$15 Faraday Cage

[another bob]

Easy DIY protection for electronics during emp or solar flare:

http://saltnprepper.com/faraday-cage

:yo:

[PurpleLama]

My wife will be much relieved if all my electronics get fried, but she will be less understanding of her lack of television.

[tonton]

purlelama
you could always a necklass with the remote so she would feel that its with her where ever she goes.

[mountain_jim]

Easy DIY protection for electronics during emp or solar flare:

http://saltnprepper.com/faraday-cage

:yo:

turns out I have all the ingredients on hand.... thanks another bob :yo:

[Debra]

Thanks Bob, I am going to set about doing this .. and pass it around !

Z :cool:

[christian]

Humungus, I always thought a massive solar flare would erase every harddrive on the planet. Now you're saying all it takes for protection is a Faraday Cage.

I was so looking forward to see all the bank account data deleted :drama:

[Realeyes]

Easy DIY protection for electronics during emp or solar flare:

http://saltnprepper.com/faraday-cage

:yo:

Thanks another bob,

I have been looking into this for a number of years - this is the easiest solution I have seen so far - great find!

I will certainly pass this on. You have made me very happy with this thread!

[kudzy]

This is cut & pasted from the comment section in the link from the opening post.
Very relevant!


Kieseyhow April 29, 2012 at 6:21 am - Reply
The information in this article is partially correct mixed with some assumptions. A Faraday cage, or an EM shield, will work by blocking EM radiation such as microwaves or radio waves. It will not block a strong magnetic pulse, like one caused by a nuclear blast unless it has multiple layers that are grounded and have resonance damping devices. A Faraday cage will block a moderate RF pulse though that is not magnetic. Solar flares do not cause an EMP. Solar flares cause a massive buildup of electrostatic potential in the atmosphere and resulting high energy particles. Power-lines and any other long cables interacting with these particles will have electricity induced in them causing power transmission systems to overload, overheat, and short out. As such, solar flares do not damage small devices, they damage the main power grid that supplies your systems and devices. Solar flares are not the same as EMP (electromagnetic pulse) waves.

Bill April 30, 2012 at 3:13 pm - Reply
@ Kieseyhow, you have it right.
A simple faraday cage will not protect electronics from a strong EMP. The cage would also need to be shielded (ie. below ground).
Grounding is also very important because studies have shown that EMP energy may be stored in isolated materials (like a capacitor). Grounding will help dissipate the energy.
Just as any other defense, layers (redundancy) will improve protection.
Solor flares do not produce EMP. They create power surges in long wire conductors (ie. power lines)
Full EMP protection is expensive. With that in mind you have to ask yourself? Is the possibility of an EMP event high enough to justify the cost to protect against it? How will I power these items after the event (and the batteries run out)? Would I be better served relying on items that require no electricity to operate?

I do not know if this is accurate but it seems as though they know what they're talking about.

[Davy]

Thanks another bob, very good info, its on my to do list!!

[RMorgan]

Hey folks,

I always wonder about this CME/Solar EMP situation...

You can have a faraday cage indeed, but how would you know when a big EMP/CME is coming, so you can put your stuff inside?

Also, in case of a huge CME/EMP, what´s worth saving our electronics if the whole electric grip would be fried and would take years to repair?

Cheers,

Raf.

[Franny]

I have read in several places, thoʻ I donʻt recall now where, that you can make one at home too. Wrap small electronics in natural fibers such as cotton, then in metal such as a foil, then in in a water tight container. Bury it about a foot deep in soil.

I cannot vouch for it but have read about it from several sources.

Perhaps the most important item to bury is a solar powered or wind-up radio/ham radio for communication and information in case of a damaging EMP. They can be purchased just about anywhere.

Solar powering devices are also available for USB items such as cell phones and pads. Maybe for radios too.

[Eram]

Hey folks,

I always wonder about this CME/Solar EMP situation...

