Attention -- All US citizens living abroad -- MUST READ

[Bill Ryan]

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Hi, All: please read this in its entirety. Even if you're not a US citizen living abroad, this hard-hitting, straight-talking piece will inform you more than most other financial or current affairs blogs. As I understand it, this is not [yet] on the net.

The author's website is http://panamalaw.org (http://www.panamalaw.org/). He states that he stands for personal sovereignty and sovereign financial management, and has posted a number of articles on those subjects.

Fasten your seat belts, and maybe read this three or four times. It's long, and is posted in full. In my opinion, this is important for just about everyone to understand. I also believe that the scenario the author paints is absolutely not impossible.






Special Alert - Second Citizenships and Passports

Background

I do not expect this to go up on the website. If you want anyone to have it, forward it to them. There has been a flurry of activity relating to Second Citizenships and Second Passports lately as a result of the bill allowing the IRS to cancel passports of those owing more than $50,000 to the IRS. People are scared. A lot of questions have been popping up, so we thought we would clear the air.

Has the IRS Canceling Passports Become Law Yet?

No, it has not. The Senate passed the bill by a wide margin, but the House has not voted on it. The expectation is the House will pass the bill. Then the Senate and House reconcile their versions of the bill. This can take a month as an educated guess. Then the bill goes back to both houses who approve it. Then it goes to Obama, who will most likely sign it quickly... figure a week or less. The bill can go into effect immediately, in a month or in six months. I am expecting it to go into effect rather fast... my thinking is 30 days.

How fast the IRS can get a list of passports to cancel together is a bit of a mystery. My thinking is within 30 days they will generate a list. Remember this is not really about canceling passports, it is about raising revenue. The theme is – "Oh Mister Tax Collector, please let me keep my Passport ... I will make payments." That is why they are doing it, and that is why they will move fast. They are broke.

Not having a passport will play havoc with those banking offshore. They will not be able to present their passports to the bank if needed, or send notarized apostilled scans if they need to. Opening new offshore accounts without a passport is completely over. This too helps them raise revenue. They cannot get offshore accounts. If they force those in debt to bank in the USA where a bank account can be opened with a driver license, then they can lien or levy the bank account.

People Living Overseas

Most have no concept of this. There are Americans living overseas with second citizenships and passports. This new law will leave them unaffected even if the IRS has their passports cancelled, they just transition to their other passports if they have not already done so which most have.

Now those with just residencies living overseas are going to be severely affected. Their residencies come without passports and are tied to their USA passport. If they lose their passport a condition of their residency has thus changed, and it can cause their residency to be cancelled. Expect this to happen. Of course the other country finding out about the cancellation can take some time, years even. It can also come about very fast if the USA so notifies the country of their residence.

The USA doing notifications is not something I expect to see, but it could happen. Bottom line is no passport, then no residency. A condition of the residency is a passport. The USA is going to be kind enough to allow these people to return home. I expect the drill will be go to an embassy and pick up a travel document allowing travel one time back to the USA.

What about their cars and personal property? Well, if they take this back it can be seized by your friendly tax police. So they will be forced to sell all. Great, now where do they put the money? In a bank when they no longer have the passport to operate the bank account if challenged.

See how thick this really is, and much of this is aimed at the 10 million or so folks living overseas. It is all about raising revenue, blood from a stone syndrome. Give the people little benefits, and tax them into dirt.

Are Second Passports and Second Citizenships Legal for Americans ?

Yes, at this time. We expect that as a result of this IRS canceling passports law (if it in fact becomes law) the fed will do something to control Americans getting other passports. What is a good question. They will probably require permission to get a second passport from the USA. This would require no debt to the IRS, probably no student loan debt and no possibility of being drafted (over 35). Then they would want to see a reason why you need such a passport.

Bottom line – forget second passports if it requires their permission. Countries granting second citizenships and passports may then require the permission in writing from the USA before granting the citizenship. It will get ugly.

Will the USA Make Second Passports Illegal ?

I doubt this. I am guessing there are more than 20 million people who have US passports and second passports. Remember green card holders can have a USA passport. They also have the passport from their home country.

Then there are people who married citizens of other countries that have USA passports and also their home country passports. There are Russians, Mexicans, Romanians, Pakistanis, Afghanis, Iranians, Canadians, Latin Americans, Panamanians, Europeans, Philippines, and so forth. Making it illegal to hold a second passport will create havoc in the US.

Anything they do will grandfather in those already having second passports and citizenships. It is the granting of new ones that they will stop and that is different than making it illegal to hold one.

They just state that now you need to file an application to get a second passport and then they basically will not approve your application unless you are connected. Do not comply and get a second citizenship without permission and it would be a felony. It is like this in India now.

If the IRS Canceling Passport Bills Passes, What Will be the Impact?

I think the cost of a second citizenship will soar in days. My thinking is that a good passport that allows for visa-free travel to Europe and a lot of countries (100 countries is good) is going to be $300,000 or more. These countries do not care about you. They see this as an economic opportunity. Some countries will say what the heck... Austria gets $1,000,000 for a second citizenship, and we can do the same. They would rather have one guy for a million, than twenty for less.

In a few months, the USA will put pressure on countries offering such citizenships for money. Will become hard for Americans to become citizens elsewhere just like getting offshore banks accounts. Not impossible... just hard and costly.

What if the Federal Government Fails?

This is a possibility. People hate them. They are a mess financially. There could be dirty bombs in the capital etc. Well then, the country is not a country if the government fails.

Your USA passport is no longer a passport if the federal government is gone. You have to get a UN or Red Cross travel document. The Red Cross document is what they gave the Jews who left Hitler's camps at end of WWII. Good to go just about nowhere with unless you get a visa. Be scared, best thing for you.

Offshore Banking

By 2013 it is going to be tough, not impossible, to get offshore bank accounts without a second passport.

Right now it is almost impossible to have a stock or forex account offshore with only a USA passport.

Can You Leave the USA on a Foreign Passport?

The answer to this is that you can do so if you entered the USA using this foreign passport.

It is not allowable to enter or exit the USA on a passport other than your American passport, if you are American. You will not be allowed to exit the USA with your second passport, sine it would have no entry stamps, since you would not be able to enter on it. So the answer is if you are an American you will not be able to leave on a non-Mmerican passport. Now you know why Bush required you to have a passport to leave the USA.

So When it Starts to Get Crazy There, How Do You Leave?

Well, the idea is to leave before. Think about it. If it gets bad, and it will get bad any day now, the ports and airports will be closed. The banks will be closed too, so forget wiring out your money or pulling out cash.

Even if the banks are open, there will be a run on cash and the banks will limit cash out to probably one or two thousand a day. Maybe if you are merchant known to them it will be higher. Your best bet is to head for Mexico by car, bus, bicycle or foot. I am being serious.

Mexico will close their borders like they did during 9/11. What you need to do is get a Mexico Residency in your second passport. This is how we do it. Then you can at least get into Mexico. You stand at the border and wave your full page Mexico Residency complete with picture and bar code at the soldiers and scream “Residente”.

They will inspect your passport and let you in since it would be against their law for them to not let you in. Your are a resident on a five or ten year residency, you should not go after a tourist visa which is of little value.

Ok, so now you can breathe a little easier. You can head to the airport, bus station or car rental agency and make your way through Mexico. Guatemala is the country directly underneath Mexico.

If you are a permanent resident or citizen of Guatemala you can enter Guatemala and then watch it on CNN with a cold drink in your hand.

Please note getting to Guatemala is not that hard compared to other jurisdictions. If your money is in a nice billion dollar bank in Guatemala you can get to your funds easy enough. If you bank in the Caribbean, Europe, or Asia, you'd better be a strong swimmer.

Visa-Free Travel When the Eggs Start to Hit the Fan

Forget visa-free travel as an American to many countries. They are going to wonder how the heck they will get rid of you when the banks are closing, the dollar crashing, the markets collapsing, and things are failing. They are going to say apply for a visa and they are not going to be handing them out easily. When the banks are closed and your credit cards are not working, you are going to join the ranks of their homeless.

