Give me your opinion on astrology, thank you

[Lunesoleil]

I notice that there are hardly any astrologers on the Avalon forum, or are they all gone?
I have many years of experience, a touch of everything, an astrology handyman, who pushes the doors, to discover, learn and meditate on new paths to explore.
I am at the same time a contemplative, a researcher, a critic of the practice of astrology, because the worst of everything in astrology is I think to prevent myself from doing something because of a terrible transit of owl thing .
Go beyond our limits and at the same time we have to deal with our achievements. Because we cannot become what we are not inside ourselves, through our education, our school background, our experience in the field of life. We learn above all from our mistakes, which make us grow in awareness and sometimes in maturity. Because we are not all equal in the face of the Eternal, we are the extension of our parents, of our roots, of our culture in the country where we were born.

What I wrote on the astrology forum :

The Moon in all these states (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?113008-The-Moon-in-all-these-states)


Solar Eclipse of December 14 (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?113295-Solar-Eclipse-of-December-14)


Do you know the position of your moon at the time of your birth? (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?113196-Do-you-know-the-position-of-your-moon-at-the-time-of-your-birth)


Astrology of the Age of Aquarius according to Edgar Cayce (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?113035-Astrology-of-the-Age-of-Aquarius-according-to-Edgar-Cayce)


Here are 72 Angels. Find yours! (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?113144-Here-are-72-Angels.-Find-yours-)


March strikes back with Trump (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?112808-March-strikes-back-with-Trump)


Falun Gong the spiritual art of energy (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?113042-Falun-Gong-the-spiritual-art-of-energy)


the 12 signs in music (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?112965-the-12-signs-in-music)


Retro phases of Mercury (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?112885-Return-of-Mercury-in-Scorpio)


Birthday Forum (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?112865-Birthday-Forum)


The four phases of the lunar month (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?52159-The-four-phases-of-the-lunar-month)


The United States: Sun in conjunction with Sirius (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?112701-The-United-States-Sun-in-conjunction-with-Sirius)


Conjunction: Jupiter, Pluto and Saturn (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?112689-Conjunction-Jupiter-Pluto-and-Saturn)


The Moon and Presidents in Astrology (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?112691-The-Moon-and-Presidents-in-Astrology)


Astrological updates from Lunesoleil (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?52177-Astrological-updates-from-Lunesoleil)


It is an invitation to share your feelings in astrology and the place that astrology has in your life, whether near or far. I would like to know the place you give to this ancient art which is both appreciated by these defenders and hated by these detractors.
Within the tolerance of divided opinions, thank you for your participation.


Tell me everything, I want to know everything even in the darkest recesses of your minds or the brightest parts
Many thanks to everyone and may the light shine on all the truths of each of the members of Avalon.

[raregem]

Hi Lunesoleil-

Thank you for your expertise and sharing astrology on PA.
I find astrology to be like a foreign language yet, I think there is a wealth of information to glean for guidance and understanding of our Verses.
I do not know what to say or ask you.
Thank you though for the offer to share.

[TomKat]

I believe in Tropical Astrology for personality analysis. I frequently look up famous people's birthdates and guess their sun sign. I believe in the houses and signs and planets of the Tropical natal chart.

I believe in Sidereal Astrology for world predictions, where Tropical Astrology falls short. But Sidereal Astrology is terrible for personality analysis.

I believe every planetary aspect influences everyone equally. I don't believe in the significance of aspects to one's natal chart, especially the ascendant.

Outside of the natal chart, I find astrology to be a weak influence on the individual, but not on the masses. Astrology has fallen victim to the human penchant for creating complex, self-referring, self-proving systems (read Cat's Cradle). Delving too deeply into astrology is a withdrawal from life.

I think astrology, like Tarot, can be a good springboard for intuition, and without intuition it isn't much use.

[Patient]

I appreciate that it shows that we are all a part of the universe and as we are affected by it, we can affect it.

Looking out into the stars we find pieces of ourselves, but we must take care of the planet we call Earth - it is from the perspective of the Earth that astrology is structured. It is such a simple way to see how we need to take care of this one piece of the universe.

I believe that once we are able to properly take care of our world, then more of the universe will become available to us and much more a part of us going forward, outward and inward. All together as we are.

[Lunesoleil]

Thank you for your expertise and sharing astrology on PA.
I find astrology to be like a foreign language yet, I think there is a wealth of information to glean for guidance and understanding of our Verses.
thank you raregem for the feedback. This astrology forum reminds me of an airplane that is on autopilot. If astrology is like a foreign language for you, is it because you have no knowledge of the position of the planets at the time of your birth?
A person born at the time of a new moon, first quarter, full moon, or last quarter will behave psychologically, just as a person born in spring, summer, spring or winter will be more or less individualistic, emotional, altruistic, or a loner.

It can be classified by the four elements:

Fire: Aries, Leo, Sagittarius.
Earth: Taurus, Virgo, Capricorn.
Air: Gemini, Libra, Aquarius.
Water: Cancer, Scorpio, Pisces.

The nervous temperament (dry and cold) is dominated by the element of the earth.
The bilious temperament (dry and hot) is dominated by the element of fire.
The sanguineous temperament (humid and hot) is dominated by the element of air.
The lymphatic temperament (wet and cold) is dominated by the element of water.

You are right astrology is a wealth of information and there is something to please everyone and the paths in astrology are multiple at all levels of knowledge, a long journey that never stops ...

Temperament (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temperament)

[Lunesoleil]

I believe in Tropical Astrology for personality analysis. I frequently look up famous people's birthdates and guess their sun sign. I believe in the houses and signs and planets of the Tropical natal chart.

I believe in Sidereal Astrology for world predictions, where Tropical Astrology falls short. But Sidereal Astrology is terrible for personality analysis.
Thank you Tomkat for your much appreciated intervention. First of all, I did a study about ten years ago on users of the sidereal zodiac. So I was interested in it for a period, so I then focused more on house position than sign position. I can know how long you have been practicing astrology ?, thanks.
Because I suppose you have developed an experience, it shows in your comment. To understand its tendency for the sidereal zodiac, one must study the position of the South Node and its ruler. There is often a proximity to the South Node. For me, the master of the South Node in conjunction with the North Node and the why I do not differentiate between the two, it is just a question of updating previous acquired knowledge, some innate who returns to continue the process already started in a previous life. For the ascendant, it takes on value by conjunction with a planet or seeing its framing, that's what my study of the sidereal taught me. The compromise between the sidereal and the tropical is when it has a planet between 25 ° and 29 ° 59 in tropical, which is found between 0 ° and 5 ° in the sidereal, therefore which does not change sign. .. For me the sideral is relative to the past, to astronomy and the north node facing it represents the present and astrology and the why that there is between the two a bridge and the two shores on each side .. .

[Johan (Keyholder)]

"Astrologia" used to be the science of astrologie ànd astronomy together, till somewhere in the late 17th century.
Sadly astrology became known as a "pseudoscience" (by many), because a.o. of heliocentrism and the like (probably) in those days.
Personally I think that they go very well together, but so many very useful methods, systems etc... have been cast aside, because of "exact science".
Is that all a part of a certain manipulation? Possibly so.

I for one learned about the value of astrology when I was about 16. Early 1970's.
In those days before the internet and computers, books and libraries where we used to go to still our hunger for "deeper knowledge".
Astrology was one of the fields I wanted to explore.

So, I got a thick book about how to make a horoscope: "The New A to Z Horoscope Maker and Delineator" by George Llewellyn. I think the book was published in 1969 or so. It would be a collectible now I think.

We did have calculators then. It took me two hours to get my radix done. I was pretty proud of it!
When I started to look up what everything meant, I fell almost of my chair. I just couldn't believe what I could get out of this unusual information.
There were a lot more astrologers around in those days (at least, I think so).
So, I thought "If I, a neophyte to astrology, like me, can get this much out of it, then what a real well qualified astrologer could do?"

From time to time I did make a simple birth horoscope, and it did tell me a lot about that person, always.
But I also experienced the same with numerology for instance and other (but not all) systems and methods.
While I certainly think it is an art that is worth devoting one's life to, for me another path was destined.

But I will always acknowledge the value of so many "forgotten paths and arts", it is just a matter of focusing on them.
Too many people today are "too shallow", but if one place on the internet gathers a large number of "souls with a purpose",
it is definitely PA and this forum.

Lunesoleil, maybe few people today are still capable of seeing your professionalism and expertise, but those that need to find you, will.
But you already know that....

[TomKat]

I've been interested in astrology for 50 years, but I won't say I actually practice it. I've picked up things along the way, am good at guessing sun signs. But some things have always bothered me. For instance, a friend who is a Taurus and has no Gemini or significant 3rd house weight in her chart, sun nowhere near the cusp, yet seems like a Gemini. I don't think people should take it too seriously. And I know from reincarnating pets that personality and intelligence level survive reincarnation nearly 100% intact, regardless of astrology.

[Peter UK]

My own view on astrology can be gleaned from the following which is the most enlightening perspective that I've ever read bar none.

Even if one isn't interested in astrology it's a great insight and maybe particularly if there's a curiosity, should definitely be read.

I make no apologies for this being from a channelled source albeit a highly respected one. Within the greater scheme of things this makes a great deal of sense, you don't need to be an astrologer for this to be either understood or relevant.

I've edited the following for brevity.

Seth on Astrology

Unknown Reality Volume 2, Session 729

You are so taken with the idea of labels that many follow astrology blindly. You are born at a certain time, at a certain place, under certain conditions – but consciousness always forms the conditions. If it is to some extent affected by these conditions, then, it is because the effects follow in the same way that a painter is affected by the landscape that he has himself created. So you decide to be born, say, in a certain month when the planets are thus-and-so. Ahead of time, you choose the seasons of your birth.

In the most simple of terms, you are deciding upon the environment.

Again: Your reality is like a shining platform, a surface resting upon probabilities. You follow these so unconsciously and beautifully, you swim through them so easily, that it does not occur to you to question your origin, or the medium in which your experience has its existence. All of these sharing any given birthdate, however, sharing even place as well as time, do not have the same “destiny”; but more, they do not share the same conditions necessarily. They are each affected by their own probability system at birth, and those conditions drastically alter the nature of their development.

The very practice of pinpointing the time of physical birth at conception itself errs. There is no point at which you can say in basic terms that an individual is alive, though you do find it more practical to accept certain points of life and death. It is true that you emerge into space and time at a certain point in your perception. Your consciousness has been itself long before, however.

Once you free your consciousness from limited concepts of time and self, then you can begin to explore the unknown reality that is the unrecognized self.

When you think in conventional terms about astrology, it is as if you are looking at the cover of a book, not realizing that there are many pages within it.

Consciousness, being active within all cellular structures, triggers itself ahead of time [in each case], so to speak, to react to certain conditions and not to others. Many are born the same day of any given year, and generally within the same time period – but individually the inner triggering may be far different, so that while the overall conditions at birth may appear more or less the same, the inner reactions to them will vary widely.

Some persons will be much more affected by, and sensitive to, other probabilities – which, for instance, do not show at all in conventional astrological “charts”.

Those charts emphasize one line of probabilities at the expense of all others. Interpretations based upon the charts then will make more sense to those who have chosen the same probable birth circumstances – but they will be of no value to those who were born at the same time, in your terms, but who follow a different order of probabilities.

As the cells operate with the knowledge of probable actions and still maintain the physical body in your chosen system, so the psyche, operating in the same way, “seeds” itself in many different probabilities – alternates, in other words, of the world as you know it. Those alive with you, your contemporaries, do not all belong to the same probable system. You are at a meeting ground in that respect, where individuals from many probable realities mix and merge, agreeing momentarily to accept certain portions of the same space-time environment.

Because you focus upon the similarities in experience, and play down the variances, then the oftentimes greater dissimilarities in so-called experience escape you completely. You take it for granted that memory is faulty if you do not agree with another person on the events that happened at a certain place and time – say those in a recently experienced historical past. You take it for granted that interpretations of events change, but that certain definite events occurred that are beyond alteration. Instead, the events themselves are not nearly that concrete. You accept one probable event. Someone else may experience instead a version of that event, which then becomes that individual’s felt reality.

These events may be quite different indeed, and the separate interpretations make quite valid explanations of separate variations. In your terms, one event can happen in many different ways.

Consciousness chooses the best overall conditions available for its own purposes of growth. It then preconditions its own organism to respond or not to respond to the time and place of birth, to exaggerate or minimize, to negate or accept.

The emergence of consciousness into those physical conditions automatically alters them – a fact not recognized by astrologers. Each child born alters the entire universe, and changes the world of its time and birth by bringing into it action not there earlier, in your terms, and by impressing the universe with the stamp – the indelible stamp – of its reality. Each child chooses its own probable version of any given birthdate. Such dates are obviously not just points in time, pinpointed in space. In the first place, since all time is simultaneous, you are always dying and being born, and your later experience affects the time of your birth.

I admit that a birthday operates as a handy reference. But if you realized that your consciousness did exist before that time, your memory will open up, and your accepted birthdate will appear far less important. “Coming out of the womb” is an event, and much better to use than “birth”. In greater terms – far greater terms than you imagine – you are aware of probable “births”, and your other parentages [that are] quite as legitimate as the personal history you now accept.

You view the heavens and the universe, the planets and the stars, from your own focus – a highly limited one in certain terms.

In the first place you are looking at one version of the universe, as it seems to exist at the moment of your perception. The entire nature of a personality cannot be considered in its totality in that small context.
The personality itself is not only independent of space and time, but uses the illusions that result for its own purposes. All things are related, but they do not act in a certain way because the planets were such-and-such at your birth. There is a relationship, but it is not causal.

It is quite as true to say that the planets behave in a certain way because you are what you are, as it is to turn the statement around, as is generally done. The very positions of the planets and the stars are effects of the senses – perceptions that would have no meaning were it not for your own kind of consciousness. Those perceptions, then, cannot cause you to behave in any given way because of conditions that have no meaning outside of your own consciousness.

The universe exists, but it takes the shape and form that you recognize only in your own perceptions. The motion of the planets, indeed their very perceived reality, exists in far different terms.

The universe is seeded with various kinds of consciousnesses. Some of these appear to you as planets or stars, as they “intrude” into your field of actuality. As such they appear to behave in a certain fashion, to take a certain form, to have certain effects. You and the stars are simultaneous events, each conscious and aware but in different “scales” of actuality – as your scale of consciousness is different from that of the violets.

