How is this possible??? (U.S. economy and stock market)

[jagman]

I have been listening to economic reports all morning. The United States economy grew in the fourth quarter.The stock market is close to a all time high!
Apparently our crashed housing market has some how managed to take off like a bottlle rocket. My spidey sense is really starting to alarm me.


At the end of this year, the United States will owe 17 Trillion dollars in debt! The United States unfunded liability ( What we really Owe!) Is estimated at 100 Trillion!


This violates laws of math,nature and common sense!

[Fred Steeves]

" Political language. . . is designed to make lies sound truthful and murder respectable, and to give an appearance of solidity to pure wind".

George Orwell

[humanalien]

I woke up around 9:45am today. At 10am, i
turned on fox news. The dow was at 126 points.

About an hour and a half later, i looked at the dow
again and it was at around 26 points. Somewhere
in between 10am and 11am, the dow must have
went down below 26 points because it showed the
dow going back up at 26 points. It ended at 20.88 points.

Tomorrow should be an interesting day watching the
stock market. I bet the dow will shoot way up there.

[WhiteFeather]

Its just a ride and an illusion. This sh!ts gonna crumble real soon. The monopoly money printing press is getting old and showing signs of weakness as it heads into the final round of the proverbial boxing match. The game is stagnant and has been played out way too long by the Banksters. They are running out of moves. The stock market is a lie and is ready to take a real good healthy bowel movement. Keep Notice the petrol dollar rising...pay attention to it. This is the stockmarkets and economical life preserver. And The life preserver is too small to rescue this catastrophe. The damage is done. The snake is beginning to swallow its own tail.

[ghostrider]

tommorrow we will get the catastrophe averted spill from the talking heads... like they were ever going to let anything fail ...

[ceetee9]

At the end of this year, the United States will owe 17 Trillion dollars in debt! The United States unfunded liability ( What we really Owe!) Is estimated at 100 Trillion!


This violates laws of math,nature and common sense!It's even worse than that Jagman. We're currently at 122.9 trillion dollars in unfunded liabilities which is about 30 trillion more than the total national assets. But don't panic yet, each taxpayer's liability is only a little over 1 million dollars. I'll probably send my check in with my IRS returns this year. How about you Jagman? ;)
US National Debt Clock (http://www.usdebtclock.org/)

[jagman]

Its just a ride and an illusion. This sh!ts gonna crumble real soon. The monopoly money printing press is getting old and showing signs of weakness as it heads into the final round of the proverbial boxing match. The game is stagnant and has been played out way too long by the Banksters. They are running out of moves. The stock market is a lie and is ready to take a real good healthy bowel movement. Keep Notice the petrol dollar rising...pay attention to it. This is the stockmarkets and economical life preserver. And The life preserver is too small to rescue this catastrophe. The damage is done. The snake is beginning to swallow its own tail.

WhiteFeather,That was priceless lol:eyebrows:

[jagman]

At the end of this year, the United States will owe 17 Trillion dollars in debt! The United States unfunded liability ( What we really Owe!) Is estimated at 100 Trillion!


This violates laws of math,nature and common sense!It's even worse than that Jagman. We're currently at 122.9 trillion dollars in unfunded liabilities which is about 30 trillion more than the total national assets. But don't panic yet, each taxpayer's liability is only a little over 1 million dollars. I'll probably send my check in with my IRS returns this year. How about you Jagman? ;)
US National Debt Clock (http://www.usdebtclock.org/)

Yeah the check is in the mail.

[puurfectten]

I woke up around 9:45am today. At 10am, i
turned on fox news. The dow was at 126 points.

About an hour and a half later, i looked at the dow
again and it was at around 26 points. Somewhere
in between 10am and 11am, the dow must have
went down below 26 points because it showed the
dow going back up at 26 points. It ended at 20.88 points.

Tomorrow should be an interesting day watching the
stock market. I bet the dow will shoot way up there.

lol...should follow through to the downside..maybe after a lottle pop if it even gets that..if the sell wave follows through it should take us to spx 1395ish or - around 1000 dow pts :)..

