All Will Be Revealed...

[Omni]

I believe the time that we have heard about (some of us, maybe most of us), in that the 'veils' will be lifted, is global first contact. All conspiracies(or the bigger ones) will come to light. Nothing can be hidden from advanced ETs if they choose such. Some extraterrestrials see it as their duty to document our history so they can gift it to us when we get to know them(although that's not the only reason they do it). Also, one reason the shadow gov't(USA) dislikes the more moral ETs is due to them documenting everything they do. They aren't called 'The Watchers' for nothing!!! Nothing goes by unnoticed. Every act of evil done to mankind by our corrupted leaders is documented. Also, every culture in our history has been documented. It's not just conspiracies being revealed in this time.

Past incarnations are documented as well. So one can go through who they have been(a personal thing I assume). It will be a great time for most of us.

I do not believe all will be revealed before global first contact. I believe then and only then all will be revealed. Is this time coming soon? I assume probably not. Maybe at the end of my life I will witness it by my calculations(I'm 30). Global first contact is the single biggest thing the US shadow gov is the most afraid of it seems to me. And for good reason. And they will do practically ANYTHING to stop it. But they know it's just a matter of time....

"if the American people really knew what we had done, we would be chased down the streets and lynched."
George Bush sr. (if the quote is real)

It is my belief that global first contact is the biggest event in a races history going forward or backwards in time. So much will be done overnight in this event..... For example extraterrestrials can cure any cancer very easily. Telepathic circles will be held and we will even be able to communicate with animals very clearly with technological telepathy. But thats a whole diff thread(which I will make shortly)....

Anyway, I look forward to this time. Even if I'm not alive then...

[Calz]

Happy to hear your voice again Omni ...

Hope you are right ... and expect you are not far from the truth.

[Omni]

Happy to hear your voice again Omni ...

Hope you are right ... and expect you are not far from the truth.

Thanks Calz. <3

[Zionbrion]

I am 29, do you really think it will take until towards the end of our lives? I have always been under the impression it would happen sooner.

[Robin]

Honestly, I think that it is more than likely that conscious first contact ("first" contact happened a loooong time ago!) will only happen when humans escape out of their current condition of slavery. No ETs will do the work for us and no ET race would want to recognize us a sovereign race worth officially contacting until humanity removes its shackles and understands the true history of Earth and how the universe works.

The wealth of evidence and witness testimonials of E.T. interactions is already out there, to be freely taken in to those who are not close-minded and grounded in false belief systems. I believe that first official contact will only happen when the majority of humanity raises its collective consciousness and understands the nature of our reality. When we collectively consciously create our own reality, we could send a call out to those E.T. races that we would love to "meet" them and integrate with them.

But until then...I don't believe it would happen. There exists universal laws that all being abide by (even the ones controlling this planet), and I believe it is a universal law to not directly interfere in the free will of a global experiment. But when we collectively give the call...they will come. I believe that it can happen in my lifetime, and I feel that the next decade will reveal a whole lot to humanity.

[Calz]

First contact ... what a concept when ... "they" ... have been here how much longer than we???

[BlueMuffin]

Sounds great and all, however, putting into proper perspective what is they're waiting for exactly?

I understand the concept of Free Will and non-interference, however our free will and general progress is impeded in almost every single way possible. They kill Scientists, Individuals who are deemed a threat, poison us, our food, and our skies. They Hijack great ideas that could free men in almost every way possible and turn it around and use in malevolent control methods and destruction. Animals and species in general are going extinct at unprecedented rates. Our delicate ecosystem is in immediate danger as they continually move us towards their "synthetic" bio-environment in which the damage could be irreversible, controlling the weather and creating patented lifeless crops that are impervious to the toxins they've prospered relentlessly.

So why not actually Intervene in such a way that ALLOWS us to make our own way, and discover by at least giving us a little breathing room we're not able to obtain otherwise.

So I'm just not sure I buy into it all to be honest...

[Hervé]

[...]
... the concept of Free Will and non-interference...

[...]

... are mutually exclusive... somebody's been lying again...

[Calz]

somebody's been lying again...




Any "truth" out there ... in your perception ... or do we all wallow in a sea of deception???

[Hervé]

[...]

Any "truth" out there ... in your perception ... or do we all wallow in a sea of deception???

The only one that has some workability, in theory, is the one in my signature, in French... try giggle translate :)

However, any psycho worth his/her label will convince you that not only your mere presence but your very existence is damaging his/her freedom... and, accordingly only s/he should exist in this whole universe.

... all right... back to the draftboard... :(

[Shezbeth]

Begging your pardon Omni, but it sounds to me like what you refer to as 'Global First Contact' is actually 'Human Assimilation/Subjugation'.

While you may be (likely are) correct that everything about human history is being cataloged and recorded, it is a bit of a leap to assume it is for our benefit or that we will be given a 'library card' to access it. They are called the Watchers (with an arguable accuracy), but they are not called the Doers, nor Movers or Shakers. You seem to posit the notion that First Contact will fix many/most/all hierarchical problems based on the technological capability of other races and their alleged (yes alleged!) benevolence. The obvious and as-yet unspoken corollary is: "what's the catch"? The guy at your door with a revolutionary way to clean your carpets really doesn't care if you have clean carpets, despite the song and dance.

I notice numerous statements that begin with 'I believe'; be wary of beliefs in yourself and others, and especially be wary of arguing beliefs. Beliefs are a vehicle for authoritarianism and represent that which an individual is least likely/want to evaluate, usually resulting from a predisposed desire, preference, or inclination. I do not contest that what you suggest may manifest - nor that it may be accurate - but if it were it stands without historical precedent whether literal or metaphorical on whatever level (macroscopic, microscopic, etc.).

At the very least, I suggest that any significant shift in humanity that were not internally localized would have far greater consequences and be far more adverse than what you depict.

[Omni]

Begging your pardon Omni, but it sounds to me like what you refer to as 'Global First Contact' is actually 'Human Assimilation/Subjugation'.
Not a clue how you got that from my post. Human subjugation is what is happening NOW.


While you may be (likely are) correct that everything about human history is being cataloged and recorded, it is a bit of a leap to assume it is for our benefit or that we will be given a 'library card' to access it.
So you think there are no good willed ET races documenting our history?


They are called the Watchers (with an arguable accuracy), but they are not called the Doers, nor Movers or Shakers.
Due to exopolitical agreements they cannot be shakers or movers. But when we can openly talk to them, there are races that will be open with us about what has transpired on our planet.


You seem to posit the notion that First Contact will fix many/most/all hierarchical problems based on the technological capability of other races and their alleged (yes alleged!) benevolence.
Are you of the belief that all ETs around here do not have our best interests at heart? It is my belief that we do not have the capability to free ourselves from our shackles as a race anymore. Mind control technology is too powerful. All opposition is either controlled/subverted or inert enough for them to not care IMHO. It is sadly unstoppable without intervention IMO. If you think otherwise what is to stop technology from synthesizing the same neurons firing etc that occurs naturally? Nothing.


The obvious and as-yet unspoken corollary is: "what's the catch"? The guy at your door with a revolutionary way to clean your carpets really doesn't care if you have clean carpets, despite the song and dance.
The catch is it wont happen any time soon due to dark powers that be IMO.


I notice numerous statements that begin with 'I believe'; be wary of beliefs in yourself and others, and especially be wary of arguing beliefs.
I often start sentences with "I believe" because I am not daft enough to say it is, period(in some cases). It's a form of being humble. :P


Beliefs are a vehicle for authoritarianism and represent that which an individual is least likely/want to evaluate, usually resulting from a predisposed desire, preference, or inclination. I do not contest that what you suggest may manifest - nor that it may be accurate - but if it were it stands without historical precedent whether literal or metaphorical on whatever level (macroscopic, microscopic, etc.).
And you aren't bringing your own beliefs with this post?....