How Will You Access Your Money Offshore?

If you are banking in the USA you have nothing to worry about. What money and what banks is the answer. If you are offshore and you survive the Obama passport confiscation the question is how are you going to get to Hong Kong, Europe, and so forth. Remember visa-free travel is gone for Americans.

How many people will get a second passport enabling them to go to Europe and Asia visa-free, get a Mexican residency and make their way into Mexico and board a flight to Europe or Asia? The answer is very few, almost none.

Don't play the "I hope" game, hoping Obama does not get elected and a hero comes along to save the day. This is not going to happen.

You're not going to have your funds wired into your closed bank in the USA. Want it converted into US dollars at that time? By the way, plan on no internet when the eggs start hitting the fan. So much for online banking.

Ok, so you can use a fax, well if the phones are open for international calling. Great: you got a fax off, now where do you have the money sent? Granted if you have a Visa or Mastercard, you may be sort of able to get by in other countries but when the banks in the USA go, the ATMs run out of money and do not get filled up anymore.

Most will get yanked out with chains on pickups and robbed. Stores will not be processing credit cards, banks closed remember. Forget checks. Some of you will have 90% silver coins, other silver coins and gold. You will be able to barter at any rate.

Those With Allocated Gold in Europe

I suggest you go to the YMCA and get a lot of swimming lessons. Maybe get a 60 foot boat and learn a whole lot about sailing across oceans.

Why am I so down on this? Remember, when you opened your account they said you can sell your gold and have it wired ONLY into the bank account that you used to send the money in to buy the gold.

So what bank was that? Is it still open? Where is it? Without internet, how do you contact the gold storage facility securely so they know it is you? The answer is you have to get into Mexico and then fly to Europe. You need a passport allowing for visa-free travel to Europe. You need a working credit card, cash etc. Your gold account is also tied to your USA passport. Keep reading.

Cooperation Level of Banks and Gold Storage Facilities

The closest thing to this is the Swiss banks keeping the money, gold and valuables of the jews that Hitler killed. They fared quite well. Banks are not the nicest people are they? They will see the turmoil in the USA and most will decide to become very difficult to deal with. I think if you present at the bank in person with ID you will have your money and your gold, but that is probably the only way.

There are going to be many people who are going to be unable to do this and may not be alive as well. These banks will hit a dishonest home run. The Swiss were not reputable and that is considered a reputable bank jurisdiction with a reputable legal system. Imagine some of these small countries. That is one reason why we favor Guatemala banks.

Where Does Gold and Silver Confiscation Fit In?

Well, we are looking through a dark glass trying to predict what the Kenyan POTUS will do. I expect if they are contemplating canceling passports for IRS bills, they will for sure go to a Roosevelt style Gold Confiscation Buyback. Somehow I see the two are tied together, time will tell.

With his executive order granting him dictatorial powers, he can just declare the gold and silver to be the property of the USA government without a buyback. When Hitler checked out of Dodge he took a submarine filled with gold, jewels and art. Obama could do the same.

I am serious here. Then an order goes to all the storage facilities in places submitted to the USA. Australia, Switzerland, Lichtenstein, Luxembourg, London, Singapore and Austria amongst others. The request says all the gold and silver belonging to any account holder who presented an American Passport on account opening has now been declared by the POTUS to be the property of the crown - whoops, I mean the USA.

The state department and the military will then pick up what used to be your gold and silver and bring it back to the USA, perhaps get it ready for Obama's submarine, who knows. Possession of gold and silver in the USA will be illegal with horrible sentences and considered to be a crime threatening national security. Thus you can be detained without courts, judge, jury, lawyer etc. You would be guilty of undermining the money supply and the economy.

Is this All Doom and Gloom?

Well, what good has Obama ever done? Has it continually gotten worse? Any sign of relief in sight? Now with the votes being collected by this Spanish Company and counted offshore, out of America, by non-Americans, are you seriously thinking Obama will not be the next POTUS? Come on, you have to be kidding.

I know it is painful, but you have to deal with this before he deals with you. I hear rumors of things getting better but there is never anything but internet rumors. Wars are on the rise. Military actions are on the rise. Putting people in jail for victimless crimes is on the rise. Unemployment is on the rise. Government employment is on the rise. Government ammunition purchases are on the rise. Bankruptcy is on the rise. Homelessness is on the rise. Bankruptcy is on the rise. Lack of trust of the government is on the rise.

Is anything going down? Sure - the value of the dollar.

Conclusion

When a government in an awful economy starts talking about canceling passports of people who owe taxes, critical mass has been reached. The Senate passed the passport cancelation 74 to 22.

Scary. The government should be suspending tax debts until the economy levels out, not doing what they are doing. It will start with passports, and then progress to debtor's prison. Then they can farm out your menial labor to make a buck off of you. This way they can compete with China on labor costs.

The window to leave is closing, and fairly quickly. It is no longer enough to just have a bank account offshore, it is time for you to go too. You are not going to be able to do your loved ones any good getting trapped there with them, are you? At least if you get set up offshore, there is some hope of helping to resettle them.

If anyone wishes to contact us to discuss options, feel free. We do have options for second citizenships, residencies and offshore banking. Best is to call or Skype us.

I sincerely hope this got you worried, best thing for you.

http://panamanalaw.org (http://www.panamalaw.org/)

[Christine]

Thanks and a big heads up! I know this organization and have spoken with the owner, it is his business to get Guatemalan passports for people but that does not dismiss what he is saying.

This article is right on the money and scary! I wonder just how close to the bone it needs to get before folks will react. It won't be possible for most Americans to get second passports. People need to prepare now.

[cloud9]

I just saw an inconsistency, they say that residents in the US have passports which is not true, you have to be a citizen in order to have a passport.

This is really scary... in my country we used to say something like this: Are you feeling the steps of a big animal?

Now, the question is: what do we need to do to stop such insanity? Obviously all insanity.

By the way, how can they be broke when they print the money? I really don't understand it. Is paper getting scarce? Perhaps ink is getting too expensive? Sorry, I couldn't help it but it really is a valid question.

[WhiteFeather]

Your thoughts here Bill. Since you posted this.

Q. If you were an American Citizen living here in America and you didnt owe any back taxes would you still be looking to high tail it out of here still? I value your opinion. Anyways It looks Grim to say the least.

[Belle]

I knew I had read an article about this a while ago...

The article is dated April 1, 2012 and can be found at http://modernsurvivalblog.com/current-events-economics-politics/new-irs-powers-to-revoke-citizen-passports/


In yet another slash at American liberty, the Senate has passed a bill giving the power to the IRS and the State Department to revoke a US citizen’s passport if it is believed (not proven) that the taxpayer owes more than $50,000 in back taxes.

Bill S. 1813 might as well be named the Passport Confiscation Bill instead of the bill’s current lengthy title “To reauthorize Federal-aid highway and highway safety construction programs, and for other purposes” also know as the “Moving Ahead for Progress in the 21st Century Act” or even shorter, “MAP-21″. (Moving ahead for progress? Progress for who?)

Tax Amendments to the Senate-Passed Highway Trust Fund Bill will essentially make border guards of IRS tax collectors as Harry Reid has apparently snuck in the sinister provision allowing denial or revocation of existing passports according to a report from the organization, ‘American Citizens Abroad’ of Geneva Switzerland.

A US citizen generally has the right to have a passport and to travel freely. It’s not clear that the inability to pay his tax bills can be used to deny him this right.
While on the surface it may appear as though the government is scrapping to find new means of collecting revenue, maybe they are planning ahead to prevent an exodus? Surely there must be constitutional issues here… Oh that’s right… what Constitution?

While we certainly do not endorse the non-payment of legally required taxes, we continue to look skeptically at actions taken which apparently undermine the U.S. constitution and the rights granted within. Thought you would like to know…

[Bill Ryan]

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A footnote (after some more intensive reading :) ):

The owner of Panama Law is Ken Biderman (aka Ken Goldman, who often also calls himself "Manny Rodriguez"). A little clever Googling will take one on an astonishing journey of intrigue, accusation, and counter-accusation -- serious stuff, too.

