Help: Family Quandary

[4evrneo]

This Family Quandary has comsumed me the last few weeks, so I submit to you fellow Avalonian's for some advice.

My mother, who has been an alcoholic all her life, and who has not been in my life for many years, suddenly wants to come stay with me.

So here is some background information. I have been on my own since I was 16, mainly because I could not live with a destructive alcoholic. I married and had 2 kids, then divorced 8 years later. Both my children were recently invited back into my life and home about 2 years ago due to them having financial difficulties. So it is me and my son and daughter in my home.
Ok, so mom’s history consists of living in Minnesota by herself and the past year or two has had several falling accidents due to intoxication that has left her using a walker and of course not working. My mom’s sister recently has put her into alcohol treatment 3 times in the last 2 years. She is currently waiting release from another treatment center in the next month or so. My mother’s sister has been calling me and pushing this responsibility on me to take care of her, saying she has had enough of dealing with it and since I am her oldest child that I need to do it. I am having serious reservations about taking this on for many reasons. The hard part is the guilt I am feeling over not wanting to do this.
Even my son (22) and daughter (25) are not liking this idea at all. We have all discussed this and ask the same questions over and over, what will she do all day? (she can’t drive) When she gets bored, she will start drinking again and all of us agree we can’t handle it when she drinks. We don’t have cable tv, she has old drinking buddies that live in Arizona, and Im afraid of coming home to finding these people in my home. Etc, etc. The list goes pretty long.
My biggest concern is my path of spirituality and how can I continue my path with her negative destructive nature? (I am the only AWAKE one in my family) I live a pretty strict schedule right now with difficulty in meditating daily as it is. I’m sharing my one vehicle with both my kids and do not ever take time off my 9-5 job. I live paycheck to paycheck and am trying my best to start preparing to move and live a simpler, more dedicated life with very serious goals in my spirituality and awakening. I want to focus on my path in a deeper way and so here I am, what do I do???

I never thought I would be confronted with something like this and I am at a complete loss at what to do. What is the right thing? Do I be a good daughter and take her on my already full plate, possibly sacrificing my goals and my sanity? Do I say no, and live with the guilt and probable backlash from her family? My aunt is already pushing me, my brother is also pushing me, and now my father (not with my mother since I was 1yr.) is also making me feel guilty !!! HELP ! I just want to do the right thing, not sure if that means the right thing by me, or by her. I have always handled my own problems but this is one I can’t seem to logically figure out. All advice is very much appreciated.
Thank you,
Annette

*My apologies if I did not post this correctly as unfortunately this is my first post*

[christian]

I have no particular personal experiences with that. I think I could find cases, where such a situation worked out and some where it didn't. That means, everything is possible. You cannot make it work all by yourself, so don't burden yourself with a too huge responsibility. Act intuitively, reach out a helping hand if you feel that don't overextend yourself by doing that and be detached enough to put an end to the 'experiment' if you strongly feel that it doesn't work out.

When it comes to being 'awakened' or not, it's not so important how much you and the others 'know' about the 'big picture' in comparison, but how the dynamics are. Surround yourself with people who are willing and determined to make steps 'forward' to a more self-responsible, balanced and harmonic life. If they have this genuine impetus, it doesn't really matter where exactly on the road they are right now, because the flow is sound, I find.

It's a walk on a tight rope, so it's foremost vital for you to keep your own balance. If you'd loose that, you couldn't really help anybody.

[indigopete]

Hi 4e

Sorry you're having such a quandry. I am not qualified to help you - I have no direct experience of alcoholism or major family problems.

Having said that, just from a simple common sense point of view, if you don't feel up to the task of taking your mother on then you maybe shouldn't do it. I would imagine that looking after someone in that state requires quite an inspired outlook on the situation, a lot of energy and favourable practical circumstances. It doesn't sound like any of those apply in your case.

Apart from all that, it's not only yourself that's affected - it's your kids as well. Screw the guilt - that's just something you'll have to live with. You may even have to live with bad feeling towards you from other family members, but if I was one of your kids I would not want your drunk mum around my house all day.

If, on the other hand, you decide that for practical or emotional or circumstantial reasons you really want to take your mum on then make sure you go into it in a positive frame of mind. Try to plan things to mitigate the damage (especially on your kids ! :)).

You asked for opinions and I hope I've not been too insensitive to your situation. Hopefully you'll get a few replies which will be helpful, but you sound like the kind of person who is capable of facing such a challenge constructively.

[Fred Steeves]

Hi 4evrneo, that's quite a pickle you're in there. My wife and I have taken care of her gramma(now 100), since she was around 87. My wife's mom, the would be natural front line care taker, was an irresponsible, and very mean alcoholic, who barely had even the capacity to take care of herself. I reckon that's where our similarities end though with your situation, as my wife never had anything but kind childhood memories of her gramma.

I'm no Dr. Phil (LOL), but let me just toss two quick things at ya, Fred style. http://nexus.2012info.ca/forum/images/smilies/newadditions/smile.gif

1) If you dare to, try this. Spend a few minutes, and get your mind into a relaxed state. Then direct this simple question to yourself: "Is it for the highest good for all concerned, that I watch over my mother?" The first thought that comes to mind will be your answer, and it's not always a comfortable one.

2) If you decide that it's not in anyone's best interest to watch your mom, then let it all go, and stick to your truth. If anyone tries to lay the infamous guilt trip albatross around your neck, then f**k em, and go your own way.

Whichever decision you make will be the right one, trust yourself.

