A demon, ufo, bigfoot, all walk into a bar... [Archive] - The Project Avalon Community Forum

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Mike

4th April 2016, 07:47

...and a priest and an ultraterrestrial...

-what is the difference between a demon and a ufo?
-what is the difference between a demon and an ultraterrestrial?
-a demon and bigfoot?
-a demon and (fill in the blank)

another question: if religion is truly bunk, why are the catholics so effective at exorcisms?

and...if religion is silly tripe...

-why do demons recoil when sprayed with holy water? when touched with religious relics?
-why do demons recoil when ordered to do this or that in the name of jesus christ?

consider this: many times and in many locations (skinwalker ranch, edmonds ranch, point pleasant west virginia in the late 60's to name a few) multiple forms of paranormal manifestation occurred IN THE SAME PLACE AND AT THE SAME TIME. greys, super soldiers, men in black, cattle mutilations, poltergeist/demonic activity, orbs, lights in the sky that responded to morse code, cryptids, disembodied voices, black triangle crafts etc. the list goes on and on...all in the same place and same time..

what are the odds?

well, if these were all distinct phenomema, separate and autonomous, i'd say 1,000,000,000,000,000 to 1.

now, if they were all the same thing, or at the very least emanated from the same source, or were simply different expressions of the same source...that would make a lot more sense, wouldn't it? i think so. so do legendary paranormal researchers john keel, brad steiger, and jacques vallee..who helped popularize this theory

ive read 2 books recently: 'the demonologist', which is about the experiences of the legendary ed and lorraine warren...and 'deliver us from evil' which is about the experiences of the warren's protege, ralph sarchie, and his experiences with the demonic, exorcisms so forth.

the themes were oddly familiar: manifestation of solid objects, mind control, possession of mind/spirit, levitation, disembodied voices, deception so forth.

these are the characteristics of many paranormal manifestations, including ufo's. i saw this quote recently: "today's ufo researchers were yesterday's demonologists". i found it profound.

here's another quote by legendary paranormal researcher john keel from the book 'operation trojan horse': "the statistical data which i have extracted, and which i have tried to summarize briefly here, indicate that flying saucers are not stable machines requiring fuel, maintenance and logistical support. they are, in all probability, transmogrifications of energy, and do not exist in the same way that this book exists. they are not permanent construction of matter.."

ok,how about this: after an exorcism, ed warren describes a scenario where he is driving down a winding, icy road. conditions are treacherous, so he is moving quite slow. but a car is approaching him very fast in the opposite lane, recklessly weaving between lanes..initiating a game of "chicken". there was nowhere for him to go as the car came closer, so all he could do was close his eyes and pray. the car never hit him. in fact, it disappeared completely...

keel might have called this phantom car a "transmogrification of energy". not a permanent construction of matter. warren called it a "demon".

if a so called "demon" could create a car, or the impression of one, out of thin air, why couldn't it create a flying saucer? a black triangle craft? an alien?

what are the differences, if any, between these "transmogrifications of energy"? i do not think bigfoot is a permanent construction of matter either. add it to the list, along with pretty much every other cryptid one can summon...

evil, if we can call it that, is infinitely clever. it can wear many costumes, it seems. deception is its calling card. where it seems there are many, there may be only one.

earth is a virtual reality playground. easy to download a bunch of weird sh!t, sit back and laugh...

question is: who is doing the downloading?

charles fort once famously said: "if there is a universal mind, must it be sane?"

indeed.

now, if you recall, a priest also walked into the bar. ive never had high opinions of these men really. i mean, whats a priest, right? he's just a guy you went to high school with, some guy named gary who never got laid, couldnt make the football or soccer teams..and now he's doing this, right? right???

well, then why are they so damn good at exorcising so called "demons"? why can they and only they bless water that helps exorcise demons? if christ is a myth, and religion nonsense, why does his name and his name alone cause demons to recoil? ditto catholic relics?

so if a priest can banish some transmogfications of energy.. like demons, why not others? is a demon no different from a ufo? a cryptid? an ultraterrestrial? would bigfoot recoil if sprayed with holy water? would superman defeat the hulk? did you know 'the thing' and the hulk have fought dozens of times, with 'the thing' only winning twice? is 'the thing' a "permanent construction of matter"? is the hulk? could aquaman be exorcised under water if need be? is he himself a devil? oh boy i'm confused...so confused...so many questions...so few answers.....help, help, help..........................

BMJ

4th April 2016, 09:55

Cidersomerset

4th April 2016, 10:08

Well Mike that's a big question and you can come at it from many angles
Demons ( Archons ? ) inter dimensionals , ETS , manifestations of our
own creation ? lots of things seem to be connected I am watching a vid
now by Alan Foster from 2012 , which I just posted on my Crop circle
thread,and he touches on this from a semi religious viewpoint as he said
at the beginning he had his first UFOsighting on his way to confirmation.
The Catholic church , Vatican and Jesuits in particular know a lot about various
phenomenon , and go back to Sumaria and beyond.....

5c2su_adJmY

Published on 9 Feb 2012
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Sunny-side-up

4th April 2016, 10:10

Hi Mike

is a demon no different from a ufo?

Do you mean to say 'is a demon different from an ET' a UFO is a craft!. although some UFO's could be entities as well.

Look up the much older word for Demon, most ET's in my book could well be mind bending, shape-shifting Djinn,

Demon is a controlling word born out of western religions.

Djinn

Mike

4th April 2016, 10:15

Redstar Kachina

4th April 2016, 10:16

..........

Mike

4th April 2016, 10:20

hi Cidersomerset,

indeed, lots of overlap. good point.

we tag and label to understand. i get it.

but i wonder about redundancy....like sunny side up said: ufo's could be djinn...or a whole host of other things...thats the point i'm trying to make

-or-

they could be "archons", as you said:wink:

without labels it would be tough to even have a conversation about this stuff, but i wonder at times how constructive they are. are they gettin us closer to truth or misleading us???

i don't know the answers of course...just trying to provoke a little thought

Mike

4th April 2016, 10:26

I know researchers who have been assigned to work reverse-engineering advanced crafts, so at least some of them are real...the rest, well...good question.

thanks - i'm glad you said this.

i/m not a dogmatic pupil of keel's, i just hugely admire his outside the box approach.

testimonies of Bob lazar and others are strong. nuts n bolts theories are very valid.

ive always felt that "contactees" and "abductees" were experiencing 2 distinct phenomena...

or are they?;)

Cidersomerset

4th April 2016, 10:42

Posted by BMJ (here)
charles fort once famously said: "if there is a universal mind, must it be sane?"
Since everything comes from source / god or whatever you want to call it then
ever aspect of reality is part of source, regardless of how good or ugly it is.

And her's your ghost car, it gets interesting at 1.36 minutes:
Source: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kuBw3NrkJHI

Wow ! if its genuine ? and we can only presume it is as its from
a police dashboard cam. I know some people will say you can
fake anything, and yes you can now a days. But say its genuine.

Ion , again this is a non -physical source , which funnily enough
they were discussing on yesterdays show could be a AI , or
demon....LOL ( Ion says 'They' are the environment ( Guf )
a transitional place of the our collective non-physical , the
greater part of all of us connected to our eternal selves ) Yes
this is an on going debate which is also a weird and wonder full place....

They discuss these subjects in detail , but I cannot explain
it properly you would have to listen to the thousands of hrs
since 2009 and you will either resonate with it or not as its a
'frequency thing' in parts or something like that. The reason
for that long winded intro is that they say that there are
unlimited parallel worlds and some of us can slip in and out
of them some knowingly others not , De ja vous can come
into this.portals and gates are open and particularly active
over the past few years . They also say ghosts , vampires
and many other things are real as we are the 'creators ' and
as there is no time , every human thought will eventually
manifest into reality.

