Planet X/Nibiru/Tyche/Hercolobus/Elenin

[truthseekerdan]

Why Is The NASA Science Chief Stepping Down? (2nd Oct 2011)

jLmfhDnfEzw

This was on CNN just a few short days ago...

Srs2By7xm4o

[The Truth Is In There]

nothing is over imho. "comet" elenin will continue to play the major role in what's going to happen here on earth... [...]

Hi TTIIT, I am curious as to what isn't understandable about that particular one, you know, the 27th Sept. alignment with a cloud of dust, being gone, done and over with?

Unless, of course, one got caught in an endlessly looping time line.

IMO, there is such a thing as accountability when such hype for huge catastrophes being predicted with the chorus of doom & gloom propaganda being repeated over and over from the 90s on... Hale-Bopp... Nibiru 2003... Elenin 27th sept. 2011... I can see it now... it's all in your signature.

it has nothing to do with "understanding", it's about perspective. the alignment was on the 29th, not the 27th. it started the final phase of humanity's awakening which ends on october 28th. afterwards there will be those who are aware of the dream they themselves created, the drama they can leave behind if they don't need it anymore and those who remain unaware, stay in the dream a while longer and experience what in their perspective could be called "doom", beginning in late november. i doesn't matter whether you believe me or think this is complete bs. i'm not here to convince anyone, i just offer a different perspective for those who are no longer entrenched in 3-dimensionality.

[teddyc1]

nothing is over imho. "comet" elenin will continue to play the major role in what's going to happen here on earth... [...]

Hi TTIIT, I am curious as to what isn't understandable about that particular one, you know, the 27th Sept. alignment with a cloud of dust, being gone, done and over with?

Unless, of course, one got caught in an endlessly looping time line.

IMO, there is such a thing as accountability when such hype for huge catastrophes being predicted with the chorus of doom & gloom propaganda being repeated over and over from the 90s on... Hale-Bopp... Nibiru 2003... Elenin 27th sept. 2011... I can see it now... it's all in your signature.

it has nothing to do with "understanding", it's about perspective. the alignment was on the 29th, not the 27th. it started the final phase of humanity's awakening which ends on october 28th. afterwards there will be those who are aware of the dream they themselves created, the drama they can leave behind if they don't need it anymore and those who remain unaware, stay in the dream a while longer and experience what in their perspective could be called "doom", beginning in late november. i doesn't matter whether you believe me or think this is complete bs. i'm not here to convince anyone, i just offer a different perspective for those who are no longer entrenched in 3-dimensionality.

Ok, TTIIT, so for those of us who are still entrenched in the 3rd dimensionality: It's past the 27th, past the 29th, when the conjunction was supposed to cause mass earthquakes, tsunamis, and tons of real doom, the 3rd dimension type of doom. It's now the 3rd of October - and you would like to inspire us to change our perspective? With a perspective change, the real doom that didn't happen can now become a mystical hazy concept of spiritual transformation of some sort? Where's the accountability regarding the doom predictions which were scheduled to occur right here in the 3rd dimensionality?

[TargeT]

Ok, TTIIT, so for those of us who are still entrenched in the 3rd dimensionality: It's past the 27th, past the 29th, when the conjunction was supposed to cause mass earthquakes, tsunamis, and tons of real doom, the 3rd dimension type of doom. It's now the 3rd of October - and you would like to inspire us to change our perspective? With a perspective change, the real doom that didn't happen can now become a mystical hazy concept of spiritual transformation of some sort? Where's the accountability regarding the doom predictions which were scheduled to occur right here in the 3rd dimensionality?

Those were never anything but RECENT "guesses" (earthquakes, tsunamis etc...) never a part of anything historically, if elenin isn't visible when it passes virgo's, then it's probably not the "proported destroyer" but that hasn't happend yet either....

Just remember, if your right, its like "knowing" there's no room for anything else.. I'm open to wait untill novemnber / december at least before I look back and think ( TO MY SELF) oh, that probably was nothing special.

[The Truth Is In There]

nothing is over imho. "comet" elenin will continue to play the major role in what's going to happen here on earth... [...]

Hi TTIIT, I am curious as to what isn't understandable about that particular one, you know, the 27th Sept. alignment with a cloud of dust, being gone, done and over with?

Unless, of course, one got caught in an endlessly looping time line.

IMO, there is such a thing as accountability when such hype for huge catastrophes being predicted with the chorus of doom & gloom propaganda being repeated over and over from the 90s on... Hale-Bopp... Nibiru 2003... Elenin 27th sept. 2011... I can see it now... it's all in your signature.

it has nothing to do with "understanding", it's about perspective. the alignment was on the 29th, not the 27th. it started the final phase of humanity's awakening which ends on october 28th. afterwards there will be those who are aware of the dream they themselves created, the drama they can leave behind if they don't need it anymore and those who remain unaware, stay in the dream a while longer and experience what in their perspective could be called "doom", beginning in late november. i doesn't matter whether you believe me or think this is complete bs. i'm not here to convince anyone, i just offer a different perspective for those who are no longer entrenched in 3-dimensionality.

Ok, TTIIT, so for those of us who are still entrenched in the 3rd dimensionality: It's past the 27th, past the 29th, when the conjunction was supposed to cause mass earthquakes, tsunamis, and tons of real doom, the 3rd dimension type of doom. It's now the 3rd of October - and you would like to inspire us to change our perspective? With a perspective change, the real doom that didn't happen can now become a mystical hazy concept of spiritual transformation of some sort? Where's the accountability regarding the doom predictions which were scheduled to occur right here in the 3rd dimensionality?

i don't feel responsible for other people's failed predictions. if you were waiting for doom to happen in late september and were disappointed you shouldn't hold others accountable for it. if you read for example the hopi prophecy you'll notice that doom is predicted to happen shortly AFTER certain other events occured, not before. perhaps a good idea would be to take things as they come and don't judge what happens. everyone will experience what's best for them. sorry if you don't feel inspired by my words. different perspectives i guess.

[Hervé]

i don't feel responsible for other people's failed predictions. if you were waiting for doom to happen in late september and were disappointed you shouldn't hold others accountable for it. if you read for example the hopi prophecy you'll notice that doom is predicted to happen shortly AFTER certain other events occured, not before. perhaps a good idea would be to take things as they come and don't judge what happens. everyone will experience what's best for them. sorry if you don't feel inspired by my words. different perspectives i guess.

Could you remind me who it was that maintained for the longest time that Elenin was the "Blue Kachina?"

[The Truth Is In There]

i don't feel responsible for other people's failed predictions. if you were waiting for doom to happen in late september and were disappointed you shouldn't hold others accountable for it. if you read for example the hopi prophecy you'll notice that doom is predicted to happen shortly AFTER certain other events occured, not before. perhaps a good idea would be to take things as they come and don't judge what happens. everyone will experience what's best for them. sorry if you don't feel inspired by my words. different perspectives i guess.

Could you remind me who it was that maintained for the longest time that Elenin was the "Blue Kachina?"

could you remind me what the blue kachina is doing as opposed to what the red kachina will do?

i give you a hint.


"The return of the Blue Star Katchina who is also known as Nan ga sohu will be the alarm clock that tells us of the new day and new way of life, a new world that is coming. This is where the changes will begin. They will start as fires that burn within us, and we will burn up with desires and conflict if we do not remember the original teachings, and return to the peaceful way of life.

"Not far behind the twins will come the Purifier - The Red Katchina, who will bring the Day of Purification. On this day the Earth, her creatures and all life as we know it will change forever. There will be messengers that will precede this coming of the Purifier. They will leave messages to those on Earth who remember the old ways.


the passage of elenin, or the blue kachina, is depicted serpent-like in the crop circle i posted a couple of days ago ("alarm clock", anyone? tick..tick..tick :sleep:). what does the ringing of an alarm clock signifiy? let me guess, maybe that it's time to wake up and leave this dream world behind, the world that you believe is real?

the head of the serpent is september 29th, the date given in revelation 12.1, a prophecy some two thousand years old (though time doesn't matter since it's an illusion as well). the tail of the serpent is october 28th, the end of the mayan calendar, also known since thousands of years which, incidentally, represents the expansion of consciousness/awareness.

maybe you can tell us how you came to the conclusion that the blue kachina causes any kind of doom? all it signifies is the "changes" to begin and it could be seen as a harbinger of doom, depending on one's perspective, but it won't cause it.

[Hervé]

[...]
... the date given in revelation 12.1, a prophecy some two thousand years old (though time doesn't matter since it's an illusion as well). the tail of the serpent is october 28th, the end of the mayan calendar, also known since thousands of years which, incidentally, represents the expansion of consciousness/awareness.

maybe you can tell us how you came to the conclusion that the blue kachina causes any kind of doom? all it signifies is the "changes" to begin and it could be seen as a harbinger of doom, depending on one's perspective, but it won't cause it.

Strange... and very bizarre... since it's all illusion... how come you give credence to a 2000 years old imposed/enforced hologram perceived as a vision?

Also, why don't you try your ridiculing and wise cracking when facing the mirror...

[The Truth Is In There]

[...]
... the date given in revelation 12.1, a prophecy some two thousand years old (though time doesn't matter since it's an illusion as well). the tail of the serpent is october 28th, the end of the mayan calendar, also known since thousands of years which, incidentally, represents the expansion of consciousness/awareness.

maybe you can tell us how you came to the conclusion that the blue kachina causes any kind of doom? all it signifies is the "changes" to begin and it could be seen as a harbinger of doom, depending on one's perspective, but it won't cause it.

Strange... and very bizarre... since it's all illusion... how come you give credence to a 2000 years old imposed/enforced hologram perceived as a vision?

Also, why don't you try your ridiculing and wise cracking when facing the mirror...

i know you don't like to be wrong, especially about such "serious" topics as worldwide doom and destruction so please ignore my posts if you feel ridiculed by them. it's an ego thing and doesn't work very well in front of a mirror since i don't take myself or anything else very serious. "doom" doesn't exist for me. it's one of creator's jokes, just like "negativity". whatever earth has in store for us, i say bring it on! you know the saying "what doesn't kill you makes you stronger"? seen from my perspective as an immortal being there's nothing that could possibly ruin my day. after all, we're here because we want these experiences :dirol:

[Hervé]

[...]

Strange... and very bizarre... since it's all illusion... how come you give credence to a 2000 years old imposed/enforced hologram perceived as a vision?

Also, why don't you try your ridiculing and wise cracking when facing the mirror...

i know you don't like to be wrong, especially about such "serious" topics as worldwide doom and destruction so please ignore my posts if you feel ridiculed by them. it's an ego thing and doesn't work very well in front of a mirror since i don't take myself or anything else very serious. "doom" doesn't exist for me. it's one of creator's jokes, just like "negativity". whatever earth has in store for us, i say bring it on! you know the saying "what doesn't kill you makes you stronger"? seen from my perspective as an immortal being there's nothing that could possibly ruin my day. after all, we're here because we want these experiences :dirol:

I have no idea where you got that I don't like to be wrong as I only presented verifiable data on this thread that contradicted the speculations and doom and gloom about the late comet Elenin. Since you do not seem to care about actual facts either, there is no way you can ever get them straight.

However the thread and its recorded posts are there for any verifications.

[RedeZra]

hello earth


http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRc2kkFxJpsNJgSXcMBbc7sjfWAy3yBbYHfc90-yJF7ofW7RsB3AA

it seems we will soon see 2 suns set in the sky just like on tatooine


look up even now or watch the countless youtube clips



incoming planet shot on location in Pakistan

8biBmO9dOh4


incoming planet shot on location in Scotland

0l-5M9uVP_0


i totally understand why our governments are silent on this celestial visitation ; )

[thegodsmakethecircles]

I just came across video footage of a little-known crop circle from 1992 in Hampshire, England, that shows the alignment (collision?) of Earth and Nibiru AND reveals the identity of the extraterrestrial species that is responsible for creating crop circles!

http://youtu.be/WWvkDnLjHDo

[jcocks]

Don't we just love jumping to conclusions here at the moment? It seems we're forgetting that this process we are currently going through is primarily a SPIRITUAL process. Yes, I believe there will be physical signs - many of which are yet to come, but it's mostly internal and thus the experience is as different for each of us as we are.

I'm personally steering away from the doom-and-gloom physical events and my bet is now that the most cataclysmic event that will happen for us in the near future will be the collapse of the economy, which will not recover.

This will be very difficult for many, but if you're in the right place spiritually you have absolutely nothing to fear as what you need will manifest for you if you let it.

Beyond that, look for signs in the sky (hint - they're already happening, and not where we neccessarily expect. For example, the recently discovered planet made out of diamond could well be a sign) - and since we're going to be in a place where we have more time to pay attention to such signs, everyone will notice them. Our religions will undergo a metamorphosis as we undergo a spiritual renaissance of hitherto unheard-of proportions.

As I said, nothing violent or doom-and-gloom... But EVERYONE will realise that our reality is NOT AT ALL what we are lead to think it is . This is the first step of humanity's mass awakening. Nothing to be afraid of, it's going to be a wonderous time for us all. Just be ready and mentally prepared for what is to come, your spiritual identity will need it. You need to be OPEN.

[passiglight]

I agree with your words jcocks,,,,,,,,,,

though as far as the financial collapse goes,,,,,,,the various galactics are saying they have a new system allready to roll out,,,,,,,

Yes i also think "going home" will be an exciting time,,,,,,,,,,and that this 3d experience is a hologram which we are actively participating in,,,,,,,,,

The earth trembles that i more or less believe will start on tuesday,,,,,,,i don't think this situation can be totally managed,,,,but that "they" will do what they can to limit the birthing pains of gaia,,,,,,

i also don't think the final outcome is guaranteed either,,,,,,,,,,,it seems to me that there are unquantifiable angles in this experiment that have no perimeters,,,,,,,,and that is the bit which has got our fellow galactics all het up with excitement,,,,

and is probably part of the reason why we need to have understanding of ourselves and the positives we can project through the next few weeks,,,,,,,,

cosmic love...we are energy

[RedeZra]

As I said, nothing violent or doom-and-gloom...

hello every culture on earth share a flood gloom

so if it happened once then it is more likely than not that it will happen again

but that's why we have the rapture hehe

[passiglight]

Further more, and unlikely as it may well sound,,,,,,,,we need 12 planets in our new system,,,,,, so they have arranged for the new planets (sun + fellow orbiting objects ) to drop out of another dimension straight into ours,,,,,,

[RedeZra]

Further more, and unlikely as it may well sound,,,,,,,,we need 12 planets in our new system,,,,,, so they have arranged for the new planets (sun + fellow orbiting objects ) to drop out of another dimension straight into ours,,,,,,

i want to comment on that

as the rapture does not sound any more likely than new planets dropping from another dimension

but as you know with God anything is possible

question is what is true and what is lie

[Hervé]

:focus:



From the Electric Universe guys:



Comet Elenin—the Debate that Never Happened

Posted on October 6, 2011 (http://www.thunderbolts.info/wp/2011/10/06/comet-elenin%e2%80%94the-debate-that-never-happened/) by David Talbott (http://www.thunderbolts.info/wp/author/david-talbott/)
by David Talbott

The comet Elenin, a subject of intense Internet discussion for several months, seems to have disappointed everyone. I speak here not just of the doomsayers (http://www.godlikeproductions.com/search.php?q=Elenin+doom), who were awaiting a frightful specter in recent weeks. You might think these folks would be happy that the celebrated intruder faded fast just when it was supposed to be reaching maximum activity. But in these strange times, Doomsday seems a lot more fun than a minor distraction in our cosmic neighborhood.

Also disappointed are the many scientists who expected a more impressive display from Elenin. That expectation seemed well founded based on the growing coma of Elenin in the months following its discovery in December, 2010. And prior space probes sent to comets helped to feed an illusion about the comet’s size. The estimates appear to have missed the mark completely.

Strangely, the popular scientific media, insofar as they’ve shown any interest in Elenin, are satisfied to simply expose the lunacy (http://www.networkworld.com/community/blog/nasa-shoots-down-comet-elenin-doom-and-gloom-) of Internet fear-mongering. But is that really all we should be discussing here? Elenin has only one connection to “Doomsday.” Like every comet, it reminds us of ancient memories of a truly terrifying and destructive Great Comet, the true source of comet fears and Doomsday anxiety—a verifiable cultural conditioning that has persisted for thousands of years. With every appearance of a comet the ancient fear resurfaces, but this fact adds nothing to scientific discussion of Elenin and its fate.

Visions of Nibiru
The little wisp of a comet has no relationship to ancient Babylonian references to “Nibiru,” a subject misrepresented up to a cosmic level by the originator of a Nibiru doomsday fantasy—Zecharia Sitchin. From the beginning, the Nibiru concept promoted by Sitchin was a meaningless fiction. A few meager examples of the word exist in Babylonian literature. Nothing in the language suggests either a comet or the rogue planet claimed by Sitchin.

Of course the spokesmen for “good science,” a phrase that too often means official dogma, delight in mocking Doomsday musings. But that response can only distract from what should be discussed—the failure of standard comet theory (http://www.thunderbolts.info/thunderblogs/archives/goodspeed08/110629_NASAs_elephant.htm) to describe or predict comet behavior over the past 25 years. The ignored fact is that Elenin has only added to the list of comet “misbehavior”—throwing a spotlight once again on mistaken theoretical assumptions.

Just when theory said the comet should have exhibited its greatest activity, it almost disappeared. One would assume from the media silence that the comet’s denouement poses no mystery to science. But to those who have come to understand the electrical nature of comets (http://www.thunderbolts.info/thunderblogs/archives/special_edition/100116_se_teu1.htm), there is something particularly noteworthy in the fading of Elenin. It is now clear that the original guesses about Elenin’s mass were overstated to a spectacular degree. It will certainly not serve the interests of scientific progress to ignore the question posed or turn away from an essential reconsideration of theory.

[...]






Full article: http://www.thunderbolts.info/wp/2011/10/06/comet-elenin%e2%80%94the-debate-that-never-happened/

PS: For rapture topics and other philosophizings... start your own threads...

[astrid]

I wonder how RCH is going to back out of this one.

Its really time for all to be less attached to convictions, so much is changing,

we need to be open to all things, all possibilities.

As the great Robert Anton Wilson said,

convictions make you a convict.

[RedeZra]

it seems a comet and i don't know if it was Elenin shot past the earth like a bullet and plunged into the sun about 10 days ago

well we don't have to worry about that one now


just a simple comet

and not a fiery red dragon ; )

[math330]

I wonder how RCH is going to back out of this one.
.

Not entirely sure he can! To me, at least, his credibility is pretty much ruined (which is a shame as he did some really good work on Dark Mission - but if he can read into the Elenin images that there's an artificial craft when there patently wasn't then.... well, what does that say about the 'glass structures' he found on the moon? More BS?). Same (and this may cause some upset - I apologise if I upset anyone but it's my personal opinion) as David Wilcock and Ben Fulford talking about an underground war between aliens and TPTB. I call BS on all of it.

The Elenin saga was the last straw for me. I can't take any of it seriously nowdays, it's all a distraction and we'd maybe be better off reading SciFi stories.
If it's true and happens, then cool - but I can't do anything about it so why bother worrying?

[Operator]

To me, at least, his credibility is pretty much ruined (which is a shame as he did some really good work on Dark Mission - but if he can read into the Elenin images that there's an artificial craft when there patently wasn't then.... well, what does that say about the 'glass structures' he found on the moon? More BS?).


I think he found anomalies in the photos which rather indicate that they were taken in a studio ...
But you're right I find more and more 'easy to understand' evidence that Apollo technology didn't make it
to the moon ... But despite his investigative mind and critical thinking he does not conclude that.



The Elenin saga was the last straw for me. I can't take any of it seriously nowdays, it's all a distraction and we'd maybe be better off reading SciFi stories.
If it's true and happens, then cool - but I can't do anything about it so why bother worrying?

Well that's the tactics they use ... if you don't trust original story A then they will make sure that someone convinces you
of B and another one will tell you C etc. The confusion will make that most of the people give up ...
While the only conclusion necessary is that the original story A isn't true and that those conveying it are liars. They need
to be removed, time and time again until the people in those positions will understand that lying doesn't help them to
maintain their position.

[The Truth Is In There]

hoagland was correct about elenin with regards to consciousness and also the tetrahedron shaped energy field. don't forget that elenin is a messenger and doesn't cause any kind of doom ("doom" is just a matter of perspective anyway.)

on the 18th elenin will cross earth's orbit. incidentally, on the 15th we'll see another blast from the sun, earth directed of course - more energy to wake us up, and we'll see more earthquake and volcano activity between the 16 through 20th. does elenin cause that? no, probably not. and yet it happens exactly during the time period when elenin is closest to earth, just like el hierro began to wake up in earnest on sep 29th, during the earth-elenin-sun alignment.

[thegodsmakethecircles]

THIS CROP CIRCLE INDICATES NIBIRU'S ALIGNMENT WITH EARTH AND CONFIRMS THE IDENTITY OF THE BEINGS WHO MAKE CROP CIRCLES ONCE AND FOR ALL!!!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hAV3dntJTeM

[Hervé]

From: http://sydneystargazers.com/

The Search For the Remains of Comet Elenin – Part 1 (http://sydneystargazers.com/2011/10/13/the-search-for-the-remains-of-comet-elenin-part-1/)•October 13, 2011 •

In 3 days time comet Elenin was due to be at it’s nearest to Earth at a distance 91 times further away than our moon.
However, there is now no doubting the fact that comet elenin has disintegrated and if there is anything left of it … it will be nothing more than debris.
Today we pointed the scope at where the comet should be, which at that time had the comet 31 degrees above the horizon. The Moon did not help with picture quality but still we should have seen something if there was any substantial pieces of Elenin left.
In the picture below, comet elenin should be centered in the middle of the picture however there is no trace of it.
We will keep on looking for any signs of debris left of Elenin over the coming days and weeks.
http://sydneystargazers.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/elenin-oct-13.jpg?w=497&h=331 (http://sydneystargazers.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/elenin-oct-13.jpg)
Comet Elenin Oct 13

[yiolas]

Thanks for the update AΖ

[The Truth Is In There]

this scientific paper from mr. omerbashich has probably been posted before but it bears repeating now.

http://lanl.arxiv.org/ftp/arxiv/papers/1104/1104.2036.pdf

here's an excerpt. in just a few days we should see proof that elenin is still around.


The ongoing increase in seismic activity due to combined effects of the Elenin and other celestial objects is manifested in form of phases longer than 3 days, and displacements of more than 10 m. This will continue until the comet crosses into the Earth's orbit around 1 August 2011, when the seismicity will subside as the comet speeds up significantly. After that time it will not have enough time for participating in long astronomical alignments in order to pose imminent danger to the Earth as before, except for the alignments involving the Sun due to the Sun's size. The strongest seismicity will then again increase around 20 October 2011, i.e. upon the comet's crossing of the Earth's orbit on the way out, only to continue subsiding till year 2016. It will finally fade out in terms of very strong seismicity by year 2060.

also, note this:

http://www.galactic-centre-2012.com/ [very informative site. recommended reading!]

http://www.galactic-centre-2012.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/ENDOFCREATIONRED28Oct2011.jpg


[...]
Yet certainly 2011 is just as dangerous as 2013, at least the month of October, of which the date that sends most goodsepimples down my back is 28th October 2011.

By the Autumn of 2011, especially in October, around the 28th a Star of David aspect forms involving the two giant planets Jupiter and Saturn that are involved by all the greatest events in history. The positions on which they are placed is common for causing volcanic eruptions, suggesting with the involvement of Saturn and the earth signs Taurus and Capricorn as well as the fire signs, that volcanic erathquakes will lead to large eruptions that may continue or increase in following years. What better way to understand the end of creation than such an eruption? Nevertheless, whether it brings a major eruption or not major earthquakes between 2011 and 2013 are a certainty . In 543 AD a bow pointed to Saturn in Scorpio and to Pluto in Capricorn. Exactly the same pattern will recur from 2011, through 2012 and into 2013.

If you are unsure which dates to be careful on as we approach 2012 I would put a big ring around the month of October in 2011, especially marking the last half of it with a red pen. With such serious aspects as these it is easy to predict disaster.

From October 2011 throughout most of 2012 and even into 2013 a bow remains involving Saturn and his sign Capricorn where Pluto is placed conjunct the Galactic Centre and this suggests that this whole period will bring large earthquakes and disintegrating effects to the Earth and its crust. The square to Uranus in Aries adds the volcanic activity.

we have already seen increased volcanic activity, most recently el hierro and now also on santorini island (thera) in greece (one prophecy says that this volcano, whose eruption was responsible 3600 (!) years ago for the end of the minoans, will erupt again on or around oct 30th, 2011 so keep an eye on it. it's already stirring.)

[yiolas]

Hi The Truth is in There, I am totally on board with you on this one. It is no coincidence that El Hierro and now Santorini are coming into the forefront as we approach October 28, 2011.

I also think that since Amzer Zo, who has been playing the role of devil's advocate since the beginning of this thread, should also be acknowledged for his contributions.
After all, we are all in this together.

Whatever the case, I've finally reached a point where I am finally calm and confident that I will be able to deal with whatever comes our way in the coming months.
By the way, have you guys watched latest James Gilliland video, where he says in no uncertain terms that we are in the final stretch.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KveZBoZ5M60

[The Truth Is In There]

from omerbashich's website (http://sites.google.com/site/omerbashich/blog):


THINK TUNING FORKS: SEPTEMBER MILESTONE
01.10.2011

Predictive abilities of the Hyperresonator are now confirmed: the September milestone (6th month into near real-time monitoring and no-miss prediction of oscillation's M6+ magnification) is reached. It was a complete success. The Elenin has interfered Earth's multiple alignments, thus causing a complete shutdown of Earth magnified oscillation. According to the past 100 years of data, such multiple alignments cause mega-quakes, of M8.5+.

