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Thread: The UK Smart-Meter battle

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    Avalon Member norman's Avatar
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    Default The UK Smart-Meter battle

    My all-in-one utility supplier/biller has tightened the squeeze on me to cave in to having a smart meter.

    The language is becoming more forceful and their tactics are getting dirty. In the last month their website widget for entering self read meter readings has become broken. The confirmation click to enter the reading goes nowhere but a revolving icon that means wait. It never stops, and a check shows that the new reading has not been added.

    My immediate impulse is to dump them and find another supplier ( or separate suppliers for each service ) but when I look on line for options I don't see any useful information about the important things I need to know.

    Like, what are other suppliers doing in the smart meter battle ?. Comparison websites don't include that kind of information.

    So, do we need to share our experiences as open source information ?. What suppliers do others use and what are your experiences so far with the smart meter push ?

    My supplier is Utility Warehouse. It's a combined deal for electricity, gas, phone ( land line ) and broadband. I don't mind splitting that up into separate suppliers if I can find an electricity supplier that's NOT pushing a smart meter. It seems like a thin chance but does anyone have any good news about this, even if it means paying a bit more for the electricity to cover their policy of not selling data from the smart meters ?

    In my case, I have a 2nd issue with having a smart meter installed at my home. They use the mobile phone network to operate. There isn't a good signal for any of the networks here. That would mean the meter would be running at maximum radiation power, constantly 24/7, trying to handshake with a tower. That's a horrible nightmare prospect even if I didn't give a damn about the data.

    Are there any options that are better than jumping out of one frying pan into another frying pan ?
    ..................................................my first language is TYPO..............................................

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    Great Britain Avalon Member samildamach's Avatar
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    Default Re: The UK Smart-Meter battle

    I've not had any pressure at all on the east coast to install a smart meter.

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    Avalon Member norman's Avatar
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    Default Re: The UK Smart-Meter battle

    Quote Posted by samildamach (here)
    I've not had any pressure at all on the east coast to install a smart meter.

    which company is that ?
    ..................................................my first language is TYPO..............................................

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    Default Re: The UK Smart-Meter battle

    Avro it's one of the smaller energy suppliers

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    Default Re: The UK Smart-Meter battle

    I went with British Gas 3 years ago for my electricity, a couple of months later they phoned me once to say "We're phoning to make an appointment to install your new smart meter". I told them in no uncertain terms that I wouldn't let them in and I haven't been bothered by them since.

    You need to look carefully at these 'best tariffs' offers, as a lot of them are dependent on having a smart meter.

    ¤=[Post Update]=¤

    Quote Posted by samildamach (here)
    Avro it's one of the smaller energy suppliers
    Thanks for posting that, I'll look into them and see if they offer a cheaper tariff than my current one.

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    Avalon Member norman's Avatar
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    Default Re: The UK Smart-Meter battle

    Quote Posted by samildamach (here)
    Avro it's one of the smaller energy suppliers

    https://www.avroenergy.co.uk/



    On the face of it, that looks good. That would leave phone and broadband to deal with. It's about 10 years since I switched any of my utility services. I'm out of touch with what's going on in the market place. I assume most suppliers are trying to combine services. It's a good way to hook people in. Because I'm on an all in one deal, it'll be extra hassle to get out of it without breaks in other services, and or extra sneaky charges.
    ..................................................my first language is TYPO..............................................

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    Netherlands Avalon Member ExomatrixTV's Avatar
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    Default Re: The UK Smart-Meter battle

    Smart Meters Health Problems UK (20,273+ members!)


    See all (future comments) here





    Last edited by ExomatrixTV; 4th July 2020 at 10:44.
    ~no need2follow anyone only consider to broaden (y)our horizon of possibilities
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    Default Re: The UK Smart-Meter battle

    Quote Posted by ExomatrixTV (here)
    Smart Meters Health Problems UK (20,278+ members!)


    See all (future comments) here






    Oh waw John, that's amazing. Even more amazing is that I can see it because I don't have a facebook account !, I usually get clobbered with a signup page when I click a link to facebook.


    I've bookmarked it.
    ..................................................my first language is TYPO..............................................

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    Default Re: The UK Smart-Meter battle

    Hi Norman,
    I've been with Southern Electric for about 7 years for both gas and electricity. They have tried to make appointments to install a smart meter on three occasions.
    I told them on the last one about 12 months ago that if they asked me again I would change suppliers. They haven't bothered me since.

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    Default Re: The UK Smart-Meter battle

    Hi Norman,
    I've just switched to Avro in May. No pressure to install smart meter. Just need to log in to your account to provide a reading each month. Doing their dual fuel deal.

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    Avalon Member norman's Avatar
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    Default Re: The UK Smart-Meter battle

    Quote Posted by celticwarrior (here)
    Hi Norman,
    I've just switched to Avro in May. No pressure to install smart meter. Just need to log in to your account to provide a reading each month. Doing their dual fuel deal.

