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Thread: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

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    United States Avalon Member wondering's Avatar
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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    East Sun, I don't think we can ever paint an entire group as good or bad since every group is made up of individuals whose journeys all differ. I know personally very fine men who are Jesuits. Just my experience.

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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    Thanks for the pdf on Biglino, Palehorse. I will dig a little into that.
    Very curious if our own Jim Duyer had any thoughts on some of the translations from Biglino..
    Pamela

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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    Wondering, I see a lot of people paint Christians in general with the same brush.... you make a good point.

    Pamela

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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    Quote Posted by pabranno (here)
    Thanks for the pdf on Biglino, Palehorse. I will dig a little into that.
    Very curious if our own Jim Duyer had any thoughts on some of the translations from Biglino..
    Pamela
    I started the reading, in the very first chapter (pages 13 and 14) it says:

    "

    (anaqìm)

    The Long-necked Men

    Old Testament writings are generally derived from stories written by other people, such as the ancient Sumerians. These stories have given rise to certain theories, which are summarized here in this first chapter.

    These theories, – we can call them truths - that once confirmed will cause the end of a great illusion: Our current religious thought system based on concepts developed by men. This religious thought system which includes Christianity, is being operated by those who have exploited pretentiously-named “sacred texts” in order to build a structure a power structure of control and manipulation. It is time for that all to end; and it is time for the truth.

    For instance, we are interested in knowing how, where and when the Bible speaks of Anaqìm: Concrete beings that have come to Earth from other worlds. Though the Roman Catholic Church now acknowledges this information, they continue to misleadingly represent the Anaqim as “spiritual entities.”

    As we analyze the Old Testament, we will identify these concrete beings using their correct Hebrew names (for instance “Those who from heaven to Earth came” in Hebrew are Anaqiti” instead of the more well-known published Sumerian name, “Anunnaki”).
    "
    Last edited by palehorse; 18th July 2021 at 12:54. Reason: formatting
    --
    A chaos to the sense, a Kosmos to the reason.

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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    Quote Posted by wondering (here)
    East Sun, I don't think we can ever paint an entire group as good or bad since every group is made up of individuals whose journeys all differ. I know personally very fine men who are Jesuits. Just my experience.
    I Agree with that principle but must ask if you read the oath of the Jesuits that was posted here on Avalon
    about a week ago in it's entirety. IMO a person would have to be a religious fanatic to agree to it's demands.

    If you have not read it please do. It's an eye opener to say the least.

    Loyola the person who first established the Jesuits was called a Saint by some. I would never consider him to be
    anything close to being a Saint.
    Question Everything, always speak truth... Make the best of today, for there may not be a tomorrow!!! But, that's OK because tomorrow never comes, so we have nothing to worry about!!!

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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    I could not make the earlier link to work on the Mauro Biglino book, but I managed to find it at Archive.org. Here it is:

    https://archive.org/details/MauroBig...ge/n5/mode/2up
    “The highest activity a human being can attain is learning for understanding, because to understand is to be free.” --Baruch Spinoza

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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    Many thanks for the Biglino.

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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    It’s difficult to avoid demonizing an entire group when the true highest leaders and highest philosophy behind the group is clearly of dark intent. Eg Masons. Catholics. Just as difficult to avoid becoming smug in our knowledge and recognition of that ugly truth. Many many souls at the bottom, ignorant of these things, find what speaks to their heart. In spite of.
    I find it beautiful that Spirit can work that way.

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    Avalon Member East Sun's Avatar
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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    Quote Posted by ExomatrixTV (here)
    • UFOs & Christians the Hypocrisy Paradox
    Millions believe in God but never saw "Him" ... Millions worldwide saw/experience genuine UFOs and know 100% what they experienced ... are still called: "believers" not experiences/knowers.

    It is "okay" to believe a man walked over water and having a "Talking Snake" in the Garden of Eden etc. etc. ... but the same who claim that say it is "not okay" to ponder if UFO's and their occupants throughout human history influenced almost all Religions on our planet.

