Recommended legislation to solve US Financial crisis and prevent violence by Human Rage [Archive]

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mactiegre

27th June 2013, 19:40

Several of my co-workers thinks my ideas are great. I have written Presidents Clinton, Obama, Senators Kay Bailey, John Cornyn and US Rep John Carter and have seen a standard form letter replies only.

Basically, I see two clear paths to winning legislation that will help solve 2 major problems facing the nation. I would love your support on this..

1) Generate $2T in new revenue from an increase in the Trading fees of derivatives and Hi-Speed Computer securities trading. There are approx 900M options traded daily and if we put a fee of approx $1 on the trades, we could raise $2T to the treasury immediately and it would not hurt the mom & pop investor. France has already implemented a small 0.2% FTT or Robin Hood Tax and other countries are close to enacting it. Currently the US fee is just pennies. We could call it the Economic Recovery Fee. This could reduce the national debt quickly which would reduce the US debt interest payments which would significantly help reduce the deficit and take the pressure off congress to increase income tax or reduce spending.

2) On helping reduce violence, I think Human Rage is the cause and people think it is OK to punish those they blame for their pain. I think that is what is causing so much violence. Also, I think people have big problems and do not know how to ask for help. I have copies of my letters. (PM me for a private link please or if enough people like this, I can post the content of the letters here. ):confused:

What Congress should propose is an anti-violence bill is a 4-part program funded mostly by the gun and entertainment industry:

a) Harsh penalties for possession of an unauthorized weapon with in .5 mi of any school or public malls, theaters, shopping centers, especially for Assault Style Weapons. Exceptions are military servicemen, security guards, Swat teams, police, etc.

b) The gun industry will be required to include strong anti-violence and responsible-gun-ownership public service announcements in all advertising and will be required to have a minimum of 30-seconds exposed anti-violence message for every 30-minutes of any media where violence is shown, such as on TV and in Movies, DVDs, etc. I am thinking it needs to be a high % of EBITDA spent on these messages.

c) The Entertainment industry must include strong messages in all media, video games, advertising, etc that shows the actor or character saying that the violent acts depicted in this media is not what they would do in real life and that there are other ways to solve problems or to get the bad guys. I am thinking it needs to be a high % of EBITDA spent on these messages.

d) The gun and entertainment industry must fund local outreach centers promoting education to the public for :

- responsible gun ownership,

- gun safety,

- and non-violent problem solving.

People need to know where to go for help if they are being hurt, or unfairly treated. They need to reach for the phone instead of a gun to punish those who they blame for their pain. Like a new 411 type number. It could also be used to get intervention for someone else.

Prodigal Son

27th June 2013, 20:10

Hi Mactiegre

You haven't been around here very long have ya?

Stick around, your world view will probably change dramatically in a very short period of time.

Those are all splendid ideas, provided that we didn't have criminals running the banking and entertainment industries, not to mention the US Govt. But these things would be like trying to put a big fat band-aid on a gigantic festering boil.

What I understand is that for a measly $400 million, we have the option of abolishing the Fed and going back to real US issued notes backed by gold and silver. That would fix all the money problems.

As for the violence, if you get rid of the CIA and their mind-control programs that are creating these monsters and then capitalizing on their actions by showing it in the mainstream media all day and night, and get rid of the CIA which is also running the drugs and guns into the country, you would dramatically cut down on the violent crimes.

Not co-incidentally, JFK tried to do precisely these two things, abolish the CIA and the Fed, and we all know what they did to him.

The wolf is guarding the hen house. Get rid of the wolf.

mactiegre

27th June 2013, 21:42

Hi Mactiegre
You haven't been around here very long have ya?
Stick around, your world view will probably change dramatically in a very short period of time.

Thank you for replying. I see things differently. Here is part of one of the letters I wrote:
April 30, 2000

Parents Television Council

PO Box 7802

Burbank, CA 91510-9817

Dear Council,

I support your mission and praise you for taking steps to make Americans aware of the need to reduce violence, but your approach is terrible. I have been thinking about this subject for a long time. I have some critical feedback, please do not take it the wrong way. I also have some suggestions.

As much as you may think that a national program to stomp out immorality on TV is the solution, it is not. I agree it is all around us, not just on TV. What we need is to "re-program" our behavior. My way is to have media include messages within books, computer programs, news, TV and Movies that say:

If someone has done something wrong, it is not OK for you to punish them.

Even if you will not get caught or punished, it is not OK to hurt someone or do something bad. If you are being mistreated, there is always someone who can help. DO NOT mistreat someone else or hurt the person back. It will not solve your situation, it will only make matters worse. Our goal should be when an immoral depiction is performed in public, we should ask the media to display an anti-immoral programming message within.

You say that "TV is undermining the morals of children."

No, it isn't. The children watch a character behave and they may imitate that behavior. Some of it is good behavior. Some of it is bad. We should ask the media to tell the public that the bad behavior is not OK before and during the depiction. In the opening, they can have the lead character say something like - do as I say, not as my character does -and associate it with a little graphical ICON. During the performance, when the character is doing something that should not be imitated, show the little ICON on the material as a reminder. There should be some standard Icons used for standard types of messages. I predict the media can become your ally in fighting the imitation of immoral behavior, not your enemy.

You say that "parents can reach TV sponsors whose ad dollars make it possible." No, they can't. You are not going to get parents to stop their way of life and stop buying the products advertised on TV. Besides, if you get one sponsor to drop the show, another one will take its place - that is the American way. But maybe you can sweet-talk the sponsors in subsidizing the re-programming messages disguised as a way to get more people to buy their products. Wouldn't it be great if you could see Microsoft say "This anti-violence message sponsored by Microsoft." Or maybe, "This anti-mistreatment message sponsored by FORD."

