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Thread: How seeing another country as evil or morally low is an illusion

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    Hong Kong Avalon Member syrwong's Avatar
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    Default How seeing another country as evil or morally low is an illusion

    Yes. You may not want to live in that country. It is your choice, but judging it as depraved, its leaders as tyrants or looking down on its culture is often all in your mind, detached from reality.

    Look at this optical illusion.

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    You are a citizen of country B, the other country is the A square. The checkerboard is the world. In order to know the world you need to see it in a certain light. This light is produced by your government, using the media and your language. So you are basically unaware of other media and information from other countries. This light is biased because it is the state/mass media there is the green cylinder, the filter. It hides without your full awareness your country’s shortcomings and the light concentrates on “exposing” the bad things about country A, which may or may not be true.

    It appears that country A is dark and your country is much brighter. As you can guess both are of equal brightness or darkness. In fact, B is darker than A as you can see from the crops. But you swear that A is darker than B, much so.

    Realizing this and trying to avoid this illusion is important because you may think destroying another country is morally justified, often times from judging wrongly one single person - its leader. This is ridiculous but many people are fooled by it. How to avoid this? I suggest from the illusion you can

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    1. View the world from a different light, from your inner light. Learn other languages and know the country from its culture and people. It is often beneficial to visit the place.

    2. Compensation. Knowing there is strong bias, balance it with actively seeking the truth, and appreciate the good things of other countries. Good things they have your country is lacking. If you know enough of the other country without the guidance of your government, I believe you cannot hate it, or any other country or culture.
    Last edited by syrwong; 31st August 2022 at 16:31.

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    United States Avalon Member onawah's Avatar
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    Default Re: How seeing another country as evil or morally low is an illusion

    Don't be fooled! I think you will find there is a lot of evidence to the contrary when it comes to China.
    But if you live in China, you may not know that because the media is so controlled, and those within China's borders who speak out are in peril of their lives.
    Here's just one recent example:
    China is Not Safe
    240,455 views Aug 30, 2022
    22K
    serpentza
    1.13M subscribers

    "More and more we're seeing evidence of how dangerous it is to be a woman in China, but now the CCP is ferociously trying to hide it...."


    There are a great many such examples in the videos from serpentza (Winston) and from his friend Matt, whose youtube page is here: https://www.youtube.com/c/laowhy86
    As well as on their collabative youtube channel The China Show here: https://www.youtube.com/c/ADVPodcasts
    I've been posting their videos (and others) regularly for 2 years now on the Turmoil in China thread:
    https://projectavalon.net/forum4/sho...rmoil-in-China
    These two men spent a lot of years traveling all around China, and they speak from direct experience.
    They also made a lot of connections while they were there with various Chinese citizens, secret whistleblowers who still keep them informed now that they are no longer living in China.
    They both married Chinese women whom they met in China, which gives them even more direct experience with the Chinese people and their family life.
    I find them to be very credible, compassionate, but also truthful in their treatment of the Chinese people, who have been so brainwashed and victimized by the CCP for so long, and they offer lots of proof to verify their claims, so they don't insult our intelligence.
    I think it's very instructive for Westerners in particular to see what is really going on in China, because the global elite have set the CCP as the example of what they would like to see happening globally via The Great Reset.
    Not to say that terrible atrocities are not being committed in countries all over the world, but China is one that really needs watching because the CCP are very hostile to other nations as well as their own people.
    Though they will do practically anything to "save face" and hide their nefarious activities from the rest of world.
    Last edited by onawah; 1st September 2022 at 05:44.
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    Hong Kong Avalon Member syrwong's Avatar
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    Default Re: How seeing another country as evil or morally low is an illusion

    Quote Posted by onawah (here)
    Don't be fooled! I think you will find there is a lot of evidence to the contrary when it comes to China.
    But if you live in China, you may not know that because the media is so controlled, and those within China's borders who speak out are in peril of their lives.
    Here's just one recent example:
    China is Not Safe
    240,455 views Aug 30, 2022
    22K
    serpentza
    1.13M subscribers

    "More and more we're seeing evidence of how dangerous it is to be a woman in China, but now the CCP is ferociously trying to hide it...."


