...so then, what should each of us do?

[Chester]

On another thread I read the following post -


"The 'left' are unaware we're monitoring for them as well as they will be in the crosshairs of the globalists right behind and along side us. Just because conservative americans are first on the list to be crushed by the globalists doesn't mean the left tools are not on the list. They are just blissfully unaware of anything right now except their bogeyman."

Some day, SOME DAY, Trump supporters will have the scales fall from their eyes and realize that their 'champion' has sold them out to the moneyed interests of globalism. When the legions of 'plundermonkeys' (Steven King's term) have destroyed the environment, driven the lower classes into destitution with slave wages and unaffordable health care and when only the children of the rich are able to attend decent schools, there will come a time - a "What have we done?" moment of horrified awareness. Then and only then will America be prepared to come together and start the rebirth of their stricken nation.

Right now, the Trump supporters are just blissfully unaware of anything right now except their 'champion'.

B.

The post seems to suggest all are doomed to permanent enslavement... (unless we exclude from the inclusive set of 'all' anyone who may not align in anyway with either bias... but this would be a very small carve out).

And though the post seems to emphasize that Trump supporters are blissfully blind and that 'conservative Americans' are first on the list for crushing... the comment also points out how the 'left' will soon be targeted and that the 'left' are also blissfully blind because of their myopic focus on DJT, their bogeyman.

My question is - what can the individual do that can change the hopeless path this post suggests we all might be on?

I ask this because if all we do is point fingers at the lunacy of the other side of our own individual bias what good might that do?

I also then ask, if we point fingers at all should we not also offer suggestions as to how we all might avoid this potential hopeless inevitability?

Can anyone who might read this post offer realistic solutions that may give us all a realistic chance to avoid the outcome desired by the current batch of globalists?

[Noelle]

I think all we can do right now is hope that the path the post suggests is wrong. In time -- sooner than later, I hope -- we will have a better idea.

[Helene West]

On another thread I read the following post -


"The 'left' are unaware we're monitoring for them as well as they will be in the crosshairs of the globalists right behind and along side us. Just because conservative americans are first on the list to be crushed by the globalists doesn't mean the left tools are not on the list. They are just blissfully unaware of anything right now except their bogeyman."

Some day, SOME DAY, Trump supporters will have the scales fall from their eyes and realize that their 'champion' has sold them out to the moneyed interests of globalism. When the legions of 'plundermonkeys' (Steven King's term) have destroyed the environment, driven the lower classes into destitution with slave wages and unaffordable health care and when only the children of the rich are able to attend decent schools, there will come a time - a "What have we done?" moment of horrified awareness. Then and only then will America be prepared to come together and start the rebirth of their stricken nation.

Right now, the Trump supporters are just blissfully unaware of anything right now except their 'champion'.

B.

The post seems to suggest all are doomed to permanent enslavement... (unless we exclude from the inclusive set of 'all' anyone who may not align in anyway with either bias... but this would be a very small carve out).

And though the post seems to emphasize that Trump supporters are blissfully blind and that 'conservative Americans' are first on the list for crushing... the comment also points out how the 'left' will soon be targeted and that the 'left' are also blissfully blind because of their myopic focus on DJT, their bogeyman.

My question is - what can the individual do that can change the hopeless path this post suggests we all might be on?

I ask this because if all we do is point fingers at the lunacy of the other side of our own individual bias what good might that do?

I also then ask, if we point fingers at all should we not also offer suggestions as to how we all might avoid this potential hopeless inevitability?

Can anyone who might read this post offer realistic solutions that may give us all a realistic chance to avoid the outcome desired by the current batch of globalists?

Extremely sorry and sad to say, and this is only in the backburner if there is no improvement or real unity in the country/culture in the near future, secession could be a real possibility.

[Baby Steps]

It's very hard.

On the one hand I believe that we are over preoccupied with the 'how', in other words if the mass of people grasped the degree of corruption and manipulation, the situation could change rapidly and easily, because the nonsense would not be tolerated for a second. Very heartening.

but on the other, it is not for us or anybody to bring people to a better realisation because:

1. As we all know they can be told, told, evidenced, bombarded etc, but they will only embrace when THEY decide to
2. Karmically & Spiritually I do not feel it's my job to try and convince people of this or that, as it might interfere with the process of learning that their soul has elected to experience.

So what's left?

I do interact & discuss, and that process has triggered me to do alot of work on my own immaturity and egotism, I have learned to drop the need to be right, or win the argument, etc. We can all grow- personal growth. That is an act of service to all those who one interacts with, because THEY will have a better interaction. Plenty to do. Grateful I am here for the ride.

[Truglivartna]

My answer would be: "Go with it"...being always conscious that the third dimension is, by its very nature, "Dual" and serves its function by its "cyclic" nature.

One could easily call attention to the two-party system (or even the "multi-party" system) as being a perfect illustration of the old adage: "A house divided against itself cannot stand".

And yet duality does serve its ultimate purpose of creating soul perspective.

[turiya]

On another thread I read the following post -




Right now, the Trump supporters are just blissfully unaware of anything right now except their 'champion'.
B.
Can anyone who might read this post offer realistic solutions that may give us all a realistic chance to avoid the outcome desired by the current batch of globalists?

The writer that you speak of, Sam, is blissfully unaware, and has no doubt forgotten (like so many), that the True Champion of the American people is the Constitution... it has been undermined & subjugated by the False song of Globalism...


Trump: I will not surrender Americanism
to false song of globalism.
(Published on Apr 27, 2016)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EOyma_8dFm0

[halcyon026]

I also then ask, if we point fingers at all should we not also offer suggestions as to how we all might avoid this potential hopeless inevitability?

Can anyone who might read this post offer realistic solutions that may give us all a realistic chance to avoid the outcome desired by the current batch of globalists?

I'm sure you'll get a full range of opinions on what to change/do to stop this, so this will just be one of many ideas, however I feel pretty strongly that the path to our freedom is to outlaw money. That's it... Outlaw money. The tough part is how would you outlaw money...

I think if you follow that through to who it will end, the industries it will end, the rulers it will end, the power structures it would end, etc it would be a huge game changer. For years now I've said, for me the sign that humans have evolved will be the day they outlaw money. Anything short of that to me won't be evolving, it will be rearranging the furniture in the jail cell and calling it freedom.

Everyone has their view on reality, on how other planets civilizations operate, etc. I'm of the opinion that the evolved races out there don't use money, it only slows us down and breads corruption and corrupt rulers. Money is a main tool, the foundation of keeping us enslaved, which is why they've conditioned us to want to end all bad things about modern Earth except money, no one wants to give up money, no one talks about giving up money. We talk about ending the Cabal, while we search for ways to make money, use money, we research economics, follow stock markets, etc but we don't give it up, we don't walk away from it, we insist it is as real and needed as food.

Part of what the Cabal has done is set us up against ourselves. We want to fight and we get on PA to talk about all this, then we go to work and pay taxes that go to building bombs and arming groups like ISIS. We want to stop oil pipe lines so thousands of people fill up their cars with Gas and drive hundreds of miles to say they don't want oil. All of this is made possible because we are seemingly dependent on their fake money.

It's a bit hard to say that humans would force an outlaw of money, with how we seem to be it seems more likely, something huge would have to happen, something else that takes the money away, our lives away, our environment away, and then people might say well let's just not bring money back. But for the masses to band together to outlaw that which they love so much... we can hope.

I think UBUNTU is one of the best/closest stabs at what could help get us those next steps towards true freedom on Earth, which includes the end of poverty and war.


There is another answer I'd give to this too, that deals more with our consciousness creating this reality, but that didn't seem like it was in scope for the type of answer you were looking for & less people are into the idea that your consciousness affects 3D reality more than your physical 'Doing' does. So my answer is outlaw money. :)

I would like to add to what Baby Steps mentioned... I feel strongly about Beings being free to do the 'trip' they are here to do, suffering included. If 3D was designed by us, for us, or by God, for God, to come here to suffer, then why would we want to 'fix' things? We'd be taking away our training grounds...

Do we assume that our human minds are so well informed that we can say 100%, that because suffering is here, something is 'wrong'?? Is there zero chance our souls designed/allow this place for us to experience this duality in a way that is safe to our souls? Like us plugging into a VR game and becoming someone else who can die in game, and the real us is safe. This body can die and it's perfectly safe for me to shed it, I can suffer here and my soul is perfectly safe.

[Baby Steps]

Can anyone who might read this post offer realistic solutions that may give us all a realistic chance to avoid the outcome desired by the current batch of globalists?

How about a really credible non partisan fact checker? Does such a thing exist outside the control structures?

[Ewan]

There is no solution.

There is a practice that one can try to adopt though it, (at least in the first instance), takes considerable effort and dedication.

