Magnesium BiCarbonate Water - a guide to make

[Bob]

Plagued by muscle ticks, then the headaches, leg cramps, and foot pain?

Then the problems with appetite, nausea, vomiting, fatigue, and weakness?

How about numbness, tingling, seizures, personality changes (anxiety), abnormal heart rhythms, and coronary (heart muscle) spasms?

Is one experiencing chest tightness or a peculiar sensation that one can’t take a deep breath? Possibly sighing a lot?

Feeling zips, zaps and vibratory sensations?

Difficulty swallowing or a lump in the throat-especially provoked by eating sugar; Photophobia (can't be in bright light comfortably, blurred vision, and having difficulty adjusting to oncoming bright headlights in the absence of eye disease; and loud noise sensitivity?

Having insomnia, anxiety, hyperactivity and restlessness with constant movement, and panic attacks?

Getting salt cravings, experiencing both carbohydrate cravings and carbohydrate intolerance, especially of chocolate, and ladies how about breast tenderness without being pregnant?

Are these signs appearing:

highly-strung,
sensitive to noise,
hyper-excitable,
apprehensive and
belligerent


or these signs?

Clouded thinking,
confusion,
disorientation,
marked depression and
terrifying hallucinations


Although the symptoms and issues above can be associated with numerous diseases, such simply could be associated with improper magnesium absorption and the consumption of a magnesium which is not properly compatible with one's body in one's own unique situation.

The broad termed observation is a MAGNESIUM shortage.

In the PDF attached below, a method will be shown of easily MAKING what some consider is a more absorb-able form, called Magnesium BiCarbonate - which can even become a dilutable "concentrate". The carbonic acid to dissolve the magnesium is simple carbonated water. For those chemists, the mechanics of reaction will be illustrated.

Numerous threads on the forum discuss the uses and perceived benefits of assorted Magnesium Therapies. Having a starting point, it seems, to obtain a useful form of very pure freshly made Magnesium BiCarbonate may be highly desired.

POST UPDATE - PLEASE READ this POST FIRST (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?86797-Magnesium-BiCarbonate-Water-a-guide-to-make&p=1076989&viewfull=1#post1076989)

The CHOICE of the BRAND of MILK of MAGNESIA used makes a BIG difference as well as the PURITY of the SELTZER WATER used.

Do NOT use seltzer water with ANY additive (no sweeteners, no salts).

Do NOT use any Milk of Magnesia with ANY OTHER additives, especially not calcium ! The PURE MAGNESIUM BI-CARBONATE is the substance being explored. There are issues apparently with ANY "adulteration" steps. The AH-HA consequences were quite amazing exploring this "MAG-BiCarb" over time. The following posts show the anecdotal results. Quite amazing indeed !

References:

http://www.nhfw.info/magnesium.html
Red blood cells are also known as RBCs, red blood corpuscles (an archaic term), haematids or erythrocytes (from Greek erythros for “red” and kytos for “hollow”, with cyte translated as “cell” in modern usage). The capitalized term Red Blood Cells is the proper name in the US for erythrocytes in storage solution used in transfusion medicine.
J. Clin. Invest. 100(7): 1847-1852 (1997). doi:10.1172/JCI119713. The American Society for Clinical Investigation



Karen Vaughan, L.Ac., Registered Herbalist (AHC) made the formulation available in 2009.. It is presented below in PDF


http://chanlo.com/images/Magnesium%20Bicarbonate%20Water%20How%20to%20Make.pdf

http://chanlo.com/images/Magnesium%20Bicarbonate%20Water%20How%20to%20Make.pdf

(PS - I am NOT bobDean ... )

[idiit]

The Epsom Salt Council was formed in 1993 to help spread the word about the wonder that is Epsom salt, also known as magnesium sulfate.

http://www.saltworks.us/salt_info/epsom-uses-benefits.asp

sulfur crystals:


Organic sulfur crystals are a miracle food that provides amazing health benefits

Learn more: http://www.naturalnews.com/029263_sulfur_joint_health.html#ixzz3rZxX5g2P

[Bob]

Dr. Sidney Baker MD discusses issues (connecting the dots on Magnesium and diseases):



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9IFZvm6Pssw?t=18

Credentials:
http://www.yourmedicaldetective.com/public/152.cfm


Sidney MacDonald Baker, M.D.

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CURRICULUM VITAE

PRESENT POSITION: Solo Practice, Sag Harbor, NY. CVO & founder of Autism360.org and CVO & founder of Medigenesis.com

Summary: I am a practicing physician with an interest in nutritional, biochemical and environmental aspects of chronic illness in adults and children. Autism260.org is a website funded by the Moody’s Corporation and dedicated to empowering families caught in the rise in incidence of autism by providing information technology that helps each child be seen as an individual by creating a detailed, structured, accurate medical record that can be used to track progress and find other closely matching individuals whose experience reveals actionable clinical options. Medigenesis is the parent company of this project and is involved in seeking other applications for its patented information technology applications to improve health and reduce health care costs. EXPERIENCE, TRAINING, AND ACADEMIC AFFILIATIONS

Medical School (1960-1964) Yale University School of Medicine, New Haven, CT

Internship (1964 1965) Department of Pediatrics, Yale New Haven Medical Center

Assistant Resident (June 1965 Jan 1966) Department of Pediatrics, Yale New Haven Medical Center

Assistant Resident (Jan 1966 June 1966) Department of Obstetrics, Hospital of St. Raphael, New Haven, CT (six months)

Peace Corps Volunteer, Chad, Africa (1966 1968) 1) Administrative and technical responsibility for program for retraining paramedical personnel for rural health care delivery. Worked with a staff of two laboratory technicians, three registered nurses, and two Chadian nurses in nine different towns to develop methods and a curriculum for retraining of allied health workers who were isolated from supervisory professionals. 2) Worked at Pilot Health Zone at Chaguoa, a village community of 7,000 outside of Njemena (Fort Lamy). Set up and supervised ambulatory health consultations; conducted a teaching program in midwifery. 3) Had partial responsibility for care of Peace Corps Volunteers and American Dependents in Chad.

Chief Resident (1968 1969) Department of Pediatrics, Yale New Haven Medical Center

Assistant Professor of Medical Computer Sciences (1969 1971) Yale University School of Medicine, New Haven, CT. with a joint appointment in Pediatrics and Obstetrics.) Worked on on line interactive medical history systems with major emphasis in the pre natal area. Developed specifications for on line and batch input mechanisms for medical information with particular interest in the effective use of allied health personnel in medical information handling.

As a member of Patient Care Studies Committee of Yale New Haven Medical Center, worked on a large systems study of information handling methods in fifty clinical areas in the Medical Center.

Assistant Clinical Professor of Pediatrics, Yale Medical School, (1969 1982)

Attending Physician, Department of Pediatrics, Yale New Haven Hospital (1969 to 1991)

Attending Physician (1971 1978) at High Meadows School, New Haven, CT, a state supported school for disturbed children.

Clinician (1971 1978), with a combined practice of pediatrics, family medicine, counseling, office gynecology, and nutrition in a pre paid group practice, Community Health Care Plan, Inc., New Haven, CT.

Adjunct Professor of School Psychology, Southern Connecticut State University, (1982 1988)

Practicing Physician (1978 1988), Director (1978 1985), and Director of Research (1985 1988), Gesell Institute of Human Development, an independent, non profit, diagnostic, treatment and research center. The Institute conducts clinical and research programs in child development, vision, nutrition and environmental medicine.

Practicing Physician in private practice (September 1988 - July 1991) and President of MCARES Development Corporation (1985 to present), a developer of medical computer software.

Senior Clinician and Director of Research (1991-1993) at Princeton BioCenter, Princeton, New Jersey.

Coordinator, Annual CME Nutrition Seminars, American Academy of Environmental Medicine (1991-1996)

Co-Founder and Coordinator, Defeat Autism Now! Group, Autism Research Institute. (1994-present

Practicing Physician in private practice (1993- )

Founder and CVO, Medigenesis (1999 -present) now powering Autism360.org funded by The Moody’s Foundation through a grant to Autism Research Institute.

Associate Editor, Integrative Medicine. 2003 – present. EDUCATION

Graduated: Phillips Exeter Academy, Exeter, New Hampshire, 1955, Cum Laude. Traveled in Far East and studied art and architecture, 1958 1959. Worked as a volunteer at Shanta Bhawan Hospital, Kathmandu, Nepal (Summer, 1959). B.A., Yale University, 1960. Major: Far Eastern History. M.D., Yale University, 1964, Cum Laude.

HONORS

Alpha Omega Alpha, 1963 Ferris Prize, 1961 (Anatomy) Ramsay Memorial Scholarship Prize, 1963 (Clinical Medicine) Keese Prize (Best Thesis), Title: Plasmacytosis and Antibody Production in Transferred Cells), 1964. Jonathan Forman Award presented by the American Academy of Environmental Medicine Linus Pauling Award 1999 Presented by the Institute for Functional Medicine.

PROFESSIONAL LICENSES and MEMBERSHIP

Licensed by Connecticut, 12263, September 29, 1965 Licensed by New Jersey, 56240, May 30, 1991 Licensed by New York, 299154, July 7, 2003 Diplomate, National Board of Medical Examiners Diplomate, American Board of Pediatrics, June 21, 1970 Diplomate, American Board of Environmental Medicine Fellow, American Academy of Environmental Medicine (Board of Directors, 1981 1986)) Fellow, American Academy of Pediatrics, April 22, 1972 Member, American Medical Association Member, Association of American Physicians and Surgeons

PATENTS/INVENTION US patents 60/176.535 and 60/233.041 specifying a ”SYSTEM AND METHOD FOR THE AUTOMATED PRESENTATION OF HEALTH DATA TO, AND ITS INTERACTION WITH, A COMPUTER MAINTAINED DATABASE, TO GENERATE INFORMATION REGARDING POSSIBLE REMEDIES, THERAPIES, PROBLEM SOLUTIONS AND BENEFICIAL PRACTICES, TO IMPROVE USER HEALTH.” filed on Sep 15, 2000, Sidney M. Baker, Inventor etc etc.

PUBLICATIONS BOOKS

Ilg, F, Ames, L.B., Baker, S.M., Child Behavior, Harper & Row, 1982. Ames, L.B., Ilg, F. and Baker, S.M., Your Ten to Fourteen Year Old, Delacorte, NY, 1988
Baker, SM, Folic Acid. Keats Publishers. New Canaan. CT 1995 (monograph)
Baker, SM, Detoxification and Healing, McGraw Hill, Chicago, IL. Revised 2nd edition 2003
Baker, SM. The Circadian Prescription, Putnam, April 2000
Pangborn, J, Baker, SM. Biomedical Assessment Options for Children with Autism and Related Problems. Autism Research Institute, 4182 Adams Avenue, San Diego, CA. 2001, new edition 2002
Pangborn, J, Baker, SM: Autism: Effective Biomedical Treatments, 2005,w.2007 Addendum. Autism Research Institute, Autism Research Institute, 4182 Adams Avenue, San Diego, CA 92116, Phone: 619-281-7165, Fax: 619-563-6840
Chinitz, J. Baker, SM. We Band of Mothers: Autism My Son & the Specific Carbohydrate Diet (Paperback) Publ by Autism Research Institute.

ARTICLES, ESSAYS, ABSTRACTS
Coleman, J., Patrick, D. and Baker, S., "Mental Health of Children in an HMO Program." J. Pediat. 91:1, 150, 1977.
Rosenberg, E.W. and Baker, S.M., Letter to the Editor, Original report of the treatment of psoriasis with antifungal agents, Arch. Dermatol., Vol. 120, April 1984.
Baker, S.M., Notes on the Yeast Problem and Other Essays, Gesell Institute Pub (1985)
Baker, S.M., A Biochemical Approach to the Problem of Dyslexia. J. Learning Disabil. 18:10, December 1985.
Baker, S.M., Ecologic View of Human Health, Behavior and Development, Update, Gesell Institute Pub, 1:1, 1980
Baker, S.M., Nutritional View of the Periodic Table, Update, 1:4 (1981)
Baker, S.M., Trees A Strategic Diagnostic Tree, Update, 2:1 (1981)
Baker, S.M., Ideas , Update, 2:3 (1982)
Baker, S.M., The Yeast Problem, Update, 2:4 (1983)
Baker, S.M., Fat is not just to Hold Your Pants Up, Update, 3:2 (1984)
Galland, L.D., Baker, S.M. and McLellan, R.K.: Magnesium Deficiency in the Pathogenesis of Mitral Valve Prolapse, Magnesium, 5:165 174, 1986.
Baker, S.M., Behavior Problems in Children Associated with Abnormalities of Fatty Acid Metabolism and Treated with Dietary Oils, Proc of International Symposium on Prostaglandins and Related Compounds, 1986
Baker, S.M. The Language of Illness: The problem defined, Clinical Ecology 3:35 39, 1987
Baker, S.M. The Language of Illness: A solution proposed, Clinical Ecology 4:23 28, 1987
Holl, M.G. and Baker, S.M. Magnesium Status as Determined by Retention of an Intramuscular Magnesium Load: Repletion and Monitoring of Symptoms. Journal of the American Dietetic Association, Supplement 90:37, 1990.
Baker, S.M. Magnesium Deficiency in Primary Care and Preventive Medicine, Magnesium and Trace Elements, 1991-1992; 10:251-262
Baker, SM. Pangborn, J. Biomedical assessment options for children with autism and related problems, A consensus report of the “Defeat Autism Now!” (DAN!) conference, Dallas, Texas, January 1995, revised 1998.
A series of commentaries entitled “Lenses” in the Journal of Integrative Medicine appearing every other month. 2003-2005
Baker, SM. The Medicine We are Evolving. Integrative Medicine. Vol.1, No.1. Dec 2002/Jan 2003.
Baker, SM. Energy Chemestry: The Metabolism of Light. Integrative Medicine. Vol.2, No.3. June/July 2003.
Baker, SM. Letter to An Immigrant From the Land of Prescription-Pad Medicine. Integrative Medicine. Vol.3, No.3. June/July 2004.
Baker, SM. The Costs and Benefits of Sticky Molecules. Integrative Medicine. Vol.3, No.4. August/September 2004.
Baker, SM. Detoxification: A Costly Synthetic System. Integrative Medicine. Vol.3, No.5. October/November 2004.
Baker, SM. Mollecular Pathology of Messengers and Their Receptor Sites. Integrative Medicine. Vol.3, No.6. December 2004/anuary 2005.
Baker, SM. Looking at the Membranes and Boundaries of Patients. Integrative Medicine. Vol.4, No.1. February/March 2005.
Baker, SM. Perception and Memory. Integrative Medicine. Vol.4, No.2. April/May 2005.
Baker, SM. Clinical Tuning: Rhythms, Resonance, and Harmony. Integrative Medicine. Vol. 4, No.3. June/July 2005.
James SJ, Melnyk S, Jernigan S, Cleves MA, Halsted CH, Wong DH, Cutler P, Bock K, Boris M, Bradstreet JJ, Baker SM, Gaylor DW. 2006. Metabolic Endophenotype and Related Genotypes are Associated With Oxidative Stress in Children With Autism. Am J Med Genet Part B 141B:947-956.
Baker, SM – The Metapnor of Oceanic Disease, Integrative Medicine, February-March, 2008
Baker, SM – Medigenesis.com Autism Advocate, April 2008
Baker, SM – Beeing Seen. The Autism File, May 2008

Papers and Seminars presented at National or Regional Professional Meetings:

First Annual International Symposium on Health and the Environment: February 10 13, 1983, Dallas, Texas. Man and His Environment in Health and Disease Dallas, TX. Title: "Fatty Acids and Prostaglandins in Clinical Practice: Immunological implications" Connecticut Association of School Psychologists, New Haven, CT, October 28, 1983, "Treating the Child vs. Treating the Illness"
17th Annual Advanced Seminar of The Society for Clinical Ecology, Colorado Springs, CO, November 4 8, 1983 "Digestion and Asthma"
The Yeast Human Interaction Conference, Birmingham, Alabama, December 9 11, 1983 (Organizer & Moderator), Paper presented:"What Every Budding Yeast Should Know About Humans"
The National Society for Children and Adults with Autism, San Antonio, TX, July 10, 1984 "Diagnostic and Therapeutic Strategies in an Autistic Child with a Positive Response to Taurine"
Omega Institute, Rhinebeck, NY, July 16, 1984, Choosing Health: Personal Goals for Wellness Prevention and Longevity Seminar: "Practice of Holistic Health" American Academy of Environmental Medicine, Chicago, IL: October 11 15, 1984, "Life Events in Multiply Sensitive Patients" and "Clinical Recognition of Fatty Acid Syndromes and their Treatment"
Boston University School of Medicine, October 31, 1984, "The Clinician's Dilemmas in the Use of Trace Elements in an Outpatient Setting"
The Yeast Human Interaction 1985, San Francisco, CA, March 29 31, 1985 (Organizer & Moderator), "Biological Questions Raised by Chronic Candidiasis Syndromes," "Nasal Colonization with Candida: Therapeutic Consideration," and "Shedding Light on the Yeast Problem"
The First Annual Medical Symposium on the Effects of the Environment on Man in Health and Disease, Toronto, Canada, April 13, 1985, "Growing Up: Problems in Learning and Behavior"
Omega Institute, Rhinebeck, NY, June 24, 1985, "History and Physical: How to Organize a Thorough Strategy for Assessing Patients in a Holistic Framework" North American Nutrition & Preventive Medicine Association, Atlanta, GA, April 11, 1986, Half day seminar for physicians, "Strategy for Evaluation, Assessment, Therapy" and "Nutrition & Inflammatory Disease (Allergy, Arthritis, Dermatitis)"
British Society for Allergy and Environmental Medicine, Royal Society of Medicine, London, May 9, 1986, 1 day seminar covering biochemically based strategies in the environmentally sensitive patient with special reference to fatty acids and prostaglandins
Department of Child Psychiatry, Dundee, Scotland, May 23, 1986, "Behavioral Disorders in Children: Environmental and Biological Factors"
6th International Conference on Prostaglandins and Related Compounds, Florence, Italy, June 3 6, 1986, "Clinical and Laboratory Responsiveness of Childhood Behavior Problems to Fatty Acid Therapy: 3 Case Reports"
North American Academy of Munipulative Medicine, 1986 Annual Meeting Philadelphia, PA, September 19, 1986, "Food and Flexibility: The Emerging Connection"
American Academy of Environmental Illness, 21st Annual Advanced Seminar, Clearwater, Florida, October 29, 1986, "The Language of Illness: The Problem Defined," and "Clinical & Laboratory Responsiveness of Childhood Behavior Problems to Fatty Acid Therapy"
North American Nutrition & Preventive Medicine Association, San Diego, CA", January 17, 1987 Co organizer and presenter of a three day conference for physicians (With Leo Galland, M.D.) "Evaluating & Treating the Environmentally Sensitive/Complex Patient"
New England Council of Optometrists, 65th Annual Vision Care Congress, Boston, MA, March 7, 1987, "Fungus Infections, Magnesium, Fatty Acids, 1950 1986" Omega Institute Course for Physicians, Rhinebeck, NY, June 26, 1987 "Why are People Sensitive" and "Introduction to Immunology"
American Academy of Environmental Medicine, 22nd Annual Meeting, Nashville, TN, October 29 November 1, 1987, "MCARES and PPRN"
American Association for the Advancement of Medicine, New Orleans. April 29 30 1988, "Medical Records for Research and Patient Care." Omega Institute, Rhinebeck, NY, Course for Physicians, July 2, 1988, "Holistic Approaches to the Immune System"
Great Lakes Association of Clinical Medicine, 5th Anniversary X International Congress, Pittsburg, PA, "Computer Applications in Clinical Practice and Research"
American Academy of Environmental Medicine, 23rd Annual Meeting, "Patterns of Plasma and Red Blood Cell Phospholipid Abnormalities in Patients with Symptoms of Pain, Itching and Inflammation.", Lake Tahoe, Oct. 29, 1988
Immune Modulation Seminar Series: The Prevention of Immunosenescence, Spring 1989
Minneapolis January 28, 1989, Dallas February 11, 1989, Chicago February 12, 1989, New York April 8, 1989, Orlando April 9, 1989, Denver May 7, 1989, Los Angeles, May 20 1989, San Francisco, May 21, 1989 This is a one day course for physicians presented in collaboration with Jeffrey Bland, Ph.D. The material of my lectures covers a clinical overview of the immune system, approaches to the assessment of its function, and a review of fatty acid and prostaglandin chemistry and magnesium metabolism. Clinical approaches to immune modulation are discussed.
Making Nutrition Work in Your Practice, Sonoma, CA, March 1 5 1989, A four day seminar given in collaboration with Jonathan Wright, M.D. and Jeffrey Bland, Ph.D. covering clinical nutrition with an emphasis on immunology and chronic illness.
American Academy of Osteopathy, 1989 Annual Convention, Phoenix, AZ, March 29-April 1. "Fatty Acid Metabolism and Magnesium Deficiency" and "Computer Applications in Clinical Practice and Research"
Omega Institute, Rhinebeck, NY, Course for Physicians, July 3, 1989, "Holistic Approaches to the Immune System"
American Academy of Environmental Medicine, 24th Annual Meeting, "Clinical Evaluation of Immune Function", Atlanta, GA, Oct. 31, 1989
First Renaissance Conference in Nutritional Medicine, Montespertoli, Florence, Italy, April 1990, "Pattern Recognition in Chronic Illness: A Comparison of the System-Function Matrix of 51 Initial Patients with Mitral Valve Prolapse with 369 Initial Patients without Mitral Valve Prolapse"
Omega Institute, Rhinebeck, NY, Course for Physicians, July, 1990, "Holistic Approaches to the Immune System"
Nutrition and Behavior; a Review of Double-Blind Studies, with Special Reference to Hyperactivity, Presented at a professional symposium sponsored by the Canadian Schizophrenia Foundation, Toronto, Aug 2-4, 1990
Magnesium in Clinical Medicine and Therapeutics, A Symposium sponsored by the American Society for Magnesium Research, La Jolla, CA, May 3-4 1991: "Magnesium Deficiency in Primary Care and Preventive Medicine: Symptom profiles in relation to magnesium loading studies.
Fatty Acid Nutrition and Therapeutics, American Academy of Environmental Medicine CME Nutrition Course, Dallas TX, July 1992
Magnesium: Clinical Assessment and Therapy, American Academy of Environmental Medicine CME Nutrition Course, Dallas TX, July 1992
Diagnosis and Treatment of Small Bowel Fermentation Syndrome, Intestinal Candidiasis, Secretory IgA deficiency, American Academy of Environmental Medicine CME Nutrition Course, Dallas TX, July 1992
The Bowel and the Immune System in Chemically Sensitive Patients, American Academy of Environmental Medicine Advanced Seminar, Reno, NV, October 1993 Double Blind Placebo Diet Controlled Crossover Study of IgG ELISA Pilot I, American Academy of Environmental Medicine Advanced Seminar, Virginia Beach, VA October 1994
Your Are NOT What You Eat: Double Blind Placebo Diet Controlled Study of IgG ELISA, Pilot II. American College for Advancement in Medicine Semi Annual Meeting, San Diego, CA , November 1994
Alternative Approaches to Autism, NIH State of the Science Seminar, National Institutes of Health, Bethesda, MD, April 11, 1995 (With Dr. Bernard Rimland) How The Gut Knows What It’s Got, - Mucosal Immune Recognition. Conference on GI Functional Assessment. Hyatt Regency, San Francisco, May 6-7, 1995 Biochemistry and Immunology of Autism, Autism Research Institute Seminar, Chicago, June 1996
The DAN! Protocol for Autism: Instutute for the Achievement of Human Potential, Wyndmoor, PA, May 1997
The Autism Database, DAN! Conference, San Diego, September 1997
Keynote lecture: Nutrient Effects in Clinical Medicine: Maximizing Genetic Potential, 5th International Symposium in Functional Medicine, Hawaii, May 1998 Workshop: The Daily Practice of Functional Mapping the Territory; 5th International Symposium in Functional Medicine, Hawaii, May 1998
Interpretation of Laboratory Tests and Clinical Strategies in Treatment of Autism, Conference on Effective Natural Approaches for Treating Children with Autism and ADD/ADHD, Cherry Hill, NJ, October 3-4, 1998
Clinical Experience with Secretin in Treatment of Autism: NICHD/NIDCD Autism Network on the Neurobiology and Genetics of Autism, National Institutes of Health, Bethesda, MD, December 14, 1998 Children as an Indicator Species: Autism and Attention Deficit. Smith College Faculty – Student Colloquium on the Ecology of Childhood.,Northampton, MA, November 19, 1998
Rhythmic Aspects of Functional Medical Therapies, Sixth International Symposium on Functional Medicine, May 26, 1999 Tucson, Arizona
The Diplomat’s Daughter’s Coma And Other Mysteries Of Molecular Mimicry, Luncheon talk at , Sixth International Symposium on Functional Medicine, May 26, 1999, Tucson, Arizona
Detoxification and Homocysteine. Healthtrends 2000, Copenhagen August 1999
The DAN! Protocol, Where We Have Come From, Where Are We Going, Defeat Autism Now, Annual Conference, October 1-3, 1999, Cherry Hill, New Jersey
What works, Defeat Autism Now, Annual Conference, September 2000, San Diego Two lectures on clinical aspects of Autism, Defeat Autism Now, Annual Conference, May 2001, Atlanta
Two lectures on clinical aspects of Autism, Defeat Autism Now, Semi-Annual Conference, October 2001, San Diego
Biomedical approaches to Autism, The DAN! Protocol, Review of Secretin in Autism: Congresso Internazionale “Il tesoro sommerso” Ricerca e riabilitazione nell’Autismo. Verona, Italy November 15, 2001
Two lectures on clinical aspects of Autism, Defeat Autism Now, SemiAnnual Conference, May 2002, Boston
Workshop on Autism for Wallingford Connecticut Board of Education, School Psychologists, August 2002
Basic Clinical Strategies in Autism, DAN! Conference, San Diego, CA, October 26 2003
Chosing The Best Treatment For Your Child, DAN! Conference, San Diego, CA, October 27, 2003
Individuality and Thiol Chemistry in Autistic Children, With Jill James, PhD. 2006 Spring DAN! Meeting, Washington DC April 4-10
Who Ignores Individuality Fails the Patient. Institute for Functional Medicine, 13th Internation Symposium. April 19-22, 2006 Tampa, FL.
The Oceanic Disease, , Defeat Autism Now, Annual Conference, April 2008, Chery Hill , NJ

COMMUNITY SERVICE
Board of Directors, Women's Health Services, New Haven, CT, a free standing, feminist health care and health education service (1971 1985)
Professional Advisory Board Member of The Huxley Institute for Biosocial Research (1979-1985)

MILITARY SERVICE
U.S. Army Reserve, 1956 1963; Rank at discharge: SP 5 Member 340th General Hospital, New Haven, CT.

