Free man/woman movement

[scootiep]

Hi all,

I have just been watching a guy called Simon Spaniard on EDGE TV http://www.emtvonline.co.uk/home.phpand he was talking about the Freeman movement.

If you don't know what this is then check out this website;

http://www.yourstrawman.com/

When you were born your parents unknowingly signed you over to the state by applying for a birth certificate creating your ficticious "strawman" or "entity".

But you as a person never signed into this agreement your parents did, so you have a right to come out of the system and become a freeman - meaning you never have to pay any taxes, fines, loans etc...

I really recommended everybody into looking into this subject, it's very interesting and if we know our legal rights we can all become free from slavery.

:happy:

[Ernie Nemeth]

Really good article. Read it through although I already knew most of it.
In this public arena, that's all I wish to say.
Thanks

[sdv]

Could we please change freeman to free person!

[karelia]

Could we please change freeman to free person!

LOL, no. A person is that fictional entity, your strawman. YOU are NOT a person; you are a human being of flesh and blood. If you have such a desire to be politically correct, refer to freeman/freewoman.

[jorr lundstrom]

Lord Sidious on this subject on Nexus NetiZen Radio tonight ( in 4 hrs 37 min)
Link below


http://nexus.2012info.ca/forum/showthread.php?10496-NeXus-NetiZen-Radio-Show-Topic-April-20th-2012


All is well


Jorr 2.0

[Mozart]

I really recommended everybody into looking into this subject, it's very interesting and if we know our legal rights we can all become free from slavery.




scootiep ~


Thanks for posting this.


Karelia is spot-on with her comment that we really can't use the term, "person", so to avoid the use of trap words, it can be cumbersome and I've not yet solved that dilemma.


Anyway, about "legal rights" -- if you exist and are active in the "legal" world, you have NO LEGAL RIGHTS, only revokable privileges.


"Legal" = color-of-law crap, i.e., Maritime/Admiralty "laws" that undergird the UCC Code, etc.


"Lawful" = Inalienable Rights that are given to us by the Creator and not even Substantive Laws can abridge them, except by one violating the Rights of another, or by agreement to delegate one's sovereign powers to a de jure body of some kind -- local, county, state or federal -- that makes it easier to live in a shared reality with other sovereign People of the Land.


So, remember -- LEGAL = color-of-law crap! Always!

[Maria Stade]

Lord Sidious on this subject on Nexus NetiZen Radio tonight ( in 4 hrs 37 min)
Link below


http://nexus.2012info.ca/forum/showthread.php?10496-NeXus-NetiZen-Radio-Show-Topic-April-20th-2012


All is well


Jorr 2.0

Ok thank you time to make som coffie ..and then I will be all ear :ear: 11 min from now.

[scootiep]

Could we please change freeman to free person!

Lol i have changed the thread to Free Man/Woman movement :)

[modwiz]

Could we please change freeman to free person!

Lol i have changed the thread to Free Man/Woman movement :)

Weakling. :jester:

Remember, it's happy holidays, not merry christmas. :p

[scootiep]

Could we please change freeman to free person!

Lol i have changed the thread to Free Man/Woman movement :)

Weakling. :jester:

Remember, it's happy holidays, not merry christmas. :p

Lol maybe but sometimes it makes life easier to agree with them :cool:

[ThePythonicCow]

Lol i have changed the thread to Free Man/Woman movement :)
I changed the thread title to that ... the forum software allows the thread poster to change the title on the opening post ... but only mods can change the thread title showing up on all the other posts.

[Straker]

In my personal opinion, one of the most knowledgeable in this area is Thomas Anderson.

http://www.theclassifiedfiles.com

I have the whole series and highly recommend them.

He also has talks on youtube and there is an animation called "Meet your Strawman" which is based on his research. I hear that even Jordon Maxwell has a set of his books.

NB: I just took a quick look at that site you mentioned at the beginning of this thread, and to be honest, in my own opinion and no offense intended, it's VERY basic stuff compared with TA's work. At least there are a few good links though.

The important thing I think is that all people should be aware of the strawman/woman/person info, so that they can better be informed and know their true place in this universe.

Thanks for starting this topic.

Best
Straker

[scootiep]

Lol i have changed the thread to Free Man/Woman movement :)
I changed the thread title to that ... the forum software allows the thread poster to change the title on the opening post ... but only mods can change the thread title showing up on all the other posts.

cheers Paul, you the man!

[kersley]

Scootiep..
Me and a few friends are practicing this way of life. I had conversation with Lord Sid about this also. He is very knowledgeable on this subject.
Maybe you can form a group here in the UK with regular meet ups and our numbers will grow. we could share information and so on..
What do you think?

[Straker]

Hi Kersley,

I just noticed you joined the forum on 11:1:11 which is pretty cool, there's a thread here on the 11:11 phenomenon.

Back to the strawman thing, I've personally been practicing this way of life now since 2004, and I know there are a great many groups out there, including the UK and Ireland and the numbers are increasing all the time. I would recommend contacting Thomas Anderson to perhaps find out if he has some contacts on his database, which must be in the thousands. For a couple of dollars, you can get his E-Books, but I found the physical printed versions far superior. If you get the Kindle ones on Amazon, best use a computer and a reader rather than a tablet due to the large file size and layouts.

His email is: classifiedbook@gmail.com

Best
Straker

[scootiep]

Scootiep..
Me and a few friends are practicing this way of life. I had conversation with Lord Sid about this also. He is very knowledgeable on this subject.
Maybe you can form a group here in the UK with regular meet ups and our numbers will grow. we could share information and so on..
What do you think?

Hi Kersley :)

To be honest I am a complete newbie on this subject, but after watching the programme on Thursday I really wanted other people to know about this movement and also wanted to be part of it.

How long have you been practising? I feel really strong about this subject and I would love to learn more, it would be great to form a local group and learn and help each other, let's fight against the machine!

Have you read about the Bikenhead case with roger hayes winning a court battle against the local council?

http://www.nocounciltax.com/courts/wirral-judge-tells-council-prove-case-council-tax-hearing/

The group you talk about could fight against the courts and represent others - now that would be superb!!

But small steps first hey, we need to (like you say) share information and knowledge.

I think forming a group would be a great idea, not sure about creating a group as I don't know enough on the subject but I would be very interested in joining a group of like minded people like yourself and your friends, I would have a few friends and family interested too.

[Straker]

Hi everyone,

I just had a look at Thomas Anderson's e-books for sale on Amazon, and noticed that you can "Look Inside"...so for anyone interested, you can read the first 10 pages of any of his books for free!

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Ddigital-text&field-keywords=thomas+anderson+classified

Straker

[kersley]

Scootiep..
Me and a few friends are practicing this way of life. I had conversation with Lord Sid about this also. He is very knowledgeable on this subject.
Maybe you can form a group here in the UK with regular meet ups and our numbers will grow. we could share information and so on..
What do you think?

Hi Kersley :)

To be honest I am a complete newbie on this subject, but after watching the programme on Thursday I really wanted other people to know about this movement and also wanted to be part of it.

How long have you been practising? I feel really strong about this subject and I would love to learn more, it would be great to form a local group and learn and help each other, let's fight against the machine!

Have you read about the Bikenhead case with roger hayes winning a court battle against the local council?

http://www.nocounciltax.com/courts/wirral-judge-tells-council-prove-case-council-tax-hearing/

The group you talk about could fight against the courts and represent others - now that would be superb!!

But small steps first hey, we need to (like you say) share information and knowledge.

I think forming a group would be a great idea, not sure about creating a group as I don't know enough on the subject but I would be very interested in joining a group of like minded people like yourself and your friends, I would have a few friends and family interested too.

If you could send me a private message to share your location, we could meet up and discuss this further. Even better come to the London meet up?
Like you, I'm no expert but I'm learning quickly. The books mentioned in the above post is a good place to start.

[thunder24]

Hi everyone,

I just had a look at Thomas Anderson's e-books for sale on Amazon, and noticed that you can "Look Inside"...so for anyone interested, you can read the first 10 pages of any of his books for free!

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Ddigital-text&field-keywords=thomas+anderson+classified

Straker

you have in three posts recommended this dudes work, with few posts inbetween.... are u getting any royalties from the work...


Why would u continue to use a system that is still under "their" thumb... "give unto ceasar what is ceasar's" or somethign like that.... u birthcertificate, drivers and social..etc.. that would b a truly soveiregn movement there. Don't play "their" game, by "their" rules. "They" make the rules... people are still going to jail, while argueing freeman/strawman/postman...

what does it mean to practice this way of life?

freedom doesn't take reading a book, it takes one's conscious decision to not play the game anymore...

Not much has changed since Waco and Ruby Ridge...


peace

[thunder24]

LDYDzQs6RV0

nNm8woCQ4WM

6 minutes and 7 seconds...listen

This work was compiled for free produced for free and given for free...

[Lost N Found]

Well since this subject has been broached, Has anyone heard of "adhesion contracts"? You might tty looking up Winston Shrout, Robb ryder and a whole host of others on the web. There is so much out there about your Strawman, your birth certificate and you name it, it is there. Try looking up HJR 192, Public law 73-10 all done in 1933 and 1934. When you start diving down these rabbit holes you are going to be overwelmed believe me. I have been there and have been a sovereign for a while. Do please use discernment and please learn to own it for yourself. Try Augustus Blackstone and check this web site out www.freedomforallseasons.com

I am sure that there are alot of you that have been down these rabbit holes and bless you all.


Loves transcends all

[thunder24]

does one need to ask permission from another to b free or sovereign!?
Must one follow a law to be free? Who made this law?

[Lost N Found]

does one need to ask permission from another to b free or sovereign!?
Must one follow a law to be free? Who made this law?

No one does not have to ask to be free or a sovereign, That is your God given right. The thing that happened was corruption of all of this by greed and evil men who think nothing more than how much money they can make or power over another or all. You can research how all this came about. Check, central banking and who owns them, Checkout Rothschilds, Rockerfellers, that is just a start. We gave up our freedoms and sovereignty at birth without ever knowing it. This is called adhesion contracts,, somewhat. Drivers license or any license for that matter is an adhesion contract and we willing give the PTB all of this through a rotten educational system and GET THE HELL AWAY FROM THAT STUPID TV because it is nothing more than a distraction and brainwash tool by the PTB.

We have always been free and sovereign, we just forgot how to hold on to that.


Love transcends all

[thunder24]

does one need to ask permission from another to b free or sovereign!?
Must one follow a law to be free? Who made this law?

No one does not have to ask to be free or a sovereign, That is your God given right. The thing that happened was corruption of all of this by greed and evil men who think nothing more than how much money they can make or power over another or all. You can research how all this came about. Check, central banking and who owns them, Checkout Rothschilds, Rockerfellers, that is just a start. We gave up our freedoms and sovereignty at birth without ever knowing it. This is called adhesion contracts,, somewhat. Drivers license or any license for that matter is an adhesion contract and we willing give the PTB all of this through a rotten educational system and GET THE HELL AWAY FROM THAT STUPID TV because it is nothing more than a distraction and brainwash tool by the PTB.

We have always been free and sovereign, we just forgot how to hold on to that.


Love transcends all

then give to ceasar that which is his...and b free...its that simple.... Im not saying what will come against u is simple to stand up too.... but the act and understanding of ur sovereign status is simple... it takes no understanding of common law, as this is under "their" control.