I made a post elsewhere recently, another forum, where several repliers responded emotionally rather than with reason. Someone said they were sick of 'moral equivalency - that if they do it, it is okay for me to do it also'. I had to explain that I was suggesting the 'moral equivalency' was turned around to look at their (our) own beliefs/standpoint. That it would be beneficial to consider if our own actions, thoughts, beliefs were in any way similar to that which we accuse the 'other side' of doing. Even with that explanation it still fell on deaf ears.

So my suggestion to the individual would be to engage in introspection. To consider whether there are similarities with their own thought processes to those of the people that seem to be so different.

It is a simple solution to circumvent emotional thinking, but it is difficult to initiate. There is so much wisdom to be found in the bible, and a phrase therein adequately emphasises that very point. Sorting the wheat from the chaff. Within the bible there is some wheat, most of it is chaff though. :)

Cast thee not pearls before swine.
Let he who has ears to hear, hear.
Some seed fell on stony ground and would not grow, whilst some fell on fertile ground and grew abundantly.

I've even hammered the history of 'divide and conquer' at people and still failed to get through when it came to current events.

You cannot make stony ground fertile without 50,000 years of inclement weather. Sadly.

We can pray for light I suppose, truth will shine like diamonds and gold if there is enough light. :)

[Gillian]

As I have mentioned elsewhere, the only logical first step to freeing humanity from slavery is disclosure. How one individual can achieve this, I have no idea. I talk openly about it with my family members, most of whom are clueless but too polite to say I am batty. Some of them might even believe in or be open to the possibility of ET manipulation of humans. I was also quite open about the subject with fellow employees.

I suppose a mass strike might help, but again, that is not an individual action. In other words, if the majority of workers refused to work and instead, gathered and sat or stood en mass in front of local places of government and demanded changes, something might be done.

[Michelle Marie]

There is a solution.

Stop paying attention to politics that uses divide and conquer strategies.

Raise the vision to unity and peace. Ignore and eliminate the energy flow to what is not working and use our inner intelligence to rise above in vibration and vision.

It seems to me that many have fallen into energy draining traps and are not lifting their vibration to Spirit to be at the cause of creation, rather they are being used energetically to support these lower vibrational effects.

The whole answer is to shift the awareness and attention to the new world that is being formed by the silent visionaries.

Be still and know...that is the solution.

Call in the Light! Be the Light! Pray and meditate...be the cause. Be higher. See higher.

My focus is on inspiration education. I'm also doing what I just mentioned.

Totally focused on solutions, we may replace the past effects with a brighter future for everyone.

Guaranteed it is coming regardless of outer appearances.

Divine Love is a vibration. Look to the Light within. Catch the vision of what is truly coming!

"Perfect love casts out all fear."

:heart: All,
MM

[Bubu]

My question is - what can the individual do that can change the hopeless path this post suggests we all might be on?

most of the problem we have are imagined

[Michelle Marie]

My question is - what can the individual do that can change the hopeless path this post suggests we all might be on?

most of the problem we have are imagined

The power of an individual to change himself (including what has been imagined) is the greatest power.

[NancyV]

If you've read a lot of history you know that eventually all civilizations fall. Thinking that we can change human nature to be always loving, kind and empathetic is fooling oneself (in my opinion). We've always had wars, we've always killed others in either defense or offense. I don't see human nature changing and pretending that WE, as a group, will evolve into peaceful, loving beings is sort of a holdover from the hippie era or the preaching of some religions/cults. We do live in the duality so we have good and evil, weak and strong, male and female, etc etc. I'm perfectly happy being here and I certainly don't expect it to even be close to what it's like in the other dimensions. Since I've been to many other dimensions many times, I know it's a LOT more awesome there than here, even in the lower astral. But while I'm here I intend to enjoy it.

If you want peace and love on a continual basis, why did you come here to this world of extremes? At least we can say it isn't boring here! We probably were tired of eternal love and feeling at one with all and decided to jump into the fires of the creation. So here we are. If our western civilization is approaching a huge upheaval, which it looks like it is, it might be wise to prepare for your own and your family's survival. Buy guns, ammo, food that can be stored and get the heck out of the big cities and don't live near a big city. Well, I suppose it might be exciting to be in the thick of it in a huge city when everything is falling apart, but I'll choose to sit out here in the hills of West Virginia with no large cities nearby and continue buying ammo, more weapons and survival gear.

I'm hoping that Trump being elected means that a huge event, like civil war, a race war, a war of the liberals against conservatives...whatever... will be delayed. If Hillary had won, the deterioration of this country would have been greatly hastened. I do get a good laugh at all the idiots protesting and clamoring for war or overthrowing Trump. Most of them are anti guns, in fact we conservatives have most of the weapons, most of the brains, almost all of the "balls", and the military, law enforcement, sheriffs, etc. are pretty much on our side of the divide.

Hopefully it won't happen until after I'm dead and y'all can have a good time without me. LOL... But I've always thought it would happen while I'm here. I'm getting pretty old but I'm still a good shot and I guess that would be as good a way to go as any other.
:)

[DeDukshyn]

My question is - what can the individual do that can change the hopeless path this post suggests we all might be on?

most of the problem we have are imagined

100% agreed - except there's also the "believed" problems -imagined by someone else to feed their agenda / ego and then "believed" by others just because it matched an emotional element, but without any verification at all ... It's a general statement that applies to everyone -- (as a test,we can observe ourselves and our thoughts, and try to find that line between what you emotionally align with and that which you actually KNOW as fact (have experienced it and reviewed it "objectively") -- good chance these don't line up at all. At this point it might be good for us to observe how our emotional alignments don't ever care for or consider reality. Most people never even think to do this or are afraid of what they might actually find.

[Wind]

Keep on developing yourself, keep your heart as generous and caring. Share the good.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/4b/eb/35/4beb35db89053876eba17ac36214cc10.jpg

[Fellow Aspirant]

Hello Sam

It is I, Fellow Aspirant, who posted this (you can see my board name right over there, above my cozy screech owl avatar!). I also go by the name of Brian, as in Brian Childerhose. Please feel free to use my name in any and all subsequent posts.

And I'd like to first clear up some confusion that may exist about the nature of the post. I was negligent in not doing a "Reply With Quote" format, instead choosing to 'cut 'n' paste' the portion of a post that I was replying to. Thus, if the reader does not notice the wee tiny quotation marks that I used, this statement ...

""The 'left' are unaware we're monitoring for them as well as they will be in the crosshairs of the globalists right behind and along side us. Just because conservative americans are first on the list to be crushed by the globalists doesn't mean the left tools are not on the list. They are just blissfully unaware of anything right now except their bogeyman."

.. can be construed to be linked in meaning to what I wrote as a rebuttal to it. Which is to say (again) ...

"Some day, SOME DAY, Trump supporters will have the scales fall from their eyes and realize that their 'champion' has sold them out to the moneyed interests of globalism. When the legions of 'plundermonkeys' (Stephen King's term) have destroyed the environment, driven the lower classes into destitution with slave wages and unaffordable health care and when only the children of the rich are able to attend decent schools, there will come a time - a "What have we done?" moment of horrified awareness. Then and only then will America be prepared to come together and start the rebirth of their stricken nation.

Right now, the Trump supporters are just blissfully unaware of anything right now except their 'champion'.

B.


Given that I had (too cleverly, I see :facepalm:) reworked the claimant's last line to reflect how easily the reverse argument could be made, reading the two statements together made for a rather self-contradictory and therefore confusing message. Mea culpa.

The lower one is my stance, and I stand by my claim.

So, to move on to a consideration of your question, and a good one it is, my response would be that yes, of course there is hope. And it will be manifests in the forms of those who, like 'Wind' mentions, are willing to help others. At the end of the Trump presidency fiasco, there will be millions of Americans of good spirit that will take on the Herculean task of repairing the damage that has been done to your country and our planet. And, if my predictions are correct, the former Trump supporters will be shoulder to shoulder with their compatriots, undertaking the rebuilding.

Unless, UNLESS, the country remains in the control of the dark forces of The Cabal. This is a strong possibility. Greed has a way of insinuating itself into every nook and cranny of human endeavour, and barring some magic intervention in human nature's makeup, impossible to eradicate altogether.

So, although I would wish, along with the current Trump base, that he will be able to truly 'reset' the way things are done, it will be business as usual - but this time on steroids. Rather than casting the man as a champion charging into the camp of the enemy (or leaping into "The Swamp") to vanquish the evil that everyone knows is there, I consider his actual role to be one of a Trojan Horse. That is, he is being used by the greedy to regain control of the government and the economy. One look at his cabinet is enough to confirm that Mammon is about to hold full sway, in a manner not seen since the days of the robber barons. Every regulation now in place to protect America's investors, middle and working class taxpayers, workers, educational system, and environment will soon be dismantled and scrapped in the interests of making money for the obscenely rich. :cash: And we all know who wins, then.