GENERAL BACKGROUND Born January 28, 1937 in Providence, Rhode Island. Grew up in Wellesley Hills, MA; Shaker Heights, OH; and Exeter, NH. Father was a Unitarian Minister and the Dean of Students, Massachusetts Institute of Technology, 1947 1950 (killed in a plane crash in 1950). Mother, an artist (died in 1974) was married in 1956 to Henry W. Bragdon, author and history teacher at Phillips Exeter Academy.
PERSONAL INTERESTS
Gardening, Carpentry, Photography, Hiking, Canoeing

Dr. Baker connected the dots of what can go wrong when magnesium is not properly absorbed in the RIGHT form.

[Olaf]

A few remarks from a Natural Health Practicioner

1. Sick and weak people very often have a deficiency of magnesium.
In western world in most cases this is a result of acidosis.

2. Magnesium is needed in transport and activation of vitamin D. That's why each symptom indicating a magnesium deficiency also can indicate a deficiency of vitamin D (which is very common in the more northern and southern parts of the earth).

3. Symptoms of magnesium deficieny are also similar to a deficieny of potassium (Kalium). In most cases you have both.

4. Only some kinds of magnesium salts can be assimilated by the human body.
The best are: magnesium citrate, magnesium orotate
Magnesium oxide is almost useless.

[Bob]

Is Mercury destroying Magnesium? Some studies are saying it certainly is...

Mercury binds with magnesium and renders it void.

Not to go off-topic (stick with vaccine threads please to discuss vaccination issues... please)... but MERCURY is added to some vaccines..

Are people absolutely certain that the VACCINE (deactivated virus, or attenuated virus) is causing the problem, and not the MAGNESIUM shortage by MERCURY being injected into the body with the VACCINE?


extracted from: http://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/concerns/thimerosal/

Thimerosal is a mercury-based preservative that has been used for decades in the United States in multi-dose vials (vials containing more than one dose) of medicines and vaccines. There is no evidence of harm caused by the low doses of thimerosal in vaccines, except for minor reactions like redness and swelling at the injection site. However, in July 1999, the Public Health Service agencies, the American Academy of Pediatrics, and vaccine manufacturers agreed that thimerosal should be reduced or eliminated in vaccines as a precautionary measure.


Thimerosal contains ethylmercury.

Mercury is a naturally occurring element found in the earth's crust, air, soil, and water. Two types of mercury to which people may be exposed -- methylmercury and ethylmercury -- are very different.

Methylmercury is the type of mercury found in certain kinds of fish. At high exposure levels methylmercury can be toxic to people. In the United States, federal guidelines keep as much methylmercury as possible out of the environment and food, but over a lifetime, everyone is exposed to some methylmercury.

Thimerosal contains ethylmercury, which is cleared from the human body more quickly than methylmercury, and is therefore less likely to cause any harm (according to the CDC).


Thimerosal prevents the growth of bacteria in vaccines.

Thimerosal is added to vials of vaccine that contain more than one dose (multi-dose vials) to prevent growth of germs, like bacteria and fungi. Introduction of bacteria and fungi has the potential to occur when a syringe needle enters a vial as a vaccine is being prepared for administration. Contamination by germs in a vaccine could cause severe local reactions, serious illness or death. In some vaccines, preservatives, including thimerosal, are added during the manufacturing process to prevent germ growth.

Just consider the OP post 1 symptoms... How many of those (if not all) have been attributed to having gotten a VACCINATION, and then people get sick with the symptoms? Could it be as ridiculously obvious (and simple to treat) with the liquid MAGNESIUM BICARBONATE??

Hmmmm..... dots.. many dots connecting...

MERCURY Blocks magnesium and zinc. Mercury binds with magnesium and renders it void.

Supplementing won’t be enough, must detoxify the mercury....

BICARBONATE Channel is the essential Channel (the pathways in and out)

The Bicarbonate acts as a transporter of magnesium into the mitochondria.
(stay away from pure magnesium OXIDE)

WHY MAGNESIUM IN the BICARBONATE FORM?

Magnesium influx is linked with bicarbonate transport according to the Dietary Reference Intakes guide from the Institute of Medicine.

AND MERCURY can be transported OUT with bicarbonate forms.. hmmm... dots.. more dots connecting...

Dr Russell Beckett, a veterinarian with a PhD in biochemical pathology that paved the way to understand the significance of bicarbonate acting in conjunction with magnesium.

He has formulated Unique Water which, it has been asserted, slowed the ageing process and increased the length of life of humans and other mammals and could be used to treat all inflammatory and degenerative diseases. Unique Water is water containing magnesium bicarbonate at an alkaline pH value. Dr. Beckett’s theoretical and experimental research has resulted in the understanding how important both of bicarbonate and magnesium ions are in human physiology and how they work together to optimize human health and the ability to recover from disease.

Bicarbonate ions working alongside magnesium would naturally create the conditions for increased glucose transport across cell plasma membranes.

Bicarbonate ions without doubt create the alkaline conditions for maintaining the enzyme activity of pancreatic secretions in the intestines.

Bicarbonate neutralize acid conditions required for inflammatory reactions hence sodium bicarbonate would be of benefit in the treatment of a range of chronic inflammatory and autoimmune diseases. An excellent research group called Agua G is studying the overall benefits of bicarbonate in human physiology.

Bicarbonate acts to stimulate the ATPase by acting directly on it...

[TrumanCash]

Hi, Bob. How does this recipe compare to Natural Calm (http://naturalvitality.com/natural-calm/) (besides being less expensive)?

TLC

[Bob]

M.O.M. (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?86797-Magnesium-BiCarbonate-Water-a-guide-to-make&p=1019790&viewfull=1#post1019790) is Magnesium Hydroxide and is NOT magnesium oxide.

The PDF in the OP post #1 describes a simple recipe with over-the-counter, "supermarket" items readily available. Some people have chosen to use carbon dioxide cylinders in making their own "carbonated water" (https://www.sodastreamusa.com/) as opposed to buying carbonated water off the shelf.

For the non-technical minded who want to get started FAST, the PDF's recipe seems to be the easier method, and the fastest..

For this magnesium bicarbonate recipe you are to use Magnesium Hydroxide (MOM) and not magnesium oxide. There is a big difference..

(see another article: http://drsircus.com/medicine/magnesium/the-ultimate-mitochondrial-cocktail by Dr. Sircus - "Magnesium Bicarbonate – The Ultimate Mitochondrial Cocktail - Dr Sircus on December 8, 2009 "

reference search: sparkling water makers - https://www.google.com/search?q=sparkling+water+makers&oq=sparkling+water+makers

[TrumanCash]

Hi, Bob. How does this recipe compare to Natural Calm (http://naturalvitality.com/natural-calm/) (besides being less expensive)?

TLC

I just checked the label on Natural Calm and it says: "ionic magnesium citrate (created from a highly absorbable proprietary blend of citric acid and magnesium carbonate).

Has anyone out there tried both formulas to compare the results?

[Bob]

Hi Truman - looks like MAGNESIUM CITRATE is the key ingredient within "Natural Calm"..


http://naturalvitality.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/calm-supfacts-063015.jpg

the Magnesium BiCarbonate mechanism appears to be the more useful mechanism, from the BiCarbonate form.. (and as you point out is lower cost to make in the BiCarbonate form than an off the shelf Magnesium Citrate powder.. the BiCarbonate form appears to have good uses, simplicity to make with over-the-counter easy to obtain product (worldwide)...)



Hi, Bob. How does this recipe compare to Natural Calm (http://naturalvitality.com/natural-calm/) (besides being less expensive)?

TLC

[Bob]

Hi, Bob. How does this recipe compare to Natural Calm (http://naturalvitality.com/natural-calm/) (besides being less expensive)?

TLC

I just checked the label on Natural Calm and it says: "ionic magnesium citrate (created from a highly absorbable proprietary blend of citric acid and magnesium carbonate).

Has anyone out there tried both formulas to compare the results?

I've used the Magnesium Citrate (capsule form) in the past with mixed results..

The Citrate form (Magnesium Citrate) had apparently ZERO ability to deal with MERCURY toxicity..

The BiCarbonate form of Magnesium appears to be very good in dealing with mercury toxicity from vaccinations plus old eroding mercury fillings...

I'm switching over to the BiCarbonate recipe..

Probably there is an additional benefit to FRESHLY made water/bicarbonate/magnesium.. This is different than adding trace minerals to water..

I had gotten a Mercury preserved vaccination recently (oye, I know), and I have mercury fillings.. And had been getting the symptoms as described in the post with muscle ticks, and other MERCURY associated issues (which looks more like the MERCURY was contributing to a magnesium loss or blocking...)

[Bob]

Just connecting more dots here - mercury blocks magnesium and zinc, the "deficiency symptoms surface"..

Bottled water - how pure is it from Mercury?

Coal fired power plants put mercury in the air (and then it ends up in the water).

Cement plants use the FLY ASH byproduct from coal fired power plants, which is RICH in mercury. Cement plants could contribute to MERCURY emission, which ends up in the WATER in bottled water - are there bottling plants near-by mercury users/producers ? Gold mining (artesian mining frequently uses mercury in gold extraction) mercury run-off into the streams, which downstream are being used for drinking/cooking/irrigation/washing (and bottling?)...

Just dots connecting... would terroristic activity (the extreme psychosis exhibited to have to "act out" violently) be due to mercury induced MAGNESIUM abnormalities..? Could it be coming from bottled water? Or drinking mercury laden water? Could something as simple as switching over to Magnesium BiCarbonate water, even in small levels start to remove mercury toxicity, and help stabilize world terror issues? Just gets me scratching my head on this one..

How vast is this toxicity, we know about the mercury in vaccines, what about the mercury in the foods/water being consumed worldwide? IF mercury is creating so much nervous system and organ/cell damage, are we missing what the significance of mercury toxicity is? Blaming the wrong category cause that is the most obvious, and not looking at the mechanism as to WHY?

Could Magnesium BiCarbonate in PURE water be that simple to help so many issues? This begs room for thought and testing..
http://cc.amazingcounters.com/counter.php?i=3190880&c=9572953

[ThePythonicCow]

Some people have chosen to use carbon dioxide cylinders in making their own "carbonated water" (https://www.sodastreamusa.com/) as opposed to buying carbonated water off the shelf.
That's what I use - a SodaStream to inject carbon dioxide into the distilled water from my Megahome counter top distiller. The Sodastream bottles then make a fine way to store the solution in the refrigerator, with a top that keeps a pressure seal. I first chill the water, as chilled water will dissolve more carbon dioxide (that's why the gas bubbles out of a soda drink when it gets warm). I then add 3 tablespoons of Philips Milk of Magnesia (plain, not flavored) to the bottle and keep cold and closed, while shaking a couple of times over the next day, to get it all to dissolve.

One of my other favorites is transdermal magnesium chloride (http://www.ancient-minerals.com/transdermal-magnesium/). I keep a spray bottle of it near my computer, and spray some on my skin, when the muscle in an old leg wound starts twitching (my "low magnesium barometer".)


Could Magnesium BiCarbonate in PURE water be that simple to help so many issues? This begs room for thought and testing..
There are many ways that the body can be deficient in something, or out of balance, or overloaded with some toxins. The cure for many issues is whatever you need more or less of. In today's world, of foods grown in mineral deficient soils, with an abundance of toxins at every stage of growing and producing our food, and with more toxins in our air, water, vaccines, drugs and elsewhere, and with plastic fantastic faux-food having an infinite shelf life (in other words, doesn't support life) replacing real food, there is often a long list of things we have too little of or too much of.

The symptoms that manifest from most chronic ailments, from my minor leg muscle twitch, to advanced cancer, heart disease and Alzheimer's, don't reliably tell what you need more or less of.

One by one, you focus in on a symptom, and backtrack to what that might tell you that you're getting too little or too much of. At the same time, you follow articles (such as this thread) which highlight various nutrients many of us are short of, and toxins we have too much of, and consider whether or not that might apply to one's own life.

Saying that one particular remedy is "the cure for many issues" is like saying the cure for your car not running is more petro (gas). If you're out of gas, sure, that works wonders. But if your battery is dead, or your drive shaft broken, or ... then the cure is something else entirely. The first job of a good car mechanic, or a good health worker, or a good computer repairmen, is to back up the trail of symptoms and circumstances, to figure out what's actually broken and then to figure out a reasonable way to fix it.

[Sunny-side-up]

Hi Bob

Cement plants use the FLY ASH byproduct from coal fired power plants, which is RICH in mercury

Wasn't there a post in Avalon saying that some of the ingredients used in some Chem-trail spraying is 'FLY ASH byproduct'

[idiit]

Health Benefits Of Epsom Salt

Researchers and physicians suggest these health benefits from proper magnesium and sulfate levels, as listed on the website of the Epsom Salt Industry Council:


1. Eases stress and relaxes the body

Stress drains the body of magnesium and increases levels of adrenaline. When dissolved in warm water, Epsom salt is absorbed through the skin and replenishes the level of magnesium in the body. The magnesium helps to produce serotonin, a mood-elevating chemical within the brain that creates a feeling of calm and relaxation. Research shows that magnesium also increases energy and stamina by encouraging the production of ATP (adenosine triphosphate), the energy packets made in the cells. Experts believe that bathing with Epsom salt at least three times a week helps you to look better, feel better and gain more energy. Magnesium ions also relax and reduce irritability by lowering the effects of adrenaline. They create a relaxed feeling, improve sleep and concentration, and help muscles and nerves to function properly.

2. Relieves pain and muscle cramps

An Epsom salt bath is known to ease pain and relieve inflammation, making it beneficial in the treatment of sore muscles, bronchial asthma and migraine headaches. In addition, it has been known to heal cuts and reduce soreness from childbirth. Mix a thick paste of Epsom salt with hot water and apply to get soothing comfort. Try soaking your aching, tired (and smelly) feet in a tub of water with half a cup of Epsom salt softens skin and will even neutralize foot odor.

3. Helps muscles and nerves function properly

Studies show that Epsom salt can help regulate electrolytes in your body, ensuring proper functioning of the muscles, nerves and enzymes. Magnesium is also known to be critical in the proper use of calcium, which serves as a main conductor of the electric impulses in your body.

4. Helps prevent hardening of arteries and blood clots

Epsom salt is believed to improve heart health and help prevent heart disease and strokes by improving blood circulation, protecting the elasticity of arteries, preventing blood clots and reducing the risk of sudden heart attack deaths, lowering blood pressure.

5. Makes insulin more effective

Proper magnesium and sulfate levels increase the effectiveness of insulin in the body, and can help to lower the risk or severity of diabetes.

6. Relieves constipation

Numerous studies have revealed that Epsom salt can be used to treat constipation. Taken internally, Epson salt acts as a detoxifying agent for colon cleansing. The salt acts like a laxative by increasing water in the intestines and can bring about temporary relief from constipation. However, it is strictly warned that Epsom salts should not be used to relieve constipation without the consultation of a physician.

7. Eliminates toxins from the body

The sulfates in Epsom salt help flush toxins and heavy metals from the cells, easing muscle pain and helping the body to eliminate harmful substances. Your skin is a highly porous membrane and adding the right minerals to your bathwater triggers a process called reverse osmosis, which actually pulls salt out of your body, and harmful toxins along with it. For a detoxifying bath, at least once weekly add two cups of Epsom salt to the water in a bathtub and soak for 10 minutes.


http://www.curejoy.com/content/epsom-salt-magnesium-supplement-health-benefits/

[Bob]

I trust people understand that Magnesium BiCarbonate is totally DIFFERENT (which is the SUBJECT of THIS thread), and works with the BICARBONATE transport mechanism of the cells. In the OP post #1, and this post (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?86797-Magnesium-BiCarbonate-Water-a-guide-to-make&p=1019803&viewfull=1#post1019803) above, I mention it is important to use the proper type of MAGNESIUM. Magnesium is a METAL, and to be absorbable by the cells, it must be converted to another chemical. The other CHEMICAL is usually an ACID.

The typical ACIDS being used to dissolve MAGNESIUM METAL are:

Hydrochloric Acid - doing so liberates hydrogen gas, the resultant compound is called Magnesium Chloride.
Citric Acid - the resulting compound is called Magnesium Citrate
Carbonic Acid (Co2 in Water, called sparkling water) - Magnesium Carbonate.. To make Magnesium BiCarbonate (a different formula) the staring chemical is Magnesium Hydroxide. Magnesium Hydroxide (Milk of Magnesia) is converted into Magnesium Chloride if ingested (in the Stomach with it's hydrochloric acid, Magnesium Hydroxide WILL neutralize hydrochloric Acid). Magnesium Chloride can transport across the skin (as Paul pointed out in his uses transdermally).
Acetic Acid (Vinegar) - Magnesium Acetate
Sulfuric Acid (battery acid) - Magnesium Sulfate (prime ingredient of Epsom Salts).
Aspartic, Malic and Orotic Acid - for making Magnesium Apartate, Magnesium Malate and Magnesium Orotate.

The particular type of magnesium is transported in different ways and acts differently in the body. This THREAD is about the BiCarbonate mechanism of Magnesium, and the process of making as the thread's title says, "Magnesium BiCarbonate Water a guide of How to make" such in a PURE FRESH WAY.

To clarify - the SULFATE form and the Chloride form have different transport mechanisms into the cells.

Bicarbonate form of Magnesium (the OP post 1 in this thread):

see: http://www.medicinenet.com/electrolytes/page3.htm
Bicarbonate

The bicarbonate ion acts as a buffer to maintain the normal levels of acidity (pH) in blood and other fluids in the body. Bicarbonate levels are measured to monitor the acidity of the blood and body fluids. The acidity is affected by foods or medications that we ingest and the function of the kidneys and lungs. The chemical notation for bicarbonate on most lab reports is HCO3- or represented as the concentration of carbon dioxide (CO2). The normal serum range for bicarbonate is 22-30 mmol/L.

The bicarbonate test is usually performed along with tests for other blood electrolytes. Disruptions in the normal bicarbonate level may be due to diseases that interfere with respiratory function, kidney diseases, metabolic conditions, or other causes.

Balance

Excessive magnesium inhibits calcium and excessive calcium inhibits magnesium. This is a balance that must be obtained. Same with Sodium and Potassium - a balance must be maintained. Taking SALTS are other anion transport mechanisms, so using Sodium Bicarbonate with Magnesium Hydroxide in the presence of hydrochloric Acid (Stomach acid) will increase the Sodium Chloride amount when the reaction generates Sodium Chloride.

The purest method for the sole Magnesium BiCarbonate form would be to apply the technique shown in the PDF, to add the Magnesium Hydroxide to the Carbonic Acid Water. Paul mentioned the use of the Seltzer maker technique for absolute control of the WATER USED (guaranteed distilled and controlled)..

From: http://www.enzymestuff.com/magnesium.htm

Symptoms of Magnesium Deficiency

Magnesium deficiency is associated with fibromyalgia, chronic fatigue, migraines, and a bunch of other ailments. Supplementing with magnesium has helped many of these conditions in clinical studies.

The symptoms of magnesium deficiency are irritability, tantrums, seizures, insomnia, muscle cramps/twitching, hyperactivity and poor digestion among others. Magnesium is needed for proper electrolyte function, over 300 enzyme functions, and calcium absorbtion.

I also found it very interested to read that one of the primary sources of dietary magnesium is whole grains and cereals. If one goes 100% gluten free, you may be losing a main source of magnesium, and could go deficient especially if you are also supplementing with extra calcium to make up for the casein free part.

Higher amount of magnesium may cause a laxative effect (milk of magnesia, and Epsom salts).

Clinical indications of magnesium deficiency were associated with the following:


ADD/ADHD
Alzheimer's disease
Anxiety
Asthma
Attention deficit disorder
Autism
Auto immune disorders- all types
Cerebral Palsy- in children from magnesium deficient mothers
Chronic fatigue syndrome
Chronic pain
Congestive heart failure
Constipation
Crohn's disease
Depression
Diabetes mellitus
Endometriosis
Fibromyalgia
Gut disorders- including peptic ulcer, Crohn's disease, colitis
Food allergy
Headaches
Hyperactivity
Hypertension
Hypoglycemia
Insomnia
Irritable bowel syndrome
Menopause
Migraines
Multiple sclerosis
Muscle cramps
Muscle weakness, fatigue
Osteoarthritis
Osteoporosis
Parkinson's disease
PMS
Psoriasis
Schizophrenia
Stress
Systemic lupus erythematosus (SLE)
Tension
Ulcerative colitis


The TRANSPORT mechanism of WHERE the magnesium goes in the CELLS is IMPORTANT.. That means the carrier for the magnesium is dependent on the ION (from the acid).

If one is interested in getting cellular ENERGY, ATP benefits, the BiCarbonate form is linked with MitoChondrial pathways.

[Bob]

WHY MAGNESIUM IN BICARBONATE FORM?

Magnesium influx is linked with bicarbonate transport according to the Dietary Reference Intakes guide from the Institute of Medicine.

AND MERCURY can be transported OUT with bicarbonate forms of Magnesium.. hmmm... dots.. more dots connecting... (that doesn't happen with oxides, chloride, orotate, citrate, sulfate forms of magnesium salts.)

Dr Russell Beckett, a veterinarian with a PhD in biochemical pathology that paved the way to understand the significance of bicarbonate acting in conjunction with magnesium. He has formulated Unique Water which, it has been asserted, slowed the ageing process and increased the length of life of humans and other mammals and could be used to treat all inflammatory and degenerative diseases. Unique Water is water containing magnesium bicarbonate at an alkaline pH value.

Dr. Beckett’s theoretical and experimental research has resulted in the understanding how important both of bicarbonate and magnesium ions are in human physiology and how they work together to optimize human health and the ability to recover from disease.

Bicarbonate ions working alongside magnesium would naturally create the conditions for increased glucose transport across cell plasma membranes.

Bicarbonate ions without doubt create the alkaline conditions for maintaining the enzyme activity of pancreatic secretions in the intestines.

Bicarbonate neutralize acid conditions required for inflammatory reactions hence sodium bicarbonate would be of benefit in the treatment of a range of chronic inflammatory and autoimmune diseases. An excellent research group called Agua G is studying the overall benefits of bicarbonate in human physiology.

Bicarbonate acts to stimulate the ATPase by acting directly on it...

Sodium Bicarbonate will increase Chloride ions (Sodium Chloride) when taken internally with the hydrochloric acid of the stomach.
NaHCO3(aq) + HCl(aq) → NaCl(aq) + CO2(g) + H2O(l)

The liberation of CO2 will happen in the stomach, with a concentration of TABLE SALT being created. Sodium Chloride.. Do we want more sodium chloride in the stomach? Are the excess chloride ions going to useful, or if SULFURIC acid was used as in Epsom salts, is the extra SULFATE Ions going to be useful? At which point is OUT-OF-BALANCE induced?

This is why the choice of the ACID is important, the resultant chemical product of the reactions may not be what is desired. What about then formulating a proper mineral base to mix with the CARBONIC ACID? (See Paul's threads on adding proper trace minerals to the Carbonated Water).. As Paul pointed out in his thread, the exact diagnosis, and the exact balancing mechanism is needed to fix what is going wrong (or what went wrong).. Creating an EXCESS can create the symptoms of the deficiency..

[sigma6]

Great thread, thanks for all the detailed infos, every time I study health and nutrition, I always step back and realize how important EVERY vitamin and mineral is... And how almost impossible it is to keep track of every interaction... As a result my answer to this is to make sure I combine as many supplements I can get a hold of...

To that end, I start with a scoop (or two) of green powder, all in one meal substitute as a base (currently Vega One, but there are many...) ... then usually purchase average grade vitamins... (a lot Puritan's Pride stuff, although I have been having doubts since they got bought out by the Carlyle group after 50 years of private ownership...o.O? but that's another story...) ie. A to E with Cod Liver Oil (for A and D) B-complex, some isolated Bs, C complex, and E and an average grade multi mineral... and a few isolated minerals... like chromium, boron, manganese, msm (organic sulphur)

Additionally I have brewer's yeast, yeast flakes (more B-complex) powderized psyllium, citrus pectin (fiber), creatine flax seeds (more fiber, omega 3) kelp powder (trace minerals), chlorella (detox) and enzyme digests, apple cider vinegar (enhance absorption)

I currently add even more supplements related to weight loss, but that is specialized and peripheral so will leave them out for now...

But the idea is to make as rich and complex a mix of nutrients as possible... Now this may sound like a lot and it is a small investment, but to make it work, you have to get the most out of it, which means processing and mixing them altogether, then taking in measured doses over extended periods...

To that purpose, I grind all the dry vitamins (mortar & pestle) empty the plastic caps into mix, grind flax (coffee grinder) add all these mixtures into green powder base, add measures of yeasts, fibers, kelp, etc, mix that (all together now...!) for a SUPER NUTRITION blast.... it usually makes around 250 grams of powerhouse nutrition... I then about 30-40g (use a scale) 1-3x daily depending... add a half chopped apple, half frozen banana, dash of oj, tbsp of yogurt (optional) top with distilled water in a magic bullet... the only "pills" remaining are the oil based Cod Liver and E, consume with or after a meal, although there is enough "food" in there to enjoy all by itself, taking small sips over a period of time...

I pray it deals with all my issues which you mentioned many above, re: heavy metals, mineral lack, stress load, etc... sometimes it is so powerful I can feel a difference within minutes... I find making it ahead and then taking it in smaller doses spread out over longer periods is more effective, as always regularity is the key. This is all based on two key (and related) principles: (1) there are ENDLESS interactions between ALL the vitamins and minerals in the body... and (2) because of this, the body prefers complexity (whole foods) to over refined, synthesized or purified compounds which are treated like toxic poisons (ie. pharmaceutical "chemicals") and immediately targeted for excretion by the liver and kidneys.

I reminded of this every time I read excellent posts like this one... (thanks again)
this concludes my "simple shotgun approach" to health care... : D

[ThePythonicCow]

(See Paul's threads on adding proper trace minerals to the Carbonated Water).
I've never yet done a proper job of writing up all that I do to "make" my water ... but this post of mine probably has the most information: Fluoride - a conversation with an insider who knows the real story -- Post #92 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?4228-Fluoride-a-conversation-with-an-insider-who-knows-the-real-story&p=827262&viewfull=1#post827262). That post is however a year and half old, and I've continued to refine (complicate) the process since then.

[Bob]

Thanks Paul and Sigma !