So going back to the 'ghost car' it could be residue of ghostly
spirits , or a parallel world delinquent coming thru by
accident or design , or something else ?...LOL

(I ought to caveat my answer by saying I have not parrelled travelled
to my knowledge ? But I have experienced de ja vous a few times
and have pretty vivid dreams , which are something to do with it....)

Innocent Warrior

4th April 2016, 11:53

The TV series Fact or Faked Paranormal Files investigated the ghost car case. Lots of good news and a little bad news, bad news first - they were able to reenact what happened that night and duplicate the footage. Good news - the footage was confirmed to be genuine, they have the police officer who was driving the car that night on the show. He said he inspected the fence that night and the clips running vertically were missing (missing clips was required for car to drive through the fence). Although they concluded the ghost car had been debunked, I'm not convinced because they presented no evidence that proved the clips were missing that night. They could have done that easy enough, they filmed at the scene of the fence in the footage, they could have shown a close up of the newer clips in comparison to the older clips on other sections of the fence. As the viewer, you need to take the word of the police officer to believe the clips were missing and also one of the investigators is a former FBI agent, so the question of whether it was paranormal or not still remains.

Either the investigation team isn't clever enough to present an airtight case or they chose not to, I'm going with the latter.

Here's the episode, go to the 11:40 mark on the video to skip to the ghost car segment -

wXWxu8uKByQ

Update: I watched the footage again (interview at the scene with officer) and noticed the poles were on the back side of the original fence but the fence they used to reenact the event had the poles on the front, which allowed the car to go through. The police officer, when asked if he inspected the fence that night, said the poles would have been (huh?) on the front side that night.

That voids my argument about the clips, but unless we believe, for some unexplained reason, the fence has since been reconstructed to have the poles now on the back side, because the officer says so, then it hasn't been debunked.

Conclusion: the footage is genuine and the ghost car hasn't been debunked.

BMJ

4th April 2016, 13:05

Mike

4th April 2016, 18:01

Cidersomerset

4th April 2016, 18:17

But exorcisms are a reality. Hundreds happen around the world each year. And the
Catholics seem to be the only effective means of resolving this issue.

There is definitely something to it and the Vatican has been involved using
more ancient knowledge than before the Catholic church's establishment,
going way back. I have posted many articles on the Jimmy Saville thread
about Satanism and a massive cover up to the extent of these events. Which
may include animal and human mutilations by ET's , inter dimensional
entities or demons/jinn/Archons. There is loads about that and I have
just put up a thread about those possible links...

Re: David Icke: Reptilian Advanced Technology Enslaves Humanity / Transhumanism agenda - Just Energy Radio
http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?89822-David-Icke-Reptilian-Advanced-Technology-Enslaves-Humanity-Transhumanism-agenda-Just-Energy-Radio

Another connected related current thread...

Re: The Fake 'Choice': God or Non-Existence // April 19: Temple Of Baal In New York Significant Day
http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?89784-The-Fake-Choice-God-or-Non-Existence-April-19-Temple-Of-Baal-In-New-York-Significant-Day&p=1057900#post1057900

So exorcisms are very real imo and are used against some of the entities/demons.
I do not know specifically which ones as I have not gone that deep on that
particular aspect, but the Catholic Church and other institutions are very involved in
these ancient secrets imo....

shaberon

4th April 2016, 19:09

Formal exorcisms are certainly also performed by the Orthodox, as well as Islamic clerics. As with any related kind of operation, it has less to do with the language, wording, or ritual techniques, and more with strength of will.

Human will is highly variable, which is why someone could perform a rite to the letter and fail, or even cause greater harm--and why someone else could succeed by mere touch. Jesus seemed to have called epileptics possessed, and healed them, whereas Mohammed gained his visions through epileptic fits. Of course, we now say that epilepsy is merely a nervous problem, and it's not usually by accompanied by levitation or affected by holy water.

Substances are less variable than humans, for example salt, which is required for the body's normal function and can preserve meat in an edible form for years--in the "next world" many things are backwards compared to here, and salt can injure those entities much as it melts a slug. Probably no one would have ever questioned that they also come pouring in from other planets until someone enforced the creed that this was the only place with life.

They are always a lot closer than one might imagine. What they cannot do is create, and therefor a signal they are playing on the mind is--stirring up memories. Fits of nostalgia and reliving the past, when it seems to come from nowhere, that's one of their doors. If the person is susceptible, it can grow to a replacement of the human creative consciousness and then you definitely need treatment.

While these may be regarded as primitive notions, it has never left many cultures. For example, when Libya was bombed to ruin, many Libyans cast thousands of djinn at the United States; whether this was effective, I am not sure.

In actuality, these things are not an enemy or a target for destruction; its simply their nature. Like unruly schoolchildren, they mostly just need to be put back in their place to continue their life's lesson, which has nothing to do with ours. They are mostly blind and have no self-control but still, they are as much a legitimate part of the universe as we are.

Thoughts and human remains are sort of a different class, also dangerous and more of our direct responsibility. I would certainly not want to be psychic enough to see this polluted river.

sirdipswitch

4th April 2016, 20:39

Sorry Mike, but ya can't just lump everything together into one big happy category as you seem to be trying. everthing! can be explained!!! JUST as YOU explain it! yep! However... EACH, to its' own category. Some is real... some isn't... some ARE Demons... and SOME are REAl-life-sh*t...ccc. And as for that Catholic Exorcising crap... that only works according to the BELIEFS of those actually involved... that is IF... the DEMONS wish to play... UN - IDENTIFIED Flying OBJECT - is all that means. Something we can't "Identify". AND, it could be "Anything" from anywhere. Could be a Demon, a People, as in from here, like Antarctica, Argentina, Germany, Area 51, you name it. Or ET. Name a Star system! A Galaxy!!! Anywhere! Some are MANY TRILLIONS of years... more advanced than we.

I asked my HS (HIGH SELF) about our Scientists telling us that this Universe only about 13 Billion years old an He just chuckled and said: "Yes... and they think they're right too!" He said that our problem lies in the fact that we don't have an accurate method of dating... anything!

There are MILLIONS of planets in THIS Galaxy, capable of supporting life... as there are in the untold billions of other Galaxies...

To think WE are alone... or, the most Intelligent... is Ludicrous! WE are just babies.

Go through the Alex Collier vids, and you will find where the Andromedans told him this planet we are on, Earth (Gaia)... is 25 Trillion years old.

So... what this all boils down to is the fact that YOU Mike... could very well be right on EVERY count...

or not! ccc:wizard:

jitu

4th April 2016, 21:07

One thing I hope to get some feedback on is excorcisms and the Catholics...

Its not that I've read a couple books and found religion or something. No no no...Far from it..

But exorcisms are a reality. Hundreds happen around the world each year. And the Catholics seem to be the only effective means of resolving this issue.

Why?

We've kind of mocked and ridiculed religion here a little, and I'm just as guilty as the next.guy. but you can't ignore this reality.....It's kind of the elephant in the room...the elephant in my room anyway.

What do you guys think of this?

Its not true that "the Catholics seem to be the only effective means of resolving this issue" ..
All cultures/religions have their own way of dealing with these things.. its just what our experience is with any particular faith/way.
In UK you are more likely to have seen Catholics ways only...
Success also depends upon how strong the person who is performing it.. not physically but strong mentally and in his faith..

my opinion only :bigsmile::bigsmile:

Shannon

5th April 2016, 00:59

Wow.

Okay so great questions. I've only read your op, mike but yeah, awesome post. I've often pondered the same exact stuff for hours in the darkness, moments in the sun, and years clouded in confusion. Yeah, deep chit I likey ;)

Okay so let's say, no....let's, imagine *giggle, that aliens and demons and ghosts are all the same thing. Okay so, some people have said that what banishes these entities has been envoking the name of Jesus christ or praying to the lord. So, now if we imagine an exorcist who is doing his job right, no matter if they are priest or a regular Christian or just believe in Jesus; they must be "true believers" to get the job done.

