Horus-Ra as the Archontic Alien Parasite: A follow-up interview with Maarit

[Fred Steeves]

No one's coming to save us. If anyone is coming such as ET's or GODS, I doubt they will be very kind to us as history has proven. We must wake up and save ourselves......we are capable of this and we are also capable of defeating the spiritual pollution that has invaded us, corrupted us, and that has also enslaved us.....

I believe this is what the Hopi's (and some others) refer to as the purification......

The time is now.

Right on SilentFeathers! Thanking that post just wasn't good enough.

Cheers,
Fred

[donk]

Not sure where all this just came from...

Maybe from in between the lines of my posts just1, you nailed pretty much what I've been trying to do, & honestly kinda up to the point I got. I got her to acknowledge there is a problem, worked enough on it that we shared enough to see that on top of all the trauma and baggage there are energies/forces at least intensifying if not outright interfereing and interjecting more crap, and she's starting to want to learn.

Things seem to have been taking care of themselves just as I actively have been working toward (& getting her on board) solving the problem of these specific outside influences. She even started reading!! Her father beat her with books when she made a mistake reading to him, so she kinda was turned off it to it at young age. Of course it's not as intellectual and directly on the subject, but it's a start!

But it eats to the root of what I am trying to fix, which is getting past these very real & even physical blocks, at least partially external and implanted, which prevent her from her getting & retainging too much truth. & again just toward it Seems to prevent a solution, I reached out to one of my very few open minded friends about some of this, and it turns out he has had some practice in something eerily similar to Truman cash's techniques I wanted to try, but require a more subjective 3rd party...good stuff, love synchronicity sometimes!

[Chester]

Those with Unconditional Love within their hearts MUST ascend out of here. The time is NOW to do this.

Those of us who recognize the Abject Evil cannot spend even one more incarnation dwelling here within this matrix of malevolence.

http://jchiappalone.com/page1.php

All those ready to abandon the ship line up to receive your cheque and lifetime supply of Kool-Aid.

Yes, Finefeather,

For someone with so much to say with so little revelation to your understanding, I don't doubt that is how you would interpret the words of my comment.

Did you even go to the Doctor J. Chiappalone link that I provided?

Just a little research on that page, and one will clearly understand that no one is promoting the "Kool-Aid" solution.

Sometimes I wonder why I even bother posting on this Thread....

Hi Observer, what I find when reading your last few posts is that you possess a strong opinion that NOW is the time we "get out of here" and that what I gleamed from Finefeather's comment was that his opinion is that your opinion is not necessarily true. The difference between how Finefeather presents his opinion and how you present your opinion came across to me that your presentation is emotionally filled.

It has become my experience that to the degree I am emotionally charged is to the degree I am open to "archontic influence." Based on my experience and where I am at now as to the way i have found I am able to function most successfully, is to remain unemotional.

I do not achieve this state via will power. I have achieved it through my own learning experience and then application of what I learn.

My point is that I am finding myself leaning towards focusing my explorations of what may be true for me based on suggestions by folks like Finefeather who seem to have a way of remaining relatively unemotional their his exchanges.

When I read Finefeather's original response, I took it metaphorically. I was hoonestly seeing his point to be that there is no clean break an individual spirit being can accomplish. Finefeather soon clarified what he was trying to convey and I must admit I agree.

This last week I have entered into the newest point of view of everything than I have ever experienced in this lifetime. I also experienced one of the most peaceful and simultaneously productive weeks I can remember. I correlate these results to my new found point of view.

Clearly this thread since page 74 has the greatest external responsibility for stimulating my growth. But I found this new place by taking the advice of 9eagle9 and Finefeather and a few others - which has been by "going within."

justone

[wynderer]

-- i am thinking of some of the photos that Houman posted of children spreadeagled on a 'altar' w/blood everywhere -- having a little chat w/these children, encouraging them to lay down their victim mode & take their power back -- do you really think this is the answer, the way to stop this? [aside from the fact that if you did this, you might find yourself next on the 'altar' ]

i've always kind of thought that, for a truth to be applied to all, it has to be able to work for all -- if all one is dealing with is annoying astral entities that a little will power, shamanic knowlege & techniques, & maybe a bit of smudging will expel -- well, consider yourself to be among the lucky ones



9eagle9 post 1481 (I think, one at top) is sooo brilliant, well said. The worst of it though I think is the more subtle abuse, that is in nearly all relationships in our society. The passive aggression, white lies, egoistic need to keep up appearances and maintain status quo...the stuff that describes a "normal, nuclear, functional family". This is perpetuated in everything within our culture, the barely discernible victim mentality--that's the tough cookie to crack cuz as defined by "social norms", it is what most of are taught to be, taught is "good".

Maybe this has been answered, how do you "dumb" it down enough and get deeply programmed, big time denial-ist victims to hear how important it is to look within, to try seeing things a different way. On the surface they may seem "wanting to be improsined/enslaved", but deep down under the baggage trauma they show subtle signs they want out....until you hand them some truth, which the programming kicks on the emotional defenses and see it as attacks.

I know it's all about delivery, and is a delicate process where you really need to know the individual, but are there any general rules of thumb on how to start chipping away at the wall? I know it is up to each individual to look inside, but I think as communal animals by nature it is also good to help one another, even if at first they don't see it as help. In fact, I feel doing that is my calling, my purpose, and have been working on it in every interaction with others.

I find questions only (instead of telling people anything) is a way where you can do it without ever having to worry about pushing "truth" (which may be wrong or misinterpretted), it by definition forces them to look inside. Most don't like it, it is not usually comfortable, and depending on the deepness of programming many can see a simple question as attacked (when they attach a bunch of assumptions to you).

Just some thoughts, this thread is just chock full of amazingness...

[Chester]

9eagle9 post 1481 (I think, one at top) is sooo brilliant, well said. The worst of it though I think is the more subtle abuse, that is in nearly all relationships in our society. The passive aggression, white lies, egoistic need to keep up appearances and maintain status quo...the stuff that describes a "normal, nuclear, functional family". This is perpetuated in everything within our culture, the barely discernible victim mentality--that's the tough cookie to crack cuz as defined by "social norms", it is what most of are taught to be, taught is "good".

Maybe this has been answered, how do you "dumb" it down enough and get deeply programmed, big time denial-ist victims to hear how important it is to look within, to try seeing things a different way. On the surface they may seem "wanting to be improsined/enslaved", but deep down under the baggage trauma they show subtle signs they want out....until you hand them some truth, which the programming kicks on the emotional defenses and see it as attacks.

I know it's all about delivery, and is a delicate process where you really need to know the individual, but are there any general rules of thumb on how to start chipping away at the wall? I know it is up to each individual to look inside, but I think as communal animals by nature it is also good to help one another, even if at first they don't see it as help. In fact, I feel doing that is my calling, my purpose, and have been working on it in every interaction with others.

I find questions only (instead of telling people anything) is a way where you can do it without ever having to worry about pushing "truth" (which may be wrong or misinterpretted), it by definition forces them to look inside. Most don't like it, it is not usually comfortable, and depending on the deepness of programming many can see a simple question as attacked (when they attach a bunch of assumptions to you).

Just some thoughts, this thread is just chock full of amazingness...

Honestly, just about everything you spilled out in this post has crossed my mind over the last few days. I am not kidding... it is like we are linked right now. Pretty cool huh? It has been an amazing ride the last few weeks. Thanks for posting and being here with us. justone

[Chester]

-- i am thinking of some of the photos that Houman posted of children spreadeagled on a 'altar' w/blood everywhere -- having a little chat w/these children, encouraging them to lay down their victim mode & take their power back -- do you really think this is the answer, the way to stop this? [aside from the fact that if you did this, you might find yourself next on the 'altar' ]

i've always kind of thought that, for a truth to be applied to all, it has to be able to work for all -- if all one is dealing with is annoying astral entities that a little will power, shamanic knowlege & techniques, & maybe a bit of smudging will expel -- well, consider yourself to be among the lucky ones



9eagle9 post 1481 (I think, one at top) is sooo brilliant, well said. The worst of it though I think is the more subtle abuse, that is in nearly all relationships in our society. The passive aggression, white lies, egoistic need to keep up appearances and maintain status quo...the stuff that describes a "normal, nuclear, functional family". This is perpetuated in everything within our culture, the barely discernible victim mentality--that's the tough cookie to crack cuz as defined by "social norms", it is what most of are taught to be, taught is "good".

Maybe this has been answered, how do you "dumb" it down enough and get deeply programmed, big time denial-ist victims to hear how important it is to look within, to try seeing things a different way. On the surface they may seem "wanting to be improsined/enslaved", but deep down under the baggage trauma they show subtle signs they want out....until you hand them some truth, which the programming kicks on the emotional defenses and see it as attacks.

I know it's all about delivery, and is a delicate process where you really need to know the individual, but are there any general rules of thumb on how to start chipping away at the wall? I know it is up to each individual to look inside, but I think as communal animals by nature it is also good to help one another, even if at first they don't see it as help. In fact, I feel doing that is my calling, my purpose, and have been working on it in every interaction with others.

I find questions only (instead of telling people anything) is a way where you can do it without ever having to worry about pushing "truth" (which may be wrong or misinterpretted), it by definition forces them to look inside. Most don't like it, it is not usually comfortable, and depending on the deepness of programming many can see a simple question as attacked (when they attach a bunch of assumptions to you).

Just some thoughts, this thread is just chock full of amazingness...

For what it is worth, if we cannot move beyond the emotionally charged outrage of the reality of these practices, I doubt we can ever find solution. - just one opinion from justoneman

[SilentFeathers]

- if all one is dealing with is annoying astral entities that a little will power, shamanic knowlege & techniques, & maybe a bit of smudging will expel -- well, consider yourself to be among the lucky ones

Perhaps if done correctly, with the proper intention, and with the collective human energy level involved to a large extent, that may very well be all it would take to eradicate ourselves from these invaders/parasites.

A conscious message sent out in to the universe that they are not welcomed here and that their attempts or efforts to interfere here in the future will be futile/or threatening to their existence, may very well also prevent future "infections" or "visits".

As it stands now they pretty much have free reign here and are more or less welcomed here. Our ignorance is their bliss.....and they are much more than annoying little pests.

[Chester]

- if all one is dealing with is annoying astral entities that a little will power, shamanic knowlege & techniques, & maybe a bit of smudging will expel -- well, consider yourself to be among the lucky ones

Perhaps if done correctly, with the proper intention, and with the collective human energy level involved to a large extent, that may very well be all it would take to eradicate ourselves from these invaders/parasites.

A conscious message sent out in to the universe that they are not welcomed here and that their attempts or efforts to interfere here in the future will be futile/or threatening to their existence, may very well also prevent future "infections" or "visits".

As it stands now they pretty much have free reign here and are more or less welcomed here. Our ignorance is their bliss.....and they are much more than annoying little pests.

Or perhaps by changing ourselves (collectively) "the food supply" changes and they either seek their "food" elsewhere or they adapt to the new form of "food." Perhaps if they adapt, they also change and perhaps the whole level of the of the interaction is raised and perhaps this would be what many might later say was the "true ascension." Why not?

...meaning instead of experiencing a gradual growth via many many lifetimes of experience at the individual level, we instigate and succeed in creating a true, massive shift in the dynamic we currently experience.

Instead of seeing the Archons as "them" and we "their targets" as "us" we consider the all that is a giant "us" which offers "them" the opportunity to come along with "us." By seeing this possibility, I also see we exclude the very energies many of us seem to cling to which at least at my own individual level of being, I am fully responsible for. justone

[wynderer]

hi Justoneman -- from your post:

'For what it is worth, if we cannot move beyond the emotionally charged outrage of the reality of these practices, I doubt we can ever find solution.' - just one opinion from justoneman

i really am not trying to be Mary, Mary, quite contrary -- tho my posts may seem as if this is my chosen Avalon mission

re your post above, here's another contrary p.o.v. -- Karla Turner said that the one Human emotion the abducting ETS really don't like is anger -- these ETs are connected to the archons in some way -- there's a righteous anger that is a natural & empowering energy when facing evil/injustice/cruelty, imo

wyn

[Chester]

-- i am thinking of some of the photos that Houman posted of children spreadeagled on a 'altar' w/blood everywhere -- having a little chat w/these children, encouraging them to lay down their victim mode & take their power back -- do you really think this is the answer, the way to stop this? [aside from the fact that if you did this, you might find yourself next on the 'altar' ]

i've always kind of thought that, for a truth to be applied to all, it has to be able to work for all -- if all one is dealing with is annoying astral entities that a little will power, shamanic knowledge & techniques, & maybe a bit of smudging will expel -- well, consider yourself to be among the lucky ones



9eagle9 post 1481 (I think, one at top) is sooo brilliant, well said. The worst of it though I think is the more subtle abuse, that is in nearly all relationships in our society. The passive aggression, white lies, egoistic need to keep up appearances and maintain status quo...the stuff that describes a "normal, nuclear, functional family". This is perpetuated in everything within our culture, the barely discernible victim mentality--that's the tough cookie to crack cuz as defined by "social norms", it is what most of are taught to be, taught is "good".

Maybe this has been answered, how do you "dumb" it down enough and get deeply programmed, big time denial-ist victims to hear how important it is to look within, to try seeing things a different way. On the surface they may seem "wanting to be improsined/enslaved", but deep down under the baggage trauma they show subtle signs they want out....until you hand them some truth, which the programming kicks on the emotional defenses and see it as attacks.

I know it's all about delivery, and is a delicate process where you really need to know the individual, but are there any general rules of thumb on how to start chipping away at the wall? I know it is up to each individual to look inside, but I think as communal animals by nature it is also good to help one another, even if at first they don't see it as help. In fact, I feel doing that is my calling, my purpose, and have been working on it in every interaction with others.

I find questions only (instead of telling people anything) is a way where you can do it without ever having to worry about pushing "truth" (which may be wrong or misinterpretted), it by definition forces them to look inside. Most don't like it, it is not usually comfortable, and depending on the deepness of programming many can see a simple question as attacked (when they attach a bunch of assumptions to you).

Just some thoughts, this thread is just chock full of amazingness...

I understand your point and have held firm to the same view up until recently and here is what I mean and as the well known saying goes, "You can lead a horse to water, but you cannot make the horse drink."

And this has been the point 9eagle9 and Finefeather have been making each in their own way. I finally, recently heard this loud and clear and have been exploring the acceptance of this possibility and mind you, I have achieved, so far, a whole new experience that has been almost 100% void of any direct conflict - something impressive and new for me.

justoneman

[observer]

Let me then ask you if you could explain that sentence in your own words so I can understand why you have come to that conclusion.
Or if you cannot, link or copy the section of the site you suggested, or must I read the whole site to find this one answer?


I once believed that the entire Mass of Humanity needed to be involved in the ascension back to the 'Great Spirit'. I once thought the participation of every one of the Mass of Humanity was required to effectively return to the God of Unconditional Love. I once believed this was the only way to stop the vile obscenity of this particular universe.

My understanding has evolved. I no longer believe this particular third density can, or should be saved. It is obvious to any critically thinking individual that this place is a place of Abject Evil.

I have spent many years (nearly 50 years, now) discovering the work of the Archons/Reptiles/Anunnaki who are credited with the creation of Humanity. In the course of that discovery, I have come to understand the Human Race was created to be a 'container (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTRFhrAr8us&list=PL550409580D9BB2C5&index=1&feature=plpp_video)' for the soul that we grow, here in this particular density. [move timer in link over to the 1 min., 20 sec. mark, and listen thru to the 2:00 min. mark.]

This soul growing process is a food source for the hyperdimensional reptilian entities that control this particular third density.

The foundational structure of this particular three dimensional universe is the result of electromagnetic frequencies. These frequencies are, and have been since the Dawn of Man, manipulated by these Abject Evil entities that operate this farming operation.

These electromagnetic frequencies are soon to be turned-off as an experiment gone wild. This Abject Evil cannot.... shall not.... will not be allowed to continue. I call on all those who understand what I'm saying to wake-up.

There are no emotions involved in what I'm saying, justoneman. What I'm saying is a point of fact from the evidence I've spent 50 years discovering. These evidential trails cannot be interpreted in one single link. That's the reason I always post a link of relevance to whatever I comment.

The message is quite simple. This must be the last incarnation any entity seeking a return to the God of Unconditional Love can spend here locked within this maya. If what I'm saying has no resonance with you, simply stop listening. Otherwise, do the research that I offer.

http://web.archive.org/web/20011216215323/http://www.alphalink.com.au/~jdm/Essays/Tm.htm

[SilentFeathers]

Or perhaps by changing ourselves (collectively) "the food supply" changes and they either seek their "food" elsewhere or they adapt to the new form of "food." Perhaps if they adapt, they also change and perhaps the whole level of the of the interaction is raised and perhaps this would be what many might later say was the "true ascension." Why not?


I personally do not believe that there is any adapting and working in a productive or beneficial way with these critters....

Taking away our food supply we would not be able to survive eating rocks, they would run in to the same problem IMO.

This little pebble called Earth is OUR home, not theirs......at least in my mind that's what I think about it.

[Hervé]

My, my, my... how to get to the bottom, basic, fundamental line of what's ailing this planet and her inhabitants?

Let me borrow a few paragraphs from Laura Knight-Jadczyk's The Cassiopaean Experiment:


What amazes us is the sudden turn from the rational beginning to the irrational illusion. Irrationality and illusion are revealed by the intolerance and cruelty with which they are expressed. We observe that human thought systems show tolerance as long as they adhere to reality. The more the thought process is removed from reality, the more intolerance and cruelty are needed to guarantee its continued existence. [Ether, God and Devil, Wilhelm Reich]


Castaneda's "Predator":
"We have a predator that came from the depths of the cosmos and took over the rule of our lives. Human beings are its prisoners. [...] You have arrived, by your effort alone, to what the shamans of ancient Mexico called the topic of topics. I have been beating around the bush all this time, insinuating to you that something is holding us prisoner. Indeed we are held prisoner! This was an energetic fact for the sorcerers of ancient Mexico. [...] They took over because we are food for them, and they squeeze us mercilessly because we are their sustenance. Just as we rear chickens in chicken coops, the predators rear us in human coops. Therefore, their food is always available to them.' [...]

"'I want to appeal to your analytical mind, ' don Juan said. 'Think for a moment, and tell me how you would explain the contradiction between the intelligence of man the engineer and the stupidity of his systems of beliefs, or the stupidity of his contradictory behavior. Sorcerers believe that the predators have given us our systems of beliefs, our ideas of good and evil, our social mores. They are the ones who set up our hopes and expectations and dreams of success or failure. They have given us covetousness, greed and cowardice. It is the predators who make us complacent, routinary, and egomaniacal.' [...]

"In order to keep us obedient and meek and weak, the predators engaged themselves in a stupendous maneuver - stupendous, of course, from the point of view of a fighting strategist. A horrendous maneuver from the point of view of those who suffer it. They gave us their mind! Do you hear me? The predators give us their mind, which becomes our mind. The predators' mind is baroque, contradictory, morose, filled with the fear of being discovered any minute now. [...]

"Through the mind, which, after all, is their mind, the predators inject into the lives of human beings whatever is convenient for them." [Castaneda, The Active Side of Infinity, 1998, pp. 213-220]


How's that possible?

MKultra and satanic types of mind control give an idea of how it can be done... even how an individual can inherit more than one "mind" when exhibiting different personalities which are "unaware" of each other's existence within a singular body. Hence , for the "social personality facade," all these other personalities and behaviours are part of its "unconscious" and is totally unaware of their existence... only aware of "missing time" when other personalities take over when triggered into manifestation/existence.

Hypnotism and post-hypnotic commands give us a clue as to irrational behaviours occurring on cues (which are akin to alternate personalities) and which 9eagle9 keeps pointing out on this forum.

Truman Cash's books "The Programming of a Planet" and "Eye of Ra" document his research on how such a mind control programming occurs planet-wide and has been occurring for times immemorial.

Steve Richards (http://www.holographickinetics.net/default.html) gives the overall law of LORE that explains the "feeding loop" that keeps growing once an entity/thought form has been given "birth," a simple matter of "survival" in the same fashion as for golems or tulpas.

Post # 1357 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=529642&viewfull=1#post529642) delineates how the same, identical "mind" has been hypnotically implanted into the population of an entire sector of this galaxy -- 250 billion souls -- that's the R6 "mind." Complete with all sorts of religions, gods and devils; archons included... so that whatever portion of the population which falls under a particular aspect or "personality" of that R6 "mind" becomes a matter of statistics.

As 9eagle9 keeps emphasizing, such a mind can only "replicate" and cannot create on its own. However, the creative abilities of the implanted billions of souls have been bound into "creating" the replications... on a "protest." The triggering of the content of that "mind" into manifestation is currently being heavily pushed all around in the MSM and alt. media (see this post (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?48358-2012-Light-Flashes-Lucifer-and-symbols....&p=535408&viewfull=1#post535408) <--) ["...they only respond to R6 symbols"].

In the vein of the latter, I wish that the people who are having these "visions" of tsunamis, devastating earthquakes, volcanic eruptions, etc... could have enough "presence d'Esprit" to dig beyond that vision and find out who are the producers, directors, art directors, etc... of the "productions" since it seems many of the militaries are following up on that "vision" and retiring in the Ozarks, etc... indicating that the military hierarchy is thoroughly "impressed" with those specific "outcomes."

I wish that some clarity as to what these "visions" actually are could be ascertained because reading Bill's posting (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?36083-Mitchell-Coombes-Does-he-really-have-access-to-insider-info&p=534533&viewfull=1#post534533) of Andamans just moving to higher grounds prior to the 2004 "Boxing Day" tsunami indicates that they just got on moving based on an "actuality" as compared to the "virtuality" of a "vision" that's being kept "alive" and perpetuated over and over.

As a conclusion, these "ETs" claiming "it is all our fault for being in such a mess" are not actually lying... they are just omitting that they gave us their concocted "mind' which started the whole mess.

[gripreaper]

We acquiesce to the energy vampirism every day. We are slaves on a prison planet and most do not even know it, and somewhat feel comfortable with their slavery, which has been conditioned as the "way things are" and they never question it.

Until we each individually decide that we will do everything in our power not to give our energy away to the Archon's, then yes, their food supply does not begin to dry up. This declaration and motion to conserve and hold our energy, operate from our own power, requires a completely new vision, rejecting EVERYTHING we have ever been taught as the lie that it is.

All religions, governments, universities, economies, corporations, attorneys and judges, are all part of the system of energy vampirism. It begins with every little step and every little decision we make. Stop feeding the banksters by going into debt, stop eating their rotten food and stop drinking their tainted water. Stop entering into adhesion contracts with the state through marriage licenses, drivers licenses, and 1040 tax forms. Just stop signing documents in any way you can. If you still must work for Federal Reserve Notes, spend them wisely on things which enhance life locally.

It's a decision of the self. The collective will resonate with your new energy only when it emanates enough for them to feel it.

[wynderer]

hi Amzer Zo -- re this from your post:

In the vein of the latter, I wish that the people who are having these "visions" of tsunamis, devastating earthquakes, volcanic eruptions, etc... could have enough "presence d'Esprit" to dig beyond that vision and find out who are the producers, directors, art directors, etc... of the "productions" since it seems many of the militaries are following up on that "vision" and retiring in the Ozarks, etc... indicating that the military hierarchy is thoroughly "impressed" with those specific "outcomes."

there's a book, 'Warriors of the Rainbow,' by Vinson Brown -- part of it is a collection of the prophecies of indigenous peoples thruout the world, speaking of these times & the changes coming -- most familiar are those of the Hopi Elders, i think

edit to add: these prophecies speak of big changes coming to Earth, catastrophic to Humans & other bio entities

personally i agree w/Observer, that this time, right here & now, is the beginning of the end -- the opportunity for Earth Humans to change things has come & gone -- i'd say the biggest contribution Earth Humans have made to what is coming is self-centeredness --

having been a peaceful political activist for all sorts of glaring peace & justice violations all over this planet for most of my life -- when young & really dumb, i thought, 'Hey! if i let others know that [this] is going on, they'll get outraged, too, & together we can stop it!' -- NOT! -- as i have learned , most Humans are only concerned about bad stuff not happening to them -- it seems if most can maintain a comfy little cocoon, they're fine w/others being tortured/killed/starved/etc

the time of reckoning for choices made thru lifetimes is drawing near -- a heart that truly cares for others [aka compassion -- from the root 'to suffer with' ] is the only way out, imo


My, my, my... how to get to the bottom, basic, fundamental line of what's ailing this planet and her inhabitants?

Let me borrow a few paragraphs from Laura Knight-Jadczyk's The Cassiopaean Experiment:


What amazes us is the sudden turn from the rational beginning to the irrational illusion. Irrationality and illusion are revealed by the intolerance and cruelty with which they are expressed. We observe that human thought systems show tolerance as long as they adhere to reality. The more the thought process is removed from reality, the more intolerance and cruelty are needed to guarantee its continued existence. [Ether, God and Devil, Wilhelm Reich]


Castaneda's "Predator":
"We have a predator that came from the depths of the cosmos and took over the rule of our lives. Human beings are its prisoners. [...] You have arrived, by your effort alone, to what the shamans of ancient Mexico called the topic of topics. I have been beating around the bush all this time, insinuating to you that something is holding us prisoner. Indeed we are held prisoner! This was an energetic fact for the sorcerers of ancient Mexico. [...] They took over because we are food for them, and they squeeze us mercilessly because we are their sustenance. Just as we rear chickens in chicken coops, the predators rear us in human coops. Therefore, their food is always available to them.' [...]

"'I want to appeal to your analytical mind, ' don Juan said. 'Think for a moment, and tell me how you would explain the contradiction between the intelligence of man the engineer and the stupidity of his systems of beliefs, or the stupidity of his contradictory behavior. Sorcerers believe that the predators have given us our systems of beliefs, our ideas of good and evil, our social mores. They are the ones who set up our hopes and expectations and dreams of success or failure. They have given us covetousness, greed and cowardice. It is the predators who make us complacent, routinary, and egomaniacal.' [...]

"In order to keep us obedient and meek and weak, the predators engaged themselves in a stupendous maneuver - stupendous, of course, from the point of view of a fighting strategist. A horrendous maneuver from the point of view of those who suffer it. They gave us their mind! Do you hear me? The predators give us their mind, which becomes our mind. The predators' mind is baroque, contradictory, morose, filled with the fear of being discovered any minute now. [...]

"Through the mind, which, after all, is their mind, the predators inject into the lives of human beings whatever is convenient for them." [Castaneda, The Active Side of Infinity, 1998, pp. 213-220]


How's that possible?

MKultra and satanic types of mind control give an idea of how it can be done... even how an individual can inherit more than one "mind" when exhibiting different personalities which are "unaware" of each other's existence within a singular body. Hence , for the "social personality facade," all these other personalities and behaviours are part of its "unconscious" and is totally unaware of their existence... only aware of "missing time" when other personalities take over when triggered into manifestation/existence.

Hypnotism and post-hypnotic commands give us a clue as to irrational behaviours occurring on cues (which are akin to alternate personalities) and which 9eagle9 keeps pointing out on this forum.

Truman Cash's books "The Programming of a Planet" and "Eye of Ra" document his research on how such a mind control programming occurs planet-wide and has been occurring for times immemorial.

Steve Richards (http://www.holographickinetics.net/default.html) gives the overall law of LORE that explains the "feeding loop" that keeps growing once an entity/thought form has been given "birth," a simple matter of "survival" in the same fashion as for golems or tulpas.

Post # 1357 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=529642&viewfull=1#post529642) delineates how the same, identical "mind" has been hypnotically implanted into the population of an entire sector of this galaxy -- 250 billion souls -- that's the R6 "mind." Complete with all sorts of religions, gods and devils; archons included... so that whatever portion of the population which falls under a particular aspect or "personality" of that R6 "mind" becomes a matter of statistics.

As 9eagle9 keeps emphasizing, such a mind can only "replicate" and cannot create on its own. However, the creative abilities of the implanted billions of souls have been bound into "creating" the replications... on a "protest." The triggering of the content of that "mind" into manifestation is currently being heavily pushed all around in the MSM and alt. media (see this post (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?48358-2012-Light-Flashes-Lucifer-and-symbols....&p=535408&viewfull=1#post535408) <--) ["...they only respond to R6 symbols"].

In the vein of the latter, I wish that the people who are having these "visions" of tsunamis, devastating earthquakes, volcanic eruptions, etc... could have enough "presence d'Esprit" to dig beyond that vision and find out who are the producers, directors, art directors, etc... of the "productions" since it seems many of the militaries are following up on that "vision" and retiring in the Ozarks, etc... indicating that the military hierarchy is thoroughly "impressed" with those specific "outcomes."

I wish that some clarity as to what these "visions" actually are could be ascertained because reading Bill's posting (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?36083-Mitchell-Coombes-Does-he-really-have-access-to-insider-info&p=534533&viewfull=1#post534533) of Andamans just moving to higher grounds prior to the 2004 "Boxing Day" tsunami indicates that they just got on moving based on an "actuality" as compared to the "virtuality" of a "vision" that's being kept "alive" and perpetuated over and over.

As a conclusion, these "ETs" claiming "it is all our fault for being in such a mess" are not actually lying... they are just omitting that they gave us their concocted "mind' which started the whole mess.

[Chester]

hi Justoneman -- from your post:

'For what it is worth, if we cannot move beyond the emotionally charged outrage of the reality of these practices, I doubt we can ever find solution.' - just one opinion from justoneman

i really am not trying to be Mary, Mary, quite contrary -- tho my posts may seem as if this is my chosen Avalon mission

re your post above, here's another contrary p.o.v. -- Karla Turner said that the one Human emotion the abducting ETS really don't like is anger -- these ETs are connected to the archons in some way -- there's a righteous anger that is a natural & empowering energy when facing evil/injustice/cruelty, imo

wyn

Maybe true for some - at this time anger is not positive for me. I had to move through the anger and out the other side to be comfortable with the me I have recently become. I am doubtful I will ever again revisit that anger. I do not exclude sadness, but the odds are very high against my re visitation of anger.

My life experience and then this thread, through which I went into deeply... into each and every image and did so ingest the harshest of images Houman was able to post (or link to) and made myself get "through the anger" because my inner judgement said that for me to be affective in any real way, I had to.

Does this mean that I am now and forever will be immune to anger? Of course not. But as for my past experiences (laced with mistakes of my own creation) I am no longer angry with myself. I also no longer feel some outside agency that is not in some way connected with the totality has caused me any harm whatsoever. I see how I brought on all my experiences be they judged as good or bad. By reaching this point, I discovered my self created role as victim has also vanished, at least for now.

I am only relating my experiences such that if someone wants to experiment with a point of view I may share, and it helps them, then good for us all. I have no care as to anyone agreeing with anything I say.

As for pulling out a name such as the revered Karla Turner whom clearly i respect, I doubt she would insist that everyone adopt her views in full and exclude views she does not share in full. As for some of her disciples, I happen to have a few one on one relationships and somehow those relationships are going well and we are able to share our views and we are able to agree to disagree.

The bottom line is, what works for one of us does not necessarily have to work for another.

Based on what most of us humans jabber about, that we wish to experience a world of peace, it is hard for me to reconcile that holding onto any anger gets us there, but that is simply and only my logic.

I wish you well, Wynderer, I wish us all well... justoneman

[wynderer]

all Karla said was that the Greys & Reptilians, etc, don't like Human anger -- we can all make of that what we want, i guess -- personally i have been fighting/resisting my abductors from the git-go -- my anger empowers me -- it does not demolish them

PS -- anger & love can co-exist -- thinking of that Earth First! saying:

Love + Anger = Action

[gripreaper]

Maybe true for some - at this time anger is not positive for me. I had to move through the anger and out the other side to be comfortable with the me I have recently become. I am doubtful I will ever again revisit that anger. I do not exclude sadness, but the odds are very high against my re visitation of anger.

To me, anger is a manifestation of a massive spike in life force energy which is judged and directed outward towards an object which this energy spike can be released into for quick relief from the agitation such a spike in life force causes.

The alternative, would be to recognize this concentrated amount of life force as positive and direct it towards an internal process of healing and not judge it, marginalize it, and release it onto someone or something external.

Since life force is of the fire element, sadness is an attempt to pour water on this element and put it out. Sadness is also a way to judge and marginalize the life force.

[edit]Or you could just feed this life force to the Archon's like most of us do. ;)

[wynderer]

i don't have a problem w/'judging' -- i know i am not the Creator, but the Creator gave me a mind & a heart to use -- i 'judge' the rituals to be a gross violation of free will, w/quite a bit of gratuitous cruelty thrown in -- & i 'judge' my abductions to be a gross violation of my own free will




Maybe true for some - at this time anger is not positive for me. I had to move through the anger and out the other side to be comfortable with the me I have recently become. I am doubtful I will ever again revisit that anger. I do not exclude sadness, but the odds are very high against my re visitation of anger.

To me, anger is a manifestation of a massive spike in life force energy which is judged and directed outward towards an object which this energy spike can be released into for quick relief from the agitation such a spike in life force causes.

The alternative, would be to recognize this concentrated amount of life force as positive and direct it towards an internal process of healing and not judge it, marginalize it, and release it onto someone or something external.

Since life force is of the fire element, sadness is an attempt to pour water on this element and put it out. Sadness is also a way to judge and marginalize the life force.

[Hervé]

hi Amzer Zo -- re this from your post:

In the vein of the latter, I wish that the people who are having these "visions" of tsunamis, devastating earthquakes, volcanic eruptions, etc... could have enough "presence d'Esprit" to dig beyond that vision and find out who are the producers, directors, art directors, etc... of the "productions" since it seems many of the militaries are following up on that "vision" and retiring in the Ozarks, etc... indicating that the military hierarchy is thoroughly "impressed" with those specific "outcomes."

there's a book, 'Warriors of the Rainbow,' by Vinson Brown -- part of it is a collection of the prophecies of indigenous peoples thruout the world...

[...]

Hi wynderer,

The point I was trying to make was that the Andamans didn't follow a "book of prophecies," they just moved, all of them, from the direct perception of an imminent actuality rather than due to a "virtuality" implanted in their "mind" eons ago.

The other point I was trying to make is that due to that handed-over "mind" from the predators, we -- the whole planet -- are boxing with our own shadows whether it's religions, gods, devils, evils, archons, blood suckers, energy suckers, vampires etc... since all these shadows are the unconscious manifestations of "our" "mind" we were handed down and which we are "happily" and "unconsciously" energizing and fuelling perpetually.

[gripreaper]

we -- the whole planet -- are boxing with our own shadows whether it's religions, gods, devils, evils, archons, blood suckers, energy suckers, vampires etc... since all these shadows are the unconscious manifestations of "our" "mind" we were handed down and which we are "happily" and "unconsciously" energizing and fuelling perpetually.

This is very profound. We are part of that which we seek to extract. We must own this or we will not be able to integrate it.

[Hervé]

we -- the whole planet -- are boxing with our own shadows whether it's religions, gods, devils, evils, archons, blood suckers, energy suckers, vampires etc... since all these shadows are the unconscious manifestations of "our" "mind" we were handed down and which we are "happily" and "unconsciously" energizing and fuelling perpetually.

This is very profound. We are part of that which we seek to extract. We must own this or we will not be able to integrate it.

Thanks grip, :ballchain: glad to see someone who admittedly "got it."

[9eagle9]

They are using children to gain power. Anyone can kidnap a child it doesn't take a particularly powerful occultist to do so. If more people were not in denial of this topic, those abductions would eventually cease. It is our own choice for ignorance and the choice for being passive towards such things that allows their perpetration.

What is sad is we have a part to play in their enpowerment.

But when I attempt to convey to people how we can over ride their power, I get nothing but resistance to the idea.



from 9Eagle9:
'That is giving them too much power.'

i think you were addressing this to me, as you quoted my post below yours -- i'm not clear what you mean by giving them too much power -- the fact is, they do have a lot of power -- the children kidnapped to be used in the rituals are completely powerless in their hands

way earlier in this thread, i'd posted about being sent, thru my job, to a multi-county law enforcement personnel conference re the 3,000 children who disappeared in one yr alone from Westchester County in NY State -- that's a lot of power, too, to be able to take that many children who disappear forever -- & that was just in one county, in one state, in one country -- & we don't even have a nice juicy war going on, when it is so easy for them to pick & choose which children

[wynderer]

thanks for response, Amzer Zo -- now i see the point on which we disagree

i do not see them as [from your post ] :
' the unconscious manifestations of "our" "mind" '

-- i see them -- the Reptilians, the Greys, the demonic beings i have had the misfortune to meet, etc -- as very real beings from other dimensions, or perhaps from elsewhere in our 3D universe

i think it is 'Humanism' which sees Humans as the center of all perceptions/interpretations of life? -- every now & then, talking w/someone by phone, in person, thru the net -- i sometimes think i get a flash of seeing that this belief system is deeply ingrained in Humans -- & i see that this is very detrimental /a great hindrance to understanding the multi-dimensional Universe we live in

wyn



hi Amzer Zo -- re this from your post:

In the vein of the latter, I wish that the people who are having these "visions" of tsunamis, devastating earthquakes, volcanic eruptions, etc... could have enough "presence d'Esprit" to dig beyond that vision and find out who are the producers, directors, art directors, etc... of the "productions" since it seems many of the militaries are following up on that "vision" and retiring in the Ozarks, etc... indicating that the military hierarchy is thoroughly "impressed" with those specific "outcomes."

there's a book, 'Warriors of the Rainbow,' by Vinson Brown -- part of it is a collection of the prophecies of indigenous peoples thruout the world...

[...]

Hi wynderer,

The point I was trying to make was that the Andamans didn't follow a "book of prophecies," they just moved, all of them, from the direct perception of an imminent actuality rather than due to a "virtuality" implanted in their "mind" eons ago.

The other point I was trying to make is that due to that handed-over "mind" from the predators, we -- the whole planet -- are boxing with our own shadows whether it's religions, gods, devils, evils, archons, blood suckers, energy suckers, vampires etc... since all these shadows are the unconscious manifestations of "our" "mind" we were handed down and which we are "happily" and "unconsciously" energizing and fuelling perpetually.

[9eagle9]

Hello Daughter of Time,

Yesterday was the first time I visited this thread because I didn't want to know about dark forces out there.....'


Is what I was referring to.




Like what WhiteCrowBlackDeer said, I was afraid to look at the negative side of things..

A point of clarification: The above is a misleading statement. I'm always processing the negative side of things, so much so I am a complete bore. I walked away from a secure job of 27 years, in 2004, just to complete this process and learn why am I here? What's next...and all that rot...

Stating more clearly "archon" is new information for me. I didn't want one more thing added to my already full plate of clearing off, so I can invite only what works for me today.

I'm learning that there's a distinct possibility that I was raised by an archon and there's a good possibility that I have a couple of psychopathic sisters. Which explains why 'Love and Light' ain't the way to go. And why I am the big joke in the family. (on some levels)

IMO, I'm one of the many brave ones that know when to take a stand. I have demonstrated that over and over in my life.

............Going, going, gone..........................................:car:

:wave:



UPDATE: I can't find in my post where I said, "...I was afraid to look at the negative side of things."

If this is what you were referencing from post #1477 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=536126&viewfull=1#post536126):

P.S. I'll save for another time that I have experiences of my 'invisible family friends when I was younger. I believe them to be my Star Family. They'd come to visit exactly at 2:10 a.m. But this thread and some others have made me silent and look within for parts I may have forgotten. My gut says that they were what helped me be strong. I just didn't want anyone to take that away from me by posting it here.

It is a poorly constructed sentence. "But this thread and some others have made me silent and look within for parts I may have forgotten."

I had only been on PA forum a couple of week (one and only experience on a forum) and got brave enough to share my Star Family experience. One person took things out of context with each additional post. And then tried to make me understand that we are All One. I ended up deleting the posts. I learned that it wasn't worth having to explain my Truth to someone that continued to use it for his/her 'gain'.

[Hervé]

thanks for response, Amzer Zo -- now i see the point on which we disagree

i do not see them as [from your post ] :
' the unconscious manifestations of "our" "mind" '

-- i see them -- the Reptilians, the Greys, the demonic beings i have had the misfortune to meet, etc -- as very real beings from other dimensions, or perhaps from elsewhere in our 3D universe

[...]

Then -- maybe? -- you are "missing" Steve Richards' input in this: "Everything is alive!" Meaning that in the same ways as golems and tulpas come to take a life and shape on their own and can take form in physical 3D, so do all these generated thoughts and trapped energies... they become VERY REAL!

[9eagle9]

Yes everything is alive. Lots of thing are not living the way we are . I'm not alive the way a jelly fish is. Its body is less dense, less complex, its consciousness I'm sure is not the same. A tree is having its animated experience differently . Because they are not alive like we are doesn't mean they are not alive.

We know how these things work by intimately examining ourselves. We don't know when we created some of these things, it may have been in other lives. Like leaving psychic fragments out there for other's to leverage. Our thoughtforms change all the time. I'm pretty sure people 200 years ago weren't thinking of buying a Ford.

As we grow more complex so do the things we unwittingly bring to life.

It's a matter of perception, Wynderer sees the ptb as powerful and I see them as rather feeble in expression.... compared to mine.

[Houman]

They are using children to gain power. Anyone can kidnap a child it doesn't take a particularly powerful occultist to do so. If more people were not in denial of this topic, those abductions would eventually cease. It is our own choice for ignorance and the choice for being passive towards such things that allows their perpetration.


No wonder why F. Springmeier got framed, this is from his book
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/bloodlines/rockefeller.htm

...The Rockefellers were involved in the creation of the FBI, so that the FBI has always been an arm of power for the Illuminati. That is why there are official FBI programs in action today to kidnap children and provide them for sacrifice. Yes, American people, the wolf was set in charge of guarding the chicken coop. The organization that is working as part of the FBI is the Finders. (The stink was so bad that US. News & World Report did a story to soften the impact of the scandal. See the article on a following page.)

Ex-Satanists who worked with the FBI to receive the children the FBI kidnapped and sold to them for sacrifice have been trying to get the word out publicly about the FBI’s corruption. When the Illuminati was beginning to get exposed in the Franklin Saving & Loan case in Lincoln, NE the FBI was part of the dirty actors and was part of the cover up. The Rockefellers have had control over the FBI since they helped get it started. When Congress wanted to investigate the CIA for wrongdoing the appointed a Commission headed by Rockefeller to investigate the CIA’s wrongdoings! Yes, the Rockefeller Commission did a big study and slapped the hands of the CIA for a few misdeeds. Their report is still cited as the big investigation of the CIA. Some investigation! Since the Rockefeller family work hand in hand with the CIA to create Monarch slaves, of course that part of the CIA’s misdeeds got overlooked!

A recent convert from Satanism, Michael McArthur, has given validated inside information about the FBI and the CIA programs which kidnap children in order to supply Satanic rituals with sacrificial material. The names of the agents who spend their official government time kidnapping children for Satanism that Michael knows about are as follows:
Chucky “Mike,” “Peters”-FBI hit man in Div, 5 of FBI, involved with inslaw case Nichol Harrah--FBI agent who abducts children for sacrifice

Unda Krieg Satanist working for FBI
Ken Lanning FBI agent who abducts children for sacrifice
Nick O’Hara FBI hit man, satanist, has covered FBI child kidnappings by murder Kape Richardson CIA agent who abducts children for sacrifice

[wynderer]

thanks for response, Amzer Zo -- now i see the point on which we disagree

i do not see them as [from your post ] :
' the unconscious manifestations of "our" "mind" '

-- i see them -- the Reptilians, the Greys, the demonic beings i have had the misfortune to meet, etc -- as very real beings from other dimensions, or perhaps from elsewhere in our 3D universe

[...]

Then -- maybe? -- you are "missing" Steve Richards' input in this: "Everything is alive!" Meaning that in the same ways as golems and tulpas come to take a life and shape on their own and can take form in physical 3D, so do all these generated thoughts and trapped energies... they become VERY REAL!

yes, i am aware of the manner in which what the Theosophists call 'thought forms' can take on a life of their own, even in 3D w/enough mis-use of knowledge -- but these are kind of secondarily created -- like robots

i guess personally i would consider these as part of the annoying astral entities category -- tho i have not met a golem [or maybe i have & didn't know it -- some weird folks out there lately]

but i do not consider Reptilians & Greys to be such mentally-created beings -- some of the Greys seem to be pretty robotic, but not all

yes, everything is alive -- tho Life manifests in many different ways, on many different frequencies, some far beyond the capabilities of a matrix-entrapped Earth Human mind to comprehend/imagine

[CdnSirian]

I have to say I appreciate all those who have hung in with this thread, which I think concerns a very challenging topic.

We all have had experiences that are somewhat difficult or plain impossible to describe. "Other" energies or beings, thought forms, beamed ideas, transferences, copy-cats, hitch-hikers, aliens, demons, angels, hybrids, bio-engineered robots, label-of-the-month critters are common to our lives.

On the huge over-view, we are all us and the whole system and accessories are included.

Apparently a well functioning brain is designed to filter out other realities, voices, beings, et al so that we can experience this focus for what it is. 3D reality. I observe that it's pretty good for some!

Any glitch or deliberate sabotaging (pain, drugs hypnosis) allows or ensures a vulnerability to intrusion and influence, or downright slavery. Movies, symbols, buzzwords, television - trawls for the rest of us, daily, hourly, filling the nets.

Where am I going with this? Not sure!!

I have observed that when I ignore the media and the bad stories I have very little interference in my ability to focus and create. When I get sucked into the drama I waste time, have nightmares, and feel haggard. So I do have some control over this.

Once in a while I tune in to the current events and the predicted horrible downfall of our (Western "civilized") culture and frankly, if I stay with it for a while, I don't see any reason to live another day. Insiders from the alphabet groups confirm we will be rounded up, camped, and brutally raped, tortured and killed.

So I just have to tune out and live every day like that crap storm is never going to happen, or die right now.

I will take every vitamin, mineral and organic food I can get to help me tune out of "reality". 9Eagle9 and others who do the clearing work, this is not to invalidate you at all. I just can't hang with it, not on a continual basis.

I have considered getting off this forum. And re-considered.

I read and viewed the videos here today: http://secretsun.blogspot.com/2011/01/year-of-thinking-magically-results.html which shows interviews with and about Philip K. Dick. Also talks about consciousness, reality et al. It's just too big to settle for tuning in exclusively to the "we are just pawns" reality.

We can re-focus as we are acted upon by exterior forces, or we can practise whatever discipline is necessary to guide our own focus. We can self heal, get help, if we need. And help others. I'm not in denial.

I think we have to create a good deal of the time, that we are sovreign in our life and consciousness. What else is going to give us the Oomph to deal with the cr**p when it looms into our view screen?

Hope this makes some sense.

[Hervé]

Re: "Finders":


[...]

From Sue Arrigo:


I want to mention one other way in which I learned about the Finder’s Experiment. The name Finders comes from a CIA slang word that was popular about the time this experiment started.

It was F***ed Into Not Denying (FIND). A boss at the CIA would tell an employee “Go find out who did this”.

It was like a game of musical chairs. Everyone would deny that they did it until finally somebody was the scapegoat and was f***ed into not being able to deny it.

So the Finders acronym was a warning to people in the CIA to be careful and not get made into a fall guy for this whole Project by letting a word out about it. A person leaking such stuff usually got blamed for the stuff itself—as people outside the agency couldn’t tell who was above whom and where the buck stopped.

The first time I heard about the Finders Group was at a party. Some kids were brought in to a fancy DC estate dressed up almost in Halloween type costumes-clowns, witches, ghosts, etc. But the costumes had big buttons on back panels over the bottom so that the kids could easily have their private parts exposed. The kids were trick or treat age. But it was not fall.

There were about 15 of these kids brought into an upscale party of people in tuxes. I arrived on the arm of the DCI Colby. Men started messing with these kids sexually, putting them on their laps with their panels unbuttoned. They did not even go into a separate room to do it. I felt uncomfortable with that - it reminded me of my own abuse as a child—and I went out on the front steps to look at the night sky and imagine being on some other planet for awhile.

