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Thread: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    Quote Posted by sllim11 (here)
    Quote Posted by DaveToo (here)
    Quote Posted by sllim11 (here)
    i haven't posted much... ever. however, i am starting to feel like so much of this is complete BS.
    and i really have no idea what is happening now. i mean were we all wrong about everything? simon parkes sudden in the know in the trenches with trump?!?! lin wood?? who the heck is he? seriously. i think i'm done with all this and am going to focus on going inward and only that. this world is too full of crazy making and mind f**king.

    i feel like we have been waiting forever. for something/someone. for what?

    it's not coming.
    it's not happening.
    it's not.

    we are super powerful beings and clearly "they" don't want us to know that... so turn turn turn again back inwards.
    at least, this it what and where i will be going.

    also, regarding the cv19... tests and vaccine. we are so powerful that if we truly believe in ourselves our bodies our higher consciousness as boundless awareness... IF we actually acknowledge and know this beyond anything else we do not need to fear the tests the vaccine...

    we need to move on from the FEAR. FEAR is the trap.

    MIND OVER MATTER. let go and trust life. i feel that is our only way out. to go in.again and again. just drop this sh*t show and live. move on to the most beautiful world we can manifest.
    Hi sliim, I agree with parts of what you are saying but not everything.
    Look within, for sure!

    Don't look/wait for TPTB to deliver solutions to you.

    However...

    Quote also, regarding the cv19... tests and vaccine. we are so powerful that if we truly believe in ourselves our bodies our higher consciousness as boundless awareness... IF we actually acknowledge and know this beyond anything else we do not need to fear the tests the vaccine...
    That can be taken two ways:

    1. We do not need to fear the tests and vaccine, so just chin up and take them!

    OR

    2. We do not need to fear the tests and vaccine, simply ignore them! Our bodies will do just fine without them.

    YES. it's not one or the other. it's both. the paradox of this world. take your pick.
    Ah come on.

    I deliberately chose not to ask you which one you were thinking because I was sure you would
    clarify on your own.

    Sitting on the fence, hmmmm.....

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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    Quote Posted by DaveToo (here)
    Quote Posted by sllim11 (here)
    Quote Posted by DaveToo (here)
    Quote Posted by sllim11 (here)
    i haven't posted much... ever. however, i am starting to feel like so much of this is complete BS.
    and i really have no idea what is happening now. i mean were we all wrong about everything? simon parkes sudden in the know in the trenches with trump?!?! lin wood?? who the heck is he? seriously. i think i'm done with all this and am going to focus on going inward and only that. this world is too full of crazy making and mind f**king.

    i feel like we have been waiting forever. for something/someone. for what?

    it's not coming.
    it's not happening.
    it's not.

    we are super powerful beings and clearly "they" don't want us to know that... so turn turn turn again back inwards.
    at least, this it what and where i will be going.

    also, regarding the cv19... tests and vaccine. we are so powerful that if we truly believe in ourselves our bodies our higher consciousness as boundless awareness... IF we actually acknowledge and know this beyond anything else we do not need to fear the tests the vaccine...

    we need to move on from the FEAR. FEAR is the trap.

    MIND OVER MATTER. let go and trust life. i feel that is our only way out. to go in.again and again. just drop this sh*t show and live. move on to the most beautiful world we can manifest.
    Hi sliim, I agree with parts of what you are saying but not everything.
    Look within, for sure!

    Don't look/wait for TPTB to deliver solutions to you.

    However...

    Quote also, regarding the cv19... tests and vaccine. we are so powerful that if we truly believe in ourselves our bodies our higher consciousness as boundless awareness... IF we actually acknowledge and know this beyond anything else we do not need to fear the tests the vaccine...
    That can be taken two ways:

    1. We do not need to fear the tests and vaccine, so just chin up and take them!

    OR

    2. We do not need to fear the tests and vaccine, simply ignore them! Our bodies will do just fine without them.

    YES. it's not one or the other. it's both. the paradox of this world. take your pick.
    Ah come on.

    I deliberately chose not to ask you which one you were thinking because I was sure you would
    clarify on your own.

    Sitting on the fence, hmmmm.....
    firstly, i would say there is no fence. ; )

    relatively , i do not want to get vaccine. if i cannot travel without it i would get it. because traveling nurtures me.

    absolutely , i am just watching it unfold and will decide when / if that moment comes.

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  5. Link to Post #23
    Aaland Avalon Member Agape's Avatar
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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    You’re quite correct in your observations there and disregard people who agree to read or watch “whatever” for so called entertainment sake.