You can have a faraday cage indeed, but how would you know when a big EMP/CME is coming, so you can put your stuff inside?

Also, in case of a huge CME/EMP, what´s worth saving our electronics if the whole electric grip would be fried and would take years to repair?

Cheers,

Raf.

You just addressed my first 2 concerns that popped into mind when reading about this. ;)

Isn't it so that when a mass solar flair occurs, there is plenty of time on earth to see it coming and stuff the electrical equipment in this Cage?

When you have a generator.... you'll be pretty popular after such a big solar flair. Having an operational pc.

cheers,

Waky

[RMorgan]

Hey folks,

I always wonder about this CME/Solar EMP situation...

You can have a faraday cage indeed, but how would you know when a big EMP/CME is coming, so you can put your stuff inside?

Also, in case of a huge CME/EMP, what´s worth saving our electronics if the whole electric grip would be fried and would take years to repair?

Cheers,

Raf.

You just addressed my first 2 concerns that popped into mind when reading about this. ;)

Isn't it so that when a mass solar flair occurs, there is plenty of time on earth to see it coming and stuff the electrical equipment in this Cage?

When you have a generator.... you'll be pretty popular after such a big solar flair. Having an operational pc.

cheers,

Waky

Hey mate,

Well, we can never be sure if the people in charge will in fact ring the alarm before such thing happens.

Anyway, you can have a computer working with a generator indeed, but you´ll only be able to play games or type some texts with it, because in such situation there would be absolutely no internet connection, which is the most important tool on a computer these days.

Besides, as I said on another thread, it would be chaos. Even if you have a generator, you wont be able to buy fuel for it, and if you do, the generator would attract the attention of all looters and other loonies of the neighborhood, which is not a good thing.

My advice? If such situation comes to happen, don´t worry about your electronics. Worry about the safety of you and your family and keep a very low profile. Things would get pretty crazy.

Don´t get to paranoid, but have a plan. Be sure to have somewhere to go in the woods, preferably a place with running water and some animals that you can hunt.

Oh, and if you have an old car in your garage is a big plus. New cars, full of electronic components wouldn´t work as well.

Cheers,

Raf.

[Positive Vibe Merchant]

Ya know, I am kind of looking forward to a solar flare or something to knock out electronics world wide.

Wipe the banks, the military, government databases, all information.

Will give me some time to hide, and everyone else gets a bit more of the playing field to themselves if they are in debt no longer.

Then again, they probably have their info safe from these situations to keep the power.
My bad...

Carry on :)

PVM

[Bill Ryan]

-------

I've just been experimenting with aluminum milk churns -- like this:

http://projectavalon.net/aluminum_milk_churn.jpg

Here's what's important:

1) It should be aluminum -- not steel. Aluminum works much better for a Faraday cage.

2) Ensure the churn has a tight-fitting lid. The tighter, the better. Then, test it like this:

3) Place a cellphone in the churn, with the lid tight on -- first wrapping the cellphone in paper, cardboard or plastic (to avoid direct contact with the metal inside of the churn).

4) Call the cellphone from another phone. It should not ring, or register the missed call. If it does... this churn will NOT work as a Faraday cage.

What you're testing is whether microwaves will penetrate the 'cage'. If the cellphone is successfully isolated from the grid, this means you can probably use the churn to protect any electronics that will fit inside it. (Again: make sure everything inside is fully insulated from the metal of the churn.)

Important:

What I discovered is that there's no way to tell simply by looking at it whether the churn will work or not. The tightness of the lid is crucial. The churns that passed the test were the ones where the lid was so tight I really had to fight to get it off again. :)

Simple aluminum garbage cans might not have a good enough seal: they really have to be 'watertight'. You have to actually do the cellphone test to know whether or not your 'cage' will work.

[Carmody]

-------

I've just been experimenting with aluminum milk churns -- like this:

http://projectavalon.net/aluminum_milk_churn.jpg

Here's what's important:

1) It should be aluminum -- not steel. Aluminum works much better for a Faraday cage.

