Pane Andov; Our Sun becomes a Red Giant in 2012

[mojo]

Hi All,
Pane Andov's research and recent video series entitled, '2012 Equation Solved,' and posted in another thread by Calz_Avaretard is very interesting. He describes how crop circles that have been decoded point to an energy wave that will turn our sun into a Red Giant. Certainly this is information worth a follow up? Does anyone else agree that the crop circles support Pane Andov's theory that this will happen? And what of the photos and other information he mentions that NASA and TPTB already know this?

Here is a link to his web site and sun information.

http://www.paneandov.com/the-sun/

[Lord Sidious]

Go and do some astronomical study and you will find that it is not possible.
This is something that happens over a vast period, not a few years.

[Jake]

I more resonated with his descriptions of the crop circles being visual references to chi energy and chakra activation! I will go back and watch again. I do love this guy. :)

[Calz]

Go and do some astronomical study and you will find that it is not possible.
This is something that happens over a vast period, not a few years.

He is suggesting that the Sun will react with the "energy wave" eminating from an explosion from the galactic center (allegedly hitting the Sun in December 2012).

Astrophysicists are not in agreement about everything by any stretch. Astronomy is similar to other sciences in that the "consensus" mainstream "peer reviewed" ideas are those funded by the "system". Those who come up with theories that don't conform loose their funding in many cases.

Programmed reality ... brought to us by the masters of illusion.

Anyway ... you could be correct Sid.

I would give pause before saying it is "not possible".

[Bryn ap Gwilym]

Its to do the with Wallace Thorhill & The Electric Universe theory if memory serves me correct?

[Calz]

Its to do the with Wallace Thorhill & The Electric Universe theory if memory serves me correct?

Yes.

Electric Universe being one of the areas of disagreement.


*** adding ***


Touched on the Electric Universe in this thread but only as background information. All sorts of info on the net about it.


http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?25150-Wanna-go----WAY----outside-dah-box

[Teakai]

Go and do some astronomical study and you will find that it is not possible.
This is something that happens over a vast period, not a few years.

Based on what theory of the sun, though, M'lord? That it is a magnet attracting its heat to its surface or that it is a raging ball of fire at its core?

[Lord Sidious]

Go and do some astronomical study and you will find that it is not possible.
This is something that happens over a vast period, not a few years.

Based on what theory of the sun, though, M'lord? That it is a magnet attracting its heat to its surface or that it is a raging ball of fire at its core?

Going by what I have read over the years.
I have been interested in astronomy since before I went to school.
I have seen nothing that could suggest that a star can go from healthy to a red giant overnight.

[Teakai]

Going by what I have read over the years.
I have been interested in astronomy since before I went to school.
I have seen nothing that could suggest that a star can go from healthy to a red giant overnight.

That's why I was asking what theory you were using. The electric universe theory is relatively new. It holds the theory that the sun is attracting heat to it rather than emitting it from it's core.

[Lord Sidious]

Going by what I have read over the years.
I have been interested in astronomy since before I went to school.
I have seen nothing that could suggest that a star can go from healthy to a red giant overnight.

That's why I was asking what theory you were using. The electric universe theory is relatively new. It holds the theory that the sun is attracting heat to it rather than emitting it from it's core.

Even so, there is no info that could get a young star to red giant stage that fast.
As far as I know, no one has ever observed such a thing.
Theories aren't worth jack without some type of info that backs them.

[Teakai]

Even so, there is no info that could get a young star to red giant stage that fast.
As far as I know, no one has ever observed such a thing.
Theories aren't worth jack without some type of info that backs them.

Have you looked into the electric universe theory at all, M'lord? It's a much stronger theory than the one we have at the moment, and it explains how things work far better. It also explains why the dark spots on the sun's surface are cooler areas, which, if the sun were a mass of fiery gas they ought not exist at all, let alone be cooler.

This is a really interesting documentary about it if you're interested.
The sun part starts at the 33:20 mark if you don't fancy watching the whole thing.
http://vimeo.com/16256646

[mojo]

Hi All,
I wish Pane Andov was reading this thread and could help. The debate should really begin with the reason why our sun might possibly become a Red Giant. It has to do with the supposed energy wave. The wave is predicted for 2012, so maybe finding out if a wave exists should have been the starting point, sorry my bad. Pane seems to have data to suggest the wave is real, with photos posted. If that is the case maybe something is coming and the sun might be affected. Thanks again for any input and sorry if my focus wasn't very clear but I was thinking this would be important information to learn about.

[Calz]

Hi All,
I wish Pane Andov was reading this thread and could help. The debate should really begin with the reason why our sun might possibly become a Red Giant. It has to do with the supposed energy wave. The wave is predicted for 2012, so maybe finding out if a wave exists should have been the starting point, sorry my bad. Pane seems to have data to suggest the wave is real, with photos posted. If that is the case maybe something is coming and the sun might be affected. Thanks again for any input and sorry if my focus wasn't very clear but I was thinking this would be important information to learn about.

Pane (as it came out in the thread with the vids) was a PA1 member and there was a link to a thread of his.

I could shoot him an email and see if would consider coming back as time permits?

Perhaps if MorningSong worked with him in the past (helping with e-book) or if anyone else knows him on a personal basis that might be preferrable.

[Calz]

Copying over from the other thread:



I am a great fan of Pane's. I helped with translating his first e-book, a compilation of his threads on the Old Avalon. His presentations were/are a big part of my re-awakening process.

Thanks for posting his work.

Thank you MorningSong.

giovonni posted this on the "From Kerry's Blog" thread.





If anyone hasn't watched this Video i suggest you do in its entirety. Im listing 1 of the 8 videos, It Has great resonance with me, this guy knows something big. It has much relevence to this thread.




Note ~ Pane (astralwalker) was (is) a member of the original Project Avalon Forum :tinfoil3:
here's a link to his very popular thread ~
012 Nexus Event – Unknown Form of Energy comes our way!
http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=8441&highlight=nexus+2012

also a link to his e-book
2012 Equation Solved
http://www.scribd.com/doc/37714816/2012-Equation-Solved

[Calz]

Going by what I have read over the years.
I have been interested in astronomy since before I went to school.
I have seen nothing that could suggest that a star can go from healthy to a red giant overnight.

That's why I was asking what theory you were using. The electric universe theory is relatively new. It holds the theory that the sun is attracting heat to it rather than emitting it from it's core.

Even so, there is no info that could get a young star to red giant stage that fast.
As far as I know, no one has ever observed such a thing.Theories aren't worth jack without some type of info that backs them.

Well, according to Pane anyway, he suggests otherwise.

Take the PDF link and consider page 5 (of 214). He suggests the "Chandra X-Ray Observatory" has "recorded stars increasing in size by the extreme influence of the energetic wave (from GC) and going through major changes; swelling in size and then ejecting the outer layer and becoming much smaller."

Cannot cut and paste from there so if nothing else have a look at that page.




Calz - I am on dialup so downloading all of these is untenable. Do you (or anyone who watches these) remember which one has the info about Australia?
Thanks for the thread.

If you go to his web site you can download a PDF of the entire lecture set to read etc plus lots more info... here is the address:

http://www.paneandov.com/

and here is the link for the download... http://www.box.net/shared/1hvnjrfd26

Der sorry guys would help if I read every post.... sory for the duplication....:yield: :yield: :yield:

[The Truth Is In There]

i'm pretty sure what that crop circle depicts is that the magnetic field of the sun expands, not the sun itself. if the sun were to expand beyond the orbit of mercury what do you think would happen to all life on earth? everyting would be roasted and there's nothing that points in that direction, not in science, not in prophecy or religious scripture, not in crop circles & ET messages nor anywhere else. about the expanding magnetic field on the other hand we got a good deal of information from various sources. i believe that essentially that is what's going to trigger the "ascension". in fact, i think it's already happening and will just further increase in 2012.

[markoid]

I downloaded a vid of his spinning crop circles and wow! they are quite amazing. They are claimed to be for dna activation and they do seem have a nice effect on me personally. Closing the eyes after watching them is quite expansive.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVtj_Hgo7uk&feature=channel_video_title

[Steven]

Pane Andov came to Avalon 1, under the nickname of Astralwalker, a couple years ago and made quite a popular thread presenting his theory. I was absolutly astonished to see people buying that, since it was filled up with false assumptions, like the Pluto's orbit, and remarkable simplistic interpretation of crop circles. Without even considering all the researches already done on crop circles from various different people.

The biggest mistake he does is jumping into conclusion regardless of what others have to say about 2012. He has a very good talent to make beautiful post filled up with images and make some interesting comments, but there are too many flaws in his theory.

Namaste, Steven

[Deborah (ahamkara)]

Whatever the final outcome of the events we are experiencing, our power lies in the moment. Each NOW is all that we have, and it is enough.
We must awaken to our sovereignty and power and learn to resonate with our own truth. People seem quick to give away power, and real knowing (knowledge) to this or that authority, theory, or research. That is a limited paradigm and seems likely to be of little use. Awakened, we are able to understand the truth of our own situation, which may be entirely different from that of our friend or neighbor. This awakened state is really the only way we "prepare", in my opinion. thanks!

[WhiteFeather]

Hopefully the Mods/Admins can contact Bill/Kerry and get the ball rolling with an interview from Mr. Astralwalker himself. Would be a very interesting interview to say the least.

[ulli]

Going by what I have read over the years.
I have been interested in astronomy since before I went to school.
I have seen nothing that could suggest that a star can go from healthy to a red giant overnight.

That's why I was asking what theory you were using. The electric universe theory is relatively new. It holds the theory that the sun is attracting heat to it rather than emitting it from it's core.

My gut tells me it is a combination of both... like an interchange.
Reciprocal maintenance.

[Calz]

I tried for about an hour to find 2nd source for Pane's claim that images from Chandra had substantiated his theory regarding the Sun going red giant (then collapsing) in reaction to the "wave" coming from the galactic core (explosion ... supernova ... whatever).

