Excerpt - Quote from the book 'Advanced Teachings' by Mrs. Endall Beall

[MrsEndallBeall]

To use an analogy, if you are hiking up a
mountain, the person at the top of the mountain has a
better understanding of the mountain and a better view
and can see more than the person still at the base of
the mountain. Just because you think you know the
entire mountain from standing at the bottom and
looking up doesn’t mean that you know the mountain.
The person standing at the top of the mountain will
know more about the mountain because they have the
experience of climbing it and being at the top of it. It
doesn’t mean they are better, smarter, more intelligent,
or more spiritual because they are at the top of the
mountain, it means they have a different and greater
perspective than they had before they climbed the
mountain. It also means they have a greater
understanding of the mountain and a better view than
the person still standing in the foothills that has never
climbed the mountain.

[Flash]

Bill must have a real great perspective with its countless hours of climbing lollllllllllllll

OK' MrsEndalBeall, to me this quote does not seem very advance, you must have some other perspectives to share as well, no??

[MrsEndallBeall]

Yes, but first I wanted to see other people perspective of it as it is. What are your thoughts on it. Why do you feel it doesn't seem to be very advanced?

[greybeard]

MrsEndallBeall

Teaching on what?
Enlightenment---Self Realization--Non-duality.
There are no advance teaching on these that Im aware of.
For me spirituality is finding the answer to the question "Who am I"
It may well be different for you.
Looking forward to your response Mrs
Ch

[animovado]

It also means they have a greater
understanding of the mountain and a better view than
the person still standing in the foothills that has never
climbed the mountain.

I would like to change 'greater' and 'better' into 'different'.
That would be, in my view, an advancement of the anology.
Comparisons are a slippery slope, because even I myself have never climbed the same mountain twice.

[Baby Steps]

The path of growth is like a walk in the park. There is no point bragging 'I got to the band stand, you are still at the duck pond'...

If one thinks one is further along that pathway than another, that should not trigger any feelings of superiority. It may be wrong anyway. To be in service does not mean to teach or rescue. Perhaps giving perspectives if asked.

Once one's presence on the path is recognised, one is drawn to those further along, naturally.

it is the path of life.

[GaelVictor]

I see no advanced teachings in the o.p., the person on top of the mountain only knows the mountain as to the path He has chosen to get to the top; the person below will choose his own path.

If there is one thing the person on top has over the person below is the view of the land below! He has a different perspective on that as he can see far in all directions. so maybe as he climbes down again he will have a better understanding of where or what he really is. Self knowledge is the highest form of knowledge.

[Sueanne47]

Quote that I *love* ~

"Dont **** on the people on the way up - you could meet them on the way down"

Also ~

34424

[RunningDeer]

The title of the thread is: Excerpt - Quote from Advanced Teachings by Mrs. Endall Beall

My understanding is that “Advanced Teachings” is the title of the book. The mountain analogy is one topic of discussion in the OP.


*************

From one perspective, in this moment as I write….and note, it’s always subject to change…like every spot on the mountain, it brings an enriched experience.

From the base, the specialist goes round and round and round, slowly making the way, picking up nuances of mountain experience.

The generalist scales it with fortitude and temperament of a different kind. Up and down, up and down. Numerous mountains of experience.

Different methods matter not. It’s life. Not a race of comparison nor judgment. Each learns lessons custom fit for themselves.

An open mind, an open posture fills and empties with each step. There is no high nor low nor girth.

♡

[Flash]

MrsEndallBeall

Teaching on what?
Enlightenment---Self Realization--Non-duality.
There are no advance teaching on these that Im aware of.
For me spirituality is finding the answer to the question "Who am I"
It may well be different for you.
Looking forward to your response Mrs
Ch

Precisely, this is what I saw too

[Flash]

[QUOTE=greybeard;1106730]MrsEndallBeall

Teaching on what?
Enlightenment---Self Realization--Non-duality.
There are no advance teaching on these that Im aware of.
For me spirituality is finding the answer to the question "Who am I"
It may well be different for you.
Looking forward to your response Mrs
Ch

Precisely, this is what I saw too, like Greybeard

A mountain is a mountain, that you climb through different path, change your point of view depending on the spot you are on, sweat to get on top, climb it twice and realised this is always different anyhow, exercise mind and body while going through it, a mountain is a mountain and will remain for a while for itself and for all.

Seeing the wisdom in this is seeing the wisdom in life anyhow,

So I do not see why it would be an advance teaching.... I would say it is a teaching, one amongst numerous ones, no more, no less. The "advance teachings" are within oneself, whatever there is.

[greybeard]

Mrs I dont think you have done yourself any favors with the way you presented the excerpt in your OP

A little explanation where it came from will help--ie is it from a book you wrote?
Many who frequent the spiritual section here are well read on spiritual matters so you may be preaching to the Choir so to speak.

Anyway, dont be put off--im sure you have something worth while to contribute.

Ch

[conk]

To use an analogy, if you are hiking up a
mountain, the person at the top of the mountain has a
better understanding of the mountain and a better view
and can see more than the person still at the base of
the mountain. Just because you think you know the
entire mountain from standing at the bottom and
looking up doesn’t mean that you know the mountain.
The person standing at the top of the mountain will
know more about the mountain because they have the
experience of climbing it and being at the top of it. It
doesn’t mean they are better, smarter, more intelligent,
or more spiritual because they are at the top of the
mountain, it means they have a different and greater
perspective than they had before they climbed the
mountain. It also means they have a greater
understanding of the mountain and a better view than
the person still standing in the foothills that has never
climbed the mountain.

But they have further to fall if they've climbed the wrong mountain.

[Clear Light]

To use an analogy, if you are hiking up a
mountain, the person at the top of the mountain has a
better understanding of the mountain and a better view
and can see more than the person still at the base of
the mountain. Just because you think you know the
entire mountain from standing at the bottom and
looking up doesn’t mean that you know the mountain.
The person standing at the top of the mountain will
know more about the mountain because they have the
experience of climbing it and being at the top of it. It
doesn’t mean they are better, smarter, more intelligent,
or more spiritual because they are at the top of the
mountain, it means they have a different and greater
perspective than they had before they climbed the
mountain. It also means they have a greater
understanding of the mountain and a better view than
the person still standing in the foothills that has never
climbed the mountain.

Oh, apologies if "I am late to this thread" but having just read it for the first time I was immediately reminded of something similar and perhaps in the same vein as the OP :

Dismount your donkey at the summit

Some places in this world are very hard to climb, and people
use animals. Each person can only ride one, and each animal
might have a different name. The riders go up the trail in dif-
ferent orders, and they discuss their varying opinions about
their experiences. They may even have conflicting opinions:
One traveler may think the trip thrilling, another may find it
terrifying, and a third may find it banal.

At the summit all the travelers stand in the same place. Each
of them has the same chance to view the same vistas. The
donkeys are put to rest and graze; they are not needed any-
more.

We all travel the path of Tao. The donkeys are the various
doctrines that each of us embraces. What does it matter which
doctrine we embrace as long as it leads us to the summit? Your
donkey might be a Zen donkey, mine might be a Tao donkey.
There are Christian, Islamic, Jewish, and even Agnostic don-
keys. All lead to the same place. Why poke fun at others over
the name of their donkey? Aren't you riding one yourself?

We should put aside both the donkeys and our interim ex-
periences once we arrive at the summit. Whether we climbed
in suffering or joy is immaterial; we are there. All religions
have different names for the ways of getting to the holy sum-
mit. Once we reach the summit, we no longer need names,
and we can experience all things directly.

Deng Ming-Dao

[raregem]

Posted by Clearlight.....
Your
donkey might be a Zen donkey, mine might be a Tao donkey.

My donkey refused to climb further...full stop on the side of the mountain....did my donkey just make an azz out of himself ?
No, seriously now...when one stops the climb I perceive one has to reflect and work through a stop gap, clear it first to move onward or upwards.

[MrsEndallBeall]

I felt like sharing the quote because it was an insight I had a long time ago that inspires me every day. I felt the push to post it here because someone else might find inspiration in it as well. This quote is about perceptions and how people tend to make snap judgment and form perceptions without knowing the rest of the story, as illustrated in most of the comments. I realize that not everyone is going to find inspiration in it, but someone somewhere probably will. I didn't put more out there because I'm not trying to push my book and I really didn't have any intention of posting more because the quote in an of itself stands alone. I will say though, please remember that there are many people at this site, and although you personally don't find this advanced someone else might, so give them the opportunity to make that choice for themselves.


Thank you for the comments.

"The only measuring tool that anyone needs to use to measure their own advancing cognition and perceptions is their own levels of perception and cognition on their own
path.

Others we have encountered perceive we are arrogant because of what we share, but that is not the case. We know the viewpoint they hold, not necessarily from their personal perspective, but from the perspective of someone that has already been there where these spiritual beliefs are concerned, done that, embraced it, and grew beyond it. I can say this because early on my path, I did the same thing. As I tore down my belief box and opened myself up to higher cognition and experiences, my perspectives changed because I allowed myself to experience higher awareness by not being so stringent in embracing a belief system or in the idea of what I think I know. I’ve always said that true wisdom is knowing that no matter how much you know, there is always more to learn, and my path has proven that to be true every day.

To use an analogy, if you are hiking up a mountain, the person at the top of the mountain has a better understanding of the mountain and a better view and can see more than the person still at the base of the mountain. Just because you think you know the entire mountain from standing at the bottom and looking up doesn’t mean that you know the mountain. The person standing at the top of the mountain will know more about the mountain because they have the experience of climbing it and being at the top of it. It doesn’t mean they are better, smarter, more intelligent, or more spiritual because they are at the top of the mountain, it means they have a different and greater
perspective than they had before they climbed the mountain. It also means they have a greater understanding of the mountain and a better view than the person still standing in the foothills that has never climbed the mountain. If the person on top of the mountain climbs the mountain again in a year, they will have a different and greater perspective once they reach the top than they had the first time they climbed it.

The way that the ego operates is pretty typical in most people. Although there is a variety of ways the ego will present itself in each person, the ego reactions are typical enough that they are highly predictable. I have shared the above analogy many times in talking to other people and only about 1% of the people agreed with the analogy, the other 99% got pissed off at me, calling me names and accusing me of being an “arrogant b*tch” because I dare think that I am more “enlightened than them”. What is so ironic and tragically funny about their reaction is that this gold nugget of truth (and it is a truth) came to me at a time on my path that I was standing on an ant hill thinking I
was on a mountain. It came to me as I was in the throes of spiritual frustration over concepts that I couldn’t grasp and watching others around me having the understanding that I just couldn’t find. When it came to me I was standing at the foothills too scared to climb the mountain. Egos are always emotionally reactive. When people are talking to each other, egos will always try to place themselves in a certain position of the information presented. The analogy I used above is just an analogy, but it is an analogy where the ego will apply an equation factor. The equation unknown is the person X at the top of the mountain and person Y in the foothills. A spiritual person, not operating from a point of ego is going to understand the analogy at face value and not try to insert itself into any part of the equation or they will insert themselves into both X and
Y as an indicator of their own path. Egos on the other hand inevitably will try to insert themselves and the other person into the equation as an assumed perspective of the other person. I’ve never had one person that got pissed at the analogy put themselves in the X spot. The egos always make the assumption that by me sharing this analogy I am inserting myself in the equation at position X and them into the equation as position Y. Yet it is their own egos perception that puts them in the foothills and not on the mountaintop. The ego will jump to this erroneous conclusion more often than not, especially if it is presented by another person and not just through reading the analogy.

Operating in spirit mode, there isn’t a need for me to tell someone at what point on my path I was at in correlation to the mountain when this insight came into my perceptual awareness, because the truth of it far surpasses any level of perceptual awareness that I have personally experienced. In other words, even though I don’t hold many things as an absolute truth, this one gold nugget has passed the test and has held up as a truth throughout many different levels of perceptual awareness.

The mountain is just an analogy and, truth be told, on the mountain of anyone’s spirit journey, there is no mountaintop it is a continual ascent into perceptual awareness and cognitive advancement."

[Flash]

I felt like sharing the quote because it was an insight I had a long time ago that inspires me every day. I felt the push to post it here because someone else might find inspiration in it as well. This quote is about perceptions and how people tend to make snap judgment and form perceptions without knowing the rest of the story, as illustrated in most of the comments. I realize that not everyone is going to find inspiration in it, but someone somewhere probably will. I didn't put more out there because I'm not trying to push my book and I really didn't have any intention of posting more because the quote in an of itself stands alone. I will say though, please remember that there are many people at this site, and although you personally don't find this advanced someone else might, so give them the opportunity to make that choice for themselves.


Thank you for the comments.

"The only measuring tool that anyone needs to use to measure their own advancing cognition and perceptions is their own levels of perception and cognition on their own
path.

Others we have encountered perceive we are arrogant because of what we share, but that is not the case. We know the viewpoint they hold, not necessarily from their personal perspective, but from the perspective of someone that has already been there where these spiritual beliefs are concerned, done that, embraced it, and grew beyond it. I can say this because early on my path, I did the same thing. As I tore down my belief box and opened myself up to higher cognition and experiences, my perspectives changed because I allowed myself to experience higher awareness by not being so stringent in embracing a belief system or in the idea of what I think I know. I’ve always said that true wisdom is knowing that no matter how much you know, there is always more to learn, and my path has proven that to be true every day.

To use an analogy, if you are hiking up a mountain, the person at the top of the mountain has a better understanding of the mountain and a better view and can see more than the person still at the base of the mountain. Just because you think you know the entire mountain from standing at the bottom and looking up doesn’t mean that you know the mountain. The person standing at the top of the mountain will know more about the mountain because they have the experience of climbing it and being at the top of it. It doesn’t mean they are better, smarter, more intelligent, or more spiritual because they are at the top of the mountain, it means they have a different and greater
perspective than they had before they climbed the mountain. It also means they have a greater understanding of the mountain and a better view than the person still standing in the foothills that has never climbed the mountain. If the person on top of the mountain climbs the mountain again in a year, they will have a different and greater perspective once they reach the top than they had the first time they climbed it.

The way that the ego operates is pretty typical in most people. Although there is a variety of ways the ego will present itself in each person, the ego reactions are typical enough that they are highly predictable. I have shared the above analogy many times in talking to other people and only about 1% of the people agreed with the analogy, the other 99% got pissed off at me, calling me names and accusing me of being an “arrogant b*tch” because I dare think that I am more “enlightened than them”. What is so ironic and tragically funny about their reaction is that this gold nugget of truth (and it is a truth) came to me at a time on my path that I was standing on an ant hill thinking I
was on a mountain. It came to me as I was in the throes of spiritual frustration over concepts that I couldn’t grasp and watching others around me having the understanding that I just couldn’t find. When it came to me I was standing at the foothills too scared to climb the mountain. Egos are always emotionally reactive. When people are talking to each other, egos will always try to place themselves in a certain position of the information presented. The analogy I used above is just an analogy, but it is an analogy where the ego will apply an equation factor. The equation unknown is the person X at the top of the mountain and person Y in the foothills. A spiritual person, not operating from a point of ego is going to understand the analogy at face value and not try to insert itself into any part of the equation or they will insert themselves into both X and
Y as an indicator of their own path. Egos on the other hand inevitably will try to insert themselves and the other person into the equation as an assumed perspective of the other person. I’ve never had one person that got pissed at the analogy put themselves in the X spot. The egos always make the assumption that by me sharing this analogy I am inserting myself in the equation at position X and them into the equation as position Y. Yet it is their own egos perception that puts them in the foothills and not on the mountaintop. The ego will jump to this erroneous conclusion more often than not, especially if it is presented by another person and not just through reading the analogy.

Operating in spirit mode, there isn’t a need for me to tell someone at what point on my path I was at in correlation to the mountain when this insight came into my perceptual awareness, because the truth of it far surpasses any level of perceptual awareness that I have personally experienced. In other words, even though I don’t hold many things as an absolute truth, this one gold nugget has passed the test and has held up as a truth throughout many different levels of perceptual awareness.

The mountain is just an analogy and, truth be told, on the mountain of anyone’s spirit journey, there is no mountaintop it is a continual ascent into perceptual awareness and cognitive advancement."

Good explanations and even good conclusion on the tricks the ego will play, putting you at the top just for giving the analogy, and putting oneself at the bottom of the mountain. Probably true for most.

Therefore, my question here is the following: despite the fact that some could find some help into this mountain analogy, why did you start the thread with it, knowing very well what the ego of most will probably do? Was your intent to have egos show up and maybe create discontent? Was your intent to show us how egos work and see throught ourselves? What was your primary intent with that first post of yours?

You see I believe that intent drives the truth or falsehood (from the heart/light or from the ego).