I am not recommending contacting this organization. I just wanted you to read the hard-hitting information.... because some of it really rings true. I welcome all discussion: not about the author of the article, but about the forecast he presents.

[Belle]

Thanks, Bill. The author's name in the article I posted is Ken with no last name...same person?

[Bill Ryan]

Your thoughts here Bill. Since you posted this.

Q. If you were an American Citizen living here in America and you didn't owe any back taxes would you still be looking to high tail it out of here still? I value your opinion.

Yes, I would.

[Bill Ryan]

Thanks, Bill. The author's name in the article I posted is Ken with no last name...same person?

More intensive reading.... impossible to tell. The style is not quite the same. The article (or extracts from it) is not one of the many on panamalaw.org (http://panamalaw.org).

The standalone quote...




A US citizen generally has the right to have a passport and to travel freely. It’s not clear that the inability to pay his tax bills can be used to deny him this right....is from Charles M. Bruce, a partner at Moore & Bruce LLP (Washington, D.C.) and counsel at Bonnard Lawson (Lausanne, Switzerland).

(source: http://renounceuscitizenship.wordpress.com/2012/03/21/no-u-s-tax-compliance-no-u-s-passport-increased-demand-for-a-second-passport )

[we-R-one]

Well I can tell you from my own personal experience, getting citizenship in another country has been a long and slow process. I've been working on this for over 9 months now and I fear I might not be able to make the cut in time due to all the red tape. And since money in most countries is the issue, I imagine the consulates are operating with less than half staff at least that's the situation with the consulate I'm working with. The rate I'm going, I could be a year plus out, making my attempt anything but successful. Not giving up though! For the record, I'm not running...I just wanted my dual citizenship as it's my blood right and can open opportunities up that I originally might not have had.

[bearcow]

I really think this law is more about keeping money within the borders rather than people within the borders.

Obama has been against US citizens having offshore accounts from day one.


The Senate has passed a bill giving the power to the IRS and the State Department to revoke a US citizen’s passport if it is believed (not proven) that the taxpayer owes more than $50,000 in back taxes.

If you owe more than $50,000 it becomes a better numbers game for the IRS. The more financially lucrative the reward, the more the IRS will be willing to exert pressure on you.

Current tax law is set up this way.

[sygh]

Thanks, Bill. Many of us aren't going anywhere; we simply cannot afford to. I owe school loans. Soon, we shall see how it all plays out. I'm glad you are in a better place, and I hope you are relatively pleased to be there.

Robin

ONe thing I will add, the mouse trap has been slow to fall.

[Belle]

Since this is an amendment to a bill (s1813), I'm assuming Senator Harry Reid was trying to sneak one by the people. Amendments are added to bills all the time that have nothing to do with the original bill itself.

Awareness and getting the word out far and wide may be the best thing we can do at the moment.

It has yet to pass the house.

[Maia Gabrial]

What I'm seeing is this wobbly tower called the US govt, teetering dangerously back and forth..... back and forth.....
What will it take, folks, for it to finally come crashing down?
Will it be this? Or just one more bad decision?
:tsk:

[Erich]

Thank you for sending this along. I'd like to point out that the article does not discuss one of the key points: 50,000 dollars. The details related to how the IRS calculates what you owe them as well as the rules regarding how to pay them are very important.

[Bill Ryan]

Thanks, Bill. Many of us aren't going anywhere; we simply cannot afford to. I owe school loans. Soon, we shall see how it all plays out. I'm glad you are in a better place, and I hope you are relatively pleased to be there.

Robin

One thing I will add, the mouse trap has been slow to fall.

All understood. Yes... but I suspect that the mousetrap is starting to accelerate a little! George Green (http://projectcamelot.org/george_green.html), whom I now know quite well, has been talking about leaving the US for many years... and is now finally making his move.

I'm not advocating anyone doing anything illegal. Each person must make their own decisions based on their own conscience, and their own unique circumstances. But regarding cost of living, there are a number of countries in Central and South America where one can live for between a third to a half the cost of that in the US.

In Ecuador, for instance, diesel is government-subsidized at $1.07 per US gallon in every gas station in the country; fruit and veg is ridiculously cheap if one shops in the local markets; and one can rent a modest apartment for way less than $500 per month. I have raw milk delivered to my door, and when I went to see a movie last week (in a comfortable, American-style theater, with all mod cons) it cost me $4.80.

In fact, I know several people who live on about $500 per month, total... including their internet and cellphone coverage. For $2,000 a month, one can live fairly affluently, eat really well, run a vehicle, and travel extensively within the country. You absolutely cannot do that anywhere in the US.

[Belle]

Thank you for sending this along. I'd like to point out that the article does not discuss one of the key points: 50,000 dollars. The details related to how the IRS calculates what you owe them as well as the rules regarding how to pay them are very important.

You can find info on the bill and its status here: http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/112/s1813

Further reading....

http://www.truthistreason.net/senate-bill-1813-owe-taxes-your-passport-and-travel-is-denied

A list of the many amendments proposed...most say "Purpose will be available when the amendment is proposed for consideration. See Congressional Record for text. http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/L?d112:./temp/~bdamwKJ:1[1-317](Amendments_For_S.1813)&./temp/~bdIq9X

Black boxes for all cars by 2015...http://forums.joeuser.com/422868 sourced here: http://www.economicpolicyjournal.com/2012/04/big-government-on-steroids-senate-bill.html

[ThePythonicCow]

I too am staying here in the USA.

I see no option, by the analysis in the opening post, for preserving wealth, outside of physical possessions (homes, cars, tools, food, liquor, toilet paper, tobacco, ...) owned free and clear and tax paid, for those of us who have decided to ride out the storm in the USA.

I hope this analysis is wrong on that account.

It does drive home the need to presume that one's ability to use the banking system, to travel, and to transfer or access remote funds or valuables is likely coming to an end, and that no one will provide a reliable warning as to when this game of musical chairs ends, and we're left, at best, with what is at hand, in whatever place we are.

[ThePythonicCow]

For $2,000 a month, one can live fairly affluently, eat really well, run a vehicle, and travel extensively within the country. You absolutely cannot do that anywhere in the US.
My experience is that costs of living vary widely in the US, and that one can live just fine, for that kind of money, in some places.

[Lazlo]

If a person lived in a major metropolitan area, had no family, no land ties, and no skills... I could see the lure of going ex-pat. However, there are still places in the USA where knowledge, community, and resourcefulness will make it much better to be than than living as a stranger in a strange land.

Tell me this, how safe would you be in some central american country after economic armageddon and the whole rest of the world blames the USA? You would likely fear for your life and find yourself a target in some makeshift compound with fellow expats while the locals looked to get their own little bit of revenge against the evil empire.

I'm not going anywhere.

ETA: I agree with Paul that $2000 a month still goes a long way in many places. I bought a small piece of land and built an off the grid cabin, free and clear with no loans, while earning less than this in a beautiful western prairie with good soil, good neighbors, great fishing, better hunting, clean air, sweet water, and views of three mountain ranges.

[Bill Ryan]

For $2,000 a month, one can live fairly affluently, eat really well, run a vehicle, and travel extensively within the country. You absolutely cannot do that anywhere in the US.
My experience is that costs of living vary widely in the US, and that one can live just fine, for that kind of money, in some places.

Until early 2011 I was spending much of my time in Switzerland -- where a movie ticket cost $20, a large Starbucks latte cost $8.60, a large pineapple cost $8, and gas was $7 per US gallon.

[norman]

I understand the urge to go "on the run", but as I see it, unless something fully takes down the crooks in charge, being on the run is going to be a long fox chase I don't want to be the 'fox' in.

Each to their own, and I fully respect each way ahead, and hope to be able to keep in touch and keep track, so we can all share the broader experience with each other. I don't expect internet chatting to be enough to do that for long.