Lots of good energy heading your way!!!
Fred

[crosby]

4evrneo - i understand exactly where it is that you are coming from. you actually have several options: you can stand your ground and say no. perhaps you may want to examine why you believe that you would feel guilty saying no. your other family members have no right to put such responsibility on you. you could take her in and eventually have to deal with what you know will happen. i have been in your situation, i understand the complexities involved. you have discussed this with your family (your children) and you all feel the same way. you can offer to help your siblings, your aunt and your 'father' find a personal care home that could facilitate the situation with her. until an alcoholic is ready to deal with their addiction/disease, they will suck the life right out of you - - and they move from family member to family member to continue the ritual. listen to what your aunt is saying when she says that she can no longer deal with the situation. she wants you to deal with it now. she is out of energy... do you want to? i know that my post may sound harsh, but i have been exactly where you are and i did not say no and the situation nearly tore my own family apart. you must stand firm with your choice and not let 'guilt' stand in the way of making the right choice for you and your children. from what you have stated in your op., you are not the person who should be feeling guilty about anything. i hope this helps, i am sending you much strength and conviction to help you make your decision.
warmest thoughts to you, corson

[another bob]

Sometimes the Universe has a different idea about what's best for our evolution than we do. We might hear that, in order to be "spiritual", we need to meditate, etc., but then we're given circumstances at the life level which preclude an ashram-type environment. As it turns out, what was right for us at that time was not an ashram, but a full-on confrontation with our own self-images that may be ripe with guilt, confusion, and fear. However much we may wish to avoid such issues, that would only amount to "spiritual by-pass", and we would just be forced to examine those same issues later. You and your mother may have karmic agreements that you made to deal with old issues in this life and finally resolve them, and this might be the opportunity you both have set up to accomplish those goals.

That being said, you have the right to make some demands, should you take her in. One would be to get power of attorney, and assume control of her finances. If she has no spending money (except what you might allot), then she can't buy booze. Since she cannot drive, you can also go to all the liquor stores within walking distance, leave a pic of your mom, and request that they refuse to sell to her. Furthermore, you can have a pre-screening interview in which your children participate, and which rules of behavior are established, as well as consequences for infringement. In other words, you would be offering her a probationary period, and if she repeatedly abuses your hospitality, you can forewarn her that she will be refused the privilege of staying with you.

At anytime, you can ask your Higher Self and Guardians for guidance, and listen closely to your own intuition for answers.

Blessings!

[indigopete]

If anyone tries to lay the infamous guilt trip albatross around your neck, then f**k em, and go your own way

R.O.T.F.W.L. !

If she picks option 2 then that little post will do fine for bedtime reading each night :cool:

[crosby]

another bob, that is great advice regarding the spending money and the liquor stores: a little caveat though, alcoholics will find a drink if they want one. cooking wines, hairspray, rubbing alcohol, cough syrup, the list goes on and on. they will drink anything that contains alcohol. it can be dreadfully dangerous. been there, saw that..... yuk!
warmest, corson

[spiritguide]

4ever, The decision is yours to make as you know. Per your outline the situation your family is trying to put you in is playing on your compassion for their own selfishness. There are not enough hours in the day for you to take on this commitment and survive with your faculties in good condition. Don't accept other family members' guilt and don't make others problem yours.
Work with them (extended family) to find a possible solution to your mom's problem but don't be afraid to say no and when they pressure you to take her in,use your mirror to reflect their guilt back onto them. Protecting yourself is your priority and if you don't nobody else will. Take care and keep your environment positive. Hoping this comment helps you to sort out the quandary.

:peace:

[RunningDeer]

http://i1262.photobucket.com/albums/ii610/WhiteCrowBlackDeer/Wilderness%20and%20Space/unity.gif

[4evrneo]

Thank you all for your great advice. I have always prided myself on looking at "problems" as "challenges" instead and have had many years of "bad environment = finding solutions, practicle experience being on my own at a young age. The best part of this situation is that I have no regrets of my past experience with her, I have gratitude for the lessons and many opportunities for growth. I have understood that I needed these lessons to cultivate the strong person I am today so maybe being so wrapped up in the "pushing" from the family made me forget that I do have a choice. I needed reminders, thank you all !
Annette

[bluestflame]

love yourself FIRST~

[Reaver]

I never thought I would be confronted with something like this and I am at a complete loss at what to do. What is the right thing? Do I be a good daughter and take her on my already full plate, possibly sacrificing my goals and my sanity? Do I say no, and live with the guilt and probable backlash from her family? My aunt is already pushing me, my brother is also pushing me, and now my father (not with my mother since I was 1yr.) is also making me feel guilty !!! HELP ! I just want to do the right thing, not sure if that means the right thing by me, or by her. I have always handled my own problems but this is one I can’t seem to logically figure out. All advice is very much appreciated.
Thank you,
Annette
If you know that living with your mother is going to be a toxic experience for you and your children, why on earth would you even consider to take her in?

The fact of the matter is that some people on this planet are beyond "salvation" and some of those "lost" people can become parasites which feed on other people. I'm talking about psychological, emotional and spiritual parasites, the financial leeching is the least of my concerns.

Why is it that you feel guilt about telling her "No"? Is it because that's not the spiritual thing to do according to whatever teachings? is it because the rest of your family will label you as ungrateful? Is it because the social conditioning which demands you to be a "good daughter"? Those are the kind of questions you have to ask yourself and think about.

What to do? well you know what's best for you. You don't need anyone here to tell you what to do. The way I see it, you already answered your own question:


I am having serious reservations about taking this on for many reasons. The hard part is the guilt I am feeling over not wanting to do this.
Even my son (22) and daughter (25) are not liking this idea at all. We have all discussed this and ask the same questions over and over, what will she do all day? (she can’t drive) When she gets bored, she will start drinking again and all of us agree we can’t handle it when she drinks. We don’t have cable tv, she has old drinking buddies that live in Arizona, and Im afraid of coming home to finding these people in my home. Etc, etc. The list goes pretty long.
My biggest concern is my path of spirituality and how can I continue my path with her negative destructive nature? (I am the only AWAKE one in my family) I live a pretty strict schedule right now with difficulty in meditating daily as it is. I’m sharing my one vehicle with both my kids and do not ever take time off my 9-5 job. I live paycheck to paycheck and am trying my best to start preparing to move and live a simpler, more dedicated life with very serious goals in my spirituality and awakening. I want to focus on my path in a deeper way and so here I am, what do I do???
So you realize you'd have a harder time in financial terms and more important than the financial aspect, you realize you are gonna have to deal with a toxic person who in all likehood will hinder your own personal progress. The only thing holding you back -you said it yourself- are feelings of guilt for whatever number of reasons.

In my view there are people who are so ****ed up and who are so toxic that the best thing that could happen to them is hitting rock bottom or dying. In fact I think that lending a hand to those people is being uncompassionate because the only thing that you could accomplish is to make them dependent on you... and that's exactly what TPTB want because it provides a breeding ground for them and it also demoralizes the population. I rather see a person die (literally) than having them become completely dependent on me so that they can make their dull existence a little bit more bearable. Sure it may not be an easy thing to do, but you can't hope to see a better world if people go around supporting insane relationships.