I'm going to repost the video you have Paul here on the BiCarbonate of Magnesium water:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kVFjQ-ZrEs


Having done stupid and gotten a mercury toxic reaction (pretty sure that's what's been the results and not "flu") it just calls so much reality about getting the mineral levels right.. My observation is magnesium ion transport has been messed up due to the mercury.. Another person I know who had a vaccination about the same timing as I did with a similar formulation, came down with about similar body symptoms as described in the OP post 1 of this thread. (I don't react negatively to vaccinations WITHOUT the crazy preservatives or mercury)... It's the Mercury that's messing with the cells/energy and nervous system I've observed. Which pushes a Magnesium shortage.. and then its a matter of how to get the right magnesium into the cellular mitochondria - ... bicarbonate version of magnesium :)

The magnesium bicarbonate IS serving as the regulator mechanism for the cells, for potassium/sodium/calcium.. so think about if one were to harm a body, low doses of mercury.. (and arsenic/lead).. would drive out the cellular regulator (and harm the repair ability)..

Getting the right magnesium in using the bicarbonate ion transport mechanism has worked wonders.. Energy levels skyrocketed.. :)

[elearah]

I have a maybe silly question for the chemists out there...
I'm taking vitamin C as ascorbate making it at home, that is mixing ascorbic acid and sodium bicarbonate 50-50 in the presence of water. The chemical reaction as far as I understand, releases co2 (it looks and tastes like sparkling water to me). Can I put the milk of magnesia in there?

[Bob]

I have a maybe silly question for the chemists out there...
I'm taking vitamin C as ascorbate making it at home, that is mixing ascorbic acid and sodium bicarbonate 50-50 in the presence of water. The chemical reaction as far as I understand, releases co2 (it looks and tastes like sparkling water to me). Can I put the milk of magnesia in there?

Hi Elearah - in the PDF recipe in the Op Post #1, the cookbook formula says to use one Litre of Chilled Sparkling water. Then adding the Magnesium Hydroxide (M.O.M) and shaking and dissolving until the BiCarbonate of Magnesium is formed. At that point you have the BiCarbonate.. It may be possible then, in a sample to add Vitamin C as Ascorbate to the Magnesium BiCarbonate.

What may happen is a precipitate of the Magnesium may settle out, as adding in the acid once again from the ascorbic acid may change the pH dramatically.. Usually when that happens dissolved substances precipitate out.

So starting with the recipe as described with the sparkling water (chilled), then try taking a sample of that, and adding in a small amount of ascorbic acid and see what happens. If you have a way to test the acid-base pH, that would be good to see what's happening..

Of course it could be possible to simply keep the two separate, and use what you normally use, and have Magnesium Bicarbonate "beverage" as a separate item..
http://cc.amazingcounters.com/counter.php?i=3190880&c=9572953

[elearah]

Hi Bob, thanks for answering. :)
I might have not been clear enough... when you mix ascorbic acid with sodium bicarbonate in the presence of water, the result is ascorbate (a salt, but in ion form if I get it right) + co2, this has neutral ph. Usually you let it sit until it stops bubbling, to make sure the chemical reaction is complete and then drink it. My question was on the line of taking advantage of that co2 instead of letting it vent. What i don't know if the milk of magnesia can react with the ascorbate (which I want as is) instead of doing solely with the co2.

[Bob]

Hi Bob, thanks for answering. :)
I might have not been clear enough... when you mix ascorbic acid with sodium bicarbonate in the presence of water, the result is ascorbate (a salt, but in ion form if I get it right) + co2, this has neutral ph. Usually you let it sit until it stops bubbling, to make sure the chemical reaction is complete and then drink it. My question was on the line of taking advantage of that co2 instead of letting it vent. What i don't know if the milk of magnesia can react with the ascorbate (which I want as is) instead of doing solely with the co2.


Good question :)

The recipe calls for "chilled" water plus CO2 under pressure to get the magnesium hydroxide to convert adequately to magnesium BiCarbonate. I've just recently gone to the store to look at the various formulations of Milk of Magnesia (various brands) and noticed some brands are including what they are considering "inactive" products which are small amounts of ascorbic acid and citric acid. That is curious as one would assume that the "acids" would interact with the "bases" and create salts.. I'd love to see a spectrographic readout of different versions what the chemistry is. Without the CO2 being chilled and under pressure there may be insufficient reaction with the Magnesium hydroxide..

My interest is focusing on the BiCarbonate Magnesium, and how stable is that with high stomach acid (hydrochloric acid).. Which one would assume then the magnesium BiCarbonate is going to interact with the HCL and start forming Magnesium Chloride.. If I assume the stomach acid is lowered, maybe then more absorption would happen of the BiCarbonate... Possibly a sublingual aborption is a good way to get it in without the Chloride formation ??

I suppose experimenting for results would be of use too.. Acids certainly are going to affect a basic substance, but it's a "salt" already (product of a strong base plus an acid) where the magnesium Hydroxide has been combined with "CHILLED" carbon dioxide.. So modifying the recipe with Bicarbonate plus Ascorbate to release a small amount of Co2 in a "WARM" solution may not provide sufficient "CHILLED" carbonic acid to combine with the Magnesium Hydroxide... -- that is what I assume where the experimentation will come in to look at effective YIELDS of Magnesium BiCarbonate.. (chemistry can be FUN when the reactions are studied, sorta like making Souffles.. when it works they are great when it flops.. well.. :) )

[Bob]

What sources (brands) of Milk of Magnesia (Magnesium Hydroxide in water suspension) are available?

(Source (http://www.toxinless.com/milk-of-magnesia))

Dollar General Milk of Magnesia (Original Flavor)
Available on dollargeneral.com
Magnesium hydroxide, purified water.

Good Sense Milk of Magnesia
Available on Amazon
Magnesium hydroxide, purified water.

Kroger Milk of Magnesia (Original Flavor)
Magnesium hydroxide, purified water.

TopCare Milk of Magnesia (Original Flavor)
Magnesium hydroxide, purified water.

-- This is the brand that I used:
http://www.toxinless.com/milk-of-magnesia-banner.jpg

Observations during making of the Concentrate:

What I found was that the seltzer bottle and liquid should be CHILLED for at least a couple hours in the coldest part of the fridge. The more chilled the less gas escapes.

I measured out the 3 tablespoon fulls (45 mL) of the MOM in the supplied plastic cup and had that ready.

I moved from the fridge CAREFULLY without any shaking at this time the seltzer bottle over to the sink basin and placed it stable so that it won't wiggle.. Carefully and slowly removing the cap now, the MOM from the plastic cup is poured carefully into the seltzer bottle.

There is a small amount of space in the seltzer bottle, and this is taken up by the MOM mixture being added, and it is possible that VERY RAPID bubbling will start up when the MOM is added.

You must at this time CLOSE THE CAP quickly and tightly so as to not loose liquid and gas. Some may try to spill over, which is why I put it in the sink to avoid a mess.

--- Now shake this bottle up with the MOM so that the mixture becomes a milky grey.. AND keep shaking for about a minute.

Put it back in the fridge in that cold place for at least an hour.

Take it out and observe. There will be a bit of a layer on the bottom of the bottle, of un-reacted magnesium hydroxide.

-- Shake it again for about a minute, and the greyish milky appearance (lighter this time) will be more like looking at a FOG.

Put it in the fridge once again for an hour, and there may be SOME cloudy appearance. That is OK, it will settle out over time..

--- Notice that the walls of the seltzer bottle (over-the-counter seltzer plastic bottle) will start to cave in.

What has happened is a vacuum will have formed, where the CO2 instead of pressurizing the bottle, has now been changed into BiCarbonate with the Magnesium, creating the Magnesium BiCarbonate.

-- Opening the bottle..

When the bottle is opened this time, there will be no hissing from CO2, and some air will get it, and the bottle sides will pop back out.

You now have ONE LITRE of CONCENTRATE of magnesium bicarbonate in purified water.


====================================

My experimenting was thusly performed:

Although the recipe in the OP post 1 calls for immediate dilution to make a large quantity of consumable liquid, I felt that to experiment to see how I would react should be done slowly..

I measured out 1 fluid ounce of the concentrate from the refrigerated seltzer bottle which we made up previously, and again noted that there was NO FIZZ..

I poured out 12 ounces of distilled water into a cup, and then added the one ounce of magnesium biCarbonate concentrate.

No observable change was noted in the cup, it did not go cloudy, indicating a perfect mixing...

---- Taste:

I sampled a bit of this holding it in my mouth. Woahhh, sweet water, like not a normal type of water... then swallowed.

Hmmm, felt "interesting"...

Within an hour, I started to notice:
1) no pain anywhere
2) ability to have ENERGY, LOTS and LOTS of it
3) no heartburn type of reactions
4) any anxiety from stress was reducing
5) alertness - brain fog was going away
6) ENERGY, MORE ENERGY - did I say energized?
7) lowered heart rate, more steady beats, and beats that felt "stronger, fuller"
8) starting of detoxing, feeling like the liver and kidneys started to activate more fully

So weoh.. that was fantastic, and then I had some more, another sip... Maybe 4 ounces of diluted liquid so far..

This continued throughout the day, slowly consuming and watching. More clarity, more energy, better breathing, not feeling weak, but like being in a chamber breathing pure oxygen..

AND CO2 seemed to easily leave the body (this is reported, the carbonic acid or CO2 clearing is improved when the ATP, and the bicarbonate mechanism is energized)..

SO I then finished the cup about 6PM...

Of course, I wanted MORE...

h......mmmmmmmmm

WELL... so I repeated the making of another cup of diluted mixture, and had about 6 ounces at a setting...

MORE ENERGY.. and all of the above..

BUT in this case I finished the cup about 11PM and thought about bed..

(ahahhaah, no way..)

With this much energy bedtime was IMPOSSIBLE.. I wanted to go out and do a marathon.. Muscles were firing on all cylinders, and alert oh so alert, and sharp..

About 4AM I decided to try going to bed, and still felt so much energy...

Summary of the story....

Logically, it seems to me one should GO SLOW.. maybe if one wanted to explore this, that one should try TRY A LITTLE BIT if one is experimenting, and KEEP the experimentation to ONLY ONE substance to test, in this case, MAGNESIUM BiCarbonate WATER... simple and least amount of variables.

The overall suggestions from the first PDF (and reading the reports on the internet) was to try it in the morning and spread it out over the day.. My experience says I would not want to use it at night unless one has to work nights I guess.

I love this stuff. In moderately small amounts I find the improvement, especially getting my LIFE BACK (energy back, breathing great), feeling like I'm in my 30's again.

This stuff is supposed to improve longevity and the QUALITY OF LIFE. I can see that. I can feel that. I assume ALL the data to date is anecdotal and not tested double blind?

This is the Magnesium BiCarbonate in purified water - (we are told that it is able to work with the ATP, celluar mitochondria, and help to facilitate the cellular detox methods).. The detoxing out the MERCURY and other heavy metals, naturally by the cell itself, the cellular ion pumps seems to me to be quite impressive. ( I haven't done any bloodwork to see what is changing tho. ) I know how I feel tho and the change to me is personally useful.

I can easily see how having a MERCURY LADEN VACCINE caused a toxic crisis in me, and I can CERTAINLY SEE why people are so adamant against VACCINATION techniques.. My point though after experiencing the bad symptoms (the mercury toxicity), is it is NOT the virus protein we are reacting to, it IS the mercury preservatives.. So is it that the mercury is clearing out by mitochondria being activated? What wonderful questions then to obtain answers on !

[Bob]

Today I tried adding the one ounce of concentrate to a full cup of brewed coffee.. Weeee that was a NICE taste.

Of course I drank it though much faster than I would have (previously for some days now, sipping one 12 ounce amount of a water diluted concentrate throughout the day).

Improvement in alertness, probably from the coffee constituents. No acid taste in the coffee..

Like having the alertness of the coffee, plus relaxation at the same time.. This seems to help with a general feeling of wellness.


http://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/06/73/82/95/excellent-coffee.jpg

[Bob]

Another day and more de-stress, zero anxiety, no muscle pain, no muscle twitches. (Only using the diluted magnesium bicarbonate water as the mineral supplement..)

[penn]

So the heat from the coffee won't deactivate the magnesium bicarbonate?

[Bob]

I let the coffee cool down - I tried it with milk, and straight.

In both cases there didn't seem to be any dimishment.

On another observation. I push my legs pretty hard at times and definitely would cause cramping to be triggered. I noticed that although they were sore (the calf muscles), they didn't spontaneously lock up in spasm cramp. That was quite amazing to me.. I had been using the regular Magnesium Citrate, which I had thought was pretty good, and still getting leg cramps.. (All the other minerals I believe are right, as well as sodium and potassium)..

Switching over to this particular magnesium bicarbonate has been quite a change for the better for me. I am impressed, and continue to be seeing how the cells are starting to work the way I remembered many years ago.

(As to lower sodium water, I don't believe the cramps were coming from insufficient water intake.. The liquid intake per day is about the same, as is the physical exertion.. The only variable added which appears to be involved with positive benefits (at least for me), is the magnesium bicarbonate water, at a level of one ounce per day of that concentrate, diluted in some carrier, such as a 12 oz. cup of water, or other beverage.. coffee is what I tested first as the other beverage. I could try orange juice to see what that is like too)..

PS: tomorrow I will try the coffee BLACK and HOT to see what happens.

[penn]

I love black hot coffee too! So far I have only found the MOM with the additives. I will keep looking. I am anxious to hear about your hot coffee with the MOM bicarbonate!

[Bob]

I love black hot coffee too! So far I have only found the MOM with the additives. I will keep looking. I am anxious to hear about your hot coffee with the MOM bicarbonate!

Well, the recipe shown in the PDF in the OP post #1 gets rid of MOM chemically (milk of magnesia is the M.O.M. abbreviation, which is technically Magnesium Hydroxide in water), and the addition of the CO2 from the Seltzer (sparkling water) to the point where ALL of the CO2 is absorbed into the Magnesium Hydroxide chemically converting it to the BiCarbonate form..

So I suppose we could ask, is the Magnesium BiCarbonate in water concentrate, (maybe we should abbreviate it MBC ???) going to be in any way neutralized by the acid(s) in Coffee, if any.. Possibly checking the pH would show that. Great experimenting I suppose?

I know it tastes really good, like the coffee is somehow better tasting..

[Bob]

Well, the black hot coffee was superb ! And weoh, what an aroma ! it seems to work that way too..

[ThePythonicCow]

So I suppose we could ask, is the Magnesium BiCarbonate in water concentrate, (maybe we should abbreviate it MBC ???) going to be in any way neutralized by the acid(s) in Coffee, if any.. Possibly checking the pH would show that. Great experimenting I suppose?
I would be more concerned that the Magnesium BiCarbonate solution was unstable with temperature ... heat causing it to disassociate into insoluble Magnesium Carbonate, and gaseous Carbon Dioxide, or some such thing.

[Bob]

Somebody do a ph Test to see? I haven't found any changes to the negative with it in hot coffee .. What does seem to be interesting is the keeping of the liquid magnesium bicarbonate water in the mouth under the tongue to see if sublingual absorption is possible. I'll dig out some pH strips and see probably tomorrow.

==update==

I did the pH and alkalinity tests today and found nominally, 8.2 is about the pH of the concentration

Reading up on "sodium bicarbonate" decomposition under high heat, is that it would SLOWLY start to decompose, releasing carbon dioxide only above 80 degrees centigrade.


Abstract
Hot beverages such as tea, hot chocolate, and coffee are frequently served at temperatures between 160 degrees F (71.1 degrees C) and 185 degrees F (85 degrees C). Brief exposures to liquids in this temperature range can cause significant scald burns.

I never make my coffee that hot cause of the scalding, nor the tea, nor hot chocolate. I would never "boil coffee" on the pot.

The experiment that I am doing with the coffee is after it has been poured into the cup, having been freshly brewed. The transfer process from the caraf to the drinking cup drops the temperature to about 135 degrees F, and by the time the magnesium bicarbonate is added, the coffee is easily drinkable, about 120 degrees F or lower.


The preferred drinking temperature of coffee is specified in the literature as 140+/-15 degrees F (60+/-8.3 degrees C) for a population of 300 subjects.

A linear (with respect to temperature) figure of merit merged the two effects to identify an optimal drinking temperature of approximately 136 degrees F (57.8 degrees C).

The analysis points to a reduction in the presently recommended serving temperature of coffee to achieve the combined result of reducing the scald burn hazard and improving customer satisfaction.

That being the case, at the temp that I consume my coffee, it is WELL below the decomposition temperature for the conventional version of "bicarbonate" the sodium version.

(I haven't seen any complete literature on the decomposition of the magnesium bicarbonate bound to water but a brief abstract).

As the effects don't seem to be diminishing at the temperature of my coffee, but appears to allow for improvement in personal feelings of 'wellness"; my feeling is there is no problem with normal drinkable temperature coffee that I prefer..

ref: study, PUBMED - Burns. 2008 Aug;34(5):648-54. doi: 10.1016/j.burns.2007.09.012. Epub 2008 Jan 15. "Calculating the optimum temperature for serving hot beverages, Brown F1, Diller KR.

-- A 41$ research paper was found on magnesium bicarbonate in water, with it being rapidly stirred, and raised to above a temperature of greater than 50 deg. C which is 122 degrees F - and there was 88% loss of bicarbonate.

It is valid to say, DON'T BOIL your Magnesium BiCarbonate (or any bicarbonate) if you want it to stay stable in that form.

I'm happy I tried it first in cooled coffee, (with milk added), and then in my HOT coffee test, my temperatures were in what I considered comfortable. Others may make their coffee scalding.. So if that is done, there will be loss, possibly about 20% remaining, requiring more of the concentrate to get the original ounce concentration back.

(I use an optical digital thermometer with a .1 decimal point subdivision for any thermal testing btw..)

[penn]

I like my coffee on the warm side so I am excited to try it. Just have to find the right product. Soon!

Thank you all

[Ahnung-quay]

Hi Bob. Thanks for this thread. I just got my supplies and I'll be making up a batch tonight. I have some sort of arthritic problem ( not diagnosed by an M.D.). I have been keeping it under control with diet and some supplements. My diet is mostly low in sugar and emphasizes fruits and vegetables. I also eat a lot of raw nuts which are high in magnesium. I'm excited to try the magnesium water in order to see what effects it has on my carpal tunnel and arthritis.
I also am interested in the anti - aging benefits. I'm 57 and started graying in my early 50's. My parents didn't start graying until their early 60's. They also ate a lot of garden produce. Not that I think I'll lose my gray hair, lol! I don't mind aging, I just want to feel good doing it.

[Bob]

Hi Bob. Thanks for this thread. I just got my supplies and I'll be making up a batch tonight. I have some sort of arthritic problem ( not diagnosed by an M.D.). I have been keeping it under control with diet and some supplements. My diet is mostly low in sugar and emphasizes fruits and vegetables. I also eat a lot of raw nuts which are high in magnesium. I'm excited to try the magnesium water in order to see what effects it has on my carpal tunnel and arthritis.
I also am interested in the anti - aging benefits. I'm 57 and started graying in my early 50's. My parents didn't start graying until their early 60's. They also ate a lot of garden produce. Not that I think I'll lose my gray hair, lol! I don't mind aging, I just want to feel good doing it.

I noticed premature greying too, that started in the late 50's.. I've used the leafy green veggies a lot, sometimes cooked too much which may have been part of the magnesium losses, or magnesium in an inappropriate form for full absorption..

I have had an email discussion with a person in Australia who points out that Magnesium Hydroxide Liquid (MOM) is not available in Australia, over the counter, of all things, but there are Pharmacies who will make it up CUSTOM. Interesting that Australia would remove such a simple product..

But there are the alternatives, as having the Magnesium Hydroxide be made up CUSTOM (but at a much higher cost than simple, over-the-counter version would be)..

I tested the coffee again this morning, with milk added, and it was 119.3 F.. Adding in the one ounce of MBC (Magnesium BiCarbonate Water) reduced the temperature to 118.4 - there was no apparent bubbling, no gas coming off the solution.

Tomorrow I am going to try adding 1 ounce of the MBC concentrate to some plain seltzer water (12 ounces of chilled seltzer) in a regular drinking cup, such as to test, WILL drinking a live carbonated product, with the 1 ounce MBC concentrate addition, so as to see if there is any change, or benefit, or loss from having excess CO2.. (Carbonic Acid is slightly acidic).. lots of curiosity with this stuff.. :)

[ThePythonicCow]

I tested the coffee again this morning, with milk added, and it was 119.3 F.. Adding in the one ounce of MBC (Magnesium BiCarbonate Water) reduced the temperature to 118.4 - there was no apparent bubbling, no gas coming off the solution.

Ah - so perhaps it helps to have chilled water to get the CO2 to dissolve into the water (to make seltzer water) in the first place, but then once the Phillips Milk of Magnesia (magnesium hydroxide) is then dissolved into that water and the reaction (slow, takes the better part of a day) to create MBC (Magnesium BiCarbonate Water) has occurred, then it's more stable with temperature. That is, CO2 solution is less stable than MBC solution, with warmer temperatures.

That likely explains my confusion - thinking that warming my dissolved MBC would cause it to gas off, the way that warming CO2 solution does.

This means that once that slow reaction has occurred, I no longer need to keep the MBC solution chilled. Good.

Thanks.

[Bob]

This means that once that slow reaction has occurred, I no longer need to keep the MBC solution chilled. Good.

Thanks.

I think a quick way to check that idea and presumably the way the concentrate was made, in the original plastic Kroeger seltzer bottle (as it is plastic and the sides caved in when the CO2 was absorbed, converting the hydroxide to bicarbonate..) is to let a portion of it, maybe a quarter of a bottle, let it warm up to room temperature, and see if pressurized out-gassing happens..

I know each time I open the concentrate bottle, (it is chilled), it remains totally FLAT, (still mineral water), no outgassing, no pressure in removing the cap.

I would think one could pour a portion into such a plastic 1 litre pop bottle, empty, dry and just let it sit at regular room temperature.

If the critical threshold temperature is about 122 degrees F for some outgassing to happen, we should never really assume that temp is going to be achieved if the bottle is not allowed to be in direct sunlight, or by a heater..

If this is such a good ingredient, I am very curious about different beverages that it could be added to. Will it be stable and remain stable and viable, such as on a supermarket shelf? PROBABLY NOT due to the rough handling..

I would not want to see commercial stabilizers added to something like this, I feel it should remain a freebie GIFT to humanity, that's me, let's not try to profit off this.. the effort to make it is nil, and it's so far so good. IN the MINIMAL amounts..

I am not one to go overboard in the more-is-better, I believe in JUST the right amount to get the body doing things on it's own.. well.. Like using the ignition key to start the engine.. If the engine is started, no sense to KEEP cranking, which could damage the starter/battery/wiring.. Just restart the engine periodically as needed I think..

To be able to then figure out exactly WHAT the ideal amount is for one would be a good study, a study to determine JUST the right minerals, and or natural substances.. Exactly what is the right amount, how to monitor for what is needed, how to determine HOW-MUCH and when.. the frequency of consumption.

[Bob]

Posted by Ahnung-quay
Hi Bob. Thanks for this thread. I just got my supplies and I'll be making up a batch tonight.

I have some sort of arthritic problem ( not diagnosed by an M.D.).

I have been keeping it under control with diet and some supplements. My diet is mostly low in sugar and emphasizes fruits and vegetables.

I also eat a lot of raw nuts which are high in magnesium. I'm excited to try the magnesium water in order to see what effects it has on my carpal tunnel and arthritis.

I've noticed over the last two years a progression of something that resembles arthritis in the finger and tendons, and joints. I had to go through an immense vaccination campaign due to my projects in Africa, having been shot with all the vaccines known to modern man ( a few years ago ), and the auto-immune damage, and the mercury damage I believe, was intense..

Recently, (last month before this MBC testing) this thing resembling "carpal tunnel" had cropped up. Awful..

It is quite a large amount of damage, to those cells which got hit hard by the mercury, removing the magnesium from the mitochondria I believe by the mercury, (or heavy metals) so those cells are/were targeted I believe, by the body (auto-immune response) cause those cells are/were indeed damaged (mercury harm)... body tries, but is hamstrung due to the heavy metals, and the ignition key being stolen by those heavy metals..

What has been happening for me, and it's taken about a week, I believe new cells have started replacing the damaged ones, because the repair mechanisms have been turned on (the ignition key on the repair engine started), and the reactions of what feels like arthritis and carpal tunnel starting to reverse. I have a LOT more movement now after a week of exploring this MBC full movement, and I can close fingers my hands completely without pain. I consider that remarkable, to not require pain killers or anti-inflammatory medication..

So probably the question to ask, did or do you have mercury fillings (old), and/or mercury containing (Thiomersal) vaccinations?

[Bob]

By the way, something i NEVER knew.. I thought Merthiolate was something as a safe alternative to using antibiotics, or topical IODINE on wounds..

LOOK at this please:

The pharmaceutical corporation Eli Lilly and Company gave thiomersal the trade name Merthiolate...

Putting Merthiolate on wounds as an anti-fungal, anti-bacterial... GEES LOUISE.. putting liquid organic mercury compound into the body.. talk about the assault on humanity..

REF MERTHIOLATE POISONING - https://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/002678.htm


Merthiolate is a mercury-containing substance that was once widely used as germ-killer and a preservative in many different products, including vaccines.

Merthiolate poisoning occurs when large amounts of the substance are swallowed or come in contact with your skin. Poisoning may also occur if you are exposed to small amounts of merthiolate constantly over a long period of time.

Using that stuff is then a sure-fire way to deplete the MAGNESIUM... (oye...) deliberate or accidental.. hmmmm....

[Chester]

Hi - I bought the ingredients and made my first batch. The Kroger I found only had the two liter size of seltzer water and so I mixed in 6 tablespoons of Milk of Magnesia... hope that is ok.

And now I have a good size batch and... well, how much really is the most I should drink in one day? I am from the school of... "If a little bit works, a lot works lots better" mentality which is probably not wise with regards to ingestion of anything.

Also, should I stop my other routine with the 1/2 organic lemon juice squeezed into 250 MLs of purified water while adding a 1/2 teaspoon of Red Mill baking soda?

[Bob]

Hi Sam - I suppose sticking with the ratio, 8 tablespoons full would have been double for the two litre bottle. http://cc.amazingcounters.com/counter.php?i=3190880&c=9572953

Did the bottle cave in after the second shaking? like after maybe 4 hours? That would be the question.

I am trying 1 ounce of MBC concentrate (magnesium bicarbonate) to 12 ounces of water, without any appreciable acid in it.

In the idea of experimentation, ONE variable is changed first, to see what happens.

SO maybe keep the MBC test as a separate test, with the beverage using lemon juice/bicarb as something not used at exactly the same time. Or stop the lemon-juice-bicarb and test this separately for a week to see if there is a difference. Pretty sure you know what it feels like for the lemon juice/bicarb combination.. ya?