[Straker]

you have in three posts recommended this dudes work, with few posts inbetween.... are u getting any royalties from the work...


Why would u continue to use a system that is still under "their" thumb... "give unto ceasar what is ceasar's" or somethign like that.... u birthcertificate, drivers and social..etc.. that would b a truly soveiregn movement there. Don't play "their" game, by "their" rules. "They" make the rules... people are still going to jail, while argueing freeman/strawman/postman...

what does it mean to practice this way of life?

freedom doesn't take reading a book, it takes one's conscious decision to not play the game anymore...

Not much has changed since Waco and Ruby Ridge...


peace


Hello thunder24,

Thankyou for your input. Remember, this is a thread about the Free man/woman movement, so I would be inclined to believe that any relevant information that is useful for members wanting to study this area is to be posted here.

Yes I do recommend Thomas Anderson's work, which I have studied for many years now, as I think he is one of the most useful and consolidated sources on the topic.

I started with Mary Croft, moved on to Winston Shrout, listened to all that Rob Menard has to say and had written, watched all the Strawman videos, been involved with this topic on SuiJuris about 9 years ago, listened to John Harris (who gets his info from Thomas), watched everything by Jordon Maxwell (who has a set of Thomas's books), Mark Pytellek, Arthur, you name it...there are hundreds of "guru's" out there.

However, I choose to identify with Thomas's books, as I think they are better presented, better written, make sense, and are purely factual, not speculative or misleading, and are not written in 10 different fonts with 15 different colours, using bold, italic, underlined, cursive, and a dozen different font sizes...all on the same page like a lot of people in this area of research do for some strange reason.

To answer your other question, no, I do not get any royalties from suggesting his work, I merely wanted to give people who weren't aware of it the opportunity to access it. Apologies if this upset you, but you have to remember that many people are not as knowledgeable about the topic as others, and you appear to know something about it already.

To answer your other question about "what does it mean to practice this way of life?"

I would first tell people that it is not something you learn, but it something you feel. It is about a conscious decision to accept full responsibility for your own thoughts and actions.

It is about knowing what is real, and is not real, and what a living thing is, and what a legal entity is.

It is about making choices based upon love and care for others, and about letting go of the system of control we have all been born into, slowly and deliberately.

Some of the things that go along with living as a sovereign include surrendering your drivers licence and travelling in peace , closing all your bank accounts and not feeding the bankers, not voting anymore as governments only make policy and not laws, and continue to make wars, being self sufficient and not relying on the system, growing your own food, harnessing your own energy from nature, living in peace and harmony and doing no harm to anyone.

I simply do not participate in the Roman system, their system or whatever anyone labels it, which is sometimes challenging, however it is also very empowering.

People who are doing something wrong, are obviously going to jail.

It is all choice and all about your state of mind.

Straker

[thunder24]

Some of the things that go along with living as a sovereign include surrendering your drivers licence and travelling in peace , closing all your bank accounts and not feeding the bankers, not voting anymore as governments only make policy and not laws, and continue to make wars, being self sufficient and not relying on the system, growing your own food, harnessing your own energy from nature, living in peace and harmony and doing no harm to anyone.



Straker

ANY body wanna voice chat on skype sometime about this...let it b known.

I agree these are things that are part of beign sovereign...but strawman, common law, etc....is DISTRACTIONARY. It is only for those that still want to play the game... do u think u can beat them at their own game!?

Its simple. and the above that i quoted from u, is a large part of the simplicity. No everyone does not have the same level of awareness on the subject nor understanding...that is correct... so why make it complicated for them...

Curious, did u surrender ur D.L., close ur accounts, harness ur own energy? I have not, before u ask.



http://finance.yahoo.com/news/jailed-for--280--the-return-of-debtors--prisons.html

Under the law, debtors aren't arrested for nonpayment, but rather for failing to respond to court hearings, pay legal fines, or otherwise showing "contempt of court" in connection with a creditor lawsuit. That loophole has lawmakers in the Illinois House of Representatives concerned enough to pass a bill in March that would make it illegal to send residents of the state to jail if they can't pay a debt. The measure awaits action in the senate.

[thunder24]

straker,

what do u think of king anthony's materials? do u know where he has been or what he has experienced in life?

A retired Avalon member that has spoken extensively on the subject, given real life situations as example, and presented it for free and simple.

[Straker]

"Curious, did u surrender ur D.L., close ur accounts, harness ur own energy? I have not, before u ask."

Hi thunder24,

Yes, I surrendered my drivers license in 2006, closed all my bank accounts in 2008, bought gold and silver with the fiat notes they gave me, and invested in solar panels, deep cycle batteries and wind power. We also grow all our own vegetables and have 16 chickens.

Sorry, I haven't heard of King Anthony...do you have any links? I've only been studying strawman stuff since 2004.

Straker

[Straker]

I do agree with thunder24, in that the only way to beat them at their game is not to play it. It's like the scene from War Games with the WOPR computer trying to figure out how to nuke the other side with acceptable losses.

The way that I personally stay safe, free and happy, is to exclude thoughts of anything else, hence I no longer study or research the strawman/freeman thing...BUT it's important to know it before you can forget about it, which is why I mention TA's work, as he says the same thing.

It is simply better to attract positive situations through conscious intent, than to dwell upon and attract negative ones through subconscious fear.

After all it is the fear that is your enemy, not the NWO or Freemasons or Government, or Alien Invasion or the boogeyman or any other thing.

I always suggest to people to stop watching the news, stop reading the paper, throw away your mobile phone and start creating your own reality based on what you want it to be.

That's the only real way out of the system.

Straker

[Lost N Found]

I do agree with thunder24, in that the only way to beat them at their game is not to play it. It's like the scene from War Games with the WOPR computer trying to figure out how to nuke the other side with acceptable losses.

The way that I personally stay safe, free and happy, is to exclude thoughts of anything else, hence I no longer study or research the strawman/freeman thing...BUT it's important to know it before you can forget about it, which is why I mention TA's work, as he says the same thing.

It is simply better to attract positive situations through conscious intent, than to dwell upon and attract negative ones through subconscious fear.

After all it is the fear that is your enemy, not the NWO or Freemasons or Government, or Alien Invasion or the boogeyman or any other thing.

I always suggest to people to stop watching the news, stop reading the paper, throw away your mobile phone and start creating your own reality based on what you want it to be.

That's the only real way out of the system.

Straker


Straker, you have the right idea, however, most folks can not completely disconnect themselves from the world. There is the private side and there is the commercial side. The big thread of all of this was the concept of having one foot in the commercial side and one foot in the private side. This is called "Secured Party Creditor" where as you become a creditor and take control of your strawman. Essentially you become the owner or controller of that fiction that the corportions created and stole from you as a real living man/woman on the land.

This is done by filing documents into the public stating your sovereignty. Now I am not real sure if all of this works or is a silver bullet. I do know that I have done this process to some degree and the point is to own all of this for yourself and know who you are. This process essentially will put you half in and half out. This has been done by lots of folks and some have taken hits for it because they do not know how to do it right. If you travel this road it could be very hard on you. Remember, when one messes with the commercial side of things then the defacto gets stirred up like a hornets nest.

I totally agree that one has to back away from all of the adhesion contracts and this (to me) has to be done in small steps to stay under the radar otherwise you will become like Jerry Kane and his son or the Waco fiasco or a whole host of folks that have been murdered or thrown in prison. That does sound like a fearful energy and you are right to say to not let that kind of energy be pulled in. So little things at a time.

I do grow my own food and I am researching the things to be energy free. I still have that driver license and pay insurance and am working on that to. Now you can also work on getting your property out from under the County, State and Federal chains. Robb Ryder started some of this and it does work to some degree.

One of the simplest rescention of signatures is to get away from the voter registration mess. Just a few other thoughts, Acknowlegement of your deed is a fairly simple thing to do. Buy the way, your Birthcertificate is also a deed so this process can work with that also. I have found in my research on this road to sovereignty, that by doing the acknowlegement of the Warranty or Grant deed one has to also do the Land patent with it to virtually make this work through a County to get away from the illegal property tax. These are just a few things to do to move yourself away from defacto and into sovereignty.

Thank you

Steven

[thunder24]

"Curious, did u surrender ur D.L., close ur accounts, harness ur own energy? I have not, before u ask."

Hi thunder24,

Yes, I surrendered my drivers license in 2006, closed all my bank accounts in 2008, bought gold and silver with the fiat notes they gave me, and invested in solar panels, deep cycle batteries and wind power. We also grow all our own vegetables and have 16 chickens.

Sorry, I haven't heard of King Anthony...do you have any links? I've only been studying strawman stuff since 2004.

Straker

i provided links and videos in this thread... you can also check out his profile page on avalon, and the threads started by King Anthony.

While im sure u know quit a bit about strawman "stuff", it is still theirs and part of their system. If one wants to continue to play their game, then yes common law and strawman would b important to that individual. But if one wants to b truly sovereign, then declare it...inform those that need to know...and live

[Straker]

Hi Steven,

You cannot take ownership and control of something that you did not create. The government created the legal fiction that resembles your name. If you are talking UCC, then forget about it, it's a waste of time. Our children were never registered, and whenever the government has asked why, we've simply explained that Regis-Tra-Tion by definition means The Kings Processing Tool, and also that the Commonwealth of Australia is a legal entity registered on the US SEC, and not a landmass or physical location, so it's impossible to be born there.

Straker

[Lost N Found]

Straker, you are so right about this, The UCC is their game and all that stuff about becoming a Secured Party Creditor is still fiction. I have done the UCC-1 and even went through the Turner docs but none of that stuff appears to do any good in this Matrix. I am glad that you have done what you could for your children. That in itself is a very good beginning for them.

My better free living woman on the land and I a free living man on land are proceeding to rescind the Marriage license. Who ever said the State had anything to do with two humans connecting with each other? All of these "license" are nothing more than adhesion contracts to keep one under control. The thing about all of this treasonous, poison on the free sovereigns of this land is that it has been brainwashed into us from birth and we never knew it. This awakening that is going on now and has been going on for quite some time is going to take time to de-brainwash.

I have been agonizing over the Social Security thing for awhile and looked at the application crap today and got very sick over it. I understand the ramifications of collecting that because one essentially places themselves under the 14th amendment citizenship which places one under the Federal Government as an employee and you know that we all live on this rotten plantation. I did send a rescintion of the power of attorney to the Social Security admin last year and never heard from them for at least 4 months and then recieved some stupid form letter with no signature stating that I could not get out of their system. Said something to the effect that the social security was governed by Title 26 USC which is the Internal Revenue Code. Well you know what that is, ain't no Law. Well all of that is for another topic. I believe Russel Means said it very succinctly.

I am enjoying our conversation and maybe you can direct me to other places to get this done. I have been researching and studying this stuff for years and have good folks that know alot about this stuff, and now you are here also, Thank you

Steven

[Phoenix]

Hi everyone,

I just had a look at Thomas Anderson's e-books for sale on Amazon, and noticed that you can "Look Inside"...so for anyone interested, you can read the first 10 pages of any of his books for free!

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Ddigital-text&field-keywords=thomas+anderson+classified

Straker

you have in three posts recommended this dudes work, with few posts inbetween.... are u getting any royalties from the work...


