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Thread: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    Thanks Shaberon. This will take time to absorb and be able to make any intelligent response. Thank you, it is a lot of work to submit this.

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    Quote Posted by Applesprig (here)
    This will take time to absorb and be able to make any intelligent response.


    It does.

    It is like complete re-education; and this sadly is in comparison to other places in the world that "never forgot" their lessons.

    But these days I have a Catholic Zionist president. Neither position is tenable. We see what is happening and how false and ineffective is this mindset. I am supposed to be "represented" but it will just steal my money and mock me, in the process of making what I see around me, which is far from impressive. It certainly is not "a culture" or anything representing a group of like-minded individuals.


    And yet we found that when Coptic and Orthodox authorities get together these days, they cannot figure out for sure if they really have a dispute. They are so much the same that they could not put a difference into words. However, they clearly do say that anything else is a false representation of Christ, and so it is not possible to reconcile anything with "denominations".

    Well, from the Buddhist view, a very similar belief is held on Maitreya. Then if you open almost any kind of theosophical or new age book, you are going to get a false representation.


    Buddhism is compatible enough with Orthodoxy, since neither one is trying to represent the other person. I am not sure you could legitimately practice both, what I mean is there is no reason for them to be inherently at odds with each other. There are tons of reasons why neither wants a distortion.


    Then we saw there is such a thing as "Iranian Hinduism" that happened before "Zoroastrianism".

    Checking into it I notice a couple things that did not quite come out right in original Theosophy. I should say incomplete. The limitation I have found in any Theosophical groups is that they can only quote what HPB or the Mahatmas said, but, let me add one to the set, she said "I am not infallible".

    She perhaps has one serious error, and then there are a few areas that are like fuzzy leads.


    In the last reply I put a question mark where I thought it might be some interpreter's mistake.

    Instead, it is correct in the Avestan original, which means they know what we didn't think anybody knew. The "Ahura" deity was said to be cognate to "asura" because they are using it in the Vedic sense. According to HPB:


    In the earlier Vedas, asura is especially used for Varuna, the ruler of the heavenly sphere. “The Mazdean Scriptures of the Zend Avesta, the Vendidad and others correct and expose the later cunning shuffling of the gods in the Hindu Pantheon, and restore through Ahura the Asuras to their legitimate place in Theogony . . .” (SD 2:60-1).


    Primarily in the Rig-Veda, the ‘Asuras’ are shown as spiritual divine beings; their etymology is derived from asu (breath), the ‘Breath of God,’ and they mean the same as the Supreme Spirit or the Zoroastrian Ahura.


    Further, the asuras “are the sons of the primeval Creative Breath at the beginning of every new Maha Kalpa, or Manvantara; in the same rank as the Angels who had remained ‘faithful.’ These were the allies of Soma (the parent of the Esoteric Wisdom) as against Brihaspati (representing ritualistic or ceremonial worship).


    Asura is used in the earliest Vedic literature as a title of the cosmic hierarch or supreme spirit. The Vedic Asura is nothing other than the Great Breath of archaic occult literature — the Great Breath coming and going as manvantara and pralaya.


    Varuna is the acme or summit of akasa-tattva...


    True enough. The root "asu" gives us:


    1) Breath; मीनगन्ध्यसु- गन्धेन कुर्वन्ती मार्गदूषणम् (mīnagandhyasu- gandhena kurvantī mārgadūṣaṇam) Bhāgavata 6.13.13; life, spiritual life; Ṛgveda 15.1.1.


    The thing is she then just chalked it up to "degraded religion" as to why an "asura" is now a "demon". Again this is close to the worst possible misunderstanding. It is actually from another genre of literature, Puranic. Primarily, it is a completely different name. But this is simple since the definition shows it for Asura:


    1) Living, alive, spiritual.

    2) An epithet of the Supreme Spirit or Varuṇa.

    3) Incorporeal, super-human, divine.



    However, the next is a sort of nickname which is given to specific families or classes:


    Asura (असुर).—Those born to Kaśyapa of his wife Danu are called Dānavas and those born of his wife Diti are called Daityas. They belong to the demonaic dynasty (Refer under 'Asuravaṃśa' in the genealogy chart). Renowned among the asuras were the following:

    Prahlāda, Saṃhlāda, Anuhlāda, Śibi, Bāṣkala, Virocana, Kumbha, Nikumbha, Bali, Bāṇa...


    ...a fallen angel, a Titan.

    Asuras are not earthly demons but celestial beings of a kind like other demi-gods, namely Yakśa, Gandharva, Kinnara, Kimpuruśa etc.



    This name is a negation, since it means, in fact, they lost something:


    Surā (सुरा) and Soma (सोम): These were the principal drinks of the Ṛgvedic Aryans.

    Surā (सुरा, “liquor”):—Daughter of Varuṇa, who is the presiding deity of the invisible world and represents the inner reality of things.

    Sura (सुर) refers to an epithet of the Devas, appointed to them after they accepted Surā (Goddess Vāruṇī), according to the Brahmāṇḍa-purāṇa 4.9.66-69. Accordingly, “when the ocean of Milk was once again churned by the Devas and Dānavas, goddess Vāruṇī with tremulous eyes on account of inebriety, rose up even as the Siddhas in the firmament began to think—‘What is this’? She smilingly stood in front of the Asuras. The Daityas did not accept her. Therefore, they became Asuras. They were given the appellation Asura in the sense ‘Those who do not have Surā (liquor)’ Thereupon, she stood in front of Devas. On the direction given by Parameṣṭhin (Brahmā) Devas joyously accepted her. In view of the fact that they accepted Surā, they became glorified by the appellation Sura”.



    There are variations, but that one is typical.

    Such Asuras are much less like "demons", and correspond more to the Greek Titans.

    I am going to add a little bit here and this is because there is more to say about the Zodiac, which kind of needs these ideas first.



    The Vedas themselves are very abstract and flowery. The purpose of the Puranas is to arrange it into more of a coherent story. There are eighteen major ones, which are all basically the same story, with regional or sectarian differences and greater or lesser descriptions. India's national epics, the Ramayana and Mahabharata were all originally hand-made, and no two have ever been found alike.


    Philosophically, Diti is "bounded space", not quite dense material it doesn't seem, but, ideation which can form definite shapes and so forth.

    Diti's first two children, the Indian Titans, are killed by Vishnu in animal guise, at first as a Lion:



    Hiraṇyakaśipu was killed by Narasiṃha.

    Viṣṇu having the form of a boar killed Hiraṇyākṣa.


    She has others and:


    In the battle between Devas and Asuras for the possession of Amṛta, Diti’s sons were killed.

    That leads to the next episode of the fetus that Indra shreds, which becomes the Maruts.


    Another breed of Titans is the children of Danu called Danavas:


    Sumbha, Nisumbha

    Rāhu and Ketu

    Mayasura wrote the astronomical treatise called the Surya Siddhānta that forms the basis of Indian astronomy even today!


    And perhaps the most important one:


    Vritra


    Vritra ("cover, obstacle") is also known in the Vedas as Ahi (Sanskrit: अहि ahi, lit. "snake"). He appears as a human-like serpent blocking the course of the Rigvedic rivers, and is slain by Indra with his newly-forged vajra.


    The combat began soon after Indra was born, and he consumed a large volume of Soma at Tvashtri's house to empower him before facing Vritra. Tvashtri fashioned the thunderbolt (Vajrayudha) for Indra, and Vishnu, when asked to do so by Indra, made space for the battle by taking the three great strides, for which Vishnu became famous, and was later adapted in his legend of Vamana.


    In the Pali Canon, Vritra is alluded to when the Buddha addresses Śakra with the title "Vatrabhū."


    Obviously, even the older Buddhist texts are conversant with the plot. This Titan is associated with "drought", he "holds the waters", so it may be indicating a stage of the earth being molten and water trapped as steam in the atmosphere, since the Vishnu Boar epoch is the cooling of the crust.

    Vishnu's pre-human incarnations should look oddly resonant of the Flood Myth:


    1. Matsya, the giant fish

    2. Kurma, the giant tortoise.

    3. Varaha, the giant boar.

    4. Narasimha, the half-man and half-lion.

    5. Vamana, infinity in a dwarf body
    Vamanavatar is the first incarnation which is clearly mentioned in the Vedas in association with the name of Vishnu, a solar deity (Aditya).


    Indra is the eldest Aditya, Vamana the youngest.

    Vamana, so to speak, fills all space, including our material globe, with consciousness of Vishnu, and Indra does something to release Water.


    Even if one wishes to call him a demon, by killing him, Indra was guilty of the priest-killing sin Brahmahatya:


    As Vritra died, a ghastly woman emerged from his mouth. She was naked. She had wild hair and fangs and a terrifying demeanour. She roared as she chased Indra through the three worlds. Eventually, she found him hidden in a lotus stalk and when she enveloped him, he became totally paralysed.

    The gods went to Brahma and asked him to secure Indra’s release from this terrible creature. He told them that the woman was Brahmahatya, the personified sin of killing a brahmin, a sin which was now attached to Indra because he had killed Vritra. Since she could not go back to where she had come from, Brahmahatya said she would release Indra if Brahma gave her a place to stay.


    This whole tale is briefly summarized and then Indra builds a Palace in the explanation of Multiple Brahmas.


    There is only one major Brahma Temple called Pushkar Temple:


    When Indra incurs the guilt of killing brahman by slaying Tvastri’s son. Nashusha shall acquire the kingdom and shall desire Indrani.


    Finally for Indra:


    After Nahuṣa had been forced to go back to the earth as a serpent by the curse of Agastya, the Devas brought back Indra. At that time, Aṅgiras praised Indra with mantras from Atharvaveda. From that day Aṅgiras got the name of 'Atharvāṅgiras'.



    The general description is that Brahma creates a world and Indra governs it. And then even in India normally there is no such thing as Creator worship:


    Brahmā was also worshiped by many Dānavas and he had granted many Dānavas a boon to increase their power. Dānava Virupakṣa together with the Daityas and the Vighnas, said these words, "...you who are the first progenitor of the world, to whom the Devas and Daityas owe their origin." Because Brahma had granted so many boons to the Asuras and this creates problems for the Devas as the Linga Purāṇa says. Hence, there is a legend that Brahma is not worshiped as God anymore because he granted boons surreptitiously to Asuras.




    There are, perhaps, further reasons, but this is one of the few other specific mentions of Danavas. And one of the only other times we hear of them is at the same Brahma Temple:



    Of it the Mahabharata says, "It is there that the Devas, Daityas, and Brahmin seers mortified themselves and possessed of great merit, achieved divine yoga...In that same ford swells forever and most joyously the Grandfather by the Devas and Dānavas.


    I am going to suggest this Pushkar is very important in the psycho-spiritual sense.

    But it is not Creator worship.


    Subba Row in talking about Libra called it the Tattvas with the main meaning that one may be Bound or Liberated. A "tattva" is an aspect of Tat -- "That". The way this word works grammatically is actually a lot like the Buddhist term "Tathata", "Thusness":


    tā forms abstracts of quality, tva forms abstracts of office or function, state or condition, and of the stages or periods of life; tā thus answering to -ness, tva to ship and hood ("kingship", "childhood").


    Virgo is in fact represented everywhere in Nepal as the Hexagram of education, science, and goddess Sarasvati.





    So there is something even more interesting about the Zodiac, in an Indo-European shared sense, that is probably a heavy slab of material for another post.


    This bit of The Secret Doctrine has a misprint--Enos is the son of Seth, and Enoch is a few generations later--but it does have an approximate rationale of relating Vaivasvata to Enoch:



    ...after separating himself as Adam-Kadmon into Adam
    and Eve in the formless, and into Cain-Abel in the semi-objective, world,
    he became finally the Jah-Havah, or man and woman, in Enoch, the son of
    Seth.

    For, the true meaning of the compound name of Jehovah--of which, unvoweled,
    you can make almost anything--is: men and women, or humanity composed of
    its two sexes. From the first chapter to the end of the fourth chapter of
    _Genesis_ every name is a permutation of another name, and every personage
    is at the same time somebody else. A Kabalist traces Jehovah from the Adam
    of earth to Seth, the third son--or rather race--of Adam. Thus Seth is
    Jehovah male; and Enos, being a permutation of Cain and Abel, is Jehovah
    male and female, or our mankind. The Hindu Brahma-Viraj, Viraj-Manu, and
    Manu-Vaivasvata, with his daughter and wife, Vach, present the greatest
    analogy with these personages--for anyone who will take the trouble of
    studying the subject in both the _Bible_ and the _Puranas_.


    And remarking on the elusive "The Chaldean Book of Numbers":


    We are not aware that a copy of this ancient work is embraced in the
    catalogue of any European library; but it is one of the "Books of
    Hermes," and it is referred to and quotations are made from it in
    the works of a number of ancient and mediaeval philosophical authors.
    Among these authorities are Arnoldo di Villanova's _Rosarium
    Philosoph._, Francesco Arnuphi's _Opus de Lapide_, Hermes
    Trismegistus' _Tractatus de Transmutatione Metallorum_ and _Tabula
    Smaragdina_, and above all the treatise of Raymond Lully, _Ab
    Angelis Opus Divinum de Quinta Essentia_.

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    Here is something about the shared Indo-European context which is very deep and works better after some of the prior posted information.


    This is from the first page of the thread where the picture of John King says to learn about the symbols. It's not really a star chart. It probably is about Shekhina and divine marriage.





    Most of the Zodiac being the same, in India, there is one sign which is not quite the same, and has no named individuals attached to it:


    mithuna (मिथुन).—n (S) Congress of the sexes. 2 m A sign of the Zodiac, Gemini. 3 n A couple or pair, a brace (male and female).


    According to Vedic Time on Mithuna:


    Though the sign is named the twins, it is in fact a trinity.

    Emblematically, the sign represents a male (Father) and a female (Mother) seated in a boat.

    Mithuna (Gemini) stands for Mind or the Mahat Principle.



    Although it does have a minor meaning of "twins", Mithuna does not seem to be read that way as a sign. Yet Gemini is, and it is thought to derive from the term "didymos" which literally is "twins". India seems to accept Tula or "Scales", even tough this may not be significant in their iconography, and yet here we see that Gemini has another association altogether, probably even a different picture of the constellation.

    As far as I know, the other signs are near-identical matches, but whereas India has seemingly failed to name the "couple", Europe does not have a lack of ideas on Twins.


    We can work this out.


    Theosophy distinguishes something that must be distinctly Greco-Masonic about Gemini:


    The pillars of Hermes and Hercules, as well as Jachin and Boaz at the entrance to Solomon's temple, are derived from the great myth of Gemini. The glyph that describes them all is a graphic indication of their nature: two columns supporting a crossbeam over a threshold. Used in this form by the ancient Spartans, the glyph was later translated into the image of two amphorae with snakes twined around them. The glyph stands for the Portal of the Temple of Humanity. The ancient Euphrateans called the twins Mun-Ga, which designates 'the making of bricks' and refers to the building of the City of Man.

    Gemini may describe two hostile brothers, but in Hindu and Egyptian tradition the twins are brother and sister.


    It may not have been brought to the foreground, but it is already noted these are not quite the same signs.

    Part of what we are looking at involves discussing a few colors.



    "Krishna" is named for the color, krsna, which in Tibet is often interpreted as "black". This is arbitrary. It really means "blue", or, more poignantly, the dark but luminous Midnight Blue. Moreover, if an Indian Buddhist character is supposed to be black, then he usually will have the phrase:


    black like the newly-split antimony


    Slightly improved translations call it the more meaningful Collyrium:

    The word collyrium comes from the Greek κολλύριον, eye-salve.


    The Sunan Abu Dawood reports, "Prophet Muhammad said: 'Among the best types of collyrium is antimony (ithmid) for it clears the vision and makes the hair sprout.'" Maimonides (12th century Egypt) mentions the use of this eye salve.


    añjaṉam


    Antimony sulphate (Ithmid, or Isfahan Collyrium) is a silvery dark grey stone, which is crushed into a very fine powder and used to darken the eyes.

    The Arabic name كحل kuḥl formed the Arabic root k-ḥ-l, "to apply kohl".

    The English word alcohol is a loan of the Arabic word (via Middle Latin and French; originally in the sense "powder of antimony", the modern meaning is from the 18th century).

    The Greek and Latin terms for antimony, stibium, στίβι, στίμμι, were borrowed from the Egyptian name sdm.

    Pastes of Sb2S3 powder in fat or in other materials have been used since ca. 3000 BC as eye cosmetics in the Mediterranean and farther afield; in this use, Sb2S3 is called kohl. It was used to darken the brows and lashes, or to draw a line around the perimeter of the eye.

    The 17th century alchemist Eirenaeus Philalethes, also known as George Starkey, describes stibnite in his alchemical commentary An Exposition upon Sir George Ripley's Epistle. Starkey used stibnite as a precursor to philosophical mercury, which was itself a hypothetical precursor to the Philosopher's stone.


    Either antimony or stibnite is silvery, but, when processed, you get kohl:








    Having recently mentioned the Lotus:


    In the collection Nightmare Tales, HPB shows Varuni inhabiting a lake where a very powerful incident involving the sound of Vina (Om) and the Voice in a relatively short story called Blue Lotus.


    From her description, "Originally heat" and then wine sounds to me like what the alchemists called Watery Fire, which was the quintessence of the Twelve Zodiacal, Seven Planetary, and Four Form Elements. Isaac Newton said this was variously called Isis, Juno, or Ceres, and personally referred to it as quintessence of chaos element, i. e. Mundus. He said it was represented by antimony or Magnesia Gebri. Magnesia is not a particular element, but all of them. "It is fiery, aery, earthy, watery. It is heat and dryness, humidity and cold. It is watery fire and fiery water. It is a corporeal spirit and a spiritual body. It is the condensed spirit of the world."

    This, from below, links earth with heaven, as the heavenly quintessence links from above. He noted that the symbol for antimony was based on the orb held by Kings, symbol of a redeemed earth, a sphere surmounted by a cross. Only antimony is "the lawful son of the sun and the true sun of nature".

    Taken from Janus Faces.



    The Orb of Kings is an extended Earth Glyph, which fits to the Venus Glyph or Mirror or Ankh, which preserves the teaching that the "heavenly union" acquired by watery fire or antimony binds man to the formless kingdom. Or, perhaps it is more accurate to say the Orb is Antimony, which is the Earth Glyph which has raised the cross above:






    From Legacy 2012:


    Also known as the quintessence. When the four elements are
    arranged in perfect balance they make up the incorruptible essence of the stone.
    The fifth element is achieved in the albedo phase and is also known as the white
    stone. It can change metal into silver and has healing properties (Abraham 75-76).
    It is known as the burning water and the watery fire and contains all properties so
    that it exhibits none of the properties. Ruland states that there is a quintessence for
    vegetable, animal, and mineral which are exclusive and cannot be combined (272-
    273, 359)




    Other than a verse entitled The Hunting of the
    Greene Lyon 1
    found in the 1652 edition of Elias Ashmole’s Theatrum Chemicum
    Britannicum (Linden 278), hunting is not a common metaphor for alchemy.


    1 As a footnote, it was an annotated copy of Hunting of the Greene Lyon owned
    by Isaac Newton that led researchers to unveil his interest in the secret science.




    Rotation of the Elements as a step in the Great Work:


    But what is the spirit to be extracted and embodied in the Stone? It has the qualities of the philosopher’s gold, the most noble metal, and therefore the most perfect combination of fusibility, the generic characteristic of all metals, and fiery color, the specific characteristic of gold. These two characteristics are represented by alchemical Mercury and alchemical Sulphur, respectively, the spirits of Water and Fire. That is, gold is a perfect combination of the fusibility of Water and the color of Fire. This explains the common alchemical descriptions of the Quintessence of gold as “the watery fire and the fiery water.” Since Mercury is the volatile spirit and Sulphur is the fixed spirit, the goal is to volatilize the fixed and to fix the volatile.


    His alchemical works are in process of being published by U-Indiana as his Chymystry:


    Our Vulcan lunatique or watery fire (chiefly described
    by Artephius & Pontanus) is of the same nature which our matter
    & both must be prepared by the Artist. The sages are very
    reserved about both. The property of this fire is to calcine
    [by a putrefaction of 40 days in the first Gate & afterwards to] dissolve &
    sublime the stone [in the 2d.] Tis the only fire in the world
    that can do this. Tis of the nature of calx & no wise
    a stranger to the subject of Philosophy. Consider how
    Geber teaches the sublimations of this art. For my part
    I can say no more then Sidera Veneris et
    corniculatae Dianae tibi propitia sunto. Le Triomphe p 42 43, 44



    He writes similarly with respect to Ourobouros.


    Eckhardt 1785:


    I am the moisture which preserves every¬
    thing in nature and makes it live, I pass
    from the upper to the lower planes; I am
    the heavenly dew and the fat of the land;
    I am the fiery water and the watery fire;
    nothing may live without me in time; I
    am close to all things yea; in and through
    all things, nevertheless unknown.



    When the ' Philosophers pronounced an Execration,
    Almighty God did respect and grant their appeal, and gave
    unto them what He had until then kept in His own hands for
    several thousand years. Now the aforesaid Subjectum is of such
    a nature that it, our Magnesia, doth not only contain a small
    proportioned quantity of the universal Spiritus Vitalis in itself,
    but also hath some of the heavenly power condensed and com¬
    pressed within it.



    It is semi-precise, but, you get Mundus and other synonyms for something he has described as the single spiritual possibility.


    For the most part, that is the same as Buddhist Yoga. Quintessence.


    Newton did not want his math taken for a mechanistic universe devoid of intelligent life force. In the long run, he may not have a very developed theology, but he definitely did not want to make a lifeless science of facts.


    Any time we think of Newton or the color black, we are back to Quintessence.


    Its nature was mentioned by Muses 1961:


    Fiery Water (contact with which in harmony is achieved through certain forms of yoga) that protects against both heat and cold.






    The Swayambhu of Nepal or Agniyogini is an aquaeous flame.

    To add to the remark that HPB is using only one fragment on the Pitrs, and, then in some of her advanced teaching she refers to the Forty-nine Fires of Agni. First of all if you follow through with what she is saying, you are just going to get a re-classification of the Tattvas.

    That is all she said about it, but, when following any kind of latter-day theosophical trends, it will come up anyway.


    And that is really just not what it is about.

    Now it is good if she has paired the two, Fire and Pitrs, since these never change or evolve through other kingdoms, they are the only thing that is identical in any world system, always represented by the same laws.


    If we look at how Fire is introduced in the Brahmanda Purana, it looks a little difficult:


    Formerly the fire Edhiti was gathered by Atharvan
    in the ocean Puskara.' Hence that secular fire is Atharvana.
    Darpana is remembered as the son of Atharvan. Bhrgu was
    born as Atharvan and Fire is remembered as Atharvana (son
    of Atharvan). Hence the secular fire is considered Dadhyan
    the son of Atharvana.



    and we will find it has multiple kinds of "watery fire":


    The fires born of water are three, viz. : Vaidyut
    (Lightning) Jathara (gastric) and Saura (Solar).



    So here, contrary to most English interpretations, there is hardly such a thing as "Electric Fire" because it will probably be called Ocean Fire, or Fire of Water, something like that. Solar Fire *is* called solar fire, and here it is only being pointed out that the sun "drinks" moisture.

    Solar Fire generates other fires upon being churned in the Arani (by Friction); this fire is taken from one place to another; this lord is known by the name Ayus (Aerial Flame).


    There is such a thing as "descent of Agni" and then all the fires also have some role around a temple. There are three main fires, and in actuality many of the minor ones are hardly ever used. Yogic meditation is derived from it.


    Fire is very simple in Astrology because:


    Agni normally rides a Ram and is Aries.





    In Buddhism, our Quintessences are usually in a standardized format which has to do with Green, which is another interesting subject. As we can see, exceptional colors, such as Black, may do something to draw attention to themselves. Another color having only a small amount of specific uses is Orange, normally characterized as Saffron, such as with Khaganana of Nepal, or:



    Om Tare Tuttare Ture Nama Tare Manohara Hum Hara Svaha

    in Tibet is for a Yellow-Red Saffron Tara called Ritod Loma Jonma.


    or:


    Vajrayogini Sadhana in the Tradition of Indrabhuti by Vijayavajra (Indrabhutikramena Vajrayoginisadhana GSS35)

    vibrant, light red ("yellow- red, like blooming saffron")



    Sometimes it may be named after the Bandhuka flower, or, it may just be yellow-red, or:


    orange Guhya Jnana Dakini

    Saffron is a light shade, such as the Indian flag.





    It is the color of Citra Devi where Carcika is Mother of Citra:


    Her beautiful saffron complexion resembles the color of kumkuma, and her garments are the color of crystal. Her father is Catura, the paternal uncle of Suryamitra. Her mother is Carcika-devi and her husband is Pithara.

    There are other gopis who mostly collect transcendental herbs and medicinal creepers from the forest and do not collect flowers or anything else. Chitra-devi is the leader of these gopis. The chief gopis in Sri Chitra’s yutha are Rasalika, Tilakini, Saurasen, Sugandhika, Vamani, Vamanayana, Nagari and Nagavallika.

    She can nicely make various kinds of nectarean beverages. (There are also eight other gopi maidservants, headed by Rasalika-devi, who are expert at making various nectarean beverages.)



    Carcika is a south Indian goddess from Orissa, frequently confused with more common fierce goddesses such as Chandi. She has a unique identity. Well, by tracing HPB's expression that the "western" brotherhood was a branch of that of Lookshoor, Baluchistan, I looked as hard as I could and there definitely seems to be such a place:



    India in Greece, or, Truth in Mythology

    That is a book from around 1862 which looks at very similar ideas to those promoted by the TS shortly thereafter. Specifically, India being the core from which most of the Western civilizations descended. One interesting point is that the author states that Lukshur, or Lookshoor, in Balochistan is the parent city of Luxor, Egypt. It is about forty miles west of Bela, at 26,14 N and 65,52 E. The same road is still there on a modern map. So far I have not found a correspondence in lists of archaeological sites.



    So I couldn't really make anything of it. I did however find something:


    Also called as native vermillion or Cinnabarite. • Derived from Greek word “Kinnaban” ore of mercury. • Chemically red sulphide of mercury.

    25.0°30′50″N 65.0°30′55″E


    The cave temple of Hinglaj Mata is in a narrow gorge in the remote, hilly area of Lyari Tehsil in Balochistan, Pakistan...12 miles (19 km) inland from the Arabian Sea...at the end of a range of Kirthar Mountains, in the Makran desert stretch, on the west bank of Hingol River. The area is under the Hingol National Park.

    The tidal waves of the sea and the strong stormy winds have carved the Makran coastal strip and the adjoining mountain cliffs in such a way that at first glance the area resembles a bizarre archaeological complex preserving the remains of some ancient civilization. The most famous of these rocks are the Princess of Hope and the Sphinx.



    Bela and surrounding areas have some mineral reserves. 64 kilometres (40 mi) north of Bela are the Kundi deposits where traces of chalcopyrite, Galena, and silver are also found. Manganese ore is also found in the ophiolitic belt of Bela.


    In the words of a Tamil poet:


    According to the Vāmaṇa purāṇā, Koṟṟavai was the name of an ancient goddess at Hingulas in Baluchistan, who was later renamed Hani by Scythians, and Carcika by Hindus, during the Gupta period.

    In fact, in ch. 49, 46-47, the goddess Carcika is said to reside on mount Haingulata.

    Korravai or Suli is a Tamil War goddess, not a native Hinguli.

    There is a cave which has a natural association since Sati's Vermillion Tika fell here. The area has this name in the Jain and Pali Buddhist texts.

    Hingula is also a name

    of the tutelary deity of the Dadhi-parṇas

    which has little meaning other than "Man, the Seven-Leafed plant" as in:

    Kinnara (किन्नर) is the name of the Yakṣa...The Kevala tree for him is called Dadhiparṇa or Saptacchada.


    Tantrachudamani equates Hingula Pitha with the Brahmarandra. They say the name comes from a Tatar in the Treta Yuga. Another legend has Dadhici using a Hingala mantra against Parasurama to protect Jayasena. They say:

    Hinglaj mata mandir is very old and has history of being in existence even before Mahabharata times (Dwapara Yuga).
    Sindh ruler Jayadratha (Saindhava), brother-in-law of Kauravas built many temples around Hinglaj Mata Mandir.


    On Jaganath and Hingula:


    Although the Hingula shrine in Balochistan is considered to be a true Shakti Peeth, other shrines dedicated to the goddess exist in India and Sri Lanka. One important shrine is located 14 km from Talcher in the state of Orissa in India. King Nala of the Vidarbha region of Western India was an ardent devotee of Devi Hingula. He was approached by the King of Puri for help. In order to start cooking 'Mahaprasada' for Lord Jagannath he had to procure Devi Hingula as fire for the temple kitchen. The Goddess agreed and moved to Puri as fire. [Nilachala = ancient name of Puri]


    along with mantra translations:

    Translation : "Mahaamaayaa (Queen of Illusions) who represents the supreme virtue by reigning over all three virtues, has Bhimalochana as her Bhairava, and derides the worldly trappings by dancing naked, resides in this cave of Hingula that enshrines her sacred head."

    Translation : "Oh Hingula Devi, she who holds nectar in her self and is power incarnate. She who is one with Lord Shiva, to her we pay our respects and make this offering (swaha)."


    She is in Kularnava and Kubjika tantras.

    In this case, we can say she pre-dates writing, was exported to Orissa, as Fire, which perhaps became the Charchika Pitha there.


    Carcika as Hingalaj and Kotari among the Rajputs:

    Charan men are also known as the sacrosanct guides of camel and pack oxen
    caravans through the Thar Desert, and as traders in horses, wool and salt, suppliers
    of food and weaponry to armies, and perhaps most importantly, as the devotees of
    Shakti and the poets and priests of cults dedicated to Charani Sagatis, living
    goddesses of Charan origin, thought of as historical women recognized as living
    goddesses during their lives or deified after their deaths. Such women, born to
    Charan lineages, are believed to be the multiple manifestations of the “first” or
    “original” goddess, the Mahashakti Hinglaj.

    She has a cat form. This is from the Kadambari where she is Jatamatr devata or watches childbirth and has the face of a cat. That is from a study of stonework which says:

    1. Animal faced mother goddess: One of the earliest evidences of a
    therianthropic figure is an elephant -faced female figure (F!G.43:d) depicted on
    a terracotta plaque exposed during the excavations at Rairh (Jaipur),
    Rajasthan (Puri n.d.26) and dated to c. 1st century B.C. Scholars tend to
    identify the figure with Vainayaki{Agrawala 1978:21).


    Goddess Carcika has a story of actually manifesting in 1368.


    Her name has a double meaning, ordinarily "repetition, recital", but also:



    ...his sweat mixing with andhaka's blood gave rise to a beautiful goddess charchikA

    Her origin on Kamakoti:


    ...a Kanya got formed from his sweat and spills of the Rakshasa’s blood and Maha Deva named her ‘Charchika’ and gave her the boon of a Symbol of Propitiousness to be worshipped by Devatas, Rishis, Pitaras, Yaksha, Vidyaadhas etc as also Sarpas, and Manavaas. There was also a boy who appeared from the sweat drops which were like sparks of fire dropped on Bhumi and Maha Deva named him ‘Kuja’ or ‘Mangala’ and made him a Senior of ‘Grahas’ (Planets) with the responsibility of providing ‘Shubha’ or Auspiciousness and ‘Ashubha’ or Inauspiciousness.


    That is very strange because he sounds like Mars, but, Mars has already been deployed:


    Kartikeya and Ganesha accompanied by the ganas destroyed his chariot...a boy who was the colour of charcoal...


    From Vamana Purana p. 449:


    ...the girl dipped in blood, and the boy like a pile of charcoal. She has her name because she is smeared with blood; she is beautiful, puts on a lion's skin, and roams the earth and settles at Hingulata.

    Hingula is supposed to be Sulfur to Shiva's Mercury, while as a sister, Charchika is Blood to her brother's Charcoal.

    Her brother is Bhutas or Kuja, "the earth-born planet Mars".


    The Buddhist Pratimalaksanam enjoins that images of such deities as Brahma, the goddess Charchika, the Risis, the Brahmaraksasa, the celestial beings, and the Buddhas should be made according to dasatala measurement, and no images of others should be made in this manner.



    Her second meaning is "smeared", "anointed", "bathed in", and her brother is some kind of hypostasis of Mars. What is interesting is that we already know about this in the exact same way as just mentioned here. This is also simple because he is charcoal--dull "now", but, is supposed to glow from spiritual fire. This is how Mars is a worshippable deity and Brahma is not.







    At her western Pitha, Hingalar is over a really big desert, and houses a steam volcano of initiation:


    It is said that when 'Bhagwan Parashurama' came after killing the Kshatriyas 21 times, the remaining Rajaghans went to the shelter of Mother Hingula and pleaded for their protection. Then the mother called him 'Brahmakshatriya.'

    It is believed that there are Kamakhya of Assam, Kanyakumari and Tamil Nadu, Kamakshi of Kanchi, Ambaji of Gujarat, Lalita of Prayag, Vindhyavasini of Vindhyachal, Volcano of Kangra, Vishalakshi of Varanasi, Mangaladevi of Gaya, Sundari of Bengal, Guhyeshwari of Nepal and Malwa In these two forms, Adyashakti is embellishing as Hingla Devi.

    In front, there is a statue of Goddess Hinglaj Devi, who is in the form of 'Mata Vaishno Devi'.


    Kotavi or Kotari, that is, an uncovered goddess, is a Hindu mythology deity and the tutelary goddess of the Daityas. She was the form of Goddess Durga...

    Chhinnamasta

    Chhinnamasta are the malevolent war goddess Kotavi and the South-Indian hunting goddess Korravai.

    She was the form of Goddess Durga, and the mother like tutelary goddess of the demon Banasur. [Vishnu Purana]

    Seeing that Bana summoned his mother like presiding deity, who came as Kotara (or Kotari), a nude women with dishevelled hair and fought with Krishna.[Bhagavata Purana]


    The category of "headless deity":


    Bhudevi, Bhumidevi, Bhumika, Bhairavi, Santeri, Lajjagouri, Lanjika, Mahakoteshwari, Yogambika, Nitambini, Kotari, Chinnamasta etc. are associated with the trunk of Devi Renuka. (The head of Renuka is Yallamma that is Jagadamba.)


    Koṭavī is said to be an eighth portion of Rudrāṇī, and the tutelary goddess of the Daityas, composed of incantations. The Hari V. calls her also Lambā...

    Kotari of Hingalaj:

    Brahmarandhra Kottawisha Bhairavi

    Brahma Vaivartha Purana calls Kotari the village deity of Sonitpur, and places her in a chariot in the middle of eight Candis, following after the Bhairavas and Rudras, followed by the Matrikas. The Matrikas include Bhairavi "of terrific form" and are led by Bhadrakalika who "looked terrific because of her protruding tongue".


    Durga is then called Narayani and the illusion of Vishnu.



    When referring to Matrikas or Mothers:


    Originally believed to be a personification of the seven stars of the star cluster the Pleiades, they became quite popular by the seventh century and a standard feature of goddess temples from the ninth century onwards.

    Devi Bhagvata Purana mentions 2 other Matrikas Varuni (shakti of Varuna) and Kauberi (shakti of Kubera).

    In lists of nine Matrikas, Devi-Purana mentions Gananayaki or Vinayaki – the Shakti of Ganesha, characterized by her elephant head and ability to remove obstacles like Ganesha and Mahabharavi, omitting Narasimhi.


    About 32 km from Bhubaneswar, in the district of Khurda (that also includes the city of Bhubaneswar) we find the temple of Goddess Barunei or Varuni, on the bank of the stream Svarna Ganga flowing from the mountain.



    Red Vermillion is one thing, and then there is Sulfur, and if very patient you may occasionally see Yellow Carcika:






    Her sunyavahini mandipa:









    While that says Carcika migrated to Orissa, what we have here next is but a fragment, but it is from the oldest pages in Asia, the Gilgit manuscripts from ca. 400. What happened is that when it was discovered, it was then presented as the internal subject. So when we clip just the header, we see it begins with Ekajata Maharaksasi, then [Lokesvara?], then Lankesvari, followed by Sankhini and Sri Devi, then rest of the article would be on Raksa Artha Pratisara Dharani:



    [13] man.icud.a ca svarn.ake´sı pingala cama {...} nı ekajat.a ca maharaks.ası |

    tatha buddha {...} vara |

    tatha lanke´svarı dhanyaanye 'pi bahu {...} raks.anti yasyeyam. mahavidya hastagata {...} [ka]´s caiva ´sa˙nkhinı kut.adantı (ca)´srıya devı ca sa {...} baddha raks.arthepratisaradharan.asya nityam. ya dharaya {...} bala |



    What that means, is, Lankesvari--i. e. of Sri Lanka or close by--has been transmitted via book to Gandahar.

    In Buddhism, King Indrabhuti was a Jaganath devotee, from what I can tell he means that Jaganath is Vajrasattva. But he was three centuries later. What that type of writing tells us is the practice of magic was widespread and somewhat unified and the strata of Buddhist practitioners compared to these Shakti sites is hard to distinguish.

    Buddhism was heavily practiced in what is now Pakistan, and, correspondingly it is easy to find Greek influence at Ladakh in India. The interchange was of such a nature, that the Roman coin, Denarius, appears in the earliest manuscripts of the Bhutadamara Tantra, around the 500s, and then in copies made around the eighth century, they no longer knew what it was and put in guesses.


    By some accounts, Alexander the Great withered in Pakistan:


    In crossing the desert, Alexander's army took enormous casualties from hunger and thirst, but fought no human enemy. They encountered the "Fish Eaters", or Ichthyophagi, primitive people who lived on the Makran coast of the Arabian Sea, who had matted hair, no fire, no metal, no clothes, lived in huts made of whale bones, and ate raw seafood obtained by beachcombing.

    According to others, Ori were as advanced as anyone, using fire-hardened javelins dipped in poison.


    Originally, he established the precursor to Bela which was of course thought to be for trading purposes, which we have reason to suspect might involve:


    Hiṅgula (हिङ्गुल):—[from hiṅgu] m. n. a preparation of mercury with sulphur, vermilion


    In fact it is very easy to look the other way and find it exalted in Chinese Medicine:


    Alchemy as the art of gold making never existed and had no beginning. It arose as the cult of longevity using simples, like gold and cinnabar, as drugs of longevity. It became alchemy on making the first synthetic drug, Chin-Yeh, Gold-plus-herbal juice, and reached its ideal with Chin-Tan, Gold-plus-cinnabar. The former was red colloidal gold, the latter vermillion with traces of gold.


    Also:


    Chin-Tan, or Makaradhvaja


    ...Newton, who believed in alchemy and prepared
    mercurials and consumed them himself which so much energized him that
    he suffered from insomnia.


    A whole biography beginning with Extraction of Mercury.


    Without confirming anything about "Lookshoor", we have every reason to expect a few isolated desert-ish places and an opportunity for, I suppose, a cultural crossroads, which would have been similar up to Tashkent and Samarkand. It appears inextricably linked to south India in mankind's most archaic evidences to date.


    Having mentioned one Indian goddess as The Zodiac:


    Bhuvaneshvari (Aditi Maya) is Indrani in the form of Ishani



    There is one of Yellow color:


    Bagalamukhi is Pranayama, Shakti of Varuna and Yama (controller of prana) and Indra's Golden Vajra Shakti (RV X 96.3).




    Whether Egyptian snake charmers or something else:


    Elizabeth Barber has pointed out that yellow is a woman's colour in the ancient world. Yellow dye was obtained from saffron (the dried stigmas of the crocus sativus), a plant which is shown being gathered by women in the Minoan fresco discovered in 1973 decorating the "lustral basin", a cultic room in which it is thought young girls underwent ritual initiations in connection with menstruation and childbirth, in the building named Xeste 3 at Akrotiri on the island of Thera.







    I am not sure if it is this extreme, but, there is this thesis as said on Necropolis:



    The Great Goddess was the original, and only, deity of humankind from the dawn of time up until around 3000 BCE, when Goddess-oriented cultures were conquered by patriarchal, warlike worshippers of a sky god. Late Bronze Age Minoan Crete (1750–1490 BCE) is considered to be the Goddess culture’s final flowering. According to Goddess History, Crete exhibits the last gasp of the feminine values associated with Goddess culture before it was wiped out by warlike, patriarchal Mycenaean Greeks. Before this time Minoan Crete was peaceful, worshipped the Great Goddess and her Dying and Rising Consort (who was also her son), and women and nature were respected.

    Here is perhaps an alternative:

    Saffron Crocus



    The best-known Minoan Snake-goddess figurine shows her wearing yellow garments.


    Saffron crocuses originated as sacred flowers of Crete. It early made its way as far into the east as India, carried along ancient trade routes. In the East, right down to the present day, saffron robes are associated with Buddhist & Hindu divinities & priests, & Buddhist monks & nuns, & with women's garments generally.

    A Minoan fresco found at Thera in 1973 shows women dressed in yellow & orange-red, gathering saffron stigmas from crocuses, & offering them to a seated goddess or high priestess.








    Anath's brother Baal, & Paghat's brother Aqhat, were Semitic grain-gods whose death was followed by their resurrection as millet.

    Krokos was a flower-boy who became the lover of androgynous Hermes. But Krokos was mortal & by their rough play together, Hermes accidentally gave his beloved a mortal wound, some said with a discus, others with a quoit. Wherever the blood of Krokos fell, a saffron flower grew, the three red style retained the color of his blood.

    It is believed that saffron crocus originally grew nowhere but on the isle of Crete as a triploid sport of a Greek species Crocus cartwrightianus. The triploid crocus is sterile & it reproduces only by offsets on the corms. It cannot spread naturally, but declines if not dug up ever other year or so & the corms divided. That it even so spread throughout Europe & India & eventually into China was due to ancient routes of IndoEuropean traders.

    The saffron dye & spice obtained from the three female style of each bloom had a value greater than jewels or precious metals, causing it to become the most widespread cultivar in the ancient world, from at least millenium before the rise of Athens.


    During the Eleusian Mysteries, initiates by the thousands honored the godling Krokos as an ancestral divinity of some consequence, first to have dwelt among the brackish rivers & inlets of the Rhiti district near Athens. There was a guarded ceremony which was known as the krokosis, the importance of which was never revealed to outsiders, though practiced into the Christian era.


    When Demeter first saw spring's bright yellow crocuses, she was angered, demanding who had disobeyed her edict that nothing flourishes until Persephone was restored to her side. The crocuses themselves replied, "But the Maid is coming!" Demeter in a dither of excitement dawned a mantle made of white crocuses in order to greet her returning daughter, who rose out of the ground in the circle of sunny yellow blooms. These pure yellow crocuses were probably the natural wild Golden Crocus (C. chrysanthus) which is native to Greece, Galacia, & Macedonia. It blooms while snow is still upon the ground, before the start of spring, hence would have provided the first evidence of Persephone's restoration. Demeter's mantle of white crocuses could have been a mixture of Autumn & Spring crocuses. At least three white-blooming autumn species grow on the Pelopponesus. Among spring species, many have always had white forms. All crocuses were sacred to Demeter & Persephone, with the Saffron symbolic of the death of the world, the white-crocused mantle being snow upon Demeter's sad shoulders, & spring's Golden Crocus representing the joy of Demeter. Of these, however, only the deathly Saffron Crocus possessed the sacred spice.


    The saffron spice became best identified with Eos or Aurora in classical antiquity, but the flower itself belonged formost to the Furies, & to Demeter & Persephone or Black Aphrodite.

    In Greece & Rome she came to be identified as Eos or Aurora the Goddess of the Dawn, with herself, her throne, her sacred robes, even her wedding bed, all the color of gold & saffron.

    Ovid among others called Eos the "Saffron mother," & many ancient poets allude to her rosy-red (saffron-dyed) fingers.

    There is a mystical attachment to Saffron Eos who harmonizes Fire & Water, being as she is both Light & Dew, dwelling in a world that Night readied for Day. This harmony is at the base of many mystical systems of religion. The myths of of Eos falling in love with such mortals as Kephalos, Orion, Kleitos & Tithonos preserves an echo of this ancient idea that Eos is the source of mortal enlightenment. She was simultaneousy a Goddess of erotic love, & was said to spend her nights with a series of mortal lovers, her saffron being a mighty aphrodisiac.

    That she was the kidnapper of such lovers as Tithonos & Kephalos, rather than their seducer, reveals an aggressiveness like unto that of Zeus who raped women in sundry guises without bothering to win them with his charms. When Zeus tricked Europa the mother of Minoa into coupling, he first took the form of a gentle bull & breathed saffron spice from his nostrils.

    Eos herself was as a rule sexually out of control because of her saffron nature, without which she would neither have loved nor illuminated mortals.


    Many of Nyx's daughters were associated with the morning sun, notably the Hesperides who dwelt far away on an island beneath which Eos had her bed, guarding the Golden Apples of the Sun.


    In Phoenicia, the place of Carthage named for Kar, the edible saffron corm as well as some of the spice was pounded & cooked to make sacramental crescent-cakes for the goddess Ashtoreth (or Ashtaroth), whose name in Greek became Astarte, & in earlier Syria, Canaan, & Israel she was Anath, who is alluded to in the book of Jeremiah, a native of Anathoth ("Daughers of Anath").

    ...the Cretan role of the Corybantes or Curetes in protecting the infant Zeus, who was said to have been fashioned entirely of saffron, or to have the odor of saffron in his infancy.


    Cretan Zeus was chosen to be a sacrificial grain-god (just as Athaliah intended to sacrifice Joash, whose Yahwist cult not coincidentally had its Temple founded by Solomon upon a Threshing-floor purchased by David). Zeus was hidden in a sacred Cave (Joash in the Temple) where he was nursed by the Goat-goddess Amalthea (akin to Joash's nurse who was hidden with Joash in the ruined Temple). Her biblical name was Kerenhappuch, "Horn of Kohl," Kohl being a common eye cosmetic. The horn was thought to be the same as "Amalthea's Horn," the horn of a she-goat, hence Amalthea is Karenhappuch's name in the Septuagint & the pseudonpegraphic Testament of Job.



    Lucrecius likewise speaks of these Curetes as defenders of infant Jupiter against Saturn. He says they were both Cretan & Phrygian, & were the armed guard of "the Mighty Mother," vis, Cybele, tramping warlike over the mountains as She rode in her lion-drawn chariot. He said they went about "With flowers fallen like snow upon the Mother & her bands of companions," reminiscent of the white snow-crocuses that formed Demeter's mantel. These snowfall flowers may well have been both autumn & spring crocuses which were the source of the bee's honey that was brought to the cavern to feed infant Zeus. Virgil explicitely states that Saffron flowers were essential for the maintenance of these sacred bees. The bees were themselves armed warriors that loved flowers, even as were the Curetes.

    The magic of the Crocus & its association with the birth & sustenance of infant Cretan Zeus survived in later myths of the adult Zeus & his bride Hera. When they made love upon a river bank, as told to us in the Iliad, a bed or saffron crocuses rose up around them in full bloom. The saffron spice that issued from these crocuses was a "golden dew" so bright that had anyone passed by the riverside nuptial bed of the God & Goddess, all that would have been seen was the shimmering light.





    In Buddhism, Saffron Water is such a thing, usually associated with Amitayus, that according to one reviewer it is:


    The Eucharist

    It is more frequently called Amrita Vase (usually a Conch Shell). Mentioned by Waddell in Lucifer.


    So, no argument about the color or plant, in fact if you do the Gelug school then this is really a part of their Guru Yoga, Lama Chopa. If that is what it takes to nationalize it or get a bunch of people interested in doing it, then, ok. It simply is not a part of Indian Buddhism in exactly the form they are using (Long Life Trinity). However Amitayus appears in some of the earliest relevant writings, ca. 300. There is no way he invented a Vase of Immortality, just that the Buddhist school does it differently than others.


    With Eight Arm Vajrasrnkhala 209, we find her expression for a skullcup full of blood:

    rudhirapūritakapālaṃ



    which is using an adjective derived from different nouns:

    Rudhira (रुधिर)

    -ram 1 Blood.

    2) Saffron.

    -raḥ 1 The red colour.

    2) The planet Mars



    It may be in water, or, in Nepal it means two powders, or, their mixture. In actual use the average person cannot afford saffron and cinnabar. Cf. red and yellow powder p. 300, Homa Variations.

    Darma Punya has a roster of ritual items:





    Kurukulla Practice Manual Chapter Four starts with the kunkuma or tikka powder:

    The mere seeing of the colored powder
    Quickly brings about the attainment of buddhahood,
    As one progresses through the stages of perception of the
    maṇḍala.
    That shall now be explained correctly...



    So, when I hear the European story of the plant, I have to say that yes, in Buddhism, it is certainly important in multiple forms, and in visualized ones.



    If we break up goddess Cinnamasta, we will find that in Hinduism, she is a personal name, whereas in Buddhism she is more like a verb, a ritual act. We have found that David Frawley dug really deep into legitimate Shaktism, and came up with a sort of modified commentary on Cinnamasta. He had one or two Indian gurus and they might have brainstormed this together. I personally have never really said anything pro or con Frawley because at least this isn't biased innovation. They have tried to delve into what they are talking about. He is going to say something that brings us back to The Twins, in a hypostasis of Hindu deities which are really the same as in Buddhism. The Buddhist Vajravarahi and Hayagriva are both Hindu deities. The way I see it, is that, if they are deities, they exist outside of time and space as we know it. Let us suppose that, this very moment, Hayagriva is being invoked by someone in Tibet who has no idea that he has a Puranic origin. Meanwhile, he probably has a statue in India with a votive candle lit by someone with no idea what he can do.

    Then if he can mentally appear to anyone with a receptive mind, but, it is conditioned by whatever beliefs they have impressed on it, he could become startlingly present to both kinds of people without his full potency.

    So, of course, yes, there could be multiple or even thousands of Hayagrivas going on right now, and probably only a tiny few convey his higher teachings.


    In one tiny little corner, HPB said that the initiations were given by Cinnamasta tantrikas. She did not explain this. I cannot speak for the Hindu one, but here for Buddhism, I will, and start with you better be careful.


    Either kind says there are Teevra deities that you do not trivialize or they might kill your family.


    And then we come across something in some notes from Frawley which include Matsya, that is, Varahi holding a Fish. This sounds semi-Astrological so let us put it together with The Twins:




    According to Varahi Tantra, her Five Forms are Swapna/Sweta (Dream) Varahi, Chanda Varahi, Mahi Varahi (Bhairavi), Kruchha Varahi and Matsya Varahi. Vaarahi is represented with a third eye on her forehead and is the Kamala Vidya of Dasa Mahavidyas.

    Chinnamasta, Chamunda and Varahi are both Shachi, or Indrani or Indra Shakti (Vaidyut). Kamala (Varahi) is Indrani in the form of Ushas (Rig Veda Viii 1.6, X 42.9, X 47.5) or Rajeshwari (RV I 174.1). The higher form of Kamala is Sundari (i. e. Tripura Sundari).

    In "Traditional Yoga: Insights into the Original Yoga Tradition, Book 2", p. 42, we find the author states that Chinnamasta's attendants are the Ashwin Shaktis, that Dadhyan "feeds" them in the same way. Then mentions she is the spouse of Vishvarupa, who, in Brihadaranyaka Upanishad, is a disciple of the Aswins.

    Cf. Ashwini Rahasya by same author.


    The reason that is intriguing is not because he is making an arbitrary declaration, but because in the religious sense, they simply are not known for "shakti", i. e., their power, which of course would be Immortality. It is indefinite. It is not even suggested in scriptures I don't think. You can only reason your way to it by saying, well, if they are divine, they must have such a power.

    I am not necessarily going to do anything with Frawley's Hindu Cinnamasta, but I am going to agree that at least in principle there must be such a shakti. Amitayus is depicted as an ever-flowing fountain of it.


    The reason I kept that is because when I started studying Indian Astrology, it seemed to me there must be such a thing as what he is talking about.

    The Aswins





    As much as I don't think HPB understood the term "Asura" from the Ocean of Milk, she actually did notice there are two kinds of Samjna. This is important to the story which we could call that of the Best Mare:


    "Sanjana, the daughter of Vishwakarman was the wife of the sun, and bore him three children, the Manu (Vaivaswata), Yama and the goddess Yami (or the Yamuna river). Unable to endure the fervours of her lord, Sanjana gave him Chhaya as his handmaid, and repaired to the forests to practise devout exercises. The sun, supposing Chhaya to be his wife Sanjana, begot by her three other children, Sanaischara (Saturn), another Manu (Savarni), and a daughter Tapati (the Tapti river). Chhaya upon one occasion, being offended with Yama, the son of Sanjana, denounced an imprecation upon him, and thereby revealed to Yama and to the sun that she was not in truth Sanjana, the mother of the former. Being further informed by Chhaya that his wife had gone to the wilderness, the sun beheld her by the eye of meditation engaged in austerities, in the figure of a mare (in the region of Uttara Kuru). Metamorphosing himself into a horse, he rejoined his wife, and begot three other children, the two Aswins, and Revanta, and then brought Sanjana back to his own dwelling. To diminish his intensity, Vishwakaraman placed the luminary on his lathe to grind off some of his effulgence; and in this manner reduced it an eighth: for more than that was inseparable. The parts of the divine Vaishnava splendour, residing in the sun, that were filed off by Viswakaraman fell blazing down upon the earth, and the artist constructed of them the discus of Vishnu, the trident of Shiva, the weapon of the god of wealth, the lance of Kartikeya, and the weapons of the other gods: all these Viswakarman fabricated from the superflous rays of the sun."


