Deciphering Forum Trolls

[gigha]

Trolls show themselves quietly

They have much wisdom to impart

Many opinions about government and religion

These are key, to the troll

It is what gives them control

They tend to be able to post many links to many different subjects

very quickly

I wonder why that is.

We should all pay attention while on Avalon

Just some thoughts from gigha peace

[gigha]

I knew that this was a bit of a dodgy subject

Oh well you have to follow your heart

[danceblackcatdance]

Interesting... Is a dodgy subject and yet I was thinking something similar, but was going to use the term 'sockpuppet'... A little more sinister than troll (edit: because I though a troll was doing it for fun / personal and sockpuppets are gov.)

Anyway, I don't know why they bother.. "what is not Tao will not last", all corrupt systems will collapse eventually... speaking from the heart is best :)

[jaybee]

Trolls show themselves quietly

They have much wisdom to impart

Many opinions about government and religion

These are key, to the troll

It is what gives them control

They tend to be able to post many links to many different subjects

very quickly

I wonder why that is.

We should all pay attention while on Avalon

Just some thoughts from gigha peace


thanks...yes the con-troll-ers


a forum such as this is bound to be teeming with aspiring con-troll-ers...or should that be 'teaming'....because they are going to work in groups.

Some (most?) will be on a pay-roll.....but some might be part of an unpaid political agenda....IMO.


I'd say......to the genuine members here....beware of serial thread-starters with a negative message....and their team-mates who support them in their endeavours.



I knew that this was a bit of a dodgy subject

Oh well you have to follow your heart


lol...it IS a dodgy subject...because it feeds on paranoia. But it is possible to observe the 'goings on' without letting it take you off course, I think.

It's no good trying to 'out' them...because, like I said they work in teams and also
capture 'genuine' members in the web of deceit. They are clever so-and-so's.


So yes. Genuine members have to just follow their heart/instincts in these matters.

:thumb:


.

[gigha]

Yes i have had my time with a "sockpuppet" but she was from mars.

That is a hole other story

Not really to do with what is called "trolls"

[jaybee]

.


trolls might use sockpuppets, though.....to back up their agenda-posting


.

[gigha]

All I want is people to be aware that there are

People that work for various 3 letter company's

And they are here

On Avalon so don't give too much away

[gigha]

I could not say it any better myself

Much love gigha



Trolls show themselves quietly

They have much wisdom to impart

Many opinions about government and religion

These are key, to the troll

It is what gives them control

They tend to be able to post many links to many different subjects

very quickly

I wonder why that is.

We should all pay attention while on Avalon

Just some thoughts from gigha peace


thanks...yes the con-troll-ers


a forum such as this is bound to be teeming with aspiring con-troll-ers...or should that be 'teaming'....because they are going to work in groups.

Some (most?) will be on a pay-roll.....but some might be part of an unpaid political agenda....IMO.


I'd say......to the genuine members here....beware of serial thread-starters with a negative message....and their team-mates who support them in their endeavours.



I knew that this was a bit of a dodgy subject

Oh well you have to follow your heart


lol...it IS a dodgy subject...because it feeds on paranoia. But it is possible to observe the 'goings on' without letting it take you off course, I think.

It's no good trying to 'out' them...because, like I said they work in teams and also
capture 'genuine' members in the web of deceit. They are clever so-and-so's.


So yes. Genuine members have to just follow their heart/instincts in these matters.

:thumb:


.

[gigha]

Still waiting for the trolls

There has to be a fight here.

I hate anyone that does not allow me to be who I am

God sucks is the moon hollow haha

what are we??

[Humble Janitor]

I'm not sure what the point of this thread is.

The term "troll" is offensive anyway because it's used far too often to paint people with differing opinions in a negative manner.

I've been called a troll on other forums for expressing my opinions.

The internet is a vicious place due to the hive minds and need to conform to "rules" and "guidelines". You can't really talk about taboo subjects like drug legalization, etc on for example, ATS because the administrators need the ad revenue to keep the site going. Like no one is going to advertise about a subject like that? How about an age-verification program?

I remember the internet when it was a vast, open frontier of information. Like a giant book. My 15 year old self was delighted at this new technology.

As a 30 year, I've had enough.

[gigha]

OK from my original OP who do you all think might work for other

Than themselves ?

[gigha]

Sorry I only meant the term "troll" to do with "TPTB" or the "tptw"


I'm not sure what the point of this thread is


The term "troll" is offensive anyway because it's used far too often to paint people with differing opinions in a negative manner.

I've been called a troll on other forums for expressing my opinions.

The internet is a vicious place due to the hive minds and need to conform to "rules" and "guidelines". You can't really talk about taboo subjects like drug legalization, etc on for example, ATS because the administrators need the ad revenue to keep the site going. Like no one is going to advertise about a subject like that? How about an age-verification program?

I remember the internet when it was a vast, open frontier of information. Like a giant book. My 15 year old self was delighted at this new technology.

As a 30 year, I've had enough.

[jaybee]

.


_p918TC6pnM


trolls, trolls...la la la la la....;)


.

