The Eight Stages of Ego Death

[Skyhaven]

Ego death is only a death to the extent that the heart becomes our master and the mind, as well as the ego, becomes the servant on the journey to fully embrace yourself
-Allen L Roland-

1. DENIAL

There is nothing wrong with me, everything is perfect. I'm in full control!

2. ANGER

I can't stay in control and manipulate things anymore, it's not working anymore and it's making me angry.

3. BARGAINING

I'll hang on to something so I won't get out of control and have to deal with the unknown, the truth and all those scary feelings deep inside me that I have avoided for years.

4. DEPRESSION

Why am I feeling so sad, and it seems to go so deep. If only I could get out of this pit of overwhelming despair.

5. ACCEPTANCE

I'm feeling so sad and there is nothing I can do about it. I can't deny these feelings or the truth any longer.

6. SURRENDER

What is this joy and excitement I'm feeling beneath this sadness, and it doesn't have anything to do with someone else. It's me ! I'm finally beginning to trust my deepest feelings and a growing sense that everything is going to be all right.

7. CELEBRATION

Being myself is not only enough, its beautiful. I will no longer say no to myself or allow my self to be controlled by fear, especially my fear of love and Joy! This is the most difficult stage of ego death for you can no longer use someone else as an excuse for you saying no to yourself. As such, it is the ultimate yes to yourself.

8. BEING IN SERVICE

There is something I'm supposed to be doing and I'm ready to do it!



Let this thread be about the nature of the ego, so that we become aware of its cunning ways and we can learn to rise above!

[Skyhaven]

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[Wind]

That's a very good video. :)

[joeecho]

Let this thread be about the nature of the ego, so that we become aware of its cunning ways and we can learn to rise above!

Ego and its cunning ways are infinite from my observation. Oh but the web it weaves!

Ego is a cleaver way for the spirit potential to endlessly deny itself.

Of course, as Ego, I could be wrong. :couch2:

[Shezbeth]

Far be it from me, but I 'love' how the ego is so besmirched, defamed, and demonized. There are those who would claim that the ego is responsible for all the ills of the world,... without realizing that it is an ego that is making such a claim. There are those who will claim to have surpassed, emerged beyond, dissolved, or otherwise minimized their ego,... and yet it is an ego that makes that claim, or perpetuates the behavior from which that claim is asserted by others.

There are still others who see the ego of others and assume it to be a lack of ego, and their ego sets out to emulate the other ego's perceived lack of ego.

Oh the vapid egocentrism! :whistle:

[Frederick Jackson]

The Eight Stages ... yes that is how I got to the little bit of pure awakened state that I have experienced. Basically, it was not through discipline, but a crushing lifetime defeat. But spiritual practice may help too in getting to the state of oneness. However, basically, I agree with one Zen school which says it generally comes of a sudden and as a complete surprise. Sufis call the experience of ego death, fana. and refer to it as dying before you die.

But hey, right on Shezbeth, there would be no world without ego. Every animal lives with ego. God manifests this way. He would not be aware of himself if there were not an "I" and a "Thou". (I in the moment of ego collapse experience Him, which is only Him experiencing Himself.) But of course the ego and all its machinery is the cause of so much ill in the human sphere. Many more of us need to die before we die.

[joeecho]

Far be it from me, but I 'love' how the ego is so besmirched, defamed, and demonized. There are those who would claim that the ego is responsible for all the ills of the world,... without realizing that it is an ego that is making such a claim. There are those who will claim to have surpassed, emerged beyond, dissolved, or otherwise minimized their ego,... and yet it is an ego that makes that claim, or perpetuates the behavior from which that claim is asserted by others.

There are still others who see the ego of others and assume it to be a lack of ego, and their ego sets out to emulate the other ego's perceived lack of ego.

Oh the vapid egocentrism! :whistle:

Ego isn't always found at center stage. It also plays and dances it the background just as well.

[Ahnung-quay]

Is there really such a thing as ego death or is more a game of keeping it at bay, chained in it's own little corner of the mind?

I went through all of these stages and thought that my ego was dead and gone. Well, then something comes my way and there's my ego trying to influence my thoughts or actions.... Back, back I say (whip cracking)!

Vigilance is necessary.

[joeecho]

Is there really such a thing as ego death or is more a game of keeping it at bay, chained in it's own little corner of the mind?

I went through all of these stages and thought that my ego was dead and gone. Well, then something comes my way and there's my ego trying to influence my thoughts or actions.... Back, back I say (whip cracking)!

Vigilance is necessary.

Whip cracking? Reminds me what a master would do with a slave. One of Egos favorite roles (among others) is of the master.