    So it is obviously speaking of a somewhat divine plane, but, as the real meaning is fractal-ish, from I believe Aitareya Aranyaka:


    There is also a section telling you how to have sex to beget a good child; as a result, the Aswins grant the fertilized egg (germ) a Puskara lotus, and then they twist a flame with two golden sticks which makes the embryo grow.



    These Indian Twins are not Gemini because they are The Beginning.

    A long time ago, 3,000 B. C. E. at least, someone said the Zodiac begins opposite Spica. Good enough for me. Spica is much more discernable.

    Approximately opposite this star is an asterism of two stars called The Aswins, who occupy the first Lunar Mansion which originally in Atharva Veda was called:

    aśvayúj, "harnessing horses"


    A Mansion is the distance that the Moon crosses in a day, and they are usually defined as thirteen degrees, twenty minutes. So the Mansion of this first day is now called Aswini, which rather means "Horse Woman", so you know the Mansion is not strictly equated with the asterism.

    The pointer from Spica helps, because, Aries is so small and almost unnoticeable, that you would have to do a lot of talking to convince me it was anything significant.


    The Mansion includes Gamma Arietis, which is so faint it does not even get a symbol on the map:






    Asvini is ruled by the Ashvins, the heavenly twins who served as physicians to the gods. Personified, Asvini is considered to be the wife of the Asvini Kumaras. Ashvini is represented either by the head of a horse, or by honey and the bee hive.


    The Twins are associated with:

    medicine, health, dawn, and the sciences


    They are called several times divó nápātā, that is 'grandsons of Dyaús (the sky-god)'. This formula is comparable with the Lithuanian Dievo sūneliai, 'sons of Dievas (the sky-god'), attached to the Ašvieniai; the Latvian Dieva Dēli, the 'sons of Dievs (the sky-god)'; and the Greek Diós-kouroi, the 'boys of Zeus', designating Castor and Pollux.

    The Mahabharata also narrates about the birth of Nakula and Sahadeva, who were the “spiritual sons” of the Ashvins. According to the epic, a king named Pandu was unable to make love due to a curse and didn't have any heir. However, he advised his wives, Kunti and Madri, to invoke various gods and ask for sons. Ashvins Nasatya and Darsa blessed Madri with Nakula and Sahadeva respectively.

    Madri is a princess without any personal story other than her name simply means she was from Madra. Here is the River Asikni; named for that wife of Daksha who gave birth to the Mansions of the Moon.


    Surya, the Sun, is an Aditya, or product of Kashyapa plus Aditi. Surya marries Saranyu (quick, nimble, as rivers and wind) to produce Vaivaswata Manu, Yama and Yami (death), and the Aswins.


    Madri and Kunti had the same earthly husband, Pandu. He was cursed for shooting some deer that were forms of sages. Note that this will be Krishna's fate, to be mistakenly shot for a deer.

    When Kunti was a little girl, she was nice to a sage, who empowered her with some Atharva Veda mantras. She used her power perhaps a bit impulsively for children with multiple deities. Later in life, she empowers Madri, but only for one time. And so Madri is considered to have carefully and wisely selected the Aswin twins for her mantra, using Surya to sire them.

    One of Kunti's children was Arjuna, the main character of Bhagavad Gita. Why is this an esoteric text, well, the character was born by mantra, so it must be an allegory.

    The Aswins are not successful souls overall; they were unable to reach the higher realms due to pride in their health and wisdom--pride in this sense meaning believing that no one was equal to them.


    It may be that at some point in time they marked the Summer Solstice.



    It is the meaning of Sidereal Astrology:


    Each and every Sanskrit astrological text from the classical era of vedic tradition explicitly mentions the usage of the sidereal zodiac for horoscopic astrology, i.e the first point of Aries is tied to a specific Nakṣatram called Aśvini.


    And from the description of Mansions:


    The earliest reference to the complete solar zodiac based on 12 sign divisions is found in Mesopotamia c. 450 BCE, yet the Indian astrologers were using the 27 divisions of the nakshatras far earlier. The original lists of the nakshatras always start with Krittika which is associated with the Pleiades.




    ‘Ashwini Kumars’ – horse-headed twins. Ashwini Kumars were celestial physicians. They were the healers for the gods.


    The first Theosophical note about them is that they are the most occult and mysterious deities. On one aspect, they are considered physicians or healers; and we may note that, as sacred sciences became more and more hidden, the main thing that was left in the public domain was herbalism and healing. Their other main aspect is in being precursors to dawn.

    In Sanskrit, dawn is known as Ushas, which in Greek is Eos, and in Latin, Aurora. She is probably the most revered goddess in Rig Veda.

    The two horsemen; two Vedic divinities which in some respects parallel the Greek Dioscuri, Pollux and Castor. Harbingers of Ushas (the dawn), they are represented as twin horsemen, appearing in the sky in a golden chariot drawn by horses or birds. One myth gives their origin as children of the sun by a nymph, Asvini, who concealed herself in the form of a mare; another myth makes Asvini their wife. Since they precede the sun’s rising they are called the parents of the sun’s form, Pushan. They are also the parents of Nakula and Sahadeva, Arjuna’s brothers by Madri. Many Vedic hymns are addressed to them; their attributes pertain to youth and beauty, to speed, and to duality. They bring treasures to mankind, averting misfortune and sickness, for they are the two physicians of heaven (svar-vaidyau).


    Using a tool for Rg Veda one finds:


    Asvini mentioned not just in the third hymn of the oldest book in the world (by academic standards), you will find them over four hundred times. In 8.35 they are invoked using a frequent repetition of the phrase "Accordant of one mind with Surya and Ushas". The final tip from esoteric philosophy is that as Aswini Kumaras, the twins are the reincarnating principles.




    Those are the sons of the Best Mare, whose story showed the individual is likely to be easily duped by Chhaya Samjna, meaning a shadow, a terrestrial limitation in the mind. Those frolics happened before breaking the Egg which it calls Martanda, that is, the world egg in the waters of the cosmos, which after shattering forms our world.

    Sometimes in linguistics, we have to forget about the fact that a word or a name looks like another, but in this case, the Aswins are also a type of living tradition elsewhere in the world:


    Ašvieniai are represented as pulling a carriage of Saulė (the Sun) through the sky. Ašvieniai, depicted as žirgeliai or little horses, are common motifs on Lithuanian rooftops. Ašvieniai are related to Lithuanian Ūsinis and Latvian Ūsiņš (cf. Vedic Ushas), gods of horses. Usins, one of the Ašvieniai, is described as driving a solar chariot pulled across the sky by a pair of white horses.





    Dievo sūneliai (the "sons of Dievas")

    Two well-accepted descendants of the Divine Twins, the Vedic Aśvins and the Lithuanian Ašvieniai, are linguistic cognates ultimately deriving from the Proto-Indo-European word for the horse, *h₁éḱwos. They are related to Sanskrit áśva and Avestan aspā (from Indo-Iranian *aćua), and to Old Lithuanian ašva, all sharing the meaning of "mare".



    Those are identical, at least on a superficial level.

    The train of thought suggested by others begins with saying that the Aswins and Gemini share the role of saviors from shipwreck and triplicate or "three", i. e. Gemini is the third sign.

    In Greece also having the name Anakes, no race descends from them.


    Greek seafarers in fact point them out as being St. Elmo's Fire.


    Using the Greek term for a temple feast, the same is ported home:


    The domestic setting of the theoxenia was a characteristic distinction accorded to the Dioskouroi.




    The image of the twins attending a goddess are widespread and link the Dioskouroi with the male societies of initiates under the aegis of the Anatolian Great Goddess and the great gods of Samothrace. During the Archaic period, the Dioscuri were venerated in Naukratis. The Dioscuri are the inventors of war dances, which characterize the Kuretes.

    They were "given" the island of Socotra near Yemen.

    The brothers became the two brightest stars in the constellation Gemini ("the twins"): Castor (Alpha Geminorum) and Pollux (Beta Geminorum). As emblems of immortality and death, the Dioscuri, like Heracles, were said to have been initiated into the Eleusinian mysteries.



    The Etruscans venerated the twins as Kastur and Pultuce, collectively as the tinas cliniiaras, "Sons of Tinia", Etruscan counterpart of Zeus. They were often portrayed on Etruscan mirrors.





    Here is another Etruscan Mirror for the Mother of Dionysus, Semele:


    The Greek cult of Dionysus had flourished among the Etruscans in the archaic period, and had been made compatible with Etruscan religious beliefs. One of the main principles of the Dionysian mysteries that spread to Latium and Rome was the concept of rebirth, to which the complex myths surrounding the god's own birth were central. Birth and childhood deities were important to Roman religion; Ovid identifies Semele's sister Ino as the nurturing goddess Mater Matuta (Eos).

    Semla:






    As you can imagine, I was going to refute everything because the signs don't match, but it turns out in India they do not use "Twins" for Gemini and I am off the hook.

    It is, I think, all of the linguists and historians who are completely positive that despite names and appearances, that the Aswins and Dioscuri are the same Divine Twins.

    They did not mention Shekhinah or Cinnamasta. But I think the key is that they must have a shakti of Immortality, and especially if we look what happens, one observes that Indra having the secret, does not want it getting out.


    From a large selection of Brihadaranyaka Upanishad:


    Indeed this Madhu Vidya not only reveals the transformation of the Inner Self to the heightened level of
    the Supreme Brahman and the incidental methodology of recovering the horse heads to normalcy as of
    original Ashwini Kumars. Moreover the ‘Puraschakre pura sharira’ or the erstwhile form of those since
    initiated to Madhu Vidya would subsequently lead to Purusha Swarupa and further help merge into
    Avyakta Swarupa of Brahman.

    It traces its lineage to Hiranyagarbha, which is called Swayambhu in the original, passing through Paramesthin--Viraj, eventually to Atharvan, Dadhyan, Aswins, Aswin Kumaras, Visvarupa Tvastr, Abhuti Tvastr, Ayasya Angirasa, eventually to Atri and Bharadwaj, ending on Pautimasya.


    In Hinduism


    Symbolically the Aswins are considered to the semidarkness before dawn. They are the only gods called golden-pathed (híranya-vartani). Their two most distinctive and frequent epithets are dasrá wondrous and násatya true.

    They are more closely associated with honey (mádhu) than any of the other gods. They desire honey and are drinkers of it. They have a skin filled with honey; they poured out a hundred jars of honey. They have a honey-goad; and their car is honey-hued and honey-bearing. They give honey to the bee and are compared with bees. They are, however, also fond of Soma, being invited to drink it with Usas and Surya. Their car is sunlike and, together with all its parts, golden. It is threefold and has three wheels. It is swifter than thought, than the twinkling of an eye. It was fashioned by the three divine artificers, the Rbhus. It is drawn by horses, more commonly by birds or winged steeds; sometimes by one or more buffaloes, or by a single asa (rásabha). It passes over the five countries; it moves around the sky; it traverses heaven and earth in one day; it goes round the sun in the distance. Their revolving course (vartís), a term almost exclusively applicable to them, is often mentioned. They come from heaven, air, and earth, or from the ocean; they abide in the sea of heaven, but sometimes their locality is referred to as unknown. The time of their appearance is between dawn and sunrise: when darkness stands among the ruddy cows; Usas awakens them; they follow after her in their car; at its yoking Usas is born. They yoke their car to descend to earth and receive the offerings of worshippers. They come not only in the morning, but also at noon and sunset. They dispel darkness and chase away evil spirits.



    Dadhyan is a hermit. Once Indra taught this hermit Madhuvidyā (the art of mead) Indra told the hermit that his head would be cut off if he taught anybody this art. The Aśvinīdevas approached Dadhyaṅ to learn this art. Fearing Indra the hermit refused to teach them the art. Aśvinīdevas cut off his head and buried it in a place. Then they cut off the head of a horse and fixed it on the neck of Dadhyaṅ. Having the head of the horse he taught the art to the Aśvinīdevas. When Dadhyaṅ had finished teaching, they took away the head of the horse and fixed his own head in place. (Ṛgveda, Maṇḍala 1, Anuvāka, 17, Sūkta 166).

    Dadhyanc is the teacher of Madhu-vidya, the mystical doctrine that brahman is present every where (SB 4.1.5.18). the name of this Vidya comes from the essence of sweetness in all flowers, transformed by bees into honey, which is not apparent to anyone.

    The Asvins give a horse's head to Atharvan's son Dadhyanc (Curds Ward), who then proclaims the location of the mead (madhu) of Tvastr.

    Further along, they are called Ocean-born (abdhi-jau), Sons-of-the-submarine-fire (vadabeyau), Wreathed-with lotuses (pusbara-srajau). Both, Wondrous Dasra and Without Untruth Nasatya, are consorts of the sun's daughter.


    Devi Bhagavata teaches that Devi also transmits Madhu Vidya, as an incorporeal voice, to avoid any harm.





    From different legends, Tvastr's nectar or Soma comes from Garuda Thunderbird Syena or Sena.

    Bogazkoy seal with Indus Script inscription:




    Can be gold, female, charioteer of dawn.

    This is heavily archaeologically examined, and presented with some of our same information in an Homage to Hindu Civilization.

    It is the Homa bird of Avestan.


    It is also the Simurg, which, in Theosophy:


    The gigantic bird of fable likened by some to the hippogriff or griffin; half phoenix, half lion. In the ancient Zoroastrian scriptures of the Avesta, it is described as a gigantic bird whose resting place is the tree Jad-besh (opposed to harm of all seeds); when he rises aloft a thousand twigs shoot forth from that tree; when he alights, he will break off the thousand twigs and shed their seed. The bird Chanmrosh forever sits in that vicinity, and collects the seed which drops from the tree and conveys it where Tishtar seizes the water, so that it may rain on the world.

    In later mythology, as in the epic of Firdusi, the simorgh is depicted as a gigantic bird who finds the infant Zal on the mountain Alberz [Berj], carries him to his nest and rears him “teaching him the language of the country and cultivating his understanding.” Simorgh-anke (simurgh-’anka), the steed of Taimuraz or Tahmurath equivalent to the phoenix or roc, was “a marvelous bird, in truth, intelligent, a polyglot, and even very religious. . . . It complains of its old age, for it is born cycles and cycles before the days of Adam (also Kaimurath). It has witnessed the revolutions of long centuries. It has seen the birth and the close of twelve cycles of 7,000 years each, which multiplied esoterically will give us again 840,000 years” (SD 2:397).

    Behind the tales that have clustered around this wonderful bird, there was a deep symbology: “Simorgh was the guardian of the ancient Persian Mysteries. It is expected to reappear at the end of the cycle as a gigantic bird-lion. Esoterically, it stands as the symbol of the Manvantaric cycle” (TG 299). Simorgh symbolizes the ancient knowledge and the creative life force. In later Persian literature, it represents the perfect man who has exalted himself to the highest degree of freedom.



    And from the article:


    The simurgh was considered to purify the land and waters and hence bestow fertility. The creature represented the union between the earth and the sky, serving as mediator and messenger between the two. The simurgh roosted in Gaokerena, the Hōm (Avestan: Haoma) Tree of Life, which stands in the middle of the world sea Vourukhasa. The plant is potent medicine, is called all-healing, and the seeds of all plants are deposited on it. When the simurgh took flight, the leaves of the tree of life shook making all the seeds of every plant to fall out. These seeds floated around the world on the winds of Vayu-Vata and the rains of Tishtrya, in cosmology taking root to become every type of plant that ever lived, and curing all the illnesses of mankind. The relationship between the simurgh and Hōm is extremely close. Like the simurgh, Hōm is represented as a bird, a messenger and as the essence of purity that can heal any illness or wound. Hōm – appointed as the first priest – is the essence of divinity, a property it shares with the simurgh. The Hōm is in addition the vehicle of farr(ah) (MP: khwarrah, Avestan: khvarenah, kavaēm kharēno) “[divine] glory” or “fortune”. Farrah in turn represents the divine mandate that was the foundation of a king’s authority.”

    Rg Veda on Syena:


    “The hawk, having taken the Soma brought it for the performance of thousands and tens of thousands of yajñas. Here the unbewildered (steady minded) performer of many deeds (Indra) destroyed the bewildered enemies with the help of soma.”

    Bogazkoy is in the Hittite region of Turkey, and the Indic seal dates to 1,400 B. C. E.


    Bokhara:

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    Depths of the Zodiac



    After posting something on Gemini, it became apparent, that dividing the ecliptic into twelve pieces may be an Indian idea, but, the legends about constellations therein are not.

    This post will compare "civilization" to Astrology, the first science.


    I can understand why HPB wanted to separate her "Brotherhood of Luxor" from named organizations such as "Hermetic Brotherhood of Luxor". Without going into great detail, we can say one difference is materialistic--even in the Renaissance, "named" Rosicrucian groups were considered in pursuit of wealth. If I open a Golden Dawn webpage today, it is going to tell me that material success comes before spiritual knowledge. Also, these groups tend to package every tiny little detail and create ceremonial magic. So you get another outer form of ritual behavior, again rather than spiritual knowledge.


    The little we know of what she called a Brotherhood amounted to maybe seven adepts with a handful of disciples apiece, not a social club.

    They took names from both obvious westernisms, such as Solomon, and then there was the odd introduction of Ellora. Both of those are a type of Masonic Temple, but, in this case, Ellora is not particularly old. It was built in multiple phases probably from around the 5-600s. It is not anywhere close to the age of the Temple of Solomon, let alone Luxor.


    We have to conclude that Greece has a symbol which is not like Egypt, it specifically gives the Temple Pillars to Gemini and selects a set of male twins. Subba Row doesn't mention any heroes or stars and felt that the whole sign was satisfied by a single sentence:


    As the word plainly indicates, this sign is intended to represent the first androgyne, the Ardhanârîshwara, the bi-sexual Sephira-Adam Kadmon.


    So, no, if we take "that kind" of Gemini, it is thoroughly explained in India, ruled by Mercury, but that is not the way most of us know it as "The Twins".


    Then there was the suggestion that ancient Egypt is also supposed to be derived from Indic origins.


    Her "western Brotherhood" is supposed to be named in just this way, by saying "Luxor" is originally Indian.


    To me, that seemed highly unlikely, but we have just found the Hittite Empire with an emblem of a magic bird using Indus script around 1,400 B. C. E., which is similar to Phoenix and Garuda and highly persistent through Persian Empires and the Byzantine Empire.

    Luxor is Thebes, site of the temple aligned to Spica.

    The name is said to be Arabic, romanized: al-ʾuqṣur, lit. 'the palace'.

    The city attracted peoples such as the Babylonians, the Mitanni, the Hittites of Anatolia (modern-day Turkey), the Canaanites of Ugarit, the Phoenicians of Byblos and Tyre, the Minoans from the island of Crete.

    Although that becomes true, "Luxor" is foreign and not original.

    It ranks highly in the list of oldest continuously inhabited areas, starting with its first Egyptian name wAs.t (approximate pronunciation: "Waset"), which meant "city of the sceptre", since:

    c. 2150 BC


    It is the city of goddess Mut:


    Mut replaced Amun’s earlier wife, Amanuet (the invisible goddess) during the middle Kingdom. Mut was believed to have existed since primeval times, existing along side Nun, the primeval waters (possibly because she replaced Amaunet who was one of the ancient gods of the Ogdoad – the great eight – who lived in the waters).

    The Theban triad of Amun, Mut, and Khonsu were worshipped at the Temple of Amun at Luxor (Ipet-Resyt). Khonsu means "The Traveler" and he was god of the moon. Similar to the the Abydos Triad of Osiris, Isis, and Horus.


    In the Eleventh Dynasty ca. 2100 B. C. E, Thebes becomes important because:


    An inscription carved during the reign of Wahankh Intef II shows that he was the first of this dynasty to claim to rule over the whole of Egypt, a claim which brought the Thebans into conflict with the rulers of Herakleopolis Magna, Dynasty X. Intef undertook several campaigns northwards, and captured the important nome of Abydos.



    The indeterminably ancient Mut was also closely associated with a number of other goddesses such as Isis and Nut, and was worshipped as a member of a number of composite deities.

    mother - mwt

    was a Vulture:


    She was "Mut, Who Giveth Birth, But Was Herself Not Born of Any". Another reason why Mut may have been seen as being able to have conceived by herself was the ancient Egyptian believe that there were no male griffon vultures (the vulture of the Egyptian goddesses and royalty). (This vulture (Gyps fulvus) has no significant markings between the female and the male of the species.) They believed that this bird conceived with the wind.


    There is a famous Stele used in Thelema which shows a type of transitional hypostasis from Montu, the original deity, to the priest Khonsu.

    Against Heliopolis:


    The priests of Waset (Thebes, Modern Luxor), on the other hand, declared that Waset was the site of the Nun's water, and the rising of the primeval mound. Amun, the creator god of Waset, was originally one of the Ogdoad and became the most powerful god of the area. They believed that Amen changed from the invisible chaos deity into the primeval mound. In this form, he created the other gods. He created the lotus, which opened to reveal the child form of Amun-Ra, who then finished the creation of the world. Nun, although he was a powerful force, was thought to have been inert until Amen awoke him from torpor, and used his chaotic waters to create the universe.



    Amun resembles Mesha--Aja--Aries:


    Amen or Amun means to be hidden or unseen, was one of the ogdoad in Khmunu (Hermopolis). Amen was a ram headed god that was merged with the god Ra and became known as the King of the gods.

    Mut is the wife of Amen and the mother of Khonsu. In the Egyptian Hieroglyph her name means mother. She is depicted wearing a white vulture as her crown. She became known as the cosmic mother that all things were derived from.


    At her Precinct:


    In the northeast corner is the structure known as Temple A and according to Brooklyn Museum's exhibition on the Precinct of Mut, it was also called the "Temple of Millions of Years" and was dedicated to Rameses II and the god Amun-Ra. Within the temple are two stelae, one referring to Rameses II's work on Temple A and the other telling of his marriage to Hittite princess. The Brooklyn Museum states that Temple A did not become a part of the Mut Precinct until the 25th Dynasty under the reign of the Ku****e king, Taharqa and during which time it became a birthing house, "mammisi", where Ancient Egyptians would celebrate the birth of the god Khonsu, the son of Amun-Ra and Mut.

    Surrounding the Mut Temple proper, on three sides, is a sacred lake called the Isheru.






    In saying it is "linked" to the Pleiades:


    ...the mortuary temple of king Mentouhotep (2040 BC) became the capital of Egypt and was named Waset, after the original fourth nomos of Upper Egypt; from the New Kingdom on it became an alternative name for Nout / Dios Polis.


    The original name sounds congruous with the power of the Waset:



    The Was scepter on the other hand represents the power and dominion of gods, pharaohs, and priests over such an enemy presence. Amplified by amulets such as the ankh (key of life) and the djed-pillar (god’s backbone/stability), the Was scepter is a symbol of truth, order and control...

    with, eventually, Amun at Karnak being:


    ...the largest religious structure ever built by man.


    Ancient Waset traditions held that Djehuti (“Thoth” in his Greek colonial designation) was responsible for creation of the Ogdoad, eight primordial deities complementarily paired to bring forth order from the four original properties of chaos: (i) Amun/Amaunet (invisibility); (ii) Hah/Hauhet (infinity/eternity); (iii) Nun/Naunet (waters and the sky); and (iv) Kuk/Kauket (darkness).

    For Mut:

    The hieroglyphic depiction of the goddess’s name is the same griffon vulture (gyps fulvus) used to write the letter “A” (alpha in Greek) and the word “mother”…

    Mut’s hermaphroditic representation (she has a penis in some depictions)...



    Or in Complete form:


    In some vignettes to Chapter 164 of the Book
    of the Dead, beginning in the 21st dynasty, Mut is
    also depicted as a composite deity with out-
    stretched wings, an erect phallus and three heads -
    those of a vulture, lion and human.


    and at Dendera:

    In her role as deity of
    sexuality and fertility, wooden and stone phalli
    were dedicated to Hathor and in at least one of her
    festivals a model phallus was carried in procession
    in formal reference to this aspect of her nature.

    her son:


    Neferhetep was also viewed
    as a divine ram and symbol of male potency. He
    was said to be loved by ‘wives at the site of his
    beauty’ in which beauty is a circumlocution for the
    god’s phallus.


    ...at Thebes
    Hathor was identified with Mut, and at Elephantine
    with Sothis.


    Next, we are more familiar with Greek and Arabic versions of Waset's second Egyptian name:


    ...later in Demotic Egyptian as ta jpt (conventionally pronounced as "tA ipt" and meaning "the shrine/temple", referring to the jpt-swt, the temple now known by its Arabic name Karnak, meaning "fortified village"), which the ancient Greeks adapted as Thebai and the Romans after them as Thebae.

    The Sahidic Coptic name Pape comes from Demotic Ỉp.t "the adyton", which, in turn, is derived from the Egyptian.


    The area around Karnak was the ancient Egyptian Ipet-isut ("The Most Selected of Places") and the main place of worship of the 18th Dynastic Theban Triad, with the god Amun as its head.






    Alright. Compared to India, Balochistan is strongly related to the Indus Valley:


    Balochistan occupies the very southeastern most portion of the Iranian Plateau, the setting for the earliest known farming settlements in the pre-Indus Valley civilisation era, the earliest of which was Mehrgarh, dated at 7000 BCE, within the province. Balochistan marked the westernmost extent of civilisation.

    Balochistan marked the westernmost territory of the civilisation, which was one of the most developed in the old Bronze Age in the world.



    We haven't said anything about the more than thirty natural formations and whether anybody believed them to have been manmade ruins:










    What actually seems to have happened is a mixture of good and bad. It is "good" because it is open-minded compared to previous rigid ideals, and "bad" in the way it may be a little too open, and hence, riddled with inaccuracies. This may be the first significant example, from 1854, India in Greece. Here, in explaining how Egypt is a clone, we are told:


    That city was " Luxor," so named from " Lukshur," in
    Beloochistan, a place situated on the route from Bela to
    Kedjee, forty miles west of the former town.* While this
    parent town remains in obscurity...


    *Thornton's Punjab, vol. II p. 26.



    He doesn't even know what he is talking about, but the linguistic identity is true, because he said so. In other words, he has nothing from Egypt where they mention this, and not even a local anecdote as to why there may be something to it. He just belts out a conclusion, which is foregone because that is the way his whole book is made.


    We can in turn follow his source to the 1844 Gazeteer:

    LUKHSUR, in Beloochistan, a village on the route from
    Belah to Kedje, and forty miles west of the former town. Lat.
    26° 14', long. 65° 52'.


    A zombie might miss this, but, two brief entries above, there is:


    LUKH, in Beloochistan, a pass twenty miles west of
    Belah, on the route from that town to Kedje. The word means a
    Pass. Lat. 26° 10', long. 66° 9'.


    At that point I have greater confidence the name is related to a local natural feature, than it is copied to Egypt.

    It means "a pass", not "a palace".

    It also happened to be the case that Balochistan was petty states from the time of Nader Shah through the printings of these books, as we can find this road's destination in a major British concern, Pretensions of Persia 1863:


    Khan’s Mekran being in 62° 30.” longtitude, Kedje, the capital...


    and then find out it is spelled various ways, as in India of Aurangzeb:


    In this province from the limits of Multan and Uchto Thatha and Kiraj -Mekran*, there are high
    northern
    mountains of hard stone, where the tribe of Baluch and
    a few Afghans live. Southwards from Uch to Gujrat,
    are sandhills and the abodes of the Bhatti (to which
    the chief of Jesalmir belongs by birth) and other Rajput
    clans.

    *The A-text may also be read as Ganj-Mekran. The Am(ii. 336) has Kach and Mekran. Jarrett takes the word Kiraj
    as an Arab corruption of Kachh (334 n.) Elliot holds that Kiraj
    was situated in Kachh (i. 391.) In Walker's map, the capital of
    Mekran is given as Kedje^ 26 28'N 62 28'E.


    In this area they also mention:


    Seventy kos from Thatha is Niklajit a place sacred
    to Durga, and situated between the north and the west,
    near the ocean.

    Not identified*


    ...the path through the desert, the absence of water and the
    plundering
    habits of the Bhil tribe, it is hard for any
    one to reach this place. But some Fakirs, esp.
    Sanyasis naked from head to foot, having chosen a life
    of hunger and thirst, reach this place and perform
    worship.

    The Sodah have been identified by Tod with the Sogdoi
    of the Greek historians. Hunter speaks of the Jareja Rajputs as
    the ruling race in Cutch (I. G. iv. 61) and of the Sodah tribe as
    "formerly the dominant race in Thar and Parkar." (xiii. 266.)


    One might not think it means much more than Col. Tod thought the name was similar. It is unlikely he had much archaeological or genetic material. He may not be wrong, but, it is bizarre the way some people agree with each other. Then we wind up with enforcement gangs for what should be theories.

    The road, in fact, is still going, as studied in 1991 USAID Balochistan Road Project:


    Awaran Sub-Division of Khuzdar District

    For the first 5 Km from Zero point
    near Kaniki River, the road traverses through a
    flat to gently rolling
    terrain with little agricultural activities (barani and
    riverain). From Km 5 to about Km 17, the road
    passes through almost barren mountains of the Hala Range at Lak Pass.


    The hilly tracts of Lak pass and Serd pass seem to devoid of any mammal population. This is
    ...[due to lacking a]...permanent water body and
    vegetation in this area...


    They happened to have matched Hala or "Hellen of the Greeks" with Lukshur "the first Luxor", in the English interpretation, in one sentence.

    The mountains in question are generally parallel to the Indus River, as in Alden 1886:


    Caspian Sea, Russian Empire, White Mountains, Black Mountains, Kafiristan, Persian Gulf, Arabian Sea, Hala Mountains








    On this one, there is "Kech", and we can tell that a "pass" near Bela must be upriver from Hingla:







    The reason not to dismiss "Lukshur" as trivial is due to its proximity to Hingla.

    If we ignore the linguistic "Luxor = Lukshur", if we just said it always meant Lukshur and this was the western branch of something, it would make sense. Hingla clearly "goes east" and is responsible for the Shakti Fire at Puri. To a certain extent, she also "goes north" as Alchemy. She perhaps is similar to the Red Granite of Egypt.


    The Met is in a position to compare a wide variety of objects and they say:


    Cinnabar has been mined and used as a precious resource by many cultures around the globe since at least the 10th millennium B.C.

    It was also applied to skulls and bones as part of burial rituals in neolithic cultures in Anatolia, China, Galilee, Spain, and Syria, and in many cultures of the ancient Americas.


    One of their earlier samples is:

    2700–2500 B.C. Greek


    which shows that it had to be imported to the Cyclades between Greece and Asia Minor.

    It is also available at Giza in Egypt, and perhaps:


    The primary prehistoric use of the mineral was grinding it to create vermillion, and its earliest known use for this purpose is at the Neolithic site of Çatalhöyük in Turkey (7000-8000 BC), where wall paintings included cinnabar's vermillion.




    The province of Balochistan has rarely been stable because of the presence of nomads who did not mix particularly well with those in fixed houses.

    Such a fixed house has much to do with the Gemini symbol as used in the west.

    Some of the original inhabitants are the Lasi and the Dravidian Brahui.



    The "India in Greece" ideas tell the Egyptians that:


    They are, however, the
    descendants of the Nasumones, or people of " Nasumon,"
    in the northern Punjab, situate on the north bank of the
    Chenab, on the great route from India to Cashmir.'

    The grand abode of the Bhils, or Bhiloi, has already been
    shown in ^' Philai," both town and island, placed opposite
    Syene, or " Aswa," that is, " the Aswas," or worshippers
    of Baal, or " The Sun."


    He determined that there is a Brotherhood of Baluchistan:


    Bhai, properly "a brother," is a term used among the warlike Rajpoots
    to denote the Bhayaud, or " brotherhood," the military clans which hold
    their respective villages by a purely feudal tenure.


    And then tells everyone in Greece that:


    The chiefs of this country were called " Helaines," or
    the " Chiefs of the Hela.'^ I have not the slightest doubt,
    however, that both the name of this mountain, and that
    of the chiefs of the country, was of a secondary form, viz.,
    ^'Heli,'' "the sun,'' demonstrating that they were of
    the genuine race of Rajpoots, who were all worshippers
    of that luminary. In this case the formation of the term
    Helenes in Sanscrit, would be identical with the Greek.



    Around 3,000 B. C. E., there was such a thing as India, Egypt, and Crete, compared to which, mainland Greece is believed to have been settled around 2,000 B. C. E. by:


    Ionians and Achaeans, which resulted in Mycenaean Greece by the 16th century BC.

    Subsequently by Dorians around 1,200 B. C. E., which resulted in pan-Hellenism becoming a subject of concern in classical antiquity.

    Most works on Hellen just speak of him as being from Greece, there is nothing migratory or non-Greek even implied.

    Pyrrha:


    In Latin, the word pyrrhus means red from the Greek adjective πυρρός, purrhos, i.e. "flame coloured", "the colour of fire", "fiery red" or simply "red" or "reddish". Pyrrha was evidently named after her red hair as Horace and Ovid describe her as red haired.


    She is the Flood Myth and re-population under the guidance of Themis.


    He uses the expression "Hela Ina" for, evidently, chiefs in the Hela or Hala mountains. Hel or Hela does not seem to have a related Sanskrit meaning, but it possibly could be these mountains combined with Ina:

    Ina (इन).—m.

    (-naḥ) 1. The sun. 2. A master, a lord. 3. A king.

    7) Name of an Āditya


    With a slight adjustment we do see the familiar:


    Heli (हेलि).—[hel + i], m. 1. The sun (borrowed from ), Bhaviṣyap., see Aufrecht, Ujjvalad. 267, n. 2. Embracing.

    4) 2. heli m. ([Greek] ἥλιος; for 1. heli See above) the sun, [Varāha-mihira’s Bṛhat-saṃhitā; Purāṇa]

    Bhaviṣyatpurāṇa



    There is, you might say, a dialectal equivalent of Baal:


    ~[mati] see ~[buddhi; ~ravi] the early morning sun;

    baal (बाल) is alternatively transliterated as Bāla.

    Bāla (बाल) or Bālasūrya refers to the “rising (sun)”

    1) Bālāditya (बालादित्य):—[from bāla] m. the newly risen sun, morning sun, [Mahābhārata]



    The city probably is not the Indian Horse because:


    Aswan is the ancient city of Swenett, later known as Syene, which in antiquity was the frontier town of Ancient Egypt facing the south.

    The Greeks associated her to the Cretan cave goddess Eileithyia:


    The Cave of Eileithyia near Amnisos, the harbor of Knossos, mentioned in the Odyssey (xix.189) in connection with her cult, was accounted the birthplace of Eileithyia.

    Here she was probably being worshipped before Zeus arrived in the Aegean, but certainly in Minoan–Mycenaean times. The goddess is mentioned as Eleuthia in a Linear B fragment from Knossos, where it is stated that her temple is given an amphora of honey.


    Whereas there is evidence that shows Swennett's Hippopotamus form existed separately in Crete as the Minoan Genius and:


    The other common composite mythological beast seen in Minoan art is the griffin—a widespread figure around the Ancient Near East. These may pull deities in chariots, as on the Hagia Triada Sarcophagus.



    It seems reasonable to say the archaic goddess is forcibly hypostasized, in the sense that a more primeval deified Astrology is adjusted somewhat to account for the story of the Zodiac:


    In the New Kingdom Taweret's image was frequently used to represent a northern constellation in zodiacs. This image is attested in several astronomical tomb paintings, including the Theban tombs of Tharwas (tomb 353), Hatshepsut's famed advisor Senenmut (tomb 232), and the pharaoh Seti I (KV17) in the Valley of the Kings. The image of this astral Taweret appears almost exclusively next to the Setian foreleg of a bull. The latter image represents the Big Dipper and is associated with the Egyptian god of chaos, Seth. The relationship between the two images is discussed in the Book of Day and Night (a cosmically focused mythological text from the Twentieth Dynasty, c. 1186–1069 BCE) as follows: "As to this foreleg of Seth, it is in the northern sky, tied down to two mooring posts of flint by a chain of gold. It is entrusted to Isis as a hippopotamus guarding it." Although the hippopotamus goddess is identified in this text as Isis, not Taweret, this phenomenon is not uncommon in later periods of Egyptian history. When assuming a protective role, powerful goddesses like Isis, Hathor, and Mut assumed the form of Taweret, effectively becoming a manifestation of this goddess. Likewise, Taweret gradually absorbed qualities of these goddesses and is commonly seen wearing the Hathoric sun disc that is iconographically associated with both Hathor and Isis.


    as to whether or not it may be related to the Indian "Elephanta", the Aswan temple is the:

    ...formerly separate community on the island of Elephantine...


    From WordSense:


    Abu: …the Babylonian calendar. The ancient Egyptian name for the city of Elephantine, near modern day Aswan.

    syenite: syenite (English) Origin & history Borrowing from Latin Syēnītēs‎, from Syēnē‎ ("Aswan"), because it was anciently quarried there.


    It is the Island of Khnum.


    Syene is:


    equidistant from Alexandria and Meroe.


    Syene (Egyptian, Souanou, Coptic, Souan) was originally the marketplace of the island of Elephantine (in Egyptian, Abou).


    It is the source of the mathematical introspection into curvature of the earth:


    At Syene, the Sun is at the zenith at noon, while at Alexandria it is not exactly overhead.


    From the time of the ancient empire royal Egyptian envoys went there to look for the stone destined for the sarcophagus of the king.


    As to its Egyptian root, swnw:


    Possibly related to swn (“to trade, to buy”), swnt (“trade, price”).



    India in Greece supposes the Hellenics are descended from Rajputs of the Horse or Haya who:


    defeated the king of Kasi, Divodasa or Dhanvantari.


    And so again, I don't know how he doesn't know what he is talking about, since these have a fairly clear story in their own Kingdom:


    After the fall of Haihaya Empire, all Kshatriya rulers (feudal of Haihayas) of Earth were killed by Lord Parshurama.




    There are straightforward meanings of Haya:


    Haya (हय):—(yaḥ) 1. m. A horse; number seven; Indra; man of a particular tribe.

    1) Haya (हय):—a m. (ifc. f(ā). ; [from] √1. hi) a horse, [Ṛg-veda] etc. etc.

    2) a symbolical expression for the number ‘seven’ (on account of the 7 horses of the Sun), [Śrutabodha]

    3) the zodiacal sign Sagittarius, [Varāha-mihira’s Bṛhat-saṃhitā]



    Concerning the First Dynasty:


    ...in west-central India between 6th and 7th centuries. They are also known as the Haihayas or as the Early Kalachuris to distinguish them from their later namesakes...

    Epigraphic and numismatic evidence suggests that the earliest of the Ellora and Elephanta cave monuments were built during the Kalachuri rule.

    The origin of the dynasty is uncertain.

    ...the Kalachuris conquered northern Konkan (around Elephanta) by the mid-6th century.


    Historical evidence suggests that he may have commissioned the Shaivite monuments at the Elephanta Caves and the earliest of the Brahmanical caves at Ellora, where his coins have been discovered.


    According to the origin in Malwa:


    Ujjain, also known historically as Ujjaiyini and Avanti, emerged as the first major centre in the Malwa region during India's second wave of urbanisation in the 7th century BC (the first wave was the Indus Valley Civilization).

    Avanti was an important kingdom in western India; it was ruled by the Haihayas, a people who were responsible for the destruction of Naga power in western India.


    According to India:


    Ujjain is ancient and historical city that is 5000 years old.

    Ujjain is described at length in SkandPurana and is considered the place of origination of Mangal Griha.

    One great importance of Ujjain is its central location scientifically. Astrology began and developed in this centrally located city of Mahakaal.

    Ujjain has provided the system of calculation of time to India and Foreign countries. This type of the natural geographical and astrological importance of Ujjain is needed to be understood.

    As per Garuda Puran there seven cities that can provide salvation and out of them Avantika city is considered the best as the importance of Ujjain is little bit more than other cities.


    It is the crucible of Time:


    As per the Surya Siddhanta, a 4th-century astronomical treatise, Ujjain is geographically situated at the precise spot where the zero meridian of longitude and the Tropic of Cancer intersect. This is why it was considered the navel of the earth, and is called the “Greenwich of India”.

    This imaginary line is also said to pass through Ujjain’s temple of Mangalnath, considered in Hindu cosmogony to be the birthplace of Mangal (Mars) and the closest point from Earth to Mars, explained Piyush.

    The Surya Siddhanta provides one of the earliest known descriptions of standard time in India. Postulating a spherical Earth, the book describes the prime meridian or zero longitude, as passing through Avanti (Ujjain), and Rohitaka (Rohtak) in Haryana.

    Vikram Samvat or Ujjain Calendar


    As well as Oscillating Obliquity there is the Prime Meridian:


    In India this line was always drawn through Ujjain. This is stated in all ancient texts on astronomy, as well as in the epics Mahabharata and Ramayana etc. It is what made Ujjain a very sacred city. Dedicated especially to Sacred Time. The main Shiva temple here is dedicated to Mahakala, Great Time. All Indian traditional calendars and all sacred time is calculated from this line. It is also the basis for geographical calculations.

    with the Tropics measured to fluctuate:

    22.1 and 24.5 degrees on a 41,000-year cycle



    The Hayas, however, killed Vishnu:


    Dhanvantari, said to be the physician of the Gods was produced at the churning of the ocean with a cup of Amṛta in his hands.

    Dhanvantari (धन्वन्तरि).—An avatār of Viṣṇu; a son of Dīrghatam(p)as, the originator of the Āyurveda, and the father of Ketuman.

    A deva who was a preceptor in Āyurveda. Origin. The devas and asuras together churned the milky ocean, Kṣīrābdhi, to salvage Amṛta (Nectar) from it. After thousand years there arose from the ocean a deva with a Kamaṇḍalu (water-pot of ascetics) in one hand and a daṇḍa in the other. That deva was Dhanvantari, (Śloka 31, Sarga 45, Bāla Kāṇḍa, Vālmīki Rāmāyaṇa).

    Son of Rāṣṭra (son of Kāśi). He was the inaugurator of medical science (Āyurveda) and an incarnation of Vāsudeva (Viṣṇu). He had a son called Ketumān. (see Bhāgavata Purāṇa 9.17.4).


    Tod refers to the Ahi Haya and their intra-Indian origin.


    They have a Second Kingdom post-1,000.


    India In Greece is quoted at length to discuss Hindu Colonization.


    Dhanvantari is also called Abja.

    There is a Dhanvantari Homa and the yearly festival Dhanteras:


    People who worship Lord Dhanvantari by lighting an earthen lamp (Diya) on the threshold of their houses are blessed with good health.


    This incarnation is, in a sense, the brother of Lakshmi:


    Dhanvantari is considered to be the incarnation of Lord Vishnu. He emerged from the milk ocean on the day of Dhanvantari Trayodashi which is celebrated as the National Ayurveda Day in India by the government.


    He introduced and taught the science of Ayurveda to the world as the King of Banaras.


    The Zodiacal sign simply has the name Dhanu, which corresponds to his father in the following:



    According to the Harivaṃśa, Dhanva—the ancestor of Divodāsa—is stated to have performed a putrakāmeṣṭiyāgya and prayed to Abja (Ādi-Dhanvantari) to be born to him as his son. The prayer was granted and the son born to him was named Dhanvantari, after Abja. He subsequently became a pupil of sage Bhāradvāja who taught him Āyurveda and Bheṣakriyā.




    The sign, Dhanu, may have alternate spellings such as:

    Dhanuṣa (धनुष) or Dhanvin


    Once there is a scene of Rivalry:

    When Vāsuki heard this he sent the serpent-maid, Manasādevī, a disciple of Śiva, to face Dhanvantari. Manasādevī and Gaḍūra were both disciples of Śiva. But Dhanvantari was a follower of Gaḍūra. Manasādevī made all the disciples of Dhanvantari swoon but the latter because of his great proficiency is Viṣavidyā soon brought back his disciples to normal. When Manasādevī found that it was impossible to defeat Dhanvantari or his disciples by using poison Manasādevī took the triśūla given to her by Śiva and aimed it at Dhanvantari. Seeing this Śiva and Brahmā appeared before them and pacifying them sent them all their way.



    In most respects, we should say that Dhanvanatari is very orthodox, so much so, he may be taken for the only god of healing. The sign is also ruled by the very orthodox planet:


    This also explains why Guru (Jupiter) has ownership of this sign. No other planet has any special impact on this sign unless it operates under Guru's authority and jurisdiction.


    And yet on careful inspection, he is also related to Horse:


    Śrī Dhanvantari is incarnation of Aśvinī (Dasra) avatāra. Aśvinī Kumar rule the first nakṣatra of the zodiac and exalt the Sun thereby being respected as divine physicians.

    Ayurveda tradition: Origin Brahmā composed Ayurveda in 100,000 śloka
    → taught Aśvinī Kumara (Nakṣatra №1 of natural zodiac and maps to lagna nakṣatra)
    → taught Devarāja Indra (Lagna, East digpāla)
    → taught Dhanvantari



    "Dhanteras" really commemorates Churning of the Ocean, and it may take place in Aswin Month:


    In Hindu astrology, Ashvin begins with the Sun's enter into Virgo.

    Ashvini is the first star that appears in the evening sky. In Indian astrology, it is the head of Aries, or the first of the 27 Nakshatra. Ashvin also stands for the divine twins, the Ashvins, the gods of vision, Ayurvedic medicine, the glow of sunrise and sunset, and the aversion of misfortune and sickness in Hindu mythology.

    The Ashvins are described as representing the "blending of light and darkness" during the twilight period.

    It begins with:

    Navaratri

    Diwali festival (amanta tradition), including Dhanteras (28 lunar Ashvin)



    But this may look very different if using:


    Diwali (purnimanta tradition), including Govatsa Dwadashi (Kartika 12), Dhanteras (Kartika 13)


    It is in a different month depending on which system marks the End of a Month:


    Two traditions have been followed in the Indian subcontinent with respect to lunar months: the amanta tradition, which ends the lunar month on new moon day (similar to the Islamic calendar) and the purnimanta tradition, which ends it on full moon day.


    One name for the month of Sagittarius is "Agrahayana" or "Beginning of the Year" and:


    The aligning of this name with the Mṛgaśiras Nakṣatra (lambda orionis), gives rise to speculation that this name may have been given when the sun was near Orion at the time of vernal equinox, i.e. around 7000 years ago.


    There has arisen the concern that the present "Time of Troubles" is due to Ketu, and subsequently the Winter Solstice, transiting the Galactic Center:


    2020-2021 marked the transit of Ketu, the South Node of the Moon or Tail of the Serpent, one of the two eclipse points, over this same region of the Galactic Center, which is located in the Vedic Lunar Constellation or Nakshatra of Mula ruled by Ketu, and relates to the cosmic force of Nirriti, indicating danger, conflict, destruction, and yet the promise of transformation and new birth. Such challenging influences will remain for some time.


    Hindu Astrology associates this entity to the name Mula:


    The centre of this galaxy, the Milky Way, lies in this nakshatra, hence the name Mula.


    Mūla means “the root” and is associated with the deity known as Nirṛti (Goddess of destruction).


    This may be an exaggeration:


    Mula nakshatra is, perhaps, the most mysterious lunar mansion. Unlike other nakshatras, it doesn’t consist of stars, but its main portion on the sky contains Galactic Center, a supermassive black hole, around which our solar system is revolving in the cycle of cosmic evolution.


    Because the asterism is not physically part of Sagittarius:


    Tail of Scorpio


    or the alternate version:

    Two Stars and then a Conch in Sagttarius.


    From details on Mula:


    The centre of the milky way is said to lie at about 6 degrees sagittarius. With is the second pada of Mula. When we zoom out and look at the whole universe we find the a swirling dust cloud of the milky way looking like a flat spiral disk with a slight bulge in the middle. On the dark nights when we can clearly see the stars of scorpions tail we will see a kind fo stellar cloudiness that is said to be the milky way. Mula represents that mid-point. This bulge is sometimes depicted as a tortoise shell, but also as mount Meru, or perhaps mula is where these two meet; at the pivot point. Some call it the “Black Sun.” All the planets including the sun orbit around this cosmic centre. This is the womb of the great goddess. The four elephants that are said to support the earth actually represent the four cardinal directions of the milky way galaxy.


    Another name for Mula is said to be Vichrita.


    The name Vichrita is attached on the page for Nakshatrayana, but not on Nakshatra which otherwise has an adequate table.


    We see that Mula is baleful, but, I did not see a medieval Indian text stating it to be a supermassive black hole and all this. They could easily call it the "center" if they so choose. It may not even be a physical "mula", such as the idea of an Axis in Cosmic Soma:


    The opposite side of the zodiac or the 0 Sagittarius area was, on the contrary, a region of death and poison, the worst place in the zodiac for the Moon to be located at birth–said to signify death of the person or death in his family. It is marked by two Nakshatras, Jyestha at the end of Scorpio (16 40 – 30 00) said to kill the eldest born (Jyestha-ghna) and Mula at the beginning of Sagittarius (00 – 13 20) said to be ruled by Nirriti or the Goddess of calamity, said to pull out the root of the family (Mula-barhana, also called Vichrita in the Vedas). As early as the Atharva Veda, there are several hymns to protect a person from the influence of these two malefic Nakshatras (VI.110, 112, 117, 121). Clearly the Taurus-Gemini side of the Milky Way represents the nectar of immortality or Soma, while the opposite Scorpio-Sagittarius side of the Milky Way represents poison or death. Rohini and Jyeshta: Taurus and Scorpio.

    There are two important first magnitude red giant stars almost exactly opposite each other in Taurus and Scorpio; Aldeberan (Alpha Taurus) called Rohini in Vedic thought and Antares (Alpha Scorpio) called Jyestha in Vedic thought. They are located around 18 degrees of Taurus and 20 degrees of Scorpio (according to Surya Siddhanta VIII.4 and VIII.18. They mark the doorways to the Milky Way.

    This Aldeberan-Antares or Rohini-Jyeshta axis is the main line of good fortune and misfortune in the Vedic zodiac that provides a key to the signs as well. We can link it with the Milky Way axis with which its meanings are aligned.


    Akin to Hermes:


    In Vedic thought, the planet Mercury is regarded as having both male and female sides, to be half-male and half-female, or alternatively male and female.






    When we add in Plato and Pythagoras, they give us the concept of Atlantis.

    So far, most modern scholarship still holds that the Greeks are a re-shuffling of relatively local Pelasgians, with their own name of Hellas being personally determined. Not that they are an Indian colony, or, as mentioned in Theosophy, may have descendants of Poseidonis from far to the west.


    We found that India had a land-based gate to the west near Bela, probably even into 5,000 B. C. E. Harrapan or Indus Valley times. But we will find another one, which was relevant until around 3,000 B. C. E. in the Age of Taurus. Atlantis had phases of disappearance, first a major cataclysm some million years ago, and then a final or minor one matching the Flood Myth and what is usually held in Geology to be then end of the:


    Little Ice Age which ended around 10,000 years ago, which altered coastlines, so it is entirely possible that the Stairways of Malta were not built underwater.


    I usually stick to some of the basics and classics, such as Ignatius Donnelly's Atlantis, the Antediluvian World:


    Published in 1882, ATAW is one of the best constructed Atlantis theories, as it makes no recourse to occult or 'channeled' information. Donnelly's lucid style and command of the facts (such as they were) make the book readable and compelling even today....--JBH



    And then--not taking anything too literally, but suggestive--are the Four Map Periods from W. Scott Elliot's Story of Atlantis:



















    What is interesting is that in the last one, what we call the Gobi Desert was an inland sea.

    This matches geological study which indicates there was a time when Himalayan glacier melt contributed to something like an inland paradise.

    Then through relatively recent history, everything dried out until the last significant settlement in Takla Makan dessicated around our year 600. Indian history strongly suggests that Uttara Kuru or "Great North Country" was around Lake Baikal, which perhaps makes sense with respect to the slowly fading sea shown above.

    In Nepal we have the legend of Manjushri who is said to have split open the Chobhar Gorge and drain a lake and thereby make Kathmandu Valley inhabitable.

    Geological studies indicate this was an event and that it was about 30,000 years ago.

    Manjushri is from Wu Tai Shan which is Five Peak Mountain in China almost to the Mongolian border.

    Is it possible this legend is 30,000 years old?


    It is not hard to imagine ancient and very extensive routes of migration. The Denisovan which was found in Siberia is thought to be generally unrelated to us, however, some New Guineans are up to 5% Denisovan.


    A standard is perhaps set by Dwarka, city of Krishna:


    Seals, inscriptions, which have been dated to 1500 BC.

    Pottery, which have been dated to 3528 BC.

    On the other hand explorations conducted in the Gulf of Cambay waters revealed sandstone walls, a grid of streets and some evidence of a sea port 70 feet under water, and artefacts dating back to 7500BC.

    Eroded debris and pottery provided evidence of a port town destroyed by sea about 3,500 years ago.



    The layout of the excavated city, the spread and the location of fort walls and bastions match the descriptions mentioned in Harivamsha, a prologue to Mahabharata. Harivamsha described the city of Dwarka in minute details. According to it, the area of Dwarka was 12 yojanas. It was connected to the mainland by a strip, which is visible even now, in low tide. The city excavated is of the same size.


    Based on the correlation between the excavated structures and artefacts with the description of Dwarka in Harivamsha purana, and the fact that the carbon dating of artefacts fall around 3500BC, the same period concluded by many astronomical analysts as the period of the Mahabharata war and the submersion of Dwarka, it is more than reasonable to conclude that the excavated site near Bet Dwarka is indeed the legandary city of Dwarka.

    The discovery of the second exploration at Gulf of Khambat proves that it was not just Dwarka that got submersed, but more costal regions got encroached by the sea over centuries, and the dating of artefacts to 7500BC indicates that the ancient indian civilization is more than 9000 years old, and the entire coastal regions has been going under sea from 9000BC, and this phenomenon took over the city of Dwarka by around 3500BC.





    Dwarka is considered to have been an international sea port, which makes it compatible with the older parts of Egypt.

    Then it certainly shows the loss of something with the Age of Taurus.




    In conjunction with the Map Periods, we could say:


    Tectonic plate drift is not observable.

    The plates may slip, horizontally, a few meters. What they are actually doing is moving up and down like pegs.

    So the two older maps represent cataclysms, and then you get to Poseidonis and the Flood, which is just a minor cataclysm, this one being remembered in multiple cultures and traceable in several ways.


    There is a smaller place that is almost as continuous:


    The hilltop of Tell Baalbek, part of a valley to the east of the northern Beqaa Valley (Latin: Coelesyria), shows signs of almost continual habitation over the last 8–9000 years.


    The Indian one is probably the genuine article. Matches the national epic. Was in a process of perishing around the time of the chart for Krishna's death.

    Correspondingly:


    According to the Mahabharata’s 23rd and 34th stanzas, the city was inundated and submerged by the Arabian Sea on the same day that Krishna departed the Earth to join the spiritual world after 125 years, and this is when the Kali age began.



    HPB is reasonably accurate about Mut:


    Her attributes are those of the world-mother, the inscriptions upon the ruins of her temple at Thebes address her as “Lady of Heaven, Queen of the Gods, she who giveth birth, but was herself not born.” Sometimes she is represented with androgynous aspects (with the head of a man and with the phallus). She is associated with Isis and Nekhebet, although more often made equivalent to Nut, goddess of the watery deep, mother of the gods, and of all that is. Mut also in many respects has the characteristics that were attributed to Hathor.


    And with Emanation of Twelve:


    The Olympian gods are six male and six female, showing dual aspects of each of the six rays of the logos (not including the synthesizing seventh); and the signs of the zodiac in astrology are similarly divided into masculine and feminine.


    Although it is in another area where she merely tells us what we recently found the assignments for:


    The twelve adityas are the twelve great gods of the Hindu pantheon; also, the twelve signs of the zodiac or twelve months of the year.


    She just says "it is", and, these days, I can find a number of websites who all say "it is" and they are not the same.

    Two things are happening here. There is the Vedic name for Vishnu, Suryanarayan, and there is also Agni and Solar Fire. For the first, we must know that "Narayan" is the transcendent, immortal aspect of Vishnu, and Surya is only a type of form or orb or manifestation, which, though enduring, is temporary. The second is like the root forces and laws which the aspect Surya consists of.

    Yajur Veda explains about Vishnu's head becoming the sun in the Hayagriva episode.


    I was interested in finally getting a source which, for example, identifies Vivasvan as Libra. The Twelve Adityas are agreed to be the incremental adjustments to that which is experienced as the Sun. But India has conflicting sources, and so it is difficult to say "this is", although nearly everything is written that way. Taking a few relevant notes, we can see that most sources give a different assignment for Libra.

    Tvastr (no source):


    In Jyotish philosophy, the 12 Aditya describe the timing of the changes that occur in the human individual soul/Jivatma.

    The Sun is your individual soul/Jivatma. The Jivatma is tied to Creation by the law of karma. Whenever you do an action with the label ‘I did this’, it is registered as karma. Thus karma is an expression of your ego.


    Pusha (no source)

    12 forms of light that Sun gives when placed in 12 zodiac signs

    All the 12 signs are created by Sun only, as they represent different energies of the Sun. The Signs are not real, they were made to simplify how the energy of the Sun is manifesting through the “Cycle of Time” (Kaala Chakra).


    Pusan:

    ...they are giver of resources and skills that are necessary to achieve the purpose of the soul.

    The Sun is the soul of the Kala Purusha. Kala Purusha is the embodiment of the divine or the birth of the divine soul into a human form. The Soul takes birth usually for a purpose ascertained by the law of karma.


    Pushya, with some attributes given, refers to Bhagavata Purana in a different order.

    Parjanya, which is written to look as if it is coming from Satapatha Brahmana--except that is a different list. It also classes Vasus/Earth, Rudras/Air, and Adityas/Sky, adding Heaven and Earth for I suppose Indra and Vamana.


    None of those are reasoned out. What we can tell is that it is the Time that the Sun is in Libra that is of concern, as the Libra stars are certainly not near one another, they are not really a system, and are mainly an imaginary picture as conceived from here. That part is subjective, while the sun transiting them follows predictable laws.


    Agni is really quite complicated and so is Surya:


    Surya in Indian literature is referred to by various names, which typically represent different aspects or phenomenological characteristics of the Sun. The figure of Surya as we know him today is an amalgamation of various different Rigvedic deities.


    They:

    ...have different characteristics in early mythologies, but by the time of the epics they are synonymous.



    Surya's origin differs heavily in the Rigveda, with him being stated to have been born, risen, or established by a number of deities, including the Ādityas, Aditi, Dyaush, Mitra-Varuna, Agni, Indra, Soma, Indra-Soma, Indra-Varuna, Indra-Vishnu, Purusha, Dhatri, the Angirases, and the gods in general. The Atharvaveda also mentions that Surya originated from Vritra.

    The Vedas assert Sun (Surya) to be the creator of the material universe (Prakriti). In the layers of Vedic texts, Surya is one of the several trinities along with Agni and either Vayu or Indra, which are presented as an equivalent icon and aspect of the Hindu metaphysical concept called the Brahman.

    In the Brahmanas layer of Vedic literature, Surya appears with Agni (fire god) in the same hymns. Surya is revered for the day, while Agni for its role during the night. The idea evolves, states Kapila Vatsyayan, where Surya is stated to be Agni as the first principle and the seed of the universe. It is in the Brahmanas layer of the Vedas, and the Upanishads that Surya is explicitly linked to the power of sight, to visual perception and knowledge. He is then interiorized to be the eye as ancient Hindu sages suggested abandonment of external rituals to gods in favor of internal reflections and meditation of gods within, in one's journey to realize the Atman (soul, self) within, in texts such as the Brihadaranyaka Upanishad, Chandogya Upanishad, Kau****aki Upanishad and others.

    Earliest representations of Surya riding a chariot occur in the Buddhist railings of the Mahabodhi temple in Bodhgaya (2nd century BCE), in the Bhaja Caves (1st century BCE), and the Jain cave of Ananta Gumpha in Khandagiri (1st century CE). They follow similar depiction of the chariot-riding god Helios of Hellenistic mythology, as appearing for example on the coinage of Greco-Bactrian kings, such as Plato I.

    In Hindu context, the sun-god only appears at a later period, as in the Virūpākṣa temple in Paṭṭadakal (8th century CE).

    Deifying the sun and its astrological significance occurred as early as the Vedic period and was recorded in the Vedas. The earliest work of astrology recorded in India is the Vedanga Jyotisha which began to be compiled in the 14th century BCE. It was possibly based on works from the Indus Valley Civilization as well as various foreign influences.

    The Vedanga Jyotisha describes the winter solstice for the period of ca. 1400 BCE.

    The Sun and various classical planets were referenced in the Atharvaveda around 1000 BCE.

    The Yavanajataka written in 120 BCE is often attributed to standardizing Indian astrology.


    The last was probably written in Alexandria, and transmitted to India considerably later.





    We have to dispute that this early India to China transmission has anything to do with Shurangama Sutra:


    *Che K'ien (223-253) with chuluhyen

    matangi sutra
    sardula karna vadana



    It does not, since upon closer examination, we find it in a discussion after saying Nychthemeron comes from a sixty-part Indian day:


    ...some kind of division answering to the division of the zodiac existed among the Hindus in the fourth century B.C. The mention of the planets in the week day order in the Baudhayana Dharma Sutra is equally significant in this direction.

    The Sardula Karnavadana, which was translated into Chinese in the third century A.D. and' the framework of (which) avadana itself must be of great antiquity' according to its learned editors Cowell and Neil, not merely contains reference to the planets including Rahu and Ketu, but even a division headed Dvadasa-ras'ika, the twelve signs of the zodiac. This avadana contains a volume of astrological information which would warrant great astrological knowledge among the Hindus. In avadana 19 of the same work, called Jyotishka-avadana, there is a reference to an astrologer named Bhurika as having made a calculation and verified a prediction of the Buddha.


    Actually, now, that whole text is posted on South India. What one notices is that these older Indian astrological references are in Buddhist hands. Surya was not emphasized as a Hindu deity until centuries later, and to say that Bhuvaneshvari is the Zodiac is to employ the Mahavidya system which is also later.


    Yet:


    Chandālika (1933) is based on the legend Sardula Karnavadana (The text was edited and
    published by Sujit Kumar Mukhopadhyaya). This shows an outcaste girl‘s love for Ānanda, the
    Buddha‘s disciple.

    Followed by a reflection on pseudo-Asvaghosha.

    I don't know how they got that. It sounds like the other book was folded into it.

    The other title shows in an article on Atheists:


    As recorded in the Matangi Sutra and the Brahmajala Sutra, most of the Lokayatikas studied medicine, astronomy, agronomy and so on and engaged themselves in secular work.


    And as a reasonable estimation that this early Sutra is only part of the introduction to the later one, comparing it to Jesus at the Samaritan well:


    This story is described in the Matangi Sutra of Buddhist Sources. This encounter gave birth to Shurangana Sutra.


    They have kept in China:

    Mo-teng-Chia Ching Huang-thu (Map of Heaven and Earth in the Matangi Sutra)


    From the Sanskrit and Chinese dictionary, we are told there are four translations called Matangi Sutra, with the last by:

    Dharmaraksha, A. D. 265—316.



    Again that is the same kind of jumping to conclusions. It is like saying Aswan must be the Aswa-riding Rajputs. Some Chinese say this Matangi means the Shurangama Sutra. It is only a related scene, and it would be much more strongly related to the Matangi of India. They may have different texts with the same title, or, the story is mixed with other information on math and science. The Matangi and the Sardula may simply be being read as one work. Hodgson lists Sardula right after Lotus Sutra.


    Lotus Sutra's proper title is found in these thoughts on Charms and Amulets:


    The earliest Buddhist charm text is to be found in the Saddharma Pundarika of the first century A.D.

    It has been suggested that eventually Buddha instructed particular gatherings of people in specific charms since he realized their potent power. In the story told in the Sardula Karnavadana, which was translated into Chinese in 265 A.D., Buddha's disciple Ananda becomes bewitched by a love charm prepared by the mother of a low-caste girl, asks Buddha for help and is saved by a protective formula.


    So yes, it is most likely that Matangi is the first reception of a magical transmission as the school of Mantra. That part is solid. But it does not have anything else of the Shurangama Sutra.

    Not having the original contents, we can only guess how and why Mantra would be mixed in with the first layer of Indian Astrology which has, shall we say, more of a potential compatibility with the western systems of Twelve Signs of the Zodiac.

    Karna is the son of Surya in Mahabharata, because Surya is the first god Kunti conjures using her magic. For some reason, they give him meanings which also indicates the son of Virgo and the Greek "governing" item:


    Karṇa (कर्ण) is a word found in the Vedic literature, where it means "the ear", "chaff or husk of a grain" or the "helm or rudder".


    If I take "sardula karna" literally, it is lion or tiger, ears. But it does not always include "avadana". Sardula Karna Sutra:


    12. She-tau-keen-king.

    The Sardula Kama Sutra.

    This is the History of Prakriti, the Matanga Woman, as given in Burnouf (Introduction to Indian Buddhism), p. 20(), n.

    Translated by Tchu-fa-hu, of the Western Tsin dynasty, 265 A.D. [This trauslation agrees with Buruouf's, and was evidently made from the Pali or Prakrit.]


    One can be nearly positive that "kama" is a mistake or bad scan of "karna".

    The best answer is in Vietnam:

    Sardula-karna (skt)—Tên nguyên thủy của Ngài A Nan, được diễn dịch là “Lỗ tai cọp.”—The original name of Ananda, interpreted as “Tiger's ears.”


    Simple enough. The pair was the Matangi Sutra and the Ananda Sutra. The different titles would appear to be the same story.


    Ananda Sutra is a Pali text found in the topic of Breath Meditation.


    It also has this strange episode which perhaps means Pali Anatta is not so simple:


    Then the wanderer Vacchagotta went to the Blessed One and, on arrival, exchanged courteous greetings with him. After an exchange of friendly greetings & courtesies, he sat down to one side. As he was sitting there he asked the Blessed One: "Now then, Venerable Gotama, is there a self?"

    "Then is there no self? "

    A second time, the Blessed One was silent.

    Then Vacchagotta the wanderer got up from his seat and left.


    Yet in China we can also retrieve the title Matangi Sutra Astronomy.


    Currently in Buddhism we are holding an empty bag. Bhattacharya says:


    It has not been possible to trace any Sanskrit text from Buddhist Tantric literature which mentions the Dhyana or even a tolerable description of these Signs of the Zodiac, But the Rasis are long believed in India to be the store-houses of mystic power, and it is but natural to expect that these Twelve Signs should be deified...When more literature on the subject is published, only then it will be possible to find descriptive texts. It is however desirable at this stage to refer to the excellent statuettes of the different Signs of the Zodiac that have been discovered in China and illustrated by Professor Clarke in his Two Lamaistic Pantheons, Vol. II.


    The system of Months has its obvious defects, since there are "approximately" twelve lunations per year. The Moon is great for days, but, its cycle is not evenly-matched enough to the sun's year that there is no satisfactory resolution. And so you get a bunch of different time keeping systems based on Months. The Signs, however, whether you define them as starting on Krttika, Aswins, or even Mula, are just even divisions, it is always physically the same. What they mean is slight variations to Surya.

    Buddhism would have no need to independently deify this, since it is the Adityas, although it would be better to explain the reasons for using a particular system.

    India lacks the extent of western deification of the zodiacal constellations.

    The west, I am not sure, has much concept of the twelve faces of the sun.


    Again for Vishnu:

    The Vishnu of the Rig Veda is a manifestation of light, whose head was, by a trick of the gods, severed from his body. This severed head is believed to have become the sun. Further in the Veda, Vishnu is a friend and associate of Indra, god of rain, thunder, and storm. Together, Vishnu the sun and Indra the rain, take on the demon Vritra, who personifies drought. Indra and Vishnu both are described as Vritrahan or the killer of Vritra.


    Then the Adityas form due to the Natural Order, Rta.




    Also, for Surya, HPB says:

    When the pralaya (dissolution) of the world comes, twelve suns will appear (MB 3:3, 26; Dict Hind 3).

    The names of the seven principal rays of the sun are: Sushumna, Harikesa, Visvakarman, Visvatryarchas, Sannaddha, Sarvavasu, and Svaraj. “These seven rays are the entire gamut of the seven occult forces (or gods) of nature, as their respective names well prove. . . . each one of the seven having its respective home in the seven sacred planets; equally, there may be said to be twelve rays of the sun, and twelve sacred planets, each one a home or mansion of one of the solar logoi.


    Shortly after his entry, there is accurate information about Surya Siddhanta, which she takes full in the face as being written over two million years ago, because it comes from the beginning of the Yugas:



    Satya or Krita, Treta, Dwapara, Kali



    This is confused because the Conjunction in Aries is not the beginning of Kali Yuga, it is the end of Krita Yuga.


    The book says this is when Mayasura wrote it, who, of course, is an Asura, or more specifically a Danava. Then of course it is given to "oral tradition", whereas the book shows obvious accretion with:


    Such phenomena was last seen around 3rd millennium BCE when Thuban was the North Pole Star and Alpha Hydri was the South Pole star.

    ...this update to Surya Siddhanta was made around 580 AD. The longtitude of the stars change by 1° in every 71 years.


    Similarly, we might expect that Signs were not in the oldest material, but were woven in.

    Some of its measurements are not that great by modern standards. It derives the age for the whole planet as close to two billion years, which is only off by a factor of two or three. Most scientists will not hold anything against early experiments unless they are off by an order of magnitude, that is, a factor of ten. So if we strongly thought the earth had an age of twenty billion or more, we might say this was garbage, but actually it is a figure of untold antiquity, which is competing against newer ideas, like 3,064 B. C. E. as the Days of Creation.


    Admittedly, many of its categories of calculations are a bit fuzzy, but interestingly where it becomes sharp is in the domain of Relative Distance.

    It makes use of the zodiac signs to make calculations on astronomical distances.


    In other words, it does not have terms like millions of miles or light years, what it does have is the ratio, and so compared to our distance/orbit/year, it knows the ratios for the other planets, which is the basis of Music of the Spheres of Pythagoras.


    Mayasura is so reverently followed in south India that he is attributed with distributing an original Pranava Veda. In one view, such "asuras" may refer to the southerly Dravidians, Tamils, etc.



    The textual genre is mixed with the term for "Greek" in this transmission:


    In Mahabharata you must have found that Narakasura's son Bhagadatta led a group of Yavanas. This shows that the Asuras of Pragjyotishpura were also known as Yavana and Mayasura was none other than the Yavanacharya...Aryabhatta made a concise version of Mayasura's work and this concise treatise was known as the Aryasiddhanta. It is generally said that the Aryasiddhanta is lost. But it need not be so. This Aryasiddhanta of Aryabhatta has been called the Suryasiddhanta by Varahamihira and that is also called the Yavana jataka of Yavanacharya by Sphuridhvaja.


    For which Five of Eighteen original types of Siddhantas survived.


    The Surya Siddhanta does not emphasize Himalaya, but locates Meru on the Prime Meridian with Ujjain and Lanka.


    Many think it is the real source of Nychthemeron:


    The seven-day week that is followed around the world finds its origin in Mayasura’s Surya Siddhanta. It was the first source that idealised the concept of a seven-day week as we know it today starting from the epochal day, that is, 22 February 6778 BCE.

    It lays down the basis of a 7-day week apart from explaining the conventions behind sequencing the days within the week. Later, Greek, Hebrew, Arabic, and Babylonian calendars in the Middle East incorporated the seven-day week concept invented in ancient India.



    It is unlikely to be from the oldest material, but Chapter Two gives the system with Signs.

    In comparison to the present day longitudinal values of these stars and the data of Surya Siddhanta, it becomes clear that this update to Surya Siddhanta was made around 580 AD. The longitude of the stars change by 1° in every 71 years.

    On the Axis:


    Such phenomena was last seen around 3rd millennium BCE when Thuban was the North Pole Star and Alpha Hydri was the South Pole star.


    In a cleaner presentation, there is a cluster of related information close to the Krittika Equinox around 3,000 B. C. E. and extends further observations to:


    The current values of the Surya Siddhanta’s pulsating epicycle parameters for the Sun appear to have been set in the 5000-5500 BC timeframe.

    ...a match for the Surya Siddhanta latitudinal data was obtained in the timeframe 7300-7800 BC...It should also be noted that this time frame matches with the establishment of the oldest archaeological site of Bhirrana found along the Saraswati river paleochannel.


    Burgess 1860 is the English Surya Siddhanta. It says of the epic:


    The signs of the zodiac were recognised to be 12 in number but they are not named in it. (MBh., Adi, Ch. 3.) They were probably taken as parts of the ecliptic traversed by the sun in one month.


    The same state of the knowledge of astronomy continued in India even up to 80 A. D., the date from which the calculation
    of the Paitarnaha Siddhanta as known to Varaha starts. The
    signs of the zodiac were perhaps not yet called by the names,
    Mesa, Vrsa, &c.


    The translator became quite aware it has three main layers, i. e., an "ancient" bundle, a standardized redaction in the 500s, and a little bit of additional information since then. He finds it hard to account for anything from the 1-400s (such as the Buddhist texts). And then when edited in its middle phase, the Zodiac is presented in a non-introductory manner, as if you should have learned about it somewhere else:


    13. A lunar month, of as many lunar days (tithi); a solar (saura) month is determined by the entrance of the sun into a sign
    of the zodiac : twelve months make a year...


    It is, however, not the tropical solar year, which we employ, but the sidereal, no account being made of the pre- cession of the equinoxes. The solar month is measured by the continuance
    of the sun in each successive sign, and varies, according to the rapidity of
    his motion, from about twenty-nine and a third, to a little more than
    thirty-one and a half, days.


    Of the Ages called Yugas:


    This system of periods is not of astronomical origin, although the
    fixing of the commencement of the Iron Age, the only possibly historical point in it, is, as we shall see hereafter, the result of astronomical computation.


    With the Surya-Siddhanta, and the other treatises which adopt
    the same general method, the determining point of the whole system is the commencement of the current Iron Age ("kali yuga);

    This deduction is a clear indication that, as remarked above (undo*
    v. 17), the astronomical system was compelled to adapt itself to an al- ready established Puranic chronology. It could, indeed, fix the previously
    undetermined epoch of the commencement of the Iron Age, but it could not alter the arrangement of the preceding periods.


    The text exempts itself from most of history:


    As the Surya-Siddhanta professes to have been revealed by the Sun
    about the end of the Golden Age, it is of course precluded from taking
    any notice of the divisions of time posterior to that period : there is no- where in the treatise an allusion to any of the eras which are actually made
    use of by the inhabitants of India in reckoning time, with the exception
    of the cycle of sixty years, which, by its nature, is bound to no date...


    It defines signs by:


    ...the revolution is accounted complete at the end of the
    asterism Revati.


    The translator realized that Puranic modeling caused Krishna's date, and, because the measurements are slightly off, there was not really a complete conjunction of all planets at that time and:


    ...their false assumption of a conjunction at the epoch of 3102 B.C. must introduce an element of error into their determination of the planetary motions.


    Although, evidently, it was said to happen at another time:


    57. Now, at the end of the Golden Age (Krta yuga), all the
    planets, by their mean motion—excepting, however, their nodes
    and apsides (mandocca)—are in conjunction in the first of Aries.


    The Yugas are instead the Tetraktys.




    It uses the same term for "circle of asterisms":


    7. In the midst of the zodiac {bhacakra)...


    However, it specifically incorporates Signs into its Puranic Creation chapter:


    25. Again, dividing himself twelve-fold, he, the mighty one, produced what is known as the signs ; and yet farther, what has
    the form of the asterisms (naksh-atra) , twenty-seven-fold.


    The "additional" alignment date is from a recent project, Chronology of India:


    I Was subsequently able to determine that this rarest of conjunctions occurred on 22nd Feb, 6778 BCE...

    which has followers, such as into a detailed timeline which, to its credit, uses conjunctions, equinoxes, etc., as markers.


    However, there is another kind of "Krita Yuga" from 57 B. C. E.:


    A number of ancient and medieval inscriptions used the Vikram Samvat. Although it was reportedly named after the legendary king Vikramaditya, the term "Vikrama Samvat" does not appear in the historical record before the 9th century; the same calendar system is found with other names, such as Krita and Malava. In colonial scholarship, the era was believed to be based on the commemoration of King Vikramaditya expelling the Sakas from Ujjain. However, later epigraphical evidence and scholarship suggest that this theory has no historical basis...earlier sources call the era "Kṛṭa" (343 and 371 CE), "Kritaa" (404), "the era of the Malava tribe" (424), or simply "Samvat". The earliest known inscription which calls the era "Vikrama" is from 842.


    "Vikramaditya" is a title that we have already found shared between:

    Gupta king Chandragupta II.

    Skandagupta (r. 455 – 467 CE)


    Buddhist Remains:


    It is well-known that in circa 600 B.C. the process of second urbanization was accelerated in north India due to the discovery of iron, Gradually, some of the important towns of north gained importance and became the centre of power and also the centre of trade and religious propagation.

    The most flourishing phase of the activities was the third phase i.e. ascribed to circa 76 A.D. to circa 300 A.D. During this period, the rulers of the region were the Kshatrapas and Satavahanas. It was during this period when w~' picked-up the sherds bearing the letters of Brahmi scripts.

    The Red-ware of this phase are highly polished and thus they show the great affinity With the Roman-Samian wares. The Red-Polished spouted vessels of different varieties, punch-marked coins, seals, beads, inscribed seals, iron objects etc. are found in abundance.


    Around Ujjain:

    The Kshatrapas of Ujjain traced their descent from Lord Chastana who was related to Ptolemy, the Greek mathematician and astrologer.

    Chandragupta II is said to be:

    ...responsible for starting the Hindu Vikram Samvat era

    around people like:


    ...the celebrated poet Kalidasa


    According to one estimate, they probably began the era with what we would call Age of Pisces, or Aswini to Revati. Not all agree on these Ages but some do:

    The Age of Pisces runs from roughly 50 BCE to 2100...



    Previously there was such a thing as Kali Samvat.




    An article on Rarity notes the multiple alignment marked a cycle change in China, to Plato and the Arabs, in Babylon, and that a "conjunction" 3102 B. C. E. was quite loose---it has multiple superior examples going forward from that point, next in 2,762 B. C. E.

    Surya Siddhanta makes a system that gives an almost perfect alignment. That is somewhat off, even e. g. compared to the Lahiri system. The same has been discovered by others. Summarized:


    Whitney gave the mean places of the planets for mean sunrise at Ujjain on Friday, 18 February, b.c. 3102, in accordance with three of the Hindū books: of those three, the Ārya-Siddhānta gives the nearest approach to a conjunction; and according to it the sun, the moon, Mars, and Saturn were exactly at the first point of Mēsha; Venus and Jupiter were 2° 52′ 48″ west of that point; and Mercury was 8° 38′ 24″ west of it: see Sūrya-Siddhānta, trans., p. 425.


    Kali Yuga seems to be exclusively determined by Surya Siddhanta or Aryabhatta.

    Going by this alignment, the year 3102 BCE is slightly off. The actual date for this alignment is 7 February 3104 BCE.


    It seems they were looking for the grail of the alignment, by a process of indeterminate equations, possibly related to Flood ideas in:

    "Mature Theory of the Epicycles" by Apollonius.


    By having selected the date they did, we might argue it is not exactly perfect, but we just need it to be close for two purposes. First is the Equinox in Taurus. Second is what happened. In weighing the value of Astrology against the other suggestions for the time of the Mahabharata, the western idea of ca. 1,000 B. C. E. is thought of as least likely, and:


    The Puranic memory of the Mahabharata war having occurred in 1924 BC may represent
    the transference of a much earlier event to the cataclysmic event at the end of the
    Harappan period. The memory of the War in popular imagination may represent the
    conflation of two different actual events.

    The Epic and Puranic evidence on the geographical situation supports the notion of the
    shifting of the centre of the Vedic world from the Sarasvati to the Ganga region in early
    second millennium BC. O.P. Bharadwaj’s excellent study of the Vedic Sarasvati using
    textual evidence supports the theory that the Rgveda is to be dated about 3000 BC and
    the Mahabharata War must have occurred about that time.

    The Indic kings of West Asia are descendents of Vedic people who moved
    West after the catastrophe of 1924 BC.


    Such a catastrophe would match the next one of the major planetary alignments found by the NASA article.


    I would not agree that because there are Hala Mountains in Pakistan that we have satisfactorily explained the Greeks. However we notice only a single mention of Orpheus on the page for Pelasgians:


    In his Description of Greece, Pausanias mentions the Arcadians who state that Pelasgus (along with his followers) was the first inhabitant of their land. Upon becoming king, Pelasgus invented huts, sheep-skin coats, and a diet consisting of acorns while governing the land named after him, "Pelasgia". When Arcas became king, Pelasgia was renamed "Arcadia" and its inhabitants (the Pelasgians) were renamed "Arcadians". Pausanias also mentions the Pelasgians as responsible for creating a wooden image of Orpheus in a sanctuary of Demeter at Therae, as well as expelling the Minyans and Lacedaemonians from Lemnos.

    .
    HPB speaking of the Cyclopes says:


    They are called "Builders," and Occultism calls them the INITIATORS, who, initiating some Pelasgians, thus laid the foundation stone of true MASONRY. Herodotus associates the Cyclops with Perseus "the son of an Assyrian demon" (I. VI. p. 54). Raoul Rochette found that Palaemonius, the Cyclops, to whom a sanctuary was raised, "was the Tyrian Hercules." Anyhow, he was the builder of the sacred columns of Gadir, covered with mysterious characters to which Apollonius of Tyana was the only one in his age to possess the key; and with figures which may still be found on the walls of Ellora, the gigantic ruins of the temple of Viswakarma, "the builder and artificer of the Gods."


    ...the mysterious Pelasgians who came from the East..

    The Pelasgians were certainly one of the root-races of future Greece, and were a remnant of a sub-race of Atlantis. Plato hints as much in speaking of the latter, whose name it is averred came from pelagus, the great sea. Noah's Deluge is astronomical and allegorical, but it is not mythical, for the story is based upon the same archaic tradition of men -- or rather of nations -- which were saved during the cataclysms, in canoes, arks, and ships.


    And as mentioned by anonymous Theosophy 1939:


    Who were these mighty builders? Pausanius said that “the walls of Tiryns were built by the Cyclopes,” and Euripides called the plain of Argos the “Cyclopean land.” The identity of the Cyclopes is shrouded in mystery. One might expect the Greeks would themselves have left a record of their forefathers. They did, but in a form unacceptable to modern scholars.


    As to how Etruscan may fit in, the script only seems to resemble that found on the island of Lemnos, thoght to be unique or non-Indo-European.


    She gets more comprehensive in a comeback where apparently Max Muller thought that Panini invented Sanskrit writing. She implies that Pelasgian was an Indian Prakrit, and/or the mystery language which was universal. On behalf of this she says:


    ...the Pandus had acquired universal dominion and taught the sacrificial mysteries to other races (see Mahabharata, Book 14).


    On the Pelasgians:


    The only divinity of their Pantheon known well to Western History is Orpheus, also the “swarthy,” the “dark-skinned”; represented for the Pelasgians by Xoanon, their “Divine Image.”

    Attention has been asked above to the interesting fact that the God Orpheus, of “Thracia” (?), is called the “dark-skinned.” Has it escaped notice that he is “supposed to be the Vedic Ribhu or Arbhu, an epithet both of lndra
    and the Sun”? And if he was “the inventor of letters,” and is “placed anterior to both Homer and Hesiod,” then what? That Indra taught writing to the Thracian Pelasgians under the guise of Orpheus...


    Being obviously familiar with the author of "India in Greece":


    Moreover, as shown well by Pococke—laughed at because too intuitional and too fair though, perchance, less philologically learned—the Pandavas were in Greece, where many traces of them can be shown. In the Mahabhârata, Arjuna is taught the occult philosophy by Krishna (personification of the Universal Divine Principle); and the less mythological view of Orpheus presents him to us as “a divine bard or priest in the service of Zagreus. . . founder of the Mysteries . . .” the inventor “of everything, in fact, that was supposed to have contributed to the civilisation and initiation into a more humane worship of the deity . . .”

    The only trouble in connecting the Pelasgians with, and tracing their origin to the Kshatriyas of Rajputana, is created by the Orientalist who constructs a fanciful chronology, based on no proof, and showing only unfamiliarity with the world’s real history, and with Indian History within historical periods.



    Here again, "kshatriyas of Rajputana" would read "Brotherhood of Lukshur" if the "Haya" claim were at least partially correct.


    If our Western Critics can only understand what the Ancient Hindu writers meant by Bhutalipi, so often mentioned in their mystical writings, they will be in a position to ascertain the source from which the Hindus first derived their knowledge of writing.

    A secret language, common to all schools of occult science once prevailed throughout the world. Hence—Orpheus learnt “letters” in the course of his initiation. He is identified with Indra; according to Herodotus he brought the art of writing from India; his swarthier complexion than that of the Thracians points to his Indo-Aryan nationality—supposing him to have been “a bard and priest” and not a god; the Pelasgians are said to have been born
    in Thracia; they are believed (at the West) to have first possessed the art of writing, and taught the Phoenicians; from the latter all modern alphabets derive.


    From Lalita Mahatmya:


    Bhūta-lipi is explained as of the following order:

    1. Short Vowels—a, ī, u, ṛ, ḷ.
    2. mixed or conjunct vowels e, ai, o, au.
    3. Ka-varga (gutturals).
    4. Ca-varga (palatals).
    5. Ta-varga (Cerebrals).
    6. Ta-varga (Dentals).
    7. Pa-varga (Labials).
    8. Ha, la, Va, Ra and La.
    9. Śa, ṣa, Sa.



    which is another type of formulaic breakdown, standard, like QWERTY.

    I don't know that I have penetrated the origin of writing. To my thought it does not directly pertain to written letters, especially judging from the context it was used:


    The sage shall be the Śabda-Brahman (Brahman in the form of sound) and the metre Bhūtalipi...


    Sound is possible in the fifth state of matter, or Aether, or Akash, which I believe is represented by the following awkward expression that science probably scoffed at:


    " Forms of time, of invisible shape, stationed in the zodiac,
    called the conjunction (Sighrocca), apsis (mandocca) and the
    node ipata), are the causes of the motion of the planets. The
    planets attached to these beings by cords of air, are drawn away
    by them, with the right and left hand, forward or backward,
    according to nearness, towards their own places. A wind, moreover, called provector (pravaha) impels them towards their apices
    (ueca) ; being drawn away forward and backward, they proceed
    by a varying motion.


    Pravaha has this meaning in Mahabharata.


    The meaning may be as from The Mahatma Letters:


    To make you hear my voice either within you or near you as "the old lady" does. This would be feasible in either of two ways: (a) My chiefs have but to give me permission to set up the conditions -- and this for the present they refuse; or (b) for you to hear my voice, i.e., my natural voice without any psycho-physiological tamasha being employed by me (again as we often do among ourselves). But then, to do this, not only have one's spiritual senses to be abnormally opened, but one must himself have mastered the great secret -- yet undiscovered by science -- of, so to say abolishing all the impediments of space; of neutralising for the time being the natural obstacle of intermediary particles of air and forcing the waves to strike your ear in reflected sounds or echo. Of the latter you know as yet only enough to regard this as an unscientific absurdity. Your physicists, not having until recently mastered acoustics in this direction, any further than to acquire a perfect (?) knowledge of the vibration of sonorous bodies and of reverberations through tubes, may sneeringly ask: "Where are your indefinitely continued sonorous bodies, to conduct through space the vibrations of the voice?" We answer that our tubes, though invisible, are indestructible and far more perfect than those of modern physicists, by whom the velocity of the
    transmission of mechanical force through the air is represented as at the rate of 1,100 feet a second and no more -- if I mistake not. But then, may there not be people who have found more perfect and rapid means of transmission, from being somewhat better acquainted with the occult powers of air (akas) and having plus a more cultivated judgment of sounds?


    Pravaha: Name of one of the 7 tongues of fire, [Colebrooke] does not seem to be useful. The Tongues are near Mt. Meru in Devi Bhagavata Purana:


    The name Plakṣa Dvīpa is derived from the name of this Plakṣa tree. This tree is of a golden colour. Fire exists at its bottom with form incarnate. This is, named Saptajihva. The Ruler of this island is Idhmajihva, the son of Priyavrata. He divided his island into the seven Varṣas and distributed them, to each of his seven sons and he himself took refuge of the path of Yoga, so much liked by the Knowers of Self and he got the Bhagavān Vāsudeva.


    and the chapter briefly describes the main deities including:


    We take refuge unto that Sun, Who is the Body Manifest of the Ancient Person Viṣṇu

    They worship the Bhagavān Moon, the Controller of all and the Creator of all the Vedas. They offer food duly in the black and white fortnight to their Pitris.

    O Fire! Thou carriest the oblations direct to Para Brahmā.


    The Sun's children are the Aswins and Death. The Pitrs are Time, and, Fire subsequently realizes this. Seven Tongues of Flame can be found in various sources, such as Mundaka Upanishad, or Ṣaṭsāhasrasaṃhitā:


    (Pūrṇagiri) is on the northern peak of Kailāśa and is full of countless flames. [...] That divine city of the supreme Lord is made of pillars of adamantine. It is surrounded by temple arches and palaces of the Fire of Time. It is filled with many forms and adorned with knowledge and (divine) qualities. Possessing many wonders, it is life itself in the triple universe. (All) this is filled by it and so it is called ‘Full’ (pūrṇa i.e. Pūrṇagiri). (The Fire of Time) has seven tongues (of flame) [i.e., saptajihvā-samopeta]; (his) form is Time and has six faces. Possessing the Full Moon, (he) is beautiful. (He is) the Great Vitality, holds a spear and brings about creation and destruction”.



    In retrospect, we are coming up on the centennial of 9-24-1924, when it was first announced there might be "something to" Indus Valley. It is not really until the 2000s that we see it is hundreds, if not a thousand or more settlements, brick built with better sewerage than modern India. The discoveries confirm Balochistan (Turan) as the origin at 7-8,000 B. C. E.; I won't jump up and insist that Indus Script is Senzar, but it is still not decoded, because only a small amount of script is found in any single piece of evidence. We also probably shouldn't insist on an Aryan invasion, or the overthrowing of Cretan matriarchy; it may have been a slower change. Indus Valley shows no signs of central authority such as palaces or temples. So it is not the same as Vedic Sanskrit culture either. It may have been damaged starting around 2,200 B. C. E. by a major 4.2k year drought cycle which also dissipated the Sarasvati River.

    I do not think that Hindu timeline showing detailed events to the age of around 14,000 B. C. E. is more reliable than Pococke, but, some of it is probably valid, such as the age of Rama around 5,600 B. C. E., and this one has good reason to think of in multiple cycles. According to Theosophy, if it has to do with Lemuria, it is on a scale of millions of years. As a major battle, it may well match the Hindu date. And there is a Buddhist Ramayana without the war, probably taking place shortly before Buddha. Rama had to travel to Hingala to atone for killing Ravana. To this day, one confesses over the mouth of its neighbor, the Chandragup mud volcano. There is still certainly a group of associated sadhus today; and that the weaver caste emerged from here, is the main spread of Hingala's cult.




    We are unable to explain websites that may show a different order; fo far we have taken an important piece of information from Sastri's brief article Tantric Hieroglyphics that we can. It is an overview that first deals with Satapatha Brahmana, by Yajnawalkya, shortly before Buddha, ca. 700 B. C. E. What HPB says is that he is the Yogacara precursor of Buddhism. Because they are both Nepali, this is almost certainly the case. They are not Kathmandu, but the Indian border region.



    Described as the most complete, systematic, and important of the Brahmanas (commentaries on the Vedas)...


    ...geometry (e.g. calculations of pi and the root of the Pythagorean theorem) and observational astronomy...

    The Brihadaranyaka Upanishad is from the last Kanda (i.e. book 17) of the Kanva recension of the Shatapatha Brahmana.

    A.A. Macdonell adds that the Satapatha in particular is notable as - unlike the Samhitas - in it the Earth was 'expressly called circular (parimandala)'.

    It references the drying up of the Sarasvati river, believed to have occurred around 1900 B.C.E.

    Agni is the Year.

    According to Shastri, similar to Music of the Spheres, the primary subject is a gigantic "Bhutalipi":


    In the Tantras the matrkas and metres are intimately associated with astronomical
    data.

    The Caturuttara series of metres is connected with the divisions of the ecliptic and the
    movements of the sun and moon.

    The older date of about B.C. 3000 is indicated by the vernal equinox in Krttika.





    Then when he gives the assignment of Adityas to Zodiac Signs, it is the system from Adi Shankara. I am not sure why a Buddhist Matangi text might be astrological, but, in the Mahavidyas system, Matangi is the Sun. In this area we are left with a cryptic statement that the Ascendant of the Devas is Sagittarius:



    Dhanus is Devalagna.

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    Depths of Time Cycles




    One of the technical parts of Theosophy is that, we have been told, numerous mantras, forms, correspondences, etc., of a semi-occult value have been given out, but, we cannot be given the "real numbers" or those equations that definitively answer for time cycles and ages. This is because the same math could be easily weaponized. So we don't actually have a true standard for the Yugas, or the Great Year, or anything like that.

    HPB does go through an adequate description of "human years" versus "divine years", which would appropriately match what I think of as "cycles", such as the Ramayana has a meaning on a scale of millions of years, another in thousands, and another in relatively recent history. There are at least seven systems for counting Yugas, and for instance that of the Vayu Purana would be close to the incarnation of Rama around 5,100 B. C. E., which would be the main era of his story. There are plenty of reasons it should have a lot of details and events, while an archaic memory of the destruction of Lemuria would more likely be "briefly summarized" as an allegory or additional explanation to this, becoming disguised as the same narrative.

    Rama lived in the Treta Yuga, which specifically refers to the three, Vamana, Parasurama, and Rama.


    What we are looking for is the quality of civilization. In other words, man has shifted from the "state of nature" by the use of domesticated agriculture and fixed houses. In most cases, this causes lots of new problems, and a dissociation from nature itself. Then people alter history. And so we are seeking the more intelligent and refined parts of what may have been much more effective cultures. Certainly, Greece was influenced by India, but it probably would not be fair to say colonized or commanded. However by the time of Rama, their personal history trails off into the Pelasgians and pure legend.

    There was Catal Hayuk, which did not last. Or the Minoans. In this part of the world, similar to India, it can be found that part of Syria has been continuously inhabited. It is not necessarily that far from Baal Zaphon. Yet we found the assertion that the Greeks were the Hela Ina from Balochistan. This was in fact published right during the time of Greek independence, when they wound up with a nation, rather than New Byzantium. This just seems slightly harmful to what may have been a beneficial aspect of Orthodox culture. One hesitates to say this about the similar so-called "denominations".


    There is a Silk Road mentality to this, something about the spread of benefits, rather than wars of conquest.



    I do not claim to know any universal mystery religion or its language. I do see however that Astrology most likely is the first science, which, along with its math, probably is universally shared, and comes fairly close to an international doctrine. It seems indeterminate whether Chaldea or India had the earliest observations and calculations, or to what extent they may have been shared, since it is evident in the earliest strata of both regions. However we must concede that the Zodiac is almost certainly of Chaldean origin, and, was simply "accepted" in India, but, became more of a dominant factor in Greece.

    It could not have been designed for the Tropical system.

    Nevertheless one can be certain there is a type of deified Astrology without needing a Zodiac.

    In order to not be waging a genocidal policy against the West, we need to come up with a reason to justify its existence, quick, and I think that would be it. They can be allowed to discuss the Zodiac, and, arrange it over Jesus if that helps. This, plus, the development of musical harmony and chord progression, which is heavily conditioned by mathematics related to astrology. These things are uniquely their own. At that point, you have something worth "sending over" to India, something valid to put at the exchange table.


    I do not know of a legitimate succession to the Theosophical Mahatmas, nor have penetrated much secrecy as to what "hidden books" or other specialized knowledge they relied on. I do not think the Root Races are that big of a deal, or, they are not presented that way in our known books. "Extended history" is, but not quite as specifically as she said it. There is supposed to be a "secret book of Maitreya", but, aside from the RGV itself--and perhaps particular recensions of it--nothing additional has come to light.

    She talked about "us" as students of eastern doctrine, and of Mahatmas as descendants of "the real Vedic Rishis".

    And actually I never came across much else that might frame Buddhism in an Indian context. Once we started getting modernized materials from Tibet, it seems everyone may have become a bit enamored of the fact that they have bells and drums, and costumes with colored beads and so on, but they were just on the receiving end of something that had developed in India for over a thousand years. Tibet uses Chinese Astrology. India uses Sidereal but accepts something about the Signs, which would have made more sense in the Age of Aries, which is when the Zodiac can first be found in existing records.


    In Triveni Journal, it was agreed there was a sort of Ur Purana or Purana Samhita much older than the Vedic age. Vyasa, in his Matsyapurana, says that there used to be such a book of Universal History. There are some great souls known as Paramaguruvulu or the Masters of Wisdom as Madame Blavatsky calls them. They have taken the responsibility of preserving this ancient book. Dr. Veda Vyas tells us that they have kept this book – it is still there – in the Himalayan ridges.


    Possibly in modern Tibet, it physically means the Altyn Tagh, on the east edge of the Tarim Basin.


    Cheiro is said to have gotten Astrology from it.


    The southern Tarim route ran from Kashgar through Yarkant, Karghalik, Pishan, Khotan, Keriya, Niya, Qarqan, Qarkilik, Miran and Dunhuang to Anxi.

    There is currently no road east across the Kumtag Desert to Dunhuang, but caravans somehow made the crossing through the Yangguan pass south of the Jade Gate.

    The snow on K2, the second-highest mountain in the world, flows into glaciers which move down the valleys to melt. The melted water forms rivers which flow down the mountains and into the Tarim Basin, never reaching the sea. Surrounded by desert, some rivers feed the oases where the water is used for irrigation while others flow to salt lakes and marshes.

    The Lop Nor region became uninhabitable in the 4th century and the middle route has been deserted since the 6th century.

    The town of Loulan was abandoned in 330 CE.

    Circa 630, at the beginning of the Tang period, Shanfutuo (鄯伏陁) led the remaining Shanshan people to Hami.

    The Buddhist pilgrim Xuanzang passed through this region in 644 on his return from India to China, visited a town called Nafubo (納縛波, thought to be Charklik) of Loulan, and wrote of Qiemo, "A fortress exists, but not a trace of man".

    The Buddhist pilgrim Faxian who stayed in Shanshan in 399 on the way to India, described the country:


    [A] country rugged and hilly, with a thin and barren soil. The clothes of the common people are coarse, and like those worn in our land of Han, some wearing felt and others coarse serge or cloth of hair; — this was the only difference seen among them. The king professed (our) Law, and there might be in the country more than four thousand monks who were all students of the hînayâna. The common people of this and other kingdoms (in that region), as well as the śramans, all practise the rules of India, only that the latter do so more exactly, and the former more loosely.


    Hellenic relics of Loulan:











    The prominence of Greek styling in northwest Indian art is indisputable, I would say it is even surprising how compelling it seems to have been for them. In the Astrological sense, it appears more that Heracles has gotten through to them. Arguably, that is because the Greek legend is derived from Indian. It is possible the Labors of Hercules had a "weak" representation of Signs, like in India, and then this became more of a focus in the West.


    Gandahar is equivalent to Afghani Balochistan. It is the main source of traffic for the Khotan to Dunhuang route, which is significant in Buddhism. In the opposite direction you would go to Pak Balochistan. Hingula is almost at the coast. It has never been an easy trek.


    I have no clue why HPB said "Lukshur", but what you get is a desert frontier off a civilization from ca. 8,000 B. C. E. building brick towns, which grew at least until the submersion of Dwarka perhaps 5,000 years after that. It probably was larger than Mesopotamia, Cuzco, etc., and experienced this flood as well as a global drought ca. 2,000 B. C. E. At some point in time, this remote western edge becomes, so to speak, highly religiously important.


    This is mostly Indian and in a peculiarly twisted way. As we go through this, it will bring up some information on time cycles, and return us to a few things that we would still say are akin to current western issues. We are looking for what is congruent, that is, one could say that neo-Platonism and Indian trade were still valid in the Greek sphere to around the 500s, and then, by around the 700s, the West was falling apart generally and this whole thing stopped.


    I have not yet found any etymology or know of any type of Sanskrit root which might be persuasive that it did not mean "defeat of Hingol". What it would mean is Asafoetida:

    The species are native to the deserts of Iran and mountains of Afghanistan where substantial amounts are grown.

    being the same in Dravidian:

    Hindi hīṅg (हींग)
    Kannada ingu (ಇಂಗು)


    But that is the shorter root word and the powder is yellow.

    Hingula "means" cinnabar. This region of the Makran is not a mining town, so she, personally, is not the source of cinnabar.

    She probably has been colored red because she is supposed to be red, like Carcika.

    As to the likely significance of her in a Puja:


    This is first Shakti Peeth Hingula (Hinglaj) Devi’s head or mind fell right here and the idols are Devi as Kotari (Durga)...


    She perhaps is named for cinnabar in notes about her Pitha:


    the ‘Upper part of the head’

    Hingula Devi (the red goddess)


    Or Sati may have left something I certainly take as an Esoteric term:


    Brahmarandhra




    Thousands go there all the time, and here are a few remarks from Pande:


    ...the largest contingent of pilgrims visiting Kottari Devi annually. While Kottari Devi is worshipped by all from different classes...

    Kottari Devi at the Hinglaj temple belongs not only to the Hindus and Sikhs of the region, but is equally popular among the local Muslims living in the area, who both revere and protect Hinglaj Mata. The locals know her as Bibi Nani (maternal grandmother)...


    She may be named Hingala for deposing:


    ...the Tatar Mongol clan, living sometime in the Treta Yuga.


    and it has another tale of violence:


    ...in the Dwapara Yuga. It is said that when Parashuram was on his killing spree...


    of the survivors:


    One of the sons of Ratnasena, Jayasena, returned to Sindh eventually to rule the kingdom, armed with a protective Hinglaj Mata mantra given to him by Rishi Dadhichi.


    They happen to be casually flailing this term among what would seem to be rather conservative folk:


    Koṭarī (कोटरी).—

    1) A naked woman;

    2) An epithet of the goddess Durgā (represented as naked).



    It is unusual because Durga is not particularly sexualized. But she is a Puranic deity. We notice among variant spellings such as Kotavi that there is in Devi Bhagavata Purana:


    Kauṭabhī (Koṭarī)

    from this list:


    ...auspicious, glorious and much praiseworthy. Śatarūpā... and other women born of the Prime Prakritis, all are excellent in every Yuga.


    As in a weird soliloquoy:


    Now, by Rādhikā’s curse I am born as Śaṅkhacūḍa, the Indra of the Dānavas.


    Elsewhere in the text, Kotari is also in the retinue of Bhadrakali.

    It probably is the case that some Durgas are Uma, i. e., the wife of Shiva, but these violent aspects and Satarupa and Bhadrakali are explained as having Mahalakshmi behind them in this same book.




    To Krishna in Vishnu Purana:


    ...the mystical goddess Koṭavī, the magic lore of the demons, stood naked before him.


    Koṭavī is said to be an eighth portion of Rudrāṇī, and the tutelary goddess of the Daityas, composed of incantations. The Hari V. calls her also Lambā, and intimates her being the mother of Bāṇa, and as identical with Durgā. The word in the lexicons designates a naked woman, and is thence applicable to Durgā, in some of her forms.


    Her pilgrimage site in Skanda Purana:


    Koṭavī in Koṭitīrtha

    1a) Koṭitīrtha (कोटितीर्थ).—A kṣetram in Prayāga; sacred to Koṭavī.*

    * Matsya-purāṇa 13. 37; 106. 44; Vāyu-purāṇa 112. 32.

    The Centre of the confluence of Gaṅgā and Yamunā is believed to be the waist of the world. There is at Prayāga the world-famous Triveṇī confluence.

    Elsewhere in Skanda Purana, she has her own Confluence.

    Unless we are specifically told, "kotitirtha" is a generic term for a sacred bathing site, such as in Vindhyacala Pilgrimage:


    Kotitirtha Kotavi along the Godavari river, Andhra Pradesh...



    There is a tank made over a spring in Bhuvaneshvar, Orissa.

    Adi Shankara used a cave of hers with a natural water flow in Pithoragarh, which is in Kumaon.



    Finding the excision of Arya Vindhyavasini from the first Critical Edition of Mahabharata:


    Here the CE is very erratic in excising verses about the goddess Kotavi who manifests to block Krishna from Skanda at 112.49, following which there is an abrupt hiatus. Then, as if this has not occurred, at 112.97 she stands naked between Krishna and Bana. The vulgate makes far better sense: she appears naked to protect Skanda, whereupon Krishna indignantly shoos her away and she vanishes with Skanda. Later, Shiva and Uma send her again to protect Bana from Krishna’s discus. Krishna shuts his eyes so as not to gaze upon her nudity and severs Bana’s thousand arms.


    That is why Harivamsa is useful as an additional text.


    It seems unusual to see:


    Koṭarā his mother appeared before Kṛṣṇa naked and with dishevelled hair, while Bāṇa entered his city;



    Since Bana typically has no known mother.


    Concerning his father Mahabali and the world before ours:


    The real aim of the devas was not to regain the lost wealth but to obtain the celestial nectar known as Nectar of Immortality (Amṛta) and to defeat the Asuras in battle. On the side of the Asuras there was the knowledge of the Mṛtasañjīvanī (life-restoring remedy). So the dead were being brought to life. But it was not possible for devas to do so. It was to make up this deficiency, by obtaining Ambrosia from the sea, that the devas tried to churn the sea, under the pretence of recovering the lost wealth. Mention is made in the Viṣṇu Purāṇa, Aṃśa 1, Chapter 9 and Matsya Purāṇa, Chapters 250 and 251 that these events took place during the regime of the Indra named Mantradruma in the Cākṣuṣamanvantara (the period of the manu named Cākṣuṣa).


    Then Mahabali takes over Heaven, which is why Vamana was born.


    One may observe how clumsily written such sastras are. The "asuras" could not have possibly entered this battle, because they could not possibly have been "asuras" until they lost it. There were Daityas and Danavas who had no personal need to churn anything since they already possessed the secret of immortality. From this logic, rather than being defeated and taking revenge, some say they won, simply refused the Sura because they didn't need it, and correspondingly proceeded to Heaven.

    Mahabali has:


    ...married Vindyāvalī and Aśanā...


    Then looking closer at the Vaisnava commentary:


    There was a demigoddess named Kotara who was worshiped by Banasura, and their relationship was as mother and son.


    There is a placeholder Vindhyavali in the Genealogy Tree.


    This is so in Srimad Bhagavatam as it is with Adi Shankara, who adds that Maha Vishnu and Vamana also call her mother.


    On the Hindu Daitya page she is Bana's Mother, and so both are true:


    Vindhyavali is Kotari.


    I am not sure that anyone has suggested she may be Vindyavasini, or that this may be a newer version of the same name. The two appear synonymous at her Pitha in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bijolia, Rajasthan.


    The Daityas are usually associated with areas around the Vindhyas. Bali's wife's name is Vindhyavali. The Narmada River is by the Vindhyas and this is also where many Daityas had done much penance, especially for obtaining boons.