2) Ensure the churn has a tight-fitting lid. The tighter, the better. Then, test it like this:

3) Place a cellphone in the churn, with the lid tight on -- first wrapping the cellphone in paper, cardboard or plastic (to avoid direct contact with the metal inside of the churn).

4) Call the cellphone from another phone. It should not ring, or register the missed call. If it does... this churn will NOT work as a Faraday cage.

What you're testing is whether microwaves will penetrate the 'cage'. If the cellphone is successfully isolated from the grid, this means you can probably use the churn to protect any electronics that will fit inside it. (Again: make sure everything inside is fully insulated from the metal of the churn.)

Important:

What I discovered is that there's no way to tell simply by looking at it whether the churn will work or not. The tightness of the lid is crucial. The churns that passed the test were the ones where the lid was so tight I really had to fight to get it off again. :)

Simple aluminum garbage cans might not have a good enough seal: they really have to be 'watertight'. You have to actually do the cellphone test to know whether or not your 'cage' will work.

large, aluminum, with a screw on lid.

I'm looking to put all my fix it tools, electronic components(parts), lights and some inverters in a Faraday cage.

That way I may be able to fix anything that has 'blown up'.

The solar panels and batteries will be just fine on their own.

Much of modern electronics is already in a Faraday cage of sorts, and not all aspects of them will blow up. for example, a cb radio in a truck, may partially survive. and if one knows how to check components and replace them, then things can be brought back to life.

Old cars are also the way to go, diesel types more than anything else. Resturaunts will have plenty of grease sitting unused, to be turned into biodesiel. Find an old diesel generator, be sure it works, then remove all of it's electronics and put them in the Faraday cage. If an EMP shows up, then it can be reassembled, as the electronics have been preserved in the cage and are ready to go...

lister engines are also great devices.

http://www.diesel-bike.com/Lister_Gen/Lister1.html

http://www.diesel-bike.com/Lister_Gen/Hookedupgp.jpg

http://www.generatorsales.com/order/09912.asp?page=L09912

[Bill Ryan]

-------

Hi, Carmody -- many thanks. A couple of questions for you...

Context: Re diesel cars and trucks, many modern engines have more electronics than gasoline [petrol] cars. They're very dependent on multiple sensors, fine balancing of the diesel injectors, turbo and intercooler --- etc etc. When any of these malfunction, the entire engine can go way out of whack.

1) Am I right in presuming that a strong EMP would be more likely to disable a modern diesel car than a gasoline-engined car?

2) If modern diesels are not a good idea to have as an EMP-proof vehicle... how old should the diesel vehicle be?

3) And re modern diesel generators... are they as sensitive as new diesel cars may be?

All and any comments and good information welcome. If you can find any web references, please do also throw them in. :)

[Ron Mauer Sr]

I would love to have a Lister diesel generator. Not effected by EMP. Simple and rugged. But I've heard that import restrictions prevent getting a complete unit in the U.S.A.

[twelve31]

Just a thought but would'nt any old microwave oven make an effective faraday cage? Microwave ovens are shielded to prevent microwaves from escaping, so should'nt the opposite be true?

If you put a cellphone in a properly shielded microwave oven (don't turn on the oven;) and call the phone it should not ring. Much like the milk container solution mentioned above. Whadayathink?

[Carmody]

-------

Hi, Carmody -- many thanks. A couple of questions for you...

Context: Re diesel cars and trucks, many modern engines have more electronics than gasoline [petrol] cars. They're very dependent on multiple sensors, fine balancing of the diesel injectors, turbo and intercooler --- etc etc. When any of these malfunction, the entire engine can go way out of whack.

1) Am I right in presuming that a strong EMP would be more likely to disable a modern diesel car than a gasoline-engined car?

