Does Breast Feeding cause Cavities ??

[Earth Angel]

My daughter is breast feeding still, baby is 17 months old.....mom and baby are vegetarian...she brushes her teeth twice a day...but just noticed three little holes in two of her molars....these teeth are not even that old......she NEVER has sugar, eats mostly organic, no baby food......I can't believe she has cavities ...any suggestions or idea's? Mom is freaking out

[Teknishun]

I know this sounds wrong but maybe its some thing in the toothpaste ?

[conk]

I doubt very seriously it is to do with breast feeding, unless it has depleted her nutrients. Cavities are often a result of nutritional deficiencies.

[RunningDeer]

Nice to hear from you, Earth Angel.

Some products that come to mind are fruit juices and cereals. I’d choose the whole food over the processed juice. Organic oatmeal rather than Cheerios. If baby is vegetarian then s/he eats yogurt, and cheese?

Are Cheerios Reilly a Healthy Choice? (http://www.gmoinside.org/are-cheerios-really-healthy/)




While GMO Inside recognizes that whole grains like oats, moderation of sugar, and balanced consumption of vitamins and minerals are certainly part of a healthy eating plan, a deeper look at Cheerios uncovers that their claimed benefits are also accompanied by a high risk of GMOs, surprisingly controversial ingredients, and a less than stellar overall nutritional profile.



The Top Five Sugariest Juices (http://www.healthnutnation.com/2011/06/02/the-top-5-sugariest-juices/)




Apple vs. Orange Juice

Apple and Orange juice are among the most commonly consumed, so which one is higher in sugar? Whether organic or conventional, freshly squeezed or from concentrate, orange juice generally came in between 22-24 grams. Apple, regardless of brand, was consistently 28 grams.



Is Sugar in Yogurt Bad for You? (http://www.livestrong.com/article/521761-is-sugar-in-yogurt-bad-for-you/)




The Sugars in Yogurt

The milk used to make yogurt contains naturally occurring sugar called lactose, which is considered a nutritious part of your daily diet when consumed in moderation. Because it's a naturally occurring sugar, lactose isn't refined or processed like added sugars are. Most yogurts, however, contain added sugar. For example, the average fruit-flavored yogurt can contain close to 32 grams of sugar per 6-ounce serving, though nutrition labels don't reveal how much of that is added sugar.



Is There Sugar In Cheese? (http://thedairydish.com/is-there-sugar-in-cheese/)




Is there sugar in cheese? Cheese is made from milk, which naturally contains a sugar known as lactose. The majority of cheese will have some degree of sugar as a result of the milk sugar. However, it not common for a cheese to have added sugar. The typical main ingredients of cheese are simply milk, rennet (for milk coagulation), cultures, and additives (salts, spices, molds, calcium chloride, ect.).

How Much Sugar In Cheese?

The amount of sugar in cheese is very minimal in comparison to other foods. Many common cheese products have less than a gram of sugar per one ounce serving. Several cheeses can be consumed by people with lactose intolerance since they are low in lactose (sugar). As you will see in the chart below, the cheeses with the least amount of sugar are the aged cheeses like Cheddar, Gruyere, and Parmesan. Aged cheeses contain less lactose because as they age the lactose transforms into lactic acid, leaving little remaining milk sugar. Typically, processed cheeses contain the most lactose because they are not aged and often contain lactose from added whey or milk.

[EFO]

I doubt very seriously it is to do with breast feeding, unless it has depleted her nutrients. Cavities are often a result of nutritional deficiencies.

Not always.Sometimes mother's milk contain substances that attack baby's teeth.

[Libico]

Hi Earth Angel,

We had a similar situation with our youngest son - he was breastfed until he was 2 and developed some cavities that was also quite a mystery to us. At home we rarely eat anything with processed sugar, lots of fresh vegetables and fruits, no white flour, etc... all around a generally healthy diet. Good on you for brushing twice a day - we were doing one a day until we noticed the cavities forming around 2.5 years old. I imagine it could be any number of things but I would take her to a dentist to check out her enamel. In our case our son had enamel hypoplasia on 3 of his teeth which is a condition where certain teeth (usually baby teeth) have little to no enamel, thus are very susceptible to cavities. If you are breastfeeding at night the residual milk in her mouth does contain sugar which could be enough to form cavities over time on those sensitive teeth. In our case it slowly progressed until we eventually ended up putting a crown on one tooth and have just been extra vigilant about having him rinse out his mouth with water after every meal as well as brushing twice a day - our hope is that when he gets his adult teeth they will have enamel.

