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Althena
9th September 2016, 13:15
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/content/dam/news/2016/09/08/13412978_10208396111614218_6156866967829747313_n-xlarge_trans++tLiXk9I2QPXgI4Uxb3W8Eeof0VMGKnOSfIlF7A9HT4w.jpg
18-year old girl insulted for wearing shorts in Toulon, southern France.

Two families on a cycle ride in Toulon, southern France, came under violent attack after assailants hurled insults at two female partners for wearing shorts, according to prosecutors.

The attack, carried out by a group of youths from a housing estate in the Mediterranean port town, has sparked claims that parts of France are prey to an Islamist “morality police”.

Two couples with their three children and a friend were on a Sunday afternoon outing on bikes and roller blades when the “incredibly violent” attack took place, according to Var Matin, the local newspaper.

They were passing near the Cité des Oeillets, an estate in eastern Toulon, when a group of adolescents starting insulting the women of the group because of their shorts, including jibes such as: “Dirty whore, get naked.”

When their male partners sought to intervene, a larger group of youths arrived and a fight ensued, according to the Toulon prosecutor; Bernard Marchal.

“The male partners had simply asked them to respect their women and that sparked the fight. The three men were violently beaten on the face in front of their children. This was provocation of a sexual nature with the intention of forcing a reaction out of the men present,” said Mr Marchal.

One of the men was severely beaten and has had to take a month off work, while another had his nose broken. The women were lightly injured and the children suffered from shock.

Thanks to CCTV, police were able to identify and arrest two suspects, aged 17 and 19, and a preliminary investigation has been launched to identify other suspects.

The attack comes a month after an 18-year old girl was spat at and insulted by a group of girls who found her shorts indecent.

Maud Vallet posted a Facebook picture of herself in shock afterwards with the caption: “Hello, I’m a slag”. The post received over 81,000 “likes”, or signs of readers’ anger and sadness over the incident.

She recounted asking her taunters: "Why are you calling me a whore because I'm wearing shorts while a man can walk around the centre of town bare-chested without anyone saying anything?"

She said they replied: "Because you're a woman and should respect yourself, you idiot."

A solidarity “march in shorts” was held in the town.

The attack comes after a summer of tensions over dress codes in France, in which a string of French resort towns banned the burkini, the body-covering swimsuit, on grounds it was against secularism and posed a security threat.

Debate over whether the bans should be upheld has split the French political classes, and sparked uproar abroad, including in Britain.

While there was no proof the shorts attack was ideologically motivated, on Thursday, Céline Pina, a former regional councillor for the Paris area who wrote a book called Guilty Silence, warned of “Islamist violence that is growing everywhere in France against women.”

“The burkini question, the rise of the full veil, the attack on women in shorts and beating up their partners contributes to the same logic, namely to turn a woman’s body into a social and political issue, a litmus test of the advance of an ideology within society," she wrote in Le Figaro.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/09/08/two-families-attacked-in-southern-france-for-women-wearing-short/

Atlas
9th September 2016, 16:32
http://www.greecemedtravel.com.au/filelibrary/images/Products/Tours/Abu-dhabi/sheikh%20zayed%20mosque%20dress%20code.jpg
https://arabspeaking.files.wordpress.com/2014/08/113.png
or...
http://cdn.ebaumsworld.com/mediaFiles/picture/730195/84531567.jpg

Althena
9th September 2016, 16:40
EXCELLENT.
Sans aller jusqu'à imaginer des hommes volontaires pour envahir notre continent, on ne peut s'empêcher de penser que tous les pays islamiques voient d'un bon œil cette marée humaine déferler sur l'Europe, activant de ce fait notre islamisation. Car, peu importe la manière, le seul et unique but, c'est l'islamisation de tous les pays du monde. Pour l'Europe, c'est fait !
Encore quelques années, 5, 10 ans tout au plus ! Il n'y a pas besoin d'être grand visionnaire ou devin pour deviner notre avenir. La question est : nos politiques en ont-ils conscience ?
La réponse est : il faut qu'ils dégagent tous et ....VITE!!!!!!!!!! SUIS-JE LUCIDE !!
Ces "réfugiés" sont à 90 % des hommes jeunes et seuls... où sont les femmes, les enfants? de quoi vivent-elles au pays? A se demander si ces gens ne seraient pas en fait une "armée" visant à la destruction d'un occident mécréant! Pensez-y et dites-moi!!
SUIS-JE LUCIDE
Quand on voit les naufrages face à Lampedusa, je me pose une simple question : pourquoi ces naufragés ne choisissent-il pas d’émigrer vers le Qatar, le Nigeria, l’Arabie Saoudite, le Bahreïn ou le Koweït ? Pourquoi veulent-ils absolument risquer leur vie pour venir en Europe chez les mécréants ? Alors que les pays du Golfe sont riches de leur pétrole et musulmans de surcroit.
À l’heure où nous voyons en boucle sur toutes les chaînes de TV l’appel de l'Unicef concernant la famine dans la corne de l’Afrique, je rappelle à tous que les pays de l'Afrique concernés sont majoritairement musulmans mais que tous ces frères sont en guerre fratricide et se chassent réciproquement, provoquent des famines et se tuent sans état d'âme. Que font les pays voisins musulmans? Le Maroc ? L'Egypte? La Tunisie? RIEN! Et le Croissant Rouge (équivalent de notre Croix-Rouge)... RIEN !
Car c'est à nous de donner... Malgré une dette de 2 000 milliards d'€uros, qui nous oblige à emprunter chaque année... aux pays du Golfe. Avec cette manne, le Golfe persique musulman construit des hôtels de luxe, des cités futuristes et s'achète des avions, des grosses berlines et ouvre des patinoires et pistes de ski dans le désert.
C'est cela la charité de cette religion. Car au lieu que les Emirats arabes ouvrent leur porte-monnaie à leurs coreligionnaires, ils font en sorte que ce soient les ouvriers et classes laborieuses des méchants occidentaux qui ouvrent le leur... pour une compassion envers des inconnus qu’eux-mêmes n'ont pas envers leurs propres frères en religion.
Pendant qu'une grande partie du monde musulman s'enfonce chaque jour un peu plus dans la misère et dans les guerres, pendant que les pays du Golfe ne savent plus comment dépenser leur immense fortune, chaque jour des marées humaines de boats people débarquent en Europe ou se noient en mer, chaque jour des hordes de sauvages s'entre-déchirent dans des guerres au nom de l’Islam ! Femmes, enfants et malades sont systématiquement mis en avant pour mieux déclencher nos réflexes de culpabilisation et de compassion.
Or ces populations musulmanes font plus d’enfants qu’elles n'en pourront nourrir, sauf avec le concours et la manne financière des occidentaux. Cette religion aveugle est en train de déséquilibrer tout l'Occident et le conduit au bord du chaos. Mais est-ce notre faute si l'Islam sans pétrole ne produit que de la misère et des guerres? A méditer s’il en est encore temps!
Faire suivre au moins 1 fois, car seul Internet permet une liberté d'expression qui aille au-delà des miettes d'information d'une Presse aux ordres.