(Hint: The pyramid points above and below. See Seal of Solomon)

http://www.remnantbride.com/images/solomons_seal.png



.......which is only Him experiencing Himself.

This might be ego play as it is probable, to me, that ego can only experience ego. Anything else is but like briefly catching something out of the corner of the eye.

[Ahnung-quay]

LOL. Maybe it is play but, I stalk mine. That way it never becomes the master (or rarely ever), hopefully. It seems after doing it for awhile, one has more time to just be and- more acceptance, tolerance, and compassion.

[Skyhaven]

Has anyone ever thought about the idea of the crucifixion of Jesus being a metaphor for the crucifixion and death of the ego? Didn't he really point to this by saying "Until a man die and be born again, he cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven"?

[joeecho]

Has anyone ever thought about the idea of the crucifixion of Jesus being a metaphor for the crucifixion and death of the ego? Didn't he really point to this by saying "Until a man die and be born again, he cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven"?

I can see the ritual/ symbolism of it.

"Until a man die and be born again, he cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven"

I see this as a potential nod to reincarnation. Dying to one particular form/ ego and being born (again) onto another form/ ego.

Like a bee flying from flower to flower in an infinite field of varying flower species. Each flower more exotic then the next with its intoxicating allure. Wouldn't a field like this be heaven to a bee?

http://imavex.vo.llnwd.net/o18/clients/urbanfarm/images/Annual_Flowers/California-Zinnia-Annual-Seeds.jpg

There is no need to die to ego (flower) because bee will always be bee thus 'death' is but a movement in time to the bee. The flower is symbolically a temporary amnesic state. In the illusion of time its but a blink of the eye.

http://www.virtuousplanet.com/shops/userimages/00006/00000000053/section/00000000000000068687.png

To bee or not to bee is not the question. ;)

[Skyhaven]

Has anyone ever thought about the idea of the crucifixion of Jesus being a metaphor for the crucifixion and death of the ego? Didn't he really point to this by saying "Until a man die and be born again, he cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven"?

I can see the ritual/ symbolism of it.

"Until a man die and be born again, he cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven"

I see this as a potential nod to reincarnation. Dying to one particular form/ ego and being born (again) onto another form/ ego.

Like a bee flying from flower to flower in an infinite field of varying flower species. Each flower more exotic then the next with its intoxicating allure. Wouldn't a field like this be heaven to a bee?

http://imavex.vo.llnwd.net/o18/clients/urbanfarm/images/Annual_Flowers/California-Zinnia-Annual-Seeds.jpg

There is no need to die to ego (flower) because bee will always be bee thus 'death' is but a movement in time to the bee. The flower is symbolically a temporary amnesic state. In the illusion of time its but a blink of the eye.

http://www.virtuousplanet.com/shops/userimages/00006/00000000053/section/00000000000000068687.png

To bee or not to bee is not the question. ;)

I'm not sure its a nod to reincarnation, that would kind of mean that the reincarnation process solely is needed to enter the kingdom of heaven. Although it is needed to facilitate it, I believe its more about the transformations that can happen within a single incarnation. That at some stage the Christ Consciousness is born within us.

I believe it has to do with the birth of wisdom, truth and love within us, and the birth of a feeling of oneness and unity with all beings. Like with any birth it's starts of small, but one can grow into it more fuller, if we nourish it. At the same time the Ego starts its gradual slow death (crucifixion).

But I love the analogy you painted out so beautifully joeecho. :)

[joeecho]

I'm not sure its a nod to reincarnation, that would kind of mean that the reincarnation process solely is needed to enter the kingdom of heaven. Although it is needed to facilitate it, I believe its more about the transformations that can happen within a single incarnation. That at some stage the Christ Consciousness is born within us.

I believe it has to do with the birth of wisdom, truth and love within us, and the birth of a feeling of oneness and unity with all beings. Like with any birth it's starts of small, but one can grow into it more fuller, if we nourish it. At the same time the Ego starts its gradual slow death (crucifixion).

But I love the analogy you painted out so beautifully joeecho. :)

That's alright. You're just on a different flower then I. I would expect you to describe your flower in better detail then I. Then again, that goes both ways.

It's like if I was in the USA where it was raining and you were in the Netherlands where it was hot and sunny. I call you up and tell you it's raining and you look out your window and see it's sunny and tell me "no it's not".

Each is right in their own reality.

Enjoy your flower. (I mean that in the best of ways)

http://imavex.vo.llnwd.net/o18/clients/urbanfarm/images/Annual_Flowers/Sunflower.jpg

[Skyhaven]

Hi joeecho, your right, that's the beauty of metaphors, they speak in different meaningful ways! Thanks for showing me your flower! I shouldn't be contradicting the perspectives of others when it comes to these matters, sorry for that.