    Some of us are quite disinclined to give a cent to anyone’s “entertainment channels”.

    The rest of people won’t get it right and we can’t hold it against them, actually. It’s their adolescence stage. It’s when every book, movie or a new ideology carries a message of inspiration. So many people are searching for themselves and the bigger message in the sands and rocks and in other curious humans.
    It could be there. We don’t know unless we study it for a while.

    It’s how new and old, core truth -sometimes so obvious- or straight lies - are sometimes too difficult to discern from a glance.

    Now to put the final nail to the coffin of “conspiracy theory”, none of the above material quoted are “pure predictions”. They’re not hitting their respective messengers from “blue sky” and only neophytes and game masters of society claim them to be a byproduct of naivety and human ignorance.

    In reality they do “belong” together to ideological trends that one has to encounter - or rather their proponents- to believe they’re “real” in this world otherwise it’s easy to fall under the impression they’re innocent theories spilled out to enlarge human awareness.

    These ideologies and their proponents exist in stark antagonism to each other perhaps but blending to colorful mandala of shared opinions at the same time.

    There is an Old World ideology that’s paradoxically the New World Order ideology as well with its powerful and amazing Spirits guarding it and there is nowhere we can really progress with it as a global community ,
    say further than to being trapped in perfect Cube. There is a horror movie or series of by that name. An allegory on AI.
    It’s not completely devoid of life but it’s a slowly aging decaying, stagnating world trying to prolong its life by stabilising its dynamics and resources.

    Paradoxically, its fear of losing its-self projects as power grip and strong hold. The strongest force around is still gravity. Therefor the “strong holds” and convictions of the power holders are based in materials and elementary grid of the planet,
    unless..it could be ..err..replaced for them by better ones.

    The same people look after ideologies the most , maintaining good scaled balance between “divide and conquer” and themselves and the crowd.


    They’re quite fearful of the crowd out there including their own children being unruly and progressive and optimistic, losing it for each other instead , losing it for Truth or Love of Life.
    The Old Morons “have seen it all” and always tried to “maintain the order”.

    Divide and conquer. Your country- my country. Your language - my language. Your territory - my plot. Anybody out there are inferior people to those Morons.

    If you’ve ever encountered their core protagonists you may be more surprised, rather shocked or disgusted how much they actually believe in the scenario forecasted by them, the scenario inevitable according their reasoning and order of things.

    They won’t care about human activity and climate issues etc. not because it’s unreal or non-existent but because it’s a waste of time and energy to address it , from larger perspective,
    weak people dying too is inevitable from nature’s perspective
    and prolonging little people lives is waste of resources at the best.

    According to them wars especially great wars are still worth the expenditure because they lead to fast results.

    The Planet is bound for major cataclysms according to these people, no matter what it takes and if we are on the edge, they will help it ( Murphy’s Law ).

    Human reproduction may come to be controlled and subjected to rules of “polished eugenics” tied to social demand for specific abilities and economic values.

    Theirs is the same old vision of Brave New World,

    numbered human society contained in zones.

    B&B 2020. Could be 4040. They “can wait”.

    They’ll be around for long yet perhaps till the last day ..with those moronic prophecies. There’s no “true prophecy” coming through it , no worries.

    It’s all based in hearsay and augmented ideology of old and outgoing Spirits of this Earth.

    It’s an empty ideology against the Power of Life and truth of our Origin and every original mind, thought and creature on the earth and beyond who are endowed with Life have right to fight or run from those morons who would -even metaphorically- eat their children to “save them” from the future they’ve “forecasted”, no, the plan they’re creating is a plan they’re loyal to.

    It has countless versions but it’s still the same old plot.


    So I say, unless you have to, don’t give it a dime


    🍵
    Last edited by Agape; 21st January 2021 at 08:15.

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  7. Link to Post #24
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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    Quote Posted by sllim11 (here)
    Quote Posted by DaveToo (here)

    That can be taken two ways:

    1. We do not need to fear the tests and vaccine, so just chin up and take them!

    OR

    2. We do not need to fear the tests and vaccine, simply ignore them! Our bodies will do just fine without them.

    YES. it's not one or the other. it's both. the paradox of this world. take your pick.
    Quote Ah come on.

    I deliberately chose not to ask you which one you were thinking because I was sure you would
    clarify on your own.

    Sitting on the fence, hmmmm.....
    Quote firstly, i would say there is no fence. ; )

    relatively , i do not want to get vaccine. if i cannot travel without it i would get it. because traveling nurtures me.

    absolutely , i am just watching it unfold and will decide when / if that moment comes.
    OK thanks!
    This makes more sense now.
    Thanks for clarifying.