As I predicted in my alignments paper (all versions) and interviews: while doing its majestic sped-up dance about the Sun, the Elenin is saving the Earth from havoc normally arising from multiple alignments such as those occurring in September, 2011. Not only that it is not partaking in many very long alignments between August-October, but its own oscillation naturally interfered the Earth's multiple alignments of September (for interference illustration, see Fig.12 in the paper). Therefore, as much as it has been causing mega-quakes on Earth in the past, our tiny companion-traveler (and the only comet in the Solar system for the past century or so!) is thus also shielding the Earth from what would likely be the most devastating series of earthquakes in centuries.

http://sites.google.com/site/omerbashich/_/rsrc/1317474579604/blog/sep02.jpg

[RMorgan]

from omerbashich's website (http://sites.google.com/site/omerbashich/blog):


THINK TUNING FORKS: SEPTEMBER MILESTONE
01.10.2011

Predictive abilities of the Hyperresonator are now confirmed: the September milestone (6th month into near real-time monitoring and no-miss prediction of oscillation's M6+ magnification) is reached. It was a complete success. The Elenin has interfered Earth's multiple alignments, thus causing a complete shutdown of Earth magnified oscillation. According to the past 100 years of data, such multiple alignments cause mega-quakes, of M8.5+.

As I predicted in my alignments paper (all versions) and interviews: while doing its majestic sped-up dance about the Sun, the Elenin is saving the Earth from havoc normally arising from multiple alignments such as those occurring in September, 2011. Not only that it is not partaking in many very long alignments between August-October, but its own oscillation naturally interfered the Earth's multiple alignments of September (for interference illustration, see Fig.12 in the paper). Therefore, as much as it has been causing mega-quakes on Earth in the past, our tiny companion-traveler (and the only comet in the Solar system for the past century or so!) is thus also shielding the Earth from what would likely be the most devastating series of earthquakes in centuries.

http://sites.google.com/site/omerbashich/_/rsrc/1317474579604/blog/sep02.jpg

Hahahahaha!!! Yesterday, Elenin would destroy Earth, everybody was sure of it!!! Today, it´s protecting Earth!!! That´s what I call a good flexible conspiracy theory!!!

[Hervé]

from omerbashich's website (http://sites.google.com/site/omerbashich/blog):


THINK TUNING FORKS: SEPTEMBER MILESTONE
01.10.2011

[...]

(and the only comet in the Solar system for the past century or so!)

[...]




I don't know what the guy smokes but I wouldn't want to try any of it:



From: http://members.westnet.com.au/mmatti/sc.htm

This page was last updated on 28-Sep-2011

Current Brightness of Present/Future comets visually observable from the Southern Hemisphere on Sep 28 , 2011.

45P Honda-Mrkos-Padjusakova 6th magnitude and steady. Northern hemisphere only. Morning twilight.

C/2009 P1 Garradd 7th magnitude and brightening. Northern evening sky. Maximum magnitude of 6 in Feb 2012 for northern hemisphere observers.

C/2010 X1 Elenin 10th magnitude and fading- in process of disintegrating. In solar conjunction. Is currently NOT visible in SOHO LASCO C3 images.

C/2011 Q4 SWAN 10th magnitude and steady. Western evening sky. New discovery!

C/2010 G2 Hill 11th magnitude and brightening. North circumpolar sky. Mag 10 in October

73P Schwassmann-Wachmann 13th magnitude and brightening. Low western evening sky.

C/2011 Q2 McNaught 13th magnitude and brightening. South western evening sky.

C/2009 F4 McNaught 13th magnitude and steady. South Circumpolar sky.

213P Van Ness 13th magnitude and brightening. Midnight sky.

78P Gehrels 13th magnitude and brightening. Midnight sky.

C/2006 S3 LONEOS 14th magnitude and steady. Eastern midnight sky.

C/2011 L4 PANSTARRS 19th magnitude and brightening. Bright comet in March 2013!
Possibly as bright as magnitude 0 but will be poorly situated in twilight.

[The Truth Is In There]

if you guys knew what omerbashich is talking about it would become clear why elenin is the only comet that has this impact. believe whatever you want, we'll see proof that he's right soon enough. actually we've seen it all the time since everything he has said with regard to elenin and its influence on earth seismicity since the beginning of 2011 has been correct but i don't expect you to get it. people who have tried to debunk elenin's impact for months are unlikely to change their opinion even when facing irrefutable facts.

[Unified Serenity]

I saw this a long time ago, and did a search and did not find it on this forum. The guy who does this work is definately a Christian and has his own agenda, but he reveals a lot of interesting information about this place in London which you can visit and explore what he shows on this 7 part series. He has an ability to see in the negative (not energy, but physically) and as such sees symbolism in buildings.

It's pretty funny at the end when he reveals a sign that even shows they are talking about UFO's. Have some fun with it.

0NMi3LneiPM

[lightning23]

:closed::closed:

[the trojan]

I saw this a long time ago, and did a search and did not find it on this forum. The guy who does this work is definately a Christian and has his own agenda, but he reveals a lot of interesting information about this place in London which you can visit and explore what he shows on this 7 part series. He has an ability to see in the negative (not energy, but physically) and as such sees symbolism in buildings.

It's pretty funny at the end when he reveals a sign that even shows they are talking about UFO's. Have some fun with it.

0NMi3LneiPM

he does have some interesting info and clearly does the research,by the way he is gorilla (something or other) and his mortal enemy is David Icke!

[Unified Serenity]

I saw this a long time ago, and did a search and did not find it on this forum. The guy who does this work is definately a Christian and has his own agenda, but he reveals a lot of interesting information about this place in London which you can visit and explore what he shows on this 7 part series. He has an ability to see in the negative (not energy, but physically) and as such sees symbolism in buildings.

It's pretty funny at the end when he reveals a sign that even shows they are talking about UFO's. Have some fun with it.

0NMi3LneiPM

he does have some interesting info and clearly does the research,by the way he is gorilla (something or other) and his mortal enemy is David Icke!

Yeh, he is interesting and over the top when it comes to being against some people or anyone he considers non-christian, but I like exploring his info.

[Malachi]

if you guys knew what omerbashich is talking about it would become clear why elenin is the only comet that has this impact. believe whatever you want, we'll see proof that he's right soon enough. actually we've seen it all the time since everything he has said with regard to elenin and its influence on earth seismicity since the beginning of 2011 has been correct but i don't expect you to get it. people who have tried to debunk elenin's impact for months are unlikely to change their opinion even when facing irrefutable facts.

here are the facts for you (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?32735-Hoax-Ends-As-Doomsday-Elenin-Passes-By-At-22million-Miles-Away..-), my good friend. please, let it go. or do as you wish, anyway.

[Lifebringer]

On number 1:24sec a bright looks like fairy flies past the building and goes off to the right of the screen. Coming from the left and flying off to the right sits on top of his forehead. I stopped it on full screen at 1:24 when he says: "this whole building" ect it flies right in. Amazing. They can't explain that one though, can they.

No matter what they try, it will NOT work. God is standing by, and no politically manipulated religion will stop the one and only God of Earth from straightening all that has to be straightened out here.

It is simply our time. May the blessing of our creator be endowed upon us on this wonderful time in mankinds history and graduation.

[Lifebringer]

They can live in the bottom of the ocean for all I care. They aren't gonna do a thing to us because they have NO POWER anymore over our lives. Their 6,000 years of rule went out with George=6 Walker=6 Busche=6, the original spelling.

The last little demonic representative went out with the election. Ronald=6 Wilson=6 Reagan=6.

It's over and the fat lady is singing loud and clear for justice.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

I told them in 1996 that their time was over, then cops started telling me, "who do you think the judge will believe, me or you?

That is when I said the true judge is coming and we'll see who sticks around buddy.

[RMorgan]

On number 1:24sec a bright looks like fairy flies past the building and goes off to the right of the screen. Coming from the left and flying off to the right sits on top of his forehead. I stopped it on full screen at 1:24 when he says: "this whole building" ect it flies right in. Amazing. They can't explain that one though, can they.

No matter what they try, it will NOT work. God is standing by, and no politically manipulated religion will stop the one and only God of Earth from straightening all that has to be straightened out here.

It is simply our time. May the blessing of our creator be endowed upon us on this wonderful time in mankinds history and graduation.

I don´t think it´s a fairy. It looks more like a dandelion seed or something like that.

[Unified Serenity]

I did a freeze frame. It's really 1:26-1:28 and I have to say, it does look like something other worldly. It does not look like a dandelion which I thought surely it must be, but darn, this looks illuminated. Very good catch! Now, I am going to have to rewatch this whole thing looking for more weird stuff!

Darn you Avalonians!

I uploaded a pic of the screenshot but I can't attach it, try here:

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/album.php?albumid=280

[RMorgan]

Here it is:

http://i592.photobucket.com/albums/tt7/rafaelmorgan2/fairy.jpg

Fairy? Insect? Dandelion seed?

You decide!!:hippie:

Ps: Image link, if you can´t see it for any reason:

http://i592.photobucket.com/albums/tt7/rafaelmorgan2/fairy.jpg

Cheers,

Raf.

[Unified Serenity]

Thanks Morgan! I couldn't get it to load, it flies in and glows the whole way, and this freeze frame looks like a body with arms, legs and wings, pretty kewl, and I seriously doubt Gorilla did this. He is not the type.

[RMorgan]

Thanks Morgan! I couldn't get it to load, it flies in and glows the whole way, and this freeze frame looks like a body with arms, legs and wings, pretty kewl, and I seriously doubt Gorilla did this. He is not the type.

Well, it´s not fake for sure. However, this could be an insect, passing close to the camera and reflecting day light...Who knows...

Ps: If you can´t get the image to load, go to this link:

http://i592.photobucket.com/albums/tt7/rafaelmorgan2/fairy.jpg

Cheers,

Raf.

[Unified Serenity]

IT'S NOT IT'S NOT!!! IT'S A FAIRY!!!! stomps foot and walks away convinced.

[the trojan]

i remember also watching this many moons ago,I dont for one minute think that the gorilla guy would add this to his videos.
I am going to have to look for the original(if this is not it) and have a look....that was lovely,and illuminated more than it should be.
it looks unreal as opposed to real.

[Unified Serenity]

Thanks trojan, it was uploaded by the maker of the documentary, Gorilla199, so I don't think it's doctored.

[Draco]

thks good post interesting timing of the thing (fairy) or spies toys something appears. right after mention Satan and the building , A sign perhaps that he is on the right path of discovery. The speed of the object is amazing i tired to catch it in the frame a few times skips a few times between 1:26 , 1:27 even between frames , be cool if they had high speed shutter on the cam.

[yiolas]

This is a video by Mr Comet Watch, where he explains the planetary alignments on October 28, 2011. It just so happens that on that day the earth will be directly between the sun and Jupiter. He expects major events as result of the earth being in between these two major objects .


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELjo0EiNlqA&NR=1

[norman]

ERRR....

I have a hard time buying anything the mainstream has for sale. If they tell us Elenin has broken up and become a non event I'm ready to believe anything, but, I'm sick of Elenin talk.

The poor thing just happened to turn up at a bad time when millions of people here are freaked out about something big happening. I think something big IS happening, but it's not Elenin. Nor is it any one of a large number of other spook factors the PTB are pumping full of ****E.

If you are so keen to be on the case with what's happening right now, try paying a bit more attention to things closer to home. Like the takedown of national sovereignty. Or any of the other advanced programs that are way ahead of you in the subtly game.

There is still an assumption in this sort of community that anything that is rumoured in the "alternative" scene is way better than the MSM clap trap.

I've got news for you.

It's the same old game. Just like the way they control the left wingers in politics and also control the right wingers in politics.

They are running the alternative scene too.

Wake up!.

[Unified Serenity]

Hey, I posted a freeze frame and you can see it on the Fairy thread I started that you see above. I've certainly never seen anything like this. I would really love it if someone has a video editing program that can slow down the footage and show it to use going much slower and thus get a better look at it in completion from 1:26 through 1:29.

[the trojan]

thks good post interesting timing of the thing (fairy) or spies toys something appears. right after mention Satan and the building , A sign perhaps that he is on the right path of discovery. The speed of the object is amazing i tired to catch it in the frame a few times skips a few times between 1:26 , 1:27 even between frames , be cool if they had high speed shutter on the cam.

too right,I downloaded it with keepvid and stared at it ,back and forth,back and forth..........
it does jump frames,its very fast....i thought it may be a leave from one of the trees in the background but it does keep the' fairy' shape and it does kind of land on his head twice then disappears.it does not rotate ,which is thought provoking...........
there is a wind from his right to left ,seen when the insect moves across at the fifty or so seconds mark.
i could not get a screen shot that is going to show any more than seen earlier in the thread.
It is very interesting.As I said earlier I dont think he has manipulated it,and i took it directly from his youtube page.
It is one of his older vids,about three years ago.
its genuine ,but i dont know what it is.

¤=[Post Update]=¤


Hey, I posted a freeze frame and you can see it on the Fairy thread I started that you see above. I've certainly never seen anything like this. I would really love it if someone has a video editing program that can slow down the footage and show it to use going much slower and thus get a better look at it in completion from 1:26 through 1:29.

slowing it down does not enhance it any more than above.

[nearing]

ERRR....

I have a hard time buying anything the mainstream has for sale. If they tell us Elenin has broken up and become a non event I'm ready to believe anything, but, I'm sick of Elenin talk.

The poor thing just happened to turn up at a bad time when millions of people here are freaked out about something big happening. I think something big IS happening, but it's not Elenin. Nor is it any one of a large number of other spook factors the PTB are pumping full of ****E.

If you are so keen to be on the case with what's happening right now, try paying a bit more attention to things closer to home. Like the takedown of national sovereignty. Or any of the other advanced programs that are way ahead of you in the subtly game.

There is still an assumption in this sort of community that anything that is rumoured in the "alternative" scene is way better than the MSM clap trap.

I've got news for you.

It's the same old game. Just like the way they control the left wingers in politics and also control the right wingers in politics.

They are running the alternative scene too.

Wake up!.

Good thing the Mayan Calendar and the Bavahagita, etc were all written long before there was a desperate MSM.

[Carolin]

Whatever the case, I've finally reached a point where I am finally calm and confident that I will be able to deal with whatever comes our way in the coming months.
By the way, have you guys watched latest James Gilliland video, where he says in no uncertain terms that we are in the final stretch.

I totally agree Yiola! I wrote in another thread that I found the Elenin threat empowering. I am such a chronic procrastinator that having a date set was probably the only thing that lit a fire under my butt. If nothing happens I can save money by only restocking when things are on sale. But it sure looks to me with the increase in volcanic activity things are heating up.....literally!!

[The Truth Is In There]

if you guys knew what omerbashich is talking about it would become clear why elenin is the only comet that has this impact. believe whatever you want, we'll see proof that he's right soon enough. actually we've seen it all the time since everything he has said with regard to elenin and its influence on earth seismicity since the beginning of 2011 has been correct but i don't expect you to get it. people who have tried to debunk elenin's impact for months are unlikely to change their opinion even when facing irrefutable facts.

here are the facts for you (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?32735-Hoax-Ends-As-Doomsday-Elenin-Passes-By-At-22million-Miles-Away..-), my good friend. please, let it go. or do as you wish, anyway.

according to the jpl model the next time there's an alignment of elenin, earth and the sun is on nov 22nd or 23rd (give or take 1 day, i'd say). this is the only seismically significant alignment that includes earth during that time frame and is similar to the one in march where earth was BETWEEN the sun and elenin. so IF a very large earthquake (say 8.0+) happens between nov 21st and nov 24th we can conclude that elenin is still around. agreed? if NOTHING out of the ordinary happens i concede your point.

my personal opinion is that by that time we'll have had several very large earthquakes as well as several volcanoes going off (REALLY going off, not just puffing up smoke). the 28th is definitely one of the days to keep in mind, as mentioned on the galactic-centre website and the video yiolas posted, but i believe the next alignment with elenin will be no less influential, also in terms of earth (/elenin) directed solar flares and/or CME's. so i suggest we drop the elenin issue for the time being until about 5 weeks hence when we should have definitive proof of whether or not elenin is still around (if the internet is still functioning by that time, that is).

[edit]

i just noticed that there's going to be another alignment on 11/11/11 (elenin-earth-mercury-venus) which should be equally influencial on earth seismicity. more, at any rate, than an aligment of just the three planets with earth at one end. mars, earth and neptune seem to be pretty much aligned as well, and also saturn, elenin and jupiter (almost). exciting times ahead. "one earth please, shaken, not stirred." :o

[Etherios]

if you guys knew what omerbashich is talking about it would become clear why elenin is the only comet that has this impact. believe whatever you want, we'll see proof that he's right soon enough. actually we've seen it all the time since everything he has said with regard to elenin and its influence on earth seismicity since the beginning of 2011 has been correct but i don't expect you to get it. people who have tried to debunk elenin's impact for months are unlikely to change their opinion even when facing irrefutable facts.

here are the facts for you (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?32735-Hoax-Ends-As-Doomsday-Elenin-Passes-By-At-22million-Miles-Away..-), my good friend. please, let it go. or do as you wish, anyway.

according to the jpl model the next time there's an alignment of elenin, earth and the sun is on nov 22nd or 23rd (give or take 1 day, i'd say). this is the only seismically significant alignment that includes earth during that time frame and is similar to the one in march where earth was BETWEEN the sun and elenin. so IF a very large earthquake (say 8.0+) happens between nov 21st and nov 24th we can conclude that elenin is still around. agreed? if NOTHING out of the ordinary happens i concede your point.

my personal opinion is that by that time we'll have had several very large earthquakes as well as several volcanoes going off (REALLY going off, not just puffing up smoke). the 28th is definitely one of the days to keep in mind, as mentioned on the galactic-centre website and the video yiolas posted, but i believe the next alignment with elenin will be no less influential, also in terms of earth (/elenin) directed solar flares and/or CME's. so i suggest we drop the elenin issue for the time being until about 5 weeks hence when we should have definitive proof of whether or not elenin is still around (if the internet is still functioning by that time, that is).

[edit]

i just noticed that there's going to be another alignment on 11/11/11 (elenin-earth-mercury-venus) which should be equally influencial on earth seismicity. more, at any rate, than an aligment of just the three planets with earth at one end. mars, earth and neptune seem to be pretty much aligned as well, and also saturn, elenin and jupiter (almost). exciting times ahead. "one earth please, shaken, not stirred." :o

Why are you guys taking effect of elenin in the alignments? its size is so small that is has no effect what so ever in the planetary alignments. if something happens it will be because of the other planetary bodies not from elenin...

[alxz]

Ill wait for 28:) hopefully on 30th I will get a nice birthday gift from mother earth:)

[phillipbbg]

Keep your eyes on this site for full sets of the Earth being effected ....

http://aslwww.cr.usgs.gov/Seismic_Data/heli2.shtml

THIS IS WHAT YOU ARE WATCHING FOR....then the effects will occur within 24hrs

[Hervé]

Keep your eyes on this site for full sets of the Earth being effected ....

http://aslwww.cr.usgs.gov/Seismic_Data/heli2.shtml

THIS IS WHAT YOU ARE WATCHING FOR....then the effects will occur within 24hrs


Not sure what you are writing about?

These seismograms are the records of the Turkey 7.2 earthquake from all over the planet.

[phillipbbg]

When you see all areas showing major seismic fluctuations like the above image expect a major quake to occur in the world within a short period of time ... it is just giving a warning as such...sorry I assumed the post was self explanatory ... my mistake... :( sorry I tend to write as I think ....oops

[The Truth Is In There]

Why are you guys taking effect of elenin in the alignments? its size is so small that is has no effect what so ever in the planetary alignments. if something happens it will be because of the other planetary bodies not from elenin...

sure mate, despite what your buddies tell you, size doesn't matter. what matters are elenin's electrical charge and its close proximity to the ecliptic. please read what omerbashich has to say about elenin and then try to debunk elenin's effect on earth seismicity. it's not possible to debunk it because all of omerbashich's research is based on facts. apart from that we currently see proof that he's been right about elenin alleviating the severity of earthquakes during recent planetary alignments and now that elenin is moving away from earth there's another uptick. ask the guys in turkey. and then wait for nov 23rd (or thereabouts) where there is no planetary alignment, only the sun, earth and elenin.

[Hervé]

[...]
These seismograms are the records of the Turkey 7.2 earthquake from all over the planet.


??????????????????????????


When you see all areas showing major seismic fluctuations like the above image expect a major quake to occur in the world within a short period of time ...


I.e., the major earthquake has already occurred!


10774
Click on picture to enlarge

[13th Warrior]

Elenin update:

http://www.spaceweather.com/

[Sidney]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBxst8r6SN0



just ran across this curious what anybody has to comment re: this. I have to admit, Jupiter has become very intense compared to other years.

[1159]

Oh-boy ...! here we go again. No sooner has comet elenin fizzled out and we're looking for the next bogey monster.

[RMorgan]

Well, I´m not sure if any planet can be converted into a sun, like he said on the video.

By the way, the video is from 2009, so we certainly would have noticed by now if something was going on with Jupiter.

[WyoSeeker]

Gibberish to me. Crazy people taking any blip on a SOHO screen and fear mongering.

[guido]

;););););););)

[gandra99]

28.10.2011. alignment: Sun - Earth - Jupiter

[ShawnDotFree]

What will be the legacy of the 2011 Elenin experience? In the months and years ahead, will we look back on this whole roller coaster ride any wiser?

[Hervé]

From: http://astroblogger.blogspot.com/2011/10/comet-c2010-x1-remnants-recovered.html



Sunday, October 23, 2011

Comet C/2010 X1 Remnants Recovered.


http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-LcNoFNprlj8/TqPl4jhlvBI/AAAAAAAAEBU/KMYC-kgye-Y/s320/SUM_Result%2Bof%2BG5_Elenin_16-10-1.png (http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-LcNoFNprlj8/TqPl4jhlvBI/AAAAAAAAEBU/KMYC-kgye-Y/s1600/SUM_Result%2Bof%2BG5_Elenin_16-10-1.png)
Where comet Elenin should have been, the faint debris doesn't register of this stack of 5 x 2 minute exposures taken with GRAS-05.

After intense searching for the remnants of comet C/2010 X1 Elenin (http://astroblogger.blogspot.com/2011/04/comet-elenin-faq-for-worried.html), which began to disintegrate back in August (http://astroblogger.blogspot.com/2011/08/comet-elenins-potential-break-up-on.html), there finally appears to be confirmed images of a debris field (that the Moon has waned somewhat probably helps too) .

Images from Rolando Ligustri (https://picasaweb.google.com/astroligu) show a nebulosity stretching along the predicted position of Elenin (https://picasaweb.google.com/107386404051271210368/CometeDiRolandoLigustriCASTItalia#5666296035910135586). Similar nebulosities at the predicted location of Elenin, found at different times (ie the debris field is moving along Elenin's orbital path) are found in these images from Leonid Elein (http://spaceobs.org/images/C2010X1-20111022.gif), Michael Jäger (http://www.cometpieces.at/images/phocagallery/2010x120111023ut0015s4x300w.jpg) , Jakub Cerny (http://smph.kommet.cz/elenin-coadded.png) and Juanjo González Díaz (http://85.152.1.133/astro/2011/c2010x1-3.gif).

The remnants are very faint, for example Rolando needed to stack six X five-minute exposures from a sensitive CCD camera (GRAS-20 (http://wiki.global-rent-a-scope.com/GRAS_Telescopes.ashx)) together to show the dim cloud of material. Scientifically, this is very interesting, we have few examples (http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2000/ast31jul_1m/) where we can follow the debris trail of a disintegrated comet. How long amateurs can follow this faint patch of dust for is unknown, but it will probably continue to fade rapidly. Update: Rolando's latest image (https://picasaweb.google.com/107386404051271210368/CometeDiRolandoLigustriCASTItalia#5666650909338719090) suggests that the remnants are fading fast.

The only people realy disappointed by this is the Doom-sayers, who will no longer be able to terrify people with lies of the scary comet Elenin.

[blufire]

You know I love you guys but I become somewhat amused at all the “tree peeing” going on here. You can’t seem to see the “forest” because of your own “personal opinion tree” you keep marking.

The undeniable fact remains that there was a 7.2 quake in India around the projected alignment . . . . not only that quake but numerous others around the world within a narrow time frame. There were aurora borealis lights far into the south here in the US . . . .as far as Memphis Tennessee . . . . a result from a major solar flare or cme. As well as, major flooding Thailand and Italy is occurring.

SOMETHING caused these significant events!!!

But, it doesn’t really matter WHAT is causing these geophysical events only that they are happening and at an exponential rate as far as magnitude and frequency.

Acknowledgement of truth is the first step into gaining wisdom.

[Hervé]

[...]

SOMETHING caused these significant events!!!

[...]
Acknowledgement of truth is the first step into gaining wisdom.

Yes: the Sun!

[truthseekerdan]

For those that believe we have 'dodged the bullet'... Watch this video presentation, and pray that we'll avoid this coming one too...

YftG3PgY4qM

[yiolas]

Hi TSDan, today was such a lovely day, that yes I thought that in fact we had dodged the bullet. I as well keep up with Nania's videos. Her persistence has to mean something. She does bring up some good points about the date of November 9th. There is so much going on these days, that it's almost impossible to keep up with. Change is definitely in the air. I don't know about you guys, but as the world scene around us changes from day to day, so do my personal circumstances and relationships. Lately, I don't know what each day will bring. It seems that we haven't reached a crescendo yet.
Good Luck and Much Love to everyone.

[truthseekerdan]

Hi TSDan, today was such a lovely day, that yes I thought that in fact we had dodged the bullet. I as well keep up with Nania's videos. Her persistence has to mean something. She does bring up some good points about the date of November 9th. There is so much going on these days, that it's almost impossible to keep up with. Change is definitely in the air. I don't know about you guys, but as the world scene around us changes from day to day, so do my personal circumstances and relationships. Lately, I don't know what each day will bring. It seems that we haven't reached a crescendo yet.
Good Luck and Much Love to everyone.

Hi Yiolas, though I don't follow anyone in particular besides my 'divine intuition within', stumbling upon her video made sense to post it here. After all we're each others teachers and students learning to live by acquiring the wisdom to see things as they really are, without prejudices or biases based on superiority, hatred or delusion.

Namaste ~ Dan

[Bill Ryan]

For those that believe we have 'dodged the bullet'... Watch this video presentation, and pray that we'll avoid this coming one too...

I stopped watching after 29 seconds, when the video claimed that ELE NIN = ELEven NINe = 11/9.

[truthseekerdan]

For those that believe we have 'dodged the bullet'... Watch this video presentation, and pray that we'll avoid this coming one too...

I stopped watching after 29 seconds, when the video claimed that ELE NIN = ELEven NINe = 11/9.

That is your freedom of choice in action, brother Bill. Nobody can force you to watch anything, if it's against your will... :)

F4caLsG6-ZA

[Kronuise]

For those that believe we have 'dodged the bullet'... Watch this video presentation, and pray that we'll avoid this coming one too...

