+ Reply to Thread
Page 12 of 18 FirstFirst 1 2 12 18 LastLast
Results 221 to 240 of 355

Thread: When men were men & women were feminine

  1. Link to Post #221
    Ireland Avalon Member gnostic9's Avatar
    Join Date
    3rd January 2014
    Age
    62
    Posts
    338
    Thanks
    2,433
    Thanked 1,971 times in 308 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    I watched this earlier from a link in my email. Very moving and emotional. The email was from Josh Del Sol the guy who made the "Take Back Your Power" film. I believe that this conversation about masculinity is vital in the time we are experiencing now, Please watch.





    Love peace and joy to all!

  2. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to gnostic9 For This Post:

    Ewan (9th August 2021), ExomatrixTV (9th August 2021), Mike (9th August 2021)

  3. Link to Post #222
    Netherlands Avalon Member ExomatrixTV's Avatar
    Join Date
    23rd September 2011
    Location
    Netherlands
    Language
    English, Dutch, German, Limburgs
    Age
    57
    Posts
    22,727
    Thanks
    30,823
    Thanked 125,700 times in 20,824 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    • Jordan Peterson on the 'backlash against masculinity' - BBC News:

    • Jordan Peterson talks MASCULINITY with Russell Brand:

    • Jordan B Peterson on masculinity and the plight of young men | BBC Sounds:

    • Jordan Peterson: Toxic Masculinity - A 12 Rules for Life Lecture:
    Last edited by ExomatrixTV; 9th August 2021 at 01:37.
    No need to follow anyone, only consider broadening (y)our horizon of possibilities ...

  4. The Following User Says Thank You to ExomatrixTV For This Post:

    Ewan (9th August 2021)

  5. Link to Post #223
    United States Avalon Member Mike's Avatar
    Join Date
    24th January 2011
    Location
    journeying to the end of the night
    Age
    46
    Posts
    5,777
    Thanks
    35,700
    Thanked 50,307 times in 5,692 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    It's important in these types of discussions that equality isn't conflated with sameness.

    Equality, to me - in the context of a relationship between the sexes - means that there's no disparity in respect being offered. But men and women are different - thousands of years of evolution are burnt into our DNA. Men have been providers and protectors since forever. It's in their biology.

    Nature is intelligent. Our ancestors didn't get it wrong for thousands of years. They weren't assigning roles arbitrarily. Biology often dictated that men did this and women did that. Now, in 2021, it's different obviously, for all sorts of reasons, because women can perform many of the jobs men currently do. But that doesn't mean that all that ancestral behavior, burnt into the DNA of men and women, will suddenly cease to exist. So we're in the middle of a rocky adjustment period.

    But regardless of what the current paradigm yields, there will still be roles that men are more suited for, and vice versa. This mania for "equality" disregards our inherent nature and can cause all sorts of damage.

    I once lived with this woman, in my mid 20's. She did little more than putter around the apartment we shared. I went to work, bought the food, paid the bills etc. It got especially annoying after a year or so. But I kept doing it. I took care of her.

    One day she suggested I stop and write the screenplay I'd been meaning to write. She'd go to work, she said, and support us while I wrote. I couldn't believe it. But sure enough, she got a job and I quit mine, and I began writing. I was thrilled on the one hand, but something about it felt off. I just couldn't articulate it.

    Within weeks, her attitude towards me changed. It was all in the eyes. She resented me. She insisted she didn't, but it was obvious. It didn't even matter that I was still buying my own food and so on; it didn't matter that I'd taken care of her for well over a year - she never worked a day or lifted a finger during that time, but just a few weeks in of this role reversal and she was already snappy and moody and bitter. That's all it took! She'd conveniently forgotten all the sweat and toil and effort that I'd put in so she could sit around and smoke cigarettes all day for the last year plus

    But I'd expected it. It was simply the acting out of the uneasy feeling I had before it all began. Even though I wasn't working, and was doing what I loved, I never felt comfortable doing it. I felt guilty somehow, even though I kept reminding myself that I was the one who had been carrying her for the last year or so. It never quieted my conscience. And she never got used to her role either.

    It's because these things are built into the biology. A woman, over time, will stop respecting a man who stays at home. I've seen this happen many, many times. Even if the man staying at home is something they both agreed on! Even if the man had done years of heavy lifting prior for the both of them. That situation fails far more often than it works. And a woman cannot love you if she doesn't respect you. It's that simple.

