The black world: what it's like working under great secrecy

[Bill Ryan]

.
I'm posting this in 'The Secret Space Program' section because the following paints a fascinating sketch of what it's like working in an intensive aerospace program that's very highly classified.

In projects that are even more sensitive than this (and there are many), even more draconian restrictions are imposed on what people see, hear, and know.

This is from a documentary about the building of the YF-23 Black Widow II, a contender for the new Advanced Tactical Fighter (ATF). Northrop, who had built the famous 'flying wing' B-2 bomber, designed the YF-23... but ultimately failed in its bid to win the contract.

It was a beautiful plane, and was faster and stealthier than its competitor. But it was not so maneuverable. Two were built, and are now both in a museum.

http://projectavalon.net/YF-23_Black_Widow_II_sm.jpg

The following is a transcript from 10:06 to 12:48 in this very interesting video:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYLiMYGBE2Q

~~~~~~~

Their job was made even more complicated by the Pentagon’s insistence that work would be designated Top Secret: Special Access Required.

Sensitivity to National Security required it to be a black program, codenamed Senior Sky.




"And a black program, by definition, is like a black hole — and that is anything that enters into a black hole, never comes out."




"There were 45,000 people working on the B-2 in the United States, and nobody knew that they were. Not one."

"The best way to keep something secure is to have no-one know about it, so they won’t try to penetrate it."

"People who know don’t talk, and people who talk don’t know."

Del Jacobs was appointed as Northrop’s first ATF Program Manager, for the preliminary design phase, and swiftly formed a special team to meet the challenge.

Bob Sandusky was assigned as Chief Engineer, and principal architect of the YF-23.




"We started this program with just four people: myself, my secretary, an aerodynamicist, and a structures engineer.

Drafted from the B-2 division, the head of the YF-23 technology team was expert physicist Yu-Ping-Liu.




"Not a day was lost. We were designing technology for B-2 and ATF. Together, side by side, daily."

"We moved them into a building which had no windows in the walls, no sign on the front of the building. It looked like an abandoned supermarket."

"And we put it in the middle of a number of other production programs, and there was no parking lot, so that a satellite could not see when the program increased its personnel or decreased them."

"Just getting to the entrance of the building, just getting past the security guards etc, required special badges, special access."

"You were isolated. REALLY isolated. In buildings that had no name, had no windows, and had double doors."

"You go into it for days, and you don’t know whether it’s raining or sunshine outside. Some of us worked for 10 years without ever seeing a window."




"One of the characteristics for working in the black world is that the more you know, the more you have to bury what you know."

"You would go home in the evening, and it’s very stifled. You have all this emotion and this enthusiasm, and it’s trying to bubble out, and you’ve got this built-in filter that says 'I can't let it bubble out'."

"My wife’s very understanding. She knows I enjoy my work, and she knows I was involved with something very special, because she can tell from my eyes."

"She would say to me, 'And what did you do today?' And I’d say, 'I can't tell you'."

“I’d say, "I was busy building an airplane, dear.”

~~~~~

In other even more highly classified programs, security is tighter still. I [Bill] once talked personally with a physicist who had worked at Bell Labs on exotic technology.

When walking from one room to another, he'd have to wear special goggles that blurred his vision apart from a couple of feet around him, enough to not bump into things, and be able to card-swipe and open doors. He walked on painted 'tramway' lines on the floor. (Interestingly, that protocol was later independently confirmed by controversial witness Dan Burisch.)

In other programs, memory-wiping is routinely used, after one's services are no longer required. You can't talk about things you can't remember ever happened.

All this is above and beyond the executive-level pay and conditions these people routinely enjoy, day in and day out. (One officer in Area 51 quite liked a particular kind of grapefruit from Africa, and these were flown in specially for him at a cost of $26 each.)

If one ever talked out of turn, not only might one be physically threatened or injured... but for sure, one would never work for the government again. Mark McCandlish, a brilliant man and a highly talented aeronautical draftsman, also one of the better known Disclosure Project witnesses, not only suffered through and survived a grueling IRS investigation, but now has no clients, and works for a pittance in a pet store. It's the only job he can get.

[danegeroussacredgeometry]

This is fascinating. I had a close friend who worked for Boeing and she built robotic arms for NASA crafts. She told me it was strange to her the way things were done. They had many different people working on separate parts of the machine and each group was completely segregated from the next. Sharing what each group was building was strictly prohibited. Her knowledge went much further than simply building robotic arms but they wouldn't allow anyone on her team including her to do anything more let alone see the finished result of the project.

