Another view of the Out of Body experience.

[Tony]

This is just another view of the Out of Body experience.


Living Enlightened Master, Acharya Shree Yogeesh sheds light on the topic of Near Death Experiences.

Many have experienced near death experiences during surgery, operations, or even in accidents. People may experience white light, or a vision of God or Jesus, and when they return they believe that guru, or Christ, is the only way to live.

Near Death experiences are real to the person, however, the visions they see reflect the beliefs and ideologies of that persons mind.

If a person experiences a near death experience and believe in Jesus, they will see Jesus. If they believe in a Guru, they will see that spiritual guru.

The True near death experience is when soul realizes itself and others. That soul does not need a body to feel, hear, touch, and see. This is the true near death experience. The others are mostly false, because they are still trapped by the mind.

If anything, hopefully those that experience being close to death, will become better in society.



NSEFprv3Xo0

[Carmody]

(the light..also has a 'sound'....) (having personally dealt with it more than a few times)

[ROMANWKT]

Hi Tony I had just downloaded the video and shall watch it, but by what you have said is exactly what I have been saying that you should not mix mindscape as spiritual, its not, it your mind at work with this matrix and no other, you go there with all your programmed beliefs that are in your subconscious, nothing to do with spiritual nonsense, another invention.

Regards and thank you Tony

roman

[Tony]

Hi Tony I had just downloaded the video and shall watch it, but by what you have said is exactly what I have been saying that you should not mix mindscape as spiritual, its not, it your mind at work with this matrix and no other, you go there with all your programmed beliefs that are in your subconscious, nothing to do with spiritual nonsense, another invention.

Regards and thank you Tony

roman


You are right, we are governed by our beliefs. What we believe we see. What we believe we create. What we believe becomes our cage.
We get caught by our own psychology.



Nice chatting,
Tony

[sirdipswitch]

Hey Tony!!! You found my favorite Guru!!! I found him 10 years ago, and watched all of his videos. I could never find disagreement with anything I heard him say, and now that I have went Astral myself, I find that he is truely that whcih he says. A Living Enlightened Master. He was one of the reasons for my obsession with going Astral, and achieving communion with my High Self/Source. :wizard:

[greybeard]

This is just another view of the Out of Body experience.


Living Enlightened Master, Acharya Shree Yogeesh sheds light on the topic of Near Death Experiences.

Many have experienced near death experiences during surgery, operations, or even in accidents. People may experience white light, or a vision of God or Jesus, and when they return they believe that guru, or Christ, is the only way to live.

Near Death experiences are real to the person, however, the visions they see reflect the beliefs and ideologies of that persons mind.

If a person experiences a near death experience and believe in Jesus, they will see Jesus. If they believe in a Guru, they will see that spiritual guru.

The True near death experience is when soul realizes itself and others. That soul does not need a body to feel, hear, touch, and see. This is the true near death experience. The others are mostly false, because they are still trapped by the mind.

If anything, hopefully those that experience being close to death, will become better in society.



NSEFprv3Xo0


Hi Tony
This Dr in the video--- had completely lost faith before the killer illness and anyway his belief system was totally obliterated as the video shows.
I accept though that normally belief system plays a big part in the experience.
This is an exception.

Proof Of Heaven: A Neurosurgeon's Journey Into The Afterlife.

Regards Chris





http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOSb3G53HsA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOSb3G53HsA

[BrianEn]

I spent 5 weeks in an induced coma last year, and there are somethings that I can't figure out. Why did I know what the cleaner looked like? Why did I know what the icu look like? I had many dreams most which I'll never figure out. The only explanation was that I did spend some time out of my body having a look around and incorporating it all into dream form, but I don't know that either.

[TraineeHuman]

... is exactly what I have been saying that you should not mix mindscape as spiritual, its not, it your mind at work with this matrix and no other, you go there with all your programmed beliefs that are in your subconscious, nothing to do with spiritual nonsense, another invention. ...


I basically agree with Acharya Shree Rogeesh and Roman that everything except Source is, strictly speaking, an illusion.

Let's not forget that includes the entire physical world, too.
Not just the worlds that some adventurous people manage to astral travel in.

I'm not going to step out into busy, speeding traffic on a freeway, just because my body is an illusion and the freeway is likewise.

Nor am I going to scoff at anybody who has the courage and the curiosity and the consciousness to astral travel. Although, as I've said a number of times in my current thread on OBEs already, it's far preferable to OB travel without any body at all. Personally, though, I'm sure not going to "advise" people they are misguided just because they're learning to astral travel!