[Lettherebelight]

I don't know if you will ever be able to get away from them. Like bacteria on the body, you've just got to live with it...just don't let it take over and build up a healthy immune system. :)

[DarMar]

THIS:
The term "troll" is offensive anyway because it's used far too often to paint people with differing opinions in a negative manner.
is so true

Why you giga have need to divide humans more than they are divided?
Who gave you power to do that?

We should learn by contradictory and different opinions not from all that: yes i agree and i feel vibe... no one has learned anything from yes yes...
To be more direct before 9/11 and mass conspiracy stuff label troll didnt even existed! helooooooo? wake up!

http://oi45.tinypic.com/1o9lbm.jpg

[jaybee]

Still waiting for the trolls



helooooooo? wake up!




pIgZ7gMze7A


:p


;)


.

[Fred Steeves]

pIgZ7gMze7A


:p


;)



Jaybee, I think you should have to serve detention after school today, for subjecting us to a "Wham" video.:cool:

[jaybee]

Jaybee, I think you should have to serve detention after school today, for subjecting us to a "Wham" video.:cool:

looooooooooool...I'm a very naughty Avalon member.....:madgrin:


you no like the skimpy shorts......?

:shocked:


.

[GK76]

How do we know who is a troll? Do we burn them and if they survive they are trolls? It's hard to be a member of a forum when the majority are charred corpses.

Did you mean co-intel pro? Those who are paid to further the 'divide and conquer' plan. This is what we need to look out for... those who throw a spanner in the works of this machine - those who drive a wedge between friends.

It won't be long before someone feels strongly about a subject and will be labelled "troll" or "co-intel pro" by the true trolls. The label just adds more ammo for the enemy. Oh look a spanner in the works and a colossal wedge too!

It's a better idea to help those in this forum to bond rather than spread confusion and suspicion. Differing opinions should agree to disagree and go their separate ways and respect the opinions and facts brought by others. Perhaps we should have more character to simply state (and only once) that we disagree and will collect more facts, and avoid the single minded hate campaign that slowly brews.

When a good friendly understanding is shown the trolls stand out much easier. Then the admin should just watch silently for other signs, they will always overplay their hands... such is arrogance.

Often those who start the troll hunt are the trolls. Maybe it's a witch hunt? Perhaps an Inquisition? Same old tired tactics, same negative (and often disturbed) minds behind it.

I'm not pointing fingers with this post, no one is being targeted, yet I think we can all remember a time when we have become lost in a discussion and could easily be called trolls. Getting lost in a passionate subject isn't a problem, the problem occurs when the subject seems to be steered towards a thread closure. The co-intel pro know how to manipulate. It seems that our mods are more than a match for them, that's why they are staying low and only come out to sacrifice their identity at key times.

The reason I'm still at Avalon is because they won't win here.

Please excuse the mind dump. :)

[Maia Gabrial]

Yes i have had my time with a "sockpuppet" but she was from mars.

That is a hole other story

Not really to do with what is called "trolls"

Now YOU'VE captured my imagination, gigha! PLEASE start a thread and share your Mars story with us....!

[Kelly]

I dont like the term troll, mainly because, on another site i was on, whenever i had an different opinion of the OP, and stated logical things, instead of airy-fairy things, i was called a troll.
I was simply trying to figure out the truth, and got slated for it, ive since left.
I do think there are people actually paid to disrupt and spread dis-info, but when we start calling people trolls, the trust between humans, gets spread thinner and thinner, and divides us even more, when really, we should all becoming together at this point in time.
Sometimes, we just have to agree to disagree, and move on without any name calling ;)

[Cartomancer]

This is kind of amusing. Do any of you really honestly believe there is anything going on here on Project Avalon that any "three letter" government agency would be interested in? Really? C'mon.

Maybe they'll find out Bob Dean is spilling the beans about the jump room to mars or maybe they need to see how we feel about Richard Hoagland's "highly rational and scientific" theories. Perhaps they want the latest skinny and real low down about the Baltic Sea anomaly. All of the latest cutting edge material must come to light for the very first time right here on humble little 'ol Project Avalon. This is a total hoot. Name one thing that is here on this board that any security agency would be concerned with enough to send operatives to disrupt. Gee Whiz gang I know paranoia is a simply a higher state of awareness but this is a little much. -signed "Trollio" and "Billy Goat's Gruff."

[NancyV]

Excellent post, GK76!

If there are any so called trolls here, who really cares? I've always enjoyed the people who have passionate views even when I disagree with them. If I don't like anything about them, I don't read their posts or go into threads they've started. I don't care if there are paid government trolls here. What a great job! Going into a forum of alternative thinkers and new age types to try to sow dissension. LOL... Of course it isn't difficult since dissension is so easy to get going.

This is part of the challenge of being here in a human body...developing discernment. If you don't experience a lot of challenges here, how are you going to have discernment when you die and some being of love and light takes you to the so-called "heaven" or "valhalla" or "paradise" or whatever you happen to believe in? Then you'll just get stuck in some pretty prison on another low vibrational frequency dimension. Oh well, hopefully you'll develop a love of constant harp music. I do have great compassion, though, for those who get stuck with 72 virgins for perpetuity! LOL... They probably deserve it.