[Christine]

Yes, I agree that you can make $2,000 stretch in the US though there is a difference living in Ecuador with that amount. Where you decide to live really comes down to your calling and not money. I am comfortable in Ecuador, but I speak the language and spent many years immersed in Mexico so it isn't such a strange land.

What I actually feel here and also felt it in Mexico before the US infiltrated is a sense of freedom. There are mountains of bureaucracy and a large un-wake population but something still exists here that has slowly been destroyed in the US. It is a reality that peeks through the contrived matrix, sorry I just don't know how to describe the difference. Life has been dampened and deadened in the US, I know not every where, but the shadow is present and palpable.

Leaving home and family can be a courageous act, I have met some dedicated amazing ex-pats who I admire greatly. To many in my acquaintance it isn't about protecting financial assets but protecting life and freedom. The front line is where ever you are.

La Tigra

[Erich]

Thank you for sending this along. I'd like to point out that the article does not discuss one of the key points: 50,000 dollars. The details related to how the IRS calculates what you owe them as well as the rules regarding how to pay them are very important.

You can find info on the bill and its status here: http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/112/s1813

Further reading....

http://www.truthistreason.net/senate-bill-1813-owe-taxes-your-passport-and-travel-is-denied

A list of the many amendments proposed...most say "Purpose will be available when the amendment is proposed for consideration. See Congressional Record for text. http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/L?d112:./temp/~bdamwKJ:1[1-317](Amendments_For_S.1813)&./temp/~bdIq9X

Black boxes for all cars by 2015...http://forums.joeuser.com/422868 sourced here: http://www.economicpolicyjournal.com/2012/04/big-government-on-steroids-senate-bill.html

Is that 50,000 including fines and/or penalties? Will they offer you a chance to pay it back? What about payments based on your income? What are the terms of the payment plan, if any?Are they going to pay for your plane ticket back to the states if you don't have any money?

[AnthonyBacala]

The rich are already doing this.

More of the Super Wealthy Defect From the USSA

http://shiftfrequency.com/more-of-the-super-wealthy-defect-from-the-ussa/

Denise Rich, the wealthy socialite and former wife of pardoned billionaire trader Marc Rich, has defected from the US and given up her US citizenship.  Rich, 68, a Grammy-nominated songwriter, renounced her American citizenship in November, according to her lawyer.  Her maiden name, Denise Eisenberg, appeared in the Federal Register on April 30 in a quarterly list of Americans who renounced their US passport.

She is better known for her former husband’s indiscretions. Marc Rich got caught doing something the US Government didn’t like; trading in oil from Iran a few decades ago – yes, this Iran nonsense has been going on that long.  For not adhering to the rules of his overseers he was on the Federal Bureau of Investigation’s Ten Most Wanted Fugitives List for many years.

It was only when Denise Rich gave a number of bribes to murderer and thief, Bill Clinton, that her husband was granted a pardon.  Smartly, after being deemed a rogue criminal, Marc Rich defected from the US in 1991, although he did not do it correctly under the rules of the US and falsely believed that he had relinquished his United States’ citizenship when he became a citizen of Spain.  But, an appeals court ruled in 1991 that for purposes of US law Rich remains a citizen and therefore is still subject to US income tax theft. In order to officially renounce US citizenship and legally avoid future theft from the IRS, a citizen must appear in person before a US consular or “diplomatic officer” outside the US and “sign an oath of renunciation” (note: last month we told TDV Subscribers which US consulate has the fastest renunciation process… less than 2 months).  Smartly, today he also holds Belgian, Israeli and Spanish passports so as to not find himself in the same predicament he did in the early 1990s when he only held one slave card (passport).

Hypocritical

Some particularly brainwashed slaves think that anyone leaving their tax farms is some sort of turncoat.  And, when expatriates leave with a large amount of money, many slaves pull out their knives and reveal their bloody fangs and call for that person to be murdered or robbed of his wealth because it is our wealth, as they did with Eduardo Saverin of Facebook who actually whipped Charles Schumer into a frenzy and set off a chain of events that would result in him launching the Expatriation Prevention by Abolishing Tax-Related Incentives for Offshore Tenancy” Act (EXPATRIOT).

But, unlike Americans leaving because they disapprove of the political situation in the US, Denise Rich has been a longtime political contributor and activist for the Democratic party. If anyone is being hypocritical here, it is her.

A typical limousine liberal, she supports heavy taxes on the population, except for her.

Expatriating From The Us… Or Anywhere

The US is closing the doors on this sinking ship and you can really see how little time there is left when the really big rats start abandoning ship.  And, Denise Rich, a big time Democrat supporter, is one of the biggest rats.

If she has decided it’s too dangerous to her wealth and self to keep that little piece of paper called a US passport, with all of her connections, then what does that say for us little guys who can’t afford to buy our husband out of prison?

The Writing Is On The Wall

If you live in the US or any Western country and aren’t already making alternative arrangements then there isn’t much more we can say or do to open your eyes to the reality that we perceive.

In this month’s issue of TDV, the Director of TDV Passports, Ken Johnson, outlines a number of residency and citizenship opportunities in a South American country for our subscribers.  Not only have we negotiated, directly with the most high level political officials an expedited citizenship for our subscribers, but we have also come up with the first ever financed citizenship program where TDV itself will finance your immediate residency and help get you on track to a foreign citizenship in a country with no income tax and who doesn’t consider its citizens as milk and beef cows in less than four years.

For the coming few weeks we will also be announcing other similar programs in the Caribbean and Asia.

The Western governments are doing everything they can to keep you hemmed in to their tax farm.  TDV is doing everything it can to help get you out.

As W.G. Hill said, “Get your money out of the country, before your country gets the money out of you.”

[ghostrider]

my co=workers and myself , regularly get letters from the IRS, we make very little always have, within two weeks we all recieved letters saying we owed 5,000 dollars. We all get very angry because we don't make enough in wages to pay that much in taxes. funny the same amount passed to all of us. One day it's 2,000 a week later 3,500 now it's 5,000 . The IRS can make up any amount and say you owe it and there is nothing can be done , they never make mistakes ( in their view) . One digit pressed on a keyboard and boom your on the short list. It all makes sense now. Thanks Bill . FYI my co-workers had the same scenerio one letter one amount, another letter different amount, then the final letter 5,000 . WE were angry together, thats what they want anger the masses and impose martial law. How can someone making around 22,000 a year owe five grand in taxes ???? my co-worker makes less, and my boss about the same as me ... the IRS can do what they want and no one stops them they are feared in every circle here....This new law doesn't suprise me , they need a diversion for the re-election of president Potus ...remember we can't protest where a government offical speaks with secret service protection, and maybe the drones over the U.S. is part of the quick control of the angry mobs...may God be with us in our struggle....

[scarletfire]

MSM is covering tax returns of Mitt Romney (see link below). This mess along with Romney's nefarious offshore accounts seem like the makings of ammunition to use in the event all the birther drama comes to head. If this happens and Obama is taken off the ballot in key battleground states, what tools are available to fight back? The legislation described above may be one such tool. If Obama is taken out of contention for citizenship questions, is it a far stretch that Romney may also be taken out of contention via new legislation that imposes loss of citizenship privilege such as running for public office as penalty for failure to pay appropriate taxes on money stored offshore. Would it not be ironic for Obama to head toward the Caymans to pick up American property (Romney gold) to fill his submarine and head out... Hitler style. I realize that those in control have resources to cover a bill for back taxes, even if it's a tax bill of a billionaire such as Romney. The x-factor in this scenario is that events and gullibility of the public seems to be more difficult to predict by those pulling the strings.

http://abcnews.go.com/m/blogEntry?id=16782100

[InTheBackground]

What to choose: Flight? Or hunker down and brace for the coming storm?

Honestly, I see no choice in the matter for most of those of us who live in the U.S. Most simply do not have the funds or conversely the freedom of a mobile profession to even begin to consider leaving. Add families and loved ones into the mix, and . . . well . . .

