Ronald Hubbard and his "VERY GOOD FRIEND CROWLEY" (Hubbard black and white). [Archive]

View Full Version : Ronald Hubbard and his "VERY GOOD FRIEND CROWLEY" (Hubbard black and white).

cuitlahuac

9th July 2014, 07:15

The topic of L. Ron Hubbard and his connection with black magician, his "very good friend" Aleister Crowley seems to be a very misunderstood topic.

Snowflower

9th July 2014, 07:20

Actually, I don't know what the hell you are talking about.

(really - I don't.)

cuitlahuac

9th July 2014, 07:29

Now regarding Hubbard and his "very good friend" Crowley, the Master Therion 666. It appears that Hubbard was joking when he referred to Crowley as his "very good friend".

Critics have accused Ron of “swindling” Jack Parsons, and while Wright doesn’t add new news to this theory, he certainly manages to leave some important facts out.

Basically, Ron and Jack, in the short 4-5 months that they hung out and became good friends in 1945/1946, decided to go into business together — it was going to be a wide ranging enterprise, and the first idea was to buy three yachts cheaply on the east coast (Miami), bring them across the Panama Canal by hiring crews, and then selling them at a significant mark-up to the rich celebrity crowd in southern California. Parsons put up most of the money, but didn’t have to do any work. Hubbard put in a bit of money, but was responsible for doing all the legwork. This is a common business arrangement, where one partner provides the money, the other takes care of operations.

Beyond that, there were a number of future ideas that the two had thought up, including adding Hubbard’s writings to the partnership, Parsons was going to add some of the assets from his rocket work. (Source: Strange Angel, by Pendle). According to Heinlein, Hubbard talked up an idea of going to other countries, including a “China venture” — in one letter to Hubbard in 1946, Heinlein scolded Hubbard for being too talkative about China, getting his (Heinlein’s) nephews overly excited about exotic trips there.
[Source: Heinlein biography by Patterson]).

But forty years later, this became “Hubbard tried to swindle Parsons” in the minds of his critics, for two reasons:

(1) Because Ron was still in the Navy, he was required to get permission to leave the country. He listed South America, Central America and China as possible destinations. Because China was nowhere near the Panama Canal, this, in the minds of Hubbard’s critics, was due to Ron’s “secret plans to go to China”. Yeah, real secret — Heinlein was actually upset that Ron was talking about it too much.

(2) Crowely and his OTO team didn’t trust people — they didn’t trust Jack (to think for himself), they didn’t trust someone named Smith. They had endless back-stabbing drama amongst themselves. And their latest object of distrust was Ron. When Crowley (living in England, and having never met Ron) heard about the business venture, he decided that it was all a con by Ron and that he needed to brow-beat Jack, and with the help from other members of the drama-filled OTO, ultimately convinced Jack that Ron was swindling him.

In the mean time, Ron was busily carrying out the business plan (with the help of Betty) in Miami for about a month, had bought the boats and even hired the crews. But Jack had been convinced by Crowley and others that Ron wasn’t staying in touch with Jack enough, and therefore Ron must be onto something tricky. So Jack races across the country to find Ron and Betty doing exactly what they had all agreed to do. Ron had actually purchased three yachts! And worse, he had arranged the crews to sail them through the Panama Canal. The horror of it all!

Jack, having been all worked up by the OTO (and wanting to stay in good graces with Crowley), forced the partnership to be dissolved.

Hubbard and Betty were left thinking: WTF?

(Sources: “Strange Angel”, by Pendle; “Heinlein Biography, Vol 1″, by Patterson.)
—
Believe me, when Hubbard later referred to Aleister Crowley in a lecture as his “good friend”, he was joking. And the audience knew it. They chuckled when he said it.

cuitlahuac

9th July 2014, 07:33

Nevertheless, "very good friend" Crowley had very good information in his Magick technology and Hubbard makes reference to that.

Here are the references, and it is not the book Pied Pipers of Heaven as I have previously stated:

Scientology Integrity: Scientology Time Track By Entry

Scientology Time Track By Entry
1969

Hubbard claims that more than two dozen thinkers, prophets and psychologists influenced Scientology; everyone from Plato, Jesus of Nazareth to Sigmund Freud whom he says he studied under in Vienna. The record can now be righted with the inclusion of Aleister Crowley, the Beast 666.

This link is from Mike McClaughry, a self confessed infiltrator of Scientology and the Scientology Freezone. The statement that Hubbard studied under Freud in Vienna is incorrect. As far as I know Hubbard learned Freudian psychoanalysis from "Snake" Thompson, and it was Thompson who studied from Freud in Vienna.

cuitlahuac

9th July 2014, 07:36

[/COLOR]
Actually, I don't know what the hell you are talking about.

(really - I don't.)

I hope the problem is corrected by commenting only on Hubbard and his relation with his "very good friend" Crowley.

cuitlahuac

9th July 2014, 07:58

Hubbard has been accused of being a sociopath in the tradition of top Secret Society personalities (freemasons, illuminati) but also receives credit for providing a workable technology for the mind and spirit.

Presented as proof of his sociopathy is the testimony of Hana Whitfield in a 26th March 2010 Educational Symposium about Scientology Organized by the Workgroup Scientology of The Ministry of the Interior in Hamburg. According to this, Hubbard was an infidel and promiscuous husband as well as a very tyrannical leader.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qd00GtwXcYQ

Is the sociopathy issue complicated by the comments on the "several Hubbards". Not only people close to him speak of "several Hubbards", but also there are accounts of Sea Org staff witnessing Hubbard drilling in one place inside of the ship and another Hubbard on top of the deck.

Here’s a strange thought: I was told by a friend who knew Hubbard that Hubbard’s butler told him there were THREE different Hubbards’ at three different times. He said they had three very different shoe and body sizes. Others have told me that the technology had three main eras, each one quite different from the others. Certainly if you listen to different audio tapes of Hubbard, his voice changed dramatically over the years. And certainly, when you understand how organised the dark side is on this planet, and the power of this technology, it stands to reason that they would interfere.

Stephanie Relfe

Feb 6 2003

https://www.themarsrecords.com/wp/the-mars-records/note-stephanie-relfe-scientology/

cuitlahuac

9th July 2014, 08:08

I am not defending Hubbard. I just want to get to the truth on all this. But mainly, I wold not want somebody come (as has happened on important occasions) and state that Scientology must be gotten rid of "destructive" policies.

This is technology, and it is like the case of a weapon or a government. A gun or a government in the hands of social and sane people is a good thing, but a gun or government in the hands of sociopaths is a warranty of death. The problem is not Scientology or the gun, the problem is what kind of person is using it.

cuitlahuac

9th July 2014, 08:17

Regarding Hubbard and his "very good friend" Crowley, one has to take into account that Hubbard's first discovery, Dianetics, was taken off of him, and he had to develop Scientology in such a way that it was not taken from him again. This in a world where the name of the game is "take over". You can see this dramatized everywhere, even in small children snatching toys from each other.

cuitlahuac

9th July 2014, 16:00

Hubbard has also been accused of initiating his son Ronald De Wolf into Crowley's sex magic in the early 50's, but somehow the context is missing from the link:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRUYESI3v3c

The missing context is that Hubbard got Dianetics taken from him:

Messiah or Madman? - Bent Corydon
[Plaintext version 1.0, August 18, 1998]

L.RON
HUBBARD

Messiah of Madman?

Bent Corydon and
L. Ron Hubbard, Jr.
a.k.a. Ronald DeWolf

306 "WOMANIZER" TO "MESSIAH"

"They came bursting in like Carrie Nation attacking a saloon. Abso-
lutely no class at all.
"We somehow distracted the Marshals from going all the way up-
stairs.
"It seems that all the Marshals wanted was to serve him a subpoena
to appear in court over the hassle Don Purcell was kicking up over
the rights to Dianetics. (He claimed he owned them).
"The subpoena was finally properly and courteously served.
"Now it was Dad's turn. When he unfolded the paper he became
unglued. He hated courts; he hated Don Purcell; he hated, period.
All the clicks in his head went off like a string of Chinese firecrackers.
"Well, Dad was psycho as hell, but he wasn't dumb. He took the
rap. A contempt of court with a fine of $5000.00.
"One does not put a god on trial nor ridicule a god. Dad vowed
never to appear in court again for any reason. He never did.
"The night after the court appearance he was still raging. When he
was nervous or upset he would shout and scream. When his concrete
self-confidence was shaken he would blindly attack people and furni-
ture.
"A bottle of rum and an hour of screaming later he had cooled down
a little; but the `Power' was still translating into anger; overriding the
alcohol. My whole life I've always marvelled at his capacity to con-
sume alcohol and remain upright and coherent. A fifth of Myers dark
rum was the same as two aspirin to Dad.
"After he got in the groove and plugged in his self-confidence
again, he got up from the couch and retrieved several books from his
suitcase. He dropped them in fRont of me on the hotel room coffee
table.
"`I'm going to need more help,' he says. `More help than I'm
getting. I'm going to outlive this whole damned world but I want you
for back-up.'
"`You got it Dad, you know that already,' I say.
"`I know, I know,' Dad says impatiently, `but you don't have much
horsepower. `
"`Hey, Dad, I'm doing O.K'
"He flies off the handle: `You snot-nosed kid. You don't know your
ass from a hole in the ground!' He slams his hand down on the books
on the coffee table. `All you are is a fart in a hurricane, kid; now read
about the Real Power!'

"*Blood of Their Bodies*" 307

"`The books and contents to be kept forever secret, he says. To
reveal them will cause you instant insanity: rip your mind apart; de-
stroy you.' he says. `Secrets, techniques and powers I alone have con-
quered and harnessed. I alone have refined, improved on, applied
my engineering principles to. Science and logic. The keys! My keys to
the doorway of the Magick; my magick! The power! Not Scientology
power! My power! The real powers of Solomon,' he says, `Caligula
and Alice too. Your past is your enemy,' he says. `the enemy of all.'
"I listen with hypnotic fascination: The books; some recently pub-
lished, some over 1200 years old, The Book of the Law, The Sacred
Magic of Abre-Melin, the Sex Magic of the Ninth Degree of the
"He is excited, fearful and cautious. He is tense. Unimparted se-
crets, imparted for the first time.
"I open the books intending only to thumb through. I am awed and
amazed; I Know these books! How could I?
"He answers:'They were used to conceive you, and birth you, too.
I've read them to you while you were asleep while you were
drugged and hypnotized; for years.
"`I've made the Magick really work,' he says. `No more foolish ritu-
als. I've stripped the Magick to basics-access without liability.
"`Sex by will,' he says. `Love by will-no caring and no shar-
ing-no feelings. None,' he says. `Love reversed,' he says. `Love isn't
sex. Love is no good; puts you at effect. Sex is the route to power,' he
says. Scarlet women! They are the secret to the doorway. Use and
consume. Feast. Drink the power through them. Waste and discard
them.'
"`Scarlet?' I ask.
"`Yes Scarlet: the blood of their bodies; the blood of their souls,' he
says.
"`Release your will from bondage. Rend their bodies; bend their
minds; bend their wills; beat back the past. The present is all there is.
No consequences and no guilt. Nothing is wrong in the present. The
will is free-totally free; no feelings; no effort; pure thought-sepa-
rated. The Will postulating the Will,' he says.
"`Will, Sex, Love, Blood, Door, Power, Will. Logical,' he says.
"`The doorway of Plenty. The Great Door of the Great Beast.'
"He repeats the incantation; invokes the door opening to the realm
of the Beast.