Singling out people and calling them trolls is like a witch hunt. It's ugly and silly and anyone who takes it seriously could get hurt. But of course there are always some good lessons there too. I would just laugh if someone called me a troll for being a contrarian or supporting unpopular views. I don't take much of anything seriously. After all, it's all an illusion. Might as well have fun while we're here. I guess if it gives someone pleasure to call others trolls...so be it. We each get to choose our own little pleasures in life.
:blah: :amen:

How do we know who is a troll? Do we burn them and if they survive they are trolls? It's hard to be a member of a forum when the majority are charred corpses.

Did you mean co-intel pro? Those who are paid to further the 'divide and conquer' plan. This is what we need to look out for... those who throw a spanner in the works of this machine - those who drive a wedge between friends.

It won't be long before someone feels strongly about a subject and will be labelled "troll" or "co-intel pro" by the true trolls. The label just adds more ammo for the enemy. Oh look a spanner in the works and a colossal wedge too!

It's a better idea to help those in this forum to bond rather than spread confusion and suspicion. Differing opinions should agree to disagree and go their separate ways and respect the opinions and facts brought by others. Perhaps we should have more character to simply state (and only once) that we disagree and will collect more facts, and avoid the single minded hate campaign that slowly brews.

When a good friendly understanding is shown the trolls stand out much easier. Then the admin should just watch silently for other signs, they will always overplay their hands... such is arrogance.

Often those who start the troll hunt are the trolls. Maybe it's a witch hunt? Perhaps an Inquisition? Same old tired tactics, same negative (and often disturbed) minds behind it.

I'm not pointing fingers with this post, no one is being targeted, yet I think we can all remember a time when we have become lost in a discussion and could easily be called trolls. Getting lost in a passionate subject isn't a problem, the problem occurs when the subject seems to be steered towards a thread closure. The co-intel pro know how to manipulate. It seems that our mods are more than a match for them, that's why they are staying low and only come out to sacrifice their identity at key times.

The reason I'm still at Avalon is because they won't win here.

Please excuse the mind dump. :)

[Praxis]

I agree with Cartomancer. This website is probably such low priority that they would only focus on it is we mention something super sensitive.

Why beat around the bush. Don't just say "thar be trolls"

Who do you think is trolling and why? Then a conversation can be had instead of an ambiguous circle jerk

[Fred Steeves]

This is kind of amusing. Do any of you really honestly believe there is anything going on here on Project Avalon that any "three letter" government agency would be interested in? Really? C'mon.


Hi Cartomancer, of course I wouldn't expect there is any information crossing the wires here what so ever, that Godzilla's lawn servive guy doesn't well know.(LOL) I would however suspect that the interest would be in the raising of consciousness thing. That's where the real action is, and that's exactly what I would send the alphabet boys out to discourage.

Hell, they'll let us follow their little bread crumb trails of secret insider information til the cows come home, if that is what it takes to keep us occupied. But at all cost we can not be allowed to raise our collective consciousness. This would be where a Project Avalon could be the first domino to set off the whole chain. That could have a Project Avalon deemed dangerous.

Well, that's what I see anyway.http://nexus.2012info.ca/forum/images/smilies/newadditions/smile.gif

Cheers,
Fred

[Sierra]

I agree with Cartomancer. This website is probably such low priority that they would only focus on it is we mention something super sensitive.

Why beat around the bush. Don't just say "thar be trolls"

Who do you think is trolling and why? Then a conversation can be had instead of an ambiguous circle jerk

<putting mod hat on>

No calling names of members as trolls here, please. Just ... maybe stick to an analysis of troll behavior that can provide recognition to newbies to the forum.

[bearcow]

Name one thing that is here on this board that any security agency would be concerned with enough to send operatives to disrupt.

The clarity of perception of the thousands of individuals trying to understand what is really going on in the world.

This is why they are more interested in spreading dis-information rather than de-bunking any particular data

[Praxis]

I was not suggesting name calling, I was suggesting that we have a discussion about members of the community who post questionable things.
We all should be aware of the software that was developed for the Armed Services which would allow one operator to run many avatars that would post seemingly legit information or ideas to locale appropriate places. (man i wish I could remember the name of it) **it is called Persona Management Software and it was developed for the Air Force ibelieve**

If the alphabet agencies are here watching, this is how they would be doing it. So if there are people seem like they fit this bill, what should we do?

[Sierra]

I was not suggesting name calling, I was suggesting that we have a discussion about members of the community who post questionable things.
We all should be aware of the software that was developed for the Armed Services which would allow one operator to run many avatars that would post seemingly legit information or ideas to locale appropriate places. (man i wish I could remember the name of it) **it is called Persona Management Software and it was developed for the Air Force ibelieve**

If the alphabet agencies are here watching, this is how they would be doing it. So if there are people seem like they fit this bill, what should we do?

Well ... I'd suggest (just a suggestion) responding to the data a member has posted, and give your reasons you think the material is trolling on that particular thread, and give your reasons for disagreement of the points made.

And sometimes it will blow up in your face ... given the nature of trolls. But if you are logical, dispassionate, and give good information, then you will build energy towards the actual point of the thread discussion, give other members something to hang their hat on so to speak.