[puurfectten]

the funny thing about the economy and the markets is that all the economic reports are bs..and the markets have nothing to do with the economy..so its kinda like double bs..twice removed..:)..

[Maknocktomb]

Wall Street is going through another bubble for the Banksters to steal more wealth. Main Street continues to suffer with no benefit from the stock market. The American motto is work harder, make less and pay more for everything.

[puurfectten]

Wall Street is going through another bubble for the Banksters to steal more wealth. Main Street continues to suffer with no benefit from the stock market. The American motto is work harder, make less and pay more for everything.

i totally agree with the second part of what u said...but anyone who takes the time to learn how it works can also benefit from the markets..don't get me wrong..i do condemn the greedy bastards...but no one has to be a victim financially from their behavior..:)..

[jagman]

I wonder who is really buying all those houses? This whole thing smells like a dead fish!

[Kristin]

It's as though the stock market has taken a step into the virtual world. Nothing based on reality, all crap based on virtual money and virtual holdings. I've noticed these trends before major events... it's interesting to see who the short term gainer's are on this... any thoughts?

From the Heart,
Kristin

Ps, Jag I'm glad you're here, always!

[Fractalius]

That investor too, the one that supposedly has placed 12 million against the market moving 200 points or whatever it was. Which thread was that mentioned in I forget? There was a date involved too.


Also, any links, there is no 'reporting' of this yet?

[mgray]

I have been listening to economic reports all morning. The United States economy grew in the fourth quarter.The stock market is close to a all time high!
Apparently our crashed housing market has some how managed to take off like a bottlle rocket. My spidey sense is really starting to alarm me.


At the end of this year, the United States will owe 17 Trillion dollars in debt! The United States unfunded liability ( What we really Owe!) Is estimated at 100 Trillion!


This violates laws of math,nature and common sense!

Let's take it one by one.
The economy grew 0.025 percent in Q4. That means nothing for all the holiday shopping. The only thing it says is that without Uncle Sam spending there is no GDP. Gov't spending slashed after the election.
And the stock market is not the economy. The Fed pumps in almost $4B a day through QE. It has to go somewhere.

US housing market is only 39 percent back from 2006 levels.

So your thinking is spot on. It is the noise of the news that is off.

[sirdipswitch]

I been hearin this very same scenario, since I was in high school. Horse Pucky.

Here's an indicator, that most don't pay attention to. The elite start puting thier Family Estates on the market, to "Liquidate" assets. (Because they're scared, and they know what's commin) The little people who watch this sort of thing, panic, and start selling stock. The market takes a nose dive. The elite quietly start buying everything they can get thier grubby little hands on, and then take those Family homes back off the market, the stock market suddenly rallies, and they make even more money than they had before, and the only ones that lose are those little people who thought they knew what was goin on. ccccc.

[Prodigal Son]

yep, $122 trillion is more like it.... might as well make it a hundred quintillion... it's all Ponzi and extortion "owed" to the banksters and they'll never see a dime of it.

GFdYT8OI6b0

[Camilo]

Smoke mirrors before the great fall.

[Lone Bean]

I am far from understanding most anything about the stock market, but I do know that as long as Ben Bernanke keeps artificially injecting billions and billions into it it will "appear" to be somewhat o.k., even if there is no growth. Also, keep in mind that much of any rise in it is due to the massive layoffs and downsizing of companies. They save ("earn") money by not paying employee salaries. It's not what it appears to be at all. About the only indicator I actually believe to a true and accurate assessment of what is going on with our economy is the "Baltic Dry Index". It went up about 12 points today but it is still at a very critical LOW level of only 757. This index is the real indicator of raw goods being shipped across the oceans for manufacturing. If very little is being shipped, then there is very little manufacturing and very little being purchased. Here is the website that I like to use:

http://www.wikinvest.com/index/Baltic_Dry_Index_-_BDI_%28BALDRY%29

[blufire]

Take a look back to the spring and early summer of 2008. In fact right up until the crash.

[Cjay]

I am far from understanding most anything about the stock market

The stock market is a heavily manipulated casino.

[Shamz]

Stock Market is a mess anywhere in the world - more so here in US of A.
Companies just create stocks out of thin air - like Feds print money.

