Richard Hoagland

[Debra]

This is getting messy, too much so. I perceive some witch hunting is going on as well. I am detecting smear campaigns all this week to discredit the folk in the disclosure community who are standing taller than some. They are doing a good job too, I feel the confusion. The pressure is on, a frenzied campaign of outing is happening, but is it true?

[RMorgan]

This is getting messy, too much so. I perceive some witch hunting is going on as well. I am detecting smear campaigns all this week to discredit the folk in the disclosure community who are standing taller than some. They are doing a good job too, I feel the confusion. The pressure is on, a frenzied campaign of outing is happening, but is it true?

There´s no witch hunting here Zebra. The thing is that, deliberately or not, slowly, the so called "alternative media" is becoming more unreliable than the so called "mainstream media".

It is possible that people like Hoagland, are manipulated to spread fake info in order to discredit the "alternative media", so we must stay alert.

If we don´t take this serious, we might have no reliable sources of information sooner than you think.

All this game of one failed prediction after another, and unfounded theories is becoming ridiculous. The question is: Is it on purpose? If it is, who is behind it?

Cheers,

Raf.

[Daft Ada]

Not sure I follow you there mate, who else is being outed then?

[Cartomancer]

Not sure I follow you there mate, who else is being outed then?

There was a big controversy's over the Wellaware1.com guy saying that many events like the rep. Gifford's shooting were faked and used actors. He accused Bill and Inelia of being plants or actors. Last week we had a big thread about "con men" and Hoagland's name came up a lot. It has been a few days of skepticism here at PA. I guess I'm on the being skeptical of Hoagland bandwagon myself. He is entertaining though.

Hoagland just did a five minute long blurb on Coast to Coast last night where he was speculating about a Russian Mars Probe secret mission that his contancts informed him of. He's doing a full show this week at some point.

[Daft Ada]

Ahh ok thanks mate, I think it's Wednesdays show he's on for the whole show.

[RMorgan]

It´s important to question things, to not believe in everything presented to you. It´s also important to always keep the mind open, and to not be ashamed of changing it and accepting new ideas.

I believe the balance between being skeptic and being a believer is crucial for all of us to get closer to the truth.

Personally, I always follow this path. I´m not ingenuous, but I´m not suspicious as well.

Cheers,

Raf.

[Daft Ada]

Sounds reasonable to me Raf, to be totally honest I am convinced that aliens exist, I have no solid proof or evidence but based on the fact that we are here and how big the universe is I would think the odds against there not being other life forms would be very slim. All the evidence I have read most of my life has pretty much convinced me that some are here on a regular basis but I confess to constantly looking for solid proof although I would be surprised if I ever found it.

[jagman]

tonight's show
1am - 5am ET
10pm - 2am PT
Mars & Phobos
Wed 11-30
C2C Science Advisor and head of the Enterprise Mission, Richard C. Hoagland, will discuss the latest American and Russian unmanned efforts to reach Mars. He'll also talk about NASA's "Curiosity" rover, the next generation of massive robotic spacecraft, and the inner Martian moon and the possibility it's more likely to be "an ancient ET spaceship" than an actual natural moon.

I have heard a lot about Hoagland this week on PA. Maybe someone from Pa could call
in and ask Hoagland about some of the accusations?

[Lord Sidious]

I have sent message after message to George via skype and he never answers.

[Cartomancer]

I will be noting all of his predictions tonight. It will be interesting to see if he addresses his predictions concerning Elenin and subsequent asteroid threat.

[jagman]

I have sent message after message to George via skype and he never answers.

Lord Sid, For some reason I always have good luck calling into coast.
I need to read through that post about humping Hoagland again so I
can formulate some questions for Hoagy or just send me some questions you want
answered.

[Lord Sidious]

I have sent message after message to George via skype and he never answers.

Lord Sid, For some reason I always have good luck calling into coast.
I need to read through that post about humping Hoagland again so I
can formulate some questions for Hoagy or just send me some questions you want
answered.

I lost interest in their show, to be honest.
People who never reply to me tend to lose any respect they might have had.

[Cartomancer]

I have sent message after message to George via skype and he never answers.

Lord Sid, For some reason I always have good luck calling into coast.
I need to read through that post about humping Hoagland again so I
can formulate some questions for Hoagy or just send me some questions you want
answered.

Ask him to address why he made all these erroneous predictions. Ask him why none of them came to pass. Ask him why we should go on trusting anything he says. Thanks.

[jagman]

I have sent message after message to George via skype and he never answers.

Lord Sid, For some reason I always have good luck calling into coast.
I need to read through that post about humping Hoagland again so I
can formulate some questions for Hoagy or just send me some questions you want
answered.

Ask him to address why he made all these erroneous predictions. Ask him why none of them came to pass. Ask him why we should go on trusting anything he says. Thanks.

If i get through I will ask him.

[RMorgan]

Hey Jagman,

I would ask:

1-Mr. Hoagland, why do you still trust your sources after they were proven to be wrong on many occasions?

2-Mr.Hoagland, do you think that there´s a possibility that someone is playing you, deliberately giving you fake information trough your sources, in order to discredit the alternative media, or for any other reasons?

That´s all I can think right now...Anyway, if you manage to ask him these questions, I would really like to see his reactions; Will him be humble and assume his mistakes, or will he perform an evasive maneuver?

Good luck,

Raf.

[jagman]

Hey Jagman,

I would ask:

1-Mr. Hoagland, why do you still trust your sources after they were proven to be wrong on many occasions?

2-Mr.Hoagland, do you think that there´s a possibility that someone is playing you, deliberately giving you fake information trough your sources, in order to discredit the alternative media, or for any other reasons?

That´s all I can think right now...Anyway, if you manage to ask him these
questions, I would really like to see his reactions; Will him be humble and assume his mistakes, or will he perform an evasive maneuver?

Good luck,

Raf.
I like your questions and i will ask if i can get through tonight. Im not sure how all
this will square with George but I think these are good questions that need to be
asked

[Truthseeker512]

Ask him why he believes there are artificial structures on/orbiting Mars, simply from photos decades old, that NO archaeologist has had the opportunity to verify, yet he laughs at the Bosnian Pyramid claim despite there being 100s of archaeologists, physicists, structural engineers, geologists, anthropologists, material scientists etc who are willing to put their professional/academic reputations on the line and confirm Dr Semir Osmanagics discovery.

Lack of 'data' is not a satisfying answer considering there are many, many scientific reports from dozens of universities/academics and NON for the majority of what he makes a living off.

:mad2:

Then ask him if he only made his History Channel 2012 Mayan Special for the cash.

http://www.sbresearchgroup.eu/Richard/Mayan.png
This is a Mayan elder who I met this summer. He came to visit the excavations. There was no doubt in his mind as to the authenticity of the discovery.

[eric charles]

Ask him about those photos from that t.v show , was it UFO digest or something of the sort ,

[Cartomancer]

Great point. I have done some archaeology professionally. I have always wondered about his obsession with structures on Mars when there are so many bizarre things to study and find right here on earth. It seems like a grand distraction. As an author I can also say that if you don't subscribe to issues like structures on Mars and UFO's you are soundly ignored. The truth is much stranger than any theories that involve these things. I think much of this is to cover up the real truth about history. It's like they have created a fairy tale world for all of those that question the status quo.

I'm not saying that UFO's or the structures are not impossible but I think they are being used to create a smokescreen. Hoagland has been one of the main people promoting all of this and he should be scrutinized for it. Bravo to Project Avalon and Bill for putting all of this info out there for us to study and analyze.

[jaybee]

tonight's show
1am - 5am ET
10pm - 2am PT
Mars & Phobos
Wed 11-30
C2C Science Advisor and head of the Enterprise Mission, Richard C. Hoagland, will discuss the latest American and Russian unmanned efforts to reach Mars. He'll also talk about NASA's "Curiosity" rover, the next generation of massive robotic spacecraft, and the inner Martian moon and the possibility it's more likely to be "an ancient ET spaceship" than an actual natural moon.

I have heard a lot about Hoagland this week on PA. Maybe someone from Pa could call
in and ask Hoagland about some of the accusations?

thanks jagman....I won't be able to listen to it live, but hopefully it will be up on YouTube fairly soon.


Richard Hoagland, like the rest of us, is not perfect...but I believe he is sincere and has made a massive contribution to the Alternative Media.


I, personally, don't like to see Hoagland bashing on forums like this...but we have to remember that this forum, like any forum dealing with conspiracies etc. will be heavily infiltrated.

Not saying that anyone who disagrees with or bashes Hoagland is a spook...but I am convinced that he is way up in the top section of the spook's hitlist.

I expect the subject of Elenin and YU 55 will come up and it will be interesting to hear what he has to say.

I hope to be able to hear the whole interview asap as I always find Hoagland to be a good and interesting speaker.

cheers

[Daft Ada]

Hi Jagman, I won't be able to listen live either as I am in the UK and asleep then, but I will hear the show next day and I would welcome some delicately put questions of that nature and I would also be very interested if you report back that you were not allowed to ask those sorts of questions

[jagman]

Hi Jagman, I won't be able to listen live either as I am in the UK and asleep then, but I will hear the show next day and I would welcome some delicately put questions of that nature and I would also be very interested if you report back that you were not allowed to ask those sorts of questions

I plan on using a technique that i have used in the past on coast.
When my call is fielded I will ask a question that is not deemed to controversial.
But when i am on the air I will be respectful but will ask Hoagland some questions
he might not want to answer. I have talked to some people who have met Hoagland
and they say he can be quite arrogant.

[RMorgan]

thanks jagman....I won't be able to listen to it live, but hopefully it will be up on YouTube fairly soon.


Richard Hoagland, like the rest of us, is not perfect...but I believe he is sincere and has made a massive contribution to the Alternative Media.


I, personally, don't like to see Hoagland bashing on forums like this...but we have to remember that this forum, like any forum dealing with conspiracies etc. will be heavily infiltrated.

Not saying that anyone who disagrees with or bashes Hoagland is a spook...but I am convinced that he is way up in the top section of the spook's hitlist.

I expect the subject of Elenin and YU 55 will come up and it will be interesting to hear what he has to say.

I hope to be able to hear the whole interview asap as I always find Hoagland to be a good and interesting speaker.

cheers

Dear Jaybee,

Hoagland doesn´t need any infiltrator to ruin his reputation. He´s doing it all by himself.

Anyway, I don´t think he´s a bad person. I just think someone found a way to manipulate him to tell lies believing it´s true.

If the rumors of him being arrogant are correct, this might be the reason. Arrogant persons are egocentric persons, and these kind of persons are the easier to manipulated, with just some sweet ego-massaging mixed with lies.

Cheers,

Raf.

[jackovesk]

Richard Hoagland - Secret Space Research (Mars - Phobus - YU55)


C2C Science Advisor and head of the Enterprise Mission, Richard C. Hoagland, discussed the latest American and Russian unmanned efforts to reach Mars and what may be the true nature of those missions. He suggested that the agenda behind the Russian Phobos-Grunt craft is not to travel to the Martian inner moon, but to actually journey to the YU55 asteroid that recently passed by Earth. He theorized that the Russians are interested in this object because it is not merely an asteroid, but is actually a craft. The origins of this craft, Hoagland said, could be from an ancient civilization that once populated the galaxy but was destroyed in a massive war.

While the dueling Martian missions of the US and Russia may appear to be a new space race, Hoagland put forward the idea that it is really "a covert cooperation with the illusion of a competition." In this scenario, he said, the Russians are hoping to land their craft on the YU55 and take samples of it. Meanwhile, the Americans may have used their secret spy plane, known as the X-37B, to "rendezvous with YU55 as it comes through the system" and take detailed images of the object. Hoagland pointed to news that the X-37B was ending its latest mission early as a potential sign that "it's bringing something home." He cited a BBC report which quoted a Russian astronomer who described "strange structures" on YU55 as well as the repeated comparisons of the 'asteroid' to an aircraft carrier as potentially leaked clues to what the object really is.