I could find no such proof.

Could be any such information was "scrubbed" like much from nasa ... but jury seems to still be out.

In the search it appears the Paul LaViolette material is somewhat sympathetic. He was interviewed by Camelot a couple years ago. For the benefit of anyone interested or who missed the interview here is the Camelot page:

Dr Paul LaViolette :
Earth under Fire : Galactic Superwaves

Lagonisi, Greece, August 2009


Dr Paul LaViolette is the measured counterpart to Patrick Geryl, whose interview we have released simultaneously. A brilliant and maverick astrophysicist, Paul is best known for his research into a new theory of matter he calls Subquantum Kinetics - based on systems theory, which he studied for his PhD thesis - and for his carefully argued hypothesis, first formulated in 1983, that our galactic center periodically emits devastating waves he termed superwaves.

Galactic superwaves are intense cosmic ray particle bombardments that originate from the center of our Galaxy, and that last for periods of up to a few thousand years. Paul explains that astronomical and geological evidence indicates that the last major superwave impacted our solar system around 12,000 to 16,000 years ago, and produced abrupt changes of the Earth's climate.

The land animal extinction episode which occurred during this interval was the worst in several million years, and Paul estimates that approximately one or two superwaves strong enough to trigger an ice age are presently on their way to us from their birthplace at the galactic core... 23,000 light years away. Paul states that there is a real chance that one such event could arrive within the next few decades. Importantly - because they travel at the speed of light - we would not see them coming.

Paul explains that less intense superwaves, which recur with considerable frequency, could also pose a threat. He cites evidence that the galactic center has erupted as many as ten times in the last 2,000 years, the most recent event occurring about 700 years ago. While these low intensity events could have passed unnoticed in earlier centuries, today they could be extremely hazardous. The EMP [electromagnetic pulse] accompanying such a superwave could knock out electrical power grids and communication networks on a global scale. Consequently, argues Paul, study of this phenomenon deserves a very high priority, and he founded The Starburst Foundation to do this.

Of some considerable interest is the testimony from our insider source Jake Simpson, who told us in October 2008 that there was a 'wave' coming - but that it would not arrive here for quite a few years: possibly around 2017-2020. When asked how he knew, his response was that highly advanced and classified superluminal [faster-then-light] craft had been out to "take a look", and had then returned to report back with the information. Jake told us that the effect could either be cataclysmic, or "just a puff of wind"... and that exactly what would happen, and when, was simply not known.

Of interest also is the anonymous testimony from a senior Electrical Engineer, whose wife contacted us in April 2009 to report an anticipated major breakdown of national power supplies a few years from now. These reports - and others (such as that from Dan Sherman) - all weave together to form an unsettling picture. While we have said separately that we do not agree with Patrick Geryl's conclusions, it does seem that the Earth, and the human race, may possibly be in for a bit of a rough ride... from a number of different causes.

http://projectcamelot.org/paul_laviolette.html

Pauls site:

http://www.etheric.com/LaViolette/LaViolette.html

[noxon medem]

- So :

let us all be red flowers
and leave the sun to be
the white sun it allways was .
( seen as yellow because of the bending of local
lightwaves on the way in our earthly atmosphere )

- on your eye
( your island )

:fish2:
nm

[Calz]

The debate should really begin with the reason why our sun might possibly become a Red Giant. It has to do with the supposed energy wave. The wave is predicted for 2012, so maybe finding out if a wave exists should have been the starting point, sorry my bad. Pane seems to have data to suggest the wave is real, with photos posted. If that is the case maybe something is coming and the sun might be affected.

Compelling material regarding the "Superwave" from Paul LaViolette:


Predictions Part I
astronomy and climatology

Superwave Theory Predictions
and their Subsequent Verification

Galactic Core Explosions - prevailing concept (1980): At the time of this prediction, astronomers believed that the cores of galaxies, including our own, become active ("explode") about every 10 to 100 million years and stay active for about a million years. Since our own Galactic core presently appears quiescent, they believed it would likely remain inactive for many tens of millions of years. Although, in 1977, astronomer Jan Oort cited evidence that our Galactic core has been active within the past 10,000 years.

Prediction No. 1 (1980 - 1983): In his Ph.D. dissertation, LaViolette hypothesized that galactic core explosions recur about every 10,000 years and last for several hundred to a few thousand years. He was the first to suggest such a short recurrence time for galactic core explosions and that our own Galactic core undergoes Seyfert-like explosions with similar frequency.

Subsequent concurrence (1998): In 1988, when presented with Dr. LaViolette's Galactic explosion hypothesis, astronomer Mark Morris dismissed the idea as having no merit. However, in 1998 after ten years of observation, Morris was quoted as saying that the center of our Galaxy explodes about every 10,000 years with these events each lasting 100 years or so.

Cosmic Ray Propagation - prevailing concept (1980 - 1983): At the time of this prediction, astronomers believed that interstellar magnetic fields entrap cosmic rays released from Galactic core outbursts and slow their outward progress so that they reach the Earth after millions of years in the form of a constant low intensity background radiation.

Prediction No. 2 (1980 - 83): Dr. LaViolette's studies concluded that Galactic center cosmic ray volleys interact minimally with interstellar magnetic fields and are able to propagate radially outward along rectilinear trajectories traveling through the Galaxy at near light speed in the form of a coherent, spherical, wave-like volley. He was the first to suggest this idea of a "Galactic superwave."

Verification (1985): Astrophysicists discovered that X-ray pulsars continuously shower the Earth with high-energy cosmic ray particles that have traveled over 25,000 light-years at nearly the speed of light, following straight-line trajectories unaffected by interstellar magnetic fields.

Verification (1997): Astrophysicists detected a strong gamma ray pulse arriving from a galaxy billions of light years away having a redshift of 3.4 (see Prediction No. 10 below). Mainstream media, such as Sky & Telescope magazine, suggested that this gamma ray pulse may be accompanied by a volley of high energy cosmic ray particles travelling at very close to the speed of light along a rectilinear trajectory and that the gamma ray pulse is produced by the radial outward movement of this volley. In effect, they were restating the same Galactic superwave idea that LaViolette had proposed 14 years earlier in the face of stiff resistance from mainstream astronomers.

Verification (2000): Radio astronomers announce at the January 2000 American Astronomical Society meeting that the synchrotron radio emission radiated from the Galactic center (Sgr A*) is circularly polarized. Scientists present at the meeting concurred with Dr. LaViolette's suggestion that the circular polarization indicated that cosmic ray electrons were travelling radially away from the Galactic center along straight-line trajectories.

Cosmic Ray Bombardment - prevailing concept (1980 - 83): At the time of this prediction, astronomers believed that the background cosmic ray flux has remained constant for millions of years, that intense cosmic ray bombardments occur very infrequently, perhaps every 30 million years, primarily as a result of nearby supernova explosions.

Prediction No. 3 (1980 - 1983): LaViolette concluded that a volley of Galactic cosmic rays had bombarded the Earth and solar system toward the end of the last ice age (ca. 14,000 years BP). Also his findings suggested that other such superwaves had passed us at earlier times and were responsible for triggering the initiation and termination of the ice ages and mass extinctions. He was the first to suggest recurrent highly-frequent cosmic ray bombardment of the Earth.

Verification (1987): Glaciologists discovered beryllium-10 isotope peaks in ice age polar ice. These indicated that the cosmic ray flux on the Earth became very high on several occasions during the last ice age, confirming Dr. LaViolette's theory that Galactic superwaves have repeatedly passed through our solar system in geologically recent times.

Cosmic Debris Around Solar System - prevailing concept (1980 - 83): At the time of this prediction, astronomers believed that the solar system resided in a relatively dust free region of space.

Prediction No. 4 (1980 - 1983): LaViolette hypothesized that large amounts of interstellar dust and frozen cometary debris lie outside the solar system just beyond the heliopause sheath and form a reservoir of material that would have supplied large amounts of cosmic dust during a prehistoric superwave event.

Verification (1984): The IRAS satellite team published infrared observations showing that the solar system is surrounded by nearby "cirrus" dust cloud wisps.

Verification (1988): Astronomer H. Aumann's observations suggested that the solar system is surrounded by a dust envelope 500 times denser than previously thought.

Verification (1992 - 95): Telescope observations revealed the presence of the Kuiper belt, a dense population of cometary bodies encircling the solar system, beginning just beyond the orbit of Neptune and extending outward past the heliopause sheath.

Verification (1999): Observations of the influx of interstellar dust particles using the Ulysses spacecraft lead Markus Landgraf and his team of European Space Agency astronomers to conclude that the solar system is surrounded by a ring of orbiting dust that begins just outside the orbit of Saturn.

Cosmic Dust Influx - prevailing concept (1979): At the time of this prediction, astronomers believed that the rate at which cosmic dust particles have been entering the solar system and the Earth's atmosphere has remained constant for millions of years. They believed that the solar system lies in a relatively clean interstellar space environment and hence that there is no need to expect the occurrence of recent cosmic dust incursions.

Prediction No. 5 (Sept. 1979): LaViolette theorized that if a cosmic ray volley (superwave) had passed by at the end of the ice age, it would have pushed nearby interstellar dust into the solar system. To test this, he began a plan to analyze ice age polar ice for traces of cosmic dust.

Verification (1981 - 82): LaViolette was the first to measure the extraterrestrial material content of prehistoric polar ice. Using the neutron activation analysis technique, he found high levels of iridium and nickel in 6 out of the 8 polar ice dust samples (35k to 73k yrs BP), an indication that they contain high levels of cosmic dust. This showed that Galactic superwaves may have affected our solar system in the recent past. In addition, he discovered gold in one 50,000 year old sample, making this the first time gold had been discovered in polar ice.