    Thank you for saying that. I'm almost ready to reach out to them, but I need to find a phone and broadband deal that I can switch to at the same time.
    ..................................................my first language is TYPO..............................................

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    Default Re: The UK Smart-Meter battle

    Here is a very informative comment I found over at stopsmartmeters.org.uk

    Quote Firstly – regarding who is driving/mandating this programme – in 2006, the EU’s Energy Efficiency Directive (Article 13) contained specific requirements for member states to encourage the use of smart meters so long as they are technically possible, financially reasonable and proportionate in relation to the potential energy savings. In 2009, the Electricity Directive and Natural Gas Directive added a requirement that 80% of consumers have smart meters by 2020, subject to a positive cost-benefit analysis for markets and consumers. None of these directives mandated the need for cancer-causing spyware which placed individual homes nor the entire domestic power supply of Britain at risk from cyber attack. The current UK Smart Meter vision is needlessly reckless and represents substantial over-reach of the directives they purportedly seek “compliance” with.

    Even with that said, though, the UK Government has stated very clearly that whilst all Energy suppliers will need to take “reasonable steps to install Smart Meters for all domestic and smaller non-domestic customers by 2019 [now 2020]” they “do not expect suppliers to seek an entry warrant simply to fit a smart meter and it will not be an offence for householders to refuse to accept a smart meter”. https://stopsmartmeters.org.uk/a-rem...-smart-meters/. The Secretary of State for Energy & Climate Change himself has confirmed this to us directly via the DECC website:

    “We believe smart meters will bring important benefits to consumers… However, there will not be a legal obligation on individuals to have one.”

    There is NO LAW obligating ANYONE to have a Smart Meter in their home. If you know of one, please tell us. If not, we would love to hear where you are you getting your information from and what steps you took to validate it. Have you kept a record of people you’ve advised on this?

    Regarding the Smart Meter being energy company’s property (Smart Meter) – whilst that may be true (it’s more likely to be financed), the placement of a device on someone’s home in order to meter usage does NOT come with a claim the householder’s property nor an inability for the householder to remove the device and replace it – the right to have your own meter installed (which one would pay for oneself) is provisioned through the Electricity and Gas Acts, as we discuss here https://stopsmartmeters.org.uk/a-rem...-smart-meters/. The energy provider can have their Smart Meter sent back to them in the post – no theft, no loss of property, no breach of the law.

    Regarding the “massive fine” your company faces for failing to violate people’s freedom of choice, breaching the law and blanketing the country with Smart Meters. Who, exactly, is threatening you with these enormous fines and just how “massive” are we talking about here? Please confirm this for us as this is VERY big news and we will be taking it up immediately with DECC, the regulator and our legal advisors.

    The end of analogue meters is also news to us – please can you provide a citation for this as it’s the first we’ve heard and may upset a few analogue meter manufacturers we know of.

    PS – Labour didn’t take us into Europe. Ted Heath did – the Tory PM at the time.

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    Default Re: The UK Smart-Meter battle

    Hello Everyone:
    I find this thread very interesting!
    Here in Alberta, Canada we had NO CHOICE for smart meters. You came home to them or you chose NO POWER. It was really that fast. Everyone has to have a smart meter here that I know of. I don't know anyone that doesn't have one.
    Do I like smart meters? NO
    Do I like to keep warm when it's 30-40 below? YES

    That's why there was no push back. The climate warrants you have some form of heat and without power your furnace won't run since the majority of furnaces in Alberta are gas for homes.

    There are some diesel furnaces but no that many.

    Have a great day!
    chancy

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    Avalon Member norman's Avatar
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    Default Re: The UK Smart-Meter battle

    Quote Posted by happyuk (here)
    Here is a very informative comment I found over at stopsmartmeters.org.uk

    Quote Firstly – regarding who is driving/mandating this programme – in 2006, the EU’s Energy Efficiency Directive (Article 13) contained specific requirements for member states to encourage the use of smart meters so long as they are technically possible, financially reasonable and proportionate in relation to the potential energy savings. In 2009, the Electricity Directive and Natural Gas Directive added a requirement that 80% of consumers have smart meters by 2020, subject to a positive cost-benefit analysis for markets and consumers. None of these directives mandated the need for cancer-causing spyware which placed individual homes nor the entire domestic power supply of Britain at risk from cyber attack. The current UK Smart Meter vision is needlessly reckless and represents substantial over-reach of the directives they purportedly seek “compliance” with.

    Even with that said, though, the UK Government has stated very clearly that whilst all Energy suppliers will need to take “reasonable steps to install Smart Meters for all domestic and smaller non-domestic customers by 2019 [now 2020]” they “do not expect suppliers to seek an entry warrant simply to fit a smart meter and it will not be an offence for householders to refuse to accept a smart meter”. https://stopsmartmeters.org.uk/a-rem...-smart-meters/. The Secretary of State for Energy & Climate Change himself has confirmed this to us directly via the DECC website:

    “We believe smart meters will bring important benefits to consumers… However, there will not be a legal obligation on individuals to have one.”