Sierra

[Praxis]

Sierra,
I am really not trying to make a thing here :) Please understand this :)

I was just responding to the OP which was very ambiguous and did not feel productive. If you cant spot information( call it a troll if you like) that does not jive with you, then this is probably not the best website to visit.

Laws: are only needed when the community is too apathetic to act as a whole. I am not saying they are not necessary, at least at this point in time, but community is the strength. If there is something in the community that is not right, then the community should act on it and if warranted ostracize the offending member. This does not mean that their membership be revoked, because redemption is always possible, but all other members can stop interacting with them until they change their tune.

I do not want H. W. Bush drawn, quartered, and hung because "before we act, let us not become the evil we deplore." What I do want, is the community to recognize his deeds and act accordingly, which will lead to ostracizing. SHould we condemn him to hell forever as certain holy books suggest? No, because we are one and this would only be sending a part of ourselves to "hell".

This was the impetus behind what I said. I must admit I do not read an awful lot of the post on this website for various reasons. But I do consume almost any link to some sort of data at all. The more data the better. I do use my discernment as every one does. But If a member of this community feels that another is intentionally giving out bad data, I would like to know why they think so. That is all. I will drop this now and let things run their course. Thanks Sierra, I know your job is not easy :)

[shadowstalker]

What is to be a questionable thing?
To whom would it be questionable?
What is the guide line for such a thing?
What would be the catch all words to determine this?
What is the definition of a troll? Who determines that?
\And so much more..........

A very thin line in being ask to be made here. (Collectively)

so don't give too much away
How much would be to much? who standards besides ones own self.

Then what would be the point of being here then, if we start being like any other forum....?

[Peace of Mind]

It doesn’t matter. If someone is saying something you don’t agree with… just ignore it. The only way anything can live is if you feed it. When you find yourself in a conversation that seems to be going the negative route…just stop, get out and change your course, simple. Being a troll and calling someone a troll is just 2 sides to the same coin, imo. When one has an issue with an opinion….that opinion is most likely not the issue, the problem is much deeper...

Peace

[noxon medem]

..
-

If anyone
is so stupid as
to use their prescious
time on earth to be
something (someone)
else than their own
true self , here ,
there, and everywhere ....

Then ...

- well, what to say ..

Be (a) well .

All

nm

[Forevernyt]

Whenever I see a post about Trolls, I always think, "Hey Trolls need love too!"

http://home.comcast.net/~forevernyt/old%20one%20eyea.JPG

[Ki's]

It's been my experience that when you suddenly see a long string of much older posts. resurfaced....chances are good that there is a gem that has been buried. Sometimes it is just a newbie playing 'catch-up' on older posts...but other times you'll notice that it is a single poster making multiple short posts to bury a thread.
Just look for the gem.
Searching for trolls, outing (perceived) trolls or engaging with them is an energy suck. It diminishes us and empowers them.

[NancyV]

This is an AWESOME Troll !! I love it!
:kiss:

Whenever I see a post about Trolls, I always think, "Hey Trolls need love too!"

http://home.comcast.net/~forevernyt/old%20one%20eyea.JPG

[RMorgan]

Why care about trolls on internet forums in the first place?

Internet forums are just a consequence; a place to discuss information which usually comes from an external source (alternative media celebrities, whistle blowers, gurus, etc..).

Instead of wasting energy trying to identify mini-trolls here, people should focus on finding the big ones; those who spread the news.

You know, some people in the alternative media are so influential that a single blog post might spread to hundreds of internet forums like this in just a couple of days.

These are the real potential big trolls, the ones we should watch. You can be sure they are highly targeted by cointelpro operatives because of their influential powers.

Raf.

[Hasanchop]

It doesn’t matter. If someone is saying something you don’t agree with… just ignore it. The only way anything can live is if you feed it.


This. Stupidity should not be encouraged on any level, however as much as I ignore religion in all its forms, it's sadly still there, being forever stupid :/

If only reality was like the Simpsons halloween episode where Lisa encourages everyone to ignore the giant corporate mascots so they receive no attention and keel over, 'Just don't look, just don't look!'

[shadowstalker]

If only reality was like the Simpsons halloween episode where Lisa encourages everyone to ignore the giant corporate mascots so they receive no attention and keel over, 'Just don't look, just don't look!

That's been going thru my head for about 2 weeks now...

[Fred Steeves]

If only reality was like the Simpsons halloween episode where Lisa encourages everyone to ignore the giant corporate mascots so they receive no attention and keel over, 'Just don't look, just don't look!

That's been going thru my head for about 2 weeks now...

Absolutely shadowstalker, good observation. "Disengage" is my magic word. Whether it be TPTB, a psychopath(same thing), or your run of the mill troll. Nothing will ever be gained from fighting and/or arguing with these types, only more loss and heartache will come.

When we recognize the situation for what it is, to simply disengage tends to starve the beast. We are the batteries that keep the machine rolling after all.

