Benjamin Fulford's posts and reports

[9eagle9]

That is because you are agreeing they are real. It's just how energy works. Your basic level energy practitioner would tell you that.

Everytime you pay your taxes you are agreeing they are real.

Everytime you see a doctor you are agreeing they are real.

Everytime you pay a traffic ticket you are agreeing they are real.

Everytime you say they are real , they become real to you. So of course they can affect you!

Everytime you play follow the leader you are agreeing they are real.

You are creating your situation. And you expect me to agree with it. I am not agreeing to your prison that you are making for yourself.

Why should I?

It's YOUR situation. You think they are real and I know they are not. It's not my problem you think they are real; I didn't make you think they were real.

I don't have to agree to it. Its just emphasizing you are deciding to be unreal right along with them. That's your choice. My failing is is not understanding you don't have an alternative. I observe you don't because as much as people bitch and complain about the system they still keep agreeing to it.

Then go on some irate tirade when I simply say, Stop agreeing with the system. Fighting with the system just acknowledges its real, and accepting it acknowledges it's real. Changing the matrix just re-enforces that it's real.

When you stop building their system things should change for you. It's inevitable.

Of course they come to my door, I've had attempts made on my life. So what. Some unreal entity posing as human comes to my door. So? It' s a matrix world I should not expect I should run across some programmed mind periodically (well...24/7). They're not real. I remember what is real and they just go away. Because they aren't real. I'm no threat to them anyway, they KNOW you want a system and won't accept anything I say so why should they be offended by me?

You may not have a common frame of reference between what is real and not real. If you have only ever known and accepted is the programs, the systems and the matrixs how would YOU know what reality is?




They are quite real. They simply did not blast open our homes, kill our families, and leave depleted uranium in their wake - in our own little world (yet), so, we can act as if they don't exist, that they have no power.

There are a very small number of people on the planet that are self empowered. It is folly to believe they will all magically leap there (ascension?) and so the vast vast vast percentage of people and animals and plants on this planet need protection from the psychopathic monsters that rule the world. When they get to your neighborhood, and your door, it will seem more real.

Dennis

[9eagle9]

I can forgive them for not knowing. Once they are informed they know, and then still keep toddling off down the road of mental enslavement.

Then what?

You may think I'm being facetious here, but I'm serious. I really have to nail this down. Not that my forgiveness is going to make any difference to them but it may make a difference to me.

If I forgive them will be outraged because its an implication of guilt on their part.

I'll forgive myself and leave at that for now.




@9, I thought we were forgive them for not knowing, whatever may they do

@Dennis Before one may magically leap, first one must magically stand on one's two feet.

[sdv]

Yes, it will be hard in some ways -- but a joy more than anything. And by the way, I do NOT think of Drake as a "savior" or even a "leader" beyond the fact that he has shown leadership capabilities and is a natural leader. What he is right now is a spokesman for what I consider to be the CREAM of humanity that are using their brains, wits and courage to free humanity while knowingly risking their lives to do so. And I cannot thank them enough.

And this paragraph is the CREAM of complete deluded thinking, at best, and plain stupidity, at worst. Your definition of leadership qualities and the cream of humanity is quite astonishing (plus your understanding of brain, wits, courage and knowingly risking his life to free humanity), but not exceptional. By the way, I did listen to Drake and soon after that first interview realised that in order to keep listening would require me to switch off more than 50% of my thinking abilities. I don't do that for anyone.

Oh, by the way, I am part of humanity and I don't want (and most certainly do not need) deluded people like this saving me or freeing me from anything at all.

On that very rude note, I leave Drake material and suggest that you form a private group on this forum for Drake groupies. If you put something on a public thread then you can expect public responses.

[9eagle9]

Yeah i'm sorta pinging in on the fact that splendid leaders and people who know how to govern themselves aren't compelled to troll their audience for 2,500 dollars.

If you can't manage yourself or govern yourself, one is not very well equipped to lead others. Self management means authority over all aspects of your life including...financial. Because he's trying to raise money the same old same old way...

They do however, to steal your word, DELUDE themselves into thinking they are leaders while engaging in OBVIOUS behaviors they are not.

And the adherents proclaim to 'feeling' empowered, when they express the OBVIOUS behaviors of being anything else.

. And the reaction from their fans keeps this delusion going. Its mutual feed off.

PS. In order to keep the peace about this whole matter you will also be required to switch off the other 50 percent of your thinking abilities.

Which is essentially what his adherents are asking you to do.

then tomorrow they'll be out blathering on about how we are supposed to think for ourselves...lol. It sounded kewl so they decided to repeat it.

I'm sitting here thinking for myself and we seen what sort of reaction that brought.


The last thing Drakes adherents want is anyone thinking for themselves.






Yes, it will be hard in some ways -- but a joy more than anything. And by the way, I do NOT think of Drake as a "savior" or even a "leader" beyond the fact that he has shown leadership capabilities and is a natural leader. What he is right now is a spokesman for what I consider to be the CREAM of humanity that are using their brains, wits and courage to free humanity while knowingly risking their lives to do so. And I cannot thank them enough.

And this paragraph is the CREAM of complete deluded thinking, at best, and plain stupidity, at worst. Your definition of leadership qualities and the cream of humanity is quite astonishing (plus your understanding of brain, wits, courage and knowingly risking his life to free humanity), but not exceptional. By the way, I did listen to Drake and soon after that first interview realised that in order to keep listening would require me to switch off more than 50% of my thinking abilities. I don't do that for anyone.

Oh, by the way, I am part of humanity and I don't want (and most certainly do not need) deluded people like this saving me or freeing me from anything at all.

On that very rude note, I leave Drake material and suggest that you form a private group on this forum for Drake groupies. If you put something on a public thread then you can expect public responses.

[Dennis Leahy]

That is because you are agreeing they are real. It's just how energy works. Your basic level energy practitioner would tell you that.

Everytime you pay your taxes you are agreeing they are real.

Everytime you see a doctor you are agreeing they are real.

Everytime you pay a traffic ticket you are agreeing they are real.

Everytime you say they are real , they become real to you. So of course they can affect you!

Everytime you play follow the leader you are agreeing they are real.

You are creating your situation. And you expect me to agree with it. I am not agreeing to your prison that you are making for yourself.

Why should I?

It's YOUR situation. You think they are real and I know they are not. It's not my problem you think they are real; I didn't make you think they were real.

I don't have to agree to it. Its just emphasizing you are deciding to be unreal right along with them. That's your choice. My failing is is not understanding you don't have an alternative. I observe you don't because as much as people bitch and complain about the system they still keep agreeing to it.

Then go on some irate tirade when I simply say, Stop agreeing with the system. Fighting with the system just acknowledges its real, and accepting it acknowledges it's real. Changing the matrix just re-enforces that it's real.

When you stop building their system things should change for you. It's inevitable.

Of course they come to my door, I've had attempts made on my life. So what. Some unreal entity posing as human comes to my door. So? It' s a matrix world I should not expect I should run across some programmed mind periodically (well...24/7). They're not real. I remember what is real and they just go away. Because they aren't real. I'm no threat to them anyway, they KNOW you want a system and won't accept anything I say so why should they be offended by me?

You may not have a common frame of reference between what is real and not real. If you have only ever known and accepted is the programs, the systems and the matrixs how would YOU know what reality is?




They are quite real. They simply did not blast open our homes, kill our families, and leave depleted uranium in their wake - in our own little world (yet), so, we can act as if they don't exist, that they have no power.

There are a very small number of people on the planet that are self empowered. It is folly to believe they will all magically leap there (ascension?) and so the vast vast vast percentage of people and animals and plants on this planet need protection from the psychopathic monsters that rule the world. When they get to your neighborhood, and your door, it will seem more real.

Dennis

How does this differ from the "ostrich" viewpoint with head in the sand?

I am not talking about metaphysics or the realm of oneness. Once the conversation shifts to that, of course, there is only one, all else is illusion. With that viewpoint, it is hypocritically silly to be on an online forum, discussing with "others" that do not exist.

Me, sticking my fingers in my ears, closing my eyes, and making noise so I cannot hear anything but the noise does nothing to slow down or stop the genocide and ecocide that is going on. Me saying , "not my problem", is selfish and infantile, not enlightened. The quadrillions of life forms on this planet suffering in the pollution of mankind, directed by a few atop a pyramid of power, did not choose to be disempowered. They need a champion, a warrior - not someone with their eyes closed and their ears plugged. Is there truth in those words, or is it simply my illusion? If there is truth, then add in the billions of sentient creatures on this planet that need the assistance and the protection of the enlightened warriors. Hopefully, someday, they will each be in a position where they can choose between empowerment and disempowerment, and hopefullly they will choose wisely. For now, they are starving, poisoned, imprisoned (the "real" prisons, with metal bars), sick, and dying.

Dennis

[9eagle9]

How does it? They are after all effecting you not me.

I said once i'm not talking about metaphysics and you can tune that out as much as you like. You make it clear you no concept of what I'm talking about because of your programming. Your program doesn't allow for it. It only allows for that which supports the program, not that which kills the program and the systems it runs on.

I'm saying DITCH THE PROGRAM so you can undertand what I'm talking about. This has nothing to do with metaphysics. so you have chosen the program, let me know how that works out for you. No don't, I already know. Programs are predictable, your little reset button notion is just a means of making sure the program happens again. I'm saying no to that to. If everyone else says yes, its still not my problem.

You can't understand, you are NOT ABLE TO. You just keep relabeling it metaphyisics.. I don't care if you relabel "Bambi" into "Debbie does Dallas" its still the same program.

. I'm talking self empowerment. Self governance, self management. We are only affected by as much as we agree to any given system.

I don't people managing my body so I don't pay health insurance and don't go to doctors. I take care of my body. Its as easy as that.
What is wrong with that exactly?

The reason we have insurance companies that take us up the arse is because a space was created for them. A means of insuring that no one would have take responsibility for their actions. Slaves are not responsible for themselves, their masters are. There's your programming , there's your head --not in sand--but the shoved up the master's arse.

The sheepl have so many masters they have no idea who they are serving.


Do you pay insurance of any sort? Then you are perpetrator to the system of insurance. You PAY them to exist. That's YOUR doing, not mine. You pay the IRS, you are paying them to keep you enslaved. Who is the ostrich here again?

the first time someone rear ended another person and refused to say "Oh ****, my bad, that's all my fault, hear let me pay for that' they created a space for an insurance company to come in and make the restitution necessary to the other person because the rear -ender didn't want to take responsibility for their actions. I don't care if it was deliberate or an accident. Teh sheep do not want to be responsible, there's no self management.

People ensure themselves that accidents don't happen. They cannot bear for anything to happen that is not programmed or expected.

What are we cutting off at the knees when we ensure ourselves that no accidents will happen. Anyone?

Oh ****, now that space if filled with a legion of pseudo metaphysicians to assure everyone that nothing will happen that was unexpected.

All you have to do is look at the ptb's calendar of events and figure out when and what they are going to do. It's not exactly occult or hidden knowledge like Drake suggests. I have one sitting in my backyard you are welcome to stare at it all you want.

A legion of people making predictions so that no one will have that utterly fearful notion that something might happen that is out of their control. Hello you don't have any control in the first place...lol.

You can't even manage yourself but you think you have control over something else. Who is the ostrich again?

Now the sheeple are caught in the insurance game. You can't get out of it. The moment you gave up responsibility you gave up your power. Then you have to pay for it. Responsibility only means the ABILITY to respond to something. Not metaphysics, how one responds to any given situation.

So you think responsiblity is metaphysics so that just shows me how far gone the sheep are. Still not my problem. Its your choice.

Metaphysics occurs only AFTER self management is undertaken. Not before. It occurs afterwards. You can't express yourself on a metaphysical level then you have no self management. That's your problem.

You're trying to make it my problem and I'm just saying No. Not my problem its YOUR problem. I Know what my problems are, you don't know what yours is and its actually YOU.

It's easier to blame 'them', right?





That is because you are agreeing they are real. It's just how energy works. Your basic level energy practitioner would tell you that.

Everytime you pay your taxes you are agreeing they are real.

Everytime you see a doctor you are agreeing they are real.

Everytime you pay a traffic ticket you are agreeing they are real.

Everytime you say they are real , they become real to you. So of course they can affect you!

Everytime you play follow the leader you are agreeing they are real.

You are creating your situation. And you expect me to agree with it. I am not agreeing to your prison that you are making for yourself.

Why should I?

It's YOUR situation. You think they are real and I know they are not. It's not my problem you think they are real; I didn't make you think they were real.

I don't have to agree to it. Its just emphasizing you are deciding to be unreal right along with them. That's your choice. My failing is is not understanding you don't have an alternative. I observe you don't because as much as people bitch and complain about the system they still keep agreeing to it.

Then go on some irate tirade when I simply say, Stop agreeing with the system. Fighting with the system just acknowledges its real, and accepting it acknowledges it's real. Changing the matrix just re-enforces that it's real.

When you stop building their system things should change for you. It's inevitable.

Of course they come to my door, I've had attempts made on my life. So what. Some unreal entity posing as human comes to my door. So? It' s a matrix world I should not expect I should run across some programmed mind periodically (well...24/7). They're not real. I remember what is real and they just go away. Because they aren't real. I'm no threat to them anyway, they KNOW you want a system and won't accept anything I say so why should they be offended by me?

You may not have a common frame of reference between what is real and not real. If you have only ever known and accepted is the programs, the systems and the matrixs how would YOU know what reality is?




They are quite real. They simply did not blast open our homes, kill our families, and leave depleted uranium in their wake - in our own little world (yet), so, we can act as if they don't exist, that they have no power.

There are a very small number of people on the planet that are self empowered. It is folly to believe they will all magically leap there (ascension?) and so the vast vast vast percentage of people and animals and plants on this planet need protection from the psychopathic monsters that rule the world. When they get to your neighborhood, and your door, it will seem more real.

Dennis

How does this differ from the "ostrich" viewpoint with head in the sand?

I am not talking about metaphysics or the realm of oneness. Once the conversation shifts to that, of course, there is only one, all else is illusion. With that viewpoint, it is hypocritically silly to be on an online forum, discussing with "others" that do not exist.

Me, sticking my fingers in my ears, closing my eyes, and making noise so I cannot hear anything but the noise does nothing to slow down or stop the genocide and ecocide that is going on. Me saying , "not my problem", is selfish and infantile, not enlightened. The quadrillions of life forms on this planet suffering in the pollution of mankind, directed by a few atop a pyramid of power, did not choose to be disempowered. They need a champion, a warrior - not someone with their eyes closed and their ears plugged. Is there truth in those words, or is it simply my illusion? If there is truth, then add in the billions of sentient creatures on this planet that need the assistance and the protection of the enlightened warriors. Hopefully, someday, they will each be in a position where they can choose between empowerment and disempowerment, and hopefullly they will choose wisely. For now, they are starving, poisoned, imprisoned (the "real" prisons, with metal bars), sick, and dying.

Dennis

¤=[Post Update]=¤

I'm not closing my eyes, I'm more aware of what is bothering you than you are.

Which is you.

[Maia Gabrial]

I found his "jew york times" pun to be in bad taste.

I guess he can say it because he is one....

[Mozart]

I don't have to agree to it. Its just emphasizing you are deciding to be unreal right along with them. That's your choice. My failing is is not understanding you don't have an alternative. I observe you don't because as much as people bitch and complain about the system they still keep agreeing to it.




9eagle9, judging from your "about me" info, it looks like that you'd be a really fun mate to hang out with in nature, in the forests, hiking, camping, fishing, etc.


I'm a retired forest ecologist and I totally love nature. She's (nature) far more real than any of these artificial 'laws' and systems of 'laws' that we create / allow to "govern" us, i.e., harass, tax, arrest, etc, us to death, yes?


Anyway, 9eagle9, do you:

1) Have a driver license?

2) Have a Social Security number?

3) Turned in 1040 Label IRS tax forms?

4) Registered to vote?

5) Accept snail mail at an address?

6) Have a birth cert?


This is a super-shortened list of the numerous traps into the existing, artificial system of 'laws' that has been allowed to spring into artificial existence via the ignorance of the stupid peons and the deceptive practices of the dark bastard elites. A longer list would have dozens of traps.


~Mozart

[Kimberley]

For awhile now, people have been mocking his credibility, but it's only a matter of time when we'll see if he's been telling the truth....

I just want to add, IMHO, I feel that Ben is always telling the "truth" to the best of his discernment of information. The important thing to remember is I personally have believed information that was not correct and that was correct... and I bet that happens for all of us...

Ben & I and many others are all doing our best to filter what resonates true for us or not... we all have different filters. I personally get it "right" for me 95% of the time, however it took 4 decades for me to trust my own inner knowing and then I still get it incorrectly 5% of the time.

So yes I agree time will tell... and I suggest we stop shooting the messengers trying their best to share to the best of their discernment "THE TRUTH"

There are so many of us doing our best to filter through the information being sent to us here in the information age.... It is a lot to keep up with , and I so thank all of us that are filtering through all of the information and sharing what feels to have validity...

Keep on keepin on my dear friends in Avalon!!!

Much love!!

[crosby]

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?44572-ARREST-WARRANTS-Liens-Filed-Against-G7-Central-Banks

interesting information just now coming through. thought you all might be interested to see.
regards, corson

[9eagle9]

I have all of those someplace or the other. The point is transcending paper articles of the systems existance not using them to establish a cause for the reality of the system. You do that willfuly instead of assigning them a value of being what they are. Meaningless. What do those articles have to do with me?

Why would I willfully hide or alter or remove myself of documents that someone else imposed on me ? I didn't do anything wrong so why should I hide? Its just something the system labeled me as much as you just did, by assumption.

Having a social security card is not that much of an impediment if one one is not paying SS taxes. What would I pay them with?

Therefore its a peice of paper not a levy, a leverage or an admission of debt. Because I am so little effected by paper why would I spend the time and effort it takes to divest myself of documentation that was imposed on me well before the age of consent, or even before my conscious recall?

So is a birth certificate. A piece of paper is not me. I made no admission on the birth certificate, it has nothing to do with me. So why should I invest into any of those articles as if they if had anything to do with me. Someone else labeled me with those articles, so they are meaningless to me. Detachment. It's all about your feelings.

There is a vast difference between the person holding a SS card and paying into it's tax system and someone with a SS card who is not.

Who is the ostrich there?

They apparently have some meaning for you? Yes because you think the system has a power , it only has the power you give it.

However people willfully pay health and auto insurance everyday as it had anything to do with them. Willfully. Not because the state makes them. or because the state in a third party way gave them another identification. You identity with those documents? Yes? you are self identified with them and percieve that I am.

You pay health insurance so the state is insured that you remain a healthy slave, not for your health. You pay the state auto insurance to make the state feel better as you drive it's cars around. As far as I'm concerned the state can pay for both since they 'think' they own my body, and they know they own my car.

There's a big difference by being identified with the state and paying the state to do so.

I could tediously remove myself from all those 'seeming' impediments, but its easier to simply transcend them. With today's technology and paper trails no one can hide so what is the point. In spite of the fact the ptb found me in a way that had nothing to do with the above listed articles, anyway , there is no point to hiding. You are just making another system for yourself in doing so.

Even claiming UCC 1 and 3 status and removing yourself from your strawman leaves a paper trail. They will find you anyway.

The point is ...why should they?

Even people who assume false identities are still not claiming their own identity and then spend years in hiding.

'They' hide out in the open why shouldn't I.

Its not my strawman. It's theirs, I didn't create him.

Divesting myself of those all those meaningless documents emphasizes how real they are. They have nothing to do with me.

How are they important to you?

Recently I had to try to cases in court on my own without legal (system) representation. those documents were never mentioned, I didn't need them , the SYSTEM needs them. SO the system tries me in a court of law, I could have stuck anyone in there to take my place, but no one can dismantle the system the way I do. No one can make a declaration of innocence for myself but me.

No one even asked who I was. I was never even asked to identify myself, so apparently they already knew who I was. Or maybe they didn't know, who knows. It didn't make a difference. I showed up in a court as responsdent, I responded, pointed out the systems own evidence against me and used that evidence against the system. I identified there was a system in place and it had nothing to do with me. They called me a defendant but what I am defending if they are providing in all their evidence against me, a statement of evidence that I wasn't the guilty party. Of course I'm not. Their labeling systems don't make me guilty, they don't 'make me' anything other than what I am.

The system provides its own evidence of my innocence. That's all. I know how to look for it, I notice everything about the system.

Do you?

I can track myself, at all times I know where I am at. It's their tracking devices let them entertain themeslves with it. They've tried, they've failed, rinse repeat rinse repeat.

Nothing is private in the physical or non physical so what is the point in hiding. Because it makes you feel like you are doing something but all you are doing is acknowledging the system is real for you.

As you have re-emphasized here.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

All articles save for the 1040 label.

My name isn't 1040 system or otherwise.

[Avocadess]

I would add to Mozart's list:

7) Filled out a Census form with more than the number of people in your household?

[KiwiElf]

Yes, it will be hard in some ways -- but a joy more than anything. And by the way, I do NOT think of Drake as a "savior" or even a "leader" beyond the fact that he has shown leadership capabilities and is a natural leader. What he is right now is a spokesman for what I consider to be the CREAM of humanity that are using their brains, wits and courage to free humanity while knowingly risking their lives to do so. And I cannot thank them enough.

And this paragraph is the CREAM of complete deluded thinking, at best, and plain stupidity, at worst. Your definition of leadership qualities and the cream of humanity is quite astonishing (plus your understanding of brain, wits, courage and knowingly risking his life to free humanity), but not exceptional. By the way, I did listen to Drake and soon after that first interview realised that in order to keep listening would require me to switch off more than 50% of my thinking abilities. I don't do that for anyone.

Oh, by the way, I am part of humanity and I don't want (and most certainly do not need) deluded people like this saving me or freeing me from anything at all.

On that very rude note, I leave Drake material and suggest that you form a private group on this forum for Drake groupies. If you put something on a public thread then you can expect public responses.

That is your opinion SDV - NOT FACT - and perhaps why you - and other like-minded people - miss out on so much - you only read/listen/see 50 % of the information. ;)

[Mozart]

No one even asked who I was. I was never even asked to identify myself, so apparently they already knew who I was. Or maybe they didn't know, who knows. It didn't make a difference. I showed up in a court as responsdent, I responded, pointed out the systems own evidence against me and used that evidence against the system. I identified there was a system in place and it had nothing to do with me. They called me a defendant




With regards to the bold, underlined part, You Go Girl; you did that right and I commend you for doing that.


Yes, the system has only to do with the strawman and nothing to do with the living, breathing Woman on the Land that you are, so you got it right, 9eagle9.


I've had knock-down, drag-out court battles with the local courts to the point which they banned me from the courtrooms, and somehow, they never did issue another ticket to me in a 4 cop stops, at each one I pretended to not have an ID on hand, nor any of the required insurance proof.


I only told them the nom de guerre, strawman name that they think that is me, then they'd see the data on their computers and it all matches up with the horseless carriage license plate, photo on the ID, etc, so they'd come back and wish me a good day, along with an admonishment for me to carry ID at all times, etc.


And this with a foot-and-half long rap sheet of numerous cases and run-ins with the damn system until I figured the damn thing out, then I used the system own goddamn rules against it. And the most recent cases were insurance-related cases, so they had financial incentive to nail the strawman to the wall with ever-higher fines, yet 4 times, they just let me carry on my merry way on the roads.


I have a local friend who also is banned from the courtroom, so he is enjoying his little bit of freedom and local notoriety of having a rep of being the first one to stand up to the system and use their own rules against them.


~Mozart

[Seikou-Kishi]

I would add to Mozart's list:

7) Filled out a Census form with more than the number of people in your household?

Do alter egos count? 'Cos there's a Seikou Kishi living in my place ;-)

"Dear Census compilers. Before I sat down to fill out your lovely form, I asked myself who I was going to be today. Unfortunately for you, I chose the me who's only half lucid at the best of times, and when he is it's all devoted to defiance, but let me tell you about this caring side I have..." lol

[tenacity1]

cynicism can become a cancer that sometimes breeds complacency. It isn't for me to say what will or won't happen down the road. My gut guides me not others words or websites. I have hope . That's all I can say without wading into a time consuming debate about "Drake ". my prayers are for their success, yet I do not see them nor anyone as "saving me" nor the world. It will take us all treating each other with empathy, kindness and respect to save the world from the horrible conditioning we've been exposed to for so long.
. If the "offline" debate is anything like the online debate, then we need another person like Rodney King to stand up and say "can't we all get along?" There is so much that needs to be done in the world.. whenever I see folks argue about a new fact or a new person... I can't help but wonder if technology hasn't given us almost "too much information." and many folks are suffering from a propensity to sit behind their screens for too long.(no offense intended...just pondering out loud)
It's natural to want to see positive change, that's all I want and all I will say about this whole "he's not all that and yes he is all that" debate. Time will tell. I'm patient.

[9eagle9]

I didn't fill out my census form.


I would add to Mozart's list:

7) Filled out a Census form with more than the number of people in your household?

[9eagle9]

Kindness doesn't remove programming though. Removing programming gets rid of the programming. People choose not to, and I choose not to follow where their programming leads them. This causes great unhappiness...in them.

They demand a response but won't give one of their own. I asked very important question that no one will answer. If you have know nothing but programming and matrixs how would you know what reality is.

No one will answer. That speaks volumes.

People who are least condition able are not popular people. There is no enticement for empowerment.

Definitely the internet provides that all to well known "having a little knowledge' about one zillion topics. A lot of it is hear-say.

Seldom do I see people asking questions but lurching right into a defense. 'The fear that someone may be correct about their hero' is broadcast hither and yon. Okay I know they are afraid. If we didn't glom onto heroes we'd not have anything to defend.

Offline I've never seen anyone get their knickers in a wad about me not agreeing with them the way I see it here. Disagreements tend to provide a resolution between two authorities on any given topic. There is a mutual respect and understanding that the other party knows what they are talking about enough to disagree to the point where all disagreements are exhausted and what is left is the resolution.

When I see that component in play I know that a self gratification patch is being sought and not a solution. It's a power struggle, from disempowered people. Kindness doesn't fix that, empowerment fixes dis empowerment.

Another person cannot empower you, only you can empower you. Otherwise you are just left with a 'feeling' of empowerment.


Oneness programming has crippled people. It's programmed them to think they should all be on the same band wagon and agreement is "Unity".

Dis-empowered people have no authority, so don't like disagreement, its another program, as if levering a 'yes' out of someone somehow gives them authority. It doesn't. No one can give you empowerment but you.

If there was true intention for change here instead of what I'm observing then it would be different.

People want someone to lead them instead of doing for themselves. So they got what they wanted. Over and over again. With agreement. The reset button clearly demonstrates people want to do this all over again.

Just more programming at work not a real solution.

I've not seen any Drake's adherents approach this with a intent towards resolution but with programmed responses, the same responses I seen with the last four flavors of the month.




cynicism can become a cancer that sometimes breeds complacency. It isn't for me to say what will or won't happen down the road. My gut guides me not others words or websites. I have hope . That's all I can say without wading into a time consuming debate about "Drake ". my prayers are for their success, yet I do not see them nor anyone as "saving me" nor the world. It will take us all treating each other with empathy, kindness and respect to save the world from the horrible conditioning we've been exposed to for so long.
. If the "offline" debate is anything like the online debate, then we need another person like Rodney King to stand up and say "can't we all get along?" There is so much that needs to be done in the world.. whenever I see folks argue about a new fact or a new person... I can't help but wonder if technology hasn't given us almost "too much information." and many folks are suffering from a propensity to sit behind their screens for too long.(no offense intended...just pondering out loud)
It's natural to want to see positive change, that's all I want and all I will say about this whole "he's not all that and yes he is all that" debate. Time will tell. I'm patient.

[Avocadess]

9eagle9: I cannot speak for others, but for myself I believe I was able to undo a lot of programming (at least, lessen its grip on me considerably) by the many hours of meditation I did over a period of 30 years, ending with several years of 2-3 hours of meditation daily. Just "seeing" the light within, "hearing" the music within, "feeling" the primordial vibration within. I learned to watch my own thoughts float by as if clouds in the sky (rather than identifying thoughts as being "me"). I do not believe this is the ONLY way; but I do believe that for me it helped, and a lot.

[9eagle9]

Meditation doesn't remove programming on it's own. It's a passive practice. Meditation on it's own is seldom overtly helpful unless one engages in 8 hours of meditation a day over a course of several decades. The practice of mediation was assumed by gurus in the east who lived in monasteries in the East and did just that. Meditated all day long and in doing so mastered their own mind.

Brain entrainment can produce the sorts of results that mediation is supposed to promise and in a fraction of a time but one has to be careful to make sure there aren't undesireable subliminal programs in the entrainments.

One has to impose enough pressure on the consciousness so that awareness can break through. There is an obvious separation felt. One feels not a divided mind but knows the mind itself is a program. Meditation is silencing the mind, one is simply idling the program for a while. Meditation better serves those who have wrought separation, they listen to awareness rather than the mind. Those who can make this separation move between the mind and awareness. Thinking and knowing. If you know something you don't have to think or meditate on it.


I would say the American lifestyle doesn't allow for 8 hours of meditation a day.. While I'm not knocking the value of meditation, it is a barely a scratch on the brick wall of social , familial, cultural and religious programming that has had opportunity to implant itself and be re-enforced in our psyche for thousands of years. We think we are going to remove thousands of years of programming in a few years?We again deluding ourselves. We aren't talking about just this lifetime, we are talking about A LONG TIME of program removal. There are fast ways to do it. But they are not easy, or blissful, they are releasing implanted dense energy and it hurts.


Program removal from this lifetime opens one up to the programming of other lifetimes. One eventually is able to observe the 'shared' psyche wounds that we experienced collectively as humans. That is the place we all collectively need to go to. But we aren't going to go there if we have deluded ourselves into 'thinking' we are deprogrammed. We havent' sufficiently deprogrammed ourselves of this life time enough to find our shared wounds. This delusion is auto-hypnosis. Which is not awareness.

Meditation is often accompanied by scripts--programming. One enters a light meditative state while reading. Reading a script. One enters a meditative state by watching an absorbing show composed around scripts.

Programming is composed around language. That is why a de-programmer can read other's like a book.

De-programming is aggressive, and often painful removal of implanted thoughts and emotions. Not drifting in blissful meditation. Seeing the light within is often a program. De programming isn't removed with light, it allows light to express. False light (dark light) runs along emotional fields. Light (less dense) doesn't create feelings. One's vibrational state remains high and steady regardless of what 'mood' they are in.

Implanted thoughts are archonic thoghts, they assume authority over you. When the archonic entities (ptb) that try to rule this planet found that implanted thoughts were an ideal way to rule a vast population they began a series of physical implants.

Programming speaks for itself ; its self evident. To someone entrenched in programming the subconscious speaks. No one can hide their programming, it can only be hidden if everyone is programmed. To a de-programmer or someone actively engaged in de-programming another's programming is entirely evidential and can be read like a book.

The 'idea' that we have removed our programming is a program itself. De-programmers know that they have to check for programming daily. There is daily means of doing this.

The ptb are masters of psychology at a certain level. We have to be too. At other levels the ptb are just as programmed as the people they impose on.

The elite sheep can be intimidated, buttons pushed, levered and manipulated as much as the common sheep. But you have to be deprogrammed yourself in order to push their buttons because you won't even be able to see their buttons. They are the same as ours. You know their programming that gives you power over them.

I have to check for implants daily and that is by allowing awareness to monitor thinking, and I will we be doing that till the day I die. I don't delude myself into thinking I have no programming when the psyche is assaulted 24 hours a day by EM, ELF, scripts, languages, media, 24 hour a day bombardment on the psyche. Anyone who is directly engaged in the practice of de-programming and KNOW what they are talking about will say the same thing.

People spend more time defending their programming than they do removing it. That too is part of the program. That's why so many people do not answer my questions, they fear revealing their programming because the revelation of programming is attached to a punishment. Programming doesn't allow for authentic answers it promotes defense.

If one is meditating in their own wretchedness then one may be on the first riser on the riser de-programming. Because the new age movement programs people into the love and light program, feeling dense energy is discouraged as 'something is wrong with you'. That is a program. That is also a key step in removing that program. There is thought and an emotion attached to the program.

Programming is below consciousness you are not aware of your own programming until the program has been broke. That is why some few say "Examine why one reacts the way they do" behind that reaction is a program. Instead people justify the reaction, which is part of the program.

The mind isn't going to reveal to it's program, the programmed never admit to being programmed. The programs don't allow for it. The mind itself is a program. The etymology of 'mental' is a far cry from mainstream understanding of it.

You can't deprogram by yourself,you need somone else who is well versed in the psyche, the programs, and how to prompt them their removal. You can support your process of removing programs but you can't do it on your own.

Changing the slip covers on the program is just making the program appear differently, its not changing the program.

You can support your own shedding off process, but you can't initiate it on your own.

People who have removed enough programming to interact with reality. The world no longer appears the way that others see it, the world is NOT the way we were programmed to believe it was. then one observes the world for the way it really is and uses that to their advantage.

Doing this provides empowerment, the self is allowed to express from behind the wall of programming. This tends to express in one's life as evidence of self empowerment and not just a thought. Events and circumstances just happen and willfully having to direct or plan or otherwise engage in thinking, is no longer necessary. One requires money it shows up, one requires the resolution of an 'apparent' problem the problem resolves itself. There are few challenges lefts because one always knows what to do so thinking is no longer required.

One lives on a different level of reality so the things that yank the crank of the programmed don't even exist for the least conditonable. Because its a program running.

A great deal of power and authority.

There's lots of thread on de-programming. Sebastion has a great one but the few that inhabit it are ones who are engaged in their own deprogramming. The only ones attending those threads are people who are engaged in various processes of de-programming ; the programmed have little to say in there because the program will not allow one to entertain a paradigm that threatens it.

We all have been gifted with one life, and the opportunity to manage it. Instead we allow programs to manage it.

[xbusymom]

I would add to Mozart's list:

7) Filled out a Census form with more than the number of people in your household?

Do alter egos count? 'Cos there's a Seikou Kishi living in my place ;-)

"Dear Census compilers. Before I sat down to fill out your lovely form, I asked myself who I was going to be today. Unfortunately for you, I chose the me who's only half lucid at the best of times, and when he is it's all devoted to defiance, but let me tell you about this caring side I have..." lol

Sounds like a case of "Sybil"

[jorr lundstrom]

Help me out here because i have to KNOW what i'm forgiving. If these people are not doing anything to me there's nothing to forgive. (check).

These are not real people to me.

What am I forgiving them for , building another matrix that doesn't affect me anyway or..... or not being as real as the matrix they are attempting to build ?

Authentic people regardless if I agree with them or not, I know to be real. They make it known they do not want to be real and I am required to honor the choices they make for non-reality?

Forgive them for not being real?

There's a flaw in here; I want someone to find it.


Forgive them, 9e9, for they know not wot they do.


Eagle, how can anyone get to a point where he/ she knows wot he/ she

is doing if they are forgiven for their unawareness all the time.

Its like stealing the opportunity, maybe the only assets someone have.

I go for Odins view: two things are unforgiveable, unfidelity and

unawareness.

And who the hell, do I think I am if I imagine I can forgive someone

else. ROFLOL


http://i600.photobucket.com/albums/tt81/sakasvattaja/392103_10150381169286044_557751043_8760065_308197052_n.jpg



All is well


Jorr 2.0

[9eagle9]

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh....so if we continuously forgive people for their ignorance it's enabling further ignorance.


Pointing out their ignorance though is 'rudeness'...lols.

the program protects itself coming and going....lol.

[Khaleesi]

I would add to Mozart's list:

7) Filled out a Census form with more than the number of people in your household?

Actually that has nothing to do with Mozart's list. You are directly asking her if she lied by asking this.
with more than the number of people in your household? Mozart is asking about ways the system traps you. YOU are implying 9eagle9 will lie and I find that tell more about you than it does about her.

[jorr lundstrom]

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh....so if we continuously forgive people for their ignorance it's enabling further ignorance.


Pointing out their ignorance though is 'rudeness'...lols.

the program protects itself coming and going....lol.


I say, just refuse to forgive. Just dont get into that field in

peoples lives. Its each and everyones own business to find out

how to get out of the selfindused pressure. LOL

[GoodETxSG]

9eagle9: I cannot speak for others, but for myself I believe I was able to undo a lot of programming (at least, lessen its grip on me considerably) by the many hours of meditation I did over a period of 30 years, ending with several years of 2-3 hours of meditation daily. Just "seeing" the light within, "hearing" the music within, "feeling" the primordial vibration within. I learned to watch my own thoughts float by as if clouds in the sky (rather than identifying thoughts as being "me"). I do not believe this is the ONLY way; but I do believe that for me it helped, and a lot.

I totally agree, we are all basically computers upgrading our Operating Systems and rewritting code. I think many people need a Chek Disk and a Defrag! Geese, I am a geek. lol.

[the_vast_mystery]

How does it? They are after all effecting you not me.

Reminds me of a quote used by a defendant in the Nuremberg trials with regards to how he was able to work at a concentration camp and every day walk past the fence by the gas chamber as people were brutally murdered. He said "If you prick your finger, I do not bleed."


I said once i'm not talking about metaphysics and you can tune that out as much as you like. You make it clear you no concept of what I'm talking about because of your programming. Your program doesn't allow for it. It only allows for that which supports the program, not that which kills the program and the systems it runs on.

Define the program, define its exact limits and its exact form/function. Can you define the pattern in a way that does not amount to you attributing people making choices you don't like to some perceived weakness or inferiority in their inherent person?


I'm saying DITCH THE PROGRAM so you can undertand what I'm talking about. This has nothing to do with metaphysics. so you have chosen the program, let me know how that works out for you. No don't, I already know. Programs are predictable, your little reset button notion is just a means of making sure the program happens again. I'm saying no to that to. If everyone else says yes, its still not my problem.

Tell me, does you being out of the program make you immune to bullets, bombs, knives and radiation? Because if not you're just as much a part of this world as we are. If not, I fully expect to see you bench pressing a Semi-truck on video as proof of your super-personhood! ;p


You can't understand, you are NOT ABLE TO. You just keep relabeling it metaphyisics.. I don't care if you relabel "Bambi" into "Debbie does Dallas" its still the same program.

. I'm talking self empowerment. Self governance, self management. We are only affected by as much as we agree to any given system.

Governance springs from the fact that people need a framework to resolve disputes. This is why Anarchy as a philosophy only works seriously when it's presented as a smaller, minimalistic form of social government. (Anarcho-Syndicalism) which is still a government. What you're missing here is that all forms of organized social in agreement are in essence government. You cannot have people without government because having formalized agreements is exactly what enables people to come together and work towards common goals. If we all were clones then you're right, we'd all get along and we'd need no formalized agreements. But this is Earth and currently we have a very diverse population. Whether you like it or not we need a way for everyone to function effectively.

Even your ability to partially exist outside of the system is a form of formalized agreement. You probably don't realize it, but the only reason the government isn't hassling you (apologies if it is) is because it does not care about what you are doing right now. But if you were to say, stop paying taxes entirely? Yes, let's see how fast you can escape the IRS jail cell you get thrown in for doing that. It doesn't mean there still aren't ways to minimize governmental dealings and get yourself entirely self-sufficient. I applaud you for doing so, but at the end of the day you too are subject to the great equalizer of all: Goons with guns called police and military which can and will impose on you at times and unless you are ready to accept a bullet willingly you cannot maintain a stance of 100% defiance in every case.


I don't people managing my body so I don't pay health insurance and don't go to doctors. I take care of my body. Its as easy as that.
What is wrong with that exactly?

Absolutely nothing! What about people born with AIDS, who get Lupus, what about people who end up getting Ebola or Antrhax? What about people exposed to toxic waste dumped onto their land by a Mega Corporation. Unless you have some magic healing pills there are a multitude of cases where yes you will need the modern medical system unless you're willing to either accept horrible amounts of physical suffering or just kill yourself to end the pain. These people are not weak, they're just trying to make the best they can out of what options are available to handle in their situation. I'm sorry not everyone is rugged enough to go Old Yeller on a family member struck with a debilitating illness.


The reason we have insurance companies that take us up the arse is because a space was created for them. A means of insuring that no one would have take responsibility for their actions. Slaves are not responsible for themselves, their masters are. There's your programming , there's your head --not in sand--but the shoved up the master's arse.

So nothing happens to anyone accept by willing consent? No one ever is hurt by someone else forcefully attacking them? So by that logic that means that rape as a crime does not exist, since rape only exists within the mind of the victim. So yes, all those women must've been totally asking for it! if we want to go down that road -_-;;


The sheepl have so many masters they have no idea who they are serving.

Oh really, well if you know them so well then please recite all of their names and how they have enslaved the people with full detail. Give me a chart that shows this web of control.


Do you pay insurance of any sort? Then you are perpetrator to the system of insurance. You PAY them to exist. That's YOUR doing, not mine. You pay the IRS, you are paying them to keep you enslaved. Who is the ostrich here again?