[Swanette]

This is the magnesium that I have been using for years. It is picometer-ionic form of magnesium. It was developed by Dr. Carolyn Dean who has written several very well respected books about magnesium. She has several of these books available free for ebook download.

'ReMag Magnesium Solution


The spark of life
•Activates 700-800 body enzyme systems
•100% absorbed at the cellular level
•No laxative effect

Magnesium is truly The Magnesium Miracle™ as it is a necessary cofactor for 700-800 enzymes systems that perform vital metabolic functions in the body. It’s a simple mineral, yet it assists in preventing and treating diabetes, high blood pressure, high cholesterol, migraines, heart disease, osteoporosis, anxiety, insomnia, and dozens of other health conditions.'

https://rnareset.com/products/remag-magnesium-solution

[Chester]

Hi Sam - I suppose sticking with the ratio, 8 tablespoons full would have been double for the two litre bottle. http://cc.amazingcounters.com/counter.php?i=3190880&c=9572953

Did the bottle cave in after the second shaking? like after maybe 4 hours? That would be the question.

I am trying 1 ounce of MBC concentrate (magnesium bicarbonate) to 12 ounces of water, without any appreciable acid in it.

In the idea of experimentation, ONE variable is changed first, to see what happens.

SO maybe keep the MBC test as a separate test, with the beverage using lemon juice/bicarb as something not used at exactly the same time. Or stop the lemon-juice-bicarb and test this separately for a week to see if there is a difference. Pretty sure you know what it feels like for the lemon juice/bicarb combination.. ya?

Hi Bob... ok, based on what you typed out to me as well as what I see in the first post in this thread -


1. Chill a 1-liter bottle of unflavored seltzer, which is fully carbonated water. The seltzer should only contain

water and carbon dioxide (CO2). Club soda is carbonated water with a small amount of added sodium and is

also suitable.

2. Shake the bottle of Milk of Magnesia well, then measure out 3 tablespoons (45 ml) and have it ready. The

plastic measuring cup that comes with the MoM is accurate and ideal for the purpose.

I followed these instructions explicitly. There was a slight variation in these than what you had typed to me... I followed exactly what the document says in post #1.

Yes... the bottle sucked in after the shake I did when I aded the milk of magnesia. Also, all the cloudiness went away within an hour.

I believe all is well.

I will stop the other routine until I have spent time with this one. I will let you know the results.

Thank you very much once again for sharing this with us... Sam

[Bob]

Hi Sam - I suppose sticking with the ratio, 8 tablespoons full would have been double for the two litre bottle. http://cc.amazingcounters.com/counter.php?i=3190880&c=9572953

Did the bottle cave in after the second shaking? like after maybe 4 hours? That would be the question.

I am trying 1 ounce of MBC concentrate (magnesium bicarbonate) to 12 ounces of water, without any appreciable acid in it.

In the idea of experimentation, ONE variable is changed first, to see what happens.

SO maybe keep the MBC test as a separate test, with the beverage using lemon juice/bicarb as something not used at exactly the same time. Or stop the lemon-juice-bicarb and test this separately for a week to see if there is a difference. Pretty sure you know what it feels like for the lemon juice/bicarb combination.. ya?

Hi Bob... ok, based on what you typed out to me as well as what I see in the first post in this thread -


1. Chill a 1-liter bottle of unflavored seltzer, which is fully carbonated water. The seltzer should only contain

water and carbon dioxide (CO2). Club soda is carbonated water with a small amount of added sodium and is

also suitable.

2. Shake the bottle of Milk of Magnesia well, then measure out 3 tablespoons (45 ml) and have it ready. The

plastic measuring cup that comes with the MoM is accurate and ideal for the purpose.

I followed these instructions explicitly. There was a slight variation in these than what you had typed to me... I followed exactly what the document says in post #1.

Yes... the bottle sucked in after the shake I did when I aded the milk of magnesia. Also, all the cloudiness went away within an hour.

I believe all is well.

I will stop the other routine until I have spent time with this one. I will let you know the results.

Thank you very much once again for sharing this with us... Sam

Gotcha, I should have clarified, I think the 6 tablespoon fulls (for 2 litres double the MOM) in the OP was because originally the 1 litre bottle would fill up to the top as that 3 tablespoon fulls described in the PDF in the OP (post-1) was the maximum amount that can be added without spillage.. I should have said (my bad), with a bigger bottle with MORE headspace up there, (empty space at the top), going for 2 additional tablespoon fulls, would cause the headspace to be filled up in the 2 litre bottle, to the top and a tad more MBC would be made..

If 6 worked, and the bottle fully caved in that I feel is all that matters.. One has made magnesium bicarbonate in water concentrate.

If 8 tablespoon fulls leaves too much residue (cloudiness) after a maximum of 8 hours of sitting, then backing off back a tablespoon full should be the right thing to do; the aim is for all the CO2 to be consumed and the minimal amount of residue is left.. (I don't have any residue at this point, the water is perfectly clear in the concentrate bottle.)

That all of it was converted, and clear no-milkiness happened, that's good.. If no CO2 (fizz) comes out, the reaction then consumed all CO2. That probably is key.. the bottle cave-in and no CO2 fizz coming out..

I'm noting btw, something in addition to the general over-all energy increase. Stamina.. When doing strenuous work, where one has to take a breath to catch up, needing to do that is less now, with a few quick breaths, holding all the muscles still for a bit, (a brief respite), the recharge back to full function seems good.

I haven't noticed the burn found with heavy exercise. I wonder why that is?

ref: http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-does-lactic-acid-buil/


As our bodies perform strenuous exercise, we begin to breathe faster as we attempt to shuttle more oxygen to our working muscles. The body prefers to generate most of its energy using aerobic methods, meaning with oxygen. Some circumstances, however, --such as evading the historical saber tooth tiger or lifting heavy weights--require energy production faster than our bodies can adequately deliver oxygen. In those cases, the working muscles generate energy anaerobically.

This energy comes from glucose through a process called glycolysis, in which glucose is broken down or metabolized into a substance called pyruvate through a series of steps. When the body has plenty of oxygen, pyruvate is shuttled to an aerobic pathway to be further broken down for more energy.

But when oxygen is limited, the body temporarily converts pyruvate into a substance called lactate, which allows glucose breakdown--and thus energy production--to continue. The working muscle cells can continue this type of anaerobic energy production at high rates for one to three minutes, during which time lactate can accumulate to high levels.

A side effect of high lactate levels is an increase in the acidity of the muscle cells, along with disruptions of other metabolites. T

he same metabolic pathways that permit the breakdown of glucose to energy perform poorly in this acidic environment. On the surface, it seems counterproductive that a working muscle would produce something that would slow its capacity for more work.

In reality, this is a natural defense mechanism for the body; it prevents permanent damage during extreme exertion by slowing the key systems needed to maintain muscle contraction. Once the body slows down, oxygen becomes available and lactate reverts back to pyruvate, allowing continued aerobic metabolism and energy for the body¿s recovery from the strenuous event.

From what we know, the glucose mechanism SPECIFICALLY needs the magnesium in the mitochondria, the bicarbonate pathway to be active.. Maybe that's why the STAMINA seems to improve..

[Bob]

I tried the MBC one ounce amount of concentrate with a can of seltzer water..

Poured the 12 ounce seltzer contents into a glass and it was quite bubbly, and right up to the top. So I drank about an ounce, and there was a LOT of CO2 gas in that first sip.

Then I added in the 1 ounce of MBC concentrate, bringing it back up to the top of the glass.

It immediately started to bubble strongly, and then rapidly calmed down..

After about 5 minutes, the majority of the intense bubbly had stopped, and I had a sip..

Excellent taste of a very good sparkling mineral water !

Throughout the day, having sips, the "sparkling mineral water" taste was there, without heavy CO2 gas.. Delightful actually.

Effects about the same as the plain MBC concentrate in pure water.. My feeling is the seltzer mix seemed to allow for the beverage to be "more interesting", and it seemed to be able to sublingually convey its effects faster than drinking..

I did not notice the same perceived sensations that I feel are desirable as with having with coffee.. I will try tomorrow with green tea (cooled to 120 degrees, no hotter) and see how that is.

Seems the higher the toxicity of one's system the more noticeable the MBC benefits are.. The lesser amount of toxicity, or younger body, not having it's magnesium concentrations depleted, the less the noticing of the effects are.. That is the general summary.. when one is in a toxic-like situation, it is very noticeable.. when clear/clean adequate magnesium supply, it is less pronounced the effects..

[Jean-Marie]

I read this most interesting thread. Thank you Bob! I went and bought the items and did the second shaking. In the morning I will start and document the results. I had previous issues with a fib and after seeing cardiologists and refusing their medication I went to an integrated systems doctor who diagnosed me with a magnesium difficiency. Taking Epsom salt baths and magnesium supplements made the a fib go away. I am excited to try it.

[Bob]

I read this most interesting thread. Thank you Bob! I went and bought the items and did the second shaking. In the morning I will start and document the results. I had previous issues with a fib and after seeing cardiologists and refusing their medication I went to an integrated systems doctor who diagnosed me with a magnesium deficiency. Taking Epsom salt baths and magnesium supplements made the a fib go away. I am excited to try it.

Who knows how it will work with folks.. I know for me it's pretty remarkable. As my situation I think was mercury toxicity, the last vaccination pushed things over the deep end.. Luckily a friend pointed me in this direction and it seemed good to share with the community.

[Bob]

The MBC, one ounce to some warm tea really hit the spot.. Great taste and overall wellness feelings.

Going to try maybe some different nutrients, I'm interested in Choline and Inositol combo to see how that will work. Anyone use those two?

[penn]

Hey Bob, I have tried inositol with nothing to note. Have not tried the combo.

I purchase milk of magnesium with sodium hydroxide in the inactive ingredient list. Can't find one without it. The directions said the club soda might have some sodium and that was ok. What do you think?
I am on my third day of one once dose. I seem to absorb more magnesium with the bicarbonate than taking the supplement magnesium citrate. Sleeping a bit more sound. Seem like I can hold a calmness when the pressure is turned up. Thanks for sharing.

[Bob]

Hey Bob, I have tried inositol with nothing to note. Have not tried the combo.

I purchase milk of magnesium with sodium hydroxide in the inactive ingredient list. Can't find one without it. The directions said the club soda might have some sodium and that was ok. What do you think?

I am on my third day of one once dose. I seem to absorb more magnesium with the bicarbonate than taking the supplement magnesium citrate. Sleeping a bit more sound. Seem like I can hold a calmness when the pressure is turned up. Thanks for sharing.

SODIUM HYDROXIDE !!! oh i would stay away from that stuff.. sodium hydroxide is LYE.. - I would stay away from that and only go for a brand which doesn't contain that. COULD it possibly be sodium hypochlorite (bleach) maybe instead? that could be a preservative or something in their forumulation.. (chlorine in other words being added)..

This brand is what I picked:


http://wholenaturallife.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Milk-of-magnesia-deodorant-1024x936.jpg

I looked up a distributor and found this:
http://www.dollargeneral.com/product/index.jsp?productId=12578869
Pretty low cost without strange added ingredients..

Amazon had a product listed under the Good Sense brand label -
http://www.amazon.com/Good-Sense-Magnesia-Laxative-Original/dp/B000V9N5UW/?tag=f038b-20
A bit more expensive than the above.

Reference on Kroger Brands:
The Kroger Company acquired Dillon Companies grocery chain in Kansas along with its subsidiaries, King Soopers, City Market, Fry's, Gerbes, and the convenience store chain Kwik Shop

Kroger has an online shopping:
https://www.kroger.com/onlineshopping/signin?redirectUrl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.kroger.com%2Fstorecatalog%2Fservlet%2FOnlineShoppingStoreSetup

I've tried the Choline-Inositol combo today with the MBC concentrate, only using cold distilled water. No immediate sensation other than the expected MBC reaction (more energy, better breathing, no muscle problems..) The choline-inositol is supposed to have benefits, weight issues being addressed, better memory, nervous system.. We'll see.

A note on the arthritic hands, zero problems now with a week of use.. Slight stiffness on the pinky finger but full range of motion.. That is most amazing to me, and I know how easy it is for me to turn on a charlie horse in the leg muscles in bed.. zero muscle spasms in the legs after a week of use.. Such was about 1/2 a litre consumption total, distributed over the days, and diluted within various beverages as tests.

[penn]

Your right. Sodium hypoclorite. Is that ok for one batch until I find some MOM without it?

[Bob]

Your right. Sodium hypoclorite. Is that ok for one batch until I find some MOM without it?

Sodium hypochlorite is basically bleach powder.. It adds a bit of chlorine gas when it converts. Not knowing the concentration, exactly it's hard to say.. I would think such is OK in the M.O.M. (Magnesium Hydroxide concentration as the stabilizer/preservative).. I tend to be of a feeling though that when exploring what one substance will do, minimize all other variables, so that one substance's benefits or not can be observed. The chemical reactions would be the slight increasing of sodium chloride salts in the tummy I think. If one is not wanting to have any sodium salt addition, not using a sodium hypochlorite probably would be appropriate..

ref: http://www.ehow.com/list_6462366_effects-ingesting-chlorine-bleach.html

[Chester]

Hi - update - I have been using this for almost 2 weeks - I find my best doasge around 2 ounces of the pure creation a day... I don't do the exact ratios with water but close... I had started at around 2 or so ounces a day as I was eyeball guessing and only later discovered the actual amount of my guesses. So I backed down to the one ounce a day and the effects did drop. I like best the way i feel with the 2 to 2.5 ounces a day.

I understand that milk of magnesia is supposed to be a laxative but I haven't had any unacceptable consequences.

I used the exact brand of Milk of Magnesia Bob shows in the photo which I found at Kroger. It us pure with no additives. I also bought Kroger's generic Seltzer Water (caffeine free).

I see that if I buy enough seltzer water to equal what i need to use a whole bottle of Milk of Magnesia, I will probably spend about $15 total for all the bottles of seltzer water and the one bottle of Milk of Magnesia. I estimate this would last me four to six months, maybe longer.

The effects are -

The obvious effect which I am most pleased about is there's a huge rise in my "clarity of mind." I articulate far better and the mind is grasping much greater detail and depth.

I feel a rise in energy - definitely a true difference and not just my imagination.

This risen energy and greater clarity remain consistent throughout the day even after meals or snacks that would sometimes cause me to tire. I am 58 and have had chronic fatigue issues for 15 - 20 years, had concluded candida issues and despite all the diets and pro-biotics and other attempts to resolve that, nothing has made the difference for me like this simple to make magnesium bi-carbonate.

I will post from time to time even if the effects remain steady.

[penn]

Bob, I made it to dollar General today. Bingo! I finally found some MOM without additives. Can't wait to make a new batch. I will feel better about my experiment now. Thanks for sharing your wisdom!

[Chester]

Now I am having a hard time finding just plain seltzer water - Uggghh

I will make a list of Krogers and go one by one.

[Bob]

Now I am having a hard time finding just plain seltzer water - Uggghh

I will make a list of Krogers and go one by one.

There are carbonate sparkling water makers, which Paul and I earlier in the thread mentioned.. That would allow one to choose the desired water (distilled/pure for instance), to be carbonated with a CO2 cylinder.. A bit more expensive than just finding the Kroger Seltzer water :) But if one is into using seltzer for other purposes (sparkling water) that may be useful..

As to the Laxative effect.. Magnesium Hydroxide is the laxative.. Magnesium BiCarbonate which one makes with the chilled CO2 addition/shake/chill and shake some more with the dilution of 1-2 ounces of concentrate really divides up the original MOM substance.. way below laxative amount..

I can't say I 've had any loose stools with 1-3 ounces a day. I did try up to 3 ounces of concentrate, in 3 separate glasses of water, again about 12 ounces of water. Same as you, a good ability of concentration, able to pick up subtle points with extreme clarity and able to differentiate.. Today I noticed light sensitivity to brght lights at night was diminished immensely.. And I also noticed the ability to note contrast changes was increased.. such as "edges".. ability to note when an object of light dark moves in the visual field was increased.. Heavy work recovery happens fast, much faster than before.

It just seems that cells which weren't working are revving up and starting to function better. I've also noticed some better vascular healing starting to happen. And I've noticed that my normal regimen of lots of mineral/vitamin supplements is diminishing.. Maybe the food that i am eating actually is having it's nutrition extracted better, or the nutrients better utilized.. So the supplement requirement may be dropping

As we have all noted, the cost to try the experiment so minimal, even over a long time period. Heck my coffee costs more than the MBC :)

[Carmody]

Doping in cycling is as simple as eating a roll of tums (original formula).

The short term caustic (calcium, etc) balance of the body from the consumption of the roll of tums....causes a lack of build up of lactic acid in the body, due to the over arching ability to balance the pH of the body.

This was doping in cycling before drug doping came along. That and being a smoker to increase o2 intake.

Our modern cosmopolitan/suburban diets are far too acidic these days (wrong side of the pH chart) for our bodies to balance themselves out to the requisite pH the given human body should be at, thus a plethora of health issues can arise.

[Bob]

I believe the Magnesium BiCarbonate corrects the calcium toxicity in the cells. Putting calcium (in the OXIDE form) in the tummy IF it converts would be causing calcium chloride with a nasty byproduct, HYDROGEN.

CaO + HCl = CaCl2 + H2O + H
(Calcium Oxide + (stomach acid) HCL = Calcium Chloride (CaCL2) plus water plus hydrogen..

What does hydrogen do to FATS? It hydrogenates them or HARDENS THEM !

Connect the dots, please, with what happens with ingesting calcium "supplements" and the heart and vascular disease from the HYDROGEN ingestion..

Hydrogenated fats are unnatural fats that are detrimental to your health. Production of hydrogenated fats increased steadily until the 1960s. As an unsaturated oil is gradually more hydrogenated, the inserted hydrogen atoms make it firmer and more solid at room temperature. The ingestion of Calcium Oxide is insanity.

As an unsaturated oil (a fat) is gradually more hydrogenated, the inserted hydrogen atoms make it firmer and more solid at room temperature.


Trans fatty acids both raise the 'bad' (LDL) cholesterol and lower the 'good' (HDL) cholesterol levels in blood, markedly increasing the risk of heart disease. Also known as trans fat.

Stay the heck away from ingesting Calcium Oxide !

If one is "popping" calcium supplements, the suggestion in this article says THINK TWICE !

http://chriskresser.com/calcium-supplements-why-you-should-think-twice/


And a 2007 study published in the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition found that calcium supplements don’t reduce fracture rates in older women, and may even increase the rate of hip fractures

and


A large study of 24,000 men and women aged 35–64 years published in the British Medical Journal (BMJ) in 2012 found that those who used calcium supplements had a 139% greater risk of heart attack during the 11-year study period, while intake of calcium from food did not increase the risk. (food does not normally contain CALCIUM OXIDE)

A meta-analysis of studies involving more than 12,000 participants also published in BMJ found that calcium supplementation increases the risk of heart attack by 31%, stroke by 20%

TG Magnesium BiCarbonate, (what has been the primary discussion of this thread), is about activating the Cellular Mitochondria which when turned on will do it's best through the BiCarbonate ion transfer channel to try to restore proper CALCIUM and SODIUM and POTASSIUM balance. Excess Calcium cause numerous problems..

There is no "HIGH" to achieve by filling one's cells with Hydrogen (making the membrane a HARDENED TRANSFAT), nor hardening the cells with the calcium inducing premature aging..

http://www.meltdown.com/calcium.htm


Excess calcium in the body's soft tissues can wreak havoc on looking good.

If the body has too much calcium, it can form calcium deposits. Calcium in the fingernails make them so soft they tear instead of break.

Calcium accumulation in the skin is a major contributor to wrinkling and premature aging. Calcium causes wrinkles by inhibiting the normal moisture content of the skin. The cells actually dry up and starve for water, producing the wrinkling effect.

You may have water retention and still wrinkle. That's because the water is between the cells and not inside them. This is exactly what happens to you after spending several hours in a swimming pool; even though you have been immersed in water, the skin dehydrates and wrinkles.

"If your skin is showing premature signs of aging, look to your diet to help retard the aging process and ward off the adverse effects of past dietary indiscretions," says Dr. Watts. "Proper diet is essential for a healthy, youthful appearance at any age."

Women with excess calcium often discover their eyes start looking old. This is caused by calcium deposits in the soft tissues around the eyes.

Do you have any hated cellulite in buttocks and thighs? These unsightly blobs are caused by excess calcium deposits combined with the body's inability to utilize fats properly. Precipitating that calcium from the soft tissues goes a long way in fighting cellulite.


The apparent way to deal with the CALCIUM and the HYDROGENATED fats from consuming calcium oxide, the subject of this thread, the "MBC", the Magnesium Bicarbonate appears to be the solution.. Like zero cost, easy to make, and works to correct excessive ACID pH by controlling the ION exchange mechanism in the cells.

Don't over do it, as the proper BALANCE is what is being looked for..

Stay away from hydrogen producing foods, or supplements (i.e. calcium oxide)..


------------------------

Signs and symptoms of Mitochondrial failure.. (Like from Calcium Toxicity, Mercury Toxicity, Heavy Metal toxicity)


http://www.thesophiestory.co.uk/images/mitochondrial-symptoms.jpg

Looking at the above chart, and the "symptoms" on page 1, the OP post 1... MAGNESIUM deficiency is the most likely problem...

So again, re-iterating, the Magnesium BiCarbonate water for looking at if it is reactivating the mitochondria, verifying if the range of SYMPTOMS start to correct would be a good study.

So far, I and others are noting a range of symptoms correcting.. That keeps me quite interested in the progress of these evaluations. :)

Have you connected the DOTS yet? I think I am, watching exactly for the proper balance, and using the Magnesium BiCarbonate method for helping get that balance back.

This thread is about verifying, seeing what benefits (if any) are available by using Magnesium BiCarbonate Water.

[Bob]

I believe the Magnesium BiCarbonate helps with dealing with the MERCURY ingestion.. Mercury kills cells, and sabotages the mitochondria, which obviously one could connect the dots, one without the cellular ENERGY ENGINE working right (the mitochondria), one would feel chronically fatigued.. (hmmmmm)

OK, where is mercury hiding? Certainly if one has sworn off getting vaccinations, and not eating "tuna fish", and not living near a coal fired power plant (hard to find a place that doesn't have coal fired power plants...), well, where else? HIGH FRUCTOSE CORN SYRUP.

from: http://stayhealthyandwell.com/are-you-eating-mercury-unknowingly/


Are you eating mercury unknowingly?

I’m sure most of you have heard about mercury poisoning and how it is definitely damaging our health. The most common ways to get mercury toxicity is from amalgam (silver) fillings in our teeth; consuming too much seafood or fish; and from vaccinations. However, now new research is coming forward with a much more insidious way that we are being exposed to mercury: High Fructose Corn Syrup (HFCS).

I’m sure many of you are unaware exactly how much of HFCS you are actually consuming. But let me warn you: it’s in virtually everything. It is a VERY cheap form of sugar and food manufacturers use it frequently to sweeten items like: sodas, barbecue sauce, weight loss bars/drinks, jellies and jams, ketchup, peanut butter, etc. The list goes on and on and quite frankly, I could write several articles about the dangers of HFCS and all the various forms you can find it in, but that is not the subject of this post.

Since our consumption of HFCS is on the rise, that means that we are also becoming more exposed to mercury toxicity. But how does corn syrup get mercury in it?

Well, four of the big plants that make corn syrup use mercury-cell technology in the production of caustic soda, an ingredient used in the corn conversion process.

MERCURY again... look at the symptoms below, and look at the damaged mitochondria symptoms in the full body graphic in my post above.. See the dots connecting? And see why we are looking to see IF magnesium BiCarbonate can be a solution to helping with the mercury damage.. turning back ON the mitochondria, turning back on CELLULAR repair mechanisms..


MERCURY: First of all, it damages your nervous system. This is one of the primary risks for pregnant women and their fetuses and why pregnant moms and also babies and children are encouraged to avoid seafood.

Vision problems, as well as impairment of speech, walking and muscle weakness are other issues.

Some people have insomnia, headaches, emotional issues and skin problems due to mercury poisoning.

And it’s been linked to autism, ADD and ADHD because mercury can cause severe brain imbalances.

So quite simply, this is yet another reason to avoid High Fructose Corn Syrup. Not only does it contribute to obesity, diabetes and a whole host of other health problems, now mercury toxicity has been linked to it. Please do yourself a favor and learn how to read food labels so you can avoid products that contain High Fructose Corn Syrup.

[Chester]

I just realized that the cramps I would sometimes get in the morning just after I would awake and then stretch... have vanished.

Note: I take no other supplements.

I get all my food at the whole foods market and go organic as best I can. I also noticed another good thing - I am eating less! I am actually losing some weight! Its only been three weeks but I don't have the same driving hunger as I had up until I started this MBC.

I also found several bottles of the plain seltzer water at another Kroger (grabbed 4!).

And yes - 2 - 3 ounces seems just about the right amount for me daily.

[Bob]

It's nice to not have muscle cramping.. I am not afraid to stretch my legs also in bed in the morning Sam while using the Magnesium BiCarbonate (MBC).. The amount is so small (of MBC) considering how large supplement capsules are of the other types of Magnesium which either don't work, or can do harm (such as the calcium oxide "calcium supplements")...

Couple days ago I went to the store to get of all things a LOT of green leafy veggies, different types of red and green lettuce, and some really wonderful looking, broccoli. Fresh mushrooms, hydroponically grown tomatoes.. Some redwine-vinegar, and olive oil.

And I had some rather great salads at dinner, lunch.. Normally my intestinal tract would say woah there padna.. and go into spasm, but it didn't. I enjoyed it, no cramping, no spasms.. Could the MBC possibly work for people with irritable bowel situations too? Could it be that easy? If we have been worrying about "candida" for instance, cause we feel that the cells' immunity methods can't handle, it (if the mitochondria are harmed, not switched on properly..) surely normally insulting substances would be very reactive to the body.. and the body would want to turn on an immune response to flush it out FAST..

But with the MBC, the immune system is like running on normal, mucous production in the lungs, and digestive system is running "normal".. Relief on so many levels happens.. And to enjoy greens without worrying about immune reactions, weoh.. that really makes my day. So folks maybe who have odd digestive issues, may see benefits also from the MBC.. http://cc.amazingcounters.com/counter.php?i=3190880&c=9572953

[Ahnung-quay]

Hi Bob (and Sam). I've been on the magnesium water for about a week now. I'm taking 2 ounces per day.

So far, I haven't noticed any big changes although I'm fighting a nasty herpes outbreak right now so that has set me back physically.

I do notice digestive changes for the better. I'll keep you posted since I don't intend on stopping.

[Chester]

Hi Bob, I may be confused about part of the process in making the MBC.

Do I first chill the seltzer water?

And prior to adding the Milk of Magnesia, do I shake the bottle vigorously first or only after I add the Milk of Magnesia?

