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    Netherlands Avalon Member gini's Avatar
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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    I have to think about what happened 2o years ago :" What was the significance of the assassination of Ahmad Shah Massoud on September 9 2001?
    Massoud was assassinated at the instigation of al-Qaeda and the Taliban in a suicide bombing on September 9, 2001. Two days later, the September 11 attacks occurred in the United States, which ultimately led to the North Atlantic Treaty Organisation invading Afghanistan and allying with Massoud's forces. "

    " In a bid to destroy Al-Qaeda and under the guise of bolstering local and global security, the US initiated the war in Afghanistan on October 7, 2001. The US quickly occupied Kabul and dismantled the Taliban regime. But it did not stop its operation. Instead, it increased its troop presence in Afghanistan in 2010.1 "

    That event foreshadowed the dark changes following 911..

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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    Quote Posted by Nasu (here)
    Interesting about the Chinese. It's all just a massive game of influence and favors. Thanks to poor alzheimer’s sufferer Biden’s latest gaf of complete and total abandonment, the fall of Saigon is looking like a well planned exit. If we lose the airport in Kabul it will be even more of a mess, if that’s even possible at this point. I suppose it can always be worse. It could be raining. At least they have the weather as they scramble into the choppers. My heart goes out to the PMC’s who will be left till last.

    Well not last last. We will leave behind thousands of translators who spoke to the Taliban on our behalf, often in adverse situations having to translate very dangerous language. Not to forget the three hundred thousand strong army we equipped and trained. Plus the tens of thousands who helped in every other way. But without our money supporting and underpinning that army it was always a hollow shell, as the relentless march by city by city to the capital with little to no resistance has proved. So instead of chasing through goat herds and dust with 50’s mounted on Toyotas, twenty years later we leave them with Humvees, Blackhawks and Jet fighters!

    We should have quit 18 years ago when we smashed up their training camps and chased AQ over the mountains into Pakistan, we won, that was our time to leave with honor. So they treat their women and people badly, it’s not our place to die for that sort of woke ****. The thing that tipped the scales in the eighties for the the Russian withdraw wasn’t the stingers we gave the mujahideen, it was the puppet government trying to make the schools system more inclusive for girls.

    They don’t share our values, end of. They probably never will, no matter how many dollars or bullets we offer them. The Taliban are a proud people and were glad to see the back of AQ, we should have left them to their medieval backward lives then. How other people choose to live should not be a call to arms for the west. Counter insurgency is a tactic, not a strategy. Clearly there was never any more of a plan than to make as much money out of it as possible for as long as we possibly could. There are literally trillions of reasons this was a great success to a few thousand and a massive loss for everyone else involved. War is a racket.......x...... N
    Wow Nasu. WORD. I agree.
    Last edited by Tracie (Bodhicee); 17th August 2021 at 04:43.

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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    Whatever power controls Afghanistan would have a firm grip on the future. Wikipedia estimate is one trillion in untapped minerals and the video says three trillion.
    Mining in Afghanistan
    Rare-earth elements

    Afghanistan is one of the richest mining regions in the world.
    video posted 03/18/21

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    UK Avalon Member Mike Gorman's Avatar
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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    Quote Posted by lizhekb (here)
    Any evidence that China muscled US out?

    No news to me that the US was there for the drug money.

    For the next 20 years(maybe 50), no country on earth could muscle US out. Because of their superiority in military and weapon.

    ¤=[Post Update]=¤

    Quote Posted by leavesoftrees (here)
    Quote Posted by viking (here)
    T

    So now China controls the heroin - again.

    Look for a surge in "China White" hitting U.S. Streets in the short term future.
    Funny how that works.

    Viking
    China's payback for the Opium Wars
    The Opium Wars was between Britain and China.
    Some would have you see that America/Britain are essentially the same empire, via the City of London macro financial control over western democratic funding, Dutch Bank, Swiss Bank IMF e.t.c : in terms of the behind the scene, macro perspective we are dealing with the same financial/power brokers District of Columbia/City of London = the same team.