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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    We could easily make the title of the thread say "mainstream" instead of "alternative", and the points made in the OP would still apply.

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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    Quote Posted by sllim11 (here)
    i do not want to get vaccine. if i cannot travel without it i would get it. because traveling nurtures me.
    Maybe wait for a traditional vaccine to come out, rather than the mRNA ones.
    And don't be deterred by the fact that in 50 years there's not been a successful coronavirus vaccine :-)

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  12. Link to Post #27
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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    Quote Posted by 42 (here)
    Since the inception of Camelot and right up to today, Bill has done more than perhaps anyone on the planet to present alternative content and in-depth interviews that have been paradigm changing to say the least. From day one his (and Kerry's) work has challenged many of us to consider extraordinary information. Much of that work is valid today. Discernment has always been a tricky and personal aspect of what and who to believe. Here's a list of Camelot interviews. I've watched them all and considered the content through my own personal BS filter. On reflection a "where are they now?" thread would obviously expose a significant number of the interviewees as snake oil merchants. Some of the names are still in good standing, many of them have been thoroughly discredited by time and exposure.

    But at least it gave us all food for thought. Thanks Bill.

    The Anglo-Saxon Mission - Bill Ryan
    Aaron McCollum
    Bill Ryan interviewed by Freedom Central
    Klaus Dona
    Dane Tops
    Gabriele Stähler on Vitamin D3
    Camelot live in Amsterdam
    Camelot Conference in LA - Cynthia Crawford
    Camelot Conference in LA - Dr Alfred Webre
    Camelot Conference in LA - Marcia Schafer
    Camelot Conference in LA - Miriam Delicado
    Jordan Maxwell
    Dr Paul LaViolette
    Patrick Geryl
    Camelot Conference in LA - David Wilcock
    Camelot Conference in LA - Bob Dean
    Camelot Conference in LA - Richard Dolan
    Camelot Conference in LA - Duncan O'Finioan
    Camelot Conference in LA - Jordan Maxwell
    Camelot Conference in LA - Alex Collier
    Jane Bürgermeister
    Futuretalk 5: Bob Dean, Henry Deacon, Alfred Webre
    Dr Pete Peterson Part 1
    Dr Pete Peterson Part 2
    Dr Pete Peterson Part 3

    Miriam Delicado - a Message
    Dr Len Horowitz
    Bill Ryan and Kerry Cassidy
    Zurich Conference - Dan Burisch/Marci McDowell
    Zurich Conference - Brian O'Leary/Henry Deacon
    Zurich Conference - Bill Ryan
    Barcelona Conference Panel Discussion Part 1
    Barcelona Conference Panel Discussion Part 2
    Dr Steven Greer
    Rafael Palacios interviews Henry Deacon
    Bob Dean at the Exopolitics Summit, Barcelona
    Bob Dean at the Press Conference, Barcelona
    Erich von Däniken
    Henry Deacon at the Zurich Conference
    Joseph Farrell
    Wade Frazier
    Elizabeth Nelson - Flight 93
    Jim Marrs
    David Icke
    Camelot Live at Vilcabamba
    Peter Levenda
    Brian O'Leary
    Ricardo Silva
    Jim Humble
    Jessica: Crystal Child
    Valery Uvarov Part 1
    Valery Uvarov Part 2

    Marcia Schafer
    James of WingMakers
    Dr Bill Deagle Part 1
    Dr Bill Deagle Part 2
    Dr Bill Deagle Part 3
    Bob Dean: The Coming of Nibiru
    The Mitchell-Hedges Crystal Skull
    Miriam Delicado
    Henry Deacon (Futuretalk 3)
    Jim Sparks and Bill Holden
    John Lear Tells All Part 1
    John Lear Tells All Part 2
    John Lear Tells All Part 3
    John Lear Tells All Part 4
    George Green Part 1
    George Green Part 2
    David Wilcock (Futuretalk 1)
    Leo Zagami Part 1
    Leo Zagami Part 2
    Leo Zagami Part 3

    Luca Scantamburlo Part 1
    Luca Scantamburlo Part 2
    Benjamin Fulford Part 1
    Benjamin Fulford Part 2
    Benjamin Fulford Part 3

    Boriska
    Richard Hoagland Part 1
    Richard Hoagland Part 2
    Richard Hoagland Part 3
    David Wilcock (Jumproom to Mars)
    Dan Sherman
    Bob Dean Part 1
    Bob Dean Part 2
    Bob Dean Part 3 (with Marcia Schafer)
    Bill Holden
    Jim Sparks
    Dan Burisch (Stargate Secrets) Part 1
    Dan Burisch (Stargate Secrets) Part 2
    David Wilcock Part 1
    David Wilcock Part 2
    David Wilcock Part 3
    David Wilcock Part 4