Who's the Ostrich? The one who seems to ignore the fact that in many cases insurance is required by law and that if those laws are avoided then those same goons with guns will show up to force your compliance. What do you expect to happen when the police come to your door? You tell them "I'm sorry Officer, but as a sovereign citizen I chose which laws I follow!" Even if you may have some legal basis for what you say, that doesn't matter when they can and will arbitrarily throw you in jail, take your children or administer any one of an innumerable amount of punishing situations to you until you can be fit into an acceptable place within society. Even if that's as a name/number on the roster of a prison.


the first time someone rear ended another person and refused to say "Oh ****, my bad, that's all my fault, hear let me pay for that' they created a space for an insurance company to come in and make the restitution necessary to the other person because the rear -ender didn't want to take responsibility for their actions. I don't care if it was deliberate or an accident. Teh sheep do not want to be responsible, there's no self management.

Or perhaps just as much so by the first person who got into a car accident and literally was so poor they couldn't pay for damages? If people could make up for their mistakes by simply being humble, fessing up, and working a little hard to pay someone back then that'd be fine. It doesn't work though when you have a car repair bill that's five figures and you life paycheck to paycheck. Let alone hospital bills which can reach six figures. What do you expect people to do in those cases? No, you don't get to cop out of this by saying that they should figure it out for themselves. Since you are espousing everyone who doesn't follow your own form of self-determination is essentially mentally retarded then you need to define your response to a bill from an accident you didn't intend that is so expensive you could never hope to begin to pay for it. What happens if you weren't looking and rear-ended someone's family car, killing their children in back, impairing the still-surviving couple with huge medical bills and wrecking their nice new Sedan? How do you expect to pay for that?

Do you seriously think you're immune from these things? Everyone makes mistakes, everyone.


People ensure themselves that accidents don't happen. They cannot bear for anything to happen that is not programmed or expected.

What are we cutting off at the knees when we ensure ourselves that no accidents will happen. Anyone?

Accidents are ultimately unavoidable, but that doesn't mean that they cannot be reduced, nor that you can't "insure" that when they happen the cost doesn't destroy anyone's life.


Oh ****, now that space if filled with a legion of pseudo metaphysicians to assure everyone that nothing will happen that was unexpected.

All you have to do is look at the ptb's calendar of events and figure out when and what they are going to do. It's not exactly occult or hidden knowledge like Drake suggests. I have one sitting in my backyard you are welcome to stare at it all you want.

A legion of people making predictions so that no one will have that utterly fearful notion that something might happen that is out of their control. Hello you don't have any control in the first place...lol.

You can't even manage yourself but you think you have control over something else. Who is the ostrich again?

Who's the one really afraid of the unknown? The one who insists they can solve a problem or the one who insists their is no problem at all? Again, until you can choose to walk through jail cell walls, dodge bullets, and survive explosions I would contend you are the one denying reality by insisting so firmly that such things could never, ever under any circumstances happen to you. What you are forgetting is that it is impossible to make every human being on this planet adhere to your vision of community or responsibility unless you were to turn them into a horde of micro chipped zombies that all had a single mind despite being in separate bodies.

People are going to have their own ideas about how they want to live their lives, we can either treasure each person's unique individuality and do our best to provide a framework for resolving any disputes or problems or we can decide that individuality itself is an aberrant behavior and we can turn everyone into factory clones that all adhere to your dogma of "personal responsibility."


Now the sheeple are caught in the insurance game. You can't get out of it. The moment you gave up responsibility you gave up your power. Then you have to pay for it. Responsibility only means the ABILITY to respond to something. Not metaphysics, how one responds to any given situation.

Someone's responsibility does not make their (or their children's) bodies impervious to armor piercing ammunition, until it does then no one is ever free from coercion.


So you think responsiblity is metaphysics so that just shows me how far gone the sheep are. Still not my problem. Its your choice.

Metaphysics occurs only AFTER self management is undertaken. Not before. It occurs afterwards. You can't express yourself on a metaphysical level then you have no self management. That's your problem.

You're trying to make it my problem and I'm just saying No. Not my problem its YOUR problem. I Know what my problems are, you don't know what yours is and its actually YOU.

It's easier to blame 'them', right?

So if the government were to take your children and put them in a foster home, deny you all right to ever visit them until they were 18 then that's all your fault? You have no one to blame but yourself? You could never do anything that might be considered aberrant to the government that might make them decide you need to be taught a lesson?


¤=[Post Update]=¤

I'm not closing my eyes, I'm more aware of what is bothering you than you are.

Which is you.

The fact that you get so upset at all of these people and feel the need to go on the offensive about how they must be mentally retarded subservient sheeple says far more about you than you think. If you are so out of the system, and can just not be bothered by anything in the world other than the fact that people might want to work together and help one another evidences a very high level of contempt for anyone who's lacking in your own form of "Rugged Individualist Machismo!" Is Ayn Rand your Hero? ;p

[9eagle9]

Yes it makes you impervious. why I never troubled by bullets, robbery, assualt. Single female living out here in the woods where no can hear me scream. I don't even lock my doors at night. Beyond that my home is easily defensible. The "Home Alone' kid could take care of it.

I know what will happen if the unlikely event that I am attacked. The same thing that happened the few other occasions I was prompted to defend me and mine. I know precisely what will happen because its' been done before. not afraid to let my true power take care of me. I have no control over it, defense would occur regardless if I had any conscious control over it or not. I know what I am capable of because I've done it before, AFTER I brought down my programming.

People who know me know what happens on a physical and energetic level when I feel something under my custodianship is threatened.

Beyond that those circumstances just do not come to your doorstep anymore. There's nothing to defend. Doesn't hurt to be prepared but I'm not obsessed about, like I said i don't lock my doors at night.

I defined the programming further upthread.

Read it. I can't do your work for you, I can only remind you to do your work. I personally don't have an emotional investment in what happens to the sheeple. It's a pity and a shame but I am not even they are human anymore, maybe they are just lazy. But if they human potential they sure aren't doing anything to fulfill it. They don't care about themselves, yet I should? I am growing increasingly detached from their plight. Its not like they arent' given tools or access they simply don't want it preferring to remain conditioned and victims of their own psyche wounds.

I do have a response to those who could possibly be preserved. Who are few. I know there is nothing here that I can say to the brainwashed masses I am only using them as template to demonstrate my point to those who have a chance. And they know who they are. They have no problem understanding me at all. They may not agree with me but they plainly know through their own experiences not what was 'told' to them, what I am talking about.

The sheeple are just baahinig about the circumstances they are creating for themselves. It's like watching someone hit themselves in the head repeatedly iwth a hammer and whine about how it hurts, pausing only to pick another hammer expecting that something is going to change. How long do I need to watch that? Name me one good reason why I have to. The sheeple are gasping over the atrocities in the world, and afraid its going to happen to them even as they are doing it to themselves. They don't like watching what is going on the world but I should care as willfully keep enslaving themselves?

I don't. I need only to support those few that can preserved from their own assholery.

[the_vast_mystery]

Yes it makes you impervious. why I never troubled by bullets, robbery, assualt. Single female living out here in the woods where no can hear me scream. I don't even lock my doors at night. Beyond that my home is easily defensible. The "Home Alone' kid could take care of it.

I know what will happen if the unlikely event that I am attacked. The same thing that happened the few other occasions I was prompted to defend me and mine. I know precisely what will happen because its' been done before. not afraid to let my true power take care of me. I have no control over it, defense would occur regardless if I had any conscious control over it or not. I know what I am capable of because I've done it before, AFTER I brought down my programming.

People who know me know what happens on a physical and energetic level when I feel something under my custodianship is threatened.

Beyond that those circumstances just do not come to your doorstep anymore. There's nothing to defend. Doesn't hurt to be prepared but I'm not obsessed about, like I said i don't lock my doors at night.

I defined the programming further upthread.

Read it. I can't do your work for you, I can only remind you to do your work. I personally don't have an emotional investment in what happens to the sheeple. It's a pity and a shame but I am not even they are human anymore, maybe they are just lazy. But if they human potential they sure aren't doing anything to fulfill it. They don't care about themselves, yet I should? I am growing increasingly detached from their plight. Its not like they arent' given tools or access they simply don't want it preferring to remain conditioned and victims of their own psyche wounds.

I do have a response to those who could possibly be preserved. Who are few. I know there is nothing here that I can say to the brainwashed masses I am only using them as template to demonstrate my point to those who have a chance. And they know who they are. They have no problem understanding me at all. They may not agree with me but they plainly know through their own experiences not what was 'told' to them, what I am talking about.

The sheeple are just baahinig about the circumstances they are creating for themselves. It's like watching someone hit themselves in the head repeatedly iwth a hammer and whine about how it hurts, pausing only to pick another hammer expecting that something is going to change. How long do I need to watch that? Name me one good reason why I have to. The sheeple are gasping over the atrocities in the world, and afraid its going to happen to them even as they are doing it to themselves. They don't like watching what is going on the world but I should care as willfully keep enslaving themselves?

I don't. I need only to support those few that can preserved from their own assholery.

See, this is the part where I say you need to either post a video that shows you shrugging off assault rifle rounds (without a vest, you don't get to cheat and use the body armor society designed without you to say you can withstand force. Besides that armor is not 100% effective against everything) or I call a big fat BS on that bolded. Yes, you need to prove you are totally PHYSICALLY RESISTANT to man made weapons, not just that nobody would be inclined to shoot at you. Because I assure you inclination is as simple as wrong place, wrong time. So show me just how empowered you are and how useless our pathetic human weapons are against your obviously superior form...because that Ostrich? Yes, it thinks that by hiding its head in the sand protects it from Predators. (Even though it doesn't really.)

So you now need to prove you are not just shoving your head in the sand by showing us just how well protected you are against those predators. Yes, you can try to double back on what you said and throw out a bunch of wishy-washy BS about how you don't have to prove anything to me and how none of this all matters because you're some great guru here to save a few people. But, supposing you did, it would just be a plausibly deniable excuse to shield your ego from being deflated at the fact you are making impossible claims about what you are capable of. Human beings, and the human body, has its limits. It's the one set of limitations we all share, and until you demonstrate your unique and total freedom FROM all of the limits of the human body, which I have yet to see anyone observe. (Although Mas Oyama, founder of Kyokushin style karate was pretty damn close. He fought 300-men on a three-day nonstop elimination tournament and regularly went one on one with rodeo bulls, but something tells me not even he would survive being shot point blank in the head with a .50 cal round.)

[9eagle9]

No Ayn Rand is not my hero she just represents another system.

And its now different than the one the Drake Wilcocks of the world are representing. Rally them or rally around John Galt.

Look you don't understand that the world has a fading power structure taking its last gasp. It's system that has been in place for thousands of years. And the programmed, the sheep, are a PRODUCT OF THAT REIGN. You are enslaved to the same system the elite are.

You will go down with their system, they shaped you, they formed you, you serve them. it is a symbiotic relationship, you need them; they need you. You are part of their system. They are part of yours. You both need systems.

If the system that is going down as we speak goes down , you will too because you cannot FIND ANOTHER way to live.

This thread demonstrates that you cannot live without a system, your solution is to find a another system. Or put a new table cloth on the old one and call it good. Bullets are part of the old system, we are coming into a time when last bullet will be discharged and that will be it as the last of the old systems dissolves. Maybe next year, ten years, next life time but its going down.

An emerging power structure is rising, those who are learning to live without systems.

As much as you perceive the elite to be your enemy you are the actually simply the deterrent that keeps a new emerging power from rising faster, when it gains enough moment you will fall before it because it is meant to bring the systems down. and you are part of the system, you belong to the system makers. You will go down with the system.

That is what you wer e made for, you are a creation of an old system. You can't live with out it. You cannot see things any differently than what old system allows.

Nor do you want to. People keep screaming for what they don't want.

That is what you are. By choice or design, it really doesn't matter. The more the programmed sheep mill about the more they belay the rise of a power they themselves are screaming for. The moment it shown to them, they attack it with bullets. You are the enemy of everything you demand. And you wonder why it doesn't come to you.

They don't understand what it means to live without a fear of bullets or another way of resolving problems. They only know the system. They scream and demand a different sort of life and when it is expressed to them, they attack it. They try to kill it because it is NOT a system, it not familiar ot them, it is a threat. That is what their masters do therefore they must too.

Here is the program at work.

You can't see that its not a matter of dodging bullets, that is not a matter of merely the physical, but transcending the physical; its matter of never having those circumstances created around you.

Come shoot me and see what happens. You demonstrate your point, come show me your point. I'll show you what happens.

I could shoot you, but you couldn't shoot me.

[9eagle9]

That is called creating a circumstance for one's self. I didn't say I was immune to bullets, I said that one is impervious to the circumstances of that nature. Here is your programming tuning out and distorting what is actually being said because the program does not find it compatible to its chosen reality.


Donning a bullet proof vest and standing in front of ten guns and asking them to open fire on me, is called consciously creating a circumstnace to get shot.

People unconsciously create circumstances within the system to get shot.


What you have described in a rather usually sheeple programmed way is a means of creating a circumstance willfully where I would be shot. I didn't make an impossible claim I said I am not given to creating circumstances where I will be shot.

I am talking about dodging bullets, or being immune to gunshots, I am talking about not creating the ****ing circumstance in the first place.

You don't know the difference do you?

There are people who actually understand what I am saying. You however cannot. That speaks volumes.

Sorry , your programming speaks volumes.





Yes it makes you impervious. why I never troubled by bullets, robbery, assualt. Single female living out here in the woods where no can hear me scream. I don't even lock my doors at night. Beyond that my home is easily defensible. The "Home Alone' kid could take care of it.

I know what will happen if the unlikely event that I am attacked. The same thing that happened the few other occasions I was prompted to defend me and mine. I know precisely what will happen because its' been done before. not afraid to let my true power take care of me. I have no control over it, defense would occur regardless if I had any conscious control over it or not. I know what I am capable of because I've done it before, AFTER I brought down my programming.

People who know me know what happens on a physical and energetic level when I feel something under my custodianship is threatened.

Beyond that those circumstances just do not come to your doorstep anymore. There's nothing to defend. Doesn't hurt to be prepared but I'm not obsessed about, like I said i don't lock my doors at night.

I defined the programming further upthread.

Read it. I can't do your work for you, I can only remind you to do your work. I personally don't have an emotional investment in what happens to the sheeple. It's a pity and a shame but I am not even they are human anymore, maybe they are just lazy. But if they human potential they sure aren't doing anything to fulfill it. They don't care about themselves, yet I should? I am growing increasingly detached from their plight. Its not like they arent' given tools or access they simply don't want it preferring to remain conditioned and victims of their own psyche wounds.

I do have a response to those who could possibly be preserved. Who are few. I know there is nothing here that I can say to the brainwashed masses I am only using them as template to demonstrate my point to those who have a chance. And they know who they are. They have no problem understanding me at all. They may not agree with me but they plainly know through their own experiences not what was 'told' to them, what I am talking about.

The sheeple are just baahinig about the circumstances they are creating for themselves. It's like watching someone hit themselves in the head repeatedly iwth a hammer and whine about how it hurts, pausing only to pick another hammer expecting that something is going to change. How long do I need to watch that? Name me one good reason why I have to. The sheeple are gasping over the atrocities in the world, and afraid its going to happen to them even as they are doing it to themselves. They don't like watching what is going on the world but I should care as willfully keep enslaving themselves?

I don't. I need only to support those few that can preserved from their own assholery.

See, this is the part where I say you need to either post a video that shows you shrugging off assault rifle rounds (without a vest, you don't get to cheat and use the body armor society designed without you to say you can withstand force. Besides that armor is not 100% effective against everything) or I call a big fat BS on that bolded. Yes, you need to prove you are totally PHYSICALLY RESISTANT to man made weapons, not just that nobody would be inclined to shoot at you. Because I assure you inclination is as simple as wrong place, wrong time. So show me just how empowered you are and how useless our pathetic human weapons are against your obviously superior form...because that Ostrich? Yes, it thinks that by hiding its head in the sand protects it from Predators. (Even though it doesn't really.)

So you now need to prove you are not just shoving your head in the sand by showing us just how well protected you are against those predators. Yes, you can try to double back on what you said and throw out a bunch of wishy-washy BS about how you don't have to prove anything to me and how none of this all matters because you're some great guru here to save a few people. But, supposing you did, it would just be a plausibly deniable excuse to shield your ego from being deflated at the fact you are making impossible claims about what you are capable of. Human beings, and the human body, has its limits. It's the one set of limitations we all share, and until you demonstrate your unique and total freedom FROM all of the limits of the human body, which I have yet to see anyone observe. (Although Mas Oyama, founder of Kyokushin style karate was pretty damn close. He fought 300-men on a three-day nonstop elimination tournament and regularly went one on one with rodeo bulls, but something tells me not even he would survive being shot point blank in the head with a .50 cal round.)

[9eagle9]

I find this an extraordinary conversation given the dream I had this morning. After talking to Unified Serenity about guns last night, I have this dream this morning where I am standing with a woman who wants to see my gun. So I pull it out of my holster, promptly drop it , it discharges into my ankle.<<<<that is my reality right there, I can easily not have ever shoot me but I can easily see me shooting myself.

My first thought is Wow I'm glad the bullet didn't strike the woman. Then my foot is swelling and blood is pumping into my boot, but there's no pain.

So I am rushed to a doctor who looks at my foot and says, there's nothing wrong with you. And there wasn't.

I assumed I had this dream because I spent a goodish portion of my pre bedtime hour discussing guns, maybe not. Maybe its a little deeper than that.

So hey you know what maybe I am immune to bullets. But I'm not going to consciously create the circumstance to test that theory. I uncounsiously created the circumstances to where that would not occur at all. It suffices I don't consciously create circumstances that put me in physical harm. That is part of the system programming.

There are all sorts of bullets in the system. Cancer, lethal diseases, people trancend those bullets all the time. Not a lot of them but enough to show a new power is rising. it's not coming from anyplace external its come inside certain people.

[Bill Ryan]

Excellent post, Dennis Leahy! Those "debunking" Drake are either disinfo agents or brainwashed fools who don't realize that if mass arrests don't happen, we obviously can't win our freedom. It's far worse to not even try than try and fail. If we don't try, we automatically fail anyway!

This very unintelligent response begs the question:

What are you, personally, "trying" to do -- that you might "fail" at?

It looks like you're posting on a forum... and that's all.

:)

Do you see? My guess is that you're doing nothing at all beyond being an armchair cheerleader for someone else's wishful thinking (or delusion -- take your pick). Please realize that this is not helping the world in any way.

[I might add that I raise my eyebrows a little at being called a disinfo agent or a brainwashed fool! Neither could be further from any truth. I suspect that one or two other members may also bridle just a fraction at this.]

[Christine]

Excellent post, Dennis Leahy! Those "debunking" Drake are either disinfo agents or brainwashed fools who don't realize that if mass arrests don't happen, we obviously can't win our freedom. It's far worse to not even try than try and fail. If we don't try, we automatically fail anyway!

I am confused here by this train of thought. What do you mean by "It's far worse to not even try than try and fail."?

Do you mean that those who BELIEVE what Drake is saying are taking part in making the supposed mass arrests happen and those who don't BELIEVE are some how detaining this event?

What type of fairy tale is this? Is it just a matter of what one chooses to believe that forms our reality?

We ALL have a responsibility to do the Work that is necessary to change our shared reality... belief has very little to do with it and is in the realm of the manipulators.

[ulli]

9eagle9 said this and I'm reposting it so it doesn't get lost:


You cannot have people without government because having formalized agreements
is exactly what enables people to come together and work towards common goals.

[the_vast_mystery]

No Ayn Rand is not my hero she just represents another system.

And its now different than the one the Drake Wilcocks of the world are representing. Rally them or rally around John Galt.

Have you ever really read into Objectivism as a philosophy? You might actually like it. It sounds about right up your alley, it's all about personal responsibility and each person being solely responsible for their own happiness (or lack thereof.) It just entirely leaves out that part where you should care anything about what happens to other human beings that most of us recognize as empathy. If you really are all about people being responsible for themselves even at cost to others then you're going to need to do a lot more philosophical gymnastics to suggest that you aren't basically espousing a re-labeled form of Rand's Objectivism.


Look you don't understand that the world has a fading power structure taking its last gasp. It's system that has been in place for thousands of years. And the programmed, the sheep, are a PRODUCT OF THAT REIGN. You are enslaved to the same system the elite are.

You will go down with their system, they shaped you, they formed you, you serve them. it is a symbiotic relationship, you need them; they need you. You are part of their system. They are part of yours. You both need systems.

If the system that is going down as we speak goes down , you will too because you cannot FIND ANOTHER way to live.

See, this is the philosophy showing right here. It's this idea of "You morons are getting what's coming to you, ha ha! I'm prepared, you're all going to die and I'll be safe and secure." That smug "every person for themselves" attitude which shuns the idea that there ever might be something more valuable to each person beyond how much manual labor they can do in a day.


This thread demonstrates that you cannot live without a system, your solution is to find a another system. Or put a new table cloth on the old one and call it good. Bullets are part of the old system, we are coming into a time when last bullet will be discharged and that will be it as the last of the old systems dissolves. Maybe next year, ten years, next life time but its going down.

Excuse me, which miraculous new technology have you acquired that makes you immune to bullets? I say again, there is far, far more ammunition out there in circulation than there are people to shoot with it. Unless you expect to physically neutralize all bullets or guns then you have not removed them from the system. You've insisted that since you don't see them they are no longer a part of your reality. The flaw being that you somehow believe you can isolate yourself from the physical world.


An emerging power structure is rising, those who are learning to live without systems.

Digestive system? Endocrine System? Repository System? Reproductive System? You're saying you can live without any of these? Gee whizz! I'd love to see an MRI of your brain seeing as it somehow manages to work in the total absence of any and all forms of neural networking that makes the normal human brain capable of functioning. A system is merely an ordered way of doing things, you cannot live without any and all forms of ordering or your body would not be able to function. Similarly no society may function without some form of order even if it's a minimal one. This is the essence of government, no large group of people can live without some kind of system unless they were all mindless clones of one another. It's just not possible because eventually there will always be disputes between people who have vastly different interests or beliefs and a framework for making sure those conflicts are resolved becomes necessary.


As much as you perceive the elite to be your enemy you are the actually simply the deterrent that keeps a new emerging power from rising faster, when it gains enough moment you will fall before it because it is meant to bring the systems down. and you are part of the system, you belong to the system makers. You will go down with the system.

That is what you wer e made for, you are a creation of an old system. You can't live with out it. You cannot see things any differently than what old system allows.

Seems more like this is what you want to be the case considering how much you laugh at the idea of people being faced with inevitable death in such a scenario. If you really felt like it was an unfortunate but natural phenomena you could not change then you wouldn't be so angry or resentful over it nor seem to take a sense of enjoyment from the idea that you're going to be the king of the hill when it's all over and everyone else is all dead. That sounds more like someone who got hurt pretty badly and is secretly seeking revenge by trying to find a way to rise above the people who attacked you so that you can claim some "moral high ground." Hint: If you have to think about how you can claim the moral high ground then you don't have it. ;p


Nor do you want to. People keep screaming for what they don't want.

I know! Things like rape, murder, theft, and fraud! bunch of whiners! Those 11 year old girls in certain Asian countries who get kidnapped and traded as sex slaves should just chose not to get kidnapped! It was totally their fault! Just like how all those whiners in Japan should just chose not to get radiation poisoning! If they can't handle the radiation they should've just chosen not to be born! ;p


That is what you are. By choice or design, it really doesn't matter. The more the programmed sheep mill about the more they belay the rise of a power they themselves are screaming for. The moment it shown to them, they attack it with bullets. You are the enemy of everything you demand. And you wonder why it doesn't come to you.

I demand complete and total physical resistance to all forms of bodily damage, because anything less would be utterly foolish. Do you think for a moment you have any real power? If you did you wouldn't be here making forum posts on the internet with a bunch of random people talking about how invulnerable to harm your personal philosophy makes you. You would be being recruited, actively, by the government or source only knows whom else. People would want your power for their own. The fact that instead, we are having a casual discussion about how since apparently nobody's tried to rob you at gunpoint or burglarize your home that it will never happen indicates quite the contrary. We're both just a bunch of sideline characters on the internet having fun wasting our time figuring out what this world all means.


They don't understand what it means to live without a fear of bullets or another way of resolving problems. They only know the system. They scream and demand a different sort of life and when it is expressed to them, they attack it. They try to kill it because it is NOT a system, it not familiar ot them, it is a threat. That is what their masters do therefore they must too.

Here's a hint: if your philosophy cannot exist in a world where there are many powerful people with guns who may decide they arbitrarily want to use their armarments to take what you own then your philosophy has already failed to take reality into consideration. That doesn't mean it even needs to be violent, but since you've already decided that as we're apparently mentally deficient we should all be left to ourselves to die I don't think you have any nonviolent solutions available to you. Starving people will do whatever they can to eat, and if you make their situation dire by laughing at it, well you can certainly guess who's food they'll be eying first (unless they find an easier source.)


Here is the program at work.

You can't see that its not a matter of dodging bullets, that is not a matter of merely the physical, but transcending the physical; its matter of never having those circumstances created around you.

Come shoot me and see what happens. You demonstrate your point, come show me your point. I'll show you what happens.

I could shoot you, but you couldn't shoot me.

I don't have to come shoot you nor even try. The entire fact that you had to walk back on that point was all I ever needed you to do. ;) You claim you are invulnerable and yet when I asked for proof you just so conveniently did exactly what I said (even after I said it was exactly what you would do, wow! you should try reading my posts more closely next time! ;p), you doubled back on your word and attempted to redefine your concept of invulnerability so that you could manage to keep from having to defend the claim that you are invulnerable. You're not, you're just some silly person posting on the internet about their personal responsibility fetish. If you were invulnerable you could conclusively prove it, you have not and then attempted to very cleverly redefine your terminology so as to try and poorly shift the burden of proof to me. But as I was not the one claiming invulnerability I don't have to prove anything beyond showing situations where you would be totally defenseless.

The default state of things though, is that no human is invulnerable and as you are now claiming said invulnerability the responsibility is on you to prove exactly how you are invulnerable. I asked you to show how you can easily render guns, knives, bombs and radiation useless with your body alone, as that would prove that nothing would harm you and instead you are now trying to state that you have "magical protection" from situations which cause harm. This is laughable, there are many many people who believe very firmly in the power of prayer and yet mountains of these faith-healers lose children to diseases that could've been cured with some modern medicine. Their prayer didn't save them when a simple bit of medicine would. There are countless cases both historical and modern of people dogmatically believing that their God of choice or philosophy would deliver them from all harm and countless recorded results of those people meeting their untimely ends. It's a lot like how when you're drunk you think you're a better driver, but you're actually doing worse. In this case though you think your dogma makes you immune from bad situations, when in fact all it's done is made you more confident about your ability to responsibly handle situations. Kudos to you!

But one day all too soon, if you keep that attitude you're going to be faced with a situation entirely out of your control that will make you realize that it is impossible to control for every factor while on this green earth and when that happens you will be quite ill prepared, as with that attitude I don't think you're going to get much help from anyone else with your problems when you spent so long saying all you ever needed was yourself.

[Avocadess]

Well, whether it is Bill or someone he trusts to post for him, I find his comments on several threads to be an effort to bully people like myself to get OFF this forum altogether so people can talk about the world the way HE sees it. Not that he has spoken more forcefully than the average poster -- but it IS his forum after all, and I really do NOT care to stay anywhere I am unwelcome -- even online -- when the host himself is putting me down.

I guess I'll have to exit now. Anyone who wants to see what I'm posting about Drake, et al. -- I'm easy enough to find. I may just get more active on my blog or "Door #2" on Avocadess.com and bid you all a fond farewell. (Well, I can't say I've been fond of ALL of those here, but I don't hold any grudges either. I'd rather "travel light.")

Wishing you all the best.

I'm sorry this did not turn out to be a good place to share my passion, but any actor on the stage can feeling it when they are getting "the hook" and I'd rather just bow out now.

Best wishes to you, Bill. I totally disagree with you, man, but I do appreciate all the work you have done in the past and wish you the best. Thanks for making this forum available. It was an awful lot of fun for a while.

(NOTE: Please no one bother to PM me. I doubt I'll be back to check.)

[9eagle9]

If you read my posts instead of having programming re-translate it for you, you will find I never said such a thing.

However I understand you unable to read what was actually said before your programming re-translates it.

Putting words in my mouth does not help make you right. It makes you look like programmed, cognitively challenged sheep.

You are creating a straw man argument and you have an audience who is observing you doing this.

You do not become impervious by using just your body; you become impervious by letting go of your mind.

I don't need people like you. I need people like me.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

It's this idea of "You morons are getting what's coming to you, ha ha! I'm prepared, you're all going to die and I'll be safe and secure.

No its you moron's are getting what you are ASKING for. Another system.

[the_vast_mystery]

If you read my posts instead of having programming re-translate it for you, you will find I never said such a thing.

However I understand you unable to read what was actually said before your programming re-translates it.

Putting words in my mouth does not help make you right. It makes you look like programmed, cognitively challenged sheep.

You are creating a straw man argument and you have an audience who is observing you doing this.

You do not become impervious by using just your body; you become impervious by letting go of your mind.

I don't need people like you. I need people like me.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

It's this idea of "You morons are getting what's coming to you, ha ha! I'm prepared, you're all going to die and I'll be safe and secure.

No its you moron's are getting what you are ASKING for. Another system.

You can't demonstrate how you are immune to/from anything. You are just saying that you "are;" I've presented countless situations where any normal human would be overwhelmed and you've done nothing but rebut "That'd never happen to me!" without putting in the most important part...the why. If you can't even explain how your miraculous power works to prevent people from being affected by others' situations when we all still share this same green Earth then that shows a reality deficit in your thinking. Because I can keep spinning out more and more circumstances where of no fault of your own, someone else's problem can spill over into your life. Because since we all share this planet, what happens to one of us happens to all of us in some fashion.

But yes, go accuse me of not understanding your arguments. Just say I have a reading deficit, you picked that one up from my last post. You really do learn quickly! ;)
You could try to address my actual argument, which was that you alone have not sufficiently proven that you can keep other people from entering your world and affecting your life against your wishes. But something tells me you won't, because that's a losing argument. Please though, prove me wrong, this is fun! :D

P.S.: The fact you had to ignore my each and every argument using rape scenarios is not a good omen. Because going by your philosophy if I overpower you physically I have apparently earned the right, and you consented by the sheer fact that you weren't physically strong or well armed enough to fend me off. Otherwise you would have to admit that yes, there are cases where someone can force themselves on you against your wishes and violate your person.

Can you even try to address that one? surprise me! ;)

[9eagle9]

Objectivism leaves out one part. You can be responsible for yourself and I know that victims just HATE that having any part in creating their situation. What objectivism doesn't state is that you can be responsible for yourself and still help others--but only those who are willing to be responsible for themselves.

The ability to look at things objectively instead of subjectively. I am not the subject of what is occurring, I am the observer.

People who are emotional basket cases cannot look at anything objectively.

Those who don't want to be responsible for themselves are just vampires. They attempt to turn each other into victims of servitude. Service to others turns into servitude to others. Why serve a sheep when you can help a lion?

And Drake and Company has done what for starving people lately?

I see stories of rape and abduction and even brainwash victims on this forum daily that took control of their situation at least enough to publish their experiences. .
Primarily being ignorant of what is occurring in the world is what caused their circumstances. Being influenced by someone 'appearing' to look out for their own good. Sound familiar? Remaining ignorant and trusting the wrong people. They had nothing to do with their circumstances. How did they save themselves. By becoming objective about it.

Everyone creates their own circumstances out of ignorance. As you are demonstrating you can't help them fix that.

The entire fact that you had to walk back on that point was all I ever needed you to do.

Your failure to comprehend what I am talking about doesn't mean I'm wrong, it means you are unable to comprehend what I'm talking about.

So have misunderstood what I said, and now are foolishly using what I didn't say as means of supporting your agreement which further demonstrates how programmed you are. Programmed people provide their own evidence.

I asked you to show how you can easily render guns, knives, bombs and radiation useless with your body alone,

You have hard time remembering we are composed of more than a body. The body doesn't create circumstances. It only is effected by them. It's not effected by circumstances that are not created. If there is no one shooting a gun at me I can't very well be affected by it can I?

There are countless cases both historical and modern of people dogmatically believing that their God of choice or philosophy would deliver them from all harm and countless recorded results of those people meeting their untimely ends.

I never said anything about God diverting bullets. You are spinning your chosen reality out of thin air, I suspect this how all the Drake followers operate. No evidence just what they want to hear. You doing the same to me here.

Drakes supporters will more than likely be his undoing.


I am impervious to bullets because those are circumstances I don't create for myself. I never said anything about God saving me.

All situations pertaining to me are under my control.

Your situation is not, you don't have any control over what you are saying and you are making that very evident. You are attempting to create evidence where none exists and that is what the rest of the Drake adherents are doing. Which is basically what every Drake critic is saying and you are making evidential right now.

You're script is running I suggest you shut it off.

Or can you?

[9eagle9]

That is all you are doing is spinning out unrealistic circumstances. That's not evidence. That all Drake and his adherents are doing, spinning out long lists of unrealistic circumstances and then telling people they are delusional when they don't believe them.

You don't have an argument, you have as you self admitted a constantly spewing chain of self created circumstances that don't have anything to do with me. How would the circumstances YOU keep spinning out be MY fault?

Essentially you are relating to me that because you are not in control of your circumstances, that means I'm a liar.

That's programming. You have two arguements going in your head that is desperate to override what is actually being said here.

Sheep magick: If I repeat myself often enough it will become true.

lol.




If you read my posts instead of having programming re-translate it for you, you will find I never said such a thing.

However I understand you unable to read what was actually said before your programming re-translates it.

Putting words in my mouth does not help make you right. It makes you look like programmed, cognitively challenged sheep.

You are creating a straw man argument and you have an audience who is observing you doing this.

You do not become impervious by using just your body; you become impervious by letting go of your mind.

I don't need people like you. I need people like me.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

It's this idea of "You morons are getting what's coming to you, ha ha! I'm prepared, you're all going to die and I'll be safe and secure.

No its you moron's are getting what you are ASKING for. Another system.

You can't demonstrate how you are immune to/from anything. You are just saying that you "are;" I've presented countless situations where any normal human would be overwhelmed and you've done nothing but rebut "That'd never happen to me!" without putting in the most important part...the why. If you can't even explain how your miraculous power works to prevent people from being affected by others' situations when we all still share this same green Earth then that shows a reality deficit in your thinking. Because I can keep spinning out more and more circumstances where of no fault of your own, someone else's problem can spill over into your life. Because since we all share this planet, what happens to one of us happens to all of us in some fashion.

But yes, go accuse me of not understanding your arguments. Just say I have a reading deficit, you picked that one up from my last post. You really do learn quickly! ;)
You could try to address my actual argument, which was that you alone have not sufficiently proven that you can keep other people from entering your world and affecting your life against your wishes. But something tells me you won't, because that's a losing argument. Please though, prove me wrong, this is fun! :D

[kk4aei]

See http://pscinet2012.blogspot.com for updates.

[9eagle9]

Here's my plan
When I was 24 I was held at gunpoint by a mugger. I knocked him out with a frozen chicken.

When I was 24, a man broke into my home. I ran after him tackled him and knocked him unconscious.

Realizing in fashion that I was somehow responsible for these situations I decided to persue why such occurrences should happen to me. What was I doing that I kept attacking such predation. (skips over whole look in the mirror and self responsibility part because its very disturbing to some audiences)

As i grew older my means of defense became a little more sophisticated and less physical.. When my daughter was four a man decided to attempt to sexual interfere with her right in front of my face. I turned into a dragon and knocked him about 20 feet across the room and out the door. What is interesting this that I caused six other women around me to shift to and they went howling after their ass as well. This is called natural expression, it occurs when one’s programming is removed.

When my daughter was older she was attacked by the neighbors dog AND the neighbor. When I went to intervene they both turned on me. People who know me well know all about the saga of me and the neighbors dog so i did the same thing. People had all sorts of helpful advice like get a gun, I have a gun. It didn't keep the neighbor or the dog out of my yard or from pestering my daughter.

Now it is amusing to shoot paint all over a dog the size of house so he can drag that **** back home where it belongs, but it didn’t stop the problem. Shapeshifting did.

When I awoke one night and there was some physical alien man thing in my room I turned into a dragon and off he went. His little alien head went rolling off onto the other side of the universe.

More recently when something attempts to interfere with me I simply and energetically begin to pound the **** out of them by a phenom called Vibration. Becaue the sheep think this is a sort 'of feel good ' mechanism they can't employ it for the various ways that it can be employed. Like driving off dumbass unwanted influences.

More recently I ran out of gas. Deciding I didn't feel like walking home or to a gas station I put my truck in drive and drove home anyway. Transcending the physical.

I have witnesses to all these events except for the frozen chicken one . After that I got a gun and a knife because it is very undignfified for someone such as myself to carry a frozen chicken as a weapon. Now that I have these things I've found I've never needed to use them.

So is there anything going on in these episodes that leads me to believe I cannot defend myself. Or that perhaps that's just suddenly going to change in the future?

Or that I need to change my plan.

Because it doesn't work for others doesn't mean it doesn't' work for me.

Once I truly knew that I can defend myself, the need even for high tension energetic defense disappeared. Nothing happens anymore and I have no reason to believe that episodes that require that sort of intervention will be required. If so….what do I have to worry about?

The sheep through their programming probably have a lot to worry about but I’m not particularly concerned. Once you understand how 'they' operate, then it becomes a stalemate.

The fact that you don’t believe me doesn’t change anything. Your belief is not required for my circumstances.

This is simply called “allowing one’s true expression” a phenom that occurs when one removes their programming that disallows true expression.

Here’s a interesting question. Why can’t David Wilcocks do stuff like that? Like….when someone says they are going to kill him. He is after all the guru on all things energetic.

After all what I'm dong is all about energetic fields and influencing them. Doesn't walk his talk? If he has direct expression of fields in his life why doesn't he allow them to..... say ....do something about those who are threatening him rather than bawling on the radio? One would be a 'new' way of managing one's life, the other is bascially your same old same old 'victim' reaction.

A mystery that no has ever answered only to say 'he's human'.


He created his own circumstances.

...and he wants to pass them along to you.

[the_vast_mystery]

Objectivism leaves out one part. You can be responsible for yourself and I know that victims just HATE that having any part in creating their situation. What objectivism doesn't state is that you can be responsible for yourself and still help others--but only those who are willing to be responsible for themselves.

The ability to look at things objectively instead of subjectively. I am not the subject of what is occurring, I am the observer.

Physically impossible, the observer determines the outcome and that's just basic quantum theory. By the sheer fact that you have a physical body and are physically present here means that you cannot be an objective observer because your presence here changes the experiment even if you do nothing but observe. Let alone the contradiction of having a physical body and doing things. Now you could say that you're a former objective observer whose now come here to take action, but once entering the physical plane you are a part of this world just like the rest of us. So if you even want to begin to state that the world has no effect on you then you need to demonstrate conclusively how isolated you are from it. The lowest common denominator here being the human body. So you would need to first, prove your body is isolated enough that no amount of attempts to do it harm would be effective at motivating your action.

This means you either need to prove you're invulnerable to physical harm, or have achieved such a strong meditative stance of pain control that you could be tortured on a rack for days without saying anything. Of course, seeing as you have children that also means you have to demonstrate one other thing as well. That being that you are either entirely unattached to your kids (So their being harmed would not motivate you to act) or that your kids shared in your same level of physical invulnerability as otherwise I am almost certain that you would react to someone's attempt to target them and use them as a tool to motivate you to act.

The moment I can harm you or them enough to motivate your action is the moment you lose your status as an objective observer. As I have now proved that you have attachments in this world that are able to be manipulated into guaranteeing you act the way I or someone else may want you to against your wishes. That doesn't mean people can't try to have a broader, less subjective view of the world but it does mean that total objectivity, just like total perfection, is an impossible achievement on this plane. We can strive for it, but never reach it.


People who are emotional basket cases cannot look at anything objectively.

Those who don't want to be responsible for themselves are just vampires. They attempt to turn each other into victims of servitude. Service to others turns into servitude to others. Why serve a sheep when you can help a lion?

Why help anyone when all you need is yourself? You apparently don't see this is the path you're being slowly led down, but that's okay it's all your choice. I'm just going to make sure that you're sure it's the one you want to make. ;p

By believing you can isolate yourself enough from the world you are basically going to have to keep isolating yourself more and more to function properly because the more independent you get the less you will see any need in giving aid to others. You might right now because of any number of reasons but what will happen is that as you get more and more along on your own you'll see less and less need for others and eventually all of your interactions will boil down to you feeling like they've become those same sheep you thought you'd gotten rid of. Because no matter how elite you think your "elites" are, which yes, that's what you're doing, practicing another form of elitism just with different membership criteria, they are not totally separate from the world any more than you are. So you'll only see them when they're asking for help, or resources, and eventually that will whittle away your belief that they were as elite as you thought until you begin to realize the only person "Elite" enough is yourself.

We're all vampires to some extent, we need to continually feed ourselves to survive, what we eat differs but everyone must eat something. The only difference between the lion and the vampire is the lion hasn't yet figured out how to farm his food. But why would anyone want to risk coming home empty handed when with a bit more effort they can insure a stable food supply? Whether it's wheat grass or beef it's still food, it's still life consumed, it all has to come from somewhere. So just like no one is free from needing to eat, and no one is free from making mistakes you're going to eventually see that you cannot learn enough by yourself to solve every problem and ensure you succeed at everything you want to accomplish. To do big things you need to work with the world, and people are diverse with diverse needs and complex ways of interacting. You'll get nowhere by snubbing everyone and everything that doesn't meet your own list of arbitrary criteria.