Trump's character will sooner or later put him into a position where he will be impeached, and Mike Pence will take the reins, just as the GOP establishment planned all along. That's the Mike Pence that stands against abortion and gay rights. (He considers homosexuality to be a sickness, one that can be "cured" with appropriate therapy.) And good luck to the women in America who have worked so hard to improve their condition with respect to health care or wages. Likewise, voting rights for blacks and visible minorities will be curtailed.

And don't think that you will be able to legally protest anything you disagree with, especially if the approach of the state of North Dakota is adopted nation wide. The Standing Rock protests, which are about to ramp up precipitously now that the US Army Corps of Engineers has green lighted the oil pipeline (thanks Donald!) will become potentially lethal thanks to a bill that absolves from blame any motorist that ploughs into protesters (on the road) as long as the driver can claim that it was an accident. Crossing the road will make you a target. :car: :yuck:

Those who would commit terrorist acts against the United States can save their energy - the country is busy demolishing itself from within.

Like I said, it will be challenging to 'reset' America to the once great country that it was before it became so angry and distracted. The first change must come in the minds of its citizens, so that they do not see each other as enemy factions. Challenging, but not impossible. Soon, as I say, the mistake of having trusted Trump will become self evident and most of his supporters will acknowledge it. Then the work of getting control back from the bankers and their greed-driven clients can begin.

Signed, (this one time :sun:)

Brian Childerhose

[Innocent Warrior]

My question is - what can the individual do that can change the hopeless path this post suggests we all might be on?

Starve what's destructive, feed what's constructive, and breathe and enjoy your life.

[Noelle]

I also then ask, if we point fingers at all should we not also offer suggestions as to how we all might avoid this potential hopeless inevitability?

Can anyone who might read this post offer realistic solutions that may give us all a realistic chance to avoid the outcome desired by the current batch of globalists?

I'm sure you'll get a full range of opinions on what to change/do to stop this, so this will just be one of many ideas, however I feel pretty strongly that the path to our freedom is to outlaw money. That's it... Outlaw money. The tough part is how would you outlaw money...

I think if you follow that through to who it will end, the industries it will end, the rulers it will end, the power structures it would end, etc it would be a huge game changer. For years now I've said, for me the sign that humans have evolved will be the day they outlaw money. Anything short of that to me won't be evolving, it will be rearranging the furniture in the jail cell and calling it freedom.

Everyone has their view on reality, on how other planets civilizations operate, etc. I'm of the opinion that the evolved races out there don't use money, it only slows us down and breads corruption and corrupt rulers. Money is a main tool, the foundation of keeping us enslaved, which is why they've conditioned us to want to end all bad things about modern Earth except money, no one wants to give up money, no one talks about giving up money. We talk about ending the Cabal, while we search for ways to make money, use money, we research economics, follow stock markets, etc but we don't give it up, we don't walk away from it, we insist it is as real and needed as food.

Part of what the Cabal has done is set us up against ourselves. We want to fight and we get on PA to talk about all this, then we go to work and pay taxes that go to building bombs and arming groups like ISIS. We want to stop oil pipe lines so thousands of people fill up their cars with Gas and drive hundreds of miles to say they don't want oil. All of this is made possible because we are seemingly dependent on their fake money.

It's a bit hard to say that humans would force an outlaw of money, with how we seem to be it seems more likely, something huge would have to happen, something else that takes the money away, our lives away, our environment away, and then people might say well let's just not bring money back. But for the masses to band together to outlaw that which they love so much... we can hope.

I think UBUNTU is one of the best/closest stabs at what could help get us those next steps towards true freedom on Earth, which includes the end of poverty and war.


There is another answer I'd give to this too, that deals more with our consciousness creating this reality, but that didn't seem like it was in scope for the type of answer you were looking for & less people are into the idea that your consciousness affects 3D reality more than your physical 'Doing' does. So my answer is outlaw money. :)

I would like to add to what Baby Steps mentioned... I feel strongly about Beings being free to do the 'trip' they are here to do, suffering included. If 3D was designed by us, for us, or by God, for God, to come here to suffer, then why would we want to 'fix' things? We'd be taking away our training grounds...

Do we assume that our human minds are so well informed that we can say 100%, that because suffering is here, something is 'wrong'?? Is there zero chance our souls designed/allow this place for us to experience this duality in a way that is safe to our souls? Like us plugging into a VR game and becoming someone else who can die in game, and the real us is safe. This body can die and it's perfectly safe for me to shed it, I can suffer here and my soul is perfectly safe.

I'm ready for the abolition of money!

[uzn]

Right on LadyM. People always think that without Money it will not work. Thats false programming. It´s only for the last 6000 Years that humankind has been enslaved by the babylonian Money Magic System. It worked before and it will work after. The System is already dead, it is just being kept alive like a comapatient in a Hospital with all sorts of infusions.

The Nightmare of Capitalism has already become a Reality.
http://c1.staticflickr.com/7/6104/6293307900_cb0d501158_b.jpg
Since 1989 1% own more than the 99% of humanity. Equality ????
in 2016 Forbes showed that 8 Superrich own more than half of the rest of humanity.
In 2016 1% earned as much as the remaining 99%.
This is continuing and getting more extreem. Make your own conclusions where this is leading.

This is roughly translated from Diego Fusaro, Professor of Philosophy at the University of Mailand.

There is a good chinese saying:
If we dont change the course,
we might end up where we steering.


In General I would suggest to first become Aware of whats Happening. And than act upon it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phHx29_Ijhs

[DNA]

It's hard for me to extract an absolute in your question. I suppose there are quite a few small questions begging for one to accept the big question, and some where I was lost and unable to proceed.


The future you suggest is nebulous in terms of knowing what it means. This statement for instance could be taken many ways, and believe it or not, not all of them are bad.
The post seems to suggest all are doomed to permanent enslavement
Sometimes slaves are treated rather well. Sometimes ignorance is bliss.
And I'm sure we could find some type of slavery that is preferential to many living conditions on Earth right now.

My question is - what can the individual do that can change the hopeless path this post suggests we all might be on?
I'll tell you where I think your question is off.
We are not slated to be slaves, we are slated to die. The lucky are slated to be slaves. And there will be very few at that.
You probably do not want to know what I think we are in for. I'll answer if you ask, but most don't want to hear it.
Suffice it to say the agenda is outlined in the Denver Airport Murals.
It's funny really. Folks always respond with this question as if they understand greed. "Why would they kill us? How are they going to continue to keep making money if they kill us all off, that doesn't make any sense".
To this my reply is these people have more money than God, these people have enough money for a hundred generations of their descendents to live in unparralelled splendor the problem is this, they found out that the carrying capacity of the earth has been reached in terms of human beings and that their vast sum of money won't continue on because the earth will no longer be able to sustain human life after about five generations.
We should have a thread asking the question "Are the Globalists Correct?" In so far as the long term is concerned they very well might be correct.

[Feritciva]

On another thread I read the following post -


"The 'left' are unaware we're monitoring for them as well as they will be in the crosshairs of the globalists right behind and along side us. Just because conservative americans are first on the list to be crushed by the globalists doesn't mean the left tools are not on the list. They are just blissfully unaware of anything right now except their bogeyman."

Some day, SOME DAY, Trump supporters will have the scales fall from their eyes and realize that their 'champion' has sold them out to the moneyed interests of globalism.

Right now, the Trump supporters are just blissfully unaware of anything right now except their 'champion'.

B.



I certainly & definitely agree with above lines. I havent read anything about Trump on this forum - as it will be a huge disappointment for me to see some truthseekers might see Trump as "saviour" or "solution" to smth.

(Takes a deep breath)

Guys, friends, Romans... You will exactly live what we experienced/and still live here in Turkey for last 14-15 years. Trust me, it will NOT be good, NOT a solution to anything, it will be plain and simple stupidity. What you'll see & hear from now on will mock your common sense, your brain, your intelligence.

Welcome to right wing conspiracy-sauced imbecility.

[DNA]

I certainly & definitely agree with above lines. I havent read anything about Trump on this forum - as it will be a huge disappointment for me to see some truthseekers might see Trump as "saviour" or "solution" to smth.
(Takes a deep breath)
I'm not religious so I've never really looked at anyone as a "savior" but I believe Trump is aware of much evil in the US Government and that he is trying to oppose it. I wait with baited breath everyday to see what is going on. I've very happy with what Trump has done so far.


Guys, friends, Romans... You will exactly live what we experienced/and still live here in Turkey for last 14-15 years. Trust me, it will NOT be good, NOT a solution to anything, it will be plain and simple stupidity. What you'll see & hear from now on will mock your common sense, your brain, your intelligence.

