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Thread: Does anyone know how to protect electronics from a massive solar flare?

  1. Link to Post #81
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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    Quote Posted by Conchis (here)
    I hear you on the computer thing. I have so much information stored on my computer and I really don't want to (and probably practically speaking can't) print out all of that stuff. I have a Goal Zero solar/battery combination that will let me keep it altogether. It's not a full solar system (I wish that I had the finances to do such a thing), but it's a small series of panels and a small battery that I can use (and have used) to run my laptop for a few hours at a time.
    A laptop and solar charger are fairy easy to protect, in case someone rings the alarm a few minutes before a possible big solar flair/EMP event.

    Just have metal boxes large enough to fit them, wrapping them first with thick plastic sheets. The important thing is that they cannot be in direct contact with the metallic surface of the box.

    Always have a backup hard drive and back up your info about once a week, keeping it protected when not connected, just in case no one rings the alarm before such event.

    Anyway, the best way to protect info is to print it. Paper is certainly EMP proof.

    Hereīs a good idea:



    I would just recommend to use several layers of thick plastic/rubber sheet for insulation, instead of cardboard. It will work considerably better against a strong EMP.

    Raf.
    Last edited by RMorgan; 8th February 2013 at 14:28.

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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    Quote Posted by RMorgan (here)
    [
    Just have metal boxes large enough to fit them, wrapping them first with thick plastic sheets. The important thing is that they cannot be in direct contact with the metallic surface of the box.
    With the trash pail Faraday cage he recommends to individually wrap each item with aluminum foil. So which is it? foil or plastic or both?
    I think I'll be getting one of these next time I go to the city.


    Lets make a list of all the things that you should routinely store in a faraday cage:


    List of all things to go into cage at time of event
    Back up hard drive
    batteries.
    Emergency radio
    ?
    ?

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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    Quote Posted by Arrowwind (here)
    With the trash pail Faraday cage he recommends to individually wrap each item with aluminum foil. So which is it? foil or plastic or both?
    Well, using a trash can or any other metal box, the important thing is that the lid must be very tight and in full direct contact with the box, so it acts like a close circuit.

    If you insulate the box from inside, preferably alternating layers of different materials, such as rubber, plastic, cardboard, carpet, etc, then thereīs no need to wrap up the electronics with anything.

    If you donīt have a faraday box ready to go, then you can just wrap your electronics with alternate layers of plastic PVC film and tin foil, starting with the plastic film. About four layers of each is more then enough.

    Raf.

    PS: Microwaves donīt work as EMP proof faraday cages, as some people believe.
    Last edited by RMorgan; 8th February 2013 at 15:09.

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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    Quote Posted by RMorgan (here)
    Well, in my opinion, itīs not worth bothering to protect computers an most other electronic stuff.

    Raf.
    Hi Raf, I agree that most electronic gadgets will quickly lose their novelty without a supporting grid and when the time comes to be focused, not twiddling. Here are my thoughts:

    Since the governments now rely on the grid being operational (hey, how can they use their surveillance equipment if it's not connected to a grid?), this will probably be a priority for them to resurrect (in the case of a solar EMP.) So, maybe it takes them a year... and when they get it back up, we don't want to have to come up with the money to buy new computer(s.)

    Another thought about the value of having a working computer: exactly what's in your computer? Do you have an herbal database? Alternative medicine information? Water purification info? Garden pest info and organic solutions? Maps (not just links to Google maps or Mapquest, but actual maps) of areas that may be important for you and your family? And, to provide emotional/mental/spiritual comfort, maybe even some inspirational documentaries, guided imagery, and (for those interested) yoga sets. If you have a working CD/DVD player, you can play recorded music, movies, and some applications hold a database and/or images on disc.

    So yes, a computer dependent on the Internet being up and accessible may be worthless, but a computer full of info may be quite valuable.

    Dennis


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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    Quote Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)
    Another thought about the value of having a working computer: exactly what's in your computer? Do you have an herbal database? Alternative medicine information? Water purification info? Garden pest info and organic solutions? Maps (not just links to Google maps or Mapquest, but actual maps) of areas that may be important for you and your family? And, to provide emotional/mental/spiritual comfort, maybe even some inspirational documentaries, guided imagery, and (for those interested) yoga sets. If you have a working CD/DVD player, you can play recorded music, movies, and some applications hold a database and/or images on disc.
    Hey Dennis,

    Itīs better to have all this information on paper, or better yet, in your brain; Printing a compilation of essential information for such emergencies may be an excellent idea. There are no substitutes for real maps as well.

    For family entertainment, itīs better to have old school games, which are pretty much EMP proof as well...And how about real musical instruments? Get yourself a small harmonica and a soprano ukulele (with a few extra string sets) and youīre ready to go.