And Drake and Company has done what for starving people lately?

LMAO! This hasn't been about Drake or David Wilcock for ages. I'm not supporting them at all and if you'd bothered to actually read my other posts you'd have seen me speak multiple times about my reservations. I'm arguing AGAINST you and your philosophy not for anyone else. ;)


I see stories of rape and abduction and even brainwash victims on this forum daily that took control of their situation at least enough to publish their experiences. .
Primarily being ignorant of what is occurring in the world is what caused their circumstances. Being influenced by someone 'appearing' to look out for their own good. Sound familiar? Remaining ignorant and trusting the wrong people. They had nothing to do with their circumstances. How did they save themselves. By becoming objective about it.

So being "objective" gives one the ability to escape from a pimp that carries a gun and watches your every move to make sure you don't bolt? This is where we get back to invulnerability again, being objective is a perspective change and changing perspectives does not amplify your ability to defeat armed thugs who are abusing you for money.


Everyone creates their own circumstances out of ignorance. As you are demonstrating you can't help them fix that.

So a child must be punished for their own ignorance by being kidnapped and sold as property in Asia? That's the punishment for anyone who doesn't adhere to your view of objectivity? Again, what about date rape? Someone slips a drug into your drink and you didn't know until it was too late. So too bad now? He earned the right to do that by being clever? People collectively create their circumstances yes, but that's the part you're missing. There is BOTH individual AND collective responsibility shared in any given situation and the individual only partially contributes to what happens to them. In many cases they are more responsible than not but in a great many situations as well the collective can force the individual to take responsibility for something that was not in any way its doing.

Such as the kidnapping and prostitution of young children in Asia. These people don't exactly have a choice when the options are either "do it, or regularly get beaten until you say you will." It's not a weakness if not everyone can withstand physical torture, that's showing complete disdain for individuality, why should everyone have to be capable of being put on the wrack for days? Isn't that the sort of world we want to move beyond? -_-;;


The entire fact that you had to walk back on that point was all I ever needed you to do.

Your failure to comprehend what I am talking about doesn't mean I'm wrong, it means you are unable to comprehend what I'm talking about.

And just what is it then that you are talking about and why is it that it fails to take into consideration the absolute litany of situations I've presented which show how little responsibility an individual can have for the creation of many very dire situations that may occur within their lives?


So have misunderstood what I said, and now are foolishly using what I didn't say as means of supporting your agreement which further demonstrates how programmed you are. Programmed people provide their own evidence.

I asked you to show how you can easily render guns, knives, bombs and radiation useless with your body alone,

You have hard time remembering we are composed of more than a body.

Quite to the contrary, I believe we are far more then that. With that said however, I do not deny the body has primacy within the physical world. It is the lowest common denominator and we are not free from it. So long as we are not free from the effects of the human body we can never be free from being affected by the situations of other human beings on this earth. As those situations can and will affect at the least our body if no other factor. So then the onus comes upon you to show how these bodily effects will not motivate you into action and therefore proving your claim that you are unaffected by the situations of others which you did not create.


The body doesn't create circumstances. It only is effected by them. It's not effected by circumstances that are not created. If there is no one shooting a gun at me I can't very well be affected by it can I?

Yes, but the flaw this argument leaves is in its insinuation that no matter what happens around you that you will never be being shot at. You are not being shot at RIGHT NOW because civilization still mostly functions. The idea that if it were to collapse you would never face this situation is where it falls apart. I mean unless you can offer an argument that conclusively proves no matter what no one will ever wish to shoot at you for absolutely any reason whatsoever. But failing that all I need to prove is that once people decide they want to shoot at you, you have lost. Because it's quite easy for anyone to imagine how, if you are hoarding scarce natural resources, and not sharing, that if civilization collapses people will want them.


There are countless cases both historical and modern of people dogmatically believing that their God of choice or philosophy would deliver them from all harm and countless recorded results of those people meeting their untimely ends.

I never said anything about God diverting bullets.

Well I am saying that you need to for you to prove in one way that no harm will ever come to you or your person from situations you did not create. You either need to prove that you cannot be harmed physically, or that you are so mentally detached that no amount of physical harm will successfully motivate you. Otherwise I can quite clearly show that no amount of your super-effective-wilderness-training is going to protect you from the large bands of roving marauders that would sprout up once civilization collapsed. Otherwise how are you going to guarantee their lack of food does not motivate them to take yours, therefore starving you?


You are spinning your chosen reality out of thin air, I suspect this how all the Drake followers operate. No evidence just what they want to hear. You doing the same to me here.

Drakes supporters will more than likely be his undoing.

Wow, I really love how you insult my reading comprehension when you haven't even been paying attention to anything I ever said about how I'm mistrustful of Drake and his PR in multiple posts over multiple threads. You are something special! <3

You're saying that for some reason you cannot elaborate on, that even if civilization were to collapse that you would always be safe and sound because your being able to "live outside the system" somehow makes you entirely immune to other people's problems. And I'm the one who's spinning reality out of thin air? LOL!


I am impervious to bullets because those are circumstances I don't create for myself. I never said anything about God saving me.

All situations pertaining to me are under my control.

And how are they under your control, what mechanism do you have which enables such control? Are you God? Can you move mountains, cloak your wilderness stronghold in a thick miasma? Can you cloud Men's minds like the Shadow? Do you have a fortress guarded by mines, automated sentry guns and booby traps? If you cannot describe the specifics of how you have this control then you do not have it, you merely think you have it and have done a bang-up job at convincing yourself you do.


Your situation is not, you don't have any control over what you are saying and you are making that very evident. You are attempting to create evidence where none exists and that is what the rest of the Drake adherents are doing. Which is basically what every Drake critic is saying and you are making evidential right now.

You're script is running I suggest you shut it off.

Or can you?

If I'm running on a script why is it I can predict your arguments before you make them? food for thought! ;)

edit:


Here's my plan
When I was 24 I was held at gunpoint by a mugger. I knocked him out with a frozen chicken.

When I was 24, a man broke into my home. I ran after him tackled him and knocked him unconscious.

Realizing in fashion that I was somehow responsible for these situations I decided to persue why such occurrences should happen to me. What was I doing that I kept attacking such predation. (skips over whole look in the mirror and self responsibility part because its very disturbing to some audiences)

As i grew older my means of defense became a little more sophisticated and less physical.. When my daughter was four a man decided to attempt to sexual interfere with her right in front of my face. I turned into a dragon and knocked him about 20 feet across the room and out the door. What is interesting this that I caused six other women around me to shift to and they went howling after their ass as well. This is called natural expression, it occurs when one’s programming is removed.

When my daughter was older she was attacked by the neighbors dog AND the neighbor. When I went to intervene they both turned on me. People who know me well know all about the saga of me and the neighbors dog so i did the same thing. People had all sorts of helpful advice like get a gun, I have a gun. It didn't keep the neighbor or the dog out of my yard or from pestering my daughter.

Now it is amusing to shoot paint all over a dog the size of house so he can drag that **** back home where it belongs, but it didn’t stop the problem. Shapeshifting did.

When I awoke one night and there was some physical alien man thing in my room I turned into a dragon and off he went. His little alien head went rolling off onto the other side of the universe.

More recently when something attempts to interfere with me I simply and energetically begin to pound the **** out of them by a phenom called Vibration. Becaue the sheep think this is a sort 'of feel good ' mechanism they can't employ it for the various ways that it can be employed. Like driving off dumbass unwanted influences.

More recently I ran out of gas. Deciding I didn't feel like walking home or to a gas station I put my truck in drive and drove home anyway. Transcending the physical.

I have witnesses to all these events except for the frozen chicken one . After that I got a gun and a knife because it is very undignfified for someone such as myself to carry a frozen chicken as a weapon. Now that I have these things I've found I've never needed to use them.

So is there anything going on in these episodes that leads me to believe I cannot defend myself. Or that perhaps that's just suddenly going to change in the future?

Or that I need to change my plan.

Because it doesn't work for others doesn't mean it doesn't' work for me.

Once I truly knew that I can defend myself, the need even for high tension energetic defense disappeared. Nothing happens anymore and I have no reason to believe that episodes that require that sort of intervention will be required. If so….what do I have to worry about?

The sheep through their programming probably have a lot to worry about but I’m not particularly concerned. Once you understand how 'they' operate, then it becomes a stalemate.

The fact that you don’t believe me doesn’t change anything. Your belief is not required for my circumstances.

This is simply called “allowing one’s true expression” a phenom that occurs when one removes their programming that disallows true expression.

Here’s a interesting question. Why can’t David Wilcocks do stuff like that? Like….when someone says they are going to kill him. He is after all the guru on all things energetic.

After all what I'm dong is all about energetic fields and influencing them. Doesn't walk his talk? If he has direct expression of fields in his life why doesn't he allow them to..... say ....do something about those who are threatening him rather than bawling on the radio? One would be a 'new' way of managing one's life, the other is bascially your same old same old 'victim' reaction.

A mystery that no has ever answered only to say 'he's human'.


He created his own circumstances.

...and he wants to pass them along to you.

Yeah, all of that? You're on just as shaky ground as Drake or David Wilcock if you want to claim you have super human powers and yet cannot demonstrate hard evidence for them. Furthermore you'd need to even then show how these abilities can give you conclusive defense against all physical threats. Even if you have the ability floor one to three attackers with guns that says nothing about chemical, nuclear and biological weapons nor does it preclude the fact that your powers, if they exist are very likely subject to their own restrictions and limitations. Giving you a leg up, but not a definitive absolute advantage over everything here.

If you were that powerful, I have a hard time believing that with everything else you would be left alone. Of course you'll cloak any further responses to this in plausibly deniable language so you can keep on implying you have some ultimate unbreakable defense, but if you were so secure in your person then you wouldn't even be here evangelizing so much to begin with in this thread.

You're projecting, and badly. My guess is you are partly telling the truth though and are here on a recruitment drive. (Though you might not be aware of that yet) Thanks for the fun debate! :D

[kk4aei]

See http://pscinet2012.blogspot.com for updates.

[Chester]

Yes it makes you impervious. why I never troubled by bullets, robbery, assualt. Single female living out here in the woods where no can hear me scream. I don't even lock my doors at night. Beyond that my home is easily defensible. The "Home Alone' kid could take care of it.

I know what will happen if the unlikely event that I am attacked. The same thing that happened the few other occasions I was prompted to defend me and mine. I know precisely what will happen because its' been done before. not afraid to let my true power take care of me. I have no control over it, defense would occur regardless if I had any conscious control over it or not. I know what I am capable of because I've done it before, AFTER I brought down my programming.

People who know me know what happens on a physical and energetic level when I feel something under my custodianship is threatened.

Beyond that those circumstances just do not come to your doorstep anymore. There's nothing to defend. Doesn't hurt to be prepared but I'm not obsessed about, like I said i don't lock my doors at night.

I defined the programming further upthread.

Read it. I can't do your work for you, I can only remind you to do your work. I personally don't have an emotional investment in what happens to the sheeple. It's a pity and a shame but I am not even they are human anymore, maybe they are just lazy. But if they human potential they sure aren't doing anything to fulfill it. They don't care about themselves, yet I should? I am growing increasingly detached from their plight. Its not like they arent' given tools or access they simply don't want it preferring to remain conditioned and victims of their own psyche wounds.

I do have a response to those who could possibly be preserved. Who are few. I know there is nothing here that I can say to the brainwashed masses I am only using them as template to demonstrate my point to those who have a chance. And they know who they are. They have no problem understanding me at all. They may not agree with me but they plainly know through their own experiences not what was 'told' to them, what I am talking about.

The sheeple are just baahinig about the circumstances they are creating for themselves. It's like watching someone hit themselves in the head repeatedly iwth a hammer and whine about how it hurts, pausing only to pick another hammer expecting that something is going to change. How long do I need to watch that? Name me one good reason why I have to. The sheeple are gasping over the atrocities in the world, and afraid its going to happen to them even as they are doing it to themselves. They don't like watching what is going on the world but I should care as willfully keep enslaving themselves?

I don't. I need only to support those few that can preserved from their own assholery.

See, this is the part where I say you need to either post a video that shows you shrugging off assault rifle rounds (without a vest, you don't get to cheat and use the body armor society designed without you to say you can withstand force. Besides that armor is not 100% effective against everything) or I call a big fat BS on that bolded. Yes, you need to prove you are totally PHYSICALLY RESISTANT to man made weapons, not just that nobody would be inclined to shoot at you. Because I assure you inclination is as simple as wrong place, wrong time. So show me just how empowered you are and how useless our pathetic human weapons are against your obviously superior form...because that Ostrich? Yes, it thinks that by hiding its head in the sand protects it from Predators. (Even though it doesn't really.)

So you now need to prove you are not just shoving your head in the sand by showing us just how well protected you are against those predators. Yes, you can try to double back on what you said and throw out a bunch of wishy-washy BS about how you don't have to prove anything to me and how none of this all matters because you're some great guru here to save a few people. But, supposing you did, it would just be a plausibly deniable excuse to shield your ego from being deflated at the fact you are making impossible claims about what you are capable of. Human beings, and the human body, has its limits. It's the one set of limitations we all share, and until you demonstrate your unique and total freedom FROM all of the limits of the human body, which I have yet to see anyone observe. (Although Mas Oyama, founder of Kyokushin style karate was pretty damn close. He fought 300-men on a three-day nonstop elimination tournament and regularly went one on one with rodeo bulls, but something tells me not even he would survive being shot point blank in the head with a .50 cal round.)

Vast - I don't think 9eagle9 is particularly worried about her physical and I see that as one of her true strengths

[the_vast_mystery]

Vast - I don't think 9eagle9 is particularly worried about her physical and I see that as one of her true strengths

Anyone can write that on an internet forum and be lying out their teeth about how little it really matters to them. When they see their child being restrained by armed goons they will be singing an entirely different tune. I'm saying that it is so utterly unbelievable that she would not react in those hypothetical situations that unless she can conclusively prove it ( by either demonstrating she is invulnerable to physical damage or mentally detached enough to withstand all physical pain, and emotionally detached enough from her children that their suffering will not affect her or that they share in her same immunity to physical harm) then I am calling her entire argument a bunch of BS she typed online to make herself feel better about her own, individual life-situation.

[Chester]

Well, whether it is Bill or someone he trusts to post for him, I find his comments on several threads to be an effort to bully people like myself to get OFF this forum altogether so people can talk about the world the way HE sees it. Not that he has spoken more forcefully than the average poster -- but it IS his forum after all, and I really do NOT care to stay anywhere I am unwelcome -- even online -- when the host himself is putting me down.

I guess I'll have to exit now. Anyone who wants to see what I'm posting about Drake, et al. -- I'm easy enough to find. I may just get more active on my blog or "Door #2" on Avocadess.com and bid you all a fond farewell. (Well, I can't say I've been fond of ALL of those here, but I don't hold any grudges either. I'd rather "travel light.")

Wishing you all the best.

I'm sorry this did not turn out to be a good place to share my passion, but any actor on the stage can feeling it when they are getting "the hook" and I'd rather just bow out now.

Best wishes to you, Bill. I totally disagree with you, man, but I do appreciate all the work you have done in the past and wish you the best. Thanks for making this forum available. It was an awful lot of fun for a while.

(NOTE: Please no one bother to PM me. I doubt I'll be back to check.)

Avocadess, you passion for the plan is honest. Your efforts in providing transcripts of the Drake broadcasts are appreciated by many on this forum.

But Bill did not at all throw his weight around. In fact, my guess is he has consciously held back. Bill has his view and belief as to the possibility of the plan being real or not and if so, the Plan's success. He is just one opinion. Maybe more informed than many, maybe he has more practical experience to make a better set of odds as to all the ifs, but he is just one of us just like you. Anyone who doesn't know the guy's heart by now - that he cares, must come from another universe. He cares, he posted his views.

Don't let what anyone else thinks effect your own truth. If they do - maybe its a good idea to look a little in the mirror and see why you are vulnerable to one man's opinion.

Lots of us appreciate both your efforts to provide information to those who cannot spend the time listening to all these broadcasts as well as the massive heart you have - and an honest one at that - that wants to see positive change in this world.

[Chester]

Vast - I don't think 9eagle9 is particularly worried about her physical and I see that as one of her true strengths

Anyone can write that on an internet forum and be lying out their teeth about how little it really matters to them. When they see their child being restrained by armed goons they will be singing an entirely different tune. I'm saying that it is so utterly unbelievable that she would not react in those hypothetical situations that unless she can conclusively prove it ( by either demonstrating she is invulnerable to physical damage or mentally detached enough to withstand all physical pain, and emotionally detached enough from her children that their suffering will not affect her or that they share in her same immunity to physical harm) then I am calling her entire argument a bunch of BS she typed online to make herself feel better about her own, individual life-situation.

I hear ya Vast - I have three sons and would instantly risk my life to save there's - wouldn't be a thought. And when some of us extend that to the possibility that unless "we" stop "them" now, its a matter of time before they DO come for our own children as well as ourselves. But I also sense she's outside of that fear zone - some have achieved that. I am not saying I have... but as the layers of programming fall off... I can see it and I can see it being very real.

Not trying to speak for 9eagle9 as I can't hold a candle to her...

[the_vast_mystery]

I hear ya Vast - I have three sons and would instantly risk my life to save there's - wouldn't be a thought. And when some of us extend that to the possibility that unless "we" stop "them" now, its a matter of time before they DO come for our own children as well as ourselves. But I also sense she's outside of that fear zone - some have achieved that. I am not saying I have... but as the layers of programming fall off... I can see it and I can see it being very real.

Not trying to speak for 9eagle9 as I can't hold a candle to her...

If someone had escaped living in fear then they would not feel the need to call all forms of human aid evil, deride compassion as a personality flaw, nor call the majority of the population mentally retarded sheeple while implying very underhandedly that they're all going to get what they deserve (by stating that every situation is always exclusively the fault of the person it happens to via her philosophy, therefore conveying the implication that any time someone suffers, starves or dies they have none to blame but themselves and therefore are just getting what they deserve.) Someone who had fully escaped fear would be happily sharing how they had escaped fear and provide everyone capable with the same opportunity. Not talk derisively about how we're all such a bunch of hopeless muppets that can't apparently understand her vastly-superior-intellect.

That sounds more like someone going on an elitist recruitment drive for their type of personality. People's actions need to match their words, and when they don't I'm going to point it out until I get a satisfactory explanation. If she's afraid of nothing, and has nothing to prove, she would never have felt the need to keep hammering home how anyone espousing compassion is evil. Simply pointing out Drake himself was fraudulent would be enough. (And I did in fact in my other posts noting the numerous factual innacuracies in his interviews with regards to legal documentation.)

It sounds far more like she fears compassion-based philosophies very much, and is doing her level best to try and demonstrate (via argumentation) to others why they are entirely fraudulent. Otherwise why feel the need to continue the discussion to such a point? Myself? Well I'll admit I just love a good debate and this one seemed kind of challenging so I couldn't help myself.

I'm not invulnerable, not free from fear, I have no super powers nor insider sources...but I can see the flaws in the arguments being presented and since a lot of them appear to be veiled behind layers of implied subtext I wanted to make sure they were apparent for everyone at home reading. :)

[Chester]

I hear ya Vast - I have three sons and would instantly risk my life to save there's - wouldn't be a thought. And when some of us extend that to the possibility that unless "we" stop "them" now, its a matter of time before they DO come for our own children as well as ourselves. But I also sense she's outside of that fear zone - some have achieved that. I am not saying I have... but as the layers of programming fall off... I can see it and I can see it being very real.

Not trying to speak for 9eagle9 as I can't hold a candle to her...

If someone had escaped living in fear then they would not feel the need to call all forms of human aid evil, deride compassion as a personality flaw, nor call the majority of the population mentally retarded sheeple while implying very underhandedly that they're all going to get what they deserve (by stating that every situation is always exclusively the fault of the person it happens to via her philosophy, therefore conveying the implication that any time someone suffers, starves or dies they have none to blame but themselves and therefore are just getting what they deserve.) Someone who had fully escaped fear would be happily sharing how they had escaped fear and provide everyone capable with the same opportunity. Not talk derisively about how we're all such a bunch of hopeless muppets that can't apparently understand her vastly-superior-intellect.

That sounds more like someone going on an elitist recruitment drive for their type of personality. People's actions need to match their words, and when they don't I'm going to point it out until I get a satisfactory explanation. If she's afraid of nothing, and has nothing to prove, she would never have felt the need to keep hammering home how anyone espousing compassion is evil. Simply pointing out Drake himself was fraudulent would be enough. (And I did in fact in my other posts noting the numerous factual innacuracies in his interviews with regards to legal documentation.)

It sounds far more like she fears compassion-based philosophies very much, and is doing her level best to try and demonstrate (via argumentation) to others why they are entirely fraudulent. Otherwise why feel the need to continue the discussion to such a point? Myself? Well I'll admit I just love a good debate and this one seemed kind of challenging so I couldn't help myself.

I'm not invulnerable, not free from fear, I have no super powers nor insider sources...but I can see the flaws in the arguments being presented and since a lot of them appear to be veiled behind layers of implied subtext I wanted to make sure they were apparent for everyone at home reading. :)

Well stated - I lean your way, Vast... but that's a bit the sheeple in me. I have had a few defense experiences where something from within me performed feats I never knew possible, yet I did them, experienced them. I also have known folks who shared similar points of view as 9eagle9 and I was always somewhat envious of them in a way because I could not detach - always finding myself stuck with the sheeple (pretending I ain't one of em)... anyways, reading the debate between you both (one of the best ongoing forum debates ever!) has helped me examine further myself.

The first few times I read her posts I thought she (didn't even know she was a she) was quite a jerk... so I stepped back and looked at myself some more - then read more and more and all I can say is, I see where she's coming from and I sense she has a great deal of frustration with most of us sheeple (well, speaking for myself here). But I'm a sheep that's perhaps black and sorta outside the herd to some extent... but I still bah, bah now and then, I still hope ETs and the Drake guys pull it off... meaning I still believe in the possibility... anyways. - You really make several excellent points - thanks for posting Vast

I also thank 9eagle9 for one post where she mentioned she doesn't descend into polarity but if she had to she could see it as greed vs decency... and I know which side she falls on there - the latter.

[9eagle9]

Because you can't do it doesn't mean its impossible. I listen to lots of people in this forum speak of such things so I know its not impossible. Not in the majority but its not all that unusual. Your programming doesn't allow YOU to do it. People scream for it but when its suggested they should be doing it they attack the notion.

Most of the metaphysics people babble on about are just talk not expression. You haven't lost any appreciable amount of programming to know this for yourself. Everyone who has ever removed their conditioning will describe much the same thing.

Metaphysics occurs after one's programming is lost.

It's easy to become the observer, instead of the subject.

You just happen to think something is happening to you, so you have to react to it, so you just follow another reactionary person, I don't. So shoot me.

I've already proved to myself no harm will come to me. That's the only person that matters is me in the equation. No harm will come to 'me'.

Whatever happens to you is your problem. It's not like you weren't warned.

8 days a week no harm comes to me. Sunday a 1400 pound horse falls on me, no harm comes to me.

Monday a 700 pound horse falls on me, no harm comes to me.

Why am I not harmed? Because its impossible. Well I'm here typing sound in body so....what happened.

Something is happening certainly, horses are falling, but its not happening to me, because otherwise I'd be harmed by it. Why I am not harmed by this?

Next week something else will happen and I 'll still not be harmed.

Moving with naturally energies instead of allowing ones programming to resist them.

[9eagle9]

If someone had escaped living in fear then they would not feel the need to call all forms of human aid evil, deride compassion as a personality flaw, nor call the majority of the population mentally retarded sheeple while implying very underhandedly that they're all going to get what they deserve (by stating that every situation is always exclusively the fault of the person it happens to via her philosophy,

I didn't say you were evil I said you were programmed. Your programming doesn't affect me.

Compassion is not passion. Detachment is required for compassion, otherwise it's passion.

Remember I'm the observer, because I'm not involved in it I can call it exactly the way I'm observing it. If I were effected by it then I would be afraid of it. But I'm not.

It's YOUR programming not mine.

I am only speaking over your head, I know you can't grasp the concept because you aren't allowed to. But there are those who can so I am basically speaking over your head to them.

You do serve a certain purpose .

[Chester]

If someone had escaped living in fear then they would not feel the need to call all forms of human aid evil, deride compassion as a personality flaw, nor call the majority of the population mentally retarded sheeple while implying very underhandedly that they're all going to get what they deserve (by stating that every situation is always exclusively the fault of the person it happens to via her philosophy,

I didn't say you were evil I said you were programmed. Your programming doesn't affect me.

Compassion is not passion. Detachment is required for compassion, otherwise it's passion.

Remember I'm the observer, because I'm not involved in it I can call it exactly the way I'm observing it. If I were effected by it then I would be afraid of it. But I'm not.

It's YOUR programming not mine.

I am only speaking over your head, I know you can't grasp the concept because you aren't allowed to. But there are those who can so I am basically speaking over your head to them.

You do serve a certain purpose .

Hey 9eagle9 - tried to PM ya but your box is full... justone

[9eagle9]

Thank you. I used to have frustration for them until I realized this is what they want. the whole nine yards holistic healing, self empowerment, shamanic healing the whole ball of wax. To the exclusion of my own life. So I spend half my life 'helping' others. Of all the thousands of people of I've seen, I've helped maybe a dozen, who demonstrated an appreciable difference in their lives but only because they wanted to change the state of their existence and claim their self authority.

Everyone else wanted a babysitter, a bunch of bull****. So I said the rest of my life will be mine to manage.

It took me a great many experiences to get it through my head that is the existence they want. An existence of acquiring more meaningless data to support the system rather than the shedding off process required to allow things to happen in a way that is called metaphysics.

They don't want to help themselves, they have no compassion for themselves but yet I'm expected to?

Why has never been made known to me.

Does anyone know why I need to expend my energy on helping people who don't want my help? It never did any good anyway save for the dozen or so I know that made an appreciable difference in their life and that was their doing not mine.







I hear ya Vast - I have three sons and would instantly risk my life to save there's - wouldn't be a thought. And when some of us extend that to the possibility that unless "we" stop "them" now, its a matter of time before they DO come for our own children as well as ourselves. But I also sense she's outside of that fear zone - some have achieved that. I am not saying I have... but as the layers of programming fall off... I can see it and I can see it being very real.

Not trying to speak for 9eagle9 as I can't hold a candle to her...

If someone had escaped living in fear then they would not feel the need to call all forms of human aid evil, deride compassion as a personality flaw, nor call the majority of the population mentally retarded sheeple while implying very underhandedly that they're all going to get what they deserve (by stating that every situation is always exclusively the fault of the person it happens to via her philosophy, therefore conveying the implication that any time someone suffers, starves or dies they have none to blame but themselves and therefore are just getting what they deserve.) Someone who had fully escaped fear would be happily sharing how they had escaped fear and provide everyone capable with the same opportunity. Not talk derisively about how we're all such a bunch of hopeless muppets that can't apparently understand her vastly-superior-intellect.

That sounds more like someone going on an elitist recruitment drive for their type of personality. People's actions need to match their words, and when they don't I'm going to point it out until I get a satisfactory explanation. If she's afraid of nothing, and has nothing to prove, she would never have felt the need to keep hammering home how anyone espousing compassion is evil. Simply pointing out Drake himself was fraudulent would be enough. (And I did in fact in my other posts noting the numerous factual innacuracies in his interviews with regards to legal documentation.)

It sounds far more like she fears compassion-based philosophies very much, and is doing her level best to try and demonstrate (via argumentation) to others why they are entirely fraudulent. Otherwise why feel the need to continue the discussion to such a point? Myself? Well I'll admit I just love a good debate and this one seemed kind of challenging so I couldn't help myself.

I'm not invulnerable, not free from fear, I have no super powers nor insider sources...but I can see the flaws in the arguments being presented and since a lot of them appear to be veiled behind layers of implied subtext I wanted to make sure they were apparent for everyone at home reading. :)

Well stated - I lean your way, Vast... but that's a bit the sheeple in me. I have had a few defense experiences where something from within me performed feats I never knew possible, yet I did them, experienced them. I also have known folks who shared similar points of view as 9eagle9 and I was always somewhat envious of them in a way because I could not detach - always finding myself stuck with the sheeple (pretending I ain't one of em)... anyways, reading the debate between you both (one of the best ongoing forum debates ever!) has helped me examine further myself.

The first few times I read her posts I thought she (didn't even know she was a she) was quite a jerk... so I stepped back and looked at myself some more - then read more and more and all I can say is, I see where she's coming from and I sense she has a great deal of frustration with most of us sheeple (well, speaking for myself here). But I'm a sheep that's perhaps black and sorta outside the herd to some extent... but I still bah, bah now and then, I still hope ETs and the Drake guys pull it off... meaning I still believe in the possibility... anyways. - You really make several excellent points - thanks for posting Vast

I also thank 9eagle9 for one post where she mentioned she doesn't descend into polarity but if she had to she could see it as greed vs decency... and I know which side she falls on there - the latter.

[the_vast_mystery]

Because you can't do it doesn't mean its impossible. I listen to lots of people in this forum speak of such things so I know its not impossible. Not in the majority but its not all that unusual. Your programming doesn't allow YOU to do it. People scream for it but when its suggested they should be doing it they attack the notion.

Most of the metaphysics people babble on about are just talk not expression. You haven't lost any appreciable amount of programming to know this for yourself. Everyone who has ever removed their conditioning will describe much the same thing.

Metaphysics occurs after one's programming is lost.

It's easy to become the observer, instead of the subject.

You just happen to think something is happening to you, so you have to react to it, so you just follow another reactionary person, I don't. So shoot me.

I've already proved to myself no harm will come to me. That's the only person that matters is me in the equation. No harm will come to 'me'.

Whatever happens to you is your problem. It's not like you weren't warned.

8 days a week no harm comes to me. Sunday a 1400 pound horse falls on me, no harm comes to me.

Monday a 700 pound horse falls on me, no harm comes to me.

Why am I not harmed? Because its impossible. Well I'm here typing sound in body so....what happened.

Something is happening certainly, horses are falling, but its not happening to me, because otherwise I'd be harmed by it. Why I am not harmed by this?

Next week something else will happen and I 'll still not be harmed.

Moving with naturally energies instead of allowing ones programming to resist them.

The problem here is you're making a fundamental attribution error. You know you have power, but not what exactly that power is, where it really comes from, nor why you have it, what exactly it is really doing, nor its truest extent. You're making very general surface observations and then immediately jumping to conclusions. (Which if you do know it that well why can't you describe it any further beyond "Well Gosh I just don't seem to get hurt! a'hyuk! I must be immune to everything!")

Power gives you leverage, just like using a pulley or other mechanical device gives a human leverage over lifting a heavy object. That said though just because you can lift two heavy blocks using a pulley system doesn't mean that you can lift absolutely every block made of anything with your pulley system. Being ignorant of the mechanics of how the pulley actually helps divide the effort required in lifting an object means that you will not be able to accurately gauge when the pulley will work and when it will break. In short, by relying on your abilities without ever trying to seriously understand them and what they do you are setting yourself up for failure the day you finally meet someone who's stronger than you who decides they want to hurt you.

If you could truly transcend the physical in its entirety you would be able to do anything on command. Which, I mean if that's the case by all means why don't you start by zeroing in on my exact location and teleporting right next to me for a good surprise? ;)
What's that, don't know how? Maybe because you have not truly transcended the physical, merely that you have some innate powers that give you an advantage at operating here.

edit:


Well stated - I lean your way, Vast... but that's a bit the sheeple in me. I have had a few defense experiences where something from within me performed feats I never knew possible, yet I did them, experienced them. I also have known folks who shared similar points of view as 9eagle9 and I was always somewhat envious of them in a way because I could not detach - always finding myself stuck with the sheeple (pretending I ain't one of em)... anyways, reading the debate between you both (one of the best ongoing forum debates ever!) has helped me examine further myself.

Yes, and I've managed to do a few miraculous things myself. But I don't parade around like that makes me invulnerable. I, in fact, tested myself and was quickly reminded that while I might have a few tricks up my sleeve I too have limits. I really won't go any further than to say that no matter if they are self-imposed or collectively-imposed limits are still limits.

To truly be free from limits is to also truly be free from yourself. That also means giving up any beliefs or actions which create personal attachments and compassion as a way of life because otherwise you limit yourself by being required to respond to the problems of others. Each person though has to decide whether or not those things are truly limits or perhaps gifts disguised as burdens.

Because ultimately we need to decide whether or not we want to be alone or work with others in a community, and if we decide the latter that means we're always going to come face to face with other people's problems on some level. It's impossible to deal with people long term without their problems contaminating your sphere somehow. So we can either banish others from our world entirely, or we can chose to do our best to work with them.

The planet, for instance, chooses to allow us to live on it despite how poorly we treat it. It works with us.

If the former however? You're still going to be spending just as much time isolating yourself from the problems of others as you would be dealing with them in that community. After all, tell the Native American population in the USA how well their isolationist strategy worked...genocide and forcible relocation. They're two sides of the same coin, and require just as much effort. Which a person chooses is entirely a matter of preference.


The first few times I read her posts I thought she (didn't even know she was a she) was quite a jerk... so I stepped back and looked at myself some more - then read more and more and all I can say is, I see where she's coming from and I sense she has a great deal of frustration with most of us sheeple (well, speaking for myself here). But I'm a sheep that's perhaps black and sorta outside the herd to some extent... but I still bah, bah now and then, I still hope ETs and the Drake guys pull it off... meaning I still believe in the possibility... anyways. - You really make several excellent points - thanks for posting Vast

I also thank 9eagle9 for one post where she mentioned she doesn't descend into polarity but if she had to she could see it as greed vs decency... and I know which side she falls on there - the latter.

I can kind of see where she comes from and yes there are some good points regarding dependency. We could do with a lot less of a codependent society but with that said personal responsibility as a dogma does not immediately convey these vast powers of matter alteration that she posits.

Expecting people to just stand up in every situation when they do not have these same vast abilities is ridiculous. That's like telling a child it's their own fault at age 11 for being kidnapped and sold into sex slavery. While yes, on a level yes you can attribute partial responsibility to them; What personal responsibility philosophy often misses is this: A person's ability to decide a situation for themselves is predicated quite firmly on their ability to understand their choices in full and determine which of multiple equally valid outcomes they prefer.

Not something one has in spades when under stress let alone when someone gets the drop behind them. Plenty of people have died fighting muggers/thieves and the fact that she has managed to survive due to some nebulous ability does not somehow make it the fault of those dead that they did not magically have access to whatever reservoir of power she might possess.

It's fallacious to expect any human being will ever be able to do the same until someone can demonstrate a full training manual which grants these awesome powers. As otherwise there is no sufficient reason to suspect these powers are in any way the result of this belief of "personal responsibility."

[9eagle9]

A 1000 years ago you would have been murdered for speaking to me the way you are now.

So be grateful.

1000 years ago I would have the right to slit your throat for the way you are speaking to me now. Indeed it would have been expected of me. You would have been summarily assigned a label of evil and your actions would have been punished by death.

Be grateful.

The more I detach from my physical body, the less that happens to it. There is more to me than the physical.

In case you aren't paying attention to my posts I just recently noted where a man tried to molest my daughter right in front of me. And what did I do? I've actually experienced the circumstances you are spinning in your head.

Have you?



Vast - I don't think 9eagle9 is particularly worried about her physical and I see that as one of her true strengths

Anyone can write that on an internet forum and be lying out their teeth about how little it really matters to them. When they see their child being restrained by armed goons they will be singing an entirely different tune. I'm saying that it is so utterly unbelievable that she would not react in those hypothetical situations that unless she can conclusively prove it ( by either demonstrating she is invulnerable to physical damage or mentally detached enough to withstand all physical pain, and emotionally detached enough from her children that their suffering will not affect her or that they share in her same immunity to physical harm) then I am calling her entire argument a bunch of BS she typed online to make herself feel better about her own, individual life-situation.

[9eagle9]

I wasn't talking about pullies and leverage, I was talking about living breathing deadweight with thrashing legs toppling over on me. You are the one who is rationalizing by the block and tackle physics because its the only thing you have been told. These are circumstances that you've spun to explain a horse falling on me.

Did a block and tackle cure me of a nearly a ton of weight collapsing on me? Is that what you are saying?

Not everything is on command, some things like creating one's reality is done without conscious thought. Some of us have different levels of existence.

That's the whole point unconsciously creating circumstances.

That is transcending the physical.

Because you believe a bunch of new age bull**** about how teleportation is achieved or you watched to much star trek you have no idea of the actual concept of projecting.

You would not even notice me if I were there. If you cannot comprehend what is being spoke of here on an intellectual level you do not have the perception to percieve those who would project themselves at you.

Not to mention I'd project myself at someone interesting. I see sheep everyday.




Because you can't do it doesn't mean its impossible. I listen to lots of people in this forum speak of such things so I know its not impossible. Not in the majority but its not all that unusual. Your programming doesn't allow YOU to do it. People scream for it but when its suggested they should be doing it they attack the notion.

Most of the metaphysics people babble on about are just talk not expression. You haven't lost any appreciable amount of programming to know this for yourself. Everyone who has ever removed their conditioning will describe much the same thing.

Metaphysics occurs after one's programming is lost.

It's easy to become the observer, instead of the subject.

You just happen to think something is happening to you, so you have to react to it, so you just follow another reactionary person, I don't. So shoot me.

I've already proved to myself no harm will come to me. That's the only person that matters is me in the equation. No harm will come to 'me'.

Whatever happens to you is your problem. It's not like you weren't warned.

8 days a week no harm comes to me. Sunday a 1400 pound horse falls on me, no harm comes to me.

Monday a 700 pound horse falls on me, no harm comes to me.

Why am I not harmed? Because its impossible. Well I'm here typing sound in body so....what happened.

Something is happening certainly, horses are falling, but its not happening to me, because otherwise I'd be harmed by it. Why I am not harmed by this?

Next week something else will happen and I 'll still not be harmed.

Moving with naturally energies instead of allowing ones programming to resist them.

The problem here is you're making a fundamental attribution error. You know you have power, but not what exactly that power is, where it really comes from, nor why you have it, what exactly it is really doing, nor its truest extent. You're making very general surface observations and then immediately jumping to conclusions. (Which if you do know it that well why can't you describe it any further beyond "Well Gosh I just don't seem to get hurt! a'hyuk! I must be immune to everything!")

Power gives you leverage, just like using a pulley or other mechanical device gives a human leverage over lifting a heavy object. That said though just because you can lift two heavy blocks using a pulley system doesn't mean that you can lift absolutely every block made of anything with your pulley system. Being ignorant of the mechanics of how the pulley actually helps divide the effort required in lifting an object means that you will not be able to accurately gauge when the pulley will work and when it will break. In short, by relying on your abilities without ever trying to seriously understand them and what they do you are setting yourself up for failure the day you finally meet someone who's stronger than you who decides they want to hurt you.

If you could truly transcend the physical in its entirety you would be able to do anything on command. Which, I mean if that's the case by all means why don't you start by zeroing in on my exact location and teleporting right next to me for a good surprise? ;)
What's that, don't know how? Maybe because you have not truly transcended the physical, merely that you have some innate powers that give you an advantage at operating here.

[Unified Serenity]

8 days a week no harm comes to me. Sunday a 1400 pound horse falls on me, no harm comes to me.

Monday a 700 pound horse falls on me, no harm comes to me.

This gave me a giggle cause I think of your hard head, and then I think "Why won't she stop feeding them beer yet?"

[9eagle9]

I need someone to drink with.



8 days a week no harm comes to me. Sunday a 1400 pound horse falls on me, no harm comes to me.

Monday a 700 pound horse falls on me, no harm comes to me.

This gave me a giggle cause I think of your hard head, and then I think "Why won't she stop feeding them beer yet?"

[9eagle9]

A kinder response than the barn owner . When told her horses had fallen on me she asked if they were okay.

Oh sure, I broke their fall.

[the_vast_mystery]

A 1000 years ago you would have been murdered for speaking to me the way you are now.

So be grateful.

1000 years ago I would have the right to slit your throat for the way you are speaking to me now. Indeed it would have been expected of me. You would have been summarily assigned a label of evil and your actions would have been punished by death.

Be grateful.

The more I detach from my physical body, the less that happens to it. There is more to me than the physical.

In case you aren't paying attention to my posts I just recently noted where a man tried to molest my daughter right in front of me. And what did I do? I've actually experienced the circumstances you are spinning in your head.

Have you?

1,000 years ago you'd be chattel owned by a rich Lord or monarch of some sorts. ;p
I mean, you might get treated well and have a nice title, but when it came down to it you'd basically be property of whichever aristocrat decided they wanted your power for their own.