Thanks... Sam

[Bob]

Hi Bob, I may be confused about part of the process in making the MBC.

Do I first chill the seltzer water?

And prior to adding the Milk of Magnesia, do I shake the bottle vigorously first or only after I add the Milk of Magnesia?

Thanks... Sam

When one chills the seltzer, that cuts down rapid release of the CO2 gas.. so chill chill chill, and do not shake until the Milk of Magnesia (Magnesium hydroxide) is rapidly added to the chilled seltzer.. and the cap is back on tightly..

After the cap is closed tightly, shake shake shake at least a minute - the seltzer/mom will go cloudy.. then..

Put it back in the fridge, tightly closed for about an hour - possibly after an hour now of sitting in the fridge, the seltzer plastic bottle will start to cave in, and it will start to become clear with some sediment on the bottom.. take it out and then...

Shake shake shake once again, and it goes slightly cloudy again as the sediment gets into the solution.. Put it back in the fridge again and let it sit for about 4 hours cold, and by that time it should have caved in really well (absorbed all the CO2 available, and converted into Magnesium BiCarbonate, MBC).. at this time one has a usable concentrate.. dilute as desired..

I'm just now making my second bottle, having chilled the seltzer for a couple hours, getting ready to add in the 3 tablespoons-full of the milk of magnesia (will cap quickly then shake shake shake..) and refridge for an hour... before taking it out and shaking once again..

[Chester]

Thanks, Bob - and very clear.

[Bob]

Thanks, Bob - and very clear.

I couldn't wait for the 4 hours after the second shaking.. What I looked for was as soon as the bottle caved in, and it was pretty darned clear, I took it out and poured myself a glass of distilled water (chilled) and then added in one ounce of the new batch.. That was outstanding, the flavor, very reminiscent of a bicarbonate taste, and less "sweetish" tasting (which appears to happen after the 4 hour wait time after the second shaking). I've upped the total amount of MBC to 3 ounces btw...


http://images.webcamgalore.com/25632-current-webcam-Black-Forest-Colorado.jpg

(the above is a webcam btw)

After working outside in the cold (it's been freezing in the Springs) for all afternoon and really pushing the muscles I think I depleted the amount (probably the minimal maintenance amount of one ounce), and noticed due to the cold much more muscle activity was burning energy fast.. Going to the 3 ounces when really cold, pushing the engine "hard" definitely helps. I'll probably cut back if I drop the physical exercise down, but it's been pretty freezing and I like working outside in the low temps.. Interesting doing yard work at 7000 foot altitude in the cold when having the MBC supplement.. The Black Forest is beautiful this time of year.

[kanishk]

Hi, I searched for Milk of Magnesia in pharmaceuticals but nobody has a brand that has plain Magnesium hydroxide. Some have flavors in it and if some brands are unflavored they have paraffin added into it. Is it okay to use the unflavored MOM with paraffin added?

I went to some chemical shops also but they don't have Magnesium Hydroxide with them. Maybe next I will thoroughly search it in chemical shops or I can ask them to order it for me..

Bob? is it a good idea to synthesize magnesium hydroxide from other magnesium slats like Magnesium carbonate, Magnesium oxide or Magnesium sulphate etc..

[Bob]

Hi, I searched for Milk of Magnesia in pharmaceuticals but nobody has a brand that has plain Magnesium hydroxide. Some have flavors in it and if some brands are unflavored they have paraffin added into it. Is it okay to use the unflavored MOM with paraffin added?

I went to some chemical shops also but they don't have Magnesium Hydroxide with them. Maybe next I will thoroughly search it in chemical shops or I can ask them to order it for me..

Bob? is it a good idea to synthesize magnesium hydroxide from other magnesium slats like Magnesium carbonate, Magnesium oxide or Magnesium sulphate etc..

Hi Kanishk - nice to hear from you again !

It can be ordered off Amazon, or other internet suppliers. I would stay away from Paraffin oil, as that definitely is part of the normal laxative, and one doesn't want this Magnesium BiCarbonate to act like a laxative.. U may want to try a flavored brand IF the byproducts are minimal, as what is needed is PURE Magnesium Hydroxide.

Potentially one could synthesize the Magnesium hydroxide, but then one would have to come up with a way to determine the concentration in solution.. Unless one is a chemist, with proper weighing systems, supplies, that could be very unwieldy.. The impurities would be like a hypochlorite... assorted "laxative" substances.. Pure Magnesium Hydroxide is what will get the best Magnesium Bicarbonate product when combined properly with the CO2 in the seltzer.. Look at the amount of active Magnesium Hydroxide in the Kroger brand, and that is the concentration one is looking for in the 3 tablespoons full to be added to the seltzer.

[Chester]

FYI - I am still drinking this daily. I did sense I was starting to overdo it a bit and so have backed down to around 1.5 to 2 ounces a day prior to dilution.

The most obvious effect is that my thinking has become much clearer and remains fairly consistently clear throughout the day. I also have experienced an energy boost since day two and this level of energy has also remained reasonably consistently.

There has never been a supplement that I have taken that has has such a dramatic (positive) impact. I am still like... "wow."

Thanks again, Bob... Sam

[Bob]

FYI - I am still drinking this daily. I did sense I was starting to overdo it a bit and so have backed down to around 1.5 to 2 ounces a day prior to dilution.

The most obvious effect is that my thinking has become much clearer and remains fairly consistently clear throughout the day. i also have experienced an energy boost since day two and this level of energy has also remained reasonably consistently.

There has never been a supplement that i have taken that has has such a dramatic (positive) impact. I am still like... "wow."

Thanks again, Bob... Sam

Thanks Sam, the person who shared this with me I really have to thank, Jose :) who said that when I was finding muscle spasms and sciatica sensitivity, maybe it is a magnesium shortage. When I researched the Bicarbonate channel, it made a lot of sense, that the mitochondria activity (cellular respiration/energy) was being diminished, or in some cases, "turned OFF" from the vaccination (the mercury toxicity, and leaking fillings).

I'm noting with still having mercury fillings, when they act up, the magnesium bicarbonate requirement goes UP..

Also, environmental toxicity, food additive toxicity... when I sense the need, adding a bit more of the magnesium bicarbonate water works.. When there is enough I also back off, and depending on the cold temperatures (I still like working outside when it is very low temp, such beautiful pictures with the trees all covered in snow and ice, just like a HallMark moment :).. in the cold the magnesium bicarbonate need apparently goes up.. I find a very good generation of body heat happens when I have adequate carbohydrates, and good fresh water.

All and all skin healing and muscle and blood vessel healing has been occurring as well.

I'm experimenting with the different mineral levels of calcium, sodium, potassium - all of which are NOT in the oxide form, but are in amino acid forms, or ascorbate forms.. I'm staying away from ANY minerals in oxide form due to the hydrogen formation potential (mentioned in an earlier post about how hydrogenation of fats can happen with oxide chemistry)..

I'm still WOW too, especially having worked VERY hard and the body instead of being exhausted says, YA !! great work out ! do it again !! which for me means a lot.

I'm glad to share this with the community. Folks helping each other.

[waves]

Is there anything wrong with flavoring the diluted water with lemon or lime/citric acid fruits, or are you aware of anything to definitely not mix it with?
Thank you in advance.

[Bob]

Is there anything wrong with flavoring the diluted water with lemon or lime/citric acid fruits, or are you aware of anything to definitely not mix it with?
Thank you in advance.

I think if one wants to have it as pure as possible keep it away from acids - when consumed, there will be a conversion with a CO2 release, when the bicarbonate reacts with the acids changing the chemistry; to keep the magnesium bicarbonate as pure as possible, don't expose it to any additional acids (ascorbic, or citric are acids).. and leave it as the bicarbonate form. The BiCarbonate channel activation I think is important, and that comes from a pure form, and possibly is absorbed through the tissues on the way to the stomach.

I've tried holding the bicarbonate water in the mouth for sublingual or direct tissue absorption, before swallowing, and that seems to work..

As to flavoring, there are concentrated flavors which are not acid based and that may be useful to try if one wants flavoring..

I find using the magnesium bicarbonate in warm (under 120 degree) coffee really works well, and/or I've tried using flavored seltzer in some cases (one can obtain flavored seltzer), which uses an essential oil flavoring, with no acids except for the carbon dioxide (carbonic acid from the CO2)... I've even tried some concentrated chocolate for flavoring, which is really interesting :)

I think minimize the variables is the best way to test.

[Chester]

2 things -

a few days ago I went to a Kroger and bought 2 2L bottles of seltzer and 2 bottles of their generic Milk of Magnesia... the cost was roughly $6.00. My point is this is incredibly cheap.

totally separate from the above - I tried to make a batch of the concentrate yesterday using one of the 1 liter bottles of seltzer I still had. I chilled the bottle of seltzer in the fridge until it was completely cold. When I opened it I heard the normal bit of fiz. I then added what was likely 3 .25 tablespoons full of Milk of Magnesia which filled it almost to the very brim. I did the normal shaking. I came back a three or four hours later and the bottle had not sunk in yet I realized since it had been almost full, that sinking in may not be very possible. So I poured out a tiny bit to allow some room. I then shook again to dispel any last cloudiness. I came back the next morning and there was still a tiny bit of cloudiness and the bottle had not sunk in.

Is it possible that I made a dud batch? My thoughts are that even the slight bit of extra Milk of Magnesia may have been an issue. Also, that there was almost zero "air space" in the bottle may also have played a role in the bottle not sinking in.

Just sharing the experience... as cheap as this is, I may throw this batch out anyways as it appears this batch may have failed.

And now a question... once I have a good batch made, must I keep it refrigerated? I was wondering about this because I sometimes travel.

[Jean-Marie]

I thought my second bottle (batch) was a dud also. When making the first batch, I put the selter bottle in the refrigerator until I thought it was cold enough. I was very excited to try it, so after adding the magnesium into the seltzer and shaking it, I put it in the freezer. removed it and shook it again the bottle collapsed and then I put it back in the freezer and left it there a bit too long with it partially freezing. No residue/sediments at all.

The second batch I only used the refirgerator. It was not the same. The finished product had sediment in it and it even tasted off to me.

I am on my third bottle now made the same way as the first. It is excellent again and I am enjoying it.

-jean-marie

[Bob]

Hi Jean-Marie, I'm on my third bottle here too. Apparently the temperature and the pressure of the CO2 has a lot to do with how much conversion happens. Some folks have reported removing about 1 ounce of seltzer from the 1 litre bottle prior to adding the MOM (Milk of Magnesia, or Magnesium Hydroxide).. and rapidly closing the bottle cap tightly.

I've experimented with a supplement afterwards, about two hours after having the MBC coffee.. V-8 veggie juice, two 12 ounces glasses of that. Zero hunger, and sustained energy, get up and go. I also tried 100 mg of pure nicotinic acid (Niacin) one of the days to see what good HDL cholesterol release would do. (source (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2399644/)) ... I'm wondering if I can make a magnesium-nicotinic-bicarbonate and have the benefits of getting rid of the "wrong" cholesterol and facilitating the good cholesterol. I know it felt fantastic, like clogged capillaries were unclogging and cells which needed the bicarbonate - magnesium.. mitochondria activation was happening.. Ah the feeling of 'young again'.

[Chester]

I am finally ready to state that -

After dealing with what I was always told was a "candida issue"...

Having first gone to the "doctors" (zero results other than contributing to the profits of the pharmaceutical cartel)

Having done every diet (never could stick with one), having tried all sorts of "pro-biotics" and having tried other potential remedies...

I am stating in all full and truthful honesty that all the symptoms of which I had come to believe I had "candida issues" have vanished completely since I started this MBC routine.

It is hard not to believe that the MBC resolved these issues (whether the issue was "candida" or not).

Also, I tried the batch that I thought may have been a dud and it seems to work just like the others. Yet for no more than the cost of $1.20 or so, I could easily have discarded it.

[Bob]

Sam that's great to hear !


http://www.candidayeastinfection.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Getting-Rid-Of-Candida-Full.jpg

[Bob]

On the question Sam about the bottle caving in or not. Some folks have said the plastic bottle doesn't some have reported that it does. Everyone one that I have made with the 1 litre size of the Kroger generic brand of unflavored seltzer water has caved. The bottle is very flimsy.

When the cap is on tight so that no gas escapes, feeling the bottle, the bottle should be pressurizing and getting quite firm, as one gives it the first shaking.. the shaking that happens is for about 1-3 minutes that first time.. that means CO2 pressure is building up.

Then moving that to the refrigerator, I can feel the intense pressure in the bottle. That should be an indication that there is a LOT of CO2 in the bottle.. Letting it settle for an hour the bottle, then starts going clear and starts caving in, meaning the CO2 is/has been absorbed.

On one batch, (#2) instead of shaking it again, I tried it, and I could taste the distinct "bicarbonate taste", which seemed really nice. On closing the bottle again, after opening it and letting air in, then shaking that second time (after having let air in), it no longer caved in...

So I wonder if there may be an 'air leak' after screwing on the cap the first time.. It should pressurize during the first shaking.. And that pressure (if the cap is tight), is going to decrease continually until the CO2 is chemically merged with the magnesium, converting the hydroxide to bicarbonate..

[Meggings]

Bob, thank you for starting this thread on magnesium bicarbonate. I researched and made this many years ago, but when my kids arrived to live under my roof, as the phrase goes "all hell broke loose" and I lost my seltzer water bottles, Milk of Magnesia, and even the made-up bottle I had in the frig.

Your thread has prompted me to pull up my socks and make a bid for a higher level of health, and I have gotten the supplies and will be ready to use the Mg(HCO3)2 tomorrow. The first test will be in my morning coffee, thanks to your posts about it.

I thanked you before with your thread on xylitol and its purported safety, for the research you provided explained why I looked askance at it when once I used sugarless gum sweetened with xylitol, and my body said "no" to it.

You have rendered me a sincere service with this thread, and I thank you for it.

[Bob]

Bob, thank you for starting this thread on magnesium bicarbonate.

I researched and made this many years ago, but when my kids arrived to live under my roof, as the phrase goes "all hell broke loose" and I lost my seltzer water bottles, Milk of Magnesia, and even the made-up bottle I had in the frig.

[..] http://cc.amazingcounters.com/counter.php?i=3190880&c=9572953


Hi Meggins - it's certainly an interesting form of Magnesium.

This is what the bottle looks like after shaking, with having about 2 ounces of the really CHILLED seltzer removed, BEFORE adding in the 3 table spoon fulls of the Milk of Magnesia (Magnesium Hydroxide initials M.O.M.).

I put the chilled bottle in the sink once again, in-case of any spillage just in case.

As soon as I added the M.O.M. the mixture started bubbling, and I rapidly put the lid back on the bottle, and closed it tightly.

I picked up the bottle and started shaking it.. As I was shaking it it sure felt like it was getting colder - maybe the reaction absorbs heat from the environment?

The bottle at first was quite pressurized, but as I continued to shake it, (total of about 3 minutes of shaking), I noticed that it was starting to cave in already ! Maybe the extra headspace at the top of the bottle allowed for better mixing of the CO2 with the M.O.M. I continued shaking and it finally reached the picture you see here:


http://chanlo.com/images/MBC-Seltzer.JPG

At this point the bottle was caved in, but I did NOT release the cap, but put it in the fridge once again, to let it set for an hour. At the end of the hour it should be pretty much clear. At that point opening the cap to let the air in should be OK. I'm preferring to store it refrigerated although, it has no organic material in it, it should last OK.

Personally, I prefer to make a new bottle every time the older bottle has about 2 ounces left in it.

==Update==

Taking out the two ounces of seltzer at first to 'make room' appears to not be the best idea as the full bottle's worth of CO2 apparently is needed to get all the hydroxide converted to bicarbonate.

So after the 2nd hour, opening the bottle, then adding 2 ounces of fresh seltzer was done. Shaking the bottle, and again it started to cave in. I assume then what that means is the CO2 is being absorbed once again.. I'll see what it is like in a couple hours. They keys appear to be chilled bottle of seltzer before opening, and to not jostle, carefully and slowly open the cap the first time and rapidly add the M.O.M., quickly close the cap.

===Update 2===

TESTING this BATCH: The bicarb taste was there, but just not as strong as it was with bottle 2. So after I had poured out the 1 ounce from this made up batch, I added in another ounce of fresh seltzer to this 3rd bottle to bring up the CO2 level.. And shook it and immediately it started to cave in, meaning the CO2 was being consumed rapidly..

What this tells me is this bicarbonate conversion process really could use as much CO2 as possible and keep the pressure up and the mixture COLD.

I'll try this extra CO2 from the one ounce replacement for what I took out this morning, and test later today to see what it tastes like. The bicarbonate taste is very recognizable.

I'm beginning to feel the initial recipe of "one FULL litre chilled seltzer" and 3 tablespoons full of M.O.M. and allow for some bubbling over is OK..

Probably the 3 tablespoon fulls of the mixing being added to the bottle when it is in the sink takes into account some MOM source loss. It will bubble over and some MOM will be spilled into the sink.

OBSERVATION: If there is too much milky color sitting on the bottom of the bottle after 1 hour of when it caves in, then possibly there was never enough CO2 in the starting bottle for the amount of MOM added..

Maybe decreasing the initial amount added to the bottle to 2 - 2.5 tablespoon fulls would be better. Keeping the CO2 UP seems to be key to the best conversion. It should only have a slight amount of visible sediment on the bottom of the bottle after an hour of sitting after it caved in.

===Update 3===

Adding more seltzer, one more ounce after removing one ounce of the CONCENTRATE batch, did not cause the bottle to cave in this time. Tasting the batch definitely had the "bicarbonate" (sorta like a fizzy-type of taste instead of strange 'sweet').. And there was absolutely NO residue left.. That confirms that this process requires a LOT of CO2.. And if residue has appeared, the mixture has not reacted completely (needing more seltzer to be added).

It looks like a 'work in progress' to tailor the brand of seltzer (CO2 content) and the MOM particular brand (the additives for instance added can change the recipe slightly it seems).

The right tasting mixture appears to be quite delightful in perceived affects. A mixture which is not completely reacted (converted to bicarbonate) appears to work, partially but the effects are less dramatic. Fresh mixtures so far seem to be best.. (Not enough data on this yet)..

[Chester]

Still experiencing the same positive effects.

[Bob]

Still experiencing the same positive effects.

Same Sam.. When I messed up getting in all the MOM into the seltzer bottle, due to spillover at the original mixing, I noticed LESS collapse of the bottle, and afterwards (the bottle went clear after being cloudy), was that there was some excess CO2 present (a hiss when opening the cap).. That told me we had a good amount of CO2 present and GREAT bicarbonate formation, but I had a lesser amount of Magnesium bicarbonate produced. So I take 2 ounces instead of 1 with this batch to deal with the lesser amount.

When I had deficiency of the magnesium bicarbonate, sciatica spasm had started to re-occur, and night/morning leg cramps. Adding the magnesium bicarbonate corrected the pain/cramp problem within 4-6 hours of having the mixture in water.

Very impressed..

[Bob]

I've refined the technique that I am using just a little bit.

I chill BOTH the 1 litre seltzer water AND the Magnesium Hydroxide (Milk of Magnesia. "M.O.M.") as cold as I can get it, without freezing.

Then I slowly move it to the counter where I pour out about 2 ounces of seltzer in a COLD (chilled cup). That is to make room for the MOM.. being added to the Seltzer bottle.

I measure out the 3 tablespoon fulls of the MOM in its mixing cup (after shaking the bottle to get it dispersed).

Then I open the seltzer bottle in the sink in-case anything bubbles over, then add the MOM slowly to minimize excess bubbling. I take some of the 2 ounces of chilled seltzer that I poured out to make room, and put it into the MOM plastic container to "rinse" it out, then pour THAT back into the seltzer bottle, and keep doing that until the 2 ounces is used up..

That way, everything is chilled, all the MOM gets into the seltzer bottle, and the least amount of CO2 is lost.

Closing the cap tightly on the seltzer bottle, I then shake it for 3 minutes - it goes uniformly "foggy" cloudy.. Then I let it set for a couple hours in the fridge.

If there is any sediment on the bottom.. I pour out about an ounce of the early magnesium bicarbonate water, into a cup (and use it, it is perfectly fine).... AND I add in from a fresh bottle of regular seltzer, enough seltzer to bring up the level to the rim of the bottle (minimal air space).. Closing the lid tightly I shake that up..

AND I notice the bottle caves in a little as the CO2 is consumed that I added through some fresh plain seltzer..

Looking at the sediment after a few hours, there is hardly any left.. That then means as much CO2 as was available now has been tied up with the magnesium so that we have Magnesium Bicarbonate..

This little extra few steps seems to make a VERY nice batch..

[Chester]

Still experiencing the same positive effects.

I did discover I can do too much... what I mean by this is that I find that when I do 2.75 ounces or so day after day, sometimes about a week or so of this level of daily dosage, I then have a night where I dream like crazy (all sorts of astral critters after me too) and that I then wake before I wish I would which then effects the next day. Yet I also found that when I take a day off, that day is almost as yucky as the pre-MBC days.

Anyways, I am certain we are all different... that our body weights, ages, metabolism, etc means we all need to find the right doses and routines and I am still honing mine.

I still have to say though that there has been nothing like what this cheap, simple to make, formula I have ever tried as far as what this is doing for me.

How incredible is this? How could this not be known by so many others??

I can never thank you enough, Bob, for finding this and sharing it with us.

[Bob]

Still experiencing the same positive effects.

I did discover I can do too much... what I mean by this is that I find that when I do 2.75 ounces or so day after day, sometimes about a week or so of this level of daily dosage, I then have a night where I dream like crazy (all sorts of astral critters after me too) and that I then wake before I wish I would which then effects the next day. Yet I also found that when I take a day off, that day is almost as yucky as the pre-MBC days.

Anyways, I am certain we are all different... that our body weights, ages, metabolism, etc means we all need to find the right doses and routines and I am still honing mine.

I still have to say though that there has been nothing like what this cheap, simple to make, formula I have ever tried as far as what this is doing for me.

How incredible is this? How could this not be known by so many others??

I can never thank you enough, Bob, for finding this and sharing it with us.

I had to do a lot of exercise yesterday in zero degrees F. I had anticipated the stressful exercise and about 2 hours before such consumed about 1 1/2 ounce of the Magnesium BiCarbonate in about 1/2 bottle of bottled water (pretty concentrated and it did taste great !)..

I was not winded, although I was exercising with high physical stress for a period of at least 1/2 hour continuously. I consider it pretty amazing. What was happening apparently is energy utilization, oxygen utilization, carbohydrate consumption was working fine - (firing on all cylinders so to speak)..

It really was a life saver in my opinion. I love this stuff !

[kanishk]

I bought Magnesium Hydroxide powder and added rough amount without any calculation which is about half teaspoon to half liter of soda water. And drinking this solution with water..

[Bob]

I bought Magnesium Hydroxide powder and added rough amount without any calculation which is about half teaspoon to half liter of soda water. And drinking this solution with water..

I don't think that particular method would create complete bicarbonate conversion; as the carbonated seltzer water must be quickly placed into a totally sealed container with the magnesium hydroxide. And then one has to wait about 1-4 hours for the conversion to happen, for no residue to be left (with complete conversion).

The magnesium hydroxide has to be added to a chilled 1 litre bottle of seltzer water.. (400 mg of magnesium hydroxide per 5 mL is the typical concentration of over the counter Milk of Magnesia LIQUID). After it is added and then the bottle closed tightly, and then vigorously shaken at least 3 minutes, the solution appears milky. After 4 hours it will be clear with no residue. If there is residue, more carbon dioxide is needed.

I think you would be drinking magnesium hydroxide unconverted which could have laxative properties - see this page on the symptoms of magnesium hydroxide ingestion: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnesium_hydroxide

One wants to CONVERT the magnesium hydroxide into the Bicarbonate form.. That has a specific recipe to follow.

The recipe makes CONCENTRATE, which is then diluted with water. So one is NOT drinking a large amount of magnesium at any one time by using the dilutions that have been talked about in the thread.

There would be wrong products for the formula - (such as magnesium oxide, magnesium carbonate). Do not use either of those to match the proper recipe.

When the formula is followed the concentrate diluted into water will have a good taste which is recognizable.

[kanishk]

Today itself I made another batch.

What I did is I chilled the 600 ml bottle in freezer overnight. After that I put it in upright position in fridge. Then after some time with care taken out the bottle so that its content will not shake. I took about one heaping teaspoon full of MgOH (Magnesium Hydroxide) ready to put inside the bottle quickly. Then I opened the lid of the bottle, this time there was no spillage, very few amount of gas bubbles formed as compared to the first time. Then I poured the MgOH powder as quickly as possible and put the lid on.

After putting the lid on I sharked the bottle for about one and a half minute. Then after five minute the bottle was shrunk. I sharked it again and put it in refrigerator. Now I see very very less amount of the powder at the bottom. Maybe its about 1/50 th or lesser of the MgOH amount that I put in.

[kanishk]

There would be wrong products for the formula - (such as magnesium oxide, magnesium carbonate). Do not use either of those to match the proper recipe.

I already have Magnesium Carbonate, Magnesium Sulfate, Magnesium Oxide with me. I have ask the Chemical shop owner to get Magnesium Hydroxide, because it's not that common used chemicals. I took precaution whether the chemical I was buying is a good quality chemicals or not. Like looking at weather it is a reagent grade, laboratory grade or industrial grade. And looking weather its a EP,USP,IP or BP, which are different pharmacopeias of different countries. And then you also have to consider which brand of chemical you are buying like MERCK, THOMAS BAKER, BURGOYNE, etc.

[Bob]

There would be wrong products for the formula - (such as magnesium oxide, magnesium carbonate). Do not use either of those to match the proper recipe.

I already have Magnesium Carbonate, Magnesium Sulfate, Magnesium Oxide with me. I have ask the Chemical shop owner to get Magnesium Hydroxide, because it's not that common used chemicals. I took precaution whether the chemical I was buying is a good quality chemicals or not. Like looking at weather it is a reagent grade, laboratory grade or industrial grade. And looking weather its a EP,USP,IP or BP, which are different pharmacopeias of different countries. And then you also have to consider which brand of chemical you are buying like MERCK, THOMAS BAKER, BURGOYNE, etc.

Hi Kanishk - the carbonate and oxide versions of magnesium are definitely not used, and an earlier post talks about potential problems with oxides and stomach acid.

I looked up dry measure conversions: The hydroxide if in dry form, based on the recipe comes out to 3.6 grams (typical "Milk of Magnesia" is made with 400 milligrams of dry powder per 5 milliliters of pure water, so the recipe calls for 45 milliliters of "M.O.M." liquid. That then comes to 3.6 grams total dry magnesium hydroxide powder). Converting 3.6 grams of dry powder to a teaspoon measure (see http://www.convertunits.com/from/grams/to/teaspoons ) is about 3/4 of a teaspoon. So that would be the recipe's amount.