    Anyway, instead of a computer, itīs much better to save an MP3 player with lots of music, for several reasons; Its battery charge lasts longer, itīs smaller, itīs lighter, itīs quicker to charge, etc...

    In such emergencies, itīs not that the lights would go out for god knows how long and everything else would remain the same; Itīs much more complicated than that. Society and civilization is held together by a real fragile structure, nowadays.

    Unfortunately, in such cases, everything turns into chaos. You just donīt have enough room to carry everything you want, specially if you are forced to hit the road, so itīs better to focus on the essential.

    The fact is, that we have grown dependent on such technologies, which are just luxuries. In case of such events, you wont need computers. The whole civilian grid structure, including the internet structure, would take more than a decade to be rebuilt, according to specialists.

    About communication, in such cases, if any satellite survives, the government will use them strictly for official/military traffic, probably for a very long time. If they manage to launch new com satellites, they will also be for official use as well. You know you canīt count on the government to save people. They will concentrate their efforts to re-establish their own grid; Only after that, which would take at least a few years, they would start repairing the civilian grid...IF thereīs any government left.

    Raf.
    Last edited by RMorgan; 8th February 2013 at 16:01.

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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    Quote Posted by RMorgan (here)
    [I would just recommend to use several layers of thick plastic/rubber sheet for insulation, instead of cardboard. It will work considerably better against a strong EMP.

    Raf.
    We have heavy duty plastic pond lining laying around. I suppose that would work?

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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    Quote Posted by Arrowwind (here)
    We have heavy duty plastic pond lining laying around. I suppose that would work?
    Sure. Use contact cement/glue to glue it around the whole internal surface of the box/trash can. Sandwich it with layers of other materials (carpet, cardboard, etc..).

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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    Quote Posted by RMorgan (here)
    Quote Posted by Arrowwind (here)
    We have heavy duty plastic pond lining laying around. I suppose that would work?
    Sure. Use contact cement/glue to glue it around the whole internal surface of the box/trash can. Sandwich it with layers of other materials (carpet, cardboard, etc..).
    Actually I just found out its called epdm a type of rubber.. so thats probably better

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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    On one of the websites I was visiting today regarding emp I came across a failry comprehensive pdf file discussing the implications and ramifactions of an EMP event. They had accessed all the leading governmental agencies for information. Its pretty informative. If you understand the nature of the event and all the issues it can create it helps you to understand what you might need to do.
    http://www.futurescience.com/A2473-EMP-Commission.pdf

    This all gets me back to storing gasoline again.. which I hate to do but would be necessary for immediate needs, especially for the truck and chain saw although a horse and wagon might ultimately be the better solution. Ive been advised that vehicle fuses would have to be replaced so thats another thing to go into the Farada can... which now leads me to an assumption that household fuses would also be at risk?

    I wonder if there are other parts in a vehicle aside from fuses that would require protection or replacement?

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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    Quote Posted by mgray (here)
    Last week somebody put on a call spread on the VIX using the April 20 and 25 puts.
    April 20th is an often used date for occult practices ... it's Hitler's birtday.

    Quote Posted by Arrowwind (here)
    Do cable and wires need to be covered to?
    Unplug all cables and wires ... they'll work as antennas and may feed currents
    into your Faraday cage. That's the reason why there was an advice to cut the cable
    from the microwave (see other remark further below).
    Keep cables open-ended!

    Quote Posted by RMorgan (here)
    Well, in my opinion, itīs not worth bothering to protect computers an most other electronic stuff.
    .....
    The only equipment that is worth saving is radio communication systems,
    .....
    Computers can be used as communication systems, especially in combination with radio equipment.
    That may be the first available grid after an event.

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    There's been a massive "bet" placed -- thousands of times larger then 'normal' -- that the markets will crash round about the end of April.
    Making money by such a bet means that this trader in the know expects that money is still worth
    something after this event. So the event probably isn't a full currency crash.

    Quote Posted by RMorgan (here)
    Well, using a trash can or any other metal box, the important thing is that the lid must be very tight and in full direct contact with the box, so it acts like a close circuit.
    I agree that a Faraday cage must be a closed circuit around the stuff you wan to protect. However
    from my previous ESD courses I know that openings like the lid opening in this case already forms a closed
    circuit (loop) by itself. Now again this is theory (just to understand it) in practice I would advice to
    close 'the box' as much as possible and make it conductive all around.

    Quote Posted by RMorgan (here)
    PS: Microwaves donīt work as EMP proof Faraday cages, as some people believe.
    Well like refrigerators, I mentioned previously, the doors may not be electrically connected to
    the rest of the housing. Refrigerators sometimes do not have a metal back.
    But anyway my statement above also states that in theory it doesn't have to be closed completely.
    As long as your stuff is contained in a metal or conductive loop.