And go where? Who's to say anywhere is safe? As for me, I think I'd rather be on familiar ground with a network of family and friends circled around me than to be a stranger in a strange land in an uncertain world, one that's getting more and more uncertain with each passing month.

Wealth is an illusion. Quality of life is important, but even that is subjective.

Just rambling here... :rolleyes:

[ThePythonicCow]

Confirmation of a sort comes for Bill's opening post from Jim Willie, CB's subscription newsletter The Hat Trick Letter (July 2012) (http://www.goldenjackass.com). Jim Willie writes:




The Obama Admin is credited with increasing the USDept Treasury agent staff by a 30-fold increase. They are fanning out across the world searching for ex-patriot bank accounts and gold purchase trails. They confiscate accounts, seize the funds, arrest the individuals, and place a large hole in the passports. Quite the benefit when burden of proof is on the citizen, since it is ignored. This is not progress toward a stable nation. It is Nazi in purity. At least five such cases involving friends of friends and colleagues have been passed on.

[Hip Hipnotist]

At this rate we, those of us in the good ole' (but not-so-benevolent) U.S. of A. won't even make it to Dec. 21, 2012! Or is that 'doomsday' for the rest of you, too?

Personally I'm (the cats, too) stickin' it out. I (and the cats -- four of them) got the biggest flat screen tv (what's left of my) money could buy (52"!) ((We haven't had a tv in over 5 years, by the way)) and plan on watching the 'take down' from high atop our Colorado mountain retreat -- at least until all communications go 'kaputt' and we find ourselves the stars in this 'realist' of reality shows. 'Cause lets face it good people if this, not to mention the plethora of other 'downers' does go 'down' and there's no E.T. intervention (if you're inclined to go that route) or higher consciousness raising above and beyond this 'earthly drama' I for one am likely goin' down with it. (The cats just put their heads down.) :(

On the other hand (the cats just perked up!) if the PTB decide to keep things pretty close to the status quo (we all know what that is -- more of the same s$%!) then we'll continue living day by day just as we do now doing our darnest to enjoy the sun rises and sun sets (when we can see them through the chemtrails) and all the other 'stuff' we still have until we don't have it any longer because the S$%! really did hit the fan. I mean the really big S$%! Not this day to day S$%! Which, by the way, me and the cats are thinkin' will continue until the cows come home. Unless there's no home for them to come home to and then me and the cats will be eating lots of egg of our faces. (Our own, not each others.)

This is only one man's (and four cats') opinion(s) on the (sad but true) insanity of it all that we (me and the cats) seem to be a (big) part of. Perhaps even contributing to. Yes, contributing to. (The cats -- not me.) :cool:

------------------------------------

POST SCRIPT: I've had a pretty good 62 years on this planet, made tons of mistakes, still do (the cats, not me), learned tons of lessons (me, not the cats) and helped others when I could. Still do, in fact. I'd surely like to live to see the 'massive shift in consciousness' that may just be the 'straw that breaks the PTB backs' and with a little help from my friends (that's putting it mildly) may just do so.

Can I get a witness!? ;)

[jookyle]

What I'm seeing is this wobbly tower called the US govt, teetering dangerously back and forth..... back and forth.....
What will it take, folks, for it to finally come crashing down?
Will it be this? Or just one more bad decision?
:tsk:


It won't crash down, it must be torn down.

[NancyV]

my co=workers and myself , regularly get letters from the IRS, we make very little always have, within two weeks we all recieved letters saying we owed 5,000 dollars. We all get very angry because we don't make enough in wages to pay that much in taxes. funny the same amount passed to all of us. One day it's 2,000 a week later 3,500 now it's 5,000 . The IRS can make up any amount and say you owe it and there is nothing can be done , they never make mistakes ( in their view) . One digit pressed on a keyboard and boom your on the short list. It all makes sense now. Thanks Bill . FYI my co-workers had the same scenerio one letter one amount, another letter different amount, then the final letter 5,000 . WE were angry together, thats what they want anger the masses and impose martial law. How can someone making around 22,000 a year owe five grand in taxes ???? my co-worker makes less, and my boss about the same as me ... the IRS can do what they want and no one stops them they are feared in every circle here....This new law doesn't suprise me , they need a diversion for the re-election of president Potus ...remember we can't protest where a government offical speaks with secret service protection, and maybe the drones over the U.S. is part of the quick control of the angry mobs...may God be with us in our struggle....
You might want to look into filing an Offer In Compromise. http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f656b.pdf
If you have a low income and owe back taxes this process lets you offer a lesser amount to the IRS to settle your debt. For example: about a year ago my daughter and her husband were having problems paying his back taxes which amounted to about $20,000. He had lost his job about a year earlier and they were living on her income which was around $23.000 a year. So I researched the Offer in Compromise Process on the Internet, filled out all the papers for them and offered the IRS $600 to settle the $20,000 back taxes. They accepted and the back taxes were eliminated. The monthly payment we offered was $50 a month and they also accepted that.

There are companies who will do this procedure for you but they charge around $1500-$2000. Since you can do it yourself with a little research and filling out a lot of papers, that's the way to go if you can't afford to pay someone. I have also done bankruptcies for a couple of friends. They're fairly easy to do on your own. If you don't have a lot of assets and only make $22,000 a year, chances are very good that you will be able to get rid of most of your back taxes.

I don't like to use lawyers so I usually do everything myself, including 2 of my divorces.

[Bill Ryan]

What I'm seeing is this wobbly tower called the US govt, teetering dangerously back and forth..... back and forth.....
What will it take, folks, for it to finally come crashing down?
Will it be this? Or just one more bad decision?
:tsk:


It won't crash down, it must be torn down.

It might be a controlled demolition.

[Marsila]

Well despite Panamalaw.org being a bit of a dodgy business, with quite a few 'immigration' and 'wealth management' lawyers websites putting it on their black lists, that article is true.

I dont know if Eduardo Saverin who was born Brazilian anyway, but gave up the US citizenship for the Singaporean one (a strict one citizenship only country) had to do with bringing this under the spot light.

A lot of countries give citizenship to rich people in such short times, and this has been happening for a long while...i remember since 2008 a lawyer who gets clients a Kittian passport within 2 weeks at times, saying that most clients, weren't wealthy Russian or Chinese people as thought...but wealthy Americans. (a lot of countries 'sell citizenship' St.kitts for $250-350 k, Dominica for $50,000, Austria for 1-5 million Euro, and so many countries around the world have laws that make citizenship exceptions for those who 'invest' a big deal of money in a place,....even the USA gives and instant green card to anyone who invest a million dollars in it)

If anything it looks like the rich and those controlling the US (a lot of those passing that tax law have another citizenship) had already gotten themselves and their families, a second a third and maybe even more than fourth passport, and now they want to stop the 'sheeple' from following that route....for if the normal American can also start traveling so easy and without obligation on another passport....then the question is where are these controllers going to run and hide from not the opposite, and where are they going to finance themselves from to?

This just reminded me that the Bushes had bought the part of Paraguay that has the Guarani Aquafier the worlds largest drinking water reservoir a few years ago, and stay in that country quite frequently since a few years...will this tax law apply to their likes to?

[Belle]

Thank you for sending this along. I'd like to point out that the article does not discuss one of the key points: 50,000 dollars. The details related to how the IRS calculates what you owe them as well as the rules regarding how to pay them are very important.

You can find info on the bill and its status here: http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/112/s1813

Further reading....

http://www.truthistreason.net/senate-bill-1813-owe-taxes-your-passport-and-travel-is-denied

A list of the many amendments proposed...most say "Purpose will be available when the amendment is proposed for consideration. See Congressional Record for text. http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/L?d112:./temp/~bdamwKJ:1[1-317](Amendments_For_S.1813)&./temp/~bdIq9X

Black boxes for all cars by 2015...http://forums.joeuser.com/422868 sourced here: http://www.economicpolicyjournal.com/2012/04/big-government-on-steroids-senate-bill.html

Is that 50,000 including fines and/or penalties? Will they offer you a chance to pay it back? What about payments based on your income? What are the terms of the payment plan, if any?Are they going to pay for your plane ticket back to the states if you don't have any money?