Regarding NASA's Curiosity Rover, Hoagland surmised that, if his theories are correct, it will ultimately lead to the disclosure that there was once an ancient race of people on the Red Planet. He explained that the planned landing site for Curiosity is inside the Gale Crater on Mars, where a mysterious mountain sits in the center. The origin of this mountain, Hoagland noted, baffles astronomers. Based on his study of photos of this land mass, he contended that it is "an ancient structure." Noting that Curiosity is nuclear powered, rather than solar powered like previous Mars rovers, Hoagland speculated that perhaps NASA plans on using the vehicle to explore inside this ancient structure. Beyond that, he revealed that Curiosity's nuclear design will also allow for it to potentially be used to journey to Cydonia and examine the infamous anomalies found there.


Richard C. Hoagland, shares some images of Mars which he will discussed on the 11/30/11 edition of the program. Richard says ...

NASA's latest, NUCLEAR-powered "breakthrough" unmanned rover mission -- aptly named "Curiosity" -- is now safely on its way to Mars, arriving next August, 2012; while, in striking contrast, the equally"breakthrough" unmanned Russian "Phobos-Grunt" mission (carrying a Chinese satellite!), destined to explore the exotic inner Martian "moon", Phobos--

Is still mysteriously "stuck"--

In low-Earth orbit!

Or ... is it?

For my "Coast" fans and friends, here's a preview of tonight's show ....

This (below) is what's at stake, waiting for the Russians to solve their "parking orbit problem."

http://www.enterprisemission.com/Phobos.html

And, for the American mission, its intended target -- Gale Crater -- has an equally astonishing "surprise" awaiting its successful landing next August--

A full blown, ancient, 3-mile-high "tetrahedral arcology" ... on Mars (see image #1)!

On tonight's "Coast," I will be discussing extraordinary details of a potential, three-way, "21st Century Space Race"--

As to who will be the FIRST--

To first to FIND -- and then ANNOUNCE ... in 2012 --- first-hand scientific PROOF of "ancient Life at Mars?!"

The second, close-up image (image #2) is a recent Mars Reconniassance Orbiter (MRO) close-in view of an exposed small section of the "Gale Crater arcology's" lowest-level ROOMS -- which "Curiosity" will be INTENSELY exploring, with a variety of super-sophisticated instruments ... over the next several YEARS ....

Note the incredible "right-angles" and even "3-D pyramids) in this tiny section of a MUCH larger, official NASA "Gale Crater Arcology" image.

http://download.coasttocoastam.com/pages/RCH113011a.JPG


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6SD_kqabsNU&feature=BFa&list=PL8013306AEF21A615&lf=plpp_video


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jcfvqmLqGn8&feature=BFa&list=PL8013306AEF21A615&lf=plpp_video


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkdKExV6q74&feature=BFa&list=PL8013306AEF21A615&lf=plpp_video

Update on YU55


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4UY14G9MoCU&feature=BFa&list=PL8013306AEF21A615&lf=plpp_video


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8yx3ltA6Ri4&feature=BFa&list=PL8013306AEF21A615&lf=plpp_video


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBA3_M21A_o&feature=BFa&list=PL8013306AEF21A615&lf=plpp_video

Caller Questions


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1vfSldZnCk&feature=BFa&list=PL8013306AEF21A615&lf=plpp_video


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=roDXd5RQgKM&feature=BFa&list=PL8013306AEF21A615&lf=plpp_video

PS - Should be interesting..? Have'nt listen to the show yet...

[Unified Serenity]

Thanks for posting. Putting my discernment boots on as I wade into the muck and mire of anything hoagland these days.

[Cartomancer]

I listened to the show last night. What he has done now is simply morphed his previous theories about Elenin and YU55 into something new. Now the Russian Mars probe and the US mars probe are part of a "secret mission." When pressed to answer questions about his previous claims he denied saying anything about it. I think it may have been Jagman that asked the last question on the show last night. He sidestepped it just like a politician. He basically did not answer the question when challenged about what he thought Elenin was.

It's kind of weird. He simply took his earlier erroneous predictions and simply changed them to fit the two Mars missions. This is B.S. because those missions were known of when he was spreading all the fear porn about Elenin before it passed and he never linked them to what he was saying. Now all of the sudden these two space missions are "part of this theory." He is grasping for straws and simply telling us things based on a bunch of B.S. I was hoping I would be proven wrong last night but he just is not reliable in my judgement. This guy is just an established party line mouthpiece and I am just not buying.

[jackovesk]

Thanks for posting. Putting my discernment boots on as I wade into the muck and mire of anything hoagland these days.

Exactly Unified Serenity,

Make sure your boots are air-tight & waterproof to keep out the BS...

[Mutchie]

i must get new boots mine are not air tight or water proof ...... i will drown in the BS lol Hoagland Mmmm whose side is he really on it makes you wanderif he is still involved with nasa in some way the people trust or they did and he gets to a far reaching audience

[RMorgan]

I think Hoagland is in the wrong business. He would be much more happy and successful if he was a Sci-Fi writer or something like that. He´s really creative.

[Cartomancer]

I listened to the show last night. When challenged about his previous statements about what Elenin was he back pedaled just like a politician and did not answer the question.

Really what I am wondering here is why he has had to change his theories. Before Elenin passed and as it approached these two Mars missions were known of. Why weren't they part of this theory then? Now that the comet and asteroid have passed there is now a "secret mission" involving the Russioan probe and the Curiosity probe from the US. Basically what this guy is doing is making it up as he goes along. When the Russian probe fails to launch from orbit what is he going to say then? Elenin did nothing. YU55 did nothing. This guy directly side stepped questions about what he thought the comet was (a tetrahedral space ship) and his calling for a New World Order. He changed the subject right away.

Nothing to be afraid of now. Must make up additional threat using the same inane B.S. I used to scare them before. Must create fear porn while ridiculing others who do so. This is a person who called for a New World Order at the UN. He says it is just so he could get funding. I don't know which is worse saying it just to get funding or actually meaning it. This guy is a public relations pro who used to work for a major network. He is not a scientist at all. This is who we look to for info about what is going on in space?

[RMorgan]

I listened to the show last night. What he has done now is simply morphed his previous theories about Elenin and YU55 into something new. Now the Russian Mars probe and the US mars probe are part of a "secret mission." When pressed to answer questions about his previous claims he denied saying anything about it. I think it may have been Jagman that asked the last question on the show last night. He sidestepped it just like a politician. He basically did not answer the question when challenged about what he thought Elenin was.

It's kind of weird. He simply took his earlier erroneous predictions and simply changed them to fit the two Mars missions. This is B.S. because those missions were known of when he was spreading all the fear porn about Elenin before it passed and he never linked them to what he was saying. Now all of the sudden these two space missions are "part of this theory." He is grasping for straws and simply telling us things based on a bunch of B.S. I was hoping I would be proven wrong last night but he just is not reliable in my judgement. This guy is just an established party line mouthpiece and I am just not buying.

Jackovesk posted his interview in this thread:

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?35939-Coast-to-Coast-AM--Richard-Hoagland--Mars-Phobos...

Hoagland did just like I expected as well. He always does that kind of "morphing" like you said.

Cheers,

Raf.

[eric charles]

Ive listened to 3 parts now , and i just couldnt bare listening to any more of it , He claims he doesnt rely onhis sources , but then always says "my sources inform me.........."

[buckminster fuller]

spectacle, really... and it truly starts with the way R Hoagland manages his hair style... this is a ufo in itself.

[jackovesk]

spectacle, really... and it truly starts with the way R Hoagland manages his hair style... this is a ufo in itself.

RATFLMAO...

http://www.pakalertpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/Richard-Hoaglands-Dark-Mission-Coverups-Lies-and-Calling-for-a-New-World-Order.jpg

:pound:

[onawah]

I still maintain that Hoagland is suffering from the onset of senile dementia.
It would surely explain a lot.
I think Robin should discreetly have him tested before he goes completely off the rails.
Sad.

[eric charles]

spectacle, really... and it truly starts with the way R Hoagland manages his hair style... this is a ufo in itself.

RATFLMAO...

http://www.pakalertpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/Richard-Hoaglands-Dark-Mission-Coverups-Lies-and-Calling-for-a-New-World-Order.jpg

:pound:

LOLOLOL , his hair and those silly 1950s Col.Saunders(KFC) ties he wears all the time

[norman]

I found the bits about the curiosity landing site very informative.

Hoagland, for me, is like many others out there. If I just regard them as sensors plugged into my own processor they are quite useful but I wouldn't want to rely on their processing much.

[baddbob]

In his words "follow the money" I feel thats what he is doing the only side he is on is the money side:confused: Only meaning here is thats what he does for a living, got to go where it flows to stay alive.:juggle:

[Daft Ada]

Hi Jagman, so did you manage to get a question on coast? I heard someone phone in and start asking an awkward question and George obviously switched his mic off and Hoagland gave a very poor explaination and they quickly moved on, was that you?

[Cartomancer]

Hi Jagman, so did you manage to get a question on coast? I heard someone phone in and start asking an awkward question and George obviously switched his mic off and Hoagland gave a very poor explaination and they quickly moved on, was that you?

Ada, check the other thread on this subject. I heard the show and to me it sounded like the last caller was jag. Hoagland sidestepped the question and just simply did not answer it. I think this is the link to the other thread:

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?35939-Coast-to-Coast-AM--Richard-Hoagland--Mars-Phobos-YU55--11-30-11-

[Truthseeker512]

Listening now...

'Google is your friend'...

Ive said this a few times, or words to that effect and feel immensely uncomfortable immediately after the words have left my mouth, knowing what I know about the company and its ongoing agenda.

I certainly would not coin it as one of my catchphrases over the airwaves where millions of people are likely to hear it. Its highly irresponsible. Unless, like me, after making such a statement you apologise and announce the small print ('Google is your friend'.... well, just as long as you realize it is censoring vital information, tracking and storing your details, search data, online habits, making revenue by selling your data to third parties without consent, developed by the NSA, aiding with China's firewall etc etc in fact, its not your friend at all, but a wolf in sheeps clothing. Lets say its better than catching a bus to the library..)

Edit: I gave up on it.

[TargeT]

F google..

this helps a LITTLE, but your still using its machinery...
www.startpage.com ;)

Hopefully the phrase "google is your friend" is like saying " can I have a kleenex"; or in other words.. the word "google" is now synonymous with "internet search" or "research" or "fact check" or "don't be F'n lazy and do something on your own"....:blah:


My question is this: how do people like Hoagland get popular / "famous" & why do the "known" ones always seem to be more than a little bat-****-crazy &/or disinfo agents?

[jagman]

I called in last night on Coast, I told Georges assistant My Question was regarding allegations made against Richard Hoagland
that were posted on" Before its News.com". He was really excited by my question but he wanted me to call in tonight during
open lines because they wanted their guest last night to get calls

[Daft Ada]

Ahhh, didn't want you to actually ask the horses mouth then Jag, will you call in tonight?

¤=[Post Update]=¤



Hi Jagman, so did you manage to get a question on coast? I heard someone phone in and start asking an awkward question and George obviously switched his mic off and Hoagland gave a very poor explaination and they quickly moved on, was that you?

Ada, check the other thread on this subject. I heard the show and to me it sounded like the last caller was jag. Hoagland sidestepped the question and just simply did not answer it. I think this is the link to the other thread:

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?35939-Coast-to-Coast-AM--Richard-Hoagland--Mars-Phobos-YU55--11-30-11-

Thanks Cartomancer I thought that to, but Jag just said it wasn't him.

[jagman]

Ahhh, didn't want you to actually ask the horses mouth then Jag, will you call in tonight?

¤=[Post Update]=¤



Hi Jagman, so did you manage to get a question on coast? I heard someone phone in and start asking an awkward question and George obviously switched his mic off and Hoagland gave a very poor explaination and they quickly moved on, was that you?