    If your desktop computer is contained in a metal case and cables are disconnected(!) there
    might be a chance that it survives too.

    While Faraday cages are great to protect against Electrostatic Discharge (ESD) I wonder what is needed for real strong (electro) magnetic fields.
    The container works as a short circuited loop. But with high power fields and currents the container may not sustain the currents and forces
    and crumble.
    So tin foil by itself will probably not be the optimum container.

    It may also be wise to take of jewelry like rings, bracelets etc. anything of metal forming loops ....

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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    Quote Posted by Arrowwind (here)
    [COLOR=darkorchid]
    This all gets me back to storing gasoline again.. which I hate to do but would be necessary for immediate needs, especially for the truck and chain saw although a horse and wagon might ultimately be the better solution. Ive been advised that vehicle fuses would have to be replaced so thats another thing to go into the Farada can... which now leads me to an assumption that household fuses would also be at risk?

    I wonder if there are other parts in a vehicle aside from fuses that would require protection or replacement?
    Gasoline gets spoiled pretty fast and becomes useless and pasty; Premium grade gasoline lasts between one and two years, common gasoline lasts between three and twelve months, depending on the climate.

    Modern cars are not reliable for such situations; They are fully dependent on several electronic parts.

    So, ideally, an old diesel vehicle is the best option.
    Last edited by RMorgan; 8th February 2013 at 17:13.

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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    Quote Posted by RMorgan (here)
    Quote Posted by Arrowwind (here)
    [COLOR=darkorchid]
    This all gets me back to storing gasoline again.. which I hate to do but would be necessary for immediate needs, especially for the truck and chain saw although a horse and wagon might ultimately be the better solution. Ive been advised that vehicle fuses would have to be replaced so thats another thing to go into the Farada can... which now leads me to an assumption that household fuses would also be at risk?

    I wonder if there are other parts in a vehicle aside from fuses that would require protection or replacement?
    Gasoline gets spoiled pretty fast and becomes useless and pasty; Premium grade gasoline lasts between one and two years, common gasoline lasts between three and twelve months, depending on the climate.

    Modern cars are not reliable for such situations; They are fully dependent on several electronic parts.

    So, ideally, an old diesel vehicle is the best option.
    Yes, i dream of an old diesel. We do have a 96 diesel ford truck.

    I have an addative for gasoline that holds it up to 6 months. You have to cycle it and not over store it. For me this means manually funneling 30 gallons of gas into the car about every 6 months.. pain in the neck.
    Didn't know that premium stored for so long. Will have to consider that and if the addative will extend that.


    So should I assume that a large vehicle battery will be ruined by strong EMP?



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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    Quote Posted by Arrowwind (here)
    Yes, i dream of an old diesel. We do have a 96 diesel ford truck.

    I have an addative for gasoline that holds it up to 6 months. You have to cycle it and not over store it. For me this means manually funneling 30 gallons of gas into the car about every 6 months.. pain in the neck.
    Didn't know that premium stored for so long. Will have to consider that and if the addative will extend that.


    So should I assume that a large vehicle battery will be ruined by strong EMP?
    No. Batteries will be fine; They are not affected by EMP.

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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    Quote Posted by ljwheat (here)
    All this stuff is designed to keep every one in there car's.
    Well yes. Its all designed to keep us in our cars. Personally, I like my car. Ive also traded it in for a new one a fair number of times.
    I disagree that I am so fully controlled. When you are playing a game you are not controlled. You agree to the rules. We all agreed to the rules when we came here if we believe we did so or not. Part of the game is to live as long and as well as you possibly can... of coures long and well is subjective.

    I would like to decide when my car is not good enough anymore, I've been long term involved in its maintance and care and I have grown temporarilly attached to it and its outcome especially to fulfill specific goals. I do not wish to be forced to trade it in, prematurely, against my will or to have it stolen from me. It is after all, mine. No one elses as a Soeverign being lives in this car and cares for it daily. I assume I will eventually get bored with driving around and I wont come here anymore even though the roads and secenery has been pretty good this time around. Until that day I will perservere in maintaining my vehicle on as many levels as possible for I came here to do a work that is not yet complete.

    Ī=[Post Update]=Ī

    Quote Posted by RMorgan (here)
    [No. Batteries will be fine; They are not affected by EMP.
    Great! I didn't like my vision of pulling auto batteries out and wrapping them up in 4 layers of stuff. Groaning just thinking about it.

    I thought I had read that batteries had to go into a faraday bag, thinking small batteries like flashlight etc. Did I read it wrong or was I dreamin? thanks.

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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    Summary:
    Disconnect all electric cords and wires and leave them outside of the Faraday Cage.
    Label the cords appropriately. You may not be using this equipment for quite a while.