[jake gittes]

This is fascinating. I had a close friend who worked for Boeing and she built robotic arms for NASA crafts. She told me it was strange to her the way things were done. They had many different people working on separate parts of the machine and each group was completely segregated from the next. Sharing what each group was building was strictly prohibited. Her knowledge went much further than simply building robotic arms but they wouldn't allow anyone on her team including her to do anything more let alone see the finished result of the project.

ANd people say, "How could they have done ______ and nobody not known about it?!?" Umm, ^that's^ how. Compartmentalization is how they whacked JFK & did 911. The doubters act like everyone involved would have had to attend a conference at a Hilton somewhere to plan such things.

[Sunny-side-up]

Just think how black working on human/mutations and projects in bases on the Moon and Mars must be (If they really are there of course)!

[wnlight]

Bill. Let me confirm what you wrote. It is a very accurate description of working in the black world. From 1977 on, I was working in the black world on two different projects. For four years at the Nuclear test site measuring the yield of thermal nuclear devices and their effect on 'space' hardware. They kept me out of the space hardware for the most part. It was the compartmentalism policy.
Then I worked on a military project at a place that does not exist. For a fictional company, on activities that never happened. I will not tell where because the military spent (and is spending) huge amounts of money to keep the location secret. This place has not been in the news or any literature that I have ever seen. I had the math and computer background to support orbital calculations and more. We had annual 'life style' lie detector exams by the NSA. Those 'tests' were fierce. They could use my own mind against me. I was not allowed to leave the country. We only knew the names of the people that we closely worked with. The IDs were picture cards - no names. For five years I put up with all that. Some of the technology we used in the 1980s is beyond what I will talk about today. Then, in 1985, I made a major career change and took a simple, Top Secret job for the Navy, and it was so nice to have windows sometimes, work for a real (not fictional) company. I felt a lot of relief of pressure. One problem was my resume had gaps in it that I could not explain when job hunting. I would not ever go back into the black world - no matter how exciting the secrets are.

[wnlight]

dangerous, your friend's story is most likely true. This kind of security policy is what caused the Hubble Space Telescope to fail after launch. Major integration tests were prevented by the restricted compartmental security requirements. Those designing the camera systems were not even told the name of the company that made the main mirror. So, in space, the Hubble systems would not work well together.

[Carmody]

Then... they must really dislike us folk who figure out the science, all on our own, and explain it to people (everyone who wants to read) in plain english.

As a friend of mine is apt to say, 'The trick is to know that something is possible. It is then a near forgone conclusion that people will figure it out.' (when the question is born, the answer [reflection] will discover itself)

Ridicule, control, penetration on forums, threats... all both subtle and gross, is the norm.

More than once I've been asked where I get my information from.......

[syrwong]

The main characteristic of capitalism is that the worker is alienated from his product, he is both a machine and a slave. But he is luckier than these black project slaves, for at least the he can talk to other workers and what he produces is likely to benefit people. I can suppose that the end products of black projects are horrible destructive machines. This is extreme alienation. We have reached the world of capitalism to the extremes.

[Bill Ryan]

Bill. Let me confirm what you wrote. It is a very accurate description of working in the black world. From 1977 on, I was working in the black world on two different projects. For four years at the Nuclear test site measuring the yield of thermal nuclear devices and their effect on 'space' hardware. They kept me out of the space hardware for the most part. It was the compartmentalism policy.
Then I worked on a military project at a place that does not exist. For a fictional company, on activities that never happened. I will not tell where because the military spent (and is spending) huge amounts of money to keep the location secret. This place has not been in the news or any literature that I have ever seen. I had the math and computer background to support orbital calculations and more. We had annual 'life style' lie detector exams by the NSA. Those 'tests' were fierce. They could use my own mind against me. I was not allowed to leave the country. We only knew the names of the people that we closely worked with. The IDs were picture cards - no names. For five years I put up with all that. Some of the technology we used in the 1980s is beyond what I will talk about today. Then, in 1985, I made a major career change and took a simple, Top Secret job for the Navy, and it was so nice to have windows sometimes, work for a real (not fictional) company. I felt a lot of relief of pressure. One problem was my resume had gaps in it that I could not explain when job hunting. I would not ever go back into the black world - no matter how exciting the secrets are.

:bump:

Thank you for this important personal testimony! :sun:

Just about every word of wnlight's post needs to be considered carefully. Yes, this is how it really is. The pressure being on the 'inside' is relentless.

People who leave certain programs are often regularly checked up on from then on out, as well. You can't just calmly resign one day, and then go traveling around the world talking to anyone you like on the plane seat next to you. Security is often MUCH more of a concern once someone's left. They much prefer to keep people on the inside, even if they transfer from program to program for years.

