North Korea shells South Korea

[HURRITT ENYETO]

Breaking news, North Korea fires at least 200 shells at South Korea which retaliates with at least 80 shells in this escalating situation.

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6AM0YS20101123

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/telegraph/multimedia/archive/01768/korea-2_1768355b.jpg
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/southkorea/8153000/North-Korea-bombs-South-Korean-island.html

[Zepheriah]

This is very disturbing news to wake up to.

One can only hope that it doesn't escalate.

[bashi]

Fh06Q1jxX00

[HURRITT ENYETO]

After North Korea admitting its got a ultra modern Uranium enrichment plant in the last few days i cant help thinking this is just too much of a coincidence.

[Ross]

After North Korea admitting its got a ultra modern Uranium enrichment plant in the last few days i cant help thinking this is just too much of a coincidence.

sure is!!!

[norman]

After North Korea admitting its got a ultra modern Uranium enrichment plant in the last few days i cant help thinking this is just too much of a coincidence.

And if that video SWAMI posted last night isn't a joke they're pulling out all the distractions they can right now. Imagine how long it 'won't' take for the world to freak out if as soon as this cloudy drizzly weather clears we all get up bright and early to look at the sunrise and see a couple of companions sitting there next to it.

[HURRITT ENYETO]

This just "feels" different than your usual north/south hostilities?

[Ross]

The divide and conquer strategy set up many decades ago is playing its hand...how far will they play? we will see.

[steve_a]

Hi Hurritt Enyeto,

What will be interesting in this will be the response not only from the US, which is broke, but also the UK and the rest of the EU, which is also broke. Let's see if they all prefer the diplomatic route now that the gloves have been put on.

By the way I was brought up for most of my adolescent life in Heywood, not a million miles away from you. :)

Best regards,

Steve

[jiix]

Is there any news or information about what's going on litterly right now between N. & S.?
Are they arming up? Has the situation de-escalated? Are we going to WW3? Anyone else getting involved yet?

[Ross]

South Korean Officials are having emergency meeting in military bunker...SBS news 10mins ago.

[HURRITT ENYETO]

Is there any news or information about what's going on litterly right now between N. & S.?
Are they arming up? Has the situation de-escalated? Are we going to WW3? Anyone else getting involved yet?

I dont think any more shells have been fired in the past hour. We haven't really had any proper reaction as yet with regard to UK,US,China,Russia,Japan other than the obligatory calls for calm.

[Swami]

And if that video SWAMI posted last night isn't a joke they're pulling out all the distractions they can right now. Imagine how long it 'won't' take for the world to freak out if as soon as this cloudy drizzly weather clears we all get up bright and early to look at the sunrise and see a couple of companions sitting there next to it.

Do you mean this one norman...?



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TvUz6s-7nI

[HURRITT ENYETO]

No official European response even though event started over 3 hours ago called exceptional. Emergency meeting of Security Council being arranged.

South Korea said it is "not concerned with North Korea's nuclear situation"

[Teakai]

Does anyone know what it was about?
I mean, I know they were never pals, but were these hostlilites something foreseen in news reports? We haven't had any sign over here in Australia (I asked husband - he watches the TV news)

[HURRITT ENYETO]

Does anyone know what it was about?
I mean, I know they were never pals, but were these hostlilites something foreseen in news reports? We haven't had any sign over here in Australia (I asked husband - he watches the TV news)

Nobody knows yet. But it is hard to believe with all the visits by NK dignitaries to china and vice versa recently that they did not warn the Chinese of what they had planned.

[The One]

Hey steve_a about the UK being broke we have decided to give Ireland 7 Billion pounds being our closest neighbour. It truly amazes me how they can just hand over that amount when we have all had to cut back on things because we are supposedly in debt. I don’t believe a word this government says anymore. Like many things in life some things don’t add up. Imagine if they gave that to a third world country what they could do with it, it would change the lives of millions.

[HURRITT ENYETO]

Hey steve_a about the UK being broke we have decided to give Ireland 7 Billion pounds being our closest neighbour. It truly amazes me how they can just hand over that amount when we have all had to cut back on things because we are supposedly in debt. I don’t believe a word this government says anymore. Like many things in life some things don’t add up. Imagine if they gave that to a third world country what they could do with it, it would change the lives of millions.

Its just another way of stealing the public s money

[norman]

Nobody knows yet. But it is hard to believe with all the visits by NK dignitaries to china and vice versa recently that they did not warn the Chinese of what they had planned.

Oh come on!....

North Korea , The Chinese elite, the US elite, the Eurpean elite,,,,,, they are all on the same team. Who got North Korea tooled up with nukes in the first place...?

Stand back a bit and get a better view of this. If we're going to have wall to wall dawn till dusk "news" about this it's definately the tail wagging the dog.

[jiix]

0932: A second South Korean marine dies after the shelling of Yeonpyeong, Yonhap news agency reports.

0923: BBC defence and security correspondent Nick Childs says that a flare-up like this inevitably sounds alarms, both literally and metaphorically, because of the potential trip-wire nature of the military stand-off between the Koreas.

0917: South Korea warns North Korea it will "sternly retaliate" for any further provocations, the presidential office says in a statement.

0910:The BBC's diplomatic correspondent Jonathan Marcus says the shelling is both a wider demonstration to the outside world of North Korea's power and - many analysts believe - an indication of some kind of political transition at the very top of the North Korean power structure. There are strong indications that North Korea's leader Kim Jong-il has designated his son Kim Jong-un as his likely successor.

0857: Russia's foreign ministry says: "It is important that this does not lead to an aggravation of the situation on the Korean peninsula", Russia's Interfax news agency reports.


0850: Japanese Prime Minister Naoto Kan orders his cabinet "to make preparations so that we can react firmly, should any unexpected event occur".

0842:The BBC's John Sudworth in Seoul says fires are said to be burning out of control on Yeonpyong island. There are reports of an evacuation under way.


0755:The BBC's Martin Patience in Beijing says China is North Korea's only major ally. The North Korean leader Kim Jung-il has visited the country twice this year. Beijing's economic and diplomatic support has been important in shoring up its isolated neighbour.


0745: China's Foreign Ministry spokesman Hong Lei expresses concern, urging both Pyongyang and Seoul to "do more to contribute to peace and stability in the region".


0732: South Korean President Lee Myung-bak orders officials to "sternly respond" to North Korea's action, but also urges to make sure the "situation does not escalate". Mr Lee is now holding a security meeting in a presidential situation room.



0700:The BBC's John Sudworth in Seoul says so far 80 shells have been fired in response according to the South Korean military, fighter jets have been scrambled and messages are being broadcast on the island instructing residents to take cover in secure positions.


0657: The first pictures from the scene show thick black smoke rising from burning homes on Yeonpyong Island. There are reports of injuries to both civilians and soldiers.

[Swami]

Hasn't the North Korean leaders son been put in the role of commander of the army lately...?
or is my brain playing tricks with me..

Edit:
There are strong indications that North Korea's leader Kim Jong-il has designated his son Kim Jong-un as his likely successor.

[bashi]

jiix:
Any link to the ticker?

[jiix]

BBC NEWS TICKET > http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/9218848.stm

*UPDATE*
0938: The White House says it "strongly condemns" the North Korean attack on South Korea, adding it is firmly committed to the defence of South Korea, regional peace and stability, Reuters reports.

0934: Sohn Young-jun in Seoul says Koreans think this event is different from past incidents, because the attack was aimed at Korean land where civilians live. People are afraid that there will be another war. We simply don't understand why North Korea is attacking us so seriously.

[bashi]

Motives?
Two choices:

"The attack has prompted the US special representative for North Korea, Stephen Bosworth, to rule out the resumption of six-party talks on nuclear disarmament that Pyongyang abandoned two years ago."

If that was to be achieved, then it points to that NK is hell-bound to pursue the Uranium enrichment as a more promising avenue than Plutonium enrichment, without being dragged immediately into negotiations.

or

scare them away, so that they do not deploy WMD into a boiling pot:

"South Korea’s Defense Minister Kim Tae-young said yesterday that he will consider talking with the U.S. about bringing back U.S. nuclear weapons to deal with the increasing nuclear threat from the North."

http://joongangdaily.joins.com/article/view.asp?aid=2928747

.

[Swami]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXD6Gtinvbc

[ExHaLaTiON]

it starts out small like a snowball and then turns into an avalanche, could this be that snowball? The U.S will get draged in if these two go at it but you know the North wouldn't go without China backup.

[The One]

Latest from sky

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/World-News/South-Korea-Says-North-Korea-Fired-Artillery-Onto-An-Island-And-Into-The-Sea/Article/201011415822829?lpos=World_News_Carousel_Region_0&lid=ARTICLE_15822829_South_Korea_Says_North_Korea_Fired_Artillery_Onto_An_Island_And_Into_The_Sea

[Swami]

Latest from sky

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/World-News/South-Korea-Says-North-Korea-Fired-Artillery-

Link doesn't work....
Edit: Works......thx.....

[The One]

just sorted the above link

[HURRITT ENYETO]

1010: Jasper Kim of Seoul National University tells BBC World Service: "It's a classic pattern from North Korea of sabre rattling. [North Korea is] trying to lure South Korea and its allies into some sort of larger skirmish, and the reason they want that is ultimately for bargaining power at the negotiating table."

[Teakai]

Hey steve_a about the UK being broke we have decided to give Ireland 7 Billion pounds being our closest neighbour. It truly amazes me how they can just hand over that amount when we have all had to cut back on things because we are supposedly in debt. I don’t believe a word this government says anymore. Like many things in life some things don’t add up. Imagine if they gave that to a third world country what they could do with it, it would change the lives of millions.

Third world countries are third world countries because these 'buggers that be' have been exploiting those countries natural wealth. Stealing it from under their noses, paying slave wages and bringing it to the Western world and making vast profits on it.
So, it's not at all likely they're going to give them money and power - they might have a fight on their hands then.

[The One]

And maybe the missiles that have been launched lately that nobody's taken responsibility for could have been a practise run for this event

[norman]

This is SO!... like football or boxing. There are those who want the drama of being on one side or the other, feeling every punch or every goal. They are not interested in the boardroom fraud or the mercinary nature of professional players who could just as easily switch and play for the other team next season.

The 'game' is for the ticket buying punters! The business is for the agents and the managers. Just like the corporate world too. The punters get what they are sold, the real free market is in the shareholdings going on over their heads and at complete odds with the punters interests. Any theater of war is a stadium full of players and punters with the executives with their backs to the windows with the best views high above. Dummy heros, dummy underdogs, roars and gasps from the crowd, grunts and war paint notching up the players scores and concieted chuckles from the executive suite up top.

Have your boys scored yet Tommy?, oh I dunno, fancy a another swifty, Jack?...you can entertain me next week at the Grouse shoot, are you bringing the little woman along with you, you'll need someone to carry your wellies if the sun comes out.


* I meannnnn...come on...... How many of those Korean and Chinese top dogs drop in at Bohemian Grove for a round of man hunting in the woods?

[Snowbird]

Norman, it appears as though you are fully awakened. :yes4:

[bluestflame]

yeah , i get it's entertainment , exciting enough to engage the masses that are becoming more alert

¤=[Post Update]=¤

I mean they've targeted an island , and are evac ing to minimise casualties

[Rocky_Shorz]

Hasn't the North Korean leaders son been put in the role of commander of the army lately...?
or is my brain playing tricks with me..

Edit:

DOH, I thought it was my Nintendo... my bad...



Nov 23 (Reuters) - South Korea said it was conducting regular military drills off the west coast before North Korea started firing dozens of shells, but that its firing exercises did not aim to the North.

"We were conducting usual military drills and our test shots were aimed toward the west, not the north," a South Korean military official said.

North Korea said on Tuesday that Seoul had initiated firing of shells, prompting it to take an instant military action. [ID:nTOE6AM05B]

(Reporting by Ju-min Park, writing by Miyoung Kim; Editing by Yoo Choonsik)

[Humble Janitor]

The usual doom porn lovers are crying WWIII at these news but I think they're off their rockers, much like Kim Jong Il.

Let's not jump to conclusions. There are many routes that this conflict could take, including a diplomatic route.

[irishspirit]

South Korea says it will retaliate with missile strikes against the North if faced with "further provocations", after an exchange of fire in which two South Korean marines were killed.

President Lee Myung-bak was responding to the shelling of an inhabited island close to a disputed maritime border.

The South returned fire in one of the worst clashes since the Korean War.

US President Barack Obama called the incident an "outrageous, provocative act" by Pyongyang.

He was speaking ahead of an expected telephone call to President Lee.

The South Korean military had been carrying out an exercise near Yeonpyeong island, and the North accused the South of opening the hostilities - something Seoul denies.

The South says North Korean shells started falling in the waters off the island at 1434 local time (0534 GMT) on Tuesday.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-11823474

Interesting times ahead here folks.

[irishspirit]

The usual doom porn lovers are crying WWIII at these news but I think they're off their rockers, much like Kim Jong Il.

Let's not jump to conclusions. There are many routes that this conflict could take, including a diplomatic route.

Humble,

For once, Kim Jong 11 is not at fault for this. The south have admitted firing first. Check out my BBC link above and see the difference in forces, the south are up to something here my friend.

[DawgBone]

The usual doom porn lovers are crying WWIII at these news but I think they're off their rockers, much like Kim Jong Il.

Let's not jump to conclusions. There are many routes that this conflict could take, including a diplomatic route.


"Doom porn" I like that!

The naked untruth ...

[kinsuemei2]

I agree some times these "doom porn lovers" want the world to end so they can whisper "I told you so..!" as the blast wave hits them, but for me, thats to much, won't happen and if it does, it will be far more subtle.

[HURRITT ENYETO]

I agree some times these "doom porn lovers" want the world to end so they can whisper "I told you so..!" as the blast wave hits them, but for me, thats to much, won't happen and if it does, it will be far more subtle.

I don't believe anyone is promoting "doom porn" here, news is news no matter how doomy it looks.

[Harley]

I agree some times these "doom porn lovers" want the world to end so they can whisper "I told you so..!" as the blast wave hits them, but for me, thats to much, won't happen and if it does, it will be far more subtle.

I like a good disaster movie as much as the next guy. You know, the plot with a good ending where we win, survive, etc and get to go to a REALLY BIG PARTY.

In contrast, I hate a good disaster movie with a bad ending. You know, the plot where everyone get's wiped-out of existence. They just leave me feeling so . . . EMPTY!

But if it does all have to end, I don't care much for "subtlety". I'm not a big fan of pain and suffering.

But still, it would be kind of nice to at least know where it's coming from!

Have A Nice Day! :)

[jiix]

RE: Doom Porn

I want the zombies to come, not the nukes!

[Hughe]

I live in a war zone, South Korea.

It's nothing special for most Koreans because life is cheap and just to survive is freaking hard here anyway.
South Korea won't engage war against the North, because full-fledged war will return the South back to the 3rd world country with extreme poverty and poor living conditions.
Any mega city in the world like Seoul, one month of no power turns into the living hell. Period. That's how vulnerable a mega city is.