    Aside from having a faraday cage or bag available keep plastic sheeting, ziplock bags and lots of tin foil and tape on hand to wrap electronic equipment with.
    The time of warning to time of impact is short so you need to know where things are and have them ready to go. If you carry your computer around with you its best to purchase a faraday bag for it and carry that too. It can hold your computer, watch, phone, gps, car fuses and solar flashlight all together. Make it part of your auto survival gear.

    List of all things to routinely store in a Faraday Cage
    Back up hard drive
    Flash drives
    Solar powered flashlight
    Small solar panels
    House and vehicle fuses
    CFL light bulbs
    Mp3 player with music on it

    List of Things to put into cage at time of event.
    Store this list in the can tapped to the lid.
    Computer
    Television
    Surge protectors
    Electric clocks and timers
    Blue ray or apple box
    Internet router
    Battery watches
    Telephones
    Printers
    Electronic Medical Equipment
    DVD player
    Baby Monitors
    Battery chargers
    Tool battery chargers
    Digital camera
    Short wave and Ham radios
    Chain saw ignition coil
    Last edited by Arrowwind; 8th February 2013 at 20:21.

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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    Quote Posted by Arrowwind (here)
    What are you using to cover large computer or TV screens as ziplocks are too small?
    er ... eh ... nothing .

    I have several "spare" computers (building computers has been a hobby of mine.) I'm figuring that a computer built in a fully surrounding metal chasis, with no wires or cables connected, should have a good chance of surviving most things. I also have spare boards and power supplies and such, if just "a little" damage is done. Getting zapped with a strong enough pulse to take out all that means that my corner of North Texas has left the electronics age and gone back to the steam age .

    I have a couple of spare, disconnected, monitors. They are not protected at present. If they all get zapped, then I have a bit of a problem .

    Quote Posted by Arrowwind (here)
    Do cable and wires need to be covered to?
    Oh heavens no. Cables and wires can withstand enormous voltage spikes, and when disconnected, they do not provide much opportunity for current flow. Those are safe ... well safer than say our own mortal bodies.

    However the cables and wires that are connected to computers act as antennae, providing a major path for an electromagnetic pulse to get into the computer and start doing damage to the computer components. I have surge protectors on both the power supply cord and the cable to my Internet modem, protecting my main computer. This should reduce the risk of serious damage from the more common problem of a surge due to lightning or even a repeat of the 1859 Carrington Event.
    My quite dormant website: pauljackson.us

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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    The folks over at TheGoldenThread.info have been compiling and discussing a lot of the best prepping info for several years now. (Some of our members here are also there.) Their extensive library can help answer in detail a lot of questions members here may have about EMP protection, food storage, energy, bugging out vs. shelter in place and other issues.

    I highly recommend: http://www.thegoldenthread.info/phpB...forum.php?f=92

    Here's a thread on the latest EMP protection info: http://www.thegoldenthread.info/phpB...hp?f=67&t=2590

    With regard to having a solar event knock out the internet, perhaps long-term, I have also taken the precaution of printing out vital survival info now and compiling it in large binders – it’s cheap, relatively permanent and boy, when you need to know how to purify water, or build a solar stove or save seeds – those diagrams and instructions will be priceless. A lot of people just think ‘I’ll look it up….It’s on my laptop.’ (Are you sure – and not just a link to a website that will be fried?) But how will you look anything up, when the power’s been out for six months?

    Paper is cheap. Knowledge is priceless.

    Cheers,

    Selene

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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    If someone can prove me wrong, then I humbly apologize!

    However, My husband designs fuses. He is into circuit protection, thin film, ceramic, used to be in power fuse, etc..

    All electronics today are protected by fuses. The fuses in you car will stop it from frying out the circuits in the event of an EMP. All modern day electronics have fuses in them. They are designed so that if they take a hit from a power surge the fuse opens up and power is stopped from continuing through the circuitry. In the case of today's smaller electronics like the IPad and IPhone the fuses are printed and laminated on the boards.

    So for your vehicle, stock up on extra fuses. For small electronics, protecting them is important because you cannot take them apart and replace the fuses. They are either soldiered or printed onto the boards.

  36. Link to Post #99
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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    Another issue to think of in regards to restoring power...

    If a solar flare caused an EMP that hit the power lines, the surge could take out the transformers that step up or down the amount of electricity. The surge could pass the transformers before taking them out and the power would continue surging on to your house. Your house fuses or breaker fuses could also take a hit and need to be replaced. So if you think about it picking up extra glass fuses (old style) or circuit breakers should be another item to stock up on when you are preparing.

    -jean-marie

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    Default Re: Essential reading for all Avalonians

    will foil act as a farady cage?

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