As I'm currently playing the 3D physical game, I honor all the rules of that game. I've freely chosen to support and co-create the illusion.
But I do stilll know that it is an illusion, and that most of what's really important therefore lies "elsewhere".

[Youniverse]

This is just another view of the Out of Body experience.


Living Enlightened Master, Acharya Shree Yogeesh sheds light on the topic of Near Death Experiences.

Many have experienced near death experiences during surgery, operations, or even in accidents. People may experience white light, or a vision of God or Jesus, and when they return they believe that guru, or Christ, is the only way to live.

Near Death experiences are real to the person, however, the visions they see reflect the beliefs and ideologies of that persons mind.

If a person experiences a near death experience and believe in Jesus, they will see Jesus. If they believe in a Guru, they will see that spiritual guru.

The True near death experience is when soul realizes itself and others. That soul does not need a body to feel, hear, touch, and see. This is the true near death experience. The others are mostly false, because they are still trapped by the mind.

If anything, hopefully those that experience being close to death, will become better in society.



NSEFprv3Xo0


Hi Tony
This Dr in the video--- had completely lost faith before the killer illness and anyway his belief system was totally obliterated as the video shows.
I accept though that normally belief system plays a big part in the experience.
This is an exception.

Proof Of Heaven: A Neurosurgeon's Journey Into The Afterlife.

Regards Chris





http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOSb3G53HsA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOSb3G53HsA

I just finished reading "Proof of Heaven" a few days ago. A fantastic book! I loved it! I felt it was an especially significant account of an NDE(I actually would change it to DE because I believe many of these people really do "die") because of the kind of person that experienced it. It is implied by Eben Alexander, and also was apparent to me, that he was "chosen" by a higher power to have this experience and be the messenger that he is. I've also read "Evidence of the Afterlife" by Jeffrey Long and Alexander's story seems consistent with many of the NDE's reported there. These books and their first-person accounts remind me a great deal of the experiences of volunteers in Rick Strassman's research, illustrated in "DMT - The Spirit Molecule." And yes there seems to be some kind of barrier where a person crosses completely our of the realm or vibration of mind and into the spiritual realm. This is also written about in the "Tibetan Book of the Dead" and the progression through the bardos. All very compelling stuff!

[soleil]

i am having a hard time hearing this video, is there a better version?

[Carmody]

I spent 5 weeks in an induced coma last year, and there are somethings that I can't figure out. Why did I know what the cleaner looked like? Why did I know what the icu look like? I had many dreams most which I'll never figure out. The only explanation was that I did spend some time out of my body having a look around and incorporating it all into dream form, but I don't know that either.

Now you're getting it..... (right brain, non linear, outside of time)

[Carmody]

... is exactly what I have been saying that you should not mix mindscape as spiritual, its not, it your mind at work with this matrix and no other, you go there with all your programmed beliefs that are in your subconscious, nothing to do with spiritual nonsense, another invention. ...


I basically agree with Acharya Shree Rogeesh and Roman that everything except Source is, strictly speaking, an illusion.

Let's not forget that includes the entire physical world, too.
Not just the worlds that some adventurous people manage to astral travel in.

I'm not going to step out into busy, speeding traffic on a freeway, just because my body is an illusion and the freeway is likewise.

Nor am I going to scoff at anybody who has the courage and the curiosity and the consciousness to astral travel. Although, as I've said a number of times in my current thread on OBEs already, it's far preferable to OB travel without any body at all. Personally, though, I'm sure not going to "advise" people they are misguided just because they're learning to astral travel!

As I'm currently playing the 3D physical game, I honor all the rules of that game. I've freely chosen to support and co-create the illusion.
But I do stilll know that it is an illusion, and that most of what's really important therefore lies "elsewhere".

Stage one is the duality form coming along for the ride, as that is the viewpoint that 'we' (individually incarnated humans) tend to begin -from, and this given inter-dimensional data is being passed back -to.

Later comes the disposal of the human shaping/reflection of the given intelligently organized energies, as you seem to be speaking about.