    Imagine this: a robber breaks into the house. the couple sits up in bed and the man says, "here's the baseball bat, go get him! let me know when the coast is clear and I'll come out!" How much equality do women really want exactly? It stops at the scenario above, surely. But where does it begin and where does it stop, exactly? These are things we're still in the process of defining, and it's quite confusing for everyone.
    Last edited by Mike; 9th August 2021 at 02:15.

  6. The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to Mike For This Post:

    Billy Vasiliadis (9th August 2021), Ewan (4th October 2021), ExomatrixTV (9th August 2021), greybeard (9th August 2021), Mark (Star Mariner) (9th August 2021), Mashika (9th August 2021), Vicus (23rd September 2021)

  7. Link to Post #224
    On Sabbatical
    Join Date
    26th September 2019
    Language
    None
    Posts
    3,411
    Thanks
    10,548
    Thanked 27,828 times in 3,335 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    Quote Posted by Mike (here)
    Imagine this: a robber breaks into the house. the couple sits up in bed and the man says, "here's the baseball bat, go get him! let me know when the coast is clear and I'll come out!" How much equality do women really want exactly? It stops at the scenario above, surely. But where does it begin and where does it stop, exactly? These are things we're still in the process of defining, and it's quite confusing for everyone.
    That's why i have a .38 Super, and a couple AK-47, that i know how to use way better than most guys i have ever met. In fact, some of them when learning i had very high military training, didn't felt like pursuing the relationship anymore. It does look like they ran scared with their tails between their legs, somehow

    Apparently being unable to be in control of the situation, is a no go for a lot of guys, which to me, just means they were weak to begin with, and they just expected to 'own' and not to stand equal, they wanted to "show me" to their friends? lol

    And by standing equal i mean, let me do whatever i want, and if i do and then fail, then i wasn't strong enough, but it was 'my choice' to try, i'll deal with the failure and if the guy is good enough, he will be with me through that. If i fail at something, and the guy immediately thinks, "it's because she's a woman" then he's just crap. And the other way around too

    I don't need anyone to 'protect' me, specially if in the end i may be one who actually has the power to protect our family
    Last edited by Mashika; 9th August 2021 at 02:40.
    Tired

  8. The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to Mashika For This Post:

    Billy Vasiliadis (9th August 2021), Ewan (4th October 2021), Mark (Star Mariner) (9th August 2021), Mike (9th August 2021), pyrangello (4th October 2021), Victoria (11th August 2021)

  9. Link to Post #225
    On Sabbatical
    Join Date
    26th September 2019
    Language
    None
    Posts
    3,411
    Thanks
    10,548
    Thanked 27,828 times in 3,335 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    If you have ever shot a Yugo AK-47 in full open mode (meaning you select the "all the ammo will go out as long as you don't let go of the trigger) then you know the barrel may burn and waste the rifle forever. I have some friends invited long ago to try one of the cheap rifles we had, for training. They shot a couple rounds, they closed their eyes while shooting. then i picked one and put on a full show, with around 30 or more shots in sequence, they kept jumping and closing their eyes like little girls.. LMFAO! I don't think man are all they think they are, and if you can't handle the sound of a barrage of rounds, are you man enough to handle areal woman? lol

    That's how i see things, and i'm pretty sure even people like Gal Gadot, the "Wonder Woman" actress from Israel, thinks the same, because she went though the army training as well before going into acting. Our world is not the same anymore, and in Russia, it never was, Women fought along with men, out there on the field, in between all the carnage. We do indeed live in very different worlds <3

    *There are boys, and there are man* Boys want to be in control, man understand that things work in a different way, and they don't want to control, they want to experience life along with a woman they can respect, and who can take over, if and when needed. That's all i know
    Last edited by Mashika; 9th August 2021 at 02:51.
    Tired

  10. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Mashika For This Post:

    Billy Vasiliadis (9th August 2021), Ewan (4th October 2021), Mike (9th August 2021), pyrangello (4th October 2021)

  11. Link to Post #226
    United States Avalon Member thepainterdoug's Avatar
    Join Date
    27th November 2013
    Age
    70
    Posts
    3,216
    Thanks
    11,007
    Thanked 33,162 times in 3,159 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    Mashi

    you made me think of Herman Melville/

    This whole act's immutably decreed. 'Twas rehearsed by thee and me a billion years before this ocean rolled. Fool! I am the Fates' lieutenant; I act under orders.
    Herman Melville, Moby Dick

    we are still doing this dance, as old as the hills. its the game we were given and we have only given it a theme and variations treatment since. Each generation thinking its new and has some liberating angle and insight, but yet ends up all the same

    i dont see any way out, and even if there were, who says it would be any better?

