Mandatory Vaccines 1983 vs 2010

[Calz]

CDC Mandatory Vaccine Schedule: 1983 vs 2010

As of late, I've heard several (well intentioned) grandparents use the following argument in favor of blindly vaccinating with any and all injections available in the United States, "Well, you had all your vaccinations when you were born and you are just fine... Why not give them all to your baby?!"

The following chart highlights just one of the reasons that this argument is not logical. Vaccines (and the quantities in which they are given) in the U.S. are dramatically different as we move into 2011 than they were 40, 30, or even 20 years ago.

When it comes to vaccines: Be informed. Know each individual vaccine and the disease it is correlated with. Know your individual child's risk factor both for getting the disease (and/or actually being harmed by it) and the likelihood of adverse effects due to over-vaccination. Know how natural, life-long immunity is built in the body, and how it benefits an individual over his/her lifetime. Understand the most powerful of infant immunizations - exclusive breastfeeding. Make decisions on a vax-by-vax basis. There is no reason to blindly say 'yes' to 36-38 injections before your baby turns 66 months of age.

The Vaccine Book by Dr. Sears (who advocates for an alternative schedule of vaccinations), Take Charge of Your Child's Health by Dr. Wootan (who takes a more natural immunization approach to wellness), The Vaccine Safety Manual and several others are good 'even keeled' places to begin your investigation if you've not previously delved into vaccine and disease prevention research.

10803

Source:

CDC (Centers for Disease Control and Prevention) Child and Adolescent Immunization Schedules at: http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/recs/schedules/child-schedule.htm


http://www.drmomma.org/2011/01/cdc-mandatory-vaccine-schedule-1983-vs.html

[Carmody]

A systematic review of 51 studies involving 260,000 children age 6 to 23 months found no evidence that the flu vaccine is any more effective than a placebo in that group. A JAMA study showed the incidence of clinical influenza in the vaccinated group was 2 percent but in the un-vaccinated group it was only 3 percent. This means that out of 100 people, one person was attributed with avoiding the flu because of the vaccine. According to the CDC, common substances found in flu vaccines include: antibiotics, MSG, formaldehyde, mercury-containing thimerosal, and polysorbate 80 (PS 80 can cause severe anaphylactic reactions). There are one to two cases of Guillain-Barre syndrome per 1 million vaccinated persons. Taking a flu shot is essentially the same as buying a lottery ticket for acquiring GBS, an inflammatory demyelinating condition of the nervous system. Thankfully, there are alternatives to improving your immune system other than the flu vaccine.


Doctors against vaccines

http://www.vaccinetruth.org/doctors_against_vaccines.htm

[jorr lundstrom]

BREAKING NEWS! CDC Has Just Recommended Routine HPV Vaccinations for Boys!
October 25, 2011
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vaccine-boyIn a shocking move, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention said today that the HPV vaccine Gardasil should be given to 11- to 12-year-old boys as well as girls.

The CDC’s Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices unanimously recommended routine vaccinations for boys to protect them from cancers related to the human papillomavirus, or HPV. Federal health officials usually adopt what the panel says and asks doctors and patients to follow the recommendations.

Merck & Co. designed Gardasil to prevent sexually transmitted HPV infections, which can lead to genital warts and cervical cancer in women, and cancer of the penis and anus in men. Merck won FDA approval for female patients in 2006, and male patients in 2009.

The problem, as we have pointed out previously, is that of the 100 different types of HPV, only fifteen might someday develop into cancer; moreover, the Journal of the American Medical Association says the relationship between infection with HPV at a young age and later development of cancer is unknown. Of those fifteen potential cancer-causing strains, the vaccine targets only two: HPV-16 and HPV-18. In other words, the vaccine will have no effect on 87% of the HPV viruses that might potentially cause cancer, and the causal link between HPV and cervical cancer is far from definitive.

According to Bloomberg.com, today’s finding reverses a 2009 recommendation by the panel that the HPV vaccine should be optional for boys. The panel at the time said the benefits of giving it routinely to 11- to 12- year-old boys wouldn’t justify the costs.

The CDC’s recommendation flies in the face of data from its own Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System, which received a total of 18,727 reports of adverse events following Gardasil HPV vaccination. A whopping 1,498 of those events (8%) were considered “serious”—such as blood clots, the neurological disorder Guillain-Barre Syndrome, and 68 reports of death. While the most common reactions might be redness or swelling at the injection site, to ignore or soft-pedal the existence of serious side effects (including death!) is not acceptable.

As our readers know, the HPV vaccine has been a national issue recently thanks to the GOP presidential debates. During this time, the major media have faithfully parroted the line that the vaccine is safe, and have refused to pay any attention whatever to the adverse event reports or the testimony of parents. The US government’s Institute of Medicine has also chosen to ignore the adverse event reports, saying disingenuously that they only consider peer-reviewed research. Unfortunately, both the major media and many of the IOM researchers depend on the drug companies for support, and it appears that we cannot expect anyone in an official position even to acknowledge, much less investigate, reports—often submitted by doctors—of what this vaccine is really doing.

It is outrageous that this vaccine has been mandated for girls in some states. To recommend it for boys is no less outrageous.

[Samsara]

I have a question for the Avalon Community. Your input on this is very much valued and welcomed.

My grandson, now 4 1/2, did not get any vaccines. He has a very good health for which we are grateful. The family will travel a lot, for now they go to relatively "safe places". Dad is peruvian, so they will go to Peru and other south american countries. The only reason they have not gone yet is because they want his immune system to be stronger.

Both parents have read a lot on the subject of vaccines, went to conferences, etc. Here's the question. My daughter wishes for him to have the polio, tetanus and diphteria vaccines - it is a "gut feeling" she has. She has consulted many homeopathic specialists on the subject and most agree that if they are going to travel a lot, he should have these three vaccines. Dad is more against it. They do want to find more information to help them with their choice. The only motivation here is the well-being of Alexis (my grandson). The doctor told them he could have vaccines without any adjuvant.

I personally am against vaccines. When I had my daughter, we did not have all the information we have today and they were not vaccinating as much either. I cannot know what I would have decided for my daughter if I had known what I know today...

I told them I would put the question out in Avalon to help them with their decision.

With gratitude.

