Maybe time to take a serious look at David Wilcock

[waves]

I'm noticing a growing number of people questioning the validity or sincerity of David Wilcock as I am. It's been evident in the recent emotional breakdown and financial article threads, and all the threads regarding his 'channeled' information, but a lot of people are also still offering empathy and support and seemingly feeling called to show a sense of loyalty to the insight and truth they felt they've resonated with in his work and lectures.

However, I'm starting to overflow with questions and think it may be time for the community to really put our accumulated knowledge to the test and possibly let go of even more layers of deception that we didn't think we had - to consider what views of reality we may have decided to adopt because they feel good - even bold, defiant or courageous - rather than what may be true.

I have been trying to apply this filter to all whistleblowers, investigators, channellers, good samaritans, authors, etc. in the growing alternative media, and think we have to filter it all with the expectation that deliberate manipulation and disinfo is probably RAMPANT and extremely clever and is possibly very long planned, patient and even star-trek level technologically advanced, including directly into undefended brains.

One probably common, powerful and possibly required tool for effectiveness is to mix real info with disinfo.

This list includes what immediately struck me especially in the recent break-down episode with David and why. This essay is not a criticism of the real David, it is great recognition and empathy/sympathy for the real David that I offer, but I have had growing suspicions for a long time of an underlying agenda possibly out of his conscious control, and wondered if blatant evidence of it seemed to finally burst into full exposure in the 'episode'.

I have suspected for a long time that public personna David is a long planned, programmed alter full of software that is being cleverly and deliberately used to infiltrate and manipulate the alternative crowd. I wonder if the real David still doesn't know it, is in denial or is mostly trapped in his programmed personna, and wonder if what we witnessed may have been a rare public break in the veneer/programming with the real David alter appearing briefly begging for help.

I too enthusiastically gravitated towards David a few years ago, appreciating his seeming incredibly deep, insightful and refreshing cutting edge grasp of the gigantic big picture delivered with a very cavalier, regular joe offhandedness. I overlooked the Cayce/self-congratulatory stuff at first.

In an order I don't remember, I started taking note of puzzle pieces that didn't seem to fit the persona he was trying to project or the purity/reliability of his message:

1. The most crucial, foundational red flag to me is that he grew up near a military base and was a former extreme drug addict (heroin?). Either or both are the classic child/teenhoods that have been the opportunities/origins of programs to create fractured minds extremely vulnerable to programming/alters (refresh your MKultra knowledge). This can be done without the conscious knowledge or memory of the programmee.

2. He is blond haired and blue eyed. This is apparently the most vulnerable/desirable genetic base for mind control programming.

3. In all his writing and lectures that I've heard claiming deep understanding of psy-ops and MKultra, he has never once addressed the issue of psy-ops having long ago perfected ability to download dreams and data into people's minds, and why he thinks his dreams are totally impervious to this. Quite the contrary - he endlessly cites his dreams as proof !! of being given special insight, futuretelling, confirmation of stuff, uncanny coincidence, etc. and even congratulates himself ad nauseum for being so special to have them.

4. He has an encyclopedic memory of extremely complex interrelated data combining mathematical, physics, scientific, historical and archaeologicial facts. This is looks like SOFTWARE to me.

5. It was too uncanny for coincidence to me that supposed Montauk survivor/lawyer Andrew Basiago with that wierd 60's b/w photo suddenly appeared on the major interview circuit out of nowhere robotically sounding exactly like David. This included repeating much of the exact same complex, supposed inside info in frequently the exact same phrases as David! I read many comments of people both mistaking Andrew for David Wilcock and/or noting the EXACT same tone of voice, phrasing, delivery and run-on knowledge spewing. It screamed SOFTWARE to me.

If this is true, then I think we need to look closely at the David and Andrew version of 'reality' and why it may be being fed to us, repeated for supposed 'proof' to the alternative crowd and for what reason. Of course psy-ops is doing this somewhere, is this one of the examples? What's this agenda, where's the line between info and disinfo?

I wonder if the similarity to David became too noticable and created too loud a buzz because something changed, and suddenly Andrew stopped sounding anything like he did at first anymore. Was this a software rewrite to de-David him? Something like a emotionless monotone really creeps me out when listening to Andrew too, and David growingly, but that's another topic.

6. I wonder if David has also been downloaded with programs to destroy his credibility on a dime if they need to. One is his unwavering portrayal of Obama as a closet good guy playing the system behind the scenes and waiting for the right moment to be a hero. David has absolutely refused to acknowledge the overwhelming evidence about who Obama might really be that screams fraud, puppet and long destined powerless figurehead.

7. Other programs that seem to have been implanted and mildly triggered to sow seeds of doubt for future use to discredit him are the growing list of set-in-stone declarations of what is going to happen that have not happened, frequently based on his prophetic 'dreams'. One example was flatly announcing on C2C in later 2010 or 09? that there would be full disclosure by the President by Nov. with one of the aliens standing next to him. I also notice David repeatedly using the don't worry, we're going to win, all these ugly facts don't matter stance in a sort of messianic way. It's sure is a timely sales magnet to market hope backed by nice sounding esoteric certainty in this atmosphere of dread, but also a podium that could be collapsed at any time.

8. Didn't he once state that the publishing company for his book was going to be the same as Tolle's? It has been obvious to me that everyone repeatedly paraded by Oprah has been a fellow MK'er then if he has the same publisher as Tolle it puts him in the deep circle of controlled, manipulated info, promotion and exposure.

9. I frankly don't know what to think about David's extreme ad nauseum self-congratulatory egotism. Would it fit that it could be an insecure alter sort of proud of/congratulating the smart alter in him?...and that's how he can do it so unabashedly egomanaically? And was the Cayce part some software yahoo in psy-ops thinking "hey.. I got it!... the new age crowd will really buy this.."? It may even be child's play to have produced a baby with facial features for this future purpose. Or I'm just sick and tired of his ego.

10. His 50-song debut album went nowhere and things sure got quiet about the movie Convergence. Now he's got how many? $10k or more investors who bought into the glowing sales pitch promoting a far-more-generous-than-average payback 3 years ago adding up to maybe $500,000 waiting for some return. I remember reading that at the new screenwriter's suggestion, the movie premise was changed to the aftermath of the Dec. 21, 2012 'ascension' rather than the before evidence, and now we're going to know what happens after Dec. 21 sooner than any predictive movie gets finished. And what happened to the 1st round of $250?k besides the 2nd round of $250?k supposedly raised just for the screenwriter?

11. Lastly, it's become glaringly obvious to me that everybody who is regularly on C2C or Rense are among the strongest candidates for disinfo agents, many of whom David cites as close allies - especially Hoagland & Fulford. I strongly suspect that anybody regularly parading around their constant flow of super secret insider leaks that no one else 'has' on major or growingly popular alternative networks and becomes a prominent name in the alternative insider leak business without being silenced are prime suspects.


Anyway, I know many arguments can be made to many of these statements, and I agree that there are provable exceptions and lots of plausible denialies, and I still acknowledge that David dispels fascinating info. I especially often don't know where the line is between truth and manipulation, especially in the archao-meta-science world.

My intention is to lay all the semi-solid pieces of a puzzle I currently see on the table for observation, refrain from conclusions and continue to closely observe to see what puzzle pieces become more solid.

I'd sure like to hear any more puzzle pieces regarding David that's ocurred to anyone, I know I've thought of others that don't come to mind right now.

But the red pills keep coming, don't they?

I think it's time to really ramp up the super-vetting of all messengers and info. I'd sure like to see lots of them sit at the same table and hash out conflicting theories. I'm not hearing any interviewer ask anyone hard, put them on the spot questions.

[Lifebringer]

I think David's gift of peering into the future and hanging out with others who are capable of the same, didn't allow him to realize that all the multiple murders to keep the secret, wouldn't eventually creep up to his door. He could have been killed and his friend was wounded when they entered his home thinking he was David. I think right then, was when he realized how phychotic these players are. It would take a Universal Justice system to screen them all out for us to be rid of them.

I will take each message from all that post them with a grain of salt, and if it feels like its from the heart, then I'll listen. The real listening comes from within.

[turiya]

Not to be too serious...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGFVkM-2XO8&ob=av3e

[WhiteFeather]

IMHO,,,,I resonate with Davids Work tremendously, his new book SFI is incredible and endorsed by a highly credible non mainstream archeologist in Graham Hancock. I don't feel the need in second guessing him, I feel most secure with his work to say the least.

[greybeard]

His book is very good.
I dont agree with all he comes up with and I think he is perhaps a bit naive at times, however there is more plus than minus I would say.

Chris

[Circe]

+1 well said Sebastasoul, totally agree :thumb:

[Lazlo]

I'm about 100 pages into Source Field now and I think that David has some skills as a researcher and presenter of disparate threads of knowledge, but I gave up listening to what he said a long time ago.

The breakdown was just too much and I nearly gagged when he and Brockbrader got into the mutual admiration and giggling with the "I can't tell you because its a secret" thing. That being said, I think that's its more about ego and persona than MKUltra.

Sadly enough, I can't think of anyone in the alt community right now, besides maybe Richard Dolan and Graham Hancock, that I take seriously any more. The disinfo and discrediting agents must have worked their majik on me :o

[Marin]

Here's a quote from a post I made in October, 2011. Thought I'd share it again. :)


I can't say I subscribe to much of what I hear but if I were to put my money on a handful of people - David Wilcock would be on my list. I can appreciate that many are not comfortable with some of his material or how it's presented. It isn't for everyone. Perhaps that's by design. Intuitively speaking, I feel some of what Wilcock has to share is spot on. Others may not agree. That's cool. I also believe it takes courage to do what he does. I know he puts his reputation on the line with some of the statements he makes. My guess is that he even puts his own life on the line with the work he does. I don't think for a second it's glamorous. It looks like hard work and I'm glad someone is out there doing it.

Here's the link to my original post: http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?32458-Underground-Bases-Update-by-Wilcock-...&p=334992&viewfull=1#post334992

[dddanieljjjamesss]

Is it not possible that both directions are equally real?
When you peel the layers back enough, all information coming through us is from both sides. David IS something, whether the downloads/uploads he receives/creates are negative/positive it is up for each individual to decide. To have a world without David Wilcock, one must simply just forget him. Otherwise, if we are playing the game with this person as another piece of the puzzle, he is going to look different depending on each player's perspective.

So in making that choice, why worry about being deceived? It will only increase the possibility that that is what you will become. Just be what you want to be in regards to David Wilcock and don't allow your opinion of him to sway YOUR path either way.

[Kristin]

Back to Wilcock, hey guess what? He's human just like the rest of us and that means a mixed bag. Strengths and weaknesses all rolled up into one human physical aspect of the creator. i'm pleased that he is here trying and doing, screwing up or not he's put himself out there in the game. That's a lot of work and research that he is doing, even if it's just to put things into perspective so that others can comprehensively understand it. Perfection I never expected from him. We all try to be the best we can be, and hopefully improve or at least I'd like to think so. LOL.

I was thinking about perceptions. Is it human nature to tear things apart so that we can understand and explore them? What about people? Can we accept the flaws that we have as being a part of our human condition and move forward to try and better ourselves without hurting others in the process? Hard one. I've torn my own psyche apart many times to understand myself. I'm glad I have. Compassion would be a key word here. David's got an ego, it's hard to be compassionate to a person with such an ego... but we must or we lose our centre.

In so far as DW being MK Ultra... hey, why not? Does this make him less of a person or more interesting? Would that knowledge, if ever divulged by him, change his perception or stance on certain issues he's written about? Honestly, I tend to think that if David had ever had the MKU training he would have had the skills not to lose his emotions to his fears of dying. That alone would make me think that he was not in an MK program. Living near a military base? Who doesn't? Harder to find someone who hasn't when you look at it that way.

My thoughts are that DW is just another guy, exploring all the questions of the universe just as many others are. He's been public about it and thus comes under scrutiny as does everyone who extends themselves publicly, it's part of the package. He is not perfect and he has a lot of talent. Is it wrong to question DW? Absolutely NOT. Question EVERYTHING.

Anyway, My opinion for what it's worth.
From the Heart,
Wormhole

[meat suit]

Hey Sebastasoul,

you put a lot of work into this post, which is a good thing to do.....go down some rabbit hole, grab the data and throw it on the table.

I have only come across DW recently within last the year and will keep watching him without judgement for now.....

Andrew Basiago however, I have only listened to the interview with Alfred Webre about humanoids on mars
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4ttNZfULQg&feature=plcp&context=C3951003UDOEgsToPDskKNjdVStX8eSQIUHmuTZufD
is completely out off his mind as far as I can tell. he is giving this detailed analysis of stuff that just isnt there...nuts...I looked at the picture while I listened.....he must be hallucinating....

[Camilo]

IMHO,,,,I resonate with Davids Work tremendously, his new book SFI is incredible and endorsed by a highly credible non mainstream archeologist in Graham Hancock. I don't feel the need in second guessing him, I feel most secure with his work to say the least.

Totally agree with you coment whitefeather!

[Daozen]

He's one of the foremost scholars of our time and has done an immense amount for Earth. A few weeks after the financial tyranny articles came out there were arrests in Italy, and waves of resignations. Not solely down to him, but he has helped.

If you don't like him, leave him to develop and work on your own personal evolution.

Peace on Earth.

[Dennis Leahy]

I think this is a very important post, Sebastasoul.

I have come to the conclusion that anyone - and I mean anyone - that offers me the viewpoint that the Global Rulers/Dark Cabal is wounded, on the run, in retreat, (or worst of all) "already defeated...it's just a matter of time" is so full of organic fertilizer that their eyes are brown.

Here in the wool factory known as the United States, I would guess that 70% or more are utterly and totally clueless that they have even been 'gamed' by banksters! This isn't esoteric information, or a deep black-op secret that I'm talking about, it has been laid out for all to see - even in the mainstraem media! So if 70% don't even know that debt money is a scam, that artificial inflationary and deflationary cycles to create booms and busts and consolidate wealth is a scam, that quasi-monetary "instruments" like derivatives is a scam and had the full support of the US Congress, and that 98% of all US Congresspersons are "on the take" from banksters... if the vast majority of my fellow citizens cannot even catch on to the most obvious and fully exposed scams, what are the odds that they are aware there is even a group of top-of-the-pyramid Global Controllers - controlling much of our lives? I'd say zero percent chance. Most of these people think the financial problems were caused by poor people lying on mortgage credit applications. I'm not kidding you!

Take that one more level, look at the 30% that have at least some awareness that there are bad guys in corporate and banking boardrooms, and try to find the percentage of people that know that there is a tier beyond those boardrooms, a tier of Global Controllers. From that small percentage, what percentage have ever even heard of MKULTRA? Out of that teeny tiny percentage, (some of whom visit 'alternative media' websites, like Avalon) how many might even entertain the notion that David Wilcock could be the unwitting mouthpiece for the Global Rulers? I'd guess the percentage is very, very low.

I like your hypothesis. If David is not outright controlled, I believe that he is sincere but naive, feels a bit like Batman's sidekick Robin (in that "insiders" tell him all about the batcave), and is an easy target for a fun blend of info and disinfo. The mountains of gold story, the Federal Reserve bonds, the implications of imminent arrests and equitable distribution of money... at what point does it start to smell like the NWO getting the "aware" crowd to stand down, and to emotionally prepare for a One World currency delivered by the "White Hats"?

Dennis

[greybeard]

In fairness to him --- I have watched quite a few videos of his talks free.
What is helpful to me I take, what is not I leave.
Over the years he has put out a lot of valid and well researched information, how many of us can say the same.
Its very easy to find fault and its as though, if one part fails scrutiny it must all be suspect.
Yes discernment is necessary and a good OP --- Thanks

Chris

[ljwheat]

your comment
posted last year ...9 months ago

Re: Holy smokes ... something new from Wilcock

I totally agree with ARTEMESIA who said... " For the most part, however, after months of reading Wilcock's stuff it became pretty obvious that most of it is a 'feed' into the mind control machine."

I think it's worth monitoring Wilcock very carefully as an example of state-of-the-art mind control in our world. He grew up near a military base, and was an early adulthood major drug addict - i.e. - created gaping holes in his mind pattern available for insertion/manipulation. In all his writings, he has never once addressed this highly developed black ops capability and it's capability of inserting 'dreams' into people that he constantly expouses as his accurate future-telling, and it's pervasiveness in the people who are elevated to notoriety in the media. He has a very extreme messiah complex and near robotic recall of vast amounts of possibly very accurate cutting edge/scientific/archaeological/metaphysical data, but seems completely helpless to not draw rediculous conclusions, predictions, Obama support and more NWO agenda concepts, the combination of that would serve to be very convincing to many less discerning people.
Parent Post
on davids comments here.
http://divinecosmos.com/start-here/davids-blog/936-disclosurebinladen

Just checking on the one razing the red flag or (pill) before giving IMHO about David. With out David present to clarify any statements on his own behalf. Razes a big flag for me, as this is about the third tread today I’ve notice, conspiracy leveling at key player’s in our quest for truth and understanding. The sudden interest in knocking down tangible coherent Researchers is growing too. So looking at the one pointing the finger also bear’s a look see. But some times when a placebo works as well as or better than the real drug. Its all about perception, and I think David should answer all your questions as none of us can speculate or give answer to your doubts. No I don’t agree with all that David or any man say’s, and don’t base the next ten minutes of my life on what any one says, unless it’s “get out of the street your about to get run over” but its still up to me to look see who’s telling me to look too. He might been referring to the guy about to get run over on the side street I just passed.

Voicing your opinion 9 months ago is just that an opinion. Starting a tribunal hearing on the man is not just your opinion. But asking for help to barbeque at a tail gate party and the man isn’t even present. IMHO :drag:

[Lazlo]

I think this is a very important post, Sebastasoul.

I have come to the conclusion that anyone - and I mean anyone - that offers me the viewpoint that the Global Rulers/Dark Cabal is wounded, on the run, in retreat, (or wost of all) "already defeated...it's just a matter of time" is so full of organic fertilizer that their eyes are brown.

Here in the wool factory known as the United States, I would guess that 70% or more are utterly and totally clueless that they have even been 'gamed' by banksters! This isn't esoteric information, or a deep black-op secret that I'm talking about, it has been laid out for all to see - even in the mainstraem media! So if 70% don't even know that debt money is a scam, that artificial inflationary and deflationary cycles to create booms and busts and consolodate wealth is a scam, that quasi-monetary "instruments" like derivatives is a scam and had the full support of the US Congress, and that 98% of all US Congresspersons are "on the take" from banksters... if the vast majority of my fellow citizens cannot even catch on to the most obvious and fully exposed scams, what are the odds that they are aware there is even a group of top-of-the-pyramid Global Controllers - controlling much of our lives? I'd say zero percent chance. Most of these people think the financial problems were caused by poor people lying on mortgage credit applications. I'm not kidding you!

Take that one more level, look at the 30% that have at least some awareness that there are bad guys in corporate and banking boardrooms, and try to find the percentage of people that know that there is a tier beyond those boardrooms, a tier of Global Controllers. From that small percentage, what percentage have ever even heard of MKULTRA? Out of that teeny tiny percentage, (some of whom visit 'alternative media' websites, like Avalon) how many might even entertain the notion that David Wilcock could be the unwitting mouthpiece for the Global Rulers? I'd guess the percentage is very, very low.

I like your hypothesis. If David is not outright controlled, I believe that he is sincere but naive, feels a bit like Batman's sidekick Robin (in that "insiders" tell him all about the batcave), and is an easy target for a fun blend of info and disinfo. The mountains of gold story, the Federal Reserve bonds, the implications of imminent arrests and equitable distribution of money... at what point does it start to smell like the NWO getting the "aware" crowd to stand down, and to emotionally prepare for a One World currency delivered by the "White Hats"?

Dennis

:bump::amen:

[crested-duck]

Only thing I can say is that after searching this rabbit hole system for a very long time there is only one constant truth to be found. That truth is all tunnells eventually run directly back to the main hole/burrow, and the only thing you'll find in there is a bunch of venemous snakes that have killed and eaten all the rabbits that had tried to find their way home.

[ThePythonicCow]

I just moved two posts, made earlier in this thread, to the The Truth Exposed by WellAware1.com? (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?35617-The-Truth-Exposed-by-WellAware1.com&p=442620&viewfull=1#post442620) thread. They seemed more on topic over there.

[aranuk]

I like David but his Obama support has me wondering. What does he say about all these anti freedom laws he has endorsed? That would have been the time for him to prove his decency. So, we have David believing that Obama is a good guy, doesn't sit well on my lap. Bill Ryan doesn't trust every word he speaks either and he has had many private meetings with him. I laughed at the names below the people on that second interview with Kerry, Bill had written under his picture Bill Ryan, Bill Brockbrader had his name under too and David had Source Field Investigation under his pic. He used that interview to promote his book. Yuck. And the smirking at the OP said between BB and DW was juvenile to say the least. He has a few question marks against him in my book. I loved Kerry interview with Stew last week. He was a real Hoot and never once advertised his website or any of his books. He would have named a few more names if Kerry had either asked him or not interupted him in full flow. Sebasasoul your OP was well written with lots of reasong and no hatred or mockery.


Stan

[aranuk]

There is a certain urgency required to have valuable information that is true in our lead up to Dec 21 2012. That, I don't think anyone here at Avalon forum can deny. If we can quickly seperate the wheat from the chaff it is in our best interests for humanity. Doing so seems to me the best thing we can do to prepare for things to come. So, this thread and others like it, gives us the opportunity the see clearer what is what. Dennis's posts lead us towards this goal I feel. I am going to read the reset button by Den again.

Stan

[WHOMADEGOD]

The fact that I hate admitting there is something wrong with DW and especially Fulford and his "System" is proof enough for me that there is disinfo and deceit in all of this. Personally I feel David is in denial and swept up in the delusion of sorts.

I know unequivically that God exists, I couldnt prove it to anyone because it goes beyond any empirical objective data, it is some inner resolution that cannot be manipulated. I do not get the same feeling with their story of salvation, and it pains me but hey, God works in mysterious ways indeed...

[songsfortheotherkind]

Just a few quick observations: it might be useful to do some mainstream, non-conspiracy related research into the traits of high 'giftedness' and Asperger's. One of the things that is interesting to discover is that many of the markers for high giftedness and Aspergers are the same. One of the interesting things about being highly gifted is often a seemingly 'robotic' ability to hold, recall, correlate and use huge amounts of data simultaneously- it's one of the markers for giftedness, particularly in certain fields.

As someone who was 'flagged' as highly gifted in childhood, I was persecuted and punished by my 'peers' for having just such an ability. I still have this ability, I just don't show it in public much because of the negative reactions I get from those who *can't* do these things and therefore make moral judgements about what I'm doing ('you think you're so superior/such a smartarse/so you think you're better than we are, hey?'), get belligerent, defensive, aggressive (' oh yeah? ok then, smartarse, what's 786592 divided by 57?' See, not so smart after all, are ya?' with the added implication that because I can't answer their questions/satisfy their demands my perspective/experience/participation is not valid and I should just shut up) and any number of other reactions that, frankly, have become tedious and dull over time, causing me to only rarely actually speak in public settings of any kind. This forum, as I said in my first post, is the first time in over a decade that I am actually attempting to truly share of my Self without self-censure.

For gifted individuals, interacting with *non*gifted can be the most painful and frightening experience around- we are judged (particularly morally, as if being able to hold more things in our mind is a suspicious and questionable ability- and surprise! look what's being pointed at David because he can do just that), misinterpreted, mocked, denigrated and a whole swathe of other behaviours that make the willingness to go public sometimes a heroic effort in itself. I know from my own personal experience that I have had to work through force 10 panic attacks while making the move back into a 'public' arena and have had to work through even more while making my film. I do know that this is not unique to giftedness at all, plenty of NTs (which is not meant as an insult, just a way of describing those who do not experience the high level states that accompany giftedness) have panic attacks; what I am pointing out is that being gifted in some areas does not make the individual impervious to frailty of *any* kind. Einstein, while having a brilliant mind in some very specific ways, was not a saint, was not incapable of low vibration behaviours- he was a Being that, along with his other traits and abilities, was able to hold more things in his mind and use them than others were.