2) If modern diesels are not a good idea to have as an EMP-proof vehicle... how old should the diesel vehicle be?

3) And re modern diesel generators... are they as sensitive as new diesel cars may be?

All and any comments and good information welcome. If you can find any web references, please do also throw them in. :)

Regarding modern diesel vs modern gasoline car..both would be disabled. To a near enough equal measure, that either would remain non functional, probably as effectively as if they had been in a flood. All sensors, diode blocks, solid state and normal relays, all electronics..which are distributed throughout the car. Near enough in complexity that both would suffer equally, and be equally unrepairable.

At the basic level, we have glowplugs in a diesel and a rotary spark distributor in a gasoline engine, with the gasoline engine having a coil, some diodes, said distributor of spark, and some spark plugs.

in the basic engine sense, the basic diesel is going to be more robust, regarding sensitivity to EMP, over that of gasoline devices.

In a generator, we have the diode block for the generator proper, which is under one end of the generator proper housing, buy a spare one of those and possibly remove the original. The speed control on most basic generators is mechanical, so that's not a problem. then, the diode and small bits of components for the sparking of the spark-plug..and then maybe some of the basic electronic components for the display, and such. Other than that, most generators are electrically VERY simple and easy to protect by removing the short list of items.

diesel generators are preferable as they are more robust due to high compression design requirements. If of Chinese origin, newest is best, as they are still learning about steel and cast metal qualities and execution.

When it comes to cars, the 70's is when electronic ignition systems began to appear. before that it was carburetors, ignition coils, simple diode controlled solenoids, and spark distributors. those parts for those designs are easy to find,and easy to put away as spares. Once again, avoid gasoline cars as gasoline needs to be refined and older diesels can be made to run on vegetable oil, diesel fuel and kerosene (possibly on the kerosene).

This means a mid 1970's design or older, with regard to the simplicity required with respect to removing and EMP protecting the critical components. Obtaining a repair manual for the given vehicle becomes important, so the given parts can be found and removed. some newer foreign vehicles from India or similar (eg, Russian skoda or yugo, or even south American market cars, at the low end of the pricing when new) might still be simple enough (up into the 1980's) that they can be easily EMP proofed, with regard to being simple enough to remove and protect the critical components. Western cars went completely electronic by the years 1978 to 1980 or so, due to the gas shortage of the 70's (OPEC embargo) making the leaps toward fuel efficiency and emissions issues.

Older tractors would be your friend, if they are diesel, due to these issues of simplicity and age of design/execution.

the Lister engine, for example, it may be possible to get it to run on a mixture of alchohol and water. Some of them being compatible with vegetable oil, kerosene, gasoline, and diesel. Lister designs will run on virtually anything that burns, except wood. Imagine having to dilute some thick oil with a few bottles of grain alchohol.....and the Lister might run on that. It is a distinct possibility. The Lister engines are arguably....the most immortal and universal/versatile designs ever made. The electronics of them are virtually non-existent. The lowest parts count, down to the point that they are barely beyond steam engine designs of the past.

Here's another potential source of materials:

http://www.lessemf.com/fabric.html

[Carmody]

Just a thought but would'nt any old microwave oven make an effective faraday cage? Microwave ovens are shielded to prevent microwaves from escaping, so should'nt the opposite be true?

If you put a cellphone in a properly shielded microwave oven (don't turn on the oven;) and call the phone it should not ring. Much like the milk container solution mentioned above. Whadayathink?

The cell phone towers would be fried and be inoperable, period, so saving the cell is a waste of energy. :)

better to put in two way radios, inverters, am/fm radios, small electronics of some sort that would be effective in a total power outage from an EMP. No cells would work, period.

I'm going to go to a major hardware outlet today and see what I can find. The possibilities lie in the area of 'raccoon' proof metal containers,and some chicken coop designs. The trick is to find the extra mesh material and also the joining of the mesh with a conductive material of some sort, so the shield is complete and electrically robust, with low impedance.