Your family is going to try to put the weight of your mother's situation on you for many reasons. The most obvious is the social conditioning which demands them act in a certain way, I also suspect that those who have taken care of your mother are fed up with it... so they'll try to put pressure on you so they can get rid of her and they will invoke any sort of bull****, like telling you that you must do it because you are the eldest.

Ultimately it is a course of action that it's entirely up to you. You are the one who has to muster the courage to say no and you are the one who knows best how to deal with the consequences of whatever choice you end up making.

If I was going through a similar situation, I'd tell my family to shove it where the sun doesn't shine... but that's me.

[4evrneo]

I only have one question that I would ask: What changes is your mother doing to empower herself?

I'm glad you asked, I just sent off a letter yesterday asking her the very same question. I told her I needed honest answers to my questions before I would even consider this situation.
Im very sorry for your loss. I have always wanted to see my mother happy and not alone. She is an amazing woman when she is sober for any length of time, although it has been almost 15 years since I have witnessed it. I want to help her but I dont know that I can, and dont know if she is willing to help herself.
Thank you for sharing.

Blessings,
Annette

[Mark]

And if she is willing to help herself?

Sometimes the hardest love is the toughest love and the most necessary expression of love.

We all know that enabling is often easy but is not an expression of love.

Strict rules you can set down if she comes to stay? Boundaries? Consequences if she breaks the rules?

Getting out of the situation will be much harder than getting into it if things turn difficult ...

... but again, with the agreements. You sound like you are in a good and solid place with a firm idea of what your path is.

This is being offered to you at a very specific time in your life for a very specific reason as a growth opportunity regardless of the outcome.

What is the worst-case scenario, and could you deal with it if it happened?

[4evrneo]

You and your mother may have karmic agreements that you made to deal with old issues in this life and finally resolve them, and this might be the opportunity you both have set up to accomplish those goals.



This has been something that has been going through my mind as well.

Thank you for your post.

Blessings,
Annette

[4evrneo]

This is being offered to you at a very specific time in your life for a very specific reason as a growth opportunity regardless of the outcome.

What is the worst-case scenario, and could you deal with it if it happened?

Thank you for sharing your thoughts, your right, either way, opportunity abounds for growth and I have great reminders here and worst-case scenario is just another challenge that provides me with more choices.

Annette

[4evrneo]

I'm no Dr. Phil (LOL), but let me just toss two quick things at ya, Fred style. http://nexus.2012info.ca/forum/images/smilies/newadditions/smile.gif

1) If you dare to, try this. Spend a few minutes, and get your mind into a relaxed state. Then direct this simple question to yourself: "Is it for the highest good for all concerned, that I watch over my mother?" The first thought that comes to mind will be your answer, and it's not always a comfortable one.

2) If you decide that it's not in anyone's best interest to watch your mom, then let it all go, and stick to your truth. If anyone tries to lay the infamous guilt trip albatross around your neck, then f**k em, and go your own way.

Whichever decision you make will be the right one, trust yourself.

Lots of good energy heading your way!!!
Fred

Thank you Fred !
I am going to spend some time "trusting myself" right now, well, after I get off work. :nod:

Cheers,
Annette

[Rocky_Shorz]

my advice? She won't get better until she is responsible for helping others... it will help cast away her anchor...

contact these centers close to you and find one she can help with her free time, and they might swap living space for her efforts...

http://www.evadultresources.org/our-services/our-services.aspx

Home care for Seniors is a paid position even though being on a walker limits what she can do, CCV might be willing to help...

being from MN I know you are struggling on this one...

if you find a place for her, she will be close enough for you to drop in and keep an eye on her, without the stress, having friends will help her straighten out. In Arizona, you only pass out once in the sun and it's over...

[chancy]

Hello 4evrneo: I'm going a different route since we all love our parent(s) or supposedly we do! From your first post it sounds like all your family doesn't want to take your mom so they have put the guilt on you and you alone. Not a great spot to be in.
I can't speak much about alcoholism but my wifes family is pretty much made up of true alcoholics. (1 or 2 - 26's of vodka a day ) This is their lifestyle and it's not a pleasant one.
I asked her what she would do since she doesn't drink and has been around this all her life. Her words "DO NOT LET AN ALCOHOLIC IN MY HOUSE unless they are completely sober"
I came across this "cure using ibogaine" on project avalon but am not sure exactly where it is so I gave you a link to another article about it.

http://www.straight.com/article-115404/the-quest-for-the-ultimate-cure-for-addiction

I don't envy your situation but since you are awake then you will also know the best way for you to go. You have lived without your mom for years. You can live without her now too. You and your kids are more important to your great life now. She has got along without you and your kids in her life so what has changed? Unfortunately, people make choices that pick their family and friends. Living together will only make things worse for you and your kids.
IF your mom is willing to go to alcoholics anonymous and really quit then you have your answer.
Good luck and God Speed!
chancy

[DeDukshyn]

I would say to do two things:

-Forgive her all the wrong you have ever perceived to have been caused by her -- do this sincerely
-When I love someone enough, I tell them and do for them what is right - not what they want, in your case I would say no, I'm not interested in taking care of an alcoholic, but a recovering alcoholic - yes. Tell you mother this straight up - who knows, maybe you can alleviate many problems at once with some tough love.

This is what I would do, but I can be tough, but I always do it for the right reasons -- which is because I "love" -- not because I "hate"

Just my 2 cents.

[RunningDeer]

I only have one question that I would ask: What changes is your mother doing to empower herself?

I'm glad you asked, I just sent off a letter yesterday asking her the very same question. I told her I needed honest answers to my questions before I would even consider this situation.
Im very sorry for your loss. I have always wanted to see my mother happy and not alone. She is an amazing woman when she is sober for any length of time, although it has been almost 15 years since I have witnessed it. I want to help her but I dont know that I can, and dont know if she is willing to help herself.
Thank you for sharing.

Blessings,
Annette


I'm glad you asked, I just sent off a letter yesterday asking her the very same question. I told her I needed honest answers to my questions before I would even consider this situation.
Hi 4evrneo,

I like that you sent off the letter stating that you want to know 'before even considering", that way she is prepared for the possibility of, "Now, isn't a good time, Mom."