It's fascinating stuff. I've talked to quite a few people who did work on 'very interesting' things — but the more interesting they are, the more compartmentalized everything is.

Someone who starts talking about everything one can think of, and is never even gently leaned on to be quiet (let alone being silenced forcibly), is not a threat... because they'd be inventing most if not all they're saying.

This is whistleblowing 101. :) Anyone who's really worked in this extremely tight, lock-down environment will confirm.

Hence the dictum, quoted in the YF-23 video in my post #1:
"People who know don’t talk, and people who talk don’t know."The challenge of black-world researchers is to piece together fragments, like so many paper shreds collected from a trash can. And, because the black world guardians understand this very well, those fragments are also laced with false information and false trails.

It's never easy, and never has been... anyone who insists otherwise, and is contracted to go on TV with their stories, is living in (literally) a fantasy world. Either that — or knowingly or otherwise, they're part of the black world guardians' huge array of defensive assets.

[Morbid]

now i get why russian made equipment is more reliable..

[Cidersomerset]

I just watched the first ten mins and this is the sort of documentary I would
have watched before I really fell down the rabbit hole , and still do now and
then. Aprox 10 min in they say the project is required to be a 'Black programme
Senior sky ' and a Black programme is a black hole , what goes in does not come out.
There were over 45 thousand people working on the B2 in the US and nobody knew
that they were, not one. The best way to keep to keep something secure is to
have no one know about it so they will not try to penetrate it.( para phrasing )

"People who know don't talk , and people who talk don't know".....

These few little statements are well known , and very common in the WW11
era and beyond into the Cold war and no doubt still in place today.But most
critics and dis info agents, trolls etc ,say that the government cannot keep
secrets . Which is total BS as we all know if you are interested in this and
is why we speculate about the secret space programme , which ties into so
many other aspects of the alternate field imo.

[Carmody]

Then... they must really dislike us folk who figure out the science, all on our own, and explain it to people (everyone who wants to read) in plain english.

As a friend of mine is apt to say, 'The trick is to know that something is possible. It is then a near forgone conclusion that people will figure it out.' (when the question is born, the answer [reflection] will discover itself)

Ridicule, control, penetration on forums, threats... all both subtle and gross, is the norm.

More than once I've been asked where I get my information from.......

Interestingly enough, when I work up in the morning today, the power went out before I could even brew a coffee, and it's been out ever since. massive levels of chemtrails. So bad I had to cough when I went outside. (grabbed a few photos)

I'm using a gas generator to be on the 'net right now and post this.

[TargeT]

explain it to people (everyone who wants to read) in plain english.


I can honestly say "plain english" and Carmody posts do not correlate in my mind.

[Sunny-side-up]

Then... they must really dislike us folk who figure out the science, all on our own, and explain it to people (everyone who wants to read) in plain english.

As a friend of mine is apt to say, 'The trick is to know that something is possible. It is then a near forgone conclusion that people will figure it out.' (when the question is born, the answer [reflection] will discover itself)

Ridicule, control, penetration on forums, threats... all both subtle and gross, is the norm.

More than once I've been asked where I get my information from.......

Interestingly enough, when I work up in the morning today, the power went out before I could even brew a coffee, and it's been out ever since. massive levels of chemtrails. So bad I had to cough when I went outside. (grabbed a few photos)

I'm using a gas generator to be on the 'net right now and post this.

I just came from this post:
Re: It's On: Obama Sends Destroyer To Chinese Islands, China Vows Military Response
http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?86336-It-s-On-Obama-Sends-Destroyer-To-Chinese-Islands-China-Vows-Military-Response&p=1014059&posted=1#post1014059

Where I posted this:

In relation to this post mention of EMP attacks:

eric dollard warns about Americas power grids emp susceptibility
14:55 to 16:19 EMP screw-up in the Grid system emp susceptibility, he shows the problem and the Guards that need be in place!
http://ericpdollard.com/2015/05/07/m...ity-harmonics/
14:55 to 16:19 EMP screw-up

There is a much deeper talk by Mr Dollard where he directly states his fears for simple EMP attack of the power grid in America, the attack would not need to be big or complex.The American grid has been designed to propagate EMP not block it!

So just who might be the hand behind such an attack on America?
Hmm!


Synchronicity ha o.0

[wnlight]

syrwong, The products of my work in the black world were the building, testing, and/or delivery of terrible weapons. Then something inside me told me to get out.