Ada, check the other thread on this subject. I heard the show and to me it sounded like the last caller was jag. Hoagland sidestepped the question and just simply did not answer it. I think this is the link to the other thread:

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?35939-Coast-to-Coast-AM--Richard-Hoagland--Mars-Phobos-YU55--11-30-11-

Thanks Cartomancer I thought that to, but Jag just said it wasn't him.

I have developed a pretty good rapport with George and has long has I do not come at Richard like im a prosecutor I think he will allow me to ask Richard to respond
to these allegations.
Also Lord Sid I dont Know if you can see this or not but im going to ask George why he has not responded to my Australian buddys skype messages lol By the way thanks Modwiz

[Davidallany]

Mr. Richard Hoagland effectively defends his position.
FLcEWVLe2nc

[Daft Ada]

Thanks Jag, I hope it goes well for you, let us know if you get on and ask your questions.

[Cartomancer]

As of Friday 12/2 Phobos Grunt has been abandoned and they are unable to make the engines fire. I guess he could go on and say:"how do we know that is true?" There is always a backdoor. I guess I can see why he is thinking what he is but it is very tenuous. If we are trusting the mainstream news the probe has failed and is stuck in low orbit and will not launch.

[jcocks]

spectacle, really... and it truly starts with the way R Hoagland manages his hair style... this is a ufo in itself.

RATFLMAO...

http://www.pakalertpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/Richard-Hoaglands-Dark-Mission-Coverups-Lies-and-Calling-for-a-New-World-Order.jpg

:pound:

He looks like Darren Hinch in that photo..


SHAME SHAME SHAME!

hahahahaha

[Trinity]

I'm sorry Richard, but I cannot continue to listen to you.. You ask just as many questions as the next person. I think that you have a great imagination but after 30 minutes is just all begins to sound like psychoanalytical babble.. Sorry mate, but I think that you have and are continuing to lose a lot of credibility.
I still don't know any more about anything after listening to you for 30 mins..

t

[ndroock1]

I think Hoagland is in the wrong business. He would be much more happy and successful if he was a Sci-Fi writer or something like that. He´s really creative.

LOL.

But he =IS= ! Hoagland is a Science FACTion writer. Hoagland ( and others in the genre, including our beloved Bill Ryan ) have created a world full of mysteries and conspiracies in which you can participate, and act as if it was all real. Sort of like the Blair Witch movie. The players in this game are people. It is a friendly, intellectual type of game in which you can make real friends for life. - There is only one rule in this game: RCH's word ( fill in the leader of -your- game, i.e. Wilcock, Icke, etc. ) is the TRUTH.

'Exposing' RCH is impossible because that would end the game which has been running for 4 decades.

[Elixer]

Bashing him good. No mercy. Kicking him when he's down?
Maybe he's been played.
Maybe he's right after all.
There is no way to tell.
I'd think it smart not to take up these extreme positions.
Not everything he says is right and not everything is wrong either.

The way he talks however, that has changed since that Red Ice interview. Now he speaks much more annoyingly, as if every sentence is a major perl of wisdom or sensational breaking news. I wouldn't mind him toning that down again.

Kerry comes to his defense in her blog (http://projectcamelotproductions.com/blog-hp.html).

I think we can be more balanced and possibly should.

[onawah]

Kerry's defense is good, but it still doesn't explain why Hoagland is being so unnecessarily hostile to people who are just asking him questions.
Unless it's just all getting to be too much for him.
Which I can certainly understand, if that is the case.

But I couldn't find the interview with David Wilcock and Richard Hoagland that is supposed to be at the link Kerry gave on her blog for: Project Camelot Live Channel on Livestream.
Never mind. Found it here:
http://www.livestream.com/projectcamelotlive/video?clipId=pla_4aa6a25b-f471-462e-b2a4-171b8af752a1

[Elixer]

I can only see the part 2 of the LiveStream (http://www.livestream.com/projectcamelotlive/video?clipId=pla_4aa6a25b-f471-462e-b2a4-171b8af752a1&utm_source=lslibrary&utm_medium=ui-thumb), which I think more than suffices. Part 1 was not very constructive as I remember.

[onawah]

David Wilcock made some interesting comments in the last part of this conversation.
http://www.livestream.com/projectcamelotlive/video?clipId=pla_4aa6a25b-f471-462e-b2a4-171b8af752a1

[Elixer]

http://camelotforum.com/index.php?option=com_kunena&func=view&catid=21&id=67945&Itemid=164#68195
This is the Camelot Forum thread about these accusations against Hoagland
Gary, MadMartian is posting lengthy pieces, highly charged, lots in ALLCAPS and making demands to be interviewed by Kerry.
I don't think this is doing his case much good.
He and Mike Vara are very very emotional in this regard. If their claims are true, they have every right. But they still have to make the case. Right now it's mostly allegations and conjecture and I therefore find it hard to take this emotional stance too seriously.
I could even go as far as to say that it is possible that this is a deliberate disinfo smear campaign against Hoagland. But I wouldn't want to take sides at this point.

[jackovesk]

Bashing him good. No mercy. Kicking him when he's down?
Maybe he's been played.
Maybe he's right after all.
There is no way to tell.
I'd think it smart not to take up these extreme positions.
Not everything he says is right and not everything is wrong either.

The way he talks however, that has changed since that Red Ice interview. Now he speaks much more annoyingly, as if every sentence is a major perl of wisdom or sensational breaking news. I wouldn't mind him toning that down again.

Kerry comes to his defense in her blog (http://projectcamelotproductions.com/blog-hp.html).

I think we can be more balanced and possibly should.

I painstakingly read every single word of Kerry's defense of Hoagland...

I admire Kerry, but due to her lengthy (Intellectual Investment) in Richard Hoagland's Fanatisies, she to is having to (Save Face) by defending the self confessed NASA's Godly Prophet...

Another way of putting it...

Its like when you listen to Alternative Radio and everytime the phone/audio goes click or drops out it must be the TPTB..!

For Once could they back up something with real Factual Proof...


Richard can't tell us everything because his Lifes in Danger..! :pound:

I'm sure the PTB would'nt even waste the bullet..!

...and just by some kind of 'Hallelujah Type Miracle' he is correct, I'll gladly eat humble pie...

As Hoagland says every 30mins on Radio - You can find even more excellent information on (MY FACEBOOK FAN PAGE)..!!!

Gimme a break, I almost done with ALL of this crap..!

[ghostrider]

Thanks for posting. Putting my discernment boots on as I wade into the muck and mire of anything hoagland these days.

hoagland hasn't had a good run lately, the lie different at every level is still a LIE.

[LisAlien]

Bashing him good. No mercy. Kicking him when he's down?
Maybe he's been played.
Maybe he's right after all.
There is no way to tell.
I'd think it smart not to take up these extreme positions.
Not everything he says is right and not everything is wrong either.

The way he talks however, that has changed since that Red Ice interview. Now he speaks much more annoyingly, as if every sentence is a major perl of wisdom or sensational breaking news. I wouldn't mind him toning that down again.

Kerry comes to his defense in her blog (http://projectcamelotproductions.com/blog-hp.html).

I think we can be more balanced and possibly should.









If he may be right and he may be wrong then, (in all due respect I ask) what the hell good is he?
Because anyone can do what he's doing which is: claim controversial, unconventional, conspiratorial and unorthodox statements then; back said-statements with nothing more than controversial, unconventional, conspiratorial and blurry photos!
I don't even think you need a high school diploma to execute that (instead just learn a few four-syllable words: i.e. tetrahedral)

He seems wacky. He's looking even more wacky since going with his 'no upper teeth' look. He comes off very rehearsed. Almost like a programmed zombie. There is something very wrong with Richard.

For some reason this year, I went through this subconscious spring cleaning of all these whistle-blowers and I now see most of them in a whole new light. And I tell you, it's an unflattering light at best!
I feel most of these people are opportunists riding the 2012 gravy train. However Hoagland is a bit different. I deeply feel that HE deeply believes all his mosaic-like observations are really true. And even if you could prove to Hoagland he's wrong, he'd somehow bend, twist and spin it into something else. Because after all the best defense is playing offense. And it is my opinion that Richard C Hoagland (The "C" is to make you subconsciously compare him to Arthur C Clarke) is not playing with a full deck.

(And I highly doubt he's working for NASA as a dis-informant or whatever some of you are saying. He just doesn't appear the type)

Does anyone know if guests on C2C get paid?

[LisAlien]

What does Kerry mean with Richard C. Hoagland is not perse a disinfo agent or a liar.

He is not 'per se' ????????????????
Does that mean he is semi, sorta or kinda like a disinfo and/or liar just not totally?

Because surely, if your goal is to defend someone who is being accused of something then I would expect words like: emphatically isn't, or categorically denies or even under no circumstance is this person...... to be used instead.
You don't use an uncommitted cliche like 'per se' if you're denying a claim (in this case, a claim that he is a liar/disinformant)

Ugh.

Kerry is losing it too. I am sure about that as well!

[ndroock1]

Does anyone know if guests on C2C get paid?

C2C say they don't pay their guests. The guests -have to- appear on C2C through contracts with their publishers, i.e. book promotion. And if they are self-publishing then a C2C appearance is a three hour free ad which is priceless. - I think that they do pay their regular advisors like Hoagland and Linda Moulton Howe.

[alienHunter]

New World Order has several contexts...only one of them implies world domination.

[Cartomancer]

This crisis of faith in Hoagland is damaging to the the people who provide us with much of the alternative content that we enjoy. They have put a lot of stock and investment in what he is saying. They have vidoes. He appears in documentaries and conferences. There is a fair amount of money involved. Lately he has damaged their investment of trust and time by making some far out predictions that seem only to serve to cover his previous bad analysis of what is going on. It is like a string of rationalization that goes all the way back to his original assertion that there are structures on Mars. This guy used to work for a major mainstream network as a Public Relations guy. How may P.R. guys to you know that you would trust?

Alternatively the genre of "the strange" has a limited audience and there is a great deal of competition for radio time etc. I have heard one notable online occult researcher lamenting the fact that he was never invited to appear on "Ancient Aliens." This guy is an occult researcher and critic of the occult organizations of America yet he is lamenting the fact that he is not being featured on a show produced by "Prometheus Entertainment." A direct luciferian occult reference. He still wants to be on the show despite knowing this. Criticize the Luciferian but then you want to be on their show. We need to stop and consider what people may say just to make a buck.

[alienHunter]

What does Kerry mean with Richard C. Hoagland is not perse a disinfo agent or a liar.

He is not 'per se' ????????????????
Does that mean he is semi, sorta or kinda like a disinfo and/or liar just not totally?

Because surely, if your goal is to defend someone who is being accused of something then I would expect words like: emphatically isn't, or categorically denies or even under no circumstance is this person...... to be used instead.
You don't use an uncommitted cliche like 'per se' if you're denying a claim (in this case, a claim that he is a liar/disinformant)

Ugh.

Kerry is losing it too. I am sure about that as well!

It could be argued that her field requires a degree of smoke and mirrors to participate.

[onawah]

I think the whole entry from Kerry's blog is worth copying here.
From:
http://projectcamelotproductions.com/blog-hp.html


December 1, 2011
The Truth is Out There : Layers of the Onion and Richard C. Hoagland
Hi all,

I have read the Glen Canady/Michael Vara article on Late Night's Before It's News click here to view and I have to take issue with several of the points made there.

Whereas clearly the writer has good intentions and is trying to 'do the right thing', unfortunately this is a case where the surface incidents and facts do not tell the whole story. Working with whistleblower testimony for nearly six years and having spent 24/7 researching this field I have to say that what comes to light most during this time of transition is how people who are well meaning seem to be misled or lack the skills and experience to delve deeper into the truth of all the things going on around them.