[SKAWF]

what if all the trolls on the internet
decided to target tptb?

my own limited experience to identifying a troll is......

someone who labours the same point over and over
and no matter how many people offer different viewpoints
it is never enough. it never leads anywhere near a resolution

someone who will take that same point and inject it into threads of different subjects
regardless if its appropriate or not.

someone who is persistantly 'contray' to anything that is presented to them

someone who displays a clear lack of regard for others

someone who will go onto a thread with the intention of causing dispruption to it
(it may take 30 people to create a good thread, but just one can destroy it)

someone who gets a jolly out of winding people up

as has been stated above, about pasting long articles.......
not wrong in itself....
but if someone is going to fill up my screen with words,
i want them to come from that person..... not wikipedia
i do feel that every now and then is fine....
but not for every post.

i have found that some trolls dont have that big a lexicon to work with.
there are only so many pre constructed replies available to the troll

and so after a while
one might notice them coming back with the same 'witty' response over and over.

i do feel that what they are really trying to do...
is project onto everyone else....the negativity they feel inside
maybe as a perverse way of redressing their own imbalance...
or as some kinda warped power game.
possibly both

steve

[enfoldedblue]

Having quickly read through this thread, it seems to me that there is confusion here due to the use of the term troll. In my understanding a troll is basically someone (generally with way too much time on their hands) who 'gets off' by stirring people up. They love to get people's goat, and make them squirm.

I didn't get the sense that the OP was saying that people with different opinions were trolls.

But my interpretation of the OP is that s/he (sorry don't know) is just putting out a gentle warning to others to be aware that there are likely AGENTS (not trolls...though they sometimes act like them) among our members, who are paid to keep the divisional info in focus.

I agree that it can be a dangerous thing to point out because we can start second guessing our fellow members, but at the same time I do think this is a good thing to be aware of...as long as we are not making accusations.

[Sidney]

I'm not sure what the point of this thread is.

The term "troll" is offensive anyway because it's used far too often to paint people with differing opinions in a negative manner.

I've been called a troll on other forums for expressing my opinions.

The internet is a vicious place due to the hive minds and need to conform to "rules" and "guidelines". You can't really talk about taboo subjects like drug legalization, etc on for example, ATS because the administrators need the ad revenue to keep the site going. Like no one is going to advertise about a subject like that? How about an age-verification program?

I remember the internet when it was a vast, open frontier of information. Like a giant book. My 15 year old self was delighted at this new technology.

As a 30 year, I've had enough.

It really should only be offensive to the TROLL. If you are not a troll, whats the worry? Nnot sure I get where you are coming from.

[LarryC]

It's hard to identify trolls, because you never really know what someone's intentions are. But it's quite likely there are a few on every forum like this. This doesn't necessarily mean they are paid disinfo agents, though some probably are. Others may just be addicted to the game of arguing, debunking and outwitting their opponents (at least in their own minds).

I am actually researching this and related topics right now. Not specifically about trolls, but about how to tell the difference between truth and disinfo. I came across the following on a forum I'm not familiar with. I would suggest reading the post by someone named Jibbguy, who claims to be familiar with the recruitment process used to hire paid shills. He says they actively recruit people who are skilled at arguing, such as out of work lawyers.

http://www.overunity.com/7516/how-to-spot-mib-disinfo-agents-in-forums/#.T_uimHA6KUc

[jaybee]

.

nice find LarryC....:thumb:

I think it's worth quoting that first post from 'jibbguy'...he's talking about some things that I've noticed here and on another forum I'm on.





Back when i was mainly in the political blog genre, i was "recruited" for this (or specifically, they tried to). I went along with it long enough to find out what the deal was. It required doing a writing test that shows the person's "persuasive writing" ability. At least with the people who offered me work, it went like this:

A "Contractor" who is a third party "cutout", hires people to shill. The individual "free-lance" shills are usually not told who the actual "Client" is (although they can often guess because of the message). The shills are given their next "projects" (sometimes as a team), given info on how to mask their MAC numbers and change I.P.'s, and sent a URL for a forum to go to, and of course the specific "message" they are supposed to disseminate and push there. Sometimes forum names of people there are also given to "support" or '"attack"; and they are often provided background info needed for them to sound "up to speed" on the subjects discussed (lol one way to detect them is they will often use "buzz words" indiscriminately and inappropriately as a means of trying to establish "cover").

Sometimes, existing forum accounts are used by giving the new person a pre-existing account name and password. This gets tricky, as people can often exhibit a strange and innate subconscious ability to detect differences in writing style (whether this is "ESP" or simply "intuition" is hard to say, but it does exist). Those that do this, usually keep their posts as short as possible... The less said the better.

The targets are not always open forums, but often news sites (like newspapers' online sites, or news orgs' online sites like "CNN"), that have popular "Comment" areas under the day's articles.

The intent is not always direct, but sometimes more subtle, in that the threads are often attempted to be "shaped" and "guided" by a team working together in certain directions first for a while as a "set-up" for some specific reason that later comes out. Not only that, but there is frequent use of something called

"REVERSE BIAS"

which means that the shill will often start out new on the site, posting in favor of the thing they are actually against. This can work two ways: "One", as setting a "provenance" and "bona fides" for the shill, and "Two" as a means of subtly dis'ing a subject by pretending to be for it. Often in the first case, the person will later "change sides"... LOL as a means of saying: "Gee, i was convinced by the wonderful arguments on the other side that i was completely wrong before! Thanks for saving me from my own stupidity!"