For English: http://www.israel-flash.com/2015/09/un-occidental-en-colere-suis-je-lucide-ou-completement-stupide/

Atlas
9th September 2016, 16:57
Who sent the crusades back in the days? and who is still fighting them right now? How do you think they will respond? These guys are worse than the jews, an eye for an eye also means a country for a country, etc... maybe they already won... In any case, this war is nothing new:

The Battle of Tours (10 October 732) — also called the Battle of Poitiers and, by Arab sources, the Battle of the Palace of the Martyrs (Arabic: معركة بلاط الشهداء‎‎, transliterated as ma'arakat Balâṭ ash-Shuhadâ) — was fought in an area between the cities of Poitiers and Tours, in north-central France, near the village of Moussais-la-Bataille, about 20 kilometres (12 mi) northeast of Poitiers. The location of the battle was close to the border between the Frankish realm and then-independent Aquitaine. The battle pitted Frankish and Burgundian forces under Charles Martel against an army of the Umayyad Caliphate led by 'Abdul Rahman Al Ghafiqi, Governor-General of al-Andalus. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Tours


La réponse est : il faut qu'ils dégagent tous
Try again...
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-9BaYbdq--q0/UI6JmKgYTfI/AAAAAAAAIxw/gDpNCGcrj2g/s1600/Manuel-Histoire-1950-bataille-Poitiers.jpg

See my thread: projectavalon.net/When-the-Crusaders-turn-against-Saladin (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?86957-When-the-Crusaders-turn-against-Saladin)

TargeT
9th September 2016, 17:37
Funny how reading that article i KNEW it was an "islamic" incident, yet they tried SO VERY HARD to never say that...

LIberal media strikes again! (everyone is bad but Muslims, they are innocent even when they attack girls in shorts)

onawah
9th September 2016, 17:45
The End of a Nation – Losing Sweden Forever
http://drsircus.com/world-news/the-end-of-a-nation-losing-sweden-forever/

A pro-government Turkish newspaper placed an ad at Istanbul’s main airport on August 19 warning against travel to Sweden due to alleged high incidences of rape. What is the price Sweden has paid for the massive invasion (by invitation) of Islamic people? According to the Gatestone Institute, “Swedish Sweden will soon be lost forever, and in many areas replaced by a Middle Eastern state of affairs, where different immigrant groups (mainly Muslims) make war on each other as well as on the Swedes.”

Tobais Andersson writes that, “Sweden’s international image is being tarnished by a much darker reputation: as the rape capital of the Western world. The irresponsible policies of Sweden’s leaders have caused years of suffering for Swedish women. By opening the gates to massive immigration from Africa and the Middle East, Swedish politicians have brought cultures and values in strict opposition to ours. Immigrants raised in societies without respect for women, who see women as possessions whose main purpose in life is to please their husband, have no place in our liberal society. Many male immigrants, when faced with our liberal lifestyle and beautiful women, are unable to control themselves.”

“There are two ways to deal with refugees: one is to promote dialogue, and inclusion; the other to be unwelcoming and uncaring. The second has led to disaster before—and in one way or another, is sure to do so again,” concludes Annalisa Merelli. What she fails to understand is that there is no dialogue, no exchange of ideas, no real listening nor desire for Islamic migrants to integrate with the West.

What is invading the west is a religion that is not open for negotiations. When she says uncaring she is very correct, we should not be uncaring like the politicians are being when they continue ignoring the epidemic of rapes at the hands of the migrants. Just recently, we had another episode of mass molestation where 26 women were recently sexually assaulted at German concert, with victims surrounded by mobs of migrant men and groped in copycat attacks like those in Cologne

Local populations would have to be suicidal to bring in hordes of people who have among their numbers rapists and terrorists hell bent on destroying because of the intolerant way their religion treats infidels. And because of the way they were treated when the West invaded their countries and supported the rise of terrorism.

Highway to Hell

Suiciding Western Civilization with massive amounts of Islamic refugees is what is happening. Europe, America and the rest of the world will be plunged into a thousand years of darkness and oppression under Islamic-Fascism if the West is not careful, which it is not being at present. Birthrates have declined all across the West but the Muslims are breeding like rabbits and by that weight alone they will eventually crush the West.

Islam expert Robert Spencer reveals Islam’s ongoing, unshakable quest for global conquest and why the West today faces the same threat as the Crusaders did. Few in the United States or Europe want to face the frightening facts about jihad.

“What was arguably the most important defeat in the history of the Roman Empire had roots in something else: a refugee crisis. The Goths descended toward Roman territory looking for shelter. The mismanagement of Goth refugees started a chain of events that led to the collapse of one of the biggest political and military powers humankind has ever known. It’s a story shockingly similar to what’s happening in Europe right now—and it should serve as a cautionary tale,” writes Annalisa Merelli.

“I live in Europe in Finland and I can feel this continent collapsing.” “Sometimes the brain-dead decision of one person can set off a contagion that sweeps the world. Merkel’s open invitation to the Muslim, pretend refugees has been tearing Europe apart. The majority are not even from Syria. European states will raise their borders and require a passport because so many of these Muslim “refugees” are unaccounted for, especially after the Brussels attack,” writes Armstrong Economics.