Because even if the analogy can help some, I still do not see it as advance teaching.

And... you came to the same conclusion as mine in your post above, that:



A mountain is a mountain, that you climb through different path, change your point of view depending on the spot you are on, sweat to get on top, climb it twice and realised this is always different anyhow, exercise mind and body while going through it, a mountain is a mountain and will remain for a while for itself and for all.

Seeing the wisdom in this is seeing the wisdom in life anyhow,

So I do not see why it would be an advance teaching.... I would say it is a teaching, one amongst numerous ones, no more, no less. The "advance teachings" are within oneself, whatever there is.



I do think that your first mountain analogy coupled with the thread title are misleading and ego provoking - not higher spiritual wisdom working, as the intent you seem to say you had (but please correct me if I am wrong). But I would rather ask you, what was your primary intent and why?

[MrsEndallBeall]

As I stated in my reply with the reason I felt compelled to present it "As I stated I felt like sharing the quote because it was an insight I had a long time ago that inspires me every day. I felt the push to post it here because someone else might find inspiration in it as well."

The last time I posted it in a different forum I didn't get the reactions that were presented in here, most people took it at face value and found merit in it. Since this forum presents itself with others that claim to be advance spiritually speaking I figured it would be a safe bet that it would be well received like it had the last time I presented., I honestly didnt think I'd get the comments that it got, so I chose to use it as an opportunity to share the rest of it I've learned from the parts I had in my book. I posted it out there without asking anyone to comment and the quote itself isn't inflammatory in any way. Once the first food critic opinion showed up, I figure I might as well share the whole post. After I saw the rest, definitely.

The book is called Advanced Teachings and it a name that others that read it suggested for the title and I've had more than enough feedback supporting the content has been aptly named. The title doesn't mean that every word in there is advanced, but don't judge a 350 page book on one paragraph as you and others have done. I did't ask anyone to comment and I certianly didn't tell them what to comment, they did that on their own and you see that my observations in the rest were met. That is on them, not me. But it is a prime example of what I talk about in the rest of my book that people make snap decision and form perceptions in the blink of an eye about something. So seeing this in their behavior will show them where to make corrections.

Thanks for responding, but it has been made very clear, this isn't the place for me. The other forum has much more open minded people that have learned to not make snap judgments without knowing more of the information. in other words, they are more advanced than you guys. But thank you for providing me with more example to share when I share this with others.

[Flash]

As I stated in my reply with the reason I felt compelled to present it "As I stated I felt like sharing the quote because it was an insight I had a long time ago that inspires me every day. I felt the push to post it here because someone else might find inspiration in it as well."

The last time I posted it in a different forum I didn't get the reactions that were presented in here, most people took it at face value and found merit in it. Since this forum presents itself with others that claim to be advance spiritually speaking I figured it would be a safe bet that it would be well received like it had the last time I presented., I honestly didnt think I'd get the comments that it got, so I chose to use it as an opportunity to share the rest of it I've learned from the parts I had in my book. I posted it out there without asking anyone to comment and the quote itself isn't inflammatory in any way. Once the first food critic opinion showed up, I figure I might as well share the whole post. After I saw the rest, definitely.

The book is called Advanced Teachings and it a name that others that read it suggested for the title and I've had more than enough feedback supporting the content has been aptly named. The title doesn't mean that every word in there is advanced, but don't judge a 350 page book on one paragraph as you and others have done. I did't ask anyone to comment and I certianly didn't tell them what to comment, they did that on their own and you see that my observations in the rest were met. That is on them, not me. But it is a prime example of what I talk about in the rest of my book that people make snap decision and form perceptions in the blink of an eye about something. So seeing this in their behavior will show them where to make corrections.

Thanks for responding, but it has been made very clear, this isn't the place for me. The other forum has much more open minded people that have learned to not make snap judgments without knowing more of the information. in other words, they are more advanced than you guys. But thank you for providing me with more example to share when I share this with others.

Your last sentence seems to me to show quite advance spiritual ego, the last and most difficult thing to go through before some enlightment (since enlightnment goes step by step, in a progressive fashion).

How can you, for heaven sake, judge people as being "less advance" than on another forum, accusing us of snap judgment, when in fact your are making those snap judgments based on a few posts from some members.

Humility and detachment is one of the trademark of englightment, isn't it?

And then telling us you will use our posts to our detriment when talking to others.

Really....... !!!???

[Baby Steps]

don't give up on us, if we are less advanced, we need you more. ....

[Flash]

Here below, the resume of the content of 2 of your books as listed on amazon.

Wouldn't it have been much more useful to dive right into the topic instead of using an analogy to gage our "spiritual advancement" level here on avalon? Your topic seems interesting, but not the evaluative judgments (my views, not Avalon).

If you ever decide to do so, here on Avalon, dive into the topic, be ready to be as you describe in your book, be ready to have stamina and courage and be able to handle our questioning and challenges when they occur - always in a polite and receptive manner from most members, even often a friendly manner despite the challenges. We are not yes men/women - those can be found elsewhere. We in fact have stamina and courage on average.

Most of the members here have more than a decade of study of religious/ET/political corruption/etc readings, studies, or direct experience. Pretty hard to beat anywhere.

So, instead of escaping, show us stamina and courage and dive into the topic, we will be glad to follow your lead and bring more or different views to your approaches.

Your book having the title : Demystifying the Mystical: Exposing the Myths of the Mystical and the Supernatural by Providing Solutions to the Spirit Path and Human Evolution (The Evolution of Consciousness) (Volume 3)


This third installment of The Evolution of Consciousness series walks the reader through the hard processes required to advance their own cognitive awareness. The book is hard-hitting truth and it is not designed for the timid where spirituality is concerned. If the reader is not totally dedicated to understanding and achieving a higher state of cognitive awareness without the need of mystical or supernatural answers, then this book is not for you. This volume is written strictly for those most serious in understanding spiritual advancement. This book is not written for the spiritual novice, nor is it written for those who want to continue to engage in fanciful ideas of the mystical or magical where spiritual understanding is concerned. This work is for the most serious-minded individuals on their personal spiritual path to higher cognitive awareness. This book offers serious criticisms of the present system of cognition that rules the consciousness of all humanity. The author identifies the root cause of all that ails humanity and he provides workable solutions for those who are totally pragmatic and dedicated in their approach to spiritual understanding. This book is going to anger most readers at some point as the information unfolds, but if one has the stamina and the personal courage to face the information presented, the reader will find what it presents is an invaluable source of information and spiritual tools to help their personal conscious advancement. This book is designed to remove all the mysterious myths of mysticism and the supernatural that permeate all religions and spiritual studies. If the reader feels they can't handle having all these myths exposed, then this book is not for you. It is only for the most courageous of readers because it exposes every myth, even the myths the reader believes about themselves.

below the book having the thread title

In Volume 8 of the Evolution of Consciousness series, Mrs. Beall shares more of her insights in the form of questions and answers that both she and Endall have encountered from others they have worked with over the years as well as questions they have been asked about their Evolution of Consciousness series. This volume gives the reader much to ponder on their individual journey towards the Second Cognition.

quite a lot of books you wrote and certainly a lot of work invovled, why not dive right in it by starting for example to tell us what you mean by Evolution of Consciousness versus cognition? Just an idea on where it could start.

Or start with the gold nugget that stood up through experience.

But up to you...

An extract from one of your book: A Philosophy for the Average Man: An Uncommon Solution for a World Without Common Sense (The Evolution of Human Consciousness) (Volume 1)


"Humanity stands at a crossroad to conscious advancement... into a new type of human being provided it could find the strenght to perform the task.

To achieve this, we will be required to come face to face with the multitude of errors of perception that currently hold our consciousness bound in a repeated pattern of destruction. Our technological have advance.....without us advancing our own conscious awareness may lead to circumstances none of us are willing to face"

Couldn't agree more here with you. This is a starting point for discussion as well if you wish.

[Baby Steps]

I have always liked the mountain analogy

The way it came to me was as follows

It is all about perspective and our natural search for a higher perspective.

1. One starts by saying - if only I had known X or y when I was younger. This progresses to - what would I say to my 18 your old self. That answer has always been ' be bold, believe in yourself, love yourself ' etc. I suppose thinking about it now that might represent an unhelpful judgement of the actual journey taken but bear with me in this exercise.

2. One then thinks 'ah why don't I tap into an 'older me' and seek help.'
The older me probably sends the same loving message.

3. Knowing that time is an illusion, one then makes the leap to tapping into a really advanced me. When I first visualised this, I got a picture of me in Ancient Greek garb, climbing near the top of mount Olympus. That me was sending the same love and reassurance . That me is closer to God, sees more , multi me's, timelines, soul groups, choices etc.

I think the exercise assists with expanding ones own perspective by dialling in to a higher one. It's all the journey to unity, by no means the only way, just dialling in to 'the one' assists with broadening perspective

But taking baby steps in that direction by exploring higher levels or layers of self also seems to be part of our cosmology

[earthadvocate]

A little disappointing from someone who red some of your books, it shows you are not any more advanced than any one in this forum, but I have to admit Mr or Mrs Endall Beall, I thought Mr Endall Beall is the writer of those books? Which I recommend any one to read because it is a very interesting perspective and might be the bottom of the rabbit hole we have been searching all those years, especially 'We are not alone' series, which you need time to read and digest the enormity of it. And Mr Endall Beall you deserve a lot of respect for the tremendous search you have done through the jagged records of our human history.

[Flash]

who are you talking to?

disappointing from someone who read some of your books? Is it about my post? If so, I read none of her books, I just made a google search to see who that forum poster was. And what is the book she mentions. I was curious enough to do this, so that I could try to understand what the poster was talking about. My first acquaintance with this author.

She has a large body of work for sure. Now.... English is not my language nor my culture, I do not see why I should be aware of works written in English or even fully understand English writings. If you addressed me, I do not understand why I should be judged - are we talking spirituality here or not? Good that I at least checked her work, no?

But sincerely, after seeing how much writing this author has, on spirituality, inner development and advancement of humanity mostly, I was surprised at the fast stunt she made here and by her immediate going away after a few posts. I would have expected true patience and potentially love to communicate with a new crowd seeing things maybe a bit differently, but nevertheless intelligently, from the cognitive as well as from the heart side (this is us the members).

It would be interesting to have real discussions, more than a fast stunt of a few posts.


A little disappointing from someone who red some of your books, it shows you are not any more advanced than any one in this forum, but I have to admit Mr or Mrs Endall Beall, I thought Mr Endall Beall is the writer of those books? Which I recommend any one to read because it is a very interesting perspective and might be the bottom of the rabbit hole we have been searching all those years, especially 'We are not alone' series, which you need time to read and digest the enormity of it. And Mr Endall Beall you deserve a lot of respect for the tremendous search you have done through the jagged records of our human history.

[Foxie Loxie]

This has all been most interesting! I have only been on this Forum for a little over a year, but one thing I really like about it is, as members, we are accepting of each other in regard to wherever each one of us might happen to be on The Personal Journey. We try to be helpful to each other, not criticize. We each can look back & see where we have come from & this allows us to be encouraging with each other. As far as I can tell; that is the point of this Forum....to be helpful & share pertinent information, allowing each person to grow at his or her own pace. That is what I have learned from those around me here & I am most grateful! :bearhug:

[greybeard]

Im always surprised at people who make a grandstand post after being here little time.
It makes sense to get a an idea of the level of understanding of those you want to communicate with.
Then you can interact meaningfully on the forum.
Basically if you are "selling" something and that includes a teaching, you have to research your market first.

Ive got my ex business man hat on, Smiling.

Flash Earth advocate was talking of himself being disappointed having read some of the books.

Ch

[Flash]

thanks now I see what Earth Advocate meant - gosh, too early for me in English, on my side of the Atlantic, I was dreaming in French lolllllllllllllll


Im always surprised at people who make a grandstand post after being here little time.
It makes sense to get a an idea of the level of understanding of those you want to communicate with.
Then you can interact meaningfully on the forum.
Basically if you are "selling" something and that includes a teaching, you have to research your market first.

Ive got my ex business man hat on, Smiling.

Flash Earth advocate was talking of himself being disappointed having read some of the books.

Ch

[RunningDeer]

I’m finishing up two of the eleven books I read from the team of Mr. and Mr. Endall Beall and Doug Michaels. I created a thread to introduce some of their concepts. It’s called, Breaking the Chains of the First Cognition (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?93618-Breaking-the-Chains-of-the-First-Cognition&p=1102053&viewfull=1#post1102053).

As stated there:




“A lot of it we’ve heard and read, but they offer a fresh perspective. So far, I’ve gain each time I sit with their material either from dots connected, a greater perspective, or confirmations of something long forgotten.”

I’ve read some of the comments left on the YouTube channel and it was clear those individuals did not take the time to read the material. Honestly, I’d not spent precious time there with back and forth debate. Some aren’t ready to open their minds or step out of their comfort zones.

There are many here that have found their niche and perspective on it all, so the material is not for them. As for myself, I’m at the point that even one kernel of new information is worth it. It’s all become people repeating the same across the internet venues and books. Myself included. I write posts and then not post or delete them because it’s redundant or I’ve stated the obvious.

In short, as long as I continue to clear the fog of this illusionary world, it’s time and money well spent. My objective is the answer gets paired up with the question I ask myself. Until such time, I’m grateful for others’ tools to quell the ego trickster. And boy oh boy, the little one has got tenacity and stealth. I’m happy to report that I’m on to her. She knows it. Often she’ll nod and step out of the drivers seat.

Here’s a sticky in my bathroom I made from the material that had a twist from what I understood. As mentioned, for many of you it’s basic 101 stuff, but there are many just coming into it know.

http://paula.avalonlibrary.net/Dear_God/embedded-ego-habit_zpsq0p3nacg.JPG
♡

[raregem]

Mrs. BeAll

Hope you share more... Me personally ...I get silly to lighten up the situation...but, I take you very serious and appreciate you sharing you works and thoughts.

[animovado]

Mrs EndallBeall,

now that we have dipped our toe into the water and got a glimpse into what you referred to as our ego's, I would like to proceed and see where we can go together.


[...] first I wanted to see other people perspective of it as it is. What are your thoughts on it. [...]

[Cardillac]

this Beall thread is all well and good but we humans continue to be bombarded by advanced sources that want to take away our humanity and turn us into technological robots (transhumanism)-

Mrs. Beall, have you delved into that concept?- it's for real whether any of us feel comfortable with that concept or not- it's truly for real-

Larry

[earthadvocate]

I was not talking about your response Flash but about MrsEndallBeall response, also the one who wrote the books is Endall Beall.

[earthadvocate]

By the way I am a she (hum, herself)

[Flash]

By the way I am a she (hum, herself)

me too................

[noprophet]

Mountain Metaphors:

The whole second half of Aleister Crowley's autobiography is about mountain climbing.

There's also the whole biblical climbing of Mt. Sinai to receive the commandments.

Mount Olympus, where the gods live.

The mountains of Tibet regarded as a mystical place of knowledge.

The Magic Mountain - Thomas Mann (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Magic_Mountain#Magic_and_mountains)

(there's a lot more, but I'm not gonna venture into the K2 stuff.)

[MrsEndallBeall]

I'm not really going to say anything here because there is nothing I can or will say that you won't view by your own ego guage. Just because you "perceive "advance spiritaul ego" doesn't not mean that is what it is, I'd done enough work on my self to understand between ego and ego habits. There is nothing untruthful in my last sentence. I do thank you for responding, but it has been made clear to me that this isn't the place for me. The other forum did have much more truly open minded people that did not make snap judgments without knowing more of the information. Yeah, that was an ego habit with the dig, but I have a trait of mirroring others energies and behaviors back to them when they are thrown at me. But yes I will use these as example when i share with others, thought I won't state your names, because these are the prime examples I talked about in m book so they are examples I can use for teaching.

It is not my fault most of you guys commented in the manner that you did, after all, it's not your faults that you are still under the indoctrinated programming that you aren't aware of. At least seeing how you jumped to conclusions and insulted me you can see where your ego behaviors are so you can work on it. Identifying it is the first step

Remember, your true character is shown in how you treat strangers, wait staff, and animals. I wasn't treated very nicely all for posting a very inspirational quote but whatever.

Good luck with your endeavors, I truly wish you no ill. Good bye

You know

¤=[Post Update]=¤

I know they are trying and no it is not a positive thing in my opinion.

[MrsEndallBeall]

Here below, the resume of the content of 2 of your books as listed on amazon.

Wouldn't it have been much more useful to dive right into the topic instead of using an analogy to gage our "spiritual advancement" level here on avalon? Your topic seems interesting, but not the evaluative judgments (my views, not Avalon).

