Absent fathers who won’t pay child support face losing their driving licences

[ktlight]

FYI:


Absent fathers who defy orders to pay towards their children’s care face immediate suspension of their driving licences and passports under new plans outlined today.

They would also face curfew orders and new powers to deduct money from their bank accounts.

But last night there were warnings it would be ‘madness’ to strip ‘runaway’ parents of their licences as it could cost them their jobs and their ability to contribute to their children’s upkeep.

Officials chasing ‘deadbeat dads’ already have a range of sanctions to force them to meet their obligations, including the power to go to court to strip someone of a passport or driving licence.

But the influential Commons’ Work and Pensions Committee today calls for officials to be able to remove the documents at a stroke, without legal action.

Extra powers to make it easier to deduct child maintenance payments from the absent parents’ bank accounts are also demanded.

The proposals come after David Cameron called for ‘runaway dads’ to be stigmatised like drink drivers.

Sources close to Work and Pensions Secretary Iain Duncan Smith said the proposals would ‘definitely’ be considered.

But Matthew Elliott, of the TaxPayers’ Alliance campaign group, said: ‘Taking away a driving licence could stop parents earning the money to help their children.’

Under existing reforms, all existing Child Support Agency functions are being taken over next year by the new Child Maintenance and Enforcement Commission.

But the committee fears the reforms may not go far enough.

source
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2010701/Absent-fathers-won-t-pay-child-support-face-losing-driving-licences.html

[Mike Gorman]

The state interfering in the core business of families, this is repugnant-how do we as citizens allow the state to encroach so far
into our lives like this. Sure there are a small percentage of parents of both sexes who renounce their responsibilities-but for the large
majority who have the misfortune to experience divorce and relationship breakdown, their lives are made a living torture by officialdom labeling them
as 'feckless' and harrying them for money-and so often the aggrieved partner uses the legislation as a form of revenge, not agreeing to private arrangements
for financial support-and the losers are the children who experience the estrangement of their Father, or mother (usually the Father) who is reduced to a
financial resource, a cash-bull-his fatherhood is trampled on and ignored because his part is defined by the state as being a provider of CASH only.
This is a huge issue, and so complex-it is yet another symptom of our great social sickness.

[Anchor]

The proposals come after David Cameron called for ‘runaway dads’ to be stigmatised like drink drivers.

Now that is a revealing line is it not?

Sure there are some real scoundrels, but others may not be. There are always two sides to these stories.

However, to be engaged in the mechanics of "stigmatizing" people is quite a telling expression of his ideals and the way these people do their work.

[Lord Sidious]

If you want to know the why, check this link.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_loco_parentis

[Flash]

In Quebec, the deadbeat parent cannot be unless he quit his job. There were so much not paying that the province edicted a law allowing it to get the money from the paycheck, at the employer, for all payng parents (mom or dads) and gives it to the custodian by law. The whole amount is calculated based on each parent revenues and ability to pay and it is the same calculations framework for everyone, based on revenues. So no more lenghty court case to get the money, no more arguments amongst parents to get or give the money, and now time to take care of the kids.

So deadbeat parents that are in fact deadbroke, not working or alike, are not penalised, there is no place to get the money. Some will quit their job though instead of paying. The one that may have an escape are small business owners if they can hide some money. Nobody loses his drivers license, it could hamper their working abilities and therefore their ability to pay.

Is it a good system? Yes and no. It is almost mandatory when the children are starving and the parent not paying does not care. Most parents that are custodians would tell you this is a real blessing, they finally get along with their ex for the children sake. Is it too much government in the family's affairs, of course - then how do you make adults to be reponsible for their children, instead of government agencies, which is what happens when the children are in dire needs.

[ktlight]

I know of a case where the father behaved to his wife in such a manner that she thought that if she did not leave the family home she would be dead. He took custody of the children by coaching them before the case went to the courts and, having established that then pursued the ex-wife through the CSA and committed her monthly salary to a rather large financial deduction. He pleaded poverty but owns two shops, which his then wife helped to build, under a different name so as to avoid paying the amount awarded to the ex-wife. He deprived the ex-wife of seeing her children and, to keep her head above water, she works two jobs.

I state this as an example of how it is not always clear cut that the partner who has the children is the right partner for them to be with, and the system is used against the ex-partner out of revenge and certainly not to help feed and clothe the children.