With physical perception the picture all fits, of course. You realize that someone – some interested observer – viewing the earth from another planet in another galaxy, would be seeing what you think of as earth’s past. But as I pointed out, “he” might also be seeing earth’s future, according to “his” viewpoint. This would in no way alter your reality. The positions of the stars and planets, however and your time scheme, cannot be depended upon to give an indication of “causal” effects. The personality simply exists in greater terms.

Using conventional astrology, you will find certain correlations, because of particular events occurring, that are indeed interrelated. Yet many individuals will not discover semblances of themselves in the charts of astrology simply because their chosen probabilities are, qualitatively speaking, so different from the “norm”.

When astrology works, it works because the astrologer is using his or her creative and psychic abilities, and then projecting that knowledge into a pattern that is of itself too small to contain it. The chart then simply becomes an aid.

I understand that some of this will be difficult to follow. The only other recourse, however, is to repeat myths and tales that you have outgrown. The stars and planets simply are in more than one place at one time. I admit that your perception of them makes them appear to be relatively stable, and you are biologically tuned in to that perception. Your experience of time and motion, as you know, is relative, and in comparison with your own relatively brief lives the planets seem to endure for almost endless periods. This is your viewpoint as you look out from your ledge.

You are small in relationship to the stars, also, but when you seek to place your fate in their hands, figuratively speaking, then it does seem as if you have little control over your own destiny.

You are consciousness at particular points of experience, and in other kinds of reality you twinkle like stars.

[onawah]

I don't have a technical, mathematical kind of mind so I wouldn't make a good astrologer, but I think intuition would always have to be an attribute for an astrologer to be really good at what they do. Good astrologers can provide amazing insights into all manner of subjects.
Astrology is a much more technically precise art than those practiced by psychics, channelers, tarot readers, numerologists, etc., imho though I think they all can offer much when the practitioner is sufficiently talented and intuitive.
Avalon member Ulli is an astrologer.
See: https://projectavalon.net/forum4/member.php?1217-ulli

[Johan (Keyholder)]

Thanks Peter UK for that text by Seth on Astrology! When you read it (several times by preference), then you can understand why astrology seems to "work" for one person and not for another.

It is SO well explained in this text - which I think does not only pertain to astrology but to almost all events and experiences one can have - how truly individual we are. That Jane Roberts wrote this about 50 years ago is amazing, I know of very few other "channels of information" that have been so thorough and balanced. I am glad I "discovered" her in 1978 (I read "The nature of personal reality" then).

Especially this: "As the cells operate with the knowledge of probable actions and still maintain the physical body in your chosen system, so the psyche, operating in the same way, “seeds” itself in many different probabilities – alternates, in other words, of the world as you know it. Those alive with you, your contemporaries, do not all belong to the same probable system. You are at a meeting ground in that respect, where individuals from many probable realities mix and merge, agreeing momentarily to accept certain portions of the same space-time environment."


Maybe I can relate an experience that has happened to me, several times. I remember more than one occasion where I made a reference in "this" reality to an event which happened in another (probable) reality where I "had been active/conscious" (but not the individuals from "this reality"). So, their reaction invariably is: "What are you talking about, that did never happen." For myself it is a kind of "proof" that I am a sort of "reality surfer" (as someone called me once). Now, everyone can do this of course, depending on his/her beliefsystem. Most people discard that possibility though: being able to be conscious in several probable realities while inhabiting so to speak just one physical body.

To me, it just illustrates the incredible "potential richness" we all have. It is just a matter of changing your present beliefsystem to this: "the only beliefsystem worth having is NOT having a beliefsystem, or in other words a beliefsystem that is "ever-changing", always evolving".

Jane Roberts is an incredible source of information, for those that can "decipher" it. Thanks again for this Peter UK!

[Lunesoleil]

I believe every planetary aspect influences everyone equally. I don't believe in the significance of aspects to one's natal chart, especially the ascendant.

I am not of this opinion, because it depends on many personal parameters and on our emotional state of the moment which for the same aspect will not be lived in the same way. We are all unique pieces. Do you know the solar revolution ?, To be active and validated, an aspect between two planets must also be identified in the natal, otherwise the promises in the SR (solar revolution) will not have little chance to occur . Then everything is relative, astrology is a tool of knowledge of oneself and cannot be substituted for our personal choices



Outside of the natal chart, I find astrology to be a weak influence on the individual, but not on the masses. Astrology has fallen victim to the human penchant for creating complex, self-referring, self-proving systems (read Cat's Cradle). Delving too deeply into astrology is a withdrawal from life.


Yes certainly the collective influence would make more sense in the movement of the great planetary cycles creating the times that we know.
We also have our own cycles, Dane Rudhyar the founder of humanistic astrology talks about it in these books.
For complex systems do not exist only everywhere, but in all sciences and in all manual learning. Everything is learned in the lower world and it starts at school in learning to read and write and why studying astrology should be so different?


I think astrology, like Tarot, can be a good springboard for intuition, and without intuition it isn't much use.

Yes intuition is essential, but also study in daily practice to develop your own reasoning and not that of someone else. Tarot is another learning process for all stages of our life, from birth with the juggler to death with the Mast. Just like the Tarot, astrology can be used as a decoding like a clairvoyant would after a question asked or simply as a tool for reflection and personal development. Everything is a question of gaze , influence and of objective or subjective awareness, that is the question ...

[Lunesoleil]

I appreciate that it shows that we are all a part of the universe and as we are affected by it, we can affect it.
Looking out into the stars we find pieces of ourselves, but we must take care of the planet we call Earth - it is from the perspective of the Earth that astrology is structured. It is such a simple way to see how we need to take care of this one piece of the universe.
I believe that once we are able to properly take care of our world, then more of the universe will become available to us and much more a part of us going forward, outward and inward. All together as we are.

Thanks for the feedback, I'm going to share with you an excerpt from a little medical stories book, which I found by chance from Doctor A. Ratie, I chose on Astrology

Doctor H… was well versed in the occult and conjectural sciences, especially in alchemy and astrology. He had submitted to me for a few patients, of whom he knew nothing, except the place and date of birth, quite astonishing medical conclusions. As an experiment, I asked him one day to study the astrological probabilities of two twins, completely unknown to him and who were born with a jet lag of about thirty minutes.

We know that traditional astrology in no way implies a fatalism: but a "probability", a more or less strong inclination in the presence of which man retains a greater or lesser freedom. Likewise, on an inclined plane, it retains the possibility of going up or down, the descent or ascent being facilitated or thwarted depending on the angle of inclination of the plane.

The horoscope of the two twins concluded that there was a strong propensity to present with generalized epileptic seizures, which was correct for each of them from their birth until their present age of seventeen years. In addition, the horoscope underlined for the elder a particularly dark, if not fatal, astral conjuncture which was to correspond to February 12 of his twenty-second year and which suggested the need for special surveillance to be planned for this period.

As for the youngest, the horoscope also predicted for the same date a markedly poor health pattern. But the time difference, compared to its predecessor, corresponded to a less significant and less serious planetary change, the frankly critical hour having been slightly exceeded.

I put the horoscopes in a drawer. Doctor H… of Jewish origin was obliged in 1942 for the sad reasons that we know, to flee clandestinely to take refuge in Switzerland. Years passed.

One o'clock in the morning. Once again, the awful phone tears my sleep apart. It is snowing heavily. The starter balks and snorts, and finally decides. The paths are buried. The fog makes a white screen in front of the headlights. I finally arrive. The two twins are lying down. They have a fever and have been coughing for a few days. But the condition of the elder has just worsened suddenly.

His lips and nails are blue, he's panting and suffocating. The signs of auscultation are diffuse. Hair bronchitis, acute bronchopneumonia? Hyper-toxic influenza with pulmonary edema? Or perhaps a suffocating granule, such as we still saw? I won't know. Because I arrived practically for the agony. He died soon after in my arms. His younger brother, on the other hand, got away with bronchitis.

I came home exhausted. Impossible to go back to sleep. A pale day was beginning to dawn. I collapsed in the chair. I then remembered the horoscope that Doctor H had established… five years ago. I searched my drawers and managed to dig it up. I looked at the calendar. They had just entered their twenty-second year. And it was February 12th.

Since ancient Chaldea, astrology has been the oldest of the conjectural sciences. It has never ceased to raise heated controversies. Great minds have always adhered to it. Others, in the name of modern science, have accused it of utopia, illuminism, obscurantism and superstition. But does the scientific spirit consist in wiping out centuries of observations with a stroke of the pen? Claude Bernard, who was not suspected of superstition, underlined that it is the facts which govern the theory and not the reverse ...

Alas !, Astrology has been overused, devalued, betrayed, distorted, popularized, demeaned, and… commercialized. The newspapers themselves offer ridiculous columns every day, on which impatient readers rush to know the days favorable to their health, their business, or their love ... Astrology is not responsible for this fall and of this degradation.

The astral influence remains a mystery. It should not be imagined childishly as the reception of kinds of influx, comparable to "projections" which would come from the stars: the bottom of things escapes us. But one can suggest an analogy.

We know that man always remains, more or less dependent on his heredity, his chromosomes, his antecedents, his childhood, his environment, the multiple conditioning that he has undergone, often without his knowledge. We also know, moreover, that, from the infinitely small to the infinitely large, from “the atom to the star”, the entire universe is subject to ineluctable laws, which nothing escapes. Chance is an appearance due to ignorance: everything is linked in the cosmos. Universal gravitation testifies to this.

Therefore, how could this literally unique event, which for man come into existence, remain independent, foreign, isolated, cut off and separated from everything else?

Remember that according to the old adage "the stars tilt, but do not oblige". The story of the twins remains very exceptional. Determinism is not fatalism, and in no way excludes, for most of our behavior and our actions, a variable share of freedom: thus the cosmonaut and the aviator can fly "freely" in space. : they nonetheless remain strictly bound by the laws of gravitation and gravity.

In the same way can one conceive of the astral influence: a more or less great disposition, an inclination, a more or less strong slope: supported by a thousand-year-old experience, it translates, very incompletely and approximately, a modality of this law of universal unity and interdependence, from which nothing escapes entirely in the cosmos: not even pathology.

Cosmopathology remains to be discovered.


I hope you enjoyed this little reading :Avalon:

[Lunesoleil]

My own view on astrology can be gleaned from the following which is the most enlightening perspective that I've ever read bar none.
Even if one isn't interested in astrology it's a great insight and maybe particularly if there's a curiosity, should definitely be read.
I make no apologies for this being from a channelled source albeit a highly respected one. Within the greater scheme of things this makes a great deal of sense, you don't need to be an astrologer for this to be either understood or relevant.

Thank you for your participation and the choice of channelized reading, initially requires a minimum of astrology knowledge required, otherwise it is more of a spiritual reflection on the external representation of astrology.

Astrology is a field of many possibilities for study and the one discussed in the excerpt reminds me of a spiritual form of astrology. When we talk about karma, we must underline the axis of the lunar nodes named in India Rahu and Ketu, the dragon that encircles the zodiac. There are also the retrograde planets, the Dark Moon which is the second focal point of the Moon, the first being the earth. And I would add the converses progressions, which go in the opposite direction than the classic progressions ...
That’s exactly it, the star chart is a tool, a kind of mandala and that’s going to depend on what you do with it and it’s valid in many areas of life and not just in astrology.
I also share with you an excerpt from a book on the astrology of Anne Barbault, the daughter of the great Astrologer André Barbault. And I chose "Bad and Good Use of Astrology" and which addresses another dialectic of the practice of astrology.

“What if, despite or even because of the knowledge it provides, astrology is harmful to us?

No science escapes the unfortunate treatment that can be subjected to it, physics or chemistry by a dangerous application of their discoveries, medicine by a therapeutic standardization ect. While it is fair to criticize practical error, knowledge in itself cannot be called into question. Any knowledge requires a sense of responsibility in addition to competence.

Let us leave here the acrobats of fortune telling and stick to the authentic astrologer. It is naturally to him that the misuse of his art is attributable, most often out of weakness towards the client, by allowing himself to be drawn into his belief system.

The usual blindness of the consultant is to believe that everything is done in advance because the course of the stars makes the stops of fate: it suffices to read in the theme the unveiling of the future, which at the same time implies that the consulted must know everything, the poor one… […] What the theme contains is only a world of potentialities, the virtuality of a being; if it is by drawing from these living forces that he comes to life, it is in his own hands that the life he draws from them takes shape, in his way of consuming and using them that he concretizes his existence. If we did not take charge, especially in our society, what would happen to us? That man is the craftsman of his destiny is obvious, if we think about it.

However, it is this unfortunate deterministic frame of mind that too often leads the client into the consulting room. There is no doubt that criticism is justified in the circumstances, equating its interest or curiosity with an infantile approach and condemning the result to a disempowerment. Believing to undergo a fate and passively waiting for it to be revealed to him what must happen to him, this type of consultant adopts a disarming inertia which contributes to demobilize him in the taking in hand of his existence.

Astrology can then serve as an alibi for a certain cowardice in the face of life, going so far as to entrust his own in foreign hands, shrugging his freedom of choice and justifying his resignation with a "it's Saturn's fault". The most confusing consultant is the one who is not interested in knowing himself, believing he knows his character and hearing that it is useless to talk about it. His lack of psychology reduces him to hang on to the prognosis and at the same time to hang on to the tips of the prognosticator. He is the one who waits the most for him to make decisions for him and take his place in solving problems which are not, however, interchangeable. This is how you put yourself in the shoes of an assisted, the astrologer becomes a tutor and astrology a drug.

With this type of clientele, there is a shift from traditional consultation, with the content of pure psychological information, towards a type of consultation that comes under psychotherapy. A certain neurotic state is often the motive of this one, the subject seeking, without clearly knowing it, to be relieved by the means of the consultation. If the fear of living pushes some to flee frequentation with astrologers, it leads others to have an unhealthy dependence on them by making them play the roles of confessor through their secrets, through their debates about moods of the roles of director of consciousness, by their discharges of emotionality from the roles of therapist. Obviously, some of this data set is always entered in the "normal" consultation; this is what means that if it is successful,through a happy encounter and a quality transmission, the client not only has the feeling of having learned something valuable; he feels, moreover, that sort of benefit which comes from any deep reunion with oneself. It is in this sense that the consultation can have the value of a self-therapeutic phenomenon ”[…]

I found the video relating to the excerpt you shared
(Unknown Reality Volume 2, Session 729)
T6LdP8ciuAg

[Lunesoleil]

I've been interested in astrology for 50 years, but I won't say I actually practice it. I've picked up things along the way, am good at guessing sun signs. But some things have always bothered me. For instance, a friend who is a Taurus and has no Gemini or significant 3rd house weight in her chart, sun nowhere near the cusp, yet seems like a Gemini. I don't think people should take it too seriously. And I know from reincarnating pets that personality and intelligence level survive reincarnation nearly 100% intact, regardless of astrology.


