The fourth amendment....

[THIRDEYE]

yesterday i had the opportunity to excercise my 4th ammendment rights with the local county bumpkin sherriffs.....i live on a 1000 acre farm and my land borders my nieghbors land,it appeared a camper was on her land and it was stolen or placed there for wat reasons ,i havent a clue,so law enforcement was called and they came with 4 cop cars for a camper in the woods,im thinking to myself hmmm is this how many cars they send to a domestic call or a break in...i went with my 84 yo nieighbor where the trailor was on her land...as soon as i got out of the pickup the sheriffs started asking me questions about the trailer.it was more of an intterrogation,i laughed and said i dont know whos camper this is its not on my land and it does not concern me....one sheriiff asked me my name and i chose not to give it to them...this is when things started to get intresting,they basically used scare tactics on me saying i was a person of suspicion,what because i have long hair,or because im not beckoning to your call of questions....to make along story short i held my ground and was threatened of arrest....this went on for a 1/2 hour or so...the came another cop car with the captain of the force...he began too ask me questions and i still would not answer them i had my own little words of vocabulary i used i will not repeat....i won they didnt get my name from my lips and didnt produce any i.d. ........all people please stand up for your rights dont be scared of law enforcement and stand your ground....i just wonder if any other avolonians have had similiar expieriences,please share....love light and abundance ...thirdeye

[Zook]

[...]
all people please stand up for your rights dont be scared of law enforcement and stand your ground....i just wonder if any other avolonians have had similiar expieriences,please share....love light and abundance ...thirdeye

Bravo, ThirdEye!!! One of the most important posts I've seen on Avalon.

:typing:

ps: To Americans, No.s 1,2, and 4 are numbers in the Bill of Ten that you can least afford to lose.

[Caren]

Hi there Thirdeye,
Hooray! and "Good For You" :nod for standing your ground in that ridiculous situation. I feel sorry for your 84 year old, elderly neighbor and glad that you were there to give her a much needed hand with those disrespectful 'Bullies'.
Thanks for the encouragement and thanks for sharing this Thirdeye.. :thumb:

[shadowstalker]

Me I would have done one better then that and right in front of the cops to.
I would have asked my neighbor why he felt he had to call the cops (no disrespect intended)
And then requested the camper to be moved onto my land if there was no true threat. (:tape2:Just to be contrary to the cops:pound:)
Cuz I'm Just that type of person ,,Mwahahahaha

[fifi]

I admire your courage, ThirdEye.

[Second Son]

Good for you ThirdEye. I was recently stopped when I was lost in Massachusets. I stopped at a CVS to get a grape soda and ask the sales clerk directions, then off to get on the highway. As soon as my tires hit I-95, there were blue lights and a siren screaming behind me. When the young turks got out of the undercover cop car, they were talking into their radios, saying things like. "We've been following him for miles; This is a definite bust; Requesting imediate back-up!" I was removed from my car (as was my friend who is 69) we were made to stand beside this extremely busy highway and roll up our sleave while these kids checked us for track marks. Seems I was guilty as sin for getting lost in a town which has the dubious title of "heroin capital of Massachusets". The real nail in my coffin, though was the fact hat I stopped at a drug store, supposedly to buy needles. These young guys were adamant that I was guilty of something. I am thankful I had a witness with me. Looking back I think at best they would have planted something, and at worst, would have shot me. The real punchline here is that I haven't drank or done drugs in 17 years, and my friend, 27. I SHOULD HAVE SUED FOR DEFAMATION.

[Arpheus]

Dont worry Second son all MA cops are like that they all act like they came right out of the gestapo its hilarious,they also think they can get away with talking to anyone like your some sort of criminal when you get stopped for any type of traffic violation around here its pathetic they got nothing else better to do tho!

[Second Son]

There's a pretty strong group of sovereigns down there as well, Arpheus, trying to shake things up a bit and get the gestapo back in line. It's an uphill battle for sure. Now the entire I-91 corridor has new surveilance cameras for the entire length of the state.:(

[Hiram]

There are two very important statements you should make to any police who ask you questions. If you make these statements, they will take you for someone who understands the law and they will be more likely to leave you alone.

1) I don't consent to any searches officer. Be firm but polite when stating this. This will cover even having to answer basic questions. be warned that once you answer even one question, you have waived your right to a verbal search.

Example: Cop: Where are you boys heading?
You: I don't consent to any searches officer. Am I being detained?
Cop: You got any drugs or alcohol in your vehicle son?
You: I don't consent to any searches officer.

2) Am I being detained officer? This question can be repeated frequently. It annoys them as if they don't have a good reason to detain you officially, they have to let you go. Most people don't know to ask...and they are certainly not going to tell you to leave unless they have to. So make them!!


These two questions put the power back into your court. They can't ask you arbitrary questions such as where you are going etc if you enact your rights. In most states they can legally ask you for your name and to show ID. Simply show it and don't answer any questions. Just stand there looking at them. Remember, they need a warrant to search your vehicle or your pockets. They can pat you down without a warrant however--just not ask you to empty your pockets.

Remember though, if they ask you what you have in your pockets, and you say "nothing". Then you have just waived your rights. You must respond kindly: I don't consent to any searches officer.

[Lost Soul]

Bravo for your courage. If the cops really knew their beat, someone there should have known who you were. That's the advantage of having a residential deputy sheriff who knows everybody or a beat officer who works a beat on a regular basis. Deputies or cops who do this develop rapport with their community and become part of the community, not apart from the community.

[bluestflame]

in victoria they're airing a media campaign to inform the public about new increased police powers to search anyone, ...in answer to the increase in knife related crimes

so much for the rest of us

http://www.justice.vic.gov.au/wps/wcm/connect/justlib/doj+internet/home/community+safety/weapons/justice+-+new+weapons+laws+faqs+(faq)

[bluestflame]

"Police currently have the power to search people for weapons if they reasonably suspect they are carrying one, ]or in designated public places[/U. Searches for weapons in designated areas can be either planned in advance, or unplanned, random, searches.

The new powers make it easier for police to designate a public place for either a planned or random weapons search.

Police provide at least one week’s notice of an area, such as a train station or event, such as a large festival, being designated for a planned weapons search. This helps people be aware of the planned search and deters them from carrying weapons.

Police will now be able to undertake random searches, without notice, [U]anywhere there has been a weapons-related incident, or where people have been caught carrying a weapon unlawfully, in the last twelve months.

Public places include any open place to which the public are admitted or have access, even if they have to pay an admission fee. This includes:

train stations and carriages
licensed premises, including bars, pubs, and clubs
sporting venues, parks and recreation areas generally, including racecourses, cricket and football grounds
schools
markets and festivals
public stadiums or theatres when there is public entertainment"

tis not the nature of the search but the search itself

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of course the whole notion of "random searches" is up to the officers discretion