You say look at the evidence:

Sex on TV causes youth sex.
No, it doesn't. Boys and girls cause youth sex. Hormones, unsupervised outings causes youth sex. You will not convince enough Americans with your appeal to stop sex on TV.

Violent entertainment causes violent behavior.
No, it doesn't. People who are hurting, mistreated and think it is OK to punish someone who does something they do not like cause violent behavior. TV does have characters who perform violent acts in response to a situation many people also experience in real life. That's why they imitate the actions. And there is nothing telling them not to imitate. The character found his TV-wife cheating, so he hit her. Wouldn't it be great if the character said "the script includes me hitting my wife, but I wouldn't do this in the same real-life situation because it is wrong" during the intro?

You say: "Fully one-third say they had consciously imitated crime techniques learned from watching TV."
Where did the other two-thirds of violent youth felons learn their techniques? I argue that your statistic is aimed at blaming TV, not understand root cause.

mactiegre

27th June 2013, 21:52

More of the same letter dated April 20, 2000:
You say sponsors need to shoulder all the blame.

That is bull-****. Blaming them is no way to get them to help you. You are no better than they are - they do something you do not like, so you try to destroy them. You need their help, do not make them the enemy. You should read the book "Demonizing the enemy."

Here is a profound news flash for you. Advertising agencies are the real sponsors because they place their clients ads. The client is what you call the sponsor. The name of the company on the commercial is only buying audience exposure - they rarely know the content of the programming they are supporting. They care about demographics and Neilson ratings. If they DO know the content, they calculate the percentage of people who will or will not be offended enough to boycott their products. They depend upon the public not associating blame to a sponsor.

Have you ever broke a promise? Told a lie? Didn't that mistreat or hurt someone? Did they try to punish you?
Did you toss litter on the street lately? Did a child see you? Would you be punished if caught?
Did you exceed the speed limit at any time last year? Was a child in the car? Ever get caught and have to pay a fine?
If you know you will not get caught, would you do it again? That IS the same thing. Everyone else is doing it, so it is OK for me to do it?? Isn't a car a violent weapon if not controlled?
Have you spanked your child because he/she did something wrong? How about raised your voice in anger? Threatened violence? So you think that TV is to blame? What does spanking teach? This is what it teaches:
Do something I do not like and you must be punished. I am empowered to punish.

Have you ever made the comment that some person mentioned in the news should be put to death because they did something wrong? "Those people should be punished." I bet you say that all the time. Could a child hear you?
Guess what the ultimate punishment is. Death. Kids see this all the time. That is what caused the Columbine High incident. TV is not to blame

Prodigal Son

27th June 2013, 21:52

mactiegre

27th June 2013, 21:59

Okay mactiegre, I like your ideas, but in order to implement them, how do you propose we wrest control of the media away from the corporate globalist mafia that wishes to program the masses for servitude and self-destruction? Or do we just declare the TV off limits to our children?

Hi Prodigal, thank you for your question.

We have to start by discontinuing to blame them and calling them names. We can make them our ally to our causes and they will see the benefit by getting young viewer eyeballs of conservatives back to watch their ads. We are all on the same team . :eek:

Mulder

27th June 2013, 22:10

I disagree with your gun control plans. Everywhere I know of that guns have been banned/restricted crime and violence goes up a lot e.g. Australia. Not to mention the genocide that often follows:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_JSpbgoKp8LA/SyarkGOjpvI/AAAAAAAAG6E/Ea9EI2Us7oI/S1600-R/JSPO_GunControlGenocideChart-01_630.gif

Lefty Dave

27th June 2013, 22:26

Although it is commendable to have given these problems much thought, one can not solve the problems of too much interference and legislation with more interference and legislation...keep looking for solutions, though...you may get the answer.
Blessings.

Ernie Nemeth

27th June 2013, 23:25

If only it were so easy, my friend.

This system, unfortunately, cannot be changed from within. It is corrupt and rotted. It always has been, always will be.

I agree it is the culture that must change, but that cannot be legislated into the middle of this fascist state. The pyschpaths will eat them alive.

Also, playing further games with the fractional reserve banking system just perpetuates the system. Even if you can reset it now with your new tax, eventually it will arrive back at this place. It is the system that must go, the institutions, the bureaucracy. It is based on an archaic practice of enslavement using monetary leverage to do the dirty work. That is our culture, that is what must be changed. And that is an internal and personal matter each must decide for themselves.

Bubu

27th June 2013, 23:34

"I have written Presidents Clinton, Obama, Senators Kay Bailey, John Cornyn and US Rep John Carter and have seen a standard form letter replies only".

They are intellectual people I am sure they understand your great ideas. But the fact that you receiving only standards means they are not interested in helping or making a better world in general. So you asked for support which means they be forced which will ultimately boil down to violence.

"Several of my co-workers thinks my ideas are great".

Wisdom means awareness that there is more to learn. The wiser you become the more you readily acknowledge your ignorance.

I do not expect you to understand any of this because apparently our ideas are miles apart. Though I am taking my chance but more so for others that may be situated on or near the borderline.

mactiegre

28th June 2013, 02:08

Hi Nature, so wonderful of you to read my post and take the time to reply. :humble:

I did get more than a standard response :grouphug: from Mr. Clinton on my second letter to him. A nice personal note. I think Mr. Clinton will go down in history as one of the best US presidents of modern times. I didn't vote for him, I got fooled by that radical guy from Texas, Perot :o . I believe Mr. Clinton or his staff did influence some media to run some anti-violence public service announcements, and I believe it did make a difference. These things do take time.

I am not blind :pizza: to the way congress in the US works - Someone has to have a sponser and a co-sponser of a bill, and someone has to work to get votes, which usually means selling yourself to the devil in some cases (sic). But in this case, I am extremely hopeful that all sides can agree and put aside their political attacks to do something right for a change because it is the right thing to do for the country and the planet. :Cry:

So you asked for support which means they be forced which will ultimately boil down to violence.

I do not support threatening someone who disagrees with me in order to get their support. How did we earthlings get into the habit of controlling one another by fear? If we are to survive another 10,000 years we need enlightenment or divine intervention.

From my song: "Divine Intervention (Tebow song") by Ian MacTiegre
"Both men said 'GOD Gave This LAND to ME!'
and fought each other endlessly.
Solder - Struggle No More -
You have fought every day since before you were born.
Look at Tebow - follow his plan!
What we need
Is a little
Divine Intervention! "
PM me for a link to the video.

What if the divine intervention really happened? And it happened in such a way that every one and all religions would believe and we would all love one another? Wouldn't that be wonderful?
Visual World Peace.
It is possible - right? So why can't we do it without divine intervention?

Prodigal Son

28th June 2013, 02:26

What if the divine intervention really happened? And it happened in such a way that every one and all religions would believe and we would all love one another? Wouldn't that be wonderful?
Visual World Peace.
It is possible - right? So why can't we do it without divine intervention?

Once again, it comes back around to the reason why humanity is asleep. We are being held in a comatose state by a relatively small band of criminals who know how to manipulate reality and wish to keep that ability all to themselves for their own benefit and to our detriment. Religion is the means by which they accomplished the collective lobotomy of the human mind.

We ARE Divine. We don't need a Savior. We need to pull the syringes out of our arses and wake up to that reality. We need to perform our own intervention. We can not move forward as a race until we get rid of the parasite that will consume its host completely if given the chance. We've been praying to "God" for help for thousands of years and none seems to be forthcoming. We ourselves can defeat the Cabal if enough people wake up and realize how they're being screwed by a bunch of old crotchety thugs.

mactiegre

28th June 2013, 02:34

It is based on an archaic practice of enslavement using monetary leverage to do the dirty work. That is our culture, that is what must be changed. And that is an internal and personal matter each must decide for themselves.

Dear Ernie Nemeth, my friend.

You have definately hit the nail on the proverbial head. It is a corrupt system.
However the issues facing our US Congress today are 1) reducing spending or 2) increasing income taxes. I propose the FTT as an alternative that gives us more time to get us out of a black hole spiral of death and swing it back into a moral democracy, if we have the political will.

I agree that the culture is within our power to change, and it is a personal decision. However, I believe many of our actions, both good and bad, are involuntry responses to invalid perceptions. Many perceptions are illusions. And we are manipulated by some perceptions invented by others to deceive. Let's replace those with just a little reality and truth. Unfortunately, many are trying to escape their dismal realities. See the Movie Black and White with Morgan Freeman. Let the truth be set free.

gripreaper

28th June 2013, 03:13

mactiegre, welcome to Avalon. These topics have been discussed extensively over the years, and Dennis Leahy has the best solution for solving the existing problem from within the existing paradigm with the existing structure. His thread is called the "Reset Button" and is located in the priority thread section of Avalon.

The other main contingent sees the existing paradigm as totally corrupt, not run by humans who have any empathy, has been run in secret using very evil inhuman rituals for centuries, is an outdated and completely reprobate system of scarcity based on debt and fiat currency, cannot be fixed from within and must be totally overthrown.

In it's place the hidden Tesla technology of free energy be released, the fiat currency be destroyed and all debt be eliminated through a global debt jubilee, with the 1% inhuman infiltrators sent off planet to a place where they can cannibalize each other and leave the empaths alone.

This would solve 95% of all of earths problems, all of which are ancillary to the elite controllers and their inhumanity being in control of planet earth.

Ernie Nemeth

28th June 2013, 03:37

Gripreaper sums it up pretty nicely.
And hello, Mactiegre.

Unfortunately, I think Prodigal son is right. It is up to us. We're not gonna get help from "upstairs" because it's our time to remember - to become a member again, of the galactic community even, eventully. For now we just need to work together, to share the bond of humanity with pride and in true justice, united in the common goal of peace and prosperity for all, not just the chosen few.

By the way, I am convinced we will do it ourselves - I just hope we do it before too much shtf...

mactiegre

28th June 2013, 05:25

Dear Mr. Leahy and ResetButton friends,

I am frightfully enlightened and amused. :o
Would it even be possible to organize voluntary and orderly transfer of power and control from the financial and industrial elite to the free democracy? I hear shouts of NO WAY. They would fight with all their might - right? :argue:
But wouldn't that make us as bad as them using force to overthrow their control? :frusty:
They control the communications, money, energy, infrastructure and the military, etc. We would need to anticipate their every defensive and offensive move. :wizard: Like ResetButton document says, a big chess game, where sacrifices are made to win the battle in the end. Except the winner may inherit a smoldering mess. And we would be moving our pieces blindfolded. One might think to make it a fair fight, we would have to blindfold them. I sense they fear us and nothing is more vicious that a cornered rat. :dizzy:

I see a different approach. :argue:
What if we could generate a realistic simulation on a IBM Watson computer, like a giant SimCity, and undeniably predict the current destruction we fear with the elite in control. Then plug in the ResetButton plan and see how it turns out? What if it shows a best case outcome as we expect? Would that be enough to convince enough people to join and execute the ResetButton plan, basically transforming their chess pieces into statues and capturing their king and queen? It would lift the veil of deception, erase the illusions, and we could do it in an open, transparent manner. :rolleyes:

I fear you are right:

they want the meltdown because it gives them more power and control when the smoke clears.
They will control all perceptions of the new reality.
They want an excuse to take away more of our freedoms and individuality.

They fear us more than we fear them. If we show any signs of weakness, they will crush us. Maybe we could convince them to pay for the simulation under the disquise of helping them optimize their power and control.

What would be the key elements of the simulation?
A simulation is Garbage-In..Garbage-Out; the simulation is only as good as the input data. Missing data would have to be estimated with a range.

Dennis Leahy

28th June 2013, 06:01

Read a bit more, please. Read specifically the sections regarding "strategy."

You have come up with some ideas that you think are sane, and realistic. You want to present them to a group of insane and unrealistic overlords. Presenting good ideas will not move us forward, because those in power like things just as they are. For the same reason, petitions and protests will not work. No one is listening. Voting will not work (the entire electoral paradigm is controlled - and not by citizens.)

Einstein said it well, but people (including activists and activist organizations) are not listening: doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results is insanity. It's time to try something completely different. If "something different" is a violent overthrow attempt, there will be a lot of activist blood in the streets, not a drop of the Elite blood will be shed, and there will be no success. The Reset Button is a non-violent goal, plan, and strategy that is different than anything that has ever been tried before. If it takes off as a movement, one of two things will happen: a.) it will succeed, and the US will have a restructured electoral paradigm that only allows ordinary citizens with no corporate ties to even run for office, and the US will finally have a "government of the people, by the people, and for the people" that some mistakenly believe we now have (or ever had), or b.) the movement will fail. If the movement fails, millions of people would know beyond any doubt that the controllers have destroyed all vestiges of democracy. The reality of tyranny would be widespread, and there is no putting that genie back in the bottle.

I have never seen anything else proposed by anyone that even has a chance of working. Virtually all activists ideas fail this test: after your activism is successful, who is in charge? If the answer is the same people, the activism is a failure.

I'm all ears for better ideas, and/or how to organize, and/or how to shake people out of the fear-based self-imprisonment leading to non-action and ultimately, warmongering, ecocidal, malevolent corporate-centric acquiescence.

Dennis

Dennis Leahy

28th June 2013, 06:06

Snookie

28th June 2013, 07:47

Until we (non psychopathic) humans have a complete paradigm shift, and start becoming more service to others than we are service to self, we can discuss this until the cows come home and nothing will change.

Very recently large areas of my province were hit by huge floods. My companion's son has several friends who have lost their homes. I keep hoping that people going through this will come to realize that possessions are not nearly as important as having friends and family, that they will start helping their neighbours more, that they will look out for each other.

I guess what I'm trying to say that a good portion of this world's problems are caused by greed. If we could magically get rid of that "what a wonderful world it would be!"

Bubu

28th June 2013, 12:46

I guess what I'm trying to say that a good portion of this world's problems are caused by greed. If we could magically get rid of that "what a wonderful world it would be!"

Everyone will agree with that and it is very easy to say that. How about coming up with a suggestion where to start to realize that. Dennis presented a sane suggestion. Although I believe that the reset button will never be realize unless we come up with a sufficient number of people who are adequately aware. And this is where my suggestion of mind conditioning comes in, or shall I say mind education.

Halo Mactiegre,

In my opinion asking help or dealing with this people is similar to dealing with vampires or cannibals only that this group is worse because they not kill the victim instantly but rather keep victims on survival stage so that they can suck the victims energy as long as they exist. They are energy vampires, the evidence is overwhelming for a real truth seeker not to see it.

mactiegre

28th June 2013, 14:12

In my opinion asking help or dealing with this people is similar to dealing with vampires or cannibals only that this group is worse because they not kill the victim instantly but rather keep victims on survival stage so that they can suck the victims energy as long as they exist. They are energy vampires, the evidence is overwhelming for a real truth seeker not to see it.

Hello Nature,
Excellent point, except I don't believe in vampires. :gossip:

Speaking of real truth, I do not wear a tin-hat, but I do have close friends and relatives with extremely high security clearances, CEO's, CFO's and COO, and President/ VP's of Oil, Media, Communications, Insurance, Technology and Energy companies. And yes I communicate with them frequently and they respect my position and insight on many things. And I can tell you we have discussed the problems of everything from banking, medicine, voting, government intrusions, loss of privacy, NSA spying, visitors from other planets, everything. But not once has their been an inkling of conspiracy by large corporations to destroy our wealth.

A few weeks ago I had a former mid-senior-level co-worker who changed to another company because everyone thought the other company did everything right, and had a plan. He told me after he had been there 3 months that they are just as screwed up as everyone else, and it was an illusion that they were better.

I have another friend who is a former-VP at a global technology company that consistently gets employee survey results that gets them labeled the best company to work at in Central Texas. Last week he told me that is an illusion, that it is management by fear. Everyone is fearful to say anything bad about the company. But it it just a harmless game to the execs due to an over-active Ego.

Dear Mr Leahy - I am not defending the greedy corporations, but I must ask what proof do you have of a widespread conspiracy? What if they were just incompetent? And because of their dis-trust of us, they are opaque and seem to be evil.

I have to defer to Nassim Taleb http://www.fooledbyrandomness.com/ on this subject. I highly recommend his book Anti-Fragile. I think it is more likely that the corporations are mismanaged than are conspiring to take over the world, and I take-back what I posted about them wanting to destroy us. Deceive us - yes; Greedy - yes. Smart enough to plan a meltdown - Not even close. That is an illusion. In My Opinion.

Does the US government have an army of ninja assassins? I don't know, I sure hope not.

risveglio

28th June 2013, 14:27

I am not defending the greedy corporations,what proof do you have of a widespread conspiracy?

Does the US government have an army of ninja assassins? I don't know, I sure hope not.

For proof of greedy corporations and a widespread conspiracy, I say look at the connection between Monsanto and the FDA. Also look at Goldman Sachs and the Fed. Big companies take control buy using our politicians to create regulations which usually are just a way to push out the small to mid sized companies because they can't afford the regulation. You see it in almost every industry the government has there hands on. The second most important need of fascism is that there is a tight bond between government and big corporations. We are currently a fascist nation.

The US does not need Ninja Assassins, they have drones.

Ernie Nemeth

28th June 2013, 14:34

There is a lot of proof of this conspiracy you think might not exist, and this forum is replete with examples. No need to go there, me thinks.

But it is fact that of the four thousand top companies the controlling interest can be traced back to a bit over one hundred companies - with(edited from without) over-lapping board of directors. It is so bad that ten companies own or control 60% of all commerce on this planet. If that is not a conspiracy it certainly hints at collusion at the very least. That is fact. And there are more such irrefutable facts, much more.

Granted, as far as I know, there is no (edit)conclusive fact of this conspiracy. But fumbling. bumbling, greedy elitists cannot have done a better job screwing up our world and enslaving the peoples of the world if they had planned it all.

Prodigal Son

28th June 2013, 16:25

Dennis Leahy

28th June 2013, 16:54

...

Dear Mr Leahy - I am not defending the greedy corporations, but I must ask what proof do you have of a widespread conspiracy? What if they were just incompetent? And because of their dis-trust of us, they are opaque and seem to be evil.

I have to defer to Nassim Taleb http://www.fooledbyrandomness.com/ on this subject. I highly recommend his book Anti-Fragile. I think it is more likely that the corporations are mismanaged than are conspiring to take over the world, and I take-back what I posted about them wanting to destroy us. Deceive us - yes; Greedy - yes. Smart enough to plan a meltdown - Not even close. That is an illusion. In My Opinion.

Does the US government have an army of ninja assassins? I don't know, I sure hope not.
OK, Mac, so let's go with your ideas. The gigantic derivatives bubble (it was estimated to be $700 trillion a couple of years ago, but I had also heard estimates as high as $1.4 quadrillion) was an accident, is simply a secondary effect of greed-based buying/selling/trading. The deregulation of the banking industry was also greed-based, with no forethought or plan by the banking industry that it would implode the global economy. The banking/trading professionals had no idea that there would be a major meltdown in late 2007/early 2008 that led to the average investor losing nearly 40% of their savings (if in a 401k or other stock-based portfolio.)

Are we also going to say that the banking industry in 1929 was not deliberately exploitative?

I would ask you not to get too comfortable mocking the concept that conspiracy is the modus operandi of multinational corporations and international bankers (at the very least.) A "conspiracy" is a simple thing, really: two or more people planning something illegal. I admit that I have personally extended the concept to include two or more people planning to do something that is egregious, that may include embedding their own agents into government positions to facilitate the action, and/or to select and sponsor candidates for high office that will "play ball" with the agenda as delivered to them, to the point of creating legislation to facilitate the plan. Thus, the term "illegal" may not technically apply - but I still see it as a conspiracy.

But, let's say there are no conspiracies at all. None. Zero. If there is an imminent gigantic economic crash, the international bankers will be taken by surprise, and if they reap benefits from it, it will be simply a happy coincidence for them. Let's just say then that somehow, by chance, that the US Congress just happens to be filled with individuals that seem to agree with corporations about virtually everything, and not ever with citizens. (If that statement itself seems too "tin foil hatted", then please grab two pads of paper, and list on one of them all of the corporate-centric legislation that has passed in the previous 3 decades, and on the other, list all of the citizen-centric legislation that has passed in the same 3 decades.) So, even though you believe that the international bankers are guilty of nothing beyond simple greed (handled a transaction at a time, and with no conspiring at all), does that somehow wipe out the derivatives bubble?

But. let's get back to the pregnant global economic situation as well as the lack of citizen representation in your and my home nation. Let's say it was just greed and incompetence that got us where we are now. Is that reason enough for you to support the notion of ousting the current regime, and transforming the electoral paradigm to ensure that we get representatives that are NOT tied to corporations and banks in high office? Or, are you comfortable with the "let it ride" position, and do not want to drastically alter the status quo? If you believe that the representatives that are empowered in the US and the process to allow the same exact type of representatives to fill any vacancies are creating the best possible government, then do nothing at all.

If, on the other hand, you believe that the US government is filled with individuals representing the corporate interest, and - as corporations are by definition sociopathic, that the corporate interests are massively exploitative and ecocidal - not representing the interests of citizens and the environment in which we all live, then you might want to support ANY plan that would empower citizens rather than corporations.

Dennis

mactiegre

28th June 2013, 18:49

Are we also going to say that the banking industry in 1929 was not deliberately exploitative?
..

If, on the other hand, you believe that the US government is filled with individuals representing the corporate interest, and - as corporations are by definition sociopathic, that the corporate interests are massively exploitative and ecocidal - not representing the interests of citizens and the environment in which we all live, then you might want to support ANY plan that would empower citizens rather than corporations.

Dennis

Dear Mr. Leahy -
I did go back and read the plan and the strategy summaries - I skipped that part last night. I love the part about the Amendment and the Election Reform act. That is brilliant and makes sense.
I need to read more details about the general strike and think about it.

Once, in the 90's, I proposed a management-LBO of a non-unionized small division of a global high-tech company. I organized a large secret employee meeting, presented my plan which included some sweat-equity, and they walked out - no one was willing to give up their perception of financial security. Many were on a hand-to-mouth budget. No safety net. The division was eventually destroyed by an incompetent Sr.VP. and 4000 people had to find another job.

One of the reasons unions can strike is because the unions help the members in times of strike.

Yes, there is no doubt the 1929 crash was exploitation by a small number of elitist greedy bankers. The facts are very clear. But I don't think they intended for the disaster that resulted. And laws were passed to restrict that from happening again, but the truth was withheld from the public for decades. The perception was manipulated for the purposes of controlling us. Because they were afraid. Those laws were weakened by the banking deregulation against strong opposition. My wife's family had controlling interest in a small state bank, so I had a little insight into that.

You make a great point, irregardless of whether or not a grand conspiracy exists, ANY plan that empowers Socially-RESPONSIBLE and Intelligent citizens needs to be done - however, some of my other relatives and acquaintances I wouldn't trust a lighter with, much less social responsibility. My dad used to say they could screw-up a steel ball with a match where it could no longer roll. There are a lot of people out there that aren't mentally prepared for this kind of change. I worry about them.

I need to do more research, share it with my friends, and see what they have to say. I will let you know.

turiya

29th June 2013, 04:23

Well, here's my 2 cents worth...

Several of my co-workers thinks my ideas are great. I have written Presidents Clinton, Obama, Senators Kay Bailey, John Cornyn and US Rep John Carter and have seen a standard form letter replies only.This should give you a big clue as to what these people are about.

Basically, I see two clear paths to winning legislation that will help solve 2 major problems facing the nation. I would love your support on this.. You interests are in keeping the present corrupt system in place. The system is broken, not possible to patch together with the bubble gum & duct tape you come here with. Your 1st suggestion is to perpetuate the ongoing cancerous system. I sense that you have no desire to have the present system go away. From this, I take it that you have (or your spouse has) a 6 digit gross income. You sit on the upper tier. You would like to perpetuate the present system indefinitely. Sorry, but fiat money systems don't work that way. You should have learned better from the short-lived chain letters that circulated while you attended high school.

On helping reduce violence, I think Human Rage is the cause and people think it is OK to punish those they blame for their pain. I think that is what is causing so much violence. Also, I think people have big problems and do not know how to ask for help.

What Congress should propose is an anti-violence bill is a 4-part program funded mostly by the gun and entertainment industry...
The gun industry will be required to include strong anti-violence and responsible-gun-ownership public service announcements in all advertising and will be required… The recent acts of mass violence are not caused by the gun manufacturers… (http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/blog/prescription-drugs-are-often-behind-mass-shootings/) or, even the illegal street drugs. Educate yourself. Go to SSRIstories.com (http://ssristories.com/) and read the thousands of stories of murders, suicides & other violent acts that have taken place over the recent past. The Pharmaceutical Drugs that are affiliated with each of these cases is listed there. Guns are not the problem - its the psychotropic & SSRIs that are the cause. And while you’re at it, be sure to click on the Soldier Cases (http://ssristories.com/index.php?p=soldier). You will find that more soldiers are committing suicide than are dying in combat (http://www.mrconservative.com/2013/05/17768-more-soldiers-die-from-suicide-than-from-combat/). You can find out how many Billions of $$$$$ that the Pentagon is spending on this crap! (http://www.cchrint.org/2013/01/23/cchr-exposes-psychiatrys-military-spending-to-create-drugged-out-super-soldiers-by-kelly-omeara/)

Congress knows perfectly well about this! Congress has held hearings on how the side effects of SSRIs as it relates to violence… especially in young people (http://www.antidepressantsfacts.com/2004-10-15-Congress-hammers-FDA-SSRIs.htm), they know all about this. Pharmaceutical Corps are the top contributors to politicians' campaign funds (http://www.opensecrets.org/industries/indus.php?ind=H4300). Is it any wonder that they will ignore what was found in these hearings?

Next when you look at the TV news, try to be attentive to the fact that most of the commercials are Pharmaceuticals… (and be sure to listen to the potential side effects). It spells huge amounts of money for the TV News Corps. Now do you think that the corporation news is going to want to post negative news about their major clients?

Antipsychotic drugs are now the top-selling class of pharmaceuticals in America, generating annual revenue of about $14.6 billion. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pharmaceutical_marketing)

Here's a video to start with...
Making a Killing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JsqDyEMkLpQ
The statistics are clear 1 out of 10 people in America are on these psychotropic drugs (http://www.npr.org/blogs/health/2011/10/20/141544135/look-around-1-in-10-americans-take-antidepressants). The military serving overseas are depressed, they are fighting an immoral war. The statistics for those taking anti-depressant medications are probably higher for those active military personnel. Military psychs reportedly hand them out like candy (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CC0QFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.kenandkay.com%2F2012%2F03%2F2 0%2Fsergeant-robert-bales-odd-afghanistan-adventure%2F&ei=WGPOUfSMEoqqyAHGpIHICA&usg=AFQjCNENZg5vVvBH2ixRcLh_MUtVBvUaJA&sig2=a6VZljkWkBPXfCmc9vjRSQ), especially to those who are diagnosed as having Post Traumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD). And if Congress were to be required to be transparent with the drugs they are taking, I would bet dollars to doughnuts that the percentage is much much higher for Congressmen & women.

So, I got a question for you: You seem to get together with your so-called "friends" & talk about stuff - you know, the elitists, the ones in high places. Do you ever talk about the anti-depressant drugs that many of them may be on? I wrote a letter to Senator Carl Levin and told him, "Being Chairman of the Armed Services Committee (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Levin), out of all the people in Congress, you should know better than anyone on how much a problem there is with the suicide rate in the military, and how many billions of dollars the Pentagon is spending on these psychotropic & antidepressant drugs that are being handed out like candy to the military overseas. The only reason that I can see why you have not proposed any legislation on these drugs, is because you, either don't want your campaign funding to go away, or you are on these drugs yourself?" - And, no, I did not receive even a form letter in response.

So, forgive me for asking, but this may be the same reason why you have not ventured onto the storehouse of information that can be readily found on the internet regarding this particular subject matter (SSRIs & violence). And, instead, have chosen to go after the gun manufacturers & the movie entertainment industry as being the leading cause of acts of rage & violence in this country. Please don't be offended... Just wondering... by chance, are you taking anti-depressant meds?

Now, if you really want to push for legislation, I would suggest a bill that would require politicians to be drug tested, and to open up their medical records for public viewing. After all, they are the ones that are in positions of power. One in particular, has his finger on the thermonuclear war button. And, then the FBI could finally be put to doing some real honest work by looking at our own political leaders' medical records - not to exclude the President, VP, Secretary of State & ALL Supreme Court Justices.

What we need is to "re-program" our behavior.
I am sorry. The American society has been dumbed-down & brainwashed enough through the propaganda education system, i.e. the public fool system. Putting another layer of propaganda conditioning on top of the already existing layer of brainwashing is a band-aid approach. Trimming the leaves from the bush is a superficial fix to a more deeply rooted problem. This overly moralistic & repressive society has conditioned its members to suppress & repress their emotions, never allowing people to express their pent-up emotions in an appropriate venue. They will never be allowed to lead healthy & joyful lives. Your suggestion is to perpetuate a masochistic & ill system of never-ending suppression & repression. Your suggestion is to prolong the life of a sick societal system so it has the appearance of being physically & mentally healthy. This is done at the cost of the physical & mental well-being of its members. Not gonna work - never has, never will.

Boys and girls cause youth sex. Hormones, unsupervised outings causes youth sex.
Sorry, but sex is energy. Living a life consists of the very same energy. Sex energy will transform itself into Love energy, ONLY if the sex energy is not overly controlled. A healthy society will help the youth to allow their sexual experiences to unfold naturally. Not by over controlling this natural flow. Attempting to Control sex has led to perversions. Just look at the Catholic priesthood. The answer is to have a system that would help to allow the youth to easily move through the sexual experience without trying to prevent the sexual energy from moving naturally. 'Control' will lead to perverted behavior, expressed in a thousand & one ways. If you try to prevent nature from expressing itself, it will simply find another way of doing so, however, the 'other' way will be expressed in a perverted form.

I do not wear a tin-hat, but I do have close friends and relatives with extremely high security clearances, CEO's, CFO's and COO, and President/ VP's of Oil, Media, Communications, Insurance, Technology and Energy companies. And yes I communicate with them frequently and they respect my position and insight on many things. And I can tell you we have discussed the problems of everything from banking, medicine, voting, government intrusions, loss of privacy, NSA spying, visitors from other planets, everything. But not once has their been an inkling of conspiracy by large corporations to destroy our wealth.
Yes – these are your people. Not once has their been an inkling of conspiracy by large corporation to destroy our wealth. Its because 'our' wealth is potentially 'their' wealth. So yeah, they are not out to destroy 'their' wealth, this what I think you mean by the use of the pronoun ‘our’, after all, they are 'your' friends. These people have no empathy with the rest of humanity. They consider themselves the “center of the Universe", imo. This is the workings of the business mind. Your use of the word “Our” is exclusive. Not inclusive. It is exclusively "their" wealth. And what they presently do not possess is, potentially, "their" future wealth.

I am not defending the greedy corporations, but I must ask what proof do you have of a widespread conspiracy? What if they were just incompetent? And because of their dis-trust of us, they are opaque and seem to be evil. The word 'Incompetent' is a nice way of saying the "self–centered importance of never having enough". Its beyond incompetent. It has overflowed extensively into the dimension of socio-pathetic mental illness. I find it amusing the way you have oriented your logic concerning the element of dis-trust. Yes, the dis-trust had to start from somewhere. I find it amusing that you have concluded that it had initially come from ‘We the People.”

I sense that you are here as a kind of an experiment. You are here to see if you can teach the members here - to see if you can set these people straight. Just my opinion at the moment, opinions can change.

I think Mr. Clinton will go down in history as one of the best US presidents of modern times. I could not at all agree with your view of Mr. Bill "An inside job? …How dare you” Clinton. I can only respond by saying "How dare you have such a fondness for the psycho-pathologically ill…."

turiya :cool:

mactiegre

29th June 2013, 06:33

So, I got a question for you: You seem to get together with your so-called "friends" & talk about stuff - you know, the elitists, the ones in high places. Do you ever talk about the anti-depressant drugs that many of them may be on?

Dear Turiya,

Thank you for reading my posts and taking the time to reply.

Anti-depressent drug abuse is a tragic failure of a social system that has left many families suffering the loss of a loved one. Drugs are no substitute for a loving support system of family and friends. Years ago before the dangers were well known, a distant relative Keith tragically took his own life because he was on those things. How dare you assume we are not painfully aware of the serious consequences of those drugs in order to make yourself feel important!

Apparently you can only feel good about yourself by putting other people down. Are you a bully?

I wrote a letter .... you are on these drugs yourself?"

Your power of persuasion is amazing :sarcastic:

Just wondering... by chance, are you taking anti-depressant meds?

Nice of you attempt to disguise your insults with an apologetic preface. Apparently anyone who expresses an opinion you can't understand must be on drugs?

'Control' will lead to perverted behavior,

I agree with you, but you missed my point. My position argued against some association of parents who were blaming sex scenes on TV as causing their children to have an unnatural desire for sex. I think parents have the right to direct their adolescent children. If done correctly, it will not contribute to perverted behavior later.

These people have no empathy with the rest of humanity. They consider themselves the “center of their universe", imo. This is the workings of the business mind. Your use of the word “Our” is exclusive. Not inclusive. It is exclusively "their" wealth. And what they do not possess is, potentially, "their" wealth.

I believe you are over-generalizing here in a hateful manner. Please read "Demonizing the enemy" to learn how those of a weak position will project evil into their enemies to manipulate the preception of the audience.

The word 'Incompetent' is a nice way of saying the "self–centered importance of never having enough". Its beyond incompetent. It has overflowed extensively into the dimension of socio-pathetic mental illness. I find it amusing the way you have oriented your logic concerning the element of dis-trust....
I sense that you are here as a kind of an experiment. You are here to see if you can teach the members here - to see if you can set these people straight. Just my opinion at the moment, opinions can change.

Wow, I really hit the hot button with you on this one.

I could not at all agree with your view of Mr Bill "An inside job? …How dare you” Clinton. I can only respond by saying "How dare you have such a fondness for the psycho-pathologically ill…."

turiya :cool:

I sense hate in your tone, and you think you are cool?

Here is a excerpt from a speech I gave to the Youth Violence Commission in my community on June 27, 1997. Hopefully, it will explain some of my reasoning for my proposal.

Unfortunately, when people sympathize with violence and law
violations, they begin to accept it as their own means of solving
similar problems. Some people get enraged and don't care who they
hurt - until they face the reality of punishment. I am concerned
because behavior that parallels that of high-profile violence
cases are becoming much more common. Three innocent sounding
stories below parallel the behavior of high profile violence:
1) I was out on a Cub Scout hike with my son's troop last year.
The rules of the wilderness area we visited were stay on the
trails and leave it in the same condition you found it in. Every
scout was told these rules. But during our 2-hour hike, each child
broke at least one of the rules. Why? The answer was because they
won't get caught. I explained that just because its convenient to
break a rule, doesn't make it OK even if you don't get caught.
2) I mentored a 4th grade boy at a local elementary school.
Standing in line at the cafeteria, he would hit his friends. He
knew it was wrong, but because he is being mistreated at home, he
thought it's OK to hurt other people. After telling him these
four reasons for violence above, and working with him to
understand its not OK to hurt someone just because you are feeling
hurt, he seems to no longer be compelled to mistreat people around
him.
3) I had an ex-brother-in-law who was extremely mean to his
family and had a tendancy to be self-destructive. To simplify
his condition, he didn't know how ask for help. By acting violent
around his family, he was internally crying for help and his
actions were an attempt to bring serious punishment upon himself.
One of the first steps to dealing with this behavior, is to
help people understand that IT IS OK to feel hurt if you are a
victim of mistreatment of any kind. Victims DO feel hurt. Then
help them understand that nothing gives anyone the right to hurt
or punish them if they haven't done anything wrong. Then make sure
that they understand that there are people who want to help them.
And that they can solve their problems without violence.
Although some experts believe that seeing violence on TV
desensitizes us to tragedy, I believe it increases our tendacy
towards violence unless we are determined as individuals towards
non-violent behavior.
Therefore, I propose that we begin a nationwide effort to
HIGHLIGHT everyday use of non-violent problem solving. Hopefully,
for every high-profile violence case, we can find hundreds of
cases where negotiation, civil obedience and individual
determination led to the most effective non-violent result. We
also need to put as much effort into countering messages on TV
that violence and civil disobedience is acceptable as we do in
countering those with opposite political views.

turiya

29th June 2013, 12:02

My dear mactiegre

I see that perhaps I may have inadvertently crossed over the line with you, in what may possibly be taken as being inappropriate in asking such a provocative personal question of you. So, I would like to genuinely apologize for posing the question of whether you are taking psychotropic, anti-depressant and/or SSRI drugs or not. Please forgive me for that. How you care for your own physical & mental health is your business & not anyone elses. However, in the case of public officials, I would deem the question as being appropriate, considering the consequences that would come into play from “certain” pharmaceutical medications being taken. Hence, the reason why I think public officials should be required to be drug tested & to come "clean" of such "FDA approved" crap.

Aside from the comment regarding Mr. Bill “9/11 – An inside job? …How dare you...” Clinton, I do think that the general context of my post, however, was not one filled with sarcasm, bullying insults or hate, in any way shape or form, as you have alleged in your response. I wouldn’t misconstrue having a passion for our Constitutional Republic form of government (not a democracy), and an appropriately placed disdain for its corporate take-over replacement, a.k.a. Fascism, and for those public officials that have taken part in securing such a result. Most public officials, imo, have forsaken & dishonored (& are continuing to dishonor) their oaths of office, which is prerequisite for filling the offices for which they have been elected to serve. This includes Supreme Court Justices & all those that are appointed to a public office.

It is common knowledge that the corporate takeover of our government, via NGO & Corporate lobbyists, is the biggest problem in Washington D.C. And, it appears to me that you are sadly supportive of the present state of affairs. I am sorry for that, too.

Late edit: For this video regarding the so-called the State of Israel "Jewish" Lobby

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2sJmMgMfEZg
Welcome to Avalon, and I will not bother you with my passionate display that you choose to perceive as a form “bullying”. Please carry-on with your discussion here in my absence. You can rest-assure that I will not intervene with any other posted message on this thread or with any other future threads that you initiate.

Be well & best regards
turiya :cool:

P.S. there is no such word as 'irregardless' (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/irregardless)