Samsara

[vibrations]

BREAKING NEWS! CDC Has Just Recommended Routine HPV Vaccinations for Boys!
October 25, 2011
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The problem, as we have pointed out previously, is that of the 100 different types of HPV, only fifteen might someday develop into cancer

How good you brought it up, because even this is a pure lie. I would suggest that please do not believe anything any white dressed so called MD tells you. Anything about cancer published in MSM or scientific publications.
In the other side there is a huge, fast growing movement of the professionals of medicine and surrounding scientific platforms with a honest humanitarian approach on research which can explain a lot about cancer.
Any vaccine is just a deliberate poisoning and making money from it.

[Calz]

I have a question for the Avalon Community. Your input on this is very much valued and welcomed.

My grandson, now 4 1/2, did not get any vaccines. He has a very good health for which we are grateful. The family will travel a lot, for now they go to relatively "safe places". Dad is peruvian, so they will go to Peru and other south american countries. The only reason they have not gone yet is because they want his immune system to be stronger.

Both parents have read a lot on the subject of vaccines, went to conferences, etc. Here's the question. My daughter wishes for him to have the polio, tetanus and diphteria vaccines - it is a "gut feeling" she has. She has consulted many homeopathic specialists on the subject and most agree that if they are going to travel a lot, he should have these three vaccines. Dad is more against it. They do want to find more information to help them with their choice. The only motivation here is the well-being of Alexis (my grandson). The doctor told them he could have vaccines without any adjuvant.

I personally am against vaccines. When I had my daughter, we did not have all the information we have today and they were not vaccinating as much either. I cannot know what I would have decided for my daughter if I had known what I know today...

I told them I would put the question out in Avalon to help them with their decision.

With gratitude.

Samsara


I cannot offer a direct recommendation but will offer a couple tidbits. Other Avalonians are more qualified than myself and perhaps some will add ...

My understanding is that *all* vaccines do a little bit of neurological damage and this is accumulative. Going back to the OP and seeing a 3-fold increase in the mandatory shots reflects this. Very few "study groups" to offer "proof" of this except for the Amish. To the best of my knowledge none of the Amish children are vaccinated and allegedly they don't have a single case of Autism. Make of that what you will.

More to your situation if a child is entering into an environment where the chances justify a vaccination then it becomes a trade-off of sorts. Tetanus is a good example (and one of the three being considered). If a child steps on a rusty nail (see below) and becomes ill (or dies) then that must be taken under consideration as well:



Signs and symptoms

An infant suffering from neonatal tetanus.Tetanus affects skeletal muscle, a type of striated muscle used in voluntary movement. The other type of striated muscle, cardiac or heart muscle, cannot be tetanized because of its intrinsic electrical properties. Mortality rates reported vary from 48% to 73%. In recent years, approximately 11% of reported tetanus cases have been fatal. The highest mortality rates are in unvaccinated people and people over 60 years of age.[3]

The incubation period of tetanus may be up to several months but is usually about 8 days.[4][5] In general, the further the injury site is from the central nervous system, the longer the incubation period. The shorter the incubation period, the more severe the symptoms.[6] In neonatal tetanus, symptoms usually appear from 4 to 14 days after birth, averaging about 7 days. On the basis of clinical findings, four different forms of tetanus have been described.[3]

Generalized tetanus is the most common type of tetanus, representing about 80% of cases. The generalized form usually presents with a descending pattern. The first sign is trismus, or lockjaw, and the facial spasms called risus sardonicus, followed by stiffness of the neck, difficulty in swallowing, and rigidity of pectoral and calf muscles. Other symptoms include elevated temperature, sweating, elevated blood pressure, and episodic rapid heart rate. Spasms may occur frequently and last for several minutes with the body shaped into a characteristic form called opisthotonos. Spasms continue for up to 4 weeks, and complete recovery may take months.

Neonatal tetanus is a form of generalized tetanus that occurs in newborns. Infants who have not acquired passive immunity because the mother has never been immunized are at risk. It usually occurs through infection of the unhealed umbilical stump, particularly when the stump is cut with a non-sterile instrument. Neonatal tetanus is common in many developing countries and is responsible for about 14% (215,000) of all neonatal deaths, but is very rare in developed countries.[7]

Local tetanus is an uncommon form of the disease, in which patients have persistent contraction of muscles in the same anatomic area as the injury. The contractions may persist for many weeks before gradually subsiding. Local tetanus is generally milder; only about 1% of cases are fatal, but it may precede the onset of generalized tetanus.

Cephalic tetanus is a rare form[citation needed] of the disease, occasionally occurring with otitis media (ear infections) in which C. tetani is present in the flora of the middle ear, or following injuries to the head. There is involvement of the cranial nerves, especially in the facial area.

[edit] Cause Tetanus is often associated with rust, especially rusty nails, but this concept is somewhat misleading. Objects that accumulate rust are often found outdoors, or in places that harbor anaerobic bacteria, but the rust itself does not cause tetanus nor does it contain more C. tetani bacteria. The rough surface of rusty metal merely provides a prime habitat for a C. tetani endospore to reside, and the nail affords a means to puncture skin and deliver endospore into the wound. An endospore is a non-metabolizing survival structure that begins to metabolize and cause infection once in an adequate environment. Because C. tetani is an anaerobic bacterium, it and its endospores survive well in an environment that lacks oxygen. Hence, stepping on a nail (rusty or not) may result in a tetanus infection, as the low-oxygen (anaerobic) environment is provided by the same object that causes a puncture wound, delivering endospores to a suitable environment for growth.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tetanus

[Samsara]

Thanks Calz... hard choices for parents today.

[Ellisa]

I am in my 70s. When i was a child I had pneumonia (hospitalised), measles, rubella, chicken pox, something called scarlatina, whooping cough, mumps and numerous colds and fevers. I survived but missed a lot of school, as did everyone else through such 'childhood' diseases. My friends were not so lucky. One died of scarlet fever, one had a serious reaction to measles and lost effective sight. I did not get diptheria, but my cousin died of it at 11, I had the then new vaccination for it and so avoided it. Then I lost 2 friends to polio, and another 2 were left with physical disabilities as a result of contracting it. One of my school friends had a brother who died of typhoid on a school trip to Italy. Another cousin of mine at 18 had to go to a sanitarium for 10 years with TB- thanks to streptomycin she is still alive and in her 80s. And we were considered to be a healthy family!