  12. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to thepainterdoug For This Post:

    Ewan (4th October 2021), Mark (Star Mariner) (9th August 2021), Mashika (9th August 2021), Mike (9th August 2021), pyrangello (4th October 2021)

  13. Link to Post #227
    United States Avalon Member Mike's Avatar
    Join Date
    24th January 2011
    Location
    journeying to the end of the night
    Age
    46
    Posts
    5,777
    Thanks
    35,700
    Thanked 50,307 times in 5,692 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    Masha I would be one of those little boys quivering with that AK lol! I've never shot a gun before. I'd like to. I should probably start with something smaller first

    Typically, men date laterally and down in the heirarchy. While women date laterally and up. Women, in general, want someone just as successful but usually more successful and competent, and men in general want someone less successful and less competent.

    I make no judgement on this. There are all sorts of reasons for it, and we can get into them if you want. I'm not suggesting men are better or smarter and so on. This is just what the social sciences tell us. And it's pretty consistent with my observations.

    I think there is a difference between a man that is a control freak and a man that is a provider/protector. You don't need any protecting perhaps, but I also think you are somewhat unique. I don't think you fit the mold of the typical woman that is looking up the heirarchy for someone more successful or competent. You are looking laterally, for an equal. So you might, according to social scientists, have a little more difficulty meeting someone because the typical man may be intimidated by you.

    Here's a question for you. I'm very curious how you'll answer this. Exactly how equal would you like your relationship to be? What if this hypothetical man was just as handy with an AK as you? And what if that robber arrived? And what if this man said, "you take care of it." Would you lose respect for that man? What if that same man asssumed a role more traditionally held by women, and stayed home while you went out into the world and earned a living? Would you lose respect for him? I know you don't *need* someone to protect and provide for you, but would you prefer a man assume that role at least some of the time? And how would that effect your feeling toward him?
    Last edited by Mike; 9th August 2021 at 03:24.

  14. The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to Mike For This Post:

    Billy Vasiliadis (9th August 2021), Ewan (4th October 2021), ExomatrixTV (9th August 2021), Mashika (9th August 2021), pyrangello (4th October 2021), Vicus (23rd September 2021)

  15. Link to Post #228
    On Sabbatical
    Join Date
    26th September 2019
    Language
    None
    Posts
    3,411
    Thanks
    10,548
    Thanked 27,828 times in 3,335 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    Quote Posted by Mike (here)
    Masha I would be one of those little boys quivering with that AK lol! I've never shot a gun before. I'd like to. I should probably start with something smaller first

    Typically, men date laterally and down in the heirarchy. While women date laterally and up. Women, in general, want someone just as successful but usually more successful and competent, and men in general want someone less successful and less competent.

    I make no judgement on this. There are all sorts of reasons for it, and we can get into them if you want. I'm not suggesting men are better or smarter and so on. This is just what the social sciences tell us. And it's pretty consistent with my observations.

    I think there is a difference between a man that is a control freak and a man that is a provider/protector. You don't need any protecting perhaps, but I also think you are somewhat unique. I don't think you fit the mold of the typical woman that is looking up the heirarchy for someone more successful or competent. You are looking laterally, for an equal. So you might, according to social scientists, have a little more difficulty meeting someone because the typical man may be intimidated by you.

    Here's a question for you. I'm very curious how you'll answer this. Exactly how equal would you like your relationship to be? What if this hypothetical man was just as handy with an AK as you? And what if that robber arrived? And what if this man said, "you take care of it." Would you lose respect for that man? What if that same man asssumed a role more traditionally held by women, and stayed home while you went out into the world and earned a living? Would you lose respect for him? I know you don't *need* someone to protect and provide for you, but would you prefer a man assume that role at least some of the time? And how would that effect your feeling toward him?
    IF it gets to that, i will do two things, if i was the one person inside the house while the robber comes, i will pick up at least 2 guns, go out in a rampage taking the feet fingers of the guy, then hand the second gun to my husband or bf. Then we would take care of it. Because he will know what to do

    If i was the one outside, i would expect the same from him, and then i would be handed a gun, i would trust blindly in his actions. Then "we would take care of the issue"

    What i expect is this, IF something happens, and i die, i expect him to take care of himself to the best he can, and if we had kids, i expect he will be strong enough to bring them up to our standards, without me.

