How Many People Here WILL Have the Vaccine and are Comfortable Doing So?

[Bassplayer1]

I know this forum has many vaccine related discussions. But in light of the fact that the UK has given the go-head to roll out vaccines as early as next week, I've taken the liberty of starting another vaccine question.

How many of you ARE willing and comfortable to have the vaccine? My question isn't about who will or who won't and why we won't. But actually about who WILL and why?

How might you reassure those of us who are scared/worried?

Thank you and lots of love to you all
xx

[Lunesoleil]

Hello 🤠
SMS received today:

The businesses are reopening and more people will pass each other. To keep the epidemic under control, the Ministry of Health recommends that you download the TousAntiCovid application now https://bonjour.tousanticovid.gouv.fr More than 10 million French people already use it. They are alerted earlier in case of contact with the virus and have access to a test.

I'm against the vaccine so what or what not to do ... :shielddeflect:

[Eric J (Viking)]

This is all over the news here in UK amongst the economy imploding...brain wash...Etc

Boris stated that in UK we’re the 1st in the world for mass vaccinations, but not mandatory.

I won’t be taken it.

Viking

[avid]

The very sad thing is that folk will do anything to get their lives back to normal, so they can travel, associate, and are accepting this ‘martial law’ fiasco to just try to get on with their lives, despite realistic advice to the contrary.
This controlling mechanism has to stop, people must be given choices, not threats, and take away the policing of our country by globalist agendas.
Unmask their agendas

[palehorse]

For me not a chance! But I know quite a few that would not hesitate to take it, and in fact they are even parroting/preaching how beneficial it would be (based on mainstream media), most of these people are using the same argument of being selfish in not taking a vaccine, using lots of emotion to address the issue, sorry but I can't deal with that mimimi... I guess we will all see when they starting drop like flies.

I truly wish the best for all conscious living beings, and I can just hope for them to see what it is all about in a timely manner and act accordingly.

[Tyy1907]

This can be looked at from different angles. Giving the world a choice for the covid vaccinne could also serve to keep the "to vax or not to vax" fights going and reinforce divide and conquer. I can see them doing this. We'll see shortly.

[indigopete]

This may have been a fashion ahead of its time.

https://i.imgur.com/GOrJi5K.png

[Baby Steps]

I will hold back as long as possible, as there are a lot of unknowns

- Will my Employer coerce me
- Will it be required to travel
- If I have immunity from last March will I be exempted (unlikely)

I would be more inclined to have the non rna version if I get a choice.

The interesting thing is that they will start giving them to vulnerable people, in care homes + workers there, Diabetics, and other deemed vulnerable groups.

If it has terrible side effects, stories will start circulating before the mass of society is offered this.

So if say, an 80 year old with dementia dies, at some point after receiving the Flu vax, & the Covid vax, will they be able to hide this in the numbers?

If the Vaccinations start before it becomes apparent what methods are going to be used to coerce people to take them, will more people hesitate?

Will the Herd Immunity argument (Barrington Declaration (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Barrington_Declaration)) win the day before mass vaccination?

[Karen (Geophyz)]

I will not be taking it. I work from home so I don't think my job will be an issue. I suppose I will not be travelling much as I suspect a non vaccinated person will soon not be allowed on airplanes. I would however like to be tested for antibodies as I am pretty sure I have had the virus. I am sure that will not exempt me.

[araucaria]

I suggest we look at it this way. Among the first to be vaccinated in any country will be doctors and health care workers. It should be easy to determine very quickly what happens to this category. One would expect they are being given something harmless, i.e. no unusual pathologies. One would expect they are being given something efficacious: less covid than previously. So just ask for what “the doctor ordered”, you should be OK.

Then there is the conspiracy version: there are several different vaccines, one for some, others for others. If anything happens to someone who has been vaccinated, the case is going to be milked for all its worth. Just as some covid deaths are due to other causes, some vaccine-related issues will also be due to other causes such as, you were given the wrong vaccine.

In other words, it is just more of the same: we find ourselves in a cloud of probabilities, and nothing ever breaks down to an actual fact. Or if they do, they are promptly built back up into a statistic, where probability/improbability rules. However, a probability cloud is just a neat pseudo-scientific term to describe a fudge factor: votes are reversible behind the scenes, and so are assassins, warmongers, you name it.

Science has been grappling for decades with the effect of the viewer on any experiment. It has come to the point where the only scientific way to make this scientific theory work is… to bang on the table until things come out right.

[TargeT]

Not for me... I'll pass

[Mike]

I work at a school, so I suspect they'll make it mandatory at some point.

I spose i could quit and find new employment - easier said than done at the moment.

But who's to say my new place of employment doesn't make it mandatory as well eventually?

And even if I avoid all that, I'm sure that tptb will make it just about impossible for a regular Joe to avoid the bloody thing: people that travel on airplanes and buses and trains...people that want to attend concerts and sporting events, and so on.

If this virus was a deliberate thing, then you can be sure that these people have contingency plans upon contingency plans. I'm afraid we're like rats stuck in a trap. One will avoid vaccination for a while, but at some point it will likely catch up with you. I'm sorry to sound so negative about it, but that's how I see it playing out.

So unless you live on a farm in Ecuador, like Bill, or are retired and don't have to move about too much, or are a millionaire hermit, it's going to be difficult to avoid

[Bassplayer1]

I will not be taking it. I work from home so I don't think my job will be an issue. I suppose I will not be travelling much as I suspect a non vaccinated person will soon not be allowed on airplanes. I would however like to be tested for antibodies as I am pretty sure I have had the virus. I am sure that will not exempt me.

I'm thinking/hoping it should be possible to have (volunteer) a Covid test before getting on a plane if our backs are against the wall!

[Forever]

While I am not an anti vaxer by any stretch, I would certainly want to see some “long term” clinical data on any vaccine before I considered taking it.

[pueblo]

I will not be taking it. I work from home so I don't think my job will be an issue. I suppose I will not be travelling much as I suspect a non vaccinated person will soon not be allowed on airplanes. I would however like to be tested for antibodies as I am pretty sure I have had the virus. I am sure that will not exempt me.

I'm thinking/hoping it should be possible to have (volunteer) a Covid test before getting on a plane if our backs are against the wall!

I won't even take a Covid-19 test, never mind taking their vaccine.

[Deborah (ahamkara)]

There has never been a successful m RNA vaccine brought to market. The mRNA technology with Moderna was developed in conjunction with DARPA and is not standard vaccine science. It may have some applications for a targeted condition that exists (i.e. cancer), but I have seen NOTHING to explain why it is being used with COVID, instead of a less lethal version of the virus. With this new technology once the RNA instructions are inserted into your DNA, a "copy" of the COVID spike will be produced by your own cells, triggering (in theory), the production of antibodies. I cannot find any literature discussing when or how this response will be ended - will your body continue to manufacture COVID spikes indefinitely?

As a cancer survivor, I will NOT be taking any vaccine that alters DNA function. Also, the standard protocol for developing a vaccine requires a bit longer observation time (3 years vs. 3 months), than is being observed. I find it ironic that health care workers (whom I believe are complicit in perpetrating an exaggerated fear narrative regarding Covid), will now be the guinea pigs for a new experimental virus. They all know enough to be very, very nervous.

[Bassplayer1]

There has never been a successful m RNA vaccine brought to market. The mRNA technology with Moderna was developed in conjunction with DARPA and is not standard vaccine science. It may have some applications for a targeted condition that exists (i.e. cancer), but I have seen NOTHING to explain why it is being used with COVID, instead of a less lethal version of the virus. With this new technology once the RNA instructions are inserted into your DNA, a "copy" of the COVID spike will be produced by your own cells, triggering (in theory), the production of antibodies. I cannot find any literature discussing when or how this response will be ended - will your body continue to manufacture COVID spikes indefinitely?

As a cancer survivor, I will NOT be taking any vaccine that alters DNA function. Also, the standard protocol for developing a vaccine requires a bit longer observation time (3 years vs. 3 months), than is being observed. I find it ironic that health care workers (whom I believe are complicit in perpetrating an exaggerated fear narrative regarding Covid), will now be the guinea pigs for a new experimental virus. They all know enough to be very, very nervous.

Perhaps they maybe given a placebo? Whilst everyone else is sent into the unknown ...

[Did You See Them]

While I am not an anti vaxer by any stretch, I would certainly want to see some “long term” clinical data on any vaccine before I considered taking it.

THIS ^

So UK is First in the World with vaccine and Liverpool is First in line in the UK !

Salvador Dali once said he thought Liverpool was the centre of the universe, either there or Perpignan Railway station !

NO love lost here between This City and Government as many know.

I'll think about the vaccine this time next year, in no rush to socialize, shop or such yet.

In no hurry for a "Vaccine Passport" either if they try dangling that carrot!