Those are the details that must be worked out if/when the bill passes the House of Representatives....when the House discusses passing a bill, they have their own take on things. A compromise between the Senate version and the House version will then have to be made.

Check NancyV's post #32 for good info as to options normally available from the IRS, exclusive of the amendment we've been discussing.

[doodah]

Bill, I've raised this question before, but I'd like to raise it again. The national currency of Ecuador is the US DOLLAR. When the dollar crashes here, it will crash there too, right? So what do Americans do who are living in Ecuador but basically still drawing their money from the US? That is, retirees who are having social security money transferred from the US to a bank in Ecuador, or people drawing off of money invested in the US, having funds transferred to a bank in Ecuador.

I'm getting this vision: You will have nothing. You will be in Ecuador, at whatever status you have (tourist, resident, worker(?), student), and then what? Suddenly you have no money or your US dollars have no value. All of Ecuador will be affected by something like this. And what will Ecuador do about the Americans living there who suddenly have no money?

I'm really curious how this might play out. Thanks! ~ Doodah

[Bill Ryan]

Bill, I've raised this question before, but I'd like to raise it again. The national currency of Ecuador is the US DOLLAR. When the dollar crashes here, it will crash there too, right? So what do Americans do who are living in Ecuador but basically still drawing their money from the US? That is, retirees who are having social security money transferred from the US to a bank in Ecuador, or people drawing off of money invested in the US, having funds transferred to a bank in Ecuador.

I'm getting this vision: You will have nothing. You will be in Ecuador, at whatever status you have (tourist, resident, worker(?), student), and then what? Suddenly you have no money or your US dollars have no value. All of Ecuador will be affected by something like this. And what will Ecuador do about the Americans living there who suddenly have no money?

I'm really curious how this might play out. Thanks! ~ Doodah

Really good question. The answer is that this is frequently discussed by aware expats in Ecuador, but no-one really knows. It's a legitimate concern.

George Green (http://projectcamelot.org/george_green.html) told us just a few weeks ago that there's a backup currency being prepared, called the El Faro -- possibly co-created by several South American countries. But this is not on any public record that I can see.

I'm no economist (really) -- but I can kind of play out the logic like this:

1) If Ecuador keeps 'their' dollar pegged 1:1 with the US dollar (and exactly the same dollar bills are used in both countries), and if the US dollar suddenly devalues -- which is the most likely scenario -- then American products will remain the same price as far as Ecuadorian importers are concerned.

2) But then inflation in the US economy -- which would inevitably and quickly ensue -- becomes the main issue. That would then infect Ecuador like a virus, as US imports start to escalate in price.

3) The other main source of goods for Ecuadorians are Chinese exports. If the dollar devalued, these Chinese imports would become more expensive. That really would affect everyday shoppers.

4) Ecuador exports would become cheaper to other countries -- because their dollar would be (e.g.) worth fewer euros, or pounds, or pesos. But that wouldn't make a great dent in the sudden imbalance.

My guess -- and it's really a pure guess, only supported by what George Green says -- is that the Ecuadorian government must be watching this like hawks, and it's just economic expediency and responsibility for them to be quietly making backup plans.

To insulate oneself against all this -- IF one is in a position to do so! -- the time-proven strategy of holding physical gold and silver remains the wisest plan. Metals may not make one a fortune -- but they will almost certainly insulate one from devaluation and inflation.

[Belle]

An interesting book on global economics can be downloaded free online...called "Confessions of an Economic Hitman" by John Perkins. It can be found here: http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/archivos_pdf/confession_economichitman.pdf

Its more than a few years old, but can give you a good idea of the game being played on a global level.

What happens when the US dollar is no longer the global currency, well, who knows.

[Ilie Pandia]

Even if El Faro is created who will guarantee that money from pension funds, investments etc. (US dollars) will be exchangeable with El Faro, and who decides the rate? Providing a local real service seems a more sensitive way to secure an income, than relying on possible worthless paper.

Also creating communities and surrounding yourself with friends to support and complete each others skills may work better than paper money.

Gold and silver also comes to mind, but it may a bit too late for that now...

[Belle]

Most Americans are well aware of the gold confiscation act of 1933 by FDR...http://www.the-privateer.com/1933-gold-confiscation.html

When in 1937 FDR hear rumors that an action of the Court could undo the gold confiscation act, he responded with a secret threat....http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2441866/replies?c=34

Could gold confiscation happen again? http://www.usagold.com/gildedopinion/gold-confiscation-ganz.html

An excerpt from the above article by David L. Ganz...


Let's look at this scenario:

It was a dark and stormy economy. Unemployment (including the discouraged workers) exceeded 18 percent. The stock market, in the midst of a trading session, suddenly lost steam and the Dow Jones Industrial Average went into a steep decline that made some wonder if it would - or could - ever come back. Gold was positively volatile.

The first three sentences sound a lot like a precursor to the Great Depression - and indeed, read like a pot boiler of the early 1930's. And all this may sound a lot like something that you'd read in the newspapers of the late 1920's, after the Crash that saw the Dow decline by 25%; but it turns out that it also could be that day in May, 2010 when the Dow plummeted by nearly 1,000 points at mid-day. Or that recent day in September, 2011 when gold dropped over $100 an ounce and silver plummeted from $49 to $30.

Actually, all the rest of the economic implications is contemporary, 21st century - and 1933 - wrapped into one.

In either case, the result could be the same because the "Trading with the Enemy Act of 1917" is still good law, and could still be used by the President of the United States, as FDR used it in 1933 to nationalize domestic gold and silver coin and bullion and JFK used it during his administration to require Americans owning gold coin and bullion abroad to turn it all in.

No one can say for sure what the future will bring. For all the precedent that argues against it - with surviving morsels of gold, the siren call of seizure could be stirring even as this is being written. We've managed to annoy every segment of the government that would be likely to support, and enforce, that type of order.

[Maia Gabrial]

Thank you for sending this along. I'd like to point out that the article does not discuss one of the key points: 50,000 dollars. The details related to how the IRS calculates what you owe them as well as the rules regarding how to pay them are very important.

Yeah, the IRS has a nifty formula that compounds interest and all that. So it's not REALLy true that they'd owe 50K's.... which means an exaggerated total equals more theft of taxpayers' money... Greed just never ends, does it?

[Lazlo]

Silver will be better to have in a collapse scenario. How do you make change for a one ounce gold coin when you are simply trying to get a few days worth of food?

An option to consider is silver in other forms than bullion. Tableware, jewelry, etc. It can often be acquired for less than the spot price at yard sales, secondhand stores, jewelry shops, etc. Just make sure you are getting sterling or pure, and not silver plate.

[trenairio]

Hmmm.... as far as I know 2009 was the worst year in the recession with negative growth. We are growing steadily now at about 1-2% per quarter? That is not even near the healthy annual growth rate of 3%, but it is fine. But some forecasters did say a second dip in the current recession is possible. I don't know what to believe.

[doodah]

...The national currency of Ecuador is the US DOLLAR. ... what will Ecuador do about the Americans living there who suddenly have no money?

[...]

George Green (http://projectcamelot.org/george_green.html) told us just a few weeks ago that there's a backup currency being prepared, called the El Faro -- possibly co-created by several South American countries. But this is not on any public record that I can see.

[...]

To insulate oneself against all this -- IF one is in a position to do so! -- the time-proven strategy of holding physical gold and silver remains the wisest plan. Metals may not make one a fortune -- but they will almost certainly insulate one from devaluation and inflation.

Thanks Bill. Even the State of Virginia, where I live right now, was contemplating creating its own sovereign state currency several years back, which I thought was very prudent, but I've not heard more about it since then.

Devaluation of the dollar is not a "future event," it's been happening and is happening as we speak. My income is the same each month, yet I effectively have less money each month; each month I can afford less and less.