    And if something happens, and he dies, or falls down, i will do exactly the same, regardless of the situation, I'll find a way, and will not fall down into "ohh poor of me, if only i had someone to support us" situation. That's preposterous lol. I'll figure it out, one way or another

    Quote What if that same man asssumed a role more traditionally held by women, and stayed home while you went out into the world and earned a livin
    I would expect him to raise exceptional children, because obviously i noticed something in him i liked so much, that i could not help being with him and raise a family. So i would expect him to be "that person" that excels just like that

    If someone needs to worry or be in a position of protecting someone else, instead of "knowing" who the other person is, and don't feel insecure about their relationship. Then i see weakness

    My role model, as far as man are, is someone who 'knows' that the person they married or live with, is capable enough to deal with anything on their own, and this guy is self aware and secure enough of his feelings and trust, that he knows absolutely nothing, will break the relationship apart, ever, regardless of who is 'in control' at any time. Like going to another country or being away for a couple years, but knowing everything back home is perfectly fine, because that person back there, is capable enough, on their own. That's how i learned man, or woman should be, at all times
    Last edited by Mashika; 9th August 2021 at 03:47.
    Tired

  16. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Mashika For This Post:

    Ewan (4th October 2021), Mike (9th August 2021)

  17. Link to Post #229
    On Sabbatical
    Join Date
    26th September 2019
    Language
    None
    Posts
    3,411
    Thanks
    10,548
    Thanked 27,828 times in 3,335 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    Quote Posted by Mike (here)
    Masha I would be one of those little boys quivering with that AK lol! I've never shot a gun before. I'd like to. I should probably start with something smaller first

    Typically, men date laterally and down in the heirarchy. While women date laterally and up. Women, in general, want someone just as successful but usually more successful and competent, and men in general want someone less successful and less competent.

    I make no judgement on this. There are all sorts of reasons for it, and we can get into them if you want. I'm not suggesting men are better or smarter and so on. This is just what the social sciences tell us. And it's pretty consistent with my observations.

    I think there is a difference between a man that is a control freak and a man that is a provider/protector. You don't need any protecting perhaps, but I also think you are somewhat unique. I don't think you fit the mold of the typical woman that is looking up the heirarchy for someone more successful or competent. You are looking laterally, for an equal. So you might, according to social scientists, have a little more difficulty meeting someone because the typical man may be intimidated by you.

    Here's a question for you. I'm very curious how you'll answer this. Exactly how equal would you like your relationship to be? What if this hypothetical man was just as handy with an AK as you? And what if that robber arrived? And what if this man said, "you take care of it." Would you lose respect for that man? What if that same man asssumed a role more traditionally held by women, and stayed home while you went out into the world and earned a living? Would you lose respect for him? I know you don't *need* someone to protect and provide for you, but would you prefer a man assume that role at least some of the time? And how would that effect your feeling toward him?
    But i do agree with something, my life experience and situation, is not exactly the same one as most girls. I do happen to have a very different life experience, due to 'reasons' i could never even begin to explain now, or ever maybe :/

    But it's no only me, try to befriend other Russian girls, and you'll see how similar some things are. Except for the fact at lot of them expect guys to pay for everything *while still dating*, but even after that, they still expect to completely be independent for everything else in daily life
    Last edited by Mashika; 9th August 2021 at 04:02.
    Tired

  18. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Mashika For This Post:

    Ewan (4th October 2021), Mike (9th August 2021), pyrangello (4th October 2021), Victoria (11th August 2021)

  19. Link to Post #230
    On Sabbatical
    Join Date
    26th September 2019
    Language
    None
    Posts
    3,411
    Thanks
    10,548
    Thanked 27,828 times in 3,335 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    I just realized something, maybe i'm thinking of this entire thing completely from my own point of view, without regard from western ideals. In which case i apologize, i'm stepping on your culture ideals without any regard, and assuming you are wrong. Which is wrong approach in so many levels

    But maybe this may explain why i sound the way i do right now....