[huyi82]

it's quite interesting that this topic came along, i was watching a youtube video the other day about christians saying that they had a near death experience and they saw "hell" but really all they are seeing is intoxication from their beliefs that they have been taught since birth to believe in that is why they see this stuff, nothing more too it.

all over the world people have near death experiences and they always have a experience depending on their spiritual beliefs, but the major question is what does a sceptic see when they have a NDE?
because the religious beliefs are stored in the subconscious mind because of the way they pray to their gurus throughout their life, so could these NDE's be connected to their brain then? what happens when you are completely dead when the brain is not functioning do you still have a experience depending on your religion that you had on earth?

it's similar to how we dream depending on what we do during the day our dreams will reflect that when we sleep or what is on our mind when we dream it always shows itself in your dreams, i think these NDE experiences work in the same way that is why i think they are connected to our subconscious brain.

so we will never know what happens after we die when we are completely separate from our bodies and no longer alive, imo i think the higher ups know about this and play along with the illusions to keep us trapped here in this matrix prison, for example when people "see" jesus it could be something else yes it may have heavenly light but it doesn't mean it's a part of the heavens it could be anything we don't know how the afterlife works at all.

also it all connects with the false tunnel of light that we see in a NDE (i think they are soul catchers), i'm sure you have heard of them, they look all blissful but they could be something else, who knows, it just adds to the major puzzle as to why we are here.

anyways this is all just my thoughts on the subject, feel free to disagree or agree it's up to you.

[Tony]

Sentient beings whether in or out of a body (form or formless) are caught up in conceptual relative truth. Meaning have not realised their ultimate true nature, which is Empty (pure) in essence, cognisant in nature and unconfined compassion. Being out of the body does not mean one is free of ignorance, one is just free of a body for a while, this is until one is driven by one's karma to take on a new body. In fact a body anchors or grounds us which is fortunate...'if', you find a human body!

We are pure knowing compassionate space. Any action in this space, contaminates the continuity of this pure essence, and grasping occurs. Meaning we are still clinging to a mental image of 'me'!

Spiritual pursuit, is going beyond the temporary existence of body and mind. “Being' spiritual, is beyond any 'state' it is timeless awareness – enlightened. Enlightened is not any thing, it is knowing one's true being, and have exhausted all mental afflictions = karma.



Tony

[Demeisen]

If a person experiences a near death experience and believe in Jesus, they will see Jesus. If they believe in a Guru, they will see that spiritual guru.


What if person doesn't want illusions? (heavens, gurus, whatever..), what will he/she experience?

EDIT: Sorry, didn't notice huyi82 already posted similar question.

[Tony]

If a person experiences a near death experience and believe in Jesus, they will see Jesus. If they believe in a Guru, they will see that spiritual guru.


What if person doesn't want illusions? (heavens, gurus, whatever..), what will he/she experience?


Dear Demeisen

My guess is that we all have some sort of illusion in which we believe. But here I shall to refer to the Tibetan Book of the Dead, as I personally can't remember what happens in the death process!

It suggests that appearances of some sort will appear to us, and we will react in accordance with our temperament - as we do in life. It is said that the consciousness is 9 times more powerful out of the body, and by a mere thought we can go anywhere, instantly. On the face of it, this sounds interesting - and useful - but just imagine being surrounded a hurricane of concepts, bewildered by what is taking place without even knowing you have left the body, as there is a residue of memories. It is described as being blown around by our own karma.

There are highly developed individuals - the ones I know of are called tulkus - who can control where they will be reborn, but for the rest of us, we are driven by good and bad karma (imprints in our consciousness, which are created by our reactions). The death period is said to be a very intense experience.

However, it is also said that all appearances in the death state are merely projections in our mind. So, depending on how we have lived our life, the same reactions will occur in death, due to our temperament.

The Tibetan Book of the Dead suggests that we supplicate the lord of compassion (Chenrezi). When I do death practices for people I have known and they didn't have a belief or a practice, I remind them that they can hear me, but I can't hear them, and I suggest they turn their heart to the lord of love and compassion, whatever that means to them - and that they try to see everything in its true form (a manifestation of empty awareness) and that there is nothing to fear. Of course, one can't be sure that anyone is hearing these words, but hopefully the good intent and stillness will help.

The Tibetan Book of the Dead says we stay in the bardo of the death state (which could be seen as a psychological event - but it could be a spiritual one if one is so inclined) for up to 49 days: other traditions will see this differently.

Tony

[greybeard]

If a person experiences a near death experience and believe in Jesus, they will see Jesus. If they believe in a Guru, they will see that spiritual guru.


What if person doesn't want illusions? (heavens, gurus, whatever..), what will he/she experience?

EDIT: Sorry, didn't notice huyi82 already posted similar question.

I dont know, but, I suspect they would experience unconditional Love.
That can be felt without an visual image--belief system etc.

Chris

[TheTwo]

...reminds me of a movie called "the invention of lying" (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1058017/).