For example.. SOME truck cargo boxes are pretty cheap AND made of aluminum, AND they are well sealed but with foam liners at the seal points, for weather proofing.

One could buy a truck box storage case made of aluminum, and then change the seal to being of a metal mesh type. However, the seal type would have to be an insert variety or type, so the following could be made.


I'll see what kind of thing I can imagine and kludge together over the next few days, regarding simple ideas that can be done immediately and anywhere, not over a long time with unobtainable parts.

for example...one way to make a metal mesh seal cheaply, is to buy the mesh, or even better ....strip it from a well made but old coaxial cable, then put a foam core inside the mesh that was stripped from the older coax. This can be a very cheap and immediate way to obtain the proper EMP proof seal for the truck bed box. (scrap instrumentation cable will have a really good shield design, over that of standard 75 ohm coax. You want a 'FULL shield', that is the design parameter one is looking for.) The 5reason one has to do this, is that electrically solid and conductive 'containment seals' are very expensive and difficult to find. One has to find ways to build their own, as easily and as cheaply as possible and to find the parts/components just as easily. this type of seal needs to be put in a groove, and be in full contact, in order for it to be effective.

Like this. these are cheap,and common. the trick is to find one that the seal can be mounted on, easily.

http://i355.photobucket.com/albums/r478/italiandominator/IMG_2211.jpg

OK. figured it out. Buy small sized channel material, that will 'cup' the home made conductive seal material..... and then attach (screw into, in the appropriate place)to the box.

However, for simplicity's sake, finding some larger aluminum based cans may be more effective in the case of the average person.

I do 'weird science' and tend to prototype everything into existence...and I find I have to practically build all my tools and devices from scratch, many times. thus I forget to find things that are 'ready made'.

All this be as it may, understanding how to make that electrically conductive seal may be an important thing to know.

[Carmody]

It took me a few minutes to figure out a more universal device (seal) that is available just about anywhere, from simple widely available components.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Another way to make a good seal, would be to use cheap aluminum tape.

clean the surface of the seal area, and then put some foam core in the middle of the aluminum tape, as a long thin strip. then lay the tape down on the surface of the cleaned aluminum. this way, the gap is THIN, or as thin as the aluminum tape's glue layer. Also, find a way to have the aluminum tape rub or contact the top or hinged cover so that it electrically completes the circuit from the top/lid to the body (box/can/whatever) 'proper'. The foam core will press the aluminum tape against the other half of the case or lid..

The way to secure the electrical contact, is to fold back one edge of the aluminum tape, and then run a strip of more aluminum tape over the folded back part of the tape, to secure it against the aluminum box casing. in that way, the manufactured seal has electrical contact along both sides of the case/lid.

to clarify.

aluminum tape from the heating or automotive section of a large hardware store.

small foam core from the heating, door seal, or plumbing section of the store. probably from the window seal section of the hardware store.

Peel back the adhesive protection layer from the aluminum tape and put the round or square sealed foam window seal down the center of the sticky side of the aluminum tape.

then, fold back one edge of the aluminum tape, about 1/4" (your aluminum tape should be 2"-3" wide) or so. That folded over strip will provide electrical contact for the length of the tape/seal, on whatever surface the seal ends up being placed on.

Place the tape, with foam on the inside, in the seal area..so you end up with a long foamed lump under aluminum tape..along the seal axis/area.

then, place a thin strip of aluminum tape on the folded over edge of the aluminum tape/foam seal, so that it presses up against the surface the seal is located on. This will provide electrical contact between the seal, case,and lid..once the lid is secured.

This aluminum tape EMP seal will not be robust, and thus will not last from repeated use.

However, it will serve incredibly well as a EMP seal on your aluminum tool/truck box, or aluminum container.

[noxon medem]

Hey folks,

I always wonder about this CME/Solar EMP situation...

