ET disclosure is the ultimate tool of dividing humanity

[donk]

The whole ET thing Greer has everyone in a huff about is a gigantic distraction. Whether or not the public believes ETs exist or not, and whether they are benevolent or not, does not matter one iota in the grand scheme of things. The real disclosure has been out there for the world to ignore for decades, if not longer.

The real hidden information by “forces of evil”….and I am defining this as those that would manipulate our will for their own purposes—and will use FOE henceforth is the technology they withhold from the masses. This is the disclosure that needs to happen if the world is to change, and this is made difficult due to inserting ETs into the equation.

Because whether the FOE is ET or not, whether their tech is ET or not, is beside the point. I read somewhere that the computing technology used in “Houston” for the moon landings was commercially available around the year 2000.

I purposely bring up this important example, and all of the emotionally charged beliefs with it. Because whether the moon landings were faked or twisted or absolutely real or not is another distraction. Whether my 2000 year is accurate or not is beside point as well. None of that information discredits this fact: We are made to believe that the technology that NASA (whoeverthe**** that is—and this ANOTHER distraction—ignore the emotional attachment to the idea of NASA for a moment please), an organization we are to believe is part or at least working with the US Gov’t (another emotional distraction, who cares the exact association)…let’s call them THEY…they had computing technology something like 30 years ahead of US, and so presumably could have our FOEs…and that is just what THEY are OK with believing, and have nurtured a belief that this is for our own good.

What I’m saying is, that the general populace has no problem with the fact some people, thanks to their access within a certain organization (in this case NASA), had use of computers while the rest of us were at home with pencil and paper and slide rules and abacus if we wanted to work out how to do it. Of course, this is for our own protection.

See where I’m going with this?? Greer and his people/followers/fans believe that the disclosure of ETs will somehow help this problem, force the hidden tech out of hiding, I suppose—or at least open people up to the idea that there’s bad humans using this tech (and of course, all the aliens only use it for good). His detractors are worried that this dangerous, that this will be used by our FOEs to do further harm. Both “sides” are happy this is making it to the mainstream regardless.

I am starting to be concerned that the real threat, AND the real hope…both poles of the issue at hand, are getting lost already. And that this is all making the “anti-prime directive” as I’ll call it, the idea that human masses are unable to handle the “truth”, so must be protected from it…becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. While everyone is running around with their minds blown that ET is making himself visible, the real FOE—whether they be ET, human, or both gets a tighter on REAL information. Testable, verifiable stuff….free energy, anti-grav, good spiritual & psychological teaching (which can be considered a technology, if you look at it a certain way), anthropological “tech” (helpful techniques and methods of living)…all this stuff gets shoved to the side…I mean, what better way to keep the hierarchical pyramid of “civilization” (status quo) going than introducing a new “top” of the pyramid --whether our FOE makes this “apex predator” (which is what the top of any control-based/hierarchical pyramid really is) look friendly (Greer) or fear based (anti-Greer).

Maybe ET just disclosure will just further divides us as species (as it seems to be doing on this forum), and hides the real thing our FOE is trying to avoid disclosure of no matter: we are a communal species of eternal, creative beings…who thrive from cooperation and selflessness, not competition and selfishness. Who need to be provided information to fully realize their potential, and that the stagnation of “security” from information is the limiting idea that allows our will to be manipulated and even taken from us.

[ExomatrixTV]

~we all are ET-souls in the first place (with temporary amnesia)

[donk]

Your kinda proving my point. I think belief in ETs is the evolution of religion....with just as many "flavors"--and aethism is currently the most popular. Religion to me defined as a belief system built up around an individuals spiritual truth or ideas.

[RMorgan]

Hey mate,

There´s a major flaw in Greer´s reasoning about disclosure.

If an official disclosure regarding intelligent alien life ever happens, it doesn´t necessarily means that free energy disclosure will be coupled with it.

The government could very well disclose the alien issue while keeping the same suppressive instance regarding free energy devices.

Raf.

[donk]

Thanks raf, that's what I was trying to get at....I guess I didn't express it clearly?

[donk]

Let me try it this way:

The purpose of disclosure (of anything) is generally agreed to be “the happiness/freedom/actualization” of mankind, no?

Disclosing the reality of the existence of beings of similar consciousness/awareness/characteristic of having sentient life would go a long way toward that, no doubt.

BUT…is it really as practical as knowledge of:

Physics/biology/chemistry beyond our current commonly accepted understanding? (free energy would fall here)
Anthropology? (consciousness/psychology/spirituality would go in here, and economics and politics and religion would be exposed as the control mechanisms they are)
History? (this gets closer to the ET phenomenon…and so I would make less important, as we can never get TRUE history, but a more accurate story and lessons would serve us well, I think)

Anyways…the idea of disclosing ETs is broad. And it seems to be divided into two main camps (with infinite expressions and variations), but majorities are forming sides (already). And there is “evidence” (some more “fact” based than others) that will support your beliefs and poo on “opposing” beliefs.

So the idea I’m throwing out there for discussion is this: are we watching ET disclosure become what the big religions were back in their early days? A tool to keep the real knowledge hidden, with a nugget of truth put out by “humanity’s FOE”, laughing it up while they watch imaginative and easily manipulated “human nature” take it’s course?

[Snookie]

One thing for sure is that the RC church is certainly trying to get out in front of the ET's are at least plausible meme, so they can then claim they were the first religion to come on board/disclose. They will certainly try to position themselves as being directly beneath the ET's, so we will still have to go through the Roman church hierarchy to worship the ET's. And make no mistake, they will be telling us that we need to worship, these beings. How else would they be able to maintain their control over the masses?

[Nanoo Nanoo]

I think people are way too fearful of being duped into another following .. this is a diacotical existance

this perplexes me .. they are fearful ... of being duped .... into another following .... ie people are fearful of them selves ... fearful they have spent too much time examining potential saviours while their own inner self goes un noticed.

Do not put faith in falce idols !

There is one creator ( wherever they are.. he, she, it, us )

That creator is us

Look inside , be who you wanna be , love everybody equally , do not give into divisiveness through judgement , do not generate fear from un supported information but rather choose to feel good about your own instinct ! be brave ! be confident ! be nice ! do things that involve the thoughts and felings of others , beneficial movement towards goals of benevolence.

all the energy and attention we give to these agentcies distract us from life its self ...

what am i doing after i write this ? Going for a bike ride in the forrest on my trusty mountain bike ! Continuing to write my book on emotions ! Having lunch in my back yard cooking fresh salmon on my new cauldron grill ( i made in the time i had whle not reading dis info ) Living life as the ball keeps spinning ! Going to the hardware store to buy a beautiful screw driver i saw the other day on special for $4 !! Oh and a water tank for my vege garden !!!

Mind you if i lived in a country on the verge of civil war ... i would have been packing my gear long ago and moving to Brazil ! Rio De Janero !

Riiiepaaaah ! ( yes i know thats typically mexican )

Huga


Naniu


what are you gonna do ?

[donk]

I know what I am NOT doing: watching Greer's movie, buying into the hype, or trashing it either.

I AM going to examine the excitement (& concern) it is causing, contemplate the implications, and vigilantly observe what's going on around me, always on look out for opportunity to be helpful (for mankind, my fellow creators) in some meaningful way. Occasionally blurting out my thoughts and observations to check my mindset.

This does not mean I live in or with fear. I am trying to help people be less fearful, and less manipulated. I am offering my reality, in hopes of receiving feedback, or new ideas.

Your ideas are great, though not necessarily "new". Perhaps my title for this thread and the line of inquiry I took today came off as alarmist? I was hoping for inquisitive, with maybe a tinge provocative (though not for it's own sake).

I'm not sure if I'm making sense, but I guess the main idea I'm trying to transmit at the moment is my current mindset and the ideas I've been exploring are NOT from a place of fear. And are not intended to cause any.

Always love hearing from you though my friend (in fact I invoked you in one of these threads)

[ceetee9]

Hey mate,

There´s a major flaw in Greer´s reasoning about disclosure.

If an official disclosure regarding intelligent alien life ever happens, it doesn´t necessarily means that free energy disclosure will be coupled with it.

The government could very well disclose the alien issue while keeping the same suppressive instance regarding free energy devices.

Raf.Sorry to disagree with you RMorgan, but only the completely brain-dead could possibly buy an ET disclosure and believe that they got here by conventional (i.e., currently known earth-based energy and propulsion systems). IMO, this is the primary reason why governments will never disclose ET presence because once they let that cat out of the bag, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that they got here by very advanced energy and propulsion systems. Systems that would invalidate our current technology and the petro-chemical industry--never mind the fact that the sheeple would then have to acknowledge that they had been duped for decades, if not centuries, and forced to live and die as slaves to a handful of sociopaths who would kill their own families to keep their money, power, and control than to allow us all to live in peace, harmony and abundance.

[Nanoo Nanoo]

I know what I am NOT doing: watching Greer's movie, buying into the hype, or trashing it either.

I AM going to examine the excitement (& concern) it is causing, contemplate the implications, and vigilantly observe what's going on around me, always on look out for opportunity to be helpful (for mankind, my fellow creators) in some meaningful way. Occasionally blurting out my thoughts and observations to check my mindset.

This does not mean I live in or with fear. I am trying to help people be less fearful, and less manipulated. I am offering my reality, in hopes of receiving feedback, or new ideas.

Your ideas are great, though not necessarily "new". Perhaps my title for this thread and the line of inquiry I took today came off as alarmist? I was hoping for inquisitive, with maybe a tinge provocative (though not for it's own sake).

I'm not sure if I'm making sense, but I guess the main idea I'm trying to transmit at the moment is my current mindset and the ideas I've been exploring are NOT from a place of fear. And are not intended to cause any.

Always love hearing from you though my friend (in fact I invoked you in one of these threads)

Ha Ju talkin to me man ! ( said in neo spanish harlem accent ) cos if hiu are ! lol

sorry , still in rio de janero dancing on a beach drinking pina coladaaa ! wearing a sombrero and faking my hybrid italian /spanglish speak whilst not realising they speak Portugeso !

I love you rposts too Donk E Kong Guy ! when i say " you " i usually mean them , as in the general reader .. never singling you out as in you .

so whats the other post you invoked me in ? send me a link ?

Adeu ( thats portugese )


Naniu

[RMorgan]

Hey mate,

There´s a major flaw in Greer´s reasoning about disclosure.

If an official disclosure regarding intelligent alien life ever happens, it doesn´t necessarily means that free energy disclosure will be coupled with it.

The government could very well disclose the alien issue while keeping the same suppressive instance regarding free energy devices.

Raf.Sorry to disagree with you RMorgan, but only the completely brain-dead could possibly buy an ET disclosure and believe that they got here by conventional (i.e., currently known earth-based energy and propulsion systems). IMO, this is the primary reason why governments will never disclose ET presence because once they let that cat out of the bag, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that they got here by very advanced energy and propulsion systems. Systems that would invalidate our current technology and the petro-chemical industry--never mind the fact that the sheeple would then have to acknowledge that they had been duped for decades, if not centuries, and forced to live and die as slaves to a handful of sociopaths who would kill their own families to keep their money, power, and control than to allow us all to live in peace, harmony and abundance.

Well, it doesn´t change anything.

Let´s supposed the US government disclosures that intelligent extraterrestrial beings have been visiting along the years; Ok, that´s disclosure.

Of course, we suppose that such beings come here inside their highly advanced space ships, which obviously use advanced technology that may include free energy devices.

Then, so what? The ETs have the tech, which doesn´t mean we will automatically have it as well at the moment the government discloses the alien issue.

For the government, admitting that we´re not alone and we´ve been visited by aliens is one thing; This might eventually happen. They might disclose their UFO case files, official reports, boxes full of pictures, a bunch of paperwork, radar records and things like that, like other countries are already doing.

Admitting that the government itself has alien tech, including reverse engineered free energy devices and who knows what else, is a completely different thing. This is very unlikely to happen, or do you expect that the US government will ever come clean about their above top secret intel and black ops records?

You can´t expect 100% full disclosure, regarding any subject, from any government.

[gripreaper]

For the government, admitting that we´re not alone and we´ve been visited by aliens is one thing;.