PS - Why are multiple military bulldozers on transports going down my quiet suburban Liverpudlian road ?

I'm just sitting here watching the wheels go round and round !

[ExomatrixTV]

I explained it all here :rant: (http://tinyurl.com/War-on-Independent-Media)

... excellent topic!

[Le Chat]

I'm not against the vaccine per se, but I will wait several months to see exactly what, if any, side-effects are present.

[Zanshin]

Bassplayer1 - having studied the vax question for years, as many others have here -

I'm yet to find any evidence to convince me of the efficacy or safety of breaching all the natural filter layers of the body, by direct introduction of pathogens and toxins into the bloodstream.

So I can offer no reassurance to those who might be worried or scared.

I realise you asked for responses from those who would vaccinate - apologies, I felt compelled to respond to the question anyway.

My short response -

OVER MY DEAD BODY

[East Sun]

I will not take it ever. I don't take flu shots either.

When you get to know what some of the ingredients are
you look at it in a different light.

No way, even if mandatory insanity strikes.

Mandatory=big red flag. imo.

[Patient]

I'm not against the vaccine per se, but I will wait several months to see exactly what, if any, side-effects are present.

A bad side affect could be hidden from a person for years before it shows up - and then they could blame it on something else.

I already have a family injured from vaccines thank you very much. No more - not a chance.

[Bill Ryan]

Folks, I've just added a poll to the thread, with Bassplayer1's full agreement. (She started the interesting thread. :thumbsup: )

The poll is anonymous, as we don't want to discourage anyone from voting on any of the options.

:sun:

[Michi]

The Covid vaccine might be engineered to have subsequent PCR tests show negative and thus "faking" a cure while it's doing a more sinister DNA ground work.
It will be valuable, what ethical DNA expert investigations will uncover. There may be more hidden aspects ...

[Constance]

ffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff

[Hym]

No.

I had a long conversation recently with another friend in the film industry, who has been going thru all of the plandemic mess for the last 4 months. No masks at first, then this mask, that mask, shutdowns, short manned crews, long hours filling in for those out for 2 weeks, sanitation problems, etc., except for one issue that stands out.

Amongst the many things he has adjusted to, he says that the studio, one he likes working with, is now pushing everyone to get a vaccine. He sees it as a slow roll into demanding them for all workers. He won't take one. That's what he says. I wish him the best, as he is a very caring soul and those who work with him and under his direction are always the better because of him. This will test his mettle.

Either way, I knew he'd get the flu going around because he is overweight, doesn't eat well and drinks every day. He got it and with Vitamin C and Zinc he was over it in 3 days. Someone in his upbringing didn't say to him, "That great big heart you have? Let's make sure you give some of it back to yourself. Here's a better life, with that same big heart, on a healthy diet and a healthy respect for your own worth." There's only so much he can ask and I can share.

I didn't expect us to talk that long, as the last I'd seen him was 5 years ago and we have separate skill sets from each other. I mention this because he seemed to want more information to bolster the little he knows about both the current flu and the Media Flu going around, vaccines, the tests given, the truths about the viability of masks as protection, etc.. The best anyone can do is share a little and refer a lot, knowing that wisdom, personal experience, is learned when we study on our own. Knowing him, he will.

I referenced sites and discussions he could view to see the sciences involved. Discussions and references from PA are always a sensible way to begin and continue learning. He also asked me my insight, knowing that I have perpetually been studying about health and how our health has been manipulated for profit and control, especially during the current attacks on the health of a world in planned co-motion. I said a little and asked a lot.

I feel for the uninformed about all of this, especially for someone like my friend, who has shown morality and character in his life.


I'll not take one for many reasons, yet one notable one being I'm a vegetarian and it's a legal issue considering my spiritual path. It is an often forgotten religious edict of most paths, as in mine, to do no harm to one's bodily temple, or to comply with tyranny, nor to allow poisons, let alone those cultured in mouse brains, as per most vacs created, to enter my decades long, vegetarian-nurtured body. Either way I know the makers are F**kin' evil, which precludes my buying anything they sell, or especially give away for free.


I consider it almost the same as not wearing a mask if I'm not sick, only humoring those who feel compelled to be fearful by doing so, but only with humor. That is my only pre-requisite.


$4.5 Billion in vaccine injury and death payments, from big pharma vaccines, some who have made out-of-court settlements in the billions of dollars for corruption in selling their poisons, should be enough to convince anyone to stay away. Lawyers for those awarded those payments complain that fewer than 1 in 1,000 viable claims are even accepted by the court. That and the fact that the companies do not stand behind their products, what with the ability to sue them for damages being removed in 1986, effectively removing all ethical responsibility in ensuring their products are safe.

In one of her many recent in depth discussions on vaccines, Dr. Judy A. Mikovits has suggested that the world halt the use of vaccines for 5 years, for many reasons. Like RFK Jr., Dr. Mikovits is not against the use of them entirely. She and other highly qualified immunologists are aware of the overwhelming evidence that vaccines, thus in turn retroviruses, have increased preventable diseases by the 10's of millions in the states alone, during the past 34 years.

I do remember a medic asking me years ago if I wanted the annual flu shot. I left it at a strong, No thank you.

[Hym]

"We are falling into their energy instead of just ignoring them and claiming our sovereignty.

We continue to give the Elite all the energy they need with our resistance and yet if we were to just starve the source of their energy, like a fire starved of oxygen, they would cease to have any power. That fire would go out in a blink of an eye.."

Yes, Constance. It only seems practical and fitting, since wearing masks without having an illness, deprives people of the basic energy, and especially the oxygen, that sustains a healthy life. It is my oxygen and my life energy.

[Bassplayer1]

No.

I had a long conversation recently with another friend in the film industry, who has been going thru all of the plandemic mess for the last 4 months. No masks at first, then this mask, that mask, shutdowns, short manned crews, long hours filling in for those out for 2 weeks, sanitation problems, etc., except for one issue that stands out.

Amongst the many things he has adjusted to, he says that the studio, one he likes working with, is now pushing everyone to get a vaccine. He sees it as a slow roll into demanding them for all workers. He won't take one. That's what he says. I wish him the best, as he is a very caring soul and those who work with him and under his direction are always the better because of him. This will test his mettle.

Either way, I knew he'd get the flu going around because he is overweight, doesn't eat well and drinks every day. Someone in his upbringing didn't say to him, "That great big heart you have? Let's make sure you give some of it back to yourself. Here's a better life, with that same big heart, on a healthy diet and a healthy respect for your own worth." There's only so much he can ask and I can share.

I didn't expect us to talk that long, as the last I'd seen him was 5 years ago and we have separate skill sets from each other. I mention this because he seemed to want more information to bolster the little he knows about both the current flu and the Media Flu going around, vaccines, the tests given, the truths about the viability of masks as protection, etc.. The best anyone can do is share a little and refer a lot, knowing that wisdom, personal experience, is learned when we study on our own. Knowing him, he will.

I referenced sites and discussions he could view to see the sciences involved. Discussions and references from PA are always a sensible way to begin and continue learning. He also asked me my insight, knowing that I have perpetually been studying about health and how our health has been manipulated for profit and control, especially during the current attacks on the health of a world in planned co-motion. I said a little and asked a lot.

I feel for the uninformed about all of this, especially for someone like my friend, who has shown morality and character in his life.


I'll not take one for many reasons, yet one notable one being I'm a vegetarian and it's a legal issue considering my spiritual path. It is an often forgotten religious edict of most paths, as in mine, to do no harm to one's bodily temple, or to comply with tyranny, nor to allow poisons, let alone those cultured in mouse brains, as per most vacs created, to enter my decades long, vegetarian-nurtured body. Either way I know the makers are F**kin' evil, which precludes my buying anything they sell, or especially give away for free.


I consider it almost the same as not wearing a mask if I'm not sick, only humoring those who feel compelled to be fearful by doing so, but only with humor. That is my only pre-requisite.


$4.5 Billion in vaccine injury and death payments, from big pharma vaccines, some who have made out-of-court settlements in the billions of dollars for corruption in selling their poisons, should be enough to convince anyone to stay away. Lawyers for those awarded those payments complain that fewer than 1 in 1,000 viable claims are even accepted by the court. That and the fact that the companies do not stand behind their products, what with the ability to sue them for damages being removed in 1986, effectively removing all ethical responsibility in ensuring their products are safe.

In one of her many recent in depth discussions on vaccines, Dr. Judy A. Mikovits has suggested that the world halt the use of vaccines for 5 years, for many reasons. Like RFK Jr., Dr. Mikovits is not against the use of them entirely. She and other highly qualified immunologists are aware of the overwhelming evidence that vaccines, thus in turn retroviruses, have increased preventable diseases by the 10's of millions in the states alone, during the past 34 years.

I do remember a medic asking me years ago if I wanted the annual flu shot. I left it at a strong, No thank you.

Thank you Hym for your thoughtful reply. As a Vegan I too have concerns like you around the vaccine and animal by-products. It got me doing a quick 'Google' about Vegans/Vegetarians and the Covid vaccine. This info popped up. I have no idea if this is trustworthy or not. I'm always a bit suspicious, but anyway ...

https://www.vegansociety.com/news/news/vegan-society-response-covid-19-vaccine

https://fullfact.org/online/mandatory-vaccine-plans/

[palehorse]

I work at a school, so I suspect they'll make in mandatory at some point.

I spose i could quit and find new employment - easier said than done at the moment.

But who's to say my new place of employment doesn't make it mandatory as well eventually?

And even if I avoid all that, I'm sure that tptb will make it just about impossible for a regular Joe to avoid the bloody thing: people that travel on airplanes and buses and trains...people that want to attend concerts and sporting events, and so on.

If this virus was a deliberate thing, then you can be sure that these people have contingency plans upon contingency plans. I'm afraid we're like rats stuck in a trap. One will avoid vaccination for a while, but at some point it will likely catch up with you. I'm sorry to sound so negative about it, but that's how I see it playing out.

So unless you live on a farm in Ecuador, like Bill, or are retired and don't have to move about too much, or are a millionaire hermit, it's going to be difficult to avoid

But it still be your rights to say NO for it. It's invasive procedure and without your consent it is a crime. At some point every and each one will have to ask themselves, what worth more? my life or my job? my life or that exotic trip overseas? my life or my football team? and so forth and so on..

This entire thing is beyond evil, anyone consenting and not resisting and/or fighting against are just becoming part of the problem, to fix it we all need to stand against vaccination for once and all and abolish this evil from our lives.

[TargeT]

I work at a school, so I suspect they'll make in mandatory at some point.

I spose i could quit and find new employment - easier said than done at the moment.

But who's to say my new place of employment doesn't make it mandatory as well eventually?

And even if I avoid all that, I'm sure that tptb will make it just about impossible for a regular Joe to avoid the bloody thing: people that travel on airplanes and buses and trains...people that want to attend concerts and sporting events, and so on.

If this virus was a deliberate thing, then you can be sure that these people have contingency plans upon contingency plans. I'm afraid we're like rats stuck in a trap. One will avoid vaccination for a while, but at some point it will likely catch up with you. I'm sorry to sound so negative about it, but that's how I see it playing out.

So unless you live on a farm in Ecuador, like Bill, or are retired and don't have to move about too much, or are a millionaire hermit, it's going to be difficult to avoid

But it still be your rights to say NO for it. It's invasive procedure and without your consent it is a crime. At some point every and each one will have to ask themselves, what worth more? my life or my job? my life or that exotic trip overseas? my life or my football team? and so forth and so on..

This entire thing is beyond evil, anyone consenting and not resisting and/or fighting against are just becoming part of the problem, to fix it we all need to stand against vaccination for once and all and abolish this evil from our lives.

I made it through 20 years of military service and public school before that with out being poked... easy if you game the system (not always easy, but doable with the right conviction).

(maybe only in the US? I guess I take that for granted at times.)

[TomKat]

No way no how.

[indigopete]

Some interesting threads on the Pfizer testing.

https://i.imgur.com/Vv7BSZz.png (https://twitter.com/LynnFynn3/status/1329536490326564864)

Comment:
https://twitter.com/lastpooloflight/status/1329791457427943425

Ivor Cummins (@fatEmperor) twitter feed (in my opinion) is ESSENTIAL for anyone wanting to stay informed about the real science and statistics around all this stuff. It's the crossroads of all non-conflicted commentators, scientists, journalists and spectators. The Zerohedge of the pandemic. Anything significant that's happening passes through there. If you don't visit anything else on the internet and are short on time but still want to stay informed this is the place to go !
https://twitter.com/FatEmperor

Mike Yeadon's (ex chief scientist at Pfizer) commentary is also essential viewing IMO. Regularly cited in Ivor Cummin's feed. Listen to what he has to say about vaccines. "No need" to vaccinate people who are not at risk:
https://www.bitchute.com/video/58aZtzo8I9E2/

Mike Yeadon interviews with Julia Hartley Brewer on London Talkradio. She is also great. Puts Government ministers on the spot
https://www.bitchute.com/search/?query=mike%20yeadon&kind=video

P.S. Just came across this. This is slightly awsome ! A true insight into the feeble thought processes of politicians:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JcpYUiZZHC0

Amazing account of a 40 year nurse's experience who is leaving the profession because she didn't sign up for a job as a prison warder:

https://unmasked-doco.net/2020/12/02/lifelong-nurse-nicky-millen-full-interview-on-covid-nhs-experiences/

https://i.imgur.com/G0MnvVo.png (https://unmasked-doco.net/2020/12/02/lifelong-nurse-nicky-millen-full-interview-on-covid-nhs-experiences/)

[Baby Steps]

The key workers including people close to me are supposedly getting it first, but there are also rumors flying about that UK health service staff have been told to lie about it, and say that they have had it when they have not, so that their health can be held up as 'proof' that the vax is broadly safe.

If I wanted to hood that kind of wink, I would just inject them with AOC (any old crap) to get some trauma without giving them the actual vax.

[Baby Steps]

The following is much darker, looks legit, and makes these products sound much more dangerous:

Dr. Wodarg and Dr. Yeadon request a stop of all corona vaccination studies and call for co-signing the petition (https://2020news.de/en/dr-wodarg-and-dr-yeadon-request-a-stop-of-all-corona-vaccination-studies-and-call-for-co-signing-the-petition/)




On December 1, 2020, the ex-Pfizer head of respiratory research Dr. Michael Yeadon and the lung specialist and former head of the public health department Dr. Wolfgang Wodarg filed an application (https://2020news.de/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/Wodarg_Yeadon_EMA_Petition_Pfizer_Trial_FINAL_01DEC2020_EN_unsigned_with_Exhibits.pdf) with the EMA, the European Medicine Agency responsible for EU-wide drug approval, for the immediate suspension of all SARS CoV 2 vaccine studies, in particular the BioNtech/Pfizer study on BNT162b (EudraCT number 2020-002641-42).
Dr. Wodarg and Dr. Yeadon demand that the studies – for the protection of the life and health of the volunteers – should not be continued until a study design is available that is suitable to address the significant safety concerns expressed by an increasing number of renowned scientists against the vaccine and the study design.

On the one hand, the petitioners demand that, due to the known lack of accuracy of the PCR test in a serious study, a so-called Sanger sequencing must be used. This is the only way to make reliable statements on the effectiveness of a vaccine against Covid-19. On the basis of the many different PCR tests of highly varying quality, neither the risk of disease nor a possible vaccine benefit can be determined with the necessary certainty, which is why testing the vaccine on humans is unethical per se.

Furthermore, they demand that it must be excluded, e.g. by means of animal experiments, that risks already known from previous studies, which partly originate from the nature of the corona viruses, can be realized. The concerns are directed in particular to the following points:

• The formation of so-called “non-neutralizing antibodies” can lead to an exaggerated immune reaction, especially when the test person is confronted with the real, “wild” virus after vaccination. This so-called antibody-dependent amplification, ADE, has long been known from experiments with corona vaccines in cats, for example. In the course of these studies all cats that initially tolerated the vaccination well died after catching the wild virus.

• The vaccinations are expected to produce antibodies against spike proteins of SARS-CoV-2. However, spike proteins also contain syncytin-homologous proteins, which are essential for the formation of the placenta in mammals such as humans. It must be absolutely ruled out that a vaccine against SARS-CoV-2 could trigger an immune reaction against syncytin-1, as otherwise infertility of indefinite duration could result in vaccinated women.
• The mRNA vaccines from BioNTech/Pfizer contain polyethylene glycol (PEG). 70% of people develop antibodies against this substance – this means that many people can develop allergic, potentially fatal reactions to the vaccination.
• The much too short duration of the study does not allow a realistic estimation of the late effects. As in the narcolepsy cases after the swine flu vaccination, millions of healthy people would be exposed to an unacceptable risk if an emergency approval were to be granted and the possibility of observing the late effects of the vaccination were to follow. Nevertheless, BioNTech/Pfizer apparently submitted an application for emergency approval on December 1, 2020.




AS BILL GATES SAID 'THE SECOND WAVE WILL MAKE THEM SIT UP'

[janette]

Not a chance..my gut just screams that it is not good and will irreversibly change our bodies and minds forever.

[indigopete]

Wow. That document looks awsome. I'm familiar with that "double infection" phenomenon with the non-neutralising antibody followed by a second infection. That's one of the things I thought might be behind the correlation of the adjuvanted flu jab and the covid-19 infection.

Yeadon is just an amazing guy. He's woken so many people up and presents himself immaculately. Very informative.

P.S. This just turned up. May skew the poll results a bit.

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/philadelphia-priest-dies-after-participating-moderna-covid-vaccine-trial

[palehorse]

I have some first hand info from a friend MD in Brazil, he is in the front line over there treating those with covid, he and his team are using Ivermectin with the patients since 3 months ago, and it is working very well, no deaths related to covid in the hospital he is working.
I spoke with his wife days ago and she told me that her entire family, including the kids and the dog is taking Ivermectin once per day for the last 4 or 5 months, there is no side effect related to the administration of this drug as far as I am concerned.
I am here just sharing his and her information, unfortunately I could not speak directly with my friend because he is very busy at this moment and she said he is sleeping in the hospital to avoid cross contamination with his own circle of people, but he is fine and he incentive the use of Ivermectin.

After my talk with her and lots of thinking about it, I decided that I will stock up on this drug just in case, I am planning a detox using Turpentine and Turpentine per se is a parasite killer as well, seems like Ivermectin and Turpentine has more or less the same effect on killing parasites.

Then it is just another reason for not taking a vaccine, my friend is also against covid vaccination, but he believes that "some" vaccines are good. I asked his wife before posting this information and she said it is okay, since his name and the name of the hospital do not show up anywhere, guess why? many attacks against doctors like him, this is real ****, they are threatened all the time to do their job, save lives!

After read lots of docs about parasites, virus, bacteria, fungi and stuffs related, I have the impression that almost everything is some sort of parasite, an old tradition wing of Zen Buddhism in old Japan used to practice mummification and they used Chinese/Japanese Lacquer from the original Lacquer tree which they believe to clean one from impurities, it is some sort of resin just like the Turpentine sap but apparently a way more strong. This old monks in Japan ingested the Lacquer daily in very small amounts and when close to their death time they increased the intake in order to preserve the body from worms after death, hence a Buddhist mummy, some of this mummies are exposed in museums in Japan and they were found in holes of 3 or 4 meters deep, all mummies were in siting meditation position and they were all very old people.

I wish this drugs could kill the parasites in our corrupted governments!!!

[Mike Gorman]

The fact is this Covid19 organism is still not clearly being defined, from mortality numbers it does not represent any kind of significant threat, beyond that of Influenza.
Each year there is a death count from Influenza, this is established and recognised: despite a broad uptake in the Flu jabs.
I have not experienced having a common cold, or the Flu for well over a decade now: this is not anecdotal hyperbole, or me being boastful, it is a fact.
My regular taking of Vitamin D3 I think is responsible, along with my immune system which I must admit is pretty good, so far!
I will depend on my own immune response.
I agree with Mike Yeadon, there are too many questions about this vaccine, maybe provide this for the most vulnerable people, those over 80 and already ill (although I would be watching their response to the vaccine!)
For everyone else, let's get on with our lives and stop this utter madness. Business closures, restrictions, civil liberties stomped over-not justified!
I will NOT be taking this vaccine under any circumstances.

[Bassplayer1]

Here in Canada we've been told by the mainstream that the Pfizer roll-out starts next week (they hope) organized by an army general. The CBC was using language like 'deployment' 'check points' 'logistics' 'task force' etc all war language. So this raised my vaccine anxiety to the next level lol!

Anyway, doing some digging around online including the FDA site (yes I know its the FDA but its what there is and we navigate any lies and make of it what we can), and my understanding is as follows and very different from the lack of transparency and scare-mongering from MSM as well as governments .... forgive me those of you that know this ....

It's an emergency release which as far as I understand means it's not as yet approved for the final official release.

Phase three trials are ongoing and not complete and won't be for quite some time.

An emergency release of a drug is when a government feels the circumstances justify using a 'potentially safe through studies so far' drug 'if the potential benefits outweigh the risks.'

At this stage NO GOVERNMENT CAN FORCE, COERCE OR MAKE MANDATORY an EMERGENCY release vaccine that is far from finishing trials and studies. Pfizer and Moderna can brag all they like about an imminent release but when I dug further I think it ain't happening just yet - I hope! There are groups of types of people yet to be studied, a key point that kept cropping up is unknowns about virus mutations, catching it twice, who catches it, who doesn't etc. How long does the vaccine last. So I repeat, this is an early unofficial release and people can refuse it at this stage - technically, participants are volunteers (guinea pigs). I don't think medical staff can be made to take it and any footage showing doctors, celebrities and politicians etc taking it are likely to be given something like a saline placebo I reckon - I mean, these people are not going to participate in what is effectively still an ongoing, and in our minds an early stages trial!!!

Anyone agreeing to take it at this stage has to be given an aftercare sheet with a medical person explaining what they are agreeing to and the issue of side-effects.

Interestingly, out of the general population outside of the healthcare services, it's the senior folk in homes getting it first and my concern is that they'll be deemed by the authorities of being incapable of understanding the process and won't be talked through this situation, given a choice to participate or not, let alone told of any side effects. Family members MUST be consulted. I wonder if the elderly in homes, assumed to be on there way out of this world are being used to monitor side-effects.

It now all makes sense the media and politicians telling us that despite the vaccine, everyone still has to wear masks and stand apart behind lines etc. None of these people have the balls to treat us like adults and be honest and say that this emergency release is not the official one and not enough long term studies have been done to know about re-infection and long-term effectiveness of the drug.

The media and governments are framing this in a misleading way and there'll be Covid scared people queuing up for this who haven't dug around for the facts.

I'm not saying it won't be an issue in the long term for us too but at the moment we certainly have breathing space before any battles and time to analyze and research the effects - healthcare workers and celebrities vs the public and elderly.

You can probably tell I'm not an expert in any of this. I'm trying to figure out some down-to-earth clarity and facts to deal with anxieties and concerns. Trying to understanding the vagueness yet bullying behaviour from the State, the weird dystopian vibe from MSM. I wanted to understand how they're framing things and to understand what they're not telling us. Basically, I'm looking around for facts to help us out of this!

If my thoughts are in accurate or wrong, please correct me!

[avid]

Here in Canada we've been told by the mainstream that the Pfizer roll-out starts next week (they hope) organized by an army general. The CBC was using language like 'deployment' 'check points' 'logistics' 'task force' etc all war language. So this raised my vaccine anxiety to the next level lol!

Anyway, doing some digging around online including the FDA site (yes I know its the FDA but its what there is and we navigate any lies and make of it what we can), and my understanding is as follows and very different from the lack of transparency and scare-mongering from MSM as well as governments .... forgive me those of you that know this ....

It's an emergency release which as far as I understand means it's not as yet approved for the final official release.

Phase three trials are ongoing and not complete and won't be for quite some time.

An emergency release of a drug is when a government feels the circumstances justify using a 'potentially safe through studies so far' drug 'if the potential benefits outweigh the risks.'

At this stage NO GOVERNMENT CAN FORCE, COERCE OR MAKE MANDATORY an EMERGENCY release vaccine that is far from finishing trials and studies. Pfizer and Moderna can brag all they like about an imminent release but when I dug further I think it ain't happening just yet - I hope! There are groups of types of people yet to be studied, a key point that kept cropping up is unknowns about virus mutations, catching it twice, who catches it, who doesn't etc. How long does the vaccine last. So I repeat, this is an early unofficial release and people can refuse it at this stage - technically, participants are volunteers (guinea pigs). I don't think medical staff can be made to take it and any footage showing doctors, celebrities and politicians etc taking it are likely to be given something like a saline placebo I reckon - I mean, these people are not going to participate in what is effectively still an ongoing, and in our minds an early stages trial!!!

Anyone agreeing to take it at this stage has to be given an aftercare sheet with a medical person explaining what they are agreeing to and the issue of side-effects.

Interestingly, out of the general population outside of the healthcare services, it's the senior folk in homes getting it first and my concern is that they'll be deemed by the authorities of being incapable of understanding the process and won't be talked through this situation, given a choice to participate or not, let alone told of any side effects. Family members MUST be consulted. I wonder if the elderly in homes, assumed to be on there way out of this world are being used to monitor side-effects.

It now all makes sense the media and politicians telling us that despite the vaccine, everyone still has to wear masks and stand apart behind lines etc. None of these people have the balls to treat us like adults and be honest and say that this emergency release is not the official one and not enough long term studies have been done to know about re-infection and long-term effectiveness of the drug.

The media and governments are framing this in a misleading way and there'll be Covid scared people queuing up for this who haven't dug around for the facts.

I'm not saying it won't be an issue in the long term for us too but at the moment we certainly have breathing space before any battles and time to analyze and research the effects - healthcare workers and celebrities vs the public and elderly.

You can probably tell I'm not an expert in any of this. I'm trying to figure out some down-to-earth clarity and facts to deal with anxieties and concerns. Trying to understanding the vagueness yet bullying behaviour from the State, the weird dystopian vibe from MSM. I wanted to understand how they're framing things and to understand what they're not telling us. Basically, I'm looking around for facts to help us out of this!

If my thoughts are in accurate or wrong, please correct me!

At least the poor folk in care homes can’t be rendered infertile, and any side-effects may not be noticeable due to pre-existing conditions, however, if any deaths ensue they certainly can't be blamed on Covid, so perhaps ‘normal’ tallies of strokes/heart attacks/cancer etc etc now will appear on death certificates, and the vaccine will have ‘worked’!!!! Hmmmm ....

[Baby Steps]

Then there’s this...

45354

[roguemoon]

You may find this interesting

Sterilize
1: to make something free from bacteria or living organisms

2: to deprive (a person or animal) of the ability to produce offspring.’

"These vaccines are unlikely to completely sterilize a population. They are very likely to have an effect which works in, say 60 or 70%."
Professor Sir John Bell talking to Jon Snow of Channel 4, August/ Sept 1st 2020.

https://www.bitchute.com/video/oNqF7SsQhree/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAV7aZYrddE&lc=z23yslwagqfet5nrc04t1aokgx31pcesshxu0v31hbhwrk0h00410&ab_channel=FreedomKeepersUnited

Could it be possible that Sir John Bell, professor of medicine at Oxford University, a member of the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation Scientific Advisory Committee and a part of the GAVI team developing AstraZeneca's Coronavirus vaccine just revealed the true nature of the forthcoming Covid 19 vaccine? What do he mean exactly by “steralize”.

Surely someone who has his levels of credentials wouldn’t misspeak without first correcting himself.
Was he simply just accidentally telling the truth?
Was he even unaware that the interview was being screened on TV?
Even the channel 4 interviewer put his hand over his mouth in apparent shock and swiftly brought the interview to a close.


June 17th 2020.
“An un-named whistleblower” claiming to be from GlaxoSmithKline (GSK) revealed in an email: ‘antigens in an upcoming vaccine are proven to cause infertility in up to 97% of recipients. There is going to be an anti-HCG antigen causing sterility in women. It is also combined with HCG and Ovine Lutinizing Hormone (antibodies to nutralise this) and 37 amino acid carboxy-terminal peptides (which degrade proteins) The principle of anti-hCG vaccine is to introduce antibodies which can bind to hCG and render it biologically ’inactive.”

Astrazenica Covid vaccine AZD1222 will also be ‘age related,’ meaning different age groups will receive different doses. older people will get a lower dose jab with younger people recieving the full dose, surely this dose ratio should be the other way round?

[pueblo]

The important question is what will their next move be once it becomes apparent nobody has any trust in them or their "vaccine"? Whatever that move is it is unlikely to be pretty, 2021 will be the year that made 2020 look like a walk in the park.



Major Covid Vaccine Glitch Emerges: Most Europeans, Including Hospital Staff, Refuse To Take It


BY TYLER DURDEN

SUNDAY, DEC 27, 2020 - 21:50

All is not going according to plan in the biggest global rollout of what is arguably the most important vaccine in a century, and it is not just growing US mistrust in the covid injection effort that was rolled out in record time: an unexpected spike in allergic reactions to the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine (and now, Moderna too) may prove catastrophic to widespread acceptance unless scientists can figure out what is causing it after the FDA's rushed approval, and is also why as we reported yesterday, scientists are scrambling to identify the potential culprit causing the allergic reactions.

Making matters worse, Europe rolled out a huge COVID-19 vaccination drive on Sunday to try to rein in the coronavirus pandemic but even more Europeans than American are sceptical about the speed at which the vaccines have been tested and approved and reluctant to have the shot.

While the European Union has secured contracts drugmakers including Pfizer, Moderna and AstraZeneca, for a total of more than two billion doses and has set a goal for all adults to be inoculated next year, this is looking increasingly like a pipe dream: according to recent surveys, the local population has expressed "high levels of hesitancy" towards inoculation in countries from France to Poland, with many used to vaccines taking decades to develop, not just months.

“I don’t think there’s a vaccine in history that has been tested so quickly,” Ireneusz Sikorski, 41, said as he stepped out of a church in central Warsaw with his two children.

"I am not saying vaccination shouldn’t be taking place. But I am not going to test an unverified vaccine on my children, or on myself."

Smart: why take the risk of getting vaccinated when others will do it, resulting in the same outcome.

Surveys in Poland, where distrust in public institutions runs deep, show that fewer than 40% of people planning to get vaccinated. Worse, according to Reuters on Sunday, only half the medical staff in a Warsaw hospital where the country’s first shot was administered had signed up. And if the doctors don't trust the vaccine, one can be certain that the broader population will refuse to take it.

The situation is similar in Spain, one of Europe’s hardest-hit countries, where 28-year-old singer and music composer German summarizes the skepticism of a broad range of the population, and plans to wait for now.

“No one close to me has had it (COVID-19). I’m obviously not saying it doesn’t exist because lots of people have died of it, but for now I wouldn’t have it (the vaccine).”

A Christian Orthodox bishop in Bulgaria, where 45% of people have said they would not get a shot and 40% plan to wait to see if any negative side effects appear - meaning only 15% of the population will actually volunteer for a vaccine in the near future - is in the tiny minority when it comes to taking the vaccine.


https://www.zerohedge.com/medical/major-covid-vaccine-glitch-emerges-most-europeans-including-hospital-staff-refuse-take-it

[Baby Steps]

The following is much darker, looks legit, and makes these products sound much more dangerous:

Dr. Wodarg and Dr. Yeadon request a stop of all corona vaccination studies and call for co-signing the petition (https://2020news.de/en/dr-wodarg-and-dr-yeadon-request-a-stop-of-all-corona-vaccination-studies-and-call-for-co-signing-the-petition/)




On December 1, 2020, the ex-Pfizer head of respiratory research Dr. Michael Yeadon and the lung specialist and former head of the public health department Dr. Wolfgang Wodarg filed an application (https://2020news.de/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/Wodarg_Yeadon_EMA_Petition_Pfizer_Trial_FINAL_01DEC2020_EN_unsigned_with_Exhibits.pdf) with the EMA, the European Medicine Agency responsible for EU-wide drug approval, for the immediate suspension of all SARS CoV 2 vaccine studies, in particular the BioNtech/Pfizer study on BNT162b (EudraCT number 2020-002641-42).
Dr. Wodarg and Dr. Yeadon demand that the studies – for the protection of the life and health of the volunteers – should not be continued until a study design is available that is suitable to address the significant safety concerns expressed by an increasing number of renowned scientists against the vaccine and the study design.

On the one hand, the petitioners demand that, due to the known lack of accuracy of the PCR test in a serious study, a so-called Sanger sequencing must be used. This is the only way to make reliable statements on the effectiveness of a vaccine against Covid-19. On the basis of the many different PCR tests of highly varying quality, neither the risk of disease nor a possible vaccine benefit can be determined with the necessary certainty, which is why testing the vaccine on humans is unethical per se.

Furthermore, they demand that it must be excluded, e.g. by means of animal experiments, that risks already known from previous studies, which partly originate from the nature of the corona viruses, can be realized. The concerns are directed in particular to the following points:

• The formation of so-called “non-neutralizing antibodies” can lead to an exaggerated immune reaction, especially when the test person is confronted with the real, “wild” virus after vaccination. This so-called antibody-dependent amplification, ADE, has long been known from experiments with corona vaccines in cats, for example. In the course of these studies all cats that initially tolerated the vaccination well died after catching the wild virus.

• The vaccinations are expected to produce antibodies against spike proteins of SARS-CoV-2. However, spike proteins also contain syncytin-homologous proteins, which are essential for the formation of the placenta in mammals such as humans. It must be absolutely ruled out that a vaccine against SARS-CoV-2 could trigger an immune reaction against syncytin-1, as otherwise infertility of indefinite duration could result in vaccinated women.
• The mRNA vaccines from BioNTech/Pfizer contain polyethylene glycol (PEG). 70% of people develop antibodies against this substance – this means that many people can develop allergic, potentially fatal reactions to the vaccination.
• The much too short duration of the study does not allow a realistic estimation of the late effects. As in the narcolepsy cases after the swine flu vaccination, millions of healthy people would be exposed to an unacceptable risk if an emergency approval were to be granted and the possibility of observing the late effects of the vaccination were to follow. Nevertheless, BioNTech/Pfizer apparently submitted an application for emergency approval on December 1, 2020.




AS BILL GATES SAID 'THE SECOND WAVE WILL MAKE THEM SIT UP'

Dr Luc Montagnier is also now on record stating that the ADE is potentially very dangerous but will emerge once a new strain hits.

The following paper points at the same danger

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7943455/

[pine boy]

I don’t fly, that’s not an issue. I do drive on Texas highways so if a vaccine passport is required to travel in my state I will have to find my way. Never say never but I won’t willingly do this particular vaccine

[ralfy]

Vaccines have been around for more than a century, and is one of several reasons why you're still alive or not sick right now, even if you didn't take them. But they are only stopgap measures, since there are many viruses on earth, mutations, and increased vectors for the spread of disease, which means not only vaccines but even medicine that might work at some point won't in the future.

Meanwhile, it takes a longer time to test vaccines, which explains why many are getting harmed or killed currently, and they had to be used because many countries experienced medical systems getting overwhelmed by the current pandemic.

[jaybee]

Vaccines have been around for more than a century, and is one of several reasons why you're still alive or not sick right now, even if you didn't take them. But they are only stopgap measures, since there are many viruses on earth, mutations, and increased vectors for the spread of disease, which means not only vaccines but even medicine that might work at some point won't in the future.

Meanwhile, it takes a longer time to test vaccines, which explains why many are getting harmed or killed currently, and they had to be used because many countries experienced medical systems getting overwhelmed by the current pandemic.


If Governments were really worried about medical systems / hospitals... getting overwhelmed ... wouldn't they have encouraged widespread use of safe cheap preventions and treatments like hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin...?

Not only did many (like the UK and US for example) fail to do that but they actively prevented doctors and hospitals using said treatments...

Had SARS-CoV-2 been treated and prevented from the beginning with hydroxychloroquine and Ivermectin and other supporting substances like zinc and Vitamin D ... there would be no chance of hospitals etc being over stretched or overwhelmed...

People who had the virus were given no treatment and no advice apart from stay at home and take paracetamol... unless they had severe breathing problems then they would be admitted...

And even that.... when I had it at the end of 2019 (no test as it hadn't even officially started then but I'm sure I did have it -)........ if I hadn't given myself steam inhalations - and I added drops of Camphor Oil...

If I hadn't done that I could have had a real problem with breathing - before I was able to breath properly I had to do a steam inhalation and cough and spit for ages to clear my lungs - until I did that they were tight and very uncomfortable...making breathing difficult...

Couldn't the Govt. 'experts' at the very least have suggested people with SARS-CoV-2 did that to help themselves... even that could have help reduce hospital admissions...

I'm afraid everything points to them WANTING to introduce lockdowns - not to save the Health Systems but for some other reason..... ie political... ie introducing draconian levels of control on an unsuspecting public...

And it all points to them WANTING the lockdowns to lead to the (unsuspecting and trusting) public accepting the experimental 'vaccine' en masse......

[ralfy]

Vaccines have been around for more than a century, and is one of several reasons why you're still alive or not sick right now, even if you didn't take them. But they are only stopgap measures, since there are many viruses on earth, mutations, and increased vectors for the spread of disease, which means not only vaccines but even medicine that might work at some point won't in the future.

Meanwhile, it takes a longer time to test vaccines, which explains why many are getting harmed or killed currently, and they had to be used because many countries experienced medical systems getting overwhelmed by the current pandemic.


If Governments were really worried about medical systems / hospitals... getting overwhelmed ... wouldn't they have encouraged widespread use of safe cheap preventions and treatments like hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin...?

Not only did many (like the UK and US for example) fail to do that but they actively prevented doctors and hospitals using said treatments...

Had SARS-CoV-2 been treated and prevented from the beginning with hydroxychloroquine and Ivermectin and other supporting substances like zinc and Vitamin D ... there would be no chance of hospitals etc being over stretched or overwhelmed...

People who had the virus were given no treatment and no advice apart from stay at home and take paracetamol... unless they had severe breathing problems then they would be admitted...

And even that.... when I had it at the end of 2019 (no test as it hadn't even officially started then but I'm sure I did have it -)........ if I hadn't given myself steam inhalations - and I added drops of Camphor Oil...

If I hadn't done that I could have had a real problem with breathing - before I was able to breath properly I had to do a steam inhalation and cough and spit for ages to clear my lungs - until I did that they were tight and very uncomfortable...making breathing difficult...

Couldn't the Govt. 'experts' at the very least have suggested people with SARS-CoV-2 did that to help themselves... even that could have help reduce hospital admissions...

I'm afraid everything points to them WANTING to introduce lockdowns - not to save the Health Systems but for some other reason..... ie political... ie introducing draconian levels of control on an unsuspecting public...

And it all points to them WANTING the lockdowns to lead to the (unsuspecting and trusting) public accepting the experimental 'vaccine' en masse......

Several treatments were used in earlier pandemics, like the one in 1918-1920, and mainly because no vaccines were available, and yet infection and mortality rates still went up.

Wanting lockdowns makes no sense as that leads to greater losses even for governments, as they earn from increased economic activity.

[jaybee]

Vaccines have been around for more than a century, and is one of several reasons why you're still alive or not sick right now, even if you didn't take them. But they are only stopgap measures, since there are many viruses on earth, mutations, and increased vectors for the spread of disease, which means not only vaccines but even medicine that might work at some point won't in the future.

Meanwhile, it takes a longer time to test vaccines, which explains why many are getting harmed or killed currently, and they had to be used because many countries experienced medical systems getting overwhelmed by the current pandemic.


If Governments were really worried about medical systems / hospitals... getting overwhelmed ... wouldn't they have encouraged widespread use of safe cheap preventions and treatments like hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin...?

Not only did many (like the UK and US for example) fail to do that but they actively prevented doctors and hospitals using said treatments...

Had SARS-CoV-2 been treated and prevented from the beginning with hydroxychloroquine and Ivermectin and other supporting substances like zinc and Vitamin D ... there would be no chance of hospitals etc being over stretched or overwhelmed...

People who had the virus were given no treatment and no advice apart from stay at home and take paracetamol... unless they had severe breathing problems then they would be admitted...

And even that.... when I had it at the end of 2019 (no test as it hadn't even officially started then but I'm sure I did have it -)........ if I hadn't given myself steam inhalations - and I added drops of Camphor Oil...

If I hadn't done that I could have had a real problem with breathing - before I was able to breath properly I had to do a steam inhalation and cough and spit for ages to clear my lungs - until I did that they were tight and very uncomfortable...making breathing difficult...

Couldn't the Govt. 'experts' at the very least have suggested people with SARS-CoV-2 did that to help themselves... even that could have help reduce hospital admissions...

I'm afraid everything points to them WANTING to introduce lockdowns - not to save the Health Systems but for some other reason..... ie political... ie introducing draconian levels of control on an unsuspecting public...

And it all points to them WANTING the lockdowns to lead to the (unsuspecting and trusting) public accepting the experimental 'vaccine' en masse......

Several treatments were used in earlier pandemics, like the one in 1918-1920, and mainly because no vaccines were available, and yet infection and mortality rates still went up.

Wanting lockdowns makes no sense as that leads to greater losses even for governments, as they earn from increased economic activity.


Just because it doesn't make sense to us that doesn't mean it doesn't make sense to them...

It's like the Western Public has had to be trained to be controlled and obedient for some future plan ---

Like the 'Great Reset' - global digital currency - a Chinese style Social Credit Score system... trained for the Technology based Totalitarian Dictatorship those who want Lockdowns are planning for...

Some Governments could be coerced and conned by the real power behind it all...

Or we could be missing an important part in the Big Picture...

Re what medicines they might have had in 1918 - 1920.... that was then and now is now... safe cheap drugs were suppressed (like Ivermectin and Hydroxychloroquine).... because the Covid MRNA Injections wouldn't have got emergency approval if there was any other accepted treatment available...

The public were lured into accepting Lockdowns step by step and it began with the 'two weeks to flatten the curve'...... and now the public are being lured into accepting the Covid MRNA injection...

The one leads to the other leading further to the Vaccine Passports and genetic modification - Totalitarianism + Transhumanism....

It all makes sense to someone...

Although personally I think they are all crazy megalomaniacs.... on the wrong track....

:(

[Mike Gorman]

If you are intent on re-engineering society and implementing a totally different order of economy then the deliberate destruction of small business, and the means for people to be economically independent are the objectives.
Consider just how these lock downs have worked, and the enormous damage they have wreaked on ordinary people. This has never been imposed in previous, much worse epidemics, like the Spanish Flu, and the much more recent Flu epidemic of the late 1960's called the 'Hong Kong Flu' which saw 4 million deaths globally, quarantining the mostly well population is a bizarre and very strange measure!
You seem to think this is all perfectly reasonable and that the governments are working in the usual interests of their populations, they are not.
Dr Mike Yeadon a man who worked for 40 years as a vaccine researcher and head of Pulmonary research for major Big Pharma companies wrote a piece where he states: 'We are in the presence of Evil' - He sees the measures and the subsequent 'Vaccines' and the 'Vaccine Passports' as being a direct threat to liberal Democracy: https://www.iwritebox.com/we-are-in-the-presence-of-evil-big-pharma-scientist-claims/
I think you are pushing credibility if you persist in supporting this response to the virus, I know it is frightening to think your own society is being malicious, but it is time to stop wearing the blinkers mate, we must face this and offer the best resistance we can.

[ralfy]

Vaccines have been around for more than a century, and is one of several reasons why you're still alive or not sick right now, even if you didn't take them. But they are only stopgap measures, since there are many viruses on earth, mutations, and increased vectors for the spread of disease, which means not only vaccines but even medicine that might work at some point won't in the future.

Meanwhile, it takes a longer time to test vaccines, which explains why many are getting harmed or killed currently, and they had to be used because many countries experienced medical systems getting overwhelmed by the current pandemic.


If Governments were really worried about medical systems / hospitals... getting overwhelmed ... wouldn't they have encouraged widespread use of safe cheap preventions and treatments like hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin...?

Not only did many (like the UK and US for example) fail to do that but they actively prevented doctors and hospitals using said treatments...

Had SARS-CoV-2 been treated and prevented from the beginning with hydroxychloroquine and Ivermectin and other supporting substances like zinc and Vitamin D ... there would be no chance of hospitals etc being over stretched or overwhelmed...

People who had the virus were given no treatment and no advice apart from stay at home and take paracetamol... unless they had severe breathing problems then they would be admitted...

And even that.... when I had it at the end of 2019 (no test as it hadn't even officially started then but I'm sure I did have it -)........ if I hadn't given myself steam inhalations - and I added drops of Camphor Oil...

If I hadn't done that I could have had a real problem with breathing - before I was able to breath properly I had to do a steam inhalation and cough and spit for ages to clear my lungs - until I did that they were tight and very uncomfortable...making breathing difficult...

Couldn't the Govt. 'experts' at the very least have suggested people with SARS-CoV-2 did that to help themselves... even that could have help reduce hospital admissions...

I'm afraid everything points to them WANTING to introduce lockdowns - not to save the Health Systems but for some other reason..... ie political... ie introducing draconian levels of control on an unsuspecting public...

And it all points to them WANTING the lockdowns to lead to the (unsuspecting and trusting) public accepting the experimental 'vaccine' en masse......

Several treatments were used in earlier pandemics, like the one in 1918-1920, and mainly because no vaccines were available, and yet infection and mortality rates still went up.

Wanting lockdowns makes no sense as that leads to greater losses even for governments, as they earn from increased economic activity.


Just because it doesn't make sense to us that doesn't mean it doesn't make sense to them...

It's like the Western Public has had to be trained to be controlled and obedient for some future plan ---

Like the 'Great Reset' - global digital currency - a Chinese style Social Credit Score system... trained for the Technology based Totalitarian Dictatorship those who want Lockdowns are planning for...

Some Governments could be coerced and conned by the real power behind it all...

Or we could be missing an important part in the Big Picture...

Re what medicines they might have had in 1918 - 1920.... that was then and now is now... safe cheap drugs were suppressed (like Ivermectin and Hydroxychloroquine).... because the Covid MRNA Injections wouldn't have got emergency approval if there was any other accepted treatment available...

The public were lured into accepting Lockdowns step by step and it began with the 'two weeks to flatten the curve'...... and now the public are being lured into accepting the Covid MRNA injection...

The one leads to the other leading further to the Vaccine Passports and genetic modification - Totalitarianism + Transhumanism....

It all makes sense to someone...

Although personally I think they are all crazy megalomaniacs.... on the wrong track....

:(

Vaccines have been used for over a century. If there are higher deaths due to use today, it's because trials were not completed.

Medicine and vaccines are not the same. The first is used for treatment, and the second for prevention.

Digital currency has been used for decades, and that's because much of transactions are large, making the use of paper bills and coins highly impractical. It's a lot easier to do them using lawyers, bankers, accountants, and contracts with financial documents.

Vaccine passports have been used for something like seventy years. I recall relatives needing them before traveling to parts of Africa and even places like HK during the early 1960s.

Totalitarianism has been employed for decades, too, and usually without the need for even getting rid of democratic systems. The best tools involve advertising, marketing, and commercial mass entertainment.

Phenomena like credit scores are part of a long history of quantifying human groups. I think that started with Prussian policies during the nineteenth century, and then copied in the U.S. and elsewhere, as seen in not only banks and factories but even in schools, hospitals, and prisons.

[jaybee]

Vaccines have been around for more than a century, and is one of several reasons why you're still alive or not sick right now, even if you didn't take them. But they are only stopgap measures, since there are many viruses on earth, mutations, and increased vectors for the spread of disease, which means not only vaccines but even medicine that might work at some point won't in the future.

Meanwhile, it takes a longer time to test vaccines, which explains why many are getting harmed or killed currently, and they had to be used because many countries experienced medical systems getting overwhelmed by the current pandemic.


If Governments were really worried about medical systems / hospitals... getting overwhelmed ... wouldn't they have encouraged widespread use of safe cheap preventions and treatments like hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin...?

Not only did many (like the UK and US for example) fail to do that but they actively prevented doctors and hospitals using said treatments...

Had SARS-CoV-2 been treated and prevented from the beginning with hydroxychloroquine and Ivermectin and other supporting substances like zinc and Vitamin D ... there would be no chance of hospitals etc being over stretched or overwhelmed...

People who had the virus were given no treatment and no advice apart from stay at home and take paracetamol... unless they had severe breathing problems then they would be admitted...

And even that.... when I had it at the end of 2019 (no test as it hadn't even officially started then but I'm sure I did have it -)........ if I hadn't given myself steam inhalations - and I added drops of Camphor Oil...

If I hadn't done that I could have had a real problem with breathing - before I was able to breath properly I had to do a steam inhalation and cough and spit for ages to clear my lungs - until I did that they were tight and very uncomfortable...making breathing difficult...

Couldn't the Govt. 'experts' at the very least have suggested people with SARS-CoV-2 did that to help themselves... even that could have help reduce hospital admissions...

I'm afraid everything points to them WANTING to introduce lockdowns - not to save the Health Systems but for some other reason..... ie political... ie introducing draconian levels of control on an unsuspecting public...

And it all points to them WANTING the lockdowns to lead to the (unsuspecting and trusting) public accepting the experimental 'vaccine' en masse......

Several treatments were used in earlier pandemics, like the one in 1918-1920, and mainly because no vaccines were available, and yet infection and mortality rates still went up.

Wanting lockdowns makes no sense as that leads to greater losses even for governments, as they earn from increased economic activity.


Just because it doesn't make sense to us that doesn't mean it doesn't make sense to them...

It's like the Western Public has had to be trained to be controlled and obedient for some future plan ---

Like the 'Great Reset' - global digital currency - a Chinese style Social Credit Score system... trained for the Technology based Totalitarian Dictatorship those who want Lockdowns are planning for...

Some Governments could be coerced and conned by the real power behind it all...

Or we could be missing an important part in the Big Picture...

Re what medicines they might have had in 1918 - 1920.... that was then and now is now... safe cheap drugs were suppressed (like Ivermectin and Hydroxychloroquine).... because the Covid MRNA Injections wouldn't have got emergency approval if there was any other accepted treatment available...

The public were lured into accepting Lockdowns step by step and it began with the 'two weeks to flatten the curve'...... and now the public are being lured into accepting the Covid MRNA injection...

The one leads to the other leading further to the Vaccine Passports and genetic modification - Totalitarianism + Transhumanism....

It all makes sense to someone...

Although personally I think they are all crazy megalomaniacs.... on the wrong track....

:(

Vaccines have been used for over a century. If there are higher deaths due to use today, it's because trials were not completed.

Medicine and vaccines are not the same. The first is used for treatment, and the second for prevention.

Digital currency has been used for decades, and that's because much of transactions are large, making the use of paper bills and coins highly impractical. It's a lot easier to do them using lawyers, bankers, accountants, and contracts with financial documents.

Vaccine passports have been used for something like seventy years. I recall relatives needing them before traveling to parts of Africa and even places like HK during the early 1960s.

Totalitarianism has been employed for decades, too, and usually without the need for even getting rid of democratic systems. The best tools involve advertising, marketing, and commercial mass entertainment.

Phenomena like credit scores are part of a long history of quantifying human groups. I think that started with Prussian policies during the nineteenth century, and then copied in the U.S. and elsewhere, as seen in not only banks and factories but even in schools, hospitals, and prisons.


You seem to be ok with the direction that the whole world is going in... and the way SARS-CoV-2 has been dealt with ... with the 'vaccine' programme.... and with the 'vaccines' themselves... fair enough that's your choice..

but to pick up on a couple of points...


Vaccines have been used for over a century. If there are higher deaths due to use today, it's because trials were not completed.


exactly - trials for the MRNA Covid injections were not completed and there are no long term studies for human use...



Medicine and vaccines are not the same. The first is used for treatment, and the second for prevention.

there are reports of doctors using hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin for prevention AND cure...

for example

https://www.healio.com/news/primary-care/20201208/this-was-a-gift-to-us-ivermectin-effective-for-covid19-prophylaxis-treatment

[ralfy]

Vaccines have been around for more than a century, and is one of several reasons why you're still alive or not sick right now, even if you didn't take them. But they are only stopgap measures, since there are many viruses on earth, mutations, and increased vectors for the spread of disease, which means not only vaccines but even medicine that might work at some point won't in the future.

Meanwhile, it takes a longer time to test vaccines, which explains why many are getting harmed or killed currently, and they had to be used because many countries experienced medical systems getting overwhelmed by the current pandemic.


If Governments were really worried about medical systems / hospitals... getting overwhelmed ... wouldn't they have encouraged widespread use of safe cheap preventions and treatments like hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin...?

Not only did many (like the UK and US for example) fail to do that but they actively prevented doctors and hospitals using said treatments...

Had SARS-CoV-2 been treated and prevented from the beginning with hydroxychloroquine and Ivermectin and other supporting substances like zinc and Vitamin D ... there would be no chance of hospitals etc being over stretched or overwhelmed...

People who had the virus were given no treatment and no advice apart from stay at home and take paracetamol... unless they had severe breathing problems then they would be admitted...

And even that.... when I had it at the end of 2019 (no test as it hadn't even officially started then but I'm sure I did have it -)........ if I hadn't given myself steam inhalations - and I added drops of Camphor Oil...

If I hadn't done that I could have had a real problem with breathing - before I was able to breath properly I had to do a steam inhalation and cough and spit for ages to clear my lungs - until I did that they were tight and very uncomfortable...making breathing difficult...

Couldn't the Govt. 'experts' at the very least have suggested people with SARS-CoV-2 did that to help themselves... even that could have help reduce hospital admissions...

I'm afraid everything points to them WANTING to introduce lockdowns - not to save the Health Systems but for some other reason..... ie political... ie introducing draconian levels of control on an unsuspecting public...

And it all points to them WANTING the lockdowns to lead to the (unsuspecting and trusting) public accepting the experimental 'vaccine' en masse......

Several treatments were used in earlier pandemics, like the one in 1918-1920, and mainly because no vaccines were available, and yet infection and mortality rates still went up.

Wanting lockdowns makes no sense as that leads to greater losses even for governments, as they earn from increased economic activity.


Just because it doesn't make sense to us that doesn't mean it doesn't make sense to them...

It's like the Western Public has had to be trained to be controlled and obedient for some future plan ---

Like the 'Great Reset' - global digital currency - a Chinese style Social Credit Score system... trained for the Technology based Totalitarian Dictatorship those who want Lockdowns are planning for...

Some Governments could be coerced and conned by the real power behind it all...

Or we could be missing an important part in the Big Picture...

Re what medicines they might have had in 1918 - 1920.... that was then and now is now... safe cheap drugs were suppressed (like Ivermectin and Hydroxychloroquine).... because the Covid MRNA Injections wouldn't have got emergency approval if there was any other accepted treatment available...

The public were lured into accepting Lockdowns step by step and it began with the 'two weeks to flatten the curve'...... and now the public are being lured into accepting the Covid MRNA injection...

The one leads to the other leading further to the Vaccine Passports and genetic modification - Totalitarianism + Transhumanism....

It all makes sense to someone...

Although personally I think they are all crazy megalomaniacs.... on the wrong track....

:(

Vaccines have been used for over a century. If there are higher deaths due to use today, it's because trials were not completed.

Medicine and vaccines are not the same. The first is used for treatment, and the second for prevention.

Digital currency has been used for decades, and that's because much of transactions are large, making the use of paper bills and coins highly impractical. It's a lot easier to do them using lawyers, bankers, accountants, and contracts with financial documents.

Vaccine passports have been used for something like seventy years. I recall relatives needing them before traveling to parts of Africa and even places like HK during the early 1960s.

Totalitarianism has been employed for decades, too, and usually without the need for even getting rid of democratic systems. The best tools involve advertising, marketing, and commercial mass entertainment.

Phenomena like credit scores are part of a long history of quantifying human groups. I think that started with Prussian policies during the nineteenth century, and then copied in the U.S. and elsewhere, as seen in not only banks and factories but even in schools, hospitals, and prisons.


You seem to be ok with the direction that the whole world is going in... and the way SARS-CoV-2 has been dealt with ... with the 'vaccine' programme.... and with the 'vaccines' themselves... fair enough that's your choice..

but to pick up on a couple of points...


Vaccines have been used for over a century. If there are higher deaths due to use today, it's because trials were not completed.


exactly - trials for the MRNA Covid injections were not completed and there are no long term studies for human use...



Medicine and vaccines are not the same. The first is used for treatment, and the second for prevention.

there are reports of doctors using hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin for prevention AND cure...

for example

https://www.healio.com/news/primary-care/20201208/this-was-a-gift-to-us-ivermectin-effective-for-covid19-prophylaxis-treatment

They are used in various countries, and with emergency authorization, just like vaccines.

[Kalamos]

I'm one of two who voted "I'm comfortable taking the vaccine. I feel the overall benefits are likely to outweigh any risks."

I got the Pfizer vaccine; second jab on May 12th.

I'll admit, I haven't been following all the alt media and conspiratorial news about the vaccine. I feel comfortable taking this vaccine. But then I think most vaccines are safe.

I'm just curious if anyone would tell me what I should be worried about. Are there really proofs that this vaccine is dangerous? I tend to think it's mostly fear porn, but again, I haven't done any research.

So I got the vaccine. What's going to happen to me?

EDIT: I also think 5G is safe, chemtrails are just contrails, and fluoride in the water is just fine. So if I get ignored here, I understand, lol.

[Sue (Ayt)]

I feel comfortable taking this vaccine. But then I think most vaccines are safe.

I'm just curious if anyone would tell me what I should be worried about.

Well, it is not FDA approved, it is the very first application of mRNA therapy presented as a vaccine, and it is still in trial. It is admitted by all that little is actually known about the long-term results or effects.
My question to you would be, would you willing to participate in a medical trial as a healthy subject for free? (Because that appears to be exactly what not-at-risk individuals are doing.)

[Kalamos]

I feel comfortable taking this vaccine. But then I think most vaccines are safe.

I'm just curious if anyone would tell me what I should be worried about.

Well, it is not FDA approved, it is the very first application of mRNA therapy presented as a vaccine, and it is still in trial. It is admitted by all that little is actually known about the long-term results or effects.
My question to you would be, would you willing participate in a medical trial as a healthy subject for free? (Because that appears to be exactly what not-at-risk individuals are doing.)

No, I wouldn't participate in a medical trial for free.

I'll admit, I felt some pressure from family to get it done. All my family has been vaccinated, from 18 year-olds to my parents in their mid seventies. No one I know has had any issues.

I believe if it were really that bad, it would be in the MSM already. I think all the negative spin on the vaccines is a Conspiracy Land Hysteria. I believe Covid is real, and the Vaccines are a good thing.

[Sue (Ayt)]

I feel comfortable taking this vaccine. But then I think most vaccines are safe.

I'm just curious if anyone would tell me what I should be worried about.

Well, it is not FDA approved, it is the very first application of mRNA therapy presented as a vaccine, and it is still in trial. It is admitted by all that little is actually known about the long-term results or effects.
My question to you would be, would you willing participate in a medical trial as a healthy subject for free? (Because that appears to be exactly what not-at-risk individuals are doing.)

No, I wouldn't participate in a medical trial for free.

I'll admit, I felt some pressure from family to get it done. All my family has been vaccinated, from 18 year-olds to my parents in their mid seventies. No one I know has had any issues.

I believe if it were really that bad, it would be in the MSM already. I think all the negative spin on the vaccines is a Conspiracy Land Hysteria. I believe Covid is real, and the Vaccines are a good thing.

Thanks for your honest reply, Kalamos. It seems to boil down to "belief".
I really am happy that to date your family has had no issues.

I must admit that I have lost my trust in MSM, and I have also learned through observation and experience that science in general, and our medical/pharma system in particular, has been responsible for many, many failures over the years. (you can probably think of a few treatments yourself, that were once considered cutting edge, but became a huge "whoops" later.)
I even started a thread about this sort of thing. (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?112724-Science-What-could-go-wrong)

Not many things are a black/white issue, and proceeding with great caution is generally wise, particularly with irreversible steps.