    Duncan O'Finioan and David Corso
    Sgt. Clifford Stone
    Gordon Novel
    Michael St. Clair
    Michael St. Clair -- Futuretalk Part 1
    Michael St. Clair --Futuretalk Part 2

    Duncan O'Finioan
    Ralph Ring
    Henry Deacon
    John Lear
    Dan Burisch Part 1
    Dan Burisch Part 2
    Dan Burisch Part 3
    Gary McKinnon
    Bill Hamilton
    'Mr. X', ET archivist
    Marking in red the interviews I personally think can be disregarded. All the others are good, and a few are pretty important. (And I'm not really interested in anyone else's opinion! I know what I know.)
    Hi Bill
    It's a big list - which ones do you think are "pretty important"?

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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    Quote Posted by Violet3 (here)
    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    Quote Posted by 42 (here)
    Since the inception of Camelot and right up to today, Bill has done more than perhaps anyone on the planet to present alternative content and in-depth interviews that have been paradigm changing to say the least. From day one his (and Kerry's) work has challenged many of us to consider extraordinary information. Much of that work is valid today. Discernment has always been a tricky and personal aspect of what and who to believe. Here's a list of Camelot interviews. I've watched them all and considered the content through my own personal BS filter. On reflection a "where are they now?" thread would obviously expose a significant number of the interviewees as snake oil merchants. Some of the names are still in good standing, many of them have been thoroughly discredited by time and exposure.

    But at least it gave us all food for thought. Thanks Bill.

    The Anglo-Saxon Mission - Bill Ryan
    Aaron McCollum
    Bill Ryan interviewed by Freedom Central
    Klaus Dona
    Dane Tops
    Gabriele Stähler on Vitamin D3
    Camelot live in Amsterdam
    Camelot Conference in LA - Cynthia Crawford
    Camelot Conference in LA - Dr Alfred Webre
    Camelot Conference in LA - Marcia Schafer
    Camelot Conference in LA - Miriam Delicado
    Jordan Maxwell
    Dr Paul LaViolette
    Patrick Geryl
    Camelot Conference in LA - David Wilcock
    Camelot Conference in LA - Bob Dean
    Camelot Conference in LA - Richard Dolan
    Camelot Conference in LA - Duncan O'Finioan
    Camelot Conference in LA - Jordan Maxwell
    Camelot Conference in LA - Alex Collier
    Jane Bürgermeister
    Futuretalk 5: Bob Dean, Henry Deacon, Alfred Webre
    Dr Pete Peterson Part 1
    Dr Pete Peterson Part 2
    Dr Pete Peterson Part 3

    Miriam Delicado - a Message
    Dr Len Horowitz
    Bill Ryan and Kerry Cassidy
    Zurich Conference - Dan Burisch/Marci McDowell
    Zurich Conference - Brian O'Leary/Henry Deacon
    Zurich Conference - Bill Ryan
    Barcelona Conference Panel Discussion Part 1
    Barcelona Conference Panel Discussion Part 2
    Dr Steven Greer
    Rafael Palacios interviews Henry Deacon
    Bob Dean at the Exopolitics Summit, Barcelona
    Bob Dean at the Press Conference, Barcelona
    Erich von Däniken
    Henry Deacon at the Zurich Conference
    Joseph Farrell
    Wade Frazier
    Elizabeth Nelson - Flight 93
    Jim Marrs
    David Icke
    Camelot Live at Vilcabamba
    Peter Levenda
    Brian O'Leary
    Ricardo Silva
    Jim Humble
    Jessica: Crystal Child
    Valery Uvarov Part 1
    Valery Uvarov Part 2

    Marcia Schafer
    James of WingMakers
    Dr Bill Deagle Part 1
    Dr Bill Deagle Part 2
    Dr Bill Deagle Part 3
    Bob Dean: The Coming of Nibiru
    The Mitchell-Hedges Crystal Skull
    Miriam Delicado
    Henry Deacon (Futuretalk 3)
    Jim Sparks and Bill Holden
    John Lear Tells All Part 1
    John Lear Tells All Part 2
    John Lear Tells All Part 3
    John Lear Tells All Part 4
    George Green Part 1
    George Green Part 2
    David Wilcock (Futuretalk 1)
    Leo Zagami Part 1
    Leo Zagami Part 2
    Leo Zagami Part 3