This father brags that his daughters wear only designer clothing.

[Arpheus]

The law is a lovely thing tho,my marriage ended when i found out me ex had an affair with a co-worker and didnt have the guts to be openly honest about it all with me,what did i get out of it?The state taking the child support straight out of my paycheck,i get cheated let her have custody of the child because i love my son and he is better off with his mother since she always made more money then me and on top of it all i still gotta give more money,ever since this bitter deal my finances have been affected in every level,because of this i barely take enough home to keep a roof over my head and pay my bills,my next step is going to be cut my internet bill so i can still purchase groceries?Aint it lovely LOL?

[Davidallany]

the deadbeat parent That's politicians and slave masters,you see it's alright with them that people work long hours, overtime and required to pay taxes on everything regardless of low wages, as long as they are given permission to make the rules, thus sacrificing everyone to save themselves. That's criminal. But instead they are given bonuses, long vacations, big credit cards and a membership in a big-boy club with some Cuban cigars and fancy whiskey.

h2pAyFR6Z3M&feature=related JJSCQq1woWw&feature=related

[Jake]

Fun topic. Here is what the State of Washington did to me. First of all,,, I pay child support on two beautiful girls, I always have. I have never missed a payment, and have gone above and beyond to make sure that they have medical coverage. I live like a worm, in order to take care of my responsibility for my children. With that said,,, keep in mind that I have never missed a payment, over 85 thousand dollars,,, SO FAR. the state of WA still did the following things to me.

1) Refused to renew my Drivers License.
2) Refused me a Business License.
3) Entered a legal lien against any and all assetts,, Home/Car,, etc...
4) Emptied my private bank accounts on two different occasions leaving them overdrawn and unrecoverable.
5) Report to the credit agencies that I am NOT paying. My credit is ruined.

I could go on and on and on and on. I HAVE NEVER MISSED A SINGLE PAYMENT. And I have been treated worse than any criminal that I have met.

It is a scam. The federal government is currently giving the State of Nazington 4 dollars for every 1 dollar that they collect for child support. Now,,, every effort is being made to demonize strong, hard working, dedicated fathers, in order to collect the 4/1 ratio MOOLA. They do not care about the children,,, they want the money!!!!

What is being done in Wa St is unconstitutional... I do not expect many people care, though.

The state Government in WA is currently taking 72% of my income,,,, and I have not committed a crime. How do you like them apples???

[Davidallany]

The state Government in WA is currently taking 72% of my income,,,, and I have not committed a crime. How do you like them apples???
I think it's very brave of you to still have the strength and courage to go on. May good news come your way soon.

[Arpheus]

Fun topic. Here is what the State of Washington did to me. First of all,,, I pay child support on two beautiful girls, I always have. I have never missed a payment, and have gone above and beyond to make sure that they have medical coverage. I live like a worm, in order to take care of my responsibility for my children. With that said,,, keep in mind that I have never missed a payment, over 85 thousand dollars,,, SO FAR. the state of WA still did the following things to me.

1) Refused to renew my Drivers License.
2) Refused me a Business License.
3) Entered a legal lien against any and all assetts,, Home/Car,, etc...
4) Emptied my private bank accounts on two different occasions leaving them overdrawn and unrecoverable.
5) Report to the credit agencies that I am NOT paying. My credit is ruined.

I could go on and on and on and on. I HAVE NEVER MISSED A SINGLE PAYMENT. And I have been treated worse than any criminal that I have met.

It is a scam. The federal government is currently giving the State of Nazington 4 dollars for every 1 dollar that they collect for child support. Now,,, every effort is being made to demonize strong, hard working, dedicated fathers, in order to collect the 4/1 ratio MOOLA. They do not care about the children,,, they want the money!!!!

What is being done in Wa St is unconstitutional... I do not expect many people care, though.

The state Government in WA is currently taking 72% of my income,,,, and I have not committed a crime. How do you like them apples???

I feel your pain brother trust me,this stuff is so infuriating i cant even begin to describe how this crap feels,but life goes on right ?If i could go back in time i wouldnt change a thing tho,because my son is one of the best things that ever happened to me in my life and i make sure he knows that every weekend i pick him up,i know what it is like Jake,most states do the same to all divorced fathers out there they suck our blood on a straw and then some more argh!