The context must include Hubbard's previous life as Cecile Rhodes and his plan to create a secret society (Society of the Elect) to rule the world:

At his death he was considered one of the wealthiest men in the world. In his first will, written in 1877 before he had accumulated his wealth, Rhodes wanted to create a secret society that would bring the whole world under British rule.[8] The exact wording from this will is:

To and for the establishment, promotion and development of a Secret Society, the true aim and object whereof shall be for the extension of British rule throughout the world, the perfecting of a system of emigration from the United Kingdom, and of colonisation by British subjects of all lands where the means of livelihood are attainable by energy, labour and enterprise, and especially the occupation by British settlers of the entire Continent of Africa, the Holy Land, the Valley of the Euphrates, the Islands of Cyprus and Candia, the whole of South America, the Islands of the Pacific not heretofore possessed by Great Britain, the whole of the Malay Archipelago, the seaboard of China and Japan, the ultimate recovery of the United States of America as an integral part of the British Empire, the inauguration of a system of Colonial representation in the Imperial Parliament which may tend to weld together the disjointed members of the Empire and, finally, the foundation of so great a Power as to render wars impossible, and promote the best interests of humanity.[51]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cecil_Rhodes

http://conspiracywiki.com/images/article/images/cecil-rhodes.jpg

And it is clear that Hubbard was in the reality of ruling the world through secret societies, which is a fact. And again, the name of the game at those levels seems to be "take over".

cuitlahuac

9th July 2014, 16:10

And more light on Hubbard and his "very good friend" Crowley. Here Hubbard's mission as a Druid is said to be the destruction of black magician Crowley:

Hubbard and magic:

L.Kin
Volume 4
__________________________
From the
Bottom
to the Top
(The Way Out)
2
A Biographical Sketch
(This article by Peter Moon appeared under the heading of "L.Ron
Hubbard", in the appendix to "Montauk Revisited" by Preston B. Nichols and
Peter Moon, available from Sky Books, Box 769, Westbury, NY 11590. It is
reprinted here with kind permission of the publisher.)
"An incredible amount of nonsense has been written about this man. I will
be as brief as possible and stick to the salient points based upon my own
personal knowledge and insights.
Hubbard was extremely wide read and had an acute aptitude for the
paranormal. His experiences were not those of a "normal" person and he was
continually finding that nobody believed him. Various authors and courts have
condemned him for being a compulsive liar. I definitely found this not to be
true in my own experience, but if he was a compulsive liar to some, it was
partly because no one believed him when he told the truth. Why not just tell
them something that works? Hubbard believed in workability beyond all else
and he was extremely effective in his pursuits. He hated the establishment
because it furthered stagnation and was a hallmark of ineffectiveness.
The Navy carreer of L.Ron Hubbard is checkered with ambiguity. His actual
naval records will not be released although there is an agreement that he
worked in Naval Intelligence. This being the case, disinformation as to his
whereabouts and duties would have been fabricated as a matter of due course.
It is known that Hubbard studied the psychiatric records of Navy personnel
and had information on the cutting edge procedures of the day. This included
narcosynthesis and regression techniques. He took what he learnt from
psychiatric research, plus his earlier studies, and formulated Dianetics. This
144
was the first major regression therapy applied on a broad basis and was
designed to be easy for the layman to use.
Hubbard also studied Aleister Crowley and found him fascinating.
Crowley´s principles are to be found here and there throughout Hubbard´s
work, but they are not one and the same thing. Hubbard developed his own
techniques and was more of an innovator than a copycat.
Hubbard´s popularity grew and he never had to look back as far as money
was concerned. The Church of Scientology grew out of this popularity and it
was incorporated as a legal religion in 1954. Hubbard had constant difficulties
running organizations and found he couldn´t openly trust others to "just go do
it". He formulated his own administrative system and set it up to be effective.
The purpose was to sell books and get his Dianetics and Scientology processes
to the public. He honestly believed this would save humanity.
The Government waged decades of war against Hubbard and much of it
was unconstitutional. I believe that they were angry at him for breaking
security with information he had obtained while with the Navy. His
organization was also perceived as a threat to J. Edgar Hoover, Richard Nixon
and other establishment forces.
I first saw Hubbard in 1972 and Scientology was a growing and dynamic
movement at that point. He had definite health problems, but they were not
exaggerated nor did they seem to hamper him. These were not hidden from the
crew. He considered himself an experimental guinea pig and what he released
as standard Scientology was watered down (as far as being dangerous) and
foolproof as far as he was concerned.
Hubbard is often described as a temperamental hot head who always had to
get his way. He had extremely high expectations and they were not often met.
Very often, he didn´t get his way and nothing was done about it for a long time
or sometimes not at all. Of course, there were plenty of times when he achieved
what he wanted, but he was mostly busy researching. Hubbard did not
constantly police anyone. At times he would keep to himself but he never
ignored the crew. I only saw him get angry a couple of times and this was after
a person had repeatedly acted like a fool.
Hubbard said he had no idea he would become so popular and become such
a figurehead. Had he known, he would have led his life quite differently. It
was wild and filled with outrageous aspects. In fact, he told a friend of mine in
the early 1970´s that he would prefer to die. His body was worn out, and he felt
he had to keep it alive because he had become an important symbol to so many
people that followed the movement.
145
Government agents reportedly used to take bets on how fast they could put
Hubbard in prison. Although they were not successful in this regard, I believe
he was under constant psychotronic attack during the time the Montauk Project
was in operation. He even ended up on Long Island during most of 1973.
The Church of Scientology grew to be a very large organization by the early
1980´s. Despite high officials going to prison for conspiracy against the
Government, the movement was highly popular and growing. In 1981, at what
was probably the height of the Church´s popularity, Hubbard was no longer
directly involved. He was hiding so as not to be served with a subpoena.
Several people thought the movement had been infiltrated by the CIA pitting
one Scientology faction against another. There was tremendous infighting
within the organization during this period and the majority of the people I
knew left. The organization totally changed its operating basis and hasn´t been
the same since.
Hubbard passed on in January 1986 at the age of 74. He called his
confidante, Pat Broeker, to his room a few days before he departed and told
him that he would be leaving his body. Hubbard was concerned that people
might grieve and cry over his departure. He said this wasn´t necessary and that
people would cry only because of their own self-invalidation. In other words,
people would be crying over their own belief system that they themselves were
not immortal.
I´ve tried to be as objective as possible about this short biographical sketch of
Hubbard. It is important to realize that this man had incredible knowledge. He
wanted the entire world to access it. If he were clearly interested in money and
power and that was all, he would have led a much more extravagant life style.
Most of the time, his quarters were not as plush as the average three bedroom
house. His life was also filled with pits and valleys and he would have been the
first to agree. The man has simply not been accurately portrayed in any
biographical accounts of him.
I believe that the real clues to this man´s role on Earth have to do with his
involvement with Jack Parsons and his heritage with the Wilson clan. His
activities there are still shrouded in mystery."

Hubbard, The Druid

The somewhat cryptical remark in the last three lines of Peter Moon´s article
needs explaining: the Wilson clan is a family of highly initiated Scottish
witches. Members of this family went abroad and settled in the USA. Ron
Hubbard´s father Harry Ross Hubbard was a Wilson really and had been
146
adopted by a family named Hubbard. Which means that Ron grew up in fairly
elevated spiritual circles. (I should think he chose a family to suit his purposes
as you´ll see in a moment.)
I´m taking this from a chapter on the Wilson family in "Montauk Revisited".
Preston Nichols, like other authors before, tries to explain the relationship of
Hubbard and Crowley by saying that Hubbard learned from Crowley and that
the link between the two was Jack Parsons who Hubbard did experiments in
magick with. (Jack Parsons was a rocket engineer and a disciple of Crowley.
See the chapter on him in "Montauk Revisited".)
This never clicked with me. Firstly, Hubbard didn´t spend a lot of time with
Jack Parsons. Secondly - and more importantly - all the session data that went
into the "Pied Pipers" clearly show that Hubbard as "Elron" was in dead
opposition to Yatrus. Given that Crowley at his time was the senior
representative of Yatrus on Earth, it wouldn´t make sense that Hubbard should
seriously study Crowley´s magick - except perhaps to find out what the enemy
was up to.
The answer to the riddle fell into my lap when at an auditor´s convention in
1996, I met a solo auditor who was also a druid. This puzzled me. How would
a druid be a solo auditor on Solo 3 or vice versa?
He told me that druids consider themselves to be the keepers of spirituality
in Europe. They keep a low profile since the Catholic Church to this day is up
in arms against them. Druids are interested in any new development to find
out what it´s worth, and perhaps to influence it.
Hubbard´s teachings are of particular importance to them. Because Hubbard
(he said) was by education a druid. He was entrusted with the task of making
druidic knowledge available to mankind in popular language.
How would my druid friend know this? Because his teacher told him. So I
rang the teacher on the phone (a very long-distance call). He confirmed the
story and said he had been told it by his teacher who as a child and a young
man knew Hubbard personally, at a time when Hubbard was already in his
fifties and sailing the Mediterranean in his Sea Org ships.
I asked him if Ron hadn´t told this young man some tall story to impress
him, because (don´t we know?) Ron loved to create his PR image to suit the
demands of his environment.
No, said the druid teacher, the story was again confirmed by his teacher´s
teacher who studied druidism right at the time when Hubbard studied it - in
the 1930´s. They didn´t study in the same place but knew of each other.
147
So for better or worse, here is the full story as it was given to me: Ron, born
into a clan of magicians and witches, received a druid education from late
childhood on. It lasted some 15 years. He was entrusted with the task of
rendering Crowley powerless since Crowley was into black magic, and black
magic is not what druids favour. Further, and as his masterpiece, he was to
rehabilitate druidic knowledge in the eyes of the world.
Ron was excluded from druidic circles when he founded the "Church of
Scientology" in 1954 since it´s against druidic policy to start a religion.
148

http://freezoneearth.org/lkin/vol4/appendix_a.html

cuitlahuac

9th July 2014, 16:38

The words supposedly stated by Hubbard to his son: "The keys! My keys to
the doorway of the Magick; my magick! The power! Not Scientology
power! My power! The real powers of Solomon,' he says, `Caligula
and Alice too." Seem to indicate that Hubbard was embarked in a two fold mission, become a ruler of the World through Magick, (a secret known by his "very good friend" Crowley) and the development of Scientology.

cuitlahuac

9th July 2014, 16:49

Regarding the phrase: Crowley´s principles are to be found here and there throughout Hubbard´s work,

I think it would be good if one could identify those principles and evaluate them.

One might be "Do as thou wilt shall be the hole of the law". But this principle of Thelema by "very good friend" Crowley is a principle first stated by Saint Augustine: “Love, and do what you will. If you keep silence, do it out of love. If you cry out, do it out of love. If you refrain from punishing, do it out of love.”

http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/143172-love-and-do-what-you-will-if-you-keep-silence

http://spreadjesus.org/21w/St-Augustine-of-Hippo-Saint-of-the-Day--August-28.jpg

And here we have a principle applied by two opposing personalities: "Do as thou wilt" as understood by our "friend" Crowley and "Love and do as thou wilt" as understood by Saint Augustine. The problem is not the principle, but the person applying it.

donk

9th July 2014, 17:24

Shezbeth

9th July 2014, 18:44

donk

9th July 2014, 20:21

So to me, so far it is a lot of he said/she said…and trying to discern which information you choose to believe.