Verification (1984): The IRAS satellite team reported observations that the zodiacal dust cloud is tilted 3 degrees relative to the ecliptic with ascending and descending ecliptic nodes at 87° and 267°, but failed to draw a conclusion from this finding. LaViolette realized that the nodes are aligned with the Galactic-center-anticenter direction in support of his earlier prediction that interstellar dust has recently entered the solar system from the Galactic center direction. 1987: He published a paper in Earth, Moon, and Planets journal explaining that the orientation of the zodiacal dust cloud nodes indicates that this zodiacal dust recently entered from the direction of the Galactic center.

Verification (April 1993): NASA's Ulysses spacecraft team published observations indicating that interstellar dust is currently entering the solar system from the Galactic center direction (from the direction the interstellar wind blows towards us) and hence that most of the dust outside the asteroid belt is of interstellar origin. Their findings were predicted by LaViolette's 1983 and 1987 publications. One Ulysses team member had received Dr. LaViolette's publications in 1985, but LaViolette's work was not cited.

Verification (1995): Cosmochemists publish observations showing that Helium-3 concentrations in ocean sediments, an indicator of extraterrestrial dust influx, changed by over 3 fold on a 100,000 year cycle between 250,000 and 450,000 years ago.

Verification (1996): The AMOR radar in New Zealand detected a strong flux of interstellar meteoroid particles, measuring 15 to 40 microns in size, entering the solar system from the Galactic center direction.

Verification (2000 - 2005): LaViolette demonstrates that the acid layers found in 15,850 year old Antarctic polar ice vary in magnitude with an eleven year solar cycle period thereby indicating an extraterrestrial origin for this material. This finding is supported by the discovery mentioned below (2003) that interstellar dust influx varies in accordance with solar cycle phase. The finding that this gas influx event heralded a series of warming trends that ended the ice age, implicates cosmic dust and solar activation as the causal agents responsible for terminating glacial cycles.

Verification (2003): Using data obtained from the Ulysses spacecraft, a group of European Space Agency astronomers led by Markus Landgraf discover that the rate of interstellar dust influx increased three fold from 1997 to 2000 with the approach to solar maximum. They theorize a correlation between solar cycle phase and interstellar dust influx rate, with the influx rate being highest at the time of solar maximum. Such a correlation could explain why the Sun could become locked into an active, dust accreting mode during times of superwave passage.

Verification (2004): Glaciologists find that the concentrations of iridium and platinum in submicron sized "meteoritic smoke" particles present in polar ice are two to three times higher during the last ice age.

Verification (2007): A group of scientists, the Younger Dryas Boundary (YDB) group, reports high levels of extraterrestrial indicators (Ir, Ni, cosmic spherules, microtektites, 3He, fullerenes at the 12,950 yrs b2k Alleröd/Younger Dryas boundary layer that overlies extinct megafauna and Clovis artifacts.

Tin in Cosmic Dust - prevailing concept (1981): At the time of this discovery, cosmochemists did not believe that extraterrestrial material could have anomalously high concentrations of heavy metals such as tin, antimony, gold and silver. Abundances higher than those typically found in meteorites were looked on with skepticism and evidence that one's samples had been contaminated.

Prediction No. 6 (1981): LaViolette found very high concentrations of tin in several ice age polar ice dust samples, one 50,000 year old sample, in particular, containing 60% of its weight in tin. Elevated concentrations of gold, silver, and antimony as well as the cosmic dust indicators iridium, and nickel were also found in the samples. He theorized that due to the presence of iridium and nickel, this tin-rich dust must be of extraterrestrial origin, possibly coming from an anomalous interstellar source.

Verification (Jan. 1984): The tin was found to contain an isotopic anomaly indicating that it was definitely of extraterrestrial origin; see Prediction No. 7.

Indirect support (1989): Cosmochemist F. Rietmeijer published a paper describing the discovery of tin oxide grains inside interplanetary dust particles, with tin abundances much higher than typically found in chondritic meteorites. This helps to substantiate LaViolette's 1983 claim that the solar system contains a dust source enriched in tin which is the source of the tin-rich dust found in polar ice.

Verification (May 2007): A group of cosmochemists report finding high levels of tin (25 - 28%) and copper (1 - 11%) along with ET material indicators platinum and nickel in magnetic separates retrieved from the 12,950 yrs b2k Alleröd/Younger Dryas boundary layer and from Clovis sites. They conclude that the grains bearing these volatile metals are of extraterrestrial origin.

Tin Isotopic Anomaly - state of the art (1981): At the time of this prediction, astronomers speculated that tin found in extraterrestrial material could have isotope ratios different from those of terrestrial tin. But up until that time no tin isotopic anomalies had been reported.

Prediction No. 7 (1981): Having found very high concentrations of tin in several ice age ice core dust samples in association with high levels of iridium, and nickel, LaViolette theorized that this tin-rich dust was of extraterrestrial origin and that if so the tin should have anomalous isotopic ratios.

Verification (Jan. 1984): Geochemists at Curtin University (Australia) in collaboration with LaViolette used a mass spectrometry technique to determine the isotopic ratios of an unirradiated portion of the tin-rich dust sample. They found significant isotopic anomalies in four isotopes thereby confirming LaViolette's prediction that the tin dust is of extraterrestrial origin. This marked the first time that tin isotopic anomalies had been discovered.

Prehistoric Global Warming - prevailing concept (1981): At the time of this prediction, climatologists believed that the Alleröd-Bölling warming and Younger Dryas cold period at the end of the ice age were confined primarily to Europe. They assumed that there was no global warming at the end of the ice age, that the northern continental ice sheets did not melt synchronously with the southern ice sheets, and that the warming in the north was due to heat being drawn from the Southern Hemisphere.

Prediction No. 8 (1983): In his dissertation, LaViolette demonstrated that the last ice age was ended by a 2000 year long global warming which he calls the Terminal Pleistocene Interstadial (TPI) identified with the Alleröd-Bölling interstadial in the north. He also proposed that this was followed by a global return to glacial conditions, identified with the Younger Dryas in the north. He showed that the melting of the ice sheets was synchronous in the northern and southern hemispheres and was brought about by cosmic causes.

Verification (1987 - 96): Climatologists published temperature profiles from various parts of the world showing the presence of this same climatic oscillation, but did not connect their data with the idea of global climatic shifts.

Verification (1998): Climatologists (Steig et al.) published findings in Science demonstrating the synchronous occurrence of the Alleröd-Bölling-Younger Dryas climatic oscillation in the Taylor Dome Antarctic ice core. They claimed this as evidence that the last ice age was ended by a global warming. Although they should have been aware of LaViolette's publications, their report did not cite his prior work.

Prehistoric Solar Conflagration - prevailing concept (1983): At the time of LaViolette's prediction, the general opinion was that the Sun has remained in its present quiescent solar cycle state for hundreds of millions of years. A small group of astronomers, however, dissented with this view. For example, in 1969, astrophysicist Thomas Gold published lunar rock evidence indicating that, within the last 30,000 years, the radiation intensity on the Moon had reached 100 suns for 10 to 100 seconds, possibly due to a solar nova. In 1975, astronomer A. Lovell suggested that sun-like stars occasionly produce flares of up to 10^37 ergs, 30,000 times more energetic than the largest solar flare of modern times. In 1977, astrophysicists Wdowczyk and Wolfendale suggested that the Sun might produce a flare a million times larger (3 X 10^38 ergs) about once every 100,000 years. Moreover in 1978, NASA astronomers Zook, Hartung, and Storzer had published lunar rock evidence indicating that 16,000 years ago solar flare background radiation intensity on the Moon's surface had peaked to 50 times the current intensity and that this may have been somehow associated with the retreat of the ice sheets. The idea that the Earth and Moon might have been affected in the past by the arrival of a giant solar coronal mass ejection had not yet been advanced.

Prediction No. 9 (1983): In his dissertation, LaViolette proposed that invading cosmic dust would have caused the Sun to become more luminous and engage in continual flaring activity. In chapter 4, he suggested that on one occasion the Earth and Moon may have been engulfed by a large prominence remnant "fireball" (coronal mass ejection) thrown out by the Sun during a period of particularly intense solar activity. He interpreted the findings of Zook and Gold as evidence that the Sun had been in a highly active T-Tauri like flaring state and that at times its flaring activity had been as much as 1000 times currently observed levels. He suggested that these may have scorched the surface of the Earth in ice age times, inducing high temperatures, rapid ice sheet melting, global flooding, and mass animal extinction.

Concordance (1997): Satellite observations showed solar flares ejecting expanding balls of plasma called "coronal mass ejections"and demonstrated that these were capable of travelling outward beyond the Earth's orbit. This lent credance to LaViolette's theory that a large coronal plasma "fireball" thrown off by an immense solar flare may have reached the Earth and Moon and scorched their surfaces.

Concordance (1999): Astronomers announced that they had observed large explosive outbursts from the surfaces of nearby normal sunlike stars. These "superflares" were observed to range from 100 to 10 million times the energy of the largest flare observed on the Sun in modern times and were estimated to occur about once every hundred years. This confirmed the Lovell hypothesis and increased the plausibility of LaViolette's suggestion that the Sun was producing mega solar flares and intense plasma fireballs at the end of the last ice age.

Verification (2002): As early as the late 1970's Dr. Han Kloosterman was arguing that a global conflagration was the cause of the black layer found in Alleröd sediments in southern England and in the Great Lakes Region. Later in 2002, when Dr. LaViolette first became aware of his work, Kloosterman was on a geological field trip in the southeastern U.S. accumulating evidence of the black mat horizon dating from the Alleröd/Younger Dryas transition and correlative with similar horizons found in Great Britain, Belgium, France, Germany, Denmark, and Poland. Kloosterman concluded that this layer was produced by a global conflagration which was also responsible for the exitnction of the Pleistocene megafauna. Kloosterman's thesis and evidence of the Usselo horizon confirm the solar CME scenario that LaViolette had proposed.