I tried using Uncle Harry's Remineralization Liquid for Tooth Enamel on him but he was so traumatized from the flavour it didn't stick for more than one night :).

[TargeT]

Good on you for brushing twice a day - we were doing one a day until we noticed the cavities forming

Honest question:

Why do we think that brushing our teeth does anything?


Diet is everything for tooth health, we know this via historical example (vegans are more susceptible to tooth decay if they have any large portion of grain in their diets). If mom is eating a high grain diet, the breast feeding baby is too.

Brushing your teeth really doesn't do much at all (http://www.curetoothdecay.com/Tooth_Decay/tooth_brushing.htm), makes your breath nicer though.

Don't do something just because it's always been done.. question everything!

[RunningDeer]

Do Vegans Get More Cavities?
full article (https://nutritionfacts.org/2013/07/25/do-vegans-get-more-cavities/)

“…How can we get the benefits of healthy foods like citrus while minimizing the risks of dental erosion? The most important thing is that we should never brush right after we eat sour fruit. We should wait at least 30 minutes. Acid softens our enamel such that if we brush right away we can actually brush away some of our teeth!…”

“…Those eating plant-based diets may have less disease of the tissues surrounding the teeth, but if people who eat a lot of fruit get more cavities, then what about the health of the teeth themselves? Though vegetarians and vegans don’t have more cavities than those eating more conventional diets, they may have greater signs of acid erosion on their teeth (as documented in two studies I run through in my dental health video (https://nutritionfacts.org/video/plant-based-diets-dental-health/)). So what should people do?

There are a number of foods and drinks that have the potential to cause dental erosion, both unhealthy foods like soda and sour candy, as well as healthy foods like fresh fruit and certain herbal teas. In the biggest study to date, consuming citrus fruits more than twice a day was associated with 37 times greater odds of dental erosion compared to those who consumed citrus fruits less often. It also appears risky to consume apple cider vinegar or sports drinks once a week or more and soft drinks daily. These habits resulted in the odds of erosion being ten, four, and four times greater, respectively, than when the habit did not exist….”

[Bubu]

Good on you for brushing twice a day - we were doing one a day until we noticed the cavities forming

Honest question:

Why do we think that brushing our teeth does anything?


Don't do something just because it's always been done.. question everything!


:thumbsup::thumbsup:

crocks can grow back teeth and they never brush nobody does except us.

[Justplain]

I met a lady who said her elderly father never went to a dentist and he chewed raw sugar cane everyday.

My daughter had a lot of cavities when just a few years old (she never had sweets, was breast fed a bit), and we avoided doing anything other than keeping them clean till she reached an age where the cavities might affect her adult teeth (she was never in any pain) when we saw a dentist for treatment.

[TargeT]

My daughter had a lot of cavities when just a few years old (she never had sweets, was breast fed a bit), and we avoided doing anything other than keeping them clean till she reached an age where the cavities might affect her adult teeth (she was never in any pain) when we saw a dentist for treatment.

how about the grains? Everyone thinks simple sugars right away because we all confuse dental health with the SURFACE of our teeth, that's not the case, it's the elevated blood sugar and elevated "body sugar" that encourages flora/fauna to grow that produces an acidic waste, and the complex sugars pack are bad because everyone assumes "bread is safe" or "I'll have some pasta" when your basically just eating a hard to process sugar that was meant for horses and cows and whatnot...

Grains are the cause of most tooth decay (you could call it modern agriculture, but it's grains).. good luck eating with out grains involved (this is why I say vegans CAN be more susceptible if they eat a high grain diet).