But wait! Disclosure completely destroys the existing paradigm. How can we be inferior beings in need of a savior, the only sentient beings in the universe, children of God, put here to suffer until we get our rewards in heaven, and now there are others out there?

I thought I as special, and the only one!

[ceetee9]

Then, so what? The ETs have the tech, which doesn´t mean we will automatically have it as well at the moment the government discloses the alien issue.You're right and you're making my point. They aren't about to admit we've been visited by ETs for decades because that would mean they've been lying to us all that time. Whether they have or have not captured and reverse-engineered the technology doesn't matter because no one with any sense would believe a word the government said at that point--assuming, of course with all the proven government lies, that there is anyone still stupid enough to believe anything the government says now (just kidding sheeple). ;) So as you pointed out: "admitting that the government itself has alien tech, including reverse engineered free energy devices and who knows what else, is a completely different thing" and that is precisely why I don't believe the US government, at least, will ever admit to their knowledge of ET visitations. Even if the masses don't get it, the scientists--especially those who "know" it's impossible for ET to get here--will realize that they too have been duped and that there is physics and technologies that they just don't comprehend. Technology that could provide the world with abundant cheap, if not free, energy and transportation systems.

[ThePythonicCow]

Sorry to disagree with you RMorgan, but only the completely brain-dead could possibly buy an ET disclosure and believe that they got here by conventional (i.e., currently known earth-based energy and propulsion systems).
What percentage of the population would you guess is that brain dead?

(My guess is the substantial majority. Most people are quite certain that they are not rocket scientists, and they're right!)

[Carmody]

Hey mate,

There´s a major flaw in Greer´s reasoning about disclosure.

If an official disclosure regarding intelligent alien life ever happens, it doesn´t necessarily means that free energy disclosure will be coupled with it.

The government could very well disclose the alien issue while keeping the same suppressive instance regarding free energy devices.

Raf.

The two kind of go hand in hand.

You can't have aliens without dimensional travel, inter-dimensional travel or FTL travel. And or infinite energy and transmutation of energies.

The understanding of the existence of the other (one begets the other) happens in a matter of days of the understanding of the existence of the first.

Whichever happens first, aliens or overunity, the second very soon follows. And the rest comes along for the ride in a few days, no matter which is first. (inter-dimensional, etc)

The whole package, almost everything that is discussed on this forum... breaks open into the public's notice.

[InCiDeR]

Interesting thread donk, and in my opinion, an important question to discuss .

---

Off the top of my head, I´d say

No, ET disclosure will not become what the big religions once were.
They are based on faith. Faith, being belief that isn't based on evidence

Will it divide humanity? Yes, I believe there will be a high probability for this outcome. Those who see ET as saviours, those who see them as a threat, those who don’t give a damn and just want to go on with their lives.

Why did I came to that conclusion? Because I started with my family and friends (so I will probably “recalibrate” my statements when taking a broader view at the question at hand)!

---

For decades the mainstream media have done its best to ridicule the question about ETs and Ufos. In my opinion they succeeded.

When I ask myself what would happen if ET disclosure took place tomorrow? If I narrow it down to my family, friends and people I know, I would say:

NOTHING!

I feel slightly ashamed to admit this, and it saddens me, but I am convinced that would be the outcome. The program is really really working well with my friends and family.

They would definitely watch the news for 30 minutes, then turn around and go back to their normal routine:

- What should we have for dinner?
- What time do you have to go up tomorrow for work?
- Don't forget to ask xxxx about that recipe, it was delicious!
- Are there any good movies tonight on TV?
- Did you hear what xxxx said about yyyy?

NO! I am not trying to make fun of my friends and family. This is a most likely scenario.

They will not for a moment consider what consequences and impact this disclosure would have on.... everything!

The next day they will go to work and school as usual, just like an ordinary day in their life, and probably about lunchtime already forgot about the whole thing!

---

So, do I believe that an ET disclosure would be the most important thing that ever happened and would change the world forever?

For me personally, yes!
Otherwise, no, not at all!

But if it came in a package with free energy and all other delicate stuff we are aware of. Yes, most definitely

But I am afraid there will be no package. ETs are here, fine, but that doesn't mean that they will let go of their control mechanisms. Why would they? I am sure they will just find other excuses and ways to suppress the technology and knowledge from the people.

---

This was just my quick first thoughts, I probably come back when I do a reality check on myself and think this through a bit LOL

[donk]

So do the responses sort of prove what I’m saying?

Consider:

There is a nugget of “truth”, which is un-debatable in your eyes. Let’s call it “T”, whether it be ET life exists, a device has been created that cleanly transforms some unusable, unlimited energy into usable power, or that Jesus taught God = light = love = All That Is = ourselves.

You know in your heart that T is an empowering idea, that if people just accepted it, the whole paradigm we live in could change (in your opinion, for the better). That the suppression of T can be used to manipulate the will of others. You find that there seems to significant data (of varying degrees of validity/verifiablility) to support T, and loads of indications that the information against it is misinformed or intentional disinformation—pushed by those that seem to benefit from the suppression of it.

You have your favorite pieces of data you like to share, your favorite examples of suppression, and your own way of telling the story of how T came to be, and how and why it would be suppressed. Lots of “facts”, stats, personalities supporting, trolls against, a whole narrative and “reality” you create….counter to the “reality” already created that we all have been immersed in our entire lives. Multiply this by the number of people “awake” to T, which makes a plethora of stories out there…with certain ones getting “play” in arenas, in packages more easily transmitted than you sharing your beliefs individually…in a way you subscribe to a certain sect—or at least transmit that particular package with a disclaimer (whether heeded or not) to discern…every single receiver has an extremely different frame of reference and slew of emotional attachments to different aspects, so necessarily different people latch on to, shout about, question, dismiss, whichever part of the story that doesn’t resonate with their experience…and T gets lost in the discussion.

If you understand what I am trying to say, can you see it happening in this thread, in nearly every thread, every conversation. The subtle shift of focus from the common important element we consider the “truth”? Even when we mostly agree, we latch on to a certain aspect that is important to us, or maybe a fear we project from our idea of possible implications, and mistake that for the “truth” element itself.

It gets tricky with semantics…and that’s why I have such difficulty transmitting this idea that seems so simple in my mind. I think it might be something like: missing the purpose of the existence of the forest—for the describing/arguing about/making important/drama about/discounting the forest and/or the trees…jeez I can’t articulate this, I overcomplicate anything…hopefully at least a little food for thought…gotta run for now…

[Youniverse]

The whole ET thing Greer has everyone in a huff about is a gigantic distraction. Whether or not the public believes ETs exist or not, and whether they are benevolent or not, does not matter one iota in the grand scheme of things. The real disclosure has been out there for the world to ignore for decades, if not longer.

The real hidden information by “forces of evil”….and I am defining this as those that would manipulate our will for their own purposes—and will use FOE henceforth is the technology they withhold from the masses. This is the disclosure that needs to happen if the world is to change, and this is made difficult due to inserting ETs into the equation.

Because whether the FOE is ET or not, whether their tech is ET or not, is beside the point. I read somewhere that the computing technology used in “Houston” for the moon landings was commercially available around the year 2000.

I purposely bring up this important example, and all of the emotionally charged beliefs with it. Because whether the moon landings were faked or twisted or absolutely real or not is another distraction. Whether my 2000 year is accurate or not is beside point as well. None of that information discredits this fact: We are made to believe that the technology that NASA (whoeverthe**** that is—and this ANOTHER distraction—ignore the emotional attachment to the idea of NASA for a moment please), an organization we are to believe is part or at least working with the US Gov’t (another emotional distraction, who cares the exact association)…let’s call them THEY…they had computing technology something like 30 years ahead of US, and so presumably could have our FOEs…and that is just what THEY are OK with believing, and have nurtured a belief that this is for our own good.

What I’m saying is, that the general populace has no problem with the fact some people, thanks to their access within a certain organization (in this case NASA), had use of computers while the rest of us were at home with pencil and paper and slide rules and abacus if we wanted to work out how to do it. Of course, this is for our own protection.

See where I’m going with this?? Greer and his people/followers/fans believe that the disclosure of ETs will somehow help this problem, force the hidden tech out of hiding, I suppose—or at least open people up to the idea that there’s bad humans using this tech (and of course, all the aliens only use it for good). His detractors are worried that this dangerous, that this will be used by our FOEs to do further harm. Both “sides” are happy this is making it to the mainstream regardless.

I am starting to be concerned that the real threat, AND the real hope…both poles of the issue at hand, are getting lost already. And that this is all making the “anti-prime directive” as I’ll call it, the idea that human masses are unable to handle the “truth”, so must be protected from it…becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. While everyone is running around with their minds blown that ET is making himself visible, the real FOE—whether they be ET, human, or both gets a tighter on REAL information. Testable, verifiable stuff….free energy, anti-grav, good spiritual & psychological teaching (which can be considered a technology, if you look at it a certain way), anthropological “tech” (helpful techniques and methods of living)…all this stuff gets shoved to the side…I mean, what better way to keep the hierarchical pyramid of “civilization” (status quo) going than introducing a new “top” of the pyramid --whether our FOE makes this “apex predator” (which is what the top of any control-based/hierarchical pyramid really is) look friendly (Greer) or fear based (anti-Greer).

Maybe ET just disclosure will just further divides us as species (as it seems to be doing on this forum), and hides the real thing our FOE is trying to avoid disclosure of no matter: we are a communal species of eternal, creative beings…who thrive from cooperation and selflessness, not competition and selfishness. Who need to be provided information to fully realize their potential, and that the stagnation of “security” from information is the limiting idea that allows our will to be manipulated and even taken from us.

As far as humanity is concerned, the greatest dislosure would be humanity in truly and fully knowing themselves. If/when that happens, the other disclosures will seem less important.

[donk]

Agreed youniverse, and that fits in to what I'm trying to say as well.

The recent excitement about the Sirius movie had me recognizing the fact that nearly every disclosure's been made, is out there to see it, and one of my purposes, the things the I find important to do is, is get it out in frog of the people that are open to it, and open those up to it who are not (as open).

That being said, to me it seems to be a delicate situation. It involves having a thorough awareness of as much data as possible, as many interpretations and their intensity/methods of transmission, as well as an understanding of the target audience. Otherwise clubbing people in the head with a disclosure "bible" or just sticking it out there hoping it gets picked up is not only a not so efficient use of time & energy, but in some cases (where the message is twisted it easily shot down), it can be harmful to the cause and possibly polluting the sea of information with toxic ideas.

We are all building a narrative, mythology even, around Greer. Not that it is a bad thing, put out as much information and opinions and personal experiences relating to it is good...at least I think it's great for the discerning individual to have access to. Sirius movie is not that, though, so it is vital to have a "clif notes" primer to help newly awakened avoid being misguiding or filling in gaps with bad assumptions/ideas

[InCiDeR]

ET disclosure could in fact also be dangerous, because the majority of the people have no interest or previous information regarding Ufos and ETs. Without any kind of knowledge or information, how will people react facing such a disclosure? Mass suicide? Shoot everything that moves out of fear? Stop working because there is no use anymore? Paralyzed? Quit doing anything because now will ET do everything for them? Run into the woods naked, calling for ETs? Without any kind of information or preparation I believe anything could happen!

What are Greers responsibility in this and how did he handle that in the movie Sirius?

Then we have to ask ourselves, what are our responsibility in this matter?

I am not saying that we are anywhere near a correct understanding about Ufos or ETs, but at least we are aware about the issue at hand. How should we handle that? Give out balanced information to people that are not aware? What are balanced information and how do we reach people that aren't interested in the first place? Should we leave them to their destiny?

Neither am I saying that ET disclosure shouldn't be provided to the people, we have the right to know. But to what price and how will we prepare those that will be taken by total surprise? Without any previous information they will probably trust whatever TPTB are telling them about ETs and Ufos.

So... the clock is ticking.....

[Youniverse]

Hey mate,

There´s a major flaw in Greer´s reasoning about disclosure.

If an official disclosure regarding intelligent alien life ever happens, it doesn´t necessarily means that free energy disclosure will be coupled with it.

