Shock Value... is it needed?

[Bongo]

Do you think that graphic content as shock value is a good thing to wake people up to what is going on in the world? i.e. People in extreme distress due to war or Dead bodies (including children) shown in videos or pictures that are quite frankly gruesome... etc etc

Me personally the words describing are enough for me to pay attention & be aware without seeing the disturbing images.

Now I am not about censorship... far from it, it should be up to peoples free will to choose if they want to view, but for this material to be accessible on websites your say not expecting it to be paraded on...

Do you think this is a good way to wake people up?

[Lord Sidious]

It depends on the audience, the message and what you are trying to achieve.

[Eagle]

Shock value to me is designed to provoke an emotional response even before the person knows what the content is, for example a “Comet is Coming”(big picture), small print, will pass by, or “12 Dead in Washington” in the streets(big picture) small print, natural gas accident.

[Ineffable Hitchhiker]

No.
What the world needs is more love, compassion, tolerance and caring and less fear mongering.

Here is something to think about....



uLSkic_kgsU

[Bongo]

It depends on the audience, the message and what you are trying to achieve.

I see your point but take the Libyan war (that they claim was not a war), there have been loads of videos with parts that show innocent casualties of these attacks & dead bodies shown on camera, now some of the dead bodies shown are of kids on these videos which always makes me feel sad & angry that these kids never got a chance at life & that our governments are bombing the s*** out of these places not caring about who gets killed & who doesn't.
I just don't think its right to be showing these dead kids on videos as shock value... its as if the film makers are trying to get you desensitised to seeing dead kids.


No.
What the world needs is more love, compassion, tolerance and caring and less fear mongering.

I'm with you 100% on that

[TWINCANS]

Greek tragedy writers always made sure that the violence was never shown onstage. There was a messenger usually who ran onstage and reported the horrible event. The reason given was that Theatre aimed to raise the audience, whereas to show violence excites the lower senses, and was therefore against the philosphy of the purpose of Art.

I learned this in English Lit study and was always sure this was correct, evne for today. But I watched as more and more the movie industry then computer gaming world broke every boundary of acceptability in this philosophy.

I wish I could remember the details/date/etc but I finally saw a serious study which showed that depicting graphic violence does the opposite of causing a empathic reaction. It puts the viewer into a place of fight-or-flight which is the lowest energy we have (the root chakkra, survival issues, subconscious urges etc) and from there humans can easiest be manipulated to be violent to each other.

[etheric underground]

De- sensitisation to graphic and traumatic scenes is one way for
the dark cabal to appropriate what they do.
The more frequent we see these images ... the more likely it is
that we arent horrified if you saw these things in real time.
And thus not making it a problem for the carnage taking place.

[Syl]

I think shock value is hard to determin, specially with the fear mongering and terrorist bs going on.. but yes, some people imo could sure as hell use some graphic violence to realise what real violence and suffering is,. we all think we know what is bad, we all think we know we are doing what is good (at least i think avalonians think and know that) but in the end most of us are stil helping perpetuating this system, be it by buying some meat, being by buying those awesome sneakers or clothes. i think still the majority part of consumer goods is still made over the backs of others,.. so no I am not in for useless violence,.. but yes let people know how it really looks when someone gets stoned, (not talking bout pot!) let people really see what happens when someone gets his brains blown out, let people see how dogs are skinned alive in china.. Make them realize this could be you.. if you realize this, i dont think you would ever want to do something likewise to someone else..

''No.
What the world needs is more love, compassion, tolerance and caring and less fear mongering.''

I agree but there is a dif between fear mongering and hardcore reality! isnt it weird, we like watching horror movies thrillers, action movies etc, which only gives a totally ****ed up suger coated impression of reality and we all think its a nice evening.. but when we see the cold reality its like.. nah lets love peace etc etc, PEOPLE, we are in this TOGETHER, torturing, killing raping, its still a part of who WE seem to be,.. saying we need love and hapiness doesnt take away the pain, closing your eyes and forgetting about it filling the void with comfort, doesnt make OUR world a better place, yours,, perhaps.

its just very double, if its ''fake violence' people can handle it, once its REAL hardcore daily ****,. its something people rather forget about. dont get me wrong i dont justify showing violence. But i think, everyone should atleast see something so ****ing gruesome once in their live, to be able to realize, what love really is, and what, never, never, ever should be experienced.

sure you think, skinning alive animals is bad, but if your coat says far trade or whatever, its ok right? sure we all know bout those 3rd world people working their asses of for our coffee and clothes. yeah sure we all understand.. well we obviously dont.

I know violence can change people for the bad.. but at this moment we have no, no right to speak, for as most of have never witnessed true violence on a such an evil and diabolical scale its incomprehensable..
offcourse those we have and are sane would never wish such things for other people.. but these people TRULY mean that.. beacause they know, and we dont. really..

somethings in reality are just what they are shocking, and its there people. FACT.

So, dont be shocked by what you see and here in the media.. be shocked about what you dont see!
Its out there, really, and its OUR reality.

try to imagine, being burned alive, try to imagine being hit by a car and getting paralyzed, try to imagine being an animal thats skinned alive,..

if i ever get kids, and lets say my son kicks me for fun, i'll kick his as back, why? not to make him suffer, but experience and realize,.. so ya, go watch that execution of that innocent gay guy in arab and watch half of his jaw get blown away.. and realize, how ****ing lucky you are! and realize how much work there still is to be done.

