Bible Topics and Questions

[kreagle]

A Message from the 'Prodigal Son'
"You don't have to eat 'Garbage' anymore!"


http://www.mannaexpressonline.com/images/stories/feeding-the-pigs.jpg




Luke 15:10-20
King James Version (KJV)

10 Likewise, I say unto you, there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner that repenteth.

11 And he said, A certain man had two sons:

12 And the younger of them said to his father, Father, give me the portion of goods that falleth to me. And he divided unto them his living.

13 And not many days after the younger son gathered all together, and took his journey into a far country, and there wasted his substance with riotous living.

14 And when he had spent all, there arose a mighty famine in that land; and he began to be in want.

15 And he went and joined himself to a citizen of that country; and he sent him into his fields to feed swine.

16 And he would fain have filled his belly with the husks that the swine did eat: and no man gave unto him.

17 And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!

18 I will arise and go to my father, and will say unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before thee,

19 And am no more worthy to be called thy son: make me as one of thy hired servants.

20 And he arose, and came to his father. But when he was yet a great way off, his father saw him, and had compassion, and ran, and fell on his neck, and kissed him.




The account of the 'Prodigal Son', as told by the Bible, is one that 'most' people are familiar with. In it we find a particularly 'low point' in the life of the 'Prodigal' when he comes 'face-to-face' with the awful consequences, ( and results), of his decision to 'leave his father's home, ( and presence),' to begin with.

The 'facts' were overwhelming,......he was literally 'starving' and began to reminisce about the nourishment he once received,.....'back home!'

Verses 16 and 17, (above), inform us of the thoughts that were racing through his mind,....as the 'Prodigal' sat in the 'muck-mire' of the 'decision' that he had previously made by leaving his father's presence.



16 And he would fain have filled his belly with the husks that the swine did eat: and no man gave unto him.

17 And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!



It should be pointed out that the 'only' choice that the 'Prodigal' currently had for nourishment was the 'husks that the swine did eat', and that he also could not rely upon anyone else helping him out, for,....'no man gave unto him'.


It should 'equally' be pointed out that 'we', ( ie. humanity in general), have become the 'Prodigal',....( every last one of us!) When our 'original' ancestors, ( Adam and Eve), left the 'home,....and presence of our Father', and left the Garden of Eden, we 'all' became the 'Prodigal',......and as such,....we've 'all' ventured 'further, and further,...away from our Father's Home',......and the Utopian conditions that He originally had planned for us. Like it, or not, we 'all' inherited the 'fallen conditions' of our ancient ancestors, Adam and Eve, and as such,.....the 'Prodigality of Mankind' exists. Sooner,...or later,....we 'all' have the responsibility to decide whether or not we are going to 'return', ( turn around),....to our Father and His Home.


The 'muck-mire',....and his 'starving' initiated wisdom in the mind of the Prodigal Son,.....for his 'sordid conditions' fully prompted in him it was time to 'return,...turn around, ( ie. repent),.....to his father's home' and his ample, ( and plenteous), provisions!


Of the 'many' messages that the Biblical account of the 'Prodigal Son' teaches, one particularly stands out, here, in a very prominent way.


The 'Prodigal Son' is telling 'every one of us today',....."You don't have to eat 'Garbage' anymore!" "You can 'opt' to go back home!"

The 'only' thing he had to eat, at the time, was 'husks', which was intended for the swine, certainly not for 'humans'. It should be particularly noted that 'husks' carry 'very little nutritional value' and are primarily intended to simply be a 'filler', or to give one the 'sense' of being full to satisfaction, even though this is a 'false' impression.

In 'our' personal 'Prodigal' condition that we all find ourselves in, the 'muck-mire' of this world in which we live,....( along with our 'spiritually' starving conditions),.... should make us all acutely aware of what this 'world' has to offer to feed us in the first place! Of course,....I'm NOT referring to feeding the 'natural' man/woman,....but the 'spiritual' man/woman, here,.....for it's the 'spiritual' man/woman that's 'starving to death!'

Guess what this 'world' is trying to 'cram down our throats?' 'Husks', my friends,.....and it's 'all' pure garbage, with virtually no 'spiritually nutritional value!' I'm, specifically, speaking of the 'spiritual' nature, within us, that we all have,....and desperately needs to be nourished! Likewise,...as with the 'Prodigal Son',....'mankind' will NOT be able to give you what you need, ( see verse 16 above). You're going to have to 'go Home' to get that!


The 'Prodigal Son' made a very wise choice,.....there in the 'muck-mire' as he was 'starving!' He decided to 'go back home!' His 'hunger and thirst' got the best of him! He decided he wanted some 'more' home cooking!



Matthew 5:6 (KJV)

6 Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.



But, of course,....this 'type' of decision normally only comes when you've, finally, become completely tired of 'sitting in the muck-mire' listening to your soul's 'stomach' growling with 'hunger pains!'


A 'Divine' dinner bell is ringing in the 'distance', my friends!,.....Father is calling!



http://media.radiosai.org/Journals/Vol_08/01DEC10/images/03_FeatureArticles/behner/prodigal-son.jpg

God Bless to 'all!',......your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[kreagle]

To Take His Name,.....or,.....To Not Take His Name?



'Studies' show that 88% of women take husband's last name,.......
http://www.qoutz.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/love-marriage-quotes.jpg


What are 'your views' on this topic,.....and 'why?'


Your brother, friend, and servant,.....kreagle

[kreagle]

Getting Beyond the Taste!



Psalm 34:8 (KJV)

8 O taste and see that the Lord is good: blessed is the man that trusteth in him.



Many, today, simply cannot 'trust' the Lord, and consequently never seem to be able to get beyond the 'taste' of His Word. The 'natural man/woman' will always find His Word to be non-palatable in relationship to their carnal instincts and it's going to require some serious 'maturity', ( spiritually speaking), in order to recognize just how essential His Word is for our lives and the need to 'ingest' It.




Our 'little fellow', here, has some pretty interesting 'reactions' to eating, ( then rejecting), his peas! dmwVy2Se7WQ


Obviously, the natural food that we ingest 'fuels', ( and enables), us to propel ourselves in this 'fleshly' life that we all live. How much 'more' does the Word of God provide the 'spiritual food' that we so desperately need to propel down the 'spiritual highways' of life, also? Is it any wonder why we see so 'many' stranded 'motorists', ( ie. lost souls), on the side of the 'highway of life' simply because their 'tanks' are depleted, and void of a valid understanding, and/or, application of His Word within their respective lives?


It's fully understandable, ( and expected), for our 'little fellow', ( in the video), to reject his 'peas' due to their unpleasant taste. He simply isn't big enough to know any better, and hasn't developed a taste for the things in life that are healthy for him. However, we find that a 'major portion' of our society still hasn't properly matured, themselves, for they continuously reject His Word, spitting It out, and harboring disgusting looks on their face! Now I sincerely ask, my friends,....."who is it that REALLY needs to grow up?"



Ezekiel 2:7-8 (KJV)

7 And thou shalt speak my words unto them, whether they will hear, or whether they will forbear: for they are most rebellious.

8 But thou, son of man, hear what I say unto thee; Be not thou rebellious like that rebellious house: open thy mouth, and eat that I give thee.



Sounds like our 'Heavenly Father' is saying,......."Eat your peas, son!",.....to me.


Your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle



Reminder!

Please take a look, again, at the previous topic,....Take, or Reject husband's name,....and respond according to your views on this!

[SilentFeathers]

Hi, I've been researching the Bible etc for years and have always been a bit fascinated with Daniels 70 week prophecy.

I found this video and thought you may want to check it out. It's a bit long but grabbed me a certain way. I don't agree with a lot in it but some stuff I seem to. If you have time and watch it, let me know what you think about it please.

Daniel's Timeline by Dewey Bruton
This video was made in 2005 after over 20 years of study, unedited, uncut and presented before a live audience


eRivtKcLqek

[kreagle]

Hi, I've been researching the Bible etc for years and have always been a bit fascinated with Daniels 70 week prophecy.

I found this video and thought you may want to check it out. It's a bit long but grabbed me a certain way. I don't agree with a lot in it but some stuff I seem to. If you have time and watch it, let me know what you think about it please.

Daniel's Timeline by Dewey Bruton
This video was made in 2005 after over 20 years of study, unedited, uncut and presented before a live audience


eRivtKcLqek


Thank you, so much, SilentFeathers for this 'timely' video! It will take a 'serious student' of God's Word to 'listen and absorb' the contents of this video,....but if any thing else, it should highlight, ( and accentuate), how rapidly things are unfolding right before our very eyes!

Whether one realizes it, or not, we are all, literally, living at a moment in time that is referred to as the 'eleventh hour' by our Lord. This will be a 'last opportunity' to become employed, ( or inducted into), God's plan for His chosen Ones.



Matthew 20:1-16 (KJV)

20 For the kingdom of heaven is like unto a man that is an householder, which went out early in the morning to hire labourers into his vineyard.

2 And when he had agreed with the labourers for a penny a day, he sent them into his vineyard.

3 And he went out about the third hour, and saw others standing idle in the marketplace,

4 And said unto them; Go ye also into the vineyard, and whatsoever is right I will give you. And they went their way.

5 Again he went out about the sixth and ninth hour, and did likewise.

6 And about the eleventh hour he went out, and found others standing idle, and saith unto them, Why stand ye here all the day idle?

7 They say unto him, Because no man hath hired us. He saith unto them, Go ye also into the vineyard; and whatsoever is right, that shall ye receive.

8 So when even was come, the lord of the vineyard saith unto his steward, Call the labourers, and give them their hire, beginning from the last unto the first.

9 And when they came that were hired about the eleventh hour, they received every man a penny.

10 But when the first came, they supposed that they should have received more; and they likewise received every man a penny.

11 And when they had received it, they murmured against the goodman of the house,

12 Saying, These last have wrought but one hour, and thou hast made them equal unto us, which have borne the burden and heat of the day.

13 But he answered one of them, and said, Friend, I do thee no wrong: didst not thou agree with me for a penny?

14 Take that thine is, and go thy way: I will give unto this last, even as unto thee.

15 Is it not lawful for me to do what I will with mine own? Is thine eye evil, because I am good?

16 So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen.




Your brother, friend, and servant..........kreagle

[SilentFeathers]

Here is the image/chart from the video....what really is interesting is if you look at the "now" time of the chart "30 days" of feb/Mar 2013, many things right now that are happening seem to resemble the chart.

The chart states alter shut down which could be the Pope resigning and the alter being shut down so to speak. It's any one's choice to see this as the temple mount alter or not, which basically has been shut down since 70ad, or the head of Christianity's alter being shut down (Vatican).

RE: In the video the date of March 22nd, 2013 is a focal date. Illuminati date? 322??? Skull and bones etc.

It also mentions in the chart that now is the time to watch for the "Abomination of Desolation"....oddly enough Obama will be in Israel on March 20th thru 22nd and possibly in to the 23rd this month.

Hamas has already warned him that if he went to the temple mount/dome of the rock that it would be basically an act of war. Could he actually be the "ObamaNation of Desolation"???? It's a stretch, but prophecy is weird sometimes and rather often symbolic more than anything.


Mat 24:15-21 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains: Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

Also for the last 3 1/2 years we have had a nobel peace prize winner speaking peace, ending wars (Iraq/Afghanistan" etc in high office here, Obama. I don't think he's the anti-Christ, but he seems to fit in this prophecy somehow.

It'll be interesting to see what the woman fleeing means, two witnesses, etc etc.....too many things are happening that are either coincidence or part of the prophecy leading up to now.....quite strange for sure. It's rather hard to discount recent events being part of the prophecy after watching this video. IMO anyways....

PS: The video has a even more detailed version of this chart below with more precise dates etc.

http://www.danielstimeline.com/images/DanielsfullchartJpeg_000.JPG

[kreagle]

'Together We Stand',.....Divided We Fall!



Jeremiah 17:7-8 (KJV)

7 Blessed is the man that trusteth in the Lord, and whose hope the Lord is.

8 For he shall be as a tree planted by the waters, and that spreadeth out her roots by the river, and shall not see when heat cometh, but her leaf shall be green; and shall not be careful in the year of drought, neither shall cease from yielding fruit.




http://www.ruralprimicias.com.ar/fotos/178854194249eb6a44db57cba8d66b3404fa9f0ad4.jpg


We have been studying the effects of 'root systems' in our Adult Sunday school class over the past several weeks. The massive Sequoia tree of Northern California can grow to a staggering height that is the equivalent of a 26 story building, but has a root system that is surprisingly shallow, perhaps only 20 feet in depth. How does it thrive, and survive, with such a shallow root system? The answer is 'togetherness!' While their root system depth may seem proportionally lacking for their massive height, weight, and diameter, they make up for this deficiency by 'spreading out their roots' and interweaving them together with each other. This is why they only grow together in groves, where they can draw from one another and flourish! While it may be possible to 'temporarily' grow a single Sequoia tree,....by itself, alone,.....it will NOT survive in the long run, for it will not be able to withstand winds, heavy rains, or flooding, that will surely come it's way, and ultimately will topple to it's death.


The 'same' is equally true for the Christian of today,....and the prophet Jeremiah fully endorses this 'law of nature' by wisely recording this in Scriptural Text for you, and I, to recognize and to implement it's 'same' principles within our lives. ( see above)


A 'massive' error that I see happening at an ever increasing, ( and alarming), rate today, is the 'lone Christian' who endeavors to 'branch out on their own',.....become that 'lone Sequoia' and abandon the 'togetherness' which has been afforded to the Church! Oh,....you may seem to 'grow and thrive',...for awhile,...but sooner, or later, you are going to require some 'stability' that only comes by 'intermingling yourself' with your fellow Christian Church brethren.


Did you know that a 'lone Sequoia tree' never happens on it's own? If you ever see one,...it's because someone specifically planted it there, by itself, ( and all alone!) This is not a 'natural' happenstance for a Sequoia tree to just 'pop' up, by itself, all alone, for this would be 'against the laws of nature',....and even nature won't allow that!


Satan would love to 'isolate' everyone today and is feverishly working overtime to do 'exactly that' by deceptively implying that,....."You don't need to go to Church to be saved!,.... You can stay home and worship God in your own way!,....You don't need organized religion!"


Would Satan be so brash as to try to destroy our 'root system'? Would he stoop so low as to endeavor to 'isolate' us and cause our Christian experience to completely 'topple' one day? Is he desperately trying to prohibit our 'root system' from intertwining itself with each other, thereby robbing us of our Christian strength as a member of the Church?

I really think we 'all' know the answer to these 'questions',....don't we?


The Apostle Paul wisely informs us, in the Epistle to the Ephesians, what has happened to the truly, Born-again believer, who has separated themselves from this world and joined themselves to the fellowship of God's household. A literal 'root system',...( Christian by designed, and supported by the original Apostolic Church as defined by Acts 2:47),.....has begun the grafting process to incorporate you fully into the kingdom of God!



Ephesians 2:19-22 (KJV)

19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;

20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;

21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:

22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.





*** Disclaimer***


I fully realize that 'quote,...religion',...has bruised many people who have become so 'disgusted' with the whole Christian scene,... to the point that they don't want anything to do with 'organized' religion. Consequently 'these' individuals have seen no other 'alternative' but to 'isolate' themselves, and to initiate their own 'religious' experience, ( or awakening), on their own, by themselves, and all alone!

Catholicism,....and other 'false' religions/doctrines,...are rampant everywhere, folks,....and are simply just another 'method' that Satan uses to 'isolate' humanity and to reproduce another,.....'lone Sequoia tree' out of you,....so-to-speak!

Just because someone hasn't found that 'original Apostolic Church' experience, yet,.....doesn't mean that it doesn't exist,...for it most certainly does! Just keep looking,....praying,....searching,....seeking,....and God will totally bring you to It's doorstep so you can enter in,... 'IF'... you are sincere and really want to find His ultimate Truth!


Don't let Satan 'isolate',.....and 'single you out', my dear friends!


Come join the 'root system' and become a 'mighty Christian Sequoia!'


God Bless to all,....your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[Prodigal Son]

Hi Kreagle!

Great thread.

I read somewhere, in an article about Jesus studying in India, that he took all the lessons from the parts of the Bible that existed at the time and condensed it into this one parable of the Prodigal Son. It is saying that there is no "judgement" as we have been led to believe. We bring all our own consequences upon ourselves through faulty thinking. God is not punishing us, we are merely reaping what we sow, and the True Father is indeed waiting with open arms the very moment that our thinking becomes clear.

From there, he further condensed the entire spiritual journey of mankind into this one verse (Note the chapter and verse #, not a co-incidence!):

Matthew 13:33 New International Version (©2011)
He told them still another parable: "The kingdom of heaven is like yeast that a woman took and mixed into about sixty pounds of flour until it worked all through the dough."

I chose the name Prodigal Son because it took me 45 years to learn that lesson... being raised as a JW, they made my childhood and teen years a living hell. The indoctrination started at age 8 and I was baptized at age 12. Once you are baptized, they own you and can threaten you with cutting you off from all your friends and family if you fail to toe the company line. They destroyed all my personal relationships and my own self-esteem. Armageddon was always right around the corner.... when Jehovah would rain down fireballs on every person who was not devoting their life to selling Watchtower literature. I disappeared from the Cult at age 19 before they had any chance to disfellowship me (their version of ex-communication). I still believed it was the truth but I was disgusted with them and the God they represented. I wanted no part of them or Him. This was a heavy burden... thinking that I was doomed to eternal destruction whenever Judgment Day came.... and I hated Jehovah and I hated all of them and their pompous, Pharisaic attitudes.

So after 15 years and a failed marriage to a Catholic woman, I decided I needed to go back and give it another try. Somehow, some way, I would find a way to live up to Jehovah's insidious demands, out of fear just to save my own arse. The elders did not like the fact that I took 15 years off from servitude.... they made it extremely difficult for me. It was like I was on probation.. for many months, they looked at me sideways. I was not exactly feeling like the Prodigal Son. I knew something was seriously wrong. In the meantime I developed close relationships with many in the Kingdom Hall... and some of them confided in me the cruelty and misery that the body of elders was causing amongst the sheep, meddling in their personal affairs. Mysogeny was rampant too... women were treated like second-class baggage, not allowed to offer congregational prayers or teach from the platform, which was an organizational thing, but this particular congregation was in extremely poor condition spiritually. Their attendance was running around 40% while the other 60% were attending neighboring congregations.

There was a mentally challenged brother who loved Jehovah and loved this religion with all his heart. He did not drive and lived very close to me, so I would pick him up and take him to the meeting and we became very close. The elders found a way to provoke him with their obnoxious judgmental attitude and he threw his Bible at them in disgust. They proceeded to punish him with "Public Reproof" and they devastated this 20 year-old kid. I went ballistic, demanded a private meeting with the Presiding Overseer and his two cohorts, and read him the riot act right from the Bible... something from 2nd Thessalonians where it talks about those in positions of authority who become full of themselves, are "over-reached by Satan", and lose their capacity from mercy and compassion. I told them that the congregation was very sick, many of them confiding in me that it was because of their treatment of people and that they had a lot of spiritual blood on their hands. They asked me to step out while they considered what I had to say, called me back in 10 minutes later and disfellowshipped me on the spot.

At the time, it was the most devastating thing imaginable. I really thought they represented "God". It turned out the be the best thing that ever happened to me, although I didn't realize that until another 10 years of mental and spiritual suffering had gone by... in my Epiphany year of 2006, when I realized hands down that this was not just another false religion, but the most insidious brand of Satanic mind-control in existence... one that perverts the highest truth into the worst type of Masonic fear propaganda... Enochian Black Magic in the extreme. (Look into the Tetragrammation YHWH and the four Watchtowers).

That is when I realized that my True Father in Heaven has never been apart from me, and that I am indeed welcomed back into his bosom whenever I am ready to make the necessary changes in my thinking.

[Kraut]

... being raised as a JW, they made my childhood and teen years a living hell. The indoctrination started at age 8 and I was baptized at age 12. Once you are baptized, they own you and can threaten you with cutting you off from all your friends and family if you fail to toe the company line. They destroyed all my personal relationships and my own self-esteem. Armageddon was always right around the corner.... when Jehovah would rain down fireballs on every person who was not devoting their life to selling Watchtower literature. I disappeared from the Cult at age 19 before they had any chance to disfellowship me (their version of ex-communication). I still believed it was the truth but I was disgusted with them and the God they represented. I wanted no part of them or Him. This was a heavy burden... thinking that I was doomed to eternal destruction whenever Judgment Day came.... and I hated Jehovah and I hated all of them and their pompous, Pharisaic attitudes...

Wow, Brother, that's exactly how I felt/feel. I wasn't aware that you were an exJW. This feeling of hatred towards Jehovah is very, very familiar and I felt liberated when I understood that the Organization has a terribly flawed view of God. Could be my perception only, but the Pharisaical attitudes have been getting worse in the past years, which is why I realized how wrong my beliefs and my faith were. I'm still in officially, but inactive. Trying to stay under the radar so my family won't have to make that hard choice between me and Jehovah.

[Kraut]

The major point that made me question Christianity in its prevalent form was the focus on judgement. To me there is a discrepancy between the loving Father and the emphasis on judgement, destruction and everlasting cutting off. It is something I do not believe in anymore. Here's an interesting quote from Wikipedia (yes, it's hardly an "authority"...):

"Matthew 7:13 is the thirteenth verse of the seventh chapter of the Gospel of Matthew in the New Testament and is part of the Sermon on the Mount. This verse begins the concluding summary of the Sermon, a series of warnings about not following the teachings laid out.

In the King James Version of the Bible the text reads:

Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way,
that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

The World English Bible translates the passage as:

“Enter in by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the
way that leads to destruction, and many are those who enter in by it.

For a collection of other versions see BibRef Matthew 7:13

The word here translated as gate refers to the large entrance to a city or a temple. In this era many cities had walls, and entrance was only through certain gates. Luz notes that the idea of the gates of heaven was in existence at the time of Jesus, and this verse may be a reference to that notion.

The metaphor of God providing two ways, one good one evil, was a common one in the Jewish literature of the period. It appears in the Old Testament in Deuteronomy 30:19 and Jeremiah 21:8. A somewhat similar metaphor appears at Luke 13:24. The context and phrasing of Luke are quite different from that here in Matthew, and Davies and Allison feel that this makes it less likely that this saying comes from Q. Luz supports the idea that the two gate metaphor was present in Q, and that the author of Matthew merged it with the well known two paths metaphor to create this verse.

This verse, with its reference to the destruction in store for those following the wrong path is clearly eschatological. Implying that the destination for those who take the easy way is punishment by God. Davies and Allison note that J.D.M. Derrett supports a very different interpretation. He argues that if the metaphor is referring to the entrance to a city or to a gate in the middle of the road, that this implies that the ultimate destination is the same. Once both groups are through the gate they will find themselves in the same place. Derrett thus argues that this metaphor states that it is the journey of the sinner which is hard and destructive, but that after facing this turbulent journey the sinner, like the pious, will ultimately find God's grace."

It's a topic I've had plenty of discussion about. In my opinion there is no everlasting judgement, we are the ones who cut ourselves off from "God", which is like hell, the way back will always be open. While many will not agree with me I cannot help but conclude that early on Christianity strayed from the path with the over focus on judgement and destruction. How many people have been manipulated by the use of fear? Fear of hell, fear that if you aren't baptized, or your children aren't baptized that judgement will follow? It's a shame that many people today believe that a loving Father would punish sinners in eternal fire and torment. Which parent would bring never ending punishment upon a child? No parent in a sane frame of mind. Are we greater in kindness than God? That's doubtful.

[Prodigal Son]

“Enter in by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the
way that leads to destruction, and many are those who enter in by it.


Of all the scriptures in the Bible, it was my misunderstanding of this one in particular that sustained my delusion in believing that the Watchtower was "The Truth". "We are the ONLY ones who follow the Bible"... blah blah blah "There is nowhere else to go" blah blah blah "No one else uses Jehovah's name" blah blah blah. (Not true! "Jehovah" is the most important word in Freemasonry!)

Well, none of that is true. They don't follow the Bible, only the verses they cherry-pick. Every "Christian" religion does this with the Bible, each and every one is very convincing and as a result we have 40,000+ denominations. The problem is, the Bible was written by Kabbalists. All of these parables and metaphors are astrological in nature, and are telling us under the surface what the real truth is. Trying to interpret it on our own through a literal reading (Madame Blavatsky interestingly called it the "vulgar" for non-initiates to be controlled and spiritually suppressed.) Once I studied Kabbalah, EVERYTHING in the Bible made 100% PERFECT SENSE.... and it became very easy to recognize the interpolated *BS*... including most of the stuff supposedly written by "Paul" who himself said to "rightly divide the word of truth". Ezra the Black Magician came back from Babylonian exile and proceeded to pervert the Torah with the stuff Jeremiah spoke of when he informed us of "lying scribes".

The metaphor of the narrow gate has to do with choosing the middle path, striking the balance between left and right on the Kabbalistic Tree of life, which has multiple levels of meaning. The human body can be superimposed over the tree, and this what it means to be impaled upon the cross.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/d/d5/Ktreewnames.png/192px-Ktreewnames.png

In the Gospel of Thomas, Jesus alluded to this when he said, "When you make your eye single, you will enter the Kingdom of Heaven".

I learned SO MUCH from reading this book....

http://www.amazon.com/Gnosis-Cosmic-Christ-Christian-Kabbalah/dp/0738705918

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51Y-ZN76ALL._BO2,204,203,200_PIsitb-sticker-arrow-click,TopRight,35,-76_AA300_SH20_OU01_.jpg

Please read the review... here is an excerpt from the last 2 paragraphs....


In the view of the Tree of Life as three pillars, the right and left pillars are composed of three Sefirot each, and the middle pillar is composed of four Sefirot. The pillar on the right is called the Pillar of Mercy and the pillar on the left is called the Pillar of Severity-the Pillars of Jachin and Boaz in the temple of King Solomon. One is positive and the other negative; one is male and the other is female; one is white, the other is black-so that these two pillars represent the eternal play of opposites in dynamic interaction. Evil is imbalanced force, out of place or out of harmony. Severity in imbalance is cruelty and oppression, and mercy in imbalance is weakness that allows and facilitates great evil. True compassion is a dynamic balance of severity and mercy.

The Middle Pillar is therefore the path of the ascension, representing the dynamic balance of all polarities or opposites, and the integration of everything that would otherwise be fragmented. The Kabbalah teaches the Middle Way, akin to what is found in forms of Hinduism and Buddhism in the Eastern schools. For this reason, whether the tree is viewed in terms of the triads or the three pillars, the Sefirah Tiferet (beauty), w...

[Kraut]

...and it became very easy to recognize the interpolated *BS*... including most of the stuff supposedly written by "Paul" who himself said to "rightly divide the word of truth"..

Thanks, Prodigal Son. Gnosticism is something I've been looking into lately, so far it's one of the few things that makes sense to me. I'll have a look at the book, the excerpt is interesting. Even while I was still a "Christian" believer I grew very skeptical of Paul, to say the least. Christianity is more Pauline than actually of Christ, but few notice that.

[Prodigal Son]

Thanks, Prodigal Son. Gnosticism is something I've been looking into lately, so far it's one of the few things that makes sense to me. I'll have a look at the book, the excerpt is interesting. Even while I was still a "Christian" believer I grew very skeptical of Paul, to say the least. Christianity is more Pauline than actually of Christ, but few notice that.

You're welcome!

From all my research, I've come to the conclusion that the earliest Christians were Gnostics, there were many different sects, and "Jesus" aka Yehoshua Ben Yosef was an initiate in the Sect of the Nazarenes, and Essene branch of Gnostics... he is mentioned at Acts 24:5-7 as the "ringleader of the sect of the Nazarenes". It is important to note that Nazareth did not exist as a city at that time.

Good website here:

http://www.thenazareneway.com/

You might also enjoy "Jehovah Unmasked" by former JW turned Gnostic Nathaniel Merritt. It's really all in the Bible very plain for all to see who exactly "Jehovah" is. Unfortunately Nate has removed all the links for free PDF download. If you google it you will come across some very eye-opening links like this one:

The God of George W. Bush is really the devil

Many Catholics, Jews, and Christians — George W. Bush, for one — actually worship the devil

http://www.rudemacedon.ca/kaminski/04/0929-jehovah.html

[SilentFeathers]

Bumping this post and adding an update for those that are interested....


Hi, I've been researching the Bible etc for years and have always been a bit fascinated with Daniels 70 week prophecy.

I found this video and thought you may want to check it out. It's a bit long but grabbed me a certain way. I don't agree with a lot in it but some stuff I seem to. If you have time and watch it, let me know what you think about it please.

Daniel's Timeline by Dewey Bruton
This video was made in 2005 after over 20 years of study, unedited, uncut and presented before a live audience


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UPDATE:

Daniels Timeline: IMPORTANT UPDATE

URShLBh3L9E

DANIEL 11:21 "And in his place shall arise a vile person, to whom they will not give the honor of royalty; but he shall come in peaceably, and seize the kingdom by intrigue."

Note:

If you subract 1260 days from the date Dewey Bruton claims is the center of tribulation (3-22-2013), you come to the date of October 9, 2009, the date Obama got the Nobel Peace Prize! This gets more strange every minute!!!!

[kreagle]

That is when I realized that my True Father in Heaven has never been apart from me, and that I am indeed welcomed back into his bosom whenever I am ready to make the necessary changes in my thinking.


Hey Prodigal Son and Kraut, also!

With your experiences in the JW movement, you 'both' seem to have a 'common thread', in that, you've been exposed to a great deal of anguish and pain as you have expressed to us, here. It 'all' has to do with the 'pathways' in life that we all choose to go down. In your case, Prodigal Son, you originally revealed that you, basically, didn't have a choice, for you were very young and forced to accept this 'pathway' whether you agreed with it or not. Upon leaving this 'pathway' you later decided to 'turn down that same road', once again, did you not?



Could be my perception only, but the Pharisaical attitudes have been getting worse in the past years, which is why I realized how wrong my beliefs and my faith were. I'm still in officially, but inactive. Trying to stay under the radar so my family won't have to make that hard choice between me and Jehovah.


Kraut, while it may be 'admirable' that you have currently elected to be 'still in officially', ( with the JW movement), in an effort to retain harmony within your personal family, it still comes down to what 'pathway' do you, also, want to go down, specifically?


There is literally no one who hasn't 'gone down the wrong pathway',...( ie. turned down the wrong road), from a 'natural' standpoint somewhere along the line in our respective lives. The 'real' question is,....."what shall I do now?,....shall I continue going down this pathway,....OR....shall I 'turn around',... go back,... and start over, again?"


Just because 'one' pathway doesn't enable you to arrive at your proper destination doesn't mean that a 'proper pathway' doesn't exist!


To be continued!,.......


Your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[Kraut]

Kraut, while it may be 'admirable' that you have currently elected to be 'still in officially', ( with the JW movement), in an effort to retain harmony within your personal family, it still comes down to what 'pathway' do you, also, want to go down, specifically?


There is literally no one who hasn't 'gone down the wrong pathway',...( ie. turned down the wrong road), from a 'natural' standpoint somewhere along the line in our respective lives. The 'real' question is,....."what shall I do now?,....shall I continue going down this pathway,....OR....shall I 'turn around',... go back,... and start over, again?"


Just because 'one' pathway doesn't enable you to arrive at your proper destination doesn't mean that a 'proper pathway' doesn't exist!


To be continued!,.......


Your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

Hello Kreagle,
it is a bit like a tightrope walk. My Mother knows where I stand, I told her clearly that I am no longer a believer. We've had many arguments and finally have seemed to reach a point where we can accept the other's stance. I am still careful though. Months ago I had started to write a letter of disassociation but friends in another forum with mostly exJWs gave me the advice to leave it. They said I would be playing by rules of the religion which aren't biblical in the first place and that it would be wise to leave the way open for friends and family members to still be able to deal with me. Some of them were at the same point many years ago and experienced in their own lives that cutting ties doesn't always accomplish what is intended, you can simply live your life away from the religion without saying you quit. It may seem cowardly but many don't fully understand the repercussions from leaving the shunning that is the consequence. Just to be clear, I do not share in any of the JW lifestyle and activities, I am only on the member list, that is all. I have left the whole form of worship and lifestyle behind and won't ever be turning back to these falsehoods and fabrications.

I don't view my past life as a Witness as the wrong pathway, there are many lessons I have learnt from that, important lessons. There is no bitterness in me about my past. My proper pathway is becoming more clear to me, it is just not linked to organized religion and is not a purely biblical pathway. What matters more than most things to me is truth, however far too often tradition trumps truth. That is why I will not link with religion anymore. My path is between me and God, going "home" to him is the destination.

[Prodigal Son]

That is when I realized that my True Father in Heaven has never been apart from me, and that I am indeed welcomed back into his bosom whenever I am ready to make the necessary changes in my thinking.


Hey Prodigal Son and Kraut, also!

With your experiences in the JW movement, you 'both' seem to have a 'common thread', in that, you've been exposed to a great deal of anguish and pain as you have expressed to us, here. It 'all' has to do with the 'pathways' in life that we all choose to go down. In your case, Prodigal Son, you originally revealed that you, basically, didn't have a choice, for you were very young and forced to accept this 'pathway' whether you agreed with it or not. Upon leaving this 'pathway' you later decided to 'turn down that same road', once again, did you not?



Actually, I was quite an 'awake' little kid.... and I will never forget that when I started talking, people were astounded at my level of intelligence for my age. I was in search of basic answers to basic questions that the church neither was able to touch nor wanted to... like why is life so short... why does God allow suffering... why are we here... what is God's purpose for the Earth.

I was born into a Catholic family and it remained that way until one day in religious instruction they decided to start teaching evolution. I objected and it turned into a big melee between my parents and the deacon and a couple of nuns... and that was the end of Catholicism for my family. That's when my mother and I started giving the Witnesses that kept coming to our door a chance to answer those same questions, and sure enough they answered them all right from the Bible without hesitation. It was quite impressive to me as an 8 year old and so I started a Bible study with them and no one forced me to... my father never joined the cult and never started a study... neither did my 2 sisters.

At the time, humanity was on a potential Doomsday timeline and the case that the Witnesses were making was certainly believable.... this was the early 70's and the world was going to hell in a handbasket very rapidly. The case they were making from the Bible for Armageddon in '75 had ALL the Witnesses selling their homes and businesses and preparing for the "end of Satan's wicked system of things".

All the way until the age of 45 I believed with all my heart that the Bible was breathed from the lungs of God and that the Witnesses were correct in restoring the name Jehovah in more than 8,000 places in the Bible including several hundred in the New Testament in spite of the Tetragrammaton appearing NOWHERE in any any of the NT manuscripts. Basically, I went for the Holy Book delusion hook line and sinker.

My first step in awakening to it was a beloved fellow poster on one of my ex-JW boards pointing out that several Bible prophecies were NEVER fulfilled... such as the permanent desolations of Damascus, Egypt and Tyre. For the first time I investigated the Bible with clear vision and saw all its flaws, atrocities and contradictions.

[Beren]

Reading here about your experiences with JWs I see an honest hearts. That`s why religion as a planetary phenomenon is flawed. Because each group of people claims that they own the truth or at least they are appointed by God to translate the truth.

In a way it`s right and OK but if you want The Truth , only God is the truth. Its or his (God is a spirit)word is the truth.
Why?

Because God is. God is I am. Meaning that God can be whatever it chooses to be because of its omnipotence.
God can choose rock to testify about its desires or truths...

But people with lower conscience imagine that they are chosen ones to deliver the truth when in fact everybody is a chosen one if that person allows holy spirit to shape them.

Why pharisees hated Jesus?
Because he had the power and was free of their influence and they couldn`t tolerate or stand that.

Paradoxically they didn`t allow him to have a freedom of choice despite him being an incarnation of God-God in flesh.
So men with little understanding wanted to limit the one who is limitless and was angry when he refused???

hehe sounds like a kindergarten kids... :)

But above all God is good and God is Love. So leave the pharisees and their seed and embrace God and Love.
:)

[kreagle]

'Old Pathways' Still Lead to Home!



Jeremiah 6:16 (KJV)

16 Thus saith the Lord, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls. But they said, We will not walk therein.





http://d2f29brjr0xbt3.cloudfront.net/788_stairspathsRU/11.jpg


I have, earlier, indicated that I was raised on my father's dairy farm in North Alabama. I can still vividly remember the many 'cattle trails', ( pathways), that our cows had blazed throughout the many pastures we had. Each day I would observe how our cows would faithfully 'fall in line' and follow these pathways from the fields towards the dairy barn. They never had to 'question' whether these pathways were accurate, for somehow they seemed to realize,....."if it got me there, yesterday,...it will get me there, today!" We seemed to have owned some pretty 'wise' cows, in my opinion!


Many people don't fully realize that a particular 'pathway' was blazed for humanity to use, right after the Divine act of Calvary. One of the last set of instructions that Jesus left to His followers is found in the Book of Luke, chapter 24, where we find that this 'pathway' is about to be established by them.



Luke 24:49-53 (KJV)

49 And, behold, I send the promise of my Father upon you: but tarry ye in the city of Jerusalem, until ye be endued with power from on high.

50 And he led them out as far as to Bethany, and he lifted up his hands, and blessed them.

51 And it came to pass, while he blessed them, he was parted from them, and carried up into heaven.

52 And they worshipped him, and returned to Jerusalem with great joy:

53 And were continually in the temple, praising and blessing God. Amen.




Any serious student/believer in God's Word who is endeavoring to 'find their way Home' would be 'wise' to recognize the pathway that was blazed by our Christian forefathers and, likewise, faithfully 'fall in line', and follow it to it's conclusion. You can be sure that the 'same pathway' that they originally blazed, themselves, is 'still accurate' and it's destination will, once again, bring it's travelers to the 'same Divine location!' That Divine location that I am referring to, here, is the Church,....the same 'original' Church,....as defined and established by those '120' trail blazers, themselves! ( see Acts 1:15)


Those '120' followers, ( ie. Jesus' eleven remaining disciples, His mother Mary, His 'natural' brothers and sisters, and the rest of His followers),....obeyed Him and went to Jerusalem and tarried there until they were endued with power from on high, the Holy Ghost. It was with this 'nucleus of believers' that He would establish His Church, ( as He earlier promised to Peter), ( see Matthew 16:18). From this 'nucleus of believers', would come It's spokesman,....Peter, himself,.....who would deliver the original inaugural Gospel Message.


After the clamor that ensued from the outpouring of the Holy Ghost on those 'original 120 followers', a serious question was asked by those who earnestly wanted to join the ranks of these believers. Here is the 'question',.....and it's consequent 'answer'!



Acts 2:37-38 (KJV)

37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.




The 'question',......"what shall we do?"


The 'answer',........"Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."


The 'question,...and the.....answer' are still the exact same, today! Absolutely, nothing has changed!


You'll notice that 'when' they received, ( and accepted), the words of the Apostle Peter,.......they were 'added to the church', also!



Acts 2:41-47 (KJV)

41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.

42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.

43 And fear came upon every soul: and many wonders and signs were done by the apostles.

44 And all that believed were together, and had all things common;

45 And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need.

46 And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart,

47 Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.



( Conclusion)


The 'express' design of this post is to simply highlight, ( and identify), the 'original pathway' that was blazed for all future generations by the Apostles, themselves, and as specifically ordained by our Lord Jesus.


That 'pathway' involved,....1) Repentance,......2) Water Baptism in Jesus' name,.......and......3) The infilling of the Holy Ghost. It's with these 'three' specific directives of Peter's message that enables each one of us to 'spiritually be able' to fulfill His.......1) Death,.......2) Burial,......and......3) and Resurrection.


I recently expounded on this, in greater detail, back on post #462, and will supply the link, again, for those who might be interested.

Link: http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?48678-Bible-Topics-and-Questions&p=630987&viewfull=1#post630987


Perhaps there will be those who will stop and pause, for a brief moment, and sincerely ask themselves,......"is 'this' the same message, ( or pathway), that I have been brought up with,...or have I been taught something entirely different from what the Apostles originally taught as doctrine within the original Church?"


A 'pathway' has been firmly established, ( and entrenched), within the Word of God, for 'all' to see, and to follow. At the end of this pathway,...you'll find yourself 'added to the Church', also,......'if' you will only have faith in this Scripturally sound pathway and 'fall in line' with the many who have gone on before you.


Sadly, our opening Scriptural Text declares that there were 'those' who refused to walk in the prescribed 'old paths' that Jeremiah was referring to. While so many 'other's turn down the wise council of our Lord,.....that doesn't mean it has to be 'you!' Wisdom awaits 'those' who will look out over the 'fields of humanity' and acutely recognize a 'pathway' that has been specifically blazed for you.


'If it got 'them' there, yesterday,.......It will get 'you' there, today!',.....my friends!


Your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[kreagle]

If you subract 1260 days from the date Dewey Bruton claims is the center of tribulation (3-22-2013), you come to the date of October 9, 2009, the date Obama got the Nobel Peace Prize! This gets more strange every minute!!!!


SilentFeathers,

Yes, indeed,....it gets more strange, ( and profound), every minute, brother! I am genuinely expecting 'something' to happen around the '22nd' of this month. This 'selection of the Pope' fiasco is sinister in every sense of the word to me, so I won't be surprised in the least when 'all hell breaks loose', literally! I know that I used the word 'cataclysmic' earlier in my PM to you describing what I was expecting around the 22nd, and you personally felt that was a little 'harsh'. I'm almost convinced that whatever 'does' happen on, or about, the 22nd may not be originally perceived to be that 'earthshaking' to begin with,....but may very well prove to be, indeed, cataclysmic in the long run and that we just don't know it yet.

BTW, I have also found another rendition of your 'Daniel's Timeline by Dewey Bruton' video that appears to be the 'exact' audio,.....but with a much more professionally produced video, and graphics, account for this. I think you might equally enjoy this, brother!


GuTb99tBC0c


God Bless,.....your brother, friend, and servant,........kreagle

[SilentFeathers]

If you subract 1260 days from the date Dewey Bruton claims is the center of tribulation (3-22-2013), you come to the date of October 9, 2009, the date Obama got the Nobel Peace Prize! This gets more strange every minute!!!!


SilentFeathers,

Yes, indeed,....it gets more strange, ( and profound), every minute, brother! I am genuinely expecting 'something' to happen around the '22nd' of this month. This 'selection of the Pope' fiasco is sinister in every sense of the word to me, so I won't be surprised in the least when 'all hell breaks loose', literally! I know that I used the word 'cataclysmic' earlier in my PM to you describing what I was expecting around the 22nd, and you personally felt that was a little 'harsh'. I'm almost convinced that whatever 'does' happen on, or about, the 22nd may not be originally perceived to be that 'earthshaking' to begin with,....but may very well prove to be, indeed, cataclysmic in the long run and that we just don't know it yet.

Thanks for the updated version, I didn't know it existed.

I agree something is very likely to happen on or near the 22nd of March, possibly (likely) leading into something down the road quite chaotic. Probably not far down that road either....

Too many "coincidences" are connecting too many things together that with just a quick glance you would never see any connection.

I think that whatever happens on or near the 22nd will be quite clear to those that are watching.....

[kreagle]

He 'Ain't Heavy,.....He's My Brother!



Even while I was still a "Christian" believer I grew very skeptical of Paul, to say the least. Christianity is more Pauline than actually of Christ, but few notice that.


Kraut,

You are certainly not the 'first' to be wary of the Apostle Paul,...nor will you be the 'last', my friend. Let me take a few moments, here, to explain something about Paul that you may have not fully realized.


It seems that Paul's past educational teachings, ( prior to his conversion), combined with him, equally, receiving the Holy Ghost experience, too, placed him on a much higher level, ( spiritually speaking), than most of his fellow 'original' Apostles. This sometimes caused 'confusion' as we see in these simple words by the Apostle Peter, as he was quick to defend his 'brother', here,.....



2 Peter 3:15-17 (KJV)

15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;

16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.




In this Text, Peter candidly admits that 'some things' Paul spoke about were 'hard to understand', in 'all of his epistles'. ( verse 16) This reveals to me that, even Peter, himself, had great difficulty understanding the spiritual depth that Paul went to in his many teachings that were directed towards the Church, and intended for edification of the saints within the Church. Here we find that Peter defended his brother, Paul, for even he fully knew there was a tremendous amount of 'wisdom' behind Paul's teachings and his writings. ( verse 15)


I want you to look at the 'vast' difference between the 'educations' of both these men,....Paul and Peter.



For Paul,.....

The scriptures tell us that Saul was an extremely well-educated man of his day, brought up, ( or taught), 'at the feet of Gamaliel'. ( Acts 22:3) This same Gamaliel was a 'teacher of the Law', noted for his learning, and was president of the Sanhedrin during the reigns of Tiberius, Caligula, and Claudius. Under Gamaliel, Saul would have started out as a 'scribe', in his early years of tutelage, and then would have graduated to the rank of a Pharisee as a young adult. Pharisees were considered the 'lawyers of their day', and as such, knew the Law, inside and out. His account of this is recorded in his Epistle to the Philippians.


Philippians 3:4-6 (KJV)

4 Though I might also have confidence in the flesh. If any other man thinketh that he hath whereof he might trust in the flesh, I more:

5 Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;

6 Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.




You see, Paul, would have received the equivalent of a today's degree from Harvard, or Yale, so-to-speak, in relationship to his privileged educational background, which very few had access to back then.



For Peter,.....

The Scriptures are not so kind in explaining the 'limited educational background' of the Apostle Peter, for It's description of him plainly states he was a 'common fisherman' and even goes a step further with this graphic depiction of his 'intellectual' capability.



Acts 4:13 (KJV)

13 Now when they saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were unlearned and ignorant men, they marvelled; and they took knowledge of them, that they had been with Jesus.




You see, while 'one of them', ( Paul), had the equivalency of a 'Harvard/Yale' degree,.....the 'other one', ( Peter), would have had what we might refer to as a G.E.D., ( General Educational Development).

No wonder Peter,....along with many 'others' had difficulty, at times, in deciphering some of the in-depth teachings, and writings, of the Apostle Paul! God was 'specifically' utilizing that 'in-depth educational background', of Paul's, to teach His people 'how' to conduct themselves within His Church, and the Christian lives that He desired for them to live!

This takes me, specifically, to the next point I would like to reveal about the role of the Apostle Paul, and what you might not know about him. In this point, you will probably begin to recognize 'why' the Apostle Paul is so 'villainized' today by so many individuals.

It seems that the Apostle Paul would become 'saddled' with a solemn responsibility as he embarked upon his ministry, and calling, from our Lord. This 'responsibility' was going to cause a great deal of 'uncomfortable' moments for him throughout the rest of his life, and even the Lord, Himself, said as much when He candidly revealed this to Ananias.



Acts 9:13-16 (KJV)

13 Then Ananias answered, Lord, I have heard by many of this man, how much evil he hath done to thy saints at Jerusalem:

14 And here he hath authority from the chief priests to bind all that call on thy name.

15 But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel:

16 For I will shew him how great things he must suffer for my name's sake.



Here, we can clearly see that Paul not only suffered ridicule, rejection, and persecution, during his 'earthly' mission while he was alive,.....but he 'still',...today,....suffers the 'same' level, ( if not 'greater level'), of ridicule, rejection, and persecution from 'those' who still cannot understand, ( or appreciate), his role that God called him to perform.

Quite frankly, Paul was specifically called upon, ( by the Lord, Himself), to 'police',...set in motion,.....set the by-laws,....solve early Christian disputes,.....reprove and rebuke, when necessary,....etc,...etc,...etc,...etc! Paul was the 'bad guy',...if you please. He was specifically the 'one' the early Church looked to, in their infancy, to establish their 'by-laws' of exactly how they should conduct themselves. The 'early Church' was nothing more than a large group of 'New-Born' Christian Babies and in great need of a 'seasoned Spiritual leader' to help them establish their 'by-laws',....the 'dos and the don'ts',...if you will. Paul was that man,....specifically chosen by God, himself,....on that road to Damascus,....for this moment in time.

The Lord specifically needed a man who was thoroughly 'educated' in all the Jewish 'laws' and understanding, and Paul was that man! The Lord specifically needed a man who was 'filled with His Spirit' to carry out this burdensome, tedious task, and Paul, once again, was that man!

No wonder Paul was 'villainized',....then,....and today, also! His message to the 'early' Church was one that often 'went against the fleshly desires' of the hearer of such message! No one, ( back 'then'), wanted to restrain their 'fleshly desires',....nor do they today, either,.....so consequently, Paul's directives are just as unpopular today as the day they were originally penned to begin with!

Additionally, it should be specifically stated that absolutely no one will ever be able to fully understand, ( or appreciate), what the Apostle Paul endeavored to do for the 'early Church',......UNTIL,.....they have 'equally' been filled with the Holy Ghost,....so spiritual enlightenment can truly reveal to them just how important Paul's message was then,....and now!

The 'message' of the Apostle Paul came with a lot of 'baggage' that most people don't want to carry around, ( and most 'refuse' to carry!)

That 'extra weight' is just simply more that 'most' can bear,....so they simply don't try to!

Paul's message seems to be 'too heavy' for most individuals/believers to include, ( or carry), around with them, in their everyday lives.

Paul's message,....'heavy' as it may have seemed,....has our Lord's approval, and anointing, stamped all over it, my dear friends!


The 'Holy Ghost' experience will make that 'baggage', ( and all that weight), go away!



He 'Ain't Heavy,......He's My Brother!,......and I, like Peter, am my brother's keeper! That's why, like Peter,...I have no problem defending, ( and taking up for), my brother!


Your brother, friend, and servant, too!,.........kreagle

[Fred Steeves]

You see, while 'one of them', ( Paul), had the equivalency of a 'Harvard/Yale' degree,.....the 'other one', ( Peter), would have had what we might refer to as a G.E.D., ( General Educational Development).


Being a high school dropout myself (with only a GED), and having been a commercial fisherman amongst many other common man endeavors, I'll listen any day to what the fisherman has to say about life, over the smug Ivy League white shoe boy.

The fisherman would suggest something common sense and simple like: "Work hard, be honest, and treat people with respect".

The Ivy Leaguer, with no real life experience, would suggest something complex that would come across as: "Blah blah blah blah blah blah blah". (LOL)

[Prodigal Son]

The problem with "Paul" is that the epistles that are attributed to him are not consistently the same style and are filled with contradictions.

Case in point: In one breath, he says women should keep their mouths shut in Church and should especially not pray out loud. In another breath he says women should wear a head covering while teaching or praying. And then at the end of several epistles he praises the many different women that were either heads of their churches or taking leadership roles in spreading the "good news". However, according to him in Colossians 1:23, the good news had already been spread far and wide, to "every creature under heaven" before Christ even came along. He speaks of a Cosmic Christ, never once referring to the actual life of Jesus, as if he never knew it existed. He hated the Torah, claimed it was dictated by "angels', and hated the tyrannical Jehovah. He was plagued with physical problems, such as Epilepsy and was probably a closet homosexual. He was a Gnostic, and I am not entirely sure that he had bad intentions, because the poor guy's writings were tampered with for centuries after he died.

[kreagle]

You see, while 'one of them', ( Paul), had the equivalency of a 'Harvard/Yale' degree,.....the 'other one', ( Peter), would have had what we might refer to as a G.E.D., ( General Educational Development).


Being a high school dropout myself (with only a GED), and having been a commercial fisherman amongst many other common man endeavors, I'll listen any day to what the fisherman has to say about life, over the smug Ivy League white shoe boy.

The fisherman would suggest something common sense and simple like: "Work hard, be honest, and treat people with respect".

The Ivy Leaguer, with no real life experience, would suggest something complex that would come across as: "Blah blah blah blah blah blah blah". (LOL)


Hey Fred,

I can certainly agree with your premise that siding with the one with the 'common sense' over the 'Ivy Leaguer' is more preferable. Common sense is a precious commodity that is woefully absent in much of our society, today, and few people seem to have it. I've often seen that the 'average Joe' has a much better grip on 'common sense', as you have indicated, and much more capable of making 'sensible' decisions than those who have exceeded him in the classroom.


My reason for highlighting the vast differences between Paul and Peter's educational backgrounds was to illustrate 'why' God specifically chose Paul for the task He had for him. God will, indeed, use our 'abilities' if we will avail ourselves to Him, and be willing vessels at His disposal. His 'educational background',....combined with his 'Spirit-filled' life,.....made him a 'perfect' candidate to... "bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel:" ( Acts 9:15), and to guide the 'early' Church through It's infancy by establishing It's by-laws.

Certainly, don't take my post as a 'slap in the face' to the Apostle Peter, for he is one of my 'favorites' concerning great men in the Bible. Peter had a 'rare', special, quality about him that prodded him to venture into 'divine places' that the other disciples either 'failed to see',....or were simply unwilling to go there. As the twelve disciples were queried by the Master, Peter was the 'only' disciple who, 'originally', fully recognized Jesus' Divine Nature, over His Human origin, ( Matthew 16:13-19) Peter's keen observance, here, equally earned him the privilege to be the 'spokesman', or 'keynote' speaker, on the Day of Pentecost, where he personally delivered the inaugural Gospel Message, and It's 'message of salvation',....as the Lord specifically 'tossed him the keys' to open this event for all of mankind. ( Acts 2:14-31) Once again, when all twelve of them saw Jesus approaching the boat in the midst of a raging storm, Peter was the 'only' disciple who had the courage, ( and faith), to 'get out of the boat' and 'walk' on water towards the Lord. ( Matthew 14:22-31)


Yes, indeed, Peter may have been a 'commoner' in the eyes of humanity,....but he truly had the 'special eye of the Lord' upon him and was far from 'common' to Him,....but a rather 'special' individual in which He would use for His glory!