The government could very well disclose the alien issue while keeping the same suppressive instance regarding free energy devices.

Raf.

Except that it may (but not necessarily) put more pressure on gov'ts, institutions, etc. to loosen up when it comes to free energy devices. Major events tend to have a snowball effect like that.

[Youniverse]

ET disclosure could in fact also be dangerous, because the majority of the people have no interest or previous information regarding Ufos and ETs. Without any kind of knowledge or information, how will people react facing such a disclosure? Mass suicide? Shoot everything that moves out of fear? Stop working because there is no use anymore? Paralyzed? Quit doing anything because now will ET do everything for them? Run into the woods naked, calling for ETs? Without any kind of information or preparation I believe anything could happen!

What are Greers responsibility in this and how did he handle that in the movie Sirius?

Then we have to ask ourselves, what are our responsibility in this matter?

I am not saying that we are anywhere near a correct understanding about Ufos or ETs, but at least we are aware about the issue at hand. How should we handle that? Give out balanced information to people that are not aware? What are balanced information and how do we reach people that aren't interested in the first place? Should we leave them to their destiny?

Neither am I saying that ET disclosure shouldn't be provided to the people, we have the right to know. But to what price and how will we prepare those that will be taken by total surprise? Without any previous information they will probably trust whatever TPTB are telling them about ETs and Ufos.

So... the clock is ticking.....

That's where folks like us come in. Awakened people could help calm things down by telling everyone they know that it's all okay. That there is no need to fear. Still, of course there will be those that won't listen to anybody and just react rather than reflect. Those will seal their own fate in a negative way.

[Youniverse]

ET Disclosure could be the ultimate tool for dividing humanity, if we let it. Or it could be the exact opposite of that if the right people stand up and speak out.

[donk]

James Gilliland, George Green, Bill Ryan, Kerry Cassidy, a slew of others were the right people who stood up & spoke out and it was made available when I was seeking evidence of what my intuition and experience seemed to be leading to. My discernment of their stories and evidence cemented "disclosure" to me, and I suspect a plethora of others.

They stood and put their experience out there, but it's individuals' attachments to their own ideas and their openness to accept new ones that makes it decisive. So I am doing my best to point it out in hopes of making strides toward alleviating divisiveness by presenting what I believe shows the nature of it, while staying open to the fact I'm just as capable to close-mindedness and attachments.

I feel like I see the framework of toolkit or something to help remove some of the blocks in creating a greater awareness, that if I can articulate properly, any gaps I leave and angles I miss could be easily filled with the so many more brilliant minds than mine.

Saying "we can let it happen" or "we can hope for the best" is true, but I'm thinking maybe not enough?

[ceetee9]

Sorry to disagree with you RMorgan, but only the completely brain-dead could possibly buy an ET disclosure and believe that they got here by conventional (i.e., currently known earth-based energy and propulsion systems).
What percentage of the population would you guess is that brain dead?

(My guess is the substantial majority. Most people are quite certain that they are not rocket scientists, and they're right!)Unfortunately I'm inclined to agree with you. I used to believe that the majority of the people were relatively intelligent and reasonable, but I don't anymore. When you can offer people a plethora of evidence (much of it very credible) that refutes one or more of their beliefs yet they refuse to look at the evidence--probably for fear of crashing their world view--and dismiss it out of hand, a logical conclusion would be that people aren't as smart as one would like to believe.

[donk]

I believe it's not so much about intelligence as it is about denial. It's not brain-dead, it's actually a harder function I think for a brain to process: ability to accept enormous amounts of cognitive dissonance.

This is the program we must neutralize to, it seems imperative to help people re-learn the ability to accept new ideas, especially those that challenge the ones they've grown strong emotional attachments to.

This is why I think Greer's movie (and what he is doing) is a great thing no matter. It's at least a possible chip into that horrible program to anyone that comes across it/him. Back to a favorite of mine: don't mistake my posts for throwing the baby out with the bath water...Sirius is seriously important and ultimately "good" regardless.

The original intent of bringing up the ideas I did is for those of (I thought a majority of Avalonians) who've advanced past the "holy **** there's really a chance of ETs & free energy", and assumed most of felt/believed (based on strong evidence and/or direct experience) that disclosure has been ongoing for some time.

It was not to point out that most people have a hard time accepting the disclosure that material that already exists. It was not to point out the various types of disclosure and pre-suppose what we think the logical outcome and implications are.

It is assuming that we are all at least NEAR the same page on all that, close enough anyway, and to see if there are workable solutions, new ideas, different angles to look at so as to more effectively plant the seeds for these "brain dead masses" to come to their "aha disclosure moment" on their own--cuz I thought we all already knew how this works best, and didnt need another ten posts pointing that out.

Cuz I don't know about you, but I realized long ago, a little creature could come out of some folks stomachs and do a little dance like the end of Spaceballs...and half the room watching would still deny ET exists, maybe even the dude it came out of. I don't think I (or anyone or anything) can change too many minds, but I'm looking for ways to get through to those directly around me, as it's really all i can do, and it matters to me, in my life.

[ceetee9]

I think the really important issue in this thread isn't if ET disclosure (or free energy, 911, or any other controversial subject) becomes the ultimate tool for dividing humanity, but whether we (humanity) are going to continue to allow ourselves to be divided. While there are many factions with vested interests in keeping the masses divided and fighting with one another, it is ultimately us--each and every one of us--who decides if we choose to be divided (i.e., join one camp and alienate (no pun intended) the other camp(s) of thought).

We all have beliefs, opinions, and agendas and we form judgments based on those beliefs, opinions and agendas whether we like to believe we do or not. But the truly important thing is what we do with regard to our judgments, beliefs, opinions and agendas. Do we observe and attempt to learn and grow from the differing ideas or do we choose to segregate, demonize, and/or destroy those who don't subscribe to the same beliefs, opinions and agendas as ourselves. Only we can make that choice.

For me the choice is easy and obvious, yet it is not so easy to practice primarily because we've been taught our entire lives that we must adopt certain beliefs and philosophies and join groups that support and nurture those beliefs and philosophies; otherwise we will be shunned, ostracized, and labeled as "different," crazy, radical or some other negative term to be avoided at all costs. Virtually all of our institutions are designed to enforce the idea that we must "fit in" and not question why. We must be part of the herd lest we be outcast and fed to the wolves.

So while I try to reserve judgment and search only for the nuggets of truth and wisdom in everything I read and/or observe, I am still human and a product of my DNA, environment, and decades of brainwashing that (I'm sad to admit) causes me to sometimes succumb to the herd mentality that serves to keep us divided with a select few firmly in control of the program.

I sincerely hope that places like Avalon can help us all to fearlessly shed these chains that keep us in bondage and serving the masters so that we can all one day live without fear in peace, harmony and abundance. The choice is ours to make.

[donk]

Thank you ceetee...I was trying to say that with my previous post. I agree with everything you say, and what you described was kind of the "base-line" I thought most of here were coming from.

So what I was trying to do, was to get those of us who understand that, get us to apply it to the "problem of disclosure", with ET being the most obvious/popular/interesting/current subject, but as I tried explaining a couple posts ago--I'm real hoping for disclosure of ANY important information that exists that's being withheld or the importance & implications of which are being downplayed or outright hidden....of even just ignored or causes defensiveness or denied...

...just had this thought: ....because if we don't, we run the risk of CREATING a sort of a religion, or at least narrative like I tried earlier to describe, without recognizing it

[donk]

I dunno if anybody notices, but I purposely use hyperbole, "loaded" terms, and emotionally charged references often and purposely/purposefully...to conjure images and ideas and emotions and assocaiations as a demonstration of how easily distracted we can become.

As an exercise for myself, to attempt to avoid doing it, to challenge myself to rid myself (and attempt to help others to also do so) of the emotional attachments and irrational associations I have to a particular idea.

The idea here is divisiveness. How easily manipulated people are. How powerful ideas are, how much more powerful emotional attachments can be to them. How any TRUTH, a shared reality capably observable by all present, can be twisted easily, by selfish intent.

The real idea, forget ET and FE and religion, is LIFE, free will, acceptance and discernment of information.

[East Sun]

I'm beginning to believe that what we believe to be aliens will turn out to be the same entities mentioned in the OT, as in Ezekiel for example: advanced tech. with advanced individual powers. The people of that time saw them as Gods and threw themselves at their feet in awe.
They would still be far more advanced than we are. Even far more advanced than the "people" in power here using reversed tech. In the past they/Gods/Aliens tried to help, at least some people. Did they choose certain people? In other cultures similar things happen as evidenced in ancient teachings etc.
They may be working with certain "leaders" for good or even evil reasons or both. Where ever the OT "creators/gods came from would probably be where the present-day ones would come from whether they are already here or soon to come.
I wonder where the second coming of the Messiah would fit into this scenario, if anywhere.
The only way to find disclosure for yourself might be to become a Jesuit and work on searching for aliens lol.
If they find what they expect to, then we might get a hint of what reality is from their prospective.

[donk]

I believe that's possible, but again, proving my point. Presupposing what "disclosed" beings are going to do, their possible intent, their history and origins...are all discussions for other threads, and ALL divisive...or at least have the possibility of divisiveness.

Their has to be a set of data we agree on, before we can form an accurate narrative that's more like reality than myth-creation. I like to think here that set is:

1. We are not the most advanced of all possible beings that its possible we can interact
2. There's a "food chain" in our existence, that we all kind of agree on the basic science of
3. If one is true, then two implies "we ain't on the top of the food chain".

#1 does not necessarily mean that all beings are going to accept our #2 (heehee). They may not necessarily choose to "be the top of the food chain" (eat us, feed off our energy) just because they CAN.

We may need to qualify is we assume #1 means they have the free will (or illusion of it) like we do. I tend to, for the purposes of my threads, I assume other beings that I'm concerned enough to talk about CAN and generally do make choices

But this is what I'm saying is important: breaking it down to a common ground, while avoiding arguing the details (the devil is in the details--teehee!!), which are important, but you can't productively hash out without at least common refernce points and open minds.

I'm trying to figure out how to get to people to "break it down". If I'm unsuccessful here, what hope do I have for "real life"?

[East Sun]

donk,
You've obviously given this subject a lot of thought as have I and that in itself can lead to changing conclusions as time goes on. I put a lot of trust in what has been written in ancient times. I am not religious at all, but still, beliefs of the past did have a lot of knowledge that has been swept under the carpet.
Because prophesies in the past came from people who "knew" things first hand even though they may not have fully understood them, they are something to put into the equation in relation to today. They may be guidelines in a way.

This is the same world with human beings just like then. We know that we have been steered away from real knowledge but are now nearing a great change which may include a better ability to "see" things we did not see before.

The old advice is still dead on, "Keep an open mind, consider everything and discount nothing."
We are all searching ... and finding ... gradually. IMO.

[donk]

An example:

I used this:


#1 does not necessarily mean that all beings are going to accept our #2 (heehee). They may not necessarily choose to "be the top of the food chain" (eat us, feed off our energy) just because they CAN.

A qualifier used purposely to avoid divisiveness: it does not dismiss the possibility that all beings more advanced than are benevolent, while allowing for the possibility of malevolence (to us, as food). It also leaves open that they are benign, never found us and never will, and all other possibilities you can imagine...IF (BIG IF) you accept that they exist.

So my example, and a lot of the posts (inciders one on top of the page resonates with my idea) are all "spin offs", narratives, devilish details--possibly every bit as important, some possibly even MORE important than the "founding thought"; of which disclosure to means that this "founding thought" become "truth" to someone who does not see the reality of it...OR they can show with evidence (their own "truth") where that FT differs from the agreed upon "reality" we share.

[donk]

So I guess what I'm saying is that this thread is not for examples of possible implications, it's about how "founding thoughts" a group of people find to be "truth" and important toward the health of their community can so easily get lost in the details, with a subsequent latching on to pet "truths" unconsciously.

Is that possible to happen? Can it happen in the case of ET disclosure (has it happened before? Is it again?)?? Is there any validity to my train of thought (if you even understand wtf I'm even blabbering on about)?