All the diseases I mentioned are practically never seen by our doctors today, but they do still exist. They are all prevented by vaccination, and, thanks to the fact that most of us have our children vaccinated when it's time, our 'herd' immunity as a society is good and most of us don't give these diseases a second thought and we fear the vaccination. These illnesses are however still dangerous and in countries with indifferent health standards are endemic. Taking an unvaccinated child to such a country would be a very risky thing to do.

By the way the Amish never getting autism is untrue. They just, in many ways , view it differently from the general community, and possibly their society is able to accommodate to it more easily.

[Calz]

Thanks for your response Ellisa. There is plenty of material on the net and who knows where it comes from or who pays for it.

I am no longer willing to "mix it up" with those who favor vaccination. My OP was to denote the increase in mandatory vaccinations and I responded to Samsara with what seemed appropriate.

I will put up one storyline regarding the Amish ... you can dismiss it if you wish. I will go no further. There are many other threads debating the whole vaccination issue.

_________________________________


The Age of Autism: The Amish anomaly

By Dan Olmsted

UNITED PRESS INTERNATIONAL

Lancaster, PA, Apr. 18 (UPI) -- Part 1 of 2.

Where are the autistic Amish? Here in Lancaster County, heart of Pennsylvania Dutch country, there should be well over 100 with some form of the disorder.

I have come here to find them, but so far my mission has failed, and the very few I have identified raise some very interesting questions about some widely held views on autism.

The mainstream scientific consensus says autism is a complex genetic disorder, one that has been around for millennia at roughly the same prevalence. That prevalence is now considered to be 1 in every 166 children born in the United States.

Applying that model to Lancaster County, there ought to be 130 Amish men, women and children here with Autism Spectrum Disorder.

Well over 100, in rough terms.

Typically, half would harbor milder variants such as Asperger's Disorder or the catch-all Pervasive Development Disorder, Not Otherwise Specified -- PDD-NOS for short.

So let's drop those from our calculation, even though "mild" is a relative term when it comes to autism.

That means upwards of 50 Amish people of all ages should be living in Lancaster County with full-syndrome autism, the "classic autism" first described in 1943 by child psychiatrist Leo Kanner at Johns Hopkins University. The full-syndrome disorder is hard to miss, characterized by "markedly abnormal or impaired development in social interaction and communication and a markedly restricted repertoire of activities and interests," according to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders.

Why bother looking for them among the Amish? Because they could hold clues to the cause of autism.

The first half-dozen articles in this ongoing series on the roots and rise of autism examined the initial studies and early accounts of the disorder, first identified by Kanner among 11 U.S. children born starting in 1931.

Kanner wrote that his 1938 encounter with a child from Mississippi, identified as Donald T., "made me aware of a behavior pattern not known to me or anyone else theretofore." Kanner literally wrote the book on "Child Psychiatry," published in 1934.

If Kanner was correct -- if autism was new and increasingly prevalent -- something must have happened in the 1930s to trigger those first autistic cases. Genetic disorders do not begin suddenly or increase dramatically in prevalence in a short period of time.

That is why it is worth looking for autistic Amish -- to test reasoning against reality. Largely cut off for hundreds of years from American culture and scientific progress, the Amish might have had less exposure to some new factor triggering autism in the rest of population.

Surprising, but no one seems to have looked.

Of course, the Amish world is insular by nature; finding a small subset of Amish is a challenge by definition. Many Amish, particularly Old Order, ride horse-and-buggies, eschew electricity, do not attend public school, will not pose for pictures and do not chat casually with the "English," as they warily call the non-Amish.

Still, some Amish today interact with the outside world in many ways. Some drive, use phones, see doctors and send out Christmas cards with family photos. They all still refer to themselves as "Plain," but the definition of that word varies quite a bit.

So far, from sources inside and outside the Amish community, I have identified three Amish residents of Lancaster County who apparently have full-syndrome autism, all of them children.

A local woman told me there is one classroom with about 30 "special-needs" Amish children. In that classroom, there is one autistic Amish child.

Another autistic Amish child does not go to school.

The third is that woman's pre-school-age daughter.

If there were more, she said, she would know it.

What I learned about those children is the subject of the next column.

PART 2: The Age of Autism: Julia

UNITED PRESS INTERNATIONAL

Leola, PA, Apr. 19 (UPI) -- Part 2 of 2.

Three-year old Julia is napping when I arrive at the spare, neat, cheerful house on Musser School Road near the town of Leola in Lancaster County.

She is the reason I have driven through the budding countryside on this perfect spring day, but I really do not need to meet her.

In the last column, I wrote about trying to find autistic Amish people here in the heart of Pennsylvania Dutch country, and noted there should be dozens of them -- if autism occurs at the same prevalence as the rest of the United States.

So far, there is evidence of only three, all of them children, the oldest age 9 or 10. Julia is one of them. I found out about her through a pediatrician in Richmond, Va., Dr. Mary Megson. I had been asking around for quite some time about autism and the Amish, and she provided the first direct link.

Megson said she would give my name to this child's mother, who could call if she chose. A few days later the phone rang. It was Stacey-jean Inion, an Amish-Mennonite woman. She, her husband Brent and their four children live simply, but they do drive a vehicle and have a telephone. After a few pleasantries, I told her about my trying to find autistic Amish.

Here is what she said, verbatim:

"Unfortunately our autistic daughter -- who's doing very well, she's been diagnosed with very, very severe autism -- is adopted from China, and so she would have had all her vaccines in China before we got her, and then she had most of her vaccines given to her in the United States before we got her.

"So we're probably not the pure case you're looking for."

Maybe not, but it was stunning that Julia Inion, the first autistic Amish person I could find, turned out to be adopted -- from another country, no less. It also was surprising that Stacey-jean launched unbidden into vaccines, because the Amish have a religious exemption from vaccination and presumably would not have given it much thought.

She said a minority of Amish families do, in fact, vaccinate their children these days, partly at the urging of public health officials.

"Almost every Amish family I know has had somebody from the health department knock on our door and try to convince us to get vaccines for our children," she said. "The younger Amish more and more are getting vaccines. It's a minority of children who vaccinate, but that is changing now."

Did she know of any other autistic Amish? Two more children, she said.