I stopped watching after 29 seconds, when the video claimed that ELE NIN = ELEven NINe = 11/9.


Bill you must get so disheartened by looking at the numerous posts by people jumping to conclusions based on ill-founded proof and dare I say YouTube videos!

When you had the vision to start an on line community for likeminded & enlightened individuals to share their thoughts, ideas & research did you ever envisage this would be the result?

I was misguided enough to think that as soon as this elenin mania was over we could get back to the real ethos of what this forum was originally set up to do but reading posts like this makes my heart sink.

I feel for you Bill I really do.

[efields]

It's Melancholia.....See it!!!

[Bill Ryan]

For those that believe we have 'dodged the bullet'... Watch this video presentation, and pray that we'll avoid this coming one too...

I stopped watching after 29 seconds, when the video claimed that ELE NIN = ELEven NINe = 11/9.

Bill you must get so disheartened by looking at the numerous posts by people jumping to conclusions based on ill-founded proof and dare I say YouTube videos!

When you had the vision to start an on line community for likeminded & enlightened individuals to share their thoughts, ideas & research did you ever envisage this would be the result?

I was misguided enough to think that as soon as this elenin mania was over we could get back to the real ethos of what this forum was originally set up to do but reading posts like this makes my heart sink.

I feel for you Bill I really do.

Thanks for your very perceptive post. Yes, I do get disheartened sometimes.

Many YouTube videos are made by people with rather more enthusiasm than scientific training or basic let's-look-at-all-the-evidence rationality. The entire Elenin fiasco (not to mention 28 October, and -- soon coming and passing, I'm glad to say -- 11/11/11) has been a massive misdirect of the time and attention of millions of people away from the actual, important issues.

Benjamin Fulford has not helped us one bit with his extreme and unprovable claims that are leaped on a little too soon by those desperate to hear good news. I've lost count of the number of people who've approached me personally in the last month to ask my view on his claims. (I reply tactfully and graciously that Fulford is well-intentioned but frequently and deliberately misinformed -- and those I'm talking with almost always nod sagely and agree. The problem is always that they wanted to believe it was all true.)

The White Hat Reports (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?33410-White-Hat-Report-31) can also be discounted: anyone referring to the long-awaited, mythical 'settlements' is merely taking their readers for another fantastical journey that has nothing to do with reality. The NESARA 'settlements' do not exist except in the pages of Rumor Mill News. (http://rumormillnews.com) You can quote that from me anywhere, including to Kerry -- who is brave, determined, impeccably intentioned, and sometimes a little too credulous.

And no, there's not been any splitting into "Two Earths". Nobody's loved ones, buddies, neighbors, or pets are suddenly going to disappear. You can quote that to Inelia, who should have known better (she was influenced by Lucia Rene) -- and reference to her my explanation here:

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?29557-Spaceship-Earth-and-YOU-are-the-captain.&p=301587&viewfull=1#post301587

[Metaphysical interlude: Our higher selves can certainly 'birth' and 'parent' more than one personal 'soul' identity at this Games level -- and maybe also multiple version-copies of you on more than one timeline, simultaneously experiencing different realities. In this way, each of us may be like just one finger on our own 'real' hand. But this is not connected with or related to the 'Two Earths' idea.]

There'll be no sudden 'rapture' or 'ascension' which gets us off our own karmic hook. We all have a great deal to do before we're each truly free of our own past and everything we've all done which has contributed to creating the world as it is. We should all beware of claimed quick-and-easy solutions. There are none -- on a global scale.

With personal dedication, one can personally get out of the web, to a substantial extent, in one lifetime -- but it may take a couple of decades of committed practice. Those who are doing this personal work are all helping to 'raise the vibration of the planet': Inelia is quite correct about this.

Has an important tipping point been reached? Yes, it's quite possible. But the transformation of Planet Earth, and its 7 billion beleaguered citizens, is still no easy mountain to climb. It's far harder than Mount Everest: this is the Olympus Mons (http://www.universetoday.com/14849/olympus-mons-on-mars) of all ascents. It's extraordinarily challenging and complex... and I'm sure this is why you -- reading this -- are here.

We have hard work before us that will take several generations. This has always been obvious to me, and I've always maintained this. And I'm optimistic. But only in the long-term. I've been more than disappointed by many in the alternative community this year. I honestly can hardly wait till we get to 1 January, 2013.

Timelines have changed (since the late 1980s, there's definitely been a steady divergence away from what so many people were 'expecting') -- and consciousness is gradually increasing. It will continue to increase worldwide during the next decade. As Inelia says, just hold your space, be positive in all you do -- and be aware of all your choices. :)

[passiglight]

Personally i find a lot of what follows to be very noteworthy,,,,,,,,

rUlYE_tbuAw

http://youtu.be/rUlYE_tbuAw


energy as love

[Carmody]

...... .. ..

We have hard work before us that will take several generations. This has always been obvious to me, and I've always maintained this. And I'm optimistic. But only in the long-term. I've been more than disappointed by many in the alternative community this year. I honestly can hardly wait till we get to 1 January, 2013.

Timelines have changed (since the late 1980s, there's definitely been a steady divergence away from what so many people were 'expecting') -- and consciousness is gradually increasing. It will continue to increase worldwide during the next decade. As Inelia says, just hold your space, be positive in all you do -- and be aware of all your choices. :)

I think they may have gone through the given standard psychological hurdles in a given 'area' of (passage of) time.

For example, the finding of the hangnail of realty, then the chewing it off, the pain of finding more..then the search for a solution.

Then the human mechanism looking for the easy way out, the first thing that pulls it out of the given quicksand, stew, boiling pot, or however one may wish to express it.

I believe the ratio 'of those who look for the deeper aspects of the given subject -vs- the folks who search for the simple direct answer, in their ignorance of such depths', is the same as it has always been.

The difference here, being that the 'thing' they are moving toward is the actual relief of their given human ignorance. THE original and deepest problem source of all issues, is the actual issue on the table.

Which, due to the standard psychological response pattern, is going to naturally take a circuitous route to this slow rolling 'mass enlightenment'.

The trick, while wandering and gaming here and there.... is to not pick up too many plush toys of illegitimate representation, while journeying on the way to the doors of the playground.... where the din and noise ends ...and clarity can be found via rumination and reflection.

To understand that both the good and the bad will hawk untenable solutions on and in a scenario that engages the human tactic of willful ignorance in complex situations, this is key to understanding the length of time it is going to take.

This is not about a solution to a problem but the solution to the ignorance that brings about all problems. This ignorance is a base psychological issue of the human edifice, an edifice that has many self (ego/edifice cross confusion and self identification) protection mechanisms (for the egoic duality system) buried under the given human 'conciseness' 'hood' (of the given avatar vehicle), and thus the levels of entrapment and self delusion outstrips normal 'problem-reaction-solution' scenarios by a few magnitudes, at minimum.

What I'm saying is that the complexity of the issue is logically small but the stubbornness of the being inside to externalize the issue ----is as big as the life itself (both individually and collectively), as big as the one(s) attempting to break the logjam.

Thus many false paths can be and will be projected by both internal and external forces, this, regarding what the individual and thus the collective sees and involves themselves with.

[Hervé]

Here is the crux and depth of the "problem" to resolve:


jorr, thank you for posting that video!

As he keeps repeating: it doesn't matter anymore if you shower them with documented facts... they won't believe you anyway! There's your answer Siberia9 and Seikou... just demonstrating that it doesn't matter any longer.

The "in your face" not even hiding in "plain sight" anymore.

His statements finally gave me the clue as to what was happening, for example since it works at all scale, on the Elenin threads:


Exposure to true information does not matter anymore: A person who is demoralized is unable to assess true information.

The facts tell nothing to him. Even if I shower him with informations [which are] authentic, true, with documents, with pictures [...] he will refuse to believe it.

That's the tragedy of the demoralization [step].

It gives the rationale behind all these Doom & Gloom propaganda from all corners that have been going on for so long... and no amount of actual facts could deter the believers... indicative of their state of mind!

The Rockefeller funded Russian "revolution" has been at it for a long time... ever read this booklet: The Soviet Art of Brainwashing (http://www.scribd.com/doc/7680588/The-Soviet-Art-of-Brainwashing)?

This also provides an explanation as to why the likes of Alex Jones, David Ickes or Bill Deagle are still alive since, first, it doesn't matter anymore, second, their data still further the doom & gloom and, third, they gather in their wakes the ones to be targetted for further demoralization...

Since no amount of real, actual facts have any bearing on changing this planned, intended situation... there isn't much left in term of solution except the one advocated by Bill and Inelia: the raising of individual vibration (see this page (http://www.whale.to/v/tone.html) for why that would work).

Here is the video originally posted by jorr:


jMWVUoYNezU

[truthseekerdan]

Many YouTube videos are made by people with rather more enthusiasm than scientific training or basic let's-look-at-all-the-evidence rationality. The entire Elenin fiasco (not to mention 28 October, and -- soon coming and passing, I'm glad to say -- 11/11/11) has been a massive misdirect of the time and attention of millions of people away from the actual, important issues.



Hello Bill, :)

With all due respect, would you care to elaborate what are to you the "actual important issues"? (you don't have to include the Charles saga) ;) Thank you in anticipation!

On a different note I would like to remind everyone here that we're all playing a 'holographic game' of duality that only exists in our minds (brain) -- therefore anything can happen 'suddenly' when one is least expected. Yes, this is a fact... :nod:

gIzZuuRpd6k

Much Love to you and All :hug:

[Bill Ryan]

Many YouTube videos are made by people with rather more enthusiasm than scientific training or basic let's-look-at-all-the-evidence rationality. The entire Elenin fiasco (not to mention 28 October, and -- soon coming and passing, I'm glad to say -- 11/11/11) has been a massive misdirect of the time and attention of millions of people away from the actual, important issues.


Hello Bill, :)
With all due respect, would you care to elaborate what are to you the "actual important issues"?

Here's the opening paragraph of Thom Hartmann’s masterwork, The Last Hours of Ancient Sunlight: (http://www.amazon.com/Last-Hours-Ancient-Sunlight-Revised/dp/1400051576)



In the 24 hours since this time yesterday, over 200,000 acres of rainforest have been destroyed in our world. Fully 13 million tons of toxic chemicals have been released into our environment. Over 45,000 people have died of starvation, 38,000 of them children. And more than 130 plant or animal species have been driven to extinction by the actions of humans. (The last time there was such a rapid loss of species was when the dinosaurs vanished.) And all this just since yesterday.
In addition, between next month and mid-2012 there's likely to be major financial instability at best (or something that would make 1929 pale in comparison, at worst) --

(read http://projectavalon.net/Aftershock_unpublished_chapter.pdf)

and the real possibility of major solar activity in 2013 that might bring down the grid in significant parts of the world, at best -- or throw many of us all temporarily into the Stone Age for a number of months, at worst.

(read http://projectcamelot.org/electrical_engineer.html)

Meanwhile, consciousness and awareness on the planet will continue to expand -- slowly but surely. Nothing instant will happen: just a gradually building wave of awareness, responsibility and demand for change.

And in the meantime, the controllers may not give up their many thousands of years of extreme hegemony all that willingly. Interesting times lie ahead.

No easy way out -- just a wild ride, maybe getting wilder, and as interesting as it comes. That's why this planet is the subject of so much attention.

All best wishes, Bill

[learninglight]

No easy way out -- just a wild ride, maybe getting wilder, and as interesting as it comes. That's why this planet is the subject of so much attention.

All best wishes, Bill

Hi Bill...Thank you for your input most interesting

Just 1 queation....This planet is the subjuect of so much attention from whom?

much love

[Bill Ryan]

-------

A personal PS to the above. I was privileged today to share lunch with Seth Beaudreau, who showed those present round the table a slideshow of some of his photos taken throughout North America. We were spellbound.

http://photosbyseth.com/landscape/index.html

This planet is a marvelous, magical place. It's a jewel in the cosmos -- literally. We're trashing it mercilessly. If we do not find or create a way to prevent this, we will lose it all.

[yiolas]

Breathtaking photos Bill ! Thank-you for bringing it down close and personal.

[Bill Ryan]

Just 1 question....This planet is the subject of so much attention from whom?


1) Extraterrestrial beings (some very powerful) -- both positive and negative.

Some of these groups and races have resources and abilities "indistinguishable from magic" (Arthur C. Clarke quote). Some of these have interacted openly with us in earlier times and were considered to be 'gods' by previous civilizations.

Some are very much on our side. Others are absolutely not. Some are just observing. Others are waiting for legitimate opportunities.

Those not on our side have been interfering and negotiating with those in power on Planet Earth, often tricking them in the process.

Those on our side are supporting in every way that is ethical -- including incarnating as humans.

2) Discarnate astral beings (some very powerful) -- both positive and negative.

Some of these are extremely ancient -- and, again, and have been perceived as 'gods' by previous civilizations. Again, some are very much on our side. Others are absolutely not.

Those not on our side are overtly interfering: sometimes using direct negative intervention, and sometimes using subtle trickery and deception (e.g. using channeled messages and other forms of persuasive communication which are believed by the uninformed).

Those on our side are supporting in every way that is ethical -- including incarnating as humans.

That's the set-up. The prize is the freedom or enslavement of humanity.

[blufire]

You know Bill the type of posts you have made today on this thread used to throw me into a state of . .. . . “What in the blue blazes do I do with this information” and quite frankly a mild to moderate state of panic.

Everything you have posted today makes complete sense to me and sits fairly solid. Except maybe the discarnate astral and extraterrestrial beings post. I do believe you and I can “feel” that these battles and conflicts are taking place when I “push” . . . . .but I stop there, simply because I don’t have the knowledge yet on what to do with or about these beings that are here with us and influencing our past, present and future.

I even came to the stark realization this afternoon quite literally while “chopping wood and carrying water” that I have changed my timeline. My timeline change although “may” not be the metaphysical change that is spoken of here on PA but by making very dramatic changes in my lifestyle and way of thinking and reasoning I can see how this will very much alter my timeline and therefore those around me.

The coming financial collapse, solar grid destroying flares, out of control “controllers” and even our increasing extreme geophysical events will have an effect on my life but on a much much smaller scale and I feel mostly manageable within my “new timeline”
Haven’t figured out the astral and extraterrestrial thing yet . . . but I’m listening on a much deeper level than ever before.

I have even rediscovered my mission or job that I signed up for before coming back to this “blue jewel”. I have returned to the Appalachian Mountains to live the rest of my years and while I have a breath in my soul I will be quietly fighting the raping of these mountains by the coal, gas and logging industries and to do what I can to take care of the people that have also been abused by these conglomerates. Also my quest is to meld the “old ways” with new technology such as using the rivers that run through these hills for hydroelectric power . . . . free to everyone. I’m rolling up my sleeves and getting to work as you have said many times and I have listened and heard you.

This is not Vilcabamba . . . but when I read the thread about your new life in Peru I can’t help but see some very striking similarities, right down to being very careful with forming a relationship with the locals and their very established way of life. So if there is anyone out there that can’t make it to Peru there are places right here in the U.S.

I know I’m somewhat of a rebel here on PA and I find myself apologizing quite a bit for my contrary ways. But I do read diligently and ponder always everything you and certain other members I have come to respect greatly. And it is because of you and others and the vast amount of material you’ve made available that I have been able to begin to metamorphosis.

I want to thank you deeply for always being patient and for gently redirecting and guiding us. And even for the occasional “smack on the back of the head”. I know many things you say and do are carefully cloaked so at the point we are “ready to hear” and assimilate the info and wisdom we can do so fully.

In closing I would like to say isn’t beautiful and incredibly peaceful when you finally find yourself home?

[Bill Ryan]

You know Bill the type of posts you have made today on this thread used to throw me into a state of . .. . . “What in the blue blazes do I do with this information” and quite frankly a mild to moderate state of panic.

Everything you have posted today makes complete sense to me and sits fairly solid. Except maybe the discarnate astral and extraterrestrial beings post. I do believe you and I can “feel” that these battles and conflicts are taking place when I “push” . . . . .but I stop there, simply because I don’t have the knowledge yet on what to do with or about these beings that are here with us and influencing our past, present and future.

I even came to the stark realization this afternoon quite literally while “chopping wood and carrying water” that I have changed my timeline. My timeline change although “may” not be the metaphysical change that is spoken of here on PA but by making very dramatic changes in my lifestyle and way of thinking and reasoning I can see how this will very much alter my timeline and therefore those around me.

The coming financial collapse, solar grid destroying flares, out of control “controllers” and even our increasing extreme geophysical events will have an effect on my life but on a much much smaller scale and I feel mostly manageable within my “new timeline”
Haven’t figured out the astral and extraterrestrial thing yet . . . but I’m listening on a much deeper level than ever before.

I have even rediscovered my mission or job that I signed up for before coming back to this “blue jewel”. I have returned to the Appalachian Mountains to live the rest of my years and while I have a breath in my soul I will be quietly fighting the raping of these mountains by the coal, gas and logging industries and to do what I can to take care of the people that have also been abused by these conglomerates. Also my quest is to meld the “old ways” with new technology such as using the rivers that run through these hills for hydroelectric power . . . . free to everyone. I’m rolling up my sleeves and getting to work as you have said many times and I have listened and heard you.

This is not Vilcabamba . . . but when I read the thread about your new life in Peru I can’t help but see some very striking similarities, right down to being very careful with forming a relationship with the locals and their very established way of life. So if there is anyone out there that can’t make it to Peru there are places right here in the U.S.

I know I’m somewhat of a rebel here on PA and I find myself apologizing quite a bit for my contrary ways. But I do read diligently and ponder always everything you and certain other members I have come to respect greatly. And it is because of you and others and the vast amount of material you’ve made available that I have been able to begin to metamorphosis.

I want to thank you deeply for always being patient and for gently redirecting and guiding us. And even for the occasional “smack on the back of the head”. I know many things you say and do are carefully cloaked so at the point we are “ready to hear” and assimilate the info and wisdom we can do so fully.

In closing I would like to say isn’t beautiful and incredibly peaceful when you finally find yourself home?

Thank you so much for this very wonderful post.

To further underscore what I'm trying to say: listen to this 7-minute extract from a radio interview Alex Merklinger did with William Pawalec back in early 2004. It says it all.

http://projectavalon.net/Alex_Merklinger_with_William_Pawelec_2004.mp3 (http://projectavalon.net/Alex_Merklinger_with_William_Pawelec_2004.mp3)

http://reinep.files.wordpress.com/2011/09/william-pawelec.jpg?w=575&h=316

For the record: Bill Pawelec, who died of cancer in May 2007, is an 100% authentic whistleblower and is the one person (maybe apart from Bill Cooper and Arthur C. Clarke!) I'd absolutely love to have interviewed before he left us. He knew a huge amount, and was an extremely fine man.

[ThePythonicCow]

In addition, between next month and mid-2012 there's likely to be major financial instability at best (or something that would make 1929 pale in comparison, at worst) --

(read http://projectavalon.net/Aftershock_unpublished_chapter.pdf)


The authors of Aftershock: Protect Yourself and Profit in the Next Global Financial Meltdown (2009) (http://amzn.com/0470481560), Robert Wiedemer, David Wiedemer, and Cindy Spitzer previously worked with Eric Janszen to publish America's Bubble Economy: Profit When It Pops (2004) (http://amzn.com/047175367X). Then Eric Janszen went his separate ways, re-opening iTulip.com, a financial and economic analysis website that I have followed since 2008. The Wiedemer's are better writers; Eric is the more diligent analyst and researcher.

Both are missing, in my view, the essential dynamic at play here. In our current monetary system, money is created by issuing debt. As I recently wrote on iTulip.com (here (http://www.itulip.com/forums/showthread.php/20639-Essential-Trends-Part-I-B-Gold-in-an-Era-of-Global-Monetary-System-Regime-Change-Eric-Janszen?p=212567#post212567)):
The basic goal of the most powerful on this planet seems to be the same in every country:
get it sufficiently corrupted that they can control its media, government, schools, churches, economy, health, food and as necessary, individuals, and
get it sufficiently indebted that it can lay claim to owning all property and a portion of all income and tax revenue streams, in perpetuity.
Debt is now being piled up higher and deeper on the Federal Reserve and US Treasury balance sheets, on the way to foreclosing on them.

The best presentation of my views that I've seen is from Pastor Lindsey Williams. See my Post #10 on the "Lindsey Williams - Jeff Rense 13 October 2011" thread (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?32705-Lindsey-Williams-Jeff-Rense-13-October-2011&p=343460&viewfull=1#post343460) for a lengthier explanation.

[David Topí]

Everything you have posted today makes complete sense to me and sits fairly solid. Except maybe the discarnate astral and extraterrestrial beings post. I do believe you and I can “feel” that these battles and conflicts are taking place when I “push” . . . . .but I stop there, simply because I don’t have the knowledge yet on what to do with or about these beings that are here with us and influencing our past, present and future.



Just to say, I deal with them on a daily basis: negative astral entities /4D /5D entities, they attach to our auras mostly, or create links/hook to feed our energy. Not science fiction, we are actually pretty much "property" and an energy feeding farm for them. They appear when do you healings, on different modalities, and at the end, you develop knowledge and some experience about that.

So what Bill says, yeah, we are pretty much influenced not by only 3D offplanet entities, but a lot of "hiper-dimensional" beings (to say something) that look at us the same way we look at our food.

[blufire]

Thank you again Bill for yet another gentle nudge. This short clip was very much an affirmation and validation to what I am doing and my foundational belief on what I feel is taking place on a global scale.

The fact this conversation took place in 2004 and his mention that the financial vice grips could begin in 2008 was astounding.

I would encourage everyone to listen to this clip and the information Paul gave us in his post as well. Bill and Paul have given us (yet again) solid information to what is truly happening, as well as, clues and wisdom on how to move forward effectively and with purpose.

A bit of a carrot . . . . In this 7 minute clip Bill Pawelec talks quite a bit about Planet X




You know Bill the type of posts you have made today on this thread used to throw me into a state of . .. . . “What in the blue blazes do I do with this information” and quite frankly a mild to moderate state of panic.

Everything you have posted today makes complete sense to me and sits fairly solid. Except maybe the discarnate astral and extraterrestrial beings post. I do believe you and I can “feel” that these battles and conflicts are taking place when I “push” . . . . .but I stop there, simply because I don’t have the knowledge yet on what to do with or about these beings that are here with us and influencing our past, present and future.

I even came to the stark realization this afternoon quite literally while “chopping wood and carrying water” that I have changed my timeline. My timeline change although “may” not be the metaphysical change that is spoken of here on PA but by making very dramatic changes in my lifestyle and way of thinking and reasoning I can see how this will very much alter my timeline and therefore those around me.

The coming financial collapse, solar grid destroying flares, out of control “controllers” and even our increasing extreme geophysical events will have an effect on my life but on a much much smaller scale and I feel mostly manageable within my “new timeline”
Haven’t figured out the astral and extraterrestrial thing yet . . . but I’m listening on a much deeper level than ever before.

I have even rediscovered my mission or job that I signed up for before coming back to this “blue jewel”. I have returned to the Appalachian Mountains to live the rest of my years and while I have a breath in my soul I will be quietly fighting the raping of these mountains by the coal, gas and logging industries and to do what I can to take care of the people that have also been abused by these conglomerates. Also my quest is to meld the “old ways” with new technology such as using the rivers that run through these hills for hydroelectric power . . . . free to everyone. I’m rolling up my sleeves and getting to work as you have said many times and I have listened and heard you.

This is not Vilcabamba . . . but when I read the thread about your new life in Peru I can’t help but see some very striking similarities, right down to being very careful with forming a relationship with the locals and their very established way of life. So if there is anyone out there that can’t make it to Peru there are places right here in the U.S.

I know I’m somewhat of a rebel here on PA and I find myself apologizing quite a bit for my contrary ways. But I do read diligently and ponder always everything you and certain other members I have come to respect greatly. And it is because of you and others and the vast amount of material you’ve made available that I have been able to begin to metamorphosis.

I want to thank you deeply for always being patient and for gently redirecting and guiding us. And even for the occasional “smack on the back of the head”. I know many things you say and do are carefully cloaked so at the point we are “ready to hear” and assimilate the info and wisdom we can do so fully.

In closing I would like to say isn’t beautiful and incredibly peaceful when you finally find yourself home?

Thank you so much for this very wonderful post.

To further underscore what I'm trying to say: listen to this 7-minute extract from a radio interview Alex Merklinger did with William Pawalec back in early 2004. It says it all.

http://projectavalon.net/Alex_Merklinger_with_William_Pawelec_2004.mp3 (http://projectavalon.net/Alex_Merklinger_with_William_Pawelec_2004.mp3)

http://reinep.files.wordpress.com/2011/09/william-pawelec.jpg?w=575&h=316

For the record: Bill Pawelec, who died of cancer in May 2007, is an 100% authentic whistleblower and is the one person (maybe apart from Bill Cooper and Arthur C. Clarke!) I'd absolutely love to have interviewed before he left us. He knew a huge amount, and was an extremely fine man.

[Sidney]

Many YouTube videos are made by people with rather more enthusiasm than scientific training or basic let's-look-at-all-the-evidence rationality. The entire Elenin fiasco (not to mention 28 October, and -- soon coming and passing, I'm glad to say -- 11/11/11) has been a massive misdirect of the time and attention of millions of people away from the actual, important issues.


Hello Bill, :)
With all due respect, would you care to elaborate what are to you the "actual important issues"?

Here's the opening paragraph of Thom Hartmann’s masterwork, The Last Hours of Ancient Sunlight: (http://www.amazon.com/Last-Hours-Ancient-Sunlight-Revised/dp/1400051576)



In the 24 hours since this time yesterday, over 200,000 acres of rainforest have been destroyed in our world. Fully 13 million tons of toxic chemicals have been released into our environment. Over 45,000 people have died of starvation, 38,000 of them children. And more than 130 plant or animal species have been driven to extinction by the actions of humans. (The last time there was such a rapid loss of species was when the dinosaurs vanished.) And all this just since yesterday.
In addition, between next month and mid-2012 there's likely to be major financial instability at best (or something that would make 1929 pale in comparison, at worst) --

(read http://projectavalon.net/Aftershock_unpublished_chapter.pdf)

and the real possibility of major solar activity in 2013 that might bring down the grid in significant parts of the world, at best -- or throw many of us all temporarily into the Stone Age for a number of months, at worst.