At the very least, I suggest that any significant shift in humanity that were not internally localized would have far greater consequences and be far more adverse than what you depict.
The problem is mind control. An internally localized revolution where corruption is ousted and we become sovereign from dark powers is simply impossible without global first contact or a total change of heart by the bloodliners IMO(fat chance). I'm sure some will disagree but I doubt those people have experiences with overt mind control. Even if they do there are all sorts of tricks they do to make people think they can beat mind control. like invoking the name of Jesus or 'Archangel Michael', which sadly, does nothing in reality to the perpetrators of mind control.


I am 29, do you really think it will take until towards the end of our lives? I have always been under the impression it would happen sooner.

I could be wrong but I do not believe global first contact will happen any time soon. Maybe 50-200 years or so by my estimations.


Sounds great and all, however, putting into proper perspective what is they're waiting for exactly?

I understand the concept of Free Will and non-interference, however our free will and general progress is impeded in almost every single way possible. They kill Scientists, Individuals who are deemed a threat, poison us, our food, and our skies. They Hijack great ideas that could free men in almost every way possible and turn it around and use in malevolent control methods and destruction. Animals and species in general are going extinct at unprecedented rates. Our delicate ecosystem is in immediate danger as they continually move us towards their "synthetic" bio-environment in which the damage could be irreversible, controlling the weather and creating patented lifeless crops that are impervious to the toxins they've prospered relentlessly.

So why not actually Intervene in such a way that ALLOWS us to make our own way, and discover by at least giving us a little breathing room we're not able to obtain otherwise.

I hear ya, and I'm totally with you(other than not buying into it)...

I'm not quite sure what they are waiting for. Might be interstellar travel technology public so we literally have to travel publicly TO a planet with life for it all to happen. Might be a global catastrophe needing to be avoided by intervention. Might be an agreement made between the races that created us. Might be a lot of things. One thing I have faith in is that many races would love to step in right now and intervene. Seems to me the opposing forces within exopolitics is the answer as to why they cannot until a certain timeframe or event chain/specific_event.

[risveglio]

[...]

Any "truth" out there ... in your perception ... or do we all wallow in a sea of deception???

The only one that has some workability, in theory, is the one in my signature, in French... try giggle translate :)

However, any psycho worth his/her label will convince you that not only your mere presence but your very existence is damaging his/her freedom... and, accordingly only s/he should exist in this whole universe.

... all right... back to the draftboard... :(

I giggle translated it and agree with the statement. First person to tell me that was a deacon (oh the horror). It's pretty much what the universal non-aggression principle is all about.

[Shezbeth]

Human subjugation is what is happening NOW.

Quite, which is why I suggest that it is up to the individual to emancipate themselves rather than accept, hope for, or rely on other humans or non-humans to do so for them. Any being that is unwilling to free themselves is not sufficient to remain free if freed by someone/thing else. I suggest that an irresponsible society let run 'free' would be as adverse to humanity and the planet as the controlled society we see today.


So you think there are no good willed ET races documenting our history?

It is certainly possible but not something that can be relied on, strategically or inherently. Moreover, the term 'good willed' can have many connotations and applications, anywhere from 'not shooting at us' to 'trying to make a better world' (I believe Monsanto operates under the latter assertion).


Due to exopolitical agreements they cannot be shakers or movers. But when we can openly talk to them, there are races that will be open with us about what has transpired on our planet.

Perhaps this is so and/or perhaps this has been promised/stated. I would argue that certain elements of the controllers and any assistance they have is not adhering to these alleged exopolitical agreements, which would serve to suggest that perhaps these agreements are overstated or less binding. Ever heard of a bait-and-switch?


Are you of the belief that all ETs around here do not have our best interests at heart? It is my belief that we do not have the capability to free ourselves from our shackles as a race anymore. Mind control technology is too powerful. All opposition is either controlled or inert enough for them to not care IMHO. It is sadly unstoppable without intervention IMO. If you think otherwise what is to stop technology from synthesizing the same neurons firing etc that occurs naturally? Nothing.

First of all I don't deal in beliefs for a variety of reasons including those previously stated. Beliefs equate to agreements - aka contracts - and one would be well advised to avoid contracts, intellectual or otherwise; I deal in ideas and theories that have been and can be consistently validated and re-evaluated. The only things 'given' are those that can endure.

I do not contest your prognosis as it is well within the threshold of possibility. IMO, it is among the more likely probabilities, but I do not consider myself sufficiently aware of all the variables to be able to accurately or adequately predict; to claim or perceive otherwise is premature in the least.


I often start sentences with "I believe" because I am not daft enough to say it is, period(in some cases). It's a form of being humble.

I suggest that arguing beliefs is far more daft than suggesting ideas and positing theories. One can offer information without definitively stating that it is true, but also without personally agreeing to it in advance.



Beliefs are a vehicle for authoritarianism and represent that which an individual is least likely/want to evaluate, usually resulting from a predisposed desire, preference, or inclination. I do not contest that what you suggest may manifest - nor that it may be accurate - but if it were it stands without historical precedent whether literal or metaphorical on whatever level (macroscopic, microscopic, etc.).
And you aren't bringing your own beliefs with this post?....

I will assume you have read section 4 paragraph 1. ^_^


The problem is mind control. An internally localized revolution where corruption is ousted and we become sovereign from dark powers is simply impossible without global first contact or a total change of heart by the bloodliners IMO(fat chance). I'm sure some will disagree but I doubt those people have experiences with overt mind control. Even if they do there are all sorts of tricks they do to make people think they can beat mind control. like invoking the name of Jesus or 'Archangel Michael', which sadly, does nothing in reality to the perpetrators of mind control.

I do not contest that what you suggest is possible, but that doesn't mean it is inevitable. You may not be aware of it, but there are numerous instances - in this discussion and the information pertaining to it - where you deliberately choose to conclude in areas and pertaining to ideas in advance of the ability to do so and often overlooking and/or omitting details or variables. Speculating, I would suggest it has to do with your apparent want to profess beliefs and indicate that your beliefs are 'true'.

Thorough and consistent empirical procedure eliminates the possibility of mind control, as anything not consistently supported/-able is discarded. Impulses, predispositions, beliefs, thoughts, inclinations, and all forms of technologically/metaphysically induced control can be identified as erroneous and discarded.

Mind control is not a new phenomenon, though one could reasonably (though arguably) suggest that it has only been in the last century that humans began participating; regardless, there are effective counter-measures that can be developed individually. IME you are correct in stating that it doesn't involve appealing to others, as this is precisely the kind of subjugation I was/am talking about. The perception that someone/thing else is sufficiently authoritative involves the agreement that the individual is not.

If humanity is to be free of mind control and controllers, it will have to collectively want it and make it happen. Expecting ETs to solve the problem or even assist in the problem makes as much sense as expecting a house-guest to help the home-owner clean up the mess left over from the last house-guest. Or - as suggested by the vacuum-cleaner reference - expecting ETs to help 'fix the mess' without recompense of some kind is like expecting a cleaning agency to not expect to be paid in some way; benevolence is an aside, ATM we are talking business.

[Omni]

Human subjugation is what is happening NOW.

Quite, which is why I suggest that it is up to the individual to emancipate themselves rather than accept, hope for, or rely on other humans or non-humans to do so for them.
Pretty hard to free ones self of something they do not know exists...


Any being that is unwilling to free themselves is not sufficient to remain free if freed by someone/thing else. I suggest that an irresponsible society let run 'free' would be as adverse to humanity and the planet as the controlled society we see today.
For some it is not possible to be free(yours truly). People are born into this world clueless about its inner workings and thereinlies the problem. How can someone change a situation they are unaware of???



So you think there are no good willed ET races documenting our history?

It is certainly possible but not something that can be relied on, strategically or inherently. Moreover, the term 'good willed' can have many connotations and applications, anywhere from 'not shooting at us' to 'trying to make a better world' (I believe Monsanto operates under the latter assertion).
I think you know what I meant by saying good willed.




Due to exopolitical agreements they cannot be shakers or movers. But when we can openly talk to them, there are races that will be open with us about what has transpired on our planet.

Perhaps this is so and/or perhaps this has been promised/stated. I would argue that certain elements of the controllers and any assistance they have is not adhering to these alleged exopolitical agreements, which would serve to suggest that perhaps these agreements are overstated or less binding. Ever heard of a bait-and-switch?
It absolutely is adhering to the exopolitical agreements. One detail of which is that both polar opposite sides of ETs can present their assistance, and TPTB of the pertaining planet can choose which they desire to take advice from. I think it's very clear who the US government takes advice from. The malevolent ETs. And yayaya I know labeling ETs malevolent is flawed. What word would you like me to use for ETs that don't give a rats ass about us? It seems to me some would like us to suffer and devolve and be disease infested....




Are you of the belief that all ETs around here do not have our best interests at heart? It is my belief that we do not have the capability to free ourselves from our shackles as a race anymore. Mind control technology is too powerful. All opposition is either controlled or inert enough for them to not care IMHO. It is sadly unstoppable without intervention IMO. If you think otherwise what is to stop technology from synthesizing the same neurons firing etc that occurs naturally? Nothing.

First of all I don't deal in beliefs for a variety of reasons including those previously stated. Beliefs equate to agreements - aka contracts - and one would be well advised to avoid contracts, intellectual or otherwise; I deal in ideas and theories that have been and can be consistently validated and re-evaluated. The only things 'given' are those that can endure.
When I say I believe in something, it's safe to say it's a theory. you are pidgeonholing my words into your own beliefs about what I was saying. If you had read many of my posts (and remembered them) you would know that I am very open minded about a great deal of things I speak about. Some things I am not open minded but that is due to direct experiences...



I often start sentences with "I believe" because I am not daft enough to say it is, period(in some cases). It's a form of being humble.

I suggest that arguing beliefs is far more daft than suggesting ideas and positing theories. One can offer information without definitively stating that it is true, but also without personally agreeing to it in advance.
Where you use the word argue, I use the word debate. Arguing is like two spouses yelling at each other. Debating is where growth comes unless one party is too egotistical or self absorbed. You can believe a theory btw and it's still a theory....



The problem is mind control. An internally localized revolution where corruption is ousted and we become sovereign from dark powers is simply impossible without global first contact or a total change of heart by the bloodliners IMO(fat chance). I'm sure some will disagree but I doubt those people have experiences with overt mind control. Even if they do there are all sorts of tricks they do to make people think they can beat mind control. like invoking the name of Jesus or 'Archangel Michael', which sadly, does nothing in reality to the perpetrators of mind control.

I do not contest that what you suggest is possible, but that doesn't mean it is inevitable. You may not be aware of it, but there are numerous instances - in this discussion and the information pertaining to it - where you deliberately choose to conclude in areas and pertaining to ideas in advance of the ability to do so and often overlooking and/or omitting details or variables. Speculating, I would suggest it has to do with your apparent want to profess beliefs and indicate that your beliefs are 'true'.
Please quote such and point it out and I will respond to each.



Thorough and consistent empirical procedure eliminates the possibility of mind control, as anything not consistently supported/-able is discarded. Impulses, predispositions, beliefs, thoughts, inclinations, and all forms of technologically/metaphysically induced control can be identified as erroneous and discarded.
You obviously do not know mind control very well. They can control your discernment. It's not like throwing concepts into a mind and hoping they grab onto them. They can control EVERY mechanic of the mind including beliefs and discernment. If they could not, mind control would not be nearly as effective, and I would not have the opinion that it's impossible to stop the current PTB from ruling us without intervention of some sort (or waiting an extremely long time).


Mind control is not a new phenomenon, though one could reasonably (though arguably) suggest that it has only been in the last century that humans began participating; regardless, there are effective counter-measures that can be developed individually. IME you are correct in stating that it doesn't involve appealing to others, as this is precisely the kind of subjugation I was/am talking about. The perception that someone/thing else is sufficiently authoritative involves the agreement that the individual is not.

If you had spoken to the ETs I have you would know they do not see themselves as authoritative. They would say the same thing Icke says. Take what you want and discard the rest.


If humanity is to be free of mind control and controllers, it will have to collectively want it and make it happen.
This assumes that the planet of people will be aware of it all. Which is not going to happen until global first contact. It is very unreasonable to assume we as a planet will become aware of the deeper parts of the rabbit hole. As you can see if you take a look around, mainstream media is a farce and will never own up to certain truths. They have gag orders and worse...



Expecting ETs to solve the problem or even assist in the problem makes as much sense as expecting a house-guest to help the home-owner clean up the mess left over from the last house-guest. Or - as suggested by the vacuum-cleaner reference - expecting ETs to help 'fix the mess' without recompense of some kind is like expecting a cleaning agency to not expect to be paid in some way; benevolence is an aside, ATM we are talking business.
The moral ETs would love to help us out for nothing in return. Pure altruism is a trait of the most high(of the moral side). Ets are like our fathers and mothers of this race. They created us. Why wouldn't they help us out from time to time when we fall down and CANNOT get up? If you had a child and he fell in a ditch and could not move, is it irresponsible to help them out? that is how I see the world situation with mind control. We NEED help. The PTB with mind control are nameless, unelected people within the shadows. And their technology is invisible. Not to mention we have like 80% of the world believing Jesus allah or Yahweh would not allow mind control to transpire. Religion is a great tool of the mind controllers. What you say about us freeing ourselves is not a viable solution.

[truth4me]

Ever thought by being awake You/We have already been contacted?

[Omni]

Ever thought by being awake You/We have already been contacted?

First contact happened ages ago. I'm curious how it happened. I hold the belief/theory we were created by ETs by taking the indiginous humanoid dna here and hybridizing with various extraterrestrial DNAs. As for global first contact, that's the big one :)

[Hazel]

With respect to all...

All this is just so much conjecture and speculation, as Bill has said the problem for we humans is that we suffer from amnesia... this much is true to my experience and understanding.

[WhiteFeather]

Ever thought by being awake You/We have already been contacted?

Bingo, My Thoughts exactly.

[Wind]

So why not actually Intervene in such a way that ALLOWS us to make our own way, and discover by at least giving us a little breathing room we're not able to obtain otherwise.

This has been going on for a long time, but it has been a slow progress.

[Tyy1907]

With respect to all...

All this is just so much conjecture and speculation, as Bill has said the problem for we humans is that we suffer from amnesia... this much is true to my experience and understanding.

Well what if this seeming pointless conjecture helps to stir up our memories and remember?

[korgh]

.....
I do not believe all will be revealed before global first contact. I believe then and only then all will be revealed. Is this time coming soon? I assume probably not. Maybe at the end of my life I will witness it by my calculations(I'm 30). Global first contact is the single biggest thing the US shadow gov is the most afraid of it seems to me. And for good reason. And they will do practically ANYTHING to stop it. But they know it's just a matter of time....
...

sooner than you realize my friend.....