You can have a faraday cage indeed, but how would you know when a big EMP/CME is coming, so you can put your stuff inside?

Also, in case of a huge CME/EMP, what´s worth saving our electronics if the whole electric grip would be fried and would take years to repair?

Cheers,

Raf.

You just addressed my first 2 concerns that popped into mind when reading about this. ;)

Isn't it so that when a mass solar flair occurs, there is plenty of time on earth to see it coming and stuff the electrical equipment in this Cage?

When you have a generator.... you'll be pretty popular after such a big solar flair. Having an operational pc.

cheers,

Waky

Hey mate,

Well, we can never be sure if the people in charge will in fact ring the alarm before such thing happens.

Anyway, you can have a computer working with a generator indeed, but you´ll only be able to play games or type some texts with it, because in such situation there would be absolutely no internet connection, which is the most important tool on a computer these days.

Besides, as I said on another thread, it would be chaos. Even if you have a generator, you wont be able to buy fuel for it, and if you do, the generator would attract the attention of all looters and other loonies of the neighborhood, which is not a good thing.

My advice? If such situation comes to happen, don´t worry about your electronics. Worry about the safety of you and your family and keep a very low profile. Things would get pretty crazy.

Don´t get to paranoid, but have a plan. Be sure to have somewhere to go in the woods, preferably a place with running water and some animals that you can hunt.

Oh, and if you have an old car in your garage is a big plus. New cars, full of electronic components wouldn´t work as well.

Cheers,

Raf.

Having a newer ( post-electronic , late 80s ) car is also possible
after an EMP pulse, potencialy destroying sensitive electronics,
- also key components of modern cars ....

- That is excactly a reason to get (or buy) a reserve , or spare,
of all the sensitive electronic components needed to run your car ,
and then store them in a safe place ...

Just a thought ..

Be well.

:- )

PS.
I suggest reading the comments on OP link.
We have also here on AF been discussing the
use of, for instance, microwave-ovens for
shelter for our prescious data tools and more.
( make sure the oven is not in use ! cut the cable ..).

PPS.
It seems wise to separate an EMP event and a solar flare.
Those are different qualities, with different impact on earth.
( and our practical excistense )

Easy to research.

Here is a start :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earthing_system

..
-

[Bill Ryan]

-------

A question for Carmody. :)

Is an aluminum briefcase likely to work? (I understand about the necessary tightness of the seal, and the tests that can be done with a cellphone inside.)

(Thanks for your advice about aluminum tape. I now have it!)
http://c745.r45.cf2.rackcdn.com/img/2009/rimowa_aluminum.jpg

[Spiral]

Pre- turbo diesel landrovers are as basic as it comes, especially the electrics, 1984 onwards for a good one, the military were still buying this type long after civvy production ceased, and are now on sale to the public via specialists easy to find on the internet. ( and are the kind of robust vehicle you are going to need post such an event, they also have an aluminium body )


Just a thought, but do milk churns have a rubber seal that stops the lid "grounding" unless over tightened ?

[Carmody]

I'll be getting back to this shortly. I even bought the components to illustrate exactly what I mean by both types of seals. I did this back on the same day I made my original comments but have yet to find the will and time to get back to it.

I'm also looking to illustrate how to make a EMP proof storage box out of an old cupboard that is made of wood. This, using common available materials, for under $35-40 or so.

A good case or briefcase for EMP proofing, would have to be molded/punched, not cut sheets that are joined, UNLESS one could ascertain the overall design characteristics, vie peering at the exterior, or pulling the inner lining out..

OR..one could line the interior correctly. There are some good options, but prices/costs of the efforts can begin to creep up.

[hohoemi]

.
How does one know when it is safe to take stuff out of the Faraday Cage again?
Is there a way to measure it?

[Czarek]

-------

I've just been experimenting with aluminum milk churns -- like this:

http://projectavalon.net/aluminum_milk_churn.jpg

.


Bill, where can we get those milk churns?