[Flash]

Fun topic. Here is what the State of Washington did to me. First of all,,, I pay child support on two beautiful girls, I always have. I have never missed a payment, and have gone above and beyond to make sure that they have medical coverage. I live like a worm, in order to take care of my responsibility for my children. With that said,,, keep in mind that I have never missed a payment, over 85 thousand dollars,,, SO FAR. the state of WA still did the following things to me.

1) Refused to renew my Drivers License.
2) Refused me a Business License.
3) Entered a legal lien against any and all assetts,, Home/Car,, etc...
4) Emptied my private bank accounts on two different occasions leaving them overdrawn and unrecoverable.
5) Report to the credit agencies that I am NOT paying. My credit is ruined.

I could go on and on and on and on. I HAVE NEVER MISSED A SINGLE PAYMENT. And I have been treated worse than any criminal that I have met.

It is a scam. The federal government is currently giving the State of Nazington 4 dollars for every 1 dollar that they collect for child support. Now,,, every effort is being made to demonize strong, hard working, dedicated fathers, in order to collect the 4/1 ratio MOOLA. They do not care about the children,,, they want the money!!!!

What is being done in Wa St is unconstitutional... I do not expect many people care, though.

The state Government in WA is currently taking 72% of my income,,,, and I have not committed a crime. How do you like them apples???

I am truly sorry about your case as well as about the case of other nice fathers/mothers. This is a shame when collecting money from people for children is on a commission base - $4 for every $1 collected, this is scandalous imho. This is the thinking of "we are America and business is the only God", when these should not be on a revenue collection basis for the agency. It is a shame as well when a mother has to pay alimonie not to see her children or when a dad is rich enough to make so much trouble that the kids end up having designer clothes but being emotionnally taxed. There is real injustice and the kids are the one ending up paying. Emotionnally for sure.

I must say, however, that I have seen soooooo often parents not respecting their responsibilities and leaving the child custodian, while being happy not to have the child full time, leaving the child custodian with nothing. This is the drama of America/Canada in some provinces as well..

And yes, it is expensive to raise children, for either parent. Yes sometimes the non costudian ends up with about nothing, but the custodian too.

I hear people screaming how expensive it is to pay child supports when they give $200/month for 2 children. Let me laugh, raisnig children cost much more in North America (unless the parent is really poor, not cheating the system).

And not only that, folloiwng the kids to sport events, doing the taxi, helping in the homeworks, cooking, washing, and there, the custodian is left with absolutely no life, no more than the parent who has to take two jobs, of course, this is if the custodian is alone with the children (remarriage makes the game different).

Personnally, I can count on one hand the times my ex took his daughter to treatment( she had a lot), to dentist, to sport, to vacation (never), to anything. I can count the numerous arguments for supplemental fees for her treatments, that I ended up often paying. As he ever done the homeworks with her, noooo. Has he ever been there when she is sick, noooo. Does he take her on vacation, nooo. And she wonders why? She ask why?

Yet, I am working 60 hours a week to afford raising her and paying her extra treatments she needs and have to do the whole gammiit of the work as described above, despite the fact that the government takes the child pension from his paycheck, based on his revenue, that are about 2 times mine. It is expensive more with special needs.

Believe me, he screams it is too much but he has had a few girlfriends since, goes to vacations for 1monht1/2 per year all over the world, has most of his week ends free (always an excuse not to take her) and he has a life.

I had none of these for the last 10 years. Not even a full week without being with her, even on vacations. I love her, so I take it, but forget a boyfriend or a personal life, i work much to much for it. Can you imagine if I had to try to collect the child support over and above.

So, when one complaint about child payment, yes, it may be a lot, it is expensive to raise a child, but do you have a life with it or not? (I understand that working 2 jobs you do not either thoughj).

You may not thank me for the post, but I truly think the other reality has to be menitoned as well, to keep the thread in balance. (and I am sooooo happy the government here does not give something that looks like a commission base reward for getting money from parents)

[Lord Sidious]

Fun topic. Here is what the State of Washington did to me. First of all,,, I pay child support on two beautiful girls, I always have. I have never missed a payment, and have gone above and beyond to make sure that they have medical coverage. I live like a worm, in order to take care of my responsibility for my children. With that said,,, keep in mind that I have never missed a payment, over 85 thousand dollars,,, SO FAR. the state of WA still did the following things to me.