[donk]

Right on east sun...and good example! Can you imagine there was a "truth" real close to reality when the prophecy was originally proclaimed? How it got twisted up and manipulated, in most cases without even needing FOE's help, just lost in translation, in second (& 3rd...) telling?

And can we learn anything from that? Is it possible we are seeing it again, in real time?

And if so...Maybe there's some tools available to us, which can help avoid history repeating--or even prevent self-fulfilling prophecy?

[donk]

This post by christian in the Wilcock disclosure thread hit was perfect in bringing coherency to the thought I'm working on with this thread:


All the information is already there. "Disclosure" always has this "give it to the people" implication. The information has been given. What's important now is, where is the awareness? Where is the will of the people to educate themselves? Where's the verve in the educated people to educate others? When is that gonna happen?

How about now? :)

It seems we are on sort of quest for the ONE DIVINE TRUTH DISCLOSURE, we have this idea there will a point where ET existence becomes “fact” to most people.

I am now wondering: when was “DISCLOSURE” of the world being round? What “authority” or “alternative thinker” declared it, and “made it so”? How long was it whispered about, the truth covered up? And how many people did it take to believe it to make it “reality” that you openly taught your kids?

[eaglespirit]

The majority of people on earth in all cultures have a loving heart and a giving nature...

This current momentum of 'letting the cat out of the bag' worldwide is new and different because the bottom is literally falling out from under ALL of the lies and deception and control in every aspect of our lives everywhere on earth...

Timing is everything here...and the time is now finally right...all of the ingredients are in the mix now for mass awareness to occur regardless the degree of individual intelligence and acceptance, the heart-centered momentum is too strong now and has never been of this intensity in one fell swoop before, ever...

This has been brought forth in a few posts in different ways here, Donk,
It IS A Unique Time, NOW...for oh so many reasons, some we can touch and know, others will have to wait to be touched and known as our 'vibration' increases by the day...by the moment...in ever-increasing-accelerating intensities...

Spirituality and science will dance together as one rhythm, it is inevitable and will happen quickly. And we all will upgrade right along with it. There will be NO government as we know it left, for the higher family connection this 'mass awakening' will bring forth will be like no other anywhere and abundance and immorality will come to life all over Mother Earth...
IT IS ALL NEW and The 'One Fell-Swoop' IS Occurring!!!

WE Are The Aliens of Higher Order!!!

[donk]

Love the post, thanks so much eaglespirit...I am just not so sure about this part:


Timing is everything here...and the time is now finally right...all of the ingredients are in the mix now for mass awareness to occur regardless the degree of individual intelligence and acceptance, the heart-centered momentum is too strong now and has never been of this intensity in one fell swoop before, ever...

It feels to me that there is a personal responsibility component to it, I wish I had the faith that everyone (present) will be 'swept up in the momentum', though it seems to be me individuals need to get their heart in the right place.

I think we all need to help each other do that (like you are so very good at!), so they don't miss out--stuck in fear and/or self abdorbtion.

And I really hope I am not coming across as alarmist or fear-mongering? I feel that i am coming from a place of love (love = light = truth), I am not feeling fearful myself not i wish anyone else to not do I think there is a reason to be (except maybe someone benefits from it, perhaps?)

I think confusion (information kept in the dark) leads to fear if we let it, and I feel we must bring light to any darkness, in order alleviate, to change the fear--"the little-death, the mind-killer", like Herbert says: let it pass through me and over me, so that only I remain.

That's my purpose anyway, to share this fearlessness with those around me, to empower as many as I can...and continue to grow myself

[Rolci]

Honestly I do not see the need for attacking Greer for trying to have ET presence disclosed. Yes, that is ONE of his agendas. True, ET disclosure does not necessarily mean free energy disclosure. But they are pushing for that too, and these two things are definitely interlinked. As soon as the gov admits that ET are here, we know of them, we are in contact with them, naturally our next question is, how did they travel here, do we know, if not let's find out. As if they haven't reverse-engineered enough crafts already. Don't forget Ben Rich's quote about taking ET home. Anyway, to the point, some people here seem to ignore the fact the Greer is also having free energy scientists working on his property under his protection and as soon as they have the tech that works reliably and can be mass-produced they will publish it instantly - free. And while that is the case, you have a problem that he by the way wants ET disclosure too? Which has a realistic chance of having tech disclosure as a side-effect if the movement gains momentum due to mass awareness?

[donk]

I stayed at The ECETI ranch this weekend, where I brought the only unbeliever (my 9 year old). We saw a bunch of lights on Mt Adams flashing around which to me were probably more fascinating than the ships, which we saw a bunch of but only one seemed to interact and two or three were more were pretty spectacular...the rest were teeny spots of light cruising along until the just disappeared.

So this researcher dude with kinda big ego and sorta abrasive personality was showing off his night vision technology and presented some footage he gathered, and my boy asked the question: how do you know they're not real, like govt or a trick or something (which other people were glad he asked as they were afraid to). While he asked in a mature way for a 9 year old, the dude answers using language I barely understood, some conflated grandiose crap that was like nails on chalk board to my ears.

Then dude puts on another commercial for his camera, and my boy asks: why are they here? (God I was so proud!) to which he gets another convoluted answer I didn't understand. So we go out on skywatch, where we immediately see a couple little dudes cruising across the sky and I ask him: so you still don't believe? Why do you think someone would go to the trouble to fake THAT (a tiny dot you gotta be looking HARD for, and the unexplainable lights on Mt Adams)? He goes: I asked that dude a question and answered with all these words I didn't know, I didnt understand anything he said.

Had to laugh, cuz I didnt either. And it brought up a huge concern for me: disclosure, the official government kind, will be a BAD thing. They get control of the message. They get to the shape the narrative their needs and sick desires. And no one will need to look inward, to question what they mean, to empower ourselves. Getting told about them by "authority" will do nothing to further the human race, and probably would become a tool for further oppression. Perhaps they are holding off until they have a better handle on clasping onto & refining their control of free energy tech, as ET disclosure was never as much of a threat to them except for the available of their tech.

So I have to go back to Christian's post again. ET has been disclosed. The "official disclosure" concept is a farce, at least a dead-end and potentially another tool of enslavement. I feel several examples between the start of this thread and now can easily show the original premise to be correct, I'm ready to take it a step further, ET disclosure by "them" is dangerous. People need to find it on their own from real experiencers, if not their own eyes, as the spiritual/existential component is necessary for anything positive to come out of it.

[Etherios]

donk i agree but its a dream that will never happen.

People WILL NOT WAKE UP ALONE ... Why? Cause they are too stuck in surviving the present to worry about waking up.

Even if you are the most kind and the most spiritually developed person ... if your family doesnt have to eat the next day you will not think of anything but how to feed them. So that person will NEVER EVER wake up by him self ... he doesnt have the time to think about it.

Humanity has reached this point cause people that had no survival problems were spending their time creatively and were thinking about the future. Did you read the no survival problems part? Thats the 1 thing that keeps humanity enslaved. You keep the sheep almost feed but never full so they NEVER day dream/think of a better future.

So either by the ETs themselves or by our enslavers ... people need to get slaped by something to wake them up.

p.s. personally i happened to come accross my fathers copies of Von Dainekens books that he had forgotten long ago. (this happened when i was around 15 years old ... 20 years ago) He told me he had no time to read/think about those "silly stories" anymore ... he said. At 15 years old you have spare time to think :-P

[donk]

I agree, there's way too many on the bottom of maslow's pyramid for much of a revolution, so that's why need to educate people and open minds the best we can. Work hard on developing real relationships so we can find a way to transmit nuggets of truth that could get people moving in the right direction.

I been doing my part, one person at a time. For those of with the luxury of being able to do so, I feel it is our responsibility...it is mine, at least. And by doing my best to educate and share ideas and open discussions the best I can at an individual level, I am improving my own personal life. So I can shoot for the stars, while making inclemental improvements on down here on earth, so to speak.

The ideas of this thread is not so much as to imagine how a genuine awaking (better IMO to disclosure) could happen or lament on what seems to be the impossible, it is to bring awareness to those of who already have more awareness of reality than the average non-believer, and point out a huge pitfall that could potentially disasterous to our intent.

But as life, the universe, and everything is pretty amazing and hard to predict, maybe that seemingly unavoidable disaster could usher in the shift we need. Or perhaps even--and like you said: dare to dream--conversations such as this one will help those of trying to approach the issue in a more productive way, and one by one we can work toward a tipping point...

...remembering we are all one...all in this together, even while it seems there's huge obstacles attempting to divide us. We can't let the emotional attachments to the concepts within this very important idea to dominate the reality we share...and if it does then out to just be a dream, I prefer the dreamer's life, always attempting to make it as lucid and remember as much of it as possible

[Another1]

So this researcher dude with kinda big ego and sorta abrasive personality was showing off his night vision technology and presented some footage he gathered, and my boy asked the question: how do you know they're not real, like govt or a trick or something (which other people were glad he asked as they were afraid to). While he asked in a mature way for a 9 year old, the dude answers using language I barely understood, some conflated grandiose crap that was like nails on chalk board to my ears.


That was fun to read.
This stands out well too:

(which other people were glad he asked as they were afraid to)
Grown ups, 'afraid' of questioning the great one. They act like that in chat rooms too
and will defend that great one to the death. Your not asking questions, you're doubting *LOL*

Bravo to your son.

[Etherios]

well man i agree with you but personally either i am really not successful in this effort.

Mostly i talk to people that have a very very strong "belief" that things are all ideal and nothing is above the law. I keep pointing to books, new reports, government reports but nothing.

I have a couple of friends that even on given topic they just ignore the news report or book and just "believe" that the world isnt acting this way.
Example 1:
The other day i saw a news cast in the US i think it was a DoD press release or something that the Goverment representative told the reporter not to read news from Drudge report. The Gov rep said i think " Careful with your sources". If you know about Drudge Report ... its just a site that links to the actual new papers / tv news on the internet. Drudge has no opinion on the news other than the fact that he selects what he thinks is be most important. SO i was talking with 2 Friends about this ... they dont know Drudge Report site and after 2 hours they reach to the conclusion that they dont trust drudge or the gov rep on any matter ...

They just couldnt understand that there is a site that links to news and that the Gov. Rep. is trashing that site. They "believed" that both sides were wrong ... but the actual news report (the actual reporter Questions was answered) was true. So for them if you go to a site that isnt approved by the Gov or it isnt approved by the mass media then the info is wrong, even if that said site just links to "official" news papers.

Example 2:

I live in the UK and i get my torrents filtered and blocked for almost all day ... it goes along the traffic regulation periods that is in Law here in the UK. So i am trying to explain to a couple friends that the ISPs here in the UK are blocking torrents almost 100% (alot of timeouts) during the peak periods. They all agreed that there is this peak period law BUT its illegal to block specific traffic so the problems i have should be on my side. I tried and tried to explain but no ... if its illegal they "believe" the ISP dont do it o.O (so far i changed 4 houses and 3 ISPs with the same issues on all the houses on the same time table.)

Example 3:

About the new UK porn laws that might be introduced in the near future... these are some comments
- "Cameron is preparing a law about forcing isps to filtering pornography, making it an opt-in choice, that's not making porn ilegal"
- "porn will not be illeagal there will be a filter that you have a option to turn off or i should say back on"
- "it is to stop kids seeing porn" - i replied "well kids watch their daddies porn anyway" so he said "yeah but that is down to the daddies and if your kids are out of sight then the next thing is a filter to stop kids from seeing porn you can not keep a eye on them 24/7"

The dont see the jail slowly being build around them ... for their protection. They "believe" its for the kids ... and that the Government is more able to protect them than their parents.


So can anyone here tell me how you can win over these "beliefs" of the people around you? They dont care about facts they just "believe" something ...

[donk]

In total agreement with you that it's tough (impossible?) with some people...my advice is to not even try real hard with people you don't care a lot about--it's an investment of emotional energy and time--you can only get the reciever to fully understand and accept the message if you're tuned into them and what resonates with them.

One individual at a time. Your responsibility (if you so choose &/or desire) to try to find out what to present and how. I've kinda made a game of it, as you have to have sorta detacement, if you take things personally or fear rejection it might not be something you wanna try.