It is interesting this relationship of the characteristics of Gemini, of the 3rd house with a Sun in Taurus and in addition a woman. A question where is the position of the Moon?
Have you looked at these progressions, because a Taurus through his Sun undeniably progresses for 30 years in the sign of Gemini. With the position of the sun in degrees in Taurus, I can tell you when this happened, but it is just the position of the Sun that is not enough to say that this woman is of Taurus or Gemini essence. It is enough to have a minimum of three planets in a sign to be charged with energy. Seeing the position of Mercury ruler of Gemini, Venus ruler of Taurus, Moon ruler of Cancer, Mars ruler of Aries, are the planetary symbols considering formed the personality.
And what makes it complex to belong to one sign, but usually several that we endorse through the progressions in our life ...
I come back to the ascendant you touched on in your previous comment, depending on where it is and then where the next house the cusp of 2 begins, because this may explain that our way of behaving will change depending on:
• From the space of the ascendant in the zodiac
• The progression of the ascendant.
This change is often done in people with oppositions, a change of personality can be done, like a change of reversed poles ...

[Lunesoleil]

We had calculators then. It took me two hours to make my radix. I was quite proud of it!
When I started looking for what it all meant, I almost fell off my chair. I just couldn't believe what I got from this unusual information.
There were a lot more astrologers around this time (at least I think).
So I thought, "If I, an astrology neophyte like myself, can get that much out of it, then what could a real qualified astrologer do?"

Thank you Johan for sharing your experience
Also for the first card I spent two hours in hand with a friend who gave me these ephemeris and books on astrology.
He is one of those who have studied astrology for a year, who have been around it and found that astrology could not give them more answers.
The click was the same in the early 70s with a small booklet and are disc to calculate the ascendancy that my mother gave me from Jean Rignac, a very popular astrologer in France at that time and I still have it.
Like everything to progress, is to practice and then to fly like a bird and not depend on such astrologer said that.
Many astrologers who have gained experience in astrology, then developed their own method, it is like the apprentice who with experience becomes by his own work a master of his art and these skills ...


And today do you still practice astrology?

George, Llewellyn (1876-1954) (https://www.encyclopedia.com/science/encyclopedias-almanacs-transcripts-and-maps/george-llewellyn-1876-1954)
His card (https://www.astrotheme.fr/astrologie/Llewellyn_George)
Llewellyn George, born August 17, 1876 in Swansea and died July 11, 1954 in Los Angeles, was an English publisher of the New Age movement, primarily publishing books on the occult and astrology.

The New Age movement, I see it by Neptune in conjunction with its MC the zenith and the Moon in 12 in conjunction Venus, a lot of charm that attracted women like... flies

[TomKat]

I've been interested in astrology for 50 years, but I won't say I actually practice it. I've picked up things along the way, am good at guessing sun signs. But some things have always bothered me. For instance, a friend who is a Taurus and has no Gemini or significant 3rd house weight in her chart, sun nowhere near the cusp, yet seems like a Gemini. I don't think people should take it too seriously. And I know from reincarnating pets that personality and intelligence level survive reincarnation nearly 100% intact, regardless of astrology.


It is interesting this relationship of the characteristics of Gemini, of the 3rd house with a Sun in Taurus and in addition a woman. A question where is the position of the Moon?
Have you looked at these progressions, because a Taurus through his Sun undeniably progresses for 30 years in the sign of Gemini. With the position of the sun in degrees in Taurus, I can tell you when this happened, but it is just the position of the Sun that is not enough to say that this woman is of Taurus or Gemini essence. It is enough to have a minimum of three planets in a sign to be charged with energy. Seeing the position of Mercury ruler of Gemini, Venus ruler of Taurus, Moon ruler of Cancer, Mars ruler of Aries, are the planetary symbols considering formed the personality.
And what makes it complex to belong to one sign, but usually several that we endorse through the progressions in our life ...
I come back to the ascendant you touched on in your previous comment, depending on where it is and then where the next house the cusp of 2 begins, because this may explain that our way of behaving will change depending on:
• From the space of the ascendant in the zodiac
• The progression of the ascendant.
This change is often done in people with oppositions, a change of personality can be done, like a change of reversed poles ...

I'm sorry, but none of your standard astrological explanations work for this person. No Gemini or 3rd house emphasis. Unrelated to progression as she has always been this way. Forget moon and ascendant. I've observed "off-sign" similarities with others also, over the years. No system is perfect, so it's best not to make a religion of it.

Tropical and Sidereal charts are different, and both have their adherents. With each school "disproving" the other, there's a lot of latitude for deviation. If astrology were the steering wheel of your car, you'd never stay on the road. It's just not exact enough to support all the measurements and calculations that astrologers rely on. It's not the planets that are at fault, it's neurotic humans calculating with them, pretending to have a science.

[Lunesoleil]

I'm sorry, but none of your standard astrological explanations work for this person. No Gemini or 3rd house emphasis. Unrelated to progression as she has always been this way. Forget moon and ascendant. I've observed "off-sign" similarities with others also, over the years. No system is perfect, so it's best not to make a religion of it. .


Sorry Tomkat, I know my tool well and we can say anything about the simple position of the Sun in astrology which is the instrument of horoscopes in the newspapers and on the radio and that absolutely does not make a credible astrology for them. real astrologers and you tell me you have 50 years of experience in astrology, are you kidding ??
Recognizing a person's position of the Sun is a derivative of horoscopes, but it is not the astrology of astrologers that I know of.

[TomKat]

I'm sorry, but none of your standard astrological explanations work for this person. No Gemini or 3rd house emphasis. Unrelated to progression as she has always been this way. Forget moon and ascendant. I've observed "off-sign" similarities with others also, over the years. No system is perfect, so it's best not to make a religion of it. .


Sorry Tomkat, I know my tool well and we can say anything about the simple position of the Sun in astrology which is the instrument of horoscopes in the newspapers and on the radio and that absolutely does not make a credible astrology for them. real astrologers and you tell me you have 50 years of experience in astrology, are you kidding ??
Recognizing a person's position of the Sun is a derivative of horoscopes, but it is not the astrology of astrologers that I know of.

I'm not just talking sun signs as you'd see if you read what I wrote. I know all the standard arguments you're using, and disposed of them long ago in her case. But believe what you want.

[Johan (Keyholder)]

Lunesoleil, I haven't practiced astrology for a long, long time.

Sometimes, I may still use "Astrodienst" to have a quick "peek" into someone's horoscope, but that's about it.
It's not that I don't realize what astrology can teach someone, it certainly càn!

It has more to do with one's Life Purpose; for some people this will be their Path and they know it (most of the time anyway).
Life tends to teach people where one's talents and possibilities are. If one is only willing to look (and learn).

Many people here on PA do exactly thàt: follow - intuitively or not - what they chose to do here, this life-time around.

It is no secret either that many here have had very unusual lives, in countless ways. You only have to jump around the subjects a bit to see that.

I think it's great that you found ànd followed your vocation! I know you also find a lot of comfort and support in it. Good for you!

[Lunesoleil]

I'm not just talking sun signs as you'd see if you read what I wrote. I know all the standard arguments you're using, and disposed of them long ago in her case. But believe what you want.

Are you, Tomkat a sore loser? , practicing astrology for 50 years and then denigrating it is almost inconceivable or there is something that escapes me. I have known so-called astrologers after 20 years of "practice" so to speak, these people were still in the basics of the basics. Hadn't taken off at all, it's like being in the plane with your parachute and not jumping. Many false astrologers, are curious observers, who take only what suits them and make no effort in themselves to go beyond what they can peck in the backyard.
This is not the astrology that I practice and even if I manage to respect those who have a different approach from mine, by the simple fact of bringing a new perspective, which will allow us to mutually enrich our understanding of an astrology that has many tricks up its sleeve. When I criticize astrologers, I have good reasons, because I am able to do so, I have the knowledge, I have had experience in the field and have been in the field long enough to give my opinion. It's good to talk about one thing, but if you are not able to go further in your reasoning it is because you are like that lame astrologer who was missing something that you did not achieve. to obtain.
Astrology is an art that requires cultivating a privileged relationship in order to obtain the quintessence of one's knowledge. It's about saying a prayer and whether or not your dearest wish will be granted. Astrology has kind of a soul that can echo or even become a Forbidden City, because you were not allowed to enter the temple….

An excerpt from a book by Dane Rudhyar "A New Man for a New Age" and read carefully on:

I chose the last chapter "the ideal of social plenitude"

Of course, it is impossible to know if this phase of synthesis, which is part of the plausible evolution of human society, will actually succeed in seeing the light of day in a world profoundly disrupted, but also energized by the planetary impact of Western civilization . The next generation might as well witness a catastrophic miscarriage, or be forced to end gestation if there is no longer any doubt that humanity is about to give birth to a monster. We are just as incapable of saying what form a peaceful and globalizing planetary society would take if it could come into being without too much trouble; yet many visionaries have tried to outline at least what form it should have, according to their own ideal of human achievement.These are projects or dreams, which have been called "utopias" […]

The possible of tomorrow depends on what our yesterdays and days before have made the world today. But the efforts that we can make to achieve a possible future are also conditioned by the type of interpretation we will be able to give of the tumultuous events and often tragic conflicts of past centuries. […]

If we consider the development of humanity from a materialist perspective and situate this process in an exclusively physical universe where forces oppose other forces and where rigid laws govern according to patterns that only the intellect endowed with reason can define, the only probable utopia has many chances to be the Marxist vision which levels humanity in a classless society, where all that remains to be solved are problems of production and material organization; unless it is the technocratic utopia born from the scientist mentality, which exalts the empiricism and intellectualism that we know well in the West and which deliberately or not would lead to the exercise of a totalitarian power by a caste of managers, engineers, biologists,psychologists and physicians seeking to develop “perfect” beings in an environment worthy of their idea of ​​flawless functionalism, total health, absolute happiness and unfailing prosperity […]

At the other end of the philosophical spectrum, we find the utopias that could be called "spiritualist" based on the idea that man is in essence a spiritual being operating in and through a physical organism, but without this the latter necessarily limits it, wherever the link is conscious. While materialistic utopias tend to emphasize the collective aspect of human development, and its objective manifestations, the spiritualist philosopher and mystic privilege the individual and his subjective experiences which reveal the possibility of the infinite supraphysical development of man. 'a spiritual “essence”, a permanent awareness of the “I” […]

At the present stage of human evolution and consciousness, it is certainly difficult to determine the natural belonging of the individual to one elementary type of function or to another. It is nevertheless interesting to note that the political organization of many democracies is based on a somewhat similar differentiation of the legislative, executive and judicial powers. Unfortunately, this principle of tripartite organization is only understood at the political level of power, and is exercised through a constant struggle for influence. It should be understood that this same tripartite principle is also exercised and in a more fundamental way, at the level of the individual conscience of the members of the socio-cultural group.

At this level, no sane person would dream of denying the existence of fundamental and natural differences between the needs, wants and purposes of individuals. Any attempt to root out psychological variances and impose any uniformity is bound to fail, because the recorded differences arise from various bio-psychic temperaments, and at the same time transcend their source. On the contrary, I insist on it, allow each fundamental mode of functional activity to unfold at its own pace and at its most characteristic, productive and significant level, but nevertheless at the same time. 'within the limits imposed by the specificity of the whole of which it participates […]


At this level of practice of astrology, the astrologer has reached another level of consciousness

Khaldea (http://www.khaldea.com/rudhyar/) you will find many articles by this author

[Lunesoleil]

I don't have a technical, mathematical kind of mind so I wouldn't make a good astrologer, but I think intuition would always have to be an attribute for an astrologer to be really good at what they do. Good astrologers can provide amazing insights into all manner of subjects.
Astrology is a much more technically precise art than those practiced by psychics, channelers, tarot readers, numerologists, etc., imho though I think they all can offer much when the practitioner is sufficiently talented and intuitive.

I would say that you don't have to be a good mathematician to practice astrology, since there are many forms of astrologies, then you have to determine the category of astrologer you have chosen to be. There are also the "consumers of astrology" who do not speak much about it and yet there are many. I noticed in the "Stoic Astrology-Astrology Reports (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?91348-Ang-Stoic-Astrological-Reports)" thread that you created, are you promoting, are you a member of his site ?, I also see who is giving consultations, have you already looked at him?

There is not one type of astrology but a multitude of astrologies, it is the plurality in the different approaches and methods that is the source of progress in consciousness.
I've never been a fan of a singer, until going to these concerts or buying these records, I just take the song that I like and never stop conquering, to discover new things, this is what brings us an exponential opening of an infinite knowledge. Astrology is not just about reading articles from your favorite author, it is about experiencing yourself in the method you are experimenting with, because there is always something to learn however little - he.

Did you know for a single astrological aspect, there is an infinite number of combinations in the interpretation which will depend on the intellectual baggage of the astrologer, his seniority, the quality of the message he wants to convey which is to be qualified between a astrologer who will write an article based on his need and not for the reader's need. I find it a shame to have an astrological interest like yours and not to have tried to share your results of your research or reflections, because after 4 years (a cycle in solar revolution) you have not taken the step in practice of this art. You know there is everything in astrologers, scientists, theorists, spiritual, emotional, intuitive, symbolists, researchers, observers, dreamers ect ...

[Lunesoleil]

Lunesoleil, I haven't practiced astrology for a long, long time.
Thank you Johan, I did not take the time to answer all of your thoughts, but believe me I really appreciated. I think we can recognize people who have experienced astrology seriously, because astrology over time brings a kind of humility, but not everyone develops this quality and that's a shame. Because the study of astrology requires being humble, as we would be with God in our prayers. I can know your level of course, thank you


Sometimes, I may still use "Astrodienst" to have a quick "peek" into someone's horoscope, but that's about it.
I know the astrodienst tool well since my beginnings on the internet, I have a free account and I mainly use various charts, but I know that the horoscopes are of quality, I like the AstroClick Partner interactive map and remain a summary approach, like the oracle of colors ...