Colby came out and asked me if I wanted to go home—that meant back to his bed. I just couldn’t get away from this issue. I got a little mad at him and asked him who brought the kids, as if I didn’t know as a remote viewer. He was defensive and then admitted that they were part of a CIA experiment and this was their “coming out” test—their graduation test to see if they could seduce DC politicians (to stay alive).

Those who flunked the test were liquidated. I had been in that system all my life—be useful sexually or die. I was not amused. Colby went into the technical details of the experiment and a “Wasn’t it a good idea?’ type of pitch to me.

[...]

Georgetown University should be called CIA U. The mental research facility is not on the main campus near the regular college students. It is on a separate piece of land that makes it harder to run away from. The name of it is not Georgetown, but it is part of Georgetown University.

Some people at the CIA have complained that attention deficit disorder is associated with the fluoridation of water and that the CIA refused to release the data on it in order to keep getting so many almost normal kids delivered to the door of their mind control clinics around North America.

They also complain that the CIA knows the treatment for attention deficit disorder, a drug to chelate the fluoride and expel it from the body and refuses to publish that data as well.

It is true that there are a number of books on the subject for internal consumption at the CIA. An ordinary epidemiologist could look at the issue and find out if those rumors within the CIA are true.

The reason everything was limited to two weeks was that was the length of time that the in-hospital psychiatric hospitalization could maximally be extended to, to run basically healthy kids “through testing of their condition”. The CIA developed a bunch of bogus tests to run on ADD kids to justify their two-week hospitalization like “withdrawing them from sugar, food dyes, etc.”

When this University facility’s history in mind control comes to the public’s attention, it will be a little hairy. Hundreds, no thousands, of parents will suddenly want to know if their child, grown or otherwise, was a mind control subject or in the control group. I will mention in passing three fairly reliable methods of knowing that.

That information comes from CIA reports about what to do to confuse parents if they get to another therapist later, ie what disinformation to give them to prevent them from uncovering that the kid was mind controlled.

That first piece of disinformation is -- "No one can tell if a person is a mind control victim—certainly not regular family and neighbors, only a qualified therapist could know and since they can’t tell no one can."

That is given because the CIA found out that 56% of the children were discovered to have been uncovered by relatives and family members as "robotic" or "messed up in their minds" or "with inexplicable behaviors that came from outside of themselves."

Teachers were particularly good at distinguishing control kids from experimental kids, and a number of teachers near that facility were killed by the CIA—on the order of a dozen in a decade.

The second piece of disinformation that the CIA primed therapists around the world have dispended is that it is "normal" for kids to act out in their teenage years by cross-dressing. It turned out that just the opposite is true of normal teenagers. They want to define their sexual identity and not cross dress.

Teenagers are the most intolerant to cross dressing per CIA research. Unless of course, they are mind control subjects and have been trained to sexually please chicken hawks by boys dressing as girls. There is no market for girls dressed as boys so the cross dressing only goes in one direction.

Surprisingly, the CIA research showed that homosexual boys rarely cross dressed on their own at that age - unless they had been used by porn filmmakers, chicken hawks and mind controllers. So the presence of cross-dressing in a teenage boy is highly predictive that he is a mind control or abuse victim.

The third piece of disinformation that the CIA fed therapists in journals to fool them and the parents is a bit subtler. The disinformation said "There is no normal age at which children should be told about sex. Sex education can occur at any age — it is up to the parents to decide. And sex education may be bad for kids so maybe we shouldn’t have it in our schools..."

The CIA spent a lot of money to convince parents, churches, and schools not to have real sex education classes. The reason was that when kids were allowed to freely talk in a group about their sexual experiences or fantasies or theories of sex, the kids themselves could see that some of them had very different levels of exposure to and sophistication in these matters.

So if sex education had to be taught the CIA wanted canned talks in which the kids were not allowed to talk. It thus trained sex educators to control the amount kids could talk and tried to make it taboo for the kids to talk to each other afterwards.

The CIA also found out that there was a best age for sex education –about the start of puberty. So then they fostered some campaigns to force the education to be earlier. The reason for that was that some young child whose native curiosity would not lead to sophisticated knowledge of sexual action, were coming out with it in front of parents and therapists.

It was better for the CIA if they could say that the kid learned it in a sex education class than from CIA prostitution of them. So although it sounds contradictory, the CIA’s bottom line on sex education disinformation was—don’t have sex education classes, but if you must have them have them very early and don’t let kids talk at them. Make it a more taboo subject by the way you skirt it or only allow it to be taught in a very short segment and never referred to again.

The CIA sponsored conferences for sex educators under a front company call “First Dating Experiences” if I remember correctly. Or maybe just “First Experiences”. When the abstinence only people objected the name of the front company was called something like “Wait for Marriage, Inc."

It was the same front. The same staff, address etc. The CIA also pushes abstinence and marital fidelity fronts while not practicing these things themselves. It does that to increase the effectiveness of its blackmail ops.

Sexual blackmail only works when the society is condemning towards others. It is not the abstinence of fidelity that the CIA is after, it is the condemning of others it is after.

Condemning is a form of hate and the CIA provokes hate and condemning as a way of controlling others. It is a mind control technique that can then be used to get people to fight wars etc against their best interests.

The CIA is looking for “handles” into a person’s psyche—an emotional issue that drives a person to act. Then it exploits it. It also creates handles by funding songs and lyrics into existence. That is another whole level of mind control directed at a population instead of individuals.

I have gotten off track some here. This is useful information but not staying focused on the main topic.

[tests to run on ADD kids to justify their two-week hospitalization] It was a total scam. They just needed something so difficult that parents couldn’t easily do at home to con the parent into letting Johnny stay at the hospital. They withdrew the food alright. They barely fed the kids at all. They fed them out of boxes, pre-packaged potato chips like Pringles and called that a sugar free diet. The last day the parents would come to pick the kid up and the interaction was observed carefully to see how well the kid could lie about his stay and what he had eaten in the hospital.

It was a complete fantasy. The kid had been down in the basement without a bed, clothes, or single hot meal. The kids that passed had incredible abilities to make believe. So good that they even believed it. They were multiples just like me. They had gone through an hour’s hypnosis at the end of that torture and with the help of the hypnotist had imagined all that had happened to them in that two-week period of time.

The parents were told that they couldn’t see the kids because the kids needed to learn a new way to relate to them to help their ADD, and that had to be learned well before they saw them again.

The parents wanted a break from their ADD kids for 2 weeks so it worked. And the kids did relate to their parents differently after two weeks of hard torture without a hot meal. Meanwhile, some say the CIA did actually give them the fluoride chelating drug—a pill once a day so that the ADD was better. The program was popular with parents.

The University facility touted its benefits. Researchers forged results to show how effective it was and others studied how to torture the kids and split their minds more reliably.

Not all kids split well enough to pretend, or keep up the pretense. These are the ones people know of as the Finder kids. They were taken away from their parents. They were not able to find pushers in their communities, so they were sent to be sex slaves and drug mules where they didn’t have to perform at as high a level.

If they couldn’t even do that, they were killed. They were not one-use kids for the sexual/torture use of the Ultra-rich, they were already used goods. The kids that Bush Sr. was expending were kids that came to that facility that were selected to be held in reserve for his use and his use only. Their parents had applied for their son’s hospitalization but the “application had been held up.”

Bush, Sr. had a certain look of boy he liked, like the youngest boy “Eager to Beaver” in the Brady House Boys (?). They looked like he looked when he was a boy before “it happened to him” at age 6. He kept on sodomizing kids like his dad sodomized him. His father kept it up much longer than others can imagine. He kept it up until he was close to death. Some things run in families.

Would you want to see your dad if that continued to be what you had to submit to? Dark and ugly secrets that even the principals might not know—what with multiplicity being what it is. Bush, Sr. — does he even know that he goes to that base and why? I leave it to your remote viewing skills and imagination to decide.

I was not at the CIA because of my ability to imagine what loose ends there were. I was there to know what loose ends there were and failing to know could cost me my life and more than that.

The actual results were that the CIA training was not adequate in amount or quality to do anything to train a kid in pushing. So the experiment was not a test of that at all. The experiment was a cover story for how to get the kids into one’s hands.

[...]

[Hervé]

[..]

but i do not consider Reptilians & Greys to be such mentally-created beings -- some of the Greys seem to be pretty robotic, but not all

[..]

Which wasn't something I was referring to in my initial post (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=536515&viewfull=1#post536515).

[wynderer]

sorry -- i was just responding to a later post -- a bit difficult to remember entireties of posts on this active thread

& i think the non-thought-form created beings are more of an issue than those thus created



[..]

but i do not consider Reptilians & Greys to be such mentally-created beings -- some of the Greys seem to be pretty robotic, but not all

[..]

Which wasn't something I was referring to in my initial post.

[Jean-Luc]

If you haven't done so yet, I wholeheartedly recommend you watch Berhnard Guenther's 110 minutes video UFOs, Aliens, and the Question of Contact 2012 (Full Documentary) which pretty much summarizes the work of Dr Karla Turner... and much more, including segments with Richard Dolan, Laura Knight and many well thought comments and extracts from various serious researchers & authors.

You can watch it on Youtube but you will get a better quality video on his website at this address:

http://veilofreality.com/2011/03/12/ufos-aliens-and-the-question-of-contact-%E2%98%9E-video/ (Press HD in the upper right corner)

The accompanying article is also published on sott.net http://www.sott.net/articles/show/247383-UFOs-Aliens-and-the-Question-of-Contact

with this sort of enthusiastic comment from a reader:


This is the topics of all topics.
This is the best article I have ever read on the subject.
I am an abductee and have been more than frustrated by the "New Age" feel good wishful thinking that this subject evokes.
Thank you for your bold truth seeking .
We are blinded by our binary thinking, black or white, good or bad.
There are answers above the childish options of, " are you a good witch , or a bad witch."

His website : http://veilofreality.com/

Excellent work!


"The idea that men, women, and children can be taken against their wills from their homes, cars, and school yards by strange humanoid beings, lifted onto spacecraft, and subjected to intrusive and threatening procedures is so terrifying, and yet so shattering to our notions of what is possible in our universe, that the actuality of the phenomenon has been largely rejected out of hand or bizarrely distorted in most media accounts."

- John E. Mack, M.D., professor of psychiatry at Harvard, from his book Abduction

[RunningDeer]

Thank you, 9eagle9. I see why you made that statement.

That's the trouble with posting. With so many points of view, it's absurd to think everyone will see it the way I intended.

Clarification: Too many books being read at once, too much time spent reading threads. Too little time to put together my personal picture without one more added topic on “Archons”. Though, I did read a fascinating article by Jay Weidner, “The Rise of Archons (http://jayweidner.com/Archons.html)”. I had layers and layers of ah-ha moments...more pieces to understand my family dynamics, and the innate understanding of why it was critical for me to spend time with nature and animals as a counter balance.

So not out of fear, did I not want to go any further with Archons. I do want to know more after I’ve come to rest on what to add and delete on my personal journey. There are negative behaviors and beliefs that keep me from my potential. That is the most important work for now.


Hello Daughter of Time,

Yesterday was the first time I visited this thread because I didn't want to know about dark forces out there.....'


Is what I was referring to.




Like what WhiteCrowBlackDeer said, I was afraid to look at the negative side of things..

A point of clarification: The above is a misleading statement. I'm always processing the negative side of things, so much so I am a complete bore. I walked away from a secure job of 27 years, in 2004, just to complete this process and learn why am I here? What's next...and all that rot...

Stating more clearly "archon" is new information for me. I didn't want one more thing added to my already full plate of clearing off, so I can invite only what works for me today.

I'm learning that there's a distinct possibility that I was raised by an archon and there's a good possibility that I have a couple of psychopathic sisters. Which explains why 'Love and Light' ain't the way to go. And why I am the big joke in the family. (on some levels)

IMO, I'm one of the many brave ones that know when to take a stand. I have demonstrated that over and over in my life.

............Going, going, gone..........................................:car:

:wave:



UPDATE: I can't find in my post where I said, "...I was afraid to look at the negative side of things."

If this is what you were referencing from post #1477 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=536126&viewfull=1#post536126):

P.S. I'll save for another time that I have experiences of my 'invisible family friends when I was younger. I believe them to be my Star Family. They'd come to visit exactly at 2:10 a.m. But this thread and some others have made me silent and look within for parts I may have forgotten. My gut says that they were what helped me be strong. I just didn't want anyone to take that away from me by posting it here.

It is a poorly constructed sentence. "But this thread and some others have made me silent and look within for parts I may have forgotten."

I had only been on PA forum a couple of week (one and only experience on a forum) and got brave enough to share my Star Family experience. One person took things out of context with each additional post. And then tried to make me understand that we are All One. I ended up deleting the posts. I learned that it wasn't worth having to explain my Truth to someone that continued to use it for his/her 'gain'.

[Bill Ryan]

If you haven't done so yet, I heartidly recommend you watch Berhnard Guenther's 110 minutes video UFOs, Aliens, and the Question of Contact 2012 (Full Documentary) which pretty much summarizes the work of Dr Karla Turner... and much more, including segments with Richard Dolan, Laura Knight and many well thought comments and extracts from various serious researchers & authors.

You can watch it on Youtube but you will get a better quality video on his website at this address:

http://veilofreality.com/2011/03/12/ufos-aliens-and-the-question-of-contact-%E2%98%9E-video/ (Press HD in the upper right corner)



I just watched the whole thing (110 minutes). I got to be impressed.

HIGHLY RECOMMENDED. I'd not seen it before. It could be regarded as obligatory course material for anyone studying this thread. :)

[Hervé]

Indeed, the best succinct summary of this thread's content.

Thanks Jean-Luc!

[observer]

Click-on forwarding arrow to see the content of Jean-Luc's comment #1534

I too just finished watching the video offered by Jean-Luc, and do concur, it was an excellent trail of evidence. I don't believe any serious researcher is denying these evidential facts regarding the UFO phenomenon.

This is all confirming evidence to what was offered in 2003 by John Lear on Coast-to-Coast with Art Bell in the, now famous, John Lear Disclosure (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTRFhrAr8us).

http://www.coasttocoastam.com/show/2003/11/02

You should be aware of what John has been saying for the best part of the last decade, Bill. You interviewed John quits some time back.

The continual rehashing of the disclosure issue is much like preaching to the choir. It is a most important issue with those who have no understanding. Most of us don't really have any issues with disclosing anything regarding the UFO phenomenon as something real.

It is now long past time that we, as members to this forum, stop concerning ourselves with 'disclosure', as this disclosure process has been ongoing for nearly the past ten years.

It is now time to focus on WHY? Let's move-on and come to some understanding as to why this is occurring.

This is the focus of my reason for being at Avalon.

[wynderer]

thanks, Jean-Luc --i watched the video a few months ago -- i found it heartening on one level, to hear so many intelligent & decent people speaking for us, the abductees --

but at the same time, i found it depressing, not because of the content, but because , when the video ended, there i was, all alone again in a world that does not know or care to know/hear what we abductees have to say

i am fortunate to be in phone connection w/Elaine Douglass, ed of JAR -- online Journal of Abduction Research -- & head of Utah MUFON -- as i told her once, the reason i continue to talk about abductions, knowing the responses i'll get, is not because i want approval/attention/drama -- it's because of the implications for Humanity as a whole

wyn

[ThePythonicCow]

If you haven't done so yet, I heartidly recommend you watch Berhnard Guenther's 110 minutes video UFOs, Aliens, and the Question of Contact 2012 (Full Documentary) which pretty much summarizes the work of Dr Karla Turner... and much more, including segments with Richard Dolan, Laura Knight and many well thought comments and extracts from various serious researchers & authors.

You can watch it on Youtube but you will get a better quality video on his website at this address:

http://veilofreality.com/2011/03/12/ufos-aliens-and-the-question-of-contact-%E2%98%9E-video/ (Press HD in the upper right corner)



I just watched the whole thing (110 minutes). I got to be impressed.

HIGHLY RECOMMENDED. I'd not seen it before. It could be regarded as obligatory course material for anyone studying this thread. :)

Excellent.

As it clearly states at the above link, this video is closely based on the article UFOs, Aliens, and the Question of Contact by Bernhard Guenther, November 21, 2010 (http://veilofreality.com/2010/11/21/ufos-aliens-and-the-question-of-contact/), to the point that the article is almost a transcript of the video, for those who prefer to read.

[wynderer]

maybe i have the video confused w/another one -- can't watch it again till i get a new headset -- i thought this was the one in which Karla Turner talks about the vats of Human body parts discovered on a ship, & that our mil/intel/gov't knows about this

edit to add: i think it was on a crashed ship, & our military discovered the vats during a crash retrieval



Click-on forwarding arrow to see the content of Jean-Luc's comment #1534

I too just finished watching the video offered by Jean-Luc, and do concur, it was an excellent trail of evidence. I don't believe any serious researcher is denying these evidential facts regarding the UFO phenomenon.

This is all confirming evidence to what was offered in 2003 by John Lear on Coast-to-Coast with Art Bell in the, now famous, John Lear Disclosure (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTRFhrAr8us).

http://www.coasttocoastam.com/show/2003/11/02

You should be aware of what John has been saying for the best part of the last decade, Bill. You interviewed John quits some time back.

The continual rehashing of the disclosure issue is much like preaching to the choir. It is a most important issue with those who have no understanding. Most of us don't really have any issues with disclosing anything regarding the UFO phenomenon as something real.

It is now long past time that we, as members to this forum, stop concerning ourselves with 'disclosure', as this disclosure process has been ongoing for nearly the past ten years.

It is now time to focus on WHY? Let's move-on and come to some understanding as to why this is occurring.

This is the focus of my reason for being at Avalon.

[RunningDeer]

Jean-Luc, I just finished "UFOs, Aliens, and the Question of Contact 2012 (Full Documentary)". It seems I need an upgrade in my beliefs.

Last winter, I listened to at least three of the guest speakers. But today, I understand them differently, partly because I'm perceiving differently. Exciting to know that it's beginning to 'stick'.

Thank you! :wave:

[Finefeather]

removed to avoid controversy

[observer]

Click-on forwarding arrow to see content of wynderer's comment #1541

Yes, wynderer,

I can show you many testimonies dating back several years regarding what 'they' are doing, which all goes to answering the question of WHY.

Here's one form a television series (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KQwJzKadso&list=PLD3AE7C4FF4CD8336&index=1&feature=plpp_video)aired in '09, that mentions vats of body parts and fully suspended human bodies. There are more of these kinds of videos (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77GbetmJF1E)that I could link. Phil Schneider (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbONIQfQmDU&feature=related)touched on these observations also before his death in the mid 90s. There has been much mention of body parts and collection of glandular fluids that I'm aware of.

This farming operation has been a continuous process since the Dawn of Man. It seems to me those of us who have accepted the phenomenon should be looking for more evidence that shows understanding as to why.

My point in the comment you quoted is that there is entirely too much focus on disclosure, and not enough focus on 'why'. It's almost as if the real answers are being delayed by an agenda of focusing on the disclosure issue. It's my belief this is a delaying tactic and part of a much larger agenda.

They are very clever at what they do....

[9eagle9]

The topic of disclosure must be frustrating for those who are waiting for an official account of disclosure from the very people ...who have always kept this disclosure from you.

It's not going to be official until the people who have always sought (and not always succeeded) to keep up in the dark put their stamp of approval on it?

What qualifies as a trustworthy disclosure? From Obama? He's trustworthy? Really?

Maybe we should make a list of things we don't know and stop focusing on what we already know.

[observer]

[....snip]

".... but as we have come a little further along the way we have also learned a bit more.

This entire thread is related to the subject of this article and we have seen in the last few pages people like 9eagle9 amongst others, give excellent insight into the causes and solutions of this increasing madness on the planet."

I begin my reply with a quote from the video offered by Jean-Luc:


“There are a thousand things which prevent a man from awakening, which keep him in the power of his dreams. In order to act consciously with the intention of awakening, it is necessary to know the nature of the forces which keep man in a state of sleep. First of all it must be realized that the sleep in which man exists is not normal but hypnotic sleep. Man is hypnotized and this hypnotic state is continually maintained and strengthened in him. One would think that there are forces for whom it is useful and profitable to keep man in a hypnotic state and prevent him from seeing the truth and understanding his position.”

- G. I. Gurdjieff



Ouspensky, in his book " In Search of the Miraculous" attributed that quote to Gurdjieff sometime between 1915 and 1925.

I address this reply to all the members, not just to what Finefeather is saying.

"Everything we think we understand is a small part of a much bigger lie.... and the lie is different at every level of understanding"

The message that Humanity has always received from telepathically communicated thought has consistently been laced with obscured Truth, masked within a believable lie.

I ask any member who subscribes to the understanding suggested by the telepathically communicated hypnotic thought process, if there has ever been a 'change for the better' since the Dawn of Man? With this perspective, why would one believe any such rubbish that we are 'creators' of our destiny? Has this principal ever manifest itself anywhere within the history of Humanity?

Ask that woman in the Golan Heights, sitting in the rubble of her bombed-out home, holding the body of her dead infant, if she feels like a 'co-creator' of her own destiny, today.

These ideas are contrary to the available evidence.

The evidence suggests this particular reality is a locked-down matrix. It also suggests there is a 'shutting-down' operation already in progress, evidenced by plasma phenomenon, and black hole (singularity) anomalies observed throughout the known universe.

Call that 'doom-and-gloom' if you prefer. I think I've made my point clear. Accept it , or reject it, the choice is completely up to the individual.

I suggest to any concerned member, the time is ripe to research and design an exit strategy, and stop subscribing to failed theologies regarding a "bright new dawn".

[Chester]

Post Thank Yous

Amzer Zo’s several recent posts (this is one poster I always take seriously)
Specifically his point that thought created beings are out there and part of the reality just as much as interdimensional beings who have the capacity to manifest in physical form in the 3rd dimension such as Reptilians and Greys. A “BOTH” situation.

The thought crossed my mind that in truth, no one is the end all to be all expert on any of this.

In addition, what works for one person in the achievement of solution (and perhaps eventually full resolution) does not necessarily have to be what works for another.

That if there is a full and final resolution achievable by any spirit being, I doubt seriously it would happen for all spirit beings all at the same time within our shared, material world reality.

And finally, full resolution for any single individual, if able to be achieved, would only ever be able to be judged at the end of “time” or perhaps (if one is open to the concept) when the material realms are transcended.

...just my current views, what do I know anyways?


CdnSirian – Post #1530 – the entire post but specifically – “It's just too big to settle for tuning in exclusively to the "we are just pawns" reality.”

and

“I think we have to create a good deal of the time, that we are sovreign in our life and consciousness. What else is going to give us the Oomph to deal with the cr**p when it looms into our view screen?

Hope this makes some sense.”

makes total sense - (I might add... "sovereign yet ever still connected")


The Dr. Greer view versus the “there definitely is malevolent non human beings.”

Dr. Greer is right

and there is definitely non human beings (beyond the various “kingdoms” we know are common to earth) [EDIT! - not sure what happened to the rest of my sentence!] ...that may eat humans - eat either the physical and/or other essences and from a human being perspective could be viewed as malevolent.

Wait a minute, justonecontradictor... how can both be true?

Perspective... purely and simply.

For example, Bill once mentioned the possibility “we” might be a bit hypocritical as we consume meat. Think about it... we have the right to kill an animal and consume that animal’s flesh and yet we are outraged that a Reptilian would do the same with a human being?

We would likely be perceived as malevolent by cows and chickens and pigs and fish and on and on... so are we also malevolent?

What else do we consume besides the physical material of an animal being when we eat it? Do we “know?” Can we “prove” we are only eating physical flesh?

If a spirit being consumes more than just flesh and is capable of obtaining sustenance from something other than the physical flesh, is that not still “eating?”

That one or more of us can “get over” these possibilities, move beyond the outrage, move beyond the anger and enter into a state where one might be able to consider potential solutions to this interesting phenomena of “consumption” that appears to be an inherent, core aspect of the entire physical universe all the way to black holes – solutions that could manifest at least on our Earth in some future time, is that “bad?”

Anyways – I graduated from the victim game, I graduated from the anger. I graduated from my arrogance that because I am a human being, I must be at the top of the food chain. I graduated from the us/them dynamic. I graduated from the fear of “the world’s gonna end and most of us are left here to die horribly!!! ahhhhhhh.”

And I did this in large part due to the good fortune I have had to survive myself and then find this forum, pour it all out, sort it all out and Wammo – here I am, ready to be the change I want to see, happily, optimistically, and determined like never before.

Yes, only one eye left, yes, a body riddled with parasites, yes, enough personally caused trauma to send many to institutions for years and years not to mention the dramas I sucked loved ones and friends into throughout my 54 + years, and yes, a field so wide open still that perhaps I attract even nastier critters... but I have had enough of school and so I have graduated... at least from the programs mentioned above.

I am sure there are new schools I will soon be entering. I hope my applications will be approved.

and to WhiteCrowBlackDeer... what would it be like with no more a-has? Can we say, boring? (justoneopinion)

justoneman

[SilentFeathers]

The topic of disclosure must be frustrating for those who are waiting for an official account of disclosure from the very people ...who have always kept this disclosure from you.

It's not going to be official until the people who have always sought (and not always succeeded) to keep up in the dark put their stamp of approval on it?

What qualifies as a trustworthy disclosure? From Obama? He's trustworthy? Really?

Maybe we should make a list of things we don't know and stop focusing on what we already know.

I don't believe "disclosure" is going to happen anytime soon either, at least not in a truthful and or detailed way. Any type of disclosure at this point in time IMO would only be another big lie with another sinister agenda behind it, such as the gov saying: "We have made contact with aliens and they promised to help us".

On a planet with the majority of the masses believing in one type or another supernatural righteous God and/or Savior, it would be foolish to tell the world the opposite is true.

The majority of the masses can't handle the truth....nor would they believe something so dark, evil, and bizarre any ways.

PWSx0bBiNIs

[wynderer]

from Justoneman's post:

For example, Bill once mentioned the possibility “we” might be a bit hypocritical as we consume meat. Think about it... we have the right to kill an animal and consume that animal’s flesh and yet we are outraged that a Reptilian would do the same with a human being?

We would likely be perceived as malevolent by cows and chickens and pigs and fish and on and on... so are we also malevolent?

What else do we consume besides the physical material of an animal being when we eat it? Do we “know?” Can we “prove” we are only eating physical flesh?
If a spirit being consumes more than just flesh... is capable of obtaining sustenance from something other than the physical flesh, is that not still “eating?”

That one or more of us can “get over” these possibilities, move beyond the outrage, move beyond the anger and enter into a state where one might be able to consider potential solutions to this interesting phenomena of “consumption” that appears to be an inherent, core aspect of the entire physical universe all the way to black holes – solutions that could manifest at least on our Earth in some future time, is that “bad?”

i've been thinking about posting something relating to your post above on Exomatrix' 'Aliens analyzing Humans' thread, & you brought up one of the points i was going to make, re killing & eating non-Human Animals by Humans

we have a higher-consciousness solution to the 3D-consumption issue already -- plenty of studies show that vegetarians & vegans are healthier then those who consume dead Animals

re whether Humans are malevolent in their treatment of Animals, i'd say Yes -- incredibly so -- factory farms -- fur farms -- labs -- 'sports' where Animals are forced to fight to the death -- Animals are used in satanic rituals in far greater numbers than Humans, & no one speaks for them --etc -- etc

most Humans are complicit in this -- & most thru consumption of your Animal brothers' & sisters' flesh -- i believe that whatever one gives permission to the Universe to be done to another, one gives permission for it to be done to oneself [ the 'We are all One' riff going around the net now]

Humans have given the invaders permission to treat them as they treat Animals

as i said elsewhere, i have no problem w/'judging' -- i figure that's one reason the Creator gave me a mind & a heart -- i 'judge' what Humans do to Animals as wrong, & i judge what the Reptilians/Greys/etc are doing to Humans as wrong

collective karma is heavy & dense, & not easy to get free of at 'death'

[Finefeather]

removed to avoid controversy

[wynderer]

thank you for your posts, Observer -- i am learning from you

re this from your post:
'The evidence suggests this particular reality is a locked-down matrix. It also suggests there is a 'shutting-down' operation already in progress, evidenced by plasma phenomenon, and black hole (singularity) anomalies observed throughout the known universe.'

i agree that this planet Earth 'reality' is a locked-down matrix -- my question for you: are you saying that this entire 3D universe/reality/dimension is being shut down? -- thru black holes? -- i had been thinking of this as kind of a localized operation, in this galaxy or sector thereof -- CERN etc seem to poking some holes in this locality, & HAARP generates plasma

i learned from Houman that the Gnostics believed that this entire 3D universe was kind of sub-created by a nasty 'demiurge', but, again, i'd always thought of the darkside having gained control of only a relatively small sector of this universe --perhaps limited to this galaxy

i've always thought that this planet could so easily have been a paradise -- for all beings here, esp Humans, whose bodies were created to feel so much pleasure from so many of the gifts of Earth herself -- just the fragrance of flowers alone, for instance

i also think that this is what the Creator intended -- & that the erect spine & chakras were not intended to lie dormant -- Humans have been deliberately cut off from the Creator/Source

wyn







[....snip]

".... but as we have come a little further along the way we have also learned a bit more.

This entire thread is related to the subject of this article and we have seen in the last few pages people like 9eagle9 amongst others, give excellent insight into the causes and solutions of this increasing madness on the planet."

I begin my reply with a quote from the video offered by Jean-Luc:


“There are a thousand things which prevent a man from awakening, which keep him in the power of his dreams. In order to act consciously with the intention of awakening, it is necessary to know the nature of the forces which keep man in a state of sleep. First of all it must be realized that the sleep in which man exists is not normal but hypnotic sleep. Man is hypnotized and this hypnotic state is continually maintained and strengthened in him. One would think that there are forces for whom it is useful and profitable to keep man in a hypnotic state and prevent him from seeing the truth and understanding his position.”

- G. I. Gurdjieff



Ouspensky, in his book " In Search of the Miraculous" attributed that quote to Gurdjieff sometime between 1915 and 1925.

I address this reply to all the members, not just to what Finefeather is saying.

"Everything we think we understand is a small part of a much bigger lie.... and the lie is different at every level of understanding"

The message that Humanity has always received from telepathically communicated thought has consistently been laced with obscured Truth, masked within a believable lie.

I ask any member who subscribes to the understanding suggested by the telepathically communicated hypnotic thought process, if there has ever been a 'change for the better' since the Dawn of Man? With this perspective, why would one believe any such rubbish that we are 'creators' of our destiny? Has this principal ever manifest itself anywhere within the history of Humanity?

Ask that woman in the Golan Heights, sitting in the rubble of her bombed-out home, holding the body of her dead infant, if she feels like a 'co-creator' of her own destiny, today.

These ideas are contrary to the available evidence.

The evidence suggests this particular reality is a locked-down matrix. It also suggests there is a 'shutting-down' operation already in progress, evidenced by plasma phenomenon, and black hole (singularity) anomalies observed throughout the known universe.

Call that 'doom-and-gloom' if you prefer. I think I've made my point clear. Accept it , or reject it, the choice is completely up to the individual.

I suggest to any concerned member, the time is ripe to research and design an exit strategy, and stop subscribing to failed theologies regarding a "bright new dawn".

[9eagle9]

"We cut up human fetuses for stem cell research.
. We remove organs and blood from one human and place it in another.
. We slaughter animals everyday and devour the flesh, often raw.
. We drink the blood of live snakes.
. We make sausage out of pigs blood.
. We rape children because we think it may cure AIDS.
. We have sex with dead cadavers in morgues.
. We have sex with live animals.
. We stick our penises into a hole full of ****e.
. We milk live horses of their blood to make vaccine.
. We inject live monkeys and mice with chemicals no one will come near to.
. We spray live monkeys in their eyes to test chemicals.
. We kill thousands everyday with chemical drugs and pollution.
. We kill thousands everyday with medically approved drugs."

All of the above is done by choice, not by necessity. A doctor may praise a person for being a vegetarian....but think strangely of a person who doesn't want a vaccine for the same reason they chose to be a vegetarian. None of the above list is necessary, we create reasons for the above behaviors to be necessary, mostly to improve quality of life. Excuse me we are under the mistaken notion we are improving the quality of physical life. But we aren't just physical entities.

This is why I keep emphasizing we have to examine our own parasitical behaviors....if we are parasitical in nature what do we hope to attract energetically?

[scarletfire]

The point was made about humans accepting and actively participating in the exploitation of animals. That being said most of humanity has also buried their heads in the sand and allowed old growth forests to be slashed and burned, oceans to be polluted and the list goes on... My point is whether or not the exploitation of humanity is our karma? The law of karma is impossible to escape and we as a species have sure racked up an expensive tab. Is it going to take a dose of our own medicine to get us to understand that empathy and compassion is something that all creatures as well as our mother earth is deserving of? Is the evil of reptilian demonic creatures the extreme catalyst it's gonna take to shake humanity out of our nonapologetic selfishness? I hope people could wake up and treat other life w/ respect but since we can't seem to get our collective act together, maybe we should be knocked off the throne of creation that so much of humanity feels and acts entitled to.

[Bill Ryan]

"We cut up human fetuses for stem cell research.
. We remove organs and blood from one human and place it in another.
. We slaughter animals everyday and devour the flesh, often raw.
. We drink the blood of live snakes.
. We make sausage out of pigs blood.
. We rape children because we think it may cure AIDS.
. We have sex with dead cadavers in morgues.
. We have sex with live animals.
. We stick our penises into a hole full of ****e.
. We milk live horses of their blood to make vaccine.
. We inject live monkeys and mice with chemicals no one will come near to.
. We spray live monkeys in their eyes to test chemicals.
. We kill thousands everyday with chemical drugs and pollution.
. We kill thousands everyday with medically approved drugs."

All of the above is done by choice, not by necessity. A doctor may praise a person for being a vegetarian....but think strangely of a person who doesn't want a vaccine for the same reason they chose to be a vegetarian. None of the above list is necessary, we create reasons for the above behaviors to be necessary, mostly to improve quality of life. Excuse me we are under the mistaken notion we are improving the quality of physical life. But we aren't just physical entities.

This is why I keep emphasizing we have to examine our own parasitical behaviors....if we are parasitical in nature what do we hope to attract energetically?

Great post. You're 100% right.

The human race is an enormous mixed bag of agendas, beliefs, compulsions, and aberrations. There are, and have been, some exceptionally wonderful human beings who might be the equal of any ET (or angelic being!) in terms of wisdom, balance, focus and development.

There also are, and have been, many depraved, arrogant, brutal and downright evil people. And I'm sure those qualities exist in some ETs as well. Sorting all this out is part of the problem.

[observer]

Click-on forwarding arrow to see the content of wynderer's comment #1552.

1. All of our perception of reality is centered on this single tiny orb located within an electromagnetic field we perceive and call "The Universe". From this vantage point, everything we perceive is manipulated by the control matrix that is in place around this 'prison planet'.

How does anyone know anything about the structure of the universe we perceive when those perceptions have only come from our observations, here on this sphere?

2. What we know about plasma can be simplified by three rules.

Plasma is now being understood by certain "Plasma Physicists (http://www.youtube.com/user/ThunderboltsProject/videos)" as the "Forth State of Matter"
Plasma can only exists within an electromagnetic field.
Plasma only occurs when it is 'triggered'.

To my knowledge, there is no consciences as to what 'triggers' the plasma discharges being observed throughout (what we perceive as) the 'known universe'. From my interpretations, I would suggest this 'trigger mechanism' is located outside of what we can perceive, i.e., outside of the known universe.

Since the known universe is some 14 billion (or so) light-years across,

And since, even reconciling the speed of the longitudinal propogation wave of electrical discharge has been measured at approximately 1.5 times the speed of light, it would still take some 9.33 billion years to observe the final effects of any such 'shutting-down' application.

This has already been observed in the anomalous features of some black holes (singularities) found throughout the known universe. Einsteinian Physicists have 'invented' all sorts of explanations for these anomalous discoveries.

I would suggest a 'shutting-down' process is yet one more interpretation.

3. I would also like to restate what you said in your comment #1549



[....snip]
beginning with: "we have a higher-consciousness solution to the 3D-consumption issue already -- plenty of studies show that vegetarians & vegans are healthier than those who consume dead Animals....."


Consumption of the flesh of a beast is foundational to remaining locked within the matrix of control.

The evidence will show, that the creation of the Human Species was specifically designed to create a slave race that would be eternally indebted to a demiurge, i.e. an archonic controller. Part of this eternal indebtedness is the product of the consumption of meat. That this species needs meat to survive is a myth.

So many of the 'True Gnostic' followers throughout antiquity were practicing vegetarians. This is a fact that was perverted by the Templar when they assumed the role of 'keepers of the gnosis' nearly one thousand years ago.

There really are two different types of Gnosis. But, why wouldn't this be so? We are locked here within this controlled matrix with Abject Evil behind the curtain of illusion.

[Chester]

The world is not in some state of siege as some like to make us belief, and yes things are going to happen that will cause death and distruction, but there is no need for us to start walling up our doors, and hanging garlic around our necks. The amount of abductions are a minute percentage of the world population which is increasing by the day.

Thank You, Finefeather for a direct, true (to me) hard hitting post and which the younger me would have rejected. justoneman

[Chester]

To observer and wynderer

Though I would not rule out the above stated possibility, my intuition rejects. Regardless, thank you both for your views.

[Chester]

"We cut up human fetuses for stem cell research.
. We remove organs and blood from one human and place it in another.
. We slaughter animals everyday and devour the flesh, often raw.
. We drink the blood of live snakes.
. We make sausage out of pigs blood.
. We rape children because we think it may cure AIDS.
. We have sex with dead cadavers in morgues.
. We have sex with live animals.
. We stick our penises into a hole full of ****e.
. We milk live horses of their blood to make vaccine.
. We inject live monkeys and mice with chemicals no one will come near to.
. We spray live monkeys in their eyes to test chemicals.
. We kill thousands everyday with chemical drugs and pollution.
. We kill thousands everyday with medically approved drugs."

All of the above is done by choice, not by necessity. A doctor may praise a person for being a vegetarian....but think strangely of a person who doesn't want a vaccine for the same reason they chose to be a vegetarian. None of the above list is necessary, we create reasons for the above behaviors to be necessary, mostly to improve quality of life. Excuse me we are under the mistaken notion we are improving the quality of physical life. But we aren't just physical entities.

This is why I keep emphasizing we have to examine our own parasitical behaviors....if we are parasitical in nature what do we hope to attract energetically?

Great post. You're 100% right.

The human race is an enormous mixed bag of agendas, beliefs, compulsions, and aberrations. There are, and have been, some exceptionally wonderful human beings who might be the equal of any ET (or angelic being!) in terms of wisdom, balance, focus and development.

There also are, and have been, many depraved, arrogant, brutal and downright evil people. And I'm sure those qualities exist in some ETs as well. Sorting all this out is part of the problem.

And why any solution (to be achieved by humanity on earth) must come from humanity on earth. And in my opinion, can only come from within each and every human being.

[9eagle9]

Cause and effect.

If we burn down every tree and plant on the planet we won't be able to breath.

This is not punishment or karma, (or reward...lol) its simply a result of the actions and choices we've made.

As we have poisoned the earth so have we poisoned ourselves. We are driving ourselves crazy.

If I drink Drano I'll die.

Who seems to be the one dispensing karma here?...me.

Now for the people who never burnt down a tree or a plant to share in this punishment fair?

No. But there isn't anyone on earth who hasn't participated in one way or the other , directly or indirectly, in destroying a tree or plant. Unless someone came straight out of the womb and levitated through life, never having a bon fire, or stepped on the earth, or bought wood furniture, etc we've done just that.

There are meaningful ways to employee the earth's resources and there are ways that are just careless and parasitical.

The nature of this planet is that in order for something to live, something must physically die. PHYSICALLY die.

This does not mean we have exterminated out of existence, it means we have altered its circumstances somewhat.




The point was made about humans accepting and actively participating in the exploitation of animals. That being said most of humanity has also buried their heads in the sand and allowed old growth forests to be slashed and burned, oceans to be polluted and the list goes on... My point is whether or not the exploitation of humanity is our karma? The law of karma is impossible to escape and we as a species have sure racked up an expensive tab. Is it going to take a dose of our own medicine to get us to understand that empathy and compassion is something that all creatures as well as our mother earth is deserving of? Is the evil of reptilian demonic creatures the extreme catalyst it's gonna take to shake humanity out of our nonapologetic selfishness? I hope people could wake up and treat other life w/ respect but since we can't seem to get our collective act together, maybe we should be knocked off the throne of creation that so much of humanity feels and acts entitled to.

[gripreaper]

Well, as long as we are on the topic of aberrant behaviors associated with aliens, we need to go back 200,000 years and start at the beginning, where the "sons of the gods" took "the daughters of men" unto themselves... and we got a brand new hybrid, which is us. Whether these were giants or what not, they were aliens. We are all part of this genetic experiment.

In the last several decades, it is fairly common knowledge among the alternative media community, that there were several crashes in the 40's and 50's, that aliens were recovered, that we are visited by these aliens, that Eisenhower did meet with them at Edwards AFB, that we did have an agreement with them to abduct us in exchange for technology, that there was an underground human farm facility under Dulce (as per Phil Schneider) where such genetic experiments of cloning and hybridization and torture and extraction got out of hand, and the underground Dulce wars did in fact occur.

It is also common knowledge that these extractions, abductions, and all manner of aberrant experiments continue to this day, creating all kinds of perverse and bizarre outcomes. Yet, what is impossible to extract and understand is the nature of the soul. Although vampirism of life force has been going on for millennium, how to actually extract a soul from a body and contain it within another biomasss, has not been accomplished to the best of my knowledge. Sure, there is illusion of perception, possession and other techniques of extracting life force, but not full soul removal.

This is the Achilles heel, and it is what we need to focus on. As a human species, with all of the aberrant tendencies of the aliens fully imbedded within our very nature, our very core DNA, we can CHOOSE to focus on our soulstream essence, and become enlightened beings, and move away from the basic, dumbed down version, carnal biometric slaves we are, and the illusion that we must remain there because that is all there is.

The main caveat is that there is a possibility that the experiment is being terminated and the fact that soul essence cannot be extracted , and that the new hybrid humans are ready to be released while the old version, which is us, is to be exterminated...

I know, I know, this is fairly radical thinking, but if true, should we not be aware and do what we can to stop it? Check out this half hour video with Barry Trower in regards to seeding for EMF and Microwave effects, which can be triggered to bring alive certain viruses and such by different frequency. it's all set up and ready for to pull the trigger at any time. Chemtrails anyone?

http://www.forbiddenknowledgetv.com/videos/weapons/dr-barrie-trower-microwave-weapons.html

[Chester]

i also think that this is what the Creator intended -- & that the erect spine & chakras were not intended to lie dormant -- Humans have been deliberately cut off from the Creator/Source


The same creator that created all?

If so, is this the same creator that created the environment within which your above stated scenario could occur?

The environment within which we humans could be deliberately cut off from the same said Creator?

If so, would we have anything to worry about since it's "Our Creator who set all this up?"

What a benevolent "creator" that would be, huh?

Maybe we don't all know all?

Anyways, not my view - just another program I have graduated from.

[RunningDeer]

Not appropriate for thread.

[9eagle9]

Consumption of the flesh of a beast is foundational to remaining locked within the matrix of control.

I know vegetarians who are more locked into the matrix of control than people who eat meat. I know a lot of vegetarians are dumb arses and are much safer in the matrix then if they went into free fall the way you do when a piece of your matrix is removed.

I don't think meat is necessary to LIVING. Amino acids found in meat are necessary for optimal brain function. You can supplement your amino acids but where are they coming from? I know a lot of vegetarians that do not have optimal brain function, their actual chemistry is ...not optimal...he he. And I know vegetarians who are really up to speed on things, and they don't seem to think that flesh is matrix building. Flesh could be considered a bi product of matrix building.

What creates flesh? You can alter the circumstances of one's own. The result of lots of de-programming IS age reduction of the flesh. You actually regress physically. The affects of the matrix are removed from flesh. That is evidential and its demonstrable.

I know a 'bit' about getting out of the matrix and I'm not a vegetarian. This is faulty reasoning and its thoughtform that people can get seduced by for the wrong reasons. . Admittedly I don't eat a great deal of meat...but I'm not a vegetarian...but I'm hardly a person who is consumed by the matrix to the point i don't know it exists or how its replicated.

Now the question remains, where did the importance between blood and flesh become divided. Who made flesh important in a derogatory way. Did the flesh of the animal be developed by other flesh-- a wolf consuming a deer. Does the flesh of an animal harm its own self?

Are animals perhaps more a bit in tune to things, and observe things perception-ally different than people. Like a wolf. Everyone says wolves are very spiritual. They have awareness, powers of perception and a means of socializing that is quite extraordinary. Things many vegetarians don't have. Or people vegetarian or not don't have.

Was that from eating flesh? Wolves are carnivores. How did they develop this extraordinary awareness if flesh keeps one locked in a matrix? Do species have their own matrices...?

In Original CREATION matrix blood is a important component. In artificial matrix replicating the sort the ptb play mud pies with, blood is important. Everything the ptb has done is a replicant of the original creation matrix that really doesn't put much importance on flesh but blood. Who put the emphasis on flesh ....flesh IS permeated by blood.

What permeates flesh? Blood. You cut yourself and your going to bleed. What seeps out of a rare steak...blood.

The Vatican did that when they corrupted the concepts, genetically, about flesh and blood. I mentioned early upthread about communion being a corruption of the original blood rites--which included the creation of flesh but never made any mention that flesh was important in anyway.

Instead of asking what's in your wallet, maybe we should be asking what's in our blood (instead what's on the dinner plate).

What is in our blood that parasitical energies find so compelling. Most external parasites aren't after your flesh, their after your blood. Mosquitoes, leeches, flies, fleas, none of them are asking for piece of meat, they want your blood.

There is not a whole lot out there, that can't be observed here in our street level common perception.

[9eagle9]

I found your post interesting due to a matter of timing of a peculiar dream I had that posted in another thread. It was a couple days ago, and what made the dream peculiar was that another member's daughter had a similar dream the same evening. And heard the same things I did during the dream.

Then there were a few admissions made to me by other members that they had either very weird patterns or sleep, inability to sleep or heard the same things I heard after I woke up the day after the dream. I wasn't soliciting for opinions, these were things that were revealed to me in idle conversation.

I don't have much dream recall, I don't have dreams that leave emotionally disturbed. That I experienced either is significant. This is the sort of dream you want to wake someone up and crawl in their lap. That someone else had a similar dream and similar waking event is significant and were left as distrubed by it seem significant. The dream itself is not important. I recognized where I was at, I've been there before. A bleak, dark industrial landscape, where everyone is backed against the wall and there's no where to go. No hope, no chance for reclamation, nothing but despair. Complete and total isolation from God. Nothing was 'happening' in the dream that was disturbing those were just the conditions.

I wake up from this dream and I'm deeply disturbed. But I also KNOW that that is just not the way it is. So I'm laying there and I hear what sounds like a deep throbbing electrical hum , its pulsing on and off....like a heart beat . Dub dub dub dub....This is not good. It's EM interference and its turned up HIGH, to where I'm not just aware of it, I can hear with my physical ears, its going through the whole house. That is when I realized this 'dream' went out through the collective and has been tapped down into the psyche with these bursts of em.

When the sun started coming up it got fainter and went away entirely.

This is what our masters of the psyche are trying to imbed in us--despair. Have a sort of covert despair lurking in the subconscious. No choices, no chances, no place to go. I remember the dream, I've been in that underworld before, that's where they operate from. What lurks behind that programming--despair implantation-- is information all on it's own. Their minds are equally open when they open this sort of operation. This covert accidentally release information has something to do with the sun, and this means of programming can't occur when the sun is out. As soon as the sun rose, it killed off that pulse. I have no idea if it's HAARP or some-other assholery, but it was a ripple through the shared collective mind. To initiate emotional undercurrents of despair, of having no options. This is the end of the line.

If those were conditions of reality there would be no reason to to keep imposing this sort of manipulation on people. So what if we 'think' we are empowered and its not really true? Would they not be content with that information if it were really true. Why do they spend so much time attempting to put us in a place of no choices, no options, and utter despair if that was our reality.

[/I]
I have to say I appreciate all those who have hung in with this thread, which I think concerns a very challenging topic.

