Julian Assange's old website, IQ.org (pre-Wikileaks) [Archive]

astrid

11th December 2010, 08:59

Great sleuthing there cosmic !!

(from the above site.)

http://web.archive.org/web/20071020051936/http://iq.org/#Witnessing (http://web.archive.org/web/20071020051936/http://iq.org/#Witnessing)

Wed 03 Jan 2007 : Witnessing

Every time we witness an injustice and do not act, we train our character to be passive in its presence and thereby eventually lose all ability to defend ourselves and those we love. In a modern economy it is impossible to seal oneself off from injustice.

If we have brains or courage, then we are blessed and called on not to frit these qualities away, standing agape at the ideas of others, winning pissing contests, improving the efficiencies of the neocorporate state, or immersing ourselves in obscuranta, but rather to prove the vigor of our talents against the strongest opponents of love we can find.

If we can only live once, then let it be a daring adventure that draws on all our powers. Let it be with similar types whos hearts and heads we may be proud of. Let our grandchildren delight to find the start of our stories in their ears but the endings all around in their wandering eyes.

The whole universe or the structure that perceives it is a worthy opponent, but try as I may I can not escape the sound of suffering. Perhaps as an old man I will take great comfort in pottering around in a lab and gently talking to students in the summer evening and will accept suffering with insouciance. But not now; men in their prime, if they have convictions are tasked to act on them
Julian Assange

astrid

11th December 2010, 10:16

Heres also a book he co wrote in 1997 called "Underground"

(Copyright (c) 1997, 2001 Suelette Dreyfus & Julian Assange.)

http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/4686

From the above publication... ( JA went by the handle MENDAX)

MENDAX

In 1992 Mendax and Trax teamed up with a wealthy Italian real-estate investor, purchased La Trobe University's mainframe computer (ironically, a machine they had been accused of hacking) and started a computer security company. The company eventually dissolved when the investor disappeared following actions by his creditors.

After a public confrontation in 1993 with Victorian Premier Jeff Kennett, Mendax and two others formed a civil rights organisation to fight corruption and lack of accountability in a Victorian government department. As part of this ongoing effort, Mendax acted as a conduit for leaked documents and became involved in a number of court cases against the department during 1993-94. Eventually, he gave evidence in camera to a state parliamentary committee examining the issues, and his organisation later facilitated the appearance of more than 40 witnesses at an investigation by the Auditor-General.

Mendax volunteers his time and computer expertise for several other non-profit community organisations. He believes strongly in the importance of the non-profit sector, and spends much of his free time as an activist on different community projects. Mendax has provided information or assistance to law-enforcement bodies, but not against hackers. He said, `I couldn't ethically justify that. But as for others, such as people who prey on children or corporate spies, I am not concerned about using my skills there.'

Still passionate about coding, Mendax donates his time to various international programming efforts and releases some of his programs for free on the Internet. His philosophy is that most of the lasting social advances in the history of man have been a direct result of new technology.

NorTel and a number of other organisations he was accused of hacking use his cryptography software—a fact he finds rather ironic.

Now if i had to take a stab at personality profiling him, i would say he is a strong candidate for Aspersgers. ( Remember Gary Mackinon ?? he is also ASP, and there are lots of similarities here).
If im on the right track here, there is NO way he would be working for the wrong side, hes far too morally and ethically driven.

just my 2 cents....

Bill Ryan

11th December 2010, 10:51

----------

This is really wonderful. Many thanks!

Two gems (of many on this page)

Wed 12 Jul 2006 : The cream of Australian Physics (http://web.archive.org/web/20071020051936/http://iq.org/#ThecreamofAustralianPhysics)

There are no unarguable axioms of value or worth, there are only
inclinations and my inclinations have turned to an intense loathing
of institutions, and most of the people in them; those spineless
supplicants agape at the passing of other men's ideas, not drawn by
desire, but driven by fear and ignorance, to the tepid hearth of
institutionalism. One may argue as to the qualities of a passing man's
wife, but as a life philosophy it can only appeal to self-loathing
celibates. How much better the subjective stance which curls the mind
around the lovely creature in one's embrace!

This perception etched into me when I attended an Australian
Institute of Physics conference at ANU (http://www.anu.edu.au) with 900 career physicists,
the body of which were snivelling fearful conformists of woefully,
woefully inferior character. For every Feynman or Lorentz, 100 pen
pushing wretches scratching each others eyes out in academic
committees or building better bombs for the DSTO (Defence Science &
Technology Organisation), who had provided everyone with a bag,
embossed with their logo, which most physicists pathetically lugged
about with pride and ignorance.

A year before, also at ANU, I represented my university at the
Australian National Physics Competition. At the prize ceremony, the
head of ANU physics, motioned to us and said, 'You are the cream of
Australian physics'. I looked around, and thought, 'Christ Almighty,
I hope he's wrong'.
Thu 08 Jun 2006 : The history of warfare (http://web.archive.org/web/20071020051936/http://iq.org/#Thehistoryofwarfare)

The history of warfare is similarly subdivided, although here the phases
are Retribution, Anticipation, and Diplomacy. Thus:

Retribution: I'm going to kill you because you killed my brother.
Anticipation: I'm going to kill you because I killed your brother.
Diplomacy: I'm going to kill my brother and then kill you on the pretext that your brother did it.

********

Anyone who thinks that Assange is an intel asset, maybe better think again. Webster Tarpley and other critics have clearly not done their research.

astrid

11th December 2010, 10:59

Yes for sure Bill... im with you, there is NO WAY

Erin

11th December 2010, 11:12

Anyone who thinks that Assange is an intel asset, maybe better think again. Webster Tarpley and other critics have clearly not done their research.

At this point I think this cannot be emphasized enough.

If you look at the guy from his past (20s to now), the "intel asset" profile just doesn't fit. He's the real deal.

astrid

11th December 2010, 12:43

http://www.theage.com.au/technology/technology-news/international-man-of-mystery-20100409-ryvf.html

In 1997 an astonishing book was published in Melbourne. It sold a respectable 10,000 hard copies but, when it was made available free on the internet it was downloaded 400,000 times within two years.

Underground told the riveting inside story of the city's computer hackers and Assange was prominently billed in it as a researcher for the book's author, Dr Suelette Dreyfus, now an academic researcher. It opened with a detailed account of the NASA attack.

Dreyfus wrote glowingly of Assange's efforts: ''Julian had worked thousands of hours doing painstaking research; discovering and cultivating sources, digging with great resourcefulness into obscure data bases and legal papers - not to mention providing valuable editorial advice.''

The book did not name the Melbourne hackers but used their online identities and told their story. The records of Assange's court case and his biographical details on WikiLeaks match the story of Mendax - one of the hacker's online identities in Underground.

Mendax is described as a super intelligent child who never knew his father and was dragged from state to state by his mother who pursued a series of turbulent relationships.

In 1988, Mendax was 16 years old and living in Emerald in central Queensland - the age Assange was at that time. Dreyfus wrote: ''For a clever 16-year-old boy the place was dead boring. Mendax lived there with his mother; Emerald was merely a stopping point, one of dozens, as his mother shuttled her child around the continent trying to escape from a psychopathic former de facto.''

Dreyfus continued: ''Sometimes Mendax went to school. Often he didn't. The school system didn't hold much interest for him. It didn't feed his mind … The computer system was a far more interesting place to muck around in.''

She also wrote that Mendax had a deep voice for his age. Assange has a distinctively deep voice. Mendax fathered a son in his teens. Assange has said he has a son at university. Mendax suffered a breakdown after he was arrested by the police, and after a period in hospital he lived rough in the Dandenong Ranges outside Melbourne. When he finally appeared in court on the hacking charges, Assange was living in the Dandenongs.

Was this the story of Assange's life? Was he Mendax? Dreyfus will not say, citing the promise she made to the young hackers who had helped her with her book, that she would not disclose their identities. She is protective of and still obviously close to Assange.

She told the Herald this week: ''He is not politically motivated. He is more concerned with truth and the quest for it. He is certainly not party political. I think he sees that there are good people on both sides of politics and definitely bad people. He is a very brave person. He is absolutely convinced that it is worth taking high personal risks in exchange for getting truth out to the community.''

Among WikiLeaks' volunteers, those who are close to Assange are similarly protective and reluctant to speak on the record. They described on background this week a man whose traits would not be unexpected if they evolved from Mendax's turbulent and nomadic formative years. Assange, they say, is noticeably self reliant, self contained, resourceful and apt to keep a distance from others.

After his conviction, he stayed in Melbourne and built up his computer skills as programmer and as a developer of freeware.

He read widely on science and maths - he is largely self taught in most of his endeavours. He did enrol for a period at Melbourne University but did not complete his studies in mathematics.

Less convincingly answered by those who know him is whether Assange's quest to reveal secrets is the destiny of man moved by social conscience, or the natural progression of a highly intelligent child raised on the run, who found solace alone on a computer and anonymous camaraderie in cyber space.

For his epigraph in the online edition of Underground, Assange used an Oscar Wilde quote: ''Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.''

Is Mendax the real Julian Assange?

(Julian himself has admitted to the "Mendax" handle in interviews -see the "inside wikileaks-uk" post)

fifi

11th December 2010, 12:44

Thank you all for your researches. This really confirms my feeling that he is a genuine whistleblower. If he does not talk about 9/11 and Israel (as others point out to say that he is a "zionist" agent), probably because he knows that these are "taboo" subjects, and he and his family would suffer worst consequences for it. Who knows, my guess is maybe these are in the encryptic files, that if he dies or something happens to his family, these will come out. Now that we know he is a real deal, I am really concerned about him, being so vulnerable now in jail.

astrid

11th December 2010, 12:50

Same here fifi, im concerned also for his welfare, he is in my thoughts and prayers.....

yohnor

11th December 2010, 13:33

Thank-you cosmiciagoon

sjkted

11th December 2010, 18:54

One thing I can't get past about him is why does he believe the official US version of 9/11?

--sjkted

Ahkenaten

11th December 2010, 19:07

CosmicLagoon your name should be Cosmic Truth Soldier. Kudos to you for your investigation that sheds more light on the character of Julian Assange. Sjkted I know people say JA believes the official version of 9/11 - but do you have any quotes as to exactly what he has said? There are other respectable journalists (I am thinking of Justin Raimundo at Antiwar.com) have avoided stepping directly publicly into the 9/11 conspiracy theories but who knows what they say privately among friends and colleagues?

sjkted

11th December 2010, 19:29

I think I saw a clip of him a while ago at a public conference saying that 9/11 truthers annoy him and that there are real conspiracies.

--sjkted

Ahkenaten

11th December 2010, 19:42

It's clear that he pissed alot of people off with that

MorningSong

11th December 2010, 20:07

I found his co-written book in pdf "Underground" here:

http://www.xs4all.nl/~suelette/underground/Underground.pdf

Ross

11th December 2010, 20:58

A little more in the life of JA...

Controversial whistleblower Julian Assange was "a very bright boy with a keen sense of right and wrong" when he was growing up, according to his stepfather.
The young Assange grew up constantly on the move, the son of parents who were in the theater business in Australia.

Brett Assange, who now lives alone in Sydney, was Julian's first real dad, raising him from the age of one and giving him his surname.
In an exclusive interview with CNN affiliate Seven News, he described his stepson as a "sharp kid who always fought for the underdog."

He added: "Strangely enough I always thought he would do something like this. He was always very independent. And he certainly wouldn't take no for an answer.

"He always stood up for the underdog. I remember that, like with his school friends. He was always very angry about people ganging up on other people. He had a really good sense of equality and equity."

Assange has been described by his mother, Christine, as "highly intelligent."

He was just 16 when she bought him a Commodore 64 computer. It was 1987, and there were no Web sites. Assange attached a modem to his computer and began his journey through the growing world of computer networks.

"It's like chess," he told New Yorker magazine. "Chess is very austere in that you don't have many rules, there is no randomness and the problem is very hard."

Though his mother raised him without any religious influence, she sensed that from a tender age, her son was led by a strong desire to do what he perceived as just.

"He was a lovely boy, very sensitive, good with animals, quiet and has a wicked sense of humor," she told the Melbourne, Australia, Herald Sun newspaper Wednesday.

Bill Ryan

11th December 2010, 21:33

I think I saw a clip of him a while ago at a public conference saying that...

Not very useful information! :)

(This doesn't qualify as research data: impossible for anyone to check, only feeds rumors, and might not be true or accurate.)

sjkted

11th December 2010, 21:40

What's wierd is I can't seem to find the clip after a bunch of searching... I know I did see it.

--sjkted

Fredkc

11th December 2010, 21:58

Wed 03 Jan 2007 : The Australian lagoon
Australia is a lagoon in a sea of english which, having no translation tarrif, washes over us, sweeps our new thoughts away and blends into those that remain, until we no longer know whose thoughts we are.

Industries can dump pig iron to crush foreign production and they can also dump words. Billions of these ideas, already produced for another english market and having no translation tarrifs or transport costs slither into the country unheeded, stricken local journalists and set their burrows in our brains.

We're part of the big english world; this is our reality -- so when we fight, we must fight like kings. When we write about the sea we must write to the sea.

str8thinker

11th December 2010, 23:21

I have great sympathy for anyone such as JA brave enough not only to blow a whistle, but to publish as much as he has.

The above posts reveal him to be quite bright. However, Mendax is Latin for "liar"; Tarpley pointed that out too. Lying is well known to be associated with sociopathic or psychopathic personalities (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_personality_disorder). Here's another summary of the psychopathic personality (http://www.oregoncounseling.org/Handouts/PsychopathicPersonality.htm), into which he seems to fit rather well IMO.

If he'd simply remained another whistleblower with his own radical website, he wouldn't have attracted the attention he has. So IMO who he is and what his background is is less important than what he has actually managed to release to the world. Here is where the matter is largely out of his hands. It depends on what is fed to him, and this in turn is affected by any one of a number of ways these sources can be manipulated.

A good place to begin reading about these influences is Cass Sunstein and Adrian Vermeule's 2008 paper at Harvard Law School entitled Conspiracy Theories: Causes and Cures (http://www.archive.org/details/CassSunstein). The original paper may be downloaded here (http://www.archive.org/download/CassSunstein/cass_sunstein_infiltration.pdf) or here (http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=1084585).

Abstract:
Many millions of people hold conspiracy theories; they believe that powerful people have worked together in order to withhold the truth about some important practice or some terrible event. A recent example is the belief, widespread in some parts of the world, that the attacks of 9/11 were carried out not by Al Qaeda, but by Israel or the United States. Those who subscribe to conspiracy theories may create serious risks, including risks of violence, and the existence of such theories raises significant challenges for policy and law. The first challenge is to understand the mechanisms by which conspiracy theories prosper; the second challenge is to understand how such theories might be undermined. Such theories typically spread as a result of identifiable cognitive blunders, operating in conjunction with informational and reputational influences. A distinctive feature of conspiracy theories is their self-sealing quality. Conspiracy theorists are not likely to be persuaded by an attempt to dispel their theories; they may even characterize that very attempt as further proof of the conspiracy. Because those who hold conspiracy theories typically suffer from a crippled epistemology, in accordance with which it is rational to hold such theories, the best response consists in cognitive infiltration of extremist groups. Various policy dilemmas, such as the question whether it is better for government to rebut conspiracy theories or to ignore them, are explored in this light.

Keywords: conspiracy theories, social networks, informational cascades, group polarization

I chose to underline cognitive infiltration as this implies using cognitive dissonance, as discussed in the PA thread Silent Weapons for Quiet Wars. Tarpley misquoted this as cognitive disruption in his interview with Alex Jones, though the outcome is the same.

See also here (http://the-classic-liberal.com/cass-sunstein-conspiracy-theory-introduction/) for an introduction to his "theory".

Fortunately, Sunstein and Vermeule haven't got it all their way.

David Ray Griffin may not be a household name, but he is one of the best-known and most respected figures in the 9/11 Truth Movement, as well as a respected theologian and professor emeritus. Griffin’s previous books on 9/11, including The New Pearl Harbor, The 9/11 Commission Report: Omissions and Distortions, and Debunking 9/11 Debunking have made him the pre-eminent scholar of the 9/11 Truth Movement.

Griffin’s latest book, Cognitive Infiltration: An Obama Appointee’s Plan to Undermine the 9/11 Conspiracy Theory is a response to and rebuttal of legal scholar and Obama appointee Cass Sunstein’s paper, “Conspiracy Theories: Causes and Cures,” which discusses how to break up so-called “9/11 conspiracy theory groups” from within through covert infiltration. Griffin is a master at breaking down complicated evidence for the layman; and here he thoroughly deconstructs and exposes the fraudulent nature of Sunstein’s call for what is essentially an illegal operation. Written with a slightly humorous approach, this factually accurate new book is an engaging read on a difficult subject.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SBProgCoalition/message/6085
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=21253

It could be argued that JA's initial contributors did so voluntarily, but as the trickle became a flood, it becomes obvious that bigger players were not slow to take advantage of the faith placed in him and Wikileaks by the vast multitude not in the know.

Thanks zook for your posts on this aspect of Wikileaks.

str8thinker

12th December 2010, 01:13

I'm also surprised that in this excellent thread no one has yet raised the matter of his association with The Family, a cult run by Anne-Hamilton Byrne. This was alluded to by Webster Tarpley in the interview mentioned in my earlier post above.

Reportedly, Julian, together with his mother Claire and his half-brother, spent his childhood fleeing the father of Julian's half-brother.

That father was a member of a cult, called The Family, run by a Anne-Hamilton Byrne.

Anne-Hamilton Byrne ran her 'child-kidnapping cult' on the outskirts of Melbourne.

"Byrne dyed the stolen children’s hair blonde and fed them LSD." (Julian Assange of WikiLeaks: “Destroyer of Worlds (http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CBsQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.uncoverage.net%2F2010%2F07%2Fjulian-assange-of-wikileaks-destroyer-of-worlds%2F&ei=gr_FTM_WGMjKjAfp0axX&usg=AFQjCNEXeDCvJaq-vZhwr_OTa0v37klKyA&sig2=fsbVzHtnqhW-0QhUDo69qQ))

"The Santiniketan Park Association (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santiniketan_Park_Association) of Anne Hamilton-Byrne conditioned children with drugs, sensory deprivation, sleep deprivation, torture and ritual sexual abuse in order to produce subjects who bent to the will of the group’s leader." (Wiki of the Damned (http://spitfirelist.com/for-the-record/ftr-724-wiki-of-the-damned/))

"Assange claims that Australian intelligence has advised him, and there is an apparent link between Australian intelligence and the cult." (Wiki of the Damned (http://spitfirelist.com/for-the-record/ftr-724-wiki-of-the-damned/))

Australian intelligence works closely with the CIA and Mossad.

http://nona-people.blogspot.com/2010/10/julian-assange.html

Byrne was the leader of a cult, The Family, discovered in the Dandenong Ranges in the early 1980s. There were 14 children in the cult, who were treated abominably, and taught that they were all Byrne's children. All of them had their hair dyed blonde (the police finally caught up with the cult in 1987).

Assange won't discuss the link with Byrne. He says only: ''My mother was never in a cult. I was never in a cult.''

My question about his own white hair goes nowhere. However, Assange told me when we first talked (we have several conversations), that his hair went white at 15.

''I was very blond until 12-ish, until puberty. I built a cathode ray tube at 15, at school, and connected it backwards. The Geiger counter went 1000, 2000, 3000, 40,000. That was about the time. Also I had some head scans, because I had something like viral encephalitis. It was very mild. I just lost feeling in one cheek. Earlier on, at nine, I'd had head X-rays because I'd headbutted a giant earth ball.''

http://www.theage.com.au/national/keeper-of-secrets-20100521-w230.html

So what makes Julian tick? As a psychologist my interest lies in history, as this is frequently re-enacted in our lives. Julian's parents were in travelling theatre and he attended 37 schools. After his parents separated his mother's new partner was involved in the infamous cult of Anne Hamilton-Byrne, from which the family eventually fled and went into hiding for some years.

I encountered Hamilton-Byrne and her brood of stolen children (later revealed to be drugged, starved and abused) at the Melbourne Siddah Yoga Ashram in the 1980s. Her illegally adopted children were eerily obedient and surreal, swathed in white with silvered blond hair that was not unlike the silver hair of the now notorious Assange.

These children were imprisoned in thinly veiled secrecy, lies and corruption. The cult was allowed to thrive for many years until it was finally exposed in 1987 and Hamilton-Byrne and her partner charged with conspiracy to defraud. A police raid released the children still being held there.

From this thumbnail sketch Julian's life emerges as involving dislocation, disrupted attachments, fragmented relationships and possible abuse linked to the cult and his stepfather. He seems to have been in hiding and on the move for much of his life. With his mother, he experienced, then fled from, a cult of abuse, lies and secrecy.

When asked recently about his core values he responded he stated that he was inspired by his father. 'Capable generous men do not create victims they nurture victims. I'm combative, not so big on the nurture but you can nurture in other ways. By policing perpetrators of crime.'

http://www.eurekastreet.com.au/article.aspx?aeid=24468

ponda

12th December 2010, 01:36

So str8thinker what do you think all of the above if true implies in regards to the released information ?

Redtailhawk

12th December 2010, 01:45

So, Julian went to Harvard? j u l i e n @ post.harvard.edu....A known CIA operations base....why the mis-spelling? Is he Julien or Julian?

str8thinker

12th December 2010, 01:51

So str8thinker what do you think all of the above if true implies in regards to the released information ?

If you are asking how do I think what we know about him influences the information he has released, I would say he relishes playing his cards very close to his chest, not letting the right hand know what his left is doing. This duplicity is part of his basic nature. Since he is at the head of his organization I guess he made the final decisions on which material should be released and the timing of the release, but he cannot release anything he hasn't got, so it depends on the influence, goodwill and generosity of his contacts. That's where the weakness lies.

In view of the latest, relatively low-key nature of the information, I would be surprised if his "backup cache" contains many real surprises, and how many of these may have been carefully doctored by his informants.

ponda

12th December 2010, 02:20

If you are asking how do I think what we know about him influences the information he has released, I would say he relishes playing his cards very close to his chest, not letting the right hand know what his left is doing. This duplicity is part of his basic nature. Since he is at the head of his organization I guess he made the final decisions on which material should be released and the timing of the release, but he cannot release anything he hasn't got, so it depends on the influence, goodwill and generosity of his contacts. That's where the weakness lies.

In view of the latest, relatively low-key nature of the information, I would be surprised if his "backup cache" contains many real surprises, and how many of these may have been carefully doctored by his informants.

You are aware that he gave ALL of the latest cables untouched to multiple media outlets to discern independently of wiki.So he has no influence what so ever over how these outlets interpret the information and when they release it ?

Yes the backup cache certainly must have a few people worried.

I think it's a bold statement to suggest that this backup cache has no real surprises and has carefully doctored and planted information in it without any proof what so ever.

What is your opinion of Openleaks ?

str8thinker

12th December 2010, 07:46

Thanks for the heads-up, ponda.

No, I wasn't aware that Assange gave all his stuff away to be distributed how and when the media see fit.

I think it's a bold statement to suggest that this backup cache has no real surprises and has carefully doctored and planted information in it without any proof what so ever.

Agreed, that's just my opinion after seeing the contents of the last massive release. Some minor surprises that will upset local politicians. I would love to see something major in it, for example some truth about 9/11, UFO disclosure, HAARP or even Solar Warden. But I won't be holding my breath.

Thanks, I wasn't aware of Openleaks till you mentioned it. The modus operandi of these groups is slowly changing since Julian started the ball rolling.

According to the Swedish newspaper Dagens Nyheter, the new site will be called "OpenLeaks," and like its predecessor, will allow whistleblowers to leak information to the public anonymously. However, the new site will differ in that it won't be responsible for hosting the information itself directly for the public eye, but will instead act as an intermediary between whistleblowers and media organisations.

http://www.thisdayonline.info/nview.php?id=189757

We'll have to wait and see. The proliferation of new groups will create much employment and make them harder to shut down; unfortunately this will also make it easier for the PTB to divide and conquer.

Erin

12th December 2010, 11:52

The above posts reveal him to be quite bright. However, Mendax is Latin for "liar"; Tarpley pointed that out too. Lying is well known to be associated with sociopathic or psychopathic personalities (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_personality_disorder). Here's another summary of the psychopathic personality (http://www.oregoncounseling.org/Handouts/PsychopathicPersonality.htm), into which he seems to fit rather well IMO.

When I was younger I had an online handle that meant "fox" in Japanese. Foxes are well known to be associated with cleverness and trickery, and cannot be trusted. Does this mean that I cannot be trusted? By that logic, presumably.

Don't get me wrong - I definitely think it's wise to keep an open mind about Julian Assange and his intentions, but not when people resort to slippery slope arguments and borderline ad hominem attacks related to things he did when he was young.

Burke

12th December 2010, 15:46

great thread!

the wikileaks saga is one I have been watching closely with great interest as the various challenges it proposes to the global society is profound and will touch on so many different pillars supporting civil liberties and I feel that before this saga plays out, we will see this saga as a centerpiece of global change

who is wikileaks and are they legit?

judging by the many differing competing narratives alive and evolving which in almost in all cases wikileaks is painted as bad, makes me want to give them the benefit of the doubt and see how it all plays out without making judgment (like I have any real data to make such a judgment anyway as there is a flood of speculation only).

There is a MS media push to paint him as terrorist, spy, and immortal womanizer all the while there is an alternative media push to demonize them as CIA front, controlled demolition of the free information architecture, or a stunt to give big brother a valid reason in the eyes of the sheep to gain control of the free internet which the controllers must be salivating over

while there is a steadily growing minority opinion that this is the real deal and just one element of many manifestations occurring in the world today in efforts to take down the bully and finally bring peace to the world

I don't pretend to know and will not be so foolish to just decide on a belief just so I have one, so I am undecided as to what place wikileaks holds in this grand theater

yet I am delighted that:

-whistle blower is becoming a mainstream buzz word

-the world's elite are ever increasingly going under the microscope in MS media

-the alternative media has captured the worlds attention including main stream outlets (an ever increasing trend and I think MS media ownership changed 2 years ago - or tactics changed direction)

-it is becoming a popular trend to distrust ruling institutions and corporations enough to question instead of accept

-being a conspiracy theorist or researcher is becoming the new coolness

-people are talking and the silent (or silenced) majority are finding a voice and bravery in numbers

-there are ever increasing routes for insider testimony to reach public scrutiny, while also escaping the "fringe" label

As to the rumored dismissal of the 911 truth movement as annoying by Mr. Assange well that is an intriguing story all on its own as this rumor was started in July of 2010 if have my facts straight, and could have been the spearheading attack made that did the most damage to wikileaks in the conspiracy corners of the internet. He did the Ted Show appearance (http://www.ted.com/talks/julian_assange_why_the_world_needs_wikileaks.html) and then right around a week later the rumor burst out on the conspiracy scene in a matter of a few short days by going viral after the Alex Jones show and Rense picked it up and Wayne Madsen ran with it. The origin of this rumor may have been this article: Wanted by the CIA: Julian Assange - Wikileaks founder (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/lifestyle/features/wanted-by-the-cia-wikileaks-founder-julian-assange-14880073.html) I have not seen nor found any video clips of him saying this (nor in any other interviews for that matter) and we must trust Matthew Bell that he did say so I presume.

Since then there has been division in the conspiracy circles over the legitimacy of the messenger while the message gets drowned out by the overwhelming emotional noise created by this division. Classic hegelian dialectic crap that has been working against humanity since who knows when, and still works like a charm on you and me today.

all this damage control and competing narratives over something not real or threatening?

hmmm

interesting times indeed

sjkted

12th December 2010, 17:34

I've done some more research on Wikileaks, and here's my current view:

I grew up in hacker culture (not that I would ever admit to hacking a computer :-) and the idea was always that information was free -- not that it should be free, but it was free because it cannot be contained.

I'm quite impressed about their technical/legal architecture and that they have teamed up with the legendary Chaos Computer Club in Germany.

My take is that if their current leaks have not been "authorized" then there will be unauthorized leaks shortly. Someone who is in possession of secret material will eventually take the liberty to leak it, and Wikileaks will make it all too easy for them.

It will be very difficult for such organizations to be inflitrated as most of the personality types in them are not in it for money and are fiercely independent.

In addition, they cannot be shut down, short of shutting down the whole internet which is impossible. They could be temporarily censored, but the information will still make the rounds, albeit slower with censorship. And, even if they find a way to pull the plug on Wikileaks, it appears there's a bunch of other organizations vying to replace them, such as Openleaks.

I think this will be a very interesting story to watch.

--sjkted

Ahkenaten

12th December 2010, 17:53

Not very useful information! :)

(This doesn't qualify as research data: impossible for anyone to check, only feeds rumors, and might not be true or accurate.)

Agreed and I wished to highlight this rumor as something desparately in need of fact-checking. I have tried to find a source documenting that, in fact, Assange actually said this and am unable to locate it. I suspect that this is a rumor planted to undermine the Wikileaks brand and Assange personally. The two main things that seem to piss off people in the alternative news panopticon are 1.) the IDEA that Assange has discounted theories countering the official 911 narrative and 2.) the iDEA that Assange is pro-Israel (implying he is working for international, coordinated activities of 3-letter agencies) - This is an example of the damaging effect of unsubstantiated allegations, similar to accusing someone of being a child-molester. Both smears are based on Assange's not taking a public position on what his theories are concerning 911 and the "fact" that none of the cables thus released tend to shed a negative light on the State of Israel. I am not able to find any public statements Assange has specifically made concerning his theories about 911. With respect to the released cable info not revealing anything damaging to the interests of Israel that is not true. Some of the information has been damaging. The problem here is that less than 1,000 of 260,000 cables have been released to the public. I am willing to as Bill would say "Bet My Hat" that not ONE PERSON ON THIS FORUM HAS PERSONALLY READ all the documents released thus far and that includes me!! Further, there are about 259,000 documents yet to be released!! How will anyone individually be able to analyze this torrent of information? How will ANYONE be able to come to any kind of informed and intelligent conclusion about the contents? There is plenty of room for spin for anyone in all of this. The information overload has exceeded our capacity to deal with it responsibly!

I am increasingly concerned that unless a firm commitment is made in the alternative news sources to Truth (including basic journalistic techniques such as FACT CHECKING) all we are doing is becoming part of the problem instead of part of the solution. Although of course I believe in the importance of freedom to express one's personal opinion, intelligent and mature people should realize that doing so is only meaningful if one actually gives thought to what is said, (acting socially responsibly) i.e. not engaging in unsubstantiated attacks on others, scrupulous fact-checking, combined with respect for others. Lacking those elements our discourse is no better, and in fact may be much worse than the spectacle we see on FAUX news.........................

Regardless of the difficulty in discerning the TRUTH it is still a core value and must be borne in mind at all times when conversing with others in any media.

This is why in ancient texts people were admonished to attend to the important task of improving one's character. A human being without exemplary character is not working at full capacity and is, therefor subject to manipulation and doomed to a life of abject slavery.
Frankly, folks - we need to take our discourse to a higher level or it really is not helping anything in fact it is hurting because it is contributing to the confusion and divide and conquer tactics employed by the other side - in the name of freedom of speech etc.

Unless participants in this information band-width ascend collectively and voluntarily to a higher level, it is not serving any higher purpose than chit-chat and perhaps should be abandoned altogether.

ponda

12th December 2010, 23:33

while there is a steadily growing minority opinion that this is the real deal and just one element of many manifestations occurring in the world today in efforts to take down the bully and finally bring peace to the world

Good post Heretic

From what i have seen perusing some online readers comments and opinion polls it appears that the vast majority of the general public are behind Wiki and the release of the information and they also think that Wiki should not be shut down at all.

In a smh.com.au poll out of about 20,000 respondents about 18,000 were behind wiki and thought that no attempts to shut it down should be made.

Poll link: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/politics/america-will-kill-rudd-with-kindness-20101208-18poe.html#poll

Houman

13th December 2010, 03:12

"Every time we witness an injustice and do not act, we train our character to be passive in its presence and thereby eventually lose all ability to defend ourselves and those we love"

Banshee

13th December 2010, 03:19

Houman,

Excellent synopsis.

In other words, and a more crude analysis - we become desensitised

str8thinker

13th December 2010, 05:19

@CosmicLagoon:

When I was younger I had an online handle that meant "fox" in Japanese. Foxes are well known to be associated with cleverness and trickery, and cannot be trusted. Does this mean that I cannot be trusted? By that logic, presumably.

Don't get me wrong - I definitely think it's wise to keep an open mind about Julian Assange and his intentions, but not when people resort to slippery slope arguments and borderline ad hominem attacks related to things he did when he was young.

I wish to make it clear that my comments about JA's childhood were not meant to be taken as an ad hominem attack, even though I have much less respect for someone who is proud to name himself a "liar" rather than a "fox".

Now that I know a little more about JA's background I feel he is exactly the right man for the time and place in which he finds himself. Lesser men bearing the excruciating cruelty of such a childhood would not have made it this far. His childhood certainly prepared him for his later life and, as such cannot be reversed. His bed was made for him and now he will have to lie in it.

Humble Janitor

13th December 2010, 09:26

I am convinced that even I share traits with Mr.Assange and Gary McKinnon.

Regardless, both should be protected as they are the true guardians of the truth.

Bill Ryan

13th December 2010, 10:14

"Every time we witness an injustice and do not act, we train our character to be passive in its presence and thereby eventually lose all ability to defend ourselves and those we love"

Many thanks, Houman:

Julian Assange wrote this in January 2007.

Every time we witness an injustice and do not act, we train our character to be passive in its presence and thereby eventually lose all ability to defend ourselves and those we love. In a modern economy it is impossible to seal oneself off from injustice.

If we have brains or courage, then we are blessed and called on not to frit these qualities away, standing agape at the ideas of others, winning pissing contests, improving the efficiencies of the neocorporate state, or immersing ourselves in obscuranta, but rather to prove the vigor of our talents against the strongest opponents of love we can find.

If we can only live once, then let it be a daring adventure that draws on all our powers. Let it be with similar types whose hearts and heads we may be proud of. Let our grandchildren delight to find the start of our stories in their ears but the endings all around in their wandering eyes.

The whole universe or the structure that perceives it is a worthy opponent, but try as I may I can not escape the sound of suffering. Perhaps as an old man I will take great comfort in pottering around in a lab and gently talking to students in the summer evening and will accept suffering with insouciance. But not now; men in their prime, if they have convictions are tasked to act on them.

-- Julian Assange, 03 Jan 2007

Zook

13th December 2010, 12:53

Good morning Houman, the Earth says hello!

"Every time we witness an injustice and do not act, we train our character to be passive in its presence and thereby eventually lose all ability to defend ourselves and those we love"

I'm a bit disappointed in your post (after having read Bill's post below where he puts the quote's context back in, including authorship). I had thought those were your own words, not Julian Assange's. It's a fine line between creative presentation of another's words and plagiarism. Merely putting quotation marks around a quote may or may not protect you from the ugly charge of plagiarism; but it cannot escape the smell of deception (even if a passing odor).

I wonder if people realize the multitude of ways in which cognitive dissonance delivers itself?

In this case, we are first encouraged to rally around the message removed from the messenger; then the messenger is made known (of course, Bill was merely reporting from his own knowledgebase; but Houman knew the identity of the messenger and did not reveal it although it was his responsibility to do so). Was it an oversight on Houman's part? Sure ... anything's possible. Probable? As probable as flying pigs being backypigged by 500-lb canaries! (IMHO, and I'd venture in the opinion of most here who are used to the practice of quoting people). Finally, the people rally around the messenger with the great message. See how dissociation from one's repugnance to evil is achieved?

The main difference between this message and the message in the Mein Kampf ... is that this message is in the purported duty of good, while that message was in the duty of evil. Nonetheless, that message resonated with the people. Hitler merely rode this resonance to its logical ends ... evil message to evil ends. Assange's good message is in the duty of Assange's evil assoCIAtions.

Humble opinions all around.

:typing:

ps: I thought about removing my thanks from your post; but my better wisdom advised me that that would be rewriting the historical record (of your deception and my falling for it). If that's how I reacted in the moment; then that's how it shall be recorded when all is said and done.

ps2: A message is only as good as its context.

Houman

13th December 2010, 20:36

Hi Zookumar,

The quotation marks were indicative of the fact that I was "quoting" someone.
I somehow hoped that someone will find out who (given that the quote was taken out of the front page of the website referenced in title of this tread , were my expectations too high? :doh:)
I am happy that Bill did...

Good morning Houman, the Earth says hello!

I'm a bit disappointed in your post (after having read Bill's post below where he puts the quote's context back in, including authorship). I had thought those were your own words, not Julian Assange's. It's a fine line between creative presentation of another's words and plagiarism. Merely putting quotation marks around a quote may or may not protect you from the ugly charge of plagiarism; but it cannot escape the smell of deception (even if a passing odor).

I wonder if people realize the multitude of ways in which cognitive dissonance delivers itself?

In this case, we are first encouraged to rally around the message removed from the messenger; then the messenger is made known (of course, Bill was merely reporting from his own knowledgebase; but Houman knew the identity of the messenger and did not reveal it although it was his responsibility to do so). Was it an oversight on Houman's part? Sure ... anything's possible. Probable? As probable as flying pigs being backypigged by 500-lb canaries! (IMHO, and I'd venture in the opinion of most here who are used to the practice of quoting people). Finally, the people rally around the messenger with the great message. See how dissociation from one's repugnance to evil is achieved?

The main difference between this message and the message in the Mein Kampf ... is that this message is in the purported duty of good, while that message was in the duty of evil. Nonetheless, that message resonated with the people. Hitler merely rode this resonance to its logical ends ... evil message to evil ends. Assange's good message is in the duty of Assange's evil assoCIAtions.

Humble opinions all around.

:typing:

ps: I thought about removing my thanks from your post; but my better wisdom advised me that that would be rewriting the historical record (of your deception and my falling for it). If that's how I reacted in the moment; then that's how it shall be recorded when all is said and done.

ps2: A message is only as good as its context.

Banshee

13th December 2010, 21:01

I think Houman was well intentioned. I didn't perceive it as a quote, but upon second glance.... it is in quotes. Maybe it was late. Makes me want to go back and edit my posts - lol. God only knows what I may have done in the late or wee hours? We're all human, Houman :hug:

Houman

13th December 2010, 21:58

Thanks :) The quotation marks were always there since the post has not been edited.

The purpose of the elliptic style is to stimulate research not over-excitement :pleasantry:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8HekrEIZTbo&feature=related

Bill Ryan

13th December 2010, 22:33

--------

Houman's quote of Julian Assange was a good find. I'm impressed more and more every day with what Assange has done or written in earlier years - he's a sharp, radical intellect, and clearly has always been so.

Regardless of how the controllers may seize on this opportunity to crack down on users of the net (like cracking down on drivers on the highway), I'm convinced that Assange is well-intentioned and is not being put up to all this.

What's happening may be dangerous, though, inasmuch as the 'hacktivists' (and maybe all wikileakers, which sort of includes Kerry and myself by association) may be sold to the public by the media and politicians as a new brand of terrorist.

It's an ideal opportunity to ramp up the policing of cyberspace - and that does not at all mean that Assange is any kind of plant.

fifi

13th December 2010, 22:45

I totally agree with you, Bill. Thanks so much to all Avalonians who have kept information about JA up-to-date.

Zook

13th December 2010, 22:47

Hi Houman,

Hi Zookumar,
The quotation marks were indicative of the fact that I was "quoting" someone.
I somehow hoped that someone will find out who (given that the quote was taken out of the front page of the website referenced in title of this tread , were my expectations too high? :doh:)
I am happy that Bill did...

All well and true, Houman ... except that Bill, to his credit, was compelled to include the missing information. If he hadn't done that, those who had yet to visit IQ.org (or who had visited but did not find the quote (not quite the needle in the haystack, agreed, but neither is it the streaker in the football stadium) ... would've thought they were your own words. Heck, I sometimes quote myself when I'm retrieving information from a previous post of mine. In short, I always try and qualify the originating source of any quote if it is not self-evident. I'm pretty sure that's an important rule of quoting (all rules have exceptions, of course, e.g. usually attributable to forgetfulness).

Here, you admit that yours was not due to forgetfulness but psychological study. Fair enough, I'm the last person that would redress playfulness. I did write above the following: "Merely putting quotation marks around a quote may or may not protect you from the ugly charge of plagiarism; but it cannot escape the smell of deception (even if a passing odor)".

I'm convinced you weren't trying to deceive. My apologies. I could have written my original response better if I'd tried a little harder.

:typing:

Rocky_Shorz

13th December 2010, 22:54

well Bill, remember, keep your friends close and your enemies closer...

The last thing they would ever want is for you to move to a private web they couldn't monitor...

Houman

13th December 2010, 23:51

No worries :)

Hi Houman,

All well and true, Houman ... except that Bill, to his credit, was compelled to include the missing information. If he hadn't done that, those who had yet to visit IQ.org (or who had visited but did not find the quote (not quite the needle in the haystack, agreed, but neither is it the streaker in the football stadium) ... would've thought they were your own words. Heck, I sometimes quote myself when I'm retrieving information from a previous post of mine. In short, I always try and qualify the originating source of any quote if it is not self-evident. I'm pretty sure that's an important rule of quoting (all rules have exceptions, of course, e.g. usually attributable to forgetfulness).

Here, you admit that yours was not due to forgetfulness but psychological study. Fair enough, I'm the last person that would redress playfulness. I did write above the following: "Merely putting quotation marks around a quote may or may not protect you from the ugly charge of plagiarism; but it cannot escape the smell of deception (even if a passing odor)".

I'm convinced you weren't trying to deceive. My apologies. I could have written my original response better if I'd tried a little harder.

:typing:

astrid

14th December 2010, 00:25

Yes i liked that quote also very much , why i posted it on the first page of this thread.... it was from a piece JA titled "Witnessing"
(sorry Houman i should have made it more clear it was from JA... rather than just putting "from the above site" , i will edit that now!)

He's certainly someone that can't just sit back and watch........

Now i want to get this off my chest and its with much respect to all on this forum that i make this comment.....

Sometimes i feel like i'm in an English class on this forum. I have a fist full of learning disorders, and its often really hard for me to articulate in words , what is very clear in my mind , this is made even harder when im worried about being pulled up , or judged for my less than perfect use of the written word....

Im saying this mostly as there might be others that DON'T post much, but would really like to, and have important things to say....

Most of the difficulties i'm referring too ( Aspergers, ADHD, Autism, Dyslexia,being some of these) have VERY LITTLE to do with intelligence, this is often not widely known. I do understand the importance of correct use of said English language, but lets be aware that some of us may not be as articulate as others in this art !!

Blessings to all ,

Astrid

Houman

14th December 2010, 04:03

No need to be... what kills information is not its lack but too much of it...

Concerning ADHD, Autism,... those are actually various degrees of induced metabolic impairments (google Amy Yasko, full blown autistic children are recovering by using her protocol), 30 days detox of
https://www.herbdoc.com/index.php?&c=1 would be an alternative

Yes i liked that quote also very much , why i posted it on the first page of this thread.... it was from a piece JA titled "Witnessing"
(sorry Houman i should have made it more clear it was from JA... rather than just putting "from the above site" , i will edit that now!)

He's certainly someone that can't just sit back and watch........

Now i want to get this off my chest and its with much respect to all on this forum that i make this comment.....

Sometimes i feel like i'm in an English class on this forum. I have a fist full of learning disorders, and its often really hard for me to articulate in words , what is very clear in my mind , this is made even harder when im worried about being pulled up , or judged for my less than perfect use of the written word....

Im saying this mostly as there might be others that DON'T post much, but would really like to, and have important things to say....

Most of the difficulties i'm referring too ( Aspergers, ADHD, Autism, Dyslexia,being some of these) have VERY LITTLE to do with intelligence, this is often not widely known. I do understand the importance of correct use of said English language, but lets be aware that some of us may not be as articulate as others in this art !!

Blessings to all ,

Astrid

sjkted

14th December 2010, 04:45

Houman's quote of Julian Assange was a good find. I'm impressed more and more every day with what Assange has done or written in earlier years - he's a sharp, radical intellect, and clearly has always been so.

Regardless of how the controllers may seize on this opportunity to crack down on users of the net (like cracking down on drivers on the highway), I'm convinced that Assange is well-intentioned and is not being put up to all this.

What's happening may be dangerous, though, inasmuch as the 'hacktivists' (and maybe all wikileakers, which sort of includes Kerry and myself by association) may be sold to the public by the media and politicians as a new brand of terrorist.

It's an ideal opportunity to ramp up the policing of cyberspace - and that does not at all mean that Assange is any kind of plant.

I agree with this and it's a problem we need to face. What if much of the truth gets exposed in a way that it the genie can't be put back in the bottle and instead of acting on it to create positive change, people vote or comply with avoiding it and accepting additional restrictions on civil liberties?

Overall, I think it's good because they won't be able to censor the information. It a will always be out there and there will be more leaks. Some day it will become apparent to everyone who is capable (intellectually or psychologically) of understanding the information.

Another thing is that the intelligentsia (i.e. critical thinkers) comprise much of what drives society. I always enjoy talking with critical thinkers. Some of these people still get their info from the mainstream and are very confused with what is happening right now as it doesn't fit their current thinking pattern models. Most of these people are curious by nature and require a high burden of proof before being able to wrap their mind around something that is "out there" like a government conspiracy. I think Wikileaks is good because it will wake up this segment of the population and they will have the power to make things happen.

--sjkted

Ahkenaten

14th December 2010, 04:57

Is there ever such a thing as too much truth? An interesting question. Maybe if the entire reality is hyperinjected with a gigantic dose of TRUTH the horrible habit of human lying will be seriously weakened....................................maybe the fundamental split at the bottom of our psyche will be exposed to the light and the air and heal

astrid

14th December 2010, 05:18

Concerning ADHD, Autism,... those are actually various degrees of induced metabolic impairments (google Amy Yasko, full blown autistic children are recovering by using her protocol), 30 days detox of

Sorry , TOTAL BS... i have brain wave scans (called QEEGs), http://www.qeeg.com/qeegfact.html to PROVE otherwise, nothing to do with diet, sorry. ( AND YES i have tried all these so called " cures")

....This is neurological, i have lived with this all my life, and have tried EVERYTHING, diet can and does help, i.e. dopamine is one thing that is low for me... protein helps to raise dopamine levels , but there is no cure. (Same as there is no cure for epilepsy)

Im presently undergoing bio-feedback which is SO interesting and works well to assist in balancing brain waves that are not working optimally, but its not a cure.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biofeedback

THIS IS GENETIC also, my mother is has Autisim, my grandmother was ADD , my father also has some brain imbalances.

BWT i see these 3D "labels" not as excuses but reasons, that can assist one to understand and develop " work- around" stategies , ( there are many)
Education is a big part of this... including helping others to understand these "conditions", so i dont hold back if the chance arises..
Note also that there are MORE pluses than minuses with alot of these neurological issues..
http://www.addcoach4u.com/positivesofadd.html

I also find it very interesting that most of these so called 3D "disordered" people are VERY gifted in many ways, esp psychically.....

The minuses are mainly social like when we try to fit ourselves into the world of neuro-typicals, bullying is one of the big issues, (as was for me and most i know), which unfortunately can lead us as adults to sitting back, rather than engaging , when we might have something to say...

I don't generally even bother engaging in social groups, so its a bit of a personal experiment/challenge to even post here, lol

And yes mods i know this is VERY off topic , but its kind of a quest i have to help educate on some of these issues, maybe i should even start a thread in the right place, as it does spin off into all sort of tangents, some of them are relevant and important to wider issues....

sjkted

14th December 2010, 05:51

jcocks

14th December 2010, 06:01

Sorry , TOTAL BS... i have brain wave scans (called QEEGs), http://www.qeeg.com/qeegfact.html to PROVE otherwise, nothing to do with diet, sorry. ( AND YES i have tried all these so called " cures")

....This is neurological, i have lived with this all my life, and have tried EVERYTHING, diet can and does help, i.e. dopamine is one thing that is low for me... protein helps to raise dopamine levels , but there is no cure. (Same as there is no cure for epilepsy)

Im presently undergoing bio-feedback which is SO interesting and works well to assist in balancing brain waves that are not working optimally, but its not a cure.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biofeedback

THIS IS GENETIC also, my mother is has Autisim, my grandmother was ADD , my father also has some brain imbalances.

BWT i see these 3D "labels" not as excuses but reasons, that can assist one to understand and develop " work- around" stategies , ( there are many)
Education is a big part of this... including helping others to understand these "conditions", so i dont hold back if the chance arises..
Note also that there are MORE pluses than minuses with alot of these neurological issues..
http://www.addcoach4u.com/positivesofadd.html

I also find it very interesting that most of these so called 3D "disordered" people are VERY gifted in many ways, esp psychically.....

The minuses are mainly social like when we try to fit ourselves into the world of neuro-typicals, bullying is one of the big issues, (as was for me and most i know), which unfortunately can lead us as adults to sitting back, rather than engaging , when we might have something to say...

I don't generally even bother engaging in social groups, so its a bit of a personal experiment/challenge to even post here, lol

And yes mods i know this is VERY off topic , but its kind of a quest i have to help educate on some of these issues, maybe i should even start a thread in the right place, as it does spin off into all sort of tangents, some of them are relevant and important to wider issues....

It needs to be said tho... When people talk of a "cure" for Autism I usually get quite angry. I just think such talk is ignorant and it just smacks of an NT parent wanting their Autistic / aspie child to be "normal"....

So, if i may ask Astrid, what form of Autism do you have? Is it normal autism or aspergers? I'm aspie (as much as I can tell - my diagnosis was a bit funny...)

Houman

14th December 2010, 07:07

Check the information before making a judgment
http://www.asdinfo.org/documents/files/Intestinal_pathophysiology_in_Autism.pdf

I didn't speak of "curing" but of "recovering" (as recovering after being hit by a truck) and thousands of people have already done it
http://www.ch3nutrigenomics.com/phpBB2/welcome.html

This recovery is made possible through the understanding that autism is a multi-factorial puzzle. It is not just an inflamed brain, it is not just a leaky gut, not just an impaired
methylation cycle, etc... A leaky gut can lead to brain inflamation and irregular EEG...

There is a genetic susceptibility but that's not all, exposed to enough toxins anyone can develop autism (if young enough), Schizophrenia, Parkinson or Alz, genetics determine the threshold.
Biofeedback is but one element of the solution...

Analyze the info... it is when you think that you know everything that you stop learning...

Sorry , TOTAL BS... i have brain wave scans (called QEEGs), http://www.qeeg.com/qeegfact.html to PROVE otherwise, nothing to do with diet, sorry. ( AND YES i have tried all these so called " cures")

....This is neurological, i have lived with this all my life, and have tried EVERYTHING, diet can and does help, i.e. dopamine is one thing that is low for me... protein helps to raise dopamine levels , but there is no cure. (Same as there is no cure for epilepsy)

Im presently undergoing bio-feedback which is SO interesting and works well to assist in balancing brain waves that are not working optimally, but its not a cure.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biofeedback

THIS IS GENETIC also, my mother is has Autisim, my grandmother was ADD , my father also has some brain imbalances.

BWT i see these 3D "labels" not as excuses but reasons, that can assist one to understand and develop " work- around" stategies , ( there are many)
Education is a big part of this... including helping others to understand these "conditions", so i dont hold back if the chance arises..
Note also that there are MORE pluses than minuses with alot of these neurological issues..
http://www.addcoach4u.com/positivesofadd.html

I also find it very interesting that most of these so called 3D "disordered" people are VERY gifted in many ways, esp psychically.....

The minuses are mainly social like when we try to fit ourselves into the world of neuro-typicals, bullying is one of the big issues, (as was for me and most i know), which unfortunately can lead us as adults to sitting back, rather than engaging , when we might have something to say...

I don't generally even bother engaging in social groups, so its a bit of a personal experiment/challenge to even post here, lol

And yes mods i know this is VERY off topic , but its kind of a quest i have to help educate on some of these issues, maybe i should even start a thread in the right place, as it does spin off into all sort of tangents, some of them are relevant and important to wider issues....

Houman

14th December 2010, 07:15

It needs to be said tho... When people talk of a "cure" for Autism I usually get quite angry. I just think such talk is ignorant and it just smacks of an NT parent wanting their Autistic / aspie child to be "normal"....

So, if i may ask Astrid, what form of Autism do you have? Is it normal autism or aspergers? I'm aspie (as much as I can tell - my diagnosis was a bit funny...)

There are so many ways of "recovering" those children
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wgjkXg38wCY
never give up!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8uJ5RpQWw0

Bill Ryan

21st December 2010, 15:39

Is there ever such a thing as too much truth? An interesting question.

Not too much truth. Too much information.

Houman had said

No need to be... what kills information is not its lack but too much of it...

I don't know anyone who's not suffering from information overload. We start to shut down.

65,000 new YouTube videos were being uploaded every day - and that statistic was in 2006. (Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/YouTube). It must be well over 100,000 per day now - maybe twice as much. That's frightening.

If I have some information to tell the public that I honesty believe is accurate and important (and I do!) - how do I do it? I have to find a way to compete with everything else on the internet.

This is the problem...

Ahkenaten

21st December 2010, 22:12

Thanks Bill point WELL TAKEN

bluestflame

21st December 2010, 22:16

like some of us in our early teens when discovered smoking were sat down and forced to smoke the whole pack one after the other in the hopes that we'd be so sick of the sight , taste, smell of them , we would not touch another one ever

the info overload is starting to feel like that ....

Snowy Owl

22nd December 2010, 01:10

Salutations to all,

I have read most of the comment on this thread and must first tell you that my sources of informations are mainly in French, English, Spanish, Italian and German.

The First thing that seems astounding was the fact that Man, in all seriousness says that he believes the report of 911 and conspirationists are nuts ???

Then about two weeks ago the same guy Praise the Prime Minister of Israël M. Netanayhu citing him as an example of frank talks and how politicians should be. ????

Now, lets look at the leaks....., from an informed European point of view I still wait for a surprise, but I think for the US people it might be surprising, maybe... As for the whole governemental apparatus worldwide diplomacy it is the shade under the spotlight.

In, what appears as the imperative time of control of informations, WikiLeaks might have engeander WikiWall.

Snowy

Ahkenaten

22nd December 2010, 01:20

Snowy I did fact checking on the assertion that Julian Assange stated that stuff about the Prime Minister of Israel and it isn't true even though this continues to rattle around on the web, the allegation having taken on a life of its own. I have not seen that he said 911 conspiracy theorists were nuts but I will look into that allegation as well. The problem in the information pipeline is that the press actually wield control over what is released, not Wikileaks which dumps info on them.

astrid

22nd December 2010, 01:50

So, if i may ask Astrid, what form of Autism do you have? Is it normal autism or aspergers? I'm aspie (as much as I can tell - my diagnosis was a bit funny...)

Hi Houman, I'm Aspergers, that part of my "neuro-cocktail" is more recent, the Doctor im working with for biofeedback, recognised it straight away, i was not to familiar with Aspies, but it fits well and makes a lot of sense, considering my Mother's long history of learning and social issues. I actually really like my brain, although its very inefficient and normal 3D land day to day stuff is hard, if not impossible, so i have lots of "work arounds". Life is so much better now that i know what im actually dealing with, education and awareness is KEY. Thankfully i have found a fantastic doctor who specialises in mind/body health, who also works with bio-feedback. So at 45 in a lot of ways i feel like my life is just beginning.

Recently i was referred to a specialist in the city , who performs and analyses Qeeg scans, specifically for people with ADD types of disorders, with the view to having bio-feedback. The report was kind of staggering, and quite emotional to read, it details in black and white, all the issues i have been struggling with since birth, its certainly great validation.
We have a very detailed plan of attack for 2011, i will having biofeedback for at least another year, maybe longer. I had to laugh the last line of the report said
" This is a very complex case and it will require careful work" , lol !
I thought , yep , that's my brain!!
Im feeling a bit vulnerable here, having "outted" myself, lol, so thanks Houman for your question, im tipping there are a few more on the forum also, these "conditions" are on the increase.

Zook

22nd December 2010, 07:13

Hi Bill,

I don't know anyone who's not suffering from information overload. We start to shut down.
65,000 new YouTube videos were being uploaded every day - and that statistic was in 2006. (Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/YouTube). It must be well over 100,000 per day now - maybe twice as much. That's frightening.
If I have some information to tell the public that I honesty believe is accurate and important (and I do!) - how do I do it? I have to find a way to compete with everything else on the internet.
This is the problem...

True ... infoglut is a problem. That being said, I can only see two nonTotalitarian ways out of this dilemma, myself (e.g. unrestricted free speech vs informational speech restricted by infloglut).

(1)Be a compelling personality; this will give you the platform to deliver any argument (compelling or not).
(2)Have a compelling personality deliver your argument; after which you can emerge and fill in the compelling details.

FBOFW, I think Camelot worked more due to the compelling personalities than to the compelling details. Those details existed long before Camelot came about, but only became compelling (at least to many of us here) when the compelling personalities got involved. Humble opinions all around.

:typing:

Erin

28th December 2010, 04:29

Weirdly enough, I was watching this debate on CNN with Glenn Greenwald (http://www.youtube.com/v/XInz4i6AV8M?fs=1&hl=en_US) when I noticed something. Check out what happens at the 3:54 mark!

Anyone else seen IQ.org quoted or referenced in the MSM?

ETA: for some reason I have no idea how to embed Youtube videos.

Bill Ryan

2nd November 2011, 18:15

-------

Here's an excellent new article (2 November, 2011) about Julian Assange's background:

http://edition.cnn.com/2011/11/02/world/europe/assange-profile/index.html?&hpt=hp_c2

The secret life of Julian Assange

He grew up constantly on the move, the son of parents who were in the theater business in Australia.

His mother and his stepfather say from an early age, Julian Assange has been driven by a sense of fighting for justice.

Now, that battle applies to himself as well. Assange, the 40-year-old founder and public face of the website WikiLeaks, lost his battle Wednesday to stay in the United Kingdom and avoid extradition to Sweden to face questioning over sex charges.

"I have not been charged with any crime in any country," Assange noted.

It's the latest turn in a saga that has kept the often elusive, enigmatic figure in the international spotlight.

Since the summer of 2010, when WikiLeaks began releasing reams of classified U.S. intelligence documents, Assange has stoked the ire of top officials in the United States and around the world. Some want him and WikiLeaks punished for what they call irreparable damage to global security.

"WikiLeaks has ... ignored our requests not to release or disseminate any U.S. documents it may possess and has continued its well-established pattern of irresponsible, reckless, and frankly dangerous actions," U.S. State Department spokesman Victoria Nuland said in September.

Supporters contend Assange represents free speech at its finest. They say he is committed to outing injustices.

Assange himself has remained stalwart that the information WikiLeaks chooses to release serves the public by exposing truths about secretive government decisions.

Days ago, when WikiLeaks announced it was temporarily stopping publication to raise funds in order to stay afloat in the wake of a financial blockade by banks, Assange said, "If this financial attack stands unchallenged, a dangerous, oppressive and undemocratic precedent will have been set, the implications of which go far beyond WikiLeaks and its work."

His parents see the makings of his persona in his youth.

His mother, Christine, describes him as "highly intelligent."

He was just 16 when she bought him a Commodore 64 computer. It was 1987, and there were no websites. Assange attached a modem to his computer and began his journey through the growing world of computer networks.

"It's like chess," he once told New Yorker magazine. "Chess is very austere in that you don't have many rules, there is no randomness and the problem is very hard."

Though his mother raised him without any religious influence, she sensed that from a tender age, her son was led by a strong desire to do what he perceived as just.

"He was a lovely boy, very sensitive, good with animals, quiet and has a wicked sense of humor," she told the Melbourne, Australia, Herald Sun newspaper last year.

Brett Assange, who raised Julian from age one and gave him his surname, says he was "a very bright boy with a keen sense of right and wrong."

In an interview with CNN affiliate Seven News last year, he described his stepson as a "sharp kid who always fought for the underdog."

"Strangely enough, I always thought he would do something like this," Brett Assange said. "He was always very independent. And he certainly wouldn't take 'no' for an answer.

"He always stood up for the underdog. I remember that, like with his school friends. He was always very angry about people ganging up on other people. He had a really good sense of equality and equity."

Julian Assange would go on to study mathematics and physics at the University of Melbourne.

In interviews, his scientific precision shines through.

In a baritone voice, he speaks in measured pace, choosing each word carefully. He can be charming yet cagey about his private life and is rarely shaken by discussions of even the most controversial revelations on WikiLeaks.

He displays a broad range of interests, from computers to literature to his travels in Africa.

He's the kind of person who, he says, can hack into the most sophisticated computer system, but forget to show up for an interview, or cancel at the last minute.

Even when he walked out of a CNN interview last year after refusing to answer questions about the sex charges in Sweden, Assange remained cool and collected. He projected a stately demeanor helped by his profusion of gray hair -- which grew at an early age -- and an equally steely facial expression.

After his initial foray into computers as a teen, Assange delved into computer encryption and grew keen on computer security. He once relayed a story about how he set up an encryption puzzle based on the manipulation of prime numbers.

The New Yorker article, published last year, described how in 1991, Assange hacked into the master terminal of the telecom company Nortel, after which he developed a growing fear of arrest.

He had married and fathered a child when he was only 18, but the relationship fell apart and his wife left him, taking their infant son with her.

He was charged with 31 counts of hacking in Australia but in the end paid only a small sum in damages, according to the New Yorker.

The young hacker began to focus his attention away from network flaws to what he perceived as wrongdoings of governments.

In a 2007 blog post on IQ.org, he wrote:

"The whole universe or the structure that perceives it is a worthy opponent, but try as I may I can not escape the sound of suffering. Perhaps as an old man I will take great comfort in pottering around in a lab and gently talking to students in the summer evening and will accept suffering with insouciance. But not now; men in their prime, if they have convictions are tasked to act on them."

IQ.org is believed to be a blog created by Assange and is registered under the name "JA" by the same U.S. domain company as WikiLeaks. Its Australian postal address is also the same as a submissions address for WikiLeaks.

Driven by the conviction of an activist and the curiosity of a journalist, Assange founded WikiLeaks in 2006. He slept little and sometimes forgot to eat. He hired staff and enlisted the help of volunteers.

Always, he protected his sources, never discussing where information came from.

"People should understand that WikiLeaks has proven to be arguably the most trustworthy new source that exists, because we publish primary source material and analysis based on that primary source material," Assange told CNN. "Other organizations, with some exceptions, simply are not trustworthy."

Daniel Domscheit-Berg, a longtime volunteer and spokesman for WikiLeaks who quit his job last year, told CNN that Assange's personality was distracting from the group's original mission: to publish small leaks, not just huge, splashy ones like the Afghan War Diary.

Assange took issue.

"It is my role to be the lightning rod," Assange said. "That is a difficult role. On the other hand, I get undue credit."

Assange's mother told the Herald Sun that she feared her son had become "too smart for himself."

"I'm concerned it's gotten too big and the forces that he's challenging are too big," she said.