(read http://projectcamelot.org/electrical_engineer.html)

Meanwhile, consciousness and awareness on the planet will continue to expand -- slowly but surely. Nothing instant will happen: just a gradually building wave of awareness, responsibility and demand for change.

And in the meantime, the controllers may not give up their many thousands of years of extreme hegemony all that willingly. Interesting times lie ahead.

No easy way out -- just a wild ride, maybe getting wilder, and as interesting as it comes. That's why this planet is the subject of so much attention.

All best wishes, Bill


Thank you for reminding us of the horrendous statistics. 24 hours. That truly brought me to tears.

[DevilPigeon]

-----

Not related to the topic (sorry!), but when writing using blue text (or any other funky colour, eg red), against the slate/grey background colour of the Gaian Night theme, it's very difficult to read.... I hate to say it, but I generally skip past those posts

MODS - is there a plugin or something that can change the colour of the foreground text dependant on the background colour being used?

[MiguelQ]

-----

Not related to the topic (sorry!), but when writing using blue text (or any other funky colour, eg red), against the slate/grey background colour of the Gaian Night theme, it's very difficult to read.... I hate to say it, but I generally skip past those posts

MODS - is there a plugin or something that can change the colour of the foreground text dependant on the background colour being used?

Hey, I was thinking exactly the sadness thing.
its bad to the eye.
And as a programmer my self I was thinking ... What kind of code could solve that.

[jp11]

DevilPigeon,

Off topic too...but I was thinking exactly the opposite. I love the blue that blufire used as well as some of the other colors used. After reading the colored font, the normal gray font seems dull in comparison. :o

[blufire]

Good grief guys . . . . you know us women we have to “pretty things” up a bit. I use the blue font obviously because of my avatar and I personally like the color blue.

Granted I know nothing about computer codes and the like . . . . but . . . . maybe a simple solution would be to do what I do when I can’t read certain fonts or colors.
Which is “highlight” the text as you would when “cutting and pasting”.

Or is this too simplistic and pragmatic of an approach??? ;)

P.S. Notice I left the font black just for you guys.





-----

Not related to the topic (sorry!), but when writing using blue text (or any other funky colour, eg red), against the slate/grey background colour of the Gaian Night theme, it's very difficult to read.... I hate to say it, but I generally skip past those posts

MODS - is there a plugin or something that can change the colour of the foreground text dependant on the background colour being used?

Hey, I was thinking exactly the sadness thing.
its bad to the eye.
And as a programmer my self I was thinking ... What kind of code could solve that.

[DevilPigeon]

-----

From what I can see, there are only 3 theme options, and they can't be customised. For me, Gaian Night is the best by a country mile, Avalon Night is similar, but Avalon Breeze (with its bright white background) is just too painful on the eye (although jp11, I must admit the blue font does look darn good! :))

It's interesting that the font colour - if left at its default when composing a post - changes depending on the background colour, ie black font against white background, white font against the other 2... But this is for the default font colour only as I can see.

This probably isn't best discussed here (thread hijacking), although it was as a result of an earlier post. I'll also post in the 'forum suggestions' forum as well, so MODS feel free to move these last few posts if you so wish.

[DevilPigeon]

Good grief guys . . . . you know us women we have to “pretty things” up a bit. I use the blue font obviously because of my avatar and I personally like the color blue.

Granted I know nothing about computer codes and the like . . . . but . . . . maybe a simple solution would be to do what I do when I can’t read certain fonts or colors.
Which is “highlight” the text as you would when “cutting and pasting”.

Or is this too simplistic and pragmatic of an approach??? ;)

P.S. Notice I left the font black just for you guys.





-----

Not related to the topic (sorry!), but when writing using blue text (or any other funky colour, eg red), against the slate/grey background colour of the Gaian Night theme, it's very difficult to read.... I hate to say it, but I generally skip past those posts

MODS - is there a plugin or something that can change the colour of the foreground text dependant on the background colour being used?

Hey, I was thinking exactly the sadness thing.
its bad to the eye.
And as a programmer my self I was thinking ... What kind of code could solve that.

:thumb: coolio...!!!

I know it's probably petty, especially when there's so much crap happening in the world, if there's no easy solution I'll change to Avalon Breeze and live with it. I don't like skipping posts, and yes I agree that highlighting the entire text may be a workaround so I'll give that a go too... Although it's not easy to do with the mousepad on the laptop (there are no "buttons" - the "buttons" are integrated as part of the touch surface.)

Update - I've switched to Avalon Breeze :p, but turned the monitor's brightness down from "nuclear" to "slightly less nuclear" :thumb:

[Snowbird]

blufire and DP, I fully understand both sides of this issue. As I was learning which color worked best, I would test it against each background setting. I also found that the royalblue-bolded seems to be read by all....at least, I haven't heard any more complaints.:thumb:

[ThePythonicCow]

MODS - is there a plugin or something that can change the colour of the foreground text dependant on the background colour being used?
Excellent question, DevilPigeon!

We've started a new thread to discuss this (right next to the one you started), over at Post formatting, color and bold fonts, and viewing themes (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?33653-Post-formatting-color-and-bold-fonts-and-viewing-themes).

[jackovesk]

NASA Lunar Science Institute senior scientist David Morrison speaks about the Truth of Nibiru

1TIy-t48uU0

HQqn-zZzbLw

[Lord Sidious]

Just seen the first video.
Very, very well done.
He is saying that if it were to arrive in December 2012, we would be able to see it already.
Whilst this is true, who linked it to that date?
What if it were to arrive a lot later?
Then his observations would not be accurate.
And as for there being no Planet X, gimme a break.
There are anomalies that can't be explained without the presence of some type of mass exerting its' own gravity on the solar system.
Typical spin, sounds good, but full of misstatements.

[Healthy Skeptic]

AbgHyrmgRZM

According to Bob Dean, at about 1:39:25 in the above interview, 2017 may be the time for Nibiru's appearance.

[nearing]

I am tired of the mocking.

Bill, the problems you speak of have been problems for a good many years now and we are no closer to a real solution than we were when Thom wrote that book. I don't know what it will take to help rally everyone together to come to a solution but human history has shown they don't rise to the occasion until a major crsis happens.

However much our Consciousness is rising, a crisis of enormous magnitude is most likely what is needed. Perhaps this is why some of us look to ancient writings of cyclical events for HOPE.

[Bongo]

just watched the top video & when he said nibiru wasn't real I could feel my pineal gland working... lol

me thinks the man is tellin porkies... lol

[Draco]

also i think David Icke might have mention about how NASA is full of left over Nazi wouldn't trust Nasa as far as i could kick em

[Mu2143]

N ever
A
S trait
A nswer

[Healthy Skeptic]

just watched the top video & when he said nibiru wasn't real I could feel my pineal gland working... lol

me thinks the man is tellin porkies... lol

Whereabouts in the Interview was that??

[1159]

David Morrison holds his lips in too much. If he was selling me a car, I wouldn't buy it, he's pulling those words back in, in other words retracting his speech through body language. That's not to say, he is lying, but he used definitives like "can't happen/ impossible/ will never ..." in a way that a real scientist would find uncomfortable. Such certainties indicate entrenchment into a scientific paradigm that is beyond further enlightenment. That is pretty typical of the established scientific community anyway.

Having said all that, the alternative community's version of events for comet elenin was atrocious and has since proved to be mainly hype and speculation. Before we point the finger at NASA for keeping us in the dark, maybe we should examine ourselves as an alternative news source for some serious propaganda gaffs that cause nothing but fear and disolusionment for many.

[Bongo]

just watched the top video & when he said nibiru wasn't real I could feel my pineal gland working... lol

me thinks the man is tellin porkies... lol

Whereabouts in the Interview was that??

in the first 30 seconds, he says he got a letter from a little girl asking to explain why nibiru isn't real... then he explains from nasa's official standpoint why nibiru isn't real in the rest of the video

[mojo]

Interesting if Pane Andov is right we're missing any discussion on the so-called energy wave that may pass through by the end of 2012 and doesn't NASA already have proof of this with their x-ray telescope?

[thegodsmakethecircles]

hAV3dntJTeM

[Tony]

Perhaps it means a meeting of minds!

[KosmicKat]

ONOZ! First off, peeps, prove to me that (a) Nibiru is a large astronomical body now within the solar system and (b) that it has been tracked for long enough to project a collision course. Thank you.

[Xenos]

I don't think that Nibiru and Earth will collid, because the sumerian doesn't mention that.

The sumerian says that Nibiru is so big, that normally we should already see it, feel it and not only little earthquake localised, but all over Earth. For me the difference is huge.

The crop circle is a symbol and we can see almost what we want in it. For exemple, why not a dimensional connection, like humanity is coming from a dimensional process and our body has been put on a planet far, but so close in fact :) Just behind :) They are maybe already looking at you, taking note and the "grey" (all of them) are part of the show and sociologic behaviour are examin like we examine how monkey behave, or rats between them. Why not ? Human arrogance take a blow lol in a materialist way of seeing life :)

[vibrations]

The title of the thread is a bit exaggerated I think. To me it looks like when I see the square the symbolism is that all the corners of the Universe are attacking us or something. Would be really nice if the title would be more explained. From the video you can't conclude anything.

And about the trillion times repeated Nibiru stuff, I wrote it here quite a few times, but the information which is not sensationalistic just doesn't interest. So, be it.

[jorr lundstrom]

This video is from 1992. We wont fall for this. You better try something

better if you are trying to provoke fear. LOL

http://i600.photobucket.com/albums/tt81/sakasvattaja/Babajimparaply.jpg

[DevilPigeon]

-----

Er, no it doesn't. I for one am getting a little tired of all the headlining/sensationalist/"my mate who lives 3 doors down from the second cousin of a hairdresser of a top Rothschild banker says so..." crap bandied about currently. Wishful thinking is one thing, hope is another... But sheesh...

[EileenCookies]

Well they (the annuki), didn't like us much, did they? to project this onto us. Avoid their discussions (is my motto).

[Ruby L.]

You've already started a thread a few days ago with the same exact video:
http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?33231-Crop-Circle-Message-Says-its-From-Anunnaki---&p=339579#post339579

And have also embedded the same video within other threads about five times.

?????

[ThePythonicCow]

You've already started a thread a few days ago with the same exact video:
Thanks for noticing this.

thegodsmakethecircles posted one Youtube video here five times, and another six times. Her posts here, and on two other sites that we identified as the same person, are exclusively devoted to linking and uploading repeatedly the same handful of doom & gloom disinformation Annunaki/NWO/... Youtube videos, without any useful comments or discussion. For this, and another (serious) reason not visible on the public forum, she is no longer a member here.

[Heyoka_11]

For this, and another (serious) reason not visible on the public forum, she is no longer a member here.

Well done Paul!

I was going to ask why you did not simply remove the thread entirely, but at least it serves as a reminder for others of what to expect when this kind of crap finds it's way onto Avalon.

Thank you :)

[ThePythonicCow]

I was going to ask why you did not simply remove the thread entirely
Deleted threads tend to raise the fear level amongst some members. Absence of information as to the cause of deletion is partially replaced with fears that the mods are "censoring" (one of those loaded words), or fears that "their post might be next".

[Ultima Thule]

Good call Paul! I appreciate greatly the effort of you and all the mods, that is worth saying to raise the frequency of this thread!!!!
Actually that is worth saying in any case :clap2:
UT

[Sidney]

8EidCgyytVQ

Informative video.. If you watch to the end he guides you to a forum where you can communicate with these astronomers and share pics and videos etc.

[Bill Ryan]

-------

Just watched the video with great interest. This is a very smart guy, well-informed and thinking like an out-of-the-box creative scientist. He's making hypotheses which can be tested, and is inviting others to check them out with observations.

He may be right or wrong (we'll see! :) ) -- but he's not crazy. I'll be keeping a track on his research over the next few months.

[Sidney]

Hi Bill, Thank you for that!! It also perked my interest that his colleagues have been threatened, so that tells me they may be on to something.

[Hervé]

A note of clarification on his "global earthquake" spiel, there is no such a thing as far as I know since that would mean the whole Earth's crust in every and each of its points would be an earthquake hypocenter... no one would be left to tell the tale.

What he is showing in support of his speculation is this:


10984 10985


That is, one big earthquake and its aftershocks somewhere like in Japan on March 11 (above left), and it gets recorded on every seismographs on Earth within a few minutes to one hour at the antipodes from the epicenter/hypocenter:


10986
Click on picture to enlarge


There has been enough big quakes recently where he took his examples (China, Turkey, Chile, Mariannas/Kermadec) to send every seismographs around Earth off their recording range...


Taking this as an indication of an Earth expansion doesn't quite sit right with the data of most of these big quakes being of the "crunch" (compression) type rather than pure rift/extension type.


An expansion of the Earth would cancel subductions at active margins such as along the Rim of Fire and would only leave mid-oceanic ridges active... not quite the case.


As for that heavy, invisible object, as Bill said: to be followed since there will be only indirect indicators of its space location.


************
I wasn't sure when I heard him say "This is Terral..." if it's the same guy as Terral03... so I checked the "Read more" section... and there he is; that same group:




Was still hoping to get confirmation regarding Saturn.






Could the photos themselves have been rotated???



That would still not account for the Saturn moon images ... nor the storm.






I think someone was having difficulties taking pictures with his telescope...




10987







Dr. Byron Glenn is... that guy:







Cape doctor says he's not leading survivalist group and has been harassed by believers in 'Planet X'

Sunday, July 10, 2011
By M.D. Kittle ~ Southeast Missourian
http://www.semissourian.com/photos/15/04/70/1504709-M.jpg (http://www.semissourian.com/story/1743142/photo/1504709.html)
Dr. Byron Glenn at Cape Urgent Care
(Fred Lynch)





Dr. Byron Glenn of Cape Girardeau says he wants nothing to do with the people he sees as online crackpots trumpeting a "conspiracy wrapped in an enigma."




He's not alone. The folks at NASA have fruitlessly tried to debunk what they say are wild conspiracies involving Comet Elenin -- a "wimpy" projectile expected to remain more than 20 million miles from Earth.




Glenn said he's been harassed and threatened by doomsday believers of "Planet X," an idea spreading in the blogosphere and in online chat rooms about a brown dwarf star, a low-mass object rapidly approaching the solar system and bent on destroying much of the Earth. He said that believers, apparently followers of Terral L. Croft, or "Terral03" as he is known in anxiety-ridden chat rooms, have shown up at his North Mount Auburn Road family practice demanding answers.




"I'm not the leader of any group. I can't tell people what to do. I don't want to," Glenn told the Southeast Missourian last week when asked about his connection to Croft's "research group," reportedly made up of people who plan to head for caves in Missouri's Ozarks in the coming weeks. The plan, according to Croft and a series of online correspondence in recent months, is to ride out the earthquakes, floods, volcanoes and other calamities they believe to be coming, thanks to the magnetic and polarizing effects of Planet X.




Croft, in letters to members of the group, describes Glenn as his good friend, a man he's been acquainted with for some time. He and others say Glenn is leading the Ozark survivalists. Glenn says he's never met Croft, a man he describes as "out there" and "on the edge," a Revelation chaser and Sept. 11 conspiracist.

"I am not the leader of any Ozark survival group," Glenn said.





Others say he is -- most notably Croft, who in his more recent Internet messages claims "our survival group leader and physician Dr. Byron Glenn and his engineer son" saw some disturbing things in their "expensive telescope.""Dr. Glenn was able to zoom in on the area of our dwarf star to realize he was looking at a monster of great size. We cannot see the actual dwarf star, but now he can make out the dark area and the dancing stars in the background created by the gravitational leasing effect," Croft wrote in his communique.

[...]





Full article here: http://www.semissourian.com/story/1743142.html




Too many contradictions and 3D physical impossibilities from Terral03 who seem to be the actual author of that anonimous PDF/Scribb paper.




As for Saturn's tilt... here's what GLP's amateur astronomer has to say:




---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Re: [+PIN+] ELEnin & Nibiru NEW Report... Holy SH*T READ THIS!!!!Quote (http://204.74.214.194/bbs/reply.php?messageid=1574871&page=30&quote=26041998) [+ (http://javascript<b></b>:addQuote('reply', '26041998');)] # (http://204.74.214.194/forum1/message1574871/reply26041998)
I read through the file. I've read hundreds of postings here and on other sites on this subject and found a lot of doomers and debunkers alike and I seriously don't know which to trust. Amateurs, "professionals", claimed professionals, religious quotes...You name it.
Quoting: Captain Spaulding 1366925





You can trust amateur astronomers. We have no reason or motivation to lie, and indeed we're telling the truth. We'd know if Saturn had experienced a "90 degree pole shift." It hasn't.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------





... and this:




---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Re: [+PIN+] ELEnin & Nibiru NEW Report... Holy SH*T READ THIS!!!!Quote (http://204.74.214.194/bbs/reply.php?messageid=1574871&page=30&quote=26041771) [+ (http://javascript<b></b>:addQuote('reply', '26041771');)] # (http://204.74.214.194/forum1/message1574871/reply26041771)http://ads.godlikeproductions.com/i/www/delivery/lg.php?bannerid=150&campaignid=40&zoneid=2&loc=1&referer=http%3A%2F%2F204.74.214.194%2Fforum1%2Fmessage1574871%2Fpg30&cb=f6240f6ad1





Errrr guys. If the gravitational pull from Nibiru was strong enough to tilt Saturn, those moons would no longet be where they are.

Just thought i'd point that one out.
Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1407727






Now *THIS* is a small, but very relevant, example of the "agenda" that I and Astronut and others are trying to get across...




...it's called education, logic, and common sense.

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1198034





Look budy through the years many famous scientist of there day where persecuted for there theories for thinking out of the box. Are you 100% certain your correct because if you are your the first because no one has firm data on this object.

Quoting: ducati60






Then *you* explain how the gravity of an alleged brown dwarf (or neutron star, that's a nice one) passed by Saturn and did NOT change the orbits of the moons.




Well?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------





Think of it... that's a major cosmic feat: Tilting Saturn by 90 degrees without flinging its moons in all directions!






I am in awe. :hail:

[RedeZra]

it's obvious that the PTB is prepared for an earth-shattering event

so why not a fly by planet

what else ?

[Lord Sidious]

it's obvious that the PTB is prepared for an earth-shattering event

so why not a fly by planet

what else ?

Asteroid bombardment.

[RedeZra]

it's obvious that the PTB is prepared for an earth-shattering event

so why not a fly by planet

what else ?

Asteroid bombardment.

right it doesn't come alone ; )

[ShawnDotFree]

> I am tired of the mocking.

Much agreed, nearing. Mocking and pettiness will get us nowhere. Not that it is worth much, but I, for one, vow to keep an open mind and heart throughout the days and decades that lie ahead. With that in mind, we all have our gifts and talents to contribute, and I hope that we can all work together as we keep uncovering the truest and most inspired way to navigate our shared world.

[Carmody]

MODS - is there a plugin or something that can change the colour of the foreground text dependant on the background colour being used?
Excellent question, DevilPigeon!

We've started a new thread to discuss this (right next to the one you started), over at Post formatting, color and bold fonts, and viewing themes (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?33653-Post-formatting-color-and-bold-fonts-and-viewing-themes).

Yes, I run with the 'gaian night' set up,and some text -I have to highlight it to read it.

¤=[Post Update]=¤


I am tired of the mocking.

Bill, the problems you speak of have been problems for a good many years now and we are no closer to a real solution than we were when Thom wrote that book. I don't know what it will take to help rally everyone together to come to a solution but human history has shown they don't rise to the occasion until a major crsis happens.

However much our Consciousness is rising, a crisis of enormous magnitude is most likely what is needed. Perhaps this is why some of us look to ancient writings of cyclical events for HOPE.

Due to the 'human' nature.... it pretty well has to be an 'after the fact' type of (re)action.

Thus the line that in any protracted war of such a nature, a given 'side' tends to loose it's best, first.

this due to the aware components of the group stepping up to the plate and doing 'what needs be done' until the rest start to wake up.

[Marin]

I am tired of the mocking.

Agreed. However, by design, given all the different experiences and perceptions of others, it's hard to avoid. It might even be part of the process. A shared dialogue. Sometimes it's uncomfortable. Sometimes the ego gets bruised. Sometimes a line is crossed but hopefully we're all better off having experienced it. (Well, at least some of the time :) )

Truthseekerdan posted a video not long ago on this thread that I thought was worth a second pass. I've highlighted a few bits.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIzZuuRpd6k

".....We can see that good and evil are affected by two variables: perception and scale... but all within the manifestation of consciousness from which they're manifested. One person may see good as something completely different than another and to a different degree. This concept is important when it's applied to your level of consciousness.

Throughout history man has allowed the church, the government and other factions to tell them what's right and wrong. One does not need a book nor laws written on paper to tell them what's right and wrong. One does not need a priest or a judge to interpret the language of the heart. Each of you were given this when you came into this world and remember... all is perception. To follow another person's perception of the ideals of good or evil means to be controlled."

[truthseekerdan]

Could there be a monstrous, undiscovered star orbiting our own Sun? Could it be scattering killer comets throughout our Solar System like clockwork every 26 million years? New scientific surveys are probing the edges of our Solar System -- a realm populated by giant worlds and mysterious planetoid -- hunting for Nemesis, the Sun's purported evil twin. We may be on the verge of discovering this ultimate death star, suspected of causing every mass extinction in Earth's history.

72mdxdUg9to

Playlist: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72mdxdUg9to&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL

[gandra99]

China's space expedition is presented transparently on their recordings Blue Planet, which was parked near the Earth in the Solar System. Pay attention to the Blue Planet which is clearly visible in the sky and not Uranus, because Uranus can see from that distance in this volume. This is evidence that we lie.Ovo is no LENSFLARE This is podstojanai space PLANET who has entered the solar system. Earth's blue brother, whom NASA is hiding along with his poslušnicima.Ovo the official recordings, the Chinese space agency.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZ_1gC1Bh_o&feature=player_embedded

[greybeard]

Could be anything gandra99 to my untrained eye.
Expert opinion would be good.
Thanks though.
Chris

[vibrations]

Could be anything gandra99 to my untrained eye.
Expert opinion would be good.
Thanks though.
Chris

I am afraid that the poor quality of the movie just doesn't give any option for an expertise. I would treat this kind of claims as junk. Maybe is just a CGI presentation for something.

[greybeard]

I have some faith in the Hopi as they are not "foretelling" the future but recounting from their history--- so at some point in time a blue "star" may appear followed by a red. That may be in my lifetime or a long way away--- who know????
I want to thank all who posted on this thread and the originator.
I believe all contributors posted positively and in good faith--- who can ask for more on any forum.
Regards Chris

Chris

[gittarpikk]

Just ran across this...
Maybe this was what Hoagland was making his prediction from...It's a good read ..

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/ciencia/ciencia_asteroids_comets_elenin04.htm

[jcocks]

Could be anything gandra99 to my untrained eye.
Expert opinion would be good.
Thanks though.
Chris

I am afraid that the poor quality of the movie just doesn't give any option for an expertise. I would treat this kind of claims as junk. Maybe is just a CGI presentation for something.

There was another post on this site of someone on youtube with video of a similar looking object close to the sun that he filmed from outside his car....
Maybe there is something to it all - would be interested to see if any other videos of similar objects surface anytime soon...

[ks4ever]

Just had a friend of mine drop in who had a photo of the sun to show me which he had just taken two hours previously with his mobile phone. This was in Glenrowan, Victoria. It showed clearly a large object just to the right of the sun with at least two smaller objects which could be in orbit around it. It is almost identical with the image posted by gandra99 and except for the colour it looks identical. It has become cloudy since and have not been able to take a photo to post. Will try again tomorrow.

[Unified Serenity]

I found this video and think it has some very interesting information, some of which we have heard before and some I doubt any of you have heard before regarding where we come from and why we are possibly struggling so much today.

I want to caution anyone who watches this though because there is a section in it that if you take it at face value could cause an unstable person some problems. Watch with care:

o0pgGTz6Dec

[GaelVictor]

This seems to be, in part, in sync with the Kathars of southern France who were a gnostic sect. They also had a policy of not procreating.

Very interesting info.

[Vrilya]

]This deception has been going on for centuries........http://educate-yourself.org/nwo/illuminatiagendabestoverviewyet8jun02.shtml
This is in 4 parts and I highly recommend reading them all, take what resonates with you and leave the rest......
Knowledge is our best defence

[AlexanderLight]

Blue Star Kachina: NASA, China's Space Program & Amateur Videos:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VtB0tm7nMYo

[greybeard]

A new thread on the Blue K might be an idea.
As yet I have no opinion but anything that has the potential to raise consciousness has my interest.
Thanks for recent posts.
Chris

[Referee]

Very interesting material. Thanks for posting.

[ROMANWKT]

Very interesting until one find that it will cost you $199 dollars to find the truth that every one seeks, and of course he has it at a price, even though the red planet is coming, he still needs that money???????????????

regards
roman

[Unified Serenity]

Very interesting until one find that it will cost you $199 dollars to find the truth that every one seeks, and of course he has it at a price, even though the red planet is coming, he still needs that money???????????????

regards
roman

If you are referring to the inner circle, then yes he charges, but he has a lot of stuff on youtube. You can also just buy his book or join a month at a time which is roughly $20.00 and get the book and access to all his papers which are very valuable imho. I went ahead and signed up because I don't mind paying for someone's dedicated work. If I write and publish a book I would want to be compensated for my time. The book alone is worth $25.00 so I thought it was worth a months membership, and so far I am not complaining. I know if I go to a conference to learn from others I end up paying to go to the event, so I look at it like that in a way.

[Elixer]

Thanks for posting this. I enjoyed it very much and am going to have to listen to it again. There is a lot of information there. It includes another prediction: 12-24-2011, related to the mayan calendar. But I'm sure due to the recent non-events on significant dates, we'll all have had enough of specifically dated predictions...

I found this one to be very well done, one of the best pieces I've heard in a while. I'm not sure of course whether any of it is true, but he seems to be a very dedicated man, this Scott McQuate. I had not heard of him before. He appears to be on the up and up and he is certainly very informative.
As far as I'm concerned though, he could also be an intelligence plant and this message, coming out of nowhere, could then be part of an MK-type operation to frame some sort of ideology. Who knows?