    Danavas are thought to have been around Sonitpur and Assam.


    It may be that Hingula's origin is somewhat inscrutable if Vindhyavali-Kotari means Carcika. If it means Vindhyavasini, this is like saying Shakti directly on her own, whereas Carcika is a divine by-product of sweat and blood.


    Also according to Godbole:


    A mountain named ‘Khirdhar’ is situated at the banks of river Hingol. At the extreme end portion of this mountain, which is popularly known as Kanraj, there is an ancient cave known as ‘Hingalaj’. This place is situated in Tehsil Lyari of Baluchistan and is, since ancient times, reckoned as the largest and the most famous place of Worship of the Goddess Hingla in the Indian Sub-continent.

    The Goddess killed Hingol in a cave at a place known as “Satdeep” in, what is known as ‘Baluchistan’ today. Hingol, just before meeting his death, requested and prayed to Goddess Shakti, that he be identified and be synonymous with his name. The place, thenceforth, was known as “Hingol Tirth”.

    Those devo-tees, visiting this place Hingalag are addressed as ‘Kapdis’. The pilgrims, after completion of their pilgrimage, sport a string, made out of “Thumra”, a variety of stone, mined from “Thatta” in Sindh.

    As per the legend, in Uttar Ramayana, Lord Rama visited Hingla Teerth in a sortie in his aircraft “Pushpak” and bathed in the water basin (Jal Kunda) here. One spot in this area is identified with Lord Rama’s sacred visit.



    Hiṃgula (हिंगुल).—A mineral (vermillion) obtained from mountainous regions. It has the colour (red) of the sky at sunset. (Vana Parva, Chapter 158, Verse 94).

    Hiṅgula (हिङ्गुल) or Hiṅgulapabbata is the name of a mountain situated in Aparāntaka (western district) of ancient India, as recorded in the Pāli Buddhist texts (detailing the geography of ancient India as it was known in to Early Buddhism).—The Hiṅgula-pabbata is in the Himavantapadesa. Hinglāj is situated at the extremity of the range of mountains in Beluchisthan called by the name of Hiṅgulā, about 20 miles or a day’s journey from the sea-coast, on the bank of the Aghor or Hiṅgulā or Hingol river near its mouth.

    The "district" is the same as western Aparantaka in Astronomy, and not in other interpretations.


    The "Thumra stone" still used by the Nath is a Nummulite, a marine fossil used by Egyptians as coins and in pyramid mortar.




    Another typical confusion here is about aSula, which is found in all the ancient texts. Artists and others often interpret it as a Trident, that is, a Tri-sula. But in this basic form, it is a one-pointed spear. This is noticeable with the older and more basic Durgas such as Viraja, and with the Buddhist Ekajati, who is "Sulini" or spear-holder. This, we think, is expressing a lot of meanings similar to "one-pointedness", which is important towards building more complex experiences represented by a more complex item.



    Hingula has two legends of being invoked by the populace, once to remove an invader, and once to save the Warrior Kings from Parasurama. In so doing, they traded warfare for thread.


    It turns out to be true there is an eastward diaspora caste called Bhavsar.


    There is also a tailor caste in Gujarat called Hingu. Dodiya Rajputs have her as Kul devi.


    There are some further details in Nizar's Dominions:



    the dyer and tailor caste of Maharashtra

    Bhavsars lay claim to a Kshatriya origin and
    profess to derive their name from ' Bahusar,' Bahu — arm and §ar —
    sprung (lit. moved) meaning " sprung from the arm of Brahma.'
    Regarding their origin, they relate the following legend. When
    Parshuram, in fulfilment of his vow, extirminated the Kshatriya race,
    a few of them escaped the general carnage by taking shelter in the
    shrine of their patron goddess, Ingala Devi. The Devi, to save them
    from destruction, deprived them of their sacred thread and enjoined
    them to betake themselves to their present occupations. Those who
    were furnished with thread and needle became tailors, while others
    were supplied with dyes and became dyers. But neither their
    physical character, nor their traditions, throw any clear
    light on their real antecedents. They were known to the
    ancients as ' Sindolaka ' or the descendants of a Shudra father and
    Bhanda mother.


    Goddesses involved are:


    (1) Bhavani and (2)
    Ellama, both propitiated with offerings of flesh...

    Renuka Yellama is the mother of Parasurama.



    Their special deity is
    Ingala or Hingala (a form of Bhavani), worshipped on Fridays
    or Tuesdays, with offerings of sweetmeat. On the eighth or
    ninth of the light half of Aswin (beginning of October), the grand
    worship of the goddess is held, at which Homa (sacrifice) is per-
    formed, mogara or jasmine flowers (Jasminum Sambac) offered to the
    deity and goats and sheep sacrificed to her. They also pay devotion to
    Khandoba, Balaji, Hanuman, and the greater gods of the Hindu
    pantheon. Parsharam, the incarnation of Vishnu, and the slayer of
    Kshatriyas, is represented by a panja (metallic palm) and is adored
    with the sacrifice of a sheep. In this worship the Brahmans take
    no part, but the head of the household officiates as priest. Animistic
    deities, including Pochamma (Sitala), Mari Amma, Maisamma and
    Ellama, are also propitiated by the members of the caste. They
    have a strong belief in ghosts, charms and witch-craft.

    In Telingana, the Bhavsars are divided into Shivas (Vibhutidharis)
    and Vaishnavas (Tirmanidharis).


    For dye:


    Safflower,
    madder, turmeric, indigo, myrabolams and mango leaves furnish
    beautiful tints of scarlet, pink, rose, crimson, purple, yellow, orange
    and green.

    Nethakani are a more recent diaspora.


    It is intriguing, since towards east India and Bengal, weavers also transmitted that type of tantra which was saying that blood rituals should only be symbolic. This was later, ca. 8th-10th centuries.


    Comparatively, we find Hingula recognized at Jwalamukhi, Assam.


    In this way, she is virtually the same as Fire at Puri:


    The worship of Maa Hingula represents
    a mixture of tribal worship and Sakta Cult. The
    earlier practice of animal sacrifice is no more.
    Now only vegetable and sweets are offered as
    Bhog. Hingula represents fire and every year
    appears in the form of flame at different places.


    In Puri, she is also considered among the Eight Mahavidyas of Mahalakshmi.


    She is in the Sarala or Oriya Mahabharata:


    Goddess Hingula is worshipped in the form of fire and she is linked with the Agni Kona or southeast direction. Although murtis of the Goddess are found in the shrines dedicated to her; she is invoked in the form of fire.

    She has the form of Fire at Vidarbha in Gujarat.

    In Assam, Sarala is understood as Hingula, and her red and fire are the same thing.



    From more Hingula:


    Hinglaj Devi along with another Devi called “Kurukullh” was

    once upon a time, universally worshipped. Hingula means “cinnabar”, largely used as materia medica in ancient India.

    The mantra or incantation for Devi Hinglaj is attributed to Saint Dadhichi, an important saint in Hindu theology.


    She has a secondary mantra as well:


    “Mahaamaayaa (Queen of Illusions) who represents the supreme virtue by reigning over all three virtues, has Bhimalochana as her

    Bhairava, and derides the worldly trappings by dancing naked, resides in this cave of Hingula that enshrines her sacred head [Brahmarandra].”



    Reason for the symbolism:


    ...the head with its Hingul (Sindhoor, Vermillion) fell at this place on the Kunraj hills.

    This Peeth is considered supreme because Sati’s head had fallen here.


    The environment bears another Mark:


    The shrine is recognised by a mark which resembles the sun and the moon. This mark is upon a giant boulder at the top of the hill containing the cave. It is believed that Lord Ram created this mark with the strike of his arrow after his penance ended.


    Noticing at her Festivals:


    During the month of Chaitra, another festival is observed in the temple every Thursday which is referred as Jantal Puja. As the goddess is seen in the form of fire 'Sabari Mantra' is chanted by Dehury and fire is lit on Charapthar (char/coal).


    for the male deity:


    The fire festival is observed in the month of Phalguna. It is believed that during this festival Goddess Hingula meets Durga Madhava.



    "Sabari" has two significant meanings. First there is Sabari, a devotee of Matanga and Rama, was a Bhil woman.



    And it means the Vindhyavasini Tribe:


    According to the local legend the
    first ancestor of the tribe was an old Bhil hermit named
    Sawar who lived in Kharod two miles from Seorinarayan.
    The god Jagannath had at this time appeared in Seori-
    narayan and the old Sawar used to worship him, being the
    only person who knew where the god dwelt. The king of
    Orissa had built the great temple at Puri and wished to
    instal Jagannath in it, so he sent a Brahman to fetch him
    from Seorinarayan. But nobody could bring him to the
    god except the old hermit Sawar.

    The Sawaras are
    great sorcerers and their charms, known as Sabari Mantra,
    are considered to be very efficacious in appeasing the spirits
    of persons who have died a violent death.



    Cunningham believes a "savara" is an Axe, and that they are older and more influential than most other tribal groups such as Gonds. For instance:


    Varaha Mihira in the Brihat Samhita (ca. 550) shows the existence of Parna Sabaras.


    Vikramaditya and King Harsha interacted with them, and what he found is that they are the source of "cemetery practices" including states of possession, which are silent in Hinduism.


    Sabari mantras are for the pacification of various "demons" which are really "demon ghosts", particularly these:


    Preta, Bhuta, Vetala, Pisaca



    Davidson noticed the gravity of Sabaris and mentions:


    ...the earliest surviving text assigning the use of mantras to the historical Buddha, the Matangi-sutra section of the Sardulakarnavadana, depicts the Buddha’s ritual combat
    with a woman who is of the Matanga group...


    That makes sense, because "avadana" is an abstract, "tale or tales". If it was "Ananda Sutra", we would expect a single story, but if the correct title is "Ananda Avadana", then it could be a collection.

    As much as "Saora" is indeterminate as a tribe or as the root of "savara", a "saura" is also a cook at Sri Mandir, the biggest kitchen in the world. That remains tied to the fire of Hingula. But the origin of Jaganath in Orissa fades into myth with Indrayumna, King of Avanti in the Satya Yuga.

    He went to Orissa to a somewhat meaningless "Blue Hills" but which probably does have meaning as a Vaisnava Ashram (Sabara Dipak).


    And he is attributed with fire according to Vaisnava:


    According to another legend, after the construction of Lord Jagannath Temple was finished at Puri, Lord Jagannath ordered King Indradyumna to bring Goddess Hingula from Bidarbha to Puri to cook His Mahaprasad. Raja Indradyumna requested the King of Bidarbha to bring the Goddess to Puri. Meanwhile, the Bidarbha king Ramananda was also given the divine instructions to shift the Goddess to Puri.

    King Ramananda was bringing the Goddess on his shoulder by covering her with a cloth. At Gopalprasad, Ramananda felt thirsty, brought Hingula down and went to a nearby pond to take water. When he returned, he found that the Goddess had vanished. When the king cursed himself, the Goddess appeared before him and told him to establish a temple for her there, and she wanted to cook Mahaprasad for Lord Jagannath from there. The fire used to cook the Mahaprasad in the kitchen of the Jagannath Temple at Puri represents Maa Hingula.


    Even with a more common name, this king of Vidarbha remains untraceable:


    Dedicated to Maa Hingula, a manifestation of the Goddess Sati, the temple is believed to have been built by the mythical King Nala of Vidarbha as his tribute to Lord Jagannath.


    This is like several ancient sites, such as Nalanda. The facilities that we as moderns refer to are larger constructions over existing sites, which probably had small temples and gathering centers, which cannot usually be given any definite origin. For Jaganath, the current facility was built by King Chodaganga Deva in the 1100s.

    And it is even later in terms of her own festival:


    ...since 1575 Maa is being worshipped here through the Hingula yatra. Birbar Harichandan was the first king of Talcher who started the festival. On Sukla Chaturdashi of Chaitra month, the Goddess takes leave from Sri mandir kitchen and gives ‘darshan’ to devotees here in form of burning fire.


    So Hingula was summoned shortly after the establishment of Jaganath, but then we are left with an undateable legend. The cooking ritual Mahaprasad must be ancient because it is in twenty-six Puranas, although the fire is usually called:


    Vaisnavagni



    which shapes it more toward a particular doctrine. Why this is now common and Hingula is not is anybody's guess. The tradition rejects foreign vegetables, and makes the same menu over and over. The only variation to Mahaprasad:


    When the Sun stays in the zodiac Dhanu, during that time an additional naivedhya is given before sunrise which is called Pahili Bhoga.


    And at most, we are left with some estimates:


    In the opinion of Pandit Krupasindhu
    Mishra, the system of Mahaprasad was first
    introduced in the Grand Temple by King Jajati
    Keshari during his rule in the 6th century AD. For
    this reason, Raja Jajati is known as the 2nd
    Indradyumna in the cult of Lord Jagannath.

    In the opinion of Aniruddha Das, it was
    Raja Jajati Keshari who had not only launched
    Mahaprasad but also brought about the system
    of offering Bhog to other gods and goddesses in
    the Grand Temple.








    Similar to Durga, she has a nine-day festival, which in this case begins with an act of possession of an oracle to determine where to put the coal. Then it largely involves fire offerings. This happens in April or possibly May:


    Sukla Chaturdasi of Chaitra month


    It means the fourteenth day of the waxing moon.

    This system of Time is primarily counting this continuous chain of lunar days, and the month or calendar is rarely repetitive, so it would only have an accidental touch to a particular date in April or anything like that.


    The Moon is oblivious to whether, for example, one uses a Kali Samvat, based from applying a Puranic myth to calculations from Surya Siddhanta, which can be shown to be off by a few years from more precise positioning in the current Ephemeris. The Vikram Samvat, even if possibly also off by a few years, may at least be trying to determine the Age of Pisces. Unlike the planets, due to variable speed, there is still no consensus as to when this exactly was.

    Kali seems to be aimed at the Bullseye, that is, around the middle of the Age of Taurus. Vikram, implying "vikramaditya" is solar, and likely aimed at the Cusp of Aries to Pisces.

    But there we run into the immediate difficulty that King Vikramaditya is forced to fit year 1 of the western calendar, and then, so is the Age of Pisces. These ideas seem less accurate and more arbitrarily forced. We are not necessarily trying to say it is that much older than 57 B. C. E. because even according to the First Point of Aries:


    This coincided with the festival of Hilaria (Cybele), a time of optimism and beginnings where farmers began to sow or observed the first growth and blossoming of trees and summer crops. The naming of Aries is late in the Babylonian zodiac where the equinox was in its earliest tradition marked as in the early Middle Bronze Age by actual coincidence with the Pleiades.

    The first point of Aries is so called because, when Hipparchus defined it in 130 BCE, it was located in the western extreme of the constellation of Aries, near its border with Pisces and the star γ Arietis.



    Various estimates are given in an article that Zoroastrianism descended to cruder estimates:


    The year of change between the Ages of Aries and Pisces is variously stated as 234 BCE, 0 BCE/CE, i.e.1 BCE/CE (favoured by Christians), 63 CE, 221 CE, 234 CE and 285 CE.


    HPB used an "older" version:


    "It is a cycle, historic and not very long, but very occult, lasting about 2,155 solar years, but having a true significance only when computed by lunar months. It occurred [in] 2410 and 255 B.C., or when the equinox entered into the sign of the Ram, and again into that of Pisces."



    She is right about the speed, it is more nearly 2,155-2,160 years, which at least is not "rounded" to 2,200, or, worse yet, to 2,000. This timing makes it such that the Theosophical Society would be a herald for the Age of Aquarius. She goes on to make a warning about a Saturn conjunction concerning Europe at the end of the twenty-first century. That does not leave much time to remediate the effect that we are still "under" what they called "the alcoholic carnivorous savages of the Royal Society period". And unfortunately ca. 2100 is around when most scientists think we will have depleted too many resources and produced too much pollution to survive as a species.


    There is even a modern guess at 498 which at least has an idea for the end of the Age of Taurus:


    The eruption of the volcano Santorini in 1680 B. C. E. destroyed the Minoan civilization and along with it their Bull cult (age of Taurus). This age was marked synchronistically by the Indo-Aryan (Aries) migration and the beginnings of cattle domestication (conquering the Bull god).


    The volcano was, of course, awful, but I am not sure it is a good astrological point, since those seem to be wildly erratic dates for the Ages.


    India has numerous calendars or eras, if we look at the one that might mean an Age of the Great Year, there is a strong belief about Vikramaditya in India:


    He started his Era in 57 B.C.E., when he conquered Nepal.



    Most others do not agree. Sylvain Levi early work on chronology of Nepal.


    Those who do not believe in Indian Vikramaditya discovered Harsha Samvat 606/7 in Nepal.

    It is not the first calendar there, it is a new one, meaning a new Age, but not an astrological one.


    It is not certain that he exactly conquered Nepal:


    Victory over Nepal and Kashmir by Harshavardhana is unsure but Banbhatta and HieunTsang, both have written about supremacy of Harsha over these areas. According to Hieun-
    Tsang, he carried tooth of Gautam Buddha from Kashmir to Kannauj and built a
    sangharam. As Harsha Samvat was prevalent in Nepal thus, it can be inferred that Nepal
    was under control of Harshavardhana.


    And in this case, such as with coins at Nalanda, there is no lack on the standard record about Harsha c. 606 – c. 647 CE:



    The peace and prosperity that prevailed made his court a centre of cosmopolitanism, attracting scholars, artists and religious visitors from far and wide. The Chinese traveller Xuanzang visited the court of Harsha and wrote a very favourable account of him (as Shiladitya), praising his justice and generosity.

    In 648, Tang dynasty emperor Tang Taizong sent Wang Xuance to India in response to emperor Harsha having sent an ambassador to China. However once in India he discovered Harsha had died...


    This leads to an intrigue and the Chinese attacking India with a Nepali and Tibetan army. However:


    He had a friendly relations with King of Kamrup, Bhaskarvarman...

    Like many other ancient Indian rulers, Harsha was eclectic in his religious views and practices. His seals describe his ancestors as sun-worshippers, his elder brother as a Buddhist, and himself as a Shaivite.

    Harsha is widely believed to be the author of three Sanskrit plays Ratnavali, Nagananda and Priyadarsika.


    Its name is confused such as a remark from New Year:


    Licchavi King Amsuvarman introduced the Manadev Samvat in 604.


    Here there is also a lengthy retort against Manadeva II 576 as a misunderstanding. It thinks that 500 was dropped off Harsha's year so that 29 was the first in the new Nepali era, there are no years 1-28 recorded.


    If at first 529 = 606 A. D., then, he was probably bringing the Saka rather than Vikram calendar, which did not have that name yet.

    As a double fusion of names, Vikram is Manadev I:


    ...according to Pashupati Puran, the Bikram era was initiated during the regime of the first king of Suryabanshi (Sun descendent) Lichchavis, who ruled Nepal after their victory on Kirats, called as Dharmapal or Bhoomi Barma or Vikramaditya.


    Such legends of new Ages do however eventually refer to the extinguishing of Public Debt.


    Indian ages or eras do not reflect Zodiacal Ages in any way, unless one chooses to pursue whether Vikram Samvat is really aiming at the Cusp of Pisces, 57 B. C. E.. The astrology is almost all in the lunar cycles. These civil years, variable months, etc., of man's artificial calendar, are subject to reset by man himself.


    Along with more information on other kinds of Nepal Samvat:


    Several legends also relate Vikramaditya of Ujjayan with
    Nepal because of his mysterious deeds (Paudyal 1963: 58-
    75). In Daniel Wright’s History of Nepal we read that during
    the reign of Amsuvarma, Vikramajit, a powerful monarch
    from Hindustan who had founded a new era, came to Nepal
    in order to introduce his era and spend the rest of his life
    there (Wright 1972: 131-132). Citing the Bhasa Vamsavali,
    a nineteenth-century chronicle written in Khas-Nepali,
    certain supporters claim the VS to be an original Nepalese
    era, but there is no evidence to validate this. They claim a
    bronze sculpture kept at the temple dedicated to Vajrayogini in Sankhu portrays the head of Vikramaditya, which
    iconographically has been identified to be the head of the
    Buddha (Sharma 1970: 3). The Bhasa Vamsavali includes
    confusing stories about Vikramsen or Vikramaditya. It
    credits King Manadev for introducing VS to Nepal. On the
    one hand, it presents Vikram as Mandeva’s grandfather;
    on the other hand, it says Mandava merely obeyed the Emperor Vikramditya, who initiated VS by using the wealth
    the female deity Vajrayogini bestowed upon him to relieve
    people of their debt (Paudyal 1963: 76).



    And we again find Jubilee in a more favorable view towards Harsha Samvat:


    Vikrama certainly introduced
    the Samvat era in Nepal and, it is said, paid off all debts-
    There is indeed a curious tradition all over India that the
    founder of an era must pay off all debts existing in the
    country, and thus make all men happy.


    Concerning King Sivadeva:


    Their son
    was Jayadeva who married Rajyadevi daughter of
    Harshadeva king of Assam who had conquered Gauda,
    Udra, Kalinga and other countries.

    Pandit Bhagavanlal rightly observes that Amsuvarman in
    these inscriptions is the same Amsuvarman who is spoken
    of by Hiuen Tsang as ruling in Nepal about his time. He
    appears to have been a Thakuri or Rajput and originally
    a Samanta or feudatory of the Lichhavi king of Nepal
    named Sivadeva ; but gradually to have assumed real sov-
    ereignty himself. Now his first inscription is dated
    Samvat 34.


    Vikramajit a powerful monarch of Hindustan founded
    a new era and came to Nepal to introduce his era here.
    Now this is a second mention of the coming of Vikramajit
    and Pandit Bhagvanlal is correct in holding that this
    refers to the conquest of Nepal by Harsha and the intro-
    duction of his era, the legend confounding him with
    the Vikrama of 57 B.C. The change in the era in the
    inscription's also indicates the same thing.




    The first thing to be
    noticed is that Harsha seems very definitely to have con-
    quered Nepal and introduced his era there. This was in
    the days of a Licchavi king named Sivadeva and must have
    happened very soon after Harsha's accesion, sometime-
    about 610 A. D. The king being thus weakened his Saman-
    ta Amsuvarman, a powerful prince, easily became ascen-
    dent...



    Inscription no. 7 is by Amsuvarma him-
    self and is dated Samvat 39 which being in Harsha's era
    gives A. D. 645.



    It is exactly this time period--Nepal in the 600s--that they show considerably advanced Buddhism, and retain history that is lost elsewhere. This bit of India and then Bengal around the 800s don't know what happened to themselves, aside from what has been kept in Nepal. At this time, it was highly important internationally, as this has everything to do with the transmission of Buddhism to Tibet.

    Some of the usual thought on Amsuvarma is that he was the father of Bhrkuti, although it may have been a successor. She has no name. In the actual histories, like Madri, she is called "princess of Nepal". Bhrkuti is rather a divine name that was applied to her retrospectively. Importantly she married the Tibetan emperor in about 640. It does not count as a "transmission" with literature and gurus, but, she brought items and statuary and started building temples. In terms of personal practice there is no one like her.

    Imperial Tibet collected Buddhism somewhat incidentally:


    He is said to have
    conquered Nepal and Assam
    and dominated over other parts
    of India. He demanded the hand
    of the daughter Amsu-varman
    the king of Assam and the latter
    dare not refuse.

    or:


    Songtsan-Gampo married the
    daughter of Amsuvarman, daughter of Nepal's King, and in deference to the new queen's belief which he
    himself favored, built a great temple known as Jokhang to house her image of Buddha.





    Asoka is the first known dating system, probably up until the Saka system, our year 78, referring to Kaniska.

    Rulers of Nepal initially followed the Saka era and then took to the era initiated by Amsuvarman. The inscriptions of
    Manadeva and his descendants, including an early set of records of Amsuvarman, show the
    regular use of the Saka era. But, it is curious to note that the era used in the later inscriptions
    of Amsuvarman and his successors can be achieved only by deducting 500 from the current
    Saka era.

    All the inscriptions dated in the reign of Amsuman
    are dated between the years 30 and 194. This ‘samvatsara’ also does not have a specific
    name. Some scholars have recently demonstrated in the light of Tibetan sources that the
    identity of this second Nepalese era is based on the model of Saka era and had its
    commencement after 500 of the commencement of the latter, i.e. in 578 CE.


    Both systems are Kartikkadi.

    In this view, eras based on the death of Krishna or Buddha are "fabricated", which is correct. Neither was a recorded moment going forward. But neither was the birth of Jesus, and this dictates the whole western calendar, although many say he was probably born around 4 B. C. E.. With the above, we find a "new era" which did not really affect the calendar or time-keeping system at all, other than to chop 500 off the number.


    Skanda Purana also uses the expression Amsuvarman Samvat.


    The oldest known Skanda Purana manuscript from our year 810 is dated in Amsuvarman Samvat.



    There is a record of Gum Vihara in 32 Amsu Samvat.

    Of Harsha of Kannauj:


    We are told by Yuan Chwang that " lately
    there was a king called Amsu Varman in Nepal who
    had written a book on Sabda Vidya.''

    ...he used an Indian
    era which was only recently instituted. As we know
    that eras are established only by king's claiming to be
    sovereign of the whole of Arya Varta there is no other
    era but Harsha's possibly in the beginning of the 7th
    century.


    From some Metalcraft:


    The Saka era was, of course,

    employed in Licchavi Nepal through the reign of

    Sivadeva I (a.D. 590-604), until Amsuvarman, his

    illustrious successor, introduced, or at least gave cur

    rency to a new era, the Amsuvarman samvat, which

    was used in Nepal from about its twenty-ninth year until the late ninth century [879].



    I suppose you could say the Harsha era starts in 576, and is ported to Nepal effectively around its year 29 or 605, or more likely it means the era "begins" with his birth and was not applied until his coronation.

    I am not sure if Assam has any of its own recorded history prior to the Varman dynasty, ca. 350-650, and there is not much about this.

    The Indian Gupta Empire collapsed in the late 500s. So there were several minor monarchs, as well as the last wave of Indian republics. Harsha emerged as the next powerful king, and made a confederation where in essence, many of these republics pledged themselves to the monarch. In Nepal, at least, he is considered a new era due to bringing a Debt Jubilee.

    If they have an old record that says "Vikram Samvat", it would be doing so centuries before the term was in use in India. So it probably wouldn't even mean the same thing. If the new era in fact involved Vajrayogini, this also appears to be prior to her written material.


    Vajrayoginī is a Buddhist deity which the Hindus borrowed in the form of Chinnamaṣṭā. Thus the name of the village appears to be unmistakably Buddhist. The village must have derived its name from the temple of Vajrayoginī which was in existence in early times.


    This is at Vikrampur, Bengal:


    On 13 April 2012, archaeologists announced the discovery of a 2.5-meter-wide wall around three feet below the surface, which was thought to belong to a Buddhist temple; this was confirmed on 23 March 2013. They also unearthed around 100 Buddhist statues, sculptures, and copper plates, and declared the site to be around 1,000 years old. The research director of the project, Professor Sufi Mustafizur Rahman, told The Daily Star, “This is an incident of huge importance to all of us. Many historians have mentioned about a Vihar at Bajrojogini in Bikrampur, but we are lucky to find it just within three years.”


    ...consider the contents of tortoiseshell inscriptions discovered at Vajrayogini (Vikrampur): both the Buddha and Vāsudeva, i.e. Viṣṇu, are praised side by side...


    In the 600s, the Varmans of Assam allied with Harsha against a common foe in Bengal. This Vajrayogini Town is the birthplace of Atisha ca. 980. But that is not particularly old evidence of it. Here again, because Bengal does not have its own history such as the roots of Baul, they turn to Nepalese Vajrayogini Dance entitled:


    bama kapara dhari


    by:

    King Pracanda Dev of Gaur/Bengal who became Santikar Acharya of Nepal


    He is considerably older than Atisha and enmeshed in Nepalese history.

    For the Swayambhunath Stupa:


    Available Nepalese historical inscriptions do not push the antiquity of Swayambhunath beyond the life and times of Shankara Deva, the grand father of Man Deva (c. 467 A.D.), the first Lichhavi king of historical importance. But if we were to go by Chinese records such as the T’ Ang Annals, to which scholars ascribe dates more than sixteen centuries prior to the composition of treatises such as the Swayambhu Purana, the exact antiquity of this great Stupa poses a baffling problem.

    In any case, few grudge it the distinction of being one of the most ancient of all the chaityas in Asia.


    The Bengali did not become king of Nepal, but something more like this:


    Prachanda Deva, King of Gaur (Bengal) built the Swayambu stupa encasing the eternal flame and his nephew Gunakadeva was anointed as the King of Nepal.



    Except he wasn't king of Bengal then, either, but renounced it.

    Nepalese history also has to be filtered as cycles, since this story is set before the Kali Yuga. It may have come from Kanakamuni:


    ...sent to Nepal by Kankamuni Buddha who came to Nepal on pilgrimage. Basupur, Agnipur, Bayupur, Nagpur and Shantipur-all shrines dedicated to the different elements of nature as earth, fire, air, water etc, which stand even to this day in the precincts of Swayambhu, are said to have been built by Prachanda Deva. After the death of Prachanda Deva, his son Shakti Deva ruled over Nepal.


    or Kasyapa:


    After obtaining blessings
    and instructions from Kasyapa Tathagata he went to Kathmandu renouncing his kingdom. King Prachanda Deva paid
    homage to lord Swayambhu and became a disciple of Acarya
    Gunakara. Acarya Gunakara ordained and initiated him in
    the mysteries of Sutras and Tantras. He was then called Santikar Acarya. Acarya Santikar, thinking of the later periods,
    when people with evil mind might destroy this self-originated
    divine light, decided to cover it by erecting a stupa over it.
    Bhikshu Gunakara gave him permission to construct a stupa
    and conferred on him the title of Vajracharya. After completing the stupa he went to the retreat in Santipur.



    There probably was a sacred site there, but probably not a massive, complex stupa until later.

    Here is how it lines up according to Dowman:


    In the {temple called Santipuri} Manjughosa's emanation, the Dharmaraja Amsuvarman ('Od-zer Go-cha), met Vajrasattva's emanation, the Acarya Santikar, who had obtained the Body of Immortality.

    If we accept Santikar Acarya as the actual builder of the concrete Stupa and accept SK's assertion that Amsuvarman was Santikar's contemporary...because Santikar is associated with the establishment of the vajrayana this date assumes a very early arrival of Tantra in Nepal. There is only one early inscription at Swayambhu, and we have only incidental literary evidence that the Stupa was worshipped by countless devotees from all over the Buddhist world...

    ...leaving his kingdom in the hand of his son, Sakti Deva...

    King Gunakamadeva entered Santipur and met the Acarya Santi Sri...

    Gunakamadeva is said to have been a puppet of Amsuvarman, an interloper who seized power at the beginning of the 7th century and became the greatest of the Nepali Kings of the Licchavi...



    more recently:


    The court of another great king, Amsuvarman (r. A.D. 605-621), was visited by a Chinese embassy. His palace in Harigaon, near the present Kathmandu, is described in Chinese records in terms of architectural magnificence. A successor of Amsuvarman, King Narendradeva, is remembered also in Tibetan history, for he married a daughter to the Tibetan emperor Songtsen Gampo, the scourge of Central Asia.


    He may have taken the numbers from Gellner:


    Amsuvarman (reigned Valley 605-21)

    Licchavi Dynasty accepts this.


    But from the East Nepal Terai, Mung Maw Rong held one of the main forces used to smash the Indian pretender after Harsha:


    This was the time when his contemporary Srong-Tsen Gampo of Tibet was consolidating his kingdom in the east, west, north and south. Assisted by the clever tact of Mung Maw Rong, he managed to gain the confidence of all the Bhutia tribes of Khampa Jong; ultimately, he was elected the Phipon or Headman of the Khampa Jong village under King Srong-Tsen Gampo of Tibet.
    During this period, Senje Lungma or Kathmandu Valley was under the rule of a Kirat King called Hangsu Deva who ruled from the fortress at Koli or Kori Drang. Kirat MSS indicates that while he led a self indulgent life and spent a major part of his time hunting, he reigned a peaceful kingdom with happy subjects and had embraced Hinduism although he did not attach much significance to religious instructions. King Hangsu Deva had a council of ten ministers who were called Karthaks, his chief minister Karthak Wookdey was himself a Buddhist. When Karthak Wookdey observed the king's habit of ignoring religious instructions, he made an effort to convert the king into Buddhism. Convinced by his Chief Minister and his council of ministers King Hang-su Deva permitted the teaching of Buddhism in the kingdom and Karthak Wookdey successfully converted him into a Buddhist.

    The year 640 AD saw the death of Kirat King Hangsu Deva and the ascension of his son-in-law, King Srong-Tsen Gampo of Tibet on the throne of Koli or Kathmandu since the king had no male heir to the throne. Srong-Tsen Gampo ruled Nepal valley for a year and it is during his reign that he brought twelve divisions of Tamang force and kept them round the Kathmandu Valley for its protection.

    The Licchavi Dynasty page shows instead a shuffle of minor rulers until:

    643-679 Narendradeva


    If Bhrkuti were Narendradev's daughter, the foregoing would not be possible. In all likelihood, there was a power vacuum, since this Tamang cavalry made major settlements all through the area, that part is not an allegory.


    Exactly why Nepal has an era from 576-879 which comes from an Indian source but so far has not been mentioned in India, I am not sure.


    In the next Indian empire after Harsha:


    The official inscriptions of the first Pāla rulers reflect a continuous tradition of donations
    made to the saṃgha by the king but also by his subjects, the sovereign ratifying the
    donation of land-revenues for the upkeep of the institution while his subjects had
    provided the funds for the initial donation; Tibetan sources, however, mention that
    Dharmapāla had been involved in the establishment of the great monasteries of
    Vikramaśīla and Somapura (Paharpur, North Bengal).


    Maw Rong introduced New Year Festival in the last week of December. This source however makes another bizarre statement that Ilam, Nepal, is an exarchate of Elam, Persia. There is nothing that would support this notion.


    There is something to this Amsuvarman as for one thing, he should be shown as an interruption of the Licchavis. He could not more likely be Assamese, Varman, that is almost the only thing known of them. He is equivalent to an Age. It causes a strong suggestion of Vajrayogini in Bengal and tantrism in Nepal at a considerably earlier point than any known scriptures or testimony of it. Yet we see that Sabari Mantra occurred in some pre-written, legendary stage. It becomes mixed with Fire and Shakti practices, which, again, if not explicitly taught, are at least comprehensible in the oldest layer of writings, e. g. Lotus Sutra and Mayuri, and Pratisara at Gandahar.

    The Fire Goddess could be much more simply explained if the whole Pitha system were explained as subordinate to this, the top of her head, including her mind, the Brahmarandra, and her Vermillion Tika.



    Most of the Silk Road through and around India is used for Buddhism including Assam:


    This is a relatively unknown, ancient trade route that is considered a part of the larger web of Silk Roads. This route existed before the Central Asian Silk route became popular. This trade route between Eastern India and China came to be known during the early 3rd century BCE, and it became popular by the 2nd century BCE. By 7th century AD various other branches of the SSR emerged to create web of trading routes.

    Indian sources have failed to provide abundant evidence about the SSR and the interaction that took place across this route...











    It has no written history but a ton of actual existence as the Eastern Gate:

    ...kaolin ceramic and four pieces of roulted pottery of
    Roman civilisation dated to the 1st and 2nd century AD...


    Kabul, Peshawar, Attari, Amritsar, Kashmir, Ambala, Kurukshetra, Delhi, Mathura,
    Patna, kolkata. They were important trade networks for long distance and local trade as well and were also
    routes through which Buddhist monks passed by on their way to pilgrimages. There are many pre historic sites
    all along this route like the Harappan sites, Buddhist stupas and monasteries Kos Minars (Mile Stones), Baolis
    (wells) etc. Other sites nominated for the UNESCO World Heritage site and which fall on the silk route in India
    are Vikramshila, Vaishali, Kushinagar, Ahichchhatra, Indraprastha, Arikameduin Pondicherry (Fonia, R.S).

    When Buddhist monks travelled to India on pilgrimages they carried silk textiles which could be used
    as cash. These silk which came to them in the form of religious donations were exchanged for lodgings and
    other facilities. The pilgrims gave silk to monasteries along the routes. This system of bringing silk by Buddhist
    pilgrims was initiated by Xuanzang who was initially denied travel documents to India by the Chinese Emperor
    (Tang Dynasty). However he soon received 30 horse loads of treasure mostly silk textile from the ruler of
    Gaochang just outside the Tang frontier. This system was followed by other pilgrims for a long time (Liu. X,
    2010).


    BhaskarVarman who was the greatest ruler of ancient Kamrup was a highly intelligent and a farsighted
    person who encouraged Sino-Indian co-operation in commerce and culture. He sent valuable presents to Chinese
    envoys such as a map of Assam, eastern India and Bengal. Silk textiles and books on aloe bark were sent as gifts
    to HarshaVardhana by BhaskarVarman from Assam. Scholars identified such fabrics with muga and pat, the
    traditional silk of Assam which suggests that these were locally produced as early as the 7th century.


    Till the 18th century AD, North East India was self-sufficient. Assam was a meeting ground for various civilisations. People from the vast expanse of South East
    Asia migrated into this land and settled here, and have formed the composite Assamese culture. Into this North
    Eastern region of India which was originally Assam before becoming separate independent states, traders from
    South, South West China and Myanmar (Burma), came for commercial activities. Many travellers have travelled
    on this road for thousands of years and kept it extremely lively with their commercial and cultural activity. This
    route forms a wonderful tourist destination and provides a whole array of expectations from large scale tourism
    and other industrial avenues.



    Even for the major calendar, Saka Era is easily disputable as to whether it was Kaniska.


    There is not one which is not a guess or a legend until Harsha comes along and says, here is a calendar reset, because I saud so. I get to say this because I have cleared the debts.


    His calendar technically has Indian evidence, such as a few copper plates in Uttar Pradesh. The memory was so strong, the articles were not even discovered until 1894.

    But in Nepal, for example, on p. 5, a Vamshavali uses some Harsha Samvat dates.


    On this point, Nepal has written archives pertaining to an Indian king, who, even though he must have affected a lot of India for at least a period of time, does not have this legacy.

    Harsha Charita at Columbia, or archive with commentary.


    Despite it being in the Code of Hammurabi, Harsha may be the last in the "tradition" of debt relief. Yet he is also possibly the first, or one of the few, where we can say "an Age begins here".

    Those are supposed to be the same.

    We know that in Europe, after this point, one can pretty much forget it. I am not sure if India has anyone further. And we see how downplayed this is in available information---again it is like, if you even say it, all you will receive is blank stares.

    Independent republics pledged themselves to Harsha, which would not be that much different from a few American states electing a King. I could see Texas and New Mexico throwing themselves at the theological feet of a Toltec revivalist. I don't think anyone could come up with a better plot for the course of their future. More likely it will be something that tries to reinvigorate the "dollar". But I have not come across anything historically that tells me that "currency" is anything other than garbage. Silk--that was a useful resource. Yes, of course, if someone came through with a bolt of silk once in a while, I would give them twenty dollars.

    As to why Amsuvarman may have been one of Sivadeva's "feudal chiefs" while he sounds like he should be from Assam, is indeterminable.

    It is, of course, possible that the Palas easily caused an "age of Harsha" to be dispersed from India, whereas it continued in Nepal, equivalently named for Amsuvarman, 606-879 in our terms. Big enough to say there is something to it, without having to claim it goes on for eternity, etc., and as to whether the 879 Nepal Samvat was an upgrade or a takeover is a different story.

    What occurred in Nepal in the 600s is a quixotical mix of a ruler who sounds Assamese, but conditioned by a spiritual guide of the rival if not enemy Bengal. This is the direct precursor of the actual first Buddhism promoted in Tibet. This is at the same time as military field masters such as Harsha and Maw Rong are thought to have converted to Buddhism; at the very least, they did not persecute it.

    After this point, we lose the integrity of the Silk Road, considering that Roman relics of the early centuries are found in Assam, but, by the 700s, no one knew what a "denarius" was any more.

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    Age of Amsuvarma and Bhrkuti




    This is a strange tale that mixes the most concretely-known facts with the surreal.

    No one is quite sure how/why it began, other than more or less by fiat. Indian King Harsha seems to have started it, which was then replicated in Nepal by Amsuwarma, but mostly disappeared in India, to the point where a few coins from Harsha Samvat are the only proof. As a king he is celebrated, but any use of his calendar is not mentioned. In Nepal, I am not sure the phrase "Harsha Samvat" is physically found, but "Amsuvarma Samvat" is identical and is used to record almost three centuries.



    Numerous different calendars such as these are the main reason that the many Indian records have been quite difficult to sort correctly.


    Before starting on the details, here are the results from a recent poll in fifty-three countries. This was large, many pages for psycho-analytic pontification, but the first question is quite simple: do you believe your country works democratically?


    1.India

    2.Taiwan

    3.Malaysia, S. Korea, Vietnam

    6.China, Singapore

    8.Philippines

    9.Indonesia, Denmark


    Those are strong showings at around 70% approval, while the U. S. is #35 at slightly less than half.

    This is from a western think tank, not supposed to be making Asia look good, which is why these results were buried. What "democratic" may mean is suggestive, as it seems unlikely the Vietnamese consulted any American technical dictionary to respond appropriately. The whole issue of voting has nothing to do with whether a society is run well. So we will return to historical issues to try to get an idea what happened.



    Recently we just saw that another one of the several reasons historical records go bad is because different Sanskrit words such as "amsu" and "udaya" use the same character in Chinese.

    Chinese records are very interesting, since, when they begin, they are large, thorough, and satisfying to the observer. However, one should be aware that they are half, or more, "lossy" just due to linguistic limitations such as above. Then there are negligent mistakes. Then there are intentional doctorations. And then the authors such as Xuan Zang or Paramartha only partially understand what they are talking about. So, you do get a stream of something that is at least based on something objectively true, and otherwise they are unreliable, or at least we should not swallow their every word as the final analysis.

    A main example being we can easily get a long list of Patriarchs of Chinese Buddhism, which is what HPB used to prove its age and authenticity. This however comes from the seventh century, which might sound old to us, but it is already five hundred years after what it says it is talking about. When placed into perspective, the very idea there might be any "patriarchs" in the way implied by the list seems unsupportable. Xuan Zang accurately reported that Indians generally did not care for mundane time-table lists of "patriarchs", or gurus or lineages or whoever, and so the relative weakness of Indian history is that it could have easily provided these details, except they don't care. The excitement was in the fact a teaching had really come from Vajrapani or some similar non-human source. It was not until later there became much concern for who and how.


    Another thing which seems to have been the case is that by the late seventh century--680 or so--a widespread cult of esoterism was "publicly visible". In other words, lay people in numerous areas of India could be seen having the belief, practice, and use of magic, all over the place, spells, amulets, and so on. Here, Theosophy would fairly question how much of it is superstition, is for personal gain, or is divine. On this, there is a type of Lacuna, because we can only find the adequate scriptures from a later period. Now if we are not going to go off the deep end of conjecture and insist it had all been transmitted by Kasyapa since the time of Buddha, there are still things that show, from this earlier time, I think they are like what might be called Mnemonics, that if you did have the personal instruction from a master, those books would work. It seems to me that it took a few centuries for this to become expressible as an art that could be summarized in a single volume.


    Again this is for the purposes of shaping a perspective, that around this time, the 600s, Europe was turning into the Roman church, and then there were Islamic Caliphates of a similar nature, and whatever may have come from an original Greek and Indian bond gets wrecked. Suddenly, tiny little Nepal is in a unique and pivotal role in world history. This happens to be in the exact same move as making a type of magical claim that is said by experts to be an anachronism.


    It is also called a Golden Age.


    It is worth cleaning up because the material is in a mish mash.


    India has multiple instances of confusing a name between two or more people over vastly different periods. Due to the resemblance, "Gunakar Acharya" might get mixed up with "King Gunakamadeva"--but who is that? We get wildly different results from standard sources.


    Wiki:

    Gunakamadeva was a Thakuri ruler credited with the founding of Kathmandu. He ruled from around 949 to 994 CE.


    Britannica:


    Kathmandu was founded in 723 by Raja Gunakamadeva. Its early name was Manju-Patan.

    He was succeeded by Udayadeva.



    None of that sounds quite right, yet, so we might as well look at a tradition founded by Three Vajracharyas:


    It is Manju Dev Acharya, who
    brought Dharmakar, a Chinese Prince along with him...

    Gunakar Acharya was the person who created the
    heir to Manju Dev Acharya and introduced the procedure
    of Abhishek in Nepal.

    Shantikar Acharya...paying homage and performing puja
    of the Goddess Guheswari and the selfless
    Swayambhu in the form of flame.


    Manjushri settled Patan some untold thousands of years ago, and so there is an obvious gap until the 600s. Then someone in Nepal isn't trying to give a chronicle of lineage holders to Kasyapa or Buddha. Gunakar has done something outside of time and space, and this becomes permanently enshrined.


    To King Gunakamadeva in a Cultural Portrait:



    The Goddess Laxmi (goddess of wealth,light,wisdom and fortune) appeared to the king as he was worshiping, and told him to build a city at the junction of the Vishnumati and Bagmati rivers. The city was to be built in the shape of a sword in this scared place. The king duly did what was requested and moved his court to Kathmandu from Patan.




    Gunakar Acharya is mentioned as an astrologer discussing Saturn somewhat differently than Alan Leo does.


    It is also said he built the stupa in the reign of King Vrisha Deva, with Gunakar being a self-taught devotee of Manjushri.



    Then with respect to Avalokiteshvara and Santikar:


    According to Guru his disciple Bandhudatta brought Karunāmaya to Nepalmandal from Kāmarukāmaksha, Asam.


    It is Red, Rakta, or Rato Avalokiteshvara, often mistaken for Matsyendranath who was somewhat later.

    In a legendary shape from Gellner:


    kAsyapa

    Varanasi

    (Benares)

    Taught Pracanda
    Dev = Santa Sri
    Vajracarya


    On the one hand, the Svayambhu Purana relates that Vajracaryas are the
    descendants of [lit. ‘flow from’] the tradition of Santikar Acarya. On the other hand,
    according to the Vajracaryas’ [own] tradition, it is also said that they take the form
    of guru Vajrasattva’s ‘created body’ ( nirmanakaya ).

    Vajracaryas draw up horoscopes, practise healing by blowing, act as
    healers ( vaidya ) etc.



    This is correct, in the Sanskrit Swayambhu Purana, Pracanda and Gunakar are in Chapter Seven.


    Santikar Acharya is in Chapters Nine and Ten, up to the last verse 161/170.


    The spelling variations are worse in an English chapter summary which also has Cunda or Cundi, possibly a source of the Pala goddess.


    The whole thing would slip and occur in the time of Gunakamadeva II if the following were true in Tibetan:


    According to the writings of Situ Panchen (1700–1774), Shantikar Acharya was Vikramashila’s western door-keeper, known as Acharya Vagishwarikirti (~10th century).



    Or according to the Nepalese:


    The tradition of this Svayambhū Purāna was handed down from Buddha Śākyamuni to Maitreya, and continued as follows: Maitreya→ Bhikshu Upagupta→ King Aśoka...


    Whether this integrated system appeared as a systematic Hinduization process or as the Newar Buddhists' strategy for survival of their tradition is open for discussion.


    They have not found a manuscript older than around 1389, when the Mughals attacked Nepal. One would think if the story had been around since Asoka, that it would be...pretty well known? So at the worst, there was no such story, and they slapped it together as a survival mechanism.

    We would almost be prone to dismiss it, except this has what may be a memory of a real geological event of the unusual age of about 30,000 years. If it was thought the lake formed at 30 million years, then we might say, well, it is probably only a story. The fact of it being relatively recent geologically leaves it open to the possibility.


    What is unusual about the Purana is that it seems to refer to Kali Yug:


    Many ages later, during the time of Buddha Kashyapa, the Indian king Pracandadeva left his kingdom of Gauda in the east and traveled to Swayambhunath, where he took ordination under the name Shantashri (Skt. Śāntaśrī; Tib. shi ba dpal). Concerned about the damage that people of this afflicted, degenerate age might inflict upon such a sacred site, Shantashri decided he must protect the stupa. He covered the original with rock, and built another above it, out of bricks. Thus emerged the stupa as we see it today, cherished by all the masters of our era.


    And then if we thought in objectively possible terms of, well, perhaps this refers to Disciple Kasyapa, then, even since before the 600s, he is believed to reside in Bihar at Mount Kukkutapada, which would make sense for a historical Pracanda.

    If the story of Swayambhu was a later fabrication, why would he have left Bengal to see it?

    There obviously was a Swayambhu Stupa well prior to the 1300s text, and almost no one would argue there was not an existing site which was enlarged with brickwork around the time of Pracanda. This would not happen unless the main part of the story was already in place.


    Bajracharya 2014 thinks a Chariot Festival was already in Maghada in the 5th century and shared with Nepal; in his telling:


    He is described to have received his initiation in a cave at
    Svayambhu from a Siddha Guru Gunakar Acarya who had attained all the
    powers of a Vajracarya by his own yoga. After the initiation, he was named
    Acarya Shantikara and he erected five temples for five deities around the
    Svayambhu stupa. In the temple of Akaspur, he erected a life-sized image of
    Heruk-Cakrasamvar and his consort Vajrabarahi and consecrated the shrine as
    an agam for the worship of tantric deities. Later, the shrine came to be known
    as Santipur. It is described that he performed the tantric initiation of those
    wishing to become Vajracarya. The lack of historical evidences makes it
    difficult to point out when the tradition of the tantric initiation started in the
    Nepal valley.


    However, the term Swayambhu is found first used in Gunakaranda Vyuha written during third century and
    has reference about the concept of PancaBuddhas. The concept of five
    Buddhas and its five consorts as supreme knowledge was being taken as
    guiding tools since the Licchavi times since every worldly thing classified
    under a Buddha family among five Panca Buddha.

    And there is fertile ground for misattribution, since the same names for kings come around again in the later Nepal Samvat during the 900s, including:


    Sahadeva was succeeded by Narendradeva and Gunakamadeva respectively.


    Gunakamadeva was succeeded by Narendradeva and Udayadeva.


    I would suspect there was an early version based on Vajrayogini, and a later version on Vajravarahi, so that both are true but conflated. The timing for the earlier group matches the correspondingly weird politics. From Art During the Malla Period:


    All Vajracaryas of Kathmandu belong to the Acarya Guthi: its
    leaders meet once a year on the eighth_day of the dark fortnight of the month of Cait. The main
    shrine of the Guthi is in the cave-like Agama-che, nowadays called Santipur, below Svayambhunath.
    According to oral tradition, Santikar Acarya, the first man in the Valley to be initiated as a
    Vajracarya, originally named this Agama-che: Akasapur “the city of space”.



    AmSuvarman was a usurper whom the
    vamsavalis designate as a Thakuri or a Vaisya Rajput. He may have been a Gupta. He was the
    minister of the Licchavi Sivadeva, his Mahasamanta, and his son-in-law, before he established his own
    kingdom. He reigned from a palace known as Kailasakutabhavana which had been built by his father-
    in-law. Hstian-Tsang says that he wrote a linguistic work the Sabda-vidya-sastra, “A Treatise on the
    knowledge of Sounds,” which is not extant. He was sufficiently influent to be able to marry his
    sister to Surasena of the Indian Maukhari dynasty; and the son from this marriage wed the Gupta
    ruler of Magadha, Adityasena. Tibetan tradition maintains that the Tibetan king Srong-btsan
    sgam-po married Amsuvarman’s daughter Bhrkuti and she is said to have carried with her to Tibet
    images of Aksobhya, Maitreya and Tara. In reality Bhrkuti was probably the sister of
    Narendradeva. Narendradeva seized power from Visnugupta who had succeeded to the throne
    after Amsuvarman’s death. It was during Narendradeva’s reign that Chinese representatives visited
    the court and we shall quote the description from the T’ang History...



    Sivadeva's daughter-in-law was Assamese because of his son:

    Jayadeva who married Rajyadevi daughter of
    Harshadeva king of Assam...


    So perhaps was his son-in-law Amsuvarma:


    He is believed to have been a son of a brother of the queen of Sivadeva.



    So far it is a little odd to see "negative" terms like "usurper" applied to someone who is the founder of a "Golden Age". However we can find the Varmans were brought for a reason such as if you travel:


    Singhakhetu, the last ruler of his dynasty brought prosperity to the kingdom. Subsequent to the rule of the Gunakadeva dynasty, rulers from India, particularly from Bengal and then Madras province ruled Kathmandu.

    This was followed by the reign of Abhir dynasty of eighth rulers and Kiratis said to be originally of the North Eastern hill region of India. Their succession of 29 rulers reigned here until the Lichavis came into power.



    Although that is true, it is not really all that long before more Abhir Guptas come in contending for power. "Varman" ordinarily means "armor, coat of mail", so it is actually frequent for a few different families of warriors to use the name. It being somewhat implied that Amsu Varman was from Assam, this is ambiguous because Maukharis are all Varmans. Sharvavarman made a chronology seal, and has other seals at Nalanda showing it must be contemporary to him, c. 560-575 CE. The first one may be the first of its kind, i. e., a visible attempt at recording "normal history". The end of his reign is congruous to the beginning of Harsha or Amsu Samvat.



    For Amsuvarman:


    Some early historians in Nepal had mistakenly concluded that the pictographic symbol used to name the father of Bhrikuti in Tang Annals stood for Amshu (which means the rays of the rising sun in Sanskrit, the language used in Nepal then), where as Udaya (the rise of the sun) would also be written with the same symbols.

    His ruling period is known as the 'Golden Period' in the history of Nepal.