Why would u continue to use a system that is still under "their" thumb... "give unto ceasar what is ceasar's" or somethign like that.... u birthcertificate, drivers and social..etc.. that would b a truly soveiregn movement there. Don't play "their" game, by "their" rules. "They" make the rules... people are still going to jail, while argueing freeman/strawman/postman...

what does it mean to practice this way of life?

freedom doesn't take reading a book, it takes one's conscious decision to not play the game anymore...

Not much has changed since Waco and Ruby Ridge...


peace

One does not simply get out of the matrix by wishing it so. We were plunged into this false reality, so we have to climb our way out, being knowledgeable about the agent smiths along the way..

Consciously, it is a decision in the mind, yes, and I don't fear death, but if I don't figure out how to discharge my student loan debt I will go to prison or screw my co-signer. Just like if others make the mental decision to exit the system, great, but if you are going to just sit there and not use money until you can get on without, you'll die.

Help me understand.

Phoenix

[panopticon]

G'day All,

I will probably listen to this later on but for those interested here's the 'NeXus Netizens Radio Show #9 - Freeman on the Land':

L_kfaVnnfCE
I'm not a member at the other forums but reckon LS knows a lot about the 'sovereign individual versus the legal fabrication' so went in search of the interview mentioned earler by Jorr and Maria.
Kind Regards, :yo:
Panopticon

[learninglight]

I have just started looking into this over the last few weeks and boy is it confusing lol

Thanks for starting this thread i'm sure it will help many that are at tip of this rabbit hole, certainly will me :)

I'm watching Dean C. Clifford 'Both sides of the story parts 1and 2' at the moment and find it quite easy to follow. I'm aware you have to follow your own path but any fed back on Dean would be most welcome

much love

[Lost N Found]

Learninglight, check out Ben Lowry and Winston shrout also, Haven't seen or even heard of Dean C. Clifford so can't comment there. You could also check into Veronica of the Chapman family, she has some very good stuff on being a free woman on the land.

Steven

[gripreaper]

Just like if others make the mental decision to exit the system, great, but if you are going to just sit there and not use money until you can get on without, you'll die.

Help me understand.

Phoenix

And therein lies the rub. The commercial realm, the fiat system, the de facto courts, the corporate governments, the benefits and privileges of being a 14th amendment citizen, are not easy to extract from. Yes, you can do certain things like Straker and eyeswideopen are suggesting, and minimize your exposure, but to completely extricate? How do you eat? How do you pay bills?

Unless you want to be a hermit living way back in the woods, I don't see how just yet. I am watching those who are attempting to access their estate trusts, but so far that has not been successful. Until you can redeem your bills and access your trust account, you cannot fully extricate from the matrix.

Do what you can, and let the energy move in the right direction.

[Bryn ap Gwilym]

Here is nigh on a video version of the op by John Harris - It's an illusion

I did post it a while back, but I guess the timing wasn't right.


http://www.bbc5.tv/video/john-harris-its-illusion

[thunder24]

Here is another linked video for all to share....
Truth hurts, but then again, truth has never really seemed to b cared for..

4qvhPdNXNJs

[Straker]

Here is nigh on a video version of the op by John Harris - It's an illusion

I did post it a while back, but I guess the timing wasn't right.


http://www.bbc5.tv/video/john-harris-its-illusion


Just as a side note: John Harris uses Thomas Anderson's images and info in his videos...for example the Policy Enforcer car. I love it..FORCING THE POLICY UPON YOU...

[Straker]

Straker, you are so right about this, The UCC is their game and all that stuff about becoming a Secured Party Creditor is still fiction. I have done the UCC-1 and even went through the Turner docs but none of that stuff appears to do any good in this Matrix. I am glad that you have done what you could for your children. That in itself is a very good beginning for them.

My better free living woman on the land and I a free living man on land are proceeding to rescind the Marriage license. Who ever said the State had anything to do with two humans connecting with each other? All of these "license" are nothing more than adhesion contracts to keep one under control. The thing about all of this treasonous, poison on the free sovereigns of this land is that it has been brainwashed into us from birth and we never knew it. This awakening that is going on now and has been going on for quite some time is going to take time to de-brainwash.

I have been agonizing over the Social Security thing for awhile and looked at the application crap today and got very sick over it. I understand the ramifications of collecting that because one essentially places themselves under the 14th amendment citizenship which places one under the Federal Government as an employee and you know that we all live on this rotten plantation. I did send a rescintion of the power of attorney to the Social Security admin last year and never heard from them for at least 4 months and then recieved some stupid form letter with no signature stating that I could not get out of their system. Said something to the effect that the social security was governed by Title 26 USC which is the Internal Revenue Code. Well you know what that is, ain't no Law. Well all of that is for another topic. I believe Russel Means said it very succinctly.

I am enjoying our conversation and maybe you can direct me to other places to get this done. I have been researching and studying this stuff for years and have good folks that know alot about this stuff, and now you are here also, Thank you

Steven

Hi Steven,

Thomas explains a great deal about the state marriage thing in his books, and my wife and I have been considering the same thing. I called the registrar to discuss it, and they basically told me over the phone that "you can't do that, unless it's on exceptional grounds". I said, how about fraud, misleading information and the fact that we were not told that the "state" is the third party in the contract.

He said of course the State is the third party, you know that..

I said if I knew that, I would have had a Buddhist wedding.

He said "that wouldn't be a legal marriage"

So I said, but it's perfectly lawful isn't it.."

No comment.

So yes folks, you can be married perfectly lawfully outside the "state" control, but unfortunately that info came a bit late for us. Now we have to try and backtrack.

I might start with a letter that points out that we could not have been married in the "Commonwealth of Australia" as it is merely an artificial legal entity listed in the company search of the US SEC with it's Business Address listed as 1601 MASSACHUSETTS AVE WASHINGTON DC 20036 , and is not a landmass or physical location. (see here)

http://www.sec.gov/cgi-bin/browse-edgar?action=getcompany&CIK=0000805157&owner=exclude&count=40

Thankyou TA for awakening me from my slumber.

Straker

[Straker]

This is the Sovereign Birth doc template that I got from Thomas. We've had it accepted by two government departments so far.

Straker

[thunder24]

[message from king anthony in brief]

A member/poster in another forum (which I do not belong to) asked if they could post previous comments between us; I offered that they may "cut & paste" the below and I thank them in advance for doing so. This version is for PA, as most of the members at this other forum are from here.

Before I begin, I would like to say I am not going to get involved in drama discussion here; meaning, this message from me will be final. In opening, I am not familiar with the topic of discussion in a thread regarding Kerry and C2C in this other forum.

The topic I wish to address, if I may, is the matter of Rob a.k.a. Lord Sidious. In order to understand this topic, the entire of my video titled "Be Wary Of Alternative Forums And False Prophets Of Freedom" should be watched on YouTube; a member here in PA had posted it in this thread.

The other day, a member in this other forum told me about another member in this forum posting the said video - I did not even know this other forum existed until then. I told this person to thank this other member for sharing my efforts in this other forum.

It appears that Rob and other members there are of the opinion that I slandered/backstabbed Rob. At no time did I slander/backstab Rob (or anyone) in the said video. All I stated were the facts of my interaction with Rob during the time we were in touch. He could have rejected it, not that it would change the facts; however, he did not - for he knows I spoke the truth.

Subsequently, Rob left this other forum and apparently (based on comments in the thread) took other members with him. On a side note, I have stated facts and observations of other people and groups I mention in the said video with no ill intent.

As for what he "speaks on", he and others who speak on the currently accepted freedom movements are more then welcome to talk to me about anything I have stated in the said video; these people have been and always will be welcome - to date, not one of these people have despite my attempting to contact them... I wait.

Note, that Rob is not the only person or group I mention in this video (or other videos I have produced). Of course, people here know this, for my videos have been watched in full and my words read in full by the people here (or there), correct? - if not, then not my problem. Perhaps I should be clever as some other people and feed the feel-good of others to gain popularity.

I addressed Rob in my video because he, and people like him, are doing harm to themselves, others who wish to be or are "free" (including me) and everyone overall. These people who speak "common law" nonsense are playing with peoples lives - this is not a game.

Rather then challenge the words I have spoken, people have once again attacked the messenger. What wrong have I stated for anyone to be "off set" by the words I have spoken!? Shame on you for believing this.

Be angry with yourselves, for you have allowed emotions to lead you and not understood what I have presented. I have never once implied, stated or wanted anyone to follow the words I give and have many times wished many people well who wanted to.

I have offered aid to others in understanding facts/truths and distinguishing them from fictions (such as, opinions, theories, beliefs and such). People can disagree on "fictions" (as stated above); however, facts/truths can not be disagreed on - ever, unless one lies to themselves.

I have offered aid in the "how to" in research skills, while highlighting the mental skills needed, such as critical thinking and common sense. I have also shared firsthand experiences on various topics; as well as, my life to the "now" and will continue to do so as long as I can.

I have never offered to be a leader of anything; nor have I stated or implied anyone to believe a word I say - I have always said, seek "this or that" out for yourselves. I have never wanted to be famous from this, nor have I wanted any monetary gain for what I do - as I offer words for free.

The reason people do not engage my me or the words I speak is because I do not feed other's feel-good and I am not interested in debating facts/truths; and not my facts/truths either - thus my observations of forums, which is also presented in the said video.

The title of this other forum speaks one thing; yet, by observation, demonstrates the opposite. When are you people going to really "wakeup", for time is growing shorter. I wish you all well - cheers!!!

As I had stated above, I post this here as most of the members in this other forum are from here (by invite only) and I wish to set the record straight so there are no ill feelings from anyone (here or there) - as I do not have any against others. These are my final words here on this topic.

king anthony

p.s. I had asked thunder24 to post this for me here and he agreed to, so no one attack this messaenger - thank you thunder24.

[Anchor]

I like this topic

Here is a great post on the subject from Robert Menard http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?2505-Slaves-no-more.&p=54895&viewfull=1#post54895

My own take on this, is in the episode of the Nexus radio show (http://nexus.2012info.ca/forum/showthread.php?10572-NeXus-Netizen-Radio-Show-9-Freeman-on-the-Land&p=75243&viewfull=1#post75243), which I was also on, and that was referred to by Jorr earlier in this thread.

The archive is available for download here (http://nexus.2012info.ca/forum/showthread.php?10572-NeXus-Netizen-Radio-Show-9-Freeman-on-the-Land&p=75243&viewfull=1#post75243), but I don't know if you need to be a member or not to download it.

In my opinion, there is no use being free of the "system" unless you are ready to take absolute responsibility, for everything you do and be ready to separate yourself from all the cushy support structures that the system uses to keep you locked in it.

My view is that this is very hard to do on your own, and you are better off attempting this in a community of kindred spirits - as such provides exponentially more power than one alone can muster.

[9eagle9]

You can use the system , understanding it is a system that you can master, you can use the system against itself, or you can transcend the system or you can do all of the above.

Even those who claim they are out of they system are a victim to it.

Those who use the system make it the victim, those who use the system against itself reveal it as a system, those transcend the system assign the system as meaningless. The ability to do all of the above is a means of freedom, you can move in and out of the system depending on what outcome you desire.

If one is mastering/using/ transcending the system it is reflected in one's own life in some fashion.

Providing 'evidence' that Person A is doing the exact same thing as Person B is doing is no evidence at all.

It is not enough to talk about Freeman/ Freewoman, this talk HAS TO BE REFLECTED IN YOUR LIFE IN SOME FASHION.