We all have had experiences that are somewhat difficult or plain impossible to describe. "Other" energies or beings, thought forms, beamed ideas, transferences, copy-cats, hitch-hikers, aliens, demons, angels, hybrids, bio-engineered robots, label-of-the-month critters are common to our lives.

On the huge over-view, we are all us and the whole system and accessories are included.

Apparently a well functioning brain is designed to filter out other realities, voices, beings, et al so that we can experience this focus for what it is. 3D reality. I observe that it's pretty good for some!

Any glitch or deliberate sabotaging (pain, drugs hypnosis) allows or ensures a vulnerability to intrusion and influence, or downright slavery. Movies, symbols, buzzwords, television - trawls for the rest of us, daily, hourly, filling the nets.

Where am I going with this? Not sure!!

I have observed that when I ignore the media and the bad stories I have very little interference in my ability to focus and create. When I get sucked into the drama I waste time, have nightmares, and feel haggard. So I do have some control over this.

Once in a while I tune in to the current events and the predicted horrible downfall of our (Western "civilized") culture and frankly, if I stay with it for a while, I don't see any reason to live another day. Insiders from the alphabet groups confirm we will be rounded up, camped, and brutally raped, tortured and killed.

So I just have to tune out and live every day like that crap storm is never going to happen, or die right now.

I will take every vitamin, mineral and organic food I can get to help me tune out of "reality". 9Eagle9 and others who do the clearing work, this is not to invalidate you at all. I just can't hang with it, not on a continual basis.

I have considered getting off this forum. And re-considered.

I read and viewed the videos here today: http://secretsun.blogspot.com/2011/01/year-of-thinking-magically-results.html which shows interviews with and about Philip K. Dick. Also talks about consciousness, reality et al. It's just too big to settle for tuning in exclusively to the "we are just pawns" reality.

We can re-focus as we are acted upon by exterior forces, or we can practise whatever discipline is necessary to guide our own focus. We can self heal, get help, if we need. And help others. I'm not in denial.

I think we have to create a good deal of the time, that we are sovreign in our life and consciousness. What else is going to give us the Oomph to deal with the cr**p when it looms into our view screen?

Hope this makes some sense.

[wynderer]

part of the price/risk/responsibility involved w/the free will thing




i also think that this is what the Creator intended -- & that the erect spine & chakras were not intended to lie dormant -- Humans have been deliberately cut off from the Creator/Source


The same creator that created all? If so, is this the same creator that created the environment within which your above stated scenario could occur? That we humans could be deliberately cut off from the same said Creator? If so, would we have anything to worry about?

What a benevolent creator that would be, huh?

Maybe we don't all know all?

Anyways, not my view - just another program I have graduated from.

[Hervé]

Well, as long as we are on the topic of aberrant behaviors associated with aliens, we need to go back 200,000 years and start at the beginning...

[...]

The main caveat is that there is a possibility that the experiment is being terminated and the fact that soul essence cannot be extracted , and that the new hybrid humans are ready to be released while the old version, which is us, is to be exterminated...

[...]


Cough... cough... cough... which beginning?



[...]

It should make it clear that all sides/aspects of any conflicts were implanted into our minds... "They gave us their minds" said Juan Maltus to Castaneda... and ever since "WE" 've been busy RE-creating all those figures, constructs, programs and kept ourselves and "them" entertained with them...

Here is the transcript of the video (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=529642&viewfull=1#post529642) I was able to concoct:

[In the following "R6" equates to the implanted "mind" given to "us" by Castaneda's "predators" and "dramatization" means the re-creation or acting out of the R6/ unconscious "mind" implanted hypnotic commands. Hence, R6ers are the hypnotically-tranced, skull-dwelling zombies we got to know as the "sheeples." Accordingly, MKultra, satanic, etc. types of mind-control and implants are "dramatizations" of that "R6" "mind/unconscious"]


[...]

Although it’s a fairly simple implant but it was quite effective in lousing people up because it interrupted them from creating what they would have created and took away what mock-ups that he did have and it stop the cycle and it put something there that is unwanted and so when they tried to create, they created it [the “unwanted”]. They fixed his attention by “protest.”

All right.

For this planet, and for this Confederacy of the 21 adjacent stars and its 76 planets; the Incident Two… it is a very long and [?] complex incident… all in 36 days.

[...]

These planets averaged 178 billion human beings per planet. One hundred and seventy eight billion. There were 250 billion on this planet, the name of this planet was Teegeeak and this is known as the “bomb-place” and this is the “evil place.” This is the place [?pretty much all of it?] got smashed.

[...]

Now, that is peculiar and only to this planet and to this confederation. There have been other implants of various kind and sizes but this is probably one of the longest, most violent and wildest implant in this sector of the universe.

[...]

They were [?imported?], they were actually… the trick was to shoot somebody, disable somebody, very often a needle into a lung and at the same time to hit him with frozen alcohol and glycol which preparation is guaranteed to pick up a being. All they had to do was: pick him up and put him in a refrigerator and they had him boy. When he tried to exteriorize from the body, there he was -- frozen.

[...]

People were ferried in here by the billions and the billions and the billions and they were ferried in here with boxes and they were put in boxes and stacked around and the people who were on this planet already, just caught it in the teeth, nobody bothered to pick them up. [...]... it blew the beings into the air and after the bomb, an electronic ribbon which also was a type of standing wave was erected over the area. The tremendous winds on the planet blew every being there was straight in to those particular vacuum zones which had been created. These were brought down, packed up and put in front of projection machines [?] with sound and colored pictures. First gave them the implant which you know as “Clearing Course.” Then, a whole track [was] implanted which you know as OT II.

[...]

The entirety of Roman Catholicism, the devil and all of these sorts of things, that is all part of R6. Practically anything you can think of, all modern theatres in actual fact are built with the exact symbols shown [???] in R6.

[...]

Now, the net result of all of this, was to make a 75 million year vacuum. That’s as far as this part of the universe is concerned. You wonder why: “Why don’t… if there are saucers around, why don’t they land on this planet?”

This planet, traditionally, over the various zones and area has an evil reputation. Mutineers and deserters and that sort of thing were often dumped on this planet. They’ll often come here and refuge because they know nobody’s gonna come after them.

This planet is the planet of the evil repute and this sector of the universe has a very evil repute.

Now, all the data which you have that was set out seventy four fluff-fluff-fluff million years ago – almost seventy five – this catastrophe overcame this confederation and has just made it an unsavory part of this universe, to say the least.

About, well, relatively, we are almost in modern times -- 20 million years ago, something like that – somebody started a body line on the planet; it gradually worked through various areas of barbarism and once more, R6 tailored made it to be nothing but a caveman civilization.

Nevertheless, they moved up the line and they moved up toward the dramatization of R6 and that’s what man calls “progress.” And they have managed to make things, this way and that way and their technology is rather pathetic but they’ve moved up the line until they… until there is some possibilities of establishing communication with regard to the activity. The “fate” of the R6ers and we have many a PC who will say to you “Oh my god, they are after me…” it sure fixed up an area, they fixed up an implant that their… people are taught carefully that any man who tries to save the world must be killed, he must be mobbed, hanged.

[...]

Somebody, somewhere on this planet -- back about 600 BC, found some pieces of R6. I don’t know how they found it, either by watching madmen or something, but since that time, they have used it and it became what is known as Christianity.

[...]

Now, to get an edge in, in this particular area and blow this up as a “mass” engram and so forth is quite a trick and we are involved in doing just that. No universe is safe where people are smashed that badly. It becomes the business of any being because the universe in which he lives – as long as it contains a cancerous area such as this old confederation and so on – is not a universe in which one can really freely move. Simple.

[...]

There are certain things which make people ill and that is when they get into certain zones or areas or positions which approximate the R6 positions; such as a body lying in the rain with a rat, below the cross. Guaranteed to give people colds. And so forth, so you have colds from rain. Yet you take baths, you get wet and don’t get a cold. When they get cold, it restimulates frozen alcohol and glycol, as a mix, and therefore they get into a dramatization. So, their sickness is very closely tied-in with R6. [...] Also, a body was only supposed to live seventy years which is a bunch of balderdash. Before R6, and so forth they lived on and on and on and on… there was no such thing as death. They taught people death, they taught them amnesia, these various things. They all come from this zone and area.

[...]




Now, I wouldn't mind THAT particular "experiment" to end... the trouble is that most everybody seem to think that all the problems are coming from the body-line and its genetics whereas the real deal LIES with the IMPLANTED BEINGS occupying said bodies... beings which are re-wired to create/manifest in their environment exactly what they specifically DO NOT WANT!

Machiavellian to say the least.

To that, add a little population problem: 7 billion incarnated "souls"... that makes, to simplify, 240 billion "out there" in-waiting... that makes for a very, very crowded "astral realm," each "manifesting" who or what they "believe" -- i.e. hypnotically ordered -- to be.

In short, it takes quite some compassion to even consider tackling that "problem."

[observer]

Click on forwarding arrow to see content of 9eagle9's comment #1563

Yes, well thank you 9eagle, for quoting my words and then misconstruing the meaning of that which I am speaking.

In your reply to my comment, you are referring to your interpretations based on your personal observations, and applying that to what you understand regarding the 'every-day' matrix of control that permeates this particular reality. Your observations based on that aspect of "releasing one's self" from the matrix of control may be all too correct.

I, on the other hand, am speaking of "releasing one's self" from the matrix of control at the moments after one expires, i.e. what one might experience after death, and things one might do during their lifetime to release one's self from this particular universe, which is nothing more than a matrix of control.

As you can see, these two concepts are, in no way, comparable to one another.

It is my interpretation from years of research into the unaltered records of antiquity.... records that have only been unearthed from the deserts of Egypt, Mesopotamia, and the Indus Valley in just the past two hundred years, or so. From these records, one might interpret that eating flesh is one of the ways that the Archons keep the 'eternal soul' aspect of our species locked within this matrix of control.

[Hervé]

I am stealing this from another thread (my apologies WCBD (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?30405-Here-and-Now...What-s-Happening&p=526226&viewfull=1#post526226)) as an example of how, although truth is clearly uttered, truth is left unacknowledged and accomodated to one's level of understanding current at that moment...



[...]

“Thank you. I was possessed back then.”

[...]

[...]

Again, apologies for taking that post of yours as an example of a truth uttered in a thread about archontic influences.

No argument as to who you are or whether or not you were aware of the dynamic taking place in your life experiences.

[RunningDeer]

Oh, seems that I need to apologies. I didn't realize that you were quoting my Dad. I thought you meant... oh it doesn't matter. It's only words right? Sorry and thank you, Amzer Zo. :wave:




I am stealing this from another thread (my apologies WCBD (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?30405-Here-and-Now...What-s-Happening&p=526226&viewfull=1#post526226)) as an example of how, although truth is clearly uttered, truth is left unacknowledged and accomodated to one's level of understanding current at that moment...



[...]

“Thank you. I was possessed back then.”

[...]

[...]

Again, apologies for taking that post of yours as an example of a truth uttered in a thread about archontic influences.

No argument as to who you are or whether or not you were aware of the dynamic taking place in your life experiences.

[Hervé]

[...]

If those were conditions of reality there would be no reason to to keep imposing this sort of manipulation on people. So what if we 'think' we are empowered and its not really true? Would they not be content with that information if it were really true. Why do they spend so much time attempting to put us in a place of no choices, no options, and utter despair if that was our reality.

[...]

Right on!

Something is indeed happening to the programming of the "predators' mind" handed down to us... it seems to disolve when light is shone on it :) .

[Chester]

part of the price/risk/responsibility involved w/the free will thing




i also think that this is what the Creator intended -- & that the erect spine & chakras were not intended to lie dormant -- Humans have been deliberately cut off from the Creator/Source


The same creator that created all? If so, is this the same creator that created the environment within which your above stated scenario could occur? That we humans could be deliberately cut off from the same said Creator? If so, would we have anything to worry about?

What a benevolent creator that would be, huh?

Maybe we don't all know all?

Anyways, not my view - just another program I have graduated from.

It would be impossible to be a child of the Creator... the Creator I know (which happens to be "us") and be "cut off."

How can the inseparable become separate?

It has been put forth that it is our "perception of being cut off... our perception of being separate" that leaves us with the feeling that we are separate (or possibly headed there).

But this is impossible or what you are isn't real in the first place. justanotheropinion

[wynderer]

this is somewhat off the topic of Archons/abductions/milabs , as in Maarit's interview

pls define 'us,' as in in the Creator being us --



part of the price/risk/responsibility involved w/the free will thing




i also think that this is what the Creator intended -- & that the erect spine & chakras were not intended to lie dormant -- Humans have been deliberately cut off from the Creator/Source


The same creator that created all? If so, is this the same creator that created the environment within which your above stated scenario could occur? That we humans could be deliberately cut off from the same said Creator? If so, would we have anything to worry about?

What a benevolent creator that would be, huh?

Maybe we don't all know all?

Anyways, not my view - just another program I have graduated from.

It would be impossible to be a child of the Creator... the Creator I know (which happens to be "us") and be "cut off."

How can the inseparable become separate?

It has been put forth that it is our "perception of being cut off... our perception of being separate" that leaves us with the feeling that we are separate (or possibly headed there).

But this is impossible or what you are isn't real in the first place. justanotheropinion

[Flash]

I found your post interesting due to a matter of timing of a peculiar dream I had that posted in another thread. It was a couple days ago, and what made the dream peculiar was that another member's daughter had a similar dream the same evening. And heard the same things I did during the dream.

Then there were a few admissions made to me by other members that they had either very weird patterns or sleep, inability to sleep or heard the same things I heard after I woke up the day after the dream. I wasn't soliciting for opinions, these were things that were revealed to me in idle conversation.

I don't have much dream recall, I don't have dreams that leave emotionally disturbed. That I experienced either is significant. This is the sort of dream you want to wake someone up and crawl in their lap. That someone else had a similar dream and similar waking event is significant and were left as distrubed by it seem significant. The dream itself is not important. I recognized where I was at, I've been there before. A bleak, dark industrial landscape, where everyone is backed against the wall and there's no where to go. No hope, no chance for reclamation, nothing but despair. Complete and total isolation from God. Nothing was 'happening' in the dream that was disturbing those were just the conditions.

I wake up from this dream and I'm deeply disturbed. But I also KNOW that that is just not the way it is. So I'm laying there and I hear what sounds like a deep throbbing electrical hum , its pulsing on and off....like a heart beat . Dub dub dub dub....This is not good. It's EM interference and its turned up HIGH, to where I'm not just aware of it, I can hear with my physical ears, its going through the whole house. That is when I realized this 'dream' went out through the collective and has been tapped down into the psyche with these bursts of em.

When the sun started coming up it got fainter and went away entirely.

This is what our masters of the psyche are trying to imbed in us--despair. Have a sort of covert despair lurking in the subconscious. No choices, no chances, no place to go. I remember the dream, I've been in that underworld before, that's where they operate from. What lurks behind that programming--despair implantation-- is information all on it's own. Their minds are equally open when they open this sort of operation. This covert accidentally release information has something to do with the sun, and this means of programming can't occur when the sun is out. As soon as the sun rose, it killed off that pulse. I have no idea if it's HAARP or some-other assholery, but it was a ripple through the shared collective mind. To initiate emotional undercurrents of despair, of having no options. This is the end of the line.

If those were conditions of reality there would be no reason to to keep imposing this sort of manipulation on people. So what if we 'think' we are empowered and its not really true? Would they not be content with that information if it were really true. Why do they spend so much time attempting to put us in a place of no choices, no options, and utter despair if that was our reality.

[/I]
I have to say I appreciate all those who have hung in with this thread, which I think concerns a very challenging topic.

We all have had experiences that are somewhat difficult or plain impossible to describe. "Other" energies or beings, thought forms, beamed ideas, transferences, copy-cats, hitch-hikers, aliens, demons, angels, hybrids, bio-engineered robots, label-of-the-month critters are common to our lives.

On the huge over-view, we are all us and the whole system and accessories are included.

Apparently a well functioning brain is designed to filter out other realities, voices, beings, et al so that we can experience this focus for what it is. 3D reality. I observe that it's pretty good for some!

Any glitch or deliberate sabotaging (pain, drugs hypnosis) allows or ensures a vulnerability to intrusion and influence, or downright slavery. Movies, symbols, buzzwords, television - trawls for the rest of us, daily, hourly, filling the nets.

Where am I going with this? Not sure!!

I have observed that when I ignore the media and the bad stories I have very little interference in my ability to focus and create. When I get sucked into the drama I waste time, have nightmares, and feel haggard. So I do have some control over this.

Once in a while I tune in to the current events and the predicted horrible downfall of our (Western "civilized") culture and frankly, if I stay with it for a while, I don't see any reason to live another day. Insiders from the alphabet groups confirm we will be rounded up, camped, and brutally raped, tortured and killed.

So I just have to tune out and live every day like that crap storm is never going to happen, or die right now.

I will take every vitamin, mineral and organic food I can get to help me tune out of "reality". 9Eagle9 and others who do the clearing work, this is not to invalidate you at all. I just can't hang with it, not on a continual basis.

I have considered getting off this forum. And re-considered.

I read and viewed the videos here today: http://secretsun.blogspot.com/2011/01/year-of-thinking-magically-results.html which shows interviews with and about Philip K. Dick. Also talks about consciousness, reality et al. It's just too big to settle for tuning in exclusively to the "we are just pawns" reality.

We can re-focus as we are acted upon by exterior forces, or we can practise whatever discipline is necessary to guide our own focus. We can self heal, get help, if we need. And help others. I'm not in denial.

I think we have to create a good deal of the time, that we are sovreign in our life and consciousness. What else is going to give us the Oomph to deal with the cr**p when it looms into our view screen?

Hope this makes some sense.

Gosh 9Eagle9, last summer I was hearing the same humming beat, very low hum, as you say, like a dim heart beat but slow. I first thought it was construction - but in the night?? - then wonder if there was some companies nearby working with humming machine at night, then talked to my Engineer and sport medecine specialist, she was hearing the same. We even called the city to be told there was nothing in our environment doing that.

I thought we may be both nut, until today. Thank you,

This also tells me it is throughout at least North America. I also wondered if it could be the earth itself.

[Chester]

this is somewhat off the topic of Archons/abductions/milabs , as in Maarit's interview

pls define 'us,' as in in the Creator being us --



part of the price/risk/responsibility involved w/the free will thing




i also think that this is what the Creator intended -- & that the erect spine & chakras were not intended to lie dormant -- Humans have been deliberately cut off from the Creator/Source


The same creator that created all? If so, is this the same creator that created the environment within which your above stated scenario could occur? That we humans could be deliberately cut off from the same said Creator? If so, would we have anything to worry about?

What a benevolent creator that would be, huh?

Maybe we don't all know all?

Anyways, not my view - just another program I have graduated from.

It would be impossible to be a child of the Creator... the Creator I know (which happens to be "us") and be "cut off."

How can the inseparable become separate?

It has been put forth that it is our "perception of being cut off... our perception of being separate" that leaves us with the feeling that we are separate (or possibly headed there).

But this is impossible or what you are isn't real in the first place. justanotheropinion

try this one

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNAqNJByrvw

and this one

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=nUwtFJ4Nc_E

and this one

http://www.lifeartsmedia.com/tim-freke-the-mystery-experience

It's something I "got."

When I was younger, I did not get it.

What I know with no doubt is that as long as I live this life, I will never "un get it."

some get it... some don't.

justone

[9eagle9]

"Why so much despair". Whose despair is it? We the people have been mostly ignorant, blissful and blind till a few decades ago.

For thousands, hundreds of years, the ptb has been our gods. The Collective, the Faction. Our banks, our governments, (our countires). We were good citizens, we toed the line so that God would give us a blessing in the ptb church on Sunday, we worked so the neighbors wouldn't think we were sleveens, we kept a good crediting rating to keep the banks happy, served our country. We served the Gods. And we were happy to do it.

Then we figured out there was more to life than the Bible, more to God than hell and heaven, figured out credit rating was fake, insurance policies were legalized gambling, retirement accounts would be dead before we were, and all of it was a means of control and we didn’t like our gods anymore. It was all fake.


Then we figured out they needed us—taxes, slave labor, consumers of their stuff.

Then we figured out …we could do without them.

We're finding out we can do without their bank, their credit rating, their credit cards, their big gas guzzling cars, their social security number, their jobs, their health systems, their pharma compaines, their seeds., their fake everything.

Isn’t everything ,not just their magickal practices, FAKE. Fake politicians who are dummies that sit on the laps of something else. Fake doctors who couldn’t find their own ass with both hands let along operate on yours, fake money, fake cures, fake replicated seeds that make fake non nutritional plants that useless food is made from.

In the meantime we began seeing what was real. Real leaders, real magic, real healers, what real currency means, real cures, real energy, heirloom seeds and natural medicine.

They are fake and now we know they are fake and they need us to keep believing that they are real gods.

So who is rightfully the ones that should be despairing? Us? Why?

That is their despair that we are feeling.

Look at all the ‘new promises of a new world’ issued by the Drakes, the Wilocks, and the Fulfords. All of them have one single theme—They, the fake ones, the plants in the midst of the fake power structures are all promising something via these rather clueless media outlets. Promising to change things, because only the 'gods' can change things. The same way they promised low interest loans, and reverse mortgages—more fake **** that didn’t work. . Another attempt to snare us in to make us believe that they are still gods and can fix everything.

[Hervé]

Speaking of nuked, blown up planets and the soul harvesting of their inhabitants (see post # 1410 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=532714&viewfull=1#post532714)):



Draconian Encounter

By Franz Erdl
http://educate-yourself.org/cn/erdldraconianencounter09jul12,.shtml
July 9, 2012
Draconian Encounter by Franz Erdl (August 12, 2012) (http://educate-yourself.org/cn/erdldraconianencounter09jul12,.shtml)


http://www.psitalent.de/Englisch/Dracoencounter.htm


Last week, I had a session with a person who had previously worked in a mine which not only greatly harmed his health, but on top of that, he got caught up in extraterrestrials. Beneath this mine there were more tunnel facilities - created by aliens. When I had a closer look at it, I could see a black creature from deep down looking up at the workers of that mine. It was a Draco.


I could feel that this Draco was senior to the others. Maybe he was the chief of the underground base . He said to me "This planet has been promised to us!" I was able to recognize at a glance how he felt. It felt like, "Why do so many of your kind still walk around?" It seemed to me as if he has been waiting for ages to regain a planet for himself.


--- A couple of weeks ago we had freed a Draco - we healed his enormous pain - it was the destruction of his planet. Martina was able to witness this downfall due to his immense agony. The planet shattered with one huge explosion. This shock was deeply felt in all Dracos and hence their strong desire for their own planet.


Back to my encounter with the Draco. The Draco was waiting to take over the earth!


By whom? By whom was this promise given?


By the snakes (or who or whatever is above them)?


I do not think they will keep their promises. But I believe that the snakes make concessions as long as they can use other beings as mere tools. If their work is done, Grays, Reptilians, Dracos (but also Illuminati, Freemasons, banksters, etc.) will be reset to their enslaved condition.


What does the dark side want? They crave for souls, not for planets.
Their plan on earth is to cut the grounding connection of all living creatures. That is the reason why they have destroyed other planets. And thinking about it, they want to destroy planet earth and our souls should serve them as food forever. If they were interested in planets, they would not have destroyed them. But I may be wrong.


Together - the Draco and I - went through the healing process. As expected, I experienced a deep pain seated in the heart chakra which took a long time to be healed. When this was done, something wonderful happened.


Even then, a few weeks ago Martina witnessed the paternal energy of this Draco. This energy seems to be characteristic for Dracos. I was not able to perceive it before, but this time I experienced it myself.


I do not know how to describe this paternal power. The moment where I felt it, it was beautiful and I knew it was the original form of paternal power in its highest concentration. Overwhelming and beyond words because we are not aware of that power which was probably long gone. We therefore, have no comparison.


Hey folks! Now while writing this, I can feel the tingling all over. So if healed Dracos should feel like I perceive them now, then I would be happy if they stayed here.
Franz Erdl

[wynderer]

LOL at the 'paternal energy' /'paternal power' -- tho, considering some of the fathers described on Bill's reconnecting w/families thread, maybe this isn't so far from the truth

edit to add: when the Reptilians first came to planet Earth, they were likely hi-fiving each other all over the place when they learned how easy it is to manipulate the thoughts & emotions of the Humans [Earth's rightful inhabitants, imo]




Speaking of nuked, blown up planets and the soul harvesting of their inhabitants (see post # 1410 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=532714&viewfull=1#post532714)):



Draconian Encounter

By Franz Erdl
http://educate-yourself.org/cn/erdldraconianencounter09jul12,.shtml
July 9, 2012
Draconian Encounter by Franz Erdl (August 12, 2012) (http://educate-yourself.org/cn/erdldraconianencounter09jul12,.shtml)


http://www.psitalent.de/Englisch/Dracoencounter.htm


Last week, I had a session with a person who had previously worked in a mine which not only greatly harmed his health, but on top of that, he got caught up in extraterrestrials. Beneath this mine there were more tunnel facilities - created by aliens. When I had a closer look at it, I could see a black creature from deep down looking up at the workers of that mine. It was a Draco.


I could feel that this Draco was senior to the others. Maybe he was the chief of the underground base . He said to me "This planet has been promised to us!" I was able to recognize at a glance how he felt. It felt like, "Why do so many of your kind still walk around?" It seemed to me as if he has been waiting for ages to regain a planet for himself.


--- A couple of weeks ago we had freed a Draco - we healed his enormous pain - it was the destruction of his planet. Martina was able to witness this downfall due to his immense agony. The planet shattered with one huge explosion. This shock was deeply felt in all Dracos and hence their strong desire for their own planet.


Back to my encounter with the Draco. The Draco was waiting to take over the earth!


By whom? By whom was this promise given?


By the snakes (or who or whatever is above them)?


I do not think they will keep their promises. But I believe that the snakes make concessions as long as they can use other beings as mere tools. If their work is done, Grays, Reptilians, Dracos (but also Illuminati, Freemasons, banksters, etc.) will be reset to their enslaved condition.


What does the dark side want? They crave for souls, not for planets.
Their plan on earth is to cut the grounding connection of all living creatures. That is the reason why they have destroyed other planets. And thinking about it, they want to destroy planet earth and our souls should serve them as food forever. If they were interested in planets, they would not have destroyed them. But I may be wrong.


Together - the Draco and I - went through the healing process. As expected, I experienced a deep pain seated in the heart chakra which took a long time to be healed. When this was done, something wonderful happened.


Even then, a few weeks ago Martina witnessed the paternal energy of this Draco. This energy seems to be characteristic for Dracos. I was not able to perceive it before, but this time I experienced it myself.


I do not know how to describe this paternal power. The moment where I felt it, it was beautiful and I knew it was the original form of paternal power in its highest concentration. Overwhelming and beyond words because we are not aware of that power which was probably long gone. We therefore, have no comparison.


Hey folks! Now while writing this, I can feel the tingling all over. So if healed Dracos should feel like I perceive them now, then I would be happy if they stayed here.
Franz Erdl

[observer]

Click on forwarding arrow to see content of 9eagle9's comment #1563

Yes, well thank you 9eagle, for quoting my words and then misconstruing the meaning of that which I am speaking.

In your reply to my comment, you are referring to your interpretations based on your personal observations, and applying that to what you understand regarding the 'every-day' matrix of control that permeates this particular reality. Your observations based on that aspect of "releasing one's self" from the matrix of control may be all too correct.

I, on the other hand, am speaking of "releasing one's self" from the matrix of control at the moments after one expires, i.e. what one might experience after death, and things one might do during their lifetime to release one's self from this particular universe, which is nothing more than a matrix of control.

As you can see, these two concepts are, in no way, comparable to one another.

It is my interpretation from years of research into the unaltered records of antiquity.... records that have only been unearthed from the deserts of Egypt, Mesopotamia, and the Indus Valley in just the past two hundred years, or so. From these records, one might interpret that eating flesh is one of the ways that the Archons keep the 'eternal soul' aspect of our species locked within this matrix of control.

I should note, that far back into antiquity up until the Templar (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Ma%27arrat_al-Numan) took-over the control of the Gnosis, each and every group that has assembled around the concept of a God of Unconditional Love have been vegetarians. I point to the history of the True Gnosis (http://essenes.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=519&Itemid=493)as evidence to what I'm reporting.

I've come to realize, the balance between good and evil all boils-down to if one is a meat eater, or not. I do believe there is a profound significance to this observation. Regardless of how those individuals who are drunk on the 'blood of the sacrifice' want to twist the reflection into something it really isn't.

As 9eagle9 inadvertently pointed-out in her rebuttal, it all boils-down to the significance of the blood. How do you prefer your meat.... rare??? with lots of juicy blood???

That point really doesn't matter, because even at 'well-done' the blood is still there.

It's all about participation in a ritual that gives-over the power to the 'Master of the Ceremony'.

[wynderer]

hi Observer --

from your earlier post:
'I, on the other hand, am speaking of "releasing one's self" from the matrix of control at the moments after one expires, i.e. what one might experience after death, and things one might do during their lifetime to release one's self from this particular universe, which is nothing more than a matrix of control. '

i perceive that this particular 'death' -- for all those of Human origin on this planet at this time -- this is the Big One -- after leaving the body, this time it will not be a question of 'choosing' which Earth Human family to be re-born/incarnate into -- it's either get totally free & clear of the matrix , or consign one's soul to a hellish plane of existence

tha controllers/archons are, of course, well aware of this , & have set up many cunningly devised traps to lure souls to their realm

re the blood stuff -- when i started reading the real history of 'pagan' religions, not the newagey ones, i was appalled at how many used 'blood sacrifices' -- mostly w/the poor non-Human Animals, but many using Humans too

apparently there is something in Earth mammal blood that the controllers /archons need, or enjoy -- the Humans who take part in their unholy rituals are just being used to get the blood spilled -- [those valuable opposable thumbs ]--

meanwhile the blood of the non-Human Animals is spilled endlessly, all over the planet, w/most Humans shutting their hearts & minds to the Animals' 'eternal Treblinka,' as one man called it






Click on forwarding arrow to see content of 9eagle9's comment #1563

Yes, well thank you 9eagle, for quoting my words and then misconstruing the meaning of that which I am speaking.

In your reply to my comment, you are referring to your interpretations based on your personal observations, and applying that to what you understand regarding the 'every-day' matrix of control that permeates this particular reality. Your observations based on that aspect of "releasing one's self" from the matrix of control may be all too correct.

I, on the other hand, am speaking of "releasing one's self" from the matrix of control at the moments after one expires, i.e. what one might experience after death, and things one might do during their lifetime to release one's self from this particular universe, which is nothing more than a matrix of control.

As you can see, these two concepts are, in no way, comparable to one another.

It is my interpretation from years of research into the unaltered records of antiquity.... records that have only been unearthed from the deserts of Egypt, Mesopotamia, and the Indus Valley in just the past two hundred years, or so. From these records, one might interpret that eating flesh is one of the ways that the Archons keep the 'eternal soul' aspect of our species locked within this matrix of control.

I should note, that far back into antiquity up until the Templar (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Ma%27arrat_al-Numan) took-over the control of the Gnosis, each and every group that has assembled around the concept of a God of Unconditional Love have been vegetarians. I point to the history of the True Gnosis (http://essenes.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=519&Itemid=493)as evidence to what I'm reporting.

I've come to realize, the balance between good and evil all boils-down to if one is a meat eater, or not. I do believe there is a profound significance to this observation. Regardless of how those individuals who are drunk on the 'blood of the sacrifice' want to twist the reflection into something it really isn't.

As 9eagle9 inadvertently pointed-out in her rebuttal, it all boils-down to the significance of the blood. How do you prefer your meat.... rare??? with lots of juicy blood???

That point really doesn't matter, because even at 'well-done' the blood is still there.

It's all about participation in a ritual that gives-over the power to the 'Master of the Ceremony'.

[Timreh]

Just finished watching "UFOs, Aliens, and the Question of Contact"
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCgqmulQCV0)
(http://veilofreality.com/2011/03/12/...2%98%9E-video/ (http://veilofreality.com/2011/03/12/ufos-aliens-and-the-question-of-contact-%E2%98%9E-video/))
Thanks Jean-Luc..

It seems awareness and education are critical in fighting the abductions and mind games/interference
Curious does anyone have any idea of the laws and rules these invaders are bound or governed by? (mentioned by Elton Turner at around 1:44:50)

..and where might all this leave our souls in the grand scheme of things?

[9eagle9]

I could make a very long post looking at this from 360 degrees instead of 1 of 359. You make that the ultimate argument for shunning meat and you are shutting the door on some very empowering knowledge in regards to matrix building.

That wasn't a rebuttal, I'm not making a case for eating meat. You are making a case for eating only bloodless plant life as if that will somehow escape you from the fact that you are composed of flesh and blood yourself. You can't escape that. As long as you are here, you will be flesh and blood and no matter what you eat, that will not change.

Any vegetarian here escaped their flesh and blood physical experience because they chose to not eat meat? Physical is one of the conditions for the ability to navigate a physical world.

Flesh and blood is a condition of having a human physical experience, and there's no way around that. Two conditions. Unconditional is not possible in a world of conditions until some of those conditions are removed.

Interestingly enough its plants that don't have flesh and blood conditions. Still I know lots of people who have been vegetarians for a life time. And they still are not fleshless nor bloodless plants, they are still flesh and blood humans that, for that reason, are still fed on by pneuma-vores. I realize that vegetarians think they are holier than meat eaters but...they are still stuck in the same flesh and blood experience that rest of us are.

So are fruitarians and breatharians for that matter, so I think the matter is a bit deeper and complex than what someone had for dinner last night.

Another interesting little factoid that has been lost in our paternal grid lock is that the subject of blood is a woman's subject. Only a woman is able to convey blood kinship to others. Do men let blood once a month? No? Women themselves have been conditioned not to know their own creation matrices that is why we allowed a paternal paradigm to consume us.

The subject of flesh and bled esoterically and in an occult sense merits its own thread. We can't have a discussion of that sort because it will be shrilled down by those who get hysterical at the notion of eating Bambi, quite dismissing how we came to eat Bambi in the first place completely derailing the knowledge hidden in the conditions of flesh eating versus blood sacrifice.

The flesh is ONLY a conveyance for blood.

We are obsessed with flesh, the ptb with blood.

The question is why?

So instead of getting hung up on our belief attachments why don't we set them aside and explore a little bit how blood and flesh signify in our 'spiritual' practices.

What is the difference between flesh and blood? Without confusing the two and making one more important than the other, good, bad or indifferent.

[Chester]

Speaking of nuked, blown up planets and the soul harvesting of their inhabitants (see post # 1410 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=532714&viewfull=1#post532714)):



Draconian Encounter

By Franz Erdl
http://educate-yourself.org/cn/erdldraconianencounter09jul12,.shtml
July 9, 2012
Draconian Encounter by Franz Erdl (August 12, 2012) (http://educate-yourself.org/cn/erdldraconianencounter09jul12,.shtml)


http://www.psitalent.de/Englisch/Dracoencounter.htm


Last week, I had a session with a person who had previously worked in a mine which not only greatly harmed his health, but on top of that, he got caught up in extraterrestrials. Beneath this mine there were more tunnel facilities - created by aliens. When I had a closer look at it, I could see a black creature from deep down looking up at the workers of that mine. It was a Draco.


I could feel that this Draco was senior to the others. Maybe he was the chief of the underground base . He said to me "This planet has been promised to us!" I was able to recognize at a glance how he felt. It felt like, "Why do so many of your kind still walk around?" It seemed to me as if he has been waiting for ages to regain a planet for himself.


--- A couple of weeks ago we had freed a Draco - we healed his enormous pain - it was the destruction of his planet. Martina was able to witness this downfall due to his immense agony. The planet shattered with one huge explosion. This shock was deeply felt in all Dracos and hence their strong desire for their own planet.


Back to my encounter with the Draco. The Draco was waiting to take over the earth!


By whom? By whom was this promise given?


By the snakes (or who or whatever is above them)?


I do not think they will keep their promises. But I believe that the snakes make concessions as long as they can use other beings as mere tools. If their work is done, Grays, Reptilians, Dracos (but also Illuminati, Freemasons, banksters, etc.) will be reset to their enslaved condition.


What does the dark side want? They crave for souls, not for planets.
Their plan on earth is to cut the grounding connection of all living creatures. That is the reason why they have destroyed other planets. And thinking about it, they want to destroy planet earth and our souls should serve them as food forever. If they were interested in planets, they would not have destroyed them. But I may be wrong.


Together - the Draco and I - went through the healing process. As expected, I experienced a deep pain seated in the heart chakra which took a long time to be healed. When this was done, something wonderful happened.


Even then, a few weeks ago Martina witnessed the paternal energy of this Draco. This energy seems to be characteristic for Dracos. I was not able to perceive it before, but this time I experienced it myself.


I do not know how to describe this paternal power. The moment where I felt it, it was beautiful and I knew it was the original form of paternal power in its highest concentration. Overwhelming and beyond words because we are not aware of that power which was probably long gone. We therefore, have no comparison.


Hey folks! Now while writing this, I can feel the tingling all over. So if healed Dracos should feel like I perceive them now, then I would be happy if they stayed here.
Franz Erdl

Fantastic Post, Amzer Zo... I am glad I am not alone in "getting this too." I love my mother and father. I love that they are a unit to themselves which from that perspective allows me to be their child. When I step outside of this view, I see the most beautifully balanced Trinity of Mother/Father/Child.

I see this as the first gift of Creation to each of us within this material world experience. Something inside suggests to me that by honoring this dynamic I could become a true father (being male in my physical body) for my step daughter and my three sons and that I can be a true husband for my wife.

Each day I am able to find gems on this Avalon forum. Thank You, Amzer Zo for bringing forth this post at this time when I sorely needed it. justonedad (and always a child of Creation)

[Chester]

I should note, that far back into antiquity up until the Templar (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Ma%27arrat_al-Numan) took-over the control of the Gnosis, each and every group that has assembled around the concept of a God of Unconditional Love have been vegetarians. I point to the history of the True Gnosis (http://essenes.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=519&Itemid=493)as evidence to what I'm reporting.

I've come to realize, the balance between good and evil all boils-down to if one is a meat eater, or not. I do believe there is a profound significance to this observation. Regardless of how those individuals who are drunk on the 'blood of the sacrifice' want to twist the reflection into something it really isn't.

As 9eagle9 inadvertently pointed-out in her rebuttal, it all boils-down to the significance of the blood. How do you prefer your meat.... rare??? with lots of juicy blood???

That point really doesn't matter, because even at 'well-done' the blood is still there.

It's all about participation in a ritual that gives-over the power to the 'Master of the Ceremony'.

My inner voice has been telling me this more and more recently. I have tried to go vegetarian more than once and failed. Each time I went through such a drop in my ability to think that I jeopardized my ability to work and thus my ability to provide for my family.

Having said the above, I have recently acquired a 30-day cleanse kit which all but demands a juice / raw fruits and vegetables diet.

I have been contacted by a poster here that has offered me help along the lines of removing parasites, specifically candida which I am all but certain I am riddled with.

I will keep folks posted as to what I do in this regard. I do not place the odds very high that I will succeed in eliminating meat from my diet, but I have once again cracked open this door and the clock of my physical body is definitely winding down.

Thanks, Observer... justoneman

[Chester]

Just finished watching "UFOs, Aliens, and the Question of Contact"
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCgqmulQCV0)
(http://veilofreality.com/2011/03/12/...2%98%9E-video/ (http://veilofreality.com/2011/03/12/ufos-aliens-and-the-question-of-contact-%E2%98%9E-video/))
Thanks Jean-Luc..

It seems awareness and education are critical in fighting the abductions and mind games/interference
Curious does anyone have any idea of the laws and rules these invaders are bound or governed by? (mentioned by Elton Turner at around 1:44:50)

..and where might all this leave our souls in the grand scheme of things?

I am sort of "new" at this (at least in this lifetime) but what works for me is that I (my egoic self that has somehow incarnated in this material reality) maintain a steady connection with my spiritual higher self where I "step aside" and allow that spiritual higher self to take the lead.

My life is far smoother yet at the same time I am presented even greater challenges than I have ever experienced before.

for what it's worth - justoneapproach from justoneman

[Fred Steeves]

It seems awareness and education are critical in fighting the abductions and mind games/interference
Curious does anyone have any idea of the laws and rules these invaders are bound or governed by? (mentioned by Elton Turner at around 1:44:50)


Our permission.

[wynderer]

a suggestion : try using the power of compassion & empathy to stop eating dead animals, instead of doing it from concern for your 3D body




I should note, that far back into antiquity up until the Templar (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Ma%27arrat_al-Numan) took-over the control of the Gnosis, each and every group that has assembled around the concept of a God of Unconditional Love have been vegetarians. I point to the history of the True Gnosis (http://essenes.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=519&Itemid=493)as evidence to what I'm reporting.

I've come to realize, the balance between good and evil all boils-down to if one is a meat eater, or not. I do believe there is a profound significance to this observation. Regardless of how those individuals who are drunk on the 'blood of the sacrifice' want to twist the reflection into something it really isn't.

As 9eagle9 inadvertently pointed-out in her rebuttal, it all boils-down to the significance of the blood. How do you prefer your meat.... rare??? with lots of juicy blood???

That point really doesn't matter, because even at 'well-done' the blood is still there.

It's all about participation in a ritual that gives-over the power to the 'Master of the Ceremony'.

My inner voice has been telling me this more and more recently. I have tried to go vegetarian more than once and failed. Each time I went through such a drop in my ability to think that I jeopardized my ability to work and thus my ability to provide for my family.

Having said the above, I have recently acquired a 30-day cleanse kit which all but demands a juice / raw fruits and vegetables diet.

I have been contacted by a poster here that has offered me help along the lines of removing parasites, specifically candida which I am all but certain I am riddled with.

I will keep folks posted as to what I do in this regard. I do not place the odds very high that I will succeed in eliminating meat from my diet, but I have once again cracked open this door and the clock of my physical body is definitely winding down.

Thanks, Observer... justoneman

[9eagle9]

Genetics certainly contribute to it. If we are a radio station, genetics is the circuit board, but then we have the transmission, the receivers, the broad cast, the electrical transmission, sound waves, and the programming to contend with as well. And whatever else I left out.



Well, as long as we are on the topic of aberrant behaviors associated with aliens, we need to go back 200,000 years and start at the beginning...

[...]

The main caveat is that there is a possibility that the experiment is being terminated and the fact that soul essence cannot be extracted , and that the new hybrid humans are ready to be released while the old version, which is us, is to be exterminated...

[...]


Cough... cough... cough... which beginning?



[...]

It should make it clear that all sides/aspects of any conflicts were implanted into our minds... "They gave us their minds" said Juan Maltus to Castaneda... and ever since "WE" 've been busy RE-creating all those figures, constructs, programs and kept ourselves and "them" entertained with them...

Here is the transcript of the video (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=529642&viewfull=1#post529642) I was able to concoct:

[In the following "R6" equates to the implanted "mind" given to "us" by Castaneda's "predators" and "dramatization" means the re-creation or acting out of the R6/ unconscious "mind" implanted hypnotic commands. Hence, R6ers are the hypnotically-tranced, skull-dwelling zombies we got to know as the "sheeples." Accordingly, MKultra, satanic, etc. types of mind-control and implants are "dramatizations" of that "R6" "mind/unconscious"]


[...]

Although it’s a fairly simple implant but it was quite effective in lousing people up because it interrupted them from creating what they would have created and took away what mock-ups that he did have and it stop the cycle and it put something there that is unwanted and so when they tried to create, they created it [the “unwanted”]. They fixed his attention by “protest.”

All right.

For this planet, and for this Confederacy of the 21 adjacent stars and its 76 planets; the Incident Two… it is a very long and [?] complex incident… all in 36 days.

[...]

These planets averaged 178 billion human beings per planet. One hundred and seventy eight billion. There were 250 billion on this planet, the name of this planet was Teegeeak and this is known as the “bomb-place” and this is the “evil place.” This is the place [?pretty much all of it?] got smashed.

[...]

Now, that is peculiar and only to this planet and to this confederation. There have been other implants of various kind and sizes but this is probably one of the longest, most violent and wildest implant in this sector of the universe.

[...]

They were [?imported?], they were actually… the trick was to shoot somebody, disable somebody, very often a needle into a lung and at the same time to hit him with frozen alcohol and glycol which preparation is guaranteed to pick up a being. All they had to do was: pick him up and put him in a refrigerator and they had him boy. When he tried to exteriorize from the body, there he was -- frozen.

[...]

People were ferried in here by the billions and the billions and the billions and they were ferried in here with boxes and they were put in boxes and stacked around and the people who were on this planet already, just caught it in the teeth, nobody bothered to pick them up. [...]... it blew the beings into the air and after the bomb, an electronic ribbon which also was a type of standing wave was erected over the area. The tremendous winds on the planet blew every being there was straight in to those particular vacuum zones which had been created. These were brought down, packed up and put in front of projection machines [?] with sound and colored pictures. First gave them the implant which you know as “Clearing Course.” Then, a whole track [was] implanted which you know as OT II.

[...]

The entirety of Roman Catholicism, the devil and all of these sorts of things, that is all part of R6. Practically anything you can think of, all modern theatres in actual fact are built with the exact symbols shown [???] in R6.

[...]

Now, the net result of all of this, was to make a 75 million year vacuum. That’s as far as this part of the universe is concerned. You wonder why: “Why don’t… if there are saucers around, why don’t they land on this planet?”

This planet, traditionally, over the various zones and area has an evil reputation. Mutineers and deserters and that sort of thing were often dumped on this planet. They’ll often come here and refuge because they know nobody’s gonna come after them.

This planet is the planet of the evil repute and this sector of the universe has a very evil repute.

Now, all the data which you have that was set out seventy four fluff-fluff-fluff million years ago – almost seventy five – this catastrophe overcame this confederation and has just made it an unsavory part of this universe, to say the least.

About, well, relatively, we are almost in modern times -- 20 million years ago, something like that – somebody started a body line on the planet; it gradually worked through various areas of barbarism and once more, R6 tailored made it to be nothing but a caveman civilization.

Nevertheless, they moved up the line and they moved up toward the dramatization of R6 and that’s what man calls “progress.” And they have managed to make things, this way and that way and their technology is rather pathetic but they’ve moved up the line until they… until there is some possibilities of establishing communication with regard to the activity. The “fate” of the R6ers and we have many a PC who will say to you “Oh my god, they are after me…” it sure fixed up an area, they fixed up an implant that their… people are taught carefully that any man who tries to save the world must be killed, he must be mobbed, hanged.

[...]

Somebody, somewhere on this planet -- back about 600 BC, found some pieces of R6. I don’t know how they found it, either by watching madmen or something, but since that time, they have used it and it became what is known as Christianity.

[...]

Now, to get an edge in, in this particular area and blow this up as a “mass” engram and so forth is quite a trick and we are involved in doing just that. No universe is safe where people are smashed that badly. It becomes the business of any being because the universe in which he lives – as long as it contains a cancerous area such as this old confederation and so on – is not a universe in which one can really freely move. Simple.

[...]

There are certain things which make people ill and that is when they get into certain zones or areas or positions which approximate the R6 positions; such as a body lying in the rain with a rat, below the cross. Guaranteed to give people colds. And so forth, so you have colds from rain. Yet you take baths, you get wet and don’t get a cold. When they get cold, it restimulates frozen alcohol and glycol, as a mix, and therefore they get into a dramatization. So, their sickness is very closely tied-in with R6. [...] Also, a body was only supposed to live seventy years which is a bunch of balderdash. Before R6, and so forth they lived on and on and on and on… there was no such thing as death. They taught people death, they taught them amnesia, these various things. They all come from this zone and area.

[...]




Now, I wouldn't mind THAT particular "experiment" to end... the trouble is that most everybody seem to think that all the problems are coming from the body-line and its genetics whereas the real deal LIES with the IMPLANTED BEINGS occupying said bodies... beings which are re-wired to create/manifest in their environment exactly what they specifically DO NOT WANT!

Machiavellian to say the least.