High giftedness can cause the individual to struggle with social interaction for many reasons. Being different- giftedness, sexual orientation, appearance, for example- is often a crime in the current dominant paradigm, for many and varied reasons; being *very* different in any way can trigger violent responses in individuals that have sometimes resulted in physical or psychological harm to the one who is different. Sometimes it has resulted in the death of that individual, either through murder or suicide. The frequent negative or unpleasant interactions highly gifted individuals experience socially can cause them to become extremely introverted and isolated, 'coming out' only in the company of peers: this can sometimes give the appearance of a bunch of teenagers getting together, giggling, making injokes, speaking in symbology and strange (to the uninitiated) parameters, frequently engaging (at least temporarily) in egoic appearing/stroking ways. It's often the glee of suddenly finding yourself in the right 'club' and it happens for all sorts of reasons, one of which is that high giftedness does not indicate perfection, regardless of the moral judgements, agendas and interpretations of observers. *Everyone* is a Sui Generis Being, which means that all Beings have things to learn about accepting each other as they are, 'gifted' and NT included. (Please be aware, I'm using these terms for a very specific reason, within the parameters of the discussion, given that a wide range of perspectives are in the space. I don't need responses that 'educate' me to the 'reality' that 'everyone is gifted', etc etc- I'm using the terms to help create the ideas and perspective I'm discussing, while at the same time holding the awareness that 'everyone' currently can't access these spaces and so marked differences in ability are present). lol, I just observed myself pre-emptively 'covering my arse'/deflecting the irritating responses with that sentence- can you tell I've had these interactions before?

David has this kind of mind and ability in some very key areas. To those not able to do such things, it makes him suspicious. Colour me unsurprised. Add to that his imperfections and he obviously MUST be up to No Good!! Thank goodness the witch burning era has generally passed, although being different can still equate with death in some parts of the paradigm- my mother used to get so bewildered, and finally enraged, by my repeated childhood nightmares that had me waking up screaming from being tortured and raped for days and then burned at the stake. Ahh, you 'human' species, fun times, fun times.... not. I also just deliberately put the blanket 'humans' reference in there, to highlight my point.

David is David. Like any Sui Generis Life Artist, you can take or leave his Art, and I appreciate that he is out there making it. I too am free to take or leave his particular pieces without making moral or other judgements about the individual- just because I don't personally enjoy Picasso's brand of art doesn't give me a solid platform for making spiritual, moral or other judgements about him as a Being - what Picasso put out there was his Life's Art, a portion of which came in painting form- and that's what we all are doing, creating the Art that is our Beingness and life. All Life Art is as subjective as fine art is subjective, so if you don't like a particular Artist's work, you are absolutely free to pass on it and find something that does make your Being sing. Sometimes you'll like *some* of the Artist's work and not others- there's absolutely no obligation that if you like *some* of it you *MUST* LOVE IT ALL, WITHOUT QUESTION, which is how some individuals are when it comes to how *they* operate (and generally they're trying to force you to take a whole bunch of their crappy art because you liked one small drawing).

I'm interested in seeing a more evolved set of skills, perceptions and understandings emerge when it comes to how we interact with each other as Sui Generis, unique Beings rather than with the old templates of judgement and fear. It may not work for all Beings, and it's how I like to go through the 'Verse.

[jaybee]

.


it's a serious thread........ man....


_02fCIMDjFY


:p


.

[Kimberley]

*************************

WOW this thread is an interesting development...

I consider David a friend of mine...not a close friend however a bit more than an acquaintance. I have had many hours of conversation talking with David one on one in the past 5 years. I also was in his physical presence for a week on a cruise in November of 2008 with a group of about 40 people (after having had several personal conversations with David and interviewing him in early 2007).

And based on all of that personal experience I see/view David as a fabulous loving person that only has the best intentions for the collective. I love him a lot!! And he is one that I have had more one on one connection than many others... Do I agree with everything ? No I do not... however I resonate with 95% of what David puts out.

To me there is no way in "H**L" that he is a dis info agent...even if he has blue eyse and blond hair!!!!!!! I love David and I love us alll!!! :hug: :luv:

[jackovesk]

Maybe time to take a serious look at David Wilcock

I did a long time ago, but got ganged up on by his Avalonian Followers...

Some are so blind to the Truth, it still amazes me...

Go figure Hey...:noidea:

[Kimberley]

Maybe time to take a serious look at David Wilcock

I did a long time ago, but got ganged up by his Avalonian Followers...

Some are so blind to the Truth, it still amazes me...

Go figure Hey...:noidea:

Sorry I for one LOVE David see post above,,,, When are WE going to agree to disagree?????? Geeezzzz ???

Much love to us all!!!! :hug:

[lilac]

ljwheat! good call, thanks. You brought me back to reality. I have learned heaps from David. He is a great heart and this thread is a waste of time. I almost got sucked in. Please remember your delete buttons folks and don't let the door hit you on the way out. OOps. Maybe that was a bit harsh.;)

[jcocks]

While it's quite possible that David is being fed disinfo or being programmed during sleep etc, there's no way in hell that he is a *WILLING* disinnfo agent. I know first-hand that the downloads of information during sleep are possible - I've had them myself. But I have no idea what they are for, and have never actually been able to access the information "downloaded"......

It is quite possible, if not highly likely, that many of us have been programmed with information that will be "triggered" at the right time. I would hazard a guess that it isn't just the negatives that are doing this. Many of us incarnate with this information already there.....

We are entering exceptionally interesting times, and the events that will shortly occur have not been foreseen by *ANYONE*...

It's one thing to talk about the events to come, but when they actually happen it will be a *COMPLETELY* different kettle of fish.

[Cilka]

There is something fishy about David, just like there is something fishy about George Kavassilas. I did resonate with both of them in the past, but not anymore. My intuition kicked in and I realized that there was something wrong with their messages. I could go into detail about what I find wrong with both of them, but then there is no point in doing so, especially for those who are still resonating with both of them. It is up to every individual to make their own decisions, I am only responsible for myself. At the time when I believed in their messages and if someone told me that I should start smelling the rat, I would have ignored their warnings.

What I noticed though about people who are in contact with ET's is that they are very smart, extreme intellectuals, and very knowledgable about the subject matter they are marketing to the masses.

[Sidney]

Back to Wilcock, hey guess what? He's human just like the rest of us and that means a mixed bag. Strengths and weaknesses all rolled up into one human physical aspect of the creator. i'm pleased that he is here trying and doing, screwing up or not he's put himself out there in the game. That's a lot of work and research that he is doing, even if it's just to put things into perspective so that others can comprehensively understand it. Perfection I never expected from him. We all try to be the best we can be, and hopefully improve or at least I'd like to think so. LOL.

I was thinking about perceptions. Is it human nature to tear things apart so that we can understand and explore them? What about people? Can we accept the flaws that we have as being a part of our human condition and move forward to try and better ourselves without hurting others in the process? Hard one. I've torn my own psyche apart many times to understand myself. I'm glad I have. Compassion would be a key word here. David's got an ego, it's hard to be compassionate to a person with such an ego... but we must or we lose our centre.

In so far as DW being MK Ultra... hey, why not? Does this make him less of a person or more interesting? Would that knowledge, if ever divulged by him, change his perception or stance on certain issues he's written about? Honestly, I tend to think that if David had ever had the MKU training he would have had the skills not to lose his emotions to his fears of dying. That alone would make me think that he was not in an MK program. Living near a military base? Who doesn't? Harder to find someone who hasn't when you look at it that way.

My thoughts are that DW is just another guy, exploring all the questions of the universe just as many others are. He's been public about it and thus comes under scrutiny as does everyone who extends themselves publicly, it's part of the package. He is not perfect and he has a lot of talent. Is it wrong to question DW? Absolutely NOT. Question EVERYTHING.

Anyway, My opinion for what it's worth.
From the Heart,
Wormhole


Couldn't have said it better!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

For the record, i have moved probably 20 times in my life,(yeah Im old) and I have never been too far from a military base. they are everywhere, and those are the ones that we know about. You are right on the mark Wormhole!!

[Dennis Leahy]

Maybe time to take a serious look at David Wilcock

I did a long time ago, but got ganged up by his Avalonian Followers...

Sorry I for one LOVE David see post above,,,, When are WE going to agree to disagree?????? Geeezzzz ???

Much love to us all!!!! :hug:
The hypothesis includes a lovable, likeable David Wilcock - that is being fed a mixture of information and disinformation. Do you agree that anyone - including David - could be a lovable, likeable person that mistakenly believes that his sources are impeccable but has one or more sneaky bastards feeding him disinfo?

I have heard tales of street gang members that require a new member to commit a serious crime in front of them, to "vet" that the member is not an undercover cop. How many crimes, how many murders, does Obama have to commit before he is clearly no longer a good guy hiding with the bad guys? Between Little Bush and Obomber, approximately 1 million Iraqi souls (reportedly, more than half were women and children) have been slaughtered. Do we simply forgive and forget if Obomber steps away from the Cabal wearing a white hat? David says Obomber is a good egg, and that is because his sources tell him so. Can we agree that at least ONE of David's sources is a deliberate disinfo agent?

David "authenticated" DUMBs being destroyed. He did not see the destruction, and I did not see an intact base, so neither of us know for sure - but the story is a stinky pile of unverifiable crap. Worse, it was the seminal event, the underground version of 9/11, that "proved" that the tides were turning, that White Hats (and/or White Hats plus benevolent and now intervening ETs, or ETs alone) not only exist but that they are very crafty, and very powerful. The meme was that the Cabal could no longer run underground; their main safe-houses were destroyed. This is a powerful meme, a dangerous meme if untrue - and we have NOTHING at all to suggest that this is true other than it was piggybacked onto earthquakes. (I happen to know a volcanologist, believe it or not, and I asked if earthquakes in those two areas were bizarre. He said no, that both areas had had earthquakes before, in the past.)

So, I cannot prove that the bombing of D.U.M.B.s, powerful ET and/or White Hat intervention, and the Cabal on the run did not happen - but I sure don't believe it did. It is the most dangerous kind of false meme that the Cabal could unleash on us. In a time when we should be on the highest alert, we relax and start a round of high-fives.

What other "info" has been injected into our consciousness by David, using the same bad source that says Barack is a White Hat double-agent, only pretending to be the worst president (for US citizens, Iraqi citizens, Afghani citizens, Pakistani citizens...) in US history.

Does David truly have such a poor understanding of the legal system and the justice system in the US to NOT realize that ALL the federal judges were appointed by and work for the Cabal? Any case brought against any Cabal member will be dismissed - with prejudice.

Does David really have such a poor understanding of money that he doesn't realize that gold-backed money is the back-door trap of the Financial Elite to control the monetary system? [[David, if you're reading this, get a copy of Bill Still's new book, No More National Debt, which explains much more than the national debt. You'll understand why we do not want a new worldwide monetary system with dollars backed by gold.]]

From my perspective:


Obama is a bad guy
No DUMBs were destroyed
No Cabal member will be convicted of a financial crime and serve hard time (unless the Cabal deliberately throws a few corpses to the sharks.)
Gold or gold backed money will not be distributed - and in the unbelievable case that it would be, it would be the harbinger of the NWO new One World currency.


Even a cuddly, lovable guy can spread disinfo. How sophisticated are the psyche black-ops boys? I don't know. I don't know if they can "beam" false memories and phony information in, or whether they need to (with drugs and repetition and the breakdown of the psyche) plant information in a subject, or whether they do it with trust and the simple passing of disinfo over a cup of coffee. However it was done, David got some of it and is disseminating it as verified and true. This is a problem.

Dennis

[off_the grid]

I think this is a very important post, Sebastasoul.

I have come to the conclusion that anyone - and I mean anyone - that offers me the viewpoint that the Global Rulers/Dark Cabal is wounded, on the run, in retreat, (or worst of all) "already defeated...it's just a matter of time" is so full of organic fertilizer that their eyes are brown.

Here in the wool factory known as the United States, I would guess that 70% or more are utterly and totally clueless that they have even been 'gamed' by banksters! This isn't esoteric information, or a deep black-op secret that I'm talking about, it has been laid out for all to see - even in the mainstraem media! So if 70% don't even know that debt money is a scam, that artificial inflationary and deflationary cycles to create booms and busts and consolidate wealth is a scam, that quasi-monetary "instruments" like derivatives is a scam and had the full support of the US Congress, and that 98% of all US Congresspersons are "on the take" from banksters... if the vast majority of my fellow citizens cannot even catch on to the most obvious and fully exposed scams, what are the odds that they are aware there is even a group of top-of-the-pyramid Global Controllers - controlling much of our lives? I'd say zero percent chance. Most of these people think the financial problems were caused by poor people lying on mortgage credit applications. I'm not kidding you!

Take that one more level, look at the 30% that have at least some awareness that there are bad guys in corporate and banking boardrooms, and try to find the percentage of people that know that there is a tier beyond those boardrooms, a tier of Global Controllers. From that small percentage, what percentage have ever even heard of MKULTRA? Out of that teeny tiny percentage, (some of whom visit 'alternative media' websites, like Avalon) how many might even entertain the notion that David Wilcock could be the unwitting mouthpiece for the Global Rulers? I'd guess the percentage is very, very low.

I like your hypothesis. If David is not outright controlled, I believe that he is sincere but naive, feels a bit like Batman's sidekick Robin (in that "insiders" tell him all about the batcave), and is an easy target for a fun blend of info and disinfo. The mountains of gold story, the Federal Reserve bonds, the implications of imminent arrests and equitable distribution of money... at what point does it start to smell like the NWO getting the "aware" crowd to stand down, and to emotionally prepare for a One World currency delivered by the "White Hats"?

Dennis

Great post Dennis.

IMO he is a fraud, and when he speaks my BS meter is going off the charts....

[jackovesk]

Maybe time to take a serious look at David Wilcock

I did a long time ago, but got ganged up by his Avalonian Followers...

Sorry I for one LOVE David see post above,,,, When are WE going to agree to disagree?????? Geeezzzz ???

Much love to us all!!!! :hug:
The hypothesis includes a lovable, likeable David Wilcock - that is being fed a mixture of information and disinformation. Do you agree that anyone - including David - could be a lovable, likeable person that mistakenly believes that his sources are impeccable but has one or more sneaky bastards feeding him disinfo?

I have heard tales of street gang members that require a new member to commit a serious crime in front of them, to "vet" that the member is not an undercover cop. How many crimes, how many murders, does Obama have to commit before he is clearly no longer a good guy hiding with the bad guys? Between Little Bush and Obomber, approximately 1 million Iraqi souls (reportedly, more than half were women and children) have been slaughtered. Do we simply forgive and forget if Obomber steps away from the Cabal wearing a white hat? David says Obomber is a good egg, and that is because his sources tell him so. Can we agree that at least ONE of David's sources is a deliberate disinfo agent?

David "authenticated" DUMBs being destroyed. He did not see the destruction, and I did not see an intact base, so neither of us know for sure - but the story is a stinky pile of unverifiable crap. Worse, it was the seminal event, the underground version of 9/11, that "proved" that the tides were turning, that White Hats (and/or White Hats plus benevolent and now intervening ETs, or ETs alone) not only exist but that they are very crafty, and very powerful. The meme was that the Cabal could no longer run underground; their main safe-houses were destroyed. This is a powerful meme, a dangerous meme if untrue - and we have NOTHING at all to suggest that this is true other than it was piggybacked onto earthquakes. (I happen to know a volcanologist, believe it or not, and I asked if earthquakes in those two areas were bizarre. He said no, that both areas had had earthquakes before, in the past.)

So, I cannot prove that the bombing of D.U.M.B.s, powerful ET and/or White Hat intervention, and the Cabal on the run did not happen - but I sure don't believe it did. It is the most dangerous kind of false meme that the Cabal could unleash on us. In a time when we should be on the highest alert, we relax and start a round of high-fives.

What other "info" has been injected into our consciousness by David, using the same bad source that says Barack is a White Hat double-agent, only pretending to be the worst president (for US citizens, Iraqi citizens, Afghani citizens, Pakistani citizens...) in US history.

Does David truly have such a poor understanding of the legal system and the justice system in the US to NOT realize that ALL the federal judges were appointed by and work for the Cabal? Any case brought against any Cabal member will be dismissed - with prejudice.

Does David really have such a poor understanding of money that he doesn't realize that gold-backed money is the back-door trap of the Financial Elite to control the monetary system? [[David, if you're reading this, get a copy of Bill Still's new book, No More National Debt, which explains much more than the national debt. You'll understand why we do not want a new worldwide monetary system with dollars backed by gold.]]

From my perspective:


Obama is a bad guy
No DUMBs were destroyed
No Cabal member will be convicted of a financial crime and serve hard time (unless the Cabal deliberately throws a few corpses to the sharks.)
Gold or gold backed money will not be distributed - and in the unbelievable case that it would be, it would be the harbinger of the NWO new One World currency.


Even a cuddly, lovable guy can spread disinfo. How sophisticated are the psyche black-ops boys? I don't know. I don't know if they can "beam" false memories and phony information in, or whether they need to (with drugs and repetition and the breakdown of the psyche) plant information in a subject, or whether they do it with trust and the simple passing of disinfo over a cup of coffee. However it was done, David got some of it and is disseminating it as verified and true. This is a problem.

Dennis

:bump:

Once, Twice , Thrice a knowing DisInfo/Liar always a DisInfo/Liar...:yes4:

He has abused his position in the 'Alternative Community' and IMHO deserves (NO RESPECT) whatsoever..!

Even if you believe his past 'Teachings' which weren't even exclusive, its time to start using your own 'Commonsense & Discernment'..!

Trust has to earned and David Wilcock has 'Abused' that Trust repeatedly and deserves to be held 'Accountable' for it..!

No Apologies, that's just the way it is...:yes4:

[jcocks]

Nothing is ever that black and white on this planet, no matter how much you want to believe that it is, Jacko :)

[Mike]

Maybe time to take a serious look at David Wilcock

I did a long time ago, but got ganged up by his Avalonian Followers...

Sorry I for one LOVE David see post above,,,, When are WE going to agree to disagree?????? Geeezzzz ???

Much love to us all!!!! :hug:
The hypothesis includes a lovable, likeable David Wilcock - that is being fed a mixture of information and disinformation. Do you agree that anyone - including David - could be a lovable, likeable person that mistakenly believes that his sources are impeccable but has one or more sneaky bastards feeding him disinfo?

I have heard tales of street gang members that require a new member to commit a serious crime in front of them, to "vet" that the member is not an undercover cop. How many crimes, how many murders, does Obama have to commit before he is clearly no longer a good guy hiding with the bad guys? Between Little Bush and Obomber, approximately 1 million Iraqi souls (reportedly, more than half were women and children) have been slaughtered. Do we simply forgive and forget if Obomber steps away from the Cabal wearing a white hat? David says Obomber is a good egg, and that is because his sources tell him so. Can we agree that at least ONE of David's sources is a deliberate disinfo agent?

David "authenticated" DUMBs being destroyed. He did not see the destruction, and I did not see an intact base, so neither of us know for sure - but the story is a stinky pile of unverifiable crap. Worse, it was the seminal event, the underground version of 9/11, that "proved" that the tides were turning, that White Hats (and/or White Hats plus benevolent and now intervening ETs, or ETs alone) not only exist but that they are very crafty, and very powerful. The meme was that the Cabal could no longer run underground; their main safe-houses were destroyed. This is a powerful meme, a dangerous meme if untrue - and we have NOTHING at all to suggest that this is true other than it was piggybacked onto earthquakes. (I happen to know a volcanologist, believe it or not, and I asked if earthquakes in those two areas were bizarre. He said no, that both areas had had earthquakes before, in the past.)

So, I cannot prove that the bombing of D.U.M.B.s, powerful ET and/or White Hat intervention, and the Cabal on the run did not happen - but I sure don't believe it did. It is the most dangerous kind of false meme that the Cabal could unleash on us. In a time when we should be on the highest alert, we relax and start a round of high-fives.

What other "info" has been injected into our consciousness by David, using the same bad source that says Barack is a White Hat double-agent, only pretending to be the worst president (for US citizens, Iraqi citizens, Afghani citizens, Pakistani citizens...) in US history.

Does David truly have such a poor understanding of the legal system and the justice system in the US to NOT realize that ALL the federal judges were appointed by and work for the Cabal? Any case brought against any Cabal member will be dismissed - with prejudice.

Does David really have such a poor understanding of money that he doesn't realize that gold-backed money is the back-door trap of the Financial Elite to control the monetary system? [[David, if you're reading this, get a copy of Bill Still's new book, No More National Debt, which explains much more than the national debt. You'll understand why we do not want a new worldwide monetary system with dollars backed by gold.]]

From my perspective:


Obama is a bad guy
No DUMBs were destroyed
No Cabal member will be convicted of a financial crime and serve hard time (unless the Cabal deliberately throws a few corpses to the sharks.)
Gold or gold backed money will not be distributed - and in the unbelievable case that it would be, it would be the harbinger of the NWO new One World currency.


Even a cuddly, lovable guy can spread disinfo. How sophisticated are the psyche black-ops boys? I don't know. I don't know if they can "beam" false memories and phony information in, or whether they need to (with drugs and repetition and the breakdown of the psyche) plant information in a subject, or whether they do it with trust and the simple passing of disinfo over a cup of coffee. However it was done, David got some of it and is disseminating it as verified and true. This is a problem.

Dennis


great post, Dennis. you're on a roll today, mate.

there is a big difference between being deliberately manipulative and naively misled. Wilcock may be grossly misguided, but he BELIEVES he is doing and saying the right things. if we're going to judge the man, i think our judgements must be made with this in mind.

in fact, this analysis applies to most of our whistle blowers imho. Icke for instance...how long has he been riding the reptilian express now? 20 years? something like that? he'd have to be a pretty damn good actor to keep it going this long if he didn't believe what he was saying. same with Wilcock. this is not a horrible, mendacious man we're talking about here; he thinks he's doing and saying the right things.

i mention these things in response to my frustration resulting from the knee-jerk emotionalism i often see in the alt field, this thoughtless tendency to pull the 'fraud' or 'charlatan' trigger the second it's revealed that an alt-media member or whistleblower hasn't got all their facts straight. many times it's a result of being dis-info'd, manipulated or deliberately misled. many of these folks are NOT DELIBERATELY LYING TO US; they are trying to be helpful!

now, ignorance can only exist as an excuse for so long--i agree with almost everything in Dennis' post. this spreading of disinfo is a huge problem, whether intended or not. but let's not be so quick to hang some of these guys; it's not always so black n white. i'll say till i'm blue in the face: regard the nuance.

[Mulder]

Speaking from my own experience, I have got a lot of good information from DW. Especially when I first came to the old Avalon forum around 2008. I absolutely loved his presentation on some of the older conferences like "Awake and Aware in LA 2009." On the basis of his work that I've seen he is a genius and has been constructive to my own growth and development.

[jackovesk]

Nothing is ever that black and white on this planet, no matter how much you want to believe that it is, Jacko :)

Just telling it like it is jcocks...:yes4:

For (Too Long) David Wilcock's Fans have continued to allow his 'DisInfo/Lies' to be swept under the carpet and blame it on his sources..?

Just think about that for a second...

David Wilcock is still happy to 'Sprout & Spruce' this rubbish all over the net and expect to get away with it..? and that includes Ben Fulford..!


A so called source tells him something, so without (Investigation) he just spews it all over the internet and still has the cheek to call himself an Investigative Journalist...WTF..?

Not in my book...:nono:

The 'Truth Community' deserves better...:yes4:

You either consistently 'Speak the Truth' to the best of your ability or you don't...(No More - InBetweens)

...and if you Get it Wrong sometimes, own up to it..!

David Wilcock's (Shining Star) is withering and dying as we speak and he has (No-One) else to blame it on except himself..!

Make No Mistake about it, he won't be the last to fall on his own sword...

The 'Truth' is back in town and will 'Out' all those who stretch or abuse it...:)

[ThePythonicCow]

Even a cuddly, lovable guy can spread disinfo.
Indeed, it is difficult, from what i can tell, for a major "alternative media" figure to (1) continue actively posting, publishing, speaking and interviewing, while at the same time (2) not becoming a conduit for some disinformation.