You've worked really hard on your own personal growth. You are all back together again as a family. Seems to me you've got a full house. You and your children need time to heal, lots of adjustments for you all. A second chance with them...that's kismet.

As for my sister, she comes around. We're cool. :wave:

Blessings,
WhiteCrowBlackDeer

[RunningDeer]

Getting out of the situation will be much harder than getting into it if things turn difficult ...
Yes! That's the sentence I was looking for. Phew...

[Flash]

karma this time around may be also to learn to say no

[RunningDeer]

karma this time around may also to learn to say no
Yes! Boundaries that speak to loving yourself.

[jackovesk]

This Family Quandary has comsumed me the last few weeks, so I submit to you fellow Avalonian's for some advice.

My mother, who has been an alcoholic all her life, and who has not been in my life for many years, suddenly wants to come stay with me.

So here is some background information. I have been on my own since I was 16, mainly because I could not live with a destructive alcoholic. I married and had 2 kids, then divorced 8 years later. Both my children were recently invited back into my life and home about 2 years ago due to them having financial difficulties. So it is me and my son and daughter in my home.

Ok, so mom’s history consists of living in Minnesota by herself and the past year or two has had several falling accidents due to intoxication that has left her using a walker and of course not working. My mom’s sister recently has put her into alcohol treatment 3 times in the last 2 years. She is currently waiting release from another treatment center in the next month or so.

My mother’s sister has been calling me and pushing this responsibility on me to take care of her, saying she has had enough of dealing with it and since I am her oldest child that I need to do it. I am having serious reservations about taking this on for many reasons. The hard part is the guilt I am feeling over not wanting to do this.

Even my son (22) and daughter (25) are not liking this idea at all. We have all discussed this and ask the same questions over and over, what will she do all day? (she can’t drive) When she gets bored, she will start drinking again and all of us agree we can’t handle it when she drinks. We don’t have cable tv, she has old drinking buddies that live in Arizona, and Im afraid of coming home to finding these people in my home. Etc, etc. The list goes pretty long.

My biggest concern is my path of spirituality and how can I continue my path with her negative destructive nature? (I am the only AWAKE one in my family) I live a pretty strict schedule right now with difficulty in meditating daily as it is. I’m sharing my one vehicle with both my kids and do not ever take time off my 9-5 job. I live paycheck to paycheck and am trying my best to start preparing to move and live a simpler, more dedicated life with very serious goals in my spirituality and awakening. I want to focus on my path in a deeper way and so here I am, what do I do???

I never thought I would be confronted with something like this and I am at a complete loss at what to do. What is the right thing? Do I be a good daughter and take her on my already full plate, possibly sacrificing my goals and my sanity? Do I say no, and live with the guilt and probable backlash from her family? My aunt is already pushing me, my brother is also pushing me, and now my father (not with my mother since I was 1yr.) is also making me feel guilty !!! HELP ! I just want to do the right thing, not sure if that means the right thing by me, or by her. I have always handled my own problems but this is one I can’t seem to logically figure out. All advice is very much appreciated.
Thank you,
Annette

*My apologies if I did not post this correctly as unfortunately this is my first post*

Hello 4evrneo,

Forgive me, but I think 'Whether or Not' you are aware...:confused:

You have already made the 'Right Decision' in 'Not' wanting to be burdened by a mother who saw fit to (DRINK) instead of doing what 99.9% of Mothers do and that is (Love & Support) their children no matter what..!

I have 'Highlighted in RED' all the reason's you yourself 'above' have had to weigh up, which really are self-explanatory...:yes4:

GUILT should only be taken on by the 'GUILTY' not by the 'Innocent'...:yes4:

I understand your need for sharing your potential 'Dilema' that has been forced upon you and your need support in your final decision from others...

In Summary

Now what you need to concentrate on is...

How you are going to break the news, that you are in absolutely no way able to take in your Alchoholic Mother ontop of providing (Love, Support & Shelter) to the 2 children who YOU never abandoned for a (Bottle of Booze)..!

I know my post above is abrupt & to the point, but you have already identified the 'Reasons' why you could'nt possibly entertain the idea of becoming your mothers inhome Nurse & Full-Time Carer...

I hope this helps you elivate that Unwarranted & Uneccessary 'Guilt-Trip' you are allowing to 'Fester in Your Mind' and finally say 'NO' and...

Move on "ONCE & FOR ALL"...:dance3: and leave the associated 'Guilt-Trip' to those who instigated it in the 1st place...!

Welcome to your 'New Life' free of the burdens you have allowed to 'Impede Your Growth' from that early age of a young 16 year old girl who desperately needed Love & Attention from a Mum who chose the bottle instead of her all those years ago..!

[RunningDeer]

jackovesk,...I'm likin' your red, white and blue advice. http://emoticoner.com/files/emoticons/smileys/big-smile2-smiley.gif (http://emoticoner.com)



This Family Quandary has comsumed me the last few weeks, so I submit to you fellow Avalonian's for some advice.

My mother, who has been an alcoholic all her life, and who has not been in my life for many years, suddenly wants to come stay with me.

So here is some background information. I have been on my own since I was 16, mainly because I could not live with a destructive alcoholic. I married and had 2 kids, then divorced 8 years later. Both my children were recently invited back into my life and home about 2 years ago due to them having financial difficulties. So it is me and my son and daughter in my home.

Ok, so mom’s history consists of living in Minnesota by herself and the past year or two has had several falling accidents due to intoxication that has left her using a walker and of course not working. My mom’s sister recently has put her into alcohol treatment 3 times in the last 2 years. She is currently waiting release from another treatment center in the next month or so.

My mother’s sister has been calling me and pushing this responsibility on me to take care of her, saying she has had enough of dealing with it and since I am her oldest child that I need to do it. I am having serious reservations about taking this on for many reasons. The hard part is the guilt I am feeling over not wanting to do this.

Even my son (22) and daughter (25) are not liking this idea at all. We have all discussed this and ask the same questions over and over, what will she do all day? (she can’t drive) When she gets bored, she will start drinking again and all of us agree we can’t handle it when she drinks. We don’t have cable tv, she has old drinking buddies that live in Arizona, and Im afraid of coming home to finding these people in my home. Etc, etc. The list goes pretty long.