Welcome to right wing conspiracy-sauced imbecility.
Well no need for name calling.
But if you depend on the main stream media for your news and points of view on the world I could just as easily counter with "Welcome to the world of zombies who have been trained to only trust the opinions of state approved academics and state approved actors reading teleprompters posing as journalists".

[WhiteLove]

Based on what I have experienced, in communication with God, God said it really simply: "Just love unconditionally". Three words, no more, no less, yet these three words when combined, form a powerful and true way forward for beings into the higher realms of existence. :heart:

[Chester]

Howdy Brian, first my own apologies. I read your original post at least 4 or 5 times because something just didn’t seem quite right about it. Yet finally, I settled on interpreting the post as I did which now, based on your response, clearly shows I was mistaken. In fact, if I had remembered what I read in this post by Helene West here (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?95893-Trump-The-Great-American-Reset&p=1133258&viewfull=1#post1133258), I wouldn’t have experienced my confusion. Yet having said this, it is interesting how all this has evolved, yes?

I will now begin my response to your post here (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?95913-...so-then-what-should-each-of-us-do&p=1133457&viewfull=1#post1133457)

That I understand (now) that you actually have a stance…


"Some day, SOME DAY, Trump supporters will have the scales fall from their eyes and realize that their 'champion' has sold them out to the moneyed interests of globalism. When the legions of 'plundermonkeys' (Stephen King's term) have destroyed the environment, driven the lower classes into destitution with slave wages and unaffordable health care and when only the children of the rich are able to attend decent schools, there will come a time - a "What have we done?" moment of horrified awareness. Then and only then will America be prepared to come together and start the rebirth of their stricken nation.

Right now, the Trump supporters are just blissfully unaware of anything right now except their 'champion'.

B.





The lower one is my stance, and I stand by my claim.

…I feel compelled to use “the snippet routine” but I also will strive not to take any single segment and present it out of context.

After you clarified that you were responding to Helene Wests’s post, you begin to express your opinions, the first being that, “of course, there is hope.” I was glad to read that as it is my opinion (just an opinion) that we create our reality experience at every level of our being. If enough of us gave up hope perhaps that may reduce our chances in achieving a more preferred 3D shared reality experience, if not for ourselves, at least for our descendants.

Your very next words are “And it will be manifests in the forms of those who, like 'Wind' mentions, are willing to help others.” I ask everyone… who can argue with that?

I would also likely add that it may be just as important that based on one’s reasonable capacity to do so, perhaps each of us should also help ourselves as this demonstrates taking seriously one’s own personal responsibility and IMO (again just opinion), nothing teaches anyone else anything any more important than the example we demonstrate to others in our behavior.

OK, so… so far both of us have shared our opinions. Who knows if the opinions we may share that have common ground are correct and who knows if my own opinion with regards to the importance that might be placed on personal responsibility may be viewed as valid in the eyes of others as to what we should expect from all or at least most folks in the world today. Note I wish to emphasize the segment of my own statement - "based on one’s reasonable capacity", as this is what I wish to focus upon further on... but first, these questions.


Assuming most can agree we should all help others, should the help that would be provided by any single individual be determined by anyone other than that single individual?


If so, how would that determination be made and who or what should make it?


I hope folks will consider answering this question. I will share my response and do so using real life experiences for support of my opinions… but first, I hope Brian might respond and/or other members might weigh in.

[peggy englebrake]

If you are playing high stakes poker and you come to realize the game is rigged, what do you do? The only sane thing to do is walk away from playing the game. You can't change the game while playing the game. You must create what you want outside the game..We are like rats in a cage on a "exercise" wheel. History is circular and appears to repeat about every 80 years. Now that the wheel is rusted, the cage is dirty, the water is foul and the food is contaminated many people are starting to realize where they are and are trying to figure out how to escape. There is chaos and confusion. And thats where we are now. How to get outside the cage? You are already doing it. With ideas, like in this blog, of a society that is freed from the control of money/debt (this was unthinkable a few decades ago) Or the creation (or revealment) of free energy Or the 3D replicators. And so on; just like the introduction of planes, then personal cars, then TV, then the internet-all these things changed the way people thought (I was born at the end of WW2 and experienced these changes and how they affected my neighborhood my thinking) When you are young you may realize it's a fixed game but you believe if you just work harder, better, longer you can beat the game.

[Bubu]

My question is - what can the individual do that can change the hopeless path this post suggests we all might be on?

most of the problem we have are imagined

100% agreed - except there's also the "believed" problems -imagined by someone else to feed their agenda / ego and then "believed" by others just because it matched an emotional element, but without any verification at all ... It's a general statement that applies to everyone -- (as a test,we can observe ourselves and our thoughts, and try to find that line between what you emotionally align with and that which you actually KNOW as fact (have experienced it and reviewed it "objectively") -- good chance these don't line up at all. At this point it might be good for us to observe how our emotional alignments don't ever care for or consider reality. Most people never even think to do this or are afraid of what they might actually find.

Good point in my case I rarely use emotion in fact checking I despise alignments, its the enemy of the truth. Not my doing I was born like this.

[Gemma13]

If you've read a lot of history you know that eventually all civilizations fall. Thinking that we can change human nature to be always loving, kind and empathetic is fooling oneself (in my opinion). We've always had wars, we've always killed others in either defense or offense. I don't see human nature changing and pretending that WE, as a group, will evolve into peaceful, loving beings is sort of a holdover from the hippie era or the preaching of some religions/cults. We do live in the duality so we have good and evil, weak and strong, male and female, etc etc. I'm perfectly happy being here and I certainly don't expect it to even be close to what it's like in the other dimensions. Since I've been to many other dimensions many times, I know it's a LOT more awesome there than here, even in the lower astral. But while I'm here I intend to enjoy it.

If you want peace and love on a continual basis, why did you come here to this world of extremes? At least we can say it isn't boring here! We probably were tired of eternal love and feeling at one with all and decided to jump into the fires of the creation. So here we are. If our western civilization is approaching a huge upheaval, which it looks like it is, it might be wise to prepare for your own and your family's survival. Buy guns, ammo, food that can be stored and get the heck out of the big cities and don't live near a big city. Well, I suppose it might be exciting to be in the thick of it in a huge city when everything is falling apart, but I'll choose to sit out here in the hills of West Virginia with no large cities nearby and continue buying ammo, more weapons and survival gear.

I'm hoping that Trump being elected means that a huge event, like civil war, a race war, a war of the liberals against conservatives...whatever... will be delayed. If Hillary had won, the deterioration of this country would have been greatly hastened. I do get a good laugh at all the idiots protesting and clamoring for war or overthrowing Trump. Most of them are anti guns, in fact we conservatives have most of the weapons, most of the brains, almost all of the "balls", and the military, law enforcement, sheriffs, etc. are pretty much on our side of the divide.

Hopefully it won't happen until after I'm dead and y'all can have a good time without me. LOL... But I've always thought it would happen while I'm here. I'm getting pretty old but I'm still a good shot and I guess that would be as good a way to go as any other.
:)

I have to thank NancyV for her post as it clearly defines for me how to offer my contribution, which is the exact opposite.

I do understand the hierarchical, elitist, hubris attitude in the post, which is not isolated to NancyV’s perspective by any means, as it is fairly common indoctrination in the upper echelons of society as a way of justifying the “I’m okay Jack, bit bored though, so could do with a good dose of entertainment (conflict and inequality will suffice nicely), and if ya don’t like it then buggar off” attitude!

My perspective is way more in line with humanity focusing more on its true strengths in the ability to apply wisdom to cultural relations for equality of growth and exploration, (no matter what realm one finds one's consciousness in), rather than humanity's illusionary misguided strengths of low level animalistic dog eat dog syndrome. And I do believe that with the open-sourcing of our globe via technology we are on the cusp of moving toward this. The chaos and trauma, repetitive by history’s standards for sure, may not evolve back into a hierarchical ruling this time.

Which is why I support disabling the old and bringing the Unknown to the Fore. Bringing in the New from a place of cooperative wisdom founded on equality in order to bring the unimaginable to Life. From an individual perspective, find people/groups that are focused on co-creating New Life, align with them, contribute, and whilst doing so resist the seductive persuasions of ideologies that claim “this is how it is, it’s always gonna be this way, so get the f#@k over it”!

[Feritciva]

I'm not religious so I've never really looked at anyone as a "savior" but I believe Trump is aware of much evil in the US Government and that he is trying to oppose it. I wait with baited breath everyday to see what is going on. I've very happy with what Trump has done so far.



THIS IS the exact disappointment I'm talking about. And I thought so-called "truthseekers" would be more aware & awake.

I know what happened here. You'll see what'll happen there. No need to contribute more for me to this thread (or anywhere else in alternative community it seems...)