God Bless,.......your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[kreagle]

The problem with "Paul" is that the epistles that are attributed to him are not consistently the same style and are filled with contradictions.


Brother,

The 'reason' Paul's style seems to be altered in his various Epistles is simply because he was addressing 'different needs',....for....'different people',.....at......'different locations'. What 'message' one particular group needed often was 'totally different' from what another group needed, thus we see the necessity to 'change spiritual gears' and address the particular need, accordingly. If Paul's 'style' suggests that 'someone entirely different' was writing a particular Epistle, then, quite frankly, he was, ( spiritually speaking),...'someone entirely different',...FOR THEM,...in their particular time of need. Mind you, this is not to 'suggest' that Paul casually 'altered' his message for certain individuals, for he always stayed, consistently, within the guidelines of the Gospel Message in a very dogmatic manner! ( see Galatians 1:1-9). Paul's 'style' was to simply 'get on whatever level it took' in order to win someone to Christ, as we clearly see in his writings, here,.....



1 Corinthians 9:16-23 (KJV)

16 For though I preach the gospel, I have nothing to glory of: for necessity is laid upon me; yea, woe is unto me, if I preach not the gospel!

17 For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me.

18 What is my reward then? Verily that, when I preach the gospel, I may make the gospel of Christ without charge, that I abuse not my power in the gospel.

19 For though I be free from all men, yet have I made myself servant unto all, that I might gain the more.

20 And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law;

21 To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law.

22 To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.

23 And this I do for the gospel's sake, that I might be partaker thereof with you.



Verses 22 and 23, above, sums up 'why' the Apostle Paul's 'style' seemed to come from 'seperate individuals', for he literally revealed the 'dual' role he was willing to employ in order to claim another soul to Christ!,......"I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some. And this I do for the gospel's sake, that I might be partaker thereof with you."


Paul's 'specialty' was 'Church building,...and...Church maintenance', for this is specifically what Paul was qualified to do, with his 'vast educational background' that was equally interwoven with the Holy Ghost within him.


As far as your charge of 'contradictions' I will, once again, refer to my original post to Kraut, concerning this. Brother, I cannot possibly underscore, enough, the fact that it's going to require being 'filled with the Holy Ghost',....( spiritually 'Born Again' of the water and the Spirit),....in order for you, ( or anyone else), to be able to spiritually grasp the in-depth teachings/writings of the Apostle Paul. Then, only, will you see for yourself!



1 Corinthians 2:13-14 (KJV)

13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.




Love, Peace, and God Bless,......your brother, friend, and servant,.....kreagle

[kreagle]

Reading Someone Else's Mail!!!

(....NOT Intended For You!!!)




http://www.1to1marketing-inc.com/Images/PURLs/reading_mail.jpg


While most of us know that it's a Federal Offense to 'willfully' open, ( and read), someone else's mail in the U.S.,...there's another set of 'letters' , ( 'Spiritual Mail'), that has been 'opened and read' by many, many, individuals who were not 'originally' intended to receive such 'letters!'


I am referring to the 'Epistles of Paul', ( letters to the many churches), that he specifically helped to establish, and then nurture, into existence. As each one of these 'churches' was established, Paul would personally visit them, ( when he could), and send them 'letters' of encouragement, ( and instructions), in his absence. It's through these many letters, ( the 'Epistles'), that we are able to get a 'glimpse' into what was transpiring during the 'early' years, ( and developmental stages), of each one of these precious works of God.


Of the 27 Books of the New Testament, Paul explicitly wrote 13 of them, and commonly is given credit for also writing the Book of Hebrews, bringing that total to 14 of the 27 Books. These Books are as follows,....




Romans
1 Corinthians
2 Corinthians
Galatians
Ephesians
Philippians
Colossians
1 Thessalonians
2 Thessalonians
1 Timothy
2 Timothy
Titus
Philemon
Hebrews


As stated, the first 13 on this list are the 'Epistles', ( or letters), that I have been referring to, and were expressly written to the churches Paul helped establish in,...Rome, Corinth, Galatia, Ephesus, Philip-pi, Colossi,...and Thessalonica. In addition to these 'churches' , the remaining 'letters' were expressly sent to Timothy, Titus, and Philemon. In 'each' one of these cases these many 'letters' were intended for 'already established members of the early Church', ( and 'fellow brethren'), who had already been 'Born Again' of the water and the Spirit, and had earlier been obedient, themselves, to the Gospel Message Peter preached in Acts 2:38, when the Church was 'originally' established. To 'read their mail', ( letters), is to read something that was not 'originally' intended for anyone, but them,......but, guess what?,.....that's perfectly alright with God for you to do so, my dear friends!


The only problem with this is that when one reads the 'Church's mail',....PRIOR....to themselves, equally, being 'Born Again' of the water and of the Spirit, ( or receiving the Holy Ghost), it exposes them to the reality that they are 'not spiritually capable to understand what they are reading' in the first place! This is a very 'common' occurrence and leaves a great deal of 'well meaning' individuals completely frustrated as they endeavor to 'spiritually' understand what the contents of these 'Epistles of Paul' was relating to His Church, and Christian 'fellow' laborers.

Remember, friends,.....spiritual understanding 'requires' a 'Spiritual-Infilling, first!'



1 Corinthians 2:14 (KJV)

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.



Your 'understanding' will, indeed, make a 'dramatic turn' after you've been filled with His Spirit.



Acts 1:8 (KJV)

8 But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you:,.......


And,....


John 16:13(KJV)

13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth:,......





A 'Spirit-filled' experience will fully enable you to, finally, be able to read the 'letters', ( Epistles), that were formerly 'never intended for you!'


And,....THEN.....my dear friends,.....you won't be 'Reading Someone Else's Mail',.....anymore!




You'll be reading 'your own!'
http://oregonbookoffaith.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/share-3.jpg



With 'Great Love' for 'all',.......your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[kreagle]

Below the 'Surface' Where the Real Fruit Lies!


( '9 fruitful reasons' to yearn for the Holy Ghost experience!)




Galatians 5:22-23 (KJV)

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.





http://forum.edoors.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=428226&d=1359546105


Most things in life that we derive the most benefits from require 'peeling back the exterior' in order to reveal, ( and consume), the 'real fruit!' Unless this 'principle' is fully realized and performed, the 'fruit' goes undetected and the would-be consumer is resigned to never realizing it's sweet ingredients and joyful experience designed by God for us.


Such is the 'Holy Ghost' experience, ( the 'Real Fruit' of our lives),....IF.....we will only 'peel back' the callused layers of 'unbelief,...doubt,...fleshly carnal desires,...and ridicule from our fellow friends/relatives.'


'Unbelief and Doubt' - 'Both' of these are closely related to one another, with 'unbelief' being a 'full-scaled version',....and 'doubt' being a 'scaled-down version'. However,...'either of these' will prohibit you from getting down to the 'Real Fruit', and experiencing the infilling of God's Spirit, the Holy Ghost!


Hebrews 11:6 (KJV)

6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.




'Fleshly Carnal Desires' - This is the #1 Enemy that will prohibit you from being able to 'spiritually' enjoy the 'Real Fruit' experience of the Holy Ghost. The desire to 'blend in with society',.....instead of.....'separating oneself to, ( and for), God's service' will firmly keep that 'callused layer' in place and between you and the sweet ingredients of a Spirit-filled life! Somewhere along the line you're going to have to decide whether you want to 'peel back this callused layer' of your 'fleshly carnal desires', and claim the 'Real Fruit' that is yours, for the taking,...or not. 'Most' don't,...quite simply,....but a 'few' do! The 'choice' is entirely up to you!



Romans 8:4-10 (KJV)

4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.

6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.

7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.




'Ridicule From Our Fellow Friends/Relatives' - No one likes persecution,... but this pesky, ( and worrisome), inclusion that will surely come your way, often 'seals the fate' of whether one attempts to peel back,...find....and possess the 'Real Fruit' we've been referring to, here, or whether you will allow yourself to be 'spiritually victimized' and denied the most 'fruitful experience known to mankind!' Unfortunately, previous alliances with friends/relatives often suffer divisions that will need to be overcome, for they will more than likely not share your 'enthusiasm', ( or desire), to venture into a life of being 'Spirit-filled' with you. You're going to be required, in most cases, to venture into this 'spiritual' area by yourself,....and most of the time,...without the support of those friends and relatives!



Luke 12:52-53 (KJV)

52 For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three.

53 The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, and the daughter against the mother; the mother in law against her daughter in law, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.




( Conclusion)


The desire to peel fruit, ( the 'spiritual' variety), is usually a path that is not very well traveled, and for all of the reasons that have been specifically identified, above.

But,....with a 'little' faith,....perseverance,....and determination,...there's a 'very sweet reward' in store for you!


With Love,....your brother, friend, and servant,.....kreagle

[kreagle]

Is there any of you expecting, ( or perhaps dreading), that something monumental is going to occur relating Obama's visit to Israel?



http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/j/MSNBC/Components/Slideshows/_production/gss-130320-obama-mideast/gss-130320-obama-mideast-07.grid-5x2.jpg


Opinions anyone?

[kreagle]

Sorry for my 'absence' of late, my brothers and sisters. I've been battling the 'flu' for the last several days. Hope to be back in the swing of things within a few days. Any 'kind' thoughts and prayers would be greatly appreciated.



http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q128/EglaV/Sick_in_Bed.jpg


With great love, always,........your brother, friend, and servant,.........kreagle

[humanalien]

Why do you think that God found it necessary to
mention Giants in Genesis?

Gen 6:4 states:

There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men, and they bore children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

What does mentioning giants, have to do with anything?

Also. What are your views on the writings of Enoch?

Enoch goes into a little more detail about giants.

[Kraut]

Sorry for my 'absence' of late, my brothers and sisters. I've been battling the 'flu' for the last several days. Hope to be back in the swing of things within a few days. Any 'kind' thoughts and prayers would be greatly appreciated.

With great love, always,........your brother, friend, and servant,.........kreagle

Best wishes, get well quickly! :wave:

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Hello kreagle and friends. I just wanted to chime in with a quick thought for the day:

"The Nature of God is not Important to us."

Some may picture God as an individual, a human-figure, dressed in a long white smock with a long white beard, sitting in a cloud. If that's your idea, then great. It doesn't matter. Some may think of him as a her, or an it. Or a bright light at the centre of the cosmos. Or as an all-pervasive spiritual energy, in everything, of everything, throughout the space-time continuum. But it doesn't matter.

God, as a power, as a presence, whatever he, her, it, maybe, will not mind how we perceive him, her, or it, because our tiny three-dimensional brains couldn't comprehend his ultimate nature anyway.

The only thing that is important is our connection to God. Our knowing of God's wisdom, and his infinite love and patience for us, and all things. The only important thing is the knowledge that God is in each and every one of us - that we are immortal spirits that came from him, and will one day return.

(All the best kreagle my friend, hope you feel better soon!)

[Akasha]

aa5FDATiErk

[kreagle]

Why do you think that God found it necessary to
mention Giants in Genesis?

Gen 6:4 states:

There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men, and they bore children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

What does mentioning giants, have to do with anything?

Also. What are your views on the writings of Enoch?

Enoch goes into a little more detail about giants.


humanalien,

Sorry for my delay in responding to your question, but I'm just now getting to the point where I feel like posting again. Thanks to 'everyone' for your kind responses and well wishes during my time of sickness.


Genesis 6:4-9 (KJV)

4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

5 And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

6 And it repented the Lord that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

7 And the Lord said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord.

9 These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.




When taken in context with the passage of scripture in Genesis chapter 6, the 'giant' issue is simply pointing out what type of conditions were existing on the earth at this time, and what drove God to arrive at His Divine decision to 'wipe the earth' from this degradation that had completely contaminated His creation. The 'wording' of Genesis 6:4, clearly shows that this 'offspring' that was created from the 'sons of God',......and.....the 'daughters of men' was not according to His design. These 'sons of God' were part of the 'fallen angels' who had been earlier cast out of Heaven, ( along with Lucifer), for their rebellion against God. It seems that Satan's goal was to 'further pollute' God's creation with a 'hybrid-type' race, which would make their offspring a combination of satanic/woman generated,....instead of the 'pure' man/woman offspring that was originally ordained by God for His creation. You'll notice that this was another 'major factor' in what caused God to choose Noah and his family to 'repopulate the world' with. Notice the wording in verse 9,.......



These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.




Certainly, God wanted a 'pure' bloodline, ( perfect in his generations), to repopulate the world with, in addition to fact that 'Noah walked with God',....so with 'both' of these divine ingredients, Noah was a perfect candidate for God to select to accomplish His will, here.



Also. What are your views on the writings of Enoch?



I have only read certain passages from the Book of Enoch. I realize that Jude made reference to a prophecy by Enoch in Jude 1:14, which would mean that he, himself, ( Jude), would have had to have earlier read some of the writings of Enoch in order to know this information in the first place. I personally don't see any reason to completely avoid the writings of Enoch, ( as some scholars do), but I do highly admonish that one needs to 'follow the leading of His Spirit' in properly deciphering what is correct and to be believed, or not. As always, a 'spirit-filled' life is always going to be a prerequisite to guide the believer in the right direction to go in.


Your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

Hello kreagle and friends. I just wanted to chime in with a quick thought for the day:

"The Nature of God is not Important to us."

Some may picture God as an individual, a human-figure, dressed in a long white smock with a long white beard, sitting in a cloud. If that's your idea, then great. It doesn't matter. Some may think of him as a her, or an it. Or a bright light at the centre of the cosmos. Or as an all-pervasive spiritual energy, in everything, of everything, throughout the space-time continuum. But it doesn't matter.

God, as a power, as a presence, whatever he, her, it, maybe, will not mind how we perceive him, her, or it, because our tiny three-dimensional brains couldn't comprehend his ultimate nature anyway.

The only thing that is important is our connection to God. Our knowing of God's wisdom, and his infinite love and patience for us, and all things. The only important thing is the knowledge that God is in each and every one of us - that we are immortal spirits that came from him, and will one day return.

(All the best kreagle my friend, hope you feel better soon!)



StarMariner,


Great to hear from you, again, my dear friend and brother!


I completely agree with your premise regarding our 'connection to God', my dear friend. I do, however, have a disagreement over your statement that,......."The Nature of God is not Important to us."


It's only through His 'Nature' that we are able to get an understanding of His Character and Divine Qualities so that we might be able to attempt to 'replicate them in our own lives'. As we endeavor to live our lives, ( once we have made the decision to obey His Word, and to be 'Born-again of the water and the Spirit'), we must have His Divine Example to equally guide us into the right direction of His Spirit's Will for our lives.


For example,.....notice these directives from our God to us in this following passage,.....



Hebrews 12:14-15 (KJV)

14 Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:

15 Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;




In this passage from Hebrews, we can literally see 'three' of God's Natures, here. The 'peace of God',.....'holiness of God',.......and the.......'grace of God' , are all vital character qualities that Paul is admonishing the New Testament believer to equally incorporate into their own Christian lives through a 'Spirit-filled' life with God.


Now,......I fully realize that it's the 'connection' that makes the ultimate difference! However, ( as you have also pointed out), the 'vast indecisiveness' over who God actually is to begin with, plays a major role in why this problem exists!



God, as a power, as a presence, whatever he, her, it, maybe, will not mind how we perceive him, her, or it, because our tiny three-dimensional brains couldn't comprehend his ultimate nature anyway.



Completely interwoven into the quote you have made here, StarMariner, is exactly why so many cannot comprehend the 'Nature of God' which ultimately plays right into whether they make a 'true connection' with God at a later date!


The 'questions' that run through so many minds is, ( as you have alluded to),....."is God a power,......is God a presence,.......is God even a He,......or is God a She,......is God an 'it',........or is God a 'maybe',......or does God even mind how we perceive him,...or her,....or it, to begin with?"


The 'answer' to this question is still the same as it has always been!



John 8:23-25 (KJV)

23 And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.

24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

25 Then said they unto him, Who art thou? And Jesus saith unto them, Even the same that I said unto you from the beginning




because our tiny three-dimensional brains couldn't comprehend his ultimate nature anyway.



You're exactly right, brother,.....and that's exactly 'why' I clearly saw that I, too, needed to be 'Born-Again of the water and the Spirit' as Jesus spoke about to Nicodemus in John, chapter 3, verses 1-7. His Spirit revealed to me what my brain couldn't,.....and never would be able to show me!

Complete obedience to God's Word will 'clear up your spiritual vision', ( as it did mine), where you won't be plagued with the many misconceptions that you have alluded to, here. No longer will you have to wonder 'if' He exists,.....for you will know for sure. There will no longer be a 'maybe',....or.....question his 'gender', for you will be convinced in every sense of the word.


He is 'One' Lord,......who operated as Jehovah in the Old Testament,......manifested Himself in flesh in the New Testament,......became the 'Sacrificial Lamb' at Calvary,.....shed 'His Blood' to cover our sins with,.....Resurrected Himself and defeated Death and Hell for those who would believe on Him,.......and made Himself available to 'all' as the Holy Ghost, God's indwelling Spirit, to those who complete the 'Born-Again' cycle.

His name is Jesus Christ!,.......and, yes, no 3D dimensional human mind can ever reveal this to you,......but His Spirit surely can and will, my dear friend!


Your brother, friend, and servant,.........kreagle

[kreagle]

Victory in the Vacant Tomb!



http://www.fpcwichita.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/easter_empty_tomb.jpg



Matthew 28:6 (KJV)

6 He is not here: for he is risen, as he said. Come, see the place where the Lord lay.



Happy Easter to 'all',......your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

I completely agree with your premise regarding our 'connection to God', my dear friend. I do, however, have a disagreement over your statement that,......."The Nature of God is not Important to us."


It's only through His 'Nature' that we are able to get an understanding of His Character and Divine Qualities so that we might be able to attempt to 'replicate them in our own lives'. As we endeavor to live our lives, ( once we have made the decision to obey His Word, and to be 'Born-again of the water and the Spirit'), we must have His Divine Example to equally guide us into the right direction of His Spirit's Will for our lives.

Hey mate, great response, and I follow it and agree with it. But what I was trying to get across wasn't worded very well. What I meant was, precisely who/what isn't important - it's not as important to know or understand what God is as it is to have faith in his presence, power and reality.

A simple analogy is the Sun. You know it's there, you see it's light, and you can feel the warmth against your skin, but to experience this, and know this, you do not need to know the science of what's happening - the precise nature of the physics involved etc. (note: I am not associating God with the Sun here).

So many today 'dismiss' God on the mere premise that because He cannot be perceived rationally, scientifically, then he cannot exist. That's the linear 3-dimensional brain talking again. This is the "nature" of God, in regards to trying to tangibly pigeon-hole what he is, that I was talking about, and a stumbling block for many. They need to understand that they don't need to worry about it. Open up the heart, and the spirit and - as you point out - all will become clear.

[kreagle]

A simple analogy is the Sun. You know it's there, you see it's light, and you can feel the warmth against your skin, but to experience this, and know this, you do not need to know the science of what's happening - the precise nature of the physics involved etc. (note: I am not associating God with the Sun here).

So many today 'dismiss' God on the mere premise that because He cannot be perceived rationally, scientifically, then he cannot exist. That's the linear 3-dimensional brain talking again. This is the "nature" of God, in regards to trying to tangibly pigeon-hole what he is, that I was talking about, and a stumbling block for many. They need to understand that they don't need to worry about it. Open up the heart, and the spirit and - as you point out - all will become clear.

Very good 'analogy', brother, regarding the 'feeling of the sun's warmth', etc. The only thing I might add is actually what you are referring to, without actually saying the 'keyword', and that's where those who stumble over this fail to deploy their 'faith!'



Hebrews 11:6 (KJV)

6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.




To 'feel' the glowing warmth of God's boundless love should 'spiritually' activate the faith that is within each one of us as we fully acknowledge,......."there IS an ACTUAL GOD out there, somewhere!"


With great love and admiration,.....your brother, friend, and servant,....kreagle

[blufire]

Victory in the Vacant Tomb!


Matthew 28:6 (KJV)

6 He is not here: for he is risen, as he said. Come, see the place where the Lord lay.


Happy Easter to 'all',......your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle



Hello kreagle,

I was wondering what your thoughts are on the true origins and meaning of the Christian Holiday Easter?

[Revere]

Kreagel,

Happy Easter my friend and when you have a chance, after writing a response to the Easter question I have one for you. During Easter Diner we were playing with the idea of “What is Satan’s motivation”. We came to the general conclusion that it must be a fundamental Hate against God and man so strong that he does not care if he is destined to lose. He knows God will triumph in the end but he does not care as long as he takes as many as possible down with him. But, I was curious if you had any thoughts on this minor question. Keep up the good work and I hope those who post here will continue to keep an open heart and mind. This really is not complicated stuff; all it takes is faith as true and simple as a child an then God will help you with the rest.

Peace,
Revere

[kreagle]

Victory in the Vacant Tomb!


Matthew 28:6 (KJV)

6 He is not here: for he is risen, as he said. Come, see the place where the Lord lay.


Happy Easter to 'all',......your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle



Hello kreagle,

I was wondering what your thoughts are on the true origins and meaning of the Christian Holiday Easter?


Hey blufire,


My thoughts on the true origins and meaning of the Christian Holiday, Easter, actually mirror my feelings on Christmas as well. They both have their Pagan origins,.....are completely over commercialized,.....and are heavily flavored by their original Catholic roots and sponsorship. However, I find myself in full support of both of these 'Christian' holidays, in that I have always celebrated them for what they really should mean. Even though the 'dates' on both of these events are in error, from a Christian perspective, I am grateful that humanity still has a specific time that we can set aside to honor/celebrate His 'birth', ( at Christmas),....and His 'resurrection' , ( at Easter).

I am always hopeful that as these 'holidays' occur that there will be 'select few' that will sincerely focus open the 'meaning of the occasion' and make a meaningful attempt to alter their respective lives to finally incorporate Him into their lives!



https://mail-attachment.googleusercontent.com/attachment/u/0/?saduie=AG9B_P9W7oA4MhEdzbMkYoLtoLPF&attid=0.1&disp=emb&view=att&th=13dc9610d6b8ad5c


God Bless, my dear friend,.......your brother, and servant,.......kreagle

[kreagle]

Kreagel,

Happy Easter my friend and when you have a chance, after writing a response to the Easter question I have one for you. During Easter Diner we were playing with the idea of “What is Satan’s motivation”. We came to the general conclusion that it must be a fundamental Hate against God and man so strong that he does not care if he is destined to lose. He knows God will triumph in the end but he does not care as long as he takes as many as possible down with him. But, I was curious if you had any thoughts on this minor question. Keep up the good work and I hope those who post here will continue to keep an open heart and mind. This really is not complicated stuff; all it takes is faith as true and simple as a child an then God will help you with the rest.

Peace,
Revere


“What is Satan’s motivation”?

Revere,

What an interesting and profound question, my dear brother! The more I look, ( and reflect), upon it's magnitude, I'm convinced that the real answer to this question has to deal with the overall 'insanity of sin' to begin with! Pride over one's 'net worth' is often grossly overrated to the point of causing the victim of such vanity to think more highly of themselves than they should. Such was the case for Lucifer as we see in this following passage of scripture. This satanic quagmire of pride/vanity will swallow it's victim every time!


Isaiah 14:12-15 (KJV)

12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.



Notice the multitude of 'I Will's' employed by Lucifer as Pride/Vanity had completely overtaken him. I'm reminded of the old statement by Lord Acton in 1887,......"Power corrupts,....and absolute power corrupts absolutely!" Only God can handle 'absolute power' and knows it's proper usage. How many times have we all seen the catastrophic results that occur when there are those, like Lucifer, who attempt to sit at the Seat of Authority of these controls?

My 'general conclusion' to your question pretty much mirrors what you and your family has surmised. Additionally, I'm not so sure that Satan doesn't think that he can still overcome God, somehow, and win! ( ie. 'Satanic Motivation Gone Wild!') Hence,.....the 'insanity of Sin', my dear friend! If anything else,....each time Satan is successful in tearing down another person's walk with God,....he adds these 'victims' to his perceived 'winning total'. He was able to 'add' King Saul,.....King Solomon,.....Judas Iscariot,.....and 'others' to his growing list, and we would all be foolish to think that he doesn't have us targeted, also.


Just 'another reason', ( out of many), why today's believer must be 'filled with His Spirit', in an effort to 'stay off of Satan's list!'



1 John 4:4 (KJV)

4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.




God Bless, always!,.....your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[Revere]

Kregal,

Nice additions to the Motivation of Satan subject! I want to point out a wondrous out come every time Satan thinks he won. God's incredible Grace often is magnified in what seems to be a loss. It's like a checkmate to his move of check. In our weakness and perceived loss God is often magnified and he is there working beyond our comprehension!

Examples:
30 pieces of silver paid to betray Jesus ends up buying a cemetery
to bury the poor.
Jesus’ death offers the new covenant and salvation of mankind.
Peter’s denial leads to Peter’s commitment to "feed His sheep"
The persecution of the disciples ended up sensationalizing their ministry
and increasing those that heard and were saved
Job got double his loss for his trouble.


And many many more!( add more Please)

God is wondrous! Never stop being awed because these types of outcomes are with us now, every day in our own lives. We have to look and that is often hard for us through the pain we perceive. We serve a living dynamic loving God.

John 16:33
"I have told you these things, so that in me you may have peace. In this world you will have trouble. But take heart! I have overcome the world."

John 14:27
Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid.

Peace,
Revere

[kreagle]

Examples:
30 pieces of silver paid to betray Jesus ends up buying a cemetery
to bury the poor.
Jesus’ death offers the new covenant and salvation of mankind.
Peter’s denial leads to Peter’s commitment to "feed His sheep"
The persecution of the disciples ended up sensationalizing their ministry
and increasing those that heard and were saved
Job got double his loss for his trouble.


And many many more!( add more Please)




Revere,

You are so correct, brother, in reference to God's mission flourishing in the face of Satan's perceived victories. That's exactly why I used that specific word when I made this former statement.


....each time Satan is successful in tearing down another person's walk with God,....he adds these 'victims' to his perceived 'winning total'.


The greatest example that we can list here, concerning a perceived victory of Satan, would have to be the moment when Jesus 'gave up the ghost' and bowed His head in death. Of course, Satan, ( and his minions), were completely taken by surprise by what was occurring before their very eyes. They had absolutely no idea that 'death, hell, and the grave' was being defeated due to this Divine act by God. Can you imagine the 'satanic party' that ensued for 3 days,.....as they thought that they had 'finally' defeated Him, once and for all? Can you imagine the look on their faces when their party came to a screeching halt on that third day, when it was discovered that the 'Tomb was empty?' What extreme measures would Satan have employed to 'keep Jesus off of the Cross' if he had only known what was transpiring and being accomplished at Calvary? Who would have thought that His death, and the draining of the Blood from His Body, would have brought such an overwhelming victory for mankind? Satan was completely blindsided!


His....Death,.....Burial,....and...Resurrection made it 'all' possible for you,..I,...and all of mankind! We, too, can 'follow in His footsteps',.....all the way to Heaven,....by 'spiritually' fulfilling our own 'death, burial, and resurrection', ( as indicated by my signature), and preached so eloquently by the Apostle Peter, on the Day of Pentecost.

[kreagle]

'Spiritually' Thinking,.....'Outside of the Box!'



http://all4women.co.za/thumbnail.php?file=box_447206780.jpg&size=article_large


As our picture, ( above), would seem to suggest, there are some who seem to never be able to emerge and 'think outside of the box' on the grand scale of life itself. Such is certainly the case, ( spiritually speaking), regarding mankind's overall concept of God, who He is, and exactly what He is capable of doing for us in life.


There are three words that exclusively belong to God which divinely define His limitless abilities and those words are as follows,.....


1) - Omnipotent: meaning Almighty, having unlimited, infinite authority and power.

2) - Omnipresent: meaning fully present everywhere at the same time

3) - Omniscient: having complete awareness, understanding, or unlimited knowledge; perceiving all things.


To acknowledge, ( and accept), these attributes of God, and resigning oneself to His complete control, is a conscience indicator that you are 'beginning' to emerge from the box, yourself, from a 'spiritual standpoint'.


While there are 'many' who are convinced that today's 'dedicated Christian' is the one who has 'boxed themselves in',....there still remains the 'select few' who opt for the 'old-fashioned deployment of faith' and submit themselves to the Faithful One, Himself.


God's indwelling Spirit, ( the Holy Ghost), fully enables today's dedicated Christian to 'think outside of the box' in ways that 'others' can only imagine. It will cause your mind and soul to soar in ways that totally escapes the human intellect, my friends. Paul informs us, here, that we are 'all' equipped with enough 'faith' to bring about this 'transformation of our mind', if we will only make ourselves available to God.



Romans 12:1-3 (KJV)

12 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.

2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.





Don't let 'this world' ......keep you 'boxed in', my dear friends!

If God can do 'this' with a caterpillar,........
http://teacher.scholastic.com/activities/explorations/bug/images/butterfly.jpg


Just imagine what He can do with YOU,.....when you finally 'emerge from your box!'



Your brother, friend, and servant,........kreagle

[kreagle]

'EVERYONE',....Asks,....Seeks,....and Knocks



https://teshcom.s3.amazonaws.com/content/articles/scammers-webbg.jpg

(.....But on 'whose' Door?)



Matthew 7:7-11 (KJV)

7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:

8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.

9 Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone?

10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent?

11 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him?





Question: Who 'really' resides at the Door you are knocking on?


Our Heavenly Father 'hears' every single question we 'ask',.....recognizes every direction that we 'seek',.....and....acknowledges every 'knock' that we register,...regardless to whether it was specifically intended 'for Him',....or not!


Where we 'direct' our,....asking,.....seeking,.....and knocking,.....fully indicates 'who' we really rely on, and are most confident in to produce the answers, ( and directions), for the maladies that we face in this life we live.


It seems that certain Israelites were guilty of 'knocking' on the door of 'other gods',....which caused the Prophet, Isaiah, to issue forth this 'timely' warning to them.



Isaiah 30:1-3 (KJV)

30 Woe to the rebellious children, saith the Lord, that take counsel, but not of me; and that cover with a covering, but not of my spirit, that they may add sin to sin:

2 That walk to go down into Egypt, and have not asked at my mouth; to strengthen themselves in the strength of Pharaoh, and to trust in the shadow of Egypt!

3 Therefore shall the strength of Pharaoh be your shame, and the trust in the shadow of Egypt your confusion.




God 'still' has all the 'answers and directions', my dear friends!,.....'if' we will just knock on the 'proper' Door!


I can assure you,.....He's already 'knocking' on yours!



Revelation 3:19-21 (KJV)

19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.




With 'great' love,......your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[humanalien]

2 Peter 3:8

But forget not this one thing, beloved, that one day
is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand
years as one day.

Is this quote saying that for God, 1000 years of our
time, is a day in his time?

If so, then for us, it took God 6000 years, just to
create heaven and earth.

Of coarse, we all know that the earth is far older than
6000 years for creation of earth + another 6000 or so
from creation of man till now= 12 - 13 thousand years old.

I think God created heaven and earth but he didn't create
human life for billions of year later.

[East Sun]

I believe that a creator or "god" is unknowable to us humans. Unknowable covers a lot of ground and part of that is, maybe never existed.

There were gods mentioned in the OT but they were creators of a kind and just advanced beings imo. And they or their descendants will be back at some time or have come back but we the billions of peons are kept in the dark as usual.

"We don't know," is the bottom line, the final realization. imol.

[kreagle]

2 Peter 3:8

But forget not this one thing, beloved, that one day
is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand
years as one day.

Is this quote saying that for God, 1000 years of our
time, is a day in his time?

If so, then for us, it took God 6000 years, just to
create heaven and earth.

Of coarse, we all know that the earth is far older than
6000 years for creation of earth + another 6000 or so
from creation of man till now= 12 - 13 thousand years old.

I think God created heaven and earth but he didn't create
human life for billions of year later.


humanalien,

I think we should remember that we are dealing with God who is not 'bound by time' like you and I are. When we try to wrap our 'human intellect' around His accomplishments, ( ie. the Creation, etc.), we often try to establish whether this event is 'feasible' within the 'time restraints' that we are accustom to, or what we can fully understand. When things don't intellectually add up to our preconceived ways of acceptance, we are often guilty of rationalizing that God,....'must have meant something entirely different' than the literal 6 days of creation that His Word speaks about.


When our 'faith' begins to reach the proper level of maturity we are, then, able to comprehend that God could have, just as easily, created everything in,.....'6 hours',.....or.......'6 minutes',.......or......'6 seconds', as He actually did in '6 days' and recorded in His Word.


WE are the ones limited by time,......not Him!


Another point of 'enlightenment', concerning this, entails a statement that God specifically made to Moses when He issued forth the 'Ten Commandments'. In this statement, God made reference to His 'Creation Week' of 6 days, and resting on the 7th day. Notice what God said in reference to the '4th Commandment' , "Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy."



Exodus 20:8-11 (KJV)

8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.

9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:

10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.



The term 'days', here, literally means what it says, ( ie. 24-hour period). If this were not true, the Lord could hardly have used the 'Creation Week' as an example to mankind's 'cycle of work' in Exodus 20: 10-11, ( the 4th Commandment).


Lastly, when taken in context with what Peter was specifically referring to, you will find that Peter was simply 'bolstering' the faith and confidence of the 'brethren' by exhorting them to 'continue to look for His return',......regardless to whether it took a 'thousand' years,....or more,.....for Him to actually return. He was simply warning them to not get impatient, or weary in well doing, and reminding them that God was not on a 'time-line', or bound to it's parameters. Hence we see Peter's exhortation for them to not constrain God, as such.



2 Peter 3:1-10 (KJV)

3 This second epistle, beloved, I now write unto you; in both which I stir up your pure minds by way of remembrance:

2 That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour:

3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,

4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.

5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:

6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:

7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.




God Bless,.....your brother, friend, and servant,........kreagle

[kreagle]

I believe that a creator or "god" is unknowable to us humans.


Hello East Sun,

Your statement is true, when viewed in the following light.



I believe that a creator or "god" is unknowable to us unregenerated humans.


To be 'unregenerated' is to be not renewed in heart and mind, or reborn in spirit. This 'condition' can easily be reversed by 'obeying the Gospel Message' of Acts 2:38, as preached by the Apostle Peter, and illustrated in my signature.



Romans 12:1-2 (KJV)

12 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.

2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.




Jesus tells us that He will, not only, know His children, ( sheep),.....but that His children will 'know Him', likewise!



John 10:14 (KJV)

14 I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.



To be 'resurrected with Him' by being born-again of the Water and the Spirit will fully enable you to 'know Him' and to recognize His voice, my dear friend!




John 10:27 (KJV)

27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:




Love and Peace,......your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[AwakeInADream]

Hi All!:)

Speaking of boxes(post 546). When you open up a box or a 3 dimensional cube, and flatten it out. You form the image of the cross from the 6 surfaces.

Kreagle:) Have you any thoughts on what the actual historical dates of Jesus's birth and death might have been?
I remember reading once that he was likely born around Easter time?

[Akasha]

Hi there, Kreagle. Hope you are well.

Based on recent posts,I have a couple of questions for you.

Within your most recent conversation with Revere, you present Satan and Lucifer as being the same person. Is there Biblical evidence for that or is it just a long-held assumption amongst Bible readers?

and.......

When do you consider Adam to have been created (in terrestrial years)?

[East Sun]

Hi Kreagle,

I've been through this whole religious or 'belief' thing countless times and there is no such thing as proving anything to a believer or vice versa.
So after decades of study and searching and observing the human condition I have my conclusions and an open mind.
Been there, done that sounds arrogant so I won't say it. I'm content with what I believe and admitting that we know less than we like to admit is a valuable realization.
We know that lies and manipulation have been used by religious leaders for a long time and if someone studies everything in the OT they will definitely see that is written by many people trying to educate and control lost people.
Think, alien visitors in those times and ancient writings that can be easily misconstrued.
I'm not preaching to anyone, just declaring what I personally have found, for what it's worth.

[kreagle]

Hi All!:)

Speaking of boxes(post 546). When you open up a box or a 3 dimensional cube, and flatten it out. You form the image of the cross from the 6 surfaces.

Kreagle:) Have you any thoughts on what the actual historical dates of Jesus's birth and death might have been?
I remember reading once that he was likely born around Easter time?


AwakeInADream,

Hey brother, been awhile since hearing from you! Don't stay away so long, my dear friend!


Pretty amazing concerning the 3D cubical box resembling a cross when folded out,....don't you think? Once mankind emerges from their respective 'box', ( spiritually speaking), and takes a look at the unfolded box from which he came,.... sounds like a 'Divine' hint to me!


http://pad3.whstatic.com/images/thumb/9/97/Make-3D-Cube-Step-2.jpg/600px-Make-3D-Cube-Step-2.jpg

Here is a link to 'Biblical time-lines' for your convenience. I don't particularly have any thoughts on these, other than I somewhat accept most of them, realizing that some of them are historically subjective, and may, ( or may not), be completely correct from a Biblical standpoint. 'Easter' is the time-line where we celebrate His Resurrection, not His Birth, my brother.

http://bibletimeline.info/


As 'always',.....your friend, brother, and servant,.........kreagle

[kreagle]

Hi there, Kreagle. Hope you are well.

Based on recent posts,I have a couple of questions for you.

Within your most recent conversation with Revere, you present Satan and Lucifer as being the same person. Is there Biblical evidence for that or is it just a long-held assumption amongst Bible readers?

and.......

When do you consider Adam to have been created (in terrestrial years)?


Hey Akasha,

I'm doing fine, as I equally hope you are, also.

The issue of 'Lucifer being Satan' has been problematic for some, but I personally don't question this, in lieu of what the Scriptures relate in Isaiah 14:12-15. ( Note: the KJV, which I personally use, refers to the name 'Lucifer', but 'newer' versions of the Bible state 'morning star' instead).



Isaiah 14:12-15 (KJV)

12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.




The Prophet Ezekiel gives us a more detailed account of what role this 'special' angel held while he was in favor with God, prior to his rebellion which resulted in him being expelled from Heaven.



Ezekiel 28:14-19 (KJV)

14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.

15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.

16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.

17 Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.

18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.

19 All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.




As you will note, Akasha, this 'angelic being', called Lucifer in Isaiah chapter 14, was cast out of Heaven. He had stated that he would 'exalt his throne above the stars of God', ( verse 13), which fully indicated that he would be their ruler.


In Revelation 12:4-9, we find where the 'dragon', ( further revealed to be Satan, himself), was equally cast out of Heaven, along with the 'third part' of the stars of God, ( ie. 'angels'), that he successfully caused to join ranks with him in his rebellion against God that Isaiah refers to above.



Revelation 12:4-9 (KJV)

4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.

5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.




'Lucifer' was his name while he was in his 'cherub' angelic form and abode in Heaven. This all changed, dramatically, when he was ousted from Heaven, along with 1/3 of the angels that he also deceived into rebelling with him. Now his name is 'Satan', or commonly referred to as the Devil.


In addition to this I know that the name 'Lucifer' is used quite extensively in the 'occult' and in satanic rituals.

I fully realize that the 'debate' on this topic of 'Lucifer/Satan' continues to rage onward for those who wish to entangle themselves with it,....but I certainly have no interest, or desire, to become 'one of them'.


As far as when Adam was created in terrestrial years, you can also click on the link that I provided on my reply to AwakeInADream about 'Biblical time-lines'. It simply states 'Before 4000 BC' . I have not researched the 'historical account' of this. Perhaps you could share any findings that 'you' have on this with us.


Great to hear from you,......your brother, friend, and servant,.....kreagle

[kreagle]

Two Manner of People

(Who Rules?)



Genesis 25:21-26 (KJV)

21 And Isaac intreated the Lord for his wife, because she was barren: and the Lord was intreated of him, and Rebekah his wife conceived.

22 And the children struggled together within her; and she said, If it be so, why am I thus? And she went to enquire of the Lord.

23 And the Lord said unto her, Two nations are in thy womb, and two manner of people shall be separated from thy bowels; and the one people shall be stronger than the other people; and the elder shall serve the younger.

24 And when her days to be delivered were fulfilled, behold, there were twins in her womb.

25 And the first came out red, all over like an hairy garment; and they called his name Esau.

26 And after that came his brother out, and his hand took hold on Esau's heel; and his name was called Jacob: and Isaac was threescore years old when she bare them.




http://ireporterstv.co/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/Unborn-Twins-Fighting-For-Space-In-The-Womb.png
( Unborn twins fighting for space in the womb)


Most people don't realize that, in the account of 'Esau and Jacob's birth' is a 'divine' example, ( or 'type and shadow'), of every one of our individual lives and the 'dual nature' that's within each one of us. Fully ingrained within our lives,..we 'all' have an 'Esau, ( carnal), nature',....and....a 'Jacob, ( spiritual), nature' that wars within us from the very onset of our lives, all the way to the very end! The 'key', ( and the ultimate goal), is to make sure that our 'spiritual side', ( Jacob),....overrides our 'carnal side', ( Esau). Somewhere along the line it will become imperative for our spiritual side, ( Jacob), to likewise 'reach out', ( verse 26), and get a solid hold of our soul's nemesis,...the carnal side, ( Esau), if we ever intend to 'come out on top of our fleshly desires' and attain spiritual victory.

We've all been given a 'Godly mandate' in this passage of Scripture,...( ie. "the elder shall serve the younger.", ( verse 23), but it remains to be seen whether 'many' will heed this Divine directive for our lives, or not. Here, the 'elder' represents the '1st natural birth experience' that we all partake of as we enter this world to begin with,.....and the 'younger' represents the '2nd spiritual birth experience' of being 'born again of the Water and the Spirit', ( See John 3:5).



John 3:5 (KJV)

5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.




Surely it must be recognized that the Divine directive from God towards us, here, is that we become partakers of the 'Holy Ghost experience', ( the 2nd Birth),.....and that we should then commission this '2nd Spiritual Birth experience' to rule over the '1st carnal birth experience' from that moment onward. Remember!,....'the elder shall serve the younger!'


In light of this 'Spiritual Truth' we sadly find that 'many' today never allow their spiritual side, ( Jacob), to come to the forefront of their lives and 'speak up for himself' and to get that divine opportunity of 'grabbing hold of the heel' of his carnal side, ( Esau). Hence,....the Divine directive from God becomes unheeded and His Divine promise unrealized.


The following passage of scripture from the Book of Romans is lengthy, but specifically denotes the 'rewards,....and the consequences' of those who position their own personal 'spiritual-side', ( Jacob) to become the ultimate 'ruler' over their destructive 'carnal-side', ( Esau).



Romans 8:1-17
King James Version (KJV)

8 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.

6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.

7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.

13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.



( in conclusion)


From a purely logical standpoint,.......why should anyone allow their own 'carnal-side', ( Esau), to call all the shots,....make all their important decisions,....and to dictate what needs to be done in their respective lives?

Will their 'carnal,...fleshly side' have to 'answer to God',....one day? ( ie. 'No',....but their 'spiritual-side' will!) The 'flesh' will have been long gone by then, returned to the dust of the ground from whence it came to begin with, and only the 'spirit' left behind to reap, or pay, the consequences!


Why does humanity allow their 'worst' side, ( flesh and carnality), call the shots,...make the decisions,....and dictate the terms of their lives,.......when 'it' won't even be around on 'Judgement Day' to answer for 'it's' actions?


Shouldn't the 'one' left standing, ( ie. our spiritual-side), be the 'one' in charge of all those 'life-defining' moments that we encountered while here on earth? Since our 'spiritual-side' will stand 'alone' on 'Judgement Day' to answer for itself, shouldn't we have taken measures a 'long time ago' to ensure that he/she, ( our Jacob side), be given complete charge and 'control' over those shots to be called,.....decisions to be made,.....and terms to be dictated during our respective lives?


Why does 'mankind' allow our 'spiritual-side', ( Jacob), take the 'rap',.... suffer the consequences/punishment, for what our 'carnal-side', ( Esau), caused to begin with?


Why isn't our 'spiritual-side', ( Jacob), placed in 'complete control' of his own divine destiny?


'NOW',....is it any wonder why God said,......"the elder, ( 1st-birth, carnal experience), shall serve, ( be under the 'rule' of), the younger, ( 2nd-Birth, spiritual experience)?"


Who rules in your own personal life? Is it the 'one' who will be there on Judgement Day, ( your 'spiritual-side', Jacob), to give a full account of his/her actions,.......OR......will you have rendered your own personal 'Jacob' powerless and completely ineffective by allowing your 'carnal, fleshly-side', ( Esau), to always be fully in charge of your earthly existence?


Who 'serves' who? Does your 'flesh' serve your 'spirit',.....or.....is it the 'other way around?'

Who 'rules',......Jacob....or.....Esau?



With 'great love',.......your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

30,100.......and counting!


The 'above' number is the current amount of 'Views' that have been contributed towards this thread from it's inception back in August of 2012.


Just wanted to take a moment and 'personally' thank everyone who has participated on this thread, whether by taking the time to personally 'contribute',....or to take the time to 'read' the contents, here. When applied, God's Word always has a special way of enriching our lives in ways that we may, ( or may not), fully recognize.


We've actually only 'begun' to explore the unsearchable riches that are contained within His Word,.....so I implore everyone, here, to 'keep in touch' as we each navigate our way through our difficult, ( and complicated), lives that we live. A Divine 'GPS System', ( His Holy Word), has been lovingly provided to us so that we might be able to properly 'map out' our way through the 'hazardous conditions' of life,.....and to ultimately find our way 'back Home' to the awaiting arms of our Heavenly Father.


I hope that 'each of you' can equally 'spiritually smell' the 'fatted calf' that has been so lovingly prepared by our Father,.... back 'Home',.....and explicitly for 'you and I',....the long, lost Prodigal.



Matthew 5:6 (KJV)

6 Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.



With 'all' my love,.......your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

Life in the 'Pressure Cooker'


http://cn1.kaboodle.com/hi/img/c/0/0/105/f/AAAADEa3fK0AAAAAAQXwgA.jpg?v=1289693720000


It seems that this little device has 'made the news' , at the Boston Marathon, in a very negative, ( and destructive), way. What sinister minds 'some' must have to take such an otherwise useful kitchen device and totally misdirect it's usage to that which is so deadly and devilish.


With that said, I am somewhat convinced that this latest event that has presented itself before us is more than likely just another 'Divine Hint', ( out of 'many'), that has been placed before us, in an effort to fully get our attention.


Whether we fully realize it, or not, mankind has a way of 'placing themselves in the pressure cooker' simply by the way we attempt to live our lives. Naturally we begin by surrounding ourselves with structural concepts, ideal-isms, and governing factors that we find will be conducive to the 'well-rounded life' that we are endeavoring to produce for ourselves and our loved ones. Once we have established these required 'ingredients', we then encase ourselves with this 'lifestyle',....hence, we have just encased ourselves in the 'pressure cooker', whether we realize it, or not. Let me further explain 'how' we have done this.


As a young man growing up, ( and even now, today), I have always been very patriotic towards the United States of America,....her concepts,...ideal-isms,....and her government of the people. I can't imagine not being afforded the opportunity, ( and extreme privilege), of being able to benefit from her provisions that many of the 'less fortunate' have only been able to 'dream' of. What a 'stroke of luck' it was for me to have been born into a country that seemingly could 'do no wrong',....'had it's act together',....and had 'God on her side'. I, like 'many' more of my fellow Americans had been 'heavily indoctrinated' with the American Dream,.....UNTIL.....one day, I finally woke up and discovered that I had 'voluntarily' placed myself in the 'pressure cooker'.


You see, the 'pressure cooker' is what you get when you surround yourself with concepts, ideal-isms, and governing factors, that are not able to 'stand the test of time' and are in reality, 'faulty by design'. Most of the time we are oblivious to the fact that we have placed ourselves in this situation until we finally mature and have our own personal 'awakening'. It's only through our 'awakening' that we truly begin to sense the 'pressure' that begins to intensify to greater, ( and more profound), levels.


At this point in my life, my own personal 'pressure cooker' situation was becoming volatile and causing extreme discomfort within my soul. I had just been 'awakened' to the fact that my country, ( the dear, old, US of A ), wasn't quite so wonderful after all! As a matter-of-fact, she had been party to many 'war-like atrocities' that I was 'painfully' becoming aware of. Her 'luster' as a nation that had 'shone so brightly' in my recent past was now dulling rapidly right before my shameful eyes. Her 'governing officials' had been exposed as incompetent and unworthy of the positions they held. Needless to say,....I was a very distraught, young American. Pressure was beginning to build in my life as instability entered in.


What does a 'young man' do when he painfully becomes aware, ( and awakened), to the fact that his entire 'system', ( ie. structural concepts, ideal-isms, and governing factors), are completely flawed and that they should not be 'blindly' relied upon as in the past? My 'structurally sound' lifestyle that I had tried to carefully lay out for myself and my loved ones had just been exposed as fundamentally flawed. Truly,...my life was in the 'pressure cooker'!


As indicated by my illustration of the 'Pressure Cooker' above, there are 'controls and valves' that are attached that, when deployed, will 'let some of the steam, ( pressure), escape'. The problem with this, though, is that 'most' people don't fully understand how to 'properly' deploy these 'controls and valves' within their respective lives during these realised moments of crisis. Hence, we see the 'suicide rates' escalating astronomically across this world in which we live as a result.


I really wish that I could answer for 'everyone', but I fully realize that I cannot, for this is where we reach the proverbial 'fork in the road'. From 'here' I can only 'suggest and advise' on the direction in which I, personally, took in my quest to get out of the 'pressure cooker' afforded by this life we live.


When 'I' personally found that I could no longer handle the 'pressure' of this world that was collapsing before my very eyes,....I allowed my 'heart' to desperately reach out for the 'controls and valves' of my self-induced 'pressure cooker' and found myself getting a 'firm grip on repentance' towards God!


Repentance, for me, not only turned the 'controls and valves' of my own personal 'pressure cooker',....consequently releasing the pressure that was rapidly building in my life,....IT GOT ME OUT OF THE 'PRESSURE COOKER',.....ALTOGETHER!!!


A 'simple' step of implementing 'Repentance towards God',.....followed up by water baptism in Jesus' name,.....and sealed with the infilling of God's Spirit, the Holy Ghost,....had fully delivered me from the 'pressure cooker' and had 'set me free!'



2 Corinthians 5:17 (KJV)

17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.


And,....


Ephesians 1:12-14 (KJV)

12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.





The world in which we live, ( and mankind in general), is under extreme 'pressure',....even as we speak. One would have to be completely blind to not acknowledge such. 'Pressure' is something that we 'all', universally, can relate to, for it weaves it's sinister presence into every one of our respective lives, whether we want it, or not.


Life in the 'Pressure Cooker' will do you in,.....and completely destroy your life,....unless you are 'successfully' able to get a 'firm grip' on the 'controls and valves' and to ultimately be set free from this overwhelming pressure.


'Repentance towards God' began the process of turning the 'valves and controls' for me. It's principle, ( and concept), is firmly established within the Word of God. I firmly believed it, and applied it,....and behold,....it worked for me, and will work for 'you', also!


No one needs to endure the 'Pressure Cooker',....when you can be 'set' free!


With 'great' love,......your brother, friend, and servant,.....kreagle

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Cheers mate for this insight. Whether the Boston bombing was a false flag or not, the fact remains that there are some very bad people operating at the apex of power in both your country and mine. God may very well have played a leading role in creating the ideal that is 'the land of the free', but in the corridors of power that God has been forgotten. Or cast away.

The Boston pressure cooker devices are a 'hint' indeed - they are a metaphor in microcosm of a rapidly worsening global situation. When will the lid blow, and the contents engulf us all?

I was watching RT news last night and caught a segment that summed up the situation perfectly. Note the juxtaposition she presents of Obama's speech with regards to bombs against civilians being 'terrorism', and his drone policy overseas. Very revealing. Watch it and applaud this woman, this independent, truth speaking journalist. I love her! She also, very bravely, exposes the cancers that infest the corporate media.

Here's the clip,

B-P1La8YU4s

[kreagle]

Cheers mate for this insight. Whether the Boston bombing was a false flag or not, the fact remains that there are some very bad people operating at the apex of power in both your country and mine. God may very well have played a leading role in creating the ideal that is 'the land of the free', but in the corridors of power that God has been forgotten. Or cast away.

The Boston pressure cooker devices are a 'hint' indeed - they are a metaphor in microcosm of a rapidly worsening global situation. When will the lid blow, and the contents engulf us all?

I was watching RT news last night and caught a segment that summed up the situation perfectly. Note the juxtaposition she presents of Obama's speech with regards to bombs against civilians being 'terrorism', and his drone policy overseas. Very revealing. Watch it and applaud this woman, this independent, truth speaking journalist. I love her! She also, very bravely, exposes the cancers that infest the corporate media.