[Lost N Found]

This is a very good thread for all to at least view and do some of our/your own research into. I posted a web site earlier and inadvertantly gave the wrong link to folks. Here is the proper link for all to research, www.freedomforallseasons.org This site has tons of stuff to puruse.

Anchor in the above comment is right in saying what has been said. Doing what is needed to extracate one's self from the matrix is a very hard and long road indeed. There are very few that I know of that have managed to do this. For the most part we can only do small things to achieve our goals. The whole idea of setting ones self free is mostly a change in our minds. Common sense and responsibility will always play the major role.

Thank you all, Straker and others have given some very good links and other folks to research. This idea of being a freeman/freewomen has been around forever. Use discernment in all things.

Steven

[thunder24]

Do any members here have any documents of court cases, or anything that could be posted, where The Avalon member was successful in court, argueing sovereignty?

any one with documented proof? If thats not to much to ask

peace

[Anchor]

It is not enough to talk about Freeman/ Freewoman, this talk HAS TO BE REFLECTED IN YOUR LIFE IN SOME FASHION.

Exactly.

Personally, I don't seek to be outside the system because I have a need to be a part of the system if I expect to be of any influence in effecting change on that system. However, that system does work to what are basically equitable rules under the covers. Rules which have been usurped and made, through trickery, one sided and consequently very unfair in the effect they have on the proles and the power they give the elite.

This must change.

So the more people learn about the return to a more "natural" justice and a system that is fair - even if it is initially for some one pointed goal of "freedom" is in my books a good thing.

Ultimately we are all as free as we want to be, provided we identify the barriers to that freedom and take advantages of the remedies that are there, are available now, and are being exposed in threads like this and all over the internet.

Don't expect fast results - take it step by step. Understand and ask questions to seek that understanding.

Don't expect this to be some kind of get out of jail card that enables you to act without consequence in ways that are harmful to others.

Do expect this to be the basis for the time I see approaching, in which we are all comfortable with having total responsibility for all we do, and we are all at harmony with ourselves and our other-selves and where we are unafraid of any attempts by those that are on the wane, to regain control.

[Straker]

Do any members here have any documents of court cases, or anything that could be posted, where The Avalon member was successful in court, argueing sovereignty?

any one with documented proof? If thats not to much to ask

peace

Hi Thunder,

Several, I will dig them out and post them. The idea however is not to go to court, as that is their world. Filing the right documents before the case is heard by using the registrar has worked for me in quite a few cases including E-Court.

Also depends on the registrar, as I've had one tear up my document and throw it in the bin, saying "you can't do that", so I went back home, printed it out again, took it into a higher court and it was accepted fine, and the case never got heard.

I've also been very successful against lawyers and debt collectors, again I'll dig out the documents from the files and scan them.

Straker

[Straker]

Okay, here is one example to start with. Sanitized for the privacy of all parties involved.

I was being harassed by a large commercial Lawyer, trying to claim that I owed $73,000 to a car dealer. I hand delivered this letter to the owner of the Law Firm, after being harassed by their lawyers for weeks, and never heard from them again. I told him face to face that I had five letters already from his company, being factual assertions without any proof of claim, which is written libel. Each instance carries a fine of $250k.

That was back in 2006.

Straker

[Straker]

This is the E-Court one I lodged at the Main Registrar on behalf of a friend who had a $7000+ debt, (along with a $45,000 debt which I also settled for him in the private, by asking the questions I got from Thomas Anderson first two books CLASSIFIED and EYES ONLY).

The E-Court case never happened, as there was no entry into the controversy. Again, that was back in 2006, and my friend never heard from them again.

Straker

[9eagle9]

What you just said, 'the case was never heard'.

They don't want those cases heard. The herd might hear them.

Could you describe the process that you used to take it to a higher court. What court did the the registrar refuse it versus what court accepted it but wouldn't hear it.





Do any members here have any documents of court cases, or anything that could be posted, where The Avalon member was successful in court, argueing sovereignty?

any one with documented proof? If thats not to much to ask

peace

Hi Thunder,

Several, I will dig them out and post them. The idea however is not to go to court, as that is their world. Filing the right documents before the case is heard by using the registrar has worked for me in quite a few cases including E-Court.

Also depends on the registrar, as I've had one tear up my document and throw it in the bin, saying "you can't do that", so I went back home, printed it out again, took it into a higher court and it was accepted fine, and the case never got heard.

I've also been very successful against lawyers and debt collectors, again I'll dig out the documents from the files and scan them.

Straker

[thunder24]

Do any members here have any documents of court cases, or anything that could be posted, where The Avalon member was successful in court, argueing sovereignty?

any one with documented proof? If thats not to much to ask

peace

Hi Thunder,

Several, I will dig them out and post them. The idea however is not to go to court, as that is their world. Filing the right documents before the case is heard by using the registrar has worked for me in quite a few cases including E-Court.

Also depends on the registrar, as I've had one tear up my document and throw it in the bin, saying "you can't do that", so I went back home, printed it out again, took it into a higher court and it was accepted fine, and the case never got heard.

I've also been very successful against lawyers and debt collectors, again I'll dig out the documents from the files and scan them.

Straker

Can u explain how the two documents provided is proof of ur success? Seems to me u just gave us two documents you claim to of written. or typed or whatever. I asked for court documents showing success.

So anyone else with PROOF of success?

[Straker]

Sorry...I don't go to court, because for one, I don't get myself into trouble, and two, I prefer to stay out of court and deal with things from the private side, after all only a defendant (legal entity) goes into court these days.

Yes, these are documents that I have written and typed, and in both instances worked perfectly, so I'm not why you're on the defensive. I'm not asking anyone to use them, nor am I recommending that anyone use them, I was just responding to your request for court related documents.

Straker

[thunder24]

Sorry...I don't go to court, because for one, I don't get myself into trouble, and two, I prefer to stay out of court and deal with things from the private side, after all only a defendant (legal entity) goes into court these days.

Yes, these are documents that I have written and typed, and in both instances worked perfectly, so I'm not why you're on the defensive. I'm not asking anyone to use them, nor am I recommending that anyone use them, I was just responding to your request for court related documents.

Straker

Straker, how was I defensive? All I did was reiterate my original words. I was clear with the words I used, because that is what i meant. Thanks for shareing what u did, though.

[Straker]

Hi 9eagle9,

The registrar that wouldn't accept it was probably a one-off case of someone's own perception of things, as another registrar at the same place (which was a district court) might have had no problem with it. To save any hassles, I took it up personally to the main courthouse in the city, and they had no problem with it at all. They even made me a photocopy for my records once it had been stamped and accepted.

That was for an E-Court thing, but I did exactly the same process for my own problem and the case never showed up on the day. I actually dropped by the court that morning incognito to check if it was still listed, and it was not on the board, so I asked the registrar, and there was no record of if, so he suggested asking the sheriff, which I did, and he had nothing either...so I went home, faxed them a notice of appearance for the time it was supposed to have been called, and never heard another thing.

Straker

[9eagle9]

You don't get a whole lot of evidence, just your court papers and the ruling. Your only evidence is that you got what you wanted.

Straker didn't have anything 'heard' so there was no order from the bench to provide evidence. Every hearing typically results in a order being passed from the bench.

The point is for the individual to succeed. The judicial system doesn't want this to be public knowledge so they just dismiss in order not to have the case heard from which a order will be issued. At least here in America.

One has to try this for themselves.

Last week the judge didn't send me home with a written declaration that said ' you whipped the plaintiff's ass and mopped the floor with his lawyer', by that time in the proceedings the hearing was interrupted to go to judges chambers for mediation--out of the public eye. Lawyers don't like having their dirty work exposed especially by a defendant that is not represented by another lawyer. That on its own sets a precedence.

The point is, I, the individual came away with what I wanted. That's the evidence. Everything got dismissed. I the defendant requested an order be issued and the judge granted my request but the order doesn't provide evidence of anything other than i got something I wanted from the court.

As long as they want this system to remain covert the bench is not going issue a order, which is public record, stating that a person has been heard as 'freeman'.

The only way the freeman mode of going , is going to work is the advantage of individuals. Those willing to 'try' it in a court of law.

Those sorts of thing are meant to be hidden from the public. There will be no order which risks setting a precedence issued as evidence. You can only provide the evidences such a motions, and notices to appear, or responses to summons. After the bench dismisses the matter it disappears. There is not another document issued .

Now think about this, do judges issue public record when a case is dismissed? They make a public declaration from the bench here, which is either recorded or not depending on the state. Is there written notification? A judge probably will not make public something the law doesn't want 'heard' in the first place.

Every court has a papertrail in the system. They don't want 'freemen' leaving a papertrail in their system.

[thunder24]

You don't get a whole lot of evidence, just your court papers and the ruling. Your only evidence is that you got what you wanted....



Are the court papers from within the court room and stamped...or do u mean papers like straker is talking about, from not actually in the court room? Does the stenographer record the ruling? If so, anyone have copies of that, or is that what u meant by they don't want "'freeman' leaving papertrail in system"?

[9eagle9]

Documents issued from the court or the bench have a date and a signature.

Motions and pracepices would have date stamps on them by the clerk receiving the motion. I am assuming the motion or whatever got Strackers case rolling was filed by the other party. Or perhaps it was a complaint, I don't know, maybe Stracker would like to lay out the entire process step by step of what occurred.

It depends on the state if a hearing is recorded. Some states the parties are required to provide their own recorder. You then have to petition for a copy of the transcripts. The transcripts would have the time and the date of the hearing. No hearing, no transcripts.

Stracker documents don't look like they made it to hearing stage. If those were documents transacted on line, then the email or electronic signature would serve as a time date stamp , the time and date the e-court received them. A hearing would have resulted from a response (order) from the judge. Stracker said he never heard from them again....so what would he have. Nothing, ' heard nothing from them again' means just that.

this has happened to me in debt collection even before it hit the judicial part of it. I responded to a laywer noting discharging my debt, never heard from them again.

Some documentation would have been generated from that. No hearing , no documentation, and not the sort of evidence you are seeking. Stracker doesn't have to prove anything, the fact he got what he wanted is evidence enough. He can correct me if I'm wrong.

If I was going to guess I'd say nothing was ever heard from again because the judge didn't want to risk public records that establish precedences.

[thunder24]

Documents issued from the court or the bench have a date and a signature.



Thanks 9e9 for helping to explain what u have and strakers position.

I am still wondering if any Avalonians, ANY, are willing to share proof of success in the COURT ROOM. Seems that would help others trying to learn about freeman (stuff), if they were actualy able to see something. thats all

[Straker]

Okay, I'll try and dig up the court stamped versions and post them. This was from 2006, and have had two computers crash since then, so bear with me.

Straker

[9eagle9]

*Its something one has to learn/do on their own. Then one will have their evidence. Not sure how a time date stamp of Strakers is going to help and our educate??????

*sorta the concept that revolves around 'free'.




Documents issued from the court or the bench have a date and a signature.



Thanks 9e9 for helping to explain what u have and strakers position.

I am still wondering if any Avalonians, ANY, are willing to share proof of success in the COURT ROOM. Seems that would help others trying to learn about freeman (stuff), if they were actualy able to see something. thats all

[9eagle9]

The reason that humans have remained matrix bound is by attempting to 'fix' the system.Attempts to fix the system have occured thousands of times throughout history. It doesn't work, the matrix depends on 'repeat'. The more one fixes the systems the more the system stays in place.