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    UK Avalon Member Journeyman's Avatar
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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    I suspect much of what we're seeing from MSM is fake. I don't think the people really fell off the plane. Hopefully this was staged. The key points were President Ghani leaving with so much cash he needs to leave $5m in cash because there's not enough room to take it and the ineptitude and dishonesty of the Biden Administration. The Greenwald piece above tells you the rest. The difference between the story we were told of a principled exercise in nation building and the reality, a baksheesh fuelled feeding frenzy for the Kabul frontmen and the insiders and mercenaries skimming the vast sums flowing in and out of the country.

    There hasn't been any fighting, none of the tribal leaders or factions have put up any kind of fight. Why? The deals were already done. I think the plug was pulled on this particular great game and it was pulled some time ago. The US military hasn't suddenly become so inept that it can't stage a withdrawal and it would never have relied upon the Afghan army when they knew better than anyone what a mirage it really was. The leader of the Taliban was released by Trump and Pompeo met with them last year. My guess is to agree a transition which would take place on President Patsy's watch.

    The regime in Kabul was rotten and that rot meant that it was always going to fall as soon as the money and external power propping it up was removed.
    There've been frightening stories about what this could mean for Afghan women or others that may incur the Taliban's displeasure but for now these are stories and I reserve judgment simply because the spreading of these stories has in the past been part of the armoury of those seeking to push intervention and profit from it. We now have to watch to see if any other great power seeks to fill the vacuum or if the people of Afghanistan will be left to govern themselves. That in itself could tell us much about the world we now inhabit. Time will tell.

    Perhaps though there's a positive aspect to this grievous waste of human potential, lives, limbs and resources. If people have been paying attention, if they learn, then it will be impossible for the voices urging imperial adventurism on humanitarian pretexts to get so many blank cheques signed in future.

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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    I think that the New World Order Elite who pull Biden's strings have probably covertly helped the Taliban to take over Afghanistan - in the same way that the Obama Administration helped ISIS in Syria with a view to assisting with the creation of a Sunni lead Islamic State... (except they didn't pull it off)

    They like authoritarian regimes - who keep the populations well under control and 'they' are trying to move the West into the same kind of politics..... where individual freedoms are a thing of the past...

    By it's very nature a One World Government has to be a dictatorship... but everyone will not (initially) be the same - I remember seeing an interview with Kissinger and he said something along the lines of... that all the geographical areas of the world don't need to be the same in the NWO and different areas would reflect their cultural basis but would be part of and answer to the One World Government... (my words and gist of it from memory)

    There was probably a deal done with the Taliban behind closed doors that so long as they traded their Minerals and heroin and went along with the NWO they would be left alone to control vast tracts of land and the people in it -

    Biden being a Globalist Puppet was just told what to say and when... and now the situation is going exactly to plan although it is being presented as a disaster...

    Biden must have been scripted to say what he said about it all previously - the 'it won't be like Saigon' speech so you have to wonder if we are seeing the first stages of him being thrown under the bus... as he reaches the end of his usefulness... and dementia takes a firmer hold on him....

    Besides handing Afghanistan over to a ( cooperating?) authoritarian Taliban regime the Globalists are humiliating America which is going towards bringing the country down...

    (that's the way I'm interpreting it all at the moment...)
    Last edited by jaybee; 17th August 2021 at 08:14.

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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    Here is an excerpt from a report of a court case going on in Australia (currently adjourned because of lockdown) against an Australian soldier accused of killing an innocent Aghani farmer. Three Afghani witnesses gave evidence from Kabul to a Sydney court, via a translator based in Ottowa. It gives an interesting picture of what life is like there

    Quote The three Afghan witnesses, 38-year old Mohammed Hanifa Fatih, 40-year old Man Gul Rahmi, and Hanifa’s elderly father, Shazada, are men of the soil, born and bred in the village.

    They’ve spent most of their lives working the fields and orchards which line the creekbed that runs below their compounds.

    They’ve never learnt to read or write. As their evidence revealed this week, they measure time in seasons – when corn is ready for harvest, or almond trees heavy with bounty – rather than in years. Distance is measured by how long it takes to reach a neighbouring village on foot, or the height of a riverbank by handspans, or the length of a limb.