    Have you ever considered, why Russia, is thought of as "The Motherland", and not "The Fatherland"? :D

    There are around 3 reasons for it, but a big one, in modern times, is that current Russia was basically built on the top of Russian women, after most men died in WW2. There are other reasons as well like "the land that we were born from" and so on, but most people don't/would not get it much unless they have met a Babushka from the old times, then they would see how little need they had, or learned to have, for "protection" of any sorts or ways
    Last edited by Mashika; 9th August 2021 at 04:20.
    Tired

  20. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Mashika For This Post:

    Billy Vasiliadis (9th August 2021), Ewan (4th October 2021), Victoria (11th August 2021)

  21. Link to Post #231
    United States Avalon Member Strat's Avatar
    Join Date
    27th April 2010
    Language
    English
    Age
    38
    Posts
    1,982
    Thanks
    4,502
    Thanked 13,307 times in 1,825 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    Quote Posted by Mashika (here)
    they still expect to completely be independent for everything else in daily life
    I don't mean to interrupt yalls discussion, it's interesting. But something I always thought was fascinating from a cultural standpoint is there was a book written in the 90s, in the US, called "Millionaire Next Door." It was basically a survey of what millionaires across the US look like and a large percentage of them were Russian immigrant gals. I have the book and I'll look into it later. I think the salient point of the book was that most millionaires lived middle class lives and saved their cash rather than buying expensive houses and nice cars.

    Oh and yes that damn AK gets really hot! Even semi auto (I never shot full auto). And the shell ejects really far. I think the M4 is better but I love/prefer the AK more because of the reliability. You can break it down in like 2 seconds. But hey, another thread for another day.

  22. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Strat For This Post:

    Ewan (4th October 2021), Mashika (9th August 2021)

  23. Link to Post #232
    On Sabbatical
    Join Date
    26th September 2019
    Language
    None
    Posts
    3,411
    Thanks
    10,548
    Thanked 27,828 times in 3,335 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    Quote Posted by Strat (here)
    Quote Posted by Mashika (here)
    they still expect to completely be independent for everything else in daily life
    I don't mean to interrupt yalls discussion, it's interesting. But something I always thought was fascinating from a cultural standpoint is there was a book written in the 90s, in the US, called "Millionaire Next Door." It was basically a survey of what millionaires across the US look like and a large percentage of them were Russian immigrant gals. I have the book and I'll look into it later. I think the salient point of the book was that most millionaires lived middle class lives and saved their cash rather than buying expensive houses and nice cars.

    Oh and yes that damn AK gets really hot! Even semi auto (I never shot full auto). And the shell ejects really far. I think the M4 is better but I love/prefer the AK more because of the reliability. You can break it down in like 2 seconds. But hey, another thread for another day.
    Yes lol, the full auto is considered a "kid" switch, for when you want to feel you are in a movie, but it does show how strong you are really, in terms of how much can you take of 'reality', even if the gun will die. It was a cheap one anyways, for training so if it dies then "it dies". It was a mistake for Yugoslavia to create those monsterous full auto guns. But like you said, that's a topic for another thread..

    I will have to look at that book, i don't remember ever hearing about it. Is that current Russia or the one from back in the USSR republics?

    Is that book about the "New Russians" or what US people now call "Oligarks" or something?
    Last edited by Mashika; 9th August 2021 at 04:28.
    Tired

  24. The Following User Says Thank You to Mashika For This Post:

    Ewan (4th October 2021)

  25. Link to Post #233
    United States Avalon Member Strat's Avatar
    Join Date
    27th April 2010
    Language
    English
    Age
    38
    Posts
    1,982
    Thanks
    4,502
    Thanked 13,307 times in 1,825 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    Quote Posted by Mashika (here)
    Is that current Russia or the one from back in the USSR republics?
    I'm a moron so I can't give you a definitive answer but my guess is USSR. I'd actually put money on it... Not a lot though.

  26. The Following User Says Thank You to Strat For This Post:

    Mashika (9th August 2021)

  27. Link to Post #234
    On Sabbatical
    Join Date
    26th September 2019
    Language
    None
    Posts
    3,411
    Thanks
    10,548
    Thanked 27,828 times in 3,335 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    Quote Posted by Strat (here)
    Quote Posted by Mashika (here)
    Is that current Russia or the one from back in the USSR republics?
    I'm a moron so I can't give you a definitive answer but my guess is USSR. I'd actually put money on it... Not a lot though.
    "Is that book about the "New Russians" or what US people now call "Oligarks" or something?"

    I bet you already figured out which category i belong to So i'm going to shamelessly 'a moron' myself
    Tired

  28. Link to Post #235
    United States Avalon Member Strat's Avatar
    Join Date
    27th April 2010
    Language
    English
    Age
    38
    Posts
    1,982
    Thanks
    4,502
    Thanked 13,307 times in 1,825 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    Oh, the book wasn't necessarily about Russians at all. It was just a survey of what the average millionaire in America looks like, how they live, spend their money, etc. They also looked at immigrants who achieved a high level of wealth and (for whatever reason) Russian gals consistently accumulated wealth. I may be butchering it, I haven't read this book since I was young. But as I said, I'll look it up.