Devaluation is already happening through inflation. I used to be able to feed myself for $30 / week. Now it's $60 / week for the same items or even fewer items and I do not live an excessive American lifestyle. No "living high off the hog" is happening at my house. I've had to stop buying olives and Brazil nuts already because these are non-essential items!

And while I understand that the price of food in Ecuador may be lower than the US, I don't think I understand what Ecuador will do about Americans living there, non-citizens, who are suddenly poor and perhaps don't have a real service to offer or a community to turn to or gold/silver stashed away. Will Ecuador just kick everyone out when they can't pay their rent because the dollar collapsed?

[Rocky_Shorz]

does anyone think this sudden push by the IRS, tax collectors for the Fed Reserve has to do with the winding down to the 100 year date?

How many want to vote to keep them around another hundred years?

taking passports doesn't keep people from leaving, just from coming back...

the Rich are about to be taxed and for those who slip out, no return without paying their way back in...

It doesn't matter what passport they get, it is recorded and will flag when they try to re-enter...


maybe that's why the elite are ready to go try another planet... ;)

[mexrph]

"True excellence in warfare lie in getting your enemy to surrender before going to battle"-Sun Tzu in The Art of War. Are we going to surrender before going to war. Let's give then a hell of a battle. Something to tell your grandchildren about. We must win this thing. If they win here, there will be noplace to hide.

[mgray]

Bill, I've raised this question before, but I'd like to raise it again. The national currency of Ecuador is the US DOLLAR. When the dollar crashes here, it will crash there too, right? So what do Americans do who are living in Ecuador but basically still drawing their money from the US? That is, retirees who are having social security money transferred from the US to a bank in Ecuador, or people drawing off of money invested in the US, having funds transferred to a bank in Ecuador.

I'm getting this vision: You will have nothing. You will be in Ecuador, at whatever status you have (tourist, resident, worker(?), student), and then what? Suddenly you have no money or your US dollars have no value. All of Ecuador will be affected by something like this. And what will Ecuador do about the Americans living there who suddenly have no money?

I'm really curious how this might play out. Thanks! ~ Doodah

Really good question. The answer is that this is frequently discussed by aware expats in Ecuador, but no-one really knows. It's a legitimate concern.

George Green (http://projectcamelot.org/george_green.html) told us just a few weeks ago that there's a backup currency being prepared, called the El Faro -- possibly co-created by several South American countries. But this is not on any public record that I can see.

I'm no economist (really) -- but I can kind of play out the logic like this:

1) If Ecuador keeps 'their' dollar pegged 1:1 with the US dollar (and exactly the same dollar bills are used in both countries), and if the US dollar suddenly devalues -- which is the most likely scenario -- then American products will remain the same price as far as Ecuadorian importers are concerned.

2) But then inflation in the US economy -- which would inevitably and quickly ensue -- becomes the main issue. That would then infect Ecuador like a virus, as US imports start to escalate in price.

3) The other main source of goods for Ecuadorians are Chinese exports. If the dollar devalued, these Chinese imports would become more expensive. That really would affect everyday shoppers.

4) Ecuador exports would become cheaper to other countries -- because their dollar would be (e.g.) worth fewer euros, or pounds, or pesos. But that wouldn't make a great dent in the sudden imbalance.

My guess -- and it's really a pure guess, only supported by what George Green says -- is that the Ecuadorian government must be watching this like hawks, and it's just economic expediency and responsibility for them to be quietly making backup plans.

To insulate oneself against all this -- IF one is in a position to do so! -- the time-proven strategy of holding physical gold and silver remains the wisest plan. Metals may not make one a fortune -- but they will almost certainly insulate one from devaluation and inflation.

I find it very ironic that Ecuador moved to the US dollar as currency on Sept. 11, 2000.

That said, the Ecuadorian government could move to Ecuadorian dollar or other unit that would trade independent of the dollar. It could be as simple as a stamp on the existing dollars in country until printing could be arranged. With a devalued US dollar I think the US Gov't would have more pressing matters than caring if Ecuador was defacing the greenback.

I believe this is the plan for a southern European euro as the PIIGS default next year. Euro with a G would be circulated in Greece and would have a reduced value to the euro itself.

[Lifebringer]

Bill do you not think that those using the passports from US will be able to pay taxes, if they can afford to travel all over the world? I don't get it. We can't even get an apartment without a credit check, and yet the people who have the money and refuse to settle debts before leaving to live in another country, are relying on trust they will pay it back to the tax payer who's taxes are the Government. The country is in debt and it appears the rich who have bribed politicians and stacked the deck for themselves, don't want to contribute to the betterment of the country, although they pollute our air, water, land and with their private jets and yachts and trucks destroy our roads, yet pay nothing to help repair them. Tax payers paid for the highways, and these people have been ducking taxes since Reagan. I say let the deadbeats pay the taxes and then obtain a passport. If they have to travel for business or work or education, a temporary passport should be available. i don't know if I'm getting the jist of this article, but it seems they want to place "play time" over responsibility and fairness. Just saying, and I'm not honestly, being facetious, but why would someone who owes the country, think they would be able to go to another country before paying their debt or setting up a payment plan to pay it?

Sounds like an avoidance of responsibility by deadbeats. Some just run up tabs on education over a lifetime and never pay it back. I had a student loan and until I checked the box on my taxes for deduction to pay the loan back, a lot of things were not available to me. Isn't responsibility to at least call or make amends on debt the best way to avoid this action? I mean if you talk to them and not try to duck them, they work with you, especially considering the income. However if a person is making a salary of 150,000 and above, they should pay their debts up before squandering money to vacation on the tax payers dole.

Correct me if I'm wrong. I only see an inconvience if they avoid their responsibility. Poor and middle class have to pay, why not the upper echelon income folks? 2 different Americas is what I've lived all my life and its totally unfair for the poor and middle class to have to pay taxes, while those at the top, thumb their noses at taxes or ignore it.

Please respond, im curious as to the thoughts on this, because i have an income of only 8,000 a year, and if I want an apartment, my credit better be right. Funny thing is, in my 54 years of my life, I have only owed 7,600.00 for a medical emergency bill, that I still am paying off, on this same income. Do you see the (different strokes for different folks) scenerio?

Just curious.

[Lifebringer]

They went after the guy from Independence Day that flew the crop dusting plane in the movie, he finally used his wife's Canadian citizenship, to stop them from killing him for his assets. They wanted his property, Dennis wouldn't sell, so they went after them to kill the stars doing so, and take their property with trumped up charges from IRS, while under Republican President and Majority. They took away the people's rights to own property or wealth, that they can't control.

Power trips of the elite ptwbG(Powers that Will Be Gone)

Phychotic control freaks, are NOT rational thinkers, and are greedy to the point of "madness." Everybody around them is too afraid to tell the person, they are crazy as a mad Hatter and border on a "Joker" mindset, when they feel they are about to be "refused access" to whatever they are seeking. Mitt Romney is like that. I try to keep the pointing of the one arm politically off the spiritual sites, but since "separation of church and state" has been abolished, the correction for all of this, is the absolute truth about everything/thewholebody of the ten headed beast. Knocking one hydra head down, is only gonnahaive the rest of the heads, to gnash their teeth/hostage bills, while the other head grows back. All the corporate sellout overseers must be removed, or the people will have no country to fight for because it will be for a ten league of nations, that you die for. A corporation beast of elites who wish to control you or kill you if you don't conform to the matrix.

[Fred Steeves]

I know we've discussed the leaving vs. staying thing Bill, and you're right, we each should follow our own inner guidance. Mine told me to stay anchored right here in the belly of the beast, but to be as self sufficient as possible, and away from the city.

I know many people, such as yourself, who are preparing to ride things out elsewhere, and then be available when the dust settles for the rebuilding. That's a viable calling, and you may well be in prime position to offer your services precisely because you've done that. On the other hand, my calling strongly says to me that my whole purpose in being here, is to be in position in a reserved front row seat for the big show. What can a mere "average person" possibly hope to accomplish in light of such a seemingly invincible array of power? I reckon we're just going to have to find out.