Relinquishing the need for a system is where freedom is. There is no freedom in a system.

You can have it one way or the other way but not both ways.





It is not enough to talk about Freeman/ Freewoman, this talk HAS TO BE REFLECTED IN YOUR LIFE IN SOME FASHION.

Exactly.

Personally, I don't seek to be outside the system because I have a need to be a part of the system if I expect to be of any influence in effecting change on that system. However, that system does work to what are basically equitable rules under the covers. Rules which have been usurped and made, through trickery, one sided and consequently very unfair in the effect they have on the proles and the power they give the elite.

This must change.

So the more people learn about the return to a more "natural" justice and a system that is fair - even if it is initially for some one pointed goal of "freedom" is in my books a good thing.

Ultimately we are all as free as we want to be, provided we identify the barriers to that freedom and take advantages of the remedies that are there, are available now, and are being exposed in threads like this and all over the internet.

Don't expect fast results - take it step by step. Understand and ask questions to seek that understanding.

Don't expect this to be some kind of get out of jail card that enables you to act without consequence in ways that are harmful to others.

Do expect this to be the basis for the time I see approaching, in which we are all comfortable with having total responsibility for all we do, and we are all at harmony with ourselves and our other-selves and where we are unafraid of any attempts by those that are on the wane, to regain control.

[thunder24]

Even those who claim they are out of they system are a victim to it.

Those who use the system make it the victim, those who use the system against itself reveal it as a system, those transcend the system assign the system as meaningless. The ability to do all of the above is a means of freedom, .....



.

So which is it, using all of the above is freedom....or there is no freedom in a system?





Relinquishing the need for a system is where freedom is. There is no freedom in a system.

You can have it one way or the other way but not both ways.






Im asking anyone to show proof of success in the court room 9e9, not just straker. An official date and time stamp would prove someone didn't just type up a letter and black out some words for it to look official, thats all.
And if the point is to do it on ur own, then why are we even discussing it. I can search the internet for days finding people who claim to do this or do that, and this will work or that will work, but I figured with so much talk on the threads of freeman 'stuff' that someone would be willing to provide these documents I asked for. Its just a request, not a demand.

[9eagle9]

You have to do it on your own. Each situation is different. People live in different states, people have different situations. No one method applies to any given situation. My situation is individual to anyone elses so a template of evidence isn't going to do me any good. Freeman is about individuality.

Some people are not good at the actual execution of this. After acquiring a great deal of information they may not be able to approach it in a way that serves them. The people I have observed with the greatest claims of success are those who absolutely know in their hearts they are FREE and approach it in a way so the law reflects their already existing state of inner freedom.

Someone can coach you but they can't represent you. A free person represents themselves. This is very much a moral philosophy attached to all this. If one approaches it like a slave fighting to get out of a system then one will probably fail.

You have to know the legal system as it exists now and then what argument you are going to use based on what is becoming known as freeman. Know your enemy know your friend. Ignorance of either side is not freedom. It is a learning process and anyone claiming to have succeeded with this just had to stick their neck out and try it based on what is already out there.

Learning contractual or UCC codes and laws. Liens. Even knowing how corporate law works.

You cannot be afraid to argue. Much of this is based on personal character , there can be no uncertainty when you approach this, you absolutely know that you right.

The court systems are very impersonal and people expect personal. Just not the way it is. A court is someplace you can sit and see how things are conducted. Observing the judge even, and how they respond.

Knowing other people's evidence is not going to fix another's uncertainty. Pick one area of your life you want to fix and pursue it until you feel confident doing it.

Freeman is not where one plays follow the leader. That is what people are accustomed to.

Being able to argue any case before it goes into jurisdiction helps.Knowing every conceivable angle they can come back with helps. It takes time.

If I am ever troubled by a debt collector again I will copy my responses and post them. I didn't attempt to enter into this to provide evidence for other people.

If I ever thought that there was anyone out there who was willing to manage their life I perhaps would have kept track of my responses but its never been demonstrated to me beyond a few that someone actually was and those who were, were already intitating their own plans.

I have found most of the people who speak of this stuff are not doing it for others, they are doing it for themselves and did so with little help or pre-existing evidence .
You want guarantees, there isn't any.

Most people are not very aware of the current legal system including myself. There's criminal law, civil law, and those are broken down into bankruptcy law, family law, contractual law, one to know very much how the otherside is going to respond. If I can't see around all corners I pose a question to someone who is knowledgeable.

Personally speaking here the one person that has helped me a great is Rob. (LS) A great sounding board. when I said he X he said they may come back with Y. I am shocked that he would be singled out to be attacked for not helping people. He couldn't do it for me, and he couldn't provide me with evidence, but he helped me to know what sorts of things I could be expected to be confronted with. Ambushed with. If you aware of an ambush, you can avoid it.

[thunder24]

Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

[9eagle9]

Based on what I know about both parties I know that this " LS is encouraging people to stay in a system" is more about "LS is getting more attention than me."

bottom line.

We do anything for attention---for any other reason but to be free-- you've failed from the get go.

There is no party involved that is not caught in the system one way or the other.

Why I said that because Party A is doing the same thing Party B is, is not any evidence at all.



You want to go into the brutal heart of the matter, I will not hesitate to go there with you.

[Seikou-Kishi]

Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

Freedom isn't avoiding systems, because then those systems define your life as surely as when they trap you. Freedom is being able to pick and choose according to your own will when you will and won't dip into their systems and when you will leave.

[thunder24]

Based on what I know about both parties I know that this " LS is encouraging people to stay in a system" is more about "LS is getting more attention than me."

bottom line.

We do anything for attention---for any other reason but to be free-- you've failed from the get go.

There is no party involved that is not caught in the system one way or the other.

Why I said that because Party A is doing the same thing Party B is, is not any evidence at all.



You want to go into the brutal heart of the matter, I will not hesitate to go there with you.

Heart of the matter is I have not agreed with LS from get go on this subject, and I don't want attention as an authority. Attention I requested by asking for proof, of what is being discussed, by individual members here. Thank you for answering, still I'm asking others also.

If all parties are caught by the system, then none are free. And u said " There is no Freedom in a system", I agree with this. 9e9 if that is what u think, then the quoted above: "LS is encouraging people to stay in a system" is accurate and factual and coorelates with me saying its keeping people slaves.

[thunder24]

Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

Freedom isn't avoiding systems, because then those systems define your life as surely as when they trap you. Freedom is being able to pick and choose according to your own will when you will and won't dip into their systems and when you will leave.

I don't see how the perpetuation of what is in place, is helping anyone.

I do think frame of mind, as in "I am free..." has a large part to do with being free.

[Anchor]

Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

I think I get what you are saying here, but there is a danger of reductio ad absurdum in this line of thinking.

Life is a system, even with no rules, there will form systematic approaches that work well for our situations.

What we need freedom from (if we want) is freedom from systems that are imposed on us.

The best way do that is to understand the system and be wise to it, and be able to avoid its tentacles!

[9eagle9]

The Freeman approach is a system as well, as it's presented.

The systems we impose on ourselves are no better.





Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

I think I get what you are saying here, but there is a danger of reductio ad absurdum in this line of thinking.

Life is a system, even with no rules, there will form systematic approaches that work well for our situations.

What we need freedom from (if we want) is freedom from systems that are imposed on us.

The best way do that is to understand the system and be wise to it, and be able to avoid its tentacles!

[9eagle9]

Because you haven't done it for yourself.

Free is not a frame of mind, that's your trap. The Mind has to have a system.

Freedom is a state of being. Free in spite of the presence of a system.




Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

Freedom isn't avoiding systems, because then those systems define your life as surely as when they trap you. Freedom is being able to pick and choose according to your own will when you will and won't dip into their systems and when you will leave.

I don't see how the perpetuation of what is in place, is helping anyone.

I do think frame of mind, as in "I am free..." has a large part to do with being free.

[thunder24]

pulled this from another thread...




I have to totally agree with you about the private and public sides not mixing. The clear, clean water of sovereignty cannot have even a few drops of the sewage that is the corporate/admiralty system. We have been programmed to think that compromising is a good thing. By accepting that premise we have been 'compromised'. Viruses trick cells into replicating for them, this tends to happen in immune 'compromised' bodies. Many of us resist viruses and have for years while friends and family alike succumb to them. Compromising is not the reasonable act it appears to be and is almost always how the pathology gains access to healthy areas. 'It' tricks the healthy part into accepting some part of 'itself' and it then gets to begin culture 'itself'. So much of our programming has come by way of 'culture'.



i would have to agree with this.

[thunder24]

Because you haven't done it for yourself.

Free is not a frame of mind, that's your trap. The Mind has to have a system.

Freedom is a state of being. Free in spite of the presence of a system.




Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

Freedom isn't avoiding systems, because then those systems define your life as surely as when they trap you. Freedom is being able to pick and choose according to your own will when you will and won't dip into their systems and when you will leave.

I don't see how the perpetuation of what is in place, is helping anyone.

I do think frame of mind, as in "I am free..." has a large part to do with being free.

how do u get to this state of being with out the mind?

[thunder24]

king anthony speaking on natural law... some call in universal law. I think it fits in well here at avalon, we discuss man made laws, who made man, who controls earth, ET comign to EAT ME, and ET come to help me fly away. It seems no matter what u call it, spirit, conciousness, God, matrix, ether, whatever, that there is a law or system behind it in it, whatever word suits ur fancy.

-uDXM61stN0

[9eagle9]

The mind is programmable aspect of the human psyche, you have to remove its programming before you even know what freedom is.

A programmed mind is not free.

The current judicial system is arranged around programming. A good lawyer knows the reactions of the defendant because programs repeat, and they are very aware that the defendant is ignorant and can only base their defense on programs. It is because of the programming that the judicial system hijacked a means of social organization for social control.

The judicial system like the systems of law and politics is all based on psychology and programming. In this same fashion religion and politics were hijacked. Both are social programming. The mind is nothing but a series of programs running.

A judge is aware of social programming simply from long years of observing it from practicing law, and observing it from the bench.

Removing the programming that allows one to form their own intelligence about much matters and they no longer depend on other people's arguments. That is programmed thinking, it perpetrates the programs. In two instances you have shown your inability to have original thought an must base your rebuttal on someone else thought.

Programmed people are read like a book. Their behaviors and their languages never deviate from the script.

When you and King Anthony have removed your programming then you than a you have a space to critique and educate people with. You are simply sharing your own programming that a second and third party has imposed on you.

I note that you aren't using your own arguments and the mind is the first place that freedom is initiated at. That's not free. You need someone else to tell you what to say instead of formulating your own rebuttal.

One is knowledgeable about programming only through removing their own.

Natural law is not programming, its order that has been turned into a program. Further revelation of ignorance, a one sided argument that provides evidence of programming but not what is on that other-side of programming. Freedom from thought. One no longer has to think. Programming is initiated in the mind that depends on thinking. If you have only ever known matrixes and programming how would YOU know the difference?

If King Anthony wants to form a convincing argument against the luv-n-lite crue and their programming of natural order, he may first stop behaving like them himself. His beliefs are based in the same program.

Programing is self evident to those who have initiated a process of de-programming with themselves. These are things that KA has been made aware of ; he willfully applies his own be-lie-f systems on natural order. That is programming and distributes it for re-belief.