    There is NO LAW obligating ANYONE to have a Smart Meter in their home. If you know of one, please tell us. If not, we would love to hear where you are you getting your information from and what steps you took to validate it. Have you kept a record of people you’ve advised on this?

    Regarding the Smart Meter being energy company’s property (Smart Meter) – whilst that may be true (it’s more likely to be financed), the placement of a device on someone’s home in order to meter usage does NOT come with a claim the householder’s property nor an inability for the householder to remove the device and replace it – the right to have your own meter installed (which one would pay for oneself) is provisioned through the Electricity and Gas Acts, as we discuss here https://stopsmartmeters.org.uk/a-rem...-smart-meters/. The energy provider can have their Smart Meter sent back to them in the post – no theft, no loss of property, no breach of the law.

    Regarding the “massive fine” your company faces for failing to violate people’s freedom of choice, breaching the law and blanketing the country with Smart Meters. Who, exactly, is threatening you with these enormous fines and just how “massive” are we talking about here? Please confirm this for us as this is VERY big news and we will be taking it up immediately with DECC, the regulator and our legal advisors.

    The end of analogue meters is also news to us – please can you provide a citation for this as it’s the first we’ve heard and may upset a few analogue meter manufacturers we know of.

    PS – Labour didn’t take us into Europe. Ted Heath did – the Tory PM at the time.
    I'm relieved to know there is no law forcing me to have a smart meter (yet). The way my supplier is behaving, it might hit me with a charge for refusing to go along with their business plan. They already charge me £3.50 a month extra for paper billing.

    Another dirty trick is that they've nobbled their website making it impossible for me to enter my own readings over the internet. If this situation continues they might start playing silly games over my lack of readings. The local rep for the company has sold his house and disappeared. He was the meter reader who popped in about once year to check my readings were ok. They are probably very keen to have zero meter readers as soon as possible, if they have not already done that.

    I have a creepy feeling they are trying to drive me into a corner where I fall foul of something they can give me financial penalty for, e.g. no meter readings for over a year, or something. The contact section of their website is also flagging up an error. All in all, the signal is loud and clear. Time to dump them. Maybe that's what they want me to do anyway. They obviously have their new business plan ( and new livery ).
    ..................................................my first language is TYPO..............................................

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    Default Re: The UK Smart-Meter battle

    Quote Posted by norman (here)

    I'm relieved to know there is no law forcing me to have a smart meter (yet).
    Hey Norman,

    That's right, as others have attested here.

    There is no UK Law that states one must have a smart meter installed but most energy companies will try their damndest to do so. I've been receiving notifications of installation now for about three years. It hasn't happened, it ain't going to happen. Simple solution, ignore all notifications and all requests. What can they do? If they up the ante, you find another supplier and make sure you have in print the details of the new contract so that you can clearly indicate that the smart meter was an offer not an obligation. My guess is most energy companies will not wan't to lose a contract, it's a business after all.

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    Default Re: The UK Smart-Meter battle

    My perception is that these people use the same kind of strongly worded bullying letters that the TV licencing people use and the response tactic is to not lose sleep worrying about it but simply ignore or discard the letters.

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    Default Re: The UK Smart-Meter battle

    Quote Posted by Peter UK (here)


    My guess is most energy companies will not wan't to lose a contract, it's a business after all.


    My guess is that if the boardroom has decided their new business plan is full automation with data trading and no human meter readers, they'll do whatever they need to do to reform their customer base around that. In other words, get a smart meter or bugger off.

    I also suspect the entire retail energy business has a general plan to morph into data trading as its main business. As things stand, ALL industries are under competitive pressure to adopt the surveillance capitalism model. Even the car industry. The 'free market' isn't about the punters, it's about the shareholder market. The data harvesting element of a company is the new shareholder attraction.

    We must stop the whole technocratic takeover or we get run over by it. It's global, ideological and extremely militant.
    ..................................................my first language is TYPO..............................................

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    Default Re: The UK Smart-Meter battle

    Whoa, after 2 years of leaving me alone I'm really getting a heavy barrage to get a smart meter... I didn't get round to switching but I must look into Avro. Are Avro still not hassling any of you?

    I did see that OFGEM brought in an obligation for energy suppliers to maintain and test existing meters (this was what one of the attack hounds from British Gas told me), but I wonder how many are tested and are 'faulty'. All of them, I would imagine.

    (Edit to add - I looked at stopsmartmeters.org, but the site doesn't seem to have been updated for over a year. Very good info to be found there, though.)
    Last edited by Brigantia; 9th October 2020 at 10:34.

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