1) Refused to renew my Drivers License.
2) Refused me a Business License.
3) Entered a legal lien against any and all assetts,, Home/Car,, etc...
4) Emptied my private bank accounts on two different occasions leaving them overdrawn and unrecoverable.
5) Report to the credit agencies that I am NOT paying. My credit is ruined.

I could go on and on and on and on. I HAVE NEVER MISSED A SINGLE PAYMENT. And I have been treated worse than any criminal that I have met.

It is a scam. The federal government is currently giving the State of Nazington 4 dollars for every 1 dollar that they collect for child support. Now,,, every effort is being made to demonize strong, hard working, dedicated fathers, in order to collect the 4/1 ratio MOOLA. They do not care about the children,,, they want the money!!!!

What is being done in Wa St is unconstitutional... I do not expect many people care, though.

The state Government in WA is currently taking 72% of my income,,,, and I have not committed a crime. How do you like them apples???

If you are prepared to learn and then execute what I can show you, I can help you turn the tables on them.
A friend of mine in manitoba had issues and how has a caveat on their parliament for $58 million.
I can help, but only if you want help.
However, be aware that I don't play by rules, as they don't, so you might be in for some rough weather if you choose to go with what I can show you.

[Jake]

Fun topic. Here is what the State of Washington did to me. First of all,,, I pay child support on two beautiful girls, I always have. I have never missed a payment, and have gone above and beyond to make sure that they have medical coverage. I live like a worm, in order to take care of my responsibility for my children. With that said,,, keep in mind that I have never missed a payment, over 85 thousand dollars,,, SO FAR. the state of WA still did the following things to me.

1) Refused to renew my Drivers License.
2) Refused me a Business License.
3) Entered a legal lien against any and all assetts,, Home/Car,, etc...
4) Emptied my private bank accounts on two different occasions leaving them overdrawn and unrecoverable.
5) Report to the credit agencies that I am NOT paying. My credit is ruined.

I could go on and on and on and on. I HAVE NEVER MISSED A SINGLE PAYMENT. And I have been treated worse than any criminal that I have met.

It is a scam. The federal government is currently giving the State of Nazington 4 dollars for every 1 dollar that they collect for child support. Now,,, every effort is being made to demonize strong, hard working, dedicated fathers, in order to collect the 4/1 ratio MOOLA. They do not care about the children,,, they want the money!!!!

What is being done in Wa St is unconstitutional... I do not expect many people care, though.

The state Government in WA is currently taking 72% of my income,,,, and I have not committed a crime. How do you like them apples???

I am truly sorry about your case as well as about the case of other nice fathers/mothers. This is a shame when collecting money from people for children is on a commission base - $4 for every $1 collected, this is scandalous imho. This is the thinking of "we are America and business is the only God", when these should not be on a revenue collection basis for the agency. It is a shame as well when a mother has to pay alimonie not to see her children or when a dad is rich enough to make so much trouble that the kids end up having designer clothes but being emotionnally taxed. There is real injustice and the kids are the one ending up paying. Emotionnally for sure.

I must say, however, that I have seen soooooo often parents not respecting their responsibilities and leaving the child custodian, while being happy not to have the child full time, leaving the child custodian with nothing. This is the drama of America/Canada in some provinces as well..

And yes, it is expensive to raise children, for either parent. Yes sometimes the non costudian ends up with about nothing, but the custodian too.

I hear people screaming how expensive it is to pay child supports when they give $200/month for 2 children. Let me laugh, raisnig children cost much more in North America (unless the parent is really poor, not cheating the system).

And not only that, folloiwng the kids to sport events, doing the taxi, helping in the homeworks, cooking, washing, and there, the custodian is left with absolutely no life, no more than the parent who has to take two jobs, of course, this is if the custodian is alone with the children (remarriage makes the game different).

Personnally, I can count on one hand the times my ex took his daughter to treatment( she had a lot), to dentist, to sport, to vacation (never), to anything. I can count the numerous arguments for supplemental fees for her treatments, that I ended up often paying. As he ever done the homeworks with her, noooo. Has he ever been there when she is sick, noooo. Does he take her on vacation, nooo. And she wonders why? She ask why?