The warmongers, politicians, elites both South and North have been always used this conflict for their benefits not for Koreans in general.
I bet all the neighbor countries including U.S do not want to see unified Korea like Germany.
For them, this tension in Korean peninsula needs to exist as long as they have benefit.

I mean, whenever I go to street I need to be alert for my safety. Every year in South only, close to quarter million people involved in traffic accidents.
This is retard but it's reality. Like I said before, people are dump down, and life is cheap.

In my honest opinion, the military industrial complex owns both South and North.
The government is just a puppet especially in the South. About 40 years, different military gangs like a tag team ruled South Korea regime after regimes.
So, this country is still a modern totalitarian society.

[Carmody]

Thank you for your insight into these matters.

A cautious note to the rest of us westerners: One must use their own eyes .......but only a fool judges the world through their own paradigm.

[yiolas]

The US will send an aircraft carrier and other warships to the Yellow Sea in a show of force after North Korea shelled a South Korean island there. Washington said it would start joint naval exercises with South Korea on Sunday after the bombardment of Yeonpyeong island on Tuesday killed two marines and injured more than a dozen troops and civilians. However, the deployment of the USS George Washington, which carries 75 fighters, is likely to spark protests from Beijing and Pyongyang.
Read More at the Financial Times. (http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/4f832eda-f78c-11df-b770-00144feab49a.html#axzz16BlXI0VY)

[bashi]

By mere looking at the geographic position of the islands, i can understand that North Korea gets angry if there are SK shooting exercises going on at my doorstep.
I, if a South Korean, would just keep more low...

http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/5880/koreaborder2crop.jpg (http://img153.imageshack.us/i/koreaborder2crop.jpg/)

[Elandiel BernElve]

Hey Yiolas.. your link is for subscribers only, so i'll place the text here:

U.S. aircraft carrier heads for Korean waters

(Reuters) - A U.S. aircraft carrier group set off for Korean waters on Wednesday, a day after North Korea rained artillery shells on a South Korean island, in a move likely to enrage Pyongyang and unsettle its ally, China.

South Korea said the bodies of two civilians were found on

the island after Tuesday's attack, which is likely to stir up

more resentment in the country against its prickly neighbor.

The nuclear-powered USS George Washington, which carries 75 warplanes and has a crew of over 6,000, left a naval base south of Tokyo and would join exercises with South Korea from Sunday to the following Wednesday, U.S. officials in Seoul said.

"This exercise is defensive in nature," U.S. Forces Korea said in a statement. "While planned well before yesterday's unprovoked artillery attack, it demonstrates the strength of the ROK (South Korea)-U.S. alliance and our commitment to regional stability through deterrence."

North Korea said the South was driving the peninsula to the "brink of war" with "reckless military provocation" and by postponing humanitarian aid, the North's official KCNA news agency said. The dispatch did not refer to the planned military drills.

The government in Seoul came under pressure for the military's slow response to the provocation, echoing similar complaints made when a warship was sunk in March in the same area, killing 46 sailors.

Defense Minister Kim Tae-young was grilled by lawmakers who said the government should have taken quicker and stronger retaliatory measures against the North's provocation.

"I am sorry that the government has not carried out ruthless bombing through jet fighters during the North's second round of shelling," said Kim Jang-soo, a lawmaker of ruling Grand National Party and a former defense minister.

Tuesday's attack was the heaviest in the region since the Korean War ended in 1953, and marked the first civilian deaths in an assault since the bombing of a South Korean airliner in 1987.

The United States and Japan urged China to do more to rein in North Korea after the reclusive nation fired scores of artillery shells on Tuesday at a South Korean island near the maritime boundary between the two sides.

Beijing will not be pleased by the deployment of the aircraft carrier and will not respond to such pressure, said Xu Guangyu, a retired major-general in the People's Liberation Army who now works for a government-run arms control organization.

"China will not welcome the U.S. aircraft carrier joining the exercises, because that kind of move can escalate tensions and not relieve them," he said.

"Our biggest objective is stability on the Korean peninsula. That interest is not served by abandoning North Korea, and so there's no need to rethink the basics of the relationship."

source: http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSL3E6MN0SQ20101124

[Bill Ryan]

only a fool judges the world through their own paradigm.

Or through CNN!

[Anchor]

Perhaps the best thing the South Koreans can do is not retaliate, even with rhetoric for the moment and do their best to mitigate the damage and help the people in the hot zones get safe.

I seriously hope that a good dose of light soon descends into the hearts of the men responsible for this idiocy.

[Bea]

I can't imagine China wanting a disastrous war next door.
It may be good for arms sales but would be bad for other money making activities. And coping with mass movements of people, which wars cause, may challenge totalitarian control.


This is an opinion piece at http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/politics/is-this-deadly-aggression-the-latest-act-in-north-koreas-perverted-version-of-dynasty-20101124-186lp.html


North Korea's latest deadly aggression can probably be blamed on the leadership succession from the fast-fading Kim Jong-il to his callow third son.

The completely inexperienced Kim Jong-un, thought to be 27 or 28 years old, was promoted from civilian to four-star general in a single day two months ago.

Yesterday's attack on South Korea appears to be his blooding. The fear is that it will not be his last as he and his father seek to unify the regime and the people around his claim to lead the nuclear-armed rogue state.
But for a solution, the world looks not to the Dear Leader, who himself committed acts of aggression against South Korea in his own succession blooding in the 1980s.

Nor does the world look to his juvenile heir, who has been lauded in North Korea as the "Bright Comrade" or "Bright Leader."

The best hope for some grown-up supervision is the regime's only big ally, China. US-led international sanctions have proved ineffective in restraining North Korea.

Can China prove itself to be a responsible great power in the Asia-Pacific, or will it allow its junior ally to wage a Cold War-style proxy war against South Korea, a principal ally of the US?

It is a deadly serious test. This attack is "one of the gravest incidents since the end of the Korean War" in 1953, a war which technically never ended, according to the UN secretary-general, former South Korean foreign minister Ban Ki Moon.

The regime in Pyongyang claimed that it had been provoked by South Korea's big military manoeuvres, a pre-announced, annual 70,000 man exercise that included artillery test fire into the sea.

North Korea claims its neighbour's shells fell on its side of the sea border, while South Korea says that it fired only into its own territorial waters.

Pyongyang reacted not by firing into the waters controlled by its rival, but took aim at the island from which South Korea fired.

In other words, it was a calculated escalation - the island of of Yeonpyeong hosts a 1000-man military base but also 1900 civilians. Two South Korean troops were killed and 13 wounded, according to Seoul, but also three civilians.

This is not an isolated incident but part of a series of North Korean acts of provocation, evidently tied directly to the ailing Kim Jong-il's decision to accelerate the rise of the "Bright Leader."

In March, Pyongyang sank unprovoked the South Korean warship the Cheonan with the death of 46 crew.

Then, last weekend, the regime decided to reveal that it had built a sophisticated new uranium enrichment plant, a clear sign that it is accelerating its nuclear weapons program.

The last time there was such a studied series of high-stakes provocations was in the 1980s when Kim Jong-il was making his own claim on the succession.

At that time, North Korea blew up a helicopter, killing four South Korean Cabinet ministers, and blew up a Korean Air Lines civilian airliner.

South Korea's president Lee Myung Bak campaigned on taking a firmer line on North Korea. But while he is threatening retaliation in case of further aggression, he is showing considerable restraint. So is the US.

Can China restrain its junior ally, or are we going to see continued, calculated aggression as the Kims play out their dangerously perverted version of "Dynasty"?

Peter Hartcher is the international editor for The Sydney Morning Herald.

[ExHaLaTiON]

Lets see if the North will try anything when the USS George Washington is around. The plot thickens.....

[John Briggs]

The thing about this is that NK and SK have been provoking one another for a long time. The real question is what will China do. China is calling for talks to take place but the USA won't until NK removes it's Nuclear program. The US has affirmed it's commitment as an ally to stand by SK in regards to it's defense. The USA has no real options but to look weak or take action if NK persists. The real hope is that NK knocks it off. I have to wonder though whether this is a strategic move by China. After all. They are the country giving them the nuclear materials and weapons. China is NK's benefactor for al intentions and purposes. The exchange of power from Kim Jung Il to his son is also a major concern. Seems there may be some infighting going on over the power structure of NK according to many analysts.

[Rocky_Shorz]

I was actually pretty amazed how quick the media allowed us to learn North Korea started shelling because of South Korea's exercises in the area...

North Korea backed down right away, so I agree, the carrier group isn't necessary to show strength, but the Monitoring equipment in the area will help assess the new nuke facility and weapons the North is hiding which is my guess why ol George is steaming in...

[Snowbird]

Lets see if the North will try anything when the USS George Washington is around. The plot thickens.....

The term plot is the perfect description of this entire situation. When I study the alternative history of any warring aggression, I learn that all sides are the same side, and that side is the side of the controllers. The heads of these governments, including the U.S., are all/each members of that controlling group. They fully understand that war, on any continent, forces the people into unbearable survival situations and keeps them in a constant state of fear. War also keeps the world's attention on the conflicts as the controllers work in a different part of the world to bring more destruction. And, I can't forget to mention the profit that is gained from each and every conflict anywhere in the world. China? Definitely a member of this group.

[jcocks]

I found it unusual that, instead of calling for talks and peace like they normally do, Americas' president instead puffs up his chest and announces that they will join South Korea in military exercises - which the North views as provocation (Wow, really? I'd never have guessed !).....

Looks like America is itching for another war to strengthen its' economy..... (But by god I hope I am wrong)

[angel in disguise]

South Korea Defence Minister Resigns...

http://news.ca.msn.com/top-stories/cbc-article.aspx?cp-documentid=26494467

[John Briggs]

South Korea Defence Minister Resigns...

http://news.ca.msn.com/top-stories/cbc-article.aspx?cp-documentid=26494467

Yeah, seems that SK has a great deal of internal embarrassment regarding there response to the attack. Makes me wonder how much pressure there is coming from outside there own government. I know Japan responded publicly right away and really agitated and prepared to deal with any conflict over SK.

[norman]

I found it unusual that, instead of calling for talks and peace like they normally do, Americas' president instead puffs up his chest and announces that they will join South Korea in military exercises - which the North views as provocation (Wow, really? I'd never have guessed !).....

Looks like America is itching for another war to strengthen its' economy.....

(But by god I hope I am wrong)

Spot on!

These are almost subliminal anxiety triggers. The worlds war machines are being deployed right now to stem the rising tide of conciousness that is only a short throw from being free from their mind control. Yes they probably will eventually have a hot war, but until then they'll do their best to scare the crap out of us.

[ExHaLaTiON]

I found it unusual that, instead of calling for talks and peace like they normally do, Americas' president instead puffs up his chest and announces that they will join South Korea in military exercises - which the North views as provocation (Wow, really? I'd never have guessed !).....

Looks like America is itching for another war to strengthen its' economy..... (But by god I hope I am wrong)

I think the trip was planed before the shellings happened. Kim Jong is near his death bed and might just let the dogs loose even if someone from up top is telling him NO!

[ExHaLaTiON]

The term plot is the perfect description of this entire situation. When I study the alternative history of any warring aggression, I learn that all sides are the same side, and that side is the side of the controllers. The heads of these governments, including the U.S., are all/each members of that controlling group. They fully understand that war, on any continent, forces the people into unbearable survival situations and keeps them in a constant state of fear. War also keeps the world's attention on the conflicts as the controllers work in a different part of the world to bring more destruction. And, I can't forget to mention the profit that is gained from each and every conflict anywhere in the world. China? Definitely a member of this group.

I have to agree.... but it would be a huge mistake if they put this conflict into motion.

[Rocky_Shorz]

South Korea has named its former chairman of the joint chiefs of staff as the new defence minister amid growing criticism of the government's response to a deadly attack by North Korea.

General Kim Kwan-jin, a 61-year-old career soldier, is replacing Kim Tae-young who resigned on Thursday two days after the attack on the small South Korean island of Yeonpyeong left four people, including two marines, dead.

"[We] think nominee Kim, well-respected for professionalism and conviction, is the right person for the post in order to restore trust from people and boost morale in the entire military," Hong Sang-pyo, the presidential secretary, told a news briefing on Friday...


It warned on Friday that South Korea's military exercises with the US would bring the two neighbours to the "brink of war".

The stark warning came as sounds of distant artillery fire were heard from within North Korea. A Reuters witness said he saw smoke rising from inland North Korea.

Revision of rules

South Korea's YTN television said the shells appeared to have landed north of a disputed maritime border in North Korean waters and the military does not believe the firing was aimed at the South...

The military in Seoul said it will revise its rules of engagement to respond more strongly to North Korean attacks in the future.

But North Korea's KCNA news agency said Pyongyang will launch more attacks if South Korea continues with "reckless provocations".

"[North Korea] will wage second and even third rounds of attacks without any hesitation, if warmongers in South Korea make reckless military provocations again," the agency said, quoting from a military statement...


"We oppose any military act by any party conducted in China's exclusive economic zone without approval," China's Foreign Ministry said in an online response to a question regarding China's position on the George Washington participating in joint naval exercises.

The exclusive economic zone is a maritime zone up to 200 nautical miles from a country's coast...

Beijing is also wary of a unified Korea that would be dominated by the United States, the key ally of the South...


story link (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSL3E6MN0SQ20101126)

[Decibellistics]

Jesus......This really isn't good.

I've gotta bad feeling about this one.

[bashi]

China warned yesterday against military acts near its coastline ahead of US-South Korean naval exercises that North Korea, days after shelling a South Korean island, said risked pushing the region towards war.

There was brief panic in the capital Seoul in the afternoon when television reported sounds of artillery fire near Yeonpyeong. But the military said the artillery fire was distant and no shells landed in South Korea.

Tuesday’s artillery barrage was a major ramping-up of tension between to two Koreas, who remain technically still at war.
South Korean troops fired back 13 minutes later, causing unknown damage. Members of Lee’s own party and opposition lawmakers accused the military of responding too slowly.

This does not sound good at all. It's the perfect recipe for a BIG ONE

http://www.gulf-times.com/site/topics/article.asp?cu_no=2&item_no=401082&version=1&template_id=45&parent_id=25

[AlkaMyst]

US 'bringing Korean peninsula to brink of war'

America is bringing the Korean peninsula "to the brink of war" North Korea warned on Friday as tension continues to build ahead of a four-day US-South Korean joint war game that starts this weekend.

Beijing 9:10AM GMT 26 Nov 2010

The latest broadside from the regime of Kim Jong-il was issued as a US carrier battle group led by the nuclear-powered USS George Washington steamed towards the Yellow Sea in a show of deterrent force to Pyongyang.

"The situation on the Korean peninsula is inching closer to the brink of war," warned a dispatch from the Korean Central News Agency said. "Gone are the days when verbal warnings are served only." All morning North Korean state television and radio blared out martial music interspersed with official statements about the shelling of South Korean's Yeonpyeong Island on Tuesday which left four people dead and destroyed houses and parts of a military base.