Yes, actually, I managed to knock someone down who regularly benches twice what I weigh and restrain them when they tried to slug me and steal my work laptop. It was the only time I've ever had to actually fight someone or face serious harm. What I noticed afterward though was that the fact I got myself out of that bad situation didn't mean that my body was immune from harm. I still bleed just like you and an injury I got later with a knife reminded me of that. I have an advantage here, but that advantage does not make me anymore than a bit luckier and more capable. These things operate within systems, just like our body does, and because of that they will always be limited in some way. (Even if perhaps nothing like we know now)

If you can't demonstrate conclusively the mechanics with which you are able to do these things then you're just guessing as much as I am. The only difference being that you've already convinced yourself that you're right. I've only convinced myself these things are possible, and that therefore I must seek to learn more fully what it is that is being tapped into, how to tap it, and how to wield it effortlessly at that which I seek to achieve. I am but a student of the unknown.


I wasn't talking about pullies and leverage, I was talking about living breathing deadweight with thrashing legs toppling over on me. You are the one who is rationalizing by the block and tackle physics because its the only thing you have been told. These are circumstances that you've spun to explain a horse falling on me.

Did a block and tackle cure me of a nearly a ton of weight collapsing on me? Is that what you are saying?

Not everything is on command, some things like creating one's reality is done without conscious thought. Some of us have different levels of existence.

That's the whole point unconsciously creating circumstances.

That is transcending the physical.

Because you believe a bunch of new age bull**** about how teleportation is achieved or you watched to much star trek you have no idea of the actual concept of projecting.

You would not even notice me if I were there. If you cannot comprehend what is being spoke of here on an intellectual level you do not have the perception to percieve those who would project themselves at you.

Not to mention I'd project myself at someone interesting. I see sheep everyday.

No, I'm saying that you're not omnipotent, and that because you are not omnipotent it is horribly egotistical to act like you are with regards both to what you can do and to insinuate how apparently everyone else is worthless for not being able to have reached your point in the journey.

P.S. I see more than you think; I just do a very good job at pretending not to notice things until I feel the need to. ;)

[RMorgan]

Hey folks,

I don´t mean to be rude, but maybe it´s time to stop this personal discussion here?

I think PMs are much more adequate for this kind of debate.

Cheers,

Raf.

[9eagle9]

I am explaining the mechanics of what I'm discussing, you can't understand them. Therefore you feel as if nothing is explained to you. That is the nature of not being able to comprehend. You don't have the ability to understand it.

It's not a system, therefore you can't understand it.

RMorgan's right, although i doubt a privately held conversation would be productive than a public one. (although a few have found VM to be educational to say the least)

[Sebastion]

the vast mystery-you will never understand what 9eagle9 is saying from a left brain intellectual perspective. Your going to have to begin incorporating the right brain-feminine aspect within you before you could even approach that understanding.

You will not understand what I have just said nor 9eagle9 until you do. You can take it from an x-hardcore left brainer for whatever you feel it's worth.





Because you can't do it doesn't mean its impossible. I listen to lots of people in this forum speak of such things so I know its not impossible. Not in the majority but its not all that unusual. Your programming doesn't allow YOU to do it. People scream for it but when its suggested they should be doing it they attack the notion.

Most of the metaphysics people babble on about are just talk not expression. You haven't lost any appreciable amount of programming to know this for yourself. Everyone who has ever removed their conditioning will describe much the same thing.

Metaphysics occurs after one's programming is lost.

It's easy to become the observer, instead of the subject.

You just happen to think something is happening to you, so you have to react to it, so you just follow another reactionary person, I don't. So shoot me.

I've already proved to myself no harm will come to me. That's the only person that matters is me in the equation. No harm will come to 'me'.

Whatever happens to you is your problem. It's not like you weren't warned.

8 days a week no harm comes to me. Sunday a 1400 pound horse falls on me, no harm comes to me.

Monday a 700 pound horse falls on me, no harm comes to me.

Why am I not harmed? Because its impossible. Well I'm here typing sound in body so....what happened.

Something is happening certainly, horses are falling, but its not happening to me, because otherwise I'd be harmed by it. Why I am not harmed by this?

Next week something else will happen and I 'll still not be harmed.

Moving with naturally energies instead of allowing ones programming to resist them.

The problem here is you're making a fundamental attribution error. You know you have power, but not what exactly that power is, where it really comes from, nor why you have it, what exactly it is really doing, nor its truest extent. You're making very general surface observations and then immediately jumping to conclusions. (Which if you do know it that well why can't you describe it any further beyond "Well Gosh I just don't seem to get hurt! a'hyuk! I must be immune to everything!")

Power gives you leverage, just like using a pulley or other mechanical device gives a human leverage over lifting a heavy object. That said though just because you can lift two heavy blocks using a pulley system doesn't mean that you can lift absolutely every block made of anything with your pulley system. Being ignorant of the mechanics of how the pulley actually helps divide the effort required in lifting an object means that you will not be able to accurately gauge when the pulley will work and when it will break. In short, by relying on your abilities without ever trying to seriously understand them and what they do you are setting yourself up for failure the day you finally meet someone who's stronger than you who decides they want to hurt you.

If you could truly transcend the physical in its entirety you would be able to do anything on command. Which, I mean if that's the case by all means why don't you start by zeroing in on my exact location and teleporting right next to me for a good surprise? ;)
What's that, don't know how? Maybe because you have not truly transcended the physical, merely that you have some innate powers that give you an advantage at operating here.

edit:


Well stated - I lean your way, Vast... but that's a bit the sheeple in me. I have had a few defense experiences where something from within me performed feats I never knew possible, yet I did them, experienced them. I also have known folks who shared similar points of view as 9eagle9 and I was always somewhat envious of them in a way because I could not detach - always finding myself stuck with the sheeple (pretending I ain't one of em)... anyways, reading the debate between you both (one of the best ongoing forum debates ever!) has helped me examine further myself.

Yes, and I've managed to do a few miraculous things myself. But I don't parade around like that makes me invulnerable. I, in fact, tested myself and was quickly reminded that while I might have a few tricks up my sleeve I too have limits. I really won't go any further than to say that no matter if they are self-imposed or collectively-imposed limits are still limits.

To truly be free from limits is to also truly be free from yourself. That also means giving up any beliefs or actions which create personal attachments and compassion as a way of life because otherwise you limit yourself by being required to respond to the problems of others. Each person though has to decide whether or not those things are truly limits or perhaps gifts disguised as burdens.

Because ultimately we need to decide whether or not we want to be alone or work with others in a community, and if we decide the latter that means we're always going to come face to face with other people's problems on some level. It's impossible to deal with people long term without their problems contaminating your sphere somehow. So we can either banish others from our world entirely, or we can chose to do our best to work with them.

The planet, for instance, chooses to allow us to live on it despite how poorly we treat it. It works with us.

If the former however? You're still going to be spending just as much time isolating yourself from the problems of others as you would be dealing with them in that community. After all, tell the Native American population in the USA how well their isolationist strategy worked...genocide and forcible relocation. They're two sides of the same coin, and require just as much effort. Which a person chooses is entirely a matter of preference.


The first few times I read her posts I thought she (didn't even know she was a she) was quite a jerk... so I stepped back and looked at myself some more - then read more and more and all I can say is, I see where she's coming from and I sense she has a great deal of frustration with most of us sheeple (well, speaking for myself here). But I'm a sheep that's perhaps black and sorta outside the herd to some extent... but I still bah, bah now and then, I still hope ETs and the Drake guys pull it off... meaning I still believe in the possibility... anyways. - You really make several excellent points - thanks for posting Vast

I also thank 9eagle9 for one post where she mentioned she doesn't descend into polarity but if she had to she could see it as greed vs decency... and I know which side she falls on there - the latter.

I can kind of see where she comes from and yes there are some good points regarding dependency. We could do with a lot less of a codependent society but with that said personal responsibility as a dogma does not immediately convey these vast powers of matter alteration that she posits.

Expecting people to just stand up in every situation when they do not have these same vast abilities is ridiculous. That's like telling a child it's their own fault at age 11 for being kidnapped and sold into sex slavery. While yes, on a level yes you can attribute partial responsibility to them; What personal responsibility philosophy often misses is this: A person's ability to decide a situation for themselves is predicated quite firmly on their ability to understand their choices in full and determine which of multiple equally valid outcomes they prefer.

Not something one has in spades when under stress let alone when someone gets the drop behind them. Plenty of people have died fighting muggers/thieves and the fact that she has managed to survive due to some nebulous ability does not somehow make it the fault of those dead that they did not magically have access to whatever reservoir of power she might possess.

It's fallacious to expect any human being will ever be able to do the same until someone can demonstrate a full training manual which grants these awesome powers. As otherwise there is no sufficient reason to suspect these powers are in any way the result of this belief of "personal responsibility."

[modwiz]

It is not so much that 9eagle9 is right brained as she works with both hemispheres simultaneously. Effortlessly synthesizing the data relevant to/for each hemisphere. This is the real capability of shamans and other magical types. Operating multidimensionally in fully awake consciousness. No trances needed. It is result of dedication to a path. Some innate ability may play some part, but like any talent, it is the work and effort that produces brilliance.

[Sebastion]

and a fine example of the masculine/feminine energies working in balance.........




It is not so much that 9eagle9 is right brained as she works with both hemispheres simultaneously. Effortlessly synthesizing the data relevant to/for each hemisphere. This is the real capability of shamans and other magical types. Operating multidimensional in fully awake consciousness. No trances needed. It is result of dedication to a path. Some innate ability may play some part, but like any talent, it is the work and effort that produces brilliance.

[9eagle9]

Unfortunately VM's right side has this sort of scripting in it , so I'm not sure how much good it would do. "1,000 years ago you'd be chattel owned by a rich Lord or monarch of some sorts..I mean, you might get treated well and have a nice title, but when it came down to it you'd basically be property of whichever aristocrat decided they wanted your power for their own."

Patriarchal mindset.

It also tells me that VM wouldn't deflect the way VM has does with a man. Thus far I haven't' seen VM discharge in that that with a man in this conversation either. That's organic programming.

Inorganic programming is external , noted the ready way VM invited another entity (myself) into their personal space. There's no discernment there because its been done before. That's external influence , attachments. That cording in we speak of in your thread Sebastion. VM's external influences would like to see VM harmed. Because something has been invited in before with willful consent the pattern repeats as a 'solution' when its really just another means to harm VM.

One spends less time talking to the person VM than the influence attached. Literally talking over one's head.

RM notes this had grown personal. It really never did. A program isn't personal they run all over the place. What's real isn't personal it's supposed to belong to everyone if they would simply own it.

Archonic energy has beef with mankind but it is primarily directed at woman and men who have re-incorporated that female side. Man functioned to preserve woman from archonic energies. The masculine energy of an individual is meant to preserve the female/intuitive side.

When they blend again in the way they are supposed one becomes re-integrated into who they are.

In spite of my 'lack of compassion' these sorts of conversations , and what they reveal, leave me feeling sad. I really don't know that humanity as whole is going to do operating under that sort of burden.

[Unified Serenity]

Hey folks,

I don´t mean to be rude, but maybe it´s time to stop this personal discussion here?

I think PMs are much more adequate for this kind of debate.

Cheers,

Raf.

No, I like watching 9eagle9 play with her foo.... i mean discuss things like this.

[Sebastion]

What most cannot see or understand is that one must integrate the right brain-the intuitive side in order to access one's true power more fully. Without doing that, you are literally using only half of your totality at best. One has to experience it for themselves to understand the truth of it. It's no wonder many feel that they need a leader to follow.





Unfortunately VM's right side has this sort of scripting in it , so I'm not sure how much good it would do. "1,000 years ago you'd be chattel owned by a rich Lord or monarch of some sorts..I mean, you might get treated well and have a nice title, but when it came down to it you'd basically be property of whichever aristocrat decided they wanted your power for their own."

Patriarchal mindset.

It also tells me that VM wouldn't deflect the way VM has does with a man. Thus far I haven't' seen VM discharge in that that with a man in this conversation either. That's organic programming.

Inorganic programming is external , noted the ready way VM invited another entity (myself) into their personal space. There's no discernment there because its been done before. That's external influence , attachments. That cording in we speak of in your thread Sebastion. VM's external influences would like to see VM harmed. Because something has been invited in before with willful consent the pattern repeats as a 'solution' when its really just another means to harm VM.

One spends less time talking to the person VM than the influence attached. Literally talking over one's head.

RM notes this had grown personal. It really never did. A program isn't personal they run all over the place. What's real isn't personal it's supposed to belong to everyone if they would simply own it.

Archonic energy has beef with mankind but it is primarily directed at woman and men who have re-incorporated that female side. Man functioned to preserve woman from archonic energies. The masculine energy of an individual is meant to preserve the female/intuitive side.

When they blend again in the way they are supposed one becomes re-integrated into who they are.

In spite of my 'lack of compassion' these sorts of conversations , and what they reveal, leave me feeling sad. I really don't know that humanity as whole is going to do operating under that sort of burden.

[jorr lundstrom]

It is not so much that 9eagle9 is right brained as she works with both hemispheres simultaneously. Effortlessly synthesizing the data relevant to/for each hemisphere. This is the real capability of shamans and other magical types. Operating multidimensionally in fully awake consciousness. No trances needed. It is result of dedication to a path. Some innate ability may play some part, but like any talent, it is the work and effort that produces brilliance.


Well, overwintered hippy. LOL

When the signals are made moving back and forth across the corpus

collosum fast enough, a standing wave is produced in the middle

of corpus collosum. This wave can be moved back and forth along

the corpus and down the spine, producing all kinds of phenomenons.

It can also be used to connect with other humans standing waves to

experience communion. ROFLOL


http://i600.photobucket.com/albums/tt81/sakasvattaja/magikereld.jpg



All is well


Jorr 2.0

[Chester]

Hey folks,

I don´t mean to be rude, but maybe it´s time to stop this personal discussion here?

I think PMs are much more adequate for this kind of debate.

Cheers,

Raf.


Apologies but I hope this discussion continues - Both Vast and 9 are making super excellent points and I have benefited and suspect others may as well benefit - Please don't stop

[9eagle9]

The hole that has been dug here is that Drake claims he is from a Dragon Order and promises to shortly 'reveal' the occult nature of the ptb (which has already been revealed). If Drake is who he claims to be then he will shortly be spouting the same sort of bull**** as VM percieves me to be. Or at least should be, although that 'occult' knowledge is anything but if we have already bandied it back and forth on this forum previously and within this very thread.

I would like to see VM then argue the same points with Drake as vigorously as I.

I would lay exactly 1, 147. 50 cents on the table to bet VM would not.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

IF (big if) Drake the draco, IS who he actually claims he his. His mode of operation suggest to me that he is not.

[Hervé]

To illustrate what 9eagle9's position is like, here is an example:



[...]


To give some reality on how a programmed individual keeps on going with the program whether the latter is inculcated on one while out-of-body as in "The Programming of A Planet (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?39288-Bill-Ryan-joining-Kerry-David-W.-with-Bill-Wood&p=411372&viewfull=1#post411372)" (abductions or `in-between lives') or through an upbringing within a particular culture, tradition or community, here is an example of a mom who tried to talk some sense into her son who is still caught up into what has become a cult:



Sadly, the last time we saw our son who is still in the [cult], I pointed out the outpoint of "[cult]" to him. He could not respond other than to repeat how the building needs to be finished first and the staff in place before the tech can be delivered.

I kept trying to get him to duplicate that all that isn’t required to get staff through, even if only one at a time. It was amazing for me to see how he could not respond other than to state the party line about the building. He just could not think it through.

The only other time I have personally witnessed what I saw in my son was a time years ago when a friend of mine was hypnotized by her brother in front of me and her boyfriend. Her brother asked me what I would like him to have her do after he woke her up. I wanted to see if she would repeat something that she would considered silly under normal circumstances. I said, have her get up and flush the toilet every time you tug at your collar.

So he gave her the command, then woke her up. He tugged his collar, she got up, went into the bathroom and flushed the toilet, came back and sat down. He tugged his collar again, and she did it again. And again. After three or four times, I finally asked her why she kept getting up to flush the toilet.

First, she just said it needed flushing. She did it again. And again, I asked her why she kept flushing the toilet. Each time I asked her, she would make up some lame reason as to why she had to flush the toilet.

She got more and more annoyed at me for asking, but she did it again and again upon command and could never see that there was anything strange about it.

Her brother hypnotized her once more to release her of the command, but what an amazing thing to have witnessed.

This is what I saw in my son. He could not answer a simple question about [cult], but only parrot the party line.



Emphasis ,mine, to underline what happens with an awake individual's "friends" and "family" who just refuse to hear or talk about anything else than what's on TeeVee...


So... how to un-hypnotize post-hypnotic-controlled skull-dwelling zombies who are either under the spell of post-hypnotic orders and behaviours, or an equivalent, when they are not only unaware of it but would fight anyone attempting to demonstrate it to them... tough catch-22 job!



In a general way, what can be done is starting, as exemplified above, with oneself then expand gradually to others on a gentle slope instead of using shock therapy as the MSM love to do following the courts proceedings: John Doe vs the rest of the whole bloody universe (see my 2sd signature)!





Then, regarding Wilcock and Drake, the following is at play as well (which ends up producing what's above to keep it in an endless loop since the underlying programming is for people to need to believe in... something):




PLAY ON PEOPLE'S NEED TO BELIEVE TO CREATE A CULTLIKE FOLLOWING



by Robert Greene



Law 27 -- Play on People's Need to Believe to Create a Cultlike Following

Judgment: People have an overwhelming desire to believe in something. Become the focal point of such desire by offering them a cause, a new faith to follow. Keep your words vague but full of promise; emphasize enthusiasm over rationality and clear thinking. Give your new disciples rituals to perform, ask them to make sacrifices on your behalf. In the absence of organized religion and grand causes, your new belief system will bring you untold power.

In searching, as you must, for the methods that will gain you the most power for the least effort, you will find the creation of a cultlike following one of the most effective. Having a large following opens up all sorts of possibilities for deception; not only will your followers worship you, they will defend you from your enemies and will voluntarily take on the work of enticing others to join your fledgling cult. This kind of power will lift you to another realm: You will no longer have to struggle or use subterfuge to enforce your will. You are adored and can do no wrong.

You might think it a gargantuan task to create such a following, but in fact it is fairly simple. As humans, we have a desperate need to believe in something, anything. This makes us eminently gullible: We simply cannot endure long periods of doubt, or of the emptiness that comes from a lack of something to believe in. Dangle in front of us some new cause, elixir, get-rich-quick scheme, or the latest technological trend or art movement and we leap from the water as one to take the bait. Look at history: The chronicles of the new trends and cults that have made a mass following for themselves could fill a library. After a few centuries, a few decades, a few years, a few months, they generally look ridiculous, but at the time they seem so attractive, so transcendental, so divine.

Always in a rush to believe in something, we will manufacture saints and faiths out of nothing. Do not let this gullibility go to waste: Make yourself the object of worship. Make people form a cult around you.

The great European charlatans of the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries mastered the art of cultmaking. They lived, as we do now, in a time of transformation: Organized religion was on the wane, science on the rise. People were desperate to rally around a new cause or faith. The charlatans had begun by peddling health elixirs and alchemic shortcuts to wealth. Moving quickly from town to town, they originally focused on small groups -- until, by accident, they stumbled on a truth of human nature: The larger the group they gathered around themselves, the easier it was to deceive.

The charlatan would station himself on a high wooden platform (hence the term "mountebank") and crowds would swarm around him. In a group setting, people were more emotional, less able to reason. Had the charlatan spoken to them individually, they might have found him ridiculous, but lost in a crowd they got caught up in a communal mood of rapt attention. It became impossible for them to find the distance to be skeptical. Any deficiencies in the charlatan's ideas were hidden by the zeal of the mass. Passion and enthusiasm swept through the crowd like a contagion, and they reacted violently to anyone who dared to spread a seed of doubt. Both consciously studying this dynamic over decades of experiment and spontaneously adapting to these situations as they happened, the charlatans perfected the science of attracting and holding a crowd, molding the crowd into followers and the followers into a cult

The gimmicks of the charlatans may seem quaint today, but there are thousands of charlatans among us still, using the same tried-and-true methods their predecessors refined centuries ago, only changing the names of their elixirs and modernizing the look of their cults. We find these latter-day charlatans in all arenas of life -- business, fashion, politics, art. Many of them, perhaps, are following in the charlatan tradition without having any knowledge of its history, but you can be more systematic and deliberate. Simply follow the five steps of cultmaking that our charlatan ancestors perfected over the years.

Step 1: Keep it Vague; Keep it Simple. To create a cult you must first attract attention. This you should do not through actions, which are too clear and readable, but through words, which are hazy and deceptive. Your initial speeches, conversations, and interviews must include two elements: on the one hand the promise of something great and transformative, and on the other a total vagueness. This combination will stimulate all kinds of hazy dreams in your listeners, who will make their own connections and see what they want to see.

To make your vagueness attractive, use words of great resonance but cloudy meaning, words full of heat and enthusiasm. Fancy titles for simple things are helpful, as are the use of numbers and the creation of new words for vague concepts. All of these create the impression of specialized knowledge, giving you a veneer of profundity. By the same token, try to make the subject of your cult new and fresh, so that few will understand it. Done right, the combination of vague promises, cloudy but alluring concepts, and fiery enthusiasm will stir people's souls and a group will form around you.

Talk too vaguely and you have no credibility. But it is more dangerous to be specific. If you explain in detail the benefits people will gain by following your cult, you will be expected to satisfy them.

As a corollary to its vagueness your appeal should also be simple. Most people's problems have complex causes: deep-rooted neurosis, interconnected social factors, roots that go way back in time and are exceedingly hard to unravel. Few, however, have the patience to deal with this; most people want to hear that a simple solution will cure their problems. The ability to offer this kind of solution will give you great power and build you a following. Instead of the complicated explanations of real life, return to the primitive solutions of our ancestors, to good old country remedies, to mysterious panaceas.




Full article here:
http://www.american-buddha.com/greene.cult.htm (http://www.american-buddha.com/greene.cult.htm)

[Taurean]

Just came across this interview which could probably apply to a few threads at the moment. - a lot of inter-twining info that requires a huge dollop of discernment !

Starts at 6.00

d4fLwBdAWyw

[seigiarchon]

Bill Ryan had always been a protagonist of kicking out TPTB, UFO disclosures, free energy devices and stamping out poverty.

Yet in the last year or so, Bill had grown increasingly distant from the fiascos on Project Avalon.

Drake and Wilcock had posted some pretty legit documents on the net in regards to some impending "mass arrests" and "take-down of the elites" yet Bill had stayed pretty aloof from the latest Charles/Atticus re-run.

Now I know why.

I don't think there will be any mass arrests. I don't think there will be any take-down of TPTB and the elites. I don't think there will be any mass UFO disclosures, no free energy disclosures or stamping out of poverty..

In fact, I don't even think there will be an "Earth" left after the "3 days of darkness" on 21st Dec 2012.

I think that Bill knows what's gonna happen is not the regime change as proposed by Drake, Wilcock and Fulford but it's gonna be a new reshaping of reality altogether.

The "mass arrests" and "topping of TPTB elites" are gonna be drops of water compared to the ocean of changes that is coming.

Bill knows what he is NOT talking about. Lol.. :madgrin:

[seigiarchon]

Bill Ryan had always been a protagonist of kicking out TPTB, UFO disclosures, free energy devices and stamping out poverty.

Yet in the last year or so, Bill had grown increasingly distant from the fiascos on Project Avalon.

Drake and Wilcock had posted some pretty legit documents on the net in regards to some impending "mass arrests" and "take-down of the elites" yet Bill had stayed pretty aloof from the latest Charles/Atticus re-run.

Now I know why.

I don't think there will be any mass arrests. I don't think there will be any take-down of TPTB and the elites. I don't think there will be any mass UFO disclosures, no free energy disclosures or stamping out of poverty..

In fact, I don't even think there will be an "Earth" left after the "3 days of darkness" on 21st Dec 2012.

I think that Bill knows what's gonna happen is not the regime change as proposed by Drake, Wilcock and Fulford but it's gonna be a new reshaping of reality altogether.

The "mass arrests" and "topping of TPTB elites" are gonna be drops of water compared to the ocean of changes that is coming.

Bill knows what he is NOT talking about. Lol.. :madgrin:

If civilizations don't need laws to keep moral conducts in check, what need will there be for arrests?

If civilizations don't need money as a concept to flourish, what need will there be for the toppling of TPTB elites?

Question is.. if a civilization or civilizations do not need laws or money as cornerstones of societies, what kind of a civilization is it?

We still need to feed our bodies.. don't we? :confused::angel:

[Wind]

Bill has already shared his view with us many times. Why would he hold back information if his mission is actually to spread it?

[Maia Gabrial]

We've been brainwashed into thinking that these are the ONLY ways to live. Look at the Andromedans, according to Alex Collier - EVERYTHING is free to them. There is no money. Give me that kind of society any day....

[eaglespirit]

No One is holding back anything in this now time of an ever so potent ethical stream that is now flowing and overflowing into every facet of Our Lives!

Clean out those 'critters' from deep within and simply live as impeccably good as You are able every moment and be inline with the cosmic and natural energies that are here on Mother Earth right in front of Us to take Our Own Loving Creative Moments to the Stars and Beyond.

It IS that simple...Living Unconditional Love with Wisdom and Creating Your Own Loving Reality has never been more smooth sailing than it is right now!!!

[mountain_jim]

I think that Bill knows what's gonna happen is not the regime change as proposed by Drake, Wilcock and Fulford but it's gonna be a new reshaping of reality altogether.

The "mass arrests" and "topping of TPTB elites" are gonna be drops of water compared to the ocean of changes that is coming.

Bill knows what he is NOT talking about. Lol..


I don't think Bill needs to have 'what he knows or thinks' claimed by other posters here.

He states that well enough on his own.

[gripreaper]

In fact, I don't even think there will be an "Earth" left after the "3 days of darkness" on 21st Dec 2012.

So, did you have an astral experience where you "heard" voices, of how did you come to this conclusion?

[tenacity1]

wise words Eaglespirit.. I admire and respect Bill Ryan and Kerry Cassidy.. that isn't to say I have to agree with them entirely to respect them and send them agape love. They have taken their lives into their hands and not been complicit in their complacency as so many have. They STOOD UP for truth and let folks decide for themselves. They remain in my prayers constantly along with David Wilcock and Drake and others. I've always found it ironic that a movement of positive thinking folks can sometimes(note I said sometimes) be so darn negative.. you'd think we all knew what will happen. None of us do. Time will tell..till then I will live with love in my heart and hope and pray for as better world. Those of you cycnicscan call me naiive ..I don't care.. in my gut I know better days can come if we support the work being done with positive energy.

[Chester]

EDIT - Posted in wrong thread

[Lost N Found]

We've been brainwashed into thinking that these are the ONLY ways to live. Look at the Andromedans, according to Alex Collier - EVERYTHING is free to them. There is no money. Give me that kind of society any day....


I am with you 100 percent on that. Money is such an evil, mind twisting thing. We have everything we need on this blue ball for free without the use of Money.

[WhiteFeather]

Bill Ryan had always been a protagonist of kicking out TPTB, UFO disclosures, free energy devices and stamping out poverty.

Yet in the last year or so, Bill had grown increasingly distant from the fiascos on Project Avalon.

Drake and Wilcock had posted some pretty legit documents on the net in regards to some impending "mass arrests" and "take-down of the elites" yet Bill had stayed pretty aloof from the latest Charles/Atticus re-run.

Now I know why.

I don't think there will be any mass arrests. I don't think there will be any take-down of TPTB and the elites. I don't think there will be any mass UFO disclosures, no free energy disclosures or stamping out of poverty..

In fact, I don't even think there will be an "Earth" left after the "3 days of darkness" on 21st Dec 2012.

I think that Bill knows what's gonna happen is not the regime change as proposed by Drake, Wilcock and Fulford but it's gonna be a new reshaping of reality altogether.

The "mass arrests" and "topping of TPTB elites" are gonna be drops of water compared to the ocean of changes that is coming.

Bill knows what he is NOT talking about. Lol.. :madgrin:

Your consciousness differs alot from mine. As I think better days are well upon us. What we think we become. Im sorry to hear of your negative thoughts.

[Lost N Found]

Bill Ryan had always been a protagonist of kicking out TPTB, UFO disclosures, free energy devices and stamping out poverty.

Yet in the last year or so, Bill had grown increasingly distant from the fiascos on Project Avalon.

Drake and Wilcock had posted some pretty legit documents on the net in regards to some impending "mass arrests" and "take-down of the elites" yet Bill had stayed pretty aloof from the latest Charles/Atticus re-run.

Now I know why.

I don't think there will be any mass arrests. I don't think there will be any take-down of TPTB and the elites. I don't think there will be any mass UFO disclosures, no free energy disclosures or stamping out of poverty..

In fact, I don't even think there will be an "Earth" left after the "3 days of darkness" on 21st Dec 2012.

I think that Bill knows what's gonna happen is not the regime change as proposed by Drake, Wilcock and Fulford but it's gonna be a new reshaping of reality altogether.

The "mass arrests" and "topping of TPTB elites" are gonna be drops of water compared to the ocean of changes that is coming.

Bill knows what he is NOT talking about. Lol.. :madgrin:


You are sure thinking alot. I certainly hope you do not have effective dreams like the guy in the "Lathe of Heaven" unless you are going to change everything for the better.

So we are, I guess. to believe that Bill Ryan knows what is really going to happen? Bill, are you going to give us all at least a 24 hour notice so we can get everything in order?

[seigiarchon]

We've been brainwashed into thinking that these are the ONLY ways to live. Look at the Andromedans, according to Alex Collier - EVERYTHING is free to them. There is no money. Give me that kind of society any day....

Question is.. do the Andromedans have 3D physical bodies?

¤=[Post Update]=¤



Bill Ryan had always been a protagonist of kicking out TPTB, UFO disclosures, free energy devices and stamping out poverty.

Yet in the last year or so, Bill had grown increasingly distant from the fiascos on Project Avalon.

Drake and Wilcock had posted some pretty legit documents on the net in regards to some impending "mass arrests" and "take-down of the elites" yet Bill had stayed pretty aloof from the latest Charles/Atticus re-run.

Now I know why.

I don't think there will be any mass arrests. I don't think there will be any take-down of TPTB and the elites. I don't think there will be any mass UFO disclosures, no free energy disclosures or stamping out of poverty..

In fact, I don't even think there will be an "Earth" left after the "3 days of darkness" on 21st Dec 2012.

I think that Bill knows what's gonna happen is not the regime change as proposed by Drake, Wilcock and Fulford but it's gonna be a new reshaping of reality altogether.

The "mass arrests" and "topping of TPTB elites" are gonna be drops of water compared to the ocean of changes that is coming.

Bill knows what he is NOT talking about. Lol.. :madgrin:

Your consciousness differs alot from mine. As I think better days are well upon us. What we think we become. Im sorry to hear of your negative thoughts.

I happen to think Humanity will experience much more beneficial changes than just "mass arrests and toppling of the NWO elite".

[seigiarchon]

Bill has already shared his view with us many times. Why would he hold back information if his mission is actually to spread it?

If you think that anybody is in here sharing 100% of their information, then you would be lying to yourself.

Why do you think Bill, with all his contacts, stated that he would put a video of him "eating his hat" on youtube if the proposed mass arrests go down this year? Pretty daring statement, I would say.

The man knows something we don't.

Now I am not saying that the NWO elite have nothing to fear.

Remember the spate of mass resignations during March and Feb?

Obviously something is gonna happen end of this year which frightens many top CEOs into handing in their resignations.. something more scary than just mass arrests I would say..

I happen to think that a more justifiable punishment than just "mass arrests of the elites" is gonna happen to humanity.

Didn't they say that Judgment Day is gonna arrive at the end of this year? Hey even the good J-Princess say our souls and hearts will be judged during the 3 days of darkness.

Now if there is going to be the 3 days of Judgment Darkness, why would the Gods have need for the "mass arrests" to happen?

Lastly Bill himself said he wasn't sharing 100% of his info. Check out his post here.

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=478348&viewfull=1#post478348

I remarked quite some time ago -- back in Camelot’s heyday – that if any researcher into covert global affairs were to be 100% intellectually honest, the rabbithole would lead to some very dark places where one might not have originally intended to go at all.

It stops being fun, and one might readily regret embarking on the journey. But the data trail leads there, so one has to take courage and proceed.

This thread epitomizes that. It’s where the trail leads. It’s unsavory, but I believe there’s an immense amount of extremely important, unsavory truth here. That’s why I think this thread is so significant.

[DreamsInDigital]

Question is.. do the Andromedans have 3D physical bodies?
Physicality exist in all dimensions,The Andromedans In reference are 5D, not 3D, even there though they have physical bodies like we do.

[seigiarchon]

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?43958-Drake-and-Teri-a-contrary-view.&p=475663&viewfull=1#post475663

Quote Posted by WHOMADEGOD (here)
Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
Quote Posted by Mozart (here)

I'm willing to bet a whole case of raw milk on having 15 out of those aforementioned 19 bastards to be arrested. Any takers?

~Mozart
I'll up the stakes. If they are arrested, I'll eat my hat and post it on YouTube. (To get it down, I'd mix it in a blender with raw milk. I love raw milk too.)

Translation: Nothing of this kind will happen. Wilcock is being taken for a ride, although he's normally pretty smart. It's disinfo, folks. Joel Skousen called it the other day talking to Alex Jones. It's a distracting sideshow. There are very serious issues in the world and (as with Elenin, 11-11-11, etc etc last year), your attention is being diverted.

Distracted from what please Bill?


* Nuclear false flag event in the US
* Fukushima deterioration leading to significant radiation release
* Global financial crisis and devaluation of the dollar
* Possibility of major earthquake risk (Japan / US West Coast / New Madrid)
* Major solar activity (1859-type event, but larger) with anticipated timing Dec 2012 -- Jan 2013.


Mass Arrests? More likely Mass Destruction of the planet would take place rather than Mass Arrests.

[seigiarchon]

Question is.. do the Andromedans have 3D physical bodies?
Physicality exist in all dimensions,The Andromedans In reference are 5D, not 3D, even there though they have physical bodies like we do.

There are no physical bodies in 5D and that is where we are going post 2012. Hell there aren't even any physical bodies in 4D.

Come 2012, Earth and Humanity will be a totally Energetic Non-Physical Spiritual Race after the 3 days of Judgement Darkness on 21st December 2012

Or it will be my turn to eat my own "hat" and more.. This I can promise you with my life..

[DreamsInDigital]

What ever, am not debating that with you. I have bigger fish to fry than debating dimensional physics with a brick wall.

[seigiarchon]

What ever, am not debating that with you. I have bigger fish to fry than debating dimensional physics with a brick wall.

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=468394&viewfull=1#post468394

Their hidden agenda is preventing us raising our consciousness. They are doing this because we are going to know what they are doing as we become more conscious. Abilities such as telepathy, seeing energy, clairvoyance and a general increased awareness of what is really going on here will develop. They are telepathic, they work using energy and don't want us to realize. We could pick up their thoughts as I started to do, we could sense their energy techniques and weapons they use to harm and then they couldn't use them. Brian has also said that we would be harder to control if we raise our consciousness. Such people don't "play ball", they question more, and they won't be told what to do and other such things, very undesirable to a control state. Our real "game" here on earth I have learnt is Ascension and leaving earth. In order to ascend, some term it enlightenment we have to raise our consciousness or vibration, They are keeping us away from this by making methods of achieving this hard to come by and keeping us distracted and this is why they try and stop and in some cases have, organizations dedicated to higher consciousness. Other techniques they use to keep us away from raising our consciousness is by distractions such as education, television, sex, material possessions, , cramming us with meaningless tasks such as bills, debt, working too many hours, we have no time to do it.

[9eagle9]

EDIT - Posted in wrong thread

I read it in my email box, it was a splendid letter regardless of the wrong thread, and what i know of Drake, and personally you are far more diplomatic than I and could very well serve as an ambassador.....of something. Something good anyway, something that supports is all that i would wish for you.

Regardless of how I view Drake I think you should repost your post here just in case other's didn't get a good look at it and are not inclined to post in the myriad Drake threads.

[sygh]

To illustrate what 9eagle9's position is like, here is an example:



[...]


To give some reality on how a programmed individual keeps on going with the program whether the latter is inculcated on one while out-of-body as in "The Programming of A Planet (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?39288-Bill-Ryan-joining-Kerry-David-W.-with-Bill-Wood&p=411372&viewfull=1#post411372)" (abductions or `in-between lives') or through an upbringing within a particular culture, tradition or community, here is an example of a mom who tried to talk some sense into her son who is still caught up into what has become a cult:



Sadly, the last time we saw our son who is still in the [cult], I pointed out the outpoint of "[cult]" to him. He could not respond other than to repeat how the building needs to be finished first and the staff in place before the tech can be delivered.

I kept trying to get him to duplicate that all that isn’t required to get staff through, even if only one at a time. It was amazing for me to see how he could not respond other than to state the party line about the building. He just could not think it through.

The only other time I have personally witnessed what I saw in my son was a time years ago when a friend of mine was hypnotized by her brother in front of me and her boyfriend. Her brother asked me what I would like him to have her do after he woke her up. I wanted to see if she would repeat something that she would considered silly under normal circumstances. I said, have her get up and flush the toilet every time you tug at your collar.

So he gave her the command, then woke her up. He tugged his collar, she got up, went into the bathroom and flushed the toilet, came back and sat down. He tugged his collar again, and she did it again. And again. After three or four times, I finally asked her why she kept getting up to flush the toilet.

First, she just said it needed flushing. She did it again. And again, I asked her why she kept flushing the toilet. Each time I asked her, she would make up some lame reason as to why she had to flush the toilet.

She got more and more annoyed at me for asking, but she did it again and again upon command and could never see that there was anything strange about it.

Her brother hypnotized her once more to release her of the command, but what an amazing thing to have witnessed.

This is what I saw in my son. He could not answer a simple question about [cult], but only parrot the party line.



Emphasis ,mine, to underline what happens with an awake individual's "friends" and "family" who just refuse to hear or talk about anything else than what's on TeeVee...


So... how to un-hypnotize post-hypnotic-controlled skull-dwelling zombies who are either under the spell of post-hypnotic orders and behaviours, or an equivalent, when they are not only unaware of it but would fight anyone attempting to demonstrate it to them... tough catch-22 job!



In a general way, what can be done is starting, as exemplified above, with oneself then expand gradually to others on a gentle slope instead of using shock therapy as the MSM love to do following the courts proceedings: John Doe vs the rest of the whole bloody universe (see my 2sd signature)!





Then, regarding Wilcock and Drake, the following is at play as well (which ends up producing what's above to keep it in an endless loop since the underlying programming is for people to need to believe in... something):




PLAY ON PEOPLE'S NEED TO BELIEVE TO CREATE A CULTLIKE FOLLOWING



by Robert Greene



Law 27 -- Play on People's Need to Believe to Create a Cultlike Following

Judgment: People have an overwhelming desire to believe in something. Become the focal point of such desire by offering them a cause, a new faith to follow. Keep your words vague but full of promise; emphasize enthusiasm over rationality and clear thinking. Give your new disciples rituals to perform, ask them to make sacrifices on your behalf. In the absence of organized religion and grand causes, your new belief system will bring you untold power.

In searching, as you must, for the methods that will gain you the most power for the least effort, you will find the creation of a cultlike following one of the most effective. Having a large following opens up all sorts of possibilities for deception; not only will your followers worship you, they will defend you from your enemies and will voluntarily take on the work of enticing others to join your fledgling cult. This kind of power will lift you to another realm: You will no longer have to struggle or use subterfuge to enforce your will. You are adored and can do no wrong.

You might think it a gargantuan task to create such a following, but in fact it is fairly simple. As humans, we have a desperate need to believe in something, anything. This makes us eminently gullible: We simply cannot endure long periods of doubt, or of the emptiness that comes from a lack of something to believe in. Dangle in front of us some new cause, elixir, get-rich-quick scheme, or the latest technological trend or art movement and we leap from the water as one to take the bait. Look at history: The chronicles of the new trends and cults that have made a mass following for themselves could fill a library. After a few centuries, a few decades, a few years, a few months, they generally look ridiculous, but at the time they seem so attractive, so transcendental, so divine.

Always in a rush to believe in something, we will manufacture saints and faiths out of nothing. Do not let this gullibility go to waste: Make yourself the object of worship. Make people form a cult around you.

The great European charlatans of the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries mastered the art of cultmaking. They lived, as we do now, in a time of transformation: Organized religion was on the wane, science on the rise. People were desperate to rally around a new cause or faith. The charlatans had begun by peddling health elixirs and alchemic shortcuts to wealth. Moving quickly from town to town, they originally focused on small groups -- until, by accident, they stumbled on a truth of human nature: The larger the group they gathered around themselves, the easier it was to deceive.

The charlatan would station himself on a high wooden platform (hence the term "mountebank") and crowds would swarm around him. In a group setting, people were more emotional, less able to reason. Had the charlatan spoken to them individually, they might have found him ridiculous, but lost in a crowd they got caught up in a communal mood of rapt attention. It became impossible for them to find the distance to be skeptical. Any deficiencies in the charlatan's ideas were hidden by the zeal of the mass. Passion and enthusiasm swept through the crowd like a contagion, and they reacted violently to anyone who dared to spread a seed of doubt. Both consciously studying this dynamic over decades of experiment and spontaneously adapting to these situations as they happened, the charlatans perfected the science of attracting and holding a crowd, molding the crowd into followers and the followers into a cult

The gimmicks of the charlatans may seem quaint today, but there are thousands of charlatans among us still, using the same tried-and-true methods their predecessors refined centuries ago, only changing the names of their elixirs and modernizing the look of their cults. We find these latter-day charlatans in all arenas of life -- business, fashion, politics, art. Many of them, perhaps, are following in the charlatan tradition without having any knowledge of its history, but you can be more systematic and deliberate. Simply follow the five steps of cultmaking that our charlatan ancestors perfected over the years.