Anyways: a friggin' little monster could jump out of a ship and slap some people in the face and they still wouldn't believe in their existence. Same goes for more mundane events they actually witness. Denial is a sonofabitch, people can only hear/see what they can handle...

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Sorry to disagree with you RMorgan, but only the completely brain-dead could possibly buy an ET disclosure and believe that they got here by conventional (i.e., currently known earth-based energy and propulsion systems). IMO, this is the primary reason why governments will never disclose ET presence because once they let that cat out of the bag, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that they got here by very advanced energy and propulsion systems. Systems that would invalidate our current technology and the petro-chemical industry--never mind the fact that the sheeple would then have to acknowledge that they had been duped for decades, if not centuries, and forced to live and die as slaves to a handful of sociopaths who would kill their own families to keep their money, power, and control than to allow us all to live in peace, harmony and abundance.

This is it in a nutshell. This is the reason, the REAL reason why the cover-up exists in the first place. And it is why the disclosure project is a sham, another flag-waving distraction to steer the UFO truthers down an avenue of hope and promise, which is all along just another dead-end, leading nowhere at all.

It will never attain true wide-spread publicity, mainstream exposure, or attention/acceptance from authorities, governments... the Powers That Be. Because 'they' control the project from within, of course they do, and of course they ensure that it does not go anywhere except the very limited spheres of 'alternative' movements, tin-foil hat conventions and so forth.

The governments will not ever allow the truth to come out to the masses. Disclosure will never ever succeed, not from these 'people' that run our planet. Not ever. And for exactly the reasons ceetee9 cites above. These tyrannies must be removed first, the whole system completely gutted out and replaced, every government, every ancient 'bloodline', every religious institution, every banking corporation, every monarchy. Only this way can we get to the heart of all the secrets they've kept from us. Only this way will all their lies, and crimes, be laid bare for all to see.

If that does not happen, then the only way the masses, the sheeple, will ever get the truth, is if 'them up there', who have waited long enough for it themselves, come openly, and do it for us.

[transiten]

What's your take on this? www.siriusdisclosure.com

[donk]

SM - disclosure will never be willingly truthly exposed by mainstream authority as it currently stands, we agree there. It would be nice to change it, though ET "truth" may be a necessary component. Non-bonafide disclosure already exists.

The inspiration for this thread is to take it one step further, stating that the "bonafide" kind of disclosure would not help the cause. It will be (has been) used against, as in the case with all the drama surrounding Greer's recent attempt.

Sorry transiten, but that was actually the driving force of my train of thought here. Greer was the face of those of us who hoped things were going to change. How about you? Have you seen that effect change in any way? I didn't see it do anything but (further) divide the "community".

[transiten]

SM - disclosure will never be willingly truthly exposed by mainstream authority as it currently stands, we agree there. It would be nice to change it, though ET "truth" may be a necessary component. Non-bonafide disclosure already exists.

The inspiration for this thread is to take it one step further, stating that the "bonafide" kind of disclosure would not help the cause. It will be (has been) used against, as in the case with all the drama surrounding Greer's recent attempt.

Sorry transiten, but that was actually the driving force of my train of thought here. Greer was the face of those of us who hoped things were going to change. How about you? Have you seen that effect change in any way? I didn't see it do anything but (further) divide the "community".

I remeber Greer saying that this project should not be managed by mainstream authority but spread among "the public" and "spread by the public" in the open. I don't take sides here, just report what i heared from the intervju where he explains how this "Disclosure project" is supposed to work.

[donk]

"Sides" is what I'm trying to avoid. In my experience (here), the drama surrounding the release (and related events) seemed to be divisive to me. Have you had an experience where the opposite is the case?

Full disclosure: I have never heard word of the movie or Greer outside this forum. I don't have a good sample and was hoping others would share different experiences.

[donk]

So I was listening to this interview, and James Gilliland mentions how Gamble or whoever the Thrive producer was interviewed him and said he brought the best stuff to the table yet ended up with a cameo, as Greer (as James puts it) stole the show like always he always seems to when they are involved in a project together, it's toward the end:

CnjowcFDJ50

Anyways make of it what you will, but I feel James has a good point that it serves no one to push a mentality that there are no beings "higher" or whatever that are capable of benevolence. And I also find it another piece of the puzzle to consider, I'm not the only one that feels certain agendas get pushed by spotlight dominant individuals...

[STR]

The whole ET thing Greer has everyone in a huff about is a gigantic distraction. Whether or not the public believes ETs exist or not, and whether they are benevolent or not, does not matter one iota in the grand scheme of things. The real disclosure has been out there for the world to ignore for decades, if not longer.

The real hidden information by “forces of evil”….and I am defining this as those that would manipulate our will for their own purposes—and will use FOE henceforth is the technology they withhold from the masses.


I wish to thank you for the topic. Secondly I'd like to share with you some new thoughts to consider both about so called "ET" and human nature.

We all know there is evil. My god we can certainly see evidence of this as surely as we can see evidence of consciousness, energy and structure in the space before us yada yada and so on. We all get that man has certainly demonstrated that as a species he is certainly evil often determined as such due to actions taken regarding ill intent.

Now, with that said allow me to introduce you to the idea that human, as in the human form is not necessarily the best way to be to live off world. So, imagine with me that you were introduced to something such as a species of 'humans' but off world humans seeded from the same base core DNA as the other planets by the originators but suppose that on each seeded planet the species of 'human' planted there adapted, grew and learned to become something other. Now this something 'other' is not necessarily natural. In fact imagine a society that learned early on many advances in both technology they stumbled upon much earlier than others as well as medical and genetic information and learning that greatly advanced them such that much as we get tattoos they can change and tweak their own genome to literally change their appearance. '

Imagine a government that ran programs of genetic manipulation to create warrior species. These have armor plating in the form of scaly plates and are taller, much more durable in extremes of temp. and so on. As things evolved imagine that although the entire planet was once the same species and all human that soon not only have they changed the way they themselves look but their own reproductive qualities to reproduce offspring much as themselves, and superior for the function, advantage, look or other perceived benefit.

Others of the same species went another way, evolving the technology to use drone extensions of the ships so they themselves, used to a lesser gravity environment could explore safely the harsher environments of planets such as earth. These, 'greys' explore as remote extensions of the ships, made of the same materials as the ships, tied into it and nothing more than drone explorer vessels controlled by operators on board mother crafts. Some chose more advantageous insect looking shells to experience life in by tweaking their own genomes to live longer, fight better, kill easier, and basically get rich faster easier and better. Regardless of the path they took you have to look past the appearance of the being in front of you realizing that we are all the same with knowledge and techno advantage being the only real difference. I can assure you our government is fully into tweaking the human genome to create a new class of soldier invasion force just as described by VonBraun. The aliens are coming, only they are not aliens. They are humans that have learned a trick that got out of hand on a planet elsewhere in creation and now its come here in agreements made with these off world astronauts. In return the off world astronauts got to birth otherwise normal children on earth that can lead normal lives as humans never knowing their own heritage or true origins.

Apparently a large cross section of society across the world has been chosen to have an occasional surprise birth of one of their seed among us that is now birthed and walking and probably typing here as my story matches those of others with questionable fathers. I have been informed a large segment of 'white society' was selected with O blood type. Many have a run away episode or missing time or they came up missing as a child for a brief period of time early in life and they have blond or strawberry blond prince valiant look to them, you know the little dutch boy look. These are many times I'm told 'donated' seeds to earth. Children of the stars some say and they will apparently exhibit some forms of Aspergers mild as well as higher artistic or creative talent and intelligence. Many will stand out as different spacing for their eyes or weird eyes is common and I understand toe and finger tip formation especially in how the fingernails grow and stick out from the tip is somehow different in many of the children of these seeds.

Forgive me but I'm trying to remember other bits shared with me on board one of their ships that I have been struggling with for a few now. Some of the parents of these kids have not been agreement with the idea of the children never knowing their origins or history. The agreement states the children of the of worlders will be allowed to live normal lives sheltered away from the knowledge of the struggle and near extinction of their own after outliving their own sun through their technology. Apparently they were on their last leg for how to continue on much longer with the infertility problems they had been having since the woman began having menstrual cycle issues after losing their sun system. Also, the deforming and stretching of their bodies changed them such it became impossible to live in a gravity environment. The children are otherwise normal I'm told. Oh it has been said to me that many of our leaders have been actively involved in all areas of glandular and genetic, genome and reproductive studies just to try to make a better astronaut. One that can survive in space, live there indefinite and I'm also told some research for thought controlled ships and drones is also just around the corner tied in somehow to fiberoptic type rods that can be made so small and so 'cell' like in how they self repair that for all practical purposes it is a self healing glass filament silica based synthetic life form that the ships and greys are made up of with outer casing shells. They communicate through the same system using light I guess and its all controlled by another remote pilot some distance from the explorer ship and the drone robot grey thing that is not really alive at all as I understand it now.

[donk]

Hi STR—thanks so much for sharing that…I think that deserves it’s own thread, I have a ton of questions for you about it.

However…it all goes along with some of the assumptions I made when starting this thread:
1. Most of us here that other beings/forms of consciousness from the 3d/5 sense earth humans exist and interact with some of us, and have for a long time
2. There are almost as many views on what form they take and what their intent is and how they operate as there are believers
3. Lots of people feel that some sort of “official” disclosure would give some benefit to (earth)man-kind, especially toward adding clarity or “truth” to the general knowledge base we use to arrange our lives and culture
4. #3 is an emotionally charged idea, that has people bringing up all kinds of tangential ideas into the discussion, which is “what is the purpose, necessity, and implications for ET existence to be ‘officially’ disclosed

So to get back on topic, I will quote myself:


So the idea I’m throwing out there for discussion is this: are we watching ET disclosure become what the big religions were back in their early days? A tool to keep the real knowledge hidden, with a nugget of truth put out by “humanity’s FOE”, laughing it up while they watch imaginative and easily manipulated “human nature” take its course?

One of my main concerns at the time of generating this discussion was all the hoopla around Greer’s movie, that was supposed to bring the “official disclosure” to the mainstream. It seemed to me then, and even more so after listening to James, that Greer is the most popular of “tools” those that control the “official disclosure message/method”, which I found to be particularly divisive in what I find to be the dangerous idea that no other conscious beings would ever be capable of the “evil” that mankind is. I also feel his presence in the “alternative community” may be intentional misdirection, as supported by James’ claims.

I encourage to listen from about the 50 min mark if you are pressed for time, prior to that he is sharing his views on reality, which I definitely reserve judgment of, it is interesting and some may believe informative or helpful or whatever as to how he sees things, though I don’t necessarily find it relevant (or particularly believe all of it…discernment and all)…but the stuff approaching the hour mark up the end is what I drawing attention to.

[mojo]

pushing for answers is critical..please start at 6:50

75RrgDuPkIA

Part of Richard's statement below...

"In a society thats supposed to be a democratic system of government , that is supposed to be responsive to us the people and which we can't get any information that's valid from our supposed legitimate government about ET, that's the problem as far as I see a very serious problem. And no matter whate else the existential issues why these other beings are here which are significant for me until we correct this agregious injustice we are going to have a completley screwed up political system for as long as we keeep moving into the future. For me disclosure is one key way for people to try and regain control of a political system that is supposed to be under our political control. We all know our politics are completely screwed up, and we are developing a global based totalitarian system of control. Its going farther and farther away from peoples control. So I ask myself what might be something that might be something that would shock this from going any further. I feel that disclosure is a reality that might be big enough...."

[donk]

Sheridan posits, and I have to agree, that “official disclosure’ is an evolution of the “second coming”, and personally, I can’t see it any other way myself. The anticipation will divide believers until it happens, and when it does, those who truly control us will have tightened their grip…it’s occurring right now, they are testing the waters throwing all kinds of “information” out for public consumption…personally I feel NOTHING is as it seems….

H-KtG4xAaGY

….so I just wanted to clarify the thread title…it is the ANTICIPATION of disclosure….the actual disclosure will unite all those who are still asleep and have not found their sovereignty (and continue to look for saviors)...I still can't understand why anyone here would actually WANT it??