My biggest concern is my path of spirituality and how can I continue my path with her negative destructive nature? (I am the only AWAKE one in my family) I live a pretty strict schedule right now with difficulty in meditating daily as it is. I’m sharing my one vehicle with both my kids and do not ever take time off my 9-5 job. I live paycheck to paycheck and am trying my best to start preparing to move and live a simpler, more dedicated life with very serious goals in my spirituality and awakening. I want to focus on my path in a deeper way and so here I am, what do I do???

I never thought I would be confronted with something like this and I am at a complete loss at what to do. What is the right thing? Do I be a good daughter and take her on my already full plate, possibly sacrificing my goals and my sanity? Do I say no, and live with the guilt and probable backlash from her family? My aunt is already pushing me, my brother is also pushing me, and now my father (not with my mother since I was 1yr.) is also making me feel guilty !!! HELP ! I just want to do the right thing, not sure if that means the right thing by me, or by her. I have always handled my own problems but this is one I can’t seem to logically figure out. All advice is very much appreciated.
Thank you,
Annette

*My apologies if I did not post this correctly as unfortunately this is my first post*

Hello 4evrneo,

Forgive me, but I think whether or not you are aware..? You have already made the 'Right Decision' in 'Not' wanting to be burdened by a mother who saw fit to (DRINK) instead of doing what 99.9% of Mothers do and that is (Love & Support) their children no matter what..!

I have 'Highlighted in RED' all the reason's you yourself have had to weigh up, which really are self-explanatory...:yes4:

GUILT should only be taken on by the 'GUILTY' not by the 'Innocent'...:yes4:

I understand your need for sharing your potential 'Dilema' that has been forced upon you and your need support in your final decision from others...

In Summary

Now what you need to concentrate on is...

How you are going to break the news, that you are in absolutely no way able to take in your Alchoholic Mother ontop of providing (Love, Support & Shelter) to the 2 children who YOU never abandoned for a (Bottle of Booze)..!

I know my post above is abrupt & to the point, but you have already identified the 'Reasons' why you could'nt possibly entertain the idea of becoming your mothers inhome Nurse & Full-Time Carer...

I hope this helps you elivate that Unwarranted & Uneccessary 'Guilt-Trip' you are allowing to 'Fester in Your Mind' and finally say 'NO' and...

Move on "ONCE & FOR ALL"...:dance3: and leave the associated 'Guilt-Trip' to those who instigated it in the 1st place...!

Welcome to your 'New Life' free of the burdens you have allowed to 'Impede Your Growth' from that early age of a young 16 year old girl who desperately needed Love & Attention from a Mum who chose the bottle instead of her all those years ago..!

[another bob]

You and your mother may have karmic agreements that you made to deal with old issues in this life and finally resolve them, and this might be the opportunity you both have set up to accomplish those goals.



This has been something that has been going through my mind as well.

Thank you for your post.

Blessings,
Annette

A couple further thoughts:

In terms of consequences, make sure there is a clear alternative for her, should she fail to keep her agreements. For example, if it is a facility, take her to it beforehand, just so she gets a concrete idea of what would await her lack of compliance.

Also, there is a remarkable group of folks right here at Avalon, the Village, who gather at the Here & Now thread. You can call on them for assistance, since they have a number of powerful remote healers who can work with you and your mother on the subtle plane to affect positive outcomes.

Blessings!

[CD7]

A lot of great advice! Avalon--- come to us with your issues and problems.... :couch2:



Wow i empathize with your situation!...ive been a single mother of two boys...not a cake walk in itself. Have not experienced having an addictive relative stay with me, but as ive read from people with this experience, it comes with challenges.


Few questions come to mind....you said you havent spent time with your mom in many years...how long ago? Is she the same person you knew back then? Have you spent any length of time with her lately?

If she did come to stay with you...discuss expectations beforehand then express that she would need to leave if the expectations were ignored. Also have a plan B if it were to fall through.

This to me would alleviate the stress head on, instead of enduring the anxt and have the situation drag out

I know you dont have the best experiences/memories with your mom, i could imagine that would be hard. I could see the guilt thing coming in (but i would call it empathy--not guilt), i would have empathy--not so much "guilt". If a friend needed to stay somewhere and asked to stay with me...i feel i would give them a chance IF i had the ABILITY to do so and set up the expectations beforehand and they were agreed upon. My 2 sense!!

[truth4me]

You do without a doubt have a full plate. The only thing I can say if they are grown and don't want to really help themselves then IMO cut them loose as far as Karma you can drive yourself nuts trying to figure that one out. I've cut any ties with people that are grown and want to stay drunk or high. I'm no better then anyone but if someone wants to keep up their habits thats on them but I'm not paying for them money wise or emotionally ether....

[Davidallany]

There is an 80 percent chance that whatever you fear will materialize. Do not allow anyone to be a distraction to you, in the mean time have patience, for those who give us problems are good teachers. At some point a line must be drawn though.

[Rocky_Shorz]

we helped a lot with that decision...

about 50/50 yes/no...

glad we could help... ;)

[waves]

The thought that occurs to me first is... you already know exactly how this would turn out - exactly like it has over and over for years and exactly like it did with your other siblings. The end result before having to kick her out would mean that you will end up pretty much where you started now with the exact same pattern of misery for everyone in between.

Letting her repeat that pattern again under your roof of making a lot of promises to change could be considered enabling. I have enabled people many times and it wasn't until I took the tough love approach and made the other party deliver promises first instead of me delivering first on their promises, that somehow the other person suddenly got 'empowered' to find the motivation to finally change.

In this case, I guess the tough love approach would be making her be sober for at least a year or something before providing another avoidance cushion for her.

I also know this is very surface advice not really knowing the people involved, so best wishes, just my 2cents.

[TelosianEmbrace]

You and your mother may have karmic agreements that you made to deal with old issues in this life and finally resolve them, and this might be the opportunity you both have set up to accomplish those goals.



This has been something that has been going through my mind as well.

Thank you for your post.

Blessings,
Annette

My understanding and experience is that if there is a karmic agreement that needs to be played through, then it will slap you in the face and you will have no choice but to live through it no matter what decision you make. You make your choices according to who you are and what you believe, and karma will take care of itself very nicely, thank you very much.

[Sidney]

I would say " just say no. That is my advise. But my real advise is that you already know the answer.:wizard:

[ginnyk]

Hello, my heart hurts for your experience. My first thought is to suggest you speak with some kind of support group in your area. Al Anon would probably be a good place to start. They will probably reiterate that only you can choose to feel guilt. No one else can make you feel guilty.