Now that's if you believe the reported cases where this has worked in alien abduction and related alien cases, or reports from hauntings where an "exorcist" is called in. And to me, anyone who is a true believer and knows what they're doing can preform an exorcism, I mean, they really have to know what's up like the warrens.

Now when I say " true believer ", I guess you can say, in Jesus christ but then I have to dive deep and say no, maybe you just have to be a true believer of something else, maybe yourself, or I don't know. My head hurts. Lol

Anyway, gonna check out the comments now. Great stuff, mike. :)

DNA

5th April 2016, 02:24

charles fort once famously said: "if there is a universal mind, must it be sane?" Since everything comes from source / god or whatever you want to call it then ever aspect of reality is part of source, regardless of how good or ugly it is.

And her's your ghost car, it gets interesting at 1.36 minutes:

kuBw3NrkJHI

what the f#ck?:)

where'd that thing go???

String theory exists, and there are alternate earth humans visiting this earth. It's not a big deal really. TPTB probably already can do this as well, and CERN is supposedly working on inventing it, but more probably trying to perfect it.

Here are five examples of interdimensional travel on a youtube video. igRbL9HpqFw

Here is an example of a dude walking into a convienant store, through a solid glass door and walking out munching on a donut, again going right through the same door. JJEqbVRxYLk

And here is a tale of time travel that sounds pretty legit. Time travel and interdimensional travel have varying overlaps. Hell I've heard that not a few time travel incidents involving folks from around the turn of the century were a result of Nikolai Tesla performing experiments in the area the person disappeared from. This incident could be one of those.

OprQIKgah54

There are several ways we could interpret this data but the last thing in the world I would entertain is a spectral or ghost like phenomenon.

But you guys know I got nothing but love for you. :)

DNA

5th April 2016, 03:03

Hi Mike

I've asked this same question, to myself but I've not brought it up for debate.

-what is the difference between a demon and a ufo?
-what is the difference between a demon and an ultraterrestrial?
-a demon and bigfoot?
-a demon and (fill in the blank)

another question: if religion is truly bunk, why are the catholics so effective at exorcisms?

and...if religion is silly tripe...

-why do demons recoil when sprayed with holy water? when touched with religious relics?
-why do demons recoil when ordered to do this or that in the name of jesus christ?

I just don't know what a demon is. I mean I know what Christians think it is, but I do not think they are correct in their definition being as they call everything they do not understand a demon. Further, I understand when it comes to the question of Jesus and his evocation working to repel unwanted encounters via they UFO abduction or demon. But,,,,,I'm just not sure I efn believe these folks. Screen memories are the norm not the exception when it comes to abduction phenomenon, as such are those being abducted calmed and satiated with a false memory of invoking the Christian god and having been non-molested only for the opposite to have really been the case?

And in the case of individuals being cleansed via an exorcisim, I suppose I just don't know if there is a large enough sample size to tempt me into biting.
Also, have you ever been to a pentacostal church? Those folks are working themselves up into manic episodes doing the whole talking in tongues thing and then someone starts talking all loud as if the Christian god is speaking through him. I lived through this stuff as a kid and a young teen. I knew beyond a shadow of a doubt then that these people were acting out for attention and to fit in with this subculture. And I think it quite possible that not a few of these demonic possessions could be similar cases.

Now, what if Jesus is a real thing. What if Jesus exists and is understood across alternate dimensions and timelines? What if Jesus manifests galactically and on different planets? I've read an account of a contactee who was told this very thing about a group of folks from the planet Reticulum, and they stated just this that the man we call Jesus is born on other planets besides earth. Edgar Cayce obviously believed in a Jesus Christ and stated there was a reincarnational slant removed from the Biblical writings. The Urantia Book states Jesus was a real figure. So yes, there could absolutely be something to this.

But here is my opinion.
Everyone is fond of stating earth is this prison planet.
But what are our chains?
I'll tell you what I think our chains are. I think time is our chain.
I'm not of the opinion that earth is a prison planet, but I will state, that it appears that the earth and all of its inhabitants are under the influence of a "being" or race of "beings" that have us at a technological disadvantage. I think that the moon is their base of operations, and I'm afraid we are the target of a time altering technology that places us or seperates us from those other folks who live outside of our planet.

As such any and all interactions with these folks are in fact putting us at an extreme disadvantage. Further more, people want to know why we are not "contacted" on a massive scale, but in my example we would be looked at as pets collared and chained to a porch and barking reactively in accordance with pavlonian conditioning.

Any interaction with folks not on our chain would be quite the shock to our nervous system and may in fact be hard for us to register in our memory.

Folks free of this constraint would seem prescient to us, and damn near omnipotent.

I'll leave it at that for now.

Have a good one Mike

mgray

5th April 2016, 03:09

One thing I hope to get some feedback on is excorcisms and the Catholics...

Its not that I've read a couple books and found religion or something. No no no...Far from it..

But exorcisms are a reality. Hundreds happen around the world each year. And the Catholics seem to be the only effective means of resolving this issue.

Why?

We've kind of mocked and ridiculed religion here a little, and I'm just as guilty as the next.guy. but you can't ignore this reality.....It's kind of the elephant in the room...the elephant in my room anyway.

What do you guys think of this?

As a Catholic with no exorcism experience, I believe it has to do with the faith of the person receiving the rite.

It works because the person believes and has a strong desire for it to work.

Carmody

5th April 2016, 03:21

I know researchers who have been assigned to work reverse-engineering advanced crafts, so at least some of them are real...the rest, well...good question.

And I know an exorcist.

These kind of folks "'don't exist", and, for example... the local catholic diocese and bishop have no idea, even, until the need for the exorcist and exorcism...occurs. Then they find out. Much to their surprise.

The whole thing is not quite biblical, but we do tend to put our own overlay on it.

It's a consensus reality. What you consciously/unconsciously project and reflect.... is..what is.

Will, intelligence, ability to create/visualize/fantasize, and so on. You are real, it is real, the reflection is real, until all of it is not.

It comes down to the meta-experiments done to 'prove' or 'disprove' psychic abilities.

In the best imagined and most thoroughly thought out experiments with unassailable logic and parameters..with all three groups agreeing that there is no way a false result can come from the experiment(s)..and all three groups do the same experiments, over and over.....

If the experimenters don't believe, they get a negative result. (no evidence for psychic abilities, zero)

If they believe, they get a positive result. (perfect or near perfect results--psychic abilities are unassailably real)

If they are ambiguous, then they get an ambiguous result. (not sure, could be either way)

All are correct and perfectly right in what they are doing and achieving. 100% perfect results for all three.

The key is that the reality is the variable.

As Max Planck, the father of quantum sciences had surmised, it is all consciousness. All of it. The whole enchilada.

As the Buddhists say: I am god, you are god, this... (waves around at 'all').... is god.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Hopefully, the light-bulb will go on in your particular knot of complex consciousness of self, and you will understand why you are manipulated in your Enforced ignorance.

For, this ignorance in the self......is the only lever of manipulation ------that truly exists.

When I talk about the commitization of humanity (the maintenance of ignorance, the maintenance of being a commodity)... this... all the above --- is what I'm talking about.

When you look at this which I've outlined, it is the only scenario which functions in and of all of the myriad possible ways that you can possibly imagine. All of them are real, as real as you can will them to be.

Pick a scenario. Anything. Anything at all. Everything you've ever heard, the wildest stories out there, the most mundane theories, and so on. All of science, philosophical thought, religions, dimensions, quantum sciences, any of it -----it all functions. Via will, and directed will, in groups and in individuals. There is no one truth, but that of everything. The perfect paradox..until that light-bulb turns on. Paradox turns out..... to be the most mundane truth.