The root of all Evils is the paper money and how it is manipulated by TPTB to keep ordinary people in the matrix.

Like all other things - it will meet its end someday

[DeBron]

stock market: PURELY rich people manipulating other people so they can get more of your money.

[Sidney]

I have been listening to economic reports all morning. The United States economy grew in the fourth quarter.The stock market is close to a all time high!
Apparently our crashed housing market has some how managed to take off like a bottlle rocket. My spidey sense is really starting to alarm me.


At the end of this year, the United States will owe 17 Trillion dollars in debt! The United States unfunded liability ( What we really Owe!) Is estimated at 100 Trillion!


This violates laws of math,nature and common sense!

I say Bullsh**. My home value dropped 30 percent in the last 3 years. Can't sell it. Period. Lots of houses are still on the market that were for sale 3 years agThey are a bunch of liars.

[rgray222]

It’s important to take a step back and think about the real driving force behind rising home prices.Everyone needs to ask the question......................how home prices can rise in an environment in which unemployment remains high, there is little growth in take-home pay, taxes have risen for every single American that pays taxes (not just the rich) and lending standards continue to be tight, so how in the world can the housing sector thrive when all these things are happening.

It is not rocket science.........the federal reserve is buying $45,000,000,000 PER MONTH of mortgages from banks with no ending date. This money is deceiving the American people into thinking that the housing market is rebounding. This is dishonest and it is a bubble that will burst. The end result will be either unsustainable debt or a collapse of the the dollar or a more likely some hybrid of both of those nightmares.

The stimulus was a failure by most economist estimations, the investment did not return higher employment rates, stronger economy or stronger exports. The banking, insurance and car companies bailouts did not provide a needed boost to the economy. By all indications these companies would have been in about the same position as they are today by going through the normal bankrupt court proceedings that other companies have been using for decades. The difference is that the American taxpayer is on the hook for billions that have been written off by these companies when they reorganized under the federal "too big to fail bailout program".

The Obama administration has spent billions on these programs and the housing fiasco is only the latest way they have found to falsely stimulate the economy. You cannot act in this careless manor without facing a day of reckoning.

Every honest Washington insider and honest economist will tell you the same thing. We are in for a crash landing. The only things they are unclear on is will it be a crash and burn landing or a bit softer and they really will not speculate on when it will happen.

The one question that I keep asking myself, is this out of control spending intentional. The president seems to be on a mission to spend money as fast as they can push the computer keys to create it without giving thought to serious cuts to any aspect of the budget. If it is intentional than to what end. I don't see a clear cut well defined winner in the demise of the American economy.

[AutumnW]

That's right--as long as they continue to deficit spend to buy up mortgage back securities, it will look good and it might be better than letting the housing market go into the toilet.....but..they are spending 45 billion a month on these securities. Meanwhile they are forcing a sequester over a piddling 85 billion per year, with an aim to reduce spending by around 1.5 trillion over 10 years? Wow...can you say, window dressing or spit in the bucket, how about major PR exercise, or putting lipstick on a pig?

[AutumnW]

[B]

The Obama administration has spent billions on these programs and the housing fiasco is only the latest way they have found to falsely stimulate the economy. You cannot act in this careless manor without facing a day of reckoning.

Every honest Washington insider and honest economist will tell you the same thing. We are in for a crash landing. The only things they are unclear on is will it be a crash and burn landing or a bit softer and they really will not speculate on when it will happen.

The one question that I keep asking myself, is this out of control spending intentional. The president seems to be on a mission to spend money as fast as they can push the computer keys to create it without giving thought to serious cuts to any aspect of the budget. If it is intentional than to what end. I don't see a clear cut well defined winner in the demise of the American economy.

Inflating the currency supply, buying mortgage backed securites allows govts to put off consequences of mismanagement greed, corruption until tomorrow--after they have finished their terms in office. If they made a genuine attempt to turn things around, they would likely trigger a depression today They would be screamed out of office. Regardless of political orientation--people don't like pain.

[jackovesk]

G'Day Jagman,

If you seriously want to get to bottom of the US Financial Charade, Gerald Celente 'Nails It' right here...:yes4:

Feb 28, 2013


Alex also talks with trend forecaster Gerald Celente about the disintegrating economy and what is in store for America in the months ahead.

http://www.trendsresearch.com/index.php

Gerald Celente: Feds Preparing for Economic Implosion..!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBFpSZsAV6g

[sigma6]

Doesn't necessarily mean anything, if you want to look at price and predict the future at better then random, you will need a wide context of fundamentals to look at... Besides all the Benjamin Fulford behind the scenes stuff, which few would actually make investment decisions on . There is plenty to look at. One of the biggest is still the Baltic Dry index, bond rates, interest trends, commodity prices. I would also pick my favourite forecaster (which is currently none) But I do like listening to Harry S. Dent Jr. for longer term outlook. He is an economist that does statistical analysis of historical data to expose cyclical patterns.

[jackovesk]

Doesn't necessarily mean anything, if you want to look at price and predict the future at better then random, you will need a wide context of fundamentals to look at... Besides all the Benjamin Fulford behind the scenes stuff, which few would actually make investment decisions on . There is plenty to look at. One of the biggest is still the Baltic Dry index, bond rates, interest trends, commodity prices. I would also pick my favourite forecaster (which is currently none) But I do like listening to Harry S. Dent Jr. for longer term outlook. He is an economist that does statistical analysis of historical data to expose cyclical patterns.

I worked in the Finance Industry for over 20 years and basically investment decisions/forecasting comes down to Knowledge/Discernment and moreso plain old...


Common Sense..!

[donk]

Jagman my friend, I been asking myself that same question (how is that possible) about all things national (& global) economics since '99, until it nearly gave me a breakdown around aught-six I think it was, when Bear Stearns got eat-ed up.

The answer, I found, as unsatisfying as it is, I think is: because [they] said so

...as above, so below. It seems to be the answer for every time you question the seemingly senseless acts of those in any position of authority

[Mulder]

Hi Jagman,
Peter explains what's going on in a easy to understand way:
ZIn7eCnqBzQ

He's saying, we're in worse shape than ever and the stock market is climbing, gold's going down and we're basically being lied to in many ways and it can't go on much longer (but it can go on for a few more years IMO).

[Carmody]

I was told that whenever the economy of the USA warms up, the stock market and those attached to it pull things in tight by manipulation of the stock market and also manipulation of the gas prices.

If the economy is stimulated and grows they pull the same amount out via hiking gasoline prices in Precisely the same amount.

This prevents growth, keeps the poor.. poor... and the power people owning things - keeping all the profits and cash to themselves.

This is how they keep you under control, keep you short and shorn, at the same time they make profits.

Purely an act of malevolent manipulation.

The country has been trying desperately to fix itself. Wall street, the bankers, and the oil power have all been conspiring and acting to make sure that it never happens.

[gripreaper]

Then and now…last time DOW was at 14164 vs now at 14164 – Oct 2007 vs March 2013

Dow Jones Industrial Average: Then 14164.5; Now 14260
Regular Gas Price: Then $2.75; Now $3.73
GDP Growth: Then +2.5%; Now +1.6%
Americans Unemployed (in Labor Force): Then 6.7 million; Now 13.2 million
Americans On Food Stamps: Then 26.9 million; Now 47.69 million
Size of Fed’s Balance Sheet: Then $0.89 trillion; Now $3.01 trillion
US Debt as a Percentage of GDP: Then ~38%; Now 74.2%
US Deficit (LTM): Then $97 billion; Now $975.6 billion
Total US Debt Outstanding: Then $9.008 trillion; Now $16.43 trillion
US Household Debt: Then $13.5 trillion; Now 12.87 trillion
Labor Force Particpation Rate: Then 65.8%; Now 63.6%
Consumer Confidence: Then 99.5; Now 69.6
S&P Rating of the US: Then AAA; Now AA+
VIX: Then 17.5%; Now 14%
10 Year Treasury Yield: Then 4.64%; Now 1.89%
EURUSD: Then 1.4145; Now 1.3050
Gold: Then $748; Now $1583
NYSE Average LTM Volume (per day): Then 1.3 billion shares; Now 545 million shares

[humanalien]

I know that stock market is being manipulated
but even knowing that, i expect the bottom to
fall out, sometime in the very near future.