I am hoping that you did not freeze the seltzer bottle liquid with it being in the freezer. The recipe calls for normal refrigerator chilled, so that it remains liquid but very low refrigerator temperature which would keep it liquid form of seltzer.

As to reagent grades, I can't comment on what is considered safe for human consumption, if I recall my old chemistry days in School, they have a label on them that says "not for animal, human use", but for laboratory use only.. Not sure why if the substances are laboratory grade "guaranteed" to be ultra-pure unless it is some sort of licensing issue.

Curious why the over-the-counter Magnesium Hydroxide liquid called "Milk of Magnesia" is not available in various countries. A friend in Australia (Sydney area) reported it was not over-the-counter available for sales.

[kanishk]

Thank you Bob, I wanted to search into how much amount of MgOH in powdered form would be needed. So just poured in just unmeasured amount. And some of that excess amount of Magnesium Hydroxide gets dissolved into the water and remaining says at the bottom.

So if there is a ample amount of CO2 present in the water all the MgOH will be utilized according to recipe. But if someone puts more amount of MgOH in recipe OR the Carbonated water spills and decreases in its CO2 while adding MOM.. then he might be consuming some amount of MgOH with Magnesium Bi Carbonate.

Although I put the Soda water in freezer it was not freezed, it was liquid.

There are only two brands of MOM in dispensaries, and it has Paraffin and flavors in it. The MOM content was also very less, 10% in one brand and 3% in another.

[Bob]

Excellent logic Kanishk I think to do the "check for residue" method to see how much Magnesium Hydroxide can be added to a given amount of CO2. We've seen the reports that some batches come out better than others, which I believe comes from different amounts of CO2 being present in the Seltzer bottle. I noticed the brand I use has an expiration date when after that it can be more "flat" (out of CO2) than when fresh. Adequate CO2 appears to be the key to good zero residue and maximum conversion, and a very cold MOM and very cold Seltzer appears to minimize the bubble-waste effect, and allowing enough "free head space gap" at the top of the bottle.

The paraffin is definitely something that they use for laxative properties and should not be used with making of the magnesium bicarbonate water concentrate :)

[Bob]

Been using the magnesium bicarbonate regularly with the morning coffee - the taste is great (remember to let it cool a bit before adding it to the cup)..

Having gotten sprayed back in early April (black helicopter with a spray that smelled peppery and floral at the same time), came down with a flu (see the Prince has died thread for details), I noticed that my magnesium bicarbonate level increased by double.. the body needed extra magnesium bicarbonate to keep the mitochondria working at full speed.

So something to think about, if under the weather maybe boosting the magnesium bicarbonate will be helpful.. I certainly found it beneficial, and, I was able to beat back the pneumonia.. I did find it essential to have micro-amounts of ephedra (Breath Easy) to keep the bronchials clear and open.

(PS note for Paul :) I did increase my Vitamin C (in chelated form) to about 10 grams a day divided over 12 hours.. so the increase in Vitamin C in the chelated form was beneficial :) - however not taken at the same time as the magnesium bicarbonate.. )

[Bob]

Arthritis in the fingers and knuckles

Interesting, when I started using the PURE magnesium Bicarbonate water, all the aches and pains in the joints went away within a few days very rapidly. I had good range of motion again.

The Problem - The mistake I made: I changed the milk of magnesia BRAND to one made by Kroeger, which has CALCIUM added to it. So that brand is a combination of Magnesium plus Calcium, as we all "know" :) that magnesium and calcium supplements should be balanced.. So they say. (sarcastic..) Thinking that balanced cal/mag was good.. Not necessarily I found.

They also say we get TOO much calcium in our diet and too much calcium might very well "plate out" in our joints, and possibly could be leached out of our bones.. (link) (http://www.medicinenet.com/hypercalcemia/page3.htm) "moans stones groans and bones" - the issues that crop-up.

I didn't think that I was getting too much calcium, but I continued to notice, the joint pain increased over time, starting to get back to levels PRE-magnesium bicarbonate use.. All it took was ONE week of increased calcium to trigger all the symptoms of hypercalcemia.

Hulda Clark - death certificate points out one of the causes being hyper-calcemia, excess calcium. Getting too much calcium apparently can raise the blood pressure, messing with kidney function, allowing for irregular heart beats, and of course those horrible pains.

AH HA! dots connected...

I had inadvertently ended up ingesting MORE calcium than my body needed, and it started to go back into the joints, in my case the knuckles, and the aches and pains and reduction of movement started to appear, slowly.. No doubt now looking in retrospect, it was messing with KIDNEY FUNCTION too.

SO.. what I did was to toss out the batch of magnesium-calcium bicarbonate made up by using the KROEGER Milk of Magnesia (which had the ADDED CALCIUM), and switched to GENERIC PLAIN PURE Milk of Magnesia WITHOUT ANY ADDITIVES, pure magnesium hydroxide was the active ingredient. (Not to slam Kroeger products, just that the excess CALCIUM was not appropriate for a PURE magnesium hydroxide product which is needed to make the magnesium Bicarbonate).

Voilà !!

The magnesium bicarbonate without the calcium restored perfect mobility for me, no more joint pain, swelling, and I feel active again.

The calcium besides apparently being plated into the joints also seemed to make me sedated, or lethargic.. So if feeling worn out for no reason see if there is excess calcium in the diet, or take a look at the supplements to see if they are "fortified" with calcium.. It's quite possible excess calcium and NOT enough proper magnesium (in the form of magnesium BI-Carbonate) is what is happening.

I made up the new bottle of Seltzer water PLUS the 3 tablespoons of PURE Magnesium Hydroxide (pure milk of magnesia NO additives), and after shaking the bottle for about 4 minutes I noticed it got a LOT colder than using the other brand of M.O.M. The other brand left the mix slightly cloudy with some "crystal formation" in the bottom of the bottle. I can only imagine what the calcium crystal formation would feel like, OH ! I did, like arthritis in the joints !!

additional link: http://www.mgwater.com/calmagab.shtml

[Savannah]

I had all my mercury fillings removed and went through a dextox afterward. After reading Dr. Tennant’s book healing is voltage, he explained how humic and fulvic are no longer in our soul. The humic and fulvic removes heavy metals from our bodies. Now I take a small amount daily as a supplement.
http://senergy.us/raw-materials-detox-concentrate.html
I was using sodium bicarbonate in my water after reading Dr. Mark Sircu’s s book about the benefits of alkaline water, but then I read what David Miller wrote:
http://growyouthful.com/tips/alkaline-water.php
about the problems he experienced with throwing off his stomach acid and developing GERD. The recipe notes not drinking much of the water with meals because of this. I have a soda stream and water distiller (I only drink distilled water) and would like to try this recipe. Magnesium bicarbonate makes the water alkaline. Is this the only water you drink or do you just supplement with it?

[Bob]

Hi Savannah = I supplement with it, usually in my morning Coffee (makes a fantastic flavor). The pure magnesium Bicarbonate seems best as I certainly don't need more sodium in my diet such as using "sodium bicarbonate". I prefer the fresh liquid made up with the Seltzer water (which provides the carbon-dioxide to convert the magnesium properly). The excess sodium worries me, as would excess calcium. Our water is relatively devoid of minerals, so I get the supplements for the minerals other ways. Paul has some very good mineral separate recipes :) which I think would be well worth looking at.

ZERO GERD with using this at 1 1/2 ounces per day. Some folks have noticed up to 2 1/2 ounces per day is good, and then may back down afterwards for a maintenance amount. I notice under extreme stress, or "leaky mercury", or doing stupid and having a mercury preserved vaccine, all up the requirement for more magnesium bicarbonate.

Dilution of the concentrate to the strength desired (I like 1 1/2 ounces or sometimes drop to 1 ounce per day if not stressed) and then the dilution ingested OVER TIME slowly seems best.

The dilution into one's drinking water bottle over the day is one suggestion, instead of shotgunning it all at once. I prefer it in my cool morning coffee, which takes me about 3 hours to finish so it is a slow intake.. Not finding a need for more during the day, except if I have to work strenuously outside during the day.

--Bob


I had all my mercury fillings removed and went through a dextox afterward. After reading Dr. Tennant’s book healing is voltage, he explained how humic and fulvic are no longer in our soul. The humic and fulvic removes heavy metals from our bodies. Now I take a small amount daily as a supplement.
http://senergy.us/raw-materials-detox-concentrate.html
I was using sodium bicarbonate in my water after reading Dr. Mark Sircu’s s book about the benefits of alkaline water, but then I read what David Miller wrote:
http://growyouthful.com/tips/alkaline-water.php
about the problems he experienced with throwing off his stomach acid and developing GERD.

The recipe notes not drinking much of the water with meals because of this.

I have a soda stream and water distiller (I only drink distilled water) and would like to try this recipe. Magnesium bicarbonate makes the water alkaline.

Is this the only water you drink or do you just supplement with it?


The humic and fulvic removes heavy metals from our bodies.

re: humic and fulvic acid substances - the "healing waters" of Scotland (near Aberdeen) contain a lot of natural humic and fulvic acid substances. My understanding on how that works, is the water from rainfall passes through decaying leaves, moss, rich in humic and fulvic acid. The nature of the rock is to have HIGH chloride (chlorine ion) concentrations..

Whence the mixture matures by the time it reaches the "springs", it is high in converted fulvic/humic acid and has converted into a form of DCA (di-chloro-Acetate).

DCA has been known to facilitate HEALING through mitochondrial adjustment, stopping or diminishing radically tumor formation. So, it makes sense, that such substances can do great and wondrous things, seemingly "miraculous", but actually have a clear scientific background.

[Bob]

For me it's been 7 months now of using the Magnesium BiCarbonate water, having tried different forms of the "Milk of Magnesia", having explored different brands of Seltzer water (Bubbling sparkling water containing Carbon Dioxide or CO2), different amounts of concentrate, looking at shelf life of the "concentrate", different techniques of making the Magnesium Bi-Carbonate (such as chilling), noting the effects of NOT taking (how long it takes to "crash" or go back to system deficiency reactions)..

I can say, I am impressed with the pure form, made freshly.

That which I have found to be essential is to use PURE Magnesium Hydroxide (milk of magnesia) for the magnesium. No adulteration, no substitution, no additives what-so-ever is important when doing the carbonation step. PURE SELTZER WATER, NO ADDITIVES... (please note that emphasis).

What I have found in preparation - The carbonation step should be done COLD, as cold as possible without freezing. Chill the milk of magnesia and the seltzer bottle overnight.

When making.. what I did was to pour out 2 ounces of the seltzer liquid into a chilled measuring cup to make room for the addition of the milk of magnesia to the MAIN 1 litre bottle. Next I added the 3 tablespoons of chilled milk of magnesia to the chilled 1 litre setlzer bottle, doing it quickly, and then adding back the previously poured out 2 ounces of seltzer that was removed to "make room".

Then closed the cap on the seltzer quickly, tightly, and then continued to shake shake shake shake for about 4 minutes or until the bottle became noticeably COLDER and started to cave in.

What I understand - The CO2 from the Seltzer is then being absorbed by the Magnesium Hydroxide and such is being converted to Magnesium Bi-Carbonate. And the liquid then starts to get clearer. At this point I put the bottle back in the refrigerator to sit. Almost ZERO residue on the bottle bottom will be the result after about 2 hours of sitting back in the refrigerator.

I've found that it can then be used, in DILUTED FORM. At first, I found that using 1 ounce of the concentrate for a starting trial seems to be good to see how I would sit with it. Up to 2 1/2 ounces (per day) of the concentrate appears to be maximum for me (a normal weight adult). The best dilution substance I've noticed seems to be pure water. I've also found that it works with coffee and tea as dilutants, provided that the dilutant isn't any hotter than about 122 degrees F when adding in the Magnesium Bi-Carbonate.

Adding to "acid like beverages" seems to break down the magnesium bicarbonate.

A Study - Possibly allowing the magnesium bi-carbonate to sublingually absorb under the tongue would be a good study. Magnesium BiCarbonate spray may be very useful for application to problem areas.

I've explored spraying the concentrate onto cuts and burns - I've noticed it appears to reduce pain and apparently the healing appears to speed up. (I think some type of additional antiseptic probably would be needed on wounds to help with preventing infection, but I believe that the magnesium ion and bicarbonate channel appears to be a facilitator of healing - how that exact mechanism may work is unknown at this time, but finding that out could result in a good study).

When I mistakenly used a milk of magnesia with CALCIUM added, probably having made Calcium-Bi-Carbonate, I believe that the addition of that calcium countered the apparent beneficial effects of the Magnesium Bi-Carbonate. (Arthritis symptoms started to appear with the excess CALCIUM as well as kidney issues, actual kidney pains were starting to appear). Temporarily stopping ingesting of the calcium substances for me during the episode and increasing (temporarily to 2 ounces per day for 2 days) the pure magnesium bi-carbonate alleviated all arthritis symptoms as well as kidney pain and normal kidney activity started back up.

I personally like this magnesium bi-carbonate. When in the summer, sweating profusely, we understand that a LOT of magnesium is lost. Supplementing with the magnesium bi-carbonate water then probably may be essential to keep the body functioning better. (Potassium and sodium is lost also during profuse sweating, so supplementing with the appropriate tissue salts is needed plus adequate water make-up). I am impressed, especially for me, the no joint pain, and alertness improvement, and extra "strength", not feeling "toxic" are keys to me.

http://d1zyt1zopjo69c.cloudfront.net/EAN13_images/0681131699938.jpg
EQUATE Brand 26 fluid ounces PURE
UPC:681131699938
EAN-13:0681131699938
or 681131-699938
or 81131699938 or 8113169993
Model #: SKU:

READ the OTHER ingredients, sodium hypochlorite (a chlorinating preservative) is the ONLY inactive ingredient - what impressed me was that I needed to watch out for that HIDDEN CALCIUM ! (and fully read the label on the back of the Magnesium Hydroxide (Milk of Magnesia) bottle.)

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/413GzvTXQvL.jpg

READ the back LABEL: (although this back label below is for GeriCare brand, this matches similarly the brand I have made under the Equate label.)

NOTE - I have noted during internet searches on different brands, that CERTAIN VENDORS using the EQUATE LABEL MAY ADD CALCIUM AND OTHER substances or ADULTERANTS ! I think CAUTION is in order - reading the back label makes a LOT of sense.

---> ALSO I noted that it was important to check the STRENGTH of the magnesium hydroxide PER 15 milliliters - the strength being used says 1200 mg per 15 ml.

I believe that a LESSER strength amount will not put adequate magnesium hydroxide in the 1 litre seltzer bottle for creating maximum saturation of the final concentrated liquid.

http://otclabels.com/lib/images-otc/milk-of-magnesia-original-14/mom-12-gcp.jpg

For me looking for purity, being aware of the additives sticks in my mind: (that was the mistake I made when I didn't pay attention to the "Calcium" added) - the "wrong milk of magnesia" for the magnesium bicarbonate recipe might have a label with wording which may look similar to this:

http://chanlo.com/images/calcium-1.jpg

[Chanlo23]

... I can say, I am impressed with the pure form, made freshly. ...
For me looking for purity, being aware of the additives sticks in my mind: (that was the mistake I made when I didn't pay attention to the "Calcium" added) - the "wrong milk of magnesia" for the magnesium bicarbonate recipe


I would just like to confirm the necessity to read both the front and back labels of both the MOM and the WATER! Although I had made an effort to purchase products that stated on the FRONT label 100% magnesium hydroxide milk of magnesia and 100% non-flavored carbonated water with no flavorings, I was not experiencing the gains reported by other folks I knew who were testing this. (I had noticed modest improvements sufficient to continue the protocol.) Yesterday, I read the BACK labels and the fine print regarding inactive ingredients and 'other information' of both water and mom.

The 'other information' on the back label of the 100% magnesium hydroxide milk of magnesia I had purchased as a generic HEB brand stated that each tablespoon contained 20 mg of calcium. The 'inactive ingredients' of the 100% pure water I had purchased indicated it contained 2% calcium. That neither manufacturer understood this meant the ingredients of both products represented a sum > 100% totally explains my lesser results. Argh...

[Bob]

Chanlo23 - that calcium plus the other additives definitely cuts back on the magnesium effectiveness. I wonder when manufacturers started adding "HIDDEN" calcium to the magnesium hydroxide milk of magnesia product? As I said, I found the generic Equate product by some stores had hidden calcium added..

If calcium toxicity is being hidden in so many items (this "fortifying step") I just wonder if it is part of some campaign to try to harm healthful "solutions"... and/or facilitate heart problems, hardened arteries, kidney problems, high blood pressure, arthritis symptoms, and who knows what else "hypercalcemia" type of reactions may happen..

As far as I personally can determine the magnesium bicarbonate appears to be the "antidote" to systemic calcium poisoning. That's my guess.

[Daozen]

Nanocalcium is supposed to be a major cause of disease and aging, if not THE major cause, along with Telomere fraying. David Wolfe gives a good talk on it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R9VEz2Px8QM

Chancapiedra and Methylsulfurmethane can also break up these calcium deposits. According to David, nanocalcium buildup is supposed to be an underlying factor in arthritis, kidney stones, heart disease and more. Most any disease can be traced to these tiny deposits. They are supposed to be like coral or limescale. Check the buildup on an old kettle, is that happening to our bodies?

[Bob]

I've never seen MSM rapidly and permanently stop my arthritic-like pain which was continuing to build. Tried it and got adequately sick from it.

The Magnesium Bi-Carbonate started clearing the apparent calcium issue dramatically in only 3 hours and by the end of 2 days (two doses of a total two ounces each at a total cost of 6 cents (US) ) it was totally gone, with full range of motion once again. One can't buy a painkiller for that low a price that is so beneficial, broad spectrum.

I haven't experienced MSM being "broad spectrum (http://www.webmd.com/vitamins-supplements/ingredientmono-522-msm%20methylsulfonylmethane.aspx?activeingredientid=522)" enough to do ANY good for me quickly and rapidly; and it is based on a methylated "sulfur", or having "sulfur" as part of it's makeup - although MSM has a LIST of claims (click that link to see it's claims and 'uses').

Also see post 15 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?86797-Magnesium-BiCarbonate-Water-a-guide-to-make&p=1020088&viewfull=1#post1020088) - one is talking about the BICARBONATE CHANNEL activation into the Cellular Mitochondria when using Magnesium BiCarbonate.


This THREAD is about the BiCarbonate mechanism of Magnesium, and the process of making as the thread's title says, "Magnesium BiCarbonate Water a guide of How to make" such in a PURE FRESH WAY.

I am not a fan of sulfur products which is why I pointed out the Epsom salts discussion(that started right immediately in POST 2) can be taken into a new thread (or old one) about using Magnesium Sulfate. I am allergic to sulfur products as well.

Magnesium Bicarbonate has been the only solution for me to deal with the calcium induced poisoning (like arthritis). The arthritis is gone, range of motion is back. That to me means a lot.. And the arthritis only kicked in and the kidney pain, only when the excess calcium was ingested (inadvertently).

Having tried MSM and for me found it useless and a waste of money, the Magnesium Bicarbonate has been outstanding for me. Maybe folks like it (MSM), but great for them - I don't find it beneficial (it does make me sick) when compared to Magnesium Bicarbonate's effectiveness for dealing with the issues which have bothered me.

I noted that the lethargy that comes from calcium toxicity also quickly clears as others have reported in this thread that the "brain fog" goes away very rapidly. If it is calcium buildup that is causing those intense issues, and Magnesium Bicarbonate seems to clear it, that's good enough for me at this point.

This thread is about Magnesium Bi-Carbonate and the list of items mentioned in Post 1 as to does it or does it not create beneficial effects, and at what amount of concentrate people have found useful. The thread goes over various methods to make a "good batch" with minimal loss of CO2, what to look for. Folks have noted the correct "taste" when the bicarbonation is just right.


http://cc.amazingcounters.com/counter.php?i=3190880&c=9572953

[Bob]

I tried up'ing the amount of Magnesium Hydroxide (the milk of magnesia, the pure type), to a new 1 litre bottle of Seltzer water (CO2 plus water), and having gone to about 4 tablespoons this time, just to see what happens.

Well I ended up with a bottle with some sediment on the bottom. :) Unreacted Magnesium Hydroxide was sitting on the bottle's bottom. I shook it up and dispersed the residual, then poured out two ounces of the concentrate, and then added pure fresh seltzer water (for more CO2). And when I closed the cap, there was some pressure noted (correct). Shake shake shake once again, and the bottle gets markedly colder, and starts to collapse.

This procedure can be accomplished a couple times if needed to deal with adding excessive Magnesium Hydroxide or starting with a WEAK bottle of Seltzer water to start. I note that they have expiration dates on the Seltzer bottles. Not knowing why I can guess that somehow the CO2 leaks, and the Seltzer goes flat.

So the two conditions to watch for are SEDIMENT and FLAT Seltzer water. Leaving the bottle open too long between taking it out of the Fridge and adding in the Magnesium Hydroxide is a reason that CO2 can be lost. The re-addition of FRESH CO2 with new Seltzer seems to be the way to salvage a bottle.

It tastes BEST when there is no sediment, and just pure Magnesium Bi-Carbonate has been made. :)

[Bob]

Continuing to use the Magnesium bicarbonate. This is probably the most amazing substance I have ever tried. Not having muscle spasms when one get's old really is something that I think is the most amazing benefit. Apparently we use up the ability to use stored magnesium as we age.. And this bicarbonate channel is so important for cellular respiration (the transmission of nutrients, oxygen, and waste CO2 out of the cell (mitochondria)..

I had to up the amount to 2 ounces per day of the concentrate as I had seen earlier, when stress levels (physically are high) needing the extra magnesium bicarbonate is needed, so that cells are able to repair themselves. After the stress level drops I have noticed 1 ounce per day with the morning coffee is really good. At the first sign of muscle spasms (usually seen in bed when stretching), up the magnesium bicarbonate asap.. Within a few hours normalization happens.

Without the extra magnesium bicarbonate, the first symptom is spasm and pain in muscles. Do remember that every capillary blood vessel is lined with muscles... Not having magnesium bicarbonate there it seems to me could lead to strokes for instance, of course spasms (inability to work the muscle). Can you imagine if blood vessels just clamped up? Brain issues, heart and lung issues, organ issues..

Anyway, just reporting when the stress is there, physically it has been literally in my opinion a life saver. I like to push it physically and there seems to be a need to then boost the magnesium bicarbonate proportionately, which then allows for proper mitochondrial energy utilization and apparently cellular healing..

[fourty-two]

so if the efficacy of the MG bIcarb working is the activity of the cO2,what is your opinion of adding a few chips if dry ice to the mix thereby sidestepping the issue of stale or flat seltzers?

I know some liquor stores sell dry ice - though Ive no idea how long it would last (tightly wrapped) in my freezer..

[Bob]

so if the efficacy of the MG bIcarb working is the activity of the cO2,what is your opinion of adding a few chips if dry ice to the mix thereby sidestepping the issue of stale or flat seltzers?

I know some liquor stores sell dry ice - though Ive no idea how long it would last (tightly wrapped) in my freezer..

Thanks for the question and thought -

I think with a fresh chilled bottle of 1 litre size of seltzer water and 3 full tablespoons of the pure magnesium hydroxide liquid (m.o.m.), what one sees is within 1/2 hour of the initial shaking, the bottle has collapsed, thereby using up the existing CO2 for the reaction. Extra CO2 at that point appears to prevent the bottle collapse, but doesn't seem to contribute to more of a reaction, if the magnesium hydroxide has been converted to the bicarbonate form. When the mixture goes clear, and the bottle collapses that seems to be all that is needed.

Where I have seen problems with making the magnesium bicarbonate form is when using more than 3 full tablespoons of the pure magnesium hydroxide for 1 litre of fresh COLD seltzer water, or if one uses a flavored seltzer water, or an artificially sweetened/flavored m.o.m. (milk of magnesia), or a m.o.m. which is adulterated with "additives", such as flavoring, or paraffin oil, or if it contains "CALCIUM" compounds of any kind. Using an "expired" bottle of seltzer water, where it has started to go flat would be an issue, where residual cloudy, or residual on the bottom of the bottle happens after an hour, and any shaking afterwards doesn't allow it to clear up (after another hour after shaking).

Adding dry ice CO2 could be dangerous due to a potential for excess pressure build-up.. And excess pressure I believe would hide the bottle collapse indication showing that the mixture has started the chemical conversion of the hydroxide to bicarbonate.. The "seltzer maker" mentioned earlier appears to be a good source of "sparkling water", if one has started with distilled water and added CO2 gas to.

The best way I have seen from the many bottles now having been made up of this, is to do it this way:


Chill over night, a plastic measuring cup, the Milk of Magnesia (m.o.m.), the seltzer water.
Next morning, take out all the components, place on the counter. Slowly open the seltzer water bottle, and carefully/slowly pour out about 2-3 ounces of the seltzer into the measuring cup.
Pour 3 tablespoons of the m.o.m. into the supplied measuring cup that was on the top of the m.o.m. bottle. Try to get it accurate and not above the line.
Add the measured amount of the m.o.m. to the seltzer bottle, quickly. Pour some of the removed seltzer water from the measuring cup into the m.o.m. measuring cup. Stir it a bit to get out any residual. And pour that into the seltzer bottle.
Finally add in the remaining seltzer water that you poured out (to make some space) back into the seltzer bottle, and then close the cap tightly.


Here is where you have some fun. Shake shake shake and shake some more, turning the bottle as you shake. The bottle will seem cold, really cold as the reaction starts. After a few minutes, you may notice the cloudy mixture starts to get slightly clearer, and it starts to collapse. When it is well collapsed, put it back in the refrigerator. After an hour take it out and shake it a little bit to get any residual cloudiness off the bottom. Keep it closed. In an hour take a look, it should be clear. At this point all of the available CO2 should have been consumed in the conversion of the magnesium hydroxide into magnesium bicarbonate.

If it remains cloudy, probably there was either too much m.o.m. or that it was an impure grade of m.o.m. or the seltzer bottle was starting to go flat. Check the expiration date on the bottle - what I do when buying the bottle, is to tighten the cap a bit, if I am not going to use it immediately. I try to buy like 4 months in advance and be sure to use before the expiration date. Also, chilling the m.o.m. , the measuring cup, and the seltzer is important. Chilled appears to prevent CO2 waste when opening, and somehow seems to allow for a better reaction. When it's made right, I think one will recognize the taste of the bicarbonate form is very different from "magnesium carbonate taste".. Sam in one of the posts noted that when made right the taste is "correct". I've noted the taste too for a well made batch myself.