One of his ideas is that the second coming, or the coming of Niburu comes with a cleansing. The Mark of the Beast is to be removed, that is to say, the Carbon (6 protons, neutrons and electrons) is literally the mark of the beast, goes against the will of 'The Creator' and will be removed, along with the temple of Solomon, the Pyramids and the possibility of sexual reproduction. Our sex organs are to be removed. What will be left of us?
This might lead into the reptillian idea of being a perfect race without the need to change and to therefore only reproduce through cloning. For instance.

The interview on the edge am is very strange as well. Close to 6 hours, the first 3 of which seem to not be available and the host Daniel Ott, talks way too much about nothing and does his best to keep the conversation quite narrow, steering it towards survival mode. Is this Ott guy for real? Really!
I only heard part two (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EqwWnAkg50M) (you can easily skip the first 20 minutes).

At one point he 'traps' McQuate into saying that indeed it is the jews that are the central part of this corrupting influence, having introduced the banking system and being in control of most of our entertainment/information etc. Looking at it that way, there is a case to be made for their removal, according to McQuate.
We all know that this is one of the things that makes Ahmadinjad seem to be clearly 'evil'.
I'm not sure whether this anti-semitic stance is central to Scott's views. It certainly seems central to the radio hosts' views, which is why I think McQuate accomodated him there, perhaps. Throughout the interview, it seems he did his best to answer a lot in the affirmative, which I also thought was a bit strange.

The corruption comes from YHVH, Lucifer, Annunaki, Nephilim, who may have come from Saturn. He's lumping them all in as being the same.
They took, in Genesis 2, the rib of Adam and created their own creature (us) with the help of the rebellious woman (Eve, Rebecca). Throughout the bible there are stories of the first born being usurped in this way and supplanted by another brother. Even Jesus had a twin that was removed, leaving him to then also be a usurper? Christianity he says, can easily be traced back to Freemasonry, which is known to have Luciferian influences.

I happened to have been listening to the latest Red Ice conversation with Robert Newman (http://www.redicecreations.com/radio/2011/11/RIR-111115.php) who goes on to explain how Shakespeare, like Mozart is the result of a corporate collaborative effort as part of the creation of the 'myth of the immaculate artist'. That this is part of a larger movement coming from the Phoenicians, going to Venice, then to Vienna and then to London. Most likely, considering the names, to originate from Venus. It is the symbol of the Phoenix, rising from its ashes to grow and grow again until it is destroyed and start the cycle all over again. Boom-bust.
Obviously this Phoenician movement concerns not only entertainment, but legal systems, financial systems, history-fabrication and in general culture-creation. It's the Babylon system.

One little suspect thing here is that this Shakespeare story from Newman comes right at the time that a new movie about the bard is coming to theaters (called Anonymous). This is something that is said to happen on History-type channels as well. They release some documentary about whatever thing is going to be featured in a movie around the same time. This can clearly be seen to be part of the propaganda arm of the would-be-controllers, concerted efforts, all in cahoots. This Newman guy just happens to have this book out at this time? Who knows?

That is more suspect than just selling a book. We cannot just say that someone is not credible as soon as they're offering something for sale. This is not very nuanced and can be shown to be part of a disinfo strategy: If anybody selling their info is suspect, then there can be no professional researcher, effectively leaving no one to tell a credible tale.
Though in the case of this Scott McQuate guy, I must say, some of his youtubes do look like very slickly done Infomercials. The name of his site, innercircle.us (www.innercicle.us), also easily associates to the free masons again. The fact that there is nothing on the site, unless you register might also raise a flag.
Admittedly though I am overly suspicious of anything we see in not only the mainstream-, but the alternative media as well. I've been checking out wellaware1.com (www.wellaware1.com), which shows that a lot of our news is performed by actors playing various characters... Though grains of salt may be required, the concept is plausible.

It is interesting to fit the stories of Robert Newman together with those of Scott McQuate.
The Phoenicians, Venicians, Viennese and surely the Venusians. They are the central problem that we face on this planet.
But not for long, since Niburu is returning and will perform this cleansing. It is supposed to be a good thing for which we are actually overdue. It is said to revisit us every 3600 years.
We can possibly also combine it with the Gnostic-type material from John Lamb Lash concerning the archontic energies.

Another nice detail is that things have been turned upside down, Illuminati-style.
He says that the plan of the Creator was to create the red human. The Luciferian corruption created the blue man. Blue is now associated with good, while red is usually evil. Look for instance at the color of the eyes of the Transformers...who, I have no doubt, would be a Sirian creation. (The people from Sirius supposedly are associated with creating animated machines...).
This red vs blue association of today is obviously a falsehood, according to Scott. Consider the royal bloodlines that 'control' us. They call themselves blue bloods. Police force is also blue...
So if blue is your favorite color, you might have to ask yourself a few questions.
Or take it with a grain of salt....

Anyway fascinating stuff, a potentially large contribution to an understanding of the bigger picture. Highly recommended, even if just to hear a possible perspective without it necessarily being true...
I'm surprised it has received relatively little attention here on Avalon.
I'd be interested to hear what other people have to say about this material (as well as Scott mcQuate's possible role, Daniel Ott's and Robert Newman's).

[Unified Serenity]

Hello Elixer,

Excellent synopsis of the information. I too have my questions and am digging around on the innercircle.us. I am currently waiting for an explanation from Dr. McQuate regarding some issues I have with YHWH being Lucifer or not. His explanation of the creation story is very compelling, and his breaking down the root words all the way back to Sumerian which I have now downloaded the Sumerian Concordance to try to do my own confirmations. I do see the very interesting twist that was done using YHWH as warned of in Isaiah.

Isa 29:15 Woe unto them that seek deep to hide their counsel from the LORD, and their works are in the dark, and they say, Who seeth us? and who knoweth us?
Isa 29:16 Surely your turning of things upside down shall be esteemed as the potter's clay: for shall the work say of him that made it, He made me not? or shall the thing framed say of him that framed it, He had no understanding?

Basically, what Scott was pointing out was that the scribes played a little letter game with YHWH and it is seen if one goes back to the original Aramaic where the letters were IAUA. Scott then said, the word in Isaiah is not translated right as upside down, but backwards and that it's been a favorite trick of the mystery schools and illuminati to turn things backwards. So, I did a concordance search on upside down in that verse and got:

H2017
הפך
hôphek
ho'-fek
From H2015; an upset, that is, (abstractly) perversity: - turning of things upside down.

H2015
הפך
hâphak
haw-vak'
A primitive root; to turn about or over; by implication to change, overturn, return, pervert: - X become, change, come, be converted, give, make [a bed], overthrow (-turn), perverse, retire, tumble, turn (again, aside, back, to the contrary, every way).


I can see where it could mean backwards, so from there we get from IAUA to AUAI and he says that is an anagram. The little tricksters left us with vowels and took out the consonants NNK. So, put in the NNK and we get ANUNAKI. I currently have a message left for Scott to tell me where he got his NNK from or is it his intuition showing him this, which may or may not be accurate. It does offer an interesting insite, goes along with the Sumerian tale of the Anunaki manipulating man's DNA to make a servant man. I found this interesting study by Dr. Scott McQuate:

The Pyramid

When we uncover a little history about the Great Pyramid at Giza, you know that it once was covered in highly-polished, white limestone, which actually glowed when the sun hit it, we also find that the three pyramids at the Giza Plateau in Egypt are also perfectly aligned to the 3 stars in the belt of Orion, which is why the Sumerian logograms ‘Kur’ and ‘Eb’, as in Horeb, also mean, ‘Waist Mountain’, in reference to those stars on Orion’s belt or ‘Waist’. When we put the pieces together, we soon find that the pyramid, placed East of Eden by YHWH (The Anunaki), was one and the same as this ‘Angle Mountain’ which ‘Shined every way’, just as described in the Bible as the Cherubim with the Flaming Sword, that did the same.

The Pyramid at Giza, created by the Anunaki (The fallen angels), is one and the same as Horeb/Sinai/The Cherub with the Flaming Sword. This is also why the pyramid is called ‘Sin-Ai’, or ‘Sin Eye’, because the watchers, residing under it, are watching the ‘sin’, and making ready when they are called upon to eradicate it, for the final time.

Another reason that the pyramid has been the ‘temple’ of choice, placed ‘over’ these watchers, is that these Watchers also represent the ‘Rib’ that was taken from Adam. Knowing now who YHWH actually represents, and that the Anunaki were the fallen ones, we can deduce that the ‘surgery’ performed on Adam in the Garden, by YHWH (The Anunaki), was not a righteous act, ordained by the Creator.

The purpose for this ‘splitting’ of Adam to create Eve was to add something to the Rib of Adam. The ‘Rib’ is simply a shrouded reference to Ribose or ‘RIB-o-nucleic acid’, which is the 5-side, star-shaped molecule which makes up one half of the genetic material that comprises our DNA chain. The thing that was added to this ‘Rib’ was six-sided, and is known as a ‘Phosphate’. The word ‘Rib’ in the Sumerian means ‘To be higher in rank’. When the phosphate (also known genetically as a ‘Pyran’) was added to the ‘Rib’ (placed over it), the Anunaki/YHWH broke a spiritual law and usurped the higher authority of the Father.

This Pyran is a representation of what the Bible calls Remphan (See Acts 7 and Amos 26), and means literally, ‘Saturn’, even in the Coptic (Egyptian) and Arabic languages. Saturn is represented by a six-sided Hexagon on its North pole, and is known for its blueness in color (See Wikipedia etc.). These two shapes, the hexagon and Pentagon, represent the number 5 and the number 6. In the Greek, the number 6 is ‘Sera’ and the number 5 is ‘Penta’, the two of which make up the word, ‘Sera-Penta’ or… ‘Serpent’, as it is referred to in Genesis during the creation in Eden. The pyramids being placed over those who represent the ‘Rib’ (The good angels/Watchers), therefore, is literally the Anunaki’s way of reminding their brethren that they have ‘raised themselves up like God’, AS the Eagle, (See Obadiah 1:4) and have overtaken the RIB. In the old Norse language, incidentally, the man’s name ‘ARN’ means ‘eagle’, and is simply an anagram for RNA, or, RIB-o-nucleic acid.

The Pyramids, especially the one at Giza, therefore, are symbols of the Phosphate or Pyran, meaning ‘fire’ (from where we get the word ‘Pyramid’, which means ‘fire in the midst’), in our DNA as well as the ‘Cherub with the flaming sword’, as well as Mount Horeb, as well as Mount Sinai. This is why Jacob stated that his son DAN would be a ‘Serpent’ (Sera-Penta) in the way, as DAN is simply an anagram of DNA. The pyramid also represents the Fig Tree itself, as it is the symbol of where the Figs, themselves have been stationed, as the Sentry’s awaiting their call to action, meaning, when they are ripe.

So, what, therefore, are the ‘leaves’ of this Fig Tree that are the true sign that ‘Summer is nigh’? Click here to go to the next page and find out now, or click here to learn the meaning of this and many other ancient stories that have been covered up for thousands of years, by those who control your world.

http://www.figtreeparable.com/The-Pyramid.html

It is very interesting for me because I have studied linguistics for years and enjoy finding new areas to study. This whole new Sumerian transliteration and understanding is definitely causing me to step back and really look at things. I am currently though confused on how this ties together with prophesy, using Israel, the Messiah coming from the house of Judah and being a king / priest if that whole line is usurped vs. just the Kenites moving in and causing havoc. Dr. Scott agrees that Lucifer was the father of Cain, and Adam is the father of Abel and Seth. So, that still causes issues. I have found a lot of interesting stuff on the inner circle and share where I can. I respect Dr. McQuate's right to limit the number of student's he has and his right to also make money from his time and efforts. I posted the above study which is on the web and not just part of the "Inner circle". I must say though that this study is in it's most simplistic explanation as Dr. McQuate goes into a lot more details than this in the book, "Blueprint for Bondage".

[Unified Serenity]

I am really starting to enjoy delving into this side of the languages. Dr. McQuate may definitely be onto something. Here is another tidbit of information that really starts to make you go, hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

From Dr. McQuate's page: http://www.figtreeparable.com/The-Language.html

Esu delivers to his ‘Inner Circle’ of adherents, the disciples, a story that gives them hints of His coming and what signs of the ‘Fig Tree' to look for to know that day is close at hand. Also, these things are said to happen after the Abomination of Desolation is standing in the Holy Place. Although you will likely not hear this from anyone else, I will tell you as a fact, that the Abomination of Desolation A) Is not a person as is taught by the pastors of the churches, today and B) has been standing in the Holy Place for quite some time, unbeknownst to most.

The Abomination of Desolation spoken of by Esu, is referred to as the bdelygma eramoses in the Greek and simply means the thing that makes desolate or brings destruction. If you attend a church, you would never know what this is talking about, because you would have been led to believe that it is a reference to a person, such as the anti-christ, false prophet, that it is related to a literal 'daily sacrifice' or is a type of statue in the shape of a man, but those definitions are false. If any of those definitions are even close to the truth, it would be the one that likens the Abomination of Desolation to a man, but it would be more accurately compared to a mon, an old word used not just for man, but also for moon, the reason for which you will understand shortly. One of the reasons for these misconceptions that lead to the false teachings, is that Pastors do not know that there was a destruction prior to the flood, in the Bible, and that this initial ‘desolation’ was by fire. This fire is the reason we find the word ‘dust’ in Chapter 2 of Genesis.
Adam and Eve in Eden Adam was ‘molded’ (Heb. ‘Yatsar’) from this ‘dust’, by the entity ‘YHWH’, but it was not truly ‘dust’. The word for this ‘dust’ is ‘aphar’ (the same root used for the words ‘Pharaoh’ and ‘Pharisee’) and is more accurately translated ‘Cinders’ or ‘Ashes’ in this context. This ‘fire’ was a result of man not being deemed ‘good’ in chapter one of Genesis, by Elohiym, his creators. When we are told at the end of chapter one of Genesis that everything Elohiym made, they saw as ‘good’, it is not speaking about man. Man was not ‘made’ (Heb. ‘Asah’) in chapter one of Genesis, but rather ‘created’, (which is the word ‘Bara’ in the Hebrew), and was therefore not ‘good’, as the things that were ‘made’. Further proof of the resulting destruction of the creation by fire, is the fact that the next words describing ‘God’s’ behavior in relation to this ‘work’, (‘rested’, ‘blessed’, ‘sanctified’, ‘finished’ and ‘ended’), are all more accurately translated, when placed into the proper context, as ‘caused to fail’, ‘destroyed’, ‘exterminated’ and ‘made this work of creating man taboo’(See Strong’s Concordance and Gesenius’ Lexicon for further information).

I speak about this more in-depth to the members of my Inner Circle, but suffice to say for now, the foundation of what you have been taught has been turned upside down, just as Isaiah said it would be in Isaiah 29:15 & 16; and when the ‘foundation’ is skewed, the whole house is crooked. (This ‘true’ story, by the way, is where we get the story of ‘Cinder-ella’ which is simply a reference to the ‘Cinders of Allah’ or ‘Elohiym’. (Elohiym and Allah stem from precisely the same root in the Arabic language, which is ‘El’ or ‘Al’. Visit my Inner Circle (http://www.innercircle.us/)to read my paper entitled The Cinders of Ella and Other Tales of the Pharies which expounds on this issue.)

The instrument of this destruction of the original Adam or Adama, was the ‘abomination of desolation’ meaning ‘the thing that makes desolate’. These were the same objects referred to by Ezekiel as ‘wheels within wheels’ and they are also inextricably linked to the parable of the Fig Tree.

[13th Warrior]

I find this material very interesting! Much like Sitchin but with greater insight and detail. McQuate's explanation of what is meant by "repenting" makes the most sense of this idea of repenting that i have heard so far...

I look forward to more insights...

Thank you Unified Serenity for bringing this to the fore!

[Sky]

@Unified Serenity - your rhetoric is well versed with your studies to date, but I would challenge you to do some more homework if you have passion for discovering the Truth. If you took the time and have value for your origins and potential future outcomes to this amazing "HUman" experience we are blessed with - then you will be grateful you did so.

I would challenge you to do some study from revered sources as the the reason the Hebrews refered to "Hashem" before you so easily accept the purpose endowed by so called "learned" experts who pose their "facts" on the web. Far too much evidence in the ancient texts for the opportunity of the contrary being true. Have you by chance taken time to read any of the Qumran Scrolls (aka Dead Sea) or even what is expounded in the Nag Hamadi texts, and possibly referred to better sources of interpretation of such by true scolars of anthropology? The deception runs deep in our history and for good reason. Linear thinking with acceptance of "personal" interpretation of what is currently expounded as the versions of the Holy Scripture could be an expensive mistake - soul speaking that is. Our purpose imo is to become self realised and then engage with the notion of the Divine in a quiet and reflective state to receive insights directly from Divine Source. Difficult if we don't know the name(s) of the Universal Creator.

What say you regarding the intention and possible implications of the book of Enoch? He had very clear warnings regarding the Watchers. Why were the other 364 texts he prepared for the children of Earth to live by so deftly destroyed (or hidden?)

I have it on good authority that the Holy word of God is meant to be understood on 7 levels of understanding, hence my invitation to study the subject with more discernment - lest the purpose of that good book is lost in the race for "illumination". Soul Spirit unity is the goal and it is not taught on the net.

After all - it is ultimately between the Light and the dark.... Understanding the true Cosmology is a noble goal.

Jest my two cents - and I too am enjoying your research and explanations here - thank you.

[Unified Serenity]

Hey Sky,

Thanks for your post. Please don't assume that just because I post something I find interesting I believe it completely in whole or in part. I am a seeker. I have read a great deal of ancient and esoteric texts. I consider myself a mystic and have had many personal experiences which cannot be verified beyond my experiences. I seek wisdom in many places, pray for discernment and do not trust in emotions as we can easily be fooled by what we think we know based on an experience. I have read each of the texts you mentioned. I have read much on magick, ancient ways, old ways, Goddess spirituality, matriarchal, patriarchal history and religions. I have studied ancient history, not so ancient history and see patterns in much of it. I know that at the core I think my existence and learning comes down to one thing and that is to walk in Divine love. It can be a love that is tender and sweet or terrible and corrective. Love has many faces, but I think a key component is seeking the best and doing the least harm if any at all, but some would view harm when it's really a loving act.

So, I appreciate this forum for the gems that are shared. I always look for more, and continue my search.

[BestLion]

I am an amateur astronomy and I often look at the night sky with my telescope. i have yet to spot this. I think the 10th planets is 'or was' Tiamat. the water planet that was destroyed and collided with earth, and is now the asteroid belt. one must understand I think the Sumerians were telling folklore of their culture of a time past 'not then 6,000 BC' but they were recording what was before. The Annuaki gods. And the 10th planet.

[DreamsInDigital]

How can Earth and Nibiru collide when Earth is a Planet, and Nibiru (factually speaking here) are a people? Contrary to popular belief / misconception Nibiru is not a planet, it's a race of humanoids that were created when two other waring planetary races combined through a marriage of their royalty/leaders. Nibiru in it's native meaning, roughly translates out to "of two sources."

[Ishtar]

I feel moved to start this discussion because I so often hear posters talking about the Sumerian gods, the Anunnaki, as if their existence as a race from outer space is a fact. However, from my study of mythology of more than 40 years, plus my memories of a previous lifetime as a priestess of Ishtar in Babylon, plus my experience as a shaman, my understanding of the Anunnaki and Nibiru is very different.

From that experience, I believe that the stories about the Anunnaki and the 3,600 year old cycle of the Planet Nibiru to be just another psy-ops campaign concocted by a very high level Freemason, Zecharia Sitchin, and created for the reason that all psy-ops campaigns are created, in order to control and dominate the peoples of Earth. The Anunnaki/Nibiru one is very clever, as Sitchin was, for many reasons including:


It piggy backs on one of the most successful psy-ops campaigns of all time, that of a real dying and resurrecting Sun god
It plays on the fact that most people can’t or won’t have time to actually read the texts from the Sumerian cuneiform tablets for themselves


To elaborate on the first point, in studying mythology, we find that many of the events in the so-called ‘life of Jesus’ had been told many times before, for thousands of years before he was even supposed to have lived. The dying and resurrecting Sun god was an astronomical metaphor for the winter solstice which was passed on in the oral teaching traditions of priest astronomers across Mesopotamia, Egypt, Greece and India when the underwent their Mystery initiations during the Neolithic period (after the last Ice Age).

So why did the ancients mix up the teachings of science and the teaching of religion? It was because to them, there was no difference. It is only us today who have been taught to separate science from God or spirituality … and we’ve also been trained through Judaeo-Christianity to see God as a sort of angry, vengeful Jehovah figure.

However, that prevailing view is slowly changing and now there are scientists at the Hadron Collider 17 mile-long tunnel in Switzerland looking for the “God Particle”, in other words, the self-organising principle of all life.

What they don’t realise it that our early ancestors already knew about this self-organising principle and the ancient Sumerians, Egyptians and Indians called it the Anu. Anu is the oldest word for God or self-organising principle. It is the Spirit at the heart of all matter. And the energetic or spirit products of the Anu (the Children of the Anu) were known as the Annuna, who Sitchin rechristians the Anunnaki.


Anu (Sanskrit) As a noun, an atom of matter; as an adjective, atomic, fine, minute. A title of Brahma, conceived as both infinitesimal and universal, thus pointing to the pantheistic character of divinity. Hence, every anu is “a centre of potential vitality, with latent intelligence in it” (SD 1:567; cf FSO 273-5, 431). In the Bhagavad-Gita (8:9) Arjuna is enjoined to meditate on the “seer,” i.e., the enlightened, omniscient One, who is “more atomic than the atom” (anor aniyamsam) and yet “the supporter of all” (cf VP 1:2, 5:1; ChU 3:14, 3-4, Katha 2:20, MU 3:1,

Anu (Chaldean) Supreme god of the Babylonian pantheon, king of angels and spirits, ruler of destiny, lord of the city of Erech or Uruk — later Ur. One of the loftiest of Babylonian divinities, part of a trinity with Enlil and Ea, he was especially the god of heaven, creator of star spirits and of the demons of cold, rain, and darkness. His consort Antum or Anatum was mother of the gods. Anu was the concealed deity; in the Chaldean account of Genesis, he is the passive deity, however, “the primordial chaos, the god time and world at once, chronos, and kosmos, the uncreated matter issued from the one and fundamental principle of all things” (IU 2:423).


Anu was also the ‘god word’ in Egypt where many priests were named Anu or Anubis, and the city of Heliopolis (renamed as the City of the Sun by the Greeks) was originally named Anu.

For those who prefer videos, there is a good one here (http://beforeitsnews.com/story/1555/901/The_Anu_-_Archetype_Of_Self_Organization.html)about shamanism and the self-organising principle of the Anu.

From this, you will see the Anu takes the shape of two vortexes, one upon the other and also known as the double vortex, or ascending and descending dragons. It is also represented by the double pyramid:

http://ishtarsgate.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/vortex-pyramid.jpg

Here is how its double vortical magnetic field supports the Earth.

http://ishtarsgate.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/vortices-electromagnetic-earth-2.jpg

In this diagram, you can see how the energy of the double vortex flows in and out, and it forms a doughnut-like shape around its middle, known as a torus.
http://ishtarsgate.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/vortex_in_vortex_out.gif

I’m sure Zecharia Sitchin was an intelligent man, and so he would have known that nowhere in the Sumerian texts is Nibiru referred to as a planet, but as an Earthly city. Nibiru is mentioned many times throughout the cuneiform clay tablets as a very important city because it is housed a sacred shrine to Anu, the “God Particle”.

There is also nothing in the Sumerian texts about rockets, other planets or an evil race of Anunnaki who come from outer Space.

The Biblical story about the Judaic equivalent, the Elohim, often gets quoted as proof that they came to the Earth and made love with the "daughters of man". But this is a metaphor for how Spirit combines with matter ~ another term for electromagnetic energy. In ancient myths, Spirit is usually depicted as the male principle and Matter (mater, maternal) is represented as female. This story is about the act of fertility that is at the heart of the creation which is electromagnetic.

That Sitchin was part of a psy-ops initiative, or at least one that sets out to deceive, is clear from his omissions, from his made-up translations, from his truncated quotes and extracts taken out of context, and from the amount of repetition there is in his copious, confusing to the general reader and complex Earth Chronicles which could also be an early form of NLP with its use of ‘redundant pattern recognition’.

When Sitchin was asked to provide references for his ‘beliefs’, he would wave away the enquirier with ‘it’s all in the books’. There are references and a bibliography of sorts in his books, but they are none to reference the more sensational part of his story regarding the Anunnaki coming from Space on rockets or the “planet Nibiru”.

The Annuna or Anunnaki were known as the Aryans in ancient India, and both are translated to Noble Ones. The Anunnaki or Aryans were the original spirits of the Anu, who taught the shaman priests everything they needed to know for survival ~ agriculture, smithery, astronomy, geomancy, sacred geometry etc. But these Anunnaki/Aryan spirits didn’t come to Earth on rockets to teach our ancestors. Even today (but particularly then) shamans learn from the spirits (Anunnaki/Aryans/Elohim/Archangels) through the shamanic trance known as ‘journeying’. It is not a physical journey. Shamans don’t journey by going ‘off-planet’ but by going ‘off dimension’. Going ‘off-planet’ may be fun, but going ‘off dimension’ is even better because it evolves your consciousness to a higher level in a way that no amount of jump rooms to Mars can ever achieve.

We can go to Mars, or we can go even to the Pleiades or to the Andromeda Galaxy or Sirius, if we could built a rocket or a jump room to get there. But we would still be in this 3D dimension and, therefore, our consciousness would be the same as it is now. We would stay the same in our consciousness but just be in a different place. However, if we learn to journey like a shaman does to other dimensions, then there is an opportunity for self-transformation and spiritual evolution through enhanced consciousness, as well as a greater understanding about the building blocks of this universe.

And so this, in my opinion, is the birthright that has been stolen from us by various psy-ops campaigns over the millennia which include Christianity, Darwinism, Western material science, atheism masquerading as humanism ~ and not least this little beaut from Sitchin about the Anunnaki and the planet Nibiru, which will also make a great psychological foundation for any false flag ET invasion they have planned.

[Ishtar]

As a sort of addendum, I’d lke to mention the DVD Thrive.

In my opinion, this DVD has a lot going for it ... apart from the otherwise excellent Nassim Haramein’s insistence that the sacred geometrical symbols which he has discovered on rocks in Egypt must have been brought to Earth by a superior race of spacemen.

