WW3? Ukraine/US vs. Donbass/Russia

[Ravenlocke]

Ukraine central bank governor resigns in a Facebook post.

https://twitter.com/zerohedge/status...32862076043266

https://twitter.com/AZmilitary1/stat...41523477381121

[Ravenlocke]

https://www.rt.com/russia/564034-pes...elensky-talks/

Kremlin reacts to Zelensky banning talks with Putin

To resume peace talks with Kiev, Moscow will wait for either a change of stance by the current Ukrainian president or for a new leader, Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov has said. This comes after President Zelensky signed a decree ruling out negotiations with Russian President Vladimir Putin.

Even before the launch of Russia’s military operation in Ukraine in late February, Moscow “was the supporter of the idea of achieving the terms put forward by the Russian side through diplomatic means,” Peskov told journalists on Tuesday.

Russia is still ready to look for a negotiated solution to the conflict between the neighbors, according to the spokesman. But “it takes two parties to negotiate,” he noted.

“We’ll now be waiting for the current president to change his stance or for the arrival of the future president of Ukraine, who would change his position in the interests of the Ukrainian people,” Peskov said.

On Tuesday, Zelensky signed a decree on Ukraine officially rejecting peace talks with Putin. It rubber stamped decisions made by Ukraine’s National Security and Defense Council, on Friday, just hours after Putin signed agreements on Donetsk and Lugansk People’s Republics and Kherson and Zaporozhye Regions joining Russia.

Zelensky pledges never to talk to Putin
Zelensky pledges never to talk to Putin
One of the resolutions was: “stating the impossibility of conducting negotiations with Russia’s President Vladimir Putin.”

Zelensky recorded a video address after the meeting claiming that “we [Ukraine] are ready for dialogue with Russia, but with another president of Russia.”

In his speech on Friday, Putin called upon Ukraine to “cease all hostilities, stop the war it started back in 2014 and return to the negotiating table.”

However, he made it clear that the decision to unite with Russia, which the people of Donbass, Kherson and Zaporozhye Regions made during referendums, was not up for discussion. Kiev should treat the “free choice” of the four territories “with respect,” Putin said, adding that it was “the only way for peace.”

Moscow and Kiev have not sat down at the negotiating table since talks in Istanbul finished in late March. The Russian side, which initially expressed optimism on the peace process, later accused Ukraine of backtracking on all the progress achieved in Türkiye, saying it had lost trust in Kiev’s negotiators.

In recent months, Ukraine has been either putting forward terms that Moscow deemed ‘unrealistic’ for the resumption of talks, or said that they can only begin after Russia is defeated on the battlefield.

READ MORE: Putin calls on Ukraine to return to negotiations
Since the conflict began Zelensky has on several occasions proposed meeting with Putin face-to-face, in order to find a way to end hostilities. But Moscow insisted that the two leaders should only get together to sign concrete agreements already prepared for them by the negotiating teams.

[Ravenlocke]

https://www.rt.com/business/563964-n...ussia-economy/


Ports, mines, agriculture: What can new regions give Russia’s economy?


On Monday, Russia's State Duma ratified the treaties on the accession of the Donetsk and Lugansk People’s Republics (DPR and LPR), as well as Kherson and Zaporozhye Regions, to the Russian Federation. The territories overwhelmingly voted to join the country in referendums in September.

Economists say the restoration of the conflict-ravaged territories will take huge investment, noting, however, that the returns may be even greater. RT looks at the economic cost as well as the benefits of integrating the territories into Russia.

What are the new regions?
The total area of Donbass, Kherson and Zaporozhye is almost 109,000 square kilometers (42,085 square miles,) or over 15% of Ukraine’s former total area. More than eight million people previously lived in the territories, which have more than 5.6 million hectares of arable land. Moscow has yet to determine the future borders of Kherson and Zaporozhye, parts of which are still controlled by Ukrainian troops.
What are the drivers of the Donbass economy?
Donbass with its coal-based economy was Ukraine's industrial heartland. The DPR accounted for 20% of the country’s industrial production as far as 2014. The mineral-rich region has the fourth-largest coal field in Europe, with its extractable reserves estimated at over 10 billion tons. As of February, 115 coal mines were operating in Donbass, producing around 70 million tons of raw material per year. Eight power plants are also located in the Donetsk region.