    Meaning what? Since even before Sivadeva's time, control of Kathmandu had been falling in the hands of the Abhira Gupta:


    Bhaumagupta was a de facto ruler until A.D 590, when King Sivadeva, the reigning Licchavi had, in fact, begun to assert his royal authority probably with the support of the Varman family.


    Sources of the family of Amshuverma are silent and there was marital relation between the Deva and Verma clans.


    After Amsuvarma, something happens that caused Udaya and Narendra to be banished to Tibet:


    Udaydeva's inscription declaring him king is dated in the A.D 621. Three years later in year 624 A.D, Jishnugupta's first inscription appears and his usurption of throne is proven.

    Vishnugupta enjoyed a brief reign and must have been ousted from the throne by Narendradeva, who restored the Licchavi dynasty in Nepal in A.D 643 with the help of Tibetan king.






    Amsuvarma as a Winged Lion with a Bull as the Body of Desire:





    That is called a "Licchavi coin". But actually, the Licchavis were mostly interrupted from 606-643, first by Varman and then by Gupta rulers.


    Amsuvarman was at the time of King Harsha, who is in one of the largest Buddhist texts:


    K.P. Jaiswal in Imperial History of India, says that according to a 7-8th century Buddhist text, Mañjuśrī-mūla-Kalpa, Harsha was born of King Vishnu (Vardhana) and his family was of Vaishya caste. This is supported by some more writers.



    This chapter is exceptionally difficult. It is written like a prophecy, "will happen", for events that are already in the reader's past. So it may be a little dolled up, but, a reasonably accurate story begins at:


    53.­656
    “Then, his younger brother with the initial H...


    MMK adds an extensive trip to Hell after describing numerous problems in Bengal until events matching the Reign of Harsha:


    Harsha, having recovered his sister – a young lady of exceptional attainments, learned in the doctrines of the Sammitiya ,school of Buddhism...

    The King of Central Bengal, Sasanka, who has been mentioned as the treacherous murderer of Harsha’s brother, and who was probably a scion of the Gupta dynasty, was a worshipper of Siva, and hated Buddhism, which he did his best to destroy. He dug up and burned the holy Bodhi tree at Bodh Gaya, on which, according to legend, Asoka had lavished inordinate devotion; he broke the stone marked with the footprints of Buddha at Pataliputra; and he destroyed the convents, and scattered the monks, carrying his persecutions to the foot of the Nepalese hills. These events must have happened about 600 A.D. The Bodhi tree was replanted after a short time by Purnavarman, King of Magadha, who is described as being the last descendant of Asoka, and as such was specially bound to honour the object venerated by his great ancestor.


    By the end of five and a half years the conquest of the north-western regions, and probably also of a large portion of Bengal, was completed...

    The Kings of Ujjain in Central India and of Pundravardhana in Bengal, both of which kingdoms were more or less subject to Harsha’s control, belonged to the Brahman caste.



    Sasanka was defeated, evidently was allowed to remain in place, performed years of penance, and went to hell.

    MMK is barely readable like that, in most cases you have to do extra work and would need other sources in order for it to make sense. It does mention "Satavahana", but mostly leaves you guessing. This most likely reflects that the subject would have been known to the audience.


    Towards the end, the chapter refers to additional kinds of kings, seems mostly normal, such as the Sun as the King of the Planets, and then for the Signs:


    And that of the rāśis, Kanya.


    One might need to mentally adjust and say "Queen", but, otherwise, no surprises here, this is what we would expect. It probably is the case in the old Chaldean records, same as this Buddhist scripture at around a thousand years later.


    It is a complete headache if you try to read it in a normal way like "tell me about King Harsha", but I think it is really using the whole world to teach Buddhism, which is primarily mantra. It is more or less the saga of Manjushri guiding kings, who in some cases are mantrins, but, in the Kali Yug, become increasingly evil and violent. This being the main theme, one can also find the Pandavas occupying a somewhat exalted position. So it has to be at least somewhat complementary to the Mahabharata.

    Moreover, it makes a definite type of theological posture based in Manjushri, and by later just kind of adding in Nagarjuna and Asanga. It is less significant as to whether one wishes to believe he literally lived six hundred years, but here, it was by the mantra of Mayuri. And then because it mentions Asanga, we would objectively suggest that the material was compiled shortly after him, ca. 550-600, which obviously matches the heavy use of Nalanda for example.


    The beginning of the chapter is very well done, because it is a large section on the importance and nature of the doctrine. As it moves into its references to at least some real people, in the past and then around the time of Buddha was a stronger proportion of virtuous kings, and it starts off focusing on Ajatasatru and Asoka. The first, nothing less than the King of Maghada, is referred to in Buddhist and Jain legends, which are widely different.

    Not much is in the link other than the legends. There perhaps aren't many sources, or nothing to suggest why any of the anecdotes were better or worse. As MMK goes along, Asoka is recognizable enough, and for example to summarize the Licchavis section:


    In the country called Nepāla
    Nestled at the foothills of the snowy mountains,
    There will be King Mānavadeva,
    Born to the Licchavi clan. {53.501}
    53.­502
    “He too, having accomplished his mantric quest...

    ...After that, the kings will defy propriety
    By serving the interests of foreigners.



    I would say that stuff is not really the subject, which is Manjushri:


    The inner essence of every being is that of the divine youth,
    Who exercises his power over the worlds.


    Manjushri is explained as and establishes the practice of Karttikeya--Mars. As this Root Manual heavily concerns mantra, in the Vimalakirti Sutra he deals with the Buddha-era Vimalakirti Licchavi, to which, there is a quite bizarre return in the 700s for the sources of mantra or guidance in using them. That is, Kukkuripa in many cases is also said to have spoken to Vimalakirti, but, on close examination, he was using the Sutra as the framework on how to arrange newer tantric texts, such as the Vajrasekhara system. So this particular Sutra has already completely conditioned any person's perception of the tantras.



    MMK doesn't really help explain King Harsha, although yes, you can figure that part out and it is reasonably close enough. In this case, we are kind of using him as the dawn of time, as that seems to be what happened, beginning a point where a lot more can be added objectively to meager hints. Sharmavarman's seal does not have dates attached to the reigns as this kind of unit. Harsha starts a calendar beginning with a Debt Jubilee. That is the most meaningful definition of an "Age" so far.


    His original Vardhana kingdom was at Sthanisvara near Kurukshetra, and Harsha expanded and moved the capital to Kannauj (Kanyakubja):







    In his writings, one finds the eclectic sense in Nagananda:


    The unique characteristic of this drama is the invocation to Buddha in the Nandi verse, which is considered one of the best examples of the dramatic compositions.



    And a depth of inter-textuality in Ratnavali:


    ...also the title of a 3rd-century (?) Buddhist philosophical work by Nagarjuna, a discourse addressed to an Indian king (possibly a Satavahana monarch).

    ...the story of their courtship and wedding is the subject of an earlier work, Svapnavasavadattam, written by Bhāsa.

    Many distinguished poets of ancient India, who flourished before Harsha, have referred to the love of Udayana and Vasavadatta, and the devotion of Yougandharayana for his master Udayana. This shows how popular the story of Udayana was even in Ancient India.



    In other words, it is a semi-fictional literary scene going since around 100 B. C. E.. Frequently in India, a "fictional" story is usually based on either a true story or at least an accepted myth. They tend to feed off each other instead of each author making their own brand new ethos. Here I would suggest the title used verifies an authentic piece by the real original Nagarjuna, compared to the possibility Harsha may have even known than the name had already been used by ghost writers. This is somewhat problematic to the understanding of Buddhist history. In actuality, Nagarjuna interacting with the Satavahanas was a heavy conditioning factor to multiple Indian states for quite some time.

    And so like this story, there are a few other creative ideas, which were applied to the basic report on King Udayana, which again relies on a Buddhist source:


    The commentary on the Dhammapada describes the story of his marriage with Vāsavadattā or Vāsuladattā, the daughter of Pradyota, the king of Avanti. It also mentions about his two other consorts, Māgandiyā, daughter of a Kuru Brahmin and Sāmāvatī, the adopted daughter of the treasurer Ghosaka.



    Similarly around the time of Harsha:


    The Mahabharata and the Harivansa states the close connection between the Vatsas and the Bhargas.

    And this makes a lot of sense taking into view Thanesar, the Pasupata Order, and Skanda Purana and Harsha's court poet Bana. Bhargas or Bhargavas generally refer to descendants of Bhrgu as in the following:



    The Skandapurana (SPS 167.123–29) informs us that the fourth pupil of
    Lagudi was a brahmacarin who came from a distinguished family in the (Land
    of the) Kurus.


    The major city in the ‘Land of the Kurus’ in the 5th and 6th centuries was
    Thanesar. In his Harsacarita, Bana depicts Thanesar (Sthanvısvara) under (the
    legendary) King Pusyabhuti as a country completely devoted to Mahe´svara.
    It is therefore not impossible, at least it is suggested by the Skandapurana, that
    the Pasupata movement had reached Kanauj from Gujarat via Kuruksetra and
    had thus passed through Thanesar.

    If the above dating is correct, the text was composed under the
    rule of either the Maukharis or Harsavardhana of Kanauj (see below, pp. 601 ff.).

    The historic relations between the Pasupatas of Varanası and those in Kanauj
    and Thanesar at the time of its composition also seem to emerge from the Skandapurana itself.

    This mythology relates that the ´Saiva sage Dadhıca (son of Cyavana, grandson
    of Bhrgu), whose asrama is on the Sarasvatı River, defeats his Vaisnava
    rival Ksupa with ´Siva’s help. To commemorate this victory the site (sthana)
    named ‘Sthane´svara’ is established.

    Bana ingeniously adapted this mythological complex by linking
    his own descent to Dadhıca, when he made the latter’s son (by his divine wife
    Sarasvatı), viz. Sarasvata, the foster brother of another scion of the Bhargava
    lineage, namely Vatsa; Vatsa again is the ancestor of the Vatsyayanas to whom
    the author of the Harsacarita belongs on his own account (see Figure 13). When
    he embroidered on the story of Dadhıca’s mother Sukanya, told in Mahabharata
    3.121–25, Bana and his audience may have been aware of the mythology that
    attributed the foundation of Harsa’s native city Thanesar to Dadhıca as told in
    the Skandapurana.


    Since the earliest transmission to Nepal relates to an ancestor of
    our ms S1, this transmission must, according to Yokochi’s theory, have taken
    place before ad 700.


    Daughter of the King of Maghada:


    Vatsadevı, married the
    Licchavi king of Nepal, ´Sivadeva II, father of Jayadeva. This Jayadeva and
    his Indian mother recorded this fact in their Pasupati Temple Inscription,
    [Amsuvarman] Samvat 157 (ad 732).

    If our conjecture
    above is right and the composition of the SP was begun under the Maukharis
    of Kanauj, it is conceivable that the princess, or someone in her entourage,
    took this text to Nepal as part of the Maukhari heirloom.



    It sounds exceedingly likely to me. This, or some similar mode. The Skanda Purana is an accreted text which strongly looks to have origins around 550 and updates at least through the tenth century. It is certainly important to Varanasi. And strongly rooted in Nepal since probably the time of Vatsadevi. That makes it look like Skanda and MMK were developed quite similarly. We just identified the names to be the identical person. It is unlikely that Hindus would agree with this, but, yes, he is Mars and critically influential to the Dharma.

    He is of undetectable antiquity also known in the south as Murugan:


    The basis for the argument is a Harappan seal featuring six female figures and one male figure, who are thought to be the six Krittikās / Matrikās accompanied by Skanda. While this is not a popular theory, it goes on to assert that Skanda is indeed seen as one of the most ancient Indian gods.


    And no one mentioned the veneration of Mars at Ujjain, where he is part of a temple that also has a Koti Tirtha.


    As an aspect of Shiva, the power at this temple is also Swayambhu, and, is the epicenter of Zodiacal Time:


    ...the 12 rays of the Sun first fell on the earth, and from them, 12 Jyotirlingas were established on the earth. Mahakaleshwar Jyotirling of Ujjain is also a Jyotirlinga that originated from the same Sun Rashmi.

    ...the standards of the whole world have been set in Ujjain since ancient times.

    The face of Mahakaleshwar situated here is also towards the south direction, that is why people doing the action of tantra mantra especially come to this temple for darshan.


    Ujjain is of course along the arc just described as the transmission of Pasupati.


    Similarly to Swayambhu Stupa, the Pasupati is not just one of the oldest shrines in Nepal, but in Hinduism. Amsuvarman was a donator to it and calls himself "favored by". Around page nine from Levi, we find the title:

    bappa pade parigrhita


    appearing to use Pasupati as the "father" he cannot claim for his royal position, while the god watches over him.



    This is repeated by Gellner on Lalitpur--Patan:


    There is a reference to Managupta Gomin, his
    great grandfather.^^^ Jisnugupta describes himself as belonging to
    Chandravamsa {Somanvaya khusana) and has added almost all the
    epithets of Amsuvarman, like bhagvat pasupati bhattaraka padanugra-
    hita, etc. This expression showed that like other rulers of Nepal he
    also tendered unqualified devotion to Lord Pasupati. But he has
    acknowledged the overlordship of the Prince occupying the throne in
    Managriha...


    According to Taranath (Pp. 151, 193) Kamala Gomin and Kamarandu
    Gomin, two upasakas, lived in Nalanda in contemplation of Mahayana, Gomin
    translated in Tibetan by the word btsun-pa signifies respectable, noble, venerable
    in the observance of religious duties.

    Patan Charter. — This is incised in a stone slab in the temple
    of Chhinnamastika in Patan (B.G.L. Ins. No. IX).




    For the first time the reference to Buddhism as such is available
    from an inscription of Amsuvarman dated Samvat 32 (Levi, XIX) which
    records donation of some money to certain monasteries (Vihara).

    There is no direct evidence of the time when Buddhism was intro-^
    duced into Nepal.


    No, as in there is no clearly written date establishing anything verifiable about some kind of Buddhist activity, then, like a switch, you go from zero to the level of the national god of the majority of the population. There is circumstantial evidence before this. But at the same time, in the new era, there is a huge upwelling of magic. The donation is remarkable.

    As seems appropriate to intellectual history, there was a review and overhaul of Levi from India 1960:


    The account of the Vamsavali (chronology) purports that
    Vikramaditya conquered Nepal just before Amsuvarman founded the
    Thakuri dynasty, which must be an indirect allusion to Harsa’s con-
    quest of Nepal.


    Harsa's conquest never extended beyond the present boundary of the Gorakh-
    pur district.

    Amsuvarman does not mention Harsa
    who in his turn did not use the title of Vikramaditya.


    It was not determined whether he may have been a Maukhari or Vardhana, just that he had that type of origin and had probably functioned as a Samanta in eastern Nepal and somehow managed to steadily gain influence. As we have seen, eventually this is significant to Tibet:


    ...the Princess from Nepal took with her a contingent of Buddhist prea-
    chers and artists who helped to build a new culture for that country.
    The name of Silamanjusri occurs in the list of Nepalese teachers who
    went to Tibet in that connection.



    The author is a great historian who may not understand Buddhist intricacies in detail:

    Gumvihara 7,
    2 (Mani Chuda Chaitya)

    This inscription indicates that up till his time
    the tantric Mahayana and Vajrayan deities had not made appearance
    in Nepal.



    Gum Vihar is at Sankhu and may have been a Kirati Mangkhim:


    It can be inferred that when the 6th Lichavvi King Manadeva ascended the throne, Gum Baha was already an established religious site.

    The fact that the same of amount of grant was given to Gum Vihara as that of the most prominent temple in all of Nepal proves that Gum Vihara must have been a highly revered site during this period.

    Spiritually powerful places of Kirati origin in the Nepal valley are placed in locations that command geomantic perfection. Ancient Kiratis understood the focal points of natural energy and chose spots and topography such as hill tops, phallic peaks, crags, confluence of rivers and natural amphitheaters. One perfect example is the ancient site of Galdang-guldung Thang.kuh ( Pubung, Darjeeling), an assortment of caves that sit on a natural amphitheatre. Unlike present day Mangkhims that are built without any consideration for focal points or cardinal directions, ancient power places built by the Kiratas fulfill that criteria. Gum Bahal’s location too, points to this same practice as it sits atop a hill that acts like a center of a circle open on all sides and fairly above levelled ground...


    Srestha's Sankhu 2002 is a current project on assembling the history and calendar, traditions, and continuity of this very thing. It is remarkably fusionistic like Hingula Mata.






    On this tangent we get the main point about thread and weaving. It had a certain meaning in west India, and watch how it unfolds with the spread of culture across boundaries into Sankhu:



    The present temple was built by Raja Prakas Malla in 1655. It enshrines the main sacred representations of this site, Ugra-tara manifesting as Ekazati, which are said to give very powerful blessings, particularly the image in the upper temple. The image in the lower temple is red in colour with one face and four arms, two of which hold a skull-cup (kapala) and knife at her heart, and the remaining two hold a sword and an utpala lotus [Guhya Jnana Dakini]. In the upper temple is an identical image of Ugra-tara in bell metal, in which her left leg is outstretched. In the upper temple is the loom of the Nepali Princess Brhikuti, spouse of the Tibetan king Songtsen Gampo. In both the upper and lower temples, Vajrayogini is flanked Baghini and Singhini, the Tiger and Lion-headed Yoginis.

    The primordial Indian Buddhists in Orissa are weavers, and, Assamese tantrists "joined" weaver caste. Assam is also the Eastern Gate towards:


    Suchuwang or that part of China near Kham was an empire since ca. 200 that a Queen expanded possibly as far west as Pamir. And it subjugated the Horpas, the Turkish Kirat descendants of Japeth, propagating the Chinese cult of Yuma Sam (Udhauli) onto them. We will mention her in a moment but the mythology as conveyed by the Limbu says:


    Yumasam is a teaching spirit that likes flowers instead of blood, and appears to be the same as what Kirat Mundhum is talking about. Yashokyeni Maharani. She incarnated as the Queen of Shun-yin empire or Suchuwang.

    Yuma is still currently a unique Limbu tradition. The closest name to her in Tibetan is Gyuma Chenmo (Mahamaya, particularly in Dream Yoga). Yum is Tibetan for Mother. Ningwaphuma is part of the original name of the goddess. If the scripture reads identically to Genesis, it would have to be changed so that in the beginning, when all was void, the goddess started it. Another goddess spins a web, then there is creation of water, and creation of earth last.

    Mailuma is grain (Lakshmi) and Khuluma is cotton (Sarasvati), although the fourteen deity list is calling her Bonirok, and Khuluma is usually Pradumnya or Kamadeva. The Fourteen Deity temple could actually be called a capital of human sacrifice.

    The cotton is white, and she teaches weaving; the name tantra has warp and woof as its roots, and the weaver caste is the Buddhist tribal minority in northern Orissa. The Limbu women are expert in making carpet, and knitting colourful local cloth (dhaka) with intricate design for clothing. They are also expert in bamboo work.


    As far as I know, that is correct, the Limbu and Assamese and even some Bengalis slew people as actual human sacrifices. One doubts this has ever totally stopped. Retrospectively, it appears that through the course of around the sixth to eighth centuries, some of these cults were "talked out of it" and the sites and temples re-baptized, so to speak, in less violent ways.


    Because there are "old" or perhaps "raw" shaktis who are inseparable from blood rituals without further information, it follows that proselytism is talking its own new language. In Assam, we may notice that the Kamakhya goddess is in a "newer" aspect which includes Zodiacal Astrology; her Pitha:


    ...is the center of the Mahavidya temple complex, and Ugra Tara is the navel pitha.



    And this is very nearly the Hindu equivalent of Buddhist Mahakala, the subjugation of Mahesvara or Kamadeva, which is probably the second most important tantric origin myth after Ocean of Milk:


    The first temple on the site of Yonipīțha was built by the divine architect Viśvakarmā. When Kāmadeva was reduced to ashes by the flame of Lord Śiva’s third eye, his wife Ratī came here and propitiated Devī Siddha Kubjikā for resurrection of her husband. When brought back to life, Kāma duly worshiped Pīțhaśakti of Yonipīțha, who then became renowned by the name “Kāmākhyā” while the region came to be known as “Kāmarūpa” country. The current temple was constructed by King Viśva Sińģha of Koch Behar (West Bengal).

    The most renowned festival celebrated in Kamakhya Temple is Ambuvācī, when a big fair is also organised and many Avadhūtas, Sādhus, Aghorīs and Sanyāsīs (who otherwise lead reclusive life) also come out in public. Astrologically in the month of Āşāďa (June-July) when Sūrya (Sun) enters Mithun Rāşī (Gemini) under 1/4th part or first quarter of Ārdrā Nakşatra, at that time Devī Vasundharā (Earth) undergoes menstrual cycle which is known as “Ambuvācī”."

    "Tara of Kamakhya, as pictured on the interior of the Bhairavi temple, is dark blue or black and pot-bellied, holding kartarī (a pair of scissors), khaḍga (a sword), muṇḍa (a severed head) or kapālā (a cup or bowl made from a skull cap), and a lotus blossom. When worshipped as Tārā, her face is beautiful and benevolent. When worshipped as Ekajaṭā (related closely to the Tantric Buddhist schools), her face becomes grotesque and terrifying. Each reveals different but related truths about the nature of practice and liberation."

    Here, her scissors are mixed up with the term kartri, or chopper. Scissors interpretation is thought to show influence from Rajasthan or Punjab. But as we see, the Kamakhya Tara is almost the same thing as Sankhu.

    The area was inhabited by matriarchal Khasis when the Aryans encountered them about 2,000 years ago. And so a Shiva culture was imposed where the original goddess still did not even waver. The Khasis are the main inhabitants of Meghalaya; in "geological time" Holocene is the period since the ice age when "australic" languages spread over southeast Asia; and Meghalayan is the name they give to the "recent" epoch from around 2,250 B. C. when a two hundred year drought is said to have hit most other civilizations.



    Nga meaning "I" is the same in Tibetan, Burmese, and Old Chinese as it is in Khasi. Meghalaya was a part of Burma much before India claimed it as a part of it after its independence from British rule. Traces of connections with the Kachin tribe of North Burma have been also been in the Khasis. The Khasi people also have their own word for the Himalayan mountains which is "Ki Lum Mankashang" which means that at one point in time, they did cross the mighty mountains.


    Uba Hang (ca. 849-865) introduced a new faith to the Limbu. He is said to be descended from Muna Khamna or Suchuwang, also called Shin Yuk. Suyen-no-su-nu-Hangma was the queen who originally strengthened it. The bizarre geographical names are likely intended as Sichuan and Shu: In subsequent periods of Chinese history the Sichuan area continued to be referred to as Shu after this ancient state, and later states founded in the same region were also called Shu. Although its ancient culture is somewhat known, there is a silent period around 200 when there might have been such a queen. It is home of an ancient Sanxingdui civilization which challenges "China is Yellow River" origin theory.


    Drawing from the Limbu to Newari to English glossary, it gives Ningwa/Ningwaphu (name of supreme goddess – source of wisdom, knowledge and power) as Chaitanya which has no English meaning but is something like animating consciousness or energetic drive of life itself. Thindolung Swyambhu Self-created god. Tomang Buddha Bhagwan Lord Buddha. Mang Ishwor, Bhagwan God.

    In that language, Mang is close to deva and ishvar. They do not seem to have a cotton goddess, but Khijora Menjora Mang = goddess of loom.



    That is all related if we are interested in the spread of peace, honor of femininity, arts and crafts, literacy, improved dietary habits, and so on, the "culture" which one hopes would become established in the "civilization" of fixed houses. Something quite close to this defines the Age of Amsuvarman. One can see a non-Buddhist, even non-Indic, type of pacifism coming from the east, while Buddhism must have slipped into Bengal and Assam in some unaccountable way with a similar ideal.



    We found, for example, that Kiev arose due to the local Boyars never agreeing and no effective system of law to regulate transmission of property. Due to the state of near constant feuding, they accepted, so to speak, external guidance of the Rus. This is almost the exact same situation as Nepal. It being unclear as to exactly what military and political means installed Amusuvarma, we have seen terms like chaos and revolution and so forth as vague ideas, there apparently being an internal problem, rather than a completely hostile takeover.

    Almost all timekeeping had been in "regnal years", i. e. just referring to some king's name, with it changing every time and it being frequently unreliable on how to arrange them. Here we have the deliberate starting of an "Era", and it is being done by someone who is publicly recorded as banning the slaughter of animals for foodstuffs, and personally wrote that he meditated on the subject of happiness of the population.

    To return to the author who has heavily reviewed Xuan Zang and the mass of available source documents:



    Amsuvarman was not an
    exception to the traditional and almost universal application of outside
    nationality to the rulers in Nepal, who without a single exception, have
    shown a unity of origin in this respect.


    The possibility of
    his being another type of head for the state of Nepal, probably in the
    nature of a President of a republic, seems to be nearer to fact, while at
    the same time his power was unchallenged and unequalled with any
    autocratic king and there was no lessening of status by an inch even,
    as his assumption of the authority and royalty by which he could issue
    command to other Feudatories and injunctions to future kings {Svayam
    ajna) would convey.



    The common people nurtured a hidden grievance against the Gupta
    usurpers and there was a longing in their heart of hearts to welcome
    the old Lichhavi dynasty whose position in the realm was regarded as
    the only legal royalty by the populace. This rendered the Lichhavi
    restoration a matter of public concern and Amsuvarman at the head
    of the army had only responded to this long felt want of the people
    in waging a war with the Guptas to drive them out.

    The course of battles waged by him is unknown, as we have no
    account, local or foreign, of this particular subject.


    Amsuvarman had a concourse of scholars
    around him including that great grammarian Chandra Varman who
    had made a name in the Nalanda University as a talented scholar. In
    conjunction with him Amsuvarman helped a great deal to give effect
    to the use of correct Sanskrit language in all written works which so
    long were subject to the odd type of defective language current in the
    locality. In his time the language used in inscriptions appeared puri-
    fied and recorded a seemingly improved style over the one contributed
    previously. His literary pursuit was carried with the best of feeling
    and courage and though himself a public figure Amsu never allowed
    the least lack of zeal or interest on account of diversion to affect his
    activity in that sphere. No wonder that under such a man Nepal banish-
    ed the evils of illiteracy from its border.


    Amsuvarman was always guided in his action with the highest
    patriotic motives. He was a man of character and integrity par ex-
    cellence. He was unique of all the dictators kings or regents of the age,
    who behaved strictly as a true servant of the people having always before
    him the only one desire and that was how to serve the best interest
    of the people. One inscription of his time speaks of him as one
    who was ever prepared to solve any problem of public welfare.


    Xuan Zang has singled the Regent of Nepal not only out of the
    coteries of his hill contemporaries or out of the long list of names
    belonging to the plains to whose individuality a reference could have
    been made, but out of the whole series of trans-Himalaya Kings, a
    fact which testifies to the high place the potentate enjoyed amongst
    the fellow royals of those days. It was not merely military achievements
    as we know, that endowed Amsuvarman with such high reputation.
    Foremost of all, he was an administrator of great talents and of high
    moral strength and of broad mentality and magnanimous spirit, built
    up to perfection of all the high ideals of public service and shorn of
    the blemishes of narrow religious zeal and bigotry. To him no
    orthodoxy appealed and to him no vain glory or pride could approach,
    and him no self interest could touch, says a chronicler.


    Here the Bull is perhaps mis-named, as Nandi is a late idea:


    ...he was devoted to Shiva and this is further confirmed by the image
    of a bull (Nandi) in some of his inscriptions...

    How he revered the Buddhist religion is
    expressed by his adoption of the symbols of the wheel of law between
    two deer (Bungmati Inscription) in his inscriptions, which is cer-
    tainly expressive of his intention to protect all religions from unlawful
    encroachments and harassment by the one enjoying undue royal muni-
    ficence. It was really a big achievement to have successfully improved
    on the much deteriorated condition of the last reign, which seems to
    have been characterised by communal quarrels and disturbances.


    Amsuvarman with his
    keen insight of human behaviour and laudable conception of public
    duty reoriented the policy pursued by the Lichhavi Kings, himself
    helped to restore the Lichhavi throne and willingly and sincerely put
    his own faith in the order of the Buddha as a measure of harmonious
    understanding between the rulers and the ruled, between different sects
    and communities. Under him the sanctity of Buddhist images and
    monasteries was well preserved and honourably maintained.

    The repercussion of this non-committal and tolerant policy was
    far reaching. An atmosphere of good-will and trust amongst the
    different sections of the people and of veneration to all types of reli-
    gious beliefs irrespective of caste and creed enveloped the land of
    the Nepalese to an extent that the whole envelopement is still casting
    its impact on the social life of the people in this country, the same
    feature of society which was so markedly noted by the Chinese pilgrim
    when he spoke of the Hindu temples touching the Buddhist convents,
    the same structure of harmony and complete fraternal adjustment
    which are indelibly passed on to the present generation unallected by
    any sort of political bickerings and incitement to communal animosity.
    The message of toleration, the gift of Amsuvarman’s reign, rings sweet
    in the ears of every Nepalese even today and blends him with all his
    fellowmen in the perfect bond of brotherhood and amity the world
    has ever seen. Amsuvarman has certainly raised his fame to the zenith
    as a man of the people to have dissociated himself and his politics
    from religious prejudices and to have looked upon all with no partiality
    or reserved feeling in which policy Asoka alone can be his equal.



    That's a lot of testimony. The Licchavi Dynasty was "interrupted", not exactly by Amsuvarman, but by the Abhira Guptas both before and after him. The odd system of "two rulers" was not understood, which caused early scholars to think of them as two separate dynasties, which would separate and extend their history unrealistically too far back. A lot of this was happening at the same time. Amsuvarman seems to have eventually purged them. It was the deaths of Harsha and Amsuvarman which resulted in Tibetan forces entering Nepal and part of India.


    At the same time, if you read through Nepal theologically, it has its own Pitha site at Swayambhu, and, relatively near there, is Sankhu, which is characterized by figuratively importing the rest of the Pitha system. It is mainly Vajrayogini (Bengal), who is understood as being capable of appearing in various forms, such as Guhyajnana Dakini (Bihar) and Ugra Tara (Assam). These in turn are significant because of the first Pitha, Hingula in Baluchistan, who clearly has the origin of the spread of Fire and Thread in a certain way.


    This shows a quite early recording of equal tribute paid to Gum Vihara as to Pasupati, the national deity.

    I found this re-capitulated in one of the worst videos ever, like five minutes of mumbling. I wouldn't bother posting it. But it was a male Limbu trance oracle being asked a few questions. He positively replied that ancient figures revered by the Limbu were the same as the great being, Manjushri, who founded Kathmandu. This great being is the same as known as Manu to the Hindus, and, in his limited knowledge, was the Adam or similar figure of all religions. In other words, a non-Buddhist says that the obviously Buddhist legend is the real thing. He's not adding information or details saying that the Limbu version either did anything or has additional practices or scriptures. The only place we would get more details therefor is Manjushri.

    Manjushri is not personally Indo-Greek, he is Mahacina or Kiratic, but his memory and effect to China does not begin until much later with the transmission of Buddhism. He had in essence left it behind. There is not a valid way to say he had inhabited Wu Tai Shan the whole time, not as a matter of knowledge. He does not seem to be personally remembered by the Kirats who did not move as far as India or Nepal.


    Finally for a round of blink-and-you-missed-it with Asia. Firstly, even though we have packed in a lot of legend and hearsay and can only partially mix something objective with the ideas, this is also the origin of all formal scriptural tantra. It is, of course, heavily emphasized in Nepal, where we find the mistake "Karma" for what ought to read "Krama" in a book of the Ten Rites:


    The practices of dasakarma were initially performed by King Pracanda Deva of Gaud (India), who is said to have come to Nepal on a pilgrimage to pay homage to Svayambhu. This king, being highly inspired by the supreme serenity and spiritual tranquility of the Svayambhu jyoti rupa- the rays radiating from Svayambhu-made up his mind to renounce his kingship and sought ordination of cudakarmabhiseka (first initiation of entry into the life of homelessness), subsequently followed by acaryabhiseka (initiation into priestly life) bestowed on him by Manjusri.

    The whole Tantra, that is, all of the Tantric stanzas together, are known as Subahu pariprccha Tantra, which are the instructive guidelines of the Kriya Samgraha of Dasakarma Vidhi.



    The Tantra uses the same character from an identically-titled Sutra which is otherwise very simple:


    Subāhu then poses a question that compels Śākyamuni to offer detailed teachings on the six perfections.


    We are fortunate to have the Tantra translated to English by 84000, but, those guys are good at one thing, translating the catalog. They are able to tell us that it was first translated to Chinese in 726, and then again in the 900s. The translation was made from four Tibetan manuscripts which contain a sole reference to Buddhaguhya. All they really have to say is:


    ...it is reasonable to conclude that the Subāhu­paripṛcchā Tantra was circulating widely in India by at least the beginning of the eighth century, and likely much earlier. There is at present no known Sanskrit witness for the text.


    No, because in Nepal the material is packaged differently. At least the translators realize that it lands in the same subject as with Sabari Mantras:



    Vetala and Possession



    mostly as instructed by Vajrapani. So you do get the beginning of Cemetery Yoga in a concretely-written form. And then the reality is that this process is placed right before the esoteric training of Inner Yoga as for example as given by Panchen Sonam Drakpa, which is effectively the Buddhist equivalent of the Hindu Mahavidya system based in mantras:


    This vehicle contains various tantras dealing with the tenets and basic
    practices of [those realized beings known as] Vidyadhara eKnowledge
    Holders') and therefore [the canon of this vehicle] is known as the
    vidyadharapitaka ('basket of teachings of the Knowledge Holders').
    If we now ask, "To which of the three baskets do~ this basket belong?",
    the answer is found in the Sutra Requested by Subahu. {'Listen and I will
    explain," it says. "Secret mantra is taught in the manner of the basket of
    sutras." Also, Santipa [Ratnakarasanti] has said, "It is the basket of sutras
    which shows the condensed profound meaning."

    The final text, the Subsequent Concentration Tantra (Kriyatantradhyanottara), teaches general aspects of the path of Action tantra such as the
    meditative stabilizations of the four branches of mantra repetition, the meditative stabilization of abiding in fire, the meditative stabilization of abiding
    in sound, and the meditative stabilization of the liberation beyond sound,
    as well as the procedural methods before and after these meditative
    stabilizations. This text also teaches rituals for achieving magical attainments (siddhi), the fire offering ritual (homa), and describes the methods of
    investigating the sites suitable for meditation.



    That is important because it is the "how-to" Buddhist Yoga.

    We don't have our own independent cosmos, or some flagrantly unusual morality unavailable in religions, what it is, is this method of Yoga that is different or unavailable through other practices. With the first part only based around Subahu, you could argue, well, this is just a grotesque Hindu ritual with different names. I guess that is something like an entry barrier. One can simply memorize all the routines that are in the Ten Rites, and you are a Priest. This status has little to do with one's capability for Yoga. It is like with the blood rituals, becomes symbolic, you don't have to have pieces of corpses--and considering the lay practitioner has no interest in becoming a Priest--then the Rites are mostly a teaching vehicle to get in to the Yoga itself.


    Because Subahu is a Tantra, it is a scripture. Vajrapani authoritatively says or does something which we as students of magic are baffled and amazed. Its companion, however, is a type of commentary:


    Buddhaguhya in his Dhyanottara-patala-tika (PTT, Vol. 78, p. 75-4)



    It is mostly a set of instructions. In fact it is synonymous to the instructions for the famous:


    Adamantine Pinnacle



    also called Vajra Sekhara, Diamond Peak, and similar names, practiced in China and the Shingon of Japan. Something gigantic that occupies a lifetime. Firstly noting that these encyclopedic transmissions were not made until Amoghavajra ca. 746, the commentary is remembered as:




    The names of the *Ch'an and *Zen schools are both derived from the word dhyana. dhyana-paramita (Skt.). The Perfection of Meditation, the fifth of the Six Perfections (*sad-paramita) that make up a central element of the *Mahayana path. dhyani-Buddhas (Skt). 'Meditation Buddhas', in the sense of *Buddhas seen in meditation or used as a subject of meditation practice. It is a generally obsolete term invented and formerly used by Western scholars to denote the Five *Jinas or *tathagatas.

    Dhyanottara-patala. A key *kriya-tantra work only surviving in Tibetan translation, purportedly a chapter (patala) from the lost Vajrosnisa Tantra, it comprises 74 verses on the basics of tantric *mantra recitation and meditation. A detailed commentary also exists by the early Indian tantric scholar Buddhaguhya.



    Vajrosnisa, its concise form (laghu-tantra) Dhyanottara (Toh. 808)

    On the link above, Subahu is 805, so you can tell they are kept close together.


    Gray uses Vajrosnisa and Vajrasekhara as equivalents.


    So he is referring to a scripture, Vajra Usnisa, which would have the same intent as the synonyms just given.

    Note that it is one work, and, the "system" in its full form is eighteen large volumes.

    This has two aspects. It is scalar like a fractal. So it is again eighteen mandalas. Then it is one mandala with eighteen objects.

    Secondly as a scripture basket, it can only partially or loosely be defined.

    What this means is the Orient mainly has one massive, "cut-and-dried" version of something which was, in a sense, only a facet of Indian culture. It is related to something that was probably a hundred years prior with Pracanda Deva. The Chinese source came from Ceylon. Buddhaguhya was in north India. This shows a rapid, thorough advancement in places that were being granted major institutions, at which point there is a solid five hundred years of the flourishing of Buddhist material in ritual manuals and so forth.

    Nepal appropriates a considerable amount of this, which has, fortunately, never been ethnically cleansed, or changed from the original. Due to a somewhat folk-lorishness, a lot of Priests still have common misunderstandings and a few distorted facts. It can nevertheless claim a few thousand ardent devotees of inquisitive and enthusiastic natures. It is entirely possible to say they had an initiatic yoga system based in the Ten Rites in the 600s.



    As a male deity, there is a generic placehholder Vajrosnisa, and then what appears to me to be the corresponding meditation is on Fire in the inner sense and this is Avalokiteshvara. Those two have a common root because applicable to the formula of eighteen is
    Ragaraja Vajrasattva.



    While this is true, it is public, formulaic, and a bit standardized. We imagine there is some benefit in a litany recited by a Priest, but, this person is not necessarily of high spiritual power. So it is a bit like a church. It's not really Yoga. To pursue this in a personal level is esoteric, which means a form of Sophia, as it were. From this view, we are saying that the Shurangama Sutra is not complete in the early Matangi Sutra, and that it appears in China in a full form in the appropriate time frame. This again is like an industry standard. Reflective of India, this deity in Nepal has a few much smaller pieces, as well as the Sutra. But the Chinese version is only around seventy per cent of the Nepali. One could say in Nepal that Parasol is extensive. She was extraordinary with Candragomin in the 600s, and he was the bastion of Yogacara or Buddhist Yoga.

    She is not really identical to the Long Life goddess Usnisa Vijaya.

    According to their titles, it is Buddhosnisa Vijaya and Sitatapatra Vajrosnisa.


    Compared to the Chinese version--which looks authentic, just basic--Parasol from India is again a cross-cultural hypostasis when pressed for detail such as in her Long Dharani:

    bhagavan stathagatosnisa sitatapatra maha vajrosnisa ,
    maha pratyangire maha sahasra bhuje sahasra-sirse ,


    It also says that Ghora Aparajita is Pandara and Bhrkuti.

    Lady Parasol is a 1,000 Arm and Head Vajrosnisa capable of destroying the strongest evil magic, which is why it is held to be essential for at least this Sutra to remain in the world.

    The first reason this is elaborate is because Pratyangira is already an intense Hindu goddess of the rare fused type, i. e., not a sakti or emanation of a god, but, the combined will of the Trinity during a crisis. Here it is like asking protection of this goddess from Buddha himself. And so it is not quite like a religion of idol or personal worship of Buddha, but, asking him as the superior magister, so to speak, of finding Sophia for ourselves. These two goddesses particularly for Long Life and Samadhi automatically respond as long as you do it right.



    Vajrosnisa is its own tantra which is about contemplation of the Six Gods of Kriya. Vajrosnisa says that Yoga Tantra is for those who find enjoyment in Samadhi as expressed in Kriya-Charya Tantra (such as Vairocana Abhisambodhi).

    This is still found in The Indestructible Way of Secret Mantra by Jamgon Kongtrul, or, in Yoga Nidra, either of which is the Kriya--Charya outline of Yoga and Divinity.

    So that is virtually the "subject" of Vajrosnisa. Divinity.


    In that sense, the Subahu is "partially" true or "transitional".

    The main key to the next five centuries of tantric material is this, which is a commentary, which means that it is a commentarial tradition that outranks the scriptures in terms of value.

    Vajrosnisa is like a technique or method, which can be applied to Vairocana Abhisambodhi as a demo or testing ground, and then there are a lot of scriptures. Within Parasol, one finds Bhrkuti, which is not a deified princess, but, rather, the princess from Nepal is considered an incarnation of Bhrkuti by the Tibetans.

    Goddess Bhrkuti is a type of initiatrix.


    She can be seen at a Sutra level in several images depicting what could be called the Divine Marriage of Sudhana Kumara. This is known across Asia, such as in Thailand and other places.


    She is also in the first Tantra in the Inner House of Vairocana Abhisambodhi. This Tantra is a contributing reason to why the 680s looked magical, and so it was possibly composed slightly before then. She is iconicly precise, also is in an Amoghapasha formation, and we are told she is named for Avalokitesvara's angry expression when that happened. She has Two Arms and Three Eyes. I am not sure that feature is usually given on most basic forms. She is an Akanistha being, white, haloed with white, yellow, and red rays.


    The Tibetan interpretation of her "frowning or scowling" is only one of the possible meanings for "the brow or eyebrows", such as, viz., the look of concentration. Or, even trembling from yogic pressure. In most cases there is nothing visible about it.



    I always wondered about this and here is the solution:


    Monier-Williams (1899)

    Vajrabhṛkuṭi (वज्रभृकुटि):—[=vajra-bhṛkuṭi] [from vajra > vaj] f. (with Buddhists) one of the 6 goddesses of magic, [Dharmasaṃgraha 13.]


    because the corresponding spot in the online Dharma Samgraha has this lacuna:

    {1} Vajrā-


    compared to a 1961 publication:

    I have not bothered to add variants from Vaidya’s edition as they represent changes made only on the authority of the editor...


    But he was copying someone's notes posthumously from around 1883. The hyphen is already there as if incomplete.



    That one is tough, because the adjective, "bhrkuti", also gets applied to male Bodhisattvas during wrathful practice, producing a different "Vajrabhrkuti". Attempting to overlook this, we can still easily find the goddess in the colossal English and Sanskrit Manjushri Mulakalpa. When it comes to its esoteric content, the MMK itself clearly states:


    “This Dharma treasury of the tathāgatas is extremely occult, as it depends in every respect on mantras. It must not be taught to those who have not received the samaya from the master, or those who do not understand the samaya. Why is this? This is because it is secret. It is an occult teaching; it is a teaching [arising from] omniscience. No beings should ever reject or take it lightly” (54.­5 ).


    It surprisingly has not a single commentary.

    Due to design, the Sanskrit is in one drop-down cell, but all the English is individual chapters.



    He [Sakyamuni] dwelt with these and with other vidyārājas, headed by Abjoṣṇīṣa, who had attained the samādhis arising from the infinite accomplishment, the Cloud of Dharma, and who were surrounded by many hundreds of thousands of millions of vidyās and many vidyārājñīs created through the form-samādhi of the lord of the world. These vidyārājñīs were...

    Tara, Bhrkuti, etc.

    These and other vidyārājñīs, headed by Parṇaśavarī, Jāṅgulī, and Mānasī, whose accomplishment is limitless, who have the nature of the space of the sphere of phenomena, and whose mental states arise due to the presence of the bodhisattva conduct and marvels‍—the dūtas and dūtīs, ceṭas and ceṭīs, kiṃkaras and kiṃkarīs, yakṣas and yakṣiṇīs, rākṣasas and rākṣasīs, and piśācas and piśācīs who have taken the samaya vows of the Lotus family and perform the mantra practice‍—also dwelt in the gods’ realm of the Pure Abode inhabited by pure beings. Staying there, they remained wholly preoccupied with acts of worship of Lord Śākyamuni.

    She more or less spans the whole book.

    Here is a post with excerpts of Bhrkuti in MMK.


    The Assembly has over 1,300 attendees, and most tantrism is like these split out into much smaller mandalas. As we see, it is moving towards something like the Ellora or Dharani Goddesses, and the excerpts attach "Sabari Mantras".



    The mantras that will be accomplished
    In the places where the Dharma wheel was turned,
    The pleasant grove of Mahābodhi
    Or the place where the Blessed One attained
    The peace that is free from rebirth,
    Are those of the deities Tārā and Bhṛkuṭī. {53.812}


    Elsewhere, Bhrkuti is in Guhyasamaja with Ekajati, where they are among the consorts of the Ten Wrathful Ones.


    She is also in Chapter Ten of STTS with Vajragarbha, evidently as his mantra.

    Hodgson retained her as the Lotus Family Bodhisattva, which means in Nepal, she has this default value. But she is rarely red. Janguli's mandala has an unusual Red Bhrkuti in the South with a Gourd, meaning she was not emanated in Lotus Family.


    And in Concealed Essence Hevajra:


    Then all the goddesses, Nairatmya in the forefront, along with Locana, Mamaki, Pandura, Tara, Bhrkuti, Cunda, Parnasavari, Ahomukha and the other yoginis, numerous as the atomic particles in the Mount Meru, were all overcome with great astonishment. Hearing such words, terrified they fell senseless to the ground.


    It is one of the most advanced tantras, yet it still accepts Janguli's companions or goddesses who are famous Sutra characters, which is even instructional to this. The way that is written would put Parnasabari into Lotus Family, and, if we turn to her Sutra, that is exactly what it says. But she is the Queen of the Pisaci or Sabari Mantras. She perhaps is a lot more powerful than Bhrkuti. She is also a lot more universal. Correspondingly, she may be more difficult to handle. She can claim to have a written receipt of donation from a female during the Satavahana era ca. 300s, which, I believe, is the second-oldest known written evidence or date for anything like this. The Parnasabari Sutra is so small, it would not be much trouble for someone to memorize it, which is what they were doing. Or, it would be easy to transmit just verbally, without any need of writing. There is quite a bit of headspace between the evidence and her about five hundred years later entering the tantra in a normal way. Cunda and Bhrkuti do not come from their own stories, which would be a lot more difficult.



    Intriguingly she tells another story in Figure 7 from an illuminated Bengali manuscript:


    Bhrkuti seated to the left on a chaise-like chair with her
    feet crossed on a support with a small female attendant intently looking at her.

    This Bhrkuti image is unique in iconographic articulation. She is shown displaying the
    preaching gesture in the principal hands, and holds a rosary (mala) and a trident on raised
    right and left hands respectively. Along with her third eye, a tiny stupa in front of her
    matted lock of hair is also clearly delineated.


    The image is arranged such that Bhrkuti and Tara appear to cause the metamorphosis of Marici.

    Those books are actually graphic novels that have nothing to do with the text. It was made some five hundred years after Ellora. This makes it worth comparing a few looks at her. The Pala art is very different and worth seeing through the link.


    This series of images may be unique for the timespan.


    We want to read this in the sense that academia has flawed "Mahacina" and "Ekajati" with premature conclusions. The former refers to Chinese frontiers all the way up to Mongolia, and Ekajati is not from Tibet because she is related to a south Indian Spear Holder from a much earlier time, which in turn was in communion with sites as distant as Gandahar and Hingula.



    In her case, we have a fairly unique marker, because she is in one of the few surviving specimens of its kind. This is on cotton and is from India as far back as the 800s and still has some of its bright coloration. At first we may think this is really about Ekajati. Bhrkuti is to the side in White, not with a Pitcher but doing the Gesture of Singing:







    I am not completely positive, but there is almost nothing at this age of this kind. So it is a leading example. Even so, when crafted, the Sutra was already a literary relic.

    The Sudhana story is not about her, she is just part of the pantheon. Bhrkuti resides on the slopes of Mount Potalaka. I believe it was Buddhaguhya that went there and mistook her for an "ordinary" goatherd so he doubled down on his attempts at Yoga. Others had met her. So Bhrkuti is also a personal practice or individual follower type of deity. In this case, she is normally using her Pitcher. This is enduring enough to be accurately produced through the auspices of the Panchen Lama, printed in Mongolia around 1810:





    That is a thousand years in a flash.

    In a magical sense, her seed syllable is Bhrim, which is instantly recognizable in Astrology as the syllable for Jupiter--Bhrihaspati. It hardly has any other meaning.

    That could be called command of Rta or Natural Order, or the beneficial purposes of orthodoxy.

    The color of Yellow because Jupiter qualifies as a mini-sun.

    So this is quite like a transition from exoteric to esoteric, if you want to put it that way, the issues with Jupiter being another famous Puranic event.




    The fact she is not static, again changes color and is standing in a flowing skirt, a partially-dancing sway and cute smirk:







    Depending how these look, there is a good chance they are larger in a new tab. Some things that post as minute details are plainly visible. This next one might have been almost life-sized. Here is a similar detail from the promenade wall from an astounding much larger array at Shangpa Kagyu Chapel at Shalu:








    She is a regular accomplice in most Avalokiteshvara retinues. However she rarely has any standout role. With Amoghapasha, part of her ability is to commandeer the retinue, in which case she becomes blue-green:






    Seen above her are Hayagriva and Ekajati, who are Hindu compounds, while she is not.

    Hayagriva is the normal Horse Head Rite from the most familiar story of Sage Dadhici repeated by Vishnu, and although Ekajati would appear to have to do with Sabari Mantras, she is actually a Nectar Goddess as well.

    Bhrkuti is mostly Peaceful, and Ekajati is capable of sitting down in a pleasing appearance and meditate with a Vase of Nectar quite similar to the Long Life Deities of the later Tibetan trio.

    Tantras such as Hevajra are based on a Sandhabhasya which is a Twilight Language, mostly sung in medieval Bengalese. I am not sure it has any written evidence before the late 700s, however, the similar Sanskrit Sandhabhasya does, and this is what the Hevajra commentary says:



    bhrkutim (eyebrows): To the one who shows frowning eyebrows, implying the Centre of Enjoyment, further: sikhamokso vidhiyate (instruct by the loosening of the hair): 'The loosening of the hair' refers to the instructions for liberation


    So, again, the adjective "bhrkuti" usually does mean a scowling expression, but, the proper name does not. Of course, that does not get rid of the fact that it can.




    Princess Bhrkuti carried an icon of Sandalwood Tara and also one of Akshobhya. Goddess Bhrkuti when she is in Akshobhya's Family is considerably more fierce.

    There are only a couple of matching examples for this. One of them, after giving notice of her in Manjushri Mulakalpa and Hevajra Tantra, MB Sakya's Iconography of Nepalese Buddhism:


    When she appears in blue colour, she is depicted as three headed and
    a six armed form.


    And, in one of the best early resources, Gods of Northern Buddhism by Alice Getty:


    Bhrikuti may also have three heads and six arms, but in this form she is blue.


    Which has a striking example--which is not appropriately linked by the website, but at least identified by them--a 1400s Guge influenced by Kashmiri mahasiddha Suryagupta (or Ravigupta):

    A wrathful manisfestation of the dark-blue Bhrkuti Tara, with a frown.







    Gods of Northern Buddhism is also posted by chapter on Wisdom Library. I would say it is probably the best starting point for anyone with an interest in polytheism. She has a few correctable errors but for the most part, it is fairly valid and well-presented.



    Once you see the intention, Bhrkuti's form is not hard to trace, such as in this Guge composition:





    or this detail taken from a later Gelug kept at the Ashmolean:






    It seems odd that Nepal might accept this if it were unacceptable, as if it were some kind of Kashmiri shock horror blatantly smeared on a national heroine of theirs. But she carried a bronze Akshobhya, and is enshrined in Nepal with Ugra Tara. She personally already embodies any concept of meditation on an encounter with peaceful and wrathful deities.

    She almost always has a Rosary, with the meaning of Mantra, having a pitcher which can be used for consecration or for initiatory purposes sometimes.

    The main Tara is with Marici and Ekajati, who are considerably pan-Indic and famous. Suryagupta's system includes a sample of other Taras, such as Bhrkuti and Usnisa Vijaya, with a few that appear to be of his own inspiration.

    Bhrkuti's symbolism is obvious, that she is the Slopes of Mt. Meru, not the Summit (Vajrosnisa). She is of limited scope compared to Parasol and other deities.

    Correspondingly, she is more accessible than complex tantric deities like Vajravarahi who were not said to be required for the founding of initiation in a general sense.

    Being called a Tear of Avalokiteshvara means that her basis is to Close the Door of Hell.

    It does not mean she was "created", but, "invited to our world" might express it better.


    Before these surviving painted images, Bhrkuti is actually highly distinguished at Ellora such as in the massive Cave Twelve.


    As a hint of its grandeur:


    Ellora Cave 12 is a three-storied Buddhist cave and the largest excavation in Ellora. Construction of the cave goes back to seventh century. The cave is full of different sculptures of deities, both male and female.

    Cave 12 is a massive monastery on three floors. The other monastic caves are much smaller. The architectural design of Ellora Cave 12 indicates that the cave might have operated as a Buddhist educational centre. Entrance to the cave is from a large courtyard.

    In the early eight century, rock cut activity in Ellora came to a stop.