To that, add a little population problem: 7 billion incarnated "souls"... that makes, to simplify, 240 billion "out there" in-waiting... that makes for a very, very crowded "astral realm," each "manifesting" who or what they "believe" -- i.e. hypnotically ordered -- to be.

In short, it takes quite some compassion to even consider tackling that "problem."

[wynderer]

luv ya, Fred, but gotta disagree -- i think this planet is of such interest to so many different ETs because the complete disrespect for & overriding of free will going on here is to the extreme at this time --

as i see it , the 'contracts'/ 'giving permission' theories going around now are just more of the very subtle & very clever manipulations of Human minds by the controllers/archons

we do give permission by our actions -- hence my trying to alert folks to the karma they are amassing by how they act w/our Animal brothers & sisiters

wyn





It seems awareness and education are critical in fighting the abductions and mind games/interference
Curious does anyone have any idea of the laws and rules these invaders are bound or governed by? (mentioned by Elton Turner at around 1:44:50)


Our permission.

[9eagle9]

The problem with today's spirituality is that it tacitly conveys that we should not have any challenges. We are supposed to be striving not to have unnecessary challenges that distract us from what concrete challenges we may not only encounter, but over power. All of life is a challenge but our challenges are in part, produced from our perception, what we have locked in side of us, our filters.

Challenge number 1. "I don't have clarity. I seek to have the clarity lacking in me. "

So one succeeds in being able to see circumstances more clearly.

Now the ability to see things clearly when others cannot is a challenge. People crave clarity but when they begin to have it they find its not well received by those who still have filters on. Conversely those who have filters on aren't noticing what you are doing, which is a blessing not a challenge.

The usual things people find challenging, I don't often experience. On the other hand this opens the door to some challenges that are basically foreign and literally 'alien' territory for us to navigate. If you are in that doorway of experiencing something that others have not its hard to convey understanding to those who are not having that experience.

So if you are alone in trail blazing foreign or alien territory, who do you call for help? Who is your back up person?



Just finished watching "UFOs, Aliens, and the Question of Contact"
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCgqmulQCV0)
(http://veilofreality.com/2011/03/12/...2%98%9E-video/ (http://veilofreality.com/2011/03/12/ufos-aliens-and-the-question-of-contact-%E2%98%9E-video/))
Thanks Jean-Luc..

It seems awareness and education are critical in fighting the abductions and mind games/interference
Curious does anyone have any idea of the laws and rules these invaders are bound or governed by? (mentioned by Elton Turner at around 1:44:50)

..and where might all this leave our souls in the grand scheme of things?

I am sort of "new" at this (at least in this lifetime) but what works for me is that I (my egoic self that has somehow incarnated in this material reality) maintain a steady connection with my spiritual higher self where I "step aside" and allow that spiritual higher self to take the lead.

My life is far smoother yet at the same time I am presented even greater challenges than I have ever experienced before.

for what it's worth - justoneapproach from justoneman

[9eagle9]

What sort of karma does our animal friends invoke when they ingest other animals?

It is interesting to me that
luv ya, Fred, but gotta disagree -- i think this planet is of such interest to so many different ETs because the complete disrespect for & overriding of free will going on here is to the extreme at this time --

as i see it , the 'contracts'/ 'giving permission' theories going around now are just more of the very subtle & very clever manipulations of Human minds by the controllers/archons

we do give permission by our actions -- hence my trying to alert folks to the karma they are amassing by how they act w/our Animal brothers & sisiters

wyn





It seems awareness and education are critical in fighting the abductions and mind games/interference
Curious does anyone have any idea of the laws and rules these invaders are bound or governed by? (mentioned by Elton Turner at around 1:44:50)


Our permission.

[wynderer]

there is an ancient Veda that says that it was the actions of Humans [highest-vibrating consciousness of all rightful inhabitants of Earth] which created the kill-eat thing

perhaps due to the genetic/astral manipulation of Humans, before they had a chance to activate/align all chakras & open that conduit to the Creator/Source

our Animal brothers & sisters do not torture each other for the fun of it -- a study determined that 7 out of 10 mice caught by cats get away, for instance



What sort of karma does our animal friends invoke when they ingest other animals?

It is interesting to me that
luv ya, Fred, but gotta disagree -- i think this planet is of such interest to so many different ETs because the complete disrespect for & overriding of free will going on here is to the extreme at this time --

as i see it , the 'contracts'/ 'giving permission' theories going around now are just more of the very subtle & very clever manipulations of Human minds by the controllers/archons

we do give permission by our actions -- hence my trying to alert folks to the karma they are amassing by how they act w/our Animal brothers & sisiters

wyn





It seems awareness and education are critical in fighting the abductions and mind games/interference
Curious does anyone have any idea of the laws and rules these invaders are bound or governed by? (mentioned by Elton Turner at around 1:44:50)


Our permission.

[9eagle9]

I periodically eat meat myself, but I've never tortured an animal in order to do so. I am curious is that the perception that is held about meat eaters is that they are indulging in forms of torture when they are claiming their meat?

[wynderer]

I periodically eat meat myself, but I've never tortured an animal in order to do so. I am curious is that the perception that is held about meat eaters is that they are indulging in forms of torture when they are claiming their meat?

'EARTHLINGS is an award-winning documentary film about the suffering of animals for food, fashion, pets, entertainment and medical research. Considered the most persuasive documentary ever made.'


h-gqikETguQ

[heyokah]

I periodically eat meat myself, but I've never tortured an animal in order to do so. I am curious is that the perception that is held about meat eaters is that they are indulging in forms of torture when they are claiming their meat?

Our hands may be clean....

LnlusPCzXI0

[Chester]

I could make a very long post looking at this from 360 degrees instead of 1 of 359. You make that the ultimate argument for shunning meat and you are shutting the door on some very empowering knowledge in regards to matrix building.

That wasn't a rebuttal, I'm not making a case for eating meat. You are making a case for eating only bloodless plant life as if that will somehow escape you from the fact that you are composed of flesh and blood yourself. You can't escape that. As long as you are here, you will be flesh and blood and no matter what you eat, that will not change.

Any vegetarian here escaped their flesh and blood physical experience because they chose to not eat meat? Physical is one of the conditions for the ability to navigate a physical world.

Flesh and blood is a condition of having a human physical experience, and there's no way around that. Two conditions. Unconditional is not possible in a world of conditions until some of those conditions are removed.

Interestingly enough its plants that don't have flesh and blood conditions. Still I know lots of people who have been vegetarians for a life time. And they still are not fleshless nor bloodless plants, they are still flesh and blood humans that, for that reason, are still fed on by pneuma-vores. I realize that vegetarians think they are holier than meat eaters but...they are still stuck in the same flesh and blood experience that rest of us are.

So are fruitarians and breatharians for that matter, so I think the matter is a bit deeper and complex than what someone had for dinner last night.

Another interesting little factoid that has been lost in our paternal grid lock is that the subject of blood is a woman's subject. Only a woman is able to convey blood kinship to others. Do men let blood once a month? No? Women themselves have been conditioned not to know their own creation matrices that is why we allowed a paternal paradigm to consume us.

The subject of flesh and bled esoterically and in an occult sense merits its own thread. We can't have a discussion of that sort because it will be shrilled down by those who get hysterical at the notion of eating Bambi, quite dismissing how we came to eat Bambi in the first place completely derailing the knowledge hidden in the conditions of flesh eating versus blood sacrifice.

The flesh is ONLY a conveyance for blood.

We are obsessed with flesh, the ptb with blood.

The question is why?

So instead of getting hung up on our belief attachments why don't we set them aside and explore a little bit how blood and flesh signify in our 'spiritual' practices.

What is the difference between flesh and blood? Without confusing the two and making one more important than the other, good, bad or indifferent.

9eagle9 is all over this forum and brings a great deal of wisdom to the table. This post of hers here is perhaps one of her most hard hitting posts yet. I vote YES to you, 9eagle9, (or someone here... maybe me if no one else) starts this thread because I can already see via the several points 9eagle9 made, that I for one would highly benefit from this deeper exploration and I suspect I would not be alone. justoneman

[Chester]

a suggestion : try using the power of compassion & empathy to stop eating dead animals, instead of doing it from concern for your 3D body




I should note, that far back into antiquity up until the Templar (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Ma%27arrat_al-Numan) took-over the control of the Gnosis, each and every group that has assembled around the concept of a God of Unconditional Love have been vegetarians. I point to the history of the True Gnosis (http://essenes.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=519&Itemid=493)as evidence to what I'm reporting.

I've come to realize, the balance between good and evil all boils-down to if one is a meat eater, or not. I do believe there is a profound significance to this observation. Regardless of how those individuals who are drunk on the 'blood of the sacrifice' want to twist the reflection into something it really isn't.

As 9eagle9 inadvertently pointed-out in her rebuttal, it all boils-down to the significance of the blood. How do you prefer your meat.... rare??? with lots of juicy blood???

That point really doesn't matter, because even at 'well-done' the blood is still there.

It's all about participation in a ritual that gives-over the power to the 'Master of the Ceremony'.

My inner voice has been telling me this more and more recently. I have tried to go vegetarian more than once and failed. Each time I went through such a drop in my ability to think that I jeopardized my ability to work and thus my ability to provide for my family.

Having said the above, I have recently acquired a 30-day cleanse kit which all but demands a juice / raw fruits and vegetables diet.

I have been contacted by a poster here that has offered me help along the lines of removing parasites, specifically candida which I am all but certain I am riddled with.

I will keep folks posted as to what I do in this regard. I do not place the odds very high that I will succeed in eliminating meat from my diet, but I have once again cracked open this door and the clock of my physical body is definitely winding down.

Thanks, Observer... justoneman

Hi Wynderer, apologies I did not make that clear that that was the actual, core, motivating reason to explore this change in lifestyle. If there be other benefits, such as for my physical body, I see those as welcome, but secondary.

But I see going vegetarian as a personal decision that I would try out in hopes that I would feel better all around and not simply physically. What I am most certainly comfortable with is that others eat meat. Doesn't bother me a bit. Isn't that an individual choice?

In addition, 9eagle9s points appear far more penetrating as to the issues we seem consumed with in this thread and I hope this thread topic suggestion she made sees the light of day and soon.

There is no escaping the fact I live in a body, surrounded by flesh where blood flows within my veins. There is no denying that just about every single authority regarding life at its various levels seems highly preoccupied with blood.

Cheers! justoneman

[Chester]

For what its worth, Wynderer, Fred and I recently discussed stopping eating meat based on "compassion" and "empathy." I tried and lasted about 48 hours and told Fred I would be honest about it if I failed. At the same time, I don't nor won't judge any living being from eating any other living being as I live in a matrix of the consumers and the consumed, the chasers and the chased.

In fact, my acceptance that my essential being (my spirit) has chosen and/or been duped into incarnating within a material world dynamic within which I have anchored myself such that (at least when I was younger) what was most important was "me" and that this "me" was the "me" centered upon my physical body, this single life and what "I" could get out of it, has allowed me to free myself of that part of my reality which in turn has allowed my "true self" which is my spirit being to begin to blossom.

What I noticed by my "ego" learning to step aside is that I have become much more beneficial to my family, loved ones, friends and anyone else with which life places me in contact. I sense that this is beneficial for all of us and I am humbled in that I can be happy with doing the tiny part I can do in this regard.

justone

[9eagle9]

Eating dead animals, she said dryly, is preferable to eating living animals live.

I would make a request. If I give a heartfelt question, please don't give me a video-ized version of someone else's truth. That tells me a number of things, that you aren't seriously invested in your own truth, because its not really yours. It's someone elses. What I am asking of you is coming from me, not someone else.

[9eagle9]

I am very aware of the energetic effects of torturing animals and eating tortured animals especially wholesale. That has its own repercussions that people view as karma but I'm sure is simply cause and effect.

I am speaking of people who are responsible for what goes into their bodies. You can consume meat without being into the commercialized slaughterhouse aspect of it. I have free range chickens, I LOVE my chickens, even my greatest critics cannot deny that I love my chickens, I eat eggs produced from animals that are loved very much.

I get milk from a local dairy that treats its animals with respect. I can actually walk the dairy and see these animals are treated respectfully.

I would eat a free range chicken before I ate from a field that was covered in pesticides, and milled over by people who didn't respect the soil from where the plants grew.

I am not sure how I am torturing animals by behaving in this matter.

Meat of animals not handled with respect smells bad right out of the package.

So do plants that have been irradiated, and grown in corrupted soil.

[Fred Steeves]

This conversation is far too important to start turning into the old tired, and unresolvable debate over what we choose to put in our bellies. As far as I'm concerned anyway, we all live with blood on our hands. Not just physically, but energetically. Especially energetically. We either have the courage to regognize this and deal with it accordingly, or nothing will ever change.

We have met the enemy, and he is us.

[Hervé]

Genetics certainly contribute to it. If we are a radio station, genetics is the circuit board, but then we have the transmission, the receivers, the broad cast, the electrical transmission, sound waves, and the programming to contend with as well. And whatever else I left out.

I agree to some degree... however I still consider these following bits the more potent factors in the "creation" of "problems" than anything else:



[...]


... Before R6, and so forth they lived on and on and on and on… there was no such thing as death. They taught people death, they taught them amnesia, these various things. They all come from this zone and area.

[...]
[...]

... beings which are re-wired to create/manifest in their environment exactly what they specifically DO NOT WANT!

Machiavellian to say the least.

[...]

After all, one's body is one's most immediate environment.

With that, some beings are still able to transmute a farm tractor "body" into a Lamborghini as far as their most immediate environment is concerned, most others do the reverse. I guess that you may have "thought" about it a lot, or not and just "did," but... if you are able to get your car running on "empty" for miles... what's so different with a body?

[Hervé]

[...]

Curious does anyone have any idea of the laws and rules these invaders are bound or governed by? (mentioned by Elton Turner at around 1:44:50)

..and where might all this leave our souls in the grand scheme of things?

You may want to have a good look at this thread and listen to the listed interviews:

Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics)

[9eagle9]

Yes Fred now that we agree on that , the issue is why we are the enemy. That is what people don't want to look at but there is where part of the solution lies.

[wynderer]

9Eagle9, you are an intelligent woman -- & a warrioress in your own way -- as another warrioress, i challenge you to watch 'Earthlings' all the way thru & then get back to me

wyn

QUOTE=9eagle9;537493]Eating dead animals, she said dryly, is preferable to eating living animals live.

I would make a request. If I give a heartfelt question, please don't give me a video-ized version of someone else's truth. That tells me a number of things, that you aren't seriously invested in your own truth, because its not really yours. It's someone elses. What I am asking of you is coming from me, not someone else.[/QUOTE]

[modwiz]

9Eagle9, you are an intelligent woman -- & a warrioress in your own way -- as another warrioress, i challenge you to watch 'Earthlings' all the way thru & then get back to me

wyn

QUOTE=9eagle9;537493]Eating dead animals, she said dryly, is preferable to eating living animals live.

I would make a request. If I give a heartfelt question, please don't give me a video-ized version of someone else's truth. That tells me a number of things, that you aren't seriously invested in your own truth, because its not really yours. It's someone elses. What I am asking of you is coming from me, not someone else.[/QUOTE]

This is an odd way to honor a request.

[wynderer]

i'm an odd person -- my friends are very tolerant folk [odd by Earth Human standards, that is]



9Eagle9, you are an intelligent woman -- & a warrioress in your own way -- as another warrioress, i challenge you to watch 'Earthlings' all the way thru & then get back to me

wyn

QUOTE=9eagle9;537493]Eating dead animals, she said dryly, is preferable to eating living animals live.

I would make a request. If I give a heartfelt question, please don't give me a video-ized version of someone else's truth. That tells me a number of things, that you aren't seriously invested in your own truth, because its not really yours. It's someone elses. What I am asking of you is coming from me, not someone else.[/QUOTE]

This is an odd way to honor a request.

[9eagle9]

I am given to take then you are the creator of Earthlings and that is an expression that came from yourself?

or as I said, earlier that is a way for you to avoid an authentic answer and give over to me someone elses truth?

* Watching videos isn't a challenge, using ones own wherewithall is...*

[modwiz]

i'm an odd person -- my friends are very tolerant folk



9Eagle9, you are an intelligent woman -- & a warrioress in your own way -- as another warrioress, i challenge you to watch 'Earthlings' all the way thru & then get back to me

wyn

QUOTE=9eagle9;537493]Eating dead animals, she said dryly, is preferable to eating living animals live.

I would make a request. If I give a heartfelt question, please don't give me a video-ized version of someone else's truth. That tells me a number of things, that you aren't seriously invested in your own truth, because its not really yours. It's someone elses. What I am asking of you is coming from me, not someone else.[/QUOTE]

This is an odd way to honor a request.

Passive/aggressive is what your kind of oddity is perceived as by those who are astute enough to see how they are being played.

No more energy from me. :bolt:

[wynderer]

i am very disappointed in you, 9Eagle9 -- a warrioress turning a challenge down thru use of words on the net -- tch, tch

what about watching 'Earthlings'? -- i think i remember you posting something about not liking to look negativity in the face [paraphrasing]


I am given to take then you are the creator of Earthlings and that is an expression that came from yourself?

or as I said, earlier that is a way for you to avoid an authentic answer and give over to me someone elses truth?

[9eagle9]

Lol. Some people are genetically inclined just to cause problems. You I suspect are one of them.

The bottom line here much of our conscious programming and the way it has been preserved has been patterned or duplicated on how genetics and dna work. Dna is meant to be self preserving, and so are the psyche programs.

Then someone (thing) hit on the idea of programming the two, in a coincident way. Why stick to mangling one's psyche when you can horse around with their physical body as well.

I happen to agree that that programming such as the R6 you refer to presents a bigger problem. Genetics seems to be , often times, a road block to clearing certain types of programming. There are deaths that are genetically programmed to occur, or rather coincide with the programs running through people's minds. What we call death contracts, on a conscious level those are fairly easy to clear.

Death is very much a program, one of the oldest population control programs we have out there. And all this time we thought it was something new the ptb cooked up .We've gotten people to accept it as such anyway as a natural 'progression of life'.. I would imagine in getting people to accept death as we have been told death to be, we've forgotten that is is a program that has been instilled in us. All the moral arguments about how death brings us to god, its rather unnecessary. It seems like a very small challenge to simply align with your maker because you dropped dead --something nearly everyone can do these days--Lo but a much greater challenge to align with Creation while living and wallowing under all these conditions.

It seems much more economical environmentally to have one container . A new definition of simplify your life( lives).

For free spirited people who don't give much thought to death, we have doctors to remind and even begin triggering the death process. As people say , the fastest way to get sick is to visit the doctor. You walk in for a check up and you leave raddled in imminent doom thoughts.


Aging is a program that is consciously and genetically coincident. Take the consciousness portion of it out of the equation and it has a hard time triggering the genetic program it's running along.

Many diseases are as well. Genetically speaking bio-engineered diseases are adapted to key in to our shared genetic structures. Whomever was playing with genetics left a situation open to where our genetics could be compromised to allow disease to invade.

Menopause--another program that is revered as the 'time of the crone'. We are taught to honor and revere our genetic programming that speeds along the consciousness death program.

Programs or conditions that work coincident with genetics and even race. I don't know a lot of white people that lay awake at night worrying they will get sickle cell anemia. Their reality is far different than certain black people who may be genetically inclined towards having that disease expressed.

If you know what I mean.

There's a reason for that well. If we just arranged programming to compromise us through consciousness someone eventually is going to wake up to that (and we have) so double security system is , in some instances, required. Make sure we have consciousness compromising conditions and genetically compromised programming to back it up.

I have no idea how people cope who are heavily compromised with both, or find their way out from under that grid lock with out becoming consciously aware of what they are burdened by First. So in that respect I agree one must come to some sort of conscious clarity to tackle the genetic portion of it.



Genetics certainly contribute to it. If we are a radio station, genetics is the circuit board, but then we have the transmission, the receivers, the broad cast, the electrical transmission, sound waves, and the programming to contend with as well. And whatever else I left out.

I agree to some degree... however I still consider these following bits the more potent factors in the "creation" of "problems" than anything else:



[...]


... Before R6, and so forth they lived on and on and on and on… there was no such thing as death. They taught people death, they taught them amnesia, these various things. They all come from this zone and area.

[...]
[...]

... beings which are re-wired to create/manifest in their environment exactly what they specifically DO NOT WANT!

Machiavellian to say the least.

[...]

After all, one's body is one's most immediate environment.

With that, some beings are still able to transmute a farm tractor "body" into a Lamborghini as far as their most immediate environment is concerned, most others do the reverse. I guess that you may have "thought" about it a lot, or not and just "did," but... if you are able to get your car running on "empty" for miles... what's so different with a body?

[modwiz]

Tsk tsk, lady raptor of the ninth energy. You have been disapproved of by a school marm who has given you a homework assignment that you refuse to attend to.

May your eggshells be thin and break. :rolleyes:

Do bald eagle omelets cause hair loss? :confused:

[wynderer]

this is going to sound really rude -- mods/admins, feel free to delete -- but -- sometimes, 9Eagle9 & Justoneman, when reading your lengthy posts, what comes to mind is something the Original People of the land i was born in say comes to mind: 'White people talk too much'

also our Original Peoples have observed that white people live in their heads, & not in their hearts

9Eagle9, the challenge to you to watch 'Earthlings' is a challenge to your heart




Lol. Some people are genetically inclined just to cause problems. You I suspect are one of them.

The bottom line here much of our conscious programming and the way it has been preserved has been patterned or duplicated on how genetics and dna work. Dna is meant to be self preserving, and so are the psyche programs.

Then someone (thing) hit on the idea of programming the two, in a coincident way. Why stick to mangling one's psyche when you can horse around with their physical body as well.

I happen to agree that that programming such as the R6 you refer to presents a bigger problem. Genetics seems to be , often times, a road block to clearing certain types of programming. There are deaths that are genetically programmed to occur, or rather coincide with the programs running through people's minds. What we call death contracts, on a conscious level those are fairly easy to clear.

Death is very much a program, one of the oldest population control programs we have out there. And all this time we thought it was something new the ptb cooked up .We've gotten people to accept it as such anyway as a natural 'progression of life'.. I would imagine in getting people to accept death as we have been told death to be, we've forgotten that is is a program that has been instilled in us. All the moral arguments about how death brings us to god, its rather unnecessary. It seems like a very small challenge to simply align with your maker because you dropped dead --something nearly everyone can do these days--Lo but a much greater challenge to align with Creation while living and wallowing under all these conditions.

It seems much more economical environmentally to have one container . A new definition of simplify your life( lives).

For free spirited people who don't give much thought to death, we have doctors to remind and even begin triggering the death process. As people say , the fastest way to get sick is to visit the doctor. You walk in for a check up and you leave raddled in imminent doom thoughts.


Aging is a program that is consciously and genetically coincident. Take the consciousness portion of it out of the equation and it has a hard time triggering the genetic program it's running along.

Many diseases are as well. Genetically speaking bio-engineered diseases are adapted to key in to our shared genetic structures. Whomever was playing with genetics left a situation open to where our genetics could be compromised to allow disease to invade.

Menopause--another program that is revered as the 'time of the crone'. We are taught to honor and revere our genetic programming that speeds along the consciousness death program.

Programs or conditions that work coincident with genetics and even race. I don't know a lot of white people that lay awake at night worrying they will get sickle cell anemia. Their reality is far different than certain black people who may be genetically inclined towards having that disease expressed.

If you know what I mean.

There's a reason for that well. If we just arranged programming to compromise us through consciousness someone eventually is going to wake up to that (and we have) so double security system is , in some instances, required. Make sure we have consciousness compromising conditions and genetically compromised programming to back it up.

I have no idea how people cope who are heavily compromised with both, or find their way out from under that grid lock with out becoming consciously aware of what they are burdened by First. So in that respect I agree one must come to some sort of conscious clarity to tackle the genetic portion of it.



Genetics certainly contribute to it. If we are a radio station, genetics is the circuit board, but then we have the transmission, the receivers, the broad cast, the electrical transmission, sound waves, and the programming to contend with as well. And whatever else I left out.

I agree to some degree... however I still consider these following bits the more potent factors in the "creation" of "problems" than anything else:



[...]


... Before R6, and so forth they lived on and on and on and on… there was no such thing as death. They taught people death, they taught them amnesia, these various things. They all come from this zone and area.

[...]
[...]

... beings which are re-wired to create/manifest in their environment exactly what they specifically DO NOT WANT!

Machiavellian to say the least.

[...]

After all, one's body is one's most immediate environment.

With that, some beings are still able to transmute a farm tractor "body" into a Lamborghini as far as their most immediate environment is concerned, most others do the reverse. I guess that you may have "thought" about it a lot, or not and just "did," but... if you are able to get your car running on "empty" for miles... what's so different with a body?

[9eagle9]

Do you know what a direct answer is? Or are you going to prove Modwiz correct repeatedly. A warrior actually engages directly not by avoidance.

I'm not a warrior by the way. That is label you are assigning to me very likely by observing the wrong sort of media on the forum of late, so you can build up a false image of me and then attempt to push into a puddle.

Sorry someone already attempted that this week.



i am very disappointed in you, 9Eagle9 -- a warrioress turning a challenge down thru use of words on the net -- tch, tch

what about watching 'Earthlings'? -- i think i remember you posting something about not liking to look negativity in the face [paraphrasing]


I am given to take then you are the creator of Earthlings and that is an expression that came from yourself?

or as I said, earlier that is a way for you to avoid an authentic answer and give over to me someone elses truth?

[wynderer]

to what do you request a direct answer? [& i notice you are avoiding any mention of 'Earthlings' ]


Do you know what a direct answer is? Or are you going to prove Modwiz correct repeatedly. A warrior actually engages directly not by avoidance.

I'm not a warrior by the way. That is label you are assigning to me very likely by observing the wrong sort of media on the forum of late, so you can build up a false image of me and then attempt to push into a puddle.

Sorry someone already attempted that this week.



i am very disappointed in you, 9Eagle9 -- a warrioress turning a challenge down thru use of words on the net -- tch, tch

what about watching 'Earthlings'? -- i think i remember you posting something about not liking to look negativity in the face [paraphrasing]


I am given to take then you are the creator of Earthlings and that is an expression that came from yourself?

or as I said, earlier that is a way for you to avoid an authentic answer and give over to me someone elses truth?

[9eagle9]

Wynder If I watch Earthlings (lovely label) and deconstruct it in my own usual fashion how happy are you going to be?

White people who have something relevant to say are going to be like anyone else of any color that has something relevant to say no matter how long winded. If you implying that you are a person of color and your brevity of passive aggressive mud pie making is some how relevant only because of its brevity, I'm going to agree.

Origin-al species are not arranged by color by the way.

[9eagle9]

Ever directly: It's a load of programmed bull****, that is meant to leverage one's emotional heart strings, and keep one in a superficial area of definition so no deeper exploration can branch out from without some emotional prohibition.





to what do you request a direct answer? [& i notice you are avoiding any mention of 'Earthlings' ]


Do you know what a direct answer is? Or are you going to prove Modwiz correct repeatedly. A warrior actually engages directly not by avoidance.

I'm not a warrior by the way. That is label you are assigning to me very likely by observing the wrong sort of media on the forum of late, so you can build up a false image of me and then attempt to push into a puddle.

Sorry someone already attempted that this week.



i am very disappointed in you, 9Eagle9 -- a warrioress turning a challenge down thru use of words on the net -- tch, tch

what about watching 'Earthlings'? -- i think i remember you posting something about not liking to look negativity in the face [paraphrasing]


I am given to take then you are the creator of Earthlings and that is an expression that came from yourself?

or as I said, earlier that is a way for you to avoid an authentic answer and give over to me someone elses truth?

[wynderer]

9Eagle8, i am going to drop this line of discourse now -- it is unproductive

i have recently realized that i am extremely 'emotionally immature' -- & i must confess that, re you & 'Earthlings,' what comes to mind is a '50s USA childrens' playground taunt: 'Scaredy cat! Scaredy cat!' [grew up near Philly ]


Wynder If I watch Earthlings (lovely label) and deconstruct it in my own usual fashion how happy are you going to be?

White people who have something relevant to say are going to be like anyone else of any color that has something relevant to say no matter how long winded. If you implying that you are a person of color and your brevity of passive aggressive mud pie making is some how relevant only because of its brevity, I'm going to agree.

Origin-al species are not arranged by color by the way.

[9eagle9]

I agree with you.


9Eagle8, i am going to drop this line of discourse now -- it is unproductive

i have recently realized that i am extremely 'emotionally immature' -- & i must confess that, re you & 'Earthlings,' what comes to mind is a '50s USA childrens' playground taunt: 'Scaredy cat! Scaredy cat!' [grew up near Philly ]


Wynder If I watch Earthlings (lovely label) and deconstruct it in my own usual fashion how happy are you going to be?

White people who have something relevant to say are going to be like anyone else of any color that has something relevant to say no matter how long winded. If you implying that you are a person of color and your brevity of passive aggressive mud pie making is some how relevant only because of its brevity, I'm going to agree.

Origin-al species are not arranged by color by the way.

[Hervé]

Wynderer,

I would highly recommend for you to to really get the concept of what a "straw man (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man)" (<-- click) is and compare it to what you are doing on this thread.

[wynderer]

from my p.o.v., i am speaking from the heart -- very close to my heart are the Animals


Wynderer,

I would highly recommend for you to to really get the concept of what a "straw man (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man)" (<-- click) is and compare it to what you are doing on this thread.

[wynderer]

PS to Amzer Zo re strawman -- started to read it but got into that 'white men think too much ' weary state of mind

have you yourself watched 'Earthlings'?

[Flash]

This thread is about archontic alien parasites isn't it? not about vegetarianism/meat eaters guruism, isn't it?

[9eagle9]

So we have the admission that our distaste for meat eating comes from an emotionally charged place that precludes any regard to intuitive logic.

thank you.

While I have a very close connection with animals I don't do them the disservice of placing inappropriate human emotional quantitative on them. Animals are possessed of their own dignity without me besmirching them with indignity that is not becoming of them. Or use them to advance my own agenda. My horse is not my horse, nor is she an emotionally templated extension of me. When I'm cold I dont' rush to blanket her . People think I'm unbearably cruel when I give her a kick not realizing that horses kick to communicate and play with each other, and with much greater punitive force than I am capable of dealing out and that she understands my heel better than she does my tongue because that is the language she uses with her own kind.

[observer]

I would make a request. If I give a heartfelt question, please don't give me a video-ized version of someone else's truth. That tells me a number of things, that you aren't seriously invested in your own truth, because its not really yours. It's someone elses. What I am asking of you is coming from me, not someone else.

I very rarely discuss my personal habits simply because they are personal. However, in respect to 9eagle9's request to give a heartfelt answer, and since I was the one who began this debate, here is my final word on the matter:

I was a hunter up until 1968. I used to fill my freezer with all sorts of meat from the kill. One day, while out hunting with my father, I shot a dear and only wounded it. When I drew my pistol to shoot the dear in the head, to finish the kill, my father wouldn't allow me to finish-off the job in that fashion. Instead he made me get down on my knees and cut the deer's throat.

As I did this, the dear let-out the most mournful moan one would ever witness.

From that day forward, I've not eaten another animal.

My rationalization has ever since been: if I'm no longer willing to kill the animal, I have no right to ask someone else to do the dirty work for me.

Now, I'll make a challenge.

To any individual who wishes to eat a cow, or any other red blooded animal. Next time you have the desire to eat such a thing, make the slaughter part of your ritual.

Do it all, the killing, the gutting, the skinning, the butchering, the cooking, and then sit-down and do the eating.

My point has been, since my first comment regarding eating the flesh of a beast: this is all part of a sacrifice ritual - whether you want to believe this or not. I brought this up as a discussion regarding how we are all controlled - through ritual - by an archonic hyperdimensional presence. One can make-up all sorts of rationalizations to justify why you are participating in this ritual. The bottom line is that you ARE participating in a ritual.

This particular reality is controlled through ritual. Blood sacrifice, in all its myriad forms, are all a function of this ritualistic control mechanism.

I believe enough has been said regarding this issue....

[wynderer]

an Avalon member whom i respect just asked me: 'Why am i derailing this thread?'

as i see it, this thread is about archons & their manipulation of Humans from behind the scenes

it so very clear to me that your disconnection from your Animal brothers & sisters is a huge part of this manipulation -- painfully clear, & i mean real pain

but -- as with other blind spots w/Humans -- i see that 'Earthlings' is too much for you all to deal with-- you can't see that disconnecting from compassion for all disconnects you from Source/God/the Creator

[observer]

This thread is about archontic alien parasites isn't it? not about vegetarianism/meat eaters guruism, isn't it?

As to the question of 'derailing the thread':

This is Houman's Thread. He is the OP. It is his right, as the OP, to step-in and publicly ask that his thread not be derailed. If a member persists after the request of the OP in public discussion, than he has the right to ask the MODS to step-in.

I've not seen him do this at any point in this debate.

[Flash]

It is ok to explain as you just did Observer, this was straight explanation of your experience, but I often felt that some posts were rather patronising from a few posters about meat versus veggies.

You see, I come from a cold country, a very cold one, and without meat my ancestors could not survive the winter. Same for the Inuits by the way. When it is done for eating, it is not a game and usually the hunter do appreciate the animal's personal sacrifice for their food. In fact, they are very very thankfull otherwise they would starve.

When hunting is for a game, appreciation is lost. Then we are talking archonic most probably. It becomes taking, not sharing ones' life.

Furthermore I was raised around farmers and yes, I did kill chickens and ate them, this is part of nature when food does not grow in trees all year around. To tell you the truth, when you eat your own kill for food, not for fun, you do love the animal you are eating and are appreciative.

However, i do not see much the necessity to kill anylonger in these days because of all the availibility of food there is all year around.

I do not want to patronize and have absolutes on anything. Just mentioning tendencies and let each one be responsible for his use and sharings with nature.

[Timreh]

[...]

Curious does anyone have any idea of the laws and rules these invaders are bound or governed by? (mentioned by Elton Turner at around 1:44:50)

..and where might all this leave our souls in the grand scheme of things?

You may want to have a good look at this thread and listen to the listed interviews:

Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics)

As much as I have followed this thread I have not made the time to follow all of the posts
Taken onboard, thanks Amer Zo

[Houman]

I share observer's opinion/experience that if we were to not only slaughter what we eat but also, perhaps, raise it and help deliver it, we would see things differently...

We live in such a fake/artificial environment that we have (perhaps by design) lost our most of our humanity and we have dulled our senses to avoid hearing our souls screaming at us (sometimes these souls take extreme measures such as an accident or a disease to get our attention)... "hollow shells" is the term used in the Hopi prophecies for what we are being turned into... and "demons" is the term used by satanists for what we are being turned into in societies engineered by them (yes, this is their intent (make us part of that hierarchy but at the lowest levels), and this is what we slowly turn into by shutting our connection with our souls).

This connection uses the language of the heart: empathy, with it you will feel what others feel, not only humans but also animals, you will also perceive their thoughts in a primitive form...
It is our lack of empathy (and the resulting compassion) that has brought us to the edge of destruction...

Note that Wynderer is an abductee and most abductees (according to Dr Turner and E. Lorgen's research) develop a heightened sense of empathy and compassion because of what they have been through...

On the thread itself, I don't see it as being derailed, I only hope that the communication remains respectful and devoid of aggression; communication shares its root with "communion": "The sharing or exchanging of intimate thoughts and feelings, esp. when the exchange is on a mental or spiritual level." It is not always an easy exercise but this mode of communication (compassionate/empathic) allows us to access our own souls... (interestingly E. Lorgen, whom I felt, has been following this thread has a recent article on that http://evelorgen.com/wp/news/compassionate-communicationnonviolent-communication-skills/)

Houman

[9eagle9]

It's now about white men who think too much. Since I'm not a white man it doesn't apply to me....

You know, Flash, how women are just mindlessly flapping their lips all over the place (bites lip).

In regards to your post about hunting, Observer, thank you for your honest expression about hunting.



This thread is about archontic alien parasites isn't it? not about vegetarianism/meat eaters guruism, isn't it?

As to the question of 'derailing the thread':

This is Houman's Thread. He is the OP. It is his right, as the OP, to step-in and publicly ask that his thread not be derailed. If a member persists after the request of the OP in public discussion, than he has the right to ask the MODS to step-in.

I've not seen him do this at any point in this debate.

[Flash]

It's now about white men who think too much. Since I'm not a white man it doesn't apply to me....

You know, Flash, how women are just mindlessly flapping their lips all over the place (bites lip).

In regards to your post about hunting, Observer, thank you for your honest expression about hunting.



This thread is about archontic alien parasites isn't it? not about vegetarianism/meat eaters guruism, isn't it?

As to the question of 'derailing the thread':

This is Houman's Thread. He is the OP. It is his right, as the OP, to step-in and publicly ask that his thread not be derailed. If a member persists after the request of the OP in public discussion, than he has the right to ask the MODS to step-in.

I've not seen him do this at any point in this debate.

Yes I think part of the archonic influence is to deny women the right of head. lol Like my chicken when killed.... I do not know which is worst really, killing chicken or killing women soul and right to think.

I just felt like this yesterday, could never finish my thought, was stopped right in my tracks with unfinished expression of a whole train of thought that was quite coherent (for train of thoughts we say thread in French - fil de ma pensée). But is was, it seems, stupid, from fast judgment and point of view of others. At the age I am at, with the experience I have, and some good "traditional" schooling (I am far from stupid), I am still speechless when stopped in my tracks. The difference now is that I do not feel bad, I do not blame myself, I just think I still have to deal with this macho attitude of my generation, which is late baby boomers. Too large egos to take something from a chicken head. But it would be worst elsewhere on earth.

Not biting my lips. This actual feeling of mine about the situation will pass.

This is, in my idea, one of the greatest killing that has been done on this planet. Killing the right to be of half the population. Forget culling 90% of the population, the job is already done for almost half of it. Women have been in over and over in quantity and quality in all the possible altars. And still are in supposedly "evolved" societies. Children with them as well.


Of course, this does not take away the great tragedy of human bloody sacrifices.

Thanks 9Eagle9 for your comment, I thought nobody had noticed.

[9eagle9]

The suppression of spirit is as much a tragedy as the theft of the mind, and the theft of the body. Even the 10 commandments awkwardly warns about theft--which is basically what parasitical is all about.

We have the fake industrially produced matrix which is poor replication of the creation matrix.

Matrices, maternal, women are a paramount factor in creation matrices, the sort that aren't fake. We have something that we pass along that the paternalistic set don't have--mitochondrial dna. Not to denigrate mans role in the creation matrix, but they were suppressed and damaged in a different way. Both were separated with true power, women handed a dis-staff and men taught to fear women because they were the source of ORIGIN-al sin. Well we the source of ORIGIN-al anything.

I haven't had any fake babies lately have you?

[Flash]

Lol

If my growing baby is fake, she is quite a busy and busying fake!! Should have gone easy on the fake!!! LOL

[wynderer]

bumping this & hi-lighting the first paragraph -- it occurred to me that this is the biggest issue facing Humans -- the Earth changes will come & go, but the controllers/archons will still be here

also i have wondered if the Reptilians came here as part of their galactic empire-building [living by a warrior code], & that they also got caught into the matrix


from
http://evelorgen.com/wp/articles/military-abduction-milabs-and-reptilians/horus-ra/#more-1095
http://evelorgen.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/JLHRa1.jpg
...
She also admits that there are many alien races who are like us in their search for divine spiritual truths, and who are also, misled via many corrupted religious beliefs which ultimately can be traced back to the same Satanic-Archontic-Parasitic game plan. She admits there are some aliens who are more spiritually attuned just like there are some humans who are more enlightened than the average mass consciousness. It is not a black and white picture, but there are some basic truths, which are being kept secret from the masses. The most guarded secrets behind the aliens, New World Order agenda and the parasitic Archontic game plan revolves around the combination of satanic psychic vampirism and high technology. This high technology has also been referred to as black meta-technology because it combines elements of ritual black magic, nano technology, mind control; genetic manipulation and alien implant technology. Truly a soul oppressing combination and in my view, a great threat to humanity. Unless, of course, we wake up and start taking responsibility for our own freedom.
....


Somebody (aliens and the creators of the aliens) under the motto “Divide et impera”, has broke the Consciousness into 3 parts:

- the Mind (more similar to the conscious mind)

- the Spirit (” ” to the subconscious mind)

- the Soul (” ” more similar to the unconscious mind)

2) In the case of the abductees, these 3 consciousnesses do not know each other, do not talk to each other and often they don’t even know who they are and why they are here.

Essentially there is a “soul disconnect” with unrecovered abductees.(EL-This can be understood as a type of dissociation from disconnected aspects of themselves.) This disconnect is facilitated by various alien technologies such as implants, alien parasites, mind control programming and trauma. This disconnect facilitates the aliens usage of their soul energy, much like how a water main has been pilfered by attaching various hoses and pipes to divert the flow from the water main.

3) In case of the abductees, most of the time the Soul consciousness believes it is a slave of the aliens, looks upon them as gods and is afraid of them.

According to Dr. Malanga, the cure for the abduction phenomena is to get the Soul to remember who she/it is– a sovereign entity upon which aliens have no right. The body must be cleaned up of parasites and implants. Soul, Mind and Spirit have to know each other and they have to unify into one single and sovereign Consciousness. This process was noted to bring unexpected coherence into the psyche of the persona.

...

In one of Maarit’s experiences with her 5-year-old son, they both remember being placed in an enclosed machine with deep red lights and pulsating sound. Her son remembered long needles being inserted into him. She believes this pulsating sound and light instrument had to do with cloning in some fashion, and recognized similarities in her and her sons experiences, as those events described in Ted Rice’s abduction testimony, written in the late Dr. Karla Turner’s book, Masquerade of Angels (Keltworks, 1995) One of Ted’s abduction memories involved a small black box that was used to transfer his astral body consciousness from his original body into a cloned version of himself. Maarit told me that one of the reasons they use the black box, is so that the human spirit consciousness does not disperse and go elsewhere, and instead is trapped and directed into cloned bodies or stored until transferred to where the aliens want to place the astral body consciousness. Maarit believes this black box technology is also key to the aliens “soul recycling” technology, which entraps human souls to be born into bodies chosen for that person.

....

I corresponded with Dorica Manu, colleague of Dr. Corrado Malanga regarding the Horus-Ra entity. She said, “In Italy we used this notation because the Ra entity operates in a transdimensional body that looks like a very tall birdlike body, similar to the Egyptian god Horus. This bird-like body is not a cyborg, but it seems to be the body of a decayed humanoid race from Orion. So, the transdimensional form is Horus, the dark entity within is Ra. It is in actuality nothing more than a black shadow or dot.” According to Dr. Malanga, Ra is a dark entity coming from another Universe, a universe archetypally situated behind our universe. There is dark out there, no physical bodies, no light, no love, no souls. This Ra entity places implants on the tailbone, below the sacrum, from where he hangs on to the abductee’s body, parasiting the persona and performing a perverse type of mind control. Ra may come and go to his liking.

....

Could this dark universe that is archetypally behind ours be what the ancient Gnostics described as the “Outer Darkness”?

The mention of the “shadow beings” beneath the various forms reminded me of a statement made by one of my former Milab female interviewees named Lilu. (http://evelorgen.com/wp/articles/military-abduction-milabs-and-reptilians/milabs-a-pandoras-box/)

She stated that it is the Shadows who are behind the reptilians and other colluding–parasite aliens and that these beings are the ones we need to be concerned with. Maarit told me that this black dot shadow is a different kind of energy within the energy body. A presence. She also said that most reptilians and draconians are in line and united with that “shadow energy”. Maarit explains,

“I am able to recognize the Ra energy everywhere and maintain my inner coherence. So in my opinion, the Ra level of universal existence is the level of the so-called Archons, not the minor reptilians, greys or draconians. Ra is the level, which eats the conscious awareness, and we have to bypass it in order to merge into higher realms of existence. The more important thing to focus on is not the origin of Ra in its different forms, but to see the patterns of behavior this Ra has. It truly enslaves. Like seen in cult activity. Ra enjoys the essence of the egotistical uplift.“ Maarit emphatically stated,

“The purpose the Horus-Ra energy force is not only to consume humans and other species as well–their inner core–but also destroy the purity of it. It wants people to forget the ultimate reality and connection to God. In every way this is true. And it goes with other races as well. Most of them are as lost as humans. Some are awakened like some humans are, too. That is why these New Age movements are so dangerous–they are a straight portal for these darker forces to manifest. They make people to compete who are the most spiritually gifted, most knowledgeable, who have more healing/psychic powers etc., and make the whole scam revolve around human ego, which becomes the source for the ego of the evil itself. So it’s no coincidence Jesus said: do not worship pictures/idols of god and one must leave the material behind in order to follow the route to God. The God is within. So that’s why there is so much ritual performances within the NWO network. The secretive “occult” energy makes the evil stronger, gives these people feeling of specialty and power. It corrupts the purity.”

...

I find that our tendency is to become distracted by the entertainment aspect of Ufology, rather than the spiritual-mental evolutionary implications of what befalls us with this alien interference. We love to dance in the distractions, but this diverts our own awareness regarding the power of our innate divinity. I believe the ancient Gnostics were well aware of this “Archontic Control” over humanity. (aka–”The Hypostasis of the Archons or Reality of the Rulers”, (II,4) Tractate in the Nag Hammadi Library) The Gnostics, in their wisdom they tell of what the signature of the Archons is: envy. This was the key human failing that makes us more vulnerable to their intrusion. But they did not leave us without hope for a solution. If we take on the protection of the Light, and rid ourselves of jealousy, then we enter the bridal chamber. (Lash’s Alien Dreaming article, excerpt from quote regarding Dialogue of the Savior, NHC III, 5 (85)

Could the humans involved with the Satanic New World Order be hosted by this same black shadow Horus-Ra energy? Is this what the Archontic influence truly is—and what the ancient Gnostics warned us about?

The archontic mode of parasitism reminds me of certain themes in a popular science fiction television series known as Stargate SG-1. The Gould are a malevolent race of beings represented by ancient Egyptian falcon and jackal headed Gods. When one is taken over by the Gould, they receive a snake like symbiote inserted into their spinal column, and from then on, they are “hosts” for the Gould’s dark Gods. Did the writers of such Sci Fi TV shows know something about what is really going on within the deep dark elements of the Illuminati, NWO, and their ancient Egyptian alien gods? It made me wonder. Abductees and milabs did not make this up!

[Hervé]

[...]


... also i have wondered if the Reptilians came here as part of their galactic empire-building [living by a warrior code], & that they also got caught into the matrix

[...]


Apparently, like most of us, they were conned into settling here:


Speaking of nuked, blown up planets and the soul harvesting of their inhabitants (see post # 1410 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=532714&viewfull=1#post532714)):



Draconian Encounter

By Franz Erdl, July 9, 2012, http://www.psitalent.de/Englisch/Dracoencounter.htm


[...]


I could feel that this Draco was senior to the others. Maybe he was the chief of the underground base . He said to me "This planet has been promised to us!" I was able to recognize at a glance how he felt. It felt like, "Why do so many of your kind still walk around?" It seemed to me as if he has been waiting for ages to regain a planet for himself.


--- A couple of weeks ago we had freed a Draco - we healed his enormous pain - it was the destruction of his planet. Martina was able to witness this downfall due to his immense agony. The planet shattered with one huge explosion. This shock was deeply felt in all Dracos and hence their strong desire for their own planet.


[...]


... I believe that the snakes make concessions as long as they can use other beings as mere tools. If their work is done, Grays, Reptilians, Dracos (but also Illuminati, Freemasons, banksters, etc.) will be reset to their enslaved condition.


[...]


... they want to destroy planet earth and our souls should serve them as food forever. If they were interested in planets, they would not have destroyed them. But I may be wrong.


[...]


Franz Erdl


See post # 1206 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=517935&viewfull=1#post517935) for the background premises of the above:


As far as I could witness, Grays are masters of reality manipulation: they make up astral holograms and even "videos", which mock the sights especially of psychic people and make them perceive false visions. We fell into their trap, too, and have learned by and by to recognize manipulated perceptions. I warn you in particular from working with more than two or three psychic people at the same time. Two or three people can communicate much better than a whole group. Groups are under control of so called group dynamics. In psychic groups, usually one or two persons are recognizably the most psychic ones. This often leads in a certain direction and the others being passively lead by this dynamics. This group dynamic strengthens automatically the direction, even if the direction is wrong! Grays amplify this dynamics even more and the participants perceive an epic "Repto vs. Human show." At the end, all group members feel very fond of themselves, without anything [having] really changed. I have experienced enough of such sessions.