To be fair to Nassim, he actually says “this is the only logical explanation to me” and I can understand that that would be the most logical explanation to a person, no matter how academically brilliant, but who has never experienced the shamanic journey to meet the extra-dimensional spirits for guidance, information and healing.

Even today, we receive this sort of scientific information from the spirits. One of my clients is currently learning vortex mathematics from her spirits in order to create a free energy device with perpetual motion.

That this intelligence and guidance comes from spirits rather than spacemen is much clearer in the ancient Vedic texts where the ‘rishis’ (shamans of India) actually do talk about visiting spirits in other dimensions and learning from them.

So again, this is why I believe that these ‘superior beings’ didn’t once come on rockets and they aren’t about to arrive here again from another planet in our universe. They are already here and have always been here … albeit in another dimension, or perhaps the term ‘parallel universe’ woud be preferred, and one which is accessible by shamans.

[BestLion]

I agree with much of what you say, and I also dont put too much stock in Z Sitchens work, and from what I learned he was no expert translator of Sumerian language.
But The Annunaki were gods in ancient times in many cultures like the Hittites, Sumerians, Babylonians, and Ammonites. They as in religion in myth were god like human in nature. Often depicted as tall blonds.
The 12th planet etc..I feel is nonsense. I do feel their may have been a planet in teh past like the one that blew up and is now the asteroid belt. So the other planet Niburu may be talk of a past planet.
I also agree with you on the other dimension and how beings come here, this is what I have came to the conclusion on myself, through study of folk lore, history, cultures and civilizations.

[777]

Very eloquently delivered theory Ishtar. The advanced knowledge of pyramids and vortices matches very much with visions I have during guided meditations. Visualy Earth appears like a small particle vibrating slightly sending waves in the patterns you've described. I can only collate my own experience with that of your thesis, I'm not saying mine carries validity.

Great thread too. It's important to wash away the disinfo.

[Ishtar]

But The Annunaki were gods in ancient times in many cultures like the Hittites, Sumerians, Babylonians, and Ammonites. They as in religion in myth were god like human in nature. Often depicted as tall blonds.


When the shaman journeys through trance into other dimensions he meets beings who we call the spirits, and they are often in human form, and some are in the form of tall, blond human or humanoids. The ancient Sumerians didn't call the Annuna 'gods' and the ancient Indians didn't call the Aryans 'gods' That was just the word of the Oxford classics-trained translators in the early 20th century.

Even today, shamans draw or make models of their spirit guides, in the same way that the Sumerians and Greeks made statues of them.

The Oxford scholars borrowed this word from the classical Greeks who called the spirits 'theo' and this was translated by the scholars as 'gods'.

The spirits were eventually subsumed by religion, and eventually one God, known as monotheism, which was a way of barring the Gate to the Spirits (true meaning of the word Babylon) to the rest of us. Babylon, the Gate to the Spirits, was dismissed as a whore by Judaic priests who made themselves into intermediaries. Only they could talk to the spirits, while we ordinary people were locked out of such a self-empowering experience, for obvious reasons, while being fed stories about ordinary people who dared to venture into the Holy of Holies meeting instantaneous death unless they were one of the Levi priesthood.

So this is all about control and manipulation.

Eventually, the priests even forgot how to talk to the spirits themselves .. but luckily, the shamans are remembering.

[Ria]

I think your right about how Sitchin has misrepresented the facts, also it has been reported that he had been with the royalties at those inform-us meetings.
Anu, as you explained is very apt.
You have applied down to earth facts, I was wondering about what you thought about the tenth planet as it some times referred to, having been depicted in the Sumerian reliefs?
Non the less I think ET's have been coming and going since the beginnings, we are an integral part, as every thing els is a part to.
And Sitchin has muddy the waters.
Thank-you for this thread, I hope more people read it.

[Ishtar]

IYou have applied down to earth facts, I was wondering about what you thought about the tenth planet as it some times referred to, having been depicted in the Sumerian reliefs?

Could you show me where in the Sumerian texts there is reference to a 10th planet?

Nibiru is very much an Earthly city, and is never described as otherwise. Sitchin lied about this, and people have been making it all up ever since.

Also ET means extra-terrestrial or extra to terra, which is Latin for Earth. But the spirits are not from outside Earth or from another galaxy extra to Earth. They are here, and always have been, with us on Earth but in another dimension which is timeless. So it would be more correct to refer to them as extra-dimensionals or EDs.

[777]

IYou have applied down to earth facts, I was wondering about what you thought about the tenth planet as it some times referred to, having been depicted in the Sumerian reliefs?

Could you show me where in the Sumerian texts there is reference to a 10th planet?

Nibiru is very much an Earthly city, and is never described as otherwise. Sitchin lied about this, and people have been making it all up ever since.

Also ET means extra-terrestrial or extra to terra, which is Latin for Earth. But the spirits are not from outside Earth or from another galaxy extra to Earth. They are here, and always have been, with us on Earth but in another dimension which is timeless. So it would be more correct to refer to them as extra-dimensionals or EDs.

Again, firmly agree with this. I would also venture these ED's are extensions of our own personal Soul collectives which I percieve to be massive. Timeless as you say, every dimension happening simultaneously, with every shard of Soul personification supporting and dipping into the 3d when required. We seem to be singing from at least the same hymn book. Not that this matters! Just an observation.

[Ishtar]

IYou have applied down to earth facts, I was wondering about what you thought about the tenth planet as it some times referred to, having been depicted in the Sumerian reliefs?

Could you show me where in the Sumerian texts there is reference to a 10th planet?

Nibiru is very much an Earthly city, and is never described as otherwise. Sitchin lied about this, and people have been making it all up ever since.

Also ET means extra-terrestrial or extra to terra, which is Latin for Earth. But the spirits are not from outside Earth or from another galaxy extra to Earth. They are here, and always have been, with us on Earth but in another dimension which is timeless. So it would be more correct to refer to them as extra-dimensionals or EDs.

Again, firmly agree with this. I would also venture these ED's are extensions of our own personal Soul collectives which I percieve to be massive. Timeless as you say, every dimension happening simultaneously, with every shard of Soul personification supporting and dipping into the 3d when required. We seem to be singing from at least the same hymn book. Not that this matters! Just an observation.

Yes. I would go further... and I don't know if you can follow me this far.

We have been trained to look for gods and God coming from the skies because we've had our birthright stolen from us. We need to stop looking to the skies for our saviours and look to ourselves because we ARE the gods we've been looking for. And that's what "they" don't want us to know, because when we know that and start acting from that place, their game will be well and truly up.

That's the ultimate teaching of the spirits and they long for the day that we realise it.

[Ria]

I am sorry I do not have a picture of the relief at hand, it is a relief showing our planetary system with a full compliment of planets plus one. By the way I am not calling it Nibiru. There is much debate about what is or is not a planet. I was interested to know if you or your colleges had gone into this.
Slightly off topic I consider potentially there to be planets that we do not see vibrating at a higher frequency.
I agree with your extra-dimensionls or EDs, other dimension which is timeless, as well as your perspective. All so I accept we have been visited by beings from other galaxies, star systems which seeded this planet with plants, animals, genetic material, etc, as well as the earth, being a creator being in her own right.

[Ishtar]

I am sorry I do not have a picture of the relief at hand, it is a relief showing our planetary system with a full compliment of planets plus one. By the way I am not calling it Nibiru. There is much debate about what is or is not a planet. I was interested to know if you or your colleges had gone into this.
Slightly off topic I consider potentially there to be planets that we do not see vibrating at a higher frequency.
I agree with your extra-dimensionls or EDs, other dimension which is timeless, as well as your perspective. All so I accept we have been visited by beings from other galaxies, star systems which seeded this planet with plants, animals, genetic material, etc, as well as the earth, being a creator being in her own right.

I've had a quick look through my pictures of Sumerian reliefs and can only find one showing nine planets. Until relatively recently, it was considered that there were nine planets until some boffin decided that Pluto wasn't one, so now there are officially only eight. However, maybe the Sumerians thought differently and considered Pluto a planet too, making nine as in this Sumerian relief below. Of course, they wouldn't have called it Pluto, as it was named such by the Greeks (or possibly the Romans? Ah no, got that wrong completely. Just looked it up. )


The name Pluto was proposed by Venetia Burney (1918–2009), an eleven-year-old schoolgirl in Oxford, England.[32] Venetia was interested in classical mythology as well as astronomy, and considered the name, a name for the god of the underworld, appropriate for such a presumably dark and cold world. She suggested it in a conversation with her grandfather Falconer Madan, a former librarian at the University of Oxford's Bodleian Library. Madan passed the name to Professor Herbert Hall Turner, who then cabled it to colleagues in the United States.[33]). From Wiki Pluto page (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pluto).

Sitchin doesn't think Pluto was Nibiru. He calls it Gaga... I'm not sure where he gets that from.

There are two planets outside the solar system, but they could be anything.

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTtYuiKgSx2tZ-Aqvg4iunVMQJxamx1KBmAx5b-ANiztDBNyBp3UB7-Bq4awg

[kersley]

What a fantastic thesis.. well put together..
I must say I agree with you Ishtar. after reading the book of Enoch everything points to spirits.

[Ishtar]

Thanks kersley,

I've always thought that that Enochian battle in the heavens between the forces of 'light' and 'dark' was an allegory for what we now see represented in the yin yang symbol, the ongoing flowing dance of the opposites. In other words, non-dualism.

http://dl.glitter-graphics.net/pub/234/234261xszuisr7ni.jpg

[Unified Serenity]

Well, unless we are being lied to, something big is perturbing the outer planets, and it's not some small rock they as they used to think. I like what you have said, and have often believed that most ET's are really ED's and can appear at will in our dimension. Having experienced many ED's in 3d astral work and just ordinary events I think you are probably correct that most if not all alien or other entity encounters are ED coming into our dimension in various shapes and forms some for positive and some for negative reasons.

My only caution though is that we do know earth has a history of scheduled cataclisms caused by something and we are apparently in the time period for another event. How soon though is always the question. I am not particularly concerned about a natural event on Dec. 21, 2012. I am concerned about a man made crisis to help usher in the new religion of Ascension.

[Ishtar]

Well, the Earth goes through natural cycles, some are warming and some are cooling, so we get Ice Ages from time to time, and then huge floods when the glaciers melt again. And sometimes, a comet hits us. But none of this need to have anything to do with ETs or Ascensionism, or any other religion, none of which will protect us from that kind of extinction event if one is due. Ask the dinosaurs! ;)

[modwiz]

Tonight! At five O'clock interview with a dinosaur. Topic: Climate change through the ages.

Also an astrophysicist will explain what is perturbing Uranus.

[Ria]

Yes that is the relief, thanks. If you look between 2&3 o'clock of the sun representation you see a small planet behind a larger one.[there is also a whitish dot at between 1&2 o'clock I do not know if this is a blemish or light reflecting on a bump/small planet] Ten planets plus Sun [not including whitish think. we live in exciting times.

[Ishtar]

I see two extra planets, Ria, outside of the solar system... making 11, ths one shows it better


http://www.ufo-contact.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/Nibiru-2012-Sumerian-Planets-Gods.jpeg

But as I said, the extra two could be just that, planets outside our solar system, and as I'm not a cosmologist, I don't know what they are ...perhaps one could come on and tell Ria?

For myself, I'm satisfied that they're not Nibiru, which is the topic of this thread.

[Ria]

Thanks again, what constitutes a planet is an on going debate.
On you tube there have been pictures of what looks like two suns.
There have been photos of the blue kachina seen[of the hopi prophesies]
What may be a planet/astroid pluto, chiron still have a strong effect on the individual as well as the collective.
To add to the mix, Jupiter is considered to be a sun in the making.
All most all star systems are binary, two suns.

[blufire]

I don’t know Ishtar . . . . . your explanation seems too neat and tidy and with current new age “type” beliefs mixed in. I have read volumes of work (and not only sitchin) that delves very deep into our solar system and how it relates to our ancient history. My research and gut tells me you are leaving out many highly intelligent and relevant facts and knowledge concerning information on nibiru and/or the other planets in and outside our system.

. . . . . . example in the Sumerian relief you have posted (#18) shows actually 13 planets or celestial bodies. You said you see only 11 . . . . look at the top almost in the shadow and you will see the other two. You said you are not a cosmologist (neither am I) but that you are satisfied those other “planets” are not nibiru . . . . without knowing what they are or where they “went” or how they disappeared, then you cannot discount completely that they may be.

As far as your experience as a shaman and the knowledge you gain from this “state” I will not address. . . . except to say. Until we as humans can intelligently and succinctly understand this physical world we inhabit how can we even begin to decipher information or experiences from another realm or dimension or do you have this dimension figured out?

[Ishtar]

I don’t know Ishtar . . . . . your explanation seems too neat and tidy and with current new age “type” beliefs mixed in. I have read volumes of work (and not only sitchin) that delves very deep into our solar system and how it relates to our ancient history. My research and gut tells me you are leaving out many highly intelligent and relevant facts and knowledge concerning information on nibiru and/or the other planets in and outside our system.

As mentioned in the opening post, Nibiru in the Sumerian texts is not a planet but a city on Earth. In this thread, we are just concerning ourself with Nibiru and what's known about it. There is no point in considering all the other trillions of billions of planets in the universe, because the Sumerians did not regard Nibiru as a planet, according to their texts.

Could you tell us what these other facts are that you've found in your research that I'm leaving out?



As far as your experience as a shaman and the knowledge you gain from this “state” I will not address. . . . except to say. Until we as humans can intelligently and succinctly understand this physical world we inhabit how can we even begin to decipher information or experiences from another realm or dimension or do you have this dimension figured out?

Yes, I can answer that. We cannot understand this physical world we inhabit in isolation from the understanding that everything is made from energy and energy is consciousness that operates multi-dimensionally and holographically.

Our brain synapses which make up our cognitive processes start to build from birth, and they are built of thoughts and according to how we think. So if we are taught to think a certain way, our brains take that shape. We have been fed a very limited story about who we are and therefore, our perception is extremely limited about who we are and what this world is.

Perhaps you know the story of the Elephant and the Blind Men? It's a story my guru liked to tell, and this is it in poem form.


http://www.wordinfo.info/words/images/blindmen-elephant.gif

THE BLIND MEN AND THE ELEPHANT by John Godfrey Saxe.

A HINDOO FABLE.

i.

IT was six men of Indostan
To learning much inclined,
Who went to see the Elephant
(Though all of them were blind),
That each by observation
Might satisfy his mind.

ii.

The First approached the Elephant,
And happening to fall
Against his broad and sturdy side,
At once began to bawl:
"God bless me!—but the Elephant
Is very like a wall!"

iii.

The Second, feeling of the tusk,
Cried:"Ho!—what have we here
So very round and smooth and sharp?
To me 't is mighty clear
This wonder of an Elephant
Is very like a spear!"

iv.

The Third approached the animal,
And happening to take
The squirming trunk within his hands,
Thus boldly up and spake:

"I see," quoth he, "the Elephant
Is very like a snake!"

v.

The Fourth reached out his eager hand,
And felt about the knee.
"What most this wondrous beast is like
Is mighty plain," quoth he;
"'T is clear enough the Elephant
Is very like a tree!"

vi.

The Fifth, who chanced to touch the ear,
Said: "E'en the blindest man
Can tell what this resembles most;
Deny the fact who can,
This marvel of an Elephant
Is very like a fan!"

vii.

The Sixth no sooner had begun
About the beast to grope,
Than, seizing on the swinging tail
That fell within his scope,
"I see," quoth he, "the Elephant
Is very like a rope!"

viii.

And so these men of Indostan
Disputed loud and long,
Each in his own opinion
Exceeding stiff and strong,
Though each was partly in the right,
And all were in the wrong!

moral.

So, oft in theologic wars
The disputants, I ween,
Rail on in utter ignorance
Of what each other mean,
And prate about an Elephant
Not one of them has seen!


If we want to understand who we are and what this physical world is really all about, we need to open our eyes ~ through enlightenment, which can be achieved with the help of the intradimensional spirits through the shamanic journey. This is how our earliest ancestors lived.

[Unified Serenity]

Great illustration of the concept of seeking the truth vs proclaiming the truth from faulty eyes. The point I wish to bring to this, in that while I see much merit and truth in your words, I also see a need for caution. I have learned much on my spirit journeys, and in some spiritual paths there is the one called the trickster. Just because someone comes to us in a spirit journey does not make them a being of truth and enlightenment. I have met many in mental institutions stuck in the astral plane after running for truth, finding spirits only to be left in the gray or driven mad by the attachments they made.

I am fully convinced that many a murderer who loudly proclaims their innocense was the victim of a walk in from the spirit realm whom they unwittingly gave their body over to or were overtaken by, and did the crime through that vehicle. Some come back and when caught have no memory but the evidence is clear it was they who did it, but who was operating the "car"? Some come back and I have watched the entity within, spoken with them, and then watched them recede and the person come back only to be in the hell of never leaving this new prison.



I don’t know Ishtar . . . . . your explanation seems too neat and tidy and with current new age “type” beliefs mixed in. I have read volumes of work (and not only sitchin) that delves very deep into our solar system and how it relates to our ancient history. My research and gut tells me you are leaving out many highly intelligent and relevant facts and knowledge concerning information on nibiru and/or the other planets in and outside our system.

As mentioned in the opening post, Nibiru in the Sumerian texts is not a planet but a city on Earth. In this thread, we are just concerning ourself with Nibiru and what's known about it. There is no point in considering all the other trillions of billions of planets in the universe, because the Sumerians did not regard Nibiru as a planet, according to their texts.

Could you tell us what these other facts are that you've found in your research that I'm leaving out?



As far as your experience as a shaman and the knowledge you gain from this “state” I will not address. . . . except to say. Until we as humans can intelligently and succinctly understand this physical world we inhabit how can we even begin to decipher information or experiences from another realm or dimension or do you have this dimension figured out?

Yes, I can answer that. We cannot understand this physical world we inhabit in isolation from the understanding that everything is made from energy and energy is consciousness that operates multi-dimensionally and holographically.

Our brain synapses which make up our cognitive processes start to build from birth, and they are built of thoughts and according to how we think. So if we are taught to think a certain way, our brains take that shape. We have been fed a very limited story about who we are and therefore, our perception is extremely limited about who we are and what this world is.

Perhaps you know the story of the Elephant and the Blind Men? It's a story my guru liked to tell, and this is it in poem form.


http://www.wordinfo.info/words/images/blindmen-elephant.gif

THE BLIND MEN AND THE ELEPHANT by John Godfrey Saxe.

A HINDOO FABLE.

i.

IT was six men of Indostan
To learning much inclined,
Who went to see the Elephant
(Though all of them were blind),
That each by observation
Might satisfy his mind.

ii.

The First approached the Elephant,
And happening to fall
Against his broad and sturdy side,
At once began to bawl:
"God bless me!—but the Elephant
Is very like a wall!"

iii.

The Second, feeling of the tusk,
Cried:"Ho!—what have we here
So very round and smooth and sharp?
To me 't is mighty clear
This wonder of an Elephant
Is very like a spear!"

iv.

The Third approached the animal,
And happening to take
The squirming trunk within his hands,
Thus boldly up and spake:

"I see," quoth he, "the Elephant
Is very like a snake!"

v.

The Fourth reached out his eager hand,
And felt about the knee.
"What most this wondrous beast is like
Is mighty plain," quoth he;
"'T is clear enough the Elephant
Is very like a tree!"

vi.

The Fifth, who chanced to touch the ear,
Said: "E'en the blindest man
Can tell what this resembles most;
Deny the fact who can,
This marvel of an Elephant
Is very like a fan!"

vii.

The Sixth no sooner had begun
About the beast to grope,
Than, seizing on the swinging tail
That fell within his scope,
"I see," quoth he, "the Elephant
Is very like a rope!"

viii.

And so these men of Indostan
Disputed loud and long,
Each in his own opinion
Exceeding stiff and strong,
Though each was partly in the right,
And all were in the wrong!

moral.

So, oft in theologic wars
The disputants, I ween,
Rail on in utter ignorance
Of what each other mean,
And prate about an Elephant
Not one of them has seen!


If we want to understand who we are and what this physical world is really all about, we need to open our eyes ~ through enlightenment, which can be achieved with the help of the intradimensional spirits through the shamanic journey. This is how our earliest ancestors lived.

[Ria]

I would like more information on the city, Nibiru.
An a side, dinosaurs are running around, in the Out back, in Australia, according to the Aborigines; bunyip, burrunjor, yarru.
You can go and ask them what ever you like, as long as you are quick, they snack on any thing they see. I'm given to understand.

[Ishtar]

Hi Unified Serenity

You make some very good points.

There are certain protocols that have to be followed in making a shamanic journey and if these are not followed, the sort of difficulties you describe can occur. That's why it's very important to be trained by a shaman who knows what they're doing, and who's been practising a long time.

This is extremely worthwhile work if done properly. I mean, we don't not take a boat journey across the sea just because there are sharks in the sea. To the shaman, there is no such thing as evil. There is energy in the wrong place. And if we were jump overboard into shark-infested waters, we would, in that instant, be the energy in the wrong place and the sharks would not be evil for gobbling us up. They would be just doing their shark thing.

If guided properly, by an experienced shaman, one need never be the 'energy in the wrong place'. There are protocols that have to be learned before setting off and when they are known about, one is completely safe.

By the way, the shaman doesn't go to the astral plains which tends to be inhabited by fairly lower level practitioners of the arts.

The shamans cosmology is the Lower World, the Middle World and the Upper World, and so long as he is always guided by either his power animal or guide in human form, he will be completely safe.

[Unified Serenity]

I think you and I are talking in semantics here. To you astral only consists of the lower planes. To me there are many planes and I just jump over the lower ones for there is nothing there I want unless it's another human mucking about where they should not. The entities in those lower planes left me alone some years ago now.

Regarding the analogy of the taking a trip in a boat, spirit journeys are more akin to swimming in the the ocean not just sailing over it. Most people do not have shammans or energy adepts to guide them. They get a book, the read about meditation, or they take some drug and kablam they are experiencing! Some are great trips and others are not so great and some only get one shot at it. No, this is not fear porn it's truth. Do NOT just go off into astral / spirit journeys without doing due diligence in preparation, knowing strong grounding skills, and having a spotter if possible until you are adept yourself.

In the old ways, people were taught these things. Nowadays it's just kewl and many travel with no issues. I have seen the direct results of the one's who did not travel safely.

I am enjoying your posts Ishtar, and look forward to more of what you wish to share.


Hi Unified Serenity

You make some very good points.

There are certain protocols that have to be followed in making a shamanic journey and if these are not followed, the sort of difficulties you describe can occur. That's why it's very important to be trained by a shaman who knows what they're doing, and who's been practising a long time.

This is extremely worthwhile work if done properly. I mean, we don't not take a boat journey across the sea just because there are sharks in the sea. To the shaman, there is no such thing as evil. There is energy in the wrong place. And if we were jump overboard into shark-infested waters, we would, in that instant, be the energy in the wrong place and the sharks would not be evil for gobbling us up. They would be just doing their shark thing.

If guided properly, by an experienced shaman, one need never be the 'energy in the wrong place'. There are protocols that have to be learned before setting off and when they are known about, one is completely safe.

By the way, the shaman doesn't go to the astral plains which tends to be inhabited by fairly lower level practitioners of the arts.

The shamans cosmology is the Lower World, the Middle World and the Upper World, and so long as he is always guided by either his power animal or guide in human form, he will be completely safe.

[Ishtar]

Most people do not have shammans or energy adepts to guide them. They get a book, the read about meditation, or they take some drug and kablam they are experiencing! Some are great trips and others are not so great and some only get one shot at it. No, this is not fear porn it's truth. Do NOT just go off into astral / spirit journeys without doing due diligence in preparation, knowing strong grounding skills, and having a spotter if possible until you are adept yourself.

Absolutely agree. Get yourself an experienced shaman guide to teach you the protocols and to open the right gates for you or leave the spirit world alone. That's my advice.

[blufire]

If I may ask Ishtar how long have you felt you have been a shaman and how long have you taken these journeys? Also who is your teacher or experienced shaman guide?

You also mentioned in another post about many others taking or achieving these shamanic journeys . . .are you suggesting that becoming a shaman is something a “regular” person can achieve?




Most people do not have shammans or energy adepts to guide them. They get a book, the read about meditation, or they take some drug and kablam they are experiencing! Some are great trips and others are not so great and some only get one shot at it. No, this is not fear porn it's truth. Do NOT just go off into astral / spirit journeys without doing due diligence in preparation, knowing strong grounding skills, and having a spotter if possible until you are adept yourself.

Absolutely agree. Get yourself an experienced shaman guide to teach you the protocols and to open the right gates for you or leave the spirit world alone. That's my advice.

[trenairio]

Very insightful and informative. Though how Sumeria propped up in such a short time frame IS a mystery. and not sure how hallucinogens can propell shamans astrally into another realm.

[Star Tsar]

Excellent read Ishtar! ;)

[Ria]

post 23 ? lost

[Deega]

Hi Unified Serenity

By the way, the shaman doesn't go to the astral plains which tends to be inhabited by fairly lower level practitioners of the arts.

The shamans cosmology is the Lower World, the Middle World and the Upper World, and so long as he is always guided by either his power animal or guide in human form, he will be completely safe.

Thanks Ishtar, great contribution you're doing here, interesting!

I wonder if you ever had a chance to read Anton Park books? I would highly suggest them, it would add-on to your great knowledge you brought in this tread.

Anton thinks that shamans work with the underworld, I'm not sure if it means astral though. I have had limited experience with a shaman, and I was in the realm of angels, spirits.

Anton believe that beings from distant STARS SYSTEMS came to Earth with flying machines, and they were the creator of human beings.

Very short bio - Anton Park was at 14, an unvoluntary child receiving coded message from the light. He didn't knew what to make of it, didn't asked for it, his mother and family were supportive and with time, getting access to the Sumerian Tablets, he decoded through the years the language on these Tablets and this is how he came about with his books.

Anton says that Stitchin didn't produced the references (when asked) he uses in his allegations to Nibiru.

All the best to you.

Deega

[BestLion]

In all this lets not forget that Sumerian culture is NOT an old culture. The findings in South Africa the 'Adams Calendar' dates to 75,000 BC. Thule dates to 22,000 BC, Atlantis destroyed around 9,400-10,200 BC time.
I have been on the opinion myself that if Annunaki gods were here they were more present around the older times, then the newer..Why? Because from 6,000 BC- Jesus time..no real technological advancements were made..When Jesus was born it was still the bronze age. If the Intelligent Annuniki were here guiding man during Sumeria 6000-2000 BC then they would have advanced far beyond the crude bronze age.
I am of the opinion that the Sumerians were merely stating myths and legends past down to them from the lost civilizations before them.