Step 1: Keep it Vague; Keep it Simple. To create a cult you must first attract attention. This you should do not through actions, which are too clear and readable, but through words, which are hazy and deceptive. Your initial speeches, conversations, and interviews must include two elements: on the one hand the promise of something great and transformative, and on the other a total vagueness. This combination will stimulate all kinds of hazy dreams in your listeners, who will make their own connections and see what they want to see.

To make your vagueness attractive, use words of great resonance but cloudy meaning, words full of heat and enthusiasm. Fancy titles for simple things are helpful, as are the use of numbers and the creation of new words for vague concepts. All of these create the impression of specialized knowledge, giving you a veneer of profundity. By the same token, try to make the subject of your cult new and fresh, so that few will understand it. Done right, the combination of vague promises, cloudy but alluring concepts, and fiery enthusiasm will stir people's souls and a group will form around you.

Talk too vaguely and you have no credibility. But it is more dangerous to be specific. If you explain in detail the benefits people will gain by following your cult, you will be expected to satisfy them.

As a corollary to its vagueness your appeal should also be simple. Most people's problems have complex causes: deep-rooted neurosis, interconnected social factors, roots that go way back in time and are exceedingly hard to unravel. Few, however, have the patience to deal with this; most people want to hear that a simple solution will cure their problems. The ability to offer this kind of solution will give you great power and build you a following. Instead of the complicated explanations of real life, return to the primitive solutions of our ancestors, to good old country remedies, to mysterious panaceas.




Full article here:
http://www.american-buddha.com/greene.cult.htm (http://www.american-buddha.com/greene.cult.htm)

Add one more thing, Zoe... you forgot "Do your own research". In other words, talk yourself into believing, it's much more potent that way.
Just my personal opinion. The same thing can happen to millions of people and, if played right, every single one of them can get what they want.
If I'm wrong, I'll take a bite of Bill's hat too. I hope I'm wrong, truely.

[Hervé]

To illustrate what 9eagle9's position is like, here is an example:







Add one more thing, Zoe... you forgot "Do your own research". In other words, talk yourself into believing, it's much more potent that way.
Just my personal opinion. The same thing can happen to millions of people and, if played right, every single one of them can get what they want.
If I'm wrong, I'll take a bite of Bill's hat too. I hope I'm wrong, truely.


True, I have a tendency to assume it's self evident and that one wouldn't need to specify it... how wrong!

On the other hand, rather than talking oneself into believing, I'd rather KNOW through experience and experiment that something works or is the way it is; much like 9eagle9.

As for hat-eating party, well... "hat" is unfortunately pretty safe from being chewed on, see: this post (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?43793-Drake-Updates-clarifications-and-more&p=483679&viewfull=1#post483679).

[sygh]

Just trying to be nice to all Avalonians. Wanting something wonderful to happen is nothing to be ashamed about. We know, unless a miricle happens, eventually there will be a Bank bust, as currently there is a banking boom printing money galore. People are scared. I don't want to see Avalonians to get forelorn just because yoohoo is talking trash.

Further... for all anyone knows, I'm doing this, right? Wrong; and here's my point: Since when have Avalonians started calling and accusing each other of being "plants", further threatening to be watching what they do from now on. If I were a mod, I'd have suspended the guy, or girl.

I say... iffin ur gonna do it, then DO IT.

[Chester]

Regardless of how I view Drake I think you should repost your post here just in case other's didn't get a good look at it and are not inclined to post in the myriad Drake threads.

Hi 9eagle9 - I wrote a letter to Drake and I meant to post it in Vivek's thread as that was the appropriate place ... I think there's a rule about posting the same thing in multiple threads and so here's the link -
http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?44252-Who-is-DRAKE-The-Loyal-Order-of-the-Royal-Dragon&p=483690&viewfull=1#post483690

I want to add that its very important to me - and probably others here but I cannot speak for them - that Drake addresses the concerns raised in Vivek's thread by several posters (not just Vivek) as well as in other threads in the forum. His reaction based on what I heard in the transcript is not at all what I would expect of a someone of the Wisdom. Now I can see overlooking the reaction based on knowing all the stress he has to be under, but that would require he make himself available to answering some questions about all that. Thanks to Kimberly, I got his e-mail address and I mailed the letter - so far no response. Some might say I should not expect one as he must be very busy with far more important matters, but if that were the case, then why did this thread get so much of Drake's attention and cause such a reaction unless Avalon was somehow important to him.

I have an idea and that is this - why don't we try and make a list of questions - present them respectfully and ask that he kindly respond to them? I would be glad to offer some suggested questions. Its so much in how things are worded that is such a key to communication - and so the way the questions are worded is just as critical.

I will sleep on this and begin my list tomorrow.

[Chester]

To illustrate what 9eagle9's position is like, here is an example:





Add one more thing, Zoe... you forgot "Do your own research". In other words, talk yourself into believing, it's much more potent that way.
Just my personal opinion. The same thing can happen to millions of people and, if played right, every single one of them can get what they want.
If I'm wrong, I'll take a bite of Bill's hat too. I hope I'm wrong, truely.


True, I have a tendency to assume it's self evident and that one wouldn't need to specify it... how wrong!

On the other hand, rather than talking oneself into believing, I'd rather KNOW through experience and experiment that something works or is the way it is; much like 9eagle9.

As for hat-eating party, well... "hat" is unfortunately pretty safe from being chewed on, see: this post (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?43793-Drake-Updates-clarifications-and-more&p=483679&viewfull=1#post483679).

That is a very, very sobering post - and sadly... those who have been in touch with Drake may be providing an opportunity/excuse for this possible scenario - somewhere behind the Plan may be chess masters who are far far better than the so called "good guys" and Bill may be wrong that its just distraction - it could be worse.

[9eagle9]

And what was his reaction that you do not percieve as being sourced from a place of wisdom, JustOne?

[Blueskywalking]

Ben Fulford – 8th May 2012 – The White Dragon Roars, Europe Rattles – Plus: Inside Report On Secret Financial Deals

www.benjaminfulford.net

The elections last weekend in Europe showed the inevitable popular backlash against government mandated austerity. The problem is that the new governments will also find their purses empty unless they start talking with the White Dragon Society. This time, they need to send official embassy representatives with valid IDs and not another batch of anonymous agents. When the new financial system starts up and the criminals are removed from the core of the Western financial system, then money will pour like rain on Europe (it already is in the non-cabal controlled part of the world).

The basic outlines of the new system are as follows: The US dollars owned by people outside of the US (and those created before 2008 in the US) will be backed by gold and a basket of commodities and other currencies. This will then become the international dollar (or perhaps international yen or yuan) and be used to facilitate world trade. The Euro will be split into a fortified Deutschemark shared by Northern countries while the Mediterranean countries will revert to their traditional currencies and devalue them until their real economies are competitive enough. This will be followed by a one off massive debt write off.

The maneuvers behind the setting up the new system involve a reunion between some old shady business partners: the CIA and their Asian secret society counterparts from the golden triangle days. This time instead of dealing in heroin (although the golden triangle may soon be back in that business) they will be dealing in black gold. This will provide for the continued financing of the military industrial secret society complex until they are able to restructure their organizations so they are once again self-financed. All Freemasons, P2ers, Thule Society and other secret groupings may join the party by contacting the White Dragon Society.

The condition attached is an agreement to participate in a massive campaign to end poverty, stop environmental destruction and free the suppressed technology.

The old world order folk, for their part are once again resorting to terrorist blackmail. There are credible reports of a massive terrorist attack against the Tokyo area on or about May 22nd. This attack is linked to a cabal plan to force 40 million Japanese to evacuate to Korea and China. The cabalists were then hoping to open a new world financial nexus in a special zone being constructed near Pusan, Korea. Their plan involved using easy to manipulate Korean Christians as a buffer between the Khazarian rulers and their new Asian subjects.

The increased radiation hype and fear mongering is also being orchestrated by the old world order. This writer found a suspicious looking lady (actually my dog, who never barks, found her by walking in a circle around her barking) in the park near my house. This was on a rainy day following two weeks of heavy rain coming from the Fukushima area around the sabotaged (courtesy of J. Rockefeller) nuclear plants. She was standing near a nexus of accumulated rain water with one Geiger counter in her hand and another on the ground. When I asked her what she was doing, she said she was testing for radiation. I asked her to show me the Geiger counters and they both registered only normal background radiation.

The local electronic shop sells 50 dollar Geiger counters these days and all paranoid people are buying them and becoming reassured.

However, this dangerous cabal is not going to go quietly into the night and we would like to ask the US armed forces, if they are serious about maintaining a defense treaty with Japan, to round up the known cabalists (they have the names and addresses of the committee of 300 etc.) before they carry out any more mass murder.

It is also becoming clear that Chinese agents linked to Bo Xilai approached this writer in February with an offer of money. The offer was to start a joint venture between a Chinese company based in Dalian (Bo’s power base) and Fireside Stoves, a wood-burning stove import company this writer owns 10% of. The idea was to utilize Fireside’s Japan-wide network of stove dealers and roof-top construction workers to install Dalian manufactured combination solar and wind power generators on roof-tops throughout Japan.

The Chinese offered to list this planned 50/50 joint venture on the Hong Kong stock exchange and raise an initial $100 million in capital. This venture would then have been able to directly fight against the cabal’s control of the global energy business.

The Chinese agent returned later to say that the deal was off because of Bo Xilai’s arrest.

My best guess is that Bo Xilai was linked to a Rothschild faction and that P2 lodge types were somehow involved in the incident that led to his downfall. This is because P2 honcho Mario Draghi appeared on Xinhua news shaking hands with Bo rival Li Keqiang shortly after the downfall of Bo Xilai. Needless to say there is a lot of speculation involved here but the Chinese are investigating the entire issue very thoroughly and I am sure they will find out the real truth. However, they should entertain and investigate the possibility that Bo was framed, especially given the role played by the US embassy in this incident.

It is also worth repeating here that this writer is in no way a Rothschild agent. I have no Rothschild blood in me and have never received a penny from them. On the contrary, I seek the end of their secret regime of murder, terror and bribery. I also plan to charge them along with some members of the Rockefeller family with various murders here in Japan.

What needs to be seen in the coming weeks is if the US military and agencies are really the good guys who are ready to resume their role as super heroes and protectors of the planet earth. If they are, they can be assured of generous continued financing as they restructure themselves for a period of global peace and prosperity.

There is a fellow by the name of Drake going around the various anti-cabal internet sites promising pentagon action and mass arrests in June. Neil Keenan confirms that Drake is a genuine US military person authorized to speak within limited parameters. If he is for real and the military is serious, they need to force the corporate media to start reporting the truth and they need to suspend from office all politicians who have been bribed by the cabal. That means most politicians.

[Dennis Leahy]

...(from Ben Fulford's blog)...

The problem is that the new governments will also find their purses empty unless they start talking with the White Dragon Society. ...

The basic outlines of the new system are as follows: The US dollars ... will be backed by gold and a basket of commodities ...

...a reunion between some old shady business partners: the CIA and their Asian secret society counterparts ... All Freemasons, P2ers, Thule Society and other secret groupings may join the party by contacting the White Dragon Society.

... free the suppressed technology.

...
The increased radiation hype and fear mongering is also being orchestrated by the old world order. This writer found ... show me the Geiger counters and they both registered only normal background radiation.

... start a joint venture between a Chinese company ... and Fireside Stoves, a wood-burning stove import company this writer owns 10% of. ... install ... solar and wind power generators on roof-tops ...
I would expect someone who has been a Forbes economic reporter to know that commodities-backed currency (such as gold backing currency) is yet another way for the ultra-rich to manipulate the value of currency. It doesn't matter what commodity you pick, or if you pick a basket of commodities. Ben's Dragon friends have gold as their commodity, and that is the source of their financial power - and they aim to keep it that way. The Dragon's may be 'white-hats' but want to hold onto the influence that they have, which they would lose if each individual nation had a distinct currency backed by each government (with NO central banks, no fractional reserve lending, no commodities backing, and with the quantity of money in each currency tightly controlled by each government to prevent inflation and deflation.) I find it impossible that Ben does not know this.

What color of hats will they all wear when the supposed 'white-hat' White Dragons join forces with the most corrupt, 'black-hatted' people on Earth? Does this sound insane to anyone but me? How much black does it take to adulterate white?

It would not be hard to confirm if Stubblebine (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?44568-FUKUSHIMA-Gen.-Bert-Stubblebine-s-Personal-Estimate-of-the-Situation-IMPORTANT&p=480667&highlight=stubblebine#post480667) (and many others) or Ben is correct. Someone is MASSIVELY deluded about the amount of radiation and the degree of danger it poses.

Um, Ben, pssssssst, Ben! Freeing the suppressed technology will make your solar and wind venture a flop. You might want to invest in a company that makes accurate Geiger counters instead.

Dennis

[Hervé]

[...]
As for hat-eating party, well... "hat" is unfortunately pretty safe from being chewed on, see: this post (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?43793-Drake-Updates-clarifications-and-more&p=483679&viewfull=1#post483679).

That is a very, very sobering post - and sadly... those who have been in touch with Drake may be providing an opportunity/excuse for this possible scenario - somewhere behind the Plan may be chess masters who are far far better than the so called "good guys" and Bill may be wrong that its just distraction - it could be worse.

Alex Collier calls it the "Orion Model" (see this post (http://http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?43737-MAJOR-EVENT-Liens-Filed-Against-All-12-Federal-Reserve-Banks&p=468674&viewfull=1#post468674)).

Indeed, not a pretty picture.

[Oouthere]

First off, $100 million to fight against an industry that has a gross income of over $1 trillion is almost ludicrous.

Secondly, the Robert Alexander motor/generator (http://www.rexresearch.com/alxandr/alexandr.htm)(if it performs as stated) could be retro-fitted into the current power plants and it would use few resources in comparison to installing wind generators, solar panels, banks of storage batteries, and invertors to power individual homes . Can you imagine what would happen to the price of copper and perhaps aluminum for building the generators? I’m on my 7th rendition of this invention but have yet to achieve over unity so it may be a scam, another patent is based on Robert Alexander’s so I’m probably just getting something wrong. But stored battery energy is not a viable solution for running a conventional home.

Rich

[Blueskywalking]

Well, let's hope they're good Dragons!
I guess it will be a colorful soul mix, like any creature half light, half shadow, like us humans, all. :)

Agreed on getting to the bottom of the radiation Truth.
We need access to 1000's of citizen Geiger Guerrillas.
I just keep feeling psy-op on this.
I also geuss ET will clear it up if it goes TOO far...


Ken Adachi has done some work on the radiation thingy:
http://educate-yourself.org/lte/japanradiationpropagandatsunami02may12.shtml

[olddragon]

I really find the hole thing just to suspicious. There have been no arrests of main player and its always "GOING TO HAPPEN". And wasn't he telling us just weeks ago that they were going to set up a new capital in Korea. Now he states that its the cabals plan.

[ceetee9]

When the new financial system starts up and the criminals are removed from the core of the Western financial system, then money will pour like rain on Europe (it already is in the non-cabal controlled part of the world).Does anyone seriously believe that replacing one corrupt financial system with another will fix anything? At best, you'll just get a new group of corrupt greedy power-hungry thugs and at worst you'll get that AND a one world government with infinite power to do whatever they want, to whomever they want, whenever they want. This doesn't sound like any type of solution to me--at least not for the masses.

[hectorlca]

Sad. Sad. Sad. Come on Ben...For someone who claims to be on the inside you just don't offer that much. The insights here could be made by anyone who pays any attention to the geopolitical state of the world. Ben's writings have the same feel as a channeler: "bla blah blah, recent developments, blah blah, prosperity is coming, blah blah blah, messiah complex plug, blah blah blah, I know a lot of stuff but not really, blah blah blah..."

Man, I wish I were wrong and this were all true, but with Ben's writing, it's easier to see right through it. I guess in some way, he is helping out...he's making the lie more obvious.

[bearcow]

Ive said this before, as i have had dealings with many people who are familiar and part of hidden occult groups in asia, and not one has ever mentioned the existence of a "white dragon society".

If this group did exist, surely there would be some documented reference to this group in the annals of Asian history. For example, the Illuminati can be traced back to Johann Adam Weishaupt and his texts in the 1700's. No such record exists for this "white dragon society".

[DreamsInDigital]

When the new financial system starts up and the criminals are removed from the core of the Western financial system, then money will pour like rain on Europe (it already is in the non-cabal controlled part of the world).Does anyone seriously believe that replacing one corrupt financial system with another will fix anything? At best, you'll just get a new group of corrupt greedy power-hungry thugs and at worst you'll get that AND a one world government with infinite power to do whatever they want, to whomever they want, whenever they want. This doesn't sound like any type of solution to me--at least not for the masses.
Well what do you suggest be done then? We obviously need some sort of monetary system to at least temporarily exist while the planet is transitioned to a bartering system and ultimately out of a monetary system all together. So please, provide a solution you think will work.

[Maia Gabrial]

Question is.. do the Andromedans have 3D physical bodies?


From what Alex Collier told everyone, the Andromedans have planets in their system that are 3D as well as 5D and 6D.
I agree with you on that Earth's Humanity will experience many beneficial changes. We just have to take out the "garbage" first....

[Maia Gabrial]

Sad. Sad. Sad. Come on Ben...For someone who claims to be on the inside you just don't offer that much. The insights here could be made by anyone who pays any attention to the geopolitical state of the world. Ben's writings have the same feel as a channeler: "bla blah blah, recent developments, blah blah, prosperity is coming, blah blah blah, messiah complex plug, blah blah blah, I know a lot of stuff but not really, blah blah blah..."

Man, I wish I were wrong and this were all true, but with Ben's writing, it's easier to see right through it. I guess in some way, he is helping out...he's making the lie more obvious.

Maybe it's Ben's clone who's saying all this.... :becky:

[ceetee9]

When the new financial system starts up and the criminals are removed from the core of the Western financial system, then money will pour like rain on Europe (it already is in the non-cabal controlled part of the world).Does anyone seriously believe that replacing one corrupt financial system with another will fix anything? At best, you'll just get a new group of corrupt greedy power-hungry thugs and at worst you'll get that AND a one world government with infinite power to do whatever they want, to whomever they want, whenever they want. This doesn't sound like any type of solution to me--at least not for the masses.
Well what do you suggest be done then? We obviously need some sort of monetary system to at least temporarily exist while the planet is transitioned to a bartering system and ultimately out of a monetary system all together. So please, provide a solution you think will work.Sounds to me like you already have a solution--the barter system. I wouldn't advocate that, but I will say it's better than a monetary system that guarantees we'll continue to have a class system of the haves and have nots. The solution that I would advocate is a contributionist system and there has been much written about it including here on Avalon.

[RMorgan]

Hey folks,

Do you guys have any doubts that folks like Ben Fulford watch this and other similar forums regularly?

Just watch the patterns!

Always, as soon as there´s a major discussion and controversy about theirs or one of their friend´s claims, they release "new material", just to make people change focus.

It´s always the same pattern.

These folks always release some info, monitor the crowd reaction, than release more info based on the reaction and so on.

Cheers,

Raf.

[hectorlca]

When the new financial system starts up and the criminals are removed from the core of the Western financial system, then money will pour like rain on Europe (it already is in the non-cabal controlled part of the world).Does anyone seriously believe that replacing one corrupt financial system with another will fix anything? At best, you'll just get a new group of corrupt greedy power-hungry thugs and at worst you'll get that AND a one world government with infinite power to do whatever they want, to whomever they want, whenever they want. This doesn't sound like any type of solution to me--at least not for the masses.
Well what do you suggest be done then? We obviously need some sort of monetary system to at least temporarily exist while the planet is transitioned to a bartering system and ultimately out of a monetary system all together. So please, provide a solution you think will work.

We don't even need a new one. The one we have right now would work just fine without the rampant incentive to enslave people into debt.

[RMorgan]

When the new financial system starts up and the criminals are removed from the core of the Western financial system, then money will pour like rain on Europe (it already is in the non-cabal controlled part of the world).Does anyone seriously believe that replacing one corrupt financial system with another will fix anything? At best, you'll just get a new group of corrupt greedy power-hungry thugs and at worst you'll get that AND a one world government with infinite power to do whatever they want, to whomever they want, whenever they want. This doesn't sound like any type of solution to me--at least not for the masses.
Well what do you suggest be done then? We obviously need some sort of monetary system to at least temporarily exist while the planet is transitioned to a bartering system and ultimately out of a monetary system all together. So please, provide a solution you think will work.


Well, I have a possible solution. It´s a kind of utopia, but still a solution.

Keep everything working. Keep every one in their current jobs, except for the criminals of course. Keep paying them their salaries, accordingly to their merit.

Then, take the liquid profit of every company in the world, take out the necessary part to sustain the structure of the system, and then share the rest with all the people in the world.

There´s plenty of money to be shared and everyone would have a very good life quality.

Then, slowly and wisely reorganize the system, managing jobs, increasing sustainability, creating new technology and making sure everyone works with what they are good at.

Of course, this idea is highly summarized, but could be further developed into something feasible.

Sounds beautiful, right? However, any really fair financial system would only work if people share honesty as a principle.

So, if we agree that the human being isn´t greedy by nature, it would so be possible to completely recreate an educational system that teaches children only the most noble and fair moral values.

If you think that the human being is greedy by nature, nothing will ever work for us.

Anyway, this could be implemented as real direct democracy.

Each person creates his own projects, which are then voted by the local community, than at state level, than at country level and finally worldwide level, so everyone in the world, let´s say, in a weekly basis, could vote for the final and most coherent projects via internet. Everyone should agree to vote for a certain number of projects every week; it wouldn´t take more than a couple of hours to do so.

We wouldn´t need any politicians or representatives this way.

Then, a very complex computer system could be created to make corruption impossible, in a very transparent way, so everyone could monitor in real time and see where the world´s money is going;

This system would enable us to monitor the legitimacy of the votes as well.

Now, feel free to add other features that you consider important, if you feel like doing so.

Cheers,

Raf.

[DreamsInDigital]

When the new financial system starts up and the criminals are removed from the core of the Western financial system, then money will pour like rain on Europe (it already is in the non-cabal controlled part of the world).Does anyone seriously believe that replacing one corrupt financial system with another will fix anything? At best, you'll just get a new group of corrupt greedy power-hungry thugs and at worst you'll get that AND a one world government with infinite power to do whatever they want, to whomever they want, whenever they want. This doesn't sound like any type of solution to me--at least not for the masses.
Well what do you suggest be done then? We obviously need some sort of monetary system to at least temporarily exist while the planet is transitioned to a bartering system and ultimately out of a monetary system all together. So please, provide a solution you think will work.Sounds to me like you already have a solution--the barter system. I wouldn't advocate that, but I will say it's better than a monetary system that guarantees we'll continue to have a class system of the haves and have nots. The solution that I would advocate is a contributionist system and there has been much written about it including here on Avalon.
That would require a huge paradigm shift, so how then do you suggest that we implement that with the current mind set of the majority of the people around the world. It's one thing for us intelligent and freeish thinkers to come up with something that would work for those with our mind set, but what will actually work?

[WHOMADEGOD]

"A ONE OFF, massive debt write off"!

Thats nice, whats happens if I get into trouble again, I mean its still a financial system?
One off, sounds like a gesture, but also a warning, an ultimatum. So many are in debt and
would jump at the chance to have their slate wiped clean to end there misery and suffering.

Is that the deal, wave a carrot to a desparate soul, watch them grab for it in desperation, (like
you knew thry would after phase one of the plan), then ready the big stick with the other hand!

Read between the lines, its where the small print lives....

However, it is also a possibility that debt will never be allowed to happen again thus a one off.

[WhiteFeather]

I found this statement highly comforting.

" The condition attached is an agreement to participate in a massive campaign to end poverty, stop environmental destruction and free the suppressed technology"

Blissfull words to say the least.

[Positive Vibe Merchant]

*Sigh*

Are we not seeing that exchanging currency for currency does not change the fundamental problems?

There will still be rich and poor simply because there is a construct. Creativity and natural talent for things is discounted, and we will still have to have 'jobs' still pay 'tax'

its just one big merry-go-round.

people who have power, in all its shapes and forms, dont want to give it away so easily.

[Siberia9]

They are real, but for me I was very surprised to see them show up the way they have here. I know they are real because one of my best friends was in federal prison for racketeering, he was an enforcer for a certain illegal organization back in the late 1980's. One of his best cell mates when he was in Arizona federal prison was a Chinese gangster from Hong Kong (a White Dragon member) that got arrested in California. He was an excellent martial artist and I talked to him on the phone once or twice as he was training my friend and I was a martial artist as well. He was also a Freemason in San Francisco and that surprised me to no end I must say. About a decade later an Italian gangster I knew from New York City told me they were into something with them and wanted to know if I knew anything about the White Dragons etc.

They are gangsters, and frankly its a little hard for me to see how they are involved in anything other than being gangsters. Of course we all know who runs and funds ALL big gangsters.

Police, gangsters, Freemasons, etc etc are all just bricks in the same pyramid system that is run by some very powerful reclusive and dangerous family's. The Idea that they are going to move to the top of the pyramid without it being part of the plan is just goofy to me.

Ive made it no secret here that I am related to some of the Illuminati Bloodline Family's, and I remember being told when I was young that it was part of the plan to have the people hate their govts and see them as criminals so they could change the way things are run once and for all. I dont have all the secrets but that piece of the puzzle is on my table and it fits right next to the one that says China will be the muscle for the New Order after the US has collapsed.

I will go out on a limb and guess that we will find the usual suspects step up to back these clowns before its over. Like the Rothchild bankers and the Chinese Govt etc.,,, we will see.


Ive said this before, as i have had dealings with many people who are familiar and part of hidden occult groups in asia, and not one has ever mentioned the existence of a "white dragon society".

If this group did exist, surely there would be some documented reference to this group in the annals of Asian history. For example, the Illuminati can be traced back to Johann Adam Weishaupt and his texts in the 1700's. No such record exists for this "white dragon society".

[RMorgan]

They are real, but for me I was very surprised to see them show up the way they have here. I know they are real because one of my best friends was in federal prison for racketeering, he was an enforcer for a certain illegal organization back in the late 1980's. One of his best cell mates when he was in Arizona federal prison was a Chinese gangster from Hong Kong (a White Dragon member) that got arrested in California. He was an excellent martial artist and I talked to him on the phone once or twice as he was training my friend and I was a martial artist as well. He was also a Freemason in San Francisco and that surprised me to no end I must say. About a decade later an Italian gangster I knew from New York City told me they were into something with them and wanted to know if I knew anything about the White Dragons etc.

They are gangsters, and frankly its a little hard for me to see how they are involved in anything other than being gangsters. Of course we all know who runs and funds ALL big gangsters.

Police, gangsters, Freemasons, etc etc are all just bricks in the same pyramid system that is run by some very powerful reclusive and dangerous family's. The Idea that they are going to move to the top of the pyramid without it being part of the plan is just goofy to me.

Ive made it no secret here that I am related to some of the Illuminati Bloodline Family's, and I remember being told when I was young that it was part of the plan to have the people hate their govts and see them as criminals so they could change the way things are run once and for all. I dont have all the secrets but that piece of the puzzle is on my table and it fits right next to the one that says China will be the muscle for the New Order after the US has collapsed.

I will go out on a limb and guess that we will find the usual suspects step up to back the clowns before its over. Like the Rothchild bankers and the Chinese Govt etc.,,, we will see.


Ive said this before, as i have had dealings with many people who are familiar and part of hidden occult groups in asia, and not one has ever mentioned the existence of a "white dragon society".

If this group did exist, surely there would be some documented reference to this group in the annals of Asian history. For example, the Illuminati can be traced back to Johann Adam Weishaupt and his texts in the 1700's. No such record exists for this "white dragon society".

Hey Siberia9,

That´s a very interesting report.

Perhaps something like this deserves its own thread, since there´s a lot o people here who are taking these White Dragons as the legit good guys.

What do you think?

Cheers,

Raf.

[Siberia9]

Iqwertyuio

[Siberia9]

This is the crew Fulford claims to be hooked up with. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Dragon_Society The Black Dragon Society, that have now changed their name to the white dragon Society in 2010 for whatever reason according to Fulford. My friends cell mate told me that he was a member of the White Dragons that operated under the Black Dragon Society. That was back in 1989, a coincidence? I think not.
But what do I know,,, I'm just just stuck in a stupid meat suit on a beautiful planet full of insane goofballs.
I don't even care to figure it out any more, if something is going to happen lets just get it on already.

[Dennis Leahy]

...But what do I know,,, I'm just just stuck in a stupid meat suit on a beautiful planet full of insane goofballs.
hahahahahaha I resonated with that comment. It's not really funny, but I am at that point in this theater of the absurd where the surreal reality is starting to make me chuckle.

Dennis

[ceetee9]

When the new financial system starts up and the criminals are removed from the core of the Western financial system, then money will pour like rain on Europe (it already is in the non-cabal controlled part of the world).Does anyone seriously believe that replacing one corrupt financial system with another will fix anything? At best, you'll just get a new group of corrupt greedy power-hungry thugs and at worst you'll get that AND a one world government with infinite power to do whatever they want, to whomever they want, whenever they want. This doesn't sound like any type of solution to me--at least not for the masses.
Well what do you suggest be done then? We obviously need some sort of monetary system to at least temporarily exist while the planet is transitioned to a bartering system and ultimately out of a monetary system all together. So please, provide a solution you think will work.Sounds to me like you already have a solution--the barter system. I wouldn't advocate that, but I will say it's better than a monetary system that guarantees we'll continue to have a class system of the haves and have nots. The solution that I would advocate is a contributionist system and there has been much written about it including here on Avalon.
That would require a huge paradigm shift, so how then do you suggest that we implement that with the current mind set of the majority of the people around the world. It's one thing for us intelligent and freeish thinkers to come up with something that would work for those with our mind set, but what will actually work?
Yep, without question it would require a huge paradigm shift. And I believe the way to implement it is embedded in your answer. If "intelligent and freeish" thinking people can come up with something that will work for those with their mind set and, if a world consisting of intelligent, free thinking people is a desirable and worthy goal, then it seems to me the solution is fairly simple. We begin to raise the intelligence level and reduce the fear level associated with thinking "outside the box" of the rest of the world. And how do we do that? Through education, and I don't mean through educational institutions that are mostly propaganda machines for the status quo. It can start with forums like Avalon where people can express their ideas and discuss the pros and cons in an intelligent and civilized manner and by encouraging others to join in. Eventually, enough people will start thinking for themselves and will start questioning their "leaders" as to why they are against ideas that are so obviously beneficial to all people and the environment. Maybe then everyone will begin to realize we don't require governments that attempt to control every aspect of our lives so a tiny fraction of the population can live like kings while the rest are herded like cattle to produce all the goods and services. Maybe then people will begin to wake up and realize that all we really need is freedom and some minimal intelligent guidance to ensure the necessities of life are there for every man, woman and child on the planet--without destroying the planet in the process.

[seigiarchon]

ASCENSION IS THE EXPRESSION OF DESIRE TO LEAVE PHYSICAL LIFE

I don't meditate often but a few hours ago, this message came to me with a clarity which shook me out of my meditation. I was actually hearing it in my inner ear as I was doing "inwards hearing" meditation.

Here I go.

Why do you think the Creator, Archangels and other Higher Beings allow the NWO Elites to accrue and abuse so much power over us? Why do you think they allow the Archons/Demons to feed off our energies and control our mind (too often to our detriment)? Why does the Creator create Demons and Gods which bring Death, Poverty, Disease, Pain and other forms of Sufferings in our lives?

Let me give a brief recap of multi-dimensional physics. On the Highest Level of Reality stands the Creator. Below him stands the Archangels and Buddhas and other High Dimensional Beings. Below them stand the "middle-level" gods and devas and below them stand the demons and other "lower-level" gods and asuras. You can check out the links below to get a fairly good idea of how spiritual and multi-dimensional politics work.

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/ptf/dhamma/sagga/loka.html

All of us possess souls which came from Archangels, Buddhas, Hindu Gods, Asian Gods, South American Gods, Greek/Roman Gods, etc and all these Higher Gods descended in turn from the Creator who created all Gods and Existence.

We descended into 3D earth because we wanna experience the 7 sins, the desires, attachments, aversions, hatred and love of mortal man. However, the Creator and Higher Gods know that, unless we are given sufferings of all kind in order to wake us up from the Great Illusion we are in, we will never wake up and we will continue to work, sleep, have sex, raise children, drink, eat, defecate and participate in all forms of mindless human activity everyday till the end of our lives.

This is why our human lives are so short and why the teachings of immortality have not been made public except to those special humans who are 101% committed to leaving Samsara and the accursed cycle of Rebirth and Death. Because firstly, if everybody is immortal and rich and never experience suffering, then everybody will have no motivations to evolve their soul and break free of this Great Illusionary Samsara which we are in.

Secondly, there is a bloody long line of souls who are waiting to learn all about Suffering on this Prison Planet Earth of ours. If everybody is immortal and never die and continue to make love and breed kids without having any worries about the money issues, then this Prison Planet would be overpopulated in less than a decade. Even bloody Africa and China would be filled to the brims and more.

So this is why the Creator, the Archangels, the Buddhas and other Higher Beings allow so much Suffering on Prison Planet Earth. Suffering like Poverty, Famine, Death, Pain, Loss. The Gods want us to break free of our Desire to experience Human Desires. The Gods want Humanity to be free of Samsara. The Gods want Humanity to let go of their Human Bodies because the Human Body is an Inferior Form of Existence.

The Gods want us to break free of our Attachments to Humanity and Attachments to Food, to Sex, to Entertainment, to our Family, our Loved Ones, our Children, our Parents and to our own Human Bodies. The Gods want us to Evolve to a Spiritual State of Existence instead of a physical existence.

ASCENSION IS THE EXPRESSION OF DESIRE TO LEAVE PHYSICAL LIFE

[Wiremu2011]

Personally I think Inelia Benz best sums up that ascension is simply an unlimited sense of awareness. Period!

[seigiarchon]

This is why I advise everyone to reject the lies of Drake, Wilcock and Fulford.

As mentioned before in my other thread The-Game-of-the-True-Immortals-on-this-Planet (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?44253-The-Game-of-the-True-Immortals-on-this-Planet), there are two major groupings of occult power players who possess the majority of the wealth and power on Earth.

One group want humans to be spiritually evolved while the other group want humans to be slaves. However, both groups want humans to remain in the 3D physical human condition which will allow the Archon Masters of both groups to continue using humans as batteries of food energies aka Matrix.

2012 Dec 21st is the ULTIMATE opportunity for EVERYONE to break free of their bondage once and for all.

Drake, Fulford and Wilcock may belong to the group who want humans to be spiritually evolved 3D human beings with prosperity funds, advanced longevity medical technologies, but in the end, Drake, Fulford and Wilcock still want us humans to be cattle and sheep to those higher Dimensional Archons who will maintain their control over our minds and bodies because they possess higher technologies and higher spiritual power.

Drake, Fulford and Wilcock may say "oh the new government is gonna give you so much money, so much new medical technologies, so much free energy for your new Porsche Cars which can fly on air, so much new, free and wonderful stuff coming up, etc etc" But this is the gist of the problem.

Humanity, because of their 3D physical bodies, have to rely on money, medicine, vehicles, houses and other forms of commodities in order to lead an easy life. If you do not have a physical body, then you do not have to rely on anyone for anything!

Don't depend on any form of Government to save you and give you free stuff even if these Governments appear to be just and kind. Don't depend on any ET races to save you and give you free stuff even if these ET races are just and kind. What did they say about despising the free lunch?

As long as you are in physical form, you will always be subjected to abuse, bullying and tyranny. You will always depend on the Government, ET races, Corporations and other forms of Big Organizations to control your lives. A Government or ET race may be kind and just now but what's to prevent the same Government or ET race from turning on you or your children 100 years down the road?

Humans may be downtrodden slaves for eons but there is a reason why everybody want to trod on us. Because we possess unlimited potential to become anything we want and this is why the Archons and other ET races are afraid of us.

The only way to grasp control of your own destiny is to leave your physical body and evolve your soul and spirit to such a high degree that you would be the one controlling the Archons and other ET races instead.

Otherwise you will always be slaves. Make a decision. Make the RIGHT decision.

¤=[Post Update]=¤


personally i think inelia benz best sums up that ascension is simply an unlimited sense of awareness. Period!

ASCENSION IS THE EXPRESSION OF DESIRE TO LEAVE PHYSICAL LIFE

As I was writing these posts out, the sun was shining through my window despite the blanketed sky today, I kid you not..

I guess I am saying the right thing eh?

[promezeus]

hey seigiarchon, no offense but I think you should stop meditating and get a life (some good sinning would do you good). Those ascended masters may turn out to be shape-shifting reptilians, and you won't see it coming. Read the 'Law of One' to get a balanced perspective on ascension. Dark entities can ascend to very high levels.

[bearcow]

They are real, but for me I was very surprised to see them show up the way they have here. I know they are real because one of my best friends was in federal prison for racketeering, he was an enforcer for a certain illegal organization back in the late 1980's. One of his best cell mates when he was in Arizona federal prison was a Chinese gangster from Hong Kong (a White Dragon member) that got arrested in California. He was an excellent martial artist and I talked to him on the phone once or twice as he was training my friend and I was a martial artist as well. He was also a Freemason in San Francisco and that surprised me to no end I must say. About a decade later an Italian gangster I knew from New York City told me they were into something with them and wanted to know if I knew anything about the White Dragons etc.

They are gangsters, and frankly its a little hard for me to see how they are involved in anything other than being gangsters. Of course we all know who runs and funds ALL big gangsters.

Police, gangsters, Freemasons, etc etc are all just bricks in the same pyramid system that is run by some very powerful reclusive and dangerous family's. The Idea that they are going to move to the top of the pyramid without it being part of the plan is just goofy to me.

Ive made it no secret here that I am related to some of the Illuminati Bloodline Family's, and I remember being told when I was young that it was part of the plan to have the people hate their govts and see them as criminals so they could change the way things are run once and for all. I dont have all the secrets but that piece of the puzzle is on my table and it fits right next to the one that says China will be the muscle for the New Order after the US has collapsed.

I will go out on a limb and guess that we will find the usual suspects step up to back these clowns before its over. Like the Rothchild bankers and the Chinese Govt etc.,,, we will see.


Ive said this before, as i have had dealings with many people who are familiar and part of hidden occult groups in asia, and not one has ever mentioned the existence of a "white dragon society".

If this group did exist, surely there would be some documented reference to this group in the annals of Asian history. For example, the Illuminati can be traced back to Johann Adam Weishaupt and his texts in the 1700's. No such record exists for this "white dragon society".


My friends cell mate told me that he was a member of the White Dragons that operated under the Black Dragon Society

perhaps you are referring to the white lotus society, who had great influence in the formation of the triad mafia groups witch migrated to hong kong after the communists took over mainland china.

update : i just did some research and found that there was a small subset, a very small subset of the triad gangs of southeast asia called the white dragons. However, this group is not a major player in the criminal underworld of hong kong, let alone asia.

whether the group was formally called the black dragon society up until a few years back or the white dragon society is not really important. the main point being these real life mafia organizations are nowhere near the top of the food chain in the Asian power structure, and are not in a position to go toe to toe with the elite criminals/black magicians of the west

[ginnyk]

The Gods want us to break free of our Attachments to Humanity and Attachments to Food, to Sex, to Entertainment, to our Family, our Loved Ones, our Children, our Parents and to our own Human Bodies. The Gods want us to Evolve to a Spiritual State of Existence instead of a physical existence.

May I respectfully add one more attachment to that list - the attachment to judging others. Probably the most difficult, and I believe the only one on the above list that Master Jesus mentioned specifically in the Sermon on the Mount. It is a lifelong quest to find the delicate balance between discernment and judgement.

[seigiarchon]

hey seigiarchon, no offense but I think you should stop meditating and get a life (some good sinning would do you good). Those ascended masters may turn out to be shape-shifting reptilians, and you won't see it coming. Read the 'Law of One' to get a balanced perspective on ascension. Dark entities can ascend to very high levels.

Yes some dark entities can ascend to a very high level but in what way are any of my words "dark"?

Because I am advising others to leave their physical bodies for a more evolved, spiritual, non-physical state?

Because I am advising others to drop their Attachments to Humanity and Attachments to Food, to Sex, to Entertainment, to our Family, our Loved Ones, our Children, our Parents and to our own Human Bodies.

I mean how else are the Immortal Elites of both Orders gonna have their own empires if there are no slaves to serve as servants?

How are the Immortal Elites gonna keep an army of slaves if the slaves do not continuously have sex in order to churn out more slaves?

How else are the Immortal Elites of both Orders gonna trap people as slaves if everybody doesn't have a physical body?