“I have more than a few friends in Sweden and privately they confirm everything Mike “Mish” Shedlock says about the inevitable collapse of the Swedish welfare system. I speak Swedish fluently and been working there many years ago. Schools are not functioning due to overflow of young migrants that can’t read or write and couldn’t care less. There are over 50 no-go areas that the police do not want to enter without strong riot troops. The welfare and healthcare systems are imploding,” writes Samijr.Germany’s Rape Epidemic Intensifies

According to the most recent report from the Gatestone Institute sexual violence in Germany has reached epidemic proportions since Chancellor Angela Merkel allowed into the country more than one million mostly male migrants from Africa, Asia and the Middle East that like rape a lot.

Germany’s migrant rape crisis has now spread to cities and towns in all 16 of Germany’s federal states. Germany is effectively under siege; public spaces are becoming increasingly perilous. Police have warned about a potential breakdown of public order this summer, when young male migrants are likely to see women lightly dressed.

During the month of July 2016, hundreds of German women and children were sexually assaulted by migrants (see Appendix). The youngest victim was nine; the oldest, 79. Attacks occurred at beaches, bike trails, cemeteries, discotheques, grocery stores, music festivals, parking garages, playgrounds, schools, shopping malls, taxis, public transportation (buses, trams, intercity express trains and subways), public parks, public squares, public swimming pools and public restrooms. Predators are lurking everywhere; safety nowhere.

Dozens of women and children have been assaulted by migrants at summer festivals and public swimming pools — staples of ordinary German life. Incredibly, the liberals and centralists that are helplessly standing on the sidelines creating awful conditions for the women of Europe. The rising right wings are steadily increasing their threats against existing political order, which refuses to protect the women.

We Needed and Got a Hero at Cologne

The hero of Cologne last New Year’s Eve had to resort to self-defense measures several times over the entire evening to defend “terrified women” who approach him, sometimes in tears, asking for his protection and to just be allowed to stand beside him because of the packs of hyenas who were following and sexually harassing and molesting them. Jurcevic the hero recalled, “Young girls, trembling right in front of me, begging, “Please, please, can we just stand next to you. We fear these people there. They are chasing us.” This was all in front of a great Gothic Cathedral that was also under attack that night. The religion of peace is attacking the Catholic Church and Christians throughout the Middle East and the Pope knows it but insists that Islam is a religion of peace.

Front Page Magazine writes, “Besides acts of sexual and religious terrorism meant to break down German society, the attacks against the women and the cathedral were also a show of Islamic power. Women and religious minorities can be terrorized by Muslim mobs just like in Islamic countries. Their reach is growing.”

"Islamophobia" has been regarded as especially unhelpful, and condemned as a means of silencing those who would warn of the growing hazards of Islamist radicalism, extremism and terrorism. This psychological operative technique is designed to work with Muslims and non-Muslims because both groups suffer terror at the hands of religious madmen.

Long Live Islamophobia

Long live Islamophobia, not as a fear or phobia but as an intense desire to stand up for what is beautiful and right—and that is to stand up for our women. Can anything be clearer? In the context of this essay Islamophobia translates into confronting Islamic rapists with an absolute no that has no fine print.

The famously liberal Swedes are now turning against migrants after being pushed to breaking point in the struggle to cope with the "totally unprecedented" influx of refugees. A new poll is showing that Sweden, which was previously was a welcoming country, has now reached its tolerance limit following months of migrant violence, sexual assaults and the death of asylum worker Alexandra Mezher in January this year.

Rise of the Right for Good Reason

The hard right is rising fast because they are the only ones with the guts to deal fairly with the Islamic refugee problem. Recently we had more corroborated accounts of how the Islamic State turns refugee women into sex slaves using them as human currency to attract and reward fighters in Libya. It is the same blueprint of abuse it employed on Yazidi women in Syria and Iraq.

There are many politicians who do not seem to care what happens to women; even Hilary Clinton is ready, like Obama, to invite more Muslims to America. Rape is a grave crime that our race has not been able to seriously address, and part of the reason is that sexual violence is sourced in the world’s great religions. The world’s religions were founded by men who felt that the fairer sex were not equal, and that certain sex crimes are punishable by death.

Eventually the human race will have to face the truth about religion; the violence of Islam will force us to. The present Pope does not want to see the truth so goes around preaching that Islam is a religion of peace and ignores what is happening to Christians in Muslim countries. Others are making so much money, and enjoy the show like the Roman emperors of old did, that they thrive on the violence and insanity.

Sexual Warfare

Orlando is Islam “in its truest form,” said Pamela Geller. “Muhammad said that gays must be killed. Muhammad is the supreme example whom all Muslims must obey. So killing gays is indeed the faith itself.” Christianity and Judaism have managed to reform themselves despite violent references to sexual practices in the Old Testament but the Islamic faith is not open to any kind of reformation of its beliefs. Though there are hundreds of millions of moderate Muslims the radicals are sweeping the world in an expansion of Islamic fundamentalism with its take no prisoners (unless they make good sex slaves) approach.

Islamic fundamentalists are taking the abuse of women to a new level that should not be taken lightly, which they are by liberals who are simply terrible at dealing honestly with this subject. They turn their backs, women are raped, and that is just the way it is to the liberal mind which has become tolerant of the intolerable.

A five year old girl was at the Fawnbrook apartment buildings in Idaho where both her parents and grandmother reside. She was playing in between those two apartment units when 3 boys (from 2 Syrian refugee families, ages 8, 10, 13) pulled a knife on her, held it to her throat, forced her into the laundry unit, stripped her naked, raped, and urinated on her. The 13 year old “coached” the younger boys as he videoed. Due to age restraint the boys could not ejaculate but did urinate on her. Father of this older boy was reported to high five his son.

I did not see this on any major news channel nor have I seen any reporting of the Islamic rape epidemic in Europe nor do we read about the epidemic rape of children in Islamic Turkey. These past few years we have been getting a close up look at what men are capable of when their minds are inflamed by a religion such as Islam. Perhaps we Westerners are not that much more civilized and in some respects we are worse but at least we do not gather in groups with the objective of assaulting and making slaves of women.

To Be Fair

Islam does not hold a monopoly on sexual violence though it is manifesting in new ways never seen before in the west. Rape is more acceptable to Muslim men so it is possible for men to gather in mass to do their raping. Of course the west has its share of gang rape but never has it been in large organized groups that gather for destructive purpose. For them it’s a justifiable form of violence against infidels so their religion even juices them up and urges them on. Non-Muslim men know rape is wrong but do it anyway, bad people tend to enjoy being bad with no justification needed.