"One of them, we're very certain it was a vaccine reaction, even though the government would not agree with that."

Federal health officials have said there is no association between vaccinations and autism or learning disabilities.

"The other one I'm not sure if this child was vaccinated or not," she added.

During my visit to their home, I asked Stacey-jean to explain why she attributed the first case to vaccines.

"There's one family that we know, their daughter had a vaccine reaction and is now autistic. She was walking and functioning and a happy bright child, and 24 hours after she had her vaccine, her legs went limp and she had a typical high-pitched scream. They called the doctor and the doctor said it was fine -- a lot of high-pitched screaming goes along with it.

"She completely quit speaking," Stacey-jean said. "She completely quit making eye contact with people. She went in her own world."

This happened, Stacey-jean said, at "something like 15 months." The child is now about 8.

For similar reasons, Julia Inion's Chinese background is intriguing. China, India and Indonesia are among countries moving quickly to mass-vaccination programs. In some vaccines, they use a mercury-based preservative called thimerosal that keeps multiple-dose vials from becoming contaminated by repeated needle sticks.

Thimerosal was phased out of U.S. vaccines starting in 1999, after health officials became concerned about the amount of mercury infants and children were receiving. The officials said they simply were erring on the side of caution, and that all evidence favors rejection of any link between Autism Spectrum Disorders and thimerosal, or vaccines themselves.

Julia's vaccinations in China -- all given in one day at about age 15 months -- may well have contained thimerosal; the United States had stopped using it by the time she was born, but other countries with millions to vaccinate had not.

Stacey-jean said photographs of Julia taken in China before she was vaccinated showed a smiling alert child looking squarely at the camera. Her original adoptive family in the United States, overwhelmed trying to cope with an autistic child, gave Julia up for re-adoption. The Inions took her in knowing her diagnosis of severe autism.

I tried hard -- and am still trying -- to find people who know about other autistic Amish. Of the local health and social service agency personnel in Lancaster, some said they dealt with Amish people with disabilities, such as mental retardation, but none recalled seeing an autistic Amish.

Still, I could be trapped in a feedback loop: The Amish I am likeliest to know about -- because they have the most contact with the outside world -- also are likeliest to adopt a special-needs child such as Julia from outside the community, and likeliest to have their children vaccinated.

Another qualifier: The Inions are converts to the Amish-Mennonite religion (Brent is an Asian-American). They simply might not know about any number of autistic Amish sheltered quietly with their families for decades.

It also is possible the isolated Amish gene pool might confer some kind of immunity to autism -- which might be a useful topic for research.

Whatever the case, Stacey-jean thinks the autistic Amish are nowhere to be found.

"It is so much more rare among our people," she said. "My husband just said last week that so far we've never met a family that lives a healthy lifestyle and does not vaccinate their children that has an autistic child. We haven't come across one yet."

"Everywhere I go (outside the Amish community) I find children who are autistic, just because I have an autistic daughter -- in the grocery store, in the park, wherever I go. In the Amish community, I simply don't find that."

UPI researcher Kyle Pearson contributed to this article.

This ongoing series on the roots and rise of autism aims to be interactive with readers and welcomes comment, criticism and suggestions.

http://www.whale.to/vaccine/olmsted.html

[karelia]

~snip~
All the diseases I mentioned are practically never seen by our doctors today, but they do still exist. They are all prevented by vaccination, and, thanks to the fact that most of us have our children vaccinated when it's time, our 'herd' immunity as a society is good and most of us don't give these diseases a second thought and we fear the vaccination. These illnesses are however still dangerous and in countries with indifferent health standards are endemic. Taking an unvaccinated child to such a country would be a very risky thing to do.

By the way the Amish never getting autism is untrue. They just, in many ways , view it differently from the general community, and possibly their society is able to accommodate to it more easily.

There is absolutely no scientific proof that even a single vaccine prevents any disease whatsoever. Furthermore, the vast majority of 'vaccine-preventable' diseases had already heavily declined by the time a vaccine was introduced. That as well as improved hygienic conditions throughout the Western world reduced diseases in general. Vaccines then added new diseases, such as mercury poisoning (check the symptoms of that and compare it with symptoms of any autism spectrum disorder), chronic diseases like diabetes, juvenile diabetes, Guillain Barre syndrome, chronic fatigue syndrome, allergies, etc. Those diseases were unknown before vaccines appeared.

You make a bold statement with the claim that the Amish get more autism than is generally thought. Please back it up with some sources. Thanks.

[Ultima Thule]

Vaccination as an issue in general is a difficult one.

When our first child was born, I did my homework on that issue. One of the most interesting things was when I dug up the graphs of cases per year of the diseases that are vaccinated against. After digging them up, I made a line at the year when the disease in question was begun to vaccinate against.

In one or two cases - I am talking about Finland here - you could actually see a slight positive change correlating with the start of vaccinations. In one or two cases you could see negative change, i.e. the descending trend that had already been going on for decades, evening out. In the rest of the cases you could´t see any change.

This in no straightforward issue, but my thoughts in a nutshell:
- statistically there is a question, whether a descending curve that was already going on, has been attributed to be the effect of vaccinations with no merit?
- generations before had fewer vaccinations and in my opinion were of more sound constitution, they could cope with them. I myself had severe spasms etc. after mmr that were never reported as a side-effect, which brings us to this:
- the reporting of side-effects is not encouraged, in fact they are in general flat out denied and still there are about 1500-2000 reported cases in Finland a year, with a population of 5 million
- the paranoid/realistic bit: in the beginning of vaccinations, the motivation was pure - no doubt about it. In my opinion big pharma, governed by tptw has taken over with an agenda of their own, I myself have no trust in that institution. There lies a risk: saying no categorically to something that might contain something useful.
- our kids in comparison to others, cousins for example are by far healthier. This is anecdotal evidenceyes, but still in clear sight.
- tetanus is a question yet unanswered in my books as is diphtheria too. Vaccinations imo is not black-and-white issue, it has definite shades of grey to it
- in Sweden they read the graphs and quit vaccinating against whooping cough in around 1980, as it predisposed people to catching whooping cough, so it is not unheard of that in places vaccines are quit, in Finland they quit TB-vaccine, as it didn´t have positive effect, but instead carried significant risks
- Elisas tale raises a legitimate question, what then has contributed? I don´t have an answer to what vaccine might be of help and what not.