The LPR is an important transport hub and is known for its metallurgy, machinery and agricultural industries. It also has chemical and pharmaceutical plants and several coal mines. A number of important transit highways pass through the republic. Authorities in LPR say its agricultural potential is great, with a focus on the cultivation of grain.
Why is Zaporozhye important?
Zaporozhye Region was the center of energy supply in Ukraine, with its three powerful energy producers: the Zaporozhye nuclear power plant, the largest nuclear facility in Europe, the Dnepr Hydroelectric Station and the Botievo wind farm. In 2019–2020, Zaporozhye produced about 40 billion kWh of electricity per year, which is approximately 25–27% of the entire energy sector in Ukraine. The region has a number of large industrial and mechanical engineering facilities, including the Zaporozhye Automobile Building Plant (ZAZ) with an output of 150,000 vehicles a year. The Dnieper River, the Kakhovka Reservoir and the Sea of Azov play a significant role in Zaporozhye’s economy, which also has great potential for industrial fish farming.
What’s the significance of Kherson?
Kherson Region specializes in shipbuilding and is known for its resorts and agriculture. It had the largest territory of arable land in Ukraine, at almost 20,000 square kilometers. The region produces cereals, sunflowers and vegetables. The fertile land allows two or sometimes even three harvests a season. Other traditional industries there are cattle breeding and winemaking. There are plans to develop a resort and tourist cluster on the territory, which has access to both the Azov and Black Sea.

What challenges does Russia face?
Russia obtained land with incredible agricultural and industrial potential, but with highly degraded infrastructure, due to a lack of investment from Kiev over the past 30 years. The government’s primary concern is to integrate those territories and help them overcome the economic development gap, and to recover from the destruction inflicted by the conflict. Initially, Moscow will finance the budgets of the four regions. In the future as integration deepens and the economy is restarted, the volume of transfers from the federal budget will decrease, experts say.

How could Donbass, Zaporozhye, and Kherson contribute to the Russian economy?
The territories have an extremely advantageous geographical location. They offer vast opportunities due to the presence of ports and maritime routes with the south of Russia. Access to the key port of Mariupol in the Azov Sea means a potential increase of coal and other supplies to Africa and South Asian countries. The regions can contribute to both ensuring the nation’s food security and to increased export supplies to ‘friendly’ states. Experts estimate the potential contribution to the Russian economy could be worth trillions of rubles or even more.

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https://twitter.com/LogKa11/status/1577349664420102145

[Ravenlocke]

https://twitter.com/AZmilitary1/stat...33912920961024

[Ravenlocke]

https://twitter.com/AZmilitary1/stat...61445825691648

[Ravenlocke]

https://twitter.com/jaccocharite/sta...61451282362369

https://twitter.com/jaccocharite/sta...17660395622400

https://twitter.com/jaccocharite/sta...17669182664705

https://twitter.com/Sprinter99880/st...22500173742081

https://twitter.com/Sprinter99880/st...52557931921410

[Ravenlocke]

https://twitter.com/Sprinter99880/st...48930211577857

[Justplain]

Posted by Mashika (here)

Posted by Justplain (here)
For those of you koolaid drinkers who think that the Ukrainian forces are the only ones targetting non-military targets, here's a video of mariupol:

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=5DWbMoyIVRo

Propaganda by the west you say. Here's grozni from the Chechnya wars:

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=bXmFaFS1etw

https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFoota...grozny_during/

https://www.rferl.org/a/checnhnya-gr.../26733810.html

Oh no... lmao! "The Telegraph" is not a serious source, they are contaminated by the same bias as you are just now, they are sell outs!