[SPIRIT WOLF]

Very interesting thread, most of you are very intelligent awake and aware individuals, giving opinions based on your possible research into this subject over time. To many it would be seen as general publics view with the added bonus of knowing more of the multi-faceted topic we may call ufology. I and those like me are directly involved in one way or another, actual disclosure, so have differing views and opinions to some here. There are many well known names within this area, some come across as very genuine credible characters, some unfortunately taint the whole thing whilst traversing their gigantic ego trip, they tend to speak louder and longer and manage to spoil the whole thing for the rest of us.

[donk]

Thanks for your reply—I am dying to know: What am I missing here Spirit Wolf?

I was really intrigued by your post on the Vallee thread, can you give me a hint :confused:


Could it possibly be that the total, complete, full topic is literally one massive psy-op? I mentioned to Mel Fabregas of the final card i hold, the one i'd be forced to play at some point, is literally this, EVERYTHING we think we know, assume, guess, opinionate is nothing more than a well orchestrated global psyop, a psychological operation of such a grand scale no one could comprehend it. Operation Mountain Haze.

There’s nothing more you can add…you can only play your card when it’s time? I mean, I understand if that's the case...but I gotta try right, beg you to throw a bone :o

This thread was designed to make some kind of sense of it all…like this item: what do these people actually think “official disclosure” even means? That whoever is making decisions to keep us in the dark and lie to us decided to (or decided they had to) change their minds? And all of a sudden we start believing “official truth”?

But you went way beyond, where I REALLY wanna go, cuz I’ve totally been of this mind you mention, but where does that leaves us? “Beyond comprehension” by definition is a place we’re not able to go…

[The Castellan]

donk i agree but its a dream that will never happen.

People WILL NOT WAKE UP ALONE ... Why? Cause they are too stuck in surviving the present to worry about waking up.

Even if you are the most kind and the most spiritually developed person ... if your family doesnt have to eat the next day you will not think of anything but how to feed them. So that person will NEVER EVER wake up by him self ... he doesnt have the time to think about it.

Humanity has reached this point cause people that had no survival problems were spending their time creatively and were thinking about the future. Did you read the no survival problems part? Thats the 1 thing that keeps humanity enslaved. You keep the sheep almost feed but never full so they NEVER day dream/think of a better future.

So either by the ETs themselves or by our enslavers ... people need to get slaped by something to wake them up.

p.s. personally i happened to come accross my fathers copies of Von Dainekens books that he had forgotten long ago. (this happened when i was around 15 years old ... 20 years ago) He told me he had no time to read/think about those "silly stories" anymore ... he said. At 15 years old you have spare time to think :-P

I am all for a seldom seen, long overdue CULTURE SHOCK. Where people go, "HOLY ****, THEY ARE REAL!!!!" Ruffle the feathers, I say the aliens outta appear, en mass, over the major cities, like in the old "V" shows....and just hover there for a bit....to make mainstream humanity sweat a bit, and go, "And our government denied everything!" And then open communication. Mainstream humanity is too STUPID, FAT, and LAZY.....and can only change if FORCED to change. Don't bother with the "FREE WILL!" crap, since there IS not free will in the world we live in right now....just dog-eat-dog, stab your neighbor in the back, work you ass off for 12 hours a day misery. Man needs a swift, hard kick in the complacency and aliens are just the ones to do it. It's hard trying to live as a better person, when you're surrounded by as doctor who would call mainstream humanity, "stupid apes!"


Culture Shock time, and it's time to let the poop hit the fan, folks. And if some folks off themselves because they can't handle it.....fine by me, I feel that's one of nature's ways of 'thinning the herd' if you will, or at least not having to worry about the the smegheads.

[donk]

So do you think the forces that shaped our culture into what you describe would have anticipated that possibility and we are trying to prevent it? Perhaps shaping that very idea itself?

Cuz if seems to me, "official disclosure" would only be done in a way that makes things better for "them", and surly not for the rest of us.

I don't think the savior/messiah paradigm is a good one to pine for. And further, I started this thread to suggest the possibility that anything "disclosure" related from our "authorities" will most likely be used to take even more of our free will.

[The Castellan]

We got no free will as it is.


I say let's have the aliens show up, and regardless of how disclosure comes, the bad guys will LOSE. From what I heard, 2/3 of the cover up people WANT the truth come out, but that remaining 1/3 does not...and that 1/3 runs everything and they enjoy killing people, causing havoc and destruction and wanting us to fear anything alien. And they know one the truth comes out, the angry people will be dusting off the guillotine. And I really hope that I can get a chance to pull the switch once or twice.

[donk]

I realized I misnamed this thread in a sensationalistic way. The ultimate tools of dividing HUMANITY are gender, race, and class (depending on the context). "Official Disclosure" is the ultimate tool for dividing the "truth seeking" or "alternative" community (or whatever we label the division we use to seperate ourselves from the "classical official view of acceptable reality" type people).

The emotional charge on the idea of bringing of our beliefs to the "sheep" or "mainstream" or "those not awake" turns places like this into energy sink...dominated by those who more emotionally express how they right they are about their view of reality.

I try to encourage detached sharing of experiences about our differences and things we don't "know" about, rather than scream about how I "know" things are. I suggest that within the for/against the importance about official disclosure (and cheerleading/poo-pooing the characters involved) is the division of those that wish to project their hurt and anger and outrage of our true victimhood onto the external "perpetrators" vs. those that believe looking within for our personal responsibility.

I think it is essential to recognize we might better spend out energies working on balancing these differences, detached from our strong feelings about our cherished beliefs. Analyizing WHY we're talking about Greer's muscles or WHY we would receive satisfication cutting off our "enemies' " heads might be more productive than proving how right we are?

[Peace of Mind]

I have always been for disclosure/truth. But I’m now finding myself going against being told “it’s coming”, “it already happened”, “those with eyes can see them”, only a select special few can see them”.

Sooo, instead of denying anything… I remain respectful and just question everything. And, if the questions cannot be answered… then there is high probability someone is/was peddling lies for what appears to be for something dubious.

If this Alien hype is so important…Why hasn’t they come as predicted by so many? If they are here…why wasn’t at least one of them exposed yet? Testimonies (from strangers) are not disclosure, not without the evidence. Considerations is the most you should expect, but don’t insult the intelligence of man thinking “an elaborate story” is all that’s needed to persuade the skeptical. We are all in a world of suffering because we are trained to believe in hear say. Soldiers in the military are losing their sanity because of this “do/believe what I say and don’t ask questions mentality”. There’s too much trust in what is not yet proven. The conditioning is strong.

Also, If only a “special group of people” can see/experience them…what makes these people so special? Give me some examples of these special attributes.
To be clear, I have always seen great potential in this place, I hold this place in very high regards simply because people “know” things aren’t right and are seeking solutions/answers. That, imho, is part of the process to creating change.

When we notice the inequalities in society, and question them, we are primed for change. But, for a place (such as Avalon) to put more interest in such things as “aliens”…when the theme of the forum/website is to create communities that will assist in creating positive changes across “our” planet…we have become distracted, big time. Especially when so much time is wasted on the subject and nothing constructive/positive ever comes out of it. If so...please display it.

All I’ve ever witnessed coming from alien talk is “more division” of people. I so much want us all to be on the same page…if that’s too much to ask, at least make honest attempts to be in the same book. We can not go forward if we are still fighting each other on various levels/in many degrees. The separation of the social being Known as "Man" is the plan. Divide and conquer, make them hate/disrespect each other, make them despise their own being, keep them confuse/angry, keep them with those competitive mindsets and they can be controlled.

I totally agree that all the Alien hype is a hugh distraction, none of the material is/or has ever been verifiable. All the material does is it take way too much of our attention and energy away from the obvious important issues we collectively hold. We shouldn’t be claiming to be “Awake” and “Aware” when we are hardly showcasing that. Awaken from what? Aware of what? Those 2 questions alone hold very important answers to them…but what are the answers?

If you have something “important” to share…Please, by all means do so. However, just be prepared to offer clarity because we are indeed becoming more conscious of the trickery and deceit in this world.

Peace

[The Castellan]

Simple, this 'alien hype' is not hype to me. Let me see.....meeting intelligent life from other worlds, with advanced technology, traveling through space.....something I need to experience. Earth has always been boring and miserable. humanity was always divided.....just look at the Jews and Muslims. Don't even bother trying to unite them, unless you want to be bludgeoned to death by big, smegging rocks.

See, I don't CARE about humanity anymore. Stop the world and let me get off is what I say. I got better things to do then engage in some fool hardy crusade of spreading 'light' and 'love' to people who just wanna kill each other.

Besides, traveling the stars will be much, much more fun.

[Peace of Mind]

I used to think like this too^^,

but, I’ve stopped because it didn’t do any good for me, no aliens heard my cries, no one cared. So, Instead of sulking and believing everyone else had the problems…I reflected and corrected (still am) my flaws and learned to love myself even more. Life became better, my power of will became stronger, and my reality became more to my liking….simply removing that negative energy by molding it into something I can use to get what I wanted.

All the alien talk, well, it may not be “just hype”, that’s exactly what I want to find out. Unfortunately, it’s becoming a time wasting, discouraging task. If indeed the cosmos is what we are told…I too would like to travel amongst them. But, I’m finding myself in a position of scrutiny because of many unanswered (or vaguely) answered questions. Therefore, it is my obligation to seek clarity due to my past lessons/experiences with deceitful people. What I request should be easy to provide, especially when said discussion is feeling like people actually have the means to provide it.

Humanity would have not come this far if we were so “divided”. (See my sig) In fact, all of our division is caused by blind beliefs. Wars are started by a handful of wicket people…and carried out by blind followers. Standards are set by people with lack in their souls…yet, those that can’t or refuse to meet such standards are deemed incapable. We exhibit our weakness by fighting over nonsense. Like our beautiful unique differences (color,culture,gender). Variety, assortment, various perspectives increases the scope of our reality...as no one person/group defines everything/all. Ingredients,is how I view our uniqueness's, I'm reminded of ingredients to a enjoyable tasty dish. If everyone was thinking, acting, looking the same....you'll have no originality to progress, nothing new to consider/experience... ultimately the dish becomes undesirable to the point of boredom... the flavor becomes bland.

The nature of man is to assist and uplift each other and for the most part we have done that within an organized control system. People gave up their responsiblilites and expect others to fulfilled them…you will rarely find happiness in this manner. Most of us are lead to believe they have no power to change the world… but on many occasions our species were propelled ahead because of a few that refuses to be “just followers”. The leaders of the world (our very few elected representatives) change the world all the time…all by themselves. Just like the righteous activist’s of our past did. A world divided remains undecided.
The world’s people can only get better by following the examples that will actually make the world better. Be the example, be inspiring, be vigilant so others (feeling like you) will regain some hope and do their parts to assist in what needs to be done.

It’s in our nature to respond, not be stagnated. When someone falls, faint, gets hurt the people in the immediate area will show concern and automatically help. When everyone stops doing this…then and only then should you be worried. There are countless people just waking up to the atrocities we created together (directly and indirectly through the deeds we perform and neglect to perform). This causes unpleasant vibes. That’s why the world is in a state of urgency, denial, anger, confusion and need people “like you” more than ever. Waking up from a deep slumber will often leave you feeling groggy, the snooze was good and comfy, your equilibrium is still off, senses have yet to fully reset…You want more sleep. You don’t want to be a part of the nightmare we created; fortunately we CAN fix/re-create something better, we just have to want to, not just “talk” about it. When you choose to stay awake, eventually you’ll regain the lost consciousness, providing you with clarity/opportunities to move on in what initially appeared to be obscurity. However, Fear is present, but fear is only of the unknown, it is supposed to be faced, do that… and you’ll remove a heavy obstacle that was holding you back. I doubt you have much of it “fear”…as you seem to want to leave the world on your own to live with a bunch of species you have never met. Imo, that’s courageous to a stint, but it takes more courage to stick it out and fix what we all have broken. There is no other way around our collective responsibility, keep putting that off and you will remain being pissed off.

Just do your best, and make honest attempts at assisting others in recognizing their own greatness. I’ve yet to hear/witness a success story/happy ending for those that have quit in life. You want a particular future to be a part of…well, the future starts now.