Well thank you so much for the confirmation that what I have been saying is 101% right on the spot.

Cheers!

P.S. ummm wasn't the law of one series quoted by Wilcock's Higher Entity Ra? The very same Ra as discussed in the Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?40941-Horus-Ra-as-the-Archontic-Alien-Parasite-A-follow-up-interview-with-Maarit&p=485410#post485410) ???

The law of one also advocated meditation and staying away from sinning, I believe.

[seigiarchon]

hey seigiarchon, no offense but I think you should stop meditating and get a life (some good sinning would do you good). Those ascended masters may turn out to be shape-shifting reptilians, and you won't see it coming. Read the 'Law of One' to get a balanced perspective on ascension. Dark entities can ascend to very high levels.

Right so all the Gods who want humanity to be free are bad and the NWO Immortal Elites are good.

You know, your reasoning is the result of Hollywood churning out movies after movies of aliens invading Earth and Earth's governments saving the human race. Just check out the latest flick the Avengers although admittedly, one of the Avengers is a God. :p

When in fact, it is the other way round.

It has always been the Governments of this Earth who have imprisoned the Human Race and it has been and always will be The Gods, the more enlightened ET races or the "aliens" in other words who are trying to break Humanity out of this Prison Planet Paradigm.

However, the masses have been so brainwashed by Hollywood, no less, to believe that the Governments (controlled by the Immortal Elites) will always save them. Why else is there so much dependency by the masses on the Governments?

Btw, "Aliens" is a very derogatory term. It is like calling an African-Amercian a "******" or calling a Chinese man a "Chink" or how the Japs call the Caucasians "Gaijin".

Calling someone "Alien" gives the message that the Creator only creates us Humans as the superior race and the other ET races, the Greys, the Orions, Sirians, Pleiadians, Andromedans are outcasts or inferior to us.

There is already enough racism on earth. I think we should stop ETism in its roots while we still have the chance and opportunity. There are thousands and thousands of benign ET races who have been around much longer than us and we should accord them the proper respect.

I am not saying every ET is good or bad. No one single race in the Universe or even on Earth itself is completely good or bad.

For eg in WW2, the Nazis and the Germans are considered to be the Devil's race on Earth but are you saying every German is a Nazi? Are you saying every German is the son of a Devil because their fellow countrymen committed genocide on the Jews?

The same reasoning applies to ET races. There are bad apples and good ones and we just have to use our own discernment to separate the wheat from the chaff.

[seigiarchon]

The Gods want us to break free of our Attachments to Humanity and Attachments to Food, to Sex, to Entertainment, to our Family, our Loved Ones, our Children, our Parents and to our own Human Bodies. The Gods want us to Evolve to a Spiritual State of Existence instead of a physical existence.

May I respectfully add one more attachment to that list - the attachment to judging others. Probably the most difficult, and I believe the only one on the above list that Master Jesus mentioned specifically in the Sermon on the Mount. It is a lifelong quest to find the delicate balance between discernment and judgement.

Well sometimes, we have a duty to judge.

The Angel of Death, Azarael, had to judge which souls are worthy of entering the Creator's Kingdom and which souls have to go to hell.

I have a duty to judge which values are good or bad for my own growth and separate myself from those whose values are different from mine.

Or are you saying, those gunmen who went on shooting rampages in schools shouldn't be judged and we do our best to embrace them for their sins and be more like them?

That is totally ridiculous, don't you think?

[NewFounderHome]

Hello seigiarchon,

I read your text and understand what you say! It might be true. How can we prove that for our selves.
Don't get me wrong but. I don't by no means dougnt your story, but we must not believe all the stories being feed to us. So how can we prove it for our selves. No guru stuff and other or believe me and I have the truth.

Peace to you all

[seigiarchon]

Hello seigiarchon,

I read your text and understand what you say! It might be true. How can we prove that for our selves.
Don't get me wrong but. I don't by no means dougnt your story, but we must not believe all the stories being feed to us. So how can we prove it for our selves. No guru stuff and other or believe me and I have the truth.

Peace to you all

I think one should do all the research on the various religions and mythologies of the world and try to draw the connections to draw the links between the various religions and mythologies and see how everything is connected with each other.

No one should simply believe what I say.

Meditation to remove one's lower desires and emotions obviously help because the lower desires and lower emotions, your animal ego in other words, will prevent your higher self from connecting the dots for you.

I know this subconsciously ever since I was a kid but I didn't have the full confidence or courage to type this all out because I thought I might be wrong and a part of me, the animal ego, wanted me to be wrong.

Unfortunately or maybe fortunately, I am right and it is only through meditation and trying to get in touch with my higher self then do I have the full confidence to type out all these stuff today.

If I didn't get this clear message ASCENSION IS THE EXPRESSION OF DESIRE TO LEAVE PHYSICAL LIFE through meditation, then this thread might not have come into existence today.

Watching the movie Mr Nobody helps a bit too. :rolleyes:

Ultimately, one should know that every human on earth is watched and judged by a panel of higher dimensional judges. They watch our every thought and move. A lot of times, things or events happen in our lives because they want us to move in a certain direction.

A lot of things happened in my life in conjunction with my own personal research lead to the existence of this thread today. Synchronicities, if you can call them that. Synchronicities which also lead you and others to this forum and to this thread.

[seigiarchon]

Hey folks,

Do you guys have any doubts that folks like Ben Fulford watch this and other similar forums regularly?

Just watch the patterns!

Always, as soon as there´s a major discussion and controversy about theirs or one of their friend´s claims, they release "new material", just to make people change focus.

It´s always the same pattern.

These folks always release some info, monitor the crowd reaction, than release more info based on the reaction and so on.

Cheers,

Raf.

SMART MAN! :sad:

¤=[Post Update]=¤





When the new financial system starts up and the criminals are removed from the core of the Western financial system, then money will pour like rain on Europe (it already is in the non-cabal controlled part of the world).Does anyone seriously believe that replacing one corrupt financial system with another will fix anything? At best, you'll just get a new group of corrupt greedy power-hungry thugs and at worst you'll get that AND a one world government with infinite power to do whatever they want, to whomever they want, whenever they want. This doesn't sound like any type of solution to me--at least not for the masses.
Well what do you suggest be done then? We obviously need some sort of monetary system to at least temporarily exist while the planet is transitioned to a bartering system and ultimately out of a monetary system all together. So please, provide a solution you think will work.


Well, I have a possible solution. It´s a kind of utopia, but still a solution.

Keep everything working. Keep every one in their current jobs, except for the criminals of course. Keep paying them their salaries, accordingly to their merit.

Then, take the liquid profit of every company in the world, take out the necessary part to sustain the structure of the system, and then share the rest with all the people in the world.

There´s plenty of money to be shared and everyone would have a very good life quality.

Then, slowly and wisely reorganize the system, managing jobs, increasing sustainability, creating new technology and making sure everyone works with what they are good at.

Of course, this idea is highly summarized, but could be further developed into something feasible.

Sounds beautiful, right? However, any really fair financial system would only work if people share honesty as a principle.

So, if we agree that the human being isn´t greedy by nature, it would so be possible to completely recreate an educational system that teaches children only the most noble and fair moral values.

If you think that the human being is greedy by nature, nothing will ever work for us.

Anyway, this could be implemented as real direct democracy.

Each person creates his own projects, which are then voted by the local community, than at state level, than at country level and finally worldwide level, so everyone in the world, let´s say, in a weekly basis, could vote for the final and most coherent projects via internet. Everyone should agree to vote for a certain number of projects every week; it wouldn´t take more than a couple of hours to do so.

We wouldn´t need any politicians or representatives this way.

Then, a very complex computer system could be created to make corruption impossible, in a very transparent way, so everyone could monitor in real time and see where the world´s money is going;

This system would enable us to monitor the legitimacy of the votes as well.

Now, feel free to add other features that you consider important, if you feel like doing so.

Cheers,

Raf.

The only solution is to evolve from a 3D physical state of existence to a 5D non-material non-physical spiritual state of existence.

Reject-Drake-Wilcock-and-Fulford-for-SPIRITUAL-NON-PHYSICAL-ASCENSION (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?44958-Reject-Drake-Wilcock-and-Fulford-for-SPIRITUAL-NON-PHYSICAL-ASCENSION-2012&p=485443#post485443)

[seigiarchon]

They are real, but for me I was very surprised to see them show up the way they have here. I know they are real because one of my best friends was in federal prison for racketeering, he was an enforcer for a certain illegal organization back in the late 1980's. One of his best cell mates when he was in Arizona federal prison was a Chinese gangster from Hong Kong (a White Dragon member) that got arrested in California. He was an excellent martial artist and I talked to him on the phone once or twice as he was training my friend and I was a martial artist as well. He was also a Freemason in San Francisco and that surprised me to no end I must say. About a decade later an Italian gangster I knew from New York City told me they were into something with them and wanted to know if I knew anything about the White Dragons etc.

They are gangsters, and frankly its a little hard for me to see how they are involved in anything other than being gangsters. Of course we all know who runs and funds ALL big gangsters.

Police, gangsters, Freemasons, etc etc are all just bricks in the same pyramid system that is run by some very powerful reclusive and dangerous family's. The Idea that they are going to move to the top of the pyramid without it being part of the plan is just goofy to me.

Ive made it no secret here that I am related to some of the Illuminati Bloodline Family's, and I remember being told when I was young that it was part of the plan to have the people hate their govts and see them as criminals so they could change the way things are run once and for all. I dont have all the secrets but that piece of the puzzle is on my table and it fits right next to the one that says China will be the muscle for the New Order after the US has collapsed.

I will go out on a limb and guess that we will find the usual suspects step up to back these clowns before its over. Like the Rothchild bankers and the Chinese Govt etc.,,, we will see.


Ive said this before, as i have had dealings with many people who are familiar and part of hidden occult groups in asia, and not one has ever mentioned the existence of a "white dragon society".

If this group did exist, surely there would be some documented reference to this group in the annals of Asian history. For example, the Illuminati can be traced back to Johann Adam Weishaupt and his texts in the 1700's. No such record exists for this "white dragon society".


My friends cell mate told me that he was a member of the White Dragons that operated under the Black Dragon Society

perhaps you are referring to the white lotus society, who had great influence in the formation of the triad mafia groups witch migrated to hong kong after the communists took over mainland china.

update : i just did some research and found that there was a small subset, a very small subset of the triad gangs of southeast asia called the white dragons. However, this group is not a major player in the criminal underworld of hong kong, let alone asia.

whether the group was formally called the black dragon society up until a few years back or the white dragon society is not really important. the main point being these real life mafia organizations are nowhere near the top of the food chain in the Asian power structure, and are not in a position to go toe to toe with the elite criminals/black magicians of the west

It is very obvious that the "white dragons" is not the real name of their organization.

As far as I am concerned, all triads and mafia are people with a lot of sins and negative karma. They wouldn't be dabbling in triads and mafia societies, otherwise. It doesn't matter if a triad or mafia is from the east or west, they all operate outside the normal rules of society and it takes people of a certain character to operate outside the normal rules of society.

What do you think triads and mafias specialize in? Running orphanages and charities? Don't make me laugh.

[truth4me]

Hey folks,

Do you guys have any doubts that folks like Ben Fulford watch this and other similar forums regularly?

Just watch the patterns!

Always, as soon as there´s a major discussion and controversy about theirs or one of their friend´s claims, they release "new material", just to make people change focus.

It´s always the same pattern.

These folks always release some info, monitor the crowd reaction, than release more info based on the reaction and so on.

Cheers,

Raf.problem,reaction,solution......hummm.......where have we heard that before? I think WE know....

[pilotsimone]

deleted post

[jorr lundstrom]

As all currencies and all barter systems can be used as ways to gaining

power over people and as Im ultimately questioning the old program

of ownership as such, I say, just supply people with wot they need

to lead good lives. Not a lot of stupifying devices and unnecessary crap,

just basics.


All is well


Jorr 2.0

[the_vast_mystery]

What I do is take responsibility for everything I experience. I don't care who starts it, where it originates, or why. If it's in my awareness, it's my responsibility.

So, this gunman...I would not look at him and try to figure out what is wrong with him. No, I would look to myself and ask what inside of me created this (external) situation. Whatever fear, anger, hate is inside of this gunman...is somewhere inside of me. And it's my responsibility to find and heal it.

My personal healing method is to find the pain and sit in it. Feeling every last bit of it...owning it as myself. Saying any combination of these four sentences to myself:

I'm sorry. Please forgive me. I love you. Thank you.

Taking responsibility for everything that comes into my awareness has brought about monumental change in my life. I recommend it.

As for the gunman, if I was in 'authority' I would remove him from the public and place him in rehab. Just like I did with my young sons when they would fight...remove them from the situation and allow space for healing.

I think what he means is more regarding judgement is that you cannot base a philosophy on simple statements, or vague platitudes which do not account for the entire spectrum of life situations (including the extremes) and therefore provide a framework with which to resolve them. In the case of judgement one must admit to the very real and very documentable case of psychopathic personalities utterly bent on a type of self-serving pleasure which destroys countless lives. The sort of person who would, until their last breath, lunge viciously at you and stab at you with anything they had rather than speak a word to you. Not that this accounts for the norm but because the extreme is not accounted for within the statement of "non judgement" that leaves a problem with how to address people's behavior within a society.

If one judges nothing, one can do nothing to prevent the destructive behavior of others as non-judgement as a statement carries with it the implication "All situations, regardless, must be considered equal and therefore nothing may be done to change them as that would disrupt equilibrium." This means that in essence, by practicing this philosophical point to its fullest extent we would be at the complete mercy of psychopaths. This is why it's hard to accept a stern philosophy of non-judgement as that in the end just sounds like practicing self-defeat more than it does practicing a virtue.

As Alfred said in The Dark Knight: Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

Until there is a means to address how to handle people such as this so they may not spread destruction amongst others in a given society this presents a problem to any human wishing to practice non-judgement.

[jorr lundstrom]

As I cant see confusion as a solution, not even total confusion,

Ill leave this thread asap. Good luck. LOL


All is well


Jorr 2.0

[Tangri]

ASCENSION IS THE EXPRESSION OF DESIRE TO LEAVE PHYSICAL LIFE

I don't meditate often but a few hours ago, this message came to me with a clarity which shook me out of my meditation. I was actually hearing it in my inner ear as I was doing "inwards hearing" meditation.

Here I go.

Why do you think the Creator, Archangels and other Higher Beings allow the NWO Elites to accrue and abuse so much power over us? Why do you think they allow the Archons/Demons to feed off our energies and control our mind (too often to our detriment)? Why does the Creator create Demons and Gods which bring Death, Poverty, Disease, Pain and other forms of Sufferings in our lives?

Let me give a brief recap of multi-dimensional physics. On the Highest Level of Reality stands the Creator. Below him stands the Archangels and Buddhas and other High Dimensional Beings. Below them stand the "middle-level" gods and devas and below them stand the demons and other "lower-level" gods and asuras. You can check out the links below to get a fairly good idea of how spiritual and multi-dimensional politics work.

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/ptf/dhamma/sagga/loka.html

All of us possess souls which came from Archangels, Buddhas, Hindu Gods, Asian Gods, South American Gods, Greek/Roman Gods, etc and all these Higher Gods descended in turn from the Creator who created all Gods and Existence.

We descended into 3D earth because we wanna experience the 7 sins, the desires, attachments, aversions, hatred and love of mortal man. However, the Creator and Higher Gods know that, unless we are given sufferings of all kind in order to wake us up from the Great Illusion we are in, we will never wake up and we will continue to work, sleep, have sex, raise children, drink, eat, defecate and participate in all forms of mindless human activity everyday till the end of our lives.

This is why our human lives are so short and why the teachings of immortality have not been made public except to those special humans who are 101% committed to leaving Samsara and the accursed cycle of Rebirth and Death. Because firstly, if everybody is immortal and rich and never experience suffering, then everybody will have no motivations to evolve their soul and break free of this Great Illusionary Samsara which we are in.

Secondly, there is a bloody long line of souls who are waiting to learn all about Suffering on this Prison Planet Earth of ours. If everybody is immortal and never die and continue to make love and breed kids without having any worries about the money issues, then this Prison Planet would be overpopulated in less than a decade. Even bloody Africa and China would be filled to the brims and more.

So this is why the Creator, the Archangels, the Buddhas and other Higher Beings allow so much Suffering on Prison Planet Earth. Suffering like Poverty, Famine, Death, Pain, Loss. The Gods want us to break free of our Desire to experience Human Desires. The Gods want Humanity to be free of Samsara. The Gods want Humanity to let go of their Human Bodies because the Human Body is an Inferior Form of Existence.

The Gods want us to break free of our Attachments to Humanity and Attachments to Food, to Sex, to Entertainment, to our Family, our Loved Ones, our Children, our Parents and to our own Human Bodies. The Gods want us to Evolve to a Spiritual State of Existence instead of a physical existence.

ASCENSION IS THE EXPRESSION OF DESIRE TO LEAVE PHYSICAL LIFE

I understand long line of souls can be bloody, but I am little confused about Africa and Chine. why did you call them bloody?
Are you giving inferiority to them?

[seigiarchon]

What I do is take responsibility for everything I experience. I don't care who starts it, where it originates, or why. If it's in my awareness, it's my responsibility.

So, this gunman...I would not look at him and try to figure out what is wrong with him. No, I would look to myself and ask what inside of me created this (external) situation. Whatever fear, anger, hate is inside of this gunman...is somewhere inside of me. And it's my responsibility to find and heal it.

My personal healing method is to find the pain and sit in it. Feeling every last bit of it...owning it as myself. Saying any combination of these four sentences to myself:

I'm sorry. Please forgive me. I love you. Thank you.

Taking responsibility for everything that comes into my awareness has brought about monumental change in my life. I recommend it.

As for the gunman, if I was in 'authority' I would remove him from the public and place him in rehab. Just like I did with my young sons when they would fight...remove them from the situation and allow space for healing.

I think what he means is more regarding judgement is that you cannot base a philosophy on simple statements, or vague platitudes which do not account for the entire spectrum of life situations (including the extremes) and therefore provide a framework with which to resolve them. In the case of judgement one must admit to the very real and very documentable case of psychopathic personalities utterly bent on a type of self-serving pleasure which destroys countless lives. The sort of person who would, until their last breath, lunge viciously at you and stab at you with anything they had rather than speak a word to you. Not that this accounts for the norm but because the extreme is not accounted for within the statement of "non judgement" that leaves a problem with how to address people's behavior within a society.

If one judges nothing, one can do nothing to prevent the destructive behavior of others as non-judgement as a statement carries with it the implication "All situations, regardless, must be considered equal and therefore nothing may be done to change them as that would disrupt equilibrium." This means that in essence, by practicing this philosophical point to its fullest extent we would be at the complete mercy of psychopaths. This is why it's hard to accept a stern philosophy of non-judgement as that in the end just sounds like practicing self-defeat more than it does practicing a virtue.

As Alfred said in The Dark Knight: Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

Until there is a means to address how to handle people such as this so they may not spread destruction amongst others in a given society this presents a problem to any human wishing to practice non-judgement.

If some men just want to watch the world burn not because they have self-serving desires like money but because they have a much more nobler mission like Elevating Humanity to a much Higher state of existence, then I say let them watch the world burn.

How do you know there won't be a much better world for all of us after this current world is burnt to the ground?

If the Creator gives such men the Authority and Power to Destroy this world and such men want to Destroy this world, what can you or I do anything about it? For eg, if Jesus was reborn on this Earth and he wants to Destroy this Sinful World because of all the Sins of Mankind instead of saving the world this time round, are you going to call Jesus a psychopath?

Who gives you the right to insult the Son of God? Who gives you the right to judge a Son of God?

Judgment of the world is only carried out by individuals with a very high level of moral codes.. someone like the Buddha or Jesus comes to mind and I don't think you or me has the right to criticize the next Messiah if He decides to Destroy this world instead of saving it.

The average man with normal human desires and average level of moral code is simply not fit enough to criticize men whom serve as the Hand of the Creator.. Such men have moral codes and wisdom much higher than the average man.

[seigiarchon]

Well sometimes, we have a duty to judge.

The Angel of Death, Azarael, had to judge which souls are worthy of entering the Creator's Kingdom and which souls have to go to hell.

I have a duty to judge which values are good or bad for my own growth and separate myself from those whose values are different from mine.

Or are you saying, those gunmen who went on shooting rampages in schools shouldn't be judged and we do our best to embrace them for their sins and be more like them?

That is totally ridiculous, don't you think?


What I do is take responsibility for everything I experience. I don't care who starts it, where it originates, or why. If it's in my awareness, it's my responsibility.

So, this gunman...I would not look at him and try to figure out what is wrong with him. No, I would look to myself and ask what inside of me created this (external) situation. Whatever fear, anger, hate is inside of this gunman...is somewhere inside of me. And it's my responsibility to find and heal it.

My personal healing method is to find the pain and sit in it. Feeling every last bit of it...owning it as myself. Saying any combination of these four sentences to myself:

I'm sorry. Please forgive me. I love you. Thank you.

Taking responsibility for everything that comes into my awareness has brought about monumental change in my life. I recommend it.

As for the gunman, if I was in 'authority' I would remove him from the public and place him in rehab. Just like I did with my young sons when they would fight...remove them from the situation and allow space for healing.

We are not responsible for everything that happens in our lives.

If you wanna be on a perpetual guilt trip, go on ahead but hey I may not be perfect but I know I have never done anything to deserve being a Slave on this Prison Planet Earth.

[the_vast_mystery]

If some men just want to watch the world burn not because they have self-serving desires like money but because they have a much more nobler mission like Elevating Humanity to a much Higher state of existence, then I say let them watch the world burn.

How do you know there won't be a much better world for all of us after this current world is burnt to the ground?

Nobody down here knows that and it's ridiculous to expect people to have blind faith in the unknown when blind faith in the unknown has in essence been used and abused throughout the entirety of human history as a tool of enslavement for self-serving people (possibly even self-serving ETs.) So asking people to blindly trust something that they have every reason to believe is a bad, such as torture and death, is a lot like asking a human to go walk into the middle of a busy street blindfolded (because the cars won't hit you if you can't see them!) Even if it's within the greater spiritual paradigm, a necessity, no fault can be assigned to people who will resist something that can demonstrate evidence will be very horrible. That people cannot see this long-game is not their fault and because of that expecting anyone who exists with such a limited perspective to practice non-judgement is a bit like asking someone who lost their arm to go pitch for Major League Baseball. They just do not have the physical capability to recognize this practice even if they can understand HOW to pitch a ball intellectually.


If the Creator gives such men the Authority and Power to Destroy this world and such men want to Destroy this world, what can you or I do anything about it? For eg, if Jesus was reborn on this Earth and he wants to Destroy this Sinful World because of all the Sins of Mankind instead of saving the world this time round, are you going to call Jesus a psychopath?

I'd have a nice long conversation with him before determining that, and I'd probably want a good psychologist or two handy just to be sure, LOL. But yes I can safely say I could assign that value if someone came around, claimed to be Jesus, practiced miracles, and then said that the world should torture all non WASPS (white-anglo-saxon-protestant-straight) to death. After all, who decides if he's Jesus? Who's to say he's not just some alien that has some advanced technology pretending to be the original Jesus?

P.S. His treatment of the money-changers? Definitely some good 'ol fashioned judgement there. Even Jesus recognized there are extreme circumstances where, yes, you HAVE to be violent.


Who gives you the right to insult the Son of God? Who gives you the right to judge a Son of God?

Who gives anyone the right to say they're a son of God or claim anything? Your words are only worth as much as people will trust they're worth. So given the fact that there are a thousand ways you could lie and pretend to be Jesus, depending on how sophisticated a culture you visited, there is definitely a need to question any so-called Son of God to determine his character.


Judgment of the world is only carried out by individuals with a very high level of moral codes.. someone like the Buddha or Jesus comes to mind and I don't think you or me has the right to criticize the next Messiah if He decides to Destroy this world instead of saving it.

But then that's not non-judgement, that's giving up your ability to judge your own circumstances to someone else who for any number of possible reasons could not have your best interests at heart. You're still performing an act of judgement in fact by doing this, because you're still saying you want to judge certain situations, merely that you do not trust yourself to render judgement and that therefore you'll just let some other guy handle it.

To try another analogy, non-judgement implies a complete and total inability to reach decisions by yourself. Since you would be unable to judge whether the outcomes of any situation were any different than the other and therefore you would be prevented from making any choices in your life. Can you imagine waking up, opening your cupboard and being unable to eat breakfast because you have three cereal boxes in front of you, none of which you may assign any judgement to? I imagine life would be quite hard.


The average man with normal human desires and average level of moral code is simply not fit enough to criticize men whom serve as the Hand of the Creator.. Such men have moral codes and wisdom much higher than the average man.

If I were demonstratively ignorant then it could be explained, I would apologize and life would go on. However instead by refusing to explain things in full and taking the dogmatic "Hands off God's boy you heathen! How dare you ask questions!" approach to my inquiries then any being is establishing itself as my enemy and not my ally. It has already disrespected me profoundly by determining I am so completely unworthy that it does not need to earn my trust or listen and respond to my questions or concerns. You can say "It's all for the greater good!" as much as you want, but without providing a full explanation on how it's for the greater good it just sounds like someone attempting to handwave away anyone questioning their latest self-interested scheme. Tyrants of many ages have said as much themselves when they were murdering their own citizenry for questioning their rule.

[danceblackcatdance]

edit: deleted!

leaving thread. have a nice day :)

[seigiarchon]

If some men just want to watch the world burn not because they have self-serving desires like money but because they have a much more nobler mission like Elevating Humanity to a much Higher state of existence, then I say let them watch the world burn.

How do you know there won't be a much better world for all of us after this current world is burnt to the ground?

Nobody down here knows that and it's ridiculous to expect people to have blind faith in the unknown when blind faith in the unknown has in essence been used and abused throughout the entirety of human history as a tool of enslavement for self-serving people (possibly even self-serving ETs.) So asking people to blindly trust something that they have every reason to believe is a bad, such as torture and death, is a lot like asking a human to go walk into the middle of a busy street blindfolded (because the cars won't hit you if you can't see them!) Even if it's within the greater spiritual paradigm, a necessity, no fault can be assigned to people who will resist something that can demonstrate evidence will be very horrible. That people cannot see this long-game is not their fault and because of that expecting anyone who exists with such a limited perspective to practice non-judgement is a bit like asking someone who lost their arm to go pitch for Major League Baseball. They just do not have the physical capability to recognize this practice even if they can understand HOW to pitch a ball intellectually.


You know, one thing I learnt over the years is that I will rather put my faith and my belief in the Divine, in the Unknown Universe than in any mortal man.

Of course, I have to use my own discernment as well when putting my faith in the Divine. My faith and my belief only goes so far but my faith and belief in the Divine and in the Unknown Universe definitely goes further than any faith and belief I have in the governments and corporations of this world.

Anything man-made is corrupt and that includes the Vatican. Especially the Vatican.

Btw, the Vatican did not create the Divine or the Unknown Universe. The Creator exists in all forms and in all cultures, even ET ones.

Lastly, you forget that if the next Messiah is going to destroy Prison Planet Earth and the entire Human society, do you think that He will need the permission or support of any humans'?

Do you think the next Messiah is going to give a damn what the average human thinks about His plan to Destroy Prison Planet Earth so that Humanity will be freed from its Chains and Bondages of Karma?

This is not the damn Presidential Race here.




If the Creator gives such men the Authority and Power to Destroy this world and such men want to Destroy this world, what can you or I do anything about it? For eg, if Jesus was reborn on this Earth and he wants to Destroy this Sinful World because of all the Sins of Mankind instead of saving the world this time round, are you going to call Jesus a psychopath?

I'd have a nice long conversation with him before determining that, and I'd probably want a good psychologist or two handy just to be sure, LOL. But yes I can safely say I could assign that value if someone came around, claimed to be Jesus, practiced miracles, and then said that the world should torture all non WASPS (white-anglo-saxon-protestant-straight) to death. After all, who decides if he's Jesus? Who's to say he's not just some alien that has some advanced technology pretending to be the original Jesus?

P.S. His treatment of the money-changers? Definitely some good 'ol fashioned judgement there. Even Jesus recognized there are extreme circumstances where, yes, you HAVE to be violent.

If a fake Messiah comes along, you won't even need to give him the time of the day. Plenty of fake Messiahs around. It is the True Messiah whom you really have to worry about.

First of all, you have to realize that if the next Jesus really comes along and He is given the Power and Authority to destroy Prison Planet Earth by the Creator, do you think that you and I are gonna have a say in this matter?

Do you think the next Jesus is gonna run in the Presidential Polls and say,"I am gonna run for World President so that I can Destroy the Earth! Please Support Me!"

Don't be foolish and naive. If the next Messiah wanna destroy the Earth, he won't give a damn about what you or the rest of the 7 billion population think. This is not a damn popularity contest. He will just go ahead and press the Red "Destruct" Button and gives you suckers a middle finger right in your silly faces.

If the next Messiah does indeed destroy the Earth, He will be doing so in order to Serve the Creator and Destroy and Evolve Humanity. Every Life has to be Destroyed first before Life can evolve to the next higher stage of existence. That is the way of things.




Who gives you the right to insult the Son of God? Who gives you the right to judge a Son of God?

Who gives anyone the right to say they're a son of God or claim anything? Your words are only worth as much as people will trust they're worth. So given the fact that there are a thousand ways you could lie and pretend to be Jesus, depending on how sophisticated a culture you visited, there is definitely a need to question any so-called Son of God to determine his character.


As I said before, the True Messiah does not need anyone to question his character. You either follow his orders or get destroyed stopping him.

You can call him a tyrant a dictator he won't a damn about what you think. As long as he follows the orders of the Creator, do you think your petty name-calling is gonna affect him?

What did they say? "Sticks and Stones may hurt my Bones but Words never will"?

You are only going to be punished if you cast derogatory remarks at the Son of God and nothing good will come in your way.




Judgment of the world is only carried out by individuals with a very high level of moral codes.. someone like the Buddha or Jesus comes to mind and I don't think you or me has the right to criticize the next Messiah if He decides to Destroy this world instead of saving it.

But then that's not non-judgement, that's giving up your ability to judge your own circumstances to someone else who for any number of possible reasons could not have your best interests at heart. You're still performing an act of judgement in fact by doing this, because you're still saying you want to judge certain situations, merely that you do not trust yourself to render judgement and that therefore you'll just let some other guy handle it.

To try another analogy, non-judgement implies a complete and total inability to reach decisions by yourself. Since you would be unable to judge whether the outcomes of any situation were any different than the other and therefore you would be prevented from making any choices in your life. Can you imagine waking up, opening your cupboard and being unable to eat breakfast because you have three cereal boxes in front of you, none of which you may assign any judgement to? I imagine life would be quite hard.


As mentioned before, the True Messiah won't give a damn what the average man thinks when carrying out his Judgement.




The average man with normal human desires and average level of moral code is simply not fit enough to criticize men whom serve as the Hand of the Creator.. Such men have moral codes and wisdom much higher than the average man.

If I were demonstratively ignorant then it could be explained, I would apologize and life would go on. However instead by refusing to explain things in full and taking the dogmatic "Hands off God's boy you heathen! How dare you ask questions!" approach to my inquiries then any being is establishing itself as my enemy and not my ally. It has already disrespected me profoundly by determining I am so completely unworthy that it does not need to earn my trust or listen and respond to my questions or concerns. You can say "It's all for the greater good!" as much as you want, but without providing a full explanation on how it's for the greater good it just sounds like someone attempting to handwave away anyone questioning their latest self-interested scheme. Tyrants of many ages have said as much themselves when they were murdering their own citizenry for questioning their rule.

A real Messiah won't be interested in running an empire on Prison Planet Earth. He will be looking to Serve the Creator's Plan and escaping from the Samsara of Prison Planet Earth asap.

No true Messiah would want to remain on Prison Planet Earth and muack around in the filth of Karma like the rest of humanity.

There is nothing on earth which can tempt the Messiah away from the True Divine Grace of the Lord Creator or trap him in the Cursed Cycle of Rebirth and Death. Not even if you give the Messiah all the wealth, all the lands and all the women in the world.

To compare the Messiah to petty tyrants would be like comparing the Sun to pigs.

[seigiarchon]

ascension is the expression of desire to leave the physical material life

[Mu2143]

The only way to grasp control of your own destiny is to leave your physical body and evolve your soul and spirit to such a high degree that you would be the one controlling the Archons and other ET races instead.

No, You have more Authority than them. They can no longer control us when we no longer trying to control them!(The victim/aggressor cycle)


The Angel of Death, Azarael, had to judge which souls are worthy of entering the Creator's Kingdom and which souls have to go to hell.

This quote is Satans Lie ,GOD is love. God judges in love not hate


Judgment of the world is only carried out by individuals with a very high level of moral codes.. someone like the Buddha or Jesus comes to mind and I don't think you or me has the right to criticize the next Messiah if He decides to Destroy this world instead of saving it.

No , Yeshua HaMashiach came to fulfill not to destroy!

[the_vast_mystery]

You know, one thing I learnt over the years is that I will rather put my faith and my belief in the Divine, in the Unknown Universe than in any mortal man.

Of course, I have to use my own discernment as well when putting my faith in the Divine. My faith and my belief only goes so far but my faith and belief in the Divine and in the Unknown Universe definitely goes further than any faith and belief I have in the governments and corporations of this world.

Anything man-made is corrupt and that includes the Vatican. Especially the Vatican.

Btw, the Vatican did not create the Divine or the Unknown Universe. The Creator exists in all forms and in all cultures, even ET ones.

Lastly, you forget that if the next Messiah is going to destroy Prison Planet Earth and the entire Human society, do you think that He will need the permission or support of any humans'?

Do you think the next Messiah is going to give a damn what the average human thinks about His plan to Destroy Prison Planet Earth so that Humanity will be freed from its Chains and Bondages of Karma?

This is not the damn Presidential Race here.

What is divine? What makes one divine? Maybe you've had your own personal experience with some other-worldly being but I have not. Not that I exactly trust corporations or many current world governments but that doesn't mean there aren't things in this world worth trusting...like the scientific method and its process of experimentation, observation, and repeated validation of results. It's by far the single most reliable thing on this planet other than the planet itself and its natural processes (Which it tries to explain itself as best as it can.) It doesn't produce some neatly packaged sound byte that somehow encapsulates some layer of mythical objective truth. But it can be guaranteed, when followed properly, to produce the absolutely most correct possible explanation (over time) for any phenomena it seeks to understand or explain.


If a fake Messiah comes along, you won't even need to give him the time of the day. Plenty of fake Messiahs around. It is the True Messiah whom you really have to worry about.

Um, yes, because a supposed Fake Messiah even in your situation could easily lead people to their deaths by leading them away from this True Messiah of yours and you'd never know the difference. So yes, finding out who is lying could quite potentially, even in your hypothetical situation be a life or death matter of importance. ;)


First of all, you have to realize that if the next Jesus really comes along and He is given the Power and Authority to destroy Prison Planet Earth by the Creator, do you think that you and I are gonna have a say in this matter?

Do you think the next Jesus is gonna run in the Presidential Polls and say,"I am gonna run for World President so that I can Destroy the Earth! Please Support Me!"

Don't be foolish and naive. If the next Messiah wanna destroy the Earth, he won't give a damn about what you or the rest of the 7 billion population think. This is not a damn popularity contest. He will just go ahead and press the Red "Destruct" Button and gives you suckers a middle finger right in your silly faces.

If the next Messiah does indeed destroy the Earth, He will be doing so in order to Serve the Creator and Destroy and Evolve Humanity. Every Life has to be Destroyed first before Life can evolve to the next higher stage of existence. That is the way of things.

So what was the point of your Anecdote again and how does it in any way demonstrate why I should trust in the divine? I just said (because I thought that's what you were implying) that strict adherence to a policy of non-judgement sounds profoundly unwise as a philosophy since it implies that you are to allow ALL peoples for any reason regardless to run roughshod over you. I used the example that there are people there who if given the chance, can and will do this just for fun and as such we as a people may have a vested interest in locking someone away so they say, don't go raping, looting and pillaging over the whole of the earth. You then interject "What if God sent Jesus to destroy the earth" at which point I respond that I'd need to know he was Jesus before I'd trust him and your response is "Stupid mortal! Jesus doesn't need to respect you! he'd just do it!" which I think misses the entire point of the discussion. Which was based on the idea that non-judgement is unwise as humans do not have the faculty to determine absolute truth merely out of the aether and therefore somehow "know" this person is this mythical Son of God. Were you perhaps trying to say something else I missed? ^_^;;


As I said before, the True Messiah does not need anyone to question his character. You either follow his orders or get destroyed stopping him.

You can call him a tyrant a dictator he won't a damn about what you think. As long as he follows the orders of the Creator, do you think your petty name-calling is gonna affect him?

What did they say? "Sticks and Stones may hurt my Bones but Words never will"?

You are only going to be punished if you cast derogatory remarks at the Son of God and nothing good will come in your way.

So I am to bow down, give up my entire life, my soul, to a mere man who is required to offer me no proof whatsoever he is who he says he is? How do you determine who to bow down to? Is anyone claiming to be the True Messiah enough? How do you know whom to take your marching orders from?
If Satan knows the Bible, and all of God's tricks, he can just as easily disguise himself as Jesus. In such a situation the only way to know your "True Jesus" from "Satan disguised as Jesus" would be who was left standing at the end of the fight, but the Bible makes it pretty clear you have to have chosen before that time came. That doesn't really make too much sense though, compelling blind obedience beforehand with threats of eternal torture and damnation? That sounds an awful lot more like something a medieval king or pope would say to someone challenging the social order of the time.


As mentioned before, the True Messiah won't give a damn what the average man thinks when carrying out his Judgement.

Well then we really don't matter anyway and there's not really any point to this conversation now is there? We're already judged so nothing we do has any point! ;p


A real Messiah won't be interested in running an empire on Prison Planet Earth. He will be looking to Serve the Creator's Plan and escaping from the Samsara of Prison Planet Earth asap.

No true Messiah would want to remain on Prison Planet Earth and muack around in the filth of Karma like the rest of humanity.

There is nothing on earth which can tempt the Messiah away from the True Divine Grace of the Lord Creator or trap him in the Cursed Cycle of Rebirth and Death. Not even if you give the Messiah all the wealth, all the lands and all the women in the world.

To compare the Messiah to petty tyrants would be like comparing the Sun to pigs.

How do you know that? What leads you to believe in such things? If it's really all just a feeling you've gotten, all I have to say is that your feeling is just as good as mine and therefore it is impossible to determine which of either of them is in fact true. :) Therefore in the spirit of this whole non-judgement situation, I render the verdict that we are both equally correct! But that perhaps in fact the truth you refer to is more along the lines of specific marching orders to recognize where you personally might need to go or what you personally might need to do in the end times.

It could be, in fact, that nearing the precipice of 2012 reality will split into a type of fractal pattern where we'll all be carefully led into whatever the next level of our existence is and that each person is led along their own path in their own time and that what each of us believes will be the sign of the end times is in fact, a series of specific signs meant to bring specific people to specific places in space/time to make the shift.

Of course, that's just based on my own interpretation from scouring over the Law of One material, which I really against my better judgement can't help but say I truly do enjoy even if there's the chance that it could contain disinformation as well. What makes you right and me wrong and how can you even assess that given your scenario? Because that would be very interesting to see.

[tenacity1]

Look I hear those who say that the Divine is the only way to go an I respect that. MY motivations for being hopeful and filled with love for all beings is because I'd rather live with positive energy than negative. Besides as one with serious disabilities and health issues.. I know I may not live long.. hence..I seek peace and harmony.. period. I simply wish that we would have people who cared about the people leading us. yet, I know that since God is within us all we all ,ust answer our own inner voice.I respect that. Personally..if we got into my prejudiced feelings..I'd say than men have had this world for 5000 years tis time women rule the world.. But that in an of itself is not fair.. pardoxes and conundrums are for our learning. try being housebound and or paralyzed for years.. you will learn to turn inward and to pray.

[Siberia9]

qwertyuiop

[Bill Ryan]

They are real, but for me I was very surprised to see them show up the way they have here. I know they are real because one of my best friends was in federal prison for racketeering, he was an enforcer for a certain illegal organization back in the late 1980's. One of his best cell mates when he was in Arizona federal prison was a Chinese gangster from Hong Kong (a White Dragon member) that got arrested in California. He was an excellent martial artist and I talked to him on the phone once or twice as he was training my friend and I was a martial artist as well. He was also a Freemason in San Francisco and that surprised me to no end I must say. About a decade later an Italian gangster I knew from New York City told me they were into something with them and wanted to know if I knew anything about the White Dragons etc.

They are gangsters, and frankly its a little hard for me to see how they are involved in anything other than being gangsters. Of course we all know who runs and funds ALL big gangsters.

Police, gangsters, Freemasons, etc etc are all just bricks in the same pyramid system that is run by some very powerful reclusive and dangerous family's. The Idea that they are going to move to the top of the pyramid without it being part of the plan is just goofy to me.

Ive made it no secret here that I am related to some of the Illuminati Bloodline Family's, and I remember being told when I was young that it was part of the plan to have the people hate their govts and see them as criminals so they could change the way things are run once and for all. I dont have all the secrets but that piece of the puzzle is on my table and it fits right next to the one that says China will be the muscle for the New Order after the US has collapsed.

