Vladimir Putin urged Journalists to Report on Impending Danger of Nuclear Arms Race.

[Ines]

Vladimir Putin urged Journalists to Report on Impending Danger of Nuclear Arms Race.
St Petersburg International Economic Forum, June 2016.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqD8lIdIMRo

[OnyxKnight]

His country is a host of over 7300 nuclear warheads, 1790 of which are fully operational and can be fired at any given second. When you warn of the dangers though, you paint the other side as the only aggressor. America does the same. Now, how do you trust one over the other, when they mirror each other in almost every way possible? The rhetoric of different sides of a same coin comes in light here.

I'd trust him much more if they developed some type of state-of-the-art defense against nuclear attacks, without setting up nuclear weapons themselves all over the place.

[Baby Steps]

COME BACK COLD WAR-ALL IS FORGIVEN!

Two sides of the same coin, they are just as bad as each other-two huge powers, armed to the teeth…

The above is the narrative that TPTB wish us to hold in our perception, it relies on us holding on to perceptions we had during the cold war, and not moving towards a more up to date, realistic and well informed assessment of the current world. Believe me, they will exploit our failure, to commit horrendous acts if we do not wake up soon.

I invite you to stop thinking about this situation in terms of two huge blocs that are having a tussle. Firstly, if there is a tussle, why? It is totally unnecessary; the interests of the USA and Russia do not greatly conflict. The narrative of Russia being our enemy is FALSE.

Russia has less than 1/6th of the economic potential of the USA, and roughly 1/3rd of the war waging capacity. Russia would only risk confrontation with NATO if its back was to the wall. This increasingly is how they feel due to OUR AGGRESSION.
During the cold war, there was a fine balance. Two vast Military complexes facing each other where the Military and leadership were very clear that they had no intentions of fighting. There were agreements, lines of communication, clear demarcations etc. They knew where they were. Despite all the fail-safes, we DID get to the brink often by error, more times than we know.

From a Russian perspective the situation now is dramatically different. More akin to 1941. Few functioning treaties, a deteriorating international security system, and Russia’s neighbour furiously re-arming & deploying vast armies. NATO has sent Russia a signal.
1. Undertakings not to encroach the NATO area beyond what it was in 1991 were solemnly given. These have been dumped without consultation. The signal is- our promises means nothing, we are happy to threaten your security.
2. Deployment of ABM systems in Eastern Europe. We have unilaterally dropped commitments not to deploy anti missile systems. This will upset the fine balance. The signal we are sending is – treaties mean nothing to us, and we are facilitating a system that will enable us (NATO) to conduct a Nuclear war without being destroyed. The balance that has kept the peace for so long is GONE. THIS IS THE HIGHT OF IRRESPONSIBILITY on the part of NATO.
3. As I always say, the scariest thing for many is that the public in Western countries seem to be stumbling in a daze towards catastrophe, and cannot see it.
4. THE RUSSIANS ARE NOT BAD OR A THREAT. THEY ARE BY NO MEANS PERFECT BUT IF WE LEAVE THEM ALONE THEY WILL LEAVE US ALONE.

[Wind]

Unlike the war hawks and neocons in Washington D.C., I believe that Putin certainly does not want a war.
That being said, he is only the lesser of two evils.

[Eram]

His country is a host of over 7300 nuclear warheads, 1790 of which are fully operational and can be fired at any given second. When you warn of the dangers though, you paint the other side as the only aggressor. America does the same. Now, how do you trust one over the other, when they mirror each other in almost every way possible? The rhetoric of different sides of a same coin comes in light here.

I'd trust him much more if they developed some type of state-of-the-art defense against nuclear attacks, without setting up nuclear weapons themselves all over the place.

Fully agreed!

For all those who believe the alternative propaganda about Putin, as if he is some sort of knight in shining armor, who stands up to the evil powers of the west and (hopefully) will rescue us from them, it would be a good idea to read this article from the Finnish Novelist Sofi Oksanen about Russia, Putin and it's current political situation.

Everyone should wake up tot the fact that Putin is an authoritarian leader who does not shy away from eliminating political opponents, false flag attacks and undermining the democratic institution.

The US and NATO seriously have to back down in their aggressive policy toward Russia, but we must not kid ourselves about Putin and what he has done to Russia.




Sofi Oksanen: Russia has already won the media war

Finland and other western countries don't recognize Putin's real intentions.


This spring the western media has asked me the same questions over and over again, in every country, in every interview:


– What does Putin Want?


– Which country will be the next attacked country?

Not even one reporter has asked me when the occupation in Crimea stops, and the lack of this very question indicates the assumption that Crimea will never be returned to Ukraine. Did the western interest stop because the western journalism's traditional dramaturgy requires action that goes forward, gives a good image and the main actor is famous enough, in this case Putin?


When Putin's focus was deliberately placed elsewhere the whole media followed him. Or is the reason because the west doesn't know Crimea's area well enough or haven't many enough even visited Crimea?


Russia started to invest in changing Crimea's atmosphere a long time ago, after that Russia focused on manipulating opinions against the west and against Ukraine.


The western media didn't follow that story, but it should had covered it later on in the news. It would offer the readers some insight into how a country is invaded, step by step, it would also give the readers information that an occupation is always also a spiritual occupation preceeded by manipulation of opinions, and after the occupation takes place changing public values and changing the context in school books, wiping the original population's history off the map. But because the international media reported only about what presidents and diplomats had said and about how troops were moving, it was easy for Moscow to determine how easily Crimea will be forgotten abroad. Russia has a lot of experiences of these kind of forced annexations, as does the former soviet-countries too.


These repeated questions about speculating over Putin's thoughts and about the next target of an attack also tells about an indirect assumption: The next target already exists, it is a physical nation, we just don't know yet which country it is.


Western puppets


The assumption is based upon old-fashioned and learned ideas about warfare. At the same time the west is sub-consciously repeating exactly those questions that Moscow's oligarch-clique wants the west to repeat. They want us to specualate over Putin's thoughts and hence enforce the Putin-myth. They want to fill our heads with these questions, because that way the west is put in a state of insecurity and instability, in other words in a beneficial state from Russia's POV. Divide and conquer - it works everytime.


Since nobody wants to be the cursed next target of aggression, the countries are forced into focusing on their own safety. and in Finland it means a Nato-debate. In a situation like this resolving the occupation in Crimea isn't that important.


The silent acceptance of Crimea's occupation is bound to raise questions in each nation bordering Russia: Is this how others would react if parts of our country would be occupied? Would that also be silently accepted that quickly?


Demonstrations for the matter would abroad be arranged by our own country's immigrants. Giving back stolen land would not become an international movement. The invasion would just take place and we would let it take place, because Russia's bordering countries and former soviet-countries are mainly small nations never visited by the majority of Western citizens, only a few of them could even find these countries from a map. It's difficult to lose your sleep over these kind of countries, and after the news about Crimea disappeared from the local papers the matter is accepted by forgetting it and the media moves on to the next hot topic, the next troops movements, the next diplomatic speaches etc. in a nano-second.


How other countries reacted to the occupation in Crimea is a message to the rest of us, us who live next to Russia and in East-Europe.


What has not been asked is what or who Russia has attacked since Putin's rise to power.


That nation is the human mind. The western set of values, the western mind and the western values. Putin's clique has attacked those for a long long time and they have succeeded in molding the western mentality the way they want.


Return to Militarism


When Putin came into power his first regulations were giving immunity to the former president Boris Jeltsin, a new military doctine, restoring the obligatory military training (which was mandatory after the Perestroika), adding defense expenses with 50 %, a law which allows specific persons to conceal information. Putin's first regulations weren't about enforcing the democracy system or improving the population's conditions who were sinking into poverty. His regulations were about militarizating Russia. In spite of that the western leaders concentrated on praising Russia's path to democracy.


During the first two presidential seasons Putin made 11 regulations, 6 of them concerned the military forces. Now 25 % of the nation's budget goes to the army, during the next two years 33 %. These days at least 70 % of the upper governmental officers belong to FSB, at least 200 000 are known to work in FSB.


Putin's rise to power didn't just meant a new leader for the nation, it meant changing the government system and this new system's character was visible already back then. That's when they also dug up Stalin, who had been banned after his death in 1953. The rehabilitation of this dictator started with Putin's elections. One of Putin's slogans were "Young Stalin". Russia got a face of a KGB-agent in the third generation, who started to put his old KGB-friends into significant positions.


When Kreml started to invest in the media, the western media outlet's were in a crisis.


Western media shut their offices in Moscow, reporters were called home. The west didn't think Russia was so important that they needed their own reporter there, and no attention was paid to the diversity of Russia's media-frontier's grouping, although for Russia's own independent journalists their profession had turned into a suicidial one.


War of images


The Russian news agencies had their budget tripled during a time when Russia's economy was in recession. In 2005 they created RT TV-channel, Russia Today, which turned out to be successful, their airings are followed in 100 countries and hotels in many countries have the channel in their selection. Western PR-offices like Ketchum, Gplus and Portland PR were recruited to make sure that the messages Kreml wanted to send out went through without anyone being able to track the background connections. In addition to PR-offices, MSM and outright propaganda, Moscow networked with the far-right and conservatives in the west.


Year 2011 Russia spent 1,3 Billion Dollars on international propaganda - more than on unemployement.


At the moment Russia's citizens are manipulated against the western set of values and understanding of history. Russia has worked for years on the new history policy. A Russian group of historians are creating a new set of text books as we speak and the group is supervised by Sergei Naryskin, a former KGB-officer.


Recently a new alphabet was introduced in Siberia and the intention is to extend it to all schools in Russia. The new alphabet is teaching both letters and values: the positive things are linked to patriotism and Russia and the negative things are linked to the west, Ukraine and Euromaidan. Wikipedia is naturally labelled as CIA:s invention. This way they create an illusion that only the state can offer their people safe and reliable information.


According to polls the majority of citizens accept that the state molds the news if it is in the advantage of the population.


Soon the population will accept even more, because they have cut the education budget significantly. Opposition leader Boris Nemtsov says that Russia's budget amounts are numbers of a country who is preparing for war and oppression.


“Putin doesn't need the intelligentsia or educated people. Those kind of people only ask unnecessary questions and it's more difficult to turn them into zombies", Nemtsov says.


In other words Russia's president loves the stupid, loves people who are battling with their health, loves alcoholics and people with sexual diseases, because the numbers of these miseries are very high in Russia and there is not going to be any changes to those things, because the money isn't channelled into public health, education and infrastructure. The money is channelled to the army and this is justified by the threatening images from the west.


Brainwashing is cheap


Moscow's silovik-clique (editors note: Siloviks are the group ruling in Russia, consisting of people from different security-, order- and defense -organizations) has already understood that Putin should not look for the popularity from the urban Russians, they have language skills and they have seen the world outside Russia. Hence they are concentrating on getting the popularity from conservative and older parts of Russia, the part who swallows easily the propaganda from Russia's state-channels.


This ruling elite has already understood that modernisizing the physical army is a much more expensive project than brainwashing.


This can be done because Russia is for the first time during it's history completely and utterly led by the secret police. During KGB the Party was at least above KGB, now there is no Party. Some Russian researchers think that although for example Juri Andropov was the leader of KGB, he wouldn't even had dreamed of bringing KGB to the government. KGB:s task was to protect the state and government, not be te government itself.


Information is a cheap weapon


Scientific Communism was studied in Soviet Union, in Putin's Russia they are now fuelling Scientific Patriotism.


After Putin came to power propaganda and media-war became an academic science. During last years they have founded several different research centers related to the matter - Russia has 74 research- and scientific centers founded by FSB.


According to an information safety -doctrine from year 2000 a nation's main threats are Russia and their officials who spread disinformation.


The softer use of power is represented by Russkiy Mir -foundation, which was founded in 2007 on Putin's initiative. A year later foreign minister Lavrov announced that Russia's compatriot-policy would be developed by using "soft force" and that Russkiy Mir would be one representation of it. It's task is to challenge western values outside Russia.


Putin's programs from last years aim to neutralize information attacks from the west. From the POV of Moscow's silovik-cliques, Russia has been the target of the west's information attack for years and their own information-frontier is the answer. One has to keep in mind that in Soviet and in Russia they have an ongoing media-war all the time.


The psychological warfare we see nowadays is based on action plans and techniques which were founded during the Soviet-era. They have tested the reaction-techniques back then and saw that they worked well. The new methods are a professional army of trolls who comment on websites and in the social media.


Russian professional actors zigzag from one Ukrainian town to another and have barely time to let the new role's hair dye dry before they are already giving new statements to the media, always expressing their concern over the locals. The media's indications about concentration camps and Nazi-Germany are popular catalogue. Recently Russia's state-channel presented a normal construction camp in Donetsk claiming it was a concentration camp that was being built for Russian speaking people.


The report was accompanied with sinister music and a shower room. TV-journalist Arkady Marmontov's report was aired immediately after Russia's foreign minister gave his statement . The report expressed deep concern over the construction camps which reminded of Nazi concentration camps.


Russia is having a full-scale media-war in every parts of society and their means are clear: Provocation, intimidation, projection and propaganda. Divide, conquer, rule.


This is how history is erased


Those of us who have personal experience of Soviet occupation, we know that even full-scale occupations can be portrayed to the west as a voluntary annexation. We know that the west was filled with people who all imagined that the Soviet Union's collectivization was based upon our citizens free will, and these same people are astonished when they are told that the truth was exactly the opposite.


We know that the spine of our nation, the values, memories and history can be wiped off the map. That's why the stupid propaganda slogans about East-Ukraine don't amuse at all. Those who experienced a Soviet occupation knew that every day was filled with just as stupid propaganda slogans from decade to decade.


Moscow's power-clique has already seen how the west believed in the imitation of democracy. Soviet Union also imitated friendship with countries, although there were many outside Soviet who didn't believe in it but they also pretended in public that the friendship is real.


In Moscow they knew that the west would buy the whole democracy-farce, because the west wants to believe in the most easiest things, which is most practical when thinking of financial relations, despite facts and obvious evidence. In Moscow they were sure that the bluff would work, because the bluffing had worked earlier also.


At the same time East-Europe and Baltic countries have been the target of different aggression for years already, not to mention Georgia, who's direction to the west wasn't in Moscow's liking. These countries have constantly been told how Moscow claims again and again that they are only imaginary nations who don't have the right to independence. Forbidding occupation of Baltic countries have been a clear policy. In 1993 before becoming a president, Putin was arranging a referendum in East Estonian Narva, which has a big russian-speaking population. The intention of the referendum was autonomy.


Narva's referendum didn't however get support from Kreml and it was overthrown as an initiative against Estonia's constitutional law.


In Estonia they have talked for a long time about an info-state, where Russia - and also Estonian-Russians live in, because they follow the Russian media aka the state propaganda. Info-state is a word that should be taken into use in the west also. We saw the consequences of it for example in Estonia's traditional slavic festival (24.5), when the youngsters from Ukraine were attacked by Russian-speaking people. This incident happened in an EU- and Nato-country - Russia's info-state has penetrated here also and some measures should be taken in order to dissolve it.


Time for recognition


One often hears how Russia's actions are explained with global politics and they make it sound almost natural. One of the myths has for example been that Ukraine naturally belongs to Russia, although Kiev existed before Moscow and Ukraine has not always been a part of Russia.


The countries Soviet occupied were non-subjects in Soviet and the "new European" countries haven't been in Europe for long after the iron curtain came down. Soviet had erased the history of these countries from Europe's map and they succeeded in creating a world with illusions where it was "natural" that these countries belonged to Soviet's empire.


A similar colonialism would not be allowed to other former empires anymore. It's completely impossible to imagine that Germany would take land from another country with the explanation that it used to belong to Germany.


So why are other countries allowing Russia's actions when they wouldn't allow it from anyone else? Although the violation of Ukraine's borders have been condemned by nearly everyone, many think that due to the Russian population the occupation of Crimea is more "natural" than for example Russia's hypotethical invasion to an area where there are no Russian-speaking people.


Russia is indirectly allowed to have an imperialistic ideology, which should not occur in the 20th century, because the west didn't recognize Russia's imperialistic features. Yet they talk all the time about Russian experts in the west, who are supposed to be several, and especially Finland has wanted to be a country with tough Russian expertise.


If there are so many Russian experts in the west, then how is it possible that the invasion in Ukraine came as such a big surprise?


KGB in the regime


Russia is run by men who have a KGB-education, they are masters of the human mind and experts at propaganda. They are experts in psychological warfare. They know how the western mind works and they know the narrative formulas for news in the west.


They knew that the west wouldn't be interested in Crimea for a longer time, no matter what would happen there. They count on the west not learning their lessons, because it hasn't learned the lessons earlier either.


The patrionizing approach to the warnings East-European countries try to tell about Russia's politics also tells that western countries have sub-consciously joined the old Russian illusions about East-Europe being the home for some kind of sub-humans, federations of ignorance.


Sometimes the west reacts to the Russia-warnings from East-European and Baltic countries like they would be stories told by traumatized patients. Those who have experienced violence - which is exactly what an occupation is about - are often invalidated, as if they wouldn't have "real" information, only colored and subjective experiences from an oppressive history. The real information comes instead from countries who lack this kind of history. Yet at the same time it would be impossible to imagine that for example the upset of some Jewish organizations for the public use of swastikas would be taken as "holocaust stress".


In the 19th century the story of a dominating evilness is related to Gestapo and Germany, because we persecuted Germany and have seen several movies and read a lot of books about the matter. In the 20th century the story of a dominating evilness is Al-Qaida and Osama Bin Laden in the west.


In this territory the Moscov silovik-clique has acted easily in the West.


They are white men who don't wear sturban, their wives don't wear headscarfs, they wear high heels. They didn't seem to be intimidating in the 20's. The western films have portrayed KGB-agents as funny men who wear fur hats and stand on the Red Square, also books about the Gulag are read much less than the Holocaust-literature.


The occupation that lasted for 50 years also meant that the post-colonial countries first had to reconstruct their past, look for facts and learn a language so that they could tell about all the silenced matters during 50 years. Russia's regime has constantly tried to interfer with this dealing-with-the-past -process and they have for years tried to infiltrate in the neighbouring countries secret services, not to mention how they deleted the files. All this has made it more difficult for East-Europe to transfer matters from their past to the west.


If KGB would have been judged the same way as Gestapo or Al-Quaida, then Moscow's silovik-clique would never had got power.


Former KGB-agents would not run Russia and Russia's new upper class would not be FSB. Because Russia's colonialism hasn't been explained in our school books and because their patterns haven't been broken they didn't recognize Russia's post-modern imperialism when they should have paid attention to the first steps.


May this be an example of how important it is to persecute people who have in the past committed crimes against humanity, as well as recognizing them.


Sofi Oksanen spoke in Legacy of Totaliarism today -seminar on Thursday in Prague.


SOFI OKSANEN



source (https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/lettlandsidannu/PrHePA_d47o)

[Baby Steps]

The documentary 'Putin's Way' is very informative

I could not get it to play for some reason, but well worth watching...

[OnyxKnight]

Unlike the war hawks and neocons in Washington D.C., I believe that Putin certainly does not want a war.
That being said, he is only the lesser of two evils.

Not every aggressor achieves goals by engaging in war and winning it. He can occupy you economically.

[Eram]

The documentary 'Putin's Way' is very informative

I could not get it to play for some reason, but well worth watching...

I can't find it on youtube either, but it can be found on a free streaming movie portal like "alluc"

http://www.alluc.ee/l/frontline-s33e02-putins-way-720p-hdtv-x264-w4f-mkv/k58pcs99

Thanx for the tip :)

[Baby Steps]

I really like Helga Zepp-Larouche's views on this!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1JijKS1Tfs#action=share

http://www.schillerinstitute.org/

[Flash]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BwvMurOiUls


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=883EboRrcLA

Here are the videos, hopefully it is accessible from everywhere

Part of my daughter's family comes from Crimean's tatar background. From Lenine's cleaning of whole ethnic groups, including her dad's genealogy, at the beginning of the communist revolution, to deportations in gulags (that were as bad if not worst than the Nazi concentration camps) and further ethnic cleansing and deportation to gulags under Stalin, the whole history of Russia is one of dictatorships over disctatorships and killings and mostly, of getting rid of your enemies through whole groups cleansings. Add to this a whole set of deeply ingrained corruption at all levels, and you have the best cake for a renewed dictatorship.

I do not see why it would be so different this times around
I would never think that Russia .. or China ... would be the planet's guardians and saviors. Nor ETs by the way.

[Flash]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yY0yOBiz0q4


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eU4LolIzju4


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXzhlXR7EI0


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQXLH7linSc


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74nnE8KSKPQ

As for Crimea, it is true that half of it is and was populated thy Russians, not Ukrainians. The question to ask is why?
When Lenine took power, and later Stalin, they displaced the rich Crimean Tatar farmers who were sent, whole groups, in gulags to die, in order to take their homes and lands.
So yes, afterwards, Crimea was half Russians, the remaining being Ukrainians, some Menonite germans, and very very few tatars.

----------

Now, for all the West detractors, who say that we are brainwashed, and we are, with our communications means being owned by only 6 people, in Russia, the wealth is owned by about 100 people, and the television is own entirely by the state, which is run by an oligarchy of a few men. So tell me which one is the worst brainwasher!! I find it quite similar.

[Baby Steps]

Be realistic about Putin by all means

But please please don’t start falling for some kind of ‘Putin is bad’ narrative, then attacking a country , millions dead, because we perceive their leader to be bad.

Does that sound stupid?

That was the narrative with Saddam Hussain-and look how THAT turned out.

I believe we have a lot to thank him for.

Under Putin, Russia has been Politically stable, despite severe and growing stresses. He still enjoys 70-80% popularity.

Russian strategy in Ukraine and Syria has displayed a sophistication and boldness that is assisting the world to side step the WW3 timeline. CAYCE may have been right. Russia might save us, but it is in ALL OUR HANDS, and demonising leaders or countries is dangerous.

[Flash]

at 6:25min, you will see that Putin uses the same tactics as the Clintons to make and hide money, through charity foundations, the oligarch way, by being paid for protection. Real mafia, all around.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXzhlXR7EI0

[Flash]

Be realistic about Putin by all means

But please please don’t start falling for some kind of ‘Putin is bad’ narrative, then attacking a country , millions dead, because we perceive their leader to be bad.

Does that sound stupid?

That was the narrative with Saddam Hussain-and look how THAT turned out.

I believe we have a lot to thank him for.

Under Putin, Russia has been Politically stable, despite severe and growing stresses. He still enjoys 70-80% popularity.

Russian strategy in Ukraine and Syria has displayed a sophistication and boldness that is assisting the world to side step the WW3 timeline. CAYCE may have been right. Russia might save us, but it is in ALL OUR HANDS, and demonising leaders or countries is dangerous.

Please, do not rely on Cayce to see prophetic goodness in Putin, for heaven sake!

And why, tell me why, the 100 millions death should not be accounted for, as well as history. ARe you telling me that we should remain stupid and unschooled, not being able to look through history to prevent the worst????

I hate being told "does that sound stupid"? for relating Putin to the history of his country. May be you should return the question on yourself.

Don't you understand that you have the same, being played on both side of the world!

And that both side won't mind to destroy the planet and every poor human on it in order to steal from each other to get wealth and power.

And please, read history, again and again and again, including the British one, when it comes to Europe and Russia and China. And read it in many languages, so that you can make out your own mind, all of those being skewed to start with.

[Eram]

Be realistic about Putin by all means

But please please don’t start falling for some kind of ‘Putin is bad’ narrative, then attacking a country , millions dead, because we perceive their leader to be bad.



That's the crux of the matter isn't it?

Every human being should have the right to full self determination in every way, so does every country.
Change has to be self chosen and initiated.
There is much truth in the saying that Every country has the government it deserves (de Maistre).

A child that is allowed to grow up to learn from it's own mistakes has a much higher chance to become a healthy operating adult then a child that is overly protected and gets intervened whenever the parents see a bear on the road.

[Flash]

Be realistic about Putin by all means

But please please don’t start falling for some kind of ‘Putin is bad’ narrative, then attacking a country , millions dead, because we perceive their leader to be bad.




That's the crux of the matter isn't it?

Every human being should have the right to full self determination in every way, so does every country.
Change has to be self chosen and initiated.
There is much truth in the saying that Every country has the government it deserves (de Maistre).

A child that is allowed to grow up to learn from it's own mistakes has a much higher chance to become a healthy operating adult then a child that is overly protected and gets intervened whenever the parents see a bear on the road.

although for a bear on the road, I would get my child out of there. lolllllllllllll

And the bear here maybe Russia, lets the bear on the road to be confronted right?

I do not think that 100 of millions dead could truly be left to their own mean to learn from their mistakes. They died mostly because of the group they were born in. Did they get the government they deserve? Well, if they did, they must have been quite very bad.

You know, a Russian once told me, in Russia, that there were very few true intelligent people left, because the very bright ones would see how it truly was under communism and could not resist but to speak out, and they would immediately be killed. Did those who let it be done deserve their killing government?

Many questions to ask oneself - on one hand, we deserve what we get, as individuals, and mostly as collective, on the other hand, many are under the spell of a few, and I am not sure those many do deserve it.

I would definitlvely lean more towards a world of helping hands and helping countries where acute self interest is of the past.

[Baby Steps]

Sorry Flash if you thought I was calling you stupid!!

Tony Blair justifies illegal aggression against Iraq because Saddam is a brutal dictator. THAT IS MY IDEA OF STUPID.That is what I was referring to.

Regarding history, we all have our views, would you be more on the side of say those, like Churchill, who said that appeasing such people invites trouble?

[Baby Steps]

Be realistic about Putin by all means

But please please don’t start falling for some kind of ‘Putin is bad’ narrative, then attacking a country , millions dead, because we perceive their leader to be bad.



That's the crux of the matter isn't it?

Every human being should have the right to full self determination in every way, so does every country.
Change has to be self chosen and initiated.
There is much truth in the saying that Every country has the government it deserves (de Maistre).

A child that is allowed to grow up to learn from it's own mistakes has a much higher chance to become a healthy operating adult then a child that is overly protected and gets intervened whenever the parents see a bear on the road.

This is very enlightened.
A prosperous and un-molested Russia will build its own democracy and civilisation in its own time scale.

Many there like strong leaders- 'strongmen', I think partly because there is so much corruption there, and so many hostile nations abroad.

[WhiteLove]

Putin is absolutely right, the US withdrawal from the ABM Treaty, was a conscious decision a step away from peace. I also agree with Putin that it is a great threat to world peace when a nuclear super power suddenly takes an offensive position like this.

Putin basically describes some peace worrying offensive moves done in the name of defence and wants the people around the table to wake up to those threats and the dangerous development having unfolded since the exit of the ABM Treaty.

What I would have wanted Putin to add to the message was this: "For world peace, let's start creating a global de-weaponization program with the goal to get rid of all military industrial complexes and their weaponry on a global scale by the end of year..."

https://www.armscontrol.org/act/2002_07-08/abmjul_aug02

[kemo]

Blimey Flash I thought I was the only one on PA that wasn't a Putinista. I think he is a very dangerous man and have done ever since he took office. He is a dictator in all but name - as well as being a gangster, inveterate liar and murderer. There is no rule of law in Russia. No independent media. RT is owned by the Kremlin. Opposition leaders, journalists, human rights activists and lawyers are bumped off by Putin's thugs on a nod. Putin almost certainly gave the order for a number of assassinations including Litvinenko - on British soil. The Dutch investigators of the MH17 attack have identified the Russian unit who shot it down with a buk missile - a buk launcher was even seen in Toez E. Ukraine. That is an act of war. Putin lied when he said there were no Russian troops in Crimea (the 'little green men'). Putin gives money to far right political parties such as the Front National and has a warehouse full of internet trolls whose objective is to undermine the West and Europe in particular. Russian planes constantly test NATO defences and there have been numerous incursions by Russia into the Baltic states.

I've nothing at all against the Russian people and I'm not convinced that Mr Putin is as popular as he seems to be.

I'm quite sure that the West has no territorial designs on Russia whatsoever while the same cannot be said of Russia or at least Mr Putin who believes in a greater Russia and recreating its former spheres of influence - even if that means undermining what are now sovereign states. Deployment of any further weaponery is to be regretted but it doesn't happen in a vacuum. It is a response. Putin is a dictator and warmonger - that's what dictators do to maintain their popularity (apart from brutal suppression of any dissent or opposition of course) - create enemies - start wars. He may succeed. Didn't he say there would be war if Hilary gets elected? Now who is threatening who?

[Baby Steps]

Who could be a Putinista when he does the things that he does?

It's about how to avoid the impending war.
One priority IS to keep a strong defence.(deter agressive voices within Putin's Government-or brain)

Looking back in history, many 'agressors' were triggered by the actions of others-who secretly wished for war.
Among other things I would cite the Japanese oil embargo in 1941.

The Ukraine catastrophe is a similar move by the West- forcing a nation to behave aggressively, and look like the aggressor, when in reality they were provoked and red lines were crossed.

Being against war, or advocating an entente with Russia is not the same as being a Putinista.

The corporate dominated west - governments and armies commanded by corporate interests - have their eyes on resources, including territory, fracking, etc.

Behind the corporate interests are the banking and arms interests who can live with severe destruction (to a higher level that other business types would wish for)

Behind the bankers are a higher group of people who just wish for population reduction, death and mayhem. These are who control the West.

[Ines]

Putin is absolutely right, the US withdrawal from the ABM Treaty, was a conscious decision a step away from peace. I also agree with Putin that it is a great threat to world peace when a nuclear super power suddenly takes an offensive position like this.

Putin basically describes some peace worrying offensive moves done in the name of defence and wants the people around the table to wake up to those threats and the dangerous development having unfolded since the exit of the ABM Treaty.

What I would have wanted Putin to add to the message was this: "For world peace, let's start creating a global de-weaponization program with the goal to get rid of all military industrial complexes and their weaponry on a global scale by the end of year..."

https://www.armscontrol.org/act/2002_07-08/abmjul_aug02

I don´t think this is ever going to happen. Why put it on the back of Putin or any other strong leader in the world for that matter ? everybody knows that the Military Industrial Complex is under control of the RKM (Rotschild Khazarian Mafia)... not in the hands of any Government in the world; there´s so little they can do as to their own "decisions". Not even the Duma or Congress can do nothing about a de-weaponization program, no body can, until other issues are fix. Don´t forget who is "really" in charge of things in the world.

[OnyxKnight]

I can't have sympathy for a country that repeatedly elects rotten politicians. This includes USA, UK but also includes Russia as well. The USA may be putting pressure and subtle threats through their so-called "ambassadors" here in Macedonia (who forced the creation of an unconstitutional prosecution body), and protecting certain criminals and would-be ruling party, but Russia did **** us up real good the previous century. USA, along with Soros, does this **** since 1992. But way back in 1913, after the Balkan War, the Russians gave the green light for the division of my country in few parts, and gave them away to our lovely little neighbours. Luckily we didn't end up like Kurdistan, with no sovereign territory left, but still, this was a cruel crime against an entire population of people.

Here's how Macedonia looked prior to 1913:

http://www.historyofmacedonia.org/MacedonianGreekConflict/images/map_ottoman.jpg

(Under Ottoman Empire occupation)

And here it is how it looked after her "liberation" from the Empire, and subsequent backstabbing by her neighbours and the 'Powers That Be' at the time (mainly Austria-Hungary, UK, Germany and Russia):

http://www.historyofmacedonia.org/MacedonianGreekConflict/images/map_partition.jpg

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9e/Ethnicmacedonia.jpg/735px-Ethnicmacedonia.jpg

So no, I do have to take the history of that country's influence over my people and what kind of legacy they have left with their actions here. Thus, my opinion of USA is not great, my opinion of Germany is not great (they are also behaving like asshole towards us at present too), Austria has improved a bit, but they have long way to go before I can safely say they have let go of their past, Hungary is okay-ish. Russia may not flex their muscles towards us, at the moment at least, but take a look at what they have done with the region. Yes, they used tanks in Crimea. They used economic trojan horse policies everywhere else. Just look into the side effects of signing up to their stupid Gazprom pipeline.

They are not the "good guys". None of these players are. What part of Putin's speech here is making him out to be the savior? The part that he left out where he has more nukes than the USA does? Why didn't he mention that he is willing to disarm himself as well, if all other countries disarm their nukes? If he's so hellbent on saving the damn world? Why look for the thorn in somebody else's eye?

With this kind of tossing the blame ball around left and right between the two biggest players, I can't blame why so many countries, as soon as they become capable, build nuclear weapons. It's the only way these big players will leave you alone, and the only way you can threaten them if they start acting out. he only way to prove you are serious enough about defending yourself. Everything else seems to have no limits to it. They do what they want.

[Baby Steps]

I really like Helga Zepp-Larouche's views on this!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1JijKS1Tfs#action=share

http://www.schillerinstitute.org/

Attached some articles from Helga

[Morbid]

I can't have sympathy for a country that repeatedly elects rotten politicians. This includes USA, UK but also includes Russia as well. The USA may be putting pressure and subtle threats through their so-called "ambassadors" here in Macedonia (who forced the creation of an unconstitutional prosecution body), and protecting certain criminals and would-be ruling party, but Russia did **** us up real good the previous century. USA, along with Soros, does this **** since 1992. But way back in 1913, after the Balkan War, the Russians gave the green light for the division of my country in few parts, and gave them away to our lovely little neighbours. Luckily we didn't end up like Kurdistan, with no sovereign territory left, but still, this was a cruel crime against an entire population of people.

Here's how Macedonia looked prior to 1913:

http://www.historyofmacedonia.org/MacedonianGreekConflict/images/map_ottoman.jpg

(Under Ottoman Empire occupation)

And here it is how it looked after her "liberation" from the Empire, and subsequent backstabbing by her neighbours and the 'Powers That Be' at the time (mainly Austria-Hungary, UK, Germany and Russia):

http://www.historyofmacedonia.org/MacedonianGreekConflict/images/map_partition.jpg

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9e/Ethnicmacedonia.jpg/735px-Ethnicmacedonia.jpg

So no, I do have to take the history of that country's influence over my people and what kind of legacy they have left with their actions here. Thus, my opinion of USA is not great, my opinion of Germany is not great (they are also behaving like asshole towards us at present too), Austria has improved a bit, but they have long way to go before I can safely say they have let go of their past, Hungary is okay-ish. Russia may not flex their muscles towards us, at the moment at least, but take a look at what they have done with the region. Yes, they used tanks in Crimea. They used economic trojan horse policies everywhere else. Just look into the side effects of signing up to their stupid Gazprom pipeline.

They are not the "good guys". None of these players are. What part of Putin's speech here is making him out to be the savior? The part that he left out where he has more nukes than the USA does? Why didn't he mention that he is willing to disarm himself as well, if all other countries disarm their nukes? If he's so hellbent on saving the damn world? Why look for the thorn in somebody else's eye?

With this kind of tossing the blame ball around left and right between the two biggest players, I can't blame why so many countries, as soon as they become capable, build nuclear weapons. It's the only way these big players will leave you alone, and the only way you can threaten them if they start acting out. he only way to prove you are serious enough about defending yourself. Everything else seems to have no limits to it. They do what they want.

may i ask what sort of backstabbing russian empire, soviet union (controlled by western bankers until 30's) or russian federation (still not fully sovereign economically) did in your opinion? also whether you believe that people of yugoslavia were better off being together rather than now being devided? thank you.

[OnyxKnight]

may i ask what sort of backstabbing russian empire, soviet union (controlled by western bankers until 30's) or russian federation (still not fully sovereign economically) did in your opinion? also whether you believe that people of yugoslavia were better off being together rather than now being devided? thank you.

Ask the countries themselves. I'm not PR spokesperson for them. I speak for mine. It's a bit dull to ask what the Russian Federation did to deserve negative reputation. Also interesting to see how you brushed everything else I said, under the rug, just to ask me what they did, at varied incarnations of theselves through history, to others, in terms of backstabbing moves.

Yes, we're better off divided. Nobody asked us, the people, if we wanted to abandon sovereignty to Serbia. They just took us the way one takes take out food from a fast food joint. The map you see above, that territory, unified, should have been sovereign Macedonia. Not a piece of territory to the Ottoman Turks, nor a piece of territory to Yugoslavia.