    • Any generalization for or against is not doing justice to the full spectrum of the truth.
    Everybody can find echo-chambers of your own bias ... not hard to do ... especially when (personal) fears and genuine worries are involved "about the other" being "deceived" ... this projected assumption can also be part of a deception agenda without realizing it.




    I can make list a long long list of subjects having unjustified over the top fears being copy-catted just because people think they are "so sure" of themselves but was an exaggeration to "convince" the other.

    Lot of people have to face their own created demons first to be able to transform these obvious fear-based projected obstacles.



    • Those who are so sure that "all" CE5 UFO Experiences are part of a "evil conspiracy" to control millions ... I have a question for them:
    01. How many people have you actually spoken/communicated with who did those CE5 Protocols successfully? (be honest!).
    02. How many videos/sites of successful CE5 testimonies have you really studied?


    To assume they "all" must be victims ... that assumption in itself proves my point how some people have a Myopic View
    (Tunnel Vision) pushing a false narrative thus become a tool for deception themselves thinking they do "good".




    Am also aware that some (very few) Avalonians are (fanatic?) Christians (or act like it) and see everything that is paranormal or alien as "demonic" ... often "forget" to add that in to the their projections when communicating to other members ... knowing if they did, that others will see what they are actually doing.



    Personally met (face to face in real life) all kinds of different types of Christians (100s over the years) that came to one (or more) of my 80+ UFO Lectures I gave in 5 countries.... what they all seem to have in common is they feel themselves as "saviors" for your Soul and use any means necessary to "save your Soul" ... And see anyone that questions that myopic behavior as part of an "evil energy" ... So you never ever can convince them one way or the other. Am so used to that. Nothing new.

    Also did many 3 hour live radio shows in Amsterdam 1990 up to 1998 where anyone could phone-in and debate me or my guest discussing UFOs live uncensored ... and guess what ... there I debated Christians too about UFOs ... many times ... So it is not new to me ... noticed a lot of recognizable predictable patterns of behavior.

    A good friend of mine told me that IF a real Christian is blending in a paranormal and/or UFO research groups not stating their true "mission" their true Modus operandi (true intentions) but slowly expose themselves can be challenged by asking if they are Christians and see everything through that lens. According to their beliefs they are not allowed to lie about that question ... because to openly deny your faith is worse than anything else for most hardcore Christians.



    Am happy to say there are also many open-minded (humble) Christians not demonizing UFO's by default ... but sadly enough most of them are afraid to speak about their more balanced honest views.



    cheers,
    John Kuhles aka 'ExomatrixTV'
    July 17th, 2021
    John, I believe we are basically on the same page.
    "Millions believe in God But have never seen etc."

    You really would not have to see him to believe in him given what we were told in Scripture.
    Jesus, if he existed was essentially human but very spiritual and I fully believe was not of this
    realm/dimension.

    I'm intrigued by such things as Ezikiel' description of et's in the Old Testament.
    Why have those things been kept from us to the point of it being obvious except for the
    conditioned tunnel versioned believers.

    Isn't it obvious that in this unending space of countless planets and stars and ultimate possibilities
    that there would be images beyond comprehension.

    Even looking at all the insects and animals that we know about and different races who are
    just a few there has to be images beyond what we can even not imagine.

    What if every thing we see in the Oceans and on land have advanced counterparts that are intelligent beyond our primitive existence by thousands of years.

    It is possible and very likely. There is no limit if we see there may be a creative being that has no end.
    Just imagine that.
    Question Everything, always speak truth... Make the best of today, for there may not be a tomorrow!!! But, that's OK because tomorrow never comes, so we have nothing to worry about!!!

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    Netherlands Avalon Member ExomatrixTV's Avatar
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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    To me Dr. Steven Greer is a "Saint" in comparison what "Christians" (not using meditation) did past 1000+ years especially towards anyone who commit the "crime" to be different ... like the Native people of North+South America & Australia!