[Timreh]

I am not in the position to offer any advice
I have spent most of my life trying to answer questions and as much as I seem to be making progress the maze just keeps getting bigger.
Is this world/life illusory, where will we be in 10 years time with technology? 20 years?

How long before we can go to a booth or hub somewhere and pay a couple of say bitcoin from a smart device or implant and.. BANG you are having an experience that is indistinguishable from real life, you could go anywhere, take any form, do anything… an experience that lasts maybe a week, maybe a year but really it was only 15 minutes!
If we could do that then what questions would that raise about our existence?
The lines between what is real and what is not may soon become very blurry.

I am just saying we live in a world with so many uncertainties; yes I am interested in the global ‘elite’, parasitic entities, aliens, the military industrial complex, chemtrails, alternate timelines/realities, mind control/behaviour mod’and I know that children are worth more than bitcoin.
Amongst so many uncertainties there is one thing that I believe in most, one foundation or cornerstone… me, all other things may or may not be real/true but I most likely am and while I am unsure whether to believe in ‘karma’ or ‘cause and effect’ 100% - I do not want to take the chances of misconduct or inaction coming back to bite me, I warm to the notion that our deeds in this life are an investment.

I think most of the wars are waged in our mind and I place a lot of energy and importance in trying to master and gain control of mine.
So instead of investing all of my eggs in finding a solution for the hopeless (and temporary) path that we might all be on I have placed but a few eggs here and most are invested in me with a belief of them enduring long beyond the grave, so I try not to buy into things too much, consider everything with a healthy measure of scepticism and try not to entertain too much fear.
Do we fight against the system; do we actively try to unravel it? I don’t know.
All bets are off… but I do think the answer is somehow not outside but inside…
The jam that we are in may be so big, so deep and so complex that the human mind cannot grasp or comprehend it, at least for now; so many people are in a state of ‘paradigm paralysis’ and couldn’t face the truth if it was handed to them on a platter, they are just not ready?!

And while this may not be the ‘realistic solution’ you may have been asking for Sam I hope you welcome my thoughts.
I didn’t really know where I was going with it, hmmph it was fast on its way to rivaling one of your “Monster Posts”!

[peggy englebrake]

All of these interesting posts indicate to me that we are all having a "change in consciousness" which manifests just a little bit different in everyone.
For many of us when we start seeing "the big and then bigger picture" there is a response of judgement and anger (I'm thinking here of that wonderful female guitar soloist posted elsewhere on this site singing "I didn't f**k this up, did you f**k this up") Feritciva forgive me for using you as an example, but your post above is exactly the kind of rant I hear myself saying and many others as well. The next step I'm experiencing is the realization that I must be the person I think others should be. It's dificult for us to see that we are often projecting our own faults onto others. That all the "irritating" people in our lives are there to mirror us and let us see ourselves more clearly. I have also come to the realization from this point onward each of us must intend our own reality and at first this seems like a big responsibility, although I'm intending that it be a marvelous experience. Don't wish to offend anyone, just sharing my observations.

[Feritciva]

You're exactly right Peggy. Sometimes I also see myself ranting about things that I believe cannot be changed. This is not a way of higher understanding or solution-based, that's for sure. But I've seen society deranged and corrupted to the core here in Turkey (I know for most of Americans there's nothing like "rest of the world". We are extras in movies for them - opps I did the ranting again!) Trump is exactly the same. So it makes me a bit crazy when I see someone whom I consider as intelligent and smart support Trump - or Erdogan here in Turkey.

There are no "big pictures" about these politicians. There is saying in Turkish, "we call a**holes a**holes in our village". Am I too rude on this? Probably. Because I've seen how this will go. Sorry people..

[Chester]

All of these interesting posts indicate to me that we are all having a "change in consciousness" which manifests just a little bit different in everyone.
I emphasized the last part of your opening statement as I agree. In my case, my spiritual journey has led me adopt the metaphysical cosmological world view known as ‘monistic idealism’ as the foundation of how I view everything (thus my primary assumption). Within this view I have adopted a view within that grand view of monistic idealism which I see life through three different levels of being where the middle level is broken into two parts. The encompassing level is a paradox to the other levels of being. I have written this up and posted it in other areas of this forum where, if I can locate the right posts, will edit this post so as to link to those posts just in case a member or reader is interested.

Why I posted this is because I will now be diving into the level of being I refer to as Level 3 which is best described in the following.

Each and every morning I wake up. When my eyes open, this thought set enter my mind – “Ahhhh, this world again… ahhh as seen through these eyes again, eyes attached to this body I appear to operate… again.” I call this level, “The 3D, material realm, shared reality” level.

I view this level as “where all the action is.”

And now to dive into Level 3 -


...I've seen society deranged and corrupted to the core here in Turkey.
I have too. I have also seen society deranged and corrupted to the core throughout most of the world. Despite the best efforts of the media, Hollywood, dishonest politicians, psuedo "teachers" who indoctrinate instead of teaching students how to think for themselves and dishonest, high profile individuals in all walks of life who hold great influence over others to make Americans and most other “western world” nations citizens lose every aspect of their "Universe-given" right to be sovereign and free … despite their best efforts in this segment of the world, I see people in various stages of what is so often called “waking up.”

Though each of us has a great deal to “wake up to,” in speaking for myself, I am glad that 15 years ago, when I was handed a copy of David Icke’s “The Biggest Secret” I began this journey in earnest. In no way do I believe I have arrived at or even come anywhere near to the theoretical end to this journey. In fact, my opinion about that is that there may be no end… in fact, I almost hope there never is an end because I have come to appreciate and enjoy, despite all the tough times… the experience I have in this strange Level 3 reality experience.



(I know for most of Americans there's nothing like "rest of the world". We are extras in movies for them - opps I did the ranting again!) Trump is exactly the same.
I can understand the emotion… our world is messed up. Depending on where one might be at this time in our world, the experience of the ‘messed upness’ may be greater or lesser, but one might be surprised at how many folks actually do understand far more about what’s going on in all sorts of hot spots in the world who also have been supporters of Trump, like myself.

Here’s an example – Illegal drug trade in Turkey – Here (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal_drug_trade_in_Turkey)

Specifically look at the map halfway down that shows how Turkey is a critical transshipment point for drug trafficking that ends up in the insatiable markets of Europe known as "The Malkan Route."

And now consider just one of Trump’s Executive Orders...

Presidential Executive Order on Enforcing Federal Law with Respect to Transnational Criminal Organizations and Preventing International Trafficking - Here (https://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2017/02/09/presidential-executive-order-enforcing-federal-law-respect-transnational)

I recommend you read this order to get an idea of the seriousness of this US President related to a matter as important as the poisoning of the vulnerable… a poisoning which impacts all of us quite negatively.



There are no "big pictures" about these politicians.

The above EO is one of a few dozen “Big Picture” actions which could… if those empowered to enforce this (and the other orders) do in fact enforce, will play a significant role where we all can paint a clear, brand new, all-encompassing actual far better BIG PICTURE.



So it makes me a bit crazy when I see someone whom I consider as intelligent and smart support Trump…

I feel it is intelligent and smart to support anyone who proactively takes practical measures to change our world for the better. Based on the centuries long push towards a totalitarian global control system, I understand why he (and others) feel it is wise to start with their own nation first (nationalism) and why we are witnessing a wave of nationalist movements emerging across the globe.



- or Erdogan here in Turkey.

There is no way for me to have as much of a clue as to what is really going on in Turkey as someone who is from Turkey and/or lives there or lives in that region of the world such as yourself. I would really like to hear as much as you would be willing to share with regards to what you are experiencing in Turkey and why you hold the opinions you do… as much as you are able to share without creating unacceptable risk for your loved ones or yourself. Please, start a thread about this…



There is saying in Turkish, "we call a**holes a**holes in our village". Am I too rude on this? Probably. Because I've seen how this will go. Sorry people..

I don’t think you are being rude… I see massive frustration. I applaud you posting about it. Let’s share information thoughts and ideas… let’s find ways to increase our own knowledge base as to what is actually going on in all parts of the world. I do this… I don’t live in the bubble that many Americans apparently do (sad, sad…)

I ask that you open your mind too in that perhaps some of your opinion of Trump has been influenced by the same loosely connected “media” as so many here in the US and western world have been.

[Innocent Warrior]

I'm not religious so I've never really looked at anyone as a "savior" but I believe Trump is aware of much evil in the US Government and that he is trying to oppose it. I wait with baited breath everyday to see what is going on. I've very happy with what Trump has done so far.



THIS IS the exact disappointment I'm talking about. And I thought so-called "truthseekers" would be more aware & awake.

I know what happened here. You'll see what'll happen there. No need to contribute more for me to this thread (or anywhere else in alternative community it seems...)