[...]

We succeeded in liberating thousands of Rep-Demons, to “undemonize” them. They re-transformed back into Dragons, kind Dragons who are friends of Humans.

[...]

How come, these dark creatures were open for healing and changing sides?
To me, this looks like the liberation impulse of the Wowos. As far as I get it, this impulse is waking beings up. The mind control of the snakes is reduced to such an extent, that these beings are able to get aware of their situation. The awareness doesn't free them, but it helps them seeking ways of liberating. For example, they come to us.

I want to acknowledge: without our insight on snakes, this liberation would have been impossible. We first had to understand that all beings in our universe are used and abused by snakes. Otherwise we would have regarded the Rep-Demons and other dark creatures as foes and we would have fought them.

[...]

Another research session: all three of us on Friday, the 14th of October. Martina could sense a being behind her. Oh, a lot of beings actually. In front of her she saw an evil-looking, black Draco. He said: "Give them back to me.“ and pointed his finger on the beings behind Martina. Oh no!

Is this the end of our lucky streak? He gouged at Martina's heart chakra, apparently trying to get through her and grab the other creatures. Person number 3 and I focused on getting rid of the snake inside this Draco, since Martina was totally blocked, out of order. Well, finally, after three hours of work, we made it. It was a lot of work. After having relieved the Draco from his snake, he collapsed. Then a beautiful, giant Dragon came out of him. But this wasn't the end. Then we saw the astral body of a Human coming out plus another Draco. Three beings inside of him.

Why so many? Well, then all of them, especially the Human needed healing. Finally, they were free.

[...]

Since the middle of September, more and more types of creatures show up to seek out our help. Dracos, Dragons, Reps and astral beings, and most of them look awkward and scary. So we make sessions for Humans and then such beings, whose snake-made task was to control and weaken these Humans, come and ask for healing. We had a hard times believing this.

[...]

... The beings in front were healed at first and to our surprise, they transformed into . . . Humans. The waves reached to the back rows more and more, and everywhere Humans showed up. Some other beings were there as well, but all of them looked kind.

There were many. Martina could perceive Humans from down through the centuries.


The above first paragraph is one of the reasons for my wish expressed in post # 1513 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=536515&viewfull=1#post536515):


In the vein of the latter, I wish that the people who are having these "visions" of tsunamis, devastating earthquakes, volcanic eruptions, etc... could have enough "presence d'Esprit" to dig beyond that vision and find out who are the producers, directors, art directors, etc... of the "productions" since it seems many of the militaries are following up on that "vision" and retiring in the Ozarks, etc... indicating that the military hierarchy is thoroughly "impressed" with those specific "outcomes."

Then, there is the question of what could turn a human into manifesting itself as a "demon" or some other evil, hideous, scary creature?

My only clue to the above question comes from hypnotism and the resulting mind control. Hence my answer put forth in post # 1513 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=536515&viewfull=1#post536515).

[wynderer]

yes, i remember you posted the paternal Draco article before -- that, & the other articles -- they sound somewhat in the realm of fantasy to me -- all the shapeshifting back & forth, etc; & the pain & suffering & paternal qualities of Reptilians/Dracos

none of this resonates w/my own experiences

also, i believe that Humans are the rightful inhabitants of Earth -- all others are unlawful invaders





[...]


... also i have wondered if the Reptilians came here as part of their galactic empire-building [living by a warrior code], & that they also got caught into the matrix

[...]


Apparently, like most of us, they were conned into settling here:


Speaking of nuked, blown up planets and the soul harvesting of their inhabitants (see post # 1410 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=532714&viewfull=1#post532714)):



Draconian Encounter

By Franz Erdl, July 9, 2012, http://www.psitalent.de/Englisch/Dracoencounter.htm


[...]


I could feel that this Draco was senior to the others. Maybe he was the chief of the underground base . He said to me "This planet has been promised to us!" I was able to recognize at a glance how he felt. It felt like, "Why do so many of your kind still walk around?" It seemed to me as if he has been waiting for ages to regain a planet for himself.


--- A couple of weeks ago we had freed a Draco - we healed his enormous pain - it was the destruction of his planet. Martina was able to witness this downfall due to his immense agony. The planet shattered with one huge explosion. This shock was deeply felt in all Dracos and hence their strong desire for their own planet.


[...]


... I believe that the snakes make concessions as long as they can use other beings as mere tools. If their work is done, Grays, Reptilians, Dracos (but also Illuminati, Freemasons, banksters, etc.) will be reset to their enslaved condition.


[...]


... they want to destroy planet earth and our souls should serve them as food forever. If they were interested in planets, they would not have destroyed them. But I may be wrong.


[...]


Franz Erdl


See post # 1206 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=517935&viewfull=1#post517935) for the background premises of the above:


As far as I could witness, Grays are masters of reality manipulation: they make up astral holograms and even "videos", which mock the sights especially of psychic people and make them perceive false visions. We fell into their trap, too, and have learned by and by to recognize manipulated perceptions. I warn you in particular from working with more than two or three psychic people at the same time. Two or three people can communicate much better than a whole group. Groups are under control of so called group dynamics. In psychic groups, usually one or two persons are recognizably the most psychic ones. This often leads in a certain direction and the others being passively lead by this dynamics. This group dynamic strengthens automatically the direction, even if the direction is wrong! Grays amplify this dynamics even more and the participants perceive an epic "Repto vs. Human show." At the end, all group members feel very fond of themselves, without anything [having] really changed. I have experienced enough of such sessions.

[...]

We succeeded in liberating thousands of Rep-Demons, to “undemonize” them. They re-transformed back into Dragons, kind Dragons who are friends of Humans.

[...]

How come, these dark creatures were open for healing and changing sides?
To me, this looks like the liberation impulse of the Wowos. As far as I get it, this impulse is waking beings up. The mind control of the snakes is reduced to such an extent, that these beings are able to get aware of their situation. The awareness doesn't free them, but it helps them seeking ways of liberating. For example, they come to us.

I want to acknowledge: without our insight on snakes, this liberation would have been impossible. We first had to understand that all beings in our universe are used and abused by snakes. Otherwise we would have regarded the Rep-Demons and other dark creatures as foes and we would have fought them.

[...]

Another research session: all three of us on Friday, the 14th of October. Martina could sense a being behind her. Oh, a lot of beings actually. In front of her she saw an evil-looking, black Draco. He said: "Give them back to me.“ and pointed his finger on the beings behind Martina. Oh no!

Is this the end of our lucky streak? He gouged at Martina's heart chakra, apparently trying to get through her and grab the other creatures. Person number 3 and I focused on getting rid of the snake inside this Draco, since Martina was totally blocked, out of order. Well, finally, after three hours of work, we made it. It was a lot of work. After having relieved the Draco from his snake, he collapsed. Then a beautiful, giant Dragon came out of him. But this wasn't the end. Then we saw the astral body of a Human coming out plus another Draco. Three beings inside of him.

Why so many? Well, then all of them, especially the Human needed healing. Finally, they were free.

[...]

Since the middle of September, more and more types of creatures show up to seek out our help. Dracos, Dragons, Reps and astral beings, and most of them look awkward and scary. So we make sessions for Humans and then such beings, whose snake-made task was to control and weaken these Humans, come and ask for healing. We had a hard times believing this.

[...]

... The beings in front were healed at first and to our surprise, they transformed into . . . Humans. The waves reached to the back rows more and more, and everywhere Humans showed up. Some other beings were there as well, but all of them looked kind.

There were many. Martina could perceive Humans from down through the centuries.


The above first paragraph is one of the reasons for my wish expressed in post # 1513 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=536515&viewfull=1#post536515):


In the vein of the latter, I wish that the people who are having these "visions" of tsunamis, devastating earthquakes, volcanic eruptions, etc... could have enough "presence d'Esprit" to dig beyond that vision and find out who are the producers, directors, art directors, etc... of the "productions" since it seems many of the militaries are following up on that "vision" and retiring in the Ozarks, etc... indicating that the military hierarchy is thoroughly "impressed" with those specific "outcomes."

Then, there is the question of what could turn a human into manifesting itself as a "demon" or some other evil, hideous, scary creature?

My only clue to the above question comes from hypnotism and the resulting mind control. Hence my answer put forth in post # 1513 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=536515&viewfull=1#post536515).

[Daughter of Time]

If you haven't done so yet, I heartidly recommend you watch Berhnard Guenther's 110 minutes video UFOs, Aliens, and the Question of Contact 2012 (Full Documentary) which pretty much summarizes the work of Dr Karla Turner... and much more, including segments with Richard Dolan, Laura Knight and many well thought comments and extracts from various serious researchers & authors.

You can watch it on Youtube but you will get a better quality video on his website at this address:

http://veilofreality.com/2011/03/12/ufos-aliens-and-the-question-of-contact-%E2%98%9E-video/ (Press HD in the upper right corner)

The accompanying article is also published on sott.net http://www.sott.net/articles/show/247383-UFOs-Aliens-and-the-Question-of-Contact

with this sort of enthusiastic comment from a reader:


This is the topics of all topics.
This is the best article I have ever read on the subject.
I am an abductee and have been more than frustrated by the "New Age" feel good wishful thinking that this subject evokes.
Thank you for your bold truth seeking .
We are blinded by our binary thinking, black or white, good or bad.
There are answers above the childish options of, " are you a good witch , or a bad witch."

His website : http://veilofreality.com/

Excellent work!


"The idea that men, women, and children can be taken against their wills from their homes, cars, and school yards by strange humanoid beings, lifted onto spacecraft, and subjected to intrusive and threatening procedures is so terrifying, and yet so shattering to our notions of what is possible in our universe, that the actuality of the phenomenon has been largely rejected out of hand or bizarrely distorted in most media accounts."

- John E. Mack, M.D., professor of psychiatry at Harvard, from his book Abduction


This is the first time I've watched a documentary of this kind without feeling angry, tearful, or depressed. This does not mean that I am less disturbed by the thought of abductions (especially my own) but that I've come to accept it for what it is, with far less fear.

I believe that ETs will not bother me anymore. I don't know why I believe this. I hope I'm not being naive or delusional.

In my core, I feel that a healing can finally be perceived. I know that being here has been very helpful.

With gratitude to Houman and all the helpful posters on this thread.

Daughter of Time

[Chester]

If you haven't done so yet, I heartidly recommend you watch Berhnard Guenther's 110 minutes video UFOs, Aliens, and the Question of Contact 2012 (Full Documentary) which pretty much summarizes the work of Dr Karla Turner... and much more, including segments with Richard Dolan, Laura Knight and many well thought comments and extracts from various serious researchers & authors.

You can watch it on Youtube but you will get a better quality video on his website at this address:

http://veilofreality.com/2011/03/12/ufos-aliens-and-the-question-of-contact-%E2%98%9E-video/ (Press HD in the upper right corner)

The accompanying article is also published on sott.net http://www.sott.net/articles/show/247383-UFOs-Aliens-and-the-Question-of-Contact

with this sort of enthusiastic comment from a reader:


This is the topics of all topics.
This is the best article I have ever read on the subject.
I am an abductee and have been more than frustrated by the "New Age" feel good wishful thinking that this subject evokes.
Thank you for your bold truth seeking .
We are blinded by our binary thinking, black or white, good or bad.
There are answers above the childish options of, " are you a good witch , or a bad witch."

His website : http://veilofreality.com/

Excellent work!


"The idea that men, women, and children can be taken against their wills from their homes, cars, and school yards by strange humanoid beings, lifted onto spacecraft, and subjected to intrusive and threatening procedures is so terrifying, and yet so shattering to our notions of what is possible in our universe, that the actuality of the phenomenon has been largely rejected out of hand or bizarrely distorted in most media accounts."

- John E. Mack, M.D., professor of psychiatry at Harvard, from his book Abduction


This is the first time I've watched a documentary of this kind without feeling angry, tearful, or depressed. This does not mean that I am less disturbed by the thought of abductions (especially my own) but that I've come to accept it for what it is, with far less fear.

I believe that ETs will not bother me anymore. I don't know why I believe this. I hope I'm not being naive or delusional.

In my core, I feel that a healing can finally be perceived. I know that being here has been very helpful.

With gratitude to Houman and all the helpful posters on this thread.

Daughter of Time

Hi DoT, glad you came to the same conclusion I did. I had to get "through" my anger. Somehow, having moved past that stage, my life has become quite smooth. But to me, and far more important, is how I have been so much more productive. How do I define productive? The degree to which I have become truly helpful to my family, loved ones, friends and those with which whom I have come into casual contact, save for a few posters whose feathers have become a bit ruffled based on my recent views.

Anyways, good to know I am not alone in transcending the anger stage (at least as up until now). Something inside me suggests I won't be revisiting that stage again.

justoneman

[wynderer]

bumping this as a wake-up call to all who are planning their escape strategy thru ascension to 5D

those trailing & stained w/the blood of many innocents, thru either commission or omission [willful denial -- Pink Floyd 'On the Turning Away' ] -- IN 5D WE DO NOT KILL & EAT ONE ANOTHER!




I would make a request. If I give a heartfelt question, please don't give me a video-ized version of someone else's truth. That tells me a number of things, that you aren't seriously invested in your own truth, because its not really yours. It's someone elses. What I am asking of you is coming from me, not someone else.

I very rarely discuss my personal habits simply because they are personal. However, in respect to 9eagle9's request to give a heartfelt answer, and since I was the one who began this debate, here is my final word on the matter:

I was a hunter up until 1968. I used to fill my freezer with all sorts of meat from the kill. One day, while out hunting with my father, I shot a dear and only wounded it. When I drew my pistol to shoot the dear in the head, to finish the kill, my father wouldn't allow me to finish-off the job in that fashion. Instead he made me get down on my knees and cut the deer's throat.

As I did this, the dear let-out the most mournful moan one would ever witness.

From that day forward, I've not eaten another animal.

My rationalization has ever since been: if I'm no longer willing to kill the animal, I have no right to ask someone else to do the dirty work for me.

Now, I'll make a challenge.

To any individual who wishes to eat a cow, or any other red blooded animal. Next time you have the desire to eat such a thing, make the slaughter part of your ritual.

Do it all, the killing, the gutting, the skinning, the butchering, the cooking, and then sit-down and do the eating.

My point has been, since my first comment regarding eating the flesh of a beast: this is all part of a sacrifice ritual - whether you want to believe this or not. I brought this up as a discussion regarding how we are all controlled - through ritual - by an archonic hyperdimensional presence. One can make-up all sorts of rationalizations to justify why you are participating in this ritual. The bottom line is that you ARE participating in a ritual.

This particular reality is controlled through ritual. Blood sacrifice, in all its myriad forms, are all a function of this ritualistic control mechanism.

I believe enough has been said regarding this issue....

[wynderer]

here comes wynderer the contrary once again

Daughter of Time, what i want so much to do is to encourage you to access the warrioress in yourself -- i have never been afraid during/after abductions

isometimes think that the idea that anger is 'unspiritual' is part of the archon's conditioning of the collective Human mind

fear is helpful to alert one to danger

in some situations, anger is helpful to deal w/that situation

wyn

PS -- edit to add: my anger is not really for me -- i'm outta here soon anyway -- it is anger for all the innocents -- the Animals & the Children



If you haven't done so yet, I heartidly recommend you watch Berhnard Guenther's 110 minutes video [I]UFOs, Aliens, and the Question of Contact 2012 (Full Documentary) which pretty much summarizes the work of Dr Karla Turner... and much more, including segments with Richard Dolan, Laura Knight and many well thought comments and extracts from various serious researchers & authors.

You can watch it on Youtube but you will get a better quality video on his website at this address:

http://veilofreality.com/2011/03/12/ufos-aliens-and-the-question-of-contact-%E2%98%9E-video/ (Press HD in the upper right corner)

The accompanying article is also published on sott.net http://www.sott.net/articles/show/247383-UFOs-Aliens-and-the-Question-of-Contact

with this sort of enthusiastic comment from a reader:


This is the topics of all topics.
This is the best article I have ever read on the subject.
I am an abductee and have been more than frustrated by the "New Age" feel good wishful thinking that this subject evokes.
Thank you for your bold truth seeking .
We are blinded by our binary thinking, black or white, good or bad.
There are answers above the childish options of, " are you a good witch , or a bad witch."

His website : http://veilofreality.com/

Excellent work!


"The idea that men, women, and children can be taken against their wills from their homes, cars, and school yards by strange humanoid beings, lifted onto spacecraft, and subjected to intrusive and threatening procedures is so terrifying, and yet so shattering to our notions of what is possible in our universe, that the actuality of the phenomenon has been largely rejected out of hand or bizarrely distorted in most media accounts."

- John E. Mack, M.D., professor of psychiatry at Harvard, from his book Abduction


This is the first time I've watched a documentary of this kind without feeling angry, tearful, or depressed. This does not mean that I am less disturbed by the thought of abductions (especially my own) but that I've come to accept it for what it is, with far less fear.

I believe that ETs will not bother me anymore. I don't know why I believe this. I hope I'm not being naive or delusional.

In my core, I feel that a healing can finally be perceived. I know that being here has been very helpful.

With gratitude to Houman and all the helpful posters on this thread.

Daughter of Time

[Daughter of Time]

here comes wynderer the contrary once again

Daughter of Time, what i want so much to do is to encourage you to access the warrioress in yourself -- i have never been afraid during/after abductions

isometimes think that the idea that anger is 'unspiritual' is part of the archon's conditioning of the collective Human mind

fear is helpful to alert one to danger

in some situations, anger is helpful to deal w/that situation

wyn

PS -- edit to add: my anger is not really for me -- i'm outta here soon anyway -- it is anger for all the innocents -- the Animals & the Children



If you haven't done so yet, I heartidly recommend you watch Berhnard Guenther's 110 minutes video [I]UFOs, Aliens, and the Question of Contact 2012 (Full Documentary) which pretty much summarizes the work of Dr Karla Turner... and much more, including segments with Richard Dolan, Laura Knight and many well thought comments and extracts from various serious researchers & authors.

You can watch it on Youtube but you will get a better quality video on his website at this address:

http://veilofreality.com/2011/03/12/ufos-aliens-and-the-question-of-contact-%E2%98%9E-video/ (Press HD in the upper right corner)

The accompanying article is also published on sott.net http://www.sott.net/articles/show/247383-UFOs-Aliens-and-the-Question-of-Contact

with this sort of enthusiastic comment from a reader:


This is the topics of all topics.
This is the best article I have ever read on the subject.
I am an abductee and have been more than frustrated by the "New Age" feel good wishful thinking that this subject evokes.
Thank you for your bold truth seeking .
We are blinded by our binary thinking, black or white, good or bad.
There are answers above the childish options of, " are you a good witch , or a bad witch."

His website : http://veilofreality.com/

Excellent work!


"The idea that men, women, and children can be taken against their wills from their homes, cars, and school yards by strange humanoid beings, lifted onto spacecraft, and subjected to intrusive and threatening procedures is so terrifying, and yet so shattering to our notions of what is possible in our universe, that the actuality of the phenomenon has been largely rejected out of hand or bizarrely distorted in most media accounts."

- John E. Mack, M.D., professor of psychiatry at Harvard, from his book Abduction


This is the first time I've watched a documentary of this kind without feeling angry, tearful, or depressed. This does not mean that I am less disturbed by the thought of abductions (especially my own) but that I've come to accept it for what it is, with far less fear.

I believe that ETs will not bother me anymore. I don't know why I believe this. I hope I'm not being naive or delusional.

In my core, I feel that a healing can finally be perceived. I know that being here has been very helpful.

With gratitude to Houman and all the helpful posters on this thread.

Daughter of Time

I've never felt that fear and anger are unspiritual. Fear and anger have their place. Anger can be a catalyst to spring one into action. Fear, on the other hand, can be paralyzing. And to become a warrior/ess, fearlessness, I believe, is a pre-requisite.

[wynderer]

---------------------------

[Daughter of Time]

hi , Daughter of Time -- my misunderstanding -- sorry -- i'd read justoneman's post saying something about 'like you [DoT], he had left fear & anger behind '[paraphrasing] -- i have not read all yr posts, & thought you'd said this

also in your post you said :
This does not mean that I am less disturbed by the thought of abductions (especially my own) but that I've come to accept it for what it is, with far less fear.

so i took that to mean you felt fear

i also had convinced myself that the abductions had stopped -- apparently a lot of us go thru this, believing the abductions have stopped

James Bartley was a big help during a time when the Reptilians were esp active in my life -- i asked him once if abductions stopped when people got older & thus of less use for breeding purposes etc

he dashed my hopes by telling me of an 85-yr-old woman who was still being abducted

as i see it, we abductees &/or milabs are part of a big joint Human/ET operation, & the abductions won't stop until the op is shut down -- we're up against some pretty sophisticated technology --

on the positive/good self-esteem side -- a fellow abductee who posted a lot on M Salla's forum -- very knowledgable -- said that the abductors prefer what she called 'the juicy ones '' -- those of us w/a lot of Life energy

wyn

I am confused and discouraged as to why an 85 year would still be abducted. What would they have to gain from an 85 year old who is no no longer a viable source of sperm/ova? Not to mention that an 85 year doesn't have much life force to offer. Obviously, the 85 year must have had an indomitable level of life force when abductions started. Would the abductions continue in order to monitor the levels of deterioration? Or something else? Would the reason, perhaps, be to continue programming the 85 year old in order for her/him to influence younger people's belief systems?

And to the best of your knowledge and understanding, if abductions stop at a younger age, does the abductee regain the lost life force, or is that gone forever?

[donk]

I have not had time to read much lately, but have been thinking a lot of the post that I took wynderer to imply that I was coming from a victim mentality--which i appreciate though is not exactly the whole picture. i feel I have lost the victimhood I used to cling to, and am able to discern truly having something/someone imposing their will on my reality--and the bullsh!t attachments and worries and fears that he/she would rightfully and helpfully point out were it the case.

That said, I just cherry-picked (and read no further than) this comment from post 1636:
but there are some basic truths, which are being kept secret from the masses.

The situation I have is that is that not only is being hidden from the most important individual in my life, I am learning that her situation is identical to the abduction experience--and further, abduction or not (not implying mental illness or some other form of outside mind control), I have seen undeniable, physically real proof of blocks in place for her from even hearing them, she experiences agitation when she starts to hear the truth and it begins to resonate, and when she really GETS IT, she is completely shut down, either from an external force or something programmed inside her mind (or both).

She is learning, growing, realizing her power, hungry for the truth, and paths to get her there have made themselves synchronistically available. Last Thursday, we made so much progress, despite (or proved by) repeated physical shut downs including repressing her memories each time. The result is some of it hit home in her, she has demonstrated in her mindset. The consequence though has been the triggering of the chronic condition she now is remembering recurring in the past, where she is constantly dizzy--initial diagnosis at ER from Sunday when it became unbearable for her to not take ANY action is labrynthitis (severe chronic vertigo caused by "virus" in the inner ear).

The good thing is that she learned that she has more control, she knows she needs to victim mentality and own this, which she has been putting great effort toward (with mixed results). My question is, can anyone give good advise (or point me to a post I have not yet been able to read) on this specific situation. Anything that could shed some light/understanding for her.

My other issue is--specific to a abduction scenario where someone is obviously controlled, and having indentical experiences that others have had (and she does NOT read, or look at any of this stuff--she either experienced these things directly or somehow I am projecting experiences on to her), what can be done to remove this block? Could her dizziness/head pain be growing pains--ie she just needs to get to the responsibilty/drop the victimhood to be free of it? From all of the stuff i have just been "coming across", I know there are people who have been through similar, and I have been consuming as much as can and attempting to find a way to get it to her that she can hear and use.

Because the other situation is the "ghosts" in our house and the demons in the attic. Can someone please give opinions on whether or not it is reasonable to assume that we seem to be on spatial/geographically area where strong is manifesting in this specific form? Would moving help, or is the energy signature ONLY from us? It seems, but i cannot definitely verify, that being in the house makes it worse. Whether it is the "ordinary" ghosts needing something from her, the demonic/vampiric seeming energy (serparate from the ghosts), it seem to be our home--the space itself--that is throwing up more blocks in addition to the programming...does this make sense? In other words: Are the archontic forces going to be as strong anywhere we go? Or would re-location (not out of fear, just out of common sense...if your house is too close to the ocean, you are not caving in to evil forces to relocate, you are accepting reality)...is it possible re-location would help? We've already decided to try not to talk too much about in the house, but she is stuck there for now, since she is so dizzy.

Any insight would be appreciated. I am not tryign to derail thread, if it is inappropriate please move it...it just seems that within it, almost every post relates! much love to all of us...

[donk]

Any insight would be appreciated. I am not tryign to derail thread, if it is inappropriate please move it...it just seems that within it, almost every post relates! much love to all of us...
Was just thinking about how silly that last statement about derailing the thread is: every post of my personal experiences is a little chronicle of my “battle” with archontic forces that have imposed themselves on my reality.

And I got to thinking about what “battling archons” really means, what I have been doing, what positive results I have getting—it is all about empowerment, and taking personal responsibility, and losing all attachments and [irrational] fear.

Whenever I learned that, my life was infinitely “easier”, and I found my calling, my passion—to share it with everyone in my reality.

Because ”battle” (conflict/struggle/attempting to control) is what feeds it. To “win”, is not to “play”. To have gained this information, find (and live) those few universal truths, so simple yet so easily manipulated--to figure it out makes life more amazing than I ever imagined it could be. I feel that all you can do is gather information, live in the now, that is empowerment...and when you have that, to spread it.

I want to personally thank every single avalonian for providing the “ammunition” (information, shared experience) in my little front in the battle, what I have learned and continue to learn has been so important and is so appreciated I can barely express it….gosh the thread is SICK!!! Thank you thank you thank you!!!

[Chester]

here comes wynderer the contrary once again

Daughter of Time, what i want so much to do is to encourage you to access the warrioress in yourself -- i have never been afraid during/after abductions

isometimes think that the idea that anger is 'unspiritual' is part of the archon's conditioning of the collective Human mind

fear is helpful to alert one to danger

in some situations, anger is helpful to deal w/that situation

wyn

PS -- edit to add: my anger is not really for me -- i'm outta here soon anyway -- it is anger for all the innocents -- the Animals & the Children



If you haven't done so yet, I heartidly recommend you watch Berhnard Guenther's 110 minutes video [I]UFOs, Aliens, and the Question of Contact 2012 (Full Documentary) which pretty much summarizes the work of Dr Karla Turner... and much more, including segments with Richard Dolan, Laura Knight and many well thought comments and extracts from various serious researchers & authors.


This is the first time I've watched a documentary of this kind without feeling angry, tearful, or depressed. This does not mean that I am less disturbed by the thought of abductions (especially my own) but that I've come to accept it for what it is, with far less fear.

I believe that ETs will not bother me anymore. I don't know why I believe this. I hope I'm not being naive or delusional.

In my core, I feel that a healing can finally be perceived. I know that being here has been very helpful.

With gratitude to Houman and all the helpful posters on this thread.

Daughter of Time

I've never felt that fear and anger are unspiritual. Fear and anger have their place. Anger can be a catalyst to spring one into action. Fear, on the other hand, can be paralyzing. And to become a warrior/ess, fearlessness, I believe, is a pre-requisite.

Seems odd to me that the recanting of my personal abduction/anomalous story/experience in relation to how I moved through the anger related to this experience and that by doing so it has been helpful to me is taken to mean that anger (nor any other emotion perhaps) is un-spiritual or "bad" or "negative." How could it be? Was my previous experience un-spiritual before I reached this threshold of acceptance? No.

My point was that by having moved completely through these emotions related specifically to this whole abduction/possession/animal and human sacrifice phenomena, I have been able to achieve peace within myself and have found the new me is much more capable of dealing with the phenomena in a proactive way that is helpful to others whereas before I was less capable of so doing because I was so consumed with the emotions.

If I had read what I have written by another poster on this forum, I would be back slapping and high fiving that person. If I were someone still dealing with the anger, I would perhaps be asking on the forum or PMing the person as to how did they achieve this.

But hey, that's just me... justoneman

[Chester]

hi , Daughter of Time -- my misunderstanding -- sorry -- i'd read justoneman's post saying something about 'like you [DoT], he had left fear & anger behind '[paraphrasing] -- i have not read all yr posts, & thought you'd said this

also in your post you said :
This does not mean that I am less disturbed by the thought of abductions (especially my own) but that I've come to accept it for what it is, with far less fear.

so i took that to mean you felt fear

i also had convinced myself that the abductions had stopped -- apparently a lot of us go thru this, believing the abductions have stopped

James Bartley was a big help during a time when the Reptilians were esp active in my life -- i asked him once if abductions stopped when people got older & thus of less use for breeding purposes etc

he dashed my hopes by telling me of an 85-yr-old woman who was still being abducted

as i see it, we abductees &/or milabs are part of a big joint Human/ET operation, & the abductions won't stop until the op is shut down -- we're up against some pretty sophisticated technology --

on the positive/good self-esteem side -- a fellow abductee who posted a lot on M Salla's forum -- very knowledgable -- said that the abductors prefer what she called 'the juicy ones '' -- those of us w/a lot of Life energy

wyn

I believe this (what you wrote, Wynderer) - in fact, based on several folks testimony, including the works from Truman Cash, families can be targeted, generations within these families can be targeted and specific souls can be targeted where they receive more attention along these lines than perhaps others. In fact, perhaps some souls are not within this program or have found a way to escape the program.

I am unsure if incarnation on earth at this time has souls who are not within the program. I would like to believe there are.

I also like to believe that I have the ability at my soul level to leave the program. I like to believe that I can do so prior to a lifetime's physical death. My personal goal is to achieve this during this lifetime and assist others to do the same.

If I am unable to achieve release from this program prior to my death, I am unsure that if I have the choice to return or not what choice I would make. I am of the type which would probably decide to return (again... assuming I might have the choice) for assisting others in freeing their soul.

But that is just me... justone

[Chester]

I am confused and discouraged as to why an 85 year would still be abducted. What would they have to gain from an 85 year old who is no no longer a viable source of sperm/ova? Not to mention that an 85 year doesn't have much life force to offer. Obviously, the 85 year must have had an indomitable level of life force when abductions started. Would the abductions continue in order to monitor the levels of deterioration? Or something else? Would the reason, perhaps, be to continue programming the 85 year old in order for her/him to influence younger people's belief systems?

And to the best of your knowledge and understanding, if abductions stop at a younger age, does the abductee regain the lost life force, or is that gone forever?

I happen to know, personally, some amazingly alive 90 year olds... vibrant and with a gleam in their eye like they could live forever. I suspect it is far more about the energetic bodies than simply their physical body life force. Just a thought there. justone

[Daughter of Time]

I have not had time to read much lately, but have been thinking a lot of the post that I took wynderer to imply that I was coming from a victim mentality--which i appreciate though is not exactly the whole picture. i feel I have lost the victimhood I used to cling to, and am able to discern truly having something/someone imposing their will on my reality--and the bullsh!t attachments and worries and fears that he/she would rightfully and helpfully point out were it the case.

That said, I just cherry-picked (and read no further than) this comment from post 1636:
but there are some basic truths, which are being kept secret from the masses.

The situation I have is that is that not only is being hidden from the most important individual in my life, I am learning that her situation is identical to the abduction experience--and further, abduction or not (not implying mental illness or some other form of outside mind control), I have seen undeniable, physically real proof of blocks in place for her from even hearing them, she experiences agitation when she starts to hear the truth and it begins to resonate, and when she really GETS IT, she is completely shut down, either from an external force or something programmed inside her mind (or both).

She is learning, growing, realizing her power, hungry for the truth, and paths to get her there have made themselves synchronistically available. Last Thursday, we made so much progress, despite (or proved by) repeated physical shut downs including repressing her memories each time. The result is some of it hit home in her, she has demonstrated in her mindset. The consequence though has been the triggering of the chronic condition she now is remembering recurring in the past, where she is constantly dizzy--initial diagnosis at ER from Sunday when it became unbearable for her to not take ANY action is labrynthitis (severe chronic vertigo caused by "virus" in the inner ear).

The good thing is that she learned that she has more control, she knows she needs to victim mentality and own this, which she has been putting great effort toward (with mixed results). My question is, can anyone give good advise (or point me to a post I have not yet been able to read) on this specific situation. Anything that could shed some light/understanding for her.

My other issue is--specific to a abduction scenario where someone is obviously controlled, and having indentical experiences that others have had (and she does NOT read, or look at any of this stuff--she either experienced these things directly or somehow I am projecting experiences on to her), what can be done to remove this block? Could her dizziness/head pain be growing pains--ie she just needs to get to the responsibilty/drop the victimhood to be free of it? From all of the stuff i have just been "coming across", I know there are people who have been through similar, and I have been consuming as much as can and attempting to find a way to get it to her that she can hear and use.

Because the other situation is the "ghosts" in our house and the demons in the attic. Can someone please give opinions on whether or not it is reasonable to assume that we seem to be on spatial/geographically area where strong is manifesting in this specific form? Would moving help, or is the energy signature ONLY from us? It seems, but i cannot definitely verify, that being in the house makes it worse. Whether it is the "ordinary" ghosts needing something from her, the demonic/vampiric seeming energy (serparate from the ghosts), it seem to be our home--the space itself--that is throwing up more blocks in addition to the programming...does this make sense? In other words: Are the archontic forces going to be as strong anywhere we go? Or would re-location (not out of fear, just out of common sense...if your house is too close to the ocean, you are not caving in to evil forces to relocate, you are accepting reality)...is it possible re-location would help? We've already decided to try not to talk too much about in the house, but she is stuck there for now, since she is so dizzy.

Any insight would be appreciated. I am not tryign to derail thread, if it is inappropriate please move it...it just seems that within it, almost every post relates! much love to all of us...

While I may not have any real wisdom to offer you, I do relate to some of the things she's going through. My left ear was implanted and that ear is a source of discomfort for me. Cacophonies emanate from my left ear on and off. However, it is possible that she is suffering from a biological condition which will clear up with treatments. She does seem to have some of the symptoms of an abductee though.

But, since you say that things are far worse when you're inside the house, then maybe it's an earthbound entity that's causing the problems. One easy and inexpensive thing you can do is visit a local spiritualist church and tell them you suspect there's an entity in your home. These people are usually very understanding and very willing to help, and often they charge you absolutely nothing, not to mention that most of them are very capable of releasing trapped entities. This is what I would suggest you do. If this is done and nothing improves, then you'll have to take different measures. But I would recommend that you start with simple things first.

Best wishes to you both.

[9eagle9]

There are no basic truths being kept from the masses. We may not be exposed to every detail and nuance but there are not 'basic' truths being hidden.

People don't want to hear about it.

[9eagle9]

Aging is a population control program instigated and keyed into our DNA at some point the past. Some people are a bit more genetically age resistant than others. Some people like myself work actively deprogramming the aging programs. I'd say if there were some species of off planet entity who had a hand in that programming they'd be interested to see how it turns out. If one is studying their 'aging' program they would more than likely choose the elderly.





I am confused and discouraged as to why an 85 year would still be abducted. What would they have to gain from an 85 year old who is no no longer a viable source of sperm/ova? Not to mention that an 85 year doesn't have much life force to offer. Obviously, the 85 year must have had an indomitable level of life force when abductions started. Would the abductions continue in order to monitor the levels of deterioration? Or something else? Would the reason, perhaps, be to continue programming the 85 year old in order for her/him to influence younger people's belief systems?

And to the best of your knowledge and understanding, if abductions stop at a younger age, does the abductee regain the lost life force, or is that gone forever?

I happen to know, personally, some amazingly alive 90 year olds... vibrant and with a gleam in their eye like they could live forever. I suspect it is far more about the energetic bodies than simply their physical body life force. Just a thought there. justone

[Sidney]

Was just thinking about how silly that last statement about derailing the thread is: every post of my personal experiences is a little chronicle of my “battle” with archontic forces that have imposed themselves on my reality.

And I got to thinking about what “battling archons” really means, what I have been doing, what positive results I have getting—it is all about empowerment, and taking personal responsibility, and losing all attachments and [irrational] fear.

Whenever I learned that, my life was infinitely “easier”, and I found my calling, my passion—to share it with everyone in my reality.

Because ”battle” (conflict/struggle/attempting to control) is what feeds it. To “win”, is not to “play”. To have gained this information, find (and live) those few universal truths, so simple yet so easily manipulated--to figure it out makes life more amazing than I ever imagined it could be. I feel that all you can do is gather information, live in the now, that is empowerment...and when you have that, to spread it.

I want to personally thank every single avalonian for providing the “ammunition” (information, shared experience) in my little front in the battle, what I have learned and continue to learn has been so important and is so appreciated I can barely express it….gosh the thread is SICK!!! Thank you thank you thank you!!!.

You have NO idea how much sense that makes. TO Win is to not play. The battling, and them feeding off of it. This one post of yours, (and I have to confess, I have not invested nearly enough time to read this thread in its intirety), but this one post has given me a HUGE piece to my own dilemmas. And my story is long, entwining, and extremely complicated. But That one phrase "to WIN is to not play". It's magic, DONK, magic.

I have been fighting battles for years, and wondering why I can never get on the winning side. Battles, and struggles, and tons of weird ***t have followed me for years. And this is it. I have been fighting them. By doing that, I am feeding them breakfast,lunch,dinner and lots of nibbly snacks in between. All I need to do is figure out a way to let go, and stop trying to be "right". or something. :nod:

You have no idea what I am talking about, but this little bit of wisdom can be utilized in many different aspects of our lives. This is all philosophical, I know, but it makes perfect sense. It
won't solve all my problems, but I think it will give me a push in the right direction.


Thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:hug:

[Sidney]

I would make a request. If I give a heartfelt question, please don't give me a video-ized version of someone else's truth. That tells me a number of things, that you aren't seriously invested in your own truth, because its not really yours. It's someone elses. What I am asking of you is coming from me, not someone else.

I very rarely discuss my personal habits simply because they are personal. However, in respect to 9eagle9's request to give a heartfelt answer, and since I was the one who began this debate, here is my final word on the matter:

I was a hunter up until 1968. I used to fill my freezer with all sorts of meat from the kill. One day, while out hunting with my father, I shot a dear and only wounded it. When I drew my pistol to shoot the dear in the head, to finish the kill, my father wouldn't allow me to finish-off the job in that fashion. Instead he made me get down on my knees and cut the deer's throat.

As I did this, the dear let-out the most mournful moan one would ever witness.

From that day forward, I've not eaten another animal.

My rationalization has ever since been: if I'm no longer willing to kill the animal, I have no right to ask someone else to do the dirty work for me.

Now, I'll make a challenge.

To any individual who wishes to eat a cow, or any other red blooded animal. Next time you have the desire to eat such a thing, make the slaughter part of your ritual.

Do it all, the killing, the gutting, the skinning, the butchering, the cooking, and then sit-down and do the eating.

My point has been, since my first comment regarding eating the flesh of a beast: this is all part of a sacrifice ritual - whether you want to believe this or not. I brought this up as a discussion regarding how we are all controlled - through ritual - by an archonic hyperdimensional presence. One can make-up all sorts of rationalizations to justify why you are participating in this ritual. The bottom line is that you ARE participating in a ritual.

This particular reality is controlled through ritual. Blood sacrifice, in all its myriad forms, are all a function of this ritualistic control mechanism.

I believe enough has been said regarding this issue....

That is a very humble post. And as I read your words, the shame of my meat eating has sneaked up and bit me on the nose. Thank you for the wake up call. Your story about the deer brought me to tears. Bless you Observer

[Chester]

You have NO idea how much sense that makes. TO Win is to not play. The battling, and them feeding off of it. This one post of yours, (and I have to confess, I have not invested nearly enough time to read this thread in its intirety), but this one post has given me a HUGE piece to my own dilemmas. And my story is long, entwining, and extremely complicated. But That one phrase "to WIN is to not play". It's magic, DONK, magic.

I have been fighting battles for years, and wondering why I can never get on the winning side. Battles, and struggles, and tons of weird ***t have followed me for years. And this is it. I have been fighting them. By doing that, I am feeding them breakfast,lunch,dinner and lots of nibbly snacks in between. All I need to do is figure out a way to let go, and stop trying to be "right". or something. :nod:

You have no idea what I am talking about, but this little bit of wisdom can be utilized in many different aspects of our lives. This is all philosophical, I know, but it makes perfect sense. It
won't solve all my problems, but I think it will give me a push in the right direction.


Thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:hug:

That's what has been working for me - by moving "through" my anger and popping out the other side, I no longer give that anger energy (which feeds these monsters) and then they seem to stop bothering you. But hey, I am sort of new at this... but I have never, ever had such prolonged stretches of peace like I have had since I got to the other side of all my anger.

Winning, is leaving the game, justoneman

[Sidney]

That's what has been working for me - by moving "through" my anger and popping out the other side, I no longer give that anger energy (which feeds these monsters) and then they seem to stop bothering you. But hey, I am sort of new at this... but I have never, ever had such prolonged stretches of peace like I have had since I got to the other side of all my anger.

Winning, is leaving the game, justoneman

The only problem I foresee is that old habits are hard to break, but I have some pretty good motives.

[wynderer]

-------------------------------

[SilentFeathers]

There are no basic truths being kept from the masses. We may not be exposed to every detail and nuance but there are not 'basic' truths being hidden.

People don't want to hear about it.

PWSx0bBiNIs

[wynderer]

-------------------------------------

[9eagle9]

Meat eating pro and con is grossly out of proportion and I can't decide which is worse for animals in general the pro or con. There's a balance here and no one can keep their emotions out of it, pro or con, to see the deeper under lying wisdom that animals lead us to by the expression of their existence, rather than the words they spea. But its very pertinent to this thread. There is nothing out there in nature that does not reflect our own condition back to us.

If you don't like meat, don't eat it. If you are making yourself noble over not eating animals you are using the animal to advance your emotional agenda, more than likely you are imposing on them in ways that simply killing them does not.

A dead animal is out of the reach of human assholery.

To be perfectly honest people who project that sort of emotional grunge onto animals, corrupting them with our own consciousness are as guilty as those who mass commercialize animals. Ones on a physical level, one is on a psyche level.

I find it gross and disrespectful to impose our consciousness , our ****, our baggage on any animal. As if they extensions of our emotional body. We see animals as victims because we see ourselves that way. We see animals as wounded and suffering because we are--to the point we grieve and moan pre-kill over them.

Animals have not been innocent since we have been not innocent. We've corrupted them. We corrupt them still by imposing our consciousness on them.

I am recently guilty of taking chicks that I knew would not live, and they would die as Nature intended, because they were not composed of what Nature intended. They had been compromised. The only reason I took them was because I wanted to make sure there was not something I was looking, but I know this, I was doing it for myself. I KNOW this. It was not a noble act. So when they died I had to accept that while it was an emotional gesture on my part, I was actually attempting to interfere with what nature had intended. In case someone else had imposed something on the chicks that I could correct. I couldn't, and I accept that.


The people who whine the most about how I keep my horses in a paddock (they should be free!) are most apt to whine when I turn them loose. Who is bothered by being loose, the horse or the human? Okay well if they can't be penned and they can't be loose, what do we do?

When my mare jumped the fence and went peeling down 8 mile road in Detroit who was troubled by it. Not her, she enjoys terrorizing motorists. It was humans who were troubled by it. She will terrorize a Peta activist or a hunter in equal measure. From experience and as a riding instructor people who think they have a mystical connection with animals usually don't.

She got out yesterday, cornered a gelding, beat the ever loving **** out of him, and every raised a great outraged cry "Oh she's so horrible". The gelding ran in a panic to huddle in the barn yard, while she fled up the road and came charging back down the driveway to find him, to cuddle with him . "Oh she's so weird."

She's not weird she's behaving like a horse. That is weird behavior for humans, not horses. Who is determining how she should behave? People are. She don't care she'll continue behaving like a horse. It doesn't matter what you impose on her. I think she needs a blanket on, she'll shake it off. I think she needs a bath, she'll roll in the dirt shortly afterwards. She steps on my foot and I object and she shrugs and ..."You sit on my back all the time" Fair is fair.

People who think they know and understand animals really don't because what is standing between them and animals is their consciousness and all its baggage it carries around.

To call an animal to you , you have to keep your consciousness , your emotions, out of it.

We satisfy our emotional needs by allowing animals to suffer while we focus on the murder part of it. " Oh don't kill them, don't hunt them, let them die of starvation and disease and have long drawn out deaths because I am weepy over the quick respectful death of an animal. YOU don't have to observe animals suffering in the wild do you? And they have to suffer because YOU are uncomfortable with the end of their suffering.

Because we are uncomfortable with removing that which is a means to end our own suffering.


That is self indulgence and animals suffer for it.

If an animal REALLY suffers during a kill, its because one doesn't really know as much about it as they like to think. That perhaps should be left up to the hunters, not the eaters. People like to eat plants because they don't have owies when they die, there's no emotional projection to be made.

I have more respect for an integrated hunter, who kills respectfully than those people who flap their hands and moan over the fate of the animal in the gun-sight than those who honestly take the life of an animal with respect and know-how.

My people used to run with the King Stag to determine who would be leader of a clan. Sometimes the stag won. Did anyone flap and moan over the man who would be king. No. When the man won and became king, did anyone flap and mourn over the stag? It was an honest engagement, and the contracts of both parties were fulfilled in honesty. The promise the king made to the stag was to preserve the stag's herd in INTEGRITY, that meant not allowing the weak to weaken the herd. This is what the animals themselves would and will do if left to their own devices.

For the strong this is a matter of course, for the weak its something that can't be confronted because it triggers their own weakness.

Wolves eat the get that are weak. Eating the puppy and the placental matter ensures that the bitch's hormones are stimulated to feed the strong pups to perpetrate the strength of the pack. Wolves lead hardship lives and don't have time to babysit the weak. These are humans attributes where the emotionally and physically defenseless should be care taken at all times AT THE RISK THAT THE ENTIRE HERD WILL BE COMPROMISED not only in the present, but in future generations. And that is what we see today within our own social structures.

The animals that Mother Nature takes care of through natural means are typically those who are compromised parasitically.

And we wonder why we are in the state we are in now, where the weak constantly clamor for the strong to be brought down. Where the weak and the few are managing things when nature intends that the strong should lead. The compromised can't make decisions that benefit the greater good of all and the future, yet that is what we see attempted today.

Any unspoiled pack or herd of animals will show you that.

This is a program that has been developed from politics--extreme right conservatism. They use babies, unborn babies, and per-conceived babies to wring the emotional heart-strings. This covert program uses animals.

Animals are not our friends. if an animal chooses to have a symbiotic relationship with you, honor it for what it is, don't try to turn them into a source of emotional bandaging or fulfillment. The animal didn't choose you for the same reasons you think you are associating with the animal.

Meat used to be supplemental nutrition. You went out, you hunted,returned with nothing, and ate whatever was stored away and you were okay. You hunted, came back with a deer, and you had supplemental nutrition. One deer would last a family an entire winter. My family were farmers, they slaughtered a beef steak and a pig every year. Part of both was bartered for something else, the rest for food--no one ate meat everyday though. Two animals.

Typically to feed a family the same amount that my family ate would be dozens of animals, to eat the vast amounts that people for some reason think they need to eat, its hundreds of animals a year.

It was supplemental, part of any animal was used as seasoning and stock. It lasted a long time because of the way they cured it, and all of it was used.

Having to eat more than 4 to 12 ounces of meat a week is a dietary aberration. We need don't eat that way for any reason other than we think we need to. For some reason (media, advertising, our own greed, the FDA who gets its cut of every cow) we feel we have consume vast amounts of meat everyday, every meal, and in this bizarre portions -- 42 ounce t bone steak should last you more than a month. Now its consumed in a single meal. Where it used to be supplementation nutrition it's a filler. There's our parasitical.

