Reincarnation - alternative views

[Chicodoodoo]

Posted by Aldous (here)
I ask this then; Why would we be having memories from the past then and not just present day?

I don't know. The answer to that may be directly related to the original question -- why are you having memories that you do not associate with yourself? You say you have THE answer (reincarnation), and I say that no one does yet.

I don't see myself as simple minded and their are many other people I know (some of them on this forum) who I don't find simple minded at all.

You are making comparisons among humans. I am not, and that's the difference.

We have an unfortunate bias in that among all the animals on the planet, we seem to have the most developed intellect. As a result, we think we are special. We even think we are apart from the other animals just because we are at the top of the pyramid (are you listening, sociopaths?). But that is an illusion caused by our bias. If we could look at intellects from many different parts of the galaxy, I think we would find that we fall somewhere between the two extremes, and that we aren't quite so special.

To people who have experienced these memories the alt explanations aren't on equal footing at all.

That should be a clue right there. It's another bias we have as humans, i.e. whatever we experience must be real. Most of the time, we feel we are justified in calling all we experience as real. There is no question that we experience the actual sensations of the experience. The question is if the interpretation of the experience is real. For example, I can show you some optical illusions that will trigger a very real experience in your brain that has nothing to do with the reality of what you are seeing. If you weren't familiar with optical illusions, you would swear up and down that the pattern was moving, and almost nothing I could say would convince you otherwise.

[king anthony]

Posted by Chicodoodoo (here)
...we seem to have the most developed intellect...

Many have said this and most believe this; however, what standard is imposed!?

[Gone001]

Posted by Chicodoodoo (here)

Posted by Aldous (here)
I ask this then; Why would we be having memories from the past then and not just present day?

I don't know. The answer to that may be directly related to the original question -- why are you having memories that you do not associate with yourself? You say you have THE answer (reincarnation), and I say that no one does yet.

I don't see myself as simple minded and their are many other people I know (some of them on this forum) who I don't find simple minded at all.

You are making comparisons among humans. I am not, and that's the difference.

We have an unfortunate bias in that among all the animals on the planet, we seem to have the most developed intellect. As a result, we think we are special. We even think we are apart from the other animals just because we are at the top of the pyramid (are you listening, sociopaths?). But that is an illusion caused by our bias. If we could look at intellects from many different parts of the galaxy, I think we would find that we fall somewhere between the two extremes, and that we aren't quite so special.

To people who have experienced these memories the alt explanations aren't on equal footing at all.

That should be a clue right there. It's another bias we have as humans, i.e. whatever we experience must be real. Most of the time, we feel we are justified in calling all we experience as real. There is no question that we experience the actual sensations of the experience. The question is if the interpretation of the experience is real. For example, I can show you some optical illusions that will trigger a very real experience in your brain that has nothing to do with the reality of what you are seeing. If you weren't familiar with optical illusions, you would swear up and down that the pattern was moving, and almost nothing I could say would convince you otherwise.

I do associate the memories with myself that's why I believe in reincarnation. I don't feel like there other peoples experiences, that's the most compelling evidence to me anyway. You say no one has the answer but how can you say that when others have experienced what you haven't?

I do agree with what your saying about animals and us not being any better or worse but that's off topic from my question. I'm asking, if some has a memory of being an animal, like a dog, how might that be explained? I don't think I'm better then animals, but we are different, our minds function differently. when you say "If we could look at intellects from many different parts of the galaxy, I think we would find that we fall somewhere between the two extremes, and that we aren't quite so special", isn't that the same as thinking that animals are less intelligent? There are probably ET's out there with a more advanced intellect but no one is more special then anyone, we're all equal in that way (minus the sociopaths).

Pertaining to your last paragraph. Your saying people may be assuming what we're experiencing is real and comparing it to an optical illusion. You haven't had these experiences so how can you judge if what someone else is experiencing is real or not? Believe it or not I do get what your saying in a grander picture. We live in the third density at the moment and we are in human bodies on planet earth. We manifest our own reality and perceive things in a linear fashion. This is why pertaining to us I believe reincarnation to be the best fit (also adding my own experiences and others). When it comes down to the nitty gritty we're probably just the source consciousness's dream and nothing may be real. If we think like that though then what is the point to anything? We're here though, right now, for better or worse and you have to make the best of it while understanding your surroundings. Basically we haven't gotten to the next stage yet, whatever that may be and in our reality things work a certain way. Maybe in others they don't, but for us 3rd density earthlings I find reincarnation to be spot on.

[Constance]

Posted by RedeZra (here)

Posted by Chicodoodoo (here)
A human is an animal.

if a human thinks he is an animal then he is more likely to act like an animal


[/I]

Maybe that could be a good thing too. Animals are in complete harmony with mother nature. We are the only creatures here that violate the laws of nature. Nature is our greatest teacher.

[Constance]

Posted by RedeZra (here)

Posted by Constance Neal (here)

What is the mind and where do our thoughts come from?

So what is "real"?

I want to know where the thoughts come from too lol

You really want to know?

[dan i el]

Posted by Chicodoodoo (here)

Posted by dan i el (here)
Chicodoodoo, would you, if you have not, consider trying these exercises over,say, 10 days or so, global alpha particle radiation levels notwithstanding?

I don't think I'm familiar with this concept or these exercises, so I'm speaking from ignorance, but I don't see why I wouldn't be willing to try (assuming I can find the time -- maybe cut down my Avalon time?). I would need more information to decide.

Great stuff. here's the wiki, for starters: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypnagogic_imagery

[RedeZra]

Posted by Chicodoodoo (here)
For those that think humans are not animals, why do you think so poorly of animals? They are as magnificent as we are. In some ways, they are much more magnificent than we are.

Nobody here has spoken poorly of animals just because they suggest that humans are not animals

why put words in our mouths that we didn't say ?


there is a difference between humans and animals

as there is a difference between animals and flowers

and again as flowers are distinct from rocks


consciousness is the common denominator in all of the above states of being


it is sleeping in rocks dreaming in plants awake in animals and inquisitive in human beings


the members of the animal kingdom cannot change it's instinctual nature while human beings have the power to manifest ideas and make dreams or nightmares come through

animals cannot compare with humans


human beings are supposed to shepherd and steward this earth for the benefit of everybody but because of ignorance and greed the human race has become slaughters and sinners


animals cannot be anything but animals

humans have the power of choice and the potential of gods

[RedeZra]

Posted by Constance Neal (here)

Posted by RedeZra (here)

Posted by Constance Neal (here)

What is the mind and where do our thoughts come from?

So what is "real"?

I want to know where the thoughts come from too lol

You really want to know?

Not really ; )

[Virilis]

Dr Sam Parnia is conducting some very interesting research addressing the question of whether human consciousness can survive 'physically measured' death. By 'physically measured' he means patients who have undergone cardiac arrest & are unconscious (i.e., the patients hearts have stopped beating & their brain activity EEG's are flatlined). Of those patients that are resuscitated from clinical death, approximately 10% have what are called Near Death Experiences (NDE's). These lucid experiences include, but are not limited to: seeing a bright light; receiving knowledge; seeing unearthly beings; having out-of-body experiences accompanied by seeing & recalling specific detailed descriptions of the resuscitation, as verified by resuscitation staff; undergoing a life review; developing healing & psychic abilities.

Parnia says in one of his papers that, "These experiences appear to be occurring at a time when cerebral function can be described at best as severely impaired, and at worst absent. Although, under other clinical circumstances in which the brain is still functioning, it may be possible to argue that the experiences may arise as a hallucination in response to various chemical changes in the brain, this becomes far more difficult during a cardiac arrest. NDE in cardiac arrest appear different to hallucinations arising from metabolic or physiological alterations, in that they appear to occur in a non-functioning cortex, whereas hallucinations occur in a functioning cortex. Therefore, it is difficult to apply the same arguments for their occurrence."

Here are links to some of his research findings on the topic. They are both published in the scientific, peer-reviewed journal 'Resuscitation'

Near death experiences in cardiac arrest: visions of a dying brain or visions of a new science of consciousness
(Great review article)

A qualitative and quantitative study of the incidence, features and aetiology of near death experiences in cardiac arrest survivors
(Prospective study)


Dr. Sam Parnia spends his time between hospitals in the United Kingdom and Cornell University in New York, where he is a Fellow in Pulmonary and Critical Care Medicine. He's the founder of the Human Consciousness Project and Horizon Research Foundation, & has published extensively and presented his work at scientific institutions around the world.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=CSuUk9lNM-U

[Gone002]

As part of my faith structure i don't believe in reincarnation. with that said there is merit to it as there is to any form of religion or faith structure. Its always important to be mindful of others faiths, reincarnation may be a fact for some be not for others.

[king anthony]

Posted by celt (here)
Its always important to be mindful of others faiths...

I say, this has only been to avoid conflict and a tool used by the 'few' to divide the many. To state or imply 'everyone is entitled' or to be 'mindful of' is the same as saying 'there is more then one way for an apple to fall from a tree'.

[RedeZra]

It's much more constructive how we conduct our lives today than speculate what will happen tomorrow

We will find out soon enough what happens after death ; )

[Chicodoodoo]

Posted by RedeZra (here)
It's much more constructive how we conduct our lives today than speculate what will happen tomorrow

Especially when how we conduct our lives today may completely change what will happen tomorrow!

[dan33]

Ten years ago, I visited a meduim. I asked for things that from my childhood, were strange for me .I called synchronicities. When my mother talked about Franz Liszt, i always listened carefully, did not know why. I asked at the meeting with the medium - "synchronicities about Liszt" (i didn't say i was referring to the composer). I was shocked when she answered -"It was your father. Siline was your name , even if your mother wanted named you Nadia."

I knew there was no daughter of Liszt with the name Siline. In his later years, Liszt had a relationship with Carolyn Saynt-Wittgenstein. I looked for information, but nothing fit. Until I found a portrait of her, titled "Carolyn and Siline". Bingo!.
That's was "me" with my "mother". I know that this story doesn't proof reincarnation theory. I even have doubts about the "story" now.
(This post it's from King Anthony's "Unusual stories")

Thank you all.
Daniel.

[king anthony]

Posted by dan33 (here)
Ten years ago, I visited a meduim. I asked for things that from my childhood, were strange for me .I called synchronicities. When my mother talked about Franz Liszt... I know that this story doesn't proof reincarnation theory. I even have doubts about the "story" now.
(This post it's from King Anthony "Unusual stories")

I recognized the story as soon as I began reading it.

[161803398]

https://youtube.com/watch?v=u1vWoUoiaP4

This one is pretty good. I think there is on the video a quantum physics type scientific explanation of why our consciousness might hang together after death.

I know it does BECAUSE my dad did what Houdini couldn't do and came back to let me know.

[Lord Sidious]

Posted by 161803398 (here)

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=u1vWoUoiaP4

This one is pretty good. I think there is on the video a quantum physics type scientific explanation of why our consciousness might hang together after death.

OUT! I order thee.

[161803398]

Lord Sidious: howd you do that, huh?

[Lord Sidious]

Posted by 161803398 (here)
Lord Sidious: howd you do that, huh?

I changed the code.

[ThePythonicCow]

Posted by Lord Sidious (here)
I changed the code.

See the second link below (in my signature) for Youtube video embedding instructions.