Richard C. Hoagland is not perse a disinfo agent or a liar. He is however playing politics and carefully working to craft his message regarding the truth about NASA in such a way to not only expose the game being played but to do so WITH REGARD TO TIMING which he feels is all important. At the same time, he, like anyone else who discovers the truth about the Matrix, wants to stay alive in the process. Whereas, it is entirely possible he is a Mason, (I do not know this) he is not one of the "bad" ones. I can say in my dealings with him, with multiple conversations in depth about areas of his research, that he is working hard to get the truth out.

What many people who get into this sector don't realize is that every person out there has multiple alliances and that not all alliances agree with each other. Given the incredibly diverse playing field we are dealing in, it is important to also note that anyone out there who stays alive is both protected and on some level dealing with shades of grey. The minute a person starts pointing fingers and looking at the world of multiple dimensions from a perspective of black and white they lose track of the game and what is really going on.

This is where discernment comes in. While I am well aware that Richard holds back data, I am also well aware he does so because he is still collecting substantiation and withholding elements that may seem random or that would change the game and cause him to be derailed, taken off-line and/or killed, if revealed too soon or at the wrong time. Especially if he releases what he knows without regard to the consequences not only for himself but for humanity.

People who call for the truth rarely realize that there is a huge responsibility to releasing it. This is something one who deals in the real stuff... only realizes over time. Every new release of info carries with it a ripple effect on the planet that is far-reaching and not to be taken lightly.

While I do not know the details of Hoagland's interaction with Gary other than what is said in the article linked above, I can say that as someone who has gone deep down the rabbit hole and put my own life in danger multiple times, I can tell you that Gary is someone who would have been targeted by the PTB from the very beginning of his dealings with Richard. This is a no-brainer. And once you realize this, then, what happened to Gary follows a through-line that makes logical sense in this Alice in Wonderland world that the purveyors of MKUtra, mind control and scaler weaponry take full advantage of....

The fact is, that it is entirely likely that the pictures of Mars that Gary is focused on exist and are being kept from the public. Hoagland may even have been told on no uncertain terms not to release them. This doesn't make him a liar. It makes him someone who wants to stay alive (and also by the way someone who wants to keep his loved ones alive).

I do not know what Robin Falkov's role was in this saga... Or if what is said in the article is at all accurate. I do know that in my dealings with Robin, she comes across to me as a very intelligent, caring person who is also putting her life on the line for humanity. Clearly her perspective as a sometime confidante of Gary's wife put her in the middle of this drama but I believe it's very likely the real story is far more complex.

Suffice to say that I have offered Richard and Robin a venue to discuss these accusations in a public forum either on my radio show on American Freedom Radio or on a Livestream event.

A note on the money: many people do not understand what goes on behind the scenes with regard to the money, how people who investigate the Matrix and stay alive, pay the rent and so on. Just recently David Wilcock and Richard Hoagland did a FREE livestream event with me that is still available for free on the Project Camelot Live Channel on Livestream.

People have got to realize that in this quest for the truth there are two major aspects... one is gathering and reporting the data, another is interpreting it!! JUST BECAUSE YOU DON'T AGREE WITH SOMEONE'S CONCLUSIONS OR INTERPRETATION OF THE DATA IS NO REASON TO THROW OUT THE ACTUAL FACTS PRESENTED. Learning to discern, cross-correlate and understand the complexities of right and wrong, who the good guys are etc is an intense discipline and takes years of experience, a level of detachment and discernment that few people are able to master at this time.

For example, both David Wilcock and Richard Hoagland prefer to see Obama as a good guy... They are fighting against all odds and appearances to maintain this perspective but this doesn't make them "liars". What it does indicate is that they are seeing levels of secrecy beyond the obvious. And, they are coming to this conclusion based on what they think they know.

My take on Obama is that as a soul he has a choice, he came in to play the game on the side of the masters (so-called) and in order to stay alive and move through the levels of the game he must appear to be on the dark side. He may in the process have been compromised and joined them. On the other hand he may at some point reveal himself to be on the side of the light by, in some strategic moment coming out with something so devastating he will get himself killed doing it. This is the Kennedy dilemma facing him. Now, all indicators are that he has gone over to the dark side and is completely compromised. However, this game is nothing if not a Hall of Mirrors. So I keep an open mind in regard to all players and all information going forward... watch and listen carefully.

There is no doubt if you follow the White Hat Reports that Obama is taking pay-offs, stealing money and stashing it... but why? This is the question you need to ask. Many White Hats MUST PARADE THEMSELVES AS OF THE DARK in order to complete their mission. So keep this in mind.

Another thing that is going on here is WISHFUL THINKING... many people including Hoagland, Wilcock and many others want to see the LIGHT SIDE win... we all do. But wanting something and seeing it happen are two different things. However, this desire can color the way you interpret the current goings on here on Planet Earth moving rapidly front and center into 4D. There is a level at which the fact is that the LIGHT WILL WIN in the end... however that may be a long time from now. So when you hear someone talk and relay info it's important to understand what they WANT and weigh it against what they say they KNOW. Because distortion is the name of the game here.

This is what I suggest. Start to realize that players in this game are playing on multiple levels. You cannot look at simply surface data and think you have the whole story. At this time, more than any other those who seem to be working to benefit Humanity are often just as easily using that as a cover, just as those who may seem to be working against you are using the dark as a camouflage in order to stay alive and complete their mission on your behalf.

Lastly, with regard to Elenin and YU55: all the Camelot whistleblower info with regard to both these so called asteroids is that they are and were CONTROLLED by someone. That means they are able to change course etc. The entire group of contacts Hoagland was dealing with---with regard to YU55 went black right after it was supposedly crossing our atmosphere. At the same time, Obama and the whole APEC conference was going on in Hawaii... Simultaneously, Hoagland's sources were seeing a SUBSTITUTION in the skies... with a metallic overlay, going along the original NASA trajectory. We were live on Livestream when this was happening. This is what his sources told him they were getting... All info on YU55 went black and then, a substitution appeared. According to Hoagland it wasn't even a good decoy... It was as if, those who are running YU55 wanted the scientists and white hats who were tracking it to KNOW they were being lied to... Where did the real craft go? Did it rendezvous with one of ours? Was there something on board being dropped off? All these are good questions but where are you going to get the answers? Listening to channelers who are as easily programmed as anyone else is not the answer.

Of course Hoagland looks like he's wrong if the people behind the scenes can change the game at any moment! And that goes for a lot of good people right now making bad predictions. Hoagland is following the clues and doing so meticulously and at great personal risk. He is not a NWO shill. There are a lot easier ways to kiss the ass of those in charge.

You can focus on tearing down other people because you see discrepancies in their logic, conclusions or behavior but I suggest keeping your eyes on the ball. No one has the whole story. And the fight to discover the real truth of what's going on and get it out to the people continues. They are waking up. And so are you. But in the end, you have to learn to see the layers within the layers. It's all cloak and dagger, yin and yang, light and dark. But in this game, especially at this level, the dark masquerades as the light and the light as the dark. Learn discernment and pay attention to what resonates. Because what resonates with your heart and spirit is where the truth is.. .not in superficial details that don't add up or painting a logic trail with a broad brush saying this is black and this is white.

Above all, as Hoagland has said again and again, 'the lie is different at every level'. This is what a source said to him and it's very very true. Especially when it comes to what the public is told. They are lied to every which way to Sunday and beyond. Nothing is as you see it. It's all maya and illusion. But within that, the truth is out there. And in all of us.

Best wishes,

Kerry / Project Camelot

Personally, I think that any whistleblower deserves a WHOLE lot of respect and appreciation from those of us who are not risking our lives, health, sanity, career, the safety of our friends and loved ones, and/or dealing with the other kinds of pressures that the likes of Kerry, Hoagland, Wilcock, etc. are dealing with.
They all know people who have been "disappeared", tortured, killed, had their lives ruined in all sorts of ways for telling what they knew.
It's easy to criticize, but a more realistic view comes from imagining walking in another's shoes for awhile.
I have been critical at times too, because face it, most of us would be clueless except for these kinds of people; so much depends on them, and so it's really important that they get it right.
But they are only human beings, just like the rest of us, and those kinds of pressures must be extremely taxing.
It's not something I signed up for, and for good reason.
I doubt I'd have the courage.

[Cartomancer]

Interesting. Ms. Cassidy seems to be kind of sitting on the fence here. It's as if she can't decide if he is legit either. That's just what I got out of what she said. Hopefully Hoagland will appear on her show and try to straighten all of this out and clearly state his theories and thoughts.

[ndroock1]

...
It is like a string of rationalization that goes all the way back to his original assertion that there are structures on Mars.
...


Hoagland's star rose to world fame when he announced his 'face on Mars'-theory. His fame did not last long. It turned out the face was an optical illusion in some low res pics only. It is the cross Hoagland had to bear all his life. He would do anything to prove he was right after alll. - Besides that Hoagland delivers spectaculair science FACTion. He certainly can think -out of the box- and he is what he says he is: the head of "Enterprise Mission Research."

Where Hoagland is a bona fide independent researcher and SFAction author, David Icke is outright dangerous. When Icke declared himself the son of God on the BBC he instantly became Britain's national fruitcake, the craziest person on The Planet. David Icke hates everybody for not believing that he is a God. He despises his audience for believing his lies, i.e. shape-shifting politicians, but rejecting the truth that he is a God. - A deeply disturbed human being indeed.

[New Dawn]

No he did not say sorry, he said sorry you feel that way, what part of that don't you understand? and there is no need for you to barge in and start insulting people either. I'm not the one who is not letting it go, all I do is answer the posts of people like you who have just got to have your say on it, as far as I am concerned it was over yesterday, but as long as people keep bringing it up I will keep answering the posts because I will not have the friends of Sid try and make me out to be the one at fault, I didn't call anyone names, all I have done is ask that no one calls me names, and as for your childish remark about attention, well it doesn't even deserve to be addressed. Can you not see that if you had said nothing, nor would anyone else duhh!

Fair enough - didn't mean to offend, but reading through it it seemed to me (in my opinion) that you were creating something out of nothing...

[Eric J (Viking)]

Richard Hoagland - Engines in the Moon - C2CAM - 2012.01.03 ??


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XlhBsKLY2as

viking

[childs hood end]

i wonder if its a petrol engine,,,,,,,,, do you think a 250cc 2 stroke would drive the moon,,,,,,,,,,

The A`s in coast to coast looks like an 11` the twin towers` or an obelisk,,

[mojo]

Hoagland is speaking of 2 new spacecraft put in orbit around the moon, I wonder how this fits in with the supposed warning not to go back? Maybe orbiting is not considered being back? Looking forward to hearing the whole program.

[jaybee]

.


Thanks for sharing that Viking....:thumb:

I love Richard Hoagland and everytime he mentions 2012 it gives me a buzzzzz.

He's not afraid to go way way outside the box, but using data and his fine mind to

process said data.







i wonder if its a petrol engine,,,,,,,,, do you think a 250cc 2 stroke would drive the moon,,,,,,,,,,

The A`s in coast to coast looks like an 11` the twin towers` or an obelisk,,

very amusing...no, really it made me L O L (boon?....C H E, I'm getting the same vibe off you as someone on another forum):eyebrows:.....just saying

[kersley]

;)
i wonder if its a petrol engine,,,,,,,,, do you think a 250cc 2 stroke would drive the moon,,,,,,,,,,

The A`s in coast to coast looks like an 11` the twin towers` or an obelisk,,

I would think it would, But just for that extra power when you need it, i'll stick in a V6

[jaybee]

I never did buy the...the moon's a chunk of earth that 'came off'.

I have thought that revealing info about ancient structures on the moon (and/or Mars) would be a good way to kick off Official Disclosure (if that day ever comes)

Imagine if sometime during 2012 ....dramatic World News......' Moon - could be artificial - maybe an ancient Spacecraft of some kind'

THAT would certainly shift a few paradigms and get consciousness raising going through the roof !!!!!

Just pondering...:biggrin:

[ghostrider]

Richard Hoagland - Engines in the Moon - C2CAM - 2012.01.03 ??


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XlhBsKLY2as

viking

he knew this years ago, he's been hiding alot. ego has him in it's grasp. he knows more but is spoon feeding the masses to keep himself feeling important.

[jaybee]

he knew this years ago, he's been hiding alot. ego has him in it's grasp. he knows more but is spoon feeding the masses to keep himself feeling important.


and I expect YOU feel very important saying that....how cheaply words come..:hand:

and what a well thought out, fine critique...sorry I mean slagging off...of the man..

[/sarcasm]


:dirol:

[childs hood end]

i wonder if its a petrol engine,,,,,,,,, do you think a 250cc 2 stroke would drive the moon,,,,,,,,,,

The A`s in coast to coast looks like an 11` the twin towers` or an obelisk,,

very amusing...no, really it made me L O L (boon?....C H E, I'm getting the same vibe off you as someone on another forum):eyebrows:.....just saying[/QUOTE]

No not me sory,,,,, this is the only place i say grace,,,,,,,,,,,:amen:


Kersley;;;
I would think it would, But just for that extra power when you need it, i'll stick in a V6

think you might need a V twin 6 million cylinder twin turbo meteor on 21`s:crazy_pilot:

[RMorgan]

Hahahaha! Mr. Hoagland is always surprising me! He surely is a very creative guy.

Cheers,

Raf.

[jackovesk]

Hahahaha! Mr. Hoagland is always surprising me! He surely is a very creative guy.

Cheers,

Raf.

LMAO Raf.

What a nice way of putting it...

:pound:

[Cartomancer]

I think the Moon has a HEMI 318 MOPAR w/ dual four barrel carbs and 12:4 rear end dual exhaust and little fuzzy dice hanging from the rear view.

[Setras]

the size and power are irrelevent when you can change gravitational constants..... once it weighs less than a single atom you could probably flick it back to whence it came.....

p.s. don't tell Jay Leno it has an engine....... He'll park it in his garage and none of the rest of us will ever see it again

[Eric J (Viking)]

Couldn't find whether this was posted ... anyway>>>>>

Hoagland...US and the Russians and the Chinese are being 'forced' into disclosure..

Coast to Coast am Richard C. Hoagland

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V4Lly1dM6TY&feature=endscreen&NR=1


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V4Lly1dM6TY&feature=endscreen&NR=1

viking

[FutureHumanDestiny]

wow thanks for posting!

i've had dreams about this video and now it's here!

[jackovesk]

Next..!.........

[Earth Draco]

:( Alas, I can not view. Not Available in my country.

Could somebody give the lowdown on whats in it. All I can see the U.S.S Enterprise thumbnail on the vid.

Thanks

[Cidersomerset]

Thanks Viking Epsalom Bootes ......That rang a bell thats where Bob Nevritt said the Booteans came from' the spiritual beings that created us
millions of years ago, according to illuminati family documents he read copies of in his 1999 ufo conference presentation.....

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38078-Regina-Meredith-interviews-...Bob-Dobbs-former-head-of-secret-council-of-10-and-more.

Ihttp://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38794-Bob-Nevritt-on-Eben-Ray-22nd-Dec-2011

I enjoy listening to Richard as long as you remember a lot of what he says, as he admits is speculation.......

update on Phoebus grunt.....24th jan 2012 Russia to investigate Phoebo Grunt crash...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/space/9020369/Russia-investigates-theory-US-radars-caused-probe-crash.html

Smoke and mirrors as usual....steve

[truth4me]

good and interesting video ........Hoagland---I want to believe....

[Cidersomerset]

Richard Hoagland back on coast two hours of comment and speculation
and a few of his usual predictions....Whether you like him or not,hes always
a entertaining listen, and plenty of moon ,mars and space discussion.....



http://www.youtube.com/user/MrSuperpotatotomato#p/c/7F21B2A8CE6688B4


http://www.youtube.com/user/MrSuperpotatotomato#p/c/7F21B2A8CE6688B4/1/7R1hvfLTVG4

Cheers steve...

http://scottcwaring.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/1bd0227a-164d-45de-b4a1-5943c1d10923114.jpg

http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/images/msl/20100916/PIA09201-640.jpg

http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.cfm?release=2010-302

Richard and George talk about all sorts of things and Richard speculates the
reason curiosity is nuclear powered, is so it will be able to explore inside the
ruins of the cities on Mars....

[Cidersomerset]

Hoagland also reveals that he predicts the government will announce that an ancient civilisation has been found on Mars this year
and that is one of the reasons curiosity has been sent ahead to explore them and that is part of the apocolyptic climax of 2012
disclosure to galvanise fresh space exploration on our doorstep...

'Apocalypse' does not mean destruction,disaster etc....it means Hidden ,enlightenment !!

'Lifting the veil or revelation, is a disclosure of something hidden from the majority of mankind in an era dominated by falsehood and misconception'


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apocalypse

Why is it everytime I hear the word Apocalypse I think something unpleasant is going to happen ? when in fact it could be the opposite !!!

The landing destination of Curiosity....Gale crater

http://images.brisbanetimes.com.au/2011/11/27/2800599/art-mars3-420x0.jpg

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/world/nasas-curiosity-with-mars-blasts-into-a-
new-phase-20111127-1o0xf.html

http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/~pppf6/Research/History/CydoniaAvebury/moc2_msss_labels.gif

http://www.disclose.tv/forum/secret-space-t37921.html

[frances]

Do you know when curiosity will be on mars ?. Do you know if spirit and rover are still moving around mars and sending back photos ?. Do you know if beagle will ever be found ?. Thank you Frances.

[Cidersomerset]

Do you know when curiosity will be on mars ?. Do you know if spirit and rover are still moving around mars and sending back photos ?. Do you know if beagle will ever be found ?. Thank you Frances.


Hi Frances Hoagland said in the interview one of the two rovers is still working they are both powered by solar panels,
which would not work inside a large covered city and is why Richard said curiosity being nuclear powered would not
have that problem, and would also be able to travel the long distance to cydonia from Gale crater.....

Its due to arrive at Mars on August 5th 2012..

2BIos8KzFMU

BudlaGh1A0o

[Cidersomerset]

This is the Frasier Show Richard is talking about.....18 minutes in...John Glenn does his cameo..
could be intepreted either way ? but still very odd !!.......

Bj8sBOxx22E

[Cidersomerset]

Just relistening to part of it, and he is suggesting the dome like hill in Gale crater maybe a collapsed ancient city !! The Crater is 96 miles wide..
He mentions a photo which I cannot find , with more details than the one here ??...

http://www.dailygalaxy.com/.a/6a00d8341bf7f753ef015393524408970b-500wi

xBVlC7VctMs

Richard says he posted geomatry of the walls,partitions of what looked like archeology
of a vast martian complex ??

Would be nice to look at what he is !!

[frances]

Loved the NASA video I hope it all goes 100 percent perfect. I am going to try to listen to coast to coast tonight. Frances.

[Mulder]

2.27min on 2nd hour. Richard says UFO-ology is a "tar-baby" or never ending spiral - as we are always dependent on NASA & the Govt to tell us the truth - that aliens exist - but they will always lie!
Tony a caller asked 2.33 min on 2nd hour if the Garden of Eden was on Mars - Richard didn't know.

[Cidersomerset]

Yes as George and Richard acknowledged there is a school of thought that Mars could have been the Garden of Eden as it has been speculated that
life may have started there and was transfered to earth eons ago and we may infact be Martian....One of many theories....

http://www.ufodigest.com/images/mars_surface.jpg

http://www.ufodigest.com/marshome.html

[Cidersomerset]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_YQoI-WNO8eo/TJ86guDD4gI/AAAAAAAAVyA/wRIUonsfQNM/s1600/8.jpg

http://globalrumblings.blogspot.com/2010/09/sunday-september-26-2010-where-will.html


3fLwfj-kmIM

[Cidersomerset]

Richard seems to think this is a massive dome with archeology inside !!!

Althouth there appears to be a hole or shadow on top ???

http://marsstore.blob.core.windows.net/exploremars/0bbc4f02-6641-471e-809b-782093ff3654.JPG

http://exploremars.jpl.nasa.gov/GaleCrater/Print/Default.aspx?rsid=137

[marielle]

Speaking of a mission to Mars, check this out:

http://manoa.hawaii.edu/hi-seas/

Anyone going to apply?

[Cidersomerset]

Thanks Marielle Richard mentions it in the show....I don't qualify..LOL..

Crew Selection
We are seeking participants for this study with qualifications similar to those required by NASA for their astronaut applicants, as follows:

Required:

Bachelor’s degree from an accredited institution, in engineering, biological or physical sciences, mathematics, or computer science.
Professional experience (including graduate school) of at least three years beyond the bachelor’s degree
Ability to pass a class 2 flight physical examination
No history of upper airway surgery, rhinoplasty, chronic rhinitis or chronic sinusitis
No other medical or psychological condition that would preclude participation in this study
Willingness and ability to eat a wide range of foods
Normal sense of taste and smell
Tobacco-free for at least 24 months
Demonstrated ability to conduct field research
Strong interest in human space exploration
Fluency in verbal and written English
Availability and willingness to take time to participate in the workshop and the two analogue missions

Desirable:

Experience in a complex operational system, e.g. submarine, ambulance, airplane cockpit, control room
Background in medicine or nursing at the “first responder” level or higher
Ability to lift 15 kg and to cover 100 m on foot in 40 seconds or less
Experience in construction, electronics, or home repair
Body mass index between 19 and 25.
Not pregnant or lactating during 2012 and 2013
Household cooking experience
Valid driver’s license
Age between 21 and 65

[frances]

I bet there will be lots of applications, research is valuable, and Mars well I hope I get to see a man or woman mission to the red planet. Frances.

[jaybee]

Hoagland also reveals that he predicts the government will announce that an ancient civilisation has been found on Mars this year
and that is one of the reasons curiosity has been sent ahead to explore them and that is part of the apocolyptic climax of 2012
disclosure to galvanise fresh space exploration on our doorstep...

'Apocalypse' does not mean destruction,disaster etc....it means Hidden ,enlightenment !!

'Lifting the veil or revelation, is a disclosure of something hidden from the majority of mankind in an era dominated by falsehood and misconception'


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apocalypse

Why is it everytime I hear the word Apocalypse I think something unpleasant is going to happen ? when in fact it could be the opposite !!!

The landing destination of Curiosity....Gale crater

http://images.brisbanetimes.com.au/2011/11/27/2800599/art-mars3-420x0.jpg




Thanks for the thread Cidersomerset and all the images etc that you have posted to go with it!


I enjoyed the Hoagland interview. He is never jaded and is always enthusiastic about his research and speculation.

cheers


.

[jaybee]

This is the Frasier Show Richard is talking about.....18 minutes in...John Glenn does his cameo..
could be intepreted either way ? but still very odd !!.......

Bj8sBOxx22E


yes it was very odd....I liked the bit in the C2C interview about the different astronauts trying to 'tell us something' in their own way. Even Armstrong.

[Cidersomerset]

UFO's or 'Space critters' the Astronauts have dropped hints over the years...

kZ94MU5W_Q0

[Cartomancer]

Last night I listened to Richard Hoagland try and defend his views on Comet Elenin. I have never heard someone backpedal from their views in such a way. My interpretation of what he said about Elenin was that it was a constructed craft of some kind and that it was going to hit the earth. When a caller confronted him with these facts he tried to minimize and deny what he had said. What is all of your interpretation of what he was saying during the "Elenin hysteria?" If you listen to the show you will hear him do everything he can to change the subject and he did not answer any of his critics directly. Is Richard Hoagland simply a P.R. mouthpiece or is he a legitimate researcher? What do you think?

[RMorgan]

Hi my friend,

Well, for me, Hoagland is done.

Either he´s deliberately lying for any reason, or he´s a damn arrogant "researcher" who isn´t man enough to admit he was wrong.

Cheers,

Raf.

[Daft Ada]

I heard it too and totally agree with you mate, and then when the guy said how can we believe anything else you say when you make claims and then deny saying it, he was quite rude and basically said no one is forcing you to listen, why are you here? He got quite nasty as is his normal response to that kind of question, George Noorey then jumped in and said now hold on Richard, the guy has a point, so he backed off a bit, but as you say changed the subject and wheedled out of it.
I don't expect the man to be correct about everything he says, but maybe if he didn't make such wild claims to sell tickets to the conferences he wouldn't be in this situation.

[Cartomancer]

I heard it too and totally agree with you mate, and then when the guy said how can we believe anything else you say when you make claims and then deny saying it, he was quite rude and basically said no one is forcing you to listen, why are you here? He got quite nasty as is his normal response to that kind of question, George Noorey then jumped in and said now hold on Richard, the guy has a point, so he backed off a bit, but as you say changed the subject and wheedled out of it.
I don't expect the man to be correct about everything he says, but maybe if he didn't make such wild claims to sell tickets to the conferences he wouldn't be in this situation.

I agree with you. It's O.k. to state what you think but to present it in a quasi-truthful way while at the same time ridiculing others for creating "fear porn" is a little over the top. He has taken a beating over this Elenin thing. I think he should go back and listen to the shows he did and at least say he made a mistake. I'm sure he is human and gets excited about things so that's understandable. Maybe he should be more careful about who he is listening to. It also bothers me that he is a trained media personality who has now morphed into some sort of "expert."

[frances]

I think he made fools out of a lot of people, people who were quite public about their belief in his words. Words that now come back to haunt him. Frances.

[Cartomancer]

I think he made fools out of a lot of people, people who were quite public about their belief in his words. Words that now come back to haunt him. Frances.

Sadly I think we may be seeing the same concept at work with the whole Fulford Wilcock thing. Notice how there are no hard facts to back up what they have been saying either but people are eating it up with a knife and fork.

[RMorgan]

Hi again guys,

Well, IF he´s indeed a researcher and not a charlatan, he might have fallen into the same trap that other researchers (from several fields) did in the past, which is called obsession.

Whenever a researcher gets obsessive with his research, he becomes biased and incapable of achieving realistic/reliable results.

I bet that, if a psychologist did a Rorschach test with him, all he would see is extraterrestrial faces, intergalactic motherships, and this kind of things.

Of course, when a man is obsessive, he doesn´t listen to anyone but himself and becomes very arrogant.

Cheers,

Raf.

[The Arthen]

Jay Weidner probably had a much more accurate take on the contrast anomalies of "glass formations" Hoagland pointed out on the moon.

Turned out it's the friggin 3M screen used for projection work back in the 70s.

The first 2 Superman films also used the exact same techniques of front-screen projection at Pinewood Studios, England.

[jsb_swampfox]

My personal view is that Hoagland and many others are being fed dis info, It could be some kind of test by the controlling powers, to test their ability to infiltrate the alternative community with, "their own". I think he was duped with info that "they" wanted to put out for one reason or another. I do believe he should have used a lot more discernment when putting out the crazy things he said about the whole "Elenin" fiasco...

[The Arthen]

I mean, even though I know Hoagie boy was wrong on the "glass formations" - this still shouldn't be a deterant on the issue of anomaly objects found on the surface of the moon.

I can see why beginner conspiracy researchers find this frustrating!

Imagine if they first started their Moon-related research from HOAGIE.
That's bound to **** up their first impressions of such "conspiracies".

I still say there are objects on the moon, but definitely not "spectacular glass formations"!

[RMorgan]

My personal view is that Hoagland and many others are being fed dis info, It could be some kind of test by the controlling powers, to test their ability to infiltrate the alternative community with, "their own". I think he was duped with info that "they" wanted to put out for one reason or another. I do believe he should have used a lot more discernment when putting out the crazy things he said about the whole "Elenin" fiasco...

Well, I don´t fully agree with that.

Thinking that the so called "elite" is feeding disinfo to those guys is just exempting them from their responsibilities. Everyone is responsible for what they say or do.

You shouldn´t doubt about the incredible ability that some people have to screw things up all by themselves.

Anyway, if someone, hypothetically, feeds Hoagland (or any of those guys) with lies and he believes them, it´s his fault, not anyone else´s fault.

Cheers,

Raf.

[jagman]

Cartomancer, IMO Hoagland is a hard one to figure out. He sprinkles truth with deception. Why? I'm not sure. Could he still be working
for the government ? Possibly. I know people who know Richard personally and they have told me Richard has a huge ego. I also think
George Noory has had his fill of Richards nonsense. A few months back I called Coast when Richard was on. My question was highly critical
of Richard and his predictions. They could not get to my question that night because of time restraints and another guest but George told me
call the next show. ( He told me he thinks Richard should answer his critics) I called the next show but that was the night Georges dad passed
away so i decided not to ask a confrontational question that night. Richard is extremely smart guy. So when it comes to deflecting a question
he does not want to answer, It's simply child's play..

[jsb_swampfox]

I agree Raf, I know some of these "Insiders" get quite full of themselves, and tend to exaggerate (hoagland is great at this). And this could be the case here. Hoagland got his info from someone, he is always bragging on his insider contacts. That is why I come to that conclusion. But he could have made it all up on his own too. I am just throwing out other possible scenario's. I don't believe Hoagland is a total farce, Of course, he has pretty much ruined his credibility.




My personal view is that Hoagland and many others are being fed dis info, It could be some kind of test by the controlling powers, to test their ability to infiltrate the alternative community with, "their own". I think he was duped with info that "they" wanted to put out for one reason or another. I do believe he should have used a lot more discernment when putting out the crazy things he said about the whole "Elenin" fiasco...

Well, I don´t fully agree with that.

Thinking that the so called "elite" is feeding disinfo to those guys is just exempting them from their responsibilities. Everyone is responsible for what they say or do.

You shouldn´t doubt about the incredible ability that some people have to screw things up all by themselves.

Anyway, if someone, hypothetically, feeds Hoagland (or any of those guys) with lies and he believes them, it´s his fault, not anyone else´s fault.

Cheers,

Raf.

[DeBron]

I think he made fools out of a lot of people, people who were quite public about their belief in his words. Words that now come back to haunt him. Frances.

Sadly I think we may be seeing the same concept at work with the whole Fulford Wilcock thing. Notice how there are no hard facts to back up what they have been saying either but people are eating it up with a knife and fork.

Probably eating it with a spoon, because cutting it up would cause one to look at it more closely, possibly altering the desire to ingest it.

[RMorgan]

I think he made fools out of a lot of people, people who were quite public about their belief in his words. Words that now come back to haunt him. Frances.

Sadly I think we may be seeing the same concept at work with the whole Fulford Wilcock thing. Notice how there are no hard facts to back up what they have been saying either but people are eating it up with a knife and fork.

Probably eating it with a spoon, because cutting it up would cause one to look at it more closely, possibly altering the desire to ingest it.

Yeah...Do you know when, in Hollywood, producers explore the same theme over and over again, when they find a theme that makes them a lot of money?

It´s the same thing with this predictions/conspiracies scenario. These guys have found the recipe for "success", which is, basically, the craziest the better.

So, they mix secret societies, solar/planetary cycles, rogue planets, extra-terrestrials of several kinds, insiders/whistleblowers, satanism, apocalyptic threats, super-soldiers and (you name it).

Mix all these things, put them in a very poorly written script, spread it all over the web, the get all "researchers" to support each other and booooom, you´ve got a successful conspiracy.

We must remember that the alternative media brainwashes people as well, so don´t trust something simply because it´s "alternative", because it might not be so alternative as you think. In fact, a big part of the alternative media and its main characters use the same strategies of the so called "mainstream media" to increase viewership.

Cheers,

Raf.

[STATIC]

Hoagland was obviously reaching with the elenin situation cause he is constantly stuck in a startrek episode.
However the man has brought more than a few interesting thoughts to my mind, so I'l always lend him my ear.
The truth is the Galaxy that we live in is much more wonderous than our current paradigm of thought is allowing us to except as "Fact".
Considering how narrow our perception of the universe is I don't even know why we place so much value on these "Facts".
I mean really. Every time we think we got it figured out the next dreamer comes along and shatters our paradigm.
So I take Hoagy for what he is. A dreamer, and that's ok in my book.

buqtdpuZxvk

[Operator]

I mean, even though I know Hoagie boy was wrong on the "glass formations" - this still shouldn't be a deterant on the issue of anomaly objects found on the surface of the moon.

I can see why beginner conspiracy researchers find this frustrating!

Imagine if they first started their Moon-related research from HOAGIE.
That's bound to **** up their first impressions of such "conspiracies".

I still say there are objects on the moon, but definitely not "spectacular glass formations"!

Yes, 'glass' domes are becoming more and more a blatant mistake now on Hoagland's part. However I think he will need
to back pedal a whole lot more. When I listen to John Lear, I have to agree, the original Apollo story is hard to believe and
most likely not true either. For me it's becoming very obvious ... for an insider like Hoagland it should have been obvious
from the start. It leads me to believe that he's controlled opposition.

[CD7]

Alot of predictor's are pretty quiet this year....:rolleyes:....in the year of such excitement!? u would think these peeps couldnt be kept off the prediction wagon airwaysa little too close to december..i presumeeeeeee ;)

[13th Warrior]

It's been my experience that it's other people who have been over exaggerating what Richard Hoagland has been stating; his speculations on possibilities have been morphed into stated truths.

[CD7]

LOL....who can predict ****e! My last post messed up so bad..i fixed it and alas it shows the color=red <----------not my intention, make of it what u will :whistle:

[Cartomancer]

It's been my experience that it's other people who have been over exaggerating what Richard Hoagland has been stating; his speculations on possibilities have been morphed into stated truths.

Here's Hoagland saying that the asteroid and Elenin are constructed objects. He is not inferring or theorizing that they are machines he is coming right out and saying it. Listen at about 25:20. If what you are saying is true he needs to be more careful about saying this is his opinion. He is being fed a raft from someone and then goes out and spews it all as if it were true.

V4Lly1dM6TY

Here's a composite pic of YU55. See any structures here?

15281

[13th Warrior]

It's been my experience that it's other people who have been over exaggerating what Richard Hoagland has been stating; his speculations on possibilities have been morphed into stated truths.

Here's Hoagland saying that the asteroid and Elenin are constructed objects. He is not inferring or theorizing that they are machines he is coming right out and saying it. Listen at about 25:20. If what you are saying is true he needs to be more careful about saying this is his opinion. He is being fed a raft from someone and then goes out and spews it all as if it were true.

V4Lly1dM6TY

Here's a composite pic of YU55. See any structures here?

15281


How carefully did you listen to the first 6 minutes of the show you posted?

[Cartomancer]

It does not matter what he said during the first six minutes of the show. All's he is saying is the some "brave men and women" supplied him with this information and then infers that he didn't mean to stretch the truth. He blames it on the listeners for misinterpreting what he said. He even qualifies it by stating that George even has trouble with some of the things he says.

He later presented material like it was true without qualifying whether it was factual or not. I listen to lots of alternative information on the radio and internet. This guy does nothing but promote "fear porn" while criticizing others who do the same thing. Even the host of the show is starting to question this guy. If you want to believe this I support you and even think it gives more credibility that someone like you is defending him. I write my own books and make videos with plenty of material people do not believe. I am always careful to point out that it is just a theory but may be possible; and not just at the start of the interview.

This guy is a trained P.R. and media consultant/personality. He clearly states that his "sources" "briefed" him on this material. He is being led down the garden path by someone who knows what they are doing and he is eating it up with a fork and knife. Sorry if you are offended or believe what Hoagland is saying but I just do not. Can you please list all of his theories that were later proven correct? What has he ever said that could not be considered "fear porn?" He had half of the forum here convinced that a large object was going to hit the earth. You don't see anything wrong with that? Even Bill chimed in with some rumor he heard at the airport.

[13th Warrior]

It does not matter what he said during the first six minutes of the show. All's he is saying is the some "brave men and women" supplied him with this information and then infers that he didn't mean to stretch the truth. He blames it on the listeners for misinterpreting what he said. He even qualifies it by stating that George even has trouble with some of the things he says.

He later presented material like it was true without qualifying whether it was factual or not. I listen to lots of alternative information on the radio and internet. This guy does nothing but promote "fear porn" while criticizing others who do the same thing. Even the host of the show is starting to question this guy. If you want to believe this I support you and even think it gives more credibility that someone like you is defending him. I write my own books and make videos with plenty of material people do not believe. I am always careful to point out that it is just a theory but may be possible; and not just at the start of the interview.

This guy is a trained P.R. and media consultant/personality. He clearly states that his "sources" "briefed" him on this material. He is being led down the garden path by someone who knows what they are doing and he is eating it up with a fork and knife. Sorry if you are offended or believe what Hoagland is saying but I just do not. Can you please list all of his theories that were later proven correct? What has he ever said that could not be considered "fear porn?" He had half of the forum here convinced that a large object was going to hit the earth. You don't see anything wrong with that? Even Bill chimed in with some rumor he heard at the airport.


All i'm going to say is that you continue to prove my point...

[Cartomancer]

It does not matter what he said during the first six minutes of the show. All's he is saying is the some "brave men and women" supplied him with this information and then infers that he didn't mean to stretch the truth. He blames it on the listeners for misinterpreting what he said. He even qualifies it by stating that George even has trouble with some of the things he says.

He later presented material like it was true without qualifying whether it was factual or not. I listen to lots of alternative information on the radio and internet. This guy does nothing but promote "fear porn" while criticizing others who do the same thing. Even the host of the show is starting to question this guy. If you want to believe this I support you and even think it gives more credibility that someone like you is defending him. I write my own books and make videos with plenty of material people do not believe. I am always careful to point out that it is just a theory but may be possible; and not just at the start of the interview.

This guy is a trained P.R. and media consultant/personality. He clearly states that his "sources" "briefed" him on this material. He is being led down the garden path by someone who knows what they are doing and he is eating it up with a fork and knife. Sorry if you are offended or believe what Hoagland is saying but I just do not. Can you please list all of his theories that were later proven correct? What has he ever said that could not be considered "fear porn?" He had half of the forum here convinced that a large object was going to hit the earth. You don't see anything wrong with that? Even Bill chimed in with some rumor he heard at the airport.


All i'm going to say is that you continue to prove my point...

Whatever. What point?? Is this the best you can do to defend your point of view? Where are the proven facts that I asked for? Can you state that anything at all that he has said can be proven as a fact? It's just theories based on B.S. Believe it if you want to. Maybe next we can debate the legitimacy of the Wilcock/Fulford circus as if it were true as well.

[13th Warrior]

It's just theories

Maybe you should re-read my original post?

[Cartomancer]

It's just theories

Maybe you should re-read my original post?

Ah. Another one line reply. "All i'm going to say is that you continue to prove my point... "

[Debra]

Hi Raf,

Who would you say that you trust in the alternative media community? And in the research field?

I think your suggestion about mixing it all up to make research juicier and more of a commodity is not a long stretch. Although, I don´t think we can taint all researchers with this same brush.

I think Wilcock is fairly rigorous as a researcher, he comes from a research field and knows that juicing it up eventually dries up if evidence is swinging tenuously. Richard Dolan as well, is an intrepid investigator.

In the alternative media, someone like Randy Maugans, I think is an exemplar of deep thinking, careful analysis, dot connecting and evaluation.
Henrik Palmgren as well at Redice Creations. I actually trust the process of his research in questioning and presenting evidence, which he brings through in his interviews. He, like Maugans, I think gives us a place setting to make up our own minds.

What more do you think on this Raf?






Yeah...Do you know when, in Hollywood, producers explore the same theme over and over again, when they find a theme that makes them a lot of money?

It´s the same thing with this predictions/conspiracies scenario. These guys have found the recipe for "success", which is, basically, the craziest the better.

So, they mix secret societies, solar/planetary cycles, rogue planets, extra-terrestrials of several kinds, insiders/whistleblowers, satanism, apocalyptic threats, super-soldiers and (you name it).

Mix all these things, put them in a very poorly written script, spread it all over the web, the get all "researchers" to support each other and booooom, you´ve got a successful conspiracy.

We must remember that the alternative media brainwashes people as well, so don´t trust something simply because it´s "alternative", because it might not be so alternative as you think. In fact, a big part of the alternative media and its main characters use the same strategies of the so called "mainstream media" to increase viewership.

Cheers,

Raf.

[Cilka]

I truly believe that people like Hoagland, Wilcock or Kavassilas, actually do receive information from the ET's which they, as the employees working for ET employers, are programmed to use to misinform the human species. They truly seriously believe what they are being told and the rest of us go along believing in their preaching of bullsh ..t. Ok, we are all guilty of being swayed by charming and intellectual and highly educated individuals, however, as long as we come to our senses soon enough then we are going to be doing just great no matter what situation we find outselves in. It's just another lesson that we, the human species, needed or need to learn, that's all. So, when another charming expert full of incredible vocabulary comes along and starts telling us of a different doomsday scenario, well guess what will happen, this time we will listen attentively and we will be prepared to respond objectively, and hopefully we wont waste any of our precious time.

[RMorgan]

Hi Zebra, how are you?

Well, to be honest I don´t really fully trust anyone that´s in any kind of media, alternative or not.

I try not to be too paranoid about it, but I don´t think we would even have the internet if TPTB didn´t want us to have it. They´re the ones who have money, who own every major internet/telecom companies and probably the whole internet infrastructure.

Trusting is a strong word for me. I trust people who I know personally, with whom I´m emotionally connected, who have experienced life by my side.

So, allow me to change your question to who I consider a legitimate source of information, right?

For me, for any source of information/researcher to be considered legitimate, I must have access to the research data as a whole, including all sources and bibliography.

It´s pretty easy to someone to come up with any fictional idea and invent a supposedly secret source to back it up. Anyone can do that. This kind of excuse doesn´t work in real life situations.

Imagine if an engineer came up with a project for a huge bridge and, when questioned about his calculations, he says that he can´t reveal them because they are secret!

Imagine if a judge asks a lawyer to show an important defense proof and the lawyer says he can´t show it, because it comes from a secret source, asking the judge to consider his word as a proof!

Imagine if a surgeon invents a new surgical technique and says it´s the most effective ever, but he can´t demonstrate it because it´s a secret.

Well...I think you´ve got it. If this strategy doesn´t work in any field, it shouldn´t work in the alternative research field as well.

Basically, I don´t consider a source of information to be reliable, in the alternative field, when people start claiming this or that, specially when they start to make predictions. People make bold claims these days, without zero realistic data to back it up.

For me, the good researchers usually are terrific detectives, who can examine several clues and possibilities, from an unbiased point of view. These guys don´t claim anything, they usually say that this or that might be possible, which are totally different things.

For the above reasons, I don´t appreciate Wilcock´s work. He researches a lot, but researching a lot doesn´t make him right. His sources are always obscure and mysterious...

I tend to appreciate Randy Maugans and Henrik Palmgren a little bit more indeed, but I think they´re still biased in their analyzes.

Biased persons can´t ever have a clear view over any situation.

Cheers,

Raf.



Hi Raf,

Who would you say that you trust in the alternative media community? And in the research field?

I think your suggestion about mixing it all up to make research juicier and more of a commodity is not a long stretch. Although, I don´t think we can taint all researchers with this same brush.

I think Wilcock is fairly rigorous as a researcher, he comes from a research field and knows that juicing it up eventually dries up if evidence is swinging tenuously. Richard Dolan as well, is an intrepid investigator.

In the alternative media, someone like Randy Maugans, I think is an exemplar of deep thinking, careful analysis, dot connecting and evaluation.
Henrik Palmgren as well at Redice Creations. I actually trust the process of his research in questioning and presenting evidence, which he brings through in his interviews. He, like Maugans, I think gives us a place setting to make up our own minds.

What more do you think on this Raf?






Yeah...Do you know when, in Hollywood, producers explore the same theme over and over again, when they find a theme that makes them a lot of money?

It´s the same thing with this predictions/conspiracies scenario. These guys have found the recipe for "success", which is, basically, the craziest the better.

So, they mix secret societies, solar/planetary cycles, rogue planets, extra-terrestrials of several kinds, insiders/whistleblowers, satanism, apocalyptic threats, super-soldiers and (you name it).

Mix all these things, put them in a very poorly written script, spread it all over the web, the get all "researchers" to support each other and booooom, you´ve got a successful conspiracy.

We must remember that the alternative media brainwashes people as well, so don´t trust something simply because it´s "alternative", because it might not be so alternative as you think. In fact, a big part of the alternative media and its main characters use the same strategies of the so called "mainstream media" to increase viewership.

Cheers,

Raf.

[Maia Gabrial]

Hoagland is a freemason.

[DreamsInDigital]

Hoagland is a clone, has been one for around two years now and was prior to that subjected to increased amounts of mind control tactics.

[13th Warrior]

Hoagland is a clone, has been one for around two years now and was prior to that subjected to increased amounts of mind control tactics.

How does this work?

Was he a mind controlled human that was some how turned into a clone?

Or, was a clone created and a body snatching occurred to replace the human with the clone?

I wonder if his wife Robin has noticed?

[DreamsInDigital]

The real Hoagland was subjected for a long time to increasing amounts of mind control tactics and then when that didn't work to shut him up / stop him. They snatched him and cloned him, the one that has been in the public for about the past two years has been an 'organic robitoid'. The terms are frequently interchangeable. If you want more info on clones, robitoids and synthetics I highly recommend checking out www.bibliotecapleyades.net , there is a whole section with tons of info and articles on this, including photos and video of clones, how to tell the differences etc.

[13th Warrior]

The real Hoagland was subjected for a long time to increasing amounts of mind control tactics and then when that didn't work to shut him up / stop him. They snatched him and cloned him, the one that has been in the public for about the past two years has been an 'organic robitoid'. The terms are frequently interchangeable. If you want more info on clones, robitoids and synthetics I highly recommend checking out www.bibliotecapleyades.net , there is a whole section with tons of info and articles on this, including photos and video of clones, how to tell the differences etc.

Thanks, i'll take a look at the website.

[Debra]

Hi Raf, I am fine thanks. Wondering what easter will bring me .. chocolate I hope :)

I understand what you´re saying, especially when researchers begin making predictions .. then again in research, when one comes to evaluation, there is always some statement made about ´where this all seems to be leading´

I do think though, Richard Dolan is a fine example of a researcher who makes it clear that this is just his evaluation .. he uses words such as: if you were to ask me what I think? Well ... blah blah. And I think this is fine myself. If someone has gone down the rabbit hole of researching a particular topic, covering and comparing as much available data as is possible, then I like to hear what they have to say, as a result of their enquiry. In academia, particularly in postgraduate research, we have a committee of people to question us on our findings before a research is handed down (or rather published), and it is there that one is asked to elaborate further.

This process can open up a new direction, that can be included in a final paper, but it also keeps knowledge infinite. Hoagland, I think would have benefited from such a process, especially prior to presenting his research last year at the Awake and Aware conference. That epic presentation became self indulgent. He just lost his boundaries, I thought. I don´t know if he consulted with others in his field to get their opinion on what he was presenting - but even if had, they were either not competent enough to critique his research and help him fine tune it, or they were overwhelmed by his personality and his sheer drive to deliver what he thought was groundbreaking. However, you can´t fault the man for that.

The sciences are not my discipline, so I cannot comment further on intricacies of Hoagland´s evidence to match his hypothesis. Actually, that´s where I thought he was moving off the rails, trying to bring ideas together to satisfy his hypothesis.

But anyway, back to Wilcock, I do not have the grounding to discuss his discourse in detail - regarding the sourcefield investigation - but I do respect how he has presented his research as a journey of enquiry, and that is important, that for me is transparent. He has taken the time - to seriously understand a discerning field of theories relevant to his research and deep mined every aspect of evidence as well. And I believe that he moves into theoretical paradigms that mainstream science is .. well, frankly not up to speed with. Maybe in the so called black projects, but not mainstream science. From my reading, his research moves into territory that is still forming and he know this, and I think he acknowledges this fact.

Where I think Wilcock comes onto wobbly ground is when he embarks on bringing evidence together to expose and bring down the status quo. And this all being done at lightening speed, which is pretty amazing but also very uncertain as well, because this enquiry is not about understanding and expanding on scientific theories, it is trying to peel an onion to find the truth and perhaps frying it prematurely, at times.

But I detect a reason for this. On the surface, it looks like research on the run, rushed, stressful, releasing bulletins all of the time to keep people interested in the effort he is undertaking. But within this particular enquiry, I think he is exercising as much transparency as possible in his process. If some sources cannot be named at this time, perhaps it is for their safety that this confidence is maintained. Is it disinformation? This is still to be known, but at least this is an investigation that we are able to follow along with him - around corners, up stairs and sometimes into dead ends. But Wilcock has chosen to expose the process, and I think one of the reasons might be, that he understands that information - however it looks - needs to be available so we can all benefit and help to make sense of. That is the nature or methodology, as I see it, of this enquiry. He is not bottling it all up to be released only after he has spent months or years to understand. No, he is sharing, which I think is also generous. And besides, let us not forget, he is the one doing the hard work here. Not you, not me.

So I think we need to cut some slack here because I think one of the core reasons that Wilcock and others like him are working like bats out of hell right now, is because time is so important. That it is critical to bring a solid case together and forward as quickly as possible, to help realise the changes that we all want to see.

Here´s hoping that they will come soon.

Raf, I hope you have a nice easter mate!
Cheers, Zebra ;)



Hi Zebra, how are you?

Well, to be honest I don´t really fully trust anyone that´s in any kind of media, alternative or not.

I try not to be too paranoid about it, but I don´t think we would even have the internet if TPTB didn´t want us to have it. They´re the ones who have money, who own every major internet/telecom companies and probably the whole internet infrastructure.

Trusting is a strong word for me. I trust people who I know personally, with whom I´m emotionally connected, who have experienced life by my side.

So, allow me to change your question to who I consider a legitimate source of information, right?

For me, for any source of information/researcher to be considered legitimate, I must have access to the research data as a whole, including all sources and bibliography.

...Raf.

[jackovesk]

Last night I listened to Richard Hoagland try and defend his views on Comet Elenin. I have never heard someone backpedal from their views in such a way. My interpretation of what he said about Elenin was that it was a constructed craft of some kind and that it was going to hit the earth. When a caller confronted him with these facts he tried to minimize and deny what he had said. What is all of your interpretation of what he was saying during the "Elenin hysteria?" If you listen to the show you will hear him do everything he can to change the subject and he did not answer any of his critics directly. Is Richard Hoagland simply a P.R. mouthpiece or is he a legitimate researcher? What do you think?

I was'nt even going to click on this 'Thread' because I no longer listen to anything 'Hoagland' has to say..!

Thanks Cartomancer, you've said everything that I would have said anyway...:thumb:

[ghostrider]

everybody makes mistakes, it proves your human, the key is , take your medicine and move on and try and learn something from your mistake. I think Mr. Hoagland is a dis-info agent hung up on his own self worth issues, he has to be the center of attention. thats my two cents. he puts to much faith in what nasa says, he should know they only tell what they want to tell. The lie is different at every level, well it's still a lie no matter the level. He knows nasa doctors photo's, and still puts stock in the reports and such they put out.

[watchZEITGEISTnow]

Sad when you realize some of these 'insiders' are really just playing a part for their bosses (agencies).

Hoagland NEVER talks about others findings other than his own...that should raise a red flag right there.

[Cartomancer]

I like what you guys are saying about Palmgren et. al. I may include Mel Fabregas in that group as well. He seems somewhat unbiased even though he believes a lot of things his guests are saying as well. Good point about Richard Dolan being kind of even handed. In the realm of hidden history check out Steven Sora, Scott Wolter, Robert Bauval, Graham Hancock and Dr. Schock. One of the best sources for the truth is my Art History two Volume textbook: Gardiner's Art Through the Ages. Its all in there.

[DreamsInDigital]

Cart,

Another great source though unfortunately now with limited sources of his work, hidden history wise is Joseph Robert Jochman, I used to love his site "Forgotten Ages Research" but it for what ever reason disappeared about a year or two ago. Some of his articles though are available around the net on various sites.

[Debra]

Hi DreamsInDigital,

Can you help me? My interest was piqued when you raised the info that Hoagland might be cloned. I went to that website www.bibliotecapleyades.net that you referred on this thread, and put in a number variations into the search engine. But not have found the references to Hoagland as a victim of cloning. I would really like to view more of this material, can you help me drill down to the sources that you speak of?

Much thanks,
Zebra


Cart,

Another great source though unfortunately now with limited sources of his work, hidden history wise is Joseph Robert Jochman, I used to love his site "Forgotten Ages Research" but it for what ever reason disappeared about a year or two ago. Some of his articles though are available around the net on various sites.

[Raven]

Personally I do really like Richard Dolan or rather feel comfortable listening to him - I don't know Randy Maugans yet but have always appreciated listening to Henrik Palmgren on Red Ice Creations and agree that he seems to invite our own thoughtfullness

[DreamsInDigital]

Hi DreamsInDigital,

Can you help me? My interest was piqued when you raised the info that Hoagland might be cloned. I went to that website www.bibliotecapleyades.net that you referred on this thread, and put in a number variations into the search engine. But not have found the references to Hoagland as a victim of cloning. I would really like to view more of this material, can you help me drill down to the sources that you speak of?

Much thanks,
Zebra
I simply referenced that site as a general source for those wanting more info on clones, synthetic and robitoids. Will work on getting you more info in regards to Hoagland.

[Debra]

Thank You :)
But I also am grateful for you pointing me to this site. It is huge, and I will certainly go back there in future.
Best wishes,
zebra



Hi DreamsInDigital,

Can you help me? My interest was piqued when you raised the info that Hoagland might be cloned. I went to that website www.bibliotecapleyades.net that you referred on this thread, and put in a number variations into the search engine. But not have found the references to Hoagland as a victim of cloning. I would really like to view more of this material, can you help me drill down to the sources that you speak of?

Much thanks,
Zebra
I simply referenced that site as a general source for those wanting more info on clones, synthetic and robitoids. Will work on getting you more info in regards to Hoagland.

[DreamsInDigital]

It's one of my very favorites.

[aranuk]

Hi Raf, I am fine thanks. Wondering what easter will bring me .. chocolate I hope :)

I understand what you´re saying, especially when researchers begin making predictions .. then again in research, when one comes to evaluation, there is always some statement made about ´where this all seems to be leading´

I do think though, Richard Dolan is a fine example of a researcher who makes it clear that this is just his evaluation .. he uses words such as: if you were to ask me what I think? Well ... blah blah. And I think this is fine myself. If someone has gone down the rabbit hole of researching a particular topic, covering and comparing as much available data as is possible, then I like to hear what they have to say, as a result of their enquiry. In academia, particularly in postgraduate research, we have a committee of people to question us on our findings before a research is handed down (or rather published), and it is there that one is asked to elaborate further.

This process can open up a new direction, that can be included in a final paper, but it also keeps knowledge infinite. Hoagland, I think would have benefited from such a process, especially prior to presenting his research last year at the Awake and Aware conference. That epic presentation became self indulgent. He just lost his boundaries, I thought. I don´t know if he consulted with others in his field to get their opinion on what he was presenting - but even if had, they were either not competent enough to critique his research and help him fine tune it, or they were overwhelmed by his personality and his sheer drive to deliver what he thought was groundbreaking. However, you can´t fault the man for that.

The sciences are not my discipline, so I cannot comment further on intricacies of Hoagland´s evidence to match his hypothesis. Actually, that´s where I thought he was moving off the rails, trying to bring ideas together to satisfy his hypothesis.

But anyway, back to Wilcock, I do not have the grounding to discuss his discourse in detail - regarding the sourcefield investigation - but I do respect how he has presented his research as a journey of enquiry, and that is important, that for me is transparent. He has taken the time - to seriously understand a discerning field of theories relevant to his research and deep mined every aspect of evidence as well. And I believe that he moves into theoretical paradigms that mainstream science is .. well, frankly not up to speed with. Maybe in the so called black projects, but not mainstream science. From my reading, his research moves into territory that is still forming and he know this, and I think he acknowledges this fact.

Where I think Wilcock comes onto wobbly ground is when he embarks on bringing evidence together to expose and bring down the status quo. And this all being done at lightening speed, which is pretty amazing but also very uncertain as well, because this enquiry is not about understanding and expanding on scientific theories, it is trying to peel an onion to find the truth and perhaps frying it prematurely, at times.

But I detect a reason for this. On the surface, it looks like research on the run, rushed, stressful, releasing bulletins all of the time to keep people interested in the effort he is undertaking. But within this particular enquiry, I think he is exercising as much transparency as possible in his process. If some sources cannot be named at this time, perhaps it is for their safety that this confidence is maintained. Is it disinformation? This is still to be known, but at least this is an investigation that we are able to follow along with him - around corners, up stairs and sometimes into dead ends. But Wilcock has chosen to expose the process, and I think one of the reasons might be, that he understands that information - however it looks - needs to be available so we can all benefit and help to make sense of. That is the nature or methodology, as I see it, of this enquiry. He is not bottling it all up to be released only after he has spent months or years to understand. No, he is sharing, which I think is also generous. And besides, let us not forget, he is the one doing the hard work here. Not you, not me.

So I think we need to cut some slack here because I think one of the core reasons that Wilcock and others like him are working like bats out of hell right now, is because time is so important. That it is critical to bring a solid case together and forward as quickly as possible, to help realise the changes that we all want to see.

Here´s hoping that they will come soon.

Raf, I hope you have a nice easter mate!
Cheers, Zebra ;)



Hi Zebra, how are you?

Well, to be honest I don´t really fully trust anyone that´s in any kind of media, alternative or not.

I try not to be too paranoid about it, but I don´t think we would even have the internet if TPTB didn´t want us to have it. They´re the ones who have money, who own every major internet/telecom companies and probably the whole internet infrastructure.

Trusting is a strong word for me. I trust people who I know personally, with whom I´m emotionally connected, who have experienced life by my side.

So, allow me to change your question to who I consider a legitimate source of information, right?

For me, for any source of information/researcher to be considered legitimate, I must have access to the research data as a whole, including all sources and bibliography.

...Raf.

You talk a lot of sense girl!

Stan

[<8>]

Hi..

I don't know if Mr Hoagland trying to deceive anyone.
all I know is that I saw him at a conference a year ago, where he started defend himself for old stuff people had pointed out about him.
It quickly became embarrassing and I got a bad vibe about him.
Having said that, it might be time for Mr Hoagland to stop searching space for anomalies and start to search the space within himself.

It's only a suggestion Mr Hoagland, you know when the time is ready for you...


..8..

[jagman]

This song always reminds me of Hogie

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=4YlTUDnsWMo

[Debra]

[QUOTE=Zebra;462764]Hi Raf, I am fine thanks. Wondering what easter will bring me .. chocolate I hope :)

You talk a lot of sense girl!

Stan

Stan, you do me proud calling me a girl. I don´t mind that at all :) But will you tell my mother I have some sense?

[jaybee]

Hoagland is a clone, has been one for around two years now and was prior to that subjected to increased amounts of mind control tactics.

This deserves a facepalm.



http://i779.photobucket.com/albums/yy78/beeejay/fun/lionfacepalm.jpg


.