If you ever decide to do so, here on Avalon, dive into the topic, be ready to be as you describe in your book, be ready to have stamina and courage and be able to handle our questioning and challenges when they occur - always in a polite and receptive manner from most members, even often a friendly manner despite the challenges. We are not yes men/women - those can be found elsewhere. We in fact have stamina and courage on average.

Most of the members here have more than a decade of study of religious/ET/political corruption/etc readings, studies, or direct experience. Pretty hard to beat anywhere.

So, instead of escaping, show us stamina and courage and dive into the topic, we will be glad to follow your lead and bring more or different views to your approaches.

Your book having the title : Demystifying the Mystical: Exposing the Myths of the Mystical and the Supernatural by Providing Solutions to the Spirit Path and Human Evolution (The Evolution of Consciousness) (Volume 3)


This third installment of The Evolution of Consciousness series walks the reader through the hard processes required to advance their own cognitive awareness. The book is hard-hitting truth and it is not designed for the timid where spirituality is concerned. If the reader is not totally dedicated to understanding and achieving a higher state of cognitive awareness without the need of mystical or supernatural answers, then this book is not for you. This volume is written strictly for those most serious in understanding spiritual advancement. This book is not written for the spiritual novice, nor is it written for those who want to continue to engage in fanciful ideas of the mystical or magical where spiritual understanding is concerned. This work is for the most serious-minded individuals on their personal spiritual path to higher cognitive awareness. This book offers serious criticisms of the present system of cognition that rules the consciousness of all humanity. The author identifies the root cause of all that ails humanity and he provides workable solutions for those who are totally pragmatic and dedicated in their approach to spiritual understanding. This book is going to anger most readers at some point as the information unfolds, but if one has the stamina and the personal courage to face the information presented, the reader will find what it presents is an invaluable source of information and spiritual tools to help their personal conscious advancement. This book is designed to remove all the mysterious myths of mysticism and the supernatural that permeate all religions and spiritual studies. If the reader feels they can't handle having all these myths exposed, then this book is not for you. It is only for the most courageous of readers because it exposes every myth, even the myths the reader believes about themselves.

below the book having the thread title

In Volume 8 of the Evolution of Consciousness series, Mrs. Beall shares more of her insights in the form of questions and answers that both she and Endall have encountered from others they have worked with over the years as well as questions they have been asked about their Evolution of Consciousness series. This volume gives the reader much to ponder on their individual journey towards the Second Cognition.

quite a lot of books you wrote and certainly a lot of work invovled, why not dive right in it by starting for example to tell us what you mean by Evolution of Consciousness versus cognition? Just an idea on where it could start.

Or start with the gold nugget that stood up through experience.

But up to you...

An extract from one of your book: A Philosophy for the Average Man: An Uncommon Solution for a World Without Common Sense (The Evolution of Human Consciousness) (Volume 1)


"Humanity stands at a crossroad to conscious advancement... into a new type of human being provided it could find the strenght to perform the task.

To achieve this, we will be required to come face to face with the multitude of errors of perception that currently hold our consciousness bound in a repeated pattern of destruction. Our technological have advance.....without us advancing our own conscious awareness may lead to circumstances none of us are willing to face"

Couldn't agree more here with you. This is a starting point for discussion as well if you wish.

I didn't escape, I went to bed, I also have a day job.

¤=[Post Update]=¤


this Beall thread is all well and good but we humans continue to be bombarded by advanced sources that want to take away our humanity and turn us into technological robots (transhumanism)-

Mrs. Beall, have you delved into that concept?- it's for real whether any of us feel comfortable with that concept or not- it's truly for real-

Larry

Yes I know they are trying to, but it is not a positive thing at all.

[MrsEndallBeall]

who are you talking to?

disappointing from someone who read some of your books? Is it about my post? If so, I read none of her books, I just made a google search to see who that forum poster was. And what is the book she mentions. I was curious enough to do this, so that I could try to understand what the poster was talking about. My first acquaintance with this author.

She has a large body of work for sure. Now.... English is not my language nor my culture, I do not see why I should be aware of works written in English or even fully understand English writings. If you addressed me, I do not understand why I should be judged - are we talking spirituality here or not? Good that I at least checked her work, no?

But sincerely, after seeing how much writing this author has, on spirituality, inner development and advancement of humanity mostly, I was surprised at the fast stunt she made here and by her immediate going away after a few posts. I would have expected true patience and potentially love to communicate with a new crowd seeing things maybe a bit differently, but nevertheless intelligently, from the cognitive as well as from the heart side (this is us the members).

It would be interesting to have real discussions, more than a fast stunt of a few posts.


A little disappointing from someone who red some of your books, it shows you are not any more advanced than any one in this forum, but I have to admit Mr or Mrs Endall Beall, I thought Mr Endall Beall is the writer of those books? Which I recommend any one to read because it is a very interesting perspective and might be the bottom of the rabbit hole we have been searching all those years, especially 'We are not alone' series, which you need time to read and digest the enormity of it. And Mr Endall Beall you deserve a lot of respect for the tremendous search you have done through the jagged records of our human history.

I didn't make a fast stunt of a few posts and leave. I do have a day job and the posts were done late at night and I went to bed, like most people do.

The fact of the matter is most of the commentors were not necessarily nice in their comments to a post that wasn't mean, rude, or offensive. Yet I had people telling me my material isn't advanced and their assumption is that of 1 paragraph out of a 350 page book. More than one person stated the same thing. That is making assumptions, jumping to conclusions, and rooting perspectives without knowing anything. those types of behaviors are typically not one offs. And it was completely typified as spelled out in my book. The widsom that I've learned is to exert energy wisely. If I received that much judgment and flack over a simple inspirational quote, not sure i care to stay around and deal with that kind of drama. Drama is not my thing and I also don't want to be the cause of hostility either. So I bid a farewell, me go and deal with people I know that don't jump to conclusions before they know more of the story and don't criticize what they don't understand. And leave you guys to your divices, if you don't find my work advanced, then there is no point in getting in to it, as I have other things I can be doing as I'm sure you guys do too. I'm not being mean, funny, or a smart-ass, I'm being sincere here, so good luck sorry I bothered everyone.

[MrsEndallBeall]

It's bedtime late here, so tomorrow be a good time for you?

[Flash]

Reread your own post as if someone else was telling it to you. And see how it goes. See.....,
What we say, what we write, what we think, is usually entirrely who we are, in this you are right. Anyone's writing here is who they are, what they tell us is what they are telling themselves about themselves, don't you see. Including you. This is truly the nicest and most ardeous learning one can have, at a given level of development.


We did not answer as you expected, therefore we are to blame for our ignorance. Interesting turn of beliefs. Don't you see? The way I perceived it, is that everyone wrote with whom they are, nothing less, nothing more. Quite genuine in fact.

And it seems that ego responds to ego, here right now, sadly, it is not different here with these kinds of comments than it is in life. In fact, it is life, with all our own paradigms, including yours, very obviously visible with a nake eye, strongly held ones, Mrs. and all of us here.

We have had real teachers - most did not know they were - here come and go, knowing quite well that on this planet right now the Christ would be crucified once again if he was to show up. Yet, they still came around and participated for a while. They are out of the victim beliefs and paradigms, so they could be around without feeling insulted, without telling us we are too indoctrinated for them (whhich we are around real teachers), without atachment to any of these beliefs, you see, or don't you?

I truly wish you good, for the good of all, here or elsewhere. Prefering to avoid the negative form.




I'm not really going to say anything here because there is nothing I can or will say that you won't view by your own ego guage. Just because you "perceive "advance spiritaul ego" doesn't not mean that is what it is, I'd done enough work on my self to understand between ego and ego habits. There is nothing untruthful in my last sentence. I do thank you for responding, but it has been made clear to me that this isn't the place for me. The other forum did have much more truly open minded people that did not make snap judgments without knowing more of the information. Yeah, that was an ego habit with the dig, but I have a trait of mirroring others energies and behaviors back to them when they are thrown at me. But yes I will use these as example when i share with others, thought I won't state your names, because these are the prime examples I talked about in m book so they are examples I can use for teaching.

It is not my fault most of you guys commented in the manner that you did, after all, it's not your faults that you are still under the indoctrinated programming that you aren't aware of. At least seeing how you jumped to conclusions and insulted me you can see where your ego behaviors are so you can work on it. Identifying it is the first step

Remember, your true character is shown in how you treat strangers, wait staff, and animals. I wasn't treated very nicely all for posting a very inspirational quote but whatever.

Good luck with your endeavors, I truly wish you no ill. Good bye

You know

¤=[Post Update]=¤

I know they are trying and no it is not a positive thing in my opinion.

[Flash]

who are you talking to?

I didn't make a fast stunt of a few posts and leave. I do have a day job and the posts were done late at night and I went to bed, like most people do.

The fact of the matter is most of the commentors were not necessarily nice in their comments to a post that wasn't mean, rude, or offensive. Yet I had people telling me my material isn't advanced true, they areand their assumption is that of 1 paragraph out of a 350 page booktrue it is. More than one person stated the same thingtrue. That is making assumptions, jumping to conclusions, and rooting perspectives without knowing anythingtrue. those types of behaviors are typically not one offs. And it was completely typified as spelled out in my book. The widsom that I've learned is to exert energy wiselygood, why not do it then, right now. If I received that much judgment and flack over a simple inspirational quote, not sure i care to stay around and deal with that kind of drama. Drama is not my thing and I also don't want to be the cause of hostility eitheryou will not be given that you openly communicate with an open heart - not only open knowledge, but open heart too. So I bid a farewell, me go and deal with people I know that don't jump to conclusionsthe way I see it, it is rather that you are going to deal with people who go your way, maybe flattering your own ego, spiritual ego, but maybe I am wrong - and we did not do that here, that I would agree before they know more of the story and don't criticize what they don't understandyou came here with a nice quote, asking what we thought. It may not have been to your taste, yet our answers were honest basically. But of course, if it was to teach us not telling us it is a teaching, well, we interpreted as we could with what was given - and sincerely, teachers have to show substance when they are. We are not here to respond to your wishes on the way we will respond, you see. And leave you guys to your divices, if you don't find my work advanced,we have not read it for the most part, how could we find your work anything? our "does not seem advance" were for your quote on your first post, only for that, limited to that. You took it much too far and generalised what you saw based on your own beliefs and expectations. YOu see in us what you project, entirely, completely, creating your own field, don't you see? then there is no point in getting in to it, as I have other things I can be doing as I'm sure you guys do too. I'm not being mean, funny, or a smart-ass, I'm being sincere here, so good luck sorry I bothered everyone.

Well, this is what it is, so good luck as well. No need to be sorry.

[greybeard]

Thinking that spirituality is about being something and becoming that, is a complete misunderstanding.
It has nothing to do with any quality ie being kind though that may happen.

It is purely finding out what you are.
That is the perfect unchanging eternal Self
There is no improving possible--just removal of concepts, misunderstandings, labels, to reveal what is always there.

Thats my current understanding.
Ch

[animovado]

Thinking that spirituality is about being something and becoming that, is a complete misunderstanding.
It has nothing to do with any quality ie being kind though that may happen.[...]
There is no improving possible--just removal of concepts, misunderstandings, labels, to reveal what is always there. [...]


But Chris, why we are here, sharing information?
I believe you answered that above already in a funny way and I like to add, that in my world, I experience some changes as improvement. That this play here can make any sense to me, I have to deal with a certain degree of concepts, labels, conditioning and patterns - in general with thought forms, no matter how very subtle they might be.

I'm very sure that no teaching, philosophy or meditation is capable to prevent us from 'enlightenment'. So I lay down my arms and weaponized wisdoms or unjust mandate to speak for others and create instead spaciousness for cooperation,diversity and exchange.
Wait a minute,...that's Project Avalon, right. Forgot that.....


It's bedtime late here, so tomorrow be a good time for you?

I guess this was adressed at me. So yes, tomorrow, next time, today, right now :bigsmile: -
unlike us, an international forum never sleeps.

[Flash]

So true
For me it is a constant removing of fears, of diverse human archetypes such as the victim, of false beliefs - all hiding in every corner of one's Psyche, on a multilevels/ multidimensional journey

AND

Cleaning the heart to develop its immense presence


Thinking that spirituality is about being something and becoming that, is a complete misunderstanding.
It has nothing to do with any quality ie being kind though that may happen.

It is purely finding out what you are.
That is the perfect unchanging eternal Self
There is no improving possible--just removal of concepts, misunderstandings, labels, to reveal what is always there.

Thats my current understanding.
Ch

[greybeard]

Thinking that spirituality is about being something and becoming that, is a complete misunderstanding.
It has nothing to do with any quality ie being kind though that may happen.[...]
There is no improving possible--just removal of concepts, misunderstandings, labels, to reveal what is always there. [...]


But Chris, why we are here, sharing information?
I believe you answered that above already in a funny way and I like to add, that in my world, I experience some changes as improvement. That this play here can make any sense to me, I have to deal with a certain degree of concepts, labels, conditioning and patterns - in general with thought forms, no matter how very subtle they might be.

I'm very sure that no teaching, philosophy or meditation is capable to prevent us from 'enlightenment'. So I lay down my arms and weaponized wisdoms or unjust mandate to speak for others and create instead spaciousness for cooperation,diversity and exchange.
Wait a minute,...that's Project Avalon, right. Forgot that.....


It's bedtime late here, so tomorrow be a good time for you?

I guess this was adressed at me. So yes, tomorrow, next time, today, right now :bigsmile: -
unlike us, an international forum never sleeps.

There is a balance to all things--be fully in the world but not of it--I suppose sums it up.

Its not necessary to take things personally--takes practice though.

Eckhart Tolle was an eye opener, about labeling.

He suggested to go watch ducks on a pond without dialogue in the head see them as for the first time.

Normal is "Oh yes isnt that lovely --Is that the same ducks I saw yesterday--are they mallards certainly looks like they are. I think one is female one male--the males are more colorful If I remember correctly.

You are no longer seeing the ducks you are in the filing cabinet of the mind--you are no longer there no longer present.

You cant be fully two places at once either you are fully present in the moment or you are in past or future.

What you really are does not need self identification as the one who knows about ducks.

Knowing about has its place.
Self improvement just fine.

When there is an awareness that you are not the body or any label then it frees you up to really enjoy what is.

Ch

[animovado]

Yes, yes Chris.

Sometimes I see doors that aren't there. So whether they're open or closed, does it matter?

[RunningDeer]

http://paula.avalonlibrary.net/Photoshop/iPhone-shake-off_zpsnkuhl7wv.JPG

[Flash]

This was written in 3 inner reflections steps, therefore a work in progress. Hopefully, it will be coherent for the post readers.

These posts of Mrs Endall Beall left me confused. With somewhat of a … sour taste… confused taste, I cannot define it exactly.

I thought everyone of us had commented naively from our point of view (vision), each of us seeing the part of the elephant the other does not see. Which to me is a wonderful way of learning.

But, our answers seem not to be in line with the expectation of Mrs Endall Beall, or did I miss anything?

Mrs Endall Beall has, with her husband, a school it seems. Where they teach the cognition regarding the ego, and how to work it out.
The premises seem good, but the ways left me really confused.

For example, she states in one of her post here on Avalon that she was insulted, while on their site they have a video explaining the ego versus self-image and how “being offended” is a monster of the mind distorting our views and actions (paraphrasing here), a mind virus.

Premises are good, so why the teachers aren’t living by it. I am left with this:
The best way to learn is to teach about what we HAVE TO learn ourselves – the teacher becomes the master of what he teaches, after having taught it for many years, not at the start of his teachings, at that point he is only THE MAIN learner.

As I did while teaching about beliefs for many years, to come to a point where I can detect beliefs right away in others, and now in myself.

Furthermore, as described in their site, when on that site, you are considered to be in a classroom, the learner, and any drift away or different stance on the topic will be thrown out and most probably you with it.

And you will be told you are in first cognition system while they are in the second, and therefore you are not equipped to comprehend yet, the second cognition being worlds apart, literally like another dimension. Which is true, the ego gone lead to another world of being. But, using the excuse of “you are not equipped yet” seems to be ludicrous and borderline manipulative, even if based on reality for some, but certainly not for all.

Mrs Beall came on our forum and did exactly this. Telling us we are not at her level of cognition, therefore not worth riding with.
No consideration for our own forum rules and ways, but transference of hers into ours. Doing exactly what she tell us our ego is doing, not seeing hers at all. This leaves me with true stupefaction.

We have been dismiss, within our own inner growth, with a single movement of her hand. Surprising.

It rings spiritual ego all around and hopefully, I am wrong, but I am left with a feeling of being around a sectarian form of thinking, albeit at a higher level.

A shame, because the basic teachings seem to start on the right premises for development.

Now, I am trying to do like Paula, trying to shake it off – and not completely succeeding.