Here's the clip,

B-P1La8YU4s



Hey StarMariner,


Thanks, so much, for the comments and the video clip. I, equally, greatly admire the 'intestinal fortitude' that this young lady demonstrated with her reporting of this tragic event in Boston.

You know, I can't help but think that this is 'another' attempt, ( out of many), where our 'government' is desperately attempting to 'pin' this latest event on various oversea enemies so they can then justify their response with whatever 'war-like' measures that they deem to be necessary.

This 'mentality' is what I was referring to in my post on 'Life in the Pressure Cooker',...which caused me to loose faith in my country's ability to 'properly govern' themselves.


Once again,......thanks brother!,......your friend, brother, and servant,.....kreagle


BTW,....on my post about the 'Pressure Cooker' I had accidentally submitted it prematurely. From the point of my statement, approximately half-way through the post,....." Needless to say,....I was a very distraught, young American,"......you will see where I 'edited' the original post to fully include the entirety of my thoughts. Sorry for the error, and any inconvenience this may have caused. Love and Peace,.....kreagle

[kreagle]

Life in the 'Pressure Cooker'


http://cn1.kaboodle.com/hi/img/c/0/0/105/f/AAAADEa3fK0AAAAAAQXwgA.jpg?v=1289693720000


It seems that this little device has 'made the news' , at the Boston Marathon, in a very negative, ( and destructive), way. What sinister minds 'some' must have to take such an otherwise useful kitchen device and totally misdirect it's usage to that which is so deadly and devilish.


With that said, I am somewhat convinced that this latest event that has presented itself before us is more than likely just another 'Divine Hint', ( out of 'many'), that has been placed before us, in an effort to fully get our attention.


Whether we fully realize it, or not, mankind has a way of 'placing themselves in the pressure cooker' simply by the way we attempt to live our lives. Naturally we begin by surrounding ourselves with structural concepts, ideal-isms, and governing factors that we find will be conducive to the 'well-rounded life' that we are endeavoring to produce for ourselves and our loved ones. Once we have established these required 'ingredients', we then encase ourselves with this 'lifestyle',....hence, we have just encased ourselves in the 'pressure cooker', whether we realize it, or not. Let me further explain 'how' we have done this.


As a young man growing up, ( and even now, today), I have always been very patriotic towards the United States of America,....her concepts,...ideal-isms,....and her government of the people. I can't imagine not being afforded the opportunity, ( and extreme privilege), of being able to benefit from her provisions that many of the 'less fortunate' have only been able to 'dream' of. What a 'stroke of luck' it was for me to have been born into a country that seemingly could 'do no wrong',....'had it's act together',....and had 'God on her side'. I, like 'many' more of my fellow Americans had been 'heavily indoctrinated' with the American Dream,.....UNTIL.....one day, I finally woke up and discovered that I had 'voluntarily' placed myself in the 'pressure cooker'.


You see, the 'pressure cooker' is what you get when you surround yourself with concepts, ideal-isms, and governing factors, that are not able to 'stand the test of time' and are in reality, 'faulty by design'. Most of the time we are oblivious to the fact that we have placed ourselves in this situation until we finally mature and have our own personal 'awakening'. It's only through our 'awakening' that we truly begin to sense the 'pressure' that begins to intensify to greater, ( and more profound), levels.


At this point in my life, my own personal 'pressure cooker' situation was becoming volatile and causing extreme discomfort within my soul. I had just been 'awakened' to the fact that my country, ( the dear, old, US of A ), wasn't quite so wonderful after all! As a matter-of-fact, she had been party to many 'war-like atrocities' that I was 'painfully' becoming aware of. Her 'luster' as a nation that had 'shone so brightly' in my recent past was now dulling rapidly right before my shameful eyes. Her 'governing officials' had been exposed as incompetent and unworthy of the positions they held. Needless to say,....I was a very distraught, young American. Pressure was beginning to build in my life as instability entered in.


What does a 'young man' do when he painfully becomes aware, ( and awakened), to the fact that his entire 'system', ( ie. structural concepts, ideal-isms, and governing factors), are completely flawed and that they should not be 'blindly' relied upon as in the past? My 'structurally sound' lifestyle that I had tried to carefully lay out for myself and my loved ones had just been exposed as fundamentally flawed. Truly,...my life was in the 'pressure cooker'!


As indicated by my illustration of the 'Pressure Cooker' above, there are 'controls and valves' that are attached that, when deployed, will 'let some of the steam, ( pressure), escape'. The problem with this, though, is that 'most' people don't fully understand how to 'properly' deploy these 'controls and valves' within their respective lives during these realised moments of crisis. Hence, we see the 'suicide rates' escalating astronomically across this world in which we live as a result.


I really wish that I could answer for 'everyone', but I fully realize that I cannot, for this is where we reach the proverbial 'fork in the road'. From 'here' I can only 'suggest and advise' on the direction in which I, personally, took in my quest to get out of the 'pressure cooker' afforded by this life we live.


When 'I' personally found that I could no longer handle the 'pressure' of this world that was collapsing before my very eyes,....I allowed my 'heart' to desperately reach out for the 'controls and valves' of my self-induced 'pressure cooker' and found myself getting a 'firm grip on repentance' towards God!


Repentance, for me, not only turned the 'controls and valves' of my own personal 'pressure cooker',....consequently releasing the pressure that was rapidly building in my life,....IT GOT ME OUT OF THE 'PRESSURE COOKER',.....ALTOGETHER!!!


A 'simple' step of implementing 'Repentance towards God',.....followed up by water baptism in Jesus' name,.....and sealed with the infilling of God's Spirit, the Holy Ghost,....had fully delivered me from the 'pressure cooker' and had 'set me free!'



2 Corinthians 5:17 (KJV)

17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.


And,....


Ephesians 1:12-14 (KJV)

12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.





The world in which we live, ( and mankind in general), is under extreme 'pressure',....even as we speak. One would have to be completely blind to not acknowledge such. 'Pressure' is something that we 'all', universally, can relate to, for it weaves it's sinister presence into every one of our respective lives, whether we want it, or not.


Life in the 'Pressure Cooker' will do you in,.....and completely destroy your life,....unless you are 'successfully' able to get a 'firm grip' on the 'controls and valves' and to ultimately be set free from this overwhelming pressure.


'Repentance towards God' began the process of turning the 'valves and controls' for me. It's principle, ( and concept), is firmly established within the Word of God. I firmly believed it, and applied it,....and behold,....it worked for me, and will work for 'you', also!


No one needs to endure the 'Pressure Cooker',....when you can be 'set' free!


With 'great' love,......your brother, friend, and servant,.....kreagle



I urge each of you to set aside 19 1/2 minutes of your time to listen to this active Lieutenant Colonel Potter and what he has to say is unfolding here in the United States, right before our very eyes. I also ask you to 'observe' the actual 'Pressure Cooker' that he obviously feels that he has, equally, become part of, and what I have endeavored to relate to all, here. You can 'see' the pressure all over his face as he earnestly tries to inform us on what is occurring on the grand stage of our lives.


yWUB4MCLsHg



Luke 21:28 (KJV)

28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.




It's time to look 'Heaven-ward' my dear friends!


Your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Thank you Kreagle, an excellent post. I hadn't seen the rest of it as I had posted my reply before you added the second part.


You see, the 'pressure cooker' is what you get when you surround yourself with concepts, ideal-isms, and governing factors, that are not able to 'stand the test of time' and are in reality, 'faulty by design'.

I agree mate. It is abundantly clear to me (and I’m sure to many of us here at Avalon) that the world and everything in it is faulty by design. I have long maintained that if the 'powers that be' wanted a Utopia for us, we would have it. But they do not. The vast majority of us are a worker class in everything but name, but many do not realise it. Even in so-called first world countries so many are struggling to meet the financial demands imposed upon them; to pay the bills, to fuel their cars, feed their children, and even keep their homes. This is entirely the intent of the powers that be who have designed this paradigm. If we are mostly concerned with basic survival, then we do not have time to be concerned with anything else, like the important stuff! Believe me, Pharaohs, Emperors, Tyrant Kings of old, they have not gone away - the ruling elite are still in place, and slavery has not been abolished. A free, peaceful, spiritual world of equality could be with us right now! - if they wanted it. But they do not.

More in line with the topics of this thread, we as human beings are also faulty by design. This is an important thing to understand about the human condition - our flawed nature, and using the spirit of God within us to overcome them.


When 'I' personally found that I could no longer handle the 'pressure' of this world that was collapsing before my very eyes,....I allowed my 'heart' to desperately reach out for the 'controls and valves' of my self-induced 'pressure cooker' and found myself getting a 'firm grip on repentance' towards God!

Isn't that just awesome!? For consider:


John 8:32
And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

I've always loved this short, very simple passage. It says so much, and on so many levels. From sin to salvation, falsehood to truth, darkness to light - to God.

Your personal revelation, that the world was not what it seemed, "that the entire 'system' ( ie. structural concepts, ideal-isms, and governing factors), are completely flawed" actually set you free my friend. It set you on your path to God. And you're quite right, there are so many that just can't handle the ‘realisation’ that the world paradigm is utterly flawed - is a lie - and either A) refuse therefore to believe it, and continue on blind (and in their minds, blissful) ignorance, or B), descend, plummet, spiral out of control. Sometimes as you say, resulting most tragically in suicide.

Your use of the terms 'controls and valves' is a really interesting and important metaphor.

We all do it - relieve the pressure from time to time, make ourselves feel better by letting off steam. And we welcome the opportunity when it comes. But there is a dark side to this as well, a danger, in which we should all beware. There are many people who, looking to ‘make themselves feel better’ compensate for the holes in their life - in their souls - by filling them in with unhealthy substitutes, and not with what they could otherwise find with spiritual understanding and faith. I speak of materialism, gluttony, depravity, drugs, fast-living, and ambition. Unfortunately many so-called leaders, rulers, and influential people in our world - who run the world, fall into this category, and thus perpetuate this unhealthy pattern from the top, down. Again, by design, because they want a material world.

'Ambition' is the mechanism by which these governing people are lifted to their lofty heights. It’s what propelled them to where they are. First and foremost their ambition was, and is, to elevate/enhance their own personal self, situation and ego (and bank account). Any initial ideal that they may have had to benefit the rest of humanity is swiftly forgotten as they are sucked further and further into the trap. It is said that power corrupts (absolute power corrupting absolutely). It is so true. For behold, we see the result of what has been created by this ‘faulty system’: Governments with materialists, hedonists and egomaniacs at their heart. Governments who care nothing for actual peace or prosperity (war is more profitable), and strive only to maintain the status quo, the world paradigm, driven with a hard, metallic, military/industrial heartbeat, a very unfair market economy, and their carefully crafted hierarchical pyramid of power. And God… only as a token point of interest, a control mechanism for the little people (us) to fall back on. That’s all He is to them, because, let's speak the truth here, there is not a senior, influential, political man or women in the world - exerting actual power over us from a high seat of authority - who actually, truly holds God/religion/spirituality in their hearts. *Ego/Ambition* and *God*, are as oil and water. They cannot exist together in the same space. That is the root of all our troubles.

The hierarchical pyramid of power I mentioned. Haha. So ironic. Many do not realise it, but the pyramids of ancient times are still being built for the Pharaohs. Khufu, Rameses, etc, they are all long gone but only in name. They have merely been replaced. The all-seeing eye shines still brightly at the apex, and us slaves still toil at the bottom to hold the whole thing up. The old order, the old empires, they did not perish. They endure, with a new name and in a new guise, hiding behind a veil of ‘political correctness’, which holds that we live in a free, evolved, and democratic system. We do not. Many do not see this, do not recognise this. The ancient tenets of the Roman Empire dictates: "the people anxiously hope for just two things: bread and circuses", and “give them bread and circuses and they will never revolt”. We get our bread, today a borderline minimum wage for a long week of labour at the base of the pyramid, and we get our diversions/circuses: Pop idol/X-Factor, the nightly trash that fills our television screens. And people are made to actually feel lucky, and forget to revolt, or to think ‘hey, there can be a better way’. They stay asleep, they forget to love, and they forget God. They are swayed into believing that the only God that matters is green, square, and made to sit snugly in their wallet.

As I said, the godless who rule over us is the root of everything that’s messed up in the world. People have been lured into a false sense of gratitude for all that they have, and that they are ‘in good hands’. They do not understand that they are an under-class, that free energy and hidden technologies could feed the hungry, relieve the sick, liberate us all from financial bondage, and completely transform this world. They do not know that we could all live in harmony, peace, and love; that innovation and fair play (not pure profit) could give us free power, free water, free everything, and that to pay our way and keep civilization going our 5 day working week need only be a 3 day week, or a 2 or a 1; that the power structures of the world could not only be transparent, but symmetrical, meaning a role in government and authority should be rotational - dealt out equally to us all to participate in, and conversely go hand in hand with occasional humble, unskilled work as well, for us all, so that all egos are kept in balance. With such a system in place across industry and the market place; with technology handling the brunt of menial tasks, our free-time would be tripled, quadrupled, or more. Perhaps 10 months of the year would be our own to pursue our personal interests, to better ourselves – to better humanity, to forge closer bonds to our fellow human beings and to clean up this planet, and perhaps most of all, to attend to spiritual studies, and to grow closer to God. This is the Utopia I speak of, and think about, and pray for. This is the Utopia that could be…

I’m sorry I’ve gone off on a tangent, and somewhat stepped onto the soap box. But in regards to the original theme, I will close with this. There is still time. The corrupt, the selfish and the violent can still be defeated. The darkness can still be driven out. And those that played a part in it can still be saved.



Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.


PS. Thanks for posting the clip of Lt. Col. Potter. I had actually watched this earlier, it was on another thread (as was the clip I posted). Another brave soul indeed, who in his high position still retains a hold over his senses, and concern for humanity. (and he looks a lot like George Peppard I think, lol). Anyway, I sincerely applaud him.

[kreagle]

Your use of the terms 'controls and valves' is a really interesting and important metaphor.

We all do it - relieve the pressure from time to time, make ourselves feel better by letting off steam. And we welcome the opportunity when it comes. But there is a dark side to this as well, a danger, in which we should all beware. There are many people who, looking to ‘make themselves feel better’ compensate for the holes in their life - in their souls - by filling them in with unhealthy substitutes, and not with what they could otherwise find with spiritual understanding and faith. I speak of materialism, gluttony, depravity, drugs, fast-living, and ambition. Unfortunately many so-called leaders, rulers, and influential people in our world - who run the world, fall into this category, and thus perpetuate this unhealthy pattern from the top, down. Again, by design, because they want a material world.


Hey Star Mariner, my dear friend,....

Thanks, so much, for your kind words and especially for your in-depth, ( and insightful), contribution to this post, ( and thread),....as ALWAYS!

Yes, indeed, the 'controls and valves' are often grossly misused, primarily as a 'temporary fix' for the afflicted's personal crisis that they are currently faced with. On the 'surface', you really can't blame them for seeking some kind of relief from the overwhelming pressure that they are under,....but the 'wisdom of God's Spirit, ( the Holy Ghost)', reveals to me that they are simply putting their crisis on the 'back burner'. Consequently they delay the inevitable, for it will, once again, rear it's ugly head in their lives somewhere down the road and will have to be dealt with, all over again, and again.

I am convinced this is why society is forced to watch this 'horror story',....over and over, again,.....in the lives of so many people as they 'endeavor' to frantically adjust these various 'controls and valves' and alleviate the enormous pressure that is currently afflicting them. It, ( seriously), is like a 're-run' that we are being forced to watch, whether we want to, or not, which often results in a 'tragic ending', ( ie. suicide, etc.).

How else are we to rationally explain where a 'highly successful businessman', ( who seemingly has 'everything' to live for),....suddenly becomes the 'news highlight of the evening' as he scales the side of a bridge and jumps to his death? How many times have we seen this 'same re-run',....over and over again,....with only a few 'minor' details changed?

The overwhelming point that I am endeavoring to make, here, is that you can only make so many 'adjustments' to your 'valves and controls' on your own personal 'Pressure Cooker' that you find yourself in. Sooner, or later, you are going to,...#1)-run out of options,....or #2)-fail to properly regulate the pressure you are currently under! Either of these will then activate that horrible 're-run' that I have been talking about!


While 'many' opt to remain in their own personal 'Pressure Cooker' existence,...periodically adjusting the 'controls and valves' the best they can,....a 'few' of us have taken the measure to 'get out of the Pressure Cooker,....ALTOGETHER, once and for all!'

The 'completion' of an Acts 2:38 experience, ( as indicated by my personal signature), will deliver it's occupant out of the 'Pressure Cooker',...just like it did for me,.....which alludes to the passage you, also, shared with us, Star Mariner.



John 8:32
And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.




Free indeed, brother!,....and now I am able to totally rely upon His skillful handling of any personal pressure that may come my way, or try to infiltrate it's way into my life, or the lives of my loved ones! The benefits of a 'Holy Ghost filled life' are limitless, my dear friend! His Spirit fully recognizes any pressure that may be attempting to come my way, or is 'just around the corner' of my life, brother! The 'controls and valves' are NOW entrusted to the Hands of the One who understands the full effect of 'pressure' on our lives. There is no telling how many times He has skillfully made many 'adjustments' for me, without my knowledge, and delivered me from situations that I, otherwise, would not have been able to handle. That's the kind of God He is!!!



Psalm 23:4 (KJV)

4 Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil: for thou art with me; thy rod and thy staff they comfort me.






I’m sorry I’ve gone off on a tangent, and somewhat stepped onto the soap box. But in regards to the original theme, I will close with this. There is still time. The corrupt, the selfish and the violent can still be defeated. The darkness can still be driven out. And those that played a part in it can still be saved.



Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.




Hey, brother,.....don't apologize for the 'soapbox', for I have personally enjoyed the 'sermon' and timely input, my dear friend!

While it is commendable, ( and fully expected), for you, I, and everyone else to oppose, ( and take measures against), the 'corrupt, selfish, and violent' that you refer to,....we should fully recognize that it will be at the Hands of Him, Jesus Christ, Himself, who will defeat these wicked forces, once and for all. We can 'assist', but it will be 'Him' that gains the victory and sets everything back in it's proper order!


You are 'equally' so right,....."And those that played a part in it can still be saved." 'Repentance' has no boundaries that prohibits 'anyone' from entering! The 'door' is still wide open for 'anyone' to enter, and then complete an Acts 2:38 experience, also!

Thanks, so much, my dear friend!


Your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[Chester]

I find "bibles" and "religions" to be tools of nefarious higher level controllers. In fact - All so called "holy books" that allow one to be misled into taking the metaphors literally always end up being tools in the hands of energetic collectives that desire to manipulate the vulnerable. It took me many years of hoping otherwise for me to finally surrender to this probability.

Bombs are made and exploded based on these types of books and religions.

I recommend each seek to awaken to their direct connection. No need for filters... they only distort and inhibit.

All and only my humble opinion.

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

The bible may well have been distorted (just check some of my own posts from previous pages!), I agree there, and I do see and fully recognise what you're saying Justoneman. But consider this: just as nefarious forces use religion, bibles, and spiritual texts as tools to control, program, incite etc, the free, the humble, and the truly spiritually inclined can use the very same tools for comfort, and wisdom, and to do good.

Along with everything else in life: it's all about how you apply what is given.

So look at the other side of this equation my friend. I am awake already, believe me. Many of my beliefs are not quite compatible with orthodoxy (ie karma, reincarnation etc), but that doesn't stop me from considering myself Christian, or from sitting down with my friend kreagle here and sharing in our collective thought (on which much aligns!) and drawing from the great fount of knowledge and wisdom which is the Bible.

[Chester]

The bible may well have been distorted (just check some of my own posts from previous pages!), I agree there, and I do see and fully recognise what you're saying Justoneman. But consider this: just as nefarious forces use religion, bibles, and spiritual texts as tools to control, program, incite etc, the free, the humble, and the truly spiritually inclined can use the very same tools for comfort, and wisdom, and to do good.

Along with everything else in life: it's all about how you apply what is given.

So look at the other side of this equation my friend. I am awake already, believe me. Many of my beliefs are not quite compatible with orthodoxy (ie karma, reincarnation etc), but that doesn't stop me from considering myself Christian, or from sitting down with my friend kreagle here and sharing in our collective thought (on which much aligns!) and drawing from the great fount of knowledge and wisdom which is the Bible.

And I fully agree. As some may recognize by now about my posts, I simply share my experience (past and present) as well as share my various (always changing) points of view.

Thus, having said that, I must state truthfully that being born and raised mostly in Texas, I explored the spiritual realms through the lens of Christianity, then the "new age" spinoffs where "Jesus" was central to the theme. I heavily studied A Course in Miracles with emphasis on The Manual for Teachers. I then found Christian Mysticism and Christian Gnosticism and eventually even more that can be related to Christianity.

I have also, since a young age, had a relationship with "a voice" in my head which I once thought was the "the voice of God" which pointed often and directly to Jesus, the teachings of Jesus and our spiritual nature where the highest state within physicality is called "Christ Consciousness." As some may know, I now consider this voice to be of another nature, not of actual "god"... more likely an echo or remnant of some AI program or some diminishing thought form created far in our past. I also consider that this "voice" may be directed energy where the source may be of non earth born human origin as well as may be generated by earth born human beings. I doubt you will find anyone more open minded about this and at the same time, as healthy about all this as I have now emerged to be. I am no longer so emotionally attached to this ongoing experience and thus it does not rule me as it had for essentially 50 years of my 55 year life.

I have the greatest respect for all traditions as long as we realize that (uhummmm this is just my opinion) - as long as we realize, these things are tools, or bridges to the lands of realization where we find that we are essentially the very thing we (in our past) felt separated from. One isn't "forgiven" or "redeemed" or "saved" etc as those explorations just create new traps one must find their way out of.

One awakens or one remains deluded. It is that simple. Once awakened, on sees the silliness of all these things... religion, special books written by the hands of the Divine or divinely guided chosen ones, etc. One, in fact, sees that the separation was an illusion (likely self generated) and that all the bridges back to actuality (the actual ality thus no need for a word such as reality).

So from within the matrix, when one is strong and loving in heart, these traditions and their sacred books are wonderful tools and thus "good."

Once securely anchored from without the matrix, one senses a sadness that things like this were ever needed in the first place.

Note, I am of the view that no opinion is totally, entirely invalid. No thing (which includes concepts) is 100% totally untrue. They may all lead to actual truth... if the truth seeker truly wants this actual truth and is willing to go through anything necessary to get there into the land of actual truth.

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Yes, indeed, the 'controls and valves' are often grossly misused, primarily as a 'temporary fix' for the afflicted's personal crisis that they are currently faced with. On the 'surface', you really can't blame them for seeking some kind of relief from the overwhelming pressure that they are under,....but the 'wisdom of God's Spirit, ( the Holy Ghost)', reveals to me that they are simply putting their crisis on the 'back burner'. Consequently they delay the inevitable, for it will, once again, rear it's ugly head in their lives somewhere down the road and will have to be dealt with, all over again, and again.

Thank you kreagle, your reply is on the money, AS ALWAYS! :)

And you have nailed it there, in that so many in this world are looking to fix / alleviate / band-aid a spiritual problem with a physical cure, which cannot be done. Like a gopher infestation, this is why these problems will resurface again and again, in one manifestation or another, if not properly treated at the source. I'm not necessarily talking about spiritual healing here, or some other means to heal the heart, or cure the spirit, I'm just talking about a bit of faith.

I mean, good Lord, perhaps the majority of the world's population do not know that they even have a god-given soul! - that they are eternal beings of tremendous value and incredible power and potential. They don't know that! And they don't know that their spirit will continue after death either. Small wonder then that there is so much misery on this backward planet.



How else are we to rationally explain where a 'highly successful businessman', ( who seemingly has 'everything' to live for),....suddenly becomes the 'news highlight of the evening' as he scales the side of a bridge and jumps to his death? How many times have we seen this 'same re-run',....over and over again,....with only a few 'minor' details changed?

That businessman example you cite is an apt one. He has spent his whole life worshipping those little green pieces of paper. Sure, one who suffers from a physical problem like nervous tension or pressure at work can take a run or visit the gym to work off this kind of 'pressure'. But I'm talking about pressure brought about from spiritual starvation. The path the businessman takes in spiritual terms leads nowhere. He has not been properly guided to believe in anything else but money, profit - even though the opportunity has been presented to him (a divine hint from above!) in his life many times. A serendipitous meeting with a holy person, or the church he passes every day on his way to work, for example. But he just walks on by, continuing to take no interest in the matters of God, in spiritual truth, or what runs this Universe etc. He doesn't care for the big picture, or even a different picture. Only his own picture. The material one. But quietly, secretly tucked away somewhere is his heart, his spirit yearns for more than what he's given it. It is desperate for more! Just like any living thing, if it is not fed it will atrophy over time, and then perish. It is one reason why he, and many like him, has driven this world to the brink of disaster, because it is administered by people who rule with cold, hard intellects, rather than their god-given spirit which is slowly wasting away inside of them. The other thing that happens is that this businessmen, and so many like him who have 'missed the point', inevitably takes a dive off that bridge.



The overwhelming point that I am endeavoring to make, here, is that you can only make so many 'adjustments' to your 'valves and controls' on your own personal 'Pressure Cooker' that you find yourself in. Sooner, or later, you are going to,...#1)-run out of options,....or #2)-fail to properly regulate the pressure you are currently under! Either of these will then activate that horrible 're-run' that I have been talking about!

The 'completion' of an Acts 2:38 experience, ( as indicated by my personal signature), will deliver it's occupant out of the 'Pressure Cooker',...just like it did for me,....


Free indeed, brother!,....and now I am able to totally rely upon His skillful handling of any personal pressure that may come my way, or try to infiltrate it's way into my life, or the lives of my loved ones! The benefits of a 'Holy Ghost filled life' are limitless, my dear friend! His Spirit fully recognizes any pressure that may be attempting to come my way, or is 'just around the corner' of my life, brother! The 'controls and valves' are NOW entrusted to the Hands of the One who understands the full effect of 'pressure' on our lives. There is no telling how many times He has skillfully made many 'adjustments' for me, without my knowledge, and delivered me from situations that I, otherwise, would not have been able to handle. That's the kind of God He is!!!


Exactly. This is exactly what happens here. I talked of this some pages back, that we are all 'conditioned' by the very nature of us 'being an eternal spirit' to seek out spiritual knowledge and draw closer to our creator. Unfortunately, our society has kept us so distracted and 'dumbed down' that many do not understand this compulsion, and continue to fill in these gaps they need to fill with material substitutes. You can adjust those valves all you want to release the steam building up under the lid, but it will be a perpetual process: as soon as steam is released at the top it will be replaced with yet more steam from below. Only a healthy dose of God and spiritual truth can make that steam subside for good!




While it is commendable, ( and fully expected), for you, I, and everyone else to oppose, ( and take measures against), the 'corrupt, selfish, and violent' that you refer to,....we should fully recognize that it will be at the Hands of Him, Jesus Christ, Himself, who will defeat these wicked forces, once and for all. We can 'assist', but it will be 'Him' that gains the victory and sets everything back in it's proper order!

I differ slightly on this aspect. Whereas 'Justice' if you will, will certainly be dealt out, in one form or another, to the wicked and selfish and corrupt etc, it won't be done on this, the Earth-side of life. Down here, it is up to us to defeat them, but not to judge them. The judgement will take place 'over there'. But with Jesus within us, and on our side, this defeat can play out, but I do not believe Jesus himself will take an active role - just like he didn't 2,000 years ago. He didn't fight the Romans, or even oppose them. He didn't lift a single finger, nor would he in his far superior capacity. His was a war of love, and of light, and of hope. Those are the tools with which we, and him, can win!

All the best mate

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

I have also, since a young age, had a relationship with "a voice" in my head which I once thought was the "the voice of God" which pointed often and directly to Jesus, the teachings of Jesus and our spiritual nature where the highest state within physicality is called "Christ Consciousness." As some may know, I now consider this voice to be of another nature, not of actual "god"... more likely an echo or remnant of some AI program or some diminishing thought form created far in our past. I also consider that this "voice" may be directed energy where the source may be of non earth born human origin as well as may be generated by earth born human beings. I doubt you will find anyone more open minded about this and at the same time, as healthy about all this as I have now emerged to be. I am no longer so emtionally attached to this ongoing experience and thus it does not rule me as it had for essentially 50 years of my 55 year life.

Thanks Justoneman, interesting stuff. This voice you have heard may in fact be a relative or loved one who has passed over just giving you a friendly tap-tap on the shoulder, a spirit guide perhaps. Or maybe a fragment of your higher-self manifesting as a sub- or even super-conscious thought? As long as such voices aren't harmful or negative then it's all good i guess.



I have the greatest respect for all traditions as long as we realize that (uhummmm this is just my opinion) - as long as we realize, these things are tools, or bridges to the lands of realization where we find that we are essentially the very thing we (in our past) felt separated from.

I agree there mate. But such tools are necessary to set us on this journey. It's just unfortunate that TPTB have seen fit to allow these tools to languish in the very same state in which they were created, ie antiquated, controlling, and nowhere near as developed as they could be, and so very *pro-separation* (internationally speaking). If you see my avatar you will understand what I stand for, and that is a further bridge between the various faiths, hoping to overturn this sense of ‘separation’ in the hope that some common ground can be found.




One isn't "forgiven" or "redeemed" or "saved" etc as those explorations just create new traps one must find their way out of.

I agree that this is a trap if it is another who professes to forgive us, redeem us, or save us. There is nothing to be learned, or achieved, when another, say a minister, places a hand on our heads and declares that we are forgiven/saved etc. We gain nothing from this. Unless we feel it, know it, and acknowledge within ourselves, it is utterly artificial. I believe that we must learn to forgive ourselves, redeem ourselves, and ultimately save ourselves - to know that we are, and believe that we are, not just because someone else has said it is so. To thine own self be true!. Honesty with ourselves is the first step. This is the beginning of insight. And it is the only way to start out on the journey if we are to have any hope of completing it.




One awakens or one remains deluded. It is that simple. Once awakened, on sees the silliness of all thee things... religion, special books written by the hands of the Divine or divinely guided chosen ones, etc. One, in fact, sees that the separation was an illusion (likely self generated) and that all the bridges back to actuality (the actual ality thus no need for a word such as reality).

So from within the matrix, when one is strong and loving in heart, these traditions and their sacred books are wonderful tools and thus "good."

Once securely anchored from without the matrix, one senses a sadness that things like this were ever needed in the first place.

Yeh I do follow you to a certain extent. But if these things, these ancient texts, lead to personal revelation, and a closer union with Spirit, God, the Holy Ghost, or whatever brand of higher, loving, force you subscribe to, it is anything but silly. The only thing that is silly about it is how spiritual truth and ancient knowledge has been ignored - or worse, misapplied, as it has been for centuries by various religions (-governments!) as a means to control / program / shepherd the masses. You just need to see through all that manipulation, and concentrate on the powerful kernals of truth and wisdom buried deep down inside these teachings - and there indeed you will find a bridge that leads out of the matrix, as you say, setting you free.

All the best

[kreagle]

While it is commendable, ( and fully expected), for you, I, and everyone else to oppose, ( and take measures against), the 'corrupt, selfish, and violent' that you refer to,....we should fully recognize that it will be at the Hands of Him, Jesus Christ, Himself, who will defeat these wicked forces, once and for all. We can 'assist', but it will be 'Him' that gains the victory and sets everything back in it's proper order!

I differ slightly on this aspect. Whereas 'Justice' if you will, will certainly be dealt out, in one form or another, to the wicked and selfish and corrupt etc, it won't be done on this, the Earth-side of life. Down here, it is up to us to defeat them, but not to judge them. The judgement will take place 'over there'. But with Jesus within us, and on our side, this defeat can play out, but I do not believe Jesus himself will take an active role - just like he didn't 2,000 years ago. He didn't fight the Romans, or even oppose them. He didn't lift a single finger, nor would he in his far superior capacity. His was a war of love, and of light, and of hope. Those are the tools with which we, and him, can win!




Hey Star Mariner, my dear friend,....


We both are actually still on the 'same page', here, for I didn't mean to imply that final justice would be issued by our Lord Jesus on the 'Earth-side of life' now. You would need to go to the Book of Revelation and read the account of the final restitution of all things to see where I was drawing my comment, above, from.



Revelation 19:9-21 (KJV)

9 And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.

10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.

13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, King Of Kings, And Lord Of Lords.

17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;

18 That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great.

19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.

20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

21 And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.


God Bless,.....your brother, friend, and servant,.....kreagle

[kreagle]

'Single' Vision,....OR.....Getting an 'Eye Full?'


http://static.flickr.com/19/110706484_7e94c6c075.jpg


We, humans, have an extremely short 'attention span' that is constantly dictating to us to 'look elsewhere'. We often find it quite difficult to pay attention to any one particular thing without having our attention diverted to other subject material that we find to be more appealing at the time. We even have many 'catch phrases' that are designed to assist us in this particular human affliction such as,......"Keep your eye on the ball!",.....or....."Pay attention to what you are doing!",....or...."Keep you eye on the prize!",....or simply to say,....."Stay focused!" Unfortunately, these many well intended phrases often wind up ineffective, ( and unheeded), as our 'eyes' still stray quite randomly from one focal point to another. Exactly,.....where, ( and when), did this human malady begin?


The answer to this is really quite simple,....for it happened in the Garden of Eden, precisely at the very moment of that 'fatal bite of disobedience' of our original ancestors, Adam and Eve. Through inheritance we have 'all' become afflicted with this 'wandering eye syndrome', for our 'carnal, fleshly nature' is constantly on the prowl looking for points of interest that individually appeals to our lustful, carnal nature.


Whether we want to admit it, or not,... we all find ourselves travelling down the 'highway of life' and suddenly coming upon the proverbial 'fork in the road' where we have a very important decision to make on which roadway we will turn down. Will we take the 'well traversed boulevard named Getting an Eye-Full',...or...do we take the 'sparsely used trail named Single Vision?'


God's Word, ( our own personal GPS system), has already carefully 'mapped out' the proper roadway for His children to use, ( and implement), here.



Matthew 6:22 (KJV)

22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.


And,....


Luke 11:34 (KJV)

34 The light of the body is the eye: therefore when thine eye is single, thy whole body also is full of light; but when thine eye is evil, thy body also is full of darkness.




Through Peter, we should all be able to see what the net results are to those who will keep their eye 'single', ( ie. 'fixed' upon God,...'fixed' upon His Will,.....'fixed' upon His Word, etc.) We also vividly see what happens when we allow ourselves to get an 'eye-full' of distractions as we have taken our 'eyes' off of Him and focus them elsewhere!



Matthew 14:22-31 (KJV)

22 And straightway Jesus constrained his disciples to get into a ship, and to go before him unto the other side, while he sent the multitudes away.

23 And when he had sent the multitudes away, he went up into a mountain apart to pray: and when the evening was come, he was there alone.

24 But the ship was now in the midst of the sea, tossed with waves: for the wind was contrary.

25 And in the fourth watch of the night Jesus went unto them, walking on the sea.

26 And when the disciples saw him walking on the sea, they were troubled, saying, It is a spirit; and they cried out for fear.

27 But straightway Jesus spake unto them, saying, Be of good cheer; it is I; be not afraid.

28 And Peter answered him and said, Lord, if it be thou, bid me come unto thee on the water.

29 And he said, Come. And when Peter was come down out of the ship, he walked on the water, to go to Jesus.

30 But when he saw the wind boisterous, he was afraid; and beginning to sink, he cried, saying, Lord, save me.

31 And immediately Jesus stretched forth his hand, and caught him, and said unto him, O thou of little faith, wherefore didst thou doubt?




The many diversions of life that we have today are constantly vying for our attention, whether they be....sexual,...monetary,...or other 'personal interests', and they will easily consume you if you don't take proper evasive measures against them. As with the 'boisterous waves' that Peter faced, I'm afraid there are many today who foolishly think they are 'good enough swimmers' to paddle their way through these 'raging seas of diversions'. Through satanic deception, this type of individual feels like they can 'periodically, ( or occasionally)', get an 'eye-full' of these diversions, ( sexual, monetary, or 'personal interests'), even though they 'know' it's not in their best interest and then 'paddle their way out' of these diversions when they want to.


This type of satanic deception, once believed, will get you 'spiritually drowned',....pure, plain, and simple, my dear friend! I don't care how 'skilled' of a swimmer you 'think' you are,....you'll never be able to spiritually survive the 'boisterous raging seas of diversions' that this world has to offer! You'll wind up on the 'bottom of this ocean', one day, wondering why you didn't reach out for His 'saving' Hand, like Peter did!


A 'Spirit-filled' life, as defined by the final directive of Peter's message in Acts 2:38, will begin the process of enabling you to keep your eye 'single',....divinely focused upon Him and His Word. Without the Holy Ghost experience, resident in your life, you're going to find yourself 'wandering', ( and 'wondering'), all over the place.


With 'all' my love,.....your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

Life in the 'Pressure Cooker'


http://cn1.kaboodle.com/hi/img/c/0/0/105/f/AAAADEa3fK0AAAAAAQXwgA.jpg?v=1289693720000


What does a 'young man' do when he painfully becomes aware, ( and awakened), to the fact that his entire 'system', ( ie. structural concepts, ideal-isms, and governing factors), are completely flawed and that they should not be 'blindly' relied upon as in the past? My 'structurally sound' lifestyle that I had tried to carefully lay out for myself and my loved ones had just been exposed as fundamentally flawed. Truly,...my life was in the 'pressure cooker'!


As indicated by my illustration of the 'Pressure Cooker' above, there are 'controls and valves' that are attached that, when deployed, will 'let some of the steam, ( pressure), escape'. The problem with this, though, is that 'most' people don't fully understand how to 'properly' deploy these 'controls and valves' within their respective lives during these realised moments of crisis. Hence, we see the 'suicide rates' escalating astronomically across this world in which we live as a result.




This article on the DrudgeReport especially caught my attention which is currently giving us a 'reading' on the mental state of an alarming number of Americans, and World-wide, too. It's titled,....."Americans 'Snapping' By The Millions" by David Kupelian. The 'pressure' just seems to be building, and building.


http://www.wnd.com/2013/04/americans-snapping-by-the-millions/

[kreagle]

What does 'Repentance' mean to you?


How,....precisely,.....would you define 'repentance' as you understand it, and it's role in Christianity? Please take a moment to seriously consider this topic and express your views/concerns towards this as you see it.





http://www.atotheword.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/repentance.jpg



Psalm 51:1-12 (KJV)

51 Have mercy upon me, O God, according to thy lovingkindness: according unto the multitude of thy tender mercies blot out my transgressions.

2 Wash me throughly from mine iniquity, and cleanse me from my sin.

3 For I acknowledge my transgressions: and my sin is ever before me.

4 Against thee, thee only, have I sinned, and done this evil in thy sight: that thou mightest be justified when thou speakest, and be clear when thou judgest.

5 Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me.

6 Behold, thou desirest truth in the inward parts: and in the hidden part thou shalt make me to know wisdom.

7 Purge me with hyssop, and I shall be clean: wash me, and I shall be whiter than snow.

8 Make me to hear joy and gladness; that the bones which thou hast broken may rejoice.

9 Hide thy face from my sins, and blot out all mine iniquities.

10 Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me.

11 Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me.

12 Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free spirit.




Your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[Akasha]

Repentance in the context of Psalms 51 was most likely a desperate bid to remove the guilt and anguish David was now feeling as a result of having sex with someone else's wife and then having them bumped off through strategic placement in battle where they were sure to be killed. I think his words of repentance were as selfishly motivated as the deeds which inspired them.

[kreagle]

Repentance in the context of Psalms 51 was most likely a desperate bid to remove the guilt and anguish David was now feeling as a result of having sex with someone else's wife and then having them bumped off through strategic placement in battle where they were sure to be killed. I think his words of repentance were as selfishly motivated as the deeds which inspired them.


Hey Akasha,


Brother, you are correct that the text I provided out of Psalms 51:1-12 deals with David's specific sin with Bathsheba, the wife of Uriah the Hittite. Indeed, the act that David committed was hideous, and self-centered , but I think it would be a great mistake to 'judge' David, ( or 'anyone' else), for his actions, here. We need to remember that David, and Bathsheba, hardly got off 'scott-free' for this act of adultery, for they lost the child of this sexual encounter, as foretold by the prophet Samuel. Another extremely important point that you might not be considering is that when the Lord first selected David, as a lad, from among his brothers, at his father's, ( Jesse), home, the Lord had to remind Samuel, ( the prophet), that He was not making His selection based upon 'outward appearances',......but was looking on the 'heart' of man, ( David), in making this divine selection. With this line of thought,....you can rest assured that the Lord 'still' had the full ability to 'see David's heart', ( ie. 'post adulterous affair'), and clearly see whether David had genuinely repented, or not! David only had to convince God of his repentance,....not you, or I,.....and he evidently did exactly that, to God's satisfaction.



1 Samuel 16:6-7 (KJV)

6 And it came to pass, when they were come, that he looked on Eliab, and said, Surely the Lord's anointed is before him.

7 But the Lord said unto Samuel, Look not on his countenance, or on the height of his stature; because I have refused him: for the Lord seeth not as man seeth; for man looketh on the outward appearance, but the Lord looketh on the heart.




I will admit, here, that I have generated this question concerning 'repentance' primarily because I'm really convinced that a great deal of individuals have a 'religiously bruised version', ( or concept), of what true 'Biblical repentance' actually is and was always intended to be.


With 'this' in mind,......perhaps 'everyone' will take an even deeper look at this 'topic' of 'repentance' for further discussion.


Your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[Akasha]

Priceless! The guy was a murderer but that's ok because god chose him lol.

[danimyl]

I find "bibles" and "religions" to be tools of nefarious higher level controllers. In fact - All so called "holy books" that allow one to be misled into taking the metaphors literally always end up being tools in the hands of energetic collectives that desire to manipulate the vulnerable. It took me many years of hoping otherwise for me to finally surrender to this probability.

Bombs are made and exploded based on these types of books and religions.

I recommend each seek to awaken to their direct connection. No need for filters... they only distort and inhibit.

All and only my humble opinion.

The New Message is sent at this time to directly address these problems and offer the path of direct connection through a program of preparation that is clear and easy to follow. It does away with the parables of ancient Messages. It speaks not to nations or leaders, but to individuals. It is given the way all God's Messages have been given by the Angelic Presence to a Messenger who is sent and prepared over decades. But now we have a literate world that can access it directly from a recording instead of waiting for Messengers to emerge from their caves of solitary Revelation. You can hear some of it in this video or click my signature for more.

YHcKhLY3d8w

[kreagle]

The New Message is sent at this time to directly address these problems and offer the path of direct connection through a program of preparation that is clear and easy to follow. It does away with the parables of ancient Messages. It speaks not to nations or leaders, but to individuals. It is given the way all God's Messages have been given by the Angelic Presence to a Messenger who is sent and prepared over decades. But now we have a literate world that can access it directly from a recording instead of waiting for Messengers to emerge from their caves of solitary Revelation.


As I have consistently stated,.....'everyone' has the God-given right to believe whatever belief system they choose to adhere to, but I have 'personally' found no fault, ( nor error), with the 'original,...Old Message' as delivered in the Bible. Furthermore, we are specifically warned,....very vehemently, by the Apostle Paul, to cleave to the 'original' Gospel Message, as taught by the Apostles, and to discard, ( and reject), any 'other' message that might come along through men, ( or angels), that preached a 'different' message.



Galatians 1:6-12 (KJV)

6 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:

7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.

8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

9 As we said before, so say I now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

10 For do I now persuade men, or God? or do I seek to please men? for if I yet pleased men, I should not be the servant of Christ.

11 But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.

12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.




Just a 'friendly, ( and loving)', reminder that one should be mindful of what the Scripture really says regarding the 'belief system' that we decide to embark upon.

A 'few' choose to do so,....but 'many' do not,.....so they turn to alternatives.


As 'always',....your friend, brother, and servant,.....kreagle

[AwakeInADream]

Priceless! The guy was a murderer but that's ok because god chose him lol.

Yep! Forgiveness is priceless!:) Earned only through true repentance/self realization:) Maybe God chose....God?:)

[kreagle]

Priceless! The guy was a murderer but that's ok because god chose him lol.

Yep! Forgiveness is priceless!:) Earned only through true repentance/self realization:) Maybe God chose....God?:)


Hey AwakeInADream,....thank you, dear brother!


Thus far, you are the 'only one' who has remotely responded within the realm of the simple question I asked concerning 'repentance'. I genuinely have a great concern that 'many' individuals do not have a proper understanding of repentance, from a pure Biblical perspective, and have been disillusioned, ( and badly bruised), by various dogmatic teachings that border between ignorance and being downright satanically inspired. I still hope to get 'others' views on this so that we might be able to address this,....as you say,....."priceless" divine commodity, ( called forgiveness), that is 'only derived through repentance'.


What is 'Biblical repentance'?,.....how should it be taught to mankind?,.....how 'has' it been taught to mankind?,....what does it accomplish?,.... is it vital?, etc?


What say 'you',.....one, and all?



Your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[humanalien]

I just wanted to talk a bit about the relationship
between God and mankind.

Many people in this world, including this forum, know
the bible, backwards, forwards and inside out. That is
all fine and good but i believe the whole idea of becoming
a christian, is to have a personal relationship with God
and Jesus.

Most people can learn the words in any textbook. They can
know these words very well and maybe even understand them
but that doesn't make it true. It's being said that school
kids are not being taught about the truth from our past and
i do believe that, yet it's being taught as truth.

Everyone knows that any bible from any religion, has been
altered to suit the need of those in power, such as kings
and church leaders. God even warned people in the kjv that
changing any word in the bible will have it's consequences.

I question people that are well versed in the bible, all the
time about how can you be sure that everything in the bible
is true. They usually throw a couple of verses at me to explain
how the words are true but that doesn't answer my question.

If the bible has been altered, then how can one be so sure
that their bible is telling the truth?

This is where having a personal relationship with God comes
in. By personal relationship, i mean that one should have a
personal communication with God (i.e) talk directly to God
or Jesus.

I have yet, to meet anyone, that has this ability and i'll be
dead before i ever see this for myself. If the bible is correct
in the beginning, Adam had this gift and so did Moses and a
few others. If one had this gift of having a personal relationship
with God, this very lucky person could question everything about
their bible and ask God if this or that is true, before preaching
it to the world.

People act like having this relationship with God is lost but
i don't believe it is. The same things that Adam, Noah, Moses
and others did with God are still available to anyone now that
believes it.

I don't even believe it involves meditating in order to talk to
God. It's more like bearing your soul to God and become Christ
like. Rid your mind of all evil thoughts and only think of Godly
things.

I wrote about this because the whole world is in a uproar over
who's religion is right or wrong and i personally, don't think
any of them are. All religions and all biblical text have been
perverted, in my opinion and the only way to know for sure what
God expects of mankind is to forget everything that you have
ever learned about religion and the bible and ask God directly.

It's time that mankind had a huge dose of truth and we just aren't
going to see this coming from mankind because we all have our
agenda's and the truth will never see the light of day.

Only through direct communication with God, will mankind finally
know the truth.

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Hey kreagle, thanks for your continuing words of wisdom my friend, very illuminating as always, and humbling.

The answer to this is really quite simple,....for it happened in the Garden of Eden, precisely at the very moment of that 'fatal bite of disobedience' of our original ancestors, Adam and Eve. Through inheritance we have 'all' become afflicted with this 'wandering eye syndrome', for our 'carnal, fleshly nature' is constantly on the prowl looking for points of interest that individually appeals to our lustful, carnal nature.

The many diversions of life that we have today are constantly vying for our attention, whether they be....sexual,...monetary,...or other 'personal interests', and they will easily consume you if you don't take proper evasive measures against them.

Whereas I view the events of the Garden of Eden as more a mythological root metaphor, than actual history, this is beside the point. We can both understand what is meant by the tale, and draw the same lesson. So that is not what I wish to discuss.

I agree, it is very hard to not get caught up in distraction, and quickly find ourselves veering off along the wrong fork in the road, especially when the Powers that Be delight in trying to entice us into taking that way, along this proverbial 'Las Vegas strip' of Distraction, Materialism, and Consumerism. So I agree totally, that this is a trap. A potentially fatal one.

But let us not forget also that the Earth is beautiful (a veritable Garden of Eden itself) , full of richness and almost endless experience. I submit that it is just as important not to 'isolate' oneself from what life has to offer in the way of simple joyfulness and yes - even base pleasures, and by that I don't necessarily mean those that make us feel guilty, but those that make us feel happy, invigorated, and fulfilled. I don't see anything wrong with that. I don't see anything wrong with what I did two nights ago for instance (a chance to let off steam), spending an evening at a friends house drinking beer ( not to excess), and playing cribbage into the early hours and having many a laugh along the way. In whatever activity one chooses to do, as long as you harm no one, there is no harm. That is my code. Sometimes religion places too much emphasis on guilt trips. In my personal opinion, distraction as in recreation, simple fun, need not be evil, or a distraction at all.

I do understand what you're saying, that in extremes, a detour from the straight path (to Jesus, enlightenment, etc) can be a serious problem, so yes I concur. Many people will sadly live their entire lives dedicated completely to self-gratification and materialism. But from the opposite polarity, there is an identical danger for the spiritually inclined, which is to shut themselves out entirely from the wide bounty that the world has to offer. Even to the holiest of holy men, I would say: 'lift your head from prayer once in a while. Don't forget to live!'

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Psalm 51:1-12 (KJV)

51 Have mercy upon me, O God, according to thy lovingkindness: according unto the multitude of thy tender mercies blot out my transgressions.
2 Wash me throughly from mine iniquity, and cleanse me from my sin.
3 For I acknowledge my transgressions: and my sin is ever before me.
4 Against thee, thee only, have I sinned, and done this evil in thy sight: that thou mightest be justified when thou speakest, and be clear when thou judgest.
5 Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me.
6 Behold, thou desirest truth in the inward parts: and in the hidden part thou shalt make me to know wisdom.
7 Purge me with hyssop, and I shall be clean: wash me, and I shall be whiter than snow.
8 Make me to hear joy and gladness; that the bones which thou hast broken may rejoice.
9 Hide thy face from my sins, and blot out all mine iniquities.
10 Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me.
11 Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me.
12 Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free spirit.

How,....precisely,.....would you define 'repentance' as you understand it, and it's role in Christianity? Please take a moment to seriously consider this topic and express your views/concerns towards this as you see it.

I will tell briefly what I believe is the core purpose of repentance, and what I 'see' in Psalm 51. By 'see', I mean perceive, 'read between the lines;' in accordance with my own understanding of how this mechanism of repentance works.

'God' as a being, a reality, a nature, whatever you wish to call him, is love. Love can neither judge nor condemn. All are loved, and forgiven. But I see here in this psalm that the speaker is seeking to find the presence of God inside of him, to feel it touch him, and to thus find a personal absolution of sins.

But I do not believe the speaker is looking for God to come down and 'actively' do this, to intervene and 'do all the hard work for him’ as a pro-active force. No, he is seeking God to enter in as a passive agent, so that with His light and His love this speaker can truly 'see' into the dark spaces in his life, and make the changes himself.

This is Repantance – remorse, regret, sorrow at our transgressions. This is necessary as a first step, before we can find forgiveness. And that can only really be achieved by seeing, acknowledging, and forgiving ourselves - not ‘repentance’ to God, but in the presence of God within us. The speaker in this Psalm wants this God-energy, the Holy Ghost, the purity of Spirit, to touch him inwardly, like a healing-salve, so he will be cleansed and purged of his iniquity, like a dry, rusty, seized engine that seeks warm, smooth oil to make it whole, and functional once again. This is that first, and most important step on the path to forgiveness, and the transformation of oneself.

This, my friends, is what it's all about. God will ultimately forgive you, but to truly move forward and not stand still (or worse, regress), you must learn to forgive yourself! Open the door and let him in, then you'll have all that you need to do this.

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

I just wanted to talk a bit about the relationship
between God and mankind.

Many people in this world, including this forum, know
the bible, backwards, forwards and inside out. That is
all fine and good but i believe the whole idea of becoming
a christian, is to have a personal relationship with God
and Jesus.

Most people can learn the words in any textbook. They can
know these words very well and maybe even understand them
but that doesn't make it true. It's being said that school
kids are not being taught about the truth from our past and
i do believe that, yet it's being taught as truth.

Everyone knows that any bible from any religion, has been
altered to suit the need of those in power, such as kings
and church leaders. God even warned people in the kjv that
changing any word in the bible will have it's consequences.

I question people that are well versed in the bible, all the
time about how can you be sure that everything in the bible
is true. They usually throw a couple of verses at me to explain
how the words are true but that doesn't answer my question.

If the bible has been altered, then how can one be so sure
that their bible is telling the truth?

This is where having a personal relationship with God comes
in. By personal relationship, i mean that one should have a
personal communication with God (i.e) talk directly to God
or Jesus.

I have yet, to meet anyone, that has this ability and i'll be
dead before i ever see this for myself. If the bible is correct
in the beginning, Adam had this gift and so did Moses and a
few others. If one had this gift of having a personal relationship
with God, this very lucky person could question everything about
their bible and ask God if this or that is true, before preaching
it to the world.

People act like having this relationship with God is lost but
i don't believe it is. The same things that Adam, Noah, Moses
and others did with God are still available to anyone now that
believes it.

