Peeling the onion - discovering Denial.

[Pam]

Posted by Miller (here)

Posted by Matthew (here)

How the ego turns hurtful... But what about when the ego functions as it should without being hurtful? How tempting is it to project our own failings onto this perpetrator called the ego. Almost sounds like the ego is hurtful not the person.

As for "On the EGO by Osho." it says ego is evil. I wouldn't be so cruel myself, because your ego is you. It's like saying my hands are evil.

This is an interesting point and relates to a comment on another thread by Pam, which was to the effect that our microbes sometimes dictate our behaviour because of their own needs. How much of our behaviour is "them" and not "us" (not that it would stand up in Court I'm sure )

I'm not even sure why I added that , it was off topic really but we, in our bodily form are very vulnerable. Only that which observes is consistent. The ego is , in my experience , like an over indulged child that wants to be the center of attention. Our body is always changing. At the bodily level we are a conglomerate of billions of independent little lives. Each with their own need. What is it that is consistent? The observer. A couple years ago, I was Pam, the righteously indignant (at times). Now I am Pam the one that cries and feels empathy that is unbearable but still wants to save that which is impossible to save. That goal alone keeps the ego relevant. At least I recognize that. There was a day when I wouldn't. My lessons at this time are that I don't control the natural world, I am not wiser than the order of things and I will not save or fix anyone.

I have relapsed on that goal with obsession with a lame doe.

[Mari]

Posted by Pam (here)

Posted by Pam (here)

Posted by Ewan (here)
Hi Matthew,

I fear we are not understanding one another. I wonder if it would help if I trimmed Pam's original post down to just.. 'I would love to know if they really, really believe this, or just are too fearful, arrogant, programmed or proud to know that what she is saying is ridiculous?'

The ego I am talking about, and went to some length to describe, is quite happy taking the lead role and espousing whatever opinion it holds to be true at that time, in this case probably the official mantra. The Dr. meanwhile is still in the back of the carriage and oblivious to this as the ego blocks it from her view. (See my own experience with suddenly seeing something right in front of me which I had been totally blind to mere minutes before). The Dr. is following the ego's lead because she hasn't found herself yet. She hasn't begun to awaken. They're simply a follower.

And yes, you cannot function very well without an ego in the three dimensions. The question is are you following the ego, blindly, or is the ego a part of a greater self that doesn't rule the roost any more?

Yes we have to take responsibility for our opinions if we are espousing them as advice, if we are keeping them to ourselves the only person we can harm, assuming our opinions are bat-sh1t crazy, is our own progress.

Its all an ego problem. You can reframe it any way you like it is still an ego problem. I fully agree with the stages of denial. I've been through them more than once, they get easier and swifter to process.

I didn't label the topic medical denial, simply denial. I don't believe there is an abuse of trust if the Dr's stating their opinions are blind to the truth - a very different matter if they become aware and keep espousing the same opinions to protect their status/security whatever. (Psychopaths excel at this, Fauci et al).

That is more than an abuse of trust, its downright criminal. But as Wade Frazier often points out, and correctly I have concluded, one of the biggest problems with humanity is a lack of integrity.

Very interesting thread, Ewan. I spent years and I mean years as an avid student of Echart Tolle and mistakenly looked at any form of ego as the enemy. I worked and worked on eradicating it. I did gain much from this experience. I learned that the ego is actually just a tool. I need some form of identity to navigate in this reality and an ego or persona is appropriate. The problem arises as I see it when it is no longer a tool but the master. Where I believe my thoughts and understanding are fact and I need to act on that.

I used to literally believe my thoughts were reality. Now I understand and can recognize many times that the ego is creating a narrative to keep me separate so it maintains relevance.I can now go for long periods without thinking about anything other than what I am doing. The imbalanced ego needs drama so it creates thought forms. I realize I don't have to act on them at all. In fact they will pass if I don't energize them. They will float away, that simple. I definitely have not mastered this 100% of the time but I continue to practice recognizing when the ego is wanting drama to validate it exists. One of my personal main issues and I have said this several times on the forum is a tendency of the ego to want to create a scenario where I can mentally obsess with some story line that allows me to feel righteous indignation. I am now aware of it so I can choose to let it go.

Seeing the ego as "the enemy" and total eradication of it is like a dog chasing his tail. But recognition of it and realizing that I don't need to act on it has been a huge game changer for me. But living hell, at least for me was believing all of my thoughts. I believe that cognitive dissonance that is baked into our culture to allow us to do all sorts of things that are insane and actually believe them.

Also, It takes a lot of courage to realize you have been totally duped. I have spent the last few years seeing the absurdity of so much of my life and the craziness of much of what I accepted as truth. If your ego has a strong enough hold on you and you believe your thoughts as always true it would be very easy to totally have blinders on because the ego does not want you doubt it if it is imbalanced and running the show.

It would be much more acceptable for the Doctor to believe the absurd than to admit maybe she made some mistakes, maybe she was wrong. Maybe her career is not so noble as she wanted to believe. Maybe she is playing a role of worldwide genocide. Not to mention cancel culture. So her ego tells her that a common cold caused myocarditis and she may be able to add to mental confirmations that is was a really bad strain of the cold virus.

Understanding the role of the ego and understanding the empathy, narcissism spectrum have really made all this insanity easier to understand.

I just had to come back and share this. I think it is a confirmation of a universe that is very aware of each of us. It is kind of funny and a great example of what I called the unbalanced ego, which I do believe plays a huge role in denial, along with cognitive dissonance.

I gave a personal example of my own inclination to want to create my identity with righteous indignation. I did not make clear the fact, that having righteous indignation might be perfectly appropriate. It's when the story get's played in my head over and over to create the original feelings of it.

This morning I needed to go to the store and there is a volunteer group callled "Friends of the Library" that has been here a long time. I think they used to sell only old library books but they have expanded to take books from people that donate them. I have been there twice. The first time I asked a question about whether there are any kinds of books they don't want. I was met with an eye roll like I was brain dead and a kind of smart ass remark. I explained that I thought they might already have too many of some topics so I was just checking. The volunteer annoyingly told me what they don't take.

They accept books on Mondays and Wednesdays between 9 and noon. I pull up and it says closed but I see people in there so I hopped out of the car and opened the door and asked if they are accepting books today. This place is huge and there must have been 8 volunteers in there. Several right in front of me. A woman comes bolting up from the back of the store. I can see she is angry, almost shaking with anger. Instead of telling me that this particular Wednesday they would not be accepting books she gets right in my face and asks me to read the sign on the door. I read it . It looks like the same sign on orange paper. When I read it, even though I knew it only accepted books on Monday and Wednesday I said Monday through Wednesday. This sent the woman into a even greater state of anger. Correcting me that they do not take them on Tuesday, which I said I realized I simply misspoke. She is screaming at this point. She apparently duplicated the regular sign but had added in small print that they would not be accepting books on 2/8. She wants me to read this out loud, which I didn't. Then she goes on a tirade about before I tell her the website says they are open on these days she had added that it would not be open today and she should know, she handles the website. It was just insane. The other volunteers have their heads down...

Next I did what I love to do in these kind of situations, I smiled at her and thanked her for the great job they are doing on the bookstore. This was not what she wanted. She wanted me to retaliate so she could feel "guess what" righteous indignation at the stupid people that donate books and can't read signs ect. I left her speechless and she looked like a fool.

I could see her narrative is she is a hard working volunteer and people are so stupid or whatever it is and I didn't play the game of getting angry. From a few other things she said a few people had been unhappy to have driven the books down and been turned away by this very nasty lady.

I felt the humor of the universe and actually left chuckling to myself as I got a great example of a ego that is driving the narrative and creating a reality that allows it to feel righteous indignation, or maybe that people are stupid. Even though it means being miserable, she's going with that narrative.

Whatever it is, it was such a perfect example. Instead of enjoying her day volunteering she was creating a reality that was making her so angry and indignant I wouldn't be surprised if she had a heart attack. All of this because someone did not read the sign. It's also interesting to note that the added closure for the day was very small. I don't carefully read a businesses hours before entering. I wonder if subconsciously she kind of set that up. And her eagerness to be the one to teach me to read a sign before I ask questions was just crazy stuff.

The other thing is, the behavior was so over the top,I mean it was comical but it makes me wonder are the vaccines effecting her behavior. I haven't known her but that was bizarre.....anyway I just had to share a great example of the lengths the ego will go when it is running the show versus being a tool that is managed.I bet she believes every thought she has is the gospel truth.
Crazy world....

Good post. The trouble with people's 'explosions', is that it's very rarely personal - not really about you at all. They are simply coming from that screwed-up/pain driven/angst ridden place deep inside them that they are in denial of. I suspect, having a good guess at this, is that the 'woman who comes bolting up from the back of the store' would, deep down, like nothing more than to drop the 'rules BS' that she feels she has to work under. 'Nasty' people rarely love or even like, their jobs, so the pain-driven part of them will seek an outlet wherever it can.