Anyone can pour in to clarify my confusion? (you may see things in me I do not, in this situation, so you are welcome to tell me).
Well, shake it off Flash!!!

----------------
Ok I listened to another videos of theirs, and now I caught what I was feeling. It is sadness.
I have seen many groups / people telling others that they are the right ones, they know, while we do not, etc., that we are not equipped yet, that we should trust them completely because they are equipped, some of those comments/actions were from cults, some were from standard religions, some were from psychotherapies schools, some were from politicians, name it, thousands of them.

When one cannot ask questions or question anything with a genuine attitude, with respect and will to learn, it is not going to go far. The heart seems to be missing in their approach (but I still remain open in case I am wrong here). Talking of cognition alone seems limiting.

It makes me sad, but I know some people will start there, with those kind of teachers, and progress forward later on, and good for them, while others will be stucked for aons. In spiritual ego – I think it may be what I have seen here with the Mrs Beall.

But the great realisation in it is that I now understand deeply the teachings I have had, why it is soooo important to develop the heart abilities first, then practice whatever one’s feel is needed to get the ego to its right place later on.

Heart development does bypass the ego. After that, practicing catching the mind’s viruses is much more efficient. The guide is the heart (love, not emotional love, but the love that goes by itself, automatically, it loves through you). Otherwise, the ego, i.e. the incarnation in 3rd dimension will catch you back, with its multi-levels survival needs.

Thank you Mrs Beall for your interventions allowing me to realised where I should go and how I have to process/feel things, words, people.

[greybeard]

All credit to you Flash--you took the time to check out the videos and website.
Hierarchy is not spiritual its a business model.
Basically you are kept in a system that moves you up grade by grade.
I dont know is that applies to Mrs Endall Beall teachings.

There are plenty of free teaching on the Internet--I like Mooji talks--I feel the love coming out of him.
A good teacher leaves you feeling uplifted and is there to serve you not the other way around.
Not patronizing but sharing.
Meeting you where you stand then moving you on.

Ch

[Bubu]

the case have always been "fools think themselves wise" thus I am very wary of books that seeks to teach spiritually because apparently the authors has enough foolishness to think they know more/ better, otherwise they would not have written the book. So back to. "Our best teacher is our experience and how we interpret it"

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?93973-Q-A-For-beginners-and-advanced

[RunningDeer]

UPDATE: they are so, so, soooo NOT into hierarchy.


***********

Ugh! This ended up being
a hodgepodge post.
http://paula.avalonlibrary.net/smilies/Calz-think.gif

Drats, the thread went wonky. No blame. Sh!t happens. My take is: 1) these days there are a lot of energetics at work to keep us in the finite layers of ones and zeros 2) we’ve made enough progress that ego is fearful of unemployment. S/he’s bringing up a lot of crap and attack.


http://paula.avalonlibrary.net/smilies/ones-zeroes.gifhttp://paula.avalonlibrary.net/smilies/ones-zeroes2.gif

All is not lost. In terms of human dynamics, it’s a lesson of how we may be too quick to point out what’s wrong rather than extending patience to see what each has to offer. It’s a reminder that many of us need a safe space to test the waters over several posts.

Full disclosure(s):

I happened upon the Beall’s material this summer. I kept it to myself for fear of it turning into another Corey Blue, “S” man, Shane, and I forget the rest.

At times, ego got threatened when I read. My mind wandered. There were times, I berated, “Why the *BLEEP* did I purchase this book?” Eleven books later, and 40+ videos watched, it’s because of:

the jewels gleaned
it opened up the space
the useful tools
fresh perspectives
confirmations of what I know
refined, discernment exercise for information I’m not in agreement with (healthy skepticism)


Generally speaking, an aspect of their work teaches one to step out of ego (poor descriptor but it’s taking too long to write this). We think we have stepped out, but even the most dedicated haven’t. The ’collective we’ are locked into our little pieces. The Bealls also remind that we don’t go to sleep in first cognition and wake up in second cognition. It’s a progressive journey. The authors stress that they are regular folks here to share pieces of what they’ve learned. As awareness evolves so does the puzzle that one thought they understood. Now it’s seen as only a small portion of a much larger one. With each changeable state, the bigger picture opens and the intuition flowers. Their work reflects their incremental growth.

In this testy energetic environment, it takes courage to not allow the vulnerable persona and the mind-chatter stop us from sharing our piece of this illusionary theater. I naively believe everyone can share without ego fingers clunking on keyboards. One of the biggest things I’ve learn at Avalon is that my expectations of friends and family have been too harsh. Speaking for myself, it’s tricky to state POVs without the extra-hot salsa. I assert I’ve got work to do with the judgement thang here and on the home turf.

Which reminds me of another sticky-note I made from the EBs material. Judgement is an area I beat myself up over. I never thought of it like this. It freed me up.


http://paula.avalonlibrary.net/Dear_God/judge-or-criticize_zps5kzrfjep.JPG

For the last bunch of years, my journey is more about letting go than data collection. Which I affectionally call green bag it. Yup, knowledge rocks! But sometimes, I use it as a means to hide from the homework of upgrades and/or deletions in beliefs, habits, rituals, healing modalities and life-long meditative practices.

♡

[Bubu]

Post deleted.
Bad timing to add that post
http://avalonlibrary.net/paula/Recovered/garbage-can_zpsgd97ktcu.GIF

One point before stepping out of thread, they are so, so, soooo NOT into hierarchy.

IF you are referring to the author, she has been here and proved what they are into.
mostly we are lost in complexity. I have a simple mind so I prefer to look at simple things. They point to the same thing anyway "so above is below"

Truth dwell in simplicity while deceit hides in complexity.

[MrsEndallBeall]

Actually we do not have a school. I've not read everything you've written here so I'll reserve any comments until I do, it's been a long day. There is a difference in being insulting and feeling offended. Insulted defined "speak to or treat with disrespect or scornful abuse". Offended "resentful or annoyed, typically as a result of a perceived insult". Offense isn't always a product of the ego, the spirit gets offended too by scorn, especially when my motives are from the heart, the difference lies in how the offense is handled in the mind. My offense wasn't that it was me that was disrespected by the comment if is for others with whom I was sharing to inspire. It only bothered me a minute, but I'm not going to harp on this. I will post a response that I put together earlier today, because this thread has giving me much to think about and a lot of insights, I will share some, please take it for what it is worth in the intent with which I give it which is from the heart.

I want to thank everyone that has participated in this thread because I have learned a lot from it  This is going to be a long post so I ask that you consider the information and read it all before forming an opinion. If you have a snap judgment come to mind, please set it aside until you have absorbed the information because this post is not aimed at anyone specifically it is for everyone to consider how or IF it even applies to you.

Who am I? I am nobody as I have explained in my written work. I am just one person sharing insights I’ve had of doing their own internal digging for a while, I am doing so because my spirit feels the push to do so as it is why I am here. My husband prompted me last year to share my insights because they are insights he thought should be shared in collaboration with the work he’s producing so I have put them out to the universe and let them fall where they may. My motivation to share is because someone out there may find inspiration in what I share; I do realize not everyone will. Every observation I share here and in my books were observations I made of myself and my own ego habit behaviors long before I recognized it in others. Does this mean I don’t still carry the habits? No, but at least I can recognize them, accept responsibility for them, and change them.

As for this post, as I explained already in this thread, I felt an intuitive push to post it because the analogy is very inspirational to me. It is the first thing I see in my mind every morning and the reason I get out of bed every day. Although I have a day job and interact with the world at large, my internal focus is on the mountain of my own journey and helping others. Did I know how everyone was going to respond? No. Could I guess? Yes, but I didn’t post it with expectations either way, until minutes later when the first judgmental response took place, then I altered how I planned to proceed with it as I saw this being an opportunity for everyone to learn if they choose to, including myself. I addressed the judgment thing in my book that has this quote and I said we do want you to judge the material, but reading one quote is not enough to form a valid judgment of an entire body of work and to do so, well it is very rude and disrespectful. The other thing I learned from this experience is that information and words are just words; knowledge and realization is truly only in the hands of the receiver and their own perceptions. Is this these the only thing I learned? No.

In the world around us, a lot of people are figuring out how we are controlled and manipulated externally by media and politicians and other forces around us, but how many people realize how their emotions, thoughts, actions, and reactions of their psyche and form are also controlled through classical conditioning from a lifetime of being controlled? People may have gotten mad at me for their reaction to my analogy when I followed up with the observation in my book that was written a year ago, others may have rolled their eyes and moved on without commenting, but the reactions of the individual are 100% internal and ultimately have nothing to do with me, but it has everything to do with them and how they perceive and classify information and experiences in their own mind. If the information itself was inflammatory, everyone would have been inflamed. If me and the way I presented the information were inflammatory, everyone would have been inflamed. The power and expectations, good or bad, ultimately lies in the internal workings of the receiver and they can only change their internal workings by recognizing and consciously altering themselves.

I know politicians and others like to use their influence (their “celebrity” or “authority”) as well as their words, body language, and energy to control and manipulate others to their ideas and will, this is how we have been controlled as a species for thousands of years and this is how we’ve been classically conditioned to react with extreme predictability. Some people may use a cheerleader approach to win people over and some may use fear tactics as their method to control others. I prefer to present my thoughts and experiences neutrally in presentation and energetically because ultimately I’m not important, the information, ideas, and thoughts I share stand or fall on their own merit. This is why I presented the quote as I did, in the manner that I did.

I didn’t come in “yo peeps, listen to me I’m better than you” nor did I come in with pom-poms doing herkies and cartwheels saying “hi everyone I’m Gemma, I wrote a book, the writing is bad but it has great ideas check it out”. I wasn’t making the presentation about me it was about the concept of the quote and nothing else. Yet, look at the focus of those that responded. Some responded with additional thought provoking words, for this I thank you and others well, you can read the thread to see how the others responded or you know how you responded. This isn’t a recrimination or a judgment from me, it is only an observation. If you responded, don’t only look at what you responded in the actual thread, what went on in your head? Was the actual quote the focus of your thoughts, or was the title of my book the focus of your thoughts and judgments? Or was I the focus of your judgements? If I would have presented more information rather than just the quote, your actions or reactions would have been influenced by my participation or preparation of the material. We humans sometimes can’t see our own internal workings until we experience it internally THEN and only then can we analyze it honestly. Humans also tend to be influenced in their likes and dislikes. People tend to put more emphasis on the message if they have emotional feelings of the messenger or completely not listen to good information using the same emotional feelings when they “dislike” someone completely ignoring or disregarding what their intuition is saying about the information. This is not a judgment to any person, only you know if this applies to you or not. For what I share, I don’t want emotions to influence anyone, I want their intuition to feel the message, not me, I’m not important.

Every person is at different levels of perceptual awareness. Perceptual awareness advances as you shift from one perception to another. If you perceive something one way, then have an “ah ha” moment, that is an advancement into greater perceptual awareness. To use another analogy, you hear a knock on your door, you can perceive that there is someone on the other side of the door, barring that you are expecting someone, you will not know WHO is at the door until you look through the peep hole, you can’t perceive through your 5 senses that it is Joe, your next door neighbor. Until you open the door, you can’t perceive that he has a strange dog at his feet. Each of these examples are different perceptions, but which perception gives you the most information? The perception that gives you the most information is the greater perception of the three, so although all perceptions are different, they are not all on the same level to provide insight within the mind. When you apply this internally in how you see things in your mind and alter how you perceive the world around you, that is an advancement. If you root in your perspective, there will be no advancement.

I do not know who is where perceptually speaking on their path, that is only for the individual to determine within themselves. I only know where I am and where I’ve been, I can’t even perceive accurately where I’m going but that doesn’t mean I’m not open for discovery. There were quite a few comments that said the quote was not “advanced”. To them, maybe not, but to someone else it could be the catalyst into greater perceptual awareness, like it is for me every day. So, ask yourself, did I state anywhere in the quote itself that it was advanced? No, the thread subject said “Excerpt from Advanced Teachings by Mrs. Endall Beall”, excerpt by definition is “a portion from text from an artistic or literary sourse” so “Advanced Teachings” being a book or a title of a literary work is implied by the word excerpt. It doesn’t mean everything within the books is going to be advanced for everyone (which I specifically state in the book, by the way). How did commenting “that’s not advanced” enhance the quote for someone else? Did you even consider that there might be someone else out there that might be “AdvanceD” in their perceptions by reading the quote and considering it? The one thing I have learned on my path, that when you work from the heart you do not go to other people's platform and contribute unless you have something positive to add that will help enhance the message for others. If I don't agree with the OP's perception, I'm not going to answer I am going to move along. Now when you come to my platform, I will defend my position sometimes aggressively so and I do explain the reasoning in my books. It's my house I make the rules of the house, if you disagree be respectful or you will be asked to leave with the same respect you showed me. Doing so isn't just being disrespectful to others it is also being disrespectful to other guests as well.

Most of us are intuitive, but this doesn’t mean that ego or ego behavioral habits don’t impede our intuiting where situations or information are concerned and mold our perceptions of our intuitions. Yes, we do carry access to everything we need inside of us, but it doesn’t mean that we properly interpret our intuitions nor does it mean that we can’t benefit from the insights of others to help us over-come our perceptual blinders we’ve been indoctrinated with where information and perceiving the world within us and around us is concerned. How many times have you heard something and thought, I’ve never looked at it that way before…..

All I’m doing in what I present, as with my husband’s work as well, is giving others a different perspective to consider or not. Consideration doesn’t work or benefit anyone if you don’t actually consider it as a possibility and you are free to consider it or not. If you don’t want to or simply refuse to consider it, why bother responding at all? If you have not experienced it and you chose not to consider it, what basis do you have to discount or judge the information or the messenger? This is something that we have encountered so many times that my spirit us just exhausted from trying to help others, which is why I came across whiny in my response to you. Actually no, I was very whiny, but put yourself in my shoes. I, my husband, and our friend put our hearts and souls into our work we share with others because we are sick to death of a crappy world full of people that have been controlled and manipulated into being something less than their birth right. We are bombarded daily with judgments from people that only see one video, or in this case read one paragraph from a book and think they know and understand who we are, what we say, and why we are working so hard to help others. Ask yourself this, I'm not being whiny and I'm not trying to be mean, I am asking you for an experience change here. You spend years and hundred of hours to put together information in the hopes of helping others who are looking for the help and you keep having people judge you personally and the information without a lick of consideration or even digesting hardly any of the body of work before forming an invalid opinion and throwing it at you like poisonous darts, then think how you would feel by the responses this thread received initially. We've worked hard and we put a tough stance on our work because we know the opposition we are up against, but still it is exhausting.

We strongly advocate in all our work to become sovereign in your own consciousness and become your own authority. We are not trying to be anyone’s authority we are showing by example of how to do it using the methods we used for ourselves. Standing there waging your fist screaming “I am sovereign, I am sovereign” isn’t being sovereign in your consciousness if your thoughts and perceptions within yourself and of the world around you are still controlled by the people you are breaking free from and controlled perceptions and embedded manipulation programming you carry in your mind or the habits you carry after the removal. Nobody on this planet has escaped the slavery or indoctrination. I find for people that refuse to “wake up” they root in their perspectives out of fear and they are almost easier to convince than someone who thinks they are “awake”. I spent years thinking I was awake because I could see the control and manipulation in the world around me. It wasn’t until I began the internal analysis that I began to actually see I was still asleep and wake up. I keep meeting people lately that keep telling me they keep having dreams where they wake up and start their day only find out they are still asleep when they actually wake up. It makes me wonder, is this their spirits trying to tell them that even though they think they are awake, they are still deep in slumber in their minds because of the internal conditioning that controls their thoughts and perceptions? I don’t know the answer to this, but I think if you are experiencing it, it might bear some internal scrutiny or not.

Thank you everyone for your time, participation, and consideration. I will not apologize for my initial post because there is nothing to apologize for, I will however apologize to anyone I may have offended with my whiny rant responses. Have a good evening and weekend.

[Bill Ryan]

Bill must have a real great perspective with its countless hours of climbing lollllllllllllll


Not just a joke. :) I don't know about perspective, but climbing mountains is (for me) liberating, energizing and inspiring. And frequently, not at all easy. I often use mountain climbing analogies, particularly with respect to partnership and trust, commitment and courage, and discovering things about oneself (and others) that one might never find simply by meditating.

Here are two threads of mine that might bear reading. The first is a personal story that one might possibly classify as a profound spiritual teaching -- a dangerous and extreme situation that spiraled out of control in seconds, faster than one could think -- and the second is someone else's account of a harrowing experience that brought a strong, tough, grown man to tears.


A day in the mountains: a tale of forgiveness (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?14409-A-day-in-the-mountains-a-tale-of-forgiveness)
The Undefinable Line (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?59272-The-Undefinable-Line)

It may not be for nothing that spiritual teachings through the ages, in every culture, have borrowed from this metaphor. I very much appreciated the opening post, and it has been true for me in my life... and when on inner journeys, too.

[RunningDeer]

Thank you everyone for your time, participation, and consideration....
...Have a good evening and weekend.

http://paula.avalonlibrary.net/Recovered/writing_zpsd26h7e8a.GIF Much appreciation for your timely post, Gemma. You have a restful weekend as well.

RunningDeer ♡

[noprophet]

I'm a big fan of the mountain metaphor tradition. I found this video awhile back and thought it was a wonderful zoom-out to the "mountain range." (1:44)
A2NQIbleJmo

[kirolak]

I actually found the original material on Youtube, presented under the name of Douglas Michael, to be very insightful. . . .& also instantly recognized the name Mrs Beall Endall from following Youtube links.

FWIW, my thought on the initial OP here, was that the mountain analogy was rather hackneyed & overused - however, I am rather critical about writing in general, & wage war on cliches in particular (but that's just part of my own personality structure, it doesn't invalidate the truisms) :)

[greybeard]

Dear Mrs
It is the nature of Avalon to perhaps be a little suspicious as there has been a history of self proclaimed experts arriving--getting a following, then being found out not to be what they claim to be.

I see that is not the case here with you.
I dont have a challenge with the mountain and found it useful in the past.
Yes there are stages of learning.
Eventually it is found that there is no path--they tend to lead away from Self--but one has to go through their personal process to eventually find there is no separate person.
Different personalities yes., but you are not the personality.

I find that sharing what I believe to be so at that moment is rewarding--I dont expect people to see things as I see them, if they do fine--if not that is fine too.
It would be sad if everyone ad the same opinion.

I hope you continue to post--no doubt it will be of value.

Ch

[ozmirage]

MEANING OF LIFE FOR MEATBAGS WHO ARE TOO LAZY TO CLIMB MOUNTAINS

To answer the skeptical belief that life is inexplicable, I say remember the Secret of Life - - -

“Life is its own answer. Accept it and enjoy it, day by day. Live as well as possible. Expect no more. Destroy nothing. Humble nothing. Look for fault in nothing. Leave unsullied and untouched all that is beautiful. Hold that which lives - in all reverence. For life is given by the sovereign of our universe: given to be savored, to be luxuriated in, to be - - respected.”
(Paraphrased from the 1980 TV mini-series, “The Martian Chronicles”)

The end goal for partially furred electrically powered water filled gas processing meat bags inhabited by sentient multidimensional beings is to ride them until they break, and get in line to ride another.

And if our environment and companions in the spiritual realm are determined by our inherent vibration or essence, it makes sense to strive to become that which one would prefer to spend eternity with. Otherwise, we become our own hell. And if we’re unforgiving, we may spend eternity “guarding the gates” to prevent entrance of those we hold a grudge against. But that means we’re “locked out,” as well. Best to forgive, and move onward. For it would be tragic to learn that there is a Prime Essence of love, peace, joy and forgiveness, that one can never approach, exiled by virtue of one’s own intrinsic traits and faults, ingrained by habit into vices.

[earthadvocate]

Thank you so much Mr Endall Beal for your long post, if we are to walk that path it will take all the support we can get. The "We are not alone series" have left me almost numb and paralyzed, and it is almost physically difficult to read, but my intuition tells me you are in the truth.

[RunningDeer]

Doug Michaels and the Bealls teamed up after discovery of each coming to conclusions from their independent research. The video series is where Doug offers acute commentary and reads excerpts from their books.

The team of three offers personal perspectives from the synthesis of research, experience and the growth of expansion which naturally occurs from openness of exploration.

[RunningDeer]

Thank you so much Mr Endall Beal for your long post, if we are to walk that path it will take all the support we can get. The "We are not alone series" have left me almost numb and paralyzed, and it is almost physically difficult to read, but my intuition tells me you are in the truth.

It was an education to watch little ego-self enacted many ploys to not continue with the series. From denial, to avoidance, to berate authors, to financial, to poor comprehension, to no comprehension, to unnecessary busy-ness. The good news is I’ve got squeaky clean windows, a double coat of wax on my car, scrubbed carpets and worn down walking sneakers.

http://avalonlibrary.net/paula/smilies/belly-laugh.gif......
http://avalonlibrary.net/paula/smilies/dielaughing.gif

[barneythez]

I'm at the bottom of the spiritual ladder, maybe that's why I thought it was a nice poem..............

[Clear Light]

All credit to you Flash--you took the time to check out the videos and website.
Hierarchy is not spiritual its a business model.
Basically you are kept in a system that moves you up grade by grade.
I dont know is that applies to Mrs Endall Beall teachings.

There are plenty of free teaching on the Internet--I like Mooji talks--I feel the love coming out of him.
A good teacher leaves you feeling uplifted and is there to serve you not the other way around.
Not patronizing but sharing.
Meeting you where you stand then moving you on.

Ch

Ah, or perhaps I query, is what you're 'feeling' the Manifestation / Arising of the "Potentials" of YOUR "Natural State" eh ? :wink:

[greybeard]

All credit to you Flash--you took the time to check out the videos and website.
Hierarchy is not spiritual its a business model.
Basically you are kept in a system that moves you up grade by grade.
I dont know is that applies to Mrs Endall Beall teachings.

There are plenty of free teaching on the Internet--I like Mooji talks--I feel the love coming out of him.
A good teacher leaves you feeling uplifted and is there to serve you not the other way around.
Not patronizing but sharing.
Meeting you where you stand then moving you on.

Ch

Ah, or perhaps I query, is what you're 'feeling' the Manifestation / Arising of YOUR "Natural State" eh ? :wink:

Yes thats true my friend --if it wasn't within it could not arise.
Mooji was the trigger of remembrance.
That natural state is within all, is all.
Ch

[DNA]

As I stated in my reply with the reason I felt compelled to present it "As I stated I felt like sharing the quote because it was an insight I had a long time ago that inspires me every day. I felt the push to post it here because someone else might find inspiration in it as well."


No disrespect, but your quote is rather,,, elementary. Nothing compelling here, nothing to really expand upon.
And in my opinion, certainly not worthy of starting any fuss and or a thread over.
Unless you were going to immediately follow it up with a pertinent connection,,, which you did not.



The last time I posted it in a different forum I didn't get the reactions that were presented in here, most people took it at face value and found merit in it. Since this forum presents itself with others that claim to be advance spiritually speaking I figured it would be a safe bet that it would be well received like it had the last time I presented.
What is the definition of "advanced spiritually"?


Are you coming from a religious perspective? Are you coming from a shamanic perspective? Are you coming from a philosophical perspective? I find so often people claiming to be spiritual are masquerading and hoping to place themselves in the position of guru for those openly searching and wanting to find answers. I find nothing more detestable than this in so far as the forum goes, and there are not a few folks here who share that view with me.
Are you here in the hopes of simply selling more copies of your book?










I honestly didnt think I'd get the comments that it got, so I chose to use it as an opportunity to share the rest of it I've learned from the parts I had in my book. I posted it out there without asking anyone to comment and the quote itself isn't inflammatory in any way. Once the first food critic opinion showed up, I figure I might as well share the whole post. After I saw the rest, definitely.

The book is called Advanced Teachings and it a name that others that read it suggested for the title and I've had more than enough feedback supporting the content has been aptly named. The title doesn't mean that every word in there is advanced, but don't judge a 350 page book on one paragraph as you and others have done. I did't ask anyone to comment and I certianly didn't tell them what to comment, they did that on their own and you see that my observations in the rest were met. That is on them, not me. But it is a prime example of what I talk about in the rest of my book that people make snap decision and form perceptions in the blink of an eye about something.
There is actually quite a bit to go on.
For instance your forum name.
You chose Mrs.endallbeall. Doesn't this sound a little presumptuous? Egotistical? Arrogant?



So seeing this in their behavior will show them where to make corrections.


Really? I seriously doubt that.


Thanks for responding, but it has been made very clear, this isn't the place for me. The other forum has much more open minded people that have learned to not make snap judgments without knowing more of the information. in other words, they are more advanced than you guys. But thank you for providing me with more example to share when I share this with others.
You mean they are sheeple eagerly awaiting anyone who shows up and anoints themselves with the title of guru?
You should stick around here. You could learn something.

[animovado]

Mrs. Endall Beall,

I'm glad you responded and the way you did.
Some of the points you made in your post catched my eye, particularly "help" and "control". These are, in my view, interesting topics to explore and it would be interesting for me to look
at how you perceive these ideas.

My response to the mountain analogy wasn't meant disrespectful, but you're right, the title of the thread and the quote itself triggered at least a part of it.
I like the analogy and have been playing with it in the past and, similar to Bill, mountains have a concrete meaning to me, albeit "I know about perspectives", because the view from the top was always a main motivation and a precious moment.

I like to mention, as a side note, that there was a question (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?93963-Excerpt-Quote-from-the-book-Advanced-Teachings-by-Mrs.-Endall-Beall&p=1107213&viewfull=1#post1107213) that wasn't answered (not to you Mrs. Endall Beall), so I will answer it myself:
It matters, because you use it anyway.

It's late in "old europe", I go to bed and wish you a good sunday

[greybeard]

Yes, yes Chris.

Sometimes I see doors that aren't there. So whether they're open or closed, does it matter?

Sorry I didn't answer animovado

I dont know but I suspect it doesn't
What matters is "what are you?"

Best wishes
Chris

[animovado]

Is there any context for what "you are"?
Take the question personal, please.

[greybeard]

Is there any context for what "you are"?
Take the question personal, please.

Yes
Consciousness tells you what you are.
Without words you know that you exist--you are that awareness that consciousness--it exists without history, your name labels concepts, it is totally self aware.
Personally I can state I know I exist.
Hope that helps.

Sleep calls Good night

Chris

[lunaflare]

Perhaps one needs to attune to the essence of the mountain.
The mountain, one may assume, has the greatest understanding of itself; how we interpret that understanding is our (subjective) opinion.

[AutumnW]

I have an analogy about mountains too. From a distance a mountain is easy to see, from top to bottom and size to side. In that respect it is like ego.

When we have distance from it, we can see it more clearly. The closer we move towards it the more it vanishes, in a sense. We can't see it's top, its outlines or its contrary contours.

The more threatened or hurt I feel, the closer I move towards the mountain of my own ego, but the less capable I am of realizing it. It is too large, for me to comprehend.

[RunningDeer]

For instance your forum name.
You chose Mrs.endallbeall. Doesn't this sound a little presumptuous? Egotistical? Arrogant?

Hi Marcus,

While you wait for Gemma's response, here's my perspective:

Many EndAll BeAlls are coming into their own. It's not as you say, presumptuous, egotistical, nor arrogant. They are what many are on the cusp of awakening to and claiming for themselves. Each must do it for themselves.

As mentioned above, after reading many of their books and watching a boat load of videos, my interpretation of the name EndAll BeAll signifies End All the ‘efin’ indoctrination, the false, the control and the implanted stop-gap-technology. Break free of the psychological and emotional manipulation. Break free of egoic control. Be All, claim it, own it, be THAT 100% natural, powerhouse spiritual being. Be All. Stand in your power. Then what we called mystery is only an incremental journey of (fill in the blank).


♡

PS This is the watered down version. There's a whole, whole lot more from their material.

[AutumnW]

I'm at the bottom of the spiritual ladder, maybe that's why I thought it was a nice poem..............

Testament to the possibility you could be the most spiritually refined on this thread, actually.

[Flash]

Thanks Paula

I am laughing alone right now

I thought this name was a true name - you see, many names in English have a foreign connotation for me anyhow, so I took for grantef that the author's name was not a plume name but was his/her true name.

Sometimes I do not understand a word and deduct its meaning based on context. This time I truly missed. And forget double meanings when it is not your mothertongue, they are a true pain to understand. I would never have seen the meanings of that plume name without your explanations.

Same with words I do not know the meanings. Sometimes I am surprised that I still do not know some réguler words in English. This time around, I learned what excerpt meant. I new its equivalent in French but had never encountered it in English and sincerely misunderstood the thread title at first, understanding only later after a few posts that it was a piece from a text.

Non English speakers like me do have a harder time in understanding at times and definitely at writing.

I will write later on about what I saw with the mountain allegory (which I now think is in part culturally biaised after reading many posts here), give my feedback on Bill post (he seems to have misinterpreted mines - I was not thinking it was a joke - and give more feedback on inner programs and beliefs systems. Also on Mr endall Bealls - lol, I even made a name pronunciation in my head completely unrelated to its actual pronunciation or meanings, trying to make sense and remembering a new name. Only people speaking and reading many languages can follow me in this!!!

Lots of confusion



For instance your forum name.
You chose Mrs.endallbeall. Doesn't this sound a little presumptuous? Egotistical? Arrogant?

Hi Marcus,

While you wait for Gemma's response, here's my perspective:

Many EndAll BeAlls are coming into their own. It's not as you say, presumptuous, egotistical, nor arrogant. They are what many are on the cusp of awakening to and claiming for themselves. Each must do it for themselves.

As mentioned above, after reading many of their books and watching a boat load of videos, my interpretation of the name EndAll BeAll signifies End All the ‘efin’ indoctrination, the false, the control and the implanted stop-gap-technology. Break free of the psychological and emotional manipulation. Be All, claim it, own it, be THAT 100% natural, powerhouse spiritual being. Be All. Stand in your power. Then what we called mystery is only an incremental journey of (fill in the blank).


♡

PS This is the watered down version. Where's a whole, whole lot more.

[MrsEndallBeall]

Thank you for your comment

¤=[Post Update]=¤

The pen name stands for "if we can't END ALL of the ego nonsense, we can BE ALL we can be as a species" fro Demystifying. thank you Running Deer

[MrsEndallBeall]

Thank you. Sharing is important which is why I share my stuff, I don't expect everyone to agree with me but agreements can be done civily and I don't feel the opening comments were done so. You sharing what you just shared is different because you included some of your own insights.

We may carry everything within us, but sometimes we don't interpret it properly or see it clearly and helping others in sharing perspectives is what can better help others understand what they know internally but don't understand or haven't yet realized.

I found for myself, the actual writing process helped me better see and understand more of what I know internally because trying to make it more robust in presentation is what made it more clear to me.

The most positive feed back I've heard from others is that "I knew this but I didn't know how to say it or put it into words". That is how we help others by sharing. More feed back has been "I know this but was unsure, this help me know I'm not alone and gave me validation that I needed". This is why I write.

I remember being fresh on my path and didn't know anything and didn't trust myself. I wish I had someone like me to help give me the confidence to trust in myself and that is why I'm working on being there to help others that want the help to get there and watch them fly.

[DNA]

Thank you for your comment

¤=[Post Update]=¤

The pen name stands for "if we can't END ALL of the ego nonsense, we can BE ALL we can be as a species" fro Demystifying. thank you Running Deer


We will never end all of the ego nonsense. Not even on a microcosmic level.


Intellectual pursuits have almost no effect on the ego.
Enlightenment is never a state of being that can be sustained. Enlightenment is having the energy to sustain abstract so called spiritual understanding. Maintaining the energy necessary for true understanding is near impossible, and such the most we can really hope for and work for are moments when we are aligned our spirit, body and mind.


There are two methods for acquiring the spiritual energy necessary to sustain understanding.
1. You can cultivate it through methods described by the Taoists of antiquity, physical methods that demand the mind-body-spirit to work in unison. Once cultivated you then need to recognize the ways in which you bleed this energy off through your everyday actions.


Or

2. You can steal this energy from those around you. Many gurus find they can aquire small glimpses of so called enlightenment through the practices they have learned. They then teach these methods and through acquiring a collection of acolytes they then realize it is much easier to steal the energy from their pupils than it is to continue the daily work, self control and abstinence from indulging in their regular energy syphoning behavior.


I find far more gurus fall under the second heading than the first.

[MrsEndallBeall]

As I stated in my reply with the reason I felt compelled to present it "As I stated I felt like sharing the quote because it was an insight I had a long time ago that inspires me every day. I felt the push to post it here because someone else might find inspiration in it as well."


No disrespect, but your quote is rather,,, elementary. Nothing compelling here, nothing to really expand upon.
And in my opinion, certainly not worthy of starting any fuss and or a thread over.
Unless you were going to immediately follow it up with a pertinent connection,,, which you did not. Actually, yes I did.