I don't even believe it involves meditating in order to talk to
God. It's more like bearing your soul to God and become Christ
like. Rid your mind of all evil thoughts and only think of Godly
things.

I wrote about this because the whole world is in a uproar over
who's religion is right or wrong and i personally, don't think
any of them are. All religions and all biblical text have been
perverted, in my opinion and the only way to know for sure what
God expects of mankind is to forget everything that you have
ever learned about religion and the bible and ask God directly.

It's time that mankind had a huge dose of truth and we just aren't
going to see this coming from mankind because we all have our
agenda's and the truth will never see the light of day.

Only through direct communication with God, will mankind finally
know the truth.

Thank-you Human Alien this is a great post and sums up so many things I personally believe to be true. You nailed it right here, saying: I don't even believe it involves meditating in order to talk to God. It's more like bearing your soul to God and become Christ like. Rid your mind of all evil thoughts and only think of Godly things.

But I would be wary of 'asking God directly' and seeing what he has to say. Rather, if God is already in you, live your life by the code this 'energy' grants (rather than any voice that speaks) and use it to direct your path, and do good in this world.. and to love.

Unfortunately, however, there are many instances of people claiming that they did this or did that because 'God' told them to do it. Usually this is claimed as an excuse for something bad (re: false messiahs like Jim Jones, the Waco guy, I forget his name, or just the various political dogmas that have perverted Islam). This is at best a fantasy, at worse coercion by dark forces. Those who claim to hear the voice of God or Jesus in their head - as an actual, speaking voice telling them what to feel, how to act, what to do etc - are more than likely under an unwholesome and potentially damaging influence. It's little more than 'Channelling', which definitely can't be trusted.

[humanalien]

John 10:25 - 30

25: Jesus answered them, I told you, and you believed not:
the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.

26: But you believe not, because you are not of my sheep, as I
said to you.

27: My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

28: And I give to them eternal life; and they shall never perish,
neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

29: My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man
is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

30: I and my Father are one.

Concentrating on line 27, "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them,
and they follow me:", wouldn't one think that the real people of
God would know his voice and not just assume it was God talking
to them?

[humanalien]

Now, if the kjv bible is correct and everyone thinks
that this is the true word of God, how would one
interpret this line from Genesis 3:16.

This comes right after eve ate the fruit from the tree
of good and evil and then gave it to adam to eat. This
is when God had found out what eve and adam had done and
passes judgement on them.

Because eve was the first one to commit the original sin,
God appoints adam as the ruler over eve.

16: To the woman he said, I will greatly multiply
your sorrow and your conception; in sorrow you shall
bring forth children; and your desire shall be to your
husband, and he shall rule over you.

The question is, does this apply only to adam and eve or
does this mean that all husbands are rulers over their wives,
brothers over sisters?

Question two is that, after Jesus came and went, did the laws
that Jesus laid out, nullify anything that God had previously
commanded man to do?

[thunder24]

Question two is that, after Jesus came and went, did the laws
that Jesus laid out, nullify anything that God had previously
commanded man to do?

no. by walking in the way as Jesus was the way, then u are fullfilling the old commandments. To love your neighbor as yourself and God with all ur heart mind, soul, strenght, etc... would b to fullfill the law of old.

[humanalien]

I realize that i seem to be stuck in the
beginning of the bible but things just are
not adding up.

We are all taught that God created adam and eve
and that they were the father and mother of all
living mankind. Well at least eve was said to be
the mother of all the living and maybe in part,
that may be true.

I found online, a 1611 version of the KJV bible
and i began reading it from Genesis. That is when
i discovered something that i had been overlooking,
in the 1995 version. Since the 1611 version, seems
to be using "U" in place of "V", in that text, i
had trouble reading it, so i was looking and reading
extra careful, when i ran across one word that proves
that God had indeed created mankind before he created
adam and eve.

Take a look at Gen 1:26 1995 version KJV

Genesis 1:26

And God said, Let us make man in our image,
after our likeness: and let them have dominion
over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of
the air, and over the cattle, and over all the
earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth
upon the earth.

The key word here is them. If God had only
created adam, one man, the bible would read,
let him and not them. Them means more than
one.

This was in the 1611 version as well.

This would certainly explain where cain got his
wife from.

This creation happened on the sixth day and
God rested on the seventh day.

Then in chapter 2, the bible begins telling the
story of adam and eve and the point here is,
how much time had passed between the 7th
day of rest to when God created adam and eve.

It had to have been a long time in order for cain
to have found a wife in a different land.

Another point to bring up is when cain built a
city. Why would cain need to build a city for
only him and his wife? There had to be a lot of
people in that new land that cain occupied, in
order for cain to need to build a city and he
couldn't have built it himself.

In the book of Enoch, It says that adam and eve
were on a mountain and after they had many
children, they began looking over the edge of the
mountain and their were other people living down
their.

There was a path leading from the mountain to
the bottom but the people on the bottom could not
walk up the path to meet with Gods chosen people
because God would not allow it.

Every time adam and eves children looked over the
edge, the people on the bottom would entice them
to come down to them.

Eventually, after adam and eve died, some of them
did go down to meet the others.

So, even though the book is not an official version
of any bible, it does have it's merits.

This is just further proof that there were already people
on the earth before adam and eve.

Just so that you know, i was begging and pleading with
God to give me some revelation and understanding about
bible because before that point, i couldn't figure that mess
out.

That is why i believe this to be true. I believe God himself
lead me to this answer. I hope to find out more.

[kreagle]

Only through direct communication with God, will mankind finally
know the truth.


humanalien,

I want to apologize to 'all' for not replying as quickly as I might normally respond, but my work schedule has been very time consuming for me this week, and may also be for the next few days. While I have been able to take an occasional 'peek' at the thread, I haven't been able to respond, but will get caught up as time permits.


Your statement about having a 'personal relationship with God',....also followed up with 'direct communication with God' is certainly correct, my dear friend. This is just another reason, ( out of many), why a person must be 'born of the water and the Spirit', ( as Jesus indicated to Nicodemus in John, chapter 3. My personal infilling of the Holy Ghost, which occurred on February 22, 1981, made that relationship with God 'very' personal, indeed,......enabling me to directly communicate with Him, in Spirit, on a level that I, formerly, never realized was even possible to do to begin with.



John 14:15-21 (KJV)

15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;

17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.

20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.

21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.



Brother, I sincerely hope that the 'colors' that I use to 'highlight', here don't offend, ( or throw you off track), for I simply do so, in an effort to specifically point out something 'special' that is contained within the Scriptures that 'many' normally just skim over without recognizing the importance of what the Spirit is endeavoring to reveal to us at that particular moment we are reading it.


Even though Jesus spoke these words over two thousand years ago, verse 20 particularly 'jumps out to me', when He said,....."At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you." My personal 'that day' was the day that I indicated, earlier,....February 22, 1981,....for it was, literally, on 'that day' that I fully realized that He wasn't just 'with' me,...anymore, but was now 'in' me,....to dwell within my own body from that point onward!


When He filled me with His Spirit,...on 'that day', I miraculously began to 'speak in other tongues',....a language that I had never previously known, or was learned in. It was, no doubt, 'my own tongue' He was using,....and 'my own vocal chords',....but His Spirit had 'taken control' of both of these as His Spirit expressed Himself through me. His Spirit literally moved into my life,....'that day',....and has changed me forevermore!


Let me, further, say this about being filled with the Holy Ghost. Obviously, being a man, I cannot explain what it is like to be filled with 'another life form', ( a child), like a woman can. However, as a father to the three children that my wife and I had, I have personally seen the 'effects' of 'another life form' inside the womb, ( and belly), of my wife as each of my children grew during the pregnancies of each of them. I can vividly remember the amazement that we both had, my wife and I, as we watched our 'children' move about in her belly causing her stomach to 'jump about' as their little elbows, legs, and even their heads, would rub against the inside of her womb and the walls of her stomach. I, as their father, could see on the 'outside' what was happening on the 'inside' of my wife's womb, and I often wondered,....."what must it 'feel like' to have another life form inside of you?"


Brother,.....I 'no longer have to wonder, anymore' what it's like to have 'another Life Form dwelling within me',......for 'now' I know!!!


That, literally, is how real my 'experience' was, ( and 'still' is), when I was filled with His Spirit,....the Holy Ghost, my dear friend! The ensuing months 'after' I was filled with His Spirit, I would often find myself crying with joy and often found myself wondering if I ought to 'go to the hospital' to get a scan, ( or image), of this new Life Form that had took up residence in my life. Of course, I would just warmly smile, to myself, for I already 'knew' what had happened to me.


So brother,.....I can certainly agree with you,....in a resounding, ( and robust), way when you state that one needs a 'personal relationship,.....and direct communication with God'. I can also tell you 'how' to get there, and attain it, too,....my dear friend!


Another few things I'd like to point out to you, brother. Yes, the KJV, is 'still' more than adequate for you, ( or anyone else), to find and obtain His full Truth. There 'are' newer versions that have been craftily, ( and satanically), altered that I would suggest for you to 'stay away from'. Let me say this, here,....that 'all' of the best laid plans of Satan, himself, cannot keep you from finding, ( and obtaining), God's Truth for you life 'if' you are hungry enough and really want to know the Truth,.....pure, plain, and simple!



John 10:25 - 30

25: Jesus answered them, I told you, and you believed not:
the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.

26: But you believe not, because you are not of my sheep, as I
said to you.

27: My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

28: And I give to them eternal life; and they shall never perish,
neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

29: My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man
is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

30: I and my Father are one.

Concentrating on line 27, "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them,
and they follow me:", wouldn't one think that the real people of
God would know his voice and not just assume it was God talking
to them?


Yes, my dear friend,.....I 'know' when I'm hearing His voice,....courtesy to His Spirit that 'dwells within', and giving His constant guidance to me.



John 16:13-14 (KJV)

13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.


And for your 'latest' post


Now, if the kjv bible is correct and everyone thinks
that this is the true word of God, how would one
interpret this line from Genesis 3:16.

This comes right after eve ate the fruit from the tree
of good and evil and then gave it to adam to eat. This
is when God had found out what eve and adam had done and
passes judgement on them.

Because eve was the first one to commit the original sin,
God appoints adam as the ruler over eve.

16: To the woman he said, I will greatly multiply
your sorrow and your conception; in sorrow you shall
bring forth children; and your desire shall be to your
husband, and he shall rule over you.

The question is, does this apply only to adam and eve or
does this mean that all husbands are rulers over their wives,
brothers over sisters?

Question two is that, after Jesus came and went, did the laws
that Jesus laid out, nullify anything that God had previously
commanded man to do?


Question #1
Notice your words,....'all husbands', brother. Now take a look at these passages from Ephesians.



Ephesians 5:21-23 (KJV)

21 Submitting yourselves one to another in the fear of God.

22 Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord.

23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.




Yes, the directive given by God, in Genesis 3:16, still applies today, as long as a 'husband' uses this divine authority 'as unto the Lord' and doesn't try to persuade, ( or force), his wife to do something that was specifically contrary to the Word of the Lord. For example,.....a wife who was being instructed to 'help' her husband rob a bank would certainly not be obligated, in God's eyes, to go along with him, for this would be in violation to the Ten Commandments,....."Thou shalt not steal",.....


Question #2
....after Jesus came and went, did the laws
that Jesus laid out, nullify anything that God had previously
commanded man to do?


Remember, brother, that Jesus was 'God manifest in the flesh', ( 1 Timothy 3:16),....and to 'nullify' anything that God had previously commanded man to do,.....would have simply been tantamount to 'nullifying Himself'.

Also,....notice this passage for further clarification.



Matthew 5:16-18 (KJV)

16 Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.

17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.



I hope you are blessed, and that this helps out, brother!


Your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Genesis 1:26

And God said, Let us make man in our image,
after our likeness: and let them have dominion
over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of
the air, and over the cattle, and over all the
earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth
upon the earth.

The key word here is them. If God had only
created adam, one man, the bible would read,
let him and not them. Them means more than
one.

It's interesting that you highlight the phrase let them here, for it is certainly of interest, but you seemed not so equally interested in the phrases of a (singular) God which reads: Let us, and our likeness etc. Curious, isn't it, well it is to me anyway...

If you analyse too deeply every word of the Bible, no matter how well meaning the exercise or what truths great or subtle that you find, you will invariably uncover a whole host of problems and contradictions, and they often require quite creative 'interpretations' to fall in line with the established ‘doctrine’. It is a highly error-prone document, and such 'interpretations' will still - always - be just a ‘guess’. This is all well and good if you are looking to increase your scholarly understanding of Christianity, and History. But if you are trying to enhance your understanding of God, and further enrich your Christian faith, my advice would be not to attempt this exercise, or to worry about such questions. Just concentrate on the good stuff!

[kreagle]

How,....precisely,.....would you define 'repentance' as you understand it, and it's role in Christianity? Please take a moment to seriously consider this topic and express your views/concerns towards this as you see it.

I will tell briefly what I believe is the core purpose of repentance, and what I 'see' in Psalm 51. By 'see', I mean perceive, 'read between the lines;' in accordance with my own understanding of how this mechanism of repentance works.

'God' as a being, a reality, a nature, whatever you wish to call him, is love. Love can neither judge nor condemn. All are loved, and forgiven. But I see here in this psalm that the speaker is seeking to find the presence of God inside of him, to feel it touch him, and to thus find a personal absolution of sins.

But I do not believe the speaker is looking for God to come down and 'actively' do this, to intervene and 'do all the hard work for him’ as a pro-active force. No, he is seeking God to enter in as a passive agent, so that with His light and His love this speaker can truly 'see' into the dark spaces in his life, and make the changes himself.

This is Repantance – remorse, regret, sorrow at our transgressions. This is necessary as a first step, before we can find forgiveness. And that can only really be achieved by seeing, acknowledging, and forgiving ourselves - not ‘repentance’ to God, but in the presence of God within us. The speaker in this Psalm wants this God-energy, the Holy Ghost, the purity of Spirit, to touch him inwardly, like a healing-salve, so he will be cleansed and purged of his iniquity, like a dry, rusty, seized engine that seeks warm, smooth oil to make it whole, and functional once again. This is that first, and most important step on the path to forgiveness, and the transformation of oneself.

This, my friends, is what it's all about. God will ultimately forgive you, but to truly move forward and not stand still (or worse, regress), you must learn to forgive yourself! Open the door and let him in, then you'll have all that you need to do this.


Star Mariner,

You are, indeed, hitting upon an aspect of repentance that is often fundamental in actually achieving 'total' repentance, and that's 'forgiving yourself', also. I personally know a man, right now, who continues to have great difficulty getting over things in his past, things that he did to 'others', and I am convinced that he is plagued by not 'forgiving himself' which is causing him to, currently, not be able to progress fully in his walk with God.

Another vital component to repentance equally deals with our 'inward' self, and that's whenever we finally 'wake-up' and come to our senses, realizing that we've 'gone far enough' and that we desperately need to 'stop the madness',....put on the brakes, ( so-to-speak),....and be willing to make a complete 180 degree turn from the direction we have been going in. This is 'exactly' what the Prodigal Son did, as he finally came to the realization that he needed to 'go back home'. Most people fail to recognize that in order to 'come to God',....one needs to 'come to themselves',....FIRST,.....before you will be able to 'successfully' make your way to Him!



Luke 15:11-20 (KJV)

11 And he said, A certain man had two sons:

12 And the younger of them said to his father, Father, give me the portion of goods that falleth to me. And he divided unto them his living.

13 And not many days after the younger son gathered all together, and took his journey into a far country, and there wasted his substance with riotous living.

14 And when he had spent all, there arose a mighty famine in that land; and he began to be in want.

15 And he went and joined himself to a citizen of that country; and he sent him into his fields to feed swine.

16 And he would fain have filled his belly with the husks that the swine did eat: and no man gave unto him.

17 And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!

18 I will arise and go to my father, and will say unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before thee,

19 And am no more worthy to be called thy son: make me as one of thy hired servants.

20 And he arose, and came to his father. But when he was yet a great way off, his father saw him, and had compassion, and ran, and fell on his neck, and kissed him.




Repentance has often been sullied, in reputation, ( especially by Catholicism), as they have exercised their 'self-righteousness' by placing extreme 'guiltiness' on individuals in their quest for God. I am, equally, persuaded that this type of satanically misplaced guidance has severely damaged, ( and bruised), many potential believers, running many of them off, and scaring the rest of them from ever returning! No wonder Jesus 'coined this phrase' in the Book of Mark.



Mark 9:42 (KJV)

42 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.




I agree with you completely, brother, where repentance involves,..."remorse, regret, sorrow at our transgressions,".....as you have accurately pointed out, but to badger someone with 'guilt' is a despicable act that I've seen deployed by many over zealous, ( and grossly untrained), Christians with disastrous results, I might add.

Simply stated,.....to 'properly' repent of one's sins,....one would be especially wise to take the advise, ( and example), of the remorseful, regretful, and sorrowful, Prodigal Son. First,....'come to yourself' and realize that you've got to 'stop the madness' of going in the 'wrong direction' and be willing, ( and determined), to come to a complete halt. Dig your 'spiritual' heals in right then,....and now! Don't allow yourself to go another 'inch' in the direction that you've been going in,....and THEN be willing, ( and determined), to make a 180 degree turn, for it's in 'that direction' where you will find the 'open arms of your awaiting Father',....my dear, dear, friends!


By the way, Star Mariner, I absolutely love your analogy of the 'rusty seized engine!'



like a dry, rusty, seized engine that seeks warm, smooth oil to make it whole, and functional once again. ]


Did you know that the Holy Ghost experience is Scripturally compared to the 'anointing oil' of our spirit? I can 'certainly' relate, ( and appreciate), that!!!



May God Bless,.....your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[humanalien]

Genesis 1:26

And God said, Let us make man in our image,
after our likeness: and let them have dominion
over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of
the air, and over the cattle, and over all the
earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth
upon the earth.

The key word here is them. If God had only
created adam, one man, the bible would read,
let him and not them. Them means more than
one.

It's interesting that you highlight the phrase let them here, for it is certainly of interest, but you seemed not so equally interested in the phrases of a (singular) God which reads: Let us, and our likeness etc. Curious, isn't it, well it is to me anyway...

If you analyse too deeply every word of the Bible, no matter how well meaning the exercise or what truths great or subtle that you find, you will invariably uncover a whole host of problems and contradictions, and they often require quite creative 'interpretations' to fall in line with the established ‘doctrine’. It is a highly error-prone document, and such 'interpretations' will still - always - be just a ‘guess’. This is all well and good if you are looking to increase your scholarly understanding of Christianity, and History. But if you are trying to enhance your understanding of God, and further enrich your Christian faith, my advice would be not to attempt this exercise, or to worry about such questions. Just concentrate on the good stuff!

I understand what you are saying but to concentrate only
on the good stuff means that we are not trying to learn
everything the bible has to offer.

The way you worded your post, although i don't believe it was
intentional, is to say only learn parts of the bible and scrap the
rest because it doesn't make sense or it's not that important.

Every word in the bible is important and it was put there for us
to learn. Not just part of it but all of it.

I had posted more here about how i believed God and Jesus were
two different entities, sharing the same spirit but as kreagle pointed
out, 1 Timothy 3:16 does say that "God was manifest in the flesh".

I was trying to respond to you talking about "Let us and In our".

I always assumed that God was talking to Jesus, so now i'm confused.

God/Jesus being the same entity makes no sense. Was God talking
to himself when saying "Let us and In our"?

After Jesus ascended to heaven, we were told that we had to pray
to God in Jesus name. Makes no sense if both are the same entity.

Maybe i'm not ready for this forum yet. I don't want to mislead
anyone.....

[kreagle]

Genesis 1:26

And God said, Let us make man in our image,
after our likeness: and let them have dominion
over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of
the air, and over the cattle, and over all the
earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth
upon the earth.

The key word here is them. If God had only
created adam, one man, the bible would read,
let him and not them. Them means more than
one.

It's interesting that you highlight the phrase let them here, for it is certainly of interest, but you seemed not so equally interested in the phrases of a (singular) God which reads: Let us, and our likeness etc. Curious, isn't it, well it is to me anyway...

If you analyse too deeply every word of the Bible, no matter how well meaning the exercise or what truths great or subtle that you find, you will invariably uncover a whole host of problems and contradictions, and they often require quite creative 'interpretations' to fall in line with the established ‘doctrine’. It is a highly error-prone document, and such 'interpretations' will still - always - be just a ‘guess’. This is all well and good if you are looking to increase your scholarly understanding of Christianity, and History. But if you are trying to enhance your understanding of God, and further enrich your Christian faith, my advice would be not to attempt this exercise, or to worry about such questions. Just concentrate on the good stuff!

I understand what you are saying but to concentrate only
on the good stuff means that we are not trying to learn
everything the bible has to offer.

The way you worded your post, although i don't believe it was
intentional, is to say only learn parts of the bible and scrap the
rest because it doesn't make sense or it's not that important.

Every word in the bible is important and it was put there for us
to learn. Not just part of it but all of it.

I had posted more here about how i believed God and Jesus were
two different entities, sharing the same spirit but as kreagle pointed
out, 1 Timothy 3:16 does say that "God was manifest in the flesh".

I was trying to respond to you talking about "Let us and In our".

I always assumed that God was talking to Jesus, so now i'm confused.

God/Jesus being the same entity makes no sense. Was God talking
to himself when saying "Let us and In our"?

After Jesus ascended to heaven, we were told that we had to pray
to God in Jesus name. Makes no sense if both are the same entity.

Maybe i'm not ready for this forum yet. I don't want to mislead
anyone.....


humanalien,


Brother, have you ever heard of anyone making the statement,......"What shall 'we' do today,....or.....how shall 'we' approach this situation,....or.....what does this teach 'us'?,.... in the midst of a problem/condition that they were trying to figure out by their self? What they are doing is simply 'counseling with themselves' as they endeavor to come up with a solution to whatever they are being faced with. God, in no wise, was discussing this creative process of mankind with any other deity, but he was simply 'counseling with His own will', here.


Notice the following scripture, brother, in Ephesians 1:11.



Ephesians 1:8-12 (KJV)

8 Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;

9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:

10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:

11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:

12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.




Furthermore, we see that there was no actual 'us', ( in a plurality sense), of Deity's that took part in the creation of mankind,.....but 'only One', my dear friend.



Genesis 1:27 (KJV)

27 So God created man in his, (singular), own image, in the image of God created he, (singular), him; male and female created he, (singular), them.

Also,....


Malachi 2:10 (KJV)

10 Have we not all one father? hath not one God created us? why do we deal treacherously every man against his brother, by profaning the covenant of our fathers?





As far as the 'them' factor, as you can see this would have also included Eve,....making a 'plurality of persons' and not just one,.....not to mention all the 'other' humans that would succeed them down the road,....certainly making mankind a 'plurality', or 'them'.


humanalien, 1 Timothy 3:16 is just the 'beginning' of many passages that begin to reveal who Jesus actually was. As stated, indeed,....'God was manifest, ( made known, or revealed), in the flesh'. Notice this passage in John, chapter one. ( note: I eliminated verses 6-9, here, for they dealt specifically with the introduction of John the Baptist, and I didn't want to confuse, or side-track you from the point I am endeavoring to show here).



John 1:1-5,....10-14 (KJV)

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 The same was in the beginning with God.

3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.






10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.

11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not. ( ie. His people, Israel,...that rejected Him)

12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.




As I said, brother, these passages are just the 'beginning',.....the 'tip of the iceberg' that begins to reveal who this Jesus 'actually was,....and IS!',....my dear brother!


Don't you 'EVER' forget these words that came 'expressly' from you!,....humanalien!



Every word in the bible is important and it was put there for us
to learn. Not just part of it but all of it.




Amen, brother,.....and again, amen!



John 5:39 (KJV)

39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.




Jesus Christ,.....The Word,......God manifest in the flesh,.....( ie. the more you look into this,....the more you will 'see', my dear friend. These are not 'typos', brother,....but 'rays of revelation' for those who wish to really see and understand!)

More 'rays' are coming your way, brother!


Your brother, friend, and servant,.....kreagle

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

I understand what you are saying but to concentrate only
on the good stuff means that we are not trying to learn
everything the bible has to offer.

The way you worded your post, although i don't believe it was
intentional, is to say only learn parts of the bible and scrap the
rest because it doesn't make sense or it's not that important.

Every word in the bible is important and it was put there for us
to learn. Not just part of it but all of it.



Hey Human Alien. When I said concentrate on the good stuff I didn't mean at the expense of all other material, I meant merely to suggest that if one over-analyses the 'discrepancies' in a scholastic sense, your Bible study will become nothing more than a clinical and academic exercise, potentially drawing you away from important truths.

I totally agree that every word is important - important for the Christian doctrine, and all who follow it. I do... for the most part. I don't think it would be good to again 'grapple' over scriptural inconsistencies/semantics etc, with you or kreagle, it would not be a productive debate, and besides, we've already been there, (kreagle and I had some very deep discussions about this on previous pages).

I've talked (In various places) about what I believe to be the case regarding the Old Testament story elsewhere in this thread (briefly summed up half-way down this post surrounding Yahweh (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?48678-Bible-Topics-and-Questions&p=569225&viewfull=1#post569225)).

This will probably not align with your own thought, but it may at least inform you as to why I, personally, feel the way I do about this topic, and why I adhere to the New Testament messages of Jesus Christ - and that it is the most important matter, rather than the ancient Jewish creation myth of the Old Testament.

[humanalien]

I understand what you are saying but to concentrate only
on the good stuff means that we are not trying to learn
everything the bible has to offer.

The way you worded your post, although i don't believe it was
intentional, is to say only learn parts of the bible and scrap the
rest because it doesn't make sense or it's not that important.

Every word in the bible is important and it was put there for us
to learn. Not just part of it but all of it.



Hey Human Alien. When I said concentrate on the good stuff I didn't mean at the expense of all other material, I meant merely to suggest that if one over-analyses the 'discrepancies' in a scholastic sense, your Bible study will become nothing more than a clinical and academic exercise, potentially drawing you away from important truths.

I totally agree that every word is important - important for the Christian doctrine, and all who follow it. I do... for the most part. I don't think it would be good to again 'grapple' over scriptural inconsistencies/semantics etc, with you or kreagle, it would not be a productive debate, and besides, we've already been there, (kreagle and I had some very deep discussions about this on previous pages).

I've talked (In various places) about what I believe to be the case regarding the Old Testament story elsewhere in this thread (briefly summed up half-way down this post surrounding Yahweh (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?48678-Bible-Topics-and-Questions&p=569225&viewfull=1#post569225)).

This will probably not align with your own thought, but it may at least inform you as to why I, personally, feel the way I do about this topic, and why I adhere to the New Testament messages of Jesus Christ - and that it is the most important matter, rather than the ancient Jewish creation myth of the Old Testament.

I figured that i had misinterpreted your post wrong
and i do apologize.

[humanalien]

Kreagle

There's a lot of stuff that doesn't make sense.

In Matthew 3:17, after john the baptist, baptizes
Jesus, Gos said "This is my beloved Son, in whom
I am well pleased".

How can God have a son(Jesus) and still be the
same entity?

I should have said:

How can God be his own son and still be God
at the same time?

That would be like you, going to a lake to be baptized
and as soon as that is done, you rush off to get a helicopter,
fly over the area where you were baptized and got on the
bull horn and said "This is my beloved son".

Obviously, you are not your son and your son is not you.

I won't say that your wrong about your post above, because
clearly, i'm considered a baby in the lord, and need the mature
more but i will say that i just don't understand how this can be.


Going back to the creation story

As i stated earlier, i believe that they were two creations on earth.
The first creation of animals and mankind happen in Genesis 1: 24 - 28

This happen on the sixth day of creation.

24:And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so.



25:And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creeps on the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good.


26:And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.

27:So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. 28:And God blessed them, and God said to them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moves on the earth.

The word we are looking for here is obviously earth.

At this time, Gods created animals and men and women and
they were not confined to just a garden in Eden.

God said, "Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind".
God said "Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth".

God didn't put any of those creations into a garden, he spread them
throughout the whole earth.

These were not your typical farm animals that he created, these were
the wild animals that didn't require any attention from mankind. They
fed themselves and bore and raised their own offspring.

Also notice the plant life he created by reading Genesis 1:29-30
29:And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is on the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.

30: And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creeps on the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so.

The plant life that God created, did not require any farming at all. Every food
plant created, created it's own seeds that could drop to the ground through
various means and grow a new plant, without the farming skills of any man.

This was to be for food or meat as the bible says, foe every living creature
on the whole earth. No garden mentioned here, God said the whole earth.

Just to point out something, God never told adam and eve to replenish the
earth at no time. At least not in Genesis.

Now, i don't know just how special these first created humans were to God.
I don't know if they were living souls like adam was. All i know is that they
were created before adam and eve.

Now lets go to Genesis 2 verses 1-3
1:Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.

2:And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

3:And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

This is just stating that God had ended his creating for a while and he
rested on the 7th day.

Why this wasn't put in chapter one, i'll never know.

Now the question to ask is, how much time had passed from the day
that God rested to the time that he started creating again, I don't
know because the bible doesn't say, so let get right into the creation
on adam and eve.

Genesis 2:4-7

4:These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens,

5:And every plant of the field before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field before it grew: for the LORD God had not caused it to rain on the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground.

6:But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground.

7:And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

Now i'll admit that verse 5 is a bit dicey about no rain on earth yet. If God did
create plants in the first creation, where did they get there water from, unless
there roots reached down into ground wells. We all ready know that water was
created in the beginning, a clouds, air and all but it never rained yet.

Notice also in verse 5 it says: "there was not a man to till the ground".

Then in verse 6, God causes a mist to come up from earth, to water the whole ground.

So now we have irrigation for plants to grow.

Then in verse 7, God creates man again and only one but this time
this man becomes a living soul. He must have been a very special
creation of God for him to become a living soul.

During the first creation of men and women, it wasn't mentioned that
they were living souls, just that they were created.

Now. What does God do next? He creates a special place for this man
call the garden of eden and right away, he places the man in the garden.

God didn't do that for his first creations of men and women. He spread
them throughout the whole earth and told them to be fruitful and multiply
but adam got his own garden area set between 4 river heads.

Genesis 2:8-14
8:And the LORD God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed.

9: And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the middle of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
10:And a river went out of Eden to water the garden; and from there it was parted, and became into four heads.


11:The name of the first is Pison: that is it which compasses the whole land of Havilah, where there is gold;


12:And the gold of that land is good: there is bdellium and the onyx stone.

13:And the name of the second river is Gihon: the same is it that compasses the whole land of Ethiopia.

14:And the name of the third river is Hiddekel: that is it which goes toward the east of Assyria. And the fourth river is Euphrates.

Verse 9 says the God made to grow, every tree that is pleasant to the sight and
good for food but he doesn't say that they create there own seeds. At least seeds
that could just simply fall off the tree and take root.

These trees must have needed a farmer to help them spread their seeds elsewhere to grow
and remember verse 5 "there was not a man to till the ground".

Just by those words, means that God needed a farmer in the garden to help maintain
and grow new trees. Not like after the first creation where those plants created their own seeds
and could grow on their own.

Verse 19
And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them to Adam to see what he would call them: and whatever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.

Remember what Genesis 1:24 said

And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so

Beast of the earth were not farm animals and did not need man to help them.

Genesis 2:19
And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field

Beast of the field. These were farm animals that did need man to help them.

After this point God created a woman from adams rib and she lived with
adam, in the garden.

Not once did i seen where God told them to be fruitful and multiple.

Maybe now, you can see where i am coming from. The bible was not written
very well and it is so cryptic, it makes it very hard for the average person
to understand.

It funny that i'm only at the first 2 chapters of the bible and already, things
are so messed up. It's like either God or the writers of Gods word, could not
get their stories straight.

From what i get from this is God did make plants and animals in the first
creation. He also made men and women. Every living creature at this point
were plant eaters. That would explain all the self seed bearing plants.

I don't believe those humans were that special to God. For him, this was
just a average thing that he could do. These may even have been the
gentiles, mentioned in the bible.

Are gentiles a soulless people? I don't know.

What-ever day it was that God created adam, it was after God rested.

God decides that he wants a special type of man, a man that is more
in tune with God. So much so that this man could walk and talk
with God in a close up and personal way.

So he creates this man (adam) and he becomes a living soul. He places
his prized man in a special garden, already prepared for him.

Adam and eve were probably the first jews in the world and the bible
mainly is dealing with the jewish people.

[Beren]

God is the Creator and creation within and without. Omnipresent and omnipotent and omniscient.
Humans think from a level very limited, narrow short sighted.

A brain game right?
When one comes at the crossroad of misunderstanding and else, it`s best to trust in God-Love-Higher power...then when some time pass by-answers are suddenly revealed and question answered with one AHAaaaa!!! Of course! and such...

:)

[thunder24]

Im sure this has been brought up, but i didn't feel like reading all thirty pages...forgive me...

how many of you , can read and speak the original language of the book you are discussing....better yet, how many of you can read and speak the language of the many books you are discussing?

If you can not, what are you discussing? If you can, where is the thread you started to clarify all the mistranslations that cause the chaos of philosiphing that which you apparently can read in its original form. If you take Berens signature to heart.... then what the hell are y'all discussing?

peace

[humanalien]

Omnipresent

present in all places at all times

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/omnipresent


omnipotent

1 often capitalized : almighty 1
2 having virtually unlimited authority or influence <an omnipotent ruler>
3 obsolete : arrant

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/omnipotent


omniscient

1 having infinite awareness, understanding, and insight
2 possessed of universal or complete knowledge

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/omniscient

None of those words says anything about being two different
entities at the same time.

Omnipresent is the only word that comes close but it basically
say everywhere at the same time.

You can not be the father and your own son at the same time
in my understanding of God but maybe we all do not know and
understand God completely. We really don't know what kind of
powers that God has.

This is what makes understanding the bible, so difficult. You
would think the God would make things very simple so that
we don't misinterpret his words.

In this day and age, you really can't trust a minister, preacher
to tell you the truth because they are only retelling you what
they learned in bible college and i know they aren't teaching
the true meaning of the bible because they are only retelling
what they were taught. Bible college is just an assemble line
any more. Get them in and get them out and take their money
before they leave.

One has to have a very close relationship with God, in order
to know the secrets that the bible contains. Reading the bible
alone will not do anyone any good as you can tell by my
confusion with it. I'm not as close to God as i would like to be
and as a result, i'm stumbling through the bible wondering, how
can this be or that can be true.

When we first come to God and accept him as the one and only
true God and when you accept that Jesus died on the cross for the
sins of the world, we are but babies in christ, not knowing anything.

We are to take baby steps, when learning Gods word and that is
what i'm trying to do by starting right at the beginning but even
then, i'm finding what i feel are flaws, right from the start.

We are taught about only one creation of man in church as children
but now that i'm grown up and up in years, i'm seeing two separate
creations of not only man but animals and plants to.

Come on now. These are only the first 2 chapters in the bible and
i can't get past them because of the flaws in the stories.

I'm not bashing God because i truly do believe in God and Jesus but
the bible seems to be less than truthful. There is no wonder why the
world is in such turmoil over religion. None of then are correct.

That is my honest opinion about religion and if i offended anyone then
i am truly sorry. I just can't help how i feel.

Good plants produce good plant food but i'm not seeing the goodness
in religion, i'm sorry. It's tearing people apart.

How can we as babies in christ, ever hope to learn anything when every
word, every meaning, in the bible is so cryptic? Why did God finally rest
from all his creations starting in chapter 2 of genesis when that should
have been put at the end of chapter 1? It's the simple stuff that is tripping
me up. It's like the bible is intentionally trying to misdirect people.

I apologize for getting so fired up but i really want to learn about God in the
bible but i keep running into stumbling blocks. This worries me because if
i'm stumbling on the easy stuff then i'll probably read right over the harder
stuff and never know that i didn't understand it.

I pray to God for guidance and understanding and i pray that God might
send me a ministering angel to teach me but i think that God has closed
the door on me. I don't know what i did to get him so angry with me but
now he won't answer any prayers that i ask.

[Beren]

Omnipresent

present in all places at all times

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/omnipresent


omnipotent

1 often capitalized : almighty 1
2 having virtually unlimited authority or influence <an omnipotent ruler>
3 obsolete : arrant

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/omnipotent


omniscient

1 having infinite awareness, understanding, and insight
2 possessed of universal or complete knowledge

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/omniscient

None of those words says anything about being two different
entities at the same time.

Omnipresent is the only word that comes close but it basically
say everywhere at the same time.

You can not be the father and your own son at the same time
in my understanding of God but maybe we all do not know and
understand God completely. We really don't know what kind of
powers that God has.

This is what makes understanding the bible, so difficult. You
would think the God would make things very simple so that
we don't misinterpret his words.

In this day and age, you really can't trust a minister, preacher
to tell you the truth because they are only retelling you what
they learned in bible college and i know they aren't teaching
the true meaning of the bible because they are only retelling
what they were taught. Bible college is just an assemble line
any more. Get them in and get them out and take their money
before they leave.

One has to have a very close relationship with God, in order
to know the secrets that the bible contains. Reading the bible
alone will not do anyone any good as you can tell by my
confusion with it. I'm not as close to God as i would like to be
and as a result, i'm stumbling through the bible wondering, how
can this be or that can be true.

When we first come to God and accept him as the one and only
true God and when you accept that Jesus died on the cross for the
sins of the world, we are but babies in christ, not knowing anything.

We are to take baby steps, when learning Gods word and that is
what i'm trying to do by starting right at the beginning but even
then, i'm finding what i feel are flaws, right from the start.

We are taught about only one creation of man in church as children
but now that i'm grown up and up in years, i'm seeing two separate
creations of not only man but animals and plants to.

Come on now. These are only the first 2 chapters in the bible and
i can't get past them because of the flaws in the stories.

I'm not bashing God because i truly do believe in God and Jesus but
the bible seems to be less than truthful. There is no wonder why the
world is in such turmoil over religion. None of then are correct.

That is my honest opinion about religion and if i offended anyone then
i am truly sorry. I just can't help how i feel.

Good plants produce good plant food but i'm not seeing the goodness
in religion, i'm sorry. It's tearing people apart.

How can we as babies in christ, ever hope to learn anything when every
word, every meaning, in the bible is so cryptic? Why did God finally rest
from all his creations starting in chapter 2 of genesis when that should
have been put at the end of chapter 1? It's the simple stuff that is tripping
me up. It's like the bible is intentionally trying to misdirect people.

I apologize for getting so fired up but i really want to learn about God in the
bible but i keep running into stumbling blocks. This worries me because if
i'm stumbling on the easy stuff then i'll probably read right over the harder
stuff and never know that i didn't understand it.

I pray to God for guidance and understanding and i pray that God might
send me a ministering angel to teach me but i think that God has closed
the door on me. I don't know what i did to get him so angry with me but
now he won't answer any prayers that i ask.


God does answer but we often like kids put our hands over our ears. You answered your own question here by your sentence : "I am not as close to God..."
This is the key my friend. Get close. Often people think that they have to pray on a certain way or do some ritual to get close to Creator. But remember that God is everywhere in all time and space, so do anything that your soul inclines you to do so you will get to be close to God (at least in your own understanding).

When you do not understand , maybe you`re not ready yet. Still draw close to Creator because answers will come as they come when one is ready for them.
Love is the key.

[humanalien]

That could be. Maybe i'm expecting to much, to fast.
I'll slow down a bit and see what happens.

Thank-you

[kreagle]

That could be. Maybe i'm expecting to much, to fast.
I'll slow down a bit and see what happens.

Thank-you


humanalien,

I am very grateful to see that you are willing to exercise some patience, my friend. With your current spiritual situation that you are facing, I'm reminded of my mother telling me to,......"slow down and 'chew your food', properly, or you're going to 'choke yourself to death!"

As a 'youth', I would often find myself being impatient, thinking I was 'starving to death', so I would try to rapidly consume my food, which would bring about the 'comments' from my mother, as stated above.

It's great to see that you appear, at this time, to be desperately hungry, ( from a spiritual standpoint), but you do need to 'slow down',....and properly digest what you have received.



Matthew 5:6 (KJV)

6 Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.




In the meantime, brother, I would carefully advise you to 'stay away' from comments, ( or 'views'), like 'this',......


I'm not bashing God because i truly do believe in God and Jesus but
the bible seems to be less than truthful. There is no wonder why the
world is in such turmoil over religion. None of then are correct.



.....and concentrate, more heavily on comments, ( and 'views'), like 'this', instead!


Every word in the bible is important and it was put there for us
to learn. Not just part of it but all of it.



I also want to comment on your statement, here,.....



We are taught about only one creation of man in church as children
but now that i'm grown up and up in years, i'm seeing two separate
creations of not only man but animals and plants to.

Come on now. These are only the first 2 chapters in the bible and
i can't get past them because of the flaws in the stories.




You need to realize, humanalien, that the first '2 chapters' of the Genesis account of creation are not written in a 'chronological order' of the events as they unfolded and took place. Genesis, chapter 1, gives us a 'complete' overview of the creative 'process' over the '6 days of creation',.....and.....Genesis, chapter 2, simply goes 'back' to reemphasize some of the 'specifics' of our creation, ( ie. Adam's rib taken and woman, Eve, created. Also, there appears more 'specifics' on the animals and plants, in chapter 2.) This does not mean there was a 'second creation' of either man, plants, or animals,.....it simply was written this way to bring out these 'specifics' of our creation for our understanding.


Hang in there, brother,.....more 'rays of revelation' are coming your way,....'if' you will be patient and remain 'true to your heart'!

Your brother, friend, and servant,.....kreagle

[humanalien]

OK. I get part of it right now.

In Gen chap 1, God created all the plant life.
In Gen chap 2, God planted a garden, not create one.

Answer this though, if you can.

Whats the difference between created and formed?

In Gen chap 1, God created male and female.
In Gen chap 2, God formed man from the dust of the earth.
Eve was made from adams rib.

[kreagle]

An Eagle's View

(*hint*....it's 'all in the Wings!')



Isaiah 40:30-31 (KJV)

30 Even the youths shall faint and be weary, and the young men shall utterly fall:

31 But they that wait upon the Lord shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles; they shall run, and not be weary; and they shall walk, and not faint.




http://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/03/53/e8/ba/paragliding-interlaken.jpg


Eagles, by the divine design of God, are able to 'naturally' soar to heights that the rest of creation can only 'dream about', much less see for themselves. A researcher, Ugo Njoku, found that the bald eagle, at top flight, can even fly at a 'staggering' height of 30,000 ft., which is about the cruising altitude of jet powered airliners! http://www.seedsinwords.com/2011/11/04/the-eagle-in-you-fly-high/

In addition to the eagle's unchallenged ability to 'naturally' soar to such unprecedented heights we find that their visual acuity is unparalleled, registering at approximately 20/4, as compared to our 'human' standard of excellence at 20/20.

What 'sights' the eagle must be able to behold from the 'advantage point' that he/she can escalate to, combined with their visual superiority! They, literally, can see 'things' from an advantage point that the 'rest of us' are not able to do,...naturally!


While 'other' birds beat their wings, furiously, to fly at their respective 'levels', the eagle normally beats his/her wings rather slowly, for a bird. Once air-born, the eagle will usually 'ride' on air-currents - hardly flapping at all! In a, somewhat, 'kite-like' fashion, the eagle is then able to soar,....higher and higher, barely having to 'flap' at all, as the 'wind' lifts the bird to breath-taking heights.


You see,....it's 'all in the wings!',....my dear friends! When 'mature',....the adult eagle's wingspan can reach 7 to 7 1/2 feet in length, giving it the 'natural ability' to create tremendous lift as the wind circulates beneath it's magnificently divine design!


In turning the attention towards 'us',.....we've all heard the term 'earning your wings' used from a military standpoint, and even spiritually applied, by some, also. It's application always is in reference to 'successfully' passing certain courses, (or tests), whether they apply to the 'military',...or....to spiritual matters.


This application of the term 'earning your wings' certainly has it's merits, but unfortunately, there are 'many' individuals who want to 'wear the wings'....BEFORE...they 'actually earn them!' A person can easily go to a military 'surplus' store,....purchase a military uniform and sew all the 'stripes, stars, and medals' on it that they want,...but it doesn't mean that they've 'earned' them at all, does it?


In a recent post, ( #589), ( http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?48678-Bible-Topics-and-Questions&p=669756&viewfull=1#post669756), I shared with many of you some of the 'events' that transpired in my life, back on February 22, 1981, when I was 26 years old, and finally had decided is was time for me, personally, to make a change and make a solid 'commitment' to God. Little did I know it, 'then', but I was about to 'earn my wings' where I, too, could soar to heights that I never realized were even possible to attain in this life! There I would 'see', ( and understand), things from a 'totally different' perspective, and my 'spiritual acuity' would suddenly take a drastic turn,....crystallizing my 'vision' beyond my wildest dreams!

I've heard several individuals express to me, ( in amazement), about my spiritual ability to quote scriptures, and my overall ability to know 'where to go' within the Bible at 'just the right time, or place'. Normally, ( after 'blushing',...for I am uncomfortable receiving such 'praise',...as I am, equally, 'very uncomfortable' even writing about it, as I am right now),...I am 'always' quick to point out that it's NOT me,....but HIM speaking within me, that should be given the credit, or accolades for any such praise. Since the event that I spoke of, above, on February 22, 1981, when He gloriously filled me with the Holy Ghost, I have spent the last 32 plus years digesting His Word,.... making countless notes,.....highlighting throughout by entire Bible,...over and over and over, again,....to get where I am today. I've become a 'student' of His Word, subjecting myself to the 'proper' authorities, ( ie. my 'Pastor',....and 'other' teachers within my life). My 'wings' were growing, and allowing me to soar to heights, once unattainable, as my wind, ( His Spirit), circulated beneath my wings, lifting me higher, and higher with each passing day! As such, my 'spiritual acuity' was allowing me to see 'things' that others failed to see.


Now,.... before I continue,.... I think it is imperative for me to reveal to each of you my 'level' of religious understanding 'prior' to this 'life changing event' as I've alluded to above.


You see,....I've only graduated from high school,.....I've never been to college,....much less 'bible' college, etc. Up to this 'event',....I had never even read the Bible through,...not even 'one' time! I couldn't have told you how many 'books' there even were in the Bible,....( 39 in the Old Testament,....27 in the New Testament). I only knew a few of the very 'basics',....and I might have been lucky to have 'accurately' named '5' books in the Bible at 'best!'


But,......there's 'one thing I DID have!',.....and 'that' was the fact that I 'always' knew, ( and 'believed'), in God! I didn't know it 'then',....but I had 'faith', ( Romans 12:3), that I was going to completely place in God, and His Word, for the first time in my life! It never even 'crossed my mind' to doubt God's Word, or to allow myself to question It's authenticity,...or whether It had been 'tampered' with like I've heard 'many' on here state!


While there are 'many' who will say,...."That's nothing but blind, foolish-type faith",......I will say to them,...."you can call it blind, and foolish if you want,....but, take it from me,...it will cause you to 'soar with the eagles', my dear friend!" While the detractors of faith spend most of their time trying to 'wrap their brains around the concept of God and His Word' , ( as they try to 'intellectually' figure Him out),....your going to find 'ole kreagle',.....'soaring with the eagles',....looking down on those who keep entangling themselves with doubt, and failing to make their own 'commitment' to God.


Quite candidly,....the 'only thing' that blurs my own spiritual acuity today is the 'tears in my eyes' that have been, ( and continue), to flow from them for those who continuously entangle themselves, unnecessarily. This 'entanglement' can easily be undone by accepting the 'simplicity' of God's saving Gospel Message in Acts 2:38, as illustrated in my signature, for 'all' to see.


This 'eagle',.....ole kreagle, himself,....would like to 'invite' you to soar with me!

But, in order to do that!,....you'll need to 'earn your wings',....just like I did, too!


God Bless you 'all',.....your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

OK. I get part of it right now.

In Gen chap 1, God created all the plant life.
In Gen chap 2, God planted a garden, not create one.

Answer this though, if you can.

Whats the difference between created and formed?

In Gen chap 1, God created male and female.
In Gen chap 2, God formed man from the dust of the earth.
Eve was made from adams rib.


Hey brother,


The 'same' principle applies that I shared with you, earlier. The act of 'forming' mankind from the dust of the ground, ( Genesis, chapter 2 account), just breaks down to a 'simpler' form, for you and I, exactly how God chose to carry out the actual creation of mankind, ( as recorded in the Genesis, chapter 1 account).

In addition,...if you think about it,.....that's all we actually are, ( just a 'glorified mud-ball'), made out of the 'dust of the ground'! That, of course, is 'all we will ever be',.....unless we allow God to 'complete' His glorious work, as I've just alluded to in my previous post,....An Eagle's View.


God Bless you, brother,........your friend, brother, and servant,.......kreagle


post update


humanalien, perhaps 'this' will further help you to rationalize your thoughts.

Only God can 'create',....which is to make 'something out of nothing',...as 'only' He can do!

To 'form' is a similar process of the act of 'creation',....but this is where He took what he had already created, ( the earth,...it's ground, or dirt),.....and then, 'formed' man, ( Adam), out of the dust of the ground. He then took what He had already created, ( Adam,....and extracted a 'rib'),......and 'made' Eve.

'All' of this took place in the Genesis, chapter 1 account,.....and 'then' His Word breaks it down for us, in the Genesis, chapter 2 account,.....to explain exactly 'how' He did this creative work.

Do you see, now, brother?


God Bless,......kreagle

[humanalien]

I'm starting to see what was going on at that time.

Gen 1, is just a general overview of creation, where-as
Gen 2, gets more specific about the creation of man.

There are still a couple of things that i don't understand.

On the 3rd day of creation, in Gen 1: 11-12, is says:

11: And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, on the earth: and it was so.

I take it that God created all these things at that time.

12: And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good.

Is this saying that what God created, began to grow?

How can that be when the sun, moon and stars weren't
created until the 4th day?

Next question.

In Gen 1, God is called God but in Gen 2,
he is called Lord God.

I never really gave it must thought before but
now that i'm digging into this more, i would say
that Lord God is referring to Jesus.

I know i'm wrong. That is why i asked.

[kreagle]

I'm starting to see what was going on at that time.

Gen 1, is just a general overview of creation, where-as
Gen 2, gets more specific about the creation of man.

There are still a couple of things that i don't understand.

On the 3rd day of creation, in Gen 1: 11-12, is says:

11: And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, on the earth: and it was so.

I take it that God created all these things at that time.

12: And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good.

Is this saying that what God created, began to grow?

How can that be when the sun, moon and stars weren't
created until the 4th day?

Next question.

In Gen 1, God is called God but in Gen 2,
he is called Lord God.

I never really gave it must thought before but
now that i'm digging into this more, i would say
that Lord God is referring to Jesus.

I know i'm wrong. That is why i asked.


humanalien,


Question #1-
How can that be when the sun, moon and stars weren't
created until the 4th day

A very astute observation by you, humanalien,.....and I hope, ( and trust), that you will be just as excited with the 'answer' as I was when I first had my 'revelation' on this, too! You are, indeed, correct in that the sun, moon, stars, etc., ( ie. 'light' as we know it), had not appeared on the scene until the '4th' day of creation. Since we know, ( and understand), that photosynthesis is a vital process for all plants, trees, etc., to grow, and since we know that photosynthesis requires 'light', ( ie. the sun), in order to be activated,.....where did this 'light' come from so these plants and trees were able to 'originally' grow?

The answer lies in Gen. 1:3, for it's here where we see the 'source' of the original 'Light' that was upon the scene, and the 'only' source of light, until He created the sun, moon, and stars, on day #4. That 'Light', my friend, was God, Himself,....for when He graced His creation with His presence, He was the 'only' source of light that was available. This Light,.....God, Himself,....was what those 'original' plants, trees, etc., had to rely upon to originally grow. Not only did they grow, but it appears that many of them even appeared to rapidly bloom to a 'fruit bearing state', overnight, so-to-speak. Of course this should not surprise us, given God's unlimited ability, combined with Him being the Light for their growth!


1 John 1:5 (KJV)

5 This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.


Also,.....note this passage about the 'Light' of Heaven, itself, and the source from where it is derived.


Revelation 21:23 (KJV)

23 And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.



What a 'glorious' Light He really must be! There is no God,...like 'our' God, brother!



Question #2-
In Gen 1, God is called God but in Gen 2,
he is called Lord God.

I never really gave it must thought before but
now that i'm digging into this more, i would say
that Lord God is referring to Jesus.



With this question, let me 'first' lay a foundation, ( which is Biblically sound), so you can see what the Scriptures have to say about the terms,....'Lord',....'God',.....'Lord God',.....and 'Lord Jesus'.


Through Moses, God specifically instructed him to relay to His people, Israel, that He was 'ONE' Lord,....and that they, ( Israel), were to 'always' look upon Him, as such,....'one' in numerical property,....and 'singular' as the Supreme Deity. The following text is the 'Old Testament' concept of God.


Deuteronomy 6:1-7 (KJV)

6 Now these are the commandments, the statutes, and the judgments, which the Lord your God commanded to teach you, that ye might do them in the land whither ye go to possess it:

2 That thou mightest fear the Lord thy God, to keep all his statutes and his commandments, which I command thee, thou, and thy son, and thy son's son, all the days of thy life; and that thy days may be prolonged.