    Man Gul scoffed this week when shown a photo taken by the SAS of Ali Jan’s mangled body. Pictured with the corpse was a communications device which Roberts-Smith claimed he and the other soldier (identified only as Person 11) found near the woodcutter’s body.

    But Man Gul and Hanifa were both adamant: Ali Jan had never been seen using a radio and had never possessed one. Indeed, Man Gul said, Ali Jan hadn’t known “how to work out a watch” let alone a wireless device.
    Last edited by leavesoftrees; 17th August 2021 at 09:40.

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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    Quote Posted by Journeyman (here)
    I suspect much of what we're seeing from MSM is fake. I don't think the people really fell off the plane. Hopefully this was staged. The key points were President Ghani leaving with so much cash he needs to leave $5m in cash because there's not enough room to take it and the ineptitude and dishonesty of the Biden Administration. The Greenwald piece above tells you the rest. The difference between the story we were told of a principled exercise in nation building and the reality, a baksheesh fuelled feeding frenzy for the Kabul frontmen and the insiders and mercenaries skimming the vast sums flowing in and out of the country.

    There hasn't been any fighting, none of the tribal leaders or factions have put up any kind of fight. Why? The deals were already done. I think the plug was pulled on this particular great game and it was pulled some time ago. The US military hasn't suddenly become so inept that it can't stage a withdrawal and it would never have relied upon the Afghan army when they knew better than anyone what a mirage it really was. The leader of the Taliban was released by Trump and Pompeo met with them last year. My guess is to agree a transition which would take place on President Patsy's watch.

    The regime in Kabul was rotten and that rot meant that it was always going to fall as soon as the money and external power propping it up was removed.
    There've been frightening stories about what this could mean for Afghan women or others that may incur the Taliban's displeasure but for now these are stories and I reserve judgment simply because the spreading of these stories has in the past been part of the armoury of those seeking to push intervention and profit from it. We now have to watch to see if any other great power seeks to fill the vacuum or if the people of Afghanistan will be left to govern themselves. That in itself could tell us much about the world we now inhabit. Time will tell.

    Perhaps though there's a positive aspect to this grievous waste of human potential, lives, limbs and resources. If people have been paying attention, if they learn, then it will be impossible for the voices urging imperial adventurism on humanitarian pretexts to get so many blank cheques signed in future.

    Journeyman, I agree with almost everything except that “there are no people who fell off plane”, it’s outrages and absurd to watch and how was it even allowed to happen in the age of strict airport controls,
    a scene I’ve only seen in some 100 year old movies otherwise.

    I think too it was all planned but “not so well”.


    People are scrambling to get out at all costs, also from Iraq, Iran, Palestine, China, Laos, Cambodia, India, Philippines and many other countries in hope and daytime dream of better life and future for themselves and their children.

    As where human emotion goes any downgrade is humiliating and often a spiral downward so my heart goes to these people, with a caveat.
    They should have been better prepared for this moment and reclaim their power instead running.

    The madness shows a discrepancy in logic between the “natives” and the “invaders” and that they were not able to cope together on a task.

    Half of them probably believed in converting their country to American paradise.

    Afghanistan has some of the eeriest, most serene and beautiful landscapes on the planet.
    It’s not easy place to inhabit due to harsh climatic conditions of mountains and deserts.


    The NWO had whole another plan for nomads and Taliban and tribes who are growing small in numbers worldwide, they could be eventually put to communal type of housing ( quite like Tibetans in China), vaccinated and taught proper manners.

    Or they could just shoot themselves to the foot and die.

    In small case now, there is something I’ve noticed with the Afghani students I once talked to and it seemed to be their national feature but in fact, probably qualifies as chronic PTSD, they seem to be blanked on empathy as they’ve got it very hard from start, from the beginning, their mothers were beaten and no one has played with them a lot and got gun for 5th birthday in some cases.

    If there is something these people urgently need is not a “force”. It’s a higher human emotion they were cut off and are massively missing.

    Their Allah is empty of substance unless even one of them proves otherwise. Everyone swears to the God everyday who is the most Compassionate.

    Be merciful and you can’t lose the case ..