And YES, i did tell them to got to hell

Lawyers who are out of work or currently "under-employed", are often tapped for this work... Either as free lancers or contracted through their Firm. Lol i guess the idea is that they are better than average at Debate (since this is actually taught in Law School).... But the truth is, very few of these people no mater where they come from, are any good at all When it comes down to it, they usually "suck" and their main strategy is to often use ad hominem personal attacks and threat of derision. In fact this is a main indicator to watch for... Not that many adults will stoop to these tactics unless first provoked. But some will who are not shills lol, so it is only ONE indicator and not "proof".

Shills can be effective on less intelligent people who are confused by more arcane arguments, by re-defining the argument into a more simple context, then once that is done they use straw-man arguments "proving" the new, simpler thrust that meets their goals... Basically it is a "bait and switch" game; and classic misdirection... Tarring all the subject by defining only one part of it.... Lol, sound familiar?

"Shilling" is not a new profession (lol if it can actually be called a profession, like "egg sucking" could ), but it has changed and grown greatly since the rise of the Internet.

I have read that the U.S. military uses actual military personnel to shill directly for them as well in at least some cases. But it would be hard to prove that one i imagine

But i've said this before, and will again prolly, lol:

The majority of people suspected of being "shills" or "dis-info artists" on these sites (which are the same thing imo), are probably not really. They are simply people who disagree with us So caution is suggested, and it is rarely wise to directly confront them (unless some good proofs exist first.. Which ARE possible to obtain).

Having said that, they certainly do exist and there are probably some reading this thread right now;) The fun part of it is, they are just "people", and are nothing to fear as they are just jerks without any personal honor sitting at their computers... And they certainly can be manipulated, the same way they try to do with others



The word 'troll' has a broad meaning....but the OP on the first page made it clear they were talking about 'agents'.


We're really talking about PSYOPS or PSYWAR.....


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychological_warfare


Psychological warfare (PSYWAR), or the basic aspects of modern psychological operations (PSYOP), have been known by many other names or terms, including Psy Ops, Political Warfare, “Hearts and Minds”, and Propaganda.[1] Various techniques are used, by any set of groups, and aimed to influence a target audience's value systems, belief systems, emotions, motives, reasoning, or behavior. It is used to induce confessions or reinforce attitudes and behaviors favorable to the originator's objectives, and are sometimes combined with black operations or false flag tactics. Target audiences can be governments, organizations, groups, and individuals.


they seek to persuade, change and influence


One way that genuine members can use the PSYOPS crew...is to notice what/who they are attacking, what they are steering genuine members towards (or away from) and also what they are largely ignoring ...if you have your psyops 'suspects'...or group of suspects, you can use them as a pointer as to what the status quo doesn't want aired...or what they want to fill your head with...


I know this can get into the realm of paranoia...lol...but I DO believe it is the reality of any forum dealing with sensitive info and/or conspiracies.


.

[gigha]

jaybee that is why I started this thread

to show that trolls shills or whatever are here

thank you.


.

nice find LarryC....:thumb:

I think it's worth quoting that first post from 'jibbguy'...he's talking about some things that I've noticed here and on another forum I'm on.





Back when i was mainly in the political blog genre, i was "recruited" for this (or specifically, they tried to). I went along with it long enough to find out what the deal was. It required doing a writing test that shows the person's "persuasive writing" ability. At least with the people who offered me work, it went like this:

A "Contractor" who is a third party "cutout", hires people to shill. The individual "free-lance" shills are usually not told who the actual "Client" is (although they can often guess because of the message). The shills are given their next "projects" (sometimes as a team), given info on how to mask their MAC numbers and change I.P.'s, and sent a URL for a forum to go to, and of course the specific "message" they are supposed to disseminate and push there. Sometimes forum names of people there are also given to "support" or '"attack"; and they are often provided background info needed for them to sound "up to speed" on the subjects discussed (lol one way to detect them is they will often use "buzz words" indiscriminately and inappropriately as a means of trying to establish "cover").

Sometimes, existing forum accounts are used by giving the new person a pre-existing account name and password. This gets tricky, as people can often exhibit a strange and innate subconscious ability to detect differences in writing style (whether this is "ESP" or simply "intuition" is hard to say, but it does exist). Those that do this, usually keep their posts as short as possible... The less said the better.

The targets are not always open forums, but often news sites (like newspapers' online sites, or news orgs' online sites like "CNN"), that have popular "Comment" areas under the day's articles.

The intent is not always direct, but sometimes more subtle, in that the threads are often attempted to be "shaped" and "guided" by a team working together in certain directions first for a while as a "set-up" for some specific reason that later comes out. Not only that, but there is frequent use of something called

"REVERSE BIAS"

which means that the shill will often start out new on the site, posting in favor of the thing they are actually against. This can work two ways: "One", as setting a "provenance" and "bona fides" for the shill, and "Two" as a means of subtly dis'ing a subject by pretending to be for it. Often in the first case, the person will later "change sides"... LOL as a means of saying: "Gee, i was convinced by the wonderful arguments on the other side that i was completely wrong before! Thanks for saving me from my own stupidity!"