[Ishtar]

If I may ask Ishtar how long have you felt you have been a shaman and how long have you taken these journeys? Also who is your teacher or experienced shaman guide?

You also mentioned in another post about many others taking or achieving these shamanic journeys . . .are you suggesting that becoming a shaman is something a “regular” person can achieve?

Blufire, it will take the thread off-topic to start talking about myself.

That there are shamans is not in doubt and that our earliest ancestors had a shamanic mindset is also clear from archaeologists and anthropologists who research the subject and there are discussions going into great depth about that on my forum, Ishtar's Gate. That is the subject of this thread. I have started also a thread on here called What Is A Shaman and What Does A Shaman Do? (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?34050-What-Is-A-Shaman-and-What-Does-A-Shaman-Do)and I hope you find that helpful.

[Unified Serenity]

Bestlion, from your studies and experience do you believe there is anything to the idea that it is odd that it appeared the civilization appeared in Sumeria almost overnight with a complete governmental system unlike any previously known? How did that spring up if that is the case? Do you think we just lost the earlier links to that civilization?




In all this lets not forget that Sumerian culture is NOT an old culture. The findings in South Africa the 'Adams Calendar' dates to 75,000 BC. Thule dates to 22,000 BC, Atlantis destroyed around 9,400-10,200 BC time.
I have been on the opinion myself that if Annunaki gods were here they were more present around the older times, then the newer..Why? Because from 6,000 BC- Jesus time..no real technological advancements were made..When Jesus was born it was still the bronze age. If the Intelligent Annuniki were here guiding man during Sumeria 6000-2000 BC then they would have advanced far beyond the crude bronze age.
I am of the opinion that the Sumerians were merely stating myths and legends past down to them from the lost civilizations before them.

[BestLion]

Bestlion, from your studies and experience do you believe there is anything to the idea that it is odd that it appeared the civilization appeared in Sumeria almost overnight with a complete governmental system unlike any previously known? How did that spring up if that is the case? Do you think we just lost the earlier links to that civilization?
it is a mystery. i have a few theories. One of which is before the great catastrophe that hit the earth around 9,400 BC, The civilization had numerous ETs and from what i have studied they were tall Aryan types..many with elongated heads, with a large brain capacity. Thus they are not human, but some type of ET. My one theory is before the event around 9,400 BC lived many higher beings on this planet...then after most were destroyed but only a few..these would become the bloodline of the rulers and cultural bringers. Thus how Sumeria popped up overnight..and not only Sumeria but it is well documented that the Mayans, Incas and Aztec cultures also popped up overnight by these red bearded people who came from the sea.
Also one thing I find..is in many paintings we see these rulers as having long elongated heads..And even the pharaohs of Egypt have this 'the bloodline' think King Tutankhamen . Also many of these same type head-skulls were found in South America, Mexico etc..near all over the world..Thus my theory a few of these gods survived and created a bloodline and became the rulers of the ancient worlds. Thats one of my theories.

[Words of Joy]

Ishtar, I'm curious about your take on the way human species(homo sapiens) evolved(if so...?). Would you like to elaborate on that?

[777]

IYou have applied down to earth facts, I was wondering about what you thought about the tenth planet as it some times referred to, having been depicted in the Sumerian reliefs?

Could you show me where in the Sumerian texts there is reference to a 10th planet?

Nibiru is very much an Earthly city, and is never described as otherwise. Sitchin lied about this, and people have been making it all up ever since.

Also ET means extra-terrestrial or extra to terra, which is Latin for Earth. But the spirits are not from outside Earth or from another galaxy extra to Earth. They are here, and always have been, with us on Earth but in another dimension which is timeless. So it would be more correct to refer to them as extra-dimensionals or EDs.

Again, firmly agree with this. I would also venture these ED's are extensions of our own personal Soul collectives which I percieve to be massive. Timeless as you say, every dimension happening simultaneously, with every shard of Soul personification supporting and dipping into the 3d when required. We seem to be singing from at least the same hymn book. Not that this matters! Just an observation.

Yes. I would go further... and I don't know if you can follow me this far.

We have been trained to look for gods and God coming from the skies because we've had our birthright stolen from us. We need to stop looking to the skies for our saviours and look to ourselves because we ARE the gods we've been looking for. And that's what "they" don't want us to know, because when we know that and start acting from that place, their game will be well and truly up.

That's the ultimate teaching of the spirits and they long for the day that we realise it.

Apart from the half sentence in bold I firmly agree, you are possibly right (and better understanding) on this part too, but that's not for me to confirm. Everything else you've put I hold as true for me. Interesting the metaphor of looking to the skies for our saviours (which has always been hammered into us, even today in the new age), but we do need to look higher (for the lighter) frequency to confirm the crude results of that which is below (3d) and henceforth be cognitive of why its' happening at all.

We will realise it! Whoohoo :-)

[777]

Ishtar, I'm curious about your take on the way human species(homo sapiens) evolved(if so...?). Would you like to elaborate on that?

If I might interject. We have only evolved if we're experiencing linear time. Much as we have to in human form does not mean that linear time is absolute indefinately and that a lack thereof can't be experienced.

[Ishtar]

Guys, fascinating as your questions are about what do I think about this and what do I think about the other, and flattering though it is to be asked, I think we'd better stick to the topic which is Sitchin, Anunnakki and Nibiru.

I think it was Ria who mentioned a few posts back that she'd like to know more about Nibiru and what it actually was, from the Sumerian texts. as I've said that I believe it was a city and certainly not a planet anyway.

If you want to know anything about anything from the Sumerian texts, tte best place to go is ETCSL (The Electronic Text Corpus of Sumerian Literature) which has translations of all the texts and a very good Search engine. I've just been over there and typed in Nibru and here's the link to the results, so fill your boots!

http://etcsl.orinst.ox.ac.uk/cgi-bin/etcsl.cgi?simplesearchword=nibru&simplesearch=translation&searchword=&charenc=gcirc&lists= (http://etcsl.orinst.ox.ac.uk/cgi-bin/etcsl.cgi?simplesearchword=nibru&simplesearch=translation&searchword=&charenc=gcirc&lists=)

[Ishtar]

Bestlion, from your studies and experience do you believe there is anything to the idea that it is odd that it appeared the civilization appeared in Sumeria almost overnight with a complete governmental system unlike any previously known? How did that spring up if that is the case? Do you think we just lost the earlier links to that civilization?

No, we have them .... in archaeological finds. For instance the world's oldest temple is Gobekli Tepe in Turkey which is 10th millennium BCE and in fact, there are lots of sites around what is now Turkey and also India and parts of Mesopotamia dated from about the 10th millennium BCE to the time of the Sumerians.

They only appear to come from nowhere if you're going by written texts because up to the time of the Sumerians, they didn't write anything down and everything was passed on orally.

[Words of Joy]

Guys, fascinating as your questions are about what do I think about this and what do I think about the other, and flattering though it is to be asked, I think we'd better stick to the topic which is Sitchin, Anunnakki and Nibiru.


My intention was to be on topic, namely, if the annunaki weren't the ones to have created mankind then howcome our evolution seems to miss some evolving time?
But with your link I can look for it in the text and see what it says about the creation of mankind. Thanks.

[Ishtar]

Slobbe, we have good firm evidence of man existing 200,000 years ago in South Africa. OK, he was a little rough around the ages, but he created art ... if that's any indication of cognitive advancement.

Modern man, homo sapiens, which is what we are today, is a more gracialised form, but even he's been around since about 25,000 years ago.

There are no significant gaps in the archaeological record.

[BestLion]

About Nibru- Many theories on this as a once planet, a current planet, a city, a continent. a moon..I've heard many!! I myself don't focus on Nibru. i don't think it offers much since it is open to interpretations. I tend to focus on who these Annunaki were, what they offered to mankind, where they lived, their lifestyles..i think if we can find out more about them personally then many clues will be answered.
The main things i try to dig up when reading Sitchen isnt the 12th planet and all that..but more the historical aspect of all this and where it fits in the timeline of things. He writes lots of Mumbo Jumbo..that needs to be passed up 'lack of info, and his own take on it type of stuff"
Also don't just take 1 writers take on these Annunaki but veiw others and other ancient sites.. The Annunaki "or Nordics or Aryans.." are well mentioned in many cultures..and I feel the evidence that they were not human is very compelling..."technologies of the lost civilizations, and even modern civilization that sprang up out of nowhere, large bones, elongated skulls found, historic writing about these people in many cultures, the list goes on..
My study as of late is trying to learn more about these people then the 12th planet, cosmos aspect of them etc...
A few things i have dug up about the Annunaki is, they were not benevolent beings, yet they were not evil. They were fair ..and they were civilization establishers. They were extremely smart, and seemed not to interfere much with interbreeding with mankind :yet they did on a few occasions" They seemed to love royalty and the kingship, gold and the history of gold was from them...they seemed to prize gold the most. They knew how to harness free energy, and how to use sound vibrations to the fullest, they were very key on the cosmos and built cities and monumental around the cosmos. They did not seem egocentric, as human tend to be. They were of a caste type system also. The list goes on..

[Ishtar]

BestLion, can you give some references for your beliefs about the Anunnaki from the Sumerian texts?

[WhiteFeather]

Ishtar: Can we attribute the Crop Circles To Interdimensional Beings that perhaps may very well be sending us important information through it's designs. Re: Crop Circle And Zero Point .

Check Out This Awesome PDF of The Barbury Castle Pi Crop Circle of 2008, and how it relates to scientific/geometrical mathematical gestures. Are they trying to tell us something of great importance. Yes, without a doubt. Have a full look at this PDF.

http://www.kashonia.com/BarburyCastle.pdf


http://www.kashonia.com/BarburyCastle.pdf

[Ishtar]

Whitefeather, like everyone else I'm fascinated by crop circles but have absolutely no clue as to who is making them.

[Kristin]

Here are some notes on the ETCSL translations. As all those who study ancient Sumer are aware, the translations and the programs used to assist are open for interpretation at any given moment as the language and contexts are of such an intricate nature. I lean to caution when looking at these and other translations. Caution as well when developing a theory based on Oxford funded transcripts. However, there are a lot of interesting lines and thoughts to be gained by doing so. Here are the ETCSL thoughts on the subject. I true literary version of the translations has yet to be made and perhaps will never be made lest some brilliant person spends his entire life on the subject... (cough, cough)

http://etcsl.orinst.ox.ac.uk/edition2/pdf/transliterationprinciples.pdf

From the Heart,
Wormhole

"Types of variation in transliteration
The broad types of variation that are likely to be encountered in different transliteration practices are four.
(i) The transliteration is different because the editor has chosen an entirely different reading of the sign or sign-group, implying identification with a different lemma. To read the sign DU as Ñen rather than gub (which normally has the meaning ‘to stand’) implies an interpretation of it as representing, in this particular context, a different verb (Ñen ‘to go’) instead.
(ii) The transliteration is different because, on the basis of historical evidence either newly reinterpreted or not previous available, the reading of the sign has been revised (either throughout Sumerian or in this particular context). An example is the sign MUNUS, with the reading munus ‘woman’, previously often read as mi¤. The reading mi¤ is now restricted to the phrasal verb mi¤...dug› ‘to treat kindly’. Many improvements of this sort have been made to transliterations in recent years, yet Sumerologists must remain familiar with the more old- fashioned transliterations encountered in many standard printed sources.
(iii) A small phonological change has been made to the reading of the sign, again because, on the basis of historical evidence either reinterpreted or not previous available, the reading of the sign has been revised. Examples are åir‹ (formerly sir‹), edin (formerly eden), iri (formerly uru), åudun (formerly åudul). Again, many changes of this sort have been made recently.
(iv) The transliteration varies between a long form of the word or syllable and a short form. The ‘long’ form generally has a consonant at the end. Examples are kur· ~ ku›, dirig ~ diri, pad‹ ~ pa‹, til‹ ~ ti. It is a feature of Sumerian orthography that the final consonant of many such bases is clearly written again in any suffixed form of the word (where the suffix begins with or consists of a vowel), e.g. kur·-re, dirig-ga, pad‹-da, til‹-le. This is an orthographic feature and does not imply doubling of the consonant. (In some words ending in -d, the d becomes -r- when followed by a suffix. In some words ending in -n, the n becomes -m- before a suffix.)
In almost all cases ETCSL has chosen the long form. There are two basic reasons for this. First, using the long form actually helps to disambiguate certain words. For example, the three different words zi ‘life’, zig‹ ‘to rise’ and zid ‘right, just’ are all written with the same sign ZI, which can have the readings zi, zig‹ or zid. By transliterating differently in each case,
the meanings are clear and the words can be lemmatised automatically. The second reason is a pedagogical one. If students learn the long readings from the first, they will be able to differentiate the lemmata and avoid errors in the identification of bases. Similarly the historical spelling court in French identifies the word as the adjective ‘short’ (fem. courte) and disambiguates it from cour ‘courtyard’, although the pronunciation is the same.
This has very little to do with the reality of Sumerian phonology. We will never be able to know whether Sumerian final stops were pronounced but unexploded (as in Cantonese wok) or not pronounced at all (as in French chat). It is a mistake to confuse transliteration (a regularised representation of the cuneiform signs present on the tablet) with attempts to reconstruct the exact phonology of Sumerian. The important thing is the regularity of transliteration, so that any subsequent changes can be made globally. Our experience shows that even advanced Sumerologists can adapt to new readings very quickly!"

[WhiteFeather]

Whitefeather, like everyone else I'm fascinated by crop circles but have absolutely no clue as to who is making them.

May very well be Interdimensional Energies/Beings at play. That's my intuition from most of the authentic and articulate ones that are created.

[BestLion]

BestLion, can you give some references for your beliefs about the Anunnaki from the Sumerian texts?
i don't only read those guys, I try to judge my findings on what history says on them..from how the Hitties talk about their gods, how the Babylonians viewed their gods ..Baal for example is a Annunaki type. Also I found when reading these gurus they dont even agree like Sitchen and Tony Green..they are not totally on the same page about all this..Thus I find it best to veiw what cultures have said about their gods..
Ive studing alot on ancient histories of peoples like the Persians, Babylonians, Hittites, Israelite, Egyptians, Sumarians..and many of these peoples gods are nothing more then offspring's of the Annunaki type gods.

[Ishtar]

BestLion, can you give some references for your beliefs about the Anunnaki from the Sumerian texts?
i don't only read those guys, I try to judge my findings on what history says on them..from how the Hitties talk about their gods, how the Babylonians viewed their gods ..Baal for example is a Annunaki type. Also I found when reading these gurus they dont even agree like Sitchen and Tony Green..they are not totally on the same page about all this..Thus I find it best to veiw what cultures have said about their gods..
Ive studing alot on ancient histories of peoples like the Persians, Babylonians, Hittites, Israelite, Egyptians, Sumarians..and many of these peoples gods are nothing more then offspring's of the Annunaki type gods.

Yes, I agree with all that. But you gave some very specific qualiities and features about the Anunnaki, so I wondered where that information came from. I also only read the sacred texts ~ the Sumerian, the Vedas, the Egyptian etc to get my information because it's the only reliable source. Anything else is just someone else's ideas (or deliberate deception). My point is, as I said in the opening post, I believe that psy-ops are using Sitchin or von Daniken-type stories about the Anunnaki to try to frighten people and keep them in line, and that's my sole reason for wanting to examine this subject, so that we can see what we can prove and what is just supposition.

[BestLion]

Here is a list of the Hittite gods..notice the similarities to the Sumerian gods>

The Hittites

A history of the Hittites including their cities, kings, art and contributions to civilization
Hittite Gods
B = Babylonian
ALALUS: Father of Anus. Anus removed him from the throne.


ANUS: Sky God. Removed his father Alalus from the throne, and was, himself, removed by his son Kumarbis. B = Anu.


ARINNA: Sun Goddess. She sent an Eagle out in search of Telepinus. The effort failed.


EA: He resides in the Apsu, just as he does in Babylonia. What he does in the Hittite pantheon I don't know. He is the one who decided on how to defeat Ulikummis, by using the copper knife that was "used to seperate heaven and earth". B.


ENLIL: Enlil also makes a guest appearance in the Ulikummis myth. He saw Ulikummis as a child and told the gods later, after the child had grown to it's great size, that they could not hope to defeat it.


HEBAT: Wife of Teshub.


HANNAHANNAS: Queen of Heaven. She urges Teshub to do something about Telepinus' disappearance. Teshub went as far as Telepinus' own door, where he banged on the door until he broke his hammer, and thus abandoned the quest.


ILLUYANKAS: A dragon slain by Teshub. There are two versions of this myth. In the old version, they two gods fight and Illuyankas wins. Teshub" then goes to Inaras for advice, and she devises a trap for the dragon. She goes to him with large quantities of liqure, and entices him to drink his fill. Once drunk, the dragon is bound, and Teshub appears with the other gods and kills him. In the later version, the two gods fight and Teshub, again, loses. Illuyankas then takes Teshub's eyes and heart. Teshub then has a son, who grows and marries Illuyankas' daughter. Teshub tells his son to ask for his eyes and heart as a wedding gift, and it is given. Restored, Teshub goes to face Illuyankas once more. At the point of vanquishing the dragon, Teshub's son finds out about the battle; realizing that he had been used for this purpose. He demaned that his father take him along with Illuyankas, and so Teshub killed them both.


illuyankas's daughter: See Illuyankas.


IMBALURIS: A messenger of Kumarbis.


INARAS: Goddess who set a trap for Illuyankas in the old version of the myth.


IRSIRRA DEITIES, THE: Either the "Maidens of Heaven" or else they are underworld deities.


ISHTAR: Only appears in Hittite myth in an attempt to lull Ulikummis by undressing and singing to him. Her attempt failed as the creature didn't see or hear her. B.


KAMRUSEPAS: Goddess of healing and magick. She calms and purified Telepinus upon his return.


KUMARBIS: The Hittlte High God (like El of the Canaanites), Father of the Gods. Removed his father, Anus, from the throne. In order to keep his son Teshub from removing him from the throne, he made Ulikummis to oppose him.


MUKISANUS: Vizier of Kumarbis.


sea goddess: Kumarbis went to this goddess for advice on how to stop Teshub from taking the throne. Her advice seems to have lead to the creation of Ulikummis.


SHAUSHKA: a Love Goddess.


teshub's son: See Illuyankas.


TELEPINUS: He is like Tammuz, a fertility god. He becomes enraged for reasons unknown and storms off into the stepp lands where he falls asleep. Draught and famine ensue. He was brought back by a Bee, after extensive searching by the gods had failed. Son of Teshub.


TESHUB: Ruler God (like Baal of the Canaanites), son of Kumarbis. He is also a sun God, and a fertility God. He carries a hammer as a weapon. He defeated Ulikummis with the help of Ea. When Kumarbis first attempted to remove his father, Anus, from the throne, he bit off the Anus' loins in the struggle. Thus, Anus' seed was implanted within Kumarbis and Teshub was born.


UBELLURIS: This deity is much like the Greek Atlas, who supports the world on his shoulders. Ulikummis was placed on his right shoulder by the Irsirra deities to grow tall and strong. Ubelluris didn't even notice the presence until Ea pointed it out to him.


ULIKUMMIS: Son of Kumarbis. He was made to oppose Teshub. There is also mention that he destoys some of mankind. However, he is actually described as being blind, deaf, and dumb; as well as immobile. He was made of stone and placed on Ubelluris' shoulder to grow. He grew until he reached heaven itself. When the gods found him, Ishtar removed her clothing and attempted to lull him with music, but he didn't see or hear her (as he was a blind and deaf creature). The gods attempted to destroy him, but had no affect (he didn't even notice). Finally, Ea called for the Copper Knife that had been used in the seperation of heaven and earth. He then used the blade to sever Ulikummis from Ubelluris' shoulder; lopping the creature off at the feet. Teshub was then able to destroy the creature totally. It is interesting to note that this god's name is the same as a pair of twin volcanic mountains in Asia Minor. This may explain why he is said to be destroying mankind, even in his seemingly catatonic state.

[Ishtar]

Yes, these peoples all married each other's sisters and swapped stories along the trade routes throughout Mesopotamia, Egypt and India. But it is important to realise that they were myths and not history.

I used to know someone who said: "The only difference between mythology and history is that mythology is true."

Think about it! ;)

[BestLion]

I think myths and legends are part of history and we can learn much about many things via this method. I for one as a historian include myths and legends in my thoughts on history. Heck if you think about it..Atlantis, Aliens, fairies etc..all really just myths...nobody has 100% solid evidence to prove them..yet..why are we on this forum if we didnt think these myths had some 'truth" to them?
** Also i agree with you on many of these writers as having agendas..best to view a wide variety of things before we 100% agree with only 1 mans writings..that can also be cult like.

[777]

BestLion, can you give some references for your beliefs about the Anunnaki from the Sumerian texts?
i don't only read those guys, I try to judge my findings on what history says on them..from how the Hitties talk about their gods, how the Babylonians viewed their gods ..Baal for example is a Annunaki type. Also I found when reading these gurus they dont even agree like Sitchen and Tony Green..they are not totally on the same page about all this..Thus I find it best to veiw what cultures have said about their gods..
Ive studing alot on ancient histories of peoples like the Persians, Babylonians, Hittites, Israelite, Egyptians, Sumarians..and many of these peoples gods are nothing more then offspring's of the Annunaki type gods.

Yes, I agree with all that. But you gave some very specific qualiities and features about the Anunnaki, so I wondered where that information came from. I also only read the sacred texts ~ the Sumerian, the Vedas, the Egyptian etc to get my information because it's the only reliable source. Anything else is just someone else's ideas (or deliberate deception). My point is, as I said in the opening post, I believe that psy-ops are using Sitchin or von Daniken-type stories about the Anunnaki to try to frighten people and keep them in line, and that's my sole reason for wanting to examine this subject, so that we can see what we can prove and what is just supposition.

Are we to assume that the ancient texts are gospel though? Everything else is just someone's ideas sure, but they're based on ancient texts which are just.......someone else's ideas elaborated upon and henceforth corrupted. It then becomes a question of how far you're permitted (with the information available) to go back. That can only come from within imo.

I agree with your point here that Niburu is proveable, but exactly what it is not reachable and mostly shrouded in bullsh..

[Hughe]

The Annunaki did what the bad boys manufactured stories for the 9/11 and other dirty things thousands years ago.
The story of Gods in Hindu context has realistic stories and facts.

[Unified Serenity]

Do you think being in the bloodline of these ancient beings matters?

[Ishtar]

You make some good points 777. They are just 'someone's idea' but the idea was for a good reason.

Myths were originally teaching stories that contained allegories and metaphors to teach various scientific concepts about the universe that could be applied through astronomy, sacred geometry, architecture, smithery and so on.... The teaching wasn't so fragmented and silo-ed off into compartments as it is now .. so philosophy was taught alongside mathematics and to understand the nature of God was to be an expert in we call today 'particle physics.' However, instead of lengthy algebraic equations, the ancients told stories to make their points.

They composed stories in the stars to act as mnemonics for astronomy studies, and the planets to them were gods and goddesses who got up to all sorts to explain astronomical cycles.

It was understood that these teachings were allegorical in nature. Right up until the Gnostic Christians, whose stories can be found in the Nag Hammadi gospels, the myths or sacred text teachings were understood to be in metaphor and allegory and it wasn't until the 3rd century CE and the Emperor Constantine that it changed.

At this time, there was only one very small cult of Christians in Rome who believed in Jesus Christ as a historical figure, and most of the other Christians were Gnostics who understood the scriptural stories as metaphors. Constantine had heard about the beliefs of this cult – that the dying and resurrecting godman was a historical account about a real person. And so he thought to himself: “That’s just the sort of religion that I need to control all the peoples of my vast empire.” … or something like that, anyway.

He had realised that, because the nature of the philosophy of this particular group was literal rather than metaphorical, it would make a wonderful control mechanism. He could control his whole empire through guilt and fear – or what became known as Original Sin. That's why I've referred to it as a psy-ops campaign.

In addition, by setting up a historical figure who died forthe sins of the people, and who interceded with the gods/God on their behalf, then the followers did not need to have their own relationships with the spirits, or gods or God. All that they had to do to be ‘saved’ was to believe in this Sun god fellow. And any interactions between the mundane and the divine could all be nicely handled by a Pope that would be appointed by the Emperor and given the title of God’s Representative on Earth.

And so all that messy and subjective and unpredictable mystical and spiritual business was finally taken out of the hands of the people and left solely to the priests who had been appointed by the Pope.

That's why during Constantine’s reign, and the subsequent reigns of the emperors who followed him over hundreds of years, the whole edifice of the Mystery teachings was destroyed. The libraries where all the knowledge of shamanism and spirituality was stored were burned down, the places where it was taught were sacked and put to the torch, and thousands of dissenters were named as heretics or pagans and murdered.

Of course, it took a long time to wipe out people’s memories that they once had had their own individual experience with, and thus were empowered by, the gods or God (aka, the spirits). Much killing and destruction took place over generations, all over the empire. You can see how extensive it was from the coloured bit of this map which also shows the names of each country’s mythical dying and resurrecting godman, the memories of which had all to be wiped out or demonised in order for the version of the historic godman to remain publicly perceived as true.

http://ishtarsgate.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/godswithinconstantinesreach-1.jpg

Even the priestly astronomers at this time were suppressed. Once, one pointed out that the Earth was round. Another that the Earth went round the Sun. But because all the literature and learning had been destroyed, no-one could quite remember what shape the Earth was, or how it fitted into everything else. And anyway, these astronomers’ teachings went against the teachings of the priesthood, that the Earth was the centre of the Universe, and not the Sun.

So here we are today after 2,000 years of reading myths literally, and that's why we apply that exact same thinking to older texts, like the Sumerian ones. We haven't been taught that they are metaphorical, let alone how to read metaphor, because the knowledge about that was destroyed. So we mistakenly read them as literal history.

As a shaman, when I read myths, I know I'm reading the accounts of other shamans describing what I experience on the shamanic journey and meeting with these same spirits who are teaching me the same particle physics and understanding about the building blocks of the universe.