If we set aside common assumptions:
Pro-LRon – he was wise and developed tech that worked and is therefore vilified by haters
Anti-LRon – there sure seems to be a lot of testimony (whether reliable or not) that he was pretty psychopathic, and his “tech” not very “original”

I think either these two don’t matter, or maybe are what we are trying to determine in finding data to support a Crowley-Hubbard connection?

Which begs the question, why does that matter? In other words, what Crowley assumptions are we basing it on?
-he was misunderstood genius, providing a not-commonly accepted (but workable) “tech” of his own?
-was a black magician?
-a spy? Evil?

I looked into both of these characters, and have seen all of the material so far (and more). I find it interesting to explore whether there is a connection between the two (and of course as much “truth” about their character as well as the nature of the material the created).

In my experience, the only thing I found in common with their teachings, is that the believers in it feel that the “higher levels” are demonstrably dangerous….possibly physically harmful…to the uninitiated.

People that believe Crowley was a black magician warn of the dangerous of studying his work. And as I related earlier, only after you get past Hubbard’s Operating Thetan II level is it even close to being safe to write down the next level, the dreaded wall of fire, forbidden to the lower levels—at risk of heart attack or death (or MS)…I won’t even name out of respect for those that have told me it is irresponsible of me to even broach the subject…uncannily like god-fearing Christians holding up crosses against the number 666…I am sure that there’s people out there that think I’m evil (or running into evil, or harmed by evil) because the beast number constantly appears in my awareness…

So this is of huge interest to me. It was suggested to me that the material itself…both LRon’s and AC666’s…”harbors entities”…can anyone relate or shed light on this phenomenon?

And to the original poster—can you please clarify what importance you think there is between a Hubbard-Crowley connection, including the assumptions that you are basing it on? Thanks!

cuitlahuac

10th July 2014, 06:29

This thread reads like an LRon book (which I have incredible difficulty making sense of).

It was suggested to me by a respected, highly intelligent LRon-teaching believer (for lack of better of word) that my attempt at exposing the uninitiated to his most sacred (and apparantely secret, and dangerous entity-bearing) teaching (the "wall of fire" that shall not be properly openly named) was extremely irresponsibly dangerous and may have brought about my MS.

So maybe there is something to 666/LRon connection...but I sure can't figure it out with what's been posted here so far...or what you are trying to get out of this?

What I am trying to do here is present an unbiased account of what happened between Hubbard and his "very good friend" Crowley. An unbiased account of Hubbard and black or white magic and an unbiased account of Hubbard as regards his sociopathic aspects. Other threads that try to provide an "unbiased" account of this issues seem to lack some of the information.

I want to remark the statement that to understand Hubbard and his effect on the planet, one has to find out the fact of him being part of the Wilson Clan of magicians.

Note: As far as I know, the Wall of Fire information does not affect too much the lower levels as it affects the upper near to the level 3 (wall of fire) levels. The danger is that the information might awaken attached body entities.

cuitlahuac

10th July 2014, 06:37

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L_Ron_Hubbard#Occult_involvement_in_Pasadena

Wikipedia has a section on L Ron and his connection to Aleister Crowley and co., particularly an interesting (IMO) evolving testimony as to his character and practices.

Thanks a lot. The connection is to Jack Parsons:

Parsons and Hubbard collaborated on the "Babalon Working", a sex magic ritual intended to summon an incarnation of Babalon, the supreme Thelemite Goddess. It was undertaken over several nights in February and March 1946 in order to summon an "elemental" who would participate in further sex magic.[118] As Richard Metzger describes it,

Parsons used his "magical wand" to whip up a vortex of energy so the elemental would be summoned. Translated into plain English, Parsons jerked off in the name of spiritual advancement whilst Hubbard (referred to as "The Scribe" in the diary of the event) scanned the astral plane for signs and visions.[119]

The "elemental" arrived a few days later in the form of Marjorie Cameron, who agreed to participate in Parsons' rites.[118]

The Church of Scientology has nonetheless acknowledged Hubbard's involvement with the OTO; a 1969 statement, written by Hubbard himself,[125] said:

Hubbard broke up black magic in America ... L. Ron Hubbard was still an officer of the U.S. Navy, because he was well known as a writer and a philosopher and had friends amongst the physicists, he was sent in to handle the situation. He went to live at the house and investigated the black magic rites and the general situation and found them very bad ...

Hubbard's mission was successful far beyond anyone's expectations. The house was torn down. Hubbard rescued a girl they were using. The black magic group was dispersed and destroyed and has never recovered.[126]

cuitlahuac

10th July 2014, 06:58

cuitlahuac

10th July 2014, 07:13

In my experience, the only thing I found in common with their teachings, is that the believers in it feel that the “higher levels” are demonstrably dangerous….possibly physically harmful…to the uninitiated.

People that believe Crowley was a black magician warn of the dangerous of studying his work. And as I related earlier, only after you get past Hubbard’s Operating Thetan II level is it even close to being safe to write down the next level, the dreaded wall of fire, forbidden to the lower levels—at risk of heart attack or death (or MS)…I won’t even name out of respect for those that have told me it is irresponsible of me to even broach the subject…uncannily like god-fearing Christians holding up crosses against the number 666…I am sure that there’s people out there that think I’m evil (or running into evil, or harmed by evil) because the beast number constantly appears in my awareness…

So this is of huge interest to me. It was suggested to me that the material itself…both LRon’s and AC666’s…”harbors entities”…can anyone relate or shed light on this phenomenon?

I don't know if Crowley's books have entities.

In the case of Scientology "Wall of Fire" material, what Hubbard say is that it is designed to kill everyone discovering it. What I know is that it might "awaken" entities in the body that will cause problems. On other upper material, the person would get overwhelmed with the information if not up to the level.

In the case of "good friend" Crowley. It might be the case that the books have entities to create havoc on those not following the directions, but I don't know.

cuitlahuac

10th July 2014, 07:22

And to the original poster—can you please clarify what importance you think there is between a Hubbard-Crowley connection, including the assumptions that you are basing it on? Thanks!

The importance I see is that there are threads describing the Hubbard Crowley connection as evidence of Scientology being a trap, and Hubbard being a satanist. The other aspect is that somebody might say Scientology needs revision to "eradicate" the trapping and destructive material out of Scientology, therefore rendering it useless or leading to the creation of lots of "Enhanced Scientology" versions or "Improved" (and useless) versions or worse... "enhanced and improved" versions which are nothing but "enhanced and improved" tyranny.

And one of the key assumptions stated here is that we will not know the extent of Hubbard's effect on society if we do not investigate his participation in the Wilson Clan magic. This would indicate that the the entries on Hubbard as a magician (black or white) are missing some 70 or 80% of the information if they do not include the fact that Hubbard was part of the Wilson Clan of magicians. Given that it was to be true information.

cuitlahuac

11th July 2014, 06:08

Was Hubbard unable to exorcise his own demons?

I don't know about his own "demons" (entities), and if those "own demons" were the ones responsible for his "psychopathy". What is known is that Hubbard was implanted with a suppressive "entity" by the "Man Behind the Scene".

Here is an excerpt from material no longer available in the internet:

history part 1
History of Scientology

There are no confidential materials enclosed.

While doing research on the OT levels LRH also found the main source of suppression on Earth and on scientology and found them to be the central banks headed by BIS, Bank for international settlement. It is an international organization (located in 44 countries of which their main facility is located in Basel Switzerland) that leads and controls the central banks (who in turn control the national banks) and other agencies in pursuit of monetary and financial control.

After these results the CIA labelled scientology as a security risk and informed the so called man behind the scene about the results and took over the research, part of which became known as the supersecret project "Grill Flame" part of which included scientology materials.

As BIS was informed about scientology and also about the fact that LRH pinpointed them as being the main cause of suppression on earth (in the RJ67 lecture) they took action to "handle" scientology as a whole. BIS made among other sure that the technology did not continue outside their control and "handled" LRH with an entity implant type mind control technique in New York December 1972. This caused the technology idle until 1978 when the remedy for this type of mind control was found. This ended up in revising the OT5, 6 and 7 levels of the bridge into New OT5, 6 and 7, dealing with similar items as on OT3.

On the 4th of December 1972 they abducted LRH in Lisbon New York and implanted suppressive entities in his space.

LRH suffered quite a bit from this, having many body ailments among other and due to this he stopped giving public lectures and the technology idled for about 5 years. It was Captain Bill Robertson who took him on a boat to take care of the body problems with a cover story of hiding in Queens New York together with Dincalci, however this did not eradicate the implant. It was not until 1978 where David Mayo, LRH personal auditor, discovered the technique together with LRH that would eradicate the implant, which became NOT's auditing (New era dianetics for OT's, NEW OT5, 6 and 7). From that point on the old OT 5, 6 and 7 having to do with OT abilities changed into the New OT5, 6 and 7.

https://web.archive.org/web/20040605195636/http://www.ronsorg.nl/history/history.htm

http://www.compasscayman.com/uploadedImages/cfr/2013/10/25/Tower-of-Basel_Book.jpghttp://www.perjacobsson.org/images/PJ.jpg
Bank of International Settlements and Mr. Jacobson, "Mr. J".

cuitlahuac

11th July 2014, 06:37

I understand that a Freezoner, The Pilot, received what he described as a Sex-Drug-Pain-Hypnotic implant that he could not handle, he being one of the most competent Scientology practitioners, not only applying the Scientology technology but also creating new one as well as a parallel (copyright free) tech.

cuitlahuac

12th July 2014, 05:19

Here is the full quote of Hubbard regarding his "very good friend" Crowley:

...the magic cults of the 8th, 9th, 10th, 11th, 12th centuries in the Middle East were fascinating. The only modern work that has anything to do with them is a trifle wild in spots, but it’s fascinating work in itself, and that’s work written by Allister Crowley, the late Allister Crowley, my very good friend.

And uh… he… he did himself a splendid uh… piece of aesthetics built around those magic cults. Uh… it’s very interesting reading to get ahold of a copy of a book, quite rare, but it can be obtained, THE MASTER THERION, T-h-e-r-i-o-n, THE MASTER THERION by Allister Crowley. He signs himself The Beast, the mark of the beast six sixty-six. Very, very something or other, but anyway the… Crowley exhumed a lot of the data from these old magic cults.[/SIZE]

What Middle East magic cults? mainly Jewish and Egyptian, I think.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/d/d8/777_and_other_Qabalistic_writings_of_Aleister_Crowley_(front_cover).gifhttp://endthelie.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/crowley.jpg

cuitlahuac

12th July 2014, 15:39

One of the main teachings of Crowley was that: "Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law."

In the case of Scientology this might be expressed as: "The road to total freedom". "Advocate total freedom".

Is "Total Freedom" a paradox?

Is "Do as thou wilt" wrong?