Greed imposed on an animal at a psychic level is worse , how, than when its imposed on a physical level. On a physical level an animal can escape that greed, via death. While living the animal cannot except a human's psyche greed. A cat is on of the few animals that can escape human psyche greed. "Your lonely? **** you, I'm walking away. When you aren't so parasitical maybe I'll climb in your lap and have a mutual exchange of energy with you."

There is a much deeper subject and implications here on the part of the animal that transcends our emotional reaction that we impose on them. Much deeper subject to this than randomly killing animals and eating them.

We collectively raise and kill way more animals than what is necessary for supplemental nutrition. We kill for the wrong reasons. When we hunted naturally the strongest, the animals that provided strength to future generations, were not culled. A buffalo in their prime can stand off and out maneuver a horse and rider. It was typically the animals that couldn't that were taken--the ones who couldn't run as fast, or were perhaps dimmer than the others. They were not overtly weak and sick they were just not as strong. Still, the herd was improved by culling.

This is mother nature in action and she has no hesitation in culling the human herd either. Animals are far more leery of the human consciousness and all its weird sticky emotions than any weapons that may be wielded.

[wynderer]

------------------------------------

[9eagle9]

Deer let out mournful moans when they are wandering in my back yard at night. Deer do that.

Does the deer decide its mournful or does the one listening to it decide that?

[9eagle9]

You've found out that fighting them doesn't solve the problem. Some people never find that out. People who are 'supposed' to be learned in these areas still fight them which is playing the game. That game has been held in perpetuity, for thousands of years. When the people who are 'supposed' to be learned in these matters, and that includes myself, learned that battle should mean walking in, detaching, and walking back out again.

Any game we play is a control drama or struggle. To win a game, cunning, subterfuge, deceit and cheating is required on the behalf of those who are not authentically engaged in a challenge. Some people can sit down and play Monopoly and someone wins and the board is put away and then some people play as if there is some war to be won.





Was just thinking about how silly that last statement about derailing the thread is: every post of my personal experiences is a little chronicle of my “battle” with archontic forces that have imposed themselves on my reality.

And I got to thinking about what “battling archons” really means, what I have been doing, what positive results I have getting—it is all about empowerment, and taking personal responsibility, and losing all attachments and [irrational] fear.

Whenever I learned that, my life was infinitely “easier”, and I found my calling, my passion—to share it with everyone in my reality.

Because ”battle” (conflict/struggle/attempting to control) is what feeds it. To “win”, is not to “play”. To have gained this information, find (and live) those few universal truths, so simple yet so easily manipulated--to figure it out makes life more amazing than I ever imagined it could be. I feel that all you can do is gather information, live in the now, that is empowerment...and when you have that, to spread it.

I want to personally thank every single avalonian for providing the “ammunition” (information, shared experience) in my little front in the battle, what I have learned and continue to learn has been so important and is so appreciated I can barely express it….gosh the thread is SICK!!! Thank you thank you thank you!!!.

You have NO idea how much sense that makes. TO Win is to not play. The battling, and them feeding off of it. This one post of yours, (and I have to confess, I have not invested nearly enough time to read this thread in its intirety), but this one post has given me a HUGE piece to my own dilemmas. And my story is long, entwining, and extremely complicated. But That one phrase "to WIN is to not play". It's magic, DONK, magic.

I have been fighting battles for years, and wondering why I can never get on the winning side. Battles, and struggles, and tons of weird ***t have followed me for years. And this is it. I have been fighting them. By doing that, I am feeding them breakfast,lunch,dinner and lots of nibbly snacks in between. All I need to do is figure out a way to let go, and stop trying to be "right". or something. :nod:

You have no idea what I am talking about, but this little bit of wisdom can be utilized in many different aspects of our lives. This is all philosophical, I know, but it makes perfect sense. It
won't solve all my problems, but I think it will give me a push in the right direction.


Thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:hug:

[Houman]

edit to add : those they can't wear down, they try to break down -- those they can't break down , they try to kill


And if they can't wear you down, break you down or kill you, they will go after your siblings, your parents, your gf/bf/wife/husband, your children, and yes, even your pets... but you are not powerless to protect them...

[Daughter of Time]

edit to add : those they can't wear down, they try to break down -- those they can't break down , they try to kill


And if they can't wear you down, break you down or kill you, they will go after your siblings, your parents, your gf/bf/wife/husband, your children, and yes, even your pets... but you are not powerless to protect them...

How does one protect one's loved ones from falling into their traps?

[wynderer]

-------------------------------------

[TheVoyager]

Alien Abductee Portraits by Steven Hirsch

http://littlestickylegs.blogspot.fi/

[wynderer]

------------------------------

[Gemini]

Thank you for your post 9eagle9. It gives me a lot to think about and to reconsider.


...I find it gross and disrespectful to impose our consciousness , our ****, our baggage on any animal. As if they extensions of our emotional body. We see animals as victims because we see ourselves that way. We see animals as wounded and suffering because we are--to the point we grieve and moan pre-kill over them.

Animals have not been innocent since we have been not innocent. We've corrupted them. We corrupt them still by imposing our consciousness on them...

The topic of projecting onto others (humans and animals) is quite an important one in my view since people do so (me likely included) without realising it or even having a clue of the existence of such a concept, unless they are very self-aware. And more often than not, I suspect, people aren't as self-aware as they think they are, which is a big part of our human condition.

The following is an excerpt from http://psitalent.de/Englisch/Atlantis.htm:




[...]

So, back to the topic contact. And to this an example:

A friend of mine has a big dog and she takes extensive care of him. Besides literature about dogs she also likes to look for the advice of dog-trainers, dog-doctors etc., in order to make everything right. The dog gets a lot of tenderness and also very much observation of her. Karin and I are however predominantly annoyed over this relationship and recently, we found out what’s the reason. What disturbs us so is that our friend doesn't have contact with the dog, no matter how intensively she cares about him.

Through the lacking contact, the following effect occurs: The other, in this case the dog, turns into the victim of projections. Dogs have a sensitive stomach, the doctor said ..... The uncertain dog-proprietress will project a big sensitive dog in the course of the time.

To come to the point: Whoever doesn't have contact lives in his projections and projects onto others. And no matter, whether the projections are good or bad for the other person, it disturbs the other person, to be or become itself. In this way parents harm their children if there is no contact. In this way therapists harm their patients if there is no contact. In this way everyone harms everyone for lack of contact.

I could often perceive that people projected their guru-ideas into my person. I clearly sensed how difficult it became for me just to be as natural as I want to be. Something squeezed me. I noticed myself giving them answers they longed to hear. I sensed more distance to myself and to the others. These were positive projections and some probably would have liked this condition. I felt unwell anyway and had a need, to get out of this.

[9eagle9]

An abduction attempt was made on me.

I say attempt because.....I am the stronger the entity because I'm not a victim. Ifone is abducted one is a victim.

When one is abducted they can decide to continue being a victim of abduction or the stronger entity. If they keep referring to themselves as an abuctee they are simply specializing the victim label.

I am not an abductee. So while i understand the peril involved in that energy I do not understand why people want to stay in that energy. No more than I can understand why someone wants to wave a prostetic leg around and keep telling the world they are an amputee instead of just putting the leg on and walking on it. One circumstance is the crutch of a victim, the other is support to a former victim.

Now the power that is granted is to the victim in acknowledging they were a victim of abduction. No one really gives a **** that there are people out there who know how not ot be victims of abduction. Which is a more desireable circumstance. Being abducted or not being abducted? One is empowerment , one is not.

How special is the victim. As long as we keep making the victim special the victim be special for a very long time. Not for anything they have done , merely for being a victim.

You can only bang the abduction drum for so long. Like any other victim drum it only varies on the details.

I am more concerned with myself hi jacking myself than something 'out there' hi jacking me.


yeah -- the 2 truths i've observed that really jerk on Human chains & set those denial mechanisms going on overdrive are :

1] Human cruelty to non-Human Animals , re which Observer recently pulled many dots together for me by explaining that the cruelty is part of a worldwide satanic blood ritual [likely the one that keeps most trapped in the karmic loop here]

2] Abductions




There are no basic truths being kept from the masses. We may not be exposed to every detail and nuance but there are not 'basic' truths being hidden.

People don't want to hear about it.

PWSx0bBiNIs

[Chester]

yeah -- the 2 truths i've observed that really jerk on Human chains & set those denial mechanisms going on overdrive are :

1] Human cruelty to non-Human Animals , re which Observer recently pulled many dots together for me by explaining that the cruelty is part of a worldwide satanic blood ritual [likely the one that keeps most trapped in the karmic loop here]

2] Abductions




There are no basic truths being kept from the masses. We may not be exposed to every detail and nuance but there are not 'basic' truths being hidden.

People don't want to hear about it.

PWSx0bBiNIs

The depth of Number 1 must be decided at the individual level. I lean heavily towards the personal goal which would eliminate all meat from my personal diet. In fact, I have begun to do so as I have also begun this cleanse program recommended by Houman. I also sense it's a bit too idealistic to assume that what I believe true for me in this regard is necessarily a collective truth such that I should take the next step and assume others "should" share my view and especially idealistic that they do so immediately.

It is my guess that ultimately there may be a collective experience such that born on Earth humanity may reach the point where no animals are consumed by any amongst us. I also include the human as an animal in this regard.

In the meantime, I am taking steps to eliminate meat that has come from factories, to reduce the meats I do consume to less than once a day, to move towards a fish only meat and I will be very honest, this has so far been quite difficult for me to do.

Regarding Number 2 - Abductions - I include myself as an abductee. The experience I had when I was 6 years old was real and against my will. What else could you call it? The following 48 years after this experience I barely physically survived.

So regarding Number 1, I assume we all arrive at what is true for us individually. Perhaps the purists are the rightest and perhaps if we do not achieve a planet wide meat abstinence before the cosmos loses it's patience, we humans on earth may not survive (ourselves). I do not place much odds on this outcome but regardless I have my stated personal goal at the center of my current focus motivated first and foremost by something I cannot explain other than to say this is becoming the way I feel, personally, about the matter.

Regarding Number 2, abductions do happen. I believe the abduction stories of others. What might surprise some posters here are the number of folks that post on this forum that have had abduction experiences and yet never post about them. I know a few through meeting them on this forum. Some have achieved solutions to their abduction issues (at least up until now). Thanks to them I have been able to (for now) move past my own, personal abduction experiences and free myself such that I can focus better on being of assistance to others (the assistance not restricted to simply abduction experiences).

There are a plethora of other truths we might explore as well.

Thanks again Bill for your forum and Houman for this thread.

[Daughter of Time]

An abduction attempt was made on me.

I say attempt because.....I am the stronger the entity because I'm not a victim. Ifone is abducted one is a victim.

When one is abducted they can decide to continue being a victim of abduction or the stronger entity. If they keep referring to themselves as an abuctee they are simply specializing the victim label.

I am not an abductee. So while i understand the peril involved in that energy I do not understand why people want to stay in that energy. No more than I can understand why someone wants to wave a prostetic leg around and keep telling the world they are an amputee instead of just putting the leg on and walking on it. One circumstance is the crutch of a victim, the other is support to a former victim.

Now the power that is granted is to the victim in acknowledging they were a victim of abduction. No one really gives a **** that there are people out there who know how not ot be victims of abduction. Which is a more desireable circumstance. Being abducted or not being abducted? One is empowerment , one is not.

How special is the victim. As long as we keep making the victim special the victim be special for a very long time. Not for anything they have done , merely for being a victim.

You can only bang the abduction drum for so long. Like any other victim drum it only varies on the details.

I am more concerned with myself hi jacking myself than something 'out there' hi jacking me.



9eagle9

If one has been repeatedly abducted and has lost much on account of it, how does one stop further abductions from happening? And more importantly, how does one regain one's lost power?

[Chester]

edit to add : those they can't wear down, they try to break down -- those they can't break down , they try to kill


And if they can't wear you down, break you down or kill you, they will go after your siblings, your parents, your gf/bf/wife/husband, your children, and yes, even your pets... but you are not powerless to protect them...

This morning I woke up with the following thought which disturbed me. Without going deeply into the story because I already posted about it in this thread, here was what crossed my mind this morning.

On the weekend of July 6, 7 and 8 I asked that the negative entity I believed I had been dealing with for years and years leave me. On July 9th at around 1:30 AM, moments after returning from a trip, I was viciously assaulted by the 65 year old woman whose home I had been living in just moments after I entered the home. The police came and took her to jail. While she was forced to lay down in the front yard with handcuffs on, my son, Reid, happened to drive by. Two days later, this same son went on a gun spree where he attempted to enforce someone's drug debt, held up a Whataburger (which he recently worked at) then went to a Walmart and followed someone home and attempted to rob them. All at gun point. A gun that someone had accidentally left in his car just a day or so before. Fortunately no shots were ever fired. Reid had never committed a violent act other than to defend himself once in a fight at school.

This morning when I awoke, I got this strange feeling that the entity I had asked to leave had somehow entered this woman (and combined forces with one or more already established demonic entities she clearly had) and that when my son passed by in his car, the entity jumped from her into my son.

My inner voice said to me that this is occurs when eye to eye contact is made.

In looking back, I had been able to change my energies over that prior weekend where the entity held within me had to leave. It chose the first viable host which I encountered and with whom I had made eye contact (the woman) who immediately changed from a reasonable state to an outright insane and violent state. I believe this entity first leapt out of me and into this woman and then leapt out of this woman and into my son.

This is what my inner voice conveyed to me this morning. Again, the inner voice said this was done through the eyes. My intuition believes this is true.

I would like to hear Houman's input in regards to what we can do to protect our families, our loved ones. If I had known what I could have done, perhaps what happened with this lady and my son may not have happened.

Strange world we live in - justoneman

[Chester]

Alien Abductee Portraits by Steven Hirsch

http://littlestickylegs.blogspot.fi/

to wynderer, if you read the link text you will realize this is people's abduction stories, in many ways no different in a general sense from yours.

Thank you, TheVoyager, for the link. justoneman

[Chester]

Thank you for your post 9eagle9. It gives me a lot to think about and to reconsider.


...I find it gross and disrespectful to impose our consciousness , our ****, our baggage on any animal. As if they extensions of our emotional body. We see animals as victims because we see ourselves that way. We see animals as wounded and suffering because we are--to the point we grieve and moan pre-kill over them.

Animals have not been innocent since we have been not innocent. We've corrupted them. We corrupt them still by imposing our consciousness on them...

The topic of projecting onto others (humans and animals) is quite an important one in my view since people do so (me likely included) without realising it or even having a clue of the existence of such a concept, unless they are very self-aware. And more often than not, I suspect, people aren't as self-aware as they think they are, which is a big part of our human condition.

The following is an excerpt from http://psitalent.de/Englisch/Atlantis.htm:




[...]

So, back to the topic contact. And to this an example:

A friend of mine has a big dog and she takes extensive care of him. Besides literature about dogs she also likes to look for the advice of dog-trainers, dog-doctors etc., in order to make everything right. The dog gets a lot of tenderness and also very much observation of her. Karin and I are however predominantly annoyed over this relationship and recently, we found out what’s the reason. What disturbs us so is that our friend doesn't have contact with the dog, no matter how intensively she cares about him.

Through the lacking contact, the following effect occurs: The other, in this case the dog, turns into the victim of projections. Dogs have a sensitive stomach, the doctor said ..... The uncertain dog-proprietress will project a big sensitive dog in the course of the time.

To come to the point: Whoever doesn't have contact lives in his projections and projects onto others. And no matter, whether the projections are good or bad for the other person, it disturbs the other person, to be or become itself. In this way parents harm their children if there is no contact. In this way therapists harm their patients if there is no contact. In this way everyone harms everyone for lack of contact.

I could often perceive that people projected their guru-ideas into my person. I clearly sensed how difficult it became for me just to be as natural as I want to be. Something squeezed me. I noticed myself giving them answers they longed to hear. I sensed more distance to myself and to the others. These were positive projections and some probably would have liked this condition. I felt unwell anyway and had a need, to get out of this.

I agree, Gemini... one of the best comprehensive posts in the last several pages. I wish I had read it before making a few of my latest posts as I have already grown in my view development.

Thank you 9eagle9... and since I am addressing you. Thank You for posting points of view few here (including myself) have the bravery to post much less consider and in such depth. I know you make yourself a target sometimes but I hope you continue to post despite other posts that I have perceived were attacks on you. In fact, of all the posters I have come to know, been fortunate to create PM relationships with and a bit more, the one I have with you is quite special and I just wanted to state publicly my appreciation for you. - justoneman

[Hervé]

[...]

If I had known what I could do, perhaps what happened with this lady and my son may not have happened.

Strange world we live in - justoneman

I guess you didn't fully digest the content of this thread: Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics) nor Steve Richards' website: http://www.holographickinetics.net/default.html (especially the case studies) nor his interviews?

It's all there as well as the inconveniences of not getting the entity to acknowledge and abide by the superior law that bind them. I vaguely recall posting something about reading them their "Miranda (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=509569&viewfull=1#post509569)"...

[Chester]

[...]

If I had known what I could do, perhaps what happened with this lady and my son may not have happened.

Strange world we live in - justoneman

I guess you didn't fully digest the content of this thread: Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics) nor Steve Richards' website: http://www.holographickinetics.net/default.html (especially the case studies) nor his interviews?

It's all there as well as the inconveniences of not getting the entity to acknowledge and abide by the superior law that bind them. I vaguely recall posting something about reading them their "Miranda (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=509569&viewfull=1#post509569)"...

Indeed you did Amzer Zo... and if you recall, I stated I was leaning towards delving into this specific process. But the process is not laid out in a fashion I was able to follow in a step by step fashion that I was able to find. If Steve Richards would do so, I would have possibly been able to accomplish the goal prior to the events which occured only days after you made this direct recommendation to me.

I have more than once gone to the links. I could not understand the video. And I never was able to pick up a step by step process within any of the materials.

I have since acquired a book recommended by Houman called The Practical Psychic Self-Defense Handbook and am about 1/4th the way through a contemplative, thorough read (and taking notes).

I am very grateful for your personal attention and PMs along the way... but you know this. justoneman

ahh and I should add that just a week after the two incidents I wrote about above, I was able to hook up with what I would certainly call a real "shaman" who I also happened to meet on this forum. From the day she assisted me with a final removal of the pesky critter, I have had an amazingly smooth experience. And note further that it was just three days after she performed this removal that I learned of my son's issues. I was able to help him through his circumstances such that he turned himself in before he was ever even charged (and before anyone else did the same). If I had not dealt with this entity, I have no doubt I would not have been able to help Reid like I did. Thank You again, Avalon and the person who helped me (you know who you are).

[observer]

I am compelled to make a clarification here.

The very personal story I told in comment #1624 was an anecdote intended to give greater understanding regarding the ritualistic nature of the act of eating meat. I clearly stated in that comment:


Click-on forwarding arrow to see full content of observer's comment #1624.

[....snip]
"My point has been, since my first comment regarding eating the flesh of a beast: this is all part of a sacrifice ritual - whether you want to believe this or not. I brought this up as a discussion regarding how we are all controlled - through ritual - by an archonic hyperdimensional presence. One can make-up all sorts of rationalizations to justify why you are participating in this ritual. The bottom line is that you ARE participating in a ritual." (emphasis added)

That comment WAS NOT about "HUNTING".

It was a comment regarding the ritualistic nature of what one is doing when participating in the meat eating ceremony.

Houman clearly understood the point I was making when he replied in comment #1629:


I share observer's opinion/experience that if we were to not only slaughter what we eat but also, perhaps, raise it and help deliver it, we would see things differently...

We live in such a fake/artificial environment that we have (perhaps by design) lost our most of our humanity and we have dulled our senses to avoid hearing our souls screaming at us (sometimes these souls take extreme measures such as an accident or a disease to get our attention)... "hollow shells" is the term used in the Hopi prophecies for what we are being turned into... and "demons" is the term used by satanists for what we are being turned into in societies engineered by them (yes, this is their intent (make us part of that hierarchy but at the lowest levels), and this is what we slowly turn into by shutting our connection with our souls).

This connection uses the language of the heart: empathy, with it you will feel what others feel, not only humans but also animals, you will also perceive their thoughts in a primitive form...
It is our lack of empathy (and the resulting compassion) that has brought us to the edge of destruction...

[....snip]


There are other members replying to my comments in this thread and convoluting my words into meanings that were never intended when I made the comment.

This 'meat eating' issue IS NOT about vegetarianism v. carnivorism. One can place all the 'spin' on my words that one desires. Rationalizations regarding your personal preferences is NOT what my comments were intended to solicited.

This is a thread about archonic influence on the human condition. Ritual is the foundation of how the Mass of Humanity is manipulated by these archonic hyperdimensional entities.

The bottom line in this regard is: eating meat is a blood sacrifice ritual.

End of story....

[Flash]

I do not know whom you are aiming at, but I can tell you my comments were not aiming at you at all Observer, I had understood your point, maybe others had not..

However, I remain on my point as well, living up north of the planet, not eating meat was equal to death. Was it archonic rituals?? Nowadays, it may, but for Inuits, who still do not have much access to vegetables and grains (they do not grow up north), are they doing blood sacrifice rituals?? Blood sacrifice while respecting the kill and being appreciative of life given, yes, but archonistic ritual, I have problem to see it for Inuits. For southerners however, very little meat, if any, is necessary (i follow more in 9eagle9 point of view in those terms personnally) and in those terms, you are right, we have worldwide massive blood ritual - without period (I see some exceptions) ;)

[9eagle9]

OMG...I think I have shown and described a thousand times in this very forum the measures taken, to abate this sort of thing. I know I posted the initialization process just a few pages back in this very thread.

This is what I mean when I say, there are no secrets, people just don't care. Because they don't want to notice the solutions.... they fool themselves into thinking they don't exist.

The thread on Holographic Kinetics is good place to start--out of many. It's right here in the forum, its not hidden, its not deceptive, the person who posted it isn't a celebrity, or otherwise inaccessible. Or secret, or occult. So what is the excuse? We ignore it or otherwise don't notice it because......why? We are deflected from that sort of thing. It doesn't apply to us does it? We're special.

I was deflected from the thread ONLY because it had the word holograph in it--I figured it was an cersize in playing one's own illusion- ****. Finally the OP contacted me and drew my attention to it . But I had to be willing to go there and I seen things I already knew...and a few I didn't . No reason to resist it, after all what it deals with has nothing to do with me as I AM, but quite a lot to do with 'who I am seduced into thinking I am'.

Doing that sort of work. Or work similar to it as HK appears to be composed of many facets. Anyone of those facets can begin a journey of SELF discovery. Having a facilitator to guide you through it. They point, you dig. You hit a root, they help you pull it up and then dispose of it.

Power is not stolen, its only the perception of stolen power through smoke and mirrors. To convince one that one does not have empowerment. One's power is not out there, it's inside whether its an abductor or an angel. . You have to go inside and be very HONEST with yourself about what you are finding there. Why are you feeling the way that you are feeling, challenging all your thoughts, acknowledging patterns in your life. People who are abducted repeatedly are experiencing a pattern.

They continue to be abducted....or they keep hi-jacking. Ever been in panic mode? You're hi-jacked. Frozen with fear? You are hi-jacked. Keep experiencing the same low form emotions all the time. You're high jacked.

No loss of power just the inability to express one's own power--which prevented me from being abducted.

If this pattern is specializing us how willing are we going to be to give it up?

Would I post on this forum that I was in bed with five guys who all had stds and were raping me repeatedly and attempt to make it sound like I have some irresistible something that no one else has.

If I did, what would you say to me?

YOU NEED HELP!!!

A victim is always getting something out of the victim relationship. What is it? They are special, not through empowerment, but through dis-empowerment.

They get attention. Because some off planet entity stuck a prod up their arse they are suddenly more special than the people who haven't . I'm not more special than someone who has been hi-jacked, or not hi-jacked---I just KNOW myself better. KNOWING my SELF, my essential true nature lurking behind me CAN come forward at times of crisis.


Most people's essential (essence) cannot because they don't know it. Or allow it.Even if it did express, they wouldn't know it. They are seduced by programming that tells them who to think they are. Where their power is. How can anyone be empowered by perpetrating the notion they are an abductee?

That is like saying "I'm raped, I'm violated, I'm better than everyone else" No you are violated and attempting to make it a grand admirable thing. "My abuser thinks I'm worthy of notice" because no one else has or does<<<<<Right there is the artificial program that needs to come out. the trauma wound. You are invisible to the rest of the world, but someone out there noticed you. The abuser is then made out to be more powerful and better than everyone else, therefore has power over everyone, but because they noticed me....singled me out....I'm special. That powerful thing noticed me while I ignore the power that I am.

If I work with an abductee I'd acknowledge that they were hi-jacked either by themselves or some other influence LONG before the actual abduction took place. I'd know that. The hard part is getting them to know it. Watch and see how much resistance I get to what I'm saying.


The abduction is just the end result of the hi-jacking not the actual problem. People who experience parasitical influence ARE abducted, the mind is taken well before the physical abduction. The physical part of it is just part of that. If you have power over your mind, you cannot be abducted. There are plenty of hi-jacked people who have never been physically taken.

Accept how one feels about that instead of deflecting it off into 'special' and 'victim' including the language one uses...I'm an abductee. That perpetrates the program running.

I would no more use that language than I allow people to really reinforce the more flattering titles-- I am a shaman and a medicine woman or or an equestrian. I know myself that is not who I am that is an expression of my SELF that one moves in and out very easily, so I am experiencing all parts of myself, and can comfortably assume a short term role of dishwasher, and vaccumer. Just empty titles. They are facets, that are part of my totality but they would be limiting if I did not know all of myself or as much as I can know. They are expressions not words. I can show you what shaman is as easily as I can show you me vaccuming and I think nothing of switching in between the two. One is not better than the other, they are just words to describe something that I can demonstrate to another.

What I know of myself is not by what I'm told to think or what I might think of myself it is what I can show and demonstrate. You have to KNOW yourself. Who I am is demonstrated in every level of my existence from the way I look to the expressions that come from me, or what effects my presence prompts in another person. Sometimes, Often times I'm not effecting people, I am triggering who they really aren't. Their pseudo installation.

If spoke continuously to people from my artificial mind, I'd speak of only mowing the lawn and the price of hay, and horses and ogling the farrier. I'm very limited there, it doesn't know much. It hasn't been educated as much as other minds, it has no intelligence whatsoever.


What we think we know about ourselves is what we know about the artificial installations running in our heads. We have no control over that until we clean ourselves of it. It is just energy, with density loaded in it. Clean out the density and it will be a clearer energy. There is no smoke and mirrors left to hide **** behind, little entry doors and avenues of intrusion hidden away from our conscious notice. If all this crap is contained in our consciousness how are we going to be conscious of it? Hiding in plain sight.

In knowing yourself you have to KNOW....(and be willing to confront)

.... where has your mind been hi-jacked.

In childhood? In other lives? There is where I would go, examine it, allow the feelings associated with it, pull it out by the roots and whatever parasitical influence is attached to it, make the appropriate arrangements to dispose of it, and then is when the avenues of abduction are shut down--whether they are physical or ....mental. You cannot have one without the other.

You have to separate consciousness from awareness, make that division in consciousness so you feel the divide-- HOW you are divided. One part of us is thumping along all unaffected by this ****, and we have to bring that part forward to BE unaffected--by anything--instead of burying it under artifical emotions and thoughts. How do I survive 2000 pound horses falling on me weekly? For that matter why do I have a pattern of horses falling on me?

The other part of yourself, your compromised consciousness which actually belongs to them, would fold you over a bench and let you take it up the ass. Because it is NOT a part of you.

We can't separate from our consciousness, we keep thinking who we are is what we are feeling and thinking, and that is NOT who we are. That is who THEY are.

I think I am a victim. How does a victim feel? Violated, disempowered, frustrated, angry, depressed, sad, helpless unable to empower changes into one's life. Do we cover that up by turning all that horrible stuff into 'special' or do we just feel it and then feeling it allows it to release. Or do we keep returning to that feeling/thought and wallow in and remind ourselves we are a victim.

You have to confront your mind. If you are believing everything your mind thinks, then you are already hi-jacked and abducted.

Every person's experience is different and every person who has been hi-jacked is facilitated in a different way. The only common denominator is ...the willingness to accept this about ourselves and then do something about it.

Managing your thoughts and your emotions. They are connected to each other. All emotions have an attached thought and vice versa.

When one reacts emotionally pause and ask one's self why am I reacting that way.

Why am I feeling this way.

If I am empowered why am I hurt over this.

People often (yes believe it or not) tell me I'm too nice. I'm not. People confuse non reaction with nice. So I respond to something instead of reacting to it. If I cannot summon a RESPONSE (which is what responsibility is based on) I will get say I don't how I feel or think about that I will get back to you later.

Re-action is based on re-acting out the same old trauma over and over again.

What are my eyes seeing? Do I believe what they are showing me. What am I hearing, do I embrace it or is it meaningless. Challenging our perceptions in every way they come into us instead of just going by how we feel , and think which often times is not our feelings or thoughts at all.







An abduction attempt was made on me.

I say attempt because.....I am the stronger the entity because I'm not a victim. Ifone is abducted one is a victim.

When one is abducted they can decide to continue being a victim of abduction or the stronger entity. If they keep referring to themselves as an abuctee they are simply specializing the victim label.

I am not an abductee. So while i understand the peril involved in that energy I do not understand why people want to stay in that energy. No more than I can understand why someone wants to wave a prostetic leg around and keep telling the world they are an amputee instead of just putting the leg on and walking on it. One circumstance is the crutch of a victim, the other is support to a former victim.

Now the power that is granted is to the victim in acknowledging they were a victim of abduction. No one really gives a **** that there are people out there who know how not ot be victims of abduction. Which is a more desireable circumstance. Being abducted or not being abducted? One is empowerment , one is not.

How special is the victim. As long as we keep making the victim special the victim be special for a very long time. Not for anything they have done , merely for being a victim.

You can only bang the abduction drum for so long. Like any other victim drum it only varies on the details.

I am more concerned with myself hi jacking myself than something 'out there' hi jacking me.



9eagle9

If one has been repeatedly abducted and has lost much on account of it, how does one stop further abductions from happening? And more importantly, how does one regain one's lost power?

[Chester]

To Amzer Zo - I decided I am dropping everything else and going back to the beginning of the Steve Richards material and going through each and every bit of it.

I am doing so in honor of all the heart you have devoted to us here on Avalon as well as because of all your direct help to me. I also believe in you in that you are making a wise recommendation (and have done so many times).

Thank You for bringing this once again to my attention.

I will post my progress and results.

justoneman

[9eagle9]

There's very little reason for northerners to eat citrus fruit ...unless it's in the summer. It's not a moral quandary, just not necessary.

Back then, before the before, as we say, we ate from the local environment. If there were no edible plants then...we ate animals. And some northern climates have little in the way of edible plants that provided enough variety for sustenance.

If these people, our forebears had decided to be noble and starve, we wouldn't be here now.






I do not know whom you are aiming at, but I can tell you my comments were not aiming at you at all Observer, I had understood your point, maybe others had not..

However, I remain on my point as well, living up north of the planet, not eating meat was equal to death. Was it archonic rituals?? Nowadays, it may, but for Inuits, who still do not have much access to vegetables and grains (they do not grow up north), are they doing blood sacrifice rituals?? Blood sacrifice while respecting the kill and being appreciative of life given, yes, but archonistic ritual, I have problem to see it for Inuits. For southerners however, very little meat, if any, is necessary (i follow more in 9eagle9 point of view in those terms personnally) and in those terms, you are right, we have worldwide massive blood ritual - without period (I see some exceptions) ;)

[Houman]

I would like to hear Houman's input in regards to what we can do to protect our families, our loved ones. If I had known what I could have done, perhaps what happened with this lady and my son may not have happened.

This is not a universal recipe but a few principles...

- "My people perish from a lack of knowledge", inform yourself for them if they are not doing it, you will be able to help them with healing (whatever their condition might be, just don't give up)...
- Spend time with them, make them your priority
- Concerning "How does one protect one's loved ones from falling into their traps? " : Love, perseverance and patience, never give up!
- Most importantly do whatever you can do and strive to go beyond that (with love and clarity of purpose), this will get you in touch with your own soul and miracles will then start happening... I recommend the following lecture by Neil Kaufman if you want to learn more about that...

qKE9FOlto1g
HPW0M0lmoJw


if you don't know who Neil is, this what he has accomplished (in 4 parts)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8uJ5RpQWw0
...
see also
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owHrxL3NvVE

[ThePythonicCow]

The thread on Holographic Kinetics is good place to start--out of many.
This thread: Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics) ?

[observer]

A note to all of those members who have experienced the abduction phenomenon:

Earlier in this thread, I gave a link to "The John Lear Disclosure (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTRFhrAr8us)".

John is the son of the inventor of the Lear Jet. He has been interviewed by Bill Ryan in the past. John grew-up in a house that was constantly visited by some of the original members of MJ-12. His insights are paradigm shattering.

In 2003 John came forward and gave a briefing on what he knew regarding the alien presence. He told a story relating what the government had discovered. The following is a synopsis of his insights:

The gray aliens are biological robots. They are doing the work for some 'hidden' alien species.
Contracts were signed by our United States Government that included a certain 'allowable' amount of abductions.
The terms of these contracts included the trading of alien technology.
The gray aliens with whom we made these contracts never held-up to their end of the bargain, in that they abducted far more individuals than originally stated, and the technology we received was far short of what was expected.


The evidence is clear on this issue. You are being abducted as a result of a contract.

Pages of psychologically influenced rhetoric regarding empowering and disempowering is nonsense. The evidence is clear on what is happening.

The 'psychiatric industry' is a billion dollar a year 'cash cow' for the banking industry. There is not a single psychiatrist on the planet that can make the claim he has 'cured' his patient. These banksters in cahoots with the psychiatric industry are the ones who benefit from the psychological trauma caused by this abduction phenomenon. It is to their benefit to confuse those effected with trauma.

Fighting-back might work for some who are unimportant to the process, but I would suggest any member who is a multiple abduction/abductees is most likely a valuable asset to whatever 'program' you are part of. I seriously doubt empowerment will have any effect.

I would imply those weaving pages of psychiatric industry influenced explanations regarding what is happening to you and how to cure yourself need to take a few minutes to review the best evidence available on the subject. Listen to what John Lear had to say.

If you want to empower yourself, arm yourself with a weapon. They don't like people with guns who show an intention to use it for personal protection. This is part of the foundational reason why the elite are attempting to disarm the public.

To truly stop the abductions there needs to begin a campaign with your Senators and Congressmen to put an end the contracts. First, however, there needs to be a total 'house cleaning' of the reptiles who currently hold these positions. That's when the abductions will cease.

[Chester]

The thread on Holographic Kinetics is good place to start--out of many.
This thread: Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics) ?

Yes Paul - that is the same thread - started by D-Day back in January - both Amzer Zo's link and yours go to this thread... what do you think about this material, Paul? I originally read through the interviews with Steve Richards in late June/early July when Amzer Zo first started bringing it up again in this Horus-Ra thread. Honestly, I got little out of it.

Astonishingly, and because I respect Amzer Zo a great deal, I decided to go through those interviews again. I spent two hours covering the first 65% of the first interview last night and strangely, every sentence of Steve Richards came through clearly and I have so far been able to achieve a great deal of comprehension where just two months ago not much was able to sink in.

I attribute this change to a.) some positive progress I have made due to my studies (all coming from Avalonians and much of that from the Horus-Ra thread and b.) that at least one suspected entity I have been dealing with has been removed in mid July and c.) I have been fortunate that I have been able to move to a peaceful land and d.) that I am well into my new diet / cleansing routine (which is not so easy to do but has already resulted in a clearer mind).

Amazing but sadly, only good for me so far... maybe some others can be inspired by my recantings.

To Observer - again another quite powerful post. Being honest, my first feeling when I read your most recent post was a feeling of hopelessness and that perhaps I should withdraw and just wait for the day I die. Then I quickly moved out of that thought and realized abductions have occurred long before the said contract anyways and just a side note to the bigger picture. I then recalled my studies of last night and felt that surge of hope and quickly returned my optimistic resolve.

Everyone is entitled to their view and mine is that I am not nor ever will be empowered by owning a gun to defend my physical body from some other physical body threat. I really don't care what anyone does to my physical body anymore if I am stuck in living in the dynamic of "fear" because the only reason I would do so is because I am afraid something might harm my physical body or kill it AND that I must use a physical weapon to prevent that. I am not spiritually developed enough to handle that. I have to find my solution in another way, through some way that cannot result in violence to another being. I found that when I approach these concerning possibilities restricting myself from weapons, I actually, simultaneously lose the fear. I cannot explain why this is the case, but it just is. I also recall in my younger days when I thought differently and those days I was consumed by my fears.

Please, don't take what I wrote as an argument in any form. In fact, I respect others who have the spiritual maturity regarding weapons and how they might be handled. I also fully admit my abduction experience and my other anomalous experiences are nothing near the horrifying nature of DoTs and wynderers and so how can I possibly know how they should feel, react, attempt to do about what appears to be an ongoing phenomena for them.

Thanks Houman for the interviews - will watch asap as I continue through the Steve Richards material again.

Apologies I got rambly - justoneman

[ThePythonicCow]

The thread on Holographic Kinetics is good place to start--out of many.
This thread: Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics) ?

Yes Paul - that is the same thread - started by D-Day back in January - both Amzer Zo's link and yours go to this thread... what do you think about this material, Paul? I originally read through the interviews with Steve Richards in late June/early July when Amzer Zo first started bringing it up again in this Horus-Ra thread. Honestly, I got little out of it.

It looked intriguing ... but between my lousy hearing and my Texas accent not being the same as Steve Richard's Aussie accent, I probably got less out of it than you did. I only attempted to listen to a few minutes of it, before giving up.

[wynderer]

---------------------------------------

[Chester]

The thread on Holographic Kinetics is good place to start--out of many.
This thread: Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics) ?

Yes Paul - that is the same thread - started by D-Day back in January - both Amzer Zo's link and yours go to this thread... what do you think about this material, Paul? I originally read through the interviews with Steve Richards in late June/early July when Amzer Zo first started bringing it up again in this Horus-Ra thread. Honestly, I got little out of it.

It looked intriguing ... but between my lousy hearing and my Texas accent not being the same as Steve Richard's Aussie accent, I probably got less out of it than you did. I only attempted to listen to a few minutes of it, before giving up.

Yes - in fact, I am getting out of it what I am getting out of it because I am reading the transcripts which I downloaded... I could get nothing out of the videos. I do not know exactly where the transcript links are at the moment though I know Amzer Zo posted those specific links in this thread somewhere around late June / early July.

I hope he might repost these links. Thanks Paul.

To wynderer and observer, I don't know the details of this contract but if we are being victimized based on this contract, then the contract must also be retroactive. I am unaware under what law this contract would be enforced nor what law would support that this contract suddenly allow for abductions to occur prior to the signing of this contract.

There are a plethora of documented cases of the abduction phenomena that have occurred well before the signing of this contract (if the contract was indeed executed as reported by Lear which I am very open minded that it did). My point is that the Grays and others by the very fact that they have supposedly violated this contract suggests that they cannot be trusted and also suggests to me they need no contract in the first place. So why then would they delve into such a contract? I can see two reasons immediately. One, the American military had achieved some technical prowess such that they were able to "shoot down" (perhaps inadvertently) the Gray crafts and so I could see a motivation by the Grays to stop that. In addition, I can also see the logic in obtaining cooperation along these lines as it would only make the overall abduction program easier and perhaps facilitate the opportunity for the Grays to abduct larger numbers of Americans.

Did the contract cover beyond America? If not, then we are talking a sampling of less than 5% of the human population suddenly being "allowed by contract" to be abducted.

Does it really make sense to believe the abduction phenomena is because of this contract? I have major doubts and consider that thought a bit naive. But I certainly don't know everything and, in fact, not much of anything.

justoneman

[Chester]

thank you for this post, Observer -- esp this part:

'The evidence is clear on this issue. You are being abducted as a result of a contract.

Pages of psychologically influenced rhetoric regarding empowering and disempowering is nonsense. The evidence is clear on what is happening.'

the Ghost Dancers here in the USA attempted to empower themselves spiritually, believing that this would stop the white man's bullets -- it did not work

i said before that we abductees are up against some pretty sophisticated technology -- &, for those who are into the soul contract deal going around the net now -- pls note that no abductee was aware of, let alone signed/gave permission to, the contract made by our gov't


A note to all of those members who have experienced the abduction phenomenon:

Earlier in this thread, I gave a link to "The John Lear Disclosure (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTRFhrAr8us)".

John is the son of the inventor of the Lear Jet. He has been interviewed by Bill Ryan in the past. John grew-up in a house that was constantly visited by some of the original members of MJ-12. His insights are paradigm shattering.

In 2003 John came forward and gave a briefing on what he knew regarding the alien presence. He told a story relating what the government had discovered. The following is a synopsis of his insights:

The gray aliens are biological robots. They are doing the work for some 'hidden' alien species.
Contracts were signed by our United States Government that included a certain 'allowable' amount of abductions.
The terms of these contracts included the trading of alien technology.
The gray aliens with whom we made these contracts never held-up to their end of the bargain, in that they abducted far more individuals than originally stated, and the technology we received was far short of what was expected.


The evidence is clear on this issue. You are being abducted as a result of a contract.

Pages of psychologically influenced rhetoric regarding empowering and disempowering is nonsense. The evidence is clear on what is happening.

The 'psychiatric industry' is a billion dollar a year 'cash cow' for the banking industry. There is not a single psychiatrist on the planet that can make the claim he has 'cured' his patient. These banksters in cahoots with the psychiatric industry are the ones who benefit from the psychological trauma caused by this abduction phenomenon. It is to their benefit to confuse those effected with trauma.

Fighting-back might work for some who are unimportant to the process, but I would suggest any member who is a multiple abduction/abductees is most likely a valuable asset to whatever 'program' you are part of. I seriously doubt empowerment will have any effect.

I would imply those weaving pages of psychiatric industry influenced explanations regarding what is happening to you and how to cure yourself need to take a few minutes to review the best evidence available on the subject. Listen to what John Lear had to say.

If you want to empower yourself, arm yourself with a weapon. They don't like people with guns who show an intention to use it for personal protection. This is part of the foundational reason why the elite are attempting to disarm the public.

To truly stop the abductions there needs to begin a campaign with your Senators and Congressmen to put an end the contracts. First, however, there needs to be a total 'house cleaning' of the reptiles who currently hold these positions. That's when the abductions will cease.

Maybe I will be proven wrong, but I will never accept that I cannot (nor everyone else cannot) resolve the ongoing abduction experience through one's own eternal Spirit. If one wants to consider discussions along those lines as, "Pages of psychologically influenced rhetoric regarding empowering and disempowering is nonsense," then they certainly can so do and I won't get in their way other than to suggest they may be wrong as I am so doing now.

I have already experienced a freeing of much of the entities that have been feeding off my ignorance since I was a child. I am determined to retain my vigilance against any new invasions but am doing so holistically via my entire being. In fact, it is clear already through the Steve Richards material that the process of holographic kinetics is holistic and based on knowledge known to the Australian Aborigines for at least 60,000 years.

Just what I was able to digest last night in about two hours has greatly expanded my view of how I am able to heal and protect myself from further intrusions. It cannot hurt anyone to consider this material - thanks already Amzer Zo. justoneman

[wynderer]

----------------------------------------

[Chester]

Maybe I will be proven wrong, but I will never accept that I cannot (nor everyone else cannot) resolve their ongoing abduction experience through their own eternal Spirit. If one wants to consider discussions along those lines as, "Pages of psychologically influenced rhetoric regarding empowering and disempowering is nonsense," then they certainly can so do and I won't get in their way other than to suggest they may be wrong as I am so doing now.

I have already experienced a freeing of much of the entities that have been feeding off my ignorance since I was a child. I am determined to retain my vigilance against any new invasions but am doing so holistically via my entire being. In fact, it is clear already through the Steve Richards material that the process of holographic kinetics is holistic and based on knowledge known to the Australian Aborigines for at least 60,000 years.

Just what i was able to digest last night in about two hours has greatly expanded my view of how I am able to heal and protect myself from further intrusions. It cannot hurt anyone to consider this material - thanks already Amzer Zo. justoneman


as i see it, there is a difference between abductions by the ETs who contracted w/our gov't [& the abductions by our own gov't] , & astral intrusions -- the former use technology -- the last does not

if you are indeed an abductee -- one handed over by our gov't to the ETs -- & you can find a way to stop your abductions -- if they don't kill you first, you'll be a rich man if you can market your technique

self edited - see posts further down

[wynderer]

-----------------------------------

[9eagle9]

You cannot empower yourself consciously, it is the psyche , the conscious compromise that is the problem.

The next problem is that people think their consciousness is spirit.

So in attempting to empower one's self spiritually they are unwittingly using the consciousness to do so, as they do not know the difference.

[wynderer]

-------------------------------

[9eagle9]

Even though as a medicine woman and only with the knowing that I have from that; I managed to thwart an abduction attempt, you are saying otherwise.

Why would you perpetrate the notion that we are helpless and dis empowered when it is clear that we are not? That KNOWING is our greatest empowerment. Not denial. If this is affecting your thinking and comprehension, you are compromised. I'm sorry that's just the way it is. I don't care if its the influence of thoughts, the trauma of the abduction, or you drank a six pack before you posted ----anything that interferes with our cognitive abilities is compromise.

I would sit up and take notice of what people are saying to you because when I post about this stuff, I get attacked too. But I know how to abate that. You thwart the same way an abduction is thwarted. Apparently you don't know how to abate it but continue to encourage others to remain in this role that you have assumed. Now you are a victim of psychic attacks. This is a pattern.

Do you not care? Not only for yourself but others who may resonant with what you are saying in a disempowering way.

What are you hoping to achieve. What is the point of all this? What is your solution, your fix,your cure because if you are being attacked right now....you are compromised.

Weren't you yourself challenging and taunting me just a few days ago to 'be' a warrior.

This is not what warriors do.



justoneman, i think we have some major sort of miscommunication going on here -- i honestly am not intending to twist your words -- it seems i have misunderstood some things

what i'm trying to say is that shamanic methods & other psychic protection methods are helpful in removing dark astral beings from influencing/controlling a person, but [imo] they do not work for those who are part of the extensive ET/Human abduction programs going on

i have been living w/severe pain & exhaustion & enduring some psychic attacks since i started posting about abductions -- this always happens when i post on this subject -- i'm sure it affects my thinking/comprehension

i do, & always have, wish you well, & that your healing journey is successful

wyn

[9eagle9]

Are your recently experienced psychic attacks considered part of all the good and simple things in life? To have those episodes interfere with your cognitive experiences is good and simple? Do you read your posts and understand what counter conflicting messages you are giving here?


i figure the fact that i am still alive, in this 3D body, & that i can still enjoy all the good & simple things in life, means that i've done a pretty good job of empowering myself


You cannot empower yourself consciously, it is the psyche , the conscious compromise that is the problem.

The next problem is that people think their consciousness is spirit.

So in attempting to empower one's self spiritually they are unwittingly using the consciousness to do so, as they do not know the difference.

[wynderer]

-----------------------------

[9eagle9]

You may want to rephrase that while you are seemingly not able to do something about your condition that doesn't necessarily apply to everyone.

I don't particularly view myself as unlimited, so this is where we are going to have to agree to be divided on the subject.

Compromised people are not the first people I turn to for advice when I need advice about my own compromised situations. I hope you understand the sanity in that remark. It's not personal its getting on with the business of taking back our world.

[Heartsong]

Hi 9eagle9,
If it's not too intrusive, would you describe your attempted abduction and what you did to thwart that attack? I'm not challenging you, I'm just curious.
Heartsong

[Chester]

Maybe I will be proven wrong, but I will never accept that I cannot (nor everyone else cannot) resolve their ongoing abduction experience through their own eternal Spirit. If one wants to consider discussions along those lines as, "Pages of psychologically influenced rhetoric regarding empowering and disempowering is nonsense," then they certainly can so do and I won't get in their way other than to suggest they may be wrong as I am so doing now.

I have already experienced a freeing of much of the entities that have been feeding off my ignorance since I was a child. I am determined to retain my vigilance against any new invasions but am doing so holistically via my entire being. In fact, it is clear already through the Steve Richards material that the process of holographic kinetics is holistic and based on knowledge known to the Australian Aborigines for at least 60,000 years.