All in all, no slam dunk issue here folks. I encourage everyone that is pondering vaccines to dig up the graphs of your country and line the stats up with the years of the vaccinations started. This will not solve the issue, but it will possibly surface the realization that the official information is not really being objective about it. To get objective graphs, i got them from international source. I would love to show the graphs here, but I lost the graphs several years ago when my computer had a meltdown.

Juha

[Calz]

Caveat is to try in as much as possible to steer clear of studies paid for (directly or indirectly) by Big Pharma.

Sounds easier than it is ... but makes all the difference in the world.

[modwiz]

Childhood disease have an important role to play besides immunity. It has to do with genetic 'weeding', but this is a subjsct few want to address because emotions cloud reason. These diseases are a hurdle to jump, a test of genetic strength, so to speak. I see the ravages of this hurdle being removed. The society we currently live in is one of the symptoms.

This is a rarefied concept and I expect flames for stating it. Certain views are lonely places to be. The view is a relatively clear one though.

[Calz]

Childhood disease have an important role to play besides immunity. It has to do with genetic 'weeding', but this is a subjsct few want to address because emotions cloud reason. These diseases are a hurdle to jump, a test of genetic strength, so to speak. I see the ravages of this hurdle being removed. The society we currently live in is one of the symptoms.

This is a rarefied concept and I expect flames for stating it. Certain views are lonely places to be. The view is a relatively clear one though.

Thank you Modwiz,

Rarefied indeed ... never quite thought of it like that. Does make some sense though.

More to consider.

[karelia]

Childhood disease have an important role to play besides immunity. It has to do with genetic 'weeding', but this is a subjsct few want to address because emotions cloud reason. These diseases are a hurdle to jump, a test of genetic strength, so to speak. I see the ravages of this hurdle being removed. The society we currently live in is one of the symptoms.

This is a rarefied concept and I expect flames for stating it. Certain views are lonely places to be. The view is a relatively clear one though.

I am TOTALLY with you here. In fact, in 2002, I learned about a sanatorium of sorts where children with a chronic disease (I forgot which one) resided. Tests showed that if they managed to contract measles, the chronic disease would retreat to the point of even disappearing entirely. So certain diseases are certainly not a threat to one but can be very beneficial. In my childhood, it was commonly known that a child would jump developmentally after a childhood disease, especially measles. I witnessed this first-hand more recently. A boy, 7 years old, showed absolutely no interest whatsoever in learning to read. He came down with measles, got over it, and three weeks later had taught himself to read.

I've said for years that vaccines are purely designed as a tool for negative forces, but the more I learn about it, the more I'm beginning to suspect that there is a lot more behind the whole agenda...

[Calz]

More on Amish (albiet a bit dated ... 2005):

________________________________________

Why Don't the Amish Have Autistic Children?

Posted By Dr. Mercola | May 04 2005

Autism is a difficult disorder to miss, as it is characterized by noticeably abnormal or impaired development in social interaction and communication and a markedly restricted array of activities and interests. And while scientific consensus claims autism has been around for millennia at generally the same prevalence, that prevalence is now considered to be one in every 166 children born in the United States.

Therefore, with this devastating statistic in mind, one reporter set out to analyze the autism rates among Amish communities. Why? Because perhaps searching for autistic Amish children would reveal clues to the cause of autism ... and it did.

The Clues Come Together

Since they have been cut off for hundreds of years from American culture and scientific progress, the Amish may have had less exposure to some new factor triggering autism in the rest of population. The likely culprit: vaccines.

Traveling to the heart of Pennsylvania Dutch country in search of autistic Amish children, the reporter, based on national statistics, should have found as many as 200 children with autism in the community -- instead, he found only three, the oldest age 9 or 10:

•The first autistic Amish child was a girl who had been brought over from China, adopted by one family only to be given up after becoming overwhelmed by her autism, and then re-adopted by an Amish Mennonite family. (China, India and Indonesia are among countries moving fast to mass-vaccination programs.)

•The second autistic Amish child definitely had received a vaccination and developed autism shortly thereafter.

•The reporter was unable to determine the vaccination status of the third child.

Dangerous Effects of Thimerosal

In some vaccines, they use a mercury-based preservative called thimerosal that keeps multiple-dose vials from becoming contaminated by repeated needle sticks. After health officials became concerned about the amount of mercury infants and children were receiving through thimerosal-tainted vaccines, the toxin was phased out of U.S. vaccines starting in 1999.

However, due to mislabeling and other problems, its presence is still being felt, and more and more children are suffering because of it.

Washington Times April 18, 2005

Washington Times April 19, 2005


Dr. Mercola's Comments:



Does anyone out there really need more evidence than this?

Admittedly, this was not a placebo-controlled scientific trial but an evidence-based fact analysis that, in my mind, provides an irrefutable link to a lifestyle and, most likely, mercury-containing vaccine connection to autism.

Folks, you don't have to be a medical doctor, hold advanced epidemiology degrees or teach molecular genetics to figure this one out. You don't even need a degree in rocket science. How much more obvious could it be?

The link between autism and vaccines is certainly not a new idea. In fact, suggestions of this link have been in the national news for at least six years now. Just last year a study, that reviewed data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention's (CDC) Vaccine Data Link, concluded that children who receive thimerosal-containing vaccinations are 27 times more likely to develop autism than children who do not.

That's a 2,700 percent increase. The numbers just don't lie.

Considering how important this issue is for nearly everyone you know, it might be a good one to forward to your friends and relatives. You can easily do this by using the E-mail to a friend button in the upper right hand section of this page, just under the search box. You can make a larger impact if you write them a personal message in the e-mail as to why they should seriously consider the advice -- and why they may want to subscribe to the newsletter.

This most recent investigation simply provides the proverbial icing on the cake. There aren't too many other places, if any, in America where you can find large groups of children who haven't been vaccinated.

The reporter found three children with autism. One child was adopted and previously vaccinated, another was one of the few Amish children who were vaccinated, and the third had an unclear vaccine history. That leaves, at most, potentially one child out of an expected 200 (from national statistics) with autism. The odds of this being mere coincidence are slim to none.