I will go out on a limb and guess that we will find the usual suspects step up to back the clowns before its over. Like the Rothchild bankers and the Chinese Govt etc.,,, we will see.


Ive said this before, as i have had dealings with many people who are familiar and part of hidden occult groups in asia, and not one has ever mentioned the existence of a "white dragon society".

If this group did exist, surely there would be some documented reference to this group in the annals of Asian history. For example, the Illuminati can be traced back to Johann Adam Weishaupt and his texts in the 1700's. No such record exists for this "white dragon society".

Hey Siberia9,

That´s a very interesting report.

Perhaps something like this deserves its own thread, since there´s a lot o people here who are taking these White Dragons as the legit good guys.

What do you think?

I'd really encourage that. Siberia9 has a great deal to say from personal, direct experience. I would be most interested to listen well.

I've been convinced for the last two years that Fulford is (a) has a messiah complex, and (b) is being played hard as a gullible asset with a useful public platform.

[pilotsimone]

deleted post

[Siberia9]

This is a video that Alexander Romanov just put out, not much of a vid but Fulford is in it and the Illuminati gets a mention as well as The Black Dragon Society.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ltgepVGeI_M

Its at this point you will realize just how muddy these waters really are.

These aristocrats are quite nutty and the closer you are to them the nuttier they will act. Some of them are gibbering maniacs others hold it together pretty well. Frankly any one of them could go down to the local health dept and tell them how they see the world and explain it to them in detail and get a mental disability check no problem, myself included LOL. And this is what rules the planet, who else would work so hard to control everything.

[wynderer]

as vox of http://www.voxfux.com/ who also knows them well says, 'These are not nice people'


This is a video that Alexander Romanov just put out, not much of a vid but Fulford is in it and the Illuminati gets a mention as well as The Black Dragon Society.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ltgepVGeI_M

Its at this point you will realize just how muddy these waters really are.

These aristocrats are quite nutty and the closer you are to them the nuttier they will act. Some of them are gibbering maniacs others hold it together pretty well. Frankly any one of them could go down to the local health dept and tell them how they see the world and explain it to them in detail and get a mental disability check no problem, myself included LOL. And this is what rules the planet, who else would work so hard to control everything.

[radiantfoods]

Ive said this before, as i have had dealings with many people who are familiar and part of hidden occult groups in asia, and not one has ever mentioned the existence of a "white dragon society".

If this group did exist, surely there would be some documented reference to this group in the annals of Asian history. For example, the Illuminati can be traced back to Johann Adam Weishaupt and his texts in the 1700's. No such record exists for this "white dragon society".

Benjamin Fulford stated on his own website that he had registered in Japan his own Foundation to collect contributions in excess of $50 dollars US each: "The White Dragon Foundation is set to become a functioning legal entity on June 1st, according to the lawyer who is handling the application with the Japanese government. The principle philosophy of the foundation will be to maximize both the amount and variety of life on earth and in the universe.

Once the foundation is set up, it will solicit donations from individual and institutional investors for the purpose of ending poverty and stopping environmental destruction." Source: http://benjaminfulford.net - May 23, 2011

I believe that this is why you were unable to verify the White Dragons Society.

radiantfoods

[EnergyGardener]

The impact of removal of people that sold us out, fractional banking, paying interest on national debts, wars, energy, inflated profits and designed waste by corporations, all owned and controlled by the same wretched beings will immediately provide disposable income/prosperity beyond our wildest dreams.

Removal of fear all forms of mind control and introduction to other universal systems from which we can choose and design for our planet, is a circumstance that we should not criticize each other for planning at the moment; we yet have so much to learn—and will do so very quickly.

Our immediate and first phase, "CLEAN-UP," will unveil plenty of solutions resulting from revelations of knowledge, personal and group power and liberty in every regard.

Smile, we are getting closer every moment.....

[Airwooz]

Gangsters always wanne appear in a legitimate form, especially the Japanese Yakuza, what a great idea for them to solve the poverty and save the world from Illuminati's claw, I don't think they can achieve any of those instead of collect money from donators and take control the government. Fulford has some reputation in altertive community which is good for him to play a pulic role for those organizations in order to run this political campaign. Yakuza seeks influence to gain power, especially in financial gloomy days, people will fall for the extremely slogan, it's very catchy. That's why the Black Dragon society helped to fund many east asian revolutions during the war time, once they successfully establish a regime they will get more compare to the little initial investment.

[eva08]

When the new financial system starts up and the criminals are removed from the core of the Western financial system, then money will pour like rain on Europe (it already is in the non-cabal controlled part of the world).
"pouring like rain" is a luciferian term of the Hollywood music industry "rain man", etc. controlled by the cabal. And I am also wondering which are the non-cabal controlled parts of the world and how much money was released and which projects did it fund and to what was the outcome? Any references, facts, statistics, reports? It sounds to me almost like the Obama "Hope and Change" hype controlled by who? Maybe some learned elders are pulling these strings too; just wondering.
A few concrete facts of actual improvements would be great to hear about.

[Nyce555]

I believe that we are each on our own journey here. No matter what we do there will always be some outside entity trying to influence our actions here on Earth (human, angelic or dark spirits). That is a part of our existence. That is what makes it worthwhile for me. Overcoming the negative and embracing the love that we receive and give. My life so far has been a wonderful learning experience and I am not quite ready to ascend out of it, until our Creator calls me home. I enjoy my astral trips and they remond me of what I have to look forward to when I do leave this place. But I'd like to learn some more stuff and give more love before I meet you all on the Other Side. :)

[seigiarchon]

The only way to grasp control of your own destiny is to leave your physical body and evolve your soul and spirit to such a high degree that you would be the one controlling the Archons and other ET races instead.

No, You have more Authority than them. They can no longer control us when we no longer trying to control them!(The victim/aggressor cycle)

You are kidding me right? Do you know the Archons and other ET races possess spiritual powers and other spiritual technologies which can affect the laws of reality itself?

For eg, if you are going on a picnic and the Archons and higher ET races wanna ruin your day, they can easily conjure up a storm which will shower on your picnic.

As a soul trapped in a 3D physical cage, all of us must realize that we are subjected to the whims and fancies of higher dimensional beings than us who has vast powers to control our reality.

If any of them wanna make things difficult for us, they can do so in a multitude of manner. They can touch our money, they can cause car accidents, they can cause our loved ones to have health problems, etc, etc

So this is why Humanity can only achieve total freedom from tyranny if they leave the cages of their 3D physical human bodies!


The Angel of Death, Azarael, had to judge which souls are worthy of entering the Creator's Kingdom and which souls have to go to hell.

This quote is Satans Lie ,GOD is love. God judges in love not hate

God Judges without love nor hate. God Judges only with impassion and neturality.


Judgment of the world is only carried out by individuals with a very high level of moral codes.. someone like the Buddha or Jesus comes to mind and I don't think you or me has the right to criticize the next Messiah if He decides to Destroy this world instead of saving it.

No , Yeshua HaMashiach came to fulfill not to destroy![/QUOTE]

Wake up. There can only be salvation through destruction of this old world paradigm.

[seigiarchon]

You know, one thing I learnt over the years is that I will rather put my faith and my belief in the Divine, in the Unknown Universe than in any mortal man.

Of course, I have to use my own discernment as well when putting my faith in the Divine. My faith and my belief only goes so far but my faith and belief in the Divine and in the Unknown Universe definitely goes further than any faith and belief I have in the governments and corporations of this world.

Anything man-made is corrupt and that includes the Vatican. Especially the Vatican.

Btw, the Vatican did not create the Divine or the Unknown Universe. The Creator exists in all forms and in all cultures, even ET ones.

Lastly, you forget that if the next Messiah is going to destroy Prison Planet Earth and the entire Human society, do you think that He will need the permission or support of any humans'?

Do you think the next Messiah is going to give a damn what the average human thinks about His plan to Destroy Prison Planet Earth so that Humanity will be freed from its Chains and Bondages of Karma?

This is not the damn Presidential Race here.

What is divine? What makes one divine? Maybe you've had your own personal experience with some other-worldly being but I have not. Not that I exactly trust corporations or many current world governments but that doesn't mean there aren't things in this world worth trusting...like the scientific method and its process of experimentation, observation, and repeated validation of results. It's by far the single most reliable thing on this planet other than the planet itself and its natural processes (Which it tries to explain itself as best as it can.) It doesn't produce some neatly packaged sound byte that somehow encapsulates some layer of mythical objective truth. But it can be guaranteed, when followed properly, to produce the absolutely most correct possible explanation (over time) for any phenomena it seeks to understand or explain.

This is not a thread to judge what is or what is not Divine. If you wanna start a discussion on what is or what is not Divine, kindly start a thread of your own and stop derailing this thread.




If a fake Messiah comes along, you won't even need to give him the time of the day. Plenty of fake Messiahs around. It is the True Messiah whom you really have to worry about.

Um, yes, because a supposed Fake Messiah even in your situation could easily lead people to their deaths by leading them away from this True Messiah of yours and you'd never know the difference. So yes, finding out who is lying could quite potentially, even in your hypothetical situation be a life or death matter of importance. ;)

A True Messiah does not need people to believe in him because he knows those who follow him know the differences between Truth and Lies.

A True Messiah doesn't need anyone who does not possess the Wisdom to differentiate between Truth and Lies.




First of all, you have to realize that if the next Jesus really comes along and He is given the Power and Authority to destroy Prison Planet Earth by the Creator, do you think that you and I are gonna have a say in this matter?

Do you think the next Jesus is gonna run in the Presidential Polls and say,"I am gonna run for World President so that I can Destroy the Earth! Please Support Me!"

Don't be foolish and naive. If the next Messiah wanna destroy the Earth, he won't give a damn about what you or the rest of the 7 billion population think. This is not a damn popularity contest. He will just go ahead and press the Red "Destruct" Button and gives you suckers a middle finger right in your silly faces.

If the next Messiah does indeed destroy the Earth, He will be doing so in order to Serve the Creator and Destroy and Evolve Humanity. Every Life has to be Destroyed first before Life can evolve to the next higher stage of existence. That is the way of things.

So what was the point of your Anecdote again and how does it in any way demonstrate why I should trust in the divine? I just said (because I thought that's what you were implying) that strict adherence to a policy of non-judgement sounds profoundly unwise as a philosophy since it implies that you are to allow ALL peoples for any reason regardless to run roughshod over you. I used the example that there are people there who if given the chance, can and will do this just for fun and as such we as a people may have a vested interest in locking someone away so they say, don't go raping, looting and pillaging over the whole of the earth. You then interject "What if God sent Jesus to destroy the earth" at which point I respond that I'd need to know he was Jesus before I'd trust him and your response is "Stupid mortal! Jesus doesn't need to respect you! he'd just do it!" which I think misses the entire point of the discussion. Which was based on the idea that non-judgement is unwise as humans do not have the faculty to determine absolute truth merely out of the aether and therefore somehow "know" this person is this mythical Son of God. Were you perhaps trying to say something else I missed? ^_^;;

You twist my words again.

What i meant was the True Messiah doesn't need to listen to any human on Earth or take any advice from any human.

The only being which the True Messiah needs to listen to is the Lord Creator.

If the True Messiah orders humans to revolt against the governments of this world and this includes destruction and looting of the rich in the process, then I am sure the True Messiah has his own reasons for doing so.




As I said before, the True Messiah does not need anyone to question his character. You either follow his orders or get destroyed stopping him.

You can call him a tyrant a dictator he won't a damn about what you think. As long as he follows the orders of the Creator, do you think your petty name-calling is gonna affect him?

What did they say? "Sticks and Stones may hurt my Bones but Words never will"?

You are only going to be punished if you cast derogatory remarks at the Son of God and nothing good will come in your way.

So I am to bow down, give up my entire life, my soul, to a mere man who is required to offer me no proof whatsoever he is who he says he is? How do you determine who to bow down to? Is anyone claiming to be the True Messiah enough? How do you know whom to take your marching orders from?
If Satan knows the Bible, and all of God's tricks, he can just as easily disguise himself as Jesus. In such a situation the only way to know your "True Jesus" from "Satan disguised as Jesus" would be who was left standing at the end of the fight, but the Bible makes it pretty clear you have to have chosen before that time came. That doesn't really make too much sense though, compelling blind obedience beforehand with threats of eternal torture and damnation? That sounds an awful lot more like something a medieval king or pope would say to someone challenging the social order of the time.



I am sure a True Messiah has ways and means of proving who He is and I am sure that humans are more than intelligent enough, especially with the upgrades to human's DNAs over the last 3 years, to know who is the True Messiah and who is the False Messiah.

If you still can't differentiate between a True or Fake Messiah by now 2012, then too bad for you.

Most people know the Truth in this year 2012. Well everyone I know or met on the street in the various countries which I have visited over the past 3 years know the truth so if you are one of the rare few who are still ignorant, then too bad for you.




As mentioned before, the True Messiah won't give a damn what the average man thinks when carrying out his Judgement.

Well then we really don't matter anyway and there's not really any point to this conversation now is there? We're already judged so nothing we do has any point! ;p

No, there is no point in continuing this conversation with You.




A real Messiah won't be interested in running an empire on Prison Planet Earth. He will be looking to Serve the Creator's Plan and escaping from the Samsara of Prison Planet Earth asap.

No true Messiah would want to remain on Prison Planet Earth and muack around in the filth of Karma like the rest of humanity.

There is nothing on earth which can tempt the Messiah away from the True Divine Grace of the Lord Creator or trap him in the Cursed Cycle of Rebirth and Death. Not even if you give the Messiah all the wealth, all the lands and all the women in the world.

To compare the Messiah to petty tyrants would be like comparing the Sun to pigs.

How do you know that? What leads you to believe in such things? If it's really all just a feeling you've gotten, all I have to say is that your feeling is just as good as mine and therefore it is impossible to determine which of either of them is in fact true. :) Therefore in the spirit of this whole non-judgement situation, I render the verdict that we are both equally correct! But that perhaps in fact the truth you refer to is more along the lines of specific marching orders to recognize where you personally might need to go or what you personally might need to do in the end times.

It could be, in fact, that nearing the precipice of 2012 reality will split into a type of fractal pattern where we'll all be carefully led into whatever the next level of our existence is and that each person is led along their own path in their own time and that what each of us believes will be the sign of the end times is in fact, a series of specific signs meant to bring specific people to specific places in space/time to make the shift.

Of course, that's just based on my own interpretation from scouring over the Law of One material, which I really against my better judgement can't help but say I truly do enjoy even if there's the chance that it could contain disinformation as well. What makes you right and me wrong and how can you even assess that given your scenario? Because that would be very interesting to see.

If you can't even see that a True Messiah doesn't want to be trapped in Samsara and wanna leave Humanity and Prison Planet Earth immediately for a non-physical, non-material existence, regardless of how much wealth, land or women is offered to him, then I say you are even blinder than a man without eyes.

[seigiarchon]

Look I hear those who say that the Divine is the only way to go an I respect that. MY motivations for being hopeful and filled with love for all beings is because I'd rather live with positive energy than negative. Besides as one with serious disabilities and health issues.. I know I may not live long.. hence..I seek peace and harmony.. period. I simply wish that we would have people who cared about the people leading us. yet, I know that since God is within us all we all ,ust answer our own inner voice.I respect that. Personally..if we got into my prejudiced feelings..I'd say than men have had this world for 5000 years tis time women rule the world.. But that in an of itself is not fair.. pardoxes and conundrums are for our learning. try being housebound and or paralyzed for years.. you will learn to turn inward and to pray.

Humanity doesn't have the need for men or women to rule the world.

Humanity doesn't need anyone or any being to rule over them.

Humanity just need to smarten up and realize the lose-lose game of the 3D Illusionary Fake Reality which we are where no one ever wins in this game unless they check out of this game for good either through Death or through Ascension.

[seigiarchon]

We are not responsible for everything that happens in our lives.

If you wanna be on a perpetual guilt trip, go on ahead but hey I may not be perfect but I know I have never done anything to deserve being a Slave on this Prison Planet Earth.

I feel your resistance (and anger) to the idea we are responsible for ourselves in every way. So, maybe you are a different kind of being that is here completely against their will. I don't see how it's logical or probable, but I'm open to it.

'Perpetual guilt trip' doesn't resonate, I feel relieved to take responsibility. Like I've finally figured out the big secret (to my past suffering).

My very best to you on your journey, seigiarchon.

There are many multi-dimensional beings, gods, devas, asuras and demons who have the power to affect the nature of our reality.

Every event that happens to us is controlled by higher dimensional forces and beings.

Even the acts of breathing, sleeping, eating and defecating are controlled by higher beings.

This in essence, makes every human being a slave on Prison Planet Earth. Even Bill Gates and Obama are slaves on Prison Planet Earth albeit slaves who command other slaves but all of us are slaves in the end regardless of how rich or politically powerful you are.

[seigiarchon]

I believe that we are each on our own journey here. No matter what we do there will always be some outside entity trying to influence our actions here on Earth (human, angelic or dark spirits). That is a part of our existence. That is what makes it worthwhile for me. Overcoming the negative and embracing the love that we receive and give. My life so far has been a wonderful learning experience and I am not quite ready to ascend out of it, until our Creator calls me home. I enjoy my astral trips and they remond me of what I have to look forward to when I do leave this place. But I'd like to learn some more stuff and give more love before I meet you all on the Other Side. :)

Well guess what a wise one finally speaks.

The fact that some outside entity is able to influence our actions is what makes our existence a slave like existence.

We are no better than the pigs and cows in a farm and every single human must awaken to this fact.

Ever watched the movie by Matt Damon "Adjustment Bureau"?

That movie gives a brilliant example of how ET forces are controlling the lives of human beings on Earth.

We don't control our own Destiny. THEY DO!

[felixq78]

From the stuff I've heard and I've listened to hours and hours of Drake's reports, he hasn't really specified who is being targeted nor from whence they've come. He's been extremely tight lipped when it comes to specifics so you can't really criticise their plans and whom they include. Many people have been attacking this guy but they have no idea who he is or what his plans may be, I don't get it. Surely we need some data before we start any form of criticism. The way I see it the lies (excluding your comment of course) and the assumptions are coming from all directions and we have no idea about what they're really doing, maybe we should stay prepared, sit tight and wait for this to unfold. There's not much we can really do anyway.

[felixq78]

Could be,..might be,..but we don't really know. I'm still in the innocent until proven guilty camp. Just because we've been caught out in the past, it doesn't mean this Drake guy is just another disinfo merchant.

[Chester]

And what was his reaction that you do not percieve as being sourced from a place of wisdom, JustOne?

several, but specifically the statement that maybe the post creator should maybe leave town for his own safety type threat - doesn't sound like someone who learned much from his mystery school... just the whole way Drake handled it - sure the guy has to be under a great deal of stress but seems to me that being a spokesman is a responsibility and the primary responsibility is keeping your cool.

[Anchor]

When I mediate and get "inner messages" the last thing I think I will ever get is a URL :)

Still there would have to be a first time for everything, I will look forward to it.

[9eagle9]

You're correct, in spite of what Felixq notes, people provide their own evidence. If one knows how to look for it.

People who truly have mastered the esoteric arts, first learn to master themselves particularly one's emotions. If Drake has indeed attended Mystery school he didn't get much out of it. A common mistake when studying esoteria is that accumulation of knowledge through study is self mastery. It's not. Its acquiring a lot of knowledge but not imposing the appropriate discipline upon one's self in order to use it. It then just become information purposes only.

The truth is never broke down by a little questioning. If it is , it's not the truth.

Drake has self identified with his own belief system, if you question the beliefs , it is is perceived as questioning him.

Estoeric people know better than to fall into that all to common mind trap.

Truth is, as always, self evident.

[Siberia9]

qwertyuiop

[Siberia9]

qwertyuiop

[Debra]

INTERVIEW ON REDICE RADIO

1st hour (free) http://www.redicecreations.com/radio/2012/05/RIR-120510.php

Clif High - Hour 1 - The "Mass Arrests" Claim, Fulford & The White Dragon Society

May 10, 2012
Clif High, along with his associate George Ure, developed the Web Bot, or the Web Bot Project in the late 1990s. It's an Internet bot software program or a web spider that originally was designed to predict stock market trends. Eventually it developed into something different. Now it's claimed to be able to predict future events by tracking keywords on the web. In the first hour of the program Clif gives his take on a story of coming "mass arrests" being told about by author and speaker David Wilcock and whistleblower and alleged insider "Drake." They say that top military brass in the Pentagon have secret plans to arrest people in high places. This means corrupt politicians, bankers and those who have subjected people to financial tyranny. Connected to this story is also Benjamin Fulford, a former writer with Forbes magazine. From Japan, he's been reporting and writing about the Yakuza and the "White Dragon Society" and their supposed opposition to the western royal families and the Illuminati. Tied into this is also material about how the severity of the Fukushima nuclear disaster is being downplayed. Listen to this program to hear Clif High's opinion on these things and much more.

Hours 2 & 3 (Members Only - Access by Paid Subscription)

Clif High - Hour 2 & 3 - Fukushima Time Bubble, Language & A.I.

May 10, 2012
We proceed with Clif High for another two hours in our members section. We discuss more about Fukushima, the radiation situation and what kind of language Clif has been receiving from the web-bot relating to the nuclear disaster. We also discuss stuxnet and the connection to Israel. Clif brings up a highly unorthodox approach, as a potential fix to the problem in Fukushima. He explains the work of Dr. David Andersson and how to create a "time bubble" around the damaged reactors. With closed time loops, Fukushima Daiichi could be "bombarded" with time and effectively speed up the half-life within the bubble or closed time loop. David Andersson, who claimed to have worked on time travel research and time control, has disappeared off the radar and is nowhere to be found. Later, we discuss artificial intelligence vs. an alien artificial intelligence and how our thoughts and reality is being shaped by language. Clif also shares his opinion on the movie Thrive and much more.

[DreamsInDigital]

Actually a very simple and effective way of dealing with Fukushima is to hit it with Scalar Energy. That will remove the radioactive stuff.

[Taurean]

Perhaps THE most important interview I have heard yet.

I think I now know what to believe.

[StarDust]

1.5 hours of empty conjecture.:doh:

[Mulder]

I'm utterly shocked at around 7mins into this video where Romanov offers a $1 Million Gold bounty on the heads of the NWO! Romanov talks with a South African accent and claims to be the grandson of Anastasia Romanov (the last Czar's daughter who may have survived the 1917 Revolution.)

I expect this video to be taken down soon, so you'd better watch it soon!

cUEVS-n-vBE

[Taurean]

Fulford is on something.

[StarDust]

He's offering a $1,000,000.00 in gold bounty for the public execution of "George Bush, Jr."

:becky:

[sdv]

Romanov talks with a South African accent

Nope, that is not a South African accent. It's European but I can't pin down from where in Europe. Anyone on this forum who recognises the accent?

[transiten]

Well this time Fulford was the calm guy and Romanov somewhat nervous. I remeber an old video with Fuford interviewing this Italian Illuminaty guy (lost his name) where they both seemed to be extremely stressed out, esp Fulford.

I've slept 12 hours tonight after taking a calmig drug since i'm suffering from Lymedisease affecting my nervous system and sleep that i hopefully will be cured from by a homeopathic remedy (The drugcompanies have not managed to stop that yet)

I had a nightmare where i dreamt that i and my likeminded were under deaththreat and i tried to hide among "unconscious pple" in a big office that was also an apartment (my home) and so this is the first thing i watch waking up. Had i not had this long night sleep i would have avoided it and i have no idea what to think of this information.

I only know that the day before the Japanese tsunami on March 10 2011 i told my father that Uranus had entered Aries and that the risk for volcanoeruptions, earthquakes and tsunamis will increase although also coupled with fire since Aries is a fire sign. Next day it all happened: an earthquake a tsunami and fires breaking out in the Fukushima nuclear plant. Not as much an astrological prediction as a synchronicity for me.

Anyway i could never judge from my synchronicities alone whether some information rings true or not, if i'm on "the right path" or not. This is something one has to evaluate by one self. There's a shallow and naive belief out there that synchronicities always are a "positive sign".....

... and i can tell you from personal experience it can be quite the opposite; or one can say that the synchronicities are neutral per se and it's up to you yourself to evaluate what they/or your subconscious/higher self want to tell you and how you interpret the "signs". You decide, you don't blindly follow the signs.

Sometimes though one cannot know until after the experience and then maybe one has learned the lesson. Some negative things we must experience as to get a true understanding of negative and positive and how to reconcile them in this 3D of opposites.

This Romanov guy and Fulford represent 2 opposing ways of dealing with negativity and all the same they seem to cooperate. This might if nothing else be an interesting example of how the Negative and the Positive might be balanced if dealt with consciously and for me in this instance has nothing to do with with the validity of what they are saying since i'm not in a position i could judge that at all.

[spannera]

i think he's originally from Serbia

[D-Day]

1.5 hours of empty conjecture.:doh:

Hmm, I thought it was a Cliff High interview... not a Drake/Wilcock/Fullford interview...? ;)

[Borden]

Romanov talks with a South African accent

Nope, that is not a South African accent. It's European but I can't pin down from where in Europe. Anyone on this forum who recognises the accent?

I'm very good with this sort of thing, and he sounds to me like authentic but quite diluted South African, with a lot of English (I mean, probably having spent quite a long time in England). There's also the faint hint of another accent influence that I can't identify. It might be Greek or Turkish.

Fulford sounds like he's from planet Fulford.

It's all very silly.

[sdv]

I'm very good with this sort of thing, and he sounds to me like authentic but quite diluted South African, with a lot of English

NOPE, this is nowhere near being a South African accent (ANY kind of South African accent, across the range of the 9 official languages), so I guess you are not as good with accents as you thought you were.


i think he's originally from Serbia

At least we are on the right continent here!!

[Rollo]

Romanov talks with a South African accent

Nope, that is not a South African accent. It's European but I can't pin down from where in Europe. Anyone on this forum who recognises the accent?

Eastern Europe for sure, he can be from Poland, Russia or other country. I guess since many years he speaks in English and his native accent is not that strong enymore.

[Cjay]

Romanov talks with a South African accent

Nope, that is not a South African accent. It's European but I can't pin down from where in Europe. Anyone on this forum who recognises the accent?

I'm very good with this sort of thing, and he sounds to me like authentic but quite diluted South African, with a lot of English (I mean, probably having spent quite a long time in England). There's also the faint hint of another accent influence that I can't identify. It might be Greek or Turkish.


NOPE, this is nowhere near being a South African accent (ANY kind of South African accent, across the range of the 9 official languages), so I guess you are not as good with accents as you thought you were.


i think he's originally from Serbia

At least we are on the right continent here!!

I agree with Borden about the accent. The mother of my children is South African. I have known a lot of ex-patriot South Africans over the last 35 years. Romanov has a slight South African accent. (If not South African, then Zimbabwean). My guess is that he spent some of his formative years in South Africa, then lived in other places. If he is who he claims to be, then no doubt, he would have moved around a lot. That would explain why his accent is diluted/mixed with traces of other accents.

When he spoke of going to the Australian Embassy in Tokyo, I wondered if he had spent part of his life in Australia.

I think the debate about his accent is a distraction from what he was saying.

[Borden]

Thank you, Cjay. Sorry sdv, but I've known South Africans most of my life, and I'm just not mistaken. I guess I am as good with accents as I think I am. So there.

[Maia Gabrial]

Fulford is on something.

I couldn't take my eyes off of Fulford. He kept blinking which I think is a sign of either no sleep or brainwashing or both.... Idk, he doesn't really sound like himself....

[bodhii71]

Sorry, don't mean to be rude, but why are you arguing accents?
How is this pertinent to the "info" being disclosed in this video?

So, 1 million for the public execution of GWB JR.... anyone know where he is, chuckle chuckle. ;)

[RMorgan]

Sorry, don't mean to be rude, but why are you arguing accents?
How is this pertinent to the "info" being disclosed in this video?

So, 1 million for the public execution of GWB JR.... anyone know where he is, chuckle chuckle. ;)

Hey folks,

In my opinion, this bounty is just another artifice to try to enrich this plot.

Killing GWB is just not practical.

Who could kill such a high-profile character without getting arrested or worse, getting killed during the process.

The chances are so small for a person to kill him and actually putting his hands on the bounty money!

Also, even if a person can actually kill him and escape, how could this person be sure that this bounty is for real?

I mean, who would take the risks to kill a person so well protected, with nothing but the words of such an obscure character (Romanov) as a guarantee?

Besides, even if the killer is successful and actually get his hands on the money, killing GWB means that he would probably need to run away for the rest of his life, so he wouldn´t even have the time to enjoy the money.

Cheers,

Raf.

[truth4me]

Well, if you "take out" Bush Jr how do you know if it's him or not?

indianinthemachine.com/areuspresidentscloned.html

Speaking of clones do you remember this one about Obama ?

vimeo.com/6747788

[observer]

Helvetic has just released a Redice interview with Clif High on the "Information Machine" website.

Clif is the brainchild behind the Web Bot for those of you who don't know him. Clif is talking very critically about this entire Wilcox, Fulford, Drake scam:

http://information-machine.blogspot.com/

Search For: Clif High | The "Mass Arrests" Claim, Fulford & The White Dragon Society, May 10, 2012

[RMorgan]

Helvetic has just released a Redice interview with Clif High on the "Information Machine" website.

Clif is the brainchild behind the Web Bot for those of you who don't know him. Clif is talking very critically about this entire Wilcox, Fulford, Drake scam:

http://information-machine.blogspot.com/

Search For: Clif High | The "Mass Arrests" Claim, Fulford & The White Dragon Society, May 10, 2012

Thank you Observer.

This is an excellent interview.

I highly recommend it to those who seriously want to investigate this Fulford/Drake/Wilcock subject.

Cheers,

Raf.

[araucaria]

Helvetic has just released a Redice interview with Clif High on the "Information Machine" website.

Clif is the brainchild behind the Web Bot for those of you who don't know him. Clif is talking very critically about this entire Wilcox, Fulford, Drake scam:

http://information-machine.blogspot.com/

Search For: Clif High | The "Mass Arrests" Claim, Fulford & The White Dragon Society, May 10, 2012

Thank you Observer.

This is an excellent interview.

I highly recommend it to those who seriously want to investigate this Fulford/Drake/Wilcock subject.

Cheers,

Raf.

Except that Cliff High himself is not particularly reliable, or so I gather. I hope you are not scared of heights ;)

[RMorgan]

Helvetic has just released a Redice interview with Clif High on the "Information Machine" website.

Clif is the brainchild behind the Web Bot for those of you who don't know him. Clif is talking very critically about this entire Wilcox, Fulford, Drake scam:

http://information-machine.blogspot.com/

Search For: Clif High | The "Mass Arrests" Claim, Fulford & The White Dragon Society, May 10, 2012

Thank you Observer.

This is an excellent interview.

I highly recommend it to those who seriously want to investigate this Fulford/Drake/Wilcock subject.

Cheers,

Raf.

Except that Cliff High himself is not particularly reliable, or so I gather. I hope you are not scared of heights ;)

Hi my friend,

Personally, I don´t care about Clif himself in this interview, since he´s not claiming anything spectacular.

What I can see here, is that he´s investigating these matters in a very concise way.

He´s just using simple logic, very effectively, by the way.

Cheers,

Raf.

[Space_Ace]

Ben does not mention ascension nor ETs and seems obsessed with the white dragons. I read on another site that the white dragons are 50% positive and are willing to help humanity in exchange they will become the new "elites" with money and power. Right now humanity, especially men have almost no freedoms. We will be half free with the white dragons, but completely free after ascension if ascension is a reality and you choose to ascend.

[Mulder]

Thank you, Cjay. Sorry sdv, but I've known South Africans most of my life, and I'm just not mistaken. I guess I am as good with accents as I think I am. So there.

I'm with you on the accent - I listen to accents very carefully as I've lived in other countries and try to talk the same as the locals to fit in. Although, the actual information in the video about the bounty seems strange to me - it would be like giving $1 million to someone who abducts a grey alien & shows him to the world. Its an "impossible" scenario as no-one could really do this.

¤=[Post Update]=¤



Fulford is on something.

I couldn't take my eyes off of Fulford. He kept blinking which I think is a sign of either no sleep or brainwashing or both.... Idk, he doesn't really sound like himself....

Yes, they seem to have "given up"on the mass arrests of NWO leaders as they said "It's 2012, if we don't overthrow them now, we never will" (I'm paraphrasing from the discussion)

[humanalien]

Actually a very simple and effective way of dealing with Fukushima is to hit it with Scalar Energy. That will remove the radioactive stuff.

That's funny. Wasn't it a Scalar Weapon that set it off to begin with?

[KiwiElf]

Sorry, I don't need a computer program to tell me what I should be thinking ;)

[humanalien]

Any more, i don't watch any video's that concern aliens, ufo's or anything
to to do with Fulford, Wilcock, Kettler or anything to do with government
going's on because i have come to the conclusion that everyone is lying.

I don't even know why i watched the interview with Cliff High but i'm
glad i did because i now feel or think the same way that he does.

There aren't any aliens out there flying around that are here to help us,
they are more likely here to do more harm than good. This is just a story
made up by someone that can make money from it. Those are my words,
not Cliff's.

I never could figure out the Fulford angle until Cliff hit me in the face with
it and i believe someone here in the forum actually said the same thing. That
being that fulford and his ninja's, if the story is even real to begin with, will
want to wipe out the Old Powers That Be to replace them with the New Powers
That Be, namely Fulford and his ninja's.

Is that a Change That You Can Believe In?

Sounds like the same old stuff with a different wrapper on it to me.

The only person that i still some what believe is Alex Jone just for that
fact that he usually has government documents or white papers to back
up what he says. Sometimes even yahoo will post on what alex just said.

In all fairness to Wilcock, i like how Cliff described how wilcock gets
his information. He said it like this: The powers that be, go to david and
show him a picture of a barn with telling wilcock that it's a barn. They
will say, Look at the tin roof. See how the sides are all red? Hey Look!
It's got a big set of white double doors.

David thinks to himself and says Hey! That's a barn. It is believed by
cliff that this is how david gets his information. He is shown stuff but
not told what it is and david draws his own conclusions and passes it
off to you as the absolute truth.

I'm thinking that this may be how much of our disinformation is spread
around, just to keep everyone concentrating on the lies and not the truth.

[jackovesk]

Any more, i don't watch any video's that concern aliens, ufo's or anything
to to do with Fulford, Wilcock, Kettler or anything to do with government
going's on because i have come to the conclusion that everyone is lying.

I don't even know why i watched the interview with Cliff High but i'm
glad i did because i now feel or think the same way that he does.

There aren't any aliens out there flying around that are here to help us,
they are more likely here to do more harm than good. This is just a story
made up by someone that can make money from it. Those are my words,
not Cliff's.

I never could figure out the Fulford angle until Cliff hit me in the face with
it and i believe someone here in the forum actually said the same thing. That
being that fulford and his ninja's, if the story is even real to begin with, will
want to wipe out the Old Powers That Be to replace them with the New Powers
That Be, namely Fulford and his ninja's.

Is that a Change That You Can Believe In?

Sounds like the same old stuff with a different wrapper on it to me.

The only person that i still some what believe is Alex Jone just for that
fact that he usually has government documents or white papers to back
up what he says. Sometimes even yahoo will post on what alex just said.

In all fairness to Wilcock, i like how Cliff described how wilcock gets
his information. He said it like this: The powers that be, go to david and
show him a picture of a barn with telling wilcock that it's a barn. They
will say, Look at the tin roof. See how the sides are all red? Hey Look!
It's got a big set of white double doors.

David thinks to himself and says Hey! That's a barn. It is believed by
cliff that this is how david gets his information. He is shown stuff but
not told what it is and david draws his own conclusions and passes it
off to you as the absolute truth.

I'm thinking that this may be how much of our disinformation is spread
around, just to keep everyone concentrating on the lies and not the truth.

Well, Well, Well humanalien,

Like yourself some people have'nt forgotten how to think for themselves and still know how to use their own 'Discernment'...:)

Well done...:thumb:

Here is the 'Entire' Interview...

Clif High - The "Mass Arrests" Claim, Fulford & White Dragon Society pt.1-3


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7DyKLlfWe5g
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7DyKLlfWe5g

===

[ Mod-edit: I removed the second and third hour, since that is material intended only for Red Ice Radio subscribers. I realized someone posted those two hours on Youtube, and you were just linking to the Youtube video. That still doesn't make it OK in my book to link to those videos. - Paul. ]

[nomadguy]

This a very good, sound interview. I very much recommend this one.
Clarity is needed here on this wonderful blue planet.

[observer]

[....snip]
Except that Cliff High himself is not particularly reliable, or so I gather. I hope you are not scared of heights ;)

Here's Bill Ryan's take on this particular Clif High issue from another thread:



On Red Ice Radio Clif High is debunking all of this.

http://www.redicecreations.com/radio/2012/05/RIR-120510.php

On record here (note this!): :)

For the first time, I completely agree with Clif High -- especially re Fukushima (a potentially extremely serious global-impact problem happening right now) -- and his take on 'Drake' (he's right).

Here are Red Ice Radio's notes to the broadcast:





Clif High - Hour 1 - The "Mass Arrests" Claim, Fulford & The White Dragon Society

May 10, 2012

Clif High, along with his associate George Ure, developed the Web Bot, or the Web Bot Project in the late 1990s. It's an Internet bot software program or a web spider that originally was designed to predict stock market trends. Eventually it developed into something different. Now it's claimed to be able to predict future events by tracking keywords on the web.

In the first hour of the program Clif gives his take on a story of coming "mass arrests" being told about by author and speaker David Wilcock and whistleblower and alleged insider "Drake." They say that top military brass in the Pentagon have secret plans to arrest people in high places. This means corrupt politicians, bankers and those who have subjected people to financial tyranny.

Connected to this story is also Benjamin Fulford, a former writer with Forbes magazine. From Japan, he's been reporting and writing about the Yakuza and the "White Dragon Society" and their supposed opposition to the western royal families and the Illuminati. Tied into this is also material about how the severity of the Fukushima nuclear disaster is being downplayed. Listen to this program to hear Clif High's opinion on these things and much more.


Just to keep the record stright....

[Debra]

Sorry, I don't need a computer program to tell me what I should be thinking ;)

Good idea to keep this resistance going KiwiElf :) I have a problem with answering to a computer over the phone.

None the less, info gleaned through web Bot technology has its uses. I think. It keeps a track on digital ''paperwork'' that is circulating and assembles it - which is a convenient and time saving tool BUT it is not the whole system, and it is NOT the whole story, either.

I find it interesting how people are still in a war of choices - on which way to lean, who to trust - and will use every means to challenge information, or rather try to discredit it, or to react to it, because it does not feel comfortable.

I guess this is just the melting down of everything as we know it, and the sands are still shifting.

Clif High is riding high with his own considered perspective - a position that has been driven and shaped by his past and informed by the changing present. And he has created a life to bring order back into the world. That is very clear in this interview. He is a strong voice, but he is also just another voice.

Perhaps his rationalist method - to assume something is wrong, before you find enough evidence to suggest otherwise - is a wise move. I think.

And his analysis goes beyond just bringing information together, it moves into voice and speech analysis. I was intrigued by his claims that Drake's level of language displays a level of control. From his own knowledge and experience of military connected insiders, he says he constantly picks up in Drake´s voice and in transcripts ''an internal discontinuity'' where he detects a shift in personalities, which convinces him that Drake is speaking on an agenda that has been delivered to him.

This is interesting. And needs to be brought up. Henrik Palmgren, during the interview, agrees at one point to recognising this - sometimes - in people he interviews.

Otherwise, I can understand why Clif High is given the microphone here because you cannot fault the man on his highly disciplined approach, which when you hear more about his personal story behind his agenda - he walks the talk, not just talks. And that needs to be valued as well.

He might not have the whole story - but, it is a part of the puzzle.

He is also a straight shooter, and knows that he creates contention. He thinks that lies are courted for the reason that people are more ready to buy into them, especially the feel good scenarios. We are a disfunctional family (and we cannot just accuse the elite of this, he says) so, we need to deal with this.

Hmmm ...

And the only thing we can do is hold our consciousness, he says, and mold it on a daily basis. And that means being honest with who we are and what we witness.

I could probably get depressed hearing High on a daily basis but I want to hear more from him.

[gripreaper]

Cliff High? OMG, he has never had any prediction ever come true. Remember November 7th of 2010 was supposed to have an energetic footprint greater than 9-11 with 3 months release language like we have never seen before?

Cliff High is fear porn at it's finest and, even though he is right about Fukushima and possibly Drake, so is Snooki and Kim Kardashian.

Geez!

[Debra]

Fearporn, living on the dark side. He even admits it, Gripreaper :)

[StarDust]

1.5 hours of empty conjecture.:doh:

Hmm, I thought it was a Cliff High interview... not a Drake/Wilcock/Fullford interview...? ;)

Clif High is COMPLETE TOOL! This review summed it up well:

http://nesaranews.blogspot.com/2012/05/red-ice-creations-loose-its-aaa-credit.html

Red Ice Creations Loose it's AAA Credit Rating in Fair and Objective Alternative News

Red Ice Creations Loose it's AAA Credit Rating in Fair and Objective Alternative News Reporting: Joins Info Wars and Fox News in Multimedia 2012 Pissing Contest. 