Just what i was able to digest last night in about two hours has greatly expanded my view of how I am able to heal and protect myself from further intrusions. It cannot hurt anyone to consider this material - thanks already Amzer Zo. justoneman


as i see it, there is a difference between abductions by the ETs who contracted w/our gov't [& the abductions by our own gov't] , & astral intrusions -- the former use technology -- the last does not

if you are indeed an abductee -- one handed over by our gov't to the ETs -- & you can find a way to stop your abductions -- if they don't kill you first, you'll be a rich man if you can market your technique

Not sure you are aware, but I have experienced a physical world event which was an abduction in that I was forced to grasp an object in my left hand against my will and this was done by beings clearly not of this earth. I have two suspicious areas which appear to be implants. My oldest son has the exact same thing in the exact same location. Neither of us had this object at birth. Mine appeared when I was about 8 years old and my son's appeared when he was about 6 years old. This oldest son of mine has had major symptoms known to be manifested by abductees. It is known that families are targeted and especially the oldest child.

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?44353-My-possible-abduction-experience

In addition to my physical experiences, have had experiences with astral entities and have focused most of my attention on these entities in my posts of the last few months.

Regardless, I see both the physical world "archontically aligned" beings (and thus the physical abductions) to be a component of the overall "archontic matrix" which is shared by the "archontically aligned" astral beings. I also see how we, as creator beings, create our own "monsters" which from refamiliarizing myself with the Steve Richards views can become actual entities themselves.

I guess the point I have been trying to make in this regard is that I do not believe I can achieve a state of freedom from any archontically aligned being (physical or not) unless I am able to transform my entire being.

I believe this can be done and done prior to leaving my physical body in this lifetime. But, perhaps the physical world itself IS the archontic realm. If that is the case, I will likely be dealing with the dilemma of whether or not I would voluntarily return. I would probably do so minimally to assist loved ones as well as any being that is caught within the matrix and wants to be free of the matrix. But I may change my mind once I am out... I don't know.

At this point in time, it is my opinion that solution for both types of experiences can be reached via the methods recommended by posters on this forum, including, but not restricted to transformation of my being via shamanic treatment (both by a shaman's direct assistance as well as learning how the shamanic process works such that I can become my own shamanic healer).

So far based on my brief application along these lines, things are working well. I have had many flying dreams of late which has always been a sign I am in a good place.

justone

[Hervé]

[...]


The evidence is clear on this issue. You are being abducted as a result of a contract.

[...]

Truman Cash's, karla Turner's, B. Bartholic's, Mangala's, etc, researches squarely disagrree with that statement.

Abductions have been going on for eons.

Hence that statement, to the contrary of being all inclusive, is derived from only ONE particular group of ETs that made it "legal" with ONE Earth's government.

In other words, in spite of claiming and clamoring it (to seemingly make it logical and scientific), that statement is not supported by evidence.

[Daughter of Time]

The thread on Holographic Kinetics is good place to start--out of many.
This thread: Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics) ?

Yes Paul - that is the same thread - started by D-Day back in January - both Amzer Zo's link and yours go to this thread... what do you think about this material, Paul? I originally read through the interviews with Steve Richards in late June/early July when Amzer Zo first started bringing it up again in this Horus-Ra thread. Honestly, I got little out of it.

Astonishingly, and because I respect Amzer Zo a great deal, I decided to go through those interviews again. I spent two hours covering the first 65% of the first interview last night and strangely, every sentence of Steve Richards came through clearly and I have so far been able to achieve a great deal of comprehension where just two months ago not much was able to sink in.

I attribute this change to a.) some positive progress I have made due to my studies (all coming from Avalonians and much of that from the Horus-Ra thread and b.) that at least one suspected entity I have been dealing with has been removed in mid July and c.) I have been fortunate that I have been able to move to a peaceful land and d.) that I am well into my new diet / cleansing routine (which is not so easy to do but has already resulted in a clearer mind).

Amazing but sadly, only good for me so far... maybe some others can be inspired by my recantings.

To Observer - again another quite powerful post. Being honest, my first feeling when I read your most recent post was a feeling of hopelessness and that perhaps I should withdraw and just wait for the day I die. Then I quickly moved out of that thought and realized abductions have occurred long before the said contract anyways and just a side note to the bigger picture. I then recalled my studies of last night and felt that surge of hope and quickly returned my optimistic resolve.

Everyone is entitled to their view and mine is that I am not nor ever will be empowered by owning a gun to defend my physical body from some other physical body threat. I really don't care what anyone does to my physical body anymore if I am stuck in living in the dynamic of "fear" because the only reason I would do so is because I am afraid something with harm my physical body or kill it AND that I must use a physical weapon to prevent that. I am not spiritually developed enough to handle that. I have to find my solution in another way, through some way that cannot result in violence to another being. I found that when I approach these concerning possibilities restricting myself from weapons, I actually, simultaneously lose the fear. I cannot explain why this is the case, but it just is. I also recall in my younger days when I thought differently and those days I was consumed by my fears.

Please, don't take what I wrote as an argument in any form. In fact, I respect others who have the spiritual maturity regarding weapons and how they might be handled. I also fully admit my abduction experience and my other anomalous experiences are nothing near the horrifying nature of DoTs and wynderers and so how can I possibly know how they should feel, react, attempt to do about what appears to be an ongoing phenomena for them.

Thanks Houman for the interviews - will watch asap as I continue through the Steve Richards material again.

Apologies I got rambly - justoneman

I agree with you here Justone,

When i read Observer's post last night, i became so depressed that I had to sign out and sit for hours while contemplating my fate and the point of continuing a life of abductions if those abductions do not stop. While I am not a MILAB abductee, I have been an abductee since infancy (two weeks old!) so I don't know what this means in terms of contracts. I am so confused and although I am no longer angry, I felt deep despair last night, which is far worse than anger. Externally, I do not show any signs of unwellness. People think I am the picture of vibrant health. Internally, I feel like I'm dying. I know I have said this before: no medical conditions have been found for my unwelless but it became very clear back in early May, after an Orionite contact (they said they were from Orion) and I became extremely ill, that the abductions are the cause of my malaise. My apologies for dwelling on this, but I'm desperately seeking answers so Observer's post almost annihilated my hopes.

As far as owning a gun, well, first of all I don't see myself owning a gun since I hate those things. And what would be the point of owning a gun since those pesky intruders usually show up while I sleep? So, that's not an answer for me. As far as taking action with the government goes, well, please! That is not really a feasible action.

9eagle9, I appreciate your contributions and wise insights and I thank you for addressing my questions. And my apologies if I asked you something which you had previously addressed in other threads. I know you are a prolific contributor on many threads, which I am not, so I am certainly not aware of all the wisdom you have imparted. But beside one friend who understands my situation, this is the only place I can voice my concerns for I could never open up to the world out there since they wouldn't believe me and I would risk losing even more if I were to open up. I did try to open up to a friend who has published a number of books on spirituality and the after life. He does believe in abductions. He said he has repeatedly astral travelled and watched abductions and ET procedures. But he believes that they just want our ova and sperm for reproduction purposes and they are studying us, without harming us, because they are contemplating living on planet earth with us, peacefully, and sharing their knowledge! So much for that! I feel that being in a community of kindred spirits (even if there are disagreements as this is not a bad thing because it teaches us other perspectives) is the most helpful place to find answers, epiphanies, inspiration, information, to guide those who are desperately seeking it.

I have asked this question repeatedly on this thread. How does one stop abductions and regain the life force that has been lost in the process? If that is even possible! I am thankful for all the answers and all the willingness to help shown by the contributors here so please don't see me as ungrateful, but the advice on this matter is not really practical. Please don't misunderstand me here, these advices may be practical to you, the writer, but not to me, the reader. There must be more! I know it is my responsibility to find the answers. Today I don't feel despair anymore. I feel so much better than last night.

I wish there were a guide somewhere that one could follow which has been proven to work. There must be abductees out there somewhere who have found of way to stop the abductions and regained their autonomy. Truman Cash has, it seems. He's a great inspiration to me. Well, I guess I'll just have to find my own, personal way. And a way must exist! For every problem, there is a solution. So a solution can be found. Perhaps the solutions are as individual as the abduction cases. But I have to trust that a solution will be found. Living a righteous life hasn't helped me at all. There must be other ways.

Pardon me for my ramblings.

[Daughter of Time]

justoneman, i think we have some major sort of miscommunication going on here -- i honestly am not intending to twist your words -- it seems i have misunderstood some things

what i'm trying to say is that shamanic methods & other psychic protection methods are helpful in removing dark astral beings from influencing/controlling a person, but [imo] they do not work for those who are part of the extensive ET/Human abduction programs going on

i have been living w/severe pain & exhaustion & enduring some psychic attacks since i started posting about abductions -- this always happens when i post on this subject -- i'm sure it affects my thinking/comprehension

i do, & always have, wish you well, & that your healing journey is successful

wyn

Wyn,

I am quite certain that abductees have been programmed with feeling fear, pain, exhaustion, and a plethora of other debilitating symptoms every time they disclose their experiences. This is a way to control us and to make us stop from sharing the nature of our encounters with ETs so that the knowledge will not be spread.

[Hervé]

The thread on Holographic Kinetics is good place to start--out of many.
This thread: Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics) ?

[...]

Astonishingly, and because I respect Amzer Zo a great deal, I decided to go through those interviews again. I spent two hours covering the first 65% of the first interview last night and strangely, every sentence of Steve Richards came through clearly and I have so far been able to achieve a great deal of comprehension where just two months ago not much was able to sink in.

[...]
- justoneman

This is exactly the kind of phenomena 9eagle9 and I have been typing about... "progams," constructs, "cicuits," automatic shut downs, etc...

Phenomena exhibited by what I call the R6ers "skull-dwelling-zombies" who are under a perpetual hypnotic trance and under hypnotic orders not to observe the obvious. The kind that never look at the skies and see chemtrails, etc... "It's all good!" they say... it's all part of the big one all... MESS!

It also illustrates what happens on this forum (less so here) and others. To the point I keep wondering if people:

a) are reading what's written or is it an overlaid picture in their mind?

b) understand what is written?

c) have any probity at all?

Thank you, Justeone, for your honesty and having the courage to report your findings.

Glad you were able to make it out of the hypnotic trance!

[ThePythonicCow]

This thread: Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics) ?

Amzer -- do you happen to know of a transcript of this two part Off Planet Radio interview of Steve Richards ?

[wynderer]

--------------------------------------

[wynderer]

-----------------------------------

[Daughter of Time]

The thread on Holographic Kinetics is good place to start--out of many.
This thread: Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics) ?

[...]

Astonishingly, and because I respect Amzer Zo a great deal, I decided to go through those interviews again. I spent two hours covering the first 65% of the first interview last night and strangely, every sentence of Steve Richards came through clearly and I have so far been able to achieve a great deal of comprehension where just two months ago not much was able to sink in.

[...]
- justoneman

This is exactly the kind of phenomena 9eagle9 and I have been typing about... "progams," constructs, "cicuits," automatic shut downs, etc...

Phenomena exhibited by what I call the R6ers "skull-dwelling-zombies" who are under a perpetual hypnotic trance and under hypnotic orders not to observe the obvious. The kind that never look at the skies and see chemtrails, etc... "It's all good!" they say... it's all part of the big one all... MESS!

It also illustrates what happens on this forum (less so here) and others. To the point I keep wondering if people:

a) are reading what's written or is it an overlaid picture in their mind?

b) understand what is written?

c) have any probity at all?

Thank you, Justeone, for your honesty and having the courage to report your findings.

Glad you were able to make it out of the hypnotic trance!

Amzer Zo,

You are so right here! I fully understand what you're getting at. However, one can read something with intense fervor, desire, and absolute willingness to understand, but if there are powerful programmings in the way, then the understanding will not sink in because it is being over-ridden by the previous programmings. And although I believe it is fully possible and doable to remove programmings as many have managed to do this, when you've been programmed life after life, it becomes extremely difficult. So since the first step must be to de-program oneself, that's what should be focused on first. Again, the question, how does one deprogram oneself? Yes, i know, it has been shared here, repeatedly. I'm not trying to be difficult. I'm just expounding that it is difficult to clear oneself in spite of all the desire in the world to do so. If one doesn't get it, it doesn't mean that they don't want to get it. One ends up feeling stupid for not getting it, even if one is not stupid.

I worked as a teacher for a number of years. I always got my students to reach higher levels of understandings when I showed compassion. Compassion and patience are the keys. I'm not saying that you don't have compassion and patience for you certainly do. Why am I posting this? Because de-programming oneself is very difficult for some no matter how much they want to be fully de-programmed.

¤=[Post Update]=¤


i don't recall Dr Karla Turner saying that -- could you pls direct me to the source?



[...]


The evidence is clear on this issue. You are being abducted as a result of a contract.

[...]

Truman Cash's, karla Turner's, B. Bartholic's, Mangala's, etc, researches squarely disagrree with that statement.

Abductions have been going on for eons.

Hence that statement, to the contrary of being all inclusive, is derived from only ONE particular group of ETs that made it "legal" with ONE Earth's government.

In other words, in spite of claiming and clamoring it (to seemingly make it logical and scientific), that statement is not supported by evidence.

You can google Karla Turner and access her videos. I do remember her saying something along that line when i watched her videos. This was sometime ago so I don't remember exactly how she phrased it.

[9eagle9]

The attempt was pretty intrusive...lol. I've expressed this story before so its not personal , its not even personal to me its just how they operate. I'ts only personal when you become a victim of it.

But basically before the actual physical attempt had been made, it started on the level of psychic and astral infiltration that I deflected. It was weird emerging pattern that started out there in the realms of the mind and blasted its way into physical reality. It may have started, even, before this time; in 06 I crossed the eyes of some letter agencies concerning some remote viewing and they spent a number of weeks trailing after me to make sure I didn't have the secrets to the universe tucked into my bra.

But during about a ten day time frame, I experienced something attempting to high jack me on a mental, emotional and astral sorts of way, lucid dreaming interrupted by ass-trals, wakening meditations being intruded on, channeling being disrupted, normal night time dreaming being disrupted. First it was subtle, then it got more aggressive as the thugs came out. Literally astral thugs threatening me and then coaxing me that they were my spirit guides. I personally don't 'do' spirit guides, and I'd not pick one that looked like it was from the Mafia anyway ....so I deflected it but pondered the pattern that was emerging. It was quite adamant I take my little bubble down I have around me when I do this sort of meandering. When I laughed at it, it got angry, and said, My boss knows what you're doing! and darted off in a huff.

Good for your boss.

One evening, in my little travels I was popped into this event where this young woman with curly black hair was leading me through this war torn landscape, the industrial landscape I speak about once and while. I'm familiar with it, that's 'their' place. The place they like to take you to completely cut you off from anything real or authentic and bang their drum really hard at you. Their version of re-education camps I'd suppose you'd say. The young woman shifted her appearance from young with curly hair to older with straight hair. She kept promising she was going to do all she could to lead me out of this landscape when it was apparent she was simply leading me in deeper, I was experiencing gunshots, sniper shots, things rushing out of the shadows to snap at me. I got bored with the whole horse and pony show after a while when I realized it was a ploy and I left.

The next day I signed into social media site for psychics, and someone had a left a post for me. I was startled to see from the avatar it was the curly haired woman from my dream. She posted a photo of the older woman she kept changing into in my dream. And she asked me, Can you tell me about this woman?

So I posted back, yes, deceased, was mentally ill in life knowing full well I was about to prod at whatever was behind this sort of ploy..

She came roaring back in me just hurling a the worst sort of verbal attack one could summon, just hysterically out of control. So the owner of the site who is equally familiar with this sort of assholery, clicked on her Avatar and it took us no where. She didn't exist on the sight even though she was clearly expressed as a member, there was no profile page, to look up, just a dead end. Like she never existed. Save for her post.

That evening I was sleeping, facing the wall on my side. I woke up from another doze where something is trying to intrude in, and realized I couldn't move. Sleep paralysis which I had never experienced. Laying there I realized something was in the room with me. I have a sort of vile temper about something holding me against my will, so I surged against it. Whatever it was , wasn't there to deliver roses, and I'm known to shapeshift when I feel like the very bones of my being is threatened. My stasis broke, I came up off the bed about three feet, flipped and landed on my hands and knees and there was what was best described as a malignant Pillsbury dough boy standing next to the bed. Utterly grotesque, devoid of any emotion. Moon faced. And it was there to do ...you...know...not give me a kiss goodnight.


Having someone (thing?) in my room, in my space, in my face normal let alone something like that doesn't sit well with me so I shifted again, and stuck my face in his and roared. Whatever comes up in me in these times has a rather draconic quality to it, so its not a human sound, its a snarling bellow that can be heard for all over the place. I've done it in public on several occasions, this was the first time I've done it in sem-privacy. It has the same result as when a flesh and blood human gets in your face.

The little dough boy got blown backwards, stumbled into my computer desk, knocking all the books off of it, and then blinked out of sight. I came back into my usual state of consciousness, and my sister was standing at the door, and I had to lie to her and tell her I had a bad dream and fell out of bed when she wanted to know if I was taming lions in the room.

she told me a few minutes before she heard all the unearthly bellowing, the cat had been sleeping on her lap. Suddenly the cat woke up, howled, and started spitting, and rushed off like big puff ball. Right after that she heard me making my objections downstairs because its quite loud.

I followed that back trail of energy the little doughboy left, to make sure his head was rolling on the other side of the universe and far away. And I haven't had any problems since then save for the garden variety of low level beings, physical and non, playing in their own crap.

Essentially though these sorts of intrusions start on the psychic level, if one is aware enough to know this or experience. When they have to take the physical body or bring their control drama out into the physical things are getting a bit desperate for them.

[wynderer]

--------------------------------------

[9eagle9]

Everyone is entitled to THEIR view.

If a person is not moving under their own volition and are under the operating programs and compromised by something else, its not their view. Its the view of whatever is compromising them.

I have often wondered about what Amerzo posted. Are they just not able to see what others are seeing. We see a sentence that says. Run, spot, Run.

And they see : Dick and Jane held hands. (or worse).

We see black and they see tie dyed.

We can't know this we are only our own experience.

Consciousness is what is compromised and consciousness has a great deal of influence over perceptions. How we see, how we hear, cognitive dissonance. is the programs running their head re-translating everything ? That's meant to cause chaos, that is the tower of Babble (sic) right there.

Emotionally trip triggered people re-translate everything based on their prejudice, they literally pre-judge everything based on previous experience and re-act out that experience over and over even when the present situation has nothing to do with the experiences that are causing them to go into reaction mode.

But people so compromised that their eyes and ears are having that information re-translated to them in their heads? How do you get through to people like that? They have to get tired of their own condition. Because I'm sure these are not highly functional people.

The world is illusionary, I know I see the world often times as it it really is rather than others are seeing it. Other people don't see tree auras, and hear the things i'm hearing which is why I say we, ALL of us, do not see the world for the way it REAL-ly is..but this overt distortion of the material senses via conscious programming.

That means we can't even provide evidence to people--they can't see it. or they see something other than what we've brought forward as evidence.









The thread on Holographic Kinetics is good place to start--out of many.
This thread: Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics) ?

Yes Paul - that is the same thread - started by D-Day back in January - both Amzer Zo's link and yours go to this thread... what do you think about this material, Paul? I originally read through the interviews with Steve Richards in late June/early July when Amzer Zo first started bringing it up again in this Horus-Ra thread. Honestly, I got little out of it.

Astonishingly, and because I respect Amzer Zo a great deal, I decided to go through those interviews again. I spent two hours covering the first 65% of the first interview last night and strangely, every sentence of Steve Richards came through clearly and I have so far been able to achieve a great deal of comprehension where just two months ago not much was able to sink in.

I attribute this change to a.) some positive progress I have made due to my studies (all coming from Avalonians and much of that from the Horus-Ra thread and b.) that at least one suspected entity I have been dealing with has been removed in mid July and c.) I have been fortunate that I have been able to move to a peaceful land and d.) that I am well into my new diet / cleansing routine (which is not so easy to do but has already resulted in a clearer mind).

Amazing but sadly, only good for me so far... maybe some others can be inspired by my recantings.

To Observer - again another quite powerful post. Being honest, my first feeling when I read your most recent post was a feeling of hopelessness and that perhaps I should withdraw and just wait for the day I die. Then I quickly moved out of that thought and realized abductions have occurred long before the said contract anyways and just a side note to the bigger picture. I then recalled my studies of last night and felt that surge of hope and quickly returned my optimistic resolve.

Everyone is entitled to their view and mine is that I am not nor ever will be empowered by owning a gun to defend my physical body from some other physical body threat. I really don't care what anyone does to my physical body anymore if I am stuck in living in the dynamic of "fear" because the only reason I would do so is because I am afraid something might harm my physical body or kill it AND that I must use a physical weapon to prevent that. I am not spiritually developed enough to handle that. I have to find my solution in another way, through some way that cannot result in violence to another being. I found that when I approach these concerning possibilities restricting myself from weapons, I actually, simultaneously lose the fear. I cannot explain why this is the case, but it just is. I also recall in my younger days when I thought differently and those days I was consumed by my fears.

Please, don't take what I wrote as an argument in any form. In fact, I respect others who have the spiritual maturity regarding weapons and how they might be handled. I also fully admit my abduction experience and my other anomalous experiences are nothing near the horrifying nature of DoTs and wynderers and so how can I possibly know how they should feel, react, attempt to do about what appears to be an ongoing phenomena for them.

Thanks Houman for the interviews - will watch asap as I continue through the Steve Richards material again.

Apologies I got rambly - justoneman

[9eagle9]

No they are not scared of you. You are under THEIR control, why should they be scared of you?

This is why I say instead of accepting the reality of one's condition, when one is ready to accept their condition only then can they have the willingness to change it, one tries to make it into something great. If you accept it, you can't deny it by slathering it in false power. That is obviously not a person who has power if it is compromised by implants. If you are feeling that way that is not empowerment. Nor should anyone ever think that is what empowerment feels like, there's not even any control over one's circumstances let alone an authentic expression of power.

I see esoteric healers do this. I have to suffer for my great healing power. I'm sensitive and sickly , and have sacrificed for my healing ability.

Then they have no healing ability if they can't heal themselves and neither can they be healing others. Who'd go to a healer who was aged, sick, weak and expect something meaningful is going to happen to their health?

You have the POTENTIAL for power, that is not expressed. If it was expressed you wouldn't be feeling this way. That is what they are concerned with--potential-- but as long as you are in this, their, condition you are not empowered.

Cheering one's self up with false sentiments doesn't fix this; removal fixes it.




hi Daughter of Time --

i believe that when we attempt to de-program ourselves, & begin to make some progress, we are repeatedly abducted for strong re-programming purposes -- since, as you noted in another post, they do this at night when we are sleeping -- & most of the time i am so worn out from the pain & very weird exhaustion that when i finally can sleep, i am out like a light [tho normally a light sleeper] -- it's rather a difficult problem

to cheer myself up , i sometimes think, 'Wow! i must be a powerful person , that they've implanted both my Third Eye & my root chakra , & all the other interference going on -- they must be scared of me!'

wyn







The thread on Holographic Kinetics is good place to start--out of many.
This thread: Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics) ?

[...]

Astonishingly, and because I respect Amzer Zo a great deal, I decided to go through those interviews again. I spent two hours covering the first 65% of the first interview last night and strangely, every sentence of Steve Richards came through clearly and I have so far been able to achieve a great deal of comprehension where just two months ago not much was able to sink in.

[...]
- justoneman

This is exactly the kind of phenomena 9eagle9 and I have been typing about... "progams," constructs, "cicuits," automatic shut downs, etc...

Phenomena exhibited by what I call the R6ers "skull-dwelling-zombies" who are under a perpetual hypnotic trance and under hypnotic orders not to observe the obvious. The kind that never look at the skies and see chemtrails, etc... "It's all good!" they say... it's all part of the big one all... MESS!

It also illustrates what happens on this forum (less so here) and others. To the point I keep wondering if people:

a) are reading what's written or is it an overlaid picture in their mind?

b) understand what is written?

c) have any probity at all?

Thank you, Justeone, for your honesty and having the courage to report your findings.

Glad you were able to make it out of the hypnotic trance!

Amzer Zo,

You are so right here! I fully understand what you're getting at. However, one can read something with intense fervor, desire, and absolutely willingness to understand, but if there are powerful programmings in the way, then the understanding will not sink in because it is being over-ridden by the previous programmings. And although I believe it is fully possible and doable to remove programmings as many have managed to do this, when you've been programmed life after life, it becomes extremely difficult. So since the first step must be to de-program oneself, that's what should be focused on first. Again, the question, how does one deprogram oneself? Yes, i know, it has been shared here, repeatedly. I'm not trying to be difficult. I'm just expounding that it is difficult to clear oneself in spite of all the desire in the world to do so. If one doesn't get it, it doesn't mean that they don't want to get it. One ends up feeling stupid for not getting it, even if one is not stupid.

I worked as a teacher for a number of years. I always got my students to reach higher levels of understandings when I showed compassion. Compassion and patience are the keys. I'm not saying that you don't have compassion and patience for you certainly do. Why am I posting this? Because de-programming oneself is very difficult for some no matter how much they want to be fully de-programmed.

¤=[Post Update]=¤


i don't recall Dr Karla Turner saying that -- could you pls direct me to the source?



[...]


The evidence is clear on this issue. You are being abducted as a result of a contract.

[...]

Truman Cash's, karla Turner's, B. Bartholic's, Mangala's, etc, researches squarely disagrree with that statement.

Abductions have been going on for eons.

Hence that statement, to the contrary of being all inclusive, is derived from only ONE particular group of ETs that made it "legal" with ONE Earth's government.

In other words, in spite of claiming and clamoring it (to seemingly make it logical and scientific), that statement is not supported by evidence.

You can google Karla Turner and access her videos. I do remember her saying something along that line when i watched her videos. This was sometime ago so I don't remember exactly how she phrased it.

[9eagle9]

I have one word for that. Well a couple.

If someone wants my ova, ASK For it. That goes double for a man, (edited out of moderations consideration) who doesn't have to have invasive measures taken like a woman does.

If they are too timid to ask, why not some less traumatizing subterfuge, even our own stuck in the false paradigm doctors can extract a few ova without having to resort to abductions, being taken off planet, traumatized by an alien experience.

I won't buy that; its a rationalization for violation.







The thread on Holographic Kinetics is good place to start--out of many.
This thread: Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics) ?

Yes Paul - that is the same thread - started by D-Day back in January - both Amzer Zo's link and yours go to this thread... what do you think about this material, Paul? I originally read through the interviews with Steve Richards in late June/early July when Amzer Zo first started bringing it up again in this Horus-Ra thread. Honestly, I got little out of it.

Astonishingly, and because I respect Amzer Zo a great deal, I decided to go through those interviews again. I spent two hours covering the first 65% of the first interview last night and strangely, every sentence of Steve Richards came through clearly and I have so far been able to achieve a great deal of comprehension where just two months ago not much was able to sink in.

I attribute this change to a.) some positive progress I have made due to my studies (all coming from Avalonians and much of that from the Horus-Ra thread and b.) that at least one suspected entity I have been dealing with has been removed in mid July and c.) I have been fortunate that I have been able to move to a peaceful land and d.) that I am well into my new diet / cleansing routine (which is not so easy to do but has already resulted in a clearer mind).

Amazing but sadly, only good for me so far... maybe some others can be inspired by my recantings.

To Observer - again another quite powerful post. Being honest, my first feeling when I read your most recent post was a feeling of hopelessness and that perhaps I should withdraw and just wait for the day I die. Then I quickly moved out of that thought and realized abductions have occurred long before the said contract anyways and just a side note to the bigger picture. I then recalled my studies of last night and felt that surge of hope and quickly returned my optimistic resolve.

Everyone is entitled to their view and mine is that I am not nor ever will be empowered by owning a gun to defend my physical body from some other physical body threat. I really don't care what anyone does to my physical body anymore if I am stuck in living in the dynamic of "fear" because the only reason I would do so is because I am afraid something with harm my physical body or kill it AND that I must use a physical weapon to prevent that. I am not spiritually developed enough to handle that. I have to find my solution in another way, through some way that cannot result in violence to another being. I found that when I approach these concerning possibilities restricting myself from weapons, I actually, simultaneously lose the fear. I cannot explain why this is the case, but it just is. I also recall in my younger days when I thought differently and those days I was consumed by my fears.

Please, don't take what I wrote as an argument in any form. In fact, I respect others who have the spiritual maturity regarding weapons and how they might be handled. I also fully admit my abduction experience and my other anomalous experiences are nothing near the horrifying nature of DoTs and wynderers and so how can I possibly know how they should feel, react, attempt to do about what appears to be an ongoing phenomena for them.

Thanks Houman for the interviews - will watch asap as I continue through the Steve Richards material again.

Apologies I got rambly - justoneman

I agree with you here Justone,

When i read Observer's post last night, i became so depressed that I had to sign out and sit for hours while contemplating my fate and the point of continuing a life of abductions if those abductions do not stop. While I am not a MILAB abductee, I have been an abductee since infancy (two weeks old!) so I don't know what this means in terms of contracts. I am so confused and although I am no longer angry, I felt deep despair last night, which is far worse than anger. Externally, I do not show any signs of unwellness. People think I am the picture of vibrant health. Internally, I feel like I'm dying. I know I have said this before: no medical conditions have been found for my unwelless but it became very clear back in early May, after an Orionite contact (they said they were from Orion) and I became extremely ill, that the abductions are the cause of my malaise. My apologies for dwelling on this, but I'm desperately seeking answers so Observer's post almost annihilated my hopes.

As far as owning a gun, well, first of all I don't see myself owning a gun since I hate those things. And what would be the point of owning a gun since those pesky intruders usually show up while I sleep? So, that's not an answer for me. As far as taking action with the government goes, well, please! That is not really a feasible action.

9eagle9, I appreciate your contributions and wise insights and I thank you for addressing my questions. And my apologies if I asked you something which you had previously addressed in other threads. I know you are a prolific contributor on many threads, which I am not, so I am certainly not aware of all the wisdom you have imparted. But beside one friend who understands my situation, this is the only place I can voice my concerns for I could never open up to the world out there since they wouldn't believe me and I would risk losing even more if I were to open up. I did try to open up to a friend who has published a number of books on spirituality and the after life. He does believe in abductions. He said he has repeatedly astral travelled and watched abductions and ET procedures. But he believes that they just want our ova and sperm for reproduction purposes and they are studying us, without harming us, because they are contemplating living on planet earth with us, peacefully, and sharing their knowledge! So much for that! I feel that being in a community of kindred spirits (even if there are disagreements as this is not a bad thing because it teaches us other perspectives) is the most helpful place to find answers, epiphanies, inspiration, information, to guide those who are desperately seeking it.

I have asked this question repeatedly on this thread. How does one stop abductions and regain the life force that has been lost in the process? If that is even possible! I am thankful for all the answers and all the willingness to help shown by the contributors here so please don't see me as ungrateful, but the advice on this matter is not really practical. Please don't misunderstand me here, these advices may be practical to you, the writer, but not to me, the reader. There must be more! I know it is my responsibility to find the answers. Today I don't feel despair anymore. I feel so much better than last night.

I wish there were a guide somewhere that one could follow which has been proven to work. There must be abductees out there somewhere who have found of way to stop the abductions and regained their autonomy. Truman Cash has, it seems. He's a great inspiration to me. Well, I guess I'll just have to find my own, personal way. And a way must exist! For every problem, there is a solution. So a solution can be found. Perhaps the solutions are as individual as the abduction cases. But I have to trust that a solution will be found. Living a righteous life hasn't helped me at all. There must be other ways.

Pardon me for my ramblings.

[modwiz]

I have one word for that. Well a couple.

If someone wants my ova, ASK For it. That goes double for a man, (edited out of moderations consideration) who doesn't have to have invasive measures taken like a woman does.

If they are too timid to ask, why not some less traumatizing subterfuge, even our own stuck in the false paradigm doctors can extract a few ova without having to resort to abductions, being taken off planet, traumatized by an alien experience.

I won't buy that; its a rationalization for violation.



Hey, I just want to make an omelet. Got three eggs? If ya got six I could make a fritatta. You did say double for a man, right?:P

Maybe the aliens are just looking for meal and hospitality. :thumb:

BTW. This post is a demonstration of how to edit out all of the lengthy prior posts. The last few posts have been getting large.

I see Wynderer gave it a go. Certainly helped.

[wynderer]

----------------------------------

[Hervé]

This thread: Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics) ?

Amzer -- do you happen to know of a transcript of this two part Off Planet Radio interview of Steve Richards ?

Sorry for the lag in answering... got distracted after posting my comment to Justeone.

Here it is:

Download MP3s:
Part 1 (http://www.divshare.com/direct/18152999-ed7.mp3) (right click and ‘Save As’ to download)
Part 2 (http://www.divshare.com/direct/18153032-794.mp3) (right click and ‘Save As’ to download)

Full Transcript -Dreamtime Healing-Hour 1-PDF (http://www.divshare.com/direct/18378351-441.pdf) (right click + "Save as")
Full Transcript -Dreamtime Healing-Hour 2-PDF (http://www.divshare.com/direct/18378353-77a.pdf) (right click + "Save as")

That's for the first interview, I do not know if there are transcripts for the second interview.

[9eagle9]

Psychic abilities don't have anything to do with empowerment. Because you are gifted doesn't mean that you have the authority to manage your life.There's many empowered people who are not particularly gifted psychically. Psychic pertains to the psyche, were we get compromised at. Many psychic people wake up to the fact that even their abilities were a form of programming.

When someone/ something psychically attacks the first thing I know is ...they cannot manage themselves or their ability. The moment that inability to manage their emotions is launched I get the upper hand.

The first time someone launches a verbal attack on me...I get the upper hand. They are not managing themselves so I'm left wide open to manage the situation as long as I don't re-act.

This is not mysticism, or esoteric it just the way it is.

A parasitical energy will whisper all sorts of truths and even predictions that come to pass to lend IT credibility and so one is reluctant to give up that false empowerment. You know how many psychics and channelers I know whose spirit guides are not spirits at all? They are parasitical energies, GFL, fake gods and fake angels. It's not even THEIR ability anymore.

An ability is an integrated part of ourselves, if we are compromised, its compromised too. Of course they want someone's abilities...they don't have any true expression on their own. We need to wake up to the fact we are being held hostage by psychically arrested entities that are more dis-empowered than we are. We'd see that if we ourselves were not so compromised.

Ask Duncan. Why? To CONTROL those abilities. Do you think Duncan was chosen because he was a big tough guy that could kick ass. There's lots of big tough guys that can kick ass. Duncan was compromised because of his abilities. It was based on his abilities that they began controlling him.

Now Duncan had to learn what it is to know what is inherently his without compromise. Naturally expressed ability.

What good is an ability if one is getting compromised simply because they have their birthright? What good is an ability if its just going to be taken and controlled by someone else? Even our own filters distort our abilities.

More often than not, highly gifted people are managed by their abilities.At the very least by their own filters. YOU have to manage them, so someone else isn't.

We have one gift that we are certain of. That is our life, given to us, for us to manage . If we don't something else will.

The ptb showed us that.

We KNOW this.


hi 9Eagle9,

i don't think/feel they have complete control of me

re the being scared of me -- there seems be some truth to the theory that both abductees & milabs are chosen for our intelligence & psychic gifts -- Duncan O'Finiaon is reporting from the seminars he & his lady are le[/PDF]ading around the country that all attendees [mostly milabs] are very gifted --

& the MUFON investigator w/whom i had coffee & talked for a couple of hours told me that at a MUFON conference, when a group of abductees were together, he could feel a very strong psychic energy, tho he said that normally he didn't pick up on things like that

re being empowered & my unlimited potential -- i know -- Know -- that, when home, i am a being of much greater connection to the Creator, & therefore more of that Power

i kind of agree w/the Buddha re life here on Earth, when he said, 'Human life is conditioned & unfree'

& Jesus told us that satan rules this world

perhaps achieving full power is part of your mission here on Earth -- it is not mine, tho i do what i can to stay headed in that direction -- i can be patient, knowing this lifetime is just one

it seems that makes me a wimp in your eyes

wyn


No they are not scared of you. You are under THEIR control, why should they be scared of you?

This is why I say instead of accepting the reality of one's condition, when one is ready to accept their condition only then can they have the willingness to change it, one tries to make it into something great. If you accept it, you can't deny it by slathering it in false power. That is obviously not a person who has power if it is compromised by implants. If you are feeling that way that is not empowerment. Nor should anyone ever think that is what empowerment feels like, there's not even any control over one's circumstances let alone an authentic expression of power.

I see esoteric healers do this. I have to suffer for my great healing power. I'm sensitive and sickly , and have sacrificed for my healing ability.

Then they have no healing ability if they can't heal themselves and neither can they be healing others. Who'd go to a healer who was aged, sick, weak and expect something meaningful is going to happen to their health?

You have the POTENTIAL for power, that is not expressed. If it was expressed you wouldn't be feeling this way. That is what they are concerned with--potential-- but as long as you are in this, their, condition you are not empowered.

Cheering one's self up with false sentiments doesn't fix this; removal fixes it.




hi Daughter of Time --

i believe that when we attempt to de-program ourselves, & begin to make some progress, we are repeatedly abducted for strong re-programming purposes -- since, as you noted in another post, they do this at night when we are sleeping -- & most of the time i am so worn out from the pain & very weird exhaustion that when i finally can sleep, i am out like a light [tho normally a light sleeper] -- it's rather a difficult problem

to cheer myself up , i sometimes think, 'Wow! i must be a powerful person , that they've implanted both my Third Eye & my root chakra , & all the other interference going on -- they must be scared of me!'

wyn

[Chester]

hi Justone -- thanks for your courteous & thoughtful reply

also thanks for bit of info re the oldest child being targeted -- i did not know that -- i'm the oldest of 4, & my son [who left his body in '87] , also an abductee, was the oldest

i thought i'd remembered, when you first started posting here on Houman's thread, that you were also an abductee -- & i was puzzled that your posts seemed to be ignoring this part of your 'special attention' -- thanks for explaining that this focus on the astral entities is a part of your plan of action

from your post:
'I guess the point I have been trying to make in this regard is that I do not believe I can achieve a state of freedom from any archontically aligned being (physical or not) unless I am able to transform my entire being.'

my response on reading this was sadness, almost to tears, thinking , 'Here's this good & caring man taking full responsibility for unlawful & illegal intrusions/invasions into his life, & that of his family' [then i got indignant on your behalf]

also from your post:
'Regardless, I see both the physical world "archontically aligned" beings (and thus the physical abductions) to be a component of the overall "archontic matrix" which is shared by the "archontically aligned" astral beings.'

well said -- i agree -- that's the heart of the whole mess here on Earth, imo

also from your post, referring to your healing:
'I believe this can be done and done prior to leaving my physical body in this lifetime.'

i hope you are right -- i'm certainly not going to stop trying -- & something else you wrote in your post was a bit of synchronistic encouragement for me re one of the ways in my personal plan of action -- not trying to sound mysterious, but i sense it's best for me right now not to write about it

keep on flying!

wyn



Maybe I will be proven wrong, but I will never accept that I cannot (nor everyone else cannot) resolve their ongoing abduction experience through their own eternal Spirit. If one wants to consider discussions along those lines as, "Pages of psychologically influenced rhetoric regarding empowering and disempowering is nonsense," then they certainly can so do and I won't get in their way other than to suggest they may be wrong as I am so doing now.

I have already experienced a freeing of much of the entities that have been feeding off my ignorance since I was a child. I am determined to retain my vigilance against any new invasions but am doing so holistically via my entire being. In fact, it is clear already through the Steve Richards material that the process of holographic kinetics is holistic and based on knowledge known to the Australian Aborigines for at least 60,000 years.

Just what i was able to digest last night in about two hours has greatly expanded my view of how I am able to heal and protect myself from further intrusions. It cannot hurt anyone to consider this material - thanks already Amzer Zo. justoneman


as i see it, there is a difference between abductions by the ETs who contracted w/our gov't [& the abductions by our own gov't] , & astral intrusions -- the former use technology -- the last does not

if you are indeed an abductee -- one handed over by our gov't to the ETs -- & you can find a way to stop your abductions -- if they don't kill you first, you'll be a rich man if you can market your technique

Not sure you are aware, but I have experienced a physical world event which was an abduction in that I was forced to grasp an object in my left hand against my will and this was done by beings clearly not of this earth. I have two suspicious areas which appear to be implants. My oldest son has the exact same thing in the exact same location. Neither of us had this object at birth. Mine appeared when I was about 8 years old and my son's appeared when he was about 6 years old. This oldest son of mine has had major symptoms known to be manifested by abductees. It is known that families are targeted and especially the oldest child.

In addition to my physical experiences, have had experiences with astral entities and have focused most of my attention on these entities in my posts of the last few months.

Regardless, I see both the physical world "archontically aligned" beings (and thus the physical abductions) to be a component of the overall "archontic matrix" which is shared by the "archontically aligned" astral beings. I also see how we, as creator beings, create our own "monsters" which from refamiliarizing myself with the Steve Richards views can become actual entities themselves.

I guess the point I have been trying to make in this regard is that I do not believe I can achieve a state of freedom from any archontically aligned being (physical or not) unless I am able to transform my entire being.

I believe this can be done and done prior to leaving my physical body in this lifetime. But, perhaps the physical world itself IS the archontic realm. If that is the case, I will likely be dealing with the dilemma of whether or not I would voluntarily return. I would probably do so minimally to assist loved ones as well as any being that is caught within the matrix and wants to be free of the matrix. But I may change my mind once I am out... I don't know.

At this point in time, it is my opinion that solution for both types of experiences can be reached via the methods recommended by posters on this forum, including, but not restricted to transformation of my being via shamanic treatment (both by a shaman's direct assistance as well as learning how the shamanic process works such that I can become my own shamanic healer).

So far based on my brief application along these lines, things are working well. I have had many flying dreams of late which has always been a sign I am in a good place.

justone

Hi wynderer, thank you for this post. Both for the feelings I got from it but even more the content and delivery as I sense you have risen above the emotions we created together (I did my part in some previous posts and I apologize for that). I feel we can now be helpful for each other and hear each other and do not need to agree, but can get the most out of our new dynamic... I was able to read your recent posts from from a yearning to learn more point of view and I gained further insights - especially from this post I quoted. I feel I know you better now and that also has increased my empathy.

What I have to offer back at this moment is that by once again picking up the Steve Richards interview (the transcript) and reading it slowly and contemplatively, I am gaining the newest insights I ever imagined. It all rings amazingly true. This guy clearly knows his stuff.

I will say that from what I have read so far, I see much similarity with Dr. Malanga's approach. Steve asks each component within a "Spirit being" (as I like to call us)... he asks permission to speak to each of these components. The Spirit, the soul, the ego self, etc. He seems to have the knowledge and experience to pick out which component is speaking. He seems able to isolate the uninvited guests as well. I, of course, am speaking of the non physical invasive entities.

What stuck me is that perhaps if an abductee such as you, that has suffered repeated abductions that appear to be primarily from the Gray/US military abduction program, which surely must be traumatic at every level of your being and which (at least as far as the Grays are involved) may have occurred in prior lifetimes... if an abductee that has had that level of repeated attention, perhaps you may also be so traumatized that you are riddled with non phsyical attachments as well.

Why I bring this up is not at all to scare you... in fact, it is meant to suggest you take a real close look at this Steve Richards material. If it clicks with you then maybe you could take the next step and hook up with either the shamanic capacity you have within yourself (I like to believe we all have this capacity) or, what may be more practical, hook up with a practicing shaman (a real one... not some pretend shaman) and experience this holographic kinetics process and clean up any attachments you may have.

It is possible that if you did this and succeeded (and I am not implying I think you have these types of attachments as I am no shaman and quite new at all this) I believe you may find a new strength within you where you might now have the ability to stop your physical abductions.

It is just an idea but it comes from the heart and my intuition was my guide in inspiring me to write this post to you.

On a personal note, when I first started posting my experience, you were one of the first to engage me and you did so from a "wanting to help" point of view and I never forgot that. We also shared some PMs and I never forgot those either. I am certain I was very, very infected at that time with these astral pests and yet you still exchanged several posts with me.

very best wishes and let's stay friends! justone

[9eagle9]

Duncan has made the same suggestion as I have. Holographic Kinetics. I don't think repeating it on his blog is particularly necessary when he's already doing it.

It's not the only solution but its a solution.

[Chester]

wow wynderer... I went back to my thread about what happened to me when I was 6 years old and you posted (Post #7)

I started that thread on the same day I found this thread (April 26th, 2012). I call that day my "Freedom Day" as I have never looked back! justoneman

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?44353-My-possible-abduction-experience

[wynderer]

--------------------------------------

[Chester]

The thread on Holographic Kinetics is good place to start--out of many.
This thread: Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics) ?

Yes Paul - that is the same thread - started by D-Day back in January - both Amzer Zo's link and yours go to this thread... what do you think about this material, Paul? I originally read through the interviews with Steve Richards in late June/early July when Amzer Zo first started bringing it up again in this Horus-Ra thread. Honestly, I got little out of it.

Astonishingly, and because I respect Amzer Zo a great deal, I decided to go through those interviews again. I spent two hours covering the first 65% of the first interview last night and strangely, every sentence of Steve Richards came through clearly and I have so far been able to achieve a great deal of comprehension where just two months ago not much was able to sink in.

I attribute this change to a.) some positive progress I have made due to my studies (all coming from Avalonians and much of that from the Horus-Ra thread and b.) that at least one suspected entity I have been dealing with has been removed in mid July and c.) I have been fortunate that I have been able to move to a peaceful land and d.) that I am well into my new diet / cleansing routine (which is not so easy to do but has already resulted in a clearer mind).

Amazing but sadly, only good for me so far... maybe some others can be inspired by my recantings.

To Observer - again another quite powerful post. Being honest, my first feeling when I read your most recent post was a feeling of hopelessness and that perhaps I should withdraw and just wait for the day I die. Then I quickly moved out of that thought and realized abductions have occurred long before the said contract anyways and just a side note to the bigger picture. I then recalled my studies of last night and felt that surge of hope and quickly returned my optimistic resolve.

Everyone is entitled to their view and mine is that I am not nor ever will be empowered by owning a gun to defend my physical body from some other physical body threat. I really don't care what anyone does to my physical body anymore if I am stuck in living in the dynamic of "fear" because the only reason I would do so is because I am afraid something with harm my physical body or kill it AND that I must use a physical weapon to prevent that. I am not spiritually developed enough to handle that. I have to find my solution in another way, through some way that cannot result in violence to another being. I found that when I approach these concerning possibilities restricting myself from weapons, I actually, simultaneously lose the fear. I cannot explain why this is the case, but it just is. I also recall in my younger days when I thought differently and those days I was consumed by my fears.

Please, don't take what I wrote as an argument in any form. In fact, I respect others who have the spiritual maturity regarding weapons and how they might be handled. I also fully admit my abduction experience and my other anomalous experiences are nothing near the horrifying nature of DoTs and wynderers and so how can I possibly know how they should feel, react, attempt to do about what appears to be an ongoing phenomena for them.

Thanks Houman for the interviews - will watch asap as I continue through the Steve Richards material again.

Apologies I got rambly - justoneman

I agree with you here Justone,

When i read Observer's post last night, i became so depressed that I had to sign out and sit for hours while contemplating my fate and the point of continuing a life of abductions if those abductions do not stop. While I am not a MILAB abductee, I have been an abductee since infancy (two weeks old!) so I don't know what this means in terms of contracts. I am so confused and although I am no longer angry, I felt deep despair last night, which is far worse than anger. Externally, I do not show any signs of unwellness. People think I am the picture of vibrant health. Internally, I feel like I'm dying. I know I have said this before: no medical conditions have been found for my unwelless but it became very clear back in early May, after an Orionite contact (they said they were from Orion) and I became extremely ill, that the abductions are the cause of my malaise. My apologies for dwelling on this, but I'm desperately seeking answers so Observer's post almost annihilated my hopes.