    Something I wanted to insert here , 2008 movie The Objective , a “sci-fi” based allegedly on some real events and experience of soldiers in Afghanistan.

    There was a full copy available on YouTube for many years that I can’t find now but anyone who can give it a look.





    🌈
    Last edited by Agape; 17th August 2021 at 10:47.

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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    I don’t know why people in the UK are describing this as the greatest foreign policy disaster since Suez , that honour goes to the illegal invasion of Iraq - we are still awaiting prosecutions of Tony Blair et al.

    The foreign policy disaster was invading Afghanistan in the first place. All strategists who understand the geography knew that a foreign power can only temporarily dominate this region due to geography. Like in jungle regions, he who controls the hinterlands can isolate and threaten the towns - you cannot occupy such places, especially when the ‘hill men’ had been forged into a highly effective guerilla force by the CIA.

    Why would the strategists and wonks tell politicians that this was false?

    It is here that the western public may get the opportunity to awaken to the reality of the huge stinking tumour growing on their shoulder that is the security state.

    It is these people who, knowing that the policy was doomed would still push it .

    Firstly as we all know 911 was a security state inside job with Saudi patsys involved. Bin laden , likely a member of the CIA likely had little to no involvement in the operation - so he was also a patsy.

    The security state never indicted him , and no real attempt was made to bring him to justice in a court of law - that would have exposed too much. The taliban offered to hand over Bin Laden if proof of guilt was supplied - see the following article (Irish Times)


    Quote Bush rejects Taliban offer to expel bin Laden

    Afghanistan's Deputy Prime Minister, Mr Haji Abdul Kabir, the third most powerful figure in the Taliban, told reporters visiting…

    Patrick Smyth

    Mon, Oct 15, 2001

    Afghanistan's Deputy Prime Minister, Mr Haji Abdul Kabir, the third most powerful figure in the Taliban, told reporters visiting Jalalabad "we would be ready to hand him over to a third country," one that would never "come under pressure from the United States." President Bush quickly rejected the offer.
    The US and Britain yesterday launched a second week of bombing raids against Afghanistan, with heavy strikes reported on Kabul and Kandahar, amid reports that a tactical shift involving land operations by special forces may be imminent.
    The strikes, and confirmed reports of civilian casualties, came as the Taliban yet again offered to hand over Osama bin Laden if evidence was produced against him.
    So why would the security state embark on what was only going to be a fiasco?

    - the generals pretended that they thought they could succeed
    - the strategists wanted a central Asian base to threaten Russia and China
    - the drug runners wanted opium
    - the arms companies wanted war and instability

    The security state provided the politicians with the short term opportunity to pretend that they were responding strongly to the 911 atrocity while propping up the lie as to who was behind it. All these people are the same in that they don’t care about truth or long term benefit, they just need to make money in the short term and succeed politically - this is the growing illness in the western system - it’s like a fiasco factory.

    What has happened now it not a disaster - it’s in many ways good for the following reasons :

    - the country will stabilise with stable government
    - the west will stop pouring resources into a fiasco
    - with stability will come investment
    - the Chinese will offer to pour money in , but will attach strings regarding moderation of the worst aspects of primitive islam
    - as China builds its ‘belt and road’ project, vast infrastructure projects will start and Pakistan will be heavily involved
    - over time , with stability and education - the taliban will moderate
    - in the west people will awaken to the causes of the fiasco and hopefully attack the tumour

    The other strategy lying in ruins is the western drive to promote unstable failed Islamic states on the fringes of Russia and China . As Turkey cosies up to Eurasia they will hopefully abandon that dangerous game

    I think the opium is a bit of a wild card . The taliban have a record of stopping this trade however theologically I think they are not against selling to infidels. This then may ramp up - or China may use it as a weapon - or a bargaining chip.
    Last edited by Baby Steps; 17th August 2021 at 11:27.
    we have subcontracted the business of healing people to Companies who profit from sickness.

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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    Factual or image-altered?

    I don't believe anything, but I have many suspicions. - Robert Anton Wilson

    The present as you think of it, and in practical working terms, is that point at which you select your physical experience from all those events that could be materialized. - Seth (The Nature of Personal Reality - Session 656, Page 293)

    (avatar image: Brocken spectre, a wonderful phenomenon of nature I have experienced and a symbol for my aspirations.)