[andrewgreen]

I think anyone who is waiting for the things to be revealed is in for a very long wait, but that is exactly the state of mind the PTB want to create in us.

[Omni]

I think anyone who is waiting for the things to be revealed is in for a very long wait, but that is exactly the state of mind the PTB want to create in us.
I'm not holding my breath. Although lots of stuff has already been revealed to me. I remember as a kid having a deep desire to know the inner workings of the world, and who runs it. Well I got that wish... Granted, not exactly how I wanted or imagined it...

[andrewgreen]

I think anyone who is waiting for the things to be revealed is in for a very long wait, but that is exactly the state of mind the PTB want to create in us.
I'm not holding my breath. Although lots of stuff has already been revealed to me. I remember as a kid having a deep desire to know the inner workings of the world, and who runs it. Well I got that wish... Granted, not exactly how I wanted or imagined it...

I hope your well these days Omni!? your a unique case who is some way down the spiritual path. My main point is I think the message has to be to engage in the path of self discovery rather than waiting around for something outside of our sphere of control that may or may not happen.

[Shezbeth]

I think you know what I meant by saying good willed.

Your adherence to word definitions hasn't been stellar thus far, I don't assume to know at all what you mean. For example, you seem to be laboring under a false impression of what 'argue' means;
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/argue?s=t


When I say I believe in something, it's safe to say it's a theory. you are pidgeonholing my words into your own beliefs about what I was saying. If you had read many of my posts (and remembered them) you would know that I am very open minded about a great deal of things I speak about. Some things I am not open minded but that is due to direct experiences...

I apologize, I should never have assumed that you meant "believe" when you used the word "believe"; my bad. :lol:



Where you use the word argue, I use the word debate. Arguing is like two spouses yelling at each other.

... moving on.


Please quote such and point it out and I will respond to each.

Far too troublesome; I prefer to allow the individual to recognize (or not) as is their preference. The following questions are rhetorical.

How do you know the ETs in question are benevolent? Didn't you say you are mind controlled? Can a mind controlled individual be in any way a credible judge of benevolence?

You assume much, and you wear your bias like a medal.


You obviously do not know mind control very well. They can control your discernment. It's not like throwing concepts into a mind and hoping they grab onto them. They can control EVERY mechanic of the mind including beliefs and discernment.

Are you positing a belief or a theory? Regardless, you seem particularly predisposed to this line of thinking; I'll suffice by saying 'not always'.

You are entitled to whatever disposition and perception suits you. It is obvious (just short of painfully) that you are adverse to critical thinking, and so I will cease wasting both of our time. Enjoy your feelings of helplessness! ^_^

[Roisin]

"Learned helplessness is a mental state in which an organism forced to endure aversive stimuli, or stimuli that are painful or otherwise unpleasant, becomes unable or unwilling to avoid subsequent encounters with those stimuli, even if they are escapable, presumably because it has learned that it cannot control the situation.[1] Learned helplessness theory is the view that clinical depression and related mental illnesses may result from a perceived absence of control over the outcome of a situation.[2] Organisms that have been ineffective and less sensitive in determining the consequences of their behaviour are defined as having acquired learned helplessness."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Learned_helplessness

Learned helplessness is a major obstacle that prevents people from analyzing and evaluating those options that are out there in the area of problem solving. As a grad student in a psychotherapy program, I ran into this a lot at those therapeutic environments I worked at during my internship.

But back to the topic of mind control. To say that there's no way to prevent, avoid or terminate mind control tactics initiated by the "controllers", is indicative of the quintessential mind state of those who are caught within the grips of "Learned Helplessness". Cognitive restructuring of ones operating paradigm needs to be implemented to allow one to "see" those other alternative options that are available to be able to block such nefarious actions. It may even take a "village to do it" wrt finding and implementing those resolutions needed to block them in their efforts to control us, but to throw in the towel and to admit defeat... well, at least for this commenter in this thread (me).... is quite frankly, not even on the table.

[Jura]

Much as i know we are the 6th generations of humans created on this planet by aliens , this planet is older than we can imagine .

And if we are the 6th generation , who can tell us that there will be no 7th ?

What will happen i do not know really and when i do not know ... but i do know that many big changes will happen in next 15 years huge huge changes people will die cause of the NWO ...

I noticed spiritual awakening in people ...i myself am able to see energy in air and some strange things happened to me in my life , i do believe that our race can evolve to the 4th consciousness but i know it will take longer than 30 years for it to many people are still in slavery and believe in various religions witch were created by ''them'' to control humans , our race has to realize that we are the real gods on our planet and we can have huge impact but for that we have to stand together and cast our differences aside ...

'' they '' doing a fine job keeping us separated and i myself hardly see how we are going to come together ...

[Omni]

Way to skip over all the points that clearly you had an erroneous stance on Shezbeth....



I think you know what I meant by saying good willed.

Your adherence to word definitions hasn't been stellar thus far, I don't assume to know at all what you mean. For example, you seem to be laboring under a false impression of what 'argue' means;
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/argue?s=t
To me, arguing is not the same as debating. I think the definition is flawed on that site. On another site for definitions it has this definition:


exchange or express diverging or opposite views, typically in a heated or angry way.

So I understood it perfectly fine. Ironically it seems you are the one who doesn't know the definitions....



When I say I believe in something, it's safe to say it's a theory. you are pidgeonholing my words into your own beliefs about what I was saying. If you had read many of my posts (and remembered them) you would know that I am very open minded about a great deal of things I speak about. Some things I am not open minded but that is due to direct experiences...

I apologize, I should never have assumed that you meant "believe" when you used the word "believe"; my bad. :lol:
I mean both at times. You can believe a theory, but still hold it as a theory. There are such things as soft beliefs and hard beliefs...




Please quote such and point it out and I will respond to each.

Far too troublesome; I prefer to allow the individual to recognize (or not) as is their preference.
I'd like to see examples of your put downs. I doubt they are strong points... In fact I know they are weak points... You being not willing to show them speaks as such as well.


The following questions are rhetorical.

How do you know the ETs in question are benevolent?
I think it's safe to say there are benevolent ETs around.


Didn't you say you are mind controlled? Can a mind controlled individual be in any way a credible judge of benevolence?
Yes they can be. You could be mind controlled as well. The difference is I know I am a mind control target.


You assume much, and you wear your bias like a medal.
Here you go with beliefs and put downs again. I hazard to say you are a hypocrite for bashing me believing things yet coming with your own as if you are immune to the variables you mentioned. I theorize that your ego has been hurt by me disagreeing with you. Could be wrong but what other explanation is there for your acidic responses and put downs. Seems you have a lot to learn about healthy debates.



You obviously do not know mind control very well. They can control your discernment. It's not like throwing concepts into a mind and hoping they grab onto them. They can control EVERY mechanic of the mind including beliefs and discernment.

Are you positing a belief or a theory? Regardless, you seem particularly predisposed to this line of thinking; I'll suffice by saying 'not always'.

You are entitled to whatever disposition and perception suits you. It is obvious (just short of painfully) that you are adverse to critical thinking, and so I will cease wasting both of our time. Enjoy your feelings of helplessness! ^_^
Pretty poisonous lines here Shezbeth. Have a good one...

¤=[Post Update]=¤


"Learned helplessness is a mental state in which an organism forced to endure aversive stimuli, or stimuli that are painful or otherwise unpleasant, becomes unable or unwilling to avoid subsequent encounters with those stimuli, even if they are escapable, presumably because it has learned that it cannot control the situation.[1] Learned helplessness theory is the view that clinical depression and related mental illnesses may result from a perceived absence of control over the outcome of a situation.[2] Organisms that have been ineffective and less sensitive in determining the consequences of their behaviour are defined as having acquired learned helplessness."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Learned_helplessness

Learned helplessness is a major obstacle that prevents people from analyzing and evaluating those options that are out there in the area of problem solving. As a grad student in a psychotherapy program, I ran into this a lot at those therapeutic environments I worked at during my internship.

But back to the topic of mind control. To say that there's no way to prevent, avoid or terminate mind control tactics initiated by the "controllers", is indicative of the quintessential mind state of those who are caught within the grips of "Learned Helplessness". Cognitive restructuring of ones operating paradigm needs to be implemented to allow one to "see" those other alternative options that are available to be able to block such nefarious actions. It may even take a "village to do it" wrt finding and implementing those resolutions needed to block them in their efforts to control us, but to throw in the towel and to admit defeat... well, at least for this commenter in this thread (me).... is quite frankly, not even on the table.

Until you have experienced overt mind control to the degree they are capable of, suffice to say you are clueless about how effective it is. I do not have learned helplessness.

[Omni]

'' they '' doing a fine job keeping us separated and i myself hardly see how we are going to come together ...
Same. I think it is impossible at this point for humanity to come together unless something like global first contact happened. Even then it still wouldn't be united humanity but it would help a lot IMHO. To say we have to wait for humanity to all become aware of our rulers and overthrow them is a fairy tale.. That will never happen by my estimations...

[The Truth Is In There]

this planet has parasites. it is up to humanity to deal with them. nobody else will. certainly not "benevolent ETs".

a much more likely scenario is another world war and lots of allegedly "natural" disasters to reduce the population to a manageable number, all the while gathering people in DUMBs, droning or microchipping them (those who aren't hosts or chipheads yet, or haven't been mk-ultra'd) or just carrying them off as food. the future for humanity would be a bleak existence as mind controlled slaves and main food source.

that seems to be the plan, anyway, and it's up to humans to prevent it. the "all powerful benevolent ETs" watch and wait. if the experiment goes wrong another batch will be seeded. it's not as if this is the first time something like that has happened.

[Shezbeth]

Sorry to disappoint but (at least) one person requests that I continue this dialogue, troublesome though it may be becoming,....


Way to skip over all the points that clearly you had an erroneous stance on Shezbeth....

Law #44; I emulate my opponents when convenient.


To me, arguing is not the same as debating. I think the definition is flawed on that site. On another site for definitions it has this definition:

exchange or express diverging or opposite views, typically in a heated or angry way.

So I understood it perfectly fine. Ironically it seems you are the one who doesn't know the definitions....

Care to reference your source; a link perhaps? I don't contest that what you describe is the colloquial misinterpretation of the word's meaning but as I indicated, your adherence to defined meaning is continuing to be lacking. I'm not suggesting that there isn't such a website, but I am curious as to how authoritative it appears that you can suggest that I don't know the definitions after referencing a site dedicated to and with an excellent reputation for not only definitions but etymology. The definition(s) I supply and adhere to are consistent not only with the word, but the word origins (french and latin).

Still, this serves as a most eloquent metaphor for my reason for contesting your general presentation. It doesn't seem to matter (to you) how effectively researched, experienced, referenced, or reasoned a person's position may be; if it contradicts or contests yours it must be wrong.


I mean both at times. You can believe a theory, but still hold it as a theory. There are such things as soft beliefs and hard beliefs...

You are missing the point (not surprising :p); you may deal in beliefs all you wish to, but I have long since empirically and dispositionally opted to operate based on conclusive and consistent veracity. As a matter of course I don't believe theories, I merely hold them as more or less validated through experience. I maintain a deliberate distinction between speculation/conjecture, and even after thoroughly vetting a theory ot idea I am still quick to indicate (as I have done in this thread) that without the ability to do so "I wouldn't rule it (the idea) out".


I'd like to see examples of your put downs. I doubt they are strong points... In fact I know they are weak points... You being not willing to show them speaks as such as well.

I assume there is a point to these statements aside from posturing; if Avalon sported a 'Flame' sub-forum I would gladly indulge your request. In the meantime there are very clear (and mutually agreed upon) rules, regulations, and expectations of conduct and behavior. You will have to suffice with my


I think it's safe to say there are benevolent ETs around.

And yet, you are still operating off of an assumption. Your whole premise - from OP to the present - is conjecture. I am sure it is personally compelling, but that doesn't make it any more/less valid, nor in any way actionable.


You could be mind controlled as well. The difference is I know I am a mind control target.

Oh, they do try, but as said there are methods and practices by which such attempts can be mediated. It isn't as difficult as you might think, but it does require a great deal of discipline; the first step is to recognize the difference between speculation (personal and otherwise) and evidence.


Here you go with beliefs and put downs again. I hazard to say you are a hypocrite for bashing me believing things yet coming with your own as if you are immune to the variables you mentioned. I theorize that your ego has been hurt by me disagreeing with you. Could be wrong but what other explanation is there for your acidic responses and put downs. Seems you have a lot to learn about healthy debates.

Names? Really? That's what you went with? I understand the desire to perceive my observations as 'beliefs', but they are observable characteristics about your disposition and demeanor. You reference 'tall blond' ETs; is it a belief to refer to them as such, or is it an observable characteristic?

You may theorize however you wish if it is preferable, but sincerity and conviction are not synonymous with truth. I will admit to being disappointed that you are so unwilling to acknowledge any perception other than your own as being valid, but that alludes to my being pre-appointed to the idea that you would recognize argumental fallibility when it was clearly indicated. My bad again. As for the 'ego' bit, you should look around the forum as I am quite familiar and accustomed to disagreement; nice bit of transference though. ^_~


Pretty poisonous lines here Shezbeth.

Poisonous? :noidea: You imply that what I suggest is not observable; Roisin seems to pretty compellingly (whether intentional or not) provide consistent confirmation. I'll leave it quoted so you can gander it again; I'm not suggesting you are suffering from it, I am using it as an opportunity to indicate a disposition that I likewise am unwilling to entertain. Cheers!


"Learned helplessness is a mental state in which an organism forced to endure aversive stimuli, or stimuli that are painful or otherwise unpleasant, becomes unable or unwilling to avoid subsequent encounters with those stimuli, even if they are escapable, presumably because it has learned that it cannot control the situation.[1] Learned helplessness theory is the view that clinical depression and related mental illnesses may result from a perceived absence of control over the outcome of a situation.[2] Organisms that have been ineffective and less sensitive in determining the consequences of their behaviour are defined as having acquired learned helplessness."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Learned_helplessness

Learned helplessness is a major obstacle that prevents people from analyzing and evaluating those options that are out there in the area of problem solving. As a grad student in a psychotherapy program, I ran into this a lot at those therapeutic environments I worked at during my internship.

But back to the topic of mind control. To say that there's no way to prevent, avoid or terminate mind control tactics initiated by the "controllers", is indicative of the quintessential mind state of those who are caught within the grips of "Learned Helplessness". Cognitive restructuring of ones operating paradigm needs to be implemented to allow one to "see" those other alternative options that are available to be able to block such nefarious actions. It may even take a "village to do it" wrt finding and implementing those resolutions needed to block them in their efforts to control us, but to throw in the towel and to admit defeat... well, at least for this commenter in this thread (me).... is quite frankly, not even on the table.

But we have gone way off topic! :focus:

Tell me/us more about how our only hope is ETs. ^_^

[Omni]

To me, arguing is not the same as debating. I think the definition is flawed on that site. On another site for definitions it has this definition:

exchange or express diverging or opposite views, typically in a heated or angry way.

So I understood it perfectly fine. Ironically it seems you are the one who doesn't know the definitions....

Care to reference your source; a link perhaps? I don't contest that what you describe is the colloquial misinterpretation of the word's meaning but as I indicated, your adherence to defined meaning is continuing to be lacking.
Care to provide examples of my definitions being lacking? More accusations without any references....

Type: "Definition of Argue" into google and it will come up before any results. So now the definition is wrong and you aren't? You seriously haven't used the word argue to define people in a tussle? Or are you emulating the flaws you brought up to 'beliefs'.


I'm not suggesting that there isn't such a website, but I am curious as to how authoritative it appears that you can suggest that I don't know the definitions after referencing a site dedicated to and with an excellent reputation for not only definitions but etymology. The definition(s) I supply and adhere to are consistent not only with the word, but the word origins (french and latin).
Excellent reputation? The site that had pop ups that couldn't be x'd out standing right over the typing field is excellent? ....



Still, this serves as a most eloquent metaphor for my reason for contesting your general presentation. It doesn't seem to matter (to you) how effectively researched, experienced, referenced, or reasoned a person's position may be; if it contradicts or contests yours it must be wrong.
I'm not sure exactly how you got this. Care to bring up examples? Or is it another case of you saying an excuse to not put your money where your mouth is and provide examples of your accusations?

Also, you seem to be doing the same thing. Neither of us have budged in our position in this thread. A lot of your accusations towards me you are doing whether you know it or not....




I'd like to see examples of your put downs. I doubt they are strong points... In fact I know they are weak points... You being not willing to show them speaks as such as well.

I assume there is a point to these statements aside from posturing; if Avalon sported a 'Flame' sub-forum I would gladly indulge your request. In the meantime there are very clear (and mutually agreed upon) rules, regulations, and expectations of conduct and behavior. You will have to suffice with my
I just ask you provide examples when you put me down, so I can analyze them. Nothing wrong with that in the rules of the forum.




I think it's safe to say there are benevolent ETs around.

And yet, you are still operating off of an assumption. Your whole premise - from OP to the present - is conjecture. I am sure it is personally compelling, but that doesn't make it any more/less valid, nor in any way actionable.
It is something called logic and intuition. You should try it out sometime. Do you really think believing there are benevolent ETs a flawed assumption? Are you really that trapped in the scientific method and mind that you cannot reason without hard evidence or proof?



You could be mind controlled as well. The difference is I know I am a mind control target.

Oh, they do try, but as said there are methods and practices by which such attempts can be mediated. It isn't as difficult as you might think, but it does require a great deal of discipline; the first step is to recognize the difference between speculation (personal and otherwise) and evidence.
Knowing the difference between speculation and evidence has no bearing on their effectiveness of mind controlling someone. So you think they have attempted to technologically mind control you, and you knowing the difference between speculation and evidence stops it? I'm not sure I've heard a more ridiculous claim to stopping mind control. That is right up there with invoking Jesus' name or sleeping with pennies....



Here you go with beliefs and put downs again. I hazard to say you are a hypocrite for bashing me believing things yet coming with your own as if you are immune to the variables you mentioned. I theorize that your ego has been hurt by me disagreeing with you. Could be wrong but what other explanation is there for your acidic responses and put downs. Seems you have a lot to learn about healthy debates.

Names? Really? That's what you went with? I understand the desire to perceive my observations as 'beliefs', but they are observable characteristics about your disposition and demeanor. You reference 'tall blond' ETs; is it a belief to refer to them as such, or is it an observable characteristic?
Its kind of both. They sent images of what they looked like into my mind, but essentially it could have been a different source if one is intellectually honest. And I haven't referenced tall blond ETs. Blond ETs yes.


I will admit to being disappointed that you are so unwilling to acknowledge any perception other than your own as being valid,...
Sorry, what you have said is too ridiculous to agree with or even remotely consider as a theory. You really think humanity as a whole has the capability to discover what the dark forces on earth do in its current state? 80-90% of earth believes God controls what goes on... If you had brought thought provoking intelligent thoughts that contradict mine that made more sense I would change views in a heartbeat. Unfortunately you basically said humans need to all figure out whats going on and kick it to the curb. I'm almost speechless you cannot grasp that such a thing is impossible with all the subversion and methods used to dominate the human race...



Pretty poisonous lines here Shezbeth.

Poisonous? :noidea: You imply that what I suggest is not observable; Roisin seems to pretty compellingly (whether intentional or not) provide consistent confirmation. I'll leave it quoted so you can gander it again; I'm not suggesting you are suffering from it, I am using it as an opportunity to indicate a disposition that I likewise am unwilling to entertain. Cheers!
Your observations are subjective. I hope you can see that...


Tell me/us more about how our only hope is ETs. ^_^
We as a race have a lot of work to do for growth. But sadly mind control is unstoppable without intervention or the technology becoming public. Simple as that.


this planet has parasites. it is up to humanity to deal with them. nobody else will. certainly not "benevolent ETs".

a much more likely scenario is another world war and lots of allegedly "natural" disasters to reduce the population to a manageable number, all the while gathering people in DUMBs, droning or microchipping them (those who aren't hosts or chipheads yet, or haven't been mk-ultra'd) or just carrying them off as food. the future for humanity would be a bleak existence as mind controlled slaves and main food source.

that seems to be the plan, anyway, and it's up to humans to prevent it. the "all powerful benevolent ETs" watch and wait. if the experiment goes wrong another batch will be seeded. it's not as if this is the first time something like that has happened.

If this is true, it's going to happen. I do not believe such though... Not sure who you are quoting for "all powerful benevolent ETs". Do you believe we can oust TPTB from their positions ourselves? And how exactly would you go about doing such in that case? Feel free to answer as well Shezbeth as you seem to carry the same belief. How do we overthrow TPTB without help?

[Shezbeth]

I'll give you two to start with. ^_^

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=Definition+of+Argue

Since you seem particularly convicted to ignorance (as in ignoring) of the classical and etymological intent, purpose, and meaning of the word 'argue', I have provided a lengthy and exhaustive list of resources (since you seem particularly skittish around pop-ups; ever heard of a blocker? I didn't even know they had pop-ups! :p) that agree with my argued meaning of the term argue. You may note that a few such resources indicate your posited meaning as later defintions (as in, less accurate and/or applicable and more divergent from the etymological origins) which is consistent with my previous statement about colloquialisms.


Origin:
1275–1325; Middle English < Anglo-French, Old French arguer < Latin argūtāre, -ārī, frequentative of arguere to prove, assert, accuse ( Medieval Latin: argue, reason)

For the second:
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=Definition+of+Humble

Having served as an exponent in expressing 'argue', the inaccuracy of 'humble' should be readily apparent, though it might require a bit of discernment. No, I will not spell it out for you.

You might consider another search engine than Google. There are several videos available on Avalon that indicate why.

As for the entire rest of the OP thesis,....

http://www.fallacyfiles.org/introtof.html
That is of course only one of several such resources available on the web which I am sure by this point you won't bother investigating because to do so would contest your clear and obvious conviction to the idea that you already know and/or are correct.

That is the difference between you and I - You are certain of an idea and are expression conviction to it; I am certain that we both lack sufficient evidence by which to be pragmatically convicted.

One perceives that they have it and the other does not, while the other perceives that they both do not have it.

And - since you asked - who ever said that humanity has any hope against the controllers? THAT is an assumption I could argue both ways!

Again, you'll have to do the work for yourself.

After-though: Anyone can claim to have 'good intentions' as far as humanity is concerned; Jehovah's Witnesses come to mind.

[Agape]

Verbal intelligence is just one type of intelligence .. among many . It may have something to do with the main topic of this thread even if indirectly .

The knowledge to be revealed , and global contact scenario in fact did already happen , no not the way as we'd like to imagine and there's certainly more to come but it's my believe in this case that it won't happen for everyone at once , and the same way .

It's the mankind in the focal point here and its fate that is obviously the most important ..
is there real place for 'visitors' to this world , to add another stress on hierarchy , competition and arguments - pros and cons - before truly humane civilisation can be established, functionally stable and caring for their own ?

Who can ever miss the mess that's going on in this world .. for long enough .. to show how frail this civilisation is ?

There's adventurous idea that comes to my mind in connection to this all and that is, the global powers are pushing the world to the edge of calamity in order to speed up the revelation and what they hope to be , open contact with other species who indeed would only come out of their shells in case of real danger to mankind ?

Insane as it sounds ... and I'm not claiming it is so consciously but like a child crying for attention and running close to the edge of the waterfall knowing that mum will come to help him out , so it seems to be the case with those 'puppet masters' running the human show . They don't care where the train runs ...or what is the fate of individuals , if only their desired 'truth' could be proven to them ,
no matter how big is the sacrifice .


The truth ... is reachable by subtle and non violent means at the same time .. it is available . But as I've said, verbal intelligence is one fragment of it all and it needs its own time to reach maturity . To connect the dots between terms and ideas ,
concepts and non conceptual understanding of what needs to be revealed .. so that all we are and live here is not in vain.

[Shezbeth]

Before global first contact could occur - both in the interest of humanity and any/all contacting beings - there needs to develop a greater receptivity by the global population. The mainstream media needs to be further disavowed, not only in the minds of those discerning enough to recognize their agendas and MO but also by the population en masse. There have been numerous studies that indicate that particularly amongst younger generations the MSM is increasingly ignored, but the younger generations hold alot less sway as far as ownership and/or control of population collectives (towns, cities, states, etc.).

For many - and I include myself in this equation - there has been direct contact with non-human entities, but even those experiences run the gamut from nefarious to magnanimous. There seem to be a greater number of contactees who report adverse experience (abduction) and by virtue express a certain aversion and apprehension to the idea of beneficial ETs. One could very easily refer such to the concept of MILAB (human) interference, but that only assuages the conscious mind and that only among the percent that recognizes the possibility of ETs; there are many more who outright don't believe in ETs and who would be likely to respond with fear and distrust not only of such entities but anyone willing to interact/work with such.

If the thesis of this thread is to be taken as a given, it could only occur once a greater percentage of humanity were actively pursuant of realms of inquiry from which receptivity could be safely and conducively offered; any race that might step in is conceivably going to be disinclined if they are to be met with guns and cages.

While I have previously pointed out the fallibility of assuming that races are benevolent (objectively, not subjectively) I do not contest that there are members of races that are most probably of a beneficial disposition. In a single township one is likely to find individuals who are anywhere from insufferable to delightful, and I suggest that one is likely to find a similar dynamic among a particular ET race, as well as the multitude of races.

Having said, I repeat my assertion in spite of the convicted expression of benevolence and good-will; any entity/race that is willing to make global contact and expose the multitude of controls and manipulations - current and historic - will be unwilling to do so without some degree of expected outcome. There are a variety of organizations (including Avalon!) where - though no monetary/resource cost is incurred, there is a responsibility, obligation, or 'catch' to any perceived benefit. Avalon is free in the sense that it doesn't cost money, but there are requirements of conduct and behavior; I am not suggesting these 'costs' are onerous or unreasonable, but the idea that humanity will be 'freely' given the truth without some form of recompense appears naive. On an individual level, an elevation of conduct and proceedure - not shooting the alien visitors for example - seems perfectly reasonable to me and many others, but there are a great number of areas across the world where it is perfectly acceptable to shoot someone else's dog (or even someone else!) on premise of trespassing!

I liken my premise to a quote by Max Planck, paraphrased for the discussion.

"No significant evolution ever makes its way by converting its opponents. What does happen is its opponents eventually die off, leaving way for a generation familiar with the idea from the beginning"

As such, the idea in this case would be one of receptivity; It is possible in this lifetime, but there are a great number of things that can be done on an individual level that can mediate much/most (if not all) the problems or issues that would be mediated by global first contact. Moreover, by the time the population reached a critical mass by which global first contact were possible (conducively) then the population will have likewise ameliorated the bulk of the operant conspiracies.

But then, this is pure conjecture based of a theoretical scenario that is chock-full of (in the least) premature assumptions.

I posit that humanity possesses the potential to fix its own matters without alien assistance/interference, but I also recognize that it is equally (potentially more) probable that humanity - at least for a significant (and indeterminable) amount of time - will have to bear the consequences of the machinations and manipulations that have been ongoing.

One can't ignore a chess-game for the first 20 moves, and then start playing and still expect to win. The global game has been ongoing long before one side has been paying attention.

It is certainly possible that there may be ETs that would have a variety of vested interests from which they would be willing to assist humanity (the masses, not the controllers) in the ongoing struggle, and there is always the philosophical concept of the 'promoted pawn' that could come into play. If a sufficient number of pawns were promoted to queens, that could certainly turn the tide.

And, that is precisely what I suggest is actively going on in society. Rather than a global contact changing the face of humanity, individuals are being promoted by their own gumption and perseverance (and in many cases some timely assistance by ETs/entities) and are helping to spearhead change; first on a small/local scale, then on a regional, then national, and ultimately international.

In short, I find the OP thesis entirely unsupportable in advancing a conducively emergent strategy for evolution, growth, and development. One can wait on ETs to 'come and save us', or one can work on themselves and with others and maybe - just maybe - we can meet the ETs in the middle.

But - and I reiterate this assertion - such ETs need to get off their asses and be willing to bend and/or break the 'rules' of earth-bound interaction comparable to the manner in which those races which benefit the controllers have been doing. If this planet is the wonderous landscape/experiment/experience et al that it is purported to be, then don't such races have a vested interest in some ninja sh!t?

[Robin]

But - and I reiterate this assertion - such ETs need to get off their asses and be willing to bend and/or break the 'rules' of earth-bound interaction comparable to the manner in which those races which benefit the controllers have been doing. If this planet is the wonderous landscape/experiment/experience et al that it is purported to be, then don't such races have a vested interest in some ninja sh!t?

I think about this all the time. Even though I cannot possibly fully understand the motives that higher beings have when looking at us in this grand experiment...it still really upsets me that these benevolent races have let this Earth situation get to the level that it is. It truly is deplorable to see some of the things that take place on a daily basis on this planet, and I often wonder how any being could sit and watch--even if it means honoring free will--while Earth is inhabited by extremely ignorant people who make mockeries of themselves in an infinite amount of ways.

But I guess they have tipped the scales a bit with the influx of Wanderers to balance out the millions of Draco-souls operating under the guise of Politicians/Bankers/Religious leaders/etc.

But it still does come down to free will. Why would any race want to help out another that does not have the self-respect and self-responsibility to want to evolve to a higher level...? The Dracos have been honoring universal law and humans have created this reality out of their own free will. But the Dracos have broke the rules on a few occasions, and from what I understand, the benevolent E.T.s have reprimanded them when they broke universal law.

[Shezbeth]

There is a vast difference between 'issuing reprimands' and 'making reparations'. ^_~

[Omni]

One can wait on ETs to 'come and save us', or one can work on themselves and with others and maybe - just maybe - we can meet the ETs in the middle.

You seem to think the two cannot be done in conjunction. I do not "wait for ETs to save us". I continue to do my work on myself and helping inform others. Like I said, humanity has a lot of growth to do, and we can't expect anyone else to do it for us. But given my experiences, it it safe for me to say there are some things we simply do not have the power to change.

And thanks for leaving out attacks in your post this time.. :)

[Shezbeth]

It still looks like you are putting the cart before the horse. Positive individual contact occurs largely when an individual pursues development and emergence; positive global contact would then rely on global development and emergence. The removal of the controllers and their conspiracies would then be a requirement to pave the way for global contact, not be something to be removed by global contact. To turn a phrase, global contact (as described) is/would be the promise of cake. In the meantime, one shouldn't even concern themselves with the promise of cake, they should spend their energy, awareness, and intent on their own emergence and fostering development in any/all who one can conducively effect.

The cake may be a lie.

[Omni]

The removal of the controllers and their conspiracies would then be a requirement to pave the way for global contact

You still haven't answered my question of how you think we could go about doing such without assistance.

[Shezbeth]

:yawn:Oh but I did; collective emergence! It will not come of one agenda or movement working in opposition to the controllers, but a multitude of independent movements operating independently. If there is one thing large movements have indicated it is their ability to be coopted; the smaller and more local, the better. A single ant is as nothing to a human, but a million swarming?

The overall answer to your question is not one that can be answered, at least not at this time or by me. I admit that it probably can't/won't happen without ET assistance, but not of an overt global variety. The pawns of the world will need to become knights, rooks, bishops and queens in order for the uncontrolled masses to have a chance; and I caution it is only a chance, success is by no means guaranteed.

http://robertgreene.net/the-33-strategies-of-war.html
But then, 'Put(ting) one's self on Death's Ground' is one of the 33 Strategies of War. That more than anything else is what will achieve success, a rigorous application of astute strategy. Morals must be cast to the side, convention to the wind, and preconception to the bowels of proverbial hell. The uncontrolled masses would need to be as ruthless, cunning, patient, and methodical as the forces that they wish to upend. One person or group cannot 'lead the people' to victory, the people have to desire victory to the point that they will accept no alternative. Unfortunately, the masses do not tend to demand much without sufficient adversity; 'luckily' adversity is well on its way.

If I were in contact with particular groups of aliens and/or humans I would say the time for some ninja sh!t has come; certain controllers - in the interest of the majority - could due for kidnapping, disappearance, and or 'timely removal',... but I am only speculating (and my browser spent a few moments 'not responding' immediately after I typed those words!). Besides, that is only the absolute tip of the iceberg, but 'when facing an insurmountable opponent or unraveling a grand tapestry, it is best to start from the edges'.

At the very least, a looser interpretation of the 'prescribed' requirements of direct conduct could be considered. Further, I would suggest that the time has come for 'cleaner' hands to become 'dirtier'. ^_~

[Agape]

:yawn:Oh but I did; collective emergence! It will not come of one agenda or movement working in opposition to the controllers, but a multitude of independent movements operating independently. If there is one thing large movements have indicated it is their ability to be coopted; the smaller and more local, the better. A single ant is as nothing to a human, but a million swarming?

The overall answer to your question is not one that can be answered, at least not at this time or by me. I admit that it probably can't/won't happen without ET assistance, but not of an overt global variety. The pawns of the world will need to become knights, rooks, bishops and queens in order for the uncontrolled masses to have a chance; and I caution it is only a chance, success is by no means guaranteed.




The problem is ... human status . Sense of individual and social identity ..needs to rise , improve big way before such contact scenario ( no matter it's local or global ) is possible .

Human civilisation is not an ant colony and never will be , even if ant colonies ( metaphorically ) are the best way to organise society . The hive structure that works for some species successfully and that's been tried repeatedly on earth as well does not fit humans in my opinion.
It may fit some humans temporarily and they maybe even bred to such environments but then , they're not 'real humans' at the end .

True human spirit is one of freedom and sovereign spiritual awareness I believe . This modern civilisation is not the best example of humanity ,
true, it has potential .. potential of multitudes that has to fight for its place in the Sun against millions of competitive breeders and sperm carriers so that even one may succeed in the game .
That likens human being more to animal than he would be otherwise .

Ask Omni who he thinks started the population boom on earth, thousands of years ago ..
because we started with few thousands of people on this planet . And look at it now ..


I've read this article before yesterday which I think is noticing the same thing ..

http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20140701-the-superorganism-engulfing-earth

Homni: The new superorganism taking over Earth


This is frightening ... because we are not who we are but how we live . We are shaped not only by physical environment but by society, peer pressure, all kinds of structures, indoctrinations, believes and more dense the net is going to become more difficult to escape .

Todays people seem to be paying thousands of $$$ for holidays ..so that for two weeks they can stand somewhere in the wilderness and breathe and think they're free men .


So back to the point ..do you think that 'advanced ETs' are going to bother to chat to civilisation of smart ants .. or smart mould at worse case ;)

It's after all what human 'advanced scientists' expect to meet from the space ... they don't know what is it going to be like but from whispers in corridors .. they expect another kind of intelligent mould OR machines . They aren't able to think bigger about it anymore, keeping to their sober budgets ...

Lets not be disgusted . My point is that HUMANS will have to sort their spiritual , social and physical status first of all to be able to express their potential fully .. to meet their counterparts from elsewhere .
It's what you expect of them ...

but it's more often missing . They miss sense of sovereignty .. as individuals representing their own kind . To be able to stand for all when required as emissaries of this planet .


:sleep:

[Omni]

Ask Omni who he thinks started the population boom on earth, thousands of years ago ..
because we started with few thousands of people on this planet . And look at it now ..
I have no idea. The history of earth isn't a subject I have been given much information about unfortunately. They just told me to research it and use logic/intuition.

[Agape]

Ask Omni who he thinks started the population boom on earth, thousands of years ago ..
because we started with few thousands of people on this planet . And look at it now ..
I have no idea. The history of earth isn't a subject I have been given much information about unfortunately. They just told me to research it and use logic/intuition.

Is that a 'quote' ;) Teasing, sorry .

I've seen lots of remote history of this planet, on the other hand .. things that do not exist anymore except for we all carry them in your genes . There were great civilisations in the past too .. millions of years ago .. all turned to dust ..
but none so outnumbered - overpopulated as the current one is ..

It's not been confirmed to me from any second source but in my own insight , the last deliberate manipulation of human genome by those you call 'greys' ( possibly , though they are very diverse group of species ) resulted in this extensive procreation capacity of humans . Maybe not on purpose .


:angel:

[Omni]

It's not been confirmed to me from any second source but in my own insight , the last deliberate manipulation of human genome by those you call 'greys' ( possibly , though they are very diverse group of species ) resulted in this extensive procreation capacity of humans . Maybe not on purpose .

No doubt in my mind it was intentional. ETs who are that advanced would be able to do such, or predict such very easily IMHO.

[Tyy1907]

Quoted by Shezbeth: "The overall answer to your question is not one that can be answered, at least not at this time or by me. I admit that it probably can't/won't happen without ET assistance, but not of an overt global variety. The pawns of the world will need to become knights, rooks, bishops and queens in order for the uncontrolled masses to have a chance; and I caution it is only a chance, success is by no means guaranteed."

According to some sources benevolent star races have already been intervening by stopping mass casualty scenarios on numerous occassions. However on the flip side benevolents are actively being prevented from open contact scenarios. Some food for thought.