Peace

[The Castellan]

No thanks. And some folks say that some humans have alien DNA in them, or alien whatever in their genetics. I probably have a higher concentration than average, perhaps, because I have no desire to do any of what you've said, and my desire to depart from the earth and be with aliens is getting stronger and stronger, almost like a burning in the blood or like those fish who defy everything to get back home. I have no inclination to 'stay behind and fix what we all have broken', I don't recall breaking anything, I'm not gonna take the rap and become a proverbial Atlas and willingly take that burden on my shoulders, no thank you.

And I offered to help others before, my intentions SCORNED, my help REFUSED. Just name calling and ridicule. So, let them reach for the pickle jar themselves, I say. I am not Christ, nor do I want his job. LAst thing I want is to end up crucified literally or figuratively . I want to be part of a good thing already made, that the aliens done already, NOT take part in creating a possible future here, since even if I did that, I'll probably be dead before it bears fruit, so to hell with that.

[Peace of Mind]

You're mad/discouraged/ bored.... I get it. Been there myself, and at times it feels it I'm still there. Many times I feel like I'm not from here too, more times than I care to admit. But, I've decided to ignore that feeling for now because all it did was distance me more from others. In that solitude is where I've done most of my reflecting (on self and the world). Except I couldn't stay there for forever, that would just be a waste of time/flesh/spirit/ thoughts/purpose.

Suppose tomorrow the whole world just snapped out of the spell and urgently commenced to implementing pure unification and equality around the world...would you then want to stick around? The world has always changed through events that were crafted by a few. You are not obligated to relegate or regulate, but to participate will demonstrate your desires. Nothing gets nothing, everything in our world was formed by "thoughts into action".

Perhaps ET will invite you/me/others..., but what do we do in the mean time?

If they "ET" are observing us, should they be impressed enough to welcome us? What will they think of us as a species...as individuals...our deeds/time spent here on this planet? What will your conversations with ET be about? Will the dialogue be interesting/inspiration/ insightful/...or sad? What would they think of you abandoning your world of opportunities for a world of unknown?

As i said, I no longer think like this because I'm still here. No sight of them either, well not yet. Now, in these times... I choose to deal with the "known" and deal with the "unknown" when it presents itself. You can't approach something that is not there...much less if it doesn't want to be approached. Why waste time on that? If they want to be known they would have made themselves obvious by now...all doubts easily removed, speculations destroyed. But that hasn't, and why? So if that interactivity isn't there...I'm not going to pretend it is.

We are here on this world now, it is our home now. You value what you have or lose it, sad case losing it when you don't have something else to replace it. It is rare for anyone/thing to move on to another home...if they don't know where they're going, seen/inspect the next residents/neighborhood.

Its easy to love/forgive/tolerate others when the love of self increases, you will recognize our tendencies, how fragile, yet strong we are. We need more people to help us remember this...to recognize this...and, to exercise this. Empower the people and you empower yourself. We fail when we "act" like we don't care.

Peace

[donk]

Well that's all well and good Castellan, but some of us feel the need to take responsibility, we really like it here and don't necessarily need to be somewhere else (I agree, it would be an incredible experience...but I kinda accept the reality I find myself in).

This thread is not to trash Greer or your feelings about living on Earth...but to explore the emotional attachment to the idea of disclosure and the effects of that on our community. Just analyzing one specific division among us, which I felt was important. I respect what's important to you and appreciate hearing it--though it really seems off topic (& divisive and distracting)

In fact, this seems like a good example of a phenomenon I see develop a lot: it's seems really difficult to stay ON TOPIC while discussing this...and near IMPOSSIBLE to discuss without at least a little of those emotional juices flowing--for most folks

[thunder24]

So you are just a user. Eating food others could have, and breathing up all my air. Hell ill bet you use electricity for ur computer to type all this un-responsible ****. Your a major part of the problem, you keep contributing to the problems... Stop driveling on about how earth and humans here are such lower cast. You don' like, then build a craft for yourself and leave. You don't like our lower technology, then quit useing it, to spread your dis-satisfaction.


No thanks. And some folks say that some humans have alien DNA in them, or alien whatever in their genetics. I probably have a higher concentration than average, perhaps, because I have no desire to do any of what you've said, and my desire to depart from the earth and be with aliens is getting stronger and stronger, almost like a burning in the blood or like those fish who defy everything to get back home. I have no inclination to 'stay behind and fix what we all have broken', I don't recall breaking anything, I'm not gonna take the rap and become a proverbial Atlas and willingly take that burden on my shoulders, no thank you.

And I offered to help others before, my intentions SCORNED, my help REFUSED. Just name calling and ridicule. So, let them reach for the pickle jar themselves, I say. I am not Christ, nor do I want his job. LAst thing I want is to end up crucified literally or figuratively . I want to be part of a good thing already made, that the aliens done already, NOT take part in creating a possible future here, since even if I did that, I'll probably be dead before it bears fruit, so to hell with that.

Should your name be "the cast", because it seems as if you are speaking like a character or part of the cast hired to bring this sense of non-responsibliltiy here. to put down all those around... Your comments sound like a spoiled kid who got their way as a child and now your stuck. Doesn't make much sense...

[william r sanford72]

i spent the first couple years ....after a supposed interaction with beings.tech.....and what followed left me feeling that maybe we deserved what i saw coming..i struggled with this..the guilt.u see i love life.always have.all life.and i couldnt resolve this division in me for a long time...anger rage.in the end i realized that most of it derived from my part in destroying our world.spirits..all of it..i was a smegging part of it.so i get where The cast...is coming from..feeln.. hell being a X convict..Junky for twenty years gives you one clear picture of truly how ignorant we can bee.Evil.just trying to talk openly to family got me a demon tag..possessed..still to this day.about my ufos..beings..psy ablities..etc..Donks thread is important on many levels...
and bitchn about humanitys major flaws.on thread about Disclosure and how it divides and im living this very moment.. is not helpfull man.not in the least...so..please..stay on freaking topic..and thanks for a kick butt thread donk.
Balance.
Truth always.
William.

[The Castellan]

Look who's talking thunder.


Perhaps ET will invite you/me/others..., but what do we do in the mean time?

If they "ET" are observing us, should they be impressed enough to welcome us? What will they think of us as a species...as individuals...our deeds/time spent here on this planet? What will your conversations with ET be about? Will the dialogue be interesting/inspiration/ insightful/...or sad? What would they think of you abandoning your world of opportunities for a world of unknown?

As i said, I no longer think like this because I'm still here. No sight of them either, well not yet. Now, in these times... I choose to deal with the "known" and deal with the "unknown" when it presents itself. You can't approach something that is not there...much less if it doesn't want to be approached. Why waste time on that? If they want to be known they would have made themselves obvious by now...all doubts easily removed, speculations destroyed. But that hasn't, and why? So if that interactivity isn't there...I'm not going to pretend it is.

1: Keep working on finding them.

2: You try making an impression of when you see monkeys in a zoo. They are still prisoners and unlike zoos, humanity does not get the benefit of free room, board and food. Humanity, despite being in a jail, still is laboring and toiling under the bad guy's whip to keep the banks from taking their homes and food, though food barely fit to eat, on the table. And the death of Kennedy, to me, was the 'official' moment the bad went, "You're our bitches!". My conversations the aliens would be me asking about their worlds, their culture, you know, making a new friend(s)....maybe even meeting my true family, or at least similar genes. As for 'abandoning' there was a saying in a Star Trek episode once, Day of the Dove I believe it was called where the Klingon named Kang said, "Only fools fight in a burning house!". To me, Earth IS that burning house. Plus...did Chris Columbus decide to stay home, no. Or the original Pilgrims, going, "I hate it here so much that I'm going to go across that great ocean on a leaky old boat and maybe I'll die!". Same thing. Besides, man's gotta see the stars one day at some point, I wanna see the stars, and I don't mean through some sissy little telescope.


And from all those ships seen in the sky, they sure as hell want to be seen.

[Peace of Mind]

Look who's talking thunder.


Perhaps ET will invite you/me/others..., but what do we do in the mean time?

If they "ET" are observing us, should they be impressed enough to welcome us? What will they think of us as a species...as individuals...our deeds/time spent here on this planet? What will your conversations with ET be about? Will the dialogue be interesting/inspiration/ insightful/...or sad? What would they think of you abandoning your world of opportunities for a world of unknown?

As i said, I no longer think like this because I'm still here. No sight of them either, well not yet. Now, in these times... I choose to deal with the "known" and deal with the "unknown" when it presents itself. You can't approach something that is not there...much less if it doesn't want to be approached. Why waste time on that? If they want to be known they would have made themselves obvious by now...all doubts easily removed, speculations destroyed. But that hasn't, and why? So if that interactivity isn't there...I'm not going to pretend it is.

1: Keep working on finding them.

2: You try making an impression of when you see monkeys in a zoo. They are still prisoners and unlike zoos, humanity does not get the benefit of free room, board and food. Humanity, despite being in a jail, still is laboring and toiling under the bad guy's whip to keep the banks from taking their homes and food, though food barely fit to eat, on the table. And the death of Kennedy, to me, was the 'official' moment the bad went, "You're our bitches!". My conversations the aliens would be me asking about their worlds, their culture, you know, making a new friend(s)....maybe even meeting my true family, or at least similar genes. As for 'abandoning' there was a saying in a Star Trek episode once, Day of the Dove I believe it was called where the Klingon named Kang said, "Only fools fight in a burning house!". To me, Earth IS that burning house. Plus...did Chris Columbus decide to stay home, no. Or the original Pilgrims, going, "I hate it here so much that I'm going to go across that great ocean on a leaky old boat and maybe I'll die!". Same thing. Besides, man's gotta see the stars one day at some point, I wanna see the stars, and I don't mean through some sissy little telescope.


And from all those ships seen in the sky, they sure as hell want to be seen.

1. There's no need to find them, if they want me/you/others...it would have happened. I'm still here, you still here, all of us are still here...and from the looks of it we will be here for a while. Its already been a while, don't ya think?

2.people in the military, law enforcement, government are people just doing a job. The hurt in the world is caused by a small few people running the whole thing. We know this. It's fear tactics and intolerance of ignorance fueling the system. If people see their fellow man will have their back, the right people will react. You don't have to pick up a gun...you might just be here to tell the guy down the block whats happening and move on. Would you help someone/thing a species that isn't willing to help itself? Whether they be people or aliens.

3.The only things I see flying in the sky are birds and planes. In fact, i've made friends with a few birds. I haven't eating flesh/meat in about 16 years, i don't kill anything, not even insects...unless its in self defense. I'm no fan of the circus/zoo/aquariums/ rodeo/ horse racing....etc. I value all life, just the last 3 or so years i'm living off of beans/nuts/ grains/ fruits. I didn't need to say any of that...just wanted to let you know that I make efforts to do better if there is opportunity there for me to do so. I welcome ET, just growing tired of waiting for them. All the delays makes me think the hype is just fabrications to create an illusion. IMO, that's highly suspicious, and distracting.

Peace

[thunder24]

ahh now we know what level we are at... still useing columbus as a measuring stick.... Im talking!
Look who's talking thunder.


Perhaps ET will invite you/me/others..., but what do we do in the mean time?

If they "ET" are observing us, should they be impressed enough to welcome us? What will they think of us as a species...as individuals...our deeds/time spent here on this planet? What will your conversations with ET be about? Will the dialogue be interesting/inspiration/ insightful/...or sad? What would they think of you abandoning your world of opportunities for a world of unknown?

As i said, I no longer think like this because I'm still here. No sight of them either, well not yet. Now, in these times... I choose to deal with the "known" and deal with the "unknown" when it presents itself. You can't approach something that is not there...much less if it doesn't want to be approached. Why waste time on that? If they want to be known they would have made themselves obvious by now...all doubts easily removed, speculations destroyed. But that hasn't, and why? So if that interactivity isn't there...I'm not going to pretend it is.

1: Keep working on finding them.