At Least Change the Rules Concerning the Hepatitis B Vaccine

Because of their religious beliefs, the Amish community chooses not to give their children any vaccines. Understandably, many of you may not choose such a radical approach. However, if you were to focus on just one vaccine, I would encourage you to look at the issues surrounding the hepatitis B vaccine.

The multi-dose version of this vaccine, which is typically administered to newborns before they leave the hospital, still contains thimerosal. This is reprehensible, irresponsible negligence of the highest magnitude. The immature central nervous systems of these helpless newborns are particularly susceptible to toxic insults, and thimerosal, the mercury-containing preservative used in these vaccines, is one of the worst.

It would be much easier to understand if the hepatitis B vaccine had some value, but most natural health experts who study this are convinced that this is nearly always an absolutely unnecessary vaccine.

There are only about 5,000 people a year who develop the most serious consequence of hepatitis B infection, liver cancer. That means we are immunizing tens of millions of infants and causing brain injury that has caused an epidemic of autism to protect liver cancer in 5,000 adults. And, many of these adults have serious social problems like IV drug abuse, alcoholism and poor nutrition that seriously increases their risk for this disease.

If you're a young parent weighing the pros and cons of vaccines, I strongly urge you to learn more about the toxicity of thimerosal, which, again, is still present in multi-dose hepatitis B vaccines, and nearly all the mandated flu vaccine for infants.

Gary Craig's Comment:

For those families dealing with autism, you should know that consistent application of EFT can help with the angers, frustrations and other behavior problems that accompany this affliction. As an example, Linda Johnson writes the following on the EFT web site ...

"With my autistic son, I tapped one night as a surrogate for "focus and attention", "hearing what people are saying", "better social connection" and "neurological symptoms". The next morning, for the first time, he got dressed without prompting at each step while watching the news on television. An absolute first. Doing two things at the same time."

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2005/05/04/amish-autism-part-one.aspx

[Ultima Thule]

Just bumped into this ongoing study: http://www.vaccineinjury.info/vaccinations-in-general/health-unvaccinated-children/survey-results-illnesses.html
Where it basically states that vaccinated children are significantly more ill than non-vaccinated children.

Juha

[Laurel]

A couple of months ago, the news issued the following next to a picture of a smiling toddler:


Tami Hughes

FOX6 Reporter

5:04 p.m. CDT, September 8, 2011
WITI-TV, MILWAUKEE —
Health officials are urging the public to be vigilant and get vaccinated for measles. This, after a young girl in Milwaukee was diagnosed with the illness.

Dr. Margaret Hennessy, a pediatrician in Racine, says measles is most certainly a public health issue that shouldn't be taken lightly.

"As this illustrates, it takes just one plane ride some place else and you're going to see a measles outbreak occur," said Hennessy.

There have been some concerns by parents who have heard about studies linking the measles, mumps and rubella vaccine to autism. But as Dr. Hennessy points out, those students have been proven false - even fraudulent.

[Laurel]

My teenage daughter is going with her school to the Galapogos Islands and Ecuador next year. Vaccinations are required. I am really torn about her getting all the vaccinations and have been told that it is best to spread them out and not get them together. Do any of you have experience with this?


Possible recommended vaccinations for Ecuador are typhoid, hepatitis A, diphtheria, and yellow fever.

[karelia]

My teenage daughter is going with her school to the Galapogos Islands and Ecuador next year. Vaccinations are required. I am really torn about her getting all the vaccinations and have been told that it is best to spread them out and not get them together. Do any of you have experience with this?


Possible recommended vaccinations for Ecuador are typhoid, hepatitis A, diphtheria, and yellow fever.

Unless you're in WV or MS, vaccinations are most certainly not required, since every other state has either a religious or philosophical exemption or both. Last time I checked, there were no vaccinations required to enter Ecuador.

I can only speak from my own experience, but I've traveled widely, including 3rd World countries. Without any vaccinations. Aside from getting the runs within days of arrival, I never had any health problems whatsoever. And more importantly, no chronic health trouble caused by vaccines.

[TWINCANS]

Childhood disease have an important role to play besides immunity. It has to do with genetic 'weeding', but this is a subjsct few want to address because emotions cloud reason. These diseases are a hurdle to jump, a test of genetic strength, so to speak. I see the ravages of this hurdle being removed. The society we currently live in is one of the symptoms.

This is a rarefied concept and I expect flames for stating it. Certain views are lonely places to be. The view is a relatively clear one though.

Rudolf Steiner (Waldorf schools) theory proponents say that at certain stages in a child's life, you want them to have a very high temperature during a common flu, rather than just a low one. Something to do with the anchoring of the next body overlay. I am a bit vague but agree that the incoming being incarnates in stages and heat can certainly activate things.

[Ellisa]

It could be the school that is requiring the vaccination as there would be a very difficult situation if a child became ill whilst away on such a trip. It may even be required for travel insurance- groups usually have to ensure all travelling children have adequate cover, particularly if it is a tour organised by a commercial company especially for schools. The company will often have their own mandatory rules. Illness and injury on such a trip is a very serious thing to happen, and teachers cannot afford to take any risks with their students.

And bear in mind that even minor illness is difficult to deal with on a trip. Maybe for a lone adult a day or two of upset tummy is not a problem--- imagine it galloping through a large group of excited, now miserable, teenagers! An overseas school trip is no holiday for the teachers!

That said however--- what an AMAZING trip. Such a wonderful opportunity, I'd go there tomorrow!

[karelia]

If a school requires the vaccination, that means the school takes full responsibility for any side effects. Do you seriously think ANY institution would take responsibility for that? Nope, me neither. Same goes for travel insurance.

Illness/injury is always a serious thing, but frankly, I would rather take a bunch of unvaccinated children than a bunch of just-vaccinated children who may react in ways no teacher is prepared to deal with.

[Calz]

If a school requires the vaccination, that means the school takes full responsibility for any side effects. Do you seriously think ANY institution would take responsibility for that? Nope, me neither. Same goes for travel insurance.

Illness/injury is always a serious thing, but frankly, I would rather take a bunch of unvaccinated children than a bunch of just-vaccinated children who may react in ways no teacher is prepared to deal with.

Allegedly public schools lose federal funding if they don't have 90% of the children vaccinated (in the USA). There are a few ways around vaccinations and it varies from state to state.

I have never heard of a school being held liable for side effects of vaccinations.