And YES, i did tell them to got to hell

Lawyers who are out of work or currently "under-employed", are often tapped for this work... Either as free lancers or contracted through their Firm. Lol i guess the idea is that they are better than average at Debate (since this is actually taught in Law School).... But the truth is, very few of these people no mater where they come from, are any good at all When it comes down to it, they usually "suck" and their main strategy is to often use ad hominem personal attacks and threat of derision. In fact this is a main indicator to watch for... Not that many adults will stoop to these tactics unless first provoked. But some will who are not shills lol, so it is only ONE indicator and not "proof".

Shills can be effective on less intelligent people who are confused by more arcane arguments, by re-defining the argument into a more simple context, then once that is done they use straw-man arguments "proving" the new, simpler thrust that meets their goals... Basically it is a "bait and switch" game; and classic misdirection... Tarring all the subject by defining only one part of it.... Lol, sound familiar?

"Shilling" is not a new profession (lol if it can actually be called a profession, like "egg sucking" could ), but it has changed and grown greatly since the rise of the Internet.

I have read that the U.S. military uses actual military personnel to shill directly for them as well in at least some cases. But it would be hard to prove that one i imagine

But i've said this before, and will again prolly, lol:

The majority of people suspected of being "shills" or "dis-info artists" on these sites (which are the same thing imo), are probably not really. They are simply people who disagree with us So caution is suggested, and it is rarely wise to directly confront them (unless some good proofs exist first.. Which ARE possible to obtain).

Having said that, they certainly do exist and there are probably some reading this thread right now;) The fun part of it is, they are just "people", and are nothing to fear as they are just jerks without any personal honor sitting at their computers... And they certainly can be manipulated, the same way they try to do with others



The word 'troll' has a broad meaning....but the OP on the first page made it clear they were talking about 'agents'.


We're really talking about PSYOPS or PSYWAR.....


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychological_warfare


Psychological warfare (PSYWAR), or the basic aspects of modern psychological operations (PSYOP), have been known by many other names or terms, including Psy Ops, Political Warfare, “Hearts and Minds”, and Propaganda.[1] Various techniques are used, by any set of groups, and aimed to influence a target audience's value systems, belief systems, emotions, motives, reasoning, or behavior. It is used to induce confessions or reinforce attitudes and behaviors favorable to the originator's objectives, and are sometimes combined with black operations or false flag tactics. Target audiences can be governments, organizations, groups, and individuals.


they seek to persuade, change and influence


One way that genuine members can use the PSYOPS crew...is to notice what/who they are attacking, what they are steering genuine members towards (or away from) and also what they are largely ignoring ...if you have your psyops 'suspects'...or group of suspects, you can use them as a pointer as to what the status quo doesn't want aired...or what they want to fill your head with...


I know this can get into the realm of paranoia...lol...but I DO believe it is the reality of any forum dealing with sensitive info and/or conspiracies.


.

[jaybee]

jaybee that is why I started this thread

to show that trolls shills or whatever are here

thank you.



you're very welcome.....:wave:


I have been interested in this subject for a while now...ever since I joined (another)

forum back in 2007. One of my first posts was a bit of a far-out theory about gravity and I was taken by surprise when my post was pounced on and the idea (and myself) was attacked...in a ruthless way. I was...woah...what's going on here?

I have since observed (in that forum) that when a 'genuine' new member appears that wants to explore deeper stuff...or get into the psyops target areas...they are given 'the treatment'....and that new member has to toughen up if they want to stick around. Many don't and just slip away. Or some can't be bothered with the aggravation.


well done for starting this thread...hopefully it will be useful for genuine members...

cheers

.

[Rocky_Shorz]

the first time I joined a forum was because what I was reading was infuriating...

I pulled on the pointy toed boots and jumped right into the center...

at this point, why would a psyop be used at a forum like Avalon?


they attempted to take Avalon, because it is special, but have given up knowing as long as there is Bill Ryan seeking truths, Avalon will be here with him...


many people communicate at the top of their voice, not knowing to others it seems like yelling...

so most trolls are just being themselves and haven't learned differently. What's funny is when they meet another and another...

then we just quietly close the door and leave them talking together, they don't even notice we are gone...

[danceblackcatdance]

You might as well ask why they would be all over a site like YouTube... And it's pretty obvious that they are, crudely and blatantly trying to sway opinion.... Hearts and minds !

[music]

The term troll is not the appropriate term here. A troll is someone with low self esteem who gets off on causing a reaction. It is a way for those who feel powerless to feel powerful. Annoying, and we have all no doubt phrased something in such a way that others think we are trolls, but c'est la vie.

The point here is people who work an agenda on forums, and I think it was Fred who was spot on when he said that they seek to derail growing awareness (empowerment). If we all realised our true natures, the fear-based consensual reality would be no more. Think about it.

