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View Full Version : Reuters: Do [ Bacterial Toxins ] Cause Heart Attack and Stroke? "TMAOs", etc!



Tesla_WTC_Solution
29th April 2013, 15:06
OR, How SOY LECITHIN IS KILLING US

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/04/24/heart-microbe-idUSL2N0D62D120130424

Gut bugs are implicated in heart attacks and stroke


By Sharon Begley
NEW YORK, April 24 | Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:59pm EDT
(Reuters) - Thousands of heart attack victims every year have none of the notorious risk factors before their crisis - not high cholesterol, not unhealthy triglycerides. Now the search for the mystery culprits has turned up some surprising suspects: the trillions of bacteria and other microbes living in the human gut.

In a study released on Wednesday, scientists discovered that some of the bugs turn lecithin - a nutrient in egg yolks, liver, beef, pork and wheat germ - into an artery-clogging compound called TMAO. They also found that blood levels of TMAO predict heart attack, stroke or death, and do so "independent of other risk factors," said Dr Stanley Hazen, chairman of cellular and molecular medicine at the Cleveland Clinic's Lerner Research Institute, who led the study.

That suggests a TMAO test could enter the arsenal of blood tests that signal possible cardiovascular problems ahead. "TMAO might identify people who are at risk (for heart attacks and strokes) despite having no other risk factors," Hazen said.

The discovery also suggests a new approach to preventing these cardiovascular events: altering gut bacteria so they churn out less TMAO.

The study joins a growing list of findings that link human "microbiota" - microbes in the gut, nose and genital tract, and on the skin - to health and disease. Research has shown that certain species of gut bacteria protect against asthma, for instance, while others affect the risk of obesity. Last week scientists reported that circumcision alters bacteria in the penis, and that this change (not only the anatomical one) helps protect men from HIV/AIDS, probably by reducing the number of bacteria that live in oxygen-free environments such as under the foreskin.

"It's very strong work," Dr Martin Blaser of New York University Langone Medical Center, a pioneer in studies of the microbiota, said of the TMAO study. "They show clearly that human microbiota play a key role in producing TMAO, suggesting new approaches to prevention and treatment" of cardiovascular disease.

NORMAL CHOLESTEROL, FATAL HEART ATTACK

The new study builds on a 2011 discovery by the Cleveland Clinic team that, in lab mice, gut bacteria turn lecithin in food into TMAO, or trimethylamine-N-oxide, causing heart disease. In addition, they found, people with high levels of TMAO are more likely to have heart disease.

But that research left two questions hanging: Do human gut bacteria trigger the lecithin-to-TMAO alchemy, like those in mice? And do high levels of TMAO predict heart attacks and stroke in people many years out, not simply mark the presence of cardiovascular disease at the time of the blood test?

To answer the first question, Hazen and his colleagues had 40 healthy adults eat two hard-boiled eggs, which contain lots of lecithin. Just as in lab mice, TMAO levels in the blood rose. After a week of broad-spectrum antibiotics, however, the volunteers' TMAO levels barely budged after they ate eggs, the researchers reported in the New England Journal of Medicine.

"That showed that the intestinal bacteria (which antibiotics kill) are essential for forming TMAO," said Hazen.

Next, to see whether TMAO predicts cardiovascular events, the researchers measured its levels in 4,007 heart patients. After accounting for such risk factors as age and a past heart attack, they found that high levels of TMAO were predictive of heart attack, stroke and death over the three years that the patients were followed.

Moreover, TMAO predicted risk more accurately than triglyceride or cholesterol levels, Hazen said. And it did so in people without substantial coronary artery disease or dangerous lipid levels as well as in sicker patients.

Specifically, people in the top 25 percent of TMAO levels had 2.5 times the risk of a heart attack or stroke compared to people in the bottom quartile.

The reason TMAO is so potent is that it makes blood cholesterol build up on artery walls, causing atherosclerosis (hardening of the arteries) and, if the buildup ruptures and blocks an artery, stroke or heart attack.

Earlier this month, the Cleveland Clinic researchers reported that gut bugs also transform carnitine, a nutrient found in red meat and dairy products, into TMAO, at least in meat eaters. Vegetarians made much less TMAO even when eating carnitine as part of the study, suggesting that avoiding meat reduces the gut bacteria that turn carnitine into TMAO, while regular helpings of dead animals encourages their growth and thus the production of TMAO.

More studies are needed to show whether TMAO reliably predicts cardiovascular crises, and does so better than other blood tests. Experts disagree on how many people have no other risk factors but would be flagged by TMAO. Dr Gordon Tomaselli, chief of cardiology at Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine and past president of the American Heart Association, guesses it is less than 10 percent or so of the people who eventually have heart crises.

