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Thread: A karmic story — with a happy ending

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    UK Avalon Founder Bill Ryan's Avatar
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    Default A karmic story — with a happy ending

    Dear Friends, this could easily have been posted in Here and Now...What's Happening?, or even in Spirituality; but re the former, I thought many others might like to comment (and maybe share their own similar experiences), and re the latter, that seemed just a little overblown, though Im sure spiritual forces were at work. So, The Human Condition it is.

    It's a very tiny story. But these mechanisms sometimes run big, and so I'd contend the principles apply no matter what the scale. And those karmic principles aren't the work of some rewarding or punishing external entity, like Jehovah in the Old Testament. I'm 100% certain we do this all ourselves.

    So, let me explain.

    One of the places I regularly hike in the local mountains has a trailhead with the only possible parking place privately owned by a local woman who has a little tienda (shop) at the same spot.

    Sometimes she's there, and sometimes she's not (it often depends on weekends and local holidays), and her fee for parking for any duration in one day is a simple $1.

    Here's where the karmic part starts. When she's NOT there, which is maybe half the time I park there, I always give her the missing $1 next time I see her. Dos días (two days), I tell her, and she always nods and smiles.

    And I always give her my small change, which she appreciates, but when counting pennies, nickels and dimes it's easy to make a mistake. So I always check the amount a second or even a third time, because I always see she doesn't really count it carefully herself.

    I do this very consciously, as a conscious personal principle. I never knew how the karma might play out (one usually doesn't!), but I felt very intuitively that doing the right thing every time (because she'd have no idea if I'd parked there for free when she wasn't present) was some kind of good investment. It just became a habit, and although it was a tiny tiny thing I felt very "clean" about it.

    Yesterday, Mara (my dog) and I had returned from a hike. It was starting to rain heavily, and I also had my mind on a problem I wanted to deal with when I got home. So I quickly bundled my wet dog into my old jeep and headed off down the mountain road. The woman was actually there, so I pushed $1 into her hand, told her Muchas gracias (many thanks) and sped off.

    One the way home, I quickly stopped off in town to buy something. My wallet was still in my backpack, so I looked in the back to fetch it.

    And then I saw that I'd left it behind on the ground in the rain in the parking place. OMG.

    It not only had my wallet with all the $$$$ I'd taken out of the ATM the day before, it had my various cards, my phone, my camera, and my personal locator beacon, a $250 high-tech gadget that connects with a GPS satellite if ever needed... but of course is quite useless if it's not switched on. And that's not to mention my backpack itself, a replacement for which would have cost another $250 or more.

    So I headed back up the mountain road as fast as my old jeep would go. And all the time I was visualizing the safe return of everything I'd left behind. I was well aware of the karmic parking fee thing, so I was optimistic. But I also know that these things are never resolved until they are.

    I arrived back there, an hour an a half after I'd set off in the rain, and it was still pouring. The woman saw my rather unique old jeep straight away, waved to me, stepped into her little shop and produced my pack. It was soaking wet, but totally untouched. Everything was there.

    I was immensely grateful, and asked her to hold out her hand: I gave her all the pocket change I had, which was maybe something like $10-12. She didn't want to take it (though this was a lot of money for her), but I insisted. And so all was well.

    I drove home, rather more slowly, wondering what the outcome would have been if in the past I'd tried to cheat this very honest, simple woman by not giving her the parking fee for the days she was nowhere to be seen.

    Does anyone else have any similar stories, to help illustrate the point either one way or (if you have the courage and magnanimity to share), the other?

    Last edited by Bill Ryan; 12th May 2022 at 14:44.

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    Australia Moderator Harmony's Avatar
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    Default Re: A karmic story — with a happy ending

    What a wonderful story and so glad there was a good ending for everyone. I can imagine the relief you felt.



    I once left my handbag in a shop where I was trying on shoes. I rarely ever take it off my shoulder and have all my important cards and ID inside my wallet and was carrying my weekly $$ for shopping as well. When I got home I realised what had happened and traced in my mind where I had been and the last time I remembred actually seeing my handbag. In the morni;ng I phoned the shop first thing and they went and checked and there was my handbag sitting under the chair where I tried on a pair of shoes., everything intact. I was so grateful, I do try and make sure change etc. I am given is correct and have given $$ back to someone if they have made a mistake, but not at that particular store, so maybe there is something karmic that comes back to us eventually.

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    United States Avalon Member DNA's Avatar
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    Default Re: A karmic story — with a happy ending

    Rather than karma I look at this as a form of energetic armor who's shape and strength correlates with ones actions.

    It's like the house rules of the universe.
    People can see this in a person.
    This woman could see it in you and I'm betting you can see it in her as well.

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    Default Re: A karmic story — with a happy ending

    My intention is NOT to insult anyone with this reply to your thread, Bill. Please, everyone, keep that in mind.

    First of all, I could tell stories about lost items very similar to what you’ve outlined here. They all had the same outcome – a kind person retrieving the item and holding it for someone to claim, without removing cash or other valuables.

    However I have a problem with using karma to explain this. First of all, karma is a word that’s thrown around like a baseball. Few who use the term agree as to what it means exactly, or how it might work. The same can be said about other terminology frequently used in discussions here on the forum. Examples are: soul, frequency, timeline, energetic, out-of-body, lucid dream, and many other loosely defined references. I say this because it’s exasperating to see one member refer to a term in a certain fashion and others use it differently within different contexts. Much is lost in translation simply because there are no hard, fast definitions that exist outside of one esoteric tradition or another. I don’t see a great deal of questioning of terminologies or traditions here on the PA forum, or anywhere, actually. I refer to ‘deep-down-to-fundamental-root-assumptions’ sort of questioning.

    So when it comes to karma it appears that most seem to see it as some sort of cosmic scoreboard. And that makes no sense to me. Especially within the context of your story, Bill. To me it seems like karma is a thought construct that many use to control their life experience. Is this practical or even desirable, especially when it comes to day-to-day minutia such as a lost or displaced item? If karma were in fact operational as a cosmic balancing or scoring system it would need to operate over far greater time spans than day to day events. Obsessively counting coins that you give to the tienda lady reminds me of how I always place an extra coin in a roll when I stuff roles just in case I accidentally miscount. It’s an endearing and love-confirming obsession, no doubt. But is it useful to think in terms of karma here? As if managing every detail of one’s actions is going to assure the outcome that you want in every case when you’re faced with a (potential) hardship? I think it’s better to seek wider perspectives. Thinking of karma in terms of control is just wrong. It’s like cargo-cults building bamboo aircraft.

    Hey, I fully understand that losing that backpack could have created much difficulty for you. But what if someone found that backpack and they kept it for themselves? What if that person was in dire need of the contents, perhaps to save their family from some kind of disaster? Would the loss of that backpack be considered ‘bad’ karma on your part? In fact, under these circumstances it could be argued that one might actually incur a large karmic bonus by letting the backpack go with blessings for whomever may have needed it more than you did, perhaps to save their children’s lives.

    Who is counting karma? Oh, here’s another term that’s used frequently without adequate definition: akashic records.

    From my own point of view definitions and terminologies must be developed across a broad expanse of direct, literal personal experience shared among those who’ve managed to delve deep into the shared relationships that bind us as human.

    A few here know that I’m highly focused on lucid dreaming and OBE’s. One reason that I’ve not been active discussing these too often misunderstood terms is that there are few opportunities to engage in discussions from the standpoint of the fundamental root assumptions necessary for fruitful engagement. The forum format doesn’t lend itself to in-depth discussions, much less defining terms based upon direct experience. I find the term ‘lucid dream’ being used erroneously so often that to respond to a post and point out that someone’s reported ‘lucid’ dream does not in fact fit the academic, scientific correlates, but actually rests upon assumptions that abound on the internet, but are mostly fallacious. To assert that a wider context is required to discuss a particular dream experience will fly in the face of the limits of the medium. Already this post has proven that the ‘medium is the message’ is erroneous when the medium cannot support the message. Unless the message is supposed to be mis-direction via swamping the medium with so much fluff that little can be conveyed to be effective. Welcome to the internet today. But effective in this case means fully engaging with the life-changing evolution of human awakening. Much mis-information is derived from mis-use of the technology via inefficient formatting of the medium.

    Already my post here is far too long for most to bother reading, as many of my other posts have been. There are no links to videos or books that refer to some higher authority on the internet. Hence little attention is drawn to the post. I think of myself as the thread killer. Once I post, threads die out. Not always, but too often to be coincidence.

    A couple of years ago I proposed that we have groups of a limited number of dedicated members that post on specific topics. These groups would remain on topic and dive deep into a predefined topic. An open thread could run concurrently for all members so that there would be feedback to the group. I’d love to see a forum group tackle definitions of loosely-used terms to enlighten the entire community. Karma would be a great place to start. I’d also like to see a group work on a lucid dream/OBE focus so that detailed direct experiences could be used to assist in the discussion without undue references to outside sources.

    I’ve always thought that the Avalon forum could function in part as a bona fide think tank using groups. I know this is sort of off topic, but is it? You’re questioning karma, Bill, and how better to go deep into the subject than to explore it in detail among members who are willing to put in the effort? Simple threads just don’t make it for me. I keep thinking that there needs to be a long-form format for such discussions. And they should be entirely public as in not members-only if possible.

    Granted, there may be something of this nature ongoing and I don’t see it because I don’t log in every day when I read new posts. I’ve become frustrated with the quick-post-video-link format and have pretty much given up on it other than to read and respond to myself with what I cannot share using such a truncated format.

    I see PA as a perfect place for multiple authors to present on-topic, in depth writing based on personal, direct experience that penetrates the chosen topic in the fashion it deserves.

    All that said, I just don’t think that attempting to control one’s life using a concept such as karma is useful.

    In the 80’s and 90’s when we actually had researchers dedicated to understanding lucid dreaming we had two basic factions: one advocated controlling dreams for one’s (perhaps ill-conceived) benefit, and the other functioned as the opposite pole, allowing the dream to unfold while developing an Observer such as found in various meditation techniques. Controlling is limiting in many cases since we are all human and with that we are usually too ignorant to know what to control and when. However, sometimes there are teachers who will emerge and set up situations that demand the dreamer control the dream as a learning technique.

    Same goes for karma, I think. At least in terms of how it appears to be interpreted in your story,
    Bill.

    Not to disappoint anyone, I’ll end with a link to a pdf that speaks to this Observer stance. This is an article appearing in the journal we used among our small cadre of researchers decades ago when we thought we could inform mainstream science via our research activities. I was intimately involved with this group of researchers at the time. Linked is a conversation between Charles Tart and Jayne Gackenbach. Jayne was the leader of the ‘do not control the dream’ pack. Stephen LaBerge was leader of the Take Control! pack. Well, they may not have seen themselves that way. Others like myself did, though.

    https://roam.macewan.ca/islandora/object/gm:2800

    And here are the Lucidity Letter archives:

    https://journals.macewan.ca/lucidity/issue/archive

    To control or not to control, that is the question. But if you choose to control do you know what it is you’re attempting to control? In the above discussion Gackenbach is referencing dreams and Tart is referencing waking life experience (via his book, Waking). Does it make sense to relinquish control in one case (dreaming) and not in the other case (waking)? Aren’t both dedicated learning environments to be respected as such?

    This country I’m loathe to live in at this time is all about control. Don’t hold your breath but I see a possible social scoring system being implemented and ‘they’ might just decide to reference karma to get everyone on board. Good karma will mean a very high score that provides you with resources taken from those with ‘bad’ scores. It’s just another way to create strife between individuals and divide them for more efficient conquering. Everyone under this social scoring system will be operating with one goal – boost the score at all costs by manipulating others beneath them in the social order. Everyone will be judiciously counting the pennies they share to increase karma, thinking that they’ll be safe and nothing bad will happen to them. Yet they’ll be oblivious to the fact that they are exerting control over others less endowed - even if there is no outright evidence that good karma comes at a cost.

    Make sense? Or does the analogy not fit?

    At least I tried. Oh, go away Yoda. I didn’t mean it that way.

    One more item. Your underlying relationship with the tienda woman need not be entirely out of sight in daily life physical terms. Has she appeared in dreams?

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