Historically, before agriculture (which enabled dense population centers, which enabled the slave culture we live in today... interesting eh?) humans had pretty good dental health (there was tooth decay, but it was very rare). (http://www.bbc.com/earth/story/20160229-how-our-ancestors-drilled-rotten-teeth)

[enfoldedblue]

One of my friends is massively into diet and health. She was the one introduced me to Weston Price. I once saw her chase down her son at a party because he had snuck a piece of cake (it was pretty funny...but poor kid..lol). Even though they fed their children only the best, her son's front teeth were completely brown and rotten...like a child who you might suspect had been given soda from a bottle. Her daughter and other son, however, had no issues at all. According to her dentist it is genetic. The good new is that now that he is 8 his rotten teeth have fallen out and his new teeth are perfect.

[Bubu]

"Sugar cause tooth decay" is the most popular meme in oral health it dates back way ahead of awakening to the deceptions. Time will come when the strategy will be reverse. depends upon the reaction of the herd.

"Does breast feeding cause tooth decay?"

If it does will you stop breastfeeding? I dont think one of the healthiest practice can cause such malady. Based on experience from my 8 breastfeed children. The longer the breastfeeding the better. The longest breastfeed is the best. Me and wife agree to this.

[Earth Angel]

thanks everyone for your replies ....was away from my computer all day yesterday so didn't get a chance to respond....

thanks Bubu........it is my daughter not me......but to answer your question NO she will not stop breast feeding, she does not believe it is the cause, how can something that provides so much good for a baby be the cause of this ? but she has a very healthy diet, no sugars at all, organic food, no baby food or cereals.....she eats fruit and veggies, beans, some grains, the baby has a mainly vegan diet (no dairy but some eggs) and mom is mostly vegan but not 100%

I know you have a point about brushing TargeT .... animals don't brush their teeth but they chew on bones .....then again deer do not chew on bones so guess I got that wrong....

In her research my daughter has seen it could be genetic, but then we were thinking of The Biology of Belief and wondering why this 17 month old would have this problem as she is not aware of genetics......and her parents both have beautiful teeth.

It is hard to know with this vegan diet if something is missing from her nutritionally but I see so many kids eating crap all the time with good looking teeth so just was extremely surprised this baby has any cavities and in molars that are just a few months old.






"Sugar cause tooth decay" is the most popular meme in oral health it dates back way ahead of awakening to the deceptions. Time will come when the strategy will be reverse. depends upon the reaction of the herd.

"Does breast feeding cause tooth decay?"

If it does will you stop breastfeeding? I dont think one of the healthiest practice can cause such malady. Based on experience from my 8 breastfeed children. The longer the breastfeeding the better. The longest breastfeed is the best. Me and wife agree to this.

[TargeT]

but to answer your question NO she will not stop breast feeding, she does not believe it is the cause, how can something that provides so much good for a baby be the cause of this ?

Good for her!



If it does will you stop breastfeeding? I dont think one of the healthiest practice can cause such malady. Based on experience from my 8 breastfeed children. The longer the breastfeeding the better. The longest breastfeed is the best. Me and wife agree to this.

I thought I had a lot with 6... haha

I can't think of a good reason not to breastfeed. 2 years is a good goal ;)




In her research my daughter has seen it could be genetic,

This sounds probable, plus it's "milk teeth", A couple of my kids had cavities in their baby teeth as well; but no issues (so far) with their adult teeth.

[Cardillac]

it was a former article that I read on this website wherein it was stated mother's breast milk contains the highest amount of cholesteral;

now this:

https://www.westonaprice.org/health-topics/childrens-health/fat-and-cholesterol-in-human-milk/

be well all-

Larry

[Bubu]

tooth enamel is the hardest part of the human body. IMO its more resistant to acid than plaques and that tooth with perfect enamel should not have plaque more so cavity. water less urinals comes to mind. I think we should have a look at saliva. shells and pearls are created through the sticky saliva.

[TargeT]

shells and pearls are created through the sticky saliva.

Ask and ye shall receive!


but they haven't looked into it for teeth that I know of yet... this is still a big discovery about our shell living friends oral secretions.