It is easy to go down the path of karmic lessons, but when we get to the fork in the road, it's hard to know which way to turn. Maybe the lesson is for you to say NO. Maybe the lesson is to put your children first this time; the list can go on and on. We can only guess and the consequences are so grave. Having had the experience of a husband with that problem many years ago, my personal advice is to stand strong and don't let her into your home. Sometimes the greatest love is to realize that she is living her experience, and to allow her Higher Self to guide her through it.

My best wishes for a good resolution for you and your family.

Ginny

[Sierra]

Whoa Annette. It is not anyone's responsibility to take on an alcoholic that is drinking. It will trash you, your children, your home, your free time, your sleep, your car, your furniture and present you with lots of expensive emergencies at very uncomfortable hours.

You know this. :) And you've just remembered you have choices. This is SO good! :becky:

RUN from that family of yours guilt tripping you for very very selfish reasons. Consider the big lesson from your family, is that no one can handle an alcoholic.

Set your boundaries. Boundaries are good. Boundaries are wicked good ...

Sierra

[ghostrider]

You put up with what you allow. set the guidlines for your home, if they are met, let karma take it's course, if they are broken, enforce the rules. My stepson tried to kill himself seven times, and was an alcoholic, severe drug addict , and always felt less than. Showing unconditional firm love, but with boundaries has made him finally a stable and happy person. I wish you well. If you have a doubt don't do it. Your inner self will help you make the desicion that is already set in motion.

[ED209]

I am so sorry to hear that you are going through this. I know how hard it is and have been there and done that myself. My own mum was an alcoholic. She died young and sick because of her addiction. She drank horribly and it was an absolute nightmare for everyone in my family. She really tortured us emotionally with her drunk behaviors. She really caused a lot of pain for those that loved her. Eventually, I started turning her away almost always and did not help her with things because I thought it enabled her drinking. Or I would help her, but I would give her ultimatums like she was a child. In the end, she actually died trying to QUIT her drinking. I did not know this until it was too late, but complete cessation of alcoholic consumption by a true addict can result in fatal seizures. Now that my mother is gone, I wish I had just let her in my life regardless if how much she drank. I know that she was doing the best she could do. I know that there are physiological and psychological and social and economic reasons that she drank herself numb. I know that nobody and I do mean nobody can love you the way your own mother does and that I feel that loss deeply now that I don't have one. I know that adults, even drunk adults have a right to self-determination and that they have the human right to decide what is best for themselves. I completely regret not biting the bullet to just letting her stay with me. I would prefer to have at least attempted to help her rather than look back and know that I did not do everything possible. I don't want to give advice one way or the other. Only you know what is best for you and yours, but I do have empathy for you and your mom. If it were me, I would invite her to stay, and then do everything possible to help her find her own place as soon as possible. A temporary stay seems like a good compromise. Ultimately you would be helping her most not by letting her live with you permanently, but by helping her find the freedom of her own place while offering her the security of love when she falls off the wagon. This is not the easy solution, but you can see why I would choose it in hindsight. It is very easy to see all if the good in people after they are dead, and much easier to see the bad. Maybe you can actively look for the good in her and maybe that will help you reframe this situation. If your mom is a true alcoholic, she could die from drinking AND from trying to quit. You have to do what whatever it is that you can live with after she dies. Sorry to lay all of that on you. I really, really do understand what you are going through. The loss, regret, pain, saddness, and guilt that I feel now far surpasses the anger and unwanted sacrifice I felt while dealing with my mom's drinking while she was alive. I hope you do not end up in the same situation.

[markpierre]

Your mother's sister knows full well what she's asking you to do and what you'll be in for. I don't think it would take a whole lot of pretending for her to get to her own truth,
that she was foolish and NOT 'doing the right thing' in supporting your mother's refusal to take responsibility for herself. Ask your aunt if she regrets it. Ask your aunt if she thinks it's right for you to
do what from her experience, you'll regret. That's a bit obvious isn't it?

Reaver mentioned this; If your mother chooses to recover it will need to be after finding a true bottom, which is what virtually all alcoholics have to experience. It's not such a bad thing. If it's in her to recover, then let her find it.
I'd recommend that experience to everyone. Anyone could benefit. It's a massive step towards awakening. You might draw some parallels from your own experiences of awakening.
You take that opportunity away when you care-take. Your mother isn't the helpless human identity that she pretends to be, any more than you owe her something for her making the choices she did.
Or the way she had it planned all along. Do you know her Soul agenda? Don't interfere. Tell your family to stop interfering.

If your mother's choice is to die of alcoholism, then don't take that choice away from her either. She's not alive in her present condition. If she dies of neglect, she's died of alcoholism.
Don't be fooled. Your mother won't be, regardless of what she tells her enablers.
It sounds harsh, I know. Until the choice is life or death you won't make a choice. Not making a choice to live is what the alcohol is sedating.

What you do is your business, but 'being responsible' is sadly warped in this culture. You're not guilty for what you feel, you're honest. That's a step toward 'reality' isn't it? Getting true
with everything. And truer and truer and truer.

You could also take it on with the intention of seeing what you can learn, or healing your past with that influence. It won't necessarily be about what you could imagine.
What's interesting is that it's put you in a position of making a difficult choice, with what seems like intolerable consequences either way.
Those kinds of situations are where miracles can occur. That could be invisible to everyone, and quantum for you. The dilemma has been given to you,
so it must be about you.

I'm only offering you what I know from my perspective as an alcoholic. By way of advice I would only suggest that you you allow yourself to go into the devastation that you feel and stay there until it lifts.
It's not so different from that 'bottoming' experience. Until you've opened and overcome your ideas about guilt and betrayal and family issues, you won't feel clear about any decision. That's the sort of freedom you're craving.

I really wish you the best. I think you'll find the real 'right' decision. Your own awakening is the single most important obligation that you have. That could look like anything.

[778 neighbour of some guy]

AB quote


One would be to get power of attorney, and assume control of her finances. Furthermore, you can have a pre-screening interview in which your children participate, and which rules of behavior are established, as well as consequences for infringement. In other words, you would be offering her a probationary period, and if she repeatedly abuses your hospitality, you can forewarn her that she will be refused the privilege of staying with you.