It would seem that as long as we each have thoroughly thought this thing through, and are at peace with where we are and what we're doing, then we are in the right place, come what may. Once preparations are complete, simply live, love, and let the four winds blow.

Cheers,
Fred

[Siberia9]

Hello Lifebringer, I cant speak for Bill but for me I think most Americans share your feelings on this. Of course this comes from the govt indoctrination centers (schools) and the govt mind control device (television). The understanding given of the tax slave system is a lie. This belief that everyone should pay their fair share is what they need from the masses to continue the slavery. Because if everyone knew the truth there would be a revolt, a big one.


To put it simply, the Federal Reserve is run by private banks, eleven of them. For example, Goldman Sacks and JP Morgan. They loan your govt all the money printed and you pay tax's on the interest on the debt.

The US and the rest of the world mostly is bankrupt through this same fraud. These banks are owned by the same secretive elite family's that own the worlds largest corporations.

No one actually owes them anything its a complete fraud. But they have the minds of the people. Its a relationship like the one cattle and the farmer have.

I would recommend watching the 30 minute movie The American Dream if you haven't already.


Heres a youtube link. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGk5ioEXlIM



Also, I think the original post is a warning to all because "they" can just decide that you dont have a constitutional right to travel, that is the ultimate goal btw and why its important more than anything else.

It seems to me that no one is leaving the US permanently unless they have a considerable amount of money to do it, its getting more and more difficult and when and not if the Dollars tanks no one will let you into there country anyway. if any of you have lottery money and just decided today that you want to split then my advice is to buy an economic citizenship from Dominica it will cost 100 grand plus another 35grand in lawyer and govt fees for you and your immediate family, it will give you visa free travel to 100 countrys. Then start a bussines in one of the BRICS or a country that does a lot of bussiness with them. Then get rid of your US Dollars for silver.


Its my oppinion that anyone living in another country counting on there US Social Security money or US retirement money etc is going to be in serious trouble very soon. They had better find a way now to bring in cash at a local level. A teaching job, or panning gold in the jugle or something, otherwise I see a very sullen one way trip back to the US when no one would want to be there.


You see about a year ago many like me where hearing that "they" were going to tank the Dollar on purpose and in a hurry. So I took a few meetings to find out what the deal was. I bring this up because a Goldman Sachs Chief Executive told me that they had decided to wait, until the BRICS nations were stronger. That they were backing the BRICS as a replacement to the US for the elite family's and their business's. The way I understand it right now, sometime in Sept of this year, probably after the 21st, it will be announced that the BRICS will no longer use the Dollar as the petro Dollar and begin dumping their holdings of the US Dollar. Of course almost no one living in the US will have a clue as to what that means and its only the first of many such hole's to be poked in that balloon. eventually the US Dollar will be dropped all together as a world reserve currency. By then you could easily see $ 50.00 hamburgers and $500.00 silver etc.

This is but one reason the rich are leaving, they must. It is the middle class that will not survive financially. It is them that the IRS and the rest of the govt bureaucrats are after, less they become wealthy some place else.


There are many more pieces of the puzzle that I wont bother to get into here as they go way beyond the scope of the original post and most are already familiar with the scenarios to come anyway. However they ARE very good reasons to get out of the US and the Northern Hemisphere in my opinion, if you can, just say'n.



Bill do you not think that those using the passports from US will be able to pay taxes, if they can afford to travel all over the world? I don't get it. We can't even get an apartment without a credit check, and yet the people who have the money and refuse to settle debts before leaving to live in another country, are relying on trust they will pay it back to the tax payer who's taxes are the Government. The country is in debt and it appears the rich who have bribed politicians and stacked the deck for themselves, don't want to contribute to the betterment of the country, although they pollute our air, water, land and with their private jets and yachts and trucks destroy our roads, yet pay nothing to help repair them. Tax payers paid for the highways, and these people have been ducking taxes since Reagan. I say let the deadbeats pay the taxes and then obtain a passport. If they have to travel for business or work or education, a temporary passport should be available. i don't know if I'm getting the jist of this article, but it seems they want to place "play time" over responsibility and fairness. Just saying, and I'm not honestly, being facetious, but why would someone who owes the country, think they would be able to go to another country before paying their debt or setting up a payment plan to pay it?

Sounds like an avoidance of responsibility by deadbeats. Some just run up tabs on education over a lifetime and never pay it back. I had a student loan and until I checked the box on my taxes for deduction to pay the loan back, a lot of things were not available to me. Isn't responsibility to at least call or make amends on debt the best way to avoid this action? I mean if you talk to them and not try to duck them, they work with you, especially considering the income. However if a person is making a salary of 150,000 and above, they should pay their debts up before squandering money to vacation on the tax payers dole.

Correct me if I'm wrong. I only see an inconvience if they avoid their responsibility. Poor and middle class have to pay, why not the upper echelon income folks? 2 different Americas is what I've lived all my life and its totally unfair for the poor and middle class to have to pay taxes, while those at the top, thumb their noses at taxes or ignore it.

Please respond, im curious as to the thoughts on this, because i have an income of only 8,000 a year, and if I want an apartment, my credit better be right. Funny thing is, in my 54 years of my life, I have only owed 7,600.00 for a medical emergency bill, that I still am paying off, on this same income. Do you see the (different strokes for different folks) scenerio?

Just curious.

[grampah]

A friend emailed me this: "A new law in Uruguay is intended to attract foreign settlers"

I googled it and nothing specific came up. Anyone know about this?

[Siberia9]

I do know that Uruguay was an excellent place to get a second passport and stash your cash. However the banking cartel threatened to tap dance on their heads so they changed the laws and added a mandatory tetanus vaccine to get your citizenship. It used to be that you could by a house and apply for permanent residency and you would then be allowed to apply for citizenship, it was quick and the tax man didn't get into your pocket. But they caved in so as not to be cut off from international trade and be black balled as a tax haven. They have been trying to attract some new people with money by adding some incentives but I dont think its working.



A friend emailed me this: "A new law in Uruguay is intended to attract foreign settlers"

I googled it and nothing specific came up. Anyone know about this?

[bluestflame]

in theory the IRS can just invent taxes you "owe" them , ideal way to prevent someone (anyone) leaving the country

[bennycog]

for those that cannot leave.. and if the scenerio plays out then we must invest in some of our own energy to help them out, for preservation of their human spirit. if it does play out and you guys that are there have to know that you're there for a reason, knowing what you know from avalon and your own research.. helpful and vigilant 50/50...
i would have to assume that the US is not the only place it manifests.. ( if it does )
im not one to say to leave it up to god, as i dont much rely on the words of the bible as fact, but as a metaphorical layout for achieving rebirth back to the energy..
so with the concept i totally agree..
"masses, globally awakening through monetry division" on this type of scale, would surely put action to revolution would it not?

[Prodigal Son]

So let's see.... They can round you up when outside of the USA and take away your right to travel abroad because you haven't ponied up to the tune of $50K or more....

And yet I wonder, why do we continue to tolerate paying extortion to these Khazarian mobsters when there is no law that says we have to?

We need to come together as a species and put these parasites out to pasture permanently. It's as simple as not paying them.

[Marsila]

A friend emailed me this: "A new law in Uruguay is intended to attract foreign settlers"

I googled it and nothing specific came up. Anyone know about this?

Grampah, i think he may have been talking about their new tax law for foreigners.... you can read about it here (http://www.internationalman.com/global-perspectives/new-uruguay-tax-law-to-attract-foreign-residents)

though as someone from Uruguay's West-side neighbor, i have to say the reality of South America is so different than what one who has never been there may think, no matter what one reads.

I also don't think it is fair that most of these 'controllers' who ruined their own countries have already moved or are moving to S.America, so easily while making it even more complicated for others to do so...so i hope this Uruguay tax exemption law benefits the 'small' guy more than the big guy.