    And what about real meditating people in Tibet vs "rational people" from China oppressing them (taking their right to self-determination away) and I can go on and on people using all kinds of hypocritical worry-some based & generalized "logic".
    • Am really happy to say there are also many open-minded (humble) Christians not demonizing UFO's by default ... but sadly enough most of them are afraid to speak about their more balanced honest views.
    I never assumed that what happened to Iris suicide is the "same" as how others behave (I thought that was obvious) ... I mentioned that (bring it up) only to show I really studied all kinds of fear based behavior of humans intensely... and the "worry too much" how others may think/act is the lowest form/level of all fears ... still can create an one-sided Myopic View (Tunnel Vision) especially when you are on a "mission" to "educate" the others.

    Some even assume that worrying is not even fear based "if it is rational" may in some circumstances be just the case indeed ... but it can also be used as a perfect excuse especially when you are generalizing a group of different people having different experiences than you have thinking they can "not" be helping Human Kind just "because they have contact with ET's" ... This over the top generalizing assumption alone proves my case!

    cheers,
    John Kuhles

    ps. Am well aware of the (possible) dangers of all kinds of UFO cults worldwide ... I even warned about that on record, 100s of times in great detail last 31 years!

    source
    Last edited by ExomatrixTV; 21st July 2021 at 20:24.
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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    Quote Posted by East Sun (here)

    You really would not have to see him to believe in him given what we were told in Scripture.
    Jesus, if he existed was essentially human but very spiritual and I fully believe was not of this
    realm/dimension.
    That is the whole freaking point ... depending on OTHER limited (in my view corrupted) humans deciding what is allowed in the scripture and "how" to interpreted them etc. etc. (blindly) trusting them they are not "deceiving/misdirecting/misquoting" stuff for political reasons or even satanic reasons.

    Even if they were not "deceiving/misdirecting/misquoting" it is still based upon very limited human-based perceptions being used by some as "absolute" creating all kinds of problems like: "us vs them" behavior ... "the chosen ones" vs the rest etc.

    I never ever claim Prime Creator "does not exist" but I do claim: Prime Creator is way too big for ANY man-made and/or alien-made religions ... and any assumed Deity that "needs" worship is wrong to begin with, in my book.

    cheers,
    John
    Last edited by ExomatrixTV; 19th July 2021 at 10:35.
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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    Interesting thread...as a Christian I am a bit saddened by negative experiences some had with Christians with regards to UDOs/aliens...I can't understand it though...open-mindedness should be the Christian way, but I know it mostly isn't.
    To me, the Bible and alien stories dovetails quite nicely.

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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    I grew up in the Catholic faith, but regret to have to say could not stay in it.
    Now I feel sorry for those who follow the Vatican (most I believe are good and dedicated people).

    But I have great doubts about the Black Pope/Jesuite Pope. that is at the top right now.
    Just my opinion.
    Question Everything, always speak truth... Make the best of today, for there may not be a tomorrow!!! But, that's OK because tomorrow never comes, so we have nothing to worry about!!!

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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    Nice response DbDraad... I came across a local Pastor that wanted nothing to do with retelling of the contact experience in my life. I understood why though, his belief in the subject matter was not relevant to God's plan of Salvation and of course Pastors are concerned about protecting the flock. I also contacted another prominent scholar LA Marzulli to express to him that not all encounters are evil or demonic but of course his books are written with a negative leaning so he was not listening either. His good friend Gary Stearman had an amazing positive encounter and LAs response to my sharing that view was that those are extremely rare. There's a lot of grace for servants of God and spiritual leaders which are dealing with some heavy subject matter such as possession, angels, demons and ghosts all part of the paranormal so it's not out of fear or bias that Pastors dont want to delve into it. Even the Bible doesn't really say specifically the motives behind the occupants of those flying vehicles like it does with other matters.

    I try to live a spiritual life and that provided the strength to remove any fear or doubt during the initial encounters and it was nice to be part of something that was extremely enlightening but at the same time I would feel remiss in not alerting other interested people to possible negative encounters if they decide to pursue contact. People should know the risk and by telling them there is supporting data on both sides seems the right response.

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    Avalon Member East Sun's Avatar
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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    This is a hypothesis of mine................

    Jesus will not come back again as promised until we we have become more spiritually oriented and less greedy
    i.e. enlightened.
    That would mean going up against the Roman Vatican establishment who have become corrupt over 2,000 years,
    and all of it's offshoots of protestants, They, the protestants need to protest against what they have become.

    We have, all of us, IMO a need to become more spiritual and less greedy. (hard to do in this time.)

    Same goes for the globalists who are control freaks and totally self oriented. This also includes cults and Satanists
    and their ilk.

    If the afore mentioned can get together we/they could make it happen in spite of the latter mentioned
    groups.

    It's entirely up to us.
    Last edited by East Sun; 19th July 2021 at 23:14.
    Question Everything, always speak truth... Make the best of today, for there may not be a tomorrow!!! But, that's OK because tomorrow never comes, so we have nothing to worry about!!!

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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    Quote Posted by East Sun (here)
    I grew up in the Catholic faith, but regret to have to say could not stay in it.
    Now I feel sorry for those who follow the Vatican (most I believe are good and dedicated people).

    But I have great doubts about the Black Pope/Jesuite Pope. that is at the top right now.
    Just my opinion.
    No need to regret dropping out of Catholicism. If it doesn't ring true then why stay? That's the guilt programming instilled in religions. I was the same. I pursued God in my own individual way cause the "fires and brimstone" angle didn't sit right.
    "Without the human request, nothing will happen."

    "This must never be forgotten, that the human has the power to prevail."

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    Ireland Avalon Member Snoweagle's Avatar
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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    Quote Posted by ExomatrixTV (here)
    • UFOs & Christians the Hypocrisy Paradox
    Millions believe in God but never saw "Him" ... Millions worldwide saw/experience genuine UFOs and know 100% what they experienced ... are still called: "believers" not experiences/knowers.

    It is "okay" to believe a man walked over water and having a "Talking Snake" in the Garden of Eden etc. etc. ... but the same who claim that say it is "not okay" to ponder if UFO's and their occupants throughout human history influenced almost all Religions on our planet.

    • Any generalization for or against is not doing justice to the full spectrum of the truth.
    Everybody can find echo-chambers of your own bias ... not hard to do ... especially when (personal) fears and genuine worries are involved "about the other" being "deceived" ... this projected assumption can also be part of a deception agenda without realizing it.




    I can make list a long long list of subjects having unjustified over the top fears being copy-catted just because people think they are "so sure" of themselves but was an exaggeration to "convince" the other.

    Lot of people have to face their own created demons first to be able to transform these obvious fear-based projected obstacles.



    • Those who are so sure that "all" CE5 UFO Experiences are part of a "evil conspiracy" to control millions ... I have a question for them:
    01. How many people have you actually spoken/communicated with who did those CE5 Protocols successfully? (be honest!).
    02. How many videos/sites of successful CE5 testimonies have you really studied?


    To assume they "all" must be victims ... that assumption in itself proves my point how some people have a Myopic View
    (Tunnel Vision) pushing a false narrative thus become a tool for deception themselves thinking they do "good".




    Am also aware that some (very few) Avalonians are (fanatic?) Christians (or act like it) and see everything that is paranormal or alien as "demonic" ... often "forget" to add that in to the their projections when communicating to other members ... knowing if they did, that others will see what they are actually doing.



    Personally met (face to face in real life) all kinds of different types of Christians (100s over the years) that came to one (or more) of my 80+ UFO Lectures I gave in 5 countries.... what they all seem to have in common is they feel themselves as "saviors" for your Soul and use any means necessary to "save your Soul" ... And see anyone that questions that myopic behavior as part of an "evil energy" ... So you never ever can convince them one way or the other. Am so used to that. Nothing new.

    Also did many 3 hour live radio shows in Amsterdam 1990 up to 1998 where anyone could phone-in and debate me or my guest discussing UFOs live uncensored ... and guess what ... there I debated Christians too about UFOs ... many times ... So it is not new to me ... noticed a lot of recognizable predictable patterns of behavior.

    A good friend of mine told me that IF a real Christian is blending in a paranormal and/or UFO research groups not stating their true "mission" their true Modus operandi (true intentions) but slowly expose themselves can be challenged by asking if they are Christians and see everything through that lens. According to their beliefs they are not allowed to lie about that question ... because to openly deny your faith is worse than anything else for most hardcore Christians.



    Am really happy to say there are also many open-minded (humble) Christians not demonizing UFO's by default ... but sadly enough most of them are afraid to speak about their more balanced honest views.



    cheers,
    John Kuhles aka 'ExomatrixTV'
    July 17th, 2021
    I am an Irish Republican Roman Catholic and I can assure you there are NO ALIENS in those pictures of exquisite art.

    What does exist, is your desire to emotionally drive Christians (no other collective groups) to accept Aliens as historical fact. When no real evidence exists. Anywhere.

    Referring only to the first image, tell me in detail what do you see? What does that image depict?

    And you being a Jew, should reveal the discontinuities of our separate education systems.

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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    Quote Posted by Snoweagle (here)

    I am an Irish Republican Roman Catholic and I can assure you there are NO ALIENS in those pictures of exquisite art.

    What does exist, is your desire to emotionally drive Christians (no other collective groups) to accept Aliens as historical fact. When no real evidence exists. Anywhere.

    Referring only to the first image, tell me in detail what do you see? What does that image depict?

    And you being a Jew, should reveal the discontinuities of our separate education systems.
    ???

    Where did I claim those Old Medieval Art Depicting UFOs "must be" aliens?? ...

    They (UFOs of the Past) could be anything, like:

    01. Time Machines
    02. Interdenominationals (beings from another dimension).
    03. Left over of Atlantis/MU/Lemuria technology of Oceanic underwater cities.
    04. (Human) beings from a Parallel Universe
    05. and yes "Aliens" should be a on this list as a possibility too ... to exclude that option is obvious ultra close-minded.
    06. etc. etc.

    @Snoweagle... Why do you claim I am a "Jew"? ... please point me where you have ANY evidence that I suppose to be that? ... and even if I was (which I am not and never was) what the Fck has that to do with anything.

    Did I touch a "sensitive nerve" or something for you to over-react? ... If so, I do it over and over again ... because I have no respect for snowflakes using false accusations to "make a case".

    cheers,
    John Kuhles aka 'ExomatrixTV'
    July 21st, 2021
    Last edited by ExomatrixTV; 1st February 2024 at 03:01.
    No need to follow anyone, only consider broadening (y)our horizon of possibilities ...

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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    Hello John,

    I have two apologies to make to you :-)

    First, I interpreted wrongly that you were always Jewish. This is not a problem for me and has never been a problem throughout my life as I am not Racist in any way. Heaps of real life experiences and references to verify that. I apologise.

    Secondly, my mistake in referring to Aliens when you were clearly referring to UFO, UAP or whatever they are called these days. Again I apologise.

    And no you did not touch a sensitive area at all with me though it is clear to everybody reading this otherwise.

    I have something to tell you about those images.

    It would help your cause to tell us what you see depicted in that image and the others will naturally be understood.

    So what do you see?
    Last edited by Snoweagle; 21st July 2021 at 15:14.

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    Default Re: UFOs & Christians: the Hypocrisy Paradox

    Quote Posted by Snoweagle (here)
    Hello John,
    First, I interpreted wrongly that you were always Jewish.
    I never was a Jew and never will be (same for any other religion) ... still waiting for you to explain where you got the idea that I suppose to be a "Jew" and in what context? ... Point at a post of me ... or a comment of mine ... or a link ... or a video or anything else from me ... please show me where you came to that weird conclusion?

    --o-O-o--

    What "Old Medieval Art Depicting UFOs" are?

    Is already stated: "U.F.O.'s" ... and what UFOs are >>> is a long list of possibilities ... as I studied UFOs 31 years now, and can talk about that for days non-stop without taking a break

    cheers,
    John
    Last edited by ExomatrixTV; 22nd July 2021 at 00:16.
    No need to follow anyone, only consider broadening (y)our horizon of possibilities ...

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