3 Hear therefore, O Israel, and observe to do it; that it may be well with thee, and that ye may increase mightily, as the Lord God of thy fathers hath promised thee, in the land that floweth with milk and honey.

4 Hear, O Isael: The Lord our God is one Lord:

5 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

6 And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart:

7 And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up.




Furthermore,....we see that this 'Old Testament' concept of God,....or Lord God, was completely the 'same' in the 'New Testament', also!



Ephesians 4:4-6 (KJV)

4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;

5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,

6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.




Now look at this passage where 'doubting Thomas', ( the disciple), finally had his eyes opened to who he was really 'following',.......


John 20:27-29 (KJV)

27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing.

28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.

29 Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.


I think it should be noted that Jesus did 'NOT' try to 'correct' Thomas, here, by saying,...."now you're going a little to far, Thomas, by recognizing me as your Lord and God". The reason for this is quite simple,....for there was absolutely no reason for any correction whatsoever, for Thomas was completely right. Jesus, indeed, was his 'Lord and God',....for in that special moment of revelation, Thomas had been able to 'look beyond the veil of His flesh',....and see the Lord God that was on the 'inside' of that fleshly body, and honored Him as such.


Lord,.....God,......Lord God,.....or......Lord Jesus,.....'each' of these simply refers to the 'ONE' Deity that He actually is, and always has been.


In the Old Testament, God's name was referred to as Jehovah, or Yahweh.

In the New Testament, God's name is literally Jesus. When we address God, today, we should call upon His name, Jesus!

The 'name' Jesus, in the Greek, ( which is what the New Testament was written in), literally means.....God is Salvation,....or simply,.....Jehovah has become our salvation. This is 'exactly' what our God did, when he robed Himself in flesh, ( remember,....God manifest in the flesh? 1 Timothy 3:16), and became the Sacrificial Lamb for you, and I, at Calvary!



As 'always',....your brother, friend, and servant,........kreagle

[kreagle]

Kreagle

There's a lot of stuff that doesn't make sense.

In Matthew 3:17, after john the baptist, baptizes
Jesus, Gos said "This is my beloved Son, in whom
I am well pleased".

How can God have a son(Jesus) and still be the
same entity?

I should have said:

How can God be his own son and still be God
at the same time?

That would be like you, going to a lake to be baptized
and as soon as that is done, you rush off to get a helicopter,
fly over the area where you were baptized and got on the
bull horn and said "This is my beloved son".

Obviously, you are not your son and your son is not you.

I won't say that your wrong about your post above, because
clearly, i'm considered a baby in the lord, and need the mature
more but i will say that i just don't understand how this can be.




humanalien,

In an effort to help you understand this, remember what we talked about earlier, where only God, has the attributes of being....omnipotent, ( all powerful).....omnipresent, (everywhere at once)......and.....omniscient, ( all knowing).

Next, you need to understand exactly 'who' God was making this statement to, ( in Matthew 3:17). You see, He was not making this statement directly to a 'second' Deity, ( Jesus), for His own benefit,...for Jesus 'already knew' that the 'fullness of God' dwelt within Him and didn't need to be informed of this. This statement was 'only' made for the benefit of those, including John the Baptist, who were there in a Divine effort, by God, to specifically emphasize to them, ( the people there), that this Individual, Jesus Christ, was the Chosen Vessel, Himself, that He had chosen to dwell within, and was pleased to do so. This was God's way of showing 'all' of humanity that He was 'specifically' anointing 'this particular fleshly Tabernacle', which He further emphasized by allowing these people to not only 'hear' His Voice,....but to also 'see' His Spirit, as a dove, descending and resting upon Him.




Matthew 3:17 (KJV)

17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.



Notice where God said here,......'in whom' I am well pleased ( to dwell). He did NOT say 'with whom' I am pleased,.....but 'in whom',.....for God literally was 'inside' of this fleshy body of the 'man', Jesus Christ!


2 Corinthians 5:18-20 (KJV)

18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.




Notice brother, in verse 19, above, that 'God was in Christ', for the express reason of reconciling the world, ( bringing mankind back), unto Himself!


As far as the 'voice from above', ( God's voice), being 'heard' while the Son of Man, Jesus, was down here on earth,....this is where His omnipresence comes in, my dear friend. To 'speak from above',....while standing on the ground in His 'fleshly Tabernacle',... ( the 'man', Jesus Christ), presented absolutely no problem for our God, brother. You see, God can be 'everywhere', at once, and fully operate as God, anytime He chooses to do so! He does this on a 'regular' basis, today, all across this world in which we live. He can easily give His 'full attention' to someone in Russia,....while 'fully attending the needs' of someone in Australia,....while 'fully comforting' a family in America, at 'precisely the same moment',.....( and the 'list' could go on, and on, and on,....including every city, country, on the face of this planet! You cannot 'overwork' God,...or place to much on His plate, that He cannot handle, my dear, dear friend!


The terms 'Son' and 'Father' really confuse the majority of people simply because we are guilty of taking these 'terms', ( or titles), and applying them 'only' within our 'human understanding'. You see, humanalien,....I, kreagle, have 'two' sons,...who, indeed, are 'separate' individuals aside from me. However, we 'must' learn exactly what the 'term',....'Son of God' really means, ( from a Bible standpoint), in order to have a proper understanding of what the Scriptures are endeavoring to relate to us.


We 'all' know that Jesus definitely was the 'Son of God', right?,....but did you know that He was 'someone else's son, also?' He 'also' is referred to as the 'son of man', brother,....almost as many times as He was referred to as the 'Son of God'!


Per the Bible,.......



Jesus referred to as the......Son of God = 136 times

Jesus referred to as the......son of man = 116 times


The Son of God terminology means He was 'Divine in origin'

The son of man terminology means He had a 'human entrance' into this world,....specifically by His design.


Galatians 4:4-5 (KJV)

4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.




At one time,....even the disciples, themselves, had great difficulty with this issue of exactly 'who' was the Father, for their eyes were yet to be 'opened' by the Master, Himself.



John 14:8-10 (KJV)

8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us.

9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.




Finally, how much plainer could Jesus be,...when He said the following,....


John 10:30(KJV)

30 I and my Father are one.


'Their' eyes, ( the disciples), were eventually opened as they grew in the knowledge of Him,....and consequently became Apostles, to establish His Church, in Acts, chapter 2. They had, finally, fully realized who 'He' was. He was God manifest in the flesh! ( 1 Timothy 3:16)


1 Timothy 3:16 (KJV)

16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.




I sincerely pray that 'this' helps you make sense of some of the issues you are currently having difficulty with. As a reminder to you, ( and everyone else), it will necessitate you 'earning your wings',....as I've alluded to earlier, in order to 'see', ( understand), this from a 'crystal clear' standpoint that I do, now.


As 'always',.....your loving brother, friend, and servant,.....kreagle

[kreagle]

The 'Grace' of God


Without God's grace, access back to Him would have been totally impossible to attain by mankind. I, prayerfully, hope you will enjoy the following passage of Scripture, along with this short 8:38 minute video/song about His unmerited Grace that has been extended to you, and I.


Titus 2:11-15 (KJV)

11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,

12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;

14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

15 These things speak, and exhort, and rebuke with all authority. Let no man despise thee.





TCsMYGFO8ko


Peace and Love,......your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

Exactly, 'WHO' Built the Boat You are on?





Is it 'built by Man',.....with 'his'....'best intentions for You, and by his design?'



http://fabiusmaximus.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/20120605-titanic-sinking.jpg



.......OR.......





Is it 'built by God',.....with 'His'....'best intentions for You, and by His Design?'




http://larryvaughn.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/noah000.jpg


'Mankind's' version 'always' seems to be more elaborate, structurally sound,...and much more 'seaworthy',......UNTIL.....the 'real storms' come 'our' way, doesn't it?


Points to 'ponder',....my dear friends!


With 'much' love,......your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[GCS1103]

Hi, Kreagle-

Thanks for reminding me about this thread. I plan on visiting now. I do miss our old friends here, who would post such wonderful thoughts.

I thought you might be interested in an email I received the other day. I had posted, some time ago, about a Messianic Rabbi by the name of Jonathan Cahn. He has his congregation here in New Jersey and it has grown very large, due to his incredible ability as a speaker and to pass the word of God. He wrote the book "The Harbinger" which describes, in historical detail, the parallels between ancient Israel and present day United States. It is an incredible book of prophesy, if you have not read it. Jonathan has become well-known and was invited to give the prayer at the Presidential inaugural breakfast earlier this year.

On May 8th, Jonathan was invited to speak on Capital Hill along with Newt Gingrich, Michelle Bachmann and a host of other politicians. He emailed his congregation of an event that happened on May 8th, while he stepped up to give his talk. As he began his sermon, it sounded to him like there was a protester in the crowd yelling out. He realized that the yelling was coming from the sound system and not from any person in the audience. Only he heard this angry voice. He writes in his email that he knew it was his "enemy" and he prayed to God to remove his enemy from the room. The voice stopped and Jonathan went on to give one of his incredible sermons. He was asked to step up later in the evening to address the crowd again.

Just another example of how we need to ask God for protection from the evil that surrounds us in this world.

With love to you, my friend and brother-

Goldie

[kreagle]

Hi, Kreagle-

Thanks for reminding me about this thread. I plan on visiting now. I do miss our old friends here, who would post such wonderful thoughts.

I thought you might be interested in an email I received the other day. I had posted, some time ago, about a Messianic Rabbi by the name of Jonathan Cahn. He has his congregation here in New Jersey and it has grown very large, due to his incredible ability as a speaker and to pass the word of God. He wrote the book "The Harbinger" which describes, in historical detail, the parallels between ancient Israel and present day United States. It is an incredible book of prophesy, if you have not read it. Jonathan has become well-known and was invited to give the prayer at the Presidential inaugural breakfast earlier this year.

On May 8th, Jonathan was invited to speak on Capital Hill along with Newt Gingrich, Michelle Bachmann and a host of other politicians. He emailed his congregation of an event that happened on May 8th, while he stepped up to give his talk. As he began his sermon, it sounded to him like there was a protester in the crowd yelling out. He realized that the yelling was coming from the sound system and not from any person in the audience. Only he heard this angry voice. He writes in his email that he knew it was his "enemy" and he prayed to God to remove his enemy from the room. The voice stopped and Jonathan went on to give one of his incredible sermons. He was asked to step up later in the evening to address the crowd again.

Just another example of how we need to ask God for protection from the evil that surrounds us in this world.

With love to you, my friend and brother-

Goldie


Hey Goldie,

It is a very great pleasure to hear from you, sister! I have to admit that I had not heard of Jonathan Cahn, so if you have a link to this particular speech you are referring to, ( or any of his other speeches), I would be interested in watching it. We've covered quite a bit of material since you've last been on, here, so you might want to take a gander at a few of these topics. We can certainly re-visit any of these topics that you might would like to talk about, so don't hesitate to mention anything that might especially catch your attention. Once again, thank you, ( from the bottom of my heart), for reappearing on the thread, sister! I've always greatly valued your input, and especially the sincerity, love, and respect for others, that you so easily display. A real sweetheart, my dear sister!


Forevermore,.....your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[kreagle]

Starry,.....Starry,.....Night!



Psalm 8:3-4 (KJV)

3 When I consider thy heavens, the work of thy fingers, the moon and the stars, which thou hast ordained;

4 What is man, that thou art mindful of him? and the son of man, that thou visitest him?



The above passage was in reference to the complete awe that David experienced when he looked up into the starry night,....many, many, years ago,.....and was overcome with the greatness of God, leaving him astounded about where mankind fit into the 'grand scheme of things'. The Apostle Paul even made specific reference to this 'same passage' in the Book of Hebrews 2:6, which gives further credence to the overall significance and magnitude of the wondrous works of God that these two great 'men of God' wisely observed.




http://www.scienceinthebible.net/KNOWLEDGE_BIBLE/bigdipper_december.jpg


Upon going out the side door of my home, tonight, this 'view' from above is exactly what I saw, also, ( with the exception of the Big Dipper being more 'tipped' downward by approximately 15 degrees more).

As I, too, stopped and scanned the night skies, taking in the awesome starry night, my mind and heart equally trained itself on this selfsame passage, ( as indicated above).

What an absolutely awesome God we have,....that 'many' fail to recognize, let alone to really get to know Him!


In addition to this,.....try to 'wrap you brain around this astounding Biblical claim!'


Psalm 147:4-5 (KJV)

4 He telleth the number of the stars; he calleth them all by their names.

5 Great is our Lord, and of great power: his understanding is infinite.




Did you realize that mankind, ( as advanced as we've become), still struggles with an 'accurate' count of the stars,....for our 'best efforts' leaves us no other option but to scientifically relate to our universe as the 'observable universe',....for we can 'only' observe a portion of it, and really don't have an 'exact' idea just how big it actually is!


From Wikipedia,....this is 'our' most up-to-date information concerning the numerical count of 'stars' in our 'observable universe'.



Matter content,....The observable universe contains between 1022 and 1024 stars (between 10 sextillion and 1 septillion stars). To be slightly more precise, according to the Sloan Digital Sky Survey, "[by] a conservative estimate.... the currently observable universe is home to of order 6 x 1022 stars"[1] These stars are organized in more than 100 to 200 billion (up to 1 trillion depending on sources) galaxies, which themselves form groups, clusters, superclusters, sheets, filaments, and walls.

Two approximate calculations give the number of atoms in the observable universe to be close to 1080.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Observable_universe


Of course, this 'current guesstimate' by mankind is certainly 'fluid', unlike the 'exact'.....star numbers, and their actual 'names',....that the psalmist relates to us, in the above passage, in reference to His infinite understanding of 'all' things!


No wonder the psalmist further stated,.......


Psalm 118:8 (KJV)

8 It is better to trust in the Lord than to put confidence in man.



The 'ONE' who 'knows',..........vs..........the 'one' who 'guesses'



God bless to 'all',......your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[humanalien]

The above passage was in reference to the complete awe that David experienced when he looked up into the starry night,....many, many, years ago,.....and was overcome with the greatness of God, leaving him astounded about where mankind fit into the 'grand scheme of things'.

It's funny that you chose to post that particular thing because, just
last night, i was thanking God for all the wondrous things that he
created and without him, nothing would exist.

I have a question though, well maybe 2.

Is there any biblical text that describes the war in heaven before God
create earth? I'm confused as to when the earth was actually created.

In genesis 1, it says


In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

This was the very first thing that God did. He created the heaven and earth.

Is this the same heaven that God resides in now?

Then in Genesis 1:2, it goes on to say


And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was on the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved on the face of the waters.

Although the earth was without form and i'm not sure what is meant
by that, to me, it's saying that earth was there already.

Then it goes on to say that the earth was void or empty. Then later,
it says that the spirit of God moved on the face of the waters. Is that
referring to water on the earth?

What i'm getting at here is from what i've read from web sites, There
was a great battle in heaven, where lucifer tried to over-throw God but
that plan failed miserably and God cast lucifer down to earth.

If earth didn't exist before mankind, how could God cast lucifer to earth,
if it hadn't been created yet?

I know that some where, i got my time scales wrong.

That is why i was wondering if there is biblical text that
goes into more detail as to when the war in heaven took
place and what actually happened.

Thank-you

[william r sanford72]

i have a question.i have had dreams.and i got a phone call from a friend about his father who is healthy by all accounts and mentaly sound.he says he was visited by a prohphet named ENOS..who walked with god for 900 years.some of the stuff enos revealed to my friends father was in line with what i had warned my friend about what i seen coming and dont share.but with my loved ones..and this had spooked him.me and his father have never spoken and he is not a bible reader.he and my friend didnt even know enos was in the bible.my friend called to find out what i knew about the name.i have read the bible.a few times.i was raised catholic but iam of no religion and claim no secular faith other than a creator.my friends father wont stop talking about it. he is worried about his dad.could you fill in some gaps on this enos.i also found him in my mormon bible.but have yet to find any referance in my islamic koran?

[kreagle]

i have a question.i have had dreams.and i got a phone call from a friend about his father who is healthy by all accounts and mentaly sound.he says he was visited by a prohphet named ENOS..who walked with god for 900 years.some of the stuff enos revealed to my friends father was in line with what i had warned my friend about what i seen coming and dont share.but with my loved ones..and this had spooked him.me and his father have never spoken and he is not a bible reader.he and my friend didnt even know enos was in the bible.my friend called to find out what i knew about the name.i have read the bible.a few times.i was raised catholic but iam of no religion and claim no secular faith other than a creator.my friends father wont stop talking about it. he is worried about his dad.could you fill in some gaps on this enos.i also found him in my mormon bible.but have yet to find any referance in my islamic koran?


william r sanford72,

There are 8 references to 'Enos', ( 'Enosh' in 1 Chronicles 1:1), in the KJV Bible. They are as follows:



Genesis 4:26 (KJV)

26 And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the Lord.


Genesis 5:6 (KJV)

6 And Seth lived an hundred and five years, and begat Enos:


Genesis 5:7 (KJV)

7 And Seth lived after he begat Enos eight hundred and seven years, and begat sons and daughters:


Genesis 5:9 (KJV)

9 And Enos lived ninety years, and begat Cainan:


Genesis 5:10(KJV)

10 And Enos lived after he begat Cainan eight hundred and fifteen years, and begat sons and daughters:


Genesis 5:11(KJV)

11 And all the days of Enos were nine hundred and five years: and he died.


1 Chronicles 1:1 (KJV)

1 Adam, Sheth, Enosh,


Luke 3:38 (KJV)

38 Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.




As far as this 'encounter' is concerned with your friend's father, I personally would proceed with caution, ( actually 'stay away from'),.... for I don't know of any circumstances where God 'sanctioned' someone who was 'deceased' to come back, ( or reappear), for the purposes of revelations/divination's, etc. There is the account where Samuel, the Prophet, was summoned up, ( through 'witchcraft'), at the behest of Saul, and for the express reason to give him, ( Saul), advice on how to fight, ( and conquer), the Philistines. ( 1 Samuel 28: 7-25)

I specifically used the word, 'sanctioned', above for God certainly did NOT put His approval, ( or give His permission), for this summoning of Samuel from the grave. One needs to fully understand that witchcraft, ( and satanic rituals), definitely has the ability to venture into these specific areas for 'divination' purposes, but to do so is in complete violation to God's Word and will always carry 'Divine consequences' for any such intrusion. Furthermore, those who 'still' throw 'caution to the wind', ( by ignoring these 'consequences'), in an effort to gain the 'insight knowledge/results' they are trying to achieve through 'divination' by witchcraft/satanic means will often find themselves being fed with complete 'falsehoods', for these types of 'spirits' are always 'lying spirits' by design. Here we find that the 'recipient',.......'gets what he/she deserves', for they have employed 'non-sanctioned' methods in an effort to 'divine' answers,....so consequently they have been fed 'falsehoods',......answers that prove to be incorrect in the long run.


I hope this proves to be beneficial to you!


Your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[kreagle]

humanalien,


Hey brother, let's see what we can do to help you out, friend.


Is there any biblical text that describes the war in heaven before God
create earth?

Read the 'entire' chapter of Revelation Twelve. You'll notice that I highlighted the term 'before', ( in red), for you. This is the 'source' of your confusion, brother, for the Bible does not specify that this war between Lucifer and the Lord took place 'before' the world was created. It would have taken place 'during' the 'Creation Week',...'after' the earth was formed, my dear friend.

Perhaps 'this' revelation should give us all an even 'greater appreciation' for what our precious Lord did for us in the 'Creation Week',....for not 'only' did He create 'everything' then,....but He also had to 'fight a demonic war' , ( and 'win', of course!),....at the 'same' time!


In genesis 1, it says


In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
This was the very first thing that God did. He created the heaven and earth.

Is this the same heaven that God resides in now?


The 'heaven' His Word is referring to, here, is the 'sky',.....or the atmosphere, ( 'space', itself). In God's 'omnipresence' He actually dwells 'everywhere', at once, but in 'this case' the word 'heaven' simply denotes where He was putting a division between the 'earth' masses/waters and 'space', as we know it. As I see it, you are probably also, somewhat, confused over the term 'earth', used here. You see, I can go outside in my garden and grab a handful of 'earth',....but that doesn't mean I have the entire 'world in my hands',....just a simple hand full of 'dirt', or 'earth'.

On 'day number one,....and....day number two',......the 'ingredients' were present, water and earth, or dirt ( created by God), but they still were not 'formed', ( or separated), into their respective places, until 'day number three.'



Then in Genesis 1:2, it goes on to say


And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was on the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved on the face of the waters.
Although the earth was without form and i'm not sure what is meant
by that, to me, it's saying that earth was there already.

Then it goes on to say that the earth was void or empty. Then later,
it says that the spirit of God moved on the face of the waters. Is that
referring to water on the earth?



Remember, brother,....at this point we are still in the 'first day' of creation, and the 'waters' His Word is referring to, here, have yet to be divided, as He consequently would 'begin the process' on the 'second day'. Water, itself, was present, but had yet to be divided,....( ie. 'waters above the 'firmament',.....and.....'waters below the 'firmament'), which He did on the second day. On the 'third day' we actually see where the 'waters', ( and 'land'), were divided and placed into their 'proper place', ( as we know it today), into....'waters in the atmosphere',.......and........'waters in the oceans, seas, rivers, lakes, etc.'

I trust this will 'help' you sort things out!

Your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[humanalien]

Just commenting about the placement of where the
story of the battle in heaven is, in the bible.

I would think that - that would have been placed in Genesis,
somewhere right after earth was formed. At least it would be
in the right timeline.

Any idea on who the woman is that satan/dragon persecute, after
he was cast to earth and who was the man child that she brought
forth?

This war in heaven, had to have happened, way after the earth was
created. Way after mankind was created because in Rev 12:17, it says:


And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Remnant of her seed, would indicate that mankind was already populating
on earth, as the event happened.

Also take notice of this line from the same verse: have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
When exactly did all of this happen? Jesus wasn't even talked about until his
birth of earth, so this war could have happened, during jesus time on earth or
after he returned to heaven.

I'm sorry kreagle. Although i believe in God, the bible is in my opinion, an
untrust-worthy source of information.

There are just way to many flaws in the bible for all of it to be true
and it certainly is not in chronological order. It's time frames are spread
every where throughout the bible.

The next question would be, is lucifer/satan/dragon, all the same entity?
If not, where did satan come from, all of a sudden, that he wage war in
heaven against God.

Why would God cast satan to earth, amongst his earthly children, knowing
that satan is a lier and a killer?

That would be like me casting a confirmed killer, inside a house full of
women and children and expecting everything to be just peachy.

I tell you kreagle, non of this makes any sense at all. Not one bit.

I'm expecting flowers to pop up in the bible but all i get are thorns
and weeds.

I'm really trying to understand this kreagle but God is not leading
me in that direction. If God doesn't lead me there, i can assume the
bible is full of lies and God doesn't want me to learn that stuff.

The only reason why i believe in God is because of an inner knowing
and not anything i learned in the bible, except for maybe as a kid.
That's when i first learned of God.

Please don't be upset with me. I know you must be getting frustrated
with me because of all the questions but it's comes from me really wanting
to learn about biblical events.

Like i said though, God is not and will not, lead me in that direction and
i have to wonder why.

Thank-you kreagle for all your help and understanding. I do, so much
appreciate what you have been trying to teach me.

[kreagle]

I'm sorry kreagle. Although i believe in God, the bible is in my opinion, an
untrust-worthy source of information.

There are just way to many flaws in the bible for all of it to be true
and it certainly is not in chronological order. It's time frames are spread
every where throughout the bible.



humanalien,

You are 'totally' missing the point, my dear friend. To continue to proceed down the 'pathway of enlightenment' using the method you are currently employing is equivalent to 'taking one step forward,....then taking two steps backwards'. You're getting 'further' from the overall Truth, my dear friend,...as you keep making 'damaging statements' regarding His Word. Just because you don't understand the layout of His Word doesn't mean you should give up on the Bible every time something doesn't resonate with your 'human reasoning'. Herein lies the real problem, for without the 'infilling of God's Spirit', ( the Holy Ghost), you're going to,.... continually,.... be left floundering, and grasping, for these precious 'nuggets of Truth' that are, indeed, contained within the glorious Word of God, the Bible. You cannot understand, ( correctly), the 'Word of the Spirit',....without the actual 'Spirit' dwelling inside of you, brother! It's an absolute impossibility. Many today are currently endeavoring to do this,.....but they will never succeed, as the Scriptures, so accurately, point out!



1 Corinthians 2:13-14
King James Version (KJV)

13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.



I am more than happy to answer your many questions, humanalien,.... but I fully understand that in order for you to 'properly' digest what you are reading, here, ( or anywhere else), it's going to necessitate that you should be filled with His Spirit so that you CAN properly sort out what His Spirit is endeavoring to teach you. I know what I am talking about, here, brother, and I sincerely hope you can grasp this!


When I, kreagle, look back on my 'past',...some 32 years ago, at the age of 26,....I, personally, did not 'require' for God to reveal to me 'exactly how He did what He did',....BEFORE....I took the actual step of faith and started believing, ( and accepting), His Word, and ultimately Him! Instead of me attempting to 'scrutinize His Word',......I instead decided it was best for me to 'scrutinize myself,....FIRST,.....and get ME under control, so that I could proceed to the 'next step' of learning all about Him and His glorious Word!

You see, humanalien,....I KNEW I was a sinner,...pure, plain, and simple. No one had to 'draw me a diagram' in order for me to figure this out. I KNEW that I was the problem,.....that I needed to address 'MY ISSUE',.....FIRST,.....then everything else would begin to fall into place for me in my quest for His Truth! Complete 'repentance' was my only solution, to which I was only happy, ( and eager), to comply with. Once I had surrendered my 'all' to Him, in repentance, it was just a simple matter of following the 'rest of His Gospel Message' that the Apostle Peter preached, as I have alluded to, over and over again, in my signature, ( Acts 2:38). I followed up 'repentance' with water baptism in the 'name' of Jesus Christ,....and then I subsequently was filled with His Spirit, the Holy Ghost,....23 days later on Feb. 22, 1981, and began to speak in other tongues as His Spirit was fully signifying that He, indeed, was residing within me.

I pray that you are getting the point, now, my dear, dear friend. When we, initially, come to God,.....it's not our responsibility, ( nor right), to place Him under the microscope for our inspection to see, whether or not, if He is fully qualified to be our Lord and God. If we approach our Christian experience in the 'right way' we FIRST place 'ourselves' under the Divine microscope,....and deal with 'ourselves' FIRST. It's US that needs changing,....NOT HIM,....nor His Word!


Remember what I said about 'rays of revelation',....brother?


Your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[GCS1103]

Hi, Kreagle-

I have a good feeling, when I come here, to this thread. I have personally experienced being filled with the Holy Spirit during the time when my mother was dying of cancer. It was a literal sensation of being filled with love and peace that I knew was from God. It's hard to describe it in words, but I'm sure you understand what I'm trying to say. I have never doubted, from that day, that God is there for us. There have been several times, since then, when I have seen the miracle of God through prayer.

I have become very aware of the changes taking place in people and the world around us. I believe in my heart that the "ruler of this world" is moving us swiftly towards a showdown with God. Several years ago I had a dream that I rememberd in detail when I woke up. It was the war between God and Satan and I saw His warriors on horses. I was on one of those horses. I remembered the feeling of love that I had towards the horse I was on and I wondered if the horse was actually an angel. I've told that story to very few people, but to this day I remember the dream in detail. (By the way, I have never taken drugs and I don't drink;))

Love, Goldie

[kreagle]

I've told that story to very few people, but to this day I remember the dream in detail. (By the way, I have never taken drugs and I don't drink;))

Love, Goldie


Hey Goldie!,

Sister, I had a 'good' laugh when I saw your comment about 'not taking drugs,...nor drinking!'

It's a shame when humanity thinks we 'must be on something' when we describe our 'experiences' with God, and His Word, in such 'elaborate' ways! Most simply cannot fathom, ( or believe), that it's really that blissful,....but it really is, to those who invest their God-given faith back in Him!

The 'initial' outpouring of the Holy Ghost, ( on the Day of Pentecost), produced the 'exact same' results, followed up by the 'unbeliever's of yesterday' expected response, that I've made reference to, here.



Acts 2:12-16 (KJV)

12 And they were all amazed, and were in doubt, saying one to another, What meaneth this?

13 Others mocking said, These men are full of new wine.

14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words:

15 For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.

16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;




Some things never change,....do they?


God Bless, 'always'!,..........your brother, friend, and servant,.....kreagle

[kreagle]

The 'Master' Sculptor





http://ih3.redbubble.net/image.5853323.6856/flat,550x550,075,f.jpg



Jeremiah 18:1-6 (KJV)

18 The word which came to Jeremiah from the Lord, saying,

2 Arise, and go down to the potter's house, and there I will cause thee to hear my words.

3 Then I went down to the potter's house, and, behold, he wrought a work on the wheels.

4 And the vessel that he made of clay was marred in the hand of the potter: so he made it again another vessel, as seemed good to the potter to make it.

5 Then the word of the Lord came to me, saying,

6 O house of Israel, cannot I do with you as this potter? saith the Lord. Behold, as the clay is in the potter's hand, so are ye in mine hand, O house of Israel.



Unfortunately, most people today cannot get past the notion that our 'original vessel',....( we ourselves),....has been 'marred' from the onset of our earthly entrance due to our 'sinful nature' which we 'all' inherited from our ancient ancestors,....Adam and Eve. Consequently,....'another vessel' is our 'Master's' Divine Plan for our lives,....IF.....we will only become 'willing vessels',....and completely present ourselves in His creative Hands for this 'molding process' that He, alone, can do.


Herein lies the problem,....for entirely too many individuals, today, are so busy striving to become their 'own self-made man/woman', that our Beloved Master often doesn't get His opportunity to get His Hands on them in the first place!


As with 'every creative work' that has entered into His Hands since the beginning of the Genesis account,....the 'net results' of His handy-work is always followed up by these 'same' descriptive terms,......"it was good,...or very good". However 'only' the recipients of His 'molding process' can actually attest to this claim! Not only does our 'Master' Sculptor mold the areas of our lives that everyone can see 'externally',....but He actually goes 'much deeper' than that as He molds from 'within',....which, in turn, blossoms on the 'outside' for everyone to see.



Ezekiel 36:26 (KJV)

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh


He's definitely a 'Hands-on type of God',....if.....we'll just let Him get His Hands on us!!


God Bless to 'all',........your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

The 'Fear' of the Lord


I just posted a reply to this 'topic' on another thread by naste.de.lumina and felt it would be conducive to, likewise, post it here. There are entirely too many, today, who view the 'fear of the Lord' from a very skewed point of view. What's you view on this?


http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?59263-Spirituality-need-for-fear.&p=676607&viewfull=1#post676607




Hello friends.
This text has not the slightest pretension to impose anything, it's just a thought that took me way today afternoon.
So it's a personal perception that I would like to discuss because I think many of you more enlightened on this subject than I do.
I realize now that in many situations, for example, real communities, online communities, tv shows and media in general, that the matter in spirituality is taking much attention.
It appears to be intrinsic, the spiritual relationship with saving in most cases.
And the fear of not salvation, not part of the herd.
Regardless of religion or who believes individually, the fear of not being part of the class chosen seems to be most often present.
If this reasoning is valid, then we have to search for spirituality by fear in many people.
Then there is the fear, the opposite of love as fuel this engine running in search of spirituality.
I do not know if fear as starter, would be the one responsible for so many people realize fundamentalist, radical and uncompromising when it comes to faith in God.
But it seems to me plausible that it is an important ingredient in this universe, because intolerance, arrogance, selfishness, lack of empathy and other similar nouns are derived from the same negative force of fear.
Do not forget that fear is a fundamental tool, key Matrix control.
So far it is valid to search for spirituality by fear?

Love without fear for all.
Wander Brazilian.


naste.de.lumina,


I have always been convinced that mainstream Christianity's perception of the 'fear of the Lord' has been grossly skewed by a combination of 'ignorance,....and, of course, satanic design, also!' While 'fear', ( ie. to be 'afraid of'), certainly has it's merits, and is to be considered and administered,....when applicable,....the 'proper application' of this religious 'catch phrase' should be as to 'fear', ( ie. have revered 'respect' for), the Lord!


I do NOT serve the Lord because I 'fear', ( am 'afraid' of), Him,......but rather, I serve the Lord because I 'fear', ( have Divine 'respect'), for Him! There is a 'massive' difference between these 'two' definitions, in correlation to our outlook on how we actually view God,....and exactly 'how' He wants us to view, ( and serve), Him!


If one 'attempts' to serve the Lord because of 'fear', ( afraid, or scared to death of the consequences), they are going to be continually bombarded with undue condemnations,...live a 'defeated spiritual existence',....and ultimately loose out on their quest for Truth. Pure love,.....God's love,....has 'no room' for this type of 'fear' and those who endeavor to 'scare individuals into serving God' are either being motivated 'satanically,...or....simply ignorant' of what they are doing.



1 John 4:18 (KJV)

18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.




The 'fear of the Lord' mantra should 'always' be associated with our Divine respect for Him and His Word. A 'follower of Christ' should adopt the view that,....."I divinely respect You Lord,...so much,... that I fully believe in You,...and Your Word,... to the point that I unconditionally accept Your directives for my life!"


Once we attain this proper view of this Christian 'catch phrase',...FEAR,....we are then well on our way to a victorious Christian experience, my friends!


Your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[humanalien]

Douay-Rheims Bible
http://drbo.org/index.htm

I think that this is as far
back as i can go, to finding
a more accurate or truthful
version of God word, in english.

The Douay-Rheims Bible was translated
from the Latin Vulgate and the KJV
was created from using the translated
english version of theDouay-Rheims
Bible.

Then king james took it upon himself
to remove many books from his version
of the Bible.

I still believe that there were other books
removed from the Latin Vulgate to.

I would expect a bible to be 6 to 10 inches
thick and packed full of information.

[humanalien]

I notice this a lot with people claiming to be christians,
so i thought that i would write a little something about
it. This post isn't meant to point fingers at any one because
we all have our faults and we could be pointing fingers all
day at each other and we would get no where.

While searching through the bible, i ran across a piece of
scripture that really kind of hit home with me. I realized
that i'm kind of guilty of this myself, so i thought that i
would refresh the memories of some of our christian
people.

In James 2:18 - 29 it say:
18: Yes, a man may say, You have faith, and I have works: show me your faith
without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.

19: You believe that there is one God; you do well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

20: But will you know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

21: Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son on the altar?

22: See you how faith worked with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?

23: And the scripture was fulfilled which said, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed to him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.

24: You see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

25: Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?

26: For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.


I'll assume that you can see where i'm going with this. Many times is see people
quoting the bible like nobodies business and they may even know what they
are talking about but according to God, that isn't good enough.

You or i can have all the faith in the world about God, we can learn all there is
to learn about God and we may even spout off a quote or two to make ourselves
all puffed up with pride because we have that knowledge but where are the works
to back that faith up?

Talking to fellow christians only about God, is not doing Gods works. Is not your
job as a christian to go out and win souls for God?

Talking about faith, Jesus once said that if we humans, had the faith, the size
of a mustard seed, we could move mountains, just by telling them to move.

I don't see anyone in the world having any type of faith like that. Is your faith
so strong that you can at least tell a car to move out of your way and it will?

So remember. Faith alone will not get you a free pass into heaven. You must
have the works to go with that faith or else your faith is dead.

Libera - Onward Christian Soldiers

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJgt2ktRJME

Now for a little Dolly

Dolly Parton - Power In The Blood

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B1CV-HtsMvc

[kreagle]

You or i can have all the faith in the world about God, we can learn all there is
to learn about God and we may even spout off a quote or two to make ourselves
all puffed up with pride because we have that knowledge but where are the works
to back that faith up?

Talking to fellow christians only about God, is not doing Gods works. Is not your
job as a christian to go out and win souls for God?



Hey humanalien,

I was specifically wondering about you today, brother. In my last post that was directed towards you, ( post #619), I made some recommendations to you that was meant to help you in your quest, ( and hunger for), God's Word.

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?48678-Bible-Topics-and-Questions&p=675353&viewfull=1#post675353


It dealt with the ultimate need that we 'all' have to be filled with God's Spirit, ( the Holy Ghost), so that you 'then' could be able to 'adequately understand' many of the scriptures that you are currently having difficulty with. I will restate to you, once again, that I have absolutely no problem answering your questions, as I can, but you will never be able to fully understand it, brother, without being filled with His Spirit, first.

In your 'latest' posts I, quite frankly, denote a sense of 'frustration' from you that is mostly directed towards me, my friend. You might recall that I have 'attempted' to go the 'extra mile' with you with various 'suggestions' in PM's that I have privately sent to you. On May 3, I provided my personal email to you for further correspondence from you,....on May 9, I even offered to give you my personal phone number where we could 'actually talk together',...and on May 11, I offered to put you in contact with some of my fellow 'brothers and sisters' who could personally come to your home in Ohio and greatly assist you with the many assorted problems you are currently undergoing with your 'home life',...your daughter's and your 'relationship',....not to mention the difficulty you are facing with understanding His Scriptures. Brother,...I'm 'stretching forth my helping hand',....but currently I'm only coming up with empty air,....for you have 'yet' to respond, ( or accept), any of the 'help' I am desperately trying to extend to you!



James 2:20 (KJV)

20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?




Brother, in my PM to you, on May 11, I specifically talked to you about taking that 'next step of faith',....and to be specific, here is my 'exact' statement to you,......


You've asked for God to 'hear' you, brother. This is His way of 'hearing' your calls of desperation. You will agree with me, one day, if you will take the next step of faith, my dear, dear, friend.



So you see, humanalien,....I have sincerely endeavored to 'put legs' on my faith specifically on your behalf, my dear friend. This is the 'works' that God's Word instructs His servants to employ towards those in need,....but there has to be a 'willing recipient',....FIRST,....in order for these 'works' to come to complete fruition, brother.


'All' of my offers still stand,....my dear friend!


As 'Always',.....your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[humanalien]

You got it all wrong kreagle. Like i already said, i wasn't
pointing fingers at you or anyone. What i posted was a
generalized thing.

I've seen many people in my life time that could quote
bible verses, all day long, pretending to be a christian
and then go home and commit many sins.

I've seen those tv evangelist go before the whole world
and preach the gospel, only to beg for forgiveness later on
because they got caught doing many bad things to their
followers.

No kreagle, this isn't about you and i'm sorry if you felt it
was directed at you.

Many people are under the influence that faith alone will
get them into heaven but as the bible clearly states, that
will not be enough.

I used to believe that as well, until i read those scriptures, so
i know there are others out there that believe as i once did.

This isn't about you or i but about what are we doing for the lord.
Are we out there, every day, winning souls for him?

Are we ministering to the poor souls that are lost or the ones
that haven't come to know the lord God yet?

I don't accuse you of anything kreagle because i don't know
what your life is like. You may, for all i know, be out there on
the streets every day, trying to do Gods works. How can i accuse
you of something when i don't know what you do?

You should be proud of yourself because you have been a source
of strength for me, in a time when i felt God had totally abandoned
me. Only now am i realizing that God is telling me to grow up, wake
up and start learning his word, so that i may share it with others.

Time on earth is short. The Lord is coming and God wants me to be
prepared.

Thank you Kreagle for all your help. I'm not sure where i'm going
from here but i do know that i need to work on my faith and my works.

[kreagle]

humanalien,

I'm glad to hear that you aren't particularly upset with me, for I genuinely didn't know whether you were, or not. Your 'current' display of admiring God's Word, one moment,.....then.....completely disdaining It's authenticity, the next, has been very perplexing to me as I have endeavored to help you 'sort things out'. It was with this observation that I surmised that I, too, was falling into this category of being 'helpful', one minute,......and then.....'hurting you', the next. Do you see, now, how I might have arrived at that conclusion?

Recent statements by you,....such as,...."I've just given up",.....have caused a great deal of concern for 'all' of us, here at Avalon, as we have recognized the 'fragile state' that you are currently in. However,......'giving up'.....is NOT an option, brother,....especially when you have a lasting, ( and PROVEN), 'solution' to your situation, no matter how bleak and uncertain it may seem, now!

Furthermore, I'm going to address a certain 'angle' that you are currently delving into, which is, quite frankly, getting you 'off track' from what you 'really need to be doing all along!' In your 'own words',...here is your 'current mentality' from a spiritual standpoint, humanalien.




I would expect a bible to be 6 to 10 inches
thick and packed full of information.


Brother,.....you don't need a 'thicker' Bible, my dear, dear, friend!,.....you 'just need to place your faith in the one you have!!!' His Word is already 'thick' enough, ( and 'thoroughly' complete), if you will simply place your trust in Him and show Him the proper respect for His Word, as you do Him! Your current 'quest' to gather 'mounds of Scriptural evidence', ( or documentations), is simply getting you 'off track' and causing you much further confusion, my friend!


This particular statement, by you, further illustrates your current disdain for 'how' His Word is presented to humanity, suggesting that you have a 'much better way' of presenting It.


Just commenting about the placement of where the
story of the battle in heaven is, in the bible.

I would think that - that would have been placed in Genesis,
somewhere right after earth was formed. At least it would be
in the right timeline.



The Bible specifically warns us that we should not be 'guilty' of....adding....or.....subtracting......'anything' to His Word.


Revelation 22:17-21 (KJV)

17 And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

20 He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

21 The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen.




Perhaps, humanalien, you might begin to 'understand' WHY God has chosen to present His Word to us in the way He has if you'll just go back a 'few years' in your own life and reminisce about your 'early' years in high school. All that 'information' we were all trying to learn just didn't 'hop off the pages of those schoolbooks and into our minds' did it? We had to 'study' them,....and commit them to memory, didn't we? The 'same' is true concerning the glorious Word of God!



2 Timothy 2:14-15 (KJV)

14 Of these things put them in remembrance, charging them before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, but to the subverting of the hearers.

15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.




It's the 'saint of God', ( workman), that faithfully accepts His Word, as written, and then embarks upon a pathway of study, ( and remembrance), of the same. Those last few words of verse 15 above,.....'rightly dividing' the world of truth,.....clearly indicates that a person can either 'rightly',.....or.....'wrongly'.....divide, ( or interpret), His Word. This is where the 'infilling of His Spirit' comes into play,...for without It the reader is going to eventually turn down the 'road of error' as the Scriptures fully indicate.


God bless you, brother!,......your friend, and servant,......kreagle

[humanalien]

I can understand where you are coming from and yes,
i have been all over the place as far as trying to understand
the scriptures.

At this particular moment in my life, it's really hard to focus
on scripture when i have just lost everything, including my
home.

My mind goes from one ex-stream to another and i just get
myself even more confused.

As far as all the scripture being there in place and every bit
of it being truthful, would be a big help for others, just learning
about God. It stands to reason that when people read a book,
they don't want to read the very beginning and then have the
book jump around a bit and then go back toward the beginning.

It makes for a very hard read.

Anyway. Tonight when i pray to God. I'm going to just drop
all my troubles off on Jesus and let him sort it all out. I haven't
got a clue what to do yet and i'm hoping he will help me out.

I ask Jesus last night to speak for me to his father and ask him to
come back into my life. I hope God agree's but i still believe that
Jesus is with me, so that's a plus. Some how, it different though
when God isn't around. You feel empty inside.

[kreagle]

humanalien,

I will pray 'with' you,.....and......'for' you, brother! I care, more than you can ever understand, and I submit myself before you to help you in any way that I can. The 'offers' I have made to you stand, and I sincerely hope you will take me up on them.

Once I was in the 'woods', ( completely lost), and this 'selfsame message' of Acts 2:38 'led me out of the woods' to spiritual safety and established the salvation of my soul!

By 'Divine design',....It is the 'only' message His Disciples, ( the Apostles), practised and taught to the 'original' Church, and it's simple directives of His.....DEATH....BURIAL....and....RESURRECTION still apply today, more than ever before! This is accomplished by you, and I, simply acknowledging our need to 1) Repent of our sins.....2) Be baptized in Jesus' name for the remission of those sins.....and then....3) Receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost which He has promised to those who believe on Him as the Scripture has said! ( see John 7:37-39)


John 7:37-39(KJV)

37 In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.

38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.

39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)




I continue to offer an 'extended hand' to you, brother! Keep in touch!


Your friend, and servant,......kreagle


***edited for additional thought***





At this particular moment in my life, it's really hard to focus
on scripture when i have just lost everything, including my
home.



Job 'knows exactly how you feel', brother! God got him through this,....and he will do the 'same' for you, too, my dear friend. Hang in there, brother! Sometimes mankind has to lose 'everything' in order to fully understand what 'everything' actually is and consequently is allowed to have it!!!


With 'agape' love from Him,.......kreagle

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

I ask Jesus last night to speak for me to his father and ask him to
come back into my life. I hope God agree's but i still believe that
Jesus is with me, so that's a plus.


Material lessons, such as you are experiencing, not always have material solutions. That is not to say that prayer and faith will 'bring' you material rewards and an answer to your problems, but spiritual realisation, revelation, can fill you with something far more valuable. Once equipped, you will view the material world, your life, completely differently.

What I'm trying to say is, don't give up. Never believe that your downturn in fortunes is some kind of punishment, or that you are neglected or unloved. Even Jesus himself had to endure 'the long dark night of the soul.' We must all go through that to experience revelation of God shining through that darkness… and the Spiritual Light of Dawn. You have asked God for aid. Ask and you shall receive, my friend. It will come, gradually or suddenly, openly or subtly. It all depends what your lesson is, and how it's meant to play out. But it will come!


Some how, it different though
when God isn't around. You feel empty inside.

Mate, mate, mate... God is never, ever 'not around'! But I do know the feeling of emptiness inside that you feel. Even with my own faith and spiritual knowledge that I possess and know to be true, there are days when I feel like that too. That isn't a lack of faith or understanding on my part, it's just the human baggage we all carry, the psychological, emotional, ego-charged energies of the life’s dramas that yes, can sometimes encroach upon our spiritual selves, smothering them.

It happens. Life is tough. Unfortunately it is aligned to a system (by evil design of TPTB) that keep us all chained to consumerism, and totally occupied by the need to 'survive' materially, rather than expand spiritually. And sometimes that endeavour does leave us with little 'left in the tank' at the end of the day. So don't feel bad, or separate, or 'neglected', just because you feel empty, exhausted, lonely, or stumbling through the darkness.

We all go there. It's called life, mate. It's called being Human. God, spirituality, knowing that 'this is not all that there is, and there's so much more to look forward to', gets me, and kreagle I'm sure, through the day. God can, and will, do the same for you!

[kreagle]

Some how, it different though
when God isn't around. You feel empty inside.

Mate, mate, mate... God is never, ever 'not around'! But I do know the feeling of emptiness inside that you feel. Even with my own faith and spiritual knowledge that I possess and know to be true, there are days when I feel like that too. That isn't a lack of faith or understanding on my part, it's just the human baggage we all carry, the psychological, emotional, ego-charged energies of the life’s dramas that yes, can sometimes encroach upon our spiritual selves, smothering them.

It happens. Life is tough. Unfortunately it is aligned to a system (by evil design of TPTB) that keep us all chained to consumerism, and totally occupied by the need to 'survive' materially, rather than expand spiritually. And sometimes that endeavour does leave us with little 'left in the tank' at the end of the day. So don't feel bad, or separate, or 'neglected', just because you feel empty, exhausted, lonely, or stumbling through the darkness.

We all go there. It's called life, mate. It's called being Human. God, spirituality, knowing that 'this is not all that there is, and there's so much more to look forward to', gets me, and kreagle I'm sure, through the day. God can, and will, do the same for you!


Star Mariner,

Excellent advice, brother! Very well put and spot on!


humanalien,

I hope you will always remember that even though you personally may feel like there's 'little left in the tank' at the end of the day, from time to time,......you will 'always' have a 'full tank of support here at Avalon', from your many 'friends' who deeply care about you. In addition, my friend, there is ONE, from above, who is endeavoring to 'fill your spiritual tank to capacity',....IF....you'll only listen to some of His simple directives He has shown you, as of late, and simply pull into His station for a 'fill-up', brother!


Take care,.....and 'love' from us 'all',........kreagle

[kreagle]

The 'Fear' of the Lord


I just posted a reply to this 'topic' on another thread by naste.de.lumina and felt it would be conducive to, likewise, post it here. There are entirely too many, today, who view the 'fear of the Lord' from a very skewed point of view. What's you view on this?


http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?59263-Spirituality-need-for-fear.&p=676607&viewfull=1#post676607




Hello friends.
This text has not the slightest pretension to impose anything, it's just a thought that took me way today afternoon.
So it's a personal perception that I would like to discuss because I think many of you more enlightened on this subject than I do.
I realize now that in many situations, for example, real communities, online communities, tv shows and media in general, that the matter in spirituality is taking much attention.
It appears to be intrinsic, the spiritual relationship with saving in most cases.
And the fear of not salvation, not part of the herd.
Regardless of religion or who believes individually, the fear of not being part of the class chosen seems to be most often present.
If this reasoning is valid, then we have to search for spirituality by fear in many people.
Then there is the fear, the opposite of love as fuel this engine running in search of spirituality.
I do not know if fear as starter, would be the one responsible for so many people realize fundamentalist, radical and uncompromising when it comes to faith in God.
But it seems to me plausible that it is an important ingredient in this universe, because intolerance, arrogance, selfishness, lack of empathy and other similar nouns are derived from the same negative force of fear.
Do not forget that fear is a fundamental tool, key Matrix control.
So far it is valid to search for spirituality by fear?

Love without fear for all.
Wander Brazilian.


naste.de.lumina,


I have always been convinced that mainstream Christianity's perception of the 'fear of the Lord' has been grossly skewed by a combination of 'ignorance,....and, of course, satanic design, also!' While 'fear', ( ie. to be 'afraid of'), certainly has it's merits, and is to be considered and administered,....when applicable,....the 'proper application' of this religious 'catch phrase' should be as to 'fear', ( ie. have revered 'respect' for), the Lord!


I do NOT serve the Lord because I 'fear', ( am 'afraid' of), Him,......but rather, I serve the Lord because I 'fear', ( have Divine 'respect'), for Him! There is a 'massive' difference between these 'two' definitions, in correlation to our outlook on how we actually view God,....and exactly 'how' He wants us to view, ( and serve), Him!


If one 'attempts' to serve the Lord because of 'fear', ( afraid, or scared to death of the consequences), they are going to be continually bombarded with undue condemnations,...live a 'defeated spiritual existence',....and ultimately loose out on their quest for Truth. Pure love,.....God's love,....has 'no room' for this type of 'fear' and those who endeavor to 'scare individuals into serving God' are either being motivated 'satanically,...or....simply ignorant' of what they are doing.



1 John 4:18 (KJV)

18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.




The 'fear of the Lord' mantra should 'always' be associated with our Divine respect for Him and His Word. A 'follower of Christ' should adopt the view that,....."I divinely respect You Lord,...so much,... that I fully believe in You,...and Your Word,... to the point that I unconditionally accept Your directives for my life!"


Once we attain this proper view of this Christian 'catch phrase',...FEAR,....we are then well on our way to a victorious Christian experience, my friends!


Your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle


I recently had a thought the other day as I pulled up to a red-light,....right next to a police car. As I sat there I was perfectly at ease, next to this patrol officer, and I suddenly 'remembered' my post, here, about 'fear'. It became crystal clear to me that my state of being at ease was simply due to the fact that I fully knew that I was 'in compliance with the law' in every sense of the word! You see,....as I stated earlier, I realized that I fully 'feared', ( ie. had 'respect'), for the law, but had absolutely no reason to 'fear', ( be afraid of any adverse consequences), as long as I lived within the 'guidelines' of the law!

No wonder there are so 'many', today, who actually have a bonafide 'fear', ( afraid of the consequences), of the Lord,.....for their lives are by 'nature' so outside of the boundaries of His Divine Law that this type of behavior just naturally comes to the surface when they become 'mindful' of the fact that they have come into His territory,....or His Word!

For example,...I have been driving on the open road, and gone around a curve where I suddenly came face to face with a state trooper and realized that I just 'might' be driving a 'little too fast'! My first reaction was to automatically touch my brake and 'slow down' because I suddenly felt that I was in 'violation of the law',....consequently producing a momentary 'fear', ( afraid of the consequences), within me.

Hence,....the overwhelming factor is whether 'we' are 'within the limits of His Law', ( His Word),.....OR.......whether we are in violation of the same!'

Once 'again', I submit the passage of 1 John 4:18, for further review,.....


1 John 4:18 (KJV)

18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.




The 'perfect love', spoken about in verse 18, surely denotes whether we are 'within the limits of His Law',.....or......'outside of the boundaries of His Law'.


The 'fear factor',.....we then display,.....denotes whether we have 'respect',.....or......'are afraid of the consequences'!


Points to ponder, my brothers/sisters,....to which 'side of the Law' we are on!


God Bless,.....your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Hey kreagle, I think you're right in many ways, but personally I do wonder if 'Law' is the right word here. The word Law to me denotes a prescribed and precisely defining rule or formula, one that is strictly enforced (not that it isn't enforced), but I would see it more as a 'code' - one laid down in the Bible, and spoken of extensively by Jesus, which is in our best interests to follow, rather than a code defined by 'you shall not', or 'you must not'. But this is just semantics and not really important.