Either they marginalize you, or they take you down, or they manage to pass enough BS through you that it's easy for the bastards in power to cast doubts on you.

The evidence presented above for the case that David Wilcock is presenting some disinformation (my perspective is about the same as yours, Dennis, on that) does not mean that Wilcock is mostly a good source passing some BS ... but that's more likely than him being "all truth, all the time."

On the basis of recommendations of others on this forum, I've started reading WIlcock's Source Field Investigations -- the first few pages looked good :) (I've not gotten far yet.)

[WHOMADEGOD]

Nothing is ever that black and white on this planet, no matter how much you want to believe that it is, Jacko :)

Just telling it like it is jcocks...:yes4:

For (Too Long) David Wilcock's Fans have continued to allow his 'DisInfo/Lies' to be swept under the carpet and blame it on his sources..?

Just think about that for a second...

David Wilcock is still happy to 'Sprout & Spruce' this rubbish all over the net and expect to get away with it..? and that includes Ben Fulford..!


A so called source tells him something, so without (Investigation) he just spews it all over the internet and still has the cheek to call himself an Investigative Journalist...WTF..?

Not in my book...:nono:

The 'Truth Community' deserves better...:yes4:

You either consistently 'Speak the Truth' to the best of your ability or you don't...(No More - InBetweens)

...and if you Get it Wrong sometimes, own up to it..!

David Wilcock's (Shining Star) is withering and dying as we speak and he has (No-One) else to blame it on except himself..!

Make No Mistake about it, he won't be the last to fall on his own sword...

The 'Truth' is back in town and will 'Out' all those who stretch or abuse it...:)

Whoa, easy tiger! Lol

You dont hold back Jackovesk, I admire your passion and I see exactly where your coming from.

I couldnt remember but another poster brought up the subject of Aspergis, I know someone with this condition and correlates exactly to Davids situation, he is a victim of his condition.

We need to cut him some slack, he has provided very valid work in the past and has become manipulated by others more recently.

IMO Ben Fulford and his asian gangster types are dangerous and if we cannot see they are peddling a NWO then we are in grave trouble.

We have all beleived falshood at some point and been swept up in the moment so we must stall our judgement in certain instances, but in others, well fortunately the dark makes serious errors in constructing lies and one of them is that if it appeals to our ego then alrm bells should kick in!

Blessings

[Kimberley]

************

Holy molly!!!! I LOVE DAVID W and I LOVE EVERY ONE>>>> geez o weeeezzz. when are we going to agreee to disagreeee!!!!

much love to us all!!! over and out .....

[WHOMADEGOD]

Nothing is ever that black and white on this planet, no matter how much you want to believe that it is, Jacko :)

Just telling it like it is jcocks...:yes4:

For (Too Long) David Wilcock's Fans have continued to allow his 'DisInfo/Lies' to be swept under the carpet and blame it on his sources..?

Just think about that for a second...

David Wilcock is still happy to 'Sprout & Spruce' this rubbish all over the net and expect to get away with it..? and that includes Ben Fulford..!


A so called source tells him something, so without (Investigation) he just spews it all over the internet and still has the cheek to call himself an Investigative Journalist...WTF..?

Not in my book...:nono:

The 'Truth Community' deserves better...:yes4:

You either consistently 'Speak the Truth' to the best of your ability or you don't...(No More - InBetweens)

...and if you Get it Wrong sometimes, own up to it..!

David Wilcock's (Shining Star) is withering and dying as we speak and he has (No-One) else to blame it on except himself..!

Make No Mistake about it, he won't be the last to fall on his own sword...

The 'Truth' is back in town and will 'Out' all those who stretch or abuse it...:)

Whoa, easy tiger! Lol

You dont hold back Jackovesk, I admire your passion and I see exactly where your coming from.

I couldnt remember but another poster brought up the subject of Aspergis, I know someone with this condition and correlates exactly to Davids situation, he is a victim of his condition.

We need to cut him some slack, he has provided very valid work in the past and has become manipulated by others more recently.

IMO Ben Fulford and his asian gangster types are dangerous and if we cannot see they are peddling a NWO then we are in grave trouble.

We have all beleived falshood at some point and been swept up in the moment so we must stall our judgement in certain instances, but in others, well fortunately the dark makes serious errors in constructing lies and one of them is that if it appeals to our ego then alrm bells should kick in!

Blessings

[Hughe]

IMO Ben Fulford and his asian gangster types are dangerous and if we cannot see they are peddling a NWO then we are in grave trouble.

Leave Ben Fulford for Asians please. He is the only person who has strong voice for Asians in alternative community. ^^
Even though most Asians hardly know who is he or crumbling world.

[Wind]

I really like David. He is genuine, compassionate and intelligent guy. However, when he teamed up with Ben Fulford I lost my interest to his updates. I loved all that spiritual stuff, but I just don't believe in that disclosure stuff and I certainly don't believe Ben Fulford. It's just too "earthly". I think he (Ben) is just making up stories to keep people entertained.

[songsfortheotherkind]

I couldnt remember but another poster brought up the subject of Aspergis, I know someone with this condition and correlates exactly to Davids situation, he is a victim of his condition.

I am the poster who mentioned Aspergers. I would just like to clarify that I do not consider being an Aspie problematic, nor do I personally think it's a 'condition', although in its extreme expressions it can be debilitating, as are most things when they are on the extreme ends of the scale. I do not for one second advocate that David is a 'victim' of anything, especially not Aspergers which, as I pointed out, has many of the same markers as high giftedness. I don't personally have a paradigm that supports the idea of being a 'victim' of things and that wasn't the intention of my post at all; I deliberately kept personal opinion of David as a Being out of the post because as I said, his Art is subjective.

I have clarified this because I find the intention and energy of some perspectives on this thread to carry a dissonant frequency, something I do not personally support or give energy to; my comment was intended to open doors of possible perspective within a paradigm that does *not* involve judgement of any kind towards David or anyone else. I'm going to stick with that, it's how I like to play. :)

[crested-duck]

Lie to me and mess with my mind once and shame on you- If I let you do it to me twice, shame on me for being a gullable fool!

[WHOMADEGOD]

I love you "songsfortheotherkind" ! :-)

[RMorgan]

Maybe time to take a serious look at David Wilcock

I did a long time ago, but got ganged up on by his Avalonian Followers...

Some are so blind to the Truth, it still amazes me...

Go figure Hey...:noidea:

Hey Jack,

Yes man, I know how you feel.

Some names are a bit "sacred" here.

Question these names and expect to be bashed all day long.

Cheers,

Raf.

[scootiep]

I ask all of you fellow avalonions to ask your self a question? what are you actually doing to help and benfit humanity? Instead of having a look at others including David, look at yourselves make the change in YOU, that you want to see in the world.

How can you attack someone like David with all of the great work he is doing, with so much FREE info he provides its a joke, get off your keyboard and get out there in the real world and do something about it instead of sitting here in front of your pc screen attacking others, boosting your own ego.

Has anybody actually read financial tyranny? if you haven't then you should!!

Bil Ryan created Avalon for people to form groups and make a difference in the world - who on this forum is doing this?? as David Icke says get off your back sides and do something about what is going on in the world instead of sitting on your arses giving your opinions on people you dont like or resonate with, what does your opinion actually count for anyway??? its a waste of time and effort, at least David is out there helping so many people with his talks and information.

what are you doing to help the world? do you think words on a computer screen and opinions on people you have never met is going to take down the corrupt system we are in??? some people need to really look at themselves - you call yourself awake what a joke.

harsh words i know but they need to be said.

[minkton]

HI SCOOTIEP

ask your self a question? what are you actually doing to help and benfit humanity? Instead of having a look at others i look at yourselves make the change in YOU, that you want to see in the world.
get off your keyboard and get out there in the real world and do something about it instead of sitting here in front of your pc screen attacking others, boosting your own ego.

says get off your back sides and do something about what is going on in the world instead of sitting on your arse giving your opinions on people you dont like or resonate with, what does your opinion actually count for anyway??? its a waste of time and effort,

what are you doing to help the world? do you think words on a computer screen and opinions on people you have never met is going to take down the corrupt system we are in??? some people need to really look at themselves - you call yourself awake what a joke.

harsh words i know but they need to be said.

Who needed to hear these words?

[DarMar]

Hey great noticing Sebastasoul!

David is a fraud for shure and i think not unconsciously so if you ask me buying his books and listening his speech and giving him credibility should be evaded alot. He is just one of many with: "you just sit down and we will win war for you" words...
That lazyness act comes from various aspects of religinons same as DW new age religion, christianity, GFL....
It is a distract force on act.

Maybe instead working all day for money and buying his books for it than lying in bed and reading them could do actually something usefull.
WE SHOULD STOP SUPPORTING SYSTEM PROGRAM ASAP

- no banks/money
- no goverment or any leaders including spiritual ones
- no silly schooling for funny jobs
- no army
- no lazyness activities such as sitting in front of TV/youtube watching 3hrs blabberings or spending hours on reading useless books

IT IS PURE ACTING and you can act NOW

im there already waiting for you, out of the system rules. It is not theory if it can be done, i do it since i know for myself.

stop frigging listen to other ideas of saviours, no one will save you cause you came to earth to learn from pain!
there is no GFL floating into saving us, there is no financial law suit, there is no .. one day i wake up as a butterfly in 4D....

If you do not act, you do not deserve! simple as that.
So what all these davids do?
they "wake" you up to the point that you agree with teir opinnions and get hooked on their material like on drugs.

When you shoot yourself with heroin, there is extasy and after that short extasy is gone.. you are hungry for more..
When you shoot yourself with DW book, there is extasy and after that short extasy is gone.. you are hungry for more..
my question is: and difference is?
on the end one reading his material have to be calm (non active) in drugged stasis and while reading and even when finishes.. reader does one big NOTHING

except... waiting for new info, for more imagionation and santa claus to save the day

[schneider]

ever since david's death threat radio show with kerry casidy, i have been suspicious of both people. what most people were not aware of is that the anonymous caller on the show was some guy named jack, and both kerry and david knew this person well. however, they acted and let everyone in the audience think otherwise. many in the alternative media are starting to smell foul.

[andrewgreen]

Their is a lot of money to be made and I think David learnt a long time ago if you don't add a bit of filling to a story then you won't get as big a piece of the pie.
First rule of media give the audience what they want. Everybody in the alternative media is aware of this rule. If they were a master or enlightened then they wouldn't be doing the job they are.

[Peace of Mind]

IMHO, DW discredits himself because all of his predictions fell flat. I agree with some of the things he speaks about as far as spirituality but he kind of presents it as if it’s his own work… much of what he talks about has been known for ages. To be precise, I really haven’t learned anything new from him. However, many have learned from him and it’s normal they feel the need to support him because “HE” was the one that brought them some light. With that said, there are many light bearers in the world and the bulk of them rather do their greatest work instead of just talking about doing it. There’s an obvious difference. This is the year where the whistleblowers claims will be exposed for what they truly are. As of now…it’s not looking good for them at all. I just wish those that put their full faith in these guys will have enough strength left to pick themselves up, (again)…as such fail prophecies can easily rob people of their ambitions. I think much of the 2012 material is fashioned to stagnate the minds of the inspired, so when it’s clearly seen as being false…valuable time would have passed and another hidden agenda will be put in effect right under our noses. Regardless of the outcome or who is real or not, the truth in the matter is we are all in trouble and as soon as we realize this and pull together…all W.B., friends, family, will experience a life exactly the way we so vehemently talk about… there is no other way.

The journey isn’t over and there is still much work to do. The road to paradise isn’t free and it’s littered with obstacles, no one is going to carry you across it, the things we hold value to in life aren’t free…so why expect this to be any different? I suspect shame will fall on those knowing the world is in pain but do nothing to alleviate the suffering…other than waiting for E.T. and false Whistleblowers to show them what they already know.

DW or any other WB doesn’t need us to support them or discredit them. If they truly care about the masses they will present info that can be validated. Only a deceiver will push something that can’t be proven. Honestly, who in their right/logical mind will do this? Why? What will people do….other than what they are doing now? It’s a clever plan to idle someone, don't you think? Keep them pre-occupy, stroke their ego with false ideologies so they do nothing but blindly worship them instead of themself. At the same time disempower them with confustion and tales of fear. The coward will do nothing but look for the most comfortable excuse to live with, I see this all the time and it’s becoming very easy to spot. In actuality, there is nothing to fear but what you give that power of fear to...even then you can easily over come if you just simply choose to.

It just saddens me to see people constantly overlooking these simple facts. In case you didn’t know…. the world is the way it is now because we are so easy to fool. We should always demand transparency and logical evidence, it will be our mistake and fault if we fail to do so…there will be no one to blame but us. Our problems are created by us; they are created by allowing a hidden evil dictate how our lives should be, we will amount to nothing unless we realize this and step it up. We will always get what we deserve, what we put out is what we will receive. If you do nothing…what do you really expect to happen? The time for change is approaching fast. We will change, there is no doubt about that, but will it be for the best or for the worse…
As always… this depends on what YOU do

Peace

[scootiep]

HI SCOOTIEP

Who needed to hear these words?

somebody who is "awake" and who has knowledge to help humanity but they don't because they are to busy glued in front of their pc giving there opinions on individuals who are actually out there making a difference.

David Wilcock is making a difference trying to help humanity, so what if all of his information is not 100% you give me a name of one person who can say they have not been duped or proved wrong? we are all humans who make mistakes, at least David is using his time to trying to help.

there are far too many people on here that point fingers accusing people of this and that, no wonder there are people leaving this forum.

As I said before stop making opinions on people who are trying to make a difference - and be the change you want to see in the world, get out there and make a difference yourself, get off the pc, Charles was right in one thing when he said we are "keyboard warriors" a very true statement.

this forum was designed for like minded people to meet, form local groups, to CHANGE THE WORLD.

with all the knowledge we have here on Avalon, do you really think we are doing enough???

we are wasting time with threads like this!!

compare this thread to this one;

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?42046-Dare-you-to-WATCH-this-video--MUST-SEE--Uprising-Revolution-2012-against-NWO

only 4 replies???

just poves my point - shows you that there are too many keyboard warriors on here more prepared to make opinions and point fingers at others then to actually do something to make this world a better place.

[waves]

Thank you to everyone who responded lucidly and thoughtfully to the actual content and intention of my post. The extremities of other reactions and interpretations have been very interesting to observe, and so far are mostly about lots of things except the actual questions and observations listed.

For one, I don’t recall David ever mentioning these childhood symptoms, but songsfortheotherkind went into great symptom detail suggesting we should just be sympathetic towards David because he appears to have Asperger’s Syndrome. If so, then I assume you just forgot to mention that it’s also possible to suddenly get Asperger’s Syndrome in your 20’s immediately after a severe heroin addiction.

In the first paragraph I tried to immediately acknowledge “the people still offering empathy and support and seemingly feeling called to show a sense of loyalty to the insight and truth they felt they've resonated with in his work and lectures” so the rest of us could move on and discuss the rest of the content, but it didn’t work. Many responses only stated their pledge of allegiance completely ignoring all of the questions.

ljwheat was incensed that I repeated a point that I had stated months ago like… hey, you already said that and now “you’re starting a tribunal hearing on the man….. without David present”. Yes I did restate the 1 point plus the 10 additional points when my brain started overflowing with questions. Who in the public can't we talk about?? Isn't it not only our right but our job to compare notes and try to discern the truth? What specifics of the issues I posed do you feel have no validity being discussed?

Thank you especially to David Leahy, Jakovesk, Peace Of Mind and all the others unafraid to stand in opposition to those slamming the door to questions that challenge their heros or belief systems. Isn’t it odd that in a forum of supposedly ex-sheeple we still have to stand in separation for being questioners?

Thank you Aranuk for acknowledging the exact spirit I posted this with which I thought was the premise of Avalon:
“If we can quickly separate the wheat from the chaff it is in our best interests for humanity. Doing so seems to me the best thing we can do to prepare for things to come. So, this thread and others like it, gives us the opportunity the see clearer what is what.”

I am willing, even anxious to realize when I’m wrong about anything to get it over with and move on. I believe that helping separate the wheat from the chaff - especially as keyboard warriors where many are now looking for answers - IS part of the valuable work we can contribute when we see the opportunity.

[songsfortheotherkind]

For one, I don’t recall David ever mentioning these childhood symptoms, but songsfortheotherkind went into great symptom detail suggesting we should just be sympathetic towards David because he appears to have Asperger’s Syndrome. If so, then I assume you just forgot to mention that it’s also possible to suddenly get Asperger’s Syndrome in your 20’s immediately after a severe heroin addiction. Many responses only stated their pledge of allegiance completely ignoring all of the questions.

Ah, I see.

This is the only time I'm going to reply to this matter with you.

I did actually reply directly to two of your assertions, the one suggesting that his ability to recall and use vast amounts of information indicated possible programming and the other regarding his 'ego'. I did not mention the heroin aspect because it simply did not occur to me to do so- what difference does it make how an individual acquires an ability or unlocks one? I don't personally see heroin addiction as indicating any kind of thing that can be moralised or used as a platform of superiority of any kind- are you without error, frailty, vice?- although I find those words... *shrugs* So, you assumed that I was saying something that I did not because it suits your perspective. Ok. Here I am saying I did not suggest anything of the sort. I rebut your assertion. It was an inelegant one anyway. Let us be clear that I did not, in fact, ignore the questions, I simply directed my answer to ones that I thought were relevant.

You don't like David's work or person for various reasons, apparently based in part on your suspicions about his motives. Ok. You seem to have a need to convince others that your perspective is the correct and 'right' one and you use the same tactics that you decry in others to achieve this. Ok. I personally don't resonate with that approach and have found it to be a closed system that eventually kills everything that comes into its sphere. I'm interested in what works in terms of evolution and increasing the richness of the frequency.

I in turn have a question for you: what does your focus on David achieve? Can these things be 'proved' or 'disproved'? It has been my personal experience, as well as observational, that sometimes the utterance of a 'prediction' in and of itself immediately alters the course of events that were leading to the outcome predicted because *consciousness does things that are currently not fully understood*. Changing the consciousness around something immediately alters the elements that have been holding the previous state in place. Is this not something that is discussed in the 'awakening consciousness' community? I have found this principle to be active throughout the frequency, which is my way of expressing the ideas held in the 'as above, so below' saying, although to me it means that I look for signals that will hold in integrity throughout an entire frequency, not just limited parts of it, hence my perspective on the immediate changes that altering consciousness around *any* topic brings.

Perhaps sometimes these changes are not big enough to suit the demands of certain observers. In my 'Verse that's an issue to be explored by the observer, not an indication that there's something wrong with the principle, but then my 'Verse is always subjective and others are free to have whatever perspective suits them.

My personal pleasure is to find signals and principles that support in every way the Sui Generis of every sentient Being, Universal signals which delight in diversity, are not afraid of difference nor see it as a justifiable reason for removing another Being's inherent and Universal right to freedom of expression and personal evolution process (providing that these do not harm another Being, including limiting another Being's Sui Generis), feel no need whatsoever to impose one Sui Generis perspective onto any other individual or group, for whatever reason. You don't like that David makes his living from offering his perspectives? You are entirely free to *not* buy his books, go to his lectures, listen to his perspective and information. You find it difficult to embrace the concept that it's possible that many of the things such individuals speak of are capable of being in the space simultaneously? In my 'Verse that's an indication of one's *own* experience as a Being, not proof that someone else is 'up to something!'. There's nothing wrong with any of it; where things go pear shaped is when one Being decides that their personal perspective is THE way and that this must be agreed with, insisted upon, embraced or forced onto others. It makes no difference what that belief system is- the belief that one religion is superior over all others, one colour of skin, one world view, that 'scientific' is more meritorious and therefore superior to anything it deems NON-scientific, that the 'abled' group is superior to the 'disabled' group, that blonde hair and blue eyes are indications of superior genetics/that blonde hair and blue eyes are indications of belonging to a cabal/NWO, that disabled children are 'defective' and need to be exterminated/aborted/dealt with in some fashion, that homosexuals are a perversion and should be locked up/executed/drugged into submission...

Ugh. Blah. It makes me feel disgusting just to write these things, but that's just *me* and I fully understand that many currently inhabiting this planet vehemently and violently enforce their 'rights' to impose their perspectives on others. Even those that do not embrace such violence and actions still like to hold to their personal justifications for expressing the less tangible forms of the concept- 'I'm not being violent or prejudiced, I'm just saying-' and then they proceed to be both energetically.

In the context of a conscious evolution, it is not possible to dismiss 'energetic' actions as if they don't count, because the Heart Math Institute has demonstrated that they *do* and that it's the 'energetic' that is the most important. I personally have come to observe that if any individual truly wants to make a difference to what's going on, taking responsibility for, and bringing consciousness to the energy, intention, purpose and vision that they are putting out into the Universe at any moment is deeply powerful to the degree that the general population has no idea of. Can any one individual TRULY state, with absolute 100% certainty, what the motives, intentions and feelings are of another Being and so therefore the stating individual has the 'right' to judge? It is absolutely true that some individuals *will* think they have the right, and will absolutely exercise that right. It's my right not to engage with those individuals and seek something that resonates more with me, given how I see the Universe.

This is a conversation that for me expands out into quantum consciousness and I am aware that such a conversation is not the intention of this thread. I will end things here for that reason.

Thank you for this interaction and thread, it's been extremely helpful to me.

Peace and evolution.

[crested-duck]

Let me ask everyone to look at this DW situation from a slightly different perspective--We all believe and know how organizations are formed for only one reason, which is to achieve a desired goal which has been envisioned by the person/org. THAT IS SERVICE TO SELF !! Although most org.'s claim to be formed for the betterment of humanity as a whole. WHO EXACTLY BENEFITS THE MOST 99.999% OF THE TIME ??? Now it does'nt matter if it's masons,illuminatti, knights of columbus ,skull & bones, DW, Project Camelot, PA, Bill Wood, J. Maxwell, or mc donalds----Is the picture getting clearer for the newby's yet ? Have I held your hand and explained gently enough for all to accept this knowledge with a little of your own critical thinking being ignited at this point?? I'm not trying to be cocky, I'm just really confident this is the true answer ! DW's info is'nt new or original, just repackaged historical works. There's absolutely NOTHING new under the sun- only forgotten knowledge being reintroduced and repackaged for a new generation of ignorant and uneducated and unsuspecting humans.

[pyriel]

When I first started watching David Wilcock's video's, I found them really good. He is good at making what he is saying sound good and he is a very good researcher.. As of around a year ago, I really dont care for alot of his stuff.. Everything he is doing with fulford doesnt sit well. Part of it is it's nothing more then money being backed by something. so basically like the manipulated fiat money we have now, it's going to be manipulated money backed by gold or whatever. It's the same story with a few differences here and there.

For the past 3ish yrs, I see him preaching more and more on his book and movie.. To me he was/is more interested in making money which he is now doing with his book then anything now. He appears to be getting bad info/manipulated from alot of the trash he is talking about now. Now I dont believe every single work is a lie, I'm sure there are some truth but most of it sounds like crap now and not worry listening to anymore.

David may have done alot in the past but lately, not really. what he is putting out just sounds like different group trying to get control of the worlds money supply. Which I dont think is good and money is a joke anyways.

[pyriel]

HI SCOOTIEP

Who needed to hear these words?

somebody who is "awake" and who has knowledge to help humanity but they don't because they are to busy glued in front of their pc giving there opinions on individuals who are actually out there making a difference.

David Wilcock is making a difference trying to help humanity, so what if all of his information is not 100% you give me a name of one person who can say they have not been duped or proved wrong? we are all humans who make mistakes, at least David is using his time to trying to help.

there are far too many people on here that point fingers accusing people of this and that, no wonder there are people leaving this forum.

As I said before stop making opinions on people who are trying to make a difference - and be the change you want to see in the world, get out there and make a difference yourself, get off the pc, Charles was right in one thing when he said we are "keyboard warriors" a very true statement.

this forum was designed for like minded people to meet, form local groups, to CHANGE THE WORLD.

with all the knowledge we have here on Avalon, do you really think we are doing enough???

we are wasting time with threads like this!!

compare this thread to this one;

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?42046-Dare-you-to-WATCH-this-video--MUST-SEE--Uprising-Revolution-2012-against-NWO

only 4 replies???

just poves my point - shows you that there are too many keyboard warriors on here more prepared to make opinions and point fingers at others then to actually do something to make this world a better place.