Let me point it out for you as you are clearly blind to the western propaganda

See the image of the before is full of color, and then the after is almost black and white, why? It's a technique used by western media to show depressive scenarios and affect the perception of people watching the video or the images. This helps in showing how evil and bad the enemy is, how much sadness and destruction it brought that even the world looks gray and depressive

It's used on clueless people, who eat it all blindly and then go run around making fools of themselves, here's a quick explanation of what's happening on that video of Mariupol.
"The BBC "Wuhan filter" and perception manipulation for western people"
https://projectavalon.net/forum4/sho...western-people

And also, see how they avoided mentioning "Who" shelled the city that way, they specifically avoided saying 'after Russian shelling" and only say "the destruction left after the Russian invasion", you know why? Because they let you fill in the rest based on the bias you already have! And then avoiding directly saying "Russian shelling" prevents from being called out for lying their teeth off, also the reason why comments are disabled, they can't afford someone posting something that refutes the lies. You are being played badly and you can't realize it

None of this would happen if you would spend more time learning how things work, instead of looking for self-confirmation and biased videos and articles that prove your deranged hate is the "right thing to do and feel"

But no one will ever change your mind, you'll continue to look around trying to find more "evidence" that only shows how easy to manipulate you are

Why don't you post videos from the people of Mariupol talking about who shelled them and what happened before the Russian/DPR army came? There are plenty, in fact, here's a full channel dedicated to show the people from Mariupol, receiving help from Russians, there are two actually, check them out, or most likely not, as you will look away for sure

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCkd...whLhC8w/videos
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCs7...kqC_qlA/videos

"But i don't understand Russian!"

You don't need to, the key points are basic:

1. People are happy to receive help from Russian
2. They don't run away in terror, instead the come willingly to the Russians and even chat and smile and give thanks, unlike what you see described in western media about "The horrors of Russian occupation"

By the way, i'm still waiting for the videos that prove the Russian army shelled towns to the ground, real ones, not pre-fabricated ones like the Telegraph one you posted

And this has nothing to do with Chechnya, that you had to go back into that just says you don't have anything to show to help the Ukrainian case. You are just helping clean up and wash away Nazi crimes, that's basically it

And in that case, let's examine in detail all the stuff the US and allies did in up to 50 countries over the past half century. Let's start specially with this
https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202206/1267807.shtml

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=tASDTZahzs0

Since you bring up Chechnya, i suppose you are all for justice and all that, right? So, are you going to demand explanations from the US about this crime against humanity that remains unresolved, even if we know 100% what happened and who did this?

Let the waiting-forever games continue!

ETA: Actually i'm very thankful that you posted this, thank you! It is the perfect example of western media propaganda and manipulation! This is a case study for real, because there's nothing better than a person directly influenced and manipulated by western media to come out and expose how it all works in real time, without anyone else's intervention. So in that way, thank you! Because you have exposed in plain view to thousands of people, how the propaganda and manipulation works on your side

I'm not anti-Russian, my wife and stepson are Russian. When I was in Russia between 2003-8 it was a pleasant place to visit, I was treated well. Back then, the regular people knew Putin was a thug, a KGB graduate who is of the Soviet imperialist mindset. All of the legitimate political opponents either ended up in exile, jail or conveniently died.

You like to discount the chechyan campaign, and deflect criticism by pointing at whatever atrocities the USA did. We are talking about the Ukraine invasion here, not USA stuff. The chechyan campaign is integral to this discussion because that campaign used the same militaery techniques as what Russia is trying to employ in Ukraine: flatten the opposition with artillery. So, don't try to say that Ukrainians self inflicted all these communities with artillery, that's just horse manure.

You koolaid drinkers are NOT giving this conflict an objective view. You're painting Russia as saviour, which is completely false. Sure, Ukraine has plenty of guilt here, but so does Russia.

I absolutely abhor violence. I absolutely detest the use of force to obtain anything. I'm of the hippie peace love dove mindset. This 'military operation's 'noble' goals could have been achieved through much more peaceful and constructive means. I am sure of this. Any other excuses you make up to justify this repulsive situation is half backed horse manure from an fsb psyop lab.

[Ravenlocke]

https://twitter.com/jaccocharite/sta...90498175717394

https://twitter.com/jaccocharite/sta...90506442739713

https://twitter.com/jaccocharite/sta...90513619144721

[Ravenlocke]

https://twitter.com/jaccocharite/sta...97723946487829

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https://twitter.com/disclosetv/statu...82631896846336

[Ravenlocke]

https://twitter.com/EvaKBartlett/sta...37151095820288

https://covertactionmagazine.com/202...ists-in-syria/

Ukrainian Army War Crimes Include Shelling of Ambulences, Firetrucks, and Rescue Workers in the Donbass Republics—Similar to Israelis and U.S. Backed Terrorists in Syria

Local residents describe the perpetrators of these crimes—who have received lavish U.S. funding—as “shameless,” “scumbags” and “terrorists.”

Heroic rescue workers in Donbas should be accorded rights under international law to help people without being targeted



In the more than eight years of bombing the civilians of the Donetsk and Luhansk People’s Republics, Ukraine has committed untold numbers of war crimes. These include bombing residential areas, markets, hospitals, schools, parks—including with prohibited heavy weapons and banned cluster munitions—and, since late July, raining banned “Petal” mines down on populated civilian areas, including the very center of Donetsk, including as recently as September 7.

A lesser-known war crime is Ukraine’s routine targeting of ambulances, fire trucks, medics and rescuers, and their headquarters and stations. Many of the times Ukraine bombs such heroic rescuers, it is when they are on the way, or already on site, to help civilians often themselves just bombed by Ukraine.

On August 21, Ukrainian shelling of the DPR’s Gorlovka wounded twelve, including five firefighters.

The day prior, Ukrainian shelling targeted an ambulance station in the LPR’s Lysychansk, wounding several and damaging some of the ambulances.

On June 23, the Kievskiy District of Donetsk came under repeated shelling over the course of the two hours I was visiting the Emergency Services headquarters there. On the grounds, I saw the remnants of a “Hurricane” missile from a previous Ukrainian attack.

See https://twitter.com/EvaKBartlett/sta...30967195783170
The previous day, Ukrainian forces targeted an Emergency Services fire truck on call, leaving the driver hospitalized in critical condition. According to his colleagues, they saw a drone above them just prior to Ukraine’s strike. The targeting was unquestionably deliberate.

On June 18, Ukraine targeted a central Donetsk district after Emergency Services had arrived, killing a firefighter and the driver, and injuring three more rescuers.

In early June, heavy Ukrainian shelling of Kuibyshevsky District, Donetsk, destroyed an ambulance and seriously injured the driver.

Donetsk ambulance destroyed by Ukrainian shelling while out on a call. [Source: Photo courtesy of Eva Bartlett]
Ukraine’s attacks on emergency workers is not new; Ukraine has been doing so for years.

In June 2021, during a humanitarian cease-fire, Ukrainian forces targeted an ambulance which had arrived to evacuate three injured DPR soldiers.

In October 2019, Ukrainian forces fired an anti-tank guided missile at a DPR military ambulance en route to help a child, wounding the driver and a paramedic.

In August 2018, Ukrainian forces fired a missile at a DPR ambulance, killing the driver and two female paramedics.

When I first visited the DPR in September 2019, going to hard-hit areas around Gorlovka, I was told by Zaitsevo administration that ambulances could not reach the villagers.

“The paramedics don’t go farther than this building; it’s too dangerous. If somebody needs medical care near the front lines, someone has to go in their own car and take them to a point where medics can then take them to Gorlovka. The soldiers also help civilians who are injured.”

This is something I was very familiar with in Gaza, occupied Palestine, where Israeli soldiers routinely fire at Palestinian farmers and other laborers on agricultural land, a policy of harassment to drive Palestinians off their land. In most cases, ambulances likewise could not reach the injured due to Israel’s policy of targeting ambulances. Consequently, seriously injured Palestinians bleed to death.

In Zaitsevo, I was told this had happened there, too. “A woman died due to huge blood loss because no one could reach her house to take her away in time. She was injured in the shelling and bled to death.”