It's not that I don't realize what astrology can teach someone, it certainly càn!
It has more to do with one's Life Purpose; for some people this will be their Path and they know it (most of the time anyway).
Astrology is an asset for developing intuition and brings many benefits in this direction in terms of changes in intuitive perceptions. It is also a mental hygiene, which changes your own way of seeing yourself as well as others when you have the person's card. Because the card has a part of magic for the astrologer, like the tarot for the seer


Life tends to teach people where one's talents and possibilities are. If one is only willing to look (and learn).
Exactly, but do we have to give ourselves the necessary time and not just the effort to get there? The study of astrology makes it easier to accept yourself as you are, it is the most important I think to accept who I am, which is sometimes more difficult to be accepted by others. And when it comes from another astrologer, you can imagine what astrology gave or denied.


Many people here on PA do exactly thàt: follow - intuitively or not - what they chose to do here, this life-time around
On Project Avalon, already we come not by chance, there can be at the beginning of the curiosity, but these people do nothing but go their way and then it is true that a forum to charge you the life according to the contents of the discussions



It is no secret either that many here have had very unusual lives, in countless ways. You only have to jump around the subjects a bit to see that.
I'm going to be very honest I don't have a lot of time for that, otherwise I spend all my day reading the exchanges, but I want to believe that there is some consciousness energy, then it all depends on what the we are looking for and our spiritual needs or response to a questioning of the moment. In astrology it's a bit the same, we will do a search on Google according to our current concerns or search for additional and specific information to land here and not elsewhere.



I think it's great that you found ànd followed your vocation! I know you also find a lot of comfort and support in it. Good for you!
A yes astrology has changed my life and my perception of the world and I think that if I had not studied astrology at the level that I chose with complete freedom of choice, I think that I would not have the life I have today. Because everything is a question of vibratory frequency, heart and level of consciousness that the study of astrology can bring in its own way. Thank you for your kindness.

:peace:

[onawah]

I like Ang Stoic's info because he publishes his charts and some of his predictions/insights online for free, and I resonate with it because he likes to share his views of the big picture, and because I like some of the imaginative artwork he includes in his updates.
( Being an INFJ, I look at the big picture a lot as well. )
I get no reimbursement for posting his info here, and I am not a subscriber to his site.

I have no desire to become an astrologer.
But as an intuitive I will make a prediction, which is that if you are using Avalon to try to drum up business for yourself, you will not meet with much success.
I think your approach is too aggressive, and in any case, such commercial endeavors are in cross-purposes to Avalon's mission.





I don't have a technical, mathematical kind of mind so I wouldn't make a good astrologer, but I think intuition would always have to be an attribute for an astrologer to be really good at what they do. Good astrologers can provide amazing insights into all manner of subjects.
Astrology is a much more technically precise art than those practiced by psychics, channelers, tarot readers, numerologists, etc., imho though I think they all can offer much when the practitioner is sufficiently talented and intuitive.

I would say that you don't have to be a good mathematician to practice astrology, since there are many forms of astrologies, then you have to determine the category of astrologer you have chosen to be. There are also the "consumers of astrology" who do not speak much about it and yet there are many. I noticed in the "Stoic Astrology-Astrology Reports (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?91348-Ang-Stoic-Astrological-Reports)" thread that you created, are you promoting, are you a member of his site ?, I also see who is giving consultations, have you already looked at him?

There is not one type of astrology but a multitude of astrologies, it is the plurality in the different approaches and methods that is the source of progress in consciousness.
I've never been a fan of a singer, until going to these concerts or buying these records, I just take the song that I like and never stop conquering, to discover new things, this is what brings us an exponential opening of an infinite knowledge. Astrology is not just about reading articles from your favorite author, it is about experiencing yourself in the method you are experimenting with, because there is always something to learn however little - he.

Did you know for a single astrological aspect, there is an infinite number of combinations in the interpretation which will depend on the intellectual baggage of the astrologer, his seniority, the quality of the message he wants to convey which is to be qualified between a astrologer who will write an article based on his need and not for the reader's need. I find it a shame to have an astrological interest like yours and not to have tried to share your results of your research or reflections, because after 4 years (a cycle in solar revolution) you have not taken the step in practice of this art. You know there is everything in astrologers, scientists, theorists, spiritual, emotional, intuitive, symbolists, researchers, observers, dreamers ect ...

[Lunesoleil]

I have no desire to become an astrologer.
But as an intuitive I will make a prediction, which is that if you are using Avalon to try to drum up business for yourself, you will not meet with much success.
I think your approach is too aggressive, and in any case, such commercial endeavors are in cross-purposes to Avalon's mission.

Tell me onawah, what makes you write such bad intentions ?, that I'm here to recruit potential clients? , have you seen something in this direction on my blog? I'm sorry to tell you, "I don't give any astrology consultations and have always declined requests received privately on the Avalon forum.
I created this discussion to bring something else to the astrology section which is not really crowded and where exchanges are very rare. I think this discussion was missing to develop a new look and why not trigger the click by pushing the door of an astrology of horoscopes to create these astrological cooking recipes.
I have opinions, I claim them is not to be aggressive, I say what I think, it is to wake up sleeping spirits or those who call themselves astrologers and are not even. It is true that the truth can hurt, but the truth is also the trigger of conscience, because the truth not clearly heard at the moment is a door which invites us to change.
Having an interest in astrology starts out with a surge of the heart for something that gives us an answer to questions or situations that we go through. It's a step to start, then we can take two, then three, four ect ...
At my level, I know the excesses of the practice of astrology, of these detractors between sidereal and tropical and heliocentric is also an approach just as exciting as one could confront with geocentrism, I have experienced both.
It may be the hour of revelations knowing that chance does not exist, because everything has a meaning in life which is filled with symbol, synchronicity, sometimes magic that we have to provoke you not to be missed….

usUe-ugm_z0

Gift for you
:cheer2:

[onawah]

Well, I'm glad to hear it.
Perhaps you can see why your unfounded assumption that I am remiss in not learning how to become an astrologer did not come across as being concerned or benevolent, but aggressively challenging in a quite unnecessary manner.
if you find others on Avalon who are interested in the study of astrology, all well and good, but it has not been so much a focal point here as yet; though that could change.
But please count me out as a possible recruit.
And if you don't like the Ang Stoic thread, hopefully you will not find a competitive need to post there.
Thank you.

[Lunesoleil]

if you find others on Avalon who are interested in the study of astrology, all well and good, but it has not been so much a focal point here as yet; though that could change. :scared:

I very much hope that other members of the Avalon Forum will provide their testimonies on the art of Urania. The purpose of this discussion is not to provoke controversy or personal attacks but to share even a negative experience. The author of another discussion provided a very interesting reflection on what "the truth (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?113364-Your-truth-v-the-truth&p=1397954&viewfull=1#post1397954)" can mean which will be different for each of us. I do not hold the absolute truth about astrology because I know these flaws and limitations, which come from my own experience. What I don't understand is the lack of honesty in these loopholes and mistakenly wanting to lump astrologers into the same bag.

My experience of astrology forums, have only "the name", because it is often a content diverted from its origin for lack of knowledge so one is ironic until becoming ridiculous by the mediocrity of the speech. Today astrology is overused, it is like this woman who is thrown stones for having cheated on her husband. Because it's astrology, we allow ourselves to say everything, until sacrificing it at the stake, because the church has prohibited its teaching, so we allow ourselves to call it a whore, of all names because astrology would not be worth studying in a university?

We even come to parochial quarrels, my god what sad language, for lack of discernment, or for having chosen to be a consumer because it is free, there is no need to make personal efforts, others do it for us and in addition a copy pasted is enough to steal recognition that does not belong to us.

What can be done when faced with a deaf person who does not want to hear? , we can't do anything more!
I do hope that some members will bring another story than yours, showing themselves in the bottom of the wave, because there is nothing else to share than resentments, contempt for an astrologer more interesting than this. that you can suggest? , only animosity that has no place in this discussion.

It takes everything to make a world and we can say that we cannot please everyone ... and all tastes are in nature. It's like in a supermarket, we still have the right to choose, unlike in times of war the choices are imposed by the restrictions ... and sometimes these restrictions have to be imposed on oneself, the excuse can seem a good way not to do one thing, rather than another. ..

:bigfish:

[TomKat]

I'm not just talking sun signs as you'd see if you read what I wrote. I know all the standard arguments you're using, and disposed of them long ago in her case. But believe what you want.

Are you, Tomkat a sore loser?

Didn't know I was in a contest, but if you want to declare yourself some kind of winner, go ahead.


, practicing astrology for 50 years and then denigrating it is almost inconceivable or there is something that escapes me. I have known so-called astrologers after 20 years of "practice" so to speak, these people were still in the basics of the basics. Hadn't taken off at all, it's like being in the plane with your parachute and not jumping. Many false astrologers, are curious observers, who take only what suits them and make no effort in themselves to go beyond what they can peck in the backyard.
This is not the astrology that I practice and even if I manage to respect those who have a different approach from mine, by the simple fact of bringing a new perspective, which will allow us to mutually enrich our understanding of an astrology that has many tricks up its sleeve. When I criticize astrologers, I have good reasons, because I am able to do so, I have the knowledge, I have had experience in the field and have been in the field long enough to give my opinion. It's good to talk about one thing, but if you are not able to go further in your reasoning it is because you are like that lame astrologer who was missing something that you did not achieve. to obtain.
Astrology is an art that requires cultivating a privileged relationship in order to obtain the quintessence of one's knowledge. It's about saying a prayer and whether or not your dearest wish will be granted. Astrology has kind of a soul that can echo or even become a Forbidden City, because you were not allowed to enter the temple….

In other words, you've gone off the deep end... Good luck

[ulli]

Having an interest in astrology starts out with a surge of the heart for something that gives us an answer to questions or situations that we go through. It's a step to start, then we can take two, then three, four ect ...
At my level, I know the excesses of the practice of astrology, of these detractors between sidereal and tropical and heliocentric is also an approach just as exciting as one could confront with geocentrism, I have experienced both.
It may be the hour of revelations knowing that chance does not exist, because everything has a meaning in life which is filled with symbol, synchronicity, sometimes magic that we have to provoke you not to be missed….

usUe-ugm_z0

Gift for you
:cheer2:

Thank you for this thread. Talking astrology is always a bit risky, and in my experience invites plenty of trolling, and also abuse, as some people feel entitled to receiving the info on a platter.

But I see nothing wrong with people who have a genuine interest in this infinite subject discussing their astrological charts and having a close look at current transits, and sharing their observations.

Here is my current situation: In 2020 I experienced Uranus squaring my AC, Phew.
(For those not familiar with those terms:
Uranus rules Aquarius, and rules the sudden, and unexpected events. Rules shocks as well as surprises. Rules technology, rules innovation, intuition, genius flashes, rebellion, rules the going against the grain.

A “square” is a right angle, and as four right angles form a cross, as in suffering, energies can become disruptive, like a star gate that might slide open and allow dark forces to march into our 3D world, entering from lower domains. It is a time of testing, of make or break tests.

And the AC, or Ascendant, is the zodiacal point of the eastern horizon which can only be known if the hour and place of birth are also known. It is determined by the rotation of the earth around its own axis. If one is born at sunrise, the AC is then the same sign as the sun sign.

The AC is associated mostly with our physical body, genetics, and our personality as it is formed during early life, by the societal forces of childhood and early education. As a person matures and becomes an individual with a unique and specific life path, collecting memories, the sun sign becomes stronger.

Anyway, here is me sharing what Uranus had in store for me this last godforsaken year.
Several times during the transit I would wake up from deep sleep, with a severe pain in my mouth, as I had bitten hard on my tongue. Ouch. I understand that there are people who are born with a bad Uranus angle who suffer with this their entire life time.
Also my smartphone slipped out of my hand and the screen broke.
Then my watch, which has a torchlight inside, and can be very useful when having to get up during the night to use the bathroom, also crashed to the floor, hitting the torchlight button, which now works no more.
My Aquarius son (three planets in Aquarius, all of them square his natal Uranus) and I had a sad falling out, due to political differences. He believes now that I am insane.
The list can go on and on, but perhaps you get the idea.

And now the Jupiter/Saturn conjunction is squaring my north node at any moment.
Not quite sure yet how to interpret this transit, but perhaps my reluctance to post here on this forum is coming to an end, and perhaps this transit could have something to do with that. Thank you for baiting me, Lunesoleil.

No two astrologers see the same things, as the subject is just incredibly vast, but we can enjoy each others different perspectives.

[leavesoftrees]

And now the Jupiter/Saturn conjunction is squaring my north node at any moment.
Not quite sure yet how to interpret this transit, but perhaps my reluctance to post here on this forum is coming to an end, and perhaps this transit could have something to do with that. Thank you for baiting me, Lunesoleil.
.

Nice to see you posting again Ulli. Welcome back!

[Bill Ryan]

I keep on thinking of posting on this thread — simply to answer the question. :)

Ever since I read Lifetide (by Lyall Watson) (https://www.amazon.com/Lifetide-Lyall-Watson/dp/0340416688), back in the late 80s, I've been intrigued about how astrology could possibly work. Watson was an inspired and open-minded biologist who also wrote the most excellent book Supernature (here it is (https://avalonlibrary.net/ebooks/Lyall%20Watson%20-%20Supernature.pdf) in the Avalon Library), and he cited quite a lot of statistical evidence showing that astrology seemed to have at least some validity.

He also tried valiantly — but in my view unconvincingly — to theorize what the mechanism might be. I've studied a lot of math and physics (and wanted to be an astrophysicist when I was a kid!), and I absolutely can't see a mechanism. Just none at all, anywhere in sight. It all seems totally impossible.

There are many questions that most astrologers seem not to consider. One of the most interesting might be: would astrology work in other solar systems, for other intelligent species, whose views of the stars and planets close to them would be very different?

And another (which I do know many have tried to address, but never at all persuasively for me) is why the moment of birth is considered more important than the moment of conception (or the moment of 'walk-in', if the spirit entered the body after birth, which can sometimes happen).

Birth is only about one's body. Isn't one's (re-)entry into the world as a spirit rather more significant?

But I have had one or two very accurate astrological readings. It all remains a complete mystery to me. I don't pay a lot of attention to it, but here we are, and you did ask the question.

:)

[ulli]

Once the astrology student discovers the validity of astrological analysis and even forecasts as being consistently accurate, then this question ought to arise, as one’s former understanding of the universe is being challenged.

Cause and effect are misconceptions here. It is more like as if things are running side by side, or parallel. As above, so below- and I don’t mean in an up and down way, but rather how microcosm and macrocosm seem to have similar laws governing their structures.