As far as owning a gun, well, first of all I don't see myself owning a gun since I hate those things. And what would be the point of owning a gun since those pesky intruders usually show up while I sleep? So, that's not an answer for me. As far as taking action with the government goes, well, please! That is not really a feasible action.

9eagle9, I appreciate your contributions and wise insights and I thank you for addressing my questions. And my apologies if I asked you something which you had previously addressed in other threads. I know you are a prolific contributor on many threads, which I am not, so I am certainly not aware of all the wisdom you have imparted. But beside one friend who understands my situation, this is the only place I can voice my concerns for I could never open up to the world out there since they wouldn't believe me and I would risk losing even more if I were to open up. I did try to open up to a friend who has published a number of books on spirituality and the after life. He does believe in abductions. He said he has repeatedly astral travelled and watched abductions and ET procedures. But he believes that they just want our ova and sperm for reproduction purposes and they are studying us, without harming us, because they are contemplating living on planet earth with us, peacefully, and sharing their knowledge! So much for that! I feel that being in a community of kindred spirits (even if there are disagreements as this is not a bad thing because it teaches us other perspectives) is the most helpful place to find answers, epiphanies, inspiration, information, to guide those who are desperately seeking it.

I have asked this question repeatedly on this thread. How does one stop abductions and regain the life force that has been lost in the process? If that is even possible! I am thankful for all the answers and all the willingness to help shown by the contributors here so please don't see me as ungrateful, but the advice on this matter is not really practical. Please don't misunderstand me here, these advices may be practical to you, the writer, but not to me, the reader. There must be more! I know it is my responsibility to find the answers. Today I don't feel despair anymore. I feel so much better than last night.

I wish there were a guide somewhere that one could follow which has been proven to work. There must be abductees out there somewhere who have found of way to stop the abductions and regained their autonomy. Truman Cash has, it seems. He's a great inspiration to me. Well, I guess I'll just have to find my own, personal way. And a way must exist! For every problem, there is a solution. So a solution can be found. Perhaps the solutions are as individual as the abduction cases. But I have to trust that a solution will be found. Living a righteous life hasn't helped me at all. There must be other ways.

Pardon me for my ramblings.

Hi DoT, I read your post this afternoon and left off my thanks until I was able to return a heartfelt reply.

We are all different, we all go through stages of emotions. I went through the most prolonged period of despair I could ever have imagined. It began late last January and did not officially end until I found this thread on April 26th. But you have followed my progress and it is real. We can move through despair and pop out the other side and never revisit it again.

When I read your post I was at work... a new "job." One that I probably should not be caught reading a forum much less posting on one.

But I dropped everything and started to write. What I wrote summarized a significant part of what I did. I am afraid to post it because I don't want to upset anyone as sometimes people take things from me that I am implying what I state is universally true. I do my best simply to share experience and offer opinion, careful to make those opinions framed as nothing more than that.

If you want, I will PM you what I wrote... and if you feel it is ok to post, then I will post it too.

take care, justoneman

[Chester]

The thread on Holographic Kinetics is good place to start--out of many.
This thread: Dreamtime Healing - Using Holographic Kinetics (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?38458-Dreamtime-Healing-Using-Holographic-Kinetics) ?

[...]

Astonishingly, and because I respect Amzer Zo a great deal, I decided to go through those interviews again. I spent two hours covering the first 65% of the first interview last night and strangely, every sentence of Steve Richards came through clearly and I have so far been able to achieve a great deal of comprehension where just two months ago not much was able to sink in.

[...]
- justoneman

This is exactly the kind of phenomena 9eagle9 and I have been typing about... "progams," constructs, "cicuits," automatic shut downs, etc...

Phenomena exhibited by what I call the R6ers "skull-dwelling-zombies" who are under a perpetual hypnotic trance and under hypnotic orders not to observe the obvious. The kind that never look at the skies and see chemtrails, etc... "It's all good!" they say... it's all part of the big one all... MESS!

It also illustrates what happens on this forum (less so here) and others. To the point I keep wondering if people:

a) are reading what's written or is it an overlaid picture in their mind?

b) understand what is written?

c) have any probity at all?

Thank you, Justeone, for your honesty and having the courage to report your findings.

Glad you were able to make it out of the hypnotic trance!

I am mostly out (I think) but you have seen me slip back at times... please, never be shy about being direct if you suspect I am slipping back. I can't wait to post about what I am getting out of this Steve Richards interview. I already want to spew it out but am being disciplined in that I will complete this round of "go through" and digest it for a few days... fascinating though how I understand this at that electrical level, and "see" how it comes through into thought, then thought forms and then can become entities unto themselves (engrams using another language?).

I can now see so much better the soul's relationship to our Spirit as well as our other components (the soul being what these non physical pests appear interested in). That by gaining control of the soul, they are able to gain control of the Spirit and then they have you and for many lifetimes.

I can see the Grays may be (as some report) "bio-robots" but that they are minions for spirit beings who are unabashed soul "eaters" such as some Reptilians, some Pleiadians (or beings who have at least told Truman Cash that they are Pleiadians), some Orionites and some Alpha Draconians and the list goes on... but my point in naming these physical beings is that some within these groups appear to have made a conscious decision to "be" "eaters" of this energy and thus are participating in what we can call "soul farming."

I have referred to all of this as the "archontic structure."

It appears to me that the non physical beings within this structure may very well be behind it all.

That is why I have been approaching my "problem" from both directions, not just seeing this as a problem I have to deal with coming from the perspective I am Chester, this physical human being living this single, current lifetime.

I am seeing this from the Spirit perspective and that my Spirit is actually the key component of my being that has been imprisoned, that it has occurred through my allowance of the capture of my "soul" which is this residual memory I carry through from lifetime to lifetime. The "death of my physical body" component is one of the ways I become separated from my "memory" but the soul keeps it all... "knows" it all. The parasitic entities and/or their minions are able to strengthen their grip over ones soul and that is the descent into the abyss which concerns me in that what would ever be able to pull one out of such a place? I doubt we can ever be destroyed but I can see the possibility that a Spirit being sinks so deeply into this abyss that the odds they may ever get out of such a place get worse and worse if the Spirit being continues to allow their sinking.

Some of the pictures Houman has posted leads me to believe some are deeply into this abyss.

I will never stop seeking a solution yet I may have to accept the possibility that solution only can be found on the individual level and from within each individual.

justone

[Daughter of Time]

Hi Justone,

Unless what you have to say is extremely personal, then go ahead and post it. Don't be too afraid of being misunderstood because there will always be those who will get it. And you never know when your revelations will be meaningful to someone.

[Chester]

hi Daughter of Time --

i believe that when we attempt to de-program ourselves, & begin to make some progress, we are repeatedly abducted for strong re-programming purposes -- since, as you noted in another post, they do this at night when we are sleeping -- & most of the time i am so worn out from the pain & very weird exhaustion that when i finally can sleep, i am out like a light [tho normally a light sleeper] -- it's rather a difficult problem

to cheer myself up , i sometimes think, 'Wow! i must be a powerful person , that they've implanted both my Third Eye & my root chakra , & all the other interference going on -- they must be scared of me!'

wyn





Amzer Zo,

You are so right here! I fully understand what you're getting at. However, one can read something with intense fervor, desire, and absolutely willingness to understand, but if there are powerful programmings in the way, then the understanding will not sink in because it is being over-ridden by the previous programmings. And although I believe it is fully possible and doable to remove programmings as many have managed to do this, when you've been programmed life after life, it becomes extremely difficult. So since the first step must be to de-program oneself, that's what should be focused on first. Again, the question, how does one deprogram oneself? Yes, i know, it has been shared here, repeatedly. I'm not trying to be difficult. I'm just expounding that it is difficult to clear oneself in spite of all the desire in the world to do so. If one doesn't get it, it doesn't mean that they don't want to get it. One ends up feeling stupid for not getting it, even if one is not stupid.

I worked as a teacher for a number of years. I always got my students to reach higher levels of understandings when I showed compassion. Compassion and patience are the keys. I'm not saying that you don't have compassion and patience for you certainly do. Why am I posting this? Because de-programming oneself is very difficult for some no matter how much they want to be fully de-programmed.


i don't recall Dr Karla Turner saying that -- could you pls direct me to the source?



[...]


The evidence is clear on this issue. You are being abducted as a result of a contract.

[...]

Truman Cash's, karla Turner's, B. Bartholic's, Mangala's, etc, researches squarely disagrree with that statement.

Abductions have been going on for eons.

Hence that statement, to the contrary of being all inclusive, is derived from only ONE particular group of ETs that made it "legal" with ONE Earth's government.

In other words, in spite of claiming and clamoring it (to seemingly make it logical and scientific), that statement is not supported by evidence.

You can google Karla Turner and access her videos. I do remember her saying something along that line when i watched her videos. This was sometime ago so I don't remember exactly how she phrased it.

I have not had this experience. The more I de-program, the more I experience freedom and the more I experience strength.

I even had a "vivid dream" (which perhaps was not a dream) where I was inside a Gray implant vehicle and the Grays even showed me the implant they were putting in me (was a glassy looking slightly crescent shaped, jet black object about 1.5 inches long) and I recalled not being angry. This was sometime last May and I posted about it.

Is it possible I just don't "fight it" and that is why I am not seeing these possible abductions as "negative?" That is very possible.

You know? I know this... perhaps it is because I became so depressed after the two suicide attempts (the biggest part of my depression was because I didn't even have it in me to kill myself) and that I went through the above mentioned 3 full months of constant despair that, that is what made the difference for me. I am so convinced that nothing could ever happen to me any more that could be anywhere near as horrific as that three months of constant wishing I would die and all that inner crying over leaving my loved ones if I did but living as I was was even worse for them.

That was it. That is why I am like I am now... all and only about solutions. All and only that there has to be a solution to all this and for everyone.

justthetruth from justoneman

[9eagle9]

One does not deprogram themselves without help. One can initiate managing themselves but as the HK demonstrates if you can't see your own programming how are you going to remove it on your own? You can't remove what you can't admit to, let alone can't see.

If I had cancer and didn't know it how would I cure it, remove it. How would I even do something like that if I couldn't admit I had it in the first place.

One reaches a certain point of clarity when they can detect their own programs but people need facilitation to get the process going.

Primarily one needs to be willing to look at themselves.

[Daughter of Time]

[QUOTE=wynderer;540145]hi 9Eagle9,

i don't think/feel they have complete control of me

re the being scared of me -- there seems be some truth to the theory that both abductees & milabs are chosen for our intelligence & psychic gifts -- Duncan O'Finiaon is reporting from the seminars he & his lady are leading around the country that all attendees [mostly milabs] are very gifted --

& the MUFON investigator w/whom i had coffee & talked for a couple of hours told me that at a MUFON conference, when a group of abductees were together, he could feel a very strong psychic energy, tho he said that normally he didn't pick up on things like that

re being empowered & my unlimited potential -- i know -- Know -- that, when home, i am a being of much greater connection to the Creator, & therefore more of that Power

i kind of agree w/the Buddha re life here on Earth, when he said, 'Human life is conditioned & unfree'

& Jesus told us that satan rules this world

perhaps achieving full power is part of your mission here on Earth -- it is not mine, tho i do what i can to stay headed in that direction -- i can be patient, knowing this lifetime is just one

it seems that makes me a wimp in your eyes

wyn

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well Wyn,

While it may be somewhat true that abductees are chosen because of their intelligence or psychic gifts or whatever other abilities, this does not make for an even remotely comforting thought. We should be able and allowed to use our intelligence, gifts and abilities for our own advancement and for the advancement of humanity, and not for the advancement of parasites and the debasement of our species.

[Chester]

Hi Justone,

Unless what you have to say is extremely personal, then go ahead and post it. Don't be too afraid of being misunderstood because there will always be those who will get it. And you never know when your revelations will be meaningful to someone.

Hi Dot - this was actually inspired by the post just after the one I quoted of yours above... you did two back to back... ok Here Goes...

DoT –

I can explain to you the process I have gone through to do “some” unprogramming.

I performed the following exercise... just pretending, just exploring “point of view.”

I went to the beginning and thought if I be God, the Creator, prior to creation then what?

I spent years contemplating this and I came up with two things. I would be lonely (being the all that is and thus the only one) and I would be bored (knowing all thus what else could there be to experience?)

From those two directions I would cast myself into the midst of a creation so incredibly vast that I could never get bored and with so many forms of “me” I would not only never be lonely, I might not even realize there’s this “big me” behind it all.

It was then that I realized I was just one of those “me s” and that all “life” that has form within the “big me” is other forms of the “casted in” “big me.”

Then I examined the boredom aspect and realized what it would be like to be one of the forms of the “casted in me” that perhaps had lost sight of the fact all forms within the “big me” are to be no less respected than “I” (a specific instance of a “casted in me’). I realized these types of “casted in me s” are perhaps what has taken charge of the local experience I find myself in now – this “matrix.”

Now I cannot say what I just described is true, but I tried the concept out for myself as if it were true and found that it may have some validity (but again, only for me).

Having reached that point, I had to accept that I am a single, unique example of the “big me” and thus, using metaphor, a “child of big me.”

Once I accepted that, I realized my power to create.

After exploring a little too much from the “bored” point of view, where I saw I had become a little bit too selfish which I discovered because I found myself isolating myself from other “cast in me s” (and thus started to become lonely), I accepted that I am happiest when I balance my selfishness with consideration to other “casted in me s.”

And that is life for me, a constant attempt at balancing my desire to not be lonely with my dislike for being bored.

By going through the above simple exercise, I realized that everything else I thought, was simply ideas contrived beyond the simple dynamic I just described above, and thus all my own creations. It was then I realized that I had complete and full responsibility for every single thing that occurred in my life. I had somehow created it. Maybe not in this lifetime, maybe not in any lifetime on this planet, maybe not even in my physical form, but somewhere back up the line I created my current perceived dilemmas.

Coming to that realization was very, very relieving. It meant I am not a victim of anyone or anything other than myself. It empowered me that I could find my way out of my self created delusions. It made me realize all I had to do is unravel, one at a time, all the lies I told myself along my many previous experiences. If I could undo all those, and still be alive in this body within this lifetime, I would be able to experience the material world while simultaneously being free.

It does not mean bad things may not ever happen to me again. But I will no longer delude myself that the bad things that do are only coming from an outside agency not connected with myself. I am connected somehow or another to those happenings. I am somehow even if extremely remotely responsible – very empowering to have this point of view!

I also no longer fear death as what is death? I don’t even know anymore. I already did out of body stuff so I know from direct experience there is no end.

Can you see all the unprogramming I have done just by exploring a point of view?

I simplified how I got to this place I am at in the now moment. I simplified how I got born into this body and into this life and into this confused place. And I tried that view as nothing more than an opinion. But the opinion grew into a likely reality (again, just for me).

I started out as a "casted in me" - a child of "creation" - and thus only a one-off from my parent(s).

I then looked at the "me," Chester, that was born 55 years ago into this body on this planet and accepted that THIS version of "me" was in a state of complete and utter confusion.

And then I realized my "core" which I like to call, my "spirit" is the same exact spirit at the base of that original "me" as it is in the "me" of today.

So I looked at how I could be in this state from both directions and was able to connect those dots.

That was the huge part because by being able to connect those dots brings me to my truth, I am and always will be simply a one-off from my "Parent(s)", that I am the next in line after them, that I have all and everything they had (have) including the ability to create everything in my experience, which includes the ability to create a world where I can be "casted-in" and experience total, utter, all but hopeless confusion.

What a challenge!

Anyway, that’s how I did it.

I suggest you consider exploring deeply your various points of view. You may find you can discard the ones that are BS if you examine them one by one. Slowly but surely you reach a point where the genuine you begins to coalesce and THAT is the place I reached the last month or so and I did it by pouring everything out on this forum. With little to no fear of what others might think. By not only being honest with myself, but testing my truths by sharing them with others, I have been able to peel away layer after layer of this huge and horrid onion I created.

See, I realized this. I told myself a lie somewhere long ago (or I bought into someone else’s lie… but the “who” that told it really doesn’t matter because the “who” is always ultimately “a casted in me” which is a child of “big me” which makes it either me that told that first lie or a sister/brother.

Now after I told myself the first lie, I told myself another, then another and another. At some point I got so lost in all my lies, I had no idea what was true or not anymore. I guess we call that a state of utter confusion.

And then I realized the outer is nothing more than a reflection of my inner. And thus if the outer world does not make sense, then I must have screwed up my inner world.

And so I realized I could incarnate (become a new version of the “casted in me”) and that I could incarnate completely confused.

And that was why I did the exercise I described above. So that I could see and understand “why poor me” and why I could be capable of creating an illusion.

I believe, once all this settles in, one can simply decide to keep creating illusions (some might want to say “making” illusions) or I could be the real me and see how that goes for awhile. This is what I have been doing for a good stretch now. And I found that this new “mostly real” me creates real stuff. And people in my life are affected by my creations completely differently than ever before and I understand why. What I created before was not real… like 9eagle9 points out… artificial. I made, I did not create. Thus everything I made was artificial and found a way to making its own end. When we create, when it is real, it continues because it comes from the principles of truth and that gives it real life, not a mortal thing.

Anyways – that is in large part what I have done – I could not resolve my issues by approaching the problem because the problem was so intricate, complex, thus all but impossible to undo from that direction alone, I had to approach “me” from the point of my own creation and even from the point of uncreation.

Coming at me from both directions has (at least it seems so in the now) been one of the most significant exercises I have performed in seeking to obtain my solution.

I believe I will never revisit that hell again in this lifetime. Even if the sun blows a huge flare and the world grid goes down and all humanity panics. I have my own solutions and have no fears in implementing them, even if that means jumping into the sea never to return to shore in this lifetime.

justoneman

[observer]

[...]


The evidence is clear on this issue. You are being abducted as a result of a contract.

[...]

Truman Cash's, karla Turner's, B. Bartholic's, Mangala's, etc, researches squarely disagrree with that statement.

Abductions have been going on for eons. [emphasis added by observer]

Hence that statement, to the contrary of being all inclusive, is derived from only ONE particular group of ETs that made it "legal" with ONE Earth's government.

In other words, in spite of claiming and clamoring it (to seemingly make it logical and scientific), that statement is not supported by evidence.

It is not my intention of disagreeing with you, Amzer.

From the evidence I've researched it is apparent the abductions have been continuing since the Dawn of Man. All one need do is research the Nag Hammadi Library (http://www.gnosis.org/naghamm/hypostas.html)and one will agree with your highlighted statement.

It is also apparent from the research into the Archon phenomenon (http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/vida_alien/alien_archons.htm), and from the descriptions of antiquity, that those referred to as "Archons" in antiquity were nothing more than those little Grey Aliens that we are all familiar with, today.

Yes, I also agree there are many species of aliens visiting this planet. Some of these MAY be abducting human beings.

From my years of research into the issue, I must conclude the obtrusive abductions are being conducted by the group of aliens (Greys included) that are in league with the Reptilian Overlords to this planet. It is these allied Greys that have most recently written and signed contracts with some of the governments of the world. It is The Reptilian Overlords whom John Lear does not speak of, but makes reference to, here:


From the written text of the John Lear Disclosure, found here: http://www.coasttocoastam.com/show/2003/11/02

And we found out so far there are 18 different alien species that we know about monitoring Earth. Some are good and some are hostile, most are indifferent. We found out that we are the experimental product, if you will, of an alien race who we never met and we don't know who they are. All we know is that the Greys are cybernetic organisms, glorified robots if you will, who work here at the behest of their employers monitoring us through abductions. We were never able to find out what the experiment is all about except that we have been externally corrected about 65 times. And they, the aliens, refer to us as "Containers." There's been speculation that the souls our bodies contain is the reason for the experiments. But nothing's been proven or determined.
[emphasis added by observer]

My point is:

Although there may be many species of aliens visiting this planet, there is only ONE species that controls the soul farming operation of the human experiment here on this planet. That species is Reptilian, and may be hyperdimensional in form (extra-dimensional) and has been referred to as such throughout the mythologies of antiquity. These Reptilian Overlords have used many different groups of aliens as allies throughout history. Among these allies to the Reptilian Overlords, throughout the history of Man, have been the Pleiadians, those aliens described as from Orion, those described as from Draco, and various species of gray aliens, among whom some may also be biological robotoids.

I, as a personal preference, do not trust any species of aliens visiting this planet. I particularly DO NOT trust any form of telepathically implanted thought. The evidence is clear that there are Archons patrolling the Akashic Records for anyone doing any sort of remote viewing of these records. These Archons are there to confuse the message, which they do very well.

This point of view is purely my personal interpretation of the evidence I've researched. You can take it or leave it. I'm making no special claim with regard to it. I'm seeking no profit from these disclosures.

And, as always, I wish to end with:

They are very clever at what they do....

[9eagle9]

Not off topic but one of our intrepid members provided us with a copy of Population Control Protocol- A Peace Program. Complete with script and audio (if the script doesn't get you , you know)

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?48705-Is-Humanity-Becoming-More-Peaceful-or-Violent&p=540366#post540366

[wynderer]

---------------------------------------------

[observer]

In response to all the members who have found some sort of 'shock' or 'horror' from the comments I've been making within this thread, get used to it, and get over it.

This has always been a Prison Planet (http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sumer_anunnaki/reptiles/reptiles06.htm). There has never been a 'Bright New Day' here. It is simply one more empty promise and a part of the Big Lie.

The only chance for anything better is to figure-out how to remove one's eternal soul from this place of Abject Evil.

My comments are designed to stimulate input into the 'Getting-Out' exit strategies necessary to extract one's soul-self from this matrix.

For, believe it or not, we are all trapped within this matrix. This is the hidden meaning of the Ouroboros (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ouroboros).

[Chester]

[...]


The evidence is clear on this issue. You are being abducted as a result of a contract.

[...]

Truman Cash's, karla Turner's, B. Bartholic's, Mangala's, etc, researches squarely disagrree with that statement.

Abductions have been going on for eons. [emphasis added by observer]

Hence that statement, to the contrary of being all inclusive, is derived from only ONE particular group of ETs that made it "legal" with ONE Earth's government.

In other words, in spite of claiming and clamoring it (to seemingly make it logical and scientific), that statement is not supported by evidence.

It is not my intention of disagreeing with you, Amzer.

From the evidence I've researched it is apparent the abductions have been continuing since the Dawn of Man. All one need do is research the Nag Hammadi Library (http://www.gnosis.org/naghamm/hypostas.html)and one will agree with your highlighted statement.

It is also apparent from the research into the Archon phenomenon (http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/vida_alien/alien_archons.htm), and from the descriptions of antiquity, that those referred to as "Archons" in antiquity were nothing more than those little Grey Aliens that we are all familiar with, today.

Yes, I also agree there are many species of aliens visiting this planet. Some of these MAY be abducting human beings.

From my years of research into the issue, I must conclude the obtrusive abductions are being conducted by the group of aliens (Greys included) that are in league with the Reptilian Overlords to this planet. It is these allied Greys that have most recently written and signed contracts with some of the governments of the world. It is The Reptilian Overlords whom John Lear does not speak of, but makes reference to, here:


From the written text of the John Lear Disclosure, found here: http://www.coasttocoastam.com/show/2003/11/02

And we found out so far there are 18 different alien species that we know about monitoring Earth. Some are good and some are hostile, most are indifferent. We found out that we are the experimental product, if you will, of an alien race who we never met and we don't know who they are. All we know is that the Greys are cybernetic organisms, glorified robots if you will, who work here at the behest of their employers monitoring us through abductions. We were never able to find out what the experiment is all about except that we have been externally corrected about 65 times. And they, the aliens, refer to us as "Containers." There's been speculation that the souls our bodies contain is the reason for the experiments. But nothing's been proven or determined.
[emphasis added by observer]

My point is:

Although there may be many species of aliens visiting this planet, there is only ONE species that controls the soul farming operation of the human experiment here on this planet. That species is Reptilian, and may be hyperdimensional in form (extra-dimensional) and has been referred to as such throughout the mythologies of antiquity. These Reptilian Overlords have used many different groups of aliens as allies throughout history. Among these allies to the Reptilian Overlords, throughout the history of Man, have been the Pleiadians, those aliens described as from Orion, those described as from Draco, and various species of gray aliens, among whom some may also be biological robotoids.

I, as a personal preference, do not trust any species of aliens visiting this planet. I particularly DO NOT trust any form of telepathically implanted thought. The evidence is clear that there are Archons patrolling the Akashic Records for anyone doing any sort of remote viewing of these records. These Archons are there to confuse the message, which they do very well.

This point of view is purely my personal interpretation of the evidence I've researched. You can take it or leave it. I'm making no special claim with regard to it. I'm seeking no profit from these disclosures.

And, as always, I wish to end with:

They are very clever at what they do....

I agree 100% with every single word of this post. I am unsure if you read a post I made in the last 24 hours where I pointed out just about the same thing you did.

I might add that I happen to have a theory as to which "ET" group may be our "parent" from the point of view of the creator of our physical apparatus or container if you will (the human body as we know it today). That does not mean these ET parents are our "Creator" for those who require this distinction as there is no reason we may not ultimately have an original "parent."

And since I brought that up, I will add something that would likely be controversial... (this is not at all pointed to you, observer - again, GREAT post!)

I experimenting with the idea of a "God, my (our) Creator" from the perspective of worshiping that "Creator." I discovered that when I lived my life "worshiping" this potential originator of my core being, my Spirit, that I found myself experiencing a world where there were the worshiped and the worshipers. I began to notice this dynamic at the core of every single relationship I entered into. In time, I found I much preferred to be the worshiped than a worshiper in most of my relationships.

Eventually (because of this dynamic) I achieved almost total isolation and became a true hermit. I then got very lonely. So, I began to question worship. Once I began to question, I eventually reached doubt about worship. Once I reached doubt, I decided to discard worship altogether. Once I did that, I experienced a void. A void that lasted until I found a worthy replacement. And that replacement was respect.

A simple thing, respect yet so so so difficult to apply. But I began to do it and so far, from my experience, being vigilant at respecting everyone, all life, all things in that all has the right to exist (even the thought forms we create that grow into actual entities all on their own), my life has changed completely and for the better.

So what I have been doing as a side project amongst my many projects is going through the dictionary regarding the most commonly used words within my own vocabulary and examining these words as to whether or not I want them in my active vocabulary in that I accept the dynamic the word fits into. See, all words inherently imply "and not this."

In fact (again, opinion only) words are perhaps the very heaviest anchors of the ship we are on which holds us firmly in duality.

Has any war ever started where it did not begin first with words?

Sorry I get this way...

justoneman (in the morning and with perhaps too much coffee)

[wynderer]

------------------------------------------

[Chester]

Not off topic but one of our intrepid members provided us with a copy of Population Control Protocol- A Peace Program. Complete with script and audio (if the script doesn't get you , you know)

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?48705-Is-Humanity-Becoming-More-Peaceful-or-Violent&p=540366#post540366

Its so strange - I remember when I was able to discover something like this and because the writer had a way with words, I was easily sucked in.

Today though, curious about this link, I went to the thread. I looked for the "target" post and started to read and immediately saw it as nothing different than Orwellian newspeak - putting all but completely disconnected words together in pairs such that an innocent reader, that could be mesmerized by the word master, would be hurled further into the pit of confusion and buy it all.

Un Freaking Real! And what's scary is that I can still remember when I would have not only bought it all... I would have been seeking ways to sell it too!

Thank you, 9eagle9 for being one of the most effective posters I have come to know in our community. You, along with NancyV, Amzer Zo and GripReaper have shaken me out of my trance. Yes, many others but you are my Fantastic Four!

justone

[Chester]

In response to all the members who have found some sort of 'shock' or 'horror' from the comments I've been making within this thread, get used to it, and get over it.

This has always been a Prison Planet (http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sumer_anunnaki/reptiles/reptiles06.htm). There has never been a 'Bright New Day' here. It is simply one more empty promise and a part of the Big Lie.

The only chance for anything better is to figure-out how to remove one's eternal soul from this place of Abject Evil.

My comments are designed to stimulate input into the 'Getting-Out' exit strategies necessary to extract one's soul-self from this matrix.

For, believe it or not, we are all trapped within this matrix. This is the hidden meaning of the Ouroboros (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ouroboros).

Perhaps the planet can be characterized as a Prison Planet (amongst many other characterizations).

But you lose me completely with the "get out with your soul alive" statement if you do not include consideration of the rest of us. And I am not suggesting you don't, but I do not see any suggestion that you do.

I have read many of your posts and I get the impression that you (at your core level of being... that which I believe is your Spirit) might be here intentionally to help others get out. But that's just my opinion.

Anyways, I can only speak for myself and I have discovered that core component within me which has this intention. It is selfish - being a helper... I can admit it. But its what fulfills me. In being honest though, most folks I think I have helped so far in most cases would see it differently... haha, but that is another matter.

Anyways, its funny how we can agree on so much and yet also find where we completely disagree!

Life on Earth in 2012! Gotta love it.

Cheers, justoneman

[wynderer]

----------------------------------------

[observer]

Sorry Wynderer but I am not buying into your victim/prison paradigm, not today, not tomorrow, not ever!
[....snip]

I'm certain wynderer would concur, Sebastion,

You are free to choose whatever resonates within your heart. Here (http://www.paoweb.com/) is a link to a website where you might find all the tripe that you are subscribing to.

There is a section of this forum (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/forumdisplay.php?83-Channeled-and-Other-Controversial-Material)that is dedicated specifically to the 'brain manure' being proposed by individuals such as Sheldon Nidle.

I (and I'm certain, wanderer in bumping my comment) am simply pointing to evidence that is contrary to the New Age Hypothesis. This is the root basis for (I'm also certain) Houman's creating this thread of exceptional evidence that is all contrary to the New Age Hypothesis.

.... and to Justoneman's comment #1740:


Click-on forwarding arrow to see content of justoneman's comment #1740

.... I would reiterate what I've said so often throughout the forums:

If you so believe this planet is such a wonderful place to be in 2012, "just ask that Afghani Mother, sitting in the bombed-out rubble of her home, holding her dead infant, if she feels as though her thoughts have in any way created her reality, today."

We are all - by the rules of karma - subject to the consequences of our life actions. Not a single one of us knows the rules by which we exist within this Prison Matrix. These rules are purposely obscured from The Mass of Humanity for the reasons that I make the comments that I do.

It is the obligation of each individual to find his own eternal soul's way out of this nightmare and back to the Unconditional Love of the Great Spirit.

[wynderer]

-----------------------------------------

[Daughter of Time]

[
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well Wyn,

While it may be somewhat true that abductees are chosen because of their intelligence or psychic gifts or whatever other abilities, this does not make for an even remotely comforting thought. We should be able and allowed to use our intelligence, gifts and abilities for our own advancement and for the advancement of humanity, and not for the advancement of parasites and the debasement of our species.

hi Daughter of Time --

i agree that we should be allowed to freely use our gifts -- as i also think that this planet was intended by the Creator to be a paradise, & there should be no wars, no children being tortured & killed in rituals, no continuing mass slaughter of billions of animals every year, etc, etc

but this is the world we are living in now -- when i place my own personal abduction-messed -with life in the context of the bigger picture, i figure it's just my own personal little burden to carry here -- not fun, but, as i said, life on Earth at this time is not fun for many of us here, including the non-Human Animals

Wyn,

While it is true that many poor souls out there have suffered far worse fates than yours or mine and many carry far heavier burdens than yours or mine or anyone's here, our fates and burdens should never be accepted with complacency because if we should all feel that way, then they have won, completely, and we are nothing but willing slaves who will die by the hands of their cruel masters.

In an earlier post you said that you realize this is only one life. I conclude that you mean that you believe you'll have other chances in the future to create better lives. But if you don't try to free yourself from their manipulations, at whatever level you are capable of now, then guess what? Your future lives will not be any better! And next time around you'll once again say: this is only one life! And so you can go through millenia telling yourself that this is only one life and the next one will be better, and that's exactly what they want you to think. Don't give into that way of thinking! It will not serve you! You have to do what you can, now!

Please understand that I'm not judging you here. I'm not against you. I feel for what you've been through for although your journey may be been unlike mine in many ways, I do understand the suffering of an abductee because I am one too. But I'll never submissively accept it as a mere condition of living on earth. And while Terra may be a prison planet, I have to believe that prisons can be destroyed, that the gates can be opened, and that eventually we can be free. Those who imprison us may be powerful, but they manage to do what they do with tricks, and the tricks are slowly being exposed. And I refuse to believe that there is no hope for humankind. While others may believe it is foolish of me to feel that we can regain our birthrights to be free beings, if I believe that, then I'm doomed; I'll slide into a state of impotent depression and I will not give into that. If I'd given into that way of thinking, I don't think I would have survived what i've been through.

In another post you encouraged me to become a warrior. A warrior doesn't accept injustice of gargantuan proportions as what we are experiencing right now. A warrior fights for what is right. I don't know how to begin this fight. Right now I'm simply beginning with my intent to set myself free at whatever levels possible. Intent is the first step.

So Wyn, again, this is not criticism, but since you like to tell people to become warrior/esses, then be one yourself. I do realize you are unwell and maybe feel lost and incapable of executing any changes. Start by removing your apathy towards your condition. That would be one step in the right direction.

Observer's advice to prepare to leave the planet is a thoughtful and noble one, but most people are not ready to do that at the particular point in time. I don't know if it's possible to leave the planet by merely wishing it. I think that first the veils have to be removed, programmings have to be changed, feelings of victimization or complacency will have to be annihilated, complete understanding of the situation has to be reached, and if I should ever reach the point when all the above clutter is cleared, I think I'd want to stay here to enlighten others. It may be ridiculously naive of me to think this is possible, but if I had one wish, this is what my wish would be.

[observer]

From a comment made in another thread by Sabastion:


Judgement does NOT exist in higher states of consciousness for there is no one and no thing to pass judgement. Been there, seen that, done that. Don't believe me? Get out of your body and go see for yourself, it isn't that hard...ask Anotherbob, NancyV, Jake, Sirdipswitch and others, then you will KNOW for yourself! [....snip]

Each and every comment I have review by many of those listed in your 'list of those to ask', have been comments of 'personal testimony'. Personal testimony is a wonderful thing when subscribing to dogma, like one might find in the 'Bible Thread' (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?35019-the-Bible), for instance.

There is not a shred of physical evidence that can support your 'personal testimony' claim of 'traveling out of your body'. Beyond your 'personal testimony', there is not a shred of physical evidence to support that which you may be experiencing, is not strongly influenced by an Archonic Presence within your 'Astral Dream State'.


If you could prove - without a shadow of doubt - what you claim to be part of this reality, than you (and the others you have represented) would be presenting hard physical evidence to your suppositions.... just as Houman has done with the (now) 88 pages of hard physical evidence contained within this thread.

All the members get from those in your 'list' are personal testimony.

I find testimonies from you, and the others whom you have referenced, to be personal interpretations of how reality works - as to the insistence of these channeled sources.

If you ever have had a doubt to your claim, than in that moment, you are questioning that to which you speak. This moment of doubt is what is referred to as a 'moral conflict'.

Show us the evidence. Otherwise contain your comments to the appropriate threads (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/forumdisplay.php?83-Channeled-and-Other-Controversial-Material)which I already suggested. This is a thread based on evidence.

Sorry for the rant, Houman, just my opinion, based on the available facts....

- edit update -

Please, do as you wish, blather-on. It can be counted as just one more with much to say, yet having so little revelation to their content. Why not ruin a perfectly good thread with more 'channeled' dogma?

I've said what I have to say, Sabastion.

[wynderer]

------------------------------------------------

[Daughter of Time]

Well, Wyn -

Glad at least I made you laugh out loud!

I've never doubted the goodness of your heart towards others. You have gone out of your way to express your sympathy towards children and animals.

But from the posts I've read of yours, it seemed to me that you are too accepting of your fate since you say "this is only one life" and other things which would be too tiresome to repeat.

If I've misread you and you're fully awake and aware, then all I can say is: GOOD FOR YOU!!!

[wynderer]

------------------------------------

[RunningDeer]

Hello All, this was posted this on another thread. It's hard to figure out the pulse and main theme on this thread partly because I don't check in often enough.

Though, I'd wager a guess that it's not a "Mooji kind of place". He does raise some points that were covered on this thread. For what it's worth, it may hit a helpful cord for some. :wave:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yk0ANlMmgI

source:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yk0ANlMmgI[/QUOTE]

[wynderer]

---------------------------------

[heyokah]

Some people are busy doing something about as opposed to those who actually do something about.



True words aren’t eloquent;
eloquent words aren’t true.
Wise men don’t need to prove their point;
men who need to prove their point aren’t wise.

The Master has no possessions.
The more he does for others,
the happier he is.
The more he gives to others,
the wealthier he is.

The Tao nourishes by not forcing.
By not dominating, the Master leads.

Tao Te Ching, verse 81

[Chester]

Sorry Wynderer but I am not buying into your victim/prison paradigm, not today, not tomorrow, not ever!
[....snip]

I'm certain wynderer would concur, Sebastion,

You are free to choose whatever resonates within your heart. Here (http://www.paoweb.com/) is a link to a website where you might find all the tripe that you are subscribing to.

There is a section of this forum (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/forumdisplay.php?83-Channeled-and-Other-Controversial-Material)that is dedicated specifically to the 'brain manure' being proposed by individuals such as Sheldon Nidle.

I (and I'm certain, wanderer in bumping my comment) am simply pointing to evidence that is contrary to the New Age Hypothesis. This is the root basis for (I'm also certain) Houman's creating this thread of exceptional evidence that is all contrary to the New Age Hypothesis.

.... and to Justoneman's comment #1740:


Click-on forwarding arrow to see content of justoneman's comment #1740

.... I would reiterate what I've said so often throughout the forums:

If you so believe this planet is such a wonderful place to be in 2012, "just ask that Afghani Mother, sitting in the bombed-out rubble of her home, holding her dead infant, if she feels as though her thoughts have in any way created her reality, today."

We are all - by the rules of karma - subject to the consequences of our life actions. Not a single one of us knows the rules by which we exist within this Prison Matrix. These rules are purposely obscured from The Mass of Humanity for the reasons that I make the comments that I do.

It is the obligation of each individual to find his own eternal soul's way out of this nightmare and back to the Unconditional Love of the Great Spirit.

Yo Observer... I am not so sure I was able to correctly convey what I said by my comment "You gotta love it!" But what I attempted to convey was "You gotta be kidding me." Read the few sentences I wrote just above that and you might understand I was using sarcasm.

Also, and I tried to make this so, so clear... what I have done for my own process of freeing my soul (specifically by taking full responsibility for everything in my life) is simply and only what I did for myself. And I only reported that to me this appeared to be part of what is working for myself. It has nothing to do with anyone else's process. It should not have been taken as something I am implying is universally true.

So, let me make this clear - I am in no way accepting such realities as in the one you used in your example above - dead babies in mothers' arms. In addition, and what I tried to convey but will again strive to make clearer, its my opinion some of us (not all) may be here because we want to help. That we may have volunteered to incarnate to help others (in truth a selfish decision but I have covered that angle in previous posts and was pointed out to me by NancyV - thanks again, Nancy). That help may include being able to be in the right place at the right time that might prevent the scenario such that some mother be found holding her dead infant in her arms inside a bombed out shelter. All I pointed out was that I sensed that same possibility in you, observer.

I really try and be clear in what I write yet I still seem to fail at times.

We have yet again another "divide" which seems to have started with words, lovely words (sarcasm).

EDIT - I just read a subsequent post of yours and so now I am going to do something that you will likely perceive as attack but my purpose in so doing this is to point out how important it is when we write publicly that we consider carefully what we release to the public.

Here are two sentences you posted back to back -

"We are all - by the rules of karma - subject to the consequences of our life actions."

This is your opinion that there is a "rule" known as "karma" and you then explain what that rule means... that we are "subject to the consequences of our life actions."

In your very next sentence you state:

"Not a single one of us knows the rules by which we exist within this Prison Matrix."

You are within this "prison matrix," you tell us about karma and how it works and then you state no one within this prison matrix knows the rules. How could you be here and know the rule(s) of karma (if there is such a thing in the form you state) and then say no one here can know the rules?

In two back to back sentences, you appear to contradict yourself. When people are found to contradict themselves, the good points they make don't get through...

Now perhaps I am also misunderstanding you and if so, I apologize - again words... lovely words.

justone

[Chester]

[
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well Wyn,

While it may be somewhat true that abductees are chosen because of their intelligence or psychic gifts or whatever other abilities, this does not make for an even remotely comforting thought. We should be able and allowed to use our intelligence, gifts and abilities for our own advancement and for the advancement of humanity, and not for the advancement of parasites and the debasement of our species.

hi Daughter of Time --

i agree that we should be allowed to freely use our gifts -- as i also think that this planet was intended by the Creator to be a paradise, & there should be no wars, no children being tortured & killed in rituals, no continuing mass slaughter of billions of animals every year, etc, etc

but this is the world we are living in now -- when i place my own personal abduction-messed -with life in the context of the bigger picture, i figure it's just my own personal little burden to carry here -- not fun, but, as i said, life on Earth at this time is not fun for many of us here, including the non-Human Animals

Wyn,

While it is true that many poor souls out there have suffered far worse fates than yours or mine and many carry far heavier burdens than yours or mine or anyone's here, our fates and burdens should never be accepted with complacency because if we should all feel that way, then they have won, completely, and we are nothing but willing slaves who will die by the hands of their cruel masters.

In an earlier post you said that you realize this is only one life. I conclude that you mean that you believe you'll have other chances in the future to create better lives. But if you don't try to free yourself from their manipulations, at whatever level you are capable of now, then guess what? Your future lives will not be any better! And next time around you'll once again say: this is only one life! And so you can go through millenia telling yourself that this is only one life and the next one will be better, and that's exactly what they want you to think. Don't give into that way of thinking! It will not serve you! You have to do what you can, now!

Please understand that I'm not judging you here. I'm not against you. I feel for what you've been through for although your journey may be been unlike mine in many ways, I do understand the suffering of an abductee because I am one too. But I'll never submissively accept it as a mere condition of living on earth. And while Terra may be a prison planet, I have to believe that prisons can be destroyed, that the gates can be opened, and that eventually we can be free. Those who imprison us may be powerful, but they manage to do what they do with tricks, and the tricks are slowly being exposed. And I refuse to believe that there is no hope for humankind. While others may believe it is foolish of me to feel that we can regain our birthrights to be free beings, if I believe that, then I'm doomed; I'll slide into a state of impotent depression and I will not give into that. If I'd given into that way of thinking, I don't think I would have survived what i've been through.

In another post you encouraged me to become a warrior. A warrior doesn't accept injustice of gargantuan proportions as what we are experiencing right now. A warrior fights for what is right. I don't know how to begin this fight. Right now I'm simply beginning with my intent to set myself free at whatever levels possible. Intent is the first step.

So Wyn, again, this is not criticism, but since you like to tell people to become warrior/esses, then be one yourself. I do realize you are unwell and maybe feel lost and incapable of executing any changes. Start by removing your apathy towards your condition. That would be one step in the right direction.

Observer's advice to prepare to leave the planet is a thoughtful and noble one, but most people are not ready to do that at the particular point in time. I don't know if it's possible to leave the planet by merely wishing it. I think that first the veils have to be removed, programmings have to be changed, feelings of victimization or complacency will have to be annihilated, complete understanding of the situation has to be reached, and if I should ever reach the point when all the above clutter is cleared, I think I'd want to stay here to enlighten others. It may be ridiculously naive of me to think this is possible, but if I had one wish, this is what my wish would be.

This was a great Post DoT... lovingly delivered. Thanks for reinforcing my own views (aimed at myself - not anyone else).

[Hervé]

On a different note and in the line of "archontic psychopathy," I posted this somewhere else:


[...]

Very similar understanding to my own of the whole genetic/DNA ooplah that's being force-fed all around in research and MSM under the guise of "It's all genetic" whether that be psychopathy, diseases, genialism, moronism, the whole of the psychiatric/psychology aberrations, etc... blame it on the body and its parents.

My bet is that, pretty soon, if not already in the works, they'll "discover" the "Christian gene" or the "Muslim" or "Budhist" ones. And with it, completely disconnect the being/spirit and its own programming from the biological body and denying "existence" to the "will" behind that body's expressed performance and abilities with the blanket statement: "Well, s/he was born that way." Which is the whole idea behind eugenics programs and agenda 21.

Well... there we go:

Scientific explanation of psychopathy cuts jail time (http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn22189-scientific-explanation-of-psychopathy-cuts-jail-time.html)
19:00 16 August 2012 by Jessica Hamzelou (http://www.newscientist.com/search?rbauthors=Jessica+Hamzelou)

Serial sex offender Raymond Henry Garland, considered one of Australia's most dangerous sexual predators (http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/100-per-cent-chance-of-psychopathic-sex-fiend-reoffending-20120813-24431.html), was officially diagnosed a psychopath last week. Psychiatrist Joan Lawrence told the Brisbane District Court that Garland had an "almost 100 per cent chance of violent reoffending." Garland has been dealt four indefinite sentences – but research out today suggests that biological evidence of psychopathy could alter the length of such sentences.

Brain scans and genetic tests are becoming a common feature of courtroom battles, as biological evidence is increasingly used to explain a person's criminal behaviour. For example, last year an Italian woman convicted of murdering her sister had her lifetime sentence reduced to 20 years on the basis of brain and genetic tests, which provided biological explanations for her aggressive behaviour (http://www.newscientist.com/blogs/shortsharpscience/2011/09/brain-scans-reduce-sentence-in.html).

Full article here: http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn22189-scientific-explanation-of-psychopathy-cuts-jail-time.html


Then... this:


From Internet Troll to Psychopathy Expert: The Con-Artistry of Thomas Sheridan (http://www.sott.net/articles/show/249840-From-Internet-Troll-to-Psychopathy-Expert-The-Con-Artistry-of-Thomas-Sheridan)
Niall Bradley and Joe Quinn, Sott.net, Sun, 19 Aug 2012 00:20 CDT

Compared to, say, ten years ago, a lot of people today are aware of and talking about psychopaths. On the one hand this is encouraging, but on the other, it's a little troubling. It is heartening to see awareness of psychopathy breach the mainstream frequency fence here and there, but the signal-to-noise ratio, as with all knowledge relevant to the growth and survival of decent human beings, remains high on the 'noise' side. We see ridiculous studies in the news portraying psychopaths as curable (http://www.sott.net/articles/show/248298-Psychopath-Disinformation-Alert-In-the-Mind-of-the-Psychopath) and articles making the rounds about how not (http://www.sott.net/articles/show/249331-Psychopathy-Disinformation-Alert-Not-joining-Facebook-is-a-sign-you-re-a-psychopath)having a Facebook account (http://www.sott.net/articles/show/249331-Psychopathy-Disinformation-Alert-Not-joining-Facebook-is-a-sign-you-re-a-psychopath) may indicate that someone is a psychopath. We've also seen Twitter being touted as a tool for 'spotting psychopaths' (http://www.sott.net/articles/show/248526-Using-Twitter-To-Identify-Psychopaths) and, just today, news that the US justice system is considering acceptance of biological evidence that someone is a genetic psychopath in court with a view to using it to mitigate the sentences of criminal offenders. The reasoning being that psychopaths can't help being psychopaths, that they lack free will and therefore they bear diminished responsibility for their crimes.

Well, yeah, that's exactly why they need to be held under lock and key permanently.

Full article here: http://www.sott.net/articles/show/249840-From-Internet-Troll-to-Psychopathy-Expert-The-Con-Artistry-of-Thomas-Sheridan

********************************************

Both are misdirects since in either case, in Steve Richards' words:


These beings come and take over, ‘party time, yee‐ha!’ But they’re leaving you to hold the bag. They jump out because they don’t want to take responsibility because human bodies are subject to pain and suffering. They’d rather jump in, have fun and leave you holding the bag. This is your free will and choice. If you choose to go out and get drunk, if you choose to go and get on the drugs, if you choose to open the doorways, then you’re choosing to be in their game. And you’re subject to laws of their game. Simple. Make changes.

All they'll do is jail or medicate a "container" with its original "spirit" stuck in it and totally bewildered while the real culprits are already on the prawl for their next "container" calling out for spirit guides or their "higher self"...