2: You try making an impression of when you see monkeys in a zoo. They are still prisoners and unlike zoos, humanity does not get the benefit of free room, board and food. Humanity, despite being in a jail, still is laboring and toiling under the bad guy's whip to keep the banks from taking their homes and food, though food barely fit to eat, on the table. And the death of Kennedy, to me, was the 'official' moment the bad went, "You're our bitches!". My conversations the aliens would be me asking about their worlds, their culture, you know, making a new friend(s)....maybe even meeting my true family, or at least similar genes. As for 'abandoning' there was a saying in a Star Trek episode once, Day of the Dove I believe it was called where the Klingon named Kang said, "Only fools fight in a burning house!". To me, Earth IS that burning house. Plus...did Chris Columbus decide to stay home, no. Or the original Pilgrims, going, "I hate it here so much that I'm going to go across that great ocean on a leaky old boat and maybe I'll die!". Same thing. Besides, man's gotta see the stars one day at some point, I wanna see the stars, and I don't mean through some sissy little telescope.


And from all those ships seen in the sky, they sure as hell want to be seen.

[donk]

Joseph P Farrell makes a compelling case for the idea I sort of tried to develop here, especially around the 45 minute where he draws the conclusion the ET phenomenon is intentionally manipulated into a new religion…

5rKJtImWGpc

[angelichuman]

So, if ships landed, they could be good Et's or not good Et's, Or it could be a landing created by govt/cabal,

So you'e saying that to be aware because this could be a distraction of the deeper information of the involvement over the years of the govt/cabal ?

So what is the first step if this happens? How do we know which ones are showing themselves en masse? I for one would just use my intuition and just look at what they are doing/saying... ?

But I would like to discuss or think about possible ways that would be a good reaction for us aware or becoming aware folks.
Thanks! Blessings

[donk]

Officially: we in the United States have a “democracy”, for the people, by the people, that represents and serves us…where our votes count and our rights are protected and those in charge believe all men are created equal, anyone can be president—or whatever they want—life, liberty, pursuit of happiness….

So when “official” disclosure happens or is achieved or granted or whatever the people hoping for/working towards it want to call it…whenever THAT happens, remember it will probably be as REAL or TRUE (and practical and meaningful—ie IDEALS that never existed in any part of reality that I actually participated in) as my above assertions.

What would be my “first step”? Trying my best to delicately remind those around me how empowering and freedom-creating and truthful/accurate every other “official disclosure” of human events have been to “we the people”, while trying my best to understand why exactly it would be happening…

In the meantime, I do my best to help people see real disclosure is all around the reality I exist, and is way more meaningful and practical than anything “official” ever could be. And I never met an ET or ED, or seen a ship closer than appearing as a distant distant speck that coulda been anything…

[angelichuman]

Officially: we in the United States have a “democracy”, for the people, by the people, that represents and serves us…where our votes count and our rights are protected and those in charge believe all men are created equal, anyone can be president—or whatever they want—life, liberty, pursuit of happiness….

So when “official” disclosure happens or is achieved or granted or whatever the people hoping for/working towards it want to call it…whenever THAT happens, remember it will probably be as REAL or TRUE (and practical and meaningful—ie IDEALS that never existed in any part of reality that I actually participated in) as my above assertions.


What would be my “first step”? Trying my best to delicately remind those around me how empowering and freedom-creating and truthful/accurate every other “official disclosure” of human events have been to “we the people”, while trying my best to understand why exactly it would be happening…

In the meantime, I do my best to help people see real disclosure is all around the reality I exist, and is way more meaningful and practical than anything “official” ever could be. And I never met an ET or ED, or seen a ship closer than appearing as a distant distant speck that coulda been anything…

Hi, Are u being sarcastic? lol that how 'We' handled previous disclosures to the people wasn't that great?
I cant imagine my neighbors, even knowing about the past so well.

"Real disclosure is all around the reality, that I exist." nice.

I don't know, but my feathers are ruffles just thinking of more bs that they could say or plan a landing being with their own craft, would just be wrong, in many ways. I hope it doesn't happen that way.
If its the good guys, I heard we would ''feel the love''. So that sounds better! Lol

What are good ways to react/respond if one of these scenarios does happen? Any more ideas all?

[donk]

What I meant is I would love to believe those things, and that a lot of people around seem to say they believe those things, but I exist in a different reality.

So if/when in this reality that i seem to inhabit and even share with other beings that also seem to experience it like me, if/when in this reality there is an official disclosure that ET exist--and "we" (the government) have known about it--I will do best my to remind people that it is a lie based on a fragment of reality that "they" control....and that it is in fact more than likely another tool for "them" to manipulate our reality.

Real disclosure can only happen (in my mind, to my reality) by actually experiencning it, or my seeing enough evidence that it makes the most sense that it does exist despite not having directly experiencing it.

So in your hypothetical where it does happen, I would try to explain that to those I care about as my first step. Then anyone "on board" with my reality and I will work together to come up with the next steps. With a firm understanding, that the disclosure itself is most likely a tool of oppression, or at the very least confusion and division

So what I am suggesting to you personally is: what does disclosure mean to you, and how does it effect your reality? Understand that thoroughly, so that if "official" disclosure comes, you will be able to get some people around you on board to the reality you exist in. Is there really anything more you CAN do??

[angelichuman]

What I meant is I would love to believe those things, and that a lot of people around seem to say they believe those things, but I exist in a different reality.

So if/when in this reality that i seem to inhabit and even share with other beings that also seem to experience it like me, if/when in this reality there is an official disclosure that ET exist--and "we" (the government) have known about it--I will do best my to remind people that it is a lie based on a fragment of reality that "they" control....and that it is in fact more than likely another tool for "them" to manipulate our reality.

Real disclosure can only happen (in my mind, to my reality) by actually experiencning it, or my seeing enough evidence that it makes the most sense that it does exist despite not having directly experiencing it.

So in your hypothetical where it does happen, I would try to explain that to those I care about as my first step. Then anyone "on board" with my reality and I will work together to come up with the next steps. With a firm understanding, that the disclosure itself is most likely a tool of oppression, or at the very least confusion and division

So what I am suggesting to you personally is: what does disclosure mean to you, and how does it effect your reality? Understand that thoroughly, so that if "official" disclosure comes, you will be able to get some people around you on board to the reality you exist in. Is there really anything more you CAN do??

Hmm, nice concept.. In my reality they don't control me..

"With a firm understanding, that the disclosure itself is most likely a tool of oppression, or at the very least confusion and division" Good to know youre view

Thanks for the ideas, def thinking about it. Hmm I could see myself sharing what I know to a group of people, but
It just bothers me that a lot of people are working so hard and tired all the time when the govt'' could easily make things easier.
If its a real benevolent Et disclosure, than that would be different.
thoughts!

[donk]

Government closure of benevolent ETs from sounds oxymoronic to me..."hi: we're the government, we're here to help!" I haven't found that to fit into the reality I exist in.

From what I can tell, people that have the positions/ability to effect change (for example, allowing the poisoning our land/air/sea, or engineering the genocide of the inhabitants of the Gaza Strip) are possessed of an anti-human force, it's hard for me to imagine a break from that paradigm.

...But if this reality really ends up doing just that, we'd be in good shape, and have nothing to worry about, right?

[angelichuman]

Government closure of benevolent ETs from sounds oxymoronic to me..."hi: we're the government, we're here to help!" I haven't found that to fit into the reality I exist in.

From what I can tell, people that have the positions/ability to effect change (for example, allowing the poisoning our land/air/sea, or engineering the genocide of the inhabitants of the Gaza Strip) are possessed of an anti-human force, it's hard for me to imagine a break from that paradigm.

...But if this reality really ends up doing just that, we'd be in good shape, and have nothing to worry about, right?

I meant that if the benevolent Et's come by themselves, disregarding the govt, that would be better, in my opinion.
Then the govt and their craft, trying to confuse us. But we could figure it out! what to do about this.

I do think its possible to break out of that paradigm. Have you heard of Laure M Eisenhower? At the end of her interview (on youtube with Alfre something) she mentions how if we get into the unity consciousness and grow in the spiritual side of things, then those 4d vampire rept cant possess anyone.
She describes it way better!! She brings hope to this situation.

anyways..
I still want to figure out how to react if the govt pull something tho..

[donk]

I still want to figure out how to react if the govt pull something tho..


IF "the govt" pulls something?

"the govt" is a magical entity manipulated into something that you (and most others) believe in (and thereby give power to), which individuals hide behind--as they are currently PULLING SOMETHING: suppressing information that they are privvy to, that may benefit others. These days it's a shapeshifting legion of organizations, personalities (figureheads/puppets), and thought forms.

We will never fix (or defeat, or not be oppressed by) THE GOVT until we drop the thoughts that create faith-based system, and recognize that it can't exist without INDIVIDUALS MAKING DECISIONS. I exist in a physical reality where beings exist that should be able to be identified, and therefore held accountable...rather than having such abstractions as "America" or "authoriities" or whatever getting the blame.

I think the most important thought to base all possible solutions or reactions is to try your best to identify who (or what) is making the decision that creates the situation that you are concerned about, so that you may try to discern WHY. If we don't properly identify the problem, it makes it difficult to come up with a solution

[angelichuman]

Hmm, good ideas.
I meant that if the 'govt' (of either kind) uses their own craft, to fly above a bunch of cities, 'disclosure' but try to spin it as being Et's, that would be 'bad'
That is what I thought this thread is partially about. How to be aware of the different things that could happen. And what could be leading us away from the reality of whats really happening.
I just got a feeling as I read your initial post, how that scenario, above, could happen. Thanks for opening our minds and sharing positive ways we can act/ or react. And to become even more aware.
Bless~




I still want to figure out how to react if the govt pull something tho..


IF "the govt" pulls something?

"the govt" is a magical entity manipulated into something that you (and most others) believe in (and thereby give power to), which individuals hide behind--as they are currently PULLING SOMETHING: suppressing information that they are privvy to, that may benefit others. These days it's a shapeshifting legion of organizations, personalities (figureheads/puppets), and thought forms.

We will never fix (or defeat, or not be oppressed by) THE GOVT until we drop the thoughts that create faith-based system, and recognize that it can't exist without INDIVIDUALS MAKING DECISIONS. I exist in a physical reality where beings exist that should be able to be identified, and therefore held accountable...rather than having such abstractions as "America" or "authoriities" or whatever getting the blame.

I think the most important thought to base all possible solutions or reactions is to try your best to identify who (or what) is making the decision that creates the situation that you are concerned about, so that you may try to discern WHY. If we don't properly identify the problem, it makes it difficult to come up with a solution

[donk]

Your welcome, I understand what you are saying…the thread is about how discussion and working out disclosure of your** hypothetical scenario, is a tool IN ITSELF for distracting us, effectively dividing us….possibly enabling the actual scenario to have a chance at working.

**by YOUR, I mean: that of the community of those of those who “believe in” and are interested in UFOs and ET-related material, of which I consider myself a part of

See what I’m getting at? I’m asserting that part of any “Project Bluebeam” type of operation would need to be the creation of an “official disclosure movement” where an “alternative community” anyone semi-credible and intelligent is going around in circles with other seemingly credible and provably intelligent folks argue about their pet (implanted) beliefs about the nature/motives of “ET”.

I further postulate that an effective aspect of this “project: alternative community” would be the insertion of a “holy grail/smoking gun” of OFFICIAL DISCLOSURE, some seemingly concrete objective, “get the gov’t to give us real info”. Throw in a dash of celebrity, a helping of Ph.Ds, some big egos, you got built in plausible deniability, skeletons ready to be dragged out of closets, a ready made self-fullfilling prophecy…all obfuscated by the people with the most knowledge, more-open minds, etc… a total mind-f*ck

In this enigma-wrapped in puzzle-buried in a shot storm, you could pull any psyop you wanted to, if you were so inclined. Why would a “government”, a “nation”, a “people” do that? I dunno, but I can think of lots of agendas I’d be able to try to pull off if I were aso inclined and had everybody who’d believe I existed arguing amongst themselves over motives they were putting on me (or some hidden friend/enemy).

So I guess what I’m saying is: much more important than imagining some possible “officially manufactured reality”, we need to be thinking about how any reality can be manufactured (even by ourselves, without even realizing it), how to convince the unaware that the reality we currently exist in is largely “officially manufactured”, and what the implications of that are.