The specific energy flow which happens when planets form mathematical angles shows that geometry plays a significant part in ordering nature. Flowers and their petals form specific designs, and all very orderly.

And here we also find that astrology connects with numerology. For example a 72 degree angle multiplied by five gives us a pentacle, or five pointed star.

In occult teachings it is associated with protective energy. Hence the US department of defense was built in the form of a pentagon.

The even-sided triangle, i.e. 120 degrees, times three, is associated with the holy trinity, while the right angle, 90 degrees times 4 gives us a cross, as in crucifixion.

So when studying sacred geometry one can then see how it fits in with astrology, and other hidden teachings.


Another thought has to do with what happens with our consciousness and how it tends to expand when there is a shock, or surprise. Our memories are made up of those specific moments, conscious as well as subconscious memories.

So for example a baby inside the mothers womb gradually becomes more and more uncomfortable as its life inside the womb draws to an end. There is panic when contractions begin, increased heart rate, and life feels as if it is being threatened.
Then comes birth, and with it comes a great relief as baby discovers that it is still alive, albeit with a different breathing method. It can finally move its limbs again.
So this is the huge surprise, this new beginning. A massive leap in consciousness follows, and like music is engraved on a blank CD disc, so personality traits are also formed. So the birth chart measures this precise moment, how our solar system that surrounds us, affected the makeup of this moment’s deepest memories.
While some scientists focus only on genetics, and find truth there, the astrologer focuses on the hidden mathematics of our solar system, although some go even further and study the positions of distant stars, finding correlation even there.

While psychoanalysis looks at patterns created during early childhood, the astrologer goes to the moment of birth, and compares the mathematical design of geometric patters in our solar system, and there finds parallels with behavior, and talents, or weaknesses that make this person unique.

And great talents then can become indicators to past lives’ merits earned, which become helpful while navigating the present life.
Lots to think about.

[Lunesoleil]

Didn't know I was in a contest, but if you want to declare yourself some kind of winner, go ahead.
Astrology is not a beauty contest, although there are also schools, trainings, conferences. It was from 1666 that Colbert refused entry to astrology at the Academy of Sciences and prohibited astronomers from practicing it, which was lamentably led astray by these detractors
Admittedly, we are not on the same level of practice of astrology and the why we cannot agree on the language formulations. Horoscopes have done a lot of damage to astrology. The fact of referring to the position of the Sun and confronting it with the polemic of the sidereal zodiac versus the tropical, shows the kind of astrology you frequent, that kind of opinion is a false debate.
Give me a star chart with its date of birth, time and place and we can start with a serious conversation. But if you are arguing about an observation that comes out of an astrological context that any astrologer will need, as it is their basic tool, I am sorry to tell you, an astrologer can only talk about what he sees and not what he does not see.



Tropical and Sidereal charts are different, and both have their adherents.
There are astrologers who use in their study the two zodiacs, where is the problem, I even did a study on the practitioners of the sidereal zodiac which is a south node force orientation and the practitioners of the tropical zodiac that the we find more with an accentuation of the north node. If you had done a study of these two psychological tendencies, you would have found a basis for working and understanding these astrological mechanisms.




With each school "disproving" the other, there's a lot of latitude for deviation

I don't see it that way, it's on the contrary an opportunity to make a choice according to our astrological aspirations, since we have personal tastes, those with an interest in DIY, cooking, sewing ... and others gifted for mathematical reasoning or physics, schools in astrology are there, to develop our innate tendencies. It is the diversity that makes astrology a complete art through these many skills ...



If astrology were the steering wheel of your car, you'd never stay on the road. It's just not exact enough to support all the measurements and calculations that astrologers rely on.

Think again in astrology there are astrologers specializing in precision, it is simply that you do not know them and that you have never met them, but believe me they exist.
There are also a lot of researchers in the study of astrology, fortunately because consulting astrologers often do wrong astrology because there are too many of them, as well as some seers taking advantage of the disbelief of their clients.


It's not the planets that are at fault, it's neurotic humans calculating with them, pretending to have a science.

Don't you think we are all neurotics ??, that's unique to human? The astrologer is like the shoemaker who is said to be the worst shod and I have verified him many times, because the astrologer is above all a human like any other. Can we blame astrology for not having received what it would not have given us?



I believe in Sidereal Astrology for world predictions, where Tropical Astrology falls short. But Sidereal Astrology is terrible for personality analysis.
I would rather say that it depends on the method you use and that there are astrologers who are very good at prediction. My area of ​​predilection is more the combination of natal and progressions, each his preference. Astrology is a very wide field of investigation and an astrologer cannot get involved in everything, it is impossible otherwise he would spend these days and nights studying.


I believe every planetary aspect influences everyone equally.
Yes there is an element of truth at a collective level then does this aspect have to resonate with a particular person to trigger an event and at this level I am thinking of the conjunction which is the strongest aspect? in astrology.


Outside of the natal chart, I find astrology to be a weak influence on the individual, but not on the masses..
We are under the influence of 29-day planetary cycles that of the soli-lunar cycle and of the 500-year Neptune / Pluto cycle, but there are larger ones such as the one referring to kali-yuga


Astrology has fallen victim to the human penchant for creating complex, self-referring, self-proving systems (read Cat's Cradle).
These complex systems do not exist only in the practice of astrology but also in all scientific studies. The work of an architect to develop the plan of a house, a modern building, an airplane pilot, a master pastry chef to make a delicious dessert, there are talents on the four corners of the planet


Delving too deeply into astrology is a withdrawal from life.
A priesthood, a religion, is better than being an alcoholic, a drug addict, as long as you move in the right direction and bring something that makes sense for the community ...


In other words, you've gone off the deep end... Good luck
it's one of my qualities, have you found my sun sign? it's easy ...

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f2/Yugas.png
Kali-Yuga (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kali_Yuga)

[Lunesoleil]

Thank you for this thread. Talking astrology is always a bit risky, and in my experience invites plenty of trolling, and also abuse, as some people feel entitled to receiving the info on a platter.


First of all, thank you wonderful Ulli for your feedback on the forum, for the observations I read from you about our shared passion for astrology, which resonated with me.
About Uranus currently in conjunction with the Dark Moon, will be the subject of my next article.
If I understood Uranus is squared with your Ascendant? , with me the next destination Uranus is a conjunction with my ascendant, for a change of Look? , I live the Uranus transits rather well, I see it as a guide and combined with the asteroid Atlantis (1198) the return of the Atlanteans.
I threw myself into the study of astrology, it was under a Uranus transit in conjunction with my MC, I could not have hoped for better! I am not hiding from you to fully understand the meaning of Uranus, we must assess its position in the natal which will accompany us at each of the Uranus transits. I confirmed this in 2018 during a fairly tough transit, in fact, I did not experience any bad surprises. Which means that it is indeed a relationship of initial belief and psychological conditioning. Tormenting yourself over something that in reality does not yet exist, it is the worry that will then cause what you feared. The way we think every day influences our choices and the situations that happen to us.
The conjunction Jupiter and Saturn with the double square of the Lunar Nodes, must be considered as a karmic challenge on the social level and its structure and which obviously raises many questions ...
Your Ulli return under a trine of Venus and the Moon Wow, we should be able to get along and keep sharing on astrology, thanks for saving this discussion from the flood
Looking forward to discussing the art of Urania ...

:flower:

[Lunesoleil]

There are many questions that most astrologers seem not to consider. One of the most interesting might be: would astrology work in other solar systems, for other intelligent species, whose views of the stars and planets close to them would be very different?

Thanks Bill for the feedback :Avalon:

Your reflection is interesting in the sense that the great American mystic Edgar Cayce speaks of planetary sojourns in the book "The Universe of Edgar Cayce" by author Dorothée Koechlin de Bizemont. I have given excerpts in my articles relating to the asteroid Atlantis to evoke Atlantis the submerged continent

An excerpt from the book about the Moon:

extract p.410 / 411: According to astrological aspects, we can find a stay made on the Moon by this entity . Hence, the lunar influence on this native. Never sleep with your face exposed to the moonlight! There is also a lot to be said about exposure to sunlight. Because Moon and Sun govern the emotions (Reading 1401-1).

As the Sun is the source of life - in terrestrial materiality - the beauty of the satellite of the Earth, experienced in these lunar stays, from where the soul of the individual goes to travel to these other planets […] gives a vital experience to the entity or soul when it passes by there (Reading 805-4)

The inhabitants of the Moon, satellite of the Earth preceded those who adapted to the matter, came to live on the Earth in the material form. And this entity was among those who thus lived on the Moon, it remains very influenced by the two stays it made there. (Reading 264-2)

Classical astrology thinks that the Sun governs sentimental affairs ... but apparently so does the Moon: The elements of the Moon influence matters of love, (Readings 9000-6) The influence of the Moon on this entity plays particularly on the material satisfaction of amorous desires. (Reading 9000-14)

The Moon plays in the direction of an increase of all that is physical, and also pushes the entity to develop towards a high established vocation… The effect of the Sun, however here, is like a brilliant trace that illuminates the relationships of this being with those he meets (Reading 288-1)

And according to astrological tradition, strongly lunar natives are changeable? With this opposing Moon, the entity changes with the phases of the Moon. Not in its goals or in its deep intentions […] but in the way it expresses itself in front of others (Reading 39-2) The Moon being badly aspectated […], the entity lives periods when all that 'she touches […] is marked by luck, but to others, everything goes wrong! (Reading 2855-1)

The entity made a stay on the Moon. Hence over the years, as she develops, the fact that, although beautiful in body and knowing how to express herself, she appears as an inconsistent person. (Reading 1620-2)

Sun and Moon are both also essential for the proper functioning of our organs: Thus astrologically, in the solar system to which the Earth belongs, the other celestial bodies have an influence on the control centers of the human body, like the Sun on the brain, the Moon on sex. (Reading 2608-1)

Everything that is element "Water" in our body is ruled by the Moon, this is what classical astrology says. The Moon has the mastery of the waters, because in the beginning our own planet, the Earth was launched into orbit. The creation of other planets, originally, assigned them the function of governing the fate of all created matter. Exactly as the division of the waters, which took place under the action of the Moon, is still governed by it, on its way around the Earth (Reading 3744-3)

other extract: p.404
For Edgar Cayce, Uranus was linked to the Atlanteans. This is what he says about the planet Uranus => "The entity is not only an Atlantean, but also a Uranian. Hence the inner certainty that she is sometimes right and that all the others, without exception, are wrong! Or the opposite: everyone is right, except her! This gives a rather special personality, influenced […] by Uranus who takes her to extremes in her desires. The entity needs urgently and all the time to love someone - which can be good or very bad… (readings 3226-1) and again => We find on Uranus the extremes and yet for this entity, the total awareness of its fullness dating from this experience of life in Atlantis - (readings 2794-3) and to finish => Here we find Mercury, Venus, Jupiter and Uranus. And Uranus Yes, who in this life in Atlantis gave the entity these unusual skills - and brings about these sudden, extreme circumstances that arise in his life (reading 2791-1)


Edgar Cayce talks about all the planets and the two luminaries the Sun and the Moon where souls have made sojourns on Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Neptune and Pluto

pLReOJkDnMY
I found a video on the subject

[Lunesoleil]

And another (which I know many have tried to address, but never at all convincingly for me) is why the time of birth is considered more important than the time of conception (or the time the `` walk-in '', if the spirit has entered the body after birth, which can sometimes happen)
I'll try Bill, answer that question. The moment of conception has already been stated time and time again by many astrologers, publicly or privately through conferences, discussion and limited access to members. Do a Google search for Bill, maybe you will find the beginning of an answer. The problem, that very often the day of conception is not known by the astrologer and knowing the time is almost impossible. In astrology, there is the calculation of the prenatal New Moon, by a program that does the calculation.

In the absence of the design theme, we can study converses progressions. It is a method that allows to go back, to follow the planets in their progressions in a retrograde direction. We use the following calculation: One day before birth is equal to one year before birth. For a person of 90 years, the Sun turns 90 ° backwards and in the period of the fetus corresponding to a period of 3 months before the birth. This limit, corresponds to this period of a preterm birth, a premature birth. You cannot exceed this limit at the risk of an under-trained fetus. This, to bring you an index of reflection compared to a mirror evaluation between the capacity of existence of a human life on earth and its equivalent in converses progression.

I have simplified the explanations of the calculations, which obviously do not stop at the sole position of the Sun, but the complete study of the planets. The study of the conception, can complete the study of the converses progressions and in the absence of the first, we still have the study of the converses progressions combined this time in Karmic astrology and this time with the secondary progressions which are calculated by one day after birth is equal to one year. It is at this level of reading the retrograde planets, such as Mercury, Venus and Mars which will bring us valuable indications .

In Astrology, we cannot stop at one element, we are forced to create ramifications between several methods that can be verified for example in a solar revolution anniversary of the current year, which can mean that the information was available now and not another day. A question asked to an astrologer is never trivial, it is part of an internal process and that even if the answer does not answer the question asked, the process is already underway and the answer will come differently, but it is on the way, because the thought there expressed.

Do not know if I answered, I would say that I tried according to my skills and my experience on converses progressions and secondary progressions. The latter is part of my systematic study of the study of the natal chart, one cannot go without the other, it is my philosophy and my path as an astrologer.

[yuhui]

I am an independent researcher and translator on Chinese astrology. Based on the books I read, astrology is a vast and profound knowledge and it can be found in most ancient civilizations. Most of people only know natal chart interpretation which is pretty sad.
Here is a Brilliant French astrology: André Barbault in Conversation with Lynn Bell

VgVYt7IQjJs

[Lunesoleil]

https://lunesoleil23.files.wordpress.com/2020/12/hades.jpg


Here is a Brilliant French astrology: André Barbault in Conversation with Lynn Bell
First of all, thank you Yuhui, for your intervention in this discussion dedicated to astrology.
Thank you for the long video with André Barbault and Lynn Bell, I only know the short version, I would listen with pleasure to this exchange between these two great astrologers.
What you should know, there was a great hostility between the astrologer Hades (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Flunesoleil23.wordpress.com%2F2019%2F10%2F15%2Flastrologue-hades%2F)who wrote many books on astrology and André Barbault (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Flunesoleil23.wordpress.com%2F2019%2F10%2F10%2Frip-andre-barbault%2F) who was more popular than the first who also had these followers. For the little anecdote: Hades died on October 1, 2019, the birthday of Barbault who himself died 8 days later on October 8, 2019. The first (Hades) was completely ignored, no homage from elite astrologers who preferred to play the big game after the departure of Barbault with a special conference on Paris to pay a last tribute to Barbault. I think this resentment between these two astrologers Hades and André Barbault will not have left either of them and until their death
And it was this mutual grudge that fueled years of competition between these two men. Why was André Barbault considered a great astrologer ?, Because he had Uranus in conjunction with the Ascendant, the favorite symbol of astrologers ? One was Scorpio / Hades and the other Libra Barbault, each born under a conjunction of Mars and Venus respectively in an aspect of reciprocal tension.
We can say in the success of Barbault hid the shadow of Hades ...

https://lunesoleil23.files.wordpress.com/2019/10/andrc3a9-barbault-1.jpg

In the video André Barbault talks about Jean Carteret (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Flunesoleil23.wordpress.com%2F2020%2F07%2F18%2Fjean-carteret-et-les-quatre-luminaires%2F), he studied the four luminaries, the Sun and the Black Sun, the Moon and the Black Moon.
Do you know Alan Léo ? (https://ux4n4lnpgkccutylqasxqx4yba--lunesoleil23-wordpress-com.translate.goog/2020/10/21/lastrologue-alan-leo-1/) , an astrologer from the beginning of the 20th century.