---update---

There is a caution notice about dry ice and closed containers:

http://www.west.net/~science/co2.htm


SAFETY NOTE:
NEVER PLACE dry ice into a closed container such as a soda bottle. The bottle can explode with a loud bang, damaging your eardrums. Loose plastic, such as the bottle cap, may fly off, damaging someone's eyes.

Probably the safest and best method to get fresh seltzer water is to use Soda Stream or equivalent to create a batch of fresh seltzer sparkling water -
This is their website - https://www.sodastreamusa.com/

If I went through a lot of seltzer water (sparkling water), I probably would buy a Soda Stream. My use of seltzer these days primarily is for making 1 litre concentrates of the magnesium bicarbonate, and I haven't been able to justify the extra cost for a fresh seltzer water maker.. 69 cents through 89 cents per litre bottle at the supermarket at worse case for a year's worth of concentrate making comes out at under 11$.

[Ewan]

Bob, should have posted this long before now, sorry.

I started drinking nothing but distilled water about a year ago. I make a batch of Mg Water conc., as per your advice above, and put a tablespoon in each litre bottle. Every fourth or fifth 4l batch of distilled water goes untouched.

A year back it was impossible for me to squat down without holding onto something, my knees were really bad. Walking the children to school would produce laboured breathing by the halfway stage. I'd been through a lot of medical problems in the preceding years which with hindsight could have had a lot to do with toxicity overload.

A couple of months ago I walked miles in Scotland and have no problem squatting up and down several times. Can I say it is solely down to Mag Water, no, but I'm damn sure it has a lot to do with it. Thanks for sharing.

[Bob]

Thanks for the report Ewan :)

- I've explored different levels of concentration, depending on the stress level.. Yesterday I had to work 8 hours in the field with a heavy land excavator, working the knees, arms, twisting around, controlling vehicle motion with the feet, and raising and lowering various levers at the same time (interesting machine) and generally its like doing heavy lifting, and all the muscles would be painful, unbearable after that level of exercise. That I was able to deal with the 8 hours of physical stress level work is I think amazing, and the after effects (the day after)... I can tell that I had a good workout, but not exhausted, and the pain level is minimal and recovery is extremely fast.. Having done years earlier, that without the magnesium bicarbonate it was really stressful and the physical burn-out happens fast.

What I also noticed is food was consumed and utilized well, so digestion was apparently improved, allowing good food -->> energy utilization. If the muscle 'burn' or cramps afterwards comes from lactic acid formation, this may have been reduced with the magnesium bicarbonate (proper cellular respiration).

When I am going to do stressful physical activity, I will use 1 ounce of concentrate in a cup of liquid taken before exercise.. I prefer to have it in my morning coffee (below 122 degrees F), one ounce average.. A really physically stressful day, 1 1/2 to 2 ounces in the morning. Folks have also chosen to use that dose level over the day, by diluting the 1-1 1/2 ounces over a couple litres of liquid (like in their water bottle). I am not sure which works best.. I really like how the coffee tastes made up this way :) I am glad to have been given this lead too from a friend.

[kanishk]

Me too, I am not regular with the Magnesium Bicarbonate water, but when I use it cramps in my calf muscle lowers down.

Acupressurist told me that this calf muscle pain is related to the back pain and I should drink coconut water. They say my body is deficient in minerals. So whenever I take this 'Magnesium Bicarbonate water' my body exhaustion reduces and I feel less exhausted in morning and after some days feel normal. But I am not regular with this practice.

What I observed is when I put only one gram of Magnesium Hydroxide in the 650 ml carbonated water, very few grains of MgOH remains on the bottom and the water almost tastes like coconut water. I gave this water to many people asking what do you think it is? and they said it tastes like coconut water. Then gave some people telling that its a coconut water, some said yes it is coconut water and some said it tastes same like coconut water but a little different.

But if I add more MgOH to the carbonated water the water made from that concentrate feels like Well water. Some people said that this is the water from good Well, because of its (sweet) taste.

One guys asks me for this water.. he says that he wants to drink that sweet water that I make adding some medicine called COOH haha..

[Bob]

I tested it again - very high stress with the legs (calfs) and only using 1 ounce per day, then that night into early morning hours I started to note a tendency for the cramping to happen specifically in the overworked muscles. The correction consisted of using 1 ounce more (total of two ounces the next day) - no more pain nor cramping, and had full muscle ability during the day. Will see if there is any cramping during the night early morning hours.. Total cost to "fix" the issue, maybe 6 cents, no pain killers needed, no ibuprofen, no aleve, no tylenol.. :)

[Jovian]

Glad to see an intrepid N=1 experimenter with Mg! Bob, thank you for posting the details of your trials, including the mention of how the added calcium diminishes the benefits. ... I just recently became obsessed with researching this element that has so many people raving about its benefits. My main quest is to finally resolve my severe PMS/PMDD ("Premenstrual Dysphoric Disorder") symptoms that rob me of half of every month.

I only started about ten days ago using transdermal Magnesium Chloride in a supersaturated solution (so-called "magnesium oil") that I made up with bath salts I had around. I am seeing some improvements already in my usual time-of-month symptoms (and super soft skin). (I will post later on, in the magnesium oil thread.)


Regarding M.O.M, I ,found NONE of the seven generic brands in my area stores are without calcium or sodium hypochlorite. The Dollar General version I found has calcium. If I find none my future search, I will order Sodium Chloride powder and simply make it that way.

If I were you, I would snatch up whatever pure MOM bottles I came across before it is also altered. I would assume that since it is another natural or inexpensive remedy that mankind has found great benefit from, it will be deemed by TPTB to be anathema to their agenda of keeping man enfeebled and with just enough energy to subsist in the slave state.

To give proper credit to the originator of this recipe, the naturopath's site that is quoted has drawn the recipe and most of its info from the afibbers.com page that she cites,

http://www.afibbers.org/Wallerwater.pdf

That page mentions Erling Waller, "a former afibber," as being one of two persons who came up with the formulation, known as Waller Water.

[Bob]

Howdy @Jovian :)

Equate brand Milk of Magnesia (M.O.M.) - page link: https://www.walmart.com/ip/Equate-Original-Flavor-Milk-Of-Magnesia-26-Oz/15754359 (From WalMart)
Ingredients: Active: Magnesium Hydroxide 400 Mg. Inactive: Purified Water, Sodium Hypochlorite.

There appears to be no problem with the Sodium Hypochlorite inert ingredient which acts as a preservative (a slight generator of Chlorine). Stay away from any Calcium added, or any flavors.

Do not use FLAVORED or artificially sweetened Seltzer water. COOL in the refrigerator, both the M.O.M., the Seltzer and a measuring cup. Coolest is best to prevent excess CO2 loss.

Equate: Original Flavor Milk Of Magnesia, 26 Oz size, product number - Walmart #: 550173456 Price (less tax) - $3.57 (US)

This brand and source appears to offer a product of good quality, very low cost, has minimal inactive ingredients and is usually in-stock


https://i5.walmartimages.com/asr/53cf5f7a-73e3-451e-839d-82a190768e9f_1.4e8f2432e79329ea555862843cc67a89.jpeg?odnHeight=450&odnWidth=450&odnBg=FFFFFF

[Jovian]

Hi Bob. Yes, I had read all of your detailed posts in this thread, with your continued tweaks about the best method. I will be following your advice.

On your recommendation that the sodium chlorite is of little concern, I will go ahead with one of the brands that add that.

I think someone upthread had mentioned a concern about the purity of the carbonated water choices. I did find Poland Spring now offering a Sparkling Water in 1L size, for only 99c, made with spring water, for anyone who thinks that might be a better choice than whatever water might be used in the other carbonated water choices. (What type of water do they use, anyway?) Personally, I am not that concerned.

[Bob]

Hi @Jovian - of all the experimentation, the most difficulty came when either artificial sweeteners were present, or fructose even, or any added "oils" for flavorings, and of course Calcium (which ended up apparently as a very reactive form of calcium bicarbonate).. (flavorings could be lime, cherry, raspberry, etc..)

Other minerals present (from something called a "Spring Water" may be an issue if one is wanting to minimize variables, and to only explore using pure water with carbon dioxide (CO2).. My thoughts about a "spring mineral water" which may be "sparkling" is that there could be traces of other minerals, which may then end up being "bicarbonated"...

If one used the Soda Stream product with pure distilled water, that should have the least amount of other substances or variables..

Taking a look at Poland Spring Water (such comes from a spring, from the earth, so it is not distilled, and therefore would contain other minerals most likely)

from - https://www.polandspring.com/springs-101/


https://www.polandspring.com/springs-101/
So you might be asking yourself, “what exactly is spring water?” That’s a great question, and the actual definition comes from the U.S. Food & Drug Administration (FDA).

The FDA definition for spring water is very detailed, but a brief description is: “Spring Water is water derived from an underground formation from which water flows naturally to the surface of the earth at an identified location.” To be able to label our product as “spring water”, we have to meet stringent standards set by the FDA – standards we proudly meet or exceed. That’s why every bottle of Poland Spring® is proudly labeled as 100% natural spring water.

I pulled up their "Water Quality Report" - https://www.nestle-watersna.com/asset-library/Documents/PS_ENG.pdf

and went to the Mineral Analysis Page - there are NUMEROUS other substances present, so the water is not PURE DISTILLED - doing the reaction with the milk of magnesia could then result in not a pure magnesium bicarbonate

http://chanlo.com/images/poland-1.jpg

So possibly, consider doing an experiment using carbonated pure (sparkling) water and the product that you want to test, and please the report what you find.

[conk]

Nanocalcium is supposed to be a major cause of disease and aging, if not THE major cause, along with Telomere fraying. ....
Chancapiedra and Methylsulfurmethane can also break up these calcium deposits. According to David, nanocalcium buildup is supposed to be an underlying factor in arthritis, kidney stones, heart disease and more. Most any disease can be traced to these tiny deposits. They are supposed to be like coral or limescale. Check the buildup on an old kettle, is that happening to our bodies?I have a little book by name of The Calcium Bomb. Conclusion, just as you stated.

Dr. Jerry Tennant's great book Healing Is Voltage discusses Mag BiCarb as a means of raising the body's pH (potential for hydrogen). Acidic pH levels mean low voltage. This pH is not the blood pH, as that can't stray far from 7.2-7.6 or so. Death ensues quickly with improper blood pH. The pH that we can affect is in the cellular fluids. The cells are where the electron exchange occurs.

W4_8EE8a8YI

Dr. Tennant recommended and I bought some expensive Mag Bicarb. So glad to find this thread from you Bob. Just wonderful! Will experiment tonight after a quick trip to the store.

[Jovian]

Wow, Bob. Thanks for that data. I appreciate it. Those numbers look pretty good to me. I will try this water for a while.

...I just attempted my first batch. This Poland Spring Sparkling seems to be extremely fizzy water. I had the idea to use a straw to remove that top ounce or so, to make room for the MOM (by creating vacuum with my finger over top of straw), in order to cause the least disturbance. ...But then I went and knocked the bottle over anyway, as I balanced it on the edge of the sink (d'oh!). I lost only about an ounce of water. Nevertheless, the water seemed to gobble up the 3 T's of MOM, as the bottle hadn't noticeably collapsed, and it was clear with no sediment, after one hour.

There was still a slight carbonation release upon opening the bottle. I then used a strawful from the bottle to rinse the MOM cap and add that back in. There was then a slight collapse upon shaking. I tried adding a tad more MOM, and there has been no additional collapse after an hour.

I will start taking it tomorrow.

[Bob]

Hi @Jovian :)

It's good to hear that there is excess CO2 with the product that you are using with the 3 tablespoons of M.O.M. I and others have noticed when the mixture is completely reacted and one tries it, it tastes "right".. If it tastes yucky, possibly that is because one is getting unreacted magnesium hydroxide, or possibly a magnesium "carbonate" having lost the BI-carbonate effect.. I like the bicarbonate taste - :)

Paul was early on mentioning to watch out for de-carbonation happening from excessive temperatures (122 degrees seems to be the maximum temperature for the bicarbonate before it could break down), so when I add it to tea or coffee, I don't put it in extremely hot liquids. (I have an optical thermometer that I used to get an idea what it feels like to have the right temperature of the liquid).

I've also tried it (1 thru 1 1/2 ounces concentrate) in a few ounces of water, consumed all at once, if I am feeling really stressed (or going to be very stressed due to working in the cold and altitude). So it's a bit different than the original PDF near the OP post 1 about how they diluted the concentrate in a LOT of water and used that water over the day for sipping... I think experimentation is pretty interesting and of course sharing with the rest of the community what we have found. (I am very curious about adding a very slight amount (less than a milligram) of MANGANESE.. as one specific "catalytic ingredient" - Paul has a few posts on MANGANESE, which must not be used in excess).. TO be continued along that line at another time... :)

[4evrneo]

It seems I will have to use the MOM with the small amount of Sodium Hypochlorite. I have been to 6 stores and have not found any without it. Here's hoping it works as well.

Bob: Do you know if this can be used topically? I am wondering what it will do with face skin....

Thanks again for all this information. Can't wait to start feeling better!

[Bob]

It seems I will have to use the MOM with the small amount of Sodium Hypochlorite. I have been to 6 stores and have not found any without it. Here's hoping it works as well.

Bob: Do you know if this can be used topically? I am wondering what it will do with face skin....

Thanks again for all this information. Can't wait to start feeling better!

I've used it topically and on burns and/or irritations. Seems to help. Some folks like magnesium chloride spray for topical use. I find the bicarbonate version for me is pretty universal. I just would not exceed 2 ounces of concentrate daily being absorbed whatever way :)

[ThePythonicCow]

Here's a good talk by Dr Russell Blaylock on magnesium. He doesn't mention the bicarbonate form of magnesium, but he does mention some other useful forms of it, and describes the importance of magnesium in a variety of critical body functions. Magnesium - Episode 21 (http://www.blaylockhealthchannel.com/bhc-ep-21-magnesium). This is an episode from September 2015 of his Blaylock Health Podcast Channel (http://www.blaylockhealthchannel.com/bhc-podcast-archive).

[Chester]

Hi Bob... can the Mag Bi Carb help folks who sometimes experience migraines?

Or do you have another suggested remedy?

[Bob]

Hi Bob... can the Mag Bi Carb help folks who sometimes experience migraines?

Or do you have another suggested remedy?

Hi Sam - on migraines I've seen that usually there is something going on with the gums/nerves/teeth around the "eye teeth". Possibly using a waterpick and checking for teeth issues, or gum issues would be good, specifically on both sides of the lateral incisors, both upper and lower, the canines upper and lower, and first premolar.


https://www.netterimages.com/images/vpv/000/000/056/56803-0550x0475.jpg

These nerves can become irritated and cause all sorts of pains, ringing in the ears, optical sensations, on and on.. Magnesium may be useful to help the nerves and cells, but I would think checking for tooth/gum issues would be a good idea. Every time I get a migraine, either the pulsing pain, or the weird optical geometry migraines, there was usually something going on with the gums, usually some trapped food particle which evoked a gum inflammation..

[conk]

Hi Bob... can the Mag Bi Carb help folks who sometimes experience migraines?

Or do you have another suggested remedy?

Hi Sam - on migraines I've seen that usually there is something going on with the gums/nerves/teeth around the "eye teeth". Possibly using a waterpick and checking for teeth issues, or gum issues would be good, specifically on both sides of the lateral incisors, both upper and lower, the canines upper and lower, and first premolar.


https://www.netterimages.com/images/vpv/000/000/056/56803-0550x0475.jpg

These nerves can become irritated and cause all sorts of pains, ringing in the ears, optical sensations, on and on.. Magnesium may be useful to help the nerves and cells, but I would think checking for tooth/gum issues would be a good idea. Every time I get a migraine, either the pulsing pain, or the weird optical geometry migraines, there was usually something going on with the gums, usually some trapped food particle which evoked a gum inflammation..
There have been several stories in the alt media that relate bad bacteria and lack of beneficial bacteria in the mouth to migraines. The colon isn't the only place we need good colonies of bacteria.

[Jeepney]

hi! cant find pure sparkling water here in my area. can i substitute sparkling mineral water just like the brand pellegrino? that's what i often see here in the supermarkets.

thanks!
-J

[Bob]

hi! cant find pure sparkling water here in my area. can i substitute sparkling mineral water just like the brand pellegrino? that's what i often see here in the supermarkets.

thanks!
-J

Hia, you could try. What one wants to minimize is calcium present in the sparkling water. If you can get a litre size of the sparkling water, then the 3 tablespoon fulls of the Magnesium Hydroxide could be added to see if it completely changes from milky color (in the mineral water), to clear after about 2 hours.

Be sure to shake after adding the milk of magnesia (magnesium hydroxide), and shake and shake.. The bottle should feel noticeably colder after shaking, and all "fizz" will go away after it gets clear.

If it doesn't get clear, there was not enough CO2 gas in the sparkling mineral water. In that case try reducing the amount of magnesium hydroxide by 1/2, and repeat the procedure with a fresh bottle of sparkling water. The ratio normally is 3 tablespoon full of magnesium hydroxide (pure, not flavored, no additives), to one litre of chilled sparkling water (seltzer).

The alternative to all that is to obtain a Soda Stream system and make your own CO2 charged water (Seltzer water). Thanks for asking ! :)

[Jeepney]

thank you so much Bob!

i think i should try your suggestion to a smaller amount of sparkling mineral water i could find here at the supermarkets. i have access to 6 nearby hehehe.

oh and btw, i coudnt find MOM too here! what i found is the Magnesium Sulfate (aka Epsom Salt). will that be ok? I saw a video in youtube of an old chap doing this.

thanks again,

-J

[Bob]

Hi -J

Epsom salts, Magnesium sulfate is a different chemical substance, and there is a different thread about that on the Forum.

If you want to try going to a pharmacy and asking of they have pure magnesium hydroxide, that may be an option, else such is available on the internet for mail order.

Page 1 on this thread talks about magnesium sulfate, and some of the differences. The sulfate version is made with sulfuric acid, which I am not partial to at all.

The magnesium hydroxide, is a form of "water'd oxide", where there is no "acid" involved.

The substance which activates the cellular mitochondria is the "BI-Carbonate" form of magnesium. The bicarbonate channel is what this thread has been focusing on. Other folks have wanted to just experiment with the use of "magnesium" and that's perfectly OK to do so, but this thread has focused on magnesium bicarbonate and how to make it. :)

Here is a thread on the forum which asks Which form of Magnesium is best to take (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?96767-Magnesium-supplement-what-form-is-best)

If you follow admin Paul's threads about the best water to make (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?96793-How-to-make-healthy-water-filters-minerals-and-energy), that would be a great reference too.

In this thread what we have looked at is how to convert Magnesium Hydroxide into Magnesium BiCarbonate (to activate the bicarbonate channel of the mitochondria (http://drsircus.com/magnesium/the-ultimate-mitochondrial-cocktail/)). <--- This link is a good read.

Amazon dot com has listings for pure magnesium hydroxide powder which might be able to be used instead of 3 tablespoons full of liquid. One could work out a conversion of dry powder to come up with the right concentration.

[Jeepney]

Hi -J

Epsom salts, Magnesium sulfate is a different chemical substance, and there is a different thread about that on the Forum.

If you want to try going to a pharmacy and asking of they have pure magnesium hydroxide, that may be an option, else such is available on the internet for mail order.

Page 1 on this thread talks about magnesium sulfate, and some of the differences. The sulfate version is made with sulfuric acid, which I am not partial to at all.

The magnesium hydroxide, is a form of "water'd oxide", where there is no "acid" involved.

The substance which activates the cellular mitochondria is the "BI-Carbonate" form of magnesium. The bicarbonate channel is what this thread has been focusing on. Other folks have wanted to just experiment with the use of "magnesium" and that's perfectly OK to do so, but this thread has focused on magnesium bicarbonate and how to make it. :)

Here is a thread on the forum which asks Which form of Magnesium is best to take (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?96767-Magnesium-supplement-what-form-is-best)

If you follow admin Paul's threads about the best water to make (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?96793-How-to-make-healthy-water-filters-minerals-and-energy), that would be a great reference too.

In this thread what we have looked at is how to convert Magnesium Hydroxide into Magnesium BiCarbonate (to activate the bicarbonate channel of the mitochondria (http://drsircus.com/magnesium/the-ultimate-mitochondrial-cocktail/)). <--- This link is a good read.

Amazon dot com has listings for pure magnesium hydroxide powder which might be able to be used instead of 3 tablespoons full of liquid. One could work out a conversion of dry powder to come up with the right concentration.

Thanks Bob for these!
a lot of reading ha ha!!!

[ThePythonicCow]

Amazon dot com has listings for pure magnesium hydroxide powder which might be able to be used instead of 3 tablespoons full of liquid. One could work out a conversion of dry powder to come up with the right concentration.
Ah - I hadn't noticed this until now - thanks - one more item to add to my Amazon shopping list.

Each tablespoon of "GoodSense(tm)" Milk of Magnesia (https://amazon.com/GoodSense-Magnesia-Saline-Laxative-Original/dp/B000V9N5UW/) (MOM) has 1200 mg of active ingredient, so 3 tablespoons would have 3600 mg of magnesium hydroxide.

Each teaspoon of "BulkSupplements(tm)" Pure Magnesium Hydroxide Powder (https://amazon.com/BulkSupplements-Magnesium-Hydroxide-Powder-grams/dp/B00GUOWENQ) has 4146 mg of magnesium hydroxide.

So to get 3600 mg of magnesium hydroxide using the powder, one would use 3600/4146 of a teaspon, which is about 7/8 of one teaspoon of the powder (a little more than 3/4 of a tsp, or a little less than an entire tsp).

[Bob]

Great improvement on the quality of the "mix"..

Instead of pouring directly the magnesium hydroxide into the 1 litre bottle of chilled seltzer.. first pour out 2 ounces of the seltzer into a cool measuring cup (hot causes out-gassing and we want to preserve the CO2 from loss). (momentarily close the cap on the seltzer bottle)

Then add in the 3 TableSpoons of magnesium hydroxide into the measuring cup and stir very well until there are no solids.. Re-open the cap on the seltzer bottle.

And now pour back into the seltzer bottle the pre-dissolved mixture. Close the cap well.

Shake for about 5 minutes, and note now that the bottle collapses very quickly as the CO2 is combined with the mixture to create the magnesium bicarbonate.

Inside of 15 minutes, the bottle is "clear" indicating the reaction is complete. This method appears to create a smaller particle sized magnesium bicarbonate as a result of seeing a much clearer bottle of liquid in a shorter amount of time. Store the bottle and liquid chilled.

report - if I don't use the magnesium bicarbonate and work my muscles HARD, there is a potential to have a shortage of the bicarbonate of magnesium and then there can be muscle spasms, or leg cramps. The solution still is to not use pain killers but to drink 1 glass of cool well filtered water with 1 to 1 1/2 ounces of the magnesium bicarbonate added and drink that within about 15 minutes.. Within an hour it appears that the majority of the 'damage' is starting to correct, and the pain highly subsides from a muscle spasm..

So biggest long term benefit for me are muscles that don't spasm out and get painful.

[fourty-two]

why not use BulkSupplements Pure Magnesium Carbonate (Micronized) Powder (250 grams)
by BulkSupplements available on Amazon?

[Perdido]

Great improvement on the quality of the "mix"..

Instead of pouring directly the magnesium hydroxide into the 1 litre bottle of chilled seltzer.. first pour out 2 ounces of the seltzer into a cool measuring cup (hot causes out-gassing and we want to preserve the CO2 from loss). (momentarily close the cap on the seltzer bottle)

Then add in the 3 TableSpoons of magnesium hydroxide into the measuring cup and stir very well until there are no solids.. Re-open the cap on the seltzer bottle.

And now pour back into the seltzer bottle the pre-dissolved mixture. Close the cap well.

Shake for about 5 minutes, and note now that the bottle collapses very quickly as the CO2 is combined with the mixture to create the magnesium bicarbonate.

Inside of 15 minutes, the bottle is "clear" indicating the reaction is complete. This method appears to create a smaller particle sized magnesium bicarbonate as a result of seeing a much clearer bottle of liquid in a shorter amount of time. Store the bottle and liquid chilled.

report - if I don't use the magnesium bicarbonate and work my muscles HARD, there is a potential to have a shortage of the bicarbonate of magnesium and then there can be muscle spasms, or leg cramps. The solution still is to not use pain killers but to drink 1 glass of cool well filtered water with 1 to 1 1/2 ounces of the magnesium bicarbonate added and drink that within about 15 minutes.. Within an hour it appears that the majority of the 'damage' is starting to correct, and the pain highly subsides from a muscle spasm..

So biggest long term benefit for me are muscles that don't spasm out and get painful.

* * *

For muscle cramps... researching I came across the following.

Besides the Magnesium Bi-Carbonate Water.... take 1/4 tsp of Taurine and 1/4 tsp of L-Arginine in a shot of water.

When I first tried it, the muscle spasms I had for several months in my lower rib cage stopped within 10 minutes.. then one day they came back.. I thought.. Now what did I do? I check my supplements and realized I had forgotten to take the L-Arginine. Again within 10 minutes the spasms stopped.

Weight lifters take L-Arginine, an amino acid. But they also take L-Citrulline, another amino acid. I never really knew why, even though I had used L-Arginine weightlifting. Finally I searched and found that L-Arginine makes Nitric Oxide... that last 30-60 minutes... but taking L-Citrulline with it.. recycles it so that it last 24-30 hours ! The ratio is 5 grams of L-Arginine to 1 Gram of L-Citrulline.

Of interest Viagra is just L-Arginine.. at a higher dosage.

[Perdido]

For endurance... besides Mag Bicarbonate Water.. I came across an Endocrinologist who mentioned that one loses Magnesium, Sodium and Potassium wen one sweats of urinates.

He had an Adrenal Cocktail, that I originally was the poster to on a popular Magnesium Facebook Forum...

4 oz of Orange Juice
1/4 tsp of Cream of Tartar (which is actually Potassium)
1/4 tsp of Ground up Sea Salt.

So to test this.. along with taking Mag Bicarbonate Water ....I happen to be clearing scrubs and trees from the fence line of a couple of foreclosures I bought. Working by myself in almost 100 degree heat for 6 weeks.. I filled a county dumpster each week... and as never tired. I am a firm believer in both these supplement now. I keep 2 bottles of the Carbonated Mag water in my refrigerator at all times.. and often drink 3/4 bottle a day when I am working in the Florida sun and heat. I share this info and supplements with labors working for me too.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

PS: I understand those with poor kidneys can not take Magnesium Bicarbonate Water.

[ThePythonicCow]

PS: I understand those with poor kidneys can not take Magnesium Bicarbonate Water.
Do you have any further details or references or sources for this? I'm not heard this claimed before, so would like to have a better idea how credible it is and if it's true, what's the reason.