I assume you mean "forcibly mandating" rather than "requiring" ... or is there something I am missing?

I was told by a school nurse that there was a "law" requiring a particular vaccination (they added another chicken pox) but, at least currently in the state I live, it can still be waived based on "religious" background. Anyway ... I would venture to guess she was simply passing along "scare disinfo". I did not follow-up by investigating said law (since I had signed the waiver).

[Ellisa]

karella- No one suggests taking recently vaccinated children away, the person enquiring has enough time to decide whether to space the injections out, or have them all at once. This is part of the preparations.

I have no idea what the rules are for travel in school groups are in the US but I do know that here in Oz the trip has to be approved by the State Education Dept and for that trip all participants must have current travel insurance, not only for health but also for property loss etc. Regulations regarding inoculations and vaccinations for every country are mandatory or advised, for re-enrty to Australia, (for us all). It is not only the school that takes responsiblity for the students, it is also the state. I do not know about private schools.

I reiterate that venturing overseas with unvaccinated students to a country with endemic exotic diseases is not a risk I would be willing to take. It is one thing to be a lone traveller but another to be responsible for the welfare of a group of children.

[karelia]

Calz, yes, I meant forcibly mandating. Most schools (teachers and nurses and other staff alike) disinform, whether that's because of ignorance or intention, I don't know, though I suspect mostly ignorance. Vaccination is one of those fields where you really need to know your rights because otherwise you may well end up vaccinating your child/self when it wouldn't be necessary.

I don't know about schools losing federal funding (we've been homeschooling in what seems like forever; youngest has never been to school) over lack of vaccination, but if a parent shows up well informed, there is nothing a school can do about the parents refusing to vaccinate, except perhaps make the child uncomfortable, which usually leads to the family deciding to turn their back on the "education" system.

The point is, no school or insurance would agree to signing anything that suggests they take responsibility should any ill effects arise from the vaccine. They WILL let you participate in anything without the 'required' vaccination. Which just shows how full of lies the whole vaccination issue is. If it were so safe, if side effect were really that rare, why wouldn't a school/institution or insurance company sign such a slip???

I know of one case in Mississippi where the kid went through the schooling system without a single vaccination. MS only has a medical exemption, which basically means, at first sight, that unless your child is vaccinated, s/he will not be admitted to school, and you won't find a doctor in the entire state to give you one. The parents of said kid agreed to the vaccinations as long as the school (who demanded it) would sign a piece of paper that simply stated that they would take responsibility for the continued health of the child. The school never asked to show proof of vaccination again.

[Calz]

Texas has and California is about to have mandatory gardasil vaccinations for girls (and as an earlier post disclosed they are working on getting the boys on board as well).

I don't know if there are any ways around it in those states.

Last I heard there were 49 girls that had died from gardasil vaccinations. Hard to imagine the school system being held liable for that. Public school system is on life support financially as is.

[karelia]

karella- No one suggests taking recently vaccinated children away, the person enquiring has enough time to decide whether to space the injections out, or have them all at once. This is part of the preparations.

I have no idea what the rules are for travel in school groups are in the US but I do know that here in Oz the trip has to be approved by the State Education Dept and for that trip all participants must have current travel insurance, not only for health but also for property loss etc. Regulations regarding inoculations and vaccinations for every country are mandatory or advised, for re-enrty to Australia, (for us all). It is not only the school that takes responsiblity for the students, it is also the state. I do not know about private schools.

I reiterate that venturing overseas with unvaccinated students to a country with endemic exotic diseases is not a risk I would be willing to take. It is one thing to be a lone traveller but another to be responsible for the welfare of a group of children.

Check out the info on the AVN: www.avn.org.au
It has a lot of information on both vaccines and regulations in Australia.

Your last paragraph suggests that you believe vaccines to be beneficial. I urge you, for your own benefit, to study the subject in depth. Vaccines are a tool, and most certainly not one in favour of our or our animals' health.

[karelia]

Texas has and California is about to have mandatory gardasil vaccinations for girls (and as an earlier post disclosed they are working on getting the boys on board as well).

I don't know if there are any ways around it in those states.

Last I heard there were 49 girls that had died from gardasil vaccinations. Hard to imagine the school system being held liable for that. Public school system is on life support financially as is.

"Mandatory" here is MSM speak. Both states have all three exemptions, so nobody sufficiently informed is going to be vaccinated against their will.

No, of course schools aren't held responsible. When a parent takes the child to the doctor, s/he signs a form that basically states that nobody takes responsibility for any adverse events, but since they're not really happening, it's not an issue (paraphrased). The parent signs it, the child has an adverse reaction (either obviously or not so obviously), and the parent is alone with the misery.

[modwiz]

Texas has and California is about to have mandatory gardasil vaccinations for girls (and as an earlier post disclosed they are working on getting the boys on board as well).

I don't know if there are any ways around it in those states.

Last I heard there were 49 girls that had died from gardasil vaccinations. Hard to imagine the school system being held liable for that. Public school system is on life support financially as is.

Imagine, Jerry Brown signing that into law. It is invasion of the freakin' body snatchers when 'moonbeam' sells out this bad. If you needed any more proof that politics is dead and worse than useless, but dangerous, here is Exhibit A.

[Calz]

Texas has and California is about to have mandatory gardasil vaccinations for girls (and as an earlier post disclosed they are working on getting the boys on board as well).

I don't know if there are any ways around it in those states.

Last I heard there were 49 girls that had died from gardasil vaccinations. Hard to imagine the school system being held liable for that. Public school system is on life support financially as is.

Imagine, Jerry Brown signing that into law. It is invasion of the freakin' body snatchers when 'moonbeam' sells out this bad. If you needed any more proof that politics is dead and worse than useless, but dangerous, here is Exhibit A.

What?

You mean Perry (read responsible for Texas "mandating" gardasil) wouldn't make a rockin' president??? :shocked:

[Dawn]

Here is a completely different way of looking at this. From an energetic standpoint. The scientists who create these vaccines have the idea of KILLING something. Let's say that the energy of murder is injected along with the physical vaccine. Would this energy be good for the body?

If a child is born to immune parents they will pass on their immunity to their offspring. So immunization really is not necessary from this scientifically supported viewpoint.