In a further show of US solidarity with Seoul, Gen. Walter Sharp, the US military commander in South Korea, visited the shelled island, touring burned buildings and stating again that the attack was a violation of the ceasefire that ended the 1950-53 Korean War.

Related Articles

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26 Nov 2010

The US confirmed that Sunday's joint exercise would go ahead regardless of warnings from Beijing that the war games risk further destabilising an already volatile Korean peninsular.

Full story here! (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/northkorea/8161662/US-bringing-Korean-peninsula-to-brink-of-war.html)

[Carmody]

http://planetark.org/wen/60155

Date: 09-Nov-10
Country: SOUTH KOREA
Author: Ju-min Park

South Korea has found an undetermined amount of rare earth minerals in a deposit in the eastern Gangwon province, state-run Korea Resources Corp (KORES) said on Monday.

The discovery came amid lingering tension over China's controls of its rare earth supplies, which account for 97 percent of global output.

The United States and Japan, in particular, have been calling for China to loosen its export constraints for the minerals that are used in high-tech products from electric cars to LCD televisions to new energy technologies.

"We have to get ready to be self-sufficient in case China strengthens its control over (rare earth) exports," a KORES spokesman said.

China has sought to reassure its trade partners. It will maintain its exports of rare earths next year, Chinese Trade Minister Chen Deming said on Friday, adding that the trade issue should not be allowed to become a political issue.

China cut back its 2010 exports quota of rare earths by 40 percent from 2009 levels, which caused prices of the minerals to soar and made it more cost effective for other countries to start searching for their own supplies.

The South Korean state-run mining firm discovered veins containing rare earths while re-developing an iron ore mine. KORES said it would proceed with exploration to determine the quantity and make up of the mineral deposit.

[bashi]

The first victim in a war is the truth:

"S Korea asks reporters to leave border island"

http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/1128/korea.html

[irishspirit]

North Korea has placed surface-to-surface missiles on launch pads in the Yellow Sea, Yonhap news agency reported Nov. 28, as the United States and South Korea began military exercises and China said it would try to ensure peace.

South Korean President Lee Myung-bak told a visiting Chinese delegation that Beijing, North Korea's only major ally which is traditionally reluctant to criticise the reclusive regime, should do more to help.

China, which agreed with South Korea that the situation was "worrisome", would try to stop it deteriorating, the delegation responded, the presidential Blue House and

Read more: http://www.kyivpost.com/news/world/detail/91513/#ixzz16ZO9MSei

[irishspirit]

SEOUL, Nov. 28 (Yonhap) -- North Korea said Sunday that the Korean Peninsula is now in a state of "ultra-emergency," as South Korea and the United States began massive naval drills south of the Yellow Sea border in a show of force against the North.

In a statement carried by the official Korean Central News Agency, the National Peace Committee of Korea, a propaganda organ of the North, denounced the joint exercise as an attempt to trigger a war against the communist nation.

http://app.yonhapnews.co.kr/YNA/Basic/Article/Print/YIBW_showEnArticlePrintView.aspx?contents_id=AEN20101128005800315

[irishspirit]

China has called for an emergency meeting of key nations amid high tension in Korea over the North's deadly shelling of a Southern island.

It proposed that members of the six nations that have been taking part in talks on North Korean nuclear disarmament should meet in December.

The two Koreas, the US, China, Japan and Russia are involved in the talks.

South Korea quickly said it was not interested in formally resuming talks on nuclear disarmament.

Tension remains high on the peninsula, with the US and South Korea undertaking joint military exercises the North has denounced as a provocation.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-11856454

[irishspirit]

SEOUL, Nov. 28 (Yonhap) -- South Korean President Lee Myung-bak told a visiting senior Chinese official that Seoul was not interested in the early resumption of the six-party talks over North Korea's nuclear program as it is more urgent to deal with Pyongyang's belligerence, Lee's office Cheong Wa Dae said.

http://english.yonhapnews.co.kr/news/2010/11/28/0200000000AEN20101128005600315.HTML

[irishspirit]

DPRK radio: Conflict might erupt in Yellow Sea anytime because of NLL issue and "ceaseless provocation of the south Korean puppet group."


http://twitter.com/W7VOA/

[irishspirit]

PAJU, South Korea, Nov. 28 (Yonhap) -- South Korea mistakenly fired an artillery shell toward the southern side of the Demilitarized Zone (DMZ) on Sunday afternoon and soon sent a message to North Korea that the firing was accidental, military officials said.

No casualties occurred from the accidental discharge that took place at around 3 p.m., the officials said.

http://english.yonhapnews.co.kr/news/2010/11/28/0200000000AEN20101128005300315.HTML

There is no chance in hell that this can be seen as a mistake! Hope NK does not see this as an attack on them...

[irishspirit]

As the US South Korean naval exercise begins, North Korea deployed surface to surface missiles in the Yellow Sea, and also moved other missiles further south. The North Koreans have vowed that any trespassing of their borders, through land, air or sea, will meet a strong response.

And even without these latest movements, North Korea has a massive artillery array of 70,000 cannons pointed to Seoul – South Korea’s capital, which is very close to the border.

http://www.forexcrunch.com/north-korea-has-70000-cannons-targeted-at-seoul/

[Sabrina]

By Kim Young-gyo
HONG KONG, Nov. 28 (Yonhap) -- The Chinese government said Sunday it will make an "urgent" announcement later in the day amid rising military tensions surrounding the Korean Peninsula.

China's foreign ministry said it will hold a press conference at 4 p.m. for both domestic and foreign reporters based in Beijing, adding that it will not accept any questions during the conference.

Yonhap News Agency




http://english.yonhapnews.co.kr/news/2010/11/28/0200000000AEN20101128003500320.HTML

[irishspirit]

USA and South Korea have launched missiles...

http://twitter.com/Tanaka_Maki

[irishspirit]

A UN sanctions committee will on Monday discuss a new report on efforts to stop North Korea trading in nuclear weapons material, with the atmosphere made more tense by the North's artillery attack on the rival South.

China stopped the last sanctions committee report being sent to the UN Security Council for several months. A new battle is expected over the latest assessment by Security Council-mandated experts.

Stiff financial and trade sanctions imposed after the North's nuclear tests in 2006 and 2009 have not halted the secretive regime's dabbling in banned nuclear and arms trading, according to the last report, which was only published this month

http://www.spacewar.com/reports/UN_faces_new_battle_over_North_Korea_sanctions_999.html

[irishspirit]

A mass exodus of North Korean workers from the Far East of Russia is under way, according to reports coming out of the region. As the two Koreas edged towards the brink of war this week, it appears that the workers in Russia have been called back to aid potential military operations.

Vladnews agency, based in Vladivostok, reported that North Korean workers had left the town of Nakhodka en masse shortly after the escalation of tension on the Korean peninsula earlier this week. "Traders have left the kiosks and markets, workers have abandoned building sites, and North Korean secret service employees working in the region have joined them and left," the agency reported.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/expats-recalled-as-north-korea-prepares-for-war-2145018.html

[bashi]

This is getting serious:

"Australian help might be required in a war, says Rudd"

http://www.smh.com.au/world/australian-help-might-be-required-in-a-war-says-rudd-20101128-18cco.html

[bashi]

Now, this is "Doom-Porn": But look at the date....


QtdSYFyyG-Q

[Orion.V]

Oh well ... These kind of videos, when i see them i like to click the X button especially when there is this " prediction date " . We all know what those that are in power can do with the world, another war is not impossible, but doom-porn is certainly entertaining sometimes and to watch it with a deep sigh sent to those that attempt and enjoy with passion on "predicting" events like this.
And about the Koreans, well this is not the first time they are in a conflict, or should i say - they like to test their current military power, an exercise "game" maybe.

[truthseekerdan]

China has warned against military activity near its coastline ahead of U.S.- Korea naval exercises, according to Reuters.
China's Foreign Ministry said in an online posting that naval exercises risks starting a war: "We oppose any military act by any party conducted in China's exclusive economic zone without approval."

North Korea has also threatened to respond to military gestures with more attacks: "The situation on the Korean peninsula is inching closer to the brink of war due to the reckless plan of those trigger-happy elements to stage again war exercises targeted against the (North)."
If this sounds familiar, it's because the same thing happened after the Cheonan shipwreck.

America sent some warships to join in naval exercises, China was outraged, and America yielded and moved the exercises primarily to a more distant location.
China wants peace. The only problem with Pax China is that it includes little protection for South Korea against the next surprise attack from Pyongyang.

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/china-us-korea-war-drill-2010-11#ixzz16aiTYvPV

[Zook]

China has warned against military activity near its coastline ahead of U.S.- Korea naval exercises, according to Reuters.
[...]
America sent some warships to join in naval exercises, China was outraged, and America yielded and moved the exercises primarily to a more distant location.
China wants peace. The only problem with Pax China is that it includes little protection for South Korea against the next surprise attack from Pyongyang.
[...]


Pax Chinesia ... Pax Americana ... Pax Europa/Europeana. Well, here's my piana:

Somehwere Under The Rainbow

Somewhere under the rainbow,
way down below,
there are misguided movements, and humans
that herd about in uniforms;
ghouls arrived by abdicated souls
looking for enemies, degenerate freedoms,
and fabricated storms.

UncleZook@November.28.2010

:typing:

[damian]

03N2irkKOho

I am sure that a lot of us on Project Avalon are more than a little concerned about the situation thats unfolding in Korea. Do you find yourself preoccupied with the possibility of negative outcomes? Are you searching MSM for any information which might lead you to believe that this is not going to turn out well? I know I have. My concern is, are we contributing the power of our thoughts to a negative outcome?

In my reality I am choosing to visualize an outcome where war is not the answer this time. If we can get more of us on this site and others around the world to do the same, maybe just maybe, we can tip the scales toward a peaceful solution.

[Fredkc]

"We oppose any military act by any party conducted in China's exclusive economic zone without approval."
Known as extending your territory by extending the language. ;)


America sent some warships to join in naval exercises, China was outraged, and America yielded and moved the exercises primarily to a more distant location. So long as Chinese territorial waters were not involved, a huge mistake. Just ask Sun Tzu (http://fredsitelive.com/books/Art_Of_War_Sunzu.htm).

Of course China wants peace. Wars are messy, and costly. Best to win the battle without them. Why do you think China has been propping up North Korea for 60 years?


The only problem with Pax China is that it includes little protection for South Korea against the next surprise attack from Pyongyang.It offers absolutely no protection for North Korea, beyond its usefulness, either. Long term, I believe China intends to assimilate the whole peninsula.

Where the danger lies here is, so far, the US still behaves as if their weakness is military, and not economic strength. This is how wars start.
Fred

[irishspirit]

AUSTRALIA risks being entangled in fighting on the Korean Peninsula under its US alliance obligations, Foreign Minister Kevin Rudd has warned.

The South Korean and US navies will put on a show of force over coming days in response to the shelling of Yeonpyeong Island last week by North Korean artillery. North Korea has warned that the four-day naval exercises, which involved an American aircraft carrier and were due to start in the region yesterday afternoon, could have dire consequences.

Mr Rudd said South Korea had shown extraordinary restraint after one of its warships was sunk by a North Korean torpedo earlier this year, killing 46 sailors. But he said the latest attack was a massive provocation by the North Korean regime. ''We are watching this with razor-sharp eyes at the moment,'' he told the Nine Network yesterday.

http://www.theage.com.au/national/korean-skirmishes-pose-risk-says-rudd-20101128-18cf3.html

[Zook]

... when the thread unexpectedly closed on me. Anyways, my comment is important enough that I am posting it here. Damian suggested that we focus on positive energy to effect change. And this was what I was typing when the gremlins flipped the offswitch. LOL!

Comment commencing, then:

While your idea is a noble one, Damian, and I fully support it ... the underlying reality of this current antebellum is a fat 40plus trillion dollar American obligations/liablities dynamic mass. I don't worry too much about the quadrillion(plus) dollar derivative burden, because that can be zeroed more or less on a whim. But the 40terabucks canine beast, dressed to attend the Chinese Ball as a 14terabucks barking beauty (in the standard of the mug ugly pug, to be sure), has got the conniving cat cornered ... and a cat with no options tends to get scratchy.

To wit, the central banksters that have engineered the destruction of the U.S. economy are not going to be swayed by the rest of us meditating about it. The New World Order, the New World Government, the New World Standing Military, the New World Bank, the New World Buck, the New World Population, the New World population Size, etc. ... including the New World War (and its epilogue) ... these have been long planned by TBastardsTB.

Humble opinions all around. Here, let me toss in a few onions to help with the crying (hey, I gotta laugh about it, folks ... else, I`ll go crazy!).

:typing:


One of my multiple personalities whispering to another: "Did he say, Go crazy?"

[irishspirit]

Chinese state media coverage of the Korean peninsula shelling incident avoided criticising Beijing's close ally Pyongyang on Wednesday and even said the episode showed North Korea's "toughness".

North Korea fired a deadly barrage of artillery shells onto a South Korean island on Tuesday in one of the most serious border incidents since the 1950-1953 war, sparking global condemnation of Pyongyang.

China's official response has so far been relatively tepid, however, while state media have largely avoided pointing the finger at North Korea and taken an occasionally pro-Pyongyang tone.

"North Korea showed its toughness during the skirmish," the Global Times said in an editorial that also criticised the "failure of the hard-line policies" of the current South Korean government toward its northern neighbour.

Amid growing pressure for Beijing to rein in its close ally, China's only official response has come from a government spokesman who on Tuesday expressed "concern", while saying Beijing sought to "verify" what took place.

http://www.spacewar.com/reports/China_media_takes_pro-Pyongyang_tone_over_shelling_999.html

[Snowbird]

I too was in the process of responding when I received an error message. Perhaps it was an accidental mistake.

"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players;
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts,
His acts being seven ages"......Wm. Shakespeare

The stage is being set for the next thriller-chiller war game. The question is, how many of us will allow ourselves to get sucked into this drama?

Below are some of the headlines from the BusinessInsider site from the opening post. I have examined every one of these Breathtaking Photos and can assure each and every one of you that there is nothing whatever breathtaking about them. In fact, they are very mundane.

I also would like to know why the Business Insider news source, whose headquarters is in New York, is so heavily into posting all of these non-breathtaking photos of war preparations. Do you see the connection here?

Check Out Breathtaking Photos Of The Last US-Korea War Drills

No one generates madcap headlines like Kim Jong-il. The rogue dictator promised to launch powerful nuclear deterrence and a retaliatory sacred war if America and South Korea went ahead with war drills.

Well, we've started the war drills.
Click here to see the breathtaking military pictures >

Dramatic Photos Of The US-Korea War Drills That Could Set Off Nuclear War

The last US-Korea drills occurred in July

http://www.businessinsider.com/china-us-korea-war-drill-2010-11#ixzz16aiTYvPV

[Bill Ryan]

---------

(Mod hat on)

Threads merged - no idea what happened! Apologies if they're needed. Please continue this important discussion.