¤=[Post Update]=¤


Do you think being in the bloodline of these ancient beings matters?

Well, how can you be in the bloodline of beings who've never been human? They were spirits. Of course, when the understanding that they were spirits was lost, then it might have been necessary to pretend that you were in the bloodline of a god. But in reality, nobody was.

[BestLion]

Do you think being in the bloodline of these ancient beings matters?
I think it does. They were not as democracy they were a Caste system. They had priest, prophets, magicians ect..and they ruler in line of the blood..as kings do.
Also they didnt have political correctness and all that modern day rubbish as we now have in society.
Also in near all ancient cultures like the Hittites the kings and nobles 'humans for the most part' considered themselves gods, and set themselves apart from the rest of the peasants. Heck this even went all the way up to near modern times.. Caesar considered himself a god, And many English Kings also claimed this.

[ghostrider]

just an opinion, south africa the first people, civilization and such, some venture out end up in sumeria taking their traditions with them. just a hunch. the annunaki have corrected our DNA 65 times according to Bob Lazar. African people in their dna cannot be programmed. they are taller, stronger, and can out work anyone . they dominate every sport even to this day. anything athletic they do it best... the original slave race of the annunaki...

¤=[Post Update]=¤


Do you think being in the bloodline of these ancient beings matters?

absolutely yes, the life of the flesh is in the blood.

[Ishtar]

the annunaki have corrected our DNA 65 times according to Bob Lazar.

What is his scriptural reference for this?

OK, have looked him up now .. this guy sounds like he's from Psy-Ops 'R Us (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Lazar).

[WhiteFeather]

Yes, these peoples all married each other's sisters and swapped stories along the trade routes throughout Mesopotamia, Egypt and India. But it is important to realise that they were myths and not history.

I used to know someone who said: "The only difference between mythology and history is that mythology is true."

Think about it! ;)

He who controls education, controls history. Think about that for a minute.

[Laurel]

Great thread. Ashtar, I would love to hear more of your thoughts.
Joseph Campbell, in "Hero with A Thousand Faces" and Bill Moyer's amazing 'The Power of Myth' videos, addresses the connection between the "gods" myths. His knowledge and explanations are breathtaking. If you haven't seen it, I highly recommend it.


He who controls education, controls history.
I absolutely agree with you, White Feather. My daughter is very lucky to have a high school history teacher from another country. He often gives the kids another point of view about what is in the history books and media. At 17, she already has learned not to trust all she hears on the news.

[BestLion]

African people in their dna cannot be programmed. they are taller, stronger, and can out work anyone . they dominate every sport even to this day. anything athletic they do it best... the original slave race of the annunaki..
I listened to Coast to Coast, and one rather smart man was taking that the genetic difference between say Sweds to Africans is really like 2-3%..thats quit huge.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDLmqfAZ2C0
"This video is 7 minutes talks of the Annunaki and races
I for one since my conquest to gain 'truth' have thrown out the window my programing thoughts on 'we are all the same, political correctness etc" I WANT TRUTH! As a historian, only since 1965 has the world said all races are the same la la la..bull. From Sumeria -Martin Luther King.. people have never considered all races equal. And also in my study on lost civilizations I am finding many clues of the same. This is nothing to do with racism, but has to do with DNA, and human differences that i think it high time to expose!
Why is it the African can spend years in the sun and not worry about skin caner while a pale white from Ireland if exposed can get skin cancer early in life? "David Wilcox claims cancer is a form of dysfunctional DNA, or a break down of it..more less, cancer is causes by corrupted DNA! just think about that , and think about races, why certain peoples are exposed to things other races cant get..like Africans and sickle cell. Also why are Africans more likely to get AIDS then whites, and one test done says 10% of Nordics are immune to AIDS. It all has to do with DNA..David Wilcox even talks about this numerous times.
Watch that quick video I think he nails it!
I also think the black race were the ones doing the Mining in Africa..and after the catastrophic they moved to central Africa as a safe harbor. I also think they had non black rulers over them. Not all races came out of Africa..thats utter BS! Many races were already here in different places. With different DNA structors.
Also I think it is Christians agenda to claim all races came from Adam..This is just complete fallacy. Adam was not the only man-race created..many were created. Adam was just one of the races.
This has nothing to do with which race is better. its has to do with different DNA, and different times of creations. The same as can be said of the differences between a tiger and a puma..Both are cat family but have different DNA..We dont consider these two cats equal..for they are not equal to each other..but both are from the same family..Same as a Lion and Tiger..two different types, and even act and command different..but are not the same...but on the same not they can mix with each other..and create a liger.

[jcocks]

Ishtar...

I know this is off-topic slightly, but would you say that a lot of our dreams may be a sort of shamanic journey? I've been, for quite some time, of the opinion that our dreams are far more important (and meaningful) than we are lead to believe. In western cultures, we're all but told to ignore our dreams.... Of course, the ancient cultures know/knew better...

[modwiz]

Ishtar...

I know this is off-topic slightly, but would you say that a lot of our dreams may be a sort of shamanic journey? I've been, for quite some time, of the opinion that our dreams are far more important (and meaningful) than we are lead to believe. In western cultures, we're all but told to ignore our dreams.... Of course, the ancient cultures know/knew better...

LOL. Western culture has become an oxymoron. Wasn't always that way. Certain unsavory influences have produced that result with the unconscious willingness of the parasitized culture.

:focus:

[write4change]

There is a documentary film out about spending two years after breaking down the human genome of them going out to various areas of the world and taking their DNA. One of the things learned is that there were no blue eyes or white men until ten thousand years ago and they showed up in the Northern Himalayas first where the Chinese found mummies of tall red haired blue eyed people and they have surpressed all research on that.

Just like they are planting forests on all their pyramids that they won't let be excavated. There is one film from 1994 showing a bunch of them from a distance and then up close so you have no doubt what they are not hills as the natives thought.

[BestLion]

Just like they are planting forests on all their pyramids that they won't let be excavated. There is one film from 1994 showing a bunch of them from a distance and then up close so you have no doubt what they are not hills as the natives thought.
They say from the Canary Islands-South American to China are thousands of these pyramids that are now covered by forest and no excavation has been done on them. No doubt their are a lot of missing clues about the lost civilizations.Also why will they not excavate under the paw of the Spinx? It is noted by sysmograpghs that their is a hallow room under the Sphinx paw. Yet forbidden to excavate that stuff..

[Ishtar]

Great thread. Ashtar, I would love to hear more of your thoughts.
Joseph Campbell, in "Hero with A Thousand Faces" and Bill Moyer's amazing 'The Power of Myth' videos, addresses the connection between the "gods" myths. His knowledge and explanations are breathtaking. If you haven't seen it, I highly recommend it.

I have read Joseph's Campbell's book The Hero With A Thousand Faces and I found it to be a good starting point for learning to read metaphor and allegory in what, up until now, others have tried to convince us are historical accounts. When you read this book, you can see clearly that myths cannot be historical accounts ~ otherwise why does the same hero turn up in so many diverse places on the Earth and perform the same or very similar actions with similar characters in similar plotlines?

So then you begin to realise that these similar stories were part of a worldwide system of teaching, with just the names and locations altered slightly to make the story relevant to the locality it was being told in. Then you start to ask why these stories were told ...

jcocks, yes I agree about dreams, but as Modwiz says, Back To Topic. ;)

[araucaria]

Fascinating thread, Ishtar, thank you!

I do have a minor quibble though, with the following:


The Oxford scholars borrowed this word from the classical Greeks who called the spirits 'Adonai' and this was translated by the scholars as 'gods'. The classical Greeks actually used the word theos, plural theoi, feminine thea (the root of theology). In Hesiod’s Works and Days, for instance (verse 72), you get ‘thea Athene’, where ‘the goddess Athena’ is not a mistranslation. (I studied ancient Greek and have read large chunks of Homer & Co in the original, so I know what I’m talking about here).

‘Adonai’ on the other hand is one Hebrew word for God/Lord.

Any discussion of this topic would have to refer to Julian Jaynes’ book on “The origin of consciousness in the breakdown of the bicameral mind”, claiming that the Greek gods were voices in men’s heads before consciousness even existed. It is a controversial thesis to say the least, and it has been taken up in some extremely negative ways, heading in the direction of presentday mind control.

[Ishtar]

Thank you, araucaria, for that correction. I was typing so fast that I got careless and mixed up my Adonais with my Theos. ;)

Yes Julian Jaynes was much under-rated if not vilified at the time.

[RedeZra]

the Anunnaki of Sumer seems to be the Nephilim of the Bible

the heroes of old the giant demigods the sons of Anak


Gilgamesh an ancient king of Sumer is described as two-thirds god and one third man and is depicted as a giant



http://homeschoolcourses.files.wordpress.com/2011/08/gilgamesh_louvre.jpg


there were giants on the earth in those days according to Scripture traditions artifacts and bones

these were huge flesh and blood hybrids between humans and spirits

[Ishtar]

t


there were giants on the earth in those days according to Scripture traditions artifacts and bones

these were huge flesh and blood hybrids between humans and spirits

We know about the stories, like Gilgamesh, but would you like to provide some archaeological evidence for these bones?

[Ishtar]

This may seem to be going off topic but I know some of you are having trouble with the idea that myths are metaphorical and allegorical teachings and not historical accounts, so I'd like to introduce you to the Stoic philosopher Philo of Alexandria (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philo) really just to make the point that 2,000 years ago, many of the most respected scribes and scholars read the Bible as allegory and not historical fact.



Philo (20 BC – 50 AD), known also as Philo of Alexandria (Greek: Φίλων ὁ Ἀλεξανδρεύς), Philo Judaeus, Philo Judaeus of Alexandria, Yedidia, "Philon", and Philo the Jew, was a Hellenistic Jewish Biblical philosopher born in Alexandria.

Philo used philosophical allegory to attempt to fuse and harmonize Greek philosophy with Jewish philosophy. His method followed the practices of both Jewish exegesis and Stoic philosophy. His allegorical exegesis was important for several Christian Church Fathers, but he has barely any reception history within Judaism. "The sophists of literalness," as he calls the literalist Jews,[1] "opened their eyes superciliously" when he explained to them the marvels of his exegesis. He believed that literal interpretations of the Hebrew Bible would stifle mankind's view and perception of a God too complex and marvelous to be understood in literal human terms.

He has actually given a sort of at-a-glance, 'quick and dirty' way to understand Bibilical stories as allegorical exegesis: a sort of Bible code if you like. (Dan Brown would love it!)



He has special rules that direct the reader to recognize the passages which demand an allegorical interpretation, and which help the initiated to find the correct and intended meaning. These passages are such as contain:

The doubling of a phrase;
An apparently superfluous expression in the text;
The repetition of statements previously made;
A change of phraseology—all these phenomena point to something special that the reader must consider.
An entirely different meaning may also be found by a different combination of the words, disregarding the ordinarily accepted division of the sentence in question into phrases and clauses.
The synonyms must be carefully studied; e.g., why λαὸς ("people") is used in one passage and γένος ("genus") in another, etc.
A play upon words must be utilized for finding a deeper meaning; e.g., sheep (πρόβατa) stand for progress in knowledge, since they derive their name from the fact of their progressing (προβαίνειν), etc.
A definite allegorical sense may be gathered from certain particles, adverbs, prepositions, etc.;
and in certain cases it can be gathered even from the parts of a word; e.g., from διά in διάλευκος.
Every word must be explained in all its meanings, in order that different interpretations may be found.
The skillful interpreter may make slight changes in a word, following the rabbinical rule, "Read not this way, but that way." Philo, therefore, changed accents, breathings, etc., in Greek words.
Any peculiarity in a phrase justifies the assumption that some special meaning is intended: e.g., where μία ("one") is used instead of πρώτη ("first"; Gen. i.5), etc. Details regarding the form of words are very important:
The number of the word, if it shows any peculiarity in the singular or the plural: the tense of the verb, etc.;
The gender of the noun;
The presence or omission of the article;
The artificial interpretation of a single expression;
The position of the verses of a passage;
Peculiar verse-combinations;
Noteworthy omissions;
Striking statements;
Numeral symbolism. Philo found much material for this symbolism in the Hebrew Bible, and he developed it more thoroughly according to the methods of the Pythagoreans and Stoics. He could follow in many points the tradition handed down by his allegorizing predecessors.[18]

[edit] Numbers

Philo analyzed the usage of numbers of the Bible, and believed that certain numbers symbolized different ideas.

Philo regards number one as God's number, and the basis for all numbers ("De Allegoriis Legum," ii.12 [i.66]).
Philo regards number two as the number of schism, of that which has been created, of death ("De Opificio Mundi, § 9 [i.7]; "De Allegoriis Legum," i.2 [i.44]; "De Somaniis," ii.10 [i.688]).
Three is the number of the body ("De Allegoriis Legum," i. 2 [i.44]) or of the Divine Being in connection with His fundamental powers ("De Sacrificiis Abelis et Caini," § 15 [i.173]).
Four is potentially what the number ten actually is, the perfect number ("De Opificio Mundi," §§ 15, 16 [i.10, 11], etc.); but in an evil sense four is the number of the passions, πάθη ("De Congressu Quærendæ Eruditionis Gratia." § 17 [i.532]).
Five is the number of the senses and of sensibility ("De Opificio Mundi," § 20 [i.14], etc.).
Six, the product of the masculine and feminine numbers 3 × 2 and in its parts equal to 3+3, is the symbol of the movement of organic beings ("De Allegoriis Legum," i.2 [i.44]).
Seven has the most various and marvelous attributes ("De Opiticio Mundi," §§ 30-43 [i.21 et seq.]).
Eight, the number of the cube, has many of the attributes determined by the Pythagoreans ("Quæstiones in Genesin," iii.49 [i.223, Aucher]).
Nine is the number of strife, according to Gen. xiv. ("De Congressu Qu. Eruditionis Gratia," § 17 [i.532]).
Ten is the number of perfection ("De Plantatione Noë," § 29 [i.347]).

Philo determines also the values of the numbers 50, 70, and 100, 12, and 120.

[araucaria]

Yes, the Cabbala takes this approach to the Bible too - as an extremely tightly knit poem where you can squeeze meaning out of every last letter.

[D-Day]

For anyone who is interested, here's another thread related to this topic that was started by Bill Ryan back in April of this year...

The Annunaki: http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?20331-The-Anunnaki

And for those who can't be bothered looking through the thread, I've included Bill's opening post below...


Bill Ryan

--------

Dear All,

I recently wrote up some notes about the Anunnaki for someone who knew little about them. The concise report I created seemed to have some value (you will not find this information all in one place anywhere else) - and so here it is:

Anunnaki is Sumerian for "those who came from Heaven to Earth". They were regarded by the Sumerians as "gods", but were actually ETs.

They are 8-9 feet tall [2.4 - 2.7m], and like dressing up in ceremonial costumes (including headdresses), which are colorful, flamboyant, ornate, and ceremonial. Their culture goes back to 100,000 years or more, and they attach a great importance to tradition, ritual, ceremony and symbols.

They have large heads with a pronounced jaw and are physically very strong. They also have enhanced mental abilities and can certainly operate effectively in the astral realms. But their technology (spacecraft, and ability to manipulate space and time) is also very advanced.

They certainly do not ride around on an icy, rocky planetoid ("Nibiru") waiting patiently for it to return near Earth every 3,600 years. They have their own spacecraft. Henry Deacon said they looked a little like this (the 'wings' retract and are ornamental):

http://projectavalon.net/Winged_craft_similar_to_Anunnaki.jpg

They were here in Sumerian times, about 6,000 years ago, when they arrived on Earth to 'jump-start' the Sumerian civilization which had always puzzled archeologists inasmuch as it seemed to arise out of a much more primitive culture, almost literally overnight.

Suddenly, the Sumerians had law, government, education, finance, literature, music, and everything that we would assume as a necessary part of a healthy civilized society.

The Anunnaki attach a great deal of importance to administration, laws, finance, agreements, and very complex administrative structures. Much of what has become imported into human societies as royal ceremony, pyramidal hierarchies, levels of initiation within secret societies, and all the attached complex symbolism, much of which has high traditional significance but which can also be deliberately obscure to the casual observer, can all be traced back to Anunnaki influence.

In present time, they are active on Mars, and this has been reported by Project Camelot whistleblower Henry Deacon (pseudonym), who saw them at first hand. Henry said that since Sumerian times, the Anunnaki race has split into two factions - one friendly to humans and the other less so.

He hinted strongly that the less friendly race has acquired a taste for human flesh. He described how when he was working for black projects as an electronics engineer, he was invited to a briefing in which this topic was presented. He walked out in disgust, and was amazed that (a) no-one stopped him from leaving, and (b) he was the only person who walked out.

According to Zecharia Sitchin (recently passed) - who 'translated' many ancient Sumerian texts - and whose work has been dismissed by conventional archeologists but widely accepted among the alternative community - one reason the Anunnaki came to Planet Earth was to mine gold, which they had a strong desire for and attributed a great deal of value and importance to. It's possible that our own love and value and fascination for gold in the present day is a throwback to the attitude introduced by the Anunnaki.

One veteran researcher, who Kerry Cassidy and I also know personally, knew Zecharia Sitchin very well. This person told us that Zecharia had told him that his books were NOT translated from the Sumerian - but were actually channeled products of automatic writing.

We were also told that Zecharia Sitchin was paid on a retainer basis by the NSA, who always wanted to be kept up to date by Sitchin about what the Anunnaki were up to - because it seemed that Sitchin had a direct telepathic line to the Anunnaki in real time. (Note: there is quite a lot in Sitchin's books that is certainly disinformation - possibly deliberately inserted by the Anunnaki themselves). But quite a lot of the basic story is probably quite true.

Bill Ryan
Project Avalon
April 2011

Just thought this might add another layer to the discussion.

POST EDIT:

Some may also find the following link to be a useful source of Annunaki-related information:

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sumer_anunnaki/anunnaki/1-anunnaki-main.html

[BestLion]

scholars read the Bible as allegory and not historical fact.
Don't forget also the Bible is nothing more the pure plagiarism of the Egyptian Book of the Dead and the Sumerian type religions.The nephliam were the Annunaki in the Sumerian religion..the Jews turned them into fallen angels. Jehovah god, also had other names like El Shadi, and Elohim...hnmm Elohim? El> Enlil?? ring a bell? Also this is the original name of god. Elohim also is plural.. NOT singular. The Bible is a copy of older religions that have been misinterpreted and used for one religions agenda. So when we read the Bible we are really reading the same old gods from the Sumerians-Hittite, Canaanites, Jubusites, Ammorities, Babylonians etc..

[RedeZra]

We know about the stories, like Gilgamesh, but would you like to provide some archaeological evidence for these bones?

the establishment does not like to exhibit evidence which challenge the theory of evolution

so bones of giants are most likely silenced inside Smithsonian cellars


http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?3415-there-were-Giants-in-the-earth-in-those-days

[jcocks]

So then you begin to realise that these similar stories were part of a worldwide system of teaching, with just the names and locations altered slightly to make the story relevant to the locality it was being told in. Then you start to ask why these stories were told ...


Actually, I would find the question of who more interesting. Then, once you know who, you can possibly ascertain why.

And, once again, I would say the anunaki / elohim / nephilim would be the likely culprits... And the why, well... probably a kind of "creation science for dummies", among other things....

I could of course be wrong, but it would really make my whole life to be shown proof that I am right :)

[Ishtar]

D-DAY

With no disrespect intended to Bill, his post is exactly the sort of pure unmitigated bilge that feeds psy-ops campaigns because it cannot be and is not substantiated by named sources or any written or archaeological evidence.

It is not enough to say that Sitchin fed us disinformation ~ he actually lied by pretending the Sumerian texts said something that they don't say. So once you know someone has lied, why would you believe anything else they say? And would you not question why they lied .... was it for money or power or were they coerced into doing so by higher powers? If his texts were channelled, why did he not say so? Because no-one would then believe him? Well, they'd be right.

Personally, I find most channelling highly suspect. When I read it, visions swim into my mind of second rate hack science fiction writers sitting around a table and cracking up laughing about the latest wheeze they've come up with. The channelling of the Ascensionists always follows the same line and has done for years ..."We are coming. It's just round the corner. We're arriving soon..." and yet they never come.

It is time for us to grow up and own our own narrative, rather than having one foisted upon by us by people we don't know, have never met and have no clue as to their integrity or motivation. This kind of disinformation feeds on ignorance and laziness... ignorance of what the texts actually say and archaeological record shows, and laziness about consulting the evidence for ourselves and coming to a self-empowered view. Instead, we just follow the latest self-professed leader like sheeple, not people.

I talked earlier in the thread about contacting other dimensions and working with the spirits there, that the Sumerians called the Anunnaki. There's another very good thread on here about Ralph Ring (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?26243-James-Gilliland-and-Ralph-Ring-Contact-has-begun-July-13-2011&highlight=ralph+ring), who makes the point that none of the intra-dimensional craft that they constructed would work unless the operators consciousness (which is energy) was raised and that the only way to raise consciousness is by unconditional Love. That's how Ring and Co operated their craft, and that's why when the CIA and other operatives took his craft and tried to make them work, they couldn't. Same goes for why the CIA or any other psy-ops agents haven't the first clue about what the Anunnaki are ... but they can construct a good tale about them in order to manipulate people, just as psy-ops campaigns have been doing since the days of the Emperor Constantine.

I was really hoping to keep this thread concentrated on what we could ascertain for ourselves without interjection from various third party anonymous sources (this person said to this person said to this person) for which there is no possible substantiation. I also didn't intend it to be a lightening rod for further disinformation to be dumped down willy-nilly with no respect for the traditional academic method of providing references and sources.

So I don't see that post of Bill's 'adding another layer' unless you mean another layer of confusion and disinformation which has the net effect of once again disempowering the people, the sub-text being "I know better than you, but I can't tell you how I know or who I spoke to and you'll just have to accept it's all for your own good. Now be good and go along and play."

[Ishtar]

--------]

They were here in Sumerian times, about 6,000 years ago, when they arrived on Earth to 'jump-start' the Sumerian civilization which had always puzzled archeologists inasmuch as it seemed to arise out of a much more primitive culture, almost literally overnight.

Just pulling out this bit ... as it is patently not true to anyone who studies archaeology and anthropology. The Sumerian civilisation did not appear from nowhere. The story of man on this Earth can fully documented by the archaeological record for more than 200,000 years and there are no breaks in that record.

There are temples and planned, structured communities discernable right up to the end of the last Ice Age.


--------]
Suddenly, the Sumerians had law, government, education, finance, literature, music, and everything that we would assume as a necessary part of a healthy civilized society.

Again, not true ~ they were the first, along with the Indians, to write down what they were doing. That's all.

As for them being the first with music, I can show you a 40,000 year old flute.

[RedeZra]

The Biblical story about the Judaic equivalent, the Elohim, often gets quoted as proof that they came to the Earth and made love with the "daughters of man". But this is a metaphor for how Spirit combines with matter ~ another term for electromagnetic energy. In ancient myths, Spirit is usually depicted as the male principle and Matter (mater, maternal) is represented as female. This story is about the act of fertility that is at the heart of the creation which is electromagnetic.


elohim in the Bible is used about spirits

there are several spirits and then there is the source of spirits

who is also Spirit

therefore elohim is also used about God who is Spirit and father of spirits

[Ishtar]

We know about the stories, like Gilgamesh, but would you like to provide some archaeological evidence for these bones?

the establishment does not like to exhibit evidence which challenge the theory of evolution

so bones of giants are most likely silenced inside Smithsonian cellars


http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?3415-there-were-Giants-in-the-earth-in-those-days

Right, so that's very handy isn't it? They must be covering it up, so we're going to believe it anyway.

I know they do cover stuff up, but we need to see what they're covering up in the first place, before they cover it up, to be sure it exists.

Otherwise, I could just say that an anonymous source told me that they've got Anunakki skeletons in the Smithsonian that have three legs, four heads and pink penises ... and who could dispute me? ;)

[RedeZra]

I know they do cover stuff up, but we need to see what they're covering up in the first place, before they cover it up, to be sure it exists.

Otherwise, I could just say that an anonymous source told me that they've got Anunakki skeletons in the Smithsonian that have three legs, four heads and pink penises ... and who could dispute me? ;)

i don't need the establishment to show me the bones

when Scripture tradition and artifacts tell me that there were giants on the earth in those days

besides there are pics and information on the net

and if google is your friend maybe you even find pink penises ; )

[D-Day]

They were here in Sumerian times, about 6,000 years ago, when they arrived on Earth to 'jump-start' the Sumerian civilization which had always puzzled archeologists inasmuch as it seemed to arise out of a much more primitive culture, almost literally overnight.

Just pulling out this bit ... as it is patently not true to anyone who studies archaeology and anthropology. The Sumerian civilisation did not appear from nowhere. The story of man on this Earth can fully documented by the archaeological record for more than 200,000 years and there are no breaks in that record.

There are temples and planned, structured communities discernable right up to the end of the last Ice Age.



Suddenly, the Sumerians had law, government, education, finance, literature, music, and everything that we would assume as a necessary part of a healthy civilized society.

Again, not true ~ they were the first, along with the Indians, to write down what they were doing. That's all.

As for them being the first with music, I can show you a 40,000 year old flute.

Ishtar, please don't misquote me.
These are Bill's words, not mine.
Just wanted to clarify that.

[Ishtar]

Sorry D-Day, will fix it immediately.

[Ishtar]

RedeZra

Is Google my friend?

We need to understand that we're in an information war and the only safe and effective way forward is to believe only what we can verify.

[RedeZra]

RedeZra

Is Google my friend?

We need to understand that we're in an information war and the only safe and effective way forward is to believe only what we can verify.

i agree

but we can't verify what the establishment wants to refute

so if we want truths then we are on our own

against the establishment

[Ishtar]

RedeZra

Is Google my friend?

We need to understand that we're in an information war and the only safe and effective way forward is to believe only what we can verify.

i agree

but we can't verify what the establishment wants to refute

so if we want truths then we are on our own

against the establishment

Redezra,

My forum, Ishtar's Gate, is now closed. But I used to have many archaeologists on there whose work had been buried/dismissed/scoffed at/ridiculed by the establishment. However, they did at least produce the evidence in the first place for it to then be buried/dismissed/scoffed at/ridiculed ....

If we don't at least produce the evidence in the first place, then we can make up anything we like as we go along and then just say "Oh well, the establishment buried it."

We have to stay open-minded, of course. But not so much that our brains fall out.