No his info isnt 100% truth. I agree with that.. If a person did have the complete truth, things would be different..

It is not everyone's path to try and change anything. Doing that deals with politics cause you will have to go up against the government.. Some people's path will be to learn serveral different things then return to spread that to as many as they can. Basically Teachers. Tho I do agree there are alot of "keyboard warriors" and I wont deny that I'm one. I dont care for politics or any of that and is fairly hard for me to pick up tho I do know most of the constitution. Now other stuff I have picked up and learn massive amounts about which would be wild foods, living/surviving in the wild, gardening, etc etc.. Others will know this, this is very likely they're path..

So in the end, some have the purpose of trying to change the system for the better. Others are meant to hold knowledge on different things (gardening for one) and to spread it if everything crashes by returning to towns/cities and for those that get displaced and end up in the wild will likely learn from those that have lived in the wild for a while and have the knowledge/know-how .

I'm sure there are plenty of different paths people will take. To piss and moan about others is pointless.. It is they're choice and not your problem/business. You preach about david and others trying to help humanity and most here on avalon are just keyboard warriors.. I havent seen anything from you on how you maybe helping humanity so I guess your just another keyboard warrior? Telling others what they should be doing is not your place and interferes with they're free will..

[scootiep]

HI SCOOTIEP

Who needed to hear these words?

somebody who is "awake" and who has knowledge to help humanity but they don't because they are to busy glued in front of their pc giving there opinions on individuals who are actually out there making a difference.

David Wilcock is making a difference trying to help humanity, so what if all of his information is not 100% you give me a name of one person who can say they have not been duped or proved wrong? we are all humans who make mistakes, at least David is using his time to trying to help.

there are far too many people on here that point fingers accusing people of this and that, no wonder there are people leaving this forum.

As I said before stop making opinions on people who are trying to make a difference - and be the change you want to see in the world, get out there and make a difference yourself, get off the pc, Charles was right in one thing when he said we are "keyboard warriors" a very true statement.

this forum was designed for like minded people to meet, form local groups, to CHANGE THE WORLD.

with all the knowledge we have here on Avalon, do you really think we are doing enough???

we are wasting time with threads like this!!

compare this thread to this one;

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?42046-Dare-you-to-WATCH-this-video--MUST-SEE--Uprising-Revolution-2012-against-NWO

only 4 replies???

just poves my point - shows you that there are too many keyboard warriors on here more prepared to make opinions and point fingers at others then to actually do something to make this world a better place.

No his info isnt 100% truth. I agree with that.. If a person did have the complete truth, things would be different..

It is not everyone's path to try and change anything. Doing that deals with politics cause you will have to go up against the government.. Some people's path will be to learn serveral different things then return to spread that to as many as they can. Basically Teachers. Tho I do agree there are alot of "keyboard warriors" and I wont deny that I'm one. I dont care for politics or any of that and is fairly hard for me to pick up tho I do know most of the constitution. Now other stuff I have picked up and learn massive amounts about which would be wild foods, living/surviving in the wild, gardening, etc etc.. Others will know this, this is very likely they're path..

So in the end, some have the purpose of trying to change the system for the better. Others are meant to hold knowledge on different things (gardening for one) and to spread it if everything crashes by returning to towns/cities and for those that get displaced and end up in the wild will likely learn from those that have lived in the wild for a while and have the knowledge/know-how .

I'm sure there are plenty of different paths people will take. To piss and moan about others is pointless.. It is they're choice and not your problem/business. You preach about david and others trying to help humanity and most here on avalon are just keyboard warriors.. I havent seen anything from you on how you maybe helping humanity so I guess your just another keyboard warrior? Telling others what they should be doing is not your place and interferes with they're free will..

and its not your place to tell me what i should be doing! as you say free will so i should be able to say what i like when i like...

but yes i do agree it's not my place to be telling people what to do, its up to them what they choose to do in there life quest, but there comes a time when the people who say they are awake need to help as much as they can and creating pointless threads like this are a waste if time, create a thread that has purpose how can we change the world for the better, how can we get involved in helping people that need out help, how can we spread the world about the corruption and greed in the world, , your not going to change the world saying david wilcock is part of mk ultra or creating disinfo which i believe he isn't - not on purpose but maybe from some of his sources.

i try to do as much as i can by providing information to people, discussing things with people that they would'nt normally discuss about to make them think differently, recycle, try to use the car as least as possible, grow my own veg and fruit, help people in need, i donate to charities, i use green search engines, i try to buy shopping from local shops, i support edge media tv, i donate to the rspb, i'm a member of the lawful bank, i'm a vegetarian, i'm part of a local meditation/raising awareness group, i have been a member of this forum since 2010 and only posted 66 times because i choose to try and make a difference instead of being stuck on a pc giving pointless opinions on people

anyway i have said as much as i want now if you dont get the point i'm trying to make you never will.

[scotusa]

Maybe time to take a serious look at David Wilcock

I did a long time ago, but got ganged up on by his Avalonian Followers...

Some are so blind to the Truth, it still amazes me...

Go figure Hey...:noidea:

Hi Jackovesk, why stop at D Wilcock? Why not rate them all for believeability? With the growing volume of info to watch and digest a rating/ranking system might help people (me) prioritize their time better, especially the newcomers. Here is my "gut feeling" from their video interviews/commentary, face to face would be better but life is short. As of March 7 2012, in no particular order

Negative
R Hoagland-
B Brockbrader-
D Wilcock
J Kettler
A McCollum
G Green
J Lear
L Zagami-
S Greer

Neutral
K Cassidy
M Tsarion
G Noory
B Fulford
D O'Finioan

Positive
G Hancock+
B Ryan
S Webb+
B Dean+
C Stone+
D Icke
G Duff+
J Maxwell
K Dona
J Marrs
A Sutton+

If other members (say 25) document their opinions, maybe the Mod or another member can summarize when the numbers are there. Nothing like more than one brain.

Scotusa

¤=[Post Update]=¤

Well I guess I screwed that up, hopefully this formatted better

[Carmody]

God gives humans the truth.

"Does that not scare you?" god gloats.... to the Devil.

"On the contrary", says the Devil, "Now I will help them organize it."

[Star Tsar]

David Icke is number one for me Claus Dona is awesome and I just love his accent (Luddite).....
:peace:

[spuddie]

Hey Sebastasoul,

I have only come across DW recently within last the year and will keep watching him without judgement for now.....

Andrew Basiago however, I have only listened to the interview with Alfred Webre about humanoids on mars
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4ttNZfULQg&feature=plcp&context=C3951003UDOEgsToPDskKNjdVStX8eSQIUHmuTZufD
is completely out off his mind as far as I can tell. he is giving this detailed analysis of stuff that just isnt there...nuts...I looked at the picture while I listened.....he must be hallucinating....

I came to exactly the same conclusion when I saw the video months ago. You have to see and hear Basiago to believe it. It's not even as if the detail he comments on is open to interpretation, as can often be the case with photographic analysis, it's so obvious that everything he declares to be evidence of life is just a dumb rock. His perceptions are so phantasmagorical as to raise serious doubts about his mental state. Even Webre seemed nonplussed.

Ever since, I've taken everything that's come out of Basiago's mouth to be pure disinfo. I can imagine after that interview his handler having a few choice words with him: "Dammit Andy, did you have to say evey friggin' rock was a fossil? You came across as completely cuckoo!"

[Cilka]

Scotusa, don't you think that it would be a total waste of time to rate anybody based on the amount of disinfo he/she is presenting to the masses? In my opinion, people are taking the ET communicators way too seriously. People stop giving these ET humanoids too much credit otherwise they will never stop manipulating us. I think tHose who do volunteer to communicate with ET's are more likely to sell their souls than those who wish to use their own mind. I prefer to keep my soul as it is not worth anything that anyone could ever offer me for my soul. There has been a lot of bull being sold to people over the years through these ET messengers, but, we should not forget that they also teach us to finally trust our own higher self. Why do we need to listen to someone telling us that the only way for us to ascend is to do exactly what they say we should do.

Start trusting your higher selves; only you know what to do.

[scotusa]

Scotusa, don't you think that it would be a total waste of time to rate anybody based on the amount of disinfo he/she is presenting to the masses? In my opinion, people are taking the ET communicators way too seriously. People stop giving these ET humanoids too much credit otherwise they will never stop manipulating us. I think tHose who do volunteer to communicate with ET's are more likely to sell their souls than those who wish to use their own mind. I prefer to keep my soul as it is not worth anything that anyone could ever offer me for my soul. There has been a lot of bull being sold to people over the years through these ET messengers, but, we should not forget that they also teach us to finally trust our own higher self. Why do we need to listen to someone telling us that the only way for us to ascend is to do exactly what they say we should do.

Start trusting your higher selves; only you know what to do.

Hi Cilka
That is exactly the point of putting something down on paper, that which is your own "higher self (gut)" feelings about these people. Whether one wishes to believe any of their stuff is entirely a different matter. Very few are in it to learn about or spread the truth. Whether any of us are matured enough to believe any truth is debatable. Re-programming usually requires a "boot". Anyone who follows a "Sheperd" is liable to get coraled and slaughtered.
BTW read Kerry Cassidy's Project Camelot blog this morning, hilarious.

[renegadejr]

David has lived in a tough world being he has his gifts along with incredible intelligence. If you have ever actually talked to him or listened to him in person you would know he is a man for the people and this planet. Living such a life isnt easy in the time frame we are in, along with some of the people he had to work with to figure this whole mess out. No one is perfect otherwise we wouldn't need to be hear and learn anything but I believe that david is solid, along with bill, kerry, kettler, etc. Fulford also might not have been right %100 of the time but he isnt afraid of being wrong to find out the convoluted "truth" that we all have been living in. Its like a "2 steps forward and 1 back" type thing at times. They all definitely seem to be getting closer by the day now. Thank you for all your work folks. One light, one love, one earth

[9eagle9]

Very thoughtful and well put together chain of exploration there Sebatasoul. While Wilcock's work on autohypnosis is very good , and I tend to agree with it ; he doesn't seem to follow his own advice. Which I find peculiar. Realizing that wasn't his own information but was compiled from other sources still doesn't make me understand why he doesn't follow his own advice. If he ddin't believe in it why did he spend so much time compiling it? If he knows this stuff as he claims to and he's an expert on it why did he react the way he did when his buttons were pushed?

9. I frankly don't know what to think about David's extreme ad nauseum self-congratulatory egotism. Would it fit that it could be an insecure alter sort of proud of/congratulating the smart alter in him?...and that's how he can do it so unabashedly egomanaically? And was the Cayce part some software yahoo in psy-ops thinking "hey.. I got it!... the new age crowd will really buy this.."? It may even be child's play to have produced a baby with facial features for this future purpose. Or I'm just sick and tired of his ego.


It may not be as complex as that. Or could be I'm putting this out there as exploration not statements. If David is in fact programmed and its his audience--his fans-- that led me to suspect that, not him personally, but his fan club made me suspect perhaps something was running in the background there. A lot of emotional cording in during that time. Basically because of what you posted in regards to query no. 9. That is symptom of deep wounding. A program to cover a deep insecurity. Assuming another identity (Cayce) is a symptom of loss of true identity and insecurity. "I don't like myself very much, I'm not good enough the way I am so I'm to assume another's identity or another label for myself to give myself validity). This isn't necessary and its a red flag when a teacher has to pre-credential their teachings. It doesn't suffice the information stand on it's own merit. It's not good infomration coming from plain old David Wilcock, its only acceptable if it comes from the senstationalized Hollywood version.

The audience at large creates those scenarios. Not the person. We at large, exepct that the truth only come from famous public figures. No wonder Wilcock chose Cayce..if he didn't have the choice imposed on him.

He may not be aware he's doing this, consciously but to the observer it becomes obvious. Emotionally wounded people are most vulnerable to psy ops, regardless if comes from the street level or higher up. That's stuff thats very obviated. His stories do not support his behaviors or outward expressions. He claims he's a warrior. Three is nothing in his expression that supports that. Edgar Cayce never came across as warrior , did he? So Davids story doesn't prop up his reactions or his behaviors.

When he recieved that death threat he suddenly just abandoned everything he claims he knows about psy ops and programming and auto hypnosis (not following his own advice.) I find that peculiar.

What really weirded me out was the emotional reactions from his fan base. They were mirroring his. That is red flag right there that of some psyche operation in play. The inablity to seperate themselves from the person and whatever is occuring. Its like it was happening to them. That is a red flag. They can't detach. When you can't detach, there's something going on there. Self idenity confusion, which is another red flag.

What led me to suspect some operation was at work here was the emotional reaction of his fan base. That's a bit less speculative and more just about how the human psyche works. Emotionally wounded people are drawn to him, and get right in with his program. Based on similar wounds, lack of security, lack of identity. this how the guru is able to cord and connect with his audience and spread whatever program is running. What is debateable is that was done with delibration or not. This is just how human psyche works to begin with, but you can slide some 2nd or 3rd party in there to give that some leverage or manipulate for their own purposes. Emotionally wounded people who don't have a clear sense of their identity are most vulnerable to this.

As related in another thread consciousness effects DNA so you think hard enough that you are Cayce you begin to assume that resemblance. If you have an outside source very skilled in applying leverage a resembelance could be artifically manufactured. I think that is the least imporant thing about the whole thing. Those previously mentioned red flags were enough for me.

[pwn_thyself]

************

Holy molly!!!! I LOVE DAVID W and I LOVE EVERY ONE>>>> geez o weeeezzz. when are we going to agreee to disagreeee!!!!

much love to us all!!! over and out .....

I love everyone too, Kimberley, And i am enjoying the use of critical information reasoning skills here i think is both instructive and written by well intentioned posters who know their writing/posting voice.

agreeing to disagree won't get us anywhere, but questioning and humbly admitting our ignorances allow us to grow better at this "existing" game we be playin'

much love from siam

[pwn_thyself]

"i am willing, even anxious to realize when i'm wrong about anything..."

AMEN. I love being wrong, it leads me to the next thing. (which by virtue of "the grass is greener" phenomenon, the next thing is *always* cooler)

-><-

[Carmody]

critical reasoning faculties are good and all and are even, heaven forbid... necessary. The problem comes when ego has one act on such things - within the context of surety in and of the self.

[9eagle9]

The ego tends to assign a value like "this is negative or positive. Or good and bad". This really isn't about anyone being right or wrong, or good, or bad." If the OP's statement has an validity to it at all, its not even personal even.

Critical thinking skills are more efficiently employed if judgments of a ego, and the accompanying emotional values the ego assigns, stay out of it. One is observing behaviors then. And how those behaviors are not in alignment with what David is saying.

I don't love everyone therefore I have the impartiality that non-emotional involvement provides. If I loved him I wouldn't be able to be an observer anymore than if I hated him. Emotional attachments and the introduction of emotions doesn't have anything to do with the subject. It then makes a person a participant. Not an observer. Enevitably someone tries to make this about feelings, emotions and love.

That doesn't mean I hate everyone because I don't love them which is usually the tactic used to deploy or deflect the awful notion I don't love everyone. Apparently the perception that I hate everyone is more desireable than the fact I don't love everyone and that is a red flag on it's own.

Ego comfort.

Just putting it out there before someone starts deflecting.

[kcbc2010]

I think my "loyalty" comes from the fact that I learned a lot about "the actual system" and how things work from DW. I also don't tend to take everything he says as 100% truth. (Like his idea that Obama is really a good guy....seriously, where's the evidence on that on, David???) I've only listened to one of his podcasts/videos or interviews, so all I'm going by is the text that he gives. I really don't want my personal feelings of whether someone is or isn't not likable to keep me from learning and discerning the actual information. I like people who make complex information accessible to those of us who have a passing interest in some of the science and he's done a great job distilling the history in an interesting and readable way. He's a clever and cheeky writer and I just enjoy reading his stuff.

Yes, I wish that he wasn't always promoting his latest book or music, but I also get that's how he makes his money. Can't really fault the guy for trying to make a living. People have given me somethings to consider as I read more of his material and I thank you for your input.

[songsfortheotherkind]

While Wilcock's work on autohypnosis is very good , and I tend to agree with it ; he doesn't seem to follow his own advice. Which I find peculiar. Realizing that wasn't his own information but was compiled from other sources still doesn't make me understand why he doesn't follow his own advice. If he ddin't believe in it why did he spend so much time compiling it? If he knows this stuff as he claims to and he's an expert on it why did he react the way he did when his buttons were pushed?

From this I take it that because a) David is out there in the *public* and b) he's putting information out there that c) he's supposed to never, ever make a mistake, get triggered beyond his ability to handle, have frailties, or meet less than perfectly the standards that *others* are holding him to. If he *does* any of these things then obviously he's a fake, a disinformation agent, a programmed puppet and worthy of extreme suspicion, his messages to be dismissed.

Hmm. I shall now apply this theory to other famous/public figures. Ghandi was, in his personal life, an abusive asshat, not only to his wife and children but in his treatment of other individuals. He was obviously not walking his talk in those arenas, because he was known to become verbally and emotionally abusive. Therefore, we must absolutely dismiss the rest of his work and assume that he was some kind of disinformation agent as his imperfections obviously outweigh the purpose and intent of other elements of his Life Art. We can also dismiss Einstein's work (same reason), JFK, (adulterer and manipulator), Martin Luther King Jr (same-hmm, is there a pattern here?), Steve Jobs, Beethoven (his music is obviously worthless because in his personal life he was an unstable and sometimes violent, possibly bi-polar jerk)- oh, now we have to discount pretty much *all* music because even the stuff produced by individuals secluded in abbeys was produced by an individual prone to less than perfection, which means whatever lofty goals they were aspiring to are negated by said imperfections...

0-o Are *you* perfect? Do I get to dismiss your work because you're not? Do I now get to judge you when something comes up and presses a button that temporarily hits force 10 on the 'insane-o meter scale' because you didn't behave as together, appropriately or in whatever manner I feel you *should* have? Are you claiming that there is now nothing that can trigger you into temporary meltdown and that you will act appropriately and how others *think* you 'should' act at all times, no exceptions?

Wow. I have a very clear experience of the Multiverse, that physical death is simply a shift in Beingness, I've had contact with dead relatives and am fairly well versed in how it all works- and when I stood beside the coffin of my beloved and magical nine year old co-daughter, unable to touch her because her body was too charred from the fire she died in and so touching the coffin instead, my heart was shattering in grief, my body was curved over itself with the internal pain, my mind was befogged and the weight of the grief lasted almost two years. Oddly enough, it didn't feel any easier in 2010 when I repeated the process with my eldest daughter, my wild horse of a child, after she lost control of her car and died alone, pinned underneath the wreckage; as I arranged the flowers around her head and stroked her body, even while I was aware of her spirit somewhere else my heart felt like it was tearing apart and my grief spilled out like a wave into the space.

I was not the 'poster child' for however others feel death 'should' be dealt with. Does this mean I am a 'fake' and a failure, that what I have to offer is to be dismissed because in the moment of experiencing what was happening I was feeling my loss, my grief, my pain, my aching womb, wanting my daughters warm, laughing and in my arms, physically incarnate? Does my work now equate to nothing because something came along and I wasn't moving through the gathered crowds dispensing elegant and measured comfort or whatever else markers others have for being a poster child of whatever in such circumstances?

David freaked out. *You* apparently feel he 'shouldn't' have, being the individual he is, knowing what he knows, saying what he says, and because *you* feel this, and he somehow failed your personal test, this allows his work, purpose, intention to be brought into question- because you think he 'shouldn't' have freaked out, given his understanding of certain material and perspectives. Interesting. So, using this logic, the rule is 'if you know stuff, and can share it well, articulately, and you're good at what you do, you must never ever get triggered beyond your ability to deal with because that will indicate that you don't walk your talk perfectly'.

You know what this reminds me of? The historical record of homo sapiens and their love/hate relationships with their 'gods' (and their 'gods' love/hate relationship with them)- lots of elevating and crashing down, the village mob happy to have the professor in the castle banging away until he does something outside their comfort zone and then out with the burning torches, brandished pitchforks and self righteous indignation. Same old, same old, same old, eon after eon, one evolutionary attempt after another, and it all comes back to the same old rationalisations and behaviours as dear ole grandpappy nine hundred times removed came up with. It's the fodder of gossip magazines and the 'famous', lifting them up and tossing them down based on a myriad of external 'shoulds' , justified because the individual concerned has asked for it by having the temerity to put themselves out there.

Hmm. Is this a disincentive operation for those here who might be considering putting their own works out, in whatever small way they are called to? Is it a way of warning others NOT to do that? We are, after all, a group that in general takes the business of being aware of our imperfections as an important one, so what better place to put the 'fear of going public because we're not perfect' into the energy? You know, I could probably work that perspective up into a nice piece of work, that all those who are critical of others are disinformation agents here to quash any inclination towards one putting one's work out into the public arena- after all, we know *first hand* how much of our target audience is going to take it (because many are getting to the place where they want to make films/produce works talking about what might be possible *after* the shift, and hey, that's really putting ourselves out there, and we're not perfect, so hmmm, maybe best to just sit back in the shadows, keep things quiet and small...).

I won't be doing that though. Do you know why? Because personally, I find that sort of thing does absolutely nothing to contribute to the energy that I'm looking to hold space for; I don't get anything from holding that energy, I'm much more into co-creation and joyous possibility than tearing down the work of others, as imperfect as they are, I'm not interested in same old, same old, same old, and because I find it really boring. I don't do things I find boring.

Some might suggest that this post is holding the space for those lower vibration energies. *shrugs* The mirror can be experienced like that, for sure- it can also be experienced in myriads of other ways, which is what I'm interested in. I was moved to make this reply because I've personally experienced being in spaces that others could have judged me as 'not walking my talk' in; part of my 'talk' is not being afraid to feel and express what I'm feeling in such moments. I'm really loud when I have sex, too. I roll around in delight sometimes at the taste of different words in my mouth. I love the feel of things on my skin and the sensations of certain things can temporarily shut down my thinking processes just from the sheer bliss of feeling what I'm feeling. Being prepared to be snotty, grotty, inelegant, sweaty, fragile, imperfect, a hag, a crone, vulnerable, 'inappropriate' and generally evolving- even if I'm doing it with the grace of an octopus wearing rollerblades on ice- is how I personally approach physical incarnation. It's one of the reasons I LOVE physical incarnation- it's not neat and refined, it's where I play, this bridge between chaos and order.

So here I am as a representative for the snotty, grotty, inelegant, sweaty, fragile, imperfect, haggish, cronish, vulnerable, 'inappropriate', gloriously evolving, insanely beautiful and brave, bloodied but not bowed, those who know what it's like to be beaten to their knees by their own imperfections and who hold out against the fear, the mind virus, the internal and external condemnations, the constant pressure to quit, to give up the vision- who slowly climb back to their feet, take a deep breath, hold their essence like a tiny courageous candle in front of them and continue moving forward, however uncertain it may appear to an observer. I have been the target of the judgements of others before and no doubt I'll experience it again and my ability or inclination to be concerned about that is diminishing the more brightly my understanding of Sui Generis shines. I'd much rather journey with those that claim no perfection and who I know to be the kind that will weather their own storms bravely, will never give up on the process, will never give up on me in my imperfection; a ragtag bunch who knows how to hold fast for themselves and each other, who doesn't demand perfection in the process of evolving, who don't see the momentary breakdown as a sign of corruption. These are my family, my kin, my companions; they're the ones I'm looking to journey with.


It may not be as complex as that. Or could be I'm putting this out there as exploration not statements. If David is in fact programmed and its his audience--his fans-- that led me to suspect that, not him personally, but his fan club made me suspect perhaps something was running in the background there. A lot of emotional cording in during that time.

Ah, there goes Jesus then, because frankly, in general his followers suck. Talk about freaky and unevolved! And what's with all that talking in tongues, hysteria and the KILLING in the name of 'god'? Obviously there's something wrong with Jesus to inspire that sort of crap in his followers. If we're using these rules, that is. Hmm, better include David Wolfe in there too, some of his followers are incredible groupies, and others are obviously nutters. So scratch David. And obviously Bill is on that list too, because have you seen some of the stuff that people on his board write? Clearly wack-a-doodle *rolls eyes* so he must be a disinfo agent as well.

Is there a useless pattern emerging here? It seems so to me, but then I'm weird like that...


This isn't necessary and its a red flag when a teacher has to pre-credential their teachings. It doesn't suffice the information stand on it's own merit. It's not good infomration coming from plain old David Wilcock, its only acceptable if it comes from the senstationalized Hollywood version.

Yep, that's Jesus again- information from 'my Father'? If that isn't pre-credentialing, then what is? Obviously not good enough to just be plain old Jesus the carpenter's son...


Emotionally wounded people are most vulnerable to psy ops, regardless if comes from the street level or higher up.

And this is where I bow and step out of the conversation, because I haven't ever, ever met anyone who *isn't*- or at least hasn't been- in one way or another emotionally wounded by their experiences here in this incarnation process. I cannot claim a space of emotional perfection or serenity by which I can definitively state I am henceforth immune from any kind of emotional freakout if new and previously untriggered buttons are pushed. I cannot definitely state that I am perfectly free of any lurking emotional black holes that might spring out of the jack in the box in the future, so using the logic quoted, I'm therefore obviously vulnerable to psy-ops and thus unsafe to be around, all my work is suspect, and I must be watched like a hawk so that any deviation from the external expectations and requirements of others can be leapt upon, dissected and held up triumphantly as proof that I am irrelevant. Clearly, I'm in the wrong environment.

*scrubbles her grubby bare feet on the ground, sticks twigs in her hair, shifts slightly out of this dimension and dances a little, grinning*

Shucks, somehow I'm not feeling bad about that. I don't need David to be perfect, I don't need me to be either- frankly I get jittery around those who need others to be anything at all. I can take or leave David's- or anyone else's- Art, just as others can take or leave mine, and I can also simultaneously be deeply appreciative that David is out there, doing what he's doing, in the face of his own frailty and imperfection. That takes courage, regardless of how others might judge it. I'm curious enough about David's energetic signature to want to meet him in person; if that happens, groovy, if not, groovy. I'm prepared to walk my Sui Generis talk, while holding my alert awareness (because yes, some individuals *are* bad news if you let them be), and I am satisfied with being open to others until it becomes clear that they are holding harmful intention towards me or those I love: when that happens I'll figure out what I want to do about it based on the unique parameters of the situation. Other than that, I can focus on my own path, focus on what *I* am putting out into the space, hold the signal that I'm interested in and find others who like to dance with their bare feet in the dirt, their eyes full of possibility and their hearts open to the Sui Generis in everything, no matter how odd (or pointy eared, or non-human, or raw, or grubby) that might look.

That's just me.

[9eagle9]

Let's see. No I'm not perfect. I'm not out in the public eye claiming perfection nor claiming to be a light warrior either so when someone proves without a shadow of doubt that I'm not a light warrior, I don''t have to be publicly humiliated b...because I didn't make those claims.

David created his own situation. Rumor is that some people wanted to call out his claims of being a warrior who was gong to kick the ptbs ass.

And when they did he reacted in the very way that substantiated he was not anything of what he claimed to be. Appears that he got his arse kicked.

Some warrior.

[modwiz]

Let's see. No I'm not perfect. I'm not out in the public eye claiming perfection nor claiming to be a light warrior either so when someone proves without a shadow of doubt that I'm not a light warrior, I don''t have to be publicly humiliated b...because I didn't make those claims.

David created his own situation. Rumor is that some people wanted to call out his claims of being a warrior who was gong to kick the ptbs ass.

And when they did he reacted in the very way that substantiated he was not anything of what he claimed to be. Appears that he got his arse kicked.

Some warrior.

David is no warrior. Priest mode at the strongest and I see Scholar with a touch of Sage with his drama stuff as a real possibility. There is no shame in not being a warrior, just as there is no shame in not being a genius. We all have our parts to play. As a public figure, David will have to endure outrageous slings and arrows. It is all part of being famous and having your book make the Times Best Seller List. Having a book on the top of a pile of dung like that list is an odd desire IMO. Quiet abundance and and making a living do not require such notoriety.

9eagle9, you are just so hard core. LOL

[songsfortheotherkind]

And when they did he reacted in the very way that substantiated he was not anything of what he claimed to be. Appears that he got his arse kicked.

Some warrior.

Because warriors never get their arse kicked? Oh.

See, in my part of the hologram, warriors do get their arses kicked at times- they then learn from it, grow, become more skilled, and continue on.

I take it that your view is because he got his arse kicked, we should all kick him because obviously he's not a warrior, he's fallen, which no *real* warrior would be, so therefore he and his work are invalid? Because he created something really big for himself to live into and the Universe showed him where he needed to live into that more?

Uh, ok. So we should never create a vision bigger than ourselves, and *especially* not in the public realm, lest we fall short of such a vision and thus be torn to pieces by the angry mob? Because, you know, the mob can't tolerate it when those in the public show themselves in fragility and because these ones have DARED to hold their vision in the public arena (which we *all know* means that they think they are better than we are) they are absolutely deserving of the public dismemberment.

Mmm. No matter which way I'm moving this logic around, it's not getting any less ugly. *tosses the logic over my shoulder with a shrug* Not something that works for me.

*wanders off to find something more joyous*

[modwiz]

critical reasoning faculties are good and all and are even, heaven forbid... necessary. The problem comes when ego has one act on such things - within the context of surety in and of the self.

Ya wanna try that in plain English, buddy? :p

[songsfortheotherkind]

David is no warrior. Priest mode at the strongest and I see Scholar with a touch of Sage with his drama stuff as a real possibility. There is no shame in not being a warrior, just as there is no shame in not being a genius. We all have our parts to play. As a public figure, David will have to endure outrageous slings and arrows.

No shame in anything, yes yes yes. Learning, evolution, embracing the unknown be it within us our without, *flaps hands at the 'we are all One' philosophy, yes yes I get it *and* there's plenty of unknown within our experience*- no shame. Shame cripples evolution.


It is all part of being famous and having your book make the Times Best Seller List. Having a book on the top of a pile of dung like that list is an odd desire IMO. Quiet abundance and and making a living do not require such notoriety.

This is entirely subjective. Perhaps his intention and purpose is to not be small, to be a voice in a larger arena than most are prepared to be, to reach out to as many as possible with his perspective. Perhaps rejoicing that one's 'awakening' topic book makes it to the top of a 'pile of dung like that' is to rejoice that so many more are now embracing such messages than have been present before, sending the signal out so that it can be picked up, utilised, transformed, by those who previously may not have been prepared to hold space for such things.

Does it matter that the way such individuals respond to the signal might not meet the 'standards' of others? Not in my multiverse.

Is it possible to get over the moral judgement about those whose work makes them more public than others? Can 'public' and 'notoriety' not be morally applied words? That would be really interesting, because then we'd all be free to respond to whatever promptings of spirit and essence we're led to without having to make our skin like diamond in defense against our fellow 'awakeners'...

[highlyter]

Expressing concern is always enough. It can be accomplished without dissecting a person and their human'ness and imperfections. Just isn't productive, except possibly to polish or ante up egoic structures. Do feelings override knowledge or vice versa?

There isn't any ONE person on the Planet that always gets it all right in all ways. Whew..it can be a jungle out here... :confused:

Sincerety matters. Alex, David, David, Bill, Bill, Inelia, Kerry, You, Me.. our perceptions are all that WE have to share and agree or disagree on. Resonation is often underrated!

Tossing "EGO" into anything is born from one's own. Take from anything ONLY that which makes you shine brightly. Thank the rest and lay it aside. "There's nothing more powerful than beauty in a wicked world." --Amos Lee / Soul Suckers.

NOW = the only moment to look for and FIND the beauty in all. May we all SIMPLY focus on loving and makingourselves available to the ginormous heart-felt coherence field.


Much love... Truly a spectacular day for energies.. Solar and Lunar.
Breathe.

[modwiz]

David is no warrior. Priest mode at the strongest and I see Scholar with a touch of Sage with his drama stuff as a real possibility. There is no shame in not being a warrior, just as there is no shame in not being a genius. We all have our parts to play. As a public figure, David will have to endure outrageous slings and arrows.

No shame in anything, yes yes yes. Learning, evolution, embracing the unknown be it within us our without, *flaps hands at the 'we are all One' philosophy, yes yes I get it *and* there's plenty of unknown within our experience*- no shame. Shame cripples evolution.


It is all part of being famous and having your book make the Times Best Seller List. Having a book on the top of a pile of dung like that list is an odd desire IMO. Quiet abundance and and making a living do not require such notoriety.

This is entirely subjective. Perhaps his intention and purpose is to not be small, to be a voice in a larger arena than most are prepared to be, to reach out to as many as possible with his perspective. Perhaps rejoicing that one's 'awakening' topic book makes it to the top of a 'pile of dung like that' is to rejoice that so many more are now embracing such messages than have been present before, sending the signal out so that it can be picked up, utilised, transformed, by those who previously may not have been prepared to hold space for such things.

Does it matter that the way such individuals respond to the signal might not meet the 'standards' of others? Not in my multiverse.

Is it possible to get over the moral judgement about those whose work makes them more public than others? Can 'public' and 'notoriety' not be morally applied words? That would be really interesting, because then we'd all be free to respond to whatever promptings of spirit and essence we're led to without having to make our skin like diamond in defense against our fellow 'awakeners'...

You read me wrong. I support him in anything he wants to do and salute him for his contributions to us. We are enriched by having him. I do reserve the right to have a personal opinion and 'take' on things. It's an 'if I were in his shoes' thing and I may certainly have a judgement about myself in his circumstance.

Take deep breaths. It helps.

[songsfortheotherkind]

You read me wrong. I support him in anything he wants to do and salute him for his contributions to us. We are enriched by having him. I do reserve the right to have a personal opinion and 'take' on things. It's an 'if I were in his shoes' thing and I may certainly have a judgement about myself in his circumstance. Take deep breaths. It helps.

That was fail on my part to delineate between my response to the bits of your post I was directly responding to (the yes yes bit) and the next bit, which was more a response to a broader elemental theme I've observed playing out across the forum. So I was doing the staring off into space, handwaving, hyperfocus response, not personal. I was talking in the complete frequency, not specific. Note to Self- remember the arena I'm in! *lol*

And I do breathe. :D I fully get that writing is subjectively interpreted and so my passion or glee can sometimes look like ranting to others:what we need is something like Edward de Bono's Pattern Language icons, so that we can preface different bits of our posts with emoticons that more specifically flag our purpose and intent in writing, without having to preface our writing with several paragraphs of explanation. That would be really cool.

Although I didn't get the 'if I were in his shoes' aspect from what you wrote, that wasn't clear at all. It did read as though you were looking at his personal choices and finding them wanting.

[modwiz]

You read me wrong. I support him in anything he wants to do and salute him for his contributions to us. We are enriched by having him. I do reserve the right to have a personal opinion and 'take' on things. It's an 'if I were in his shoes' thing and I may certainly have a judgement about myself in his circumstance. Take deep breaths. It helps.

That was fail on my part to delineate between my response to the bits of your post I was directly responding to (the yes yes bit) and the next bit, which was more a response to a broader elemental theme I've observed playing out across the forum. So I was doing the staring off into space, handwaving, hyperfocus response, not personal. I was talking in the complete frequency, not specific. Note to Self- remember the arena I'm in! *lol*

And I do breathe. :D I fully get that writing is subjectively interpreted and so my passion or glee can sometimes look like ranting to others:what we need is something like Edward de Bono's Pattern Language icons, so that we can preface different bits of our posts with emoticons that more specifically flag our purpose and intent in writing, without having to preface our writing with several paragraphs of explanation. That would be really cool.

Although I didn't get the 'if I were in his shoes' aspect from what you wrote, that wasn't clear at all. It did read as though you were looking at his personal choices and finding them wanting.

My bad for not stating what I hope would be an obvious insert here. It would be very unfair of me, and personally embarrassing, to criticize someone who works as hard as he does to bring us such brilliant work. I have a deep personal dislike for things like the NYT BSL. On most weeks it is a list of complete crap. Well written emotional distractions when it is good and psychopathic power porn at its' worst. Some really good books have found their way there. It is the dynamics of market forces.

Let me end this with affirming the very positive contributions DW provides us all and wanting only happiness for him in his pursuits.

Did I miss any nuances this time? :confused:

[Sierra]

critical reasoning faculties are good and all and are even, heaven forbid... necessary. The problem comes when ego has one act on such things - within the context of surety in and of the self.

Ya wanna try that in plain English, buddy? :p

I think he said when ego has one act on such things ... that when one is so sure of one's self, one's critical reasoning faculties, that one is blind to the ego driven action one is actually performing?

It is hard to tell with Carmody's subtlety sometimes ... <snickering> :rolleyes:

[modwiz]

critical reasoning faculties are good and all and are even, heaven forbid... necessary. The problem comes when ego has one act on such things - within the context of surety in and of the self.

Ya wanna try that in plain English, buddy? :p

I think he said when ego has one act on such things ... that when one is so sure of one's self, one's critical reasoning faculties, that one is blind to the ego driven action one is actually performing?

It is hard to tell with Carmody's subtlety sometimes ... <snickering> :rolleyes:

Thanks Sierra. I follow the words.. I wanted to have a little fun with him.

[songsfortheotherkind]

My bad for not stating what I hope would be an obvious insert here. It would be very unfair of me, and personally embarrassing, to criticize someone who works as hard as he does to bring us such brilliant work. I have a deep personal dislike for things like the NYT BSL. On most weeks it is a list of complete crap. Well written emotional distractions when it is good and psychopathic power porn at its' worst. Some really good books have found their way there. It is the dynamics of market forces.

Let me end this with affirming the very positive contributions DW provides us all and wanting only happiness for him in his pursuits. That is a great affirmation, may it come back onto you many fold.


Did I miss any nuances this time? :confused:

*laughing* no, no, I think we're getting the nuance thing down really well, don't you? *waves hands in slightly self mocking woo-woo fashion* :D

[9eagle9]

Danvd is no warrior . Neither was Edgar Cayce. You may be a bit more close to the core of it with Scholar and Sage.

When David accepts that for himself he may find he doen't create those situations for himself that he just recently experienced.

Again quiet abundance and making a living that way seems to be a jarring opposing value to what he claims to stand for.

Why wait for some governtment official to return all our gold to us when the obviated fact of the matter is no one has any evidence that gold ever belonged to us in the first place. Dig a hole in the ground and give it back to mother as far as I'm concerned that's not abundance drawing its rationalization based in ego. Why wait for anyone to return anything to you at all.

A matter of observing what one says and what one does and how one principal exhaled from the right hand opposes the one that has isssued from the left hand.

Not hard core, just grateful every damn day someone up there gave me the wits to notice this hinky dinky for myself and not flinch for what I'm seeing.



Let's see. No I'm not perfect. I'm not out in the public eye claiming perfection nor claiming to be a light warrior either so when someone proves without a shadow of doubt that I'm not a light warrior, I don''t have to be publicly humiliated b...because I didn't make those claims.

David created his own situation. Rumor is that some people wanted to call out his claims of being a warrior who was gong to kick the ptbs ass.

And when they did he reacted in the very way that substantiated he was not anything of what he claimed to be. Appears that he got his arse kicked.

Some warrior.

David is no warrior. Priest mode at the strongest and I see Scholar with a touch of Sage with his drama stuff as a real possibility. There is no shame in not being a warrior, just as there is no shame in not being a genius. We all have our parts to play. As a public figure, David will have to endure outrageous slings and arrows. It is all part of being famous and having your book make the Times Best Seller List. Having a book on the top of a pile of dung like that list is an odd desire IMO. Quiet abundance and and making a living do not require such notoriety.

9eagle9, you are just so hard core. LOL

[Carmody]

I'm thinking of starting a thread called:

"Time to take a serious look at the people who bitch about David Wilcock."

I'm barely half joking. Barely.

This post/comment is attached to no particular person or post in this thread. it is attached to the extension of ego that makes people think that they need to gather swords and rescue people against their will from imaginary problems.

Let me put it this way: if some part of the world were to grab everything that David says and fly completely out of control on situations concerning that data...if this where to happen the world would be a batter place.

If you think you are in this thread using tissue paper and cleaning dirty little backsides up and organizing them..well...understand that we have not even sat down to take a dump yet, nor are our collective stomachs and innards even remotely full of food.

so... RELAX.

Chill.

Go find something functional to bitch about. something, some behavior... that has a future and is useful.

[9eagle9]

Och my children , my beloved. \ Turn a blind eye to anything that is remotely going to assign you the label of egotistical. Turn the other cheek if you see something hinky after all its that nasty little ego of yours. Use your intuition but understand if it sees something that isn't all flowers and its ..its your EGO. It magickally transforms from intuition to Ego in an instant the moment you open your mouth!

Don't ever identify anything going on in the world thats just not right, the world that you live in and we all share, because if you do..its' the EGO. Don't even talk about the notion that someone might be amiss. You have to believe every word they say without question because if you don't ...its your ego! Don't even use those critical thinking skills ......that is the ego.

ssssst don't talk about it.

What ever gave you the idea that you could about an alleged whistleblowers credibility in a forum arranged around ....whistleblowing. Where did you ever??!!! From your ego that's where!!!

If you are examining anything that might possibly be a bit suspicious to you, that's your ego and you are hysterical and need to chill out. You're uptight because you seen something that didn't quite add up. Would you ego maniacs poke your eyes out pleeeeeeeez so we our own egos are not triggered by your well put together, thoughtful and critical thinking ego-centric skills!!!

Enough! What kind of forum do you think you're in anyway??!!


Don't you even dare mention against the fact there's a David Wilcock glowing report posted several times a week and or even suggest you might be tired of those. That is coming from YOUR ego!! If you are as equally tired of David Wilcocks shadow looming over every alternative media topic, you have to understand that the people who are tired of you being tired of David Wilcocks have priority because THEY aren't coming from the ego.

Like you are.

Psssst. Don't you dare rebuttal my post, that is your ego prompting you to do it.

Don't you thank it either, that's your ego.

Don't do anything.

If you have the answer quietly raise your hand and put it over your mouth.





I'm thinking of starting a thread called:

"Time to take a serious look at the people who bitch about David Wilcock."

I'm barely half joking. Barely.

This post/comment is attached to no particular person or post in this thread. it is attached to the extension of ego that makes people think that they need to gather swords and rescue people against their will from imaginary problems.

Let me put it this way: if some part of the world were to grab everything that David says and fly completely out of control on situations concerning that data...if this where to happen the world would be a batter place.

If you think you are in this thread using tissue paper and cleaning dirty little backsides up and organizing them..well...understand that we have not even sat down to take a dump yet, nor are our collective stomachs and innards even remotely full of food.

so... RELAX.

Chill.

Go find something functional to bitch about. something, some behavior... that has a future and is useful.

[Sebastion]

Oh my goodness.....I ain't sayin nothing!........I can't.....rofl!




Och my children , my beloved. \ Turn a blind eye to anything that is remotely going to assign you the label of egotistical. Turn the other cheek if you see something hinky after all its that nasty little ego of yours. Use your intuition but understand if it sees something that isn't all flowers and its ..its your EGO. It magickally transforms from intuition to Ego in an instant the moment you open your mouth!

Don't ever identify anything going on in the world thats just not right, the world that you live in and we all share, because if you do..its' the EGO. Don't even talk about the notion that someone might be amiss. You have to believe every word they say without question because if you don't ...its your ego! Don't even use those critical thinking skills ......that is the ego.

ssssst don't talk about it.

What ever gave you the idea that you could about an alleged whistleblowers credibility in a forum arranged around ....whistleblowing. Where did you ever??!!! From your ego that's where!!!

If you are examining anything that might possibly be a bit suspicious to you, that's your ego and you are hysterical and need to chill out. You're uptight because you seen something that didn't quite add up. Would you ego maniacs poke your eyes out pleeeeeeeez so we our own egos are not triggered by your well put together, thoughtful and critical thinking ego-centric skills!!!

Enough! What kind of forum do you think you're in anyway??!!


Don't you even dare mention against the fact there's a David Wilcock glowing report posted several times a week and or even suggest you might be tired of those. That is coming from YOUR ego!! If you are as equally tired of David Wilcocks shadow looming over every alternative media topic, you have to understand that the people who are tired of you being tired of David Wilcocks have priority because THEY aren't coming from the ego.

Like you are.

Psssst. Don't you dare rebuttal my post, that is your ego prompting you to do it.

Don't you thank it either, that's your ego.

Don't do anything.

If you have the answer quietly raise your hand and put it over your mouth.





I'm thinking of starting a thread called:

"Time to take a serious look at the people who bitch about David Wilcock."

I'm barely half joking. Barely.

This post/comment is attached to no particular person or post in this thread. it is attached to the extension of ego that makes people think that they need to gather swords and rescue people against their will from imaginary problems.

Let me put it this way: if some part of the world were to grab everything that David says and fly completely out of control on situations concerning that data...if this where to happen the world would be a batter place.

If you think you are in this thread using tissue paper and cleaning dirty little backsides up and organizing them..well...understand that we have not even sat down to take a dump yet, nor are our collective stomachs and innards even remotely full of food.

so... RELAX.

Chill.

Go find something functional to bitch about. something, some behavior... that has a future and is useful.

[9eagle9]

Are YOU laughing?!

Ego ego ego. We all know how much fun the ego is.

[Sierra]

critical reasoning faculties are good and all and are even, heaven forbid... necessary. The problem comes when ego has one act on such things - within the context of surety in and of the self.

Ya wanna try that in plain English, buddy? :p

I think he said when ego has one act on such things ... that when one is so sure of one's self, one's critical reasoning faculties, that one is blind to the ego driven action one is actually performing?

It is hard to tell with Carmody's subtlety sometimes ... <snickering> :rolleyes:

Well, you and I may *think* we get it perhaps rhetorical is better. :becky:

[jaybee]

I'm thinking of starting a thread called:

"Time to take a serious look at the people who bitch about David Wilcock."

I'm barely half joking. Barely.

This post/comment is attached to no particular person or post in this thread. it is attached to the extension of ego that makes people think that they need to gather swords and rescue people against their will from imaginary problems.

Let me put it this way: if some part of the world were to grab everything that David says and fly completely out of control on situations concerning that data...if this where to happen the world would be a batter place.

If you think you are in this thread using tissue paper and cleaning dirty little backsides up and organizing them..well...understand that we have not even sat down to take a dump yet, nor are our collective stomachs and innards even remotely full of food.

so... RELAX.

Chill.

Go find something functional to bitch about. something, some behavior... that has a future and is useful.

bolded above.....I hear you Carmody....and very well said.


I am of the opinion that David Wilcock and Kerry Cassidy are major targets for the psyops crew in 2012, in our little neck of the woods... (that began in ernest with the awful Brockbrader character)


But a new thread is probably not necessary.....much of the info needed for a serious look at them is in this thread....

:photo:


;)


.

[songsfortheotherkind]

I'm thinking of starting a thread called:

"Time to take a serious look at the people who bitch about David Wilcock."

I'm barely half joking. Barely.

Note to Self: stop drinking tea while reading threads. *wipes screen again, smorfling*


Go find something functional to bitch about. something, some behavior... that has a future and is useful.

:)

[highlyter]

[QUOTE=Sebastion;444994]Oh my goodness.....I ain't sayin nothing!........I can't.....rofl!


everytime i read "rofl" I hear scooby doo trying to say waffle

What would scooby do? ;)

Rich Soul Food.

[waves]

I'm thinking of starting a thread called:

"Time to take a serious look at the people who bitch about David Wilcock."

I'm barely half joking. Barely.


To paraphrase and add to what 9eagle9 aptly pointed out, why isn't a new thread far more aptly:

"Time to take a serious look at the people in a forum dedicated to discussing the validity of whistleblowers who bitch about anyone who wants to discuss the validity of whistleblowers."

[Mike]

I'm thinking of starting a thread called:

"Time to take a serious look at the people who bitch about David Wilcock."

I'm barely half joking. Barely.


To paraphrase and add to what 9eagle9 aptly pointed out, why isn't a new thread far more aptly:

"Time to take a serious look at the people in a forum dedicated to discussing the validity of whistleblowers who bitch about anyone who wants to discuss the validity of whistleblowers."


well, seeing as though there are 97 posts here, and only 1 person is "bitching about the people who want to discuss the validity of whistleblowers" , simple mathematics would dictate that your creative idea wouldn't work here:)

but it was funny, i'll have to concede that.

though i wouldn't call what Carmody was doing here "bitching". i won't define bitching here because that would just be obnoxious, but i will say that i'm quite familiar with it, having had 3 failed relationships in 6 months that were mostly my fault, 2 expressive sisters, and a mother who is not afraid to tell me when i'm acting like an a@@hole.

based on my extensive experience, i simply can't give his post the 5 star bitch rating you've judged it to be; maybe a 1 and a half, at best.

i will say this: if I could have 'thanked' his post 10 times, i would have happily done so.

[nonesuch]

Over several years, David Wilcock has coined his brand as an easy going intellectual with extraordinary gifts to share with us. He comes across as a cheerful guy who rarely shies away from a self compliment but is authentically on the side of humanity.

He maintains rapport with his fans through humor, his love of mystery and his casual accessibility. Whether he's consciously self-critical about it or not, he makes no bones about holding mainstream personal ambitions—in music, film and books (Is Broadway in the mix yet?)—while developing and presenting his spiritual, psychic and historical knowledge.

Not long ago he began doling out insider-selected prime cuts, initially tossing mere morsels as snacks into our watering mouths, then after a few weeks, serving them cafeteria style in steaming, super-sized portions no one could finish in one meal. Now there’s a whole cow sitting on his website.

I don't recall having read any one piece David had written about his vulnerabilities, fears and failures. Honestly, he may have, probably within other articles, but if he did and I read it, I’ve forgiven or forgotten it by now. Down and dirty is not his schtick. I like him for that.

I was surprised in a big fat way on Kerry’s show that as he began talking about the death threat, instead of invoking transcendence and vision, he crumbled like a cookie in a child’s lunch bag. My immediate reaction to the awkward drama was to squawk to myself, ‘False advertising! This product is defective!".

He panicked in the precise way he’d repeatedly urged his readers not to. My estimation was that he’d made publishing and marketing a priority over maintaining a balance of teaching and practice. He was unprepared in consciousness and I was pissed at the cognitive dissonance I was experiencing.

I waited for the crucial Part 2 of his time-sensitive, life-saving exposé to appear on schedule the next morning. And waited. When he finally posted it a week or so later, it contained zilch…nothing more than a neatly organized copy of the cluttered alternative history I’d already dug up online and integrated. That couldn’t be the straw that broken-backed camels cursed and commiserated over.

Then the days turned into a whirlwind marathon of mission and urgency. One night, David kept his promise to deliver news as it came out. He published an imperfect, unfinished and raw report! It was fresh, unprocessed and presumably, non-GMO.

I was unhappily jarred the next morning when I discovered he’d filed down the article’s rough edges, dolled up the nouns with tawdry adjectives he'd picked up on some street corner and added hints of intrigue that were nonexistent just hours before. I was mildly nauseated with disappointment that he felt he had to go Harry Potter on us to please a magical market segment of civilized thrill seekers he considered his own.

I asked myself, how could he even be thinking that way under the circumstances?. It didn’t ring true that he was in danger. He had time to spare. His actions didn’t seem to jive with his words.

I felt like an exiled insider, kicked from the reporter’s cubby with the messy desk where the hot leads were scrawled on Subway receipts, back into the homogenized pool of consumers who were permitted—and who preferred—only the taste of scrubbed, polished and gently fictionalized sizzle.

I didn’t like what this said about me, so I tucked that pocket mirror of unwelcome insight into my jacket for later viewing once I'd calmed down.

I wonder if David has amended his belief that the kind of socio-psychopaths who hone their knives on controlling an entire planet are merely ‘damaged’ and that we in our compassion can understand, trust and possibly help them.

Until they try to kill us.

What do we do then? Do we offer them a warm heart as our defense and lay down our lives, true to our slave-as-saint conditioning? Maybe we run for the hills and take to meditating 24/7, never showing our face again, at least until the hills burst into flames. Do we fight back, an eye for an eye, a drone for a drone—Forever, and Ever, Hallelujah, Hallelujah?!

We’re facing questions whose answers have no market value, since you can’t pop them in the microwave for a few minutes and come up with something delicious for dinner.

What do we hold as true that we’re willing to act on in the face of apparent chaos?

How do we resolve conflicts with others who don’t share our perceptions or values?

What are we?

Judgement day isn’t executed from a golden throne. It is the final, complete and unspeakable Dilemma that we collectively invoke in our uniquely individual ways just prior to facing our common release from the mind-curling misunderstandings about our species that we've trusted and enforced as the foundation for human etiquette over millennia.

Face it, the milk has curdled and we need a new refrigerator.

It’s 2012. We’re nearly cornered with no way out. There are others out there who may help or harm us, but which is which? We're teetering on a string-thin tightrope stretched over a keening chasm that once was the world we knew and loved. Some say the rope is tethered at one end to fear and rejection, and at the other, to love and acceptance.

Where are we on the rope anyway?

Are we shaking uncontrollably with terror and striking out with violence at anyone or anything that confuses us? Or are we prematurely celebrating false confirmation that we are, in fact, graced—particularly when peering down the rope at the huddle of unattractive victims shivering at the other end.

Maybe we can save them through prayer…blessing and corralling them into the beautiful prison of “our way.”

Is it even possible to 'save' anyone without frivolously taking on the Lord’s prestigious name as our own, purely for vanity’s sake, or as they say, “in vain”? How could that be considered anything other than theft (and not the good kind for the right reasons)?!

A soft pillow of time now muffles the 2.6 mhz sirens that screamed across system platforms when David temporarily lost it during a late dinner hour in mid-December last year. I’ve stepped back into a wider view where my projections fall on objects closer to home and farther from DivineCosmosDotCom.

David is once again the lanky blond guy with an interesting slant who reminds me that even as we search for the latest loose rail to retire or repair, life is still on-track. I never used him as my personal GPS, so we’re still good there.

My home is in the middle of a very flat, treeless nowhere with little to hold my attention outdoors but clouds, some brownish prairie stubble and a few skinny rabbits making a beeline toward Spring. I’ve made sure they’re all accounted for today. Whether or not the D.U.M.B.S. are humming along as usual or are smoking piles of metallic and stone rubble doesn’t change my day in any practical way.

As a rule, gentle souled bloggers don't have bodyguards shadowing us as we research, synthesize, edit and click on "Publish”. I suspect most of us have no interest at this late date in mastering the disciplined martial arts skills necessary to fend off a lethal attack with our bare hands. So its scary stuff when our pen bumps up against an actual, sharpened sword. Who wouldn't cry at the realization that torture will be our final chapter...if not from fear of pain and madness, then from a deeply sad nostalgia for a time just a few years back when the beast hadn't yet gone publicly global with such shamelessly self-congratulatory pride.

Yes, David chose to be a public figure, but that's not usually a life or death decision for most bloggers. Maybe he has an interesting fate that is not driven by "his controller," the Federal Reserve or a trillion dollar bribe. I don’t sense he's a disinfo agent posing as a tree hugger or as a super psychic with both physical and nonphysical sources I should trust more than my own common sense, training and intuition.

Is it a crime to be happy in the face of doom? Then, I’m breaking the law right now—and for my unserious cartwheels, I may pay dearly, or I may find others of like mind...as will the parts of me that miserably muck around in the drama and terror that result from clinging to—or battling against —a fallen world as it tunnels blindly through the darkness on its drunken joyride to hell.

I don’t expect more of myself than to work, read, meditate, honor Nature, try to process my crap faster than it flows and switch off my monitor occasionally to enjoy some unpixelated, quality time with my fellow humans, dogs and soil.

I hope I’ve built a strong enough spiritual shield to protect my face against the high winds when they decide they'll settle for nothing less than my sun-dried skull. I can’t promise to act with dignity if I’m forced to dance some ridiculous new steps on twinkle toes as the floor drops out from under my feet. And where is that crystalline craft that will sweep me into its unconditionally loving machinery, then whisk me to who knows where?

I’m waiting.

So, frankly, I don’t know or care where David Wilcock is right now. I was with him when he was last on the air. We were very close. I’m sure he felt it too. You know how psychic he is. But dammit, even after all the intimate hours we shared together, he never calls, he never writes!

[Dennis Leahy]

nonesuch, someone's going to wag a finger and spank you for that mildly petulant outburst. Not me.

Someone's going to come along and invoke the Rodney King call to sanity about now. Not me.

Damn, I wish I could write prose that well. Where in the hell is the standing ovation button when I need one.

Dennis

[gripreaper]

That's beautiful writing nonesuch. best I've seen in a long time.

[onawah]

DW has displayed his deep vulnerability and human imperfections on a worldwide stage for all to see.
Did he do himself a disservice; did he do us a service by providing a mirror for us,
to see the edge of the cliff on which we are now poised?
That question can only be answered by each one, individually.

He has made huge mistakes, as we all do,
and had some wonderful victories too along the way,
and he's still only in his 40s.
Perhaps his greatest service has been to captivate a large audience of relatively naive people who were new to the Alternative Community
and help them to realize they were asleep to a great deal of serious undercover stuff that has been going on in the world.
And he has provided a genuine service by organizing a lot of information
in a way that will help many to understand what's been going on behind the scenes
much more quickly and easily than those of us who have been sifting and slogging our way through a lot of uncoordinated information from many different sources,
trying to get an overview, for years now...

He has disappointed many with some unapologetic flakiness which seems to be due to his strong desire to keep his celebrity status and his money making potential.
And it seems very likely he has been misled down a path of some dead ends, which hopefully has been instructive enough that he will come clean with himself and with us all, in time.

That ego was really in need of some humbling and reality checks.
And if he was misled, then obviously his intuitive abilities are not as acute as he supposed,which would be very good for him to see.

I think it would be a good idea if he would step back now and do some deep processing.
He's been on a roller coaster ride for quite some time, and that can get very wearing after awhile.
Celebrities tend to burn out young.

[9eagle9]

My response to a post like that is reframe that Avlaon is supposed to be informational and isn't strictly a religous temple or strictly a consciousness clearing workshop.



I'm thinking of starting a thread called:

"Time to take a serious look at the people who bitch about David Wilcock."

I'm barely half joking. Barely.


To paraphrase and add to what 9eagle9 aptly pointed out, why isn't a new thread far more aptly:

"Time to take a serious look at the people in a forum dedicated to discussing the validity of whistleblowers who bitch about anyone who wants to discuss the validity of whistleblowers."

[foreverfan]

I've been following David Wilcock since 2008 and watched most of his videos. He mostly does research and then makes this information available. He does a great job of this.

About his Financial Tyranny thesis... If in fact what he say is True....

If this information became public information without a new system being in place to take over, it would create a run on the banking system that would make 1929 look pale in comparison since our Fiat Currency situation is much worse now. This is the MAJOR REASON that nothing can be done at this time. Until then we are all waiting.

Saying that Ben Fulford and David Wilcock are plants or mind controlled individuals is hardly fair considering how they are putting themselves out there and risking their necks. I certainly hope for the worlds sake that something happens to straighten out this whole banking/debt mess.

Remember, most of David's work is a regurgitation of others works and he doesn't take credit for it being his. Sure he makes a few dollars off of it. That shouldn't discredit the wealth of information or make it any less relevant. He simply put it out there. I applaud his efforts at disclosure. Time will tell if he's wrong. He very well may be.

Last I checked 155 World Bankers have resigned, so something big is up. Just because it isn't reported on the MSM, doesn't make David a complete fraud. It simply can't be reported correctly since the MSM is controlled by the banking industry and REAL DISCLOSURE at this time would create a run on the banking industry.

I look for a military coup to take place before we get disclosure. Until then, it's the status quo.
It has to be that way.

FF

[ljwheat]

Maybe time to take a serious look at _________________ < you

Enter your Name? If I enter it for you. All of a sudden its slanderous, personal not allowed as the moderator’s would flag me for doing so.

Some one explain to me, what in gods name is the difference, its ok to dehumanize a person out side this membership. ??? If DW was an Avalonian member in good standing. How would this thread run under that flag, I do not see a difference. Explain it to me as you would to a little child. I don’t get it? Its like standing in a down pour looking up at the sky complaining you ass off. Why not get out of the rain. The sun will shine once again wait for it.

My dad worked on a turkey farm and he said that domestic turkey’s are so dumb they have to be herded back under shelter when it rains , or they would literally drown looking up with there moth open. ( Domesticated )? :frusty: (Me):rain:

John XXX:cool:

[waves]

Maybe time to take a serious look at _________________ < you

Enter your Name? If I enter it for you. All of a sudden its slanderous, personal not allowed as the moderator’s would flag me for doing so.

Some one explain to me, what in gods name is the difference, its ok to dehumanize a person out side this membership. ??? If DW was an Avalonian in good standing. How would this thread run under that flag, I do not see a difference. Explain it to me as you would to a little child. I don’t get it? Its like standing in a down pour looking up at the sky complaining you ass off. Why not get out of the rain. The sun will shine once again wait for it.
John XXX:cool:

I think this is a good idea to try to carefully answer your question and explain to you and many others who have reacted to my post as if the intent was to slander DW as opposed to contributing to a forum dedicated to comparing notes on the validity of information and informants in a quest for truth as was the stated intent in the OP as "My intention is to lay all the semi-solid pieces of a puzzle I currently see on the table for observation, refrain from conclusions and continue to closely observe to see what puzzle pieces become more solid."

I think the problem that makes for such wide-ranging misinterpretations, erroneous assumptions and emotional reactions to posts has to do with the extremely wide-ranging level of knowledge/awareness of each individual respondee with so much info and disinfo out there, differing interpretations of the same information, and/or differing levels of emotional development of any individual.

I'd think it would be helpful to do this in discourse if you'd be willing. I'd like to begin by asking you a question.

Without doing any more research so we can look at the level of awareness you have responded to the OP from, please tell me what your understanding of MKultra and Monarch is.

Thank you.

[ljwheat]

Maybe time to take a serious look at _________________ < you

Enter your Name? If I enter it for you. All of a sudden its slanderous, personal not allowed as the moderator’s would flag me for doing so.

Some one explain to me, what in gods name is the difference, its ok to dehumanize a person out side this membership. ??? If DW was an Avalonian in good standing. How would this thread run under that flag, I do not see a difference. Explain it to me as you would to a little child. I don’t get it? Its like standing in a down pour looking up at the sky complaining you ass off. Why not get out of the rain. The sun will shine once again wait for it.
John XXX:cool:

I think this is a good idea to try to carefully answer your question and explain to you and many others who have reacted to my post as if the intent was to slander DW as opposed to contributing to a forum dedicated to comparing notes on the validity of information and informants in a quest for truth as was the stated intent in the OP as "My intention is to lay all the semi-solid pieces of a puzzle I currently see on the table for observation, refrain from conclusions and continue to closely observe to see what puzzle pieces become more solid."

I think the problem that makes for such wide-ranging misinterpretations, erroneous assumptions and emotional reactions to posts has to do with the extremely wide-ranging level of knowledge/awareness of each individual respondee with so much info and disinfo out there, differing interpretations of the same information, and/or differing levels of emotional development of any individual.

I'd think it would be helpful to do this in discourse if you'd be willing. I'd like to begin by asking you a question.

Without doing any more research so we can look at the level of awareness you have responded to the OP from, please tell me what your understanding of MKultra and Monarch is.

Thank you.

History! get over it. we all have luggage.

[9eagle9]

Then David would be forced to directly substantiate and debate the claims he makes and because its been demonstrated that he cries a lot when challenged it would be very hard to retain a working membership because we're not supposed to make other members cry. He's much better off defending his position through his fan base so he doesn't have to risk the sorts of the emotional breakdowns that we recently witnessed.

And prefer not to witness here in the forum.



Maybe time to take a serious look at _________________ < you

Enter your Name? If I enter it for you. All of a sudden its slanderous, personal not allowed as the moderator’s would flag me for doing so.

Some one explain to me, what in gods name is the difference, its ok to dehumanize a person out side this membership. ??? If DW was an Avalonian member in good standing. How would this thread run under that flag, I do not see a difference. Explain it to me as you would to a little child. I don’t get it? Its like standing in a down pour looking up at the sky complaining you ass off. Why not get out of the rain. The sun will shine once again wait for it.

My dad worked on a turkey farm and he said that domestic turkey’s are so dumb they have to be herded back under shelter when it rains , or they would literally drown looking up with there moth open. ( Domesticated )? :frusty: (Me):rain:

John XXX:cool:

[ThePythonicCow]

Some one explain to me, what in gods name is the difference, its ok to dehumanize a person out side this membership. ??? If DW was an Avalonian member in good standing. How would this thread run under that flag, I do not see a difference.
Many of us, myself included, have our various emotionally reactive hot buttons. If you come at someone in a way that hits one of their buttons, they are more likely to respond in a way that lowers the quality of the discussion and distracts from our common effort to find better understanding and awareness.

We allow much more latitude in hitting such hot buttons when the targeted person is not on the forum than when they are, because someone not on the forum is not able to respond defensively on the forum and thereby directly drag the discussion further into the mud. We don't allow infinite latitude even then ... an unexpurgated drunken rant of what I thought of Clinton-Gore ten years ago, or what I thought of Bush-Cheney-Rumsfeld more recently (dang - that side sucks too :)), would not make a good post, but quite a bit more latitude is allowed.

In other words, we ask that members treat each other with a modicum of respect, to facilitate healthy discussion. We don't ask that members treat all the bastards out there with respect ... too few of us could or would choose to follow that request.

[waves]

<br>some one explain to me, what in gods name is the difference, its ok to dehumanize a person out side this membership. ??? ...... Explain it to me as you would to a little child. I don’t get it?.....<br><br>
i think this is a good idea to try to carefully answer your question...... <br><br>
<br>history! Get over it. We all have luggage.<br><br>

?? Sorry for trying. Thought you were sincerely asking for help.

[songsfortheotherkind]

Then David would be forced to directly substantiate and debate the claims he makes and because its been demonstrated that he cries a lot when challenged it would be very hard to retain a working membership because we're not supposed to make other members cry. He's much better off defending his position through his fan base so he doesn't have to risk the sorts of the emotional breakdowns that we recently witnessed. And prefer not to witness here in the forum.

That *you personally* prefer not to witness here in the forum. Please make this clear, because I personally have no such preference, I don't have an issue with someone hitting a huge learning curve or personal black hole and having a temporary melt down as a result. It's what they do with it that is interesting to me.

[Borden]

Then David would be forced to directly substantiate and debate the claims he makes and because its been demonstrated that he cries a lot when challenged it would be very hard to retain a working membership because we're not supposed to make other members cry. He's much better off defending his position through his fan base so he doesn't have to risk the sorts of the emotional breakdowns that we recently witnessed. And prefer not to witness here in the forum.

That *you personally* prefer not to witness here in the forum. Please make this clear, because I personally have no such preference, I don't have an issue with someone hitting a huge learning curve or personal black hole and having a temporary melt down as a result. It's what they do with it that is interesting to me.

That's interesting to me too, but I'm pretty sure there are rules about not making other members cry in the forum. 'Crisis and observation' tests aren't very friendly! Haha, maybe the mods should create a special thread or sub-forum where the gloves are off and only the strong survive! Okay ... maybe not.

Something I find more uncomfortable than crying is fake crying. Passive/aggressive fake crying (and there's a lot of it about) in the face of an attack or an argument disgusts me. Someone genuinely crying does not, whether they're man, woman or child. I think tears are a valuable, powerful, cathartic thing, and to pretend them or to chuck them about all over the place at the drop of a hat isn't good for a person.

Stiff upper lipped Borden

[songsfortheotherkind]

Then David would be forced to directly substantiate and debate the claims he makes and because its been demonstrated that he cries a lot when challenged it would be very hard to retain a working membership because we're not supposed to make other members cry. He's much better off defending his position through his fan base so he doesn't have to risk the sorts of the emotional breakdowns that we recently witnessed. And prefer not to witness here in the forum.

That *you personally* prefer not to witness here in the forum. Please make this clear, because I personally have no such preference, I don't have an issue with someone hitting a huge learning curve or personal black hole and having a temporary melt down as a result. It's what they do with it that is interesting to me.

That's interesting to me too, but I'm pretty sure there are rules about not making other members cry in the forum. 'Crisis and observation' tests aren't very friendly! Haha, maybe the mods should create a special thread or sub-forum where the gloves are off and only the strong survive! Okay ... maybe not.

right, that's it, let's have at it!

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-e5Ryx0-StIw/TyXKPz3Uz1I/AAAAAAAAArI/Cwh4xZGiNHk/s1600/matrix-origami.gif

now that I have kicked your butt with my paper dollies, I would like to clarify that I wasn't advocating *provoking* someone into crying- I simply am not bothered if something comes up for an individual that causes them to break down, or causes their normal demeanour to have a splat attack. I am of the particular view that it would be far more evolved to engage with one another in such a way as to obviate this reaction *and* I am aware that there is a wide variety of Beings, in various stages of awareness, inhabiting these hallways and corridors; splat is, at least for now, likely to happen. It's how we *deal* with splat-individually and collectively- that is, imo, the really fertile ground for evolution.


Something I find more uncomfortable than crying is fake crying. Passive/aggressive fake crying (and there's a lot of it about) in the face of an attack or an argument disgusts me. Someone genuinely crying does not, whether they're man, woman or child. I think tears are a valuable, powerful, cathartic thing, and to pretend them or to chuck them about all over the place at the drop of a hat isn't good for a person.

I too go very cool in the face of passive aggression. I have an excellent radar for it, having grown up with it, and no time for it at all- emotional blackmail/manipulation of any kind for me is tedious and closed system. I'm not interested in either state.


Stiff upper lipped Borden This bit made me smorfle with laughter. I am too wildish for stiff lippery... :D

[songsfortheotherkind]

my new and improved previous post now makes a lot more sense, due to the gif properly working. Otherwise, there just seems to be a strange reference to random paper dollies...

*laughing*

[Borden]

Haha, yes - I experienced a moment of confusion until I refreshed the page. Brilliant gif (gift of a gif?), thank you!

I think the reason passive/aggressive behaviour annoys me so much is that it's simply animal cunning. It's not that I necessarily value sophistication, but I do value honesty. A display of animal cunning is an honesty in itself of course, but an unwitting one. It bankrupts whatever point is being made. For instance, something that particularly angers me is when people wish to insult, but do it 'within the rules' so to speak. I'm not talking about this forum and its rules, but the world at large. You know, random people you meet going about the day, or people you know but who are not really friends or enemies. There is a simple way to deal with that sort of cowardly 'attack', and the guilty pleasure there is the reminder that animals tend to freeze in headlights, haha.

I agree with you about the 'splat' subject, and for all the lovely people I speak to here, I do still find it frustrating when I see some people coasting in their particular beliefs (especially the ones I find ludicrous). Devotees, for instance, of characters whom I personally believe to be lying or delusional or a mixture of both. I'm torn between feeling that it's their business and not my place to challenge their beliefs ... and feeling that I should because a place like this is surely about the evolution of ideas and I have as much right to an opinion as anybody. I have this theory that humour is a decent way to bypass a lot of the traps to be found 'inhabiting these hallways and corridors'. Personally, I find that laughter can be cathartic in a similarly powerful way to tears. Maybe that's a form of manipulation too, I'm not really sure - but I do know that people have used it successfully on me and forced me to re-evaluate this or that idea.

Borden

[araucaria]

As a forum of, let’s just say, spiritually minded folks, Avalon should be trying to get above ego-filled bitchiness and involuntarily judgmental amateur diagnoses (eg the Asperger’s label).

If we just take a compassionate view of everyone – everyone – we tend towards understanding people as well as what is to be taken from their message. The abuser is usually someone who has been abused, and even the worst abuser needs to be treated as a human with issues (granted, possibly too big for us to handle alone) rather than some inhuman monster.

If we cannot show humanity to our fellow earthling humans, then we are not ready to be mixing with Martians, still less with Greys. They too must be shown humanity, or if the word seems too restrictive, compassion. The ‘ET threat’ is largely of our own making because we fail to see this.

Regarding those who would separate the wheat and the chaff, they seem to have got the wrong end of the stick. To the contrary, the biblical parable of the wheat and the tares makes it quite clear that such attempts at weeding out would kill the wheat crop. Babies and bathwater come to mind :)

[Borden]

Perhaps you don't see the need to check that it is in fact a baby in that bath water, and not something a diaper-less baby may have left behind.

I do take a compassionate view of everyone. Everyone. Compassion does not mean never challenging.

By the way, the bible contains some of the most horrific fear-mongering and judgment I have ever read. I'd rather have the wrong end of the stick than the wrong stick.

Borden

[9eagle9]

As noted elsewhere Avalon isn't JUST a temple for conscious work shopping, spirituality or a religious temple. There is no prohibition in the guidelines that say 'leave your ego at the door'.

Is it it a requirement for people to be spiritual to discuss anything in here? With 5000 belief systems and everyone thinking theirs is the most important, its very impossible for each member to toe the line and not offend or challenge that many belief systems in play. Chances are someone's ego is going to be stepped on. How well one manages themselves reveals how well their checking their ego. No one is required to check their ego, they just have to make sure their ego remains with the realms of a certain standard of conduct. That includes squealing that one is hurt because their idol was scrutinized.

People confuse spirituality with belief. Because someone invests their utter faith and ourtight devotion to David doens't automatically make them spiritual. That's coat tail spirituality. Then they have an opportunity to squawk and moan when someeone observes that he has obviated discrepancies between what he talks and what he walks. Your belief in him does not make him above reproach. The devotees feel they are being criticized when its actually David who is being scrutinized here. No one is critiquing his fan base and if his fans are taking it personally they have to follow their own advice and manage their ego.


This is how deceptions are kept in place by devotees.




As a forum of, let’s just say, spiritually minded folks, Avalon should be trying to get above ego-filled bitchiness and involuntarily judgmental amateur diagnoses (eg the Asperger’s label).

If we just take a compassionate view of everyone – everyone – we tend towards understanding people as well as what is to be taken from their message. The abuser is usually someone who has been abused, and even the worst abuser needs to be treated as a human with issues (granted, possibly too big for us to handle alone) rather than some inhuman monster.

If we cannot show humanity to our fellow earthling humans, then we are not ready to be mixing with Martians, still less with Greys. They too must be shown humanity, or if the word seems too restrictive, compassion. The ‘ET threat’ is largely of our own making because we fail to see this.

Regarding those who would separate the wheat and the chaff, they seem to have got the wrong end of the stick. To the contrary, the biblical parable of the wheat and the tares makes it quite clear that such attempts at weeding out would kill the wheat crop. Babies and bathwater come to mind :)

[highlyter]

Emotional hot buttons?; simply ego. Hard to leave it at the door anywhere, however, practice makes perfect!

DW is hope-filled just like everyone else. His blog has opened many eyes. H2 channel has been flooded with programming leading up to disclosure! We are in the final minutes, omniversally speaking!!

Gregg Bradens Fractal Time Book, Bill Ryans interview with Lucia Renè and watching "What the Bleep do we Know" catapulted me into the living from the heart coherency path. After reading Unplugging the Patriarchy, I've found so much that aligns with unplugging to connect!!! David has been part of that connectivity. I am grateful to be here NOW.
Thanks Loving Avalonians.

[Mike]

Then David would be forced to directly substantiate and debate the claims he makes and because its been demonstrated that he cries a lot when challenged it would be very hard to retain a working membership because we're not supposed to make other members cry. He's much better off defending his position through his fan base so he doesn't have to risk the sorts of the emotional breakdowns that we recently witnessed. And prefer not to witness here in the forum.

That *you personally* prefer not to witness here in the forum. Please make this clear, because I personally have no such preference, I don't have an issue with someone hitting a huge learning curve or personal black hole and having a temporary melt down as a result. It's what they do with it that is interesting to me.

That's interesting to me too, but I'm pretty sure there are rules about not making other members cry in the forum. 'Crisis and observation' tests aren't very friendly! Haha, maybe the mods should create a special thread or sub-forum where the gloves are off and only the strong survive! Okay ... maybe not.

Something I find more uncomfortable than crying is fake crying. Passive/aggressive fake crying (and there's a lot of it about) in the face of an attack or an argument disgusts me. Someone genuinely crying does not, whether they're man, woman or child. I think tears are a valuable, powerful, cathartic thing, and to pretend them or to chuck them about all over the place at the drop of a hat isn't good for a person.

Stiff upper lipped Borden


Borden, i really like your posts *BUT*...(Avalonians, fill in passive-aggressiveness here, and add a smiley face to take the edge off...:))

that seems to be the first symptom of p.a. disorder. the remedy? not sure. a smiley face flashing the finger? a pantless smiley face mooning? 2 aspirin and a couple guinness?

re fake crying: see: Benjamin Fulford.

i like your idea of a no-holds barred area here. i find that i really have to put my 'nice hat' on when i enter the forum, and it's just as well. i understand we have to be civil etc etc. but in my everyday life, i don't have a single friend who i can't spontaneously call an a@@hole or worse without them getting offended. they'll give it right back to me, even if we're talking casually, and something is released. there is a certain healthiness to this type of banter that i find refreshing.


p.s. (chinaski, with lips quivering) is it really ok to cry, man? sniff sniff, because my day hasn't been going so well. in all seriousness, i took several hits of LSD when i was 21 or 22, and spent the next 5 hrs sobbing. they were heaving sobs too, and as you say, it was the most cathartic moment of my life. i felt so light afterwards. it was wonderful. i would have never allowed myself that emotional outburst otherwise--even if i was in a room by myself. i wasn't surprised to learn years later that certain psychoanalysts have used acid in their practice, going so far as to claim that one session with LSD is worth 6 months of therapy. (a new thread?)

p.s.s. you couldn't be more right about the use of humor. i mentioned in the Pila thread that sarcasm is an underrated form of communication. i probably should have said humor is an underrated from of communication, as this is in closer alignment with my thoughts.

p.s.s.s. this thought just occurred to me: maybe Wilcock was tripping during his mawkish meltdown;) maybe we should let the poor guy of the hook.

[jaybee]

p.s.s.s. this thought just occurred to me: maybe Wilcock was tripping during his mawkish meltdown;) maybe we should let the poor guy of the hook.


shortly after David had his (genuine) emotional breakdown on radio...:)... Alex Jones decided he'd better have one as well....;)


omV4bweWfpw

:ohwell:


.

[songsfortheotherkind]

Borden, I just spent half an hour replying to your post and the internet ate my reply. I shall begin again when I feel less fangy.

:D

[greybeard]

Borden, I just spent half an hour replying to your post and the internet ate my reply. I shall begin again when I feel less fangy.

:D
Hi
If I have more than a few words to say I put it on the word processor and when finished paste it in.
Think most of us have been there and its frustrating.
Best wishes Chris

[songsfortheotherkind]

Hi
If I have more than a few words to say I put it on the word processor and when finished paste it in.
Think most of us have been there and its frustrating.
Best wishes Chris

*grinning* I have had enough experiences with doing this and still get caught with thinking 'oh, this isn't going to be a long reply...'

ahem.

It is utterly my own folly. And an indication of some element of stubborn refusal in there somewhere which, in the appropriate settings, is absolutely useful and necessary. In wrangling with replies in a forum where there is no 'save reply' button, it is completely self defeating. Clearly I'm not done with 'using my stubbornness in entirely the wrong situation' and 'being frustrated at my own stubbornness when I use it in entirely the wrong situation'.

Ah, good times, good times... *laughing in that semi-grrrr with self sort of way'

[Borden]

Borden, I just spent half an hour replying to your post and the internet ate my reply. I shall begin again when I feel less fangy.

:D

That is extremely annoying, I know. I've been there too. If you were writing in disagreement with me I will of course claim that my psychic powers were responsible.

Borden

[songsfortheotherkind]

Borden, I just spent half an hour replying to your post and the internet ate my reply. I shall begin again when I feel less fangy.

:D

That is extremely annoying, I know. I've been there too. If you were writing in disagreement with me I will of course claim that my psychic powers were responsible.

Borden

hah, you're just saying that because the awesomeness of my paper dolly Fu completely overwhelmed you. *snips scissors at you haughtily*

[Dennis Leahy]

Borden, I just spent half an hour replying to your post and the internet ate my reply. I shall begin again when I feel less fangy.

:D
If you are using Firefox:
Go to Tools
Add-ons
Extensions
search for and enable Lazarus: Form Recovery

This was a tip from a very bright and very computer savvy friend of mine, named Paul. Mooooo. This has saved me quite a bit of typing when Firefox crashes. I have an insane habit of having many many multiple tabs open simultaneously, and have noticed an increased frequency of crashes once I exceed 100 tabs open. Earlier today, it crashed with 162 tabs open. Lazarus is still holding data I typed in to an Avalon post I will yet finish, from 2 or 3 crashes and a couple of days ago. Lazarus: text rises from the dead. :~)

Dennis

[ThePythonicCow]

If I have more than a few words to say I put it on the word processor and when finished paste it in.
If you're using any of the browsers Chrome, Safari, or Firefox, then consider using the (free) Lazarus (http://lazarus.interclue.com/) browser add-on. It automatically saves what you enter into forms, as you type it (such as it is doing now, as I type this), and lets you easily recover what you were entering. I could pull out the power cord from my PC as I type this right now, and then come back here after rebooting, to recover what I've just written in a few clicks, and to continue writing this reply.

¤=[Post Update]=¤



If you are using Firefox:
Go to Tools
Add-ons
Extensions
search for and enable Lazarus: Form Recovery

This was a tip from a very bright and very computer savvy friend of mine, named Paul. Mooooo.
Aha - hi Dennis :).

The newest version of Lazarus also runs on Chrome and Safari (from what they say; I'm still using the earlier Firefox only version.)

[9eagle9]

I can't access Avalon off of Firefox at all . Any ides why. Not to go off topic. I used to be able to but can't anymore, very annoying I have to use flu prone IE.

[Dennis Leahy]

I can't access Avalon off of Firefox at all . Any ides why. Not to go off topic. I used to be able to but can't anymore, very annoying I have to use flu prone IE.

Well,
Not to go off topic.... we might have to ask David Wilcock.* (How's that for a segue!) If Firefox did not work for me, I'd uninstall it, and reinstall it. If That still didn't work, I'd use Chrome. If that didn't work, geez, what the hell would I do then... maybe call that off-world guy with the quasi-Irish accent. He would know who to call. Using IE is like being covered in chicken blood and staked over a large fire ant colony, or like getting gang raped by the Monsanto board of directors, or like getting stuck in an elevator with a dozen mimes - I just couldn't give my consent.

Dennis

*(p.s. Not teasing or mocking David - I just needed a way to segue back on-topic.)

[songsfortheotherkind]

I can't access Avalon off of Firefox at all . Any ides why. Not to go off topic. I used to be able to but can't anymore, very annoying I have to use flu prone IE.

Well,
Not to go off topic.... we might have to ask David Wilcock.* (How's that for a segue!) If Firefox did not work for me, I'd uninstall it, and reinstall it. If That still didn't work, I'd use Chrome. If that didn't work, geez, what the hell would I do then... maybe call that off-world guy with the quasi-Irish accent. He would know who to call. Using IE is like being covered in chicken blood and staked over a large fire ant colony, or like getting gang raped by the Monsanto board of directors, or like getting stuck in an elevator with a dozen mimes - I just couldn't give my consent.

Dennis

*(p.s. Not teasing or mocking David - I just needed a way to segue back on-topic.)

" like getting stuck in an elevator with a dozen mimes"

*falls about laughing* this post is chock-full-o-win...

[Borden]

I can't access Avalon off of Firefox at all . Any ides why. Not to go off topic. I used to be able to but can't anymore, very annoying I have to use flu prone IE.

Well,
Not to go off topic.... we might have to ask David Wilcock.* (How's that for a segue!) If Firefox did not work for me, I'd uninstall it, and reinstall it. If That still didn't work, I'd use Chrome. If that didn't work, geez, what the hell would I do then... maybe call that off-world guy with the quasi-Irish accent. He would know who to call. Using IE is like being covered in chicken blood and staked over a large fire ant colony, or like getting gang raped by the Monsanto board of directors, or like getting stuck in an elevator with a dozen mimes - I just couldn't give my consent.

Dennis

*(p.s. Not teasing or mocking David - I just needed a way to segue back on-topic.)

... and brilliantly done, sir!

[9eagle9]

No no no send a ufo down to fix it.

thank you for advice Dennis I will try that and if that doesn't help I'll put a sos in the technical portion of the thread. Some brainiac should know what's up.



I can't access Avalon off of Firefox at all . Any ides why. Not to go off topic. I used to be able to but can't anymore, very annoying I have to use flu prone IE.

Well,
Not to go off topic.... we might have to ask David Wilcock.* (How's that for a segue!) If Firefox did not work for me, I'd uninstall it, and reinstall it. If That still didn't work, I'd use Chrome. If that didn't work, geez, what the hell would I do then... maybe call that off-world guy with the quasi-Irish accent. He would know who to call. Using IE is like being covered in chicken blood and staked over a large fire ant colony, or like getting gang raped by the Monsanto board of directors, or like getting stuck in an elevator with a dozen mimes - I just couldn't give my consent.

Dennis

*(p.s. Not teasing or mocking David - I just needed a way to segue back on-topic.)

[songsfortheotherkind]

This is absolutely, definitely not aimed at anyone specifically, has nothing to do with this thread *and*-

It is, some days, extremely difficult to engage with individuals who seem to be chronically unable to read and respond to what you have *actually* written- it makes discussing anything at all extremely difficult *and* it makes me not want to go into the kitchen...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6R9fY8lfGo&feature=related

(warning- contains the F word that sounds like truck, for those that don't like to hear that word.)

[Borden]

A clip from one of my all time favourite films.

I bet you posted this because I didn't respond to post 126!

Borden

[9eagle9]

I get annoyed by people who insist I don't understand them when in reality I'm just disagreeing with them.

[songsfortheotherkind]

A clip from one of my all time favourite films.

*grins hugely at you* Of course! How could we get through the noise of this planet without such sustenance and good advice? *flaps gloves vigorously* Never do anything without the gloves! It was, however, a real bitch with typing until I discovered latex- so many errors when wearing the rubber ones...


I bet you posted this because I didn't respond to post 126! Borden

You fiend! You just said that because you knew I'd be compelled to go find out what post 126 is! Blast it!

[Mike]

I get annoyed by people who insist I don't understand them when in reality I'm just disagreeing with them.


if your signature wasn't already so epic, i would have strongly suggested using this line here.

[onawah]

Withnail and I was one of the funniest movies made in 1987 and several other years.

[modwiz]

I get annoyed by people who insist I don't understand them when in reality I'm just disagreeing with them.

This is such a strong and often overlooked aspect of 'not being on the same page'. Sometimes we understand others better than they understand themselves, as well. Good point and one that should help address some of the sulking that can accompany disagreement, which often results from 'feeling' misunderstood. :cry:

[Mike]

well....there's 15 members on this thread at the moment.

somebody f#cking say something already:)

[songsfortheotherkind]

I get annoyed by people who insist I don't understand them when in reality I'm just disagreeing with them.

This and the emotionally sticky World of Goo that comes when an individual believes that *their* discomfort is something that *I* have to do something about and they continue to raise the energetic stakes as their anxiety climbs with each rebuttal.

I do tend to bypass the 'you're not understanding me' with an interaction that involves mirroring (is this what you are saying? Are you meaning this when you say 'blahblah'?), it is clearly established that I *do* understand them and that I simply am not agreeing with them. Then, if this triggers a melt down, I'll ping off somewhere else and wait to see if anything mutually interesting is going to happen from there.

I'm always willing to engage with an individual until such time as interaction becomes counterproductive- sometimes this takes time to establish, sometimes it's an immediate thing...

[Borden]

I was trying to think of a quote from Withnail and I that wouldn't get me banned. It's not easy.

[songsfortheotherkind]

well....there's 15 members on this thread at the moment.

somebody f#cking say something already:)

cheese.

oh, apparently that answer is too short and I need to increase my character count. Ok-

tasty cheese.

[Sidney]

LOL- I haven't read any of this thread much, and was just trying to figure out where David W factors in here?? Not that it matters or anything. :rolleyes: lol

[songsfortheotherkind]

I was trying to think of a quote from Withnail and I that wouldn't get me banned. It's not easy.

Now you can grasp the extreme self control that I exercise every time I post- the strain of having to mentally edit out the F word that sounds like truck! *makes extreme angst motions with hands*

I write it like that because years ago one of my children was told once 'I don't watch that show, they use the F word': cue small child with puzzled expression- 'Fat?' 'No, not that word. The rude word.' More puzzlement, then- 'Fart?'

[thunder24]

amaru...what do u think of this thread?

[songsfortheotherkind]

*laughing* maybe we need a pub in this forum- 'hey, let's all head to the pub and quote Withnail and I while ***ing around with other unseemly folderol and irreverent, unevolved hoopla! I'll bring some tasty cheese...'

[Sidney]

Love the pub idea. I need to celebrate just by passing my 1000 th post.

[Mike]

*laughing* maybe we need a pub in this forum- 'hey, let's all head to the pub and quote Withnail and I while ***ing around with other unseemly folderol and irreverent, unevolved hoopla! I'll bring some tasty cheese...'


'tasty' cheese only!

because 'cheese' alone would just not be adequate.:P

¤=[Post Update]=¤


Love the pub idea. I need to celebrate just by passing my 1000 th post.


here! here!

[Borden]

Maybe we could take David Wilcock down the pub with us and get him s*it-faced. We'd all be mates by the end of the night.

We urgently need to get this thread back on topic. I deny any accusations that I am partially to blame.

Borden

[Sidney]

*laughing* maybe we need a pub in this forum- 'hey, let's all head to the pub and quote Withnail and I while ***ing around with other unseemly folderol and irreverent, unevolved hoopla! I'll bring some tasty cheese...'


'tasty' cheese only!

because 'cheese' alone would just not be adequate.:P

¤=[Post Update]=¤


Love the pub idea. I need to celebrate just by passing my 1000 th post.


here! here!

actually, sharp white cheddar,wheat thins and dry red wine sound excellent.

[9eagle9]

Very good. You established my point about the David Wilcocks devotees and their inabilty to manage their emotions concerning their hero better than I did.




I get annoyed by people who insist I don't understand them when in reality I'm just disagreeing with them.

This and the emotionally sticky World of Goo that comes when an individual believes that *their* discomfort is something that *I* have to do something about and they continue to raise the energetic stakes as their anxiety climbs with each rebuttal.

I do tend to bypass the 'you're not understanding me' with an interaction that involves mirroring (is this what you are saying? Are you meaning this when you say 'blahblah'?), it is clearly established that I *do* understand them and that I simply am not agreeing with them. Then, if this triggers a melt down, I'll ping off somewhere else and wait to see if anything mutually interesting is going to happen from there.

I'm always willing to engage with an individual until such time as interaction becomes counterproductive- sometimes this takes time to establish, sometimes it's an immediate thing...

[davyj0nes]

just catching up on this thread.

Personally, when i heard David Wilclock crying i felt it was all for show. I did enjoying reading parts 1 and 2 of the trillion dollar lawsuit. I found that it 'resonanted' with what i had learned in school, and my personal studies. I would say that it's to everyone's benefit to hold these 'whistleblowers'/'contactees' at arms length. If it 'resonates' with you then great, if not thats good too. What gets people in trouble, (like a certain, little robotoid on these forums) is when they take it as true and faithful gospel handed down from on high. And, heaven help you if you disagree with them. They will curse you, bad mouth you, and buy hexes off of ebay to get you with. It is so scary to read what those people write, its as if they identify with the message so fully that they lose all sense of self. To disagree with them is to mortally wound them.

I am in full agreement with scotusa post, that avalon should have some sort of rating system/cow patty meter for 'whistleblowers/contactees'.

[songsfortheotherkind]

Maybe we could take David Wilcock down the pub with us and get him s*it-faced. We'd all be mates by the end of the night.

We urgently need to get this thread back on topic. I deny any accusations that I am partially to blame.

Borden

I rebut your denial, so there, and have ample evidence to support my claim, so there! And I've been trying to think how to get the thread back on topic, but this pub is noisy and I'm about to throw a dart at an annoying patron and then pretend that I was actually aiming at the dart board but that I'm just a really crappy shot, particularly considering that they are at the opposite end of the room...

Personally, I don't have any energy for the actual topic of the conversation, I got involved because I could see what to me personally was some fairly dodgy reasoning and use of parameters of thinking going on: for me, certain things are really simple-

if I don't like what someone is saying and I can engage with them personally about it, I'll endeavour to communicate with them about it, see what is possible, what can be created (or not) and go from there- is there room for something to happen co-creatively? Can greater mutual understanding happen? Or is it better to agree to disagree and move on?

If I *can't* engage with them personally about it, I'll evaluate what is bothering me, make further explorations, get some other perspectives as a way to hold more information from the hologram, move the pieces around more while holding my sense of 'mmm' in the space and see what comes up. If I discuss it with others, I'll be discussing *my discomfort*, moving that around, not engaging in a dissection of the individual that has triggered the discomfort or 'mmm'- in my world, they're doing me a valuable service by bringing something up that my otherwise occupied consciousness may not have picked up. I don't need to shoot the messenger if it's me that's getting triggered! Even if I can manage to rustle up some impressive rationalisations about how I'm getting fired up on behalf of all those who can't figure out for themselves that they're being taken for a ride- (oh, won't someone think of the children???) *handwringing*)

Mmm. ahem. So I'm really unsupportive of efforts to engage others in tearing apart the works of another individual with a view to getting some kind of consensus. So what if 51% of the board were to agree that David's work is bunkum? Would this then be followed by an edict that his work was not to be presented or discussed, or that the 'majority' could squash anyone who found David's work to be interesting and relevant for them personally? This is how 'democracy' works and, just as it sucks out in the world, it also sucks everywhere else it's applied.

I am actually into developing new ways of Being, new ways of approaching things that resonate as *intelligent* and evolved to me- I get how the majority do things and it just isn't interesting, intelligent or evolved from the part of the hologram I'm looking out of. I find psychonauting exhilarating and useful, find moving the pieces around fascinating, I love the evolution that comes from an individual sharing their subjective process, perspectives and experiences- I don't like closed systems.

So I don't know that I can add anything useful to the theme of this particular thread. :)

¤=[Post Update]=¤


Very good. You established my point about the David Wilcocks devotees and their inabilty to manage their emotions concerning their hero better than I did.

And established some other things about your broken record comments that add little to the matter but support your own view of things aplenty.

[songsfortheotherkind]

*laughing* maybe we need a pub in this forum- 'hey, let's all head to the pub and quote Withnail and I while ***ing around with other unseemly folderol and irreverent, unevolved hoopla! I'll bring some tasty cheese...'


'tasty' cheese only!

because 'cheese' alone would just not be adequate.:P

too right! there are some appalling cheeses out there. Who *do* they think they are? *rolls eyes* Upstart cheese...

and congrats, starchild111. :)

[Borden]

Hi songsfortheotherkind,

I find your approach interesting, and I'm not disagreeing with you, but ...

First, I am not interested in ganging up, shouting people down, all that sort of thing. I agree about useful discussion and evolution of ideas through it, and I understand the point that sometimes it is better to disagree and move on. However, I honestly believe there is sometimes value in stating an opinion even in the face of stony opposition. My reasoning is that our peers and what they think is a valuable part of our own process. I want to know what certain members think about a certain subject. Greater mutual understanding and co-creativity may not always come in a friendly package. No, the messenger should not be shot, but perhaps the messenger should occasionally be asked the question, "what is it with you and these stupid messages?"

To be fair, I don't have the energy either to really bang on about David Wilcock. I've been reading the thread and have found it interesting, but only chimed in recently on a particular aspect. The thread title appeals, because it says 'take a look' ... it doesn't say 'tear apart'. We could tear people apart instead of taking a look, but what would be the point? It only bolsters the defenses of those with an emotional investment.

An unusual character I once knew who was a martial arts expert and sometimes did some work for the police force told me that whenever they'd had to chase or fight a suspect, and captured him (Ha, another Withnail quote: "Get in the back of the van!!!"), if they ever asked him what he was thinking or why he did it, etc - the answer would almost invariably be "What?" As I vaguely understand it this is because the fight or flight response makes the body prioritize its energy, and hearing is surplus to requirements in those moments.

There's a time and a place for tearing apart too, I suppose. Not here though. There are some opinions I have about Wilcock that his devotees would dislike, but they're only a part of my whole opinion, and he clearly does have some interesting things to say.

Borden

p.s. personally I find 9eagle9's 'broken record' to often be the sort that's constructive. That's what I mean about the views of our peers. But I find both your comments interesting, and don't want any fights in the pub!

p.p.s remind me never to play darts with you.

[songsfortheotherkind]

Hi songsfortheotherkind,

I find your approach interesting, and I'm not disagreeing with you, but ...

*laughing, pointing to the 'but'* AND you're about to disagree with me? Awesome! *more laughing*


First, I am not interested in ganging up, shouting people down, all that sort of thing. I agree about useful discussion and evolution of ideas through it, and I understand the point that sometimes it is better to disagree and move on. However, I honestly believe there is sometimes value in stating an opinion even in the face of stony opposition.

I would not still be roaming the face of this planet if I didn't believe this was valuable. All joking aside, I have had to battle expressions of the mind virus that have been able to leave physical scars and damage on me from within the ether realms. I've woken up with snake bites, bullet hole scars, bruises, cuts, bite marks where the teeth have been clearly outlined and a bite that indicated what bit me was really really big. So mmm, I'm used to being a band of One. :)


My reasoning is that our peers and what they think is a valuable part of our own process. I want to know what certain members think about a certain subject. Greater mutual understanding and co-creativity may not always come in a friendly package.

I'm totally, absolutely fine with packages that come with prickly wrapping- in another part of my life I'm rather Goth, so prickly is utterly fine- what I'm not thrilled with is the tendency to globalisation that goes on with Beings who claim to know better, who espouse that *they* know how asleep the 'sheeple' are, that *they* have a handle on What Needs To Be Done. Umm. Mmm. Narp. (brief but pleasurable Hot Fuzz moment). I have expressed my view of what lurks beneath the exterior of 'globalisation' as a way of thinking and there's no way that I have been able to discover to make it work. It simply reseeds crap thinking whenever it's employed.*That* is what I get fangy about: if I didn't enjoy and embrace different perspectives, I would come here. So it's not the difference in perspective that causes the claws to unsheath, it's what is being done in the moment with that perspective. Individuals die every day because some other individual believes that their opinion is more right, appropriate, 'true' or relevant than that of the first. I just can't move that way of thinking to a place where the seeds of these behaviours are not present. I'm open to someone trying to present them in such a way as to obviate the presence of crap and destructive seeds *and* I'm going to employ some pretty hardcore hacker skills on their information and thinking/belief processes. Again, it's how I am and if I'm going to get into a discussion that's what's going to be present.

Is that confrontive? Possibly. We're experiencing a fairly insidious manifesting of mind f*ck on this planet- doesn't it behoove us to be vigorous in weeding it out? That's how I think anyway- *swishes sword through the air*- I'm not one to be patient with mind virus crap, as far as I'm concerned it's gone on long enough, time to dissolve the miasm that supports it and move into healthier realms.


No, the messenger should not be shot, but perhaps the messenger should occasionally be asked the question, "what is it with you and these stupid messages?" *laughing* I thought that's what I was doing...


To be fair, I don't have the energy either to really bang on about David Wilcock. I've been reading the thread and have found it interesting, but only chimed in recently on a particular aspect. The thread title appeals, because it says 'take a look' ... it doesn't say 'tear apart'. We could tear people apart instead of taking a look, but what would be the point? It only bolsters the defenses of those with an emotional investment.

Yes, it was in response to my observation of 'tear apart' instead of 'take a look' that got me involved too, because that's all mind virus inspired behaviour as far as I've been able to discern.


An unusual character I once knew who was a martial arts expert and sometimes did some work for the police force told me that whenever they'd had to chase or fight a suspect, and captured him (Ha, another Withnail quote: "Get in the back of the van!!!"), if they ever asked him what he was thinking or why he did it, etc - the answer would almost invariably be "What?" As I vaguely understand it this is because the fight or flight response makes the body prioritize its energy, and hearing is surplus to requirements in those moments. *nodding* total agreement there, which is why I find creating that condition quite counter productive.


There's a time and a place for tearing apart too, I suppose. Not here though.

Now I'm curious- where would you consider that to be appropriate? In what context, or around what?


There are some opinions I have about Wilcock that his devotees would dislike, but they're only a part of my whole opinion, and he clearly does have some interesting things to say.

Personally, as long as you weren't making them as Pronouncement of Authority From on High, I don't think sharing your perspective would be problematic at all, but I can see how you would conclude that. I'm not a devotee of any Being *and* I"m aware of the intensity with which some people approach their experience around such things.


p.s. personally I find 9eagle9's 'broken record' to often be the sort that's constructive. That's what I mean about the views of our peers. I have yet to experience that personally and I have no doubt that you have experienced otherwise- horses for courses. :D


and don't want any fights in the pub!

can't promise that at *all*, because don't you know how amusing and cathartic pub brawls can be? As long as all the Jedis have left their lightsabres behind the bar- those guys can really bring the tone of a good pub brawl down, one severed limb and the fun really leaves the building...


p.p.s remind me never to play darts with you.

Hey, if I *hit* you with a dart, it's not going to be accidental, and we don't have to be playing together for me to hit you with a dart. :P

[K626]

I think this is a very important post, Sebastasoul.

I have come to the conclusion that anyone - and I mean anyone - that offers me the viewpoint that the Global Rulers/Dark Cabal is wounded, on the run, in retreat, (or worst of all) "already defeated...it's just a matter of time" is so full of organic fertilizer that their eyes are brown.

Here in the wool factory known as the United States, I would guess that 70% or more are utterly and totally clueless that they have even been 'gamed' by banksters! This isn't esoteric information, or a deep black-op secret that I'm talking about, it has been laid out for all to see - even in the mainstraem media! So if 70% don't even know that debt money is a scam, that artificial inflationary and deflationary cycles to create booms and busts and consolidate wealth is a scam, that quasi-monetary "instruments" like derivatives is a scam and had the full support of the US Congress, and that 98% of all US Congresspersons are "on the take" from banksters... if the vast majority of my fellow citizens cannot even catch on to the most obvious and fully exposed scams, what are the odds that they are aware there is even a group of top-of-the-pyramid Global Controllers - controlling much of our lives? I'd say zero percent chance. Most of these people think the financial problems were caused by poor people lying on mortgage credit applications. I'm not kidding you!

Take that one more level, look at the 30% that have at least some awareness that there are bad guys in corporate and banking boardrooms, and try to find the percentage of people that know that there is a tier beyond those boardrooms, a tier of Global Controllers. From that small percentage, what percentage have ever even heard of MKULTRA? Out of that teeny tiny percentage, (some of whom visit 'alternative media' websites, like Avalon) how many might even entertain the notion that David Wilcock could be the unwitting mouthpiece for the Global Rulers? I'd guess the percentage is very, very low.

I like your hypothesis. If David is not outright controlled, I believe that he is sincere but naive, feels a bit like Batman's sidekick Robin (in that "insiders" tell him all about the batcave), and is an easy target for a fun blend of info and disinfo. The mountains of gold story, the Federal Reserve bonds, the implications of imminent arrests and equitable distribution of money... at what point does it start to smell like the NWO getting the "aware" crowd to stand down, and to emotionally prepare for a One World currency delivered by the "White Hats"?

Dennis

He's primarily a businessman with secondary dulusions of grandeur, mixed within all that is some kind of personal emotive drive that sometimes produces moments of clarity. There is a prevailing theme of the 'other' which is beyond the scope of the everyday and it is within this that he plies his trade. I sometimes browse him as he triggers ideas and it is good shorthand to take a bearing of the prevailing wind. ;)


Peace

K

[Borden]

My broad response to your post, songsfortheotherkind, is ... yarp.

The tearing apart question is a tricky one. I'd rather not cite instances because the dredging up of old hassles would not be productive here. I think that there are certain behaviours where a victim is involved that may need someone to step in and do a little tearing apart. Certainly not over a harmless belief or assertion though.

I do agree about the insidious mind-f**k on this planet, but I have mixed feelings about weeding it out. It's not my job. Unless it becomes my interest. I realized long ago that it doesn't matter what I think, what I've figured out, what I feel ... another person will only be affected by it if they're heading in the vague direction of that particular idea already. The same applies to me - I'm not being arrogant. I don't have all the answers, obviously - I just mean those specific areas I feel I've engaged and know something about. Quite honestly, I find a level of stupidity and acceptance in this world that angers me. The treatment of animals for instance is something that makes me sometimes think that the human race deserves everything it gets from the dark powers that enslave it. Everyone's got a heart and a brain the same as me ... why can't they figure it out? (Is it because I'm a Nordic Jedi? Shhh!)

As for David Wilcock (frantically attempting to get back on topic) ... it's quite recent events that have informed my opinion. As I said, he has some very interesting things to say. That doesn't make him completely reliable in my eyes, or even completely honest - but it does mean I won't dismiss him on the basis of a conflict in my views. After all, anyone who Graham Hancock will sit and chat with on film has to be okay.

Borden

p.s. I will wear a storm-troopers helmet when in the pub with you.

[songsfortheotherkind]

I will answer you at a time that is not disgusting o'clock *and*-


p.s. I will wear a storm-troopers helmet when in the pub with you.

*grins at you in appreciation* I like your style- plus it's a geek fetish thing. *laughing*

[9eagle9]

Because David isn't the warrior he bragged to be doesn't have much to do with his work or if it's faulty. That's already been established. It has more to do with 'if David is so convinced of his theories,why doesn't he follow his own advice." David Wilcocks the self proclaimed expert on psy ops doesn't know how to cope with a psy ops directed at him?

More so why would his fans expect us to follow his own advice, when he doesn't follow it? for that matter why don't his fans and devotees follow his advice yet there is a portion of the forum that should be exeptcted to when the author himself and his fans don't.


This may leave a inkling of deserved suspiscion that perhaps David doesn't think his advice is very good either, if he doesn't feel compelled to follow it.

[jaybee]

.


David takes a 'serious look' at the Pineal Gland....


igxygG5MWiw



:thumb:


.

[9eagle9]

Is it a serious look at pineal glands in general or do we take the risk of viewing a long dissertation about how wonderful David's pineal gland is?

Does it mention anything about how you don't need a pineal gland to access one's higher intellgience?

Or perhaps explore the notion that we accept the fact we all have pineal glands based on someone else's authority mostly the already corrupt medical community. The same way we accepted that all of us have a reptilian brain? How would we know. Did we cut our heads open to find out?

[Borden]

The clip jaybee posted just made me warm to him a bit. Not sure whether I should be worried now!

I think I like him a lot better talking about this sort of thing than global financial scams and threats on his life.

Borden

[9eagle9]

I like him a lot better when his hand is over his mouth rather than having his foot inserted there.

[jimbojp]

It's all well and good having a nice talk about the pineal gland, but what does it achieve.
blah blah blah.
I think the chinese call it sifu syndrome, you know when all the energy gets trapped in your head.
Bit of a distraction, if you ask me.
Yawn.

[Mike]

Because David isn't the warrior he bragged to be doesn't have much to do with his work or if it's faulty. That's already been established. It has more to do with 'if David is so convinced of his theories,why doesn't he follow his own advice." David Wilcocks the self proclaimed expert on psy ops doesn't know how to cope with a psy ops directed at him?

More so why would his fans expect us to follow his own advice, when he doesn't follow it? for that matter why don't his fans and devotees follow his advice yet there is a portion of the forum that should be exeptcted to when the author himself and his fans don't.


This may leave a inkling of deserved suspiscion that perhaps David doesn't think his advice is very good either, if he doesn't feel compelled to follow it.


it's a valid point, but it doesn't mean the advice isn't good, neccesarily. some advice is more easily followed than others...i.e.my mother is a smoker and has frequently urged me to never take up the habit, but she continues to smoke.

i can understand the criticism here up to a point, as recent events have not helped the man's credibility. but before we start throwing stones, we should all probably remind ourselves that we have no idea what enduring a psy ops attack is like. assuming this is all true, go ahead and combine that with death threats from the most powerful organization on earth, and i don't think there's a single one of us here that wouldn't be wimpering like a child.

i am neither a supporter nor detractor of Wilcock. open discussion of the man's credibility is reasonable and encouraged, but if i'm going to hold anything against him it's going to be repeated faulty predictions and irresponsible letting out of unconfirmed reports from dubious 'sources', not his commercial appeal or his emotional outburst. he's off the hook in those areas, in my book anyway.

[9eagle9]

Thus why people intiate in these discussions they aren't supposed to. To find out if the information is good.I don't have any problems with his advice on psy ops and auto hypnosis. At least not the sorts of problems the author has experienced with him. Thus my stance he should follow his own advice.




Because David isn't the warrior he bragged to be doesn't have much to do with his work or if it's faulty. That's already been established. It has more to do with 'if David is so convinced of his theories,why doesn't he follow his own advice." David Wilcocks the self proclaimed expert on psy ops doesn't know how to cope with a psy ops directed at him?

More so why would his fans expect us to follow his own advice, when he doesn't follow it? for that matter why don't his fans and devotees follow his advice yet there is a portion of the forum that should be exeptcted to when the author himself and his fans don't.


This may leave a inkling of deserved suspiscion that perhaps David doesn't think his advice is very good either, if he doesn't feel compelled to follow it.


it's a valid point, but it doesn't mean the advice isn't good, neccesarily. some advice is more easily followed than others...i.e.my mother is a smoker and has frequently urged me to never take up the habit, but she continues to smoke.

i can understand the criticism here up to a point, as recent events have not helped the man's credibility. but before we start throwing stones, we should all probably remind ourselves that we have no idea what enduring a psy ops attack is like. assuming this is all true, go ahead and combine that with death threats from the most powerful organization on earth, and i don't think there's a single one of us here that wouldn't be wimpering like a child.

i am neither a supporter nor detractor of Wilcock. open discussion of the man's credibility is reasonable and encouraged, but if i'm going to hold anything against him it's going to be repeated faulty predictions and irresponsible letting out of unconfirmed reports from dubious 'sources', not his commercial appeal or his emotional outburst. he's off the hook in those areas, in my book anyway.

[gripreaper]

I was going to try and take a look at my pineal gland, but it's in the middle of my brain and it's only the size of a walnut.

So I grabbed my cordless drill and put a one inch auger bit in it and held it up to my head, and then changed my mind.

[foreverfan]

So much of this thread has gone to crap.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_t9D_ovmGhQE/R5gH8_fnbbI/AAAAAAAAMgs/GOoHs1SGbCw/s400/Kitten+gun.jpg

[9eagle9]

Dummy. you're supposed to use a sharpened stick ;)


I was going to try and take a look at my pineal gland, but it's in the middle of my brain and it's only the size of a walnut.

So I grabbed my cordless drill and put a one inch auger bit in it and held it up to my head, and then changed my mind.

[9eagle9]

Raises hand.

I have question what is a thread supposed to do? After the first few pages of heated posts an equally heated rebuttals out as about information as can be exhanged has been? Is it required that thread 'be' something. Become something and when it doesn't its some sort of **** or failure? Most threads in here don't ever become anything more than archives.
...
What would that be ? Why does it have to 'be' anything --**** or otherwise. What defines a goes to **** thread? Is it lack of agreement, lack of disagreement, disagreement in general or lack of interest ?Is it allowed to die a dignified death, or is it serving some sort of purpose. What about threads that are full of truth and facts and someone shouts them down because those facts didn't make them feel good? what are those callled?

What is the purpose of the thread? Like will we file a summary and a report. Is it official , or legal and can used as evidence in a lawful court against any miscreants? Is it a standard we must live our life by? If it goes to **** or dies a quiet death or become a means of entertainment should we be concerned? Which one should it be? We don't know the function of the thread serves exactly why does it matter if it goes to ****?

What does that mean exactly. That a consensus and agreement hasn't been met over the thread topic?. Is one necessary?

That would interesting if pounded a topic to death, make an agreement from it and the laid it rest. And then the subject couldnt' be brought up again unless some one made a motion stating they had new information concering a topic that could breath new life into the dead thread file. I particularly like this idea for egotistical self serving reasons so I'm not reading 'new' spiritual concepts that I was readiing about 15 years ago, 'new conspiracy theories that have been around for 50 years. and 'news' that I was reading about 5 years ago. I am also egotisically put off by people who discovered chakras yesterday and is trying to show that a topic of that nature is the answer to our probems and its not really. No more than it was 5000 years ago.

Making a comparsion between the discovery of a pineal and the discovery of one's penis typically ends up with the same result.

[Explodey]

Indeed.


I really like what David says... but his MASSIVE EGO gets in the way... (along with some repetitive commercial referencing).

If he's right - I look forward to stepping through my backyard stargate with my Daddy from Atlantis... :flypig:

x

[araucaria]

Not quite sure what this post has to do with mine you quote. Confusing spirituality with beliefs is not something I go in for. Neither am I suggesting that spirituality should be the focus of this forum. You can talk about whatever you like including the weather, but you do so either taking or not taking the spiritual angle into account. That's all I was saying.


As noted elsewhere Avalon isn't JUST a temple for conscious work shopping, spirituality or a religious temple. There is no prohibition in the guidelines that say 'leave your ego at the door'.

Is it it a requirement for people to be spiritual to discuss anything in here? With 5000 belief systems and everyone thinking theirs is the most important, its very impossible for each member to toe the line and not offend or challenge that many belief systems in play. Chances are someone's ego is going to be stepped on. How well one manages themselves reveals how well their checking their ego. No one is required to check their ego, they just have to make sure their ego remains with the realms of a certain standard of conduct. That includes squealing that one is hurt because their idol was scrutinized.

People confuse spirituality with belief. Because someone invests their utter faith and ourtight devotion to David doens't automatically make them spiritual. That's coat tail spirituality. Then they have an opportunity to squawk and moan when someeone observes that he has obviated discrepancies between what he talks and what he walks. Your belief in him does not make him above reproach. The devotees feel they are being criticized when its actually David who is being scrutinized here. No one is critiquing his fan base and if his fans are taking it personally they have to follow their own advice and manage their ego.


This is how deceptions are kept in place by devotees.




As a forum of, let’s just say, spiritually minded folks, Avalon should be trying to get above ego-filled bitchiness and involuntarily judgmental amateur diagnoses (eg the Asperger’s label).

If we just take a compassionate view of everyone – everyone – we tend towards understanding people as well as what is to be taken from their message. The abuser is usually someone who has been abused, and even the worst abuser needs to be treated as a human with issues (granted, possibly too big for us to handle alone) rather than some inhuman monster.

If we cannot show humanity to our fellow earthling humans, then we are not ready to be mixing with Martians, still less with Greys. They too must be shown humanity, or if the word seems too restrictive, compassion. The ‘ET threat’ is largely of our own making because we fail to see this.

Regarding those who would separate the wheat and the chaff, they seem to have got the wrong end of the stick. To the contrary, the biblical parable of the wheat and the tares makes it quite clear that such attempts at weeding out would kill the wheat crop. Babies and bathwater come to mind :)

[Soda]

9. I frankly don't know what to think about David's extreme ad nauseum self-congratulatory egotism. Would it fit that it could be an insecure alter sort of proud of/congratulating the smart alter in him?...and that's how he can do it so unabashedly egomanaically? And was the Cayce part some software yahoo in psy-ops thinking "hey.. I got it!... the new age crowd will really buy this.."? It may even be child's play to have produced a baby with facial features for this future purpose. Or I'm just sick and tired of his ego.

10. His 50-song debut album went nowhere and things sure got quiet about the movie Convergence. Now he's got how many? $10k or more investors who bought into the glowing sales pitch promoting a far-more-generous-than-average payback 3 years ago adding up to maybe $500,000 waiting for some return. I remember reading that at the new screenwriter's suggestion, the movie premise was changed to the aftermath of the Dec. 21, 2012 'ascension' rather than the before evidence, and now we're going to know what happens after Dec. 21 sooner than any predictive movie gets finished. And what happened to the 1st round of $250?k besides the 2nd round of $250?k supposedly raised just for the screenwriter?





Do you know if any of David's investors are on this forum? Thank you. :)

[waves]

.......10. His 50-song debut album went nowhere and things sure got quiet about the movie Convergence. Now he's got how many? $10k or more investors who bought into the glowing sales pitch promoting a far-more-generous-than-average payback 3 years ago adding up to maybe $500,000 waiting for some return. I remember reading that at the new screenwriter's suggestion, the movie premise was changed to the aftermath of the Dec. 21, 2012 'ascension' rather than the before evidence, and now we're going to know what happens after Dec. 21 sooner than any predictive movie gets finished. And what happened to the 1st round of $250?k besides the 2nd round of $250?k supposedly raised just for the screenwriter?

Do you know if any of David's investors are on this forum? Thank you. :)

No one here has acknowledged being one of the investors that I've noticed. I'd sure like to hear what the story they're being told is now. It's long past the delivery date of all the dazzling projections used to entice interest.

[Soda]

.......10. His 50-song debut album went nowhere and things sure got quiet about the movie Convergence. Now he's got how many? $10k or more investors who bought into the glowing sales pitch promoting a far-more-generous-than-average payback 3 years ago adding up to maybe $500,000 waiting for some return. I remember reading that at the new screenwriter's suggestion, the movie premise was changed to the aftermath of the Dec. 21, 2012 'ascension' rather than the before evidence, and now we're going to know what happens after Dec. 21 sooner than any predictive movie gets finished. And what happened to the 1st round of $250?k besides the 2nd round of $250?k supposedly raised just for the screenwriter?

Do you know if any of David's investors are on this forum? Thank you. :)

No one here has acknowledged being one of the investors that I've noticed. I'd sure like to hear what the story they're being told is now. It's long past the delivery date of all the dazzling projections used to entice interest.

Thank you for responding. I am one of David's investors. There is no "story" being told at all. There has been no contact for three years. I have tried to reach him several times. It was promised to us that he would provide regular updates on the project. But so far, I have gotten nothing even close to what was agreed to in writing. I was wondering if maybe it was just "me" that hadn't heard back from David since I wired the funds, or if other investors had been successful at reaching him. At this point I have let go of any attachment to the money. It's gone as far as I am concerned. I made a bad decision and have to live with it. Was just curious if anyone else had any information. Thanks again.

[DNA]

Excellent writing by Waves. The initial thrust of this thread is excellent. Many thanks to Waves for the time and effort put forth.

[Rozzy]

When it comes to david Wilcock and his speak I consider it leaverite, I do not even find him entertaining. The things he preaches are not deep and enlightening, they are confused and are like following rabbit trails, bafflegab at best, IMHO.

[Luke Holiday]

Waves

Thank you, As I can see now your post was and continues to be very insightful - thank you for sharing this with me 6 years later. Your info is hands down the most helpful in allowing me to come to a new perspective on DW and SSP information as a whole

Blessings

Luke

[bluestflame]

Have never felt right about david wilcock, something felt off , at first it was just his constant reference to OTHER people making a comparison between himself and Edgar Cayce , but as time passed i felt it was something hidden , inauthentic

lack of the ESSENCE he was alluding to

[Joe from the Carolinas]

The ridiculousness that this man has become is literally palpable. I had to make a statement. Mr Wilcock, it’s medication time.

WE36fC0cfKA

[Foxie Loxie]

:ROFL::ROFL::ROFL: You really had me laughing!! I guess it's the same 'ol, same 'ol....Follow the Money theme!! :wof: The "campy" music was wonderful! :Music::Music:

Down through the ages, people have made a "decision" which direction they want to take & Logic & Reason have nothing to do with it! :doh: I do hope the threats towards you have have ceased!

Looks like the people who have decided to follow this particular train do not wish to think for themselves. Been there....done that myself! Just thankful that after 70 years a whole new world opened up for me! :boom:

Such a pleasure to here you here on Avalon with your discerning insight!! :first: