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lilac
27th May 2012, 23:25
http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2012/05/20/anthony-swofford-on-the-epidemic-of-military-suicides.html

Anthony Swofford on the Epidemic of Military Suicides
All across America veterans are committing suicide at unprecedented rates, but no one has been able to answer why. Author and former marine Anthony Swofford gets to the bottom of an epidemic.
by Anthony Swofford | May 20, 2012 1:00 AM EDT

I was sitting next to Melissa, a call responder at the VA Crisis Hotline in Canandaigua, N.Y., when she looked at me and whispered, ‘He just said he thinks he should walk out into traffic on Interstate 5 and end it all, that life is not worth living.’

On the other end of the line was a young man who’d been out of the Marines for four months. He was unemployed and broke and hadn’t eaten all day. He’d driven his father’s truck from the middle of the country to Southern California to be near Marine Corps Base Camp Pendleton and his buddies. But most of them were either overseas again or separated from the Marine Corps. He’d taken to drinking and occasionally smoking pot. After four years of military service and two combat tours in Iraq, he couldn’t find a steady job. Now he sat at a rest area near Camp Pendleton, contemplating suicide.

Melissa had about her the endearing charm of a kindergarten teacher coupled with the steely nerves of a nose tackle and the all-American looks of a blonde-haired, blue-eyed beauty queen.

She smiled and nodded at her computer screen as she spoke to the young Marine. Her voice radiated goodness. Her screen indicated that he’d called twice earlier in the afternoon and had had brief conversations with two other responders.

“You’ll learn from reaching out and making this call. It’s a brave call.”

She IM’d a colleague on the crisis-hotline floor, a health technician, and told her that she thought this kid was in need of a rescue.
apg20080701_031

Cheryl Softich sits by her son's casket and body at his funeral in Eveleth, Minnesota in late July, 2007 (Courtesy of Cheryl Softich via Ashley Gilbertson / VII)

The tech had no idea where Interstate 5 and Camp Pendleton were. I told her Southern California, North County San Diego. I’d flown to Rochester from San Diego that morning.

“You have a long time to figure this out. You can’t figure it out in four months,” Melissa said to the young man.

The technician got to work initiating the rescue with a 911 center in California. I thought about calling my wife in San Diego and telling her to go find the kid.

The Crisis

About 18 veterans kill themselves each day. Thousands from the current wars have already done so. In fact, the number of U.S. soldiers who have died by their own hand is now estimated to be greater than the number (6,460) who have died in combat in Afghanistan and Iraq. Eleven years of war in two operating theaters have taken a severe toll on America’s military. An estimated 2.3 million Americans have served in Iraq or Afghanistan, and 800,000 of those service members have been deployed multiple times.

Pull up your local newspaper online and search “veteran suicide,” and you’re likely to come up with at least one link to a story. Based on data from the National Violent Death Reporting System, Mark Kaplan of Portland State University asserts that male veterans have a twofold increase in death by suicide over their civilian counterparts and that female veterans are three times as likely to kill themselves as their civilian counterparts. Veterans are 60 percent more likely to use a firearm in an attempted suicide than civilians, and firearms are the most effective way of taking one’s own life.

So why are these young veterans killing themselves at such high rates?

In 1992 I was in danger of becoming such a statistic, just released from the Marines after four years of service and combat action in Kuwait during the Gulf War. I know the suicidal temptation that can accompany the isolation and loneliness veterans experience after the high of combat and the brotherhood of arms fade in the rearview mirror. I skulked around college campuses with a watch cap pulled tight to my ears, looking for a threat, knowing that when it appeared, I could extinguish it. I took a swing-shift warehouse job that required very little human interaction. I became a writer, which also required very little human interaction. It took nearly two decades to find my way free of the morass.

While there is no one reason for any person’s suicide, the Department of Veterans Affairs and the military shy away from placing blame directly on the psychological and social costs of killing during combat.

No one within the VA will use the word “epidemic” when talking about suicide, but it can’t be denied that the rate of suicide among current-war veterans is drawing attention and concern. Before these current wars, the rigorous training and intense discipline of military service were considered a defense against suicide.

Even Peter Gutierrez of the Denver VA, codirector of the Military Suicide Research Consortium, concedes this fact. “The stresses of multiple deployments and the amount of time that troops have to reset between deployment probably is more a unique factor,” Gutierrez says. “It’s not necessarily increasing risk of suicide, but it is certainly having an impact ... Perhaps the protective influence of training is no longer enough. But we don’t have the data to back that up.”
The Lives Of Soldiers

Family members mourn infantry soldier Dirk Terpstra, who committed suicide Feb. 24, 2010. (Courtesy of Cheryl Softich via Erin Trieb / VII)

Researchers and practitioners are unwilling to overtly connect the trauma of combat with suicidal tendencies. But why? They assert there is no evidence to support this link. However, when you teach a kid how to kill and send him to combat a few times, he will come home mightily changed, with a dependence on weaponry and a tendency to treat violence as a perfectly acceptable way of solving a problem.

What we do know is that something has clearly changed. “Up until the last 10 years, being in the military, including serving in combat, seemed to be a protective factor against suicide,” says Gutierrez. “[But now] in certain cohorts of active-duty personnel, the suicide rates are actually higher than in their civilian counterparts.”

Despite the reluctance of many within the military medical establishment to discuss the subject, I spoke with two doctors who have extensive experience working with Vietnam veterans and were willing to offer straight answers.

Dr. Jonathan Shay, who has written books about soldiers at war and coming home, was the central proponent of the “unit cohesion” model of deployment back in the Vietnam era. He recognized isolation and despair in the veterans he treated and linked this directly to the way they had been deployed. During Vietnam, new troops filled the ranks of combat units when others died or rotated home. This lack of unit cohesion corrupted trust, and trust is one of the main protective factors against mental injury in combat. Because of Shay’s advocacy, unit cohesion is a significant consideration in arranging standard deployments these days.

But today, Shay says, soldiers face a different set of challenges flowing from multiple deployments. When they are sent on repeated combat tours, soldiers run a much higher risk of suffering what Shay describes as a “moral injury.” A moral injury occurs when a soldier’s concepts of trust and right and wrong do not survive the heat of battle. This breakdown can result from a soldier’s real or perceived failure under fire—or from the failure of a commander to properly lead. As a result of this moral injury, the soldier brings home the psychological habits he developed for coping with the intense stresses of combat. In other words, he returns to civilian life hypervigilant and trusting no one—a difficult way to live.

Another doctor who has examined the state of veterans today is Dr. David Spiegel of the Stanford Center on Stress and Health, who believes that the country is so checked out from the realities of the war on the ground, with assistance from the government, that “the troops come home with questions, and they don’t feel understood.” He points to the policy during the Bush administration that forbade the publication of images of returning soldier coffins at Dover Air Force Base. As a society we didn’t have to turn away from those images, since they were never even presented to us.

Spiegel notes that during Vietnam, the war became a central part of American culture. Whether you’d fought there, whether you were for or against the war, you cared about it deeply. It might have been better for the psyche of a soldier to be the object of protest than to be simply ignored. As Spiegel says, “Now we pretend the vets don’t even exist.”

Spiegel is unwilling to dismiss the violence of warfare as a contributing factor in suicide. “When the line of violence has been crossed once, it’s easier to cross again. Homicide and suicide differ greatly, but they are both [forms of] killing.”

Self-Healing

Many veterans and their families have taken matters into their own hands rather than rely on the VA. Dan West admits that he had been “avoiding the mental-health question for many years.”

West served as the public-affairs noncommissioned officer with the Army’s 214th Fires Brigade in Al Kut, Iraq, in 2009. Within a week of being deployed, his public-affairs unit was on a medical mission to a nearby village—the Hearts and Minds aspect of American counterinsurgency operations. He’d been snapping photos for a few minutes and watching the docs do their good deeds when a woman appeared holding a 2-year-old baby boy with burns covering nearly his entire body.

He had to step away from the scene and collect himself. But it didn’t take long for him to habituate to the gore of the battlefield. A week later he snapped a photo of an old man carrying a severely malnourished boy of about 12. He took the photo and moved on quickly to the next task. A copy of that photo hangs on West’s refrigerator today to remind him of what he saw while at war.

“Our post-deployment mental-health screening took place with the entire unit sitting down with the chaplain, and the chaplain asking if we had any problems, and the commanding officer saying that no one had any problems,” West says.

When West returned home to Missoula, Mont., he noticed that the world just didn’t feel the same as before he’d deployed. “I still reacted to situations like I was in combat,” says West. So the military offered to send him to three post-deployment reintegration Yellow Ribbon weekends in Las Vegas. “I called that death by PowerPoint,” he says. “I don’t want to denigrate the Yellow Ribbon system. But I lived a thousand miles away from my command unit. They didn’t direct me to services in Missoula.”

A single, never-married soldier without children, he was forced to sit through sessions on marriage counseling and other family-health matters.

West faced the same perplexing experience that greets many Reserve and National Guard members when their units disperse after deployment: when a reservist returns from combat, within weeks he’s sitting back in the civilian office chair he vacated for the battlefield.

West had been back in the civilian world for three years when he finally found a group of local veterans through a group called XSports4Vets that helped him to realize he had mental-health problems. The group—founded by Jesse Scollin, an Iraq War veteran, and Janna Sherrill, an occupational therapist—gets combat veterans together for high-adrenaline extreme sports that foster camaraderie and esprit de corps that are unavailable in the daily grind of job, school, and family. “Extreme sports force veterans to achieve levels of concentration that daily civilian life does not require,” Sherrill explains. “By improving their ability to pay attention, the sports also help veterans engage in meaningful interactions.”

West says that his involvement with XSports4Vets helped save his life.

The Military Wakes Up

The VA has finally begun to screen for posttraumatic stress disorder and suicidal tendencies, even if a guy walks into the ER with nothing more than a broken thumb. Caregivers from social workers to physicians are supposed to be asking the right questions and listening for the answers that indicate significant psychological problems. If a veteran is drinking excessively or using drugs, not sleeping, out of a job, and isolating himself, those are pretty good indicators that he’s in trouble. Matt Kuntz, a mental-health advocate in Helena, considers the shame attached to mental illness for soldiers and veterans the major hurdle to individuals seeking care. As Kuntz, a West Point graduate, puts it, “In the infantry there’s a stigma against blisters. You think a combat vet is going to reach out for help? The soldiers need to be aggressively screened. Repeatedly.”

Groups like Disabled American Veterans and Veterans for Common Sense are constantly pushing (sometimes via lawsuits) the VA to improve and adapt its services for a plugged-in and media-savvy veteran population. Finding troubled veterans through outreach is an essential part of the VA’s task. And there seems always to be room for improvement.

But the question remains: once veterans are in the system, do they get any better? A multipronged approach seems necessary. Dr. Jessie Lu, a current psychiatry resident at the UCLA Medical Center who did rotations at the West Los Angeles VA hospital in its PTSD clinic, is a proponent of prolonged-exposure therapy. In this form of treatment, a patient recounts into a tape recorder the most intense traumatic event he suffered. He’s asked to talk about how the day started and to use all of his five senses. The therapist might ask a question along the way to guide the patient. The idea is that the patient walks out of the room having narrated the trauma with as much clarity and intensity as possible. The patient is then asked to listen to a recording of the session every day for a week. This is repeated for three months.

Lu admits that it is not an easy therapy to undertake, because its point is to force the patient to confront what stresses him most in daily life. “It’s effective for the people who can stick with it,” she says.

I asked Lu why some soldiers return from combat damaged and others don’t. “Oh, God,” she said. “If I knew the answer to that ...” And she trailed off. “When you sit down with a patient for the first time and give him a PTSD diagnosis, it’s like sitting with a patient you’ve just diagnosed with schizophrenia. Nothing will ever be the same. They went off to do something idealistic for their country, and they came back shattered.”

Selling Hope

Ninety minutes had passed, and Melissa was still on the phone with the young Marine who was thinking about killing himself on Interstate 5. The rush-hour traffic was heavy, and the highway patrol had gone to the wrong rest area. Now I seriously considered calling my wife and telling her to go find the Marine. Take him for a walk along the beach, I thought.

“Selling hope” is how Stacey, another responder and an Air Force veteran, describes the work they do. One hundred sixty-four thousand calls received last year; 6,760 rescues; 2,300 calls from active-duty personnel; 12,000 calls from friends and family of veterans.

Finally, Melissa looks up at the health technician with a smile and a thumbs-up, saying into her headset, “Oh great. OK? It’s MPs from Camp Pendleton? That’s OK. Put me on with them.”

“Thank you for showing up,” she says to the MP. “This young Marine needs some help.”

Arrowwind
28th May 2012, 00:37
You ask what we can do.

As mothers and parents we should teach our children not to enter the military under this current regimen at least.
the confusion and conflict of between what the military people are doing and the truth is so wide a gap it could make anybody go crazy, depressed suicidal.

to maintian mental balance you have to have congruency of purpose in your life with concrete meaning behind action that in general supports a good intention and will lead to a good outcome

Our local newspaper had an aricle today that hunge numbers of military are qualifying for disability benefits... and merited benefits at that.. aside from the benefits alloted for physical injury which is very high because more soilders survive their wounds than ever before, mental health is a leading issue for allotment of benefits. Another one is trauma from sexual assault for women incured while in the military... and you gotta wonder how much of this leads to suicide also?

There will be no more war when people believe that war is unnecessary and they refuse to fight. I cannot condone it unless someone is attack our shores and a threat is imminent or if a nation calls out for help and it is approved by a congressional vote to go and help. Restoring honor and dignity to the forces may eliminate some of this suicide stuff.

When you send hundreds of thousands of young people out to slaughter women and children (collateral damage) I guess this is what you get. People break down. Good people dont want to do this and all the mental repression, all the denial in the world wont make it go away. Even if they are not directly involved in such outcome of military tactics they are signficantly associated and must support the acts. This will wear anyone down given time along with the other stress the service brings.

I also have to wonder about the experimental vaccines the military folks are subject too. Its a nasty nasty deal. We know what vaccines do to children. I can only assume that adults will suffer in kind.

18 a day. Wow. That is huge. and that stat was for veterans. Is there another number for those in active duty?

lilac
28th May 2012, 01:09
Yes, I immediately thought about the vaccines and experimental substances historically used on the armed forces. Probably at their worst these days. You also hit the nail on the head when you speak of honor and dignity. It's probably the reason they signed up in the first place - to find direction, purpose - a team. I suppose they are subjected to different forms of mind control as well. I don't know. I just think that these are the strong young souls that we hope will find their voice - speak up and turn this thing around. I have my own fantasy that everyone should adopt a veteran. Put them to work in the garden, feed them and let them heal. I knew a man who had a big farm in California. Ex-inmates would come and stay as long as they needed. Each had his job on the farm - planting, building fences, working with the animals.... it became an industrious, productive operation. There were those who returned years later to thank my friend and introduce wives and children.

I am not in the US, but if there was a hotline or a forum like this, I would volunteer. I think it is hugely important.

spiritguide
28th May 2012, 01:40
Wars are hell and these examples are the resulst. Viet Nam was just as bad. The answer to this is no more wars period. Until we get there we need to protect our sons and daughters from the DOD.

:peace:

Dennis Leahy
28th May 2012, 02:18
Lilac, you reminded me of this new organization, Farmer Veteran Coalition (http://www.farmvetco.org/).

Here's an article: http://healthfreedoms.org/2011/02/15/veterans-finding-new-life-in-organic-farming-2/

These vets need mental health help, and many/most have PTSD as well as other afflictions (from debilitating guilt to traumatic brain injuries.)

Dennis

lilac
28th May 2012, 03:02
“The military is not for the faint of heart, and farming isn’t either,” said Michael O’Gorman, an organic farmer who founded the nonprofit Farmer-Veteran Coalition, which supports sustainable-agriculture training. “There are eight times as many farmers over age 65 as under. There is a tremendous need for young farmers, and a big wave of young people inspired to go into the service who are coming home.”

Sustainable-agriculture training offers this county a new generation of capable and knowledgeable organic farmers. It also offers an opportunity to soldiers returning from war to have a new lease on life as their attention turns from the stress of military duties to growth and the pride of providing. With programs such as this, those who are returning from service can truly ‘beat their swords into plowshares’.

~Health Freedoms

Great! That's what I'm talkin' about.

jackovesk
28th May 2012, 04:37
Besides stopping the Wars & Getting the Satanist NWO Minions/Military Industrial Complex out of the Military altogether, there is nothing we can do...

The Perpetual Tours - The (Forced) Vaccinations - The (Big Pharma) Psychotic Drugs prescribed to (ALL) those who have PTSD make them even (MORE) prone to suicide...:yes4:

Wake Up America - You've been told by your own Govt. that they now consider disgruntled 'Military Vets' potential Homegrown Terrorists..!

What the Govt. doesn't tell you is 'This is (ALL) going to Plan'...

They can't have too many Vets joining the Constitutional Militias or turning their Guns against the very Govt. that have systematically (Destroyed) their lives...!

Dennis Leahy
28th May 2012, 04:50
Jack, jump the next plane and come on over to the US and bitch-slap about 320 million people awake, please.

Dennis

im awake
28th May 2012, 05:55
The Crisis

About 18 veterans kill themselves each day. Thousands from the current wars have already done so. In fact, the number of U.S. soldiers who have died by their own hand is now estimated to be greater than the number (6,460) who have died in combat in Afghanistan and Iraq. Eleven years of war in two operating theaters have taken a severe toll on America’s military. An estimated 2.3 million Americans have served in Iraq or Afghanistan, and 800,000 of those service members have been deployed multiple times.

not much of a crisis if you ask me, according to unicef there is 246 million child slaves. how about we work on that first?

jackovesk
28th May 2012, 08:35
The Crisis

About 18 veterans kill themselves each day. Thousands from the current wars have already done so. In fact, the number of U.S. soldiers who have died by their own hand is now estimated to be greater than the number (6,460) who have died in combat in Afghanistan and Iraq. Eleven years of war in two operating theaters have taken a severe toll on America’s military. An estimated 2.3 million Americans have served in Iraq or Afghanistan, and 800,000 of those service members have been deployed multiple times.

not much of a crisis if you ask me, according to unicef there is 246 million child slaves. how about we work on that first?

Correct me if I'm wrong but the 'Thread' was titled...

Military Suicide - What Can We Do?

Please start your own 'Thread' on "246 million child slaves. how about we work on that first?", instead of demeaning/belittling the important 'Topic' as mentioned in the OP...!

...and while your at it, do some Research/Homework on just how Unicef operates, & How in Tandem with the UN, child slavery is thriving..!

:focus:

fathertedsmate
28th May 2012, 09:09
as one who completed 22yrs, as one who has had a go at the suicide thing, as one who has been on the road to oblivion,as one who has been left to get on with it oneself, as one who could put any one back to gether dont care what condition the person is in ,
i have learned so much found a person that i didnt know existed, that was me,
now i know that for at least 15 of those 22 yrs i have been slowly poisoned, only now can i say that i have only ever functioned at 50% when doing things for myself, 110% when its for someone else.
the biggest education received has been the totall lack of desire for individuals to do anything for themselves,
and the deception thats taking place within the system, one thing that all western,NATO soldiers cannot avoid is the dentist,then heat,then the machine is functioning 24/7for 6 months,try leaving your headlights on for that period, the bodys cells are being destroyed from heavy metals, will even go as far as stating those with o neg Blood grp are under attack

lilac
28th May 2012, 17:08
Fathertedsmate! It's you, my brave friend. Thank you for fighting the good fight. We need you in one piece. Your healing is everyone's healing. (((big cyberhug)))

Arrowwind
28th May 2012, 17:24
“The military is not for the faint of heart, and farming isn’t either,” said Michael O’Gorman, an organic farmer who founded the nonprofit Farmer-Veteran Coalition, which supports sustainable-agriculture training. “There are eight times as many farmers over age 65 as under. There is a tremendous need for young farmers, and a big wave of young people inspired to go into the service who are coming home.”

Sustainable-agriculture training offers this county a new generation of capable and knowledgeable organic farmers. It also offers an opportunity to soldiers returning from war to have a new lease on life as their attention turns from the stress of military duties to growth and the pride of providing. With programs such as this, those who are returning from service can truly ‘beat their swords into plowshares’.

~Health Freedoms

Great! That's what I'm talkin' about.

If every soilder could be turned into a farmer that might be a solution. Better to give life, to nurture life and support life than to take life away. Certainly a remedy for suicide.


¤=[Post Update]=¤


Wars are hell and these examples are the resulst. Viet Nam was just as bad. The answer to this is no more wars period. Until we get there we need to protect our sons and daughters from the DOD.

:peace:

Yes, when the military recruiters came looking for my sons they got an ear full. I never permitted them to talk to my boys... after all my right, I pay the phone bill. And my boys grew up learning the truth about the military and how to discern a true millitary need for a nation.



¤=[Post Update]=¤


as one who completed 22yrs, as one who has had a go at the suicide thing, as one who has been on the road to oblivion,as one who has been left to get on with it oneself, as one who could put any one back to gether dont care what condition the person is in ,
i have learned so much found a person that i didnt know existed, that was me,


Thank you for waking up and thank you for healing yourself.

Arrowwind
28th May 2012, 17:28
The Crisis

About 18 veterans kill themselves each day. Thousands from the current wars have already done so. In fact, the number of U.S. soldiers who have died by their own hand is now estimated to be greater than the number (6,460) who have died in combat in Afghanistan and Iraq. Eleven years of war in two operating theaters have taken a severe toll on America’s military. An estimated 2.3 million Americans have served in Iraq or Afghanistan, and 800,000 of those service members have been deployed multiple times.

not much of a crisis if you ask me, according to unicef there is 246 million child slaves. how about we work on that first?

The UN is not interested in eliminating childhood slavery. If they were it would be done. Nor are they interested in curing malaria, nor are they interested in a free Africa. The are interesting though in bombing the hell out of any nation that stratigistically stands in their way of political gain and earth plunder.

humanalien
30th May 2012, 12:02
All those military men were not drafted but joined the military, willingly,
knowing that they had to kill other people in another country. Many of them
did more than one tour of duty because i guess one tour was not enough
killing time for them.

That being said, the only reason, in my mind, for these people to be
killing themselves is because they have been reprogrammed to do this.

They went in, knowing that they would have to kill other people and
they also knew that there was a possibility of them coming home maimed
or not coming home alive, so that should be there reason for killing themselves.

Being reprogrammed to kill themselves, is the only thing that makes sense.

GoodETxSG
30th May 2012, 12:27
I have literally lost several friends to PTSD related suicide after returning from a tour. There are many factors, the Military has finally gotten better at awareness of yourself and your buddies and signs to watch for and report. They then get them the help they need. Once back in the public sector there is a stigma that people with PTSD have to fight, a whole new battle indeed. I have suffered from this, discrimination at work by HR or coworkers... Secondary PTSD issues with spouse or children who have to learn to change their lives to support their loved one and not trigger PTSD related depression etc... It is something that EVERY HR representative needs to learn about. When I have had to report it for reasons for going to therapy HR has become "Hostile", which is the last thing you want to do if you know anything about PTSD. The divorce rate among returning soldiers and the problems with discrimination at work are two of the major triggers for the deep depression... the triggers that just push them far enough to make that one last clouded judgment (Usually while not medicated properly, not in therapy or abusing drugs or alcohol self medicating) to take their life. It is very sad but a problem that the public needs to be educated on and learn to give these Men and Women the proper respect and treatment they need once returning to the public sector. I myself have been lucky with my Spouse, how ever I am going through a law suit right now with a blatant dismissal from a job due to discrimination to PTSD and Traumatic Brain Injury related Epilepsy. I have actually gotten together with a large group to do a protest and awareness event at this company on July 4th that will be covered on National News as well as covered by a couple of documentary movie makers. Support these people and learn to spot the warning signs in those you love with suspected or diagnosed PTSD. You could very well save their lives!

Click on my profile and see the messages for more info on this protest if you are in TX/OK/LA and want to join in.

GoodETxSG
30th May 2012, 12:33
All those military men were not drafted but joined the military, willingly,
knowing that they had to kill other people in another country. Many of them
did more than one tour of duty because i guess one tour was not enough
killing time for them.

That being said, the only reason, in my mind, for these people to be
killing themselves is because they have been reprogrammed to do this.

They went in, knowing that they would have to kill other people and
they also knew that there was a possibility of them coming home maimed
or not coming home alive, so that should be there reason for killing themselves.

Being reprogrammed to kill themselves, is the only thing that makes sense.

To be honest, the over whelming majority of these people joined in response to either the 911 event (Most of which have come back home since) or for college money. This kind of cold rationalization takes away their humanity. They have the same feelings and fears that you do. They join for patriotic reasons and after playing video games they think they know what it is to do battle. NO one can know what it feels like to be in a position to take a life or see a friends life taken until it actually happens. Video games and movies have desensitized people to war and when they get into battle... WOW... where is that PAUSE button???

I do see where you are coming from, not an attack on your post. I just saw an Op to make a point.

fathertedsmate
30th May 2012, 13:42
each and every one are all victims in the same game, put yourself in any soldiers shoes then comment, no soldier that i ever knew has fought for country, they fight for each other,the controllers decide the scenarios, and when you know how a human body works physically and mentally then it can be programmed.

i went through 22yrs, the good and the bad,received an education that money cannot buy, and i dont mean that freinds for life crap,the big family nonsense,veterans agencys are there to help,dont make me laugh.

a multi billion dollar industry has grown from the condition the troops are in, those conditions are deliberatly being created, just ask yorself some simple questions, why do all the different name tags,PTSD,combatt stress,gulf war syndrom,bipolar,alxiemers,all mental health issues. all have the same symptoms,just depends who diagnosed you, why would a chef, a clerk,a storeman,individuals who have never seen more action than action man all have the same symptoms, ps its happening to you just at a different pace,
first step to any recovery, is realise that the condition you are in is because of you,everything from birth to present is responsible for what you become, depending on blood grp will dictate what is going to affect you and how.

only now that mercury etc is out of inner organs,calcium/plaque has been removed from kidneys/arteries etc,magnesium,iodine,essential oils,vitamine c has been slowly replaced,,so many ailments gone, stress tension anger fear etc all gone,in addition to metals being removed, the job has only just begun,the damage they have caused needs to be dealt with,and thats a different ball game, parasites,pathogens,yeast, fungus,mould and viruses have to be dealt with whilst rebuilding the body from cell level, then theres the slight problem of all that brainwashing and programming to deal with, not to mention the moment you start to do something for yourself you will always be distracted from sticking to a routine,throw in all the withdrawall symptoms from medication,caffeen etc,add the outside pressures of having to survive when in controll of a broken down machine that is running on contaminated fuel, that before you even start, its a mother of a journey,its not over by a long shot,now 8st 5lb,and still wearing an overcoat of metals in skin,now discovered most muscles are calcified,its being dissolved but palms of my hands seem to be only route out.

i have analysed my life its been done 100,s of times,incidents,pictures videos all played a 1000 times each, they only stopped when i learned what it was i had to learn from them,and when that hit me,wow,i look back in horror, i thought i was in controll, no chance,i thought what i was told was true,i thought we were the good guys, i now know the frequency you are on does not allow you to see whats in front of your face,and whilst you are in that frequency range you will never see anythin other than what you are told.

a strange thing happend when i went for help armed with results showing i was worth more melted down than running about like the mad hatter (research that chap,then compare the causes and behaviour patterns of my fellow unbalanced beings) i learned that curing by going to the source and understanding exactly what is happening and why,(well i thought i did at the time,) that is not part of the deal,the system is into managing, no money in curing,also the slight problem that if they start to cure then they have to admit what the sources are,that aint going to happen.

in the meantime divide and conquer continues, the crazy thing is, your answers,thoughts,posts etc,allow anyone with the manuel of behavior and responses,can analyse the condition that person is in both physically and mentally,
peace my freinds, one day thats if i make it, i will find someone who can extract it all from me and get it accross in a way people can understand,unfortunately that wont happen, unless you change the frequency you are operating on,and you will never know unless you do something to remove chemicals/toxins/heavy metals, then the guests who have been having a ball need to go, that takes desire my freinds, mine is not for me.

i know the same thing at different rates is happening to my children, i will never get through to them untill the job is complete and it also has to be visual, ps programmed to kill yourself, are you seriouse and here i thought that i was the one that was a retard,give me a break i can only smile for so lon before my jaws hurt,

we-R-one
30th May 2012, 18:41
You ask what we can do.

As mothers and parents we should teach our children not to enter the military under this current regimen at least.
the confusion and conflict of between what the military people are doing and the truth is so wide a gap it could make anybody go crazy, depressed suicidal.

to maintian mental balance you have to have congruency of purpose in your life with concrete meaning behind action that in general supports a good intention and will lead to a good outcome

Our local newspaper had an aricle today that hunge numbers of military are qualifying for disability benefits... and merited benefits at that.. aside from the benefits alloted for physical injury which is very high because more soilders survive their wounds than ever before, mental health is a leading issue for allotment of benefits. Another one is trauma from sexual assault for women incured while in the military... and you gotta wonder how much of this leads to suicide also?

There will be no more war when people believe that war is unnecessary and they refuse to fight. I cannot condone it unless someone is attack our shores and a threat is imminent or if a nation calls out for help and it is approved by a congressional vote to go and help. Restoring honor and dignity to the forces may eliminate some of this suicide stuff.

When you send hundreds of thousands of young people out to slaughter women and children (collateral damage) I guess this is what you get. People break down. Good people dont want to do this and all the mental repression, all the denial in the world wont make it go away. Even if they are not directly involved in such outcome of military tactics they are signficantly associated and must support the acts. This will wear anyone down given time along with the other stress the service brings.

I also have to wonder about the experimental vaccines the military folks are subject too. Its a nasty nasty deal. We know what vaccines do to children. I can only assume that adults will suffer in kind.

18 a day. Wow. That is huge. and that stat was for veterans. Is there another number for those in active duty?

I couldn't agree with you more, with the exception of qualifying for military benefits, they may qualify, but whether they get them is another story....read here and you'll see why I think that:

http://www.infowars.com/us-veterans-face-financial-ruin-waiting-for-benefits-from-overburdened-va/

When I got involved in the patriot movement back in 08 one of the first books I read was The Shadows of Power by James Perloff. What an eye opener......I was often nauseated while reading that book. Whenever a mother would proudly tell me that her son or daughter was signing up for the military I would try and talk them out of it. They had no clue what they were signing up for and they would look at me as if I was telling them something absolutely crazy because they didn't want to believe that their "amazing child's decision to serve his country" was nothing but a farce. It was utterly shocking that they wouldn't take my warning seriously. I would give them plenty of resources to verify information, but they wanted nothing to do with it.

These men and women are pawns and though they sign up for all the right reasons, the reality is they are being used to serve the agenda of the cabal and nothing more. I am thoroughly disgusted at the military's leadership who allows this massacre of our men and women to continue in the manner that it has in the name of the mighty paycheck. I have lost all respect..........what they are doing is just as criminal by not stepping up to the plate in droves to detest the implementation of a genocide-like agenda - as far as I'm concerned. I have tried very hard not to judge and I am fully aware of the spiritual purposes that military leadership serves in playing the dark roles, BUT.... the 3D side of me will never hold these so called leaders in the highest regard that they feel they deserve. I find their lack of action very, very cowardly and $#@$%! despicable.

What can you do? Start educating parents who want their kids to sign up for the military. Give them a few resources or links that verifies your concerns. PARENTS THIS IS YOUR WAKE-UP CALL! IF you are a parent reading this I urge you to do your homework before you allow your child to sign up to this disasterous institution that we call our military. This institution DOES NOT REPRESENT THE INTERESTS OF WE THE PEOPLE!

UNDERSTAND THIS:
You and your child are corporate entities through your all cap name on your social security card and drivers license. Pull out your drivers license and take a look...your name is in ALL CAPITAL LETTERS. Your all cap name signifies that the corporation has jurisdiction over you! Every city, county and state has an EIN number which identifies the existence of a corporation(these are Duns and Bradstreet numbers). What does this mean? It means you are a citizen of the corporation of the United States of America and there is no such thing as the Constitution to protect your rights. Why? Because corporations follow corporate law or common-law not common law. Our laws aren't unconstitutional they're non-constitutional. And when little Johnny gets mistreated with unprecedented vaccinations that slow kill and drain him of all his worth and he decides he's going to fight because he's been wrongfully violated,.... the court system is going to protect the corporation not the individual. How? Through corporate law you are guilty until YOU prove your innocence, it's not innocent till proven guilty as they would like you to believe. Under corporate law they use interpretive ruling which means they can throw out whatever evidence you may provide and "interpret" the law as they see fit. And if that's not insult to injury that attorney you're paying out the _ss to represent you....his allegiance lies to the corporation not you the paying client! Get it??? EVERYONE SHOULD READ THE BELOW LINK so they understand what an "attorney" is all about:

"A BAR licensed Attorney is not an advocate, so how can he do anything other than what his real purpose is? He can't plead on your behalf because that would be a conflict of interest. He can't represent the crown (ruling government) as an official officer at the same time he is allegedly representing a defendant. His sworn duty as a BAR Attorney is to transfer your ownership, rights, titles, and allegiance to the land owner. When you hire a BAR Attorney to represent you in their courts, you have hired an officer of that court whose sole purpose and occupation is to transfer what you have to the creator and authority of that court. A more appropriate phrase would be legal plunder. See "The Law" by Frederic Bastiat, 1850."

The authority of the court they are referring to is the STATE also known as the corporation, aka "the landowner".

http://www.barefootsworld.net/sui_juris/hiding_behind_bar.html

Additionally, pull out your SS card, it is my understanding that it's printed on bond paper. What does that mean? It means each individual has a bond put out on their name. Which means you are worth $$$$$. Why do the ruling elite like war? Because when your beautiful child signs up to serve, only to be killed during his tour of duty, someone behind the scenes is cashing out on that bond which was taken out in his name the day he was were born unbenounced to you. Numbers I've seen hover around $350million dollars for each individual. Which means, if you're worth that much, every time you sign a contract whether it's buying a house or opening a credit card, your signature allows that dollar amount to be released and paid to an unknow entity. This means you're paying for everything twice at minimum plus interest. This is what I have come to know in my quest for the truth...though I have been unable to find this in print anywhere for obvious reasons, this is talk amongst those who know and once you see how the world really works, a scenario such as this seems more than likely.

I'm very passionate about this topic if you can't tell and my hope is if I can alert at least one person who might be considering a military career, whether he's an Avalon member or just a viewer, than I have served some sort of purpose. I encourage other's to do the same. There is nothing honorable about what's happening to our military personel. So parents, please, please take this warning seriously and start verifying what I'm saying. And please, god please, DO NOT RELY ON MAINSTREAM MEDIA FOR YOUR INFORMATION!!!! Yes, I'm shouting because I don't want anyone thinking this isn't true because it's not being broadcasted from kingdom come for all to hear.

In your quest for the truth please utilize a few links I'm providing to get you started:

Excerpts from the book The Shadows of Power- approach your local John Birch Society chapter and they might have one for you- $10 bucks or try Amazon.

You need to know who the members are of such organizations -The Council on Foreign Relations and the Trilateral Commission. Notice the "corporations" that align themselves with these organizations?

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/New_World_Order/Part1_Shadows_Power.html

Wanna know what vaccinations are doing to our military personel?
They're not just being blown up on active duty they are literally being slow killed via these vaccinations. Genocide, one of the agendas of the New World Order, is what these military men and women are serving when they sign up!

http://thinktwice.com/gulfwar.htm

Joyce Riley is an advocate for veterans and their battles with Gulf War Syndrome

http://www.coasttocoastam.com/guest/riley-joyce/5610

Is it any wonder that suicide is at such a high rate when you read this?

http://www.naturalnews.com/036001_soldiers_psychiatric_drugs_veterans.html

Still want your kid to sign up? Is this sounding glorious to you yet? Cause the paycheck your kid thinks he's gonna get for his "honor and glory" will be whittled away in no time as he battles for his life after his deployment of 10+ tours of duty all in the name of valor........

There is nothing pretty about the truth as to what's really going on here.......and instead of leaving the reader hanging, let me offer this piece of information. This is a game being played down here on Earth. It is a battle for your soul and an opportunity for soul evolution. Do not be overtaken with fear though when you truly understand my post after you investigate on your own, fear and anger may be your initial reaction. You are consciousness living many experiences for the purpose of soul evolution- a truth that's being hidden from you. Why? Because if you truly understood what being consciousness means you would fully realize the power you have and that is what "they" don't want you to understand. Part of the experience you are living entails you to encounter negative attrocities. The best advice I can give is to not operate in fear and anger as you will only serve the dark by generating negtive energy. Rather take that energy and transmute it to thoughts of love and forgiveness so that you may heal and learn from this experience, this is key! It's a game, it's only a game........watch the movie The Game with Michael Douglas and you will get a general idea of what I'm saying. What's happening down here is not real, it's an illusion. Consciousness is your power and once you realize the world is your oyster, you may find yourself appreciating this new found information as it will give you a fresh outlook to a reality that has always been, though you were unaware of it's existence. Do not allow the ugliness of this 3D world to consume your every thoughts. Once you get over the shock of the truth, focus on the spiritual aspect and teach others what you have learned.


Stepping off the soapbox now.

Nickolai
1st September 2012, 21:59
I mean, what is the question?
Do you believe in karma? I do. Do I feel compassion? NO!
Those people killed children, women, men. natural consequence!
No compassion.

In the States you call them veterans, in most of the world they call them murderers. Sorry, but that's just it!

Nickolai

Flash
1st September 2012, 23:51
My daughter has Hyperbar therapy at one point. This is pressured oxygen tanks, the same used for divers when they resurface, for decompression.

What happens is that under heavy water pressure, the blood and muscle do not react the same way and if there is no decompression, the person will die because of CO2 bubbles forming in its blood, this is for divers.

However, pressure oxygens is also used extensively by top notch sport experts for athletes injuries. When the muscles and organs are under oxygen pressure, they cure much faster and much time is gained to put them back on the ice (hockey players in Canada) or on the field, which means looooots of money for the team owners.

Well, this guy who was an expert on pressured oxygen and hyperbar usage was telling me that he believed PTSD for combat veterans was in great part due to compresssed explosions near their head and body, creating the similar traumas with minute CO2, similar to waht divers would have if not going through decompression. He had the whole explanations with impact on different brain and body parts of bombs and bullets firing nearby and how it would affect the overall resiliency of anybody under this kind of compressed air and detonations nearby.

Being himself an ex Medical Military in US, he even presented his findings to the US military, high levels ones, but with no results or follow up.

He says he has a very high rate of cure for PTSD in war Veterans when the persons are put in an hyperbar chamber for decompression (few sessions - 40 - 5,000$).

Parents do it for autism as well and other neurological/muscular diseases and I even met a medical doctor taking hyperbar therapies to reduce her brain tumors (cancer). This is not for decompression but for cure.

HYPERBAR THERAPY SHOULD BE OFFERED TO VETERANS. It should be part of the treatment, at least some studies should be done with that tool.

Jackson
2nd September 2012, 00:44
A great problem facing us now. I know that sometimes the pain is so great the only way out is suicide. A permanent solution for a temporary problem.....only the soldiers feel like it is not temporary.
I feel great compassion for those that are suffering....but for just a moment consider what those innocent civilians in Iraq and Afganistan are going thru. Talk about PTSD......their country is devastated. the men, women and children are suffering daily from depleted uranium poisoning and life for most is a daily struggle just to stay alive. Remember, we are responsible for this.

We must have compassion for both sides.

sunnyrap
2nd September 2012, 01:28
I imagine Nickolai's words and attitude are what the suicidal vets are hearing in the backs of their own heads. I understand your anger, Nickolai, I've felt it myself.

Even so, here's how I see it: though such an 'eye for an eye' might temporarily satisfy anger over such tragic losses, it doesn't really do much to correct what caused it in the first place. For that to happen, not only we the observers but also those who materially participated in the travesty have to realize the error then move to eradicate the sources of it. And it apparently, unfortunately, it takes seeing it first hand to really bring home certain really essential truths about warring with others. That where it starts is evil, greed-inspired, sociopathic manipulation, ignorance, bad programming. Until you really get it yourself, you're likely to be easily manipulated to label groups like this and the knowledge that would keep us and ours from willingly waging war on any other group as 'wing-nuts and conspiracy theorists' and mistaking all the political rhetoric as 'intelligent adjustment to reality'.

But for a lot of young people today, joining the military isn't/hasn't been about being heroic, macho or patriotic or participating in a (however misdirected) political solution...it's just a desperate choice born out of the carefully crafted economic crash that most people are simply not educated enough to realize. Most of the young people joining around here are doing it to have some kind of job to support themselves and their families. I went to Texas Workforce Commission with my teenage son. There was an Army recruiter with a permanent desk there. He makes a strong pitch for 'all expenses paid travel', free training in the area of your choice, yada yada yada (I threatened to bodily harm my son if he said anything to the guy beyond 'thank you for sharing, now where's the job counselor's office"). But other naive young people fall for it, some even aware of what they will put themselves in, because they have nothing else: then they are pumped up in boot camp, sent out to kill and maim on command, then be discarded.

This mind massaging starts early these days. Military is allowed on middle school campuses on up. I signed paper stating my son was not to be talked to by these people. In the local high school, a uniform code was adopted. I was infuriated because I knew it as the first step in reducing resistance to soldier behavior. I didn't vote for it and couldn't find any parents who did--only a small number of parents even liked the idea. I fought it right in the principal's office. The vice principal was ex-military (in fact a former drill sargent). I unleashed my full passion about having my son conditioned to unquestioning obedience and regimented behavior. I told that VP that if the teachers and staff were not earning respect the old fashioned way, by EARNING IT, they didn't deserve it by force. (He quit the folling term, btw, and I ended up homeschooling. My son graduated with some of the highest scores in the county.). My point bringing this up here is it takes action on the personal level to start reversing these terrible trends.

WE are going to have to--our so called 'leaders', elitists, politicians and (negative) corporatists distanced themselves so completely from the people they bilk, manipulate and destroy (and consider if the people LET them, they deserve it), we cannot possibly believe any solution will come from them. It must come from all of us--especially the veterans, who must decide to wake up, refuse to be complicit in the stupidity. But that's what this forum is about isn't it? Clearing out bad programming, eradicating misperceptions, sharing techniques that work?

I have a personal goal to help veterans reconnect to their humanity and harness what has to be an enormous emotional charge over what they've seen, experienced, done and learned into sharing
themselves in such ways to prevent others from taking that wrong road, making that mistake yet again. Saving lives is important, but saving souls is more so.

For those who are veterans or have a relationship with one who is suffering depression, there are some programs out there to help them. A friend (with appropriate credentials) and I are in the planning stages of setting up such program here in the southwest using methods known to be very helpful in restoring mental-emotional-physical balance in veterans. I will give more information on it via Private Message to anyone interested.

mexrph
2nd September 2012, 04:27
The antidepressant drugs are causing these suicides. Read the warnings on any antidepressant drug and there is a boatload of side effects including suicide and hostility. THESE ANTIDEPRESSANT DRUGS ARE EXTREMELY DANGEROUS!. I am a retired pharmacist. If you need a good antidepressant, take 500mg of St. Johns Wort and 500mg of Kava Kava twice a day. I take it myself and it works like a charm. Buy from the internet. Prices are very reasonable.

gooty64
2nd September 2012, 04:42
carry war no more

F-1pxv6H6yM

Jules
2nd September 2012, 07:14
Obviously, this cry for help shows an issue. Acknowledge it. This person has served in a mafia military (maybe), and I don't believe that's what he/she signed up for. They wanted to serve their country and be a hero. Now they realized, the world isn't what they thought. The first thing I would do (if it were me, but it isn't), is ask, what is so bad that you think life doesn't have worth it. Let them talk (if they will). Listen, really listen. Then let them know, you understand things must be horrible at this time, and they must very well have a good reason. They may say you don't understand. Agree, each person has been through an individual experience. Why not stick around to see what happens, even if it is hard. Life is short anyway. Maybe you can help someone else who has been through same experience. Maybe by talking to people that have gone through similar experiences, you can help each other, yourself, and others. You are upset, and don't know what to do, but everything changes. Live, just to see what happens. It is worth it. You are worth it. Forgive yourself, learn from what happened, and do something to make the world a better place, if you can't, just forgive yourself, and take care of yourself and loved ones. We don't live forever, so let things happen naturally as they should. God loves everyone, and encourage him/her to find their own truth, not self destruction.

Carmody
4th September 2012, 22:35
There can only be one way tha the number of military suicides is higher than the atual death count.------ they have to be lying about the number of soldiers killed in these wars.

There IS a way to prove that.

All one has to do, is begin an organization that gathers the names of the war dead.


In very short order, the list will be of a greater number of dead than has been reported, for the number that has been 'guestimated' as the true number, is somewhere between 3x-5x-7x higher than the official number of dead reported.

Think about it. A HIGHER number of suicides than dead in battle?

Very, very unlikely. As in, it has never happened before, in the history of conflict between humans, on this earth. Never.

Yet, this is the number that is out there, and it ends up showing their hand, when it comes to hiding the number of dead in the wars themselves.

Kindred
5th September 2012, 00:15
Truth be told, there's nothing 'we' can do about "it" (suicide by veterans)... these are individual decisions, driven by a variety of personal circumstances, typically made in the heat of a moment, that are made by people outside our knowledge and sphere of influence, unless one happens to be on the 'front lines' of this particular problem - family members, friends, or those in the health services. Yes, it would be good to see more services provided to the veterans who need it. However, as long as the profit motive remains, it is unlikely there will be any improvement, as the gov't is probably pleased to see these people end their lives, as it reduces the demand on future benefits from said gov't.

The only Real 'solution' is to end the wars. And, to end the wars, you must end the profit motive for them. And, what drives that profit? The desire for the domination of other country's resources, primarily oil, or pathways to gain access to said oil or other fossil fuels or resources, via the use of military might. So, the solution is truly the creation of freely available unlimited energy sources. THIS will kill the profit motive, and thus force a paradigm shift away from war. When energy is cheap and plentiful, these money junkies and power-hungry oligarchs will have Nothing to control the populations with.

That is why they Do Not want their secrets revealed - the secrets of unlimited power generation, and the resultant benefits it can provide in all areas of human endeavor. You can be certain that not only do they have access to unlimited power, but they most likely have knowledge of technology that can greatly benefit the entire health services arena.

Certainly, this is not a complete solution, but I suspect it would be a major step forward in turning our world away from it's headlong decent into a self-made hell, and allow humans to turn away from the divisiveness that dominates our landscape - all promoted by these manipulators of our current situation.

In Unity, Peace and Love