Verification (2008): LaViolette locates the legendary solar conflagration event in Summit, Greenland ice cores. Using correlations to the Cariaco Basin varve chronology, he dates this event at 12,885 years b2k. He finds that it is marked by a sudden increase in atmospheric radiocarbon concentration which occurs together with a climatic warming climate in Greenland changing from glacial to interglacial temperatures within less than two years. He finds that the event is also associated with an increase of ammonium, oxylate, and formate ion, which is indicative of a period of global biomass combustion. This suggests that this is the time of the conflagration that produced the Usselo Horizon. He also finds that it occurs together with an acidity ECM spike lasting less than a month as well as a rise of nitrate ion, both being indicators of a dramatic rise in the influx of solar cosmic rays.

Geomagnetic Reversals - prevailing concept (1983): At the time of LaViolette's prediction, geophysicists believed that geomagnetic reversals and magnetic polarity flips were brought about by causes internal to the Earth, that they arose from instabilities in the inner rotation of the Earth's core magnetic dynamo. They believed that these field excursions took hundreds of years to occur due to the inherently slow movement of the core material.


Prediction No. 10 (1983): In chapter 3 of his dissertation, LaViolette proposed that geomagnetic reversals are induced by solar cosmic ray storms. He proposed that at times when invading cosmic dust causes the Sun to become very active and engage in continual flaring activity, major solar outbursts could occur that are a thousand times more intense than those currently observed. Further he proposed that solar cosmic rays from such a mega flare could impact the Earth's magnetosphere, become trapped there to form storm-time radiation belts, and generate an equatorial ring current producing a magnetic field opposed to the Earth's. If sufficiently intense, this ring current magnetic field could cancel out the Earth's own field and flip the residual magnetic field pole to an equatorial location. From this position it could later either recover or adopt a reversed polarity. He proposed that this geomagnetic excursion would be very rapid, occurring in a matter of days.

Verification (1989 - 95): Geophysicists reported their analysis of a geomagnetic reversal recorded in the Steens Mountain lava formation, conclusively demonstrating that during this reversal the Earth's magnetic pole changed direction as fast as 8 degrees per day. This overthrew the conventional geocentric view which could not account for such rapid changes with internal motions of the Earth's core dynamo. It confirmed Dr. LaViolette's mechanism of rapid change.

Concordance (1995): Unaware of LaViolette's publications, two French geophysicists published a paper that sought to explain the Steens Mountain polarity reversal as being due to a solar cosmic ray cause. Their mechanism was the same as that which LaViolette had proposed 6 years before the Steens Mountain discovery. Their independent arrival at the same idea is evidence of parallel idea development and consensus with LaViolette's earlier theory.

Verification (1994, 1995): McHargue, et al. discover Be-10 anomalies in ocean sediments at 32 kyr and 43 kyrs BP, contemporaneous with the Mono Lake and Laschamp geomagnetic excursions. Unaware of LaViolette's publications, they suggest they were caused by the passage of supernova shock fronts during a time of unprecidented long-term solar activity.

Radiocarbon Date Anomalies - prevailing concept (1983): At the time of this proposal, the idea that anomalously young radiocarbon dates might be produced by intense solar cosmic ray bombardments had not been suggested. Such young dates were thought to be due to sample contamination with younger carbon having a higher C-14 content.


Prediction No. 11 (1983): Anomalously young radiocarbon dates are frequently found in fossil remains of Pleistocene megafauna that became extinct at the end of the last ice age. In chapter 10 of his dissertation, LaViolette proposed that a solar cosmic ray conflagration caused the demise of these mammals and their subsequent burial by the action of glacier meltwater waves. He suggested that the neutron shower produced by the intense solar cosmic ray storm (coronal mass ejection) that engulfed the Earth would have radiogenically changed nitrogen atoms in animal collagen into carbon-14 atoms. He proposed that this in situ radiocarbon generation could have made the radiocarbon dates on exposed organic matter anomalously young.

Verification (1998): After conducting seven years of research, archeologist William Topping proposed that the abnormally young radiocarbon dates of ice age Paleo-Indian sites (ca. 12,400 - 13,000 calendar yrs BP) could be explained if a major solar flare cosmic ray particle storm had caused in situ carbon-14 production from nitrogen in the organic remains of those strata. His conclusion of heavy particle bombardment in Paleo-Indian times was partly supported by his discovery of particle tracks and micrometeorite craters in artifacts. This in situ C-14 production mechanism is the same that LaViolette had earlier proposed to explain the young dates for Pleistocene mammal remains dating from a similar period. Like Topping, LaViolette had concluded that the demise of the large mammals at that time was due to a solar flare conflagration. Since Topping was probably not aware of LaViolette's dissertation, his work would constitute independent corroboration.

Concordance (1995 - 1998): Researchers report the discovery that atmospheric radiocarbon levels strongly increased during the period spanning the Allerød/Younger Dryas transition and the megafaunal extinction. Over a 300 year period between the time of the IntraAllerod Cold Peak and the beginning of the Younger Dryas, atmospheric C-14 levels are estimated to have risen from 3 to 7 % and subsequently declined during the course of the Younger Dryas.

Concordance (2000 - 2004): Additional evidence comes from analysis of the varved sediments from the Cariaco Basin off the coast of Venezuela and from Icelandic ocean sediments showing a 9 percent rise in C-14 during the time of the megafaunal extinction, from 13,500 - 12,800 years b2k, and on several previous occasions, including a 90 percent rise in radiocarbon concentration that climaxed around 40,000 yrs b2k after having progressively risen for a period of 5000 years. The events coincide with times when the atmospheric beryllium-10 production rate also rose to high levels.

Glacial drift deposits - prevailing concept (1983): At the time of this prediction, geologists believed that the ice sheets melted gradually at the end of the ice age and that their meltwater outflow was also gradual, with the exception of instances of dam breaks occurring in proglacial lakes such as Lake Missoula in Montana.


Prediction No. 12 (1983): LaViolette proposes that much of the glacial drift deposited at the end of the last ice age was laid down by glacier waves issuing from the upper surfaces of the ice sheets. These are water outbursts far larger than the glacier bursts seen today issuing from mountain glaciers.

Verification (1983): To explain sediment morphology in Manitoba, North Dakota, and Minnesota, geologists Alan Kehew and Lee Clayton propose the occurrence of catastrophic floods produced by a domino effect of proglacial lake discharges. LaViolette had proposed a similar domino effect mechanism for the production of glacier waves on the surfaces of ice sheets.

Verification (1988): German scientist Harmut Heinrich calls attention to North Atlantic ocean sediment layers composed primarily of rock grains of continental bedrock origin that had been transported distances of up to 3000 kilometers prior to their deposition. Subsequent investigations uncovered evidence that these "Heinrich layers" were deposited suddenly. Heinrich advances a theory that this material was transported by drifting and melting ice bergs. However, not all are satisfied with this explanation which fails to explain the suddenness of the deposition events. In 2001 (Galactic Superwaves CDROM), LaViolette shows that Heinrich events correlate with times of climatic warming and that these layers are evidence of long-range sediment transport by glacier waves. He shows that Heinrich layer 0 correlates with accelerated glacier wave discharge activity he proposed was occurring around 12,700 years BP and that Heinrich layer 1 spans the Pre-Bölling Interstadial which began the deglaciation phase.

Verification (1989): Canadian geologist John Shaw points out that drumlins are more likely produced by forceful discharges of glacial meltwater rather than by the action of slowly advancing glaciers. He proposes that the meltwater discharges had reached depths of hundreds of feet and that they originated from beneath the glaciers. However, more probably they were formed by glacier waves originating from the ice sheet surface.

Gamma Ray Bursts - prevailing concept (1983): During the early 1970's, astronomers discovered the Earth is sporadically bombarded by gamma ray bursts. At the time of this prediction, they incorrectly assumed that gamma ray bursts were medium energy events originating from local sources within our Galaxy. They did not regard them as a significant social threat.



Prediction No. 13 (1983): In his dissertation, LaViolette proposed that a superwave produced by an explosion of our Galaxy's core could be immediately preceded by a very strong gamma ray pulse, 10,000 times stronger than what could come from a supernova explosion. He pointed out that upon impacting our upper atmosphere this burst could strip electrons and induce a powerful electromagnetic pulse which, like a high-altitude nuclear EMP, could have serious consequences for modern society. It could knock out satellites, interrupt radio, TV, and telephone communication, produce electrical surges on power lines causing widespread black outs, and possibly trigger the inadvertent launching of missiles. He was among the few to suggest that Galactic core explosions could produce high intensity gamma ray outbursts that could affect the Earth.
In 1989, under the sponsorship of the Starburst Foundation, LaViolette initiated an international outreach project, to warn about the dangers of such astronomical phenomena. He pointed out that our Galactic center could produce seriously disruptive low intensity outbursts as frequently as once every 500 years and that we are currently overdue for one. This was the first time a widespread gamma ray pulse warning of this sort had been made.

Verification (1997): In December 1997, astronomers for the first time pinpointed the source of a gamma ray burst and found that it originated from a galaxy lying billions of light years away. This led them to conclude that these are mostly extragalactic events having total energies millions of times greater than they had previously supposed, thereby confirming LaViolette's earlier proposal of the existence of high intensity gamma ray bursts. If this particular outburst had originated from our Galactic center, it would have delivered 100,000 times the lethal dose to all exposed Earth life forms.

Verification (1998): Some months later, in August 27, 1998, a 5 minute long gamma ray pulse arrived from a Galactic source located 20,000 light years away in the constellation of Aquila. The event was strong enough to ionize the upper atmosphere and seriously disrupt satellites and spacecraft. It triggered a defensive instrument shutdown on at least two spacecraft. Astronomers acknowledged that this marked the first time they became aware that energetic outbursts from distant astronomical sources could affect the Earth's physical environment. These events reaffirmed the validity of warnings LaViolette made 9 years earlier about the potential hazards of such gamma ray bursts.

Galactic morphology - prevailing concept (1980 - 83): At the time Paul LaViolette was writing in 1983, most astronomers believed that quasars and blazars were very different from most other galaxies and in a class of their own. LaViolette recalls a telephone conversation he had, in which the renown astronomer Geoffrey Burbidge steadfastly defended this view. Astronomers also believed that active giant elliptical galaxies were structurally different from spiral galaxies.