DNA

5th April 2016, 10:47

I was going through an old thread when I ran into this.

gave up religion many years ago. I believe that satan and the demons are the fallen angels and their Nephlim decendants, Book of Enoch, Solomans writtings etc. Aliens/demons they could be the same thing or completely different species. The old writings say that the Nephlim's spirit did not die when their physical body died. And they are the "demons" that torment us today. The writing of Soloman speaks of these same Nephlim, he lists their names, and discriptions, how they torment, and which Angel to call for protection. I do not recommend everyone go read the Soloman stuff, But, for those of you who feel compelled to read it, it can be found at Sacred-Texts.com Just FYI this is a fabulous resource. You can find sacred texts from all belief systems, translated into english, Its a huge amazing library. OK so I am a nerd.

I couldn't quote it properly because this was quoted from a different forum, but, strangely enough this individual is now a member of this forum and goes under the name Misskat

Also in so far as interesting correlations are concerned there is this thread on Avalon. Reptilian Entity Attaches itself to boy who viewed Egyptian Mummy (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?79009-Reptilian-Entity-Attaches-Itself-to-Boy-who-Viewed-an-Egyptian-Mummy-at-a-Museum)
In the thread there is this post here.

In Carlos Castaneda's "EAGLE'S GIFT", he talks about the pyramids of ancient Mexico, and he states it is absolutely a bad idea to go there.
He states that the folks who created those ancient monuments were masters of capturing awareness.
From what I understood, he stated that these ancient masters of awareness were extremely ruthless and that they were capable of amazing feats.

Castaneda stated these folks were not past using whatever means necessary to increase their life span into the form of a ghoul or ghost and that if certain baits or traps for awareness were tripped, they would awaken to try and capture the essense of whom ever had sprung their awareness or life force trap.

Castaneda hinted these folks had their origins in Atlantis and of course I'm thinking Egypt did as well.
So, I would think it wise to avoid these ancient artifacts all together.

I'm of the opinion that almost all phantasmagorical entities that we find parasitic in nature are in fact discarnate beings not going into the tunnel of light and wishing to circumvent the natural order of God, which is reincarnation.

Some individual ego's do not want to forfeit life as they knew it. This results in entities of varying power.

Ghosts absolutely "do" exist. But, there are limitations placed upon them so their disruption of life as we know it is kept to a minimum.

But these are discarnate mortals of "our" world and society, and we are not much of a threat as far as knowledge in this area is concerned. I will report from personal experience that there appears to be a "dark dead" mafia, not a hell, but a place ruled by old beings who force newbie (ghosts) into being corded by higher level beings and then they are to participate in the cording of physical living beings and stealing their "chi" "Qi". These are "shadow" beings, a ghost doesn't turn into a shadow being over night, it takes a while.

I have an experience where I had an interaction with the lowest level type of shadow being. My interactions with a Shadow Being (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?28318-My-Interactions-With-A-Shadow-Being.) But my experience would not be able to properly explain and or describe those much more powerful shadow beings. It is my guess that the sons of Belial of Atlantis (of which the modern "cult of care" practiced in the Bohemian Grove is a byproduct of, and these Illuminati types consider themselves related to these sons of Belial from Atlantis) took their dark ways of human sacrifice and moved into Egypt and the New World. I think it quite possible that those ancient beings could in fact still live as Shadow Beings and because of arcane arts and the perfected methods for stealing human energy still live as described by Castaneda and the story of the boy being possessed by an entity living in an Egyptian mummy.

zen deik

5th April 2016, 16:35

Mike, author Scott Peck,"People of the lie",and followed by"Glimpse of the devil" should be two books to read if you are interested in possession. He wrote a lot of books regarding spirituality and psychology you may also find interesting.

DNA

5th April 2016, 18:56

Hi Mike

I think the crazy thing is that the Djinn/Demon possession may actually offer beneficial attributes to the host.

When I say a Djinn/Demon can offer positive things to the individual being possessed, I suppose there is a needed explanation.

We are constantly being fed upon by things we do not see in terms of parastic non-organic parasites.

It's very likely that Castaneda's Don Juan character allowed such a possession to take place in himself in order to rid himself of lower parasites. The Non-Organic beings as Castaneda's Don Juan referred to would be this Djinn/Demon like character.

Although it is never stated in the books, I have often thought that this in fact could be the case.

Smaller parasites would include
1. Ghosts
2. Shadow Beings feeding on Sexual Energy
3. Lower fourth dimensional astral animal type parasites that feed on bad habit energy.

It has been my experience that the DJINN/Demon entity has the rare ability to rid a human of some of these other entities, thus cleaning things up for itself.
The Djinn in turn does not feed on YOUR energy, it instead feeds on the energy of those in your proximity, turning the possessed into a psychic vampire.
Really a vampire period.
And for some reason being rid of the lower parasites makes you more attractive and capable in the eyes of others.
Increasing your ability and role as this psychic vampire.

I have an experience where such an entity made an offer to myself.
I hate creating long posts. The length of which causes folks not to read them, but for the sake of sharing here it is.

DNA's Encounter with a Vampire
This is an experience where I feel a astral entity,,,stronger and more permanent and pervasive than a ghost attempted to form a symbiotic/parasitic bond with me.
.
I began a correspondence with Jonathan Zap (e-mail) at the end of 2003. At the time I was heavily into this idea of there being a non-organic, non-physical energy oriented life form, or forms. Zap did a show with Jonathan Grey on this subject on coast to coast in 06.
Zap is a very cerebral guy, and he was very influential in helping me explore/understand and categorize this phenomenon. Zap has some excellent first hand experience with energy parasites including an encounter with a parasite possessed human, making that human a vampire, found here Mind Parasites,Energy Parasites and Vampires. (http://www.zaporacle.com/mind-parasites-energy-parasites-and-vampires)

So, I started working at this call center/phone modem tech, temp company in march of 07. I was in a training class, and as training classes go, you make friends hang out at lunch, that kind of thing.

I made an acquaintance, and,in so far as the story goes, I believe Darren, was home to a parasite of greater strength, tenacity and permanence than I'm used to encountering.

He (Darren) was quite the character, he was like a guy from the wrong time period, he wore long black riding boots, had long lustrous hair, he wore non-collared long sleeve white cotton button shirts that gave him a bit of a pirate look. He was muscular about 6'2 and looked like he could take care of himself in a fight.
As a guy you can't help but to gauge these kinds of things.

Darren lacked the ability to engage, and I know that sounds weird, but, in a conversation, I tend to value those who can engage, and though we had lots in common, and we talked quite a bit, he never really engaged with me, or if you will, in a Celestine Prophecy esque meaning, he never opened up energetically.

Zap states in his personal encounters with people like this, that folks tend to tell you if they are a vampire, you just have to listen and believe them when they let you know. Now on this note, i could tell you that Darren went on and on about playing this vampire RPG game called Kindrid the Gathering, and that is a little clue. Darren would become amazingly animated (much more so than normal) when telling the tales of his RPG game,,and it was almost as if,,he felt like he was allowed to express that he really, identified with vampires.

On our last day of class,,,we were all coming back from our last break of the day, and getting ready to take the last test of the training class, the instructor was late coming back and I was talking to Darren.

He asked about a turtle I was wearing on a rope around my neck.
I told him it was my animal totem, joking I thought. He became serious, and well,, for the first time, rather engaging. He asked if I believe in animal totems. I told him that thousands of years of shamanic practice lend some backing in my opinion.

He then went into this rant, now, when people want to tell a story, I have no problem with giving them my energy via attention, and I even have this cool ability to zero in on a place in the aura where the memories being shared are stored and focus in on that area, imbuing it with more energy and thus, giving the story more energy to be told. Giving the story teller more energy to and ability to tell the story.