[Fredkc]

Zook, and all...

It was the dummy with the Blue name who posted without his morning coffee.
My mistake.

fixed,
Fred

[Snowbird]

Zook, and all...

It was the dummy with the Blue name who posted without his morning coffee.
My mistake.

fixed,
Fred

NO PROB! :laugh:

[bashi]

snowbird, click where?

[Snowbird]

snowbird, click where?

Sorry bashi. I've linked it below for your convenience.

http://www.businessinsider.com/china-us-korea-war-drill-2010-11#ixzz16aiTYvPV

[shiva777]

...hmmm...seems to me to be a situation of 2 bullies flexing their muscles at each other but both too afraid to fight as they know they will both get hurt....more fear to feed the masses with...don't buy in to it

[Beth]

And I merged again, I don't think we need two threads on the same topic.

[irishspirit]

Plan 'B'.....

with respect, and awareness, let us begin...

They, the powers that used to be, are trying it again.

You know, the whole 'problem, response, solution' thing that they use to control large numbers of mostly hypnotized people on this planet. They create a 'problem' that causes you to go into fear mode which is chemically triggered by the R-complex in your lower brain matrix, and then they control you through your emotions by manipulating events such that you agree to give them your power in exchange for them providing a 'solution' to the 'problem' that they caused.

They had thought that their 'israel versus iran' problem would be sufficient to lever the planetary populace into a middle east focused global war. It did not work since so many of us were watching for so long.

Note, and you may certainly argue with me, that the planetary populace focus on the potential for a [nu-war] beginning with the [israeli mistake] has contributed to the destruction of potential emotional energy for that war to exist. Also note i am not saying anything more than words from hph *participated* in the process of grounding that potential war. It works on an energetic level beyond the condensate matter plane which is the 'place' where your body, the planet, universe and all the pies exist. It works at this energetic level by concentrating 'attention' which is a form of 'directly focused consciousness (note...little 'c' consciousness, not BIG 'C"). This directly focused consciousness acts as a spot light may act on a particularly vulnerable area of a house, which is to say, preventing burglary and other mischief due to the 'exposure' to the whole neighborhood.

So they fell back to Plan 'B'..... also please note that tptw (the powers that were) undoubtedly have Plan B as a bolded statement in their minds. This is due to their whole attitude of "we are the grown-ups in this world" and we have 'really really serious plans'. Yeah..right (sarcastic derision here).

The Plan B, it appears, is to generate a war between amongst the Korean peoples. Nope, not as good as getting the whole planetary populace whipped up about the Israeli's and Jews versus the Farsi and Islamists, but hey? what can you do...it's a plan B. Ok, so mostly Korea is too far away from the energy (oil) center of the planet, (note that location matters to tptw in their majic plots, so to have to move their war is quite irritating indeed), and outside the usual emotional framework of the hundreds of millions of sheeple that tptw (the powers that were) are trying to herd, but what the hell. In cases of desperation, you take what you can get.

So they are trying to promote this latest [nu-war] effort into their [coup-de-grace] that would, in their twisted reptilian minds, lead to WW3, then the N W O, and their wet dream of the great harvest of souls.

They are desperately working their Plan B, this is, by the way, their response to the Chinese submarine continental ballistic missile signal off the coast of California. All this **** is connected...in case you were not paying attention. The Plan B, again as an aside, is no where near their ideal energy draining control-of-planetary-humans optimum, and they, that is the former powers-that-be, are in a desperate, and intensely fearful state, as they realize just how shaky their position has become. They know they are in deep and sinking fast.

So look for them to be both stupid, and careless.

Since the former-powers-that-be are trapped in ritualistic, even reptilian, thinking, they will re-run one of their previous hits, which is to say, expect another 'gulf of tonkin' incident. Only this time in the seas off of Korea, and considerably more violent. In fact, judging from our emotional quantifiers and the steady erosion of emotional tone sums within the FPTB (Former ThePowersThatBe) entity in our modelspace, they will likely have to pretty much totally destroy at least 1/one large, American carrier group in the Gulf Of Tonkin Incident, Part Deaux.

Now please note...if you are ignorant of what the Gulf of Tonkin Incident is, and how it affected your life and the social fabric of the planet, you should go look it up now. We will wait till you get back...

http://www.halfpasthuman.com/mastery.html

[Carmody]

This may bring more perspective of the dangers in this situation. look at the percentages, and then understand a bit more about potential positions of the North Korean People and governing bodies.

North Korea lost close to 30% of its population as a result of US bombings in the 1950s

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=viewArticle&code=CHO20101127&articleId=22131

This is about 100x times number (population percentage wise) of deaths the US suffered during WWII.

Imagine taking somewhere in the area of 17 of the US states and having them cease to exist, in totality.

[irishspirit]

SEOUL, Nov. 29 (Yonhap) -- Large-scale joint naval drills between South Korea and the United States off the Korean Peninsula's west coast went into their second day Monday, stepping up their warning against any further provocations by North Korea which has bristled over the maneuvers.

Led by a massive U.S. aircraft carrier, the USS George Washington, the allies started the four-day drills Sunday in the wake of the North's deadly artillery attack on an inhabited South Korean island that killed four South Koreans, including two marines.

Monday's "high-intensity" drills far south of the tense Yellow Sea border with the North were to be focused on defense against attacks by North Korea's submarines and guided missiles, officials for the South's Joint Chiefs of Staff (JCS) said.

"Monday's drills include a live-fire exercise by multiple aircraft from the George Washington, which will shoot mock targets in waters," a JCS official said on condition of anonymity.

http://english.yonhapnews.co.kr/news/2010/11/28/19/0200000000AEN20101128006300315F.HTML

[Zook]

Hi Irishspirit,


Plan 'B'.....
[...]


I would suggest that the brewing battle of the Koreas is Plan C.

Plan B being the (abandoned??) battle of the former British Crown colonials (India and Pakistan).

Plan A being the (abandoned??) battle of Armageddon in the land of prophets, messiahs and moshiachs.



Since the former-powers-that-be are trapped in ritualistic, even reptilian, thinking, they will re-run one of their previous hits, which is to say, expect another 'gulf of tonkin' incident. Only this time in the seas off of Korea, and considerably more violent. In fact, judging from our emotional quantifiers and the steady erosion of emotional tone sums within the FPTB (Former ThePowersThatBe) entity in our modelspace, they will likely have to pretty much totally destroy at least 1/one large, American carrier group in the Gulf Of Tonkin Incident, Part Deaux.
[...]


Agreed. Of course, FUBARPTB would be a closer description.

:typing:

[jcocks]

03N2irkKOho
In my reality I am choosing to visualize an outcome where war is not the answer this time. If we can get more of us on this site and others around the world to do the same, maybe just maybe, we can tip the scales toward a peaceful solution.

What we really need is for people to WAKE UP. WE need the sort of peaceful protests we had before the Iraq war - only larger.

But do you think it'll happen? I live in hope.

People of the earth - you are on notice :

***** WAKE THE F*CK UP BEFORE IT'S TOO LATE! ******

All my love to everyone everywhere :)

[bashi]

North Korea's undercover journalists reveal misery of life in dictatorship :

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/southkorea/8165274/North-Koreas-undercover-journalists-reveal-misery-of-life-in-dictatorship.html

[xeon]

North Korea's undercover journalists reveal misery of life in dictatorship :

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/southkorea/8165274/North-Koreas-undercover-journalists-reveal-misery-of-life-in-dictatorship.html

But then again, so is the supposedly "better" Western world, except in this case, they are in chains, and they know it not.

What better way to enslave someone than to do it without them being aware of it. ;)

[HURRITT ENYETO]

Plan 'B'.....

with respect, and awareness, let us begin...

They, the powers that used to be, are trying it again.

You know, the whole 'problem, response, solution' thing that they use to control large numbers of mostly hypnotized people on this planet. They create a 'problem' that causes you to go into fear mode which is chemically triggered by the R-complex in your lower brain matrix, and then they control you through your emotions by manipulating events such that you agree to give them your power in exchange for them providing a 'solution' to the 'problem' that they caused.

They had thought that their 'israel versus iran' problem would be sufficient to lever the planetary populace into a middle east focused global war. It did not work since so many of us were watching for so long.

Note, and you may certainly argue with me, that the planetary populace focus on the potential for a [nu-war] beginning with the [israeli mistake] has contributed to the destruction of potential emotional energy for that war to exist. Also note i am not saying anything more than words from hph *participated* in the process of grounding that potential war. It works on an energetic level beyond the condensate matter plane which is the 'place' where your body, the planet, universe and all the pies exist. It works at this energetic level by concentrating 'attention' which is a form of 'directly focused consciousness (note...little 'c' consciousness, not BIG 'C"). This directly focused consciousness acts as a spot light may act on a particularly vulnerable area of a house, which is to say, preventing burglary and other mischief due to the 'exposure' to the whole neighborhood.

So they fell back to Plan 'B'..... also please note that tptw (the powers that were) undoubtedly have Plan B as a bolded statement in their minds. This is due to their whole attitude of "we are the grown-ups in this world" and we have 'really really serious plans'. Yeah..right (sarcastic derision here).

The Plan B, it appears, is to generate a war between amongst the Korean peoples. Nope, not as good as getting the whole planetary populace whipped up about the Israeli's and Jews versus the Farsi and Islamists, but hey? what can you do...it's a plan B. Ok, so mostly Korea is too far away from the energy (oil) center of the planet, (note that location matters to tptw in their majic plots, so to have to move their war is quite irritating indeed), and outside the usual emotional framework of the hundreds of millions of sheeple that tptw (the powers that were) are trying to herd, but what the hell. In cases of desperation, you take what you can get.

So they are trying to promote this latest [nu-war] effort into their [coup-de-grace] that would, in their twisted reptilian minds, lead to WW3, then the N W O, and their wet dream of the great harvest of souls.

They are desperately working their Plan B, this is, by the way, their response to the Chinese submarine continental ballistic missile signal off the coast of California. All this **** is connected...in case you were not paying attention. The Plan B, again as an aside, is no where near their ideal energy draining control-of-planetary-humans optimum, and they, that is the former powers-that-be, are in a desperate, and intensely fearful state, as they realize just how shaky their position has become. They know they are in deep and sinking fast.

So look for them to be both stupid, and careless.

Since the former-powers-that-be are trapped in ritualistic, even reptilian, thinking, they will re-run one of their previous hits, which is to say, expect another 'gulf of tonkin' incident. Only this time in the seas off of Korea, and considerably more violent. In fact, judging from our emotional quantifiers and the steady erosion of emotional tone sums within the FPTB (Former ThePowersThatBe) entity in our modelspace, they will likely have to pretty much totally destroy at least 1/one large, American carrier group in the Gulf Of Tonkin Incident, Part Deaux.

Now please note...if you are ignorant of what the Gulf of Tonkin Incident is, and how it affected your life and the social fabric of the planet, you should go look it up now. We will wait till you get back...

http://www.halfpasthuman.com/mastery.html

No offence but i thought we were over the whole Clif High thing.

[HURRITT ENYETO]

North and South Korea move close to war footing
North and South Korea have moved closer to a war footing around the Yellow Sea island targeted in last week's artillery strike as tensions in the region continue to rise.

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/telegraph/multimedia/archive/01773/korea_1773008b.jpg

Pyongyang on Sunday moved SA2 surface-to-air missiles nearer to its Yellow Sea coast, according to South Korean military officials quoted by the Yonhap news agency. The officials said they also detected signs that North Korea was preparing multiple-launch rocket systems in the same area.
North Korea issued fresh warnings of military action, threatening to "deal a merciless military counterattack" at any "intrusion" into its territorial waters. The rhetoric came as four days of US- South Korean naval exercises in the Yellow Sea, involving the aircraft carrier George Washington, got under way - a deployment which the Pyongyang regime says has brought the region to the "brink of war."
The US has also agreed to a South Korean request to deploy the E8-C Joint Surveillance Target Attack Radar System (JSTARS), used in the 1991 Gulf War, according to military sources quoted by Yonhap. The deployment was approved by the US Defense Secretary, Robert Gates.
RELATED ARTICLES
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North Korea nuclear test: state ignores UN and fires more missiles28 Nov 2010
The former Republican presidential candidate, Senator John McCain, yesterday became the first senior US figure to advocate "regime change" in North Korea, though he insisted he was not supporting military action against the North.
North Korea yesterday fired several artillery rounds inside its territory near the island of Yeongpyeong, triggering a brief outbreak of panic among journalists and the few remaining residents who feared a repeat of Tuesday's attack. All those on the island were ordered to take cover in bunkers for about 40 minutes.
Late yesterday, the South Korean government expelled all journalists from Yeongpyeong, saying it could no longer guarantee their safety.
South Korea last night reacted coolly to a proposal by China for emergency talks on the crisis. In its first significant intervention in the dispute, Beijing, North Korea's closest ally, suggested an urgent meeting later this week of the six nations which have been taking part in negotiations on Pyongyang's nuclear programme.
But these so-called "six-party talks," involving the US, China, Japan, Russia and the two Koreas themselves, have been stalled for more than eighteen months amid mounting evidence that the North continues to race ahead with its nuclear programme. Earlier this month, Pyongyang unveiled an ultra-modern centrifuge facility to manufacture highly enriched uranium, a key ingredient in nuclear weapons.
Washington and Seoul say the six-party talks should not resume until North Korea is prepared to make a serious offer of disarmament, insisting that Pynongyang must not be "rewarded" for bad behaviour.
China's move is likely to confirm fears that North Korea staged last week's attack to strengthen its hand in the nuclear negotiations and get itself back to the table without needing to make concessions.
"South Korea will take note of China's proposal," South Korea's foreign ministry said in a statement. "But holding a six-party chief delegates' meeting should be studied very carefully considering" North Korea's series of provocations, it said. President Lee Myung-bak was reported to have told a Chinese envoy that he would not accept the proposal.
The naval exercise, being held at least fifty miles south of Yeongpyeong, involves about ten ships of the US and South Korean fleets. "The intensity for the Yellow Sea drills will be higher than planned," said an official of the South's Joint Chiefs of Staff.
"Participating troops will conduct live-fire shooting and bombing drills."
President Lee will address the nation later today (mon) amid growing public anger at his government's failure to deal more firmly with the crisis. The country remains on "Watchcon 2," only one alert level below all-out war.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/northkorea/8166251/North-and-South-Korea-move-close-to-war-footing.html

[HURRITT ENYETO]

Kim Jong-il 'laying the ground for succession' with military attacks
Palace power-struggles between North Korea's new-generation political leadership and its hawkish military establishment could spark off a full war on the Peninsula, South Korean and US authorities are warning.