The other agenda being worked is to introduce NWO friendly concepts, and to normalise them. They appeal mostly to the intellect (hence ego), and this is the area where most of us are weakest. They work in teams, engage in tag-team bullying, and divert, bump or bury threads as their agenda dictates. They seem to be on-line 24/7, because after all, it is their job.

Self-empowerment, awareness, connection to higher consciousness, connection to bodily and supra-bodily energetics - these are really the only things that cause the NWO agenda to falter, and that is why certain agencies or agents bother disrupting things. The more they can stop us from discussing the real "meat and potatoes" of the issue, the stronger the paradigm of their masters gets.

I feel sorry for them too. They are tools being used, and once they have been used, they will be discarded. There will be no place for them in the NWO, but I take no joy imagining their pain at their forthcoming betrayal.

[Rocky_Shorz]

You might as well ask why they would be all over a site like YouTube... And it's pretty obvious that they are, crudely and blatantly trying to sway opinion.... Hearts and minds !

the only trolls here and in the alternate media right now are republican plants, an offshoot of Fox news propaganda machine...

you will see in every post they stop one sentence short of calling for a lynch mob...

they come up with good spins, but all discredited knowing the source.

their method works, look how many Birthers they had spinning all the way to the top... ;)

[gigha]

I started this thread mainly for the thanks button

I thought it would be interesting to see who thanked certain posts.

So far so good.

[778 neighbour of some guy]

I started this thread mainly for the thanks button

I thought it would be interesting to see who thanked certain posts.

So far so good.

HUH???? I dont have the slightest clue what that could all mean or even what you are trying to figure out, what does the thanks a post gets from whom has to do with agreeing or disagreeing with the post?? For instance, it could mean thank you for your post i do not agree or dissagree but your effort to respond is apriciated, thank you for taking the time, it can mean a zillion other things too.

[Cartomancer]

I get trolled a lot on my blog and youtube channel. I'd say its about 50/50 between those with an agenda and those that simply like to insult and degrade others. I think a lot of points of view and older institutions like religions are taking as much of a beating as the NWO, Masons, and others becasue of the ready information platform of the internet. Its kind of like when the printing press was invented.

[Snoweagle]

There are trolls here at Project Avalon.
How do you spot them? You can't (or it's not easy especially if your guard is down)
This is the problem with the practice of trolling. It is used to great effect by marketing techniques to persuade and dissuade peoples views and opinions on the subject matter being considered.
Unlike Youtube where comments through lack of moderation can be seen for what they are; insensitive, crass and derogatory, and is accepted by the YT community as "normal", "funny" and tolerated as the way "it is", easily ignored. I certainly don't bother with reading them as they are generally irrelevant to my purpose there.
But here, changing the opinion of thousands of Avalon readers is different, even with the excellent moderation, tempers do fray with occasional insults being reprimanded and warnings issued.

As the heavily sponsored Government NGOs, secular groups and anyone with an alternative agenda infiltrate these open house forums they have to be cute so as NOT to drive people away from the forum BUT to change your opinion with cleverly orchestrated differing opinions. They seldom work alone and they will become your friends.
Yes you will believe them because more often than not those that succumb, do not research the truth about a given topic.

Here within Avalon there are respected participants with thousands of "Thanks" and "Posts" who win hearts and minds by supporting the safe subjects and portraying themselves as supportive to the "little guy". Once they have won the apparent trust of many they will "STEER" individuals from their established belief system into a new paradigm of thought, creating confusion and swaying opinion from an accepted "NORM".

There is no easy way to spot them so don't worry about it. If you want to see how it works, you can do your own investigation here at Avalon. There are a couple of methods I use.
First, which I do not favour, is click on the persons name and trace back through previous posts posted by that individual. Means a lot of reading and quite frankly will bore the "tits of ya" and totally unnecessary.
Secondly, which I do regularly, if comments made by an individual appear contentious to you, then go into the Avalon database and find all relevant topics relating to the topic you are currently discussing and quickly review the "PAST" comments made previously. Now you are armed with relevant research material and you can either go elsewhere to validate your point of view and return and impress us all or simply have confirmed your opinion by simple reference to the the previous thread already posted within the database.

Remember, trolls are disinformationalists, misinformationalists and debunkers. DO NOT confuse with people who are simply mistaken. Protect and guide those weak of knowledge. Steer them to "GOOD" reference material.
Trolls work as teams. Trolls may appear as "enemies" yet will join forces to sway opinion. It becomes very difficult to "spot" them.

There is only one way to spot a troll, do your own research.

The CIA database for terrorists is called al-Qaeda. The Avalon database should be called al-Billda. Check in the Avalon database earlier threads and see for yourself how certain "players" interact with each other with comments, thanks and posts. Remarkably insightful.

[music]

I started this thread mainly for the thanks button

I thought it would be interesting to see who thanked certain posts.

So far so good.

The thanks button realistically has no point. It is prey to personailty judgement, agents know how to thank and not to thank to allay suspicion, many people can't be bothered, and many over thank because many thanks given in their stats may convey the idea that they are good people. Good thread though :)

[goinghome2012]

the troll is within all of us, since we are all one of this universe. All of us are trolling back home. The troll or shill is a blessing because they teach one of us how to love each other unconditionally and accept all that is.

peace and blessings