For starters, if total freedom was the start of our downfall from the Godlike state we enjoyed previously, then it follows that total freedom is a must if we are to recover those Godlike abilities.

cuitlahuac

13th July 2014, 08:02

I didn't know of the details. Amazing:

"Hubbard had experienced a peculiar hallucination in 1938, while under nitrous oxide during a dental operation. He believed that he had died during the operation and while dead been shown a great wealth of knowledge."
- Tony McClelland, "The Total Freedom Trap"

According to Forrest Ackerman, Hubbard's former literary agent, Hubbard's vision appeared when he "died" on an operating table during the war.

"Basically what he told me was that after he died he rose in spirit form and looked back on the body he had formerly inhabited. Over yonder he saw a fantastic great gate, elaborately carved like something you'd see in Baghdad or ancient China. As he wafted towards it, the gate opened and just beyond he could see a kind of intellectual smorgasbord on which was outlined everything that had ever puzzled the mind of man.

All the questions that had concerned philosophers through the ages - When did the world begin? Was there a God? Whither goest we? - were there answered.

All this information came flooding into him and while he was absorbing it, there was a sort of flustering in the air and he felt something like a long umbilical cord pulling him back. He was saying 'No, no, not yet!', but he was pulled back anyway. After the gates had closed he realized he had re-entered his body."

"According to Ron, he jumped off the operating table, ran to his Quonset hut, got two reams of paper and a gallon of scalding black coffee and for the next 48 hours, at a blinking rate, he wrote a work called Excalibur, or The Dark Sword"

Hubbard, "said that as he shopped the manuscript around, the people who read it either went insane or committed suicide. The last time he showed it to a publisher, he was sitting in an office waiting for a reader to give his opinion. The reader walked into the office, tossed the manuscript on the desk and then threw himself out of the window."

"He said it was in a bank vault and it was going to stay there. I think he was quite sincere. He seemed like a man who had seen too many people go crazy or commit suicide, who had enough on his conscience already. I never did get to see the manuscript or show it to any publisher. In fact, I never encountered anyone who said they had seen it."
- Forrest Ackerman

Art Burks, a fellow writer, did see the manuscript, but in 1938.

"He told me it was going to revolutionize everything: the world, people's attitudes to one another. He thought it would have a greater impact upon people than the Bible."
- Art Burks

"Burk's recollection of the manuscript was that it was about seventy thousand words long and began with a fable about a king who gathered all his wise men together and commanded them to bring him all the wisdom of the world in five hundred books. He then told them to go away and condense the information into one hundred books. When they had done that, he wanted the wisdom reduced into one book and finally one word. That word was 'survive'."
- Russell Miller, Bare-Faced Messiah

Yes, There Was a Book Called "Excalibur"

by L. Ron Hubbard.
Arthur Burks recalls many fascinating details in the unpublished novel.

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sociopolitica/sociopol_scientology02.htm

cuitlahuac

14th July 2014, 04:50

The previous link has an interesting topic as regards the subject of "Hubbard demons":

"Hubbard undeniably had great talent; some would call it genius. He led an extremely active life, and met his goals except for one, emotional comfort - for which his wealth and power could only substitute. Dianetics/Scientology was to be his cure, but it didn't work. He fell victim to the delusions he fostered in others, and it is known that, right up to his demise or shortly before, he audited himself, or was audited, on his pack of "creatures."
- Robert Kaufman, "Scientology Auditing and Its Offshoots"

"I was advised by Richard Aznaran, Sinar Parman and Annie Breeder that Hubbard was an unhandled PTS III [psychotic] when he died. According to Sinar Parman, Hubbard was a psychopathic insane person screaming about BT's [Body Thetans] and clusters at the top of his lungs."
- Andre Tabayoyon (Tabayoyon was an ex-Marine Vietnam verteran who became a Scientologist for 21 years and knew Hubbard personally.)

If this accounts are true, namely that Hubbard was unable to handle his "demons", it leads one to consider the subject of Psychic Warfare on Earth. And this psychic warfare being developed by veteran scientologists. If scientologists developed this kind of psychic warfare, then for sure, the government of the United States in the hands of his extraterrestrial masters has the same kind of psychic warfare.

cuitlahuac

14th July 2014, 05:10

Comments from Mike MacClaughry regarding psychic warfare.

Psychic Warfare has two branches - Psychic Spying and Psychic Influencing…

On our time track of Church history Pat Price is identified as a CIA agent. In the late 1960’s he infiltrated AOLA, did the OT levels, then went to Stanford Research Institute where he helped the CIA develop Psychic Warfare capabilities. After that he carried out Psychic Warfare assignments for the CIA. His connection in the Church who helped him develop Psychic Warfare was Alan Walter.

Posted by Alan Walter to COSinvestigations on 16 July 2000
“Pat Price and I began remote viewing in 1968. We spent roughly 350 hours training ourselves. Much of what Pat and I did was over the phone. We would set each other targets and debug each other.

The one ability that most do not want to talk about is Remote Commanding. LRH, MSH, Bob Thomas, Jane Kember, Yvonne, Alex Sybersky, myself and our top crews had these abilities. If Scott takes a look at the period in LA in the early 70's he will observe a Remote Command Team in Operation. They were powerful!”

Posted by Alan Walter to alt.clearing.technology on 10 December 1998
“I had since early '68 been putting my spiritual teammates into a co-process [2 beings applying Scientology to each other] set-up and letting them handle each other. (As did several other highly trained people.)

Off course it was squirreling [altering Scientology] :-)

Over the years we had built a very powerful team. I and several other highly trained ex-Scio's then set about building a by-pass ST [Spiritual Teammate, an entity or a disembodied being] based team. The first step was to send out several thousand audio tapes to ex-scios and scios called Miracles and Magic.

The ST's then went to each of the advanced org areas and picked up all available abandoned ST's. Which we included into the spiritual co-processing organization. As you can well imagine a tremendous amount of these ST's were highly trained and processed beings in their own right.

The removal of so many abused ST's from Hemet and Flag as well as other areas takes away a vast amount of power. Also picked up were the ST's who were being used in black operations against specific targets.

There is of course much more to this. Much of what is going on today have provided enough distractions to allow this to come about.

I expect that over the years they will begin taking over new bodies and allow other ST's to get trained and processed.

I do not know if you have read the Psychic War material, but the beings involved on the other side have joined the ST co-process unit.

I expect by the year 2015 the full force of what these ST's are engaged in to have a massive impact on earth. A major part of this impact will also be net related.”

I am not going to include the link because this reference contains confidential OT 3 material.

Below are the comments by MacClaughry. Another warning must be made: MacClaughry has confessed he infiltrated Scientology to spy, and this information is provided on that warning, that he is a spy that infiltrated Scientology and now speaks against Ronald and Scientology.

My comments on the above two posts by Alan Walter…

He was a busy boy in 1968. At the same time as he is working with CIA agent, Pat Price, to develop Psychic Warfare - he starts recapturing thetans who have been set free by people auditing on OT 3. He is essentially forming them back into clusters, under the guise of “Spiritual Teammates.”

It is interesting that Alan considers setting Beings free, as abuse. It is also noteworthy that he is preparing them for the year 2015 because that is the target date the Enslavers have for establishing a One World government.

cuitlahuac

14th July 2014, 05:15

Comments from Mike MacClaughry regarding psychic warfare and how this might have to do with Ronald's "handling of his demons".

WARNING. SOME OT III ITEMS AND WORDS USED HERE HAVE BEEN DESCRIBED IN THIS FORUM AS HITCHHIKERS OR DEMONS.

Psychic Warfare has two branches - Psychic Spying and Psychic Influencing…

On our time track of Church history Pat Price is identified as a CIA agent. In the late 1960’s he infiltrated AOLA, did the OT levels, then went to Stanford Research Institute where he helped the CIA develop Psychic Warfare capabilities. After that he carried out Psychic Warfare assignments for the CIA. His connection in the Church who helped him develop Psychic Warfare was Alan Walter.

Posted by Alan Walter to COSinvestigations on 16 July 2000
“Pat Price and I began remote viewing in 1968. We spent roughly 350 hours training ourselves. Much of what Pat and I did was over the phone. We would set each other targets and debug each other.

The one ability that most do not want to talk about is Remote Commanding. LRH, MSH, Bob Thomas, Jane Kember, Yvonne, Alex Sybersky, myself and our top crews had these abilities. If Scott takes a look at the period in LA in the early 70's he will observe a Remote Command Team in Operation. They were powerful!”

Posted by Alan Walter to alt.clearing.technology on 10 December 1998
“I had since early '68 been putting my spiritual teammates into a co-process [2 beings applying Scientology to each other] set-up and letting them handle each other. (As did several other highly trained people.)

Off course it was squirreling [altering Scientology] :-)

Over the years we had built a very powerful team. I and several other highly trained ex-Scio's then set about building a by-pass ST [Spiritual Teammate, an entity or a disembodied being] based team. The first step was to send out several thousand audio tapes to ex-scios and scios called Miracles and Magic.

The ST's then went to each of the advanced org areas and picked up all available abandoned ST's. Which we included into the spiritual co-processing organization. As you can well imagine a tremendous amount of these ST's were highly trained and processed beings in their own right.

The removal of so many abused ST's from Hemet and Flag as well as other areas takes away a vast amount of power. Also picked up were the ST's who were being used in black operations against specific targets.

There is of course much more to this. Much of what is going on today have provided enough distractions to allow this to come about.

I expect that over the years they will begin taking over new bodies and allow other ST's to get trained and processed.

I do not know if you have read the Psychic War material, but the beings involved on the other side have joined the ST co-process unit.

I expect by the year 2015 the full force of what these ST's are engaged in to have a massive impact on earth. A major part of this impact will also be net related.”

I am not going to include the link because this reference contains confidential OT 3 material.

Below are the comments by MacClaughry. Another warning must be made: MacClaughry has confessed he infiltrated Scientology to spy, and this information is provided on that warning, that he is a spy that infiltrated Scientology and now speaks against Ronald and Scientology.

My comments on the above two posts by Alan Walter…

He was a busy boy in 1968. At the same time as he is working with CIA agent, Pat Price, to develop Psychic Warfare - he starts recapturing thetans [spiritual beings] who have been set free by people auditing on OT 3... under the guise of “Spiritual Teammates.”

It is interesting that Alan considers setting Beings free, as abuse. It is also noteworthy that he is preparing them for the year 2015 because that is the target date the Enslavers have for establishing a One World government.

cuitlahuac

14th July 2014, 05:39

The question is: Was Hubbard the target of attack by entities (demons) sent him by his very collaborators from the 60's and 70's? Like Alan Walter? Or was he the target of the same kind of psychic warfare but this time performed by the US Federal Government on him while he was abducted by the Feds in the early 70's? If the US Federal Government has this capability for psychic warfare. Was that technology provided to them by extraterrestrials or was it obtained in collaboration with Alan Walter?

http://ensifer.files.wordpress.com/2010/09/013_13.jpg

Apparently, Alan Walter died 2009. If that be the case... is he now training his "Spiritual Teammates organization" disincarnate in preparation for the 2015 New World Order takeover of planet Earth?

Jesus! Reality is more surprising than fiction.

cuitlahuac

14th July 2014, 16:09

It has been stated (in Mike McClaughry's Scientology time track) that Scientology was the result of a collaboration of many people, and that the writing of the policy "Keeping Scientology Working", is the year where Hubbard makes himself the only source of the subject, abandoning the research conducted at the time and concentrating on the R6 Implant (an implant on all mankind and this sector of the galaxy). It seems that the R6 implant is the hottest topic in these days, affecting mankind in every aspect. The subject of pedophilia in every elite and ruling/governmental body is part of that picture.