    It definitely wasn't referring to Oligarks. Just average people who achieved high wealth.

  29. Link to Post #236
    United States Avalon Member Mike's Avatar
    Join Date
    24th January 2011
    Location
    journeying to the end of the night
    Age
    46
    Posts
    5,777
    Thanks
    35,700
    Thanked 50,307 times in 5,692 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    I once worked with a Russian woman named Vera. One day she saw me reading 'The Gulag Archipelago' during a break and we had a little chat about it. We became friends. She spoke of her daughter often..and one day, in her thick Russian accent, she said, "Would you like meet my daughter?" I said, "sure", and never really gave it a thought after that.

    Well, maybe a month later here comes this young woman, widely grinning, approaching me as I was leaving work. She explained in broken English that she was Vera's daughter, and said little else. But even in the silence between us, I sensed some kind of expectation from her. She was sort of looking at me like, "well, what now?"

    And then I dimly recalled Vera asking me if I wanted to meet her daughter about a month prior, and my stomach sank. This was obviously her way of trying to create a romantic connection between us. I was naive. I didn't make that connection at the time.

    So this woman, named Anna, followed me to my car and just got in! "My Mom send me picture of you when I in Russia. You very handsome!" she told me. "She say you want meet me."

    At that moment, I realised that my agreeing to meet her meant about 10 different things in Russian, apparently It meant that I was supposed to entertain her for the 2 weeks she was in America, for starters. But it also meant, I quickly discovered, that I was expected to act as tour guide and pay for every last little thing. But that wasn't it. There's more..

    The whole point of her coming to America was to not only meet me and let me entertain her for 2 weeks..it was to marry her so she could get into the country LOL. She was very open about this by the way. She acted as though herself and Vera and I had spent hours discussing it, that I'd happily agreed and that a ring would be arriving shortly. She made it all sound as simple and easy as a walk in the park. How Vera got all this from me merely agreeing to meet her daughter was beyond me. All I said was "sure", and then suddenly I was confronted by this grinning Russian woman and thrust into this arranged marriage plan of which I had absolutely no previous knowledge of.

    But the funniest part of all this was her attitude, which was: you have to earn me buddy! You have to woo me and impress me. Yes i want to come to America but first you must show me you're worthy if I'm going to marry you.

    And I just couldn't convince her that I wasn't interested in marrying her LOL. I tried to explain, as politely as I could, that I didnt even particularly want to show her around and spend money I didn't have on her. She simply couldn't believe it. She was quite beautiful, and I suspect men had been tripping over themselves back in Russia to get in her good graces. And had the situation been a little different, I may have done the same. But it was all so bizarre and unexpected that I couldn't quite wrap my head around it.

    Anyway, her and I are friends now and we still chat sometimes. She found her American guy and married him eventually. Worked out for everyone....except the guy, who she eventually left
    Last edited by Mike; 9th August 2021 at 04:55.

  30. The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to Mike For This Post:

    Billy Vasiliadis (9th August 2021), Ewan (4th October 2021), Journeyman (9th August 2021), Kryztian (15th November 2021), Mark (Star Mariner) (9th August 2021), Mashika (9th August 2021), pyrangello (4th October 2021), Vicus (23rd September 2021), Wind (9th August 2021)

  31. Link to Post #237
    On Sabbatical
    Join Date
    26th September 2019
    Language
    None
    Posts
    3,411
    Thanks
    10,548
    Thanked 27,828 times in 3,335 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    Quote Posted by Mike (here)
    I once worked with a Russian woman named Vera. One day she saw me reading 'The Gulag Archipelago' during a break and we had a little chat about it. We became friends. She spoke of her daughter often..and one day, in her thick Russian accent, she said, "Would you like meet my daughter?" I said, "sure", and never really gave it a thought after that.

    Well, maybe a month later here comes this young woman, widely grinning, approaching me as I was leaving work. She explained in broken English that she was Vera's daughter, and said little else. But even in the silence between us, I sensed some kind of expectation from her. She was sort of looking at me like, "well, what now?"

    And then I dimly recalled Vera asking me if I wanted to meet her daughter about a month prior, and my stomach sank. This was obviously her way of trying to create a romantic connection between us. I was naive. I didn't make that connection at the time.

    So this woman, named Anna, followed me to my car and just got in! "My Mom send me picture of you when I in Russia. You very handsome!" she told me. "She say you want meet me."

    At that moment, I realised that my agreeing to meet her meant about 10 different things in Russian, apparently It meant that I was supposed to entertain her for the 2 weeks she was in America, for starters. But it also meant, I quickly discovered, that I was expected to act as tour guide and pay for every last little thing. But that wasn't it. There's more..

    The whole point of her coming to America was to not only meet me and let me entertain her for 2 weeks..it was to marry her so she could get into the country LOL. She was very open about this by the way. She acted as though herself and Vera and I had spent hours discussing it, that I'd happily agreed and that a ring would be arriving shortly. She made it all sound as simple and easy as a walk in the park. How Vera got all this from me merely agreeing to meet her daughter was beyond me. All I said was "sure", and then suddenly I was confronted by this grinning Russian woman and thrust into this arranged marriage plan of which I had absolutely no previous knowledge of.

    But the funniest part of all this was her attitude, which was: you have to earn me buddy! You have to woo me and impress me. Yes i want to come to America but first you must show me you're worthy if I'm going to marry you.

    And I just couldn't convince her that I wasn't interested in marrying her LOL. I tried to explain, as politely as I could, that I didnt even particularly want to show her around and spend money I didn't have on her. She simply couldn't believe it. She was quite beautiful, and I suspect men had been tripping over themselves back in Russia to get in her good graces. And had the situation been a little different, I may have done the same. But it was all so bizarre and unexpected that I couldn't quite wrap my head around it.

    Anyway, her and I are friends now and we still chat sometimes. She found her American guy and married him eventually. Worked out for everyone....except the guy, who she eventually left
    Most girls are like that, but not in Russia, mostly on the Ukraine republic, "mail brides" they are called. I believe

    In Russia, most guys are always treated hard, so that they show if they are capable or not, to be "the right one", in other old USSR republics, like Belorusia and/or Ukraine and such, girls are dumb in that "I want the guy to pay for me all the time" way, silly rabbits
    Tired

  32. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Mashika For This Post:

    Ewan (4th October 2021), Mike (9th August 2021), pyrangello (4th October 2021), Vicus (23rd September 2021), Wind (9th August 2021)

  33. Link to Post #238
    Netherlands Avalon Member ExomatrixTV's Avatar
    Join Date
    23rd September 2011
    Location
    Netherlands
    Language
    English, Dutch, German, Limburgs
    Age
    57
    Posts
    22,727
    Thanks
    30,823
    Thanked 125,700 times in 20,824 posts

    Lightbulb Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    • "Feminism vs Masculinity"
    Most (if not all) Avalonians do not know how I really was raised ... as I never told anyone here ... that my mother was a very verrrry pro-active Dutch Feminist & Anti-War Activist being multiple times on national front page news papers, national radio & national tv shows in mid 1970s up to mid 1980s ... She even had her own radio shows in Amsterdam and published own news-paper dealing with Women & Gay Rights ... She was also one of the first in The Netherlands creating a network of parents schooling 3 & 4 years olds before they go to school officially and it was considered "very bad" by Christians at the time .... She was also co-founder of helping to shelter women who were abused & raped even within marriage!

    My mother studied Psychology in University of Maastricht and I became like a "target" for some benevolent "experiments" ... I remember her asking me questions like "how do you feel" when I was 8 or 9 years old and my answer was: "my vocabulary is not big enough to express that sufficiently" ...

    She also organized "Alternative Eastern" long weekend & "Alternative Christmas" long weekend by renting a big Farm in nature often with a big lake nearby with 2 other Feminists (Gonnie & Mirre) ... partial "camping" partial big sleeping places ... and placing a small advertisement in the big national (classical liberal) news papers asking if anyone is creative like playing music or organizing "scavenger hunt adventures" scouts for the kids ... and all ages were welcome.

    So I met all kinds of creative people from all walks of life for years ... like some one who teaches yoga or some one who can play chess with me or some one who works in theater as an actor and prepares a group of voluntaries to join a play ... and I can go on and on of being immersed in diversity & meeting "weird" people having their own story to tell.
    • All of it shaped me who I am today.
    Being raised like that and being a "Product of Feminism" has its downfalls and set-backs ... as for a long time "I had to be ashamed to be a man" and when I started be in my puberty phase ... I was not welcome anymore where my mother was active. Not all were like that but there were some "women only" events & protest marches where they took their children with them until some of the children became a "man" thus they debated if I was allowed to be there.

    I remember my mother saying that most feminists are "anti-man" because of having multiple traumatic experiences with men ... and she tried to educate all of them that children have always the right to see his or her fathers and visa versa ... She found out many times how children are lied to by his or her mother about how evil their dads are ... yes it has some truth mixed with endless exaggerations & demonizing/misrepresentations where a child has no clue what to make of it. This problem of many divorced parents where children are used as pawns between wars is happening more than people realize and HOW that can effect somebody for the rest of your life. So she knew the flaws of feminism vs masculinity ... she was one of the very few that repeated many times fathers have rights too to see their children.

    Emotionally I was confronted with all kinds of female victims of rape & abuse for couple years at young age that shaped me to be feeling guilty for being a man later on long time.

    So many layers of behavior fused with guilt, shame, not understood, "being an outsider", anger towards a "masculine system" etc. etc.

    The older I became to more I was aware of how psychological conditioning works in so many parts of how people act/operate and why ... and I literally "breathe psychology" meaning: for me it seems effortless to explore all possible psychological mechanisms ... not assuming I am right ...nor claiming to "know best" ... that is not what it is about ... it is about allowing yourself to see all perspectives/perceptions and having empathy enough NOT to judge too fast when some one behave in a certain weird way.
    • Should I write a book or make a video about: "how it is to be a son of a very pro-active Dutch Feminist activist and how I found my own path to a (healthy form of) masculinity?
    cheers,
    John Kuhles
    August 9, 2021
    Last edited by ExomatrixTV; 9th August 2021 at 16:37.
    No need to follow anyone, only consider broadening (y)our horizon of possibilities ...

  34. The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to ExomatrixTV For This Post:

    Dorjezigzag (4th October 2021), Ewan (4th October 2021), greybeard (9th August 2021), Michel Leclerc (16th October 2021), Mike (9th August 2021), Vicus (23rd September 2021)

  35. Link to Post #239
    Administrator Mark (Star Mariner)'s Avatar
    Join Date
    15th November 2011
    Language
    English
    Posts
    4,399
    Thanks
    29,156
    Thanked 35,504 times in 4,311 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    The twisted concepts of wokeness get proven out when they become entangled and conflict with each other.

    That's what seems to be happening here in the clip below. Boys are competing with girls at sports on account of inclusivity. But that is not a fair contest, as males are just built differently, and that's a biological reality.

    Perhaps the official symbol for wokeness should be the Ouroboros: eventually it must consume itself, for it trapped itself in a corner here. Due to the need to pander to this inclusivity nonsense it was forced to facilitate ridiculous sporting match-ups, which can only end one way.

    In a way this is a good thing, as it should serve as a very rude wake up call, particularly for women and girls - they are the victim of this. Don't forget, they are also under severe assault from the trans community, being called abhorrent things, like 'people who menstruate', and 'chest-feeders' (breast-feeding being deemed unacceptable and offensive to pregnant trans-women).

    ‘Absolutely outrageous’: All-male netball team beats girls in state tournament


    Women once fought for their rights and won. I feel (I fear) they may soon have to do so again, and fight against the very ideology (gone toxic and out of control) that once liberated them.
    "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace."
    ~ Jimi Hendrix

  36. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Mark (Star Mariner) For This Post:

    Ewan (4th October 2021), greybeard (4th October 2021)

  37. Link to Post #240
    Canada Avalon Member Ernie Nemeth's Avatar
    Join Date
    25th January 2011
    Location
    Toronto
    Age
    66
    Posts
    5,659
    Thanks
    26,233
    Thanked 36,600 times in 5,379 posts

    Default Re: When men were men & women were feminine

    One of my fondest memories is when we got the great privilege of playing the senior girls basketball team. Our sophomore team was undefeated that year, with no one coming within 20 points of us. The team was so good I only managed to be the sixth man.

    It was unheard of in those days. And it was not an official meeting. They said they could beat us, we told them they were welcome to try. They showed up at one of our unofficial practices at the local revamped old church. No adults...no referees. It was almost a free for all, really, and a whole lot of fun for us young boys...

    We lost, but we were not really trying to win...we focused on our...um...man-to-man coverage as it were.
    Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless — like water...Now water can flow or it can crash. Be water, my friend. Bruce Lee

    Free will can only be as free as the mind that conceives it.

  38. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Ernie Nemeth For This Post:

    Ewan (4th October 2021), greybeard (4th October 2021), Mark (Star Mariner) (5th October 2021)

+ Reply to Thread
Page 12 of 18 FirstFirst 1 2 12 18 LastLast

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts