EM/EG craft - cockpit / bridge arrangements

[betweener]

for this topic, i wish to explore and discuss, to hash out, what is or is not needed to build a suitably conventional cockpit or command bridge interface for earthling humanites (ie, generally non-spiritual, and unpowered/ un-gifted people) to operate and fly electromagnetic / electrogravitic craft.

The reason for this is because i've heard a great many rumors about 'magical' control interfaces like mind-interfacing chairs and electro-lava-lamps that you have to Think specific colors and patterns at in order to control a given craft, nevermind an abundance of undertones and overtones of the ship itself being more a metallic creature than what we humans think of as a craft, vehicle or ship.

As Impressive and wonderous as it would e to actually use such interface devices, im inclined to think that such things are thusfar a major turn-off for the majority of earthlings so far, and is likely a contributing inhibitor to the spreading of the understanding of electromagnetic flight technologies, nevermind actual construction and use of. Therefore, i think it is best that we earthlings 'rig' the controls of such a flight craft to an arguably more 'conventional' format.

(yes, im well aware that such vessels may be arguably more accurate to be said to 'teleport' and/or 'dimension-shift' than any a-to-b-to-c-to-d journeying from point A to point B, the way 'flight' is said to indicate.)

Eventually, i would like for this topic, or the resulting ideas and conclusions, to be used as a how-to reference for other "Flying Saucer" builders.

to get things started, i shall double-post my rather preliminary reasoning's and observations below.

Nominally, your post should be detailed as to the what, the how and the why, and hopefully without being too jargon-y, although due to the technical nature of the topic, i understand if we may have to get to the point of almost wholesale arcane speek.

[betweener]

In my own endeavor to build an EM flight craft, i understand it to be necessary that any flight control computer units (optimally, craigslist-bought laptops) may be needed to be linked together with fiber-optics cords, because light isn't likely to be messed with by magnetic fields.

The controls would primarily consist of 2 flight-sim twinned joysticks (an otherwise identical left/right model) to separately control horizontal and vertical directional movement, with smaller thumb-joysticks to control directional pitch-roll-spin orientation, along with an adjacent flight-sim engine control bank, and probably a more general-interface computer off to the side, below the large TV view-screens linked to external cameras, if windows are avoided.

the reason i project the use of flightsim cockpit gear and other common items, is that it is, to the best of my understanding, and depending on the device-interface softwares, it probably wont matter in terms of use-performance that just about everything in the cockpit came from the local shopping marts and other specialty stores, so long as it is an inner-most faraday cage and is insulated from the magnetics of the engines.

the components im not sure about, however, are arguably more conventional things like altimeters, and other gobs upon gobs upon gobs of switches, buttons levers knobs blinkies and other 'more conventional' components of what we have thusfar seen on related craft such as the space shuttle, any sort of aeroplane or jet plane, and perhaps even boats and wet-navy ships, as such functions are either no longer applicable, or can probably be controlled via a more digital computer interface function, unless so desired to contine to be distinctivly featured as a seperate greeblie-control panel.

[GoodETxSG]

Hello, I have been through some of these motions and discussions with other high tech persons. I would like to discuss more. I see your profile is pretty shy on info most likely as a security measure ("Cut Out" Profile). I understand security measures and I too am watching out for "Honey Pots" and trying to buzz clear.

Of course knowing the basic capabilities of the craft would determine a lot - Altitude Ceiling, Top speed and time to reach it, the ability to maneuver at these speeds and the pos/neg G's etc... I would suggest putting your efforts into your guidance and control systems/simulator before the actual propulsion and aircraft fuselage fine tuning and testing (Accept computer simulating of course). My very humble opinion of course... If you are building your prototype I would only fly by wire until you get your simulator working.

Depending on the crafts abilities there are of course things to take in consideration for the pilot... may want to start low tech like the GOV did with electrically stimulated graphite density response to G systems (Basically shock absorbers that the strength of electric current determines resistance) or a form of "G-Gel" that was developed later that the "Cockpit" kind of floated in that absorbed the "G's" and didn't rely on a electrical charge (Possible Failure Point).

First, working on the simulator, a combo of HIGH and LOW tech for control systems available to the private sector should be considered over any XBox type controllers or Laptops (LT's WILL not survive). The response time needed is so humanly impossibly quick and being in a "Cockpit" within a freely rolling cage and +/- G dampeners... ADD being in a pressurized suit/or sealed environment its just not practical... The stress and human factor (Now you see why most of the Space Craft "THEY" fly now are Drones") can make a major difference in making a maneuver that is impressive or one that sheers off parts of the craft and causes catastrophic failure.

You will need to learn to merry some technologies that may seem silly. The newer "Games" out there that use a head/wrist bands that senses "Galvanic Skin Responses" to control the game... can be enhanced and made more sensitive. Multiple ones for multiple systems would be needed for your simulator. There is also a totally different Gel laminated with a clear coating that is super advanced ((That reads the "Mind of pilots) and used in older models along with smart helmets (Which have very advanced brain scanning abilities) and heads up displays.

If you can or know someone that can hack a PSIII or XBOX (Most advanced models of course) they will suit your needs better than a laptop or tablet for these needs (Many nations use their components to try to build guided cruise missiles).

When it comes to the vast array of shielding you will need both for wiring, fiber optics, components and cabin/personnel I have some info for that as well.

But, we can talk more about this off line as I wouldn't mind being involved if you do not mind as I have resources. The above is just a very very light touching on the topic in an open forum. I did NOT want to address the POWER/FUEL info here either.

Good luck

[betweener]

i am not entirely sure we are talking about the same craft. i am talking about what is perhaps more widely known as 'UFO's' or 'flying saucers', or maybe Foo Fighters (if indeed such craft were piloted.)Also, my profile is bare-bones, not out of paranoia, but to focus on what i am saying, now who is saying it (that's kinda what happened to all the major religious figures.)

to the best of my knowledge of the craft i anticipate building, there will be no significant G-forces exerted into the craft, if at all, even during the otherwise most brutal and intricate of maneuvers, at speed. The craft also has no known theoretical flight ceiling or practical maximum speed (well above mach 6 to mach 10, i would presume), and may well be trans-atmospheric, if not out-rightly able to be a relatively 'light duty' solar-system space vehicle. Even if it is found to have a maximum flight ceiling and maximum speed, im not sure such would be low or slow enough to care for the time being, as it would be well above and beyond what is normally allowed to the common citizenry.

However, i am welcoming of any information you are willing to provide out in the open (such is preferred, because i am of the general opinion that the Long Night of Secrecy is coming to a decently swift and actually rather ignoble end, as evidenced by.... the very existence of This Forum, among a great many other things).

Fortunately or unfortunately, these discussions are, rather unfortunately, limited to logical deduction and theorizing, as i have no allowed working space to build either a simulated craft edifice or any size of actual craft. Even so, it is best to have atleast a basic outline of how to do what, so it is entirely possible i would have gone a-discussing even if i had plenty of space on which to build a craft.

the x-box/ other videogame console idea is a good reminder, and had laptops failed initial magneto-Faraday stress-testing, i then would have gone to that avenue of electronics.

If in the event you cannot openly provide anymore information on craft controls and interface available to the common populace, then i wish you good luck and goodbye, goode from texas.

[GoodETxSG]

No, I understood fully where you were coming from and my questions were posed in a way to get the information to provide the answers to the questions you asked in your OP. I have a pretty broad understanding of the whole process (How Naval/Air Force/Military Contractors and owned/ran corporations do anyway) from how funding meshes in with Research & Development, Scale Model Prototype Testing, 1:1 Unmanned Prototype Testing... which leads to tons of telemetry to decipher or God forbid EXPENSIVE accidents that lead to setbacks in the form of lengthy investigations... then MORE prototypes and testing until we strap a highly paid crazy SOB test pilot in one and give it a run...

Sources of mine have been through all of this both from the concept to development and reverse engineering ends of the spectrum. (Take a look at my Profile and Started Threads and Posts to get some ideas of where some of my info comes from). If you already have the tech to create an isolation field for an occupant from the inertial/external forces of a high velocity craft (In or out of the atmosphere) making radical maneuvers (Or Dimensional Shifting) then I think you should be far beyond joy sticks and contemplating laptop's and video displays in place of windows.

The talk of the crafts altitude ceiling and atmospheric flight capabilities was to give me ideas on what type of processor calculations would be needed as well as if any commercial flight instruments would even be useful (For some of your questions in your original Post). Also, a joy stick is not going to cut it no matter how intuitive the Human or Non Human Pilot is. The crafts I and sources have observed have ALL directly interfaced with the pilot.

I am not sure you are going to get any real helpful info in the way this Forum/Thread is designed. Most likely more questions than answers. But I wish you luck. If you you do have the finances and access to the closely monitored "items" needed to provide the capabilities you allude to then please be careful and have a full team of great minds to help you. I guarantee the "Great Minds" will be quite challenged, unless you or they happen to be one of the few rumored missing personnel I have heard about.

As far as "Faraday" shielding... spend the cash with some of the light weight fabrics or paints that commercial material science has provided...
EMI RFI shielding gaskets, EMI RFI solutions, Faraday cages ...

http://www.hollandshielding.com/

OR

http://www.lessemf.com

==================================
NOTE: Secrecy is good, but it also creates an environment where an ops team can come in and do a mop up (They have kept this kind of tech in the dark using very clever methods and they are dayam good at what they do, I have know of several victims of their handy work). The minute you posted key words on this site... Immediate back traces of your IP/MAC address were made and your ISP provided all of your info to the investigating group including a masked open port to your system.

There really is no secrecy anymore... But the way my family, friends and former colleagues in Military Intel and in unacknowledged programs are leaking info the last few years (Exponentially) I believe you are correct that the veil of secrecy cannot possibly remain much longer. But what the "Truth" will be twisted or spun into is a whole other scenario.

[GoodETxSG]

Tiz kind of bizzar how this thread got started cryptically and then when beginning to cover topics that seemed to be the goal of the thread the OP stopped posting... was this a social experiment of some sort?
:confused:
Oh, well... I spoke in good faith and thought this could have been an interesting discussion.

[betweener]

not 'bizzar' at all, i just got kinda distracted.

anyway, if joysticks and tv screens aint gonna cut it for even the decently meager-est, most 'professionally amateur' of 'flying saucers', then what is the nearest available conventional interface format that joe/jane street can get ahold of and/or build without alot of difficulty in either acquiring materials, or actually building it, and also bench-testing and operating it ?

skin-muscle activation diodes on/in a chair, which then 'reads your mind' via either controlled or semi-involuntary muscle twitches ?

maybe some sort of 'short plan/execute' semi-auto pilot where the pilot touch programs the auto pilot atleast 5 moves ahead, or something ?

im not trying to sound facetious, but apart from either actually being a Galactic Human (with all the powers and traits implied), an enhanced human/ super soldier, or having a Matrix style brain-jack installed, im rather skeptical that common civilian earth humans can do much in the way of what is likely to be needed for adequate, never mind optimal control of an EM/EG craft.

(that being said, im also rather eager to be proven horribly wrong, and earthling humans can in fact build AND operate such a craft, engines and cockpit and all, with relative ease in both skill and financial cost.)


Tiz kind of bizzar how this thread got started cryptically and then when beginning to cover topics that seemed to be the goal of the thread the OP stopped posting... was this a social experiment of some sort?
:confused:
Oh, well... I spoke in good faith and thought this could have been an interesting discussion.

of course, if you prefer being all that paranoid, you can freely swallow the proverbial blue pill, never post to this topic ever again, and believe whatever you like about me.

and on that subject, your continual remarks of this nature makes me think that, as much as you are admirable for being able to get in close to such obviously dangerous circles of people, to be there first hand for experiences and knowledge, perhaps it has messed with your head, and that where once you stared unblinkingly into the abyss, it now unblinkingly stares into you.

anyway, as insane as we all are to some degree or another, i do indeed thank you for your continued sharing of information, and am still looking to atleast formulate and disseminate a how-to on crafting an appropriate cockpit for such a craft.

Even if i am fated to be dis-allowed to actually build it, atleast some form of knowledge can spread, and in turn help to spread the technology of such vehicles further and wider than just what the upper-most syndicates and self-appointed rulers of the earth develop for themselves.

(i would bet that in your familiar life of James Bondage and mazes wrapped in riddles packaged in cloak-and-dagger games of life and sudden death, you're not at all sure of what to make of someone who is usually transparently truthful, perhaps to a fault. Are you ?)

well, the truth is im just some joe street with a life chock full of a dog i don't care for (and yet saddled to do just that), and family that is just this side of insufferable, who come the possibly imminent american authoritarianism, i have no doubt will gleefully turn in their guns, and then snitch me right into a camp for half a chance at a decent meal for the kids/ nephews.

So, if i am allowed to build any decent sized sort of craft, you can bet the moon i will try my good-god-damnest to high-tail it off the planet with afew bob's and maybe some laptops chock full of information (or perhaps alot of printed out books.... that may be alot of paper i be hauling.).

hopefully however, i can build a very big craft (rather like a flying superyacht), move into it ala a house, and just live as some sort of wandering spacer.

[GoodETxSG]

:crazy_pilot:

WOW, how does one respond to all of that??? I think yes, bizarre indeed. Cloak and Dagger, Mind Mazes? WTF?

What I have tried to do is drop some bits of info to help you out and realize what gaps have to be bridged and see if I received any legit responses. The reality of you having everything crafted and operational and just need help Jerry Rigging the cabin and flight controls out of joy sticks etc... come on. I alluded to this in prior posts above... I would venture to guess the skills needed for this project not to mention funding are more than just a little out of your league... just a blind guess based on profiling what you have written so far...

(Okay, I will provide a slightly skewed and lets call it completely speculative and a fictional account below to explain some of this)

ALL of the functional craft have honestly just been somewhere comfortable for the "Pilots" to sit... years, no decades were spent looking for the operating systems, the processing units (CPU's) and not only flight control but navigational "Computation" systems. Turns out that the vast majority of the craft were just shell's with no locomotion or navigational use at all.

The Navigator's sat in a seat and directly interfaced with the shell and the Navigators MIND was the Flight Control, Navigation, and even what caused the shell to move (If you can call it "move"). These clever beings that were "handing over" this "tech" for various things in return did not even need them to travel back "home". They just thought about it, became and orb and blinked out.

There were "Others" that offered to provide us similar tech, but we were so backwards when they wanted to offer us "spiritual technology, assistance" they were scoffed at... Now we realize that all of the level 3 Civilizations use a Spiritual/Consciousness Based Technology or Understanding of the illusion of Space/Time/Matter that we still cannot wrap our minds around. We should have gone along with that group!

The tech we bartered for with the clever con artists of the Galaxy got us no where as there were no free energy devices, engines, moving parts, navigation devices or "joy sticks and flat screen panels". They were just where the being sat and had some square footage to carry out their missions and tools of their trade. Their "Consciousness" was their technology.

It has taken many decades and lives but we have found ways to get close to their capabilities without the hassle of dealing with the spiritual part. We found certain pilots with several developed abilities (That we all have/or can have) to interface with our "Earth Built" craft and when used in tandem with "AI" that assists with the complex physical navigation and "engion types" we finally became a space faring civilization many many thousands of years below what the visitors ARE... then we were in the game so to speak.

You haven't researched the technical "bread crumbs" I have dropped for you. If you bother to follow up on the hints of the technologies I suggested blending and which can be enhanced if you already have the claimed skills to build such a device then there should have been some light bulbs going off and inspiration.

The muscle twitching mind reading comments of yours and the response in general gives a pretty clear psychological profile as well as the technical jargon indicates the level expertise. The tech's I mentioned are already available in techie toy's... if one is stuck on joy sticks and flat screen panels when building a hyperdimensional conveyance then responds with such an extremely emotional display is powerfully revealing! As I seem to be the only one to take the time to contribute it puzzles me even further.

Good luck with your Garage Built UFO. I think I will spend my time on some Threads where common courtesy and true exchange of ideas occurs. The entire dialog and blending of technologies suggested has to be a put off to anyone with any type of real world experience in this area from joining this discussion.


I think I am done with this thread as I think I am starting to get myself in trouble lately when it comes to topics of classified aircraft. I need to step back and watch more and comment less I guess...

[Aurelius]

for this topic, i wish to explore and discuss, to hash out, what is or is not needed to build a suitably conventional cockpit or command bridge interface for earthling humanites (ie, generally non-spiritual, and unpowered/ un-gifted people) to operate and fly electromagnetic / electrogravitic craft.
<snip>

if want to understand how to control a craft without joysticks and the usual paraphernalia? .. listen very carefully to the 9 words mentioned after the 4:50 mark (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g7zC--A_mEk), then go think long and hard about this, then go search for evidence of this. ;)

ps. this vid was recently posted (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?57202-George-Van-Tassel-1964-Rare-UFO-Research-Classic)in the forum.

if anyone debunks this .. be suspicious.

you need to be a conscious being for this to work. not sure what you mean by "non-spiritual(1) (http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/spiritual)" we are all spiritual by design. ie. it most probably wont work for a "machine" (unless it's a "special" machine ;)).

[betweener]

i apologize for being rude. Sometimes i go abit more insane than usual. (im inclined to think that we are all adversely affected by our time on earth, in one way or another, or sometimes many ways, and some are more affected than others.)

anyway, in spite of my faithlessness and insanity, i really wouldn't mind trying to help out my fellow earthlings, in whatever ways im allowed to get away with.

by 'non-spiritual', i try to convey concepts of ordinary-ness, of the concept that you can approach anyone from any walk of life, from the most out there hippie or new-ager to the most conservative republi-crat, from priests to atheists to buddhists, from die hard conspiracy theorists who believe that Elvis lives, to people who would seek to debunk the internal combustion engine and the scientific process, and alot of other sorts of people i cant think of right now.....

and after some basic lessons on how to fly it (anywhere from a 30 minute crash course on what cockpit thingie does what, to the equivalent of a 2 or 3 day motorcycle rider class), the person has basic competency of flight of the craft, and can take off, navigate from point A to B to C, possibly dodge an obstacle or two, and land safely with minimal to no bumps.

i had initially hoped for a rather familiar joysticks and screens cockpit for this reason, as it would be most analogous to a fighter jet, something that, while perhaps not as ordinary as morning coffee and the 9 to 5 grind, would be mundane enough to be understood with ease.

video; "..... this zone is subject to thought."

im...... not entirely sure how to go about harnessing that in any sort of smaller package, be it a helmet or a chair. He does mention a 4 story apparatus the size of a building.

also, as much as it would be interesting to harness time, im not really looking to go messing about with temporal paradoxes and other such time-based things, merely the more vehicular aspects of flying saucers and other such 'UFO' craft.

[betweener]

in reviewing the online materials, it is stated that in Adamski style flying saucers, that the 3 orbs on the undersides of the saucer are controlled by linear sliders and/or rheostats (aka dimmer switches).

of this style of craft, i think it may or may not be viable to convert such a craft to the more familiar 'joysticks, screens, and throttle banks' cockpit, considering that it still has manual control of the engines (as stated by the presence of manual controls), rather than a more exotic thought helmet or thought chair, (or whatever other exotic and strange control formats one could come up with.)

[GoodETxSG]

in reviewing the online materials, it is stated that in Adamski style flying saucers, that the 3 orbs on the undersides of the saucer are controlled by linear sliders and/or rheostats (aka dimmer switches).

of this style of craft, i think it may or may not be viable to convert such a craft to the more familiar 'joysticks, screens, and throttle banks' cockpit, considering that it still has manual control of the engines (as stated by the presence of manual controls), rather than a more exotic thought helmet or thought chair, (or whatever other exotic and strange control formats one could come up with.)

Hmm, (This is all based on hear say 2nd/3rd hand info of Adamsky you know) to control a craft (Assuming it travels at speed in our realm in space and only in free flight in Atmosphere) traveling at such speeds with manual "dial" controls and no AI calculations or ESP/Mental enterface to the Adamsky craft... I bet these Aliens were grand champions at Atari's "PONG".

Traveling at high velocity in relation to other high velocity objects as well as stationary objects (If there is such a thing in Galactic/Planetary Dynamics) with Dials, joy stick and slides (Like on a sound board controller) is a contradiction in technology of 1. the craft's ability to traverse/teleport distance 2. the Material Science behind components... and so on...

Just like prehistoric people described craft as "Shields" in the sky or flaming chariots, Wheels with wheels... Maybe Adamsky didn't have the words in his lexicon to describe what he was seeing. They may have been just turning down the air conditioner (kidding)... But the round bulges that moved in and out (up and down) were indeed atmospheric gravitation focus/reducers...

But I would stop trying to dig through the internet to back up your low tech control system ideas for the high tech craft and do some PROOF OF CONCEPT... THEN COME BACK, with some video, skematics, telemetry etc... Otherwise this thread really seems like an exercise in futility.

[GoodETxSG]

http://www.messagetoeagle.com/controlledbypowerofthoughts.php#.UbEXv6KG2So

Helicopter That Can Be Steered By Power Of Thoughts
6 June, 2013

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MessageToEagle.com - A helicopter controlled by power of thoughts has been flown through a series of hoops around a college gymnasium in Minnesota.

The experiments have been performed by researchers hoping to develop future robots that can help restore the autonomy of paralysed victims or those suffering from neurodegenerative disorders.

There were five subjects (three female, two male) who took part in the study and each one was able to successfully control the four-blade helicopter, also known as a quadcopter, quickly and accurately for a sustained amount of time.


http://www.messagetoeagle.com/images/powerofthoughtshelicopter01.jpg


"Our study shows that for the first time, humans are able to control the flight of flying robots using just their thoughts, sensed from noninvasive brain waves," lead author of the study Professor Bin He, from the University of Minnesota College of Science and Engineering, said.



The noninvasive technique used was electroencephalography (EEG), which recorded the electrical activity of the subjects’ brain through a cap fitted with 64 electrodes.

Facing away from the quadcopter, the subjects were asked to imagine using their right hand, left hand, and both hands together; this would instruct the quadcopter to turn right, left, lift, and then fall, respectively.

The quadcopter was driven with a pre-set forward moving velocity and controlled through the sky with the subject’s thoughts.

The subjects were positioned in front of a screen which relayed images of the quadcopter’s flight through an on-board camera, allowing them to see which direction it was travelling in. Brain signals were recorded by the cap and sent to the quadcopter over WiFi.



http://www.messagetoeagle.com/images/powerofthoughts02.jpg


http://www.messagetoeagle.com/images/powerofthoughts03.jpg





“In previous work we showed that humans could control a virtual helicopter using just their thoughts. I initially intended to use a small helicopter for this real-life study; however, the quadcopter is more stable, smooth and has fewer safety concerns,” continued Professor He.


6LWz4qa2XQA


Mind Over Mechanics


After several different training sessions, the subjects were required to fly the quadcopter through two foam rings suspended from the gymnasium ceiling and were scored on three aspects: the number of times they sent the quadcopter through the rings; the number of times the quadcopter collided with the rings; and the number of times they went outside the experiment boundary.

A number of statistical tests were used to calculate how each subject performed.

A group of subjects also directed the quadcopter with a keyboard in a control experiment, allowing for a comparison between a standardised method and brain control.

This process is just one example of a brain–computer interface where a direct pathway between the brain and an external device is created to help assist, augment or repair human cognitive or sensory-motor functions.

Now, researchers are looking at ways to restore hearing, sight and movement using this approach.

“Our next goal is to control robotic arms using noninvasive brain wave signals, with the eventual goal of developing brain–computer interfaces that aid patients with disabilities or neurodegenerative disorders,” continued Professor He.

Paper has been published 4 June 2013, in IOP Publishing’s Journal of Neural Engineering.

MessageToEagle.com

See also:
A Milestone Towards Future Satellite-Based Quantum Teleportation Achieved But Race Still Continues!

European Physicists Break Quantum Teleportation Record!

[Bob]

That's it on the thread?

Sure would have wanted to read more on this.

I did publish in 1983 a document to the SIGINT group of IEEE dealing with interfacing neurology to fly-by-wire craft. It was one of those things DARPA tagged me on afterwards to find out more.. I never provided any more data than in that report. I don't know if it is still in publication tho. Digital signal processing was the primary key and Bayesian processing of the neural signals was the prime mode of operation.

What I didn't see in any of the threads was the particular gravity motors, such as how much horsepower is needed to affect a given amount of gravity buoyancy..

The DARPA guys said they were more interested in jet fighter craft fly-by-wire interfacing to deal with issue happening during heavy g-force rolls and climbs. So nothing was talked about neutralizing the inertial forces inside the vehicle.

Bob