If it wasn't for the alternative community the masses wouldn't have been informed enough not to fall for the MSM BS and the US would likely have had another President Clinton right now. Trump is doing what he thinks is best for the US, which is a whole lot more than what Hillary would be doing. It's not a perfect situation but it's a vast improvement and I thank every truth seeker for it, imagine if you really were the only one who was awake and aware enough...thank God for all the truth seekers.

[Wind]

If Clinton was in office then we would be witnessing the beginning of WWIII right about now.

[Bruno]

I am definitely left leaning as people who have read my posts know. I have been schooled by a few people on here and think I have had my eyes opened to more than a few things in the process. Thank you Targe T and Sam. I don't agree with all you say but I understand your view point and have adjusted mine in several areas as a result. I think just being here opens you up if you allow it. I am grateful to all of you who post an share your ideas and information.

I was so disappointed by Obama and now increasingly by our Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau. Both Liberals and eloquent speakers who talk the talk but don't walk the walk. I know people have been up in arms about the fact that people are criticizing Trump for the same things Obama did, but its that smooth talking feel good Liberal bull that distracts you from the reality of their dark intents. The trouble is I still don't believe that Trump will be any different except that Trump doesn't know how to or doesn't care to speak in a soothing manner. He doesn't care about offending anyone. I realize that people that hate political correctness are happy, but what else is actually changing?

The ban on the immigration from those seven countries... everyone keeps pointing out that those were Obama's seven countries of concern. Who cares who came up with the list! It doesn't change the fact that Egypt, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia aren't on the list! If Trump is different why use Obama's list? why not include the Arab countries where terrorists that have actually committed crimes on American soil are from?

Also it still appears we are heading towards confrontation with Iran.

What has Trump done besides polarize people? I am looking for a shred of hope.

[Innocent Warrior]

For hope, look to the people of the world, not politicians. Trump's fortune is loose change for families like the Rothschilds and they think politicians are their tools when really they're the people's. We are the real power but the system limits our choices, so step by step, one foot after the other, the awakening people of the world are the hope and the power and not all the money in the world will change the trajectory of an aware populace.

[Chester]

I am definitely left leaning as people who have read my posts know. I have been schooled by a few people on here and think I have had my eyes opened to more than a few things in the process. Thank you Targe T and Sam. I don't agree with all you say but I understand your view point and have adjusted mine in several areas as a result. I think just being here opens you up if you allow it. I am grateful to all of you who post an share your ideas and information.

I was so disappointed by Obama and now increasingly by our Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau. Both Liberals and eloquent speakers who talk the talk but don't walk the walk. I know people have been up in arms about the fact that people are criticizing Trump for the same things Obama did, but its that smooth talking feel good Liberal bull that distracts you from the reality of their dark intents. The trouble is I still don't believe that Trump will be any different except that Trump doesn't know how to or doesn't care to speak in a soothing manner. He doesn't care about offending anyone. I realize that people that hate political correctness are happy, but what else is actually changing?

The ban on the immigration from those seven countries... everyone keeps pointing out that those were Obama's seven countries of concern. Who cares who came up with the list! It doesn't change the fact that Egypt, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia aren't on the list! If Trump is different why use Obama's list? why not include the Arab countries where terrorists that have actually committed crimes on American soil are from?

Also it still appears we are heading towards confrontation with Iran.

What has Trump done besides polarize people? I am looking for a shred of hope.

Thanks for this post - I also appreciate your posts and have found I sometimes agree fully, sometimes partially and sometimes I feel sad that I believe you might be missing some facts... guess what? I also am very aware I may be missing all sorts of facts too. But I very much appreciate your views.

What will be surprising to folks is my upcoming posts that will be related to the "immigration issue" both here in the US but also, the world.

One other thing that I now wish to share... I took this test on November 19, 2016 (something I discovered in a post on this forum)

https://www.politicalcompass.org/

Here's where I plotted -

34974


Here is the "About" (https://www.politicalcompass.org/analysis2?ec=-2.0&soc=-5.49) of the Political Compass tailored to where I landed

In the introduction, we explained the inadequacies of the traditional left-right line.

34977

If we recognise that this is essentially an economic line it's fine, as far as it goes. We can show, for example, Stalin, Mao Tse Tung and Pol Pot, with their commitment to a totally controlled economy, on the hard left. Socialists like Mahatma Gandhi and Robert Mugabe would occupy a less extreme leftist position. Margaret Thatcher would be well over to the right, but further right still would be someone like that ultimate free marketeer, General Pinochet.

That deals with economics, but the social dimension is also important in politics. That's the one that the mere left-right scale doesn't adequately address. So we've added one, ranging in positions from extreme authoritarian to extreme libertarian.

34975

Both an economic dimension and a social dimension are important factors for a proper political analysis. By adding the social dimension you can show that Stalin was an authoritarian leftist (ie the state is more important than the individual) and that Gandhi, believing in the supreme value of each individual, is a liberal leftist. While the former involves state-imposed arbitrary collectivism in the extreme top left, on the extreme bottom left is voluntary collectivism at regional level, with no state involved. Hundreds of such anarchist communities existed in Spain during the civil war period

You can also put Pinochet, who was prepared to sanction mass killing for the sake of the free market, on the far right as well as in a hardcore authoritarian position. On the non-socialist side you can distinguish someone like Milton Friedman, who is anti-state for fiscal rather than social reasons, from Hitler, who wanted to make the state stronger, even if he wiped out half of humanity in the process.
The chart also makes clear that, despite popular perceptions, the opposite of fascism is not communism but anarchism (ie liberal socialism), and that the opposite of communism ( i.e. an entirely state-planned economy) is neo-liberalism (i.e. extreme deregulated economy)

34976

The usual understanding of anarchism as a left wing ideology does not take into account the neo-liberal "anarchism" championed by the likes of Ayn Rand, Milton Friedman and America's Libertarian Party, which couples social Darwinian right-wing economics with liberal positions on most social issues. Often their libertarian impulses stop short of opposition to strong law and order positions, and are more economic in substance (ie no taxes) so they are not as extremely libertarian as they are extremely right wing. On the other hand, the classical libertarian collectivism of anarcho-syndicalism ( libertarian socialism) belongs in the bottom left hand corner.
In our home page we demolished the myth that authoritarianism is necessarily "right wing", with the examples of Robert Mugabe, Pol Pot and Stalin. Similarly Hitler, on an economic scale, was not an extreme right-winger. His economic policies were broadly Keynesian, and to the left of some of today's Labour parties. If you could get Hitler and Stalin to sit down together and avoid economics, the two diehard authoritarians would find plenty of common ground.

A Word about Neo-cons and Neo-libs

U.S. neo-conservatives, with their commitment to high military spending and the global assertion of national values, tend to be more authoritarian than hard right. By contrast, neo-liberals, opposed to such moral leadership and, more especially, the ensuing demands on the tax payer, belong to a further right but less authoritarian region. Paradoxically, the "free market", in neo-con parlance, also allows for the large-scale subsidy of the military-industrial complex, a considerable degree of corporate welfare, and protectionism when deemed in the national interest. These are viewed by neo-libs as impediments to the unfettered market forces that they champion.


As for this comment...


What has Trump done besides polarize people? I am looking for a shred of hope.

I must first say that the whole world has been massively polarized for a very long, long time... so much so that perhaps I must sadly admit that this "shared character trait" of humanity is what might be best we strive to overcome... and in fact, that is part of what stimulated me to ask the very question in the title of this OP.

I also learned via my own experiences with my own personal struggles that sometimes outside intervention, though not fun to experience at the time, is all too often needed. We can all sit back and sing "Kumbaya" all day and night but that won't stop the cartels in Mexico from chopping off people's heads.

vo9AH4vG2wA

check out these links... Here (https://www.google.com/#q=beheading+blamed+on+mexican+drug+cartel)

Here's just one -

‘El Loco,’ drug cartel leader, arrested for beheading of 49 people in Mexico (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/el-loco-drug-cartel-leader-arrested-beheading-49-people-mexico-article-1.1082203)

[Helene West]

First, I appreciate Sam's earnest endeavor at solution brain-storming. For me this thread, or rather the sentiments behind it, exists because good people waited far too long to take any action over the infiltration that has overtaken the country. And that just may be the human condition - Good people largely take whatever's on the menu unless they are being squeezed to death and sometimes they will prefer death to effecting change.

Even though so many have been observing and experiencing for decades the ever increasing New Racism (whitehaters, including self-hating whites) and the New Sexism (male haters, particularly of alpha-males) plus assorted other haters (posing as oppressed or offended groups), not to mention the ever decreasing purchasing power of their money (theft), twisted uses of education, technology and media content (mind-control), etc., etc., they still didn't do much about anything they were witnessing.

The election only proved to me that most don't want to give up the notion that going to the polls for 1/2 hr every 4 years is their sufficient contribution.