Someone with high levels of TMAO could reduce her cardiovascular risk by eating fewer egg yolks and less beef and pork. But someone with a two-eggs-a-day habit but low TMAO probably has gut microbes that aren't very adept at converting lecithin to TMAO, meaning she can eat eggs and the like without risking a coronary.

Just as statins control unhealthy cholesterol, prebiotics (compounds that nurture "healthy" gut microbes) or probiotics (the good bugs themselves) might control unhealthy TMAO. For now, however, no one knows which prebiotics or probiotics might do that. In one study, probiotics actually increased TMAO-producing bacteria - "not what you want," Hazen said.

Neither will popping antibiotics work: bacteria become resistant to the drugs. Developing compounds that crimp the ability of the bacteria to turn lecithin into TMAO, Hazen said, is more likely to succeed. (Reporting by Sharon Begley; editing by Michelle Gershberg and Prudence Crowther)
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http://treato.com/Soy+Lecithin,Cholesterol/?a=s

I was researching Soy Lecithin Oil and came across this... 03/06/2012
...I agree. I was researching Soy Lecithin Oil and came across this ...atherosclerosis in mice through TMAO production and 'augmented macrophage cholesterol accumulation and foam cell formation'. [8] Mice fed with egg-yolk... (from www.heartvalvepatients.org) Read full post

conk
29th April 2013, 16:08
Did they miss the whole point of the story, that the bad gut bacteria are prevailing and that the correct ratio of 80/20 (good/bad) of gut bacteria is off in those susceptible to the TMAOs? Sounds like a commercial for anti-biotics (anti-life).

bruno dante
29th April 2013, 16:37
I don't have any respect for the Cleveland Clinic. How can you claim professionalism when you neglect to treat the heart with what clearly works: coq10, carnitine, magnesium and ribose. They pretend it doesn't exist even though it has healed thousands of hearts...with problems ranging from high bp to heart failure....

I notice they even have carnitine as a culprit in TMAO production. And lecithin, which has been used for years as an artery cleanser.

Makes me suspicious. Next they'll be incriminating coq10

Tesla_WTC_Solution
29th April 2013, 16:51
They failed to mention soy, which is why i added soy lecithin to the top of the thread!

i agree that in these studies and articles, things are omitted!

it is up to us, the consumers of information, to correct this! ;)

wikipedia:

Lecithin can easily be extracted chemically (using hexane, ethanol, acetone, petroleum ether, benzene, etc.) or mechanically. It is usually available from sources such as soy beans, eggs, milk, marine sources, rapeseed, cottonseed, and sunflower. It has low solubility in water, but is an excellent emulsifier. In aqueous solution, its phospholipids can form either liposomes, bilayer sheets, micelles, or lamellar structures, depending on hydration and temperature. This results in a type of surfactant that usually is classified as amphipathic. Lecithin is sold as a food supplement and for medical uses. In cooking, it is sometimes used as an emulsifier and to prevent sticking, for example in nonstick cooking spray.

Commercial lecithin, as used by food manufacturers, is a mixture of phospholipids in oil. The lecithin can be obtained by degumming the extracted oil of seeds. It is a mixture of various phospholipids, and the composition depends on the origin of the lecithin. A major source of lecithin is soybean oil.
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Evil beans!

Health risks

Allergy
Main article: Soy allergy
Allergy to soy is common, and the food is listed with other foods that commonly cause allergy, such as milk, eggs, peanuts, tree nuts, shellfish. The problem has been reported among younger children, and the diagnosis of soy allergy is often based on symptoms reported by parents and/or results of skin tests or blood tests for allergy. Only a few reported studies have attempted to confirm allergy to soy by direct challenge with the food under controlled conditions.[112] It is very difficult to give a reliable estimate of the true prevalence of soy allergy in the general population. To the extent that it does exist, soy allergy may cause cases of urticaria and angioedema, usually within minutes to hours of ingestion. In rare cases, true anaphylaxis may also occur. The reason for the discrepancy is likely that soy proteins, the causative factor in allergy, are far less potent at triggering allergy symptoms than the proteins of peanut and shellfish.[113] An allergy test that is positive demonstrates that the immune system has formed IgE antibodies to soy proteins. However, this is only a factor when soy proteins reach the blood without being digested, in sufficient quantities to reach a threshold to provoke actual symptoms.