Yet, I am working 60 hours a week to afford raising her and paying her extra treatments she needs and have to do the whole gammiit of the work as described above, despite the fact that the government takes the child pension from his paycheck, based on his revenue, that are about 2 times mine. It is expensive more with special needs.

Believe me, he screams it is too much but he has had a few girlfriends since, goes to vacations for 1monht1/2 per year all over the world, has most of his week ends free (always an excuse not to take her) and he has a life.

I had none of these for the last 10 years. Not even a full week without being with her, even on vacations. I love her, so I take it, but forget a boyfriend or a personal life, i work much to much for it. Can you imagine if I had to try to collect the child support over and above.

So, when one complaint about child payment, yes, it may be a lot, it is expensive to raise a child, but do you have a life with it or not? (I understand that working 2 jobs you do not either thoughj).

You may not thank me for the post, but I truly think the other reality has to be menitoned as well, to keep the thread in balance. (and I am sooooo happy the government here does not give something that looks like a commission base reward for getting money from parents)

Hello, Flash. I appreciate your understanding. And I appreciate all of the hard work that you do. I mean it. It helps me to realize that there ARE folks out there who appreciate how hard it can be. I have had to shed many layers, and have come to appreciate anyone in this sort of situation. :) There are some real horror stories with regards the Child Support Issues. The only thing that keeps me sane is the 45 days a year that I get to see my girls. Many folks have it much worse than me.

There is no logic in punishing people who pay their child support!!!

Believe it or not,,, many people will not agree with that!!!

[Maia Gabrial]

I've got one for you, ktlight. My son's friend had to pay child support for a child who wasn't even his. The judge who was a friend of the family, refused to accept the paternity test which would have proven his case. And to top it all off, his court letter was intentionally sent late, so he would miss it. And this seems to happen quite frequently in Michigan....

[Flash]

=Jake;256056
Hello, Flash. I appreciate your understanding. And I appreciate all of the hard work that you do. I mean it. It helps me to realize that there ARE folks out there who appreciate how hard it can be. I have had to shed many layers, and have come to appreciate anyone in this sort of situation. :) There are some real horror stories with regards the Child Support Issues. The only thing that keeps me sane is the 45 days a year that I get to see my girls. Many folks have it much worse than me.

There is no logic in punishing people who pay their child support!!!

Believe it or not,,, many people will not agree with that!!!

i agree, you get the money reasonably with other means. When a parent is punished, traumatized, asbent, or overworked, it iis the child who is paying the main price with emotionally tired parent, with his brain connections being rewired for pain and suffering or victimhood, with feeling of being deprived, and yes they are, deprived of time and love from both parents.

This is why despite all I mentioned I still speak to my ex and pushes as much as possible for them to meet, even if it is 2 hours a week. She needs to see her dad. She needs not to feel too abandoned and she needs to be able to reproach him whatever makes her feel bad, while learning to do it still in a respectful manner (which is not obvious).

[Maia Gabrial]

Alot of single parents don't realize how important both parents are to the growth of the child.

[Flash]

=Lord Sidious;256048
If you are prepared to learn and then execute what I can show you, I can help you turn the tables on them.
A friend of mine in manitoba had issues and how has a caveat on their parliament for $58 million.
I can help, but only if you want help.
However, be aware that I don't play by rules, as they don't, so you might be in for some rough weather if you choose to go with what I can show you.

When some jerk in government offices think they are gods, or when a dad screw the whole system in order to deprive the mother from her children and the children a mother, yes, the means will often mean not playing in the rules.

As far as I am concern, you are dealing here with sociopaths and the rules do not apply with them (they will make sure it does not for them while trying to have you follow rules, their trick is not to do anything they expect)

[Rocky_Shorz]

and don't forget, owing over $8000 in Child Support means your Passport is revoked and nonrenewable...

Divorce agreements are made during angry times, revisiting after you are friends again isn't a bad idea...

one signature can get authorities off your back to start making a living again.

[GCS1103]

Fun topic. Here is what the State of Washington did to me. First of all,,, I pay child support on two beautiful girls, I always have. I have never missed a payment, and have gone above and beyond to make sure that they have medical coverage. I live like a worm, in order to take care of my responsibility for my children. With that said,,, keep in mind that I have never missed a payment, over 85 thousand dollars,,, SO FAR. the state of WA still did the following things to me.