    There are a great many such examples in the videos from serpentza (Winston) and from his friend Matt, whose youtube page is here: https://www.youtube.com/c/laowhy86
    As well as on their collabative youtube channel The China Show here: https://www.youtube.com/c/ADVPodcasts
    I've been posting their videos (and others) regularly for 2 years now on the Turmoil in China thread:
    https://projectavalon.net/forum4/sho...rmoil-in-China
    These two men spent a lot of years traveling all around China, and they speak from direct experience.
    They also made a lot of connections while they were there with various Chinese citizens, secret whistleblowers who still keep them informed now that they are no longer living in China.
    They both married Chinese women whom they met in China, which gives them even more direct experience with the Chinese people and their family life.
    I find them to be very credible, compassionate, but also truthful in their treatment of the Chinese people, who have been so brainwashed and victimized by the CCP for so long, and they offer lots of proof to verify their claims, so they don't insult our intelligence.
    I think it's very instructive for Westerners in particular to see what is really going on in China, because the global elite have set the CCP as the example of what they would like to see happening globally via The Great Reset.
    Not to say that terrible atrocities are not being committed in countries all over the world, but China is one that really needs watching because the CCP are very hostile to other nations as well as their own people.
    Though they will do practically anything to "save face" and hide their nefarious activities from the rest of world.
    I am not discounting that the world is very complicated and many countries are controlled by evil forces. The evil forces want world division, sow hatred between peoples and cultures and the destruction of anything they think redundant. I am pointing out a simple mechanism probably used by the evil forces, with which this can be achieved. It is quite possible that once the delustions were form, for instance that Saddam or Gadaffi were tyrants, it is very difficult to remove it. It is best to be aware of this mechanism to get an objective view of world politics.

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    Default Re: How seeing another country as evil or morally low is an illusion

    Quote Posted by syrwong (here)
    Realizing this and trying to avoid this illusion is important because you may think destroying another country is morally justified, oftentimes from judging wrongly one single person - its leader. This is ridiculous but many people are fooled by it. How to avoid this? I suggest from the illusion you can

    1. View the world from a different light, from your inner light. Learn other languages and know the country from its culture and people. It is often beneficial to visit the place.

    2. Compensation. Knowing there is strong bias, balance it with actively seeking the truth, and appreciate the good things of other countries. Good things they have your country is lacking. If you know enough of the other country without the guidance of your government, I believe you cannot hate it, or any other country or culture.
    Mark Twain (Samuel Langhorne Clemens) was a writer and humourist that lived in from 1835 until 1910 and he pretty agreed with what you are saying.




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    United States Avalon Member onawah's Avatar
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    Default Re: How seeing another country as evil or morally low is an illusion

    There is also such a thing as constructive criticism.
    While not everyone can afford to travel to and live in other countries, many now can surf the internet and learn a lot about other countries through the world wide web, through movies made in other countries, and through long distance communication with people from other parts of the world, so there is much more mutual understanding among individuals as a result.
    But at the same time, those same channels of communication are being used for nationalist propaganda, censorship, mind control and brainwashing.
    More than ever, individuals must learn to develop discernment so they can sort the truth from the lies.
    But as is clear, many still choose to take the path of least resistance and just "go along to get along".
    The truth may not pad our comfort zone, but it will help to set us free if we are ready for that.
    Last edited by onawah; 2nd September 2022 at 00:48.
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    UK Avalon Member Mike Gorman's Avatar
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    Default Re: How seeing another country as evil or morally low is an illusion

    I experienced a wake up call concerning prejudice, pre judging an entire country based on impressions rather than first-hand experience when I taught English to South Korean school kids way back in 2000 (nearly 23 years ago, aint that something?). I had become jaded with life at this point and I answered a 'newspaper advert' (remember those?) about graduates being employed in Seoul to teach English, I had little knowledge of South Korea at this point, beyond the awareness the Americans had basically set up a huge military base there and helped the country to re-build after the Korean war in 1953; I expected a massive American influence and this was borne out.
    For a mature teacher with an Australian/British accent it was a strange experience, all of the teaching materials were American in emphasis, the audio teaching aids were all American accents, and the kids expected American English, I am definitely not American so the kids reacted to me differently.
    Anyway, this was the first time I had ever felt like the 'Foreigner' - it was a bizarre feeling, walking along the city streets and not seeing any western faces, this gave me a keen appreciation for displaced people and how it must feel, to be very much alone in a strange culture.
    South Korea has no old buildings, they are all 1950's/60's brutalist architecture, people tend to live in apartment blocks that are typical of 1960's project building, because of the war, infrastructure had to be rebuilt.
    Overhead big military helicopters are a common sight, I listened to the U.S military radio stations in the evenings, classic rock mostly.
    South Korean people are very determined, and proud, while I was there they celebrated the day Hiroshima was nuked, this is a public holiday, South Koreans dislike Japan intensely, really dislike.
    This was an educational experience for me, short lived but intense.

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    Default Re: How seeing another country as evil or morally low is an illusion

    Quote Posted by onawah (here)
    There is also such a thing as constructive criticism.
    While not everyone can afford to travel to and live in other countries, many now can surf the internet and learn a lot about other countries through the world wide web, through movies made in other countries, and through long distance communication with people from other parts of the world, so there is much more mutual understanding among individuals as a result.
    But at the same time, those same channels of communication are being used for nationalist propaganda, censorship, mind control and brainwashing.
    More than ever, individuals must learn to develop discernment so they can sort the truth from the lies.
    But as is clear, many still choose to take the path of least resistance and just "go along to get along".
    The truth may not pad our comfort zone, but it will help to set us free if we are ready for that.
    Viewing the world through the web appears to be a good alternative to travel, but it is not a replacement. The illusion I talk about includes this because the web is used predominantly as a media and most media are manipulated (think who owns them). For instance, if you get all of your covid information from Youtube, you are trying to know all about covid from Youtube, which could be worse than knowing nothing. Moreover, the web is highly compartmentalized by language. If you know Russian, for example, you will certainly form a very different view of say Iran or N. Korea than from the English sources. Imagine if this forum has many more people from different countries talking about their country's response to covid, we would have a greater understanding of the manipulation. The illusion I talk about is very hard to break but the first step is to know it is encompassing.

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    Default Re: How seeing another country as evil or morally low is an illusion

    When I see the globe at the top banner of Avalon I don't see any countries. Must be an optical illusion too.

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    Default Re: How seeing another country as evil or morally low is an illusion

    Quote Posted by dim (here)
    When I see the globe at the top banner of Avalon I don't see any countries. Must be an optical illusion too.
    The world would be better if there is no concept of a country. To the ancient Chinese, there were no countries surrounding them, only nomad people and their world view was quite cosmopolitan, exemplified in the Tang Dynasty when merchants and people from the far west were quite welcomed and the Arabs, Islam etc blended in easily to the Chinese culture. Same as the American Indians, no concept of country and they gathered at the beaches and cliffs to welcome Columbus. To them there was only land and people, no tariff and travel restrictions.

    Now countries are prominent to the largest degree, people define themselves by country. Countries against each other and peoples hate each other. What we see and anticipate is greater separation, greater restriction, less liberty as in travel, only to be rationalized by covid. The eventuality is likely self destruction of the world.
    Last edited by syrwong; 3rd September 2022 at 06:51.

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    Aaland Avalon Member Agape's Avatar
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    Default Re: How seeing another country as evil or morally low is an illusion

    “The world would be better if there is no concept of a country”.

    100% agreeable statement from my perspective. I don’t believe in “countries” either. We take refuge in them mostly because there is no other plausible option and realistic view on makings of current humanity has not transpired.
    On grass roots level people think similar ways no matter where you go.

    I try to remind people that “the place we live on” is not a country but a Planet. We share the same global ecosystem and weather, we use the same water and other elements of nature in order to survive and enjoy our individual evolution.

    More than half of the worlds populace is stuck in their past and faith in their ancestral history , often nourished by very poor, limited education in certain areas of history, geography and the rest of sciences so in turn they turn themselves to either form of bigotry , religiously or not, makes the same sense for that purpose.

    While consciousness in all its higher aspects is non local and without solid centre, you could say dispersed and connected to the Universal consciousness of Life,
    much of the old generational discussion starts and ends with “but we ..” or “I” know it better and “we have suffered the most”.
    Every such consciousness fixed on illusion of “I am important” automatically misreads or is practically deaf to validity of other beings because it fails ( and always will) to validate itself as real and the “most advanced/smartest” of all so in that subliminal egotistic grip and struggle for supremacy among humans everyone else are seen as “3rd class citizens who need to prove themselves to be equal”.
    Equal to whom , begs the question but again there is no logical, physical even metaphysical answer to that question.

    When most defence mechanisms of an individual are exhausted most human males start beating themselves in chest in manner of well mannered orangutan or start burning the bush around to mark their territory.

    There is absolutely no difference in that atavistic mechanism among human populace around the world no matter what class, nationality and other attributes that particular human or their ancestors claimed.
    It’s the very same reason for every country spending most of their income of defense budget.


    To be even little practical with my opinion : India was portrayed as “wild and barbarian” country by the occupying British Empire for nearly 200 years of not so ancient history, brutally exploited and suppressed in eyes of other nations where it concerned its true knowledge and culture base dating back uninterruptedly for thousands of years.

    74 years after occupation global consciousness and young generations started to “pick up” rapidly and ancient philosophical resources such as Vedas are being mined, quoted together with the rich lore of legends ( Puranas) by researchers all over the world because -and after all- anyone capable of deeper philosophical insight are equally entitled to gnosis.
    So does science of this century slowly but meticulously approve and discuss with science preserved and practiced by forgotten ancestors and civilizations,
    while this is clear to the informed and knowledgable,
    it is still an eye opener to people with limited education and interest and “Bs” to the bigots.

    Would be wonderful news if ..the majority of people in India did not suffer from famines and long term effects of post traumatic stress disorder following their humiliating colonial past. You may say, the situation of many African countries is much worse but yet ..

    the pattern of someone’s else dominance and supremacy - forced subjugation - settles . Together with fake smiles that only photographers approve as genuine and titles of aristocratic character applied casually and globally as they proliferated long ago ,
    theatrical poses of “dames” and Masonic clubs of modern knights ,
    equality of well payed actors who can play it perfectly if they are well payed at any time.

    How much of its ancient history and knowledge base did China lose after communist takeover and Maos cultural revolution ?

    Did common citizen ever notice the whole scheme was copied from Russia, respectively from its leaders who were renegade Jews in fact.

    How much was destroyed in the name of modernization and loyalty to “modern world” around us.

    How could anyone truly “hate the people”?

    Here in the Himalayan regions people have always travelled to both sides of the grandiose mountains and were brothers and sisters to each other for literally thousands of years of their history.
    What a shame there is any problem created about it now while the world is getting over populated and more borders pose just more problems.

    To anyone with straight logic has to be clear by now that the world is not going to return to any sort of “past” and where ever you would wish to “return” yourself or others does not exist anymore.

    Without clear logic human society can not move forwards.

    There is no one who want “to return” to some kind of childhood on this Planet or hope other people would unless they are partially mentally retarded or worse,
    hope that other people are mentally retarded that way.

    Everyone capable of learning deserve their evolution path because it helps the world and every society the most.
    And it isn’t only education for education itself that is important , it is practical learning and evolution of consciousness through direct contact and communication, empathy, counseling human issues in either field that makes us part of this world rather than isolation and “holding to old stale opinions” and knowledge pressed into individuals 50 years ago .

    I also see clear solution to the worst humanitarian crisis we are prospectively facing anytime during this century is dissolving borders and passports rather than enacting new ones.

    I also know that human society is still wild and barbarian , if not for lack of education then for its spoiled eating and dining habits.
    While most animals have been killed for food in matter of mere 200 years , more or less, humans became the predators , the animal power to fight , more aggressive on inside, wolves in sheep clothing, so difficult to trust.

    Who is feeding these human wolves and predators then governments of this world, entertainment seeking governments , the hunger games overlords.

    In either case , individual and social evolution happen in quantum leaps , not by so called “everyday effort” as some low philosophers maimed people to believe so the time will come for new generations of humans to decide about their fate.

    Till then, never give up on study. The only property we can take from this life to any other life is not material in elemental sense , it’s the amount of information and wisdom we have collected and assimilated.

    Never give up on the path of knowing including the deepest possible sense of knowing the truth, our ability to recognize truth from fiction , right from wrong and knowing each other.
    Leave agnostic philosophy its only due place as scientific method.

    Do not take it home or experiment on your friends. No one deserves to be a subject of someone’s random experimentation and egotistic evolution path, try to get through to the other people over the hill just to make sure they are the same smart and lovable.

    Reject hypocrisy and racism of any kind.

    🙏🥀🙏
    Last edited by Agape; 3rd September 2022 at 08:53.

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    United States Avalon Member onawah's Avatar
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    Default Re: How seeing another country as evil or morally low is an illusion

    Unfortunately, it seems that a great many of the world "leaders" now are very corrupt, and you can't really get an objective view of world politics unless you realize that.
    Some are worse than others, of course, but politics as a whole just seems to get dirtier and dirtier.
    I think the bigger problem is that most people are still largely unaware of just how dirty, and get stuck in the trap of thinking the lesser of two evils is actually a viable choice.
    It would be great if there was more of a unified global consciousness, and though that what the NWO professes it would do, it wouldn't achieve that at all, it would only keep the people dumbed down and living in fear.
    In the process, it would destroy much that is unique in the worlds' many cultures, as Mao did in China, and that would be tragic.
    The CCP would have the Chinese believe that Mao was a great hero when in fact he was responsible for the deaths of millions of his own people, and they have not recovered yet from the trauma.

    Quote Posted by syrwong (here)

    I am not discounting that the world is very complicated and many countries are controlled by evil forces. The evil forces want world division, sow hatred between peoples and cultures and the destruction of anything they think redundant. I am pointing out a simple mechanism probably used by the evil forces, with which this can be achieved. It is quite possible that once the delustions were form, for instance that Saddam or Gadaffi were tyrants, it is very difficult to remove it. It is best to be aware of this mechanism to get an objective view of world politics.
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