Not only infiltrated "Scientologists" were using Scientology to spy and take the research to the CIA or the NSA, but it seems that some of those "Scientologists" aiding in research were ready to create their own suppressive "organizations" and splinter groups as is the case with Alan Walter referenced above.

This generates the question: Did Hubbard wrote Kipping Scientology Working policy (making himself the sole source of the subject) to safeguard Scientology or to make himself owner of the technology on life?

cuitlahuac

15th July 2014, 15:51

It is clear that BTs are part of the Third World War.

Don't listen to claims of "prophecy." In the aberrated state of Man, there is no such thing. Those are NOT prophecies, they are... re-plays of historical occurrences in the games... This is what Man believes is the "future." It isn't, but the combined intention of millions of players BELIEVING it can make it happen to some degree. The future IS the progress toward each player's... ideal scene.

Bill Robertson.

cuitlahuac

16th July 2014, 05:14

As far as I understand, black magic has to do with the control of entities and spiritual beings that do the dirty work, and there is where magic and probably occultism has to do with entities or demons. Crowley, being a black magician, used entities. Hubbard is releasing them... with the purpose to control them? I don't know. This depends on Hubbard's intentions.

The following might explain why Hubbard might not get rid of his "personal demons". Specially the ones implanted during his kidnapping by the US Federal Government.

Warning. The text might contain confidential information on OT III.

EXCALIBUR

Those that were kicked out of the CofS carried on outside. Many small centers formed around individual auditors. In terms of research William Brenton Robertson, a long-time Sea Org member, carried on along the line of Hubbard’s intentions... In honor of Hubbard’s novel of 1938, Robertson called this process “Excalibur”.

Because of his former CofS connections Robertson and his associates were in the position to put together an impressive list of ex-CofS auditors all around the world, contacted them and taught them the new method... Hubbard’s old OT III battle of 1968 had received a fresh impetus in 1985, seventeen years later.

The next “generation” of BTs (entities) were different. Although they could be made to disappear during the session, they “grew back” over night - as if they had never gone away! Auditing them again (and again and again, day after day) revealed that each one leaving was replaced by identical installations within some hours only... It was at this time (still in 1985) that the term “Monitor” was coined.

The conclusions Hubbard and his associate Fuller had to come to in 1950 were reciprocated by Robertson in 1985. The difference was that after almost 20 years of OT III auditing having occurred all around the globe (1968 to 1985) the sheer amount of BTs and Clusters was considerably reduced; Robertson wasn’t faced with quite the same resistance as Hubbard.

With that advantage and recognizing that one was engaged in a live battle, one could concentrate on fighting the actual enemy instead of his ammunition, the Monitors (which despite all the auditing already done still seemed inexhaustible)... - and discover control stations! Some on space stations, others on Mars or remote planets outside this solar system, some even on Earth (Pyrenees). These stations weren’t BT imagery, no figments of imagination - they were real...

Instead of merely auditing the BTs and Monitors sent to Robertson and his auditors, they proceeded to audit the operators supervising them on their computer screens. They helped these thetans to get rid of their own control entities which kept them in line, made them switch off the power supply, leave their bodies and go off. This was easy insofar as their job satisfaction wasn’t particularly high (what with ten thousand years on the same post), and since their understanding of what they were doing was limited due to instruction by implant exclusively, it didn’t take much to convince them that there was more fun to be had elsewhere, with more ethical purposes. Leaving their bodies was no problem to them as they didn’t use flesh bodies.

In 1986, after one year of Excalibur auditing all around the world, there were signs of the enemy’s morale weakening. It was often sufficient to mention that one was working for Elron to get a resigned “Oh, not again!”, and key people of the opposing side would agree to be audited without any further resistance. This continued throughout the hot phases of Excalibur between 1986 and 1988. Every three months the case would present a different pattern, because the enemy had worked out something new to cross Robertson’s purposes. This would be reported to Robertson and communicated by telephone to all other auditors, and so one was prepared for the “novelty” to come up. Or one would bump into a novelty, not know what to do, phone Robertson and learn that he already knew about it from his own or another’s sessions. This system worked very well.

The Pied Pipers of Heaven, by L. Kin.

spiritwind

16th July 2014, 16:05

Absolutely fascinating material cuitlahuac. For some reason this interests me very much. The story goes that my biological mother who had gotten pregnant by a Jewish attorney had moved across country and married a guy who was already married, then had the marriage annulled. Right around this time she was staying with some Scientologists. This would have been 1958. While she is staying with these people I am told I came down with pneumonia and she literally had to sneak out of the house in the middle of the night to take me to a hospital because I was so sick and the people she was staying with disapproved of her taking me for treatment. My life has been strange, so I know there is more to this story. I did not even find out that the name of the father on my original birth certificate, before I was adopted, was not even my biological father until I was in my 20's. Plus my mom always seemed to act like she had a curious case of amnesia when I questioned her about any of this but she could remember details about anything else from this time period.

Thanks for this information. I believe I will eventually stumble across a piece of information that will help me unravel my own mystery.

cuitlahuac

17th July 2014, 18:13

Have a good search.

cuitlahuac

21st July 2014, 07:49

Considering this connection with the ocult, one might say that Hubbard is moving to be pan-determind. That is, he is to control both sides of the game, good and evil. Good and grong.

cuitlahuac

22nd July 2014, 07:51

In other words. Is Ronald Hubbard a good thetan (spiritual being) assuming control of both sides of the game Ie. Good and Evil, or is Hubbard a bad thetan assuming control of both saides of the game?

What other BIG PLAYER is doing the same? Assuming control of both sides of the game? Good and Evil?

cuitlahuac

17th August 2014, 07:04

Here is a quotation of the tape where Hubbard refers to his "very good friend Crowley". Hubbard states that "very good friend" Crowley exhumed very valuable magical data from previous centuries:

A magician, uh...the magic cults of the 8th, 9th, 10th, 11th, 12th centuries in the Middle East were fascinating. The only modern work that has anything to do with them is a trifle wild in spots, but it's fascinating work in itself, and that's work written by Aleister Crowley, the late Aleister Crowley, my very good friend. And uh...he...he did himself a splendid uh...piece of aesthetics built around those magic cults. Uh...it's very interesting reading to get ahold of a copy of a book, quite rare, but it can be obtained, THE MASTER THERION, T-h-e-r-i-o-n, THE MASTER THERION by Aleister Crowley. He signs himself The Beast, the mark of the beast six sixty-six. Very, very something or other, but anyway the...Crowley exhumed a lot of the data from these old magic cults.
And uh...he...he, as a matter of fact, handles cause and effect quite a bit. Cause and effect is...is handled according to a ritual. And it's interesting that whenever you have any of these things you can always assign a ritual to it and that ritual is what you do in order to accomplish this. Or how you have to go through and how many motions you have to make to come into the ownership of that. And that's a ritual.
Or how many motions or words you have to say in order to be something else. Now that's a ritual. And that is a...each ritual is a cycle of some sort or another. Now you can have cycles that start low and end high, but because homo sapiens has agreed to a cycle that starts with space and ends with matter, when homo sapiens starts into a cycle of action he finds himself up with his hands full of gold and with shackles on every limb.

http://www.matrixfiles.com/Scientology Materials/Tapes&Lect chrono/5212c01 Philadelphia Doctorate Course Lectures/Pdc - htm/5212c05 PDC-18 Conditions of Space Time-Energy.HTM

cuitlahuac

27th August 2014, 12:19

I think this deserves some analysis:

http://img.youtube.com/vi/jIoD7iyBnps/0.jpg

L. Ron Hubbard Jr. (above) was L. Ron Hubbard (Sr)' son.
_________________

Penthouse Interview with L. Ron Hubbard, Jr.
Penthouse/June 1983

Scientology and all the other cults are one-dimensional, and we live in a three-dimensional world. Cults are as dangerous as drugs. They commit the highest crime: the rape of the soul. -- L. Ron Hubbard, Jr.

For more than twenty years L. Ron Hubbard, Jr., has been a man on the run. He has changed residences, occupations, and even his name in 1972 to Ron DeWolf to escape what he alleges to be the retribution and wrath of his father and his father's organization-- the Church of Scientology. His father, L. Ron Hubbard. Sr., founder and leader of Scientology, has been a figure of controversy and mystery, as has been his organization, for more than a generation. Its detractors have called it the "granddaddy" and the worst of all the religious cults that have sprung up over the last generation. Its advocates-- and there are thousands--swear that the church is the avenue for human perfection and happiness. Millions of words have been written for and against Scientology. Just what is the truth?

L. Ron Hubbard, Sr., and the very few who have worked at the highest echelons of the organization have never spoken publicly about the workings and finances of the Church of Scientology. Firsthand allegations about coercion, black-mail, and just how billions of dollars the organization is said to possess have been accrued and spent is lacking: that is, until very recently. In an extraordinary petition brought November 10, 1982, in Superior Court in Riverside, Calif., by L. Ron Hubbard, Jr., to prove that his father is dead and that his heirs should receive the tens of millions of dollars being dissipated from his estate, some of the mystery about Scientology has begun to unravel. Some of the details are shocking.

L. Ron Hubbard, Jr., is a survivor. His appearance on earth, May 7, 1934, was the result of failed abortion rituals by his father, and Ron, after only six and a half months in the womb and at 2.2 pounds entered the world. His mother, Margeret ("Polly") Grubb, was to have one more child, Catherine May, before her husband ditched her in 1946 to enter into a bigamous marriage with Sarah Northrup. A half sister, Alexis Valerie, survived that union. Soon after that, the founder of Scientology married Mary Sue Whipp, the current Mrs. L. Ron Hubbard, Sr., who at this writing is serving four years in federal prison for stealing government documents. There were four childrens: Diana and Quentin, who died under mysterious circumstances in 1976; Arthur, who has been missing for several years; and Suzette.

Ron Jr. says that he remembers much of his childhood. He claims to recall, at six years, a vivid scene of his father performing an abortion ritual on his mother with a coat hanger. He remembers that when he was ten years old, his father, in an attempt to get his son in tune with his black-magic worship, laced the young hubbard's bubble gum with phenobarbital. Drugs were an important part of Ron Jr.'s growing up, as his father believed that they were the best way to get closer to Satan --the Antichrist of black magic.

Ron Jr. also recalls a hard-drinking, drug-abusing father who would mistreat his mother and other women, but who, when, under the influence, would delight in telling his son all of his exploits. Finally, Ron Jr. remembers his father as a "broke science-fiction writer" who espoused that the road to riches and glory lay in selling religion to the masses.

Nineteen fifty was a watershed year for the sixteen-year-old Ron Jr., when his father's book Dianetics: The Modern Science of Mental Health was published. While in the 1980s self-help books hold little novelty, Dianetics was a pioneer of that genre. Happiness in 1950 could be a reality, if only one practiced the strange amalgam of science fiction and psychoanalysis offered in the senior Hubbard's best-seller. It was an unexpected success for Hubbard, then living in New Jersey, when the mailman would deliver daily sacks of letters from the unhappy and desperate who had read the book and wanted L. Ron Hubbard to take them to the promised land. It was a dream come true --a science-fiction writer who not only created a world of fantasy but packaged it and sold it as reality.

In 1950 L. Ron Hubbard opened a Dianetics clinic, where the hopeful and newly cenverted could come, for a fee, and their ills --from loneliness to cancer --would ce cured. Danetics was the new Scientific Revolution. and L. Ron Hubbard was its prophet.

Scientology is essentially a self-help therapy. It is based on one premise that by recalling negative experiences or "engrams", a person can free himself from repressed feelings that cribble his life. This liberation process is assisted by a counselor called an "auditor" who charges up to hundreds of dollars a session. The auditor's basic aid is the "E-meter", a skin galvanometer that is said to help him ascertain the problems of his client.

Soon the New Jersey authorities and the American Medical Association challenged the veracity of the new faith. L. Ron Hubbard met the challenge by fleeing the state (not the last time this was to happen). A frequent memory of Ron Jr. is his father's packing up shoe boxes with thousands of dollars to move on to greener and safer pastures.

Coming into manhood in the early fifties, Ron Jr. learned the virtues of flimflam and keeping one step ahead of the law and creditors. But he admits that he accepted his father's teachings and example as correct. By the time his father started the modern Church of Scientology in Arizona and New Jersey in 1953, young Hubbard was not only a disciple but a willing organizer in the new movement. He was to be so throughout the 1950s.

While Ron Jr. may never have questioned his father and the mushrooming cult of Scientology, a growing uneasiness began to take hold of him. In 1953 he married Henrietta, whom he never allowed to join the church. They were to have six children --Deborah, Leif, Esther, Eric, Harry and Alex, age twelve, who suffers from Down's Syndrome-- plus six grandchildren, none or whom were ever members of Scientology. The importance of family life, especially in contrast to his own up-bringing, caused Ron Jr. to question his life as a member of Scientology, albeit privately. Other factors also caused Ron Jr. to think about breaking away from the cult that was dominating his life. His father's autocratic and arbitrary control of Scientology often led to violence, and the young Hubbard began to be disturbed by his own participation.

Certain questionable transactions involving drug dealing and the transfer of large sums of money abroad by his father was another troubling factor. But, he says, the breaking point came over his father's involvement with the Russians. Finally, in 1959, when his father was in Australia, Ron, his wife, and two children fled the Church of Scientology.

According to Ron Jr., life was to become a nightmarish existence. No matter, where the family went in the United States, it would not take long for a member of the organization to find them. Because he knew too much about Scientoiogy and its founder, Ron says, attempts were made to ensure his silence. For many years L. Ron Hubbard, Jr. kept a low profile.

Keeping silent did not end Ron's terror of what his father and followers might do to him and his family. In 1976 his half brother Quentin died under mysterious circumstances that Ron is certain was murder. Quentin, a son of Scientology's leader, was a drug abuser and an embarassment to his father. Whether all these questions were signs ot paranoia finally became less important to Ron than discovering, once and for all, the truth about his father. In 1980 Ron became convinced that his father was dead, and that his death was being kept a secret by the Church of Scientology, lest knowledge of his death cause chaos in the organization. He filed his petition and an open war was declared. Should he win the suit by proving that his father is either dead or incompetent, Ron and other family members will receive the millions of dollars believed to be part of L. Ron Hubbard's estate.

For some thirty years, stories, rumors, and innuendo about the Church of Scientology have been whispered, and sometimes reported, internationally. Obviously, the final judgment of L. Ron Hubbard. Jr., and his allegations remains to be made. But because of his high-level involvement for such a long time with this controversial organization, he himself has become a newsworthy figure. To find out what this man at the center of an international firestorm is like. Penthouse sent contributing editor Allan Sonnenschein to Carson City, Nev, where he met Hubbard in the small three-bedroom apartment in which he lives (he manages the apartment complex). "DeWolf." Sonnenschein told us, "is a stocky and ruddy-complexioned man, with thinning red hair. Despite his almost continuous involvement with lawyers of both sides of his case, DeWolf was very relaxed during the several hours. I spent with him. He seemed convinced that his desire to tell his story after all these years was of vital importance ... and he spoke with a firmness and intensity befitting a person who claims to be risking his life by speaking out."

Because of the seriousness of Mr. DeWolf's charges and because his father has affected the lives of thousands, if not millions, of people, Penthouse will be launching an independent investigation of these charges. The results will be published in a forthcoming issue.

Penthouse: Before you filed your lawsuit and began speaking openly about Scientology, there was very little news of it in the media. Why do you think there has been so little investigation of Scientology?

Hubbard: it's very simple. Scientology has always had a "fair-game doctrine"--a policy of doing absolutely anything to stop an investigation or publication of a critical article in a magazine or newspaper. They have run some incredible operations on the several people who have tried to write books about Scientology. It was almost like a terror campaign. First they'd try throwing every possible lawsuit at the reporter or newspaper. We had a team of attorneys to do just that. The goal was to destroy the enemy. So the solution was always to attack, full-bore, with every possible resource, from every angle, instantaneously it can certainly be overwhelming. A guy would get slapped with twenty-seven lawsuits, and our lawyers would start depositioning absolutely anybody who ever knew the man, digging up dirt while at the same time putting together an operation that would get him into further trouble. I know of one case, concerning Paulette Cooper, who wrote a book called The Scandal of Scientology, in which they spent almost $500.000 trying to destroy her.

Penthouse: So you think the press was intimidated?

Hubbard: Oh, absolutely. All the way through, since the fifties. I found this very sad. It seemed very much like Germany in the thirties. The freedom of the press seemed buried. They got scared. They thought. "Well, who wants to go through ten years of lawsuits, just because we printed the name L. Ron Hubbard?" I'm delighted to see that Penthouse has the balls to print this interview.

Penthouse: Why do you think it's so risky?

Hubbard: My father drilled into all of us: Don't go to court thinking to win a lawsuit. You go to court to harass, to delay, to exhaust the enemy financially, physically, mentally. You file every motion you can think of and you just lock them up in court. The courts, for my father, were never used to seek justice or redress, but to destroy the people he thought were enemies, to prevent negative stories from appearing. He just wanted complete control of the press --and got it.

Penthouse: What exactly is Scientology?

Hubbard: Scientology is a power-and-money-and-intelligence-gathering game. To use common, everyday English, Scientology says that you and I and everybody else willed ourselves into being hundreds of trillions of years ago --just by deciding to be. We willed ourselves into being ourselves. Through wild space games, interaction, fights, and wars in the grand science-fiction tradition, we created this universe --all the matter, energy, space, and time of this universe. And so through these trillions of years, we have become the effect of our own cause and we now find ourselves trapped in bodies. So the idea of Scientology "auditing" or 'counseling" or "processing" is to free yourself from your body and to return you to the original godlike state or, in Scientology jargon, an operating Thetan --O.T. We are all fallen gods, according to Scientology, and the goal is to be returned to that state.

Penthouse: And what is the Church of Scientology?

Hubbard: It's one of my father's many organizations. It was formed in 1953, basically to avoid the harassment of my father by the medical profession and the IRS. The idea of Scientology didn't really exist before that point as a religion, but my father hit upon turning it into a church after he started feeling pressured.

Penthouse: Didn't your father have any interest in helping people?

Hubbard: No.

Penthouse: Never?

Hubbard: My father started out as a broke science-fiction writer. He was always broke in the late 1940s. He told me and a lot of other people that the way to make a million was to start a religion. Then he wrote the book Dianetics: The Modern Science of Mental Health while he was in Bayhead, New Jersey. When we later visited Bayhead, in about 1953, we were walking around and reminiscing --he told me that he had written the book in one month.

Penthouse: There was no church when he wrote the book?

Hubbard: Oh, no, no. You see, his goal was basically to write the book, take the money and run. But in 1950, this was the first major book of do-it-yourself psychotherapy, and it became a runaway best-seller. He kept getting, literally, mail trucks full of mail. And so he and some other people, including J. W. Campbell, the editor of Astounding Science Fiction, started the Dianetics Research Foundation in Elizabeth, New Jersey. And the post office kept backing up and just dumping mail sacks into the building. The foundation had a staff that just ran through the envelopes and threw away anything that didn't have any money in it.

Penthouse: People sent money?

Hubbard: Yeah, they wanted training and further Dianetic auditing, Dianetic processing. It was just an incredible avalanche.

Penthouse: Did he write the book off the top of his head? Did he do any real research?

Hubbard: No research at all. When he has answered that question over the years, his answer has changed according to which biography he was writing. Sometimes he used to write a new biography every week. He usually said that he had put thirty years of research into the book. But no, he did not. What he did, reaily, was take bits and pieces from other people and put them together in a blender and stir them all up --and out came Dianetics! All the examples in the book --some 200 "real-life experiences" --were just the result of his obsessions with abortions and unconscious states... In fact, the vast majority of those incidents were invented off the top of his head. The rest stem from his own secret life, which was deeply involved in the occult and black-magic. That involvement goes back to when he was sixteen, living in Washington. D.C. He got hold of the book by Alistair Crowley called The Book of Law. He was very interested in several things that were the creation of what some people call the Moon Child. It was basically an attempt to create an immaculate conception --except by Satan rather than by God. Another important idea was the creation of what they call embryo implants --of getting a satanic or demonic spirit to inhabit the body of a fetus. This would come about as a result of black-magic rituals, which included the use of hypnosis, drugs, and other dangerous and destructive practices. One of the important things was to destroy the evidence if you failed at this immaculate conception. That's how my father became obsessed with abortions. I have a memory of this that goes back to when I was six years old. It is certainly a problem for my father and for Scientology that I rememoer this. It was around 1939, 1940, that I watched my father doing something to my mother. She was lying on the bed and he was sitting on her, facing her feet. He had a coat hanger in his hand. There was blood all over the place. I remember my father shouting at me. "Go back to bed!" A little while later a doctor came and took her off to the hospital. She didn't talk about it for quite a number of years. Neither did my father.

Penthouse: He was trying to perform an abortion?

Hubbard: According to him and my mother, he tried to do it with me. I was born at six and a half months and weighed two pounds, two ounces. I mean, I wasn't born: this is what came out as a result of their attempt to abort me. It happened during a night of partying --he got involved in trying to do a black-magic number. Also, I've got to complete this by saying that he thought of himself as the Beast 666 incarnate.

Penthouse: The devil?

Hubbard: Yes. The Antichrist. Alestair Crowley thought of himself as such. And when Crowley died in 1947, my father then decided that he should wear the cloak of the beast and become the most powerful being in the universe.

Penthouse: You were sixteen years old at that time. What did you believe in?

Hubbard: I believed in Satanism. There was no other religion in the house! Scientology and black magic. What a lot of people don't realize is that Scientology is black magic that is just spread out over a long time period. To perform black magic generally takes a few hours or, at most, a few weeks. But in Scientology it's stretched out over a lifetime, and so you don't see it. Black magic is the inner core of Scientology --and it is probably the only part of Scientology that really works. Also, you've got to realize that my father did not worship Satan. He thought he was Satan. He was one with Satan. He had a direct pipeline of communication and power with him. My father wouldn't have worshiped anything. I mean, when you think you're the most powerful being in the universe, you have no respect for anything, let alone worship.

Penthouse: Let's get back to how you saw Scientology working on an individual basis. What if someone wrote to your father asking if he could cure their cancer?

Hubbard: He'd say, Oh, yes, he could handle that.

Penthouse: And what would be the charge for curing cancer?

Hubbard: Back in those days it was anywhere from $10 to $25 an hour. Now ,it's up to $300 or more an hour.

Penthouse: What exactly did that pay for?

Hubbard: To be audited. In the old days, the patient would lie on a couch and the auditor would sit in a chair and counsel. The words auditing, counseling, and processing are really the same in Scientology.

Penthouse: What would be discussed?

Hubbard: They would say that the cancer and its cure are just incidental to the main problem of one's "spiritual development." And according to Dianetics and Scientology, the explanation for cancer is basically that you have a sex problem?

Penthouse: A sex problem?

Hubbard: Right.

Penthouse: How did he figure that?

Hubbard: Quite simply, according to my father. Cancer is basically cells that are dividing out of control, and so, according to my father, the problem is a sexual thing. Therefore the cancer is rooted in a sexual problem. If you have cancer, you are really screwed up on sex. So what would happen in this auditing --I don't know what it's like now, but it's probably just the same as in the old days --is that they would address a guy's entire sex life. There was certainly an incredible preoccupation. In Dianetmos and Scientology, about sex was a great means of control. You have complete control of someone if you have every detail of his sex life and fantasy life on record.

Penthouse: What if someone who went thought the training just wanted to drop out?

Hubbard: There was no way. There were thousands of people, back in the fifties who would come in and receive various levels of training, such as a Hubbard Certified Auditor's Certificate or a Bachelor of Scientology or a Doctorate of Scientology, and if they didn't toe the mark as my father wanted them to, then we would cancel their certificates. And then he would notify the Scientologists in the area where the man lived not to have anything to do with him, to disconnect from him. And if information was available about him, we would spread that information around to his wife, his family, his children, where he worked, everywhere. It was straight blackmail. It was "Stay in the fold or else." Then, later on, they developed what they called an ethics review board. If you didn't toe the mark, you'd be put on trial in front of a kangaroo court and then be sentenced to maybe scrub floors. I heard that you had to walk around with a dirty rag tied around your arm like a badge. You could be made to do anything. You would be locked in a chain locker or handcuffed to a bed. This is in later years. We were simpler in the fifties, more direct. I just went out and beat them up.

(For my father, the courts were used to destroy people he thought were enemies ... I'm delighted to see that Penthouse has the balls to print this interview.)

Penthouse: Physical beatings?

Hubbard: Yeah. We'd strong-arm them. I did it myself. And you had to realize that I weighed around 240 pounds in those days. When I taught Scientology, no students ever blew my courses! I would go out and physically retrieve my students. You know, the Scientologists are now trying to make me out to be the worst person since Attila the Hun. They forget that when I was director of training for the organization, I trained literally thousands of people. I created a lot of the Scientology processes and procedures throughout the fifties. I really helped create and run the organization. I was very deeply involved, very directly, for seven years, during its formulation and building. So I find their attempts to discredit me amusing. I used to have a thing about saying that nobody ever ran out of my courses. If you think est is tough, you ought to have taken courses under me in the fifties!

Penthouse: What would happen if someone went to your class, decided it was bull****, and never came back?

Hubbard: If you signed up for a course and you came to my class, I'd keep you there or go physically retrieve you if you left.

Penthouse: You'd already gotten the money, so why did you bother?

Hubbard: Because I thought I was allknowing, all-powerful --totally arrogant and egotistical --for one thing. I was quite insufferable.

Penthouse: Your father knew this was going on?

Hubbard: Well, sure. Nobody did a thing in Scientology without his direct knowledge or consent or without his orders.

Penthouse: Did it ever go beyond these physical beatings?

Hubbard: I remember locking one girl up in a shack out in the desert for at least a couple or weeks.

Penthouse: Why were things like this never publicized?

Hubbard: Because the same reign of terror that occurred under Robespierre and Hitler occurred back then in the fifties, as it occurs now. You must realize that there is very little actual courage in this world. It's pretty easy to bend people around. It doesn't take much to shut people up, it really doesn't. In the fifties all I had to do was call a guy up on the telephone and say, "Well, I think your wife would like to know about your mistress." The response would be a shocked "Oh, my God!" I'd say, "Well, nobody really wants to divulge that kind of information. I think it would be absolutely terrible if your wife found out, so I'm going to make absolutely sure that she doesn't find out. Now, if you just drop in here for a little more auditing ... Now you know in your heart that the critical things you've been saying about Scientology are just vindictive. They're not really true in your heart. You know that, don't you?" And the guy says. "Yeah, sure, I sure do know that!"

And then, if Scientologists couldn't blackmail you, they'd create some dirt on you through their "special operations." There were quite a few of those operations. This one, for example, happened recently. I wasn't involved in it, but Scientologists tried to get an assistant attorney general of the state of California embroiled in a fake operation where a Scientologist pretended to be a nun and pretended to get pregnant by him and filed papers against him. Then in another scheme they tried to set up the mayor of Clearwater, Florida, for a fake hit-and-run accident. I could give you operation after operation that they set up like this.

Penthouse: This has been going on since the fifties?

Hubbard: Sure. It was pretty tame back then compared to very sophisticated operations like they have now. When we hid assets, for example --I remember being in Philadelphia when the FBI anc the U.S. Marshall's Office were after my father on a contempt-of-court charge. There I was running across town with my father with our complete mailing list and a suitcase full of money! Heading for the hills!

Penthouse: Where did the money end up?

Hubbard: A lot of it went abroad. But my father always kept a great deal of it around his bedroom so that he could flee at a moment's notice. In shoe boxes. He distrusted banks.

Penthouse: What kind of money are we talking about?

Hubbard: Back then? Hundreds of thousands at least. The last time I saw my father, in 1959, he mentioned that he had at least $20 million salted away.
Penthouse: Did he invest the money?

Hubbard: No. He wanted to stay really liquid. Very fluid, so he could cut and run at any time.

Penthouse: Where did all this money come from? How much did it cost to be audited, in Scientology parlance?

Hubbard: It cost as much as a person had. He had to stay in the organization, getting audited higher and higher, until he paid us as much as he had. People would sell their house, their car, convert their stocks and securities into cash, and turn it all over to Scientology.

Penthouse: What did you promise them for this price?

Hubbard: We promised them the moon and then demonstrated a way to get there. They would sell their soul for that. We were telling someone that they could have the power of a god --that's what we were telling them.

Penthouse: What kind of people were tempted by this promise?

Hubbard: A whole range of people. People who wanted to raise their IQ, to feel better, to solve their problems. You also got people who wished to lord it over other people in the use of power. Remember, it's a power game, a matter of climbing a pyramidal hierarchy to the top, and it's who you can step on to get more power that counts. It appeals a great deal to neurotics. And to people who are greedy. It appeals a great deal to Americans, I think, because they tend to believe in instant everything, from instant coffee to instant nirvana. By just saying a few magic words or by doing a few assignments, one can become a god. People believe this. You see, Scientology doesn't really address the soul; it addresses the ego. What happens in Scientology is that a person's ego gets pumped up by this science-fiction fantasy helium into universe-sized proportions. And this is very appealing. It is especially appealing to the intelligentsia of this country, who are made to feel that they are the most highly intelligent people, when in actual fact, from an emotional standpoint, they are completely stupid. Fine professors, doctors, scientists, people involved in the arts and sciences, would fall into Scientology like you wouldn't believe. It appealed to their intellectual level and buttressed their emotional weaknesses. You show me a professor and I revert back to the fifties: I just kick him in the head, eat him for breakfast.

Penthouse: Did it attract young people as much as cults today?

Hubbard: Yes. We attracted quite a few hippies but we tried to stay a way from them, because they didn't have any money.

Penthouse: A poor man can't be a Scientologist?

Hubbard: No, oh no.

Penthouse: What do you think of the great popularity of cults in this country?

Hubbard: I think they're very dangerous and destructive. I don't think that anyone should think for you. And that's exactly what cults do. All cults, including Scientology, say, "I am your mind, I am your brain. I've done all the work for you, I've laid the path open for you. All you have to do is turn your mind off and walk down the path I have created." Well, I have learned that there's great strength in diversity, that a clamorous discussion or debate is very healthy and should be encouraged. That's why I like our political setup in the United States: simply because you can fight and argue and jump up and down and shout and scream and have all kinds of viewpoints, regardless of how wrongheaded or ridiculous they might be. People here don't have to give up their right to perceive things the way they believe. Scientology and all the other cults are one-dimensional, and we live in a three-dimensional world. Cults are as dangerous as drugs. They commit the highest crime: the rape of the soul.

Penthouse: You mentioned that Scientology attracted a great many well-known or important people. Can you give us some examples?

Hubbard: Two of the people we were involved with in the late fifties in England were Errol Flynn and a man who was high up in the Labor Party at the time. My father and Errol Flynn were very similar. They were only interested in money, sex, booze, and drugs. At that time, in the late fifties, Flynn was pretty much of a burned-out hulk. But he was involved in smuggling deals with my father: gold from the Mediterranean, and some drugs --mostly cocaine.

They were both just a little larger than life. I had to admire my father from one standpoint. As I've said, he was a down-and-out, broke science-fiction writer, and then he writes one book of science-fiction and convinces the world it's true. He sells it to millions of people and gets billions of dollars and everyone thinks he's some sort of deity. He was really bigger than life. Flynn was like that, too. You could say many negative things about the two of them, but they did as they pleased and lived as they pleased. It was always fun to sit there at dinner and listen to these two guys rap. Wild people.

Errol Flynn was like my father also in that he would do anything for money. He would take anything to bed --boys, girls, Fifty-year-old women, ten-year-old boys, Flynn and my father had insatiable appetites. Tons of mistresses. They lived very high on the hog.

Penthouse: And what about this Labor Party official?

Hubbard: He was a double agent for the KGB and for the British intelligence agency. He was also a raging homosexual. He wanted my father to use his black-magic, soul-cracking, brainwashing techniques on young boys. He wanted these boys as his own sexual slaves. He wanted to use my father's techniques to crack people's heads open because he was very influential in and around the British government --plus he was selling information to the Russians. And so was my father.

Penthouse: Your father was selling information to the Soviets?

Hubbard: Yes. That's where my father got the money to buy St. Hill Manor in East Grinstead, Sussex, which is the English headquarters of Scientology today.

Penthouse: What information did your father have to sell the Soviet government?

Hubbard: He didn't do any spying himself. What he normally did was allow these strange little people to go into the offices and into his home at odd hours of the night. He told me that he was allowing the KGB to go through our files, and that he was charging £40000 for it. This was the money he used for the purchase of St. Hill Manor.

Penthouse: Do you know any specific information that the KGB got from your father that might have been harmful to security?

Hubbard: The plans for an infrared heat-seeking missile in the early fifties. They obtained the information by extensive auditing of the guy who was one of the head engineers. There were great infiltrations clear to this day. There has always been an inordinate interest on the part of Scientology in military and government personnel. There's no way for me to prove it sitting here, but I believe that the KGB trained East German agents who came via Denmark to London to the United States who were, supposedly, Scientologists. They made very good Scientologists. They were very well trained.

Penthouse: Did your father do this just for money?