Mussel gloop can be used to make wounds knit without any scars

The humble mussel could soon help us prevent scarring. A sticky substance naturally secreted by the marine animal is one element of a glue that closes skin wounds seamlessly in rats. The glue could be used to prevent unsightly scars after accidental cuts or surgical operations.
“If this can be replicated in humans, it might be the next big thing for scar therapy,” says Allison Cowin at the University of South Australia, who wasn’t involved in the study.
Scars form when the collagen scaffolding in skin is broken apart. Instead of re-forming in their original and neat basket-weave arrangement, the collagen fibres grow back in parallel bundles that create the characteristic lumpy appearance of scars.


One way to reduce scarring is to apply decorin, a skin protein involved in collagen organisation. But because decorin has a highly complex physical structure it is hard to synthesise and therefore not used in the clinic.
Sticky substance

To get round this problem, Hyung Joon Cha (http://magic.postech.ac.kr/member/professor.html) at Pohang University of Science and Technology in South Korea and his colleagues have created a simplified version of decorin. They combined a small section of the decorin protein with a collagen-binding molecule and a sticky substance secreted by mussels.
The resulting glue was tested on rats with deep, 8-millimetre-wide wounds. The glue was spread over each wound and covered with clear plastic film. Rats in a control group had their wounds covered in plastic without any glue.




By day 11, 99 per cent of the wound was closed in the treated rats compared with 78 per cent in the control group. By day 28, treated rats had fully recovered and had virtually no visible scarring. In comparison, control rats had thick, purple scars
Closer inspection under the microscope confirmed that collagen fibres in the treated wounds had returned to their original basket-weave arrangement. The new skin had also developed hair follicles, blood vessels, oil glands and other structures that aren’t regenerated in scars.
The glue is able to promote normal collagen growth because negative charges on the decorin fragments hold the fibres apart, says Cha. In doing so, the fibres are more easily able to weave in and out between each other instead of sticking together randomly.
Cowin says the results are impressive but there is still a way to go before the results can be translated to humans. “Rats have loose skin, whereas we have tight skin, and they tend to heal better and have less scarring than we do,” she says. As a result, the glue may not be as effective in people as in rats.
Cha says that the glue will now be tested in pigs, whose skin better resembles our own.
Adding to the toolbox

New scar treatments are greatly needed because the existing ones don’t work very well, says Cowin. Silicone gels, steroids, pressure bandages, cryotherapy and laser treatments are often used to reduce the appearance of scars, but they cannot erase them completely.
Cowin is developing a scar treatment that uses monoclonal antibodies to block a type of protein that impairs wound healing. Other groups are applying embryonic stem cells to wounds, based on the observation that skin abrasions in embryos and early fetuses don’t scar (https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg19526221-400-as-good-as-new-scarless-healing/). These approaches are still being tested in animals.
tu5110b4KS8

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2130806-mussel-gloop-can-be-used-to-make-wounds-knit-without-any-scars/

[CurEus]

There is a very good Facebook page called Cure Tooth Decay based on Ramiel Nagel's research into his own children's dental problems. Literally dozens and dozens of parents with stories about babies first teeth coming through with cavitations. Weston Price Foundation is also an excellent resource. Although your daughter is vegetarian most of the needed nutrients can be sourced from fish and raw milk. Rigid Vegans are a bit beyond my understanding for these protocols. I don't see how they can be helped to resolve, reverse and cure tooth decay....they can stop the progression I expect. They tend to be highly aware of what they consume so they may find "similar" plant based options based on the research below. Good luck and I hope everything resolves well for your daughter and grand daughter.

book: http://www.curetoothdecay.com/ Lots of PDF's floating around the web.


Part 1 is Ramiel Nagel discussing how to cure cavities and reach optimal human health with the Paleo Diet.

Part 2 is Sally Fallon of the Weston A. Price foundation discussing more about the Weston A. Price Diet ...film is cut off abruptly at the end.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNP_QOWxoDk

[suwesi]

Hello Earth Angel,
I researched it a while ago and came to the conclusion, that breastmilk does not feed the bacteria that causes cavities (it has to do with special bacteria in it that "combat" the bad bacteria). Look at http://www.lalecheleague.org/ or pubmed.
(Formula on the contrary can aid cavities).