    Luca Scantamburlo Part 1
    Luca Scantamburlo Part 2
    Benjamin Fulford Part 1
    Benjamin Fulford Part 2
    Benjamin Fulford Part 3

    Boriska
    Richard Hoagland Part 1
    Richard Hoagland Part 2
    Richard Hoagland Part 3
    David Wilcock (Jumproom to Mars)
    Dan Sherman
    Bob Dean Part 1
    Bob Dean Part 2
    Bob Dean Part 3 (with Marcia Schafer)
    Bill Holden
    Jim Sparks
    Dan Burisch (Stargate Secrets) Part 1
    Dan Burisch (Stargate Secrets) Part 2
    David Wilcock Part 1
    David Wilcock Part 2
    David Wilcock Part 3
    David Wilcock Part 4

    Duncan O'Finioan and David Corso
    Sgt. Clifford Stone
    Gordon Novel
    Michael St. Clair
    Michael St. Clair -- Futuretalk Part 1
    Michael St. Clair --Futuretalk Part 2

    Duncan O'Finioan
    Ralph Ring
    Henry Deacon
    John Lear
    Dan Burisch Part 1
    Dan Burisch Part 2
    Dan Burisch Part 3
    Gary McKinnon
    Bill Hamilton
    'Mr. X', ET archivist
    Marking in red the interviews I personally think can be disregarded. All the others are good, and a few are pretty important. (And I'm not really interested in anyone else's opinion! I know what I know.)
    Hi Bill
    It's a big list - which ones do you think are "pretty important"?
    I'm pretty sure most of them are to a certain extent besides the ones in red obviously.

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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    Quote Posted by PurpleLama (here)
    We could easily make the title of the thread say "mainstream" instead of "alternative", and the points made in the OP would still apply.
    Very true! And again, Avalon has no problem calling out bull**** on the mainstream media. Why is calling out bull**** in the alternatie media met with so much resistance?

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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    We are living in a war of information. With the Intel that comes from various sources, there will often be disinfo embedded. Sometimes as a means to deliberately derail people from the truth, sometimes as a strategy for a plan to be successful, and sometimes as a way to have plausible deniability for the safety of the whistleblower (or the people who get the info).

    It is impossible in this war to know the whole truth, or to be objective. And then there is the question, does objective reality really exist? In order for us to function, we need to make decisions for what we choose is our explanation for things. And these decisions are never perfect.

    You can state as a fact that 1 + 1 = 2, you might think right?

    So you get a male and a female together, and 9 months later you have 3. So 1 + 1 = 3.

    Or you have 2 drops of water and you put them together, and you end up with 1. So 1 + 1 = 1

    There goes objectivity.

    Most of the time we decide that 1 + 1 = 2, because that works in most situations.

    So you get Intel, in code, then some people interpret it and make predictions. Some, or sometimes most predictions turn out not to come true. Was the Intel wrong? Was the interpreter wrong? Or did things change in the mean time? Who can say for sure?

    It is easy to start a topic like this after the fact, it is not so easy to stick your nose out there and make some seemingly outrageous predictions with the risk of being wrong.

    Mike Adams is mentioned as an example. Mike Adams continuously assesses the situation based on the current info and situation. If you listen to his podcast his assessment changes by the day, because he is also in the dark, trying to find the truth in a sea of info and disinfo. To label him as unreliable because he was wrong with certain assessments is not a sign of true discernment. It is like throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    Quote Posted by BoR (here)
    We are living in a war of information. With the Intel that comes from various sources, there will often be disinfo embedded. Sometimes as a means to deliberately derail people from the truth, sometimes as a strategy for a plan to be successful, and sometimes as a way to have plausible deniability for the safety of the whistleblower (or the people who get the info).

    It is impossible in this war to know the whole truth, or to be objective. And then there is the question, does objective reality really exist? In order for us to function, we need to make decisions for what we choose is our explanation for things. And these decisions are never perfect.

    You can state as a fact that 1 + 1 = 2, you might think right?

    So you get a male and a female together, and 9 months later you have 3. So 1 + 1 = 3.

    Or you have 2 drops of water and you put them together, and you end up with 1. So 1 + 1 = 1

    There goes objectivity.

    Most of the time we decide that 1 + 1 = 2, because that works in most situations.
    I agree with the sentiment of there not being an objective truth, even if, as a math enthusiast, I have some problems with the examples given

    But the absence of an objective truth is no excuse for throwing all discernment out of the window. If I tell you, tomorrow a nuclear bomb will detonate in Paris, and it doesn't happen, there is no way I can say "you interprreted what I said wrong". There's a reason fake psychics always make very general predictions that can be interpreted many ways (example: "something good will happen in March"). Yet, many of the predictions that have been made on my list in the original post, are very specific and not up for any other interpretation. When the article youtube video says "we will have martial law tomorrow, the president will use the emergency broadcast system and communications will be down for 10 days", and here we are talking on this forum the next day, I'd say the prediction was wrong. I don't think you would disagree.