The dow may drop 2 to 3 thousand point, if
not more. I don't see the dow to continuously
keep raising when there is no reason for it to.

[crosby]

i didn't see this video posted anywhere, if it is, i apologize for redundancy. this helps to explain the inequality that is going on, and it should beg the question of how indeed this is possible:

QPKKQnijnsM

warmest, corson

[donk]

I was told that whenever the economy of the USA warms up, the stock market and those attached to it pull things in tight by manipulation of the stock market and also manipulation of the gas prices.



I've noticed that, though never been told...just curious: what type of person can tell you such things?

Back when I was interested and curious and researching the topic, I had an opportunity to lunch with the head of the US Chamber of Commerce (Mr Big Biz himself). At the time, I was all bent about peak oil, which I was totally obsessed with at the time. He was on board with conversation of resource scarcity, and at the time wasn't as worried about the economy...he kept talking about how much "liquidity" is out there, preventing the collapse I was sure was going to occur (about aught-four to aught-six somewheres).

All the talk was normal, not much concern about market crash or hyperinflation I was fearing, but when I got in a question asking about peak oil, he got a lot more serious, curt and short even, and said only something like: I'm not so concerned about that...what you got to worry about is WATER.

[rgray222]

[B]

The Obama administration has spent billions on these programs and the housing fiasco is only the latest way they have found to falsely stimulate the economy. You cannot act in this careless manor without facing a day of reckoning.

Every honest Washington insider and honest economist will tell you the same thing. We are in for a crash landing. The only things they are unclear on is will it be a crash and burn landing or a bit softer and they really will not speculate on when it will happen.

The one question that I keep asking myself, is this out of control spending intentional. The president seems to be on a mission to spend money as fast as they can push the computer keys to create it without giving thought to serious cuts to any aspect of the budget. If it is intentional than to what end. I don't see a clear cut well defined winner in the demise of the American economy.

Inflating the currency supply, buying mortgage backed securites allows govts to put off consequences of mismanagement greed, corruption until tomorrow--after they have finished their terms in office. If they made a genuine attempt to turn things around, they would likely trigger a depression today They would be screamed out of office. Regardless of political orientation--people don't like pain.

Yes that is very true that people don't like pain but even more telling is that politicians are loathed to inflict pain. There is only one thing that needs to be considered and that is do people want a good deal of pain now or a great deal of pain later. Both political parties are guilty of running up the debt and deficit but the American people have never seen or experienced the spending like they are seeing with the current administration. Obama has had ample time to set dates to end the wars but that has not happened. The end dates for both wars is still going along the Bush schedule, he has had time to cut spending and entitlement but has refused to even lift a finger to do so. No budget in four full years tells us that he does not want a budget, with a budget you get spending caps and that is something he has avoided like the plague. He ran twice promising to accomplished these items but once elected they fall off the radar as if they were never intended to actually happen, only rhetoric to get elected and reelected.

This makes one think that the spending and the lack of any effort to cut spending is intentional. I do not actively seek out conspiracies but when you see one creeping up on you an inch at a time, eventually you have to recognize it for what it is!

In another regard, everyone should be in awe of how this president has put policies in place that have hurt the country and he has been immensely successful blaming others, the first four years it was Bush and now it is the opposition party. Everything in life needs to have balance to survive so the blame can only go so far before a truthful balance sets in. The first sign of that honest balance is the sequester, he is attempting to blame others but the American people (for the most part) are not buying it. This is the start of accepting responsibility for your own actions and setting the balance back on track. It may take a year or a bit more but you can see the writing on the wall, the $45 Billion being pumped into banks through the mortgage buybacks has sent the stock market through the roof. This is a false indication that things are good in the economy. This money will eventually have to stop and when it does there will be a lot of questions being asked on how did it get so bad so fast!

For reasons we may never know the intentional actions of the government have put us on a road to financial disaster without much hope for any other outcome!