By Praveen Swami, Diplomatic Editor 6:54PM GMT 28 Nov 2010
Last week's attack on Yeonpyeong island, a senior South Korean defence official told The Daily Telegraph, was personally approved by North Korea's supreme leader, Kim Jong-il and his son and heir-apparent Kim Jong-un, in an effort to curry favour with hostile military hawks.
"I fear we're going to see much more fighting in weeks to come," the official said.
Hardship has mounted in North Korea ever since sanctions were imposed to punish its pursuit of nuclear weapons. Hundreds of North Korean soldiers are reported to have fled across the border into China seeking food in recent months. In August, a North Korean pilot's attempt to escape to Russia ended when his jet crashed in China's Liaoning province.

But Kim Jong-il, US government sources said, is determined not to rejoin talks aimed at curbing North Korea's nuclear programme in return for aid, fearful of upsetting military leaders. He hopes precipitating a crisis will lead the generals to rally behind his son and compel South Korea and the West to engage in dialogue on his terms.
Kim Jong-un was made a four-star general and named vice-chairman of the country's National Defence Commission in September – even though the Swiss-educated 27-year-old had no military experience. "The generals saw Kim Jong-un as a puppy who wasn't even lavatory trained," said Kongdan Oh Hassig, a North Korea expert, "not a credible leader. There was lots of fuming."
Bruce Bennett, another North Korea specialist, said the succession left generals "asking themselves how much longer they would have a role in government". He noted that replacements of officials in North Korea "usually occur as the result of a purge or a 'traffic accident,' so that could be cause for some instability."
"Every time there's been a succession in North Korea," Dr. Hassig noted, "you've had trouble, because the leadership has needed to reassure the military."
Kim Jong-il ordered the bombing of a Korean Air plane in 1987, killing all 115, and an attack on officials which left 17 dead.
Little noticed in the West, tensions with the military have often threatened North Korea's ruling family. In 1991-1992, there were reports that a group of generals had been planning to assassinate Kim Il-sung, in order to implement a programme of radical modernisation. Later, in 1995, elements of North Korea's VI corps in famine-hit North Hamgyong province almost revolted.
"The Kims are playing the Crazed Fearsome Cripple Gambit," a US military official told The Daily Telegraph, referring to a term coined by the strategic analyst George Friedman.
North Korea's regime, Mr Friedman argued, wilfully chose to be an economically-crippled state to make itself unattractive as a target for intervention. Then it sought to inspire fear by developing nuclear weapons.
Finally, Mr Friedman argued, "having established that they were crippled and fearsome, the critical element was to establish their insanity". Since no one would wish for a nuclear-armed North Korea to engage in a crazed military adventure, it would give the regime what it wanted.
Both Koreas are now holding out threats of further fighting. North Korea's official news agency warned on Saturday that the "situation on the Korean peninsula is inching closer to the brink of war".
Lieutenant General Yoo Nak Joon, commander of the South Korean Marine Corps, meanwhile, called on his troops to "put our feelings of rage and animosity in our bones and take our revenge on North Korea".
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/northkorea/8166343/Kim-Jong-il-laying-the-ground-for-succession-with-military-attacks.html

[kinsuemei2]

Nuclear war? Please!!, if anything China will turn around and say you know publicly we will say blah blah blah, but if you guys need to go in, you have our approval just make sure you let us get our foot in the door on the reestablished parliament that put into place, China have their plans, and they very sneaky and devious, but the last thing they need is a war.

The USA is the economic position Russia was just before the soviet collapse we can’t afford a war, and China does not believe America is worth the trouble, ultimately it’s not going to be long before they call the shots, as they are slowly becoming the landlords and were only the tenants.
Now throw a date at me that predicts the next looming apocalypse because I don’t quite have enough manure to cover central park yet but were for sure getting there.

[irishspirit]

Tensions are heightening in the area around Yeonpyeong Island, with the confirmation that North Korean forces deployed multi-launch rocket systems (MLRSs) forward to a coastal location facing the island and opened additional naval artillery firing ports on Sunday, the first day of joint South Korea-U.S. exercises. The North Korean military was also reported to have stepped up its anti-air posture targeting aerial activity by South Korean fighter planes, with the forward deployment of SA-2 earth-to-air missiles in the area north of Baengnyeong and Yeonpyeong Islands.

“The North Korean military was found to have deployed some of its 122 mm MLRSs forward to an inland area near Kaemori, from which the attack on Yeonpyeong Island was launched, and opened additional 76.2 mm naval artillery firing ports besides the previous fourteen locations,” said a military official said Sunday. “The South Korean military is also stepping up its alertness posture to prepare for a potential provocation situation.”

http://english.hani.co.kr/arti/english_edition/e_northkorea/451190.html

¤=[Post Update]=¤

FULL text of President Lee's speech
Quote

Fellow Koreans,

Today, I am standing here keenly aware that I am responsible for not having been able to protect the lives and property of the people. I understand very well that you were greatly disappointed with how we responded to the shelling of Yeonpyeongdo (Yeonpyeong Island) by North Korea.

I feel enormous frustration and regret over the fact that innocent lives were lost and the homes and livelihood of the islanders were devastated.

I pray for the repose of the souls of Staff Sergeant Seo Jung-woo and Lance Corporal Moon Kwang-wook as well as the two civilian casualties-Mr. Kim Chi-baek and Mr. Bae Bok-chul. I also once again extend my heartfelt condolences to their families. I hope that those who were injured will recover quickly. I promise to urgently come up with the comprehensive measures to help the islanders of Yeonpyeongdo.

Fellow citizens,
North Korea's provocation this time was entirely different and unprecedented in nature. Since the end of the Korean War, the North has perpetrated numerous provocations, but it has never launched a direct attack onto our territory before. Making matters worse, it indiscriminately shelled the island where some 1,400 residents are peacefully living.

A military attack against civilians is strictly prohibited even in time of war; it is a crime against humanity.

Only a few meters away from where shells landed, there is a school where classes were going on. I am outraged by the ruthlessness of the North Korean regime, which is even indifferent to the lives of little children.
Countries around the world are joining us in denouncing North Korea.

We have thus far tolerated provocations by the North time and again. On January 21, 1968, North Korean commandos infiltrated into Seoul with the intent of killing the President. A bomb explosion in Rangoon, Burma, set off by North Korean agents, killed many high-ranking South Korean Government officials who were accompanying the President. The North has already tried and failed twice to kill the South Korean head of state. North Korean agents blew up a civilian airplane in 1987, taking the lives of 115 passengers.

South Korea nonetheless endured these continual provocations because we entertained a slight hope that the North would change course someday and an unwavering commitment to peace on the Korean Peninsula. Over the past 20 years, therefore, South Korea has striven to resolve the North Korean nuclear issue through dialogue and collaboration while at the same time providing unstinted humanitarian assistance.

North Korea, on the other hand, responded with a series of provocative acts, including the development of a nuclear program, the sinking of the Navy corvette Cheonan by an explosion and the shelling of Yeonpyeongdo.

At long last, we came to a realization that it no longer makes sense for us to anticipate that the North would abandon its nuclear program or its policy of brinkmanship on its own. The South Korean people now unequivocally understand that prolonged endurance and tolerance will spawn nothing but more serious provocations.

Those who have so far supported the North Korean regime might now see its true colors.

We are aware of the historic lesson that a disgraceful peace achieved through intimidation only brings about greater harm in the end. Only courage that defies retreat under any threat or provocation will bring about genuine peace. If the North commits any additional provocations against the South, we will make sure that it pays a dear price without fail.

I have confidence in the courage and potential of the citizens of Korea. We are a great people who, as of this year, have built the world's seventh largest export powerhouse in the face of the North's incessant menace and belligerence. In the current national crisis situation, the Korean people have demonstrated patriotism and composure.

Many young men and women went to the wake of the young soldiers who were killed in action. Citizens have volunteered to collect donations and have gone about their business with fortitude. The Republic of Korea is going to be safe and sound because of you.

There was a split in public opinion over the torpedoing of the Cheonan. Unlike that time, our people have united as one this time. Amid such unity and determination, any surreptitious attempt to create divisiveness in the nation will have no chance of success. Along with all the citizens of the Republic, I will never retreat.

The international community, too, is supporting us. Leaders of the United States, Japan, Germany and the United Kingdom as well as Russia and many other countries condemned the act of brutality by the North and are standing in full support of our position. Especially, as our ally, the United States has demonstrated a strong resolve to respond by taking action.

Fellow Koreans,
The courageous members of our Armed Forces have fought well. Some soldiers dashed to fulfill their duties without even noticing that the camouflage on their helmets had caught fire in the barrage of live shells. Those who were on leave of absence promptly returned to their units.

Citizens of Korea,
From now on, the Government will do whatever is required of it without fail.

The Government will establish Armed Forces that live up to their name. We will defend the five West Sea Islands near the northern sea border with a watertight stance against any kind of provocation. We will proactively carry out the defense reform as planned in order to make our Armed Forces even stronger.

Fellow Koreans,
Now is the time we have to demonstrate our determination with actions rather than many words.

I plead with you to have confidence in the Government and the Armed Forces and rally around our cause.

Unity is the best national security measure.

Thank you very much.

[jackovesk]

Obviously - Don't take this as Gospel

But Ben Fulford has a different take on why North Korea shelled South Korea.


Weekly Geopolitical News and Analysis101129: North Korean attack linked to dismantling of North Korean spy network in Japan.

Last week’s North Korean artillery barrage against South Korea was a response to the arrest of Yamaguchi gumi Yakuza syndicate number two Kiyoshi Takayama. Takayama was a senior North Korean agent in Japan and his arrest was part of the dismantling of the North Korean spy network in Japan. The arrest also marks a fundamental change in the secret Japanese government and is part of a comprehensive defeat for the Federal Reserve Board crime syndicate and their proxies. The Feds have responded by trying to start a war in the Korean Peninsula. They are also threatening to seize Japanese owned-factories in North America, starting with Toyota and Honda.

http://benjaminfulford.typepad.com/benjaminfulford/

Like I said before, Don't believe anything that Fulford says but he does make a bit of sense here. Don't shoot the messenger!

[Carmody]

Another interesting combination of events. What truth is contained in either is up for debate, but there they are as an interesting pair:

http://educate-yourself.org/cn/napolitanoshippingstraightjacket27nov10.shtml

Napolitano Halts Shipment of Packages from Japan as Prelude to Civilian 'Shipper' ID Lockdown (Nov. 27, 2010)

For TV entertainment, we normally watch video tapes of Japanese TV sent to us by my wife's relatives living in Japan. We were just notified today from the relative in Japan who sends the box with the tapes that he couldn't send the box to the USA, but the Japanese postal clerk didn't know why when asked for the reason.

We then took a look at Japanese postal web sites to try to find out what's going on and discovered that Janet Napolitano, loyal minion of the NWO takeover agenda and obedient lapdog to the Indonesian Usurper in the White House, had set up new Department of Homeland Security (DHS) shipping restrictions on November 17, 2010 that blocks the shipping of any NON COMMERCIAL parcel into the United States that weighs more than 0.9 pounds (under 16 ounces) without first supplying the Social Security number (or taxpayer ID number) of the RECEPIENT of the package (and it's likely that the new DHS shipping restriction will soon also apply to detailed ID requirements on the part of the person sending the package as well).


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

And Fulford: Same as Jack's quote, above.

I also recall back in 1993(?) or so, when Bush I was in the hot seat, that Toyota tried to bring a 'over-unity' motored car into the US. Timeline wise that was seemingly the point of the origin of the, at that time, big import tax or duty proposed against all Toyota vehicles imported, combined with a direct attack against Toyota and attempt to shut down their US factories. The car supposedly had a Minato motor derivative in it as a motive device, and required nothing. Zip. Nada. Just go. (The Minato motor is an over unity motor, electromagnetic and magnet based, from Japan)


The information on the Toyota/Minato vehicle came over the Reuters news service line and had disappeared after ONE news reading, within minutes of it's original issuance.

if I had not been there for it, I never would have believed it.

I was sharing a space with my Brother at the time. He heard it on his alarm clock about 10:am or so in the morning. he got up..and immediately called the office of the radio station to get the specifics. The DJ had the original piece of paper in his hand,and had read it onto the air in the morning news slot for 10am. He went back to the teletype electronic set up they had and found that when he tried to get the original and get more or alternative information..that it was wholly gone. Nothing. Zip, nada. All that remained was the original sheet of printed paper in the radio Station DJ's hand.

That is when the mid/early-90's attack on Japanese imports by Bush I began? Right after that. It may not have been Bush, Clinton was in office by then, maybe. But that is the sequence of events, from my person bit of intrigue I seemingly found or stumbled into.

[HURRITT ENYETO]

Nuclear war? Please!!, if anything China will turn around and say you know publicly we will say blah blah blah, but if you guys need to go in, you have our approval just make sure you let us get our foot in the door on the reestablished parliament that put into place, China have their plans, and they very sneaky and devious, but the last thing they need is a war.

The USA is the economic position Russia was just before the soviet collapse we can’t afford a war, and China does not believe America is worth the trouble, ultimately it’s not going to be long before they call the shots, as they are slowly becoming the landlords and were only the tenants.

Now throw a date at me that predicts the next looming apocalypse because I don’t quite have enough manure to cover central park yet but were for sure getting there.


I remember thinking something similar when it was stated that South Korea has just found a large deposit of its own rare earths, SK stated that it could no longer be reliant on China for these minerals and wants to be self sufficiant.I could imagine China wanting to get its hands on those Rare Earths to futher strengthen its strangle hold over the west and world in general. Just let them fight it out and then China can move in control the whole area.

[irishspirit]

Seoul warns: 'dear price' if North Korea attacks again

Seoul, South Korea (CNN) -- South Korean President Lee Myung-bak warned Monday that North Korea will face severe consequences if it launches another military attack across its southern border.

"If the North commits any additional provocations against the South, we will make sure that it pays a dear price without fail," he said in a nationally televised address.

"We are aware of the historic lesson that a disgraceful peace achieved through intimidation only brings about greater harm in the end."

South Korea has reportedly deployed more long-range artillery and rocket launchers on Yeonpyeong Island, a border island struck by a North Korean shelling last week, according to military officials.

The officials' remarks were reported Monday by the Yonhap news agency in Seoul.

The report comes as joint military exercises between South Korea and the United States continue in the Yellow Sea and tensions with North Korea continue to brew.

http://edition.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/asiapcf/11/29/koreas.crisis/?hpt=T2

[irishspirit]

Nuclear war? Please!!, if anything China will turn around and say you know publicly we will say blah blah blah, but if you guys need to go in, you have our approval just make sure you let us get our foot in the door on the reestablished parliament that put into place, China have their plans, and they very sneaky and devious, but the last thing they need is a war.

The USA is the economic position Russia was just before the soviet collapse we can’t afford a war, and China does not believe America is worth the trouble, ultimately it’s not going to be long before they call the shots, as they are slowly becoming the landlords and were only the tenants.
Now throw a date at me that predicts the next looming apocalypse because I don’t quite have enough manure to cover central park yet but were for sure getting there.

Any war involving China and the US will lead to Nuclear war! I cannot see any other way around that. Do I think that China/US want war with each other? NO! However, do I see them allowing America and the South overthrowing the North? NO! Why? Because China has a vested interest in the North. China can use the North to its own advantage. To say that China will say to America "we want a stajke in who you put in ans that we want in with you"; shows a level of ignorance that I am quite surprised at.