    Quote So you get Intel, in code, then some people interpret it and make predictions. Some, or sometimes most predictions turn out not to come true. Was the Intel wrong? Was the interpreter wrong? Or did things change in the mean time? Who can say for sure?
    My point is it doesn't matter which it is. We should stop listening to people who are wrong almost every time. Whether or not they 'mean well' is irrelevant.

    I'm not talking about cancelling these people. I'm not saying they should be hung. They can do whatever they want, but it's up to us to say "Your info has proven to be not credible, so I will not listen to you anymore".

    Quote It is easy to start a topic like this after the fact, it is not so easy to stick your nose out there and make some seemingly outrageous predictions with the risk of being wrong.
    You would think... As far as I can tell, it's actually quite easy to make predictions, be wrong every time, and still keep those 200.000 followers on Youtube. Apparently it doesn't matter if the info you give never comes true. And that is what surprises me.

    Quote Mike Adams is mentioned as an example. Mike Adams continuously assesses the situation based on the current info and situation. If you listen to his podcast his assessment changes by the day, because he is also in the dark, trying to find the truth in a sea of info and disinfo. To label him as unreliable because he was wrong with certain assessments is not a sign of true discernment. It is like throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
    I agree that Mike Adams is probably the best one out of the bunch I mentioned. And maybe I should not have thrown him in with the likes of Simon Parkes. My point still stands for many other sources out there. Simon Parkes' videos are still being shared on all of the threads. Whenever someone points out that the info he gave yesterday did not come true, they are either ignored, or accused for derailing the thread for pointing that out.

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    Netherlands Avalon Member Deneon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    I want to thank everyone for the contributions so far.

    Many of the posts that argue my point in the opening post are going in either two ways
    - But the mainstream media is unreliable too!
    - It's only normal with the abundance of information out there, that there is bad info as well

    Both points I agree with completely. These are not things I am disputing.

    What I'm asking is this: Why don't we hold the alternative media sources to the same standard as the mainstream media? Why don't we approach the stories in the alternative media with the same skepticism, ESPECIALLY after they have proven to be wrong on so many occasions? And why is anyone who DOES question stories the alternative media being accused of being negative, or derailing threads, or worse?

    You don't HAVE to believe either everything or nothing in either of those communities. Both can be right sometimes, and both can be wrong. And I'm saying is that we should not default to "MSM bad, alternative media good".

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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    Quote Posted by Deneon (here)
    I want to thank everyone for the contributions so far.

    Many of the posts that argue my point in the opening post are going in either two ways
    - But the mainstream media is unreliable too!
    - It's only normal with the abundance of information out there, that there is bad info as well

    Both points I agree with completely. These are not things I am disputing.

    What I'm asking is this: Why don't we hold the alternative media sources to the same standard as the mainstream media? Why don't we approach the stories in the alternative media with the same skepticism, ESPECIALLY after they have proven to be wrong on so many occasions? And why is anyone who DOES question stories the alternative media being accused of being negative, or derailing threads, or worse?

    You don't HAVE to believe either everything or nothing in either of those communities. Both can be right sometimes, and both can be wrong. And I'm saying is that we should not default to "MSM bad, alternative media good".
    Hi Deneon,

    To your first response to me I can make counterarguments to some of your sentences, but I choose to leave that up to others, if they feel the need. But maybe I will later when I have more time.

    To this response I say that I don't believe there are people here that think MSM bad, alternative media good. That is a simplification. But I do agree with you that you don't have to believe either everything or nothing.

    However, MSM is talking in much more unity about their approach to reality, because they are owned by the same families/corporations/power structure. There is such a thing as THE MSM. But there is no such thing as THE alternative media. They consist mostly of private individuals with a mission, where only some of them have made a living out of it. So you can not compare the two as being the same. When you approach an alternative source you must keep in mind that a lot of the info might be flawed, but most of the time (But not always), especially with people who do it from their basement, there is no intent to deliberately fool people. Whereas for MSM that is, in my estimation, too many times the case.