Tadaaaaaaaaaah,

And under no circumstance let yourself be blackmailed into a guilt trip, this may sound very harsh to you but i deal with these cases very frequently, and as a rule of thumb it is three strikes a stiff talk and/or youre out, if she wants to drink no matter what, thats up to her, there is nothing much you can to about that, she can always move in with her drinking buddies, i do not consider alcholism as a disease as many people do but rather a coping mechanism, the root of her problem may very well have nothing to do with you whatsoever but only added to a situation she could not handle in the first place.

Its up to you how you are going to handle this situation, but it sounds like a tough one since she has no means of transport is in poor health mental and physical, but no matter what, do not get involved/respond in/at imposed emotional blackmail by ANY third party.


Its like Another Bob said, when you decide to take your mother in you have to discuss your issues of her doing so in a way that leaves her no misunderstanding of the consequences of making your life any harder and you do not appriciate guilt trips imposed on you, making sure the current state of her finances does not affect you is also very important.

[778 neighbour of some guy]

This Family Quandary has comsumed me the last few weeks, so I submit to you fellow Avalonian's for some advice.

My mother, who has been an alcoholic all her life, and who has not been in my life for many years, suddenly wants to come stay with me.

So here is some background information. I have been on my own since I was 16, mainly because I could not live with a destructive alcoholic. I married and had 2 kids, then divorced 8 years later. Both my children were recently invited back into my life and home about 2 years ago due to them having financial difficulties. So it is me and my son and daughter in my home.
Ok, so mom’s history consists of living in Minnesota by herself and the past year or two has had several falling accidents due to intoxication that has left her using a walker and of course not working. My mom’s sister recently has put her into alcohol treatment 3 times in the last 2 years. She is currently waiting release from another treatment center in the next month or so. My mother’s sister has been calling me and pushing this responsibility on me to take care of her, saying she has had enough of dealing with it and since I am her oldest child that I need to do it. I am having serious reservations about taking this on for many reasons. The hard part is the guilt I am feeling over not wanting to do this.
Even my son (22) and daughter (25) are not liking this idea at all. We have all discussed this and ask the same questions over and over, what will she do all day? (she can’t drive) When she gets bored, she will start drinking again and all of us agree we can’t handle it when she drinks. We don’t have cable tv, she has old drinking buddies that live in Arizona, and Im afraid of coming home to finding these people in my home. Etc, etc. The list goes pretty long.
My biggest concern is my path of spirituality and how can I continue my path with her negative destructive nature? (I am the only AWAKE one in my family) I live a pretty strict schedule right now with difficulty in meditating daily as it is. I’m sharing my one vehicle with both my kids and do not ever take time off my 9-5 job. I live paycheck to paycheck and am trying my best to start preparing to move and live a simpler, more dedicated life with very serious goals in my spirituality and awakening. I want to focus on my path in a deeper way and so here I am, what do I do???

I never thought I would be confronted with something like this and I am at a complete loss at what to do. What is the right thing? Do I be a good daughter and take her on my already full plate, possibly sacrificing my goals and my sanity? Do I say no, and live with the guilt and probable backlash from her family? My aunt is already pushing me, my brother is also pushing me, and now my father (not with my mother since I was 1yr.) is also making me feel guilty !!! HELP ! I just want to do the right thing, not sure if that means the right thing by me, or by her. I have always handled my own problems but this is one I can’t seem to logically figure out. All advice is very much appreciated.
Thank you,
Annette

*My apologies if I did not post this correctly as unfortunately this is my first post*


There is no selfish word in this whole post whatsoever, she should be lucky to have you, you are a good daughter already.

Great first post.

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Indeed. It is a difficult situation that, one that fills you quite understandably with dread, but it requires that in your spiritual awareness there is an obligation to help.

You could fulfill both the obligation to her, and take care of any guilt by doing your best to try. Even if it is one trip up there (or her coming to visit you), just for a few days, a week or two...

If she responds, at least makes an effort to meet you half way, then great. And she will if there is 1% of her or more that is asking for help. If there is 0%, and she is locked wholly into that pattern of alcoholism and has no desire to break free of it, then sadly there is nothing more you can do.

That will be the time to part company unfortunately, but you can do so with your conscience in tact.

Fond wishes, and best of luck!

[Doctor]

She was destructive then, and she will be destructive now.

I am all too familiar with your situation. I'm 25 and haven't heard from my father since I moved out of his house 10 years ago. Living with him was crushing my every being and when I moved out, it was like the biggest breath of fresh air. Just because you are her daughter, doesn't mean it's your responsibility to take care of her. SHE IS AN ADULT and has clearly not made any adult decisions.....well, ever, it would seem. I put myself in your shoes and say 10 to 20 years from now, if family tried pushing me to take that responsibility, I would decline. I would not let ANYONE guilt trip me, because I know people would and that's the same for you.

I just don't see how this situation could work out in your family's favor. She needs to be in special care where professionals can take care of her, not with you and your family, who ALL do not agree with her presence.

[Flash]

If it is any help, let me give you some of my experience

I have a brother, a lovely heart, who is a drug addict. Our family altogether must have put over 200,000$ to help him in all kind of therapies, his will was there, he wanted to get out but yet, would always fall back.

He ended up in jail for a few years, having cultivated weed and sell it in order to pay for his cocaine (he said he would never sell this crap and get other caught like him, but weed was not that addictive and mostly not that damageable - weird ethics, but nevertheless some ethics there).

When it was time to get out on parole, the parole board would not let him out if he did not have a place to go. So I accepted to take him, knowing very well that:

1. It could impact on my young daughter who already had learning difficulties at school and needed a lot of therapeutic follow up, etc
2. It not only could, but would impact on my revenues because I would not be able to work in some firms that need a basic security clearance (I work on contracts). As well, I would probably have to pay some extras which would impact on my overall revenues and futur.
3. It could as well jeopardize relations with some members of my family if they do not agree with what I do for him.