What is important is how such a code or a law functions, and how it is 'put into effect' (better phrase for me than the word 'enforced'). The first thing that I believe, relevant to this topic, is that this world, this reality, is the realm of Free Will. It is our most precious gift. With free will we can shape who we want to be, where we want to go, what we want to become, and how we will conduct ourselves, and treat others. Free will defines everything about us: it is sovereign choice, pure and simple. God would have us choose the Positive side, His side, of course.

But we are free to side with the other if that is our preference. Evidence of so many people choosing the dark side is to be seen everywhere in the world at this time. And God does not interfere. Because transgressions against this code are of our own choice - they are self-inflicted, but so is the punitive side of the 'consequences' you named: you reap what you sow.

If there was an actual Law the world would function more like a kind of spiritual police state, with all transgressions met with swift judgement and divine wrath. But it isn't. Many evils endure, and in many sectors of our world. They have been playing out - quite freely - for centuries. For millennia. These are dark powers which we are free to align with, if we so choose. Beware those that do! Because, once again, what we reap is what we sow. That is the beauty of perfect justice. This is in essence karma, not a Christian doctrine I know, but that is not to say it's concept is not highlighted in many places, eg:



Proverbs 26:27
Whoso diggeth a pit shall fall therein, and he that rolleth a stone, it will return upon him.


Job 4:8
Even as I have seen, they that plow iniquity, and sow wickedness, reap the same.


2 Corinthians 5:10
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to what he hath done, whether it be good or bad.


Just thinking aloud some thoughts I have on this subject matter, which I wanted to share just for the conversation, and even if they don't 'tessellate' with your own, kreagle my friend. The most important thing I'm trying to get across is, it isn't important whether you believe in the idea of karma/reincarnation or the Christian idea of Hell and damnation, all that matters is that God, in my opinion, is not something to be feared. Quite the opposite. Any punishments that we will 'receive' will happen automatically, because we have, by our actions, inflicted them upon ourselves.

Just generalizing here: we have been 'let loose' by God, out into the Universe to freely explore it. We are free to explore wherever and whatever we wish, to live, learn and experience - and to err, sometimes even far from God if we fully descend, but always with the promise that God is available. Salvation can never be denied. If it is the free will of a soul to go down a long and dismal road estranged from God, then so be it. But all roads have an exit. And all roads wind back the way they have come.

So nothing is forever, and all ills that are done can be undone, in time. That is the greatest transition a soul can make, from utter darkness and the absence of God, straight into the love and light of his waiting heart. This for the lost soul is the greatest and most celebrated of all transitions, and God's fondest hope...

Love is eternal, and hope never fades! This is my belief.

****

On a slightly different topic, and to add to John 4:18 which you quoted (many thanks), may I offer John 4:20 as well, a wonderful passage. There are many in his world who profess a 'love' for God in one way or another - a God by this name or by that name, and yet will turn on his fellow man and scorn him, harm him - sometimes in the very name of said God! I speak particularly of those men who hold the reigns of Power. They may attend church on a sunday, and yet make war on a monday. What then do they know of God at all? And what do they know of love?

Remember this, I say to them, and heed it well.


1 John 4:20
If a man say, “I love God,” and hateth his brother, he is a liar. For he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen?

[kreagle]

Hey brother!,

Interesting 'points' you bring up, my dear friend. The main reason some of our 'points' don't 'tessellate', ( or perfectly align together), results from your personal view of many Biblical concepts as 'figurative',......whereas my standpoint is 'literal'. You've equally stated this observation, between you and I, so I can easily see 'why' you might express yourself on this point as such. It's with much gladness that I especially denote a 'slight lean within you', ( towards the 'literal side'), that 'most' don't have,....particularly with your articulate way of expressing yourself, and overall command of intellectually viewing these types of subjects. I highly commend you, my brother!



Hey kreagle, I think you're right in many ways, but personally I do wonder if 'Law' is the right word here. The word Law to me denotes a prescribed and precisely defining rule or formula, one that is strictly enforced (not that it isn't enforced), but I would see it more as a 'code' - one laid down in the Bible, and spoken of extensively by Jesus, which is in our best interests to follow, rather than a code defined by 'you shall not', or 'you must not'. But this is just semantics and not really important.

Brother, I really am convinced that 'Law' is the perfect word to use, here,....it's just that 'humanity' has now come to the point where the 'Law' doesn't carry the weight that it once did, in their minds, not too many years ago. To 'many' individuals, today, the 'Law of God's Word' has become 'overgrown with the cares of this world',.....as illustrated, here.



http://www.kingcounty.gov/environment/animalsAndPlants/noxious-weeds/weed-news/~/media/environment/animalsAndPlants/noxious_weeds/imagesD_G/English_ivy_stop_sign.ashx


Make no mistake, brother,....the 'STOP' sign, ( ie. the 'Law'), is 'still' there, and to be fully heeded. Through 'indifference,...and carelessness', towards God, mankind has allowed the 'cares of this world' to choke out, and overgrow, His 'many Divine signs',....( ie. His Word, His anointed Preachers and Teachers, etc.), to the point that these 'signs' go unheeded to the impending peril of mankind! Oh,....you might be able to 'run through this overgrown, obscured STOP sign',...over, and over, again without suffering any 'consequences',....but sooner, or later,....the 'Law' is going to catch up with you, with potentially 'deadly results', my dear friend!

Likewise,....the 'Lawgiver', Himself, shall return to completely 'restore order',... and His Law will then totally rule, again, forevermore.

Perhaps we need to listen to the Words of this 'Lawgiver', Himself,.....straight from His Mouth,......



Matthew 5:17-19 (KJV)

17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.


Brother,.....the 'one jot or one tittle' that His Word refers to, here, denotes the precise 'smallest part' of His Law,...or His Word,....the 'iotas',...if you will. Mankind seems to 'conveniently' forget that He is definitely a 'God of His Word',....and 'He says what He means',.....and 'He means what He says!'

There are 'no' idle Words proceeding from the 'Mouth of God'!



On a slightly different topic, and to add to John 4:18 which you quoted (many thanks), may I offer John 4:20 as well, a wonderful passage. There are many in his world who profess a 'love' for God in one way or another - a God by this name or by that name, and yet will turn on his fellow man and scorn him, harm him - sometimes in the very name of said God! I speak particularly of those men who hold the reigns of Power. They may attend church on a sunday, and yet make war on a monday. What then do they know of God at all? And what do they know of love?

Remember this, I say to them, and heed it well.


1 John 4:20
If a man say, “I love God,” and hateth his brother, he is a liar. For he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen?


I fully, and completely, agree brother!


As always,......your 'cherished' brother, friend, and servant,.....kreagle

[kreagle]

Star Mariner,

Brother, I apologize for having to break up my comment to you on your latest post. I had 'everything' together in one single post, when I received an 'Internet error' signal which wiped out the 'second half' of my reply to you. This 'second half' of my post was meant to deal with your comment on 'Free Will', which I agree with in principle, subject to my own 'literal' translation, compared to your 'figurative' view.




What is important is how such a code or a law functions, and how it is 'put into effect' (better phrase for me than the word 'enforced'). The first thing that I believe, relevant to this topic, is that this world, this reality, is the realm of Free Will. It is our most precious gift. With free will we can shape who we want to be, where we want to go, what we want to become, and how we will conduct ourselves, and treat others. Free will defines everything about us: it is sovereign choice, pure and simple. God would have us choose the Positive side, His side, of course.

But we are free to side with the other if that is our preference. Evidence of so many people choosing the dark side is to be seen everywhere in the world at this time. And God does not interfere. Because transgressions against this code are of our own choice - they are self-inflicted, but so is the punitive side of the 'consequences' you named: you reap what you sow.

If there was an actual Law the world would function more like a kind of spiritual police state, with all transgressions met with swift judgement and divine wrath. But it isn't. Many evils endure, and in many sectors of our world. They have been playing out - quite freely - for centuries. For millennia. These are dark powers which we are free to align with, if we so choose. Beware those that do! Because, once again, what we reap is what we sow. That is the beauty of perfect justice. This is in essence karma, not a Christian doctrine I know, but that is not to say it's concept is not highlighted in many places, eg:



Proverbs 26:27
Whoso diggeth a pit shall fall therein, and he that rolleth a stone, it will return upon him.


Job 4:8
Even as I have seen, they that plow iniquity, and sow wickedness, reap the same.


2 Corinthians 5:10
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to what he hath done, whether it be good or bad.


Just thinking aloud some thoughts I have on this subject matter, which I wanted to share just for the conversation, and even if they don't 'tessellate' with your own, kreagle my friend. The most important thing I'm trying to get across is, it isn't important whether you believe in the idea of karma/reincarnation or the Christian idea of Hell and damnation, all that matters is that God, in my opinion, is not something to be feared. Quite the opposite. Any punishments that we will 'receive' will happen automatically, because we have, by our actions, inflicted them upon ourselves.




Surely, we have been divinely endowed with a 'Free Will' to pursue whichever direction we wish to embark upon,...( as you have indicated), but I would not confuse this with the notion that there is no 'cost, and/or reward' associated with the choice we make. To your credit, you do accurately allude to the fact that there are 'present-day',...self-inflicted consequences that often are thrust upon us,...and to which His word highlights for us. ( Also supplied by you in your post,....many thanks!) What should be realized, through this, is that God is endeavoring to 'nudge us into the right direction' with these 'present-day consequences' so that we might 'all' learn our lesson 'now',......rather than,.......'later on', ( in eternity), when it's too late to make any corrections! Once again, I'm sure that our current 'figurative/literal' views on God's Word don't 'tessellate' in complete unison, but I am persuaded to, once again, adhere to the Biblical teachings on this, as I'm sure you would expect me to, at this point.


Much 'Love and Peace',......your brother, friend, and servant,.....kreagle

[humanalien]

One day, you all will realize that all religion is wrong and
all bibles are lies or at best, old fables, stolen from a time
before biblical text even existed.

A lot of stories in the bible, like maybe the flood of noahs
day, can be found somewhere in the epic of gilgamesh.

Everything, just about, was copied from other, non biblical
text, that existed way before biblical text was even dreamed
up, and bible(s) and religion(s) were created.

If you believe what the bible says, in 2 Thessalonians 2:10-11
it says:

10: And with all delusion of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

11: And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

Their is only one thing in the world, that is so big that people believe everything
they are told about it and that is religion. It doesn't matter who's religion it is
because all of them are wrong. All bibles are wrong. They have been so severely
tampered with and mis-translated, over and over again, that there is barely a
sliver of truth in any of them now.

Religion and bibles are a man made thing and in control of and by man.

Anyone that hasn't been brainwashed in religion can plainly see that there
are so many holes in the biblical stories and events happening at wrong times,
that bibles can't possibly contain any truth.

If any man were a true follower of God, he/she would know that everything
religious is a lie. God would plainly tell them so, or would he?

I'm taken back to the story of Job.

Job was a righteous and just man and served God with all the love
in his heart.

Gods sons, one day, all come before God and satan came to.

Right there, i have a problem. If satan was thrown out of heaven,
then how is it that he just casually drops by Gods place, for a visit?

There is already a lie in this story and we hardly begun yet.

Anyway, God tells satan, like they are really good buddies, have you
considered my servant Job? There is none like him in all the earth.

Satan tells God, hey, let me have a crack at this guy and i'' have him
cursing your name in no time.

God accepts the challenge and satan leaves.

Satan goes out and has everything that Job possessed, stolen from
him and later on, satan created a windstorm or a tornado that flattened
the house that all of Jobs children were inside of, killing them all.

Later on, Gods sons come before God again and satan were there again to.
Again the same bet was made and satan put huge boils all over Jobs body.

If any of you have ever had a boil, those are so painful and to have a body
full of them, it's goes way beyond pain.

Point here is, Job was a trusted and very loyal servant of God. He loved
God with all his heart and prayed and gave thanks, every day. There was
not a man like him, found on all the earth.

If this is how God treats his loyal servants, count me out. I want no part
of a God that will, at a whim, do to you, what-ever he feels like doing to you,
just because he can.

The bible teaches us that God is all loving but there was no love shown there.

One of the ten commandments is not to kill, yet God sends moses out to kill
others. Shouldn't he lead by example.

Jesus the meek and mild one, tells us that if someone slaps your face,
turn the other cheek and get that one slapped to. He is all about the
peace and not being violent.

In Matthew 10 34-35 it says

34: Think not that I am come to send peace on earth:
I came not to send peace, but a sword.

35: For I am come to set a man at variance against his father,
and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law
against her mother in law.

From what i gather of this, jesus being born was never to
bring peace to the world but perpetual wars.

He came to set son against father, daughter against mother,
daughter-in-law against mother-in-law.

I know what your thinking and you saying that i have it all wrong
but i do not have anything wrong sir.

In you own words:

Brother,.....the 'one jot or one tittle' that His Word refers to, here, denotes the precise 'smallest part'of His Law,...or His Word,....the 'iotas',...if you will. Mankind seems to 'conveniently' forget that He is definitely a 'God of His Word',....and 'He says what He means',.....and 'He means what He says!'

There are 'no' idle Words proceeding from the 'Mouth of God'!


Does this only apply when you say it is so or can these words be applied
to all of Gods Word?

Jesus says in Matthew 10:37

He that loves father or mother more than me is not worthy of me:
and he that loves son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.

Who really knows jesus well enough to say that they love him
more than anyone.

I don't know about any of you but i love my daughter more
than God and Jesus. I don't know them and even if i did, i'd
still love my daughter more.

What father or parent would give up their childrens lives,
to maybe go fight in Gods war or just to be with him? Not me.

What give jesus the right to say something like that? He wants
you to choose him over your own flesh and blood. That is so sad.
It really is.

Now either God/Jesus are liers or the bible has been so messed up that
there is barely and truth in it any more. Which is it? This is why i
posted this stuff. Not to pick on you kreagle but to point out the many
many flaws in any biblical text. They are a man made thing, and not
of God.

I'm not falling for the old, "you have to be filled with the
holy spirit, before you will understand", story again.

That's how Christians talk their way out of everything. For once,
come out of your belief system and read the real words the
bible says.

A friend of mine, from another forum used to get pissed at me
because i tried to prove to him things in the bible by quoting
scripture but if the scripture is a pack of lies, and mistranslations,
like he kept telling me, then how is quoting scripture going to
prove anything?

It's funny that scriptural text has only been around 2 to 3 thousand years
, yet we have text dating much much further back in time, that
tells of different gods that were around at that time.

If according to scripture, the earth is less than 10 thousand
years old, how do we get artifacts and text that dates further
back than 10 thousand years?

A mind blowing thought just entered my cranial cavity.

Everyone by now knows how governemts work. Reps and dems, are
suppose to be on different teams with one team being the bad guy
and the other one, the good guy, depending on how you look at
it. In reality though, they both play for the same team. Team
Greed. Their titles just make them look like they are on different
teams.

What if God and satan are playing on the same team. One is presented
as the good guy while the other is presented as the bad guy but in
reality, they both play for the same team and play the same game.

Maybe every character in the bible has been severely misrepresented
and we really don't know any of the at all.

I believe this to be the case. I believe in God/Jesus, for what-ever
reason but thats it. The bible(s) are a pack of lies and mistranslations
and all religions are wrong.

If you do just a little research into the far past history, you will see for your
self that the bible is made up of stories, stolen from a time before the bible.

Until you can climb out of your world of lies and see what is really the truth,
God will continue to send you those delusions, to make you believe that
religions are truth. Of course though, we can't trust what the bible say anyway.

All i really know, in my heart is that God exits. Thats all i know about him.

[kreagle]

humanalien,

Brother, I'm going to give you a little 'time' to think about your latest tirade towards.... God's Word, ( the Bible),.... 'pure religion', ( which does exist, James 1:27),...and your 'potential' role in all of this, my dear friend.


Your 'current' Dr. Jekyll/Mr. Hyde persona makes it virtually 'impossible' for me to accurately assist you,....UNTIL....you decide 'who you actually want to be, ( or become).'

I have never made it a practise to 'continue to try' to teach someone who 'doesn't want to be taught!',....OR....to help someone who 'doesn't want to be helped!'

Furthermore,....I will not be able, ( or willing), to continue to attempt to instruct you, ( or anyone else), who seemingly insists that I 'abandon my Answer Book,...the Bible!'


You need to fully understand that I 'continue' to care, ( very deeply), for you and your situation and prayerfully hope you will get a grip on yourself and decide 'which side' you want to be on. Only you can make this decision.

Your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[humanalien]

I'm not truly pick on you or your religion Kreagle. Your
happy being who you are and that is fine with me. I was
just pointing out more mistakes that i find in the bible and
i trying to show others(not only you) what i found.

I agree. Don't try to teach me kreagle because i'm not ready
for that step yet or maybe never. I don't know.

I do appreciate what you were trying to do and i thank you
for that but i didn't come here to be converted to begin with.

If i were to do that, i would contact a local church to help me with
that. I was just totally confused when i first came here and yes, i
probably looked like a jeckle/hide thing but now i can see more clearer
and now, i'm not confused any more.

Phones ringing, i'll have to go but thanks for your help kreagle.
I still consider you a friend to. I know you only have my best interest
at heart.

I'll not post any more on this forum thread, so that i don't become
a disrupter or derailer or what-ever magical name people are calling
it now.

[kreagle]

When 'Earthly' Treasure Looses It's Luster


I'm really convinced that 'this spiritual insight' of earthly treasures loosing their luster is one of the first things a person will notice when, ( if ever), they finally decide to embark upon their 'walk with God'. It certainly was for me.

As long as the 'luster' of this earthly life captivates most individuals,....they never seem to 'get around' to seeing their impending need for 'another life'. You can rest assured that Satan will go to extreme measures to 'polish up your earthly existence' as much as he can in an attempt to prohibit you from ever getting a 'divine image' of what God has in store for those who become disenchanted with the luster of this earthly existence!


Notice, here, the 'state of mind' of the Ethiopian eunuch in Acts chapter 8,...prior to his conversion.



Acts 8:26-40 (KJV)

26 And the angel of the Lord spake unto Philip, saying, Arise, and go toward the south unto the way that goeth down from Jerusalem unto Gaza, which is desert.

27 And he arose and went: and, behold, a man of Ethiopia, an eunuch of great authority under Candace queen of the Ethiopians, who had the charge of all her treasure, and had come to Jerusalem for to worship,

28 Was returning, and sitting in his chariot read Esaias the prophet.

29 Then the Spirit said unto Philip, Go near, and join thyself to this chariot.

30 And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Esaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest?

31 And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him.

32 The place of the scripture which he read was this, He was led as a sheep to the slaughter; and like a lamb dumb before his shearer, so opened he not his mouth:

33 In his humiliation his judgment was taken away: and who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken from the earth.

34 And the eunuch answered Philip, and said, I pray thee, of whom speaketh the prophet this? of himself, or of some other man?

35 Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus.

36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?

37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.

38 And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.

39 And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.

40 But Philip was found at Azotus: and passing through he preached in all the cities, till he came to Caesarea.




In verse 27, above, we find that this Ethiopian eunuch 'had the charge' of all of the queen's treasure. He had complete control over this wealth and, no doubt, his entire daily routine would have consisted of 'being around money and wealth'. However, in the midst of wealth that he constantly found himself surrounded by we find that his 'state of mind' had become disillusioned with what he easily had at his disposal. The 'luster' of all that he had before him was finally beginning to erode away causing him to, wisely,....look 'elsewhere' in his attempt for an 'everlasting treasure',....and one that would 'never loose it's luster!'

It takes 'complete faith', my dear friends, to 'totally' invest in 'another life',...( from a spiritual standpoint), when you've become so accustom to 'this side of life' that the world has to offer. The only way that 'most' are able to take that 'initial step of faith' is when they become cognizant of the fact that 'this world' does not contain the answers they are looking for. This 'earthly existence' has to, personally, 'loose it's luster', in order for you to seek a more promising and 'lasting' spiritual lifestyle.


Matthew 6:20-22 (KJV)

20 But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:

21 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.




In closing, here, I ask you to look, again, at verse 22,....The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.


The 'eye being single' that is spoken about, here, is in direct correlation to us having the 'spiritual acuity' that I spoke of earlier in post #604,....http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?48678-Bible-Topics-and-Questions&p=671262&viewfull=1#post671262


That 'spiritual acuity',....( if properly used),....should begin to engage itself the very moment you 'begin to see', ( and recognize),....that 'this world doesn't have your answers',....and has 'lost it's luster'!

This 'moment of truth' is often our own, personal, 'Genesis moment',....'a true beginning' of seeking that which will 'never tarnish,...nor lose it's value!'

At least,...it was for me! Perhaps it is for you, also!


Your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

What kind of 'hand' do you have?
(....."is 'it' good enough to go 'ALL IN?')


http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_dfClHjAuXrE/TFXhlFxSBkI/AAAAAAAAB6c/AT-7-MKnzjM/s400/Poker+going+all+in.jpg


In the grand scheme of things there are 'many' who feel that they have unjustly been 'dealt' a horrible hand in life. Truth be known,.....we've 'all' been dealt a 'potential' winning hand,.....it's all according to 'how' you play the hand you have been dealt! You can 'win' with the hand you have been dealt,....or.....you can 'lose' with it,.....the 'choice' is entirely up to you, with the actions you take.


In reality, the hand we are dealt looks like 'this',......all 'face down', and to our much dismay we don't have a 'clue' as to what we really have, do we?


21753

All along, God's Word tells us 'exactly' what kind of hand He has dealt to 'every single one of us',....if we will only take the time to look within It's Sacred Pages and see it for ourselves.


Romans 12:3 (KJV)

3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.




21751


21752


Yes,....regardless to how 'bleak' we may, individually, feel our own personal hand stacks up with the rest of this world, our own God-given hand contains the adequate ingredients of 'faith'! Here it normally lies dormant for many years before it's owner wakes up and finally recognizes what God has divinely placed in their hands and just how powerful it can be when properly activated within their own lives. Once one finally becomes awakened to just how powerful their 'God-dealt' hand of faith actually is,....there's only 'one thing left to do!'

It's time to go,.....'ALL IN'!

Quite frankly, the Word of God is replete with examples of various individuals who were required, ( one way or the other), to take what extreme 'little...or...abundance' that they had in their possession and to then be 'willing' to go 'ALL IN' with God in order for them to divinely arrive where God was beckoning them to.


#1)-In the Biblical account of the 'poor widow' we find where there are 'those' who don't have much to begin with, but nevertheless sense the spiritual need to go 'ALL IN' with God, as she certainly did,......



Mark 12:41-44 (KJV)

41 And Jesus sat over against the treasury, and beheld how the people cast money into the treasury: and many that were rich cast in much.

42 And there came a certain poor widow, and she threw in two mites, which make a farthing.

43 And he called unto him his disciples, and saith unto them, Verily I say unto you, That this poor widow hath cast more in, than all they which have cast into the treasury:

44 For all they did cast in of their abundance; but she of her want did cast in all that she had, even all her living.



#2)-In the Biblical account of 'Job', we find the polar opposite of earthly wealth. When 'all' of his abundant worldly possessions were stripped away from him, he still didn't hesitate to go 'ALL IN' with God, as fully indicated by his unswerving dedication to Him through this fiery trial, and especially by these words uttered from his lips.



Job 13:15 (KJV)

15 Though he slay me, yet will I trust in him: but I will maintain mine own ways before him.




#3)-In the Biblical account of 'Abraham', we find another man of 'great abundance' who was being asked to give up his 'prized possession',.....his 'only' son, Isaac. Here, the 'Father of Israel', ( Abraham), and his 'original seed' , ( Isaac), were specifically 'put to the test' by God to see whether they were 'ALL IN' with Him, or not. It was very obvious that God had a specific plan in store for this 'nation of Israel', ( His people), and though they would encounter moments of doubts, and failures, down their long illustrious history, they would walk through places, situations, that no other nation has ever had to endure since the dawning of mankind. For 'this', it was going to require a 'people' that were 'ALL IN' with Him, going all the way back to their very inception with Abraham and Isaac that we read about, here.



Genesis 22:1-14 (KJV)

22 And it came to pass after these things, that God did tempt Abraham, and said unto him, Abraham: and he said, Behold, here I am.

2 And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of.

3 And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and saddled his ass, and took two of his young men with him, and Isaac his son, and clave the wood for the burnt offering, and rose up, and went unto the place of which God had told him.

4 Then on the third day Abraham lifted up his eyes, and saw the place afar off.

5 And Abraham said unto his young men, Abide ye here with the ass; and I and the lad will go yonder and worship, and come again to you.

6 And Abraham took the wood of the burnt offering, and laid it upon Isaac his son; and he took the fire in his hand, and a knife; and they went both of them together.

7 And Isaac spake unto Abraham his father, and said, My father: and he said, Here am I, my son. And he said, Behold the fire and the wood: but where is the lamb for a burnt offering?

8 And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together.

9 And they came to the place which God had told him of; and Abraham built an altar there, and laid the wood in order, and bound Isaac his son, and laid him on the altar upon the wood.

10 And Abraham stretched forth his hand, and took the knife to slay his son.

11 And the angel of the Lord called unto him out of heaven, and said, Abraham, Abraham: and he said, Here am I.

12 And he said, Lay not thine hand upon the lad, neither do thou any thing unto him: for now I know that thou fearest God, seeing thou hast not withheld thy son, thine only son from me.

13 And Abraham lifted up his eyes, and looked, and behold behind him a ram caught in a thicket by his horns: and Abraham went and took the ram, and offered him up for a burnt offering in the stead of his son.

14 And Abraham called the name of that place Jehovahjireh: as it is said to this day, In the mount of the Lord it shall be seen.



In verse 10, above, we clearly see that Abraham, ( and Isaac, too), were undoubtedly 'ALL IN' with God. Nowhere, throughout this divine request from God do we find any 'hesitation',....or....'questioning God' about His directives, from either Abraham, or even Isaac, the 'would-be' sacrifice. In the 'moment of truth', spoken about in verse 10, we find Abraham 'fully committed' into carrying out God's direct order, with the knife actually beginning it's downward thrust into the chest of Isaac, before being called off at the 'last moment' by the angel of the Lord.

The 'hearts' of both Abraham, and Isaac, had just clearly spoken out!

The 'Father,...and his Seed' had just made their declaration,....."We're ALL IN!"



( A 'personal' note)


Make no mistake, my dear friends,.....somewhere along the line the 'child of God' will clearly be tested to see whether they are 'ALL IN' with God, or not. To think that someone,.....'anyone',....will somehow 'slip in under the radar', ( so-to-speak), is only wishful thinking. His Word clearly tells us that with God there is 'no respect to persons', and that we are 'all' on 'equal footing' with equal treatment, requirements, and love coming our way from Him!


I've shared my personal testimony with many of you in relationship to myself being 'born again' of the water and the Spirit. As I've stated, before, I had repented of my sins around the 2nd, or 3rd week of January, 1981,....and had followed that up with being baptized in the 'name' of Jesus Christ, for the remission of those sins, on January 30th, 1981. I had 'fully expected' to be filled with His Spirit, the Holy Ghost, when I came up out of the water when I was baptized,....but alas, I was not immediately filled with His Spirit, then, as I had thought I would be. Consequently, I began to 'seek' His infilling Spirit each day, after my baptism. I would conclude each day with a great deal of in-depth prayer,....seeking God,....seeking His presence,.....and His infilling Spirit. Nevertheless,.....the days began to roll by,....one-by-one,....and I still had not received the 'promise' of being filled with the Holy Ghost! I began to wonder,....."what was wrong,....where was I erring,.....what had I 'yet' to do?"


I was starting my 'third week' since being baptized in Jesus' name, when it dawned on me to call my pastor, and asked him if I could drop by his house for a few questions, which he, of course, said yes to come on by. When I got there, my pastor and his wife were entertaining some other 'guests',...but he came outside and we decided to sit in the front seat of their car, for a few moments, while I talked to him, assuring him it would only take a 'few minutes'.

I began to describe to my pastor all of the efforts I was undergoing in order to completely 'clean up my life' and to be pleasing to God. I told him of my concentrated 'prayer life' I was undergoing late each evening,....and my intense seeking of God. After searching my soul,.....and telling him everything I was attempting to do,.....I finally, ( out of desperation), asked my pastor,....."what else am I to do?,.....I'm willing to do 'whatever' God leads me to do!",......and THEN,.....I specifically remember telling my pastor the following. "I've know this might sound silly,....but, I've got a 'few' old coins I've been saving,....and I've been wondering if I should 'give them to the Lord',....because I don't want NOTHING to come in the way of me being filled with the Holy Ghost, pastor!"

My pastor had been 'intently' listening to what I was saying, and as soon as those 'words' had come out across my lips, I saw the most 'loving' look come across his face as he warmly smiled and said the following,...."Brother Ken, ( aka...kreagle),....you don't have to 'give them to the Lord',....for 'in your heart',....you 'already' have given them to Him,....you just haven't realized it, until now!"

Folks,.....little did I 'realize' it THEN,.....but I had just gone 'ALL IN' with the Lord!

The 'next' Church service,....two days later,.....on February 22, 1981, on our Sunday evening worship service,.....twenty-three days after being baptized in Jesus' name,....I was gloriously filled with the Holy Ghost and began to 'speak in other tongues' as His Spirit spoke through me in another language that I had never learned, ( or knew), before. I was now 'born again' of the water and the Spirit!


( In conclusion)


So you see,....regardless to whether you're a 'poor widow' woman with only two mites to your name,....or.....a man who seems to have everything going for them, ( Job),.....or.....the historical/Biblical 'Father-figure' of a great nation throughout the annals of earth's history, ( Abraham),.....or......just a 'plain' young man of 26 years old, ( Ken,..aka..kreagle,... 'southern raised',...and soon to be 59),.....or.....wherever 'You', particularly fit in on this grand scale,.....the 'theme' remains the same!

The 'events of Calvary' clearly indicates, ( and proves), that He is 'ALL IN' for you and I! His Word, likewise, indicates He expects the 'same' from each of us,....from the 'smallest to the greatest'!


Your 'God-dealt' hand is Divine,.....it's a Winner!,......it's time to go 'ALL IN', my friend!


Your 'loving' brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[kreagle]

Our 'Caboose' finally self-detached himself, today!


http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-QgIGmwzzjBQ/ThcBf10fRlI/AAAAAAAAAWI/gbkDTMrzVDY/s1600/1674601636.jpg


No,....this picture is not an actual photo of our 'youngest' son, ( the 'caboose' in our family),....just simply a 'thought' I wanted to visualize, here. Quite frankly,....our son, ( the 'caboose'), is much 'older' than the young man in this image,...and his 'departure' from our little 'nest' is long overdue.


I, personally, have been forced to endure quite a bit of 'extreme ridicule' from 'both sides of my family',..( mine and my wife's), in relationship to my son being 'allowed' to continue to live with us. My rationale for allowing him to stay was simply due to the fact that he wasn't 'ready', ( or mature enough), to venture out into this world at the time. Everyone within my family was crying out for me to 'kick him out',...and force him to grow up on his own. The 'one' thing they didn't realize, that I, ( his father), fully did was the 'fragile condition of his soul' . You see,....my son did NOT know God,....like I did,...and I did NOT want to be guilty of sending him out into this world in this 'fragile' state of mind/spirit which would have been very detrimental to him!


I am 'elated' to report that my son finally saw the 'light of God', through some of my personal efforts, and testimonies, to him. It was with great joy that I was able to take him down to Church, ( at his request),.... late one evening, ( a little over two years ago), and met with our pastor, and his wife, and he consequently was baptized in the precious name of Jesus Christ! Two days later,....he, also, received the gift of the Holy Ghost, where he, also, spoke in other tongues as God gloriously filled him with His Spirit!


Now I can at least have the comfort of knowing that my 'youngest' son is being sent out into this world with His Spirit dwelling within him to be his 'guide' in this turbulent world in which we all live. The 'missing' Ingredient within his life was, ( and IS), fully there NOW, to direct his path in all the areas of life that I, ( his 'earthly' father), cannot adequately direct him in.

He's in 'God's Hands', now,.....which is 'exactly' where I wanted him to be all along!

From here, on out,....I don't know what life has in store for him,...but I have fully commended him into the Trusting Hands of our Lord GOD, Himself!

He's yours,....Lord Jesus!,....Take care of my son!

I've 'run this race' of fatherhood the best I could, on his behalf, and now I'm turning the 'baton' over to your Hand,...my sweet Lord.


Proverbs 22:6 (KJV)

6 Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not depart from it.



Attach my 'detached caboose' to Your magnificent Train and be his Conductor!


My heart is heavy,.... please say a prayer for my son!


As 'always',....your loving brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

The Surgeon's Scalpel


http://images.fineartamerica.com/images-medium/the-two-edged-sword-william-robelen.jpg


As pointed out by this passage of Scripture, God's Word is specifically designed to surgically 'divide', ( or separate), between the 'spiritual-side and the carnal-side' of mankind. The 'dividing asunder of soul and spirit, ( spiritual-side),....and of the joints and marrow', ( carnal-side), clearly indicates which side of mankind that God wants to 'come out on top' in His quest for us to be in harmony with Him.


In today's society,....'many' individuals will not hesitate to 'go under the surgeon's knife' for various types of surgeries,....regardless to whether they are actually needed, or not. The primary type of surgeries I am referring to, here, are 'cosmetic', in nature, and designed to 'enhance the carnal-side' of man/woman through plastic surgery, etc. It has become increasingly apparent that the 'vanity of mankind' is the motivating factor for these such 'operations'. Futhermore, this popular practise has now reached such epic proportions that 'few' rarely see anything wrong, or amiss, with these 'cosmetic' procedures to begin with.


You will hardly, ( or rarely), 'hear a peek' of opposition from this 'ever growing crowd' of individuals who seemingly endorse this type of excessive 'cosmetic surgeries',...and which often end in horrendous mutilations of their bodies and appearances. However,....just let the 'occasional' young man/woman decide to 'go under the knife of our Surgeon, Himself',....to make a 'spiritual change' in their life seems to be a different matter, altogether! The 'screams of opposition' really seem to resonate, then, especially when any of His 'handy-work' is placed on display for 'all' the world to see what He has done in their lives!


Isn't it odd that 'many' don't have a problem trusting a 'human surgeon with a knife in his hand',.......BUT,.......cringe at the thought of trusting, ( or allowing), a 'Divine Surgeon to perform His transformational Work on them?'


A 'thought' well worth pondering,....my dear friends!


Your brother, friend, and servant,........kreagle

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

You always have a very interesting take on scripture kreagle and I continue to applaud it - meaning that you are able to present a passage and then draw an insightful analogy from it, to impart wisdom. Because it might be said that there are multiple 'possible' connotations in any given passage. And I don't mean conflicting ones in this instance, but several multi-layered nuggets of information/wisdom embedded in what appears, at first, to be a singularly presented context.

I really like the above interpretation of vanity versus spirituality, the divine knife and the surgeon’s. And it is definitely an apt observation.

I know this passage and have considered it before, but arrived at something different. Again, not to say that one understanding must compete with another - the two can exist side by side in the same space. I believe the Bible in many areas and respects is multi-layered - even multi-dimensional in how it is written and constructed.


Hebrews 12
For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

What I have perceived with this statement is that the word of God is not in manner a word at all - not a spoken article, but a thought. Any religious or spiritual person that knows God, loves God, has ever 'communed' with God, has not actually audibly heard God 'speak' with human voice in human language. Everything they know and have learned has entered directly into their heart and mind in the shape of a thought, an emotion, a realisation: this is to say mentally - telepathically. Because this is the medium of communication that needs no body, needs no spoken tongue. It is mental, and instantaneous, it is a giver to, and discerner of 'thoughts and intents of the heart'.

Have you ever been in a situation where you have a very clear notion in your mind – a thought, a concept, an emotion, an experience in every detail, which you can construct instantly in your mind but cannot for the life of you adequately put into words/language?

This medium is the language of God, and of all spiritual beings that have no physical body, no tongue or voice-box or joints and marrow. It is pure thought, and thus knows no error/mistranslation in the communication.

This concept is further highlighted in the next verse.


Hebrews 13
Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do.

It shows again how physicality is no obstacle to the spiritual. God can literally cut - with that divine knife - through whatever physical barricade we may put up. He can see through whatever screen we might raise to hide behind. He can perceive to the very heart and mind that might close down to protect whatever secret we hold. In a nutshell, we are naked and open to the Lord. And this should serve as a warning to the negative ones in our civilization. There is no where they can run and hide, and nothing they can do, to evade detection, or avoid spiritual justice.

[kreagle]

You always have a very interesting take on scripture kreagle and I continue to applaud it - meaning that you are able to present a passage and then draw an insightful analogy from it, to impart wisdom. Because it might be said that there are multiple 'possible' connotations in any given passage. And I don't mean conflicting ones in this instance, but several multi-layered nuggets of information/wisdom embedded in what appears, at first, to be a singularly presented context.

I really like the above interpretation of vanity versus spirituality, the divine knife and the surgeon’s. And it is definitely an apt observation.

I know this passage and have considered it before, but arrived at something different. Again, not to say that one understanding must compete with another - the two can exist side by side in the same space. I believe the Bible in many areas and respects is multi-layered - even multi-dimensional in how it is written and constructed.


Hebrews 12
For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

What I have perceived with this statement is that the word of God is not in manner a word at all - not a spoken article, but a thought. Any religious or spiritual person that knows God, loves God, has ever 'communed' with God, has not actually audibly heard God 'speak' with human voice in human language. Everything they know and have learned has entered directly into their heart and mind in the shape of a thought, an emotion, a realisation: this is to say mentally - telepathically. Because this is the medium of communication that needs no body, needs no spoken tongue. It is mental, and instantaneous, it is a giver to, and discerner of 'thoughts and intents of the heart'.

Have you ever been in a situation where you have a very clear notion in your mind – a thought, a concept, an emotion, an experience in every detail, which you can construct instantly in your mind but cannot for the life of you adequately put into words/language?

This medium is the language of God, and of all spiritual beings that have no physical body, no tongue or voice-box or joints and marrow. It is pure thought, and thus knows no error/mistranslation in the communication.

This concept is further highlighted in the next verse.


Hebrews 13
Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do.

It shows again how physicality is no obstacle to the spiritual. God can literally cut - with that divine knife - through whatever physical barricade we may put up. He can see through whatever screen we might raise to hide behind. He can perceive to the very heart and mind that might close down to protect whatever secret we hold. In a nutshell, we are naked and open to the Lord. And this should serve as a warning to the negative ones in our civilization. There is no where they can run and hide, and nothing they can do, to evade detection, or avoid spiritual justice.


Star Mariner,


As always, your kind words mean a great deal to me. However, any accolades should always be aptly directed back to Him, for it's through His anointing that makes any of these 'insights' possible to begin with. It's surely not because of any innate ability of mine,....I can assure you of that!


Because it might be said that there are multiple 'possible' connotations in any given passage. And I don't mean conflicting ones in this instance, but several multi-layered nuggets of information/wisdom embedded in what appears, at first, to be a singularly presented context.

As your statement insinuates, here, there are, indeed, many passages of Scripture that are 'close-ended' by Divine design, such as the 'Ten Commandments', ( Exodus 20: 1-17), the 'universal nature, and consequences, of sin', ( Romans 3:23 and Romans 6:23), and then God's Divine Antidote for Mankind's sinful nature, which is found in Acts 2:38, and displayed in 'my signature'.

Outside of these 'few' examples, there are several 'open-ended' passages that certainly can be 'expanded upon' and functionally applied to the many different facets of our lives, as you have alluded to, here. This simply is possible due to the fact that His Word is, quite literally, a 'Living Breathing Document'. It's 'alive',...in every sense of the word, for no other manuscript, ( known to mankind), carries the weight, and validity, that It does, nor will it ever.


I, equally, applaud your perception of Hebrews 4:12, and verse 13, and find your views on this to simply be a 'continuation' of what I perceive, likewise.



It shows again how physicality is no obstacle to the spiritual. God can literally cut - with that divine knife - through whatever physical barricade we may put up. He can see through whatever screen we might raise to hide behind. He can perceive to the very heart and mind that might close down to protect whatever secret we hold. In a nutshell, we are naked and open to the Lord. And this should serve as a warning to the negative ones in our civilization. There is no where they can run and hide, and nothing they can do, to evade detection, or avoid spiritual justice.

You'll notice that I have taken the liberty to 'highlight' some very 'key' statements from your quote, here,....for the 'magnitude' behind what you are saying is even greater than both you, and I, can even imagine, my friend.


When God sent Samuel, the prophet, to select and anoint the next king of Israel, ( successor to Saul), we find this 'Divine principle coming into play' that I am referring to,...and to which you have alluded to in your quote. You see, God NEVER looks on the 'external' qualities, or abilities, of mankind,....but always goes 'much deeper' than that,.....all the way to the very 'heart'.



1 Samuel 16:4-7 (KJV)

4 And Samuel did that which the Lord spake, and came to Bethlehem. And the elders of the town trembled at his coming, and said, Comest thou peaceably?

5 And he said, Peaceably: I am come to sacrifice unto the Lord: sanctify yourselves, and come with me to the sacrifice. And he sanctified Jesse and his sons, and called them to the sacrifice.

6 And it came to pass, when they were come, that he looked on Eliab, and said, Surely the Lord's anointed is before him.

7 But the Lord said unto Samuel, Look not on his countenance, or on the height of his stature; because I have refused him: for the Lord seeth not as man seeth; for man looketh on the outward appearance, but the Lord looketh on the heart.




You see, my dear friend, it's with this very simple concept of the 'heart of mankind' that literally dictates , ( or ultimately decides), whether any man, or woman, progresses to the point of actually receiving God's fullness within their own respective lives, or not. My point being that as God 'still' looks upon our individual hearts,....it's He, alone, who can easily observe whose heart is 'tender,...and ready' to receive more of His glorious truth, to which He THEN, measures to us accordingly. As our 'heart' becomes more hungry, open, ( and trusting), to Him, the Divine dispersing of His Word,....His Love,....and His Understanding, becomes a 'steady' stream towards us.

Conversely, it saddens my heart very deeply to observe so many individuals who have their own 'hearts' on anything, ( and everything), other than God on a continual basis.

Make no mistake, brother,....the 'heart' will play the 'pivotal role' in deciding which direction the soul will ultimately take!

The 'wisdom' of Proverbs tell each of us,.....



Proverbs 4:23 (KJV)

23 Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life.



May God 'richly' bless,.....your brother, friend, and servant,........kreagle

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Very well said my friend, and very apt. I completely agree in every sense.


Conversely, it saddens my heart very deeply to observe so many individuals who have their own 'hearts' on anything, ( and everything), other than God on a continual basis.

I feel this too, very much so. It is a continuing source of frustration, and grief, to see so many around us wandering astray of where they could potentially be - where God, if he were heeded, would have them. As I have said before, that before we incarnate here, each and every single one of us has a plan. We are not motes floating in the air, or sand thrown into the winds of fate. There is a Plan for us. We have a destiny. It is ours to obtain and accomplish if only we look, listen, and heed the higher forces that are there from the beginning to guide us.

So yes mate, it is very sad indeed to see so many off kilter, so to speak, with their personal paths. They walk with blinkers on, and head down. They do not know who they are - or what they are.

In fact, to know this - I say that it's not actually necessary to be 'one' with God, or even close to God, on a ‘continual’ basis, as you put it. Just simply being AWARE of God would be enough for us, for now. Aware of him as a reality, and aware of him inside of us, and every living breathing thing. Just this alone would elevate Humankind to a much higher expression than he already is. This may sound bizarre to you. But in my opinion the world does not need 7 billion pious, in order for it to be a perfect, peaceful haven - that which it could ideally be. Just simple, spiritual awareness and an acknowledgement of God, in each of us, would achieve that.

[kreagle]

Very well said my friend, and very apt. I completely agree in every sense.


Conversely, it saddens my heart very deeply to observe so many individuals who have their own 'hearts' on anything, ( and everything), other than God on a continual basis.

I feel this too, very much so. It is a continuing source of frustration, and grief, to see so many around us wandering astray of where they could potentially be - where God, if he were heeded, would have them. As I have said before, that before we incarnate here, each and every single one of us has a plan. We are not motes floating in the air, or sand thrown into the winds of fate. There is a Plan for us. We have a destiny. It is ours to obtain and accomplish if only we look, listen, and heed the higher forces that are there from the beginning to guide us.

So yes mate, it is very sad indeed to see so many off kilter, so to speak, with their personal paths. They walk with blinkers on, and head down. They do not know who they are - or what they are.

In fact, to know this - I say that it's not actually necessary to be 'one' with God, or even close to God, on a ‘continual’ basis, as you put it. Just simply being AWARE of God would be enough for us, for now. Aware of him as a reality, and aware of him inside of us, and every living breathing thing. Just this alone would elevate Humankind to a much higher expression than he already is. This may sound bizarre to you. But in my opinion the world does not need 7 billion pious, in order for it to be a perfect, peaceful haven - that which it could ideally be. Just simple, spiritual awareness and an acknowledgement of God, in each of us, would achieve that.


Star Mariner,

It's certainly easy to tell by your response that your concerns are equally 'in-line' with mine, also. What a relief it is to, personally, see that there is still a 'few' of us with genuine concerns regarding this. However, while it might seem to be a 'great improvement' for mankind to suddenly become more 'aware' of God, as a reality, I'm afraid that 'awareness', alone, falls well short of His Divine Plan for our lives. As you stated, above,...."There is a Plan for us",....which routinely requires for the 'heart' to initiate the 'next step' in fulfilling that Divine Plan, and that's one of obedience to that which God has manifested to the believer.

Case in point,....the '12 disciples of John the Baptist', as illustrated by their account in the Scriptures.



Acts 19:1-7 (KJV)

19 And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples,

2 He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.

3 And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism.

4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.

5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

7 And all the men were about twelve.



You see, Star Mariner,....no one can argue the fact that these 12 disciples of John the Baptist were 'fully aware' of the existence of God, evidenced by their status as both 'disciples and also as believers', ( verses 1 and 2). However, at this precise moment in Scripture, their 'awareness' could only be measured in an 'external knowledge, only',....to which the Apostle Paul was soon to address.

Even today,....countless individuals have an 'external knowledge' of God, in that they are 'aware' of Him,.....however they fall, woefully, short of actually 'knowing Him' on an intimate basis. This level of relationship,....(The Divine Plan we've 'both' alluded to, here),.....comes 'only' by 'opening the heart, completely' to God where He then 'internally reveals' Himself in the 'New Birth' experience, the infilling of the Holy Ghost!


Notice the 'sequence' of events of the passage, in Acts 19:1-7, again. When Paul questioned the disciples/believers in regards to their current 'awareness level', their response clearly indicated that their 'awareness level' was lacking,.....( v. 2,.... And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.) You see, they 'currently' only knew of an 'external God',.....and at that 'particular time' they had no idea that an 'Internal God' was even available to them! Thank God for the 'messenger', ( the 'man of God', Paul), who would soon bring them all 'up-to-date' in their own 'awareness level' of a God whose Divine Plan was to 'dwell in them',....'walk in them',.....and 'internally prepare them' for their respective futures!


The Prophet, Ezekiel, prophetically spoke of what these '12 disciples' were about to experience for themselves,.....


Ezekiel 36:26-28 (KJV)

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

28 And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.



As we see, the Scriptural account of the '12 disciples/believers' ends on a very 'promising note' in that they were, now, fully 'adopted' into the family of God. This 'adoption' was only made possible by their willingness to 'open their heart,....completely' to God,.....to accept what was being presented before them, by Paul,....and to obey his, ( Paul's), directives of being 'baptized in Jesus' name', ( verse 5).


Romans 8:14-16 (KJV)

14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:



Yes,....I concur, completely, that 'AWARENESS' is a 'step in the right direction!'

But,....if 'mankind' will only 'listen to their heart',.....they will find that 'it' is literally screaming,....."DON'T STOP THERE!!!,.....KEEP ON WALKING!"


The 'heart' will lead you to a 'Divine Adoption',......IF......you 'listen' to 'it'!!!


Your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Oh yes mate, you're quite right. In fact I believe... yes I FIRMLY BELIEVE... that this knowledge, this knowingness, that you allude to here is the destination, the destiny of Mankind.

One day.

One day, all our souls will bear fruit, and as a united civilization we will walk this path together. But I was specifically referring to the current state of Mankind as a whole, where the spiritual scales of 'awareness', if you like, are tilted towards the largely 'ignorant' - that the greater majority are total novices. The truth as to why this has transpired is, I fear, because the Churches, for 2,000 years, have failed to properly administer the teachings that they were charged to communicate, and instil.

In response to the tale of Paul in Corinth… (Corinth I have visited btw, I have some great pictures, I could upload a few if you’re interested. Corinth is a wonderful site!) These disciples to whom Paul was speaking were already aware, as you say, they already had their foot in the door, so the next step was not far for them to go. Even before they met Paul, I’m sure they lived a far more spiritually minded life than those of whom I am speaking. For there are still so many, today, that do not see that open door before them, they are not even facing that door. So whilst it is a wonderful vision that the greater, further, journey of the heart is to one day sit in perfect harmony with God, it is just an ideal to hold on to for now, for there are a great many souls that are still so ignorant, so lost, that they need first a helping hand to find that door knob and thrust open the way to the Divine Light shining through, and thus their first awareness of it.

But we must guard against thinking of these poor lost masses as being ignorant in the sense that they are purposefully narrow-minded. It is not their fault. They are merely reluctant. It’s because they are victims (as we all are in one way or another) of an 'aspiritual' system. So many are oppressed or left in want, that trying to survive, pay the bills, and feed their children from one day to the next, becomes their chief occupation. For so many there is hardly the time available in today’s manic society to turn their thoughts to this mysterious 'external force' that may or may not even be there (in their minds). And for all that they have been taught, this is a force to fear, or at least revere, for they are unworthy of it. The religious institutions that are in place to instruct, teach, inspire, and spread love, are at best stale, antiquated, and steeped so much in ‘tradition’, that they have become more like 'businesses', commercial enterprises. At worst, thoroughly self-serving, and corrupt. Small wonder then that so many do not turn to God, for his representatives on earth cannot be trusted.

This is just another stratagem of those 'Powers that Be' again, which sponsor and license these institutions. And it is exactly how they want things to be; it is exactly why they even ‘allow’ religion in the first place. Because it serves the function they want. These authorities do not want an ethical, peaceful, and spiritually aware population to preside over, for how then would they sustain their agenda to oppress us, enslave us, keep us in fear; how then, if we all knew God, loved God, and loved each other, could they possibly justify their ridiculous wars?

On the macro-scale, religion, in various shapes and organizations, was set up to fail from the start. At some point along the path the ‘true way’ was knowingly infiltrated. It has been distorted by ego, and suppressed by materialism… One may place blame on the ruling elite, or capitalism, secular sciences; on governments, monarchies, and massive banking corporations, - these Powers that Be, or even Satan if that is your preferred interpretation.

So for the time being, I still think that the greater majority of us – which are still good, honest, hard-working people, need first an introduction to the reality of God and the spiritual forces in the world – in the universe. The bigger picture. But this will never happen, not for the ignorant masses of which I speak, unless every single political, social and religious institution is torn down, gutted out, and thoroughly reformed. At least in how they currently function. Sorry if that sounds a tad radical. I know such establishments are cherished by so many. But if they are not, the next 2,000 years will not be any different than the last 2,000. Oppression. Fear. Violence. War. Everything needs to change, or there will be no end to it.

…And I still believe this will happen. I have not lost faith. One day. One day we will literally have ‘Heaven on earth’. Think on that my friend with great hope!

[kreagle]

One day, all our souls will bear fruit, and as a united civilization we will walk this path together. But I was specifically referring to the current state of Mankind as a whole, where the spiritual scales of 'awareness', if you like, are tilted towards the largely 'ignorant' - that the greater majority are total novices. The truth as to why this has transpired is, I fear, because the Churches, for 2,000 years, have failed to properly administer the teachings that they were charged to communicate, and instil.


But we must guard against thinking of these poor lost masses as being ignorant in the sense that they are purposefully narrow-minded. It is not their fault. They are merely reluctant. It’s because they are victims (as we all are in one way or another) of an 'aspiritual' system. So many are oppressed or left in want, that trying to survive, pay the bills, and feed their children from one day to the next, becomes their chief occupation. For so many there is hardly the time available in today’s manic society to turn their thoughts to this mysterious 'external force' that may or may not even be there (in their minds). And for all that they have been taught, this is a force to fear, or at least revere, for they are unworthy of it. The religious institutions that are in place to instruct, teach, inspire, and spread love, are at best stale, antiquated, and steeped so much in ‘tradition’, that they have become more like 'businesses', commercial enterprises. At worst, thoroughly self-serving, and corrupt. Small wonder then that so many do not turn to God, for his representatives on earth cannot be trusted.

This is just another stratagem of those 'Powers that Be' again, which sponsor and license these institutions. And it is exactly how they want things to be; it is exactly why they even ‘allow’ religion in the first place. Because it serves the function they want. These authorities do not want an ethical, peaceful, and spiritually aware population to preside over, for how then would they sustain their agenda to oppress us, enslave us, keep us in fear; how then, if we all knew God, loved God, and loved each other, could they possibly justify their ridiculous wars?