Hubbard: Yes. The more he made, the more he wanted. He became greedy. He was really just interested in the use of money and power, wherever it was or whosoever's it was. Morality and politics made no difference to him at all.

Penthouse: Did the Labor Party official get any of his young men via Scientology?

Hubbard: Yes. The British were ripe for Scientology. The British school system fosters lesbianism and homosexuality, because from the time you're born until you're in your twenties, all you see is the same sex. The schools are so segretated. And you'll notice in Scientology the focus on sex. Sex, sex, sex. The first thing we wanted to know about someone we were auditing was his sexual deviations. You know, in actual fact, very few people exclusively practice missionary-style sex. So all you've got to do is find a person's kinks, whatever they might be. Their dreams and their fantasies. And if you find that central core, their sexual drives and desires and fantasies, then you can fit a ring through their noses and take them anywnere. You promise to fufill their fantasies or you threaten to expose them --very simple. And People do have outrageous sexual fantasies. Nothing wrong with that --I'm the last guy on earth who should make a value judgment about somebody's sexual practices. But once you find their sexual core, you've got them. And you find this by brainwashing, through auditing, through interrogation, investigations, following them, photographing them, tapping their phones, whatever.

Penthouse: You did all that?

Hubbard: Sure.

Penthouse: Nere there any other highlevel British government people in Scientology?

Hubbard: There was a member of Winston Churchill's medical staff. We had him by the balls.

Penthouse: Did he give you any information about Churchill?

Hubbard: Yes, certainly. You see, these people didn't realize where their information was going. They always thought that in Scientology auditing they had the priest-confessor's confidentiality --but it was never that way. People just assumed it, and still do. But everybody knew what was in everybody's files.

Penthouse: What was the first example you can remember of your father's espionage activity?

Hubbard: I remember one day in 1944 when he came nome from the naval base where he was stationed in Oregon with a big, gray metal box under his arm. He put in our little attached garage and put a tarp over it. That weekend a couple of funny little guys came over to the house. I remember it was summer and they were wearing heavy woollen overcoats --dark brown overcoats. It stuck in my mind: what are they doing wearing overcoats when it's hotter than hell? I was only about ten at the time. Anyway, these big, sweating guys take the box and put in in their car and drive off. But before they'd come, I'd shuck a look in the box. It had this strange-looking object in it. I didn't know what the hell it was.

Later on, in the fifties, I was walking through a warsurplus store and I suddenly saw an object that was just like the one I'd seen in the box. It was the heart of the radar. During the war --when those men took it from our garage --it was super-secret, super-valuable, worth thousands of dollars. I remember that people were told to commit suicide if it ever got captured in order to blow it up.

Then, in 1955, I went to work in the Scientology office in London. I noticed a woman in the office doing strange things with strange people in the office, so I investigated her. I found out she was a card-carrying member of the Communist Party. I got very angry at her and broke into her apartment, where I found dozens of little code pads. They looked like little milk pads with a whole mess of letters and numbers on them. I had people follow her to the Russian Embassy. I finally wrote a long report to my father about her. He was furious. He told me not to investigate anymore, not to write anymore, not to tell anyone what I had found out, to destroy all my evidence. I yelled at him, "The goddamn Russians are running around the office and doing God knows what." He yelled back. "I want'em there!" He told me that she was placed there by the KGB with his knowledge and consent. This really bothered me. My grandfather, who was a lieutenant commander in the navy, had impressed me with his red-white-and-blue honor and integrity. He was an officer of the old school. 180 degrees different from my father, in fact, I credit him a great deal with my ability to get rid of Scientology and get my head straigntened out, because his patriotism had gotten through to me and made me sour on what my father was doing in dealing with the Russians.

Penthouse: Was this why you became disenchanted with Scientology?

Hubbard: It was the beginning. I began to see that my father was a sick, sadistic, vicious man. I saw more and more parallels between his behavior and what I read about the way Hitler thought and acted. I was realizing that my father really wanted to destroy his enemies and take over the world. Whoever was perceived as his enemy had to be destroyed, including me. This "fair game" policy since the beginning. The organization couldn't exist without it. It keeps people very quiet.

Penthouse: Do you mean killed?

Hubbard: Well, he didn't really want people killed, because how could you really destroy them if you just killed them? What he wanted to do was to destroy their lives, their families, their reputations, their jobs, their money, everything. My father was the type of person who, when it came to destruction, wanted to keep you alive for as long as possible, to torture you, punish you. If he chose to destroy you, he would love to see you lying in the gutter, strung out on booze and drugs, rolling in your own vomit, with your wife and children gone forever: no job, no money. He'd enjoy walking by and kicking you and saying to other people, "Look what I did to this man!" He's the kind of man who would pull the wings off flies and watch them stumble around. You see, this fits in with his Scientology beliefs, also. He felt that if you just died, your spirit would go out and get another body to live in. By destroying an enemy that way, you'd be doing him a favor. You were letting him out from under the thumb of L. Ron. Hubbard, you see?

Penthouse: It's been said that many Scientologists have similar philosophies.

Hubbard: Yes. Many are sadistic, just like he was. Very Teutonic, very Gestapo.

Penthouse: Do you think they would stop at murder?

Hubbard: Many wouldn't. The one super-secret sentence that Scientology is built on is: "Do as thou wilt." That is the whole of the law. It also comes from the black magic, from Alistair Crowley. It means that you are a law unto yourself, that you are above the law, that you create your own law. You are above any other human considerations. Since you came into being by an act of will, you can do anything you will. If you decide to go out and kill somebody --bam! --that's it. An act of will. Not connected, to any emotions or feelings, not governed by any ethics or morality or law. They are very vicious people. Totally into attack. Most people think these people are so insane and wild and berserk and unpredictable. Not to me. Insane people are very predictable, because they're trapped on the same mental and spiritual merry-go-round and all they can do is go round and round. For years I've been able to Counter them --to stay alive --simply because I was one of them. I had a helluva good teacher.

Penthouse: Was your father violent in his behavior with his family?

Hubbard: Not to me. But he beat up a lot of women very badly. Blood, black eyes, busted teeth, the whole thing. He beat the holy hell out of women. His rages were incredible. I've read reports of the kinds of rages Hitler used to have, and they sound just like my father's. He was especially touchy about food. He would always have somebody else at the table sample everything on the table before he'd eat it. I've seen him pick up an entire dinner table and throw it against the wall if he didn't like the food or thought it was suspicious. He got very strange in the fifties. He had to have his clothes washed and washed and washed. He would take showers half a dozen times a day. I have often wondered if all of this might have been caused by the massive amounts of drugs and medication he took.

Penthouse: Did your father take a lot of drugs?

Hubbard: Yes. Since he was sixteen. You see, drugs are very important in the application of heavy black magic. The personal use of drugs expands one's conscious ability to break open the doors to the realm of the deep.

Penthouse: What kind of drugs did he generally use?

Hubbard: At various times, just about everything, because he was quite a hypocondriac. Cocaine, peyote, amphetamines, barbiturates. It would be shorter to list what he didn't take.

Penthouse: Did he encourage you to do drugs?

Hubbard: Well, he used them with me. He was a real night person. We used to sit around all night, sit around his office or home, get loaded up, and talk. He had a pretty liquid tongue. He loved to talk. And of course, in the fifties, he decided that was the heir apparent, so he wanted to teach me everything he knew. He started me out by mixing phenobarbital into my bubble gum, when I was ten years old. This was to induce deeper trances in order to practice the black magic and to get an avenue to power.

Penthouse: How exactly would this work?

Hubbard: The explanation is sort of long and complicated. The basic rationale is that there are some powers in this universe that are pretty strong. As an example, Hitler was involved in the same black magic and the same occult practices that my father was. The identical ones. Which, as I have said, stem clear back to before Egyptian times. It's a very secret thing. Very powerful and very workable and very dangerous. Brainwashing is nothing compared to it. The proper term would be "soul cracking." It's like cracking open the soul, which then opens various doors to the power that exists, the satanic and demonic powers. Simply put, it's like a tunnel or an avenue or a doorway. Pulling that power into yourself through another person --and using women, especially -- is incredibly insidious. It makes Dr. Fu Manchu look like a kindergarten student. It is the ultimate vampirism, the ultimate mine-****, instead of going for blood, you're going for their soul. And you take drugs in order to reach that state where you can, quite literally, like a psychic hammer, break their soul, and pull the power through. He designed his Scientology Operating Thetan techniques to do the same thing. But, of course, it takes a couple of hundred hours of auditing and megathousands of dollars for the privilege of having your head turned into a glass Humpty Dumpty --shattered into a million pieces. It may sound like incredible gibberish, but it made my father a fortune.

Penthouse: When was the last time your father was seen in public?

Hubbard: Sometime in the sixties he granted an interview to British television. After that he didn't appear in public and just slowly became a recluse. One of the reasons he became a recluse was his own physical and mental condition was deteriorating so badly that he couldn't let the public or the Scientology membership know just what kind of shape he was in. He was a testament to the fact that Scientology didn't work.

Penthouse: Looking over the past twenty-odd years of your life, what would you have done differently?

Hubbard: That's a complex question, guess if I had it to do all over. I would do the same thing. With a father like mine. I don't think I could live it differently. It's been twenty-three years of hell, out sometimes you have to go through hell to get to heaven. It's been a very exciting life. I can say that. We come from a long line of rogues and scoundrels, going back 200 or 300 years, at least. And so I guess we're built for this kind of life. I've said that I am a preacher of adversity and controversy, and I thrive on it. Plus maybe by our example, people will quit trying for god-ship.

Penthouse: What if your father's alive? Would you be able to confront him?

Hubbard: Yes I would love to.

Penthouse: Do you have any fear of him?

Hubbard: No if he is sick, I would make sure he receives the best treatment I could find in the world for him. I consider him a victim of all this as much as I consider myself a victim of his own involvement with black magic, drugs and his own delusions. He became a victim of himself.

Penthouse: Many people would say that your father is guilty of a great many sins and crimes. Do you think he should be punished?

Hubbard: He hasn't escaped punishment. I think at this juncture, dead or alive, he fell into his own insanity, and that's quite sufficient punishment. That is the most terrible jail of all, to be trapped inside his own head. With him it must be like being locked inside an exploding fireworks factory with no way out.Penthouse: Have you ever wished your father dead?

Hubbard: I don't believe so, no. Regardless of the things he's done to me --we had a helluva good time!

Penthouse: Ripping the world off?

Hubbard: We did! I enjoyed my life then, and I enjoy it now. And really, as far as crimes go. I think my father has received the ultimate punishment wichis being locked and traped in his own insanity. There's no way out for him.

cuitlahuac

27th August 2014, 12:24

First, Hubbard Jr. is said to have been subjected to brainwashing or mind control by the Powers that Be. And that is not a crazy statement in this world and in his position as the then "Heir" of Scientology.

Second. According to Hubbard Jr. Scientology originated from his father's desire to make money from a religion, and not by the reason that the original Dianetics Research Foundation was taken out of him. In other words, Hubbard Sr. started Scientology to counter the takeover of Dianetics Research Foundation by TPTB.

Even Hubbard Jr. himself states in another account that his father was mad as hell after the Dianetics Research Foundation was taken from him and decided to counter that by creating Scientology. I think Mr. De Wolf is not telling all the truth here.