BUT - if the toddler would not have harmful bacteria in its mouth, it would not have cavities. So it is NOT genetic (this one NEVER is) - the bacteria (Caries) has to be transmitted (often by the parents licking babys spoon, biting on the same apple, even sharing their tooth brush etc.) And if the parents immune system is strong, they can have caries bacteria, but no cavities - and still transmit it unknowingly to their child.

So the best way for a baby not to have cavities is when the whole family makes sure not to transmit caries bacteria. I know, that does not help for your 17 month old grandchild, but maybe for the next one :waving:

Once caries bacteria is in the system, it stays there and then you only can make sure it is kept in bay.

Yes, banning sugar/carbs in general helps a lot (no honey, syrup, no sweet fruits ... ). And banning gluten makes it even better (gluten "sticks" to the teeth and helps building biofilms that protect the bad bacteria). Birch sugar is the perfect substitute for sugar. It is antimicrobial and used in tooth pastes, mouth washes. So perfect, if you want to have him/her treats now and then.

Do not brush too hard! Brushing too hard (especially after certain foods) might harm the enamel and help the bad bacteria find its way.

Many people on a ketogenic diet (low carb/high fat) report they do not develop plaque/tartar on their teeth anymore.

Does she take D3 supplements/or has her levels checked? (or spends a lot of time in the sun between 11 a.m. and 3 p.m. without sun protection creme or a creme below spf 8?)

D3+K2 (+Boron + Magnesium) are responsible for depositing the Calcium into the bones and teeth.

If her parents do not want their toddler to get supplements, your daughter can make sure to have a D3 level of 70+ ng/ml (so there will be enough D3 in the milk).

Does she get enough proteins? (The body is made of amino acids = proteins). You mention eggs and beans. What else? How often?

Where does she get her Omega 3 fatty acids from? (What oils/fat are they using?)

How are her bowels? How many times/day. Loose or firm? Diarrhea?

The first thing I would do, is to write down what she eats and have the nutritious value calculated for a couple of days (I only know german apps, so you have to took for one, but I am sure there are plenty in english). This is the quickest way of finding any imbalances she might have. (Look for D3 deficiency seperately!)
Check if the calculator is able to distinguish between content and absorption. e.g. beens and eggs have a lot protein, but the protein out of beans is not absorbed as well as the egg-protein.

My 3,5 year old would not let us brush his teeth until he was almost 2,5 (sometimes yes, sometimes for weeks no). I had him sugar free for the first 2 years. But he was and is eating gluten and milk and everything (it is near to impossible to find a kindergarden that cooks really healthy food). Me and his father have both bad teeth. My son has so far no cavities/healthy teeth and gums and the dentist said it is unusual that he has calcium build in properly - they do not see it nowadays a lot (they can see if teeth are kind of "transparent/shine through" at the top).
He gets a lot of good fat, D3 (started with 800 iU/day, now 1.600 a day), occasionally K2 (if I have the feeling he did not eat enough greens), occasionally Boron, now and then a multi vitamin, and I almost forgot - vitamin C daily multiple times (now 1-3g a day).
I do not let him drink anything but water and unsweetend tea. We do not give him fluoride (toothpaste is free from). And yes, he was also breast fed quite a while.

Hope that helps
Suwesi

[Gillian]

I haven't had time to read all replies here. My thought is that you, or your daughter, should go to YouTube and look up videos about Dr. Nagel's work. Those teeth will probably remineralize. Also, check out videos about fluoride. Fluoride Nation might be the name of the good one. Fluoride causes cavities as well as brain rot. I hope your daughter is not using a fluoride toothpaste or allowing a dentist to apply fluoride to anybody in her practice. Raise the child with no sugar or grain in the diet and everything should be fine. Let them enjoy the breastfeeding for as long as they want as there are still advantages to doing it.

[Earth Angel]

thanks everyone I see I missed some replies to this post and have just asked about this problem again on a new one.....my mind is going lol