On the macro-scale, religion, in various shapes and organizations, was set up to fail from the start. At some point along the path the ‘true way’ was knowingly infiltrated. It has been distorted by ego, and suppressed by materialism… One may place blame on the ruling elite, or capitalism, secular sciences; on governments, monarchies, and massive banking corporations, - these Powers that Be, or even Satan if that is your preferred interpretation.

So for the time being, I still think that the greater majority of us – which are still good, honest, hard-working people, need first an introduction to the reality of God and the spiritual forces in the world – in the universe. The bigger picture. But this will never happen, not for the ignorant masses of which I speak, unless every single political, social and religious institution is torn down, gutted out, and thoroughly reformed. At least in how they currently function. Sorry if that sounds a tad radical. I know such establishments are cherished by so many. But if they are not, the next 2,000 years will not be any different than the last 2,000. Oppression. Fear. Violence. War. Everything needs to change, or there will be no end to it.

…And I still believe this will happen. I have not lost faith. One day. One day we will literally have ‘Heaven on earth’. Think on that my friend with great hope!


Star Mariner,

Brother, I certainly 'feel your pain', my dear friend. You'll notice that I have copied the portion of your post, and highlighted some of the areas where you pinpoint, ( and express), the 'source' of these spiritual problems as they relate to the masses, and as you have indicated.



The truth as to why this has transpired is, I fear, because the Churches, for 2,000 years, have failed to properly administer the teachings that they were charged to communicate, and instil.


Further down, in your post, you continue with this 'specific charge', as indicated by your words,......



On the macro-scale, religion, in various shapes and organizations, was set up to fail from the start. At some point along the path the ‘true way’ was knowingly infiltrated.


Brother,....this may 'completely surprise' you,.....but I absolutely agree with you, 100%!

Now,....'after' I have given you some ample time to recover from the shock of my statement, here,.... let me explain what has 'actually' transpired over the course of history in order for these 'chain of religious events' to occur as they have.


To begin with, it should be fully understood that there is absolutely 'nothing' wrong with God's Church, today, for It has remained fully intact and 'doctrinally' sound ( as It was 'originally' established on the Day of Pentecost, and 'first' mentioned in Acts 2:47) As the Lord anointed Peter to be the 'keynote' speaker on the Day of Pentecost, ( where he delivered the inaugural Gospel Message of Acts 2:38), He specifically made it a point to pronounce 'Divine' protection upon His Church, as indicated by this passage,.....



Matthew 16:18 (KJV)

18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.



Even though we find that His Church has been, ( and 'still' is), 'Divinely protected', that never negated what Satan set out to do from the 'onset',....and that was to 'infiltrate', ( as you accurately point out), His Church. How did Satan do this?,.....by establishing the church of Rome, ( ie. the Roman Catholic Church).

Satan fully knew that it would be 'impossible' to defeat God's Church, ( see Matthew 16:18, once again),.....so he adopted the philosophy,...."if you can't beat 'them',....then join 'them'. There he would deceitfully, ( and 'gradually'), infiltrate It's ranks with 'false doctrines', and methodically erode away any 'original truths' as orginally established by the Apostles to begin with.

Repentance 'towards God' became substituted with 'confessional booths' to a priest,.......water baptism by emersion in the 'name' of Jesus' Christ became completely altered to accomodate a triune formula by 'sprinkling' the candidate and then altogether eliminating the 'saving' name of Jesus, and replacing it with His 'titles' of.....Father....Son.....and....Holy Ghost, a complete violation of the Scriptures, themselves. ( see Acts 4:12)



Acts 4:12 (KJV)

12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.


So you see, Star Mariner, any 'failed administrations of His Teachings' certainly can be laid at the feet of Catholicism, and her 'sister organizations' that have aligned themselves with her teachings over the years.


In light of this, you should equally know that God's 'original' Church, as established in Acts Chapter 2, is 'still' vibrantly alive, and still hasn't altered the Apostle's doctrine, ( see Acts 2:42), but continues steadfastly in it.

The 'gates of Hell' still haven't prevailed over His Church, my dear friend! Numerically speaking, It doesn't measure up to the 'multitudes' of Catholicism,...but It has, indeed,....stood the 'test of time',...for His sake, and His Glory!

And yes,.....One Day, very soon,....we will, indeed, have 'Heaven on earth', once again!



Revelation 21:1-7 (KJV)

21 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.

7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.




What a 'glorious' Day that will be!


Your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

A 'great' thread by TruthSeekah,...concerning 'Is Meditation Demonic?',.....is worthy of your 'viewing'. I've supplied the link for your convenience.


http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?60725-Is-Meditation-Demonic&p=696312&viewfull=1#post696312



Later,.....your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[kreagle]

What does this comment, ( by the Apostle Paul in his first Epistle to the Church in Corinth), mean to you? Many feet on the ground, and 'in the race',.....but only 'one' receiving the prize?



1 Corinthians 9:24 (KJV)

24 Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain.




As always,.....your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[kreagle]

Christianity Leaving It's Mark


Various documentations, and artifacts, have been presented in the past concerning the location, ( and existence), of Noah's Ark,....the Ark of the Covenant, etc. Each of these documentations,.... ( when unearthed),.....reveals where Christianity, indeed, 'left It's Mark', and that these events were 'factual' instead of simply being 'symbollic'. Such is the case of King David's Palace according to this recent article.



3,000-year-old palace in Israel linked to biblical King David

Alan Boyle, Science Editor, NBC News Facebook

http://msnbcmedia4.msn.com/j/streams/2013/July/130719/6C8322403-130719-science-ruins-415p.blocks_desktop_large.jpg
Skyview / Hebrew Univ. / IAA
This aerial picture shows what the excavators say are King David’s palace and a Byzantine-era farmhouse.

Israeli archaeologists say they have found the remains of a palace that they believe was a seat of power for the biblical King David — but other experts say that claim shouldn't be taken as the gospel truth.

The discovery, announced on Thursday by the Israeli Antiquities Authority, revives a debate over one of the Bible's central stories as well as the origins of the ancient Jewish state. The debate focuses on an archaeological site known as Khirbet Qeiyafa, about 20 miles (30 kilometers) southwest of Jerusalem. Khirbet Qeiyafa has been associated with the ancient city of Sha'arayim, which is mentioned several times in Jewish scriptures as Judean territory.

For seven years, archaeologists from the Hebrew University of Jerusalem and the antiquities authority, or IAA, have been excavating the site — and finding ample evidence of a fortified city dating back to around 1000 B.C. That's the era when the House of David is thought to have ruled over the Israelite tribes.

On Thursday, the Hebrew University's Yosef Garfinkel and the IAA's Sa'ar Ganor announced the completion of the excavation. They said they uncovered evidence of a 10,000-square-foot (1,000-square-meter) palace in the center of Khirbet Qeiyafa, with a 100-foot-long (30-meter) protective wall. A pillared building to the north was apparently used as an administrative storeroom.

'Unequivocal evidence'
The two buildings serve as "unequivocal evidence of a kingdom's existence," Garfinkel and Ganor said in an IAA statement.

http://msnbcmedia4.msn.com/j/streams/2013/July/130720/6C8321751-130719-science-jars-415p.blocks_desktop_medium.jpg
Clara Amit / IAA
Various vessels were found at the Khirbet Qeiyafa site.


"Around the palace's perimeter were rooms in which various installations were found — evidence of a metal industry, special pottery vessels and fragments of alabaster vessels that were imported from Egypt," they said.

The Israeli newspaper Haaretz quoted Garfinkel as saying "there is no question that the ruler of the city sat here, and when King David came to visit the hills he slept here."

The storeroom could have been used for taxes collected from the surrounding residents in the form of agriculture produce. "Hundreds of large store jars were found at the site whose handles were stamped with an official seal, as was customary in the Kingdom of Judah for centuries," the archaeologists said.


They said that the fortified city was probably destroyed in a battle with the Philistines around 980 B.C., and that the ruins of the palace were covered over during the construction of a fortified farmhouse during the Byzantine period, about 1,400 years later.

Claims disputed
The view that Khirbet Qeiyafa was a power center for the Kingdom of Judah and the House of David has long been disputed by other archaeologists. On one level, some archaeologists argue that Khirbet Qeiyafa could have been a Canaanite settlement, or an outpost for the ancient northern Kingdom of Israel rather than the southern Kingdom of Judah.

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It's mostly true, with some fiction. 27%
It's mostly fictional. 23%
Total Votes: 19,283


On a deeper level, the skeptics say there's no firm evidence that the historical David was as powerful as the Bible makes him out to be. They suggest that the inspiration for the biblical figure might have been a miscellaneous tribal leader, or perhaps even a folkloric figure on a par with, say, Robin Hood.

The latest claim about King David's palace came in for harsh criticism from David Willner, co-director of Foundation Stone, who said Garfinkel was indulging in "unabashed sensationalism." On the Bible History Daily blog, Noah Wiener said the dramatic link to David was "sure to elicit a great deal of debate."

"Khirbet Qeiyafa is an undoubtedly important site, and we look forward to an imminent archaeological discussion on the newly uncovered palatial structure," Wiener wrote.

More about biblical archaeology:

•Inscription dates back to King David — but what's it say?

•Artifacts hint at history behind David and Goliath
•Gallery: Eight Jewish archaeological discoveries

•Israelis find 2,750-year-old temple


Link: http://www.nbcnews.com/science/3-000-year-old-palace-israel-linked-biblical-king-david-6C10687021




Of course, interwoven within this article are the views of 'skeptics', which are always plentiful, and eager to discount any real 'evidence' that might have been, ( or will be), presented. You can 'count on this!'


Here's something else 'you can count on!'



1 Timothy 6:14-16 (KJV)

14 That thou keep this commandment without spot, unrebukable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:

15 Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords;

16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.




His Grace,.....and His Mercy,... still abounds, my dear brothers and sisters. I would not advise anyone to 'wait around for tangible proof' to surface before making your decision to believe in Him, or His Word.


'Tangible proof' only clouds the REAL issue at hand,...as it endeavors to dilute the 'Divine conduit to God',.....and that's FAITH!



Hebrews 11:1-3 (KJV)

11 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

2 For by it the elders obtained a good report.

3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.




To 'wait around for tangible proof to surface' totally breaks down this 'Divine conduit to God',....called FAITH,.....making it impossible to truly reach Him through His Divine design.



Hebrews 11:6(KJV)

6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.




To those who continue to 'dig in the earth and unearth God', ( or His validity),.....I've got news for you!


His 'origins' is not, ( nor has it ever been),....earthly!,......It's Heavenly, my dear friends!


You're looking in the 'wrong direction',....my dear friends,...if you're 'digging in the earth!'


FAITH,....properly implemented,.....will get you 'back on track'!


Your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[Bill Ryan]

--------

Here's a fabulous hour-and-a-half long BBC documentary on the lost 'Gnostic' gospels. I've watched it twice now, and have learned a very great deal. Highly recommended.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3fywVlTB98

(YouTube descriptive text -- edited and expanded by myself)




This is a BBC documentary presented by Anglican priest Pete Owen Jones that explores the large number of ancient Christian texts, all documenting the life of Jesus, that didn't make it into the New Testament. Shocking and challenging to many with orthodox views, many of these texts portray a Jesus really very different from that found in the traditional books of the New Testament.

Pete Owen Jones travels through Egypt and the former Roman Empire looking at the emerging evidence of an early Christian world very different to the one we have been taught about, and discovers that aside from the gospels of Mark, Matthew, Luke and John, there were over seventy gospels, acts, letters and apocalypses, all circulating in the early Church. Many of these became formally dismissed and pronounced as heretical -- primarily because the picture of Jesus that was painted was inconvenient to the controlling Roman Church.

Through these 'Lost Gospels', Pete Owen Jones reconstructs the intense intellectual and political struggles for orthodoxy that were fought in the early centuries of Christianity, a battle involving different Christian sects, each convinced that their gospels were true and sacred. The truth of those early times may be very different than that which we have been taught to believe.

[Agape]

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll256/PaldenLhamo/5416789926_ac263426f9_z_zps68fb8b56.jpg (http://s290.photobucket.com/user/PaldenLhamo/media/5416789926_ac263426f9_z_zps68fb8b56.jpg.html)

...and this is the Sphere they have in Vatican ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sphere_Within_Sphere

Sphere within Sphere

WEhS9Y9HYjU



:pray:

[kreagle]

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll256/PaldenLhamo/5416789926_ac263426f9_z_zps68fb8b56.jpg (http://s290.photobucket.com/user/PaldenLhamo/media/5416789926_ac263426f9_z_zps68fb8b56.jpg.html)

...and this is the Sphere they have in Vatican ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sphere_Within_Sphere


Sphere within Sphere

WEhS9Y9HYjU



:pray:



Hey Agape,.....and Bill!


I'm afraid their, ( Vatican's), overall agenda is far more sinister than most people realize. In the midst of their 'religious' tinkerings, God has still managed to keep His Church alive, just like He said He would. He let it be known that the 'gates of hell shall not prevail against it', ( Matthew 16:18),.....and it certainly hasn't,......regardless to the many satanic attempts that we've all seen in the past, ( and present, too.)


Thanks Bill, for the link to the video. I just watched it and equally found it to be beneficial.


As always,....your friend, brother, and servant,......kreagle

[Positive Vibe Merchant]

Hello All, I just wanted to ask a question.

it has probably been answered previously and I would like to be pointed to the answer if that is so. Why is god referred to as He? Surely an omnipotent creator of all living things would possess no sex and be purely energetic?

[Maunagarjana]

--------

Here's a fabulous hour-and-a-half long BBC documentary on the lost 'Gnostic' gospels. I've watched it twice now, and have learned a very great deal. Highly recommended.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3fywVlTB98

(YouTube descriptive text -- edited and expanded by myself)




This is a BBC documentary presented by Anglican priest Pete Owen Jones that explores the large number of ancient Christian texts, all documenting the life of Jesus, that didn't make it into the New Testament. Shocking and challenging to many with orthodox views, many of these texts portray a Jesus really very different from that found in the traditional books of the New Testament.

Pete Owen Jones travels through Egypt and the former Roman Empire looking at the emerging evidence of an early Christian world very different to the one we have been taught about, and discovers that aside from the gospels of Mark, Matthew, Luke and John, there were over seventy gospels, acts, letters and apocalypses, all circulating in the early Church. Many of these became formally dismissed and pronounced as heretical -- primarily because the picture of Jesus that was painted was inconvenient to the controlling Roman Church.

Through these 'Lost Gospels', Pete Owen Jones reconstructs the intense intellectual and political struggles for orthodoxy that were fought in the early centuries of Christianity, a battle involving different Christian sects, each convinced that their gospels were true and sacred. The truth of those early times may be very different than that which we have been taught to believe.


Good video. Most of it is review for me, as I've been fascinated by these texts ever since I found out about them. I spent a long time on a gnostic usenet group, and I spent some time also on a mailing list called "Jesus Mysteries" where some very intelligent people hung out, even some professional scholars and writers. At the time, I was pretty sure there was no historical Jesus and that the whole thing was metaphorical, but now I'm not so sure.

Also, the guy in the video seems to have been inspired by Bill Ryan for his style of dress. :)

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Hello All, I just wanted to ask a question.

it has probably been answered previously and I would like to be pointed to the answer if that is so. Why is god referred to as He? Surely an omnipotent creator of all living things would possess no sex and be purely energetic?

If God could even be anthropomorphously envisaged it would be a She, if anything, as the divine feminine energy is more in line with unconditional love as well as creation (fertility). The reason God has been depicted as male is quite simply because men, and male energy, has dominated the ages, particularly in the hierarchy of religious institutions (as it still does today). The idea of a female god eventually became heretical. There were once many instances of God being perceived more as a goddess in other, smaller cultures, that were later suppressed or cast aside by the mainstream religions that replaced them.

The truth is, God is neither a male or a female energy. It is a perfect assembly of both.

[Joe Akulis]

One thing to consider. When it is said that we are created in the image and likeness of God, what was this phrase referring to? If you think it is our mortal human bodies that are created in the image and likeness of God, then I think maybe you are limiting yourself. Doesn't it make more sense that the thing that was made in the image and likeness of God was our immortal spirit? The part of us that we truly are, which continues on after these frail vessels give out on us. That aspect of each of us is androgynous, and therein is where your answer lies.

You are a fractal of that Divine Creator.

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

One thing to consider. When it is said that we are created in the image and likeness of God, what was this phrase referring to? If you think it is our mortal human bodies that are created in the image and likeness of God, then I think maybe you are limiting yourself. Doesn't it make more sense that the thing that was made in the image and likeness of God was our immortal spirit? The part of us that we truly are, which continues on after these frail vessels give out on us. That aspect of each of us is androgynous, and therein is where your answer lies.

You are a fractal of that Divine Creator.

It depends on your belief system really. I have one, someone else here, my dear friend kreagle for example, will have another, in accordance with the knowledge-base and teachings that one follows.

You’re correct mate, (in my opinion) that we are a fractured part of the creator, each and every one of us. Therefore we are all the same, individualized elements of the One-God. But I do believe that the 'created in our own image' thing, does relate to the physical, biological unit that we, as divine spirits, incarnate into.

I talk about it in older posts on earlier pages, that ancient Jewish creation myths refer (and in my opinion) merely to an 'experiment' if you will, which sought to introduce what we now know as Homo Sapiens, the Human Being as an incarnation vehicle, here on Earth, for young and developing souls. This new, advanced being was derived genetically of their own being, these creators. And yes, I speak of extra-terrestrials.

[Joe Akulis]

I agree. There does seem to be a preference for this form that walks on two legs and has two arms and a head. But I wonder if it would be a cool survey to do a universal census and see just how many different "forms" there are out there and how they stack up to the humanoid form. Like, is there a small percentage of dolphinlike forms scattered throughout the universe that we use for the occasional vacation? :-) Or are there just as many dolphinlike forms as there are humanoid forms? Inquiring minds would like to know. But probably not here. I don't want to make waves on this thread. I lean toward the spirit as being the image and likeness. But it's just a theory.

Love,
Seeker

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Thanks for the input there. Yes indeed it would interesting to investigate what these other forms would be, but I agree that we must stay on track here with regards to this thread's theme, being the Bible and Christianity.

[kreagle]

Hello All, I just wanted to ask a question.

it has probably been answered previously and I would like to be pointed to the answer if that is so. Why is god referred to as He? Surely an omnipotent creator of all living things would possess no sex and be purely energetic?


Positive Vibe Merchant,


Welcome to the thread, here, brother,.....and thanks for your input!


Off the top of my head,....the closest we have previously discussed this was back at Christmas time, last year, where Rocky_Shorz basically brought up a form of this same question. I've supplied a link to his post, #396, for your convenience. Immediately following his post, ulli brings up a Bahai Revelation version of this also, if you would like to scroll down and read it.


http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?48678-Bible-Topics-and-Questions&p=605962&viewfull=1#post605962


I will also supply my response to him, likewise.




The Holy Ghost is a she, not a him...

I do believe in Luther's teachings, but even he left out that important little bit...

why are all religions afraid of man knowing?

is there one passage, where Jesus actually states the Holy Ghost/Spirit is a man, or is it word of mouth teaching?

many Christian Preachers teach God is Jesus, when even Jesus himself looked up to God...

no disrespect to anyone, sharing clarity to those who want to know...


Rocky_Shorz,



The Holy Ghost is a she, not a him...

.......is there one passage, where Jesus actually states the Holy Ghost/Spirit is a man, or is it word of mouth teaching?



The Holy Ghost is the 'Father' of the child, Jesus. A 'she' did not overshadow Mary, ( another 'she'), and impregnate her. I certainly agree that this event is considered to be the 'immaculate conception', and totally 'magical' in essence,.....but NOT 'that' magical, brother!


Matthew 1:18 (KJV)

18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.


Holy Ghost,.....'his' voice,.....NOT 'her' voice!


Hebrews 3:7-11 (KJV)

7 Wherefore (as the Holy Ghost saith, To day if ye will hear his voice,

8 Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:

9 When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.

10 Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways.

11 So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)



Here is your passage of Jesus specifically identifying 'the Spirit of truth' as a He,.....( 10 times!)

John 16:13-16 (KJV)

13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

16 A little while, and ye shall not see me: and again, a little while, and ye shall see me, because I go to the Father.



Also, from the 'mouth of Jesus', Himself,......

John 14:26 (KJV)

26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.




many Christian Preachers teach God is Jesus, when even Jesus himself looked up to God...



More accurately,.....God is God,......God is 'One',......and Jesus is His Name!

Our Catholic 'friends' have endeavored to divide His Godhead, by three, and established this dogma, ( three separate 'persons', or 'Deities'), at the Council of Nicaea 325 A.D.

Of course, one can 'choose to believe' whatever they wish to believe,....in this regards. Personally,.....I 'choose' to take a closer look at what the Scriptures actually say, and what they have always taught mankind.

There may be 'three offices,...or roles',....that God has operated in, ( and still does),....but that at no time has this meant that He was ever more than 'One' in property.


1 John 5:7 (KJV)

7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.



This 'Biblical point' was specifically 'drilled into the hearts and minds of His people, Israel',.....and absolutely no mention, ( much less 'teachings'), of a divided Godhead, ( ie. 'trinity') were ever entertained by Israel,....much less allowed.


'Godhead 101',....to Israel was 'always' defined as follows,......

Deuteronomy 6:4 (KJV)

4 Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord:


He hasn't changed today, either,......for He still remains 'One'. He is still the 'only God we need',....and His New Testament name is Jesus!

Rocky,....in light of your statements,.....we are going to have to 'agree to disagree', brother!

Peace and Love,.......kreagle



When God made man 'in His own image',....we certainly can see that He created Adam, ( a male), first, followed up by extracting a rib from Adam and creating woman, Eve.

In this simple creative process, God literally became, not only the Creator, but also the Father of mankind,....hence we understand His role, as such.


Once again,.....great to have you on board! Please continue to contribute your thoughts and become a 'regular' here!


On a side note,.......great to see you, again, seeker1972!


God bless to all!,.....your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[Positive Vibe Merchant]

I love your enthusiasm and passion on this topic Kreagle. Thanks for the reply.

I just find at times that the view of some religious folk can become quite like tunnel vision, and by their beliefs, not allowing themselves to be open to other perspectives.

It is unfortunate, but sometimes I have witnessed such unwavering faith in their belief which has garnered positive results to their prayer.I have always been of the view that I can't allow myself to not at least hear other perspectives and make my mind up about them, with my own thought process of logic and heart.

[kreagle]

Hello All, I just wanted to ask a question.

it has probably been answered previously and I would like to be pointed to the answer if that is so. Why is god referred to as He? Surely an omnipotent creator of all living things would possess no sex and be purely energetic?

If God could even be anthropomorphously envisaged it would be a She, if anything, as the divine feminine energy is more in line with unconditional love as well as creation (fertility). The reason God has been depicted as male is quite simply because men, and male energy, has dominated the ages, particularly in the hierarchy of religious institutions (as it still does today). The idea of a female god eventually became heretical. There were once many instances of God being perceived more as a goddess in other, smaller cultures, that were later suppressed or cast aside by the mainstream religions that replaced them.

The truth is, God is neither a male or a female energy. It is a perfect assembly of both.


Hey Star Mariner,.....my dear friend and brother!

Believe it, or not, I can actually 'see' how this 'thought process' of God being recognized as feminine by many people. Our society,.....( especially here in America),....has been basically brought up where the 'male figure', ( Father), was always considered to be 'work orientated' and unemotional in his feelings towards others. More often, than not, if a child was looking for a 'nurturing type of love filled with emotion' he/she would turn to the 'female figure', ( Mother), in order to receive this vitally needed component in their lives. With this in mind, I can also readily recognize where this type of 'system' of raising a family is just another 'prime example' where Satan has successfully infiltrated the family unit causing our 'priorities' to become out of order.


However, the 'work load' of our God has never, ( at no time), diminished the level of love and nurturing that He, ( alone), is able to send our way!



Hebrews 4:14-16(KJV)

14 Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession.

15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.



A closer look at verse 15, above, begins to reveal His anthropormorphic revelation to mankind in many ways. You see,....no one can complain to God by saying,...."You don't know how I feel,...or what I am going through!",......FOR HE DOES! He has certainly,....been there and done that,....Himself, also! He has fully felt 'all the emotions' that inflict every one of us. He fully knows what it is like to be 'robed in flesh'!



If God could even be anthropomorphously envisaged,........



1 Timothy 3:16 (KJV)

16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.



Everything about this passage is attributed to 'Jesus Christ, ( the man)',....and accurately illustrates what this anthropormorphic revelation produced. ( ie.,......God was manifest in the flesh,.....God was justified in the Spirit,.....God was seen of angels,.....God was preached unto the Gentiles,.....God was believed on in the world,......and finally.....God was received up into glory!)


"anthropomorphously envisaged,.....seen of angels"

Evidently, prior to God being condensed into human form, the 'only' vision of God that the angels saw was His 'Glorious Light'. With the 'entrance' of JESUS CHRIST, they were 'now' able to 'see' Him in a 'condensed' form, unlike never before!


Of course, the 'prime reason' for this anthropormorphic manifestation and entrance into 'this world' can be seen by exactly 'how' God dealt with His children, ( Israel), in the Old Testament. When they, Israel, were exposed to 'sin' they were specifically instructed, ( in His Word), to take an 'unblemished, spotless lamb' and to offer it up as a 'sacrifice' for their sin, so as to receive atonement from God.


So you see,....this anthropormorphic manifestation of 'God in the flesh' literally supplied the 'Lamb' needed, ( once and for 'all'), for mankind to receive complete atonement, and forgiveness of their sins at Calvary! The blood that was shed there, at Calvary, was 'spotless and unblemished' in every sense of the word,...coming forth from the 'Perfect Sacrifice',......God, Himself, manifested in flesh,.....the 'Lamb of God',.....JESUS CHRIST!


He set the 'Plan in motion' with His children, Israel,....and completely fulfilled it at Calvary!


Thanks be to an 'unchangeable God' who Divinely developed a Plan,....and stuck with this 'same Plan' all the way through!


Why change a 'Plan',.....when It is 'perfect in every way?'


With God's resounding Love!,.....your brother, friend, and servant,.....kreagle

[kreagle]

Thought I would 'eliminate' the usage of this post #666 for reasons that I feel are Biblical in nature.


Revelation 13:18 (KJV)

18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.


Love to 'all',......your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

^ :) at the 666 thing mate, that is superstitious of you hehe. I'm sorry for laughing but I lol'd.


In fact mate I see yet another 'version' of God, at least the 'anthropomorphously envisaged' (try saying that a few times after a few wines :)) version of Him, as in 'God in the flesh' being omnipresent in us! Was it not part of Christ's mission to teach us that 'hey, we all have God in us, He is part of us and is with us at all times, no matter where we go or what we do'? In this sense, we are God in the flesh, so when seeking God all we really have to do is look at ourselves, and into our own hearts.


Another thing mate, what did you think of the video Bill posted on the previous page?


--------

Here's a fabulous hour-and-a-half long BBC documentary on the lost 'Gnostic' gospels. I've watched it twice now, and have learned a very great deal. Highly recommended.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3fywVlTB98


The documentary brought up important issues in my opinion. It clarifies and mirrors many of my own feelings, particularly in regards to a desire by some parties at the birth of the Christian church to distance itself from ancient Jewish traditions - to stand alone based solely on the ministry of Jesus. Marcion, Ah, a man after my own heart! He was interested more in truth and a new beginning, rather than Control, and clinging to the old world. The old (testament) world was what Jesus came to transform and replace...

[kreagle]

I love your enthusiasm and passion on this topic Kreagle. Thanks for the reply.

I just find at times that the view of some religious folk can become quite like tunnel vision, and by their beliefs, not allowing themselves to be open to other perspectives.

It is unfortunate, but sometimes I have witnessed such unwavering faith in their belief which has garnered positive results to their prayer.I have always been of the view that I can't allow myself to not at least hear other perspectives and make my mind up about them, with my own thought process of logic and heart.


Positive Vibe Merchant,

I fully agree with your view of at least hearing 'other' perspectives and equally find myself sifting through quite a plethora of religious material from a wide range of viewpoints. My only advice to you,.....as equally to everyone else,.....is to have in place a 'Divine Template' to check these perspectives out with. Of course, that 'template' that I'm referring to, here, is the Word of God,.....the Bible.


If a person fails to 'properly' use this 'Divine Template' against such perspectives,....choosing rather to go with their own 'gut' instincts, ( or what they feel 'sounds right' to them), they are treading on very dangerous grounds, with potentially very serious consequences.



Proverbs 14:12 (KJV)

12 There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.




The wisdom imparted by this passage of Scripture fully indicates that we all need to rely upon something much more deeper than mankind's wisdom,.....especially when it comes to topics concerning the Bible.



2 Timothy 2:15(KJV)

15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.




Bear in mind, my dear friend, that 'when' a perspective is presented to you, ( or I), that is found to be in direct contradiction to God's Word, ( the Bible), it will be our responsibility to make the proper selection and ultimately opt for the truth of the matter at hand. These types of 'decisions' will sometimes place you in the category of having 'tunnel vision'.


This reminds me of a very wise saying,....."He who fails to stand for something will fall for anything!"

Moral: Use your 'Divine Template', my dear, dear, friend!


Your friend, brother, and servant,.......kreagle

[kreagle]

^ :) at the 666 thing mate, that is superstitious of you hehe. I'm sorry for laughing but I lol'd.



Yes, I knew I was going a little overboard, but did so in order to specifically point out, yet another, vitally important situation that many people will have to face, one day. I don't consider myself to be superstitious,...but certainly 'cautious' with things that carry Biblical consequences. I can understand the 'giggle', and somewhat 'laugh at myself', likewise,....but I can fully understand that this pending 'mark of the Beast, 666' situation will be 'anything but funny' when it becomes a reality in the future.



In fact mate I see yet another 'version' of God, at least the 'anthropomorphously envisaged' (try saying that a few times after a few wines ) version of Him, as in 'God in the flesh' being omnipresent in us! Was it not part of Christ's mission to teach us that 'hey, we all have God in us, He is part of us and is with us at all times, no matter where we go or what we do'? In this sense, we are God in the flesh, so when seeking God all we really have to do is look at ourselves, and into our own hearts.



It certainly was part of Christ's mission to make the indwelling Spirit of God 'available' to those who would 'believe on Him,...as the scripture hath said'.



John 7:37-39 (KJV)

37 In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.

38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.

39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)



This obedience to scripture would entail hearkening to the 'Gospel Message' that Peter preached on the Day of Pentecost, and outligned in 'my signature'. While it would be wonderful if 'God was in us all', to begin with as your statement seems to suggest,.....it still requires the 'New Birth experience' for this Spiritual phenomenon to occur. It did 'originally', back then,...and it still does 'today',.....nothing has changed in regards to the outpouring of the Holy Ghost, my friend!

As a 'New Born believer', we are 'part of the body of Christ,.... and He is the head'. Even though I fully understand what you are trying to say with your statement,.....
"In this sense, we are God in the flesh, so when seeking God all we really have to do is look at ourselves, and into our own hearts."

......I, personally, would refrain from 'looking at ourselves', in my quest for God and His guidance. Looking at ourselves, ( from a human standpoint), invariably leads to 'eliminating, or diminishing Him',....virtually all the time. Yes, the 'New Born believer' now has God 'in' them,.....but we are NOT 'God in the flesh', just yet, brother! For 'now',....we are simply the 'sons of God',.....as John points out for us in this Scripture. Later on,......we'll be 'like Him!'



1 John 3:2 (KJV)

2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.





Another thing mate, what did you think of the video Bill posted on the previous page?



In my reply to Agape, I gave 'salutations' to him, and Bill, also. There I thanked Bill for the video and expressed that I felt it could be beneficial to some. In my recent reply to Positive Vibe Merchant, I expressly advised him to use God's 'Divine Template', ( ie. the Bible), to decipher what was 'in harmony' with God's Word, and that which was not. This system has yet to fail me, nor will it ever in my estimation.

The information I received by viewing this video was very limited, to me. I don't mind saying that I am very skeptical with 'bits and pieces' of ancient manuscripts that have been badly damaged by erosion, or 'ants', as the commentator put it. There's way to many 'holes', ( pun literally intended), for me to accept some of the views they were trying to insinuate. The part where they felt like Thomas' text was referring to Jesus 'kissing him on the mouth' was especially an extreme 'reach' since there was a 'huge hole' missing where they 'felt' like the word 'mouth' would have appeared.

I'm sure that in 'some' of these ancient texts there are points that are worthy of consideration,....as long as they 'passed the Divine Template test' that I, personally, would use.



Your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle


I will comment on your last statement, here, later on, as I am short on time right now. You bring up a very valid point, that equally means a great deal to me, likewise.




The documentary brought up important issues in my opinion. It clarifies and mirrors many of my own feelings, particularly in regards to a desire by some parties at the birth of the Christian church to distance itself from ancient Jewish traditions - to stand alone based solely on the ministry of Jesus. Marcion, Ah, a man after my own heart! He was interested more in truth and a new beginning, rather than Control, and clinging to the old world. The old (testament) world was what Jesus came to transform and replace...


Later, brother!,......kreagle

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Thanks for your interesting reply as always mate. Many things to think on. The key matter I wanted to touch on was (to quote myself):


In fact mate I see yet another 'version' of God, at least the 'anthropomorphously envisaged' (try saying that a few times after a few wines ) version of Him, as in 'God in the flesh' being omnipresent in us! Was it not part of Christ's mission to teach us that 'hey, we all have God in us, He is part of us and is with us at all times, no matter where we go or what we do'? In this sense, we are God in the flesh, so when seeking God all we really have to do is look at ourselves, and into our own hearts.


......I, personally, would refrain from 'looking at ourselves', in my quest for God and His guidance. Looking at ourselves, ( from a human standpoint), invariably leads to 'eliminating, or diminishing Him',....virtually all the time. Yes, the 'New Born believer' now has God 'in' them,.....but we are NOT 'God in the flesh', just yet, brother!

This is where we take a slightly different stand. I believe that we are ALL God in the flesh. Or at the very least fragments/individualized manifestations of God, in a state of potential, if not fully realised, energy. In other words, we are ALL a part of God, even if some neglect this understanding, or simply refuse it, and it is our mission to understand this true nature of ours, and to find Him in the ignorance and chaos that is the Earth-reality.

That you, kreagle, have experienced a wonderful union with this God-energy in dwelling with the Holy Ghost, it means only that you have glimpsed a further reality of what you ALREADY ARE, and were. That 'potential' is there, is always there, for everyone, if we so choose to take it. Jesus said that 'he was the way' - only through him, and his example, was this 'salvation' and revelation available.

This perspective I have on the subject may provide a little further validation for my stance on the Old Testament and the ancient Jewish ways, in that this wasn't the way. Judaism may claim that 'it is the word of God', that 'it is the true path', but for me, Jesus in those days when he sought to usurp those ancient doctrines, was saying 'No, it is not. This is why I am here! Listen to me. and walk with me, for I am the way.'



I would write some more but I have to dash off. So catch up with you again soon mate!

A pleasure to chat, as always!

[Joe Akulis]

"This is where we take a slightly different stand. I believe that we are ALL God in the flesh. Or at the very least fragments/individualized manifestations of God, in a state of potential, if not fully realised, energy. In other words, we are ALL a part of God, even if some neglect this understanding, or simply refuse it, and it is our mission to understand this true nature of ours, and to find Him in the ignorance and chaos that is the Earth-reality."

You mean, like a fractal? :-)

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

In a sense I suppose so, looking at it mathematically:) But seeing as everything in the Universe is energy, and we as energy are in the Universe, that makes us connected to everything in the Universe. That is one type of 'oneness', in a physical sense. Another is intelligent energy, that which is separated from the Creator as individualized consciousness, defined by sentience, because it's aware of its own consciousness and separation. This constitutes what we call a 'soul'.

Each soul has migrated from the Creator out into the Creation to experience it, and achieve a perfect understanding of it, and of itself as a unique expression of the Creator (imagine the Creator experiencing itself in infinite ways and permutations). But we are all the same, because we all came from the same Creator, from God.

This is my perception anyway :)

[Joe Akulis]

Our perceptions are seeing virtually eye-to-eye then, S.M. Well put.

Kreagle, would you agree that we are all on individual journeys back to God?

[kreagle]

Our perceptions are seeing virtually eye-to-eye then, S.M. Well put.

Kreagle, would you agree that we are all on individual journeys back to God?


seeker1972,


My dear friend, Star Mariner, refers to it as......



Each soul has migrated from the Creator out into the Creation to experience it, and achieve a perfect understanding of it, and of itself as a unique expression of the Creator (imagine the Creator experiencing itself in infinite ways and permutations).



I'm actually in more agreement with your statement, here.......



Kreagle, would you agree that we are all on individual journeys back to God?


My stance, on this, deals with the events which occurred in the Garden of Eden where mankind, ( Adam and Eve), became the 'original Prodigal',......left the Father's home, ( Eden),......and ventured out into the world. The 'injection of sin' in their lives would no longer allow them to be able to abide in the Garden of Eden, so by their self-inflicted actions they left 'home',......hence the 'original Prodigal son'.


Whether humanity realizes it, or not,.....'we', ( through inheritance of our ancient ancestors,....Adam and Eve), have 'all' become the Prodigal Son, ourselves. Every last one of us have taken on the 'sinful nature' of our ancient ancestors,....for no one can claim to be 'sinless'. Therefore,....( to answer your question),.....as the Prodigals that we 'all' are, there should be no doubt that we should, equally,.....wise up,..... 'come to our senses',.....and make plans to go back 'home' to our Father, who anxiously awaits our return!

I've supplied the Biblical account of the Prodigal Son for you, here. You'll notice that Jesus began this account by 'defining' what the 'journey back to God' would entail. It was, quite simply, repentance! Repentance 'starts' the journey 'back to God', my dear friend. When one finally recognizes the 'madness' of going in the 'wrong direction',...( as the Prodigal Son finally did), he suddenly got a 'grip on himself', ( see verse 17), and was willing to do a 180 degree turn. This 'measure taken', by the Prodigal Son, is a perfect illustration of what 'repentance' is all about. ( ie. stop going in the wrong direction, ( away from our Father),......come to your senses,......make an altering decision,.....and finally,......make a 180 complete 'turn around' and go back 'home' to Father!)



Luke 15:10-32 (KJV)

10 Likewise, I say unto you, there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner that repenteth.

11 And he said, A certain man had two sons:

12 And the younger of them said to his father, Father, give me the portion of goods that falleth to me. And he divided unto them his living.

13 And not many days after the younger son gathered all together, and took his journey into a far country, and there wasted his substance with riotous living.

14 And when he had spent all, there arose a mighty famine in that land; and he began to be in want.

15 And he went and joined himself to a citizen of that country; and he sent him into his fields to feed swine.

16 And he would fain have filled his belly with the husks that the swine did eat: and no man gave unto him.

17 And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!

18 I will arise and go to my father, and will say unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before thee,

19 And am no more worthy to be called thy son: make me as one of thy hired servants.

20 And he arose, and came to his father. But when he was yet a great way off, his father saw him, and had compassion, and ran, and fell on his neck, and kissed him.

21 And the son said unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and in thy sight, and am no more worthy to be called thy son.

22 But the father said to his servants, Bring forth the best robe, and put it on him; and put a ring on his hand, and shoes on his feet:

23 And bring hither the fatted calf, and kill it; and let us eat, and be merry:

24 For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found. And they began to be merry.

25 Now his elder son was in the field: and as he came and drew nigh to the house, he heard musick and dancing.

26 And he called one of the servants, and asked what these things meant.

27 And he said unto him, Thy brother is come; and thy father hath killed the fatted calf, because he hath received him safe and sound.

28 And he was angry, and would not go in: therefore came his father out, and intreated him.

29 And he answering said to his father, Lo, these many years do I serve thee, neither transgressed I at any time thy commandment: and yet thou never gavest me a kid, that I might make merry with my friends:

30 But as soon as this thy son was come, which hath devoured thy living with harlots, thou hast killed for him the fatted calf.

31 And he said unto him, Son, thou art ever with me, and all that I have is thine.

32 It was meet that we should make merry, and be glad: for this thy brother was dead, and is alive again; and was lost, and is found.




Yes, seeker1972,... we are all on individual journeys back to God ,....the very moment that we 'replicate' the steps that the Prodigal Son took, himself. Those 'footsteps' he left ingrained on the 'trailway of life' will, equally, begin to show you, ( and I), how to get Home, my friend!


Your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

Star Mariner,


Posted by Star Mariner (here)

The documentary brought up important issues in my opinion. It clarifies and mirrors many of my own feelings, particularly in regards to a desire by some parties at the birth of the Christian church to distance itself from ancient Jewish traditions - to stand alone based solely on the ministry of Jesus. Marcion, Ah, a man after my own heart! He was interested more in truth and a new beginning, rather than Control, and clinging to the old world. The old (testament) world was what Jesus came to transform and replace...



Brother, you'll notice that I specifically highlighted two points of your quote, here, that I'd like to address.


#1-
a desire by some parties at the birth of the Christian church to distance itself from ancient Jewish traditions

The 'some parties' you are referring to, here, would have certainly been the Gentile faction that was 'now' being allowed to divinely incorporate themselves into the 'family of God', likewise. We see their entrance into this 'family', ( which had formerly been, exclusively, Jewish), in the account of Cornelius and his household equally receiving the Holy Ghost, and being baptized in Jesus' name in Acts chapter 10.

It seems that the 'Gentiles' had hardly gotten their 'toes in the door', ( so-to-speak), before some of the Jewish faction began to 'try to impose' their ancient Jewish traditions, ( ie. circumcision, dietary laws, etc.), upon the Gentiles, also. To 'this', Peter set the record straight, in Acts chapter 15. If you will read the 'entire' chapter, you will get a better grip on this. I will supply one verse, from Peter, which will summarize what I am referring to, here.


Acts 15:24 (KJV)

24 Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:



I think it would suffice to say Peter was literally telling these 'certain Jewish zealots' that they were entirely 'out of bounds' with their religious agendas. They were, ( not only), trying to 'hang on' to their past Jewish heritage, but to impose it on 'others', also,.....to which Peter candidly told them,...."we gave no such commandment!"

The Apostle Paul would go on to extensively teach on the New Testament version of being 'circumcised'. You see, it's not that circumcision was eliminated,.....it was just changed from being applied to the 'fleshly side of mankind',.....to the 'spiritual side of mankind!'



Romans 2:28-29(KJV)

28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:

29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.


Also,....


Colossians 2:10-12(KJV)

10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:

12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.




Once again,....in Paul's discourse to the Church in Colossi,.... we find him giving complete credence to Peter's opening message to the Church in Acts chapter 2, and fully illustrated in 'my signature', of Acts 2:38. Here, ( in verse 12 above), we find the.....DEATH......BURIAL.....and.....RESURRECTION, is 'once again' clearly seen, and vitally important to the Gospel Message His Apostles endeavored to deliver to us! Obedience to Peter's message in Acts 2:38 enables us to be 'circumcised with the circumcision made without hands'. It's the 'only' Biblical passage we have which enables us to be 'born again, of the water and the Spirit', if we will only hearken, once again, to the 'messenger with the keys',....the Apostle Peter!


#2-
rather than Control, and clinging to the old world. The old (testament) world was what Jesus came to transform and replace...

Brother, your words 'transform and replace' are indicitive that there was something 'wrong' with the Old Testament, to which I fully disagree with, my dear friend. Of course, I fully remember many of your 'views' that you have posted on the Old Testament, so I can understand where this 'line of thinking' is coming from, even though I understand it is conflictive. What you see as 'conflicts' between the Old Testament and the New Testament, I see as a 'perfect fulfilment', and I fully believe that is exactly what Jesus was endeavoring to relate on this topic in the following passage of Scripture.



Matthew 5:16-18 (KJV)

16 Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.

17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.




I fully realize how 'natural man' can easily become befuddled between the teachings of the ancient Jewish traditional laws,.....the 'letter' of the Law,.....the jots and the tittles, etc. This is just 'another valid reason' why it is so vitally important to have one's mind 'regenerated' by God's infilling Spirit, the Holy Ghost. Then,...and then only, can one 'spiritually' understand how these 'two great periods of time', the Old Testament and the New Testament, are beautifully meshing together, with Jesus Christ completely fulfilling them both!


With 'brotherly love',.....your friend, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

The Race We Run



What does this comment, ( by the Apostle Paul in his first Epistle to the Church in Corinth), mean to you? Many feet on the ground, and 'in the race',.....but only 'one' receiving the prize?



1 Corinthians 9:24 (KJV)

24 Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain.




As always,.....your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle




http://strategicchange.files.wordpress.com/2010/06/relay-race.jpg


Make no mistake, my brothers and sisters, we are 'all' in the 'Race',....every single one of us,...as indicated by the Apostle Paul in his Epistle to the Church in Corinth. This 'race' that I refer to, here, is one of 'spiritual endurance',....and entails a lifetime to complete. I don't think it 'strange',...or by happenstance,....that endurance races, ( as we know them), are broken up into 'four legs', as commonly seen in Olympic events, etc. Furthermore, our 'runners' are equally known by the 'same name', whether we fully realize it, or not.


Based on the speed of the runners, the generally accepted strategy used in setting up a 4 person relay team is: second fastest,... third fastest,... slowest,... then fastest (anchor). Each segment of the relay (the distance run by one person) is referred to as a leg.


Let me introduce you to the 'four runners' we 'all' employ in our lifelong,..Spiritual 'Race'.



#1) http://art.bcoutlet.com/product-images/ARQAMACA-P694429.jpg AMBITION ( first leg of race,....second fastest runner)

AMBITION, invariably is our 'first runner' out of the starting block. He/she isn't known to be our 'fastest' runner, but certainly comes in close as our 'second fastest runner', for he/she is normally 'all over the place',....eager to burst forth,....due to our 'youthfulness', and desire to embark on life's journey. More often, than not, he/she resembles the 'Keystone Cops', ( in operation), for 'Ambition' awkwardly propels us in many directions, ( initially), before finally reaching a state of 'maturity' as it reaches the conclusion of our 'first leg' and hands over the 'baton' to our 'next' runner. Ambition, alone, can only get you 'so far', and it will take a 'smooth transfer of the baton' to our 'next' runner, WISDOM,....else we will be in peril of coming 'derailed' and knocked off track.



Philippians 3:14 (KJV)

14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.




#2) http://art.bcoutlet.com/product-images/ARQAMACA-P694448.jpg WISDOM ( second leg of race,....third fastest runner)


In this 'second leg' of our spritual lives, WISDOM, ( by Divine design), solidifies our efforts and gives purpose to our 'course' upon the 'Race' that we are in. By this time in our lives we should have learned some valuable lessons, as our 'Ambition' perhaps left us 'battered and bruised' from the many knocks we encountered, and the 'blows' delivered by life, that certainly come our way. Wisdom,....properly placed,.... doesn't 'burst out of the gates' with the same speed that 'Ambition' did, for it knows, ( and better understands), the 'race' that is before him/her, consequently eliminating much of the pitfalls that 'Ambition' had to endure.



Proverbs 4:1-12 (KJV)

4 Hear, ye children, the instruction of a father, and attend to know understanding.

2 For I give you good doctrine, forsake ye not my law.

3 For I was my father's son, tender and only beloved in the sight of my mother.

4 He taught me also, and said unto me, Let thine heart retain my words: keep my commandments, and live.

5 Get wisdom, get understanding: forget it not; neither decline from the words of my mouth.

6 Forsake her not, and she shall preserve thee: love her, and she shall keep thee.

7 Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding.

8 Exalt her, and she shall promote thee: she shall bring thee to honour, when thou dost embrace her.

9 She shall give to thine head an ornament of grace: a crown of glory shall she deliver to thee.

10 Hear, O my son, and receive my sayings; and the years of thy life shall be many.

11 I have taught thee in the way of wisdom; I have led thee in right paths.

12 When thou goest, thy steps shall not be straitened; and when thou runnest, thou shalt not stumble.




#3) http://art.bcoutlet.com/product-images/ARQAMACA-P694435.jpg FAITH ( third leg of race,....slowest runner)


As 'Wisdom' completes his/her leg we find that the race, often, becomes very treacherous for many. It's here at the exchange of the 'baton' between Wisdom, and Faith, that great diversions occur, sending 'many' spiritual runners in alternative directions which are contrary to the Scriptures. You see,... 'Faith', at this point, ( which should be firmly directed towards God), is often misdirected everywhere BUT in God's direction. Make no mistake, this '3rd runner of this particular leg' in our lifelong race is still known by it's name, 'Faith',...but it often is known as 'Faith in a career',.....'Faith in the stock market',....'Faith in an interest group', etc.,.....instead of 'Faith in God'!

It's at the vital junction,....( or handing over of the baton),.....between 'Wisdom...and...Faith' that we come to realize whether 'Wisdom' has fully 'done it's job', or not. Has 'Wisdom' fully paid attention as it has 'sped along in our lifelong journey'? Has 'Wisdom' fully recognized the absurdities of life, itself, by now, and the need for a 'much higher Source' down the road? In the relay of the 'baton' between 'Wisdom...and...Faith' will God even be a factor, or not? To 'many' it won't be,....but to a 'few'.....it will!


Matthew 7:13-14 (KJV)

13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.



With the exchange of the 'baton' between 'Wisdom...and...Faith' you will undoubtedly find that 'Faith' is our 'slowest runner' in this 3rd leg of our lifelong race. 'Faith' won't have the jack-rabbit speed that 'Ambition' had,...nor quite the speed of 'Wisdom',...for 'Faith' will, ( by Divine design), be required to run the race with 'much less natural clarity' than it's predecessors, 'Ambition and Wisdom', had. After all,... it's 'Faith',...( you see), that has to view things in an entirely different perspective. 'Faith' might not 'see' the racetrack as 'clearly',......but it 'knows it's there, nevertheless!'


Hebrews 11:1 (KJV)

11 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.



'Faith', properly placed in God, should bring you to the 'final leg' of our lifelong race! Here's where the 'speedster' takes over!


#4) http://art.bcoutlet.com/product-images/ARQAMACA-P694424.jpg DETERMINATION ( 'Anchor' leg of race,....fastest runner)


From a 'spiritual standpoint', it's here at our 'final leg of our lifelong race' where we should be able to do nothing more than to 'pick them up,....and put them down' as illustrated by our small picture of our 'Anchor',....named 'Determination'! As 'Faith' hands the 'baton' over to 'Determination', nothing more than a 'blur' should be seen, as 'Determination' sets it's sights on the finish line!


As our 'fastest runner' goes down the home stretch,...you can rest assured that 'Ambition,.....Wisdom,.....and......Faith' are still very much present as they 'root on their comrade, 'Determination', all the way to the finish line!'


Once the 'baton' has been firmly secured in this final leg, our anchor, 'Determination', doesn't have to worry about any 'false handling,...or fumbling of the baton'. Just simply finish the race,.....and give the 'baton' to God,.....for the 'baton', my dear friends, is our own very 'soul'!


'AMBITION,.....WISDOM,.....,FAITH,.....DETERMINATION',......( 'these' are your runners!)


Train 'them' well, my dear friends! Be sure to fully 'introduce' them to God!



1 Corinthians 9:24 (KJV)

24 Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain.




Who is the 'one' that receiveth the prize?



Matthew 10:22 (KJV)

22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.



Tighten up those 'spiritual sneakers', brothers and sisters, this is a 'race of endurance!'


Your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[kreagle]

In the 'Hunt' for Jesus


Isaiah 55:6 (KJV)

6 Seek ye the Lord while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near:



It certainly appears that mankind 'continues to hunt' for God in one form or the other. While there are a 'few' who continue to 'hunt for Him' for all the right reasons,....there still remains a 'vast majority' of individuals who seem to harbor an entirely different agenda in their 'hunt for God'.

In hunting there are certain devices one must 'equip' themselves with in order to be successful. Can you imagine what kind of 'luck', ( or results), a 'natural hunter' would have if he/she were to attempt to go hunting and fail to take their 'gun, or bow and arrows' with them? Absolutely none!

The 'same' can be said for the 'spiritual hunter' who has failed to 'properly equip' themselves. 'Faith' is to the 'spiritual hunter' what the 'gun, or bow and arrows' are to the 'natural hunter'. Without 'faith', the 'spiritual hunter' will, likewise, wind up with absolutely nothing as they endeavor to hunt for God!



Hebrews 11:6 (KJV)

6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.



Quite often, the nation of Israel had to learn the 'hard way' as they would, periodically, find themselves in another 'self-induced' state of trouble. These 'troublesome times' were clear indicators that they, ( Israel), would need to go on the hunt,...once again,....for God, and that they would need to properly 'equip' themselves, if they were going to find Him again,....and they did!



2 Chronicles 15:3-4 (KJV)

3 Now for a long season Israel hath been without the true God, and without a teaching priest, and without law.

4 But when they in their trouble did turn unto the Lord God of Israel, and sought him, he was found of them.



Once again, you'll notice in verse 4, above, that 'faith' is the key component that Israel combined with 'turning unto the Lord God', ( repentance). Consequently,.....He was found of them! FAITH,....properly placed in Him,.....always works! FAITH 'always' finds our God!


The 'entirely different agenda' that I spoke about in my opening paragraph, above, relates to those who are endeavoring to 'find out about Him' , minus implementing the 'God-given faith' that they actually, already, have but are failing to use!