Being on this forum gives me good vibes yes, it may create consensus for the good, but if you truly want to change your environment for the good, one has to understand what bad is,.. not per defeniton by personal experience, but atleast a picture in general,. so one can relate and reflect as a human being.. my point is, graphic violence on itself doesnt work, its the context within its placed, its the origin of why this 'violence' is there in the first place,.. being happy happy and lovely doesnt change this..

fear, needs to be confronted to be overcome, not sugercoated because we westerners are to pussy to face reality in the end.

Are you willing to die in a revolution for the good? are you willing to sacrifice yourself in order to save many others?

sure we all debate about infity off live past lives etc... but if that would all be true in your reality.. whats the fuz about sacrificing yourself for a cause that goes beyond your lifespan?

nah, we'll never come that far, in the end we'd rather focus on whats directly around us, even though everything is constructed in such away our actions affect more than just ''around us'' but hey,..

what you cant see...


(imo, fake violence should be banned,.. its a disgrace to those we have really died,.. fake violence is the real danger, thats what numbs people down, presenting facts as shocking but telling only half the story, thats numbing down people, REAL violence, goes straight through your heart, and it will tell you alot about who you are..) Like we watch saving private ryan out of respect to those died in the 2nd world war... yeah rite,.. its bs, i guess half of the men were eager to see the scene were guts came out.. they were eager to put the dvd in their new home cinema set to check out all the cool explosions in DTS dolby whatever.. thats western reality... now thats sick! and like i said, a disgrace to those died for real)

srry for my rant..

[Bongo]

I have seen my fair share of murders, shootings & torture videos on the internet when I was younger & they didn't have that much of an effect on me but seeing something like that now absolutely would. Growing up I used to watch horror films all the time, this is what most likely had a desensitising effect on me when watching the real extreme videos but the older I get the more I can't watch this kind of thing any more. I feel myself turning away from films more & more now from people getting sore one's. I don't even watch horror films any more & I'm aware that it is fake but it still has that effect. My empathy is through the roof now, its at the stage now that I can't even comprehend just how strong it is now.

So what if the shock value violence creates fear within people after watching say, someone getting shot in the head... that can make people not act in real times of need, & I'm talking about situations that are nowhere as extreme as that, the worse case scenario gets burnt in to you & you willingly don't act due to the continuing cycle of fear & we can all do without that.

People should all be made aware of the bad things that happen, but we don't necessarily need to see the videos of the extremeness of it though.

[Syl]

you are right, you cant force people to watch violence, that would be sick.. i guess i was a bit on ranting mode, still my point is,.. violence is a LARGE part of our culture, doesnt matter if its fake, we are confronted with 'violence' everyday, lyrical, visual, physicle, even if its just being bombarded by twisted commercials,.. its just so hypocritical.. once that sh*t is real everybody is shocked, not even thinking bout what exactly happend and why.. no just, shocked by what they see thats it. But when its in the movie and some patriot waves a flag at the end of it its all cool..

what i ment to say is,.. if we want get rid violence, we have to confront it first, confront ourselfs! as we are likewise beings with likewise biological bleuprints..
Not to mention each (violent) action has a cause or reason, if we want to understand that, if we want to understand what brings people to their evil deeds,.. it starts by reflecting, looking inwards, i am you as you are me.. Emphaty, it works both ways, but when its about a killer its suddenly called profiling.. hey wait, lets make a tv series out of that!!! and show it around dinner time so peopl can watch an autopsy!!
Never heard anyone whining about that...

''So what if the shock value violence creates fear within people after watching say, someone getting shot in the head... that can make people not act in real times of need, & I'm talking about situations that are nowhere as extreme as that, the worse case scenario gets burnt in to you & you willingly don't act due to the continuing cycle of fear & we can all do without that.''

i dont think in terms of shockvalue, rather in terms of reality. I think, people will react in times of need or not either way,.. unless someone is very traumatized to begin with,.. anywhow i think in a truly dire situation, survival instincts take over and a person's true character arises.

No its not good to shock people, or force them unwillingly, still, we westerners need to face reality, WE are still perputuating all what is happening, and thanks to us, yes us, still alot of people work their ass of to suffice in our needs..

So yeah, if all backfires and WE are facing a violent confrontation,.. we had it coming.. while we consider us enlightend and share our 'intelect' on sites like these we damn well seem to know our place in the system, and we comply.

So either look from time to time what REALLY happens around the world and give it some thought, pray some.. show respect to those died for your (western) freedom! (as far as we can define freedom..)
Or cry like a baby when you are faced with suffering and violence.. while your economic system collapses,.. food and water becoming scarse.. I am not saying its happening allready FOR US, but many are still suffering for the benefits of our western way of living,.. and we know it.

Knowing is seeing? it isnt,... isnt it?

because in reality we dont really wish to see, only the things that fit our welbeing and our believe systems, and thats why we are on avalon arent we?


(srry for the sarcasm, i dont wish to offend anybody,. and all of the above counts for me aswell, but i dont turn my mind from violence when i see it, i'd rather 'profile it' to give me a better understanding of the human psyché and my own role within this very psyché we all have in common.. even if its the rotten side)

''People should all be made aware of the bad things that happen, but we don't necessarily need to see the videos of the extremeness of it though. ''

i think i agree with you :P (my primitive brain just had to rant.. still a monkey ;) ) and btw,.. i think watching all this violence eventually had a profound influence on you, i salute you for that :)