Tther, spirit there is program in front of it, not behind it.

Freedom is gained by de-programming not providing more programming.

There is no responsibility in programming as demonstrated here. One's failure to get their programmed point across is then blamed on another person 'who is blurring the issue and dangerous'.

Actually its simply because the programmed is only offering more programming.

King Anthony's own programming as self admitted in his self published book admits to being passive and subordinate to females.

This is why you are left here on your own to defend his program.







Because you haven't done it for yourself.

Free is not a frame of mind, that's your trap. The Mind has to have a system.

Freedom is a state of being. Free in spite of the presence of a system.




Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

Freedom isn't avoiding systems, because then those systems define your life as surely as when they trap you. Freedom is being able to pick and choose according to your own will when you will and won't dip into their systems and when you will leave.

I don't see how the perpetuation of what is in place, is helping anyone.

I do think frame of mind, as in "I am free..." has a large part to do with being free.

how do u get to this state of being with out the mind?

[thunder24]

The mind is programmable aspect of the human psyche, you have to remove its programming before you even know what freedom is.

A programmed mind is not free.

The current judicial system is arranged around programming. A good lawyer knows the reactions of the defendant because programs repeat, and they are very aware that the defendant is ignorant and can only base their defense on programs. It is because of the programming that the judicial system hijacked a means of social organization for social control.

The judicial system like the systems of law and politics is all based on psychology and programming. In this same fashion religion and politics were hijacked. Both are social programming. The mind is nothing but a series of programs running.

A judge is aware of social programming simply from long years of observing it from practicing law, and observing it from the bench.

Removing the programming that allows one to form their own intelligence about much matters and they no longer depend on other people's arguments. That is programmed thinking, it perpetrates the programs. In two instances you have shown your inability to have original thought an must base your rebuttal on someone else thought.

Programmed people are read like a book. Their behaviors and their languages never deviate from the script.

When you and King Anthony have removed your programming then you than a you have a space to critique and educate people with. You are simply sharing your own programming that a second and third party has imposed on you.

I note that you aren't using your own arguments and the mind is the first place that freedom is initiated at. That's not free. You need someone else to tell you what to say instead of formulating your own rebuttal.

One is knowledgeable about programming only through removing their own.

Natural law is not programming, its order that has been turned into a program. Further revelation of ignorance, a one sided argument that provides evidence of programming but not what is on that other-side of programming. Freedom from thought. One no longer has to think. Programming is initiated in the mind that depends on thinking. If you have only ever known matrixes and programming how would YOU know the difference?

If King Anthony wants to form a convincing argument against the luv-n-lite crue and their programming of natural order, he may first stop behaving like them himself. His beliefs are based in the same program.

Programing is self evident to those who have initiated a process of de-programming with themselves. These are things that KA has been made aware of ; he willfully applies his own be-lie-f systems on natural order. That is programming and distributes it for re-belief.

Tther, spirit there is program in front of it, not behind it.

Freedom is gained by de-programming not providing more programming.

There is no responsibility in programming as demonstrated here. One's failure to get their programmed point across is then blamed on another person 'who is blurring the issue and dangerous'.

Actually its simply because the programmed is only offering more programming.

King Anthony's own programming as self admitted in his self published book admits to being passive and subordinate to females.

This is why you are left here on your own to defend his program.







Because you haven't done it for yourself.

Free is not a frame of mind, that's your trap. The Mind has to have a system.

Freedom is a state of being. Free in spite of the presence of a system.




Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

Freedom isn't avoiding systems, because then those systems define your life as surely as when they trap you. Freedom is being able to pick and choose according to your own will when you will and won't dip into their systems and when you will leave.

I don't see how the perpetuation of what is in place, is helping anyone.

I do think frame of mind, as in "I am free..." has a large part to do with being free.

how do u get to this state of being with out the mind?
You say
"Those who use the system make it the victim, those who use the system against itself reveal it as a system, those transcend the system assign the system as meaningless.
The ability to do all of the above is a means of freedom"
then u say
"Relinquishing the need for a system is where freedom is. There is no freedom in a system. You can have it one way or the other way but not both ways."

These 2 statements makes me think an original thought of "WTF is she talking about, why does she contradict herself."

Why do u lump us together, because we share similar views on the subject.
I do not know law, and don't argue law, tell me where my original thought on here has not been.
I shared a video of KA's for others to watch. What does his book have to do with this thread?

Has KA wronged u in some way or mislead u, that caused pain in ur life?

If u are speaking of the video i last posted, and modwiz's comment i copied as my unoriginal thoughts, ok, but it was not a rebuttal, and i typed my own words.

9e9 im probably wrong, which is fine, but u seem to b angry, and i'm glad u dont' believe everything u think


anyways, Anyone have any documents showing that in the court room they were successful? Just seems like if freeman "stuff" worked someone would have the documents from the bench.

[apokalypse]

i don't think is the system but more of spirituality which is the key, doesn't matter what kind of system we live in but with our spirituality not taking responsibility, lack of love and not knowing thyself nothing will work ...this is one of most important thing that human need to work on by helping each other to evolve, to love just like what in the bible said "love thy neighbor as thyself".

[9eagle9]

There is no freedom in a system as long one remains a victim of the system and is dependent on the system, and remains unaware how the system programs them.

When one becomes aware that it is a system and how the system works , it is dependent on one's own programming then one has the freedom of choice, they are no longer limited by the system. When one begins using the system for means other than what it is intended the system breaks down like any other system.

In identifying one's own programming one is able to detach from the system, use it to serve themselves, or rise above the system. One neither has to be included in the system or be always apart from it. Their placement within and without the system is no longer static--the ability to maneuver within the system and go back out again at will by choice.

People who are dependent or victim of the system are not capable spokes people for transcending the system.

Can you do that? Probably not but implicating another person into your failure to do so is not going to allow you to be unimpeded by the system. Another's 'lack' of freedom is certainly not going to grant you yours.

Until all people have given up their programming the system will remain in place. That does not mean one becomes a victim of it. It's a symbiotic relationship, you need the system, it needs you. You are a creation of the system. As long as everyone has programs running in their mind, the system matrix will remain in place.

There is not contradiction there, there's only 360 degree views of the systems, instead of the one linear way of thinking of it. You have one view of the system and I have several ways of seeing the system. The system can be used against its own existence to serve my purpose.

One's own systems or programming disallows this and views the system as something that victimizes them, and they have no maneuverability within the system.

You think I'm angry and that's a programmed response.

There is a difference between thinking and knowing.

As I have told other parties involved i have no emotional investment in the matter other than freedom itself. That someone is going all emo when there is no evidence suggesting it simply an assumption that the programmed fall back on when they fail to garner an agreement. Freedom means not requiring another's agreement, the system remains in place only through your agreement to its programming.

"She doesn't agree with me so she must be mad, crazy, or emotional' or as I have been previously accused of "having some emotional involvement with the person you chose to put down in order to make one's own blaring programmed responses more 'truthful'. That is ptb programming, and is used to now in mainstream psychology to substantiate mental or emotional anomaly in those who do not agree with any given system or program.

You are now dependent on Rob only by marking up his perceived failures, rather than your successes, to make your case stronger and that isn't freedom either. That is another program. If another person failed that of course must establish a case that I am entirely correct.

You are insisting someone else provide you with proof instead of finding it on your own. It is someone else responsibly to enable your own freedom and that isn't freedom either. It is no different than the people who are waiting for the ET's to come save them. They are waiting for ET's you are waiting for another person to save you.

If one chooses to exercise their unwitting hypocrisy on a person that has actually helped me to maneuver the system I will comment on that hypocrisy.

You were not aware you were being a hypocrite and waiting for someone to save you, even as you mock those who are waiting for something other than themselves to save you. Now you are aware of it and You have an opportunity to put that to good use.

KA was given a opportunity by myself to explain his actions, in private and he could not or would not do so prefering to fall back on the old programmed response that you are using here. You must be angry, instead of explaining his actions he preferred to blame me . That is co-dependent programmed behavior. It is the same programming the powers that be use in slandering those who criticize the government.

How did I get involved in it? the moment one presents video evidence to be viewed you are involving other parties, you may not necessarily agree with you. Of course you have the handy excuse of claiming emotional attachment when in reality one opens their material to disagreement only posting it.

You are using freedom to harm another person who is CONVENIENTLY barred from the ability to pose their rebuttal in the matter. That is ptb programming as well. The Bush Administration and Guantanemo Bay provided much evidence for people who are 'tried' in public, without the ability to pose their own comments on the matter.

If you want to be free of them, I suggest you quit behaving like them.

If you want documents from the bench go get your own.

Having someone else provide evidence for you as I noted much further upthread is not freedom.

[Straker]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6526777574574871930

www.theclassifiedfiles.com

[Straker]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ME7K6P7hlko

[9eagle9]

This Thunder 24 is your evidence of collusion. Your post. This is not a matter of simply sharing a belief this collusion in attempting to character assassinate someone without evidence. You are playing messenger boy for someone who is quite unable to remark in public on their actions. You are not employing your own critical thinking skills, and are blinded by your own belief systems if you cannot objectively see what your own re-post is saying.

One because you posted it on the behalf of KA, that takes it beyond 'shared beliefs' and into the realms of collusion. Now you are stuck here to defend it.



There is one principal the current judicial system has taken a great deal of liberty with and that the common law and freeman law activists need to keep in mind.
The accusers are the ones who bear the brunt of providing evidence.

"Do not attack the messenger' translates into 'do not question the messenger'.

If KA didn't want his messenger attacked he should have posted that message himself. Therefore you willingly engaged in collusion to slander another person in order to make your shared beliefs stronger. It did nothing of the sort but provide textual evidence of collusion.

Are we that naive still that anything posted in the public of that sort of Deliberately Inflammatory nature is not going to be commented on. Or questioned?

So like many adherents to a personal belief one is found on the hotseat for spreading messages from the guru. You and Anthony may share a system of beliefs but does that belief system include playing messenger boy when the message sender is not able to response to their accusations in pubic? Is that freedom, when one cannot defend or respond to comments made on their own allegations? No that is the current fawtly and imprisoning system all over again, when guilt is attempted to be established without evidence and based on hearsay. When Anthony employes his own critical thinking skills and realizes he is promoting the very thing that he claims to be against, he may enjoy the popularity that he seeks. If he is so certain of his 'information' he'd be able to defend it, or rather the evidence would speak for itself.

I have commented on his beliefs before in private and he fails to substantiate them quoting others, as evidence, I have personally challenged him in private conversations to substantiate 'the truths' he extols and he has failed to do so repeatedly prefering to bow out of the conversation.

Truth is self evident.

Freedom is expressed in one's own life. If I am free am free to comment on this matter since it was shoved under my nose. I do share the public domain along with billions of others.


I still have found no evidence of any harm that Rob has done to anyone . However right here here in textual evidence is the obvious attempt to slander someone elses character without show or cause conceding this is a personal matter. So while there is no evidence there would be a reason for doing so, a tacit reason that is not being spoke of.

Which is?

This does not make your case or KA's case for freedom stronger.

It strongly implicates a personal agenda or program though. I suggest you have been swept along in someone else's personal problem.

It is obvious to those who observe forum dynamics that Rob is very popular for the various topics he comments on . This in itself doesn't suggest he is right but neither does it mean he is a false prophet not anymore than King Anthony who spends more than a substantial portion of time posting live time videos of his opinions on the forum.