Prediction No. 14 (1980 - 1983): In his dissertation, LaViolette proposes that quasars and blazars are the bright cores of spiral galaxies in which the light from the core is so bright that it masks the dimmer light coming from the galaxy's disk. He suggests that quasars and blazars are essentially the same core explosion phenomenon that is seen in Seyfert galaxies and N-galaxies. He predicts that when it eventually becomes operational the Hubble Telescope will resolve the disks around these bright cores. He also suggests that edge-on spiral galaxies with active cores would give the appearance of being giant elliptical galaxies due to synchrotron radiation emitted from their outward streaming cosmic rays. In connection with this, he predicts that when active giant ellipticals are imaged with the Hubble Telescope, spiral arm dust lanes oriented edge-on will be detected.

Verification (1995, 1997): Astronomers publish the results of a survey which imaged quasars using the Hubble Space Telescope. These quasars (luminous cores) are seen to be surrounded by spiral arm disks, just as LaViolette had predicted. Earlier in 1982 a group of astronomers had resolved galactic light fuzz around quasar 3C273 using a special imaging technique. This was published after the date of LaViolette's prediction. In 1997 NASA astronomers release a photo of an active giant elliptical galaxy that resolves its equatorial dust lane and shows that it is oriented edge-on as LaViolette had predicted.

Archeoastronomy - prevailing concept (1979): At the time of this prediction, ancient historians, cultural anthropologists and scholars of esoteric traditions did not suspect that ancient myth makers knew the location of the Galactic center or that they had associated this part of the sky with the cataclysmic cycles described in legend.

Prediction No. 15 (1979): LaViolette discovered that the ancient star lore connected with the Sagittarius and Scorpius constellations indicated the location of the Galactic center, conveyed the idea of an explosive outburst, and specified a significant past date of 13,865 ± 150 years B.C. which also is encoded in the ancient Egyptian Dendereh zodiac. Also LaViolette found that myths, customs and esoteric lore descendent from prehistoric times indicated that cosmic rays from a Galactic core explosion catastrophically affect the Earth and solar system in recurrent cycles with the most recent event occurring near the end of the last ice age. He wrote up this idea in an unpublished paper in 1979 and formally published these ideas in 1995 and 1997 in his books Beyond the Big Bang and Earth Under Fire. In Earth Under Fire he also connected Mayan cosmology and World Ages with the Galactic center and Galactic superwave events. He began discovering these associations around 1987.

Concordance (1994 - 1998): In a December 1994 magazine article and later in his book Maya Cosmogenesis 2012 (1998), John Major Jenkins presented his findings that Mayan lore contains a Galactic center oriented cosmology. that specifically refers to the Galactic center vicinity (ecliptic-Galactic plane crossing point) in connection with the occurrence of the Mayan World Ages. One of his findings is that the Mayan calendar 2012 AD end date, which designates the end of the present World Age, also indicates the time when the Earth's precessing axis will be maximally tipped in the direction of this Galactic plane intersection point. Jenkins was not aware of LaViolette's work at the time he wrote, so his findings constitute an instance of independent discovery and corroboration. Jenkins went into much greater depth in exploring Mayan cosmological references to the Galactic center, but did not explore the Galactic explosion/Earth cataclysm theme discovered by LaViolette.

Concordance (2000): LaViolette discovered evidence indicating that the largest acidity spike in the entire Antarctic ice core record was of extraterrestrial origin, possibly produced by a major incursion of interstellar or cometary dust; see paper posted at solar.html. The date of this event, beginning 13,880 B.C. and tailing off 13,785 B.C., closely corresponds to the date encoded in zodiac star lore marking the arrival of a galactic superwave.


http://www.etheric.com/LaViolette/Predict.html

[Deborah (ahamkara)]

Thank you for the details on Paul LaViolette's work. He seems to be grounded in science in a way that few others can match. His theories make sense. I believe he is conservative, however, at not naming an exact date - feeling that the idea of a window of possibility exists. Intuitively, many of us feel that window begins NOW.

[Calz]

Found something edging towards "proof" that it is at least *possible* for our sun to go Red Giant in a matter of months.

Will first quote a slide from Andov's dvd set:


As it expands, Chi Cygni cools and dims, growing to a diameter of 480 million miles - large enough to engulf and cook our solar system's asteroid belt. This star behavior clearly demonstrated Red Giant Phase and gives unbreakable proof that it does not take billions of years for a star to grow drastically in size but just a period of months.

Doing a search on "chi cygni star" turned up many and will quote a couple:

http://www.astronomynow.com/news/n0912/15chi/



A heart still beats in
a dying star

KEITH COOPER
ASTRONOMY NOW
Posted: December 15, 2009


A throbbing red giant star called chi Cygni, 550 light years away in the constellation Cygnus, has been imaged in unprecedented detail, giving a clear insight into the fate that awaits our own Sun in five billion years time.


9044

The variations in brightness and size of chi Cygni over a period of 408 days. When the star has contracted to its smallest size, notable hotspots can be seen on its surface. Image: Sylvestre Lacour (Observatoire de Paris).

When a Sun-like star begins to run out of hydrogen gas to fuel its nuclear reactions that generate energy in its core, it swells into a red giant, engulfing its innermost planets. As the star’s central engine begins to falter the red giant pulses in and out. By combining the light from the now disassembled trio of telescopes at the Smithsonian Astrophysical Observatory’s infrared Optical Telescope Array (IOTA) at Whipple Observatory in the United States, astronomers were able to image these pulsations, creating a movie from the still images.

“IOTA offered unique capabilities”, says Marc Lacasse of the Harvard–Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics, who was co-author on a paper in The Astrophysical Journal; describing the results. “It allowed us to see details in the images that are about 15 times smaller than can be resolved in images from the Hubble Space Telescope.”

The images show that the pulsations are not symmetrical, but are lumpy, with hotspots and clouds ejecting in different directions, and the star contracts and expands every 408 days. We call these stars Mira-type variables, after their prototype star Mira in the constellation Cetus. Imaging chi Cygni was no simple task – infrared light, which can pass through the clouds of dust that surround the star, was the only way to do it.

At its smallest, chi Cygni is 482.8 million kilometres across, with huge spots covering its surface (granules blown up large) and clouds of boiling plasma. As it expands, it reaches 772.5 million kilometres across. If placed in our Solar System, it would incinerate Mercury, Venus, Earth and Mars and extend well into the Asteroid Belt.

In time, our own Sun will run out of hydrogen and follow suit, engulfing the inner planets; in a sense chi Cygni warns us of our own Solar System’s fate. With each pulse, the red giant throws off some more of its outer layers; over time, these layers will accumulate, spreading out into a beautiful planetary nebula, the parting shot in the life of a star.

An animation combining the individual images of the pulsation of the star chi Cygni is available here.

More "mainstream" from wiki:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chi_Cygni


Chi Cygni (χ Cyg, χ Cygni) is a variable star of the Mira type in the constellation Cygnus.

Chi Cygni shows one of the largest variations in magnitude known. Typically it brightens and fades from 5th to 13th magnitude. The average period of this brightness fluctuation is 407 days. Observed extremes were 3.3 and 14.3 respectively. Thus Chi Cygni is visible at its minimum only with telescopes larger than 30 centimeters, while at maximum brightness is easily visible to the naked eye. Its distance is approximately 345 light years. The astronomer Gottfried Kirch discovered its variability in 1686.

Thomas Dick, LL.D, writes:

"The period of this star has been settled by Maraldi and Cassini at 405 days; but from a mean of the observations of Mr. Pigot, it appears to be only 392, or at most 396-7/8 days.

"The particulars relating to it are,

When at its full brightness, it undergoes no perceptible change for a fortnight.
It is about three and a half months in increasing from the eleventh magnitude to its full brightness, and the same in decreasing; for which reason it may be considered as invisible during six months.
It does not always attain the same degree of lustre, being sometimes of the 5th and sometimes of the seventh magnitude.
"It is situated in the neck [of the Swan constellation], and nearly equi-distant from Beta and Gamma, and south by west from Deneb, at the distance of about twelve degrees, and is marked Chi."


*** adding ***

Andov later shows that this (and one other) star exhibiting such characteristics are experiencing a "superwave" such as is allegedly ready to hit us now from our own galactic core.

[Lord Sidious]

Did you read up on what a variable star is?
Then read up on the Mira type.

[Calz]

Did you read up on what a variable star is?
Then read up on the Mira type.

I am doing what I can to follow up from 2nd sources.

Andov implies that when the "superwave" hits the sun there will be a nuclear reaction.

Thanks for your post and continued efforts to keep as close to verifiable "facts" as possible.


*** adding ***


Seems to be some consensus regarding our solar system moving into a more "energized" portion of the universe and considering the "electric universe" theory that opens up possiblities that are not normally demonstrated???

[Seikou-Kishi]

There is one very good way to find out if Andov is right. A year and a half should do it lol.

[mojo]

Thank you Calz, for the supporting information. Lord Sid I also appreciate your perspective as well and maybe thats how we stay fair and balanced on our thread, more so than the news media that is supposed to keep the rest of us abreast. But I wonder when will there be enough evidence for the governments of the world to explain their silence if this energy wave is coming?

[Lord Sidious]

The thing is, there are many, many people out there saying a lot of things.
If I haven't heard what they say before, I instantly get into investigation mode.
Why didn't I hear about this before?
Is there anyone else talking about it?
Is there anything verifiable from another source?
And things of that nature.
That isn't to say that new things aren't true, but if only one guy speaks of it, then that in itself is interesting too.

[Calz]

The thing is, there are many, many people out there saying a lot of things.
If I haven't heard what they say before, I instantly get into investigation mode.
Why didn't I hear about this before?
Is there anyone else talking about it?
Is there anything verifiable from another source?
And things of that nature.
That isn't to say that new things aren't true, but if only one guy speaks of it, then that in itself is interesting too.

Did you watch the vid provided by Teakai earlier in the thread regarding the "electric universe" theory?

Here is more:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUHQL9QQekE&feature=player_embedded


*** adding ***


For that matter ... did you watch the youtube vids by Andov?

The newer dvds from him are not (yet) available on youtubes ... but he provides the basis for his "theories" on youtube as well as a well done pdf file.

There is support from varied camps for much of what he suggests except I am still working on supporting evidence for the "Red Giant". If you take the time to watch his presentation (and not view that event in isolation) you might see why some of us have come to appreciate the connecting of dots.

[Calz]

There is one very good way to find out if Andov is right. A year and a half should do it lol.


Well ... actually ... he (allegedly) is presenting material shown to him during his lifetime on how we humans can manifest a temporary "replacement" of the magnetosphere while the natural one has collapsed.

Waiting a year and a half would mean crispy critter time at least for 3d (if he and the ET messages he has been given are correct).

[Calz]

Pane Andov came to Avalon 1, under the nickname of Astralwalker, a couple years ago and made quite a popular thread presenting his theory. I was absolutly astonished to see people buying that, since it was filled up with false assumptions, like the Pluto's orbit, and remarkable simplistic interpretation of crop circles. Without even considering all the researches already done on crop circles from various different people.

The biggest mistake he does is jumping into conclusion regardless of what others have to say about 2012. He has a very good talent to make beautiful post filled up with images and make some interesting comments, but there are too many flaws in his theory.

Namaste, Steven

Pluto's orbit ... I have to assume you mean as it appeared in the crop circle as the only planet not in the correct position for dec 2012 (which he actually addresses in his dvd set).

I have seen other crop circle interpretations. His make sense to me. Simple is not necessarily wrong. In many cases simple is correct.

I would be happy to entertain any elaborations on flaws or false assumptions in his material. Not in any way suggesting you are "wrong" but simply wanting to examine this as closely as possible.

His presentation is quite compelling. Cross-examination is welcome.

[Ba-ba-Ra]

Most of what Pane talked about on the first video I watched (posted by Calz_ under the original thread) I heard directly from NASA at various times. Clearly there are things happening in the Universe which are unusual and don't fit into NASA's "version" of science. One video I watched the NASA scientists, there were 7 of them on the interview (can no longer find it on line was about a year ago where they admitted while talking about the "ribbon" discovered by IBEX (http://spacefellowship.com/news/art14472/giant-ribbon-discovered-at-the-edge-of-the-solar-system.html) and that the way it was moving didn't fit into any known theories of science.

Also NASA's declaration that THEMIS spacecraft have discovered a breach in Earth's magnetic field ten times larger than anything previously thought to exist. Solar wind can flow in through the opening to "load up" the magnetosphere for powerful geomagnetic storms. But the breach itself is not the biggest surprise. Researchers are even more amazed at the strange and unexpected way it forms, overturning long-held ideas of space physics. http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2008/16dec_giantbreach/

So, it's clear our Universe isn't doing the expected from Science's pov; therefore, it may be wise for us to listen to those who can think outside the box, i.e. Pane.

The one thing Pane mentioned that I'm not hearing anyone talk about is consciousness and the Merkaba also spelled Merkabah (flower of life). In sacred geometry known as the Star Tetrahedron. While it's important to focus on the physical universe, I'd like to suggest that we also keep one foot in the metaphysical universe. This body is temporary - whether we live 100 yrs or learn to live 1,000 years as Jay Weidner was encouraging in his alchemy theory - it is still temporary. Consciousness is forever. Spend time expanding it. I believe meditating on the Merkaba is one possible way. The other is to stay out of boxes. The Sufi's felt that every belief was a prison cell. Sometimes we exchange our beliefs, but that's only putting us in a prison with gold bars instead of iron. Look for ways to expand your consciousness, this is what will utimately save you - not necessarily this body, but the real YOU.

[greybeard]

David Sereda and Nassim Haramein also think out of the box--
It would seem that a change of consciousness is a real possibility.
Not posting their videos yet again--- easy found on U tube (coast to coast interviews)

Chris

[Lord Sidious]

The thing is, there are many, many people out there saying a lot of things.
If I haven't heard what they say before, I instantly get into investigation mode.
Why didn't I hear about this before?
Is there anyone else talking about it?
Is there anything verifiable from another source?
And things of that nature.
That isn't to say that new things aren't true, but if only one guy speaks of it, then that in itself is interesting too.

Did you watch the vid provided by Teakai earlier in the thread regarding the "electric universe" theory?

Here is more:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUHQL9QQekE&feature=player_embedded


*** adding ***


For that matter ... did you watch the youtube vids by Andov?

The newer dvds from him are not (yet) available on youtubes ... but he provides the basis for his "theories" on youtube as well as a well done pdf file.

There is support from varied camps for much of what he suggests except I am still working on supporting evidence for the "Red Giant". If you take the time to watch his presentation (and not view that event in isolation) you might see why some of us have come to appreciate the connecting of dots.

Nope, I didn't watch em.
I am on wireless and have limited bandwidth, so I am picky which vids I do watch and which ones I don't.

[Calz]

Most of what Pane talked about on the first video I watched (posted by Calz_ under the original thread) I heard directly from NASA at various times. Clearly there are things happening in the Universe which are unusual and don't fit into NASA's "version" of science. One video I watched the NASA scientists, there were 7 of them on the interview (can no longer find it on line was about a year ago where they admitted while talking about the "ribbon" discovered by IBEX (http://spacefellowship.com/news/art14472/giant-ribbon-discovered-at-the-edge-of-the-solar-system.html) and that the way it was moving didn't fit into any known theories of science.

Also NASA's declaration that THEMIS spacecraft have discovered a breach in Earth's magnetic field ten times larger than anything previously thought to exist. Solar wind can flow in through the opening to "load up" the magnetosphere for powerful geomagnetic storms. But the breach itself is not the biggest surprise. Researchers are even more amazed at the strange and unexpected way it forms, overturning long-held ideas of space physics. http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2008/16dec_giantbreach/

So, it's clear our Universe isn't doing the expected from Science's pov; therefore, it may be wise for us to listen to those who can think outside the box, i.e. Pane.

The one thing Pane mentioned that I'm not hearing anyone talk about is consciousness and the Merkaba also spelled Merkabah (flower of life). In sacred geometry known as the Star Tetrahedron. While it's important to focus on the physical universe, I'd like to suggest that we also keep one foot in the metaphysical universe. This body is temporary - whether we live 100 yrs or learn to live 1,000 years as Jay Weidner was encouraging in his alchemy theory - it is still temporary. Consciousness is forever. Spend time expanding it. I believe meditating on the Merkaba is one possible way. The other is to stay out of boxes. The Sufi's felt that every belief was a prison cell. Sometimes we exchange our beliefs, but that's only putting us in a prison with gold bars instead of iron. Look for ways to expand your consciousness, this is what will utimately save you - not necessarily this body, but the real YOU.

Excellent post.

Thank you Ba-ba-Ra :yo:

[Davidallany]

Nope, I didn't watch em.
I am on wireless and have limited bandwidth, so I am picky which vids I do watch and which ones I don't.
My Nuggetarianisim kicks in, it's time for some Afra'a Hazeh 71Gp3DM5ROQ&feature=watch_response

[9eagle9]

Go and do some astronomical study and you will find that it is not possible.
This is something that happens over a vast period, not a few years.

And his research is 'validated' by the Galatic Federation Light. Those cheery people who love you and want to save you but don't seem to mind if you burn up in fiery expanding ball of gas.

[WhiteFeather]

The thing is, there are many, many people out there saying a lot of things.
If I haven't heard what they say before, I instantly get into investigation mode.
Why didn't I hear about this before?
Is there anyone else talking about it?
Is there anything verifiable from another source?
And things of that nature.
That isn't to say that new things aren't true, but if only one guy speaks of it, then that in itself is interesting too.

Pane Andov simply connects the larger dots for us here. This guy is out of the universe literally with his perspectives. Most amazing concepts to say the least. Seems he is on to something here.

[9eagle9]

He's into something all right. ...lol.

[ghostrider]

the emv's won't let our sun go to a red giant. not possible would ruin the project called human.

[Lord Sidious]

Nope, I didn't watch em.
I am on wireless and have limited bandwidth, so I am picky which vids I do watch and which ones I don't.
My Nuggetarianisim kicks in, it's time for some Afra'a Hazeh 71Gp3DM5ROQ&feature=watch_response

Alf shurkr, Daoud.
That is a good find, arabs posting Ofra videos.
Just like I said, she is a bridge between the brothers.

[Calz]

Hmmm ... wonder how this one will be interpretted??? :smokin::haha:


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http://www.cropcircleconnector.com/2011/cherhillwhitehorse/cherhillwhitehorse2011a.html

(note: ponda 1st posted this in another thread)

[Calz]

the emv's won't let our sun go to a red giant. not possible would ruin the project called human.

No doubt posted elsewhere. Putting here in case anyone is not familiar with "emv".


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rZHB0wetl0&feature=player_embedded

[Calz]

One last (hopefully) post here regarding the red giant.

I sent email to Pane about week ago and have not gotten a reply. I was hoping he could elaborate. I don't know if his red giant theory was based on info from ETs or simply on the crop formation(s).

Here is Wilcock talking about the same formation (go about 2 mintues in):


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8IHZE1-lOo&feature=player_embedded#at=28


It could well be the enlarged sun (in the follow-up pattern) is representative of something other than a rapid growth into a red giant. Perhaps the solar flare activity in reaction to the "superwave" is such that the cme's would extend that far (setting aside EMV protection anyway).

With what appears to be solid evidence of Nibiru surfacing (see elenin/nibiru thread) it is probably a moot point although "planet x" is also depicted and talked about in this crop circle. Perhaps it has something to do with Pluto being out of place for the dec 21 (or 23), 2012 date?

Andov has solid material for all the other "dots" he connects so unless he eventually responds to my email or else new information surfaces I guess it is time to move on.

Thanks for the thread mojo.

[The Truth Is In There]

One last (hopefully) post here regarding the red giant.

I sent email to Pane about week ago and have not gotten a reply. I was hoping he could elaborate. I don't know if his red giant theory was based on info from ETs or simply on the crop formation(s).

Here is Wilcock talking about the same formation (go about 2 mintues in):


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8IHZE1-lOo&feature=player_embedded#at=28


It could well be the enlarged sun (in the follow-up pattern) is representative of something other than a rapid growth into a red giant. Perhaps the solar flare activity in reaction to the "superwave" is such that the cme's would extend that far (setting aside EMV protection anyway).

With what appears to be solid evidence of Nibiru surfacing (see elenin/nibiru thread) it is probably a moot point although "planet x" is also depicted and talked about in this crop circle. Perhaps it has something to do with Pluto being out of place for the dec 21 (or 23), 2012 date?

Andov has solid material for all the other "dots" he connects so unless he eventually responds to my email or else new information surfaces I guess it is time to move on.

Thanks for the thread mojo.

there's a lot of energy coming in with planet x and it's expected to reach perihelion around september 2012, give or take a few months, so something is definitely going to happen with the sun. unfortunately i'm not an expert on electromagnetism but maybe someone can explain what happens if two intense magnetic fields, one circling clockwise, the other counterclockwise, clash. do they negate or augment each other?

[Calz]

Okay - Pane has indeed responded to my email:


Hi Cal,

IBEX has measured high energy fluxes along the galactic plane of the Milky Way. We are talking about few million degrees C hot cloud with extreme magnetic properties. Of course this is not a cloud but the spreading wave of energy from the explosion of the galactic core of the milky way in the distant past. Chandra team knows what is going on and that cosmic jet was ejected out from the Sgr A* but they are not allowed to talk about it.

So here is the situation we are facing: http://www.sciencedaily.com/images/2010/05/100521191114-large.jpg There is no chance that this wave will miss us.

Mainstream science does not deny that we will make a physical contact with this cloud. Deliberate false estimation of contact is given - 100 years in the future. In reality they either speculate or not telling the truth on purpose. 6 months of extensive scan by IBEX had shown how fast is moving - ancients and ETs are correct - estimate time of impact Dec 23 2012.

The temperature of the magnetic ribbon is Millions of degrees C. The temperature of the surface of the Sun is around 6000 C however the Sun's corona is by factor 200 hotter then the surface of the sun's plasma. Now facts: Science confirms existence of M. Ribbon at the border of our Heliosphere in the direction of the galactic plane, with extreme magnetic properties. Fact two: the surface of the sun is only 6000 C with only hot atmosphere around it.

The official science claims we will hit this interstellar cloud of energy in 100 y which is incorrect and it’s the spreading wave of energy of the Sgr A* outburst in distant past. So the contact with the sun is again a fact and science has no problem with it only the time of the contact. When a cloud highly highly magnetic with temperature of few millions degrees C will make physical contact with the plasma surface which is less than 6000 C it will change the rate how hydrogen is fusing into helium, eliminating the whole hydrogen in a matter of seconds, starting nuclear fusion between helium and carbon and moving our star from its main sequence into what is known red giant phase. As mentioned many time before the expansion phase will last few months when on March 28 2012 outer layer of our star will be released into space, or will die in order to be reborn again into white dwarf or baby star.

This spreading wave cannot just hit the sun and jump over us.

Which means it will hit Earth also. The temperature of Earth’s Thermosphere is around 1,500 °C. Again if a magnetic cloud millions of degrees C hits a density of atmospheric gas that has temperatures less then 1,500 °C it will deplete the whole atmosphere. And I do not want to comment further about this.

In other words, gov are not hiding anything, the data is all there - people just do not want to see it...because if they face the facts and what that means they will awake from the dream and realize that clock is ticking...

That is all the time I can dedicate to this at this moment...soon more and more evidence will surface into direction.

Don't fall for the deliberate attempts to ridicule the crop circle phenomena by the man made ones - its only distraction tactics. Be smart, prepare as much as you can.

God bless, P

[greybeard]

Hi this is the energy that David Sereda talked about on the Coast to Coast talk.
It is a fact.
He also talks about the possible consequences of this, I cant do justice to a resume but it is possible we will see a very positive result.
Im not inclined to post the video again as I dont like spaming.
perhaps some one else will.

Chris

[Calz]

Much of Pane's material is of a positive nature and he is simply passing along what he has been shown from his lifetime of ET contact to help prepare humanity (those with ears to hear) for what is coming.

It isn't simply doom n gloom "fear porn".

I appreciate David Sereda's work as well (and you know that Chris) :)

[mojo]

Thank you for posting Panes response Calz and Greybeard thanks for mentioning David Seredas research. I posted a thread using David's information about sun changes so it seems other people are in some agreement about the changes coming. I'm having a little difficulty in the metaphysical aspect of Pane's research such as creating a flower of life shape using sacred geometry although I totally believe in the use of sacred geometry I'm having trouble in the application of it in my life. I watched some of the material Pane posted in regards to this but it's not easy for me to understand. Any help in this area would be much appreciated and perhaps it wil help me in communicating with the visitors in my sighting.

[Snoweagle]

Red Sun, 2012 ! and it warrants comments? Bunkum, twaddle and truffles!
In that case the post is in right place; Red skies need sheep, apparently plenty here, for the poster shepherd of course.

The sun is driven by scalar energy, quanta; driven by the scalar energy engine of the Milky Ways Black Hole. (Dark Matter)

[eaglespirit]

...been gazin' at the sun for almost 5 years and 1300 hours of direct eye intake at meditation...maybe I will turn into a Big Ball of Red Plasma : )

[Davidallany]

Hopefully the Mods/Admins can contact Bill/Kerry and get the ball rolling with an interview from Mr. Astralwalker himself. Would be a very interesting interview to say the least.
I second that, although the time may not be the best because of Dr. Brian O'Leary's passing.

[Flash]

Hi Cal and everyone,

First thanks for inquiring to Dr Pane and please thank him for us for his answer and the right to post it for all of us.

This is very interesting because I just listened to an interview from George Kavassillas with Kerry on Camelot this morning and George thinks that the whole solar system will definitly change and that earth will become a star itself. That was in fact a very interesting interview.

George thinks the final dates are March 2013, major changes on earth starting in December 2012. The months correspond but the year not. However, the process is similar for the sun, and the core of the earth will be transformed into a star. He also says the earth core is not metal but crystal and this will be activated in the earth change. He says the change encompasses many dimensions and time that will collapse, and some of us will be going to the fifth while others will be going to parallel universes, etc.

I saw another article that described the new discovery of scientists for the core of earth being crystal.

What amazes me is that from entirely different points of view, one scientific and the other spiritual, they both agree on the process, the only difference being the dates, one year apart, which is nothing - not even a dust - in terms of cosmic time.


the article:

http://ascendingstarseed.wordpress.c...-crystal-ball/

Here the video at camelot:


http://http://projectcamelotproducti...avassilas.html

[Davidallany]

Alf shurkr, Daoud.
That is a good find, arabs posting Ofra videos.
Just like I said, she is a bridge between the brothers.
I have been too, in my own ways, my Lord. Everything is proceeding as you have foreseen it. I wonder sometimes what language do they speak on Coruscant !! Is it the binary language of moisture vaporators ? or is that which Salacious Crumb speaks?

[Ian Gordon]

Having noted on the link to Pane's website he states that the only known safe zone is in the Australian opal mining area since it has underground water and opals can absorb gamma rays.
I have read with interest the "1st Pine lake now Woomera" thread (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?26342-1st-Pine-Gap-NOW-Woomera-Something-is-Goin-On-They-Aint-Telling..-&p=273206#post273206) that the US are going to station troops in Woomera, which I believe is close enough to raise eyebrows IMHO. However I would like someone with more local knowledge to confirm my suspiscions.

[Calz]

Having noted on the link to Pane's website he states that the only known safe zone is in the Australian opal mining area since it has underground water and opals can absorb gamma rays.
I have read with interest the "1st Pine lake now Woomera" thread (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?26342-1st-Pine-Gap-NOW-Woomera-Something-is-Goin-On-They-Aint-Telling..-&p=273206#post273206) that the US are going to station troops in Woomera, which I believe is close enough to raise eyebrows IMHO. However I would like someone with more local knowledge to confirm my suspiscions.

I will repeat ... Pane suggests that is the only safe zone passed along to him by the ETs. (note - Pane now lives in Oz)

He does not suggest that is the only safe zone.

There are many very spiritual and very connected souls who suggest "safe zones" in other areas.

Connect to ***yourself*** perhaps you will find one as well :)

[Ian Gordon]

Calz, :hug:
you are quite correct, I didn't mean to alarm anyone, that is why I put my question as "known" not the only safe own zone (if the theory is correct of course) to save confusion my section quoted from Pane's website
"Only rare zones on Earth will remain shielded – places where the Hand of God is put. Places that organic life survived during the last four times of Sun Reset Point.

One location is in Australia.

Other safe locations – unknown."
later in the text from www.paneandov.com/thesun/ when talking about Australia
"One small area with a triangle shape will support life. Inside this triangle there is water deep underground and the land is filled with opals. Opal miners discovered that when you point a beam of gamma radiation – its absorbed by the opals."

No fear porn was intended, just trying to confirm if the US goverment may (or may not) be working to a similar agenda and info. I am more than happy with my location and outlook whatever the universe throws at me:party:

[Calz]

Interesting observation of star going "red giant".



This one is mostly for a fun reminder of how much we still have to learn about what all is "out there" in space.

I would suggest this might be a shameless bump to entice more posts about the electric universe but ... nah ... I would never stoop so low ...


A glowing bubbly bauble in space


Look, I’ve been around the block a few times. I’ve spent my whole life as an astronomer, so I’ve seen pretty much every big, bright object there is in the sky.

However, "pretty much" != "all". It’s still possible to surprise me, and folks, let me tell you: the Gemini telescope’s observation of the nebula Kronberger 61 did just that!

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Wow! [Click to ennebulenate.] It looks like a buckeyball or a soccerball; my wife pointed out it looks like the shape you get when you use a bubble maker to make a bunch of bubbles all stuck together. Kn 61, as it’s called, is actually a planetary nebula, the gas flung off by a star like the Sun as it dies. You can get the details (along with many pretty pix) of how this works in a recent post of mine. In a nutshell, when a star runs out of useable hydrogen fuel in its core, it expands into a red giant and expels a huge wind of gas. This strips away the outer layers of the star, revealing the hot, dense core. Ultraviolet light from that star then lights up the surrounding gas, making these gorgeous nebulae.

The exact mechanisms for this process, however, are still not clear. I studied planetary nebulae (so-called because they sometimes resemble planetary disks through small telescopes) when I was in grad school, and a big question then was how the creation of these things depends on whether the central star was solitary, like the Sun, or had a companion (or planets). This relationship is still not clear, in fact, which is where Kn 16 comes in.

This nebula happens to be in the field of view of Kepler, an orbiting observatory that’s looking for planets around other stars. It’s staring at about 100,000 stars, looking for dips in light from the stars that indicate orbiting planets that periodically block the stars’ light. The central star of Kn 61 — the blue dot in the middle of the cloud — is being examined to see if it’s a binary or not. Professional astronomers have partnered with amateurs to do this, and Matthias Kronberger is a Swiss amateur who discovered this beauty.

The image uses filters that select the light from ionized oxygen (emitted very strongly by such nebulae) and hydrogen. I love the barred spiral galaxy just adjacent to Kn 61; the planetary nebula is in our Milky Way galaxy, but that spiral is probably tens of thousands of times farther away.

The overall symmetry of the nebula is striking — in fact, it’s sphericity makes me inclined to think the star is not part of a binary; the centrifugal force of two stars revolving around each other tends to flatten such nebula and create bizarre shapes (see Related Posts below). The filaments creating the soccerball-like structure are probably due to the nebula expanding into surrounding gas, compressing it (or a faster wind from the stellar core that has caught up with and slammed into the slower-moving red giant wind). I’ve never seen any other planetary nebula that looks quite like this one though. It’s really fantastic, in the sense of the word "fantasy": ethereal, strange, and beautiful.

Image credit: Gemini Observatory/AURA


http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2011/07/25/a-glowing-bubbly-bauble-in-space/

[grapevine]

Love Pane Andov and all he has to say. Would also love Bill and/or Kerry to interview him but only if they could edit out the "if you will"s. Sooo distracting..... I was also left bemused by Pane's advice not to get caught up in the soul catcher on the point of death but instead to head off to the other side of the universe. I thought it a wonderful idea worth remembering but then I don't want to end up alone out there, even if it is the best place ever. Don't want to end up with a harp or a trident either, come to think of it ..... :)

[Orion.V]

Pane had a good start and i believe a lot of his experiences are true, if you will. But however i think he went a little bit off the scale with his latest 2012 sun red giant theory, if you will.
Also his theory about capturing astral bodies and taking them on another planet to continue the PTB agenda ??? Having 30 seconds time to escape while in astral form and head to the ribbon ???
Come on ....

If you ... nvm ...

[Forevernyt]

Call me dense, and I stopped reading the responses about half way down, but if this energy wave is turning suns into red giants as it proceeds toward us, wouldn't it be leaving a trail of red giant suns in it's wake? Wouldn't there be some tell tale signs of it's progression?

Just a thought.

[johnf]

i'm pretty sure what that crop circle depicts is that the magnetic field of the sun expands, not the sun itself. if the sun were to expand beyond the orbit of mercury what do you think would happen to all life on earth? everyting would be roasted and there's nothing that points in that direction, not in science, not in prophecy or religious scripture, not in crop circles & ET messages nor anywhere else. about the expanding magnetic field on the other hand we got a good deal of information from various sources. i believe that essentially that is what's going to trigger the "ascension". in fact, i think it's already happening and will just further increase in 2012.

I find this idea of a "magnetic" wave to be closer to the truth of what has been happening in the last year or several years. I have not waded through the entirety of Pandov's presentations, and wasn't aware of the belief that the earth will be fried in 2012 was part of the package.
I have looked into a lot of metaphysical thought systems over the last 3 decades, and I have noticed that there is often a lot of stuff that brings up intense positive feelings, followed by some message of fear. It is quite possible that he has been subjected to a very long and thorough indoctrination process that leads to him being a very powerful deliverer of this message. OBE states and Lucid dreaming states (I am only naming two possibilities out of many) have an immense potential to release people from negative emotions and beliefs, and in the space left over from powerful experiences is an equally powerfull space that begs to be filled.
Not everyone having these experiences comes up with a planet killing scenario, but it seems that all of them do go along with a sort of clearing of the way , and that is something I helpful, because it gives me the responsibility over what I put in that new space rather than some other unexaminable source.

The hunger for answers is a very sharp two edged sword, the existence of us all here and the interesting changes and upheavals, loss of old friends and making of new ones points that out very strongly to me. The electric universe ideas make a whoe lot of sense to me as far as I understand them, but I really don't think they have come far enough to predict what is going to happen on the planet yet.
I intend to continue to watch and keep my eyes open and keep asking ,is this something I really know? Is this something I am really being asked to answer? And am I willing to not know until it is really time?

[Mark]

People are ascribing all kinds of potentialities to that "Wave" that we are going to pass through or that is going to pass through us. Pane Andov speaks of spending hours and hours as an astral traveler and in meditation. He seems to consider himself quite the expert at it. I wonder if people think he makes that up also ... it's always interesting how we seek to interpret things through the lenses of our own knowledge, even when the basis of the things we wish to interpret are by nature outside of our knowledge, especially if we are relying primarily upon the mainstream.

[ghostrider]

Go and do some astronomical study and you will find that it is not possible.
This is something that happens over a vast period, not a few years.

exactly right , no way , to become a red giant it would take billions of years. for example I read our sun will be a red giant in five billion years.

[araucaria]

Call me dense, and I stopped reading the responses about half way down, but if this energy wave is turning suns into red giants as it proceeds toward us, wouldn't it be leaving a trail of red giant suns in it's wake? Wouldn't there be some tell tale signs of it's progression?

Just a thought.

You ain't dense, but if the wave is approaching at light speed, everything closer than us to the galactic centre, whatever the distance, will light up simultaneously, like a Christmas tree - should be pretty spectacular! (I can't remember, it might be slightly slower, but not much). The only way to find out ahead of time is via much faster-than-light travel, as one poster suggested.

Example: Earth at 2600o light years from galactic centre, wave takes 26,000 years. Star X exactly midway - waves takes 13,000 light years to reach Star X plus another 13,000 for the resulting event on Star X to reach us

[Davidallany]

People are ascribing all kinds of potentialities to that "Wave" that we are going to pass through or that is going to pass through us. Pane Andov speaks of spending hours and hours as an astral traveler and in meditation. He seems to consider himself quite the expert at it. I wonder if people think he makes that up also ... it's always interesting how we seek to interpret things through the lenses of our own knowledge, even when the basis of the things we wish to interpret are by nature outside of our knowledge, especially if we are relying primarily upon the mainstream.
It's difficult to say what Pane has experienced through his meditation, as a meditator and practitioner of metaphysics I can safely say that meditation and special visualization techniques can bring about higher degrees of perception and insight. Especially when aided with the so called kundalini. Knowledge comes from the five senses, but intuition comes from somewhere higher.

[Forevernyt]

Ah, I get. Damn physics. :)

[araucaria]

It isn't actually quite as fast as that I think, and the path is usually not straight, so it probably wouldn't be exactly similar, but the problem of finding out remains the same - short of remote viewing or something of that nature.

[Carmody]

i'm pretty sure what that crop circle depicts is that the magnetic field of the sun expands, not the sun itself. if the sun were to expand beyond the orbit of mercury what do you think would happen to all life on earth? everything would be roasted and there's nothing that points in that direction, not in science, not in prophecy or religious scripture, not in crop circles & ET messages nor anywhere else. about the expanding magnetic field on the other hand we got a good deal of information from various sources. i believe that essentially that is what's going to trigger the "ascension". in fact, i think it's already happening and will just further increase in 2012.

When we have large coronal ejections that disturb the earth's field powerfully, I get ejected out of my body at night. So at least I personally have a form of psychic cross correlation to electromagnetic/high voltage/plasma phenomena.

[Calz]

Someone posted a *fantastic* hour long crop circle vimeo video within the last couple of days and for the life of me I cannot remember what thread I found it in.

Anyway ... focused on several serious long-time investigators.

Their conclusion (brilliantly backed up in the video) was that about 95% of all crop circles are man made. The real kicker is the patterns that are incredibly complex to such a degree it would seem quite impossible for people with boards to make ... are not only possible but demonstrates how they are made. The "real" ones are more "organic" and less "mathematical".

Video also documents probable MI5 involvement with creating many of these "hoaxed" patterns as disinfo (trying to keep public confused since there are a few of the real deal).

Anyway, I bring it up here as it calls into question the authenticity of the crop circle depicting the sun expanding that we have been referring to in this thread.

If anyone else happened to see that video or have any idea what thread it was in please post a link. It was a real eye-opener for me because I truly thought there was *no* way for the complex patterns to be man made.

[Calz]

Found it. Well worth the time here folks.

If you watch carefully it actually flashes the pattern in question. It doesn't comment directly on it but it was shown as they were talking about man-made patterns suggesting it was not legit.


This is a great documentry by Richad Hall if you have not seen it , its a must if you are interested in crop circles.....
It explains the background and later Richard exposes John Lundbergs links with intellegence agencies

A9J_to9tbCE




Heres a link to the vid full 55mins as i said excellent piece of work imho..

http://vimeo.com/27953209