[LouisZbunjuel]

I consider astrology a genuine branch of knowledge. Especially jyotish since I am into yoga. A jyotishi predicted some major happenings in my life which at the time seemed very unlikely to me, but today are reality. I had an opportunity to learn jyotish for free many years ago and I sadly declined, preferring to focus all my energy and time on the university studies. Today I would choose differently. I often wonder upon the differences between the Indian and Western astrology and hope to find some clues in the writings of Aurobindo. I also would like to know about the measure in which the planets spell fate. I remember reading in The Autobiography of a Yogi that the more advanced a being is, the weaker is the hold of the planets over him or her, which intuitively rings true. Anyhow, these are just some musings on a very interesting topic...

[Lunesoleil]

I often wonder upon the differences between the Indian and Western astrology and hope to find some clues in the writings of Aurobindo
Thank you for your testimony, I have often heard about Aurobindo who with his partner Mirra (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Flunesoleil23.wordpress.com%2F2017%2F05%2F16%2Fmirra-la-mere-de-pondichery%2F) created Auroville (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Flunesoleil23.wordpress.com%2F2017%2F05%2F19%2F50eme-anniversaire-auroville-en-2018%2F&sandbox=1) which celebrated its 50th anniversary in 2018, I had published an article for the event.
I know a little about Indian astrology, I have a few books and I am interested in the 27 nakshatras (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Flunesoleil23.wordpress.com%2F2012%2F05%2F05%2Fzodiaque-lunaire-et-les-27-nakshatras%2F) or lunar mansions. Indian astrologers have a strongly spiritual approach, much more than Western astrologers ...

[ulli]

https://lunesoleil23.files.wordpress.com/2020/12/hades.jpg


Here is a Brilliant French astrology: André Barbault in Conversation with Lynn Bell
First of all, thank you Yuhui, for your intervention in this discussion dedicated to astrology.
Thank you for the long video with André Barbault and Lynn Bell, I only know the short version, I would listen with pleasure to this exchange between these two great astrologers.
What you should know, there was a great hostility between the astrologer Hades (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Flunesoleil23.wordpress.com%2F2019%2F10%2F15%2Flastrologue-hades%2F)who wrote many books on astrology and André Barbault (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Flunesoleil23.wordpress.com%2F2019%2F10%2F10%2Frip-andre-barbault%2F) who was more popular than the first who also had these followers. For the little anecdote: Hades died on October 1, 2019, the birthday of Barbault who himself died 8 days later on October 8, 2019. The first (Hades) was completely ignored, no homage from elite astrologers who preferred to play the big game after the departure of Barbault with a special conference on Paris to pay a last tribute to Barbault. I think this resentment between these two astrologers Hades and André Barbault will not have left either of them and until their death
And it was this mutual grudge that fueled years of competition between these two men. Why was André Barbault considered a great astrologer ?, Because he had Uranus in conjunction with the Ascendant, the favorite symbol of astrologers ? One was Scorpio / Hades and the other Libra Barbault, each born under a conjunction of Mars and Venus respectively in an aspect of reciprocal tension.
We can say in the success of Barbault hid the shadow of Hades ...

https://lunesoleil23.files.wordpress.com/2019/10/andrc3a9-barbault-1.jpg

In the video André Barbault talks about Jean Carteret (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Flunesoleil23.wordpress.com%2F2020%2F07%2F18%2Fjean-carteret-et-les-quatre-luminaires%2F), he studied the four luminaries, the Sun and the Black Sun, the Moon and the Black Moon.
Do you know Alan Léo ? (https://ux4n4lnpgkccutylqasxqx4yba--lunesoleil23-wordpress-com.translate.goog/2020/10/21/lastrologue-alan-leo-1/) , an astrologer from the beginning of the 20th century.

When two people have a lifelong connection like those two astrologers you mentioned, (Hades and Barbault) then the dynamic between their charts gets my attention.
The Uranus/ AC conjunction of Barbault not only shows the astrological talent, but would have also given him a strong desire for fame. Ascendant in Aquarius even more so.
And the need to push against someone else. Proving that competition is a healthy source of energy.
And added to that his Libran need for recognition...to be noticed. The vanity factor.

Hades, the Scorpio, probably had some Libra vanity as well, due to a full 7th house, a his Taurus AV ruled by Venus, but he prefers to be hidden, like its ruling planet Pluto- way out there in the darkness, far from the sun.
In real life, not having attended high school, was also a contributing factor, to show that one can excel without formal tuition.

Hades (LOL, what a name!!) as you said, was his shadow.

[Lunesoleil]

Hades (LOL, what a name!!) as you said, was his shadow.

Hades was a speudonym, his real name Alain Yaouanc (https://nhujzchxszmfjwodqweptl7jha-adwhj77lcyoafdy-fr-m-wikipedia-org.translate.goog/wiki/Alain_Yaouanc) with whom he was known this time as the author of some thirty books on spy novels. The astrologers only knew Hades the astrologer who would have published forty books on astrology. These books have been reissued twice with a new conversion each time. In these books Hades gave many examples of maps to draw attention to aspects related to the nature of the book.

He was an astrologer who had depth and a spiritual approach through extracts in the form of notes from the great masters of India. These were not astrology books to put in everyone's hands, as its interpretation had a realistic meaning and could shock sensitive souls. We can say that there was a certain contrast in these writings. I have some Hades books in my library ...

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTOJe5qmZrQKwXLk211AalSdHnBUFOz313P1p-uw7YC_g&s

[ulli]

Hades (LOL, what a name!!) as you said, was his shadow.

Hades was a speudonym, his real name Alain Yaouanc (https://nhujzchxszmfjwodqweptl7jha-adwhj77lcyoafdy-fr-m-wikipedia-org.translate.goog/wiki/Alain_Yaouanc) with whom he was known this time as the author of some thirty books on spy novels. The astrologers only knew Hades the astrologer who would have published forty books on astrology. These books have been reissued twice with a new conversion each time. In these books Hades gave many examples of maps to draw attention to aspects related to the nature of the book.

He was an astrologer who had depth and a spiritual approach through extracts in the form of notes from the great masters of India. These were not astrology books to put in everyone's hands, as its interpretation had a realistic meaning and could shock sensitive souls. We can say that there was a certain contrast in these writings. I have some Hades books in my library ...

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTOJe5qmZrQKwXLk211AalSdHnBUFOz313P1p-uw7YC_g&s

Yes, and a perfect one for a Scorpio astrologer.

As Hades was the name of the Greek god of the underworld, which later on in Roman mythology became known as Pluto, and of course Pluto rules the sign of Scorpio.
This sign gives an obsessive desire to penetrate into the beyond.

From our position here on this nether planet there are two directions to choose from, i.e. the lower worlds beyond, where application of the principle of penetration seeks only self gratification, (example burglary)

and the higher worlds where penetration is applied only after receiving permission, (example eye surgeon).

In the case of Hades, the astrologer, it is no wonder that his popularity lagged behind that of André Barbault, if his books were shocking to sensitive souls. After all, most people who show an interest in astrology, are sensitive, and while a Libra approach is diplomatic, the Scorpio way of doing things is often without anesthesia.

[yuhui]

Do you know Alan Léo ? (https://ux4n4lnpgkccutylqasxqx4yba--lunesoleil23-wordpress-com.translate.goog/2020/10/21/lastrologue-alan-leo-1/) , an astrologer from the beginning of the 20th century.

No, but thank you for this fascinating story. I shall dig in when I have time.
Astrology folks' natal charts tend to have highlights in their 8th/12th house and with planet pluto. I definitely agree with you that they are linked with the power to "penetrate into the beyond."
In ancient china, the school of esotericism is actually called "study of black" （玄学）for it's hidden.
Of course modern astrology has been used to tell the "fate", but in the ancient time, it is the knowledge to communicate with the unknown power. Picatrix is a book I would recommend.

[Lunesoleil]

https://i1.wp.com/64.media.tumblr.com/63b354664dcbda19c0ae1d8b06f055ec/0c3b95df91422f1c-0a/s400x600/3de596a62dab8b42f1b8c9985ec5edbc8ce3a589.gifv?ssl=1


but in the ancient time, it is the knowledge to communicate with the unknown power. Picatrix is a book I would recommend.
Thank you for discovering Picatrix that I did not know. I found some excerpts that I share in English translation.


EXTRACTS FROM THE PICATRIX: BOOK III, CHAPTER IV # 1 (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fmadamemagique.wordpress.com%2F2019%2F11%2F30%2Ftraduction-extraits-du-picatrix-livre-iii-chapitre-iv-1%2F&sandbox=1)


EXTRACTS FROM THE PICATRIX: BOOK III, CHAPTER IV # 2 (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fmadamemagique.wordpress.com%2F2019%2F12%2F10%2Ftraduction-extraits-du-picatrix-livre-iii-chapitre-iv-2%2F)


EXTRACTS FROM THE PICATRIX: BOOK III, CHAPTER IV # 3 (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fmadamemagique.wordpress.com%2F2019%2F12%2F28%2Ftraduction-extraits-du-picatrix-livre-iii-chapitre-iv-3%2F)


EXTRACTS FROM THE PICATRIX: BOOK III, CHAPTER IV # 4 (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fmadamemagique.wordpress.com%2F2020%2F01%2F20%2Ftraduction-extraits-du-picatrix-livre-iii-chapitre-iv-4%2F)


EXTRACTS FROM THE PICATRIX: BOOK XXXIII, CHAPTER X (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fmadamemagique.wordpress.com%2F2019%2F11%2F02%2Ftraduction-extraits-du-picatrix-livre-xxxiii-chapitre-x%2F)


EXTRACTS FROM THE PICATRIX: BOOK XXXIII, CHAPTER XI (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fmadamemagique.wordpress.com%2F2021%2F01%2F02%2Ftraduction-extraits-du-picatrix-livre-xxxiii-chapitre-xi-1%2F)

MZXAulegXpcVersion 2 HERE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ydNdmjmBBtg)

vkTjOonTMpM
Other version HERE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khc0nX1XcU4)

iTtxeEUAQhg
for the beauty of the images

e-book (https://books.google.fr/books?id=DRAyAwAAQBAJ&printsec=frontcover&source=gbs_ge_summary_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q&f=false) (1)
e-book (https://books.google.fr/books?id=kLekDwAAQBAJ&printsec=frontcover&source=gbs_ge_summary_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q&f=false)(2)

[Lunesoleil]

I started with Linda Goodman's books, then Liz Greene's, before even learning how to set up charts.
I trust that the web is the greatest tool there is, just write astrology for beginners, and then let your intuition guide you to the websites that were designed just for you.. then start reading.
Compare what you learn there to the facts, and trust the process, it gets easier the more time you spend investigating.
...your family members are the people you know best..


I read Linda Goodman's book Astral Affinities a long time ago, I loved it. I also have the book Jupiter and Saturn Outer Planets, Collective Cycles, and the Inner Planets by Liz Greene. I really liked Stephen Arroyo, Astrology Karma and Transformation. Bill Tierney Dynamics of Astrological Aspects, another excellent book. I read many articles on the Astrodient site of Liz Greene an essential astrologer ...


Liz Greene (https://www.astro.com/astrology/in_greene_e.htm)

[Journeyman]

I notice that there are hardly any astrologers on the Avalon forum, or are they all gone?
I have many years of experience, a touch of everything, an astrology handyman, who pushes the doors, to discover, learn and meditate on new paths to explore.
I am at the same time a contemplative, a researcher, a critic of the practice of astrology, because the worst of everything in astrology is I think to prevent myself from doing something because of a terrible transit of owl thing .
Go beyond our limits and at the same time we have to deal with our achievements. Because we cannot become what we are not inside ourselves, through our education, our school background, our experience in the field of life. We learn above all from our mistakes, which make us grow in awareness and sometimes in maturity. Because we are not all equal in the face of the Eternal, we are the extension of our parents, of our roots, of our culture in the country where we were born.


It is an invitation to share your feelings in astrology and the place that astrology has in your life, whether near or far. I would like to know the place you give to this ancient art which is both appreciated by these defenders and hated by these detractors.
Within the tolerance of divided opinions, thank you for your participation.


Tell me everything, I want to know everything even in the darkest recesses of your minds or the brightest parts
Many thanks to everyone and may the light shine on all the truths of each of the members of Avalon.



Astrology in the UK was long represented, on a national /Television level, by people who seemed to be either obvious charlatans, or at best, entertainers. We had 'celebrity' astrologers who wrote newspaper columns or made tv show appearances and they really just seemed to be cold reading people and pretending to have an insight. So for a long time I thought there was very little to it. I did however always resonate with the description of my birth sign.

I've thought a lot more about it since then though. Firstly, the facts that I was previously aware of but paid little heed to, that monarchs had always paid attention to it, that court astrologers were respected and listened to etc. Those I started to reconsider. Then there's evidence that astrology is very much in the minds of those that are controlling events. If they pay attention to numerology or astrology then it makes sense to pay attention to why that may be?

So I'm now finding myself in middle age having to adjust my perspective and try and come at things like Astrology with an open mind and a fresh perspective!

[Lunesoleil]

Then there is evidence that astrology is very much on the minds of those in control of events. If they pay attention to numerology or astrology, it makes sense to pay attention to why this can be?

In ancient times, every King had their astrologer and astrology at that time had nothing to do with today's practice. Eclipses were seen much more as times of calamities. The King's birth sky described his kingdom and his power over his people.