[Perdido]

PS: I understand those with poor kidneys can not take Magnesium Bicarbonate Water.
Do you have any further details or references or sources for this? I'm not heard this claimed before, so would like to have a better idea how credible it is and if it's true, what's the reason.

It is best to know how to search for the answer... and references yourself... This is really the key to using the internet for research... I find 90% of what I am seeking the following way.. I take lots of notes.. but one can never have enough notes on all matters....

USE the + Sign !!!!

The best way to find this is to search the internet for it like this..
Magnesium Bicarbonate Water + Poor Kidney

Or a better specific way is this

Magnesium Bicarbonate Water + Avoid Poor Kidney

One link that turned up was this...

https://academic.oup.com/ckj/article/5/Suppl_1/i39/449350/Magnesium-in-chronic-kidney-disease-Stages-3-and-4

Quote..
Abstract
The kidney has a vital role in magnesium homeostasis and, although the renal handling of magnesium is highly adaptable, this ability deteriorates when renal function declines significantly. In moderate chronic kidney disease (CKD), increases in the fractional excretion of magnesium largely compensate for the loss of glomerular filtration rate to maintain normal serum magnesium levels. However, in more advanced CKD (as creatinine clearance falls <30 mL/min), this compensatory mechanism becomes inadequate such that overt hypermagnesaemia develops frequently in patients with creatinine clearances <10 mL/min. Dietary calcium and magnesium may affect the intestinal uptake of each other, though results are conflicting, and likewise the role of vitamin D on intestinal magnesium absorption is somewhat uncertain. In patients undergoing dialysis, the effect of various magnesium and calcium dialysate concentrations has been investigated.....

[ThePythonicCow]

te Water + Poor Kidney[/B]

Or a better specific way is this

Magnesium Bicarbonate Water + Avoid Poor Kidney

One link that turned up was this...

https://academic.oup.com/ckj/article/5/Suppl_1/i39/449350/Magnesium-in-chronic-kidney-disease-Stages-3-and-4

I would have never found this that way ... for a reason that may surprise you.

I would have looked for something specific to Magnesium Bicarbonate Water, and I would have looked for some reason why someone with (moderately or severely) poor kidneys should not take it at all, as your earlier comment suggested.

This article you reference says that someone with very poor kidneys (not just poor), must be careful with their magnesium balances, due to their kidneys limited ability to excrete magnesium through their kidneys.

The article's abstract makes no specific mention of Magnesium Bicarbonate, and draws no conclusion that magnesium, in that form or any other, should be entirely eliminated.

This demonstrates why I asked you to provide such background ... so that myself and others could chase down a source for your comment and confirm (or in this case, refine), your observation.

References are an important part of a good discussion. They help avoid propagating misunderstandings ... as we can see here. It is better one person provide such a reference, then ten readers have to go searching and guessing (perhaps incorrectly), as well as a hundred more readers not search (we all have to choose where to focus our limited time), and be misled.

[Perdido]

If you read the entire article you will see it is very specific at what levels Magnesium impacts the Kidneys. There is no scientific definition of poor and very poor. My purpose in posting the note is to make people with Kidney PROBLEMS AWARE... Those are the ones who should be motivated to research more. I am not and will not provide specific medical advise. So I would prefer vague warnings, instead of me trying to be specific about what the limits are for them. Few things are absolute in medicine or supplements. Everyone is different.. how could you expect some specific warning? Most warnings on labels are not specific.

I stand by my position as originally posted.

[Bob]

Apparently there is an accidental derailing on this thread - I will refer to the use of the + sign mentioned above in a POST. When one does NOT PUT SUCH in quotes, one then will bring up immense erroneous (data which is not specific to the point(s) discussed).. Such as "MAGNESIUM OXIDE" can be an incorrect substance, as could "MAGNESIUM SULFATE", or "MAGNESIUM SULFITE", or "MAGNESIUM CARBONATE" (quite chemically different than "magnesium BICARBONATE").

Generally there is no literature that says "MAGNESIUM BICARBONATE" causes problems in the amounts discussed in this thread. There is literature that says MAGNESIUM and they are inspecific as to the chemical compound that the magnesium is associated with.

That is the problem with making a broad sweeping statement about CHEMICALLY different substances being the 'same' in action - they are NOT the same. One specifically trained in chemistry knows this very very well.

It is like broadly saying ALL MUSIC CREATES EAR DAMAGE. If one does a search for +MUSIC and Ear damage, one can find that, and obviously mistake that MUSIC CAUSES EAR DAMAGE.. That is the problem with haphazard search engine searches. Music at 200 decibels can most definitely evoke ear damage...

This thread goes specifically into the "BICARBONATE" channel of the mitochondria and the magnesium bound to the "BICARBONATE". It also discusses damage from CALCIUM. There are numerous schools of thought that CALCIUM is more dangerous than magnesium, such as "CALCIUM OXALATE"..

So STAYING on topic, this thread is about "MAGNESIUM BICARBONATE", not "magnesium" in general.

Thanks Paul for asking the other poster to clarify. I think I clarified this a bit further too.

[Bob]

I did another study just 2 days ago in the deep desert, where air temperature was 115 and ground temperature was about 135 (sun absorption on darker patches raised the temp quite high). I brought an optical thermometer.

I deliberately did not use "magnesium bicarbonate water" for 4 days and continued to exert myself in the heat. I didn't hydrate sufficiently, which would have require much more water than I was consuming which was deliberately creating a "KIDNEY ISSUE" (insufficient water intake, plus physical exertion and what would be red blood cell breakdown).

And I accidentally induced then when "frightened" by a specific situation, tachycardia (rapid very fast heartbeat), which did not go away with just sitting down in the shade and "meditating".

THE ONLY THING that restored normal kidney balance, PLUS normal heartbeat was the "magnesium bicarbonate" liquid concentrate which I had with me, within about a minute.

So to me I am not only a "believer" of the effectiveness of "magnesium bicarbonate" to help restore needed bicarbonate channel regulation, I feel it saved my life..

[Bob]

why not use BulkSupplements Pure Magnesium Carbonate (Micronized) Powder (250 grams)
by BulkSupplements available on Amazon?

There is a CHEMICAL DIFFERENCE with "magnesium CARBONATE" - magnesium CARBONATE is chemically different and is NOT the same substance as the topic of this thread and the substance discussed "magnesium BICarbonate". Magnesium carbonate would not be the same as the "bicarbonate" form. The bicarbonate form can only be made easily as discussed in this thread, in the form of "magnesium bicarbonate water".

[Bob]

A friend of mine started on the Magnesium Bicarbonate this last week (3 days total), and was /is using 2 ounces of the concentrate described in this thread a day - his weight is about 215 pounds and he is about 60 years old.

What I noticed is he could work almost straight for 18 hours physically (!!) and hardly get tired. He commented that he felt HOTTER while working (more utilization of sugars/protein) and continually had strength until he started saying his lower back muscles were just too tired after 18 hours of (normally back breaking) lifting and stress.

I noticed he seemed "redder" in color while working out. We were digging trenches of all things at about 9000 foot altitude.. It was amazing to watch..

Also, I noticed his cognizant ability (smarts) was really improved, as well as his sense of humor and "sharpness" to be able to pick up subtle details.. He is normally a bit dyslexic but I noticed hardly any such symptoms.. He's been using the Magnesium Bicarbonate for 3 days so far.. quite amazing !! He's suffered from "blankness" periods, and dyslexia all his life.. Wouldn't it be neat if that went away too ??

[Daozen]

It wouldn't surprise me if dyslexia came from heavy metal poisoning. Keep going Bob.. the health Renaissance is here.

[Bob]

It wouldn't surprise me if dyslexia came from heavy metal poisoning. Keep going Bob.. the health Renaissance is here.

That certainly is a good conjecture, the heavy metal poisoning. He grew up primarily in Iowa on a farm, and then moved to NY city, where no doubt there was a LOT of heavy metal in the plumbing systems out there.. (see https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/28/nyregion/new-york-schools-lead-water.html) - historically many of the pipes were bound together using LEAD based soldered...


On Friday, the new results were released, and they paint a starkly different picture: This time, 8 percent of outlets had lead levels above 15 parts per billion. And the vast majority of school buildings — 83 percent — had at least one outlet with a lead level above the threshold. The city had previously said that two-thirds of its roughly 1,500 school buildings had no outlets above the 15 parts per billion threshold. Flushing cleans most soluble lead and lead particles out of the pipes and thus reduces lead levels temporarily.

Two schools in Queens were among the worst for the number of outlets involved. (NY Times article source (https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/28/nyregion/new-york-schools-lead-water.html))

see also - http://www.ourtownny.com/local-news/20170823/lead-in-water-was-common-in-city-schools/2

I have absolutely no doubt lead exposure happened. I grew up on Long Island, and had lead exposure, and it is no fun de-toxing.. My friend grew up in Iowa, and NY City.. years and years of exposure to not only the pesticides on the farm, but the lead in the water.. The change in the last 3 days has been amazing..


Lead in water was common in city schools

Department of Education testing showed that drinking water in a number of Upper East Side schools, including P.S. 6, The Lillie Devereaux Blake School, contained lead at concentrations many times greater than state-mandated action levels for the toxic metal during the last school year.

The New York City DOE completed lead testing on drinking and cooking water outlets in every public school in the city during the 2016-2017 school year. Results showed that 83 percent of school buildings had at least one water sample with lead levels above the action level of 15 parts per billion. Elevated lead levels were found in roughly 8 percent of all samples. After testing, the DOE sent letters notifying parents and staff of their individual school’s results. Results for each building were made available on schools’ individual websites, but a single, comprehensive database of results for each outlet tested in every school was not made available by the DOE until recently, following a freedom of information law request filed by Straus News.

The DOE’s remediation protocol calls for outlets with elevated lead results to be immediately removed from service and replaced. Outlets are not returned to service until follow-up testing shows that lead levels are below the 15 ppb action level.

“Many of the elevated water samples came from fixtures that are not typically used for drinking, including bathrooms, slop sinks, and laboratories,” read one DOE letter to parents and staff. Faucet-level test results, however, show that elevated samples were found in drinking fountains at many schools.

At P.S. 6, The Lillie Devereaux Blake School, an elementary school on East 81st Street that serves children in pre-kindergarten through fifth grade, one classroom drinking fountain had results of 3,268.2 ppb, more than 200 times greater than the 15 ppb action level. Nine other samples taken at the school, all from cold water faucets, also had elevated lead levels.

Three of the 20 samples with elevated lead levels found at the East 100th Street building that houses M.S. 224, the Manhattan East School for Arts & Academics, came from drinking fountains, including one outdoor bubbler with results of 470 ppb. Eighteen percent of samples taken at the building were elevated, one of the highest ratios of any school in the neighborhood.

A higher proportion of elevated results in a given building did not necessarily correlate with higher lead levels in the school’s individual water outlets. For example, only two of the 176 samples tested at P.S. 87 William Sherman on the Upper West Side turned up elevated results, but one was a cold water faucet in a first floor classroom with test results of 1,191 ppb, nearly 80 times greater than the action level.

Other Upper East Side schools that had drinking fountains with elevated results include P.S. 169 Robert F. Kennedy on East 88th Street, which had four, and the Julia Richman Education Complex on East 67th Street, which had one.

DOE Deputy Chancellor Elizabeth A. Rose wrote in an April 2017 letter to families and staff that the department’s testing “demonstrates that we do not have any systemic issues with water in our school buildings and our remediation protocol is effective.” Lead poisoning rates among New York City children have declined in recent years, and according to the DOE there has never been a known case of lead poisoning due to water in city schools.

The DOE has said that elevated lead levels found during testing are not necessarily reflective of actual lead levels students and staff are likely to encounter during the day, as testing was performed on water that had sat in pipes overnight. The DOE says that lead levels drop sharply after faucets are first used each day and stagnant water is cleared from the pipes.

Lead enters drinking water primarily through the corrosion of lead plumbing materials, which are now banned but were once widely used. For adults, exposure to lead over time can result in a number of harmful effects, including increased risk of high blood pressure and kidney disease. Young children, who absorb ingested lead at a higher rate than adults, are particularly susceptible to harmful effects of lead exposure, which can have permanent negative impacts on the development of the brain and nervous system.

The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency emphasizes that there is no safe level of lead exposure.

I recall Mom and Dad saying LET the water run for a few minutes before drinking it, and absolutely DO NOT drink water from the hot water faucet.. I'm beginning to understand why.

Absolutely great dot connecting Daozen ! Thanks !!

[Bob]

I've been adding Taurine now to my regular diet, and using the Magnesium BiCarbonate concentrate in morning lukewarm coffee.. I've started trying some GluTamine (500 mg) for overall digestive system rebuilding. All three are quite amazing.. Any irritable bowel syndrome and/or digestive issues seem to be clearing up. It may be useful to separate the timing of the 3 supplements throughout the day - not quite yet exploring that method.. We have a separate thread up on the Taurine (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?101645-Macular-Degeneration-Enlarged-Heart--HeartFailure--Gallstones-treatable-----). May start a separate thread on the Glutamine (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glutamine) - (note Glutamine is DIFFERENT than Glu-cos-amine)

[avid]

No, please keep the interactions related and not in separate threads at the moment, due to folk like me starting on the Taurine reactions. It’s important to keep it all together initially, thanks Bob. Then we will feel supported. One thing at a time.

[Bob]

No, please keep the interactions related and not in separate threads at the moment, due to folk like me starting on the Taurine reactions. It’s important to keep it all together initially, thanks Bob. Then we will feel supported. One thing at a time.

I could keep the Taurine thread the most active, although, the Glutamine is essential when rebuilding muscles, intestinal tissue, nerves.. Magnesium Bicarbonate is very essential in the energy utilization and respiration - all 3 are then part of cellular energy, cleansing, rebuilding and repairing, and proper life system maintenance.. (Glutamine is NOT GLU-Ta-Mate..) So during a critical emergency room case that could be quite toxic and systems shutting down left and right, glutamine and magnesium bicarbonate it seems to me should be essential components for stabilization, then probably getting in the taurine to help with the detoxing and repairs..

[avid]

Now it’s getting difficult for me Bob, I’ve already imparted my intake to you, but to do even more additional stuff in this transitional period is going to be difficult, and challenging. I appreciate the help, but to be ‘hauled up’ a health precipice is quite daunting, especially when one has noone to pick up the pieces if it all goes ‘pear-shaped’! I really don’t want to scare my neighbours if I mess up! Gently does it, and although I appreciate you are a stoical challenger of all things, please give advice if there should be any contra-indications. You have a great heart, and thanks for all you do.
I’m just doing one thing at a time, taurine.

[Bob]

Absolutely one thing at a time, minimal amount possible, note any changes for the better or worse, and then have the ability to back off if anything goes awry or move more forward if something goes better, until the correct level is found. That's what we did in the Magnesium Bicarbonate thread here, to find out what the best way was to make the best substance, then how to take JUST the right amount based on body necessity, or environmental conditions.

Don't stress it. The Taurine seems best for dealing with Fluoride and other toxicity. One step at a time. Gentle gentle.


Now it’s getting difficult for me Bob, I’ve already imparted my intake to you, but to do even more additional stuff in this transitional period is going to be difficult, and challenging. I appreciate the help, but to be ‘hauled up’ a health precipice is quite daunting, especially when one has noone to pick up the pieces if it all goes ‘pear-shaped’! I really don’t want to scare my neighbours if I mess up! Gently does it, and although I appreciate you are a stoical challenger of all things, please give advice if there should be any contra-indications. You have a great heart, and thanks for all you do.

I’m just doing one thing at a time, taurine.

[Ewan]

Well I've just discovered the EU banned Milk of Magnesia (https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/news/10151660/EU-rules-force-mothers-Milk-of-Magnesia-off-the-shelves.html) back in 2013. I had no idea of this until I searched Amazon.co.uk for one of my regular purchases only to discover there were zero result. I guess they were given some timescale to get rid of stock etc. and I'll go out on a limb and suggest that timescale was 5 years. But its gone now and I don't know what I can do about it.

Can anyone think of some sort of alternate way to get the magnesium into my diet that won't cost the earth too?

[Bob]

Hi Ewan - Paul in post http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?86797-Magnesium-BiCarbonate-Water-a-guide-to-make&p=1154364&viewfull=1#post1154364 had a link to Magnesium hydrozide powder. https://www.amazon.com/BulkSupplements-Magnesium-Hydroxide-Powder-grams/dp/B00GUOWENQ?th=1

Interesting. Friends in Australia reported a similar shortage.. Biggest issue so far is purity of the Magnesium Hydroxide .. must not have flavorings, or oil additives, nor calcium..

[Ewan]

Hi Ewan - Paul in post http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?86797-Magnesium-BiCarbonate-Water-a-guide-to-make&p=1154364&viewfull=1#post1154364 had a link to Magnesium hydrozide powder. https://www.amazon.com/BulkSupplements-Magnesium-Hydroxide-Powder-grams/dp/B00GUOWENQ?th=1

Interesting. Friends in Australia reported a similar shortage.. Biggest issue so far is purity of the Magnesium Hydroxide .. must not have flavorings, or oil additives, nor calcium..

Cheers Bob. A quick search of UK Amazon reveals only 2 products, one claims to be 100% pure, the other also contains maize starch. The downside is it is only available in 150g amounts at approx twice the cost of USA prices. I'll give it a go in place of the liquid but perhaps the local chemist could buy larger qauntities if I asked.

[Bob]

The dry powder could be used with the values Paul found thereby not needing to make liquid mag hydroxide.


Each teaspoon of "BulkSupplements(tm)" Pure Magnesium Hydroxide Powder has 4146 mg of magnesium hydroxide.

So to get 3600 mg of magnesium hydroxide using the powder, one would use 3600/4146 of a teaspoon, which is about 7/8 of one teaspoon of the powder (a little more than 3/4 of a tsp, or a little less than an entire tsp).

The above should work in that ratio to a 1 litre bottle of pure seltzer.

[Bob]

The dry powder could be used with the values Paul found thereby not needing to make liquid mag hydroxide.


Each teaspoon of "BulkSupplements(tm)" Pure Magnesium Hydroxide Powder has 4146 mg of magnesium hydroxide.

So to get 3600 mg of magnesium hydroxide using the powder, one would use 3600/4146 of a teaspoon, which is about 7/8 of one teaspoon of the powder (a little more than 3/4 of a tsp, or a little less than an entire tsp).

The above should work in that ratio to a 1 litre bottle of pure seltzer.

https://www.amazon.com/BulkSupplements-Magnesium-Hydroxide-Powder-grams/dp/B00GUOWENQ?th=1

Folks have been saying this brand of powder works well with the seltzer to create the Magnesium BiCarbonate - "Bulk Supplements Brand"

[Bob]

I've been using the magnesium bicarbonate concentrate now since the start of this thread and there are continual benefits

For me no charliehorse muscle cramps

Better stamina

No "calcium toxicity" adverse effects noted (see thread in health and wellness)

More overall energy

Better mental clarity

More stable heart rate


----------------------

Fresh concentrate still seems best, if there is any crystallization in the bottom of your 1litre pure seltzer bottle, either the water was not pure, or not enough CO2 gas, or too much magnesium hydroxide, or magnesium hydroxide contaminated with some additional substance such as calcium (check the label of ingredients.. No calcium in the ingredients).

[Olaf]

Magnesium is needed to transform and transport different kinds of vitamin D.
There is no proper calcium transport into the bones, when magnesium is missing.

Two interesting cases and a medical source are described in my post in the calcium thread (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?104472-Taking-Calcium-Supplements-Causes-Brain-Lesions&p=1251886&viewfull=1#post1251886).

[Bob]

I find that any Calcium that my body seems to require comes from the foods eaten, and there is no reason to supplement with Calcium in any other form with a normal healthy diet.

[Saracatt]

Hi Bob. I’ve been taking about 2oz daily of the concentrate with great results. I am still confused about how much magnesium is in a dose.
How much is in an ounce of he concentrate, and how much is in a liter made per the instructions with 3tbls MOM?

[ThePythonicCow]

Hi Bob. I’ve been taking about 2oz daily of the concentrate with great results. I am still confused about how much magnesium is in a dose.
How much is in an ounce of he concentrate, and how much is in a liter made per the instructions with 3tbls MOM?

By my calculations, 3 TBS of Milk of Magnesia (MOM) is equivalent to 7/8 tsp of Magnesium Hydroxide (a stable white powder), which is equivalent to 3627 mg of Magnesium Hydroxide, Mg(OH)2, which contains 1450 mg of elemental magnesium.

I have started making my Magnesium BiCarbonate Water using 7/8 tsp of Magnesium Hydroxide powder rather than 3 TBS of Milk of Magnesia (MOM) liquid. I obtain Magnesium Hydroxide from BulkSupplements.com. It's easier and cheaper to ship and store in this powder form, than in the MOM liquid form, and seems to work just as well for the purpose of making Magnesium BiCarbonate Water.

(Well, actually, I am using 1 tsp of Magnesium Hydroxide powder, which is slightly more than 7/8 tsp, but easier to measure, and still seems to dissolve just fine in the soda water.)

[Saracatt]

Thanks, Paul.

I may try the powder.

So then a 2oz serving of concentrate is slightly less than 100mg of Magnesium. Is that correct?

But since it is absorbed so much better, it is actually like taking more than the standard dose you get in pill form.

[ThePythonicCow]

So then a 2oz serving of concentrate is slightly less than 100mg of Magnesium. Is that correct?
Yes - that's correct.

I take magnesium in several forms ... chocolate being perhaps my favorite :).

So I don't measure the dose carefully in mg/day.

Rather I have an old wound in my right leg with a muscle that starts to twitch if I get low on magnesium. Then I slobber on some magnesium chloride (dissolved in water, rather like salt water) on my skin. This form of magnesium intake is called "transdermal magnesium", referring to the fact that the magnesium in this solution is easily absorbed through (trans) the skin (dermal). That quickly boosts my magnesium levels back up to where the muscle stops twitching. Then I say a little thanks to the Gods that it was a (small, long ago scarred) leg muscle, not a heart muscle, that was just twitching.

[kenj70]

My experimenting was thusly performed:

Although the recipe in the OP post 1 calls for immediate dilution to make a large quantity of consumable liquid, I felt that to experiment to see how I would react should be done slowly..

I measured out 1 fluid ounce of the concentrate from the refrigerated seltzer bottle which we made up previously, and again noted that there was NO FIZZ..

I poured out 12 ounces of distilled water into a cup, and then added the one ounce of magnesium biCarbonate concentrate.

No observable change was noted in the cup, it did not go cloudy, indicating a perfect mixing...

---- Taste:

I sampled a bit of this holding it in my mouth. Woahhh, sweet water, like not a normal type of water... then swallowed.

Hmmm, felt "interesting"...

Within an hour, I started to notice:
1) no pain anywhere
2) ability to have ENERGY, LOTS and LOTS of it
3) no heartburn type of reactions
4) any anxiety from stress was reducing
5) alertness - brain fog was going away
6) ENERGY, MORE ENERGY - did I say energized?
7) lowered heart rate, more steady beats, and beats that felt "stronger, fuller"
8) starting of detoxing, feeling like the liver and kidneys started to activate more fully

So weoh.. that was fantastic, and then I had some more, another sip... Maybe 4 ounces of diluted liquid so far..

This continued throughout the day, slowly consuming and watching. More clarity, more energy, better breathing, not feeling weak, but like being in a chamber breathing pure oxygen..

AND CO2 seemed to easily leave the body (this is reported, the carbonic acid or CO2 clearing is improved when the ATP, and the bicarbonate mechanism is energized)..

SO I then finished the cup about 6PM...

Of course, I wanted MORE...

h......mmmmmmmmm

WELL... so I repeated the making of another cup of diluted mixture, and had about 6 ounces at a setting...

MORE ENERGY.. and all of the above..

BUT in this case I finished the cup about 11PM and thought about bed..

(ahahhaah, no way..)

With this much energy bedtime was IMPOSSIBLE.. I wanted to go out and do a marathon.. Muscles were firing on all cylinders, and alert oh so alert, and sharp..

About 4AM I decided to try going to bed, and still felt so much energy...
I successfully made this formula and tried a quart about six weeks ago. Yesterday I made this formula again and have been simply taking one fl/oz or so of the concentrate throughout the day. I have had NONE of the reactions you have recounted here. It would be wonderful to have SOME reaction! Can you advise? -=Ken=-

[Bob]

Quite possibly Ken your magnesium intake as-is with food is AOK for what efforts you normally experience.

I found myself in the cold working outside, out-of-breath after a moderate exertion. I used 1 ounce of the magnesium bicarbonate concentrate in the morning but found for whatever reason it was not enough for the cold and work being performed outside. After resting I measured out one additional ounce of the magnesium bicarbonate concentrate, and added it to 4 ounces of filtered water. And consumed that within a few minutes. I waited for about 1/2 hour feeling stronger, went out into the cold and proceeded to work on some highly stressing activities (wood cutting, splitting, stacking, and movement to the house) all without being winded, or exhausted. I continued to feel "energized" throughout the evening.

The next day I didn't have any lactic-acid burn, no pain, no stress, no weak muscles.

So that's my observation, and my thoughts about any lack of "reactions" observed. Are you exerting yourself in the cold? Do you have any of the "symptoms" that magnesium shortage shows up as? If one can measure the work level one experiences, and how one feels (the burnout or tired, or exhaustion point), and then see if that is any different before and/or after magnesium bicarbonate, that would be useful to evaluate I think.

For me the big point is not getting "winded", and having muscles that don't get excessively tired (exhausted). I notice a type of "ever-ready-bunny-like activity" sensation after the second ounce with a high physical work load. And I don't have a toxic fog which would happen with energy usage..

tnx for testing :)

Possibly take a look at the LATER posts which was to consume the 1 ounce of concentrate in to a lesser amount of liquid, and to NOT use it continually through out the day... I am using one ounce in the morning with my coffee (not too hot, less than 120 deg F), and then one ounce when I know I am going to be stressed physically in the cold.

[kenj70]

Thanks Bob for the kind and prompt reply. This is a somewhat old topic but the only one I have been able to find which pertains to my health shortcomings and presents some intriguing benefits.

I have had a lack of energy all my life. Now, age 70, I have sporadic but not life threatening tachycardia. Doing research I found this very interesting topic. It is generally acknowledged that this is a body - electrical problem. Perhaps supplemental magnesium is the answer?

After 45 years looking for answers, using nutrition/supplementation has helped the energy problem somewhat but the heart rhythm thing has me searching again. It will take a longer term magnesium test to see if it works for that but the ENERGY improvement has me greatly intrigued. I have had to 'run my body on caffeine' just to get routine things done. I wish I could get off that treadmill. Cold, warm, inside, outside - it hasn't ever made any difference for me.

-=Ken=-

BTW, I'm not getting email notices when someone replies here.