However, to be fair, women in Mexico are being tortured by officials at every level of law enforcement, according to a report released by Amnesty International. Violent threats, aggressive groping, severe beating, gross genital trauma and rape are all tactics Mexican law enforcement officers use, with "almost absolutely impunity," to extract confessions.

Too many Catholic priests also show us how perverted non-Muslims can be. Though they cause a lot of pain they are not threatening a way of life. They are unfortunately a part of the West we need to protect whether they deserve it or not.

We are who we are in the West, though we could be so much better—much more humane. However, when we look at ISIS and other extreme Islamic fundamentalists it is easy to conclude that they are a throwback to the Dark Ages a place we just cannot go back to. Islam is offensive to women in general and this was again put on display recently when women were depicted as witches and demons in Palestinian school textbooks.

So men have to be real men and protect the women and children from a future too horrible to contemplate. Though most Muslims have as much distaste for radical Islam as Westerners do they cannot control or confront what is wrong with their religion.

We are all going to pay a great price and there is little to nothing we can do about that. But what we can do is protect the women and children and make that our guiding light. Though we know this is an impossible task for our present crop of politicians it is not going to be too difficult for the rising right.

In a passionate speech Marine Le Pen, the leader of the anti-immigration group, kicked off her presidential campaign in France, promising she would crush radical Islam and terrorist acts. The alternative is to let them continue to rape Western women, which is what the present crop of politicians are doing. That is why they will not stay in power much longer as people all over Europe wake up to what is going on.

Carmody
9th September 2016, 17:54
This was designed from the beginning ----- to come to a boil and explode.

Atlas
9th September 2016, 18:17
Islam does not hold a monopoly on sexual violence [...]
Obama - Islam is a religion of Peace !
ulZW6cJ56d8
Islam - The Religion Of Peace?
sb7lhUNqHsg

DNA
9th September 2016, 18:25
This was designed from the beginning ----- to come to a boil and explode.


I agree.
I think this is all a recipe with the end result being a one world religion and a one world government.
The western world is to be destroyed from within first.

Atlas
9th September 2016, 18:34
George W. Bush: "Let me quote from the Quran itself":
9_ZoroJdVnA

Zampano
9th September 2016, 20:47
Dear Althena!
Over the months your threads/posts on the refugee situation are very one-sided. It seems you only pick the bad news and post it here to increase the fear mongering, which is nicely done by cheap mainstream media too. I would really love to invite you to come over to Europe and see different integration projects. Of course, there are problems which have to be solved-instead of pointing the finger to the bad Islam people (some of them even arent Muslim). I have no intention to derail this thread, but just give everyone here another picture.

Stupid people you can find everywhere...no matter what nationality, religion, social standard, skin colour,...

Maybe the whole situation is/was designed, but that doesnt mean, that we cannot change the outcome. Call me naive, but I believe in that.

I wrote the essence of some articles down:

The tragic earthquake in Italy: Refugees know what suffering is and from all arround Italy some of them donated their pocket money (€ 2,50 per day) as a symbolic gesture of solidarity (own decision). It doesnt matter if it is for screws or a diaper. Many from the region came to the earthquake scene and offered their help.

Wildfire in Calgary (Canada): Syrian refugees donating the little money they have for hygenie items.

Austria: Local Mosque cooking for new refugees, because the government (poorly prepared on purpose) did a bad job. Situtation now: Refugees are growing vegetables and give it to market to socially disadvantaged locals. Humans helping humans.
After mudflow, refugees help to remove the mud-not taking money for it.

Germany: Refugee finds 50.000 Euro at a donated cupboard at a secret shelf and returns it to the police (plus another 100.000 in bank books).
2 Syrian refugees helped badly injured extreme right wing politican out of the car after the accident. (Oooh, the irony)

There are a lot of smaller projects all over, where young refugees help in projects (voluntarly)...keeping the park clean and tidy, planting trees, cooking for the neighbours, interpreter and language teaching. And whatever they studied or learned in their countries of origin.

Instead of seeing them as a threat, we should give our best to integrate them here, because me personal, can see a lot of potential.
It is a complex situation and I condemn the bad things happening.

Without volunteers in society (not only in the refugee situation), social responsible "living together" cannot happen. When politics fail, real people are coming together and find solutions to create a better world. One more step to take the power away from this power structure we are trapped in. As sad as it sounds.

bluestflame
9th September 2016, 21:11
still a chance to fix this , it's not gunna be easy, pretty or without a whole lotta ****


i guess the elite got the kickstart they wanted , now self preservation programs kick in both sides

Althena
9th September 2016, 22:44
Dear Althena!
Over the months your threads/posts on the refugee situation are very one-sided. It seems you only pick the bad news and post it here to increase the fear mongering, which is nicely done by cheap mainstream media too. I would really love to invite you to come over to Europe and see different integration projects. Of course, there are problems which have to be solved-instead of pointing the finger to the bad Islam people (some of them even arent Muslim). I have no intention to derail this thread, but just give everyone here another picture.

Stupid people you can find everywhere...no matter what nationality, religion, social standard, skin colour,...

Maybe the whole situation is/was designed, but that doesnt mean, that we cannot change the outcome. Call me naive, but I believe in that.

I wrote the essence of some articles down:

The tragic earthquake in Italy: Refugees know what suffering is and from all arround Italy some of them donated their pocket money (€ 2,50 per day) as a symbolic gesture of solidarity (own decision). It doesnt matter if it is for screws or a diaper. Many from the region came to the earthquake scene and offered their help.

Wildfire in Calgary (Canada): Syrian refugees donating the little money they have for hygenie items.

Austria: Local Mosque cooking for new refugees, because the government (poorly prepared on purpose) did a bad job. Situtation now: Refugees are growing vegetables and give it to market to socially disadvantaged locals. Humans helping humans.
After mudflow, refugees help to remove the mud-not taking money for it.

Germany: Refugee finds 50.000 Euro at a donated cupboard at a secret shelf and returns it to the police (plus another 100.000 in bank books).
2 Syrian refugees helped badly injured extreme right wing politican out of the car after the accident. (Oooh, the irony)

There are a lot of smaller projects all over, where young refugees help in projects (voluntarly)...keeping the park clean and tidy, planting trees, cooking for the neighbours, interpreter and language teaching. And whatever they studied or learned in their countries of origin.

Instead of seeing them as a threat, we should give our best to integrate them here, because me personal, can see a lot of potential.
It is a complex situation and I condemn the bad things happening.

Without volunteers in society (not only in the refugee situation), social responsible "living together" cannot happen. When politics fail, real people are coming together and find solutions to create a better world. One more step to take the power away from this power structure we are trapped in. As sad as it sounds.

Dear Zamapano,

I'm not going to stop posting threads about what's really going on because it's out of control. The MSM doesn't want to tell us about it and are constantly hiding the mass rape, pedophilia, crimes and other atrocities that are happening in the E.U. specially in Sweden. It is up to us to open peoples' eyes and to share in the alternative media world what's REALLY going on in Europe to the ones that can't or won't see in order to stay cozy and warm in their safe space and comfort blankey.

And as for the good "deeds" that a 1% of the "refugees" made that you stated I can post thousands of horrible deeds that they're committing on a daily basis in Western society but I choose not to because I'd be here all day. Drinking the Kool-Aid is not an option anymore.

Like T said, liberal media at it again and avoiding stating where these punks are from( not surprising). This PC bull has got to stop, this is the reason why they're getting away with this crap, no one wants to complain about the refugees and how they're destroying your culture and if you do raise your voice, Heaven forbid you're racist.

P.S. I lived in many countries in Europe in the nineties and I don't remember it EVER being so bad as it is now, what a coincidence. Whether this invasion was designed and orchestrated from the beginning it is now irrelevant. I hope nothing like this attack happens to anyone you love in YOUR LAND because if it did I think you'd be changing your tune real fast.

PurpleLama
10th September 2016, 02:00
And Soros giggles with glee....

markoid
10th September 2016, 03:29
If there are any German members reading this thread, please chime and tell of your own experiences of this actually happening at the rate that the media is claiming that it is.
I have a few German friends that go back home each year and the 4 that I have asked about all this unrest since the major influx of refugees, have said they did not hear or notice anything of the sort.

Iloveyou
10th September 2016, 09:37
I'm so tired of reading this sort of posts here, though I always click on a new title in a kind of disbelief . . actually again. This time I step in to thank Zampano for that one.



. . maybe the whole situation is/was designed, but that doesnt mean, that we cannot change the outcome . .

I wished that there was a clear defined enemy (like Muslims, Islam f. e.) visible for all of the population and acting openly, so it would be easy to get rid of it. The 'Islamic threat', the orchestrated 'refugee crisis' is the symptom, not the disease itself (symptoms, side effects caused by a vaccination perhaps, to stick with the metaphor).

I admit that there is an issue regarding criminality and certain very small groups among (male) refugees. It could be addressed at an appropriate level, without generalisation.



" . . constantly hiding the mass rape, pedophilia, crimes and other atrocities that are happening in the E.U. specially in Sweden."


The media constantly hiding it does mean it happens "constantly"? Vague and manipulative.



"I can post thousands of horrible deeds that they're committing on a daily basis . ."


For sure there are websites where all this is listed meticulously.



It is up to us to open peoples eyes and to share in the alternative media world what's REALLY going on in Europe to the ones that can't or won't see in order to stay cozy and warm . .

In fact in Austria and (I don't know if to the same extent) in Germany, a quite large portion of the population is 'aware' of this 'out-of-control' situation and the 'daily existential threat'. They're in fear, panic, utter hatred and more than ready to act against it (just someone tell them how and give the GO-signal) . . they've been woken up by the yellow press!


Whether this invasion was designed and orchestrated from the beginning it is now irrelevant.

Dangerous statement. On the contrary. Whether it has been planned or not (I think yes), by whom, how it is carried out and by what means - is most essential.

Sorry, Althena, for slipping into a sarcastic or annoyed tone at times and for jumping in like pawlow's dog :happy dog: I strongly do believe communication IS possible among people with the most contrasting views.

Tangri
10th September 2016, 09:47
This was designed from the beginning ----- to come to a boil and explode.

I clicked the thanks button but when I see the other thankers' name who will never be agree with my view, I start to think you may not saying what I thought you were implying. :confused:

Hervé
10th September 2016, 12:23
Toulon: les femmes agressées ne portaient pas de shorts (http://www.bfmtv.com/societe/toulon-les-femmes-agressees-ne-portaient-pas-de-shorts-1035148.html)

09/09/2016 à 12h18

Dimanche dernier, une bagarre a éclaté à Toulon opposant deux couples, un de leur proche et des jeunes. On a d'abord cru que celle-ci avait eu lieu car les agresseurs reprochaient aux femmes d'être en shorts. C'est faux, explique aujourd'hui l'une d'elles.

Le 4 septembre, deux couples (http://www.bfmtv.com/societe/toulon-leurs-compagnes-portent-un-short-deux-hommes-agresses-1034313.html) accompagnés de plusieurs enfants et d’un proche se promènent à vélo et rollers à Toulon (Var). Soudain, ils sont abruptement pris à partie par une bande de jeunes. Le ton monte puis les choses dégénèrent rapidement et les jeunes en viennent bientôt aux mains avec les deux hommes. Ceux-ci en sortent particulièrement amochés: l’un, âgé de 33 ans subit des dommages qui lui occasionnent 30 jours d’ITT tandis que l’autre, un des maris âgé pour sa part de 46 ans, se retrouve avec le nez cassé. Depuis, deux des agresseurs présumés, 17 et 19 ans, ont été déférés devant la justice.

Personne ne portait de short
Devant cet accès de violence, on a d’abord cru que la tenue vestimentaire des deux femmes était à l’origine de l’altercation: les shorts qu’elles auraient portés excitant soi-disant la colère de jeunes les jugeant indécents. Sauf que, selon l’une des femmes impliquées, Marie, citée par Var-Matin (http://www.nicematin.com/faits-divers/familles-agressees-cetait-purement-gratuit-et-nos-tenues-ne-sont-pas-en-cause-76563), il n’a jamais été question de short. Pour la bonne et simple raison que personne, d’après elle, n’en portait:
"Nous n'étions pas en short. Nous étions en tenue de sport. Un premier jeune nous a mal parlé et puis les choses ont rapidement dégénéré alors que nous étions en famille et avec nos enfants ..."


=====================================

Toulon: insulted women were not wearing shorts (http://www.bfmtv.com/societe/toulon-les-femmes-agressees-ne-portaient-pas-de-shorts-1035148.html)

09/09/2016 at 12:18

Last Sunday, a fight broke out in Toulon between two couples, a close friend and youth. It was initially believed that this had occurred because the attackers accused the women of being in shorts. This is false, says one of them today.

September 4, two couples accompanied by several children and a close friend, on a bike and rollerblades outing in Toulon (Var). Suddenly they were abruptly insulted by a gang of youths. The tone rises and then things escalate quickly and youth soon come to blows with the two men. The latter end up particularly banged up: one, aged 33 suffers damage that cause him 30 days of ITT and the other, one of the husbands, age 46, is left with a broken nose . Since then, two of the alleged attackers, 17 and 19 years, were brought to justice.

Nobody wore shorts
Before this outbreak of violence, first it was believed that the attire of the two women was the cause of the altercation: they would have worn exciting shorts supposedly angering the youths judging them indecent. Except that, according to one of the women involved, Marie, quoted by Var-Matin, there was never any question of shorts. For the simple reason that no one, according to her, was wearing one:

"We were not wearing shorts. We were in sportswear. A young first spoke insultingly and then things quickly escalated in spite of being with family and our children ..."


==============================


Someone's cashing in... with this propaganda wave. Like, you know, "Putin's Missile."


http://image.hnol.net/c/2014-07/18/09/201407180924549851-3353961.jpg

Sierra
10th September 2016, 12:59
Nobody wore shorts
Before this outbreak of violence, first it was believed that the attire of the two women was the cause of the altercation: they would have worn exciting shorts supposedly angering the youths judging them indecent. Except that, according to one of the women involved, Marie, quoted by Var-Matin, there was never any question of shorts. For the simple reason that no one, according to her, was wearing one:

"We were not wearing shorts. We were in sportswear. A young first spoke insultingly and then things quickly escalated in spite of being with family and our children ..."


==============================


Someone's cashing in... with this propaganda wave. Like, you know, "Putin's Missile."




Considering what we read in US mainstream media, I am not the least bit surprised to hear this.

Hatred, and fear are the best forms of loosh available, and the deliberate fostering of hate is a global problem.

We need to wise up.

Althena
10th September 2016, 13:11
Well, maybe now the French family with this new imposed cultural enrichment episode will go out to exercise wearing a full burka, how dare they wear sportswear in France?? Or shorts or bikinis? The attire is not the issue here, let's not try to minimize the real problem here.

The point is that the kids are now traumatized from this experience that they should not have to be put through on their land, FRANCE IS NOT AFGHANISTAN.

Sierra
10th September 2016, 13:16
Well, maybe now the French family with this new imposed cultural enrichment episode will go out to exercise wearing a full burka, how dare they wear sportswear in France?? Or shorts or bikinis? The attire is not the issue here, let's not try to minimize the real problem here.

The point is that the kids are now traumatized from this experience that they should not have to be put through on their land, FRANCE IS NOT AFGHANISTAN.

The point is that traumatization of children to use your example, has been going on in Afghanistan for decades, deliberately so on the part of the first world. Cities, economies, food, shelter, parents and children bombed to rubble.

Reap what you sow. Merkel made sure of that.

Althena
10th September 2016, 13:27
Well, maybe now the French family with this new imposed cultural enrichment episode will go out to exercise wearing a full burka, how dare they wear sportswear in France?? Or shorts or bikinis? The attire is not the issue here, let's not try to minimize the real problem here.

The point is that the kids are now traumatized from this experience that they should not have to be put through on their land, FRANCE IS NOT AFGHANISTAN.

The point is that traumatization of children to use your example, has been going on in Afghanistan for decades, deliberately so on the part of the first world. Cities, economies, food, shelter, parents and children bombed to rubble.

Reap what you sow. Merkel made sure of that.

Agreed, but why should the common folk pay for something their governments decided to do with out their consent?

Sierra
10th September 2016, 13:29
Well, maybe now the French family with this new imposed cultural enrichment episode will go out to exercise wearing a full burka, how dare they wear sportswear in France?? Or shorts or bikinis? The attire is not the issue here, let's not try to minimize the real problem here.

The point is that the kids are now traumatized from this experience that they should not have to be put through on their land, FRANCE IS NOT AFGHANISTAN.

The point is that traumatization of children to use your example, has been going on in Afghanistan for decades, deliberately so on the part of the first world. Cities, economies, food, shelter, parents and children bombed to rubble.

Reap what you sow. Merkel made sure of that.

Agreed, but why should the common folk pay for something their governments decided to do with out their consent?

Now there is the crux of it. The governments, the 1% that set up the scenario in the first place.

Hervé
10th September 2016, 13:58
It goes a bit deeper than that... this is "Mediterranean" country.

What that means is that whether "good" Christian, Muslim or Villager; women - especially when young - who dared to enhance their attributes via makeup or sexy dresses in post-war Europe were instantly labelled "Puta du village" and ostracized by the vast majority of the "village" whether living in Spain, Portugal, Southern France, Italy, Greece... never mind North Africa and the Middle East.

See this post (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?93029-The-Middle-East-and-self-hatred&p=1095111&viewfull=1#post1095111) (<---)

As I wrote earlier, someone is cashing in (or investing) in a certain propaganda... the one that can be associated with terrorism and the submission of European nations.

TargeT
10th September 2016, 15:47
Well, maybe now the French family with this new imposed cultural enrichment episode will go out to exercise wearing a full burka, how dare they wear sportswear in France?? Or shorts or bikinis? The attire is not the issue here, let's not try to minimize the real problem here.

The point is that the kids are now traumatized from this experience that they should not have to be put through on their land, FRANCE IS NOT AFGHANISTAN.

The point is that traumatization of children to use your example, has been going on in Afghanistan for decades, deliberately so on the part of the first world. Cities, economies, food, shelter, parents and children bombed to rubble.

Reap what you sow. Merkel made sure of that.

Don't forget the Afghani them selves... they are BY FAR the largest contributors to their own living conditions. You cannot even start to understand that culture unless you experience it IMO.

I've been there, it's no picnic... The last thing I would want to be is a young boy in Afganistan... you'd have to constantly watch your ass... LITERALLY.


I can't imagine that type of abuse turns out a healthy balanced person.. and then you mix Islam in there...

lake
10th September 2016, 16:04
I've been there, it's no picnic... The last thing I would want to be is a young boy in Afganistan... you'd have to constantly watch your ass... LITERALLY.
.. and then you mix Islam in there...

TargeT....can you tell me that the above is the normal interaction there?
I have no first hand knowledge of the place so cannot define it.......nor do I wish to consider your post as correct!
But I would wish to know truth....so are your words correct for the adult men of Afghanistan?

TargeT
10th September 2016, 16:41
I've been there, it's no picnic... The last thing I would want to be is a young boy in Afganistan... you'd have to constantly watch your ass... LITERALLY.
.. and then you mix Islam in there...

TargeT....can you tell me that the above is the normal interaction there?
I have no first hand knowledge of the place so cannot define it.......nor do I wish to consider your post as correct!
But I would wish to know truth....so are your words correct for the adult men of Afghanistan?

Afghanistan and Iraq...it was VERY common, ever heard the term "man love Thursday?" (that might be exclusive to the military)

We were officially told to ignore it.. but goddamn it's hard to ignore a grown ass man leading a young boy off to a tent (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bacha_bazi)... that eventually quit happening around us (some of us didn't "ignore it" very well) & was just "the men" going off to the tents, which was fine with me.

the mentality there is: women are for breeding, men are for fun.

Contextual example:
I
n a 2013 Vice Media, Inc. documentary titled "This Is What Winning Looks Like", British independent film-maker Ben Anderson describes the systematic kidnapping, sexual enslavement and murder of young men and boys by local security forces in the Afghan city of Sangin. The film depicts several scenes of Anderson along with American military personal describing how difficult it is to work with the Afghan police considering the blatant molestation and rape of local youth. The documentary also contains footage of an American military advisor confronting the then acting Police Chief on the abuse after a young boy is shot in the leg after trying to escape a police barrack. When the Marine suggests that the barracks be searched for children, and that any policeman found to be engaged in pedophilia be arrested and jailed, the high-ranking officer insists what occurs between the security forces and the boys is consensual, saying "[the boys] like being there and giving their asses at night." He went on to claim that this practice was historic and necessary. "If [my commanders] don't **** the asses of those boys, what should they ****? The pussies of their own Grandmothers?"

Lots on the topic if you care to learn more

even a few documentaries
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dancing_Boys_of_Afghanistan

Iloveyou
10th September 2016, 18:12
x4txIXdKK-c

That's terrible, just terrible. Prostitution. Child trafficking. Sex slavery. Worldwide business. Big business exploiting the poorest. Start to look for it in any given city of the world. What difference does it make, if it's boys or girls, young men, women? Why point out Afghanistan? These crimes, this evil have existed in all main religions, all main 'cultures' and societies, for millennia. We would not call all Western cultural- and family traditions satanic because satanism does exist in in our countries.

In the West it's just handled more subtle, at least in public. I only have to look at the true purpose of the commercials and child models of the major fashion chains. It's obvious what kind of clientel is addressed (in Europe).

I (maybe) do understand, you've personally witnessed what was going on around you, that's for sure VERY different from just reading about it. Thank you for making me aware of that, anyway.

AutumnW
10th September 2016, 18:21
Very unfortunately multi-generational cousin marriage is the preferred arrangement in many parts of the Middle East. I am sorry to say this, but when I read about the pedophilia that is rampant in places like Afghanistan, I can't help but think it might be partly a legacy of inbreeding.

And the western world has it's own callous pathologies and idiocy to deal with. Championing the 'rights of women' while bombing the crap out of a region, is so profoundly stupid, I don't even know where to start.

If anything, any country that joined the U.S in its plan to create chaos in the Middle East, for corporate gain, bl**dy well deserves the refugees it gets.

TargeT
10th September 2016, 18:41
What difference does it make, if it's boys or girls, young men, women?

because those boys grow up to be men, and often men who follow Islam, and thus: suicide bombers.... Think about the mentality of these boys, their self worth & self image, they are basically traumatized into the perfect MKultra like victims that can be talked into some pretty crazy **** if you know how to leverage their insecurities etc... I don't know much about that manipulative stuff except that it can be done and the situation in the middle east are WHY we have Pakistani rape gangs, (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotherham_child_sexual_exploitation_scandal) its WHY we have a "migrant" rape crises in Germany right now. (https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/8663/germany-migrants-rape)


I'm not sure if this is a contrived situation, but it certainly is one that is being leveraged, RIGHT NOW, to cause destabilization on a global scale.


I focus on the middle east for that reason, and the fact that it's a UBIQUITOUS phenomenon, pedophilia in the west is limited/shunned; in the middle east it's so common it's not even remarked on & they will openly talk to you about it.

This was said in front of a camera:

"If [my commanders] don't **** the asses of those boys, what should they ****? The pussies of their own Grandmothers?"

You cannot compare the situation there with anywhere else...

AutumnW
10th September 2016, 19:09
Exactly Target, what kind of mentality accounts for the offhand manner this military dude uses to describe a process that is not only emotionally damaging but physically mutilating to a child. It's like a Hell on earth.

The New York Times ran a long article fairly recently about 'boy play'. The U.S had Afgani police secured, all over Afghanistan. They would hunt for children and pretty much kidnap them. One general had a young boy chained to his bed.

The screams of the child could be heard after dark. There was NOTHING that the American military could do about it, at the time, as they had been told to stand down, that it was a 'cultural issue'! Nope--don't think so. Attending a fair, going to the local mosque, cooking traditional food....these are cultural issues.

You obviously know more about it than anybody. And this article and numerous documentaries, attest to your honesty.

AutumnW
10th September 2016, 19:18
A lot of the madness in Pakistan and Afghanistan can be traced directly to large monied interests in Saudi Arabia. Wealthy businessmen fund the madrassas that radicalize young boys. And of course, pedophilia is rampant.

AutumnW
10th September 2016, 19:24
x4txIXdKK-c

That's terrible, just terrible. Prostitution. Child trafficking. Sex slavery. Worldwide business. Big business exploiting the poorest. Start to look for it in any given city of the world. What difference does it make, if it's boys or girls, young men, women? Why point out Afghanistan? These crimes, this evil have existed in all main religions, all main 'cultures' and societies, for millennia. We would not call all Western cultural- and family traditions satanic because satanism does exist in in our countries.

In the West it's just handled more subtle, at least in public. I only have to look at the true purpose of the commercials and child models of the major fashion chains. It's obvious what kind of clientel is addressed (in Europe).

I (maybe) do understand, you've personally witnessed what was going on around you, that's for sure VERY different from just reading about it. Thank you for making me aware of that, anyway.

Yes, all kinds of child abuse happens in the West. Much of it is very damaging and a lot of it falls into our cultural blind spot because it is not as blatant as child rape. Children lose their innocence way too early here and can become jaded and cynical by the time they are in grade school.

Althena
10th September 2016, 19:34
Shouldn't this topic be on the "Hot threads this week" section? It's gotten more replies than other "Hot threads" in that column. Mmmm...

Tangri
11th September 2016, 05:59
Well, maybe now the French family with this new imposed cultural enrichment episode will go out to exercise wearing a full burka, how dare they wear sportswear in France?? Or shorts or bikinis? The attire is not the issue here, let's not try to minimize the real problem here.

The point is that the kids are now traumatized from this experience that they should not have to be put through on their land, FRANCE IS NOT AFGHANISTAN.

" FRANCE IS NOT AFGHANISTAN"

Another deliberately ignorance sample.

Below pics. were taken before Russians and Americans raped the country (AFGHANISTAN) . Again, I feel some Salem breeze here.

TargeT
11th September 2016, 06:17
Below pics. were taken in the brief period between when various countries raped ... AFGHANISTAN


Fixed! (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invasions_of_Afghanistan)

There's a saying out there:
Afghanistan as been refereed to as "the graveyard for empires" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Afghanistan) since LONG before russia OR the usa went in there...

Salem all you want, this place has been a war zone for a millennia.

Tangri
11th September 2016, 22:03
Below pics. were taken in the brief period between when various countries raped ... AFGHANISTAN


Fixed! (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invasions_of_Afghanistan)

There's a saying out there:
Afghanistan as been refereed to as "the graveyard for empires" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Afghanistan) since LONG before russia OR the usa went in there...

Salem all you want, this place has been a war zone for a millennia.

If it makes your conciseness clear lets be it, I can live with SALEM all I want;) I hope all ex Libyan and Iraq troops of Americans will have same clear conciseness , as they didn't contribute too much to make situation more complicated than it was. You killed Taliban, they killed AL Qaeda to make some money for collage funds and world and that countries more safe, eh?.

PS: Salem is a dark page of american history.

Althena
12th September 2016, 00:09
Below pics. were taken in the brief period between when various countries raped ... AFGHANISTAN


Fixed! (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invasions_of_Afghanistan)

There's a saying out there:
Afghanistan as been refereed to as "the graveyard for empires" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Afghanistan) since LONG before russia OR the usa went in there...

Salem all you want, this place has been a war zone for a millennia.

If it makes your conciseness clear lets be it, I can live with SALEM all I want;) I hope all ex Libyan and Iraq troops of Americans will have same clear conciseness , as they didn't contribute too much to make situation more complicated than it was. You killed Taliban, they killed AL Qaeda to make some money for collage funds and world and that countries more safe, eh?.

PS: Salem is a dark page of american history.

First of all calling my statement "another ignorance sample" shows your ignorance in your statement.

Second of all: who the **** are you to judge a soldier like T?

And third of all: go back to school as your writing is dreadful.

I see you're still making friends around here, as one of the members said: I've lost what ever little credibility I had on tangri.

Sound familiar?

Atlas
12th September 2016, 01:03
About dress codes: how disparate?
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/51/fc/1c/51fc1ce0a104304ca36e9a6994839d40.jpg vs http://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/44908464/avalon/divs/tribe.jpg

TargeT
12th September 2016, 01:21
You killed Taliban, they killed AL Qaeda to make some money for collage funds and world and that countries more safe, eh?.

we worked WITH the Taliban (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taliban%27s_rise_to_power) (and very likely helped to (CIA) created them back in the early 90's)

we helped consolidate Taliban power...

I think ignoring the fact that AFG has been invaded and repelled invaders for their entire history is very significant error (this history is also probably the reason why they can repel invaders so efficiently). Nothing we discussed on the 2nd page of this thread started in the 70's 0r 80's (when the US and russia were playing games) these people have been who they are for a long long time.

I certainly think we encouraged this & destabilized the region to keep them exactly in that state (probably for this very current turn of events). I also think that these types of strategies are done far beyond boarders of countries and blaming any individual country is pretty shortsighted & falls in to one of the layers of the multilayered divide and conquer tactic that is used globally.

you commenting on my conscious is pretty irrelevant to the discussion at hand (and one of the worst logical fallacy (Ad hominem) examples I've seen on this forum.. shame on you?) ; if you wan't to go back and forth with someone, pick someone else. I'm giving experience based testimony on a region I spent YEARS of my life in...


you are not providing anything useful to the discussion with this tact.

DNA
12th September 2016, 01:39
What difference does it make, if it's boys or girls, young men, women?

because those boys grow up to be men, and often men who follow Islam, and thus: suicide bombers.... Think about the mentality of these boys, their self worth & self image, they are basically traumatized into the perfect MKultra like victims that can be talked into some pretty crazy **** if you know how to leverage their insecurities etc... I don't know much about that manipulative stuff except that it can be done and the situation in the middle east are WHY we have Pakistani rape gangs, (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotherham_child_sexual_exploitation_scandal) its WHY we have a "migrant" rape crises in Germany right now. (https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/8663/germany-migrants-rape)


I'm not sure if this is a contrived situation, but it certainly is one that is being leveraged, RIGHT NOW, to cause destabilization on a global scale.


I focus on the middle east for that reason, and the fact that it's a UBIQUITOUS phenomenon, pedophilia in the west is limited/shunned; in the middle east it's so common it's not even remarked on & they will openly talk to you about it.

This was said in front of a camera:

"If [my commanders] don't **** the asses of those boys, what should they ****? The pussies of their own Grandmothers?"

You cannot compare the situation there with anywhere else...


TargeT, you are kicking the knowledge hard. It is difficult stuff, but the world needs to understand what goes on.
Amazing job linking the child trauma/abuse to MKULTRA type programming.


It's also just impossible for most of us to understand that this is an accepted cultural practice, not shunned, not underground, it's hard to believe.