1) Refused to renew my Drivers License.
2) Refused me a Business License.
3) Entered a legal lien against any and all assetts,, Home/Car,, etc...
4) Emptied my private bank accounts on two different occasions leaving them overdrawn and unrecoverable.
5) Report to the credit agencies that I am NOT paying. My credit is ruined.

I could go on and on and on and on. I HAVE NEVER MISSED A SINGLE PAYMENT. And I have been treated worse than any criminal that I have met.

It is a scam. The federal government is currently giving the State of Nazington 4 dollars for every 1 dollar that they collect for child support. Now,,, every effort is being made to demonize strong, hard working, dedicated fathers, in order to collect the 4/1 ratio MOOLA. They do not care about the children,,, they want the money!!!!

What is being done in Wa St is unconstitutional... I do not expect many people care, though.

The state Government in WA is currently taking 72% of my income,,,, and I have not committed a crime. How do you like them apples???

Jake-

If you haven't already done so, get yourself a good attorney. Pro se litigants are always at a disadvantage. If you already have an attorney, it's time to retain a new one who specializes in family law.

Goldie

[Lord Sidious]

Fun topic. Here is what the State of Washington did to me. First of all,,, I pay child support on two beautiful girls, I always have. I have never missed a payment, and have gone above and beyond to make sure that they have medical coverage. I live like a worm, in order to take care of my responsibility for my children. With that said,,, keep in mind that I have never missed a payment, over 85 thousand dollars,,, SO FAR. the state of WA still did the following things to me.

1) Refused to renew my Drivers License.
2) Refused me a Business License.
3) Entered a legal lien against any and all assetts,, Home/Car,, etc...
4) Emptied my private bank accounts on two different occasions leaving them overdrawn and unrecoverable.
5) Report to the credit agencies that I am NOT paying. My credit is ruined.

I could go on and on and on and on. I HAVE NEVER MISSED A SINGLE PAYMENT. And I have been treated worse than any criminal that I have met.

It is a scam. The federal government is currently giving the State of Nazington 4 dollars for every 1 dollar that they collect for child support. Now,,, every effort is being made to demonize strong, hard working, dedicated fathers, in order to collect the 4/1 ratio MOOLA. They do not care about the children,,, they want the money!!!!

What is being done in Wa St is unconstitutional... I do not expect many people care, though.

The state Government in WA is currently taking 72% of my income,,,, and I have not committed a crime. How do you like them apples???

Jake-

If you haven't already done so, get yourself a good attorney. Pro se litigants are always at a disadvantage. If you already have an attorney, it's time to retain a new one who specializes in family law.

Goldie

Incorrect.
SOMETIMES, pro se litigants are at a disadvantage, but that depends on their knowledge, backup and drive.
Most times, the lawyers have a limit to how far they can push the envelope, the individual does not.

[Anchor]

Alot of single parents don't realize how important both parents are to the growth of the child.

And a lot do, and of those some don't have a chance of making it work and this makes it even worse for them.

Tough, thorny issues like are touched on in this thread, show us all, especially people like me that don't have children, just how hard and complex it can be. I have friends with children and it seems hard enough in a normal "functional" working family.

One thing does seem to shine through though, and that is, of course, love! It also shows that love is not PASSIVE, it is active.

Love drives people to cope with these harsh and frankly absurd mixed up situations.

[ktlight]

I've got one for you, ktlight. My son's friend had to pay child support for a child who wasn't even his. The judge who was a friend of the family, refused to accept the paternity test which would have proven his case. And to top it all off, his court letter was intentionally sent late, so he would miss it. And this seems to happen quite frequently in Michigan....

Thank you for that, Maia G. In UK, there is an organisation that fights the CSA on behalf of men, not sure about women. They state that they can prove CSA is a fraud, but CSA move in on you via your mail and telephone and work, and use the tax department to learn more. They call from unidentifiable telephone numbers. They take 15% of your salary per child, at least, although 15% is stated to be the maximum they can take. They act like the mafia and legal thugs, attaching Orders to your salary.

It is a totally unfair system. They do not investigate the ex-partner who made the application to them and merely take their word regarding income.


Lord Sidious, I hope Jake takes you up on your offer. The ride you introduce him to surely could not be any rougher than the ride he has been taken on.