The rest of the article here,
https://covertactionmagazine.com/202...ists-in-syria/





https://twitter.com/EvaKBartlett/sta...37546077511682

[Ravenlocke]

https://twitter.com/Sprinter99880/st...47418915471361

https://twitter.com/Sprinter99880/st...04558459998237

[Mashika]

Posted by Ravenlocke (here)
https://twitter.com/Sprinter99880/st...47418915471361

https://twitter.com/Sprinter99880/st...04558459998237

This may not be very well known, but it is a Russian phenomenon, it is known as "Light Pillars" and it happens in several parts of Russia at this time of year, it may be a "Russian-only" thing so it is confusing or weird for other people to see

"Magical ‘light pillar’ phenomenon spotted across Russian skies"
https://www.rt.com/news/375419-light-pillar-russia-sky/

Here's one in Syberia from 2020
https://siberiantimes.com/other/othe...stern-siberia/


Run an image search on youtube for "russian light pillars" and there are lots of examples of it over the years

[TargeT]

FYI, I was pretty interested on your take re: this question:

Posted by TargeT (here)
Did you just do the 2 years, what was your take on the moral / effort exerted from the mandatory service soldiers?

I suppose it's not a very well stated question with out a contextual reference (all volunteer vrs forced etc..)

[ExomatrixTV]

2,433,392 votes·Final results

[Johnnycomelately]

I think you are also not giving this an objective view. You have not acknowledged the Russians’ motive involving the growing threat to their existence as they are. Do you history?

Posted by Justplain (here)

You koolaid drinkers are NOT giving this conflict an objective view. You're painting Russia as saviour, which is completely false. Sure, Ukraine has plenty of guilt here, but so does Russia.

I absolutely abhor violence. I absolutely detest the use of force to obtain anything. I'm of the hippie peace love dove mindset. This 'military operation's 'noble' goals could have been achieved through much more peaceful and constructive means. I am sure of this. Any other excuses you make up to justify this repulsive situation is half backed horse manure from an fsb psyop lab.

[Tintin]

This I think may be another Yovan and Lexus prank (?). It isn't subtitled in English so I'll have to roll with what I assume is a reliable translation or summary text instead:

Source: https://twitter.com/narrative_hole/s...05163141009412

Text:

The Ukrainian Human Rights Government official admitting the stories are systematically fabricated.

Just imagine if it was the Russian counterpart, by now I’d have:

- 50 thousand likes

- two CNN articles

- trending on Twitter

Former Ukrainian Human Rights ombudsman, thinking she’s talking to the ex-US ambassador to Ukraine, admits:

- SBU made her spin fakes about the Russian Army

- her fictional stories about Russian atrocities helped secure speeches at European parliaments and arms supplies

- she’s dissatisfied with the current Ukrainian Human Rights ombudsman because he refused to disseminate a fictitious story about a prison at the Zaporozhye Nuclear Power Plant.

This video alone discredits every single Ukrainian report that’s not backed by contextual evidence.

[Tintin]

Another example of the deeply racist mindset of the Ukrainian administration, not just today, but, as we all do now know, historically too.

This, from 2014 although a month would be helpful as well.

Source: https://twitter.com/thghtcrme/status...81154416623623

[Bill Ryan]

Another useful map. (Though everyone reading this will surely be very familiar by now!)

Jackson Hinkle will be in Washington in a few days' time for a conference. Yesterday he told his followers he's also going to politely approach members of the US Congress and ask them to please point to Donbass on a map of Europe and Asia. He'll post the videos he records.



https://t.me/intelslava/38376

[Tintin]

...and the Oscar goes to.....

A quick anecdote: many years ago the boyfriend (and an acquaintance of mine) of my then landlady told that while he was in the Balkans in 1999 on a contract job he happened to be staying in the same hotel as Kate Adie, a well known BBC British reporter at the time, who was recording a broadcast 'live, in the thick of the action'. This hotel was many dozens of miles away from the actual area of battle