    From Sahapedia:


    Ellora was an important centre of tantric Buddhism. We do not get any concrete evidence of the existence of Theravada or Hinayana at Ellora. Standard Mahayana caves, that is shrine-cum-monastery, seen in Caves 1, 2, 16 and 17 at Ajanta, are missing at Ellora. Ellora was developed as an important seat of tantric Buddhism. When we talk of tantric Buddhism in the western Deccan, Ellora is the most significant centre, along with other supporting centres such as Kanheri and Panhalakaji caves, both located in the coastal region of the western Deccan. The religious imagery at Ellora shows that tantric Buddhism was very much developed by this time in the western Deccan and flourished from the 7th century onwards till the early 10th century. The tantric Buddhist imagery which we get at Ellora is quite interesting as some of the icons do not match with the textual description. So it can be suggested that tantric Buddhist icons at Ellora were excavated even before standard Buddhist tantric texts were codified or were being circulated. This shows that Ellora was an important centre of tantric Buddhism. Mahasidha Sarahapada is credited with spreading tantric Buddhism from eastern India to the western Deccan, especially at Ellora.

    In tantric Buddhism, the female counterpart or Shakti plays a vital role. That is why the 12 Dharinis seen in Cave 12 are important. Some of the Dharinis have been identified as Janguli, Chunda, Tara and Bhrikuti. This suggests that by the end of 7th century female deities had occupied a significant place in Buddhist rituals and were worshipped alongside Bodhisattvas. In Ellora we have the earliest evidence how female Buddhist deities were placed and how their imagery developed. The entire process of ritualistic development can be seen at Ellora in proper context.

    The presence of Rakta-Lokesvara in Ellora is very interesting because images of Rakta-Lokesvara are very rare in the Buddhist iconography of ancient India. Rakta-Lokesvara is mainly associated with shringara rasa. In Buddhist caves he is shown along with Tara and Bhrkuti.



    So this is saying, for example, that Cunda was not a brand-new revelation that started the Pala dynasty, but, some kind of standing power that was discovered by them. If by 700 these deities were important enough to be worked into a gigantic mountain interface, then, during the 600s, they must at least have meant something. Bhrkuti is one of the primordial companions of Red Avalokiteshvara:






    Nepal invited Red Avalokiteshvara from Assam in the 600s when this thing was in its early phases or perhaps plans. West India was subject to periodic Islamic attacks starting around the 800s, which combined with declining state support caused Buddhism to dissipate at a somewhat early time. Ellora continued to be worked for centuries but not as a Buddhist site.

    At least for some time, the same Vidarbha became as crucial to tantric Buddhism as it appears to be for the Fire of Puri.

    The first written evidence of "Mumbai" is in a Nepalese Dakarnava Tantra.

    From what I can tell, Avalokiteshvara was probably first used to penetrate extreme south India such as Kerala, possibly as early as the 400s, achieving some, temporary, success. This also produced the wave of Mahayana into Ceylon, which is why the Chinese went there. Although Taranatha is a late Tibetan--1500s--it appears his guru was still able to travel to Lanka or perhaps Puri and collect a Mamaki sadhana. That actually seems to be its last bit of evidence as all sites are believed to be abandoned by 1600.

    It would probably be accurate to say that yoga and tantra practice is hugely south Indian in its developmental phase, and, Nepal becomes a type of selective amanuensis, a scribe with a cerebral filter somehow magnetizing the more effective and powerful bits regardless of point of origin, most likely already in the 500s. Every other country can be shown receiving slightly more limited branches.



    Comparatively, there is even a Mahamayuri in the older, sixth century, Cave Six:


    The earliest caves at Ellora appear to be caves 28 and 27 carved in the vicinity of the kunda [now known as Sita ki Nahni – meaning where Sita of the epic Ramayana took bath].

    In Six:

    On the side walls of the vestibule, two large reliefs shelter goddesses. The worship of the goddesses will gain importance in Buddhism at this time. The one on the right, accompanied by a peacock, figure Mahāmāyūrī, one of the oldest representations of which is found in Ellora.


    Unfolding a Mandala on p. 28 observes one of the earliest known Bhrkutis here, characterized by top knotted hair and an animal skin shawl, believed to represent asceticism. As a counterpart to Mayuri, this is "unusual" elsewhere, but appears to be the theme of the internal mandala here. This earlier Ellora project is approximately contemporaneous with the living princess who was given the name.

    In the later Twelve:

    On either side, two large reliefs are occupied by twelve female deities which are the oldest example of the multiple forms of Tārā.


    Receptacle of the Sacred discusses the intermediate Cave Ten where Mayuri appears prominently featured as leading a disciple in reading and reciting.

    The first two are linked according to India:


    The sculpture in the Buddhist caves accurately conveys the nobility, grace and serenity inherent in the Buddha. Caves 6 and 10 house images from the Buddhist and Hindu faith, under the same roof, the latter dedicated to Vishwakarma, the patron saint of Indian craftsmen. The Vishvakarma cave is both a Chaitya and a Vihara, with a seated Buddha placed in the stupa. Its two - storied structure sports a colourful pageant of dwarfs, dancing and making music.


    And then some of the last Buddhist work in the early 700s seems to make Cave Twelve and its Mahamayuri as a central figure in Twelve Vidyarajnis with the Mayuri panel featured.


    A wider perspective is available from Sahapedia Figure 22.


    On p. 87, Unfolding a Mandala due to the presence of Janguli concludes they must mean the presence of Dharani goddesses from the Dharmadhatu Vagisvara and Mahavairocana mandalas.


    I had not thought about whether the two were related; in Stephen Beyer's Cult of Tara:


    Avalokitesvara, Tara, and Bhrkuti- This iconographic arrangement of the Bodhisattva with his two female companions is found as early as the Manjusri-mulakalpa; it is found in the Mahavairocana-sutra and is placed by the Japanese Shingon sect in their great Garbhakosa...


    Equivalently in Orissa:


    Udayagiri’s stupa was built in Mahakarunagarbhodbhva mandala




    Not only does Ellora plainly establish the Seven Historical Buddhas which are a continuing practice in Nepal, it gives a distinct Vajrayana Pantheon:


    Bodhisattva Avalokitesvara has a small image of Amitabh Buddha in his crown. Bodhisattva Vajrapani (we have seen his painting in Ajanta Cave -1) has a replica of a small stupa in his crown and Vajra in his right hand.

    The seven Dhyani Buddhas are also represented here – Vairochana, Akshobhya, Ratnasambhava. Amitabh, Amoghasiddhi, Vajrasattva and Vajraraj.


    With further investigation, it may have been built as the scheme of Heaven, Hell, and Cosmology.


    We can trace the survival of its relatively obscure Cunda in Genesis and Development:


    Cunda, though she
    appears not have been a major constituent of learned Tantric Buddhism, seems to
    have been popular in the region. Two bronze statues of this goddess have been found
    in Pala territory, one from Kurkihar cast in the reign of Mahipala I, and the other
    from Nalanda, assigned by Huntington on stylistic grounds to the ninth century; and there was a temple of Cunda in Pattikera (Mainamati) near Comilla, which is illustrated in a manuscript of the Astasahasrika Prajna-
    paramita (ULC MS Add. 1643, copied in 1015), as one of eighty-five illustrations of
    Buddhist sacred sites, most in eastern India, with the legend pattikere cundavara-
    bhavane cunda (MlTRA 1971, p. 244). There are images of Cunda from Ratnagiri,
    Udayagiri, and Achutrajpur in Orissa, Ellora in Maharashtra, Gujarat, and Nepal.



    The Dharani goddesses can also be identified as belonging to the Dharmadhatu Vagisvara Mandala built as statuettes in the Forbidden City at Beijing, but the Chinese do not have all the interpretation. Most of the constructions are based from the Indian Nispannayogavali.


    Despite the number, nothing says the Dharanis have anything to do with the Zodiacal Signs. But if Cave Twelve also symbolizes the Heaven of Thirty-three, they would be present as the Adityas. The Dharanis, instead, are Vidyarajnis, quite similar to the Hindu Mahavidyas. Rather than being a set pattern, like the signs, each has a kind of individual strength in representing her particular flavor of full enlightenment. Each dharani reveals an aspect or portion of Samadhi, which would be the point of the Dhyanottara or Vajrosnisa.

    Mayuri is, of course, a much older and mediumishly-large Sutra which already engages this spoken practice with what could be components for a mandala, if, perhaps, there was such a thing as guru's instructions. It would not be that hard, since other classes of literature already give correspondences to one's mental and elemental principles, and what is missing is any assignment of doctrinal beliefs to the beings and items of a mandala or visualization. The waves of tantric literature beginning ca. 550 could be described as an ever-increasing fusion of teachings into roughly the same formula of meditative practice. Something like inflating a hot air balloon and it begins to rise. Nothing with any significant level of detail is believed to have been written early enough to explain the twelve goddesses. The likelihood is they arose as their own practice, which becomes portable as a retinue ring to Manjushri or Vairocana in their mandalas.

    On this, we found a huge error, Bhattacharya originally misprinted it because the first should read "Vasumati Mahalakshmi", which, we have tried to view in context of being mostly equivalent to "Kolhapur Mahalakshmi" of Maharastra. And here the group of associated deities is found.


    Dharani Goddesses are mostly based from Sutras, meaning anyone can read them and do a sadhana as a type of external praise, like having a conversation.

    Mahayana Buddhism in this sense is synonymous with literacy. It is intended to give high mileage from Sutras in this manner.


    Ellora and Nepal were not ever basic Mahayana to begin with, each has a complete presence of Vajrayana or tantric meditation practices. It seems most likely there was a pulse of Vajrayana Buddhism over the same route and almost in the same vehicle as Shiva Pasupati, and if that meant Mars, this would sound correct, along with Kolhapur Mahalakshmi. This constitutes a Golden Age.

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    This is much worse than anyone could have ever imagined.


    I posted a bunch of stuff about Cinnabar, which is all true, except it turns out to be relatively common, such as in being the namesake of Aswan, Egypt, where it is also found. Hingula Mata must be derived from the use of it, not the source and supply of it. And in her case, further details are all intra-Indian, very blurry about international connection. But it left a curiosity about Balochistan.

    In turn, this area shows brick-built cities dating back to about 8,000 B. C. E., which, so far, have no signs of central authority such as governmental or temple buildings.

    Most scholarship has always revolved around ancient Egypt and Mesopotamia, both of which can rightfully claim some form of advanced civilization from around 3,000 B. C. E., compared to which India is practically ignored, due to lack of written documents, and these villages being excavated only recently.

    There are some places, such as Catal Huyuk, which have been believed to have been older at 5,000+ B. C. E., that never developed into empires and eventually ceased.

    Today, we still see articles with misleading phrases such as "oldest form of Sanskrit"--which cannot really be determined--but if India had very old records on paper, they disintegrated. Other places could be credited with the idea of marking words onto indelible surfaces, carved in stone or baked in bricks. That does not tell us anything about the language itself, it shows areas where these practices were applied.


    We have neglected something from the art world. They haven't said it boldly enough. Stone, of course, is not just more durable than paper, some of it is much easier to work than metal. Given the age of Balochistan, then, Catal Huyuk and similar areas are perhaps comparable, and here is a seemingly-familiar Mother goddess amulet, lapis lazuli, Anatolia, 7th-5th millennium BCE:






    Later in Sumeria, there is a Bifrons Bull 2650-2350 B.C., and then in Babylon or Chaldea, you get that interesting printing method called Cylinder Seals:







    Well, almost any one of us would know, if you even did Wicca 101, nothing like this is surprising. Curiously, when we take Egypt and Mesopotamia and their religions as something ancient and original, which is somewhat indisputably quite old and I would say provable to around 3,000 B. C. E., our hands will be tied. You can look from the very beginning, the most important items of all the deities are always lapis. It is the same with Maat or Ishtar. Gilgamesh slays the Bull of Heaven, which has lapis horns, which has two tellings--a Sumerian appropriate for the Age of Taurus, and a Babylonian which is similar, except Ishtar has been kicked in lieu of Asshur or the Sun God, Age of Aries. The expression "sapphire" at times in the Bible or by the Romans, etc., in many cases is believed to have mean lapis rather than blue beryl. Lapis is not even a mineral, it is a rock; beryl is a crystal.


    For the Bull of Heaven:

    Representations are especially common on cylinder seals of the Akkadian Empire (c. 2334 – 2154 BC).


    Here is a long article on Gilgamesh about the transfer of kingship from Ishtar to Asshur around Hammurabi's time ca. 1,800 B. C. E., probably as movement into the Age of Aries. The kingdom named for Asshur, Assyria, was run by Massatru astrology.





    So, perhaps because it is so common it escapes notice, blue, Heaven, because the sky is blue, nothing impressive about that.

    Here's the thing. I am not expert enough to go into small hut villages which may have been in Egypt or Ur or things like that, there is not any dispute there was some kind of stone age existence in many places. As soon as they enter the historical record with identifiable artifacts and writing, their entire spiritual culture is based in lapis lazuli.


    They could not possibly have come up with this independently.


    The material for every single thing they had came from here:







    The region north of Balochistan was the world's source of lapis since 8,000 B. C. E.


    That's not a written legend or astrological calculation. It is the comparative analysis of all evidence that has been extracted from archaeological sites.

    Sumerian and Egyptian mythology are undefinable without this source.


    Nothing about this changed until relatively recent times.


    Lapis has eventually been discovered and mined in other countries, but, all through these ancient civilizations, it was only here. Northern Afghanistan had this major supply, and a few smaller digs were found through Balochistan. And there is a legendary top quality vein in the Pamirs:

    Only the secret of the silkworm was kept with the same care.


    Let that sink in for a moment. Even from the early regimes in 3,000 B. C. E. or more, there is nothing in Egypt or Mesopotamia that is not utterly physically dependent on this.

    Nothing.


    We can say there is a difference between shared trading culture and colonization or takeover, because, the oldest form of Sanskrit--the engraved kind--is not from India, it is Hittite Mittani:


    They signed a treaty with a rival king in 1380 BC which names Indra, Varuna, Mitra and the Nasatyas (Ashvins) as divine witnesses for the Mitannis. While modern-day Hindus have mostly stopped the worship of these deities, these Mitanni gods were also the most important gods in the Rig Veda.



    So that was the interior of Asia Minor and northern Syria such as Aleppo. Here again, physical evidence indicates continuous habitation since around 8,000 B. C. E., which is the only thing in the area that could compare to Balochistan.


    Unless that first little fat goddess is a fluke, there was never a time when Aleppo area was not in commerce with Balochistan.

    If she is not a reliable clue, then, we just re-read the dawn of civilization. It is all suffused with a product of Indic highlands accepted by everyone as Heaven. And then again at the very beginning of Ezekiel:


    “Above the expanse (רקיע (over their heads [that is, of the חיות [was
    the semblance of a throne in appearance like lapis-lazuli stone (MT
    ספיר ;LXX λίϑος σάπϕειρος).” The lapis-lazuli stone in the form of
    the throne is the seat of the divine kabod.

    At Ugarit,
    Baal’s heavenly dwelling on mount Zaphon is made of lapis-lazuli
    (CTA 4.5.80-81). Another glimpse of the lapis-lazuli heaven emerges
    in Exod 24:9-10, which describes “the God of Israel” on Sinai who
    has, under his feet, a work resembling a lapis-lazuli brick as clear
    as the sky.


    This is not written anywhere, but, after preaching in Heaven, Buddha returned to earth at the site of the Ashokan Samkashya Stupa, not terribly far from where the Taj Mahal is now:


    As often depicted in ancient stone carvings and paintings, three ladders stretched down from the heavens into the city of Samkashya. The Buddha descended on the central ladder made of lapis lazuli, with Brahma to his right, on a white ladder, holding a white fan, and Indra to his left, on a crystal ladder and holding a parasol. Flowers fell from the heavens, strewing the earth where the Buddha and assembly touched down.



    It seems kind of inexcusable that we are apparently blind to this universal.

    It says nothing as to languages or meanings of pagan gods; doesn't have to. There is a shared unity here that nothing else can lay a finger to.


    Compared to the Silk Road, lapis lazuli implies the sea. It is believed to have been shipped to Mesopotamia, who then traded it to Egypt. The following represents the height of medieval caravan routes. It is handy because you can make out the Makran port of Balochistan because it stands out by itself. It is across from the eastern point of the Arabian peninsula, where you can see the road sort of dips down to it, and then goes back up. For a long time, it did not continue into Iran, it ended there at the port. The Hingula Mata site would be a detour before you get there:






    In Makran, you can probably get a pretty good idea when the international-ness solidified:


    Large and massive quadrangular stone building were constructed already before 4000 BC. Flints, worked stones, and bone tools used by the inhabitants were found by archaeologists, but no ceramics were yet used.

    At Miri Qalat, some links with Uruk culture ceramics were also found.


    That sounds about right. Somewhere around the 3,000s B. C. E., something sprung into action. Ongoing from Harvard:


    With Sutkagen-dor and Sotka-Koh, two major maritime trading outposts located in the coastal area of Kech-Makran, Miri Qalat is one of the westernmost sites relating to the Indus Civilization...

    ...some thirty sites dating from the second half of the 3rd millennium BCE which show that the local tradition in connection with a south-eastern Iranian cultural horizon did not disappear with the arrival of the Indus Civilization.


    The ancient port appears to be today's Gwadar:


    In April 2015, Pakistan and China announced their intention to develop the $46 billion China–Pakistan Economic Corridor (CPEC), which in turn forms part of China's ambitious One Belt, One Road. Gwadar features heavily in CPEC, and is also envisaged to be the link between the One Belt, One Road and Maritime Silk Road project


    The area shows inhabitation as early as the Bronze Age with settlements around some of the area's oasis. It is from this settlement pattern that the word Makran, the original name of Balochistan, is derived.


    named for fish-eaters:


    ...the ancient Persian phrase "Mahi Khorana," which has itself become the modern word "Makran".








    It looks great, but, given the time frame, looks a bit delicate to have resisted that greatest of maritime disasters, the submergence of Dwarka. First of all, the sunken city was directly linked to the lapis lazuli mines on the Dvaraka-Kamboja route:


    From Pushkalavati, the Kamboja-Dvārakā and Uttarapatha routes ran together to Bahlika through Kabul and Bamyan. At Bahlika, the road turned east to pass through the Pamir Mountains and Badakshan, finally connecting with the Silk Road to China.


    When we look at the peak of the Ice Age around 20,000 years ago, one finds a gradual sea rise for about ten thousand years, and then there is a 2,000 year rush around 8,000 B. C. E., corresponding to flood myths and the age of places we are discussing. The event is long done and there is not exactly a reason why Dwarka should be said to have submerged in a day. Except, instead of the sea rising, maybe it just slipped under, because it is unstable:


    The Gulf of Khambhat was formed by a major rift that resulted in a down sliding of the Khambhat region. The area is very tectonically active today, and several faults can be found in the gulf. Periodic earthquakes also occur here.


    Unfortunately, the research that has been done there is of far slacker quality than that of the International Gemological Society or a university-sponsored dig. I would not think that a single piece of wood dated to 7,500 B. C. E. proves a civilization, but, it still looks like there was something around the time of Krishna, without knowing exactly how it happened.

    Lapis was the same all the way through the Roman Empire. Then as we know, things start to break, and something basic like this is forgotten.



    Describing objects found in its settlement:


    ...nephrite, and obsidian, all native to Anatolia, along with imported ivory, amber, and lapis lazuli.


    This is a new vista, which comes from a handful of excavations starting around 1987 and of course they are kind of slow, and then from the thesis of Kelsey 2010:


    ...the most compelling conclusion of this study is the
    possibility of a trade route by sea originating in the Indus Valley.


    That of Massa and Palmisano 2018:


    ...investigates and offers explanations for the distribution of specific products (ivory and lapis lazuli artefacts, “Syrian” bottles) and technologies (metrology) that have often been invoked as tracers of long-distance trade contacts and/or political units in Anatolia, northern Levant and northern Mesopotamia during the Early and Middle Bronze Ages. Unlike former studies investigating third and second millennia exchange networks as separate entities, we examine comparatively and systematically a large corpus of published archaeological data by adopting a quantitative and spatial approach. Through this analysis, we propose that a significant degree of similarity in the shape, infrastructure and motivations behind the development and maintenance of these long-distance exchanges existed between the third and early second millennia BC.


    It is easy to start rolling and find it discovered in the artifacts of Crete and Khorasan, or when it appears to be introduced in Achemenid Sardis, or already In Situ for Troy. In many cases, overland routes are considered more dangerous than the sea.


    All of that--which surely must resemble the "root of the world's religions"--still pales in the face of what it already was for thousands of years in its local area. So, that gives more reason to envisage the Fixed Cross and Taurus as a definite astrological stamp.

    I get the sense it is sacred not just because there are not many blue stones, the color of sky, but also for the ability of water to take on the color of sky. The scenery in the Pamirs article shows this.

    It is not a word, name, form, or teaching, it is the material of Heaven.

    It is in paganism, in Judaism, and Buddhism, always primordial and the most exalted substance, more than diamonds and rubies and so on. Even if the Jewish calendar at 5,000+ years were literally true, it would fit like a drop in this bottle. As to why, exactly, the Egyptians might become fiendishly obsessed by their ability to buy something from a distant land, I am not sure. Is it a drug? Was there a sales pitch involved? There is no apparent reason why you would pay for something that is otherwise useless, for tools for example, but if you felt yourself in tune with the speech of someone describing their own experience of why they feel it is like Heaven or the sea, then you are inspired by culture, rather than crude survival.

    This steady state is found in India. It never completely perished. It did, somehow, achieve a massive circuit in the western direction starting around 3,500 B. C. E., which engulfs known history about civilizations. Eventually it is severed. Then in only the nineteenth century, the idea that India may have been influential towards and European cultures was absurd. Theosophy suggested it was otherwise, and, HPB said the secret of the Tarot would probably be found in the Rota or Cylinder Seals, and, I am not sure that means what is written on them, but, what they are made of.

    All we give it is a Roman Arabic polyglot, lapis "stone" lazuli "blue", which is not really even a word. It is supposed to compose the Divine Throne, and you get a mashup of two languages from religions that have an inherent argument.

    If we give it the perhaps technically incorrect name "Sapphire", it at least sounds nicer, and either one or both may be called the stone of Sagittarius. In India, this has more to do with healing. In Buddhism, lapis is the Light of Medicine Buddha. It still appears as the substance of certain sacred items. It is not everywhere but it is easily recognizable in this vein.

    That is truly an "Ark of the Covenant", or some such thing, because it isn't anything in particular, it is like the spine of the known world.

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    This post is not new, but, I am going to dragnet things I put in other threads so we don't forget.


    I personally am practically stunned from a few recent posts above about the dominance of Lapis Lazuli. This provenance has only been revealed by art and archaeology projects in the 2000s--not a part of any traditional history, since it was literally buried.

    As the projects continue, they continue to find this evidence, and no contradictory evidences.

    At this point, we can now find many sites and web pages with more prevalent finds which re-state "Indus and Mesopotamian trading" from the ca. 3,000 B. C. E. period, remaining a step shy of the conclusion of what a cultural dependency this represents. But the information is percolating into public consciousness, which will eventually wear out the idea that the oldest known writings "started" something. We can agree that the Zodiac is a more specifically-western adaptation of the same astrology as in India, where they remained more interested in solar months than constellations, so it is not a hard line dispute.


    We do see a dispute beginning with the murder of Hypatia and the subsequent repression of heretics until around the 600s, western society visibly changes and breaks away from what had continued to function in the ancient lapis routes. It does so under increasing central power. Here is a summary of the break of Orthodoxy and western churches.


    The worst gripe was not the nature of Jesus, but of the Holy Spirit, in tandem with the Pope's ability to dictate the whole religion.


    At the beginning of the truly modern era, HPB on the Student Group and assassination of Tsar Nicholas II.


    Tarpley on Palmerston's assistants Mazzini, Urquhart, and Napoleon III, along with the main Mazzinist tract responsible for the spread of terrorism--Propaganda of the Deed.


    That is a lot like the French Revolution, which was a mix of revolutionaries, terrorists, and the psyop that infiltrated terrorism.

    HPB's writings constantly pin terrorism to Mazzinism, and take a different tone with Garibaldi.

    There is not much equivalency at the time of English publications composed by Russians. Moreover, she is adamant about the solidarity of Tsardom and Orthodoxy. As we have seen, it is only modern Communism which is strictly anti-monarchist, beginning with the Bolsheviks. This is closer to the system of China. The American Revolution was not anti-monarchist, since there was a substantial movement intended to elect George Washington as King. It was just the removal of British authority.

    The problem with kings is "election by birthright", and an unchecked person exercising all three branches of government.

    Splitting the three is the idea of Montesquieu, which was followed by Russia.

    The second refinement is a bi-cameral legislature, i. e. a House of Commons or Representatives who, at least by design, are supposed to represent the working class.

    If a king is elected and those powers split, then, he is largely equivalent to a president or prime minister in today's terms, so, an axiomatic forbiddance of monarchy does not seem to hold tremendous value.

    I am not sure there is much to add in this space, but, I will try to use it as a basket for things which tend to vanish in a lot of other threads.

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    Hi shaberon. I am enjoying your posts here. Cheers.
    Last edited by Johnnycomelately; 5th July 2023 at 13:40.

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    Quote Posted by Johnnycomelately (here)
    Hi shaberon. I am enjoying your posts here. Cheers.


    Thank you.

    I am not sure off the top of my head if there is a whole lot to add--this being a type of re-education which simply undermines most of the paradigm.

    I personally have reached the conclusion that "the West" is like a bubble which more or less started with Aristotle, split from the Silk Road culture around the 600s, and continued to foment the totally artificial and backwards state of things, which, we now enjoy here in the West but are increasingly seen as useless and dangerous by most of the rest of the world, Capitalism.

    What I do not have a word for is something like "exclusion principle"--I have found it applies to numerous things. What I mean by this is that often, a piece of evidence (usually writing) can be found that asserts or supports a given position, and--nothing else is ever found. There are no other positions. The thing that trickled to me recently being the example of Lapis Lazuli. It has all the positive proof of being exactly what it says it is, but, there have not been found any additional sources, substitute materials, or anything that would even remotely indicate that the oldest written mythologies were not dependent on it.


    The dang stuff now is in a tussle between militias and the Taliban unfortunately. At first, the region was not Afghan or Islamic...these obviously have nothing to do with the interesting story. Besides, we can get it from other places now.


    Previously, the region dissipated forces which were engaged in building "the West". If we go back to our statistics, Macedonia currently has about the largest Muslim minority in the western direction. It however is also subject to "Catholic Orthodoxy" and shall we say some materialistic Judaism. When we start saying the tenets of Aristotle were materialistic--he professed astronomy, not astrology--not only did he essentially betray Plato, but, he connived the entire Old World through the hands of the Macedonian Alexander the Great:



    Aristotle may have had his strongest influence on his student in the fields of politics and morality. Aristotle had written two books on both subjects, and his ideas must have fueled Alexander’s decisions later in life. The teacher not only urged the student to conquer eastern lands, but he also conveyed to Alexander that slavery was part of the natural order of things and that all non-Greeks were barbarians. He further advised the young Macedonian to be a good ruler of the Greeks and treat all barbarians as mere plants and animals. Aristotle looked at barbarians as creatures who did not have human intelligence and, therefore, lived only to chase pleasures.



    Passed along a bit of Stoicism and intellectual brilliance. But that attitude is rather strong. Some of these ancient Greeks took to the practice of slaughtering groups of healthy workers doing their farm work, based only from the statistic that "young men might cause trouble".

    Then you get a long era of his former empire's Governates or Satrapies which continued to wield destiny throughout influential events such as the Gospel era.

    Again, not remembering where I posted it, one might say it is technically correct that a few Greek philosophers had already exalted cruelty of this kind, but, at most, they perhaps briefly gained notoreity only in a city-state. With Aristotle you are definitely turning a new leaf.

    Litmus test of the Jesuits by their own decree.

    The rivalry between schools of Plato and Aristotle is clearly expressed in original Theosophy, and, admittedly, by the La Rouchians such as Tarpley, who are about as unrelated as you can get.

    One could say the pre-Christian influence of Aristotle amalgamated into the Roman Church.



    Europe is similar to India, there are a fair amount of written records back to ca. year 1,000, and then it dries up and there is hardly anything before 500. And so, like anyone else, I became able to examine my ancestry in comparison to historical events. In those fuzzy years, there was some resistance until eventually succumbing to Catholicism, however the Romans usually left most public officials intact. Consequently, going back to the first female I would be able to trace as a matriarch, out comes pure Evil from a story now known as Murder of a Monster, Mabel Talvas d'Alencon:


    While still on monastery land they passed the home of Roger Suisnar. Mabel demanded his infant child suckle at the nipple causing her the most pain. The child did, and died. Mabel feeling much better returned home.


    Unable to accept this humiliation, some months later during the night of 2 December 1079 Hugh led his three brothers and forced their way into Mabel’s Château at Bures-sur-Dives. They found Mabel in her chamber relaxing after a bath and cut off her head.



    That is a long article, and that is right, the point is she was decapitated in bed.

    Said to be an outright bad person by all accounts.

    Fair enough, I can own that. Also, to live with the account of one of her sons:


    The legend of Robert the Devil, fathered by Satan himself is based on him.


    Over time, the ancestral personalities become less bad, and, the information available about the role of British government becomes increasingly horrible. So they kind of trade places. And then it speaks a lot to the development of the English language Western system.

    According to Tarpley, England was plied by the Venetians around the 1500s. That made it unusually bad on a global scale. Before then, it was just kind of predictably bad by attacking Wales and Scotland. Before then, it was a state of banditry when the Normans conquered it. Before then, it may have been a better role model with an elected king.

    English language, Roman alphabet...I just keep using it...why...

    Today's articles on Russia have the CIA director planning to exploit alienation inside the country, followed by an ex-CIA remark that, not only is that not going to be possible, it is actually backwards, since Americans *do* have a really high level of alienation, they are prime targets for recruitment.

    Story of my life.

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    There might be something which we have not done much with so far.

    It has to do with the original "United States" was a confederacy.

    This is because I came across another article today calling all of the American founders racist despots and the like, which seems to be the train of thought currently villainizing "The Confederacy" and so on, but this is mostly true only in terms of New York.


    The difficulty is perhaps that thing called The Constitution was rammed through by sheer force, and, carried within it the seeds of what would become the so-called "Civil War".


    Many things about this were presciently indicated by Patrick Henry:



    A final cause Henry engaged in before leaving the House of Delegates at the end of 1790 was over the Funding Act of 1790, by which the federal government took over the debts of the states, much of which dated from the Revolutionary War. On November 3, 1790, Henry introduced a resolution which was passed by the House of Delegates and by the state Senate, declaring the act "repugnant to the constitution of the United States, as it goes to the exercise of a power not granted to the general [federal] government". This would prove the first of many resolutions passed by Southern state legislatures in the decades to come, defending states' rights and strict interpretation of the Constitution.


    So, yes...the south was sort of mutely passing resolutions against the fed for over fifty years, as soon as it started.

    This new government was terrible, and he had tried to prevent this during drafting and ratification:


    Several factors had eroded Henry's trust in the Northern states, including what he deemed Congress's failure to send adequate troops to protect Virginia settlers in the Ohio River Valley. Henry was outraged by the Jay–Gardoqui Treaty, which would have ceded exclusive navigation on the Mississippi River to Spain for 25 years. This was in exchange for commercial concessions that would benefit New England, where there was a growing separatist movement.


    While thanking Washington for presiding in Philadelphia and for sending the document, he said of it, "I have to lament that I cannot bring my Mind to accord with the proposed Constitution. The Concern I feel on this account is really greater than I am able to express."

    Henry opposed the Constitution because of its grant of a strong executive, the president; he had not fought to free Virginia from King George to surrender such powers to what might prove a despot. Henry accordingly deemed the Constitution a backwards step and a betrayal of those who had died in the Revolutionary cause.


    Henry suggested that the framers of the Constitution had no right to begin it "We the People" and ignore the powers of the states. He suggested that the document put too much power in the hands of too few.

    Henry was disappointed when the First Congress passed only amendments dealing with personal liberties, not those designed to weaken the government.



    Bearing in mind that what would become the Bill of Rights was originally missing--which is why I called it "window dressing", a diversion from the other issues he raises--trying to overlook that single issue, here are some quotes from his very long speech at the Virginia Ratifying Convention:


    Quote Have they said, we the States? Have they made a proposal of a compact between States? If they had, this would be a confederation: It is otherwise most clearly a consolidated government.


    Here is a revolution as radical as that which separated us from Great Britain. It is as radical, if in this transition our rights and privileges are endangered, and the sovereignty of the States be relinquished: And cannot we plainly see, that this is actually the case?

    It is said eight States have adopted this plan. I declare that if twelve States and an half had adopted it, I would, with manly firmness, and in spite of an erring world, reject it. You are not to inquire how your trade may be increased, nor how you are to become a great and powerful people, but how your liberties can be secured; for liberty ought to be the direct end of your government.

    Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are inevitably ruined. I am answered by gentlemen, that, though I might speak of terrors, yet the fact was, that we were surrounded by none of the dangers I apprehended. I conceive this new government to be one of those dangers: it has produced those horrors which distress many of our best citizens. We are come hither to preserve the poor commonwealth of Virginia, if it can be possibly done: something must be done to preserve your liberty and mine. The Confederation, this same despised government, merits, in my opinion, the highest encomium: it carried us through a long and dangerous war; it rendered us victorious in that bloody conflict with a powerful nation; it has secured us a territory greater than any European monarch possesses: and shall a government which has been thus strong and vigorous, be accused of imbecility, and abandoned for want of energy? Consider what you are about to do before you part with the government.


    I acknowledge that licentiousness is dangerous, and that it ought to be provided against: I acknowledge, also, the new form of government may effectually prevent it: yet there is another thing it will as effectually do — it will oppress and ruin the people.

    My great objection to this government is, that it does not leave us the means of defending our rights, or of waging war against tyrants. It is urged by some gentlemen, that this new plan will bring us an acquisition of strength — an army, and the militia of the states. This is an idea extremely ridiculous: gentlemen cannot be earnest. This acquisition will trample on our fallen liberty. Let my beloved Americans guard against that fatal lethargy that has pervaded the universe. Have we the means of resisting disciplined armies, when our only defence, the militia, is put into the hands of Congress? The honorable gentleman said that great danger would ensue if the Convention rose without adopting this system. I ask, Where is that danger? I see none.


    I address my most fervent prayer to prevent our adopting a system destructive to liberty. Let not gentlemen be told that it is not safe to reject this government. Wherefore is it not safe? We are told there are dangers, but those dangers are ideal; they cannot be demonstrated. To encourage us to adopt it, they tell us that there is a plain, easy way of getting amendments. When I come to contemplate this part, I suppose that I am mad, or that my countrymen are so. The way to amendment is, in my conception, shut.


    What, sir, is the genius of democracy? Let me read that clause of the bill of rights of Virginia which relates to this: 3d clause: — that government is, or ought to be, instituted for the common benefit, protection, and security of the people, nation, or community. Of all the various modes and forms of government, that is best,which is capable of producing the greatest degree of happiness and safety, and is most effectually secured against the danger of mal-administration; and that whenever any government shall be found inadequate, or contrary to those purposes, a majority of the community hath an indubitable, unalienable, and indefeasible right to reform, alter, or abolish it, in such manner as shall be judged most conducive to the public weal.

    This, sir, is the language of democracy — that a majority of the community have a right to alter government when found to be oppressive. But how different is the genius of your new Constitution from this! How different from the sentiments of freemen, that a contemptible minority can prevent the good of the majority! If, then, gentlemen, standing on this ground, are come to that point, that they are willing to bind themselves and their posterity to be oppressed, I am amazed and inexpressibly astonished.

    You read of a riot act in a country which is called one of the freest in the world, where a few neighbors cannot assemble without the risk of being shot by a hired soldiery, the engines of despotism. We may see such an act in America.

    A standing army we shall have, also, to execute the execrable commands of tyranny; and how are you to punish them? Will you order them to be punished? Who shall obey these orders? Will your mace-bearer be a match for a disciplined regiment? In what situation are we to be? The clause before you gives a power of direct taxation, unbounded and unlimited, exclusive power of legislation, in all cases whatsoever, for ten miles square, and over all places purchased for the erection of forts, magazines, arsenals, dockyards, &c. What resistance could be made? The attempt would be madness. You will find all the strength of this country in the hands of your enemies; their garrisons will naturally be the strongest places in the country. Your militia is given up to Congress, also, in another part of this plan: they will therefore act as they think proper: all power will be in their own possession. You cannot force them to receive their punishment: of what service would militia be to you, when, most probably, you will not have a single musket in the state?


    The distinction between a national government and a confederacy is not sufficiently discerned. Had the delegates, who were sent to Philadelphia, a power to propose a consolidated government instead of a confederacy? Were they not deputed by states, and not by the people? The assent of the people, in their collective capacity, is not necessary to the formation of a federal government.

    Are the people, therefore, in their aggregate capacity, the proper persons to form a confederacy? This, therefore, ought to depend on the consent of the legislatures, the people having never sent delegates to make any proposition for changing the government. Yet I must say, at the same time, that it was made on grounds the most pure; and perhaps I might have been brought to consent to it so far as to the change of government. But there is one thing in it which I never would acquiesce in. I mean, the changing it into a consolidated government, which is so abhorrent to my mind.

    But now, sir, the American spirit, assisted by the ropes and chains of consolidation, is about to convert this country into a powerful and mighty empire. If you make the citizens of this country agree to become the subjects of one great consolidated empire of America, your government will not have sufficient energy to keep them together. Such a government is incompatible with the genius of republicanism. There will be no checks, no real balances, in this government. What can avail your specious, imaginary balances, your rope-dancing, chain-rattling, ridiculous ideal checks and contrivances?


    Consider our situation, sir: go to the poor man, and ask him what he does. He will inform you that he enjoys the fruits of his labor, under his own fig-tree, with his wife and children around him, in peace and security. Go to every other member of society, — you will find the same tranquil ease and content; you will find no alarms or disturbances. Why, then, tell us of danger, to terrify us into an adoption of this new form of government? And yet who knows the dangers that this new system may produce? They are out of the sight of the common people: they cannot foresee latent consequences. I dread the operation of it on the middling and lower classes of people: it is for them I fear the adoption of this system.

    I see great jeopardy in this new government. I see none from our present one.

    The clause under consideration gives an unlimited and unbounded power of taxation. Suppose every delegate from Virginia opposes a law laying a tax; what will it avail? They are opposed by a ma–jority; eleven members can destroy their efforts: those feeble ten cannot prevent the passing the most oppressive tax law; so that, in direct opposition to the spirit and express language of your declaration of rights, you are taxed, not by your own consent, but by people who have no connection with you.

    In this scheme of energetic government, the people will find two sets of tax-gatherers — the state and the federal sheriffs. This, it seems to me, will produce such dreadful oppression as the people cannot possibly bear. The federal sheriff may commit what oppression, make what distresses, he pleases, and ruin you with impunity; for how are you to tie his hands? Have you any sufficiently decided means of preventing him from sucking your blood by speculations, commissions, and fees?


    I would rather infinitely — and I am sure most of this Convention are of the same opinion — have a king, lords, and commons, than a government so replete with such insupportable evils. If we make a king, we may prescribe the rules by which he shall rule his people, and interpose such checks as shall prevent him from infringing them; but the President, in the field, at the head of his army, can prescribe the terms on which he shall reign master, so far that it will puzzle any American ever to get his neck from under the galling yoke.

    This, sir, is my great objection to the Constitution, that there is no true responsibility — and that the preservation of our liberty depends on the single chance of men being virtuous enough to make laws to punish themselves.


    The history of Switzerland clearly proves that we might be in amicable alliance with those states without adopting this Constitution. Switzerland is a confederacy, consisting of dissimilar governments. This is an example which proves that governments of dissimilar structures may be confederated. That confederate republic has stood upwards of four hundred years; and, although several of the individual republics are democratic, and the rest aristocratic, no evil has resulted from this dissimilarity; for they have braved all the power of France and Germany during that long period.

    Permit me, sir, to say, that a great majority of the people, even in the adopting states, are averse to this government. I believe I would be right to say, that they have been egregiously misled. Pennsylvania has, perhaps, been tricked into it. If the other states who have adopted it have not been tricked, still they were too much hurried into its adoption.


    After his complaints, the only thing I am sure that changed much was the obvious personal stuff, i. e. Bill of Rights, but, nothing about the intra-governmental issues he addresses. We certainly still have a "consolidated kind" with federal taxes, a standing army, and violent commanders-in-chief.

    The Constitution is almost completely backwards from the Revolution, which made the independent countries called States. That is exactly what was fought for. Nothing federal.

    Very few amendments were added any time soon, especially considering thirty others omitted at the time of passage.

    As we can see, revisionism that makes this about "kings" or "monarchy" is not true, the concern is "despotism", to which Henry makes several remarks about liberty in England superior to what is coming here.


    Although he is one of its main talking heads, Anti-Federalism is a label slapped on to all forms of resistance:



    After the war, the group that felt the national government under the Articles was too weak appropriated the name Federalist for themselves.

    Perhaps the nationalists' most brilliant tactic in the battle of ideas ahead of them, however, was their decision to call themselves "Federalists" and their cause, "Federalism." The men behind the Constitution were not, of course, federalists at all. They were advocates of a strong national government whose authority diminished the independence of the states.

    The Anti-Federalists rejected the term, arguing that they were the true Federalists.

    In Rhode Island, resistance against the Constitution was so strong that civil war almost broke out on July 4, 1788, when anti-federalist members of the Country Party led by Judge William West marched into Providence with over 1,000 armed protesters.

    North Carolina and Rhode Island prevented ratification until the definite establishment of the new government practically forced their adherence.

    Some activists joined the Anti-Administration Party that James Madison and Thomas Jefferson were forming about 1790–91 to oppose the policies of Treasury Secretary Alexander Hamilton; this group soon became the Democratic-Republican Party.

    The Republicans splintered during the 1824 presidential election. Those calling for a return to the older founding principles of the party were often referred to as "Democratic Republicans" (later Democrats. e. g. Andrew Jackson) while those embracing the newer nationalist principles of "The American System" were often referred to as National Republicans (later Whigs).

    During the 1790s, the party strongly opposed Federalist programs, including the national bank.

    Hamilton implemented an expansive economic program, establishing the First Bank of the United States, and convincing Congress to assume the debts of state governments. Hamilton pursued his programs in the belief that they would foster a prosperous and stable country. His policies engendered an opposition, chiefly concentrated in the Southern United States, that objected to Hamilton's Anglophilia and accused him of unduly favoring well-connected wealthy Northern merchants and speculators. Madison emerged as the leader of the congressional opposition while Jefferson, who declined to publicly criticize Hamilton while both served in Washington's Cabinet, worked behind the scenes to stymie Hamilton's programs.



    Then, when the "civil war" about "states' rights" was lost, you get a new national bank, for the first time loading itself with Treasury Bonds, which has remained in place ever since. Such a "war" was just the outcome of what Henry already said. It wasn't about some kind of new argument about slavery.



    The issue of slavery should have been legislative, whereas Lincoln getting involved with the Emancipation Proclamation went like:


    Lincoln understood that the federal government's power to end slavery in peacetime was limited by the Constitution, which, before 1865, committed the issue to individual states.

    Lincoln issued the Emancipation Proclamation under his authority as "Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy" under Article II, section 2 of the United States Constitution. As such, in the Emancipation Proclamation he claimed to have the authority to free persons held as slaves in those states that were in rebellion "as a fit and necessary war measure for suppressing said rebellion".

    He did not have such authority over the four border slave-holding states that were not in rebellion—Missouri, Kentucky, Maryland and Delaware—so those states were not named in the Proclamation.



    To Horace Greeley:

    My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery.


    Sometimes thought of as just a prequel to Emancipation I. that would be less of a justification than:


    Lincoln was softening the strong Northern white supremacist opposition to his imminent emancipation by tying it to the cause of the Union.



    They may not have had slaves, but, an issue like "strong white supremacy" does not bode very well. This has not changed by any means, even in NY or NJ, they just find it easy to hide. Do you think that sounds very welcoming to a million people running up from the south??

    So we see The Constitution has more to do with another imaginary "foreign threat like Britain", and, as soon as they sail to China around 1850, it is "a threat". What is this, neurotic and paranoid since 1789?

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    Here is a sort of two-sided post. First, learn Russian:


    Sobornost


    "spiritual community of many jointly-living people"

    reflecting the concept of the Christian Church as an "ecclesia"

    The term expresses the need for co-operation between people at the expense of individualism, on the basis that opposing groups focus on what is common between them. Khomyakov believed that the Western world was progressively losing its unity because it was embracing Aristotle and his defining individualism.

    Khomyakov's concept of the "catholicity" of the Christian Church as "universality", in contrast to that of Rome, reflects the perspective from the root-meaning of the word "liturgy" (Greek: λειτουργία), meaning "work of the gathered people".

    Lossky used it almost as a mechanical term to define when the dichotomy or duality of a conflict is transcended or how it is transcended and likened it to the final by product after Plato's Metaxy.

    In Trubetskoy's interpretation, sobornost means a combination of the religious, moral and social element, as an alternative to individualism and socialist collectivism. In Trubetskoy's works, the idea of sobornost quite clearly becomes part of the solidarity and altruism discourse. In one of his major works, On the Nature of Human Consciousness, Trubetskoy wrote, "Good will, which is the basis of morality, is called love. Any morals, based on principles other than love, are not true morals…. Natural love is inherent to all living beings. Descending from its supreme manifestations in the family love of man, from animal herd instincts to elementary propagation processes, everywhere we find that basic, organic altruism, owing to which creatures inwardly presuppose each other, are drawn towards other creatures and establish not only themselves, but other creatures as well, and live for others".

    Sobornost is an asceticism akin to kenosis in that the individual gives up self-benefit for the community or ecclesia and is driven by theophilos rather than adelfikos.



    So this Russian idea--despite some personal differences, you still have a united group because it is based from love and similar values--closely stems from some of the early Christological disputes. This time Christianity will sound like Buddhism when we learn Greek:


    The term kenosis comes from the Greek κενόω (kenóō), meaning "to empty out".


    [Epistle from Paul to the] Philippians 2:7 is generally considered the most significant for the Christian idea of kenosis:

    Let the same mind be in you that was in Christ Jesus, who, though he was in the form of God, did not regard equality with God as something to be exploited, but emptied himself (ekenōsen heauton), taking the form of a slave, being born in human likeness. And being found in human form, he humbled himself and became obedient to the point of death— even death on a cross. Therefore God also highly exalted him and gave him the name that is above every name...

    — Philippians 2:5-9 (NRSV)


    Kenosis is not only a Christological issue in Orthodox theology, but also relates to Pneumatology, matters of the Holy Spirit. Kenosis, relative to the human nature, denotes the continual epiklesis and self-denial of one's own human will and desire.


    Kenosis in Orthodox theology is the transcending or detaching of oneself from the world or the passions, it is a component of dispassionation. Much of the earliest debates between the Arian and Orthodox Christians were over kenosis. The need for clarification about the human and divine nature of the Christ (see the hypostatic union) were fought over the meaning and example that Christ set, as an example of kenosis or ekkenosis.


    Pope Pius XII, in his 1951 Sempiternus Rex Christus, condemned a particular interpretation of Philippians in regards to the kenosis.


    The equivalent to kenosis in Gnostic literature is Christ's withdrawal of his own luminosity into himself, so as to cease dazzling his own disciples. In the Pistis Sophia, at the request of his disciples, "Jesus drew to himself the glory of his light".



    Rome, evidently, does not care for this concept found in Gnosticism and Orthodoxy. I understand it, I would say it would be wise to do some kenosis to attain sobornost. Oxford calls this:


    A Russian term with no exact English equivalent.


    I am not surprised. In English, every tiny little detail separates us, and rather than good will, we are bound together by the collectivist interest in economics.


    1914 The Soul of the People:







    Here is some English from Senator Helms 1998 from an article on how to Say No:



    Quote A Revolutionary War veteran and native of Warrenton, Senator Macon was chairman between 1825 and 1829. He was a fierce opponent of any and all measures to expand the power of the new federal government.

    Indeed, during his entire thirty-seven-year tenure in Congress, Macon cast more no votes than did any ten other members combined.

    Woodrow Wilson, for example, loathed the United States Senate. He was a man in a hurry, with grand visions of a new world order, and the Senate Foreign Relations Committee stood in his way.

    Compare the fight over the League of Nations with the Senate’s recent consideration of NATO expansion. The growth of the Atlantic Alliance is perhaps the most important foreign policy matter to come before the Senate since the end of the Cold War. Yet, while the debate was spirited, it was not confrontational. Why?

    Early in the process the Foreign Relations Committee raised a number of reservations about the administration’s approach to NATO expansion. For example, Dr. Henry Kissinger came and testified before the committee about his concern that by giving Russia a voice in NATO decision making, we were letting the fox into the henhouse. And so the committee drafted conditions in the Resolution of Ratification that built a “fire wall” in the NATO-Russia relationship. Also, over the next nine months, I and fellow committee members worked with the Secretary of State to address a number of other concerns. The result: The Senate overwhelmingly approved NATO expansion. Had the administration dug in its heels and expected the committee to rubber-stamp the expansion protocols, I can assure you the Senate would still be deliberating the wisdom of NATO expansion today.

    So I disagree with President Wilson; I believe the Founding Fathers showed great wisdom when they established the separation of powers. Because in so doing, they ensured a voice for the American people in their nation’s foreign policy—a check on those foreign policy elites who would prefer to run foreign affairs unencumbered by the popular will.


    His point is the Senate opposing the Executive. In principle true enough. But the Senate is not about the people, that is the Representatives, the whole point of bi-cameral legislature. Reading through it, the implication is that the President would have allowed Russia a legal say in such matters, but Kissinger and the Senate were so adamant, that by refusing, this idea was dropped.

    I am not sure Kissinger actually favored the expansion, but he apparently did not want Russia to have a part in the decision.

    Helms and some other senators are more responsible for this than anyone, i. e. unchecked expansion by a "sovereign" NATO.

    It was an important decision; I am not sure what he means by "Cold War", if not the end of the U. S. S. R., which of course was massively the outcome of U. S. foreign policy. I guess they could do that because Soviet-ism lacked Sobornost.

    It is the pride of his career that NATO expansion happens regardless of Russian views. That doesn't show any sense of community either.

    The end of The Wall and the opening of borders was truly remarkable. That part was fantastic. Very excellent on a human level. Then not only NATO expanded, but Liberal Democracy also pre-empted most of the socialist systems. In a recent poll, 86% of Bulgarians found they hate democracy and wish they had their old system back. Now most of these countries have pro-Ukraine regimes and a conflicted populace who can't stand them.

    There were others involved; Helms happened to be the chair of the committee, and so, at the...helm...of the whole thing. I don't know who gave him this drive. Might have come from his own surprisingly articulate but utterly bombastic brain.

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    Here is a vein of obscurity which is not really obscure.


    This is an example I have noticed where Wikipedia hasn't quite published something that is "wrong", but, it is "incomplete" in a way that could easily be done much better.

    If you look at the page for "conspiracy theory", you will be relegated to the words appearing in an 1863 letter to the NY Times, where it isn't clear that they are even a "phrase", just the two words being used together in an understandable manner.


    In the sense that it may have designated a "subject", then, of course, a "school of thought" may promote a subject, without always using the same terms.


    Concerning the subject, then, this is completely accurate on the page for the Jesuit author:


    Furthermore, Barruel is seen as the father of modern conspiracy theory.



    We have the book uploaded here--it is four massive volumes with tons of details, which, on an "information" basis, are not necessarily even wrong, but incomplete.


    It is in the thread Memoirs Illustrating the History of Jacobinism, where I put a few points of my own trying to express the "incomplete"--particularly in what he does not mention:


    The Jesuit institution he stands for; the sweeping of everything he doesn't understand into the Anti-Masonic "one label fits all"; and no recognition of British statecraft.


    and of his revivalist protegee':


    Ms. Webster dismissed English involvement in the same manner Barruel denies Jesuit Masonry.



    I did not get that from his page--but something similar is posted there for Memoirs:




    Margaret Jacob argues that Barruel's writings "offer a point of departure for understanding the relationship between the Continental Enlightenment, as it was lived in the clubs, societies, and lodges of the eighteenth century, and the outbreak of the democratic revolutions in the late 1780s in Amsterdam, Brussels, and most important, Paris." She believes that if readers can look past the paranoia within the text, it can provide information about how Freemasons were treated during the Revolution. Jacob also sees value in the text because Barruel argued for a distinction between English Freemasonry and its Continental counterpart. Barruel believed that his allegations against the Continental Freemasons did not apply to the respectable English Freemasons. The activities of the English Freemasons were not the cause for concern.


    Despite the initial popularity of the book, Barruel's contemporaries soon rejected his book.



    The same is also true for:


    In England, the Scottish scientist John Robison published Proofs of a Conspiracy against All the Religions and Governments of Europe, carried on in the Secret Meetings of the Free Masons, Illuminati, and Reading Societies.


    The two writers had many similarities in their arguments and conclusions and their books spawned an anti-Enlightenment and anti-revolution discussion that was constructed on the same theses.


    Exactly. A thesis was constructed. That would be a lot more obvious if it were linked to the American Anti-Masonic Party:



    It was active from the late 1820s, especially in the Northeast, and later attempted to become a major party by expanding its platform to take positions on other issues. It declined quickly after 1832 as most members joined the new Whig Party; it disappeared after 1838.


    It is this which Nesta Webster was "reviving". She continues the creed about the superiority of English Freemasonry, and this would be more obvious if there was simply a link to Nesta Webster:


    Nesta Helen Webster (née Bevan, 24 August 1876 – 16 May 1960) was an English author who revived conspiracy theories about the Illuminati.

    Prior to World War II, Webster was involved in Fascist political groups in the United Kingdom.


    She became influential around this time:


    The French Revolution: A Study in Democracy. London: Constable & Co. (1919).


    Winston Churchill praised her in a 1920 article...


    They have practically the same belief as Hitler in "Judeo-Masonic Conspiracy Theory".

    The most sober response I have seen was that Minister of Propaganda, Hermann Goering, on that same "Protocols of the Elders of Zion" sacred to these people, that, it was "true in character but not in fact".

    She had to "revive" the Illuminati idea, because governments at the time ceased caring about them, and were terrified of Thomas Paine. The Illuminati were a non-issue as soon as they were suppressed.


    That summarizes this school of thought. One would not argue there are not some facts which cast some Jews and Masons in an unfavorable light that they probably deserve. But the way this has been done is pretty much one-sided, the English are paragons of virtue and others are to blame for all our problems.


    As we have said, English Freemasonry is, itself, artificial, and much more of a Jesuit tool than surface appearances would suggest. Who is the first one to amplify this...a Jesuit...

    Moreover, we found Memoirs written in response to a prior publication which had argued against them.


    Moreover, if we go from Wikipedia, we are going to go into all these cognitive dissonances and questions on how to validate reality and so on, as if we are taking a psychology course. That may be part of how things work, but, it does not explain the divergence of two sides. Citing Voltaire as the worst:


    His tactic was to cite document after document with a commentary that effectively showed it was the truth. The reader of the Memoirs could have been any individual who doubted some of Barruel's inferences, but who would eventually be overwhelmed by the sheer weight of evidence against the Enlightenment and liberation movements. His fanatical hatred for revolutionary and enlightenment ideas is hidden behind a faux neutrality and casuistic slight of pen. By isolating single passages and quoting them out of context, Barruel presented what seemed to be a convincing case. He made up for quality with quantity and persuaded a number of contemporaries to adopt his view. The Memoirs is constructed according to reason and Barruel attempts to use the Enlightenment's own tool to bring about its demise.


    whereas the guy who penned the words "conspiracy theory":


    He used it to refer to claims that British aristocrats were intentionally weakening the United States during the American Civil War in order to advance their financial interests.



    which might of course have something to do with Cromwell and the Bank of England.

    It really is British supremacy versus everything else.


    We also have a thread for the close successor, Occult Theocrasy.


    Unfortunately, it is so riddled with inaccuracies that you cannot even begin to read these materials. These days it will be prefaced by HPB was a Mason. But as we know, she was not part of any Lodge, and was simply given an honorary certificate due to her knowledge. Then we will be told her successor was Annie Besant. Yes, in terms of management of an organization, but not at all in terms of school of thought. This can be easily shown by the few who boiled down to United Lodge of Theosophy, around the time of Nesta Webster.

    It is a huge backdoor influence on America, viz. John Birch Society for example. The idea as a whole has adherents who probably have no idea how this information was developed.

    They hate above all Alice Bailey, who is like a Jesuit reprise over the fact that 1800s Jesuitry fomented this kind of American Nationalism, and, like anyone else, the country is supposed to be brought into the "international fold".

    This is visible because we can find that around the times of original Theosophy or ca. 1890, some American Jesuits developed a new strategy. Rather than the grim Army of Catholicism, they reasoned they could maintain influence over anyone who believed in a "weak, watered-down Jesus". It may have been something like Navaho Jesus to begin with, and obviously it could morph into whatever it needs to.

    That is where Alice Bailey comes in, although she is not Catholic, the summum bonum of her Externalization of the Hierarchy is the return of Jesus as Pope.

    Alice Bailey never mentions the Jesuits. She does, however, several times emphasize the Zionists as the main world problem. Not excusing their behavior, we are categorizing them as "useful tools".

    She praises a small number of right-minded men for bringing the United Nations to be, and we found out what this means was machinations of coups in South America. When we get down to the core determinants of how this works, it does not sound like a hierarchy I would want to externalize. On paper, some of the core principles, sure, just not some of the people who are actually doing it. Sort of like the U. S. Constitution.

    During this time, we are aware that the Jesuit order or Catholic Church cares less and less about membership and donations, since they own more and more schools and hospitals and sports teams.

    The modern Capitalism through the United Nations is a lot more finely-crafted than the ham-fistedness of Anti-Masonry, which is, to an extent, related, but they both wind up offering us two voices of fascism.

    Watered-down Jesus serves two roles. After the inevitable societal collapse, one is supposed to turn to Rome for salvation. Secondly, it allows one to reach for whatever is out there, which means there is very little chance it would be Orthodoxy.


    Bailey's standing with Theosophy is such that she eventually entered what was called "Back to Blavatsky" for about a year. While in India, she applied to, but did not get answered by:

    Suddha Dharma Mandalam


    which in its own words is this Hierarchy:


    Suddha Dharma Mandalam (SDM) is name of an ancient Hierarchy which watches over the evolutionary progress of the Humanity.


    David Reigle finds it to be a fairly accurate mix of Vedism and The Secret Doctrine. And that some of its members joined Bailey's Arcane School.

    He also knows that HPB said there would not be anything "more" than The Secret Doctrine from her sources until 1975.


    This was concurrent with the false Maitreya who of course walked out of the role he had been cast in. What Bailey claims is that Maitreya is Christ, the spirit that "overshadows" Jesus. You don't get Jesus and the Apostles, he is with similar variations of other actual people.

    Any of that would constitute "a new order of priestcraft" as described by the Mahatmas. I do not really think there was a 1975 sequel because humanity for the most part did not "stick to the original". HPB warned something about "Hindu Jesuits" and SDM was a type of fiat dictation after she was gone.

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    Going to pack something else in here, which seems to keep slipping through the cracks.


    Whereas HPB was an open book, Alice and Foster Bailey are virtual unknowns on a personal level, minus what we are given in Autobiography.

    Following through the post above, it only takes a few synoptical bullet points from Wikipedia to expose whatever the reality is behind what she claimed to be the sacred founders of the U. N.

    It happened on the heels of a near-fascist coup against FDR--the one whose "big players" were never interrogated, or even re-published as suspicious characters...Charles Lindbergh, Henry Ford, and their kind. The main foundation accused of harboring such antics is the American Legion.


    We can import a few points from this post:


    Stalin accepted the UN because of the veto, Khruschev asked to join NATO and stunned the audience to silence, and then we found that Kissinger and Helms *blocked* Clinton's 1990s proposal, which would have given Russia a veto influence on NATO expansions--they were relegated to think tanks and dialogues.


    The main lever in finalizing the UN plans, Rockefeller was bringing "Nazi Argentina" into the fold via Dumbarton Oaks:


    Schlesinger noted that although Nelson Rockefeller did not have an official role in the conference, he asked the FBI that he would be the one who passed reports to Stettinius. The FBI indeed passed all reports to Rockefeller. Schlesinger also explains how the UN logo was designed in a way to exclude Argentina for its friendship with Nazi Germany. Rockefeller insisted that Argentina, despite its pro-fascist government, must be allowed to join the UN. Rockefeller had the Latin American delegations on his side, a relationship that angered Nicolo Tucci, the head of the Bureau of Latin American Research in the US State Department, who resigned, declaring that ‘my bureau was supposed to undo the Nazi and Fascist propaganda in South America but Rockefeller is inviting the worst fascists and Nazis to Washington.


    While Washington was aiming at the creation of a world body, Rockefeller was pressuring the conference to accept the Chapultepec Pact:


    Therefore, the conference adopted a formal resolution called the Act of Chapultepec which proclaimed the principle of collective self-defense through regional pacts. This policy was adopted by the United Nations and Article 51 of the UN charter, which authorized regional security arrangements.

    A few years later, Schlesinger documents, at a dinner with Rockefeller, Dulles said: "I owe you an apology. If you fellows hadn't done it, we might never have had NATO."


    Chapultepec was soon ratified as a Treaty, becoming similar to NATO of South America, although it has sometimes been defied, and has started falling apart as noted here, such as Mexico being the first to withdraw from the Rio Treaty around 2004.


    So the main design originates from whatever Rockefeller was doing in Argentina. This exact thing is the substrate for UN defense pacts, and then for the whole NATO, which is nothing other than such a pact. America rapidly changed its tune to the Truman Doctrine of anti-Communism, which of course sits comfortably with the British Russophobia from the 1700s. Irony being the British hand in the new Communism replacing the traditional Russian Tsars; everything being a way to beat down any kind of country in the area.

    Getting rid of the U. S. S. R. put the liberated Russia into a western economic scheme of "shock therapy", which was regressive, and only by beginning to purge Atlanticists in the 2000s was Russia able to get back on its feet.






    Going back to Stone Age relics, the other day was an announcement which, like Dwarka, does not seem to mesh with the timelines for submergence:


    The submerged ruins of a 7,000-year-old road have been found, linking an ancient artificial landmass to a Croatian island.
    Archaeologists have made a fascinating discovery in the waters off the Croatian island of Korčula: an ancient road tied to the lost maritime culture known as the Hvar, who inhabited the region during the Neolithic Era.

    Numerous underwater Hvar ruins and artifacts have already been uncovered, including a settlement built on an artificial island.

    One such site is a cave in the nearby town of Vela Luka, which has been continuously occupied for at least 19,000 years by various cultures, including the Hvar.



    Okay. A cave is not a city, so, it is not quite on par with Aleppo. The Hvar occupation still fits what we found to be the age of Balochistan, however, there is no mention of lapis lazuli as these sites. It also appears to fit the time of the "Pelasgians". A corresponding quote is found in a thesis from Vuljevic 2020 on Balkan racial statecraft:



    ...the Pelasgians in Hvar...


    which is a criticism of dumping them in with Slavs and Illyrians to formulate a "Balkan identity" or something.

    There is a bit more evidence about them cited in Ancient Languages:


    On the Adriatic coast some sites on the island of
    Hvar have been excavated, and a peculiar form of Neolithic culture
    has been discovered there. Another type has been found in Istria
    and in a part of what today is Slovenia. All the sites belong to
    agricultural communities whose idols testify to the cult of a mother-
    goddess and the worship of female fertility.

    About 2000 B.C. all these Neolithic cultures came to a catastro-
    phic end in the cataclysm of a big migration from the east. This was
    an extensive population shift which originated in the Euro-Asian
    steppes and penetrated the whole of South-Eastern Europe. In its
    last phase, this migration reached the North-Western Balkans and
    destroyed the Neolithic culture of that area. In its course a series
    of new elements of material culture were brought to the region.
    The most important ones are: pottery ornamented by strings
    ( Schniirkeramik ), long flint knives, and battle axes. The grave
    mounds that appear in the interior then link the new-comers with
    the kurgan-graves of the Euro-Asian steppe.



    Hvar is the island which the Greeks call Pharos.

    Given the time frame, in turn, that matches the "great drought", and signifies that the later Hindu kingdom of Aleppo was probably not some isolated incident. The Kurgan culture is not, itself, exactly Hindu, although the two are though to be related.

    Because the oldest known "fertility goddess" is a lapis lazuli piece from Catal Huyuk, it seems to imply that other places such as Hvar were copyists in local stone, maybe they were not as wealthy or well-connected as the sites in mainland Anatolia.



    Similar to "Celtic", Illyrian appears to be a Greek term for the rivals northwest of Macedonia:


    ...at least six material cultures have been described to have emerged in Illyrian territories.

    ...the substantial evidence of Minoan and Mycenaean contact in the valley where the Illyrioi/Illyrii presumably lived.

    The Illyrians emerged from the fusion of PIE-descended Yamnaya-related (Kurgan) population movements ca. 2500 BCE in the Balkans with the pre-existing Balkan Neolithic population...


    I am not sure we get anything very conclusive from that, other than if a road may be 7,000 years old, that does not tell us when it was submerged. It would be considerably after the end of the Ice Age. You would have to assert they built ruins underwater. Kind of contradictory. I don't know where you get more liquid water unless you melt ice.

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    So we have a few posts above about "splitting into sides", where it is easily shown that AB was not well-grounded in original Theosophy, got mixed in with a 1905-ish declaration about spiritual world government, somehow attached her beliefs into the formation of the United Nations, and promoted a false Maitreya.


    Right now we will go back and recover HPB and how it is far more likely that she was involved with the real Maitreya--which although true he is considered the "future Buddha", this is far less significant than him as simply a teacher of Yoga Sastra, a paragon of explanation about how Mahayana Buddhism works in the Sutras. However, part of the trouble with HPB is the difficult mish-mash of how Buddhism relates to "other religions" and how these may be united by a common language of symbolism, and that although she may have been expert in a lot of topics, her information about Buddhism is in some ways incomplete.



    One of the first aspects of unity between Greek/Roman mythology and Buddhism--which is supported by the Mahatmas--is about the One Life:



    Cupid, the god, is the seventh principle or the Brahm of the Vedantin, and Psyche is its vehicle, the sixth or spiritual soul. As soon as she feels herself distinct from her “consort”—and sees him—she loses him. Study the “Heresy of Individuality”—and you will understand.


    Cupid or Eros is equivalent to Amitabha, or, Amida, which she actually says is Senzar for Adi Buddha.



    Senzar was investigated by John Algeo:

    Quote H.P.B. twice states a relationship between Senzar and hieroglyphics — a difficult statement to understand in view of her earlier linkage of Senzar and Sanskrit, since it and Egyptian have no known affinity.

    [Some Russian linguists have proposed a linkage between Hamito-Semitic (which includes Egyptian) and Indo-European (which includes Sanskrit) in a hypothetical Nostratic language family; however, this theory is generally regarded as speculative. In any case, Blavatsky seems to be talking more about writing systems than about language proper in the passage cited above.]

    H.P.B. must have known those simple facts. It is difficult to imagine that she did not, and therefore she must have meant something other than a simple etymology by her statement.

    She says that the writing on the Kumbum tree is

    in the Sansar (or language of the Sun) characters (ancient Sanskrit); and that the sacred tree, in its various parts, contains in extenso the whole history of the creation, and in substance the sacred books of Buddhism. In this respect, it bears the same relation to Buddhism as the pictures in the Temple of Dendera, in Egypt, do to the ancient faith of the Pharaohs.



    I am not sure what to make of that, or which "sacred books" she has in mind, but we can give her a grain of salt since there were no published catalogues, or even standardized spellings. There were six or seven European books on Buddhism, which she was kind of forced into using as sources, while nefariously turning against some of the things that were being said in them. But now we can easily see the vast majority of original sources. When you have the source, it is additional work to try to re-symbolize it as something else such as in that Tree.




    HPB's Voice of the Silence is something she claimed to have summarized from the Buddhist disciples' "Book of the Golden Precepts". We found it re-printed in an altered way by Ms. Besant, and then Alice Cleather worked with the next Panchen Lama to restore it. This Panchen said his predecessor knew HPB very well.

    Nobody knew anything about her "Golden Precepts" until:


    A Catholic
    priest from India said that he, with the help of a
    Tibetan Lama, had compared the original (apparently Tibetan) of The Voice of the Silence, the “Book
    of the Golden Precepts,” with Blavatsky’s English
    translation, in the town of Kalimpong (north India)
    around 1950. The statement is found in his book,
    Cosmic Ecumenism via Hindu-Buddhist Catholicism: An Autobiography of an Indian Dominican
    Monk, by Anthony Elenjimittam (Alias Bhikshu Ishabodh Anand), Bombay: Aquinas Publications, p.270.



    This in turn was pursued by David Reigle at Tongsa
    Gompa:


    The older monk said
    that when he was a child he had seen Lama Tinley
    and another man, presumably Anthony Elenjimittam, there at Bhutan Monastery in Kalimpong.
    Lama Tinley, I was given to understand, did not
    belong to this monastery, but was from Bhutan, and
    went back to Bhutan some time after meeting Elenjimittam.


    Accurate according to his biography:


    In 1949, he received the Buddhist habit with the name Bhikshu Ishabodananda which means "Mendicant Monk whose Beatitude is Isha Bhod (Jesus and Buddha)".



    So what they are talking about is the Drukpa monastery and a Bhutanese individual. Druk pa is literally the namesake for Bhutan, Land of the Thunder Dragon, and the facility was built in Sikkhim in 1692. It may, physically, have been using Tibetan books or Tibetan script, but Thongsa Gompa was built by the Drukpa, demolished by the Gorkhas in the 1800s, and restored by the Nyima order.




    HPB does not fully understand Tson kha pa:


    It is with Him that began the regular system of Lamaic incarnations of Buddhas...


    because this was done by H. H. Karmapa.


    The point is that Tson kha pa cannot possibly provide anything original. All he has is a mixture of Kadam (Atisha's order) and Kagyu (Manjushri and Chakrasamvara), centuries after these formed. His strength was in being able to visit multiple locations in Tibet, and thereby perhaps making the first compound analysis of the entire volume of Tibetan Buddhist literature. If it was desired to be said that he begins a reincarnating line of a particular form of Avalokiteshvara, I think you could say that. I think he was a high caliber individual and could only criticize him on a few points.

    The first Panchen Lama was the Fourth, in exactly the same way with the Dalai Lama, they are saying they are tulkus of their predecessors, the Panchen tracing himself to a disciple of Tson kha pa.

    The Mahatmas said one of the few things that Europeans understood correctly was the Dalai and Panchen Lamas are tulkus of Amitabha and Avalokiteshvara.



    In this article she goes on to:


    “Amida” is the Senzar form of “Âdi”; “Âdi-Buddhi” and “Âdi-Buddha,”


    There is a great difference between the popular Od—pag-med (Amitâbha) who sits enthroned in Devachan (Sukhâvatî), according to the Mani Kah-’bum Scriptures—the oldest historical work in Tibet, and the philosophical abstraction called Amita-Buddha, the name being passed now to the earthly Buddha, Gautama.

    The Chinese Amitâbha (Wu-liang-sheu) and the Tibetan Amitâbha (Od-pag-med) have now become personal Gods, ruling over and living in the celestial region of Sukhâvatî, or Tu****a (Tibetan: Devachan); while Âdi-Buddhi, of the philosophic Hindu, and Amita-Buddha of the philosophic Chinese and Tibetan, are names for universal, primeval ideas.



    Elsewhere she refers the Amitabha Sutras to the principle of white light able to form a spectrum. And I have no idea about differentiating Sukhavati from universal ideas. I am not sure she has any theological point here. She says similar things about Parasol. Any of these forms are automatically tied to whatever ideas she means.


    Asserting that Tson kha pa's school dispersed a new wave of Lohans in China, she then refers to what we would call Manjushri:



    Quote They had been already preceded by other Lohans...The world-famous disciples of Tathâgata, called the “sweet-voiced” on account of their ability to chant the Mantras with magical effect.


    The first ones came from Kashmir in the year 3,000 of Kali-Yuga (about a century before the Christian era), while the last ones arrived at the end of the fourteenth century, 1,500 years later; and, finding no room for themselves at the lamasery of Yihigching, they built for their own use the largest monastery of all on the sacred island of Pu-to (Buddha, or Put, in Chinese), in the province of Chusan.

    The chanting of a Mantra is not a prayer, but rather a magical sentence in which the law of Occult causation connects itself with, and depends on, the will and acts of its singer. It is a succession of Sanskrit sounds, and when its string of words and sentences is pronounced according to the magical formulae in the Atharva-Veda, but understood by the few, some Mantras produce an instantaneous and very wonderful effect.

    But there existed, and still exists to this day, a Word far surpassing the mysterious monosyllable, and which renders him who comes into possession of its key nearly the equal of Brahman. The Brahmâtmâs alone possess this key, and we know that to this day there are two great Initiates in Southern India who possess it. It can be passed only at death, for it is the “Lost Word.” No torture, no human power, could force its disclosure by a Brâhman who knows it; and it is well guarded in Tibet.

    Yet this secrecy and this profound mystery are indeed disheartening, since they alone—the Initiates of India and Tibet —could thoroughly dissipate the thick mists hanging over the history of Occultism, and force its claims to be recognized.



    That is roughly correct, Buddhist devotees may have entered China as early as she claims, and the translating of manuscripts can be shown to begin in the late 100s, which is simply known as Han Buddhism. They do not really suggest the practice of mantras until about the 300s. If we will agree with her that from this moment going forward, there was indeed a proliferation of mantra systems that happened to include China, that is just a reflection of what was taking place in India.



    Some of the few European Theosophists who tried to authentically enter Buddhism include Mme. David-Neel, W. Y. Evans-Wentz, and Lama Anagarika Govinda--who had a hand in the fascinating system we posted as White Conch. This concerns a tulku who was trained at Tashi Lhunpo from 1874-1894, the same time that HPB was present.



    David Reigle arranged a newer translation of Voice of the Silence by this tulku, Geshe Lozang Jamspal, who, according to Sylvia Cranston, "During the course of the visit the Muratores showed him The Voice of the Silence, directing his attention especially to the notes. The effect was electrifying. He confessed amazement that such information was available in the West. As to HPB, he said, “She must be a bodhisattva“.”"







    Comparison of translations of this stanza.


    Here is a special Lotus Crown he has helped with, which starts with Manjuvajra.

    He also worked with Robert Thurman on Maitreya's Mahayanasutralamkara.

    In their discussion, they refer to an unknown "Darba Tulku", which should likely be Thar Pa, i. e. Tharpa Choling, which is in Kalimpong. The current Tulku appears to be a successful move to thwart the Dorje Shugden or "Tibetan nationalist protector" movement, which is supported by the Chinese government to weaken Lhasa.

    One could call Kalimpong a British-developed ethnic melting pot, also widely accepted as receiving rare texts in wake of the Chinese invasion at Zangdokpalri. The Roerichs lived here, Lama Kazi Samdup was born here (translator for Evans-Wentz and David-Neel), HPB stayed here at Ghum, which is under the same tulku; the Darjeeling patron personally gave Rinpoche the Ghum retreat house (year unknown). The modern practitioner Sangharaksita was here and in "In the Sign of the Golden Wheel" he mentions having to go to Maitri Bhavan, Bangalore, to study even rarer texts. This was in fact the local ULT center, the residence of B. P. and Sophia Wadia, with whom he became great friends. They heavily focused on Buddhism in relation to what HPB said, and Sophia spoke of taking police protection in Argentina due to the Jesuits.

    If Wadia was not successful with Dion Fortune or others in England, here we finally find the English person (Sangharaksita) who tried to pursue Buddhism in its own light. He went to Kalimpong in 1950 and was friends with Lama Anagarika Govinda (German), who had met the same tulku. From here you have the modern public domain.

    The tulku in question is Shariputra or the student in the Heart Sutra. His nineteenth century body (1866-1936) was discarded but continues to meditate posthumously:







    His embalming was a rare honor as he was seen as a southern Tson kha pa. He was not only spreading Gelug monasteries around the trans-Himalaya but was also doing so with the Ghantapada lineage of Demchog or Chakrasamvara-Vajravarahi tantra, which is what they got from the Kagyu order. Sikkhim is a bit complicated, since it has Drukpa and Nyingma strata, then it would be correct at the modernized Kalimpong from the ca. 1900s that it is a Gelugpa project from someone who must have had twenty solid years of what HPB was slightly introduced to. And then speaking as a Kagyu practitioner this means I hold Ghantapa in a pretty high regard, like Maitreya, which is grounds to hold their feet to the fire and make sure they are doing it in an appropriate way. When seeing other Gelug machinations such as Shugden and Pabonkha, I think it is not, while I think the system being developed here is probably closer.



    On his order, Govinda founded Arya Maitreya Mandala in 1933. I cannot speak for them and the list of Govinda's works appears to be a kind of philosophical overview.


    His next body created Dungkar Gonpa Society, and he has since passed to a new one. This went to New York 1976 and I have seen materials published by some of its branches, and I think they are better versions than the similar Pabonkha ones.



    For about a year in 1887, Col. Olcott attempted to use Papus to transmit what they called Kiato Buddhism, which refers to a town in Himachal Pradesh represented by the purple pin. It never happened, but, it does appear to match "Trans-Himalayan Buddhism", which I think we have adequate records about, where for example we can find that the original Djual Kul was "a tall Hindu", and there is no real statement about his eventual destiny.


    Rather than the Theosophical Society itself, the actual successors to the Founders of Theosophy were Indians who were taken to Tibet:


    The Chohan gave orders that the young Tyotirmoy -- a lad of 14, the son of Babu Nobin Banerjee whom you know -- should be accepted as a pupil in one of our lamaseries near Chamto-Dong about 100 miles off Tchigadze, and his sister, a virgin Yoginn of 18, at the female monastery of Palli.



    It almost certainly means Galden Jampaling near Chamdo, a Tson Khapa Maitreya (Jampa) temple, almost to Sichuan, where the weird C. A. Muses Tson Khapa text is from. Article does not mention the infamous "Black rock of death" near there, which I think over twenty people have perished attempting to climb.

    Esoteric Teachings of Tibetan Tantra on Sacred Texts does not sound like typical Tson kha pa, and it does in fact look like he got it off the walls of the Maitreya Gompa in Mustang, Nepal, which has been used by Brown University to study neurological symptoms or effects of mantra practice.


    Jampa Lhakang:


    ...contains the world's largest collection of mandalas painted on its walls. The earthquake of April 2015 severely damaged these paintings and 500-year-old frescos of the floors.



    I am not sure about the neurological research, but Brown has posted their project on Buddhist Temple Art, and anyone can go to their identification of Mustang Maitreya Temple
    Mandalas and easily see how it is basically the same as in Muse's text.

    Arguably, the temple itself may be slightly younger than Tsonkhapa, but the contents are identical.


    Navin Kumar Gallery 2019 gives another close look there based around:


    One 15th example from the Ngor monastery places all remaining mandalas outside of the main mandala, following the depiction found in the murals of the Sarvadurgati Parisodana mandala at Jampa Gompa...


    In other words, the Manjushri sequence copied by Tsonkhapa is from this much greater array, such as a vast exposition of Sarvadurgati Parishodhana Tantra, that was also transferred to Ngor.


    It is all pretty easy to understand, although I am not sure that is what Theosophy or White Conch are talking about, yet. The Nepalese variety has not drifted around other countries and languages, nothing has happened to it.


    The more accurate way to understand it, is that Maitreya commented the prior Sutras to explain how Mahayana Buddhism should be practiced, and, these later mandala systems are the application of what he said, developed by following his teachings. This is not represented in any system other than its own, i. e., it is not possible to take some extraneous opinion of Maitreya and adjust it to something that is not present here. You can go through the thing and you will never find eschatology or anything like him as a messiah taking over India or anything like that. It is nothing but a discipline.

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    After expressing dissatisfaction several times in the use of "dimension" for different realms of being, since it expresses distance, a line, only, and that its first clear use in an extrapolated way was by H. G. Wells, it struck me that the word "plane" might seem equally objectionable due to sounding like a square or surface, as it is in geometry. So this is where we get Plane of existence:


    However the original source of the word plane in this context is the late Neoplatonist Proclus, who refers to to platos, "breadth", which was the equivalent of the 19th-century theosophical use. An example is the phrase en to psychiko platei.



    Not being sure if this is irony or redundancy, it is obviously a play on Plato.


    Quite similarly to Buddhism, for Proclus:


    One challenge with determining Proclus' specific doctrines is that the Neoplatonists of his time did not consider themselves innovators; they believed themselves to be the transmitters of the correct interpretations of Plato himself.

    Proclus, like Plotinus and many of the other Neoplatonists, agreed on the three hypostases of Neoplatonism: The One (hen), The Intellect (nous) and The Soul (psyche).

    The particular characteristic of Proclus's system is his elaboration of a level of individual ones, called henads, between the One which is before being and intelligible divinity. The henads exist "superabundantly", also beyond being, but they stand at the head of chains of causation (seirai) and in some manner give to these chains their particular character. He identifies them with the Greek gods, so one henad might be Apollo and be the cause of all things apollonian, while another might be Helios and be the cause of all sunny things. Each henad participates in every other henad, according to its character. What appears to be multiplicity is not multiplicity at all, because any henad may rightly be considered the center of the polycentric system. According to Proclus, philosophy is the activity which can liberate the soul from a subjection to bodily passions, remind it of its origin in Soul, Intellect, and the One, and prepare it not only to ascend to the higher levels while still in this life, but to avoid falling immediately back into a new body after death. Because the soul's attention, while inhabiting a body, is turned so far away from its origin in the intelligible world, Proclus thinks that we need to make use of bodily reminders of our spiritual origin. In this he agrees with the doctrines of theurgy put forward by Iamblichus. Theurgy is possible because the powers of the gods (the henads) extend through their series of causation even down to the material world. And by certain power-laden words, acts, and objects, the soul can be drawn back up the series, so to speak. Proclus himself was a devotee of many of the religions in Athens, considering that the power of the gods could be present in these various approaches.

    Proclus exerted a great deal of influence on Medieval philosophy, though largely indirectly, through the works of the commentator Pseudo-Dionysius the Areopagite. This late-5th- or early-6th-century Christian Greek author wrote under the pseudonym Dionysius the Areopagite, the figure converted by St. Paul in Athens. Because of this fiction, his writings were taken to have almost apostolic authority. He is an original Christian writer, and in his works can be found a great number of Proclus's metaphysical principles.



    Is "platos" anywhere in the Bible used in this sense? Only perhaps one time, in Ephesians 3: 18, which is there in a handy inter-linear format with Romanized and original Greek. This is hard to find! That is a very good tool as most other sources just give you the script.


    It is a mystical statement about how the heart must be filled with love to know the breadth, length, height, and depth. This is a little unusual, in that it is saying breadth first, and height and depth are different poles of the same dimension. It does not say this is "of something", such as a few other instances you find the platos or breadth of a country; here, it describes an abstract volume to be occupied by qualities.

    That way you will be filled with Pan Pleroma of Theou.

    Where does he inhabit? ouranois

    And what is something of his you are trying to get? ploutos

    What do the English always call "the church"? ekklēsias

    And "the Lord"? Kyriō


    That is a huge mistake since Ecclesia is "an Assembly", not a church.

    Paul is trying to convert Gentiles, while referring to himself as a prisoner and servant. He has a certain value of freedom, while being a slave, very similar to "Muslim".

    Pluto seems to be one of the only things you are trying to "get", nearly the same as Sanskrit Nidhana.

    Although we are told it is "Sky", Ouranois is cognate to:


    Sanskrit varṣá 'rain', Hittite ṷarša- 'fog, mist'


    Being very primeval in the emanations, he is similar to Varuna, although rain would be Parjanya.


    The number of Greek mythic variations make the Puranas look simple, but we can find an instance of Fertilizing Rains of Heaven:



    Aeschylus, Fragment 25 Danaides (from Athenaeus, Deipnosophists xiii. 73. 600B) (trans. Weir Smyth) (Greek tragedy C5th B.C.) :

    "The holy Heaven (ouranos) yearns to wound the Earth (khthon) [i.e. Gaia], and yearning layeth hold on the earth to join in wedlock; the rain, fallen from the amorous heaven, impregnates the earth, and it bringeth forth for mankind the food of flocks and herds and Demeter's gifts [i.e. grain]; and from that moist marriage-rite the woods put on their bloom. Of all these things I [Aphrodite, goddess of procreation] am the cause."


    The Father's plane is Ouranos. One can deal with that, it is not too troubling, however there are great variances for the title Kyrios:


    The Gospel of John seldom uses kyrios to refer to Jesus during his ministry, but does so after the Resurrection, although the vocative kyrie (meaning sir) appears frequently. The Gospel of Mark never applies the term kyrios as a direct reference to Jesus, unlike Paul who uses it 163 times. When Mark uses kyrios (e.g., in 1:3, 11:9, 12:11, etc.) it is in reference to YHWH/God. Mark does, however, use the word in passages where it is unclear whether it applies to God or Jesus, e.g., in 5:19 or 11:3.

    Kyrios is a key element of the Christology of Apostle Paul.


    For the Septuagint, the Greek translation of the Old Testament, wherever YHVH is written, Jews said "Adonai":

    ...which was thus translated into Greek from 3rd century CE onwards in each instance as kyrios and theos.


    Kyrios Theos would refer to the Father, whereas, especially for Paul, Kyrios on its own refers to Jesus.


    And then Aramaic Mari--which is how Jesus was personally addressed:

    In everyday Aramaic, Mari was a very respectful form of polite address, well above "teacher" and similar to rabbi. In Greek this has at times been translated as kyrios. While the term Mari expressed the relationship between Jesus and his disciples during his life, Christians eventually came to interpret the Greek kyrios as representing lordship over the world.





    Paul could perhaps be taken out of context when he explains the New Covenant in 2 Corinthians 3, where that which originally inscribes letters in the human heart is:

    Pneumati Theou

    and it is towards the end that the "lifting of the veil" is done by Christ, and it is at the time of this action:

    Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. 18 And we all, who with unveiled faces contemplate the Lord’s glory, are being transformed into his image with ever-increasing glory, which comes from the Lord, who is the Spirit.


    Or, one is being "metamorphosed from glory to glory".

    Without really considering the whole epistle, you could clip the ending and say that the Spirit is Jesus, or that the Spirit proceeds from Jesus, but this is more like a transfer of the Spirit of Theou into the transformative action, not a postulate of equating Spirit to Jesus. It is "at that time", as in "now", when the process happens, not permanently or a priori, as is the case at the beginning of the epistle.

    Theosophy says:


    Theos, Theoi (Greek) [from theein to run, in reference to the planetary deities who perform the formative work in cosmic evolution]


    And predictably you will hit a dead end, there is no Greek etymology of "theos" or Sanskrit or IE cognates in almost any source, however this derivation is exactly as kept by the Orthodox as a quote from Plato.


    For the deity, Jesus only said "Abba", until on the cross, El (the term Eli is possessive, i. e. "my El").

    Similarly, Mari is "my Mar", something like "my lord" as a respectful saying, although in Jewish history:


    In the Palestinian schools "Mari" and "Rabbi" were customarily employed in addressing the sages.

    Jesus was addressed by his disciples both as "Mari" and as "Rabbi".


    Mar is given to all saints in Eastern Christianity, and has various Christian applications such as in Aramaic, reflexively to the "lord" YHVH, but later Christian developments do not reflect the background of being in a predominantly Jewish area as Jesus was.

    There is absolutely nothing that suggests he had a "God" which was different than the Jewish or Phoenician, he could not possibly have used that term, there would not have been anything unusual in calling himself the Son of the Father or of El, but it would be to combine this with Son of Man. Then, perhaps, the method of commune at least as described by Paul was perhaps different from other trends of the time. At least he speaks to what we call the Heart Doctrine.

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    Here is a dreadful example of what it is like to pretend to be a Zionist, as if expecting someone to give you back land from your ancestors thousands of years past because they were unfairly overwhelmed. This is with the disadvantage of lacking a Bible or Torah to even attempt to prove anything.


    It is relevant to Gaul, generally. More specifically to Lisieux, whose "tribal name" until recent additions looks like Law of the Egg, Lexovii:

    Gaulish: *Lexsouioi, 'the leaning, lame'

    Lēxooúioi (Ληξοούιοι) by Strabo

    It is a derivative of the adjective *leksu- ('oblique'; cf. Greek λοξός). An exact parallel has been highlighted in the Welsh llechwedd ('slope'), itself derived from an earlier *lexsouíiā.



    The given interpretation appears to be that of J-P Savignac, Dictionnaire Francais Gaulois:


    Mot déduit du nom des Lexouii, Lixouii, retrouvé dans celui
    de Lisieux (Calvados, ex ciuitate Loxouia, en 614), superpo-
    sable au gall. llechwedd (de *lexouiia « inclinée »), dérivé en
    -io d’un adj. *leksu- issu de la racine i.e. *lek- « courbure »,
    cf. le gr. loksôs et Loxias « L’Oblique », épithète d’Apollon,
    lat. licinus « courbé en arrière » (en parlant des cornes d’une
    vache), v. irl. losc « boiteux ». Les Lexouii étaient donc « les
    Boiteux », hétéro-ethnonyme, c’est-à-dire nom donné à un
    peuple par ses voisins, qui n’est pas nécessairement élogieux.


    He deduces that because the root "Lek" means "curvature", that the neighbors called these people "lame". Would Vercengetorix invite someone like that to join an uprising?


    Well, Gaulish is similar to Coptic. It had no written form. Starting from Marseilles ca. 600 B. C. E., Greek script began to be used for receipts and mundane speech, whereas Druidic tenets were not written, other than perhaps symbolicly. So if we compare the Greek-looking equivalents, it will land on Apollo Lyceus near the Lyceum:

    Its main exemplar is the Apollino in Florence or Apollo Medici, in the Uffizi, Florence.



    This is the design where his left hand rests on a support, and the right hands flops over his head:


    The famous pose with the arm resting on the head was so thoroughly identified with Apollo...


    Which is thought to be originally designed by Praxiteles:


    He was the first to sculpt the nude female form in a life-size statue.


    Roman copy believed to be of the original:







    It is called "Lycean" not after Lycia itself, but after its identification with a lost work described, though not attributed to a sculptor, by Lucian as being on show in the Lyceum...


    And here is what we find in the entry for Lyceum:


    Apollo Lyceus ("Apollo the wolf-god")


    even though they just said:


    Lyceum (Ancient Greek: Λύκειον, romanized: Lykeion)



    There are various statements about "Apollo in wolf form" that we do not actually see iconographically. Why is "wolf god" dominating and cramming other things out of view? So far, I have not come up with anything from the period that deals with this, just relatively modern interpretations. Under "wolf", Lykos or Lukos, there is one whole Apollo, who does not exactly match:


    Lycus, one of the Telchines who fought under Dionysus in his Indian campaign. He is otherwise said to have erected a temple to Apollo Lycius on the banks of Xanthus river.


    Ancient Lycia was Anatolian-speaking Lukka until being over-run by the Achaemenids, having:


    Letoon, an important center in Hellenic times of worship for the goddess Leto and her twin children, Apollo and Artemis...


    Mount Lykaion, Arcadia, *does* have "wolf Zeus", and:


    Assertions as to Apollo having an archaic wolf-form are speculative at best (and likely based on historically contested etymologies).

    The figure of Apollo Lykaios [i. e., at Mt. Lykaion] should not be confused, however, with the famous Apollo Lyceus, the distinctive statue type of the god that was displayed in the Lyceum in Athens where Aristotle taught. This figure is completely unrelated to Apollo Lykaios. Likewise, Lycian Apollo refers to the Apollo cult in the Anatolian kingdom of Lycia, across the Aegean, and not Lykaia.

    Early 20th century excavations at the site had revealed nothing earlier than ca. 700 BCE, but the Greek-American interdisciplinary Mt. Lykaion Excavation and Survey Project excavated a trench and detected ritual presence at the site at the beginning of the third millennium BCE, a thousand years before Zeus was worshiped in Greece. A Late Minoan rock crystal seal bearing the image of a bull was a notable surprise.


    No one said Pan Lykaios was a wolf, or any of the others, whereas even Constantine was Pontifex Maximus of Syrian Sol Invictus, strongly parallel to Ashur of Assyria.




    Going back to Greek references:

    Orphic Hymn 34 to Apollo (trans. Taylor) (Greek hymns C3rd B.C. to 2nd A.D.) :

    Lykoreus (Lycoreus)

    Bakkhion (Bacchian), twofold and divine, power far diffused, and course oblique is thine.


    Later statues of Bacchus copy this form, perhaps due to Apollo's similar epithet.

    In Homer:

    Lykia (Lycia) is yours


    and contrasted to "wolf-born":


    ...unless we take Lukêgenês (Il. iv. 101) in the sense of "born in Lycia," which, however, according to others, would only mean "born of or in light."



    There is an odd translation given by Druide Gaulois:


    lexsoui, rambled


    although these look easy:


    landa, land

    licentious, licentious


    But she does take to task the exaggerated difficulty, beginning similarly to "multiple Henads":


    Quote The sacred language is known to be that which deals with divinities and interacts directly with the heavens. The Gauls thought they were controlled by deities who guided their actions, thinking and a fiortiori words are therefore particular.

    The translated texts have been done by people who wanted deep down even to hide certain annoying things for Christian civilization, it is better to translate them yourself if you want to know the truth.

    I studied the Gallic language a little, which remains closed to many professional researchers and I was able to realize that it was a very codified language.

    The Gauls thought they were controlled by deities who guided their actions, thinking and a fiortiori words are therefore particular.

    But the Gallic language does not come from the old Indo-European language which all the Freemasons advertise, in its great majority this language is of indigenous origin.

    So who will have had enough interests to make it disappear. First of all, the Catholic Church, it was necessary to erase all traces of the Druids and of the true roots. But what's more, the researchers willfully glossed over their most compromising results. There again it is certainly to protect their Catholic culture, their world and their interests. It's understandable, all the great linguists were affiliated with Catholic dogma for nearly two thousand years and all were born into well-to-do circles.

    For the most believing among you, I would add that this Gallic language, in addition to its encrypted construction, has something very different from the Celtic languages, however close, I cannot tell you without betraying its secret that the parallel with special elements is mind boggling. I seriously think it was a sacred language, which no one should know except the druids and the initiates.

    To say that there are several Celtic or Gallic languages is a perfect imposture. And from what I was able to reconstruct, the Gallic language had the same framework everywhere on the territories concerned. The invader wrote that the Gallic peoples spoke in different languages and this is not true. I also noted that Celtic and Gallic are distant even if there are terms in common. That the Indo-European thesis is an immense mistake, many of the connections which are made are perfectly abusive.

    The Gallic language, from which Gallicism comes, is easily cheerful, playful or sly. Example: Daco-uiros: good man, or rather good sex. (A good hit) As opposed to Catholics, I would not say: I "believe" what I see ... but rather: I understand what I hear. Because it is the spiritual world that takes over the physical senses, the invisible is thought.

    I count 20% of clear words of Celtic origin, 20% more generally come from an Indo-European language, around 6o% obviously come from a very old indigenous language. Any attempt at translation using the Roman language is impossible (on the other hand Italian contains a number of usual Gallic words) it ends in failure where at least part of the text is not correct. The roots here belong to a general Gallic language because most of the tribes also used a slang of their own.

    The beginning and the beginning of the "lettering" must be found at the level where the Milky Way intersects the zodiacal belt, in the bull.


    By a similar process, we might conclude that Lexovians are not "lame", but, recognized as followers of that Apollo who is not a wolf, but, present at the academy which gives its name to the Lycee' or French high school.



    Even worse is when we turn to his namesake and purveyor of the Nychthemeron, which we assert is Indian and not Babylonian, Apollonius, who may have visited Taxila.


    Just as a few scratches on the surface, J. Downie:


    In Philostratus’ Life of Apollonius of Tyana, the hero Palamedes appears twice: Apollonius meets him reincarnated among the sages of India, and he later undertakes to restore the hero’s tomb and cult in Asia Minor. These appearances have attracted relatively little attention, and scholars have generally regarded the two scenes as underdeveloped and only loosely connected. In this article I argue that together they mark a turning point in the narrative.


    M. Cobb:


    Similarly, he sought to invert expectations when it came to the presentation of Alexander and the mythic heroes Dionysus and Heracles, as well as India more broadly. In doing so, Philostratus was able to present a utopian land of the Sophoi (within India) grounded in time and space that could ironically act as source of true Hellenism which Apollonius spread to the West (rather than Alexander spreading it to the East).


    G. R. S. Mead:


    It is plainly asserted by the ancient Greeks that Pythagoras went to India, but as the statement is made by Neo-Pythagorean and Neo-Platonic writers subsequent to the time of Apollonius, it is objected that the travels of the Tyanean suggested not only this item in the biography of the great Samian but several others, or even that Apollonius himself in his Life of Pythagoras was father of the rumour.

    Indeed, there are phrases in the oldest treatises of the Trismegistic Hermetic literature which can be so closely paralleled with phrases in the Upaniṣhads and in the Bhagavad Gītā, that one is almost tempted to believe that the writers had some acquaintance with the general contents of these Brāhmanical scriptures.


    In the case of Apollonius, his biography was written about 150 years after him; but there are manuscripts he personally wrote.


    This is a terribly disconcerting argument about to follow.


    Bart Ehrman, a professor of early Gospel variants (e. g. Nag Hammadi), even begins a course by making him sound like Jesus and then revealing the change.

    The fact that even canonical Gospels do not agree leads one to be skeptical:


    There lived a very famous Greek philosopher whose birth and death is uncertain but as per his primary biographer Philostratus the Elder it is 3 BC – 97 AD, in the Roman empire of Tyana. He was a student of Pythagoras, named Apollonius of Tyana.

    But what does the world know his story as? Jesus Christ!

    Well the bad news is that there is no evidence of Jesus birth date or death date even after so many thousands of years, even the earthquake that is mentioned in the Bible when Jesus died is in question. Also 12 years of Jesus are missing in the Bible along with a grave found in Kashmir marked as Hazrat Isa tomb is found. What does all this mean?


    Since Bible is word of God then how can it have variations in the description of a single event?





    The Christian claim of course is that the Gospel stories were written closer to his lifetime than those of Apollonius, and the Epistles of Paul even within about twenty years. And of course the miracles of Jesus were real, especially that he totally died and came back. Most modern scholarship accepts his twenty healings, while the four others such as water into wine, are probably allegorical. Many think the crucifixion was a NDE, and some kind of drugged wine (different in each Gospel) caused sedation and appearance of death.


    From Greek Reporter:


    Apollonius defied the bloodiest tyrants who ever sat on the Roman throne — Nero and his successor, Domitian.

    In the Ancient World, however, the great philosopher had something like 16 temples built in his honor all over the Mediterranean world, and possibly down through Mesopotamia (Babylon-Iraq) and into India.

    Jesus Christ taught his followers that God answers prayers. Apollonius of Tyana believed in a God who was pure intellect and taught his followers that the only way to converse with God was through the intellect. He taught that prayers and sacrifice were useless and that God really did not want to converse with men.

    Philostratus’ biography of Apollonius has many skeptics. Some researchers believe that it was written on the instructions of Empress Julia Domna, the wife of Emperor Septimius Severus and the mother of the bloody tyrant Caracalla.

    They believe that the Empress commissioned the biography by Philostratus in order to counteract the popularity of Christianity. She wanted to strengthen paganism in the Empire and was worried about the threat from the Christians.

    This means that the real figure of Apollonius may have been lost. Philostratus may have misrepresented him in order to turn him into a pagan alternative to Jesus Christ. This appears to have been successful and Apollonius was honored by many, including the Emperors Julian and Aurelian and his image was worshipped in many temples for centuries after his disappearance.


    HPB:


    ...let his hair grow to its full length, as all the Initiates before and after him.

    ...after crossing the Hindu Kush, Apollonius had been directed by a king to the abode of the Sages, whose abode it may be to this day, by whom he was taught unsurpassed knowledge. His dialogues with the Corinthian Menippus indeed give us the esoteric catechism and disclose (when understood) many an important mystery of nature. Apollonius was the friend, correspondent and guest of kings and queens, and no marvellous or “magic” powers are better attested than his. At the end of his long and wonderful life he opened an esoteric school at Ephesus, and died aged almost one hundred years.




    There is even material saying that Apollonius personally authored the things about Jesus, if one is willing to accept the extreme:


    The originals of the four gospels I obtained through one Hiram Ermandi, of Taxila, who took me forward into Farther India. They were written in characters not unlike those used by the Chinese, on thin, tough paper. They treated of the four stages of the life of Buddha. The first to his incarnation and birth, the second to his childhood and youth, the third to his mature life, and the fourth to his old age and death. These books I obtained at Singapore, at the extreme point of India, on the strait between India and Sumatra.

    There can any longer be a question that there was a Gospel of Paul, and that the writer of it was none other than Apollonius of Tyana. This Gospel of Paul was a Samaritan version of the Sanscrit gospel or gospels of Deva Bodhisatoua, obtained at Singapoor by Apollonius, and modified by him in accordance with his philosophic views.

    —It was this Buddhistic gospel of Apollonius that was still further modified by Marcion in the gospel which he took to and preached at Rome.

    — It was still further modified by some writer thirty years afterward, and labelled the Gospel according to St. Luke. The author of the Gospel of Marcion, the Gospel of Luke, and the Pauline epistles being one and the same person, and that person none other than Apollonius of Tyana, the only Apollos or Paulus or Paul that ever had an existence.

    Excerpts taken from the massive Antiquity Unveiled 1892, a spiritualist work.


    That is superficially similar to a recorded Apostle:


    Apparently already well versed in the Scriptures and probably influenced by the teaching of disciples of John the Baptist, Apollon[ius] became known to Paul in Ephesus where Aquila and Priscilla spoke with him and instructed him more accurately in the ways of God (Acts 18:24-28, 19:1-7).

    Summary of his Letters and Books.

    Although it sounds backwards, Marcion Priority still has scholastic proponents in the 2000s.




    Of course, it seems to me that Roman Christianity was never the "right kind", it, too, having a lack of information for some 200 years. It elevates Peter, whom we have strongly questioned with respect to Simon Magus.


    That is the major thesis of H. Davis:


    The gospels are a satire based around a war which took place between the aristocracy of Rome and the Jewish group called the Pharisees. Called the Roman-Jewish War, it began in 66 AD and ended in the year 74 AD. The Pharisees were against slavery and were battling with the Roman/Jewish Piso and Flavian families, but the problems started earlier. The Pharisees had gained support from the Jewish people, taking power away from the family of Herod 'The Great', the Herodian royal family who were related to both the Pisos and the Flavians. These families were losing their power over the people, and the use of force to control them wasn't enough, so a plan was devised. That plan was to subtly undermine the beliefs of the Jewish people, by using the Judaic religion against them, creating a new syncretistic religion which became Christianity, but the plan didn't work during their lifetime," says Henry.


    From his own site:


    The gospels of 'Mark' and 'Matthew' are not written in the first person, i.e., spoken by the author, anywhere in the text. Instead, both narratives are told in the third person. That is why scholars doubt and have concluded that the author is not relating personal experiences.


    He gives six interpolations of "Piso" in the Gospels, and ten in Revelations.

    Website dedicated to Piso forgery.

    Of course, that all has to do with Rome and its imperial struggle between the Saducees and Pharisees, which cannot answer for Eastern Christianity.

    The Gospel of Thomas has no narrative; it is almost completely sayings:


    Several authors argue that when the logia in Thomas do have parallels in the synoptics, the version in Thomas often seems closer to the source.

    In saying 13, Peter and Matthew are depicted as unable to understand the true significance or identity of Jesus.

    According to Meyer, Thomas's saying 17 – "I shall give you what no eye has seen, what no ear has heard and no hand has touched, and what has not come into the human heart" – is strikingly similar to what Paul wrote in 1 Corinthians 2:9, which was itself an allusion to Isaiah 64:4.


    It was condemned by Cyril; scholars speculate that the works were buried in response to a letter from Bishop Athanasius declaring a strict canon of Christian scripture.

    So it does seem to indicate intra-Christian disagreement, which was perhaps resolved in a less-than-satisfactory, authoritarian manner.

    It is possible that the Evangelion or "Gospel of Marcion" existed before he, personally, did, and so the possible appearance of Thomas in Ethiopia, India, and China in the 50s would not be anachronistic in comparison.


    That is all really difficult, and, of course, my sympathies drift towards the view that Holy Spirit is Feminine, which may be acceptable to Gnostics, although it is a much older Jewish teaching. In Greek, "Pneuma" is a neuter expression, compared to Sophia:


    The Hebrew word for spirit, ruah or ruach, literally meaning wind or breath, is in the feminine gender. As an example of usage, Genesis 1:2 speaks of Ruach Elohim, the Spirit of God: “And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.”


    Femininity is also found in Proverbs and Solomon.


    According to HPB, this is not the plural of El:


    ’Elohīm [from ’elōah goddess + īm masculine plural ending] The monotheistic proclivities, not only of the Jews but of Christian translators, have led to this word always being translated as God; yet the word itself is a plural form, nor is it in any sense necessarily a plural of majesty, as suggested by some monotheistic scholars. A correct rendering should denote both masculine and feminine characteristics, such as androgyne divinities...in Talmudic literature, however, the plural is frequently given as ’elohoth, oth being the feminine plural ending.


    That makes perhaps two reasons that the first sentence of Genesis is wrong:

    In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.


    From Masoretic Hebrew, the first sentence was translated from:

    B’râsh ithbara Elôhîm eth hashamayim v’eth h’arets

    However--without breaking any rules, one can get sensible Hebrew by simply moving the very first space:

    B’râsithbara Elôhîm eth hashamayim v’eth h’arets


    This arrangement dispenses with any notion of a "beginning" or a "creation". Instead of "In the beginning God created", it comes out more as "In the source, the androgynous host shaped".

    G. de Purucker puts it:

    “In a host (or multitude), the gods (Elohim) formed themselves into the heavens and the earth. And the earth became ethereal. And darkness upon the face of the ethers. And the ruah (the spirit-soul) of the gods (of Elohim) fluttered or hovered, brooding”


    As per Kabala:


    RVCh, Ruach, Spirit, is feminine, as appears from the following passage of the Sepher Yetzirah: "AChTh RVCh ALHIM ChIIM, Achath (feminine, not Achad, masculine) Ruach Elohim Chiim: "One is She the Spirit of the Elohim of Life."



    Not much further in Genesis, we stumble on the untranslated "Nephilim". This certainly does not work out as "Fallen Angels" if there is no malakim/cherubim/seraphim included with it. It's fairly close to just "fallen (ones, things)" although that would not quite be grammatically correct. It does essentially match Aramaic "Nephilin" meaning "giants", with most of the Aramaic loan-words swapping the final "n" for an "m" as the Hebrew plural.


    Compared to Adonai:


    AHIH (Hebrew) A Qabbalistic form of the tetragrammaton, representing the Macroprosopus, in contradistinction to IHVH (Jehovah), representing Microprosopus.


    As in Kabala Unveiled:


    In Macroprosopus all is light and brilliancy; but Microprosopus only shineth by the reflected splendour of Macroprosopus. The six days of creation correspond to the six forms of Microprosopus. Therefore the symbol of the interlaced triangles, forming the six-pointed star, is called the Sign of the Macrocosm, or of the creation of the greater world, and is consequently analogous to. the two countenances of the Zohar.

    The one is AHIH, Eheieh; the other is the V, Vau, of the Tetragrammaton. The first two letters, I and H, Yod and He, are the father and mother of Microprosopus, and the H final is his bride.


    The permutations of four letters in Kabalism are about as convoluted as some of the Hindu mantra squares.



    To re-capitulate, who is Apollo? we again run in to:

    Lyceus (/laɪˈsiːəs/ ly-SEE-əs; Λύκειος, Lykeios, from Proto-Greek *λύκη), "light". The meaning of the epithet "Lyceus" later became associated with Apollo's mother Leto, who was the patron goddess of Lycia (Λυκία) and who was identified with the wolf (λύκος).


    Helios, Eos, and Selene appear to have a separate origin, from similar deities of Lycian/Carian, most likely pre-Hellenic origin. Helios "is" the Sun, Apollo being its rays or influence.

    The information is not attached, but we have found this comes shortly after the removal of a Hindu dynasty:


    Hittite Apaliunas is among the gods who guarantee a treaty drawn up about 1280 BCE between Alaksandu of Wilusa (Troy), interpreted as "Alexander of Ilios" and the great Hittite king, Muwatalli II. This is probably Shaddai (Omnipotence) in Masoretic Samuel. For the war, most consensus favors the dates given by Eratosthenes, 1194–1184 BC, which roughly correspond to archaeological evidence of a catastrophic burning of Troy VII.



    Plato and his kind are weak about the derivation of these names; at least they admit they are speculating. This is very convoluted and a lot harder than working with Indian lore! The Indians have been banished, and this is shortly before the Trojan war, and seem to be of the Lycian or Luwian's own devising. So my tendency would be to look at the parentage and early background of this Apollo. And this is a little strange.


    His mother Leto supports the Trojans, standing opposite of Hermes. After witnessing Hera beat Artemis with her own bow, and Artemis fleeing in tears, Hermes refuses to challenge Leto, encouraging her to simply tell everyone she beat him fair and square. Leto picks up Artemis' bow and arrows and runs after her crying daughter.

    According to the scholium, Hermes here represents reason, rationality (λόγος, "logos") as opposed to Leto, who stands in for forgetfulness (λήθη, "lethe", perhaps a wordplay on Leto's name); or lotus (the fruit that brings oblivion to those who eat it). It would thus mean "the hidden one". In 20th century sources Leto is traditionally derived from Lycian lada, "wife".




    Diodorus Siculus states clearly that Leto was born in Hyperborea and not in Kos.

    Hera would not let her give birth on "terra firma" and harassed her menacingly.

    It is said that Leto came to Delos from Hyperborea accompanied by a pack of wolves. Henceforth, Hyperborea became Apollo's winter home and wolves became sacred to him. His intimate connection to wolves is evident from his epithet Lyceus, meaning wolf-like. But Apollo was also the wolf-slayer in his role as the god who protected flocks from predators. The Hyperborean worship of Apollo bears the strongest marks of Apollo being worshipped as the sun god.

    Antoninus Liberalis hints that Leto came down from Hyperborea in the guise of a she-wolf, or that she sought out the "wolf-country" of Lycia, formerly called Tremilis, which she renamed to honour wolves that had befriended her. Another late source, Aelian, also links Leto with wolves and Hyperboreans:

    Wolves are not easily delivered of their young, only after twelve days and twelve nights, for the people of Delos maintain that this was the length of time that it took Leto to travel from the Hyperboreoi to Delos.

    Leto found the barren floating island of Delos, still bearing its archaic name of Asterios, which was neither mainland nor a real island and gave birth there, promising the island wealth from the worshippers who would flock to the obscure birthplace of the splendid god who was to come.


    Hesiod describes Leto as "dark-gowned" and the Orphic Hymn 35 to Leto describes her as "dark-veiled" and "goddess who gave birth to twins" (θεός διδυματόκος). In the Homeric Hymn to Apollo, she is described as golden-haired.


    Since Leto was unable to feed him, Themis, the goddess of divine law, fed him with nectar, or ambrosia. Upon tasting the divine food, Apollo broke free of the bands fastened onto him and declared that he would be the master of lyre and archery, and interpret the will of Zeus to humankind.

    Python was sent by Hera to hunt the pregnant Leto to death, and assaulted her. To avenge the trouble given to his mother, Apollo went in search of Python and killed it in the sacred cave at Delphi with the bow and arrows that he had received from Hephaestus. The Delphian nymphs who were present encouraged Apollo during the battle with the cry "Hie Paean".

    Paean was considered by Homer a distinct god of the Egyptians, which became grafted to both Apollo, and his son, Aesclepius. To discover the relation between Paean or Paeon, the healer-god, and paean in the sense of "song", it is necessary to identify the connection between ritual chant and the shaman's healing arts.



    In the near family are depictions of summer/winter sun, and waxing/waning moon:


    Apollo rides on the back of a swan to the land of the Hyperboreans during the winter months, and the absence of warmth in winter is due to his departure. During his absence, Delphi was under the care of Dionysus, and no prophecies were given during winters.

    Apollo's sister Artemis, who was the Greek goddess of hunting, is identified with Britomartis (Diktynna), the Minoan "Mistress of the animals".

    The oldest evidence found for Hecate's worship is at Apollo's temple in Miletos. There, Hecate was taken to be Apollo's sister counterpart in the absence of Artemis. Hecate's lunar nature makes her the goddess of the waning moon and contrasts and complements, at the same time, Apollo's solar nature.

    Immediately after his birth, Apollo demanded a lyre and invented the paean, thus becoming the god of music. As the divine singer, he is the patron of poets, singers and musicians. The invention of string music is attributed to him. Plato said that the innate ability of humans to take delight in music, rhythm and harmony is the gift of Apollo and the Muses.

    Among the Pythagoreans, the study of mathematics and music were connected to the worship of Apollo, their principal deity. Their belief was that music purifies the soul, just as medicine purifies the body. They also believed that music was delegated to the same mathematical laws of harmony as the mechanics of the cosmos, evolving into an idea known as the music of the spheres.








    I would guess that "leaning/relaxing" Apollo is probably a word play on "all of the above". Wolves are involved, but kind of on the sidelines, as he is not a wolf, and/or Mt. Lykaion is mostly about something else.

    Lisieux or Lexovii most likely pertains to this Apollonian theme, rather than the people being "lame", which comes from a thought process similar to what we just did, but, it seems to me, less accurate. The Gauls had a Greek-compatible mythos with Mercury and others, which has been replaced by a shibboleth.


    Plato’s Cratylus terms the planets theoi, from theein meaning “to run, to move.”

    Ouranos is in the Gospels, but no Christian writers respond to this. The remark is followed by a denial of historical Moses, that it was drawn from Orpheus. Hebrew astronomy had, possibly, two planets prior to the Babylonian captivity. Mosaic legend as thievery:


    Walker relates that the "stone tablets of law supposedly given to Moses were copied from the Canaanite god Baal-Berith, 'God of the Covenant.'


    Kern's Orphic Fragments even includes the early rebuttals, called testimonies, such as:


    This testimony claims that Orpheus was taught by Moses, who the Greeks called Musaeus, this idea coming from the Jewish historian Artapanus of Alexandria.

    This testimony consists of two quotations from Christian church-fathers: the first says that Orpheus learned the Egyptian Mysteries and then gave them to the Greeks; the second quotation claims that while in Egypt he learned doctrines of Moses.


    What a vacuum cleaner. If someone says they believe in god, it means they believe in Plato's planets.





    Before he was attributed the legend of being cast from Olympus, Virgil's Saturn was an actual person, a refugee from the Trojan War, who formed good relations with the Etruscans--hence a Golden Age. Rome, the city, was a few centuries later, and dismembered this. It is generally true that Saturn has a dual nature:


    His one wife Ops was a goddess of wealth and abundance. But his other wife Lua was a goddess of war and destruction.


    As to the first, some remarks on Saturn:

    Saturn was worshiped according to the Greek rite instead of the Roman rite. By the Greek rite, the gods and goddesses were worshiped with their heads uncovered, as opposed to the Roman religion where the people worshiped with their heads covered.

    In Latium, Saturn ruled over the Golden Age. The area where Saturn settled was supposedly the future site of Rome. He was welcomed to Latium by Janus, the two-headed god, and Saturn taught the people the basic principles of farming, of sowing seeds and growing crops.

    He founded the city of Saturnia and ruled wisely. This was a peaceful era and the people lived in prosperity and harmony. Roman myths say that Saturn helped the people of Latium to turn away from a more “barbaric” lifestyle and to live by a civil and moral code. In some accounts, he is even called the first King of Latium or Italy, while others see him more as an immigrant god who was expelled from Greece by his son Jupiter and chose to settle in Latium. By some, he is considered the father of the Latin nation as he fathered Picus, widely accepted as the first King of Latium.


    This is basically erased, and replaced by "Sabbath" or i. e. Saturday.

    The younger, or roughly Roman-concurrent Edomite version swallowed and re-branded the Old Testament Elohim. Under "Eve" we are told:


    The original from which the Hebrew Genesis was later compiled is lost. Yet even as the latter has reached us — first veiled, then probably remodeled by Ezra with shiftings that confuse the chronology — despite important words and clauses mistranslated by European scholars, its resemblance to the esoteric account is unmistakable. For Jehovah, who gave the human body and (physical) breath of life, is the hyparxis of Saturn and an earthly, not a celestial, hierarchy.


    Infusion of Yahweh to Saturn.

    Proclus's Henads are described as the first time philosophy tried to interact with this "religion".


    Jesus was baptized by John, which is effectively Mandeaism. They do not really condemn him, personally, but some of his followers, who changed the rites, such as baptism. Most likely, both the Templars and Hospitallers found Mandeaism, which was again attempted to be suppressed by the Pope in 1879. However, he was most likely already a Nazarene or Nasorean, which is in scripture. In the accusations against Paul, he is a man "set apart" in Acts 24: 5:


    For we have found this man a pestilent fellow, and a mover of sedition among all the Jews throughout the world, and a ringleader of the sect of the Nazarenes:

    "The sect of the Nazarenes" refers to the 'followers of Jesus the Nazarene' (cf. Matthew 2:23)

    Matthew 2: 23:

    ...that it might be
    fulfilled which was spoken through the
    prophets: "He will be called a Nazarene."


    No such prophecy has been found, unlike everything else in Matthew.

    Likewise “Paul must have belonged to this class of Initiates, for he himself tells the Galatians (i, 15) that he was separated or ‘set apart’ from the moment of his birth; and that he had his hair cut at Cenchrea, because ‘he had a vow’ (Acts xviii, 18) i.e., had been initiated as a Nazar; after which he became a ‘master-builder’ (1 Corinth. iii, 10)”

    Some believe the Ur-Gospel is Hebrew or Aramaic Matthew.

    It remained unknown until the fourteenth century anti-Christian polemic including Shem Tob's Hebrew Matthew:

    A characteristic feature of this Hebrew gospel is the appearance in 20 places of השם (HaShem, "the Name"), in the abbreviated form ה״, where the Gospel of Matthew has Κύριος ("the Lord").


    Often referred to as "The Logic of Shem Tob", it argues against the belief that Jesus is God. It also argues against attributing the role of Messiah to Jesus.

    And from the many versions of "Talmudic Jesus", there is also the medieval Yemeni Yeshu ben Pandera:


    At this great deliberation, he forthwith did separate them from amongst themselves, and they are those who are called to this very day Nazoraeans.


    There is no mention of either Nazareth or Nazarene in the Old Testament.

    The earliest known reference to Nazareth outside the New Testament and as a contemporary town is by Sextus Julius Africanus, who wrote around AD 200. Writers who question the association of Nazareth with the life of Jesus suggest that Nazorean was originally a religious title and was later reinterpreted as referring to a town.

    The first confirmed use of Nazarenes (in Greek Nazoraioi) occurs from Tertullus before Antonius Felix.

    Herod Agrippa II (Acts 26:28) uses the term Christians, which had been "first used in Antioch." (Acts 11:26), and is acknowledged in 1 Peter 4:16.

    However, in the statement of Tertullus in Acts 24:5, Nazarenes and in Jesus of Nazareth are both nasraya (ܢܨܪܝܐ) in Syrian Aramaic, while Nasrat (ܢܨܪܬ ) is used for Nazareth. This usage may explain transmission of the name Nasorean as the name of the Mandaeans leaving Jerusalem for Iraq in the Haran Gawaita of the Mandaeans. Saint Thomas Christians, an ancient community in India who claim to trace their origins to evangelistic activity of Thomas the Apostle in the 1st century, are sometimes known by the name Nasrani even today.


    Some conclude that:

    It was Paul who created the Christian church in Antioch.


    The trouble with Nazarene means a follower of Mosaic Law. Mandeans were never Jewish.

    Matthew specifically identifies John the Baptist as Elijah's spiritual successor, the gospels of Mark and Luke are silent on the matter. The Gospel of John states that John the Baptist denied that he was Elijah.


    In Matthew 17:11–13, Jesus speaking calls him Elijah; in John, John's own words deny he is anything special.

    The Dead Sea Scrolls were found at Qumran, which the majority of historians and archaeologists identify as an Essene settlement. John the Baptist is thought to have been either an Essene or "associated" with the community at Khirbet Qumran. According to the Book of Acts, Paul met some "disciples of John" in Ephesus.

    He was killed at Herod's will because he "might" start trouble, a few years before Jesus. He possibly was Essene.

    He is irrelevant and not mentioned in any Jewish sources.

    He is favorably remembered in Islam and by the Druze.

    Called by the Mandeans:

    Iuhana Maṣbana


    having his own quite large Book (G. R. S. Mead partial translation), he is in the lineage:


    Adam, Seth, Noah, Shem and John the Baptist


    which is why their calendar is 483,000 years old.

    I don't think those are the same Judaic or Islamic prophets; it is, rather, the religion of Adam. Abel, Seth, and Aram are "revered", which means a Semitic Aramaic heritage, and then a rather large gap until John.


    The Essenes could not have avoided being Jewish by origin, however, it is something like a blanket term for numerous sects who altered or dropped various beliefs and practices, which can mostly only be viewed through the lenses of outsiders:


    Pliny relates in a few lines that the Essenes possess no money, had existed for thousands of generations...

    Josephus adds that the Essenes ritually immersed in water every morning...

    Epiphanius describes each group as following:

    The Nasaraean—they were Jews by nationality—originally from Gileaditis, Bashanitis and the Transjordan... They acknowledged Moses and believed that he had received laws—not this law, however, but some other. And so, they were Jews who kept all the Jewish observances, but they would not offer sacrifice or eat meat. They considered it unlawful to eat meat or make sacrifices with it. They claim that these Books are fictions, and that none of these customs were instituted by the fathers. This was the difference between the Nasaraean and the others...

    After this Nasaraean sect in turn comes another closely connected with them, called the Ossaeans. These are Jews like the former... originally came from Nabataea, Ituraea, Moabitis, and Arielis, the lands beyond the basin of what sacred scripture called the Salt Sea... Though it is different from the other six of these seven sects, it causes schism only by forbidding the books of Moses like the Nasaraean.

    Another issue is the relationship between the Essaioi and Philo's Therapeutae and Therapeutrides. He regarded the Therapeutae as a contemplative branch of the Essaioi who, he said, pursued an active life.

    The Teacher of Righteousness of the Scrolls would seem to be a prototype of Jesus, for both spoke of the New Covenant; they preached a similar gospel; each was regarded as a Savior or Redeemer; and each was condemned and put to death by reactionary factions...

    Mandaeans believe that they constitute the true congregation of bnai nhura meaning 'Sons of Light', a term used by the Essenes.

    In the Clementine Homilies (ii. 23), John the Baptist and his disciples are mentioned as Hemerobaptists.


    Similar to Elohim:


    Life Recognition of the existence of one God, whom Nasurai call "Hayyi" which in Aramaic means "the Living" or life itself. The Great Life (or Supreme Deity) is a personification of the creative and sustaining force of the universe, and is spoken of always in the impersonal plural...


    As, roughly, an Aramaic correspondence to Hebrew El Elyon of the original temple, i. e. David and Solomon:

    The Mandaeans
    themselves claim that they were originally the same people as the Jews, but the
    Jews were corrupt and began to practice evil rituals such as circumcision.

    Enos (Anos)-Uthra comes and proceeds to Jerusalem,
    clothed as with a garment in water-clouds.

    Mandaeans have a rich tradition of the veneration of Mary (Miriai).

    Homilies records that Simon Magus, a Samaritan
    heretic associated with magic and proto-Gnosticism, was part of, and for a
    time led, John’s group.

    The
    Mandaean sacred text Hauran Gawaita states that the Mandaeans “loved the
    lord Adonai” until the appearance of Christ.

    The temple cult of Jerusalem, as it appeared in ancient Israel, was
    nearly destroyed by Josiah’s reforms. However, the tradition survived over the
    next six hundred years in one form or another and was still being practiced, to
    some extent, by the Essenes and Nasarenes in Judah just prior to the advent of
    Christianity. John the Baptist and Jesus Christ were likely either born into or
    adopted this tradition and used it as the backdrop for their teachings. After
    John’s death, it would appear that the Nasarenes who revered him as a prophet
    mingled with some outside influences and began to be persecuted by the Jews.


    Drower's 600 page work on Mandeans is not scanned that great, but, here we find a Zodiac that only partially matches the Greek, whereas it does utilize an eastern Apollo. First, this is distinguished from Adonai; moreover, we find the Sun as simply the vehicle for the cosmic plane, in turn having its own lesser agents:



    This is the likeness of Shamish, Adona is his name.'

    The light of Shamish's banner, he said, came from the four 'uthri of the Polar Star : 'From these four come the strength and light of Shamish. Thus the sun gets its light and strength from Melka Ziwa. Just as a mirror reflects a face, it reflects Melka Ziwa. Shamish is lord of all the melki of the material world.

    The melka of darkness who is with the sun is responsible for the evil sometimes done by the sun's rays. He is called Adonai. From his eyes dart
    rays which sear and burn, and
    his gaze causes "cupboards of air" (i.e. whirlwinds).
    'But the flaming standard of Shamish, his dravsha, throws out
    beneficent rays and gives forth light and life and electricity.

    ...the face of Shamish is like a wheel of light' (he drew a
    swastika).



    At the end of the world, the planet
    will be burnt up with the rest of the material world. The heat and cold ( !) of the sun are of the Darkness. The sun lights four of the seven worlds, the other three being illuminated by the world of light.' 'Shamish has a female aspect, not a spouse, but a dmutha (complement, likeness). She is the mother of all the melki, is in likeness
    female rather than male, and, in my thought, the sun is in this form(i.e. a female form) of Malka Ziwa's power, and the universe
    proceeds from her. Her name is Simat Hiia (pronounced Haiy or Hei), Treasure of Life.'



    You can't do that in Europe. In Canaan, you had to hide in a cave or in the wilderness. In India, nothing like that would ever be a problem. The problem now is the Druze and Mandeans are closed societies, which is historically understandable. But that way they will not grow or restore anything. You don't have to really do anything to "convert" to Hinduism, or Sanatana Dharma. All of these systems involve a gross material aspect of planets, such as Archons, which revolves around issues of discipline and understanding in order to compel them to behave. Just above, we are told the sun illuminates the four form worlds; it is quite close to the most elaborate esotericism. But such things have been called "idolatry" and stamped out by vested interests. I am not sure we can ever straighten out the mess that was made of the Gospels and so on. We kind of don't have anything. This was more the philosophy of nature, than the attempt to install a dictatorial priesthood.

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    After finding the pre-Troy Apollo, this flows in to the general ideal of Theosophy:


    Chrestes meant an interpreter of oracles. In the language of the Mysteries, a chrestos was a candidate or neophyte, and a christos (anointed) was an initiate.


    The subjects merge in a reversion of two prophecies claimed by the church.


    The first is Virgil's Cumaean Sibyl and the Golden Age, which is supposed to mean Jesus. It however is about Saturn. This turns out to have a trove of evidence, only needing a brief quote from an article that is about beards on Bifrons Coins:


    Janus ' Head on the Monetal As. The head of Janus on one side, and the prow of a ship on the other, is an almost perpetual type on the Roman As. Several ancient writers have alluded to this fact, and the reason for it. Macrobius says "This Janus having hopitably received Saturnus, who had come with a fleet to Italy, and after been instructed by him in agriculture, has improved the rude and savage mode of living which had prevailed before fruits were known, he bestowed upon him (Saturnus) a share in the kingdom. He was the first also who stamped brass; and in this too, he displayed his respect for Saturnus; for, as he had arrived in a ship, on one side was expressed a likeness of his own head, and on the other a ship, to perpetuate the memory of Saturnus. - That the money was so stamped, may be gathered from the game 'pitch and toss ' at the present day, in which boys, throwing up their denarii, cry out 'heads or ships?" Aurelius Victor gives the same information.


    Florentine. In the Sistene Chapel, she is horrid, and strewn in with Old Testament Prophets:






    The other prophecy is more intricate. HPB tells us that outside of Paul, there is no recognition of "Christos" anywhere:


    In Bockh’s ‘Christian Inscriptions,’ numbering 1,287, there is no single instance of an earlier date than the third century, wherein the name is not written Chrest or Chreist.” (The Name and Nature of the Christ, by G. Massey, “The Agnostic Annual.”)


    There is a staggering hoard of Chrest, whose first definition is "oracle", and:



    The word ⲭⲣⲓⲥⲧⲟⲥ doesn't appear in any text of any kind at least up to 500 CE


    The word "anoint" uses many other translations in *most* of the Bible, except:

    1 occurrence in Luke and 1 in John, nothing in Mark or Matthew: this while XRISM/XRISTOS thing appears to be a very late invention by the Falsifying Fathers, and as such would be evidence of their writings dating well after 400/500 CE at the very earliest if we go by Bezae, Vaticanus and Sinaiticus dating.






    As to the appropriateness of "Christos", according to HPB:

    ...he never was anointed, either as king or priest.

    Tertullian denounces in the 3rd chapter of his Apologia the word “Christianus” as derived by “crafty interpretation".




    Giving the exception:


    As Paul says (Ephes. iii. 17) “κατοικησαι τον χριστον δια της πιστεως εν ταις καρδιαις ὑμωι.” “That you may find Christos in your inner man through knowledge” not faith, as translated; for Pistis is “knowledge,” as will be shown further on.


    He uses it 270 times.




    The Erythyrean Sibyl taken by the church as a Jesus prophecy says:


    ἹΗΣΟΥΣ ΧΡΕΙΣΤΟΣΘΕΟΝ ὙΙΟΣ ΣΩΤΗΡ ΣΤΑΥΡΟΣ



    Read exoterically, the words “Iesous Chreistos theou yios soter stauros,” meaning literally “Iesus, Christos, God, Son, Saviour, Cross,” are most excellent handles to hang a Christian prophecy on, but they are pagan, not Christian.

    If called upon to explain the names Iesous Chreistos, the answer is: study mythology, the so-called “fictions” of the ancients, and they will give you the key. Ponder over Apollo, the solar god, and the “Healer,” and the allegory about his son Janus (or Ion), his priest at Delphos, through whom alone could prayers reach the immortal gods, and his other son Asclepios, called the Soter, or Saviour.



    Interestingly, as the above concerned Saturn moving to Italy, this deals with Apollo moving to Greece. I will give her some links for some of the obscure parts:


    The city of Chrisa (now spelt Crisa), was built in memory of Kreusa (or Creusa), daughter of King Erechtheus and mother of Janus (or Ion) by Apollo, in memory of the danger which Janus escaped. We learn that Janus, abandoned by his mother in a grotto “to hide the shame of the virgin who bore a son,” was found by Hermes, who brought the infant to Delphi, nurtured him by his father’s sanctuary and oracle, where, under the name of Chresis (χρησις) Janus became first a Chrestis (a priest, soothsayer, or Initiate), and then very nearly a Chresterion, “a sacrificial victim,” ready to be poisoned by his own mother, who knew him not, and who, in her jealousy, mistook him, on the hazy intimation of the oracle, for a son of her husband. He pursued her to the very altar with the intention of killing her—when she was saved through the pythoness, who divulged to both the secret of their relationship. In memory of this narrow escape, Creusa, the mother, built the city of Chrisa, or Krisa. Such is the allegory, and it symbolizes simply the trials of Initiation.

    Finding then that Janus, the solar God, and son of Apollo, the Sun, means the “Initiator” and the “Opener of the Gate of Light,” or secret wisdom of the mysteries; that he is born from Krisa (esoterically Chris), and that he was a Chrestos through whom spoke the God; that he was finally Ion, the father of the Ionians, and, some say, an aspect of Asclepios, another son of Apollo...

    Asclepios (Esculapius) was the divine physician, the “Healer,” the “Saviour,” Σωτηρ as he was called, a title also given to Janus of Delphi; and IASO, the daughter of Asclepios was the goddess of healing, under whose patronage were all the candidates for initiation in her father’s temple, the novices or chrestoi, called “the sons of Iaso.”

    Now, if we remember, firstly, that the names of Iesus in their different forms, such as Iasius, Iasion, Jason and Iasus, were very common in ancient Greece, especially among the descendants of Jasius (the Jasides), as also the number of the “sons of Iaso,” the Mystoï and future Epoptai (Initiates), why should not the enigmatical words in the Sibylline Book be read in their legitimate light, one that had nought to do with a Christian prophecy? The secret doctrine teaches that the first two words ΙΗΣΟΥΣ ΧΡΕΙΣΤΟΣ mean simply “son of Iaso, a Chrestos,” or servant of the oracular God. Indeed IASO (Ιασω) is in the Ionic dialect IESO (Ἱησὼ), and the expression Ιησους (Iesous)—in its archaic form, ΙΗΣΟΥΣ—simply means “the son of Iaso or Ieso, the healer,” i.e. ο Ιησοῦς (υῖος). No objection, assuredly, can be taken to such rendering, or to the name being written Ieso instead of Iaso, since the first form is attic, therefore incorrect, for the name is Ionic. “Ieso” from which “O’ Iesous” (son of Ieso)—i.e. a genitive, not a nominative—is Ionic and cannot be anything else, if the age of the Sibylline book is taken into consideration. Nor could the Sibyl of Erythrea have spelt it originally otherwise, as Erythrea, her very residence, was a town in Ionia (from Ion or Janus) opposite Chios; and that the Ionic preceded the attic form.

    Leaving aside in this case the mystical signification of the now famous Sibylline sentence, and giving its literal interpretation only, on the authority of all that has been said, the hitherto mysterious words would stand; “Son of Iaso, Chrestos (the priest or servant) (of the) Son of (the) God (Apollo) the Saviour from the Cross”—(of flesh or matter).


    G. Higgins:

    Delphi—the seat of the great oracle of Apollo, of the town of Krisa (or Kreusa) the great centre of initiations and of the Chrestoi of the decrees of the oracles, where the candidates for the last labour were anointed with sacred oils before being plunged into their last trance of forty-nine hours’ duration (as to this day, in the East), from which they arose as glorified adepts or Christoi.”


    G. Massey:


    In the Clementine Recognitions it is announced that the father anointed his son with ‘oil that was taken from the wood of the Tree of Life, and from this anointing he is called the Christ:’ whence the Christian name.


    HPB:


    Scorpio, as Chrestos-Meshiac, and Leo, as Christos-Messiah antedated by far the Christian era in the trials and triumphs of Initiation during the Mysteries, Scorpio standing as symbol for the latter, Leo for the glorified triumph of the “sun” of truth. The mystic philosophy of the allegory is well understood by the author of the “Source of Measures”; who writes: “One (Chrestos) causing himself to go down into the pit (of Scorpio, or incarnation in the womb) for the salvation of the world; this was the Sun, shorn of his golden rays, and crowned with blackened ones (symbolizing this loss) as the thorns; the other was the triumphant Messiah, mounted up to the summit of the arch of heaven, personated as the Lion of the tribe of Judah.

    John, Jesus and even Apollonius of Tyana were but epitomizers of the history of the Sun “under differences of aspect or condition.” The explanation, he says, “is simple enough, when it is considered that the names Jesus, Hebrew יש and Apollonius, or Apollo, are alike names of the Sun in the heavens, and, necessarily, the history of the one, as to his travels through the signs, with the personifications of his sufferings, triumphs and miracles, could be but the history of the other, where there was a wide-spread, common method of describing those travels by personification.” The fact that the Secular Church was founded by Constantine, and that it was a part of his decree “that the venerable day of the Sun should be the day set apart for the worship of Jesus Christ as Sun-day,” shows that they knew well in that “Secular Church” “that the allegory rested upon an astronomical basis,” as the author affirms.


    But his Christos was not Jesus of Nazareth, nor any living man, as shown so ably in Mr. Gerald Massey’s lecture, “Paul, the Gnostic Opponent of Peter.”

    Neither they, nor their humbler followers, were in danger of accepting the dead letter of their own texts. But it was different with the victims of the fabricators of what is now called orthodox and historic Christianity. Their successors have all been made to fall into the mistakes of the “foolish Galatians” reproved by Paul, who, as he tells them (Galat. iii. 1-5), having begun (by believing) in the Spirit (of Christos), “ended by believing in the flesh,”—i.e., a corporeal Christ. For such is the true meaning of the Greek sentence, “ἐναρξάμενοι Πνεύματι νῦν σαρκι ἐπιτελεῖσθε.” That Paul was a gnostic, a founder of a new sect of gnosis which recognized, as all other gnostic sects did, a “Christ-Spirit,” though it went against its opponents, the rival sects, is sufficiently clear to all but dogmatists and theologians.


    From the 270 examples, he never uses:

    κúρως χριτóς

    χριτòς κυριου

    Paul never feels the necessity to state ‘Jesus is the Christ’.


    perhaps because:

    Does not Paul himself speak of “Principalities and Powers in heavenly places” (Ephesians iii. 10; i. 21), and confess that there be gods many and Lords many (Kurioi)? And angels, powers (Dunameis), and Principalities?



    According to Wiki:

    Iaso had many children.


    That's it. No names, hardly any mention of her other than existing, but it would make sense if initiates.


    Sister of Hygeia:


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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    Here is a thing that turns it around.


    I did not understand this, and it means there is not even such a thing as "Pauline Christianity".

    I have typically compared names and doctrines and things like that, which at least gets you to the point that the synoptic Gospels are not quite in agreement. These are epynomos, i. e. next-gen writings of, perhaps, someone who may have known Luke may have written the Gospel according to Luke, and so on. The closest thing to real-time "life of Jesus" would be the Epistles of Paul. This is where the whole thing falls apart.


    We ought to disregard what he says about Egypt, but there is something patently objective from G. Massey:


    Paul: The Gnostic Opponent of Peter

    Jesus of Nazareth is unknown to Paul!

    His name never once appears in the Epistles; and the significance of the fact in favour of the present view can hardly be exaggerated.

    So, Jesus of Nazareth does not appear in the Gospel of Marcion.

    Paul was the only apostle of the true Christ who was recognised by Marcion.

    There was no history to explain until the myth had been made exoteric by those who were ignorant, or who cunningly converted the Gnosis into history.

    ...that which had been an impossibility for the Gnostics was an accomplished fact for those who knew no better than to believe.



    This revolves around a well-attested event of the 40s:

    Between 44 and 48, a famine took place in Judea.



    Quote The conversion of Paul, according to the Acts, is supposed to have occurred sometime after the year 30 A.D. at the earliest; and yet if we accept the data furnished by the book of Acts and Paul's Epistle to the Galatians, he must have been converted as early as the year 27 A.D.

    Paul states that after his conversion he did not go up to Jerusalem for three years.

    Then after 14 more years he went up again to Jerusalem with Barnabas.

    This second visit can be dated by means of the famine, which is historic, and known to have occurred in the year 44, at which time relief was conveyed to the brethren in Judea by Barnabas and Paul.

    If we take 17 years from 44, the different statements go to show that Paul had been converted as early as the year 27.

    Thus, according to the dates and the data derived from the Acts, from Paul's epistle, and the historic fact of the famine, Paul was converted to Christianity in the year 27 of our era!

    This could not have been by a spiritual manifestation of the supposed personal Jesus, who was not then dead, and had not at that time been re-begotten as the Christ of the canonical history.

    This is usually looked upon (by Renan, for example,) as such an absurdity that no credence can be allowed to the account in the Acts.

    On the contrary, and notwithstanding all that has been said by those whose work it is to put a false bottom into the Unknown, I am free to maintain that nothing stands in the way of its being a possibility and a fact, except the assumption that it is an impossibility.

    You cannot date one event by another which never occurred, or, if it did occur, is not recorded by Paul, especially when his own account offers negative evidence of its non-occurrence.

    It is only using plain words justifiably to say that the concocters of the Acts falsify whenever it is convenient, and tell the truth when they cannot help it!

    If he "converted" before there were any Christians, then he could not possibly have persecuted any Christians before he was converted.

    This means the Book of Acts is...it may not have any truth in it.

    Massey's thesis is quite similar to general information about Paul:


    Fourteen of the 27 books in the New Testament have traditionally been attributed to Paul. Seven of the Pauline epistles are undisputed by scholars as being authentic, with varying degrees of argument about the remainder.

    The Acts of the Apostles also contradict Paul's epistles on multiple accounts.

    Acts does not refer to Paul writing letters. Historians believe that the author of Acts did not have access to any of Paul's letters. One piece of evidence suggesting this is that Acts never directly quotes from the Pauline epistles. Discrepancies between the Pauline epistles and Acts would further support the conclusion that the author of Acts did not have access to those epistles when composing Acts.

    ...no references to John the Baptist in the Pauline Epistles, although Paul mentions him several times in the Acts of the Apostles.

    Elaine Pagels concentrated on how the Gnostics interpreted Paul's letters and how evidence from gnostic sources may challenge the assumption that Paul wrote his letters to combat "gnostic opponents" and to repudiate their statement that they possess secret wisdom.



    Moreover, he sometimes finds interpolations within a single Epistle, i. e. someone changed part of what he said, while leaving other remnants as clues. We generally do not think a person will contradict their own beliefs with the diametric opposite. So it is a matter of sifting and assessment to determine what his personal teaching really is. Massey's lecture has more examples through the link.

    From a similar compilation by the Philalethians:


    1 Corinthians iii, 10


    “According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise master builder, I have laid the foundation.”

    The expression, master-builder, used only once in the whole Bible, and by Paul, may
    be considered as a whole revelation. In the Mysteries, the third part of the sacred
    rites was called epopteia, or revelation, reception into the secrets. In substance it
    means [the highest stage of clairvoyance — the divine] . . . but the real significance of
    the word is “overseeing,” from όπτομαι — “I see myself.”

    The word epopteia is a compound one, from επί — “upon,” and όπτομαι — “to look” or
    be an overseer, an inspector — also used for a master-builder.


    "Faith", or trust, allegiance, etc., is not automatic, but a result of Persuasion:


    In classical rhetoric, pistis can mean proof, belief, or state of mind.

    proof or conviction (pistis)





    Pistis was personified as:

    the Charites

    by:


    Theognis of Megara (Greek: Θέογνις ὁ Μεγαρεύς, Théognis ho Megareús) was a Greek lyric poet active in approximately the sixth century BC.


    Pistis was the personified spirit (daimona) of trust, honesty and good faith. She was one of the good spirits to escape Pandora's box and promptly fled back to heaven, abandoning mankind. Her Roman name was Fides and her opposite number were Apate (Deception) and the Pseudologoi (Lies).


    Okay. Faith is a Demon.

    Charis is the namesake of the Graces:


    "Elpis (Hope) is the only good god remaining among mankind; the others have left and gone to Olympos. Pistis (Trust), a mighty god has gone, Sophrosyne (Restraint) has gone from men, and the Kharites (Charites, Graces), my friend, have abandoned the earth. Men's judicial oaths are no longer to be trusted, nor does anyone revere the immortal gods; the race of pious men has perished and men no longer recognize the rules of conduct or acts of piety."



    Massey refers to Charis in post-Christian Valentinian Gnosticism, where:


    Aglaea or Charis had a role as the wife of the smith god Hephaestus.

    The cult of the Charites is very old, with their name appearing to be of Pelasgian, or pre-Greek, origin rather than being brought to Greece by Proto-Indo-Europeans.

    ... with epigraphical evidence for a cult to the Charites dating to the sixth century B.C.E. on the island of Thera.

    ...the Charites were particularly connected with Apollo and appear to be connect to his cult on Delos.

    The earliest representation of these goddesses was found in a temple of Apollo in Thermon dated to the seventh to sixth century B.C.E.

    In fact she is the highest Aeon:


    Charis, in the system of Valentinus, was an alternative name, with Ennoea and Sige, for the consort of the primary Aeon Bythos (Iren. i. 4). The name expresses that aspect of the absolute Greatness in which it is regarded not as a solitary monad, but as imparting from its perfection to beings of which it is the ultimate source...

    The word has possibly also a technical meaning in the Ophite prayers preserved by Origen (Contra Celsum, vi. 31), all of which end with the invocation he charis synesto moi, nai pater, synesto.


    Massey suggests that the Marcosian oracles were "the Eucharist" before the "official" one; I am not sure about that, but the Kharites were certainly said to be Anointing the Messiah:


    Homeric Hymn 5 to Aphrodite 58 ff :

    "She [Aphrodite] went to Kypros (Cyprus), to Paphos, where her precinct is and fragrant altar, and passed into her sweet-smelling temple. There she went in and put to the glittering doors, and there the Kharites (Charites, Graces) bathed her with heavenly oil such as blooms upon the bodies of the eternal gods--oil divinely sweet, which she had by her, filled with fragrance."



    The church tends to admit that its whole raison d'etre is about a man being physically killed and "resurrecting".

    The actual St. Paul is about a chrestos--any good person--transforming into christos--an inner experience spawned by trance.

    The two have no common ground.

    What Paul says is natural and verifiable by personal experience.

    The other requires blind faith.


    I suppose he was too well-known to delete, but he has been over-written for the most part. Some more of his catch phrases as mentioned by HPB:


    “I am again in travail until Christ be formed in you” means, but what we give in its esoteric rendering, i.e. “until you find the Christos within yourselves as your only ‘way.’” (vide Galatians iv., 19 and 20.)


    Paul says (Ephes. iii. 17) “κατοικησαι τον χριστον δια της πιστεως εν ταις καρδιαις ὑμωι.” “That you may find Christos in your inner man through knowledge” not faith, as translated; for Pistis is “knowledge”.

    The language of St. Paul is in no way different: “The aspect of the world,” he says, “is a passing vision, an image which passes and renews itself continually—transit figura hujus mundi.”

    “The invisible things of God are made visible to the eye of man through the visible things of the creation,”

    And “all that is sown in the earth under a material form, does it not rise under a spiritual form,” as St. Paul says?

    in the “Word made flesh” God dwells corporeally, according to the true and beautiful saying of St. Paul.

    Their successors have all been made to fall into the mistakes of the “foolish Galatians” reproved by Paul, who, as he tells them (Galat. iii. 1-5), having begun (by believing) in the Spirit (of Christos), “ended by believing in the flesh,”—i.e., a corporeal Christ. For such is the true meaning of the Greek sentence, “ἐναρξάμενοι Πνεύματι νῦν σαρκι ἐπιτελεῖσθε.” That Paul was a gnostic, a founder of a new sect of gnosis which recognized, as all other gnostic sects did, a “Christ-Spirit,” though it went against its opponents, the rival sects, is sufficiently clear to all but dogmatists and theologians.

    This sentence analyzed means “Shall you, who in the beginning looked to the Christ-Spirit, now end by believing in a Christ of flesh,” or it means nothing. The verb ἐπιτελοῦμαι has not the meaning of “becoming perfect,” but of “ending by,” becoming so. Paul’s lifelong struggle with Peter and others, and what he himself tells of his vision of a Spiritual Christ and not of Jesus of Nazareth, as in the Acts—are so many proofs of this.


    Does not Paul himself speak of “Principalities and Powers in heavenly places” (Ephesians iii. 10; i. 21), and confess that there be gods many and Lords many (Kurioi)? And angels, powers (Dunameis), and Principalities? (See 1 Corinthians, viii. 5; and Epistle to Romans, viii. 38.)


    As an example of what happened:



    Quote The works of Basilides alone—“The philosopher devoted to the contemplation of Divine things,” as Clement describes him—the 24 volumes of his interpretations upon the Gospels—were all burned by order of the Church, Eusebius tells us (H. E., iv. 7).

    As these Interpretations were written at a time when the Gospels we have now, were not yet in existence, here is a good proof that the Evangel, the doctrines of which were delivered to Basilides by the Apostle Matthew, and Glaucus, the disciple of Peter (Clemens Al. “Strom.” vii. 7, § 106), must have differed widely from the present New Testament. Nor can these doctrines be judged by the distorted accounts of them left to posterity by Tertullian. Yet even the little this partisan fanatic gives, shows the chief gnostic doctrines to be identical, under their own peculiar terminology and personations, with those of the Secret Doctrine of the East. For, discussing Basilides, the “pious, god-like, theosophic philosopher,” as Clement of Alexandria thought him, Tertullian exclaims:

    “After this, Basilides, the heretic, broke loose. He asserted that there is a Supreme God, by name Abraxas, by whom Mind (Mahat) was created, which the Greeks call Nous. From this emanated the Word; from the Word, Providence; from Providence, Virtue and Wisdom; from these two again, Virtues, Principalities, and Powers were made; thence infinite productions and emissions of angels. Among the lowest angels, indeed, and those that made this world, he sets last of all the god of the Jews, whom he denies to be God himself, affirming that he is but one of the angels.” (Isis Unv. vol. ii.)

    Another proof of the claim that the Gospel of Matthew in the usual Greek texts is not the original gospel written in Hebrew, is given by no less an authority than S. Jerome (or Hieronymus). The suspicion of a conscious and gradual euhemerization of the Christ principle ever since the beginning, grows into a conviction, once that one becomes acquainted with a certain confession contained in book ii. of the “Comment. to Matthew” by Hieronymus. For we find in it the proofs of a deliberate substitution of the whole gospel, the one now in the Canon having been evidently re-written by this too zealous Church Father.


    It's actually not that big of a deal. All you have to do is de-couple all the "carnal", or, that is, the aspect of it being about a single dead man, and one can accept Christos, as a universal spiritual principle, towards which Hesychasm could indeed induce the epiphany thereof. If you gather is assembly on Sun Day rather than Saturn Day, it matches this, and so one particular decree of Constantine manages to get something right, even if otherwise he had no idea about much, it does congrue with the Apollo cult of which he was the chief minister. It is hardly any different.


    Chances are that Paul knew Greek Mysteries, and never met John the Baptist, who probably had more of a Babylonian influence. The two are similar in meaning, but not in language.
    Last edited by shaberon; 3rd August 2023 at 10:35.

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    Default Re: Neo-Platonism vs. Capitalism

    After taking a look at "messiah = christos", that is, "anointed"--of which there were many, such as King Cyrus of Persia--we found that religion requires faith that one man is "the" Messiah or the important one because he rose from the dead.

    He was never anointed in the Jewish sense, which perhaps explains the line in Matthew "tell no man I am Christ".

    Paul, however, had quite possibly never even known who Jesus was, although he seemed to be aware of certain doctrines, which he vehemently tried to dispute by teaching a spiritual or gnostic christos-principle, which seems to have been covered up and talked around. Marcion followed him quite closely.

    This teaching is Solar-focused, which resembles "El" that is the most specific thing Jesus ever says in the Gospels, since it was usually Abba or "Father".

    The New Testament is mostly Greek, and practically all Greek understanding is that man is subjected to ethereal and heavenly influences that are not different from their earthly counterparts. If it seeks pluton or "riches", this would not be seen as any different from the Pluto of legend. Following this logic, Pistis or "faith" is a Demon. The real Greek meaning of Pistis is almost exactly the same as Sanskrit Sraddha, both being a matter of conviction due to knowledge or experience.

    The only knowledge or experience one could have of a dead body walking around again is due to the statement being repeated many times, which is the propaganda technique we now call the Big Lie.

    That would be what Paul and Marcion are disputing.


    Here are a few more details about untwisting some Greek vocabulary, which does not involve pulpit-pounding any third-person Gospels.

    Some of it comes from western Astrology. In India, the main operative is the Nakshatras, which are the distance traveled by the Moon in a day. The similar but different western "small slices", the Egyptian Decans, are based on visible stars and found at least as far back as 1200 B. C. E..


    They likely are even older, and exported as far as Tajikstan and India, where they are accepted by Varamihara and considered Greek in origin. They are not in major use in India; they simply did not reject the idea. So, we can accept that it is ancient Egyptian, either of their own making, or at least not Indian. The reason for bringing this up is in the etymology of eucharist:


    eukharistos "grateful," from eu "well" (see eu-) + stem of kharizesthai "show favor," from kharis "favor, grace,"


    It will become relevant to the decanates of the Orthodox and Catholic St. Cosmas (8th century).

    Egyptian Decanates were defined by fixed stars. The ones now given are still the same "pie slices", except now they are not only ruled by planets in "Chaldean order", or the Nychthemeron of Apollonius, but each has its own god or daimon, which he attributes to Zoroaster.


    He is actually commenting St. Gregory of Nazianus:

    Cosmas of Jerusalem’s commentary on G.’s poems, found in Vaticanus Graecus 1260...


    such as seen in De Mundo, is, rather, a refutation of Astrology.

    They don't like it because it sounds fatalistic or a lack of free will. Nevertheless, his information largely matches that of the astrologer Hephaestio of Thebes.

    Briefly quoting from there:


    Heracles is an analogue for the Sun (whose domicile is Leo) who
    must perform twelve works yearly (as the Greek hero did) through
    the zodiacal circle (so the allegorists say).

    Porphyry, De statuis 8


    Concerning Heracles and Gemini, the connection is supported by the
    name of one of the stars in the constellation, called ‘Heracles’
    according to many astrological texts, including the Tetrabiblos [Ptolemy].

    In fact, the constellation has been represented as Apollo and Heracles,
    as we read in Hyginus and other astrological texts. Vettius Valens
    perhaps is also thinking of this association when he relates the hero
    and Apollo (among other gods) to the sign.



    But the point being made is that even though Cosmas is an opponent, he is writing some 300 years after Hephaistios, and they are in close agreement and we find:

    Taurus: Charis

    compared to the older:


    Eros and the Charites (Graces) are related to Taurus, Libra and
    Pisces, the domiciles and exaltation of Venus, because they are
    closely bound to the goddess of love and beauty.
    Indeed, in regard
    to Eros (according to the Liber Hermetis), the 1st to the 8th degrees
    of Taurus (exactly Venus’s terms) are called Cupido.

    As for the Graces, Hephaestio’s text agrees with Cosmas’ decans, where
    Χάρις appears as the first decan in Taurus.


    So, Charis has been for centuries enfolded in "thanksgiving", now made into a sacramental meal of Transubstantiation.

    She was well- known, such as in Agamemnon, Charis may be traumatically disruptive. That is the nature of Daimon--it may be a benediction, or rather violent and deranging to the individual. It is divine grace, there is not another kind. There are other Graces, but she is paramount in this sense.

    Some of her children are listed under her alter-nym, Aglaia:


    Eukleia (Eucleia, Good-Repute), Euthenia (Praise), Eupheme (Eloquence) and Philophrosyne (Welcome)


    Her name translates as 'splendor, brilliant, shining one'. It perhaps is confused or mized up with Aigle, sister of Iasos and Hygeia:


    The Asklepiades shared their name with, and were patrons of, an ancient guild of doctors which claimed descent from Asklepios.


    As a lover of Helios:


    AIGLE (Aegle) The nymph mother of the Kharites (Graces) by Helios.

    Aegle, "brightness" or "dazzling light".


    She is possibly Charis, or, the mother of Charis, for whom all the Graces are collectively named. Looping back, Charis was the wife of Hephaistos. Collectively, they have a festival, charisia or charitêsia, and are the source of the English word "charisma".


    One can see them in a relatively modern drawing surrounding Apollo who is being anointed with oil.


    They are frequently close, such as from Trismegistos:

    This is a dialogue between the Delian statue of Apollo and an interlocutor who asks questions about the fact that he carries a statue group of the Graces in the left hand and a bow the right. Apollo explains that these attributes mean that he is slow to punish the bad and eager to reward the good.

    From a much longer article explaining his items and general lack of a wolf:


    ...he has a threefold power in heaven, where he is called Sol; in earth, where he is named Liber Pater; and in hell, where he is styled Apollo; he is usually painted with these three things: a harp, a shield, and arrows. The harp shows that he bears rule in heaven, where all things are full of harmony; the shield describes his office in earth, where he gives health and safety to terrestrial creatures; his arrows show his authority in hell, for who ever he strikes with them, he sends them into hell.


    He was called Cynthius, from the mountain Cynthus, in the island of Delos; whence Diana also was called Cynthia.


    To borrow an abstract from J. Eyl:


    Paul relates this array of divine abilities to the ethic of pistis, or faithfulness. In essence, Paul suggests that divinatory and wonderworking powers are extended in proportion to gentile faithfulness; he does not say that such gifts are offered “in exchange for,” but rather, “in proportion to” faithfulness. The reciprocal relationship between pistis and his divinatory powers hinges on the mechanism of empowerment—the pneuma of Christ. The chapter departs from the task of comparison, as we lack sufficient ancient data with which we may compare Paul’s construction of the pistis–pneuma–gift relationship (as Paul provides almost our only first-person account of the inner working of his type of religious specialist in the early Roman Empire, we are sorely lacking another figure with whom we may compare him on this level of detail). The chapter explores forms of reciprocity thought to be critical to religions in the ancient Mediterranean, and challenges scholarship that reduces ancient religiosity to do ut des [I give so that you will give].


    Considering such "faithfulness" to be more akin to "gnosis", there would still be no one to compare him to.

    Another hypothesis suggests that Paul was none other than Apollonius of Tyana.

    The idea that he was originally Saul is only in Acts, and, at most, would have only been his Aramaic name, nothing to do with "conversion".




    Considering that Constantine initially was at Trier/Grand, and the extend of the solar cult in Gaul:




    there likely was another fusion occurring due to him.

    Rather than Jesus,

    ...the Cumaean Sibyl foretold that with the birth of a child, the worldwide Golden Age of Saturn would return when Apollo reigned through this child.


    ...the Divine Institutes’ apocalyptic book 7 uses not just Jewish and Christian Scripture, but also a host of Mediterranean prophets to herald the advent of the savior king: from Apollo’s priestess the Sibyl, to the Egyptian divine sage Hermes Trismegistus.

    According to the late fourth-century bishop, Filastrius of Brescia, Gaul was home to a Christian heresy "propagated by Hermes Trismegistus among the Celts". These people, he says, adored the sun as the sole god and creator.


    The attribution of the Decanates to Zoroaster may owe to Mithras:

    Mithraism was not an alternative to other pagan religions, but rather a particular way of practising pagan worship; and many Mithraic initiates can also be found worshipping in the civic religion, and as initiates of other mystery cults.

    which has surprisingly little extant written material.

    From what has been found, one can establish a connection of Apollo and Saturn's return in its highest grade:

    "Nama to the Fathers, from East to West, under the protection of Saturn!"


    For Latin, we would expect "In Nomine..." and so that oddly sounds Sanskrit, but, all I know is I see it written here.

    Porphyry attributes it to Zoroaster, considerably after it was attributed to the pirates of Cilicia.

    "Western Hinduism" mixed with angel-ology would be Yazidism, which did not incorporate Sufism until the 1100s.


    In Sanskrit, Mitra is an Aditya, not usually the main one, but understood as the Sun, as any of them would be. However he is more important from the Rg Veda:


    Mitrāvaruṇas are two devatās of great intimacy. They are always found together. If you pray to Mitrāvaruṇas you will get plenty of rains. (Śūkta 2, Anuvāka 1, Maṇḍala 1, Ṛgveda).

    Mitra-Varuna is the most common dual deity addressed in the Rig Veda. Mitra is almost never addressed separately, but Varuna has hymns devoted to him solely.

    The dual deities Mitra-Varuna are the lords of justice, are said to be laying down the law for men. They watch over oaths and punish oath-breakers.


    So, yes, it is a type of parallel to for instance the Apollonian Mysteries, but no, it is not identical, and somewhat indeterminate, compared to the Greek view that much older and more specific deities have certain domains and effects.




    Practically all Abrahamic faiths are eschatological, i. e., revolving around a type of "final battle", which is in general similar, but they all disagree with each other, and, within any given strand, the sects disagree with each other.

    The Platonic system is rather a nascent step towards Indian doctrines, not quite the same, but at least a basic approach. The Greeks seem quite fixated towards intellection or rationality, whereas several Indic streams are all about the End of Mind. Mahayana is perhaps Christian-esque, in the sense that it does preach Salvation, but that is about where the similarity ends. It is really only the Kalachakra Tantra that associates Maitreya with the Hindu Kalki Avatar, which would be a final battle; and such an avatar is Puranic, not Vedic. And the combination was most likely made because the Muslims were in actual fact assaulting India for centuries.

    Peel that away, and Maitreya is less distant from what seems to be the actual christos of Paul. Salvation gained due to knowledge from inner transformation after personal struggle.

    Instead, the arbitrary cobbling of "faith-based" doctrines into something relatively unbelievable, merged with the political death of the Debt Jubilee, which I am not sure ever occurred in that Rome that ended Saturn's Golden Age. Instead of what Mithraism may have been, or the original Saturn may have intended, it was rendered into that Saturn of what may have once been Judea, but was converted into Esau--Edom, the materialistic or Demiurge kind.

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