I've had scattered experiences in political activity years ago and it is very frustrating, preps for even small events or meetings can easily fall apart for a myriad of reasons. And with the extraordinary budget the oligarchs have to bankroll thousands of saboteurs, it must be even more difficult than ever to get anything done of integrity today.

I'm not easily shocked but my choo-choo has been thrown off the track by the festival of malice that has emerged and is directed at the new president. In another post I've likened him to Gregory Peck in the hair-raising scene from The Omen where he is battling the diabolical nurse with her pit bulls. The American Republic was so unique and it attracted those from every nook and cranny in the world and they wanted to be Americans. Not today, we have too many that if they don't want to destroy and make it something else, then they are begrudging hyphenated americans. If the malicious phalanx succeeds in sabotaging his agenda which I believe, despite him being a social bull in a china shop, has betterment at heart for all americans, the country is done imho.

In that case, would it be worth rebelling, fighting for? or at that point just accept the sad, deadened nation, change the name to some People's Republic of Whatever and let it go the way of other failed ultra controlled, impoverished socialist-type dictatorships and just try to survive?? At this stage in my life, I've seen enough elections and negative changes in the country to consider the possibility of another option - I'll let Oscar Wilde express it for me in his witty, succinct fashion -

"Divorces are made in Heaven".

[Chester]

Pow - what a post (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?95913-...so-then-what-should-each-of-us-do&p=1134016&viewfull=1#post1134016) Helene West... no less powerful than the famous soliloquy from Network

WINDtlPXmmE

[Helene West]

It's hard for me to extract an absolute in your question. I suppose there are quite a few small questions begging for one to accept the big question, and some where I was lost and unable to proceed.


The future you suggest is nebulous in terms of knowing what it means. This statement for instance could be taken many ways, and believe it or not, not all of them are bad.
The post seems to suggest all are doomed to permanent enslavement
Sometimes slaves are treated rather well. Sometimes ignorance is bliss.
And I'm sure we could find some type of slavery that is preferential to many living conditions on Earth right now.

My question is - what can the individual do that can change the hopeless path this post suggests we all might be on?
I'll tell you where I think your question is off.
We are not slated to be slaves, we are slated to die. The lucky are slated to be slaves. And there will be very few at that.
You probably do not want to know what I think we are in for. I'll answer if you ask, but most don't want to hear it.
Suffice it to say the agenda is outlined in the Denver Airport Murals.
It's funny really. Folks always respond with this question as if they understand greed. "Why would they kill us? How are they going to continue to keep making money if they kill us all off, that doesn't make any sense".
To this my reply is these people have more money than God, these people have enough money for a hundred generations of their descendents to live in unparralelled splendor the problem is this, they found out that the carrying capacity of the earth has been reached in terms of human beings and that their vast sum of money won't continue on because the earth will no longer be able to sustain human life after about five generations.
We should have a thread asking the question "Are the Globalists Correct?" In so far as the long term is concerned they very well might be correct.

DNA
I feel very similar to you. I speak on a few themes politically/culturally but I keep my ideas of the ruling class's end game to myself. If you share your grim vision the average joe and jane will use it against you.
When you have tried to convey to others that the ruling class have more money than God to live in luxury for generations I have also tried to convey similar - that these people do not have to work for a living like we do. They have from birth till death the free TIME to do nothing but plan how they want the world to be and how our lives are to be fashioned to make us fit their vision. It's not just money it's Time as well. And though they can afford all kinds of protections, how much fun can they continue to have surrounded by millions of angry, hungry and unemployed people?
It's funny to me that you've thought about a thread called Are the Globalists Correct? cause in some respects I've wondered the same thing, particularly when I look at the stupidity people love and settle for as entertainment. They believe civilizations are theirs to create, destroy and recreate. The world is their oyster. The initial stages of the american experiment was the first time they were somewhat pushed into the shadows, but they are unrelenting and they kept trying until they got in, 1913 - SCORE! They have to be smarter, shrewder and more prepared than the masses of plebs as there are far more of us than them. They are aware that they are the minority group and they act accordingly not leaving one stone unturned culturally, politically, financially, etc. On the other hand the majority are in denial that a ruling class even exists... wow...
woe be to us....

[DNA]

DNA
I feel very similar to you. I speak on a few themes politically/culturally but I keep my ideas of the ruling class's end game to myself. If you share your grim vision the average joe and jane will use it against you.
You are correct. I've never successfully communicated this. The writing is literally on the wall with the Denver Mural and the Georgia Guidestones. Come to think of it, this is probably why Alex Jones doesn't catch on with a wider audience, because he talks about this all the time.
When ever this topic comes up folks just shut down and refuse to participate. It's as if the topic is taboo.
There is a guy named Kevin Treadeu, he wrote a few books on natural cures and weight loss. He wrote a book called "the weight loss cure they don't want you to know about", in it he states how it is not speculation as he is concerned, he stated that under no uncertain terms the elite are trying to kill people off through processed food poisoning, GMO's, pesticide and the pharmecuticals designed to mask the symptoms and cause even more health problems. Kevin stated that although he had about 35 million he was by no means a member of this elite group but that his affluence allowed him to have friends who rubbed elbows with these people. He stated he was once invited on to a yacht, one of those huge ones and that a meeting of these elite took place and their discussion was on the best methods for depopulating the planet in terms of the human race. Now all of this is neither here nor there in terms of the guy's honesty. He could have been lying, but I would like to submit what happened to him for writing this book. He received ten years in prison for it. Not often is a guy sent to prison for writing a book. U.S. TV pitchman Trudeau sentenced to 10 years in prison (http://news.yahoo.com/u-tv-pitchman-trudeau-sentenced-10-years-prison-213615517--sector.html?vp=1)


When you have tried to convey to others that the ruling class have more money than God to live in luxury for generations I have also tried to convey similar - that these people do not have to work for a living like we do. They have from birth till death the free TIME to do nothing but plan how they want the world to be and how our lives are to be fashioned to make us fit their vision. It's not just money it's Time as well. And though they can afford all kinds of protections, how much fun can they continue to have surrounded by millions of angry, hungry and unemployed people?
Everyone is pretty accepting of the New World Order plan that is underway. Folks can believe the elite want mankind under one government, one currency and one religion. But a major component of that plan is to reduce the population to five hundred million. And to this people act offended and in disbelief but this is their stated agenda. That means if there are 8 billion in the world right now only one in sixteen people are slated to live through this plan. Those are some pretty bad odds. Right off the bat folks could do themselves a favor and move out of the big cities. I absolutely believe when this agenda is started the PTB will destroy exit routes out of big cities because they want us inside them to die.

It's funny to me that you've thought about a thread called Are the Globalists Correct? cause in some respects I've wondered the same thing, particularly when I look at the stupidity people love and settle for as entertainment. They believe civilizations are theirs to create, destroy and recreate. The world is their oyster. The initial stages of the american experiment was the first time they were somewhat pushed into the shadows, but they are unrelenting and they kept trying until they got in, 1913 - SCORE! They have to be smarter, shrewder and more prepared than the masses of plebs as there are far more of us than them. They are aware that they are the minority group and they act accordingly not leaving one stone unturned culturally, politically, financially, etc. On the other hand the majority are in denial that a ruling class even exists... wow...
woe be to us....
I try to get my friends and such to watch the Dr. John Coleman vides, being as he is so much less nebulous when describing who the elite actually are.
I'm one of those people who think the "Report from Iron Mountain" was real. And in this document it states the biggest threat to the planet earth is overpopulation. I think these elite know this, and aside from not wanting the hoi polloi to use up resources I think some of these folks may actually consider themselves environmentalists and stewards of the planet in so far as acknowledging a problem the world does not seem to take seriously. I think they look at it as they are making the hard decision no one else wants to acknowledge exists. So when I state we could argue that these folks are correct in their agenda, this is what I mean. But I understand what you mean when watching people guzzling down their propaganda and exploding emotionally on cue all the while acting as if they are a deep well informed autonomous person when nothing further could be the truth.

[BMJ]

I certainly & definitely agree with above lines. I havent read anything about Trump on this forum - as it will be a huge disappointment for me to see some truthseekers might see Trump as "saviour" or "solution" to smth.
(Takes a deep breath)
I'm not religious so I've never really looked at anyone as a "savior" but I believe Trump is aware of much evil in the US Government and that he is trying to oppose it. I wait with baited breath everyday to see what is going on. I've very happy with what Trump has done so far.

I would second DNA's comment.

It is also "possible" Trump is another tptw puppet, and even though we are in favour of him does not mean we are blind to that possibility.

I do not think we are on a hopeless path, look at the positives.