Darren told me about how he believed he had an animal totem, a cat or panther like totem. He said he felt it saved him. He said without it, he knew he would have went the way of his two brothers and two sisters, who were drug addled and homeless or in prison.

Darren and his siblings were the victims of horrible physical and sexual abuse from their father.
Darren acknowledged this as the reason for his siblings having their problems, and stated his not repeating their mistakes, was the help he began receiving one day from this animal totem.

He said he felt a force or living being asking to live in him (he was very adament about it), and he said "yes" to the entity asking to live in him, then feeling an indwelling force that he cited had changed him and continues to, to this day. This indwelling force,,made him feel stronger,,more focused, he said he no longer felt the same craving for substances (drugs,alcohol) like his brothers and sisters did.
By now we were in the class, given notes for the test and given time to study.

Darren had worked there before, and he didn't need to study.
And he wouldn't stop talking about this subject.
I say wouldn't cause I needed to study.
He went on and on, saying this cat like totem lived on in him, and that he never wanted drugs again or needed to drink again.
He said his addictive vices were gone.
Now I could see part of the problem, was that he was getting kind of high on the energy I had given him, and I tried to pull back now, but he seemed to not want to let me.

Later that same night, I had this dream.
I received a call from Jonathan Zap and I answered it on an outside pay phone, telling me that someone was coming. There was a traveling circus, complete with caged animals, the whole nine yards. One of the accompanying performers was going to be paying me a visit.

I took it that it was his friend(Jonathan Zap's friend), and I told him any friend of his was welcome to stay at my place.
He then told me I should be carefull of who I allow to stay in my place and that I should really think it over.
I took this as him being to shy to ask for his friend and told him non-sense, his friend could stay with me.
He again protested, and I told him I had to go.

I was then in my apartment, answering a knock on the door, and it was a young thirty year old man with a dufflebag, he was a sturdy thin gentleman, wearing warm baggy clothes with short black curly hair, he looked greek or roman, but very contemporary.

I invited him in, and told him to make himself at home.
I told him I had some errands I had to run and I left the apartment.
When I came back in, I saw the man with children tied to chairs, torturing them with a drill. He was removing their teeth.
I was in horror. I was in shock. I mean for a dream, I was really feeling the impact of this horror. It was as if this was all really happening, and the children were as alive and important as any child I would see while waking.
As I stood, not knowing what to do, the man nodded to me, as if he would be done in a second, and for me to just wait a minute and watch.

I screamed obscenities at him, not making much sense, and demanded him to leave.
He stopped what he was doing, and told me he was doing this for me.
I failed to articulate a response and motioned for him to leave and then said to leave.
He stopped what he was doing and seemed to understand, he then looked me in the eye and said that I would be better off if I allowed him to continue. He had this knowing look in his eyes he looked very genuine. His eyes had a knowing in them and empathy, it was wierd.

I then knew what he meant.
The apartment represented me, the children represented lesser parasites attached to me.
He couldn't kill them, but he could torture them until they decided to leave on thier own.
He was a non-dead entity parasite maybe a Djinn if you will, basically he would rid the host of all other energy parasites but, I knew not what HIS DEMANDS or tax would be.
He genuinly seemed to believe his presence would benefit me.
He told me to think about it.
.
.
I was crying at this point and told him to leave. And he did.
Next thing, I was on the outside pay phone with Jonathan Zap and he was chastising me for letting this guy in my apartment when he had warned me against doing so. And though I was going to blame him for the whole thing, I realized then that he(Jonathan Zap) had tried to warn me.

I woke up with the sense that there was a presense in the room. A powerfull one. Had the animal totem/energy parasite of Darren followed me home and attempted to make a new home,,,,a new home of myself? Had the parasite/animal totem contacted another entitiy and pointed me out? Are my corrolations in error,,,possible,,,but it all felt very real.

In retrospect I do believe almost all of us have lesser energy parasites, urging us to do things that will step down our spirit energy into a lesser vibration more easy for them to consume.

The lesser parasites are obvious to me, greed, indulgence, stealing, beligerance, aloofness, superiority, I could get into this but these are not my questions, these are obvious.

It seems the Djinn parasite is able to feed off of the energy of others through helping a host appear Alpha like. Atleast in this example

Now here is where I think it relates with what you are talking about Mike

It is my opinion that when folks ask Jesus to come into their heart and basically occupy their being, I think they are engaging in an actual possession of sorts.

I think either Jesus or an entity assuming that guise is entering into people and because the apartment is occupied, no other goulish guests may stay.

I'm of the opinion that fully committing to the Christian paradigm means you are possessed by something, it has positives for sure, but at this point and time I do not know the extent of committing to something like this.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2755/4430738876_b2f859298e.jpg

shaberon

5th April 2016, 20:34

Going to touch on the "what they are" somewhat today.

Must largely /agree DNA about a club of dead guys, some of whom hang around much longer than they should, feeding and "recruiting" others that come their way.

Those are not demons.

Ancient peoples spoke in a largely poetic form; language was increasingly beaten up and simplified to the point where what we have today, is great for "nuts and bolts", but very inadequate for the vast landscape of reality.

However, even our physical sciences have now discovered the manifestations of what was widespread knowledge in the "old ignorant gibberish". Such as 96% of the cosmos is invisible--dark energy (Mother). The core of the galaxy is a supermassive black hole (Night Sun, Central Spiritual Sun). Energy/matter comes out of "nothing"--Big Bang, Quantum Fluctuations--the "Fall".

The Fall, of Angels or Men is simply the process of manifestation, perfectly normal, natural, and necessary.

"Angel", it refers to messenger, but this is not like a message of text or speech. It is "how" consciousness perceives other energy fields. An example of a "high" angel would be say, Hawksbill Mountain. It is there for millions of years and is "how" the mountain is perceived as we see it--for in reality, all those tons of matter are almost entirely "empty" space and it is not filled with any "tiny, solid pellets" but is a bunch of electro-magnetic vibrations. Thus the Angel "informs" us that it is a huge slab of quartz covered in vegetation and considered a sacred pilgrimage site, and not only that, his personal, individual form is not all that hard to see.

A "smaller" angel would be something like an "elf" that paints a flower in my yard blue; it only lasts a few days and I am the only one who sees it. In this way, the Hawksbill angel "hosts" millions of those smaller ones in its environment--the "little folk".

The demons are simply blind elements that "are" the matter itself. Gnomes, sylphs, salamanders, undines. Dao, djinn, afrit, marid. Compared to an angel, it has "fallen" into a lower state. The quartz is "made by" a gnome and it "is" a lot of gnomes and they are supposed to ceaselessly stay on task. If they get idle hands and set free, then those can assume terrible forms and work wonders. Technically, you could summon and command them, but this is extremely dangerous, and not often the most useful thing you could be doing even if successful.

Neither one is anything other than the mind. As the body is made of molecules, so, too, on the invisible side, the mind is made of "something"--Them. Just as an unattended dead body will rot, so, too, an unattended dead mind rots, leaving a ghost. The "true individual" stays in his mind for a relatively short time after death, and then drops it as a husk, or shell, and the fate of this shell depends on several factors. It is a corpse, and this is why the wise attempt to de-energize them so the components may be released and re-used. Unfortunately, this is rare and they hover around seeking to re-enact their memories.

The saddest, sorriest ones are the suicides, followed by those who meet a violent end at an early age. These remain full of activity; a person who felt their life was complete and ready to let go, will leave something that fades away quickly and peacefully. The worst sorts of entities are former humans, and the worst kind of sorcery is that which prolongs their activity.

Naturally, there is commerce between world-systems, between our Earth and the rest of the solar system and on out. The gateways are somewhat restricted, much as it takes a certain amount of force to escape physical gravity. Our Earth world is full of impostors; and, as difficult as it is for us to understand and deal with the ordinary world of our senses, it must be incredibly more difficult for us to understand a world of living light, where shapes and voices beckon, all susceptible to the merest twinge of unconscious thought. This is why I would hold any "vision" or "revelation" at the extremity of disbelief. In most cases, you'd be looking at your neighbor's repressed emotions, or some long dead guy in a sparkly white sheet claiming to be St. Athanasius, all--fleeting phtantasms.

Mike

5th April 2016, 20:38

DNA

5th April 2016, 21:28

Hey DNA, as usual, your ideas are wholly original and thought-provoking. Youve given me alot to think about here. And I will! Next week or so I'll be in an internet-less environment...lots of time for contemplation...

Im often tempted to view demonic possession as a semi fictional drama at times...not because I dont think people are being affected by diabolical entities, because I do, but because of the way these entities behave when confronted by so called holy people and holy relics. These entities are generally regarded as master deceivers with infinite cleverness...and yet, when pressed, they simply wilt. I know many put up quite a fight, but why, for example, can't they keep lying when persistently asked their name and origin? Why do they always break? I mean, I hate my uncles' tapioca pudding....he doesnt know that, he thinks I like it...but i'll lie about.that till the day I die man, whether confronted with the name of jesus or david hasselhoff Lol. No sacred relic would cause me to break down, shrug, and confess I hated the sh!t all along, ya know? I mean, how powerful can you be if you can't keep a ruse going for a few hours??

Perhaps im overthinking it, but its occured to me that perhaps this is a form of psy op to get folks to believe in catholicism...

Yeah, im overthinking it...;)

Your not overthinking. These are the kind of threads I live for. Honestly if Avalon gave us one gold star a year to give to a thread this would be it.
I'm amazed to see threads where upon the OP pasted a youtube video and the prewritten synopsis for the youtube video and the thread gets 100 likes.
I value people who analyze data and make connections on their own and then share those connections with the rest of us.
And I'm amazed more Avalon folks don't seem to value that. It's as if they need a source to be validated and stamped with a seal of approval before they will give something a chance.

Have a good one on your holiday.
Take care

Carmody

6th April 2016, 00:08

BTW, the exorcist I know is not a catholic. No, not at all.

Mike

6th April 2016, 00:25

BTW, the exorcist I know is not a catholic. No, not at all.

Thats interesting. Ever witnessed his process? If not, do you know anything about it? Can you elaborate a little?

Chester

11th April 2016, 12:54

Here ya go Mike - its not only a "Catholic" thing.

YTEshwPppFM

and here are some "real Djinn" (I spell the word this way... some don't)

5Bp8R9OhAOs

here's an Evangelical removing "Shiva" from a possessed Hindu

21aELwC_rQo

Here's another -

_aVX4MiWNb4

Now just imagine that what is possessing the one appeared possessed by a demon is simply "the bad cop" of a larger paradigm we might call, the "Archontic paradigm" and that what might be possessing the one "filled with the Holy Ghost" and doing the exorcism might just be "influenced" by "the good cop" of the same Archontic paradigm?

It's a consensus reality. What you consciously/unconsciously project and reflect.... is..what is.

That consideration has led me to consider the wisdom I stop feeding that entire paradigm so as not to make it stronger when I do feed it (as I have).

Mike

21st June 2019, 05:28

:bump:.........................................................

Hym

21st June 2019, 08:27

I was Rumbling thru the Casbah tonight, smelling the spices, seeing the faint glint of jeweled silk, out beating the day's heat and I stubbed my toe on this here golden thread of yours Mike. Love it.

As sometimes happens late at night I listen to some of the amazing singers on the worldwideweb of entrainment.

Tonight, after I put my 12 string to bed, I was listenin' to the first few years of The Voice UK Best Auditions (2012-2015), the singing competition. While listening, I happened upon one of the videos above, the 2nd in Post #30.

No sound except the contestant was singing "Something's Got Ahold On Me". The song starts at the 46:00 mark here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pka-LakCOPo

The video read "Real jinn caught on camera". No matter that I saw not one single jinny, just some deeply repressed m.f.'ers. (please to sound out the whole abbreviation for full affect).Let's not take that alternate reality into this discussion.

Enter train mints, traveled, tasty for sure. Inner tame mitts. Be kind to yourself when you take on the task of believing, beyond the creator you are in this immense inner voyage.

Someone's getting pulled on the tracks in all of those possessions. No wetsuits. No protection given. Ya' see, each reel legion creates it's own demons. They all have their own kits, and believe me they charge rental for each one used. I worked for the recording angels once as a temp accountant.

Without the show it's only half lame. However, with the nasties in attendance, like the semen-possessed, bigfoot ufo captain stepping out on R&R, chewing on one of Arnold's discarded stogies (he, too, can't stand the way he smells)......full and complete crippled consciousness is attained.

Jesus, Mohammed and the Buddha Dude walked into a diner. Guess who was stuck with the bill? I don't know. By this time they are all cartoon characters arguing who's going to get a date with Jessica Rabbit.

Denise/Dizi

21st June 2019, 14:53

I know, I know, off topic, but I can't help myself.. Mike have you ever considered being a comedian? I know this is a serious thread but it was presented in such a humorous way.. Thanks for that, I needed the laugh.

In regards to the thread? I don't know, I don't know, and honestly I don't know, and I think this is what leads to most of the confusion in the subject matter. Those that claim to know the answers? Are all seemingly saying the same things, yet calling it something else.. Heck, I can discuss my own experiences in several different arenas as things do line up with many different topics.. Which suggests they're all somehow related.. And those not lumping it all together aren't getting anywhere either, because they don't claim to know everything, so people don't listen, thinking they don't know what they're talking about. HAHAHA..

I suppose until someone pulls back the curtain and shows us how it all works, we will be questioning such things forever. But i prefer to do that with a smile on my face, so thank you for the thread.

Patient

21st June 2019, 19:01

Yes, this topic always grows into others and we always have more questions.

Through my experiences, I have wondered this...perhaps the energy used by a travelling ET opens a portal for them to travel through. Now there is a portal opened for a short time, or maybe enough energy from it for other entities to travel through. Perhaps this is why there is paranormal activity in the same area as a UFO sighting.

I had recurring experiences of both in the same area over a period of time. Seems i still have some residual lower strength entities hanging around but nothing as strong as when I was experiencing frequent UFO sightings.

Tried to put as much info together in a short post - but i am always here to elaborate on anything in particular if anyone has any questions about it.

Intranuclear

21st June 2019, 23:21

Hey Mike, have you read this article? https://hopes.stanford.edu/exorcism-and-mental-illness-across-different-cultures/

Huntington’s Disease (HD) is a rare inherited disorder that breaks down nerve cells in the brain over time, affecting the patient’s behavior and movement. In its early stages, HD symptoms can vary among patients. Mood swings are a common early symptom and HD patients may become depressed, irritable, apathetic, or angry. In some cultures, psychological disorders that also have a motor component, such as Huntington’s Disease (HD), Tourette syndrome and schizophrenia, can result in the individual being labeled as possessed. The notion of possession, in which a person becomes demonized, possessed, or controlled by a demon, was present in many ancient religions and is still present in many beliefs today. To drive out the demons or evil spirits, family members or religious figures turn to exorcism. An exorcist is typically someone of religious faith who is thought to be able to channel benevolent powers and cast out evil spirits from otherwise good people. The concept and practice of exorcism crosses cultural and historical boundaries.

In Catholicism, priests undertake prayers for repentance, divine intervention and protection before engaging in ceremony. The patients then undergo counseling to enhance their spiritual life after the ritual. Buddhist exorcism involves prayer and meditation to persuade the spirit to leave the body. Taoists mainly use chanting, praying, and physical movements to drive away the evil spirits. Among Muslims, the belief of demon possession is not universal. Mr Nazirudin Mohd Nasir, head of the Office of the Mufti at the Islamic Religious Council of Singapore, said, “We believe there are unseen creations of God such as the ‘jinn’ or spirits.” However, he added that although, “One could possibly be possessed by the unseen, but one should not simply blame everything on this. In fact, some people do not believe in possession, although they believe that the unseen exist.” For Muslims who do believe, however, he said that there were those in the community who specialized in the exorcism ritual.

As a case study for practiced exorcism, this paper will examine North Thailand Hill tribe Shamans. There are Lahu, Lisu, Karen, Hmong and Lawa hill tribes. Among these hill tribes of Thailand that migrated from southern China, Laos and Burma, Lisu hill tribal villagers believe in exorcism and possession. According to their belief, there are two beings that can take possession of a person, including the ‘phi pheu’ or tigers as well as ‘phu seu’ or vampires. The hill tribe believes that ‘tai’ or black magic that is implanted in the body of the afflicted person by another person causes many of the illnesses they experience. This object must then be sucked out by the shaman in order for the person to be cured.

While the process of exorcism varies across many cultures, the act of restraining the patient is common; and these restraints can sometimes lead to injuries. The illusion that exorcism works on people with a disease experiencing supposed symptoms of possession can be attributed to the placebo effect. However, there are 370,000 reported cases of people killed during exorcism and another 310,000 reported injuries. These numbers are an underestimate as there are still unreported fatal cases in many rural areas of developing countries where mental illness is stigmatized. Scientifically, demonic possession is not a valid psychiatric or medical diagnosis recognized by either the DSM-V or ICD-10. Patients with symptoms associated with physical or mental illness can be mistaken for victims of demon possession. For example, a shaman beat a mother of two from Thailand with a dried stingray tail because the family had suggested it as a way to rid of her mental illness (later revealed to be a form of motor disorder). Despite her efforts to flee, the shaman abducted her and continued until she died. Even though the shaman was later on charged with murder, this case study shows that the process of exorcism can be fatal and victims can been bound, beaten, burned, starved, and even tortured.

In conclusion, it is difficult to come by documentation of any outcomes of official exorcisms, harmful or beneficial. Exorcisms are supposed to be low-key. Although they are not necessarily a secret, exorcisms are not performed in public or in front of press representatives. However there have been reported cases that victims of exorcisms, whom the officials believe to have mental illnesses, had past away from the rigorous ritual. Therefore, it is imperative to raise awareness about treatments for mental disorder in areas where exorcism is prevalent and mental illness is a social stigma.

Denise/Dizi

21st June 2019, 23:38

DeDukshyn

22nd June 2019, 00:43

A bit disappointed by a lack of a joke ... misleading title. ;)

Constance

22nd June 2019, 09:10

A bit disappointed by a lack of a joke ... misleading title. ;)

Maybe I can make it up to you. This is the only joke I can ever remember so I hope it's okay and Mike doesn't mind :p

Q. What is a specimen?

A. An Italian Astronaut

Mike

22nd June 2019, 21:36

good responses here. thanks guys (Hym, your response was lovely ..and poetic even, but i'm not sure if i understood it tbh!:bigsmile:)

i worked in a hospital once, and the eyes of some of the more heavily medicated patients suggested hate and menace. was it the medication itself, or did the medication make them susceptible to outside influence? Just gonna let that dangle there...

i might spend a very pleasant 4 hours talking to a really calm and kind patient, only to return after dinner to an utter monster. i was in charge of watching this priest once. Real sweetheart at first. His buddies came to visit one day(some also priests) and they cursed like sailors and told hilarious stories. i broke for dinner, thoroughly amused and even anxious to get back; he was a fun guy. but when i returned, his whole demeanor had changed. the guy he was before was gone, almost instantly replaced by this sinister looking, seething, angry man who accused me of being Satan himself before attacking me. sure, he was ill. but there was something in the eyes there, something undeniably malevolent. i don't know how to explain it except to say that it wasn't him.

i was a caretaker for my uncle for 7 years. he has parkinsons and MS, and is wheelchair bound due to back surgery. One problem begets another in these situations, and the medication intake keeps increasing as a result. at the end of my tenure there, he had that same look of menace and hate that the patients in the hospital had. i'd look at his eyes, and it was not him. so, even if it was just the medication possessing him, he was possessed. but i suspect something more sinister.

i note and accept quite a bit of that article Intranuclear posted. but there are some events that take place in these ed and lorraine warren exorcisms that can't be explained away by anything else other than the paranormal....like levitation, for example. there were all kinds of strange things that would happen during and even after these exorcisms, like the phantom car i described in my original post.

and yes, since i created this thread a couple yrs ago, i have learned of the techniques used by other traditions to attempt to remedy these situations. good to know.

as times changed, and we went from vampires and wolfmen and fairies into the technological era, our phantoms changed as well. demons and such were getting replaced by flying saucers, and alien abductions. why? were the phantoms changing costumes or was it our perceptions that were changing? or had we all invented the whole bloody thing like some sprawling, phantasmagorical tulpa landscape?

the point i was trying to make, was that our 3d paranormal representations all tend to behave in the same ways, whether we call them demons or ghosts are aliens or whatever. john keel would often muse that what we see were merely side effects of one prime source. he'd say that bigfoot and mothman and reptilians and skinwalkers and greys etc, were all tentacles of the same thing. at the end of his career, he wasn't even interested in the manifestations anymore, he was only interested in the source

in the skinwalker ranch story for example, there are reports of cigarette smoking dogs. there are giant thought-to-be extinct wolves who are impervious to shotgun blasts. there are creatures that left raptor prints in the snow. there are disembodied voices mocking the family who stayed there. does that sound like the actions and behavior of an intelligent space-faring species looking to make contact with earth humans??? some of it is downright silly. there is a very obvious trickster element to all of it. superficially anyway, it would seem more demonic in nature.

and yet, there were also the infamous flying saucers in the area, and triangle shaped craft. and "men in black". in other words, it seemed as though something was being contrived here....like a wacky paranormal stage show was being put on for reasons unknown. keel would call it mythmaking in action.

it's important we use labels and things to make distinctions, and yet i wonder if our language in these instances is helping or hurting us. perhaps many of these manifestations are really the same thing, expressing itself in many different guises in order to stay undetected.

Gemma13

23rd June 2019, 01:46

William Friedkin, the Director of “The Exorcist” film decided to check out the real stuff and made a documentary about a Roman Catholic Priest who is renowned for exorcisms – Gabriele Amorth.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Devil_and_Father_Amorth

One of my big take-aways from watching this was when Friedkin asked a Priest, with a ranking high enough to be authorized to perform exorcisms, why he chooses not to.

He said because they scare the hell out of him. He talks about a special quality exorcists, like Father Amorth, need to have. An unshakeable faith that gives them No Fear.

This priest makes an appearance in this trailer @1:02.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpjRQokeQNo

Interestingly exorcists are more common than I once thought. I had been working with a school Pastor for some time on projects when in general conversation one day she told me she was an exorcist. Our conversation was very interesting after that lol.

She doesn’t advertise it but reveals it appropriately when she gets the call to. And just so happened that a family I knew were having traumatic experiences with one of their children that modern medicine, counselling, etc couldn’t help with. This poor 5yr old child would literally have episodes that appeared to be of demonic possession.

His father would have trouble holding him in an embrace because of strength that came out of nowhere as his body kicked, thrashed, hissed, bit and spat. When released the child would often hide under the table with terror all over his face. Needless to say I recommended the Pastor pay a visit and she is working with the family.

As to aliens, demonic entities, etc – I think at this point that they are different “species”. My guess on demonic entities, at this point, is they are born of A.I. The energetic/power/force in the “No Fear” state is what has the potential to disable/repel them within the circuit board.

I personally don’t think that transitional and/or trapped souls are demonic entities either. Different species again.

Hym

23rd June 2019, 06:00

Carmody's brilliant post, #21 above, states my view more accurately, without all of the poetry and loveliness. It is exactly what I was thinking. I have watched religions and negative social narratives incite, inject and create all of the possessive behaviors talked about in this thread. I have never seen a possession or take over without the negative training, the thing I call entrainment, being the learned and mimicked behavior of the victim. Never.

"Jesus, Mohammed and the Buddha Dude walked into a diner. Guess who was stuck with the bill? I don't know. By this time they are all cartoon characters arguing who's going to get a date with Jessica Rabbit." You started with the premise of a common joke and I ended with the same, only connected to highlighting the phenomenal nature of humans to accept their cultural entrainments. This is what I see as the essence of Carmody's insights.

I just riffed on how I consider all of those representatives as another story. Produce it, follow it, accepting it's negative consequences and you will have the power to manifest it. I have noticed that parents and all who have seen some truth others should know do not express that honesty and insight to their children. That's neglect and a missed opportunity for the parent to reaffirm their children's right to be free from the illusion, the negative experience. Empowering others is vital, no matter their age.

This also is my view from an understanding based on the history of those religions, even as I know from my experience that they are not a true representation of the lives of those three guys, so I make a joke about this seriously sick condition. This is my creative, if not poetic agreement with DeDukshyn that the title was misunderstood, not necessarily misleading.

The mere fact that anyone would connect those three phenomenons shows me how invasive the training is, connecting very unrelated things and not viewing them objectively, as EM crafts and Bigfeet are not a matter of possession or deep psychological illnesses, nor are they seeded by a negative cultural narrative. Very different subjects. Very different experiences from the psychology of mental impairment, psychosis and dementia. I can see that the common thread is that they are viewed and talked about. In some very deep level, the level of each viewers perception of their reality, they are connected, but to me the premise is disjointed.

My little lullaby about stumbling across this thread is exactly how it happened. The synchronicity of simultaneously going thru song competitions, as I enjoy quality vocals so much, and then going through the 2nd video, with the sound off, about some exorcist, in Indonesia most likely, is a common thread in my life. Things match.

I invite the magic I choose into my life, just as I do not invite the boring creation of the negative spirit world. I must say that people enjoy distractions and the thin layer of the surface world. They swim in the illusion of their own creation, saying it's not of their invention, while obviously removing the sense, the reality of awareness that then leaves them open to negative influence. I see those lost in those circumstances as constantly forgetting the power to manifest that they all have, being trained so very well to believe in only the negative, abusive and spirit-denying creations of others.

Love is often lost and treated as something we're not worthy of, keeping the worlds of enjoyment on some primitive level, taught to grasp only that as relief, forgetting that the entire world is a place enveloping us all, and by it's created nature, highly tuned to respond to those who travel inside. However, once inside of our own motivations and endless layers of habits, hidden in the subsurface, closely beyond the outer layers of peripheral consciousness, insights often reveal that both positive and negative realities are choices. Hey, if someone chooses to dance with the devil at least they should know that they are the devil.

I see it for what it is, as do my close friends. My speech seems to be a little different than a few here, yet all of my friends talk this way. One thing I've noticed is that those of them who do imbibe, speak the same sober as when under some influence. It's just that their incursions into suspending a need to be healthy, getting drunk or loaded, doesn't mean that they let go of their consciousness.

We value our honesty and insights. We all recognized that we didn't have to go thru the many hells of the human condition we have experienced. For some of us the veil doesn't exist and we choose to joke about it all. It is a choice of consciousness. It's because most of us grew up early on seeing the worst that humans do to each other. A few I knew chose to leave soon after those early traumas.

At some point I chose not to be the arbitrator in handing out justice, as I would not be able to stay here. So I get to use words, presence and to listen, listen and listen some more. In listening there is a great healing. It should be shared, and shared openly, that it is impossible to not interfere, especially when listening. In this context there is no such thing as neutrality.

Just as physicists have proven that the "mere" viewing of an action or a condition changes the reality of that condition, this viewing also has a choice in that seemingly innocuous and "mere" viewing to affect a positive outcome. TPTB know that this knowledge is their biggest secret about the power of consciousness and they do all that they can, in their deep impermanence, to prevent every single soul from experiencing it.

Mike

23rd June 2019, 06:36

thanks for elaborating Hym!

you said, EM crafts and bigfeet are not a matter of possession or deep psychological illnesses... well what about alien abduction?:wink:

one of the quotes i shared earlier was, yesterdays demons are todays ufo's (paraphrase)

these paranormal manifestations seem to have evolved with the times. i'm suggesting they may all be the same thing, or at least emanate from the same source.

if you take Skinwalker Ranch for example, or Point Pleasant in the 60's: the phenomena displayed at these locations ranged from bigfoot creatures, raptor-like creatures, poltergeist activity, traditional ufo's, cattle mutilations, trickster displays such as taking all the groceries that had just been put away and putting them back in the bags, disturbing dreams, shadow figures, the "mothman", men in black, disembodied voices saying very nonsensical things, and so on and so forth. it could just as easily have been called a "haunting".

having read of the adventures of ed and lorraine warren in the book 'the demonologist', i couldn't help but see the parallels between so called demonic activity and so called ufo activity.

in the mothman prophecies book, for example, many of the people who were involved with "indrid cold" and other alleged ET's, were often hypnotized by lights, or the arrangement of words in a book, or by a telepathic message. they would often be given orders to carry out activities that they couldn't remember, or would only remember much later. possession.

george knapp relates a story of a creature possessing the minds of the NIDS scientists on the ranch during the Bigelow years. possession.

i'm speculating that ufo's and demonic forces may actually be one and the same thing. i'm not beholden to the theory, however..just putting it out there

Hym

23rd June 2019, 07:31

I get it. It took me a couple of walks around the block and some fresh air to see the connections.

Frequency. I've seen what people call aliens, knowing how humans allow and often, to my dismay, choose to desensitize their hearing, mimicking the frequency of brain waves in a room to influence and create an experience in abductees, sometimes moving them and other times creating a false memory. Is that memory, once it is experienced, not registered by the power of the consciousness as real?

Knowing the power of consciousness and at times it's disconnect from the soul, the only thing I can relate is that few have the experience beyond their conscious mind and it's limitations, even though this experience comes with every body's life tools.

The ranch (funny enough called skinwalkers and alluding to it's apparent ability to remove the skin, the surface of consciousness) challenges survival with the tools of fear. Sounds like the company to me and, by the company, I mean 100% privately contracted, connected controllers of government agencies.

The same entities, lest inaccurately call them humans, are the same ones who conducted all of the crimes experimenting on people in the name of control, rationalizing (an oxymoron in this context) and measuring the effects of influencing consciousness thru fear.

The only good thing is adding more than a dose of sick humor by letting the dogs have a smoke. Measure the energy, match the frequency then vibrate it to the desired outcome. It doesn't take a lot of inquiry to suggest what instruments they have developed to induce the manifestations and amplifying their connection to the natural world.

Mike

23rd June 2019, 19:13

hi Hym, sounds like the "company" to me too, at least to some extent (skinwalker ranch i'm speaking of here)

this is also interesting: point pleasant west virginia, during the whole mothman saga (which was really a paranormal smorgasbord, just like skinwalker ranch, with the mothman only playing kind of a minor role..for those who have seen the movie and not read the book), john keel, the excellent researcher who put all that on the map, makes a very short reference in his book to a military project on the ohio river, right up the road from where all the activity was taking place. he expresses anger over it, but he never elaborates on it...much to my dismay. i'd love to know exactly what he's referring to there