I am a subscriber to Red Ice Creations, and up until recently considered myself one of their biggest fans. On the May 10th Red Ice Radio podcast featuring Half Past Human's Clif High, the typical hard nosed insight for truth seeking journalism that Red Ice has normally put out on a regular basis, was nowhere to be found. That really was a big disappointment for me, regarding the lack of integrity and investigative journalistic ethics of Chief Editor and brain child of Red Ice Creations, Henrik Palgren. Mr. High went on a hour long attack on David Wilcock, from Divine Cosmos.com, Benjamin Fulford of benjaminfulford.net, and new comer from Freedomreigns.US, Drake. 

These three men have been reporting on the high probability of mass arrest of the Global Banking Criminal Cabal, The end of the debt based Federal Reserve economic system, and a releasing of suppressed technologies leading to a Golden Age where over unity energy devices are made available to  the people of Planet Earth. Sounds like some pretty far out stuff huh? Well for five years Red Ice Radio has been leading the way in reporting the way way far out. Nothing too taboo, nothing  too extreme. Longer than almost anyone else, Red Ice Radio has been reporting on all of these issues, if fact they really have been leading the charge in these highly controversial topics, the brain dead sleep walking masses would only entertain if they were watching some science fiction movie. Red Ice Radio seems to be, as renown researcher Michael Tsarion would but it, "territorializing" the most far out and fantasmigorical ideas and memes, for their own. 

With the recent tone and posture of the most cutting edge show in the alternative media, I have to wonder if Mr. Palmgren is finally getting soft, with his own personal brand of arrogance and alternative media elitist veneer.  I personally have researched new comer Drake by taking the necessary time to listen to all of his podcast appearing at Freedom Reigns.US, Fredomizer Radio on Blogtalk Radio.com and Wolf Spirit Radio.com. I have also taken the time research a broad scope of what  Fulford and Wilcock have also been reporting about. From geopolitics, to the controlled demolition of the Federal Reserve baking cabal, and the inevitable release of new energy technologies to name a few.  All three of these men have been working quite independently in their own said sphere of related interest, though Fulford and Wilcock have done some recent interviews together. The idea that there is some conspiracy, from some dark cabal disinfo campaign, propagated by Wilcock, Fulford and Drake is quite a ridiculous and  lazy brained conclusion to jump to .This subject matter is really quite open source, no one out there really has the moral authority to really throw anyone else under the bus like we heard on the recent RIR podcast. 

So with that said, it is highly, highly unusual for Red Ice Creations to attack David Wilcock, Benjamin Fulford and new comer Drake in such a brash, close minded, and testosterone driven fashion. We normally see this style of hit and run reporting from alternative media Hulkster, Alex Jones, who we all still love but, is almost more like some twisted form of entertainment for must of us. It seems now that Red Ice Radio has become so big, so groundbreaking, so much an insider in setting trends of what is and what is not relevant, that they no longer have to do their homework and put in the necessary hours or research, to report on issues fairly and honestly. Red Ice Radio can now finally rest on it's laurels and just shove information and news down your throat like Info Wars.com  It is a sad day for the alternative media when the people we look to mirror the truth back to us, loose their edge. With all fairness to Henrik Palmgren, he did contact Wilcock and Fullford multiple times to get their story on the record, unsuccessfully. But the contrast laid out by Cliff High was pretty brutal and boarded on the line of agent provocateur fervor, with the pure rage and profanity coming out his potty mouth. The victim based mindset that came from Clif High seemed to try to bully listeners into a corner, that smart people like him, can break it down for us, and it's simply more efficient, to take his word for it, that Wilcock and Fulford were bad guys who were basically tools, stooges and putty in the hands of NWO elite. In the end, the May 10th RIR podcast sounded much more like a competitive, male dominated ego, pissing contest between two people who had a very large bull horn and three guys who weren't even there to defend themselves. I would hope that Drake, Fulford, and Wilcock will not stoop and lower themselves to respond irresponsably to this type of attention seeking, childish type of  hack journalisim. 

It is my humble opinion that fine people over at Red Ice Creations should retract the Clif High interview and or at least offer a substantial apology to the injured parties. 

The venom coming from the May 10th podcast almost served as some sort of blackmail to get the previously unavailable Wilcock and Fulford onto Red Ice to finally tell their story, which is also, in my opinion, simply tabloid journalism on par with Fox News. So just as France was recently downgraded this year by Standards and Poor's rating system from AAA  down to AA which will most assuredly lead to France being kick of the Euro and joing the southern strangler nations like, Spain, Italy, and Portugal, to start their own Southern Euro Reject Currency. So dose Red Ice Radio loose it's AAA rating of being a beacon of sanity and trust worthy news reporting for the world to rely on in these troubling and interesting times. 

[Whiskey_Mystic]

So with that said, it is highly, highly unusual for Red Ice Creations to attack David Wilcock, Benjamin Fulford and new comer Drake in such a brash, close minded, and testosterone driven fashion.

Maybe I missed something, but what I heard was Mr. High attacking these peoples' positions and trying to make sense of something he found to be senseless. He might have gone too far, but he is entitled to his opinion just like everyone else. All Red Ice did was conduct an interview. I will listen again, but I don't recall Red Ice attacking anyone. Maybe they could have explored alternate angles a little better, but this is talk radio, not journalistic reporting and there is a huge difference.



It is my humble opinion that fine people over at Red Ice Creations should retract the Clif High interview and or at least offer a substantial apology to the injured parties.  

No, what they should do is invite Ben, David, or Drake on the air.

[eileenrose]

I've stopped reading Wilcock and Fulford already. And I never read Drake anyway. Clif High I still check out....for as long as he continues to make any sense. Time will tell on him (but my spending time and/or money on these other folk is already over...I don't feel they panned out.....just too many he said she said ....is going on with them).

[KiwiElf]

Zebra,

Haha resistance? Yeah, always... I'm allergic to "Borg Mentality" :D

As with most things, it was "interesting"... it's just one person's perspective - why should it be more or less important for anyone else?

There are by all counts, now just over 7 billion people on the planet. Maybe that's how many different "perspectives" [realities/parallel Earths] are out there... minimum. ;)

Choose your own [perspective] works best ;)

[jorr lundstrom]

1.5 hours of empty conjecture.:doh:

Hmm, I thought it was a Cliff High interview... not a Drake/Wilcock/Fullford interview...? ;)

Clif High is COMPLETE TOOL! This review summed it up well:

http://nesaranews.blogspot.com/2012/05/red-ice-creations-loose-its-aaa-credit.html

Red Ice Creations Loose it's AAA Credit Rating in Fair and Objective Alternative News

...


Ahhhh, Cliff High being a tool. ROFLOL The mirror is at play

again. Well irs not pleasent being confused with facts when

one already has made up ones mind. ROFLOL I always find

it interesting to read descriptions of wot people see in the

mirror. Its so obvious for the observers around. LOL


All is well


Jorr 2.0

[KiwiElf]

Could be,..might be,..but we don't really know. I'm still in the innocent until proven guilty camp. Just because we've been caught out in the past, it doesn't mean this Drake guy is just another disinfo merchant.

I'll take that even further, if I may? Something to... "play" with, if you wish ;)

Our present is NOT the result of our past - understand that fully, and you will break the connection to the third density - Have Fun :)

[ThePythonicCow]

1.5 hours of empty conjecture.:doh:

Hmm, I thought it was a Cliff High interview... not a Drake/Wilcock/Fullford interview...? ;)

Clif High is COMPLETE TOOL! This review summed it up well:

http://nesaranews.blogspot.com/2012/05/red-ice-creations-loose-its-aaa-credit.html

Red Ice Creations Loose it's AAA Credit Rating in Fair and Objective Alternative News

... Mr. High went on a hour long attack on David Wilcock, from Divine Cosmos.com, Benjamin Fulford of benjaminfulford.net, and new comer from Freedomreigns.US, Drake. 
...
All three of these men have been working quite independently in their own said sphere of related interest, though Fulford and Wilcock have done some recent interviews together. The idea that there is some conspiracy, from some dark cabal disinfo campaign, propagated by Wilcock, Fulford and Drake is quite a ridiculous and  lazy brained conclusion to jump to .This subject matter is really quite open source, no one out there really has the moral authority to really throw anyone else under the bus like we heard on the recent RIR podcast. 

So with that said, it is highly, highly unusual for Red Ice Creations to attack David Wilcock, Benjamin Fulford and new comer Drake in such a brash, close minded, and testosterone driven fashion. We normally see this style of hit and run reporting from alternative media Hulkster, Alex Jones, ...

And nesaranews is complaining that Clif High's interview is a hit piece :)? Clif High had his rants in that Red Ice interview, but on the whole, he was far more measured and sensible, in my estimation, than this nesaranews post.

The above post on nesaranews is a hit piece; it has much more name calling and defamation than Clif High's interview. It is little more than a pot stirring.

The effort to stir this Drake-Fulford-Wilcock controversy into a first class Hatfields vs McCoys feud within the alternative media audience (us) appears to still be in high gear.

I am a bit disappointed that you would post a copy of such clap trap here.

[Debra]

StarDust,

fix it man is most clearly defending a movement that many have put in 100s of hours of time and their support behind. It worries me though, that free speech is being denied here - Clif High has as much right to give his ideas as anyone else. The response I felt was not very evolved.

I also do not agree with tarring Henrik Palmgren with the same brush, either. The whole interview - if you listened to it - does not spend 3 hours critiquing Wilcock, Fulford and Drake.

I have been listening to Henrik Palmgren - almost weekly now - since 2009. I think his standard is very high and this interview was no less. His show is not just talk back radio, either, this man is a fine journalist. I wouldn´t be wasting my time listening in, week after week if he wasn't. He is one of the few left standing, who bring perspectives to the table and in a respectful, intelligent and professional manner.

I don´t know him personally, there is no need to. His output is high and quality, plus the man has integrity.

Claims made by this anonymous character called fix it now are sadly shallow. We want to be better than that, surely!

I suggest you take some time to listen to more of Henrik´s work - Redice is a great resource.

Respectfully, Zebra





Clif High is COMPLETE TOOL! This review summed it up well:

http://nesaranews.blogspot.com/2012/05/red-ice-creations-loose-its-aaa-credit.html

Red Ice Creations Loose it's AAA Credit Rating in Fair and Objective Alternative News

 

[StarDust]

And nesaranews is complaining that Clif High's interview is a hit piece :)? Clif High had his rants in that Red Ice interview, but on the whole, he was far more measured and sensible, in my estimation, than this nesaranews post.

The above post on nesaranews is a hit piece; it has much more name calling and defamation than Clif High's interview. It is little more than a pot stirring.

The effort to stir this Drake-Fulford-Wilcock controversy into a first class Hatfields vs McCoys feud within the alternative media audience (us) appears to still be in high gear.

I am a bit disappointed that you would post a copy of such clap trap here.

I can't believe anyone would defend someone who managed to get on the airwaves only to spend multiple hours bashing other people. The only place that interviewee should be accepted is on the Jerry Springer show.

It would have been different if High had spent the time discussing information/ideas that he had researched himself. No, he's not capable of that. All he can do is discuss what a badass he is in the dojo and hide behind a really bad computer algorithm that can't make a prediction to save his life. What made it a complete waste of time was that it amounted to 1.5 hours of listening to his character assassinations of others.

People are welcome to praise him as a breath of fresh air, but from my perspective that blast of air came straight from his arse.

[Debra]

It would have been different if High had spent the time discussing information/ideas that he had researched himself. No, he's not capable of that. All he can do is discuss what a badass he is in the dojo and hide behind a really bad computer algorithm that can't make a prediction to save his life. What made it a complete waste of time was that it amounted to 1.5 hours of listening to his character assassinations of others.

People are welcome to praise him as a breath of fresh air, but from my perspective that blast of air came straight from his arse.

Well, listening to him talk, I think he has analysed and evaluated a wide range of data, quite confidently. There is a lot of sense in what he says, in how in joins the dots.

Hard predictions, per se, don´t interest me so much but the potential, emergent trends that he points to, are interesting to consider.

Could you explain what you know about the technology that he uses? Why you think it has no value?

Personally, by the way, I am not interested whether he hangs out in a dojo or a rodeo. What he is trying to understand and what he is trying to do in relation to help the earth - that´s important. So, I am keen to know more.

[ThePythonicCow]

I can't believe anyone would defend someone who managed to get on the airwaves only to spend multiple hours bashing other people. The only place that interviewee should be accepted is on the Jerry Springer show.

So ... when I object to the name calling of the nesaranews post you quoted, you defend it ... with more name calling.

I hope you're not surprised that you didn't persuade me.

I recommend this Red Ice Radio interview of Clif High. It has much substance.

[indigopete]

I can't believe anyone would defend someone who managed to get on the airwaves only to spend multiple hours bashing other people

:rolleyes: I've seen more "bashing" on a cooking programme.

The critical appraisals of the 'mass arrests' prediction were well made and well explained without resort 'add hominems'.

The host even went right out of his way to declare his interest in airing all sides of the discussion and reported his efforts to invite the relevant parties on the show.

Pete

[StarDust]

I can't believe anyone would defend someone who managed to get on the airwaves only to spend multiple hours bashing other people. The only place that interviewee should be accepted is on the Jerry Springer show.

So ... when I object to the name calling of the nesaranews post you quoted, you defend it ... with more name calling.

I hope you're not surprised that you didn't persuade me.

I recommend this Red Ice Radio interview of Clif High. It has much substance.

Name calling? You're being sensitive about something that doesnt exist as there was nothing within my rebuttal that remotely resembled name calling. Any descriptors were aimed as a direct critique of High. My response was not intended to persuade you to do anything. Knock yourself out & reccomend away!

[StarDust]

It would have been different if High had spent the time discussing information/ideas that he had researched himself. No, he's not capable of that. All he can do is discuss what a badass he is in the dojo and hide behind a really bad computer algorithm that can't make a prediction to save his life. What made it a complete waste of time was that it amounted to 1.5 hours of listening to his character assassinations of others.

People are welcome to praise him as a breath of fresh air, but from my perspective that blast of air came straight from his arse.

Well, listening to him talk, I think he has analysed and evaluated a wide range of data, quite confidently. There is a lot of sense in what he says, in how in joins the dots.

Hard predictions, per se, don´t interest me so much but the potential, emergent trends that he points to, are interesting to consider.

Could you explain what you know about the technology that he uses? Why you think it has no value?

Personally, by the way, I am not interested whether he hangs out in a dojo or a rodeo. What he is trying to understand and what he is trying to do in relation to help the earth - that´s important. So, I am keen to know more.

Here is High's "genius" prediction for 2012:


Future predictions

Major catastrophe in 2012 – The Web Bot has gained most of its notoriety for contributing to the 2012 phenomenon by predicting that a cataclysm will devastate the planet in the year 2012, possibly a reversing of Earth's magnetic poles or a small series of nuclear attacks leading up to a major attack during the year. The prediction does not call for a complete end of the world.

It's absolute rubbish. If his ALTA based linguistics algorithm was so incredibly advanced then he should be a multi-trillionaire from cleaning up on the stock market. He isn't anywhere close. He's a hack technologist with a good idea that was poorly executed.

[ThePythonicCow]

Here is High's "genius" prediction for 2012:
...
It's absolute rubbish.
I had not been listening to Clif High for some time ... for when I had, I didn't trust it.

This Red Ice Radio interview of Clif High was excellent however (though I realize that some who support Drake, Wilcock and/or Fulford won't like it, and may choose to attack the messenger.)

[nonesuch]

I liked the interview. I found it as credible and as interesting as any of the other speculative fiction writers/speakers who've found favor with a growing internet fan-base who wouldn't consider skipping the next online episode of "Conspiracy Mob Wives" and certainly wouldn't be caught dead in any forum worth its salt without an acceptably strong opinion against one of the regulars on the show. Mea culpa!

Talk about fear porn. Let's! What keeps anyone polarized against another? Fear. What keeps the suspicions alive that someone you don't like deliberates against your interests? Fear. What brings you to dis someone to protect your favorite online reality star? Fear. What makes the muskrat fear his musk?! Well, you get the idea.

And what is fear, but rejection of feeling afraid. And why reject it? Because it appears so powerful! More powerful than your love? Not so. To make it a habit to disallow each fear its silly moment in the spotlight creates over time the banquets our Fathers Who Aren't in Heaven feast upon in all their grease slobbering gluttony.

So the next time I notice how much I do not like someone, I'll check under the table to see if there's something a little scary slithering in the shadows, maybe looking for a little action in my shoes. Then against all conditioned wisdom, I shall take a deep breath, invite that sucker into my body , let it know its welcome here and give it a luxurious taste of life in a body of love, letting it grow up healthy and strong, then freeing it from my awareness and care to it's own evolution. It might take more than a few minutes, sometimes less, but then— poof, it's gone!!!

That is, until I come across another post by some idiot who, in my expert opinion, doesn't know what he or she is talking about! Ugh, not this again! (Rinse and repeat.)

[joedjemal]

Um... I've been a subscriber to HPH since the old days. Cliff gave me a free subscription to the old ALTA reports when he found out I was on disability benefits. The HPH technology predicts language not events although I've seen a great many hits come from it. The prediction of a radioactive volcano and radioactive winds around the world were fulfilled by Fukushima. I watched the Bunsfield oil depot fire fulfill another and he got the Indonesian quake and tsunami.

Because the technology predicts what people will be talking about rather than actual events it also picks up stuff that a lot of people talk about but that doesn't actually happen like that daft Elenin thing.

I agree with his position on Drake, Fulford and Wilcock. I disagree with him on other things like his expando planet stuff and a few other things. He does have a bit of a tendency to go into hyperbolae but that doesn't invalidate his work with the web bots which in my experience has about a 60% hit rate for language and about 40% for real events. He often gets the interpretation wrong but you do see the actual language he bases his interpretation on unfold frequently.

I have yet to see anything that Fulford or Wilcock predicted happen in the real world, to me, track record speaks volumes about the reliability of a source.

[sigma6]

I hope this catches on more, I try to follow these Mopal TV - National Emergency Committee shows that Benjamin Fulford has started doing on Mopal TV, approximately every two weeks. There seems to be two Youtubers that are translating the Japanese parts and it is very interesting... they are poppletelevision, and workingamateur, this one is done by dandomina

Benjamin Fulford National Emergency Committee May 8 2012 Alexander Romanov
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HHrriKgJoCQ

In one bit at around 10 min, Fulford/Romanov talk about the 70 Kilos of laced marijuana Romanov tried to deliver to Ben, wow... Romanov says he is a descendant of Russian Royalty, (newsworthy in and of itself, as that means Anastasia apparently did survive the cabalist extermination of the Russian Czarist bloodline) He also talks about his association with the self title of 'Anti-Christ' and a book he has written Called "The 666"? which he says contains evidence that would undermine the Western (Vatican) Religious Cabal.... this definitely needs more context, and I would love to read this book he is talking about if it has actual evidence in it...

[Billy]

Alexander Romanov's utube channel

http://www.youtube.com/user/AlexanderAntiChrist?feature=mhee

Illuminati website

http://www.armageddonconspiracy.co.uk/

[StarDust]

Um... I've been a subscriber to HPH since the old days. Cliff gave me a free subscription to the old ALTA reports when he found out I was on disability benefits. The HPH technology predicts language not events although I've seen a great many hits come from it. The prediction of a radioactive volcano and radioactive winds around the world were fulfilled by Fukushima. I watched the Bunsfield oil depot fire fulfill another and he got the Indonesian quake and tsunami.

Because the technology predicts what people will be talking about rather than actual events it also picks up stuff that a lot of people talk about but that doesn't actually happen like that daft Elenin thing.

I agree with his position on Drake, Fulford and Wilcock. I disagree with him on other things like his expando planet stuff and a few other things. He does have a bit of a tendency to go into hyperbolae but that doesn't invalidate his work with the web bots which in my experience has about a 60% hit rate for language and about 40% for real events. He often gets the interpretation wrong but you do see the actual language he bases his interpretation on unfold frequently.

I have yet to see anything that Fulford or Wilcock predicted happen in the real world, to me, track record speaks volumes about the reliability of a source.

As I stated previously, he has a good idea but a poor way of executing it. If you look at the earth as a system of collective consciousness then you will understand where I am coming from. Since his model is centered around internet chat, 'news', & tidbits of this and that, it is missing a HUGE piece of the puzzle. Namely the billions of people who either do not have internet access, don't use the technology and most importantly, don't participate regularly. This is the singular reason why his methodology and consequently his algorithms are inaccurate.

It also does not account for infinite possibility within infinite parallel realities just for "Earth". But that's another rabbit hole all together and the only way one could create an algorithm to work within that understanding would be to plug directly into the Akashic record. As if that was even a possibility. I don't know if it is or what level of being you would need to be granted access. What I do know is that the current version of "Clif High" is not advanced enough to have access. Sorry Cilfford, nice try, but hardly accurate enough to provide anything more than a glimpse of what may be less than half the time in the negative space that it operates within.

[Omni]

Hopefully they get rid of all the technology that causes these disasters...

[Blueskywalking]

Major purge of US puppets in Japan continuing behind the scenes, Nato terrorist state group being cut off, May 14, 2012
http://benjaminfulford.net/

The top US criminal corporate government representative in Japan, Edward Nye, will no longer be welcome in Asia following the release of new information about his links to the March 11, 2011 nuclear and tsunami terror attack on Japan. He is believed to be the author of a February, 2000 CIA report on the Japanese energy sector that stated the following: “In order to prevent Japanese national power from becoming any stronger and to prevent a resurgence of anti-American feeling in Japan it is necessary to put hand-cuffs on Japan’s energy sector over the long term. Nuclear energy now accounts for 30% of Japan’s power production. The most effective counter measure would be to neutralize the main concentration of Japanese nuclear know-how, the Tokyo Electric Power Corporation. TEPCO has Japan’s largest market capitalization and it is a leader of Japan’s corporate and financial world. It is also very trusted by the Japanese people. To prevent Japan from becoming a nuclear power, it is necessary to destroy trust in TEPCO and drastically set back Japan’s progress in nuclear power.” This CIA report was quoted in the November 2002 issue of Zaikai Tenbo, a leading Japanese business magazine.
Many of the top Japanese and Korean agents working for the US corporate government in Japan have already been or are about to be purged and now all “Japan handlers,” working for the criminal corporate US mafia government are being advised to get out of Japan and never come back.

There was also a meeting last week between representatives of the committee of 300, the White Dragon Society and an Asian secret society last week to discuss the new financial system.

At the meeting, the committee of 300 representative, who we will refer to as J., offered the White Dragon Society a 1200 trillion dollar “Elizabeth Victory Bond.” However, once again, it was not made clear exactly what real world stuff actually backed this astronomical number (remember world GDP is about $75 trillion). The White Dragon Society made a counter proposal which was for an initial donation of $100 million to the White Dragon Foundation to be used to hire experts to begin planning the establishment of a world economic planning agency. Further payments would be contingent on the presentation of detailed, publicly acceptable and concrete development plans.

There was also a lot of discussion about Asian gold stashes. J. claimed that most of the gold in the Philippines was removed after World War 2 and that since more than 50 years had passed the statute of limitations had run out and any claims to historical rights to that gold had thus expired.

There was some heated discussion between the 3 parties on the subject of Chinese gold that was evacuated to the US in 1938. The Kuomintang government of the time was given 60 year bonds backed by that gold and was given solemn promises the gold would be returned in 1998. In fact the Rockefellers, Warburgs, Rothschilds, Mellons, Morgans, Harrimans and other families behind the US Federal Reserve Board never intended to give the gold back. When Nixon restored US diplomatic relations with communist China in 1972, he gave a chunk of that gold to the Chinese communists. Needless to say a lot of mainland Chinese pockets were greased with that gold and the original owners are not too happy about that situation.

A Chinese communist government agent present at that meeting said the communist party considers all that historical gold and treasure in China to be property of the Chinese people. However, he said any Chinese gold taken out of China and deposited in Asia or elsewhere should be used for global economic development and that the Chinese communist government laid no claim on it.

There was thus a general agreement the gold should be used to back the new financial system. J. said the committee of 300 would also accept the use of that gold as a backing for any dollars or euros to be created in the future.

J. who claims links to the Japanese imperial family also had some interesting history to share. He said Japan’s share of the gold removed from the Philippines after WW2 was handled by a Mr. Shimura (no first name given) who was the real power behind post-war Japanese fixers like Yoshio Kodama and Ryoichi Sasagawa. The now deceased Shimura was able to call Prime Ministers and get them to immediately drop parliamentary business to hurry to his side, according to J.

J. was introduced to this writer by the head of a major financial institution who is also a member of an Asian secret society.

Shimura, who was the top committee of 300 representative in Japan, hosted, as students, such Asian leaders as Lee Kuan Yew, Aung San the father of Myanmar Western darling Aung San Suu Kyi, Japan Democratic Party power broker Ichiro Ozawa and Chinese politburo member Li Keqiang among others.

He also said Chinese paramount leader Hu Jintao had a Japanese mother and spent time at Japan’s Waseda University as a student (this is not mentioned in Hu’s official CV). Hu is fluent in Japanese, according to J.
Needless to say, we could not independently verify much of this information and remain wary of the possibility that J. provided this writer with a mix of information and disinformation. However, most of what he said fits in with reports from other inside sources and information available in the public record.

In any case, the battle against the financial mafia that illegally seized power in the West is proceeding well.

The situation has reached the point where anybody with access to the internet can see that the G5 terrorist countries (the USA, Germany, France, England and Italy) and their shrinking group of slave states (like the Gulf of Arabia monarchies run by Satanists) are being steadily isolated.

The non-aligned movement that favors world peace now includes over 140 states including the BRICS (Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa). The war-mongering NATO group meeting in Chicago this week, by contrast, only includes 28 countries.

These 28 countries as a whole are dependent on financing from the other 140 nations. Jacking up the price of oil sold by NATOs middle-Eastern slave states is just not enough to pay the bills any more. Sabotaging Japan’s nuclear industry and forcing Japan to buy more oil has not been enough either. That is why there is this “world financial crisis,” which is really just a Western world financial crisis.

The whole world has a message to the criminal cabal of Satan worshipping oligarchs who enslaved the West: We want an end to war, an end to poverty and an end to environmental destruction. We also want you to release, in a safe and responsible manner, all the energy and other technology that you have been suppressing. We want you to stop behaving like criminals and become responsible global citizens.

[Rocky_Shorz]

I guess he does watch Avalon...

now Luciferians have turned into "Satan Worshipping" ;)

[Siberia9]

Feel the energy of the drug smuggler. Then feel the energy of the secret agent, the member of the Illuminati, and the gangster, and the aristocrat. They are the same kind of people with the same kind of energy. I know this first hand, its not just an oppinion.

Now why are you giving them YOUR energy? Be guarded, less you find yourself enslaved and pimped and used like cattle. Because that is the true nature of the parasite, regardless of the label he claims to carry.

[eileenrose]

Um... I've been a subscriber to HPH since the old days. Cliff gave me a free subscription to the old ALTA reports when he found out I was on disability benefits. The HPH technology predicts language not events although I've seen a great many hits come from it. The prediction of a radioactive volcano and radioactive winds around the world were fulfilled by Fukushima. I watched the Bunsfield oil depot fire fulfill another and he got the Indonesian quake and tsunami.

Because the technology predicts what people will be talking about rather than actual events it also picks up stuff that a lot of people talk about but that doesn't actually happen like that daft Elenin thing.

I agree with his position on Drake, Fulford and Wilcock. I disagree with him on other things like his expando planet stuff and a few other things. He does have a bit of a tendency to go into hyperbolae but that doesn't invalidate his work with the web bots which in my experience has about a 60% hit rate for language and about 40% for real events. He often gets the interpretation wrong but you do see the actual language he bases his interpretation on unfold frequently.

I have yet to see anything that Fulford or Wilcock predicted happen in the real world, to me, track record speaks volumes about the reliability of a source.

Thanks for bringing this up. I havn't tried to make sense of every prediction Clif High makes. Just like pretty much anyone, he has his own take on what the information means...which obviously he gets wrong (as often as not). I just like the idea of using computer bots to predict events....which sounds...reasonable. And, when just lightly read over, his information stands out (on its own). I just don't take any of it too seriously.

But I can't say the same thing about other researchers, as they are using humans as their base of information. And humans are more un-reliable than computer software programs (as they say in the programing world, 'Garbage in, Garbage out'). I am only speaking of people who talk to other people and then report to us. They tend to become unreliable. As they become invested in the information meeting their requirements/needs, which usually involved their own popularity (and finances).

Basically, if money is involved anywhere in their information collection system, it falls apart (the information). And guess what, there is money to be made...reporting on alien encounters, UFO sitings, whistleblower interviews and 'being seen as psychic'. Lots of money at stake means the person needs the information to fit certain criteria. ....that it inflames people. Otherwise, who would anyone pay to hear it (at conferences or where ever)?

Just my ten cents worth on this topic (clif high, drake, wilcock, fulford and I am hinting at others as well...pretty much anyone invested in 'reporting' to us the 'facts').

The only honest people left, then, are the people who don't claim to have an opinion (ie. who arn't getting paid to have one). But they arn't as much fun and don't incite lots of 'hits' on websites. So practically speaking, this idea that we need popular forums with loads of members dishing on one another is something that isn't going to last that long.

As the more dishing out that happens, the more people get turned off, and the more attractive a site for dis-information it becomes.
Two things that will kill the internet.....

[UnrealDreams]

So with that said, it is highly, highly unusual for Red Ice Creations to attack David Wilcock, Benjamin Fulford and new comer Drake in such a brash, close minded, and testosterone driven fashion.

Maybe I missed something, but what I heard was Mr. High attacking these peoples' positions and trying to make sense of something he found to be senseless. He might have gone too far, but he is entitled to his opinion just like everyone else. All Red Ice did was conduct an interview. I will listen again, but I don't recall Red Ice attacking anyone. Maybe they could have explored alternate angles a little better, but this is talk radio, not journalistic reporting and there is a huge difference.



It is my humble opinion that fine people over at Red Ice Creations should retract the Clif High interview and or at least offer a substantial apology to the injured parties.  

No, what they should do is invite Ben, David, or Drake on the air.

In defense of Red Ice, they said at the very beginning of the interview that they did invite Drake, Fulford and Wilcock to discuss these events and were declined by all parties. He also stated at the very beginning that this was going to be a contrary view, so those who didn't wish to hear the contrary view were warned right from the get-go.

My opinion may not be popular, but I am getting the exact same feeling as Clif High.

Fulford is an idiot and a tool.
Drake is a fake. I've thought this from the first few minutes I heard him speak. He reeks of disinfo.
Wilcock, although well meaning, is being sidetracked with the financial terrorism BS.

I'm most sad and extremely disappointed about Wilcock dropping his life's work at the very moment humanity needs to be awakened to the incredible facts he was uncovering, and running with the financial terrorism material.

[eileenrose]

re: "I'm most sad and extremely disappointed about Wilcock dropping his life's work " by UnRealDreams
Wait ten minutes. That is about how long it takes me to find someone else's work to read instead (since he has lost interest in what he started....his earlier work...which interest me a lot).

[gripreaper]

http://media.merchantcircle.com/22658504/That%20was%20today_full.jpeg

[eileenrose]

What I really think is interesting is some of the background fact checking that is going on about Fulford right now. Here and elsewhere.

I am starting to think very little is real (in the internet whistleblower world). Which is probably what TPTB want.

[Debra]

http://media.merchantcircle.com/22658504/That%20was%20today_full.jpeg

;) Fabulous, thanks.

However, nothing is certain .. and Clif High makes this known in a disclaimer on his site, stating: Please note that our interpretations are provided as entertainment only. We are to be held harmless for universe placing substance behind our words. Or not, as it so chooses.

Here is an extract from his theoretical underpinning:


Here at Half Past Human we forecast the future.

We are not alone in forecasting the future, all humans do it to some degree. Just a quick search of the internet will provide dozens of forms of future forecasting. Some use astrology, some use other methods.

We employ a technique based on radical linguistics to reduce extracts from readings of dynamic postings on the internet into an archetypical database. With this database of archtypical language, we calculate the rate of change of the language. The forecasts of the future are derived from these calculations. Our calculations are based on a system of associations between words and numeric values for emotional responses from those words. These 'emotional impact indicators' are also of our own devising. They are attached to a data base of over 300/three hundred thousand words. This data base of linked words/phrases and emotions is our lexicon from which the future forecasting is derived.

We call our future viewing the ALTA reports for 'asymetric language trend analysis'. The ALTA reports are available by subscription.

In the beginning.....

The beginning of all of our processing is the word. Or words, rather - actually excessively large amounts of them. Totals of words beyond all reason. These then are distilled down into a thick syrupy mass and placed in an inadequate visual display and from there interpretation proceeds.

Our interpretations of the data sets that we accumulate are presented in the form of a series of reports which detail the interpretations of the changes in language and what we think that they may mean.

Please note that our interpretations are provided as entertainment only. We are to be held harmless for universe placing substance behind our words. Or not, as it so chooses.

The interpretations provide a broad brush view of the future over the next few years. The broad view of the future is based on set theory and provides a collection of linguistic clues which can be used to forecast developing trends.

Some of our subscribers use these forecast interpretations to develop models of their own futures in our collective and changing planetary future. Some use the forecasts for trading purposes. Others for wild entertainment of the mostly implausible and highly improbable kind.

Even by our own rigorous standards, our forecasts are proving out better than mere chance would allow. Our track record is being tested with each new report series. So far, so good. We have a very high rate of returning subscribers (over 90%) which is likely an indication of needs being met.

Read more here: http://halfpasthuman.com/altaprocess.html

Or view on video:

wJLZU_b4iao
4AXhNXNyIBQ
hmN5VSf3j04
_izQwNgARJg
EoBLAsjMb2o

[hectorlca]

Perhaps THE most important interview I have heard yet.

I think I now know what to believe.

Hi Taurean,

I don't think I have enough time to listen to the whole thing right now, but I'm definitely interested in possibly listening to it later.

Could you expand on what you thought of the interview and what things were clarified for you?

Many thanks!

Hector

[hectorlca]

So with that said, it is highly, highly unusual for Red Ice Creations to attack David Wilcock, Benjamin Fulford and new comer Drake in such a brash, close minded, and testosterone driven fashion.

Maybe I missed something, but what I heard was Mr. High attacking these peoples' positions and trying to make sense of something he found to be senseless. He might have gone too far, but he is entitled to his opinion just like everyone else. All Red Ice did was conduct an interview. I will listen again, but I don't recall Red Ice attacking anyone. Maybe they could have explored alternate angles a little better, but this is talk radio, not journalistic reporting and there is a huge difference.



It is my humble opinion that fine people over at Red Ice Creations should retract the Clif High interview and or at least offer a substantial apology to the injured parties.  

No, what they should do is invite Ben, David, or Drake on the air.

In defense of Red Ice, they said at the very beginning of the interview that they did invite Drake, Fulford and Wilcock to discuss these events and were declined by all parties. He also stated at the very beginning that this was going to be a contrary view, so those who didn't wish to hear the contrary view were warned right from the get-go.

My opinion may not be popular, but I am getting the exact same feeling as Clif High.

Fulford is an idiot and a tool.
Drake is a fake. I've thought this from the first few minutes I heard him speak. He reeks of disinfo.
Wilcock, although well meaning, is being sidetracked with the financial terrorism BS.

I'm most sad and extremely disappointed about Wilcock dropping his life's work at the very moment humanity needs to be awakened to the incredible facts he was uncovering, and running with the financial terrorism material.

Completely agree. This shift is about something much more profound than economics. Sure, it has to do with economics, but that's just the setting, not the goal. I'm sick of hearing him spew "hope" every week with nothing to show for it except some low production youtube videos with people that seem to have gotten their attire from a film studio that had an overstock of ancient japanese costumes.

And David? Sigh David....The constant Edgar Cayce references and his mentions to how reliable his dreams are...and this whole financial terrorism bs...he must realize it's a dead end. That cow is running out of milk fast, and I'm waiting to see what his next topic is going to be about, because this one just makes me roll my eyes.

[Finefeather]

What strikes me is that there are more or less 2 distinct sides, one for and one against the Fulford, Wilcock, Drake consortium.
Both have such convincing arguments. Here is a must read for a take down of this audio interview: Quite powerful !
http://jhaines6.wordpress.com/2012/05/15/op-ed-from-sas-a-response-to-the-clif-high-interview-of-may-12-2012-on-bbs-radio/

Now after listening to both sides for quite a while, I have to say that each have their merits and are quite entertaining to read and watch.
But my vote goes to the 'against' the Fulford, Wilcock, Drake consortium, Why ?...Just too many technical errors.
I know that mankind will find it's own solution to the predictable state which we are in.
I do not need a Fulford, Wilcock, Drake consortium to tell me that we are on the verge of a breakthrough with a never ending soap drama.
The minority have outsmarted the majority because the majority are clever AND devious, and they know the majority are just too busy with themselves.
The majority thinks that voting comes along every few years so there is no need to worry and plan, "I'll get to that when it comes around again!"
While the minority are planning..., have been planning for 100s of years and they know i'ts like taking candy from a kid.
When the majority grow up and get their heads out of their asses, we will start seeing change.
Fortunately we are at the beginning of the manifestation in this our 5th race (2 to go) of the 7th Ray (Constellation of Aquarius) wherein the life energies will influence the mental side of our nature.
This will expand and reveal our abilities to think and adapt and become seekers of knowledge and masters of truth.

[childs hood end]

Why would anybody go public against someone else's beliefs...... 1. self attention........ 2. diss info it........... if your not feeling it...... its simple` dont listin.

[Taurean]

Perhaps THE most important interview I have heard yet.

I think I now know what to believe.

Hi Taurean,

I don't think I have enough time to listen to the whole thing right now, but I'm definitely interested in possibly listening to it later.

Could you expand on what you thought of the interview and what things were clarified for you?

Many thanks!

Hector

We live in a World/Matrix of ambiguity. - ( I think ):ohwell:

[amym]

I don't get a good feeling about Clif High. Not that I buy into the whole mass arrest, etc. info either.

He seems like a fast-talking fraud to me.

[karelia]

I was going to talk about why I've not had a change of heart, only to find that I have had a change of, well, opinion about the entire Drake thing. I'm still of the opinion that there is no harm listening to Drake. Definitely way less harm than sitting in front of the TV watching soaps, no doubt about that. But now I also feel that I gain absolutely nothing from listening (I've just switched off the current episode).

I know it's wise to be friendly with one's neighbours. I know it's a good idea to have a certain amount of food in your cupboards. I know it's a good idea to grow some of your own vegetables. Guess what? I've lived exactly this way my entire life with very few exceptions when I was traveling and therefore couldn't grow things, when I lived in a huge apartment complex and gave up greeting the neighbours because all I received was scowls, but those occasions were rare. But all that stressing about "localisation," or community I can live with. Having lived in the US, I know it's nowhere near as normal there as it is here in Europe. Anonymisation has never quite taken on such an art form as it has in the US.

What really made me view Drake in a different way was the way he talked about Project Camelot and dragged David Wilcock into it. If my children talked that way about someone in a public venue, I would drag them home by their hair. It sounded way too much like "He said, she said." And that's just... well, it's exactly the kind of behaviour you'd expect from someone who has been too heavily influenced by the cabal agenda.

Personally, I don't want to return to the 1950s' values. It's in the past, so let it sleep! The 1950s was the time just before every single household had a TV, before having a bigger car than the next-door neighbour became important. But the signs were already there, and I really want no repeat of that. I want to move on to a world that absolutely excludes the spanking of children, the punishment for bad behaviour, and most of all, I want to move beyond people's need to execute anyone for whatever crimes. That kind of reality requires the end of duality, and that is what I want to see.

You can scream Constitution, or Common Law, all you want, but until we're all on the same page about true freedom, it's not going to happen. And that same page isn't about the US constitution because let's face it, the US is just one country amongst how many who don't have that constitution?

2012 isn't about resurrecting the constitution. It's about becoming free. And the only way we can achieve that is to set and aim for a common goal: to work on our consciousness. If our consciousness increases, there will be no space for the cockroaches in terms of energy because we will fill all that space.

By all means, let's continue to listen to Drake. He makes a lot of good points, and he probably has a good point repeating and repeating and repeating himself because I'm sure we've all been there where we had to see/listen to/watch a truth a million times before it would sink in, but let's not forget our goal to move beyond duality, and that we can only do ourselves, at each one's own pace.

[Debra]

I don't get a good feeling about Clif High. Not that I buy into the whole mass arrest, etc. info either.

He seems like a fast-talking fraud to me.

David Icke shows support for Clif High on his website in relation to this latest interview on Red Ice Radio:

Clif High on the 'Useful Idiots' that Serve the Control System While Claiming to Expose it

Wednesday, 16 May 2012 12:06

''Brilliant demolition of the Wilcock/Fulford 'diversions' (see under 'bollocks') and the nonsense that radiation levels in and from Japan are not dangerous when they are potentially and cumulatively lethal.''

http://www.davidicke.com/headlines/66486-clif-high-on-the-useful-idiots-that-sserve-the-control-system-while-claiming-to-expose-it-