Trump's opposition to:
- tptw pedo/satanic stuff;
- destruction of the USA;
- globalism;
- vaccines;
- the federal reserve;
- the Washington DC swamp; &
- did I miss anything?
would at the "very least" be an acknowledgement by tptw that humanity is evolving and awakening and that they no longer can run the show as they see fit as they did previously under bush 1 & 2, clinton and obama.

MSM, the real fake news, is doing a fantastic job of imploding better than anyone even Alex Jones could have hoped for.
With Trump even calling CNN, NYTimes Washington Post several times the "fake news".

Humanity is not buying into, (giving energy/focus enough to), tptw push for WW3 or a mega financial collapse. For how many years have tptw been pushing financial doom and gloom via MSM also remember Pastor L Williams on Alex Jones, anyone, and now Simon Parkes.

Generation Z is questioning and awake, (any person born after 2000 is gen Z).

Starseeds are re-educating humanity and working to improve the state of the planet as a whole.

As well we have the alternative community bringing the truth to the light of day.

So.

The tptw have to go with the flow to stay in power as humanity evolves but I think in the long run they will become irrelevant and they keep playing as if they are in charge but I think not.

So you maybe able to tell that tptw are losing control, as we take back control of reality on multiple fronts..

Then.

Re: ...so then, what should each of us do?
In short keep doing what we have been doing it seems to work well.

And since Trump wants to give ownership of America back to the people, then it the peoples responsiblity to keep Trump in check and voice their opinion on his actions.

[Fellow Aspirant]

Hi Sam

I'm glad to be a part of a thread that is about rising above. :happythumbsup:

The most reasonable answer is also shortest one: "No."
But the reasoning behnd this choice is also a response to the negative, no?
In other words,I recognize an opportunity to expand, so ...

The reason I say no is because I believe that every human is (or should aspire to be) a sovereign being. That being has the absolute right to decide its course of action.

Which opens a whole can of worms, eh? What if the being is coerced? Enslaved? What should a conscious being do?
What if the victim doesn't a) want help? or
b) doesn't even know that he or she is a victim? Should one intervene? How? How does one go about breaking a spell?

Gently, I guess. And ... "depends". If it's a member of my family, I can watch for candid moments when certain truths can be mentioned (or indicated). Over time, minds can be changed.
The public at large? Wow. Isn't that what we are engaged in right here? I direct many people to this site. Those of us with a clear message could start (and do) blogs, sites and emails. Some produce excellent videos. Some, like our Mr. Ryan, both create content for posting and host a site for important exchanges of information - and opinion. I consider this place to be a very comfortable park bench where I can drop by every day and see what's been posted on the board.

Thanks again, Sam

Brian

[Chester]

Hi Sam

I'm glad to be a part of a thread that is about rising above. :happythumbsup:

The most reasonable answer is also shortest one: "No."


Hi Brian, apologies... but help me with some context. Thanks, Sam


EDIT - added: I think this may be in response to a few questions I asked several days ago... if not, apologies.

Here were those questions - found here
(http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?95913-...so-then-what-should-each-of-us-do&p=1133585&viewfull=1#post1133585)


Assuming most can agree we should all help others, should the help that would be provided by any single individual be determined by anyone other than that single individual?


If so, how would that determination be made and who or what should make it?

...I will now go back and read your reply assuming I guessed this right. Note: I am 59 and the memory is not what it used to be.

Also, I thank you that we have begun this dialogue.

Final EDIT: OK, I really appreciate your reply, Brian. I should be able to respond this afternoon, Sam

[Chester]

Hi Sam

I'm glad to be a part of a thread that is about rising above. :happythumbsup:

The most reasonable answer is also shortest one: "No."
But the reasoning behnd this choice is also a response to the negative, no?
In other words,I recognize an opportunity to expand, so ...

The reason I say no is because I believe that every human is (or should aspire to be) a sovereign being. That being has the absolute right to decide its course of action.

Which opens a whole can of worms, eh? What if the being is coerced? Enslaved? What should a conscious being do?
What if the victim doesn't a) want help? or
b) doesn't even know that he or she is a victim? Should one intervene? How? How does one go about breaking a spell?

Gently, I guess. And ... "depends". If it's a member of my family, I can watch for candid moments when certain truths can be mentioned (or indicated). Over time, minds can be changed.
The public at large? Wow. Isn't that what we are engaged in right here? I direct many people to this site. Those of us with a clear message could start (and do) blogs, sites and emails. Some produce excellent videos. Some, like our Mr. Ryan, both create content for posting and host a site for important exchanges of information - and opinion. I consider this place to be a very comfortable park bench where I can drop by every day and see what's been posted on the board.

Thanks again, Sam

Brian

Apologies for the delay... a few days ago my mom, aged 79, entered her final phase and transition. She passed yesterday morning.


Now back to our dialogue.

You present so many of the same questions I have. I sense we share far more common ground than folks might imagine from reading our exchanges.

I ask that you read the post response I made HERE (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?96131-Clinton-Escobar-Gary-Webb-and-the-CIA-s-Wars-FOR-Drugs&p=1135299&viewfull=1#post1135299) as it asks so many similar questions.


Considering both your post that I quoted above and the post I wrote which I linked to above... I then ask, how far do we think "government" should go with regards to "defining where these lines might be drawn?"

It is my opinion that this question could be answered in the following way -

When the vulnerable are unnecessarily harmed... by whoever and for whatever reason... and no one else is there to protect these vulnerable, government may be the only entity society can count on to do the right thing.

But when government overreaches with regards to interference in our lives such that the individual is prevented from the opportunity to grow, the opportunity to experience the good of life along with the trials and tribulations of life... both in my view being intrinsic to life... life that is incredible, exhilarating, challenging, potentially rewarding... (on and on in applicable descriptors)... government becomes the problem. And BIG government becomes a BIG problem (and why I fall heavily towards the libertarian descriptor if someone wishes to label me politically).

For me, the most rewarding "thing" of all with regards to life has been my experience of fulfilling some... perhaps now I can say "much" of what I have perceived to be my own personal responsibility - personal responsibility (which I must balance with an honest, realistic self assessment as to my own capabilities)... noting that my perception of such has changed as I have lived the (so far) 59 years of my life.

Honestly, I have no illusions there can ever be a universally accepted agreement as to definitions of these magic lines or an agreement on how heavy a role should any government play in each of our lives. This is why there's politics. Maybe one day the human race (if we survive ourselves) transcends the need for government... but that is clearly an ideal which, if ever achieved, is likely far far off in the future.

[Fellow Aspirant]

Hi Sam

I'm really sorry for your loss. I hope that you were able to spend some quality time with your mom at the end. Mine passed away suddenly and I have many regrets about things unsaid.

So now, welcome back.

There are, of course, no hard and fast rules about aid or intervention. I subscribe to the old adage that everything is politics. And I have found that those who are willing to make such fast rules are exactly the kind that should not be put into the position of caring for anyone. Our society needs basic rules, of course, to guide our police and our courts, but the fuzzy gray areas of interpersonal interactions are pretty ad hoc, despite the best efforts of the Dear Abby's of our press. Humans, it seems, are too subject to their emotional drives. And the closer the problem, the harder the call. Yeah, I've been an enabler, but I've also been able to rid myself of certain hopes and illusions and resort to 'tough love', thus saving both myself and the person having difficulty. Maybe there should be some guidelines for how long one should continue to invest their energies into the 'project', as I sometimes refer to those I'm trying to assist. But the answer always seems to come back to an "it depends". One gets into the helping mode, I think, when one is made to personally feel badly (empathy!) and then there's a boost in feeling when you are helping and making a difference. So maybe the termination of the project should be the time when your own feelings of frustration start making your own life drift into the negative.

Governments are a clumsy way of intervening, but most of the population would rather pay taxes and have someone, a professional, deal with crime, education and healthcare. We've also come up with a sh*t ton of rules and ordinances to deal with the petty annoyances that confront us. Which is probably a good idea in my case, because I just know that if it was up to me to speak to the guy who leaves his garbage all over his front lawn that things could get very ugly very fast. And then the police would have to be involved. :fie:

So I guess what I'm saying is that there are roles for the experts, especially when they reduce the need for negative personal interaction. Unless it's someone in my immediate family, or an immediate threat to life & limb, I will shy away from the opportunity to personally correct someone's lifestyle choices. No, wait, scratch that. Upon reconsideration, I would have to say that I would even avoid messing with the personal choices of my close family members. Everybody has the right to learn. And more often than not, hindsight has demonstrated to me that what I thought was going to end in tears and trauma turned out just fine. Within human struggles, non-lethal learning situations should abound!

I hope that I'm making better choices now than I did in my youth, but the learning curve shows no sign of flattening out, even at the ripe age of 66. So you're just a pup, my friend! Is it good news or bad that even we old fogies are still trying to figure it out? At least we're still in the game!

Namaste Sam. Nice to meet a fellow aspirant. :highfive:

Brian