The conjunction of the Sun with Jupiter was a good clue to achieving victory, and the conjunction of the Sun and Saturn was rather a clue of prudence. Jupiter / Zeus son of his father Saturn / Chronos who was saved by his mother Rhea and Jupiter dethroned Saturn, to take his place.

The why the conjunction of Jupiter and Saturn is very revealing of the fall of a power before the new birth at the time of the Winter Solstice 0 ° Aquarius in Tropical, will only be a half victory, it will be necessary to wait I think 2040 and still 17 ° Aquarius and a precession of the equinoxes of 25 °, the era of Aquarius will be long overdue ...

Thank you for the feedback, what Solar sign are you from ?, and the Lunar sign HERE (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?113196-Do-you-know-the-position-of-your-moon-at-the-time-of-your-birth)

[Catsquotl]

He also tried valiantly — but in my view unconvincingly — to theorize what the mechanism might be. I've studied a lot of math and physics (and wanted to be an astrophysicist when I was a kid!), and I absolutely can't see a mechanism. Just none at all, anywhere in sight. It all seems totally impossible.

There are many questions that most astrologers seem not to consider. One of the most interesting might be: would astrology work in other solar systems, for other intelligent species, whose views of the stars and planets close to them would be very different?




The way I have come to understand it is that there is no magic ingredient.
It isn't the stars that make some event happen..


As the universe and life appears cyclical, We can measure the cycles.
As the stars move about in a cyclical manner they can be used to remember what happened the last time the stars lined up in a similar fashion and make predictions of possible cyclical tendencies that may come up.


On my have yet to read list is a book called cosmos and psyche by Richard Tarnas which (As I am told) dives deeper into the cyclical nature and supposed to dive into the history of some of the outer planet cycles to describe worldly events that took place..


With Love
Eelco

[Catsquotl]

Picatrix is a book I would recommend.


Have you tried to make one of the talismans or sigils?
I got the book over a year ago, but am not too sure about the current astrological weather to have a pattern captured yet.


With Love
Eelco

[Lunesoleil]

On my list to read is a book titled Cosmos and Psyche by Richard Tarnas which (as I'm told) delves deeper into cyclical nature and is meant to delve into the history of some of the outer planet's cycles to describe the world events that have taken place
I mainly know astrology books in French and I have a particular interest in planetary cycles.
Starting with the cycle of the Moon, see the four words of my quote:

🌚 initiation = New moon
🌛 decision = first quarter
🌝 evaluation = full moon
🌜 reorganization = last quarter.

These four phases are found in all the planetary cycles, the smallest is that of the Sun and the Moon which gives rhythm to the tides and our biological cycles. The largest planetary cycle that of Neptune and Pluto of almost 500 years, this cycle began in the first decan of Gemini, 100 years ago and we are currently in the phase of the 60 ° aspect sextile and which gave birth to a new form of spirituality separating from religion. We have been in this influence for more than 50 years ... There is the Uranus / Pluto cycle started in 1965 in Virgo, we lived the phase of the first quarter between 2012 and 2015 with a series of 7 repeating squares which is related to these new technologies and these uses for good and for wrong ... The cycle of Saturn and Uranus of 45 years, we are living its last quarter, the next cycle in 10 years ect between the achievements of the past and progress through the evolution of consciousness and technologies ... Jupiter and Saturn 20 year cycle and the ebb and flow of the world economy ... Jupiter and Neptune 13 year cycle, the social dream of humanity ...

[Catsquotl]

I have not seen the cycles explained like this before, but then I am still stuck in the beginner section of astrology.
You may like the archetypal explorer website. Seen some pretty impressive cyclical charts from them on the astrology podcast.
The site itself requires some payment, which I'm not (yet) ready to spend there..


I knew about the jupiter/saturn 20 year cycle which also just changed elements for the next 200 years right?


So to look at how this great conjunction plays out we need to look back 800 years.
So what happened in the 1200's?


The start of the end of the middle ages?
If I'm right march 5th 1226? Jupiter and saturn were conjunct at 2'58'' Aquarius.


Been looking at the history of 1226 through 1230.
Spanish inqiusition.
war on muslims.


Tristan and Isolde was written down(1226).

Carmina Burana was composed/put together(1230) .seems to be the only positives I could find at a glance..
sigh....


With Love
Eelco

[Catsquotl]

There are many questions that most astrologers seem not to consider. One of the most interesting might be: would astrology work in other solar systems, for other intelligent species, whose views of the stars and planets close to them would be very different?



Yes it would, given that the rules of manifestation and cyclical time are somewhat similar to hours.
Beyond that I would propose that it works however we want it to.


The best analogy for that is from studying chines medicine.
In TCM the choice of diagnosis. either zang fu (organ theory) or the 5 elements (wu xing) theory give profoundly different ways of viewing an illness, also the needling in acupuncture is very different.
Still both way work depending on the choice of the practitioner.


This dials back to the mind being the creator of all things. the mind figures out how something works and locks that working into a manifest reality.
So another sentient species in a vastly different constellation may someday see a pattern in the sky when confronted with an event.
The next time a similar constellation occurs he/she/it expects a similar event.. and what do you know the universe complies with it's expectation..


With Love
Eelco

[Lunesoleil]

Have you tried to make one of the talismans (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talisman) or sigils (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sigil)?
I got the book over a year ago, but am not too sure about the current astrological weather to have a pattern captured yet.


To answer your question, I don't practice this kind of ritual, but I recently shared a series of such articles on my blog. I put the links to the original articles, you will find there the magic squares of the 7 planets of traditional astrology, talismans or even Seals (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seal_(emblem))


[CORRESPONDENCES]SUN (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=%20https%3A%2F%2Fmadamemagique.wordpress.com%2F2019%2F09%2F14%2Fcorrespondances-le-soleil%2F&sandbox=1)


[CORRESPONDENCES] MOON (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=%20https%3A%2F%2Fmadamemagique.wordpress.com%2F2019%2F09%2F08%2Fcorrespondances-la-lune%2F)


[CORRESPONDENCES] MARCH (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=%20https%3A%2F%2Fmadamemagique.wordpress.com%2F2019%2F10%2F14%2Fcorrespondances-mars%2F)


[CORRESPONDENCES] MERCURY (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=%20https%3A%2F%2Fmadamemagique.wordpress.com%2F2019%2F10%2F14%2Fcorrespondances-mercure%2F)


[CORRESPONDENCES] JUPITER (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fmadamemagique.wordpress.com%2F2019%2F10%2F18%2Fcorrespondances-jupiter%2F)


[CORRESPONDENCES] VENUS (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=%20https%3A%2F%2Fmadamemagique.wordpress.com%2F2019%2F10%2F17%2Fcorrespondances-venus%2F)


[CORRESPONDENCES ] SATURNE (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=%20https%3A%2F%2Fmadamemagique.wordpress.com%2F2019%2F10%2F14%2Fcorrespondances-saturne%2F)



I do a reminder for those who do not know.

Monday moon day
Tuesday March day
Wednesday, Mercury day
Thursday Jupiter Day
Friday Venus day
Saturday Saturn Day
Sunday Sunshine Day

good discovery and excellent reading in the world of symbolism :happythumbsup:

[Lunesoleil]

The best analogy for that is from studying chines medicine.
In TCM the choice of diagnosis. either zang fu (organ theory) or the 5 elements (wu xing) theory give profoundly different ways of viewing an illness, also the needling in acupuncture is very different.
Still both way work depending on the choice of the practitioner.

I saw that you practice Shiatsu, do you know Maguerite de Surany, author of many books on Chinese thought.

Some of the author's books:
Astrology guide yesterday, today, tomorrow

Your destiny and the lunar nodes

New guide to astrology without calculus

Modern graphology guide

Taoist Medicine Dictionary

Le Corps d'Arc-en-Ciel: Chinese medicine, medical astrology

Soul medicine

45808
Photo taken from his book Body Language that I had found in a second-hand bookstore, do not know if these books have been translated into English.
I just found with a search his date of birth, I will do an article soon.
In his book, the author refers to the 12 signs of the zodiac and 23 relative hexagrams with targeted body parts and the 7 planets

[Lunesoleil]

I knew about the jupiter/saturn 20 year cycle which also just changed elements for the next 200 years right?

The start of the end of the middle ages?
If I'm right march 5th 1226? Jupiter and saturn were conjunct at 2'58'' Aquarius.

I know the 200 year cycle of Jupiter and Saturn, but I have never done any research.
I think I'll do it, these conjunctions are found in the Earth signs: Taurus, Virgo and Capricorn, except with the cycle in the early 80s, the conjunction of Jupiter and Saturn at 9° Libra which is a sign of air and which marks this anomaly.
About the cycle of Jupiter and Saturn, it is to forget Pluto nearby and this cycle is 400 years; you will find my article HERE (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?112689-Conjunction-Jupiter-Pluto-and-Saturn)



So to look at how this great conjunction plays out we need to look back 800 years.
So what happened in the 1200's?
I do not understand your reasoning of the 800 years, if the cycle is 200 years, especially since it is actually on a cycle of 400 years if we include the conjunction of Pluto + Jupiter + Saturn

:sherlock:

[Catsquotl]

I do not understand your reasoning of the 800 years, if the cycle is 200 years, especially since it is actually on a cycle of 400 years if we include the conjunction of Pluto + Jupiter + Saturn

:sherlock:

The 800 years signifies the elemental cycle. For the next 200 years Jupiter and Saturn will have their conjunctions in air signs. 800 years ago was the previous 200 year cycle jupiter and saturn had their 200 year cycle in air signs.
with Love
Eelco

[Lunesoleil]

The 800 years signifies the elemental cycle. For the next 200 years Jupiter and Saturn will have their conjunctions in air signs. 800 years ago was the previous 200 year cycle jupiter and saturn had their 200 year cycle in air signs.

I will have to do a research of all these cycles of Jupiter and Saturn, especially since I was born at the time of this cycle of Jupiter and Saturn, it is my dominant. The basic generic cycle is 20 years. Many articles have cited the 800 year cycle which is an astronomical event, not an astrological event. Jupiter and Saturn were closest at the time of the Winter Solstice, this astronomical influence had occurred 800 years ago. When I have done this astrological research I will start a new discussion. In the meantime, here is an interesting article that I just found HERE (https://olympia-astrologie.com/2020/12/19/jupiter-saturne-de-2000-a-2020-violence-et-conspirationnisme/)

the ephemeris working tool of astrologers HERE (https://www.astro.com/swisseph/swepha_f.htm?&lang=e)

[Catsquotl]

What do you think the 200 year cycle of Jupiter and Saturn means? I don't understand what you mean by the difference between astronomical vs astrological.

In my understanding the 200 year cycle is measured/interpreted by the fact they during that cycle Jupiter and Saturn have their conjunctions in signs of the same element.

That's why I look 800 years back for clues. Same element ruling the 200 conjunction cycle.

With Love
Eelco

[Lunesoleil]

What do you think the 200 year cycle of Jupiter and Saturn means? I don't understand what you mean by the difference between astronomical vs astrological.
The astronomical event of the proximity of Jupiter and Saturn in addition to its astrological conjunction, are two events, one which recurs every 20 years and the other an astronomical phenomenon which took place the last time, there is 800 years.

This 200-year cycle is the journeys of conjunctions in signs of the same elements with one exception.

200 years as an earth sign between 1802 and 2020 200 years as a sign of fire?
200 years as a sign of water?

From 2021, we start the series as an air sign ... I started my research, it will take a few days before I publish my article ...

Enabled the English translation of the article I shared, look at the bottom left, in my previous comment.

[Lunesoleil]

The 800 years signifies the elemental cycle. For the next 200 years Jupiter and Saturn will have their conjunctions in air signs. 800 years ago was the previous 200 year cycle jupiter and saturn had their 200 year cycle in air signs.

I will have to do a research of all these cycles of Jupiter and Saturn, especially since I was born at the time of this cycle of Jupiter and Saturn, it is my dominant. The basic generic cycle is 20 years. Many articles have cited the 800 year cycle which is an astronomical event, not an astrological event. Jupiter and Saturn were closest at the time of the Winter Solstice, this astronomical influence had occurred 800 years ago. When I have done this astrological research I will start a new discussion. In the meantime, here is an interesting article that I just found HERE (https://olympia-astrologie.com/2020/12/19/jupiter-saturne-de-2000-a-2020-violence-et-conspirationnisme/)

the ephemeris working tool of astrologers HERE (https://www.astro.com/swisseph/swepha_f.htm?&lang=e)

https://lunesoleil23.files.wordpress.com/2021/01/conjonctions-jupiter-et-saturne.-2021-1.jpg

and here is the result after the research work.
I will soon write an article on my blog :Avalon:

[Catsquotl]

Below are 2 more articles i found very enlightning, if you are still investigating.
I'm a sucker for the medieval and Hellenistic stuff



great-conjunction-tropical-aquarius-sidereal-capricorn (https://classicalastrologer.me/2020/12/21/great-conjunction-tropical-aquarius-sidereal-capricorn/)

mean_conjunctions (http://www.skyscript.co.uk/mean_conjunctions.html)


With Love
Eelco

[Lunesoleil]

mean_conjunctions (http://www.skyscript.co.uk/mean_conjunctions.html)


https://classicalastrologer.files.wordpress.com/2020/12/keplers_trigon.jpg
The progression of the Firey Trigons which commenced 8 Dec 1603 as illustrated by Johannes Kepler.

we find the same logic in the table that I shared



great-conjunction-tropical-aquarius-sidereal-capricorn (https://classicalastrologer.me/2020/12/21/great-conjunction-tropical-aquarius-sidereal-capricorn/)


thank you for the blog, I subscribed :Avalon:

[gord]

I've puttered around off and on with learning something about astrology since 1988, though I haven't done anything with it in about 6 or 7 years. I sort of understand some of it well enough to see that these three bits of my natal chart are interesting.

Venus: 19d19m4s Scorpio
Ascendant: 16d15m20s Scorpio
Neptune: 11d55m18s Scorpio

Pluto: 10d48m3s Virgo
Uranus: 3d7m19s Virgo
Midheaven: 28d26m14s leo

Saturn: r4d19m48s Aquarius
South Node: r7d2m27s Aquarius

Really, I'm more interested in Richard Tarnas' type stuff, and it's only an occasional hobby.