Do you really think that China will allow America to build on it's empire within their Region of the world? Really, come on!

Yes, China is slowly taking over not just Asia, but indeed the World! However, they have done it in a way which has earned them Friends! Not through pure aggression and force, but through smart lending and excellent trade agreements. Unlike Americas which has used force and aggression . However, China is a massive Dog that I would not want taking a bite out of me.

Peace


Irish

[irishspirit]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O0oxY25EA2o&feature=player_embedded#!

[Rocky_Shorz]

thanks Wiki...


Wikileaks reveals China ready for reunified Korea and ready to abandon North Korea



In highly sensitive discussions in February this year, the-then South Korean vice-foreign minister, Chun Yung-woo, told a US ambassador, Kathleen Stephens, that younger generation Chinese Communist party leaders no longer regarded North Korea as a useful or reliable ally and would not risk renewed armed conflict on the peninsula

• South Korea's vice-foreign minister said he was told by two named senior Chinese officials that they believed Korea should be reunified under Seoul's control, and that this view was gaining ground with the leadership in Beijing.

• China's vice-foreign minister told US officials that Pyongyang was behaving like a "spoiled child" to get Washington's attention in April 2009 by carrying out missile tests.



• A Chinese ambassador warned that North Korean nuclear activity was "a threat to the whole world's security".

• Chinese officials assessed that it could cope with an influx of 300,000 North Koreans in the event of serious instability, according to a representative of an international agency, but might need to use the military to seal the border.

South Korean vice-foreign minister, Chun Yung-woo, said the PRC would be comfortable with a reunified Korea controlled by Seoul and anchored to the US in a 'benign alliance' – as long as Korea was not hostile towards China. Tremendous trade and labour-export opportunities for Chinese companies, Chun said, would also help 'salve' PRC concerns about … a reunified Korea.

A senior Chinese official, speaking off the record, also said China's influence with the North was frequently overestimated. But Chinese public opinion was increasingly critical of the North's behaviour, the official said, and that was reflected in changed government thinking.

link (http://beforeitsnews.com/story/285/875/)

[Elandiel BernElve]

Cool down irish spirit... especially with your claims concerning a definite nucleair war in case of a hypothetical fight between China and the US.

Rocky_Shorz is right, China is divided about the usefulness of North Korea. They prefer the steady but not threatening presence of the west rather than a communist fool's son with a nucleair army in Korea.

Nucleair war is impossible nowadays, the only reason nucleair arsenals still exist is for the sole purpose to terrify potential enemies into never attacking the concerning nucleair superpower.
It's a weapon that's most effective when never fired.

You end your post with peace, maybe you should trust a little more in peace.
I'm sorry for my agitation, I read a lot on Avalon these days and I keep on reading posts from people just shouting around their first thoughts or fears when the actual true information/sitrep can be found just around the corner.

It's a forum of truth, as it should remain. A lot is happening right now:
- financial crisis
- korea crisis
- wikileaks
- oil spill
- worldwide tensions
- missile launches
- extreme winter coming up
- massive protests against reforms

It's imperative we keep our heads cool and seperate FACT from fiction and personal fears.
So bring your sources when making a claim:)

Love & Peace

[irishspirit]

Cool down irish spirit... especially with your claims concerning a definite nucleair war in case of a hypothetical fight between China and the US.

Rocky_Shorz is right, China is divided about the usefulness of North Korea. They prefer the steady but not threatening presence of the west rather than a communist fool's son with a nucleair army in Korea.

Nucleair war is impossible nowadays, the only reason nucleair arsenals still exist is for the sole purpose to terrify potential enemies into never attacking the concerning nucleair superpower.
It's a weapon that's most effective when never fired.

You end your post with peace, maybe you should trust a little more in peace.
I'm sorry for my agitation, I read a lot on Avalon these days and I keep on reading posts from people just shouting around their first thoughts or fears when the actual true information/sitrep can be found just around the corner.

It's a forum of truth, as it should remain. A lot is happening right now:
- financial crisis
- korea crisis
- wikileaks
- oil spill
- worldwide tensions
- missile launches
- extreme winter coming up
- massive protests against reforms

It's imperative we keep our heads cool and seperate FACT from fiction and personal fears.
So bring your sources when making a claim:)

Love & Peace

I am not stating a definite nuclear war. I do not even say a definite war! However, that is the way it will go should it kick off.

You stated that they prefer a western presence and not a "communist fool's son with a nuclear army in Korea", when China itself is a communist state with an unknown nuclear arm, no doubt having supplied the North with them.

To say Nuclear war is impossible is, in my view, wrong! Did they not say that it was impossible to attack the twin towers with planes? But it was done! Regardless by whom it was. Some nut job President in America, (and lets be honest they are not short of them) or a fool like the President of Korea to hit a switch. These are not restrained men! These are evil deranged man, with nothing to loss.

However, under no circumstances do I want a nuclear war, or any other type of war.

Remember this?

MORE than half of Chinese people questioned in a poll believe China and America are heading for a new “cold war”.

The finding came after battles over Taiwan, Tibet, trade, climate change, internet freedom and human rights which have poisoned relations in the three months since President Barack Obama made a fruitless visit to Beijing.

According to diplomatic sources, a rancorous postmortem examination is under way inside the US government, led by officials who think the president was badly advised and was made to appear weak.

In China’s eyes, the American response — which includes a pledge by Obama to get tougher on trade — is a reaction against its rising power.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/asia/article7017951.ece

It would not take much for the cold to turn into the hot. Remember who we are dealing with!!!

¤=[Post Update]=¤

Seoul, South Korea: Last week's deadly attack on Yeonpyeong island has escalated military and diplomatic tensions on the Korean Peninsula, and for some in the South Korean capital, Seoul, there is an increasing fear of North Korean retaliation.

Hence, evacuation centres were being prepared in the city on Monday, amidst mounting tensions.

There are 3919 emergency shelters across Seoul - many are housed in subway stations or underground carparks.

According to local officials, evacuation shelters can be easily reached by everyone within five minutes and can accommodate more than 20 million people.

http://www.ndtv.com/article/world/south-korea-prepares-emergency-shelters-69600

¤=[Post Update]=¤

US, Japan, South Korea to meet soon over crisis

Seoul, South Korea (CNN) -- Government ministers from the United States, Japan and South Korea will sit down in Washington early next month to grapple with the tensions in the Koreas, South Korea's Foreign Affairs Ministry said Tuesday.

The ministry did not provide further details about the date of the meeting, but it comes as China continues to call for an emergency meeting of the six major powers involved in talks about the Korean peninsula.

This diplomatic activity reflects efforts to lower anxieties in the Koreas, which have been at a boiling point since last Tuesday, when four people died and 18 others were injured in a North Korean artillery barrage that targeted Yeonpyeong Island in South Korea's part of the Yellow Sea.

The war of words got louder when South Korea and the United States launched joint anti-submarine military exercises in the Yellow Sea on Monday, a move that drew North Korean ire.

Being North Korea's largest trading partner and strongest ally, China has been urged by the international community to confront the crisis. It has been meeting with both North and South Korea and it has engaged in diplomacy over the matter.

http://edition.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/asiapcf/11/30/koreas.crisis/

[Hughe]

North Korea is controlled by the military industrial complex in western world?


Excerpt from Benjamin Fulford's blog:



Weekly Geopolitical News and Analysis101129: North Korean attack linked to dismantling of North Korean spy network in Japan

Last week’s North Korean artillery barrage against South Korea was a response to the arrest of Yamaguchi gumi Yakuza syndicate number two Kiyoshi Takayama. Takayama was a senior North Korean agent in Japan and his arrest was part of the dismantling of the North Korean spy network in Japan. The arrest also marks a fundamental change in the secret Japanese government and is part of a comprehensive defeat for the Federal Reserve Board crime syndicate and their proxies. The Feds have responded by trying to start a war in the Korean Peninsula. They are also threatening to seize Japanese owned-factories in North America, starting with Toyota and Honda.

[Carmody]

The information has been indicating for the past few years that the Nuclear capacity in N. Korea is directly associated with the Bush (via Pakistan) regime, at least in some circles....that's the story.

Hard to say about any of this.

[xeon]

This guy apparently made quite a number of successful prophecies in the past. Of course, he can always make a mistake, but he says back in July, 2010, he saw an aircraft carrier sunk by missile attack in Korean waters.

It is uncanny, but I've been hearing about the Chinese capability to take out aircraft carriers with new generation missiles (which they could have supplied North Korea with), and also currently, the USS George Washington (of all names) is there, trying to provoke a war and it is obvious to me, the Americans want to try another Gulf of Tonkin incident. Predictably they rejected China's call for 6 nation "emergency talks."

Anyway, make of it what you will. It should be obvious what they (PTB) want to do, whether it actually works out or not, is another issue.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GX_m313u-yU&feature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GX_m313u-yU&feature=related

[jahbless]

http://edition.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/asiapcf/11/30/koreas.george.washington/index.html?hpt=C1

CNN this morning bringing us special coverage from the USS George Washington.

That'll get it out there in the public eye...

[neptuneforce]

My boss was from Korea, South, he told me how to say thank you in Korean ...... kam-sam-ni-da

[Carmody]

As long as I don't have to eat any cabbage, I'm good to go.

[HURRITT ENYETO]

North Korea 'highly likely to attack South Korea again'

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/telegraph/multimedia/archive/01775/korea_1775257c.jpg

North Korea is “highly likely” to attack South Korea again as its ailing leader Kim Jong-il seeks to bolster the standing of his regime ahead of a planned handover of power, South Korea’s intelligence chief has warned.

“There is a high possiblity that the North will make another attack,” said Won Sei-hoon, director of South Korea’s National Intelligence Service told a parliamentary committee meeting in Seoul.
He added that phone-tap intelligence last August had hinted at the likelihood of an attack off South Korea’s west coast, months before last week’s shelling by North Korea of a South Korean island, killing four.
The attack had come against a backdrop of economic and political instability in the North, which is reeling under UN sanctions imposed last year after its second illegal nuclear weapons test.

“Internal complaints are growing about the North’s succession for a third generation, and its economic situation is worsening”, he told the committee.
His warning came as the US wrapped up its war games off the Korean peninsula on Wednesday. China continued to push for a resumption of the Six Party talks that would see North Korea receive economic aid in exchange for nuclear disarmament.
The four-day joint exercises involving the US supercarrier George Washington were designed as a show of deterrent force to the regime of Kim Jong-il following the shelling of a South Korean village a week ago that killed four.
The exercises, which were opposed by China as an unnecessary provocation, passed off without further incident, but tensions between North and South Korea remain high.
As the George Washington steamed out of the Yellow Sea, South Korea immediately announced live-fire naval exercises from 29 sites next week, as well as reports that it was deploying short-range surface-to-air missiles in Yeonpyeong, the island attacked by the North's artillery.
North Korea's latest provocation, coming weeks after it revealed a new uranium enrichment program, has revealed stark divisions within the international community over how best to deal with the regime in Pyongyang.
China has repeatedly called for a resumption of the stalled Six Party talks with China's foreign minister Yang Jiechi saying on Wednesday that all parties must avoid actions that "inflame the situation", according to the state-run Xinhua news agency.
"The parties concerned should keep calm and exercise restraint, and work to bring the situation back onto the track of dialogue and negotiation," the agency quoted Mr Yang as saying.
However Chinese overtures on the North's behalf have been firmly rejected by the US and its allies, Japan and South Korea, who say that resuming talks so soon would reward Pyongyang's attempts to bully the international community back to the table by use of force.
In a visible sign of the divisions, the US, Japan and South Korea will meet for talks on the crisis in Washington – not Beijing – next week, while China has invited two senior North Korean envoys to Beijing for talks this week.
The differences were also highlighted at the UN headquarters in New York where diplomats said that British and French efforts to censure Pyongyang for its artillery assault have been blocked by China.
"Against the wishes of the vast majority of the Security Council members, China is blocking any action on the uranium enrichment plant and there is not much hope of any talk about the attack," a diplomat told the AFP news agency.
"It [China] says it is unacceptable to condemn or even express concern over North Korea. Council talks have come to a standstill. It is now very likely that the Security Council will do nothing about North Korea," the diplomat added.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/southkorea/8173030/North-Korea-highly-likely-to-attack-South-Korea-again.html

[irishspirit]

North Korea Says South Korean Drills Push Pensinsula Tensions to `Extreme'

North Korea said South Korea is pushing tensions on the peninsula to an “uncontrollable extreme phase” by holding military exercises with the U.S. and staging a live-firing drill by naval artillery tomorrow.

South Korea “is so hell-bent on the moves to escalate the confrontation and start a war that it is recklessly behaving bereft of reason,” the state-run Korea Central News Agency said in a commentary today. North Korea is “maintaining a maximum self-possession and self-control,” it said.

The drills starting tomorrow will include live firing from ships into seas near Daecheong Island, South Korea’s Joint Chiefs of Staff said last week. North Korea said today shells will land in its territorial waters.

Tensions on the Korean Peninsula have increased since North Korea’s Nov. 23 shelling of South Korea’s Yeonpyeong island that killed two soldiers and two civilians. South Korea’s new defense minister, Kim Kwan Jin, two days ago vowed retaliation that would include airstrikes if North Korea made another attack.

“I will mobilize all combat capabilities available to severely punish the enemy,” Kim, former chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said at his confirmation hearing on Dec. 3. “I will surely use planes. This is a matter of self-defense.” KCNA said today that North Korea denounced the minister’s comments.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-12-04/north-korea-condemns-u-s-japan-south-korea-military-alliance.html

¤=[Post Update]=¤

SEOUL—North Korea's state media maintained its barrage of criticism at South Korea and the U.S. on Sunday, saying Seoul was "far from drawing a lesson from the deserved punishment" of the North's attack on the South's Yeonpyeong Island nearly two weeks ago.

The latest statement, issued by Korea Central News Agency, said South Korea is "getting more frantic in military provocations and war moves." The statement also showed that Pyongyang closely watched the confirmation hearing of South Korea's new defense minister, Kim Kwan-jin, on Friday.

Mr. Kim said that South Korea would respond to any fresh attacks by North Korea with air power, something that it didn't do during the Nov. 23 assault on Yeonpyeong, an island in the Yellow Sea just a few miles from the North Korean coastline. Four South Koreans, two civilians and two Marines, died in the attack.

South Korea has added new weaponry, including multiple rocket launchers, to the island since the attack. And officials have said they will continue to test artillery there, firing into waters that South Korea has long controlled.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703814404576000892448429826.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

[Rocky_Shorz]

come on guys, does anyone really think Obama's recent trip through the region was just financial?

While in India, we have a mysterious Chinese missile launch off the California coast which was vaporized...

I would say this was to show the other countries in the area that the weapons North Korea has received from China mean nothing...

It is the final hours, North Korea's Rabid dog, has bit one too many times, a sneeze and it's over, a united Korea will be created...