I set for him and told the parole board very definit conditions (they set me some as well)

1. Absolutely no drugs in the house, around the house, in him while in my house, in him while living at my place and no friends in those conditions
2. No jail friends
4. He had to work to pay for his rent, either outside, or in the house. As he could not find a job easily outside, I ask him to repaint my house and evaluated his salary on an hourly basis. I would give him pocket money but the rest would be exchanged for room and board. We agreed on the value of this work. I should mention here that it was not absolutely necessary to paint the house, but I did it to ensure that he had self respect and would not feel he owe me something and that I would not feel either he owe me something. I was not comfortable budget wise but still did it.
5. If any of the above were not respected, he was out (and probably back in jail)

So he painted most of my house, repaired my bathroom, extended my kitchen counter (he is very good handiman, this guy has talents but is caught with real emotional and addiction problems), it cost me a lot financially to keep him working (I had to pay for the material which was not planned in the year's budget and his pocket money and his cigarettes).

Then one weekend, he went away and came back 4 days later completely washed out, dirty, etc. So I gave one warning and you know, when he is like that, he is not the most pleasant person. He would never steal or hit, but verbally he could be negative and agressive.
He remained depressed for 2 weeks, then came back to his normal self (a sweet heart when normal), to get away again for another spree of coke.

Came back again negative and verbally unpleasant, another warning. By this time, my daughter who loves him dearly was starting to react and feel bad because of the negativity. He came back to himself again after two weeks just to start again. Third warning plus explanations at lenght of the impact he had on me and my dauhgter through his negative behavior. Explanations he would not want to listen to but I made sure he would (looking direct in his eye, very few sentences but with absolute impact, without agressivity on my part).

Finally, his time on probation was up and he went for another spree of coke. He came back, I said nothing, two days later he made a fit telling me that I WAS UNFAIR, not paying him direct money for his work and that I was quite bitchy when warning etc and that he would leave in one week because of it. I understood that he could not face himself at that time, and let him depart. He knew very well that if he did not take the initiative himself, I would have thrown him out. So I thank him for having gone by himself.

Now, years later, he moved away from the city to be away from drugs. He still have some binges, but much less frequently. Once in a while he still come to repair my house, for which I pay him entirely - sometimes he keeps the money, sometimes he goes on binges.

In order to have a brother who is more or less ok, I did have to kind of throw him out, and I never let him out of the hook of self responsibility.

I was in a similar situation to yours, alone raising my daughter.

Would I do it again??? Probably not. Do I regret?? No because the impact was very much financial and less emotional, but as it was starting to impact on my daughter, I did not accept that at all.

However, the financial impact was hefty, believe me (it will impact on my retirement and did impact on my daughter treatments).

I am not sure your mother would have this minimal level of self responsiblities my brother had. Anything less than that would have made my input unreasonable and unhealty for my child and me.

[4evrneo]

A lot of great advice! Avalon--- come to us with your issues and problems.... :couch2:


Few questions come to mind....you said you havent spent time with your mom in many years...how long ago? Is she the same person you knew back then? Have you spent any length of time with her lately?



Actually, my boyfriend did something very nice for me last year, paid for her ticket to come visit for a couple weeks. Before that it had been 6 years since I seen her last. It was stressful to say the least. A day after she arrived she wanted to drink. I said no, the next day, we (me and kids and her) were out shopping and she disappeared to go to the "bathroom". Later that night, I noticed she was different. Next morning I was getting clothes from my room for work (I let her stay in my room while visiting) and I found a bottle of vodka. I tossed it out but a day or two later I found her with a bottle of NyQuill (with alcohol) she was claiming she was sick. She also was begging my daughter to take her to the store to get her a bottle. So yes, I have spent time with her and I couldnt wait to send her home. Sigh..........

Thanks for posting,
Annette

[Lone Bean]

Al-Anon Al-Anon Al-Anon........call them and attend meetings. They will know exactly what you should do. Al-Anon! :)

[Paranormal]

A lot of great advice! Avalon--- come to us with your issues and problems.... :couch2:


Few questions come to mind....you said you havent spent time with your mom in many years...how long ago? Is she the same person you knew back then? Have you spent any length of time with her lately?



Actually, my boyfriend did something very nice for me last year, paid for her ticket to come visit for a couple weeks. Before that it had been 6 years since I seen her last. It was stressful to say the least. A day after she arrived she wanted to drink. I said no, the next day, we (me and kids and her) were out shopping and she disappeared to go to the "bathroom". Later that night, I noticed she was different. Next morning I was getting clothes from my room for work (I let her stay in my room while visiting) and I found a bottle of vodka. I tossed it out but a day or two later I found her with a bottle of NyQuill (with alcohol) she was claiming she was sick. She also was begging my daughter to take her to the store to get her a bottle. So yes, I have spent time with her and I couldnt wait to send her home. Sigh..........

Thanks for posting,
Annette

Wow, this is a wonderful thread! What have you decided to do about your mom? I'm asking as there's many other choices that doing "everything" or "nothing" and maybe you chose something in the middle - e.g. to do a few little things for her.

[4evrneo]

Paranormal,
I have quite decided as of yet. Will be finding that answer in the next few days hopefully.
I will definitely post that decision soon.

Best wishes,
Annette

Update*
Well, I was contacted from a social worker of my mothers today. She told me that my mother has legally had her rights taken away some time ago and was ordered by the courts to continue treatment. I had no knowledge of this and had no idea that it was not her decision to move and come stay with me. By the conversation I had with social worker today, she will not be allowed to come here because I would not be able to provide the care (daily transportation to her therapy)that she needs.
It looks like the universe has asnswered. I meditated frequently "if it is for the good of all for her to come here then let it be so".
This confirms to me that the universe is listening.
I am sad that her choices have led to this point in her life but I am confident it is ultimately for her safety and her greatest good.

Blessings,
Annette

[Paranormal]

Paranormal,
I have quite decided as of yet. Will be finding that answer in the next few days hopefully.
I will definitely post that decision soon.

Best wishes,
Annette

Update*
Well, I was contacted from a social worker of my mothers today. She told me that my mother has legally had her rights taken away some time ago and was ordered by the courts to continue treatment. I had no knowledge of this and had no idea that it was not her decision to move and come stay with me. By the conversation I had with social worker today, she will not be allowed to come here because I would not be able to provide the care (daily transportation to her therapy)that she needs.
It looks like the universe has asnswered. I meditated frequently "if it is for the good of all for her to come here then let it be so".
This confirms to me that the universe is listening.
I am sad that her choices have led to this point in her life but I am confident it is ultimately for her safety and her greatest good.

Blessings,
Annette

Indeed, the universe is listening!