Great movie on what happens after death....strongly recommend :)

[Carmody]

It's not that we specifically have a being we may want to see, but that the constructional aspects of the wiring of a human avatar tends to create certain kinds of constructs.

for example, when we listen to speech or read the written word. When we commit to either effort, our minds cue up all the given words that begin with or have similar shape/sound, and then we identify each, as a form of flow.

the same goes for threats or whatever the shape may be. For example, one of my favorite blatant ones that serves as good example, is the current trend of putting 'faces' on the front of cars. Mazda is one of the current heavy abusers of this aspect. exhibit A:

http://www.auto123.com/ArtImages/143016/2010-mazda-cx9-i001.jpg

Humans tend to go for what they are raised with, which is "anthropomorphism". (attribution of human qualities to nonhumans) thus, due to wiring and design, we see humans.

Now, in the realm of psychic works, specifically that of seeing through time, and space, via remote viewing and temporal viewing, this plays out in the form of individual wiring and the given thinking of the moment or mental space of the given time and situation for the given human. Ie, like the mindset of a thief, would see everyone as being like a thief. A cop sees everyone as criminal, due to their being associated with difficult situations in similarity, far too often.

The most difficult thing to do, for a human incarnate, in the act of psychic exploring, is to drop the human mind associations and see things as they really are.

one of the things I did, when I was heavily into such explorations, is to use auto-hypnotic techniques to go slowly back to pre-birth mind and mindset, over a period of about 1+ years. slowly, day by day, in daily sessions of self hypnosis. to return to pre-womb mindsets. To return the beginning. the blank page, the point where the 'soul' connects to the body.

And when that point was reached, the dimensional spaces and energies began to be seen for what they are, or as humans involved project them and manipulate them, or are involved in them, either individually, or enmasse, energetically speaking. to see what other people where painting into reality, instead of my internal programming/interpretation of their painted reality. big difference.

in order to do that or complete that trick, I had to avoid event the slightest reinforcement of old habits, which can be likened to quitting habits like smoking. To prevent the library of visual and mental imagery that exists in the mind, in proto form, always ready to interpret for the body, in the automatic or autonomous hindbrain function that it always does and is/was designed to do.

This is a familiar aspect with regard to sensory deprivation techniques. In extreme levels of sensory deprivation, the mind goes a bit stir crazy and creates imagery from it's internal programming like slipping on ice or falling constantly, like a falling cat spinning it's tail, legs and body. The mind tries to grasp, but has no data.

So, like a drowning person, it must go through the aspects of a death of sort. An extreme struggle..then extremes of all bizarre sorts (even a return to the first ideas on shape and color, sounds, and so on), and then finally the silence of the mind begins to take place. Which is why there can be no re-reinforcement of the old, for it would be like getting breaths of air, and then the system is alive again--and the result is zero progress. This is ego function at the lower levels, of bodily activity. Once gain, like exercising the body, I did this slowly, over a period of a year+. this shape I managed to get myself into..could not be held while still integrating with all of us, like I am now. It could only be held for a while, unless I was willing to completely and permanently withdraw from modern society and human contact. To become and remain the guru in the cave, so to speak.

Thus, I isolated myself from all standard inputs of media and the like, even sound. As all that would keep the system alive (via the bits of re-inforcment) and interpreting psychic aspects of remote viewing and temporal viewing FOR ME, instead of this one seeing things as the really are.

I had to teach myself to see the thing and then slowly build shape from it, not have my mind immediately shape it for me, from what it knows.

At that point, I was into the levels of pre-birth program unwinding, and committed to heavy levels of astral projection, the kind that is witnessed by other people.

And at that time, I had managed to regain the projection of my 'apparent' original form, my birth as a multidimensional, which in my case, as related to me by more than one 'viewer', was Sirian. Which are cetaceans, and aquatic in origin.

The below happened before I was told I was Sirian, thus, I contend it was not suggestive in nature, as a form of recall:

http://rense.com/general13/drchupa.htm

I tended to, at the time, use power lines as a conduit, as the electrical fields provide a zone that is complementary (along their powered length), to zip down. Don't need ley lines, you see.... I am also heavily influenced by my astrological chart which has high levels of Uranian (planet Uranus, ie, Aquarius) influence, which rules electricity. The right vibration for that aspect to be included in the given incarnation.

I could go on and on, here......