Bill, "People who know don’t talk, and people who talk don’t know." is very true. That is why I still keep a lot to myself.

Keep in mind that they DO NOT tell you ahead of time just what you are getting into. One day, about a year into the project (my deepest BW project) I met someone who had left several months before. It was such a relief to discover that she was alive and well. I had been developing a kind of paranoia since the day I discovered that my predecessor had committed suicide. You know the saying: "Suicide is easy."

[Atlas]

Reposting this here: in this video, @1:20, a consultant on blast effects of atom bombs says:


We were put on a bus which the windows were all completely covered with curtains and, in some cases, black paper tape for the windows.
q1bWaYgpxXw

[Carmody]

syrwong, The products of my work in the black world were the building, testing, and/or delivery of terrible weapons. Then something inside me told me to get out.

Bill, "People who know don’t talk, and people who talk don’t know." is very true. That is why I still keep a lot to myself.

Keep in mind that they DO NOT tell you ahead of time just what you are getting into. One day, about a year into the project (my deepest BW project) I met someone who had left several months before. It was such a relief to discover that she was alive and well. I had been developing a kind of paranoia since the day I discovered that my predecessor had committed suicide. You know the saying: "Suicide is easy."

My best guess is that you still have a case officer to this day. And that they watch for signs of potential disclosure as you age. The closer you are to your deathbed, the more serious the threat...The better your health the safer they are and you are. If you pull the emotions out of it and look at it clean and cold, it looks something like that. It is what I would see in their position.

[wnlight]

There are many others that were/are in much deeper into the BW than ever was I. I met some of them. I am so glad to be out of that realm. I protect myself and my health by asking for and receiving spiritual protection.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

I was spared the nuclear blast effects while working at the NTS in the 1970s. I picked up more radiation working in the tunnels and project labs at Fermilab.

[Cidersomerset]

I just saw this article that shows how $'s can be hidden in projects
and used for other purposes. In this case it could just be local
corruption , bribes or something else ? but you get the picture...

Who can forget the 2 trillion unaccounted prior to 9/11 that got
lost in the dust of the Pentagon missile attack...'SCAM ,SCAM ,SCAM.....

Rumsfeld 2.3 Trillion Dollars missing Pentagon 1 DAY before 9/11!!!

aDUD5GZchIo

Video from CBS NEWS about September 10, 2001 report of trillions gone from the pentagon with out knowing. Scary Stuff.

------------------------------------------------------------------------



US spent $43 million on gas station in Afghanistan: Report

By David Icke on 3rd November 2015

------------------------------------------------------------------

PRESS TV...


US spent $43 million on gas station in Afghanistan: Report
Mon Nov 2, 2015 3:5PM

http://www.davidicke.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/aae3aefa-2733-47c5-9568-bedc7196fd091.jpg


‘The US Defense Department spent $43 million of American taxpayers’ money
to build a gas station in Afghanistan that should have cost roughly $500,000,
according to a new government watchdog report.

One of the most “troubling” issues is how the Pentagon was unable or unwilling
to explain why the “ill-conceived” project was so expensive, the Special Inspector
General for Afghanistan Reconstruction (SIGAR) said in a report issued Monday.

“Even considering security costs associated with construction and operation in
Afghanistan, this level of expenditure appears gratuitous and extreme,” said
John Sopko, the director of SIGAR.’

Read more: US spent $43 million on gas station in Afghanistan: Report

http://www.presstv.ir/Detail/2015/11/02/435999/Afghan-gas-station-cost


====================================================
====================================================
====================================================

This one is in the public domain


Heads roll at Lockheed Martin over troubled F-35 program

By David Icke on 3rd November 2015 Corporate Crime, War and Terror


http://www.davidicke.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/56374a32c4618855648b45e9.jpg


‘Problems with the most expensive weapons project in Pentagon history, the $400
billion and counting F-35 jet have forced a reshuffle at Lockheed Martin.

The US aircraft designer named Jeff Babione the new executive vice president and
general manager of the F-35 Program, succeeding Lorraine Martin.

“Jeff is a seasoned leader who is uniquely qualified to lead the F-35 team through
this critical phase of the program,” said Orlando Carvalho, Lockheed Martin
Aeronautics executive VP in a statement.

“He brings a deep understanding of the F-35 program, strong customer
relationships and a collaborative leadership style that will ensure we continue the
positive momentum of the program.”’

Read more: Heads roll at Lockheed Martin over troubled F-35 program

https://www.rt.com/business/320487-f35-lockheed-martin-pentagon-us/?utm_source=browser&utm_medium=aplication_chrome&utm_campaign=chrome