Soy can also trigger symptoms via food intolerance, a situation where no allergic mechanism can be proven. One scenario is seen in very young infants who have vomiting and diarrhoea when fed soy-based formula, which resolves when the formula is withdrawn. Older infants can suffer a more severe disorder with vomiting, diarrhoea that may be bloody, anemia, weight loss and failure to thrive. The most common cause of this unusual disorder is a sensitivity to cow's milk, but soy formulas can also be the trigger. The precise mechanism is unclear and it could be immunologic, although not through the IgE-type antibodies that have the leading role in urticaria and anaphylaxis. Fortunately it is also self-limiting and will often disappear in the Toddler Years.[114]

Phytoestrogen
Main article: Phytoestrogens
Soybeans contain isoflavones called genistein and daidzein, which are one source of phytoestrogens in the human diet. Because most naturally occurring estrogenic substances show weak activity, normal consumption of foods that contain these phytoestrogens should not provide sufficient amounts to elicit a physiological response in humans.[115]

Plant lignans associated with high fiber foods such as cereal brans and beans are the principal precursor to mammalian lignans which have an ability to bind to human estrogen sites. Soybeans are a significant source of mammalian lignan precursor secoisolariciresinol containing 13–273 µg/100 g dry weight.[116] Another phytoestrogen in the human diet with estrogen activity is coumestans, which are found in beans, split-peas, with the best sources being alfalfa, clover, and soybean sprouts. Coumestrol, an isoflavone coumarin derivative is the only coumestan in foods.[117][118]

Soybeans and processed soy foods are among the richest foods in total phytoestrogens (wet basis per 100g), which are present primarily in the form of the isoflavones daidzein and genistein.[119]

Women
A 2001 literature review suggested that women with current or past breast cancer should be aware of the risks of potential tumor growth when taking soy products, based on the effect of phytoestrogens to promote breast cancer cell growth in animals.[120] A 2006 commentary reviewed the relationship with soy and breast cancer. They stated that soy may decrease the risk of breast cancer, but cautioned that the impact of isoflavones on breast tissue needs to be evaluated at the cellular level in women at high risk for breast cancer.[121] A high consumption of omega-6 polyunsaturated fatty acids, which are found in most types of vegetable oil including soybean oil, may increase the likelihood that postmenopausal women will develop breast cancer.[122] Another analysis suggests an inverse association between total polyunsaturated fatty acids and breast cancer risk.[123] A 2011 analysis of the literature said: "Our study suggests soy isoflavones intake is associated with a significant reduced risk of breast cancer incidence in Asian populations, but not in Western populations."[124]

In a recent (August 2011) trial the daily administration of tablets containing 200 mg of soy isoflavones for 2 years did not prevent bone loss or menopausal symptoms.[125][126]

Men
Because of the phytoestrogen content, some studies have suggested that soybean ingestion may influence testosterone levels in men. However, a 2010 meta-analysis of 15 placebo controlled studies showed that neither soy foods nor isoflavone supplements alter measures of bioavailable testosterone or estrogen concentrations in men.[127] It has been hypothesized that soy foods and enterolactone may increase the development of prostate cancer although no significant associations were observed for the soy isoflavones.[128] Furthermore, soy consumption has been shown to have no effect on the levels and quality of sperm.[129] A 2009 meta-analysis of the research on the association between soy consumption and prostate cancer risk in men concluded that "consumption of soy foods is associated with a reduction in prostate cancer risk in men."[130]

Brain
Though there is some evidence that estrogen can help protect and repair the brain after injury in rats,[131] there is also evidence that phytoestrogens may be harmful for the recovery of rats in other situations[132] that have sustained brain injury.

Similarly, epidemiological evidence of humans eating soya products is currently divided: a study of Japanese men between 1965 and 1999 demonstrated a positive correlation between brain atrophy and consumption of tofu meals,[133] and a study on elderly Indonesian men and women found that high tofu intake was associated with poorer memory, but the consumption of tempeh was associated with better memory.[99]

So it may be that the type of soya bean used, or its preparation or additional ingredients are relevant factors, there is not yet definitive evidence known.[134]

Carcinogenicity
Though raw soy flour is known to cause pancreatic cancer in rats[135] the cooked flour has not been found carcinogenic.[136][137] Whether soy might promote pancreatic cancer in humans is unknown because studies have not yet attempted to single out soy intake and the incidence of pancreatic cancer in humans, and the amount of soy fed to the rats is proportionately far larger than what humans would normally consume. However, the soy isoflavone genistein has been suggested as a chemopreventive agent against pancreatic cancer, by interfering with the chemical pathways that promote the creation and growth of tumors.[138]

The Cancer Council of New South Wales, Australia has released a statement saying scientific research suggests that overall the moderate consumption of soy products does not appear to present a risk to women with breast cancer, and there is equivocal evidence that consuming large amounts of soy products may have a protective effect against developing breast and prostate cancer. However, the Council does not recommend taking soy dietary supplements as there is no evidence they are either effective or safe at preventing or treating cancers.