    However, I totally agree that people should question everything. This is what I do: if something makes sense to me, I can choose to accept the hypothesis. But at the same time I hold in my mind that it can easily be untrue or partially true as well. If in the end my choice to accept it turns out to be wrong, instead of feeling disappointed or feeling bad about my 'mistake' I have the feeling I know more now than yesterday and therefore today my assessment of the situation has become more clear.. I can do that because all the time I was holding two or three opposite thoughts in my mind, while choosing 1 outcome as the most likely. By doing this you will always be aware of signs of misinformation, and never get the feeling you invested time in something that wasn't worth it.

    For example, I was always very skeptical about mass arrests. I never said to myself that it was out of the question, I just didn't choose to see it as a likely outcome. But over time I saw more info that was pointing towards that direction, until I decided that it might very well happen. Might still, but not unlikely anymore. It didn't, at least not now, and I do not feel the need to call all these people who said it would happen untrustworthy. Because I knew they could not know for sure either. I was really enjoying the exitement and the feeling that Magic could happen and that was worth my focus and time. And no disappointment in the end, because I have seen things change in my lifetime, for the better, that I never thought possible or likely.

    But I agree if you go along with alternative viewpoints all the way, then you have a high chance of feeling screwed in the end. 🙂
    Last edited by BoR; 22nd January 2021 at 11:21.

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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    By the way, 1 + 1 = 2 indeed always works in the field of mathematics 😄, if this rule had exceptions in pure mathematics. you as a mathematician would have an enormous problem on your hands..😁

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    Avalon Member Merkaba360's Avatar
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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    Let's take Alex Jones for example. He has been quite spot on many times. He also is a sensationalist and talks constantly. lol Anyone who talks that much is bound to be wrong a fair amount.

    What do we do about this guy? My friend says that he is a shill. I don't know, I tend to think he just has many people feeding him info and hard to sort out the truth of the rumors.

    If he is "on the payroll", Alex is like the greatest actor of ALL time. lol Seriously, who the hell can spaz out for 27 years as an act. Who has that kind of acting stamina. I guess its possible, but Jesus that would blow my mind. IT would mean he is an actor that hardly ever even takes a week off for vacation and his health looks to be suffering from it as well.

    We are often throwing out ALL possibilities and might seem to be taking a side because we lean toward that view. But many of us are not dumb enough to get sucked in fully. I agree that anyone who is really hard nosed about their speculative belief needs to check themself

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  26. Link to Post #36
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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    Quote Posted by Deneon (here)
    Quote Posted by PurpleLama (here)
    We could easily make the title of the thread say "mainstream" instead of "alternative", and the points made in the OP would still apply.
    Very true! And again, Avalon has no problem calling out bull**** on the mainstream media. Why is calling out bull**** in the alternatie media met with so much resistance?
    Re: the bolded portion. I recommend doing a lot more reading on the forum. In my recollection, there has been about as much criticism of alt. media information as there has been wholesale acceptance or advertisement of it, with a huge gray area of research and speculation in between. Of course, there are members who will post about every crazy thing that will come across the 'net, and just as many members who are entirely skeptical of such.

    The majority of the board is in between, and will present themselves as open minded and willing to investigate a matter wherever such will lead, whether the end indicates the idea was true or false.

    Using the recent election as an example, as your sudden involvement in that discussion preceded this thread, there are so many people online who have presented evidence of fraud, and while the powers that be have had their desired outcome, it happened in spite of what people saw, often with their own eyes, of fraud and other questionable activities.

    You were quick to call BS on the examination of these details, but how many hearings did you watch or listen to, how many testimonies did you read? While the MSM derided the whole thing with claims of "no evidence" the truth was much closer to "evidence abounds". Don't fall into the temptation of labeling me a Trump loving Qanon, because honestly I am just willing to look, and the claim of "no evidence" is the one that falls flat.

    I gave the topic due diligence, did you?

    Are you just going along with popular opinion? Are you using the actions of Lin Wood, who was pushed to the forefront of the public face of Trumps legal team only to start taking his public stance into unbelievable territory (as for mainstream consumption) which nonetheless may very well be true?

    I believe that if you took a few steps back, and the whole election topic aside, if you tried to go back through the board (11 years worth is a lot, I don't mean all of it!) with a fresh and honest look, you might find that your treatment of PA in your OP may be a little unfair.

    We are a pretty diverse group. While some members may fit your description, others are the opposite, and most would defy either categorization.

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    UK Avalon Founder Bill Ryan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    Quote Posted by Deneon (here)
    Avalon has no problem calling out bull**** on the mainstream media. Why is calling out bull**** in the alternatie media met with so much resistance?
    Actually, I think Avalon does pretty well at calling out or questioning alt media BS, or its possibility.

    We have a whole Known Hoaxes and Other Bad Information section, where posts and threads are retained (not censored), but tagged with a caveat.

    On quite a large number of other threads and posts, fairly prominent alt media figures or influencers such as Robert David Steele, David Wilcock, Simon Parkes, Charlie Ward, Pete Peterson, Gorey Goode, Emery Smith, Michael Salla, Laura Eisenhower, Sorcha Faal, Gosia Duszak, Jordan Sather, Steven Greer, Sean David Morton, Jordan Maxwell, Alfred Webre, Kim Goguen, Kerry Cassidy, Mark Richards, Kevin Moore, Jim Fetzer, Gordon Duff, all of TTSA and even Alex Jones and Steve Pieczenik (plus many others!) have been called out and/or criticized, as has Qanon as well.

    That kind of discussion really is alive and healthy here — as it should be. But often it's not all in one easy-to-find place, of course.

    On post #12 on this thread), I flagged the Project Camelot interviews which I feel should be disregarded. Not many, but definitely some. That counts, as well. I don't think there's any kind of critiquing problem here.
    Last edited by Bill Ryan; 22nd January 2021 at 21:48.

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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    Quote Posted by Deneon (here)
    That being said. at what point can we safely conclude that the likes of Qanons, Lin Wood, Simon Parkes, Charlie Ward, Mike Adams, 100s of twitter users, and websites like beforeitsnews.com and countless others spreading similar stories are not, or at the very least, no longer trustworthy?

    And at what point is anyone still trusting these sources and sharing their fantasies any better than someone trusting and sharing stuff from CNN?

    At what point does someone blindly sharing these stories become part of the problem, instead of part of the solution?

    And most importantly: When can we have this discussion on this forum, without being personally attacked and be called a shill, a low information citizen, an antifa agent, a sleeper account or worse?
    Lot's of good questions. I don't hold alternative media to quite the same standard as MSM, because I know they won't have the same resources or access to information. I do expect them to try and make the most of what they should have though, their independence.

    For myself I distinguish somewhat between participating in a thread and starting one. If I see something relevant to an ongoing discussion I may post with a small amount of context, but if I'm asking for attention for something new, its incumbent on me to start things off in the right way.

    I also share stuff which I think is of interest, not that I necessarily believe it to be true. I've seen people say 'this resonated' and I think that's a good way of indicating that whilst one cannot fully endorse it, it feels like there's some value to be had there.

    So to take the current, frenzied situation as an example. I treat the ongoing threads about the election or the Q posts as places where I can post something without fully endorsing it or knowing it's completely legit. How could I?


    Quote One of the moderators mentioned in another thread that she feared for the forum for the reasons I describe above (which again, was met by ridicule). I want to say: there have been many times where I decided not to post something because I was basically told to f off in the past. I'm sure others that are critical of the behaviour I outlined above see these attacks and decide against posting. It's either that or this part of the forum has really become an echo chamber.

    One example of this is the meme at the bottom of this post. I saw the meme posted on Reddit a couple days ago and thought it was funny. I contemplated posting it in the Memes thread, but ultimately I decided against it (untill now I guess). Now this is obviously just for fun, but the same thing happened with 'serious' posts.

    I would expect Avalon to be a place where we can have a discussion about all this, without any personal attacks. I guess we'll find out.
    People have become very invested over time and with that comes emotional involvement and a drawing up of the wagons. I think online communities have a shared responsibility to protect civil discourse and that involves a certain amount of looking at oneself, recognising when one is allowing emotion to get the better of them and pulling back. Not always easy, especially when the stakes seem to be so high. We are all victims of a year of unique stresses, from the impacts of lockdowns to the machinations of the people who are pulling the strings. Sometimes I think those are the forces which are really driving some of the disputes I see here and elsewhere...

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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    Developing intuition and what happens when we don't
    See: https://projectavalon.net/forum4/sho...=1#post1406065
    and
    Facing Shadow in Society & Disclosure https://projectavalon.net/forum4/sho...=1#post1406073
    Last edited by onawah; 22nd January 2021 at 20:47.
    Each breath a gift...
    _____________

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    United States Moderator Chris Gilbert's Avatar
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    Default Re: Discussion on the reliability of alternative media sources and personas

    As I see it, alternative media is best when it critiques MSM narratives, along with the MSM's slimy arrogance of pretending to be non-biased when it clearly isn't. However, when alternative outlets try to construct a wholly new explanation of events and reality, they tend to fail..epically. Much of that is due to the aforementioned lack of resources and funding compared to the MSM leading to wild speculation in order to fill in the gaps.

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