[Hughe]

come on guys, does anyone really think Obama's recent trip through the region was just financial?

While in India, we have a mysterious Chinese missile launch off the California coast which was vaporized...

I would say this was to show the other countries in the area that the weapons North Korea has received from China mean nothing...

It is the final hours, North Korea's Rabid dog, has bit one too many times, a sneeze and it's over, a united Korea will be created...

Hopefully, it will be done by peaceful manner. I live in South Korea.

By the way, a newly appointed ministry of defense department said "We will attack the North without discussing with U.S or UN military forces."
Which means the breach of international agreement between South Korean and other nations including U.S. So far, U.S can attack the North but not South Korea alone.
South Korea never had the right of independent strike against other nations.

The warmongers rule!

[Rocky_Shorz]

I'm really hoping Kim realizes what is best for his people is to unite the Koreas...

Give him a little authority for local affairs and move operations to the south...

none of us want to see a war...

[irishspirit]

N. Korea's Minisubmarines Equipped with Torpedos Discovered in North's Nampo

It has been found that North Korea has been running mini-submarines equipped with torpedos suggesting that the reclusive regime is planning more torpedo strikes.
According to South Korean intelligence sources satellite imagery have featured 4-meter-long torpedo launch tubes attached to North Korea minisubmarines facilitated in North Korea's westernmost naval base of Nampo.

http://www.arirang.co.kr/News/News_View.asp?nseq=109993&code=Ne2&category=2

[Fredkc]

Imagine that!!

1. Two countries gather their warships to practice strategy in a battle against an enemy, holding said 'practice' just off the enemy's shore.

2. Said enemy decides that this might be a perfect time to both a) observe and study said strategy, and b) hold practice sessions of their own about how to combat it.

The nerve of some people!!

[irishspirit]

SEOUL—North Korea state media on Thursday issued a statement that claimed possession of all waters around South Korea-controlled Yeonpyeong Island, clarifying for the first time that its Nov. 23 attack of the island was motivated by a different view of the inter-Korean maritime boundary in the Yellow Sea than is widely held.

North Korea has said since the attack that it was motivated because shells from an artillery test South Korea conducted on the island that day fell into its waters.

Military officials in South Korea have said that its test-firing that day was routine and was directed into South Korean waters south of the island. South Korea has long understood the maritime boundary to be in several miles north of the island and, as a result, directs its tests southward.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704447604576008183284284532.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

[irishspirit]

China Has Hit Back At US Comments Over North Korea,Tensions Rise

China has hit back at US comments criticising Beijing for not reining in its North Korean ally, saying military threats cannot resolve tensions on the Korean peninsula.

Earlier, US top general Adm Mike Mullen said China was "enabling" North Korea's "reckless behaviour".
Meanwhile, China's top diplomat has met North Korean leader Kim Jong-il in Pyongyang, amid rising tensions

http://hot-discovery.blogspot.com/2010/12/china-has-hit-back-at-us-comments-over.html

[irishspirit]

China stands with North Korea and criticises US threats

China has hit back at US criticism over North Korea saying military threats are not the answer.

The message came as China's most senior diplomat, Dai Bingguo, met with Kim Jong-il in a sign of Beijing's deep and continuing support for North Korea.

In the first meeting between the two allies since North Korea shelled a South Korean island at the end of last month, Mr Dai was reported to have presented Kim with presents and a greeting from Hu Jintao, the Chinese president.

Xinhua, the official Chinese news agency, described their meeting as "candid" and that the two men had agreed to boost their "friendly and co-operative relations".

North Korea, which has barely any other allies, depends heavily on China for aid and diplomatic support. Mr Dai had previously delayed his visit, in the light of the ongoing tension on the Korean peninsula, and his decision to visit Pyongyang was a strong gesture of support.

China's ties with North Korea have drawn increasing criticism from the United States, and Admiral Mike Mullen , the head of the US Joint Chiefs of Staff, remarked on Wednesday that he wished the Chinese would be more helpful.

"The Chinese have enormous influence over the North, influence that no other nation on earth enjoys. And yet, despite a shared interest in reducing tensions, they appear unwilling to use it," he said.

In response, the Chinese Foreign ministry questioned on Thursday what Mr Mullen had ever done "for peace and stability in the region".

http://www.independent.ie/world-news/asia-pacific/china-stands-with-north-korea-and-criticises-us-threats-2455119.html

¤=[Post Update]=¤

China delegation visits North Korea, expresses support for Kim Jong Il

The US was hoping that China, the only country with diplomatic influence over North Korea, would rebuke the country for shelling South Korea last month. But China appears intent on maintaining support for Kim Jong Il.

North Korean leader Kim Jong Il met with high-level Chinese officials on Thursday in North Korea's capital, Pyongyang, where China reaffirmed its relationship with its fellow communist state and maintained a neutral stance on North Korea's attack on South Korean forces last month.

North Korea, which hasn't explained why it shelled the South Korean island of Yeonpyeong, heightened tensions on the Korean Peninsula further by saying that the island is surrounded by North Korea-controlled waters. The internationally determined border is several miles to the north of the island, reports The Wall Street Journal.

China's stance has irked many American leaders and their allies who hoped that China, North Korea’s only ally, would apply pressure on Mr. Kim to stop his hawkish policies, reports BeijingNews.net.

Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Adm. Michael Mullen was among the loudest critics, sharply condemning China for its apparent unconditional support of North Korea. He had hoped that Chinese officials would express public disapproval of the North's Nov. 23 artillery strike. The shelling was the most violent exchange since the Korean War ended in 1953.

http://www.csmonitor.com/World/terrorism-security/2010/1209/China-delegation-visits-North-Korea-expresses-support-for-Kim-Jong-Il

¤=[Post Update]=¤

China, North Korea stand fast despite US anger

SEOUL — Communist allies North Korea and China proclaimed their unity Thursday as the North's leader Kim Jong-Il held his first meeting with a senior Chinese envoy since the region's worst crisis in years erupted.

China's most senior foreign policymaker Dai Bingguo visited Pyongyang as pressure intensifies on Beijing to rein in its neighbour, after North Korea's deadly shelling of a South Korean island inflamed tensions on the peninsula.

The top US military officer, Admiral Mike Mullen, accused China of aiding and abetting the hardline Kim regime's "reckless behaviour". But the old wartime allies are firmly together, dispatches from their official media said.

"The two sides reached consensus on bilateral relations and the situation on the Korean peninsula after candid and in-depth talks," said a brief report from China's Xinhua news agency, datelined Pyongyang, after Kim and Dai met.

North Korea's official news agency said the delegations discussed "issues of mutual concern" and efforts to improve friendly relations.

It marked the first time that Kim has met a senior foreign official since the North's shock artillery attack on the South Korean island, and since his regime startled the world by showing off a sophisticated new nuclear programme.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5iT5C3SV2Gq_cl_ycYVOuJ10T1W5Q?docId=CNG.c41db06392485b1ac24c577f6d55fb67.6b1

[Decibellistics]

So the Winter Solstice is coming up.........

[irishspirit]

SEOUL, South Korea -- North Korea warned Monday that U.S.-South Korean cooperation could bring a nuclear war to the region, as the South began artillery drills amid lingering tension nearly three weeks after the North's deadly shelling of a South Korean island.

The South's naval live-fire drills are scheduled to run Monday through Friday at 27 sites. The regularly scheduled exercises are getting special attention following a North Korean artillery attack on front-line Yeonpyeong Island that killed two South Korean marines and two civilians.

The Nov. 23 artillery barrage, the North's first assault to target a civilian area since the end of the 1950-53 Korean War, began after the North said South Korea first fired artillery toward its territorial waters. South Korea says it fired shells southward, not toward North Korea, as part of routine exercises.

After the attack, South Korea staged joint military drills with the United States and also pushed ahead with more artillery exercises, despite the North's warning that they would aggravate tension.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/12/13/AR2010121300133.html

[shadowstalker]

My future son in law maybe going to S Korea after his training is done.

[irishspirit]

shadow,

I wish him the best off luck. That will not be easy if these people start a war with each other. Much blessing to him.

[irishspirit]

(MOSCOW) -- Russia announced Tuesday that its armed forces in the east are on high alert. This comes in light of what it calls an "inadequate situation" on the Korean peninsula as tensions have increased in recent weeks between the North and South.

The head of Russia's military said they continue to follow what is happening and have taken measures to raise the forces' combat readiness.

http://www.nktoday.com/contents/view_content/7802/russian-armed-forces-on-high-alert-over-north-korea

[giovonni]

This is encouraging news :thumb:

15 December 2010 Last updated at 00:18 ET

US envoy Bill Richardson hopes to calm North Korea
http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/50430000/jpg/_50430866_010850023-1.jpg
Mr Richardson has good contacts with senior North Korean officials

Bill Richardson, governor of the US state of New Mexico, is travelling to North Korea on an unofficial diplomatic mission to ease regional tensions.

Mr Richardson, who has been to Pyongyang several times in recent years, said he hoped to persuade the North Koreans to "calm down a bit".

Tensions have been especially high between the two Koreas since the North shelled a South Korean island.

There are also renewed fears that the North has advanced its nuclear work.

The US State Department has said North Korea has "at least one other" uranium enrichment site in addition to the one shown to US experts last month.

And South Korean Foreign Minister Kim Sung-hwan said he believed there were facilities in North Korea aside from the Yongbyon site shown to the US scientists.

Uranium can be enriched to provide fuel for nuclear power reactors, as Pyongyang says it is doing, or it can be enriched more highly to provide material for nuclear weapons.

North Korea has conducted two nuclear tests and is believed to have enough plutonium to make about six bombs.

In a sign of how alarmed South Korean officials are by the renewed tensions with the North, the country has been holding its biggest-ever civil defence drill.

The drill was held in tandem with military live-fire exercises across the country.
Northern frustration?

The US State Department has said Mr Richardson is not delivering a message to the North Korean government for President Barack Obama.

He was invited to Pyongyang by Kim Gye-gwan, North Korea's lead negotiator in the stalled six-party talks on his country's nuclear disarmament talks.

Before leaving the US, Mr Richardson said he would talk to the White House on his return.

"My objective is to try to get North Korea to calm down a bit, see if we can reduce tension in the Korean peninsula," he said.

Analysts say his invitation is a sign of North Korea's frustration at being denied formal negotiations with the US.

Pyongyang and its main ally, China, have been calling for a resumption of the six-party talks.

But South Korea and the US have said the North must stop its "provocative and belligerent" behaviour and take action to roll back its nuclear work.

South Korea was shocked by the shelling of Yeonpyeong island on 23 November. Two soldiers and two civilians were killed in the barrage, which came after South Korea held live fire exercises in the area.

South Korea has reviewed its rules of engagement and promised air strikes in response to any future attacks.

The sinking of a South Korean warship, with the loss of 46 sailors, in March was blamed on North Korea. Pyongyang denies the accusation.

Source;
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-11997172

[irishspirit]

SEOUL (AFP) - – North Korea's military threatened Friday to strike back with deadly firepower if South Korea goes ahead with a live-fire drill on a border island which the communist state shelled last month.

The North "will deal the second and third unpredictable self-defensive blow" to protect its territorial waters if the South holds the one-day drill scheduled sometime between Saturday and Tuesday, it said.

"It will be deadlier than what was made on November 23 in terms of the powerfulness and sphere of the strike," said the military statement carried on the North's official news agency.

The bombardment of Yeonpyeong island last month killed two marines and two civilians, injured 18 people and damaged dozens of homes, and came after a firing drill into the sea by South Korean marines based on the island.

The latest warning sharply raised the stakes in the regional crisis, amid diplomatic moves to ease tensions. The news agency said the military's message was delivered earlier Friday to the South. Related article: SKorea drill risks 'chain reaction': US general

The South, outraged at the first shelling of civilian areas since the 1950-53 war, has fortified Yeonpyeong with more troops and artillery and vowed to use air power against any future attack.

Its military has said artillery will be aimed away from the North as usual during the upcoming drill, but it will respond strongly if provoked.

http://sg.news.yahoo.com/afp/20101217/tap-nkorea-skorea-us-military-nuclear-2a5be5e.html

[AlkaMyst]

This is some really scary stuff that is just developing to be a very unstable situation....this is serious stuff in my opinion!!!

http://d.yimg.com/a/p/afp/20101217/capt.photo_1292566129017-1-0.jpg?x=400&y=231&q=85&sig=AUMvDqpvdCLIEkOibzguLA--

Original Source, here. (http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20101217/ts_afp/nkoreaskoreamilitarynuclearwarning)



SEOUL (AFP) – North Korea warned that another war with South Korea would involve nuclear weapons, as diplomatic efforts continued to ease high tensions over its deadly artillery attack and atomic ambitions.

Uriminzokkiri, the official website of the communist state, said in a commentary seen Friday that war on the Korean Peninsula is only a matter of time.

"Because of the South Koreans' reckless war policies, it is not about war or peace on the Korean peninsula but when the war will break out," the website said.

"If war breaks out, it will lead to nuclear warfare and not be limited to the Korean peninsula," it said in a posting dated Thursday.

In a separate commentary, ruling party newspaper Rodong Sinmun Friday described the peninsula as the world's most dangerous place.

It reiterated calls for a formal peace treaty with Washington and the withdrawal of 28,500 US troops from South Korea.

"The Korean peninsula remains a region fraught with the greatest danger of war in the world," the paper said. "This is entirely attributable to the US pursuance of the policy of aggression against the DPRK (North Korea)."

The North frequently claims nuclear war is imminent. But military tensions have risen sharply since it bombarded a South Korean border island on November 23, killing two marines and two civilians.

Pyongyang's disclosure last month of an apparently working uranium enrichment plant -- a potential new source of bomb-making material -- also heightened regional security fears.

Prominent US politician Bill Richardson is paying a private visit to Pyongyang to try to ease tensions.

The US envoy to stalled talks on the North's nuclear disarmament, Sung Kim, was to hold talks in Seoul later Friday with his South Korean counterpart Wi Sung-Lac.

[Ahkenaten]

Hi Alka - North Korea has been making stridently militaristic threats for many years as its army faces the South Korean Army along their border eyeball to eyeball. This has been a very lucrative way of basically extorting all kinds of stuff from the Western world. Although it is by no means certain that the rule "pigs do not S^^T in their own pens" would prevail in this situation, i.e. any nuclear action against South Korea by the North would invaribly blow back upon the North in the form of radioactive fallout due to proximity - surely this would be a major concern to China who is a close neighbor. I would expect that China could and would make its presence and interests known should N. Korea get too out of hand - as the recent Wikileaks revealed, North Korea has no reason to be 100% certain that China will stick by it no matter what. Just a thought.