Gout
Soybeans and soy products contain significant amounts of purines, a class of organic compounds. For people who suffer from gout, eating foods containing moderate or high levels of purines might make the condition worse. The U.S. National Institutes of Health (NIH) recommends that gout sufferers limit consumption of soy products (although also suggesting that soy may have health benefits by reducing the risk for heart disease).[139] However, other researchers have found little or no association between consumption of purine-rich vegetables (including beans) and gout.[140][141]

Soybean politics

The American Soybean Association represents soy farmers, and it claims as its mission, "To serve farmers by protecting and increasing the market value and opportunities for soybean farmers." Policies have included pushing to pass the Estate Tax Provisions, as well as pushing for free trade agreements with South Korea, Colombia, and Panama.[142]

Soybean futures

Soybean futures are traded on the Chicago Board of Trade and have delivery dates in January (F), March (H), May (K), July (N), August (Q), September (U), November (X).

It is also traded on other commodity futures exchanges under different contract specifications:

SAFEX: The South African Futures Exchange[143]
DC: Dalian Commodity Exchange[144]
KEX: Kansai Commodities Exchange in Japan[145]
TGE: Tokyo Grain Exchange in Japan[146]
KCX: Fukuoka Commodity Exchange in Japan that was absorbed by the KEX
NCDEX: National Commodity and Derivatives Exchange, India.
ROFEX: Rosario Grain Exchange in Argentina

See also

Cash crop
Soy allergy
Soy molasses
Soybean management practices
Soybean wars of Paraguay

sheme
29th April 2013, 16:57
Also don't forget the effect of chlorine and fluoride water additives allegedly causing agglomeration of cholesterol in the blood vessels! who can you trust for unbiased information?

DeDukshyn
29th April 2013, 16:58
Here's some level headed reading on the subject:

http://drnibber.com/an-interesting-tale-of-red-meat-l-carnitine-and-gut-bacteria/

http://www.aor.ca/clearing-controversy-over-l-carnitine/


I believe there was attempt by certain interests to try to link L-Carnitine to heart disease, in attempt to demonize this potentially health beneficial amino, but the real cuplrit appears to be a particular strain of gut bacteria that reside in omnivore and carnivore guts.

The studies overall indicate this:

-fats and cholesterol don't cause heart or cardiovascular disease, TMAO does.
-TMAO is caused by a "certain" of bacterias -- likely ones you don't want in your gut
-vegetarians don't have this problem, because they have different gut flora -- it seems carnivores and herbivores induce different gut flora

Another reason to eat less red meat is all. ;)

Tesla_WTC_Solution
29th April 2013, 17:01
red meat today is full of antibiotics.
so is milk.

this leads to harmful, antibiotic-resistant bacteria in the gut!

:(

conk
29th April 2013, 17:40
Also don't forget the effect of chlorine and fluoride water additives allegedly causing agglomeration of cholesterol in the blood vessels! who can you trust for unbiased information?

And that cholorine kills beneficial gut bacteria.

Bruno, great advice on protecting the vascular system, but don't forget vitamins B. Most heart ailments are forms of beri beri, a B deficiency.

bruno dante
29th April 2013, 18:52
Sure thing Conk. The b's are crucial. No doubt about it.

This is one example of where being sick with heart issues is almost beneficial, as I know what works and what doesn't( for me anyway) and there's really no need to consult the 'science'. I know carnitine works, and as another enlightened poster just pointed out, it seems to be getting demonized...from the so-called "prestigious" Cleveland Clinic, of all places, which disgusts me to the core. In medicine, omission as just as great a sin as commission...and the C.C seems to have both down pat.

bruno dante
29th April 2013, 19:39
red meat today is full of antibiotics.
so is milk.

this leads to harmful, antibiotic-resistant bacteria in the gut!

:(

Well sometimes they are.

Even most standard milks are antibiotic free now. And if you pay attention you can buy uncontaminated meats as well.

Amysenthia
29th April 2013, 21:29
This is a great article about eating red meat and TMAO as a by product. It appears to be a better predictor of heart health than just eating red meat or not.

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2013/04/22/eating-red-meat.aspx