[Tony]

It's not that we specifically have a being we may want to see, but that the constructional aspects of the wiring of a human avatar tends to create certain kinds of constructs.

for example, when we listen to speech or read the written word. When we commit to either effort, our minds cue up all the given words that begin with or have similar shape/sound, and then we identify each, as a form of flow.

the same goes for threats or whatever the shape may be. For example, one of my favorite blatant ones that serves as good example, is the current trend of putting 'faces' on the front of cars. Mazda is one of the current heavy abusers of this aspect. exhibit A:

http://www.auto123.com/ArtImages/143016/2010-mazda-cx9-i001.jpg

Humans tend to go for what they are raised with, which is "anthropomorphism". (attribution of human qualities to nonhumans) thus, due to wiring and design, we see humans.

Now, in the realm of psychic works, specifically that of seeing through time, and space, via remote viewing and temporal viewing, this plays out in the form of individual wiring and the given thinking of the moment or mental space of the given time and situation for the given human. Ie, like the mindset of a thief, would see everyone as being like a thief. A cop sees everyone as criminal, due to their being associated with difficult situations in similarity, far too often.

The most difficult thing to do, for a human incarnate, in the act of psychic exploring, is to drop the human mind associations and see things as they really are.

one of the things I did, when I was heavily into such explorations, is to use auto-hypnotic techniques to go slowly back to pre-birth mind and mindset, over a period of about 1+ years. slowly, day by day, in daily sessions of self hypnosis. to return to pre-womb mindsets. To return the beginning. the blank page, the point where the 'soul' connects to the body.

And when that point was reached, the dimensional spaces and energies began to be seen for what they are, or as humans involved project them and manipulate them, or are involved in them, either individually, or enmasse, energetically speaking. to see what other people where painting into reality, instead of my internal programming/interpretation of their painted reality. big difference.

in order to do that or complete that trick, I had to avoid event the slightest reinforcement of old habits, which can be likened to quitting habits like smoking. To prevent the library of visual and mental imagery that exists in the mind, in proto form, always ready to interpret for the body, in the automatic or autonomous hindbrain function that it always does and is/was designed to do.

This is a familiar aspect with regard to sensory deprivation techniques. In extreme levels of sensory deprivation, the mind goes a bit stir crazy and creates imagery from it's internal programming like slipping on ice or falling constantly, like a falling cat spinning it's tail, legs and body. The mind tries to grasp, but has no data.

So, like a drowning person, it must go through the aspects of a death of sort. An extreme struggle..then extremes of all bizarre sorts (even a return to the first ideas on shape and color, sounds, and so on), and then finally the silence of the mind begins to take place. Which is why there can be no re-reinforcement of the old, for it would be like getting breaths of air, and then the system is alive again--and the result is zero progress. This is ego function at the lower levels, of bodily activity. Once gain, like exercising the body, I did this slowly, over a period of a year+. this shape I managed to get myself into..could not be held while still integrating with all of us, like I am now. It could only be held for a while, unless I was willing to completely and permanently withdraw from modern society and human contact. To become and remain the guru in the cave, so to speak.

Thus, I isolated myself from all standard inputs of media and the like, even sound. As all that would keep the system alive (via the bits of re-inforcment) and interpreting psychic aspects of remote viewing and temporal viewing FOR ME, instead of this one seeing things as the really are.

I had to teach myself to see the thing and then slowly build shape from it, not have my mind immediately shape it for me, from what it knows.

At that point, I was into the levels of pre-birth program unwinding, and committed to heavy levels of astral projection, the kind that is witnessed by other people.

And at that time, I had managed to regain the projection of my 'apparent' original form, my birth as a multidimensional, which in my case, as related to me by more than one 'viewer', was Sirian. Which are cetaceans, and aquatic in origin.

The below happened before I was told I was Sirian, thus, I contend it was not suggestive in nature, as a form of recall:

http://rense.com/general13/drchupa.htm

I tended to, at the time, use power lines as a conduit, as the electrical fields provide a zone that is complementary (along their powered length), to zip down. Don't need ley lines, you see.... I am also heavily influenced by my astrological chart which has high levels of Uranian (planet Uranus, ie, Aquarius) influence, which rules electricity. The right vibration for that aspect to be included in the given incarnation.

I could go on and on, here......





This proves we can see 'things' differently!;)


Tony

[Tony]

If a person experiences a near death experience and believe in Jesus, they will see Jesus. If they believe in a Guru, they will see that spiritual guru.


What if person doesn't want illusions? (heavens, gurus, whatever..), what will he/she experience?

EDIT: Sorry, didn't notice huyi82 already posted similar question.

I dont know, but, I suspect they would experience unconditional Love.
That can be felt without an visual image--belief system etc.

Chris




Morning Chris,

They could well experience unconditional love...or a concept of unconditional love. :panda::panda:They may 'look' the same!