Last night I listened to a talk by Alan Watts, found his perspective to be very interesting, so I'd like to share it here:

WhOpuY8NO0A

[joeecho]

Hi joeecho, your right, that's the beauty of metaphors, they speak in different meaningful ways! Thanks for showing me your flower! I shouldn't be contradicting the perspectives of others when it comes to these matters, sorry for that.



Thanks for the vid share. Alan Watts is one of my absolute favorites!

Actually I am glad you described your flower as well. It is additional reinforcement, for me, to see things as less contradiction and more as one of contrast.

Also to see, in general, ego/ form more clearly...meaning the full spectrum that includes various thoughts/ ideas/ beliefs as form. Not just a narrow band of the 'form' family, if you will.

I am one of those bees that has, and continues, to meander between flowers. In the past it has definitely been engaging but confusing at the same time. The confusion part is progressively clearing up. I would equate it to going from a severely turbulent overcast day to now partly cloudy with a forecast of clear skies ahead. (I hope the meteorologist is right! ;) It has been a rough 'winter' for me.)

[Skyhaven]

Is Alan Watts one of your meteorologists? I like Alan because of his superb verbal skills, his creativity in offering different perspectives (and his witty humor of course), but I'm not sure he's the best guide; he tends to contradict/contrast himself with all his different perspectives.

[joeecho]

Is Alan Watts one of your meteorologists? I like Alan because of his superb verbal skills, his creativity in offering different perspectives (and his witty humor of course), but I'm not sure he's the best guide; he tends to contradict/contrast himself with all his different perspectives.


No, not one of my meteorologist. I don't have one or even a few. Never had a guide in the sense of a name or discipline etc. The nectar that drives me has come from many sources, each with it's unique energizing quality.

Alan Watts is a flower I visit in the field from time to time. I only linger there a little longer then with some others.

My sense of a weather change is more of a trending observation I have had over the course of the greater part of my life. There are smaller variation in a shorter part of the span of my life but what I really watch for is the longer term trending.

[Skyhaven]

Well, in my opinion you don't really need meteorologists anyway, the seasons will turn with or without them, but its nice to have some affirmations once in a while. Jiddu Krishnamurti once said:

Bringing about a transformation of the mind, is to not accept things as they are, nor revolt against them. Revolt doesn't answer a thing. You must understand it, go into it, examine it, give your heart and your mind, with everything that you have, to find out a way of living differently. That depends on you, and not on someone else, because in this there is no teacher, no pupil; there is no leader; there is no guru; there is no Master, no Saviour. You yourself are the teacher and the pupil; you are the Master; you are the guru; you are the leader; you are everything.

[joeecho]

Well, in my opinion you don't really need meteorologists anyway, the seasons will turn with or without them, but its nice to have some affirmations once in a while.


Agreed.

Affirmations are a nice surprise from time to time but I do not depend on them as they have been known to change shape leaving me with feeling of being a puppet on a string (dance puppet, dance)....and then what? Most of us have been there and it is fine for awhile but, for me personally, at some point I started looking for some scissors! :p



Oh, and lingering on the bee/ flower analog again, most of the time I have been the flower looking to bee but the blessing comes when I am bee appreciating the flowering field (for what it is).

[Skyhaven]

Yeah I know the feeling... too many perspectives and affirmations and I feel trapped in a cage of thought.

Are you sure you wouldn't rather be a butterfly instead of a bee? A bee has to kind of work for the queen all day...

[joeecho]

Yeah I know the feeling... too many perspectives and affirmations and I feel trapped in a cage of thought.

Are you sure you wouldn't rather be a butterfly instead of a bee? A bee has to kind of work his #$* off for the queen all day...

To me, bee works well in the metaphor with 'be' as a .......... reminder of................................without qualification.

[Skyhaven]

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[joeecho]

Thoughts are echoes of Thought within ego.

This thought is one of those echoes.

[Skyhaven]

Hans Wilhelm is explaining his perspective of the ego by drawing. I'm very right-brainy so this kind of explanation really gets my focus... I like his acronym of EGO too... Edging God Out

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[joeecho]

Hans Wilhelm is explaining his perspective of the ego by drawing. I'm very right-brainy so this kind of explanation really gets my focus... I like his acronym of EGO too... Edging God Out

lF5N1O-6GhU

In a sense Ego and 'god' are the same. The point being that once you have a 'name' you have an ego.

It's a concept so it can be aborted if you like. ;)