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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    China, at least in the use of "illegal" opiates has already dominated the US with the synthetic opiate fentanyl which is 80-100 times stronger than morphine and quite affordable on the streets. It is so strong it doesn't need to be injected to get the rush that heroin addicts seek.Where oxycontin was the first wave of OD's in the US, fentanyl is the second. It is a white powder and is easily shipped to the US. Interestingly, the largest suppliers of fentanyl for this are located in Wuhan.

    Of course, fentanyl has therapeutic uses as well for intense pain relief.

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    UK Avalon Member Journeyman's Avatar
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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    Quote Posted by Agape (here)
    Journeyman, I agree with almost everything except that “there are no people who fell off plane”, it’s outrages and absurd to watch and how was it even allowed to happen in the age of strict airport controls, a scene I’ve only seen in some 100 year old movies otherwise.
    I may well be off my rocker and I've said I increasingly feel like I'm watching a movie, but the scene of the people running alongside the plane, there was a CGI look about it.

    More than that, much of this has felt staged, there was a shot of a chinook over the US embassy that looked, to this observer, as if someone had been given the iconic shots of the evacuation of Saigon and told 'make it look like that'.



    So much of this just doesn't quite add up. There are tens of thousands desperate to escape? Then why does the German plane sent there to evacuate them leave with 7 people onboard?

    https://www.rt.com/news/532274-germa...cuation-plane/

    Quote “We had very little time, so we only took on board people who were on site.”
    Ok, maybe so, but maybe we're getting a distorted picture?

    I don't want to deny people's lived experience. Easy for me to sit here looking at photos on the web and say 'it's all fake' whilst there could well be people in desperate circumstances out there. However, my take is based on the fact that the MSM has been repeatedly caught out in lies, from small lies of omission to gigantic whoppers that would make Pinocchio's nose grow all the way to the moon and back. They cannot and should not be trusted on face value, in particular whenever they're pushing a particular line in unison.

    I also remember a lot of things about the initial push to go into Afghanistan. The Taliban were in govt and although there were aspects of their rule that do not sit well with this Western liberal, they had made much progress in certain areas, for instance on encouraging farmers to ditch poppy production. They also offered in the wake of 9/11 to make any of the people charged with offences available to international courts, what they wouldn't do is surrender them unconditionally to US custody, which was of course the only option acceptable to the Bush administration.

    The generals of the Northern Alliance which the CIA then bought to overturn their regime all had blood on their hands and a nasty record when they'd been in power, but all that was overlooked as regime change was sought. Once back in power they governed just as they had before, settling old scores, playing tribal politics, demanding vast amounts of tribute etc.

    For almost 20 years the Taliban has been the bogey man, whilst there's been ample evidence that the regime that was installed by the West has itself been corrupt to the core. I'm not naïve to the nature of some of the extremists in the Taliban or the very real likelihood that some people are facing a grim future under their rule. However, just like yourself, I know people who have come from the very harshest area of the country and it's a place where violence is endemic in a way that few here can understand. Whichever faction was backed externally, there would be a reaction against them.

    I don't think the intervention took place to seek justice for 9/11, because the people that really did that weren't in caves in the bora bora mountains, they were probably more likely to be found in mansions in NYC itself, or Bern, London, Tel Aviv, Dubai etc. etc. It was about controlling one of the most strategically vital locations on the planet, whilst making vast sums of money at the same time. Tragically it's the population of the country, as ever, that are left to pick up the bill.

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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    Quote Posted by Baby Steps (here)
    I don’t know why people in the UK are describing this as the greatest foreign policy disaster since Suez , that honour goes to the illegal invasion of Iraq - we are still awaiting prosecutions of Tony Blair et al.

    The foreign policy disaster was invading Afghanistan in the first place. All strategists who understand the geography knew that a foreign power can only temporarily dominate this region due to geography. Like in jungle regions, he who controls the hinterlands can isolate and threaten the towns - you cannot occupy such places, especially when the ‘hill men’ had been forged into a highly effective guerilla force by the CIA.

    Why would the strategists and wonks tell politicians that this was false?

    It is here that the western public may get the opportunity to awaken to the reality of the huge stinking tumour growing on their shoulder that is the security state.

    It is these people who, knowing that the policy was doomed would still push it .

    Firstly as we all know 911 was a security state inside job with Saudi patsys involved. Bin laden , likely a member of the CIA likely had little to no involvement in the operation - so he was also a patsy.

    The security state never indicted him , and no real attempt was made to bring him to justice in a court of law - that would have exposed too much. The taliban offered to hand over Bin Laden if proof of guilt was supplied - see the following article (Irish Times)


    Quote Bush rejects Taliban offer to expel bin Laden

    Afghanistan's Deputy Prime Minister, Mr Haji Abdul Kabir, the third most powerful figure in the Taliban, told reporters visiting…

    Patrick Smyth

    Mon, Oct 15, 2001

    Afghanistan's Deputy Prime Minister, Mr Haji Abdul Kabir, the third most powerful figure in the Taliban, told reporters visiting Jalalabad "we would be ready to hand him over to a third country," one that would never "come under pressure from the United States." President Bush quickly rejected the offer.
    The US and Britain yesterday launched a second week of bombing raids against Afghanistan, with heavy strikes reported on Kabul and Kandahar, amid reports that a tactical shift involving land operations by special forces may be imminent.
    The strikes, and confirmed reports of civilian casualties, came as the Taliban yet again offered to hand over Osama bin Laden if evidence was produced against him.
    So why would the security state embark on what was only going to be a fiasco?

    - the generals pretended that they thought they could succeed
    - the strategists wanted a central Asian base to threaten Russia and China
    - the drug runners wanted opium
    - the arms companies wanted war and instability

    The security state provided the politicians with the short term opportunity to pretend that they were responding strongly to the 911 atrocity while propping up the lie as to who was behind it. All these people are the same in that they don’t care about truth or long term benefit, they just need to make money in the short term and succeed politically - this is the growing illness in the western system - it’s like a fiasco factory.

    What has happened now it not a disaster - it’s in many ways good for the following reasons :

    - the country will stabilise with stable government
    - the west will stop pouring resources into a fiasco
    - with stability will come investment
    - the Chinese will offer to pour money in , but will attach strings regarding moderation of the worst aspects of primitive islam
    - as China builds its ‘belt and road’ project, vast infrastructure projects will start and Pakistan will be heavily involved
    - over time , with stability and education - the taliban will moderate
    - in the west people will awaken to the causes of the fiasco and hopefully attack the tumour

    The other strategy lying in ruins is the western drive to promote unstable failed Islamic states on the fringes of Russia and China . As Turkey cosies up to Eurasia they will hopefully abandon that dangerous game

    I think the opium is a bit of a wild card . The taliban have a record of stopping this trade however theologically I think they are not against selling to infidels. This then may ramp up - or China may use it as a weapon - or a bargaining chip.


    I hadn't read your post when replying to @Agape but we see things much the same way in terms of the long term implications.

    In the short term my suspicion is that this entire process was agreed upon when Baradar was released:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ghanistan.html

    Maybe there's a tacit 'sphere of influence' agreement with China and Russia also.

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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    • Biden SLAMMED Over Kabul Crisis Over The Weekend, But Some PRAISE His Speech:
    No need to follow anyone, only consider broadening (y)our horizon of possibilities ...

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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    Quote Posted by ExomatrixTV (here)
    • Biden SLAMMED Over Kabul Crisis Over The Weekend, But Some PRAISE His Speech:
    There was a lot of truth in the speech. Biden is something of an enigma. Like they said about Trump, there are 'two Joe Biden's'. There's the fall down the airport steps, forget things, exaggerated senility guy and then there's the other Joe, the one that delivers speeches with timing and the semblance of sincerity. I think he's being prepared to take a fall and that may have been the plan all along, but there are flashes in what he says which have the ring of truth about them and the speech on Afghanistan was one of them.

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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    As reminded to me by X22 report vid, this from December 2019

    https://www.businessinsider.com.au/m...report-2019-12

    Quote Mike Flynn’s blunt interview with staffers kicked off the investigation into a bombshell Afghanistan report


    Retired US Army Lt. Gen. Michael Flynn, President Donald Trump’s first national security adviser, is in the spotlight for his critical statements on America’s war in Afghanistan.

    His statements prompted an extensive Washington Post investigation, published Monday, that uncovered a candid history of the war that revealed the US government had largely misled the public.

    The Post, stumbling upon a secret government review, found that officials and advisers from the White House and the Pentagon held private reservations about the war even as they publicly peddled an optimistic view of Afghanistan’s progress.

    “From the ambassadors down to the low level, [they all say] we are doing a great job,” Flynn told government investigators, according to documents and audio recordings obtained by The Post. “Really? So if we are doing such a great job, why does it feel like we are losing?”

    Retired US Army Lt. Gen. Michael Flynn, President Donald Trump’s first national security adviser, is in the spotlight for his past statements about America’s war in Afghanistan.

    The Washington Post on Monday said it was those statements, which it received a tip about years ago when Flynn emerged as a prominent campaign surrogate for Trump, that prompted its extensive investigation into the US government’s history of misleading characterizations of the war.

    The full Post report on Monday into what are now dubbed “The Afghanistan Papers” detailed a secret government review in which hundreds of people involved in the war effort were interviewed. Many, including senior officials, were found to have held private reservations about the war effort even as the White House and the Pentagon publicly peddled an optimistic view of Afghanistan’s progress.

    Flynn’s comments about the war, which were made in a November 2015 interview with the Office of the Special Inspector General for Afghanistan Reconstruction but which The Post said it learned about in the summer of 2016, sparked what became a three-year push by The Post to obtain transcripts of interviews like Flynn’s.

    “From the ambassadors down to the low level, [they all say] we are doing a great job,” Flynn told SIGAR investigators, according to documents and audio recordings obtained by The Post. “Really? So if we are doing such a great job, why does it feel like we are losing?”

    “So they all went in for whatever their rotation was, nine months or six months, and were given that mission, accepted that mission and executed that mission,” Flynn added, referring to the mission of newly deployed military leaders. “Then they all said, when they left, they accomplished that mission. Every single commander. Not one commander is going to leave Afghanistan … and say, ‘You know what, we didn’t accomplish our mission.'

    Flynn, who was the intelligence director for the NATO coalition in Afghanistan, had a tenuous relationship with the Obama administration at the time. He was fired from his position as the director of the Defence Intelligence Agency in 2014 after differences with James Clapper, then the Director of National Intelligence.

    “I was fired … after telling a congressional committee that we were not as safe as we had been a few years back,” Flynn wrote in his memoir, “The Field of Fight.”

    Flynn would continue to make disparaging remarks about the Obama administration. He was later tapped by Trump’s 2016 presidential campaign and then served as his national security adviser. He was ousted from that role in less than a month, however, after lying to Vice President Mike Pence about his contact with Russian officials. In 2017, Flynn pleaded guilty to making false statements to the FBI in connection to its investigation of 2016 Russian election meddling. He is expected to be sentenced later this month.

    Jeffrey Eggers, a White House staffer for both Presidents Barack Obama and George W. Bush, also questioned whether the US’s efforts in Afghanistan was paying off after the killing of the Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden in 2011.

    “What did we get for this $US1 trillion effort? Was it worth $US1 trillion,” Eggers, a retired US Navy SEAL, told government investigators.

    “After the killing of Osama bin Laden, I said that Osama was probably laughing in his watery grave considering how much we have spent on Afghanistan,” Eggers added.

    The findings of the government review have been considered incriminating when compared with top US officials’ public statements. John Sopko, the special inspector general for Afghanistan reconstruction, told The Post that the report indicated “the American people have constantly been lied to.”

    More than 2,300 US troops have died in the 18-year war, in addition to more than 3,800 contractors.

    The Defence Department on Monday afternoon denied it had misled Congress or the public.

    “Most of the individuals interviewed spoke with the benefit of hindsight,” Lt. Col. Thomas Campbell said in a statement. “Hindsight has also enabled the Department to evaluate previous approaches and revise our strategy … [the Defence Department] has been very clear that this war will not end on the battlefield.”

    “We remain in Afghanistan to protect our national interests and ensure that Afghanistan is never again used as a safe haven for terrorists who threaten the United States,” Campbell added.
    From yesterday

    https://beforeitsnews.com/politics/2...n-3241998.html

    Quote Regarding Afghanistan and beyond..I believe we have passed the point of salvation for our senior military leaders and politicians _General Flynn
    Monday, August 16, 2021 14:41

    Regarding Afghanistan and beyond; I believe we have passed the point of salvation for our senior military leaders and politicians. We have allowed military and civilian lawyers (read rules of engagement restrictions) to become all powerful and our Generals (indecisive and risk averse) to become nothing more than career seeking politicians. Those are 2 big reasons we have continued to fight and lose wars (we are trained at participating in wars and untrained at winning wars since WWII). AFG is a sad situation, as were the kurds in Iraq, but at least Trump pushed our respect internationally (being tough and smart is better than being tough and stupid). Today I don’t believe America is respected the way we were only a few short months ago. More countries visit China these days than come to the U.S. and China is prepped to recognize the Taliban once they declare the Islamic State simply to embarrass us. My sense is Taiwan is having some incredibly uncomfortable internal discussions (American apathy is likely starting to sink in). As are a lot of US allies in Europe. I also believe China is doing a lot of war gaming of costs and benefits currently with respect to the south China sea and Europe. We are now in a fully engaged information war. Soon it may be worse—I pray our senior military leadership is intensely planning all options—the best plan offers the most options at the last possible moment. So now we wait. Trust me, our enemies are not waiting. They plan and they don’t care about stupid mask policies or fake insurrection BS. Our enemies will be working on the next three vulnerabilities we haven’t even thought about. I believe Russia and China are clear eyed on our corrupt political leadership that they and many other nations no longer respect nor fear. America will come back and soon but it will come at a cost. If the bureaucracy in WDC (esp., DOD, State and the IC) want to keep acting like utopian ideologues, we will lose, if you find your courage, we will win. I say step up, stand up and straighten up your backbones, demand far better from your leaders and let’s start winning again.
    Last edited by mountain_jim; 17th August 2021 at 15:36.
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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    This is interesting. Trump from back in late June both taking full credit for the withdrawal, and acknowledging the obvious that the installed puppet government doesn't stand a chance against the Taliban without US backing.

    Only the first 35 seconds are relative to this thread.

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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...






    also Trump:

    Quote
    What took place yesterday in Afghanistan made our withdrawal from Vietnam look like child’s play. Perhaps in World history, there has never been a withdrawal operation that has been handled so disastrously. A President who has been illegitimately elected has brought great shame, in many ways, to our Country!





    Quote " You forgot “destroy any usable equipment/materials.”

    https://twitter.com/LucasFoxNews/sta...051465732?s=20


    https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitic...kabul-airfield



    Quote And on the question of what actually happens after the August 31 'complete pullout' deadline previously set by Biden, the Pentagon had no answers.

    Kirby's answer when pressed about the ongoing chaotic scenes in Kabul has tended to be simply to shrug it off and say "no plan is perfect".
    Whaat do you mean this is rocket science to idiots?!?? The above is standard protocol, the fact such protocol was broken shows this was deliberate generation of a crisis...its by design


    Last edited by mountain_jim; 17th August 2021 at 18:16.
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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    Hi Gracy May There is a huge difference in the type of exiting strategy. Nobody I know wants to keep Troops in Afghanistan. Trump was solid in his plan for leaving because the exit for leaving was conditioned based. He warned the Taliban exactly what would happen if they didnt comply. Biden broke Trump's timing and he wanted to use 9-11 for some reason and provided no exit strategy.

    A video segment filmed by one of our contractors in Kabul. All the military equipment is all left out for the Taliban.

    start 37 minutes
    Last edited by mojo; 17th August 2021 at 17:56.

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    Default Re: The real truth behind the Taliban that are now in control of Afghanistan...

    I heard rumors that thousands of Americans were left behind after being told to "shelter in place" and I want to know if this is true?

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