[modwiz]

karella- No one suggests taking recently vaccinated children away, the person enquiring has enough time to decide whether to space the injections out, or have them all at once. This is part of the preparations.

I have no idea what the rules are for travel in school groups are in the US but I do know that here in Oz the trip has to be approved by the State Education Dept and for that trip all participants must have current travel insurance, not only for health but also for property loss etc. Regulations regarding inoculations and vaccinations for every country are mandatory or advised, for re-enrty to Australia, (for us all). It is not only the school that takes responsiblity for the students, it is also the state. I do not know about private schools.

I reiterate that venturing overseas with unvaccinated students to a country with endemic exotic diseases is not a risk I would be willing to take. It is one thing to be a lone traveller but another to be responsible for the welfare of a group of children.

Check out the info on the AVN: www.avn.org.au
It has a lot of information on both vaccines and regulations in Australia.

Your last paragraph suggests that you believe vaccines to be beneficial. I urge you, for your own benefit, to study the subject in depth. Vaccines are a tool, and most certainly not one in favour of our or our animals' health.

Vaccines are a form of kool aid. Those that drink it get their DNA altered. I believe those who think they are valuable should get them, but let those who wish to eschew them to do so. After all, they are immune from all of us disease-ridden, bare-back ridin' crazies.

If missing a class trip means better health for my child in their lifetime, let it be so. I went on class trips, they just sucked less than class itself. I remember all of my childhood diseases fondly. They kept me out of school for weeks at a time. At 58 my body aches sometimes, but it is better than being a kid in school. Fortunately my 15 year old seems to like it. Although, like his dad, he is a night owl and school starts too damn early.

Disclaimer: I did see 2001: A space Odyssey on a class trip on a big fancy screen with an awesome sound system in Manhattan, NYC. It was totally cool. I didn't need to get jabbed to see it either. I think it was in 1968 that I saw it.

[modwiz]

Texas has and California is about to have mandatory gardasil vaccinations for girls (and as an earlier post disclosed they are working on getting the boys on board as well).

I don't know if there are any ways around it in those states.

Last I heard there were 49 girls that had died from gardasil vaccinations. Hard to imagine the school system being held liable for that. Public school system is on life support financially as is.

Imagine, Jerry Brown signing that into law. It is invasion of the freakin' body snatchers when 'moonbeam' sells out this bad. If you needed any more proof that politics is dead and worse than useless, but dangerous, here is Exhibit A.

What?

You mean Perry (read responsible for Texas "mandating" gardasil) wouldn't make a rockin' president??? :shocked:

No! Just one good for throwing rocks at. :p

[karelia]

Vaccines are a form of kool aid. Those that drink it get their DNA altered. I believe those who think they are valuable should get them, but let those who wish to eschew them to do so.. After all, they are immune from all of us disease-ridden bare-back ridin' crazies.

Modwiz, you're my hero.

I use koolaid. Does that make me a bad person? I only use it to dye yarn when I can't get a shade right with the proper dyes. It works a treat, though.

[modwiz]

Vaccines are a form of kool aid. Those that drink it get their DNA altered. I believe those who think they are valuable should get them, but let those who wish to eschew them to do so.. After all, they are immune from all of us disease-ridden bare-back ridin' crazies.

Modwiz, you're my hero.

I use koolaid. Does that make me a bad person? I only use it to dye yarn when I can't get a shade right with the proper dyes. It works a treat, though.

Oh stop it. :becky: It is just a form of speech. Kool aid for a dye? Brilliant!

[karelia]

All those food colourings? They're acid dyes. And what's better even, they already contain the acid, so you don't even have to add vinegar or citric acid. ;)

[Samsara]

I am reading this thread with much interest. Thank you all for your input. My question was more on three vaccines (polio, tetanus, dyphteria) because of my daughter's feelings about it, but the overall think-tank about the issue of children's vaccination is noted.


My grandson, now 4 1/2, did not get any vaccines. He has a very good health for which we are grateful. The family will travel a lot, for now they go to relatively "safe places". Dad is peruvian, so they will go to Peru and other south american countries. The only reason they have not gone yet is because they want his immune system to be stronger.

Both parents have read a lot on the subject of vaccines, went to conferences, etc. Here's the question. My daughter wishes for him to have the polio, tetanus and diphteria vaccines - it is a "gut feeling" she has. She has consulted many homeopathic specialists on the subject and most agree that if they are going to travel a lot, he should have these three vaccines. Dad is more against it. They do want to find more information to help them with their choice. The only motivation here is the well-being of Alexis (my grandson). The doctor told them he could have vaccines without any adjuvant.

I personally am against vaccines. When I had my daughter, we did not have all the information we have today and they were not vaccinating as much either. I cannot know what I would have decided for my daughter if I had known what I know today...

I told them I would put the question out in Avalon to help them with their decision.

With gratitude.

Samsara


Dad's parents are pushing hard on the vaccination with the usual horror stories to back them up. I tend to not get involved unless asked to, which I am doing now by getting more information.

Our little "papito" does not get any sicker than the other vaccinated kids in daycare. He was the second child to get varicella two years ago and the people at the daycare where saying that it was because he was not vaccinated. Turned out that all the kids at the daycare got it, and most got it harder than Alexis. Makes you go hum.




I can only speak from my own experience, but I've traveled widely, including 3rd World countries. Without any vaccinations. Aside from getting the runs within days of arrival, I never had any health problems whatsoever. And more importantly, no chronic health trouble caused by vaccines.

karelia, did I hear right ? You never got any vaccination whatsoever and travelled much ?

Thank you,

Samsara

[karelia]

karelia, did I hear right ? You never got any vaccination whatsoever and travelled much ?


I had some childhood vaccines (smallpox, OPV, diphtheria and tetanus), which resulted in extremely bad hayfever, then a rhogam shot when I was pregnant 22 years ago, which led to joint pain. Since then, I've been staying away from the sick management system and fared a lot better healthwise.

[Samsara]

karelia, did I hear right ? You never got any vaccination whatsoever and travelled much ?


I had some childhood vaccines (smallpox, OPV, diphtheria and tetanus), which resulted in extremely bad hayfever, then a rhogam shot when I was pregnant 22 years ago, which led to joint pain. Since then, I've been staying away from the sick management system and fared a lot better healthwise.

Thank you for taking the time to answer. Very much appreciated.

:)