Romans 12:3 (KJV)

3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.



Failure to use 'faith' in one's quest for God is, quite frankly, your 'own fault', for absolutely, no one, can say that they were not properly, 'divinely equipped', can they?,....in light of Romans 12:3, above!

This 'entirely different agenda' crowd of today is reminiscent of Herod, of yesterday,....for his quest to find Jesus was 'anything, but honorable',...to say the least.


Matthew 2:7-8 (KJV)

7 Then Herod, when he had privily called the wise men, enquired of them diligently what time the star appeared.

8 And he sent them to Bethlehem, and said, Go and search diligently for the young child; and when ye have found him, bring me word again, that I may come and worship him also.




In reading on, in the Book of Matthew, you will find in verse 16, of chapter 2, that Herod's agenda was certainly NOT to worship Jesus,... ( as he had proclaimed in verse 8, above),...but to 'destroy Him' and keep this King of kings 'off the throne'!!!

Did you know that we have 'many', current-day, Herods in this world, today, whose agenda still remains the 'same'? Their goal is 'still' to keep Him off the 'throne of their soul',....and not only that, but to deny Him the right to be anyone else's Lord and Saviour, also!

It's agendas like 'these' that continually try to,.....1) refute the veracity of God's Word, ( the Bible),....2) discredit the many, Biblical, facts concerning His Death, Burial, and Resurrection,.....3) and relegate Jesus to nothing more than a 'mortal man' instead of Him being 'God manifested in the flesh' that both 1 Timothy 3:16 and John 1:1-14 declares He was!

Another glaring characteristic of these types of 'alternative agendas', ( that fail to deploy their faith), deals specifically with the unwillingness of 'many' to 'make a change' in their lives. Repentance to God will, indeed, bring about a 'change' in one's life,....pure, plain, and simple. It's a complete, Biblical, impossibility for one to undergo 1) repentance towards God,....2) water baptism, ( by immersion), in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of your sins,....and to be sealed with the 3) infilling of the Holy Ghost, evidenced by 'speaking in other tongues' as the Spirit gives utterance to the 'newborn believer',......and to NOT be changed,...dramatically!

'If', ( and 'when'), a person finally decides they have received a 'belly-full' portion of this hypocritical world in which we live, there are 'divine' choices in store for them. God is just waiting on you to activate that 'faith' that He placed within you that has been lying dormant within your life for many, many years. It's at this point in life that the 'prodigal son/daughter' within you should 'equally' say,...."That's it!,.....I've had more than enough!,....I'm going to turn myself around, ( ie. repent),....and go 'home' to my Father!")

At least that's what I did!,.....and a 'few' more with me!

Finally, one needs to realize that Jesus fully recognizes the 'condition of our hearts' as we, ( 'all' of mankind), embark upon our 'hunt for Him'. Make no mistake, my dear friends, for He fully sees whose heart seeks Him for the 'right reasons',....and whose heart is being driven for the 'wrong reasons'!

You cannot fool the Alpha and the Omega,.....for He's 'seen it all', my dear brothers and sisters!

When the 'hunt' is being conducted for all the 'wrong reasons', ( and 'faith in God' is woefully absent), the 'seeker' will ultimately find out that they are coming up with nothing more than 'thin air', from a Biblical perspective. He simply 'won't be found', and will simply 'slip through the unbelieving crowd' towards the 'next' group who would HAVE, wisely, deployed their 'faith' in Him!



John 10:30-42 (KJV)

30 I and my Father are one.

31 Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him.

32 Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me?

33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?

35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;

36 Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?

37 If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not.

38 But if I do, though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the Father is in me, and I in him.

39 Therefore they sought again to take him: but he escaped out of their hand,

40 And went away again beyond Jordan into the place where John at first baptized; and there he abode.

41 And many resorted unto him, and said, John did no miracle: but all things that John spake of this man were true.

42 And many believed on him there.



In this passage, Jesus was specifically speaking to a 'Jewish audience', which, by divine design, was heavily indoctrinated in the concept of ONE GOD, ( and ONE GOD, or Deity, only!) ( see Deuteronomy 6:4-15)

In 'light of this' it should come as 'no surprise' why this Jewish audience was so incensed at the magnitude of what was coming out of the mouth of Jesus,...to the point that they were going to stone Him. He had just 'clearly' told them,....face to face,....that He was, indeed,....'God manifested in the flesh', as 1 Timothy 3:16 and John 1:1-14 also declare!

Hence, we find when they couldn't 'handle the Truth',... that pointedly stood before them,... that the 'Truth' literally 'slipped through their fingers' and onward to 'another crowd' who WOULD believe in Him!

In John 10:30-39,....the 'Hunt' had gone bad,...as fully displayed by the 'condition of their hearts',.....but thankfully, in verses 40-42, 'faith' was fully deployed and we read about a 'happy ending', after all!

'Faith in God' still works,......'if'......you're looking to find Him!


Your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[SilentFeathers]

Hi Ken, can you watch this when you get time and let me know what you think?

It really hit me as some type of smoking gun to some possible hidden facts/knowledge.

You'll find this quite interesting I'm sure.

Peace brother,
Jim

Z_75v1XA46g

MORE:

There has been a lot of suppressed evidence about the Israelites/Hebrews being in N. America long before the spin of the Columbus Discovery fiasco, there's actually some Hebrew writings carved in to stone that are quite old not far from where I am in the SE US. Pastor Arnold Murray made a documentary about this years ago and he actually found some Celtic, perhaps Scandinavian like writings/carvings too. (that pre-date Columbus by perhaps centuries).

The video has many strange messages in it, and for many years I always wondered why if Jesus came through the line of Leah/Judah/David/ etc why was so much focus on Rachael and Jacobs son Joseph....and of course Egypt. Both Benjamin and Joeseph seems to be special and from Rachael, all the other brothers seem to be portrayed as renegade naughty cut-throats. Also Rachael has the "EL" at the end of her name.

Regardless, the video is quite interesting and has a few bits of info in it that can't quite be wrote off as nonsense...

Everything always seems to lead right back to Egypt regardless......

[SilentFeathers]

Did the devil create this too?
7oqABkyNQL0

[kreagle]

A Lasting Foundation
(.....'One' that will stand the test of time!)



1 Corinthians 3:10-11 (KJV)

10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.

11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.



Jim,

Once again, many thanks to you for your PM to me, followed up with this post here on this 'timely' subject, my dear friend and brother. I'm in full agreement with you, brother, in regards to the 'hidden facts/knowledge' that you make reference to along with your closing statement,...."it can't be written off as nonsense''. In my estimation, documents/videos like this can be specifically used to, further, 'educate' onesself as to what Satan is really up to, and exactly who he is using to further his deceptive plan for mankind.

In your video, 'Lost Secrets of the Illuminati', I readily can see some of the 'who' factor because it is heavily Catholic-based, to which I have not been shy to expose it's complete demonic side, and origins. As the video points out, the Jesuits , ( or realistically,...the Catholic 'Gestapo'), are heavily involved in the handling of this 'stone' piece which supposedly came from Jacobs pillow in the Genesis account. Leave it up to the Catholics to come up with another 'image' to pay homage to, ( or 'worship'), and they'll do it 'every time'! Instead of 'spiritually' leading mankind down a pathway 'towards God',....they seem to always provide a pathway of diversion 'away from God', and in another direction, altogether!




http://www.godsebook.org/04_01_12_cornerstone_533.jpg

While these 'code breakers', ( depicted in this video), spend hours, upon hours, of time in research to bring us this special illumination, a 'diversion' is in full gear as Satan attempts to divert our attention off of where God really wants our attention, ( and allegiance), to be in the first place.


You see,....all this 'fascination' with this 'stone piece' and it's special placement in a casket and being sealed in a 'corner stone' at the the Nicholas Roerich Museum in Manhattan, New York, ( which was the 'highest' sky scraper at the time in 1929), plays right into the hands of Satan. It is always the goal of Satan to come up with a 'counterfeit' to the 'Real Thing', and that being JESUS CHRIST,....( our 'living Chief corner stone!')



1 Peter 2:1-8 (KJV)

Wherefore laying aside all malice, and all guile, and hypocrisies, and envies, and all evil speakings,

2 As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby:

3 If so be ye have tasted that the Lord is gracious.

4 To whom coming, as unto a living stone, disallowed indeed of men, but chosen of God, and precious,

5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

6 Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded.

7 Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner,

8 And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.




The 'hidden facts/knowledge' that you speak of, Jim, become quite transparent to me when I couple this information, ( as supplied by this video), with my memory of verse 7, above. This passage wisely informs us that 'the builders' are endeavoring to disallow this corner stone from 'ever being part of the building to begin with!' Surely,....'the builders' is in reference to the 'masons', ( or Illuminati), as they have, in many ways, attempted to construct mankind's dwellings with something else than the 'REAL' corner stone,...JESUS CHRIST, Himself,....and offering, ( or building), a 'substitute,.....counterfeit' instead!


A 'born-again experience', as Biblically defined by the Apostle Peter, in Acts 2:38, and prominently displayed in my signature, below, will provide 'A Lasting Foundation', (....'One' that will stand the test of time! ) This message, is exactly what the Apostle Paul was revealing to the Church in Ephesus, and certainly applies today, also!


Ephesians 2:19-22 (KJV)

19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;

20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;

21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:

22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.




Furthermore, I fully agree with the 'other' issues you make reference to, Jim. There's just no telling how many lies, and distortion of facts, we've been told over the course of our human existence. However, I do feel that I have accurately addressed the most consequential one, here, that carries such eternal weight for everyone.

God Bless,..... your brother, friend, and servant,.....Ken ( aka.....kreagle)

[kreagle]

Did the devil create this too?
7oqABkyNQL0

I do believe that the 'presentation' of this book, ( supposedly an 'overnight', miraculous work), was completely deceptive, and demonic in nature. Of course, it's Catholic roots, ( and the 'monk' who authored it), tried to paint the illusion of it's miraculous conception being a 'one night' sensation, only to be debunked at the end of the video. It seems this 'work' took decades to complete. ( Leave it up to the Catholics to 'manufacture', once again, another spectacular miracle!)

I also found it 'amusing' of this monk's depiction of Satan in his artwork rendition. I almost believe this is 'how' Satan would like to portray himself, ( sinister and ugly), so that the 'real' Satan can 'slip up on mankind' unnoticed by his actual appearance. This disguise should be recognized by 'students of the Bible',....for the Scriptures describe his appearance in an entirely different way. In the Old Testament, Ezekiel 28:12-18 describes his extreme 'beauty',....followed up by this passage in 2 Corinthians.



2 Corinthians 11:14 (KJV)

14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light


In 'fairness' to the book, ( providing 'it' deserves any), this video did not go into any 'details' of exactly what this book contained in it, making it impossible to tell if it contained anything Godly, or not.


Catholic-based, and full of distortions,etc. tells me it comes from the 'wrong side of the tracks'.


God Bless,.....your friend, brother, and servant,........Ken ( aka....kreagle)

[blufire]

Regarding the discussion on the 'holy spirit ' and other being male or female.

I would suggest you study the translations of relative passages from the original Greek or ancient Hebrew.

I think you will find there is no gender. . . When referring to the trinity icons the gender is neutral or androgynous.

Gender was applied (erroneously) during the translation into the kjv.

Which then becomes a matter of which is Truth.

[kreagle]

Regarding the discussion on the 'holy spirit ' and other being male or female.

I would suggest you study the translations of relative passages from the original Greek or ancient Hebrew.

I think you will find there is no gender. . . When referring to the trinity icons the gender is neutral or androgynous.

Gender was applied (erroneously) during the translation into the kjv.

Which then becomes a matter of which is Truth.


Hey blufire,


At your request, I took a look at the original Greek/ancient Hebrew. You will notice that I have supplied the KJV quote,....along with the Orthodox Jewish Bible, ( OJB), quote,.....side-by-side for comparison, and this is what I found.



Matthew 1:18 (KJV)

18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.


Mattityahu 1:18
Orthodox Jewish Bible (OJB)

18 The huledet (birth) of Rebbe, Melech HaMoshiach was as follows. When Moshiach’s Em, Miryam, had been given in erusin to Yosef , but before they came together, [B]she was found with child through the Ruach Hakodesh.



Furthermore, it should be noted that 'Ruach Hakodesh' is the Hebrew phrase identifying the Spirit of YHWH, ( God).


The Hebrew language phrase ruach ha-kodesh (Hebrew: רוח הקודש, "holy spirit" also transliterated ruah ha-qodesh) is a term used in the Hebrew Bible (Tanakh) and Jewish writings to refer to the Spirit of YHWH. (The expression in Hebrew is: רוח יהוה) The Hebrew term ruakh kodeshka (רוּחַ קָדְשְׁךָ, "thy holy spirit"), without the definite article, also occurs. The "Holy Spirit" in Judaism generally refers to the divine aspect of prophecy and wisdom. It also refers to the divine force, quality, and influence of the Most High God, over the universe or over his creatures, in given contexts.[1] Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruach_HaKodesh




In light of the 'above' information, I, once again, submit my comment to Rocky_Shorz, in post #663.

The Holy Ghost is the 'Father' of the child, Jesus. A 'she' did not overshadow Mary, ( another 'she'), and impregnate her. I certainly agree that this event is considered to be the 'immaculate conception', and totally 'magical' in essence,.....but NOT 'that' magical, brother!


Matthew 1:18 (KJV)

18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.


Also,.....note the following,.....


Hebrews 3:7-11
King James Version (KJV)

7 Wherefore (as the Holy Ghost saith, To day if ye will hear his voice,

8 Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:

9 When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.

10 Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways.

11 So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)


***Compared side-by-side with the Orthdox Jewish Bible***


Yehudim in Moshiach 3:7-11
Orthodox Jewish Bible (OJB)

7 Therefore, just as the Ruach Hakodesh says, "HAYOM IM BEKOLO TISHMAU ("Today, if you hear His voice" TEHILLIM 95:7f);

8 AL TAKSHU LEVAVCHEM KIMRIVAH K’YOM MASSAH BAMIDBAR ("Do not harden your heart as you did at Meribah, as you did that day at Massah in the desert")

9 ASHER NISSUNI AVOTECHEM BEKHANUNI GAM RA’U PO’OLI ARBA’IM SHANAH ("Where your Fathers tested me and tried me though they saw my deeds forty years")

10 Therefore "AKUT BEDOR VAOMAR AM TO’EY LEVAV HEM V’HEM LO YAD’U DERAKHAI" ("I was angry with that generation and I said they are a strayingof-heart people and they have not had da’as of my ways");

11 ASHER NISHBA’ETI V’APEY IM YEVO’UN EL MENUKHATI ("Therefore I declared on oath in my anger, Never shall they enter into my Rest, Home, Abode, Place of Tranquility.")






I think you will find there is no gender. . . When referring to the [B]trinity icons the gender is neutral or androgynous




Yes, sister,....the 'trinitarian' Catholic concept has skillfully woven this 'non-gender' mindset into it's dogma, along with the complete changing of the 'original baptismal formula', at the Council of Nicaea, 325 A.D. It's 'all' there to educate yourself with, should you, likewise, care to 'brush up' on your studies.

Thank you, sincerely, for challenging me to 'brush up' on mine!

[kreagle]

Sorry for double post. Not sure what happened.

[blufire]

I specifically suggested the original Greek and ancient Hebrew languages.

The Orthodox Jewish bible is (mis)interpreted from the original Greek and Hebrew as much as the Christian bibles. My first husband had a master in Old Testament and a doctrine in New Testament. Part of his education was several years study in both ancient Greek and Hebrew languages. He was privileged to study with several knowledgeable bibical scholars and I then by association received in depth study.

When trying to infer gender ‘words’ from the ancient languages there is no correlating English word. We use the word ‘he’ or ‘him’ because of our current social, cultural construct worldwide . . . . . we are comfortable with this misinterpretation because it seems to feel right.

But . . . . if you apply this nongender interpretation to other verses, even within current ‘bibles’ it rings and holds true.

An example: The first Being created (adam) was both male and female, an androgynous Being. The ‘female’ was not removed from the Being, Adam, until later when Eve was ‘taken’ from Adam because God felt the original Being should not be alone. Eve (the femaleness) was not ‘created’ during the first 6 days of creation . . . as it is most generally thought of.

The original Being created in the likeness of ‘God’ was nongender specific or androgynous or both male and female in form. In as much as God and the Holy Spirit has no gender . . . these Beings are not organic human.


Genesis 1: 26-28 (creation of the Being Adam)

26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.


Genesis 2:18-25 (creation or removal of the femaleness from original Being)

18And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him.
19And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.
20And Adam gave names to all cattle, and to the fowl of the air, and to every beast of the field; but for Adam there was not found an help meet for him.
21And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;
22And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.
23And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.
24Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.
25And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed.

[kreagle]

blufire,

Hello again, sister. I don't have much time, right now, to fully answer you now. It seems I'm about to 'add' to my grandfather status, so I'm off to the hospital to witness the birth of my fourth grandchild. I should be back in the swing of things within the next day, or so.


With 'agape' love from Him,........kreagle

[kreagle]

I specifically suggested the original Greek and ancient Hebrew languages.

The Orthodox Jewish bible is (mis)interpreted from the original Greek and Hebrew as much as the Christian bibles. My first husband had a master in Old Testament and a doctrine in New Testament. Part of his education was several years study in both ancient Greek and Hebrew languages. He was privileged to study with several knowledgeable bibical scholars and I then by association received in depth study.

When trying to infer gender ‘words’ from the ancient languages there is no correlating English word. We use the word ‘he’ or ‘him’ because of our current social, cultural construct worldwide . . . . . we are comfortable with this misinterpretation because it seems to feel right.

But . . . . if you apply this nongender interpretation to other verses, even within current ‘bibles’ it rings and holds true.

An example: The first Being created (adam) was both male and female, an androgynous Being. The ‘female’ was not removed from the Being, Adam, until later when Eve was ‘taken’ from Adam because God felt the original Being should not be alone. Eve (the femaleness) was not ‘created’ during the first 6 days of creation . . . as it is most generally thought of.

The original Being created in the likeness of ‘God’ was nongender specific or androgynous or both male and female in form. In as much as God and the Holy Spirit has no gender . . . these Beings are not organic human.


Genesis 1: 26-28 (creation of the Being Adam)

26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.


Genesis 2:18-25 (creation or removal of the femaleness from original Being)

18And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him.
19And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.
20And Adam gave names to all cattle, and to the fowl of the air, and to every beast of the field; but for Adam there was not found an help meet for him.
21And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;
22And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.
23And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.
24Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.
25And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed.




blufire,

Well,.....6 lbs. 4 ounces, and one grandson later,....I'm back! God is so good, and I praise Him for that!


I'll have to admit that when I originally posted my reply to you that I 'suspected' there was a more 'original manuscript' that you would point to, so I'm not surprised to say the least. I've also, wisely, observed that regardless to which manuscript one wishes to use over the other there exists quite an array of 'detractors' who are eager to debunk whatever material you place before them. Consequently, because of this, many people have become so disillusioned that they just simply disregard it all, which is 'exactly' what the intentions of Satan were to begin with. They've 'thrown the baby out with the bathwater', ( so-to-speak), rendering their quest for spiritual enlightenment a serious, ( if not fatal), blow.

I've also learned to be cautious in fully incorporating various spiritual points of interest, ( regardless to it's pedigree of origin), simply because it came from an impressive source of 'higher education'.

The 'non-gender', ( or 'dual-gender'), issue you bring up is one that I, personally, reject, as it scripturally violates many of the principles that God has endeavored to teach us through His Word.





An example: The first Being created (adam) was both male and female, an androgynous Being. The ‘female’ was not removed from the Being, Adam, until later when Eve was ‘taken’ from Adam because God felt the original Being should not be alone. Eve (the femaleness) was not ‘created’ during the first 6 days of creation . . . as it is most generally thought of.

The original Being created in the likeness of ‘God’ was nongender specific or androgynous or both male and female in form. In as much as God and the Holy Spirit has no gender . . . these Beings are not organic human.




To claim that Adam, ( the first Being), was androgynous, ( 'both' male and female,....or....a 'hermaphrodite'), clearly means that you are insinuating that God is the 'same', for Adam was made in the 'image of God' ( Genesis 1:27). However, we clearly see that 'One' God created 'one' man, ( Adam). Nowhere does the Bible insinuate that a 'female side of Adam' was extracted from him to make woman, ( Eve), from. It simply, ( and accurately), just states a 'rib' was removed, to which God took and worked around this 'rib' to create woman with, ( and 'all' her female parts). To imply anything 'more than this' is a complete 'stretch', to say the least. It's with this 'rib' from man, ( as the 'nucleus' to which God worked around in His creation of woman), that God was able to accurately point out the significance behind His method He was using here.



Genesis 2:23-24 (KJV)

23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.

24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.



When God specifically used the 'rib' of Man to create Woman with,....He was now able to say,......"they shall be one flesh". This 'principle' would fully demonstrate the Divine will of God, in relationship to 'marriage', and the 'oneness' that He would recognize this relationship to be. Later on, Jesus, ( who was God, Himself,...manifested in the flesh.... 1 Timothy 3:16), restated this exact same 'principle' in the Book of Matthew.


Matthew 19:6 (KJV)

6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.



May God Bless,......your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

A note to 'all',.......

A recent poster, humanalien, has elected to disassociate himself from the Avalon forum. I was just made aware of this as I stumbled upon this particular thread where many Avalon 'well-wishers' were saying their farewells to him. Here is the link to this thread.

Link: http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?62427-humanalien-farewell-to-a-member-I-will-miss-you

I, also, supplied my comments, ( and desires), to humanalien in post #7, there. You can read what these comments/desires were, if you would like to, by clicking on the link and scrolling down to post #7.

My reason for mentioning this, here, is twofold. First, I would like to sincerely solicit 'prayer' for humanalien and all of the various problems that he has been undergoing. Some of these problems have been made public to us, by him, in his posts to us, and some of them have been made private, to me, in various PM's between he and I. He really needs our prayers, folks!

Secondly, I have decided to begin a new thread, which I will title,......'A Place for Prayer',....which I encourage, ( and sincerely hope), all Avalonians will use from 'time to time' to post their own 'personal' prayers that we 'all' have from time to time. Prayer is highly powerful when properly implicated by people who 'bind together' and care.

It's been said,....."Those who pray together, stay together".

We can make a huge difference,.....'if' we try, folks!

Here is the link for the new thread,.....'A Place for Prayer'

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?62476-A-Place-for-Prayer&p=717207&viewfull=1#post717207


Your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

Rowing in Vain



https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-HJnmoZxhkxM/UXQkQGR7PUI/AAAAAAAAmfM/tCnIqehFIZE/w497-h373/f9670254febe3cbc2132a8b1ceaa682d-d51wtmy.jpg




John 6:16-21 (KJV)

16 And when even was now come, his disciples went down unto the sea,

17 And entered into a ship, and went over the sea toward Capernaum. And it was now dark, and Jesus was not come to them.

18 And the sea arose by reason of a great wind that blew.

19 So when they had rowed about five and twenty or thirty furlongs, they see Jesus walking on the sea, and drawing nigh unto the ship: and they were afraid.

20 But he saith unto them, It is I; be not afraid.

21 Then they willingly received him into the ship: and immediately the ship was at the land whither they went.



The 'storms of life' always seem to come crashing down on us, periodically, rendering our 'rowing efforts' futile,...or so it seems. It's during these many futile moments of 'rowing against the storm' that it becomes pretty obvious that we are 'getting nowhere', despite our best efforts.

I can vividly remember, ( approximately 33 years ago), as I, too, was attempting to 'row myself out of a treacherous situation',....when it suddenly dawned on me,....."I didn't have Jesus on board, with me, in my life". Verse 21, ( above), accurately depicts the results that 'always' occurs,....when, ( and 'if'), we wise up and 'take Him on board'.



21 Then they willingly received him into the ship: and immediately the ship was at the land whither they went.


As soon as we 'consciously' make the decision to 'willingly receive Him' on board in our lives,.....you will find, my friends,.....that you have, miraculously, arrived at your destination! What previously had been a condition where I 'couldn't even see the shoreline',......had miraculously been transformed into a 'shoreline under my feet'!

What a difference He makes,..... when invited on board in our lives!

True to cause,....I'm not trying to 'paint the illusion' that no storms 'still' crop up in my life,...for they do, from time to time. However,....I've learned a very, very valuable lesson,...( some 33 years ago!)

When I, once again, grab my oar and put it in the water, ( of Life),.....I make sure that 'He is fully on board with me!' An Acts 2:38 experience, ( as indicated in my signature), will firmly entrench Him 'on board' with you!

No more,.....'Rowing in Vain',.....for me!

And you don't have to, either!


Your 'loving' brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

I have been led to purposely 'stand back' and observe events unfold themselves over the last several days. I don't mind saying that I have been, somewhat, dismayed at the lack of participation on this thread, for these 'events' that I am referring to, here, are rapidly transforming, ( and growing), before our very eyes, but few seem to fully recognize this.

Our need for God,..( and His insight), has certainly increased, exponentially, my friend,.....NOT decreased, nor diminished.

If we think this little incident of 'hacking Avalon', etc., is alarming,....just wait, my fellow friends, for things are going to get a great deal worse for mankind, sooner than most would like to acknowledge.

War in Syria, ( perhaps the beginning of WW3),.....Obama-Care, ( from a President, and administration, that really doesn't care!),.....and the growing complete financial doom that we 'all' are facing in our economy worldwide, should make us more determined than ever to turn to the only viable, ( and lasting), 'Answer Book' that we really have to begin with!,.....The World of God,....The Bible!

I hope this little 'pep talk' has caused someone to refocus some priorities.

Bible Topics and Questions has always been a place for 'us', and I have tried to specifically emphasize that from the very inception of this thread.

'Now' is a time to put the 'pedal to the metal', ( from a spiritual standpoint), and push the accelerator all the way to the floor. It's certainly NOT a time to 'let up',....and attempt to 'coast to the finish line', my dear friends!

I have 'many things' yet to say, ( and share), here, my brothers and sisters!

Please don't tell me that the 'audience' has dissipated, completely!


As 'always',....your caring brother, friend, and servant,.....kreagle

[Referee]

On the Holy Sprit aspect... I have to side with Blue fire. IMHO the Holy Spirit is an extension of a being so pure it needs no gender.......... just my 2 cents.
PS Remember all early translations were done by males.

WAR EAGLE!

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Hey kreagle, have no fear brother! If the Bible has taught you, or anyone, anything, it is to have no fear!

Bottom line, i guess, is that Avalon is an alternative forum, not an orthodox Christian one, so there will be few fully fledged, practising Christians here to engage in biblical debate. I think that is the case. I personally, as you know, am not an orthodox Christian, in that I subscribe to the 'man-made', man-written, man-MANipulated aspects of its doctrine, but purely the words and messages of THE Christ. He lived and he died to teach mankind a very important lesson. A philosophy. I hold that philosophy, and I cherish it. Everything else to me is irrelevant, insofar as the doctrine (re, Old Testament = political pamphlet) is concerned. No shock there, I'm sure, I've described my thoughts and feeling on this matter for a long while. But...


'Now' is a time to put the 'pedal to the metal', ( from a spiritual standpoint), and push the accelerator all the way to the floor. It's certainly NOT a time to 'let up',....and attempt to 'coast to the finish line', my dear friends!

You couldn't be more right! And everyone here does remember that, and that's what they are doing. It's happening right now! If you just look around you'll see threads such as:

SPECIAL-SYRIA-ENERGY-FOCUS-Ground-Crew (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?62742-SPECIAL-SYRIA-ENERGY-FOCUS-Ground-Crew-Initiative-Please-help-me)

HOW-TO-HEAL-THE-WORLD-A-roadmap-you-may-have-been-waiting-for... (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?62596-HOW-TO-HEAL-THE-WORLD--A-roadmap-you-may-have-been-waiting-for...-)

Calling-all-light-warriors-the-Bees-need-you- (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?62676-Calling-all-light-warriors-the-Bees-need-you-)

Peace-Crew-Please-Pray-Meditate-Peace-One-Hour-Day (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?62729-Peace-Crew-Please-Pray-Meditate-Peace-One-Hour-Day)

GMO Focus Group-Carmen-s-Crew (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?62649-Carmen-s-Crew)

Help-Love-Needed-in-Colombia (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?62827-Help-Love-Needed-in-Colombia)

How-to-Create-the-Effects-that-Will-Bring-Down-the-cabal. (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?62840-How-to-Create-the-Effects-that-Will-Bring-Down-the-cabal.)

And that's just a few! From just a couple of pages in General Discussions, there are many more, on many other threads throughout the forums. The pedal is, as you say, firmly hitting the metal! In many many ways (and that is probably why, just now, the forum was attacked!!)

So there is absolutely no reason to feel concerned at all. I have no idea why you would feel 'dismayed' mate. We are all working very hard to steer the ship, spiritually, to the shoreline of positive change! as you allude to in your earlier post about 'rowing in vain' / 'riding out the storm'.

Have no fear!

[kreagle]

On the Holy Sprit aspect... I have to side with Blue fire. IMHO the Holy Spirit is an extension of a being so pure it needs no gender.......... just my 2 cents.
PS Remember all early translations were done by males.

WAR EAGLE!


Hey Referee,

You are totally correct concerning the 'pureness' of His Spirit. The balance of what we are discussing, ( referring to His gender, etc.), fully comes down to whether one accepts the Scriptures as They are recorded, or not. I simply do, for They have proven themselves to me, over and over again, in more ways than one.

By revelation, ( and the Word of God), I have come to realize, ( and accept), that the concept of God is ONE in numerical property,....one Deity, with absolutely no plurality at all, as the Catholic concept of a 'trinity' would have us to believe.

Whether He is revealed as our Father,.....God,......the Holy Ghost, ( or Spirit),......or in the fleshly body of Jesus Christ,.....He is still 'ONE' Deity. As such,.....His 'gender' is clearly revealed by Scriptures,....'if' you take a closer look at what the Bible truly reveals, here.


1 John 5:7 (KJV)

7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.


( note: in connection to the 'Word' in verse 7, above,......)


John 1:1 and verse 14 (KJV)

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.


14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.




Furthermore,....it's through His 'gender' issue, here, that we find out, exactly, 'why' His disciples, ( the Apostles), baptized their converts to the Church 'exclusively' in the saving, New Testament, name of God, which was JESUS CHRIST 'only'!( see Acts 2:38, Acts 8:16, Acts 10:48, and Acts 19:5) ( also see Acts 4:12)

They 'never' used His Titles, ( ie. of 'Father',....'Son',...or....'Holy Ghost'!)

Water Baptism was 'always' performed by immersion in the 'name' of JESUS CHRIST,....a Male 'gender', and masculine, ( in every way), GOD!

His disciples/Apostles 'never' deviated from this baptismal, Christian, formula!

You will have to 'fast-forward' to around 325 A.D., ( at the Council of Nicaea), to see when this 'diversion' was established and the Catholic Church began to baptize, ( by sprinkling), in His Titles,.....instead of His Name,...JESUS CHRIST!


Once again,....I humbly submit,....it all boils down to whether one accepts the Scriptures as They are recorded, or not. Furthermore, it also depends on whether one views Them as Divine, or not. I, unquestionably, do in 'both' cases!



2 Peter 1:20-21 (KJV)

20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.


God Bless,......and WAR EAGLE back at you!


Your brother, friend, and servant!,.......kreagle

[kreagle]

Hey kreagle, have no fear brother! If the Bible has taught you, or anyone, anything, it is to have no fear!




So there is absolutely no reason to feel concerned at all. I have no idea why you would feel 'dismayed' mate. We are all working very hard to steer the ship, spiritually, to the shoreline of positive change! as you allude to in your earlier post about 'rowing in vain' / 'riding out the storm'.

Have no fear!


Brother,

My 'dismay' stems from an observation that I made some time ago, and not only deals with Avalon members, here, but has reached global proportions from the onset of humanity.

Let me explain.

Another Avalon member, here, ( EMSC,...formerly USGS), provides a very beneficial service to us by providing up-to-date data concerning seismic activity around the world. I have observed that humanity, ( in general), doesn't get too excited over the many 'tremors' we have,....say the 4.9's,....or the 5.3's, etc. It seems that the only ones that garner any special attention have to be the 'big ones',...( ie. the 6.9's,....or the 7.1 'Fukushima-type' earthquakes), in order to truly 'rattle' us to action. Humanity has become very apathetic towards the multitudes of 'small' tremors that we experience daily and are inevitably setting the table for the future.

Such is the case, ( and even more so), for the multitude of 'small spiritual tremors' that God, in His Mercy and Grace, has strategically placed in our pathway, Divinely designed to warn us, ( and propel us), to properly plan for our date with eternity! However,...as in the 'natural',....so is the 'spiritual' according to the actions of 'many'. Apathy rules, once again!

And, yes, Star Mariner, there are 'many' well thought out plans, threads, etc., that have been specifically structured, here, ( and in our society), that are designed to address, fight against, and 'fix' many of these 'earth-shaking' situations. However, I'm afraid that mankind has become so enamored with 'fixing the problem' that they have totally lost track of the fact that we, 'individually', need to address the most important task of 'fixing us,....FIRST!'

To compound this,.....'many' don't even realize, ( or accept the fact), that they need 'fixing' to begin with!

Today's 'popular' adage seems to be,....."If it ain't broke,....don't fix it!"

Nobody seems to be 'broke', ( or a sinner), anymore,....no one seems to need to be 'fixed'!

Brother, my level of 'dismay' is enhanced by those who scurry about trying to 'externally fix their problems' when the wisdom of God's Word is feverishly trying to inform us to 'internally dig down deep' and find the Rock on which to build, ( and maintain), our complete spiritual existence.


Luke 6:47-49 (KJV)

47 Whosoever cometh to me, and heareth my sayings, and doeth them, I will shew you to whom he is like:

48 He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock.

49 But he that heareth, and doeth not, is like a man that without a foundation built an house upon the earth; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.



Certainly,....anyone can 'build' where ever they choose, for it's their God-given right to do so. Science, ( and God's Word), equally tells us that the 'Big One' is coming, does it not? A 'natural', and a 'Spiritual' earthquake of epic proportions is surely coming our way,...'if' any of these sources are close to being right. I, personally, believe them 'both'.

'Now',....perhaps you better understand my 'concerns', (and dismay), brother!


As 'always', your friend, brother, and servant,.....kreagle

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

A big 10-4 there kreagle! I see now where you're coming from. I had originally thought this dismay was centred largely on the Avalon community. I get you now mate.

I understand fully what you mean about the numerous 'tremors' reported around the world - tell-tale signs of earth-changes etc, that might seem to be indicative of the 'big one', somewhere around the corner - and your concern that the public are largely ignorant, or at least apathetic to the danger. Yeh many are ignorant, of this and so many other things.

I take a different view of all this to be honest. Forgive me, I’m going to ramble here, and go into some tangents you may feel are pretty strange…

There are manly hundreds, thousands, of such tremors recorded every year, around the world, and they have historically occurred since records (or the means to scientifically measure seismic activity) began. I do believe however that yes, the frequency of these events is on the 'up', as well as their geographical locations, where usually these disturbances are not felt.

I perceive a couple of other different reasons for some of these quakes that may not align with your beliefs, but they stem from my thoughts/feelings/observations/ as well as metaphysical studies in these areas. I believe that:

Earth, as an organism (and yes it is one, a macro-lifeform and thus entity but on a scale that we do not really comprehend), is sensitive to disturbances and negative forces afflicted upon it by us, Humans. It doesn't even have to be something even quite so profound and destructive as fracking. But what we do physically, effects the earth energetically, and all these subtle energy grids (ley lines et al) are out of whack - or were out of whack. I see them now coming back into natural alignment. For it is now the Will of humanity that the darkness be cleansed, and the world be healed, and thus these magnetic and etheric imbalances are being adjusted, restored. But they are still being bombarded by so much negativity, and it is in the collective morphic field of humanity’s negative emotional state, just as much as it is being manifested in actual physical violence. All this has a jarring effect on the earth, expressed by seismic activity.

Secondly, the Earth (in fact our entire solar system) has for a while now been entering into a new region of galactic space. This is not just new-age hocus pocus. It has been observed, this ‘energy bubble’, or galactic superwave, by astronomers. And it is part of the Plan. We are in the final stages of emerging into this pulse of energy, that will, and is, lifting the earth and all its (positively-aligned) inhabitants, into a new frequency of existence. (The un-positive will be left behind). The Bible speaks of this. It is in Revelations my friend. That time is now, the final confrontation between the positive and negative, the good and the evil, the last showdown. And boy, do TPTB not want this ‘positive, free, heavenly’ side to win, or a New Earth to appear, and a New beginning for mankind! They want war, and tyranny, and oppression, to keep us here, on the old negative earth! To hold us back, and prevent Heaven from exerting itself on the earth. But they can’t. It is inevitable. It is already happening. It will happen. And for that, all I can say is, celebrate!

But anyway, these forces are afflicting somewhat of a ‘growing pain’ for this new earth, which is hatching right now into this new dimension of existence. So yes, there will be some rockin’ and rollin’ to come as the darkness is released.

I’m probably speaking complete nonsense to you kreagle. But really all I’m doing is just expressing what Christian doctrine has declared ‘as the destiny of mankind’ all along, but in a different way. But I still say, your dismay is unfounded mate – as unfounded as one who is dismayed by the discomfort of a mother in the childbirth process. Yes, it is difficult and painful to witness, with so much turbulence expressing (releasing) itself. But what miracles will eventually come, emerging right there on the delivery table of the universe!

Mate, we have everything to be so very thankful for, and to rejoice! But yes I do understand the dismay. It is heartbreaking to see such suffering in the world, the wars and the poverty, hunger and oppression, and the lives that may be lost with the subsequent earth-changes to come, and perhaps indeed, the ‘big one’ that may yet strike. But we have it in us, as surely as God is in us, in prayer, to dampen the devastation of this ruin, diminish suffering, and steer the course of least destruction as possible. To make the birthing process as smooth as it can be. And we are getting a lot of help from ‘up there’, believe me! Without it, the ruin would already have been great indeed. We may not even be talking to each other, right here and right now.


To compound this,.....'many' don't even realize, ( or accept the fact), that they need 'fixing' to begin with!

Quite true. They are just ‘uninformed’. They do not see, firstly because TPTB do not tell them, and secondly, they do not want to find things out for themselves. They live in ignorance. Which is why it is important for those that do know – us – to ‘steer the ship’ for them, be the rock of stability and understanding and love, and faith, when the time comes. And you know what I mean by ‘when the time comes’. A vulgar expression perhaps, but when ‘the s**t hits the fan.’

The fan is already spinning up. Be ready. And be strong, for all those who count upon you. The reward will be glorious.

[kreagle]

But I still say, your dismay is unfounded mate – as unfounded as one who is dismayed by the discomfort of a mother in the childbirth process.

Let me see if I can help you 'find' exactly what I have been referring to, here, all along, my dear friend and brother.

You see, the source of my dismay can easily be seen if you will begin to look, once again, at my recent post on 'Rowing in Vain', to which you, yourself, made reference to in your post. Brother, when I 'took Jesus on board in my life', ( through the infilling of His Spirit,....the Holy Ghost), I accepted Him 'AS IS'! I did NOT try to alter Him in any way, form, or fashion,......much like many 'other' well-meaning individuals attempt to do today. Despite the best efforts by 'many', the Lord is NOT going to be changed, for He, Himself, is unchangeable, and 'always' has been.


Hebrews 13:8(KJV)

8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.


As such, when Jesus 'came on board' in my life I gladly gave Him complete freedom to 'express Himself', through me, in any way that He saw fit to do. In other words,.....I specifically told the Lord,....."Make yourself at Home, Lord, and carry on as usual!" This 'spiritual mentality' is virtually impossible to relate to the unregenerated individual, but through the genuine infilling of the Holy Ghost, you will find yourself 'expressing yourself' in many, many ways that you never did before. Christ is now 'in you', ( Romans 8:10), and will not hesitate to express Himself through you, ( and your emotions), as He sees fit.

With 'this' in mind, I ask you to take a 'glimpse' at how Jesus viewed His beloved city, Jerusalem, one day, many years ago.


Luke 13:34 (KJV)

34 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, which killest the prophets, and stonest them that are sent unto thee; how often would I have gathered thy children together, as a hen doth gather her brood under her wings, and ye would not!



It doesn't take a very keen eye to quickly observe that Jesus, here, was very 'dismayed' at what He was observing. His children, Israel, had been looking, ( and longing), for a Messiah to save them for a long, long, time. Finally, when He stands right before them, ( face-to-face), they completely reject Him and fail to recognize who He fully was. The 'gift of salvation' had been Divinely packaged up for them, ( in a fleshly body to be the 'Sacrificial Lamb' at Calvary), and with the exception of a very 'few', this 'gift of salvation' was totally going unnoticed,....un-opened,....and discarded.

Conversely, the 'gift of salvation', from God today, is likewise going unnoticed,....un-opened,....and discarded, by the 'majority' of mankind as we speak. History is repeating itself!

The 'gift of salvation' that I speak of is found in Acts 2:38,....to which I 'regularly' make reference to, and is quoted in my signature.


Acts 2:38 (KJV)

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.



So you see, Star Mariner, the 'dismay' that you see from me, my friend, is simply an 'expression' from Him, ( Jesus Christ), who is firmly entrenched within my life, responding in exactly the 'same way' that He always has!

I can assure you, brother,....it 'dismays' God when His 'gift to mankind' is rejected,....when it goes completely unnoticed,....un-opened,....and discarded!

Furthermore, this 'dismay' is acerbated when He sees His people eagerly turning to 'alternative sources of enlightenment' in their quest for 'Truth'. Many today are turning to OBE's, ( or OOBE's), Out of Body Experiences,....when they can, instead, receive the 'infilling' of the Holy Ghost, an IOBE, Inside of Body Experience. God, in His infinite wisdom, works on the 'inside' of mankind, so the 'outside' can be positively affected later on in his Christian walk.


John 7:38-39 (KJV)

38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.

39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)



A 'word of Wisdom', here,...my dear, dear, friend. Satan has made it his business to always conjure up an 'alternative' for 'every God-given' gift to mankind. It's up to 'us' to choose from which 'source/Source' to accept from.

Your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[kreagle]

Good News concerning God's Word!


http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-oWzPL8fl-eU/T0Fc7fo0MtI/AAAAAAAAAZE/aGQhPup06wE/s320/dusty-bible.jpg


Here's a good way to 'knock that dust off' of that Bible you've got that's been lying around!

Link: http://washingtonexaminer.com/internet-bible-reading-surges-now-4-in-10-read-gods-words-digitally/article/2535148

Internet Bible reading surges, now 4 in 10 read God's words digitally
By PAUL BEDARD | SEPTEMBER 4, 2013 AT 10:31 AM

248Comments
Share on printShare on email505Topics: Science and Technology Washington Secrets Freedom of Religion

God is still great in the eyes of Americans, even on the internet. While an amazing 88 percent of the nation’s homes own a Bible, more and more are switching to the internet, cell phones and iPad for their weekly inspiration, according to a sweeping new survey of Bible use.

In their latest survey of Bible use, the American Bible Society finds that 41 percent of Americans used the internet to read the good book on a computer. Some 29 percent said they searched Bible verses on a cell phone and 17 percent said they read an electronic version of the Bible on a Kindle or iPad.

The trend is similar in the news business, with the readers shifting to digital over paper.

“The data shows a continual shift to digital content. The number of Bible readers who use their smart phone or cell phone to search for Bible content has increased each year, with a 6 percent increase in the use of this format from 2012,” said the Society. “Use of internet to find Bible content has also increased, up 4 percent from 2011,” they added.

And, said the survey of 2,083, the most read and searched version of the Bible was the King James version. Thirty-eight percent preferred that over the New King James version, which just 14 percent prefer.

Americans also said that the Bible is king over the Koran, with 80 percent calling the Bible sacred, with just 8 percent citing the Koran. That was followed by the Torah, at 4 percent, and Book of Mormon at 3 percent.

With more people tapping into the Bible for direction and inspiration, the most read book in the world is also having a bigger influence in American politics. More than two-thirds, or 69 percent, said their personal faith has at least a little influence in political issues. And the percentage of those who said their faith influences their political leanings has increased from 27 percent last year to 31 percent this year.

Other findings:

-- 77 percent believe that morality in America is on the decline, with a third blaming the lack of bible reading.

-- 66 percent believing teaching the Bible in public schools is important.

-- 54% of adults agreed with the statement, "the Bible and politics do not mix."

-- 22% of adults believe the Bible should be taken literally, word for word

Paul Bedard, The Washington Examiner's "Washington Secrets" columnist, can be contacted at pbedard@washingtonexaminer.com.


While I still submit that there's no 'substitute' like having your own Bible, ( and 'using' It!), I certainly 'applaud' the efforts of these people. Whatever it takes to 'taste and see that the Lord is good!' , ( Psalms 34:8), is A.O.K. with me!

What a great God we have!

Your brother, friend, and servant,.......kreagle

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

A 'word of Wisdom', here,...my dear, dear, friend. Satan has made it his business to always conjure up an 'alternative' for 'every God-given' gift to mankind. It's up to 'us' to choose from which 'source/Source' to accept from.

I’m very sorry you feel this way, I really am. There are many paths to wisdom, my friend. Many. One that blocks it, however, is the FEAR of this purely man-made invention 'Satan', this fairy tale person, which keeps people afraid of seeking and discovering any other truth but what the bible contains. Which is exactly what the church fathers wanted: ignorance and fear = control.

With dearest respect my friend kreagle, we operate on entirely different frequencies, you and I, we always have really, but I've tried my very best to bridge the gap by adopting your language and ideology, in order to reach some level of discourse where the truths that we do share can be explored - and celebrated. I've done that to the best of my ability. It has been a rewarding and enriching experience for me, to speak with you on these important topics. But now I feel it is the time to withdraw, and bow out.

All the very best to you my brother. May the steps on your path to God never falter, nor the light that guides the way ever fade.

Love, light, and blessings, as always, SM.

(P.S If you ever need me, for anything at all, you know where I am)

[kreagle]

A 'word of Wisdom', here,...my dear, dear, friend. Satan has made it his business to always conjure up an 'alternative' for 'every God-given' gift to mankind. It's up to 'us' to choose from which 'source/Source' to accept from.

I’m very sorry you feel this way, I really am. There are many paths to wisdom, my friend. Many. One that blocks it, however, is the FEAR of this purely man-made invention 'Satan', this fairy tale person, which keeps people afraid of seeking and discovering any other truth but what the bible contains. Which is exactly what the church fathers wanted: ignorance and fear = control.

With dearest respect my friend kreagle, we operate on entirely different frequencies, you and I, we always have really, but I've tried my very best to bridge the gap by adopting your language and ideology, in order to reach some level of discourse where the truths that we do share can be explored - and celebrated. I've done that to the best of my ability. It has been a rewarding and enriching experience for me, to speak with you on these important topics. But now I feel it is the time to withdraw, and bow out.

All the very best to you my brother. May the steps on your path to God never falter, nor the light that guides the way ever fade.

Love, light, and blessings, as always, SM.

(P.S If you ever need me, for anything at all, you know where I am)


Star Mariner,

Brother, if you could see inside of my heart, then you would begin to visualize just how meaningful my intentions are towards you, ( and everyone else.) Perhaps then you wouldn't be so 'hasty' in, potentially, making such a decision to abandon this thread. There's absolutely no reason to abandon the 'rewarding and enriching experiences', ( by your own words), that you have received, here. I, too, have benefited, greatly, from our many discourses, and I will be greatly saddened if they come to an end!

While you may view Satan as a mere 'fairy tale person', ( and man-made), I can assure you he is just as REAL as God, Himself, for his, ( Satan's), existence remains firmly entrenched, ( and recorded), within the Scriptures. The remedy for this is NOT to ignore his 'obvious' existence,....but to learn how to deal with him,....understand his ways,.....and ultimately defeat him! Brother, I can 'deny', ( all day long), that the 'sun' exists,.....but as I stand under it's heat, mopping the sweat off my brow, something tells me that it really does exist after all.

Conversely, there are many more 'truisms', ( Books, Chapters, Biblical events), in the Scriptures that you, likewise, seem to want to 'omit' in our discussions, as you are, likewise, uncomfortable with these, too. With that, I suppose you could continue that 'line of thinking', and pretty soon you simply wouldn't have 'anything at all to discuss',....for you have systematically eliminated everything that you have found to be, personally, offensive, or what you simply don't believe.

Brother,....I really believe the reason for your involvement, here, is simply because you, indeed, have a 'great mind', ( and I mean that!), and wish to expand on that by exploring the 'unsearchable riches of God's Word'. To that, I richly applaud you, and your efforts, for you certainly are heading in the 'right direction' in your quest for knowledge and Truth. God, ( and His Word), are the 'nucleus of ALL Truth' , so let's not be guilty of discarding 'any' of It, simply because we have 'yet' to fully understand It. His 'Truth' is the only thing that will separate,.....and ultimately set us free, my dear friend!


John 17:17(KJV)

17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.


and,.....


John 8:32 (KJV)

32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.






A 'word of Wisdom', here,...my dear, dear, friend. Satan has made it his business to always conjure up an 'alternative' for 'every God-given' gift to mankind. It's up to 'us' to choose from which 'source/Source' to accept from.


In my 'word of Wisdom' quote to you I, personally, intended to give a 'thoughtful' warning to you, ( and everyone else), who just might not fully recognize what they were partaking of. If I were to see a 'friend' drinking from a 'cup' that seemed to contain nothing but 'harmless water',....and personally had knowledge that the water was not so 'harmless', after all,....I would be 'compelled' to sound the alarm, and to 'warn my friends!'

You see,.....that's what 'friends' are for!


Please 're-consider',....and let's proceed in our quest for Truth, together!


Your 'friend', brother, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

Calling Your Father


http://ak0.picdn.net/shutterstock/videos/479284/preview/stock-footage-making-a-phone-call.jpg


A few things have kept me sidelined for a short period of time. Of these,...the hospitalization of my father, has certainly caused my attention to be directed, ( and focused), upon his well-being and recovery. It seems he has been suffering from an old ulcer that has been bleeding internally and causing him to require several units of blood before he finally began to heal and stop requiring additional blood. He was given '10 units' of blood,....which is quite a lot,.....before he finally took a turn for the good and was consequently released from the hospital yesterday.

I have 2 younger brothers and 2 younger sisters,....and between us all, we took turns, ( as we could), and stayed with him at the hospital so he wouldn't have to endure this all by himself. When I stayed with him, myself, I received very little sleep as he would keep me up in either assisting him as he went to the bathroom,....or simply by providing an 'ear' to listen to him as he, ( and I), reminisced about things in the past.

My father lives about a hundred miles north of where I live, in Alabama, so it takes about an hour and half to travel to where he is. When I had arrived back at my home I received a call informing me that he wanted 'all' of his children to call him ASAP. Naturally, I was concerned, for I had just come from where he was, but I, nevertheless, called him right away. To my complete, ( and grateful), surprise my father simply stated, ( when he got on the phone),......"Son,....I simply wanted to hear your voice",......and then proceeded to express how grateful he was to have fathered such faithful and loving children that he could depend upon in a time of need.


So with this in mind, my dear friends at Avalon,......my question to you is simply this,......."How long has it been since Father has heard your voice?"


As your brother,....I would like to expressly encourage each of you to 'call our Father',.....for I can assure you He would 'love to hear from you!'



Isaiah 55:6(KJV)

6 Seek ye the Lord while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near:




God bless all of you!,.......your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

The 'Unmistakable' Voice of God


With so many 'voices' out there that are endeavoring to garner our attention,......make no mistake about it, my dear friends,.....there is only 'ONE' Voice that stands out from them all!


Psalm 95:6-7 (KJV)

6 O come, let us worship and bow down: let us kneel before the Lord our maker.

7 For he is our God; and we are the people of his pasture, and the sheep of his hand. To day if ye will hear his voice,


AND,.....


John 10:11-16 (KJV)

11 I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.

12 But he that is an hireling, and not the shepherd, whose own the sheep are not, seeth the wolf coming, and leaveth the sheep, and fleeth: and the wolf catcheth them, and scattereth the sheep.

13 The hireling fleeth, because he is an hireling, and careth not for the sheep.

14 I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.

15 As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep.

16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.





Undoubtedly, God's Voice is endeavoring to speak to us in many, many, ways today. To this point,.....I wonder just 'how' many of you, ( my fellow Avalonians), feel that God is speaking to the current world in which we all live?

He's actually 'saying' quite a lot,.....wouldn't you say?


Your brother, friend, and servant,......kreagle

[kreagle]

A note to 'all'.

I have temporarily decided to 'step back' for awhile due, in part, to the recent passing away of my father on the 12th of last month. I have been reflecting quite a bit on my past with him. I'm sure most of you will understand.

I will be returning, very soon, and hope you will understand.


May God bless each of you,......and give 'your' father a hug, or call, if you are still able to do so!


Your brother, friend, and servant,........kreagle

[panopticon]

My condolences to you and your family on your loss.
-- Pan

[Akasha]

Sorry to hear about that, Kreagle.

Much Love.

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Very sorry to hear mate. May he be at rest. My sincerest condolences to you and all your family...