The case of the pot calling the kettle black.


[message from king anthony in brief]

A member/poster in another forum (which I do not belong to) asked if they could post previous comments between us; I offered that they may "cut & paste" the below and I thank them in advance for doing so. This version is for PA, as most of the members at this other forum are from here.

Before I begin, I would like to say I am not going to get involved in drama discussion here; meaning, this message from me will be final. In opening, I am not familiar with the topic of discussion in a thread regarding Kerry and C2C in this other forum.

The topic I wish to address, if I may, is the matter of Rob a.k.a. Lord Sidious. In order to understand this topic, the entire of my video titled "Be Wary Of Alternative Forums And False Prophets Of Freedom" should be watched on YouTube; a member here in PA had posted it in this thread.

The other day, a member in this other forum told me about another member in this forum posting the said video - I did not even know this other forum existed until then. I told this person to thank this other member for sharing my efforts in this other forum.

It appears that Rob and other members there are of the opinion that I slandered/backstabbed Rob. At no time did I slander/backstab Rob (or anyone) in the said video. All I stated were the facts of my interaction with Rob during the time we were in touch. He could have rejected it, not that it would change the facts; however, he did not - for he knows I spoke the truth.

Subsequently, Rob left this other forum and apparently (based on comments in the thread) took other members with him. On a side note, I have stated facts and observations of other people and groups I mention in the said video with no ill intent.

As for what he "speaks on", he and others who speak on the currently accepted freedom movements are more then welcome to talk to me about anything I have stated in the said video; these people have been and always will be welcome - to date, not one of these people have despite my attempting to contact them... I wait.

Note, that Rob is not the only person or group I mention in this video (or other videos I have produced). Of course, people here know this, for my videos have been watched in full and my words read in full by the people here (or there), correct? - if not, then not my problem. Perhaps I should be clever as some other people and feed the feel-good of others to gain popularity.

I addressed Rob in my video because he, and people like him, are doing harm to themselves, others who wish to be or are "free" (including me) and everyone overall. These people who speak "common law" nonsense are playing with peoples lives - this is not a game.

Rather then challenge the words I have spoken, people have once again attacked the messenger. What wrong have I stated for anyone to be "off set" by the words I have spoken!? Shame on you for believing this.

Be angry with yourselves, for you have allowed emotions to lead you and not understood what I have presented. I have never once implied, stated or wanted anyone to follow the words I give and have many times wished many people well who wanted to.

I have offered aid to others in understanding facts/truths and distinguishing them from fictions (such as, opinions, theories, beliefs and such). People can disagree on "fictions" (as stated above); however, facts/truths can not be disagreed on - ever, unless one lies to themselves.

I have offered aid in the "how to" in research skills, while highlighting the mental skills needed, such as critical thinking and common sense. I have also shared firsthand experiences on various topics; as well as, my life to the "now" and will continue to do so as long as I can.

I have never offered to be a leader of anything; nor have I stated or implied anyone to believe a word I say - I have always said, seek "this or that" out for yourselves. I have never wanted to be famous from this, nor have I wanted any monetary gain for what I do - as I offer words for free.

The reason people do not engage my me or the words I speak is because I do not feed other's feel-good and I am not interested in debating facts/truths; and not my facts/truths either - thus my observations of forums, which is also presented in the said video.

The title of this other forum speaks one thing; yet, by observation, demonstrates the opposite. When are you people going to really "wakeup", for time is growing shorter. I wish you all well - cheers!!!

As I had stated above, I post this here as most of the members in this other forum are from here (by invite only) and I wish to set the record straight so there are no ill feelings from anyone (here or there) - as I do not have any against others. These are my final words here on this topic.

king anthony

p.s. I had asked thunder24 to post this for me here and he agreed to, so no one attack this messaenger - thank you thunder24.

[9eagle9]

I'm going to put your own question back to you. Has rob harmed you in some fashion besides disagreeing with you? So much so that you need to serve as messenger boy for the person who presents flimsy evidential videos of false prophecy. If one is going to attack another at least be a man about it and not employ some third party means of attack, why not confront Rob directly if his agreement is that necessary to you?

No you stated yourself that Rob and yourself don't agree on the topic.

Dis-agreement is sufficient enough to single out a KNOWN popular poster and attempt a feeble character assassination based on nothing but opininon and some comments made on a radio show? Lack of agreement? He should be punished for not agreeing to your system?

Even with pre existing knowledge I'm sure is still puzzled by my responses here.





The mind is programmable aspect of the human psyche, you have to remove its programming before you even know what freedom is.

A programmed mind is not free.

The current judicial system is arranged around programming. A good lawyer knows the reactions of the defendant because programs repeat, and they are very aware that the defendant is ignorant and can only base their defense on programs. It is because of the programming that the judicial system hijacked a means of social organization for social control.

The judicial system like the systems of law and politics is all based on psychology and programming. In this same fashion religion and politics were hijacked. Both are social programming. The mind is nothing but a series of programs running.

A judge is aware of social programming simply from long years of observing it from practicing law, and observing it from the bench.

Removing the programming that allows one to form their own intelligence about much matters and they no longer depend on other people's arguments. That is programmed thinking, it perpetrates the programs. In two instances you have shown your inability to have original thought an must base your rebuttal on someone else thought.

Programmed people are read like a book. Their behaviors and their languages never deviate from the script.

When you and King Anthony have removed your programming then you than a you have a space to critique and educate people with. You are simply sharing your own programming that a second and third party has imposed on you.

I note that you aren't using your own arguments and the mind is the first place that freedom is initiated at. That's not free. You need someone else to tell you what to say instead of formulating your own rebuttal.

One is knowledgeable about programming only through removing their own.

Natural law is not programming, its order that has been turned into a program. Further revelation of ignorance, a one sided argument that provides evidence of programming but not what is on that other-side of programming. Freedom from thought. One no longer has to think. Programming is initiated in the mind that depends on thinking. If you have only ever known matrixes and programming how would YOU know the difference?

If King Anthony wants to form a convincing argument against the luv-n-lite crue and their programming of natural order, he may first stop behaving like them himself. His beliefs are based in the same program.

Programing is self evident to those who have initiated a process of de-programming with themselves. These are things that KA has been made aware of ; he willfully applies his own be-lie-f systems on natural order. That is programming and distributes it for re-belief.

Tther, spirit there is program in front of it, not behind it.

Freedom is gained by de-programming not providing more programming.

There is no responsibility in programming as demonstrated here. One's failure to get their programmed point across is then blamed on another person 'who is blurring the issue and dangerous'.

Actually its simply because the programmed is only offering more programming.

King Anthony's own programming as self admitted in his self published book admits to being passive and subordinate to females.

This is why you are left here on your own to defend his program.







Because you haven't done it for yourself.

Free is not a frame of mind, that's your trap. The Mind has to have a system.

Freedom is a state of being. Free in spite of the presence of a system.




Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

Freedom isn't avoiding systems, because then those systems define your life as surely as when they trap you. Freedom is being able to pick and choose according to your own will when you will and won't dip into their systems and when you will leave.

I don't see how the perpetuation of what is in place, is helping anyone.

I do think frame of mind, as in "I am free..." has a large part to do with being free.

how do u get to this state of being with out the mind?
You say
"Those who use the system make it the victim, those who use the system against itself reveal it as a system, those transcend the system assign the system as meaningless.
The ability to do all of the above is a means of freedom"
then u say
"Relinquishing the need for a system is where freedom is. There is no freedom in a system. You can have it one way or the other way but not both ways."

These 2 statements makes me think an original thought of "WTF is she talking about, why does she contradict herself."

Why do u lump us together, because we share similar views on the subject.
I do not know law, and don't argue law, tell me where my original thought on here has not been.
I shared a video of KA's for others to watch. What does his book have to do with this thread?

Has KA wronged u in some way or mislead u, that caused pain in ur life?

If u are speaking of the video i last posted, and modwiz's comment i copied as my unoriginal thoughts, ok, but it was not a rebuttal, and i typed my own words.

9e9 im probably wrong, which is fine, but u seem to b angry, and i'm glad u dont' believe everything u think


anyways, Anyone have any documents showing that in the court room they were successful? Just seems like if freeman "stuff" worked someone would have the documents from the bench.

[9eagle9]

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/straw-man.html

http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/what-is-a-straw-man-argument.aspx

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

People who call for the abatement of strawmen shouldn't be creating strawman arguments.

[Virgo]

thank you for this post.

[scootiep]

You have to do it on your own. Each situation is different. People live in different states, people have different situations. No one method applies to any given situation. My situation is individual to anyone else’s so a template of evidence isn't going to do me any good. Freeman is about individuality.

Hi 9eagle9,

Thank you very much for your posts on this thread they are very interesting and I’m glad that you are here telling us about your freeman/woman experiences :)


In my personal opinion, one of the most knowledgeable in this area is Thomas Anderson.

http://www.theclassifiedfiles.com

I have the whole series and highly recommend them.



Hi Straker,

Thank you for your posts also, I am very interested in all of your posts on this subject and I’m glad to be speaking to somebody with a lot of experience in this matter. I have been to the Thomas Anderson website and will be ordering BOOK 1 – CLASSIFIED as I feel I have a pulling of direction towards this subject so I can help others in the future.

I was wondering who could help on the following situation and how it can be tackled;

My friend has just got a parking ticket and I was wondering how to respond to this matter as a freeman so she doesn’t have to pay the fine?

I am very curious as for the last few weeks I have failed to pay for a parking ticket in my local town car park but haven’t gotten a ticket yet lol as 9eagle9 says you have to try freeman on your own and this is what I am going to do!! :)

[Anchor]

My friend has just got a parking ticket and I was wondering how to respond to this matter as a freeman so she doesn’t have to pay the fine?

I am very curious as for the last few weeks I have failed to pay for a parking ticket in my local town car park but haven’t gotten a ticket yet lol as 9eagle9 says you have to try freeman on your own and this is what I am going to do!! :)

Before you get into fighting the system, you need to have a position that you yourself hold in power - and that will come from inside you.

It does not come by asking for people giving you silver bullet formula - and if that happen anyway, it usually does not work out well.

There are some TV documentaries glofying the failures of "that freeman stuff" in Canada right now - because people think its simply away to duck responsibilities.

Despite that, people may toss you a few sparks to get the fire going.

My advice to you is either:

1) Find out in yourself if you are a FREE man

2) in the mean time, pay the ticket and avoid obstacles on your path to (1)

At some point along path 1, you may find that you have worked out the philosophy surrounding the freeman stuff, and you have internalized your logic so well and perhaps run it past a few others for honing to razor sharpness - and you KNOW you are a free man, then nothing I say will make any difference to you because you will be free - and the system will crumble before you.

[scootiep]

Hi Anchor,

I am free as a Human being, but because of the system we live in it is extremely hard to be truly free.

We will always be entrapped into this system as long as we are governed by money, we need money to survive and it controls our lives.

But my argument is why should I be charged money to park my car in a car park? The Car park is designed to park your car so you can use the town/city shops and facilities.

If the car park was not there the town/city would lose business as people would not be prepared to walk long distances or use public transport after a long period shopping carrying lots of items/bags.

So the council is laughing charging people money to park their car while we spend lot’s of money in there towns and cities.