[Lunesoleil]

Really, I'm more interested in Richard Tarnas' type stuff, and it's only an occasional hobby.
https://www.astrotheme.fr/carte/ZF4jZmcmqGMVZwWyHKW5pGpjZQNjZGNjZQNj.png

thanks for the discovery Richard Tarnas is a historian and professor of philosophy at the California Institute of Integral Studies in San Francisco. He was born on February 21, 1950 in Geneva.
The Moon of the day, arrives on its Sun in Pisces, you are very intuitive by nature with the supervision of Venus and Neptune on your Scorpio Ascendant, a mystical and artistic side, ...

PBcfesgsYow
although he was born in Switzerland, I found no video in French translation ...

[Lunesoleil]

m13LDIuyalI



Personally I prefer this opposition of fiery Mars and icy Saturn this way, Mars being in Virgo, and Saturn in Pisces, than if it were reversed, with Saturn in Virgo and Mars in Pisces.
The clashes with authority, in my view, are overdue in most European countries, and certainly in all countries controlled by the WEF.

Not so easy, however, for those people whose natal charts are negatively aspected by this opposition.

Hello Ulli
I answer you here
And what about the Parallel of declination between Venus, Mars and Saturn for the whole month of July?
my article is in French but with a translator so I can read the English version?

https://lunesoleil23.wordpress.com/2023/07/06/parallele-de-declinaison-entre-venus-mars-et-saturne/

[ian33]

good to see this explained for all
especially good to be on the same page regards labeling, with parallels, all astrologers

[Antagenet]

After studying astrology for 40 years, I have concluded that it's just a form of demonic magic, which is even worse than being just BS.

[ulli]

m13LDIuyalI



Personally I prefer this opposition of fiery Mars and icy Saturn this way, Mars being in Virgo, and Saturn in Pisces, than if it were reversed, with Saturn in Virgo and Mars in Pisces.
The clashes with authority, in my view, are overdue in most European countries, and certainly in all countries controlled by the WEF.

Not so easy, however, for those people whose natal charts are negatively aspected by this opposition.

Hello Ulli
I answer you here
And what about the Parallel of declination between Venus, Mars and Saturn for the whole month of July?
my article is in French but with a translator so I can read the English version?

https://lunesoleil23.wordpress.com/2023/07/06/parallele-de-declinaison-entre-venus-mars-et-saturne/

Any interaction between Mars and Venus has to do with gender issues, in my view. With conjunctions they become blurred or confused, with squares and oppositions there are projections of the other gender being disharmonious to the self, and with trines and sextiles there is a healthy attitude towards people of the opposite gender.

I suppose parallel declinations (which I have not studied in decades) act like a conjunction? I’m not sure. Anyway, Saturn in the mixture might be about rewriting all the gender rules.

Like I said, I’m not sue, and frankly, I’m too old to care.

When someone asks me to have a look at their planets I might look at their transits, and if I have extra time I might also have a glance at their progressions.

I no longer practice astrology, like I did thirty or forty years ago, when I only had knowledge from books.

I just tell people to try to calm down and respond to the challenges of life in the best way they can.

[ulli]

After studying astrology for 40 years, I have concluded that it's just a form of demonic magic, which is even worse than being just BS.

Very true, there is no doubt that sorcerers amongst the deep state use it to get power over others. However, if everyone learnt the basics in order to study their own charts, with the motive of discovering their personal shadowy side, and gaining self knowledge, it can do a lot of good.

Also, knowledge of medical astrology helps with diagnosis of illnesses.

[Lunesoleil]

After studying astrology for 40 years, I have concluded that it's just a form of demonic magic, which is even worse than being just BS.

It's not an astrologer who writes?, you can't call yourself an astrologer and have that kind of thinking and believe me, I've known all kinds of astrologers and rare, because I can't say that it doesn't exist had such a speech.

[Lunesoleil]

Very true, there is no doubt that sorcerers amongst the deep state use it to get power over others. However, if everyone learnt the basics in order to study their own charts, with the motive of discovering their personal shadowy side, and gaining self knowledge, it can do a lot of good.

Also, knowledge of medical astrology helps with diagnosis of illnesses.

Without a doubt, astrology is in the hands of politicians, so why at the time of the meeting of Jupiter, Saturn and Pluto in Capricorn 400 year cycle the control with the covid has taken world power over the population on the planet. The fear of losing control for the next 400 years???, that's the question we could ask ourselves.
Thank you Ulli for this feedback :heart2:

[Antagenet]

sorry, I did over 1000 charts, and found no truth in any of it, either for study of self or medical info.

[Lunesoleil]

sorry, I did over 1000 charts, and found no truth in any of it, either for study of self or medical info.

Everything will depend on what you are looking for in your astrological practice.
Ask professional astrologers what they think of astrology. There will always be two speeches, those who have looked for clues outside the changes or the means to earn a lot of money on lonely people?, as for the seers and those who have looked inside themselves and found a great tool.
There are the curious, the mockers, who want to prove that astrology is a banality, a belief like many other things that are denounced on this avalon forum...
Everything you believe is a form of belief, that's what astrology teaches you and if you don't even understand that, you don't know anything about astrology 👌

[Gwin Ru]

[...]... why the moment of birth is considered more important than the moment of conception (or the moment of 'walk-in', if the spirit entered the body after birth, which can sometimes happen).
[...] ...

... lately, I think that it's the "Electric Universe" that could explain how astrology could work in terms of an energetic point of view and a birth chart gives a snapshot of the energies interference pattern at that moment, much like a hologram is recorded and a piece of the hologram recreates the whole 3D picture. Excepted, in this case, it’s a snapshot of the whole universe; all energies included.

That snapshot is why the birth moment is the one that's retained because it imprints that interference pattern into the biological and energy body within an emotionally and physically traumatic incident... you know, the big transition from being warm, comfy and compressed down a tunnel; to cold and inundated with bright, blinding light and being slapped to trigger the catching of one's breath. People familiar with regressions - hypnotic or otherwise - could tell you that everything that happened at that moment has been recorded in that newborn body's unconscious down to the minute details including what was said as well as WHAT WAS THOUGHT by the perpetrators in the room and outside the room... kinda like an OBE in reverse. Of course, most regressionists never think outside the room/box to ask what were Saturn or Mercury doing/thinking at the time ... :) In any case, that's the unconscious' driving blueprint snapshot of the universe for its life time.

So, energetic interference patterns within an Electric Universe… well, nowadays it’s getting real tricky and makes me think of astrologers as being in the WW II resistance attempting to listen to their short wave receivers (ever tried to pinpoint a station on shortwave?) for news… while the axis is actively and heavily interfering with the broadcast frequencies to prevent the potential audience from receiving the message… never mind the weather throwing in electrostatics or the occasional sparkplugs statics from motor vehicles passing by…

…. Because, nowadays, according to my speculations, a birth chart should include the positions of the 4 and 5G towers… communication satellites, the UAPs zipping by manipulating the cosmic frequency fluxes to get us to bash each other on the head, etc… one current analogy would be the Rockefellers’ modification of the music baseline resonant harmonic from 432Hz to 440 Hz.

Any need to mention the consideration that the current Moon is kinda artificial? How does that fit in the astrology of old? Me think the books need to be re-written from scratch…

[ulli]

[...]... why the moment of birth is considered more important than the moment of conception (or the moment of 'walk-in', if the spirit entered the body after birth, which can sometimes happen).
[...] ...

... lately, I think that it's the "Electric Universe" that could explain how astrology could work in terms of an energetic point of view and a birth chart gives a snapshot of the interference pattern at that moment.

That snapshot is why the birth moment is the one that's retained because it imprints that interference pattern into the biological and energy body within an emotionally and physically traumatic incident... you know, the big transition from being warm, comfy and compressed down a tunnel; to cold and inundated with bright, blinding light and being slapped to trigger the catching of one's breath. People familiar with regressions - hypnotic or otherwise - could tell you that everything that happened at that moment has been recorded in that newborn body's unconscious down to the minute details including what was said as well as WHAT WAS THOUGHT by the perpetrators in the room and outside the room... kinda like an OBE in reverse. Of course, most regressionists never think outside the room/box to ask what were Saturn or Mercury doing/thinking at the time ... :) In any case, that's the unconscious' driving blueprint snapshot of the univers for its life time.

So, energetic interference patterns within an Electric Universe… well, nowadays it’s getting real tricky and makes me think of astrologers as being in the WW II resistance attempting to listen to their short wave receivers (ever tried to pinpoint a station on shortwave?) for news… while the axis is actively and heavily interfering with the broadcast frequencies to prevent the potential audience from receiving the message… never mind the weather throwing in electrostatics or the occasional sparkplugs statics from motor vehicles passing by…

…. Because, nowadays, according to my speculations, a birth chart should include the positions of the 4 and 5G towers… communication satellites, the UAPs zipping by manipulating the cosmic frequency fluxes to get us to bash each other on the head, etc… one current analogy would be the Rockefellers’ modification of the music baseline resonant harmonic from 432Hz to 440 Hz.

Any need to mention the consideration that the current Moon is kinda artificial? How does that fit in the astrology of old? Me think the books need to be re-written from scratch…


The birth moment can also be seen as a huge and pleasant surprise.
Hospitals use heart monitors during the birth process to measure the baby’s stress levels.
Because the contractions cause stress, also the womb has become too confined, making life inside the womb more uncomfortable each week that passes.

So just before being born there is an experience like dying, and then, when arriving in the next world, the stress of the transition is over. Freedom of movement is restored.
Anyway, whether shock or surprise, (shock being a negative, and surprise being a positive experience) both are consciousness raisers, and high consciousness connects the person to the entire cosmos, and so the energies of that moment imprint themselves in the subconscious mind, and possibly also in every cell of the body.

So later on, when planets pass or make angles to those positions of the birth hour, events in one’s life are affected by the same energies, and whether favorable or unfavorable depends on the nature of the geometry involved. I call those moments “star gates” .

[Lunesoleil]

Any need to mention the consideration that the current Moon is kinda artificial? How does that fit in the astrology of old? Me think the books need to be re-written from scratch…

We can think that the Moon is the point A which allows to go to the point B?
About rewriting the astrology books, evolution itself is going that way. Because between what was written 100 years ago and what is written today, it is not at all the same state of mind.
I have two original early 20th century Alan Leo booklets, the discourse of astrologers today is much less esoteric and much more psychological.
And when we know the intellectual level of astrologers with a background in higher education, astrology has a great future with these new astrologers whose hero is Harry Potter...

:wizard:

[norman]

I notice that there are hardly any astrologers on the Avalon forum, or are they all gone?
I have many years of experience, a touch of everything, an astrology handyman, who pushes the doors, to discover, learn and meditate on new paths to explore.
I am at the same time a contemplative, a researcher, a critic of the practice of astrology, because the worst of everything in astrology is I think to prevent myself from doing something because of a terrible transit of owl thing .
Go beyond our limits and at the same time we have to deal with our achievements. Because we cannot become what we are not inside ourselves, through our education, our school background, our experience in the field of life. We learn above all from our mistakes, which make us grow in awareness and sometimes in maturity. Because we are not all equal in the face of the Eternal, we are the extension of our parents, of our roots, of our culture in the country where we were born.

What I wrote on the astrology forum :

The Moon in all these states (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?113008-The-Moon-in-all-these-states)


Solar Eclipse of December 14 (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?113295-Solar-Eclipse-of-December-14)


Do you know the position of your moon at the time of your birth? (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?113196-Do-you-know-the-position-of-your-moon-at-the-time-of-your-birth)


Astrology of the Age of Aquarius according to Edgar Cayce (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?113035-Astrology-of-the-Age-of-Aquarius-according-to-Edgar-Cayce)


Here are 72 Angels. Find yours! (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?113144-Here-are-72-Angels.-Find-yours-)


March strikes back with Trump (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?112808-March-strikes-back-with-Trump)


Falun Gong the spiritual art of energy (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?113042-Falun-Gong-the-spiritual-art-of-energy)


the 12 signs in music (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?112965-the-12-signs-in-music)


Retro phases of Mercury (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?112885-Return-of-Mercury-in-Scorpio)


Birthday Forum (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?112865-Birthday-Forum)


The four phases of the lunar month (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?52159-The-four-phases-of-the-lunar-month)


The United States: Sun in conjunction with Sirius (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?112701-The-United-States-Sun-in-conjunction-with-Sirius)


Conjunction: Jupiter, Pluto and Saturn (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?112689-Conjunction-Jupiter-Pluto-and-Saturn)


The Moon and Presidents in Astrology (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?112691-The-Moon-and-Presidents-in-Astrology)


Astrological updates from Lunesoleil (https://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?52177-Astrological-updates-from-Lunesoleil)


It is an invitation to share your feelings in astrology and the place that astrology has in your life, whether near or far. I would like to know the place you give to this ancient art which is both appreciated by these defenders and hated by these detractors.
Within the tolerance of divided opinions, thank you for your participation.


Tell me everything, I want to know everything even in the darkest recesses of your minds or the brightest parts
Many thanks to everyone and may the light shine on all the truths of each of the members of Avalon.

You did ask. I'll keep it short.

I regard Astrology in much the same way I regard Numerology. They are man-made phenomena. As such they have acquired considerable 'power' over the time people have woven in their magic.

Personally, I want nothing to do with man-made magic.

If the question was specifically about numerology I might repeat my rant about number bases etc but I don't see a hill I want to die on, regarding either of them.

[Lunesoleil]

You asked. I will be brief.

I view astrology the same way I view numerology. These are man-made phenomena. As such, they have gained considerable "power" over time as people have woven into their magic.

Personally, I want nothing to do with artificial magic.

If the question was specifically about numerology, I could repeat my rant about the basics of numbers etc., but I can't see a hill I want to die on, as far as either goes.
.

We agree but consider astrology as numerology
is that perhaps you have not gone far enough in the practice of astrology?, much criticism without really having practiced it?? I'm talking about my experience and if I hadn't evolved I think I could accept your criticism, but it's that I can have the same judgment, for the reason I don't have the same positioning. I know the detractors too well, even if I can understand them, it's too easy to criticize without knowing.

[gord]

I'll just say that anyone who knows me personally, and who is significantly familiar with astrology, would agree that I've been through a pretty nasty Saturn return (#2) not so long ago, which would have been exact at 4°49'47" ♒ in late January 2021.

[Lunesoleil]

In my opinion, there is something else, one cannot blame Saturn, unless Saturn at the time of birth is weak and receives very bad aspects.

:wizard:

[gord]

Didn't include blame in my comment.

[Lunesoleil]

Didn't include blame in my comment.

http://www.kosmogen.com/zxsatf.htm

Utilisez un traducteur sur Saturne