The last time I posted it in a different forum I didn't get the reactions that were presented in here, most people took it at face value and found merit in it. Since this forum presents itself with others that claim to be advance spiritually speaking I figured it would be a safe bet that it would be well received like it had the last time I presented.
What is the definition of "advanced spiritually"? My book is titled Advanced Teachings, the definition of advancing is to "move forward in a purposeful way", Advancing Teachings didn't have a nice enough ring to it, so it was suggested Advanced, it wasn't chose by me.


Are you coming from a religious perspective? NO Are you coming from a shamanic perspective? Sort ofAre you coming from a philosophical perspective? No, more of a psychological perspectiveI find so often people claiming to be spiritual are masquerading and hoping to place themselves in the position of guru for those openly searching and wanting to find answers. I find nothing more detestable than this in so far as the forum goes, and there are not a few folks here who share that view with me. We state in all of our work, we are not gurus, become your own authority
Are you here in the hopes of simply selling more copies of your book? No, that is why I didn't mention the book in the texts, being that it is copywrited material I am required to give credit when I pust a public quote










I honestly didnt think I'd get the comments that it got, so I chose to use it as an opportunity to share the rest of it I've learned from the parts I had in my book. I posted it out there without asking anyone to comment and the quote itself isn't inflammatory in any way. Once the first food critic opinion showed up, I figure I might as well share the whole post. After I saw the rest, definitely.

The book is called Advanced Teachings and it a name that others that read it suggested for the title and I've had more than enough feedback supporting the content has been aptly named. The title doesn't mean that every word in there is advanced, but don't judge a 350 page book on one paragraph as you and others have done. I did't ask anyone to comment and I certianly didn't tell them what to comment, they did that on their own and you see that my observations in the rest were met. That is on them, not me. But it is a prime example of what I talk about in the rest of my book that people make snap decision and form perceptions in the blink of an eye about something.
There is actually quite a bit to go on.
For instance your forum name.
You chose Mrs.endallbeall. Doesn't this sound a little presumptuous? Egotistical? Arrogant? My husband started writing his books first, he chose the pen name based on this "if people don't END ALL their ego bull****, we cant BE ALL we can be as a species. When I started writing mine, I used Mrs. Endall Beall to keep the books in the series together, which has been explained in our books



So seeing this in their behavior will show them where to make corrections.


Really? I seriously doubt that. Actually, there are times when it does work when the people are open minded. Most people are not consciously aware of their behaviors until it is pointed out to them.


Thanks for responding, but it has been made very clear, this isn't the place for me. The other forum has much more open minded people that have learned to not make snap judgments without knowing more of the information. in other words, they are more advanced than you guys. But thank you for providing me with more example to share when I share this with others.
You mean they are sheeple eagerly awaiting anyone who shows up and anoints themselves with the title of guru? Since I didn't show up wearing a title or anointing me a guru which I have never and would never do, you are just making assumptions.
You should stick around here. You could learn something. Oh I have already, but are you willing to learn something?

[MrsEndallBeall]

Thank you for your comment

¤=[Post Update]=¤

The pen name stands for "if we can't END ALL of the ego nonsense, we can BE ALL we can be as a species" fro Demystifying. thank you Running Deer


We will never end all of the ego nonsense. Not even on a microcosmic level. But that is not stopping us from trying, the ego can be broken it's the habits that take longer to fix


Intellectual pursuits have almost no effect on the ego. I disagree with this, the ego latched on to the intellectualism and makes the intellectual more firmly rooted in their perspectives
Enlightenment is never a state of being that can be sustained. Enlightenment is having the energy to sustain abstract so called spiritual understanding. Maintaining the energy necessary for true understanding is near impossible, and such the most we can really hope for and work for are moments when we are aligned our spirit, body and mind. This I also disagree with, enlightenment is a journey not a destination and you can make it an ever present journey. which is what we share about our journeys.


There are two methods for acquiring the spiritual energy necessary to sustain understanding.
1. You can cultivate it through methods described by the Taoists of antiquity, physical methods that demand the mind-body-spirit to work in unison. Once cultivated you then need to recognize the ways in which you bleed this energy off through your everyday actions. when you learn how you emit and receive energies, you have the choice to use them. Most people do not have control of the energy they emit, I and others I know consciously chose how our energies are emitted and how we use them. It is actually quite easy to do.


Or

2. You can steal this energy from those around you. Many gurus find they can aquire small glimpses of so called enlightenment through the practices they have learned. They then teach these methods and through acquiring a collection of acolytes they then realize it is much easier to steal the energy from their pupils than it is to continue the daily work, self control and abstinence from indulging in their regular energy syphoning behavior. Most people do this without knowing and this kind of energy vampirism is what the controllers do to drain us so they can keep their control. You learn how to control your energy, you control what you take in and emit. The work I do, I do energy exchanges with everything in nature and with stellar energies, these energies become a part of my operating field and mine theirs with their cooperation which expands my energy source that gives the strength for the spiritual knowledge to keep growing as a collective effort.


I find far more gurus fall under the second heading than the first. Agreed according to your description.

[DNA]

"You should stick around here. You could learn something." Oh I have already, but are you willing to learn something?
I'm willing to hear you out.
If I were to summarize my explorations into the briefest of statements it would be this.
We are not egotistically ruled and spiritually stunted without a reason.
There are vast forces placed in positions to manipulate mankind. They do so for the second reason I've listed above.
The maneuvers they use on you are not the maneuvers they use on me, they have a unique set of methods for manipulating everyone on the planet.
True spiritual awakening is not just opening one's eyes, it is entering into battle with forces who wish to keep you asleep.
When you have learned to open your eyes the battle has just begun.
It seems to be you wish to help people open their eyes.
Fair enough, but this is exceedingly difficult to do, and it is a solitary battle first and foremost.
As someone who has done this, I'm here to tell you, this is only the very first step, and for those who are truly capable of opening their eyes to what is going on, be prepared, for there are forces that will be gazing back at you.


Having seen what I have seen I feel the pursuit of spirituality is folly.
I prefer to take a break from my ego while enjoying a glass of scotch, and to try my best to be in service to my friends and family.
I raise my scotch and I toast you.
I apologize if I've over reacted. I simply have a knee jerk reaction to guru types who try to lead folks on a fools errand.
I take solace in the understanding that reincarnationally speaking, we all chose to be here, and that this is simply a lesson we have chosen to take part in.


Cheers :cocktail:

[greybeard]

D.N.A. when Self is realized there is no ego left to claim enlightenment.
When an experience happens, no matter how profound, who is aware of this event?
Experiences come and go, Self does not and is unchanged by any experience.
The persona is sometimes greatly affected.
So time being anything that is helpful to the persona is just that.

Not everyone wants enlightenment/Self realization--most want an easier more enjoyable life and thats good too.

Chris

[RunningDeer]

Earlier I stated some of the benefits from Doug Michaels and the Beall’s material: 1) confirmations of what I know 2) confirmations of something long forgotten.

What I’ve come to know is expansion happens in the sweet-spot of the unknown. That last step before I’m in, there’s a clamor of fright and ballsy and excitement.

At one level it took incremental steps of preparation to sideline security blankets of intellectual and physical properties. It takes/took determination to break from the range of rituals to beliefs. Such as, in order to progress, I needed the false notion of the twenty-eight years of Tai Chi, the Reiki, the books, the philosophies, the affirmations, the gadgets, the matching cranberry zafu cushion and meditation mat and on and on.

An example of a symbolic gesture was fifteen years ago, I simplified things by donating my Reiki massage table. Two weeks ago, my final act of really breaking free was I tossed my massage chair and matching stool. Healing? Boom! Done. No props. No ritual. No burning incense. No smudging. No song. Boom! Done.

Now, my approach is health is our natural state. Note: I’m a work in progress. I’m a work in progress. I’m a …


http://paula.avalonlibrary.net/Recovered/work-in-progress_zpsrvqqttes.GIF

Forty-five plus years, I’ve collected anchors. All of it served to keep me sideline; away from the straight up sweet-spot of the unknown, the expansion, the growth of expansion which naturally occurs from openness of exploration.


Now? I’m all in.
I’m bungie jumping without a rope.
I’m a fire-waker.

http://paula.avalonlibrary.net/BeAll/fire-walk_zpsr6mchhno.JPG

♡

[RunningDeer]

Thanks Paula

I am laughing alone right now

I thought this name was a true name - you see, many names in English have a foreign connotation for me anyhow, so I took for grantef that the author's name was not a plume name but was his/her true name.

Sometimes I do not understand a word and deduct its meaning based on context. This time I truly missed. And forget double meanings when it is not your mothertongue, they are a true pain to understand. I would never have seen the meanings of that plume name without your explanations.

Me, too, Flash. Initially, I was taken aback by the name. But I couldn’t blame it on language barrier. That snarky voice in me came out of no where.
Fortunately, I persisted even when the ego said, “Oh, no you don’t, sister.”
“Step awwayyyy from the book.”
"Hey, look over there! What's that?"
“RunningDeer...Ben & Jerry’s. Ben & Jerry’s.”
http://avalonlibrary.net/paula/Recovered/hypnotize_zpsiw4jb96s.GIF

♡

[Rich]

Now, my approach is health is our natural state.


I Think that's true.
Sickness is a Defense against the truth, according to ACIM.


Sickness is a decision. It is not a thing that happens to you, quite unsought, which makes you weak and brings you suffering. It is a choice you make, a plan you lay, when for an instant truth arises in your own deluded mind, and all your world appears to totter and prepare to fall. Now are you sick, that truth may go away and threaten your establishments no more. How do you think that sickness can succeed in shielding you from truth? Because it proves the body is not separate from you, and so you must be separate from the truth. You suffer pain because the body does, and in this pain are you made one with it. Thus is your "true" identity preserved, and the strange, haunting thought that you might be something beyond this little pile of dust silenced and stilled. For see, this dust can make you suffer, twist your limbs and stop your heart, commanding you to die and cease to be.

I have forgotten what I really am, for I mistook my body for myself. Sickness is a defense against the truth. But I am not a body. And my mind cannot attack. So I can not be sick.

[RunningDeer]

I Think that's true.
Sickness is a Defense against the truth, according to ACIM.


Sickness is a decision.

Sickness is an intentional designer flaw by the trickster gods that want everyone on their knees in praise and obedience of their authority. Sickness is part of the tampered body template of implants and programs. The same with limited intelligence, imperfection, fear and god dependency. Sickness is livestock management.

The antidote is annihilation of the egoic hypnotic trance. Knowledge of and brutally honest self-assessment and behavioral changes will lance the puss filled the mind-body virus.


I have forgotten what I really am, for I mistook my body for myself.

I had become complacent in my quest because I had fallen into habits of quoting from outside authorities. It became no different from the religious zealots that speak their rote jargon of chapter and verse.

Simply put: I live this spirit-body. Yes, I'm spirit. I'm here to explore and expand in ways I discover as I go.


according to ACIM

I read ACIM and from cover to cover and parts over and over, including the exercises provided and the workbook. I’ve long since moved on from it.

“A Course in Miracles” was channeled through Helen Schucman. I now understand how those false induced feelings of elation only served to feed a trickster Jesus impersonator.

What little ah-has I gleaned while engaged in the material was just enough to keep me side-tracked from my journey of wakening to this holographic dinner party. I was not a guest. I was the menu. Today’s special for inorganic minions to feast off.

This spirit-body is shaking off the implanted nano-bot-fleas and zapping the matrix circuit boards.


Now, the only mantra chanted is:

god, no soup for you.
Don’t come back in one year.

This kitchen is C-L-O-S-E-D.
This kitchen is closed.
http://paula.avalonlibrary.net/Recovered/bliss_zpstdsixjgz.GIF
M2lfZg-apSA
♡

[Flash]

Wow!.... Bumping


Earlier I stated some of the benefits from Doug Michaels and the Beall’s material: 1) confirmations of what I know 2) confirmations of something long forgotten.

What I’ve come to know is expansion happens in the sweet-spot of the unknown. That last step before I’m in, there’s a clamor of fright and ballsy and excitement.

At one level it took incremental steps of preparation to sideline security blankets of intellectual and physical properties. It takes/took determination to break from the range of rituals to beliefs. Such as, in order to progress, I needed the false notion of the twenty-eight years of Tai Chi, the Reiki, the books, the philosophies, the affirmations, the gadgets, the matching cranberry zafu cushion and meditation mat and on and on.

An example of a symbolic gesture was fifteen years ago, I simplified things by donating my Reiki massage table. Two weeks ago, my final act of really breaking free was I tossed my massage chair and matching stool. Healing? Boom! Done. No props. No ritual. No burning incense. No smudging. No song. Boom! Done.

Now, my approach is health is our natural state. Note: I’m a work in progress. I’m a work in progress. I’m a …


http://avalonlibrary.net/paula/Recovered/work-in-progress_zpsrvqqttes.GIF

Forty-five plus years, I’ve collected anchors. All of it served to keep me sideline; away from the straight up sweet-spot of the unknown, the expansion, the growth of expansion which naturally occurs from openness of exploration.


Now? I’m all in.
I’m bungie jumping without a rope.
I’m a fire-waker.

http://avalonlibrary.net/paula/BeAll/fire-walk_zpsr6mchhno.JPG

♡

[Rich]

Deer, ACIM may not be for everyone the book itself says that there are many valid teachings.

What I like about ACIM is that it goes all the way,
no other teachers are required.

[greybeard]

The late Dr David Hawkins promoted A.C.I.M.
He made several comments.
One was that the first part was possibly channeled from a different entity and best to concentrate on the work book,.
Secondly that the course demonised the ego, which was in his eyes not helpful--best to transcend it.

I moved on from the course but have respect for it as it makes one questions all belief systems, concepts etc.
Eckhart Tolle also respected the course.

As said its up to the individual to find what ever is helpful.
That may change as "progress" is made.
Ch

[greybeard]

Paula several "Enlightened souls" have said that you have to try, try, try, till you see the futility of it and just surrender to what is.
No one ever gained enlightenment--you cant make it happen.
Its not surrender in normal terms--just give up searching.

Ch.

[DNA]

The late Dr David Hawkins promoted A.C.I.M.
He made several comments.
One was that the first part was possibly channeled from a different entity and best to concentrate on the work book,.
I'm okay with channeled material, as long as one has developed the ability to discern the wheat from the chaff.


Secondly that the course demonised the ego, which was in his eyes not helpful--best to transcend it.Rather than fight with my ego, I've learned to recognize it, embrace it, know the nuances of it.
If you truly know your ego, if you really get to know it, you will find that you can bust your mother efn ass doing whatever you want to transcend, battle, escape from it, in the end you realize you will never be rid of it. Best to make good with your ego and in all honesty live as peaceful as you can with it.
The ego does not follow you to the other side.
Not only does the ego not follow you, but you are suddenly aligned with the greater part of yourself that you separated from in order to incarnate here.
We incarnated here to understand life while connected to ego. We did not incarnate here to experience life in a blissful state of meditative transcendence. The ego is not a lesson taught in terms of a prison guard one needs to escape from, but rather a life long room mate one has to learn to endure and proceed in spite of, it is as if we are Felix from the Odd Couple and our ego is Oscar. Apparently reincarnationally speaking there are not too many lessons to be learned with legs in a lotus position while sitting in contemplative bliss next to a willow reed punctuated pond.

[RunningDeer]

Paula several "Enlightened souls" have said that you have to try, try, try, till you see the futility of it and just surrender to what is.
No one ever gained enlightenment--you cant make it happen.
Its not surrender in normal terms--just give up searching.

Ch.

Chris, I’m no stranger to the genre. In fact, I have replacements for many I’ve read, also with some duplicate copies in iBook and Kindle. And then there’s reams of color coded note taking and reflection as I read along.

I get it. I have the experiential as part of the resume as well. It was time to removed them from my favorites on my GPS of life.

To name a few:


All of Dr. David R. Hawkins books, (with the exception of the first: The Hidden Determinants of Human Behavior), replacements and some in iBook and Kindle. Then there’s Dr. Hawkins lectures on VCR and then DVD. All passed along to a dear friend.


Eknath Easwaran’s trilogy of: The Dhammapada, The Upanishad and The Bhagavad Gita. Others such as Dialogue with Death: A Journey Through Consciousness and Timeless Wisdom: Passages for Meditation from the World's Saints & Sages, and a couple of his lectures on DVD.


If not all then most of Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj books including the ones from several authors.


The same for Sri Ramana Maharshi and author David Godman.


Also books by Sri H. W. L. Poonja, Mooji, Eckhart Tolle, Gangaji, Thich Nhat Hanh, Rumi, Osho, Adyashanti, Krishnamurti, and more…

[greybeard]

Paula several "Enlightened souls" have said that you have to try, try, try, till you see the futility of it and just surrender to what is.
No one ever gained enlightenment--you cant make it happen.
Its not surrender in normal terms--just give up searching.

Ch.

Chris, I’m no stranger to the genre. In fact, I have replacements for many I’ve read, also with some duplicate copies in iBook and Kindle. And then there’s reams of color coded note taking and reflection as I read along.

I get it. I have the experiential as part of the resume as well. It was time to removed them from my favorites on my GPS of life.

To name a few:


All of Dr. David R. Hawkins books, (with the exception of the first: The Hidden Determinants of Human Behavior), replacements and some in iBook and Kindle. Then there’s Dr. Hawkins lectures on VCR and then DVD. All passed along to a dear friend.


Eknath Easwaran’s trilogy of: The Dhammapada, The Upanishad and The Bhagavad Gita. Others such as Dialogue with Death: A Journey Through Consciousness and Timeless Wisdom: Passages for Meditation from the World's Saints & Sages, and a couple of his lectures on DVD.


If not all then most of Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj books including the ones from several authors.


The same for Sri Ramana Maharshi and author David Godman.


Also books by Sri H. W. L. Poonja, Mooji, Eckhart Tolle, Gangaji, Thich Nhat Hanh, Rumi, Osho, Adyashanti, Krishnamurti, and more…

Oh yes Paula Im well aware that you have knowledge of the genre, more than most.

I dont read anymore--things get removed from my life without me giving them up it just happens.
My opinion and its just mine, is as stated that there is a process then you give up--im not searching anymore but I do like the energy or whatever you would call it from some of the videos.
Mooji I like but I tend to listen to Stephen Wolinsky the most.
He spent time with Nisargadatta and said that his final suggestion was forget his teaching and just remain in consciousness , thats enough.

None of the considerable time spent on the "search" is regretted as it has changed my life for the better.
The mind is at peace--its a good servant, nothing troubles me, yet im not dumbed down and there is compassion.

I consider my self fortunate.

With respect for you.

Chris

[happyuk]

MrsEndallBeall

Teaching on what?
Enlightenment---Self Realization--Non-duality.
There are no advance teaching on these that Im aware of.
For me spirituality is finding the answer to the question "Who am I"
It may well be different for you.
Looking forward to your response Mrs
Ch

Hi Greybeard I think this deceptively simple teaching penetrates some pretty subtle levels and is worthy of an advanced teaching.

Replace the word mountain with any difficult predicament you or I commonly face.

For many the word 'mountain' can be analogous to overcoming any problem that serves to prolong human misery, and to attempt to overcome it and fail in the attempt is infinitely preferable to having never tried in the first place. It may well be too high to complete in the first few inexperienced attempts, and this symbolizes a predicament common to every person with high aspirations. Man longs instinctively for a life freed from competition and worry (a definition of happiness?) ; freed from hatred and violence; freed from the need for constant care.

Alas few people even suspect that such a state can exist or can be found. Of those who do entertain such hopes, most will turn away discouraged by saying, “But it’s much too difficult for me!" "Out of a thousand,” Krishna says in the Bhagavad Gita, "one seeks Me." Those who take up the spiritual path for commonly expecting only blissful visions and a comfortable, trouble-free life, become discouraged when they find how often God neglects the roses in favour of thorns.

[AutumnW]

Now, my approach is health is our natural state.


I Think that's true.
Sickness is a Defense against the truth, according to ACIM.

Sickness is a decision. It is not a thing that happens to you, quite unsought, which makes you weak and brings you suffering. It is a choice you make, a plan you lay, when for an instant truth arises in your own deluded mind, and all your world appears to totter and prepare to fall. Now are you sick, that truth may go away and threaten your establishments no more. How do you think that sickness can succeed in shielding you from truth? Because it proves the body is not separate from you, and so you must be separate from the truth. You suffer pain because the body does, and in this pain are you made one with it. Thus is your "true" identity preserved, and the strange, haunting thought that you might be something beyond this little pile of dust silenced and stilled. For see, this dust can make you suffer, twist your limbs and stop your heart, commanding you to die and cease to be.

I have forgotten what I really am, for I mistook my body for myself. Sickness is a defense against the truth. But I am not a body. And my mind cannot attack. So I can not be sick.

I have been almost totally incapacitated for 20 years and ill for going on 50 years, starting in late childhood. As a vibrant healthy and happy child, I did NOT decide to have half my brain compromised and my body broken as a defence against the truth.

I was always big into the truth. I quit believing in Santa Claus when I was five years old and was labelled from early childhood as having 'morbid' curiosity. I wanted to know everything, including the unpleasant and ugly underside of things.

My body is a huge part of who I am. To deny that, in my life, would be a weird and unnecessary oversight. To identify solely as a sick person without any other identifiable characteristics, would also be pretty weird. Maybe this is what you are trying to say. Did you perceive your illness as a pure negative and identify too much with that aspect of it?

For me--(and I am speaking very specifically here, so as not to offend you, or diminish your own journey,) illness has been informative, one of those bitch goddess teachers you hated so much in school, but who forced you to knuckle down and learn.

I won't get better unless a cure is found. I don't mourn my condition nor seek sympathy. My illness has led me into deeper recesses of meaning and compassion, though it isn't always readily apparent. ;) I have to be grateful for that, though I won't be sending 'teacher,' a fruit basket and thank you card anytime soon!

[greybeard]

MrsEndallBeall

Teaching on what?
Enlightenment---Self Realization--Non-duality.
There are no advance teaching on these that Im aware of.
For me spirituality is finding the answer to the question "Who am I"
It may well be different for you.
Looking forward to your response Mrs
Ch

Hi Greybeard I think this deceptively simple teaching penetrates some pretty subtle levels and is worthy of an advanced teaching.

Replace the word mountain with any difficult predicament you or I commonly face.

For many the word 'mountain' can be analogous to overcoming any problem that serves to prolong human misery, and to attempt to overcome it and fail in the attempt is infinitely preferable to having never tried in the first place. It may well be too high to complete in the first few inexperienced attempts, and this symbolizes a predicament common to every person with high aspirations. Man longs instinctively for a life freed from competition and worry (a definition of happiness?) ; freed from hatred and violence; freed from the need for constant care.

Alas few people even suspect that such a state can exist or can be found. Of those who do entertain such hopes, most will turn away discouraged by saying, “But it’s much too difficult for me!" "Out of a thousand,” Krishna says in the Bhagavad Gita, "one seeks Me." Those who take up the spiritual path for commonly expecting only blissful visions and a comfortable, trouble-free life, become discouraged when they find how often God neglects the roses in favour of thorns.

I was not questioning the mountain story as it is well known and used by quite a few--I think I said I found it useful.
However it was the way that the opening post was presented that led me to query
It was an honest question as to the variety of teaching being offered.
It was as if a superiority was there---as in, I know something that you dont, ive come to share an advanced teaching--thats an assumption.
Advanced suggests superior levels superior knowledge.

There are different levels but they are all equal.
A univerrsity stutent is equal to a primary school pupil learning ABC
The teacher has to know the class he is supposed to be teaching.
Now that was my initial feeling--Im not saying I was right.

If you read the rest of my posts you will see that encouraged Mrs to continue.

Chris

[Rich]

Aplogies Autumn, I did not write this, it is an excerpt from ACIM not my words. I put it in a quote bubble now to make it more clear.

[greybeard]

Now, my approach is health is our natural state.


I Think that's true.
Sickness is a Defense against the truth, according to ACIM.

Sickness is a decision. It is not a thing that happens to you, quite unsought, which makes you weak and brings you suffering. It is a choice you make, a plan you lay, when for an instant truth arises in your own deluded mind, and all your world appears to totter and prepare to fall. Now are you sick, that truth may go away and threaten your establishments no more. How do you think that sickness can succeed in shielding you from truth? Because it proves the body is not separate from you, and so you must be separate from the truth. You suffer pain because the body does, and in this pain are you made one with it. Thus is your "true" identity preserved, and the strange, haunting thought that you might be something beyond this little pile of dust silenced and stilled. For see, this dust can make you suffer, twist your limbs and stop your heart, commanding you to die and cease to be.

I have forgotten what I really am, for I mistook my body for myself. Sickness is a defense against the truth. But I am not a body. And my mind cannot attack. So I can not be sick.

I have been almost totally incapacitated for 20 years and ill for going on 50 years, starting in late childhood. As a vibrant healthy and happy child, I did NOT decide to have half my brain compromised and my body broken as a defence against the truth.

I was always big into the truth. I quit believing in Santa Claus when I was five years old and was labelled from early childhood as having 'morbid' curiosity. I wanted to know everything, including the unpleasant and ugly underside of things.

My body is a huge part of who I am. To deny that, in my life, would be a weird and unnecessary oversight. To identify solely as a sick person without any other identifiable characteristics, would also be pretty weird. Maybe this is what you are trying to say. Did you perceive your illness as a pure negative and identify too much with that aspect of it?

For me--(and I am speaking very specifically here, so as not to offend you, or diminish your own journey,) illness has been informative, one of those bitch goddess teachers you hated so much in school, but who forced you to knuckle down and learn.

I won't get better unless a cure is found. I don't mourn my condition nor seek sympathy. My illness has led me into deeper recesses of meaning and compassion, though it isn't always readily apparent. ;) I have to be grateful for that, though I won't be sending 'teacher,' a fruit basket and thank you card anytime soon!

Autum W--I certainly don't agree with that A.C.I.M. post.
My heart goes out to you and I hope that, though you are making the best of it, a cure is found soon.

Best wishes
Chris

Ps on re reading the quote I agree with the last part
Quote "But I am not a body. And my mind cannot attack. So I can not be sick.[/QUOTE]

What you truly are is not affected so that is not ill--the body certainly is though.

[AutumnW]

Emex, no apologies necessary, regardless! It is an excellent choice of quotes, in any case! Very thought provoking!!

[AutumnW]

Thanks Greybeard,

I am open to whatever happens. If I can be cured...cool. If I can't, well bummer...but cool! If I was in extreme pain I wouldn't be singing the same tune. My heart goes out to those who have intractable pain. When I compare myself to others, that's what I do. I compare myself to people in unrelenting mental or physical and even financial extremes of pain or people in war torn countries. So I usually feel confined but lucky. Kind of Pollyanna zen:sun:

[Bill Ryan]

Sickness is a Defense against the truth, according to ACIM.


Well, ACIM (A Course In Miracles) is 100% flat wrong about that. :)

Of course, that might be true in some cases. But to lay that on everyone is a cheap, thoughtless, insensitive insult.

Think about it: actually, no-one would be exempt. Unless we're a victim of an accident (or is that a 'defense against the truth', also?), we're all going to die... of something, sometime.

Life is full of unknowns, and that's part of the Great Game we all play. We come here, and we take risks. It's all part of the package. There's no other deal.

Sometimes, we take a stray bullet. And sometimes, it's the more courageous among us -- not those in some kind of denial -- who receive those impacts and wounds.

[AutumnW]

The late Dr David Hawkins promoted A.C.I.M.
He made several comments.
One was that the first part was possibly channeled from a different entity and best to concentrate on the work book,.
I'm okay with channeled material, as long as one has developed the ability to discern the wheat from the chaff.


Secondly that the course demonised the ego, which was in his eyes not helpful--best to transcend it.Rather than fight with my ego, I've learned to recognize it, embrace it, know the nuances of it.
If you truly know your ego, if you really get to know it, you will find that you can bust your mother efn ass doing whatever you want to transcend, battle, escape from it, in the end you realize you will never be rid of it. Best to make good with your ego and in all honesty live as peaceful as you can with it.
The ego does not follow you to the other side.
Not only does the ego not follow you, but you are suddenly aligned with the greater part of yourself that you separated from in order to incarnate here.
We incarnated here to understand life while connected to ego. We did not incarnate here to experience life in a blissful state of meditative transcendence. The ego is not a lesson taught in terms of a prison guard one needs to escape from, but rather a life long room mate one has to learn to endure and proceed in spite of, it is as if we are Felix from the Odd Couple and our ego is Oscar. Apparently reincarnationally speaking there are not too many lessons to be learned with legs in a lotus position while sitting in contemplative bliss next to a willow reed punctuated pond.

DNA,

I think that the ego persists in such a resistant crazy way because life, in the not so distant past was nasty brutish and short. The only thing that stood between the individual and social ostracism (certain death for a social species) was bluff, bluster.

Resignation to a more inward, reflective self, could very well have been perceived as a weakness. Societies self cull. It's tragic. So, we are truly and remarkably sensitive to any slight, perceived or otherwise that would place us more on the social periphery.

For example -- and this goes for women as much as men. If you insult someone along the lines that doesn't diminish their power, for example, imply they are mean spirited, they will merely react, but retain composure.

Imply though, that somebody is a goof, a nitwit, a laughing stock, in other words someone who can't be taken seriously -- and watch their ego go completely berserko. Those kinds of suggestions, REALLY weaken the individual socially. They hurt badly and seemingly out of proportion, because they represent an existential threat, rooted in historical precedent. The ego defends against humiliation, more than anything else.

[RunningDeer]

Doug Michael and Mr. & Mrs. BE quotes:




The spirit path is about your spirit. Your spirit path is about you recognizing and owning your spirit and revering it above everything else but knowing it is above nothing else.

Mrs. Endall Beall - “The Energy Experience: Energy Work for the Second Cognition, Chapter 20: The Human Myth”


****************




The ego is like a mind virus. It could be compared to a parasite on our original consciousness. In order for us to find and re-attach to our originating consciousness, to our inner spirit, we have to remove the control of the ego parasite as the governing element over our consciousness.


This ego parasite is like a computer virus, a piece of malware on our psyches that controls us and limits our perceptions and prevents our advancement into a more consciously aware species.


Endall Beall & Doug Michael - “The New Paradigm Transcripts: Teachings for a New Tomorrow: Chapter 3 - Practical Spirituality”

[DNA]

DNA,

I think that the ego persists in such a resistant crazy way because life, in the not so distant past was nasty brutish and short. The only thing that stood between the individual and social ostracism (certain death for a social species) was bluff, bluster.


I think you are on to something here. I see it a tad different though.
I see things through a Gnostic lens of sorts, and this view is repeated by Ayahausca imbibing Shamans from South America.
I think there are two distinct battles to engage when looking to free one self and seek autonomy.
Extracting oneself from the clutches of sociological indoctrination is first and foremost.
To examine who you really are and distill that from your socially implanted reactions takes a bit.
In truth, without taking the time to weed the garden and remove the views of society we absolutely can not call our selves autonomous.
When folks are in the midst of this process I often refer to it as the elongated introspection. It is a time when one questions "everything" and it can be quite draining to be around such folks while they are engaged such. If folks hop on and truly immerse themselves in this process it can be accomoplisehd to a large degree in as little as just a few years.
But separating one's self from ego and separating one's self from society are two distinctly different undertakings in my opinion.


Resignation to a more inward, reflective self, could very well have been perceived as a weakness. Societies self cull. It's tragic. So, we are truly and remarkably sensitive to any slight, perceived or otherwise that would place us more on the social periphery.
I believe you are correct here.
I believe this fact that we are so sensitive to any slight as you say is absolutely true, and one of the most used and successful devices of the demiurge when milking mankind of it's god given essence. Every time we experience being offended by our fellow man we are bleeding energy, and this energy is lapped up by the forces that keep us in a constant state of spiritual sleep.


For example -- and this goes for women as much as men. If you insult someone along the lines that doesn't diminish their power, for example, imply they are mean spirited, they will merely react, but retain composure.

Imply though, that somebody is a goof, a nitwit, a laughing stock, in other words someone who can't be taken seriously -- and watch their ego go completely berserko. Those kinds of suggestions, REALLY weaken the individual socially. They hurt badly and seemingly out of proportion, because they represent an existential threat, rooted in historical precedent. The ego defends against humiliation, more than anything else.
I believe there are two main connections used by the demiurge to bleed mankind of it's vital essence.
I believe the connection to society is one.
And I believe the connection to ego is the other.
Ego being different from society, in that it contains inherent flaws, flaws we soon realize after disconnecting from society that are inherent to our person and almost impossible to free ourselves from.
These flaws are different for every person.
But if you take the time to get to really know yourself, you should be capable of becoming aware of them.

[Rich]

Sickness is a Defense against the truth, according to ACIM.


Well, ACIM (A Course In Miracles) is 100% flat wrong about that. :)

Of course, that might be true in some cases. But to lay that on everyone is a cheap, thoughtless, insensitive insult.


Bill, it's not meant as an insult, ACIM teaches that we are all powerful but we cannot see this if we deny responsibility. Our ego interprets taking responsibility for what happens as taking the blame, but it is actually only about admitting our power. Which then gives us the possibility of changing our situation.


Defenses are not unintentional, nor are they made without awareness. They are secret, magic wands you wave when truth appears to threaten what you would believe. They seem to be unconscious but because of the rapidity with which you choose to use them. In that second, even less, in which the choice is made, you recognize exactly what you would attempt to do, and then proceed to think that it is done. Who but yourself evaluates a threat, decides escape is necessary, and sets up a series of defenses to reduce the threat that has been judged as real? All this cannot be done unconsciously. But afterwards, your plan requires that you must forget you made it, so it seems to be external to your own intent; a happening beyond your state of mind, an outcome with a real effect on you, instead of one effected by yourself.


This is from Lesson 136 if someone wants to read it, the book pdf can be downloaded for free.

[AutumnW]

DNA,

I don't disagree that there is a Demi-urge and appreciate the Ayhuasca shamans who describe it and your thoughts about it. We could very well be a species, interfered with, on an emotional, ideological level, that flies under the radar of self observation.

My perception of 'ego' is that it is the self projecting itself into the social sphere. That projection can be mostly authentic or all the way to utterly false. We all fit somewhere on that continuum. If we were born on a desert island and lived out our lives alone, ego wouldn't be an issue. Would it? The demiurge could work on us in a different way, I guess, but not on our ego. It would work on anger, fear, etc... but not on public embarrassment.

For me, the best way to look at solving the problem of demiurge and ego, is to follow the golden rule and try to limit undercutting others -- though I really find it tempting when I feel I am being undermined, myself. And sometimes it's necessary to just disengage, move away from, distance self. But, other than those instances, I think the best way to defeat the demiurge is to love and engage fully. T give others the sense, "I BEHOLD thee."

Too much distance placed between self and those perceived to be in the grip of the demiurge, can feed post human impulses in an atomized society. This might be one of the ultimate meta-jokes being played out by any interfering entity.

They may nurture within us a desire for "safe space," for those trying to escape their influence. Can you imagine the cool clinical detachment and lack of nurturance that could cause and how like the machine we could become.

Corny as it sounds, real and deep enduring love for our fellow man is the only way out of Hell.

[greybeard]

Sickness is a Defense against the truth, according to ACIM.


Well, ACIM (A Course In Miracles) is 100% flat wrong about that. :)

Of course, that might be true in some cases. But to lay that on everyone is a cheap, thoughtless, insensitive insult.


Bill, it's not meant as an insult, ACIM teaches that we are all powerful but we cannot see this if we deny responsibility. Our ego interprets taking responsibility for what happens as taking the blame, but it is actually only about admitting our power. Which then gives us the possibility of changing our situation.


Defenses are not unintentional, nor are they made without awareness. They are secret, magic wands you wave when truth appears to threaten what you would believe. They seem to be unconscious but because of the rapidity with which you choose to use them. In that second, even less, in which the choice is made, you recognize exactly what you would attempt to do, and then proceed to think that it is done. Who but yourself evaluates a threat, decides escape is necessary, and sets up a series of defenses to reduce the threat that has been judged as real? All this cannot be done unconsciously. But afterwards, your plan requires that you must forget you made it, so it seems to be external to your own intent; a happening beyond your state of mind, an outcome with a real effect on you, instead of one effected by yourself.


This is from Lesson 136 if someone wants to read it, the book pdf can be downloaded for free.

The difficulty is context.
If the course in its entirety is studied then it is seen in a different light.
The language used I find a bit difficult to get my head round at times.

Chris

[greybeard]

The ego--don't feed the beast--don't fight it don't give it energy--don't own it--just let it be.
Thats all I need to know.--now!!!
Ch

[AutumnW]

Emex, tcim, in my experience is teaching something that is wrong. It is a grosse over-simplification to declare that anybody is all powerful. In what way? What does it even mean? In it's own way, this kind of thing is as detrimental to the human spirit as the Christian nonsense that we are a bunch of powerless sinners.

[Rich]

Yes Chris, it took me a while to get used to its writing style, and actually understand what it is trying to say.

Autumn we can't believe that we are all powerful and completely loved if we see ourselves as separate from God. I'm not saying I accept complete responsibility but I think it's a helpful thought to keep in mind that God created us perfect, which is what ACIM teaches.

[Flash]

thank you Chris, you are making my job easy. Because I had the exact same feeling as you had with the opening post. Right or wrong does not matter, it is just the feeling I had. This is why I wrote that a mountain is a mountain. And that I did not see the "advanced" in it.

Bill, this is what I meant. I know very well that climbers can and often do have epiphanies after a difficult climb or when they are saving the life of a partner. I know very well too that many highly demanding physical activities (the gold medals of this world) will encounter some real "dépassement" of themselves, leading sometimes to spiritual awakenings.

I also know that for others, the mountain is not physical, but psychological, mystical, in fact, different in appearance. Yet, they will reach the same spiritual awakenings with a different kind of mountain (difficulty). We all have tremendous montains to climb, this is why we are here, to learn on climbing. Some have it soft, and we cannot judge on why: maybe it is karma and they need rest this life around, maybe they are just younger souls in the 3rd dimension learning path and need to go slow, who knows, certainly not me. All I know is that I had my own mountains to climb and they were (are) truthfully very difficult at times.

And surprisingly, the positive and delighful times in life are sometimes as difficult to cross as the hard ones, because they too demand a revision of false beliefs systems (I am going through this at the present time, I am so use to fight for survival that letting go to live a smooth and enjoyable life is a major challenge). A delightful mountain, but nevertheless a mountain.

So, to me, the mountain allegory was somewhat poor in regards of what we go through in life. And not advanced, no more than an illness which is often a mountain as well, no more than scary negative egregores to confront, no more than ETs close encounters for example. Pretty much the same intensity, depending on what one has to learn in order to go forward in its development.

Also, I think we do not use this allegory as much in French as it is used in English, except for the New Testament maybe were you have the calvary (a mountain) and "le mont des Oliviers". So this allegory probably does not have the same cultural weight for me as it has in the English speaking world. Therefore, not that "advanced". In French we will use "displace a mountain - déplacer une montagne" which means a real ardeous enormous task and "to climb a mountain - gravir une montagne" which simply means again something difficult to do (but not with the end being an inner change, a psychological transformation, or a different view on life, we do not use it that way usually, although we are being inundated with English meanings and allegories nowaday).

Talking about climbing mountians: death of Junko Tabei, the first woman to have climb the Everest, today October 23.
Décès de Junko Tabei, la première femme à avoir gravit l’Everest

http://www.kairn.com/deces-de-junko-tabei-la-premiere-femme-a-avoir-gravit-leverest/




MrsEndallBeall

Teaching on what?
Enlightenment---Self Realization--Non-duality.
There are no advance teaching on these that Im aware of.
For me spirituality is finding the answer to the question "Who am I"
It may well be different for you.
Looking forward to your response Mrs
Ch

Hi Greybeard I think this deceptively simple teaching penetrates some pretty subtle levels and is worthy of an advanced teaching.

Replace the word mountain with any difficult predicament you or I commonly face.

For many the word 'mountain' can be analogous to overcoming any problem that serves to prolong human misery, and to attempt to overcome it and fail in the attempt is infinitely preferable to having never tried in the first place. It may well be too high to complete in the first few inexperienced attempts, and this symbolizes a predicament common to every person with high aspirations. Man longs instinctively for a life freed from competition and worry (a definition of happiness?) ; freed from hatred and violence; freed from the need for constant care.

Alas few people even suspect that such a state can exist or can be found. Of those who do entertain such hopes, most will turn away discouraged by saying, “But it’s much too difficult for me!" "Out of a thousand,” Krishna says in the Bhagavad Gita, "one seeks Me." Those who take up the spiritual path for commonly expecting only blissful visions and a comfortable, trouble-free life, become discouraged when they find how often God neglects the roses in favour of thorns.

I was not questioning the mountain story as it is well known and used by quite a few--I think I said I found it useful.
However it was the way that the opening post was presented that led me to query
It was an honest question as to the variety of teaching being offered.
It was as if a superiority was there---as in, I know something that you dont, ive come to share an advanced teaching--thats an assumption.
Advanced suggests superior levels superior knowledge.

There are different levels but they are all equal.
A univerrsity stutent is equal to a primary school pupil learning ABC
The teacher has to know the class he is supposed to be teaching.
Now that was my initial feeling--Im not saying I was right.

If you read the rest of my posts you will see that encouraged Mrs to continue.

Chris

[Flash]

For the ego now,

working with the ego is like "déplacer une montagne - displace a mountain" a very difficult and enormous task at times.

Why working with? Because it means the ego is not having the conducting role, it has a supporting role. Getting rid of the ego as some eastern monks say, is, in my view, ridiculous. The ego exist because we need it in this third dimension world. We need an ego to push us to build a roof over our heads, to find strategies to protect us agains predators, to build a social network where the ego is recognised, in order to motivate us to built a society and to live in it. The ego is necessary, as much as the body is, to live the dream of the 3rd dimension.

A very strong ego is I think always the hall mark of someone on the evolutionary path, as long as the link with the higher self is not cuf off. It is important to deal with this strong ego, and get the higher self into the driver seat, because that very strong ego will first help sharpen our spiritual tools, being a force in itself to tame, and second it will ensure a true and strong incarnation with strong 3D abilities to serve the higher self. In other words, a mushy ego (mushy being in 3D, kind of unable to create life in 3D) with high level spiritual abilities won't help much on this planet.

But, I, the big I, the eternal I, the higher self, the soul or spirit, is/has to be the driver, at all times (which the ego won't let because it perceives the big I as not from this world, which rightfully it is not, and not worthy of ensuring the continuation of its ego/body life. The ego is right, it has been put in place to allow for life continuation in 3D simply because it is an easy way to build the experience. I allows for automatic responses to life situations or life dangers when there is.

The problem arise when the ego is the driver, because it does not know where the next destination is, so it drives us as it can, without a global map. Being afraid for itself, it does not let the higher self in the driver seat and try to fight it. Often, as in the case of the Ellite/cabal, the ego will even cut all links to the higher self without realising that this cut off stems from its first primordial incredible fear.

Therefore, we are caught with ego without higher self who have taken the driving seat of our societies, thinking that their brain understand where they are heading, when in fact they do not.

It is up to us to let our higher selves in our own driver seat so that as a society, we can finally do the same.

_____________

A note: I have not read that anywhere, I came, through much ego stance, fights and work, and through observation of nature and other humans, exchange with developed people, I therefore came to that conclusion. It may change at any time as I get more information, inspiration, creative work, etc.

So I have no references to give of books etc.

-------------------

Oh yes, and I know that the higher self is translating its energies into love very often and
that one path to bypass the ego is the heart path, otherwise it may take 1000s of years to tame that much too use and probably genetically tweaked ego.

[greybeard]

Thanks for your posts Flash which make sense to me.
The best definition I ever read of ego is "Identification with the story of me"

Ramesh Balsekar said "God gave you and ego, let him take it away" I think the operative bit is "let him"

The ego is only a thought which we give great power to by personalizing it as in ownership--my thought

The my extends to everything--My car My house My partner My profession.
When the my is removed so is the power of the ego.

I dont mind so much if a neighbors car is damaged--if its mine a different story.
We live in a materialistic world and it seems our personal worth is noted by the house we live in the car we drive and so on.

There is a saying "That which brings you pleasure, brings you pain"
That new relationship that is the one then turns sour--what then ?
The new car scratched.
All ego.---My story.
Things happen, they dont have to be taken so personally.
The so called ego takes everything personally---It rained on my parade--that was not supposed to happen..
First step I suppose, is realizing that its an egoic, thought then, distancing yourself from it.
Not my thought

"To whom did that thought arise?
It arose to me,
Who is this I ?"

That is a technique taught by Ramana Maharshi.

The enlightened do not see anything as separate--different but not separate as we see it.
The finger is part of the hand but not the hand,
The wave is part of the ocean but not the ocean.

The enlightened do not have an ego--there is not an individual separate person there to have an ego.
The ego is a separation device.
It makes you think you are separate from creation.
Wayne Dyer said it stands for Edge God Out.

Ch

[Chester]

To use an analogy, if you are hiking up a
mountain, the person at the top of the mountain has a
better understanding of the mountain and a better view
and can see more than the person still at the base of
the mountain. Just because you think you know the
entire mountain from standing at the bottom and
looking up doesn’t mean that you know the mountain.
The person standing at the top of the mountain will
know more about the mountain because they have the
experience of climbing it and being at the top of it. It
doesn’t mean they are better, smarter, more intelligent,
or more spiritual because they are at the top of the
mountain, it means they have a different and greater
perspective than they had before they climbed the
mountain. It also means they have a greater
understanding of the mountain and a better view than
the person still standing in the foothills that has never
climbed the mountain.

I agree with this quote based on my own experience.

I recall in my younger days that all too often I believed I had a combination of 1.) basic knowledge and 2.) my own personal ability to "get stuff" that I could understand what I needed regarding just about anything including deeply profound spiritual concepts.

Fortunately I have continued to be open minded about most everything, including the possibility I may have a better (greater) perspective when I reach milestones such as climbing to the top of a mountain. Another thing I have learned is... there are always taller mountains.

When I consider the possibility of an eternal journey, I hope there is always taller mountains.

[Chester]

I want to add this -

I went through a stage of life where I thought I had something to teach to others. That was a very long stage of my life. Fortunately (with perhaps the exception of a rare post of this nature now and then), I have mostly 'grown' out of this stage. Perhaps that I rarely post is a reflection of that. Part of why I am no longer much able to offer anything that appears to be 'teaching' is because I have discovered so much depends on perspective. For some folks this is easily resolved by adopting the perspective of what words can only point to - non-duality as one word.

Yet still, is that not a perspective? I rest in the comfort that I am "the timeless, formless eternal one life" (Eckhart Tolle) yet when I accidentally drop that heavy brick on my toe and find myself hopping up and down screaming in pain, I accept that at that very moment, my perspective is reduced to the self reflective and physically incarnate being known as Sam Hunter, a completely different perspective. In addition, I hold hope that there be an individuation of what is, at least, the essence of "me" which survives the death of the physical container. I call this hope, "me, the spirit."

There's three perspectives alone. And when I consider the possibility of the lovely Gnostic myths being more than just myths, perhaps that explains this thing called "the soul" considering "the soul" just might be the very "container" within which "me, the spirit" is held. And for this I find that I am constantly recycled into a matrix produced by some third party (the demiurge?) and perceived by my lower aspects of being as "against my will."

Ooooops, I think I slipped into some bad habits - is "suggesting possibility" close enough to "teaching?"

[AutumnW]

Emex, tcim, in my experience is teaching something that is wrong. It is a grosse over-simplification to declare that anybody is all powerful. In what way? What does it even mean? In it's own way, this kind of thing is as detrimental to the human spirit as the Christian nonsense that we are a bunch of powerless sinners.

Emex,

This came off as pretty aggressive. I have to remember that the written word, weirdly enough, rather than softening our responses can harden them. Let me expand just a bit here. When somebody uses the term 'all powerful,' it can mean such different things to different people. I think this is the original point you made and I should have heeded it. In it's purest form power is just energy, like electricity and can be applied to anything. Power in conjunction with love, care and concern can make us all powerful, in a sense.

I took the 'all powerful,' too literally after you attempted to provide context. I'm sorry.:sun:

[Ewan]

The guy who introduced me to an awakening said at one point to me.. "..you can't function in this dimension without an ego, but let it be the passenger and not the driver."

He also used to tell a tale where there was a coach and horses, a coach driver and a passenger. He said the average human sits in the carriage unaware where he is going, the ego holds the reins and the emotions (horses) are much too free to do as they please.
The awakening human would climb up onto the seat next to the driver and tell it where to go, further along the path they would let the ego take the back seat. With the horses under full control and the voice of the ego now back in the carriage there was no reason the driver could not reach whatever destiantion he set his mind to.

[earthadvocate]

Replying to your long post Mrs EndallBeall, and I think only you can answer this:
I was reading the part 1 of the "we are not alone " series on page 254 when you mention about "the appearance of certain Gnostic traditions that reared their ugly head in the Cathar religion" you mentioned about them been an outcome of the Isis cult?
I happen to do a personal study on the Cathar from France, I actually was there in the Cathar region of France just over a month ago visiting my brother who lives near Toulouse (I was born in France) every time I go there to visit I study a little more about the Cathar.
It was a very intriguing movement who came out of no were around the year 1000, there was other countries in Europe were they appeared as well, but the difference with what the Isis cult were practicing is they did not believe in baptism with water, it was done with the laying of hands, and only willing adult were baptized which they called "consolation", also they did not believe in the trinity and took no interest in the cross because in their eyes Jesus died in the cross and that was nothing to be celebrated upon .
Also they treated woman as equal to men (not superior) , I needed to let you know because you mention about how baptism with water started before Christ in the cult of Isis, and that you were putting the Cathar in that category as in the Isis tradition.