My argument is a) we should be able to park free if we are helping the town/city by buying products and helping them financially for without this there would be no income for them b) all councils or local governments are private companies who cannot create laws that we need to abide too c) all fiat money used in currencies across the globe is worthless as it is backed by thin air and are promise to pays, they have no value so the parking fine has no value.

I really do hope that the system will crumble as we can all be set free; MONEY is the route of all evil the human race would benefit immensely and we could all start working together to make this world a better place instead of the divides amongst us caused by money, selfishness, power and greed.

[Anchor]

I think you may have misread my message - or missed what I was getting at. Either that or I am missing something from yours.

My message is not logical. It is not a formula to fix problems.

You are looking FIRST to the outside - and that is what THEY want you to do, because when you do that it seems HOPELESS.

You cannot, straight away, find the freedom outside - that's where the controllers who mess it all up for you work! They are better at this than you. You evidently agree with me :)

My proposition is that the freedom you are looking for is found within first; and at the center, the heart, the seat of your eternal soul that is linked to all that there is - that is the only place where you cannot be subverted and it is the place where you are indisputably sovereign. It is where you are a "Child of God", and more than just Human. There, you are subject to no man made laws, you are a "sovereign" individual component of the infinite creation. I am sorry if this sound spiritually biased but that's the way I roll. I happen to think that the concept of freedom and responsibility are all essentially spiritual concepts.

The challenge we ALL face is how does that freedom come out from there into that which is not US in this/(OUR) world?

But THEY, the people who cause all the unfairness and problems for you, THEY are constrained by the same truths; but they use trickery and deceit to mask the reality from you.

So if you find that inviolable freedom within you and you then start letting that spiritual freedom inform the way you navigate your way in life, you will find that things change; because you will be able to defeat them.

There is no formula except what you do from moment to moment.

It may sound trite, but this is what I think is meant by Ghandi, (when its all resolved down to the present tense):

"Be the change you want to see in the world."

Starting with this shift in perspective, you can reframe, you can see and assess the structures that assail your exterior freedoms in the manner that you allege and you will find the ways to deal with it. This was part of the meaning of my last paragraph in the previous post - when I said the system will crumble. It will crumble for you.

There is a reason we are individual and we each tread our own paths and we all find our different ways to do things, but I am sure of my initial premise, the truth is within.

If you don't know you are free, then you are not free.

Its only a paradox at the moment, because that's the way it looks right now.

Luckily we are not living in a zero sum game of a creation. It is infinite. And that means paradoxes can be solved :)

Even if it takes us a good part of our lifetimes to realize it.

[Straker]

Hi scootiep,

You'll find a lot of answers in those books, and one of the basic things I learned was that you need to address the presumptions in every situation, rather than fight the illusion of a conflict. For example, in the case of a council fine or ticket, you might like to address the presumption that they have any authority to issue such a thing, based on the fact that local councils are not mentioned in the constitution and that although they attempted to ratify this in 1988 through referendum, the people said no. Therefore councils must get their money to exist through extortion, such as fines and levy's, rates etc.

I'm actually off to the council next week to ask them who owns the land around my property, as they expect me to maintain it. But if it is indeed theirs, then surely they should look after it. And if they are not in the constitution, and are only an artificial legal entity, then where did they get the title from, and whose land was it in the first place.

Many people do not even know that our Prime Minister is a DeFacto one. That position is not a legal one, it is just a generally accepted thing that we allow her to be there.

A lot of people fight tax, but if you instead challenge the presumption, you might ask if there was any taxable event in the first place. After all, the Commonwealth of Australia is not a physical place, landmass or country, but rather a private artificial legal entity listed in the US SEC with it's office in Washington.

It's impossible to do anything there, be born on it, work on it, travel on it (or in any STATE) for that matter, as they are all essentially pieces of paper in a filing cabinet, or ones and zeroes on a computer somewhere.

And as there is no lawful money in circulation, backed by anything of value, and the ATO is asking you how much your strawman made last year, wouldn't you rather answer honestly and address the presumption that it can physically do anything, when it's yet another artificial legal entity with no arms or legs.

The only way a physical living being can interface with the artificial digital machine world is through a conduit, known as the strawman, the all caps legal entity that you sign for, and accept to be you through enjoinder.

Challenge the presumption that you are one and the same, and break the bonds without having to enter into conflict or arguement, which is dishonourable...
Best
Straker

[scootiep]

I think you may have misread my message - or missed what I was getting at. Either that or I am missing something from yours.

My message is not logical. It is not a formula to fix problems.

You are looking FIRST to the outside - and that is what THEY want you to do, because when you do that it seems HOPELESS.

You cannot, straight away, find the freedom outside - that's where the controllers who mess it all up for you work! They are better at this than you. You evidently agree with me :)

My proposition is that the freedom you are looking for is found within first; and at the center, the heart, the seat of your eternal soul that is linked to all that there is - that is the only place where you cannot be subverted and it is the place where you are indisputably sovereign. It is where you are a "Child of God", and more than just Human. There, you are subject to no man made laws, you are a "sovereign" individual component of the infinite creation. I am sorry if this sound spiritually biased but that's the way I roll. I happen to think that the concept of freedom and responsibility are all essentially spiritual concepts.

The challenge we ALL face is how does that freedom come out from there into that which is not US in this/(OUR) world?

But THEY, the people who cause all the unfairness and problems for you, THEY are constrained by the same truths; but they use trickery and deceit to mask the reality from you.

So if you find that inviolable freedom within you and you then start letting that spiritual freedom inform the way you navigate your way in life, you will find that things change; because you will be able to defeat them.

There is no formula except what you do from moment to moment.

It may sound trite, but this is what I think is meant by Ghandi, (when its all resolved down to the present tense):

"Be the change you want to see in the world."

Starting with this shift in perspective, you can reframe, you can see and assess the structures that assail your exterior freedoms in the manner that you allege and you will find the ways to deal with it. This was part of the meaning of my last paragraph in the previous post - when I said the system will crumble. It will crumble for you.

There is a reason we are individual and we each tread our own paths and we all find our different ways to do things, but I am sure of my initial premise, the truth is within.

If you don't know you are free, then you are not free.

Its only a paradox at the moment, because that's the way it looks right now.

Luckily we are not living in a zero sum game of a creation. It is infinite. And that means paradoxes can be solved :)

Even if it takes us a good part of our lifetimes to realize it.

Hi Anchor,

To be honest from your first message I didn’t understand what you were trying to tell me but after reading this message I do very much so, you are looking at this situation form a spiritual point of view which I really respect as I try to do this myself and fully agree with everything that you have said.

From the sound of it you are at such a high level of spirituality that you can see things so easily from the outside of the mind matrix and not to be sucked into the system way of thinking.

But living and being part of this system that controls us in the world it is very hard to try and see things the way you talk about.

One of the biggest problems for humanity is that we always try to over complicate things when it’s so easy, if everybody thought like you there would be no system and we would be free :)

But this will not happen until humanity evolves spiritually which will take many generations.

Thanks for your words of wisdom my friend.

[scootiep]

Hi scootiep,

You'll find a lot of answers in those books, and one of the basic things I learned was that you need to address the presumptions in every situation, rather than fight the illusion of a conflict. For example, in the case of a council fine or ticket, you might like to address the presumption that they have any authority to issue such a thing, based on the fact that local councils are not mentioned in the constitution and that although they attempted to ratify this in 1988 through referendum, the people said no. Therefore councils must get their money to exist through extortion, such as fines and levy's, rates etc.

I'm actually off to the council next week to ask them who owns the land around my property, as they expect me to maintain it. But if it is indeed theirs, then surely they should look after it. And if they are not in the constitution, and are only an artificial legal entity, then where did they get the title from, and whose land was it in the first place.

Many people do not even know that our Prime Minister is a DeFacto one. That position is not a legal one, it is just a generally accepted thing that we allow her to be there.

A lot of people fight tax, but if you instead challenge the presumption, you might ask if there was any taxable event in the first place. After all, the Commonwealth of Australia is not a physical place, landmass or country, but rather a private artificial legal entity listed in the US SEC with it's office in Washington.

It's impossible to do anything there, be born on it, work on it, travel on it (or in any STATE) for that matter, as they are all essentially pieces of paper in a filing cabinet, or ones and zeroes on a computer somewhere.

And as there is no lawful money in circulation, backed by anything of value, and the ATO is asking you how much your strawman made last year, wouldn't you rather answer honestly and address the presumption that it can physically do anything, when it's yet another artificial legal entity with no arms or legs.

The only way a physical living being can interface with the artificial digital machine world is through a conduit, known as the strawman, the all caps legal entity that you sign for, and accept to be you through enjoinder.

Challenge the presumption that you are one and the same, and break the bonds without having to enter into conflict or arguement, which is dishonourable...
Best
Straker

Hi Straker,

Thanks for the reponse and providing this information, I think I will understand it more when i read some of Thomas Andersons books.

I think I will download the ebooks as i'm in the UK and this is the cheapest option.

Can't wait to start reading and learning from them, but yes you are 100% right the council is an artifiical legal entitity that cannot interface with me a human being so how can they fine me? :)

[Straker]

Hi scootiep,

Remember that the ebooks are formatted for large screen readers such as Kindle for Mac (which I have on my iMac) or Calibre etc, but not for the Kindle tablets due to the complex layouts and format. I can read them full screen fine on my Mac. You can also look through quite a few pages online in the Amazon store using the "look inside" option.

All the best, Straker.

[scootiep]

ok today i parked in a Morrisons supermarket car park and didnt pay for a ticket, when i came out of the supermarket on my car was a "parking charge notice".

so now I am going to see for myself if the freeman actually works, the actual company that issued the parking charge notice is "EURO CAR PARKS".

I am going to appeal by telling them that I am happy to pay but first I need some verification before payment is made;

a) ask them to send me a bill with a signature on it
b) i need to see the lawful, two-party contract supporting the bill.

As they can't supply neither it should kill the claim stone dead!!

lets see what happens, once I find out I will let you know :)

[scootiep]

here is the letter which I will be sending

EURO CAR PARKS
APPEALS DEPARTMENT
30 DORSET SQUARE
LONDON
NW1 6QJ


To whom it may concern,

Ref: PARKING CHARGE NOTICE – Ticket no.

I am writing to you in regards to the above parking charge notice, I have noticed your notice and as I appear to owe you money I am happy to pay, but first I need some verification before payment is made.

First, there is a need to verify the debt, so please could you send me the bill with a signature on it.
Also I need to see the lawful, two-party contract supporting that bill.

If you cannot supply what I have stated above I ask you to please not to bother me again on this matter.


Yours sincerely,

[Anchor]

here is the letter which I will be sending

EURO CAR PARKS
APPEALS DEPARTMENT
30 DORSET SQUARE
LONDON
NW1 6QJ


To whom it may concern,

Ref: PARKING CHARGE NOTICE – Ticket no.

I am writing to you in regards to the above parking charge notice, I have noticed your notice and as I appear to owe you money I am happy to pay, but first I need some verification before payment is made.

First, there is a need to verify the debt, so please could you send me the bill with a signature on it.
Also I need to see the lawful, two-party contract supporting that bill.

If you cannot supply what I have stated above I ask you to please not to bother me again on this matter.


Yours sincerely,


Great stuff. May all power go with you on this one.

I think you do "know" that you are free don't you :)