[AlkaMyst]

Hi Alka - North Korea has been making stridently militaristic threats for many years as its army faces the South Korean Army along their border eyeball to eyeball. This has been a very lucrative way of basically extorting all kinds of stuff from the Western world. Although it is by no means certain that the rule "pigs do not S^^T in their own pens" would prevail in this situation, i.e. any nuclear action against South Korea by the North would invaribly blow back upon the North in the form of radioactive fallout due to proximity - surely this would be a major concern to China who is a close neighbor. I would expect that China could and would make its presence and interests known should N. Korea get too out of hand - as the recent Wikileaks revealed, North Korea has no reason to be 100% certain that China will stick by it no matter what. Just a thought.

Thanks for the input Ahkenaten, I completely understand what you're saying and where you coming from....my only concern is that with all the S@#t going on at the present time, which is all come out so fast nothing at this point would surprise me really.

It would be nice if we just didn't have to deal with that headache on top of all the other ones we currently face. :)

Blessings,
AlkaMyst

[irishspirit]

The North Korean military threatened Friday that it would launch self-defense attacks after South Korean military authorities announced South Korean Marines on Yeonpyeong Island would restart live-fire drills on a day with clear weather between Dec. 18 and 21. Accordingly, concerns about a military clash are heightening.

In a message sent in the name of the head of the North Korean delegation to inter-Korean military talks, North Korea warned that if South Korea pushes ahead with its drills on Yeonpyeong Island despite its advanced warning, North Korea would carry out unpredictable second and third self-defensive strikes to protect its territorial waters. The message warned that the attacks would be more serious in terms of strength and scope than the artillery attack launched on Nov. 23, when North Korea shelled Yeonpyeong Island.

http://english.hani.co.kr/arti/english_edition/e_northkorea/454553.html

[Carmody]

December 21st, an eclipse on the solstice.

An exceedingly powerful day.

Be concerned.

[bluestflame]

get the funny feeling they are using this and other incidents to drive the push for a one world government under guise of getting all countries to call for an end to hostilities that could potentially escalate and spread to and effect other surrounding countries

[irishspirit]

Russia urges S Korea to scrap drill

Russia has asked South Korea to stop a scheduled joint military exercise with the United States, hours after North Korea warned it will strike back if the South proceeds with the drill.

The foreign ministry in Moscow on Friday summoned South Korean and US ambassadors to express its "deep concern" over South Korea's plans to carry out live-fire drills over the weekend.

The ministry in a statement called on Seoul to "refrain from holding the planned firing of artillery in order to prevent the further escalation of tensions on the Korean peninsula".

Russia's intervention follows a warning by North Korea earlier on Friday that it will retaliate if the South holds the drills near the disputed border in the Yellow Sea on Yeonpyeong Island, which the North shelled last month.

The ministry said a similar drill on November 23 had "provoked an exchange of fire ... that caused casualties", echoing North Korea's assertion that its shelling of the island was a response to South Korean artillery fire.

The Russian ministry also said it was "extremely important" to ease tension between the two Koreas, restore dialogue and resolve all disputes without using force.

Russia, a member of the six-party talks on North Korea's nuclear disarmament, hosted the North Korean foreign minister last week in a bid to help the two Koreas negotiate their way out of the escalating dispute.

When Sergei Lavrov, the Russian foreign minister, met with his North Korean counterpart on Monday, he said military exercises had added to tension but also that the North's shelling of the island deserved condemnation, according to the ministry

http://english.aljazeera.net/news/asia-pacific/2010/12/2010121715214998243.html

[bashi]

It seems the US has smuggled some marines inside the SK troops:

Pyongyang has threatened "disaster" if the South stages the drill on Yeonpyeong, and a foreign ministry statement on Saturday accused US troops -- about 20 of whom who will take part in the drill -- of providing a "human shield".


this will give a perfect excuse, IF the shelling will be returned by NK...

http://www.smh.com.au/world/korea-crisis-un-security-council-holds-emergency-talks-20101220-1923t.html

meanwhile the UN is scrambling:

http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-news-world/security-council-holds-korea-crisis-talks-20101219-191tb.html

[Rocky_Shorz]

OK light Warriors...

We need the Stormy weather to stay over Korea for 2 more days...

[bennycog]

more show of force from the duelaing nations.. so sad..

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=8185825

South Korea announced that a live-fire artillery exercise would go ahead on Monday on a border island despite strong threats of retaliation from North Korea.

"It will happen today," a defence ministry spokesman told AFP without giving a time.

Local officials on Yeonpyeong island made a similar loudspeaker announcement on Monday morning, an AFP photographer said.

They did not give a time but told residents, reporters, officials and others on the island to be prepared to move to shelters when ordered by the military.

Yonhap news agency, quoting sources, said the drill was expected to be held between 11am and noon local time (1300 and 1400 AEDT).

It said that apart from the military there are about 280 people on the island, which is 12 kilometres from the North Korean coast.

After a similar exercise by marines based on Yeonpyeong on November 23, the North fired about 170 shells on to or around the island, killing four people including civilians and damaging dozens of homes.

It has threatened even deadlier retaliation if the upcoming drill goes ahead. The United Nations Security Council is meeting to try to calm tensions.

Yonhap news agency quoted an unidentified official of Seoul's Joint Chiefs of Staff as saying the exact time will depend on the weather around the island.

The AFP photographer said there was thick fog around the coast on Monday morning.

The North disputes the Yellow Sea border between the two Koreas drawn by United Nations forces after the 1950-53 Korean War. It claims the waters around Yeonpyeong and other frontline islands as its own maritime territory.

The North says it attacked last month after the South's drill dropped shells into its waters.

Last month's bombardment was the first of civilian areas in the South since the Korean War. It sparked outrage in the South, which rushed more troops and guns to frontline islands.

[jcocks]

Unfortunately this needs to happen. People NEED to learn the lessons that these situations bring. Lets pray that this lesson is learned with the least loss of life as possible.

[bashi]

It is happening right now:

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/politics/nation/South-Korea-goes-ahead-with-firing-drill-despite-war-threat/articleshow/7132525.cms

[bashi]

The 94 minutes drill has ended without response from NK:

http://www.voanews.com/english/news/South-Korea-Concludes-Artillery-Drill-Scrambles-Jet-Fighters-112173129.html

http://www.rediff.com/news/slide-show/slide-show-1-south-and-north-korea-on-brink-of-war/20101220.htm

http://newsinfo.inquirer.net/breakingnews/world/view/20101220-310008/SKorea-holds-live-fire-drill-as-UN-bickers

[HURRITT ENYETO]

North Korea has agreed to permit the return of UN nuclear inspectors as part of a package of measures to ease tensions on the peninsula.

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/telegraph/multimedia/archive/01784/Yongbyon_1784763c.jpg

After meeting with Bill Richardson, a veteran negotiator and the governor of New Mexico, the North Koreans have agreed to let inspectors from the UN's International Atomic Energy Agency back into its Yongbyon nuclear facility, according to CNN.

Full story http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/northkorea/8213453/North-Korea-to-let-UN-nuclear-inspectors-return.html

[HURRITT ENYETO]

Thank you everybody for continuing to keep us all informed :)
And its great news that the live fire exercise today did not escalate.
Only one day left (i think) and hopefully we will get through the Lunar Eclipse without major incident *fingers crossed*

[bennycog]

without response for now bashi..
we all know that the koreans from anyside are relentless in their own idea of patriotism.. but will also want their counterpart to look the worst in any scenerio... the longest and worst game of tennis i have ever seen is between them two nations....
oh sh$t no it's not.. it is happening everywhere.... but who gets the most news coverage..

[bennycog]

on the late night news in oz right now is the threat of north korea retaliating ( the threat of war they say)... on channel 10..
another small chess piece moves across the table guys


http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTOE6BG05Y20101219

(Reuters) - The U.N. Security Council met in emergency session on Sunday to try to cool tensions on the Korean Peninsula, but the five big powers were split on whether to publicly blame North Korea for the crisis.

Pyongyang raised an alert for artillery units along its west coast in what appeared to be its latest move in a growing crisis between the two Koreas, Yonhap news agency said, quoting a South Korean government source. The report was issued ahead of a planned live-fire drill by South Korea.

South Korea's Defense Ministry offered no immediate comment on the Yonhap report. Bad weather has so far delayed the planned firing drill at a disputed border that has enraged Pyongyang.

Both sides have said they will use military means to defend what they say is their territory off the west coast, raising international concern that the standoff could quickly spiral out of control.

The 15 Security Council members were meeting behind closed doors to try to agree on a statement that Russian U.N. Ambassador Vitaly Churkin said he hoped would send a "restraining signal" to both the North and the South.

Western envoys inside the meeting said the five permanent veto-wielding members were split over whether to blame North Korea for the crisis, as the United States, Britain, and France -- along with Japan -- demand, or to urge both sides to avoid acts that could deepen the crisis, as Russia and China want.

The Chinese, North Korea's staunchest supporters on the council, and Russians reject the idea of assigning blame to Pyongyang, the envoys told Reuters on condition of anonymity.

RUSSIA, CHINA SEEK COMPROMISE WITH WEST

The U.S., British and French delegations rejected a Russian draft that called for U.N. Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon to send an envoy to Seoul and Pyongyang and urged the two sides to exercise "maximum restraint." Russia and China then revised the text to make it more acceptable to the Western powers.

Western diplomats said the latest Russian and Chinese draft statement condemns a November 23 incident in which North Korean artillery shells killed four people in a South Korean village but does not explicitly blame North Korea for the attack.

However, they said it implicitly blames Pyongyang by referring to a statement by U.N. Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon the same day, calling the attack "one of the gravest incidents since the end of the Korean War." Ban's statement also made clear North Korea was to blame for the attack.

The new draft is "not perfect but we can probably live with it," one diplomat said. Although the U.S., British, French and Japanese delegations could accept it, South Korea is unhappy with the draft statement because it does not explicitly condemn the North for attacking the South, he said.

Washington has backed Seoul's push to go ahead with the planned live-fire drill on Yeonpyeong island, where four South Koreans were killed in last month's artillery attack.

The drill, within view of the North Korean mainland, is scheduled to take place sometime before Tuesday. U.S. and Chinese officials have described the situation on the Korean Peninsula as "extremely precarious" and a "tinderbox."

Recent Western attempts to get the Security Council to rebuke Pyongyang over the deadly artillery incident and its nuclear program have been blocked by China.

[bashi]

North Korea Says It Will Not Retaliate After South’s Drills:


NK : “The world should properly know who is the true champion of peace and who is the real provocateur of a war”

Wisdom in service of diplomacy...

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/21/world/asia/21korea.html?_r=1&src=me&ref=world

[bashi]

hdZk5CQpQZA

[bashi]

It seemed first that the "PRIVATE" diplomatic initiative by New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson was just a cover up for US efforts without losing their face, if something went wrong. But now the truth comes out:

The US is not happy that Richardson`s trip has borne peaceful fruits:


No talks to NK and no debriefing of Richardson!

The game is very clear now...

http://www.wdio.com/article/stories/S1892740.shtml?cat=10373

[Rocky_Shorz]

Ron Paul for Pres with Richardson for VP in 2012!!!

[irishspirit]

Ron Paul for Pres with Richardson for VP in 2012!!!

Sorry! But it is never going to happen. To many sheep, not enough common sense.

[Carmody]

Sorry! But it is never going to happen. To many sheep, not enough common sense.

It's closer than you think. More people than you would think...are vacillating, these days. On the edge of it. Now, obviously, I hope...they likely follow what their gonads and their desires speak to them.

But... they are aware of the potential. In order for them to feel safe, they have to have a crowd to hide in and run with, when making this switch to a new happy state. happy as their anger finds release, happy as they are not alone, happy as everyone is with them.

Note that the psychological attacks and all that goes in the opposite direction... works on those points and almost exclusively on those points of psychology, in their entirety.

It is our job to keep sparking things to the break point.

[irishspirit]

Vowing to 'Punish Enemy,' S. Korea Launches Vast Drills

(Newser) – South Korea is continuing to thumb its nose at the North, today launching three days military drills close to the DMZ, as hundreds of troops, tanks, jets, and helicopters gather, the AP reports. It’s the 48th such training this year—only 47 had been planned—and the largest joint army-air force winter exercises ever staged by South Korea, it says. “We will completely punish the enemy if it provokes us again like the shelling of Yeonpyeong Island,” says an officer.

http://www.newser.com/story/108093/s-korea-launches-massive-drills-at-border.html

[Elandiel BernElve]

North Korea threatens 'sacred' nuclear war against the South

AP - North Korea's armed forces minister said his country is ready for a "sacred war" using nuclear weapons. Kim Yong-chun said live-fire exercises conducted by South Korea near the border were a preparation for war with the North.

North Korea threatened Thursday to launch a "sacred'' nuclear war against South Korea if it attacks, as Seoul staged military exercises that have raised already high tensions on the peninsula.

The remarks seemed aimed at revving patriotic spirit on the eve of the 19th anniversary of leader Kim Jong Il's appointment as the supreme military commander.

Defense chief Kim Yong Chun said North Korea is ''fully prepared to launch a sacred war'' and would use its nuclear capabilities if attacked and warned the South against intruding even the smallest amount on its territory, according to the official Korean Central News Agency.

North Korea's anger has been piqued this week by South Korea's staging of live-fire drills on Yeonpyeong Island, which was shelled by the North's artillery on Nov. 23. Four South Koreans were killed.

North Korea has said it shelled the island because South Korea fired artillery into its territorial waters first. South Korea has countered that it fired artillery away from North Korea as part of routine drills.

Earlier Thursday, South Korea conducted its largest air-and-ground firing drills near the tense land border in a show of force against North Korea. The North's state media has called the drills ''provocative'' and ''offensive.''

The two Koreas are still technically at war because their 1950-53 Korean War ended with an armistice, not a peace treaty.

source: http://www.france24.com/en/20101223-north-korea-threatens-sacred-nuclear-war

[jcocks]

There's so much sabre-rattling going on on the korean peninsula at the moment that you can't even hear yourself think!

On a serious note, I have a feeling that some sort of military exchange is almost inevitable between these two now.... I can't see these tensions being released any other way.... :(

[irishspirit]

SEOUL — North Korea threatened a nuclear "sacred war" on Thursday and South Korea vowed a "merciless counterattack" if it was attacked again as both sides raised the rhetoric on a day of more military exercises in the South.

South Korea's land and sea exercises prompted North Korea, which has threatened to reduce the South to ashes on many occasions, to denounce its richer neighbor as a warmonger.

"To counter the enemy's intentional drive to push the situation to the brink of war, our revolutionary forces are making preparations to begin a sacred war at any moment necessary based on nuclear deterrent," North Korea's KCNA news agency quoted Minister of Armed Forces Kim Yong-chun as saying.

State Department spokesman P.J. Crowley said "we need constructive actions, not heated rhetoric" from Pyongyang.

"The last thing the region needs from North Korea is more threatening rhetoric," he said in Washington.

North Korea has wielded its nuclear capability threat before but analysts say it has no way to launch a nuclear device.

Tension reached a peak last month when North Korea shelled a southern island, Yeonpyeong, killing four people, in response to a South Korean live-fire drill in what the North said were its waters.

http://www.comcast.net/articles/news-general/20100111/NEWS-US-KOREA-NORTH/